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These Scrubbed Reports Reveal New Secrets Into the Prince Andrew-Jeffrey Epstein Relationship
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Several now-censored reports from the 1990s and early 2000s reveal that Prince Andrew’s involvement with the minors exploited by Jeffrey Epstein is greater than previously believed.

While the Jeffrey Epstein scandal has largely faded from media coverage in the United States, it has continued to attract attention abroad, particularly in the United Kingdom in connection with Epstein’s long-standing association with Prince Andrew, the Duke of York and the Queen’s son.

The Epstein-Prince Andrew relationship has long been a fascination of the U.K. press, with numerous articles dating back to the early 2000s detailing the most outrageous aspects of their relationship. Prior to that, Epstein had also garnered attention from U.K. newspapers regarding his association with Ghislaine Maxwell, whose reputation in the U.K. is rather notorious, as was that of her father, Robert Maxwell.

Yet, since Epstein’s arrest in July, many of these older articles on Epstein and Maxwell, as well as those focusing on the Epstein-Prince Andrew relationship, have disappeared from the archives of several prominent U.K. media outlets that reported on these relationships years ago.

Several of these articles, though largely scrubbed from the internet, were recently obtained by MintPress and a review of their contents makes the likely motive behind their disappearance clear: several articles not only reference Epstein’s connection to both U.S. and Israeli intelligence years before the first investigation into Epstein’s exploitation of minors had even begun, but also reveal surprising aspects of Prince Andrew’s involvement with Epstein that strongly suggest that the Prince partook in illicit sexual activities with minors to a much greater extent than has previously been reported.

New, disturbing details of Prince Andrew’s early links to Epstein

Since Epstein was arrested the first time in 2006 and even more so after he was arrested again this past July, those named in press reports as his associates have made every effort to distance themselves from the accused pedophile and sex trafficker. For this reason, press reports that discuss Epstein long before there was any hint of the larger scandal are particularly important for understanding the true nature of Epstein’s past associations with the rich and powerful.

In light of what is now known about Epstein’s sexual blackmail operation and sex trafficking activities, several reports from the late 1990s and early 2000s contain details long since forgotten regarding Epstein’s relationship with Prince Andrew.

One particularly censored article that appeared in London’s Evening Standard in January 2001, for instance, gives several indications regarding the apparent entrapment of Prince Andrew as part of Epstein’s sexual blackmail operation, which is now known to have been connected to intelligence — specifically Israeli military intelligence, according to recent revelations in the case.

The article, written by Evening Standard journalist Nigel Rosser, quotes a personal friend of both Ghislaine Maxwell and Epstein as saying the following about their friendship with Prince Andrew:

A screenshot from a now-deleted 2001 Evening Standard article
A screenshot from a now-deleted 2001 Evening Standard article

Another friend of Maxwell and Epstein made similar claims that appear in the same article:

A screenshot from the same Evening Standard article
A screenshot from the same Evening Standard article

The article further describes Epstein and Prince Andrew as having a “curious symbiotic relationship,” adding that “wherever Ghislaine is seen with Prince Andrew, Epstein isn’t far behind.”

These quotes are particularly telling now that it is a matter of record that Epstein was seeking out rich and powerful individuals and entrapping them with minors for the purpose of blackmail. The fact that personal friends of Epstein and Maxwell at the time openly stated that their “manipulative” relationship with Prince Andrew was “very premeditated” and “probably being done for Epstein” strongly suggests that not only was the Prince entrapped, but that this type of entrapment activity was known to occur among those who were close to Epstein and Maxwell at the time.

Prince Andrew — as a member of the Royal Family, which is very protective of its social reputation, as well as the U.K. envoy for investment and trade — certainly fits into the category of people that Epstein entrapped on behalf of intelligence: rich, politically powerful, wary of damaging their social reputation, and thus susceptible to blackmail.

Notably, the year this article was published (2001), is the same year that Epstein’s most well-known accuser and victim, Virginia Giuffre (then Virginia Roberts), claims that she was introduced to Prince Andrew by Maxwell and Epstein and forced to have sex with the Prince on at least three occasions. She has also claimed that Epstein would subsequently instruct her to describe the encounters in order to learn compromising information about the Prince’s sexual habits and preferences. Her claims regarding Epstein’s trafficking of her, specifically to Prince Andrew, have since been largely corroborated by photographic evidence, flight logs, and public records.

This undated photo released by Virginia Giuffre shows Prince Andrew posing with a young Giuffre, Ghislaine Maxwell is shown standing in the background
This undated photo released by Virginia Giuffre shows Prince Andrew posing with a young Giuffre, Ghislaine Maxwell is shown standing in the background

While it appears that Prince Andrew was deliberately entrapped as part of Epstein’s intelligence-linked sexual blackmail operation, the article further suggests that Andrew’s involvement with the minors exploited by Epstein went far beyond his alleged three encounters with Giuffre.

Rosser quotes a friend of Prince Andrew’s ex-wife Sara Ferguson as saying that Andrew “used to be smart when he came back from abroad…He’s started having a girl massage him…He even travels abroad with his own massage mattress.”

During this same time period, Epstein and Maxwell also introduced Prince Andrew to “sex aid entrepreneur” Christine Drangsholt during a trip to Mar-a-Lago and describes Andrew traveling to Los Angeles, where he was seen “flirting…with a group of young girls,” and to Phuket, Thailand where he “wandered around the sex bars in the area’s red light district.” The Los Angeles trip saw Andrew accompanied by artist and close friend of Michael Jackson, Brett Livingstone Strong, and Ghislaine Maxwell accompanied Andrew to Thailand.

The mentions of massages from a “girl” and Andrew traveling around with Maxwell and Epstein while bringing along “his own massage mattress,” are particularly striking given what is now known about Epstein’s sex trafficking and sexual blackmail operation. Court documents, police reports, and other evidence have since made it clear that “massage” was the code word Epstein and his co-conspirators used for sex with the minors he exploited and massage tables and sex toys were frequently present together in the rooms of his various residences where he forced underage girls to engage in sexual acts with him and others.

Most notable of all is the fact that claims of Prince Andrew receiving “massages” from girls during his trips with Epstein and Maxwell were published in January 2001, at least two months before Virginia Giuffre states that she was first introduced to and forced to have sex with the Prince in March of 2001. This means that the claims of Epstein- and Maxwell-brokered “massages” refer to at least one other girl, strongly suggesting that Andrew’s involvement with minors exploited by Epstein is greater than has been recently acknowledged.

Other recently reported information has added to the likelihood that Prince Andrew engaged in illicit activities with more minors than Virginia Giuffre. For instance, the FBI recently expanded its probe into Epstein’s sex trafficking network to include a specific focus on the Prince’s role. The FBI has claimed that they are reviewing claims regarding Prince Andrew made by other Epstein victims aside from Giuffre, but did not specify the nature of those claims.

Ghislaine Maxwell’s open secret

Media reports cite Prince Andrew and Ghislaine Maxwell as having developed a close relationship at least by February 2000, when Andrew had spent a week at Epstein’s controversial New York penthouse at 9 East 71st Street. One report published in 2000 by London’s Sunday Times claimed that the two were introduced by Andrew’s ex-wife Sarah Ferguson, often referred to as “Fergie” in the press, and further claims that this introduction had taken place several years prior. Epstein is alleged to have first been introduced to Andrew via Maxwell in 1999.

A screenshot from a now-deleted 2000 Sunday Times article
A screenshot from a now-deleted 2000 Sunday Times article

Years after this introduction was made, Jeffrey Epstein would provide financial assistance to Ferguson at Prince Andrew’s behest by paying Ferguson’s former personal assistant £15,000, allegedly in order to allow for “a wider restructuring of Sarah’s £5 million debts to take place,” according to The Telegraph.

Oddly, by April of that year, Maxwell and Prince Andrew were spotted by their fellow diners at a posh New York restaurant holding hands, prompting both the Prince and Maxwell to claim that their relationship was merely “platonic.” However, a separate report from 2007 in the Evening Standard refers to Maxwell as one of Prince Andrew’s former girlfriends.

Within a year of their close relationship having become public, Andrew and Ghislaine were reported to have gone on eight different vacations together, of which Epstein accompanied them for five. Andrew also brought Maxwell and Epstein to celebrate the Queen’s birthday in 2000 as his personal guests.

Several reports from this period also provide interesting insight into Maxwell’s business activities and private life. One article from 2000, published in London’s Sunday Times, states that “for all her high-profile appearances on Manhattan’s A-List merry-go-round, she [Maxwell] is secretive to the point of paranoia and her business affairs are deeply mysterious.” It goes on to say that Maxwell “has been building a business empire as opaque as father’s” — referencing Robert Maxwell’s business empire, which included multiple front companies for Israeli intelligence — and adds that “her office in Manhattan refuses to confirm even the nature or the name of her business.”

On her relationship with Epstein, it states that “he’s always kept her secrets, no one knows what their relationship is really about.” An article from 2001 claims that Maxwell’s Manhattan lifestyle, her New York residence and her vehicles were all purchased by Epstein and that she was employed as his “consultant” while also acting as his social organizer and interior designer.

One report on Maxwell — which was published by the Evening Standard in 2003, years before Epstein was first publicly revealed to be exploiting minors — contains very telling information about Maxwell’s work for Epstein. It states “Ghislaine has risen, largely thanks to property developer Epstein bankrolling her, to become queen of the billionaires’ social circuit,” adding that “Jeffrey only likes billionaires or very young women and uses Ghislaine as his social pimp.” It then discusses “rumors” that Maxwell was hosting “bizarre parties at her house to which she invites a dozen or so young girls, then brandishes a whip and teaches them how to improve their sexual techniques.”

Given what is now known about Maxwell’s role as Epstein’s procurer of underage girls and her role in “training” them in sexual techniques, this passage — again from 2003 — reveals that Epstein’s and Maxwell’s dark acts were pretty much an open secret for years prior to Epstein’s first arrest in 2007.

Jeffrey Epstein, spy and property mogul?

One recurring theme in many of these older reports from the U.K. is their mention of Epstein’s alleged ties to both U.S. and Israeli intelligence. For instance, Nigel Rosser’s 2001 article contains the following passage:

A screenshot from a now-deleted 2001 Evening Standard article
A screenshot from a now-deleted 2001 Evening Standard article

Another articl e, published in 1992 in the U.K.’s Mail on Sunday, describes “rumors” that linked Epstein to the CIA and the Mossad and claimed that he had worked as “a corporate spy hired by big businesses to uncover money that had been embezzled.” In addition, an article published in 2000 in London’s Sunday Times also states of Epstein that “nobody knows whether he’s a concert pianist, property developer, CIA agent, a math teacher or a member of Mossad.”

A screenshot from a now-deleted 2000 Sunday Times article
A screenshot from a now-deleted 2000 Sunday Times article

Notably, these rumors of Epstein’s links to intelligence have since been confirmed. The CIA-Mossad links to Epstein were detailed in a recent MintPress investigative series and several mainstream media reports have corroborated Epstein’s time as a self-described “financial bounty hunter” who hunted down embezzled funds and also hid stolen money for powerful people and governments.

Another odd commonality among these now-scrubbed articles on Epstein from the 1990s and early 2000s is that the majority of them refer to Epstein not as a “financier” or “hedge fund manager,” as has become common in more recent reports, but as a “New York property developer” and even as a “property mogul.”

For instance, the 2001 Evening Standard article introduces Epstein as an “immensely powerful New York property developer and financier” with an “intensively secret business life” who “owns properties all over the country [the U.S.].” It also states that Epstein had made millions from “his business links with the likes of Bill Gates, Donald Trump and Ohio billionaire Leslie Wexner” during the 1990s and beyond.

A screenshot from a now-deleted 2001 Evening Standard article
A screenshot from a now-deleted 2001 Evening Standard article

Wexner, in addition to his other close financial ties to Epstein, was involved in several Manhattan real estate deals with Epstein and Epstein’s brother Mark while Donald Trump was then best known for his career as a New York property developer and real estate mogul. Trump is also cited in a separate article from January 2001 as being good friends with both Prince Andrew and his ex-wife. In addition, this article’s claim regarding Epstein’s most notable “business links” in 2001 contradicts Bill Gates’ recent assertions that he never had any business relationship with Epstein and did not meet with him until 2013. Notably, Gates’ former chief scientific adviser was recently named as an alternate executor for Epstein’s will and Gates appears on the flight logs of Epstein’s now-infamous private plane. Gates, one of the world’s richest men, has since claimed that he only had met with Epstein in order to meet other wealthy people and to discuss “philanthropy.”

Donald and Melania Trump with Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell at the Mar-a-Lago club, Palm Beach, Florida in 2000. Photo | Davidoff Studios
Donald and Melania Trump with Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell at the Mar-a-Lago club, Palm Beach, Florida in 2000. Photo | Davidoff Studios

Another article in the Evening Standard refers to Epstein as a “property mogul.” Several other articles — such as a 2000 article from Australia’s Sunday Mail, a 1995 article from Australia’s Sun Herald, and a 1995 article from the U.K.’s Mail on Sunday — also refer to Epstein as chiefly a “property developer.” Interestingly, references to Epstein as a property developer continued to occur (though less frequently) after his first arrest in 2007 and then again after his recent arrest this past July, yet oddly only in non-U.S. newspapers. Another article states that Ghislaine Maxwell had sold property on Epstein’s behalf and was also involved in the New York real estate market.

While several articles in the early 2000s describe Epstein as both “property developer” and “financier,” even earlier articles about Epstein refer to him exclusively as a “property developer.” For instance, the 1992 article in the Mail on Sunday cited above referred to Epstein as “a shadowy, almost maverick New York property developer” and noted that, even then, Epstein appeared “to have an inexhaustible supply of money and yet no one seems able to answer the question of precisely what the source.”

As will be revealed in an upcoming MintPress investigative series, these references allude to Epstein’s shady business activities in the New York and Palm Beach real estate markets from the mid-1980s to the late-1990s that were used to launder massive amounts of money for organized crime and intelligence. It is likely for this reason that Epstein’s real estate activities during this period have been so deliberately ignored by the U.S. press, even though other aspects of his financial activities were heavily scrutinized in recent months.

Indeed, in examining Epstein’s involvement in real estate markets, particularly in New York, it becomes clear that those activities have no shortage of controversial tie-ins to the current U.S. presidential administration as well as major New York power players involved in suspect financial activity immediately prior to the September 11 attacks as well as the 2008 financial crisis. All of those connections and more will be explored in MintPress’ upcoming investigative series on the financial crimes of Jeffrey Epstein and their broader implications.

Correction | An earlier version of this report incorrectly stated the name of the artist that accompanied Prince Andrew to Los Angeles in 2000 as Bruce, as opposed to Brett, Livingstone Strong.

(Republished from Mint Press News by permission of author or representative)
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: American Media, Jeffrey Epstein, Mossad 
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  1. Given that the thoroughly despicable Alan Dershowitz, who was also accused by Giuffre, had his lawyers combing through emails between Roberts/Giuffre, and found emails in which she stated she didn’t know who Dershowitz was, this appears to be little more than another shakedown. Until someone comes up with a photo of Andrew boinking Roberts, there is no reason to believe her.
    This long winded column is not about “reports” its about newspaper article speculation.

    Call me naive, but it seems to me that with Andrew’s connections, this bimbo would have met with an accident by the time she started in on Maxwell being a procurer. I’ve had my picture take with famous people, it doesn’t mean any sexual relations occurred.

  2. Randy Andy …………………

  3. Truth says:

    This story is a spot of truth in a foundation of lies.

    These “men” like little boys, not girls.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Rabbitnexus
  4. No report is as damning as the photo of the royal weasel with his meathook around the underaged girl’s bare waist.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Niebelheim
  5. @Truth

    Evidence? I’ve never heard the slightest suggestion that Prince Andrew, or Epstein, was a pederast.

    In the absence of evidence the question arises why you wriite such things.

    On the main subject of gossip I would say that the pictire of Andrew and Giufre/Roberts would be enough for a jury to disbelieve any allegation of forced sex.

  6. Strange.
    No mention of how sexual perversion, and so much more, is a ‘windsor’ family specialty. The Queen and her hubbie were seen in Canada with 10 or so children. Those children were never seen again. There was enough evidence for a warrant to be issued for their arrests. The Canadian Parliament subsequently changed the laws so that a member of the royal family cannot be charged.
    Suffice it to say the Queen does not come to Canada.
    In truth, the Royal Family are murderous filth. They practice satanism. They have murdered many children and they depths of depravity of the Royal family knows no bounds.

    • Replies: @Omegabooks
  7. @Curmudgeon

    Naive and ostrich like I’d say. I’ve been around, travelled a bit and lived on the streets for a few years many years back and even I had met someone who was a victim of Epstein as a young girl. I did not realise it was him she was talking about until recently but it all falls into place now. Andrew’s association with Epstein in itself and the proven lies being told about it are enough to show his guilt. You believe whatever makes you feel good but not only was Epstein a pedo blackmailer and well known as such for many years you can use your own eyes to see the body on the Gurney is not Epstein by a wide margin. Not surprisingly he has been spotted back on his island actually since his alleged suicide. He is too valuable to the intel agencies which use him to be allowed to die or get locked up.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  8. @Truth

    Most of them go both ways. The bum-brother thing is more about domination among their own kind. It was ‘put into them’ at their expensive elite schools where this sort of thing is traditional. Who buggers whom and who gets buggered. They are sick mofos who get off on things most people would find abhorrent. The more wealth, power and privilege you have, the harder it becomes to get your rocks off and the more extreme things have to be to excite you. The destruction of childhood innocence is just about as good as it gets for such people.

    • Replies: @Sean
    , @Truth
  9. eah says:

    I found this “LOL” funny:

    For instance, the FBI recently expanded its probe into Epstein’s sex trafficking network to include a specific focus on the Prince’s role. The FBI has claimed that they are reviewing claims regarding Prince Andrew made by other Epstein victims aside from Giuffre, but did not specify the nature of those claims.

    Yes, I’m sure the FBI, the same utterly compromised organization that was so complicit in the Trump/Russia coup/hoax, is working very hard to investigate the Epstein case.

  10. the other chapter of prince Andrew’s thing is that he is an MI6 guy: MI6, CIA, Mossad, they are all the same colonized bodies of the “chosen”.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  11. Anonymous[648] • Disclaimer says:

    If the email report is true, it’s more likely she didn’t know who Dershowitz was at the time she was forced to have sex with him than her making it up. As one of Epstein’s chief advisors going back 25 years, one would assume Dershowitz was intimately aware of if not guiding Epstein’s espionage on behalf of Mossad. Moreover, Fox News continues to rely on Dershowitz for spin and so much so as to presumptively implicate Fox News as a limited hangout for Mega and Israeli intelligence in the ongoing cover up.

  12. Sean says:

    Giuffre, said she had sex with Andrew in Britain, but Andy could have easily and perfectly legally had sex with younger (and much better looking) girls than the at least 17 year old Giuffre in Britain.

    Andrew does not particularly like young girls, when he was young himself he went for much older women. His wife Sarah Ferguson and American girlfriend Koo Stark were both older.

    Andrew has been tabloid fodder, but he is not and never was a person of influence even by the standards of the almost entirely ceremonial royal family. I think he was good PR for Epstein. Andrew being seen with Epstein after his conviction is difficult to explain if Andy was some kind of agent of influence asset for Epstein’s putative organisation. Andy has been discredited by not immediately dropping him.

    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
    , @eah
  13. @Sick of Orcs

    Where were the underage girl’s parents? Do you think Prince Andrew’s daughter could be flown off from her high school to some Caribbean Island to be passed around? Or Epstein?

    Why is it that these white girls are in a position where they can be exploited like this?

    How can some old pervert show up at a public high school and start recruiting white girls for his sexual pyramid/bribery scam?

    Why are underage white girls so sexually sophisticated at age 16?

    Why are white girls willing to do this?

    What backgrounds did they come from?

  14. Sean says:

    Have you been reading Stephen Fry’s memoirs? At the kind of small schools the Royals went to there was none of that going on for anyone,certainly not them. Andy was rumoured in upper class circles to have went gay for a while after his divorce though.

    BTW the photo of Andy with Guiffre and Ghislaine Maxwell also in the shot was taken at Maxwell’s central London house. Guiffre was 17 years at least as she now admits, so there was no crime in (16 year old is the age of consent) Britain even if he had been fucking her brains out.
    So even if he had film, where was the blackmail?

  15. Bruno says:

    For people who speak French, it is very interesting to read Gerard Fauré book and liste to his interviews :

    He’s father was a physician and sub-direction of WHealthOrg and he describes paedophilia, prostitution, drug and trafficking with political and media elites. It’s very stunning.

  16. Gordo says:

    Why are white girls willing to do this?

    You are edging close to blaming the victims.

    Not that that is unfashionable.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Harbinger
  17. melpol says:

    Rare diamonds and precious gems were provided to those who came to Epstein’s homes. It is a closely guarded secret of what Epstein got in return. The young hookers were just a false flag to hide the important transactions. Young hookers are easily obtained by the poorest workers.

  18. @Jeff Stryker

    How do filthy, stinking, ugly mohammedans groom White British girls?

    • Replies: @Moi
    , @Macon Richardson
  19. Anonymous[648] • Disclaimer says:

    When you consider Chabad’s overt hostility toward non-Jews, to the extent non-Jews are dogmatically said to have no souls and should be exterminated, save only so many as are needed to serve the Jew, it follows their presence within the CIA, FBI, State Dept, etc is presumptively as dangerous a security breach as having Capone’s men in the Chicago police or serving as judges. Any sane investigative heuristic would assume their guilt within the relevant reference class of Israeli espionage and Jewish criminality. The rest is eyewash.

  20. @Sean

    Andrew has the ken of a fruit fly. As a member of the Royal family he should have known that he had wealth, power and privilege but not nearly enough not to exercise great care in picking his friends.

    They’re the royal family, for God’s sake. They’re expected to be predictable, traditional and stodgy.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  21. @Gordo

    No, I am questioning the entire framework around them. Parents. Society. Economics. Cultural mores.

    Why is it so easy for some old pervert to pass the word that he is willing to pay a few lousy bucks (Like $300 even though he is a billionaire) and half a high school’s tenth grade girls will rush over to his house for a huge orgy session.

    Why are they prepared to do these things?

    And why do they appear to working class white girls? Not Jews. Not Asian girls. Not Muslim girls. Nope, it was white Gentile girls.

