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9/9 and 9/11, 20 Years Later
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Massoud leaving Bazarak in the Panjshir after our interview in August 2001, roughly three weeks before his assassination. Photo: Pepe Escobar

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It’s impossible not to start with the latest tremor in a series of stunning geopolitical earthquakes.

Exactly 20 years after 9/11 and the subsequent onset of the Global War on Terror (GWOT), the Taliban will hold a ceremony in Kabul to celebrate their victory in that misguided Forever War.

Four key exponents of Eurasia integration – China, Russia, Iran and Pakistan – as well as Turkey and Qatar, will be officially represented, witnessing the official return of the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan. As blowbacks go, this one is nothing short of intergalactic.

The plot thickens when we have Taliban spokesman Zabihullah Mujahid firmly stressing “there is no proof” Osama bin Laden was involved in 9/11. So “there was no justification for war, it was an excuse for war,” he claimed.

Only a few days after 9/11, Osama bin Laden, never publicity-shy, released a statement to Al Jazeera: “I would like to assure the world that I did not plan the recent attacks, which seems to have been planned by people for personal reasons (…) I have been living in the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan and following its leaders’ rules. The current leader does not allow me to exercise such operations.”

On September 28, Osama bin Laden was interviewed by the Urdu newspaper Karachi Ummat. I remember it well, as I was commuting non-stop between Islamabad and Peshawar, and my colleague Saleem Shahzad, in Karachi, called it to my attention.

Saudi-born alleged terror mastermind Osama bin Laden in a video taken ‘recently’ at a secret site in Afghanistan. This was aired by Al Jazeera on October 7, 2001, the day the US launched retaliatory bombing of terrorist camps, airbases and air defense installations in the first stage of its campaign against the Taliban regime for sheltering bin Laden. Photo: AFP / Al Jazeera screen grab
Saudi-born alleged terror mastermind Osama bin Laden in a video taken ‘recently’ at a secret site in Afghanistan. This was aired by Al Jazeera on October 7, 2001, the day the US launched retaliatory bombing of terrorist camps, airbases and air defense installations in the first stage of its campaign against the Taliban regime for sheltering bin Laden. Photo: AFP / Al Jazeera screen grab

This is an approximate translation by the CIA-linked Foreign Broadcast Information Service: “I have already said that I am not involved in the 11 September attacks in the United States. As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. Neither I had any knowledge of these attacks nor I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people.

“I have already said that we are against the American system, not against its people, whereas in these attacks, the common American people have been killed. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; the people who are a part of the US system, but are dissenting against it.

“Or those who are working for some other system; persons who want to make the present century as a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity so that their own civilization, nation, country or ideology could survive. Then there are intelligence agencies in the US, which require billions of dollars worth of funds from the Congress and the government every year (…) They need an enemy.”

This was the last time Osama bin Laden went public, substantially, about his alleged role in 9/11. Afterward, he vanished, and seemingly forever by early December 2001 in Tora Bora: I was there, and revisited the full context years later.

And yet, like an Islamic James Bond, Osama kept performing the miracle of dying another day, over and over again, starting in – where else – Tora Bora in mid-December, as reported by the Pakistani Observer and then Fox News.

So 9/11 remained a riddle inside an enigma. And what about 9/9, which might have been the prologue to 9/11?

Arriving in the Panjshir valley in one of Massoud’s Soviet helicopters in August 2001. Photo: Pepe Escobar
Arriving in the Panjshir valley in one of Massoud’s Soviet helicopters in August 2001. Photo: Pepe Escobar

A green light from a blind sheikh

“The commander has been shot.”

The terse email, on 9/9, offered no details. Contacting the Panjshir was impossible – sat-phone reception is spotty. Only the next day it was possible to establish Ahmad Shah Massoud, the legendary Lion of the Panjshir, had been assassinated – by two al-Qaeda jihadis posing as a camera crew.

In our Asia Times interview with Massoud, by August 20, he had told me he was fighting a triad: al-Qaeda, the Taliban and the Pakistani ISI. After the interview, he left in a Land Cruiser and then went by helicopter to Kwaja-Bahauddin, where he would finish the details of a counter-offensive against the Taliban.

This was his second-to-last interview before the assassination and arguably the last images – shot by photographer Jason Florio and with my mini-DV camera – of Massoud alive.

One year after the assassination, I was back in the Panjshir for an on-site investigation, relying only on local sources and confirmation on some details from Peshawar. The investigation is featured in the first part of my Asia Times e-book Forever Wars.

The conclusion was that the green light for the fake camera crew to meet Massoud came via a letter sponsored by CIA crypto-asset warlord Abdul Rasul Sayyaf – as a “gift” to al-Qaeda.

In December 2020, inestimable Canadian diplomat Peter Dale Scott, author among others of the seminal The Road to 9/11 (2007), and Aaron Good, editor at CovertAction magazine, published a remarkable investigation about the killing of Massoud, following a different trail and relying mostly on American sources.

They established that arguably more than Sayyaf, the mastermind of the killing was notorious Egyptian blind sheik Omar Abdel Rahman, then serving a life sentence in a US federal prison for his involvement in the first World Trade Center bombing in 1993.

Among other nuggets, Dale Scott and Good also confirmed what former Pakistani foreign minister Niaz Naik had told Pakistani media already in 2001: the Americans had everything in place to attack Afghanistan way before 9/11.

In Naik’s words: “We asked them [the American delegates], when do you think you will attack Afghanistan? … And they said, before the snow falls in Kabul. That means September, October, something like that.”

As many of us established over the years after 9/11, everything was about the US imposing itself as the undisputed ruler of the New Great Game in Central Asia. Peter Dale Scott now notes, “the two US invasions of Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq in 2003 were both grounded in pretexts that were doubtful to begin with and more discredited as years go by.

“Underlying both wars was America’s perceived need to control the fossil fuel economic system that was the underpinning for the US petrodollar.”

Deceased Taliban founder Mullah Mohammed Omar in a file photo. Photo: Wikimedia
Deceased Taliban founder Mullah Mohammed Omar in a file photo. Photo: Wikimedia

Massoud versus Mullah Omar

Mullah Omar did welcome Jihad Inc to Afghanistan in the late 1990s: not only the al-Qaeda Arabs but also Uzbeks, Chechens, Indonesians, Yemenis – some of them I met in Massoud’s riverside prison in the Panjshir in August 2001.

The Taliban at the time did provide them with bases – and some encouraging rhetoric – but deeply ethnocentric as they were, never manifested any interest in global jihad, in the mold of the “Declaration of Jihad” issued by Osama in 1996.

ORDER IT NOW

The official Taliban position was that jihad was their guests’ business, and that had nothing to do with the Taliban and Afghanistan. There were virtually no Afghans in Jihad Inc. Very few Afghans speak Arabic. They were not seduced by the spin on martyrdom and a paradise full of virgins: they preferred to be a ghazi – a living victor in a jihad.

