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US and Ukraine, Goals in Conflict
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Among the nations aiding Ukraine in its resistance to the Russian invasion, America has been foremost. Yet the war interests of our two nations are not identical.

To the U.S., the imperative is that the war be contained, not expanded, and that we not be drawn into a wider war with Russia.

For the independence, territorial integrity and democratic rule of Ukraine, while championed by the U.S., are not vital U.S. interests. None of them justifies a war with Russia that could imperil the security and, if it escalated to nuclear weapons, the very survival of our country.

That America is not “all in” in Ukraine is obvious. Before Feb. 24, the U.S. never brought Ukraine into NATO, never gave it an “Article 5” war guarantee, never agreed to fight alongside it if attacked.

From the first February days of this war, we ruled out U.S. “boots on the ground” or U.S. participation in a “no-fly zone,” which would require U.S. pilots to shoot down Russian planes.

These decisions and declarations about what we would not do testified to the limits of the U.S. commitment to Ukraine, as well as to our reluctance to take serious risks to ourselves on Kyiv’s behalf.

President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s goal, however, the defeat of the Russian invaders and their expulsion from Ukraine, would require greater support from the U.S. and NATO than he is receiving or is likely to receive.

The U.S. and NATO are willing to supply Ukraine with the weapons to defend themselves and defeat the Russians in battle, but neither NATO nor the U.S. is prepared to fight the Ukrainians’ war for them.

When it comes to the fighting and dying, this is their war, not ours.

To shame NATO and the U.S. more fully and openly into his war, Zelenskyy is accusing reluctant Western nations of being appeasers cut from the same bolt of cloth as Neville Chamberlain at Munich.

What is Zelenskyy saying?

Our cause is Europe’s cause. Our cause is NATO’s cause. Our cause is democracy’s cause. Our cause is the world’s cause. If we go down, we will be only the first to fall to Vladimir Putin’s empire. Others will follow.

Henry Kissinger has said that, in any negotiated settlement, Ukraine will likely have to cede some territory to Russia. Ideally, said Kissinger, “the dividing line should be a return to the status quo” before the 2022 invasion. Russia has held Crimea and parts of Luhansk and Donetsk since 2014.

“Pursuing the war beyond that point would not be about the freedom of Ukraine,” said Kissinger, “but a new war against Russia itself.”

A livid Zelenskyy replied: “It seems that Mr. Kissinger’s calendar is not 2022, but 1938 … Nobody heard from him then that it was necessary to adapt to the Nazis instead of fleeing them or fighting them.”

These cracks in the coalition backing Ukraine are certain to become more pronounced, as Russia appears to be consolidating control of the Donbas, which Putin has set as his principal goal.

Italy, France and Germany are all in contact with Putin. All are pressing for negotiations. None has insisted on what Zelenskyy has at times demanded: Russia’s surrender of Ukrainian territory it has held since 2014.

East European nations, familiar with Russian rule, echo Zelenskyy in calling for the defeat, humiliation and expulsion of Russia from Ukraine.

When and if a ceasefire comes and negotiations begin, there seems certain to be a fracturing of the coalition backing Ukraine.

For while Russia was defeated in its offensives to capture Kyiv, Kharkiv and Odessa, Moscow has succeeded in capturing Mariupol, the Sea of Azov and the “land bridge” it sought from Russia to Crimea — and appears to be moving toward dominance of the entire Donbas.

Ukraine is also blockaded by Russian warships from exporting its wheat and corn, upon which a number of developing nations depend to feed their populations and avert malnutrition and even famine.

And with Russia making slow but steady gains in the Donbas, Putin does not appear to be holding a weak hand in any negotiations.

With the Ukrainians and Russians exchanging artillery fire in the Donbas, Zelenskyy asked the U.S. for its High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems, known as HIMARS.

With strike capabilities of almost 50 miles, this could put Russia itself in range. But U.S. officials say they have assurances from Ukrainian leaders that HIMARS will not be used against Russian territory.