    And how are they so sexually sophisticated at the age of 15 or 16?

    Is it biological? Are white girls simply more inclined to do sexual acts for money at an early age?

    Is it economics? Psychology?

    • Replies: @giddyup
    , @Jonathan Mason
  22. BTW the photo of Andy with Guiffre and Ghislaine Maxwell also in the shot was taken at Maxwell’s central London house. Guiffre was 17 years at least as she now admits, so there was no crime in (16 year old is the age of consent) Britain even if he had been fucking her brains out.

    Randy Andy denied there was any sex, so your legal strategery is not available to him.

    Besides, the optics of that photo are disastrous, and well-deserved.

    • Replies: @Sean
  23. Harbinger says:

    “You are edging close to blaming the victims.”

    Jeff Stryker makes an incredibly good and valid point that needs addressing.
    If anything, the Epstein case, not only promotes Jewish predation upon the non Jews, but the moral and ethical decline of the west.
    The 60’s saw that begin. Young women, even from poor working class families were still taught to have manners and be chaste. Fathers were incredibly protective over them. That all changed and we can certainly blame cultural Marxism which obliterated our cultures. And we can also blame the rise of power within woman and ultimately the rise of single mothers, who see their daughter as ‘best girl friends’. They go out, together, on the hunt for men, mother in her mid thirties, dressed the same as her daughter and the daughter 17/18 trying to solicit sex. I was out on the weekend, with friends, after a party, in a nightclub, being approached by a 20 year old. Her mother was there and then they both had an argument with one another, because the mother also showed interest. I quickly left as I had no interest from the start.

    The west is in a moral and ethical, rapid state of decline.

    • Replies: @eah
    , @melpol
    , @Alden
    , @Anon
  24. eah says:

    Your comment is rather absurd — “Andy” — what, are you on a first name basis with the useless mother fucker? — almost from the moment I saw the foto reproduced here, I felt “Prince Andrew” was a lying weasel — here is the only thing I could possibly say/ask that is even slightly in his favor: is he really so fucking stupid that he would allow such a foto to be taken? — but the answer to that question is probably ‘yes’.

  25. It is my opinion, that Epstein is alive and is in Israel.

  26. anonymous[403] • Disclaimer says:

    It’s not clear what value Andrew had. If it’s a spy operation then what sort of info could he provide? For blackmail what sort of policies could he affect? Perhaps Epstein liked hobnobbing with a ‘prince’. In this case this person is hardly different from the thousands of sex-tourists going to places like Thailand looking to obtain cheap and often underage sex. He’s just got a title, that’s all. The entire British royal family are just a clown show anyway.

    • Replies: @Alden
  27. Anonymous[648] • Disclaimer says:

    What makes you think he wasn’t making the best of it, given Epstein’s m.o., and that he wasn’t set up and caught off guard?

    • Replies: @Sean
  28. The enduring mystery of Epstein’s life is how anybody managed to call him a “hedge fund manager” with a straight face. He was so blatantly full of shit. Actual investment professionals were left speechless by his make-believe bafflegab strategies. Hedge. He couldn’t tell you what Black-Scholes is if his 3:15 dick massage depended on it. He wouldn’t know a Gaussian copula if it copulated with him. The suggestion that an autodidact’s knack for Algebra II & Trig and maybe AP Calculus prepared him for securities analysis only goes to show how stupid CIA thinks you are.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Sean
  29. eah says:

    Jeff Stryker makes an incredibly good and valid point that needs addressing.

    And your comment is incredibly dumb, because in this context his “point” is irrelevant — Epstein was accused of statutory sexual crimes — in the case of statutory crimes, there is no such thing as “consent” on the part of the victim — it’s simply against the law (for good reason) to engage in such acts with females who are underage — everything else, eg whether ‘the west is in a moral and ethical, rapid state of decline’ or not, is a matter for another discussion.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Harbinger
    , @Sean
  30. jsinton says:

    I think I’m more concerned about the Orwellian history control than the Prince’s dalliances.

  31. @Kolya Krassotkin

    The Upper Class Twit competition has to exclude Royal Twits like Andrew because of the unfair advantage such twits as the princes seem to have been born possessing. There simply is no twit like a royal twit

    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
  32. @Jeff Stryker

    Read Whitney Webb’s excellent four part series and most of your questions will be answered. Epstein and his coreligionist, Maxwell, preyed on young goyim females who were troubled, poor, came from broken homes or just naive. If you can’t understand how a multi-millionaire could tempt poor young girls after reading Webb’s articles then it’s a willful ignorance.

    • Replies: @Sean
    , @Wizard of Oz
  33. @Nothing's sadder than a dumb Jew

    Even as a predator, he wasn’t very intelligent.

    I lived in the Philippines at a time when a few sophisticated child predator operations were busted.

    Epstein was sort of a dumb ass. He was bound to be busted spreading the word around some local high school that he was a trick looking for young girls. You would have thought he would have recruited girls from Eastern Europe or Russia or something. Nope. Just hung around the local high school like run-of-the-mill moron.

    I’m not sold on this man’s sophistication or the purported CIA web of blackmailing syndicates he supposedly he had behind him. If this were the case, why hang around a local high school?

    • Replies: @Bill
    , @jsinton
  34. Sean says:

    Epstein maybe took the photo but why would Giuffre end up with it? She is a shakedown artist.

    • Replies: @m
  35. @eah

    Sean reveals himself as a bounder, though he may actually be only a wannabe bounder. If he was actually a cad, he would still adhere to the rule of referring to a member of the royal family by his title, if the mention is in 2nd person form. Referring to a royal by a nickname in a conversation among commoners would be a horrid pretense of familiarity, and is just the sort of thing a bounder might do.

    Among the peerage, that just isn’t done. It simply won’t do.

  36. giddyup says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Young white girls are addicted to snapchat, instagram, and pornography . Snapchat and Instagram are softcore porn sites that enable these girls to get attention from strangers, and attention to a woman –particularly a young woman– trumps everything. You ask how in the world young white girls could be groomed by disgusting Muslims (and they ARE disgusting), well, they’re given attention by these swarthy orcs. And attention is everything to a young white woman. Excitement is everything to a young white woman. In fact I don’t even think Epstein needed to pay these girls, though of course a couple hundred was nothing to him.

    Young white women don’t care about their heritage, their family, or their honor. They only care about their depraved appetites being satisfied, by who or what, it doesn’t matter. They simply want attention. True it is the fathers of these whores that are — in the end– to blame, and I freely admit, the young white men of the West are similarly depraved, but I don’t think my description of these women is off…

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  37. Sean says:
    @Nothing's sadder than a dumb Jew

    He portrayed himself as a tax avoidance specialist and bounty hunter of illicit funds. Tax evasion schemes are a great way to rip people off. You cannot cheat an honest man.

  38. melpol says:

    Pedophiles know where to go to catch their prey. It is in modeling agencies where the best fruit reside. Of course the mother and the manager have to get a cut before the youngster is sold or borrowed for a night. Pedophiles often work at orphanages where they have the access to blemish their prey with sexual juice. No youngster is safe from the clutches of the Pedophile unless they are accompanied by the heavenly angel.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  39. Sean says:
    @Chet Roman

    Guiffre was working in a Trump resort and her father, who was a manager there, ran her to the interview for the job she was offered by Epstein. Guiffre is now being represented by the top lawyers in the country, Jewish of course and bitter rivals of Dershowitz. As in so many cases this boils down to arguments between Jews.

    • Replies: @Philadelphian
  40. bluedog says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I don’t think “forced sex” was the issue but the fact that under age sex is illegal,and I don’t really think that you would have read any headlines that the queen’s boy is a sex offender,which is something that has always been prevalent in the so called British royalty.!!!!

    • Replies: @Sean
  41. @giddyup

    At 45 years old I am no longer a young man or up on youth. I am a middle-class white, by the way.

    Most 15 year old girls when I was 15 in 1989 were virgins. A few slags, yes, but the idea of an ENTIRE HIGH SCHOOL OF GIRLS selling their bodies would have been ridiculous. Ridiculous.

    Back in 1989 porn was around, but girls had no interest in watching it or women. Even most grown men in 1989 did not watch porn habitually. It was mostly teen boys, frat guys and a few dirty old men who watched porn. The idea in 1989 of a female porn addict, much less a 15 year old girl, would have been impossible. Nobody would have believed it.

    Girls in 1989 cared more for their reputation than attention. Rumors used to fly back in 1989 when some 15 year old girl had sex with a boy her own age…that was relatively uncommon for middle-class or even working-class whites.

    I have not been in the tenth grade in thirty years. Heck, I have not lived in the US in 20 years. But it is astounding the degree to which sexual morality has changed among young white girls. Even working class ones.

    As for the British preteen girls, I suspect this is proximity. These are poor whites who just did not sell their house in time before their community became a Caliphate/ghetto of Pakistanis. Probably lower class parents without much money. Maybe a single mother too.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @Alden
  42. @eah

    How many times can we state that Epstein and his slut B J queen wife/madam/whatever Maxwell was were amoral human pieces of shit before we start to examine the underlying cause?

    Epstein was no Charles Manson with hypnotic Rasputin charm. And Maxwell was not kidnapping girls at gunpoint and forcing them over to the mansion.

    Which leads me to ask:

    …What kind of idiot parent lets their 15 year old daughter fly off to an island in the Caribbean alone with some creepy Jews? I mean it is one thing to lie to your Mom and sneak off to a slumber party or something but where were Mom and Dad when some 10th grade girl is being flown by two Pedos off to the Virgin Islands!

    …How is it that half of a 10th grade of girls from a single high school are such hardened hookers at age 15 that they will rush over to trade their bodies for cash like hardened call girls?

    …We know about child prostitution in desperately poor countries like Brazil or Cambodia but this kind of poverty exists in Southern Florida among white people!

    …Where is Dad? Dad just doesn’t care that little Suzie in the ninth grade is off to some ungodly EYES WIDE SHUT orgy with a sinister cabal of rich people on some island in the Caribbean for the weekend….Back when I was in 10th grade girls had to lie to go to a slumber party.

    …$300 is really that much to young girls in this day and age that they trade in their virginity to some creepy old pervert?

    Forget Epstein and what he did. He did it because he could. There will always be guys that do that. Amorality is as cheap as table sugar. But what is does it say about white girls in society today?

    • Replies: @Bill
    , @Skeptikal
    , @melpol
  43. Sean says:

    I never understand those who think the royals are a supreme elite in Britain. Rupert Murdoch and his family now that is real wealth, power and privilege. Anyone else who did what Murdoch and his son did with bugging people’s phones would accessing the police computer and paying them for information ect ect would get a term in prison. Vermin. But the establishment let them get a stranglehold over the media, so they are untouchable.

    • Replies: @anonymous
  44. Anonymous[648] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    White women in both countries, as a matter of fact, are so utterly brainwashed they mistake giving the edge in elections to their families’ executioners as proof of their empowerment.

  45. Skeptikal says:

    I wish some of this damning and suggestive info could be used to blackmail the UK govt into releasing Assange.

    OTOH, perhaps the Brits are being blackmailed into keeping him illegally detained.

  46. Skeptikal says:

    Where there’s smoke, there’s fire.

  47. Bill says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    I’m not sold on this man’s sophistication or the purported CIA web of blackmailing syndicates he supposedly he had behind him. If this were the case, why hang around a local high school?

    What sophistication? He ran a blackmailing op for an intelligence service most likely. He was crude and clumsy because he didn’t have to be subtle and deft. Clumsy ole him didn’t get caught for a long time (how did that happen?), and, when he did get caught, he got let go (how did that happen?).

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  48. Harbinger says:

    On the contrary, my comment and your reply proves, precisely, the moronity of people who firstly do not understand the concept of paeophilia and secondly are unable to understand ‘chaste’.
    It’s time you and others had an education on sex.

    When a boy’s testicles drop and he starts producing sperm NATURE has defined that boy ready to procreate – have sexual interecourse.
    When a girl starts to menstruate, or in the past was known as flowering (coming into the final metamorphosis of the flower and pollination then is able) she is ready, like the boy, to start procreating. The girl THEN became a woman at that precise time.

    Boys do not become MEN, because they get a job earning paper, or women. They become men and women, adults, when nature decides.

    NATURE defines adulthood, not the stupidity and ignorance of man and we can see, of late just how so they truly are.
    A girl, or should I say woman, at the age of 12/13 knows VERY WELL what she’s doing. Capable of producing offspring, now a woman, these women, who were part of Epstein’s ‘Lolita Express’ and ‘Fantasy Island’ giving sexual favours to prominent businessmen and women, knew that they would have access to elites who could further their careers and earning of money. What we were seeing, with these women, was hypergamy in action – the seeking of a higher status male, to start a family, have stronger children and find security.

    It is utter and sheer ignorance, of people, who truly believe these girls were young and innocent regardless whomever they had sex with. Guaranteed, these women were, most certainly, sexually active, LONG before Epstein & Co got their hands on them.
    Where were the mothers and the fathers, making sure their daughters weren’t out ‘giving it up’ to whomever?

    In the past, children by the age of 8/9 were cleaning the house and making dinner. The boys were out hunting with their fathers and learning about the land and the animals within. By the time they reached puberty, most certainly around 11/12, they were ready to be married off and start a family of their own.
    Man now states “having sex under the age of 16 is against the law” – whose law? Man’s law? The same laws that permit men to sodomise other men? The same laws that give men the right to invade foreign lands, kill, rape, rob and plunder for the Jew bankers and state of Israel? The same laws that allow a man to become a woman and woman a man and to persecute sane people for stating otherwise?

    It is clear, in today’s society that man is incapable of making laws.
    Incidentally, it was Edward 1st of England (aka Longshanks/Hammer of the Scots) who brought about the first age of sexual legality at 12 years old, in the 13th century.
    Nature defines male and female. It then defines when a child becomes an adult. Not man. Having sex with prep pubescent children is simply blatantly wrong. But when nature decides when a woman/man is ready to procreate, humanity has absolutely no moral, or any ground in this debate to stand on. It’s that simple. We are part of nature and we succumb to the order of it. You have to be dafter than a brush to think that man is greater, above it and able to control it to their own will.

  49. Sean says:

    1) Guiffre was 17 at least, she originally claimed to be 15 but employment records in the defamation case led her to admit she was a full 2 year older when she started working for Epstein. While she was working for him she had a boyfriend who was Epstein’s bodyguard. She finished at 19.

    2) The photo was taken in Britain where Giuffre says she had sex with Andrew.

    3) The age of consent in Britain then as now was 16. Andrew committed no crime having sex with her in Britain and possibly not in America either .

    4) If Giuffre was, as she claims, a trafficked sex slave for a honeytrap blackmailer pimp, how could she possibly have come into possession of a photograph that was Epstein’s bread and butter?

    • Replies: @eah
    , @Skeptikal
  50. Bill says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    How many times can we state that Epstein and his slut B J queen wife/madam/whatever Maxwell was were amoral human pieces of shit before we start to examine the underlying cause?

    You aren’t interested in the underlying cause, though. You’re interested in thinking and talking, a lot, about slutty tenth-grade white girls and the slutty, sexy, oh so interesting things you think they’re up to.

  51. Skeptikal says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Give it a rest, Jeff.

    • Agree: Alden
  52. Harbinger says:


    Parents should not be putting their children in modelling agencies PERIOD! They do so for their own greed, having failed in their lives and use their children as commodities to financially gain from. It’s immoral.
    Let us also understand as well that paedophilia is having sexual intercourse with pre-pubescent children. A girl who is menstruatng and boy who is having wet dreams, producing sperm are now women and men. They are, by nature’s decree, adults and ready to procreate.

    Does this mean that I have sex with children who are menstruating and producing sperm? Good God no, but I am merely explaining that nature is above man, not the other way around and society is wrong on the definition of adult and child.

    That stated, yes, sexual predators DO groom the young. I won’t deny that. And this is PRECISELY WHY I am an anarchist and promote anarchy. Were there no police to PROTECT these sexual predators, society would deal with them incredibly fast – noose around the neck, hoisted over a tree bough, strung up and their bellies opened up. End of existence for those who do wrong.

    • Replies: @Alden
  53. melpol says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Gals in my high school kept their virginity because guys were poverty stricken and never had enough cash to tempt them. But a rich guy like Epstein could tempt them and break every cherry in my classroom. Even poor straight guys would please a H-mo for a few bucks. It is unbelievable what money can do to morals.

  54. Alden says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Many of the high school girls in Florida were Hispanic. And the pimps don’t recruit girls in or near schools. Part of the job description of prostitutes is recruiting other prostitutes as you know very well.

    Teens don’t tell their parents what they’re doing.. Probably told parents they had a baby sitting gardening cleaning restaurant etc job

    • Agree: Sean
    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  55. Nobody really cares about 17 year old courtesans who “know” old men for money unless they can watch it on the internet. The oldest profession is so common around the world it is telling that the American propaganda system with its police state played up the salacious aspects of sensationalized sex to hide, obscure and protect the real crimes of the elite – and then not say another word about it while leaving the surveillance and opinion forming to the less than main stream media outlets.

    Hedge fund manager Epstein’s real troubles were probably too complicated for most of the zombies to understand because they don’t really understand finance, Only massive international debt keeps the dollar afloat, and the military. The elites have counted on widespread ignorance in the sheep like public – the criminal law really only applies to the poor. Lots of Americans would have gladly bedded old men for thousands of dollars when they were teenagers too knowing what they know now but didn’t know then

    • Replies: @melpol
  56. eah says:

    1) Guiffre was 17 at least …
    2) The photo was taken in Britain where Giuffre says she had sex with Andrew.

    People should note: the info commenter Sean gives here essentially matches what Giuffre/Roberts says about “Prince Andrew”, eg in her affidavits — but the fact that it was not statutory rape does not make it any less tawdry, and therefore something he would naturally want to strongly deny — what her interest might be in lying about him in particular is far less clear — I personally still think he is lying.

    What’s not known is what other girls/young women, perhaps some underage, he may have had sex with thru Epstein — because Epstein was murdered (duh), the investigation was severely blunted.

    • Replies: @Sean
  57. Alden says:

    A hot 34 year old mom and hot 16 year old daughter together in a bar on the prowl for a 3 some. Standard porn movie plot. Watch your porn movies if you like. Why repeat the plots here? Are the plumbers and pizza delivery porn actors girls and the housewives men porn actors now? Pool girl and house husband must be the new genre in porn.

    And if those bars you frequent are so tawdry and immoral, why do you keep going to them?

    You’re behind the times. Those hook up bars and all bars are having problems surviving, especially the gay bars. Gays use Grindr heterosexuals use Tinder. Cheaper no buying drinks or driving to the bar, wasting hours chatting being rejected, finally finding someone then driving to his or her place for sex, then driving home.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  58. @Alden

    I didn’t read that many of Epstein’s victims were Hispanic.

    From what I can read the victims were white and from chaotic backgrounds. Maybe it was a poor high school! Must have been poor for 50 students to rush out and trade their bodies for cash to some leathery old Jewish man.

    The idea that some girl could show up at homeroom and say “pssttt, there is the old creepy couple who are offering $300 if you’ll go to their house and prostitute yourself.”

    • Replies: @Alden
  59. Sean says:

    Epstein was accused of statutory sexual crimes — in the case of statutory crimes, there is no such thing as “consent” on the part of the victim

    Not true because lack of consent would mean a far more serious charge . Consent is not a defence to under age sex, but refusing to recognise there was consent by a 17 year old girl (Giuffre started with Epstein when she was 17) is a mere legal fiction. While she worked for Epstein, Guiffre had a boyfriend.

    • Replies: @eah
  60. Dear Unz Review Readers

    Just another gentle reminder:


    David French….Tranny Freak Time for Todlers…..

  61. Alden says:

    Lots of girls menstruate before 13. In fact sometime in the 12th year is most common. Boys can produce sperm and some peach fuzz above the upper lip as early as 10, definitely by 12 depending on maturity and ethnicity.

    The law states birth to the 13 birthday is pedophilia and or pederasty. That’s the law. Violate it if you like. Defend yourself by claiming the 11 year Old menstruates or ejaculates sperm.

    See if it works.

    This topic is turning into a dirty old men lusting after 12 year olds blog.

    • Agree: Daniel Rich
  62. Republic says:

    Several now-censored reports from the 1990s and early 2000s reveal that Prince Andrew’s involvement with the minors exploited by Jeffrey Epstein is greater than previously believed.</blockquote

    Yet, since Epstein’s arrest in July, many of these older articles on Epstein and Maxwell, as well as those focusing on the Epstein-Prince Andrew relationship, have disappeared from the archives of several prominent U.K. media outlets

    Is it technically possible to delete all material regarding a past article from the internet?
    Wouldn’t there still be some traces left?

    I noticed that the archives of the wayback machine did not have any records of that evening standard
    story of January 21, 2001 regarding Andrew

  63. Alfred says:

    Prince Andrew was and is surrounded by people whose sole job is to ensure that he does not get into “trouble”. The fact that he got himself embroiled in all these allegations is ample proof that he chose to ignore the instructions of his minders.

    These minders were/are answerable to the Queen. Undoubtedly, she knows all about his escapades.

  64. Harbinger says:

    Did you happen to read the part, I wrote, that stated “I quickly left”?
    Obviously not.
    Wherever alcohol is served you are always going to get immoral people, loose women and violence. I do not frequent bars to solicit sex. I go there to meet friends, have conversation and enjoy myself. For your information, I’ve been single for 12 years now and almost the same without sexual intercourse. I have no need for it in my life. The purpose of sex, has been fulfilled to fruition thank you.

    • Replies: @Colin Wright
  65. @Bill

    Why would the CIA endorse an operation ON US SOIL that involved a sloppy pervert bird-dogging the local high school?

    Why not recruit out of Russia? Eastern Europe?

    I mean why would the US government want to get entangled in a domestic situation involving the teachers of some students at a local high school?

    • Replies: @Bill
    , @Commentator Mike
  66. eah says:

    While the Jeffrey Epstein scandal has largely faded from media coverage in the United States, …

    People should also note this: the story has been faded — the media is deliberately not covering it; this is entirely intentional — they have some cover: because the accused is dead, the criminal case against Epstein is now moot.

