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Steppe on Fire: Kazakhstan’s Color Revolution
Maidan in Almaty? Oh yeah. But it’s complicated.
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So is that much fear and loathing all about gas? Not really.

Kazakhstan was rocked into chaos virtually overnight, in principle, because of the doubling of prices for liquefied gas, which reached the (Russian) equivalent of 20 rubles per liter (compare it to an average of 30 rubles in Russia itself).

That was the spark for nationwide protests spanning every latitude from top business hub Almaty to the Caspian Sea ports of Aktau and Atyrau and even the capital Nur-Sultan, formerly Astana.

The central government was forced to roll back the gas price to the equivalent of 8 rubles a liter. Yet that only prompted the next stage of the protests, demanding lower food prices, an end of the vaccination campaign, a lower retirement age for mothers with many children and – last but not least – regime change, complete with its own slogan: Shal, ket! (“Down with the old man.”)

The “old man” is none other than national leader Nursultan Nazarbayev, 81, who even as he stepped down from the presidency after 29 years in power, in 2019, for all practical purposes remains the Kazakh gray eminence as head of the Security Council and the arbiter of domestic and foreign policy.

The prospect of yet another color revolution inevitably comes to mind: perhaps Turquoise-Yellow – reflecting the colors of the Kazakh national flag. Especially because right on cue, sharp observers found out that the usual suspects – the American embassy – was already “warning” about mass protests as early as in December 16, 2021.

Maidan in Almaty? Oh yeah. But it’s complicated.

Almaty in chaos

For the outside world, it’s hard to understand why a major energy exporting power such as Kazakhstan needs to increase gas prices for its own population.

The reason is – what else – unbridled neoliberalism and the proverbial free market shenanigans. Since 2019 liquefied gas is electronically traded in Kazakhstan. So keeping price caps – a decades-long custom – soon became impossible, as producers were constantly faced with selling their product below cost as consumption skyrocketed.

Everybody in Kazakhstan was expecting a price hike, as much as everybody in Kazakhstan uses liquefied gas, especially in their converted cars. And everybody in Kazakhstan has a car, as I was told, ruefully, during my last visit to Almaty, in late 2019, when I was trying in vain to find a taxi to head downtown.

It’s quite telling that the protests started in the city of Zhanaozen, smack into the oil/gas hub of Mangystau. And it’s also telling that Unrest Central immediately turned to car-addicted Almaty, the nation’s real business hub, and not the isolated, government infrastructure-heavy capital in the middle of the steppes.

At first President Kassym-Jomart Tokayev seemed to have been caught in a deer facing the headlights situation. He promised the return of price caps, installed a state of emergency/curfew both in Almaty and Mangystau (then nationwide) while accepting the current government’s resignation en masse and appointing a faceless Deputy Prime Minister, Alikhan Smailov, as interim PM until the formation of a new cabinet.

Yet that could not possibly contain the unrest. In lightning fast succession, we had the storming of the Almaty Akimat (mayor’s office); protesters shooting at the Army; a Nazarbayev monument demolished in Taldykorgan; his former residence in Almaty taken over; Kazakhtelecom disconnecting the whole country from the internet; several members of the National Guard – armored vehicles included – joining the protesters in Aktau; ATMs gone dead.

And then Almaty, plunged into complete chaos, was virtually seized by the protesters, including its international airport, which on Wednesday morning was under extra security, and in the evening had become occupied territory.

Kazakh airspace, meanwhile, had to contend with an extended traffic jam of private jets leaving to Moscow and Western Europe. Even though the Kremlin noted that Nur-Sultan had not asked for any Russian help, a “special delegation” was soon flying out of Moscow. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov cautiously stressed, “we are convinced that our Kazakh friends can independently solve their internal problems”, adding, “it is important that no one interferes from the outside.”

Geostrategy talks

How could it all derail so fast?

Up to now, the succession game in Kazakhstan had been seen mostly as a hit across Northern Eurasia. Local honchos, oligarchs and the comprador elites all kept their fiefdoms and sources of income. And yet, off the record, I was told in Nur-Sultan in late 2019 there would be serious problems ahead when some regional clans would come to collect – as in confronting “the old man” Nazarbayev and the system he put in place.

Tokayev did issue the proverbial call “not to succumb to internal and external provocations” – which makes sense – yet also assured that the government “will not fall”. Well, it was already falling, even after an emergency meeting trying to address the tangled web of socioeconomic problems with a promise that all “legitimate demands” by the protesters will be met.

This did not play out as a classic regime change scenario – at least initially. The configuration was of a fluid, amorphous state of chaos, as the – fragile – Kazakh institutions of power were simply incapable of comprehending the wider social malaise. A competent political opposition is non-existent: there’s no political exchange. Civil society has no channels to express itself.

So yes: there’s a riot goin’ on – to quote American rhythm’n blues. And everyone is a loser. What is still not exactly clear is which conflicting clans are flaming the protests – and what is their agenda in case they’d have a shot at power. After all, no “spontaneous” protests can pop up simultaneously all over this vast nation virtually overnight.

ORDER IT NOW

Kazakhstan was the last republic to leave the collapsing USSR over three decades ago, in December 1991. Under Nazarbayev, it immediately engaged in a self-described “multi-vector” foreign policy. Up to now, Nur-Sultan was skillfully positioning itself as a prime diplomatic mediator – from discussions on the Iranian nuclear program as early as 2013 to the war in/on Syria from 2016. The target: to solidify itself as the quintessential bridge between Europe and Asia.

The Chinese-driven New Silk Roads, or BRI, were officially launched by Xi Jinping at Nazarbayev University in September 2013. That happened to swiftly dovetail with the Kazakh concept of Eurasian economic integration, crafted after Nazarbayev’s own government spending project, Nurly Zhol (“Bright Path”), designed to turbo-charge the economy after the 2008-9 financial crisis.

In September 2015, in Beijing, Nazarbayev aligned Nurly Zhol with BRI, de facto propelling Kazakhstan to the heart of the new Eurasian integration order. Geostrategically, the largest landlocked nation on the planet became the prime interplay territory of the Chinese and Russian visions, BRI and the Eurasia Economic Union (EAEU).

A diversionary tactic

For Russia, Kazakhstan is even more strategic than for China. Nur-Sultan signed the CSTO treaty in 2003. It’s a key member of the EAEU. Both nations have massive military-technical ties and conduct strategic space cooperation in Baikonur. Russian has the status of an official language, spoken by 51% of the republic’s citizens.

At least 3.5 million Russians live in Kazakhstan. It’s still early to speculate about a possible “revolution” tinged with national liberation colors were the old system to eventually collapse. And even if that happened, Moscow will never lose all of its considerable political influence.

So the immediate problem is to assure Kazakhstan’s stability. The protests must be dispersed. There will be plenty of economic concessions. Permanent destabilizing chaos simply cannot be tolerated – and Moscow knows it by heart. Another – rolling – Maidan is out of the question.

The Belarus equation has shown how a strong hand can operate miracles. Still, the CSTO agreements do not cover assistance in case of internal political crises – and Tokayev did not seem to be inclined to make such a request.

Until he did. He called for the CSTO to intervene to restore order. There will be a military enforced curfew. And Nur-Sultan may even confiscate the assets of US and UK companies which are allegedly sponsoring the protests.

This is how Nikol Pashinyan, chairman of the CSTO Collective Security Council and Prime Minister of Armenia, framed it: Tokayev invoked a “threat to national security” and the “sovereignty” of Kazakhstan, “caused, inter alia, by outside interference.” So the CSTO “decided to send peacekeeping forces” to normalize the situation, “for a limited period of time”.

The usual destabilizing suspects are well known. They may not have the reach, the political influence, and the necessary amount of Trojan horses to keep Kazakhstan on fire indefinitely.

At least the Trojan horses themselves are being very explicit. They want an immediate release of all political prisoners; regime change; a provisional government of “reputable” citizens; and – what else – “withdrawal of all alliances with Russia.”

And then it all gets down to the level of ridiculous farce, as the EU starts calling on Kazakh authorities to “respect the right to peaceful protests.” As in allowing total anarchy, robbery, looting, hundreds of vehicles destroyed, attacks with assault rifles, ATMs and even the Duty Free at Almaty airport completely plundered.

This analysis (in Russian) covers some key points, mentioning, “the internet is full of pre-arranged propaganda posters and memos to the rebels” and the fact that “the authorities are not cleaning up the mess, as Lukashenko did in Belarus.”

Slogans so far seem to originate from plenty of sources – extolling everything from a “western path” to Kazakhstan to polygamy and Sharia law: “There is no single goal yet, it has not been identified. The result will come later. It is usually the same. The elimination of sovereignty, external management and, finally, as a rule, the formation of an anti-Russian political party.”

Putin, Lukashenko and Tokayev spent a long time over the phone, at the initiative of Lukashenko. The leaders of all CSTO members are in close contact. A master game plan – as in a massive “anti-terrorist operation” – has already been hatched. Gen. Gerasimov will personally supervise it.

Now compare it to what I learned from two different, high-ranking intel sources.

The first source was explicit: the whole Kazakh adventure is being sponsored by MI6 to create a new Maidan right before the Russia/US-NATO talks in Geneva and Brussels next week, to prevent any kind of agreement. Significantly, the “rebels” maintained their national coordination even after the internet was disconnected.

The second source is more nuanced: the usual suspects are trying to force Russia to back down against the collective West by creating a major distraction in their Eastern front, as part of a rolling strategy of chaos all along Russia’s borders. That may be a clever diversionary tactic, but Russian military intel is watching. Closely. And for the sake of the usual suspects, this better may not be interpreted – ominously – was a war provocation.

(Republished from Strategic Culture Foundation by permission of author or representative)
 
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  1. Tom67 says:

    I lived in Kasakhstan in the oughts and afterwards been periodically visiting there. It is hard to explain Kasakhstan as it is a Nomad nation that was forced to settle down under tremendous loss of life in the Thirties. The mentality is more free than in the agricultural “settled” stans but also much less organized. The reality for the majority of Kasakhs is pretty dismal. Their heritage didn´t gear them for life in settlements and they lack the habit of monotonous drudgery that characterizes Chinese or Uzbek peasants. They are also not of a monetary mindset which again makes them the losers in their own country. They always knew that their leaders are stealing the huge income from gas and oil and waste it on white elephants like the new capital Nur Sultan. But they kept quiet as their betters at least let them participate by keeping gas artificially cheap. The hiking of the gas price was the breaking of this informal compact. No need for foreigners to incite these riots. The utter venality of the jetsetting upper class is to blame. Nasarbayev and his ilk probably wanted to impress the Davos crowd by doing something about “global warming” and the Nomads finally had enough.

  2. Anonymous[359] • Disclaimer says:

    Russia is an imperialist nation trying to hang onto the last of its colonies and their resources. They are morally no better than the British, French, Spanish, etc, nations that largely abandoned this sort of imperialism after WW2.

    The truth is ethnic Kazakhs have every much as reason to hate Russians as any of the former subjects of Western colonial powers do to hate their former colonial masters.

    • Agree: Philip Owen
    • Disagree: RadicalCenter
  3. Anonymous[364] • Disclaimer says:

    “an end of the vaccination campaign,”

    If they’re against vaccines, I’m with them. I don’t even care if the CIA is behind it. Any government or regime that pushes this poison down your veins deserves to be taken down.

    • Agree: Rabbitnexus
    • Replies: @Wild Bill
    , @Old Brown Fool
  4. neutral says:
    @Tom67

    No need for foreigners to incite these riots.

    That is hard to believe considering that within a few days they seize airports, are supplied with huge amounts of weapons and have all the talking points of colour revolution text books.

    • Agree: Decoy, showmethereal
  5. Anonymous[351] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tom67

    You make some solid points here. The situation reminds me of how it plays out similarly in some Gulf countries which also run on oil wealth. As long as the leadership at the top is willing to share it to a degree with the various tribes and clans, they’ll let one family or clan run the show (and simply ignore the elite corruption or vanity). This social contract works as long as the deal remains generally beneficial to the majority population and the autocrats get to keep getting elected with 98% of the vote – yeah right. A major or sudden shock will remove the rug from under the social contract. At this point, any outside power that has a major stake in the country (and let’s be honest, due to the strategic location, that is a lot of them) who has been watching the situation will be able to take advantage of it…this includes countries that would like to intervene with their own boots on the ground to prop up a grateful quisling government. Fomenting an armed revolt/insurrection is a great way to either sap your enemy’s strength or to give the local government an excuse to invite in your own soldiers to “secure valuable state resources”.

    • Replies: @Tom67
  6. Aedib says:

    Color revolution already failing. If nothing weird and unlikely happens, it will end in less than a week.

  7. El Dato says:

    The reason is – what else – unbridled neoliberalism and the proverbial free market shenanigans. Since 2019 liquefied gas is electronically traded in Kazakhstan. So keeping price caps – a decades-long custom – soon became impossible, as producers were constantly faced with selling their product below cost as consumption skyrocketed.

    Wut?

    “Price caps” is the complete opposite of the “free market”. Indeed, it is the usual politicial ploy to buy the peasantry with “cheap stuff” while problems accumulate behind the curtain. And at some point in time, the curtain must fall. Of course, then “gougers” will be found but that won’t help.

    • Replies: @Alex70
    , @skrik
  8. El Dato says:
    @Anonymous

    The truth is ethnic Kazakhs have every much as reason to hate Russians

    Yeah, CIA-kun, but it’s not an “anti-russian revolution” at all.

    • Agree: GomezAdddams
  9. @Anonymous

    Well, perhaps Northern Kazakhstan formerly known as Southern Siberia should go back to Russia, as it is historically populated by ethnic Russians, and the Kazakh lands proper should be left on their own.

    • Replies: @frontier
  10. @Tom67

    It makes sense that Nur Sultan/Astana project was a boondoggle. Moving the capital from the largest city (Almaty) a thousand miles north to the more isolated and much colder Astana made no sense otherwise. I think I read that it is in fact now the coldest capital city in the world, supplanting Mongolia’s Ulaanbatar.

  11. People in the west should take notice how easy it is to take down a government. If enough people show up, no politician is stupid enough to want to be hung in the national square. Ceaucescu waited too long. The German, French and Austrian governments could all be taken out, it’s just up to the determination of the people to do it.

  12. Former says:
    @Tom67

    You are right and you are wrong. It is way more complicated than this. To start with, kazakhs are not a uniform nomadic nation pushed into industrialisation and urbanisation from their innocent pastoral pursuits in the 30s. They have been divided by and amongst themselves for a very long time into three Zhuz(s) – by territory and tribe. Not all of them are equal, think of them in terms of casts. Some are simple herdsmen, with low IQ, some are overseers, smart, quick to learn and adapt. Some are settled, some are nomadic. There is also a very distinct Aksuekter cast – white bone (or blue blood in Western terms), they were always religious and aristocratic (there were no secular aristocracy, I believe, though a lot were liberal and progressive.)
    Russian empire started building forts and military settlements in Kazakhstan since the 18 century. Only southern cities belong to the much earlier times of Samarkand and Chorasmia and Silk road.
    The region has such a long and patterned history, that calling its population “nomadic” is an over-simplification. Clans and tribes were always fighting for influence and riches, the state was always feudal, with nobility of all sizes and tribes from the higher zhuz feeling entitled to enrich themselves as much as possible. To paraphrase “Black Diamond” TIA – This Is Asia. It is imminently corrupt. Any new “ruler” who climbs to the top, brings his relatives and his tribe to the trough.
    To go back to the riots, since collapse of the USSR, young males from southern tribes were given hashish, alcohol, primitive weaponry and trucked to Almaty to cause havoc, frequently making remaining nationalities into scapegoats (there used to be around 100 nationalities from Greeks, Spaniards and Germans to Slavs of all kinds to Uyghurs, Dungans, Koreans etc). And these simple-minded drug and alcohol-fuelled mobs, armed with lengths of timber and metal rods are only happy to oblige. Who mobilises, sends and pays them is irrelevant. Do not confuse what’s happening with real protests. Real protesters achieved their moderate demands and went home. Who is sponsoring the mob and what is the end game – probably to get to the trough (either to continue robbing mineral resources or to be paid by Saudis for Islamisation, or to be paid by the Mossad to provoke Russia, or to be paid by the USA to sabotage the BRI, or all of the above). In any case, ordinary people will lose.
    Thank you to the author, Pepe Escobar. This is the only analysis that looks at it from various angles.

    • Thanks: joe2.5, Levtraro, clyde, nokangaroos
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @Dr clyde regis
  13. Yee says:

    After the US pull out of Afghanistan, the next step would be mess up Central Asia. So, no surprise here.

    • Agree: Fred777, Johnny Smoggins
  14. Yee says:
    @Tom67

    Isn’t it the norm of the world that the 1% getting all the wealth and leaving the 99% struggle for life? What’s so special about Arab Spring nations, Ukraine, Hongkong, Kasakhstan that they have such well-organized flare up?

    • Replies: @Old Brown Fool
  15. Anonymous[351] • Disclaimer says:
    @Former

    Thanks for adding some important points to the conversation, appreciate it.

    • Agree: Cortes
  16. Wild Bill says:
    @Anonymous

    I ran across this recently.
    This week we time travel to 1530 and Geneva.

    [MORE]

    “When the bubonic plague struck Geneva in 1530, everything was ready. They even opened a whole hospital for the plague victims. With doctors, paramedics and nurses. The traders contributed, the magistrate gave grants every month. The patients always gave money, and if one of them died alone, all the goods went to the hospital.

    But then a disaster happened: the plague was dying out, while the subsidies depended on the number of patients. There was no question of right and wrong for the Geneva hospital staff in 1530. If the plague produces money, then the plague is good. And then the doctors got organized.

    At first, they just poisoned patients to raise the mortality statistics, but they quickly realized that the statistics didn’t have to be just about mortality, but about mortality from plague. So they began to cut the boils from the bodies of the dead, dry them, grind them in a mortar and give them to other patients as medicine. Then they started dusting clothes, handkerchiefs and garters. But somehow the plague continued to abate. Apparently, the dried buboes didn’t work well. Doctors went into town and spread bubonic powder on door handles at night, selecting those homes where they could then profit. As an eyewitness wrote of these events, “this remained hidden for some time, but the devil is more concerned with increasing the number of sins than with hiding them.”

    In short, one of the doctors became so impudent and lazy that he decided not to wander the city at night, but simply threw a bundle of dust into the crowd during the day. The stench rose to the sky and one of the girls, who by a lucky chance had recently come out of that hospital, discovered what that smell was.

    The doctor was tied up and placed in the good hands of competent “craftsmen.” They tried to get as much information from him as possible. However, the execution lasted several days. The ingenious hippocrits were tied to poles on wagons and carried around the city. At each intersection the executioners used red-hot tongs to tear off pieces of meat. They were then taken to the public square, beheaded and quartered, and the pieces were taken to all the districts of Geneva.

    The only exception was the hospital director’s son, who did not take part in the trial but blurted out that he knew how to make potions and how to prepare the powder without fear of contamination. He was simply beheaded “to prevent the spread of evil”.

    – François Bonivard, Chronicles of Geneva, second volume, pages 395 – 402

    • Thanks: John Q Duped, Nancy, W
    • Replies: @simple mind
  17. @Anonymous

    I guess this demand was put to gain sympathies of the great unwashed of other countries. If the coup succeeds, the new regime will quietly discard this demand / promise. Universal surveillance and universal vaccination as a tool to decide who to live and who to die are two issues where the globalists will never compromise.

  18. @Yee

    Sugardaddies with deep purses and long arms. They provide the framework for the well organized flare ups.

  19. More upheaval in a country bordering Russia. From The Ukraine to Belarus and now Kazakhstan. But the US wants you to believe these are all just a coincidence. It really is not that complicated.

  20. Anonymous[416] • Disclaimer says:

    It’s ironic how the Kazakhs rise up against the Covid agenda, and most Western anti-vaxxers support Russia’s authoritarian military response against it.

    Western anti-vaxxers have zero respect for their own weak Western governments, but respect and admire the iron fist of countries like Russia and China and would no doubt accept vaccines and Covid restrictions imposed by them.

    • Agree: Supply and Demand
    • Thanks: simple mind
    • LOL: Chester
    • Troll: Thor Walhovd
  21. Ross23 says:

    Strange how the previous generations of Russians / Soviets allowed such a huge but weak sparsely populated county to exist.

    One would have thought they would have grabbed all the useful land for Russia and pushed the 18 million or so native kaz into the bottom part of the country.

    • Replies: @Emslander
    , @simple mind
  22. Every country on Earth is threatened by US Imperial subversion and sabotage. Just how long this situation can go on before someone reacts to US perfidy with some ‘kinetic’ (to use a favourite word of Imperial thugs)response, is the only question. Sitting back got the Ukraine turned into a fascist dystopia on Russia’s doorstep. I sincerely hope that these goons get the treatment that the Maidan thugs should have received.

    • Agree: Thor Walhovd
    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  23. Ross23 says:
    @Tom67

    So the fuckers hiked fuel prices to impress their green Davos friends and Greta and the country burned.

    Hopefully will be a lesson other countries will learn from.