The Kremlin has warned that any nation sending advanced weapons to Ukraine will face harsh repercussions. Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov has charged the West with declaring “total war” on Russia.

What this suggests is that the war is now generating greater risks and dangers for the U.S. than any additional rewards we might realize from “weakening” Russia with further fighting.

It may be time to tell Zelenskyy not only what we will and will not provide but what we believe are the acceptable terms for a truce.

Patrick J. Buchanan is the author of “Nixon’s White House Wars: The Battles That Made and Broke a President and Divided America Forever.”

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: American Military, NATO, Russia, Ukraine 
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  1. JimDandy says:

    With apologies to the moron formerly known as Sting:

    But what might save us, me and you
    Is that the Kissingers love their grandchildren too

    • Disagree: Verymuchalive
  2. For while Russia was defeated in its offensives to capture Kyiv, Kharkiv and Odessa

    Pat and his researchers continue to parrot MSM propaganda. There was no Russian offensive to capture Odessa, full stop. The offensives round Kiev and Kharkov were feints, one of the two aims of which was to tie down Ukrainian forces in these areas and stop them reinforcing Ukrainian forces in the Donbas. After a few weeks, job done, Russian forces returned home.

    Moscow has succeeded in capturing Mariupol, the Sea of Azov and the “land bridge” it sought from Russia to Crimea

    The other aim of the feint was to enable Russian forces to attack Ukraine from Crimea. In this regard, it was devastatingly successful. They captured Kherson City two days after the start of the incursion. They met little resistance. The Ukrainian defenders apparently fled westwards, some flinging down their arms. The Russians quickly occupied nearly all Kherson Oblast and most of Zaparozhzhia ( spellings vary ) Oblast. Again, with little resistance.

    The Russian Crimean Army then attacked the Ukrainian Army in the South Donbas from the rear. They joined up with the forces of the Donetsk People’s Republic, forcing Ukrinian forces to flee northwards or to Mariupol, where they were surrounded.

    Very few analysts have given the Russians credit for their very effective Crimean strategy. The “land bridge” was built from Crimea to Moscow, not the other way round. On the other hand, the Ukrainian strategy has been thoroughly abject. I’m sure it will studied in military academies as an example of how not to conduct a war.

    • Replies: @Greta Handel
  3. @Verymuchalive

    And what of this?

    Ideally, said Kissinger, “the dividing line should be a return to the status quo” before the 2022 invasion. Russia has held Crimea and parts of Luhansk and Donetsk since 2014.

    Is this an Establishment (provisional) narrative, saving face by claiming to have pushed Russia back out this year?

  4. Dumbo says:

    To the U.S., the imperative is that the war be contained, not expanded, and that we not be drawn into a wider war with Russia.

    If that was the “imperative”, they wouldn’t be sending weapons and billions of dollars to the Ukraine, and they wouldn’t be there training Ukrainian soldiers since (at least) 2014 in the first place.

    The whole thing is absurd.

  5. @Greta Handel

    The Western political class are now very largely composed of ideologues who wouldn’t recognise an off ramp if they saw it. So even Kissinger’s not very subtle hints will be completely ignored.
    Those whom the Gods would destroy, they first drive mad !

  6. @JimDandy

    Monty Python
    The Henry Kissinger Song

    Henry Kissinger
    How I’m missing yer
    You’re the Doctor of my dreams
    With your crinkly hair and your glassy stare
    And your machiavellian schemes
    I know they say that you are very vain
    And short and fat and pushy but at least you’re not insane
    Henry Kissinger
    How I’m missing yer
    And wishing you were here

    I think we can agree that Kissinger is not insane. He has no moral centre, for sure, but does have a sense of pragmaticism, however warped, totally lacking in present-day, Western mainstream politicos.