    But in every other way, this case is still relevant and deserves more coverage — but the corrupt media will no doubt continue to see that it doesn’t get this attention.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @eah
  67. Alden says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    When you first appeared in this site you claimed you went to a Detroit high school in the White slums of Detroit. You claimed the White girls in your Detroit high school were all tattooed drug addicted pregnant prostitutes. And the boys were all drug addicts.

    When other posters mentioned there were hardly any Whites in Detroit high schools in the late 1980s you claimed you went to high school in a Detroit suburb full of White teen drug addict pregnant prostitutes.

    Get your stories straight

    • Replies: @utu
    , @Bill
  68. Moi says:
    @Sick of Orcs

    You have a problem.

    • Replies: @Sick of Orcs
  69. Prince Andrew is a red herring.

    He, Alan Dershowitz, Bill Clinton, and Ehud Barak were all obviously getting their kicks screwing the fourteen year old shiksas Epstein provided. The ‘Lolita Express…’

    Now ask yourself why is you hear the most about Prince Andrew, very little about Dershowitz and Clinton, and nothing at all about Ehud Barak. His involvement is very thoroughly documented — but it’s all been nicely scrubbed out. There’s not even a reference on his Wikipedia page.

    Why would that be? Think it was Prince Andrew who had Epstein whacked?

    British Royals are fair game. Throw one into the lion pit and everyone will watch that while we ignore the ones we’re intended to ignore. If a former Prime Minister of Israel was implicated — well, can’t have that.

    This is a fucking production. It’s choreographed.

    • Replies: @Where-Wolf
  70. @Harbinger

    ‘Wherever alcohol is served you are always going to get immoral people, loose women and violence…’

    Lol. I could take you to all kinds of disappointing places, then.

    • LOL: Harbinger
    • Replies: @Harbinger
  71. Alden says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Palm Beach Fl high school. Big Hispanic population in Palm Beach. And when you first appeared on this site you claimed that most of the White girls in your high school were drug addicted tattooed teen mother prostitutes.

    And yes, prostitutes do recruit other prostitutes as you well know. You’ve made a living in the sex and porn industry your entire life. How do I know this? I read your posts bragging about it.

    And sneering at the White American men who stayed here and managed to make a good living at normal jobs. And not involved in porn / sex industry jobs. As you so obviously are.

  72. Sean says:

    She took money for sex and you think she isn’t capable telling fibs for money? She misled the world about her age (17 not 15) at the time of these alleged events, and I don’t see how anyone could make a genuine mistake like that.

  73. melpol says:
    @Test Execution

    Investment seminars not parties were Epstein’s forte, he offered great investment opportunities in Israel and China. The young gals were just for decoration. He was busted after one of his big players lost billions. Epstein had ER since he was a youngster. He was after a buck not gals.

  74. Harbinger says:
    @Colin Wright

    I worked on doors for a good part of my life. I saw it all. And I also worked on the ‘gay’ scene in London as well. That’s when my eyes were truly opened to the perversity, depravity and degradation of homosexuality. But as a whole, there’s always the propensity for violence, a high chance of meeting loose women and incredibly immoral people.

    • Replies: @Colin Wright
    , @Alden
  75. Alden says:

    Jeff Stryker operates a business in Thailand. Because his posts are exclusively about sex and porn ; one cannot help but speculate about what his Thai business is.

  76. @Harbinger

    ‘But as a whole, there’s always the propensity for violence, a high chance of meeting loose women and incredibly immoral people.’

    Still. As applied to my choice of places to go to get a drink, your description is less than completely accurate. It’s pretty comic to contemplate, actually.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  77. anon[137] • Disclaimer says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I can recall reports that Prince Andrew was forced to resign from the Royal Navy due to his poofter proclivities aboard ship and the effects of such on morale.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  78. utu says:

    Ron Unz was promising on two occasions to have Jeff Stryker banned but somehow did not do it.

    • Replies: @Republic
    , @Flo
  79. Anon[627] • Disclaimer says:

    People don’t note, or notice, things, unless they are programmed to. That’s by definition, and no should is going to modify it.

  80. Anon[627] • Disclaimer says:

    The west is in a moral and ethical, rapid state of decline.

    Trust me, punctuation isn’t doing any better.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
    , @Alden
  81. Harbinger says:
    @Colin Wright

    Quite the contrary. Your reply shows a great deal of ignorance, I’m sorry to have to state and incredibly naivety.

  82. Agent76 says:

    Jul 7, 2019 IT BEGINS: Epstein Indicted, Black-Ops Mega-Base Destroyed!

    IT’S TRUE: Jeffrey Epstein has actually been arrested.

    September 4, 2019 Strange Things Are Happening on Epstein Island: Drone Footage

    Recent drone footage of Little Saint James reveals strange activity and telling facts about the Jeffrey Epstein investigation since his death. As expected, everything points towards a massive cover-up. Here are the most revealing images captured by drones in the past weeks.

  83. melpol says:

    Excuse my typographical error, Epstein had ED not ER, he couldn’t maintain an erection. His thrill was making a buck, he seldom had any sexual encounters. Epstein was another Bernie Madoff, but his investments and high returns were kept secret. He traded with international drug dealers whose investments in poppy crops promised big profits. All collapsed because of the Afghanistan drought. Now the big secret is out.

  84. Harbinger says:

    Oh forgive me……

    “The west is in a moral and ethical, rapid state of decline.”

    “Trust me, punctuation isn’t doing any better.”

    I believe you’re looking for the word grammar? The punctuation isn’t wrong, but the correct grammar should really have been:

    “The west is in a moral, ethical and rapid state of decline.”

  85. Alden says:

    Sounds as though you enjoyed your work. Observing and probably participating in all those disgusting, depraved, degenerate activities.

    Don’t bartenders waiters and bouncers in those gay and straight hook up bars get to sweep up the leftovers at closing time?

    Worked in a gay bar and pontificates about the immorality of parents, teen girls, women and society.

    Words fail

  86. Wally says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Jeff Styker is merely trying to offer up a distraction, some twisted excuse for his beloved Zionist perverts.

    “Zionist perverts”, now that’s a redundancy.

  87. Bill says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    It would be great to know the answers. Let me know when you find out.

  88. Bill says:

    He is consistent. He is consistently writing (one-handed?) stories about slutty tenth-grade white girls.

    • Replies: @Alden
  89. Alden says:

    Harbinger claims to have been a bouncer in gay hook up bars and clubs for years.

    So his prospective on western society is a bit different from those of us worked in non sex and alcohol related jobs; bought homes, were faithful to our lawfully wedded spouses and all that normal lifestyle.

  90. Alden says:

    Are you aware that federal state and large city police forces have software roaming the internet picking up words and phrases indicative of sex offenders including pedophilia and pederasty.

    Advocating consensual sex with 16 17 year olds isn’t too bad. But you’re advocating sex with children as soon as they menstruate or produce sperm is a sure red flag.

    Expect to soon receive emails snap chat tinder etc messages from horny 11 years 6 month girls claiming “ I just got my first period and yearn for a dirty old man for sex”. Or 11 years 6 month boys “. I just jacked off for the first time and yearn for a dirty old man for sex”

    Hope your posts don’t draw law enforcement attention to the website. Read Jeff Stryker’s posts. Being more experienced than you, he never writes anything that will draw attention from law enforcement.

    Your posts about nature intended children should have sex as soon as they menstruate and produce sperm are the standard defense of every pedophile and pederast.

    Some of your statements come straight from
    NAMBLA, the pederast North American man boy love association.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
    , @byrresheim
  91. Alden says:

    Oh yeah. Didn’t think about what perverts do when writing and reading about sex.

  92. Republic says:

    He was banned for about two weeks

  93. @Colin Wright

    Yes it’s choreographed but the purpose is not distraction.

    The purpose is normalization of a new social order where people of wealth and status may do as they wish with our children, and everybody else.

    The purpose is to foster a sociopathic perspective and encourage privileged persons, mostly but not entirely men, to defend the sexcapades of degenerates and therefore minimize their own questionable attitudes toward other people’s children.

    Come for my 15 year old daughter and see what I do to you when I find you. I teach the values to my children but it is pointless unless I also have the power to enforce them. Reading about this reminds everyone they are impotent in the face of Intelligence and Security/Police State Power.

    Media establishes the social norms upon which our lives will be lived. What norms are being established in cyberspace by stories like this? Where is the movement to arrest these criminals? Cops no longer charge people who molest children unless they are toddlers because the norms by which we live have slowly been adjusted.

    Most of the people coming here are not raising children. They move back and forth between commentary oriented websites and porn hub, on a daily basis. Having been pushed here by the Intel squeeze on all free speech they now get to be useful by spreading their judaising perspective resulting from excessive cognitive dominance.

    That’s why they gave you the Internet and seemingly access to everything. They knew it would seriously fuck you up.

    Just look at how many commenters twist the Epstein kompromat operation into an opportunity to rationalize their own deviance while encouraging others to behave the same way.

    The final objective, closely associated with promoting homosexuality, is to replace love and attraction with addiction and fetish. Only your heart knows the latter while the mind will justify anything when put to the task.

    • Agree: Alden
    • Replies: @Alden
  94. lauris71 says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    On the main subject of gossip I would say that the pictire of Andrew and Giufre/Roberts would be enough for a jury to disbelieve any allegation of forced sex.

    I am pretty sure that nobody thinks that Prince Andrew violently raped underage girls.

    But soliciting prostitutes is illegal in many places, soliciting underage prostitutes is illegal everywhere, trafficking prostitutes over state borders is illegal, manipulating minors to have sex is illegal in most places, knowingly using prostitutes that have been trafficked/manipulated/forced to do what they do is illegal etc. etc. And not reporting it is also crime. As is knowingly using the results of crime of someone else to your personal gain.

    Andrew should convince the jury that he did not know how and why Virginia Roberts happened to be in Epstein company and why she was so eager to have sex with him. And court system being as corrupt as it is, he probably will succeed.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Sean
    , @Truth
  95. Harbinger says:


    All I can really state about you is that you are truly a hateful individual.
    First you accuse me of engaging in homosexual acts and fail to see what I wrote on working in homosexual bars:

    “That’s when my eyes were truly opened to the perversity, depravity and degradation of homosexuality.”

    and now you accuse me of paedophilia because I correctly state that nature defines male and female and when a child becomes a man and woman, that is when they are ready to procreate. Again you also missed what I wrote:

    “Does this mean that I have sex with children who are menstruating and producing sperm? Good God no, but I am merely explaining that nature is above man, not the other way around and society is wrong on the definition of adult and child.”

    There are people, in debate, who when their argument is utterly demolished, they go on the attack. They are utterly loathsome individuals and clearly trolls, which you, most certainly are. You are incapable of critical thinking, incredibly ignorant and unable to accept reality and the natural laws of life.

    You also missed the following as well:

    “In the past, children by the age of 8/9 were cleaning the house and making dinner. The boys were out hunting with their fathers and learning about the land and the animals within. By the time they reached puberty, most certainly around 11/12, they were ready to be married off and start a family of their own.
    Man now states “having sex under the age of 16 is against the law” – whose law? Man’s law? The same laws that permit men to sodomise other men? The same laws that give men the right to invade foreign lands, kill, rape, rob and plunder for the Jew bankers and state of Israel? The same laws that allow a man to become a woman and woman a man and to persecute sane people for stating otherwise?”

    Any more comments from you will instantly be ignored. To accuse people of acts, when they specifically state the opposite, shows that you are nothing more than a trouble maker.

    • Agree: Twodees Partain
    • Replies: @Alden
  96. Harbinger says:


    As regards to the article, it’s a pointless one. Royalty is untouchable, regardless what they do. They murdered Diana and nothing happened, very probably because the Crown Prosecution Service happens to take its orders from the crown. No policeman will arrest royalty, because they work for the crown. No judge or lawyer will prosecute royalty, because they work for the crown. So bottom line is they can do whatever they want – divine rule and rights of kings.

    The only way that people are going to free themselves from the control of the Crown is to essentially remove the Crown from the police force, the armed forces and the judiciary. When that happens they will no longer be immune to prosecution and rightful imprisonment for their wrongdoings.
    But again, this is never going to happen.

  97. melpol says:

    Lets not break the world down to good guys and bad guys, we are all scum. Except there are a few hypocrites that play the good guys and when nobody’s looking behave like the rest of the scum. Sex laws have to be relaxed and sexual perversions must be legalized and overlooked. Only political and financial crimes have to be highlighted. People are born from scum and have the right to behave like scum.

  98. If Epstein was a blackmailer, he broke a lot of rules of the game.

    Rule 1. Do not let your victims know about each other. They will only be manageable if they feel alone.

    Rule 2. Conceal the fact you are a blackmailer. If word gets out about your activities you won’t get any more victims.

    Rule 3. Do not let your victims know where you live. They might come after you.

    Epstein was a pimp. He ran a club for perverts who wanted to rape children and he used his contacts to shelter the club members from prosecution. The members no doubt promised to advance the careers of other members and to respect the interests of an unnamed foreign power.

    Everybody understood the arrangement from the outset. There was no entrapment. The pervs knew they were being recorded but also knew that evidence would never surface as long as they respected club rules.

    The problem with the Blackmail’s narrative is it makes the club members, however loathsome, into victims. They were willing participants.

    And what happened to all the videos Epstein gathered to enforce club rules?

    BTW there was an entry in Epstein’s book for Dr Ellie Wiesell.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  99. anonymous[403] • Disclaimer says:

    He picked a tough sounding, masculine, all-American name for himself to project an image. Probably the opposite of the reality.

    • Replies: @Alden
  100. Harbinger says:
    @Gordon Pratt

    “BTW there was an entry in Epstein’s book for Dr Ellie Wiesell.”

    I think you’ll find there was most certainly lots of high profile names in his book, hence why he was ‘suicided’, although many believe, including myself, he’s living in Israel.

  101. Skeptikal says:

    Go back to the farm, or where ever it was that you were able and permitted to screw and impregnate your girlfriend at the age of 12.
    This very long post is also very silly.
    The faux scientific pontificating persona has earned a few LOLs.

    • Replies: @Skeptikal
    , @Harbinger
  102. Skeptikal says:

    This reply is attached to the wrong post.

  103. @Chet Roman

    When did Ghislaine Maxwell convert to Judaism?

    This about her mother from Wikipedia:

    “She was born Elisabeth Jenny Jeanne Meynard in La Grive, near Saint-Alban-de-Roche, France, to Louis “Paul” Meynard and Colombe (née Petel) Meynard. Paul Meynard was a Protestant descendant of the Huguenot aristocracy and Colombe Meynard was a Roman Catholic (whose marriage to a Protestant resulted in her excommunication). Her father Paul owned a silk-weaving factory and was the mayor of the village. Elisabeth had one sibling, an older sister, Yvonne. Her parents sent her to England at age nine to attend the convent of Our Lady of Compassion at Acocks Green in Birmingham. In 1932, she returned to France. Elisabeth Meynard studied law at the Sorbonne”

    There is nothing about her converting to Judaism before Ghislaine’s birth or at all.

  104. @lauris71

    That seems to be a good analysis. But there is no reason why a jury properly instructed on reasonable doubt shouldn’t have had enough doubt that Prince Andrew knew he was doing whatever might have constituted the crime in question, assuming it wasn’t a crime of strict liability or one for wwhich the onus of proof had been reversed.

  105. @anon

    Assuming the truth of what you say you remember being reported what does it have to do with pederasty?

    In fact you seem to have exhibited a willingness to sound off without evidence on the basis of a faulty memory or lack of discrimination about sources.

    It appears he was promoted to Vice Admiral in 2015. See

    • Replies: @Alden
  106. Jeff Stryker 65, “Why would the CIA endorse an operation ON US SOIL that involved a sloppy pervert bird-dogging the local high school?”

    Because they know they can get away with it.

    This has been another episode of Simple Answers to Stupid Questions.

  107. Harbinger says:

    You were replying to me and not to Sean.
    The reply is clearly beyond your intellect, as well as others on here who are incapable of understanding the difference between natural laws and man’s laws.

    Now, Skeptical, of which your name most certainly was the worst one, someone like you, with your view, should never have chosen. You most certainly are not skeptical.

    So let’s see your line on reality shall we? Let’s see just how skeptical you are?

    1. What is puberty?
    2. Why do girls and boys reach puberty at the ages they do?
    3. In most cultures around the world, why do they promote womanhood and manhood, for children once they reach puberty?
    4. Do you believe that a man or a woman can choose their sexual identity or does nature do that for them?
    5. Do you believe an individual should have authority over their body, or should a body of men/women (government/lawlords), who have no relation to them whatsoever?
    6. Do you believe in consent?
    7. Do you therefore believe that another/s should have authority over another without their consent?
    8. Why have the laws for sexual reproduction changed over the years, initially starting when children reached puberty?
    9. Who were those people to enforce laws upon others, outwith their consent, to have sexual reproduction at the age of their choosing, once they’d reached puberty?
    10 Who or what is the law and who was it that decided it should be an authority over the lives of people who gave no consent, whatsoever to it being enforced upon them?
    11. Do you believe in natural laws having authority over man or man having authority over nature?

    You see, there’s a problem in society and that problem is people like you who THINK you know what’s going on, but really haven’t the foggiest, whatsoever.
    You start off by insulting those who have farms by telling me to go back to one and have sex with a 12 year old, when you fail to see that before the corporatists, the Jewish bankers etc started flooding countries with cheap corn, as they did in the UK, in order to drive them into the cities and work in their factories, everyone lived in the country and many worked/owned on a farm. And everyone then DID have sex as 12 year olds and have children. Child mortality rate was exceptionally high.

    There’s nothing scientific about it. It’s merely promoting the truth that natural laws are absolute and control life on this earth. It is man, who is rebelling against natural laws in order to continue authoritarianism and tyranny over the population.

    Here in the UK, as stated Edward 1st brought in the law of minimum age of sexual consent at 12, in 1275. It was 600 years later that Parliament changed this law, due to the fear of young women being sold into brothels, to the age of 13. Ten years later it was raised to 16 with the Criminal Law Amendment Act 1885
    Now this is what people like you are incapable of understanding, because you’re NOT skeptical in the least, instead you simply follow the herd and go baaah; the Criminal Law Amendment Act 1885 was essentially campaigned by and brought into power BY FEMINISTS!

    So let’s see shall we? For 600 years, from the initial law, created by Edward 1st, it was perfectly acceptable to procreate at the age of 12, but 600 years later, when the Jews have full control of the empire, the Protocols of Zion are being implemented within society, feminism is being promoted to bring women into the workplace as well as giving them power and influence over society, they decide to increase the age restriction of sexual reproduction by 4 years to 16.

    Considering that back then, as stated, child mortality rate was very high, by stopping procreation at a younger age, more people are going to die and therefore you are going to restrict population growth.
    What is the current agenda on whites? Genocide by any chance? And what is feminism if not the destruction of the family unit and thus lowering of birth rates? Anyone who believes that feminism was really all about rights for women hasn’t a clue about conspiracy. The first suffragettes were not only aristocrats but Fabian Socialists.

    There is a COLOSSAL difference between the natural reproduction of a man and a woman and the perversity and depravity of homosexuality. The Criminal Law Amendment Act 1885 was essentially the first piece of legislation, brought about by Jews, to stop the natural procreation within the United Kingdom that had existed for thousands upon thousands of years. It was essentially the first piece of legislation for the DEPOPULATION agenda of European peoples.
    Nature defines male and female gender and when a child/woman/man is ready to procreate, NOT a lawlord.

    You and other idiots like you are incapable of joining the dots and seeing the bigger picture.

    • Troll: Alden
  108. @Jeff Stryker

    Why are they prepared to do these things?

    You have probably not worked in social services or law enforcement.

    Part of it is probably to do with getting older men to provide them with drugs and alcohol. Obviously not all working class white girls get into this scene, but some of the more delinquently inclined ones do, especially when they come from homes where there is drink, drugs, and crime.

    One of the most stunning statistics I have ever heard, which has been verified, is that 33% of the men born in Britain in 1953 have at least one criminal conviction. These will be nearly all white men, born before there was any kind of drug problem in England, whose parents were veterans of World War II.

    I was born two years earlier, but if I had been asked to guess the number of that cohort who had criminal convictions, I would have guessed around 5%. Nope! Not even close. In fact 9% of the women born the same year had criminal convictions too.

    Having lived in Florida for many years, it would not surprise me in the least if an equal number or greater of the men of the same age as Ms Giuffre/Roberts’ father’s generation living in Florida have similar records. Certainly, in various areas of social services, it is quite difficult to find male employees as a large proportion of potential applicants are ruled out for criminal records.

    So there are a lot of delinquent families living in a trailer park near you, and when relatively large amounts of money, like $300 are being handed out in no questions cash, money talks and there are plenty of people ready to lend an ear.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Michael888
  109. anonymous[324] • Disclaimer says:

    Britain should go to the bicycle riding monarchies like they have in Holland, Denmark and Norway, where there is no fuss made about the princes and princesses and how “elite” they are. In these countries the sovereign is just seen as representing the people and are much closer to the people than these hundreds of entitled snobs that run around Britain. The reason that Britain is this way is probably due to the fact that many of the wealthy titled British families intermarried with rich Jews in the 19th century. These people are Jews being Jews and having a British title just plays into their already built in feelings of superiority to everyone.

  110. Alden says:

    I for one am repulsed by the idiots who think sex with 17 year olds in states where the age of consent is 18 are pedophiles.

    I’m used to Jeff’s sex and porn posts. That’s his occupation after all.

    But this Harbinger pervert posting about sex with girls as soon as they menstruate and with boys as soon as they “produce sperm” ejaculate, jack off etc is just obscene.
    Lots of men who have sex with their own 10, 11, old and teen daughters justify it that it’s better the girls learn from kind caring Daddy than rude crude teen boy.

    27 years in sex crimes. Most were just rapists of non family members . But a few did their pre teen daughters. 27 years in sex crimes. My expertise in questioning and investigating sex offenders leads me to suspect Harbinger of……… something

  111. Sean says:

    You are getting confused with th Florida schoolgirls under age sex and soliciting conviction of Epstein. Epstein never faced any charges at all in relation to Virginia Roberts/Giuffre, and she was not used as a witness by prosecutors either. They obviously did not think her stories were credible. Rich men bang the help, and I can believe Epstein did her. Her assertion to have been sleeping with presidents and prime ministers on Epstein’s orders makes is highly dubious though.

