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Afghanistan: Between Pipelines and ISIS-K, the Americans Are Still in Play
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Something quite extraordinary happened in early November in Kabul.

Taliban interim-Foreign Minister Amir Khan Muttaqi and Turkmen Foreign Minister Rashid Meredov got together to discuss a range of political and economic issues. Most importantly, they resurrected the legendary soap opera which in the early 2000s I dubbed Pipelineistan: the Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India (TAPI) gas pipeline.

Call it yet another remarkable, historical twist in the post-jihad Afghan saga, going back as far as the mid-1990s when the Taliban first took power in Kabul.

In 1997, the Taliban even visited Houston to discuss the pipeline, then known as TAP, as reported in Part 1 of my e-book Forever Wars.

During the second Clinton administration, a consortium led by Unocal – now part of Chevron – was about to embark on what would have been an extremely costly proposition (nearly \$8 billion) to undercut Russia in the intersection of Central and South Asia; as well as to smash the competition: the Iran-Pakistan-India (IPI) pipeline.

The Taliban were duly courted – in Houston and in Kabul. A key go-between was the ubiquitous Zalmay Khalilzad, aka ‘Bush’s Afghan,’ in one of his earlier incarnations as Unocal lobbyist-cum-Taliban interlocutor. But then, low oil prices and non-stop haggling over transit fees stalled the project. That was the situation in the run-up to 9/11.

In early 2002, shortly after the Taliban were expelled from power by the American “bombing to democracy” ethos, an agreement to build what was then still billed as TAP (without India), was signed by Ashgabat, Kabul and Islamabad.

The Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India (TAPI) gas pipeline route
The Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India (TAPI) gas pipeline route

As years went by, it was clear that TAPI, which runs for roughly 800 km across Afghan lands and could yield as much as \$400 million annually in transit revenue for Kabul’s coffers, would never be built while hostage to a guerrilla environment.

Still, five years ago, Kabul decided to revive TAPI and work started in 2018 – under massive security in Herat, Farah, Nimruz and Helmand provinces, already largely under Taliban control.

At the time, the Taliban said they would not attack TAPI and would even provide their own security. The gas pipeline was to be paired with fiber optic cables – as with the Karakoram Highway in Pakistan – and a railway line from Turkmenistan to Afghanistan.

History never stops playing tricks in the graveyard of empires. Believe it or not, we’re now back to the same situation on the ground as in 1996.

The spanner in the works

If we pay attention to the plot twists in this never-ending Pipelineistan saga, there’s no guarantee whatsoever that TAPI will finally be built. It’s certainly a quadruple win for all involved – including India – and a massive step towards Eurasia’s integration in its Central-South Asian node.

Enter the spanner in the works: ISIS-Khorasan (ISIS-K), the subsidiary of Daesh in Afghanistan.

Russian intel has known for over a year that the usual suspects have been providing help to ISIS-K, at least indirectly.

Yet now there’s a new element, confirmed by Taliban sources, that quite a few US-trained soldiers of the previous Afghan National Army are incorporating themselves into ISIS-K to fight against the Taliban.

ISIS-K, which sports a global jihadi mindset, has typically viewed the Taliban as a group of dirty nationalists. Earlier jihadi members used to be recruited from the Pakistani Taliban and the Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan (IMU). Yet now, apart from former soldiers, they are mostly young, disaffected urban Afghans, westernized by trashy pop culture.

It’s been hard for ISIS-K to establish the narrative that the Taliban are western collaborators – considering that the NATO galaxy continues to antagonize and/or dismiss the new rulers of Kabul.

So the new ISIS-K spin is monomaniac: basically, a strategy of chaos to discredit the Taliban, with an emphasis on the latter being unable to provide security for average Afghans. That is what underlies the recent horrific attacks on Shia mosques and government infrastructure, including hospitals.

In parallel, US President Joe Biden’s “over the horizon” spin, meant to define the alleged American strategy to fight ISIS-K, has not convinced anyone, apart from NATO vassals.

Since its creation in 2015, ISIS-K continues to be financed by the same dodgy sources that fueled chaos in Syria and Iraq. The moniker itself is an attempt to misdirect, a divisive ploy straight out of the CIA’s playbook.

Historic ‘Khorasan’ comes from successive Persian empires, a vast area ranging from Persia and the Caspian all the way to northwest Afghanistan – and has nothing whatsoever to do with Salafi-jihadism and the Wahhabi lunatics who make up the terrorist group’s ranks. Furthermore, these ISIS-K jihadis are based in south-eastern Afghanistan, away from Iran’s borders, so the ‘Khorasan’ label makes zero sense.

Russian, Chinese and Iranian intel operate on the basis that the US ‘withdrawal’ from Afghanistan, as in Syria and Iraq, was not a withdrawal but a repositioning. What’s left is the trademark, undiluted American strategy of chaos executed via both direct (troops stealing Syrian oil) and indirect (ISIS-K) actors.

The scenario is self-evident when one considers that Afghanistan was the precious missing link of China’s New Silk Roads. After the US exit, Afghanistan is not only primed to fully engage with Beijing’s Belt and Road Initiative (BRI), but also to become a key node of Eurasia integration as a future full member of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO), the Collective Security Treaty Organization (CSTO) and the Eurasia Economic Union (EAEU).

To hedge against these positive developments, the routine practices of the Pentagon and its NATO subsidiary remain in wait in Afghanistan, ready to disrupt political, diplomatic, economic and security progress in the country. We may be now entering a new chapter in the US Hegemony playbook: Closet Forever Wars.

The closely connected SCO

Fifth columnists are tasked with carrying the new imperial message to the West. That’s the case of Rahmatullah Nabil, former head of Afghanistan’s National Directorate of Security (NDS), “the Afghan intelligence service with close ties to the CIA,” as described by Foreign Policy magazine..

In an interview presented with a series of trademark imperial lies – “law and order is disintegrating,” “Afghanistan has no friends in the international community,” “the Taliban have no diplomatic partners” – Nabil, at least, does not make a complete fool of himself.

He confirms that ISIS-K keeps recruiting, and adds that former Afghan defense/security ops are joining ISIS-K because “they see the Islamic State as a better platform for themselves.”

He’s also correct that the Taliban leadership in Kabul is “afraid the extreme and young generation of their fighters” may join ISIS-K, “which has a regional agenda.”

Russia “playing a double game” is just silly. In presidential envoy Zamir Kabulov, Moscow maintains a first-class interlocutor in constant touch with the Taliban, and would never allow the “resistance,” as in CIA assets, to be based in Tajikistan with an Afghan destabilization agenda.

On Pakistan, it’s correct that Islamabad is “trying to convince the Taliban to include pro-Pakistan technocrats in their system.” But that’s not “in return for lobbying for international recognition.” It’s a matter of responding to the Taliban’s own management needs.

The SCO is very closely connected on what they collectively expect from the Taliban. That includes an inclusive government and no influx of refugees. Uzbekistan, for instance, as the main gateway to Central Asia for Afghanistan, has committed to participating in the reconstruction business.

ORDER IT NOW

For its part, Tajikistan announced that China will build a \$10 million military base in the geologically spectacular Gorno-Badakhshan Autonomous Region. Countering western hysteria, Dushanbe made sure that the base will essentially host a special rapid reaction unit of the Regional Department for Organized Crime Control, subordinated to Tajikistan’s Minister of Internal Affairs.

That will include around 500 servicemen, several light armored vehicles, and drones. The base is part of a deal between Tajikistan’s Interior Ministry and China’s Ministry of State Security.