    • Agree: Max Maxwell, JimDandy
  7. Emslander says:

    Ron Unz sends out his little sock puppet identities after every Buchanan column. Unz will never forgive Pat for dumping him from his screwed up magazine attempt. Techy robot types never forget and never forgive.

  8. …anyone like to take a guess as to how many rounds the US supplied multiple rocket launchers will fire before being removed by a Russian hypersonic missile?

    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
  9. France Italy and Germany do not control NATO; the USA does. Unfortunately the US Government and Mr Biden appear to still hope for a Ukrainian victory over Russia. It appears Mr Putin may conquer the Donbass and then begin peace talks. Mr Zelenskyy is saying Ukraine will not cede territory but at some point Ukraine will have to negotiate. Most likely any deal would be autonomy or Russian rule of Donbass as well as recognition of Crimea as Russian territory. The Russians have been threatening to retaliate against western arms shipments for months but have not done so. Perhaps despite his bluster Mr Putin does not want a conflict with NATO.

  10. @Carroll price

    I was watching a video from The Duran the other day. They drew on info supplied by Jacob Dreizin ( Dreizin Report ). The US is supplying 4 MLRS, the other NATO states 8. A grand total of 12. We must assume that all get safely to the frontline. This is a big if, as Russia has been destroying ammo dumps, train electricity substations etc daily since the start.

    OK, 12 MLRS at the frontline. They can use up to 15,000 rounds maximum daily – for the whole 12. Bear in mind that Russia is firing at least 500,000 rounds a day in total. The rail logistics behind this is astounding, and continues to astound. Also, bear in mind that Ukraine had far more of MLRS type launchers at the start of the war than the 12 they have been offered now. Seemingly, nearly all have been destroyed in Russian air attacks, hence the Ukrainian demands for more.

    Conclusion. Even if all 12 get to the frontline, their effect will be completely insignificant.

    • Thanks: Carroll price
  11. @Emslander

    I’ve had trouble with loonies like you on this website before. They seem to think that Mr Unz the publisher either employs commenters to promote his views/criticize columnists he doesn’t like or uses commenters’ identities to do it himself.

    You are insinuating that myself, Greta Handel, JimDandy, Max Maxwell, Dumbo etc are Mr Unz’s “little sock puppet identities”. You are deluding yourself. Mr Unz is a very busy man, I’m sure, and has neither the time nor inclination to take part in such skullduggery.

    If the other commenters want to reply to you, that’s up to them. For my part, I can say that I am nobody’s sock puppet, least of all Mr Unz’s, if you care to look at my record.
    If you can’t stop oozing paranoia, Emslander, then scuttle back to Emsland.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    , @Emslander
  12. “Weakening Russia” is a euphemism. Ukraine, its Israeli-aided nuclearization, bio-warfare labs, fanatic political police and reprisal units, was aimed at destroying Russia as a country. The stake is existential. This is the sense of Medvedev’s reference to the apocalypse horsemen. If those HIMARS should be used against Russian territory, and there is a good chance that NATO might want to have a go at that, then it will inevitably be the end of life on earth because “decision centers are not in the Ukraine” and “a world without Russia is not a world we wish to live in”.

  13. @Max Maxwell

    The Russians have been threatening to retaliate against western arms shipments for months but have not done so.

    See my reply #10. This is why very few western arms shipments have been getting to the frontline. Most have been destroyed. As well as the attacks on ammo dumps and traction substations, there has been repeated attacks on petroleum refineries – oil is now very scarce in Ukraine – and munitions and other trains carrying materiel.

    All this has been happening right from the start of the war.

