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Are Americans All-In for a Long Coronavirus War?
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“It’s a war,” says President Donald Trump of his efforts to contain the coronavirus pandemic, and likening his role to that of “wartime president.”

New York Governor Andrew Cuomo welcomed the president’s claim to his commander in chief role in the crisis and his resolve: “The president and I agreed yesterday… we’re fighting the same war — and this is a war.”

Some measures already taken do call to mind actions in wartime.

Commercial airline flights have been reduced or canceled. Schools have been closed. Universities have shut their doors.

Where Ford, Chrysler, GM and other great auto companies shifted production to jeeps, tanks and bombers in 1942, U.S. auto factories have today been shut down to prevent the spread of the virus.

Bars and restaurants are being closed.

This month, millions of Americans will be added to unemployment rolls, and millions of senior citizens and elderly have already followed government directives to “self-isolate” or “shelter in place.”

There is talk of quarantines lasting not days or weeks, as Americans knew in the days of measles, mumps, chickenpox, scarlet fever and polio, but months.

While a new social solidarity and spirit of self-sacrifice seem to be manifesting themselves in this pandemic, can it endure?

Is the country prepared for months, or years, of social isolation, if that is what is required to win this war?

It is a question that needs to be addressed.

Consider. The Chinese government, whose word is admittedly suspect, claims to have achieved a deceleration in the daily number of new coronavirus infections. The South Koreans say they, too, have broken and reversed the momentum of the spread of the virus.

On March 3, the number of new cases of the coronavirus reported across South Korea was 852. On St. Patrick’s Day, March 17, exactly two weeks later, the count was 85 new cases, a plunge of 90%.

South Korea appears to have “flattened the curve.”

We Americans, however, are far from that.

Exactly how far behind South Korea we are cannot be known until more tens of thousands of Americans are tested, and we learn how many cases of the disease are out there undiscovered and unreported.

But whatever the success of Asian nations in containing the virus, are we politically and socially able to impose the same draconian measures?

Ordering people to “shelter in place” in their own homes, not just for days or weeks but months — can this be done in a free society, as it can be done in the surveillance state of Communist China?

Can mayors and governors of beach towns along the East Coast from Maine to Miami, and the Gulf Coast from Florida to Texas, keep tens of millions from gathering on beaches this summer?

Last week, we saw college kids cavorting on Florida’s beaches, despite warnings that any one among them infected with COVID-19 could transmit it to the rest, leading to grave illness and, in some cases, death.

Moreover, they could become carriers of the disease to parents and siblings. They did not seem to care.

As Prohibition proved, Americans are a rule-breaking people.

Scores of thousands are injured in auto accidents and thousands killed each year from driving under the influence of alcohol, despite tough laws against drunk driving.

Since the 1960s, laws against the use of marijuana, cocaine, heroin, fentanyl, have not halted the rampant ingestion of illegal narcotics and dangerous drugs.

We are endlessly admonished that climate change poses an existential threat to the planet. But have the elites who profess to believe this given up flying in private jets? Have Americans given up their SUVs or ceased to heat their homes with oil and gas?

Are parents going to be able to confine to their homes children whose lives are built around friends on playgrounds? Is the crowd on Martha’s Vineyard going to give up socializing to prevent the spread of the coronavirus?

In the ’60s, we were told that the correlation between cigarette smoking and lung cancer, emphysema and heart disease, is absolute. Yet 34 million Americans continue to risk shortening their lives by smoking.

Seniors and elderly, among whom the mortality rate from the coronavirus is the highest — 15% of those over 80 in one estimate — may shelter in place for months.

But if, in diverse cities, minority communities come out for block parties in summer, are we going to have the police march them back into their homes? Do we have enough cops for that?

A prediction: The longer the orders to shelter in place and self-isolate remain in force, the greater the probability they will begin to be ignored and people will take the risks to end their isolation and be with friends.

Will Americans suffer in social isolation, inside their own homes for months, while a state-induced Great Depression washes over the land?

My guess is that many will rebel.

Patrick J. Buchanan is the author of “Nixon’s White House Wars: The Battles That Made and Broke a President and Divided America Forever.”

Copyright 2020 Creators.com.

 
• Category: Economics, Ideology • Tags: Coronavirus 
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  1. lloyd says: • Website

    The cops are going to rebel too. One in six octogenarians will die from it. So really what is the fuss? The greatest drain on economies is health care for the elderly and chronic invalids. Well is this an evolutionary development for humanity? The rest of the population take on average every few years a bout of viral illness that for a few weeks requires rest and warm environment. Some degrees higher than what modern society has been acclimatised to since the 1950s. I recently saw a photograph sent by Tom Hanks in Australia of a vegemite toast and a glass of water. American were revolted by the overlaid vegemite toast, and baffled by the glass of water. That sort of helps to explain the proliferation of American ill health.

  2. KA says:

    Even as President Trump says he tested negative for coronavirus, the COVID-19 pandemic raises the fear that huge swaths of the executive branch or even Congress and the Supreme Court could also be disabled, forcing the implementation of “continuity of government” plans that include evacuating Washington and “devolving” leadership to second-tier officials in remote and quarantined locations.
    But Coronavirus is also new territory, where the military itself is vulnerable and ….

    According to new documents and interviews with military experts, the various plans – codenamed Octagon, Freejack and Zodiac – are the underground laws to ensure government continuity. They are so secret that under these extraordinary plans, “devolution” could circumvent the normal Constitutional provisions for government succession, and military commanders could be placed in control around America.
    Ads by scrollerads.com
    “We’re in new territory,” says one senior officer, the entire post-9/11 paradigm of emergency planning thrown out the window. The officer jokes, in the kind of morbid humor characteristic of this slow-moving disaster, that America had better learn who Gen. Terrence J. O’Shaughnessy is.
    He is the “combatant commander” for the United States and would in theory be in charge if Washington were eviscerated. That is, until a new civilian leader could be installed. https://www.newsweek.com/exclusive-inside-militarys-top-secret-plans-if-coronavirus-cripples-government-1492878

    It seems we will get very likely an Irish President – long after Kennedy .

    • Replies: @asfg
    , @Twodees Partain
    , @Miro23
  3. anonymous[245] • Disclaimer says:

    Before wasting time trying to discern the point of this say nothing column:

    Consider. Since when have there been “children whose lives are built around friends on playgrounds”?

    Ward Cleaver for President!

