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Why Sweden Succeeded While Others Failed
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How do you measure success in dealing with an illness for which there is no cure?

This is the question we need to ask ourselves before judging which country’s approach has been most successful in dealing with the coronavirus. The fact that there is no silver bullet, no vaccine, does not change the fact that leaders must seek the best possible way forward by crafting a social policy that helps to achieve their goals. In my opinion, most of the European countries and the United States have imposed a social policy that is the least likely to help them achieve the objectives that they should be pursuing. In other words, while the “containment” strategy of self isolation and social distancing might temporarily prevent the spreading of the virus (and prevent the health care system from collapsing), the infection will undoubtedly reemerge when the lockdown is lifted causing a sharp uptick in the cases and deaths. This is the problem that many countries, including the US, now face. They want loosen the current restrictions, but additional easing unavoidably triggers a surge in new cases. So, what is to be done?

The problem is that the approach was never sufficiently thought-through from the very beginning. This scenario should have been gamed-out before the policy was ever adopted. Now it’s too late. Now the people are anxious to get back to work, but the threat of infection still remains. That means that we’re going to see workers return to their jobs followed by sporadic outbreaks that ignite more social reaction and unrest leading to more “walk-offs”. These disruptions will prolong the recession and intensify the fractious political climate that is already as acrimonious as any time in recent history.

All of these problems can be traced back to the early days of the pandemic when the government first concocted its containment strategy. The aim of containment was to prevent a collapse of the public health system. That’s fine, but containment is just one wheel on a two-wheel axle. The other wheel, which is equally important, is immunity. The question is: How does one achieve immunity while imposing a containment policy that forces isolation? It can’t be done or can it?

Swedish experts figured out how pursue two seemingly-conflicting objectives at the same time: Contain the virus sufficiently so it doesn’t collapse the health care system while exposing enough people to the infection to eventually achieve herd immunity. They encouraged the public to comply with their distancing directives while –at the same time–they allowed the controlled spread of the virus. This is how they managed to achieve their core objectives: Containment and immunity. At the same time, Sweden eschewed the lockdowns, kept their economy running, and preserved an atmosphere of normalcy unlike any other country in Europe. It’s really an astonishing achievement.

The Swedish strategy rests on three main pillars: Immunity, sustainability, and protection of the old and vulnerable. On the immunity count, they score an A+, far superior to any of the other countries that opted for a containment plan that ends as soon as the lockdowns are terminated resulting in a surge of cases and fatalities. What good is that? What good is a strategy that forces people to bolt the door and hide under the bed until the pain of economic retrenchment becomes too excruciating to bear? It’s lunacy. In contrast, the Swedish strategy employs some social distancing and crowd control measures while–at the same time– allowing low-risk people to engage in normal social interactions that expose them to the virus. The vast majority of these healthy people remain either completely asymptomatic or get a minor cough or fever. They don’t wind up in the hospitals or ICU or on ventilators. Instead, they get the infection, they recover from the infection and, in the process, they develop the antibodies they need to staunch (or mitigate) any future outbreak. This is crucial, because without immunity, nations are condemned to an endless cycle of recurrent outbreaks that decimate the economy, stress the health care system and wipe out the old and weak.

Even so, some critics now question whether exposure to the virus will produce sufficient antibodies to create immunity. It is an interesting question, but irrelevant. Swedish epidemiologists must proceed on the basis of their prior experience that infections do in fact produce antibodies that will help to fight future forms of the viruses. In any event, the matter should be settled soon enough, perhaps within the year, when a second or third wave of the infection spreads across the world. That is when the “herd immunity” theory will be put to the test. We will suspend judgement until then.

A great deal of attention has been focused on Sweden’s fatality rate which is noticeably higher than any of its neighbors. But the numbers don’t tell the whole story. More than 50 percent of the deaths have taken place in Sweden’s large nursing homes. This is tragedy and Sweden’s leaders have admitted their failure. They’ve accepted responsibility for the deaths and taken steps to tighten protective restrictions, like banning visitation.

Some of the other deaths can be attributed to the strategy itself which allows for greater circulation in the community leading to more infections. But there’s the tradeoff here: While more public interaction may increase the death toll on the front end, the lockdowns merely postpone those fatalities until the restrictions are lifted. When the dust settles and we look back a year from today, we will probably see that the percentage of deaths are only slightly different between the various countries. That, at least, is the assumption of some well-respected epidemiologists.

As we noted earlier, the Swedish plan does not impose lockdowns, does not decimate the economy, and does not overtax the public health system. In this way, it achieves its second goal of sustainability. Swedish leaders say they can continue in this same vein indefinitely without causing serious damage to the economy. Can the same be said for the US? Will the United States be able to shut down the economy, lay off millions of workers, destroy thousands of small and mid-sized businesses and spend trillions of dollars if a second wave of the virus hits in the Autumn?

No, the US strategy is not sustainable, repeatable or even desirable. It is a poorly conceived, catch-as-catch-can Trump clunker that fails to address the critical issue of immunity. If the US population does not achieve some degree of collective immunity, than how can we prevent similar catastrophe from taking place in the future? That’s the question Trump and his crystal-gazing advisors should be asking themselves, but we doubt they will. Here’s more from the New York Times:

Anders Tegnell said, “We think that up to 25 percent people in Stockholm have been exposed to coronavirus and are possibly immune. …We could reach herd immunity in Stockholm within a matter of weeks.”…(Note: Herd immunity is a form of indirect protection from infectious disease that occurs when a large percentage of a population has become immune through previous infections thereby providing a measure of protection for individuals who are not immune.)

“What’s happening now is that many countries are starting to come around to the Swedish way. They are opening schools, trying to find an exit strategy. It comes back to sustainability. We need to have measures in place that we can keep on doing over the longer term, not just for a few months or several weeks” (“Is Sweden Doing It Right?, New York Times)

Herd immunity is the Holy Grail of coronavirus social policy because it provides the population with some level of protection from future infection. But if herd immunity is such a desirable goal, then why is Sweden the only country that appears to be actively pursuing it? An article in the Wall Street Journal by Joseph Sternberg provides some intriguing background on this matter. According to Sternberg, it all started when a number of experts departed from their original and correct assumption that “We can’t stop the virus, we can only slow it.” Check it out:

“The trouble started in mid-March when “herd immunity,” previously the tacit or acknowledged endgame for most of the world, became a toxic phrase. Critics pointed out that allowing the virus to spread in a controlled manner would cost lives. They presented a stark alternative of total lockdown or the disaster of Italian hospitals, with no middle ground. But if those experts have a more plausible plan than taking a controlled path to herd immunity, the world is waiting to hear it. Experts propose instead either that we await the arrival of a vaccine or that we ramp up testing and contact tracing of the infected. Good luck. A vaccine is a year or more in the future, if one ever emerges….” (“Maybe the Experts Were Right About Covid-19 the First Time”, Wall Street Journal)

So, according to the author, the experts actually were on the same page at one time, but they were bullied into changing their approach. In contrast, Sweden ‘stuck to its guns’, shrugged off the media’s withering criticism, and forged ahead with the only rational policy, herd immunity through the controlled spread of the virus. That goal is now within striking distance, but it has required great strength of conviction and gritty perseverance.

Hurrah for Sweden! Hurrah for sanity!

 
• Category: Ideology, Science • Tags: Coronavirus, Disease, Politics, Sweden 
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  1. g8way says:

    lolwut… Others Succeeded wildly. In the US alone, 30 million out of a job, thousands of small businesses shuttered, 3 trillion dollars printed and counting, compliant populace neutered and humiliated. Greatest power grab since 9/11 and it’s just getting started.

    • Agree: Alfred, Felix Krull, Denis
  2. Whitney’s childish enthusiasm/ignorance will come to bite him in the ass – mark my words. As for “Sweden succeeded where others failed,” aren’t countries like Finland, Denmark, Norway getting a actual grip on the corona virus?

  3. Anonymous[847] • Disclaimer says:

    Superb and very true

  4. At least a fourth of Swede blondes tend to have babies with Africans. I don’t know how long the recessive Blonde gene will survive.

    I believe that by early 2050s, Swedes will be a minority in their own country and will be slowly bred out.
    The worst lot are the Somalis, they tend to have 2 or more baby mamas(mostly native Swedes).

    Unfortunately, that is the truth and I have been living here since 2010 when I got married to my Swedish wife.

    It is still a much better place than the US to live but I don’t see it remain so in the next few decades.

  5. Alvin says:

    I thought one of the main reasons for the lockdown was so not to overwhelm and destroy our health care system, but we ended up destroying healthcare in order to save it.

  6. Even so, some critics now question whether exposure to the virus will produce sufficient antibodies to create immunity

    This question seems to have been answered, as I pointed out in a comment I wrote yesterday, and which I reproduce below:

    Some good news on a new study from China:

    Antibody responses to SARS-CoV-2 in patients with COVID-19
    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0897-1

    The abstract is:

    “We report acute antibody responses to SARS-CoV-2 in 285 patients with COVID-19. Within 19 days after symptom onset, 100% of patients tested positive for antiviral immunoglobulin-G (IgG). Seroconversion for IgG and IgM occurred simultaneously or sequentially. Both IgG and IgM titers plateaued within 6 days after seroconversion. Serological testing may be helpful for the diagnosis of suspected patients with negative RT–PCR results and for the identification of asymptomatic infections.”

    For those who are not familiar with the concepts, the following Wikipedia article may help somewhat:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antibody

    IgG is defined in the above Wikipedia article as:

    “In its four forms, provides the majority of antibody-based immunity against invading pathogens.[5] The only antibody capable of crossing the placenta to give passive immunity to the fetus.”

    IgM is defined in the above Wikipedia article as:

    “Expressed on the surface of B cells (monomer) and in a secreted form (pentamer) with very high avidity. Eliminates pathogens in the early stages of B cell-mediated (humoral) immunity before there is sufficient IgG.”

    The media has reported the finding:

    https://www.news1.news/n1/2020/04/coronavirus-the-chinese-study-100-of-patients-cured-of-covid-19-develop-antibodies-burioni-good-news.html

    • Replies: @Levtraro
    , @KA
  7. Excellent article, which would have been even better with the addition of a last-minute information which I have provided on comment #5.

    There is a minor untruth to it, though: total lockdowns do work, and China is a good example of that. The virus stops reproducing and eventually dies out in a matter of weeks. But that would have to be done in most of the planet, otherwise the risk of a resurge is still there, unless China bans international travel for years to come, or implement rigid control of who enters the country. As for Western countries, their ‘lockdowns’ seem to have lots of holes in them; otherwise there wouldn’t be the staggering numbers of deaths they are witnessing.

    Apparently Sweden has reached the right equilibrium between immunization and the protection of the health system. A definitive answer should not delay.

    Brazilian president Jair Bolsonaro had roughly the same idea as Sweden, though Brazil doesn’t have as good a health system as Sweden’s. Anyway, he couldn’t have his way in this matter, because the Supreme Court has ruled that State governors are the ones with power to decide local policies. Regardless, Bolsonaro is stamped forever as the greatest villain of all history, and Sweden’s leadership is possibly about to become the exact opposite of that.

  8. There is a site in Singapore which predicts when the pandemic will end in each country. I really don’t know how reliable their calculations are, but maybe it will be of interest to some:

    When Will Covid-19 End
    https://ddi.sutd.edu.sg/when-will-covid-19-end/

    They have produced a related paper:
    When Will COVID-19 End? Data-Driven Prediction
    https://people.sutd.edu.sg/jianxi_luo/public_html/COVID19PredictionPaper.pdf

    • Thanks: Levtraro
    • Replies: @Raz
  9. Dumbo says:

    At least a fourth of Swede blondes tend to have babies with Africans.

    If true, that is quite depressing.

    Swedish women are retarded and men are cucks.

    Also, “not closing the economy” did not help Sweden as the slowdown is global (impossible to be completely isolated these days), business is down, etc.

  10. Levtraro says:
    @Brás Cubas

    There are further good news on the immunity front:

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/04/covid-19-vaccine-protects-monkeys-new-coronavirus-chinese-biotech-reports

    “For the first time, one of the many COVID-19 vaccines in development has protected an animal, rhesus macaques, from infection by the new coronavirus, scientists report.”

    The experiment tackled several aspects with good results, such as dose-response (positive outcome), side effects (negative outcome) , cheap and simple method of production, good enough animal model, partial protection (negative outcome of potential vaccine enhancement of infection at low doses), and wide range of virus-genome activity (10 strains, parallel test tube experiments).

    The company reporting this is privately-owned based in Beijing.

    http://www.sinovac.com/

    Check press release 2020-04-17

    • Thanks: Brás Cubas
  11. Anon[645] • Disclaimer says:

    Have they? And what did they win?

    1) They’re a small country with demographics that do no match other nations.

    2) New Zealand, Taiwan, etc all acted sooner and better than Sweden with far fewer casualties. They’ve eliminated the virus. Their economies will now quickly recover.

    3) The true death count in Sweden will greatly exceed basically any flu season in modern history.

    4) There will now be a push to increase immigration to fill the ranks of the dead.

    5) Doing what Sweden did in the US would result in hundreds of thousands of casualties. Maybe a million.

    What exactly did these people win? Muh economy? Lol, selfish 401k boomers. Get ready to get wiped out in November. It’s richly deserved.