  24. Tom67 says:
    @Anonymous

    I doubt it is the West that is stirring the pot. The Davos crowd actually loved Nasarbayev. Not the last because he was turning the Kasakhs into color-coded cattle. If you think vaccine totalitarianism i bad in the West you have not been to Kasakhstan. Total control along Chinese lines is what was being attempted. Kasakhstan was actually a pretty free country by -stan standards. Now there is (was) a process going on by which everybody´s biometric data (DNS, Iris, Scan etc) was to be centrally stored and linked to a persons electonic devise. Who you met, where you met was going to be open to an all seeing eye. All in the name of “health” of course. That was another straw that broke the camel´s back.

    • Thanks: Emslander
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @The_MasterWang
  25. Pepe knows the story just 2 days after riots broke out, and he is not in Kazachstan currently. Pepe knows that Kazachstan ‘revolution’ must be discerned from Ukrainian one, therefore it cannot be Blue-Yellow, it must be Turquoise-Yellow.
    Hm. Pepe is clearly in the know. Pepe knows too much?

    Did Arkady Dvorkovich, the current president of FIDE, and a former member of Russian Goverment, knew something when just 2 weeks before its planned time he decided to move FIDE World Rapid & Blitz Chess from Nur-Sultan to Warsaw, ostensibly due to strict covid regulations in Kazachstan….?

    • Replies: @Ukraine Tiger
    , @Height_776
  26. The end (and probably desired) outcome of this story is: Russian troops closer to the Near East.
    Will something happen now in Turkmenistan…?

    Will the ‘Great Game’ guys be alarmed ?

    • Replies: @foolisholdman
  27. clyde says:

    In the news is how bitcoin is tanking due to being cut off from Kazakhstan bitcoin miners. Due to the Kazakhstan internet being down.

    KAZAKHSTAN: LIFE EXPECTANCY
    Male 66.8 Female 75.3
    —-Which is decent enough—

  28. ebear says:

    Who the hell has a city named after them while they’re still alive?
    The only example I can think of is Stalingrad.

    • Replies: @erzberger
  29. @Former

    Putin is a jew, how exactly would mossad provoke them? Ksa follow the talmud, how is a country that is actively destroying all islamic heritage sites and maintaining the jewish sites going to “islamify” another nation.

    • Replies: @Dave Bowman
  30. Anon[344] • Disclaimer says:

    My college roommate is a mid tier State Depart lifer. He‘s a real Stratfor Imperialist type. And he‘s been nosing around Alma Alta (so?) for the last 4 years. I can state with certainty He still believes Washington runs the world. Boy, is he in for a learning experience.

  31. How about if this crisis was engineered by Russia? Increase prices to create unrest and see which Western agents, provocateurs, and fifth columns raise their heads to be cut down. So some useful idiots also get caught up and eliminated. Then bring the prices down again to calm the situation after eliminating the main culprits. They should have done something like this in the Ukraine early on instead of letting it all get out of hand. Good to hear they cut off the Internet, and hopefully when it’s turned on again the Western propaganda will be filtered out. And yes. US will do all it can to sabotage China’s BRI silk road plans by creating more unrest and instability in central Asia.

    • Replies: @Andreas
    , @Yee
    , @GMC
  32. The metaphor of the bridge has been used to describe Kazakhstan’s diplomacy with the Big Powers. Those nations should be prescient of the danger that lies ahead. It will be too late to cross that other proverbial bridge when they come to it – there will be no bridge to cross.
    https://www.ghostsofhistory.wordpress.com/

  33. Alex70 says:
    @El Dato

    “Price caps” is the complete opposite of the “free market”.

    That’s what the author wrote. Decades long price caps were untenable after 2019 neoliberal reforms .

    • Replies: @Mefobills
  34. Baz says:

    Obviously not a nation suitable for the democratic process as envisaged by the founding fathers.

    I hope it settles down and the average Kazakh citizen person prospers from the nations natural endowment of riches.

    It does seem rather odd that it flared up just before the crucial Russian/USA discussions on NATO expansion. Hopefully it will focus minds on how to come to an equitable agreement between Russia and the collective West before the situation gets really ugly.

    Shows how realpolitik works.

    • Replies: @republic
    , @Yee
    , @RadicalCenter
  35. republic says:
    @Baz

    Escobar

    The first source was explicit: the whole Kazakh adventure is being sponsored by MI6 to create a new Maidan right before the Russia/US-NATO talks in Geneva and Brussels next week, to prevent any kind of agreement.

  36. Fred777 says:
    @Joe Paluka

    Which western NGOs are going to help the German or French people?

  37. @Anonymous

    The USA Failed in containing Covid –847,00o dead versus 4, 636 in China –Facts matter. Doubt ,e–head to any USA hospital –head to the Intensive Care Unit and tell them Covid is a hoax or better yet unhook all those being treated in Intensiive Care who arrived there unvaccinated – Bingo –90% more space now available – –

    • Disagree: InnerCynic
    • LOL: Chester
    • Replies: @RobinG
  38. Yee says:
    @Baz

    I hope it settles down and the average Kazakh citizen person prospers from the nations natural endowment of riches.

    “the nation’s natural endowment of riches” have mostly been privatized, I heard… You know, going the capitalism way.

  39. Realist says:
    @Tom67

    The utter venality of the jetsetting upper class is to blame.

    Similar to the U. S.

  40. @Another Polish Perspective

    I read an article by another independent journalist that said basically the same things before Pepe wrote this. Does he know too much as well. Maybe some people are too dim to be able fathom things out.

  41. Thim says:

    This article reads like some misdirection from spooks. Not a single mention of the issue that enraged the people and convinced them to fight the power. Not one mention.

    I have noticed that is how Russian propaganda is playing it.

    If you needed a QR code to buy food or to access the money in your bank account, and didnt want the kill shot so you cannot get a QR, then you might get off your ass and begin fighting the power too.

    The whole thing looks to me like a clever Russian op to secure the South before they attack in the West.

    • Replies: @jsinton
    , @neutral
    , @Wild Bill
    , @Boo
  42. profnasty says:

    Violence is the only answer for the Russians.
    Paul Craig Roberts warned them.
    It looks like the rubber has met the road.

    • Troll: Ukraine Tiger
  43. jsinton says:

    I read something yesterday that the entire “revolution” may be a globohomo plot to disrupt Bitcoin mining in Kazakhstan. Kazakhstan is supposedly the #2 Bitcoin mining country because of the abundance of cheap electricity. ALL oligarch despots in ALL nations HATE Bitcoin because it undermines the local currency and returns economic power to the hands of the people.

    From stateofthenation.co :

    “The second-biggest country for bitcoin mining lost its internet access, taking as much as 15% of the network offline.
    Kazakhstan is home to coal mines that provide a cheap and abundant supply of energy, which is a major incentive to miners who compete in a low-margin industry, where their only variable cost is typically energy.
    Bitcoin fell below \$43,000 for the first time since September in trade on Thursday, falling over 8% at one point.”

  44. Andreas says:
    @Commentator Mike

    “How about if this crisis was engineered by Russia?”

    Very possible… The Western MSM isn’t exactly crowing. This is not the West challenging Russia’s ultimatum. This is the first of Russia’s responses to continued violations of its ultimatum. We’ll soon know if there is any truth to this spin.

  45. jsinton says:
    @Thim

    Escobar is somewhat one dimentional about all these things are a CIA plot. Never says anything negative about the Chinese or the Russians. He never gets to “who runs the CIA”. He’s just another propaganda hack.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  46. AndrewR says:
    @Priss Factor

    Just more distraction from the Islamic regime’s own crimes

  47. Emslander says:
    @Ross23

    One would have thought they would have grabbed all the useful land for Russia and pushed the 18 million or so native kaz into the bottom part of the country.

    You know, some things are just as impossible as they sound, even for a totalitarian. Only an idiot like Joe Biden would try something like that, like transporting the poorer and more criminal half of Latin America to Republican states.

    • Replies: @simple mind
  48. @Joe Paluka

    Sure, but would you want to be a martyr of the new New Order?

    • Replies: @Wild Bill
    , @Joe Paluka
  49. Emslander says:
    @jsinton

    Bitcoin is to the Millennial generation what a BA in English Literature was to the Boomers – entirely worthless.

    • Disagree: RadicalCenter
    • Replies: @Chester
  50. @Baz

    The Founding Fathers definitely did not envisage a democracy.

    Moreover, before tarring Kazakhs with that brush, let’s admit that tens of millions of the current residents of the “united” States — of all backgrounds — are not well suited to limited representative government, the rule of law, or individual liberty and responsibility.

    You’re right that all the citizens of Kazakhstan need to prosper from their nation’s natural resources, not just a select few. But isn’t the same true here in the USA?

    Whether Kazakhs or Americans, the God-given natural resources under the land in our country — oil, natural gas, minerals and metals — should be publicly owned. That means NOT that the government keeps the money, but that all natural-resource profits would be paid to all non-felon citizens in equal shares, every quarter, as a basic income.

    How about an uprising to demand that in the USA before the US rulers meddle in Kazakhstan?

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
    , @Derer
  51. @jsinton

    Good time to buy Bitcoin, then — or, better yet, Ethereum and Bitcoin Cash.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  52. Avery says:
    @neutral

    {That is hard to believe considering that within a few days they seize airports, are supplied with huge amounts of weapons and have all the talking points of colour revolution text books.}

    That’s right.

    The discontent clearly has popular roots.
    I mean, Kazakh leaders themselves made the boneheaded decision to remove price controls all at once.: huge shock to the average consumer. (…instead of gradually, over many years so common people can adjust)

    But Western NGOs and intelligence agencies CIA/MI6 are and were there all the time (embassies). So when something breaks, they are ready to take advantage: they have the expertise, the contacts, the people, and the means to bring in professional killers (e.g. Islamist terrorists, ISIS*).

    Here is a link to Andrey Martianov’s take on the events there.
    He used to post here and write for UNZ.

    [Kazakhstan and Russia.]

    ___________________________________________
    * reportedly a couple Kazakh cops were beheaded: the Islamist calling card.

    • Thanks: republic, Sarah
  53. @jsinton

    You’re right. It’s best to read Escobar like one would read/view Russia Today (www.rt.com): they are useful for Americans especially, because they tend to report openly and truthfully about the evils done by competing government thugs (the US) … but they ignore, downplay, or rationalize the wrongs done by the sponsoring-government thugs.

    • Disagree: Ukraine Tiger
  54. skrik says:
    @El Dato

    unbridled neoliberalism and the proverbial free market shenanigans

    With all due respect, can anyone explain why, in this ‘enlightened’ day and age, any fool would even contemplate introducing neoliberal madness? How to ‘kill’ the 99%! Unless that [+ any other associated madness] is corrected, Kazakhstan is lost. rgds

  55. antibeast says:

    This looks like yet another well-planned, foreign-instigated but ill-executed Maidan-style ‘Color Revolution’, with crowds, riots and mob violence. Kudos to the Kazakhtan President for calling it a ‘foreign terrorist attack’ and invoking Article 4 which calls for CSTO military intervention in case of an attack on a CSTO member-State. The message: CSTO ensures geopolitical stability in Central Asia which has eluded Ukraine ever since the Maidan Revolution.

  56. Yee says:
    @Commentator Mike

    How about if this crisis was engineered by Russia? Increase prices to create unrest and see which Western agents, provocateurs, and fifth columns raise their heads to be cut down.

    Those agents, provocateurs, and fifth columns can be quite easy to replace, so doesn’t worth such a big effort to remove them. In any case, those people don’t take instructions from Russia to do their job.

  57. Smith says:

    Solidarity with turkic people!
    Death to the CIA and American Empire.

  58. “A competent political opposition is non-existent:” same as in every white country. The right almost to a person refuses to fight the propaganda war effectively.

  59. neutral says:
    @Thim

    If anything it is you that is doing the misdirection here. Nobody can seriously argue that armed groups launching a coup is triggered by fuel cost increases. It is not in the Russians interest to have this happening in their South, it was already secure. It is VERY beneficial for the US to have this happen in Kazakstan, this is more than enough to tell me that this was a US (and its usual gang of puppets) operation.

  60. Bookish1 says:

    Keep in mind that the big big war coming in the future will be between Russia and China over oil and minerals and water and everything else in Siberia. So is Russia entering Kazakhstan to have two fronts against China.

  61. Wild Bill says:
    @Thim

    This article reads like some misdirection from spooks. Not a single mention of the issue that enraged the people and convinced them to fight the power. Not one mention.

    If you needed a QR code to buy food or to access the money in your bank account, and didnt want the kill shot so you cannot get a QR, then you might get off your ass and begin fighting the power too.

    You sure got that right. Sharp eyes.

  62. Wild Bill says:
    @Fluesterwitz

    You will have to change your name to pincushion soon.

  63. Anonymous[341] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tom67

    I will certainly agree that blaming everything on Western governments is blinding oneself to the very real motivations that China and Russia would have to make sure any outcome in that country goes the way they want – something that doesn’t interfere with their economic goals and security concerns. When I said boots on the ground, I can see why China would want an excuse to be invited in along its large border with Kazakhstan especially since there is a sizable Uighur population near that area and they want to shut down any potential “activism” or unrest. Bilash and other members of Atajurt posted regular video testimonies from people whose relatives had gone missing in Xinjiang, as well as from recently released camp detainees, cataloging their abuse and indoctrination and bringing international attention to the issue in the process. But Atajurt’s success and Bilash’s reputation as a critic of China’s policies put him in the crosshairs of the Kazakh authorities. Like others vying for favor with Beijing, the Kazakh government has used its location to position itself as a strategic notch in the billion-dollar Belt and Road infrastructure program. Bilash was arrested on charges of interethnic incitement for critical remarks he had made about China’s policies in Xinjiang. The case, his supporters say, is an example of China exerting influence beyond its borders, pushing the Kazakh government to muzzle its own citizens.
    https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2019/09/china-xinjiang-uighur-kazakhstan/597106/

    I’m guessing the Khazakhs have a better idea of just how invasive this biometric monitoring nonsense is right across the border and don’t want anything to do with it. As you said before, Khazakhs seem to be from pastoral and nomadic background and far less agreeable to this kind of “seeing eye” government micro management of their lives.

    However, given all that, we cannot discount that the US and Britain also have some very real motivations for wanting to destabilize a country that borders both Russia and China and do whatever they can to bring about a result that is optimum for their own strategic geo-political goals.

  64. Von Rho says:

    This pothead is desperated because soon we will see the collapse of this farce called “new silk road” and he will be fired.

  65. gotmituns says:

    I don’t give a flying fucc at a rolling donut what happens in this kazak place. I just pray we don’t send troops. It seems they can kill each other very well without any of our “training.”

  66. Z-man says:

    Complicated my ass. The current corrupt president should be removed. A populist government should be put in its place.

    • Replies: @Fred777
    , @Ukraine Tiger
  67. Sean says:

    MI6 is behind it all. Laughable.

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
    • Replies: @Peter Rabbit
    , @Dave Bowman
  68. What happened to all Unz Review’s Russia knowledge?

    They all seem to have left and even Israel Shamir hasn’t written a piece for UR since October.

    I disagreed with plenty of what all the UR “Russia Hands” had to say, but still, it was an impressive caste overall, and I only now realize they are no longer here.

    Pepe is not a bad guy, but in his zeal to see the end of American Empire, he constantly overreaches analytically. He’s one of those guys who can’t separate the world as it is and is likely to be from the world as he would like to see it.

    Pepe says that this is likely the work of MI-6. Well, maybe so. But how does MI-6 manage to bring off something like this in Central Asia?

    Were the Russians surprised by this? It sort of sounds like they were. Where was Russian intelligence in Kazakhstan? Surely they must have more resources there than the British could possibly deploy.

    I see no answers to these questions in this piece.

  69. @RadicalCenter

    Whether Bitcoin, Ethereum or similar such Neo-monetizations; they all share one thing in common: They are not tangible. All these simulations are highly dependent upon forces that the individual “owner” cannot control or even manipulate. They strike me as being somewhat akin to Bernie Madoff’s Ponzi schemes. You best better not be the last one to desert the merry-go-round.

    • Agree: Sarah, Emslander
    • Replies: @jsinton
    , @showmethereal
  70. Fred777 says:
    @Z-man

    Wait are we talking about Kazakhstan or the USA?

    • Replies: @Z-man
  71. @Tom67

    You can doubt but we already know the US has demonstrated it knew about it ahead of time. Wasn’t even a secret. They warned about civil unrest in Kazakhstan in mid December. Down to where the riots were going to happen. It’s a color revolution. An American sponsored camping of terrorism and insurrection.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  72. Yee says:
    @Anonymous

    Bilash and other members of Atajurt

    I heard the US has double their NGO spending in Kazakhstan for the last 2 years, I think it’d be a safe bet that these people get a share of the increased funding…

    • Thanks: Nancy, Sarah
    • Replies: @Anonymous
  73. Mefobills says:
    @Alex70

    There is no such thing as a “free market.” It is a made up term.

    If you are a gas producer country, you can afford to deliver gas to your populace at cost.

    Alaska has long rebated profits from Alaskan oil back to its population.

    Here is the real economics:

    https://carnegiemoscow.org/commentary/85078

    Kazakhstan, however, is bucking this regional trend. Its relationship with Washington was never centered on Afghanistan or building democracy, but on economic factors. U.S. companies are leading producers in Kazakhstan’s oil industry, which contributes up to 44 percent of the country’s budget. In 2019, they accounted for about 30 percent of the total oil extracted in Kazakhstan, compared with about 17 percent produced by China’s CNPC, Sinopec, and CITIC, and 3 percent by Russia’s Lukoil.

    You don’t ever bite the hand that feeds.

  74. @Anonymous

    Citing material emanating from the Atlantic magazine is a a bit unwise and perhaps even sophomoric; as every informed resistor full well understands that said publication is nothing more than a typical Atlanticist mouthpiece, similar to Time, Newspeak, the Chew Pork Slymes and Reuters.

    In a word, these publications are enemy propaganda…well, two words.

    That said, your comments on biometric monitoring is to the point and quite logical. My advise is to not cite “authority” to buttress your otherwise shrewd assessments.

  75. frontier says:
    @siberiancat

    Well, perhaps Northern Kazakhstan formerly known as Southern Siberia should go back to Russia, as it is historically populated by ethnic Russians, and the Kazakh lands proper should be left on their own.

    Perhaps not… As we speak, 4000 metric tons of military plane capacity are doing round trips between Rus and Kaz. Kaz cannot defend itself and they now know it, the Russians have been warning them for many years and have been proven right. The informal federation between Rus, Kaz and Belarus is taking shape and in due time it will be formal… with the continued help of Western Intelligence agencies.

    This solution is much better than fighting over borders.

    Nah, you can’t beat Putin in a war, he has also mastered the low intensity stuff and he’s using it well. I wish he was that good at politics too… but considering who is against him, he’s pure genius in comparison.

  76. @The_MasterWang

    You make an interesting observation. It would help if you can cite specifics and buttress those not-unlikely Nuland/Nudelman strategies and tactics as may have been employed in Kazakhstan.

    It is hardly possible that all posters—and the very many lurkers—on this site, are able to spend the time researching every single geopolitical situation. Many of us are here to learn as well as to blow off a bit of accumulated steam.

    • Replies: @The_MasterWang
  77. Today, Vladimir Putin goes to Orthodox Christian Church to pray…

    On Dec 25….John Bolton licked Satan’s rectum in HELL!!!….Hillary Clinton smiled…

  78. Aedib says:

    Pepe says that the intent was managed by MI6 + CIA. Alexander Mercouris disagree, pointing to CIA (Nuland’s wing) + SBU + Polish intelligence. This last hypothesis seems likelier to me since Nexta (a Pole asset) started to write demands and ultimatums very weel coordinated with the uprising.

  79. @emerging majority

    https://kz.usembassy.gov/demonstration-alert121521/

    Some more interesting facts about Kazakhstan:

    China has four pipelines going through the country and the right to pump gas in some oil fields. Kazakhstan is central to China’s BRI. It’s also right next to Xinjiang. China’s trains go through there to reach Europe.

    Tell me this isn’t an American color revolution op.

    • Replies: @Quibus
    , @picture111
  80. Anonymous[341] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yee

    Would not surprising me in the least. It’s not that I think the US government actually cares about what China is doing to the Uighurs (you barely hear a peep against the humanitarian tragedy the Saudis have caused in Yemen) – it is a convenient way for them to galvanize the surrounding Turkic Muslim populations against them. That is useful for getting in the way of Chinese financial Silk Road ambitions.

    On the other side of the coin, to counter that, the Chinese would obviously like a compliant -Stan government that will keep export oil prices in its favor (and instead raise prices on its citizens) and even arrest its own citizens that get too nosy about publicizing what is known among its Uighur population (who just happen to be the largest outside of China). And if that government invites Chinese troops in to stabilize the situation – conveniently – in the same border areas where those Uighurs happen to live, well that just works out that much better for Beijing.

    • Replies: @Yee
  81. I have to say the last two paragraphs are concurrent with my own thoughts beginning the day after these events broke out.
    Let it also be said, this is a serendipitous two-fer for the West, not only fucking with Russia, but causing roiling in the current of the BRI for China—especially as the country borders China’s Xinjiang Province. Five Eyes be High Fiving right now. But it’s soon enough there will be Hell to pay. Gayronteed.

  82. @Dr clyde regis

    Putin is a jew

    Rubbish.

