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A Tonkin Gulf Incident in the Gulf of Oman?
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A week ago, the MT Mercer Street, a Japanese-owned tanker managed by a U.K.-based company owned by Israeli billionaire Eyal Ofer, sailing in the Arabian Sea off the coast of Oman, was struck by drones.

A British security guard and Romanian crew member were killed.

Britain and the U.S. immediately blamed Iran, and the Israelis began to beat the war drums.

Monday, Israeli Defense Minister Benny Gantz said action against Iran should be taken “right now.”

Tuesday, Prime Minister Naftali Bennett warned Israel could “act alone.” “They can’t sit calmly in Tehran while igniting the entire Middle East — that’s over,” said Bennett. “We are working to enlist the whole world, but when the time comes, we know how to act alone.”

Wednesday, Gantz ratcheted it up, “Now is the time for deeds — words are not enough. … It is time for diplomatic, economic and even military deeds. Otherwise the attacks will continue.”

Thursday, Gantz went further: “Israel is ready to attack Iran, yes. … We are at a point where we need to take military action against Iran. The world needs to take action against Iran now.”

And what do the Americans say?

“We are confident that Iran conducted this attack,” said Secretary of State Antony Blinken. “We are working with our partners to consider our next steps and consulting with governments inside the region and beyond on an appropriate response, which will be forthcoming.”

Iran, however, has repeatedly denied that it ordered the attack.

What makes the attack puzzling is its timing, as it occurred just days before the inauguration of the newly elected president of Iran, the ultraconservative hardliner Ebrahim Raisi.

Query: Would Raisi have ordered a provocative attack on an Israeli-owned vessel, just days before taking office, when his highest priority is a lifting of the “maximum pressure” sanctions imposed on his country by former President Donald Trump? Why?

Would Raisi put at risk his principal diplomatic goal, just to get even with Israel for some earlier pinprick strike in the tit-for-tat war in which Iran and Israel have been engaged for years? Again, why?

If not Raisi, would the outgoing president, the moderate Hassan Rouhani, have ordered such an attack on his last hours in office and risk igniting a war with Israel and the U.S. that his country could not win?

Could the attack have been the work of rogue elements in the Iranian Republican Guard Corps? Gantz and Foreign Minister Yair Lapid claim that Saeed Ara Jani, head of the drones section of the IRGC, “is the man personally responsible for the terror attacks in the Gulf of Oman.”

Or was this simply a reflexive Iranian reprisal for Israeli attacks?

For years, Israel and Iran have been in a shadow war, with Iran backing Hamas in Gaza, Hezbollah in Lebanon, the Houthi rebels in Yemen, and the Shia militia in Syria and Iraq.

Israel has both initiated and responded to attacks with strikes on Iranian-backed militia in Lebanon, Syria and Iraq, and by sabotaging Iran’s nuclear program and assassinating its nuclear scientists.

But whoever was behind the attack in the Gulf of Oman, and whatever the political motive, the U.S. was not the target, and the U.S. should not respond militarily to a drone strike that was not aimed at us.

No one has deputized us to police the Middle East, and we have not prospered these last two decades by having deputized ourselves.

With America leaving Afghanistan and U.S. troops in Iraq transiting out of any “combat” role, now is not the time to get us ensnared in a new war with Iran.

Lest we forget. It was in an August, 57 years ago, that the Tonkin Gulf incident occurred, which led America to plunge into an eight-year war in Vietnam.

ORDER IT NOW

President Joe Biden’s diplomatic goal with Iran, since taking office, has been the resurrection of the 2015 nuclear deal from which former President Donald Trump walked away. In return for Iran’s reacceptance of strict conditions on its nuclear program, the U.S. has offered a lifting of Trump’s sanctions.

Whoever launched the drone strike sought to ensure that no new U.S.-Iran deal is consummated, that U.S. sanctions remain in place, and that a U.S. war with Iran remain a possibility.

But, again, why would Tehran carry out such a drone attack and kill crewmen on an Israeli-owned vessel — then loudly deny it?

Since he took office, Biden has revealed his intent to extricate the U.S. from the “forever wars” of the Middle East and to pivot to the Far East and China. By this month’s end, all U.S. forces are to be out of Afghanistan, and the 2,500 U.S. troops still in Iraq are to be repurposed, no longer to be designated as combat troops.

Those behind this attack on the Israeli-owned vessel do not want to reduce the possibility of war between the United States and Iran.

They want to make it a reality. We ought not accommodate them.

Patrick J. Buchanan is the author of “Nixon’s White House Wars: The Battles That Made and Broke a President and Divided America Forever.”

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: American Military, Iran 
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  1. Jokem says:

    I think Iran is continually testing the worlds resolve.
    This may be an example of that.
    I would like to know how this Ebrahim Raisi could order an attack when he was not yet in office?
    Was this an attempt by hard line elements to get into his good graces?

    I have never been fond of involving the USA in entangling alliances, but technology has changed the face of warfare, and thus, its dynamic.

  2. Begemot says:

    Says Mr. Buchanan:

    A week ago, the MT Mercer Street, a Japanese-owned tanker [emphasis added] managed by a U.K.-based company owned by Israeli billionaire Eyal Ofer, sailing in the Arabian Sea off the coast of Oman, was struck by drones.

    Then Mr. Buchanan twice refers to the ship as Israeli owned:

    Would Raisi have ordered a provocative attack on an Israeli-owned vessel …?

    But, again, why would Tehran carry out such a drone attack and kill crewmen on an Israeli-owned vessel — then loudly deny it?

    Very sloppy on Mr. Buchanan’s part, a carelessness which only furthers a misperception that Israel is under attack.

    Per the Washington Post:

    Zodiac Maritime described the Mercer Street’s owners as Japanese, without naming them. Shipping authority Lloyd’s List identified the vessel’s ultimate owner as Taihei Kaiun Co., which belongs to the Tokyo-based Nippon Yusen Group.

    And Zodiac Maritime, who managed the Liberian flagged Mercer Street’s operation? Per the same newspaper:

    London-based Zodiac Maritime, part of Israeli billionaire Eyal Ofer’s Zodiac Group

    The only thing Israeli that has been attacked is the revenues of an Israeli billionaire. A cause worth killing thousand’s for?

    Again, very sloppy work Pat.

  3. roonaldo says:

    Israel and the U.S. are already waging economic and kinetic war against Iran, but neither is willing to go it alone in a large-scale conflict.

    The neocon fools will initiate the larger war after a humdinger of a black flag operation once they’ve lined up enough stupid nations to ensure air and naval dominance. They figure on taking out Russian bases in Syria and ousting Assad. They will risk nuclear war in their feverish fantasies of world domination.

    • Agree: donut
    • Replies: @follyofwar
  4. Altai says:

    It’s a question as old as time, why do Israel’s enemies keep doing things to provoke a military intervention from the US when it’s of absolutely no necessity or interest to them to do so. And always at the worst times.

    It’s a shame the media doesn’t seem interested.

    • Agree: Kratoklastes
  5. Credit where credit is due. Pat Buchanan (or his ghostwriter) is not afraid to call a false flag when he sees one.
    Go Pat!!!