Mullah Omar could not possibly send Osama bin Laden packing because of Pashtunwali – the Pashtun code of honor – where the notion of hospitality is sacred. When 9/11 happened, Mullah Omar once again refused American threats as well as Pakistani pleas. He then called a tribal jirga of 300 top mullahs to ratify his position.

Their verdict was quite nuanced: he had to protect his guest, of course, but a guest should not cause him problems. Thus Osama would have to leave, voluntarily.

The Taliban also pursued a parallel track, asking the Americans for evidence of Osama’s culpability. None was provided. The decision to bomb and invade had already been taken.

That would have never been possible with Massoud alive. A classic intellectual warrior, he was a certified Afghan nationalist and pop hero – because of his spectacular military feats in the anti-USSR jihad and his non-stop fight against the Taliban.

Jihadis captured by Massoud’s forces in a riverside prison in the Panjshir in August 2001. Photo: Pepe Escobar
Jihadis captured by Massoud’s forces in a riverside prison in the Panjshir in August 2001. Photo: Pepe Escobar

When the PDPA socialist government in Afghanistan collapsed three years after the end of the jihad, in 1992, Massoud could easily have become a prime minister or an absolute ruler in the old Turco-Persian style.

But then he made a terrible mistake: afraid of an ethnic conflagration, he let the mujahideen gang based in Peshawar have too much power, and that led to the civil war of 1992-1995 – complete with the merciless bombing of Kabul by virtually every faction – that paved the way for the emergence of the “law and order” Taliban.

So in the end he was a much more effective military commander than politician. An example is what happened in 1996, when the Taliban made their move to conquer Kabul, attacking from eastern Afghanistan.

Massoud was caught completely unprepared, but he still managed to retreat to the Panjshir without a major battle and without losing his troops – quite a feat – while severely smashing the Taliban that went after him.

He established a line of defense in the Shomali plain north of Kabul. That was the frontline I visited a few weeks before 9/11, on the way to Bagram, which was a – virtually empty and degraded – Northern Alliance airbase at the time.

All of the above is a sorry contrast to the role of Masoud Jr, who’s in theory the leader of the “resistance” against Taliban 2.0 in the Panjshir, now completely smashed.

Masoud Jr has zero experience either as a military commander or politician, and although praised in Paris by President Macron or publishing an op-ed in Western mainstream media, made the terrible mistake of being led by CIA asset Amrullah Saleh, who as the former head of the National Directory of Security (NDS), supervised the de facto Afghan death squads.

Masoud Jr could have easily carved a role for himself in a Taliban 2.0 government. But he blew it, refusing serious negotiations with a delegation of 40 Islamic clerics sent to the Panjshir, and demanding at least 30% of posts in the government.

In the end, Saleh fled by helicopter – he may be now in Tashkent – and Masoud Jr as it stands is holed up somewhere in the northern Panjshir.

In this file photo taken on September 11, 2001, a hijacked commercial aircraft approaches the twin towers of the World Trade Center shortly before crashing into the landmark skyscraper in New York. Photo: AFP / Seth McAllister
In this file photo taken on September 11, 2001, a hijacked commercial aircraft approaches the twin towers of the World Trade Center shortly before crashing into the landmark skyscraper in New York. Photo: AFP / Seth McAllister

The 9/11 propaganda machine is about to reach fever pitch this Saturday – now profiting from the narrative twist of the “terrorist” Taliban back in power, something perfect to snuff out the utter humiliation of the Empire of Chaos.

The Deep State is going no holds barred to protect the official narrative – which exhibits more holes than the dark side of the moon.

This is a geopolitical Ouroboros for the ages. 9/11 used to be the foundation myth of the 21st century – but not anymore. It has been displaced by blowback: the imperial debacle allowing for the return of the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan to the exact position it was 20 years ago.

We may now know that the Taliban had nothing to do with 9/11. We may now know that Osama bin Laden, in an Afghan cave, may not have been the master perpetrator of 9/11. We may now know that the assassination of Massoud was a prelude to 9/11, but in a twisted way: to facilitate a pre-planned invasion of Afghanistan.

And yet, like with the assassination of JFK, we may never know the full contours of the whole riddle inside an enigma. As Fitzgerald immortalized, “so we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past,” probing like mad this philosophical and existential Ground Zero, never ceasing from asking the ultimate question: Cui Bono?

(Republished from Asia Times by permission of author or representative)
 
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  1. It seems like a time now far away. Like those old videos of Kennedy or Nixon.

  2. The biggest reason to believe the US is hiding something is that – whether Osama was guilty or not… Why not provide the Taliban with evidence? Why not use special forces in the 1st place – which is how they say they got Osama in Pakistan anyhow… So why invade a whole country?
    Well you reap what you sow…

    • Agree: Jett Rucker
  3. @showmethereal

    “So why invade a whole country?”

    1.) MIC profits

    2.) Poppies (CIA spooks love flowers, you know)

    3.) Israel (Afghanistan borders Iran)

    4.) Mineral wealth (or so the story goes)

    5.) Oil/gas pipelines (future)

    • Replies: @Showmethereal
  4. Another point of interest is that the American FBI never sought bin Laden for the 9-11 attacks, just for two embassy attacks in Africa.

    [MORE]

  5. BBC broadcast Building 7 collapsing one half an hour before it fell ——and then the one time interview with Fire Chief was “We decided to Pull it !” and what was good for 7 was likewise good for 1 and 2 and then for Don Rumsfeld to declare war on Afghanistan and refusing to negotiate with the then Afgan government which was the Taliban—-20 years later and 2.9 trillion spent –_Afghanistan is again led by ——the Taliban. And you believe pro wrestling is rigged or real?

    • Replies: @Kit Walker
  6. The only reason to use ground forces against a defenseless people in today’s age of global satellite cameras and CIA ground informants is to flex the MIC money machines that would follow with unimaginable wealth, resulting in vast resources being expended for the benefit of globalists hellbent on using scorched earth tactics to prove they have bigger dicks in total failures.

    • Agree: Half Back
    • Replies: @Monty Ahwazi
  7. GMC says:
    @showmethereal

    They never supply evidence or want any back – ask Russia, China, Iran Syria and the rest of the countries America attacks. Hell, ask half the people in US prisons or better yet , look at all the Honest Evidence that the 9/11 re-investigation movement of architects, engineers and others have presented the Southern Judicial district of New York. !. The Jewish Empire doesn’t need to supply No Stinkin – Evidence – and when it gets legit evidence in return, they throw it in the trash.

    • Agree: Half Back
    • Replies: @Maddaugh
  8. The Ummat interview with Bin Laden clearly conflicts with his own past statements. In 1998 he told John Miller:

    “We do not have to differentiate between military and civilian. As far as we are concerned, they are all targets, and this is what the fatwah says…”

    But when speaking with Ummat he claimed:

    “Islam does not allow killing of innocent people, men, women, and children even in the event of war.”

    These statements are obviously contradictory. Hamid Mir even reported to Peter Bergen that Bin Laden admitted everything privately but simply did not want any public statement on record.