    Putin is single-handedly responsible for kicking the kike carpetbaggers like Berezovsky out after they looted and ruined Russia for years after the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

    Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin was born on 7 October 1952 in Leningrad, Russian SFSR, Soviet Union (now Saint Petersburg, Russia), the youngest of three children of Vladimir Spiridonovich Putin (1911–1999) and Maria Ivanovna Putina (née Shelomova; 1911–1998).

    – – Wikipedia

    “Ivanova Shelomova” > White Russian – NOT Jewish – mother. Ergo Putin is NOT Jewish.

    He privately despises the filthy thieving, war-mongering scum as much as we do. That’s WHY they hate him !!

    • Replies: @Quibus
  83. @Oscar Peterson

    Pepe says that this is likely the work of MI-6. Well, maybe so. But how does MI-6 manage to bring off something like this in Central Asia?

    Pepe spells it out in capital letters; Western NGO’s. This is how the Imperialists do it everywhere.

  84. Boo says:
    @Thim

    The “Russians” are in your brain already…

    • LOL: Z-man
  85. @Bookish1

    The ‘book’ being the Talmud.

  86. @Avery

    This is why the US ‘left’ Afghanistan, and moved their ISIS-K thugs from Syria to Afghanistan. To sow terror and destruction in the ‘Stans, to undermine the BRI and Russia and China. There will be more terror as ‘ISIS’ establishes itself in Central Asia. Evil NEVER rests.

    • Agree: Avery
    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
  87. Tom67 says:
    @Anonymous

    I braodly agree with your take and you are very right in bringing up Xinjiang. In fact that is an important and easily overlooked factor in why people are rebelling. As to the West stirring the kettle: could very well be. But it is certainly less a factor than in Ukraine. The goody-goody and well endowed NGO´s were generally not half as critical of Nasarbayev as they were of Yanukovic. And good old Soros was generally quite happy with the Kasakh goverment bringing digital enlightenment and passports to the Kasakhs. I must admit I was flabbergasted by the speed things went awry. I saw the same thing hapen in Mongolia in 2008. Everybody was unhappy and gnashing their teeth. And then there was a demonstration that suddenly turned violent. Mongolian cops had no good non lethal equipment and short of deadly weapons didn´t know what to do. In consequence the headquarters of the former communist party was burned down and then martial law was declared. Later in the night the military moved in and shot random stragglers and even witnesses like some hares.
    What is amazing and definate is the fact that two days ago even the security services evidently weren´t 100% on the side of the government. This is absolutely not surprising when you consider the distance between the ruling elites and the common folk. A bit like Hillary finally meeting the deplorables.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  88. anon[406] • Disclaimer says:

    Russia is an imperialist nation. There are several reasons why Kazakhstan is in turmoil and near the point of civil war. Both Russia and US elites have their hands in their but there’s also some natives pissed off at what’s happening to their country.

    1)Kazakhs aren’t allowed to take money out of their banks without being vaxxed, having a QR code that acts as a vaccine passport.
    2)Kazakhs are poor despite being oil, gas and uranium rich. The native Kazakhs are poorer than the large Russian minority that have most of the better jobs.
    2a)average income Kazakhstan is \$7000, the averages usually lie on the 65th percentile meaning most earn less than that. In comparison the poorest country in Europe, Moldova has an average income of \$6200 despite being landlocked and have no natural resources
    3)Kazakhs are ruled by tribes and clans always competing against each other, they never had the western beliefs of citizenship identity.

  89. @RadicalCenter

    ‘Democrazy’ gives an equal vote (ONLY in theory, of course)to the wise and the moronic, to the kindhearted and the vicious, to the pig ignorant and the knowledgeable, to the insatiably greedy and those who are not, to the wicked and the benevolent etc. The fruits of this insanity, plus the corruption of private political ‘donations’, MSM bias, and various measures to rig the vote toward the servants of the rich, are plain to see, particularly in the Anglosphere sewers.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  90. Quibus says:
    @neutral

    You are right, it is as usualy, they can’t stop this sick people, I give no names but we know them all !

  91. Quibus says:
    @Dave Bowman

    Sorry Sir, but you may not like Putin or Russian people, they are domed by the western MEDIA who are in the hands wel you know and I know, and if you know the USA millitair budget, wel you can bye the whole world with that money from the USA tax payers !

  92. Quibus says:
    @The_MasterWang

    Yes maby you are right, its a very complicated surrounding their, we will see soon enough !

    • Replies: @The_MasterWang
  93. JamesinNM says:

    Not all that complicated. A simple five-letter word, Soros, explains it. The Soros problem needs to be addressed.

  94. JamesinNM says:
    @Anonymous

    Don’t underestimate Soros and the evil globalists.

  95. @mulga mumblebrain

    Weighted voting privileges is a concept I have long favored. Under this proposal nobody would be unable to cast a ballot–even felons and retards. Here’s where it gets interesting. Testing regimens could be put to the task. Tests would include basic literacy; knowledge of local, state and national history; elementary geography, localized for specific districts or municipalities and finally a grasp of civics: What is government, how does it function, what is its purpose, what are the rights and responsibilities of citizens. More could be added, but that’s a general perspective.

    Possibly there could be three classes of voting, the relatively ignorant would have a single vote, which could be considered as being in their best interest as a citizen; a moderately well-informed person would be granted two votes. Those who would have good general knowledge of relevant factors would have the privilege of full voting citizenship and their vote would carry triple weight.

    This system would encourage those with two votes to better their understanding of civics and civil responsibility. They would be allowed a re-test and if they passed this one, would achieve the higher status. Needless to say, the testing questions would never be identical to previous ones. Think about it. It could work. Of course, those parties based on prostitutional demagoguery would strenuously object. When it comes to matters political, there are always people who will never be satisfied.

    • Replies: @DevilAdvocate
  96. Anonymous[251] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tom67

    Thanks for bringing up the Mongolian incident, that certainly has parallels – though anything post-Covid is going to be even worse along with the increase in tracking/monitoring technology.

    When I look for images of “Kazakh people”, I see stuff like this.

    Often wide open spaces, colorful and traditional dresses, natural background, multi-generational families, etc.

    When I look up “Chinese people” I get stuff like this.

    Crowded, monotonous colors, modern clothing, uniformity, singular units, urban backgrounds, etc.

    The Chinese population of today seems primed for bio-metric monitoring and tracking. Maybe in the past, much of rural China more resembled the traditional Kazakhs. But that was a way different China before the communist reshaping of the country and culture over the last 70 years.

    The Kazakhs already had the communists ruling over them for a while and they shed that identity after they broke off from the Soviet Union. Have these factors reached a tipping point for which the oil prices were the final “straw”?
    Then, the study examines the practical impact of Islamic revival and makes reference to an institutionalization of Islam through religious, economic and political institutions. The study argues, after independence, despite the secular and authoritarian nature of the government, ‘Islamic revival’ has become an institutionalised phenomenon and its appearance and social function in the public space has increased rather than decreased.
    https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/25765949.2019.1630576

    The fortune and misfortune of Kazakhstan is that it has large oil resources and is in a geographically strategic location – and – I believe this is key, doesn’t have the population quantity or quality to maximize the resources for its own population’s main interests. Maybe if it had an already-industrial population of 50-60 million, it could stand on its own, but it doesn’t so it will always be massively influenced by outside powers.

    External powers like to deal with corrupt and venal elites that are ruthless and authoritarian. It is much easier to negotiate contracts that are beneficial to your side and detrimental to the local population when you can deal with these kinds of people that will sell out their own populations for a price. And when the population seems to get edgy about being exploited or left out of the conversation about their share of the resources, the local strongman denounces them as terrorists and has his generals (who have been trained by outsiders and have contacts with their military elites) open fire on them and invites in outsiders to help quell unrest against his own people. Works like a charm if you happen to be that influential outside power – especially because, even if the local strongman gets overthrown, all you have to do is make sure the new guys will live up to the contracts signed by the previous regime and will inherit their liabilities on behalf of the country.

    Let’s go through the list…

    US and Britain – obviously have an interest in replacing the current authoritarian and corrupt elites (who are friendly with China and Russia) with their own friendly authoritarian and corrupt elites. This allows them to be the ones to strangle any oil exports or raise their prices against China or interfere with Chinese affairs or the BRI or spy on both Russia and China from a neighboring country. Also, currently, all military hardware that Kazakhstan purchases with that oil money is Russian or Chinese. The US and UK would obviously like to replace that with their own weapons – no more SU30s, but F22s instead.

    Russia doesn’t really need much from Kazakhstan other than a secure border. They don’t need oil resources since they are already a net exporter. The current government of Kazakhstan is already well-integrated with Moscow (especially on the military front) and are arms/munitions clients. Russia has real concerns with a sizable Russian population near the northern border and has likely been observing the rising ethnic-nationalist sentiment in parts of Kazakhstan with concern. They would only need to seriously secure they northern areas since those are the most heavily populated by ethnic Russians – the concern being to make sure ethnic tensions do not spill into those areas and that Russians in the south have an escape corridor. The good thing about this is that the oil fields are not located in those areas so there wouldn’t necessarily be a huge push from Kazakhs about losing control of those, might even be seen as reducing a liability. Russia doesn’t want a US client state directly to its south that can spy on it or (worse case scenario) have nuclear missiles based there – the equivalent of the Cuban missile crisis.

    The Chinese government would probably not care if a disease came through and wiped out all the annoying Kazakhs that seem to be between them and the oil they need. Right now they have negotiated a deal in their own favor and don’t want a change of hats to spoil that. So if the Kazakhs have to pay more for gas even though they sit on top of it, it’s fine as long as the Chinese can be assured the oil will continue to flow to them at the same price. Again, negotiating this deal with corrupt elites that don’t care about throwing their own population under a bus is far easier than with a government that actually cares to do what is in the best interests of its populace. Along with that, they have a real concern that there could be unrest along their rather large border that is catalyzed by what they are doing to their Uighur population. Khazaks are Turkic and Muslim so they would be sympathetic to what’s happening to Uighurs on the other side of the border. It is on the Chinese best interests to have a local authoritarian government that jails/disappears anyone talking about it rather than having to enter the country and do it themselves. This is where the bio-metric tracking comes into play. I think we all know that Kazakhstan is not capable of doing this on their own, but who in the area is? Who is building this software? Hmmm…
    http://gca.satrapia.com/kaznu-and-its-supercomputer

    Second, there is an issue of data sovereignty. Chinese ICT companies are either directly state-owned enterprises or private companies closely linked to the Chinese Communist Party. In recent years, many notable Chinese ICT companies including Huawei and Dahua, for example, have been involved in scandals where the security of their systems has been called into question. In relying on foreign ICT companies to build surveillance apparatuses, Central Asian states may risk losing complete autonomy over the data gathered within their borders.
    https://daviscenter.fas.harvard.edu/insights/budding-digital-authoritarianism-central-asia

    It helps China if the local authoritarian foists these upon the people as if it is a local initiative so that there is less resistance to it. With steady rising Islamic awareness and sentiment in the country, as I cited earlier, and the fact that the IS and UK are known to weaponize Muslim extremists to do their dirty work, China wants to (ideally) preemptively have the same level of surveillance on that potentially troublesome neighboring population before things get out of hand. Giving the necessary tools to a secular authoritarian regime that can spy on its own population is part of the equation.

    So…in short…the average Kazakh is screwed for the near future.

    • Thanks: emerging majority
    • Troll: d dan, showmethereal
  97. @Oscar Peterson

    Nazerbayev paid Tony Blair 3.6m GBP a year for political advice. MI6 is heavily entrenched in KZ. Also the US army has trained and conducted joint exercises with the KZ army.

    Nevertheless, my main money is on the current president provoking this to clean out Nazerbayev from control and access to money. Why else increase fuel prices in the middle of winter? Gilets Jaunes can be found everywhere.

    My second bet is on Ablyazov, a Kazak oligarch wanted for fraud by Kazakhstan, Ukraine, Russia and the UK. He is currently a refugee in France and sponsors an organization hosted in Ukraine dedicated to bringing down the Nazerbayev clan. He removed \$3.5 Bn in CASH, 20 years ago. The largest bank fraud in history at the time. There are 0.5m Ukrainians in KZ to help him.

    And then there is Turkey to consider. Perhaps in league with Ablyazov. Erdogan is under pressure in Idlib. He and the Ukrainians both benefit from diverting Putin.

    At stake in order of impact.
    Nazerbayev’s clan income
    Baikonur Cosmodrome (shades of Sebastapol’s little green men)
    4.5m Russian colonists (also Ukranians, Germans, Greeks …)
    Railways in ethnic Russian North Kazakhstan.
    40% of the worlds uranium
    18% of Bitcoin mines
    Oil and gas for China
    China’s back door
    Access to Uighur inhabited borderlands
    China’s phosphate (fertilizer) supply

    • Replies: @Miro23
    , @Von Rho
    , @Seraphim
  98. @Anonymous

    Yep, I can see that obvious cognitive dissonance, but the back story is what will happen if Russia, China and other CSTO get the upper hand on West Civ degenerates.

    I believe that all CoVid1984 BS will also be withdrawn.

  99. @emerging majority

    That system would never filter the corrupt, the wicked and the insatiably greedy. Quite the opposite, because these ones are more often than not quite knowledgeable. They would devise soon a system where “some” could get 1.000 or 100.000 voting weights.

    • Replies: @Miro23
    , @emerging majority
  100. @mulga mumblebrain

    I sincerely hope that these goons get the treatment that the Maidan thugs should have received.

    It looks like they will as the president has declared a state of emergency which is to last until all the militants have been shot. Orders are out to shoot them on sight without any warning and operations are to continue until they have all been “exterminated”, “destroyed”. This is the kind of justice that should have been dispensed to the bastards who burned innocent people alive at Odessa.

    • Agree: GomezAdddams
  101. @Another Polish Perspective

    And for the record, Arkady Vladimirovich Dvorkovich – is a Russian public servant and economist, who was Deputy Prime Minister in Dmitry Medvedev’s Cabinet from 21 May 2012 until 7 May 2018.
    Dvorkovich was born on March 26, 1972 in Moscow to a Jewish family of international chess arbiter Vladimir Yakovlevich Dvorkovich (1937-2005) and Galina Lvovna Dvorkovich. His paternal grandfather was Yakov Isaakovich Dvorkovich.
    In November 2016, Deputy Prime Minister Dvorkovich was mentioned among the high federal officials who were in the development of the FSB in the Ulyukayev case about extorting a large bribe from the head of Rosneft, Igor Sechin.

  102. jsinton says:
    @emerging majority

    I have to agree. Bitcoin is not backed by anything tangible. You can’t hold it in your hand. And what happens when the internet goes down? Or you simply can’t login anymore? Compound that with what happens when the governments don’t tolerate the threat to their fiat money and they go Chinese and seek to outlaw it. No, Bitcoin is not for me.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  103. anonymous[139] • Disclaimer says:

    Nazarbayev’s daughters Dariga, Dinara and Aliya are all very wealthy, the first two being a half-billionaire and the second a full one. They were all in business over there. This despite the mass of the population not being particularly well off. In typical third world fashion those holding power are kleptomaniacs and endlessly greedy. He himself has obviously been hanging on way too long for all the good he has done. Having a city named for him is about as egotistical as it can get. One faction of parasites simply replaces another.

    • Replies: @anon
  104. @jsinton

    Is that your worry? WTF??

    • Replies: @jsinton
  105. @Bookish1

    You are an absolute idiot and will be banned.

  106. Seraphim says:
    @Bookish1

    If the ‘West’ continues to hope for the ‘big big war’ between China and Russia means that they are totally insane and don’t know what planet they are living on.

    • Replies: @Bookish1
  107. Miro23 says:
    @Philip Owen

    At stake in order of impact.

    Nazerbayev’s clan income
    Baikonur Cosmodrome (shades of Sebastapol’s little green men)
    4.5m Russian colonists (also Ukranians, Germans, Greeks …)
    Railways in ethnic Russian North Kazakhstan.
    40% of the worlds uranium
    18% of Bitcoin mines
    Oil and gas for China
    China’s back door
    Access to Uighur inhabited borderlands
    China’s phosphate (fertilizer) supply

    Overall Putin stops this colour revolution putsch (same as in Belarus), gets rid of hopeless Nazerbayev and installs someone who cooperates with Russia/China and understands the BRI.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
  108. @Anonymous

    When I look up “Chinese people” I get stuff like this.

    You’re obviously not looking very hard. Here is China last week:

    Here is a look at a Tier 4 city (lowest rank) in poorest province in China last month:

    And the security you see in the Metro and elsewhere is to PREVENT any foreign sponsored color revolutions and terrorist attacks. People are free to do as they wish….as anyone can see.

    • Agree: GomezAdddams
    • Thanks: Sarah
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @The_MasterWang
  109. Miro23 says:
    @DevilAdvocate

    @emerging majority

    That system would never filter the corrupt, the wicked and the insatiably greedy. Quite the opposite, because these ones are more often than not quite knowledgeable. They would devise soon a system where “some” could get 1.000 or 100.000 voting weights.

    Agreed that honest, average/lower intelligence people don’t get a look-in in this system.

    It’s designed for an intelligent satanic elite and their intelligent and corrupt collaborators.

    In simple terms, the average and below average people in a society have to be PROTECTED (the same as less able people are protected in a family) – and their enemies rooted out. Democracy is just a subterfuge for special interest dominance. How many members of Congress can really speak freely without coercion on all major issues?

  110. Von Rho says:
    @Philip Owen

    They have also since Stalin’s times, as other Central Asian countries, many Korean immigrants.

  111. Z-man says:
    @Ukraine Tiger

    Too complicated for you, genius.

  112. @Quibus

    Thousands of “NGOs” in that country. Guess who is financially backing them? “The CCP” busted a Hong Kong “independent” media outlet a few weeks ago and of course found money that didn’t have an well-explained source. The rest of the “independent media” ended their operation.

    You see, from the experience gained in Hong Kong and Belarus an effective counter to American color revolution has been developed. Look how decisively Putin is acting.

  113. Anonymous[409] • Disclaimer says:
    @dogbumbreath

    Yes, you are free to do as you wish as long as it doesn’t go against government dictates. That’s basically how it works practically everywhere.

    I mean, you’re not really going to tell me that you’re free to walk around downtown Beijing wearing a t-shirt like this right?
    I get that the Chinese population have been convinced that they all need to be monitored, supervised and graded on some “social credit system” from cradle to grave in order to prevent revolts and terrorism – in fact that is what they are trying to convince us of here in the West. In fact, if you are lucky, Chinese firms will get the contracts for supplying our governments with the software to monitor its own citizens.

    Look, I get it from your angle – it makes sense to you. And maybe the previous generation of Chinese thought they were also free to do anything they wanted, as long as they only had one child. For plenty of other people, it is the stuff of science fiction dystopian nightmares.

    I pointed out the Kazakhs and how they are a culture that still seems much more traditional and in touch with nature (many photos have them with some symbiotic relationship with animals like falcons or horses) and is family-oriented.

    It could be argued that the current Chinese culture is one of the most family-unfriendly cultures on the planet. Look at this map.
    Why would a Kazakh people want to import an all-seeing security-state culture from a people who build massive urban metropolis where they go to die alone?

    “According to the existing data, in the next 10 years, the number of women aged 22 to 35, which is the childbearing period, will drop by more than 30 percent compared with the present data. Without strong policy intervention, China’s new-born population is likely to fall below 10 million in the next few years, and its fertility rate will be lower than Japan’s, perhaps the lowest in the world,” Liang predicted.
    https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202105/1223141.shtml

    Do Chinese people have to be propagandized by the state to have kids because they literally live in an environment that only used to exist in fiction that they wouldn’t naturally want to bring children into? How many of the wumao keyboard warriors here are married and have kids – or even foresee that in their future? Why would self-respecting Kazakh men who want to live natural lives and be fathers and grandfathers want to bring that into their land?

    I don’t buy idiotic US propaganda that every Kazakh is a natural born Jeffersonian Democrat just waiting to establish a constitutional republic. This is what they’re going to be telling us in order to convince us they care about Kazakhs and that we need to intervene.

    I just don’t buy your nonsense either.

  114. @DevilAdvocate

    Your critique has elements of validity, but its a bit overblown. Mine is, of course, an idealistic point of view. That considered, such a proposal could be implemented as part of a new Constitution. As many posters here have pointed out, the Federalists created a document which ultimately worked to their particularist benefit.

    The most egregious example would be the monarchical court system, which Jefferson, then far from the scene as Minister to France, vehemently opposed, specifically because such a black robed monarch or a set of them were not only unelected politician-lawyers, but were also totally unaccountable.

    What I have set out to develop on this site, on numerous occasions over the years, was to set in motion a re-think of the entire governmental system for this, our ruptured republic. So I would like to see some positive input from a critic such as yourself. Change will never come about without the full participation of many concerned individuals.

    • Replies: @DevilAdvocate
  115. Yee says:
    @Anonymous

    and even arrest its own citizens that get too nosy about publicizing what is known among its Uighur population

    What is known is that the US has set out to dis-inform the world ever since the end of WW2.