The base is a necessary compromise. Tajik President Emomali Rahmon has a serious problem with the Taliban: he refuses to recognize them, and insists on better Tajik representation in a new government in Kabul.

Beijing, for its part, never deviates from its number one priority: preventing Uighurs from the East Turkistan Islamic Movement (ETIM) by all means from crossing Tajik borders to wreak havoc in Xinjiang.

So all the major SCO players are acting in tandem towards a stable Afghanistan. As for US Think Tankland, predictably, they don’t have much of a strategy, apart from praying for chaos.

(Republished from The Cradle by permission of author or representative)
 
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  1. “Enter the spanner in the works: ISIS-Khorasan (ISIS-K), the subsidiary of Daesh in Afghanistan.”

    Why not just kill ISIS-K? All of them. Would that be so hard for some combination of Russia/China/Iran?

  2. Not sure why anyone would come up with the idea to run a pipeline through India and Pakistan at the same time.
    In any event ISIS and other militants are always a useful tool to be wielded by you know who… This web seems even more entangled than previous one… Lets see what the result is. Putin addressed it in Valdai as well. All the countries in the region prefer to keep foreigners out.

  3. BorisMay says:

    More undiluted drivel from CIA operative Pepe Escobar which Unz should not be publishing.

    There is no way ex US trained Afghan military are joining the US/Israel funded ISIS-K or any other salafist group.

    Afghan Army men joined for the money and access to modern weaponry, but are so nationalistic that ISIS is just not an option. Escobar is just pedalling misinformation to addle American minds further.

    Escobar is a prime enemy to the people of Afghanistan because he peddles CIA lies and should not be trusted by any patriotic US website.

  4. Mr. Escobar writes another excellent article. From a week-old link:

    Since the Taliban take-over, ISIS-Khorasan (often referred as ISIS-K) has claimed responsibility for multiple attacks in the country, including the ones targeting Friday prayers, imambargahs. The biggest so far, has been the August 26 attack outside the Kabul Airport. Over 170 Afghans and 13 US soldiers were killed that day.

    Now, the Wall Street Journal has reported that former members of the Afghan intelligence agencies and elite military units are joining the only resistance that they see can challenge the writ of the Talibam: ISIS-K.
    ~~~~~~
    And in some cases, it’s all about money. ISIS-K offers handsome amounts of cash to new recruits.

    The Afghan forces were cash-strapped and were not paid for months when the US forces left in August. This was one of the reasons for the lukewarm resistance that the Taliban faced from the Afghan National Army and other forces.

    I wouldn’t have seen this without being prompted by Mr. Escobar’s article. Everything fits. The US tapered off the money for the Afghan forces because it knew it was leaving, and when. That was to get them “hungry”, and ready to grab a new source of income.

    https://cricketdailylive.blogspot.com/2021/11/former-afghan-commanders-intelligence.html

    • Thanks: Mustapha Mond
  5. Escobar is a prime enemy to the people of Afghanistan because he peddles CIA lies and should not be trusted by any patriotic US website.

    Please show us how your accusation explains why Escobar contends in this article that ISIS-K is a CIA asset.

    • Replies: @Maddaugh
  6. Anon[357] • Disclaimer says:

    …. What’s left is the trademark, undiluted American strategy of chaos executed via both direct (troops stealing Syrian oil) and indirect (ISIS-K) actors…..

    Chaos is a feature, not a bug of our Foreign Policy. In every place we engage (Europe, Asia, Africa, and South America), chaos and destruction is the goal.

  7. Anonymous[124] • Disclaimer says:

    So Washington’s fresh new policy in Afghanistan is merely to rebrand its sundry gangs of professional terrorists. Sure, because this time the definition of insanity is surely due to change. If not for all the upcoming deaths and bloodshed this might even be hilarious comedic entertainment.

  8. @WorkingClass

    It is more costly for muttmerica to run (((ISIS-K))). Same reason the Chinese go along with the coronahoax but refusing to collapse their economy.

  9. Yahweh! I am exhausted with this shit.

    It’s all about personal interest except when it’s about ethnic (tribal) interests.

    Just get your injection of the Trump Juice (Warp Speed Bitches!)..

    I’ve just watched “Curb Your Enthusiasm” episode 3 season 9. It’s fucking hilarious how clueless the evangelical and orthodox and COVID compliant and the rest of you retards are.

    Seriously. You quiver in fear that the Jews are dictating your future. You quiver in fear that the mutants will rule (thanks Jewlywood). You quake at the thought that your Messiah may not bring you eternal life.

    You Boomers are hilarious.

    Nature is Nature. The Universe is a bajillion years old. The number is a wild assed guess. The point is that YOU are completely meaningless (with the possible exception of your personal contribution to the patriarchy).

    In 10,000 years, where is “BLM” or “CRT”?

    AND, if your point is to preserve the next century, rather than the next millennium or Age, whatever you are doing is pathetically weak sauce.

    Will any history remember you for your voting record? You voted for Orange Man! Yay you! What else did you do?

    You Boomers are some real heroes!

    • Agree: Robert Bruce
    • Troll: RoatanBill
    • Replies: @Maddaugh
    , @RadicalCenter
  10. It’s comical to focus on the collapse of the empire based on the outposts. “Look, the savages are reverting to savagery!” How shocking!

    Humans have NEVER wantonly and arbitrarily abused other humans. Especially not on the basis of tribal membership! That’s NEVER happened.

    Oh my.

    The (((NEW))) WORLD ORDER isn’t working out any better than the old world order? How shocking that messianic Jews and Orthodox Jews were wrong. Gosh. I am just shocked that everything that the Jews have ever proclaimed has been wrong.

    Maybe it’s time to listen to some different Gods?

  11. With 6.2% inflation, America has a lot more to worry about its economy than its imperial games in Afghanistan.

    • Replies: @Arthur MacBride
  12. Maddaugh says:

    Something quite extraordinary happened in early November in Kabul.

    And….the Americans are still in play. A few weeks ago, America was OUT and the Chinese and Russians were IN.

    As with all Pepe’s articles I have to turn my bullshit meter off. I can no longer afford the repairs !

    In any case, who really gives a shit about what happened in Kabul. Where is that anyway ? Oh in Minnesota ! Well excuse me>>>>!!

    • Agree: Robert Bruce
    • Replies: @Robert Bruce
  13. Maddaugh says:
    @Alan Orsborn

    Pablo, I meant Pepe Escobar is no CIA asset, not with a surname like that or could he be ? Who knows. What I do know is that Pepe sits at his kitchen table, fires up Google Search and conjures up articles, prognosticating, pontificating, waxing, assuming, ruminating, flatulating !

    You can be sure that the story will change in 2 weeks with the Americans, Russians and Chinese out and The Republic of Burkina Faso in on some dastardly conspiracy with Afghanistan to take over the world Pinky and the Brain style.

    I long for those days back in 2o20 when Anatoli Karlin wrote those 4000 word essays complete with dozens of graphs showing the extinction of humankind due to Covid. Why can;t we return to those glorious days of blogging and compelling prose.

    Pepe, Anatoli and Ling Ting Ding and his travel monologues. The Three Amigos, whose mission in life is what ?? ! !

  14. Maddaugh says:
    @Stan d Mute

    Look at it this way. If you had to go to a comedy show you would have to pay, entrance fee, drinks, gasoline at \$7 a gallon to and from. Some of the characters, ie authors on UR, entertain us for free and we dont even have to crawl out from under our beds for fear of Covid infection. Be grateful !