    • Agree: Rurik
    • Replies: @WJ
  6. Molip says:

    No mention of the dozen or more Israeli attacks on Iranian shipping reported by the Wall Street Journal.

    I take it that Iran is supposed to simply turn the other cheek and ignore these constant attacks on shipping, bombings in Syria and murder of its scientists on home soil.

  7. @Begemot

    I think the question is why Israel would carry out such an attack on a de-facto Israeli merchant vessel, though one de-jure, the hull, Japanese-owned, killing a few Gentiles.

    Of course, Israel does not engage in deception or false-flag attacks and blame Iran. Of course not!

  8. @Jokem

    More perceptive readers understand the Gulf of Tonkin and other hints that those responsible for this incident aren’t likely Iranian. But misleading people like Jokem is how Mr. Buchanan serves the Establishment.

    • Replies: @SaneClownPosse
    , @Jokem
  9. From the track record of such “attacks” across the Middle East over the past few decades, perhaps we should just assume that any claimed kinetic damage to Israeli, American or associated assets, or on the helpless “oppressed” citizens of the Empire’s chosen adversaries, is a false flag until emphatically proven otherwise.

  10. @roonaldo

    Well, Washington hasn’t been able to “take out Russian bases in Syria and oust Assad,” ever since Obama stupidly established his “Red Line” and said that Assad had to go. Obama has been out of (official) power for five years now and Assad, who thumbed his nose at the president’s “scary” red line, is still the Syrian leader. And, do you really think that the Washington psychos would be foolish enough to drop bombs on Russian bases in Syria?

    Right now, the idiotic Biden regime is too busy forcing recalcitrant troops to submit to dangerous vaccines that aren’t even working, and purging so-called White Supremacists (who are among its best soldiers) from the military. With morale at an all-time-low, do these morons think it will be easy to bomb mountainous Iran back into the stone age with a feminized woke military? Hell, they couldn’t even defeat the Taliban after 20 years of bombing. And the much more numerous and militarily advanced Iranians, preparing for an invasion ever since they overthrew the Shah, are ready for them.

    As Albert Einstein said: “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

    • Replies: @roonaldo
  11. rgl says:

    I am of the firm conviction that the Mercer was attacked by Israeli drones. They fervently want the US to tackle Iran militarily.

    How many times now – according to Israel – has Iran (repeatedly) come ‘this close’ to developing a bomb?

    Iran, trying to have crippling sanctions lifted would now commit an act that would entirely derail this?

    Israel, or more correctly Mossad, deceptions are becoming evermore transparent.

  12. What makes Pat think that Iran couldn’t “win” a war against Israel and the fast-crumbling US? If US psycho military planners thought it would be easy to take out Iran, it would have already happened. Now, Washington’s hated invaders are running with their tail between their legs from both Afghanistan and Iraq, two much weaker countries.

    Donald Trump almost allowed the bombing of Iran to start, but something made him back off at the last minute and recall the bombers. Could he have been told by experts that it would be a ruinous war we could not win, and would make him the most hated president in US history? And now our woke military is paralyzed by vaccine mandates which tens of thousands of troops reject, and its obsession to root out white supremacy. Is it in any condition to fight a much larger war against Iran?

    In any case, Iran wouldn’t be going it alone against US/Israel. They’d be joined by much of the Muslim world. Plus, would Russia and China sit idly on the sidelines as these mad dog neocons laid waste to their ally in Teheran? Somehow, I don’t think so. It could be WWIII.

    • Agree: Max Maxwell
  13. gottlieb says:

    Ah, Paddy, you’re not wrong. But it doesn’t matter a hoot who did or didn’t attack this tanker or that. Could be anyone. Drones are a dime a dozen and the new weapon of choice for the ‘resistance’ in the middle east.

    What Paddy can’t say is the obvious truth. War is inevitable as long as the zionist monster continues to exist.

    • Agree: GazaPlanet
  14. Rurik says:
    @Jokem

    I think Iran is continually testing the worlds resolve.

    ESAD, Jokem

    If zio-coward Israel attempts to use this flagrant false flag to foment a war on Iran, it should be the last straw for the world’s resolve, and the entire planet must finally, at long last, declare the experiment with a ‘Jewish state’, a catastrophic failure.

    ‘We tried’, the world can say, in good faith. ‘History will always know, that We tried’.

    • Replies: @Joe Levantine
    , @Jokem
  15. Currahee says:

    Just curious: does Israel have the reach to strike Iran?

  16. Chris Moore says: • Website

    Monday, Israeli Defense Minister Benny Gantz said action against Iran should be taken “right now.” Tuesday, Prime Minister Naftali Bennett warned Israel could “act alone.” “They can’t sit calmly in Tehran while igniting the entire Middle East — that’s over,” said Bennett. “We are working to enlist the whole world, but when the time comes, we know how to act alone.” Wednesday, Gantz ratcheted it up, “Now is the time for deeds — words are not enough. … It is time for diplomatic, economic and even military deeds. Otherwise the attacks will continue.” Thursday, Gantz went further: “Israel is ready to attack Iran, yes. … We are at a point where we need to take military action against Iran. The world needs to take action against Iran now.”

    There go the ((Jews)) again, attempting to stampede the world into war.

    Notice how the Zio-fascists go about it? If the world doesn’t attack Iran, we’ll do it. I swear we will. We might even go nuclear. You better attack Iran for us!

    That’s the Chosen for ya. They never want to get their own hands dirty, and demand the goyim do the fighting and dying while they sit back and count the money. Just like our insular overlords in Zionist Occupied Washington, who also live inside a gold-plated fortress where they never have to pay any consequences for their self-serving policies. The “deplorable” taxpayers and peasants across America can pay. They’re all lowly goyim anyway.

  17. conatus says:

    Stockdale in the Washington Post, The Gulf of Tonkin, a view from down close, Sept. 30, 1984
    “That is why Stockdale’s harrowing account of his mission in defense of those two U.S. destroyers is a whole lot more than just one war story in a book called “In Love and War,” which he has co-authored with his wife, Sybil. Their story is an astonishingly moving account of a devoted couple’s terrible ordeal — his as a prisoner of war in Hanoi for eight years, hers as a dogged organizer of a campaign on behalf of all Vietnam POWs. But Stockdale’s account of the second battle of the Tonkin Gulf is the stuff of history. He says it never happened. He was at the controls of the only U.S. aircraft working down low over the destroyers, searching wildly for targets, firing rockets and cannons on cue from the destroyers. He had “the best seat in the house from which to detect (torpedo) boats.” His report to debriefing officers when he returned to the carrier was: “No boats.””

    So 58,000 Americans die so Lyndon can prove he is the bigger Manly Man.

    As Buchanan himself has shown in WW2, Churchill wanted to go to war. He waited 18 months for the US to come to his aid so FDR, who wanted to go to war also, would come to Churchill’s aid. And half a million Americans died so these two guys, one fat and small, and one crippled, could ‘prove’ their manliness. Britain lost their empire. Later Churchill reportedly said, “we have killed the wrong pig” (meaning the man of steel is really a butcher of his own people).Hitler knew that, Stalin and his murderous Bolshies had slaughtered ten million Russians by the time Hitler reached full power.
    Don’t trust old men to lead you to war.