    Soft Power: The U.S. Cultural Offensive and Japanese Intellectuals
    Takeshi MATSUDA

    President Harry Truman clearly sensed the advent of a new age. On August 31, 1945, he proclaimed that “the nature of present-day foreign relations makes it essential for the United States to maintain information activities abroad as an integral part of the conduct of our foreign affairs.”

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  116. @dogbumbreath

    They have an innate psychological tendency to reject the idea that non-Whites are human. And they react with hostility to the thought that those human-shaped things may have the power to resist, or in the case of China, match, them. Man lives on bread, and the word of God is “kill them and take their stuff”. The human mind is evolved for race war on a subconscious level. That serves a very useful evolutionary purpose and you can’t do much about it.

    • Replies: @neutral
  117. @Miro23

    Miro: My question to you is how can representative governance be re-established? For starters there is no way that one person can “represent” the wishes and needs of upwards of 600,000 people. It’s quite likely that half the American public cannot identify their Congresscritter.

    Congress simply does not work any more and that entire concept needs to be shit-canned. Now with internet communications, it would be possible to create public referendums to either propose laws or to eliminate bad ones. So my proposal would be to do away with the House. Those people, as you appear to note, are no wise representative of, nor have abiding interest in, the betterment of the lot of the American people. So the House goes and so does the Supreme Court.

    So that leaves us with the Senate. When originally conceptualized, the Senate was viewed as the wise body of second consideration. Emotionally driven or greed-impelled resolutions by the public could be not ratified by a Senate drawn from folks that the Japanese call “Living National Treasures”. In most every community there are selfless and public spirited individuals of retirement age who have dedicated much of their energy to various ways of public service and help to others—and that’s without being financially compensated for doing so.

    In order to re-establish an actual geniuses originally created by the founders, Senators were to be picked by state legislatures. A bad Constitutional Amendment during the corrupted and corruptive terrorist regime of the blackmailed Woodrow Wilson, made for direct election of Senators. This switch was very much appreciated by the plotters and schemers, simply because it is far easier to bribe and/or blackmail 51 Senators than it would be to buy a majority of state legislatures. The genius in the original setup was the now badly tattered concept of Separation of Powers—in this case between a number of united states and a federal government.

    Wherever possible, power must always be de-centralized and diversified. I’ve long given thought to these matters and seeing as you appear to have some interest in these matters, hereby solicit your thoughts on national reconstruction.

    • Replies: @Miro23
  118. @jsinton

    Thanks. You have done a good job of pointing out some of the things which I had considered, but did not include. Bitcoin is a close relative of what the stoopid Swedes have done by going over to an all electronic money system. Such a scheme is very easy for the schemers to control and almost impossible for ordinary people to even retain control over their own property.

  119. Anonymous[409] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yee

    The disinformation effort is earlier than WW2.

    What is known is that all governments carry out propaganda and disinformation campaigns to further their own geopolitical goals and interests. The US and UK do it and so do Russia, China, Japan and even small players like Oman and Peru. The only question is how effective each one is and the scope of their reach.

    • Replies: @Yee
  120. @Miro23

    Not in my original post.

    The senior officers in the Kazak army have all been trained in Sandhurst (the UK Army academy). It might be why the army hasn’t featured so far.

  121. Yee says:
    @Anonymous

    What is known is that all governments carry out propaganda

    There’s a distinct difference between other countries’ propaganda and the US.

    Other countries’ propaganda are more like “look how good we are”, the US manufactures lies of “how bad they are”. One generates friendly reactions, the other generates hate.

    • Agree: Sarah
    • Replies: @Anonymous
  122. Seraphim says:
    @Philip Owen

    It is enlightening to see the ‘law of unintended consequences’ operating in the case of Kazakhstan’s ‘unrest’.
    The ‘unrest’ was provoked by the spike in the price of liquefied gas which is the fuel of choice for all the cars in Kazakhstan. Pepe Escobar clearly indicates the reason, in that presumably not read (or not fully understood) paragraph:
    ”The reason is – what else – unbridled neoliberalism and the proverbial free market shenanigans. Since 2019 liquefied gas is electronically traded in Kazakhstan. So keeping price caps – a decades-long custom – soon became impossible, as producers were constantly faced with selling their product below cost as consumption skyrocketed.
    Everybody in Kazakhstan was expecting a price hike, as much as everybody in Kazakhstan uses liquefied gas, especially in their converted cars. And everybody in Kazakhstan has a car, as I was told, ruefully, during my last visit to Almaty, in late 2019, when I was trying in vain to find a taxi to head downtown”.
    So, what did cause the spike in prices of gas around the world? Not the imbecilic war against NorthStream2? OTOH, is not the Kazakhstan’s oil and gas industry heavily ‘penetrated’ by the ‘multinational energy corporations’ (for everybody’s information ‘Chevron is Kazakhstan’s largest private oil producer, holding important stakes in two of the nation’s biggest oil-producing fields – Tengiz and Karachaganak’)?

    As an aside (but not irrelevant), has the absolutely disgusting endorsing by the decrepit, degenerated British Monarchy of the criminal activities of the war criminal Tony Blair by conferring on him ”the most senior order of knighthood in the British honours system”, the ”Most Noble Order of the Garter” (in principle reserved to royalty) no relation to his ‘position’ as ”one of several well-paid western advisers who have burnished the image of Kazakhstan’s former ruler Nursultan Nazarbayev and his autocratic regime, now the target of angry protesters” (irrespective of the fact that ”The Kazakh government is said to have paid Blair’s consultancy \$13m for its services” and that Nazarbaev’s ” daughter and grandson own £80m of property in London. In 2020 the National Crime Agency lost an attempt in the high court to force them to explain where the money came from” – but it didn’t ask where the \$60 million of Tony Blair’s ‘worth’ came from)?
    So, the idea that the MI6 was directly involved in the ‘regime change’ attempts in Kazakhstan is no that farfetched (taking into consideration the crazy dreams of the mountebank Boris Johnson (who fancies himself the reincarnation of Churchill) of the ‘Global Britain’, absurdely imitated by his correspondent mountebanks Down Under – remember that the mountebank Tony Abbot was dreaming of a knighthood for himself – perhaps as a reward for ‘shortfronting Putin’). Unfortunately, the Australians continue to misread and misinterpret the situations in their region and even worse, the real rapport of forces in the region.
    The result of this tragicomedy? The promise of the President of Kazakhstan that he would ‘exterminate’ the MI6 ‘jihadi’ patsies with the unselfish aid of Putin -who promised long ago (and in Kazakhstan of all, in 1999) that ”if we catch them in the toilet, we’ll whack them in the outhouse (Yesli, pardon, v tualeteikh poymayem, i v sortire zamochim)”.

  123. @mulga mumblebrain

    They could have stayed in Afghanistan and still fomented problems in the ex-Central Asian republics, the two things are completely unrelated. The Americans bolted from Afghanistan because they know a big war with Russia is on the horizon and they want to deny the Israelis an asset for distracting from that operation with a war against Iran.

    It’s highly amusing that the Team Russia and Team China nut-huggers here are scandalized by the idea that it might be the Russians, not Americans, who are behind this mess in Kazakhstan I say: it’s about damn time Putin did something like this. After so much strategic inaction and wasting of time, he needs to shore up Russia’s southern border in preparation for what’s coming.

  124. RobinG says:
    @GomezAdddams

    Indeed. This article is heavily over-simplified, (the authors have their own agenda), and avoids the vaccine question entirely, but it does hit many high points.

    Yes, there really were only two COVID deaths in mainland China in 2021. Here’s how they did it
    https://www.liberationnews.org/yes-there-really-were-only-two-covid-deaths-in-mainland-china-in-2021-heres-how-they-did-it/

    • Thanks: Sarah
  125. Anonymous[409] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yee

    Please. Chinese ambassadors write op-Eds in other nations’ newspapers to denounce actions and rile up others against rivals. Here is one about how Japan is going down the route of becoming a regional threat because their prime minister visited their shrine for the war dead.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/shinzo-abe-risks-ties-with-china-in-tribute-to-war-criminals/2014/01/09/dbd86e52-7887-11e3-af7f-13bf0e9965f6_story.html?tid=a_inl_manual

    As if the Japanese haven’t already apologized enough for Imperial Japan – your propaganda is a lot like Israeli propaganda. And severely miscalculated, Japan is probably one of the most popular nations in the world and viewed positively by practically everyone. Your job is to take any little thing and blow it up to make it look like they are about to invade Manchuria and Indonesia again. What a joke.

    Kazakhs aren’t worried about Japanese installing facial recognition cameras at their bus stops.

    • Agree: InnerCynic
    • Troll: d dan
    • Replies: @GomezAdddams
  126. Bookish1 says:
    @Seraphim

    Everyone that knows anything about world affairs knows that Russia and China are consolidating their gains getting ready for the big one. Right now they are playing their cards trying to get into a favorable position in the new world order that is evolving as the U.S. recedes from our position of power. Russia is already courting India as an ally to serve as another front against China. Wake up and see the light.

  127. @Fluesterwitz

    If you are referring to western “leaders” not wanting to be martyrs of the New World Order. I doubt if any of the ones we are familiar with would be willing to do a Ceaucescu, they are only in it for the money and power and would jump ship very quickly rather than go down with it.

  128. Chester says:
    @Emslander

    Not totally worthless. All the fanboy tech-geeks developed the technology for the deep state…for free. The new E-dollar will use blockchain technology to monitor and record every single transaction you make.

    Bitcoin is the end of financial privacy, not the beginning of it.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @jsinton
  129. @Anonymous

    China graduates STEM —Science Technology Engineering Mathematics—so don’t peddle a line of nonsense about Chinese being stupid or brainwashed fools.

    • Replies: @🧐
  130. The usual destabilizing suspects are well known. They may not have the reach, the political influence, and the necessary amount of Trojan horses to keep Kazakhstan on fire indefinitely.

    It’s my guess the Trojan Horse supplies are coming in from Uzbekistan, a NATO partner. If the Empire stockpiled enough materials in that nation, this crisis could go on for a while.

    Seems to me the Russians and their Allies are playing it smart in this case. The CSTO troops appear to have been given the jobs of guarding important buildings and bases, freeing up the local Police and Army to tackle the rebels. Low risk, potentially high reward.

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/01/07/kazakhstan-russia-troops-csto/

  131. @Bookish1

    You are so full of shite I can smell it from here. China and Russia grow more friendly and allied by the day. You’re just slobbering for a race war, aren’t you.

  132. @Anonymous

    Since you don’t live in China or Kazakhstan why the concern? You likely live in a country run by a kakistocracy. Why don’t you use your energy to rid the West of this parasite rather than talk about countries/cultures you know absolutely nothing about? Every country/culture has the beauty of family. Here is a rural video of China:

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Thanks: Sarah, InnerCynic
    • Replies: @🧐
  133. RobinG says:
    @Avery

    Thanks for that link. The next day, Jan.6, Martyanov is more pointed…

    Also of interest, from MoA…
    The U.S. Directed Rebellion in Kazakhstan May Well Strengthen Russia
    https://www.moonofalabama.org/2022/01/the-us-directed-rebellion-in-kazakhstan-may-well-strengthen-russia.html#more

    • Thanks: Avery
  134. neutral says:
    @The_MasterWang

    I recommend China import millions of Africans, this will both improve the economy and the declining birth rates. Also since there are no white people in China, there will be no racism and everyone will be living in harmony as non white brothers. I can also assure you that those train stations in China will remain exactly the same as before when blacks start using them a lot.

    • LOL: InnerCynic
    • Replies: @The_MasterWang
  135. Seraphim says:
    @Bookish1

    Everyone that knows anything about world affairs knows that you don’t know anything about the real world. It is different from your world of fiction books.

  136. GMC says:
    @Commentator Mike

    Before this protest, was one about getting rid of the US BioLabs out of Kazahkstan. Seems like an old cattle disease , { black leg} that hasn’t been seen in nearly 100 years, surfaced in the cattle country ranches last year or the year before. The US BioLab satellite was a little to close to the ranches , for the Kazahk ranchers, Not to notice, and they starting to add 2 + 2 together.

    In the meantime, the Kazahk Gov. OKd another US Biolab in their country and this one was going to be a huge underground one . I read articles about Kazahkstan from time to time , since I’m in Russia and have a couple friends from there. This was the first thing I thought of, when these riots broke out – that the US is trying to keep the heat off of the BioLabs that are attacking animal and agriculture – all over the world , including Kazahkstan. Of course these Labs are also where any Monsanto, Carghill, Dupont and Lily Pharma are working also , as in Ukraine today. Dilyana Gaytandzhieva wrote a great article years ago on the Lab sites and other connections. And yes, she lost her job because of it. SNAFU

    • Thanks: Commentator Mike
  137. Tom67 says:
    @Anonymous

    Here please a few addenda:
    – Islamism. Kasakhs were only converted a few centuries ago and their Muslim believes are heavily shot through with animism. Their womenfolk have much more freedom that in the agricultural -stans and the Kasakh who doesn´t like to swill a bottle of Vodka is hard to find. In short Islamism will not be a huge factor
    – Chinese style control. I am not sure that this sort of control will prevail even in China. For that to happen you need the people online all the time. But the psychological effects of constant smart phone use especially on younger people are so terrible that in China itself the govermnent is already restricting its use. These things make you sick and you can´t build a world power with a sick population.
    – Covid. That is the pretext to implement total control. I believe that thing is past now. The government will have a hard time regaining control let alone force people to get “vaccinated”
    – I believe that in the not so far future it will be China and not Russia that will intervene in the -stans. The middle kingdom desparately needs the hydrocarbons and the pipelines are the soft spots of these brittle regimes. China will have no choice if they want to keep the gas flowing.

    • Replies: @🧐
  138. @Anonymous

    Japanese have done NOTHING —except go to that Yasukuni Shrine and worship thugs.

    • Agree: Avery
    • Replies: @Peter Rabbit
    , @🧐
  139. @Bookish1

    “USA is simply too stupid —-most University students now study social sciences and Wayback Machine History and think Pro Wrestling is real Gomez –and this is frighening !” Is Peabody on the mark and Sherman in reverse mode —-hang tight.

  140. @Anonymous

    All this surveillance technology and infrastructure originated and was first applied in the West. The Chinese are good at copying and improving. Now if you hadn’t bothered with all that and had chosen a different way maybe China would have followed too.

    • Replies: @🧐
  141. Miro23 says:
    @emerging majority

    Wherever possible, power must always be de-centralized and diversified. I’ve long given thought to these matters and seeing as you appear to have some interest in these matters, hereby solicit your thoughts on national reconstruction.

    Off topic, but I agreed that power has to handled very carefully. The more decentralized it is, the more difficult it is for the looters to get their hands on it. Washington makes it altogether too easy by having the whole power structure gathered together in one place.

    For example, individual states retain their taxation and decide on their own spending.

    Just to get some idea of the scale, the state of Wisconsin (5.9 million) has the same population as Denmark, or the state of Virginia (8.6 million) has the same population as Switzerland.

    Denmark and Switzerland are fully functional democracies, with their own governments, social policies, currencies, banking, media and military. They’re successful rich countries that control their borders and have good relations with their neighbours.

    Although, having said that, their citizens need a greater personal political involvement/ higher level of accountability from their political leaders. For example, citizens in both places demand that borders are protected and they are.

    If the majority of states gained popular support for a North American Confederation of independent states, and individually started down this route, Washington probably couldn’t do much to stop it.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  142. @GomezAdddams

    They should come to Arlington.

  143. 🧐 says:
    @Commentator Mike

    Communism was also started off in Germany with the ideas of a guy named Marx. The West ended up dropping it altogether.

    Maybe the Chinese do end up adopting really bad versions of ideas from the West. In 1850 some Chinese guy claimed he was the brother of Jesus Christ and came up with his own version of Christianity and tried to overthrow the emperor. Led to around 20 million Chinese people dying.

    Are you saying the Chinese have no volition in deciding what ideas to import? So are they next going to import in LGBT from the West and improve the rates of transgender sex-change operations on their people?

    Regardless, even if they are really bad in choosing what comes out of the West, why should the Kazakhs next door want to adopt obviously detrimental policies or have them forced upon them? Especially when they already lived under Communism and dropped it.

  144. 🧐 says:
    @GomezAdddams

    STEM graduates are among the most willingly propagandized in a technocratic society – you find them working enthusiastically for the NSA and Facebook thinking they are doing the Lord’s work.

    They make the greatest cogs to fit into the machine. They just do what you ask them to – that was the major problem with Snowden, he asked too much, he asked himself if what he was doing was right. STEM guys don’t do that, they’re not supposed to, we specifically don’t train them to. They are tools we use to solve a problem; crack this encryption key, come up with an algorithm to determine which accounts on social media are speaking out against Covid mandates, come up with accurate face scanners…

    And they run off and do it without asking if they should be doing it, what the long term effects will be, etc.

    Faith, family, culture, tradition, wisdom, poetry, etc….the foundations of civilization STEM guys can’t measure that in a lab. And since they can’t understand the underlying foundations of civilization, they cannot build one on their own, they can only tear it down. They are tools in the hands of those who decide to use them for whichever purpose they want to put them to.

    STEM guys are – not surprisingly – disproportionately represented among violent Muslim extremists.
    Why are there so many Engineers among Islamic Radicals?
    Published online by Cambridge University Press

    https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/european-journal-of-sociology-archives-europeennes-de-sociologie/article/why-are-there-so-many-engineers-among-islamic-radicals/91ED8BEFDE3793834667750B31575422

    Rose coins the notion of “an engineering mindset”, which makes science students easier prey for terrorist recruiters. His report draws on a range of academic studies and a British intelligence dossier that describes the ideal recruit as “intelligent and curious, but unquestioning of authority”.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/03/scientists-easy-prey-jihadis-terrorists-engineering-mindset

    I never said the Chinese were stupid.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @MxEdge
  145. Anonymous[189] • Disclaimer says:
    @Chester

    Nailed it. Bitcoin is a Trojan horse/trial run to get the public comfortable with the idea of a central bank digital currency. If the Luciferians win the war on cash, it’s game over.

  146. @Wild Bill

    This happened in Switzerland?? I don’t think so

    • Replies: @Dave Bowman
  147. 🧐 says:
    @dogbumbreath

    Do they not pay you guys enough? Learn to argue the goddamn point!

    I never said the family culture of rural China wasn’t beautiful. I even said that resembled more closely what the Kazakhs are about to lose if they import security-state communist culture from China.

    That rural family culture is dying in China, it has been actively killed off by Chinese government policies.
    China’s rural ageing population. Even if nothing actively physically affects these areas, the ageing rural population, heirs to centuries of tradition, will soon pass and take with them irreplaceable traditions and secrets of their local culture.
    The Chinese central government’s drive to develop the country saw it, among many strategies, urbanising its population by building new cities where hundreds of millions of its population were relocated — the rate is staggering, in 1980 only about 20% of the population lived in cities. In 2021 this is about 64%, and may go to 70% by 2030.

    https://www.thinkchina.sg/chinas-rural-elderly-disappearing-keepers-tradition

    Former culture chief sounds alarm over China’s vanishing traditional villages
    The mass migration of people from the countryside to cities is destroying a valuable rural legacy, former cultural heritage chief warns

    https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/2163492/former-culture-chief-sounds-alarm-over-chinas-vanishing

    You guys are so propagandized you can’t even see the warnings coming from your own kind. It’s like you are in a bullet train about to head off a cliff and the people in charge have distracted you with how fast it’s going and how shiny it is.

    After the fall of communism, the Kazakhs have got their TFR to a nice and healthy 2.5 – 2.7. Why should they import the security-state infrastructure (or allow it to be imposed on them) of a family-suffocating culture in order to exchange having children for nice shiny gadgets and dying alone in some high rise?

  148. @Emslander

    transporting the poorer and more criminal half of Latin America to Republican states

    That’s a smart move! Let them deal with each other

    • Replies: @Emslander
  149. @Ross23

    One would have thought they would have grabbed all the useful land for Russia and pushed the 18 million or so native kaz into the bottom part of the country.

    that’s exactly what happened

  150. jsinton says:
    @Ukraine Tiger

    No, that’s not my “worry”. I simply point out another aspect to the situation. Like Escobar says: “It’s complicated”. As we’ve seen with the scamdemic, Globohomo has the power to influence the entire world in the same direction at the same time. Something that Escobar seems to not see, nor Ron Unz seems not to care about.

  151. jsinton says:
    @Chester

    Agreed. Not only that, but your microchip Mark of the Beast with graphine body circuitry will also integrate your “money” with all your other data telemetry, not to mention the power to put thoughts in your head and take away your free will. Total spectrum dominance life and thought control.

  152. Anonymous[265] • Disclaimer says:
    @🧐

    +100%. The Team China nut-huggers who love to crow about high Chinese IQ (and who seem to think that no native-born American can do scientific or engineering work) are oblivious to the fact that being narrowly proficient in a technical discipline and being a mindless drone are not at all incompatible.

  153. Emslander says:
    @simple mind

    I think you need to pay better attention.

  154. @neutral

    I would rather watch them rob, rape, and murder you people. It’s hilarious. Especially when you’re not stating the obvious.

    My ancestors picked their own cotton. They were infinitely superior to yours.

    Then again, something good can be done about Africa. Some infrastructure and industrial develop without White interference is a good start.