    • Replies: @gsjackson
  4. asfg says:
    @KA

    Biden’s brain is mush. Look for him to step aside after he wins the nomination–and, lo and behold,
    Hillary Clinton will become the new nominee.

  5. Anon[348] • Disclaimer says:

    Trump is fighting coronavirus as a proxy war. His real war is still against China, which is why he and the rest of the Ziocon media like Breitbart, Townhall, Daily Caller, Zerohedge etc. insist on calling it “Chinese virus” at every turn. Instead of keeping a laser focus on helping to bring the country together, he continues to use incendiary language to turn people against him. Despite his daily press briefings and proclamations, the Trump admin’s crisis response has been an abject failure:

    1. CDC made a major mistake from the get go by limiting local doctors to only test those who came in from China, it kept the virus spreading silently in the community for weeks before it was detected in a teenager who lives 15 miles from Patient Zero in Snohomish County, WA.

    2. For two months since Jan. 23 when Wuhan went into lockdown, CDC did nothing but watched passively at the horror show that unfolded in China, when they should’ve immediately ordered large scale manufacturing of test kits and masks.

    3. Local hospitals in King County, the “Wuhan” of US, are dangerously short of masks, hand sanitizers, ventilators, beds etc. Mike Pence came to visit a couple of weeks ago and accomplished nothing. It was all just for show. We are still totally short on all equipment even test kits.

    4. Even as S. Korea and Italy were having massive outbreaks, Trump continued to allow in daily flights from both countries, including direct flights from Milan, the center of Italy’s outbreak, to dozens of cities in the US. None of these passengers were ever checked. In our local high school one kid came home sick from Italy over spring break, was back at school within a week, the nurse didn’t even bother checking, she assumed she was checked at the airport.

    5. Seattle Times reported today that passengers who recently returned from Europe were shocked that there was no screening for symptoms whatsoever at SeaTac, and it is one of the “designated” airports where many passengers were redirected for screening. This despite Trump proclaiming that all those coming in will be screened.

    6. The State Dept. is now urging all Americans overseas to return home ASAP, so they can bring in more virus from abroad to infect their families? How stupid can we get?

    7. Lindsay Graham took full advantage of the crisis and inserted his own pork to one of the stimulus bills to increase the number of EB5 visas from 10,000 a year to 75,000 a year, and lowering the threshold from $900k to $400k, so that “more rich foreigners can come in and buy our real estate”. The real estate market was doing just fine even as of last week. And 80% of this visa goes to rich corrupt Chinese, so he’s using this opportunity to bring in more Chinese, even as his boss insists on calling this “Chinese virus”. How much was he paid to insert this pork?

    8. It is utterly and profoundly stupid to send a check to every family. Everything is closed, where are we supposed to spend this money other than on Amazon.com? Do Bill Gates and Jeff Bezos get one too? He could’ve simply spent a fraction by boosting existing unemployment benefits for those temporarily out of work. What an idiotic, knee-jerk response to get us into even more debt unnecessarily, and will only result in minimal impact on the overall economy.

    So no, we are not prepared for a long war, or a short war, or any war. The dysfunction, corruption and incompetence of the US government is laid bare for the whole country to see in this crisis. Increased civil disobedience is just another broken link in the broken chain. We are a basket case of a country, rotten from top to bottom.

    America and Israel are the modern day Sodom and Gomorrah. And we are meeting our fate.

    • Replies: @follyofwar
    , @artichoke
    , @Wally
  6. In the ’60s, we were told that the correlation between cigarette smoking and lung cancer, emphysema and heart disease, is absolute.

    And this is a lie. For 50+ years, the tobacco control establishment has gotten away with falsely blaming smoking for diseases caused by infection: HPV, EBV, H. pylori, CMV, HBV, and HCV. Every Surgeon General report is proof of this fraud. If they even bother to mention infection, there’s no discussion of how it can and does confound the results of the poorly-designed studies favored by the SG clique.

    The bottom line is that at least two thirds of supposed smoking disease is bogus. And the biggest chunk is from blaming smoking for heart disease caused by CMV. NHANES data shows that 40% of cardiovascular disease is due to CMV, with more among the working class, which includes more smokers. http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/38/3/775.full and http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/38/3/787.long

    • Replies: @Lol
  7. Lol says:
    @Grace Jones

    Are you seriously using studies that control for smoking to prove smoking has no link to disease? The entire purpose of those articles is eliminating the effects of smoking from the data to glean the effects of other factors that can explain the part of disease variance not explained by smoking.

    • Replies: @Grace Jones
  8. Wantoknow says:

    The results of the last week show this government has too much power and too much arrogance. For the moment the population seems to be a pack of wusses. The current reaction is fear of the unknown but that should change as time passes. This virus will have to kill a lot of people very soon to justify these actions.

    The costs of this “war” are likely to eventually seem greater than the risks of the virus. Perhaps sooner than later. When that happens the claims of this government will be sorely tested. Hopefully the government will be tested as well.

    Korea apparently has gone with testing for the disease and isolating the infected. It has not shut down its economy to “fight” this virus. This seems the smart approach to me and is what I would have expected. The current approach has the flavor of the policy decisions of an occupying army towards a conquered population. If so who are the occupiers?

  9. swamped says:

    “A prediction: The longer the orders to shelter in place and self-isolate remain in force, the greater the probability they will begin to be ignored and people will take the risks to end their isolation and”…ransack their communities in search of survival rations setting off an unprecedented crime spree & climate of unchecked chaos.
    “Will Americans suffer in social isolation, inside their own homes for months, while a state-induced Great Depression washes over the land?”…or will they be visited by their neighbors breaking into their pantries & closets looking for any horded scarce commodities? Will jails & mental wards be overrun first, as people begin to snap?
    California has always been a bellwether state; what’s going to happen now that Newsom has gone full fascist & ordered everyone inside? Will his National Guard really make sure everyone has enough food (and toys)? This could get really ugly.

    • Agree: follyofwar
    • Replies: @follyofwar
  10. Realist says:

    Oh, the irony. A German scientist, during the Nazi time period, discovered a possible cure for Covid-19…at least 86 years before Israel…who has been bragging that they will soon have a cure .

  11. Realist says:
    @lloyd

    One in six octogenarians will die from it. So really what is the fuss? The greatest drain on economies is health care for the elderly and chronic invalids.