    • Agree: Jaylonw
  12. Raz says:
    @Brás Cubas

    Their projections are more optimistic than others. Predicting pretty sharp drop offs starting from about now. We can hope.

    Projections don’t go that far out. Expect a resurgence this Autumn/Winter?

    • Replies: @Brás Cubas
  13. Levtraro says:

    In other words, while the “containment” strategy of self isolation and social distancing might temporarily prevent the spreading of the virus (and prevent the health care system from collapsing), the infection will undoubtedly reemerge when the lockdown is lifted causing a sharp uptick in the cases and deaths

    .

    The existing evidence on this matter comes from countries like China, Taiwan, South Korea, and Norway. In those countries containment worked and there has been so far no “sharp uptick in the cases and deaths”. Check this plot:

    https://ibb.co/0rRVkfG

    • Replies: @anon
  14. Even so, some critics now question whether exposure to the virus will produce sufficient antibodies to create immunity.

    The expectation is that exposure to the virus confers immunity for some period of time, it would be unusual if that turns out not to be the case.

  15. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Levtraro

    The existing evidence on this matter comes from countries like China, Taiwan, South Korea, and Norway. In those countries containment worked and there has been so far no “sharp uptick in the cases and deaths”. Check this plot:

    Provide links to the web sites where you obtained the data for your plot or be written off as a hysterical propagandist

  16. anon[185] • Disclaimer says:

    It’s really an astonishing achievement.

    No, it’s how societies have dealing with the flu for centuries.

  17. unit472 says:

    2653 Covid deaths in a nation of 9 million is hardly ‘success’. That’s more deaths per capita than the US and guess what, the Swedish economy is not going to do any better than its neighbors or the rest of the EU. Its not big enough to isolate itself from the EU depression and it can’t stay neutral as in WW2 and escape the consequences of the coming Sino/American rift.

    • Replies: @Den Lille Abe
    , @Alfred
  18. @Raz

    Although I too hope they are correct, the dominant discourse is much more pessimistic. A few minutes ago Marc Lipsitch was on CNN (I watch it fromBrazil). He is a scientist who co-authored a study published on Science magazine on precisely this subject, predicting that the end date for the pandemic in the U.S. will probably happen in 2022, and up until then restrictive measures will have to be applied, either continuously or intermittently. He said on CNN, and I quote from memory, that, “paradoxically”, the more successful they are in fighting the spread of the virus, the longer they will probably have to live with it. Cute, isn’t it?

    Oh, he said that he is for the opening of parks. He is a nice guy.

  19. @Anon

    Let me get this straight, #645, these Boomers are scared of dying so that’s why they have been pro-panic, so I read. Yet, you’re saying they need their 401k’s to stay high, so are selfish about “muh economy”. The rest of your comment is not a lot less idiotic.

    Here are a couple of Boomers: “Make up your mind, dude, is he gonna shit, or is he gonna kill us?”

    “First he’s gonna shit; then he’s gonna kill us!”

    • Replies: @anon
  20. Nice article, Mr. Whitney. My one beef is that you still think the authoritah from above is what Sweden should be so proud of. That is, the authorities that made this wise decision. Is it not always the most wise move to let the individuals decide how they want to handle it? That’s basically how it was left for them, but there need be no government to leave the people this.

    Another point is that I think America will achieve this herd immunity pretty quickly too. It’s not like all Americans respect authoritah and have been holing up in their closets. I am a case in point. Fresh air and sunshine, cheap gas, no traffic, homeschooling, and flouting the Guvner’s orders – “I’ve Loved These Days”.

    • Agree: AaronInMVD
    • Replies: @ThomasT
  21. Even the idiots at the WHO now agree that Sweden was right.

  22. @Brás Cubas

    What staggering number of deaths in the West?

    How many people have died in the usa after testing positive for this virus?

    Do we count all the “died WITH COVID-19” cases as “died FROM COVID-19”?

    How many US deaths this past month, or this calendar year, have been attributed to all flu viruses including this virus? How does that total compare to recent past years?

    Where is the proof that this is a particularly deadly pandemic or that the lockdowns were necessary?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  23. some critics now question whether exposure to the virus will produce sufficient antibodies to create immunity

    The immune system only produces antibodies when the infection is severe and stresses the body. For a trivial infection that is easily dealt with, no antibodies will be produced.

    • Replies: @St-Germain
  24. @RadicalCenter

    RC, Peak Stupidity, in this post about the Governor of Michigan, Nanny from Hell, one Gretchen Whitmer, included an excerpt directly from the State of Michigan’s own website. I quote:

    The case fatality rate is the number of people who have died from causes associated with COVID-19 out of the total number of people with confirmed COVID-19 infections.

    Note that bolded part. One could have died from respiratory problems. However, they are one of the symptoms of the Kung Flu, so, there ya’ go – chalk up another one. It doesn’t even state that the patient necessarily tested positive for the virus, in fact. It’s the denominator that are Kung Flu infected people, and has been shown to go pretty much linear with number of people tested!

    Mr. E. H. Hail has done great work in a 7-part series of long essays demonstrating this Kung Flu Infotainment Panic-Fest stupidity, with great data and explanations – here.

    • Replies: @Hail
  25. @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    “As for “Sweden succeeded where others failed,” aren’t countries like Finland, Denmark, Norway getting a actual grip on the corona virus?”

    So long as they allow no one to cross their borders bringing in a new infection, yes. The people can live like palms in a Montreal greenhouse. They need to stay that way until the virus is no longer present anywhere in the world.

    I don’t think they can do it, not when there are refugees to admit.

    • Agree: Hail
    • Replies: @Alfred
  26. Rahan says:

    Nice article, but it’s not “just Sweden”. Belarus is the second country that decided to simply ride it out.

    The East Asian Confucians did fast controlled lockdowns and actually suffocated the spread as such.

    If this novel coronavirus gradually vanishes like SARS, then both the Swedish and Belorussian models and the Confucian models paid off equally well–the first saved their societies through herd immunity, and the second–through lightning fast isolation and eradication the viral hotspots.

    If, on the other hand, unlike SARS and more like the Spanish Flu, this virus keeps coming back wave after wave, well then, the Confucians will also have to either figure out a way to do a controlled herd immunity thing, or remain isolated from the world for the forseeble future, forcing all arrivals with no exceptions to go through a half-month quarantine.

    • Agree: Alfred
  27. Hail says: • Website
    @Brás Cubas

    Apparently Sweden has reached the right equilibrium between immunization and the protection of the health system. A definitive answer should not delay.

    We have the data in hand already. “Sweden was right” is no longer possible to dispute.

    Of the several “epidemic curves,” the most lagging of all is Deaths, and it is now in clear, sustained decline, following roughly the bell curve shape. As the population approaches, there will be no huge second spike.

    See Sweden’s Vindication is Complete (April 29). Latest data updated by the Swedish Health Ministry two hours ago as of this writing here:

    The Wuhan-Coronavirus apocalypse was yet another false one. What we should now focus on is how the Panic was allowed to do its evil deed in the world. Find the guilty. I have a few ideas.

    • Agree: Alfred, Anonymous Jew
    • Replies: @Brás Cubas
    , @Hail
  28. @Hippopotamusdrome

    That’s a downer. Does this mean our conscientious government health authorities have now interviewed a statistically significant number of equally honest antibodies?

  29. Hail says: • Website

    How do you measure success in dealing with an illness for which there is no cure?

    I would replace one word there to make a different question, as food-for-thought:

    How do you measure success in dealing with Death, for which there is no cure?

    C.J. Hopkins on this website had a series of good columns on this matter, relatively early on during the Corona-Panic.

    I assume those reading this in May 2020 are nearly all born before year 2000, and maybe there are plenty of readers born before 1945. For any born between 1945 and 2000, you have already lived through many peak-flu-events similar to the Coronavirus pandemic of 2020. For those born before about March 1945, you have lived through some demonstrably worse.

    According to the solid, long-running data in the US, the last of the big “hits” from a peak-flu-event in the US was in the 1944-45 winter season (which actually overshadows the 1968-69 Hong Kong Flu pandemic which has gotten some press lately), no doubt associated with the various disruptions of World War II. The oldest Unz Review commenter of whom I am aware, Simply Simon (born 1929, iirc) will have seen much, much worse than Corona-2020 in his 1930s boyhood. Yet no one cared or much noticed. Life goes on!

    Fear not death in old age or sick condition; many of us in any case (all those with any basic religious belief) believe death is not the end.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  30. Hail says: • Website
    @Achmed E. Newman

    tested positive … has been shown to go pretty much linear with number of people tested!

    In some cases , not even linear but much less still. There is a major lag effect along several steps of the way, and the Panic has only exacerbated the usual lag.

    Here is a graph of the effect from Germany. As April proceeded, more testing produced rising confirmed-positive numbers in far greater apparent magnitude than the virus’ actual spread, producing a substantial delay in narrative vs. reality. (via Swiss Propaganda Research‘s “A Swiss Doctor on COVID19” series, clarifying title in English added by me):

    This probably holds all over the world. The true transmission curve (reality) can and often goes bear some relationship to the the curve of “confirmed positives” (that which flashes at people via the media on screens large and small) because the latter is entirely based on how many tests are given. This is one of the keys to seeing just how irresponsible the media has been, and what a statistical-fiasco the whole Corona-Panic has been. I have seen the anti-Panic commenter Intelligent Dasein make this point repeatedly and it is a good one.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  31. @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    Right or wrong it’s far too early to write such “hurrah” articles.
    Fact is — we still DON’T know about immunity, vaccines etc. Not has the Swedish experiment come to a conclusion.

    • Replies: @Herald
  32. Sweden has many more statistically more deaths than the other Scandinavian countries. Even than the US. I like how commie Sweden is the new hero for you will-o-the-wisp silly little limp-wristed fly-by-night baby sillikins. Consistency is not your problem, that’s for sure.

    http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2020/05/01/conservatives-are-obsessed-with-sweden/

    • Disagree: Hail
    • Replies: @Anonymous
  33. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:

    we still DON’T know about immunity, vaccines etc.

    Daily hospitalization, ICU and death numbers continue on a bell shaped decline which prove Sweden’s success. Data, not theories should always be the measure of success.

    • Agree: Hail
    • Replies: @Alfred
  34. @Hail

    So: There is you, Hail, then there is Intelligent Dasein and – Kratoklastes, right?

    (Achmed and I are somehow in this picture too, – like Buster Keaton, riding on the half-off wing of a runaway car… James Thompson is somewhere near this scene because his latest posts talk of a mortality rate of maybe 0.4 % of the severe cases. – I know, this might still be much more than you’d say is correct, but nevertheless – it is far away from the numbers which were estimated by Gregory Cochran and Anatoly Karlin (and millions of others…) in March, still.

    PS

    It is not easy for Europeans to synthesize your numbers with the tragedy in Italy (even a dozen + priests died of CO-19…).

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Hail
    , @utu
  35. anon[133] • Disclaimer says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Let me get this straight, #645, these Boomers are scared of dying so that’s why they have been pro-panic, so I read. Yet, you’re saying they need their 401k’s to stay high, so are selfish about “muh economy”. The rest of your comment is not a lot less idiotic.

    You couldn’t rebut anything said in that comment, because it’s all true. That’s really all that needs to be said. … But I feel like saying more:

    You and company have been debunked on essentially everything you’ve claimed. You don’t care, though. You’ve got a 401k to look after. New model: ~170,000 U.S. deaths by August. Maybe 2 million over the next two years. Get ready for that well-deserved Trumpslap coming in November.

    But yes, I was right. They ARE worried about their 401ks. Critical thinking may not be your thing, but not everyone is that thick. A group of selfish boomers who’ve screech about “muh economy” 24/7 and since the very beginning pulling out EVERY excuse imaginable to keep “muh economy” roaring over human life is obviously being pretty selfish … and hysterical (but over their pocketbook health).

    “Just the flu, bro” … “muh hydroxychloroquine” … “muh swine flu” … “muh hotspots” … “muh suicides if the economy gets bad” … “muh Germany” … “muh warm weather” …”muh Sweden” … “muh China” …”muh herd immunity” … “muh antibodies I don’t understand” … “muh fredums, muh black helicopters” …. “muh models are wrong” (they were — too optimistic) … etc.

    You’ve pulled out every conceivable excuse to do nothing from the very beginning because you never cared in the first place. That’s patently obvious. No one goes through all that denial (hysteria) if they are genuine in their motives. You people had your 401k in mind the whole time when you were making these excuses to do nothing because that’s your ideology — me, me, me. There is no other explanation.

    Of course, not literally all boomers agree with you. Many agree with me, but since critical thinking is hard for libertarians, you (like most of Trump’s cult) simply make up strawmen when you can’t win an argument. Therefore, you’ve implied a contradiction that does not exist. It only exists if you think I meant literally ALL boomers, which is obviously absurd. But maybe that was just sarcasm on your part. Maybe too much Lysol injected into the brain, eh? That stuff isn’t good for you bro. Lay off Trump’s miracle magic medicine.

    Libertarian boomer: “Waaa, I can’t go to the beach for a month. Waa, they shut down Burger King for six weeks. Where am I going to get a Trump hamberder (TM)? Waa, no more cruise ship vacations for me. Me me me.” Selfish. Old. Cult. Boomers.