    • Agree: simple mind
  155. GMC says:

    The Ukie armies are just part of the picture. The US, big pharma and all the usual criminals of the world, have been building more BioWeapons around Russia than Nato has armies. And Kazakhstan should open Russian eyes up or else. Say what ? Ukraine – 12+ BioWeapons Labs – Georgia – 1 huge one and probably some Satellites – Kazakhstan – 6 maybe 7 BioWeapons Labs.
    Ya, that ” Old Man” that ran/runs Kazakh and his family are billionaires many times over and he let in the NWO, US military and the big Pharma BioWeapons labs, using the gaz, oil and uranium to his own advantage also.
    Notice that that X Ukie Prez YanukoBitch also let in the NWO Globalists and their BioLabs, being disguised as Agriculture and Animal labs.. Since then Poroshankster and the other comedian prez also lets the NWO and US , do whatever they want – also.

    Which brings up the Big Question Why is Russia allowing this shit to happen , but plays with Nato on its Borders ? My sources ? Vladimir Platov’s many articles @ NEO, Dilyana Gaytandzhieva from Bulgaria and Anti Empire +Edward Slav…. with his correlations of big pharma and Russia.And like the rest of you – I connect the Dots.

    • Thanks: emerging majority
  156. GMC says:
    @Tom67

    Were you aware of the 6+ BioWeapons labs in Kazakhstan , when you lived there. Did you know about the black leg disease on the ranchers cattle? Did you know about the huge underground BioWeapons lab that is going to start this year? Vladimir Platov who writes for New Eastern Outlook has covered this and others have too. Spacibo

    • Replies: @Tom67
  157. @Joe Paluka

    But this failed…. And though overthrowing a government is is not impossible – actually governing is even harder

  158. Yee says:

    Too many Hindu trolls in this thread…

    • Replies: @d dan
  159. @Avery

    What are his archives on UNZ??? Did he write in his own name?

    • Replies: @Avery
  160. @Anonymous

    Rather – China dealt with the Uighurs the way they did because they had to deal with the same type of rioting Kazahks. The same networks arming the militants in Kazakhstan are likely the same ones who armed the militants in Xinjiang. You should also note that some of the measures the Chinese gov implemented in Xinjiang are things they learned from Tajikistan and Kazakhstan.. none of the governments in the region want trouble makers.

    • Replies: @🧐
  161. anon[461] • Disclaimer says:
    @anonymous

    In typical third world fashion those holding power are kleptomaniacs”
    May be you live in a 3rd world country and not aware of the get rich scheme pioneered by western oligarchs from rail road steam ship to current Facebook,Amazon,Google,and the figures sitting on big lobbying , think- tank ,hedge fund and numerous gov officials including Fed Chairman and Pelosi.
    3rd world’ corruption impacts the local.1st world corruption impacts the local and the foreigners . Locals dont have balls to rise up like they have in the 3rd world countries.

  162. @Miro23

    In simple terms, the average and below average people in a society have to be PROTECTED (the same as less able people are protected in a family) – and their enemies rooted out.

    Agreed. But HOW to do that ?
    If you create an open system, where everybody can participate, besides the obvious, that is, the more knowledgeable will always have the upper hand, you have also the “knowledgeable + no-moral standards”, which will also have the upper hand over the “simply knowledgeable”. Because the former ones will always devise some ways to rule over all below, while the latter ones, due to their moral standards, are more limited in their scope of action.

    The average and below average people will then be protected by whom ?…

    • Replies: @Miro23
  163. d dan says:
    @Yee

    “Too many Hindu trolls in this thread…”

    Actually, I think those anonymous trolls are either state-paid agents or some trash from the Soros-sponsored type NGOs. They are more subtle than the bomb-this bomb-that nightwarer. Their scripts follow the State’s narration very well.

    Since they ran out of way to credibly criticize China, this is an excellent opportunity to leverage their points, just because it is close to China. They need to work overtimes to smear China even though the color-revolution has ZERO thing to do with China.

    BTW: Kazakhstan has over 20,000 NGOs with population of less than 20 millions – just imagine how powerful and well-resourced they are.

  164. @Miro23

    A North American Confederation, as you present, might make for a valid theme for consideration and speculation. By citing Danmark and Switzerland, comparatively sized per population with Wisconsin and Virginia, your metaphor has some relevance. Biggest question would be how such a confederation would maintain foreign relations and mutual defense policies, as well as interstate trade policies.

  165. @🧐

    Chinese hyper-urbanization is indeed a global tragedy. Living in rural America, I can witness to what has happened here over the past 60-70 years. There are virtually no farmers left, rather Barons of Beef, Hog urbanizers, chicken incarcerators, heavy-equipment operators and chemical warfare applicators. No wonder cancer and other morbidity rates keep escalating.

    On the urban front, the majority of Americans exist in sub-urbs. They are neither possessed of urban street-smarts and some levels of neighborhood feeling, nor of rural values of common-sense and mutual respect and caring.

    • Thanks: showmethereal
    • Replies: @🧐
    , @DevilAdvocate
  166. An interesting picture in the light of recent events

  167. 🧐 says:
    @showmethereal

    Well of course, that’s why I stated that the average Khazakh is screwed. The corrupt authoritarians running those countries since the fall of communism were all former card-holding CCCP members. So all of that goes without saying. And the US and UK and their intelligence agencies have obviously done plenty of work in profiling the kinds of people they can recruit into militant Muslim extremist organizations to do their dirty work of destabilization. If these nut jobs ever take over, they will also oppress the average Khazakh, just for different reasons like being a Sufi or not cutting their hair or something. As I mentioned, many of these radicals are from STEM background also, so if they take of control of the state, they’ll likely do similar tracking of their political opponents – they will simply instead purchase their software and resources from the US or Israel.

  168. 🧐 says:
    @emerging majority

    Both the Kazakh culture and the Chinese culture are foreign to me, but where I live in the US, I can go to a horseback riding less than 4 miles away from my house. I can travel for miles on the open road passing by miles and miles of farmland.

    It is becoming abundantly clear to me that the folks around here would have more in common with the average Kazakh when it comes to views about family, gun rights, being more comfortable around nature than asphalt, not being monitored from birth to death by tracking devices that watch your every move, have the government track all your financial data and be able to freeze your money on the spot, letting the government force vaccination and a whole bunch of other issues than the average urban dwelling Chinese person.

    I found out recently that they participate in something called the Nomad Games which reminds me of some of the rodeo culture we have in the South.

    So I’m cheering for the average Kazakh on this one and hope they come out on top and can find their way around all the external forces that want to exploit them or worse – make them into urban, borg-zombies.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  169. @emerging majority

    Let me just ask one simple question:

    The people (the common people, the mass of those forming the base of a country), do they really know what is best for them ? In a micro and macro-scale ?

    For me, it’s obvious they care just about immediate and limited concerns: how to get their food, their living needs, what is the outcome of soccer or NBA championship, their living safety, etc. So, it’s also obvious that most of the ruling and management of society must be delegated to someone else, who supposedly will care about those issues.
    Supposedly… and here the problems start.

    As I said in a previous comment:

    If you create an open system, where everybody can participate, besides the obvious, that is, the more knowledgeable will always have the upper hand [over the less-knowledgeable], you have also the “knowledgeable + no-moral standards”, which will also have the upper hand over the “simply knowledgeable”. Because the former ones will always devise some ways to rule over all below, while the latter ones, due to their moral standards, are more limited in their scope of action.

    So, you have to create a system where the “knowledgeable” are NOT ruled out by the “knowledgeable+ no-moral standards”. That means erradicating or at least crippling at maximum any moral deficiencies of the ruling people.

    IMO, this cannot be done by multiplying law over law, neither by punitions nor by any kind of close scrutiny. How will you examine the soul of people ?…

    You propose a more fragmented power structure, closer to the people, at the level of small states, or communities. IMO this does not solve anything, because the same tiering (as I proposed above) exists at any scale, from the large centralised state to the small town level (and even below). Going from one to the other, you surely limit the amount of power and scope, concentrated in a few individuals across a whole country, but you create a whole host of smaller problems, and others. In the worst case you could end having a myriad of feuds, crushing their own subjects, each warring against the others, destroying the lives of all the “small people” and making impossible any kind of trade and economy of scale.

    The olden peoples were wiser than we may think of them now. A leader, either a tribal chief or a king, was not picked by a system who just takes in account the “knowledgeability” of a candidate. Face to the impossibility to scrutiny someone’s moral standards and weakness of character, a high praise was placed on the proven living standards of the same individual, the education he received, in what family he (or she) was raised, etc.
    This was latter condensed (and assumed as true) in a lineage succession by blood. Because the probability that a raised son (or daughter) through the motions of a strict scheme was more assuring of a good outcome, than leaving the choice to people who had not the means to really see what kind of leader they were choosing.
    This system is not exempt of failures (and sometimes big ones). The king could become a madman, or totally mislead by his counsellors, or simply too weak. But, in the long term the results were not too bad.

    And this structure of power was also supposed to be under the rule of a Higher Order, through an adhesion and obedience to a super-structure, to which the top leader would have also to obey and respect, diminishing the danger of seeing himself as a kind of “omnipotent god”.

  170. Tom67 says:
    @GMC

    No I haven´t read Vladimir Platov and I never heard of those biolabs. But rest assured that nobody in his right mind would build a Bioweapons lab in Kasakhstan. The idea is simply preposterous. You´d end up killing yourself because nothing is up to the extremely high standard that you´d need for such a dangerous enterprise. Nothing quite works in Kasakhstan the way it should. Take mains electricity. Sure you can run a water kettle. But anything else detoriates quite quickly as the frequency changes to much and to often. So you need generators. But you would need to import them and the workers as well. Kasakhs simply aren´t the meticulous straight types. In fact they three generations ago lived in yurts and hate right angles. There are some Kasakh build multistory buildings. But nobody not even Kasakhs will live there if they have a choice as even the naked eye will see that the walls are not perpendicular. And so on and so forth. There is no high end manufacturing in Kasakhstan for a reason. To run a biolab there you´d need to import really everything. Much easier to build it in Wyoming and then bring the “products” in uncontrolled diplomatic baggage.
    I love Kasakhs and Kasakhstan but to run a bioweapons lab there you must be mad. Also the very reason why I like Kasakhstan presents another reason why I cannot believe in any biolabs there: you need a police state or at least a highly structured society to keep something like that secret. But Kasakhs are a free spirited people and you can run a total police state in Uzbekistan or China but not among the Kazakhs as Globocab just found 0ut

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  171. @emerging majority

    Any kind of big urbanisation is a tragedy.
    Man was not made to live piled by the millions or even by tens of thousand people in limited spaces.
    The first thing happening is they all start to hate all other people. Unconsciously, to himself, but quite visible if we had previous experience of living in small communities, with mutual caring among members.

  172. 🧐 says:
    @GomezAdddams

    You see, this is the kind of inane bleating that passes for wumao propaganda. It’s reminiscent of BLM wanting to tear down statues and erase the names off all the streets and landmarks of the previous generations of American leaders.

    The shrine lists the names, origins, birthdates, and places of death of 2,466,532 men, women, children, and various pet animals.[2] Among those are 1,068 convicted war criminals, 14 of whom are A-Class (convicted of having been involved in the planning, preparation, initiation, or waging of the war). This has led to many controversies surrounding the shrine. Another memorial at the Honden (main hall) building commemorates anyone who died on behalf of Japan, and so includes Koreans and Taiwanese who served Japan at the time. In addition, the Chinreisha (“Spirit Pacifying Shrine”) building is a shrine built to inter the souls of all the people who died during WWII, regardless of their nationality. It is located directly south of the Yasukuni Honden.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasukuni_Shrine

    So let’s see, the names of war criminals represents less than one percent of the total names at the shrine and they even built a shrine to commemorate the dead of all of WW2 including all non-Japanese. But no – to you, all they are doing is worshipping thugs.

    This is why people like you are here being hired to do Chinese propaganda online and you don’t see any equivalent Japanese wumao anywhere – because they don’t have to. They are already liked by practically everyone except the Chinese.

  173. @🧐

    That rural family culture is dying in China, it has been actively killed off by Chinese government policies

    .
    You are really ignorant. Urbanization has nothing to do with Communism. Urbanization is happening everywhere. Modern Capitalism and the Finance Capitalistic model is pushing rural peoples into urban centers. It’s where the jobs are….

    You guys are so propagandized you can’t even see the warnings coming from your own kind. It’s like you are in a bullet train about to head off a cliff and the people in charge have distracted you with how fast it’s going and how shiny it is.

    You telling me the US isn’t about to head off a cliff? China’s government strategy to rapidly modernize was necessary otherwise it would be forever left behind Industrially and forever a “slave” to the Industrialized West. Watch the Hans Rosling TED talk:

    Anyway, you have zero idea what poverty feels like. Over 800 million people have been lifted out of poverty in China. A Sovereign China can reverse whatever is necessary to promote a better future for it’s people. Get off your horse and hop on a plane to see the World.

    • Replies: @🧐
  174. 🧐 says:
    @Tom67

    Thanks for more good points. You make an interesting point about islamism – I just want to point out that often external powers use Muslim extremists (which are often at odds with the majority of the Muslims in that country) to cause disproportionate mayhem and it allows the state to justify repressive measures. The authoritarian state and these extremists as in a symbiotic feedback loop – they cannot exist without each other and justify their own existence by pointing at the other. The average Kazakh will be caught in the middle of all this.

  175. 🧐 says:
    @dogbumbreath

    I said Chinese government policies, I didn’t say communism. And, yes, urbanization is happening everywhere. And it’s plaguing the US with similar problems – which is why a lot of our political battles are between rural folk pushing back on urban elites that want to root out traditional American culture. We are trying not to lose that same fight here with our own government.

    The point is that the rural Khazakhs have a right to resist it if they don’t want it. And especially if a corrupt elite is imposing it upon them at the behest of outside powers. If they have seen what the cost is to industrialize that is being paid next door by the Chinese to their culture and families and don’t want anything to do with it, then more power to them.

    I’m not some guy who has never traveled. I’ve been to Europe, Africa and parts of Asia before. I’ve seen people living in poverty. What surprised me was that some of them still seemed happier in their humble existence than rich city people that need meds to keep them sane and be able to sleep.

    Given two choices, what is better for a man:
    1 – that he lives a simple life with basics and dies surrounded by his children and grandchildren.
    2 – that he becomes highly educated and lives with luxury and dies alone.

    If the rural Khazakh choose option one and you choose option two – then there is simply no way you are going to see eye to eye on your vision of society and he should absolutely see what is happening to the Chinese as a warning sign.

    I’ll believe China can reverse its policies at anytime when I see them actually get their birth rates back in order. The state has been trying to get people to have children but has utterly failed on being able to convince people of that basic human biological impulse. You think government can solve everything, that’s why they pay you guys to convince everyone else.

  176. Miro23 says:
    @DevilAdvocate

    The average and below average people will then be protected by whom ?

    This looks like a question for elites and they don’t all think the same way.

    For example, China has a very intelligent highly selected leadership that isn’t a client of special interests. Over decades they’ve made serious efforts to raise the educational level of all Chinese, build national infrastructure and banish poverty and they’ve been very successful. Both climbing the national technology/manufacturing skills curve and improving agricultural techniques/prosperity.

    In contrast, the US elite labels half the population “Deplorables”, tries to start a race war at home + runs non-stop wars abroad, and loots the public through their subservient Congress.

    https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-23d47aa423ee6d770877f4949c61c1f3

  177. @🧐

    I’ve been to Europe, Africa and parts of Asia before. I’ve seen people living in poverty. What surprised me was that some of them still seemed happier in their humble existence than rich city people that need meds to keep them sane and be able to sleep.

    I’ve traveled a bit also. And I would add to your observation: the people who are more deprived from the so-called conforts of modern life, and the more opressed, they’re also the people with the best hearts and human richness. Hospitable even when poor and with little to offer, open to talk and discuss any matter even when dominated by a ruthless opressor, warm to welcome a stranger even when life around is hard.
    Last ones I visited were palestinians in Jerusalem/West Bank. I enjoyed so much I came back a 2nd time.

    • Agree: 🧐
  178. @Miro23

    China has a very intelligent highly selected leadership that isn’t a client of special interests. Over decades they’ve made serious efforts to raise the educational level of all Chinese, build national infrastructure and banish poverty and they’ve been very successful.

    Well, we both may agree they have something in common with the old monarchy systems (see my comment above #174).
    Leaders in both systems were surely raised and imbued with a sense of serving the country for the common good. Certainly, both took the opportunity to make their personal fortune, and they also gave in to the occasional corrupt greedy businessman, but they did not lose sight of the larger objective.

    Now, the thing which is probably lacking in the chinese leadership system is the sense of service and obedience to an Higher Order, relatively to which the leader is just a “tool”, a subject. Maybe they do this regarding their people and the whole country as an embodiment of this Higher Order, I don’t know.

  179. @gotmituns

    But US taxpayer dollars go into the billions every year funding these types of operations. Wouldn’t you like to see that money spent at home…???

  180. @Miro23

    That’s the idea behind the Chinese social credit system. It helps ordinary Chinese identify shonks, crooks, parasites and other detritus. Those types rule in the Glorious West, hence the Western lie-machine’s hate propaganda directed at it. And the Chinese system encourages good behaviour towards others. Disgusting!

  181. @🧐

    What is your ideal global human population? Ten billion? One hundred Billion? How many animal species and individuals would you allow to share the planet with us?

    • Replies: @🧐
  182. @Tom67

    What psychic or ideological rewards do you get from straight out lying? The existence of US bio-labs, worldwide, including in former Soviet Republic, including Kazakhstan, is IRREFUTABLE. Stop spewing idiot diversions and face facts-or would you lose your cosy disinfo sinecure in that case?

    • Replies: @Tom67
  183. @simple mind

    Who do you think gives a shit whether you believe historical facts or not ?

    Cretin alert.

  184. @emerging majority

    Not to mention – the amount of energy that it takes to “mine” these electrons is very very inefficient. It would be a complete debacle to think that they will be an every day use of “currency”.

  185. Avery says:
    @showmethereal

    yes, he wrote in his name.
    see below.

    when he started posting @unz he was posting as [smoothieX12].
    after a while he started posting under his own name Martyanov.
    Then I guess Ron liked his writing and invited him to write columns.
    Andrei seems to have good sources* from Russia: his knowledge of Russia’s military hardware is first rate. He also has written a book about Russia’s military capability.

    https://www.unz.com/author/andrei-martyanov/?lang=en
    _______________________________________
    * he was in Soviet military (officer?) a while back — I believe in the Navy — posted at Caspian Sea.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  186. Derer says:
    @RadicalCenter

    The only effective retaliation for Russia and China is to take the game to the US soil and start the clandestine arming numerous US forest militias. These anti-Yankee forces will make the Washington arrogant elite tremble in fear and would derail their scheming in foreign places. The time is right after Jan.6 persecution and anti-white lawlessness everywhere.

  187. @Anonymous

    You compare people who live in major cities at a major event to people who live in the wilderness in yurts??? That is troll-ish type of analysis. China still has hundreds of millions of people living in rural areas. Lots of them dress like those Kazakhstan… I think you think you need new sources…

    Your idea about China not caring about Kazakhs is garbage. Guess what… China has the largest population of Kazakhs outside of Kazahkstan. Along with Tajiks they were both looked at favorably because they were known to fight for China on the border regions generations past and seen as patriotic. Even many who returned to their “motherland” look at China with fondness. The militant Uighurs were attacking everyone who didn’t follow their brand of militancy – even secular Uighurs. You do know the SCO was formed by all the governments in the region to track militant groups such as those among the Chechens and the Uighurs and the people rioting in Kazakhstan right now….

    • Replies: @🧐
  188. 🧐 says:
    @mulga mumblebrain

    I don’t know but it’s not necessarily a numbers game. The world can handle a lot more people who live simply like rural Khazakhs and probably not a lot more that live like large city urbanites. It’s more a question of who produces more waste and uses less resources, isn’t it?

    It seems to be balancing out though – city slickers are dying off to make more breathing room for rural people.

  189. McCrumb says:
    @Oscar Peterson

    @oscar Peterson
    The global elite is firmly entrenched in Kazakhstan
    Resources are privatized and M16 have an outpost. The global elite probably don’t like the growing Russian and Chinese influence in the country, especially after the US retreat in Afghanistan So it’s in their interest to create major unrest, get rid of the current government (like how Afghanistan’s Ghani fled the country) fill the power void with their chosen loyal-to-western-interests spy/servant then have that president call in The US/NATO to create a base for keeping the peace. So there will be strong American presence protecting the global elites’ assets and interests.
    That is what the American military is paid to do.
    But Russia thwarted their plans and the global elites’ puppet fled(he paid Tony Blair for advice?) Russian puppet President Tokayev is secure and has now joined the CSTO. Whereas before Kazakstan refused to to join the organization.
    What this shows is the power and influence of Russia.
    Watch the CSTO grow in influence and membership.

    • Thanks: emerging majority
    • Replies: @Seraphim
  190. @Sean

    MI6 is behind it all. Laughable.

    Sources ? Evidence ? Dare I say it… Proof ?

    Thought not.

    • Replies: @GMC
  191. @gotmituns

    don’t give a flying fucc at a rolling donut what happens in this kazak place

    You might want to consider a little more closely the basic geographic, economic, and politically-strategic international implications of a war in Kazakhstan now being prepared by the ((( usual suspects ))).