  15. drsmith says:

    Who knew a cartoon, of all things, would lay all this to bear? But sure enough, fans of Archer will certainly remember season 4, episode 6 titled “Once Bitten’ which takes place in the Afghanistan region and about a pipeline being built in that region and they are being paid the blow it up. True, in the cartoon, the pipeline was in the wrong direction, but hey can’t be too obvious, can they?

    Yup, since we know who controls Hollywood and the entertainment industry, they can’t help but to telegraph their own moves – sort of ‘nananana you can’t stop us!’ Most in the west , including myself until recently, we’re totally oblivious to this covert war going on. What is different this time is that both Russia and China have made it clear they no longer care about playing reindeer games and will no longer tolerate this nonsense in their backyard. Guess the west is going to get used to constant humiliation.

  16. As for US Think Tankland, predictably, they don’t have much of a strategy, apart from praying for chaos.

    Personally I believe that USUK, despite their crap military and Alzheimer leader, are far from just praying for chaos. They have Muslim puppets, notably KSA, Oman, UAE, possibly Jordan; they occupy Iraq, strategic areas of Syria and are in the process of wrecking Lebanon, all at the service of Greater Israel.

    USA left big consignments of weapons and gold in the desert for ISIS to pick up to kick-start their campaign — the “Muslim Terrorist” group that has never attacked Israel, had a Jewish leader and whose wounded are treated in Israeli hospitals …

    ISIS, with USUK officers, presently fights in Yemen, although reports indicate that they are being defeated; they are are at the beck and call of their judeo-masonic masters who, far from combatting them, have set them up and continue to nurture them. Action must be directed at the Head of the Snake, whatever form that action may take.

  17. @Old Brown Fool

    Right.
    Along with reports of collapsing cities, here is a recent vdo of urban USA —

  18. @BorisMay

    I find Pepe’s articles and analysis to be some of the best you can read here. Certainly far better than your constant rants. How the hell would you know what is going on from your couch in the former BE?

    • Agree: showmethereal
  19. Adûnâi says: • Website

    Whenever I read Westerners’ shitting on ISIS, I feel like this is an expression of American cultural chauvinism. This mindset presupposes that any kind of jihadism is necessarily a spawn of Anglo-American imperialism, as if those Jews were omnipotent gods. They’re not, in fact. They definitely may finance certain groups, but those groups are already active on the ground with weapon in hand.

    The Emirate (called the Talibs by Westerners) seems to cuck over to China and the rest of the infidels for the sake of dirty shekels. Is it any wonder that a sizeable part of the Muslim society would support Daesh?

    • Replies: @The_MasterWang
    , @anon
  20. gotmituns says:

    the Americans Are Still in Play
    ————————————
    Meddling in other people’s affairs – It’s what we do.

  21. Maddaugh says:
    @BorisMay

    More undiluted drivel from CIA operative Pepe Escobar which Unz should not be publishing.

    My sources tell me that Elvis is alive. I even wrote to him in Memphis and he replied and sent me a complimentary copy of his Christmas Album. Unlike you, I therefore have no reason to doubt Pepper’s informants are reliable.

  22. antibeast says:

    Russian, Chinese and Iranian intel operate on the basis that the US ‘withdrawal’ from Afghanistan, as in Syria and Iraq, was not a withdrawal but a repositioning. What’s left is the trademark, undiluted American strategy of chaos executed via both direct (troops stealing Syrian oil) and indirect (ISIS-K) actors.

    With all due respect to Pepe Escobar, methinks he is wrong this time around: the USA has ceased to be relevant to the whole region of Central Asia after its humiliating withdrawal from Afghanistan just two months ago.

    There was talk of the USA using Russian military bases in Central Asia as well as launching OTH attacks against ISIS-K ‘terrorists’ inside Afghanistan, none of which has materialized. Instead, China has struck an agreement with Tajikistan to build and operate a military base near its border with Xinjiang while Russia has managed to get the rest of Central Asia to reject any future US military bases in the region.

    Afghanistan itself has quickly returned to its normal rhythm of Islamic life, unperturbed by the occasional attacks of the pathetic joke that is ISIS-K which has no popular support whatsoever in the Islamic World. Unlike Assad’s Syria or Saddam’s Iraq, Afghanistan is now ruled by the Taliban, an Islamic political movement which is supported by much of the Islamic World. The idea that the Yanks are going to recruit former ANA cowards who ran away from fighting the Taliban to join ISIS-K in order to come back and fight the Taliban is laughable nonsense. Those ANA deserters are now enjoying their spoils of the War in Afghanistan.

    • Replies: @anon
  23. The Afghan withdrawal and the gifted military toys did seemed a bit of the deep state version of trust the plan. Don’t know what the plan is except for it is not q’s. So if it is the intended rise of the cereal terrorist, well why not? Given our cognitive national decline, whatever it is will probably be worse than the usual. Nor would it surprise me if it involves the American homeland.

  24. “Beijing, for its part, never deviates from its number one priority: preventing Uighurs from the East Turkistan Islamic Movement (ETIM) by all means from crossing Tajik borders to wreak havoc in Xinjiang.”

    How long can Peking keep the Uighur freedom fighters out of their own country, East Turkestan, illegally, and furthermore, doesn’t the hegemon wannabe consider the implications of immoral policy of atrocities towards minorities, including the hapless Tibetans? Shame on China!

    • Troll: showmethereal
  25. @Maddaugh

    Guys like Pepe and the Saker for the most part are cheerleading useful idiots that don’t get that both sides are working together to build the one world government system with co-opting the opposition if you will. Syria and Iran are somewhat beholden to Russia, who is one of the main false protagonists in the game. Putin never put the heel on the neck of ISIS’ and pushed down on it full force. In an unexplained turn of events, he stopped the air assault, giving no real reason behind the dumbass move. The resistance movement in the ME is being sold out from both sides.

    • Replies: @RedpilledAF
  26. Agent76 says:

    September 10, 2021 The Bin Ladens and the Bushes: On 9/11 George Herbert W. Bush Meets Osama’s Brother Shafiq bin Laden

    Lest we forget, one day before the 9/11 attacks [as well as on the morning of 9/11, the dad of the sitting President of the United States of America, George Herbert Walker Bush was meeting none other than Shafiq bin Laden, the brother of the alleged terror mastermind Osama bin Laden.

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-bin-ladens-the-bushes-and-911-a-former-us-president-meets-osamas-brother-not-subject-to-anti-terrorism-legislation/5582436

    August 9, 2020 Global Warfare: “We’re Going to Take out 7 Countries in 5 Years: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan & Iran..”

    All these countries including Lebanon and Iran are on the Pentagon’s drawing board. These seven countries have directly or indirectly been the object of US aggression.

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/we-re-going-to-take-out-7-countries-in-5-years-iraq-syria-lebanon-libya-somalia-sudan-iran/5166

  27. @BorisMay

    Drugs, p*ssy, and good old fashioned propaganda/psychological warfare are wielded masterfully by Mossad/CIA/MI6. Of course angry young males, uneducated for the most part, will be led astray and manipulated by scummy Jews and their Shabbos Goys.

    The saying “Beware of a Greek bearing gifts” should really should be updated to “Beware a Jew or a Shabbos Goy screaming about democracy and women’s rights.”

    Just look at what massive shifts in the Ukrainian psyche have taken place in just a few short years since the Soros colour revolution. Now, imagine those Afghani young men and what is possible to do with them with Soros money and Mossad/CIA/MI6 mental games.