    It’s true enough that the whole war in Afghanistan should have seemed unnecessary after Osama was allegedly finally caught and killed in Pakistan. Given some of the stories which circulated in late 2001 about Osama supposedly dying one has to wonder if maybe that 2011 “killing of Bin Laden” may have been just a fake story rigged up to dispose of the issue. Either way, it’s obvious that the entire 1st decade (never mind the 2nd) of occupying Afghanistan didn’t have much to do with capturing Bin Laden.

    Still, it’s an error to treat those early post-911 statements by Bin Laden as if they were evidence that he had not been behind 911. Whatever else one may think was going on on 911, the comments by Bin Laden where he disclaimed responsibility are easily accounted for without assuming his innocence.

    • Replies: @Phil4Phil
  9. Paladin says:

    “Neither I had any knowledge of these attacks nor I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people.” Uh, excuse me, but…

    • Replies: @peterrabbit
    , @Observator
  10. A curious question.
    Somewhere there was a mention that a system was being developed in the United States to intercept the control of a civilian aircraft and turn it into something controlled like a drone. Perhaps all this was done using this system.

    • Replies: @Carlo
    , @Rev. Spooner
  11. Sarah says:

    Warmongers and warprofiteers revolt me.
    Billionaires, philantropists, psychopaths, NGOs, sociopaths, politicians, ready to exterminate millions of people to become even richer, disgust me to the core.
    I totally sides victims.
    I am amazed to see, while they have just left Afghanistan yet, they are already preparing the next war.

    Probably Iran and Lebanon.
    And also China :
    – they are preparing to use the South-Koreans, Japanese and maybe Taiwaneses as cannon fodder.
    – South-Korea : they “allowed” (translate “forced”) South Korea to have missiles capable of reaching China : so it will be the South-Koreans who will be massacred and not the US,
    – South Korea is considering the draft of women, which will double the mass of cannon fodder, coincidentally at the same time as the US legalized it.

  12. Franz says:
    @Si1ver1ock

    It seems like a time now far away. Like those old videos of Kennedy or Nixon.

    That’s about where my thinking is.

    It’s gone to “The Twin Towers and All That” just like 1066. The “winners” of 911 left the building with barrels of loot and lots of time to spend it ages ago. They need never care of the lives lost or blighted, because folks like us aren’t human in their eyes anyway. No.

    The same magic bullet that killed Jack Kennedy never stopped; it’s entered folklore as the weapon of choice for magicians who own TV and intelligence networks. Those two can accomplish anything, including fo0ling their true believers into thinking there is no one behind the curtain. Things just happen. Then things get worse. Your friends get dead. Prices go up. There is no exit.

    • Replies: @Daniel Rich
  13. All of the above is a sorry contrast to the role of Masoud Jr, who’s in theory the leader of the “resistance” against Taliban 2.0 in the Panjshir, now completely smashed.

    There is no evidence of this. The author is doing precisely what he accuses the US of. Afghanistan has descended back to its historic state. The men either fight some invader, or they fight each other.

    • Agree: Johnny Rico
  14. @showmethereal

    Why not provide the Taliban with evidence?

    Because there wasn’t any.

  15. Hell, even the Lion of the Valley of Five Lions (Panjshir) knew it was the Al Qaeda, the Taliban and the Pakistani ISI that was dangerous to the health of his beloved nation and there you are promoting bogus alliance of China and Pakistan with Shite Iran and orthodox Russia… it’s a pipe dream!

  16. “They were not seduced by the spin on martyrdom and a paradise full of virgins: they preferred to be a ghazi – a living victor in a jihad.”

    Leave the false promise of a paradise full of virgins for the moronic Pakis, though those “braves” were used as servants to cook and clean by the afro-semitic Arabs in the ISIS gangs in Iraq… once an “untouchable”, always an untouchable!

  17. @Paladin

    Yes. You are right. There is no law forbidding causing harm to innocent women, children, and other people.

  18. anon6541 says:

    Two people rejected Iran’s hand and both of them died before achieving their objectives

    1- Yasser Arafat
    After the Islamic revolution Iranians took over the Israeli embassy and offered it to PLO. Arafat, the beggar that he was, had really nice things to say about Iran while in Iran.But he then went to Iraq and announced his alliance with Saddam- because he was a Sunni, an Arab, and would finance PLO’s suicide missions.
    In that meeting, there were people from Lebanon as well. The Lebanese accepted Iranian offer and went on to form the Hezbollah.
    To PLO, Hezbollah was a joke at the time. Look at them both now.

    2- Ahmad Masood
    Qaseem Soleimani visited Masood in Afghanistan and invited him to join their movement. Soleimani was a pan-Islamist while Masood an ethnic leader although he saw himself as an Islamist as well and always prayed how he would go to Palestine after the jihad in Afg was over.
    Soleimani saw through this and returned empty handed to Iran.
    Masood who was the strongest commander in Afghanistan was reduced to few valleys here a mountain there. Masood was also a fanatic Sunni which did not set very well with Soleimani.

    moral of the story: only friends of Iran have been successful.

    • Thanks: Mevashir
  19. We must never forget the mantras intended to mask our egregious lies invariably tagged to our criminal forever wars: we promote democracy, human rights, are a force for good and the rule of law. It is part of an attack on the intelligence (better yet the lack thereof) of what must rank as the most gullible people on earth. Yet our leadership boasts of the largest collection of war criminals and cowards post-WWII. Cowards because not one of such leaders have had the balls to stand up to our Jewish puppeteers.

    • Agree: Druid55
  20. GMC says:
    @Sarah

    I tried to answer your question on 9/11 20 years ago article – its pretty accurate and short.

  21. @Paladin

    The biggest problem with interpreting the Koran is that it constantly contradicts itself, just like the Jewish and Christian Scriptures that partly inspired it. The Suras most quoted by modern anti-Islamists are 8:39 and 9:5, which command the killing of nonbelievers and polytheists, respectively. Yet the next verse, 9:6, praises those who offer them asylum from persecution! In 5:13, Allah himself commands his followers to “pardon them [nonbelievers] and turn away”, and this command is repeated verbatim in 7:199. In perfect contradiction, Suras 4:56, 4:91, and 2:191-94 all authorize mass killing. In contrast, the rather famous Sura 5:32 (often quoted by those attempting to defuse Islamophobia) states that killing a single man is the same as killing all men.

    Sura 5:51 forbids having Jews and Christians as friends, but 5:5 allows followers to marry a woman of either faith. 49:10 proclaims the brotherhood of all believers; 29:46 proposes respectful debate with them on theological questions, while 4:91 recommends “hunting down” those who do not believe. Sura 9:30 contains prayers for the extermination of Christians and Jews, while 9:71 says that they, with Muslims, are “people of the book” and are obliged to guard one another’s freedom. Similarly in 4:80 Allah announces tolerance to non-Moslems by saying “We have not sent you as a keeper over them” and in 2:256 He disingenuously asserts “There is no compulsion in religion”.

    I would suggest there is no consistency, and precious little decency, in the Abrahamic religions.