  192. @🧐

    Some 2,500 years ago Socrates pointed out that the largest a city could become without losing internal cohesion would be in the range of 35,000 people. The most successful of all human living situations has been for millennia the commons and the villages those commonly-held lands encompass. Totally private property was limited to your home and a bit of space in the immediate environs. An old African proverb, which Hillary used/misused is that it takes a village to raise a child.

    We also should take note of the historical fact that the Mayan people had created a culture centered on a number of frequently warring cities as well as currently undecipherable alphabets, high levels of mathematical excellence, a calendar more accurate than the ones we use today and levels of astronomical knowledge that we have surpassed only very recently. Yet, somehow 700 years ago abandoned those urban settlements, leaving them to the jungle and its creatures and retreated/returned to the countryside. What impelled that migration?

    Our contemporary alleged “civilization” is teetering on the brink. Why? In the first place it was erected upon a number of false assumptions about reality. Some of those assumptions were premised on the dogmas and tenets of organized religions, which at least here in the States, are rapidly losing their holds on the younger generations. The very etymology of the word “religion” means to re-tie or to re-connect. The reconnection we desperately need is to directly engage with the soil, the waters and the living creatures of the natural world. Firstly, we must re-connect with our own spirits and from there, with each other.

    Ever since Los Alamos in the Summer of ’45, our metaphorical reality can be likened to atomized individuals, households and entire society. The Age of Pisces is rapidly dissipating and so may also be the case with the Kali Yuga, a 6,000 year cycle of dissipation and dissolution. The 2,000 year paradigm developed in the Roman Empire is collapsing like a house of cards. Visionaries are needed to discover new pathways to the rediscovery of our elementary humanity. We can begin to rebuild our societies on that basis.

    • Agree: GMC
  193. @Bookish1

    “Russia is already courting India as an ally to serve as another front against China.”

    That is complete folly since Russia and India have been allies since India got independence. In fact in the 1962 war with India China has prepared to have to fight Russia too. India cozying up to the US – is causing angst in Russia. India started to do so because for the past 30 years since they finalized the border – Russia and China have been growing closer. So now India hopes the US will help it. The one who needs reality is you.

    • Replies: @Bookish1
  194. @Avery

    Ok thanks. Yes I know who he is… I just didn’t know he used to write on this site.

  195. 🧐 says:
    @showmethereal

    Yeah I compare them. What, you think you are superior to them because you have running water and electricity? Do you laugh about them as savages over dinner conversations?

    They seem to be content with their simple life and freedom in their expansive wilderness. Your kind doesn’t understand them and their kind doesn’t understand you. The one fact that everyone can agree on is that – they seem to have families and kids and you don’t.

    You seem to be misunderstanding me. I don’t really care if the Chinese view the Kazakhs fondly – I stated my reasons for why I was rooting for the average Kazakh. I specifically stated that the misfortune of the Kazakhs in Kazakhstan was that they sit on a bunch of oil and in the middle of a centrally and strategically located part of Asia. The Kazakhs in China don’t have to worry about that so it doesn’t whether the Chinese think they are honorable people or noble savages or tourist curiosities like pandas. Those Kazakhs have the luxury to be unimportant enough to be left alone.

    And yes, the average Kazakh in that nation, has to deal with the misfortune of being caught in the middle of authoritarian governments that want to justify reducing their freedoms and tracking them and the idiot extremists that get provoked and manipulated by outsiders that just happen to hand the same authorities the reasons for further restrictions and tracking.

    • Replies: @d dan
    , @showmethereal
  196. 🧐 says:
    @emerging majority

    You make some good points here, especially on the subject of “scale”. Can serious participatory government go beyond a certain number of people?

    How does one balance the local freedom and autonomy while being able to be united enough to defend one’s nation against large and organized enemies? Little, independent nations can easily be picked off by a large one unless they stand united in a common cause. But then centralizing that authority results in losing that autonomy – again, where does the balance lie?

    The Internet, which was said would bring us closer together seems to be pulling people further apart.

    I especially like the last two sentences you wrote.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  197. Bookish1 says:
    @showmethereal

    Let me clue you in to some reality. Russia just sold some s-400 anti aircraft missles to India for use on the front with China. Those missles are capable of neutralizing China’s air force. Go back to sleep and keep dreaming your bullshit.

    • Troll: d dan
    • Replies: @showmethereal
  198. d dan says:
    @🧐

    “I was rooting for the average Kazakh”

    To all the casual readers: when a so-called “average” American care a lot about an average foreigner: run, don’t walk away.

    They sure “care” a lot about the freedom, liberty, democracy and human rights of average Iraqis, Syrian, Iranian, Ukrainian, Afghan, Uighur, Tibetan, Hong Konger, Taiwanese, (an endless list)…, and now Kazakh, than about average American.

    Kudo to such “selfless” people.

    • Replies: @🧐
    , @Jazman
  199. Seraphim says:
    @McCrumb

    Kazakhstan was a founding member of CSTO (1994). It never left it, therefore never ‘joined’. In December 2010, the member states approved a declaration establishing a CSTO peacekeeping force. In December 2011 Kazakhstan took over the rotating presidency of the CSTO from Belarus.
    In addition it is a founding member (with Russia and Belarus) of the Eurasian Economic Union and a founding member of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization.
    But how many people really know where Kazakhstan is in the first place?

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  200. GMC says:
    @Dave Bowman

    Anytime there is an easy target { Kazakh } for the NWO to enter a country and set up NGOs, upper level educational schools, and if that country has Gaz, Oil and Uranium, the Brits, Americans and Israelis are there – ” working”. There is so much proof that even Google can’t keep some articles off the internet. The upper educational schools are easy to figure out – just look and see where the parent school is located – in kazakh case – London . The rest you can find pretty easy – I have sources on my article here – chk them out .

    • Replies: @Sean
  201. GMC says:

    Jan. 9 2022
    – RIA – Ru. News – The minister of health in Kazakh denies the reports of a military Biological Lab in Alma Ata. being taken over.

    RIA Katyusha news at Anti Empire – Was there a medical element of Freedom in the Kazakh revolt ? This story in Russian and English is a great article , showing the true prerequisites to the revolt, in terms of economy, covid lockdowns, NGOs – – etc. etc. etc. A must read !!!

  202. Tom67 says:
    @mulga mumblebrain

    Unfortunately I get no money for my opinions. If you can point me to a place where I can collect I would be much obliged. Thankk you

    • Replies: @Yee
    , @mulga mumblebrain
  203. 🧐 says:
    @d dan

    Rooting for the average Kazakh doesn’t mean I want my government to interfere. I already said that…
    I don’t buy idiotic US propaganda that every Kazakh is a natural born Jeffersonian Democrat just waiting to establish a constitutional republic. This is what they’re going to be telling us in order to convince us they care about Kazakhs and that we need to intervene.

    I also stated how the US and UK had cynical goals in wanting to replace the current corrupt authoritarian elites with their own corrupt authoritarian elites. So I already see through the propaganda my own government peddles and I don’t support it.

    In fact it should be obvious to the casual reader to see right through when the average wumao like you says they care about the average Kazakh.

  204. @emerging majority

    – It was Aristoteles who argued that states – “like tools and animals” – have a
    “natural size”, “above and below which they lose their qualities” i.e. a one-inch
    hammer is as useless as a 5 yard one.
    Peter Prince Kropotkin (Czar´s butler and aristo-anarchist) added that
    anything bigger than the polis is of inner necessity unfree because
    accountability is lost (as well as every incentive for good governance).
    A rough Germanic equivalent would be the duchy, with the
    duke/duc/Herzog/wojwod as the elected leader in wartime
    but little else.
    – Appealing though this line of thought is, I doubt its applicability to
    Western degeneracy; for rebuilding after the apocalypse it will happen anyway.
    The “let a thousand flowers bloom an sheet” aspect of Greek his/herstory surely
    wasn´t lost on the Founders 😀

  205. @emerging majority

    I put forth your original post’s suggestion on weighing votes according to intellect and understanding current events several years ago on this site but with an understanding that it is but a discussion point because in large populations with corrupt infrastructures it could still be easily subverted.

    With the record of all types of governing structures since antiquity I ended up with my opinion that the best governance could only come about with what could be called a ‘benevolent dictatorship’.

    The leader would be incorruptible, economically well grounded and have a good knowledge of large nation power structures. In two examples I personally use from the 20th century, the two nations went from devastation to world class standard of living within a decade. And because of that they were destroyed and their record of success memory-holed. So there is that. A religious person would say that the earth is the devil’s domain. There can be no heaven on earth while humans are in charge.

    Speaking of heaven on earth, I have it good in that I live smack in the middle of 100 acres and farm in a hobby way. You are correct in the virtue of living with the land and being friends with all your neighbours several properties deep. I am not a fickle person but I would seriously worry about my mental health if I had to live in an urban center since this COVID world took shape. Zombies everywhere and in your face 24/7. A horror movie on an endless loop.

    Cheers-

    • Replies: @DevilAdvocate
  206. Yee says:
    @Tom67

    If you can point me to a place where I can collect I would be much obliged.

    If so, you’re incredibly dumb for a businessman running business in Kazakhstan…

    There’s 1 NGO for every 500 people in that country. They should be easy enough to find, go seek them out. Since you’re saying the same thing as the NGOs do, no piont doing it for free. NGOs are spending money from the West anyway.

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  207. @Timur The Lame

    With the record of all types of governing structures since antiquity I ended up with my opinion that the best governance could only come about with what could be called a ‘benevolent dictatorship’.
    The leader would be incorruptible, economically well grounded and have a good knowledge of large nation power structures.

    And the best ones would have usually a good religious formation, considering themselves as a “tool” at the service of a Higher Good.

    A religious person would say that the earth is the devil’s domain. There can be no heaven on earth while humans are in charge.

    Exactly.

    I would seriously worry about my mental health if I had to live in an urban center since this COVID world took shape. Zombies everywhere and in your face 24/7. A horror movie on an endless loop.

    It was like that even well before Covid era.

    • Replies: @🧐
  208. @nokangaroos

    The only measure for a form of government is its success at securing resources and lebensraum for it’s core constituents. At some point one should be mature enough to abandon the notion of justice or at least understand its true meaning.

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  209. @🧐

    So in other words you don’t know much about anything and are just spouting off at the mouth..

    • Replies: @🧐
  210. @Bookish1

    Ummm…. India just took delivery…. But Russia gave S-400 to China almost 3 years ago. It was the first export customer. You sound like the idiots saying “oh Russia sold 4 Kilo class subs to Vietnam to target China”…. Except Russia sold China a full dozen Kilo class subs before giving any to Vietnam. You seem to be another “know nothing”.

    • Replies: @Mehool Mehta
  211. @Seraphim

    Exactly… It’s so laughable all the people who come out speaking on Kazkhstan and as you note – could probably never had found it on a map. We do know of course NATO wants them to be in chaos because of the important role it plays in between Russia and China. There is almost no question foreign fighters were used in a supposedly domestic issue of fuel prices. That is the typical method… Take a genuine grievance and then exploit in by causing destruction (or an overthrow if they are able).

    • Thanks: emerging majority
  212. 🧐 says:
    @DevilAdvocate

    You know, Escobar mentioned a good point in this part with regards to Kazakhstan.
    Kazakh institutions of power were simply incapable of comprehending the wider social malaise. A competent political opposition is non-existent: there’s no political exchange. Civil society has no channels to express itself.

    The initial demands of the protesters seemed pretty reasonable; roll back prices, financial incentives for women with many children, halt vaccine mandates, etc. I think if – after the dust settles – the government delivers on these, it seems to be a good compromise for most.

    The one other issue was one that Escobar didn’t bring up but Tom67 mentioned.
    Now there is (was) a process going on by which everybody´s biometric data (DNS, Iris, Scan etc) was to be centrally stored and linked to a persons electonic devise. Who you met, where you met was going to be open to an all seeing eye. All in the name of “health” of course. That was another straw that broke the camel´s back.

    I do wish that Escobar would report on that one because I know it’s a topic being pushed in the US. Already a few major cities have issued bans on things like facial recognition and tracking – so that’s at least one positive sign.

    I was looking around for where other urban centers are with this technology and came across this frightening video.

    A couple things that come out at me is how the video and the official say it’s about finding criminals but what it shows is a drone hover around some guys – it looks like they are praying or something – and making sure they are masked and seated apart. The guys look so docile, as if this drone is some master. Now they may be docile because they are sitting for meditation or something, but the image of this drone zipping through and making sure everyone is following the rules is pretty scary to me, but they seem used to it. I think all Americans should see this video.

    I dug into it a bit and it looks like it’s from a place called Sharjah in the UAE. Seems to be a tiny city-state with an “absolute monarchy” (sitting on top of a bunch of oil) – so it makes sense that the government would monitor its own citizens without really caring for their opinion on the matter and the people are used to this kind of top-down dynamic already. One question I plan to dig into further is who exactly is supplying them with the drone and hardware and software technology to pull it off.

  213. 🧐 says:
    @showmethereal

    I’m no expert – I’ll agree there – but at least I know how to argue the goddamn point – which you wumaos seem to completely miss or attempt to distract.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  214. @🧐

    it looks like they are praying or something – and making sure they are masked and seated apart. The guys look so docile, as if this drone is some master.

    They are doing one of the requested muslim prayers, probably the dhur or asr given it’s full daylight.
    They are not docile, just minding their own business (the prayer). And the spacing is just for everyone get some personal (private) space. During crowded praying assemblies, they usually don’t bother to stand in compact lines, touching each other.

    Soon you will see this privacy intrusion and facial recognition through every vigilance camera everywhere…

  215. @🧐

    Sharjah is the one part of the UAE that does not have oil. It does the manufacturing for the rest of the UAE. As they have oil, profits are good. The construction industry types tend to live there too including their suppliers. It blends into Dubai but you definitely noitce when you cross the boundary. Most workers are Pakistani, poor and potentially violent so surveillance might matter.

    I don’t recognize that view as Sharjah but it might be.

    • Replies: @🧐
  216. @🧐

    For my humble part in re-visioning reality, I’m currently engaged in development of an introduction to a transliteration of our Latin/Phoenician lineal, abstract alphabet into symbological form. Each of the current letters is replaced by a symbol, whether drawn from the natural world, elements of human ingenuity, or Cosmic connectivity.

    To understand where I’m coming from with this, might I recommend a reading of Dr. Leonard Shlain’s “The Alphabet versus the Goddess” and also of Marshall McLuhan’s “Gutenberg Galaxy” as well as “Understanding Media”. My realization has been that abstraction of literacy is the message implicit in our current lettering system. However, this pattern was predicated by Gutenberg’s revolutionary shattering of the Mediaeval world by employment of lineally employed metal type…in other words, as I describe it, the McLuhan Barrier.

    Shlain, from a Jewish perspective, though a universalist rather than parochial wing of that tradition: holds that alphabetical literacy, most particularly among the Judaics, proscribed IMAGES —see the Second Commandment and consider the iconoclasm inherent in Islam. The work I shall soon release reintegrates images into our contemporary alphabet and transmutes leaden type into offset gold…an act of alchemical Real-Eye-Zation.

    Our contemporary existence may be as batshit crazy as it is due to the probability that we are in a timeframe which may signal the denouement of Kali Yuga and the transition from the Age of Pisces into that of Aquarius. Symbols are embedded deeply within our rightbrain consciousness. Western humanity has devolved culturally by left-brain asphyxiation. While maintaining a role for logic and reason, we must engage our suppressed and repressed intuitive and spiritual senses.

    Watch for presentation of my humble offering intended as an offset to our current inability to slide effortlessly through the interstices of the McLuhan Barrier. Unz delvers will be amongst the first to gain exposure to a re-imagined alphabet, one which should particularly appeal to poets as well as to all whose mindsets are not rebarred in concrete abstraction.

    • Replies: @🧐
  217. Anastasia says:

    There are no spontaneous protests. They are all organized by the same people the ones that have \$\$\$\$\$\$\$\$\$\$ the number of dollar signs to indicate their unlimited supplies of the stuff

    • Replies: @Franz
  218. @nokangaroos

    My idealized society was envisioned clear back in the earliest 80’s in an unpublished manuscript chapter titled “The Million Tribes of Turtle Island”. Citing the old African proverb of “it takes a village to raise a child”; it is only logical to presume that the vast majority of people would live in communitarian tribal villages.

    [MORE]

    A second settlement pattern would take somewhat the form of Mediaeval market towns, each located within a matrix of surrounding tribal village lands. They would also have the role of being a locus for higher-level craftsmen, who would take on apprentices, logically at the onset of puberty/adolescence. The Classical Greeks, in particular, evolved along the lines of where the boys, in particular would leave their maternal nest and take on to learn skills which they would find to be of interest and perhaps, even, fascination. Each of these towns would also have agora-modeled schools which would cater to those youths with more artistic and/or intellectual interests.

    We cannot neglect cities. There are people who need them…most evidently singles and childless couples whose interests and predilections trend towards communities made up of likeminded seekers of civilized, urban values. No room for children and rather little for precocious kids. Here we would encounter Cosmoversities, centering on collegiate rather than university modes. Pure scholarship would be one of the primary elements. Agoras, comprised of those whose scholarship and/or wisdom would be the loci of highest levels of education…not mere trade-schools for business, government and industry…rather, mutual education in the round replacing a sterile classroom with one “expert” preaching to an amen-choir of half-bored acolytes.

    Is such a Polis possible? The Greeks pulled that one off some 500 years before Jesus showed up. Socrates posited the upper population limit for such urbanities at 30-35,000 inhabitants. Employed as the master-planner for Duke Svorza, Leonardo composed a masque which utilized the combined talents of the entirety of Firenze (Florence) and it’s environs. The artistic/intellectual center for Renaissance Italy had a population similar to that prescribed by Aristotle.

    So the proposal I make for remediation of the current sub-urbanized metastasis comes in three discrete divisions. As for its viability? We been there, done that. It worked.

    • Replies: @RobinG
  219. @The_MasterWang

    Pardon the tangent – it was a rather specific response; but I think I made clear
    Greece was a hyper-Darwinian Petri dish 😉

  220. jsinton says:

    Turns out the Biden mafioso clan has Kazakh blood on their hands too:

    “…email and communications have surfaced, previously subject of extensive reporting in The Daily Mail, and related to prior extensive commentary and questions concerning Hunter’s ‘laptop from hell’ – that appears to confirm that Hunter Biden and Massimov were “close friends”. Reporting at the time indicated that “when Biden was vice president, Hunter worked as a go-between between for Rakishev from 2012 until 2014. And further the emails were from “anti-corruption campaigners” in Kazakhstan showing that Hunter made contact with Rakishev. And more: “Per the report, Hunter successfully got a \$1million investment from Rakishev to a politically-connected filmmaker.”

    https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/palace-coup-kazakh-security-chief-arrested-treason-was-close-friends-hunter-biden

  221. Franz says:
    @Anastasia

    They are all organized by the same people the ones that have \$\$\$\$\$\$\$\$\$\$ the number of dollar signs to indicate their unlimited supplies of the stuff

    FORTUNE may have given away part of the game on Kazakhstan. It named some of the players in November and now the predictable is happening. And a lot like the games they played in (for instance) Bulgaria in the 90s.

    Kazakhstan welcomed the Bitcoin miners that China banned. Now an energy crisis is forcing some miners to relocate—again

    https://fortune.com/2021/11/24/kazakhstan-bitcoin-crypto-mining-energy-power-crisis-china-xive-shuts-down/

    Miners flocked to Kazakhstan after nearby China banned crypto mining in May. Kazakhstan welcomed China’s cast-off miners with open arms. Since 2019, Kazakhstan has invested hundreds of millions of dollars to support crypto mining operations, believing that its cheap and abundant supply of fossil fuels—essential for mining—could lure the industry and unlock a new source of government revenue.

  222. @🧐

    People who resort to silly name calling like “wumaos” usually betray themselves of having little intellectual heft.

    • Replies: @🧐
  223. 🧐 says:
    @Philip Owen

    Thanks to both you guys for the insights. Do you know if Sharjah is the one manufacturing all this electronic equipment or is it imported?

    Also, the crowd did look like it wasn’t native, it had that look of Pakistani or Indian, so what you’re saying makes sense. It’s a city-state with Helots.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
  224. 🧐 says:
    @showmethereal

    Don’t really care what you wumaos think because I’m not trying to convince you of anything. Paid propagandists are supposed to distract the conversation and not stick to the issue at hand.

    • Replies: @antibeast
    , @showmethereal
  225. @🧐

    It’s imported. Sharjah does stuff like ice cream, biscuits and perfume (a traditional product there).

    • Replies: @🧐
  226. 🧐 says:
    @emerging majority

    That seems to be far more ambitious than what I’m doing. I’m just trying to raise my three sons to be good family men and have a healthy sense of suspicion of the government and its motives.

    Let us know when it’s published.

  227. 🧐 says:
    @Philip Owen

    I figured it was imported. I doubt they have the know how to run all the servers and the IT infrastructure to manage this. I wonder if it’s Chinese tech or Israeli or US. It may be Japanese, I know they’re starting up biometric tracking programs there but it seems to be under various legal reviews and public debate at this point before widespread adoption. I wonder if cities can opt out of it over there like some cities in the US are.