  28. @Robert Bruce

    Chabad surrounds Putin. They pour poison in his ears.

  29. @BorisMay

    They are nationalistic??? Many of the people who fled to Europe and claimed asylum were US trained aafghan military. They c.aimed they were under threat – even though the Taliban offered clemency. Another large contingent simply handed over their weapons to the Taliban… But I dont doubt there may be a small hardcore group who is willing to cause chaos wkth their former trainers. If that means helping ISIS – then I believe they surely would. We have seen this play out before.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  30. Sean says:

    Yes pipelines tell us a lot, there was the Wuhan to North America Fentanyl pipeline, now the Fentanyl precursor pipeline to Mexico, and the Wuhan to everywhere Covod-19 pathogen pipeline. Pakistan ceded the 2,000 sq mi Shaksgam Valley to China in a boundary agreement in 1963, Pakistan has more glaciers (glacial ice) that anywhere outside the polar regions, maybe their battles (literal battles) with India over the Siachen Glacier in Kashmir (in which India grabbed 1,000 square miles) were about the water that could be piped down from it. Or just maybe Pakistan’s repeated initiation of hostilities (most recently in 1999) to win back its positions have to do with how Pakistani control of Siachen would allow them unite the Chinese and Pakistani front in a against India.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karakoram_Highway The highway, connecting the Gilgit–Baltistan region to the ancient Silk Road, runs approximately 1,300 km (810 mi) from Kashgar, a city in the Xinjiang region of China, to Abbottabad, of Pakistan

    Abbottabad is home to the Pakistani equivalent of West Point, which is less than a mile from where Osama bin Laden was found to be living while the world’s most wanted man amongst many retired Pakistani officers. Pakistan is known to have received missile parts from China. As for the Pakistani development of nuclear weapons, draw your own conclusions. India’s armed forces including reserves are comparable to the entire population of Pakistan. Everyone admits that the Taliban originated and are still substantially beholden to the Pakistani Secret Service. Hence, if a pipeline Across Afghanistan to India is attacked it will be because Pakistan wants it attacked; nor would this annoy China, which is Pakistan’s protector against India.

    • Troll: d dan
    • Replies: @emersonreturn
  31. sardar says:

    [So the new ISIS-K spin is monomaniac: basically, a strategy of chaos to discredit the Taliban, with an emphasis on the latter being unable to provide security for average Afghans. That is what underlies the recent horrific attacks on Shia mosques and government infrastructure, including hospitals.]

    Excellent. You are absolutely right.

    The policy of the Evil empire is not to help Afghanistan and bring stability to the region, rather the empire’s PLAN B is to continue its policy of terrorism and chaos using its agents ISIS and its branches ISIS-K and other terror groups to keep these countries including Taliban in Afghanistan fighting for their lives and spending their money, if there is any, because the majority of these countries are under economic, fighting terrorism not be able to meet the needs of their people and keep Afghanistan unstable so the evil empire create a chance of ‘going back’.

    ISIS-K has its own plan and needs the financial and arm support of its backers, US, Saudis, Turkey and UAE dogs to keep these terrorists alive so they can prevent stability which is necessary to bring SECURITY to create a suitable environment for economic improvement working with China, Russia and Iran.

    Other goals of the West is to send a message to the world that Taliban is unable to provide security despite their claims. This is an important goal of ISIS-K as well. Therefore, it is important all the regional countries condemn the latest massacre of Shia in their place of worship and they should expect Taliban to do everything possible to prevent ISIS-K terrorist act against people including Shia, because this is one of the basic needs of Afghanistan today.

    The ISIS-K was formed in 2015. From 2015 to 2020, creating terror was one of the main programs of ISIS-K. The ideological differences between the Hanafi Taliban and the salafi ISIS-K have been and are the main reason for the conflict between the two groups. Naeem al-Haq Haqqani, a Taliban cultural official, said in an interview: “The Islamic Emirate is intellectually and jurisprudentially different from Salafism (ISIS-K) and ISIS Wahhabi. We in Afghanistan follow the Hanafi religion and have no relation with Salafism and ISIS. Also, Salafism and ISIS do not have a popular and important position in Afghanistan. Therefore, the Islamic Emirate is fighting the ISIS-K in Afghanistan to avoid controversy and discord among Muslims and to repel sedition and corruption … There is no doubt that ISIS-K in Afghanistan is an American phenomenon and a product of Kabul intelligence, rather than challenges and problems. The United States and NATO and the Afghan government [then Ghani who stole \$69M and is seeking Lebanese citizenship now] are behind ISIS-K to create problems for Taliban in jihadist affairs.”

    The ISIS-K, like Turkey, is seeking ‘caliphate’ and is against Taliban because Taliban is seeking stability and economic development in AFGHANISTAN and does not give a damn about ‘caliphate’, competing with the mafia ‘world government’.
    The evil empire thinks it is a good business to use these lunatic ISIS-K to keep Afghanistan and the region, especially the Iranian borders, unstable so China can not have a piece of mind to expand its project ‘belt and Road initiative’ any further and keep these countries poor and their population dissatisfied so we have chance for regime change in the future.

    So the zionist regime in Washington, Trump and Biden, thought they were killing two birds with one stone, by helping the terrorists ISIS-K. the US and NATO, where Turkey is embedded in, are continuing their plan of destabilization of the region, like in Syria, Libya and Iraq, undermining Chinese economic initiative in the region, because when there is NO STABILITY, then there is no economic development.

    The evil empire has no intention helping Afghanistan and its people, only to keep it poor and weak like what they are doing to Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, Venezuela. the Evil empire has no ‘Marshall plan’ for Muslims, only terrorism to keep the region in chaos and wars putting one against the other to keep their influence in the region.
    In Iraq ,the zionist regime, Biden, is seeking a civil war of Shia against Shia to continue the chaos in the country.
    The latest stupid FALSE FLAG operation in Iraq where the attack suppose ‘to kill’ a traitor, Al Kazemi, PM, a servant of the empire, is the latest example.

    The US/Israel milking of the cows, the Arab ‘head of states’ in UAE and Saudi Arabia bring funding for these terrorists. These criminals are the enemy of people.
    Russia, Iran, China and even Pakistan must act now and form a committee helping Afghanistan to root out the empire’s terrorist activities ISIS-K.

    The people of the region must be united against the Jewish mafia and its servants in Washington at the centers of power. Death to enemy of the people.

  32. @Sean

    sean, wouldn’t you be happier posting on ZH…you would have so many friends, posters applauding every thought?

    • Replies: @Sean
    , @Sean
  33. anon[350] • Disclaimer says:
    @antibeast

    https://theintercept.com/2021/11/04/drone-attack-kabul-pentagon-report-whistleblowers/

    and US crieshttps://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/11/07/zhang-zhan-prisoner-wuhan-china-covid-origin/?commentID=478afb25-c42f-4bb6-a4e4-37d09c354541

    and UK crieshttps://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-59258112- “It also sends a chilling message to all journalists in Myanmar. If they are willing to snub a superpower like the US, and hold one of its citizens hostage, the treatment of local journalists may be even harsher.” and “a travesty of justice by a kangaroo court” and “But the charges against him are clearly absurd” and more “has been critical of the military since the coup”

    It is possible uSA killed its own operatives by drones to prevent them becoming real Afghanistan and spill the secretes .