    • Replies: @Chris Moore
  18. Phipps says:

    When it comes to cunning, scheming, deception and manipulation, the Jews are in a league of their own. Indeed, even Satan takes notes on the sophisticated ways the Jews lie. And with only 2% of the U.S. population, the Jews have still managed to take over both the media and Washington D.C. America’s Mideast foreign policy completely reflects Jewish interests. Now we have a Jew Secretary of State (Blinken) who, like all Jews in Washington D.C. is an agent for Israeli interests. Of course this de facto Israeli blames Iran for the attacks and wants stupid American Goyim to fight yet another war for Israel. P.S. No wonder the Jews have been kicked out of 106 countries and territories since they engineered the death of Jesus Christ.

  19. @Jokem

    Israel can take care of itself; they certainly get enough aid from us; we would gain nothing from a war with Iran; let Israel fight its own battles.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  20. @Greta Handel

    This recent “attack” was just another hoax event, same as the Gulf of Tonkin ghost gunboat attack.

    Israel reaps what it sows.

    Perhaps, a created distraction to divert attention away from the current negativity towards their apartheid policies. Pushing Ben & Jerry’s out of the news cycle.

    Did the ship’s owner/operator put in an insurance claim?

  21. Chris Moore says: • Website
    @conatus

    So 58,000 Americans die so Lyndon can prove he is the bigger Manly Man. As Buchanan himself has shown in WW2, Churchill wanted to go to war. He waited 18 months for the US to come to his aid so FDR, who wanted to go to war also, would come to Churchill’s aid. And half a million Americans died so these two guys, one fat and small, and one crippled, could ‘prove’ their manliness.

    The British Empire was forced to hand off World Reserve Currency status to the more thoroughly ((Jewish)) controlled USA. This wasn’t a macho pissing contest between Churchill and FDR, it was a transition of power between two factions of the Anglosphere, brokered by top ((Jews)).

    LBJ was a Zionist with ((Jewish)) background. You’ll recall how he sided with Israel against America during the USS Liberty incident. This is why ((Jews)) wanted America under the control of racial Zionists with ((Jewish)) heritage–so they wouldn’t mind sacrificing Anglo-Saxon blood in favor of ((Jews)).

    Being in the upper crust, FDR and Churchill were already somewhat hostile to the lower classes, but they probably weren’t prepared to do blatant treason for ((Jews)).

    Starting with LBJ, all bets were off. It became clear to every corrupt poltico that US policy was going to be Israel First. This is how and why DC is a nest of vipers. This is how and why no one would call out top ((Jews)) for their 9/11 treason.
    https://wikispooks.com/wiki/9/11:Israel_did_it

  22. roonaldo says:
    @follyofwar

    Collectively, the air forces of the U.S., Israel, Saudi Arabia, etc. can take out Russia’s Syria bases and devastate Syria and Iran. The U.S./Israel, etc. would pay a price from Russian air defenses and counterstrikes and Iranian missiles, but I think the neocon lunatics think it would be worth it and worth the risk if igniting wider war (they may salivate at the thought of nuclear war). I think they see a future weakening of their position vis-a-vis Iran and Russia and thus are accelerating their mad plans.

    The neocon/Israeli bastards want regime change in Syria and Iran and I think they are insane enough to try. No, they can’t occupy Iran and wouldn’t intend to, but would throw it into chaos and manipulate the aftermath through proxies.

    I hope I’m wrong and war is averted.

  23. @Rurik

    Amen. But considering the current crop of Western leaders, I am afraid that this logical and just reasoning might be wishful thinking. In the end, nothing can be better for the sake of humanity than seeing this criminal terrorist state of Israel overplay her hand.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  24. Jokem says:
    @Greta Handel

    I am not sure how to take this comment. I suggest this may be a way for Iran to test the resolve of the rest of the world, Mr Buchanan suggested this might be a variant on the Tonkin Gulf ‘mistake’.

    Since we have suggested two opposite interpretations of the event, I m not sure how Mr Buchanan is ‘misleading; me. Is this a reverse psychology attempt by him?

  25. Jokem says:
    @Rurik

    Since you have resorted to pejorative comments, I am done discussing this with you.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  26. Jokem says:
    @Max Maxwell

    I suggest Iran is a country we properly ought to be at war with, since they committed an act of war on us. True, it was decades ago, but that does not change the event.

    I know what I would do about it, but no one listens to me.

  27. Anonymous[249] • Disclaimer says:

    It should be noted that “the Gulf of Tonkin incident” didn’t take place 57 years ago or at any other time.

    Where was Israel when the U.S. embassy in Tehran was overrun and hostages taken?

    @Jokem:
    “I suggest Iran is a country we properly ought to be at war with, since they committed an act of war on us. True, it was decades ago, but that does not change the event.”

    We were, financially, for decades. Then Obama surrendered.

    “I know what I would do about it, but no one listens to me.”

    Why do you suppose that is?

    • Replies: @Jokem
  28. BluEidDvl says:
    @Jokem

    “I suggest (Israel) is a country we properly ought to be at war with, since they committed an act of war on us (USS Liberty, June 1967) True, it was decades ago, but that does not change the event”.

    Fixed it for you!.. 😉

    • Replies: @Jokem
  29. Verity says:
    @Jokem

    What act of war was that? Taking THEIR country back was more than justified after what the USA did.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  30. Jokem says:
    @BluEidDvl

    You mean the accidental attack which Israel apologized for and paid compensation?

    Fixed it for you!.. 😉

    • Replies: @BluEidDvl
    , @El Dato
  31. Jokem says:
    @Verity

    Taking their country back from who? The Shah?

  32. Jokem says:
    @Anonymous

    ‘Why do you suppose that is?’

    Don’t really know for sure. I presume people are more concerned with keeping their personal lives together as well as earning a living in this Command Economy.

  33. BluEidDvl says:
    @Jokem

    “Accidental” my a\$\$!. Read the transcripts of any of the sailors on the Liberty. It was absolutely intentional. Apologies are a little compensation for murder. Thankfully, that satanic sh#tstain of a country won’t last much longer after the dollar collapses.

    Let me guess, your either a ((small hat)) yourself or one of those utterly cucked evangelicals that believe kissing hebe ass will garner you brownie points with your “god”?.. 😏

    • Agree: El Dato
    • Replies: @Jokem
  34. @Jokem

    “ I suggest Iran is a country we properly ought to be at war with, since they committed an act of war on us.”

    I wish you could elaborate more on this contention and explain how Iran committed an act of war on “us” ( I suppose you mean the USA). If you are referring to the taking of the hostages at the American embassy in Tehran, then you are either ignorant of history or you are lying by omission. I presume that you are ignorant which does not make your statement any less dangerous. The US was the party that spilled first blood when she backed the British coup D’etat against the democratically elected government of Dr. Mossadegh, a man of integrity and a fine patriot who sought to bring the British imperialist to reason to no avail. What followed is history but to refresh your mind, the Anglo American operation in Iran destroyed the biggest and oldest working democracy in the Middle East and replaced it by the police state oligarchy of the Pahlavi family which ruled by terror and indulged in blatant Western sumptuous living style while most of the Iranian countryside was left to rot in poverty and desolation.