    P.S. Sweden needs over 70k deaths to reach herd immunity, an extraordinary number for a relatively small country … but that doesn’t mean the crisis will end there. It will continue on for a while due to overshoot. So, no … they haven’t succeeded at anything. As I pointed out before, actual nanny states like New Zealand and South Korea have defeated Covid-19 — economies intact, freedoms retained. Why aren’t you guys using them as a success story because obviously their response > Sweden’s response. Answer: because that deflates your bubble. Obviously you were wrong and people like me were right. There is no middle ground. Your ideology just got debunked publicly.

    What the Proponents of ‘Natural’ Herd Immunity Don’t Say

    Try to reach it without a vaccine, and millions will die.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/01/opinion/coronavirus-herd-immunity.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage

    COVID-19 Projections Using Machine Learning

    https://covid19-projections.com/

  36. anon[116] • Disclaimer says:

    Why Sweden Succeeded While Others Failed

    Here’s a dissident right (whatever that means) site that debunks this Sweden nonsense. Maybe you guys will listen to reason if it comes from your own side:

    “Sweden stands out from its neighbors in Northern Europe in that is doing much worse than all of them. Why isn’t Norway hailed as a success story? Deaths are 79 per million in Germany compared to 263 per million in Sweden. It is 33 per million in Hungary, 17 per million in Poland, 39 per million in Norway and 39 per million in Finland, 79 per million in Denmark, on 22 per million in Czechia.”

    “Sweden’s response to the virus has also been severely misrepresented by conservatives and libertarians. Sweden is full of Swedes who trust and obey the government. Large numbers of Swedes work from home anyway. The situation in Sweden is in no way comparable to what the “Liberty or Death” conservatives and libertarians want to do here in the United States after ending the lockdowns.”

    “Why isn’t Tucker Carlson touting South Korea or Singapore as a success story? Only 248 people and 16 people have respectively died there from the virus. Why isn’t Tucker Carlson showcasing the success that Australia and New Zealand have had in eradicating the virus after taking the extraordinary step to close their borders? Only 93 and 19 people have respectively died there from the virus. New Zealand has even declared victory over the virus after eradicating local transmission.”

    Here’s why none of these countries are touted by Tucker Carlson on FOX News: Germany has a universal multipayer health care system and imposed a strong national lockdown. Norway and Denmark went into lockdown. China and Singapore went into lockdown. Australia and New Zealand went into lockdown and closed their borders. All of these other countries like Hungary, Vietnam, Mongolia, North Korea and Taiwan closed their borders to deal with the virus. South Korea and Singapore have used what Tucker Carlson decries as Big Tech surveillance state tyranny to fight the virus. The Czechs required the public to wear masks and that alone brought down the virus far better than Sweden’s approach.”

    http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2020/05/01/conservatives-are-obsessed-with-sweden/

    What a real success story looks like:

    New Zealand health official claims ‘elimination’ of coronavirus as new cases hit single digits

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/28/coronavirus-new-zealand-health-official-claims-elimination-virus/3038321001/

    • Replies: @Hail
    , @Alfred
    , @Brewer
    , @anon
  37. anon[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dieter Kief

    maybe 0.4 % of the severe cases

    Whatever the final number, it’s certainly nowhere near the comparison to “just the flu” he and other posters were making just a few weeks ago. In fact, one of these guys claimed we wouldn’t even get to 40k deaths as I recall it. Lol. The latest projection has it at ~170,000 deaths by August, and that doesn’t account for releasing lockdowns and the rest of the year. It could be 250k by Christmas.

    P.S. A note on Sweden, the so-called success story. Latching onto this country which American libertarians did not understand was yet another hysterical attempt to force the beaches to open and light the grills. They are opposed to doing anything that affects their ability to “live their lives”– even for a month.

    All is Not What it Seems in Sweden

    Contrary to impressions created in American media, Sweden’s approach to handling the pandemic has not been “relaxed,” but essentially the same as in other Western countries.”

    https://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/all-is-not-what-it-seems-in-sweden/

    But if it makes you guys feel any better, yes the economy will open soon and you’ll get to light those grills … and a lot of people will die. You let this get too far out of control to contain and now it will burn through the population. Probably 200k will die before the end of the year and we may not even have a vaccine until fall 2021 at best. Smh. Prepare for the Trumpslap. You’ll lose the House, Senate, state legislatures, and White House by a historic margin. It’s coming.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Hail
    , @schnellandine
  38. MB says: • Website

    ” The latest projection has it at ~170,000 deaths by August . . . .”

    You don’t get it, do you?
    Forget Sweden, what happened on the Diamond Princess or the Roosevelt aircraft carrier?

    There are models and there are models.
    Imperial College/Ferguson, IMHE, the CDC/WHO are bought and paid for by Bill Gates.

    Even if the Spanish Flu, we didn’t shut down the economy and sunshine and fresh air was found to heal those who couldn’t be stuck indoors in the real hospitals.

    This is not the second coming of the bubonic plague. It is a rerun of the ’08 bailouts though and revival of moar big govt. solutions courtesy of Bill Gates money making the way smooth for his microchipped vaccines/msm thought control.

    You’re welcome.

  39. @Hail

    I am somewhat skeptical of your claim. Sweden’s policy was not herd immunity. It was social isolation, the same as all the rest. The only difference was that it was not imposed, but rather voluntary. It has probably caused a lesser degree of damage on the economy, but I wouldn’t bet on a big difference from other countries on that area either.

    Anyway, this can only be settled by numbers, which should not delay.

    I searched (only a little) for some information on Sweden’s rate of immunity, and found this article from about a week ago, which reports a very low rate:

    How Close Is Sweden to Herd Immunity From the Coronavirus?
    https://www.realclearscience.com/articles/2020/04/27/how_close_is_sweden_to_herd_immunity_from_the_coronavirus_111374.html

    • Agree: Dieter Kief
    • Replies: @anon
    , @Hail
    , @Felix Krull
    , @Alfred
  40. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    In fact, one of these guys claimed we wouldn’t even get to 40k deaths as I recall it

    Was this before CDC issued guidelines to basically call every death, even if the decedent never tested positive for Covid-19, a Covid-19 death?

    Lol. The latest projection has it at ~170,000 deaths by August, and that doesn’t account for releasing lockdowns and the rest of the year. It could be 250k by Christmas.

    Are these the same prognosticators who were predicting 2.2 million US deaths a few weeks ago? How accurate have any of the prognosticators been and why should we believe them now?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  41. @anon

    “OK, Doomer”. Here’s the deal. I am not quite a Boomer per Strauss & Howe’s definitions. I don’t have a 401k. Yes, I would have come out pretty good having had one, but I had no faith in the long-term finances of this country since the bail-outs. I’d rather just take care of my own money, thank you very much, as the US Feral Gov’t can change the rules at any time. I’d rather be way early than a day late, as the preppers say. (This is more a comment for some of Audacious Epigone’s posts.)

    From everything I’ve read of the commenters/writers dissing the Boomers, it’s always in the vein of “they don’t ever want to die, so they are making TOO big a deal out of this.” You seem to be saying the opposite now, that most of them are for everyone going back to work and not panicking. Maybe this Kung Flu gap cuts across the generations. Have you thought of that?

    For the young people to put up with this, is, to me, pretty sad. Freedom and rights obviously mean nothing to most of them. It’s not only that, but they are the ones that need to be working, and they don’t have so many of the good jobs that enabled those Boomers you deride to have those 401k’s. Those 401k’s will go back up with the stock market, as the US Gov’t MUST keep interest rates low, and these finanical “instruments” make people feel rich and an increasing stock market enables pension funds to act like they are solvent. If interest rates went up to natural “price of money” levels, the US national budget would be so busted, and people would take money out of the stock market to put into less-risky things like CDs again.

    I don’t think it’s selfish to want to avoid an economic depression, but that’s just me. Some of you, I guess, need “muh Infotainment Panic-Fest”. Enjoy, sucker!

    • Thanks: RadicalCenter
  42. Guys, all of you: I had time today to spend an hour and a half outside in a place with a perfect day, in the bright sunshine and fresh air. I’m dosed up for anything now! I hope you all can do the same.

    We’ve got it way better than the Swedes, well most of us in America, weather wise. Though not that awful cold in the south, that place can get pretty gloomy pretty often. We’ve got it better here, so let’s not act like hysterical menopausal women. The Swedes have taught us to act like rational men, as much as I never thought I’d have occasion to say that.

  43. @anon

    How accurate have any of the prognosticators been and why should we believe them now?

    Because they’re on TV, dammit!

  44. @Dumbo

    I suspect it’s their boundless vanity that compels their incessant weirdness, more than their retardation and cuck levels. They just can’t contemplate that their innate Swedishness won’t be the deciding factor in all matters that they stride smugly in to, utterly oblivious of the abilities of predators to overcome them. The narcissism of the Swede is a well that I’ve never seen run dry.

  45. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Brás Cubas

    Anyway, this can only be settled by numbers, which should not delay.

    Agreed

    I searched (only a little) for some information on Sweden’s rate of immunity, and found this article from about a week ago, which reports a very low rate:

    Instead of searching around the Internet for opinions, why are you not simply going to the Swedish Ministry of Public Health web site to get the official daily number of infections, deaths and ICU patients, reviewing the plots and drawing your own conclusions?

    • Thanks: Brás Cubas
  46. Wally says:
    @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    – Except even the full blown Marxists are getting onboard the Swedish train.

    WHO hails Sweden as a ‘model’ for fighting coronavirus without a lockdown
    https://www.theblaze.com/news/who-hails-sweden-as-a-model-for-fighting-coronavirus-without-a-lockdown
    excerpt:

    “I think if we are to reach a new normal, Sweden represents a model if we wish to get back to a society in which we don’t have lockdowns.”

    – WHO’s chief emergencies expert, Dr. Mike Ryan

  47. @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    Time will tell. Point Whitney made is that preventing ‘herd’ immunity there may be a re-emerging of the virus and what this will mean to the economy and the population. I think he made a valid point.

  48. The author blames trump for shutting down our economy but the states made the call and a number of them chose to NOT go into lockdown.

    Most countries in the world chose lockdown because they were told to do so. The world economy started to collapse last september and the bankers needed a scapegoat and they told their stooges in the fake news press to wildly exaggerate covid.

    • Agree: Bro43rd, BannedHipster
    • Replies: @orionyx
    , @Hail
  49. Hail says: • Website
    @Dieter Kief

    It is not easy for Europeans to synthesize your numbers with the tragedy in Italy (even a dozen + priests died of CO-19…)

    Was the 2017-18 flu season a tragedy in Italy? No, no one cared. But hospitals in certain places were filled with flu patients and many died. No one called it a tragedy. Few probably even knew about it.

    If 2020 has a similar number of flu deaths, why would it be a tragedy now? What if 2020 is 1.1x as many? 1.2x as many? When do we cross the “let’s burn everything down” line? Or is it based solely on the fact that the international media is talking about it nonstop, and “waving bodies” at viewers?

    All the randomized population studies in the world have found a fatality rate down at ca. 0.1%. One in a province in Iran just came out with 0.08%, in line with every other study of the kind. The data all says the virus is not unusually dangerous, unless there is an international conspiracy to falsify these findings.

    I have very rarely seen anything in which the “narrative” is so far detached from the reality as corona.

    • Agree: acementhead
  50. Hail says: • Website
    @anon

    New model: […] 2 million [corona-deaths] over the next two years

    Sweden needs over 70k deaths to reach herd immunity

    You are a Doomer engaging in CoronaParanoia-induced doomer-fantasies, and(/or) you are a troll.

    Strangely, there are more than a few authors on this website who either agree with, or at least have seen fit to publicly say they agree with, these unhealthy doom fantasies which are unmoored from the nice warm shores of Reality, where we demand thing like evidence rather than indulging in wild, gut-feeling, ultra-worst-case-ism.

    ________

    One thing that the evil-beast of rge Corona-Panic has led me to appreciate more: For the sake of human civilizational stability, lo these last ten or more millennia, thank God that the people running the show have (for the most part) not been subject to wild hysterias, panics, paranoia, apocalypse fantasies, and “burn the village in order to save it” extremism like we see with the most extreme of the CoronaPanic-pushers. We, humanity, would never have advanced past the Stone Age!

    See again the graph in my comment above. Imagine if the pro-Panic squad had been around in any of those earlier years and ran the show then as much as it has managed to seize control now:

    Just about every year, a civilization-ending disaster descends upon us! A monstrous killer virus! Flu victims; virus terror! Fear! Panic NOW! What will we do, better shut down all economic activity and plunge everyone into poverty, for their own good of course. I mean, viruses are on the loose. Viruses!

    • LOL: TomSchmidt
    • Replies: @Alden
  51. Hail says: • Website
    @Brás Cubas

    How Close Is Sweden to Herd Immunity From the Coronavirus?

    The Swedish public health authority has run several randomized population studies that show they are very far advanced towards herd immunity. They may be there now, as of this writing, in Stockholm County. If not, they are very, very close; the rest of Sweden follows later.

    The epidemic is definitely now on the decline in Sweden (without destructive shutdowns or ‘lockdown’). Deaths (the most “lagging” indicator) will continue in May at a lower rate than the peak in mid-April. Then it will be over.

    I clicked onto the link you provided; the author seems unaware that Sweden did a major study on Easter weekend which showed the rapid advance towards herd immunity.