  22. Maddaugh says:

    That one said this. This one said that. He say, she say, I heard, I was told……………….. !!

    I am convinced Osama did it. The man was a genius. Hiding in a remote cave accessible only by goats, using homing pigeons, WW2 walkie talkies and satellite phones that worked only when Mars and Jupiter aligned and of course subject to eavesdropping, logistics using mules and junk pickups/ motorbikes the guy managed to fool every intelligence agency in the world and execute a highly complex operation in New York.

    Just think of the expertise he harnessed. Guys who could barely fly a Cessna flew commercial jets putting them into turns that would tear the wings off, hijacking 3 planes with Dollar Store box cutters. Shit, Osama was so thorough he even made crashed planes disappear. Poooooooofff !!

    That is why he had to die several times, the final time resulting in his body being thrown to the sharks. In a final twist of genius, Osama had even planned for the Seal Team that killed him to be killed in turn.Poor fellow though, he will never be considered a martyr nor get 30 virgins to boff in Paradise.

    UR readers need to accept the assignment of the responsibility and blame for this atrocity. Our government said that is the way it happened and they never lie so stop with all these silly conspiracy theories and he say she say claptrap.

    • Thanks: Druid55
    • Replies: @showmethereal
  23. • Agree: frontier
    • Thanks: Agent76
    • Replies: @Druid55
  24. Maddaugh says:
    @GMC

    Jewish Empire doesn’t need to supply No Stinkin – Evidence – and when it gets legit evidence in return, they throw it in the trash.

    Is that before or after they wipe their ass with it ?

  25. anonymous[139] • Disclaimer says:

    On the anniversary of 9/11 there’ll be an outpouring of tear-jerker narrative about it, exploiting people’s emotions to guide them along the approved narrative of what took place. How some people who couldn’t master flying small propeller planes could later fly jumbo jets like stunt pilots including into the Pentagon at ground level, or how two planes could collapse three buildings, won’t be addressed. The whole story unravels the more one looks into it. Apparently that’s all right with a large part of the American public many of whom don’t even know that WTC 7 collapsed. No mention will be made of all the people who have died, turned into destitute refugees, been orphaned or crippled, etc, by the supposed war on terror. Not that many Americans care anyway; they’re all goat herders on the other side of the world that nobody thinks twice about. The rah-rah flag waving will just be a part of blinding the public to the reality of what’s taken place and what’s going to take place.

  26. anon6541 says:

    @ Maddaugh

    As Bob Marley put it

    You can fool some people sometimes
    But you cant fool all the people all the time.

    relax…and unclinch your a-hole.

    • Replies: @Maddaugh
  27. Phil4Phil says:
    @Patrick McNally

    I would call bin Laden’s statements strong evidence of his innocence. The logic of terrorism is to take credit for an attack, not to deny it.

    Besides, why would someone organize the most successful terrorist attack in history — no mean feat –and then deny participation?

    What is more interesting is that while bin Laden, in his original statement, said that killing innocents was forbidden, he praised those who had made the attacks — but always talking about them as other people, not himself.

  28. Carlo says:
    @Mike_from_Russia

    This is simply impossible from a technical point of view. You would need to have a dedicated transmissor/receptor connected to the flight controls of the plane, and no civilian aircraft has this. Flight controls in most airplanes (except, obviously, drones) are a closed system with no outside access.

    • Replies: @SS-The Independent
  29. Yee says:

    A Half Naked Fakir,

    “and there you are promoting bogus alliance of China and Pakistan with Shite Iran and orthodox Russia… it’s a pipe dream!”

    No more ridiculous than the US, Oz, Japan and India alliance…

  30. anon[369] • Disclaimer says:

    Preplanned: Afghanistan, Iraq, NYC. Not sure when anthrax attacks conceived.

    9-11 was an ambitious program same as this Sars-Cov-2/Covid 19, Vaxxines.
    Both bum rushed the citizens before a thought could appear.

    Those behind our visible puppet leaders (bus, govt) will rule
    at the very least the Zionized West.

    Unless truck drivers, others relearn use of a crow bar.

    5 dancing shlomos

  31. @Mike_from_Russia

    With the inept and inexperienced pilots who never learned to land, I also think that the planes were remotely controlled.

  32. From my files:

    {As documented immediately below, I was the only analyst on Earth on the day of the event itself correctly, publicly and in print to identify the perpetrators of the WTC Stunt aka JLS–911 [Jewish Lightning Strike].

    [MORE]

    Exhibit A =
    http://tinyurl.com/y243tdr
    From:
    Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 19:48:38 GMT
    Local: Tues, Sep 11 2001 12:48 pm
    Subject: “R” Is For Ram: NY-DCR — _Cui Bono_ ?

    Exhibit B =
    http://tinyurl.com/y7gepo3q
    From: womack – view profile
    Date: Sat, Oct 20 2001 12:55 pm
    Groups: talk.politics.mideast, talk.politics.misc,
    soc.culture.african.american, soc.culture.usa, soc.culture.palestine,
    alt.politics.greens, alt.politics.bush , alt.politics.radical-left
    PSST, PASS THE WORD:
    THE JEWS DID IT !
    By Hal Womack 3-dan
    [snip]

    {The sole public benefit of JLS*–911 [*=“Jewish Lightning Strike”] has been that the backflash of that notorious stunt’s comparative crudity at last lit up lit up for us the NAGIM** [** = Normal, Alias “Gentile”, IMmensity] the grim character of the Dallas Jack Whack 38 years earlier as having been the all-time biggest kosher coup d’etat.}
    ………………………………………………………………………..

    How to save our world from the Jews?

    Answer: First, the diligent student will begin by getting a firm grip on the 7 week time period of 8 July – 26 August 2014 and then on the date of Tuesday 3 March 2015. The earlier segment = GM’14 or the Gaza Massacre in which the high-tech Jew military murdered some 2,300 victims, including about 550 children (under 18 years), helpless prisoners all. The later occasion was Israeli P.M. Benjamin Netanyahu’s quasi-divine appearance before a Joint Session of the U.S. Congress, his third such. The American top politicians then gave him 28 standing ovations and the promise –since amplified– of an extra \$38,000,000,000 [thirty-eight billion U.S. dollars] in tribute to the Jew State.

    The official title of USGov can thus be rendered in plain English as JAR for “JewAmerican Regime” or for international perspectives as JAPE for –“Planetary Empire”. Can we the NAGIM [Normal, Alias “Gentile”, IMmensity] now agree to arrest at the very least JAPE’s top ten thousand balebatim for war crimes? Then we will send them to purpose-built prisons located near the sites of their main atrocities. AFTOC = “After a Fair Trial, Of Course”.

    “Think Big”, as they say Back East in my native Texas, eh what?

    • Agree: Justrambling
  33. frontier says:
    @Si1ver1ock

    It seems like a time now far away

    Not for me. I remember distinctly reading about Massoud assassination and the media tone was nothing short of contained jubilation, I knew he was betrayed.