    Here is hoping you don’t make it to the octogenarian class

  12. KenH says:

    But if, in diverse cities, minority communities come out for block parties in summer, are we going to have the police march them back into their homes? Do we have enough cops for that?

    We live in an anarcho-tyranny so the racially diverse can pretty much do as they please while any shelter in place orders will only be enforced against white people.

    The college kids they interviewed have the right attitude as most said the Coronavirus scare has been blown way out of proportion and it has. I think some cases of flu are being misattributed to Cornovirus and if someone doesn’t feel well or has a sniffle or is nauseated then they’re told they have Coronavirus.

    • Replies: @lloyd
    , @follyofwar
    , @gsjackson
  13. @Anon

    As to your point #6, if I was an expat living a normal life in a foreign country, the last thing I would ever consider doing would be to return to the demented US police state.

    Also, as I said to my wife, when Trump takes to the podium with his latest pronouncements, he is always surrounded on either side by “experts.” Don’t see any social distancing there. After meeting with people who have the disease, (that guy from Brazil for one), and shaking who know how many hands, the fact that Trump claims he tested negative for C-19 would lead many to think it is not as communicable, or deadly, as our betters keep telling us.

    And, in the face of a declared National Emergency, I thought it was against protocal for the president and VP to be sharing the same space, which they do constantly. That sounds kind of reckless to me, esp. with Nancy waiting in the wings.

    • Replies: @Anon
  14. anonymous[425] • Disclaimer says:

    Mass immigration and assimilation, ‘diversity’ is an obviously stupid idea. Lowered wages, culture clashes, lowered social trust, less affordable housing, diluted votes, crowding, environmental damage, etc. What’s called ‘far right’ in the West is simply ‘normal’ everywhere else. Is Vietnam ‘racist nationalist supremacist’? Is Peru?

    If you reject ‘diversity’ and open borders as a gift, you’ll get it anyway as punishment. That’s our ‘democracy’. The only place the in world where white Christians derive any benefit from their ‘democratic government’ is Russia and and Eastern Europe, which is precisely why our globalist establishment hates them so much.

    If us ‘evil whites’ offered to seal ourselves on an island somewhere, cut off so we couldn’t possibly oppress anyone under any circumstance, they would say no. So what’s the real goal?

    The globalists aren’t generally demanding the movement of poor into less-poor, e.g. Sudanese into India, Afghans into Vietnam, or Bulgarians into Japan. It’s ONLY nonwhite into white. Open borders ‘diversity’ is demanded for all and only whites including Slavs, Greeks, Irish, Swedes, and many others with no history of ‘oppressing’ and/or a centuries-long history of being colonized and enslaved themselves. And open borders ‘diversity’ is NOT demanded for nonwhite, non-Christian ‘historical oppressors’ like Turkey, Japan, Mongolia, the Arab world.

    The vast majority of the Aboriginals died from airborne diseases long before we arrived, there was no genocide. Antiwhites are not offering to give up their own ‘stolen land’ as they call it back to the Aboriginals, instead they are inviting more random third party ‘thieves’ to share the ‘loot’, including peoples with far bloodier histories as a ruling class than we have. Contrast the fate of the subjugated Ainu, Slavs, Greeks and Armenians, to that of the Aboriginals under whites. Contrast the fate of Africans slaves sent to America to African slaves sent to the Arab world.

    In South Africa, whites settled an empty Cape 400 years ago, long before today’s dominant Bantus showed up. And unlike the Bantus, we did not genocide other helpless tribes on the continent. Apartheid was to protect against being just another tribe exterminated by the Bantus, and against the mass murdering ideology of Communism. Nothing in white SA history is remotely as evil and cruel as the gang rape and torture of minority whites today. You’ll notice antiwhites curiously aren’t concerned about Arab ‘apartheid’ ‘colonialism’ in North Africa.

    Our globalist, anti-Christian, hostile elite hates us with the same genocidal fervor that they felt towards Christians in Bolshevik Russia. They teamed with angry criminal minorities to rape and murder them by the tens of millions, with the most sadistic torture saved for the church men and women. Their end goal today is no different.

    For the 90% of the world we call minorities, protecting their children’s future is an ethical priority, while ‘antiracism diversity’ is not. It’s time we believe the same. Support our guys Ron Unz and Nick Fuentes.

  15. @swamped

    I woke up this morning to find that my PA Governor Wolf has ordered the same lockdown as Newsom. And my state has very few cases compared to the feces-filled Golden State. These rabid dogs are all copying each other as they squeeze the vise further every day. Inside of every politician is an inner fascist waiting to emerge, else why do they seek to rule over us.

    • Replies: @Old and Grumpy
  16. artichoke says:
    @Anon

    He hadn’t cleaned out the CDC from the incompetent Obama-era management. Rod Rosenstein’s sister was a big honcho there! Anyway the CDC is epidemiologists. They’re mathematicians more than doctors. Their sage advice: “wash your hands”. While necessary, that isn’t sufficient.

    Maybe if he hadn’t been constantly attacked, he would have been able to get more of that sort of stuff done in time.

    Now the NIH is much more central, and they’re much more competent.

    • Replies: @Anon
  17. @anonymous

    Modern day Christians, unlike their tough Christian ancestors, have no one to blame but themselves for the dire fate of Western Man. Look no further than the fact that most Christian churches in the US are pro-Israel Zionists. The term Judeo-Christian tradition did not exist until recently, and its use is mostly confined to the US, maybe Canada also.

    The Judeo-Pope running the RC church (why does he wear the came beanie cap as Jews?) loves to preach open borders, just as they do – with Israel exempted of course. Just to take one example, for 19 centuries Christians followed Saint Paul’s teachings and rejected boy circumcision, a crime against humanity, even going to the point of kicking Jews of their countries. Now, in the name of tolerance and inculturation, they no longer have a problem with the torture of boys.

    Putting Ron Unz and Nick Fuentes in the same sentence – you can’t be serious.

  18. Anon[153] • Disclaimer says:
    @follyofwar

    I noticed that too. Each time he gives a presser, there are always a handful of people standing behind him, none are observing the 6′ rule. And in every presser, we always see Pence’s evil face standing behind him. The Albino is probably dying for someone to give Trump the virus, so he can be president, and launch WWIII for his Zionist masters.

    As to Pat’s point about civil disobedience, NY’s governor Cuomo today is investigating reports of teenagers spitting on produce in grocery stores.