    War by the US against Iran will be the equivalent of stretching the imperial drive to its breaking point when wisdom and logic should advocate a totally new American foreign policy based on dumping the five eyes parasitic alliance in favour of stretching a hand to Russia and China for the sake of prosperity and peace in a multipolar world. And if that means the end of the imperial policies of the City of London, then good riddance, for the world has had enough of the treachery of Perfidious Albion.

    • Agree: El Dato, Max Maxwell
    • Replies: @Jokem
  35. El Dato says:
    @Jokem

    Ah, those “mysterious accidents”.

    (((Them))) are really the winners in the “mysteries” of history even more than goyim. I won’t get into the mysteries of the “Balfour Declaration”, the mysteries of the “6 (down from 14) million”, the mysteries of 9/11, the mysteries of the Apollo Affair, and the more recent mysteries of “Trump” and “Biden” and media control, but let’s go into the mysteries of Liberty “accident” …

    It’s not a reason to declare war otherwise everybody would be at everybody’s throat for myriad of “accidents” but honesty is a virtue:

    ‘To Live or to Perish’: The Six-Day-War and its mythology

    [MORE]

    North: What do you think happened to the USS Liberty?

    I corresponded with one of the surviving crew members, James Ennis, who wrote a book on the attack indicting Israel. His account was totally credible.

    For example, a 5-by-8-foot American flag hoisted on the Liberty was fluttering in the wind on a crystalline summer day. Ennis recalled that before the assault an Israeli pilot overhead was flying so low they even waved to each other. So how could Israeli pilots have missed the flag?

    It’s ingenious—or hilarious—how Oren explains away this inconvenient fact. He says, “But Israeli pilots were not looking for the Liberty, but rather for Egyptian submarines.” In other words, the pilots didn’t see what was staring them in the face above the water because they were in search of a vessel beneath the water. This explanation must have deeply impressed the Los Angeles Times, which awarded him the newspaper’s annual book prize in history.

    North: The reason for the attack?

    None of the standard explanations hold up. I have my own hunch but I readily admit it’s highly speculative and unorthodox.

    Weiss: The conventional theory is the Liberty had radio surveillance and knocking out the Liberty allowed Israel to continue the war another two days.

    It’s alleged that the Liberty had gotten wind of the fact that Israel was going to seize the Golan, so Israel attacked it. But this theory doesn’t hold up on close inspection.

    My own hypothesis is, this is Israel’s big moment, the climactic of the Jewish people, a collective paroxysm-cum-orgasm. All the armed services want to get a piece of the action. The air force, the army, the navy.

    The navy hadn’t yet seen real combat. As the war was winding down, they were probably anxious to be part of this glorious chapter. To play their part in the Jewish people’s revenge on the goyim.

    Remember, the Israelis don’t just hate Arabs. They’re in an eternal war with all the goyim. All the goyim wanted the Jews dead. Just read Daniel Goldhagen if you have any doubts. The Americans are goyim. They refused entry to Jews fleeing the Holocaust; they didn’t bomb the railway tracks to Auschwitz; they, too, wanted all the Jews dead. Now they’re butting into our war, dispatching a spy ship into our waters, trying to restrain us in our moment of glory. Fuck the Americans! Fuck the goyim! Long live the Jews!

    Besides the Israeli air assault on the USS Liberty, the Israeli navy torpedoed the vessel. It got to share in the mock heroics and avenge the millennial suffering of the Jews. Everyone got their 15 minutes of drawing blood, in memoriam of the Jewish martyrs.

    I am the first to admit gaps in my hypothesis but it probably gets closer to the truth than positing a rational motive.

    North: How was the attack suppressed?

    Raison d’etat. Of course President Johnson knew what happened. But Israel was now the US’s “strategic asset” in the Middle East, so Johnson gave it a pass.

    Weiss: We’re coming to a moment of reckoning in the Jewish community, per Alan Solow. There will be soul-searching, and the Israel lobby groups are going to have to come up with a very good narrative. Do you anticipate any sort of thoughtful examination of the war and will it have any consequences, not just historiographically, but in Israel’s image?

    Whereas the real facts leading up to Israel’s first strike will be consigned to Orwell’s memory hole, the baneful effects of the war on Israeli society will probably be cause for reflection. It’s arguable that Israel became a different place after ’67. As journalist Gideon Levy recently observed, pre-’67 Israel was not a pretty place, far from it, but it also did not lack in virtues.

    I hate the word nuanced, I hate the word complex—more often than not, they’re moral cop-outs—but, still, it must be possible to reconcile that, alongside the crime that was inflicted on the indigenous population, there were—just as here in the US, burdened with its own “original sin”—redeeming facets of the Israeli experiment before ‘67.

    You can’t otherwise explain why many decent, progressive people, solidly anchored in the Left, found a lot to admire there. Professor Chomsky’s wife, Carol, who was very smart, sensitive, down-to-earth—she wanted to stay. She liked the people and kibbutz life. Read Marxist historian Isaac Deutscher’s admiring essays on Israel before ‘67.

    Incidentally, the single shrewdest assessment of where Israel was heading after the war was Deutscher’s 1968 interview in New Left Review. It’s a withering portrait of, for example, the newly anointed King of the Jews, Moshe Dayan—“hero and savior, with the political mind of a regimental sergeant-major, ranting about annexations, and venting a raucous callousness about the fate of the Arabs in the conquered territories.” But if you read Deutscher up until ’67, a lot of what he witnessed first-hand on his several visits there resonated with him.

  36. @Jokem

    We should not be at war with Iran; the hostage crisis was over 40 years ago; Israel shoul fight its own battles and stop expecting us to pull their chestnuts out of the fire; we would lose a lot of military people in a war with Iran; the missile attack on the US base in retaliation of the killing of the Iranian general was carefully calibrated to avoid American casualties; we ae the ones who walked away from the Nuclear deal; lets just get out of the Middle East and solve our problems at home; that place has been nothing but trouble for us. Israel can defend itself and we dont need their Petroleum anymore.

  37. Israel will not attack Iran without the consent of the US despite their bravado; Im sure Biden has secretly told Bennett not to start a war as a war with Iran is the last thing he or the US needs; clandestinely because the US and Israel must maintain the myth that ”there is no daylight between the US and Israel;” we have no formal defense treaty with Israel and they are not a true ally of ours; Israel can continue to kill Iranian scientists and luanch limited airstrikes against Iran; the shadow war will not get hot because its not in anyones interest.

  38. Jokem says:
    @BluEidDvl

    The official version of the attack was it was gross negligence or incompetence.
    I have no idea what motivation Israel would have for provoking the USA when they already had their hands full dealing with Egypt et. al.

    Even if what you say it true, Iran has not apologized for the invasion of our Embassy or paid compensation. Instead, we paid compensation to them.