  14. Kissinger should have been hanged many times over but he isn´t stupid
    (of course a return to the “status quo ante” is out of the question now, but
    if it is enough to get you excommunicated it is a measure of the delusion that
    has taken hold).
    – The Ukraine is a carcass, propped up only by “Western” supplies; clearly
    ZATO´s goal in this is to get as many of “the best of the goyim” killed as
    possible.
    – Their newest trope of “All Righteous Nations ™ must get together to send
    the bestial Red Fleet to the bottom of the Black Sea, for the CHILLUN!!!”
    smacks of desperation …
    1) It was the Jew that mined the Ukrainian ports.
    2) The Russians wouldn´t object to Ukie grain exports as long as they get
    the same rights (ah-hah!); of course they would reserve the right to
    inspect cargo going in.
    3) USrael has been stealing Syrian oil and wheat for a decade now, for the
    express purpose of causing hunger revolts.
    – So much for the CHILLUN!!! ™ ; Elendski´s priorities at this point are
    exclusively his retirement funds.
    It would be nice if Europe grew a pair and told the Itzigs where to stuff their
    war, but the privations are not yet deep enough for that.

    • Agree: Rurik
    • Replies: @Carroll price
  15. Rurik says:
    @Max Maxwell

    Unfortunately the US Government and Mr Biden appear to still hope for a Ukrainian victory over Russia.

    I don’t think so.

    Without a direct intervention from NATO (WWIII) then the outcome (Ukrainian defeat) was always a foregone conclusion.

    What they’re doing now is simply using the conflict as a pretext to gush billions in lucre to all the players involved. Biden and son, Kolomoisky, Zelensky, no doubt untold hundreds of other Zionists and others like these charming folks. (just the introductory paragraphs is enough to sicken and repulse).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_the_Study_of_War

    Ukrainian and Russian men are dying so that guys like this

    can become fantastically wealthy, while orchestrating the mass-slaughter of untold tens of thousands of Russian and Ukrainian Christians.

    Such a deal! It’s like ((WWI and II)) all over again!

    An unlimited supply of slop in the trough, (tell me that guy doesn’t look like a pig)

    ` this is his brother, the neocon Robert Kagan

    the whole point of dragging this thing on is to milk it for the maximum lucre they can steal, and get as many Ukrainian and Russian people killed as possible.

    It was these people’s grandfathers, like Lazar Kaganovitch who orchestrated the deliberate mass starvation genocide of millions of Ukrainians in the last century. Or Genrikh Yagoda, who terrorized or murdered untold millions of Russian Christians.

    It’s what they do. Their hatred for Russians and Ukrainians (white Christians) is infinite. And a war where they can steal billions from Americans (mainly white Christians), and force British and French and German and Polish and other white Christians to cough up weapons and lucre to slaughter other white Christians, is just about as good as it can get for these filthy Satanic scum. And it’s difficult for me to understand how the Ukrainian people can serve as cannon fodder, with such depraved degradation- the same tribe who murdered so many millions of their ancestors, in the most cruel way imaginable.

    It is, just as the Russian Coat of Arms depicts, as if Vlad Putin is a modern-day Saint George, and is slaying the forces of evil that menace the very survival of Christendom and its people.

    God speed to Vlad Putin, and pray he prevails, for the people of Russia, for the people of Ukraine, and for all the rest of us.

  16. Here we go again!

    For while Russia was defeated in its offensives to capture Kyiv, Kharkiv and Odessa.

    Mr Buchanan, learn some history at least. Kiev is a huge city, 800 square km. The Russians had to send 700 thousand troops to liberate it in 1943. How can anybody in his sane mind assume that they intended to capture it with 40 thousand troops? That’s plain stupid sir.

    Stop repeating that, it’s embarrassing.

    Ukraine is also blockaded by Russian warships from exporting its wheat and corn.

    No it’s not. There are humanitarian corridors open, during certain hours every day. You keep lying and lying. Makes me wonder how much do they pay for lying.

    How much do they pay for lying, Mr Buchanan?

    • Replies: @Rurik
    , @Ann Nonny Mouse
  17. nsa says:

    The Russian Federation spans 11 time zones and sits atop 1/4 to 1/3 of the world’s natural resources….including 11/24 of the arctic. Real stuff like oil, gas, gold, iron, coal, trees, grain, water….not silly crypto shekels, crap bonds, frn asswipes, etc. They got it. The yid dominated globo-homos want it. What else do you need to know?