    Giuffre being employed by Epstein as a masseuse is hardly evidence of her being any kind of prostitute or victim that Andrew had a duty to inform the authorities about. Andrew denies having any sexual contact with her. There simply is no possible case against Andrew. The royals are used to these kind of baseless allegations. I would like someone to tell me why she was in possession of that photograph if Epstein was the blackmailer.

    • Replies: @Bill
  112. anonymous[324] • Disclaimer says:

    The people who made these laws were just trying to set some guidelines to protect young girls and boys from predators. A civilized society is a society of laws which may not seem logical, especially over the passage of time, but nevertheless were intended to protect the young. Our society has changed dramatically and young people have more knowledge about sex than old people did 100 years ago. The one thing that hasn’t changed is that while nature might make young girls of 12 able to get pregnant, it doesn’t mean that their maturity is capable of fully appreciating the gravity of the situation. The laws are still valid because a certain segment of older men need to be kept in their place and give the state the means to prosecute those that violate the law. Most men who might approach a 12 year old girl for sex if it was totally legal don’t because there are severe penalties for doing so. The men who aren’t controlled by the threat of punishment for any wrongdoing fill our prisons. Just because the system is flawed doesn’t mean that these child protection laws should be thrown out. Look at countries that have little or no protection for minors, are they better than what we have? If you don’t like it here you can always move to Thailand, India or the Philippines that have little or no protection for children. Oh, I just heard, they’ve started deporting people who are caught violating young children back to the US or Europe. Hard to get away from those pesky laws. Anarchy is so much more fun!

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  113. Alden says:

    First, nothing forced you to work in gay bars.

    If bouncer was the only job you could get there are many more heterosexual bars and clubs than gay. Also auditoriums stadiums and other venues provide plenty of jobs for bouncers.

    Second, your obsession with very young girls first menstruation is truly sick to the point of mental illness and perversion. Same with boys first production of sperm. Unheard of amongst adults with normal sex preferences.

    Third , 27 years as a probation officer in the sex crimes unit. In depositions and law courts I’m what is known as an expert witness about sex crimes and crime in general, just as a doctor plumber accountant and others are accepted as expert witnesses in their occupations.

    If you had children and talked about them you write about children on this site the neighbors might call child services.

    Maybe in your sick perverted mind you don’t realize how bizarre your obsession with children is.

    • Replies: @anon
  114. Alden says:

    Google Jeff Stryker.

    This one claims to live In Thailand. The Jeff Stryker on the internet lives in Los Angeles. He’s a real person. He’s a porn actor, gay and heterosexual, producer and distributor. He’s suing a coffee house next door because the noise of the customers annoys him. He lives in his porn studio.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  115. @Alden

    I only read his posts occasionally and can’t say I have noticed a preoccupation with sex and porn. Arw you sure you are not exhibiting a variation on that marvellous witticism about every problem looking like a nail to a man with a hammer?

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  116. @Moi

    I indeed have a problem with sandfleas who worship an epileptic elf who raped children and made up ‘visions’ to bang his buddies’ wives. Eff pedo-mohammed, right in the neck. islam delenda est.

  117. Harbinger says:

    First off, there is only one purpose for sexual intercourse and that’s the procreation of the species, nothing else. The concept of love is a societal construct. Unconditional love exists between mother and child and to a point father and vice versa, but between a man and a woman it’s conditional and therefore not love. People have relationships solely, today, for the sexual aspect, the recreational aspect of sex which is pleasure seeking.

    Secondly, if you had read what I wrote you will see that the age of sexual consent was, since 1275, 12 years old for 600 years. It changed all of a sudden, in 1875, ironically when a feminist got involved???
    You state:

    “A civilized society is a society of laws which may not seem logical, especially over the passage of time, but nevertheless were intended to protect the young. Our society has changed dramatically and young people have more knowledge about sex than old people did 100 years ago. The one thing that hasn’t changed is that while nature might make young girls of 12 able to get pregnant, it doesn’t mean that their maturity is capable of fully appreciating the gravity of the situation.”

    We are talking for 600 years, the age of sexual consent was 12 years old. Child mortality rate was incredibly high. If people hadn’t been procreating at a young age, there would have been no UK population!!!
    As stated, girls at the age of 12 already could keep the house, sew, knit, mend, darn, cook, clean, wash….and the boys were working also in their various jobs, able to understand nature, flora and fauna, scout the land, understand the lay of the land. They were far more knowledgeable than their counterparts today. They were also far more responsible and thus far more mature!
    Women at the age of 12, 100 years ago, could do far more and were more knowledgeable than women in their 30’s today. Many women today are nothing more than 8 year old girls in 20+ year old bodies! They can’t cook, clean, sew, darn, mend…they haven’t a clue about nature and the land around them. They’re whizzkids on I-phones and can type a text message in no time, but that’s it – trapped in arrested development.

    They have dumbed down society. They have purposefully made young boys and girls ignorant on the world around them in ORDER to be protected by the state – “Oh the children….think of the children….” and just put a dead child on the cover of a newspaper and every woman is begging their government to open the floodgates on immigration.

    You seem to misunderstand me and there are many like me who see that sexual intercourse is there, only for one purpose. I have absolutely NO desire of using a woman’s vagina as a masturbatory device. It is an utterly pointless act that wastes, time and energy.
    But you see, here’s the thing that so many heterosexuals fail to understand. They are all, pretty much engaging in homosexual activity. They are all masturbating one another off, with no productive output – offspring, the very purpose for sex. And in acting like homosexuals, the condone homosexuality, because they are heterosexual homosexuals when it comes to sex. And worse, they murder their unborn, because it might affect their career.

    Again you also fail to see the concept, like many, of consent. Laws are created by people who force their authority over people who do not give their consent – tyranny.
    No man/woman/s has any authority over any other unless they specifically give their consent.
    You, in your consent of being under the authority over another have essentially waved goodbye to your freedom and submitted yourself to slavery. You haven’t the concept of freedom, because you believe that you should be governed by people who you seem to think not only know better than you, but will protect you and do what’s best for you. In other words, you are still very much an immature child, not the very mature children of yesteryear, who grew up incredibly quickly and actually knew what freedom was and most certainly ended up fighting and dying for it in some battle.

    Anarchy is the only answer against tyranny. Those who choose to live in whatever state, other than anarchy, fail to see that they are happy slaves, oblivious to see that the shepherd (government) always takes his sheep (you) to the slaughter.

    And as for protection of children, well, where was it in Rotherham? Where is all over the UK, where Muslims have free reign to molest the young, where the police don’t get involved for, what we’re told, is fear of racism, when in reality, they’ll all be in on it, procuring those children for wealthy government officials, you like to support and vote for, because you think that government is good for society.

    • Replies: @Daniel Rich
    , @Alden
  118. @Harbinger

    We don’t know the exact speed of human evolution. Excavations have shown us changes over extended periods of time.

    Perhaps nature has not kept up with human life expectancy being in upward trajectory [although in some countries that’s in reverse as we speak] and the necessity to produce offspring can [or should] move upward with it.

    When there’s little food, polar bears skip having cubs until a time when food is aplenty.

    My family tree runs back to 1122 A.D., but even back then, nobody married that young [age 12 to 16]. Lots of kids died, that’s for sure and most lives didn’t last as long as they do now.

    In Epstain’s case, they went after him for trafficking underage minors. That fact still stands undisputed, regardless who one wants to blame for girls being in such a horrid situation.

    side note: according to one of my friends, who teaches at an elementary school, the menstrual cycle in girls has dropped quite a bit [age-wise]. From a natural pov [longer lives] that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Alden
    , @anon
    , @Harbinger
  119. eah says:


    “People should also note this: the story has been faded — the media is deliberately not covering it; this is entirely intentional”


  120. Alden says:
    @Daniel Rich

    There’s been lots of research into medieval and early modern marriage and family customs since women’s studies began.

    Lots of research proved that for most people in early modern Europe average age of marriage for women was about 18-22 and men about 27-30. It varied according to country, and economics. Early marriage when times were good, later marriage when times were bad.

    Another thing ignorant pervert Harbinger doesn’t understand is the average of first menstruation until about the last 170 years was several years later, mid to even late teens.

    That’s because of poor nutrition and lack of plentiful candles, oil and kerosene lamps and electricity. Because of poor nutrition poor English girls often didn’t menstruate till 17.

    Harbinger the ignorant pervert doesn’t know what triggers first menstruation although he is obsessed with the subject.

    First menses or the maturation of the first of the 450-500 eggs a girl is born with is triggered by the ratio of fat to bones and muscles. That’s why those scrawny , starving 5ft 2 80 pd working pauper class English girls started menses so late compared to well fed girls.

    Light has a lot to do with first menses too. Until about 1830 when kerosene lamps cane along people lived in semi darkness when the sun went down. Candles and even oil lamps cost money.

    So, until about 1900, few girls menstruated till much later than 12 because physiology adjusts to the times. Electricity affordable kerosene lamps and good nutrition resulting in fat to muscle and bone ratios favorable to early weren’t possible to early menstruation till around 1900.

    The McCormick reaper refrigeration and the railroads and ships that brought American and Russian wheat and Argentine beef to Europe had a lot to do with improved nutrition.

    It’s true that most history is written about the elites because they kept records. All those princesses and upper aristocrats did marry at 14 but didn’t have their first baby till years later.

    And don’t try to refute me with Margaret Beaufort. She only did it because as a girl she couldn’t become a sovereign Queen in the warlord anarchy of England at the time. But she knew a son of hers could. So she had her first and only child a boy at 13 or 14, accounts vary.

    Harbinger needs to get off his menstruating child porn sites and read some anatomy and physiology sites.

    I’ve heard of perverts who want to drink milk out of breast feeding women. I know what gays do with glass table tops and cheese. But sexually obsessed with 10-12 year olds who are menstruating is new for me.

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  121. @Sick of Orcs

    What’s so damning about everyone smiling and so happy, and why not? 16 is the age of consent in the UK.

    • Replies: @Sick of Orcs
  122. Alden says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Lol naturally his family connections had nothing to do with his promotion. Just a few months before retirement so he’d get the vice admiral pension.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  123. @Alden

    Describing reality != “advocating”.

    We now have western countries where the age of consent is higher than the voting age in local elections.

    Do you, as an expert witness, see it as an indicator of sexual perversion if one notices the underlying absurdity of such laws in an era of multiple Rotherhams?

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Daniel Rich
  124. @Harbinger

    How about males of certain species [I saw a male zebra do it in the wild] who kill the preexisting offspring before they mate, does that give me a big thumbs up to do the same?

    And girls are girls, not adult women. Treat both with respect, but focus most of your energy on the latter.

    Harpies, harlots, whores [not saying you, Harbinger, said that, to my knowledge]?



    The way some of you guys turn victims into perps is truly sickening.

    • Agree: Alden
    • Replies: @Harbinger
  125. sally says:

    Thanks for the article and the organization of its contents.. they help. But I think it might be more productive to focus on how to frame a set of null hypotheses in complete enough fashion to allow proactive involvement of every person interested in getting to the truth of this question Does external foreign or criminal influence control or influence the behaviors of persons, agencies or elected officials in the USA? if so what agency, person or contractor has not been compromised ?

    I think a great deal of investigative journalism should be framed in hypothesis to be tested formats.. Then, for each hypothesis discuss the matters related, present the then known facts and prove or disprove or leave open for want of evidence to prove the null the hypothesis.. By using the hypothesis frame work, the journalist commits the audience to the investigation..

    Articles such as this one come and go.. people forget the names, points made and miss or ignore items missing from the article..and cannot later retrieve the article itself. But the hypothesis that still stand keep getting closer and closer to the failure of evidence to prove the null. By employing a method of research as a journalist endeavor (say by creating and numbering a set of hypothesis) and then by setting out to prove the null for each of the hypothesis ( may serve to keep the salient facts in everyone’s mind and help to discover and properly state updated and related hypothesis to be tested. The collective works remained connected, and can lead to a final statement for which no nullifying evidence exist.

    Hypothesis: At least one of Epstein’s behavior was directed by a Mossad agency. <= what evidence proves this statement wrong?
    Hypothesis; Epstein modified at least one of his behaviors to suit or accommodate a Mossad Agency.
    Hypothesis: X was (is) directed by a Mossad agency. <= what evidence proves this s statement wrong?
    Hypothesis: The FBI is directed by a Mossad agency < what evidence proves this statement wrong?
    Hypothesis: At least one behavior of highly placed persons in the FBI was influenced by a Mossad Agency <what evidence proves this statement wrong? and if slightly wrong, how should the hypothesis be amended to accommodate in the hypothesis the new or better understood information.
    Hypothesis: At least one of Trump's behaviors was (is) directed by a Mossad agency < what evidence proves this statement wrong?
    Hypothesis: Epstein was a CIA agent?
    Hypothesis: At least one of Epstein's behaviors was directed by a CIA agency.
    Hypothesis: Members of the CIA are directed by one or more foreign agencies.
    Hypothesis: Epstein, et. al was a CIA Agency
    Hypothesis: Epstein was directed by an agency of Saudi Arabia..
    Hypothesis: The political party (D or R) candidates for elected office in the USA are denied access to party backed candidacy until and unless the hopeful person candidate has been compromised by a Mossad Agency?
    To prove the null (that this statement is wrong) it is only necessary to show that at least one of the elected persons h/n/b compromised by a Mossad Agency?
    Until such proof is presented the hypothesis and statement stand.

    What is needed is an ever narrowing set of continuously undated and restated and improve hypothesis or set of hypothesis which stand as true until evidence sufficient to prove their positive statement ( the null ) wrong. If the journalist involves everyone's help it might not be long until a lot of questions appear that need evidence to deny them. Active searches for the answers and evidence by the audience could result in proving nulls and finally shed a lot of light on this problem the journalist is investigating.

    Also such a method makes it possible to advance ideas that might be impossible using narrative methods only

  126. @Harbinger

    Creepy is as creepy does, Creep.

  127. Truth says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Has anyone ever shoved a toothpick in your eye before?

    OK, so how do you know it hurts?

  128. Truth says:

    As the Greeks used to say, “boys are for pleasure, girls are for babies…”

  129. Truth says:

    I am pretty sure that nobody thinks that Prince Andrew violently raped underage girls.

    Well for what it is worth, I certainly don’t think he ENJOYED doing it.

  130. anon[661] • Disclaimer says:

    Third , 27 years as a probation officer in the sex crimes unit. In depositions and law courts I’m what is known as an expert witness about sex crimes and crime in general, just as a doctor plumber accountant and others are accepted as expert witnesses in their occupations.

    Good on you.
    You may remember a Royal Commission into Sexual Abuse of Boys in the U.K. a few years ago.
    The Association of Probation Officers was legally represented at the Inquiry.
    Why was that, do you think?

    • Replies: @Alden
  131. Alden says:

    Rotherham , Oxford and child rape all over England happened because the sex crime laws were not enforced . That was the reason.

    The local government ordered the police to leave the child rapists alone. The police, fearful of losing their jobs or being sued into poverty didn’t enforce the law.

    The written laws weren’t the problem. Refusal to enforce them was.

    Had the police enforced the laws when it started the rapists would have been in prison. The rest would have backed off from the girls.

    It was like leaving a huge store open with no staff for anyone to come in and take what they wanted.
    Some speculate the police and politicians enjoyed the girls. But far as I know, no girls have claimed they were pimped to White English men, just low life Muslims.

    The laws should have been enforced. The police youth workers and politicians should be in prison for conspiring to aid and abet prostitution, rape, beatings and any and all violations a prosecutor can find.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  132. @Alden

    How much thread are you going to waste going on this? We’re talking about real-life issues.

    As a former probation officer you might have a valid insight into why public morals are collapsing.

    It is a shame that instead of offering insight from a probate officer’s point of view, instead you wish to waste space on silly ad hominems.

    Some of your comments actually have some interesting points.

  133. Alden says:
    @Daniel Rich

    First menses is triggered by the ratio of fat to the rest of the body. When it reaches a certain point the first egg ripens and moves down the Fallopian tubes.,

    We’ve all been getting fat in the last 40 years, children too. That’s why, what percent of the body is fat.

    Medieval and early modern times, 15, 16 was normal, not 12. If we continue getting fatter it will be 10, soon. Now days the poor have food cards and welfare. Until after WW2 the poor were thinner than the better fed middle class.

  134. @Wizard of Oz

    There is a King’s Cross in every country. I am not talking about that. What I was discussing was the alarming ease with which half a high school was willing to stampede over to the house of a leathery old pedo for $200 to trade the bodies for cash as quickly as a hardened King’s Cross hooker.

    This is not a good sign. Thirty years ago it would not have happened. When I was fifteen, fathers kept a close eye on their daughters. There was always a so-called slag or two, but in 1989 you would never have seen an entire high school full of girls leaping like a kangaroo to engage in prostitution.

    Epstein is amoral. Okay. We know that some men are amoral. Ivan Milat was amoral. Charles Manson was amoral. Amoral men are as common as mud.

    What is disturbing are the disintegrating morals of girls. These were not King’s Cross hookers on the game for 10 years. They were high school girls.

  135. @Jonathan Mason

    No, I have never been a social worker or police officer. I am just a civilian who finds it disturbing that a single high school is so full of girls willing to work as prostitutes at age 15.

    Epstein was not the usual black pimp at the bus stop looking for runaways. These girls went to his house on their own volition. He did not have them hooked heroin or whatever.

    I don’t doubt these white girls were what used to be known as trailer trash or came from shabby lower-income backgrounds. But it is astonishing so many girls in a single high school could have trailer trash morals.

    Epstein was not up in Times Square scouring the “Minnesota Strip” for teen runaways. This was white suburbia (Or exurbia) and not an inner-city.

    As for those born in 1953 I’d argue that his generation came of age in the seventies and were hit hardest by drugs. Especially the crack era.

    Also, many middle-class kids do something really stupid in college. Some borderline-felony frat prank.

    And drunk driving is fairly common. Both in the US and in Britain.

  136. @Jonathan Mason

    A third of black males in the US will have a felony conviction in their lifetimes.
    If a third of British men born in 1953 have criminal convictions, it is probably mostly for misdemeanors or sting operations/ protests/ similar “victimless crimes”. Was it a statistical abnormality or were there similar “criminal” conviction rates for other pre- and post- ’53 years?

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
  137. anon[316] • Disclaimer says:
    @Daniel Rich

    … the menstrual cycle in girls has dropped quite a bit [age-wise]. From a natural pov [longer lives] that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.

    The average age of menarche in Germany in 1750 was 17 years of age.
    That was when 95% of people were farmers and spent their lives outdoors in the Sun.

    Bottom Line:
    We now live in the dark, so the age of menarche will continue to decline.
    Another commenter says the Age of Consent was 12 in England for 600 years.
    That’s hard to believe, since girls at that time weren’t mature until at least 17.

  138. Jake says:

    The very most ELITE of WASPs in bed with something fairly close to the worst of Anglophere Jews (wh0 are the worst Jews in the world, save the bunch ruling Israel, which is a creation of the UK and USA).

    No way that ever happened. You mean spirited anti-Semites need to stop talking bad about Prince Andrew. WASP Elites are to be admired, respected, adored. If they are in bed with Jews, it is for your own good.

  139. @anon

    Maybe hard to believe, but easy to research.

  140. Harbinger says:
    @Daniel Rich

    “In Epstain’s case, they went after him for trafficking underage minors. That fact still stands undisputed, regardless who one wants to blame for girls being in such a horrid situation.”

    They knew about Epstein for a very long time, before the last election, before Obama, before Clinton….They went after him because they want to get Trump out of office as he’s not bombing Iran, as he’s supposed to be doing but stalling.

    “side note: according to one of my friends, who teaches at an elementary school, the menstrual cycle in girls has dropped quite a bit [age-wise]. From a natural pov [longer lives] that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.”

    I can’t answer that. I do know that the use of Bisphenol A on the rinsing of beer and baby bottles has resulted in human tampering with sexuality (creating homosexuality) along with women throwing sanitary towels and urinating while on the birth control pill into the toilet tampering with hormones, due to getting into the water supply.

  141. Che Guava says:

    On a lighter note, Captain Sensible, of the English punk band, The Damned, made a few fun pop-disco songs, before they adopted a dull stadium-rock meets goth style. The link below is to one titled Rnyal Rave up. Tnpic:Prince Andrew. It is a good song, and funny,

    This is not to say that I approve of youtube, it is a very cynical means of copyright violation, Japanese rights-holders (and I would guess those in many in other places) are very strict about youube not stealimg their works.

    … and yes, I bought the recording of this.

  142. Harbinger says:
    @Daniel Rich

    “And girls are girls, not adult women. Treat both with respect, but focus most of your energy on the latter”.

    Again, throughout history, all over the world in all cultures, including our own, a girl became a woman when she began her menstrual cycle and a boy a man with the production of semen. They were ready to procreate.
    What’s annoying me about this debate, not with you, as at least you can debate objectively without attacking people because they have an opposing opinion, is the fact that for 3/4 of the last millennium, society was procreating with women as early as the age of 13. This was law.

    Now look at the scenario? Imagine if all of a sudden, just as they did in 1875, they changed the sex laws here in the UK and stated – “We have decided that the minimum age of consent for women and men to procreate here in the UK is 25”?
    The agenda of the elites/rulers is to eventually outlaw all heterosexual relationships and bring in homosexuality as the norm.

    You and all others have, courtesy of living in the time, accepted that a girl is any female under the age of 18 or whatever. That she becomes a woman at 18. This is social conditioning (indoctrination) to accept something completely unnatural as normal. A girl is essentially a female who isn’t menstruating, just as a boy is a male who hasn’t started producing sperm.
    Now, people on here will, of course, bring about the ‘psychological’ aspect of it and state that they’re not mature enough mentally.
    Who’s fault is that?
    Could it be that society has deliberately dumbed down people, stopping them from maturing at a much earlier age? What is the reason for this? Well, it’s blatantly obvious as to why. As stated already, look back into your country’s past and see maturity levels amongst the young. Children, in the past by the age of 12 were nearing adulthood. The girls could run a home, sew, nit, darn, mend, cook, clean. The boys could hunt, knew how to scout and track wild animals, how to build, how to survive. Now look at the situation today? Most women haven’t a clue how to cook, not, sew, darn in their 20’s!!!