    I have no idea what a ((small hat)) or cucked evangelical is.

    • Replies: @arami
  39. Jokem says:
    @Joe Levantine

    I presume you contend our Embassy in Iran was not invaded and no hostages were taken?
    The proper way to do this is to close the Embassy and expel the diplomats.

    As far as the overthrow of Dr. Mossadegh, it was over 25 years before the 1979 revolution there, so how far back to you want to go to mark impropriety? That part of the world hold grudges going back thousands of years.

    I suspect you are one of those people adamantly opposed to Western Civilization. Your admiration of Russia, Red China and Islamic fundamentalism, then with the same breath decrying treachery.

    • Replies: @arami
    , @Begemot
    , @Joe Levantine
  40. arami says:
    @Jokem

    [Even if what you say it true, Iran has not apologized for the invasion of our Embassy or paid compensation. Instead, we paid compensation to them.]

    Would you get lost ignorant zionist. You the idiot staged thousands of COUP around the world, killed millions of people in many countries, staged 9/11 with ISRAEL and killed 3000 Americans for the interest of Israel’s dick which should be chopped off now, then framed Afghanistan and fooled your own people with videos of Ben Laden, your own agent, MADE in the basement of CIA building and did not apologize, now you expect Iran apologizes for your fucking embassy?

    You the ignorant must know that, Israel and US, toppled and killed many leaders around the world, including Mosaddeq and did not appologize for anything, you idiot, illiterate, ignorant. Instead, go and read your dark history.

    You staged 9/11 in order to bring dummies like you on board to invade country after country, 7 countries in 5 years where still is in progress. You shut up and fuck off now.

    • Replies: @Jokem
    , @Pat Kittle
  41. arami says:
    @Jokem

    [As far as the overthrow of Dr. Mossadegh, it was over 25 years before the 1979 revolution there, so how far back to you want to go to mark impropriety? That part of the world hold grudges going back thousands of years.]

    You ignorant tell your tribe that how long do you want cashing in billions of dollars from ‘hollohoax’ INDUSTRY from other countries, using the victimization card to steal more lands, manipulating the fifth column ‘politicians’ in the western capitals to accumulate more wealth and power to take Western citizens as HOSTAGE waging war by staging FALSE FLAG Operation, ASSASSINATION, pushing for war using the dummies in the West.
    People in the West are FED UP fast, that’s why the western population feel that they are ALL Palestinians, where this new development let Palestinians to win the media war against the terrorists in the occupied land of Palestine.

    The latest attack on the ship at sea was a FALSE FLAG OPERATION by Israel to force Zionist fifth column Biden and his Mafia regime to enter another war where, I assure you, will not happen. Israel should stop its terrorist activities at once, and if wants to fight anyone must do it ALONE. Otherwise shut up and fuck off. People of the world are fed up with all these wars for Israel.

    Biden should sack Tony Blinken, Jewish mafia fifth column, to protect American interest.

    Israel has no right to exist. Down with Zionism, down with terrorism.

    Iran civilian Air Flight 655 was shutdown by US Missile in 1988. In total, 299 civilians on board were killed, 38 being non-Iranians and 66 being children.

    [The U.S. Killed 300 Iranian Citizens. Americans Don’t Remember This—But Iranians Do]

    https://www.newsweek.com/iran-remembers-killed-americans-should-1445104

    The ‘president’ did not even take responsibility and never apologized. Please watch to see how arrogant these terrorists are.

    • Agree: Joe Levantine
    • Replies: @Jokem
  42. Jokem says:
    @arami

    A blatantly pejorative comment not worthy of a response.

    • Replies: @arami
  43. arami says:
    @Jokem

    You have NO answer idiot. First educate yourself, then comment.

  44. arami says:

    Who BENEFITS from the increase tension in the Persian Gulf? George Galloway, the former MP, asked. He answered the question this way: Surely, it is not Iran.

    Is it the one who has a history of terrorist attacks on other vessels and countries, almost daily, to expand its borders and its influence? You know the answer, don’t you?

    Israel fakes two deaths that no one has seen to provoke an ‘international response’, where the zionist PM, Johnson, and fifth column Jewish mafia Blinken are already jumped on the zionist bandwagan to deliver for the apartheid entity. Biden must sack Blinken for the stupid statement he made earlier.

    Is Biden interested in American interest or jewish mafia interest? He should make it clear now, otherwise, he will be kicked out of office soon to join another zionist servant, trump.

  45. Begemot says:
    @Jokem

    As far as the overthrow of Dr. Mossadegh, it was over 25 years before the 1979 revolution there, so how far back to you want to go to mark impropriety?

    Are you suggesting that the time for legitimate grievance for the overthrow of Mossadegh had expired by 1979, as 25 years was past the expiration date?

    If so, applying your own rule, it has been 42 years since the US embassy seizure. Is it time to let your sense of grievance about this event go?

    • Replies: @Jokem
  46. @Jokem

    “ I suspect you are one of those people adamantly opposed to Western Civilization. Your admiration of Russia, Red China and Islamic fundamentalism, then with the same breath decrying treachery.”

    To the contrary, I am immersed in Western culture up to my ears. Though we should distinguish between the Western culture that I grew to love and the Western culture of nowadays, that is the hidden mask of Talmudic Zionism. Looking at France, I grew to admire and love the great people of that once glorious nation that gave us Colbert, Mazarin, Victor Hugo and Charles De Gaulle. Looking at England, I do admire Sir Thomas More, David Icke and Roger Waters. Looking at all of Europe, I see an enormous amount of gems in the world of arts, philosophy and literature that amazes me with Beethoven being IMHO the greatest gift of God to mankind. But, looking at Talmudic Europe makes me cringe to see how this landscape has abandoned God and embraced the Jewish Revolutionary Spirit ( a highly recommended book by the scholar E. Michael Jones) only to see Western society fall pray to the masters of Zion.

    You still have not answered my question about how Iran committed an act of war. Is it by virtue of Israel accusing Iran of the latest maritime incident? If so, then you are either too naive to take the words of the biggest factory of lies in the world Israel whose record at false flags is second to none or too crafty to impress your desire to serve Israeli machinations on gullible readers. By your own logic, the United States should have declared war on Israel in 1967 when the latter attacked the USS Liberty for that incident was indisputably a naked and deliberate act of aggression.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  47. Rurik says:
    @Jokem

    Since you have resorted to pejorative comments, I am done discussing this with you.

    I didn’t ‘resort’ to a pejorative comment, rather I was (and am ; ) specifically calling you a POS.

    (piece of shit)

    The others here seem to wonder if you’re just ignorant and/or misguided. But I’m convinced you’re too savvy to be your typical university sophomore, dumber than dirt and programmed with your imbecilities.

    No, you’re a POS alright. A Zionist.

    Says it all.

    • Troll: Jokem
    • Replies: @Greta Handel
  48. @Rurik

    I still think there’s a substantial chance that Jokem is as deft a troll — in the true meaning of that term — as any ever seen on this website. The best generate not only hostile comments, but an image ..