  18. @Emslander

    It seems fair to ask: Is there a familial or other personal relationship informing your defensive comments under these Buchanan columns?

    Please also refute or otherwise address #3.

    • Replies: @Emslander
  19. Rurik says:
    @Here Be Dragon

    The Russians had to send 700 thousand troops to liberate it in 1943.

    the tragic irony is that it wasn’t liberated, but enslaved to the same regime that had starved millions of the best of Ukraine in a mass genocide in the 1930s.

    Ukraine went from being occupied by the genocidal Bolshevik Jewish cabal, to being occupied by the Nazis, then again to being occupied by the Soviet fiend.

    In none of that time was it ever free.

    Then in the 1990s they, like so many other formerly occupied peoples and nations, were granted self-determination and a modicum of freedom. Finally.

    Only to have it all taken away, yet again by the Nuland/Kagan Jewish cabal. The irony is that in the 1930s and 40s, it was the Jewish cabal in Russia that was menacing and mass-murdering Ukrainians, while today it’s the Jewish cabal in Ukraine (and the ((West))), that is menacing Russians and forcing war.

    Wherever they infest in significant numbers, you’re going to have genocide (Israel), war, (Ukraine), civilizational collapse (England, North America and western Europe), swindling (Wall Street), spiritual rot (Hollywood)..

    ..and so forth.

    It’s really a mathematical certainty once you get the critical percentages.

    • Replies: @boomerfeed
  20. In the end it will be what EUROPE wants, not the US. And Europe does not want to see protracted war. Been there, done that. France, Germany and Italy will lead the way. Eventually I believe this will be settled at the table and it says here that Russia will wind up with everything east of Kyiv and the Dnipro along with their cherished warm water port in the Black Sea–which is what they wanted in the first place.

  21. @nokangaroos

    Maybe Kissinger is like war criminal Robert McNamara who suffered from a guilty conscience toward the end of his miserable life.

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/why-robert-mcnamara-came-regret-war-he-escalated-180961231/

  22. @Greta Handel

    Yeah, one of several falsities by Buchanan that reveal he isn’t deeply engaged on the topic and is just regurgitating some lightweight media claims.

  23. JimDandy says:
    @Verymuchalive

    I am God’s sock puppet.

    • LOL: Verymuchalive
    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
  24. All wars are over “vital interests”. The warning from history is that pursuit of interests – or power – eventually leads to the war that ultimately undermines or destroys those interests.
    https://patternofhistory.wordpress.com/

  25. @JimDandy

    Very good !
    Victoria Nuland is the Devil’s sock puppet.
    Biden is just a sock puppet – there’s nothing left inside.

    • Agree: JimDandy
  26. Emslander says:
    @Greta Handel

    Yeah, Pat Buchanan is my father, my intellectual father. LOL

    • Replies: @Greta Handel
  27. Renoman says:

    The stupidity of the Democrats knows no bounds. It’s will take a long time to fix the Biden mess , if ever. PT Barnum said it and it continues to be more and more true every day.

  28. The United States is heading to it’s destruction and I don’t just mean the woke insanity or attacks on our Constitutionally guaranteed freedoms, I mean literal, physical destruction. This is what happens when you combine arrogance with incompetence. The people running the show including some of these corrupt retired Generals really believe they can do as they please around the world and take on all comers including resistance by their own population, all at the same time. They’re in for a very grave awakening.

  29. @Max Maxwell

    Right Putin doesn’t want a conflict with NATO but not due to NATO’S conventional forces, but rather risk of nuclear war. NATO is a hollowed out paper tiger. How many combat ready divisions do they have to commit? Check what Scott Ritter has said about that. The scum running both Europe and the US treat their people like peasant subjects and simultaneously make war on other nations. Personally I’d like to see Europeans drag these morons in their capitals into the streets and beat them senseless. Nothing but a bunch of fa**ed up slimy 2 bit dictators who seriously need to be dealt with in the worst way.