    • Replies: @Brás Cubas
  52. Yes it gone ok I suppose? But people have not fallen in to hysteria but we have tried to keep distancing, which i thing is good. Now swedes are very good, following advice from authorities and obeying the law. I suspect I have had the virus too, I had 14 days where I absolutely did not feel well, did not feel to concerned even I am 64.
    I think its luck/ bad luck who kicks the bucket with this disease.

    • Replies: @orionyx
  53. @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    Yes but it has cost/costing dearly, people staying home , most things closed etc.

  54. @American in Sweden

    You are a foreigner trying to tell the native people of some country how they should behave and who they should marry. Why don’t you go back to YOUR country and fix the MESS that you left behind in first place, Mr. White American? Let the Swedes take care of their country, I’m sure they can make decisions without Americans’ supreme “wisdom”.

    • Replies: @ben sampson
  55. Pft says:

    I can speak first hand on Taiwan. There was no lockdown. Schools closed for a month in February. They started temp checks at airport early January. In middle of March they banned foreign visitors and imposed 14 day stay at home for all incoming residents.

    They did a pretty good job with contact tracing for the few (400+) who tested positive (5 dead). No over testing.

    They did close a couple of nightclubs and stopped large gatherings. Baseball being played without fans.

    They encouraged mask wearing and made masks a available. It was only mandatory for hospitals until recently on trains too. Gyms open with temp checks and registering name/tel number. Only employees wear masks.

    Pretty much everything open from what I see. Schools since March 1, you can eat out, shop, whatever you want pretty much.

    A large number of people here travel abroad, especially before and shortly after the lunar new year when it was at its peak in China. Lot of people living and working in China came back for the holiday. Many others travelled abroad to Europe and US for holidays. Many Taiwan kids returned from schools in Europe and US when colleges closed. Most confirmed cases were from those coming back. Very little local spread.

    People of course exercised caution especially in the beginning . Fewer people at hospitals. Some ate out less. Pretty much normal over the last month. More people walking in parks

    Social distancing here is just a pipe dream. Way too high a population density. Plus culturally, its just not done by most people especially older people. Most elderly live with family and not nursing homes.

  56. utu says:

    More irresponsible demagoguery from Mike Whitney. How special is Sweden? Very special. Actually Sweden is 4 Standard Deviations outlier when compared to European countries. The Swedish the total of deaths is 4SD above the European average. In the following graph the total deaths per capita were divided by population density. Population density is a confounding variable as it is approximately proportional to R0.
    If countries that are around the Mean like Belgium (BEL), Estonia (EST), Italy (ITA) followed the Swedish life saving method their fatalities would be six times higher. If countries that are below the Mean like Portugal (POR), Austria (AUS), Denmark (DEN) followed the Swedish approach their death total would be 12-18 times higher. We can calculate for each country its hypothetical deaths total under the Swedish laissez-faire regimen. In the following graphs deaths totals as of May 3 for 22 countries are shown in red and the hypothetical deaths totals for the same countries under the Swedish laissez-faire regimen are shown in blue.
    Mike Whitney with his demagoguery is advocating killing 1,030,400 Europeans which is 7.5 times more than the current total of 136,000 deaths as of May 3 for the 22 countries. The countermeasure so far have saved 900,000 lives by not following the Swedish example.

    The death totals and deaths totals per capita were taken from the worldometers.info and the population density form wikipedia to generate the two graphs.

    • Thanks: Dieter Kief
    • LOL: Wally
    • Replies: @Swedish Family
    , @Hail
  57. Hail says: • Website
    @anon

    the comparison to “just the flu”

    I don’t get why some among the pro-Panic holdouts still think this is a winning line.

    Okay, I do get it in one way: The pro-Panic side has a lockstep media, and legions of shrill auxiliaries in social media, behind them — or is it in front of them? — and the media will “wave bodies” at people, run 24/7 corona-propaganda (corona-prolefeed), flash rolling body counts and so on, on screens across the land, and keep people scared and in line, leading people to say “No way is this like the flu! Look at the pictures!

    Removing the media from the equation, what is the, uhh, evidence basis Wuhan-Coronavirus is something orders of magnitude worse than the usual flu, (which always causes some number of deaths and varies from year to year)?

    – If it’s a flu-causing virus (a certain proportion of all so-called “flu-like illnesses” have always been caused by coronaviruses, and there are hundreds of them),
    – if the symptoms are not so different from other strains,
    – if it kills exactly the same sorts of people as other flu viruses (deathbed patients or the very weakest and frailest, statistically never the young/healthy),
    – if ca. 0.05% – 0.15% of those who get it die, just like other flu viruses,

    then it’s the flu. (Better stated as “a flu virus.”)

    As we have learned now, over and over again, this flu is a flu.”
    — Dr. Knut Wittkowski, on the Wuhan-Coronavirus, April 16.

    Maybe it’s slightly worse than the other strains in circulation since Swine Flu, but it fits the flu description on every single parameter. Remove media-directed hysteria and the fear campaign, and what do the pro-Panic holdouts actually have?

  58. I’m afraid I must agree with the assessment of “childish enthusiasm”.

    I don’t want to detract from the value of the author’s analysis, but it isolates one factor and presents it as the only important consideration.

    Sweden may well have succeeded in one thing, but that approach killed everyone in the nursing homes, similar to what happened in Washington State and what is happening in many states in the US and a few other countries. Nobody protected the old people and in some US nursing homes the fatality rate has been around 50%. Sweden too. That’s not a success by any measure.

  59. Hail says: • Website
    @anon

    a dissident right (whatever that means) site that debunks…Sweden

    That’s just Hunter Wallace, who for reasons I don’t understand personally caved in to CoronaParanoia in March and looks to be among the bitter-ender holdouts still pushing the pro-Panic line.

    Hunter Wallace doesn’t want to know what’s going on with Sweden.

    There are people out there who want very much to “use” this flu pandemic (a minor one in world-historical terms, which, absent the saturation-news-cycle, the 2010s/2020s-era Internet, and some other things, might not even ever have been noticed), to push one or more petty agendas. Lots of people, in fact, are doing this, big and small. I think this is immoral. They don’t understand, I guess, that they are playing with an enormous amount of fire here, in that the pro-Panic forces are hurting more and more people the longer they keep up the shutdowns, restrictions, disruptions, and general Panic atmosphere with the low-info masses riled up. How many of their own people’s lives do they want to majorly disrupt or destroy?

    Sweden is actually great news for all of us. The lesson is, We need not fear the virus; we need not hand over the keys of the land to ‘Lockdown’-fanatics; we have our pride; we are not slaves. That’s the anti-Panic side’s position. That, and evidence.

    • Agree: Bro43rd
  60. @American in Sweden

    while I have never been to Sweden I can hardly imagine than Swedish women have a lot of children with the rather gracile and unattractive Somalians. I could imagine the rather have kids with West Africans of which the have fewer in Sweden as far as I know.

  61. Alfred says:

    The fake epidemic is over. But the economies will never recover to 2019. Well done Bill Gates and your minions.

    Perspectives on the Pandemic | Professor Knut Wittkowski Update Interview | Episode 5

    • Agree: Hail
    • Replies: @Hail
  62. Alfred says:
    @TomSchmidt

    So long as they allow no one to cross their borders bringing in a new infection, yes

    You clearly don’t understand how herd immunity works. As soon as those who are most sociable or those who deal most with the public have antibodies, the virus stops dead in its tracks.

    What is so difficult for you to understand?

    This is what has been happening for thousands of years. Humans are great at handling viruses this way. The proof is that you are alive.

    The fake refugees coming into Sweden probably already have had their own herd immunity. They either have nothing to transmit or they have antibodies.

    I must admit that those orchestrating this thing through their control of the media have managed to infect the mentality of a huge number of people with fear, panic and hysteria. Well done chaps!

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
  63. Max Payne says:

    Anyone here has covid-19? If you do I’ll let you fly me out to your shit hole of a home and you can sneeze in my face, put it up on YouTube and both of us can make a fortune. Show the world how much of a nothing burger it is.

    • LOL: Bro43rd
  64. Cargill says:

    Sweden is the European poster-child for stupid:

    Australia (pop 25 million)

    Total Cases: 6,799
    Cases per million: 267
    Deaths per million: 4

    Sweden (pop 5 million)

    Total Cases: 22,082
    Cases per million: 2,186
    Deaths per million: 264

    Australia succeeded by going early and going hard. It was the right model.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Alfred
  65. It will be interesting to see if Sweden will continue its experiment as events continue to unfold.

    When the dust settles and we look back a year from today…

    …people may ask: Was it worth it?

    Based on the data provided by Worldometer, the ratio of concluded cases (deaths + recovered) to active cases in Sweden is currently only 20% so the viral epidemic there is still in its early phase, compared to other European countries.

    If one presumes that pending cases will eventually play out roughly in the same manner as already concluded cases, then this is bad news for Sweden because their current ratio of deaths among the concluded cases is one of the highest in the world, at around 73%.

    Already, the deaths per million ratio in Sweden is one of the ten highest in the world, which makes this article appear like good “spin control”.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  66. Herd immunity is the Holy Grail of coronavirus social policy

    No, Herd Immunity has repeatedly been shown to be viable … vaccines are the current Holy Grail.

    • Agree: Alfred
  67. @Dumbo

    This is rubbish. No such thing. Mixing with non-Europeans is extremely rare, and is more frequent among Swedish males, who have Asian wives & mistresses.

    Somewhere from 40-50% deaths from c-chan are Somalis and similar colored minorities, and that’s why Swedes do not care about this all too much.

    This is Stockholm, where most non-whites reside. Where do you see those black or mulatto faces?

    • Replies: @anonymous
    , @Dumbo
  68. @American in Sweden

    At least a fourth of Swede blondes tend to have babies with Africans

    Keep on dreaming, boy.

    • Agree: Bardon Kaldian
  69. Be it immigration or Corona virus, Swedish response always seems to be of doggy style or play possum variety, whatever one prefers to call it.

  70. @Brás Cubas

    Sweden’s policy was not herd immunity. It was social isolation, the same as all the rest. The only difference was that it was not imposed, but rather voluntary.

    You forgot the bit about Sweden not shutting down its economy.

  71. Parfois1 says:

    It may be impertinent on my part amongst all this gloating about the blue-eyed (pardon the pun) boy’s success in fighting the virus to mention the crude reality of numbers, as some commenters have soberly pointed out.

    Compare the numbers of Sweden with the nearest European countries: Portugal (with a similar population to Sweden’s) and Ireland. The Swedish death rate is about twice of the other two; which is surprising considering, supposedly, its superior healthcare system.

    The much bloviated “herd immunity” may not in fact materialise; the only “herdy” thing going on here is not immunity – more like stupidity, if the numbers mean the opposite of what they state.

    What you should notice is something staring at you on the map of Europe: the Eastern side’s death and infection rates from Greece in the South to the Balts is consistently much lower than the Western side’s. Are the Slavs more resistant to the virus? If yes, then that may explain why US researchers have been harvesting DNAs from specific populations through their offshore labs, that is, some populations may have an innate immune system or more resistance to some type of infections and they are experimenting to customise their future targets with the most efficient bugs.

    It may also explain the different levels of virulence going on now (the “S” and “L” types) giving more credence to the suspicion of synthetic engineering by the USual evildoer.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  72. China chose for a part lockdown . Only the city of Wuhan and I believe part of the province Hubei were locked down only This left the remaining part of China to continue to function normally and kept most of the economy in tact and to recover more quickly. Quite a smart approach I reckon.

  73. utu says:

    There is a very chance that Sweden is cooking the daily deaths data. From their official site
    https://www.folkhalsomyndigheten.se/smittskydd-beredskap/utbrott/aktuella-utbrott/covid-19/bekraftade-fall-i-sverige/
    the daily infections and daily deaths do not correlate.

    One should be able to recognize a similar signature in both plots but this is not the case. In the second plot the daily deaths are rapidly decreasing from April 17 till now. One should see similar decrease in the first plot but beginning about 3 weeks earlier, i.e., in late March. But infection in late March are still in increasing phase and then they reach a plateau with periodic signature. Swedish daily deaths data compiled by worldometers.info have the same period signature as daily infection data.

    Let me bring again what the Chief Epidemiologist Anders Tegnell has promised: “[we will] slash the death rate to well below 1 per cent, perhaps even lower than seasonal flu.” by “cut[ting] the number of people dying from coronavirus by as much as four fifths.” End apparently they are doing it by hook or by crook.

    Sweden’s Chief Epidemiologist Anders Tegnell (April 3)
    https://archive.fo/seBhv#selection-981.0-981.230

    The Swedes believe that changing how the figures are reported will cut the number of people dying from coronavirus by as much as four fifths, and slash the death rate to well below 1 per cent, perhaps even lower than seasonal flu

  74. @Erik Sieven

    So you think that the gorilla is better than the bonobo … how interesting!

  75. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Cargill

    Sweden (pop 5 million)

    Actually, the population of Sweden is over 10 million. You were only off by over 100%.

    https://sweden.se/quick-facts/population/

    One thing I have noticed is that the doomers rarely get data from any official sources, like Sweden’s Ministry Of Public Health, review the data, and draw their own conclusions. Instead, they search around the Internet for articles and “expert” opinions that agree with them and they think they are being scientific.