    Otherwise, another weak article by Pepe Escobar. Yes, Massoud was betrayed but he was no “classic intellectual warrior” he was a pawn anyway and he was dispensed with in accordance with the main political objective. This is where Escobar failed – this was not a “war on terror”, nor was it a war for MIC enrichment, oil or minerals. In reality, the war was for something quite simple that was lost in Syria after the Russian intervention. After that, the grand chess game was redundant and so was the Afghan war. Judging by the current troop deployments, the dream is still alive, time will tell how justified that is.

  34. The supposed mastermind of 9/11, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is still in Gitmo and his trial is hobbled by the fact that the US really doesn’t want the facts to see the light of day.

    Same with the Epstein secret video blackmail evidence.

    Same with the evidence that ISIS in Syria was birthed by Western intelligence, supported by Gulf State Arabs, and sold oil through NATO member Turkey.

    As long as counter-narratives don’t appear in the journals of record or wikipedia, fake stories are treated as truth.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  35. Hamza says:
    @Phil4Phil

    This is simply false. Bin Laden took credit for the attacks on numerous occasions, both directly and through inference. His associates did so as well.

    I’m no fan of the Zionists, and they probably had intel on the coming attack, but they clearly didn’t do it. Bin Laden did. Ask Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. The plan was his, the organization was Bin Laden.

    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  36. @Phil4Phil

    It’s really more evidence that the central leadership of the Taliban was not a willing party to 911. Hence he was doing some things behind their backs even while residing as a guest in Afghanistan. But his statements are fully consistent with his having willfully organized a terror strike while hiding this from the Taliban.

    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  37. Maddaugh says:
    @anon6541

    As Bob Marley put it

    You can fool some people sometimes
    But you cant fool all the people all the time.

    relax…and unclinch your a-hole.
    =====================================

    I will unclinch it if your black face in under it LOL

    • Replies: @showmethereal
  38. Switzerland has avoided all of this sort of thing for over 500 years.

  39. Druid55 says:
    @Carlton Meyer

    Ron Paul is the only one I trusted in government. Rand is good but not his dad. The rest are cash sales!

  40. There are clowns in the mainstream press who are actually making remarks to the extent that 911 improved the country and it’s since a better place due to it.

    • Replies: @Johnny Rico
  41. @Romper stomper

    And then there are clowns like you. lol. keep on truckin

  42. bin laden was logistics
    KSM was the planner

    what people can’t understand is that after 30 years of affirmative action, YES, our government IS this incompetent

    it really was that easy to hijack a plane. you can rob a bank tomorrow with a post-it note.

    flight simulators are also quite cheap and realistic even on PCs. not that hard to do what they did

    • Troll: Mevashir
    • Replies: @Mevashir
  43. Agent76 says:

    Sep 10, 2021 Reflecting on 9/11 by Bring Our Troops Home

  44. @Sarah

    I love how you characterize some of these people. I stay sane by reminding myself of the song by the 1960’s psychedelic group, the Strawberry Alarm Clock, especially the line, “Beatniks and politics nothing is new, a ”yardstick” for lunatics, ONE POINT OF VIEW. Having said this, ” I know how you feel, believe me.

  45. Mevashir says:

    SENT OUT TO MY EMAIL LISTS TODAY

    [MORE]

    I think a huge demonstration of heavily-armed NRA members surrounding the Israeli embassy in Washington would make a powerful point that their presence in our country is no longer desired. The embassy should be shuttered just like Trump did to the Chinese in Houston. Their staff deported back to Israel. Then Congress can take a deep sigh and start reassessing our relationship to that pariah country. Hopefully leading to the rescinding of all treaties and abrogation of all financial and military support rendered to them:

    With the anniversary of 9/11 approaching, I urge you to look at the Unz Review website. They have some tremendous articles:
    https://www.unz.comhttps://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/
    https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/#comment-4895370

    Summary of the best websites exposing 9/11 truth: https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/#comment-4892964

    Alan Sabrosky is a highly respected Jewish expert working for US military intelligence. He long ago indicted the Israelis for 9/11. I urge you to read his article. He’s very articulate not hysterical but uncompromising in his perspective. I hope you can get on board and help rescue North America from its death spiral into intellectual stupefaction irrelevance and insanity:
    https://www.unz.com/article/demystifying-9-11-israel-and-the-tactics-of-mistake/
    https://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/2010/03/full-transcript-of-sabrosky-interview.html
    https://www.unz.com/CONTENTS/AUDIO/misc/uglytruth15MARCH2010sabrosky-trim.mp3?_=2

    This is some information I posted about a journalist named Victor Thorn, who way back in 2006 already was implicating the Israelis. I was looking up his website and discovered on the SPLC website they are gloating that he committed suicide in 2016. He bit the dust with some very eminent people like Phyllis Schlafly. (I wrote to Victor back in 2006. He was a very enthusiastic and confident journalist. It’s very difficult to believe he would commit suicide. More likely the Zionists killed him.)
    https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/#comment-4894281
    https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/#comment-4894341
    https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2017/sunrise-sunset-five-leading-extremists-dead-2016

    Israel’s GDP is higher than Britain Canada and Japan! And those fckrs demand annual tribute from Congress:
    https://www.unz.com/runz/seeking-9-11-truth-after-twenty-years/#comment-4894268

    GENERAL 9/11 TRUTH WEBSITES
    https://www.ae911truth.org/[email protected]

    http://patriotsquestion911.com/
    [compiled into one 1600 page pdf at these links:
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CujXM5Wx1D0Lp1c1z-FCYyMpdIHan3ac/view
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CXox9ANgt2xOtDXCRZeAA7tiG8Hh2rCg/view
    [email protected]]

    https://rense.com/general24/t500.htm[email protected][email protected]

    https://www.americanswhotellthetruth.org/portraits/david-ray-griffin
    [email protected]
    https://www.amazon.com/David-Ray-Griffin/e/B000APTCK4/ref=dp_byline_cont_pop_book_1

    VETERANS TODAY ON 9/11 AS ISRAELI NUCLEAR TERROR ATTACK ON THE USA
    https://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/10/05/911-filling-in-the-map-tracing-the-nukes/ [email protected]

    JONATHAN REVUSKY ARTICLES
    https://www.unz.com/author/jonathan-revusky/[email protected]
    https://heresycentral.is/author/revusky/[email protected] – Wings on Pigs: the 9/11 Narrative

  46. Mevashir says:
    @bob jones1

    If they teach reading at Bob Jones University, then delve into this link and reeducate yourself:
    https://www.unz.com/pescobar/9-9-and-9-11-20-years-later/#comment-4895567

  47. Emslander says:

    There were people on all those planes on 9/11 who were talking on their cell phones to family members describing everything that was going on. The perpetrators were Islamic jihadists who had been organized and trained by Usama Bin Laden. Please allow the story to rest at that.

    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  48. @Mustapha Mond

    Indeed it was a rhetorical question… Sowing…reaping. 20 years and embarassment…

  49. @Sarah

    South Korea has no beef with China. Their military build up has lots to do with Japan. The US media tries to keep it under raps but the two cou tries do not get along.