    • Agree: GomezAdddams
  30. @Emslander

    Please also refute or otherwise address #3.

    • Replies: @Emslander
  31. Emslander says:
    @Greta Handel

    Neither Henry Kissinger, Pat Buchanan nor I have any need to “save face”. That’s for crappy little Unztards.

    • Replies: @Greta Handel
  32. @Emslander

    OK, then maybe someone else can help out here: Which parts of Luhansk and Donetsk has Russia held since 2014?

  33. Anonymous[410] • Disclaimer says:

    I am not that bright, my IQ has been tested professionally to be 90, so maybe one of the smart TOO members can explain this to me. Regarding the evolutionary genetics of Russia, can someone explain their evolutionary genetics to explain their relationship with the Ashkenazi people. If my history is correct, the Ashkenazim has several times waged war against Russia in the last 100 or so years, and in each case, many Russians died, but no Ashkenazi people lost their lives. For example, Ashkenazim waged a war against Russia in the Bolshevik Revolution, and 20 million Russians were killed. However, the number of Ashkenazi people who lost their lives was: Zero. Next, After Russia made a partnership with Assad and Syria, the Ashkenazim against launched a war against Russia in Syria. My understanding is that around one thousand Russian soldiers died in Syria, but the number of Ashkenazim who lost their lives is: Zero. Next, the Ashkenazim again launched a war against Russia in Ukraine, which is the current war going on. So far, several thousand Russians have been killed by the Ashkenazim. Thousands of Russian soldiers have been killed by the Ashkenazim in Ukraine, and the Ashkenzim have launched hundreds of missiles/bombs into Western Russia, killing a few thousand Russian civilians in the last several months. However, the number of Ashkenazim that have lost their lives in this war is: Zero. The Russian government has made sure that not a single Ashkenazi person lose their lives – this is priority number one for them. In fact, before Russia invaded Ukraine, they sent a message to the billionaire Ukrainian Ashkenazi oligarchs to leave Ukraine so they can be safe. ZeroHedge.com had an article where they showed how the Ashkenazi Oligarchs in Ukraine left Ukraine a few weeks before the war started. So, here is my question: what can we say about the evolutionary genetics of the Russian race when in all their wars against the Ashkenazim, millions of Russians have died, but no Ashkenazi person has lost their lives because the Russians have put policy into place that only millions of Russians should die, but every Russian should give their lives to ensure that not a single Ashkenazi person should lose their life? Does this mean that Russian evolutionary genetics have now failed in the evolutionary wars and Russians will very soon go extinct and be replaced by the genetically superior Ashkenazim?

    One thing I find interesting is that the Russian government has passed a law making it a crime to point out the fact that they are at war with the Ashekenazim. Instead, the Russian government uses proxies such as they are at war with the “west,” or with “Washington,” or with “NATO,” or with “Neo-Nazis,” and so forth. What does this say about the evolutionary genetics of the Russian race? My speculation is that this shows that the Russian genetics have completely degenerated via dysgenics and mutational load, and they will very soon be destroy by the Ashkenazim. But, I am too unintelligent to really understand this, my IQ is only 90. Can the TOO members please explain to me what is going on?

    Some have speculated that Russia was just bluffing about using nukes against the Ashkenazim. It seems to me that the Ashkenazim have also concluded that Russia is just bluffing. As such, they have saturated Ukraine with weapons, such as long range missiles. Soon, I speculate that the Ashkenazim will provide Ukraine with biological/chemical/nuclear weapons to eliminate the entire Russian population. I speculate that Russians as an ethnicity will very soon go extinct. And interestingly, the Russian government themselves have passed laws making it a crime for any Russian to support preserving the Russian race, thus making the job even easier for the Ashkenazim to eliminate all Russians. What does this all say about current Russian evolutionary genetics?