    The scientific method requires original source raw data. If your post does not contain a link to the official raw data or demographics, at best, you are being unscientific. At worst, you are being a propagandist or promoting someone else’s propaganda.

    • Replies: @Hail
  76. Keep in mind that according to the Swedish Riksbank the Swedish economy is de facto closed with first quarter economic activity being off by 11%.

    Keep in mind also that at this point in our knowledge of the virus herd immunity is only an assumption. Reinfections and tests showing too few antibodies in recovered patients to provide immunity raise questions about the reality of herd immunity.

    • Replies: @anon
  77. orionyx says:
    @Hang All Text Drivers

    Most countries in the world chose lockdown because they were told to do so. The world economy started to collapse last september and the bankers needed a scapegoat and they told their stooges in the fake news press to wildly exaggerate covid.

    A good, concise summing up of the truth.

    But of course it will be ignored.

    • Agree: Alfred
  78. utu says:
    @Dieter Kief

    IFR increases with age almost exponentially. The best job of estimating the IFR from Italian excess mortality statistics was done by the team of physicists:

    Total COVID-19 Mortality in Italy: Excess Mortality and Age Dependence through Time-Series Analysis, Chirag Modi1, Vanessa Bohm, Simone Ferraro,, George Stein, and Uros Seljak

    Berkeley Center for Cosmological Physics, Department of Physics, University of California, Berkeley, CA 94720, USA
    Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, One Cyclotron Road, Berkeley, CA 94720, USA
    Berkeley Institute for Data Science, University of California, Berkeley, CA 94720, USA
    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.15.20067074v2.full.pdf

    I have plotted their results from Table 2.
    For Age70 IFR double every 7.8 years.

    Population’s effective IFR depends on the population age demographics. In many European countries 20% of population is above 65 years old (Italy 23%, Germany 21.5%, Portugal 21.5%, Finland 21.2%, Sweden 19.9%, ….). The youngest European countries are Norway 16.8%, Poland 16.8%, Slovakia 15.1%, Iceland 14.4%, Ireland 13.9%). Outside of Europe many countries are much younger: Israel 11.7%, Columbia 7.6%, Vietnam 7.2%, Egypt 5.2%, Nigeria 2.8%. So one may expect that IFR in Israel will be two times lower than in Italy and in Vietnam it will be 3 times lower and in Egypt 4 times lower and in Nigeria 8 times lower than in Italy.

    Anyway, anybody can read from the graph his own risk of dying if being infected.

  79. orionyx says:
    @Den Lille Abe

    And how did you know just which virus you had? Did you just pick the one that’s in the news? If you’d felt this way and never heard of coronavirus, would you have said you have a touch of the flu?

  80. anonymous[161] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Lol! You too are from a loser beggar genocidal entity called serbia, right? You should really stop trying to feel all superior. You are just a lowlife.

    • Troll: Alfred
    • Replies: @Dumbo
  81. @Hail

    I clicked onto the link you provided; the author seems unaware that Sweden did a major study on Easter weekend which showed the rapid advance towards herd immunity.

    Well, this is one of those occasions in which I rejoice in being wrong. I don’t live in Sweden myself, but as Brazil has been said to have one of the greatest transmission rates of the planet, I expect that we also may have a somewhat higher than average number of immunized people.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  82. Sean says:

    Herd immunity is the Holy Grail of coronavirus social policy because it provides the population with some level of protection from future infection

    No, the Grail is to tame the virus and make it far less dangerous, which can only be done by as far as feasible an absolutely enforced complete closedown.

    WHEREIN L type coronavirus was dominant until the first week of January when the outbreak was concentrated around Wuhan in the Hubei province of China. As the transmission spread to other places, S type coronavirus became dominant. The study found that L type has a higher transmission rate as it replicates faster in human populations, making it a more progressive strain. These two types of strains have a genetic difference of about 4%. The L-type strain was later found to be more prevalent in places where the mortality rate was very high, like Italy (26,644 deaths), Spain (23,521 deaths) and New York (17,280 deaths).

    —–

    As for the economy, Swedes simply could not have a lockdown, they have to work long and hard, much more so than the most comparable countries. In the only thing that counts, Sweden is totally different to Norway. That thing is natural resources, which Norway has and Sweden does not. Russians work not very many hours a week, South Koreans work the most hours per week of any country in the world.

    South Korea quashed its coronavirus epidemic without a lockdown

  83. 450.org says:
    @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    Once again, it amazes me how these heretofore critics of Sweden because of its “socialism” are now jumping on the Sweden “socialism” bandwagon. What hypocrites. As for me, I never bought the falsehood that Sweden was “socialist.” In fact, my research has proven to me that Sweden is actually quite fascist replete with a rather deranged, psychotic upper class elite. Stieg Larsson’s The Girl With The Dragon Tattoo series sheds proper light on Sweden’s fascist underbelly it hides behind a veil of “socialism.” Sure, it’s a fictional series but it’s non-fictional fiction meaning there’s more than a ring of truth to it in its critique of Swedish society.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Alden
  84. Z-man says:
    @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    As for “Sweden succeeded where others failed,” aren’t countries like Finland, Denmark, Norway getting a actual grip on the corona virus?

    Deaths per 1M population; Finland 42, Norway 39, Denmark 84… Sweden 265.

  85. Parfois1 says:
    @utu

    There is a recognizable pattern in the deaths graph though: there is a respite on weekends as if the Grim Reaper takes a break from the slashing.

    Pardon my flippancy, but the whole rigmarole, to-do and hue-and-cry is becoming farcical, perhaps deliberately as a smoke-screen to distract everyone from and about the real issue: finding Patient Zero and perpetrators, or rather, finding the smoking gun as the gunslinger is well-known.

  86. geokat62 says:
    @utu

    Let me bring again what the Chief Epidemiologist Anders Tegnell has promised: “[we will] slash the death rate to well below 1 per cent, perhaps even lower than seasonal flu.” by “cut[ting] the number of people dying from coronavirus by as much as four fifths.”

    Anders Tegnell promised these things, really?

    I read the article and while I did find the two phrases you quoted, they did not appear to come from the mouth of Anders Tegnell, as you so deceptively made it appear to be the case.

    End apparently they are doing it by hook or by crook.

    The Swedes simply intend to present data that distinguishes between those who died WITH and those that died FROM the coronavirus.

    Here’s how the article you linked to described it:

    But public health officials have one more trick up their sleeves to dampen down the fears over the virus. The country is also about to start releasing figures that show how many people died “from” coronavirus rather than died “with” coronavirus, as the British statistics show.

    They’re not hiding anything. They will simply by releasing data for both kinds of deaths, WITH and FROM.

    • Replies: @utu
  87. KA says:
    @Brás Cubas

    1Antibody responses depend on various factors which vary widely . Gene, gender, pollution,nutrition level and coexisting medical diseases can have robust impact .
    Type of antigens most instrumental in initiating the antibody responses is very important . In case of corona virus , it’s the coat spike protein S which so far has been found to give rise to protective antibodies .

    IgG and IgM are serum and nonmucosal antibodies . They have less or no effect on the viruses sitting in the skin or the inside of the noses . IgA is the mucosal antibodies and are not triggered by viral antigen .

    ———-

    China and Sweden have apporuachef it differently, We have to wait . It’s too early to conjecture , let alone analyze even the emerging data .
    Herd immunity is what we are looking for . I am sure Chinese have given thought about it also .
    Let’s see what happens in coming months

  88. Bro43rd says:

    All the pro-shutdowns like to point to the numbers but do not acknowledge the numbers are massaged & compiled by other pro-shutdowners. The number(s) that matter most will be total deaths (of all causes) compared yoy, that will tell the tale whether Sweden’s path or pro-shutdowners is better. Herd immunity has worked thus far for humankind & so Sweden’s path will be most probably shown correct.

  89. Chippers says:

    This virus will be with us for a long time to come. Vulnerable people should be protected and protect themselves if they are able, for a long time to come. I do not predict a vaccine will be widely available within 1 year to 18 months. This is not at all likely to happen. Immunity to the four Coronaviruses that cause the common cold lasts maybe a year, so reinfections are entirely within the realm of possibility, “herd immunity” be damned. Meanwhile, we are learning more about this virus daily. It appears to attack the endothelial linings of our blood vessels. Sure, it gets entry via our airways and attaches to our ACE2 receptors deep in our alveoli, but our blood vessels are rich in ACE2 receptors also. Via a mechanism called oxidative stress, this virus appears to be able to damage the endothelium so badly as to cause clots to form in various places all over the body, hence we are seeing what we call the “Happy Hypoxics” in the ER, seemingly doing fine and talking and in no respiratory distress with oxygen saturations in the 70s, who then very suddenly, crash and burn (from a clot). People in their 30s, 40s, 50s, are dying from clots, forming in real time in their hearts, brains, kidneys, lungs, and elsewhere. Wear masks, people. Please. Don’t fight each other. Wash your hands and cover your damn coughs with a mask, like forever…. Do like the Asians do, wear masks out in public places. Don’t be dicks like in Oklahoma recently where store clerks were threatened for wearing masks… People, don’t be willfully ignorant.

  90. Emslander says:
    @American in Sweden

    I don’t know how long the recessive Blonde gene will survive.

    A recessive gene will never be eliminated from a population, primarily because it is recessive. It stays hidden until it gets paired with its like. It will continue to show up, desired or not, because it can’t be selected out. Its carriers who show the dominant variety can’t be selected one way or another. Basic genetics. It’s actually easier to select-out a dominant gene.

  91. theMann says:

    Three irrefutable points:

    1. The stupendous corruption of the Medical “Professionals”.

    https://commission.itnj.org/2020/04/30/corona-emergency-hearing-4-dr-rashid-buttar-dr-judy-mikovits/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=corona-emergency-hearing-4-dr-rashid-buttar-dr-judy-mikovits

    Pay particular attention at the 1:03 mark.

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog/judge-napolitano-we-have-no-obligation-to-obey-tyrant-state-governors-5-1-20/

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2020/05/david-stockman/the-three-nations-of-covid-and-a-windbag-named-fauci/

    I could go on, but the facts aren’t changing anybody’s minds.

    If you are under the age of sixty, you have abetter chance of getting hit by lightning than dying from the “corona virus”. Although if you got hit by lightning, you would be taken to a hospital, somehow die for a certainty, and the Death Certificate would claim Corona Virus.

    2. We are a nation currently ruled by a collection of hysterical 6 year old girls. Physically they may appear differently, but in reality……..

    Still, it is OBVIOUS that the wholly preventable deaths of sick old people in (criminally awful) nursing homes is worth destroying the Economy and the Rule of Law.

    We will never forget this, or let it go.

    3. You are doomed, there is NO WAY to avoid the virus.

    Oh, wait a minute, it isn’t normal for healthy people to catch much of anything, that is a function of compromised immune systems. Getting sufficient vitamins C and D during the Winter months would guarantee an infection rate so small it wouldn’t be particularly detected. All those dead people in old folks homes could have been avoided by the simple expedient of putting in sun lamps. But modern medicine doesn’t do prevention, there is neither profit nor power in it.

    And Profit and Power are the whole story of CoronaFraud.

  92. Isn’t the whole theory of “flattening the curve” out of the 17th or 18th century? You think people locked themselves in their homes, and hoped the couriers dropped off supplies paid on credit? Open air markets were the thing. People brought their wares their to be sold. Social distancing wasn’t a thing. Not hugging and smooching acquaintances was. The sick were likely quarantined. Their infected belongings were likely incinerated, a practice we should currently be doing. In other words you got exposed, and the weak got sick. Funny how the science crowd, who tend to love Charles Darwinism, don’t want to practice a little old school Darwinism. After all isn’t that the gist of flattening the curve?

    I don’t know if Swedish authorities are lying, or maybe foolish, or just smart. In the end if they don’t get a second wave of infection that will give you the answer. Having employment is a bonus except their taxes will be spent welfare for lazy invaders, but that is another issue. I will point out if Sweden is proven to be correct in their approach, their lead epidemiologist is a white Swedish man. Probably the only white man in the world doing the epidemiology. At some point take time to ponder that one.

  93. Wielgus says:
    @Parfois1

    I am in Greece (lockdown is to start being relaxed tomorrow). The death toll has been relatively small and many have been elderly or vulnerable on other grounds. Generally the death toll has been low in the Balkans and there may indeed be a West/East thing going on, one of the many mysteries of the virus.

  94. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @utu

    Swedish daily deaths data compiled by worldometers.info have the same period signature as daily infection data.

    Thanks for providing this link. From their Frequently Asked Questions:

    Official reports, directly from Government’s communication channels or indirectly, through local media sources when deemed reliable.

    Translation, if we don’t like the official government numbers we use local media sources in line with our hysterical Covid-19 world view.

    More from the FAQ.

    Worldometer’s Covid-19 data is trusted and used by Johns Hopkins CSSE, Financial Times, The New York Times, Business Insider, and many others.

    Here they graciously provide partial list of users and therefore sources not to be trusted for any Covid-19 reporting.

    https://www.worldometers.info/faq

    It gets even better. Worldometer is owned by DADAX whose web page is http://dadax.com/. Interestingly the web page only contains this information and.nothing else.

    Dadax is a US-based and American owned small digital media company.
    It was founded over 15 years ago.
    We are the publishers of Worldometer.