    What I’m stating should really be obvious to people, but they are not clicking. For most of the last millennium and before, there was no debate or argument on girls, who were having children at 13. it was perfectly natural. But then, along comes the elites and feminists and create legislation which instantly raises the age of consent from 13 to 16. This argument has NOTHING whatsoever to do with titillation and perversity of having sex with young girls purely for their own, warped, perverted purposes, far from it. This argument is about cutting off natural procreation ages and the dumbing down of the young. People are incapable of seeing this. Like I stated feminism arrived in the latter part of the 19th century, then society changed drastically and our procreation levels began to drop, to the point that now, 150 years later, essentially our population is between 1&2 in the west, with 2 at the required number of children a family needs, to replace the mother and the father. If they don’t the overall population begins to fall. It means that if you’re only having one child, the population growth is dropping by 50% every generation.

    The agenda for the elites is depopulation, more importantly white genocide. Jews are behind this. We know this.

    “Harpies, harlots, whores [not saying you, Harbinger, said that, to my knowledge]?”

    I don’t know what you’re addressing, possibly Rotherham, but let’s be clear about this, many of the young women, involved in the scandal were chasing drugs, good times, parties and sex. We have to stop this nonsense now of looking at these women as innocents. Many of them most certainly were not, with alot certainly being sexually active in their early teens.
    Hypergamy kicks in, in women, at an early age. Hypergamy is the natural desire for women to seek a stronger male, to procreate with, who will have stronger genes, thus stronger offspring and ofcourse a better chance of survival. All women have this. I have seen this a lot. I watched, when I was in my teens, fellow girls ALL chasing the older, wealthier men in order to secure their futures. This is why, when you’re at school, the girls in your year are always dating the older men. It’s a natural instinct and a natural attraction that is inbuilt within women. Men do the exact opposite. They have always gone for the younger women – healthier younger women, have a much higher survival rate during childbirth than older women.
    Have you not noticed that they are promoting older women in society with younger men? And then there’s the madness of women freezing their eggs in order to have them fertilized when they’re older and have had a successful business career, to then become mothers in their late 40’s onwards?

    We have to stop looking at the female sex as this innocent young thing who doesn’t know what she’s doing and is unaware of bad people out there who want her for sex. Many young girls are sexually active in their early teens, along with boys. This has now, gone full circle. The only difference is that unlike in the past, 13/14 year old girls weren’t just jumping on men to have sex for the sake of self pleasure, sex was about procreation and starting a family.
    What’s happening today is very much the promotion of what Aldous Huxley wrote in Brave New World – rut like rabbits but DON’T procreate. You’ll find that many young women are having abortions, without their parent’s knowledge, having seen doctors respecting client/doctor confidentiality, regardless of age of the girl. Many teenage girls know exactly what they’re doing and many manipulate men to get what they can.
    The concept of ‘innocence’ amongst teenage boys and girls is a modern creation. In the past, you had to fight to survive. Innocence, back then, probably ended when they were around 6.

  143. Harbinger says:

    “Rotherham , Oxford and child rape all over England happened because the sex crime laws were not enforced . That was the reason.”

    I won’t deny that, that’s obvious.

    “The local government ordered the police to leave the child rapists alone. The police, fearful of losing their jobs or being sued into poverty didn’t enforce the law.”

    While I certainly agree that the local government told the police to back off, I do not, for one minute believe that the police didn’t enforce the sex laws through fear of being called racists. I don’t believe that one minute.

    I have come to realise that the police, here in the UK, have absolutely no respect, nor concern for the citizens and are merely enforcing the will of the Crown Corporation which is the destruction of this land. It is my belief that had the police been right wing and lovers of their people, they’d have turned around to their chiefs and told them to get lose, got in their car and arrested the Muslims responsible. More so, if they hadn’t gone in this direction, they’d have liaised with locals and the white, criminal underworld, passed on information to them and let them sort it out.
    The police are corrupt and the ‘fearful of racist charge’ is BS, created as a smokescreen to deceive the public.
    If anything, the Rotherham incident should have woken people up, in the UK, to the fact that the police are not there to protect them, but to protect the elites and enforce, whatever their masters wish upon the UK populous.

    “The police youth workers and politicians should be in prison for conspiring to aid and abet prostitution, rape, beatings and any and all violations a prosecutor can find.”

    Again, I won’t deny the above.
    However, on a more important note, had they NOT allowed the mass immigration of Muslims, into the UK, from 1969 onwards, heeded the words of Powell and better still elected him into power, we would not have had Rotherham or any of the madness we have today.
    But they didn’t and they didn’t for a reason. Powell was overwhelmingly the people’s choice for leader. Instead they brought in the paedophile (a man who had sex with pre pubescent children/infants most notably boys – the real meaning of paeophile), who MI5 had dossiers on and ordered him to take the UK into the EEC and start the ball rolling of mass immigration into the UK.

    But many people will not see this, nor recognise this. In the past, this wouldn’t have happened. Young girls and boys (13 upwards) would have known what was going on, instead of today’s younger generation hooked on nonsense films, music and MSM, utterly oblivious to what’s going on around them, worse, like their adult peers and parents, also hooked on nonsense films, music and MSM.

    Society has been deliberately dumbed down for obvious reasons – they don’t notice the smoke and mirrors. They live behind a facade of pure evil that seeks to obliterate their culture, their nation, their civilisation and their race and worse, when people try to inform them of this, they attack them, defending their assassins and their society continues to plummet off the edge of a cliff.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
    , @Alden
    , @Alden
  144. Harbinger says:

    “Bottom Line:
    We now live in the dark, so the age of menarche will continue to decline.
    Another commenter says the Age of Consent was 12 in England for 600 years.
    That’s hard to believe, since girls at that time weren’t mature until at least 17.”

    Read the following: The Average Age Women Got Their First Period, Throughout History
    The average age, pretty much throughout history was around 13-14 for the start of menstruation.
    My only conclusions as to fluctuations in this are most certainly population control. Now I do know that there certainly is tampering with the food and water supplies, thus bringing on puberty at an earlier age, but then there’s also the natural aspect of it. People, European people that is, fail to see that their population is plummeting. This could very well be nature lowering the age of puberty in order to rectify this and thus increase the European population. Women are simply not procreating, courtesy of choosing a career over children. This is wrong, so, so, wrong. Women’s primary job is procreation on this earth. Careers are a societal construct and are nothing in the grand scheme of things, the chasing of pieces of paper to live a material existence is a truly sad path to follow.

    Is nature, making girls menstruate at a younger age in order to bring about procreation at a much earlier age? I don’t know. I haven’t researched it enough, but one thing is for certain; if European peoples do not start procreating and having more children, then the European peoples will become a minority in their own lands and then, any (((peoples))) who would wish to genocide them will have a much easier time doing so.

    • Replies: @Flo
  145. Harbinger says:

    “Society has been deliberately dumbed down for obvious reasons – they don’t notice the smoke and mirrors. They live behind a facade of pure evil that seeks to obliterate their culture, their nation, their civilisation and their race and worse, when people try to inform them of this, they attack them, defending their assassins and their society continues to plummet off the edge of a cliff.”

    Today, I found out that YouTube have terminated the Red Ice TV channel due to informing the western peoples that there’s an ongoing genocide, by the (((establishments))) against them. Upon clicking their channel the following comes up:

    ‘This account has been terminated due to multiple or severe violations of YouTube’s policy prohibiting hate speech’.

    Hate speech has no boundaries, hence why it was created. It was created to shut down any opposition to whatever agenda the system is enforcing. I would urge all of you to go to their webpage and support them. They are one of the few organisations that are actively trying to wake up European peoples from the genocide agenda against them.

    You Tube is now becoming a barren wasteland for the truth. As I stated, a while ago, YT is essentially going to become the main platform for the ‘fake’ msm. I predicted that they will shut down ALL channels promoting the agenda against the western peoples and it will turn into a platform that promotes hatred towards the white peoples of the western civilisation.

  146. Anon[550] • Disclaimer says:

    I think in a longish thread with plenty of obsessives, nobody is asking the relevant political quedtion: why hasn’t the UK media dropped the Andrew-Epstein link from the news?

    What/who is the target that should be paying attention?

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Harbinger
  147. Alden says:

    The laws should have been enforced. Oxford, Rotherham occurred because the laws were not enforced.

    Had the laws against rape of 10-15 year olds been enforced from the first reports by victims and their parents it would not have been more than a few rapes that were swiftly punished.

    FYI, prostitution and procuring pimping for prostitution are illegal in the U.K. no matter what the age of the prostitution and pimp.

    Rape, unlawful detention assault and battery torture are illegal no matter what the age of the victim in the U.K.

    The Muslims charged their customers money to have sex with 11-15 year old girls. That’s procuring for prostitution.

    Now you’re defending the Muslim lowlifes of England who raped 11-15 year olds. And were pimps. Serious crimes

    Typing with one hand are you? Are you another obsessed with menstruating 11 year olds? A new perversion every day.

    • Replies: @byrresheim
  148. Alden says:

    Because some of the men were abusing the boys? I’m not surprised.

    Some people work with kids because it’s an available job. Some people work with kids to have access to them.

  149. Alden says:

    Ha ha, so you agree with me. I’m anon 257. I can take my phone with me today and every 50 feet get on to a different WiFi network with different anon numbers.

    Stores, post office gas station, car wash bank everywhere I go there’s WiFi

    Sincerely, Alden aka anon 257

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  150. Alden says:

    Because royalty is always news and half the population is men who don’t notice what Duchesses Kate and Meghan are wearing as the other half of the population does? UK press has royal fashion for women, scandals for the men.

    Sex sells.

    Off topic Didn’t Prince William go to Jerusalem and worship the Roman retaining wall the Jews claim is a remnant of non existent Solomon’s non existent Temple?

  151. Harbinger says:

    “why hasn’t the UK media dropped the Andrew-Epstein link from the news?”

    I think it’s more social programming making the people feel completely powerless to act against those who wish to harm them. It’s letting them know that the police won’t protect them and that the elites are untouchables. This is what it’s all about. It’s Pavlovian programming of humanity and nothing more. There isn’t a hope in hell that any action will be taken against Prince Andrew.

  152. @Curmudgeon

    It;s not just one victim but multiple young girls. I call you naive and/or intentionally trying to protect the british royal family.

  153. @anon

    A woman’s duty 100’s of years ago was to produce offspring, and if you were married to the nobility to produce a male heir ASAP. Margaret Beaufort was, I believe, only 12 or 13 when she bore Henry VII and left unable to bear further children.

  154. Alden says:

    I do so agree with every word in your post.

    Watching people going into the little branch court house, building permit building, and young men expertly skateboarding up and down the steps

    Have a nice day

    Yours Alden aka anon 324 using LAC WiFi

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  155. Harbinger says:

    “A woman’s duty 100’s of years ago was to produce offspring….”

    This IS and ALWAYS has been the sole function of the female of any species on this earth – human, plant, animal, fish, bird and insect.
    The very fact that women DO NOT procreate but instead choose to chase the green Manalishi and effectively ‘rent’ out their vaginas as masturbatory devices for men and woman to use, shows how lost women truly are. Worse, we allow our women to murder their young, so as to not affect their ‘career’ which is nothing more than the accumulation of taxes and the earning of money to be allowed to actually build a habitat from the elements to survive in. Marriage today is no longer about settling down and starting a family, but a chance for a woman to sign a legal document with the state, to steal her, then, husband’s finances and assets, when she decides she wants to move on and not live with him anymore, never punished for breaking the marriage contract.

    The world is a truly f*cked up place. Women simply no longer want to be female.

  156. @Alden

    Does he get paid? Anyway totally irrelevant to my nailing a random slanderer with no evidence. He had been a Rear Admiral and before that Captain so in good standing as a naval officer. BTW what makes you think the old custom of retirement rank promotions had anything to do with his being Royal?

    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
  157. @Niebelheim

    What’s so damning about everyone smiling and so happy….

    As if people never fake-smiled for cameras?

    Once Randy Andy denied there was any sex, the ‘UK’s age of consent’ argument no longer mattered.

    Virginia Roberts Giuffre’s criminal complaint is the encounter was non-consensual, she was ordered or otherwise coerced to perform a sexual act with someone she never would have of her own choosing.

    JFK did similar, using his authority to coerce frightened intern and then virgin Mimi Alford, whom he later allegedly passed around to others epstein-style.

    • Replies: @Niebelheim
  158. @Harbinger

    The female pelvis is not mature until 15, so if some hebephilic was pushing the limit, 14 would be the lowest limit that medicine could recommend for procreation. But the risk of birth defects like Down’s falls from 15 to 20, although at 15 it is about the same as at 25 – so not particularly risky, since yes – the physiology is there.

    However, a human’s mentality and psychology are fully grown between 23 and 25. Now, humans are mostly an intellectual species, not beasts of burden, so looking at the physiology and ignoring the psychology of the matter is at best outdated.

    We don’t just need children, we need kind and well-reared children, and that requires psychological maturity. And if you think middle-aged males with 15 year old girl-wives could take the job of the mother for their first 5-7 years, you are jumping away from the history and practice of the whole human species. Small children depend on mothers – I know as a stay at home dad, that my 4 year old son will a) choose her over me every time (even though his mum is not motherly) and b) take her opinion over mine every time (even though I devote substantially more of my mind to dealing with his world view)

    Let humans develop an intellect whilst they are psychologically maturing, establish themselves in our societies, gain experience, and then marry and have kids. 20-25 is a good age for this.

    • Agree: Daniel Rich
    • Replies: @Harbinger
  159. Bill says:

    They obviously did not think her stories were credible.

    What a deranged inference.

  160. @Michael888

    Was it a statistical abnormality or were there similar “criminal” conviction rates for other pre- and post- ’53 years?

    As far as I know it was just an average year, but it was mentioned in a well-known book about crime.

    Really I just referred to it to indicate that there are probably far more delinquent families in the general population than people ever realize.

    Having grown up in a small town in northern England in the 60’s, I know that if just one girl from the local girls’ high school had been involved in prostitution it would have been a massive, massive scandal that would have shocked the whole community, but probably we all led more sheltered lives before the Internet.

    In 21st century Florida, where every teenager has access to instructional videos on how to give a hand job on their cell phone or tablet, not so much.

  161. eah says:

    Look, I find you tiresome, in some ways obtuse, and would normally just ignore you — but:

    Not true because lack of consent would mean a far more serious charge.

    I thought what I said was pretty clear: when one party is underage, consent plays no role in whether a criminal act occurred: it’s a crime, period — consent/no consent — you may be right: if the sex was forced, perhaps there are normally additional charges — I don’t know (and don’t really care, as it is not relevant here).

    I do not give a damn if Giuffre/Roberts consented or not — in fact, I have always assumed the act itself was not forced, in the sense that “Prince Andrew” did not force himself on her — nonetheless, a case could be made that her entire association with Epstein was a form a coercion, and the sex acts with “Prince Andrew” happened within this context — also, how old was she initially when this (ostensibly) coercive relationship with Epstein began?

    Finally, read my comments about “Prince Andrew”: the only thing I said about him was I think he’s lying — I think he is lying about having sex with her.

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
    , @Alden
    , @Sean
  162. @Rabbitnexus

    How could Epstein still be “too valuable to intel agencies to allow him to die or to be locked up”?

    The only thing thaat might make sense is that he had left intelligence bombs around that he threatened would be “detonated” if he wasn”t saved.

    What credible reports can you cite of his being spotted back on his island?

  163. @Sick of Orcs

    People can fake smile and also fake testify. Anything can be faked. Point here is nothing about that pic is “damning”, necessarily, or even probably, unless you’re a me-tooer who believes any sexually oriented accusation by a woman against a man must be believed unless the guy disproves it with something independently corroborating.

    • Replies: @Sick of Orcs
  164. @eah


    There’s far too much speculation in this thread about things we don’t know. But yes, we’ve been told coercion was generally used when it needed to be, such as taking away the girls’ passports, which is a standards first step in such international prostitution rings. Then it may progress to psychological and physical abuse, and rape, getting the girls drunk and/or drugged – take your pick.

    the only thing I said about him was I think he’s lying — I think he is lying about having sex with her.

    You mean his claim of NOT having done it. The question really is how deep was he involved in this ring or whether he was a just a casual punter without much knowledge about its inner workings and purposes. There is much we’ll never know about this but one thing is sure – a replacement top pimp for the rich and infamous must have stepped in to take Epstein’s place supplying the “merchandise” for this exclusive clientele. Also what does “blackmail” really mean in this context? They’re just members of a sordid club where deals are always being done and profits made.

  165. Harbinger says:
    @Ilya G Poimandres

    With all due respect and I do mean that, knowing that you mean well but it’s simply not substantiated what you write. The human race, for thousands upon thousands of years were having children at a very young age, the minute, almost as soon as they reached puberty. It’s also the same in the animal kingdom as well.
    The concept of “is a girl mature enough to have a child at 13/14” is irrelevant. Today’s psychologists state that homosexuality is perfectly natural and there is nothing wrong with sodomy or homosexual relationships.

    In the past, the father ruled the house. There is always the bond between mother and child and for thousands of years the older males, impregnated the younger females. This was life.

    You are also failing to see that the very reason our population, our European population, is dropping is because women are choosing careers over family. They have decided that they’d rather make money, to lavish their lifestyles with material goods that do the very job they were born to do – have children.

    This is psychology and as far as I’m concerned, this has absolutely decimated the western civilisation where people, who are psychologists, are so because they simply parrot the BS theory that they’ve been indoctrinated with, within society.

    Again, I know you mean well, truly I do, but I think far too many people are waylaid by complete BS of psychologists on what is good for humanity. These people, as far as I’m concerned are self indulged, Freud brainwashed zealots who haven’t a clue upon reality, working as nothing more that drug pushing pimps for multiglobal pharmaceutical corporation who have never had to experience reality or never having done a hard days work in their lives. They have been, as far as I’m concerned a tentacle of the elite obliteration of our civilisation and species.

    A child is ready to procreate when he or she reaches puberty, no different to any other species on this earth. If they were supposed to reach puberty at a later age they would.
    You need to understand that children today have been dumbed down, kept in a mental prison and their natural mental development stopped in order to be kept ignorant about reality.

    What annoys me about this whole topic of conversation is the utter ignorance and stupidity of people who continue to have this faith in government and lawlords, who create legislation that is destroying our civilisation, when in reality it was these vile individuals who brought about the concept of ‘child protection’ in order to bring about state control of family so they could have their wicked way with them. It is the elites in society, overwhelmingly, with their utter contempt for the lower classes, due to their elitism and supremacist beliefs over them, who have done the most damage.

    Again, the very people, whom you promote, who are dictating what the best age for this and that, happen to be people who are simply parroting theories from others who haven’t a clue what they’re on about, but they become experts, because they receive a piece of paper, signed by another of the same ilk, that dictates they are now ‘experts’ on the subject.

    Establishments are corrupt to the core. It’s really that simple, every single one of them. I don’t trust any of them and neither should you.

    • LOL: Alden
    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Ilya G Poimandres
  166. @byrresheim

    When you live in a country where an 18-year-old girl can be gangbanged [provided a camera is present], but said girl can’t [legally] buy a drink, something is worrisome wrong in the picture…

    • Agree: byrresheim
    • Replies: @byrresheim
  167. @Alden


    I don’t know why you suddenly got it in for Harbinger. I gather he was just giving some historical and biological information, which you can accept or dispute, and expressing an opinion about its consequences. I don’t get the impression that he said he’d do it or advocated for others to break the law in this regard. He has mentioned that he has long stopped having sex and it doesn’t interest him any more so he is surely blameless and your accusations are tasteless. Now why not carry on about the Jewish circumcision ceremony and the rabbis sucking the babies’penises in full view of others? That actually goes on IRL and is considered socially, morally, and legally acceptable.

    If I mention that Jerry Lee Lewis married a 13 year old cousin it surely doesn’t mean that I’m advocating underage incest, does it? Or that John Peel married a 15 year old in Texas in 1965.

    • Replies: @Alden
  168. @Harbinger

    I can only reflect about my own life and I wasn’t really grown up until way in my twenties.

    I don’t follow anyone’s guidelines.

    I look at nature and the universe if I want answers [even if it’s difficult to comprehend a single one of them] to any questions I have. They’ve found solutions to any problems that have arisen over billions of years.

  169. @Harbinger

    Have you not noticed that they are promoting older women in society with younger men?

    Yes, Macron is their poster boy. Depopulation of every white nation is the agenda. And procreation of the other races is the weapon of race replacement or genocide or whatever you want to call it.

    The worst argument I have heard to justify immigration is because European population is declining. Europeans bounced back from the Black Death which decimated the population reducing it by a third, and nobody then advocated importing people from elsewhere. If it is a problem that European population is in decline then solutions should be found to correct this – replacing them with some others is no solution.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  170. @Wizard of Oz

    Does a Royal get paid? LOL! He leeches off the British taxpayer just like the rest of his clan. It would appear that they do not go hungry. Bro Charles even claims that the businesses that he runs from his estate are covered by his privileged tax status so that he can avoid corporate taxation rates.

    They are all inbred low-lifes living a reality-show soap-opera, a pox on the lot of them.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  171. @Alden

    Jeff claims he sells lottery tickets in Thailand. I mean his Thai wife does since as a foreigner there he cannot do actually anything, even help his wife reach for some item on a high shelf in her store. Unlike in the West, they’re very strict over there. You can be deported if you help your wife carry a sack of rice from her car to her store unless you have a work permit, even though you may be married to a local and have some visa allowing you to live in Thailand.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  172. @Niebelheim

    A male hand on a woman’s hips indicates a degree of possession. Pic just doesn’t look right, Andy in his late 30s and she seventeen. The Duke of Dork probably regrets that pic every day since finding out new shit’s coming to light.

    A royal like Andy, even if he’s a dunce, would have had some kind of lessons in comportment and be wary of all publicity. Maybe he’s just not that bright, having married and divorced an embarrassment like Swingin’ Sarah.

    Though what counts is only what can be legally proven, I believe all of epstein’s accusers. A nothingburger of baseless accusations would not have this many roaches scurrying for cover.

    The only lie so far is that epstein committed suicide.

  173. @Alden

    Typing with one hand are you? Are you another obsessed with menstruating 11 year olds? A new perversion every day.

    You are one sick puppy.

    • Replies: @Alden
  174. @Daniel Rich

    This is the point I was trying to make.

    Provoking a pervert who deliberately blurs the line between children and youths, between sexual abuse of immature young women and violent rape was not my intention.

    One wonders what that sort of zealot has to hide.