    • Replies: @SMK
  19. @Lol

    Absolutely not. In fact, I consider “controlling for smoking” to be extremely improper, because it would automatically falsely blame smoking for heart disease caused by CMV. It suggests that CMV is probably even more important than this report concludes.

    You seem to think that once charlatans have claimed that smoking causes heart disease, that means it’s set in concrete for all eternity, and it is forbidden to reconsider. And you pretend that is scientific!

    As for “glean[ing] the effects of other factors”: Gleaning is what is collected after the main harvest is done. Smoking is a main harvest only for those with a social engineering agenda. This data shows that CMV is at least as important as high blood pressure, which is a real major factor. And those studies relied on by Surgeon General reports simply ignore CMV, which means that they’re confounded to falsely blame smoking.

  20. Anon[153] • Disclaimer says:
    @artichoke

    Now the NIH is much more central, and they’re much more competent.

    Judging from the continued medical staff/equipment/bed shortage, and the chaos and total lack of screening in our airports, I’d say NIH is just another incompetent government bureaucracy like CDC.

    https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/times-watchdog/single-point-of-failure-the-cdcs-past-successes-with-an-fda-process-set-the-table-for-coronavirus-testing-debacle/

    This failure is a combination of bureaucratic red tape between CDC and FDA, and CDC’s utter failure to deliver test kits that are both accurate and in large quantity in a short time.

    Per the Seattle Times, when they investigated why there was no screening of incoming passengers from Europe at SeaTac airport, the CBP, DHS and CDC all were busy dodging responsibility and pointing to one another as the responsible entity. A total FAIL.
    https://www.seattletimes.com/life/travel/travelers-returning-from-europe-to-seattle-tacoma-airport-claim-theres-little-to-no-coronavirus-screening/

    The head of CDC Robert Redfield should step down for utter incompetence.

  21. @asfg

    Re: Hillary becoming the nominee

    That was the plan all along in promoting Biden, whose dementia is now impossible to hide.

    The Democrats let the trash, which makes up its membership, choose the nominee? Phhhttt. Get bent.

    • Replies: @asfg
  22. @lloyd

    You are overlooking how many drugs Americans of all ages take. Not really a good sign of a healthy people. Also what is it with all this ageism?

  23. Paulbe says:
    @lloyd

    While I can understand that in this situation aggressive triage is called for, I am impressed by the speed with which everyone became prepared to hurl the elderly under the bus.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  24. @follyofwar

    Wolfie just wants to show off that freak show called Rachel Lavine. Bet all his male parts are intact, and someone never got the deserved justice for sexual assault due to Rachel’s sexual confusion. Just a speculative hunch. Nor do I think it is some kind of inner fascism on Wolf’s. More like screwing the goynim because of Hitler, Rome, Persia, Egypt, etc… What exactly is essential anyway?

  25. lloyd says: • Website
    @KenH

    The kids are out in the open air. They may be safer there than in sealed apartments. Public transport is likely the second most dangerous place to be. The most dangerous is likely being in an apartment with someone who has it. Pat Buchanon referred to a statistic that octogenarians are one in six fatal with Coronavirus. Well he is in that generational class himself. Then take away octogenarians without underlying health issues and it would be substantially lower. I imagine statistically lower than their dying of cancer. It is a new health hazzard in the world. The health authorities should be issuing practical instructions of how to avoid institutional care. Tom Hanks had the right approach, plenty of wholesome foods and water. He was slated for it. If the virus was natural or a laboratory accident, it has been a marvellous convenience to establish the One Party State. Like 911, Anglo Zionism has again been saved by the bell

  26. @KA

    “They are so secret that under these extraordinary plans, “devolution” could circumvent the normal Constitutional provisions for government succession,”

    Wait a minute. The unconstitutional “two” parties already did that, with their little deal by which they just announce whatever vote count suits them.

  27. @Paulbe

    You seem to be more understanding than I am, Paulbe. This situation appears to be totally contrived, so I don’t understand how any triage is necessary at all, since there are no victims to speak of yet.

    I do agree that it’s appalling how quickly all of these “for the greater good” types went fully morally retarded.

    • Replies: @Franz
  28. @KenH

    Those young kids partying have the right attitude. Stick it to The Man, and remember there is strength in numbers. My instincts tell me that most cops aren’t too happy wasting their time trying to get celebrating college kids off the streets, and their morale must be low. Already many have reported feeling sick, so have been sent home for a 14 day vacation.

  29. KenH says:
    @anonymous

    You’ll notice antiwhites curiously aren’t concerned about Arab ‘apartheid’ ‘colonialism’ in North Africa.

    Nor are they concerned about Israeli apartheid in most cases. I don’t think the S. African government bulldozed homes and shot black S. Africans for sport as Israeli Jews do to Palestinians.

    If whites were as bad and evil as (((they))) say then putting non-whites in our nations puts the non-whites in harm’s way. But we all know it’s just the reverse and with loss of territory due to demographic swamping comes loss of numbers and eventually genocide which is (((their))) goal.

    Whites have been completely cleansed from neighborhoods and cities and very soon, states and regions.

  30. Sparkon says:

    If the 1918 Influenza pandemic is any template, we could be in for a long war against this novel coronavirus, now named SARS-CoV-2, responsible for the disease known as COVID-19.

    These data are from Newfoundland, but the data and charts are representative of the 1918 pandemic’s infamous three waves that swept around the world 1918 – 1920.

    https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ajhb.23198

    Unusual for a flu, this bug first reared its head in spring 1918, then appeared to recede, only to come roaring back in the autumn, with the biggest death spike in October 1918.

    Reported cases of Spanish flu dropped off over the summer of 1918, and there was hope at the beginning of August that the virus had run its course. In retrospect, it was only the calm before the storm. Somewhere in Europe, a mutated strain of the Spanish flu virus had emerged that had the power to kill a perfectly healthy young man or woman within 24 hours of showing the first signs of infection.

    In late August 1918, military ships departed the English port city of Plymouth carrying troops unknowingly infected with this new, far deadlier strain of Spanish flu. As these ships arrived in cities like Brest in France, Boston in the United States and Freetown in west Africa, the second wave of the global pandemic began.

    https://www.history.com/news/spanish-flu-second-wave-resurgence

    (my bold)

    So far, I don’t see very many young people taking this pandemic seriously, because, you know – “Let’s Party!” – but thankfully, the people in charge are older, wiser, and well aware that an ounce of prevention in this case is indeed worth a pound, if not a ton, of cure.