    In another theater of absurdity ,another faint cry exhaled with full lung power to swing a fallen autumn leave :

    “Late on Wednesday in Washington, the US government imposed sanctions on two senior military officials: Cambodia’s navy commander, Tea Vinh, and Chau Phirun, director-general of the Defense Ministry’s Material and Technical Services Department.

    Both are accused of planning to “profit from activities regarding the construction and updating of Ream Naval Base facilities,” the country’s largest naval base.”–https://asiatimes.com/2021/11/us-turns-new-screws-on-cambodias-hun-sen/

    America is superpower (BBC) and it can punish military related corruption ( Asia Times)!! WTF

    Still there are sane voices who can read the writing on the wall

    https://asiatimes.com/2021/11/us-taliban-recognition-would-be-a-game-changer/ US will meet Taliban in Pakistan for constructive dialogue.

    • Replies: @antibeast
  34. @Adûnâi

    ISIS only attacked the enemies of the US. They said they would fight Israel AND Hamas. They didn’t. When they accidentally shot something into Israel while fighting near the border they apologized. The US “bombed” ISIS for weeks to no effect. The fleet of oil tanker trucks were still hauling oil to Turkey and generating an income. Then Russia came in and bombed ISIS for real and the whole jihad began to collapse after a week.

    So yes, I believe ISIS is an arm of the American empire, like the Taliban was.

  35. @WorkingClass

    They are protected by the USA, Saudi Arabia and Israel, so destroying them means bombing US bases in Syria, Saudi Arabia and the Occupied Golan Heights at least. No possible. The USA and its stooges can churn out jihadists from psychopathic, brainwashed, youth, until Kingdom Come.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  36. @The_MasterWang

    Daesh butchers in the so-called al-Nusra Front were treated in hospitals in Israel when wounded. They were visited at least once by Nutty-yahoo, who urged them on. In the Occupied Golan Heights the Quneitra Gate into Syria became known as the Nusra Gate, and local Druze rioted after al-Nusra massacred Druze in Syria.

    • Replies: @Mario Partisan
  37. @sardar

    Daesh is the latest manifestation of US, Saudi, UK and Israeli created jihadism. As with other systems it has evolved, into ever more brutal and Evil forms. Daesh in Afghanistan attacks hospitals including maternity hospitals, ever eager to reach ultimate depths of Evil and depravity. The fact that the Western ruling elites, particularly those of the Anglosphere, have totally given themselves over to Absolute Evil, truly diabolical Satanism.
    I just watched our former PM, Keating, no great shakes in office, a true proto-Blairite in economics (he retired a millionaire),speaking about geopolitics in our region. That he went against the Official Line peddled by both major parties, the ENTIRE MSM and various US-funded ‘think-tanks’, ie that China is ‘The New Nazis’ and we must prepare for WAR!, troubled most of the whorenalists’as they asked their questions. Indeed one or two were quite agitated with barely suppressed rage at Keating’s treachery. And at least half asserted bare-faced lies regarding Chinese behaviour. As I said, Satan and his minions rule the West, and are driving it to a thermo-nuclear race and civilizational apocalypse. But with ever more fundamentalist ‘Christians’ in Parliament, who are slavering for the End Times, that is probably OK with them.

    • Replies: @sardar
  38. antibeast says:
    @anon

    It is possible USA killed its own operatives by drones to prevent them becoming real Afghanistan and spill the secretes.

    No, Biden sent the drone which mistakenly killed an Afghan family being evacuated by an aid worker because he forgot about the ISIS-K which was supposed to be the new enemy in Afghanistan. Biden needs to take more meds to help him remember things.

    US will meet Taliban in Pakistan for constructive dialogue.

    Biden’s USA is being treated like the Big Joke it is today. He didn’t even bother to help CIA/MI6 assets Massoud and Saleh who led the Panjshir Resistance against the Taliban, despite the usual US Deep State shills like Bolton pleading for a continued US military presence in Afghanistan. All Biden could do was to mumble incoherently by uttering: “C’mon, man! I thought we’re done in Afghanistan!”

    Nobody takes the Yanks seriously anymore. Not even the Taliban which is openly courting China for investment in Afghanistan as part of the BRI. And they’re now enjoying the spoils of the War in Afghanistan by creating a modern military, equipped with US-made weapons.

    The Taliban fought the USA for 20 years to establish the Islamic Emirate in Afghanistan. That was a true Jihad against the Yanks which the Taliban won, fair and square, not the fake ‘Jihad’ against Iraq and Syria by the CIA/MI6/Mossad-created ‘ISIS’ . The Taliban has now become the new heroes of Islam which makes it impossible for the ISIS-K to even exist much less survive in the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan. If the stupid gringos feel bad about that, then they’d be better off sucking their own limp dicks by watching gay porn in their trailer parks somewhere in the Banana Republic of Yankistan.

    The USA is finally out of Central Asia for good. Finished. The End. Fin.

  39. @Mulga Mumblebrain

    ISIS strikes me as a mercenary group that the US helped put together during the late W years as it began to realize that Iran and the shia crescent were the actual beneficiaries of it’s Iraq regime change operation.

    Early, in the years following the invasion, it was Sunni elements in Iraq who were the main insurgent force. Meanwhile, as the US fought these groups, Shia forces consolidated their influence in Baghdad under US protection and in fact fought on the US side against these groups. It seems the neocons thought they could bring the Shia parties under their influence. But it turned out not to be so.

    As it dawned on US planners that Iraq was becoming an Iranian partner, the US reached out to it’s Sunni opposition and made an effort to “domesticate” the resistance. If I recall correctly, the initial groups were called Awakening Councils. These were Sunni groups that had realized that fighting the combined forces of the US and the Shia meant total destruction, and so made peace with Washington, and offered to be their “chaos” makers. In short, I would venture that much of the ISIS rank and file are young Iraqi sunnis who grew up facing intersectarian violence and want revenge against their Shia neighbors.

    What Mr Escobar is saying about sowing chaos in Afghanistan seems to me to have precedent in it’s Iraq strategy. In summary, Washington went on an imperial crusade in the middle east and central Asia, attempting to impose regimes under it’s influence. When this turned out to be impossible, it decided to play on regional divisions as a way of preventing other powers from capitalizing on it’s failures. The “mystery” of groups like ISIS is that they are pawns of the US, but in a purely opportunistic way. They are supported as a plan B or C, which helps explain why they are simultaneously supported materially while being demonized in propaganda.

    These policy twists really speak to the decline of Washington as a world power. Not only does it have to sow chaos among Sunni and Shia, but now in the case of Afghanistan, Sunni and Sunni. Anyone who sees anything progressive in US empire is not seeing straight. An empire that can only protect it’s influence by destroying is one whose time is truly over.

    • Agree: nokangaroos
  40. sardar says:
    @Mulga Mumblebrain

    [Daesh is the latest manifestation of US, Saudi, UK and Israeli created jihadism. As with other systems it has evolved, into ever more brutal and Evil ]

    You are right. I don’t know if you remember an article published long time ago by Ralf Peters by the title ‘Blood Borders: A Proposal To Redraw A “New Middle East”’ where suggested a new map of the greater Middle East. So far, the evil empire and the zionists have done a lot of killings using their terrorists like ISIS of all kind, but the project is not even near the end.
    Now, they are trying to partition the central Asians countries to create ‘Baluchistan’, like what they have done in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Sudan, Somalia and other places. Their agents of evil is ISIS-k where have many Bloch in addition to other ethnic groups.