    I can’t find any information about who their owners are or their funding sources which is typical for entities acting as fronts for other organizations.

    • Thanks: utu
  95. Emslander says:

    What if, like just about everything, the effect of the virus on a person depends entirely upon the unique vulnerability of that person. Besides age, most of the things that cause death are fully controlled by life behavior. Obesity, heart disease, kidney failure and lung cancers are affected overwhelmingly by diet and abuse of various substances, including alcohol. Genetic vulnerabilities can be reduced by self-discipline.

    Given the fact that death comes to us all, why should it be your business that I stay at home, stay away from Church, wear a stupid mask or kiss a willing woman who tests positive for the virus? We can be pretty sure that, like voter supression and government jobs, the statistics depend entirely upon the political party of the state or local authority. Why give your life over to idiot politicians and digital dictators of any persuasion? I’ll take my chances on freedom.

  96. @Beau Nydle

    I suspect it’s their boundless vanity that compels their incessant weirdness, more than their retardation and cuck levels. They just can’t contemplate that their innate Swedishness won’t be the deciding factor in all matters that they stride smugly in to, utterly oblivious of the abilities of predators to overcome them. The narcissism of the Swede is a well that I’ve never seen run dry.

    Right on. Many fail to see this, which is why they get Sweden wrong. Humble we are not! 🙂

  97. The Republican party, led by Lindsey Graham, is fighting to make sure that the average America who lost their jobs to this can’t even get a lousy 600 dollars in unemployment. Graham has said he thinks Americans will just be lazy and won’t work.

    Graham, when he ran for President, bragged about how much money he was getting from rich New York Jews because of his 100% support of the foreign country of Israel, half way around the world. Graham had no problem voting to bail out Wall Street with unlimited money and he puts the interests of foreigners over Americans. He’s also a life-long advocate for open borders and amnesty who calls his own white population “bigots” while lavishing praise on the racial supremacist Jewish state in the Levant.

    Real piece of work that guy. I wonder how many little boys Mossad delivers to him every year?

    • Replies: @Bro43rd
    , @Akouo
  98. @utu

    How special is Sweden? Very special. Actually Sweden is 4 Standard Deviations outlier when compared to European countries. The Swedish the total of deaths is 4SD above the European average. In the following graph the total deaths per capita were divided by population density. Population density is a confounding variable as it is approximately proportional to R0.

    It’s confounding all right, but dividing total deaths by countrywide population density creates more problems than it solves. Most of northern Sweden is wilderness, just like northern Canada, Asian Russia, and the Australian outback.

    • Replies: @utu
  99. @Erik Sieven

    while I have never been to Sweden I can hardly imagine than Swedish women have a lot of children with the rather gracile and unattractive Somalians. I could imagine the rather have kids with West Africans of which the have fewer in Sweden as far as I know.

    And they don’t. It’s anyone’s guess how “American in Sweden” (“On the Internet, nobody knows you’re a dog”) came up with this bizarre idea.

  100. Alfred says:
    @Brás Cubas

    Sweden’s policy was not herd immunity. It was social isolation, the same as all the rest.

    Have you read the article? I don’t think so.

    Kindergartens, primary and secondary schools were open throughout. Restaurants, bars, offices, factories, government offices, sports and so on were all open.

    Sweden, Belarus and a handful of other places have proven that you were all suckered by this plandemic. You, with your low understanding of pandemics, have made a bad choice. Pretending to have done the right thing only confirms that you are unable to learn from your mistakes. You have permanently fucked up your economies. The price of oil is screaming it out aloud – WTI $25.

    When you are hungry and cold and your neighbours are threatening to take what little you have, you will understand the ramifications of what you have brought on yourselves. Instead of listening to respected independent epidemiologists who have studied these phenomenon for a century or more, you have decided to trust Bill Gates and his minions. A well-known psychopath who tried to cheat his partner Paul Allen out his share of Microsoft.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  101. Alfred says:
    @anon

    Why isn’t Tucker Carlson showcasing the success that Australia and New Zealand have had in eradicating the virus after taking the extraordinary step to close their borders?

    Australia is only now beginning to enter its winter season. For the first time in many years, they have snow on their ski slopes one month before the ski season begins. Of course, it a typical Fascist way, no one is allowed to ski although there is plenty of snow.

    Australia will sooner or later be compelled to reopen its borders. When it does, this flu is going to enter the country by hook or crook. Drugs get into Australia in large quantities so why shouldn’t viruses?

    This means that Australia is destined to have a miserable winter and a never ending quest to get rid of this virus – until herd immunity is reached.

    Here is some “good news” from Australia. 🙂

    Elimination of COVID-19 possible in Victoria if lockdown endures

    Of course, Sweden is already waving goodbye to this virus while the Australians will have to endure much more agony before they reach herd immunity. The have a lower IQ than the Swedes so what do you expect?

    The photo is of the deserted Melbourne Cricket Ground

    • Replies: @Curmudgeon
  102. Bro43rd says:
    @BannedHipster

    Both your comments today made me LOL but I had already met my limit to agree. You may be the first hipster I have ever liked. Keep up the good work!

  103. @Brás Cubas

    Apparently Sweden has reached the right equilibrium between immunization and the protection of the health system.

    I know this is a tangent, but back in the 90s I heard a lecture on the purpose of the Human Genome Project. The speaker, born in the mid 1930s, took the position that it was a project for Big Pharma to sell us more vaccines and drugs. He posed the following about the success of vaccines:
    – In the 1800s, it was reported that millions of people world wide, had died or suffered horrific side effects, such as blindness or infertility. He personally knew of know one who died or suffered those effects. He claimed no one he knew, knew of anyone either. He pointed out that until measles vaccines were hyped as the be all and end all to eradicate the disease, there were steady declines in reported measles outbreaks. While Big Pharma took all the credit, the reality was that humans, overall, were becoming immune to measles.
    Over the last 25 years, I have asked literally hundreds of people born in the 1950s or earlier, whether they knew of anyone who died or suffered from the effects of measles. I have yet to find one. The more I have looked into vaccines, the more I am convinced they are a fraud. The “flu shot” has an efficacy rate of about 20%, yet they are hyped by government as a “must” for older people. Vaccines ain’t what they are cracked up to be. Your best defense is a healthy, strong immune system.

  104. @Anon

    3) The true death count in Sweden will greatly exceed basically any flu season in modern history.

    They are using WHO counting methods. Anyone who dies that has contracted the virus is a Covid19 death. That includes people who are terminally ill.
    https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/

    A recent study overlays 5G with Covid 19. While correlation does not prove causation, the results are an eye opener. http://stateofthenation.co/?p=12846

    About 10 days ago, the local media reported another death from Covid 19. I went on line to check the local statistics for seasonal flu deaths. The rate for “Covid” deaths from March 1 was the same as the seasonal flu deaths reported between September 30, 2019 to February 1, 2020.

    Whatever the “official statements” of governments are, they are at best, half truths.

  105. @Alfred

    Closing borders when you live on islands a thousand miles from anything else is easier than multiple borders on a land mass. That said, closing borders is a good idea irrespective of a plandemic.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  106. Coronavirus is the one of the biggest scams in the history of America, and is just the common flu, being used to bring on a one world government via UN Agenda 2030.

  107. Alfred says:
    @anon

    Data, not theories should always be the measure of success

    Correct. But a difficult-to-grasp concept for those numerically-challenged.

    Here is the Swedish data from the government website in all its glory.

    Total numbers laboratory-confirmed (the numbers from New York are not laboratory-confirmed)

    The top chart shows the number of newly sick collapsing. It means that there are almost zero new infections – because of the delay between infection and falling sick. Bottom left is those who fall ill by age group. Bottom right is those who die by age group. Again, there is a delay between falling ill and dying.

  108. Sweden already has herd immunity to Stockholm Syndrome.

  109. Hail says: • Website
    @Hang All Text Drivers

    Most countries in the world chose lockdown because they were told to do so. The world economy started to collapse last september and the bankers needed a scapegoat and they told their stooges in the fake news press to wildly exaggerate covid.

    That doesn’t explain how they conned SO many, including many otherwise intelligent people, into believing a flu virus was the apocalypse. They got them emotionally “hooked” on Corona-Doom. This was sad, and alarming, to see. How easy mass manipulation really is.

    There are a lot of lessons here. One is, when the media is drumbeating something, it’s time to start asking critical questions; when signs of social-hysteria begin appearing, it’s really time to start asking questions. The attitude needs to be: “Show me the evidence.”

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  110. Hail says: • Website
    @utu

    utu is someone who believes we need to destroy as many people’s livelihoods as possible (and lives, in many cases) and stretch out the damage as long as possible, in a monomaniacal obsession with “crushing” a respiratory virus. He, and others of the pro-Panic side, focus entirely and solely on the semi-arbitrary figure of “deaths positive for x virus, up to the arbitrary point in time I’ve set” and ignore all else.

    The pro-Panic side decided in March that cost-benefit analysis is blasphemy, and even something like weighing lives and net-life-years lost to the Corona-Response than to the (historically relatively minor) fly virus that the media has been drumbeating since late January.

    Such is the Corona-Cult. Believers also ignore all evidence that the apocalypse scenarios, which are holy documents to the cult, may be (are definitely) false.

    Sweden, a heretic nation, must therefore be punished.

    • Replies: @Wally
    , @utu
  111. Alfred says:
    @unit472

    Its not big enough to isolate itself from the EU depression and it can’t stay neutral as in WW2 and escape the consequences of the coming Sino/American rift.

    You are not happy that Sweden has not crushed its economy like almost everyone else. You would have preferred Sweden to commit economic suicide like the USA and so many others.

    To “prove your point”, you resort to saying that the mistakes of Germany, the UK and other countries that Sweden trades with will rebound on Sweden. You are even not happy with Sweden having remained neutral in WW2. You would have preferred Sweden to have been occupied like Norway and destroyed like Poland.

    I call that sour grapes. 🙂

  112. Hail says: • Website
    @Alfred

    See also Compilation of Written Updates from Knut Wittkowski covering the period April 14 to April 30.

  113. Wielgus says:
    @450.org

    The Swedes actually bought into eugenics in a big way, up to and including sterilising people who did not make the cut, supposedly targeting Sami among others.

  114. Akouo says:

    Misleading. For a start, Sweden couldn’t impose a lockdown if it tried so it doesn’t try; imagine Paris, where the migrants attack the police trying to enforce lockdown but on a much bigger scale. Secondly, the Swedes have the ‘friendly’ version of the virus not the vicious version. It’s like the difference between what the west coast americans have vs what new yorkers have, VERY different. Eventually though, everyone will get every version so don’t be surprised by 180 degree attitudes soon. Lockdowns ARE good even if simply allowing hospitals etc to keep up and expand ability, as long as they actually do of course. My worry is that they’ll forget the expand ability bit and just be back at square one when the next worse wave hits and it will, hit.

    • Replies: @Hail
  115. Akouo says:
    @BannedHipster

    sHe has terrible taste in heels and handbags too.

  116. Hail says: • Website
    @anon

    doomers rarely get data from any official sources, like Sweden’s Ministry Of Public Health, review the data, and draw their own conclusions. Instead, they search around the Internet for articles and “expert” opinions that agree with them and they think they are being scientific.

    Right. This, combined with either innocent non-understanding, or willful non-understanding, of the way flu epidemics work. See above for graphs of Sweden’s Coronavirus-positive ICU-intakes and Deaths, direct-from-source data, which continues to show the epidemic in clear and sustained decline, now two weeks running.

    There was no virus apocalypse. There never was going to be one. It was all some combination of: honest misunderstanding, groupthink-hysteria, and malicious hoax.

  117. Hail says: • Website
    @Akouo

    Lockdowns ARE good even if simply allowing hospitals etc to keep up and expand ability

    Even this is now a long discredited position; hospitals have never been emptier. And no “swamped hospitals” have been observed in Sweden even at their peak period, proving the extremists and doom-foretellers wrong. I think you have fallen for media hype.

    Also, in a statement like “Lockdowns ARE good,” why not apply basic Cost-Benefit Analysis? Better than what? What are the costs? Ask questions. If only we’d done more of that instead of caving in.

    ________

    If only the anti-Panic side had been able to hold out in more countries, Western Man would be a lot better off. There are a lot of guilty parties here responsible for the victory of the Panic over us. I have a few ideas on naming who they are. Others in comment-sections on this website have named a lot of he potentially guilty.

  118. Alfred says:
    @Curmudgeon

    closing borders is a good idea irrespective of a plandemic.

    For the Black Death or Ebola, I agree. But for another version of the seasonal flu, I disagree.

    Australia is not the same as Pitcairn. In 2019, 10 million tourists visited this country of 24 million. Furthermore, there were almost one million foreign students. 11 million Australians traveled abroad.

    The Australian government’s catastrophic decisions – which were imposed by the media – will result in a massive amount of unemployment and social distress.

    Funnily enough, the journalists who are pushing this agenda are going to lose their jobs as the advertising business will take a huge hit. The newspapers are also very dependent on their house sale/rental websites. The drop in house prices and the lack of buyers will hit them hard.