  228. Kazakhstan’s intelligence chief Karim Massimov was arrested for starting the revolution on charges of treason.
    He was Hunter Bidens close friend and business partner. Joe and Hunter met with him twice.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FIoWo6JXIAoJ3YD?format=jpg&name=small

    • Replies: @🧐
  229. antibeast says:
    @🧐

    Paid propagandists are supposed to distract the conversation and not stick to the issue at hand.

    LOL! How’s the weather down there in Bangalore? Your verbose style betrays your Indian nationality from 10,000 kms afar.

    The only thing that made sense from your mumbo-jumbo is to ‘distract the conversation and not stick to the issue at hand.’

    • Replies: @🧐
    , @mulga mumblebrain
  230. 🧐 says:
    @littlewing

    That dude is jacked – those guys don’t mess around over there. I wouldn’t be surprised if they pull fingernails out until he sings and rats out a bunch of other people. That’s the thing about attempting an overthrow in those countries, very big gamble – of you win, you win big and if you lose, you lose big. Wonder if his wife and kids are out of the country – they aren’t afraid of using them as leverage to loosen lips either.

  231. 🧐 says:
    @antibeast

    Yeah buddy, I’m not a Hindu troll and have never set foot in India but go ahead and imagine I am if it makes you feel better. In fact, I’d pay to see a cage match between Xi and that Modi guy (winner gets the disputed border territory of their choice). I’d pay double if they tossed ten hyenas in there with them – if hyenas win, they get it.

    Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

    Getting back to the subject at hand though, so you think India is involved in the unrest in Kazakhstan? I know that after their debacle and massive loss of investment into Afghanistan (China and Pakistan seemed to have completely outmaneuvered them there), they would love to screw over China any way they can from a bordering country – especially one that supplies them with fuel and is part of the BRI plan.

  232. @antibeast

    The punkas love to make trouble for the Chinese because they are deranged with jealousy at China’s successes, while India languishes on the brink of economic, ecological and political catastrophe.

    • Agree: picture111
    • Troll: littlewing
    • Replies: @antibeast
    , @🧐
  233. @🧐

    The issue at hand is you just made up things in your mind… Several people pointed out you were wrong – and so you threw a hissy fit.
    But here – a westerner who actually travels and knows what he is talking about. Wow – there are people who live in cities who go and visit tourist attractions… They even have families… And they even pay to dress up in the local clothes…. And even more of a shock for you… Contrary to what your “sources” tell you… There is even clean water and clear skies in this part of China. Shocking isn’t it (sarcasm)… In the second – there is a westerner hanging out with Kazakhs in China… But according to your sources they should have all left China or they were all in camps with the Uighurs. Shocking how westerners that don’t work for western mainstream media (or it’s agents elsewhere) can find such things…

    • Replies: @🧐
  234. @Yee

    And these foreign NGO operatives MUST be detained and investigated before being expelled. Any who have actively worked to subvert the host country, MUST spend time shoveling snow in winter, and herding sheep in the warmer months. The world needs to get serious about Western subversion, and its operatives. Locals who were dupes can just get off with some education, but knowing traitors need a nice long stretch in pokey. And NO expulsion, because traitor claques residing in foreign regimes are a constant menace.

  235. @Tom67

    So you lie for free, do you? How noble.

  236. denk says:

    There were no wars in the eastern front.

    But ever since THE 911 FF, gringo used
    the carte blanche to plant JSOC death squads into the STANS…to hunt AQ.
    tHATS when terrorists attacks on gringo Chinese started to explode like mushrooms after a rainfall

    Exhibt A

    PAKISTAN 2013
    TTP killed Russian and Chinese tourists…… to avenge drone strikes which are carried out by US. ???

    [MORE]

    PAK 2006
    .

    In May 2004, a car bomb killed three and injured nine of the 300 Chinese technicians working at Gwadar port. Then in October 2004, two Chinese technicians employed by the Syno Hydro Corporation on the Gomal Zam Dam project were kidnapped. And most recently, on February 15 this year, three Chinese engineers were killed in Hub, some 700 km southeast of Quetta.

    [1]

    PAK

    Many Chinese nationals have been attacked, kidnapped and killed in the country since May 2004, when three Chinese engineers were killed in Gwadar.

    [2]

    2003
    21 Killed Before Chinese Bus Burnt Down in Kyrgyzstan

    2002
    China consul killed in Kyrgyzstan

    2011
    Markets Closed After Chinese Traders Killed In Bishkek, Kyrgyzstan

    2000
    Four Chinese killed in Kazakhstan

    2011
    China believes unrest in Kazakhstan supported by external forces [3]

    warning…
    These are merely the tip of an iceberg,
    too much mayhem, too little time,.

    [1]
    https://web.archive.org/web/20060318013515/http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/HC02Df04.html

    [2]
    https://web.archive.org/web/20090816163417/http://atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/KH14Df02.html

    [3]
    https://www.voltairenet.org/China-believes-unrest-in

  237. 🧐 says:
    @showmethereal

    Christ – you guys are dense! And the thing is, you get so easily triggered over anything perceived negative about the Chinese government or its policies.
    But according to your sources they should have all left China or they were all in camps with the Uighurs.
    None of my sources claim this nor did I write anything like this. The fact that you think I did shows either that you have a serious lack of comprehension or are trying to distract.

    So – let’s try this again from the top shall we for the benefit of everyone else…

    Please quote which of the specific points I made – quotes please, not inferences from whatever you were triggered into assuming – then show how that specific claim about Kazakhs in Kazakhstan and motivations for unrest is refuted by you posting videos of Kazakhs in some remote, autonomous, and oil-lacking region in China.

    Let’s see if you can argue the point.

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
  238. RobinG says:
    @emerging majority

    Pfft, your cherished Greeks again! Aspects of their ancient culture survive. Read this to the end: it’s not just about a couple of immigrants!

    ATHENS—Anna, a 30-year-old woman living in Greece…kidnapped, beaten by ex…
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/uproar-after-man-livestreams-vicious-beating-of-ex-girlfriend/ar-AASAnJ3?ocid=msedgntp

    In May of last year, Greek society was shocked by the brutal murder [by her husband, Babis Anagnostopoulos] of British-born Caroline Crouch, a 20-year-old who was found strangled to death in her home next to her 11-month-old daughter.

    But the unfortunate reality is that what [police officer Stavros] Balaskas said (“He is stupid. If [at] the time he killed his wife, he called the police and said it was an unfortunate event… that ‘he lost it and went crazy,’ he would not go to prison for more than four years.”), wasn’t far from the truth.

    • Replies: @emerging majority
  239. You made uninformed comments about Kazahks and Uighurs – and about the Chinese gov not caring if all Kazakhs die… Chinese all conformists and soulless and no families… Your own dumb comments are above for anyone to see… Unless of course there is more than one of you using the same anonymous tag. Instead of just shutting up and being humble after multiple people tried to explain your folly – you resulted to childish attempt of taunts as “wumao”. Maybe where you come from baseless talk is seen as a sign of intelligence. Maybe where you come from attempting to insult others is a sign of being intelligent… I don’t know what to tell you.
    If you have no real clue about what I listed above – I can’t see how you are confident about Kazakhs in Kazakhstan and their conditions and that of their government.

    I don’t know anything about the people in Kansas… And guess what? I won’t read and watch some stories from writers in Los Angeles to make an opinion about Kansas. I will just shut up when I see people talking about Kansas instead of writing things I have no real clue about. Where I’m from that’s how people operate.

    • Replies: @🧐
  240. antibeast says:
    @mulga mumblebrain

    That’s also another giveaway on his Indian nationality: he kept on maligning China’s urbanization by using the Kazakhs’ lost nomadic lifestyle as a red herring. I mean if that is what he wants to say, just say it. No more of this ‘I feel their pain’ as if China’s urbanization had anything to do with the Kazakhs who were urbanized by the Soviets 100 years ago. The Kazakhs may miss their nomadic lifestyles but I don’t think they abhor the benefits of urbanization such as water, sewage, power, housing, etc. as Kazakhstan today has a GDP per capita of US\$9,000.00 which affords Kazakhs a ‘middle-income’ standard of living.

  241. denk says:

    Q

    Why the U.S. Is Building a High-Tech Bubonic Plague Lab in Kazakhstan

    ?

    A

    We’re looking forward to this becoming a regional training facility focused both on human and animal infections,” he said. “Cholera is also one of the major problems in our region, mostly with our numerous southern neighbors.”

    Increased trade with its eastern neighbor China also threatens to increase the transmission of disease.

    [1]

    [puke]

    barely 1 year later, Chinese border town Yumen hit by Bubonic plague…triggering a lockdown. !

    [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20170113191139/http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/why-the-us-is-building-a-high-tech-plague-lab-in-kazakhstan

    [2]
    https://web.archive.org/web/20170709015519/https://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2014/07/25/us-builds-bubonic-plague-lab-close-to-chinese-border-and-to-yumen-city-in-gansu-province/

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  242. @RobinG

    Like all Westerners, the once great Greeks were thoroughly deracinated and culturally demolished by the perversion of the originally spiritual movement inspired by Jesus, the Christed One. Deformed by “Saint” Paul and “Bishop Eusebius”, the original Jesus movement which was all about love and peace was co-opted by the Roman Emperor Constine whose symbol was the cross and whose slogan was “In Hoc Signe Vincis” (in this sign Conquer).

    Thus were the Greeks and ultimately all Western peoples conquered by organized religion and their dogmatism and wickedness. But as most probably a typical American historical ignoramus, you appear to be comfortably numb and equally clueless.

    • Replies: @Seraphim
  243. @antibeast

    Man, are you out to lunch. There may be a few Hindoostanis who post here, but that guy is most assuredly not one of them. Go take a walk in the Alaska wilderness around some big blueberry patch and you may learn a bit about beasts.

    • Replies: @🧐
  244. 🧐 says:
    @antibeast

    See what I mean when I say you guys don’t know how to argue the goddamn point?

    I never said Chinese urbanization had anything to do with the Kazakhs being urbanized. I was talking about the hyper security-state. I said the following.
    Why would a Kazakh people want to import an all-seeing security-state culture from a people who build massive urban metropolis where they go to die alone?

    I also said.
    If the rural Khazakh choose option one and you choose option two – then there is simply no way you are going to see eye to eye on your vision of society and he should absolutely see what is happening to the Chinese as a warning sign.

    Which means that they should take heed of the direction of their direct Chinese neighbors and understand the massive consequences that come with too much urbanization. They are right now in a much more healthy and natural balance between urban and rural and were able to pick up their TFR from the nosedive in the late 90s so they should be extremely careful about losing this healthy momentum because most countries have been unable to lift themselves back out.

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
    • Replies: @antibeast
  245. 🧐 says:
    @showmethereal

    I asked for specific quotes and you still gave your inferences like “Chinese all conformists and soulless and no families”.

    Again, learn to argue the point – which of my quotes stated that all Chinese are conformists, soulless and had no families? Is their culture (specifically urban Chinese) more conformist than the average Kazakh? Definitely. Is their culture (specifically urban Chinese) less family-friendly and amenable to family creation and having children? Definitely. Soulless? I’m not sure what you mean by that but there are definitely far more atheists among Chinese than the average Kazakh – that’s for certain.

    And yes, I think the Chinese government would rather not have to negotiate oil rights with Kazakhs in Kazakhstan, if a disease came and wiped them all out, it would make it that much easier and more in their favor and far less to worry about. For what it’s worth, I think the US government wouldn’t mind if all Venezuelans died off so that the corporations that it represents (more so than its citizens) could go in there and take over those huge oil reserves without having to deal with pesky Venezuelans.

    The rest your post is not relevant to the point – if you think I’m a jerk, OK – still doesn’t properly address anything I stated.

    One other thing that you did mention that is tangentially related…you said that you were confident that the Chinese give could reverse the terminal birth decline. From what I have seen, the Chinese government is getting more desperate and has now upped the permissible amount of children to three (up from two). Furthermore, as I cited, a Chinese expert quoted in a Chinese source stated that China could have a birth rate lower than anyone in the world at this rate. So, let’s ask the obvious question. All of you Chinese government fanboys out here, a simple raise of your hand – how many of you have actually heeded the advice of these policy makers and taken advantage of the various incentives and actually put the work forward to get married and have two or more kids? I mean, it should be a snap, right? The government has asked you to do your part and is warning you about consequences to your society if you don’t and is trying to give you various incentives.

    Any takers…?

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
    • Replies: @🧐
    , @Showmethereal
  246. 🧐 says:
    @emerging majority

    The funny thing is that I can’t believe these guys are actually that worried about pro-India trolls lurking around here. Does that mean they take them seriously? I certainly don’t. I mean those guys do far more damage to India’s reputation on these forums with their inane we-will-take-back-all-of-historic-India revanchism.

    I’ll give the wumao this much – they come across as far more intelligent, organized and calm compared to those loose cannons operating out of Hyderabad or whatever. I mean, maybe India should consider paying their guys instead of having keyboard vigilantes operate for free? You get what you pay for.

  247. Seraphim says:
    @emerging majority

    The majority of typical Americans are historical ignoramuses, comfortably numb and equally clueless.

    • Agree: Showmethereal
  248. antibeast says:
    @🧐

    You’re barking at the wrong tree.

    The USSR created modern Kazakhstan as it exists today with 1/4 of its citizens being ethnic Russians, Ukrainians, Germans, Koreans, etc. The Kazakhs lost their nomadic lifestyles during the Soviet period of rapid modernization and planned urbanization.

    China’s urbanization had nothing to with Kazakhstan which may import surveillance technology from China, Russia, Israel or other countries. But those are meant to address their national security threats not import the alleged ‘all-seeing security state culture’ of China’s urbanization.

    Your intent was to malign China’s urbanization as ‘soulless’, ‘all-seeing security state culture’, ‘childless’, etc. by romanticizing the Kazakhs’ lost nomadic lifestyles. Next thing you did was pose China’s urbanization as an existential threat to the Kazakhs’ nomadic lifestyles which had been lost to prior decades of Soviet rule.

    China’s urbanization has no relevance to Kazakhstan. The fact that you did try your best to drag China’s urbanization into this thread about Kazakhstan simply means you’re suffering from sour grapes.

    And THAT is a very Indian thing to do.

    • Replies: @🧐
  249. 🧐 says:
    @mulga mumblebrain

    India languishes on the brink of economic, ecological and political catastrophe.
    Sounds about right. Hey, do you have a list of like the top five policy disasters the Indian government has made in the last decade or so?

    Can’t use “investment in Afghanistan infrastructure” because I already called that one out. Also, I asked the other guy – is there news that India had its hands in what is going down in Kazakhstan?

    Also, completely off topic, but since I seem to have a captive audience of wumao here…

    The wife is out of town and I like to cook once in a while (maybe you guys do too) and I whipped up some of this for me and the boys tonight along with some egg fried rice.
    https://thecookful.com/chinese-garlic-chicken/

    It came out great, chicken was very moist and soft and the taste was solid also, but I have to admit, I only used half the honey it mentioned and about a third less soy sauce. I think it would have come out way too sweet or strong otherwise. So, is this recipe more along what’s authentic? Do you guys use that much honey in this dish? Would kind of drown out the garlic, right?

    • Troll: antibeast
  250. @denk

    The Khazaks also had a good collection of coronaviruses from bats garnered during Soviet times. Why ANY country would co-operate with Septic bio-warfare labs is beyond me. Bribery, I assume, or threats-the usual Septic modus operandi.

  251. @antibeast

    It’s like the scum who bemoan China re-asserting sovereignty in Tibet, as if feudal theocracy, torture, hideous executions, hereditary indebtedness, serfdom, a life expectancy under forty, mass illiteracy, no mass transport, no higher education, alliance with the CIA etc, are boons to humanity. Feckwits like Richard Gere.

    • Replies: @Showmethereal
  252. 🧐 says:
    @🧐

    Sorry, I realized that it was “dogbumbreath” (go figure) who said he was confident that the Chinese government could reverse the birth decline (which keeps getting worse as time progresses)…tough to keep track of all of you.

  253. • Replies: @_🧐
  254. 🧐 says:
    @antibeast

    You still – 1) missed my actual points and 2) misquoted me. That seems to be a very wumao thing to do.

    I never said the Kazakhs have lost their nomadic lifestyle, I said they seem to be in a healthy balance between urban and rural which they should try to maintain at this point.

    Also, there is no “alleged all-seeing security state culture“ of urban China – that is simply a fact.

    The Chinese government tracks the movement and transactions of all of its citizens in urban areas like Beijing – whether they are minorities or even the Han majority. These same citizens overwhelmingly seem to be completely on board with that same tracking and have no problems with it. What is false in the last two sentences?

    You mentioned Israeli surveillance tech. Everything I’ve read so far states that Kazakhstan has imported surveillance tech from China and Russia (more heavily Chinese). When did they start using Israeli tracking technology? Not that the Israelis wouldn’t love to completely replace all the Chinese contracts and software with their own – and likely would have had a chance to if a coup had worked.

    • Replies: @antibeast
  255. _🧐 says:
    @Priss Factor

    I often find your comments entertaining and at times enlightening, Priss – even the long-winded ones. But, WTF?!

    But since you are here – I have a question for you…given the below two scenarios as the only options, which is better for a man?

    1 – that he lives a simple life with basics and dies surrounded by his children and grandchildren.
    2 – that he becomes highly educated and lives with luxury and dies alone.

    I want to get your take on what you consider to be truly rich and what you consider to be truly poor. Try to keep it to three paragraphs though.

  256. antibeast says:
    @🧐

    Israel has close defense ties with Kazakhstan, dating back to 1992. Israeli telecoms giant NICE has supplied eavesdropping technology to Kazakhstan. Israel has also agreed to help Kazakhstan build a drone based on Israeli technology. This close defense relationship between Israel and Kazakhstan stems from mutual wariness of radical Islam.

    China’s allegedly ‘all-seeing state security culture’ is designed to culturally condition its citizens to socially-accepted behavior. Those public surveillance systems serve social goals such as penalizing citizens who jaywalk, litter, vandalize, spit, loiter, etc. in public spaces. That’s the theory behind its ‘social credit’ system.

    China’s internal security agencies have their own private surveillance systems serving state security, which is orthogonal to the public surveillance systems used in the ‘social credit’ system. Those private surveillance systems are designed to address financial crimes, political subversion, terrorist attacks, government corruption, foreign influence, etc. which affect state security.

    This will be my last reply to you as you’re obviously trolling this thread.

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
    • Replies: @_🧐
    , @_🧐
  257. _🧐 says:
    @antibeast

    Well, even if this is your last reply, I did much appreciate the info about the Israeli connection!

    Surveillance systems in the region are enabled by foreign companies that provide the products and services that allow Central Asian governments to spy on their citizens. The largest players in the region are two multinational technology companies with offices in Israel: Verint Israel and NICE Systems. Privacy International uncovered that these companies have supplied monitoring centres to Kazakhstan’s KNB and Uzbekistan’s SNB, two security agencies widely implicated in human rights abuses. The monitoring centres allow agencies unchecked access to citizens’ telephone calls and internet activity on a mass, indiscriminate scale.
    https://privacyinternational.org/press-release/1186/privacy-international-uncovers-widespread-surveillance-throughout-central-asia

    It indeed looks like Kazakhstan incorporates advanced technology from multiple sources in order to spy on its citizens. Very interesting. I wonder if that means the Israelis have direct access to that info and share it with M16 or CIA. They would seem to be well-placed no matter who came out of top – any new government would simply inherit the already-existing spy infrastructure.

    China’s allegedly ‘all-seeing state security culture’ is designed to culturally condition its citizens to socially-accepted behavior.
    Yeah, that’s what it sounds like.

    You are saying there are two comprehensive surveillance systems tracking China’s citizens with no overlap between them? One to prevent crime and political subversion and then a separate one to ensure proper behavior?

  258. @🧐

    I dont have time to go back and copy all of your quotes… But i condensed them. Anyone interested can go back and read your comments in full..
    Time to stop trolling. And while I have relatives – I do not live in the PRC and never have. And yes you are correct that chinese expert s are warning the birth rate dropped too low… Reason being because unlike the US and Europe – who all are below replacement rate – they make it up by allowing mass migration…. China will not.. And for the record no it is not lower than South Korea or Singapore.
    But What on earth does that have to do with anything with the Kazahk people – whom this story is about (though the ones in China do have a healthy birth rate)?? What does that have to do with who and what influenced the violence..?? Trolling is all.

    • Replies: @_🧐
  259. @mulga mumblebrain

    You have to remember that most of them have zero clue about the history of the Tibetan Empire – let alone the fact that Dalai Lamas had to be approved by Chinese emperors. You have to remember they were raised on the psyops Hollywood version run by the CIA. You can only try to educate them. You have to remember that brainwashed people dont know they are brainwashed. Just like many of these Kazahks being used to destabilize their own cou try. They dont know they are being fooled. But when they realize they often turn out to be the staunchest anti establishment. Hey – the guy who stepped down at Global Times the other day was once a protestor at Tiananmen. Once he realized later in life he was used as part of a psyops it turned him fervently supportive of his government and the tough choices it had to make.