  50. @Patrick McNally

    But his statements are fully consistent with his having willfully organized a terror strike while hiding this from the Taliban.

    Which statements? Please.

    • Replies: @Patrick McNally
  51. @Hamza

    This is simply false. Bin Laden took credit for the attacks on numerous occasions, both directly and through inference.

    When? Which occasions? Please.

    • Replies: @Sean
  52. @Emslander

    There were people on all those planes on 9/11 who were talking on their cell phones to family members describing everything that was going on.

    You do believe in fairy tales, don’t you?

    • Replies: @Mevashir
  53. anon[268] • Disclaimer says:
    @showmethereal

    There was that passport with intact covers and margins and everything inside frozen into the day the passport was issued . It was crying like a baby to be picked by NYPD . That was the evidence.Rest came from deep thinker Miller’s enhanced interrogation . Soon the videos followed with grainy footage . There apparently Bin laden admitted because he wanted to be assassinated and get to heaven with 72 virgins.

  54. @Olivier1973

    The ones which I was quoting in post 8 up above. The interview with John Miller from 1998 is here:

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/who/interview.html

    In that interview he expresses a willingness to go to the point of attacking civilians.

    “We do not have to differentiate between military or civilian.”

    But in the Ummat statement which he released right after 911 he maintains something different:

    “Islam does not allow the killing of innocent people, men, women and children even in the event of war.”

    The most logical explanation of such discrepancy is that the Ummat statement was obviously insincere but necessitated because the Taliban would not have welcomed a statement from him in support of the attacks.

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  55. Mevashir says:
    @Olivier1973

    If he is a Jew then his whole Bible is a fairy tale

  56. Sean says:
    @Olivier1973

    Afghanistan ignored many warnings from the US because 9/11 was not Osama bin Laden’s first rodeo. And his previous attacks had already got him attacked by the US in Afghanistan, where the Taliban leader protected him. The US wasn’t fucking asking Mullah Omar to hand over bin Laden. It was an either/or.

    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  57. Agent76 says:

    Sep 5, 2016 9/11 Suspects: Rudy Giuliani

    Mayor Giuliani oversaw the illegal destruction of the 9/11 crime scene and is criminally liable for the deaths of hundreds of emergency workers for not passing on prior warnings about the collapses of the Twin Towers. It is no wonder, then, that the Fire Department of New York so passionately detest Giuliani for his actions in disgracing their fallen brothers and covering up the 9/11 crime.

    https://www.corbettreport.com/911-suspects-rudy-giuliani/

  58. A lie repeated a thousand times becomes a truth.

    There are still a lot of people who lack the intelligence and the knowledge (physics) to understand that no plane entered the Pentagone, that 3 WTC buildings were pulled and a 4th one exploded (WTC6).

    One more proof: tiny bone fragments were recovered on the roof of the Deutsche Bank. To reduce a human body with its bones to such fragments, it needs explosives and it needs explosives in a closed room. The WTC was set up with explosives and detonated.

    https://gumshoenews.com/2014/09/08/bones-the-forensic-evidence-of-explosives/

  59. @Patrick McNally

    Thanks for the detailed answer and for the link.

    I do not think there is a contradiction, especially if we look at the context of the quoted sentence.

    He is saying first:

    Besides, terrorism can be commendable and it can be reprehensible. Terrifying an innocent person and terrorizing him is objectionable and unjust, also unjustly terrorizing people is not right.

    And then:

    We believe that the worst thieves in the world today and the worst terrorists are the Americans. Nothing could stop you except perhaps retaliation in kind. We do not have to differentiate between military or civilian. As far as we are concerned, they are all targets, and this is what the fatwah says … . The fatwah is general (comprehensive) and it includes all those who participate in, or help the Jewish occupiers in killing Muslims.

    He made the distinction between innocent people and other people who are taking part in the war against muslims. In that case “civilian” does not mean women and children for instance, but those taking part as civilians to the war (from politicians to any person looting the country).

    People who stand away, innocent people are not a target. No contradiction.

    • Replies: @Patrick McNally
  60. @Sean

    Afghanistan ignored many warnings from the US because 9/11 was not Osama bin Laden’s first rodeo.

    911 was not Bin Laden’s rodeo, it was a joint CIA & Mossad rodeo.

    Bin Laden aka Tim Osman.

    Bin Laden was first in Sudan as a refugee. Like Carlos. The then Sudanese leader proposed to the French the arrest of Carlos. It was done, Carlos was extradited, sentenced and is still in prison. The same proposal was done to the US. They refused.

    You guess why?

    Then he went instead to Afghanistan.

    Before 911, the US were already preparing the invasion/agression against Afghanistan.

    • Replies: @Sean
  61. Sean says:
    @Olivier1973

    https://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/taleb04/taleb_index.html

    Consider: How would an understanding of the world on June 27, 1914, have helped anyone guess what was to happen next? The rise of Hitler, the demise of the Soviet bloc, the spread of Islamic fundamentalism, the Internet bubble: not only were these events unpredictable, but anyone who correctly forecast any of them would have been deemed a lunatic (indeed, some were). This accusation of lunacy would have also applied to a correct prediction of the events of 9/11 — a black swan of the vicious variety.

    A vicious black swan has an additional elusive property: its very unexpectedness helps create the conditions for it to occur. Had a terrorist attack been a conceivable risk on Sept. 10, 2001, it would likely not have happened. Jet fighters would have been on alert to intercept hijacked planes, airplanes would have had locks on their cockpit doors, airports would have carefully checked all passenger luggage. None of that happened, of course, until after 9/11

    But they knew all about Osama bin Laden and his organisation, and feared he was going to use a chemical or germ warfare weapon of mass destruction.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Infinite_Reach
    Operation Infinite Reach was the codename for American cruise missile strikes on Al-Qaeda bases in Khost Province, Afghanistan, and the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory in Khartoum, Sudan, on August 20, 1998. The attacks, launched by the U.S. Navy, were ordered by President Bill Clinton in retaliation for al-Qaeda’s August 7 bombings of American embassies in Kenya and Tanzania, which killed 224 people (including 12 Americans) and injured over 4,000 others. Bin Laden justified the high-casualty attacks, the largest against the U.S. since the 1983 Beirut barracks bombings,[32] by claiming they were in retaliation for the deployment of U.S. troops in Somalia; he also alleged that the embassies had devised the Rwandan genocide as well as a supposed plan to partition Sudan

    Instead he just brought down the Twin Towers, which had been the objective of a terrorist attack years previously. If the FBI had been doing their job, instead of glory hunting a la Giuliani in going after the mafia, 9/11 would have been easily preventable.

    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  62. A man whom the Taliban were offering to give up, briefly denied the crime he was potentially being given up for. Astonishing!