    Any highly contagious disease like this could overwhelm our hospitals if the number of cases grows too rapidly, so it is good to see Pres. Trump and his team taking the measures they have, and also Gov. Newsom of California, Gov. Cuomo of New York, and Gov. Pritzker of Illinois following suit with good leadership by issuing stay-home directives in those states.

    First and foremost, this is a public health issue. The safest place for you and everyone else is at home. In order to preserve the public health and the public health system, we will have to endure some unfortunate but common-sense restrictions until this disease runs its course, or until effective treatments and vaccines are available.

    Already, there is encouraging news out of Japan.

    https://www.livescience.com/flu-drug-could-treat-coronavirus.html

    Be smart, stay well.

    And always close the lid before flushing the toilet.

    • Disagree: Zumbuddi
    • Replies: @Three of Swords
    , @CCZ
  31. Miro23 says:
    @KA

    According to new documents and interviews with military experts, the various plans – codenamed Octagon, Freejack and Zodiac – are the underground laws to ensure government continuity. They are so secret that under these extraordinary plans, “devolution” could circumvent the normal Constitutional provisions for government succession, and military commanders could be placed in control around America.

    COG (Continuity Of Government) organization is certainly in place, and the Zio-Globalists tried to trigger it (unsuccessfully) under Cheney on the day of 9/11.

    There’s a consensus that the worst of the Coronavirus crisis has passed but this isn’t necessarily true. The oil price hit a new low today (21st April) with the oil price being an important indicator of the economic effect of the Coronavirus shut down (independent from the Saudi-Russia question).

    If the thing continues down, then COG could well become a reality, and it will be judged locally. COG will need be represented in every county and state by some sort of enforcement (Police/Homeland Security/Military) and their interaction with the public will determine the future of the US.

    For what it’s worth, my guess is that enforcement will side with the locals.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  32. fenestol says:

    Americans all-in for Long Dong Silver.

  33. @Miro23

    I would hope that LE would side with the locals, but it doesn’t seem likely to me. LEOs have an attitude, at least the ones I’ve observed, that they aren’t part of the citizenry. There are bars that are pretty much off-limits to non LE. Maybe in rural county police forces, the cops might be more apt to see their fellow citizens differently, but I’ve noticed a subtle contempt for civilians displayed by cops.

    Charlotte police were very obviously a community apart when I lived there. The same was true in Wilmington, DE in the relatively small force there, and I’ve noticed it in other cities. Expecting any sympathy from police seems to me to be a little irrational.

  34. Talha says:

    As Prohibition proved, Americans are a rule-breaking people.

    Well, as I pointed out elsewhere, the first amendment literally states; “the right of the people peaceably to assemble”.

    So this could be challenged (not saying it should be) on constitutional grounds. “Muh frat party” seems to be a stupid reason to take a risk, but whatever.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @SolontoCroesus
  35. Franz says:
    @Twodees Partain

    This situation appears to be totally contrived

    At least.

    It’s flu season. Not very many more people than usual dying, but the extra ones that are dying can be chalked up to the idiocy of outsoucing, cunningly labelled “free trade,” and the totally artificial amount of worldwide air travel, nine-tenths of which can be chalked up to numbskulls with more money than brains going off to places that don’t want them anyway and overcharge their dumb asses for the privilege.

    It would be worth it if we all got a dose of tend-your-own-garden sanity. Which means it won’t be worth it.

  36. China has shown us exactly what must be done to end this threat, in pictures, every day. We, the #1 country in the Universe, did nothing. China is virus free and back to work. Business, almost, as usual. WE, the mighty, are falling into an abyss, probably fatally.

    • Replies: @Chinaman
    , @Neo-Socratic
  37. Realist says:

    All death statistics are from government data.
    Is anyone checking to see if the data is correct?
    Does anyone know the name of one person who died from Covid-19?
    Has anyone checked to see what the death certificate states as cause of death?
    Is anyone checking…anything?

    Or are people just running around like chickens with their head cut off?

  38. @Talha

    How about “Muh church service”?

    “Muh protest-rally against the Pompeo-Bolton-Netanyahu persecution of Iranians”?

    Pompeo and Netanyahu paved a path to war with Iran, and they’re pushing Trump again
    -Gareth Porter
    https://thegrayzone.com/2020/03/20/pompeo-netanyahu-war-iran-trump/

    Stupid reasons to take risk?

    How significant is the risk REALLY?

    Is the risk of catching Covid19 greater than the risk of hundreds of thousands of men and women being cut off from their friends, family, and faith?

    Greater than the risk of evil and madmen who are attempting to subvert the President and rule of law in league with accused corrupt head of another state provoking a war against Iran — that much risk?

    Mannagio! Pompeo
    Not in my name!
    Not in the name of Americans who are Italian

    • Agree: follyofwar
  39. Chinaman says:
    @Robert Magill

    This already prove who is number 1 in the world. All Americans know is to flex his muscles.

    Paper tiger, as Mao said. Why do Americans still hang on to that fantasy of being #1?

    The unconditional glorification of the the individual pursuit of happiness ( like those teens on the beach) at the expense of the greater good ensures that society will collapse in the long run. Liberty without responsibility is a disaster. Thin line between Liberty and anarchy. The leviathan is needed
    for a reason. Asians intuitively understand that each of us need to sacrifice such that society can ensure. It is common sense.

    I am amused by the rapid dissolution of America. can’t help a bit of schadenfreude given all the misery that America have brought onto the world

    This is the perfect opportunity for China to launch a preemptive war against America. It is going to happen sooner or later anyway.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  40. Chinaman says:

    Any of my Unz buddies need masks or medical supplies from the Chinaman? I have plenty and have sent a bunch to Italy.

    Sorry, but can’t help but imagine how funny the scene where obese Americans fight and shoot each other on the streets for masks and disinfectants as I drop from the rooftop.

  41. @Chinaman

    As you must be aware President XI emulates the Great Khan ergo, no war. He has other ways to be victorious.

  42. JimB says:
    @Franz

    worldwide air travel, nine-tenths of which can be chalked up to numbskulls with more money than brains going off to places that don’t want them anyway and overcharge their dumb asses for the privilege.

    They don’t want foreign tourists, but they do want the easy money of foreign tourism. For example, tourism underwrites Italy’s lazy, self-indulgent child-free lifestyle.