    He watched the wars against Iraq on a big, loud TV as though they were football games.

    That’s his bumper-stickered SUV in the parking lot of the church seen from the interstate, with its huge USA and Israeli flags.

    He was working the phones at the local McCain campaign office in 2008, Romney in 2012, Bush and then Trump in 2016, Trump in 2020, and will be back for Cotton or DeSantis in 2024.

    You get the picture.

    • Troll: Jokem
    • Replies: @Rurik
    , @Jokem
  49. Rurik says:
    @Joe Levantine

    wishful thinking.

    agreed

    In the end, nothing can be better for the sake of humanity than seeing this criminal terrorist state of Israel overplay her hand.

    But at what cost, Joe?

    Just look at the terrible price the Iraqis and Libyans and Syrians and so many others have been forced to pay, while doing zero to provoke any of it, except being in 100% compliance with ((NATO’s)) demands.

    Now they want to destroy Iran too.

    How many millions of innocent lives must the fiend demand as sacrificial tribute before some semblance of resistance in the world starts to manifest?

    Where are the politicians in the Western world who would take to their bully pulpits to say the Zionist emperor has no clothes (legitimacy)? And that all these wars are foisted upon them by a sinister cabal of Jewish supremacists who hold their nations hostage by controlling the purse strings.

    Canada? England? France? Germany? Australia? Anywhere?

    Is there even one prominent public person who will tell the truth about today’s state of affairs anywhere in the Western world?

    I suppose the closest thing we have here in the ZUS, is David Duke. An elected former member of the legislature who tells the truth, and tries to warn our people, but look at how he’s treated by the (((respectable))) politicians. Trump’s spawn says Duke deserves a bullet for telling the truth.

    Not even Ann Coulter or Tucker Carlson would dare come to his defense.

    The rot has metastasized, from the head down. I look for a shred of honor or integrity or decency, from the length and breadth of our civilization, and all I see is venality.

    If these J-supremacists are able to drag America into yet another catastrophic war on their behalf, where are the voices going to come from telling the American dupe what is actually going on?

    The NYT, CNN and the Biden administration will no doubt blame it all on ‘white supremacy’ fomenting another war on brown people because white Raytheon executives get rich on wars.

    Perfidious and France and the rest will claim America is dragging them into it.

    No one, anywhere in sight, will tell the obvious truth, about the (((blood-stained elephant))) in the living room.

    We live in a time of ubiquitous moral cowardice. Of greed and inequity and all-pervasive dishonesty.

    Just look at how wokeness has conquered the media and culture. Our corporate CEOs all get on their knees, like the Pope, and lick it off the floor.

    Is there going to be some resistance from that lot?

    It must have been something like this during the world wars. Where millions of ‘little people’ all understood the wars were being foisted and fought for Jewish bankers/Zionists, but there was simply zero honestly anywhere in the newspapers or politicians.

    Is there some chance that your typical Westerner is aware that all these wars are being fought for Jewish supremacists?

    Jokem is a lying shill. But just consider how many sheople are out there who believe the idiocies he spews.

    If you polled them, and asked them ‘Who is America’s (or England or Canada’s…) enemy, Iran, or Israel?

    How many would simply regurgitate the same vomit they’ve been force-fed since they were children?

    Israel is our greatest ally!

    Iran hates America and calls it the Great Satan!

    How many Americans (or Brits or French or Germans…) understand today that the war mongering, torturing, pedophilia promoting, anti-white, genocidal fiend on the world’s stage today, *is* the Great Satan?

    About ten percent, at best?

    How is going to war with Iran, ever going to wake up those other 90%, when it’s been 20 years since the obvious false flag of (((9/11))), and yet Americans are still sending their children to die in the ‘war on terror’.

    And if you were to go to your church or family gathering, and tell people that Israel and ‘the Jews’ did 9/11, they’d shrink from you as if you were a social abomination, which, in our Zionised culture, you would be.

    I was just talking to others about the death of the dollar, and how it will eventually free mankind. But I just don’t see any evidence that it would happen soon enough, to free humanity in anything like the current or next few generations.

    Rather, like with a war on Iran, it will cause massive and unpredictable levels of human suffering. And all of it on innocent people, as the worst scum get richer, and gloat at the carnage they’ve wrought.

    But perhaps all of that is necessary. Perhaps America (and England and Canada and the rest) has to be taken down to its knees, and destroyed utterly, by the forces of Zion, until they’re no longer a threat to other nations.

    But I know what will happen then. Zion will simply aim its weapons and hatred internally, until North America and Western Europe are reduced to a dystopian nightmare straight our of Barbara Spectre’s ghoulish dreams.

    If so, I hope Germany somehow remains intact, and can look across Western ‘civilization’, at those under the Zio-heel, and with acrid and tragic sadness, ask England, France and North America, how it feels to have “won” the war.

    • Thanks: Pat Kittle
    • Troll: Jokem
    • Replies: @Joe Levantine
  50. Rurik says:
    @Greta Handel

    He was working the phones at the local McCain campaign office in 2008, Romney in 2012, Bush and then Trump in 2016, Trump in 2020, and will be back for Cotton or DeSantis in 2024.

    You get the picture.

    yea, ‘Jokem’

    he thinks the joke’s on us

    As for Cotton or DeSantis, I despise Cotton, but would hold my nose and vote for DeSantis if the alternative were someone like Cotton or Liz Cheney in the primaries, or Kamala in the general.

    As treasonously slavish DeSantis is to Israel, I’d still prefer him over Kamala and co.

    So long as there were no new wars for Israel

    If I had a crystal ball, and knew who would start new wars for Israel, then I’d vote against that.

    If they both would, and it were Kamala vs. DeSantis, I’d vote for DeSantis.

    As I’ve said, voting still (sometimes) matters (even if nominally). If DeSantis would have lost to his challenger for the Florida governor, then things would be very (unimaginably) worse for the people of Florida today.

    I know there are those who (understandably) say ‘stop participating!’ Let the whole rotten edifice come crashing down!

    And I get that. Believe me. But then I think of what a Hillary presidency would have been like. Or a Liz Cheney presidency, and my scrotum knots up like a Shanksville ‘plane crash’, and I burst out- God No!!

    So, I wonder if the sanest and best informed voters, should at least allow thier voices to be heard at the voting booth, even if they don’t even allow the electronic machines to count them. At least we know, we tried..

  51. Biden has revealed his intent to extricate the U.S. from the “forever wars” of the Middle East and to pivot to the Far East and China.

    The “Forever” part never dies, just shuffles around. Pretendsident Diaper is the senile figurehead of the now-hot War Against Whites, starting with canonizing Saint Meganose of Fentanyl and continuing with the imprisonment and show trials against harmless 1/6 Patriots.

    The Uniparty and its (((handlers))) pose an immediate threat to Americans, not some diaper-headed licebeard in Sandland or the descendants of Mow Say Dung. Neither Iran nor China has allowed the invasion of our Southern border!