  34. It has been argued – by people more knowledgable than the humble one –
    that Iwan IV Grozny (“awe-inspiring” is a better translation than “terrible”)
    was in a very real sense the creator of the Russian people:
    Secret police and vodka monopoly;
    further, that a certain indolence was an adaptation to harsh winters – indeed
    there have been villages where they almost hibernated, rising once a day to
    discharge of the necessary and sleeping the rest of the time.
    The Ashkenazim (“Ashkenas” = Germany(!) ) filled the same Hofjuden
    niche as in the Polish-Lithuanian realm – bailiffs, tax farmers and vodka
    monopolists – until Catherine the Great put a curb to it in 1791
    (-> Pale of Settlement, and exclusion from certain professions); this particular
    social reform they never forgot.
    In evolutionary biologist terms we have a brain parasite capable of inducing
    suicidal behavior in the host …

  35. The people of east Ukraine welcome the Russians as liberators. Any attempt by west Ukraine and NATO to take back east Ukraine would be resisted as a war of conquest and occupation.

    The Kyiv-controlled Ukrainian army complain that the east Ukrainian civilians are helping Russia, by disclosing their concealed positions to Russian artillery. Hint: they don’t like you, and want to see you defeated.

    20 years ago, NATO engineered stability in the former Yugoslavia by redrawing borders and encouraging ethnic cleansing. Ukraine is also divisible, and is at this point now.

    The ethnic Russian language population of the former east Ukraine have had enough of occupation by Kyiv. They are like the Serbs, only with a nuclear-armed big brother by their side.

    • Agree: JR Foley
  36. There is no Article five war guarantee.

    • Replies: @Greta Handel
  37. @Bill Jones

    Thanks — Mr. Buchanan relentlessly dissembles this.

    Consider. In “Where Does NATO Enlargement End?” published January 11, 2022, he quoted a truncated portion of the document, as demonstrated there in comment #5. He has since served as propagandist, as in this column, about

    an “Article 5” war guarantee

    without quoting any of the words. This can’t at this point be credibly excused by “Pat’s” age — it’s willful misrepresentation.

    Please read and understand this columnist for what he’s become: the Right jamb of the Overton window, obscuring dissident views of Uncle Sam. The Establishment is not threatened when a supposed “Mr. Paleoconservative” helps to sell war to gullible Americans as “our” legal obligation. If yours becomes a Gold Star Family in Ukraine, remember to thank Mr. Buchanan for his Exceptional! service, too.

  38. @Rurik

    I don’t think a direct intervention by NATO would make much difference other than time scale, unless NATO uses nukes. All the none neocon analysis I’ve seen suggests that the US would lose several hundred aircraft in any concerted attack in the Dombass and were I Putin I’d level Oslo to remind the King that having a Norwegian lead NATO is not a Bright Idea.

    Warsaw would be second, just on principal.

    Both the US and Russia have the capability to kill satellites and put communication back to 1840’s levels. The US would not survive. Russia might.

    The European military’s are a joke. It would be fun to watch Erdogan. I believe Turkey would want no part of an attack on Russia. The UK army is 80,000 men (and boys and girls and trannies) given a tooth to tail ration of 1:8 that’s about 9,000 actual fighters.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tooth-to-tail_ratio

    • Replies: @Jokem
    , @Rurik
  39. Jokem says:
    @Bill Jones

    I do not agree, assuming NATO fight it like a war.
    If Russia uses Nukes they know the reprisal will be devastating and Russia will cease to exist as a nation.

    Russia is not Iraq, so they can make war more seriously, but at this point they still have not been able to overwhelm the Ukraine, and with NATO joining in – well – that would be too much.