    Below is a link to the “for rental” properties in a desirable part of Melbourne – it shows 650 properties. It was not like that a few months ago. So far, the rents have hardly dropped. In another few months, rents should be 30-40% lower. Domain.com.au is owned by the Fairfax media business. The hoped to sell it for A$1.4bn but were a bit late. 🙂

    Domain.com.au rental listing

  119. Hail says: • Website

    Related:

    Coronavirus hype biggest political hoax in history,” says Cheryl Chumley in Washington Times op-ed.

    I know we’re only twenty years in, but how about “The Hoax of the Twenty-First Century”? Okay, we’ll have to wait on that, but at very least, it takes the crown for “The Hoax of the First Quarter of the Twenty-First Century.”

  120. Hegar says:

    I live in Sweden. Note that the Swedish strategy – which all political parties basically agree on – was what they wanted in Britain too, but Boris Johnson was pummeled for it. He was called “a cold capitalist who only cares about the economy.” (The economy: The sum of all our livelihoods.) But the coalition government in Sweden is headed by the Social Democrats again, so then it’s okay.

    Note however that we do have about half of stores closed down. And 60% fewer commuters on buses, trains and in the subway. Many workplaces have only 40% work hours, and others work from home. There is a semi-quarantine.

    I will not say that quarantine is bad. Or that the system in Sweden is bad. Clearly Italy and Spain and New York need quarantine. Clearly you need to prevent massive outbreaks that overwhelm the hospital systems in countries and U.S. states, which can happen. But also, I hope the strategy employed in Sweden will result in herd immunity in the future.

    Because we can’t have this deadly virus come back every winter. For six months, instead of just in the end of the winter like now. We can’t have it spread everywhere and be deeply rooted, like the much less deadly flu is. Corona already kills more people globally per day than tuberculosis, the second largest killer. And tuberculosis is mostly outside the West. Imagine having a worse killer than tuberculosis spread in every Western town and city forever.

    If quarantine stops that, I’m for it. If going for herd immunity stops that, I’m for it. We’ll see. And let’s not make this a partisan issue. But of course, the U.S. political climate right now won’t allow for anything but warfare in every issue right now – for or against Trump, in everything.

    This part of Whitney’s well-written article bears repeating:

    “This is crucial, because without immunity, nations are condemned to an endless cycle of recurrent outbreaks that decimate the economy, stress the health care system and wipe out the old and weak.”

    A single patient at a British hospital, who later turned out to have corona, sent 25% of staff into quarantine after contact. No hospital system can afford this permanently and in every town and city. Corona must be stopped.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  121. @anon

    The people I see mingling in the mini-mall parking lot are young. The people I see mingling by the local baseball park are young. The people I see mingling in the West Village are young. It is the young people who don’t give a shit about the virus because they won’t, or at least think they won’t, get it. And they laugh at infecting other people, because they are sociopathic to a man.

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
    , @Emslander
  122. Sweden is a failure. Their ideas are dumb. It is already obvious that their deaths are considerably higher. What more do you want? “Herd immunity”? “Herd immunity” means many more people will die.

    • Replies: @Alfred
    , @Commentator Mike
  123. @utu

    There is a very chance that Sweden is cooking the daily deaths data. From their official site
    https://www.folkhalsomyndigheten.se/smittskydd-beredskap/utbrott/aktuella-utbrott/covid-19/bekraftade-fall-i-sverige/
    the daily infections and daily deaths do not correlate.

    You and others in this thread seem to be mixing up two unlike time series. The first (from the Public Health Agency — your second graph) shows the day a given death occured and the second (from Worldometers — your third graph) the day a given death was reported — no matter when it occured.

    From the Public Health Agency website:

    The time series of daily deaths includes only cases where the date of death is known (“Tidserien med antalet avlidna per dag innehåller endast de fall där datum för dödsfallet är känt”)

    This is also why you see such great swings in the Worldometers series, which tends to reflect variations in reporting more than variations in daily deaths. We can safely assume that the death figures for May 1 to May 3 (67, 16, and 10, respectively) will be balanced by higher figures over the coming days.

    Swedish daily deaths data compiled by worldometers.info have the same period signature as daily infection data.

    You think? To my eyes, Graphs 2 and 3 are the ones with similar shapes.

  124. Dingbat says:

    The following articles are in Swedish. Put them trough a translator and see yourself:

    https://www.friatider.se/kommuner-i-planerad-morklaggning-av-coronasmitta-pa-aldreboenden
    This article says that municipalities just south of Stockholm had been actively planning to hide the numbers of Corona-infected in care homes for the elderly. It also says that a country-wide investigation by daily newspaper Dagens Nyheter came to the conclusion that thousands are infected in care homes for the elderly.

    https://www.friatider.se/sjukskoterskans-larm-coronasjuka-kvavs-till-dods-under-flera-dagar-vagras-syrgas
    This article says that a nurse (who is also a local politician for the populist Sweden Democrats) had reported on people in care homes suffocating from Corona. According to her this way of dying from Corona is torturous and can be drawn out for days. These people are left in their care homes, they are denied oxygen and are only administered opioids by care home staff. She has actually been put in charge of approving this type of “care” in each single case in the area where she lives.

    Sweden has a tradition of neglecting the elderly as conditions in care homes are often appalling and can be compared to animal husbandry even without Corona. Just before the outbreak, there were several cases of care homes being emptied of their inhabitants, who then had to move, to let migrants move in. Sweden also has a culture of general silence on all kinds things that are insufferable (“tystnadskultur”), in particular with respect to the effects migration has on Swedish society. (Hate speech laws are applied so widely that people have been convicted for putting words like “refugee child” in quotes when they were referring to these “children” often not being children.) The Corona response is largely guided by the migration aspect, too, like basically everything in Sweden. In this vein ordinary people who are used to never speaking up about anything keep their mouths shut about Corona. Sweden has a but rump police force that has been hollowed out like so many other things to pay for immigration. Sweden could never impose any kind of lock-down on its migrant-heavy suburbs to begin with. Neither does the Swedish state have the power, nor do the people who live these suburbs have the ability to stay in their cramped living quarters for long. Tegnell is just a front man for it all. The real man in charge is still Stefan Löfvén, the childless, uneducated, opportunistic, Islamist-friendly, commie prime minister with his unfailing power instinct. Löfvén once said that his policies of mass immigration had to be implemented at any price. He meant it and he has been acting on it ever since he took over from his equally radical, centrist predecessor. Sweden is a country-sized, leftist mental asylum and open-air gulag. The Corona “response” follows these same lines. The only thing that’s even madder is conservatives and libertarians suddenly discovering their fondness for it.

    • Thanks: Levtraro, Dieter Kief
    • Replies: @Alfred
  125. @anon

    It could be 250k by Christmas.

    You don’t get to cross flu seasons like that and not be taken for what you are: A Chicken Little sideshow.

    It could be 895k! (Where’s my Honorary Floptorate?)

    Go hide. Leave life to the men.

  126. Dingbat says:

    Here is another “interesting” tidbit in Swedish:

    https://omni.se/djuroperationer-stalls-in-i-brist-pa-narkosmedel/a/jd2OEn
    This article says that animal surgeries are being cancelled because supplies of a commonly-used animal anaesthetic have been re-directed to being used on Corona patients.

    So much for Swedish “success” in the face of an epidemic that was known to hit the country several months in advance.

  127. @Beau Nydle

    The narcissism of the Swede is a well that I’ve never seen run dry.

    A trait likely passed down by their negroid Viking ancestors.

  128. Alfred says:
    @obwandiyag

    Sweden is a failure

    Keep on repeating that mantra. But the facts belie it. You can eat your heart out. Are you going to quote the NYT?

    The people I see mingling in the mini-mall parking lot are young.

    I am sure you were young at one time. I am equally sure that you were a miserable young person. No one wanted to befriend you. It comes across in everything you write.

    You are upset because young people are healthy and enjoying themselves. It is the mentality of people like you that has locked up entire populations. Young people are the future – whether you like it or not.

    Substitute “sad” for “short” in this song and I think that would fit you nicely. 🙂

    “Randy Newman – Short People (Official Video)”

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
  129. Alfred says:
    @Dingbat

    Dagens Nyheter is owned by the Jewish Bonnier family. They are not ethnic Scandinavians. They are the ones behind the immigration of 3rd world trash to Sweden. They are liars. Mossad killed Swedish prime minister Olof Palme because he supported the Palestinians.

    The same crowd are fixing the New York numbers and putting people who have a cough on ventilators in infected rooms so that they die. You can be absolutely certain that the numbers in the Jewish hospitals of NYC are very different.

    If you find this hard to believe, why do you think the NYC scenario is not replicating in non Jew-controlled areas of the USA?

    Funeral Directors in COVID-19 Epicenter Doubt Legitimacy of Deaths Attributed to Pandemic

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5f_6ltv7oI&feature=youtu.be

  130. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Paul Craig Roberts

    Keep in mind that according to the Swedish Riksbank the Swedish economy is de facto closed with first quarter economic activity being off by 11%.

    According to JP Morgan the US unemployment will be 20% and GDP will drop by 40%. I believe we will start to see If JP Morgan is correct on May 8, when I believe the US releases its unemployment statistics. However, no-one seems to be taking into account the loss of civil liberties and social costs.

    No one in Sweden is dying alone because hospitals are not allowing family member, including spousal visitations like in the US.

    No one in Sweden is having mental health issues because they are living alone and work colleague contact is the only social contact they have like here in the US.

    To name a few.

    Keep in mind also that at this point in our knowledge of the virus herd immunity is only an assumption. Reinfections and tests showing too few antibodies in recovered patients to provide immunity raise questions about the reality of herd immunity.

    Whether herd immunity is real is not ielevant. The data shows that what Sweden is doing works. Why it works we may never know. We don’t know how the sun works either but that doesn’t invalidate the light and heat we get from it.

  131. Anonymous[447] • Disclaimer says:
    @obwandiyag

    “occidentaldissent”? That site appears to be a parody of Cass Sunstein’s “cognitive infiltration,” of infiltrating for the purpose of discrediting with gibberish like yours.

  132. Levtraro says:

    We don’t know how the sun works either but that doesn’t invalidate the light and heat we get from it.

    I am sure you don’t know, anon 230, you didn’t have to say it. Most of us however, do know how the sun works.

    Here is a hint: hydrogen and helium.

    • Replies: @anon
  133. Wally says:
    @Hail

    Indeed, utu believes in many cult fantasies & bizarre wishful thinking, especially of the unhinged Marxist kind.

    He even believes in the scientifically, technically impossible ‘Nazi gas chambers’.

    Donald Trump Goes to War: Shows Media Video of Their Reporting Failures on Coronavirus
    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/04/13/donald-trump-goes-to-war-shows-media-a-video-of-their-reporting-failures-on-coronavirus/

  134. Anonymous[447] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hail

    Given that the nonstop fear porn on TV has continued beyond data and reality as you show, the nonstop excess suggests using the opportunity as predictive programming for the future release of an actual pandemic to cull populations, enforce sterilization, vaccination, and total behavioral control, as well as reduce the standard of living to what’s considered “sustainable” for the chosen, or by about half.

    It also follows that, having introduced this human “plannedemic,” it will be fairly easy to introduce livestock and crop pandemics with equally destructive longterm consequences for society in a way not unlike the results of DC’s bombing America’s cities to the cheers of their citizens, as we see citizens already conditioned to do in GB. Putative health professionals are falling all over themselves imitating wind-up monkey toys with that tiktok insanity. These people’s minds are clearly not their own.

    The new normal is some war or another requiring submission to the medico-scientific dictatorship owned by Gates and his ilk, and tragically for freedom we already see how easily it was for them to run the President of the United States of America around like a poodle in the circus.

  135. utu says:
    @Swedish Family

    Obviously population density is not a perfect variable because it can’t explain everything but it correlates with data so it plays a role in how the epidemic evolves in a give n country. Basically it affects the reproduction number R0. Lower density means lower R0. In the data I used the population density explains 27% of variance in data among the 21 countries (w/o Sweden). And when Sweden is included the population density explains 22% of variance. Dividing by density is nothing else than a shortcut to linear single variable regression fit.

    We would get much higher percent of data explained if for each country we could calculate the death effective density. Each death would be associated with a surrounding, say, 10 km radius area of a known density and then one could calculate the average effective density for all cases. This would take case of your objection that population is not uniformly distributed.

  136. utu says:
    @geokat62

    “They will simply by releasing data for both kinds of deaths, WITH and FROM.” – That’s how they do it, by hook or by crook. Where do they draw the line between “WITH” and “FROM” categories and do they keep shifting the line if they get more deaths cases than they planned to have? There is lots of pressure on the from Swedish general public and form the international community. The stakes are high for Anders Tegnell who must save his face and the honor of Sweden. Swedes are very proud and conceited. Their sh*t never stinks. The truth will come out and the heads, including that of Anders Tegnell will roll.

    “…they did not appear to come from the mouth of Anders Tegnell…” – So it was made up by the newspaper, right?

    • Replies: @geokat62
  137. WJ says:
    @anon

    Yet another person actually angry that the projections from a month ago or more, were bogus. It’s strewn through your writing with your liberal use of “muh” and general sense of outrage.

    Regardless of the lockdowns, the virus will always be there. At least that’s what the scientists say. With an R0 of around 3 the spread rate will increase again when restrictions are lifted. The Swedes recognized this. We will also, eventually. It’s inevitable and unavoidable. Or perhaps we will lockdown until “muh vaccine” comes out.