  52. @Rurik

    Thanks Rurik for this deep and conscientious analysis of the state of the world. Unfortunately, the truly illuminated like you are bound to be treated like lepers by the masses of people who are dumbed down to a point that they are trading their dignity for the sake of convenience and lining up like lemmings to get the jab and surrendering their intimacy and privacy to corporate interests do they can enjoy useless and senseless “free” communications on social media. Just watching the German cops attack German citizens in such a vicious way while exercising their right to challenge the German judiciary’s ban on Covid protests made my heart sink in despair for the prospects of what was once Europe’s bravest sons. Even the much vilified Orban of Hungary courtesy of making a stand for the integrity of his people had to genuflect to Zion in his interview with Tucker Carlson as a way to hedge his bets from the wrath of Zion.

    The only hope for mankind to break the cycle of misery is the rising challenge to the PTB from Asia under the Russo-Chinese alliance or the eventual demise of the dollar. The price for humanity will be terrible but staying put will drive us all into slow and agonising physical and spiritual death.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  53. Jokem says:
    @Begemot

    My question is, how far back do you go? That part of the world has grievances going back millennia.

    I suggest if you want to make 42 years the deadline for the expiration date, I can make 67 years (not 25) the deadline. Or maybe we can go back to 1941, 80 years. or maybe go back to 1828? How about 1729? 1221?

    I am not so sure Dr. Mossadegh was the hero some have made him out to be, turning his country over to Joe Stalin would be a mistake and a betrayal of his democratic mandate.

    • Replies: @arami
    , @Mulga Mumblebrain
  54. Jokem says:
    @Joe Levantine

    When I mentioned Western Culture, I meant that in a political sense, not regarding the arts, and certainly not restricting it to France and Britain only. Western Culture goes back farther than that, and has its origins in Greek Democratic concepts.

    I agree the Western World is in the process of losing sight of those founding principles but I claim this is the eventual fate of all democracies, which is why the USA is supposed to be a Republic.

    I have already answered your question in my reply to another poster here, re: act of war.
    Invading our Embassy and capturing the staff there is a blatant act of war. The proper way to do that is to close the Embassy and expel the Diplomats.

    • Replies: @Joe Levantine
  55. Jokem says:
    @Greta Handel

    I am pretty sure we have never met, so your accusation of me doing things you have never seen me do qualifies you more as a Troll than me.

  56. arami says:
    @Jokem

    [I am not so sure Dr. Mossadegh was the hero some have made him out to be, turning his country over to Joe Stalin would be a mistake and a betrayal of his democratic mandate.]

    You have to watch what you are writing here, because people knowledgeable in Iranian history may come after you.

    What does ‘turning his country over to Joe Stalin would be a mistake and a betrayal of his democratic mandate’ mean, illiterate. This lies have been copied from the terrorists who staged the Coup in 1953, US and Britain, to fool the public.

    This lies are coming from those terrorists who staged 9/11 and then framed Afghanistan. These lies are coming from those thieves who told the world that ‘Saddam has WMD’ in order to invade, kill,rob, rap and destroy the country using ‘democracy’ but in fact to weaken Iraq for the interest of the Jewish mafia and ‘greater Israel. Watch it.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  57. Resartus says:

    This lies are coming from those terrorists who staged 9/11 and then framed Afghanistan.

    No (Taliban) were accused of protecting Al Queda who was blamed….
    That a low noise civil war which had been going since the Russians left,
    gave the U.S. a group inside the country to support….

    • Replies: @arami
  58. arami says:
    @Resartus

    By ‘those terrorists who staged 9/11’ I mean US and Israel who staged false flag terror, then accused ‘ben ladin’ of being the mastermind of this terror which was a LIE, to invade Afghanistan. They knew they were lying from the beginning.

    The same is true with Iraq. US accused Saddam of having WMD, which everyone knows it was a lie, and Bush and co. knew they were lying, in order to invade Iraq. It was all against the International law. Everyone calls it ‘Iraq war’ and invasion of Iraq. So, in fact Bush and the Jewish neocons (Israel) framed Iraq to invade.

  59. Jokem says:
    @arami

    ‘You have to watch what you are writing here, because people knowledgeable in Iranian history may come after you.’

    If you mean Iranians will attempt to do me violence, keep in mind that is a two edged sword as I am a pretty good shot.

    If you mean Iranians will try to insult me and write pejorative comments comments here on Unz, I am pretty sure that has already happened, I have a thick skin when it comes to that.

    Insulting language such as calling me ‘illiterate’ are convincing arguments only to those who already agree with you, so you can continue to ‘preach to the choir’ if you want. The only effect I can see is it will raise your blood pressure.

    There WERE WMD in Iraq. The Poles found some. There were others, too, but it is still in question whether Saddam had control of them or not.

    • Replies: @arami
    , @Resartus
  60. arami says:
    @Jokem

    [If you mean Iranians will attempt to do me violence…]

    You must be a zionist to manipulate my words.

    Where did you get “violence” from “you have to watch what you are writing here..”?

    It means your WORDS, that is not true, then people come after you and challenge your lies.

    It is the zionist Israelis who spy on people around the world and assassinate them, they think this way.
    Stop manipulating people’s words.

    “keep in mind that is a two edged sword as I am a pretty good shot.”

    Stop threading people. We know what you are capable of.

    The whole world knows your skills: Assassination, terrorism, bombing, propaganda

    • Replies: @Jokem
    , @Mulga Mumblebrain
  61. Jokem says:
    @arami

    ‘You must be a zionist to manipulate my words.’

    I did not manipulate your words. You made an ambiguous comment and I asked for clarification.

    ‘Where did you get “violence” from “you have to watch what you are writing here..”?’

    I didn’t, I got it from ‘may come after you’. You did not say ‘may come after you with insults and inflammatory words’. Based upon what people have said about me here I conclude that has already happened, so were you warning me that people will do what has already happened? Makes no sense.

    Calling me a Zionist when you have never even met me and do not know my race or ethnicity suggests you are the one manipulating words.

  62. arami says:

    “Calling me a Zionist when you have never even met me and do not know my race ….”

    It is not impossible to tell something about people’s point of view from their writings, but it is impossible to harm people when you don’t know them, or have never met them, or simply don’t care about them.

    Having said that, then how will Iranians attempt to do you violence when they have not meet you or don’t know you, or don’t give a damn about you, when you write:

    [If you mean Iranians will attempt to do me violence, keep in mind that ..]

    I don’t need an answer.

    • Replies: @Jokem
    , @Resartus
  63. Jokem says:
    @arami

    ‘I don’t need an answer.’

    And your comment is not worthy of one.

  64. @Begemot

    As the Yesha Council of Rabbis and Torah Sages declared in 2006, as Israel was bombing Lebanon ‘back to the Stone Age’ (again), according to Judaic Law, killing civilians is not just permissible, but is, in fact, a mitzva or good deed. There is all the justification Israel needs for countless murders.

  65. @arami

    And, in Iraq, after the aggression and invasion, the Zionazis and their stooges like MEK killed scores of scientists and academics in a campaign to decapitate Iraq intellectually.

  66. @Jokem

    And Jews have hated the goyim for 3500 years. Is that far enough back for you?