  260. _🧐 says:
    @Showmethereal

    Well if you do go back to my original comments replying to Tom67 (though I posted as anonymous), you would see where the convergence is. I also condensed it here:
    https://www.unz.com/pescobar/steppe-on-fire-kazakhstans-color-revolution/#comment-5108748

    The tangents I went off on were in response to people replying to me getting triggered by the idea that the average Kazakh might (among the other reasons cited for the “social malaise” that Escobar mentioned) take umbrage at being surveilled/tracked/monitored by their corrupt elites – a surveillance made possible by Chinese IT hardware/software and influence and the natural evolution and results of which were plain to see in their neighbor to the East and which follows them across the border.

    Now living across the border in Kazakhstan, she told The Associated Press by phone on Monday that she had been confined to house arrest in China and taken to a police station, where they photographed her face and eyes and collected samples of her voice and fingerprints. “This can be used instead of your ID card to identify you in the future,” she said they told her. “Even if you get into an accident abroad, we’ll recognize you.”
    https://techxplore.com/news/2019-02-exposed-chinese-database-depth-surveillance.html

    And if we in the US aren’t careful, will follow us home – from the same techxplore article – above.
    In recent years, NetPosa has been buying stakes in American surveillance startups such as Knightscope, a security robot maker. In 2017, NetPosa tried to buy the now-bankrupt California surveillance camera maker Arecont, but later backed out, court records show.

    The Kazakhs in the remote autonomous area China seem to have a healthy birth rate – and it’ll stay that way as long as they don’t follow the hyper-urbanization of the Han majority and the trap they’ve gotten themselves in.

    After Li’s article went viral, the subject made the hot topic list on Sina Weibo, attracting 240 million views as of press time. Many netizens expressed unwillingness to get married and have children. Some women said they were worried about their careers, and others said that they can’t afford more than one child — or any at all. In an online poll on Weibo that had 130,000 participants as of press time, only 9,000 said that they would have a second child. About one-third said that they weren’t married and another one-third said no to a second child…”Once it slips below 1.5, a country falls into the trap of low fertility and is unlikely to recover,” He said, noting that China’s fertility rate has fallen below 1.5.
    https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1208784.shtml

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
    • Replies: @Tom67
    , @picture111
  261. _🧐 says:
    @antibeast

    This is actually great info, thanks!

    Surveillance systems in the region are enabled by foreign companies that provide the products and services that allow Central Asian governments to spy on their citizens. The largest players in the region are two multinational technology companies with offices in Israel: Verint Israel and NICE Systems. Privacy International uncovered that these companies have supplied monitoring centres to Kazakhstan’s KNB and Uzbekistan’s SNB, two security agencies widely implicated in human rights abuses. The monitoring centres allow agencies unchecked access to citizens’ telephone calls and internet activity on a mass, indiscriminate scale.
    https://privacyinternational.org/press-release/1186/privacy-international-uncovers-widespread-surveillance-throughout-central-asia

    Damn! So the government is using both Chinese AND Israeli tech to spy on and track their own people?! As I said, the average Kazakh is screwed.

    Wait, wait – so are you saying there are actually two concurrent and separate surveillance networks in place tracking Chinese citizens? One to combat crime prevention and political subversion and another to ensure proper behavior? So, like in Beijing, you are getting tracked twice to two separate agencies?

    • Replies: @denk
  262. Tom67 says:
    @_🧐

    Really like your post! Thanks! Good compilation of information and much food for thought

    • Replies: @_🧐
    , @denk
    , @_🧐
  263. _🧐 says:
    @Tom67

    Thanks for your personal insights on Kazakhstan. It looks like this round of instability is over, but with so many nations involved – I didn’t know Israel also gets oil from Kazakhstan – the best the people can hope for are those initial demands. After this, I doubt the security tracking/surveillance is going to take a break – it’s just going to get worse for them and foreign companies are going to keep laughing to the bank. What can you do?

    One thing that this thread and some of the stuff I read on this subject makes me realize is just how vigilant we have to be to make sure this facial and biometric tracking doesn’t become ubiquitous in the US. I’m glad many cities have banned it and I will definitely be at any meeting or town hall in my area if our municipality tries to adopt this stuff though I doubt it’ll reach out to our area – but you never know. On top of that, we need to be vigilant about foreign ownership of the tech companies that do this stuff – we really should outright ban it – it’s way too sensitive to lose track of or have it fall into their hands.

    On top of that, any future travels will definitely avoid countries that require facial or biometric data for tracking. Have no clue what they will use it for or who they will share it with.

    Best of luck keeping this stuff out wherever you are.

  264. @_🧐

    The U.S. has a much better way to track you, take a look at this Israel Patent used in almost ALL coive-19 vaccines

    [MORE]

    link for the patent, see [0352] for the names of vaccines,
    https://patents.google.com/patent/US20210082583A1/en

    Methods and systems of prioritizing treatments, vaccination, testing and/or activities while protecting the privacy of individuals
    Abstract
    An aspect of some embodiments of the invention relates to system and methods for anonymously selecting subjects for treatment against an infectious disease caused by a pathogen, comprising: 1. a plurality of electronic devices configured with instructions to generate an ID, when in proximity of another such electronic device, one or both of transmit said ID to said another electronic device and receive an ID from said another electronic device, generating a score based on a plurality of such received IDs, receiving information from a server, displaying relevant treatment instructions to said subjects based on received information; 2. at least one server comprising instructions for sending to said plurality of electronic devices information to display said relevant treatment instructions; where said at least one server or said electronic devices comprise instructions to generate a prediction of likelihood of a subject transmitting said pathogen, based on a score of the subject.
    All WHO approved vaccines are using this Patent, see the following
    Patent Inventors are both from Israel
    Gal EHRLICH
    https://patents.google.com/?inventor=Gal+EHRLICH
    Maier Fenster
    https://www.ipatent.co.il/home/dr_gal_ehrlich/

    • Replies: @_🧐
  265. denk says:
    @_🧐

    amn! So the government is using both Chinese AND Israeli tech to spy on and track their own people?! As I said, the average Kazakh is screwed.

    IF Chinese co handles Kazak system, Im not worried.

    If Its Israel, the Kazaks are really screwed, everybody knows there’s practically no secret bet Washington/Tel Aviv, which means the entire database is open to CIA/NSA monitoring 24×7 !
    OMFG !!

  266. _🧐 says:
    @picture111

    Thanks for that info – definitely why I’m against vaccine mandates!

  267. MxEdge says:
    @🧐

    STEM people are overrated. They are good at memorizing large volumes of information. They can even do the math.

    But actually understanding it?

    Lmfao!

    That’s the problem with ego. You wave a big formula in front of someone, show them how to pen in the values and suddenly they think they’re geniuses.

    But ask them what function that little dx performs at the end of an integrand, ask them what the exact meaning of an integral symbol is, or even ask them by what mathematical kinetics a rotation matrix works, and all you will get are the furrowed eyebrows of an NPC. You’re not supposed to ask those question. You’re supposed to do what you’re told, not understand it. Besides, there are deadlines to meet and ambitions to fulfil.

    Generally I don’t find STEM people overly impressive. The entire education process of STEM is an intellectual circumcision that makes one a slave.

    • Replies: @_🧐
    , @ki
  268. denk says:
    @Tom67

    Good compilation of information

    Disappeared Kazaks, UIghurs,
    concentration camps

    Huawei scandals

    Oppressive Chinese surveillance system

    Sounds like someone is parroting the entire FUKUS psyop ?

  269. _🧐 says:
    @MxEdge

    STEM guys will be the ones that dutifully – nay – enthusiastically create the robot overlords that enslave them. Literally, if we end up with a SkyNet situation on our hands with humans living underground…you can thank the STEM guys.

  270. ki says:
    @MxEdge

    But ask them what function that little dx performs at the end of an integrand, ask them what the exact meaning of an integral symbol is, or even ask them by what mathematical kinetics a rotation matrix works

    Just interested, what answer do you expect for these questions? Explanation of the group theory for rotation matrix?

  271. _🧐 says:
    @Tom67

    Thanks as well for your initial posts that shared your personal experiences with Kazakhstan. We really have to be vigilant about not letting this get out of hand in the US and push back against this kind of out-of-control security state. This is more food for thought and a possible vision for the future.

    My biggest concern is all the people who do not live in our city. Those we lost on the way. Those who decided that it became too much, all this technology. Those who felt obsolete and useless when robots and AI took over big parts of our jobs. Those who got upset with the political system and turned against it. They live different kind of lives outside of the city. Some have formed little self-supplying communities. Others just stayed in the empty and abandoned houses in small 19th century villages. Once in a while I get annoyed about the fact that I have no real privacy. Nowhere I can go and not be registered. I know that, somewhere, everything I do, think and dream of is recorded. I just hope that nobody will use it against me. All in all, it is a good life.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/worldeconomicforum/2016/11/10/shopping-i-cant-really-remember-what-that-is-or-how-differently-well-live-in-2030/?sh=2d6ea9311735

  272. KZ has horrible Corona restrictions…absolut Corona terror.
    That was the igniter (according to some Russians without pepelitical escobargendas).

    Looking at those restrictions and flowons in detail, the real revolt, the first instance becomes obvious.

    Typical to see what both (thieves in law) – “East” & “West” – have made out of it.

    Both – “East & West” seemed to have been taken by surprise and then tried to make the most of it.

    Rather disappointing to see how even the supposed objective freelancers censor and drive the common narrative of Nato/Russia instead of looking and exposing the real beneficiaries of this East/West-BS.

  273. erzberger says:
    @ebear

    “ Who the hell has a city named after them while they’re still alive?
    The only example I can think of is Stalingrad.”

    You conveniently forgot Washington (1791)

  274. @Anonymous

    China Is Tracking You Online. Yes, You.

    China is tracking you online—or potentially tracking you if it deems you a target. China’s censorship doesn’t end at the great firewall that circles the Chinese internet, it goes all around the world. It mostly targets ethnic Chinese, but not always.
    Youtube/ Google has demonetized above video.

    Also

    China’s Muslim minority seek sanctuary in Kazakhstan Al Jazeera

    China has been accused of holding more than a million Muslims, including ethnic Kyrgyz and Kazakhs, in its so-called re-education camps in Xinjiang Province.
    Rights groups in Kazakhstan have been trying to help locate and reunite individuals with family members.
    —–Mehool Bhai.

    • Troll: Showmethereal
  275. @showmethereal

    Showmeprick bhai says
    “But Russia gave S-400 to China almost 3 years ago.”

    But , showmedick Bhai, great Russia came to its senses and suspend supply to evil China.

    https://theprint.in/opinion/why-russia-really-stopped-its-s-400-supply-to-china/542583/
    Why Russia really stopped its S-400 supply to China – ThePrint

    “In February 2020, Valery Mitko, one of Russia’s leading Arctic scientists, was arrested on charges of allegedly passing secrets on submarine-detecting technology to China. Later, in June, after investigations, a court in Russia extended his house arrest. Russian scientists have been under a cloud because of links to China in the last couple of years and the Mitko incident aggravated a growing suspicion that hangs over a collaboration of convenience between China and Russia. A month after the court’s decision on Mitko, Russia chose to suspend the supply of missiles to China.”

    So China stealing technology from Russia also!!!! Always stealing the technology of others. President Putin’s wisdom be praised.

    —–Mehool Bhai, happy & beaming in Mumbai about this positive development.

    • Troll: Showmethereal
  276. _🧐 says:

    See, now this Mehool fellow is the real deal Indian troll. But you see how disorganized these guys are? Can’t even keep track of themselves.

    This guy already shot his load earlier praising China for being brutal in order to crush Islam in China.
    https://www.unz.com/pescobar/will-the-islamic-world-save-afghanistan/#comment-5080463

    Now he wants to act as if he cares about what China does to Muslims to try to score points.

    And you wumaos are actually worried about these guys influencing opinion, really?

  277. @Mehool Mehta

    No see that is your fake news media telling you that. Here is what Russia says about fake news claiming there is weakness in the Russia/China relationship.

    https://www.rt.com/russia/532033-zapad-military-exercise-china/

    • Replies: @Malla
  278. @Mehool Mehta

    Happy and beaming because he found a place to shit, in Mumbai.

  279. Malla says:
    @Showmethereal

    No see that is your fake news media telling you that.

    Chinese media is not any more trustworthy than Indian media.
    The first video posted by Mehool uncle may be fake news. It belongs to a channel called the TFI “The frustrated Indian” which is a hyper nationalist Indian site which dishes China, Pakistan, the West, USA etc… but is all about praising India and Israel. Indian patriots like Mehool Uncle go to that site to masturbate.
    But the next link of the print.in is pretty legitimate. Print.in is one of the few news outlet still free from the BJP/Modi influence and it critics the Modi government a lot of times. I am surprised Mehool Uncle frequents a site which is so critical of the Indian Government. Indian patriots call it left winged media but to be honest it is just outside Hindutva control, for the moment.

    Mehool Uncle reminds me of those old retired salary men in parks early morning doing yoga and laughing exercises and lecturing us young Indians about the greatness of Indian traditional culture. About why Indians are “getting spoiled by Westernisation”. About “evul China”, “evul Pakistan”, “evul British”, “evul America”, “evul West”. 24X7. “Buy only Indian goods, not Chinese or any other foreign goods, our money should not go to foreigners”, that type. They are old socialist guard still fighting their resistance war against the West and China. According to these old fashioned uncles there is “a Pakistani or Chinese spy under every bed”, Muslims & Christian Indians are “traitors and will betray the country”, how “the West, Pakistan, Islam, China are planning to destroy and enslave India. ”
    Don’t bother with him. They are old-fashioned, conservative, super-patriotic and inarticulate, the Old socialist guard salarymen.
    They give me a headache. I had thought of running every morning in Parks in Delhi and thus avoid spending money on gyms. Running is cheap. But parks in Delhi are full of these Old uncles & Aunties, early morning, exercising and lecturing us young dudes. So eventually I joined a gym. LOL

  280. Sean says:
    @GMC

    Precisely the opposite of reality, it is Britain that is infested by treacherous educational and other elites intent on importing allies in their class war, and scientists who are happy to be funded by totalitarian states killing minorities and selling their organs.

    Civil servants have drawn up lists of academics at UK universities suspected of passing confidential information to China, including technology that may have been used to track and repress dissidents. The University of Manchester and Imperial College London are believed to be two of the worst candidates with Oxford and Cambridge also under investigation.

    Imperial’s income is a fifth Chinese students including a dozen post grads from the Harbin top secret defence institution. Huawei, funded several million pounds of research in the Department of Electronic Engineering focused on biometric data analysis.

    • Thanks: GMC
    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  281. _🧐 says:
    @Malla

    Ha! While the phenomenon of old people giving unsolicited advice to random youngsters is probably a universal across all cultures, I could imagine entire parks full of them that you have to run through like some geriatric obstacle course.

    Maybe that is India’s cheaper answer to China’s all-seeing security cameras and social credit system, just a bunch of old “uncles” and “aunties” with too much time on their hands scattered around public venues.

    • Replies: @Malla
  282. Washington pursues RAND’s plan in Kazakhstan, then in Transnistria

    by Thierry Meyssan:

    https://www.voltairenet.org/article215271.html

  283. @Malla

    Interesting… Well i know the idea of Russia denying China the S-400 was fake news. The first was delievered with no problem. The second was delayed because of Covid. A batch of missiles were destroyed in a storm. Everything has been finished. It is already operating. I sent him a story crom Russian news during the huge military joint drills between Russia and China (where Russians even were using Chinese weapons) which noted the western hope that they would be able to drive a wedge between Russia and China. Not sure why he doesnt understand that Russia isnt going to take sides between India and China and prefers tombe friends with both. And China doesnt feel bad if Russia sells weapons to both. China does the same with Iran and Saudi Arabia. There is no divide and rule involved. Mature countries can understand.

  284. @Malla

    Spot on Malla. Conservative retards are the same everywhere be it india or america. These American conservative clowns think Indians are great and China is evil. They don’t know that the Indians despise the white man more than anyone on earth. Both are going down eventually. I’ve figured democracy….I’ll try to make a lot of money from it and then just relocate to some tax haven. There is zero point breaking ones head over patriotism and religion. Clowns like Mehool Bhai can be sacrificed for those causes. Delusional conservatives are the dumbest people on the planet..

    • Replies: @Malla
  285. @Anonymous

    I don’t think the Kazakh response was really about that. Considering the police beheadings, as an example.

    As a Western Antivaaxer, I don’t have respect for my government because it is evil. It is also, in many ways, incompetent and deranged. The latter two are, if anything, worse than the evil, because a person can respect a high functioning supervillain. Still, the last two are merciful in different ways.

    Anyhow, having said that, I would not respect the vaccine anywhere, or any vaccines anywhere. Russia only has a mandate for government officials and within the regions the choice is almost entirely individual. Moscow had lockdowns, but Moscow is Moscow.

    If China decides to make me have a vaccine, then I wouldn’t be staying in China. That is the way of things. Their absolute right to rule as they see fit with outsiders and their people, and my right to disagree and leave. America, for now, remains my land, and as an American I am under no obligations to respeft or oblige my regime. Aquiesence is evil.

  286. @Sean

    The Harbin defence institution so top secret that a slimy Sinophobe troll knows of its, alleged, existence. And how dare those rotten ‘Chinks’ defend themselves? No wonder that a White wonder like sean is outraged. AND the lying troll repeats known lies re. minorities in China, and salutes the growing racist fascist repression in the UK.

  287. Smith says:

    Job completed and the russians go home.
    Another american plot squashed.

    True heroes!

    • Agree: antibeast
  288. Jazman says:
    @d dan

    what is your opinion of this guy that spreading propaganda against China
    Many using his twitter account to say how China is bad

  289. @neutral

    No need for foreigners to incite these riots.

    I have no direct evidence to support my suspicions, but there is one foreigner whose presence makes me very suspicious as he is likely to have been in on any plot to embarrass Russia/China and was advising Nasabayev and therefore, if he had known known when the preparations for the color revolutions were complete, could have suggested the hike in LPG prices at the right time. I am talking, of course about our newest member of the Most Noble Order of the Garter,

    Incidentally, Wikipedia has this note: “The Tony Blair Institute confirmed that it has received donations from the U.S. State Department and Saudi Arabia. European Union.”

  290. @Another Polish Perspective

    Will something happen now in Turkmenistan…?

    To borrow a phrase from Dame Theresa May: “It seems highly likely!” Ukraine, Hong Kong, Xinjiang, Myanmar, Thailand, Belarus, Kazakstan…. Why not the other ‘stans? Because it looks as though that game has ended? We shall see. We shall also see whether Turkmenistan decides finally to join the CSTO.

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  291. antibeast says:
    @neutral

    Yeah, the Presidential Palace in Almaty got burned down within a few days after the protests began, all because of gas prices?

    No, Sir, that’s the textbook definition of an ‘attempted coup’ by attacking the symbolic center of State power in Kazakhstan.

    And the violent seizure of Kazakhstan’s international airport? And the sudden supply of high-powered weapons during the violent riots? That’s called ‘armed insurrection’.

    Now squashed by Tokayev. Within one week. With help from the CSTO.

    One small win for Kazakhstan. But one big loss for Yankistan.

    Bravo Tokayev! Long Live Kazakhstan!

  292. Hello Pepe,

    I had read this article, then I watched your interview with Max Blumenthal twice. FYI, I lived in Western Ukraine in 1999, so I was roughly familiar with the issues having been “not American-stupid” about that part of the world. Your interview with Max was … beyond good.

    You are one of the best journalists I have ever known about. Thank you.

  293. Malla says:
    @_🧐

    While the phenomenon of old people giving unsolicited advice to random youngsters is probably a universal across all cultures,

    Agreed but Indian traditional oldies are scarier than any other.

    Maybe that is India’s cheaper answer to China’s all-seeing security cameras and social credit system, just a bunch of old “uncles” and “aunties”

    LOL, yes our Indian oldies are more effective than China’s face recognition tech. Thousands of eyes peeking about.

  294. Malla says:
    @RJ Macready

    Both mainstream liberals and conservatives are retards in the USA, the only sensible folk are the far right/ National Socialists.

    They don’t know that the Indians despise the white man more than anyone on earth

    Very true, it would be stupid for the West to see India as a long term ally. India is a potential threat to the West. It is only that Indians are more anti-China/ anti-Islam for the moment. But China falls and India rises, it will be an even more dangerous threat to the West. Indians have the same humiliation-victim mentality of the Chinese but only greater.

    Clowns like Mehool Bhai can be sacrificed for those causes.

    Mehool Uncle is the typical Gujju Seth Nationalist. But some of the videos he posts (Elmer Yuen, Desmond Sung, Atilla Yesilada ) are hardcore stuff. Lots of behind the scenes info. I had always wondered how a Hinduvadi Uncle (they tend to be very insular) got access to such info. But lately there have been a few sophisticated high IQ types like Abhishek Mitra Iyer coming up in the Hinduvadi scene and some of them Hinduvadis have become much more sophisticated. Mehool uncle might have tapped this hardcore info from these guys. He may be irritating, but the videos he posts are solid stuff.

    • LOL: RJ Macready
  295. @foolisholdman

    The ‘game’ NEVER ends. If Evil psychopaths cease spreading Evil, they no longer exist. Scorpion and frog time.

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