    Pakistan’s southern province of Balochistan is widely projected to become a regional trade hub on account of the Chinese-funded China-Pakistan Economic Corridor. But the evil empire is using gullible people promising them an estate of their own, like the Kurds, to work for the west against the rest where is an empty promise and only stupid people trust these criminals.
    As we know the empire uses gullible people to help their expansionist policy and after their gain what they want using these gullible people, then they will kick them out and put their own trusted men.
    An example would be the case of Hussein in WWI. The McMahon–Hussein Correspondence that were exchanged during World War I shows that the Government of the United Kingdom agreed to recognize Arab independence after the war in exchange for the Sharif of Mecca launching the Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Empire to break up the Ottoman empire.
    But we know that Britain did not honor its promises.
    Furthermore, the promise that given to gullible terrorists in Libya that if they topple and massacre Qaddafi and his family for THEM, then they can have the power to rule Libya. We know that did not happen. The empire is trying to place its own ‘strongman’ Haftar instead. Hafter was working for Qaddafi in the army, then turned against him and became CIA agent and a US citizen.

    The empire and the zionists are waging wars to change the borders in many countries to bring their puppets like the Kurds on. All these pawns are willing to be engaged in terror. ISIS-K has special interest in killing shia like the evil empire and its extension the zionists.
    The following map shows how much more work these criminals have to do in order to achieve their goal. China, Russia, Pakistan and Iran should never allow the evil empire achieve its goals.

    • Replies: @antibeast
  41. anon[204] • Disclaimer says:
    @Adûnâi

    Dont BS. Israel is not the father of ISIS. USA and UK are .The duo forced Saudi to support and finance . They cajoled and provided false rosy hopes to Turkey . Israel took the advantage by inserting itself to further its geographical nest .That did not work.

  42. antibeast says:
    @sardar

    ISIS-K has special interest in killing Shia like the evil empire and its extension the zionists.

    That was the original plan of ISIS-K which was to destabilize Shiite Iran from their future base of Afghanistan after the expected US/NATO military defeat of the Taliban. But the triumph of the Taliban has thrown everything into disarray as the ISIS-K do not enjoy any support in Afghanistan.

    The Balochs are a different problem altogether as they are fighting for their own ethno-State, independent of Pakistan. But they comprise only 3% of Pakistan’s population, hardly an existential threat compared to the Pashtuns who comprise 15% of the same. That’s why Pakistan’s ISI actively nurtured and supported the Taliban because they wanted to ‘deracinate’ the Pashtuns on both sides of their border with Afghanistan by ‘Islamizing’ them. For this and other reasons, ISIS-K has no chance of succeeding in either Pakistan and Afghanistan, both of which are Sunni Islamic fundamentalist States.

    That begs the question: why should Sunni Muslims join ISIS-K in a fake ‘jihad’ against Islamic States?

  43. Jake Dee says:

    If Pepe Escobar is correct (and I think broadly speaking he is) then I just can’t see how ISIS-K can win this game, all the strategic calculations work out against them.
    Revolutionary guerilla movements (either Red flag communist or Black flag Islamist) have a patchy record but they can win if they have broad popular support. That means not only offering the people a better way of life but also showing them how it’s done. The Eurasianists, regardless of their religion are building pipelines, motorways, railways and airports, ISIS-K are blowing them up.
    It’s certainly easier to blow up a pipeline than to make one, but the tribe that has a pipeline, motorway etc. on their territory gets money and real resources from it everyday that it operates. The tribe that blows them up gets nothing. ISIS, ISIS-K and all the other flavors of Jihad (and the shadowy forces backing them) might give you and your cousin a Toyota Hi-Lux, but only if you then mount a heavy machine gun on it and use it to shoot up the local police station. You can’t use it to take your fruit and vegetables to market or your kids to school.
    The open and public American operations in Afghanistan have collapsed. Covert operations funded by Atlanticists to destabilize the region will only ever work if they remain covert, but there is essential work that needs to be done which can only ever be done by legitimate forces working out in the open.
    Eventually the builders will beat the wreckers.

  44. I translated this article into Russian and presented it on a similar forum
    https://aftershock.news/?q=node/1033794

  45. @Stan d Mute

    Because people younger than Boomers have done such a better job? Give it a rest.

  46. @Showmethereal

    I’m no fan of what the US empire has done in Afghanistan or most anywhere else. But it’s untenable to expect anyone to put his life at the mercy of a promise from the Taliban (or from the US government, either).

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  47. @Mulga Mumblebrain

    China and Russia together would have no problem wiping US bases in Syria and elsewhere in the Middle East and Central Asia off the map, quickly. Don’t want to see that happen to our soldiers, but they shouldn’t be there and they shouldn’t keep volunteering when they know they are merely paid murderers and aggressors these days.

  48. @sardar

    The point you make about ISIS-K targeting Shia is an important one. The Taliban were brutal toward Shia in their first go round… But they have decided it is important to be in good relations with Iran and have said they will protect Shia in Afghanistan. That is drawing them closer to Iran.

  49. @RadicalCenter

    That is true… But many did not leave. Many simply handed their weapons over. My contention was in calling them “nationalistic”. The ones that fled did so in most cases because they really had a reason to flee… Meaning they often were hated by locals for various offenses (extortion – bullying – thievery – rape). Those people would absolutely become targets because locals would want the Taliban to kill them… It is my contention that very few of them were every really pro western and very few would really want to still serve western interests by helping ISIS-K. Doesn’t mean some won’t – but a minority.

  50. Adûnâi says: • Website
    @The_MasterWang

    > “ISIS only attacked the enemies of the US. They said they would fight Israel AND Hamas. They didn’t.”

    This is such a stupid assertion, which I have seen constantly over in the moronic 4chan archives. Have you even seen the map of the Syrian civil war? ISIS were fighting both Damascus and Baghdad, two potent nation-states, while never having subdued the Kurds to the north. Why would the Caliph have opened a fourth front, even beyond the Jabal al-Druze stronghold (never subdued either)?

    I swear, Americans have not seen a single map in their lives. It’s fascinating. Israel to you is a word, not a country with borders and border guards.

    (I’m not denying that France-style terror attacks against Israel would have been possible. But then it’s a matter of political expediency. Again, history is not a morality tale. If ISIS was not storming the Golan, it doesn’t mean they were loving the Jews. Quite simple Realpolitik.)

  51. Sean says:
    @emersonreturn

    One of the biggest secrets that the materiel that WikiLeaks got from Manning revealed was what Alexander Cockburn in 2010 called “the complicity of Pakistan’s intelligence services with the Taliban”. Abbottabad is home to the Pakistani equivalent of West Point, which is where many retired Pakistani officers choose to live. It is also on end of a highway from China to Pakistan.

    You think Bin the most likely explanation is that bin Laden was living there for the climate, as would ring true were Jeffery Epstein to have escaped prison and years after a global manhunt failed to find him, he was f years later discovered to be living in Langley, Virginia? Nine eleven, deindistrialisation, Fentanyl and Covid-19: nothing good comes from China. If China is isolating the West then I say good, pity it didn’t happen sooner.

    • Agree: Johnny Rico
    • LOL: Showmethereal
    • Replies: @Showmethereal
    , @antibeast
  52. @Sean

    Everyone should know Pakistanis ISI ties to the Taliban. Recall that is how the US and Pakistan got friendly. India was friendly with Russia and so the US decided to work with Pakistan as a hedge against India and to use Pakistan as a training and funding ground (with the US friends in Saudi Arabia) for the mujahadeen to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan. The rest of what you wrote doesnt add up.