    • Replies: @anon
  63. @Olivier1973

    It’s the kind of statement which is totally consistent with willingness to make an attack on New York in a place which is widely associated with Jewish financiers such as Larry Silverstein who was buddies with Benjamin Netanyahu. Osama’s statement from 1998 matches the profile of someone willing to plan 911. The other statements made after 911 were political necessities for him to make.

    • Replies: @Olivier1973
  64. @Sean

    The bombing of the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory in Khartoum, was a crime against humanity.

    https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/1998/09/sud-s12.html

    • Replies: @Sean
  65. @Patrick McNally

    Ah, now you are in the head of OBL, aren’t you?

    The other statements made after 911 were political necessities for him to make.

    Which other statements, please?

    OBL had no reason at all to lie. Lies are the trademarks of the USA. Do you remember Pompeo explaining that “we lied, we cheated, we stole”. The main thing they are stealing is the truth.

    So you believe in fairy tales that were planned by the neocons. Do you need a list of them?
    Maybe you forgot that Bibi was very happy of the 911 and that some Mossad people were rejoicing. Mission accomplished.

    • Replies: @Patrick McNally
  66. Ivymike says:

    Osama released A video before the 2004 US election claiming responsibility for the attack. It was viewed world wide, even by me. Why do you want to send it down the memory hole?

    • Replies: @anon
  67. @Olivier1973

    The statements made to Ummat where he disclaims any possibility of killing innocent people are things which he would have said to imply that he was not part of 911, But the statements which he made in 1998 show the profile of a man who would be quite willing todo something like 911 and justify it as a strike on the enemy. There’s no need to believe anything which comes out of a neocon or Likudnik in order to understand that Osama’s statements to Ummat were of a very self-interested character and his earlier statements made when he was not on the spot for anything specific show a willingness to do something like 911.

  68. anon[308] • Disclaimer says:
    @Triteleia Laxa

    When did Taliban offer to deliver Bin laden?

    • Replies: @Triteleia Laxa
  69. And yet, like with the assassination of JFK, we may never know the full contours of the whole riddle inside an enigma.”

    Oh, yes we do.

    It’s spelled;

    J
    E
    W
    S

    Always look at what you’re not allowed to say [although TUR tends to be an exception], the rest of [jewish owned FSM] firmly clamps down on diverse opinions.

    Whereas they keep harping on how ‘diverse’ our societies have to be [not with JAPs, please], and not in Occupied Palestine, of course [jeder Schwartze, raus!!!!!!!].

    It’s like being ‘a little bit pregnant,’ ‘passive-aggressiveness.’ or ‘toxic, white, male supremacy.’

    Well, gfy!

  70. Given some of the stories which circulated in late 2001 about Osama supposedly dying one has to wonder if maybe that 2011 “killing of Bin Laden” may have been just a fake story rigged up to dispose of the issue. ”

    TPTB showed ‘us’ the pictures of the dead bodies of Saddam Hussein’s 2 sons.
    TPTB showed ‘us’ the pictures of the dead body of Mullah Dadullah.
    TPTB showed ‘us’ the pictures of the hanging of Saddam Hussein.

    But…

    OBL…

    Dumped at sea, with now shots fired taken…

  71. @Carlo

    Really, Carlo ?! Are you another ‘ expert ‘ in the field, or what ?…Take a look at the belly of the airplane, just before ‘ hitting ‘ the tower…what do you see ? What do you think is that…’ thing ‘ under the belly…have you ever saw one under an airplane, at the airport ( if you ever use an airplane for travel )…?!…EVER ?!…There is even a movie, part of a serial from Feb. ’01, I think…on ‘ Fox ‘, where a rogue group is taking control of an commercial airplane and taking toward WTC…’ Predictive programing ‘…

  72. @CelestiaQuesta

    And of course the monetary promises from the MIC to the corrupt politicians for creating the opportunities, “Recycled money”!

  73. @anon

    Every conspiracy theorist seems to claim they did, but I don’t know. They tend to imply that it “proves” that the US just needed to invade Afghanistan, despite it being the most pointless place on the planet.

    • Replies: @anon
  74. @Franz

    Those two can accomplish anything, including fo0ling their true believers into thinking there is no one behind the curtain.”

    I think [in reality] it’s even worse, because, over time, I’ve detected attempts to convince me, there isn’t even a curtain…

  75. @anon6541

    Yeah, suuure…Iran, Iran, Iran…bomb…bomb…bomb ( John Mc-Quaida )…nothing about Zionist Israel…’ By way of deception…’…right, anon6541 ?!…Are you ‘ Unit 8200 ‘, or just a ‘ Christian-Zionist ‘…?!…

  76. anon[402] • Disclaimer says:
    @Triteleia Laxa

    Taliban offered to deliver him provided proofs were offered and trial were held in a third country .

    • Thanks: showmethereal
    • Replies: @Triteleia Laxa
  77. anon[402] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ivymike

    Was that one of the videos made by Pentagon and CIA?

  78. @Si1ver1ock

    AND…?!…What’s your point…that being ‘ a time far away ‘, doesn’t have any relevance to what’s happening TODAY ?! Let me tell you something: the assassination of JFK was/is the most important assassination, after that of Jesus of Nazareth, in the history of humanity. It’s not only Vietnam and other tens of wars around the Globe, with hundred of millions murdered, wounded, or displaced, not the destruction of the American middle class… not even the Dimona and Zionist Israel’s atomic bomb, but the Executive Order 11110 and the end of the ( not so ) ‘ Federal ‘ Reserve Bank…the end of usury…We had false flag operations a-la Sept’11 because those responsible for the Kennedy brothers ( and JFK-Jr. ) assassinations were never exposed, put on trial and executed for high treason…we live today in a Medical Martial ‘ Law ‘ because of that…I was born and lived until almost 30 on the ‘ other side ‘, in Eastern-Europe…and like Alexandr Solzhenitsyn said, the perpetrators of the crimes against Russians and other nations from Eastern-Europe are the same of the crimes in Western Europe/North America…The only reason that USA has any liberties left and is not as Russia after Lenin & Co. took the power in ’20’s, is because of the 2nd Amendment/millions of guns in the hands of the Americans ! If you still don’t believe me, take a look of Australia as TODAY: even Communist China criticized them for the human rights abuses…They surrendered their guns, after a blatant false flag operation…and they reap what they sow…

    • Agree: Mevashir
    • Replies: @Mevashir
  79. Mevashir says:
    @SS-The Independent

    Beautiful insightful comment. Thank you!

  80. Mevashir says:
    @anon6541

    Do you consider the Taliban “friends of Iran”?

  81. denk says:

    I am amazed to see, while they have just left Afghanistan yet, they are already preparing the next war.

    FUKUS [UK, US] never left their war booty behind without booby trapping it , cue India, HK….

    sleepy wily joe seems to be anticipating some ‘beautiful sight to behold‘ ala HK.

    China has real problems… it will be interesting to see what happens.

    Empire watch rule 1
    When FUKUS sounds an alarm, run for cover, those are insider info.