    • Replies: @Daniel Rich
  175. Like these Whitney Webb exposes; however, they are a bit repetitious and wordy.
    Big question: why the obsession with an ineffectual Clown Prince and ignore real power elites like former Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell and Bill Richardson both very influential
    Democrats ?

  176. @byrresheim

    The individuals who try to blur the line between when a girl turns into a fully functioning woman, using nature as a guideline, should be aware of the fact that what technically is possible [pregnancies] might [and in mot cases will] run into physical problems as a body isn’t fully developed when a girl is 12 or 13 years old [as some have pointed out above].

    This ups the bar to when she becomes/is/turns into [in that sense] a woman; in my case [or morality] to a 20+ age.

    Yes, there are girls who look like a fully grown woman at an early age, but to use those 0,002% as a measure to rule all other with, is not advisable.

    Needless to say, as has been pointed out as well, a certain maturity when it comes to dealing with kids, is a must [not a guarantee of anything though].

  177. Alden says:
    @Commentator Mike

    Harbinger is a pervert obsessing about menstruating 11 year olds.

    His blathering about girls in early medieval medieval and early modern Europe, 500AD to 1800 menstruating at age 11 and 12 and capable of beating and raising children is dead wrong.


    Today the average age is 12. But girls didn’t start menstruating at 12 till the 1930s, 40s.

    In the medieval times Harbinger types one handed about, girls didn’t menstruate till mid late teens 15-18. As late as the 1940s, working class English girls often didn’t menstruate until 17 or 18 due to malnutrition

    Harbinger is completely wrong that medieval girls menstruated at 10 11 12. It was more like
    15 16 17. He lied. His historical post was wrong wrong wrong

    Pervert Harbinger went way way off from Epstein’s crimes to claim that girls should begin having sex as soon as first menarche even if they’re 10 or 11.
    Lots and lots of research about marriage and family life 500AD to 1800AD has been done in the last 40 years. Turns out average age of marriage for women has always been 20 22, for men around 30z

    Can you not understand that just because Harbinger claimed girls menstruated got married and pregnant at 11 a thousand years ago he was wrong wrong wrong wrong.?

    His post is as false as MSNC and CNN

    Once more to the pervert idiot men obsessed with the sex lives of 10 to 18 year old girls.

    Epstein was a pimp and procurer of prostitutes. The girls were prostitutes.

    That’s the crime he pled guilty to. That’s the crime he was arrested and jailed awaiting trial for in July.

    Prostitution I and procuring for prostitution is illegal in every state and territory in the USA and the U.K. and France. Those were the countries where Epstein the pimp exchanged sex with his stable of prostitutes for money.

    That’s what he did.
    Doesn’t matter if it’s wealthy Epstein and Prince Andrew or some low life 7th grade dropout black pimps and $20 lowlife black street walkers.
    It’s illegal

    Get that? What Epstein did was illegal. He pled guilty. He served a sentence in county jail.
    Get it? Or should I just keep pasting it?

    Harbinger’s perverted posts have nothing to do with Epstein Maxwell and the girls. He never mentioned them. Just repeated his perversion that if 10-12 year old girls menstruate they’re old enough to have sex and get pregnant.

    His silly completely false posts about girls menstruating at 11-12 a thousand years ago is wrong. There has been a lot of research about it. Girls weren’t menstruating at ages 10-12 until after WW2.

    Unless there’s a dr or nurse on the site none of you perverts typing with one hand about 12 year olds getting pregnant know a thing about human development.

    2 things ripen an egg.

    First is what percent of total body weight is fat. Ratio of fat to bone muscle and organs. What none of you perverts and idiots know is that the fat around the top of the thighs produces hormones that triggers ripening of the ova. No fat, no hormones, egg doesn’t ripen, no menstruation Nutrition, especially for most people, wasn’t good enough to produce enough fat in 12 year olds to trigger menarche till well into the 180os.

    Second hours a day exposure to light. Until kerosene lamps 1830? Gaslight 18870? And electricity 1900? People lived in semi darkness after the sun went down.

    Therefore, as you can see, Harbinger is wrong wrong that a thousand years ago girls menstruated, married, got pregnant and had babies age 10-12.

    He just made up the lie and endlessly posted historical falsehoods that were completely irrelevant to Epstein’s pleading guilty to procuring for prostitution pimping.

    Harbinger claims he hasn’t had sex for years. He just write that. No way we can know if he’s telling the truth. He also claims he’s been a bouncer in degenerate gay and heterosexual hook up bars for many years. He claims he was totally repulsed by the degeneracy. Yet he stayed

    Again, we have no way of knowing if that’s the truth.

    What I do know for sure, is that girls didn’t menstruate at 12 and have babies a thousand years ago. All those Princesses married at 14 didn’t have their first baby till late teens when their bodies were ready.

    Harbinger’s obsession with menstruating 10-12 year olds is bizarre and perverse. And has absolutions nothing to do with Epstein’s crime of pimping.

    Another thing you guys don’t know. Regular sex with a child brings in early maturity of the eggs, menstruation and the girls can and do get pregnant.

    When you read stories about 8 or 9 year olds being pregnant it’s because some man has been having intercourse with her for at least a year. That triggers early puberty.

    Harbinger’s obsessed with a topic irrelevant to Epstein. And his historical posts are just wrong.

  178. Alden says:

    You men are the sick puppies. Epstein pled guilty of procuring for prostitution or pimping and served a sentence in county jail.

    So you men ignore his crime and make hundreds of posts not about the prostitution and procuring but about sex with under age girls and denouncing the child molesting and age of consent laws.

    No matter how much all you men think sex with 12-18 year olds should be legal, check with the laws of your state first.

    • Replies: @byrresheim
  179. Alden says:

    You really need to get hold of some medical school pediatric text books, an anatomy physiology book and a human development book.

    And a couple good histories about marriage and family life 500AD to 1800.

    And google Jeffrey Epstein. He pled guilty to procuring for prostitution pimping served a term in county jail. After his release the investigation continued. Many new offense of procuring for prostitution were discovered. He was arrested because of that new evidence in July. He died in jail.

    You’re not aware of that are you?

  180. Alden says:

    The men on this site believe there should be no age of consent laws.

    The men in this site don’t realize prostitution and the crime Epstein pled guilty to, procuring for prostitute is illegal in every state.

    All they care about is overturning the age of consent laws.

  181. Harbinger says:

    Had I known the post I replied to was yours, I most certainly would have ignored every word of it and therefore not replied. Now it will mean ignoring all posters who reply under ‘Anon’.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  182. Harbinger says:
    @Commentator Mike

    1654 was when the Jews started coming back into England, after Cromwell’s revolution (funded by Dutch Jews) and murder of Charles 1st.
    1665 was the great plague.
    1’666′ was the great fire that wiped out much of central London, which incidentally then became the City of London and banking capital of the world. The fire never started in Pudding Lane but in ‘various’ places, clearly showing deliberate arson.

    The people of the UK and Europe were and still are being deliberately targeted for extinction. The people responsible are in power. The populous haven’t a clue because they’re all zombified on TV, Hollywood, the music and sporting industries and every other distraction out there.
    I really cannot see any light at the end of the tunnel. Nothing is going to stop the population growth of non westerners in the west, who will become the majority population in the west over the indigenous.

    They deliberately destroyed the relationships between men and women. And in doing so now have an epidemic of lonely single mothers and older ‘career’ women, the latter having lots of money who like to chase after the younger males for sexual pleasures and a toyboy. Essentially, they say older men, with all the younger women attracted to them and decided they wanted that. The only problem is, a woman loses her attraction in her mid thirties when she hits the wall. No amount of plastic surgery will stop everything going south. This is why you marry young, have one sexual partner whom you bond with, grow old together in relative happiness not wishing for carnal desires with others.
    At my age, were I to date, I’ve a choice of grandmothers in their 40’s, single mothers in their 30’s and psycho women in their 20’s who haven’t a clue what’s going on and whether they want a boyfriend or a girlfriend. The dating scene is completely closed for me now and I want no part of it.
    And Macron, the Rothschild boy. He’s pathetic.

  183. @Harbinger

    I give my opinion, and I certainly discount Freud and his lot! 🙂

    There is my argument that if a woman really wanted a career and kids it would be simpler to have them early and retrain at 30 for a career when they are leaving the roost anyways.

    You are right – if child rearing were to become a norm in the reasonable teens, society would have to change pretty drastically. My friends who had kids at 18-19 had it pretty difficult. That can be fixed by making society value children, but that would be a serious statist undertaking in social engineering.

    Thing is we are living longer, and require more education – the highest level of abstract thought is seen to appear at around 10-12 for whites and east asians, and that takes a while to settle into.

    I agree that most fall for materialism, whether the shopping or the erotic play type, but this is not related to having kids late, just that most people now follow the ultimately irrational religion of atheism. That problem has deeper roots than an increasing average birth age!

  184. @Commentator Mike

    I bankrolled her lottery and emporium. With my last $10,000. We earn $1500 a month. Fairly good money. We drive a new Nissan. We own a house (I built for $20,000) and keep a fairly nice apartment ($250 a month in Bangkok).


    Most foreigners here bankroll a business that their wife then runs. Many major businesses are owned by a foreigner from Mexican restaurants to pole bars. Government does not discourage that. My wife employees one teenage boy as a helper. All foreign-backed businesses employ locals.

    But I don’t work. Where do you think I get the time to post on this website?

    A few posers have said that I would be a “loser back home”. That isn’t quite true but more than anything else, the weather is agreeable here. On top of being crime ridden and polluted, my city outside Detroit is freezing in the winter and I caught several lung ailments there as a result when I was young (Bronchitis, pneumonia).

    Moving to the Southwest is impossible because of Hispanic crime. I tried that in Phoenix, Arizona where I had some scrapes with Mexicans. So I need a warm climate with no Mestizos.

    • Replies: @Alden
  185. @Alden

    This also explains what my friend [the teacher, mentioned earlier] observed when she stated about menstrual cycles starting earlier in [some] girls.

    Thank you, Alden. I learned a few new things today, I knew nothing about.

  186. @Alden

    You are one very sick puppy, projecting your perversion onto others.

    I wrote nothing of the sort and I think nothing of the sort.

    Get a grip, man.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  187. @Alden

    Read what he wrote instead of projecting your suppressed perversions.

    I take no sides in this fight but you are clearly misrepresenting written statements and have the gall to accuse others of lying.

    • Replies: @Alden
  188. @Alden


    Calm down, there is no evidence here that Harbinger is a nonce. He only brought up the issue of age because obviously Epstein was also using and/ or procuring underage girls, although he may have not been charged with that. It is Epstein and his high flyer friends who was/are nonces as well as punters.

    I have no problem with the age limit laws but even legal authorities in some countries have recognised that there is a gray area and are experimenting with some alternatives, like 10 year age difference, but there are problems with that too. These laws have been changing, generally the age of consent increasing in order to prevent abuse by dirty old men who may be exploiting their wealth to abuse young girls and turning them into underage prostitutes (precisely what Epstein was doing), but then that can result in young boyfriends getting a criminal record and getting labelled as sex offenders for going out with someone just a little younger than themselves, hence ruining their future. On the other hand decreasing the age of consent leads down the slippery slope to legalising pedos. Then of course there are cultural aspects to this issue which become relevant when you start mixing up peoples from different cultures and religions in one place.

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Skeptikal
  189. @NoseytheDuke

    Having skipped four out of five opportunities to shake hands with Royals it would be right to say that I am not a Royalist would be an understatement. But I suppose one could argue that the simple pleasure that the Royals give to the non high falutin is a pretty inexpensive plus given that there are few extravagances now by the standards of the rich.

    I believe the Queen now pays tax, Britannia is decommissioned and the vegetarian Charles is very active in restoring e.g. Dumfries Castle – not for his own pleasure but for the sake of the heritage. I have no idea how far, on balance, they pull their weight in doing ceremonial things that need to be done (or something worse would be substituted. (Princss Anne – the Princess Royal? – was known for doing her duty). But it is fair to say that most of the Royals expenditure goes on paying for Royal collections, castles and so on which are not optional luxuries.

    However you actually miss my point that I am not even sure that the Vice Admiral gets paid apart from the Civil List if that still exists. And Alden missed my point that I just couldn’t resist clobbering the stupid evidence free slander.

  190. @byrresheim

    Alden is a woman and one who, as a former parole officer (I believe) knows a little about the law. I am not sure whether she sees the point of arguing whether Epstein was or was not a pederast. I believe there is a definite point because neither Mossad nor the CIA would want to be tainted with pederasty for which there is general disgust, way exceeding statutory rape.

    BTW her “pled” is quite eccentric. Said to be a one to twenty minoroty usage for “pleaded”.

    • Replies: @Alden
  191. Harbinger says:

    I think what many people fail to realise, about the Epstein case, is that it has absolutely, nothing, whatsoever to do with the pimping out of young ‘women’ to men and women of status. This really is no different to ‘Poland’ and WW2, conveniently using it as an excuse to attack Germany. They couldn’t give a sh*t about the girls, just as they never gave a sh*t about the Polish.

    Occasionally, the Jews will throw one of their own under the bus, ONLY, if there’s something to be gained. Take Harvey Weinstein for example? They didn’t throw him under the bus (because every Jew, of note, in Hollywood, is getting sexual services from women and in return they get a ‘foot in the door’ in the acting world) to protect women. They threw him under the bus because the #MeToo movement had a far reaching affect to Jewish Hollywood producers’ activities. It launched an all out attack on men by women and creating the false ‘rape culture’ and created a bigger wedge between the sexes.

    As for Epstein, they couldn’t give a sh*t about the young women he procured for the elites. They knew about Epstein for decades. They knew about Epstein when Bill Clinton was president and before.
    As stated above, they threw him under the bus because they’re going after the president. Why? He’s a puppet of Zionism, but he’s not bombed Iran. Had he bombed Iran, guaranteed 100%, we’d never have heard about Epstein. They made the huge hullabaloo about it and faked his death, so he’s now most certainly living in Israel.

    • Agree: Ilya G Poimandres
    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  192. @Twodees Partain

    Andy’s parents, Liz-2 and Phil, are 2nd cousins, so with all that royal inbreeding one should, I suppose, not be surprised at the royal family’s lack of intellectual heft.

    (If marrying your cousin is good enough in the hollers of Appalachia, then why would they frown on it at Buckingham Palace?)

    • LOL: Twodees Partain
  193. Alden says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    In America we use pled for past tense plead. Might be different in Australia. Might just be a legal term?

    • Replies: @byrresheim
  194. Sean says:

    Consent is on topic relevant; the subject of the post that you have perhaps forgotten in what Andrew did to be the putative subject of Epstein’s blackmailing. Why do you ignore the comments going completely off topic but pick up on me when I pertinently explain the OT context of American courts finding there was a crime by conviction of Epstein.

    The situation in Britain as it would have applied to Giuffre’s allegations of being a sex slave ordered to have intercourse with Andrew is completely different because there consent was a complete defence. ‘Whether’ is not the issue I was raising. Which crime was committed is relevant to what the subject of the post is, and soliciting under age prostitution is a lesser crime than trafficking under age girls for prostitution. Moveover a prosecution for under age sex is very unlikely unless the girls is far under age and there is a complaint by her and some collaboration. As young as 13 girls have been blanket considered over age to have sex with much older men by prosecutors in Britain.

    Also to get you back on topic the allegation against Andrew by Giuffre was not of of under age sex and therefore there was no way for Andrew to be blackmailed with it as long as it was consensual. Epstein might have been able threatened to blackmail Andrew with the threat of an accusation of rape, but he would have simply denied it. Again, Andrew could have had a full year younger and much better looking girls than Giuffre with absolute impunity and perfectly legally in Britain.

    The court decided Epstein was a john not a pimp in relation to the mainly Hispanic high school girls .And they were right to do so. They did not use Giuffre as a witness because she would be too easy to trip up with all the little fibs discrediting their case. Guiffre has been involved in civil cases only, which she has sought and brought. No criminal charge would be brought on her evidence unless the prosecutors wanted to be laughed out of court.

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Jonathan Mason
  195. Alden says:
    @Commentator Mike

    I believe many American states have the 3 year thing . 18 and 15 is ok. In actual fact, young boyfriends don’t get in trouble. In the good old days outraged parents might want to charge them. But realistically, those police reports went nowhere. Investigation goes nowhere when the “ victim” of the crime tells the investigator it never happened.

    But over all, there are too many comments ignorant of the fact that the charges were procuring for prostitution, not statutory rape or molestation of minors.

    Until I began reading UNZ, I didn’t realize there were so many middle aged fathers of 1 or 2 children so interested in the fertility of teen girls. I don’t mean just Harbinger. It’s been about 6 years I think and I noticed it from the start.

    If these fertility fanatics want women to have large families they should do what my husband did. Have a large family, instead of blathering about it on UNZ.

    I can see being militantly for or against abortion. But men obsessing about the fertility of total stranger women just strikes me as totally absolutely weird.

    Think Whites should more children? Then do your part.

    And Harbinger really needs to buy some medical school pediatric textbooks which have several chapters on human development including puberty, an obstetrics text book, a standard baby and child care book, and read about the history of marriage and family for the last 1400 years.

    His claims that girls menstruated and had babies at 12 1,000 years ago is contrary to all historical fact and 1400 years of Christian church marriage and birth records.

    Men think differently than woman I know. But I still think Harbinger’s focus on pregnant 11 and 12 year olds is just weird and unseemly. And he was the only commenter to bring up menstruation.

    He was totally wrong. Girls didn’t start to menstruate at 10,11, 12 till the 20th century because of better nutrition and kerosene and electric light.

    Maybe it was the only job he could get, but bouncers in gay clubs shouldn’t preach about morality to others.

  196. Alden says:

    Great post. Epstein was a procurer of prostitutes. Compared to all these idiots arguing against age of consent laws you can read and comprehend at a 3rd grade level.

    Thank you

  197. If they had something on Andrew (and the fact he visited Epstein after his conviction suggests Andrew was after what Epstein provided), the problem for us Brits becomes any British government will do whatever it takes to keep the royal family from seedy exposure which could even bring the monarchy down. We’d become extremely vulnerable to doing things that are clearly not in our interest, such as getting involved in Middle East wars.

  198. Alden says:

    Harbinger made many comments claiming that a thousand years ago girls matured at 11 or 12 and were capable of having children at that age.
    It’s just not true as anyone who knows a little history knows.

    Historians have looked at marriage and birth records and noted that 12 year old mothers didn’t exist a thousand years ago.

    There is plenty of information about women’s puberty delayed till 16 or 17 due to lack of light after dark and poor nutrition. It’s rather specialized scientific and medical history but the information is available to anyone who’s interested. Harbinger is weirdly fascinated with menstruating 10-12 year old girls.

    He should have researched the information instead of just making it up.

    • Replies: @byrresheim
  199. Alden says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Good for you. Congratulations.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  200. @Alden

    Pled for the past of plead is correct english.

    Still I have no use for her abominable behaviour. The lady doth protest too much.

    Perversion hides behind zealotry.

    The most disgusting case of pederasty I know of – and they are all digusting – happened in Germany, Worms. Look up Spatzennest. The director of a foster home accused several parents of sexually abusing their children – what is called statutory rape in certain countries.

    The medical exams of several girls taken away from their parents showed no anomalies before these girls were entrusted to his care. They did show anomalies several months later, if you get the gist. He ended up in prison, sadly a few years too late for those poor girls and their parents whose life he ruined.

    Look it up, perhaps you come to the same conclusion I do: people who play fast and loose with that sort of slander have weighty but ugly reasons to do so.

  201. @Alden

    Well you have been accusing me of being a porn producer and pimp, which is untrue.

    For a grown woman of eighty to be going on about porn and sex in general like you do is really ridiculous.

    It is not that males like myself cannot live and work in America. I could. I have. I did. Males however have less attachment to homes and social networks than women. Another words we don’t care as much. We can tire of a place and simply walk out, which is what I did. Males have always been doing this. That is why males are immigrants. Young men will go anywhere we like best. We are not like women…we do not have to worry about sitting on a public toilet seat in India. We can urinate anywhere. We can have sex partners anywhere and are less choosy about them. We can tolerate heat. And insects.

  202. @Alden

    If you stop accusing people of lusting after jailbait, this is a highly problematic subject extremely worthy of discussion.

    Epstein could ply his disgusting trade in a country where minors are routinely convicted for sexting.

    Does that in any way excuse him?

    Does that however, indicate that law enforcement and courts have to review their priorities?

    As you rightly said about Rotherham and Telford: the law has to be enforced if it is to protect those most in need of protection.

  203. @Harbinger

    What I see in the yawning canyon of class differences is that the old feudal system of class exploitation is coming back.

    Maxwell at one point described the girls as “trash”. Which is how an upper-class Londoner of the Victorian era might have seen them when Jack the Ripper was roaming the East End.

    The class differences since about 1990 or so have just really widened.

    Part of it, in my opinion (and yours) is the gullibility of the working class. Some sixties toffs came out and told the proles to get naked and do a bunch of drugs, so they did. Whereas some sixties Eton hippie can cut his hair and put the joint down and reenter the bourgeois when some market vendor’s daughter does this she is really screwed.

    Flash forward ten years and George Bush the hippie is now a conservative politician. The working class girl who became hippie in 1969 now has a kid fathered by a stranger and is living in squalor. The kid becomes a throwaway child.

    That throwaway kid is now forty and cruising the bars with her own daughter, fathered by some loutish lad she has not seen in twenty years. They cruise for men together. All of the barriers the working class built up have now crumbled. And those barriers were their only protection from the ravages of exploitation.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  204. @Harbinger

    “Now it will mean ignoring all posters who reply under ‘Anon’.”

    That might be a good idea. Some of the anons are just trolling without using their established screen names. Some are one or two post drop-ins who don’t intend to post regularly. This Alden troll has a habit of posting as anonymous.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  205. Omegabooks [AKA "Anon"] says:

    I take it you mean the Kamloops Native (First Nations) school near or on some native reservation, I think in British Columbia.