  53. antibeast says:
    @Sean

    Nine eleven, deindistrialisation, Fentanyl and Covid-19: nothing good comes from China. If China is isolating the West then I say good, pity it didn’t happen sooner.

    Here comes the American Psycho who can’t even spell ‘deindistrialisation’ [sic]. The Covid-19 pandemic was caused by the European strains not by the Wuhan strain which died out after flight bans took effect. 9-11 didn’t come from China nor did Fentanyl which was promoted by US firms such as Purdue Pharma.

    No, China is not ‘isolating’ [sic] the West but has been ‘decoupling’ from the US economy since the GFC in 2008. In fact, China signed an investment deal with the EU in 2020 for the simple reason that the Chinese wants to dump USD assets as they’ve lost all confidence in the US economy which is about to suffer from a catastrophic financial crisis.

    • Thanks: showmethereal
  54. Sean says:

    The Obama administration tried to get get China’s help with the war in Afghanistan. Why? Well China gave Pakistan the key technology for missiles including actual parts of one and China was likely who supplied the know how and wherewithal for Pakistan to build nuclear weapons. Pakistan is China’s key ally in Asia and China building a road to the town in Kashmir where the pakis had bin Laden was stashed; that just happened to be the LESS THAN A MILE from the Pakistani West Point in Abbottabad. The road from China terminates there because it is the centre of the Pakistani Deep State.

    . One of the Pakistani Air Force’s US-supplied F16’s three times attempted to lock on to the US helicopters (ie fire a missile at them) as they were escaping out of Abbottabad after killing bin Laden. It is simply ludicrous to suggest that Pakistan did not know bin Laden was there. His house was out of place and very close to an institution Pakistani intel would be careful to protect. the only time the Pakistan took on the (mainly Pashtun) Taliban was when they killed some Chinese workers.

    https://thewire.in/south-asia/pakistans-support-to-the-taliban-is-one-of-the-greatest-feats-of-covert-intelligence
    05/SEP/2021
    The presence of the Inter Services Intelligence chief in Kabul this week is an in-your-face reminder of Pakistan’s role in protecting and promoting the Afghan Taliban during the course of the latter’s war with the United States.

    Pakistan’s aim throughout was to use the Taliban as a proxy to curtail Indian influence in Afghanistan. and, circumstances permitting, to perhaps escalate violence in Kashmir. […] Pakistan’s 22-month long counterterrorism operations in North Waziristan were undertaken after 2014 far more seriously and were effective too, having killed some 3,400 militants. However, by that time their concerns were different. The fate of Afghanistan was sealed by then. In 2011 itself, Robert Gates had confirmed that the US was holding reconciliation talks with the Taliban; two agreements were signed in March-April 2012. This time, Pakistan knew that investments from China would not materialise if Chinese workers kept getting killed. […] From a purely professional angle, what Pakistan has achieved in Afghanistan today has to be regarded as one of the greatest feats of covert intelligence. If anyone deserves to celebrate the Taliban victory, it is surely the ISI.

    Wuhan was and probabally still is the place where Fentanyl was made for illegal sale in the US

    • Troll: Showmethereal
    • Replies: @antibeast
    , @Showmethereal
  55. antibeast says:
    @Sean

    You need to seek psychiatric treatment if you think China is somehow behind 9-11 because the Chinese built a road to someplace in Pakistan close to where Bin Laden was supposed to be hiding prior to his reported assassination by Obama’s highly publicized raid.

    While I agree that Pakistan’s ISI played the crucial role in supporting the Taliban, that is a Strawman argument in your attempt to link China to 9-11 which had nothing to do with Pakistan or the Taliban. The USA claimed that Osama Bin Laden was behind 9-11 but then President George Bush protected and escorted the Bin Laden family out of the USA right after that 9-11 which then served as the cassus belli for the War in Afghanistan.

    And for the nth time, the Wuhan strain did NOT cause the Covid-19 pandemic which was caused by the European strains arising in Bergamo, Italy three weeks AFTER flight bans were imposed on China in Jan. 31, 2020. Trump imposed flight bans on China the next day on Feb. 1, 2020. By March, the European strains reached the US East Coast which spread rapidly due to its D614G mutation making them 10x more infectious than the Wuhan strain.

    You’re flat out making things up regarding the origin of the Fentanyl epidemic in the USA which was caused by Purdue Pharma of the Sakler family who had to declare bankruptcy due to the lawsuits filed by the victims of the opioid crisis in the USA. The Chinese sellers took advantage of the opioid crisis by selling Fentanyl through online websites for a few years but that has come down as China has cracked down on those illicit trades.

    China decided to dump USD assets as early as 2014 when the Chinese stopped buying and began selling US T-bills. China also went on a buying spree abroad using its USD foreign reserves since then, investing in property, energy, manufacturing, infrastructure, farms, mines, etc. China is no longer allowing its tech startups to raise USD by selling their stock in the USA. Contrary to Trump/Navarro that China was allegedly ‘ripping off’ the USA, China has been moving away from the US market simce 2008. That’s why China launched the BRI and joined the RCEP in order to reduce its trade dependency on the USA by creating a pan-Asian market which is set to come online next year. That and the China-EU investment deal should serve to expand China’s trade with Asia and Europe, offsetting the decline with the USA.

  56. Sean says:

    Khalid Sheikh Mohammed made a money transfer to one of those involved in the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center and 1995 was linked to a plot to blow up multiple airliners over the Pacific.: Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was the 9/11 mastermind and On September 11, 2002, Pakistani Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) claimed to have killed Sheikh Mohammed during a raid in Karach that caught Ramzi bin al-Shibh, (the intermediary between Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and the 19 hijackers).This Pakistani claim was false

    .When finally caught a year later and two years after the attack he was found–stop me if you have heard this before-in Pakistan. It is absurd to claim that bin Laden could have been living where he was without the knowledge of the Pakistani military intelligence, or that the Pakistani generals would have been protecting bin Laden like that if the Chinese disapproved.

    • Agree: Johnny Rico
    • Replies: @Showmethereal
  57. @Sean

    Your last sentence is Complete and utter nonsense. Pakistan does not answer to China. Of course Pakistanit intelligence knew – but they dont take orders from China. In any event Their closest relationship is with the Saudis. You guys are desparate to start a war making nonsense comments like that.

  58. @Sean

    Ohhhh. Now it makes sense. You consume Indian media. How do those brainiacs claim F16’s attempted to lock on to the US helicopters but couldnt. That is about the dumbest thing they could have said in a fake story. Only they and US public are dumb enough to believe loud helicopters snuck into Pakistan near an army base – stayed there for 45 minutes and made it out and outran jets with their helicopters. It is actually pathetic they take peoples intelligence to be so low. Pakistani officials allowed the raid to happen. It allowed the US to save face. Even US journalists exposed it. It has nothing to do with China. Only pathetic Indian media and their perverse obsession with China could come up with that.

    • Replies: @Sean
  59. Sean says:
    @Showmethereal

    The mission was completely clandestine, and only went ahead because the SEALS used covert insertion helicopters with secret technology (which is why the Paki F16 could not get a lock on). Pakistanis gave the Chinese the wreckage of the special helicopter that crashed during the mission. I am sure it is just a coincidence that subsequently.