    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
  43. Since the 1960s, laws against the use of marijuana, cocaine, heroin, fentanyl, have not halted the rampant ingestion of illegal narcotics and dangerous drugs.

    One certain result of the legalization of marihuana is that there are going to be more potheads, more mass killings, and more death! The costs will be borne by society and the families of future victims of potheads! Marihuana is the gateway drug, the escalator drug, to cocaine, heroin and fentanyl. Just one taste of the devil weed and it is only a matter of time until you are eating fentanyl patches.

    According to a report in the Rocky Mountain News, 370 people were killed across the state on Jan. 1, the first day the drug became legal for adults to purchase. Several more are clinging onto life in local emergency rooms and are not expected to survive.

    “It’s complete chaos here,” says Dr. Jack Shepard, chief of surgery at St. Luke’s Medical Center in Denver. “I’ve put fifty college students in body bags since breakfast and more are arriving every minute.

    “We are seeing cardiac arrests, hypospadias, acquired trimethylaminuria and multiple organ failures. By next week the death toll could be more than 9000. Someone needs to step in and stop this madness. My god, why did we legalize marihuana? What were we thinking?”

    The New York Times reported that a 27-year-old Mexican named Escrado Valle, “crazed from injecting just one marihuana,” “ran amuck in a local hospital and killed six persons before he could be subdued.”

    The New York Times also chronicled the fate of an unfortunate family who happened upon the most sinister of herbs…

    A widow and her children have been driven insane by eating the marihuana plant, according to doctors, who say that there is no hope of saving the children’s lives and that the mother will be insane for the rest of her life.

    The tragedy occurred while the body of the father, who had been killed by the coronavirus, was still in the hospital.

    The mother was without money to buy other food for the children, whose ages range from 2 to 15, so they gathered some herbs and vegetables growing in the yard for their dinner.

    Two hours after the mother and children had eaten the plants they were stricken. Neighbors, hearing outbursts of crazed laughter, rushed to the house to find the entire family insane.

    Examination revealed that the narcotic marihuana plant was growing among the garden vegetables.

    Will the trail of carnage left in the wake of this marihuana epidemic ever end?

    And remember, it’s important to know your tolerance before you eat your fentanyl patches.

    https://opiateaddictionsupport.com/chewing-fentanyl-patch/

    • LOL: follyofwar
  44. gsjackson says:
    @anonymous

    You’ve got Paddy nailed.

  45. gsjackson says:
    @KenH

    Allegedly (by Robert David Steele and the X22 Report) there are 50-80 percent false positives rendered by the tests. In their view this is a rather unlethal bioweapon intended to damage the economy enough that Trump will lose in November, and false positives are needed to keep the panic and economic collapse going.

    I never know what to believe any more, but this business is smelling more and more like a hoax. When was the last time a corporate media consensus on anything was in fact true? Serious question. While it’s rebuttable, the presumption always is that what they produce is agenda-driven propaganda, and nothing more.

  46. anonymous[326] • Disclaimer says:

    wow PAT you Missed IT…the key word IMMIGRATION before-after a pandemic…Open borders like Italy??? even ultraliberal Canada’Tradeu closing the borders….lets hear the DEMs antifa now???

  47. @asfg

    As I understand, her health ain’t all that great either, so we should be looking at who would be 3rd in line.

  48. @lloyd

    As another pointed out in a comment elsewhere on this site, these “elderly and chronic patients” were probably not always a “great drain” on the system, and probably contributed their share to it and maybe more. Maybe their current health issues resulted from those contributions. Should they now be written off a priori and discarded like a bag of moldy tangerines?

    • Replies: @follyofwar
  49. @Sparkon

    Hopefully a lesson will be learned from the 1918-1920 flu outbreak and “victory” will not be proclaimed prematurely.

    In looking at the statistics in Illinois, total known cases went from 585 yesterday to 753. Of this new total, almost 73% are in Cook County/Chicago. If you take the total from Cook, Lake County just to the North and DuPage to the West, the percentage is almost 90%.

    My bet is that the majority of the cases in the neighboring counties originated from Cook.

    I haven’t looked at the numbers or patterns for other major cities and hate to generalize, but I think quarantine measures should be considered for major metropolitan areas in addition to just the “stay-at-home”. Properly screened medical personnel would be exempt.

  50. Exactly how far behind South Korea we are cannot be known until more tens of thousands of Americans are tested, and we learn how many cases of the disease are out there undiscovered and unreported.

    I would add few more zeros to that. South Korea has reportedly tested a quarter of a million. The US population is roughly 6 times that. Millions need to be tested.

  51. @Franz

    Yes, that’s about it, in a nutshell. It won’t be worth it.

  52. @Three of Swords

    No they should not be written off. Still, a huge problem in America is that many of the elderly are too afraid of dying – and there is nothing more natural in life than dying. It happens to everyone. Some people, or their loved ones, insist on staying alive in nursing homes even though all hope is lost, and the only thing keeping them alive is high tech medicine. At some point death is a blessing, and people need to come to grips with that. Maybe this virus is nature’s way of telling those sick and elderly vegetating in nursing homes that they have lived too long and it is time to meet their maker.

    Former Colorado governor Richard Lamm put it more crudely when he said old folks “have a duty to die.”

    • Replies: @Three of Swords
    , @Anon
  53. Wally says:
    @Anon

    But no criticism of Italy and Spain whose infection & death rates are many, many times higher.

    Trump declared a health emergency Jan. 31, stopped flights from China, no one else did.

    BTW, previous CV-19 tests elsewhere have shown to be highly inaccurate.

    Trump landslide 2020

    • Replies: @nsa
    , @bluedog
  54. CCZ says:
    @Sparkon

    “And always close the lid before flushing the toilet.”

    Here’s why you should always close the toilet lid before you flush: toilet plume, the dispersal of microscopic particles into the air as a result of flushing a toilet.

    “Research suggests that this toilet plume could play an important role in the transmission of infectious diseases for which the pathogen is shed in feces or vomit,” the scientists wrote in the American Journal of Infection Control. “The possible role of toilet plume in airborne transmission of norovirus, SARS, and pandemic influenza is of particular interest.” [American Journal of Infection Control, 2015]

    • Replies: @Sparkon
    , @follyofwar
  55. @follyofwar

    I grant you that. But if these folks do not contract the virus, as the institutions responsible for them are tightening security, they will continue to cling to life or be kept on life support, placing the onus back on the patient and/or their relatives.