  206. Harbinger says:
    @Jeff Stryker


    The upper classes have always looked down on the lower classes. It’s always been that way.
    And quite frankly, when I look at the working classes today I can understand why they do. They are, overwhelmingly just a moronic brigade of zombies.
    It’s the complete lack of concern, for what’s going on around them that just makes my mind boggle.
    I’m not joking when I say that like the homosexuals who live for night life, having dead end jobs in the day, to go out and pick up others to have sex, the heterosexuals are following suit.
    Added to that worship of celebrity, concern only for who wins what game of [insert sport] at the weekend, some film and complete addiction to Marvel/other comic heroes now on the big screen and there you have your working class. The younger generations are completely addicted to class A drugs. Cocaine consumption is now pretty much no different to having a pint of beer. Zombie junkies, high on heroin/methadone beg and wander the streets.
    Everything is a distraction.
    Pubs, here in Scotland are closing down. People go out not to discuss reality, but instead watch football games from ALL over the world. Before people supported their local team now football is on every night.
    They have been completely distracted from reality through Roman bread & circuses.

    The working class are gone. I think after WW2, when they came back from war, the upper classes had to think of a way to lull them all back to sleep as many would rightly be angry, especially seeing their country change with mass immigration and lack of jobs. So yeah, they brought in the 60’s summer of love, weaponised music and of course red brick universities sprang up all over the place, to get the poorer people into the state, brain laundries to give them a dose of cultural Marxism and voila, roll on 40 years and here we are.

    The working classes, as I stated are just addicted to whatever rubbish the elites feed them. Very, very few have the ability to critically think and be skeptical. Morons, most of them. I actually think that the hell that’s about to befall the west is a good thing. Nothing like sheer horror to wake people up to reality. Sad thing is people have been trying to warn them for years, to stop the inevitable. Freedom does not come for free. You have to fight for it and no one’s been fighting for freedom for a long time now, hence the current predicament we’re all in today.

    • Agree: Commentator Mike
  207. Harbinger says:
    @Twodees Partain

    It very much seems so.
    As for Alden, well a completely nasty, vile, piece of work. I’ve come across quite a lot of vile people in my time, but she certainly is up there with the top. The good thing about Unz is it brings critical thinkers onto a forum to debate. Along come the likes of Alden, who because she disagrees with what’s being said wants to shut it down instantly. Then again, it’s just women in general. You should never allow them positions of influence or authority because they’re incapable of logic, being ruled by emotion. Her outburst simply strengthens that. Women are easily manipulable. Like I stated, stick a picture of a dead baby on the cover of a magazine and within hours, everyone with a vagina will be begging their politicians to open the mass immigration floodgates. “Let them in. Let them all in. We don’t care if they’re all rapists and murderers. The children, think of the children……” And yet, ironically, the overwhelming majority of these women will happily support family planning and condone abortion. Like I stated, ruled by emotion, easily manipulable and hence why the west is the sh*thole it is. Too many people like Alden, with a voice of authority.

    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
  208. @Harbinger

    A bit of a generalisation there. Some women are more easily manipulatable than others and some are not at all.

    I don’t think that Alden is a troll, she’s got grandkids I think and as a long-serving probation officer she has likely seen things that most of us have been spared even thinking about. Things like how otherwise good kids can go right off the rails when sexualised too soon especially when they are influenced and manipulated by a much older person where the power equation is so out of balance. The result is all too often bad relationships throughout their lives, drugs, alcohol abuse, prison and even suicide so it would seem odd if it didn’t provoke a strong reaction from her.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  209. @Wizard of Oz


    She later dropped the civil action because of threats of death against her and her family. If you would care to know how sick Trump and Epstein are read paragraphs 10 – 13 of the civil action.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Harbinger
  210. @Edward Huguenin

    Why do you believe any of it? It is true, i believe, that attorneys would have to be careful to cover themselves against allegations that they simply made up the case out of whole cloth. But, as long as they could get apparently honest witness statements that might not be a problem.

    If I were to focusc on the likelihood that this was just a blackmailing or politically motivated gambit I would seek to test the cell phone alleged to have received threats and see if any slips had occured which might suggest that the case was fraudulent. The police might follow that up.

    • Replies: @anon
  211. Harbinger says:
    @Edward Huguenin

    “These are the charges against Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein for the rape of a 13 year old girl”

    Do you really, honestly believe that the state, the authorities, give a damn about whether some 13 year old is raped?
    CIA, MI5, Mossad…the list goes on and on of security organisations (read Rothschild controlled protective services for the elites) who have known for decades of the exploits of Epstein & Co and done NOTHING whatsoever about it.
    The reason this is coming to light now is for one reason and one reason only – Trump is not obeying orders and this is a shove to move him back on track on bombing Iran. That’s why he was put into office. Both he and Clinton are controlled puppets, but there was too much heat around Clinton, for her criminal activities, as well as mental health problems people were seeing. Trump had also fooled the public into thinking he was for them, again summing up the idiocy of the voters, who somehow think that a multi billionaire actually gives a sh*t about them.
    Nothing will happen to anyone, not Trump, not Prince Andrew, Ghislaine Maxwell and any high status individuals involved.

    I’m just amazed at people who actually think the state cares about them. To think that they brought this charge about because of 13 year old girl shows the mind of an ignoramus. They’re ALL knobbing 13 year olds and younger for crying out loud. Those up there are psychopathic, paedophiles who are sodomising pre pubescent teens and killing them. If these people can take countries to war, resulting in horrific slaughter and destruction, how on earth can you think they care for one girl, or how many, raped by whomever? This is a warning to Trump – get back on track into the creation of Greater Israel. Wake up for crying out loud! Geez….

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  212. anon[320] • Disclaimer says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    You may be right.
    Epstein was an obvious poofter, and Roy Cohn taught Trump everything he knows.
    Case closed?

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  213. @Alden

    Are you sometimes [258] or is that someone else’s code for hi-wire cranky trolling? (Forgive me: I turn 110 today and there are deviant passages in my memory of verbal niceties/ingenious BS).

  214. @anon

    Very interesting – no, can’t really dignify this stuff with doing more than prompting some curiosity – but, yes, all those massages “are at least consistent with his being a [euphemism du jour – if poofter ?pooftah” is a currently acceptable euphemism].

  215. @Harbinger

    Are you just testing what nonsense you can get away with? I mean probability 1 or 2 per cent stuff.

    To start with you explicitly say Trump was given victory instead of Clinton because she was unreliable and that involves a ridiculous degree of control of electoral colleges in at least ten states including votes going to independents.

    Then there is the absurdity of “those up there” sodomising and killing prepubescent teens. Has human nature changed so much since JFK screwed his way round America?

    And, slightly less weighty point, how is one withdrawn civil claim for damages going to apply critical pressure on Trump to do anythimg he doesn’t want to?

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Harbinger
  216. @NoseytheDuke

    Yes, I am disappointed in Harbinger. I vaguely thought he was (just) credible on some matters but it seems that he is the prince of over statement. See his next eruptiin. (Not that I disagree with his opinion that the fate of 13 year old girls is not likely to figure high amongst the concerns of Epstein’s coterie).

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  217. @Wizard of Oz

    Harbinger wrote:

    Those up there are psychopathic, paedophiles who are sodomising pre pubescent teens and killing them.

    What about the case of England? Haven’t they been doing this for decades from top government (Edward Heath) and entertainment (Jimmy Savile) to the streets (Pakis) and covering for all of them for decades. I bet that if you had told a common man at the time that Heath or Savile were at it they wouldn’t have believed you, but now everyone knows it. The rot goes too far and too deep. I’d still hate to think that absolutely all those who rule at the top of society are either at it or accepting of it in their circles, but … It’s common among rich and powerful Orientals too – they think it acts as an elixir and gives them power. Yes, it’s sick out there.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  218. anon[222] • Disclaimer says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    JFK was light on his feet too.
    One of the blokes on PT109 said that the true story of the night they were run over by a Jap battleship will never be told.
    In other words, they were Gaying it up, Prince Andrew style, when reality intervened.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  219. @anon

    My gut instinct is to not even pause for a moment before treating that as garbage. I recall how one would-be-important member of my political party told me solemnly about the former heavy drinking PM Bob Hawke having gone off the wagon when it was obviously nothing but an attempt to attract attention by appearing to know something important. That’s what your unsubstantiated gossip is worth IMO.

    • Replies: @anon
  220. Harbinger says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I was wondering how I knew your name, other than of course the L. Frank Baum book of course and remembered….. You were the individual who liked to poke fun at me when I correctly stated that the Crown happened to be the corporation of the City of London, having changed from British aristocracy into the hands of Jewish bankers. I realized then that you’re not to bright.
    Do forgive me for not replying to you, but you see, I do recall simply having nothing to do with you after our last spat and I truly thought that you would have honoured our avoiding one another. Obviously not.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  221. @Commentator Mike

    No, it doesn’t fly. The Pakis groomed “trouble teenagers” (per Wikipedia), with Ted Heath it was only rumour floated implausibly just because his enemies would know how disgusting and exceptional it would seem, and, as for Jimmy Savile I think his offending was so bizarre (and he sued people for defamation) that no one of any weight in the community could believe it. (I.e. it was very far from any kind of ruling class cover up). Jeremy Thorpe was a homosexual and arrogant abuser but nothing to do with disgusting pederasty. (I believe it was dealt with accurately enough in “A Very British Scandal” which did involve attempted murder if I remember correctly).

  222. @Harbinger

    You are doubly a fool, if that is not to understate matters.

    (a) The idea that you can have a hissy fit and cut off incoming communications on Unz Review is pathetic. Especially as I received no notice of your apparent unwillingness to hear the truth.

    (b) It remains fact that the “Crown” is not “the corporation of the City of London”. Just in case some amazing change in the law had taken place after I learned such important legal facts I read it up as a refresher in the long Wikipedia article on the City of Londom and I challenge you to find the one reference to the Crown in it.

    In fact, you ignorant chump, you must have been taken in by the rubbish in an article which Google somehow managed to put first when I asked “Is the Crown the same as the corporation of the City of London?”.

    You no doubt read the following with gormless credulity

    Oh well there is one born every day. Can I sell you, say, London Bridge, only half the price od Brooklyn Bridge?

    • Replies: @Harbinger
    , @NoseytheDuke
  223. anon[222] • Disclaimer says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Can’t assist with facts on your Bob Hawke story, but it was pretty well known that he was a drunk all his life, and a wife basher, but his mates in the Media kept the lid on the pot.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  224. @anon

    Well I still may have enough mates in the media to check the story. I’ll try to let you know if I do. Come to think of it I know well an alarmingly frank former President of the Labor Party who wouldn’t be able to resist telling me all the grubby details.

  225. Harbinger says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    “The idea that you can have a hissy fit and cut off incoming communications on Unz Review is pathetic. Especially as I received no notice of your apparent unwillingness to hear the truth.”

    The wonderful thing about believing in and promoting a freedom loving society is precisely the fact that you can cut off communication with whomever and whenever you choose. This is something that you are obviously oblivious to. You conduct yourself in an exceptionally arrogant manner and have absolutely no respect to those whom you debate with. This is the only reason I choose to ignore people and not involve myself in any discourse with them, whatsoever.

    On the concept of the ‘crown’ you are utterly, totally and completely incapable of seeing the reality. You believe FAR too much what you read, proving, ironically you are ‘ignorant chump’ you accuse me of being.

    “I learned such important legal facts I read it up as a refresher in the long Wikipedia article on the City of Londom “

    And this sums you up. Lol You are clearly a troll.

    Now, I’ll leave it there. You are a fool. You are incapable of looking outside the box on life, incapable of see the true state of affairs of this world. You are a ‘know-it-all’ and contemptuous boor, hence why I’ve ignored everything you’ve ever had to state, since our disagreement however many months back.
    You have nothing to state that I am remotely interested in reading and the only reason I’m replying to you, now, is simply out of good manners and to answer any questions you may have as to why I don’t reply to any of your replies in the future.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  226. Flo says:

    “Jeff Stryker” certainly sounds like a porno pseudonym. His real name is probably something like Jeff Shapiro.

  227. Flo says:

    On average, a girl who lives with and is close to her father will reach menarche a bit later — sometimes several years later — than a girl who has no father in the home or — worse — an SOB for a father. It’s something to do with pheromones. Also, a loving, devoted father’s pheromones will easily trump those of any sullen, pimply youth who comes sniffing around. A girl with no fatherly pheromones filling her nasal passages will be susceptible to that same oversexed youth, or anyone else who floats by in a cloud of pheromones.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
    , @Skeptikal
  228. @Harbinger

    Well thank you. I suppose someone who can spell “boor” correctly is at least literate but, though I haven’bothered to check your extended UR oeuvre, you appear to be plain loopy if not, perhaps, on some med.

    Most significant: indeed prima facoe conclusive, is that you don’t seek to justify your egregious nonsense about the Crown.

    True you do incline me to arrogance, but contempt is a negative emotion I prefer to avoid. Still it is somewhat ironic, is it not, that you should call me a “fool” and claim to write out of “good manners”. There’s a word I think for such lack of self knowledge. Autistic?

  229. Harbinger says:

    Thank you for that Flo.
    Again, nature steps in as it seems, although I will certainly look into this. It appears, that a young girl will become ready for procreation depending on her safety. If she has little safety around her, she will seek protection in a strong male. It makes sense.

  230. Skeptikal says:
    @Commentator Mike

    Alden is right.
    Harbinger goes on and on and . . . on, on this topic of mestruation and his conclusion that a girl is ready to carry a child after her first menstruation.

    This is simply wrong and shows Harbinger’s obsession and distortion.
    Even a well-nourished middle-class American or British or other girl is not ready to conceive and carry a child to term without significant harm to her own physiological development. Menstruation does not signal the end of physical growth. A girl who is still growing cannot provide the sustenance needed by the foetus.

    Indeed, it was often the case that a woman would lose a tooth for every child she carried. The foetus’s demand on nutrition pulled minerals etc. away from those needed to maintain the woman’s own body.

    So, Harbinger is not only obviously obsessed with what he thinks he knows about pubescent girls—he is quite misguided in his conclusions. But he seems to get off on repetitions of the words “menstruation,” “ejaculation,” and “sperm.”

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  231. Skeptikal says:

    Any documentation for these assertions? Or is it anecdotal or perhaps autobiographical?

    • Replies: @Flo
  232. Harbinger says:


    All I can simply say is your ignorance is truly, truly, truly, truly astounding to state the least.
    The sad thing here is that other than the fact you completely failed to answer ANYTHING I asked you in post 108, you still want to harp on about man knowing better than nature, the very thing that created us. Talk about sheer arrogance.
    You have ignored everything that I have mentioned. Completely ignored the fact that for the history of man, (thousands upon thousands of years) women have been giving birth at an early age, due to high mortality rates. From 1275 to 1875 the legal age for sex was 12. Again you ignore this completely. And here’s the rub, ALONG COMES A FEMINIST (TAVISTOCK INSTUTE OF LONDON) AND SAYS THAT IT’S WRONG AND THE AGE SHOOTS UP TO 16. THIS INCIDENTALLY COINCIDES WITH THE BEGINNING OF HUGE CHANGES WITHIN SOCIETY AND ESSENTIALLY THE BEGINNING OF THE NEW WORLD ORDER’S DEPOPULATION AGENDA OF EUROPEANS.

    As stated, you are not, in the least skeptical, whatsoever and yet you like to call yourself just that. Any skeptic, upon reading about the Criminal Law Amendment Act 1885, knowing what’s going on today will easily realise this was essentially where the plans for the reduction of the western population began indirectly. You haven’t a clue, because you are unable to read between the lines. You are trapped within modern indoctrination.
    The minute anyone speaks about this subject, along with Alden, you instantly start shouting out paedophile, child molester, pervert and all other slur words in order to attempt to destroy the argument. Morons like Alden will instantly compare what is stated to being “right out of NAMBLA” when anyone with the slightest modicum of common sense and understanding this argument will know that the promotion of males sodomising one another, at an early age has absolutely NOTHING, whatsoever to do with the procreation of the human race and the birthing of children by young women, whom nature has deemed ready to procreate. To compare the two, shows nothing but sheer ignorance and worse a bone to grind on a dead end argument they’re trying to promote.

    For your information, the European birthrate has drastically dropped. If you had the slightest modicum of common sense, you’d realise that the Criminal Law Amendment Act 1885 played a part in that. Essentially, the European population’s birthrate rate is standing, on average, at around 1.5. Seeing as you’re too stupid to understand this, It means that essentially every generation, our population is essentially dropping by 25%. On the contrary, the Muslim birthrate, on average, here in the west is around 4/5. That means that their population is increasing by 100-150% every generation.
    It means that if the European population DO NOT START having children then they will become a minority, in their own lands by 2060. And will the immigrants show the same compassion we have? Will they institute laws that protect the minority?

    Look, fool, if you’re going to debate on a subject know what you’re discussing. You don’t. The tool of the Jew is to divide and conquer. Your stance, along with Alden’s is just that, attacking anyone as a paedophile, a child molester, a pervert and whatnot who makes a perfectly valid debate about procreation being decided by nature NOT man and yet you’ll still come on stating the crap you have above, about man knowing better than nature and man knowing when a child is ready to give birth.
    Again, I will draw you to the simple fact that if girls were not “doing that thing that happens to the body when nature decides they’re ready to have offspring” they would not be at the correct age to have children.

    You ignored answering anything in my initial reply to you because you can’t. If you do it will either show you to be an authoritarian or a complete and utter hypocrite.

  233. Harbinger says:

    As mentioned in my post above:

    “Essentially, the European population’s birthrate rate is standing, on average, at around 1.5. Seeing as you’re too stupid to understand this, It means that essentially every generation, our population is essentially dropping by 25%. On the contrary, the Muslim birthrate, on average, here in the west is around 4/5. That means that their population is increasing by 100-150% every generation.
    It means that if the European population DO NOT START having children then they will become a minority, in their own lands by 2060. And will the immigrants show the same compassion we have? Will they institute laws that protect the minority?”

    Some do see the serious problem, western civilisation faces, while others bury their head in the sand.

    Muslims, along with the non white population have children at a young age. It is not frowned upon in their culture whatsoever. However, here, in the west we have decided to (or were you brainwashed into believing?) frown upon this. We tell each other it’s wrong and as a result, women are giving birth, much later, if at all and choosing careers instead, deciding that having a string of sexual partners, in their life is far more rewarding.
    While you frown upon this, your population is dying. This argument is comparable to the Swedish woman, who seeing that she is now the minority in her country, her peers are all being raped and murdered, she holds up her head and shouts “maybe you are raping murdering my people, but when the Swedish people are genocided, at least we won’t have been racist” which essentially had they been, that is stopped mass immigration, then they wouldn’t about to be genocided.

    What has truly and I do mean truly angered me in this debate is that you fail to see the programming within you, that is the cultural Marxist indoctrination, you have decided to agree with 140 years of western society, which has essentially been heavy indoctrination and brainwashing and thrown out thousands of years of your culture and traditions. What the alternative media has been doing, on the internet is showing you, just how far back this indoctrination began, here in the west and yet some of you, on this wesbite, are incapable of ‘clicking’ when Parliament, here in the UK, releases legislation to effectively stop procreation amongst its people by increasing the age of consent, because some woman is concerned that children are being sold into brothels?
    Everything that came from Parliament, every organisation that promoted a change within society was HEAVILY controlled by change merchants with ulterior motives. Feminism (Fabian Socialists and Tavistock) was precisely one of those and look where we are today?

    This is your wake up call, because those here who think they are awake most certainly are not.
    In the past, your ancestors had children and the women were protected as they were vital to the survival of that clan/tribe. Now everything’s changed for the worse and women are now going off to fight in the armed forces, effectively negating the very purpose of it in the first place – to protect the people from invasion of their lands. Men were expendable, women however brought life. When the woman dies, so too does the tribe. And sadly, you have been brainwashed into thinking it’s all about equality. Utter idiots to state the least.

    The western civilisation needs to rapidly start increasing its population rate. War is coming whether you like it or not and that was is going to be in your cities and villages. War is rather simple in understanding – the bigger the force the higher the likelihood of success. So, like the Swedish girl analogy mentioned earlier, you have a choice – you can either get with the program and start educating your women to start procreating or else you will become a minority and most likely genocided, as the Jews did to the Russians. This is Russia all over again and it is coming. It cannot be avoided.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  234. Harbinger says:

    Finally, for those of you who still are incapable of understanding………

    In the past the tribe who was the largest had a far better chance of surviving against invaders.
    Tribes, whose women gave birth at an early age, brought more men to fight and protect them and more women to continue the tribe’s numbers.
    Tribes whose women gave birth at a latter age, obviously had a smaller tribe and were at a disadvantage to attackers.

    Most non whites do not have the argument about women giving birth at 13/14 years old and it’s perfectly acceptable in their culture. It is not frowned upon. However, ironically it is in the west and our population is plummeting. The NON white population, on the other hand is increasing.

    So, to put it bluntly, your government, brought in legislation, to increase the age of procreation in your country to stop your tribe from having children, skipping generations, while your enemies are not and their tribes are increasing vastly. It has promoted the emasculation of men. It has promoted homosexuality and transgenderism. It does not punish women who murder the unborn, or the doctors who carry it out. It has polluted the water the food supply that has brought a drastic drop in the male sperm rate…..the list goes on.
    Your countries are being invaded. Hate and race legistation has effectively stopped you from speaking out about this.
    Essentially your countries are being primed for takeover and most of you are utterly oblivious to this reality. There won’t be enough men to defend this land from attack and most of the men are either effeminate sodomites, confused transgenders or simply incapable of defending themselves, let alone others.

    Well done people. But hey, by all means, continue to shout out paedophile, child molester and rapist to those who try to point out blatant natural reality when it comes to when people are ready to procreate. When you’re all rounded up like sheep, locked away and brought out to be publicly executed, you can hold your head up high, like the Swedish girl and shout that you were never a racist, nor a homophobe, nor a transphobe, that you are a feminist, promoted feminism, promoted abortion, the rights of the LGBTQ, equal rights. welcomed all immigrants an……and I don’t really think the executioner of anyone listening is going to give a sh*t what you stated or were about to. They’ll just look at you and the rest of your people as a pathetically weak civilisation that died the minute it allowed Jews to take control and empower the woman over the man.

    • Replies: @anon
  235. m says:

    In court documents she claims the photo was to show her mom that she met the prince.

    • Replies: @Sean
  236. @Wizard of Oz

    FYI Dizzy, Wikipedia is not an information source to be at all trusted nor to add any credibility whatsoever when quoted as a source, in fact the very opposite is the case. You’re welcome.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  237. anon[218] • Disclaimer says:

    You’re confusing the Age of Consent with the age of Menarche.
    When 95% of people in Europe were farmers, that age averaged around 17 and a half.
    Women were having a lot of children then, but apart from Princesses kept locked up in castles their entire lives, they weren’t having them at 12 or 13 years of age.