    No sooner than the gringo ‘left’ Afghan, when CIA /RAW patsies , the TTP and Baloch militants have already slaughtered dozens of Chinese engineers in PAK….

    China should squint before jumping into the Afghan re-construction ‘windfall’, lest it might turn into another Guinea. !

    https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2021/09/10/us-plan-b-for-afghanistan-screw-up-china/

  82. @GomezAdddams

    The “pull it” interview was with Silverstein, not a fire chief.

  83. Sean says:
    @Olivier1973

    Your reference is from 1998 and shows that Osama bin Laden was a subject of international discussion and US use of force in Afghanistan years before 9/11. Mullah Omar the head of the Taliban refused to hand bin Laden over repeatedly and the US fired missiles into Afghanistan at bin Laden associated targets in 1998. Every precaution was taken so as to not kill innocent civilians. Indeed that consideration saved bin Laden’s life.

    On August 23, 1996, Osama bin Laden had declared war on the Saud family dictatorship for allowing an United States army to be stationed in Saudi Arabia, which was to protect it from Saddam (still in power in Iraq).

    If George Bush the elder had invaded Iraq and overthrown Saddam in 1991, none of this would have happened. The majority of Democrats in both the House and the Senate, opposed the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 1991

    https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/12/05/george-h-w-bush-careful-leader-best-outcome-iraq-gulf-war-column/2190726002/

    George Bush and Dick Cheney decided against invading Iraq and toppling Saddam Hussein. Remember that?

    It’s true. Bush and Cheney analyzed the situation carefully and determined that it wasn’t worth the casualties, and that America might get bogged down. Besides, who knows what might have resulted from the Pandora’s box that an invasion and occupation of Iraq would pry open?

    Cheney made the case for restraint on the Sunday talk shows. Here’s what he said: “Well, just as it’s important, I think, for a president to know when to commit U.S. forces to combat, it’s also important to know when not to commit U.S. forces to combat. I think for us to get American military personnel involved in a civil war inside Iraq would literally be a quagmire.”

    There was no need for staging 9/11 as a pretext to to invade Iraq, The US, indeed the very same personages such as Cheney, had a perfect justification for removing Saddam a decade previously but deliberately chose not to. They did not understand the rage that would be provoked against the Saud family dictatorship by having a US infidel army in Islam’s holy land. Everything America does in the Middle East is about control of Saudi Arabia and petrodollars.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @showmethereal
  84. @anon

    So they were just stalling? Thanks for the correction.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @anon
  85. @anon6541

    I fear that you are very wrong! The rise of Talibans in Afghanistan again is another dirty plan on the eastern front of Iran by the US and its lackey in the ME. This is a continuation of Pimpeo’s max pressure strategy against Iran which includes creating chaos and possibly another war at the eastern borders of Iran in the near future. Hopefully I’m wrong too but time will tell soon.

  86. Anon[381] • Disclaimer says:

    From Sputnik news

    “ US Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) reacted to a New York Times report which claimed that an Afghan man who worked for Americans was erroneously killed in a retaliatory US airstrike after the Kabul airport attack.
    Speaking to Fox News’

    Paul raged”


    But what happened to the chattering that led to the attack ? Who were chattering on phone , email , in Instagram or what’s apps?
    What happened to those or three plans ?

    Is it possible that rogue elements of US military staged the attacks near the airports?

  87. Anon[381] • Disclaimer says:
    @Sean

    USA has no right to invade Iraq in 1991
    It had no right to attack Iraq after it agreed to leave .
    It had no right to attack once the retreat began . It had no right to impose sanction
    It had no right to demand that sanctions would continue until Saddam was gone
    .Ot had no right to use 2 billions dollars worth of ammunition dumped on Iraq in 1999 and 2 billions in 2000 attacking Iraq every 3 weeks .

    It had no right to cave to Israeli pressure in 1990 and ignore the Arab’s plans at work to secure the status ante quo .

    It is rascal country totally Zionized .
    It’s fate is obvious and Israel will be first to leave USA to its own device and root for next powerful guy on the block .

  88. @Maddaugh

    You guys have to get this characterization out of your head. Bin Laden was from a rich family. Many Gulf Arabs are filthy rich and don’t like western ideals. Many of the jihadi groups are lead by very well educated and financed people. Regardless of the full truth of 9/11 – westerners need to get this out of their head about unsophisticated militants. As to abilities – why do people forget many of these militants were trained by US and Pakistani and Saudi intelligence agencies and militaries to fight the Soviets. Bin Laden himself picked up a gun and fought against the Soviets. He used his experience in construction to build bulwarks their too.

  89. @Phil4Phil

    Well yeah he was probably referring to Khalid Mohammed… He boldly stated he was the planner… he also said he killed Daniel Pearl with his own hands. He said he wanted to finish what his nephew Ramzi Yousef started by trying to take down the towers in 1993. Of course he knew Mohammed and that’s probably exactly who he met. He and his nephew Yousef were both engineers and had big connections all over the Muslim world especially Kuwait – Qatar – Egypt – Pakistan.

    The whole Bin Laden more just seems revenge for his previous embarrassments of targeting the US. Why not take him alive??? Why shoot him in the face claiming it made it hard to identify him??? The seals supposedly were only a few feet from him and his gun was against the wall. Why not put him on trial? Or at the very least when not shoot him in the chest so his body could be displayed to the public?? Claiming they didn’t want his followers to idolize him sounds stupid. Those guys aren’t afraid to die and they already venerate him. Who knows – maybe it was a favor to the Saudi royals – whom Bin Laden didn’t like them because he felt they prostituted themselves to the west…

  90. @beavertales

    Yea not sure why people keep saying Bin Laden when all the jihadis said KS Mohammed. Which he said himself he did it. But apparently his trial is delayed because it was unclassified that he was tortured many times. They apparently water boarded him around 150 times. He proved a tough bird though. He regularly mocked his handlers by sending the on wild goose chases. US intel wasted tons of money chasing shadows. He got a big kick out of it. But yeah he admitted to having intel on US intel. He told his FBI handlers he knew which hotels US intel stayed in in Qatar when they were tracking him. it’s all a big game. It’s not like these guys are afraid to die.

  91. @Maddaugh

    Bob Marley had a white British father… White men seem to love black berries. I wonder why?

  92. anon[222] • Disclaimer says:
    @Triteleia Laxa

    no they were not stalling . But neocons were very impatient and impulsive .
    But

    these names ,draft,and terror shops of abbreviated alphabets might explain better :

    draft Defense Planning Guidance, or DPG, which came out of the left colon of the devil duo–Paul Wolfowitz and , I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby,in 1992
    and PNAC crmie syndicate owned by the following-
    Elliott Abrams, Richard Perle,Robert Kagan,William Kristol,

    Douglas Feith and David Wurmser Benjamin Netanyahu .

    • Thanks: RobinG
  93. @Sean

    If the US hadn’t been propping up Saddam and using him as an attack dog against Iran – then he wouldn’t have felt emboldened to take Kuwait… See how that works? The mistakes go back even decades before

    • Agree: RobinG
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