    To quote from the Kenny Rogers’ (RIP) song:

    “You’ve got to know when to hold ’em
    Know when to fold ’em”.

    I only hope that when my time comes I will remember these lines.

    Back to the virus, however, your comment made me consider that this could also be nature’s way of humbling man, in general.

    Cheers.

  56. @Robert Magill

    China IS NOT back to work, at least in Wuhan.

    Here is real time traffic data in Wuhan compared to last year.

    https://www.tomtom.com/en_gb/traffic-index/wuhan-traffic

  57. Sparkon says:
    @CCZ

    Yes. Please see my previous comment here, where I talk about the toilet plume, and related issues:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/arguably-wrong-potential-american-deaths-range-from-5k-to-5-million/#comment-3781998

    To summarize and expand a little on that comment, the novel coronavirus SARS-CoV-2 responsible for the disease known as COVID-19 has been found in the stool of some patients.

    According to Chinese researchers, almost half of the infected patients in China were suffering from digestive tract disorders, including diarrhea, and that was their main complaint.

    A Purdue University air quality expert claims that “cruise ship air conditioning systems are not designed to filter out particles as small as the coronavirus, allowing the disease to rapidly circulate to other cabins.”

    Previously, Japanese researchers had found that the air in public restrooms is contaminated with aerosolized fecal matter from toilet plumes.

    Obviously, the best plan is to avoid entirely all public restrooms. In most of these, the crappers have no lids, at least in the U.S.A., and one must assume that virtually every hard smooth surface in a public restroom will be contaminated with little dew drops of doo doo.

    Could aerosolized fecal matter possibly carrying SARS-CoV-2 circulate through HVAC systems in some buildings?

    The journey that a virally infected droplet would experience to arrive back in an occupied space would typically include extended ducted air pathways, multiple changes in direction and air velocity, and multiple impacting surfaces including air filters, fans, dampers and grilles. There is a good likelihood that a particle would impact, entrain and dry on a surface.

    While published research on healthcare ventilation systems and scenarios suggests that the transmission of droplets containing viral material is theoretically possible in these situations, it is thought to be less likely in a well-designed and properly maintained typical HVAC system in a public setting.

    https://www.thefifthestate.com.au/innovation/facilities-management/hvac-and-covid-19-explained/

    At home, always close the lid before flushing the toilet, and then immediately wash the hands, lower arms, and face with hot, soapy water. If you are lucky, no one else is using your toilet, even luckier if you are one of those people whose ship doesn’t sink.

    Something like that, anyway.

  58. Ann H. says:

    A prediction: The longer the orders to shelter in place and self-isolate remain in force, the greater the probability they will begin to be ignored and people will take the risks to end their isolation and be with friends.

    As Prohibition proved, Americans are a rule-breaking people.

    Of course. Americans like freedom! They are not like most colonized Canadians who prefer to obey, and remain serfs for the Ottawa’s mob.

    We, Quebecers, have to go on sites like UNZ or other American website to have our comments published. Otherwise all our posts are deleted by the CBC, Powercorporation and other BS MSMs who prefer to publish the opinion of Ukrainian, Kosovars, or any other mob or ”rebels” affiliated with Al-Qaeda in Libya and Syria.

    Thanks for being there, America. I’m sure you’ll get out of this ”crisis” long before servile, rampant, and dead-brain canadians.

    • Replies: @follyofwar
  59. SMK says: • Website
    @Anon

    Does anyone believe that most of the young are going to stay at home for months, or even weeks, especially blacks and Mestizos/Amerindians. How many inner-city black males, most of them violent and/or recidivist criminals, have the disicipline and self-control to stay in the homes of their welfare mothers rather than go out on the streets to engage in drug-trafficking, giving them the money to buy drugs, or commit aggravated assaults, muggings, armed robberies, home invasions in white neighborhoods, burglaries, acts of vandalism, rapes and gang-rape, abuctions, murders, etc., or simply hanging out all day or night and harassing and propositioning females. Imagine the anarchy and chaoes if it takes months to defeat this virus or even contol it to the degree that life can return to normal.

    If it takes years to defeat this pandemic, as Pat suggests, which is unlikely but not inconceivable, the economy will collapse into a depression far worse than the “great depression” of the 1930s in the mass disorder and violencea it will engender in large and medium-size cities with nonwhite-majority populations, unprecedented anarchy and riots and crime and mayhem which could only be ended by martial law enforced by the police and national guard and probably also the army and marine corp and all that that entails in respect to privacy and freedom and constitutional rights.

    This pandemic must be contolled, and defeated, in weeks, not months. And the borders must be closed to end an invasion of illegal aliens, especially from Mexico and Central American, and legal immigration must be ended or significantly reduced. If not, America as we’ve known it, and know it even now, is finished.

    • Replies: @Bahmi
  60. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Franz

    and the totally artificial amount of worldwide air travel, nine-tenths of which can be chalked up to numbskulls with more money than brains going off to places that don’t want them anyway and overcharge their dumb asses for the privilege.

    Yep. It might be a good thing if the airlines never recover from this disaster.

    Perhaps we need to explain to middle-class people that international air travel is not a basic human right.

    • Agree: follyofwar
    • Replies: @Franz
  61. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Chinaman

    I am amused by the rapid dissolution of America. can’t help a bit of schadenfreude given all the misery that America have brought onto the world

    I can’t help agreeing.

  62. @JimB

    Are you blaming all Italians for some of the very poor choices made by successive preceding Italian governments? I wonder if that standard were to be applied to the US, would it render all Americans morally culpable for the many murderous war crimes committed by their previous governments during the many military adventures?

  63. SafeNow says:

    “…have lived too long and it is time to meet their maker.”

    You had me until the euphemism “meet their maker.”

    Two more humidifiers arrived here yesterday. I kept the Amazon box in the garage for a day, so that any viruses on the cardboard would die. Deployed them today. Not ready to die. I do hope to meet my maker. But in these times, no euphemisms. I speak plainly.

  64. @Neo-Socratic

    The last of the 30,000 doctors, nurses, etc left Wuhan yesterday, 3/21 to return to normal life.