    • Replies: @byrresheim
  238. Sean says:

    Assuming she is telling the truth about the twerp Andrew, let alone a president and prime ministers, one wonders why Giuffre was left alive after she ‘escaped’ to years later, after Epstein had been convicted over the mainly Hispanic high school girls, begin to tell her lurid tale.

    The account was filed on her behalf in regard to a defamation suit and allegations in a civil case mean very little. It was not evidence of any allegation about men apart from Epstein the dispute with was between her and Maxwell who was not with Epstein by that stage. Basically it was a legal ploy to get the allegations reported. Guiffre had the top firm of lawyers in the America (who happen to be bitter rivals of Dershowitz who was the person named in the documents ) representing her. She was caught out in a series of untruths during the case. Most egregiously she said she was working for Maxwell aged 15 years old when in fact she was a 17 year old changing room attendant at a Trump resort studying to be a masseuse when she met Maxwell and was offered a job with Epstein, who had a fetish about massage.

    She might well have wanted to keep a photographic memento of a trip to England and having been friends with one of the Queen’s sons. However, there was no way Andrew could plausibly deny he was the man in that photo and it would have been essential to any blackmail plot along with a far less conclusively identifying video. Epstein the pimp/ blackmailer would have the very best of reasons for not letting such a conclusive piece of evidence against not only Andrew, but himself and Maxwell, out of his control, especially as Maxwell was so clearly identifiable in it. Epstein letting Guiffre have something so putatively valuable and incriminating as the photo is what does not make sense. What Andrew was being blackmailed with is what Epstein let his employee/slave Giuffre waltz off with?

    I think the photograph is evidence Guiffre was friendly with Andrew and was given a snap in the same way anyone else might have, but not that Epstein was running any kind of blackmail scheme against Andrew. Guiffre having that photo argues against her account of being a slave, and if anything it is evidence against Epstein being involved in the deadly serious business of blackmailing seriously powerful figures in the country he was living in.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  239. @Harbinger

    Muslims have children in a traditional framework, young or no. Poorer whites don’t; this goes back to your original point about the sixties trashing working class whites.

    Take Jimmy from QUADROPHENIA. He came from a solid and respectable working class family. But he was already messing around with speed at the end of the film.

    By the late sixties, when Jimmy is 25, he has moved on to heroin. He has a kid with some hippy chick.

    Jimmy has thrown away any interest in conventional morality-he is now a hardcore hippy rather than a mod. Jimmy isn’t going to support his kid. He’s a drug casualty. Moreover, he has completely and utterly rejected the working class mores of his parents as seen in QUADROPHENIA. Ten years after throwing his motorcycle off a cliff he is a druggy hippie burnout.

    Jimmy’s kid was born in 1968 when he was 23. A young girl. She never sees Jimmy. By the mid seventies Jimmy is a heroin addict. Her Mum is now an ex-hippy into disco who smoke pot around the house.

    When Jimmy’s kid Moonbeam is ten or so, Jimmy’s parents who kicked him out at the end of QUADROPHENIA step in and take her and change her name by public deed registry to Daphne. They do the best they can with Jimmy’s daughter but they are old and weary. Jimmy is found OD’d in a fast food restaurant in 1985. Daphne’s mother lives on welfare.

    In 1983 when Daphne is fifteen, she starts to become rebellious. Jimmy’s parents are now in their sixties and too tired to really do anything about it.

    In 1986 when Daphne is 18 she meets a young man at a party. He is twenty-a little older. He owns a car. He gets her pregnant.

    Daphne has a daughter in 1987.

    Meanwhile, the area that Jimmy’s parents raised him in-where Daphne has lived all her life-is being filled with Pakistanis.

    …See how it happened.

    • Replies: @Harbinger
  240. @NoseytheDuke

    It happens to be something I know well enough to attempt to give him a prod in the rught direction without wadting too much time. Even the sceptical Ron Unx uses Wikipedia from time to time for, presumably, similar reasons of time saving where there isn’t much danger of ot being subjected to systematic and critically important subversion of the truth. I have heard suggestions of attempted censorship by both Chinese and Zionists but it is interesting to see how much of the disputes are exposed. In the case of Harbinger whom I had some tentatively favourable impression of he is apparently so profoundly ignorant of that on which he offers a confident opinion that he has been taken in by some nonsense which, given an obvious choice of search words, pops up first.

  241. Flo says:

    I don’t remember where I read about the pheromone angle, but it was in a serious book or publication, honest. It made such a strong impression — and made so much sense — that I’ve remembered it all these years later. And yes, it also seems to explain why I didn’t begin menstruating until I was 16 — a junior in high school. (And I was perfectly healthy!) My father and I were very close. Although he was a rather modest man himself, my little world revolved around him and he was certainly my favorite male, with older male relatives and male teachers (which were still quite common at the time and whom I loved) a close second. I’ll add that a girl is very fortunate to be close to her father in childhood. The usual result is a very well adjusted adult woman. Indeed , some of the most remarkable women were very close to their fathers — fathers’ girls — including Golda Meir, Indira Gandhi and Margaret Thatcher. Some of the most troubled and troublesome women had “daddy problems.”

  242. Harbinger says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    As you know, the attack on the western culture has come from TV, radio, film, music and sports. These 5 industries have completely destroyed what culture there is in the west. Take my country, Scotland, for example. When I was young, back in the 70’s there was still Andy Cameron on the TV (folk music and dancing in kilts etc). There were ceilidhs going on in pubs. There was still some semblance of my culture and now, it’s pretty much gone. People listen to music that’s predominantly black based. Young people love hanging out in gay bars, because those gays love to dance and of course, it’s filled with the ‘fag hags’ a name, when I worked on doors, given to straight women who socialised with gay men, because they never got harassed, as they used to say, by straight men.

    Quadrophenia, was essentially one of those moves that changed a generation. Mods, listening to their R&B, ska and two tone music, essentially were the gateway generation into multiculturalism, which would begin to dominate. Look at London today and compare it to say, The Ipcress File or Monty Python’s Meaning of Life movies? It’s a vastly different place in every way, shape and form. And of course, 44% of the population are indigenous. You won’t find any other non European capital city with an indigenous under at least 95%. And the minority indigenous, in capital cities is spreading throughout Europe, North America, Australia and New Zealand.

    People, here in the UK, are no longer English, Irish, Scottish 0r Welsh. They are the modern Briton – globalist, with no relation to culture, heritage, ancestry and traditions. Their playground is the world. They don’t holiday at home, but abroad. They drink and eat foreign food and not their own. Fashion is now universal…….

    Nothing can stop the slide into demolition of the past. Our younger generation have wholeheartedly accepted homosexuality, transgenderism, multiculturalism, multiracialism and of course mass immigration. The only real fightback is from the over 40 generations who have the common sense to see what’s happening. And what (((they’ve))) done is promote the youth into positions of management of influence, thus essentially having sock puppets in every organisation, NGO, student union and probably school. It’s really sad watching it all. The young are completely clueless to the fact they’re building the walls to their own prison they’ll never be free from.

    • Replies: @Daniel Rich
  243. @Harbinger

    Have you visited Paris lately?

    To me, it looks like ‘colonial chickens‘ coming home to roost [Europe].

    The only [mostly rhetorical] question I ask is: who benefits from destroyed societies?

    And my answer is: It’s not you and/or me.

    That’s for sure.

    The following might be a partial explanation as to why all this is happening [and it has been going on for a much longer period than most people anticipate]:


  244. @Sean

    “Guiffre is now being represented by the top lawyers in the country, Jewish of course and bitter rivals of Dershowitz.”

    David Boies is not a Jew.

    • Replies: @Sean
  245. @Sean

    The situation in Britain as it would have applied to Giuffre’s allegations of being a sex slave ordered to have intercourse with Andrew is completely different because there consent was a complete defence.

    Not so. Pimping and/or prostituting of a 17-year-old has never been legal in England in modern times.

    Of course, whether you believe Giuffre or not is another matter when it comes to determining whether she was willing to have sex with Prince Andrew, or was forced to for fear of whatever.

    My opinion is that there is a kernel of truth in her claims, but that she has smudged many of the details. Why is it still not clear how old she was at various times?

    For example of one photograph she says something like “It looks like I was about 16.” If there was a photograph of me as a teenager in a specific place, I am sure I would be able to accurately given the month and year, especially if it was a matter of importance and I had a little time to research the matter. And I am twice the age of Giuffre. For example, was it during the school year, or during a vacation or spring break?

    Why is it not clear how much Epstein paid her for sex with Prince Andrew and how she was paid. Was this in cash or by check, or by a bank transfer? In which country was she paid. In what currency? She seems to be holding back a lot and I wonder what the reason for this might be.

    • Replies: @Sean
    , @Alden
  246. Sean says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    She said she was 15 at the time though Maxwell’s lawyers proved she was at least two years older, and a judge in a criminal case would by law have to point out to the jury that she had been caught out in a falsehood on oath, so her unsupported word was too tainted as evidence by itself. She is the only one for the allegations against Maxwell and the presidents prime ministers and blackmail. The girl was a sex worker, and her being in possession of that photograph is quite a telling piece of evidence that her relationship with Epstein is one she misrepresents. Why would Maxwell and Epstein give her that photo and let her keep it if things were as she says?

    Andrew has said he never had sex with her, which would be risky if he had because there might be secret photographs and film. There would be no possible court case with Andrew as accused, and even if the newspapers printed the he had sex with a girl who was at least 17 years old at the time he could have said, so what? He still could say that now and suffer no consequences. I think if he had sex with her he would say so, especially now her story of being 15 not 17 years old is discredited.

    Not so. Pimping and/or prostituting of a 17-year-old has never been legal in England in modern times

    . She never said Andrew forced her, procured her, or paid her, just that she had sex with him at Epstein’s orders. It is a very long time since a crime of pandering (semi pimping without money changing hands) existed as a criminal offence in Britain, and allowing yourself to be fixed up by your friends up with girls at least a year over legal age is not so discreditable or unusual that Andrew or anyone else could be blackmailed with it.

    Why is it not clear how much Epstein paid her for sex with Prince Andrew and how she was paid. Was this in cash or by check, or by a bank transfer? In which country was she paid. In what currency? She seems to be holding back a lot and I wonder what the reason for this might be.

    Beyond the obvious explanation (of her lying about everything except sex with Epstein) I think she said she was having sex with all these VIPs for no payment beyond legit wages. Her father says she seemed to be in a good job and enjoying the high end lifestyle with international travel . He also told journalists that his daughter had met the Queen, so Guiffre tells fibs even when she has a truthful basis to her story. She was lying to her father for years about what her work involved. Even if what she said is really what happened, the one who was committing an offence was Epstein, not Andrew.

    Andrew does not have a thing for young women, if anything rather the opposite. Guiffre was absolutely average looking and her exerting a fatal attraction for the prime ministers and billionaires she said all wanted her seems a little far fetched. I cannot see Andrew climbing over the stunning models Epstein had around in order to get to Guiffre. Andrew could have girls much better looking than her for the asking without being around Epstein. I think like all these well brought up It Girls and Ehud Barak, Andrew’s was around Epstein even after the conviction because he knew how to use money to win people over.

    Epstein paid some debts of Andrew’s ex wife, had a nice place to stay in New York , superb holiday location on private atoll with servants; who would not like a friend like that enough to give him the benefit of the doubt over a court case. Barak’s statement to the press showed he certainly did not realise that Epstein had been convicted in relation to soliciting under age prostitution. Epstein’s money came from him duping the billionaire Wexner into handing complete financial control to Epstein, who was a confidence man.

    • Replies: @Anon
  247. @Sean

    Well reasoned if I may say so up to the last sentence though I am not sure I understand the full implications of your emphasised words. All your reasoning leads to – and it is important enough – is that Prince Andrew was used as a lure to get upper class people and wannabes to socialise with Epstein. Have I missed something?

    • Replies: @Sean
  248. Sean says:

    Hurriedly reading off the search result page was misleading, sorry. I don’t know he isn’t, but certainly no indication he is Jewish beyond his success as a lawyer and hiring the Mossad Squad. He is for sure a rival of Dershowitz, and he is representing Guiffre for free, which seems a little like a settling of scores to me. Boies :

    “The royal family did everything they could to try and discredit the Prince Andrew stuff,”

    He is poorly informed about the position of the Royal family in British life and their power. They tend to be helpless victims of every kind of calumny because they never sue.

  249. Anon[195] • Disclaimer says:

    You have obviously gone well into the sexy stuff but you make me uncomfortable. I’ve been roumd too long to suffer a sexual Dunning-Kruger syndrome. I’m a Beta?+ tops and what you are telling me is that I can’t tell the difference between an Alpha Minus and an Alpha Plus – a bit like saying I can’t tell that Ron Unz (IQ astronomical) is smarter than me. I wouldn’t have turned down Victoria drunk or sober (yes, yes “it provokes the desire, but it takes away the performance” as the Porter said to Macduff) but then you raise a question deep enough for the collectwd wisdom of UR commenters to adjudicate. That is, do you really think there is any extra sex appeal in “stunning models” in the flesh even for Royals who might have some stuffed-up theoretical version of what they’re entitled to rathet than what flesh and blood experience teaches??

    • Replies: @Sean
  250. Sean says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Epstein fancied himself as a Doc Savage figure, but you can’t live like that, and he was just a confidence trickster who happened to run into a dream ‘mark’ in Wexner. Thereafter his life was a holiday that never ended but he wanted to have respect so he bought into society an science. Maxwell was Epstein’s key to high society, she is an old friend, probably old girlfriend, of Andrew from way back.

    Maybe Epstein did have his friends partake of the models he had around, but those who investigated him say he spent his days having sex over and over again. My belief is he got jaded and spiced it up with schoolgirls? No one with half a brain would touch the underage stuff, and important men who have normal working days would be happy to knock off a twenty something. I think the little girls were Epstein’s private vice that stemmed from him having a life like a teen fantasy that turned stale He needed something new for a bigger kick. Andy is an insouciant fool, so is Barak. Every one else had dropped Epstein after the 2015 court case.

  251. Sean says:

    The male royals like charles have got introduced to sex very young so they would not be tempted into unsuitable liaisons, there are plenty of sexy women they have access to. Actress Amanda Barrie said in her memoirs she was offered the chance to be with Prince Charles when he was 14. The recruiter was the actor James Robertson Justice.

    I wouldn’t have turned down Victoria drunk or sober

    Maybe I was harsh about her looks but the girl was a changing room assistant. Much more importantly it must have been obvious to Andrew that Guiffre was employed by Epstein primarily as personal sex toy. Celebrity public figures get fairly hot women approaching them all the time, they are going to feel a bit of failure sleeping with a sex worker.

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  252. @Sean

    You are projecting your psychology onto others. Many celebrity males use high-class call girls right and left. Certainly Trump has. And of course the Saudi Royal Family.

    • Replies: @Sean
  253. Jeff Stryker [AKA "GO"] says:

    I’ve rubbed elbows with a few Nouveau Riche and they retain fairly lowbrow tastes. Epstein bird-dogged trailer parks and high schools because he was low-class. No great predator of Gentile poor. Just a middle aged schlub trying to get local high school girls drunk.

    • Replies: @Sean
  254. @anon

    Please take a look at the legal age of consent in those old times.

    Trolls: project your perverted thoughts on someone else.

    • Replies: @anon
  255. nonce says: • Website

    I must personally agree that young girls have both agency and sexuality. Some do it for money, some for fun, and some because they have to (poor, groomed, coerced or no impluse control). I do think girls this young are fooling themselves if they think they can be in control of the situation. But to pearl clutch about innocent youth is to deny reality. Does not excuse the exploiters.

  256. Sean says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Epstein bird-dogged trailer parks and high school

    No, for the really young stuff you need someone their own age to recruit them. Charley Manson would get his youngest male follower (sometimes with an older woman one to pretend to be his mother) to trawl high schools and highways (hitchhikers) seriously under age girls.

    Epstein used a 19 year old Hispanic girl who did not seem to realise the seriousness of what she was confessing to, The 19 year old told police she was paid a commission by Epstein and in turn she paid other girls to bring in the younger ones Epstein was keen on They got hundreds of dollars a time, but although the type of massage was not made explicit they realized it was going to be sexual for that kind of money. Tens of millions was paid our in compensation. Hardly any had full sex . A lot of them were Hispanic and several were family members of friends of the 14 year old high school girl who after being assaulted by a jealous Michelle Rodriguez-type classmate, was discovered to have hundreds of dollars on her. That started the whole thing. Epstein had no cut outs, and used his own home. He was truly an idiot, and predictably did not last even a year after he started on San Quentin Quail.
    Guiffre was not part of that case at all, so you bet she is pissed. Fact is, she was a lot older and may not have been under age at all when she had sex with Epstein. Rich men bang the help, who knew?

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  257. Sean says:
    @Sick of Orcs

    As the story was originally reported she was 15 at the time of the photo. He has not testified on oath to not having sex with her and was under no obligation to honestly reply to impertinent media questioning. I think he could now say ‘well actually I did have sex with her, so what?’ no problem. It is looking increasingly likely Guiffre made the whole ‘I was the ultimate courtesan to VIPs’ thing up.

    Even Guiffre admits in her accusation against Ghislaine of being present as a sexual massage that when Ghislaine pretended to boss her (Guiffre) around in the encounter she did it because Epstein found that a turn on. As a young women Maxwell was very close to Prince Andrew and she introduced Epstein to Andrew. As seen with his duping of Wexner, Epstein was an accomplished ingratiator and gaining the friendship of Andrew would not be that difficult once Ghislaine had provided the introduction and the assurance that Epstein was trustworthy. Ghislaine was his access to the parts of society where you need to be one of the insiders. She clearly wanted him to marry her and indulged his peccadilloes, but she was definitely not the recruiter of the Palm Beach schoolgirls and cut contact with him once that came out.

    Besides, the optics of that photo are disastrous, and well-deserved

    Newspapers will print bullcrap about the royals because they need the circulation it brings. Few people take it seriously in Britain because there have been many stupid stories , especially by the vile toerag press of Murdoch who hates the Queen and hated Ghislaine’s late father. Maxwell has fled to Brazil, but Andrew does not seem bothered and why should he be? I am curious as to how Guiffre could have retained possession of the photo, if Epstein and Maxwell were was the blackmailer and espionage team Guiffre portrays them as.

  258. anon[509] • Disclaimer says:

    You sound a tad excitable yourself.
    What your rubbish Wikipedia reference doesn’t show is that these instances of child marriage were all
    of rich nobs and toffs.
    In the England of Sir Edward Coke’s time, 95% of people were farmers, they spent their childhood out in the open air, and the age of Menarche was c. 17.5 years.

    • Agree: Alden
    • Replies: @Alden
  259. Jeff Stryker [AKA "GO"] says:

    Charles Manson never went near a high school. His youngest follower, Diane Lake, was 14 years old and had run away from home. The other second youngest was Angela Lansbury’s daughter, Diedre, who was sixteen. These were girls already deep into drugs and hanging around hippies when they met him.

    Most of them, however, were adults. Certainly his killers were adults. None of the people were responsible for the murders were kids. Some of the women were slightly older like Catherine Share and Mary Brunne and in their mid or late twenties but none of the women were over 30.

    As for the behavior of Epstein’s “victims” it calls into question the general morality of Hispanic girls in Florida that all he had to do was have one young woman spread the word and half of the high school class of girls would rush over to his house to trade their bodies for cash. It is amazing that 15 year old girls could be so hardened and amoral.

    • Replies: @Sean
  260. Sean says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    Lake (AKA ‘Snake’ from her movements during sex) was brought to Manson by her hippie parents when she was 13 years old.

    Epstein never had sex and hardly ever even penetrated the Palm Beach girls who brought him down, it was almost entirely him jerking off as the watched the girls play with vibrators while they kept their panties on, handjobs and buttock to buttock action (?).

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
  261. Jeff Stryker [AKA "GO"] says:

    There is no way a Rasputin-looking hillbilly like Manson could literally have hung around schoolyards in the sixties and not had the authorities on him.

    Regardless of the gory details of Epstein’s transactions with those girls it is hard to believe that 15 year old kids would clear out a homeroom rushing over to the house of some creepy pervert like Epstein ready for action (Whatever it was). How do 15 year old girls get so hardened and amoral at such an early age? One or two class sluts, sure, but it sounds as if a whole class of 10 the graders went romping over to Epstein’s house from the school.

    But remember I was in the 10th grade in 1989. Single familoies were not so prevalent then and children of the eighties benefited from the conservative backlash of the Reagan Revolution. The do-what-you-want craziness of the sixties was over and the Just Say No era was in full swing and pornography was not on every kid’s cell phone and the louche decadent Clinton era was not yet upon us.

    So my own perspective is a little warped.

    • Replies: @Alden
  262. @Sick of Orcs

    You presume that only filthy, stinking, ugly Muslims (Mohammedans) groom White British girls? Or you presume that the only Muslims (Mohammedans) who groom White British girls are stinking, ugly ones. Both are inane, erroneous presumptions. Have you looked in a mirror recently?

  263. Paul Singer, famous of late due to the Tucker Carlson reveal, has an ancillary,yet important link to the Epstein case, through his partnership with Roger Hertog of the Tikvah fund, and the Wexner foundation, in setting up the large, umbrella, infiltration of the Christian evangelical and liberal mainstream denomination.

    It runs through a variety of foreign cut outs and partners, detailed, documnted here:

  264. Alden says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    The picture of Guiffre with Andrew was taken March 2001. She turned 18 August 9 2001.

    The age of consent in the UK is 16. Prostitution and procuring for prostitution of 17 year olds is illegal in the UK.

    Facts and laws guys

  265. Alden says:

    Read the lives of royalty and upper level aristocrats. It’s very common to see a royal woman married at 14, first child at 18 or 19.

  266. Alden says:
    @Jeff Stryker

    You’ve made hundreds of posts about the drug addicted tattooed pregnant sluts and prostitutes in your own high school in the late 198os early 1990s. Then you went to college in rural Michigan and both college, town and all young women within 50 miles were drug addicted tattooed pregnant sluts and prostitutes.

    Then you moved to Phoenix and every woman you knew was a drug addicted tattooed pregnant slut prostitute school dropout.

    And now you claim the girls in your high school were virtuous paragons of morality.

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