    In the immediate aftermath of the raid into Abbottabad (centre of the Pakistani Deep State/infrastructure juncture of the Sino-Paki alliance) China openly warned the US to respect Pakistans independence, just in case people in the US were put off funding the Pakistani military, which is a way the US subsidises a Chinese asset that can be used against India. Another obvious motive for China to encourage Pakistan to hide bin Laden is that forced the US into ongoing official cooperation with China; wittiness Obama’s appeals to China to help with getting Pakistan to do more against the Taliban. The only time the Pakis did anything against the Waziristan militants (Bin Laden’s very big and high security house was known as the ‘Waziristan Mansion’ among locals) happened after the insurgents killed some Chinese workers, then there was a major offensive that Pakistan did no bother to inform the US about.

    • Thanks: Johnny Rico
  60. @Sean

    Lololol. You read too many spy novels (and Indian media)..
    The only thing you got right is China getting access to piece of the wreckage (because there are indeed some in the Pakistani intellligence and military who despise havimg to work with the west).
    Again there is nothing clandestine about flying helicopters hundreds of kilometers into a quiet village. You would hear them in the middle of Bangkok or Brooklyn. Not even Airwolf from the fantasy tv show could pretend to be that quiet. So yeah to top it off as you noted one of them exploded while trying to land and it still took 30 minutes for Pakistan authorities to respond. The scary thing is you dont get how ridiculous that sounds. If they were that incompetent Balochistan would be an independent state and India would have taken away Kashmir. Its pretty sad you can be so gullible.
    And of course China would state the US should respect Pakistani sovereignty… Pakistan does not need tell China about things it does with the Saudis and US since China respects Pakistan as being sovereign. But China isnt stupid… They would of course be able to figure out whay really happened…

  61. Sean says:

    You read too many spy novels (and Indian media).

    I read geopolitics. If India called out all their reserves, they would have a force comparable to the entire population of Pakistan. America would not help Pakistan against India and Saudis couldn’t. Anyway the Saudi got very little for any money they gave the Taliban, who are Pashtun supremacist Deobandi not Wahhabi.

    Bin Laden knew nothing of the Taliban , which had came into being after he left Afghanistan where he saw a little action against the Soviets). On being forced out of Sudan went to Afghanistan and was sheltered by an old Mujahidin in the Khyber Pass area where Pakistani intelligence was active. In 1996 the Taliban took over that area and informed the head of Saudi intelligence Prince Turki that bin Laden was there and undertook to see he didn’t make trouble Bin Laden’s camps trained many of who were dispatched to fight in Kashmir (Pakistan’s geopolitically imperative to combine into a single front with China yet again).

    After some of his men were caught with weapons intended for terrorism in Saudi Arabia Prince Turki went to Kandahar along with an Islamic scholar to see the Taliban leadership , who agreed in principle to hand over bin Laden and in return got a lot of trucks which they used to finally conquer the Shia stronghold of Maza-alSarif). Two weeks later came the Embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania. which were enthusiastically received by the occupants of Kandahar, which Mullah Omar rarely left. Turki went back to Kandahar along with general Naseem Rama , head of Pakistani military intel and the main money man for the Taliban. This proves that the Saudis had zero influence over the Taliban of pakistan as regards bin Laden.

    https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics-and-nation/china-asks-us-to-respect-paks-sovereignty-independence/articleshow/8454577.cms?from=mdr BEIJING/ISLAMABAD: China on Thursday said the international community “must respect” Pakistan’s sovereignty, tacitly confirming reports that it has asked the US not to violate Islamabad’s territorial integrity, following the killing of Osama bin Laden.

    Asked about reports that China has asked US during its recently concluded strategic dialogue with Washington to respect Pakistan’s sovereignty as Islamabad came under heavy pressure after bin Laden’s killing, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson, Jiang Yu told media here that “sovereignty and territorial integrity of Pakistan must be respected.”

    If “Pakistan does not need to tell China about things it does with the Saudis” and China did not know about bin Laden then it is strange that China was willing to openly support Pakistan over them habouring bin Laden and bleeding America in Afghanistan. It is no secret that China is now going to have access to Afghanistan’s natural resources including rare earth elements ores, which China is already dominants in the refining of.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  62. @Sean

    I am looking forward to watching this this weekend. At the AMC Loews Theatre on Boston Common next to Chinatown. It will be interesting to see how many Chinese are in these early showings compared to Dune and James Bond. This theatre opens a new first run Chinese flick almost every week.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Battle_at_Lake_Changjin

    What are the chances Trevor Lynch reviews it here on UNZ?

    • Replies: @Sean
  63. @Sean

    You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about because you read Indian media. The fact is the US supported Pakistan for decades because India was a Soviet ally. That is a fact. Indians don’t want to admit it now because they want to erase that history so they can swoon over the Anglos as they abandon their Russian friendship.

    If you think the Saudis had no influence with Pakistan and the Taliban then you should just stop posting. Indian media has gotten you completely looney. Saudis funded and even send teachers to all the madrassas in Pakistan that churned out all the jihadis. Bin Laden got to be hosted in Afghanistan in the first place because of Saudi influence. It was the Saudis who along with the US were the ones funding the mujahadeen to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan. If you don’t understand these things then quit… Indian news has greatly confused you from reality.

  64. Sean says:

    Saudis funded and even send teachers to all the madrassas in Pakistan that churned out all the jihadis.

    First of all the ‘Taliban’ was merely a name chosen to suggest piety. When Prince Turki met the leadership of the Taliban they were all missing body parts; these were combat soldiers from the war against the USSR by run by Pakistan. India attempted to be nonaligned but Soviet influence in Afghanistan is what kept China and Pakistan from linking up. India is too big for Pakistan and China gave Pakistan the wherewithal for building nuclear missiles. Hence China is the only protector of Pakistan against India. Secondly, the leadership of the Taliban are of a completely different religious school of though to the House of Saud; for example Mullah Omar donning the alleged cloak of the prophet is something Saudi would regard as idolatry. China wished to non-confrontationally very subtly use proxies in regional geopolitics so as to Byzantinely keep the US focused on regional terrorism as the big problem and target while venal American economic elites held the country down to be subjected to Sino-economic rape.

    The US was bled by Pakistan and its Chinese puppetmaster (proven by the only time Pakistan did anything drastic against the Taliban insurgents was when they killed Chinese workers) and China was the beneficiary. The Chinese strategists are heartbroken that now America is no longer engaged in Afghanistan they will come to understand, ever more deeply, that it has been China all along (as it was in Korea and Vietnam). President Trump’s ordering of a withdrawal from Afghanistan was his great masterstroke, a historic watershed in perceptions of China from being an ally against Russia to the focus of evil in the modern world, complete with racist concentration camps.

    • Replies: @Showmethereal
  65. @Sean

    Wow.. You have really gone off the deep end and drowned in Indian media. Carry on then.. Little hope for you then.

  66. Sean says:
    @Johnny Rico

    We Were Soldiers (mentioned in your link) is interesting because the Vietnam war battle it depict was played up to obscure a terrible beating in an ambush that an another unit had walked into just before that. While it was hardly The Five man Army, Chinese troops were far fewer in number at Changlin than the US ever admitted. The myth of human waves attacks was created to explain how the Chinese troops dispatched at extreme short notice without proper equipment or even warm clothing defeated the ill advised US invasion of North Korea. Though it was supposed to be all MacArthur’s doing, in actuality there was a consensus that the USSR would not cause trouble and Red China was seen as being completely without agency. It still isn’t. Does it even matter if they intend all these nasty surprises they keep springing? Rely on it, the pandemic is not the last or worst of them.

    • Thanks: Johnny Rico
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