  65. DaveE says:
    @anonymous

    I think it’s important to keep the big picture in mind when trying to assess the details. This whole contrived pandemic-panic is simply a precursor for 9/11 round two. But the “long game” for the zionists is to drive US to war with Russia, China and of course, Iran. Mutual annihilation of all the Goyim is the goal. World War III is the means to accomplish that vile Old Testament goal — of G_d’s Chosen taking control of “all the nations and all the affairs of men.” (Deuteronomy somewhere.)

    In order to do that, the zionists need to create a pretext to go to war with Russia or China. They already tried Russia with Mueller-gate and Impeachment-gate. Both flopped miserably and only succeeded in waking many up to the zionist agenda behind the wheel. So now the zionists must get serious about starting a war with China, hoping to draw Russia in later.

    The zionists have succeeded in convincing many Chinese that the US introduced coronavirus into their country, an act of war. They have also convinced many Americans of the opposite; that China introduced the virus to the US.

    So what’s next? There’s nothing too dirty or vile for these creatures, but I think they must be running out of options.

    IMHO the zionists will opt for their ol’ reliable standby, the False-Flag Terror Attack, this time to be blamed on China. They’ve tried almost everything else, it seems.

  66. nsa says:
    @Wally

    It took your hero, Trumpstein, 6 weeks to cave and go full viral hysteric. Damn, come October wanted to see all those moms in N95 masks outside the White House gate chanting “Trump lied and granny died……Trumps lied and granny died….” in front of the nitwit cable news cameras.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @anon
  67. anon[261] • Disclaimer says:
    @nsa

    “all those masks” would reflect “the cunning of history” if they stymied all the surveillance cameras.

    However, since no one is allowed to travel, Hegel’s going to have to figure out a way to bridge that gap.

  68. Bahmi says:

    Trump is a disgrace to the human race.

    • Troll: follyofwar
    • Replies: @John Johnson
  69. Bahmi says:
    @SMK

    The “virus” is not about sickness, it’s about taking over the world, destroying our economy, etc. The “virus” is a distraction to allow that.

    • Agree: DaveE
    • Replies: @DaveE
  70. Anon[214] • Disclaimer says:
    @follyofwar

    At some point death is a blessing, and people need to come to grips with that. Maybe this virus is nature’s way of telling those sick and elderly vegetating in nursing homes that they have lived too long and it is time to meet their maker.

    Or, don’t eat bats like cavemonkeys.

  71. anon[261] • Disclaimer says:
    @nsa

    all those moms in N95 masks outside the White House gate chanting “Trump lied and granny died……Trumps lied and granny died….”

    . . . oh to reproduce what that would sound like thru recycled masks, or masks helpfully stitched up by blue-haired DAR types pining for a reprise of scratching cotton to make gauze for “our boys on the Potomac.”

    try it — put something over your mouth and say “Trump lied granny died”

    “-rump eyed — rannee — eyed”

    America: the land of the addled and home of the brain-dead.

    Darwin update: evolution works backward once it meets the headwind of propaganda

  72. @CCZ

    It’s pretty hard to always close the toilet seat when these low-flow toilets can’t digest a large dump, and have to be plunged (or snaked), and flushed 4 times before your toilet is finally cleared.

    • Replies: @NoseytheDuke
  73. Franz says:
    @dfordoom

    Perhaps we need to explain to middle-class people that international air travel is not a basic human right.

    Totally agree.

    But I’ve known well-heeled libertarians who actually do think that way. The workers of the world didn’t unite, but the spoiled brats of the world did.

  74. @Ann H.

    Our governor has issued a shelter-in-place order, only “essential” businesses allowed open. And he has threatened us with more draconian actions to come. I just spent a beautiful afternoon outside walking on a brisk sunny day, and I never saw so many people out running and walking, teaching their kids to ride bikes, and playing tennis and basketball. I can’t recall seeing so many friendly people who went out of their way to say hello. If our clueless governor want everyone to stay home, it is clearly backfiring.

  75. DaveE says:
    @Bahmi

    Exactly. There’s no such thing as a virus that’s both easily transmitted in air AND lethal-on-contact, as the media constantly tries to con you. For the simple reason that if a virus is happy in the air, we are constantly exposed to it and our bodies have long-ago developed the necessary antibodies to dispose of it. Conversely, blood-borne viruses that are very virile in the bloodstream (HIV, hepatitis, rabies) don’t survive more than a few minutes when exposed to things like air and sunshine, so we’re never exposed to them and therefore don’t have the required antibodies to expel them.

    So guess what? You’re being conned, folks. There ain’t no pandemic, and there never will be a pandemic that wipes out humanity. It ain’t even statistically possible. If it were, it would have happened a million years ago, already.

    Good nutrition, common sense and basic hygiene are more than enough to maintain a natural balance of things. And whatever you do, DO NOT let a zionist or their “useful idiots” stick a needle in your arm. If you do, you will probably find out what a truly lethal blood-borne virus can do and it won’t be pretty. But it sure as hell won’t be no stinkin’ “coronavirus” you caught from some Chinese person’s bad-breath.

    • Troll: Corvinus
  76. bluedog says:
    @Wally

    And wally as normal is laying a turd on someones front lawn where the truth never sees the light of day, Trump was notified on the January 3 about the virus and his reply was its nothing to worry about go to work, go shopping, fake news fake news,he pissed away 3 weeks doing nothing, when he should have been shutting down the border and stopping flights,Its stupid people like wally that spend their time spreading propaganda and misinformation that cause much of the harm, in ways they are worse than the virus.!!!

  77. @Bahmi

    Trump is a disgrace to the human race.

    As if the Democrats would do any better. Let’s not forget that Biden and the media called Trump’s Chinese travel bans racist and xenophobic.

    Neither party is serious about hiring the best of the best.

    Democrats *want to believe* that White men are the problem so they only attract career politicians like Biden. White men with integrity and intelligence are not attracted to an ideology that demonizes them for being too unequal. Democrats value diversity over quality and everyone knows it. Well if hereditarians are right then they have major problems if we are talking about hiring the top .01%.

    Republicans have too many idiots in their ranks that think the “Free market” is everything. Half of them don’t even know what to think outside of what Fox tells them. This leads to deluded thinking and misplaced blame.

    We are stuck between two dumb parties. The fact that after the cringeworthy Democrat primary they can only come up with Biden speaks volumes. Biden should be retired.

    • Agree: bluedog
  78. asfg says:
    @Kolya Krassotkin

    Why are so hostile? I think Hillary is repulsive scum.

  79. @follyofwar

    Too much information, and probably too much fibre as well.

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