  40. Rurik says:
    @Bill Jones

    I Putin I’d level Oslo to remind the King that having a Norwegian lead NATO is not a Bright Idea.

    Warsaw would be second, just on principal.

    naw

    I suspect that should NATO intervene, that those responsible understand exactly where Russia’s retaliation would concentrate. The Norwegians are quislings, not the power center that orders them around like dogs.

    Russia knows where the center of evil is in this existential fight for their survival.

    Not Oslo, but London. And a few other chosen targets.

    No doubt ((they’ve)) ran every kind of computer scenario trying to figure out where they can hole up in the event they’ve left no alternatives for Russia, and in every case, even in bunkers deep in the Patagonian mountains, the Kinzhal always finds its mark.

    Oy vey, the poisecution!

  41. Vince McMahon is a goner at Wrestling –perhaps Pat Buchanan can fill in with his big boots —or Justin Trudeau– Boris Johnson—Scottie Morrison —

  42. @JimDandy

    I turn on the TV he is there. I read the news–he is there. I enter University websites –he is there. I view the UN and he is there. Zelenskyy Zelenskyy Zylenkyy Zylenskyy —It shows Zylenskyy spending BIG pile of USA coin on the media and buying friends —Joe Biden — Jackboot Trudeau – Chrystia ( successor to Madeline Albright) Freeland formerly Chomiak as in Chomiak the media newspaper magnet Ukraine best buddies of Stepan Bandera —-

  43. @JimDandy

    Sorry about the late Disagreement.
    So far as I know, Kissinger doesn’t have any grandchildren
    Correct me, If I’m wrong !

  44. “To the U.S., the imperative is that the war be contained, not expanded, and that we not be drawn into a wider war with Russia.”

    I think I disagree. I’ll assume for the sake of argument that even the State Department – Blinken, Nuland, Sherman – don’t actually want nuclear missiles to be flying – but it strikes me that the US, emboldened by Russia’s failure to grab Ukraine in three days and by strong Ukrainian resistance, is in this up to the neck and determined to neuter Russia’s strategic independence “by any means necessary”.

    There’s no way Lithuania shut off traffic to Kaliningrad by their own initiative. And if one lot of sanctions fail, why not try a few more?

    This seeming US dedication to attacking Russia is apparently having reactions even among the many pro-Western Russians.

    https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2022/06/06/why-russian-intellectuals-are-hardening-support-for-war-in-ukraine/

    “An article by Dmitri Trenin, entitled “How Russia must reinvent itself to defeat the West’s ‘hybrid war’: Russia’s very existence is under threat,” may be one of the most consequential published in Russia in recent times — partly for what it says, and partly for who is saying it.

    Dr. Trenin, director of the Carnegie Moscow Center until the Russian government closed it in April, was for many years one of the most important pragmatic Russian voices in support of cooperation with the West and the “westernization” of Russia. He was one of the few Russian figures still to retain some of Gorbachev’s hopes for a “common European home.” (I should say that I have known Dr Trenin since I was a British journalist in Moscow in the 1990s, and I was his colleague at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace between 2000 and 2004).

    The significance of Trenin’s article lies in the evidence it gives of a consolidation of the Russian intellectual elites in support of the war effort in Ukraine. It is not in many cases out of a desire to conquer Ukraine (many of the figures joining this new consensus were strongly opposed to the invasion and loathe Putin), but out of an increasingly strong feeling that the United States is trying to use the war in Ukraine to cripple or even destroy the Russian state, and that it is now the duty of every patriotic Russian citizen to support the Russian government.”

  45. @Max Maxwell

    Yes, but France and Germany control the EU and the only thing that matters to this war is the EU maintaining the sanctions regime and they control the purse about what EU funds Eastern European countries get which matter far more to these nations of beggars than the approval of Americans who didn’t do squat for Eastern Europe. lol

  46. @Rurik

    Ukraine was so oppressed by the Soviets it gained territory from all her neighbors, including Russia lmao

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