    • Replies: @Jokem
  67. @Jokem

    “ When I mentioned Western Culture, I meant that in a political sense, not regarding the arts, and certainly not restricting it to France and Britain only.”

    You noticed that I included the names of Western artists and politicians. The politicians I mentioned had in common the desire to serve their people without resorting to imperialistic pursuits. Mazarin and Colbert drained the French swamp by stripping hundred of parasitical families from their bought nobility titles and engaged in developmental infrastructure projects that changed the face of France to the better and De Gaulle took the courageous decision to withdraw from Algeria and concentrated his efforts at lifting the middle class through economic growth. This modus operandi is antithetical to that of almost all Western leaders of our time who are in hog to Zionism, a philosophy that evolved from a desire by Theodore Herzl to make the Jews a people just like any other people and let go of their destructive messianic drive ( at the expense of the Palestinians unfortunately) but which ended up as a gross failure by creating a racist, expansionist Israel that is no more than one of the imperial tentacles of the West, thereby creating havoc in the Middle East.

    I do realise that Western culture can be traced back to Ancient Greece which I consider the cradle of Western civilisation especially in philosophy which taught people how to think for themselves. I gave a few examples related to three leading Western countries for the sake of brevity. Jerusalem, in contrast to Greece, gave the world the Revelations whereby one has to accept the memes which he/ she were brought up around; independent thinking not in line with Talmudic masters becomes a dangerous game.

    The international struggle is between two choices: on the one hand the Chinese Belt and Road Initiative under international law which is based on win win arrangements, and on the other hand the imperial rule of the City of London based on a Hobbesian win lose approach. Iran will join the Chinese BRI whereas Israel is stuck with the City of London endless trail of blood and tears.

    Your advocacy of war rather than dialogue under International Law gives me a clear idea where you stand.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  68. Resartus says:
    @Jokem

    There WERE WMD in Iraq. The Poles found some. There were others, too, but it is still in question whether Saddam had control of them or not.

    Saddam did his best to present the case he had WMDs…
    Basically, to make it seem his military was stronger than it actually was…

    Media did their best to parse words to prove Intel wrong on several things:

    ie Iraq was looking to buy Yellowcake….
    Media lied, saying the government lied that Iraq bought yellowcake…..

    The whole lead-up, was a massive cluster fuck on both sides to push their agenda…..

    • Replies: @Jokem
  69. Resartus says:
    @arami

    I don’t need an answer.

    “I Don’t Want an Answer” —- fixed that for you……

  70. Jokem says:
    @Mulga Mumblebrain

    Would be if true. I think you are exaggerating.

  71. Jokem says:
    @Joe Levantine

    ‘You noticed that I included the names of Western artists and politicians. ‘

    I am not sure why you made this comment. Since you mentioned France and Britain, and those are Western countries, I only see the comment as redundant.

    Your claim that somehow DeGaulle did things differently than other countries does not make sense.
    I don’t see where his policies differ significantly from other Western countries. What I see are Western Countries are devaluing Western Values in favor of Eastern concepts of Socialism.
    I see this as an inevitable result of Democracy, Zionist or not.

    I have no idea what this ‘City of London’ commentary is about. If by China you mean Red China, I would prefer British rule to that, as Britain still has remnants of of the concept of government being servant of the people. Red China does not embrace those concepts.

    • Replies: @Joe Levantine
  72. Jokem says:
    @Resartus

    I agree Saddam did his best to try to make his country stronger than it was. The fact of the matter is the CIA was purchasing WMD on the down low from someone in Iraq. Maybe that person
    managed to get away with it due to all the confusion there so Saddam was not aware he had lost control of them.

    • Replies: @Resartus
  73. ” Tuesday, Prime Minister Naftali Bennett warned Israel could “act alone.” “They can’t sit calmly in Tehran while igniting the entire Middle East…”

    Exactly! Can’t let Iran do the work of Tel Aviv and Washington.

  74. WJ says:
    @Spender_CGB

    I had forgotten how incredibly stupid Elanor Clift was. I’m assuming this was around 2013 or so when BO put out the red line silliness. It’s funny how people like Clift can become war hawks when their pets are engaged in conflict.

  75. Resartus says:
    @Jokem

    Maybe that person managed to get away with it due to all the confusion there so Saddam was not aware he had lost control of them.

    Don’t know about that, but as a Military Analyst, watched the numerous times inspectors started toward a base etc for an inspector (prior notification to Iraq before they left their offices), before their arrival at the site, convoys of dozens of trucks departed in the opposite direction….
    That went on for years from the mid-90s until 9/11…….

    Whether the trucks has anything in them is unknown, as there was never (as far as I know) any attempt to stop and inspect them….

    To question the intelligence was one thing, to flat out deny it even happened was “Aiding and abetting”….

    • Replies: @Jokem
  76. Jokem says:
    @Resartus

    I recall that regarding the trucks. Saddam definitely wanted to appear stronger than he was.
    The last thing he wanted was to appear weak while surrounded by enemies. This is probably the origin of the ‘Slam Dunk’ comment.

  77. Resartus says:

    The last thing he wanted was to appear weak while surrounded by enemies.

    Can only say, I believe, the News Media (all members) need annual classes in “Reading Comprehension”…….
    The only other excuse, is they continually lie to push political agendas…..

    The line falls between the choices with individuals involved…..

  78. Atle says:

    One of the breathtakingly few positive actions the Biden administration has taken are the attempts to resurrect the Iran nuclear deal. Trump’s attempt to suck up to the Israelis, like McCain’s lifelong quest to get the news media on his side, was proven to be completely futile.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  79. Jokem says:
    @Atle

    ‘One of the breathtakingly few positive actions the Biden administration has taken are the attempts to resurrect the Iran nuclear deal. ‘

    It is breathtaking alright. Iran will cheat on it. I do not want them with their finger on a nuclear button when they have one of their mood swings.

  80. Rurik says:
    @Joe Levantine

    The only hope for mankind to break the cycle of misery is the rising challenge to the PTB from Asia under the Russo-Chinese alliance or the eventual demise of the dollar. The price for humanity will be terrible but staying put will drive us all into slow and agonising physical and spiritual death.

  81. @Jokem

    You wrote : When I mentioned Western Culture, I meant that in a political sense, not regarding the arts…

    I responded : You noticed that I included the names of Western artists and politicians.

    Now if you fail to see the difference between De Gaulle’s era and the West of today, I suppose there is no need to go any further with this debate.

    “ I would prefer British rule to that, as Britain still has remnants of of the concept of government being servant of the people.”

    Sweet dreams.

    • Replies: @Jokem
  82. Jokem says:
    @Joe Levantine

    ‘ I suppose there is no need to go any further with this debate.’

    I claim the differences are not significant. The main one I see is DeGaulle being upset at the way his ‘allies’ refused to prosecute former Nazis, because they were needed to oppose Soviet influence.
    I suppose protecting Nazis was just another part of the Zionist Conspiracy?

    But if you do not want to continue the discussion, OK, I agree.

  83. @arami

    So well said that Israel’s hasbara trolls (“Jokem” in this case) have no response.

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