    • Agree: Alfred
    • Replies: @Hail
  138. Brewer says:
    @anon

    As a Kiwi I can tell you that only a fool calls a rugby match won until the final whistle.
    The virus may have been suppressed by the lockdown (which only postpones immunity) but it is not eradicated.
    I will make a prediction…….

    By election time in November when the full cost of the lockdown has killed the NZ economy and deaths from poverty and curtailed health services displace the silly self-congratulations of Ardern and co from the headlines, her administration may well be tossed out.

    …….and I am a life-long supporter of her Labour party.

  139. Herald says:
    @animalogic

    Nor has the Swedish experiment come to a conclusion.

    But then again the great lockdown bankruptcy experiment hasn’t yet come to any conclusion either, nor does one seem likely in the near future. However, the early indications are that the bankruptcy part of the experiment is working very well.

  140. Agent76 says:

    Apr 25, 2020 7 Studies IMPLODE Covid-19 Fear Agenda!

    Here’s The Sigh Of Relief You’ve Been Waiting For!

    Apr 24, 2020 Sweden, 5 U.S. states to have ‘herd immunity’ to COVID-19

    Ruling Republicans in five U.S. states are keeping their economies open as part of their coronavirus response similar to that in Sweden. According to Swedish scientists, there are unexpected benefits of such relaxed policies.

    Apr 15, 2020 Healthcare Workers Furloughed From Empty Hospitals

  141. geokat62 says:
    @utu

    Where do they draw the line between “WITH” and “FROM” categories and do they keep shifting the line if they get more deaths cases than they planned to have?

    While you (and Ron) were initially very dismissive of the Swedish approach, I see you’ve now resorted to “where to draw the line” arguments. That says a lot.

    The truth will come out and the heads, including that of Anders Tegnell will roll.

    If anyone has to worry about their head rolling, it’s Tony Fauci, not Anders Tegnell.

    So it was made up by the newspaper, right?

    I never suggested these phrases were made up. I merely pointed out that the newspaper never claimed they came out of Tegnell’s mouth. But you decided to make it appear as though they did.

    Simple question: What motivated you to do that?

    • Replies: @utu
  142. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Levtraro

    I am sure you don’t know, anon 230, you didn’t have to say it. Most of us however, do know how the sun works.

    Here is a hint: hydrogen and helium.

    Then maybe you can explain it in more detail. Let’s start with something simple. Why are there plasma accretion flows into sunspots? I and the Nobel committee are anxiously awaiting your response.

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  143. @anon

    Google Hans Bethe.

    • Replies: @anon
  144. utu says:
    @Hail

    If 21 European countries I included in the data followed the Swedish approach 900,000 more people would have been dead by now. Your cost-benefit analysis is just another mambo-jumbo which sweeps under the carpet the fact that w/o the countermeasure which were implement in most countries the death toll would be intolerable. If Sweden used more countermeasure 2250 would be still alive.

    • Troll: Alfred
    • Replies: @Hail
  145. Agent76 says:

    May 3, 2020 Surviving the Panicdemic, how to take back control of your mind by Dr. Bergman

    February 12, 2020 5G networks Switzerland halts rollout of 5G over health concerns The country’s environment agency has called time on the use of all new towers

    Switzerland, one of the world’s leaders in the rollout of 5G mobile technology, has placed an indefinite moratorium on the use of its new network because of health concerns.

    https://www.ft.com/content/848c5b44-4d7a-11ea-95a0-43d18ec715f5

  146. @obwandiyag

    I wonder if veterinarians preach and practice “herd immunity” if some cattle, chicken, pigs, etc. get infected with an incurable viral disease or do they just cull the herd. Some smart ass will say it’s to protect us humans from transmission. After all we goyim are just a herd of cattle to the elites and their chief vet Bill Gates. They have calculated how few of us “useless eaters” they’ll need in the greatly downsized world that is unfolding in front of our very eyes as the world economy crashes, or it actually did a long time ago but they just never told us, having been on life support with their endless printing of useless money and ever increasing debt. Beware of the promoters of “herd immunity”. Be afraid. Be very afraid – not so much of the coronavirus but of what comes next if the herd can’t be saved after they let this spread with very few not catching it or showing natural immunity to be spared. And if not this time then next time when they cook up something even more malignant. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
  147. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Google Hans Bethe

    How does your answer address my question. – Why are there plasma accretion flows into sunspots? Providing a link or saying Google this is not an answer. Give a detailed explanation in your own words.

    • Agree: schnellandine
    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  148. anon[191] • Disclaimer says:
    @American in Sweden

    How do you know this? Are you a negro? The very fact that you went straight into a subject which is not the one at hand shows that you are a troll.

  149. @Alfred

    You fucking scumbag. Sweden is a success if you mean they have more deaths than anybody else. You probably do you piece of shit. And you don’t even understand what I mean about the young people, who are mingling so that they can take death home to their beloved grandparents, you illiterate boob.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  150. Agent76 says:

    February 14, 2020 Parts of Switzerland has halted 5G rollout after health concerns

    Switzerland is one of the leading countries in the rollout of 5G mobile technology. The country has built more than 2000 antennas last year alone to upgrade its network, and many telecom providers has promised their customers imminent 5G coverage.

    http://timesofsweden.com/2020/02/14/parts-of-switzerland-halts-5g-rollout-after-health-concerns/

    Apr 4, 2020 ΝYC-ΙCU DR unknowingly describes the EFFECTS of 60GHz on patients.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  151. @Commentator Mike

    But … but … most of the clowns on here tell me herd immunity is the answer and so get with the program. Because those against herd immunity are the evil ones who are poised to take over the world.

    Oh myohmyomy, what do I do? How to make a choice. Which side should I be on. It’s truly difficult. Like choosing between either dumbshit or brilliantgenius. Which one to choose?

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  152. @Anti-White

    I love this reply!

    Tell him Anti-White. he got his blonde already and wish to stop others from having theirs

    hahahahahaha

  153. anon[191] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    The government of New Zealand just declared the virus an assault virus and banned it. Voila! Total success no more deaths from Covid!

    • LOL: RadicalCenter
  154. @Swedish Family

    I imagine that Erik Sieven’s point is actually the case

    but how cares any which way it actually goes. I dont! why in the hell would I be concerned who likes who and marry who and breed for whom. what a waste.!

    as long as I do what I want with whom I want and I am happy making my own chocies.. why should I be be concerned with the choices of others..IN THEIR PERSONAL LIVES?

    lots of poeple still need courses in how to mind their own business. my mother taught me how important that is…’just mind your own bizness bwoy! and you should be fine!”

    hahahahaha

  155. @anon

    The question was not about plasma & sunspots. It was how the sun (or any star) is powered. Bethe answered it. As for technical details you may be interested in, there are numerous detailed explanations. Just consult any regular site on the topic.

  156. utu says:
    @geokat62

    “While you (and Ron) were initially very dismissive of the Swedish approach, I see you’ve now resorted to “where to draw the line” arguments. That says a lot.”

    I was making the “where to draw the line” argument since I saw the Telegraph article (almost month ago) where Swedish strategy was explicated where in simple words it was stated that they will slash the four fifths of the death rate to get close or below the flu mortality. Since the article did not say that Sweden had a special drug or treatment to reduce mortality the only means they had was the accounting trick where they would draw a line between “From” and “With” to obtain the desired result. So if indeed they are slashing numbers by 4/5 the actual fatality in Sweden could be 5 times higher.

    My personal belief is that Sweden is indeed cooking the data. We would have to see true excess mortality data to know by how much. But even if we take the Swedish data on the face value they demonstrate that mortality rate in Sweden is seven times higher than in the remaining three Scandinavian countries after the density of population is taken into account. Actually Finland and Sweden have very similar population densities so their deaths per capita can be compared directly. This is enough to condemn the Swedish approach as they kill people at seven times higher rate than it is necessary. 6/7 of Swedish deaths form the official count could have been avoided. And it would be much more if indeed they are cooking the data.

    • Troll: Alfred
    • Replies: @geokat62
  157. ThomasT says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    There is NO scientific evidence that the CV infection, from a virus designed* to do massive damage and kill, causes immunity. Reinfections have been logged in S Korea, not known whether from active CV segments or CV hiding in eyeballs or testicles.

    *From Dr Boyle, top bio-warfare scientist recently.. ”We also know that one of the cooperating institutions [to Wuhan BSL4]was Harvard, and that the chairman of the Harvard chemistry department, [Dr. Charles Lieber], a specialist in nanotechnology, set up an entire laboratory in Wuhan where [according to reports]he specialized in applying nanotechnology to chemistry and biology.

    My guess is, based on what I’ve read in the literature, that they tried to weaponize all that together. And that is SARS-CoV-2 that we are dealing with now. So, it’s SARS, which is genetically engineered biowarfare agent to begin with. Second, it has gain-of-function properties, which makes it more lethal, more infectious. It has HIV in there. That was confirmed by an Indian scientist …”

    • Replies: @Hail
  158. I dont know about this article and Mike Whitney. at times I appreciate what that guys writes then again….

    tremendous attack on the people in the usa as far as I see…all of it seems well planned and calculated to me. the american economy collapses and Whitney is giving the money men a pass blaming th economic catastrophe on the virus..rather that the looters of america

    what always freaked me is: the use of plastics as in gloves, masks etc when it has been exposed that the corona lives for 72 hours on plastic surfaces. therefore does not the use of plastic spread the virus not stop it?

    the closing of parks and pathways and locking people inside. if you are in the park, the wide open space and breezes should neurtalize breath and reduce the threat of spreading?

    they locked down all the parks!!! incredible!

    and locked down inside homes is murderous, at a time of spiraling uneployment and total material uncertainity..a recipe for social dysfunction if there ever was one: family abuse and crime of all kinds and you cant even go to the park to walk off rile in the open air

    it looks to me like the ‘experts’ deliberately chose a policy that maxed social hurt for the people, not help. they must know that all they imposed on the people would harm them as bad as the virus…and was opposed to what was necessary to be done.

    and look at when the virus hit: when the american economy collapsed, the stock market went kaput and the unepmplyoment began figures began to attain a position in the stratosphere!

    of course if there is a connection there, the looters knew the economy would collapse from their looting as it did in 1918, the 19-thirties etc…. and every time there was economic catastrophe caused by financial looting

    previously we got cataclysmic wars which apparently are are out this time, with nuclear weapons that woud annihilate the planet. they may have decided no war this time..but the same level of killing/human death, the same wartime death rates and social chaoac achieved with Covid-19. all thats missing are the war time sounds and smell of exploding ammunition and mobilising for war..soldiers in the streets marching off…

    seems to me the same old song: financial looting of the world..leading to economic collapse, then massive death, war, starvation, rationing etc – a huge genocide really, and waste of material and mostly human life. that goes on for years, that breaks the world, massive catastrophy, waste down everything..then restart, rebuild and another cyle of looting commences

    I am so tired of all this..this same shit repating, repating, repeating…all of this for what. it has made of life an awsome, incredible load of crap, in which few if any are ever happy..even the looters. in the process the bankers never loose..the have hoarded all the wealth, have it under lock and key, sequestered so in the restart they are in charge again, on top. hundreds of millions are dead, everythng wasted and must be rebuilt..except their tresue which is always there..never needs to be restocked only increased by and in the new cycle of looting

    what on earth can be the frame of mind of people who loot humanity for centuries causing all manner of social dysfucntion..and that is routine for them..absolutely atrocious behavior. they pass it all on from generation to generation..their young are the same, or worse

    and I get up every morning..and I cant see why. I did not ask to be born into this life…no one called and said to me..Look! we are going to let you be born human into their world.. what do you think… you want to go there?

    wow! would that not have been something?

    at that point I could have would have told god where to go and stick it.

    man that would have been fun..an opportunity to tell god to kiss my arse! he is going about doing whatever the hell he likes and giving no one any say in the issues he entwines them in.

    what a guy eh!

  159. @ben sampson

    If that is true then they’re taking advantage of the Swedish men, not the women. In some societies if an outsider tried to pick up a local woman he’d be in for some serious trouble. Because “minding my own business” means minding our business, our people’s business. But yeah, some people are getting slack and Swedes are at the forefront of it. Try pulling something like that in Iran. Sure the odd stranger in countries with a strong culture may succeed but he has to prove himself to the locals, show he respects them and their culture, that he will abide by the local codes of social conduct, and then maybe, just maybe, he’ll be given a chance. But Sweden isn’t the world and what happens there has little bearing on how people conduct themselves, or should conduct themselves, in the world at large. If they get away with it there good on them. But then people aren’t much protective of whores anywhere, so maybe the Swedish guys don’t mind handing any such of their own countrywomen out to disrespecting foreigners.

    • Agree: RadicalCenter
  160. @ben sampson

    why in the hell would I be concerned who likes who and marry who and breed for whom. what a waste.!

    That’s an announcement of what color you aren’t… your character’s color anyway.

    Whites care about being bred out of majority in our ancestral lands because we’ve noticed explicitly what non-whites generally know only instinctively (and prove through their actions): it’s better to be in white-produced societies. Whites don’t need non-whites. Good luck with the converse!

    If only the “let’s be near whites” instinct was matched by a healthy and intelligent time horizon. Instead, disease.

    • Replies: @ben sampson
  161. Salcio says:

    It appears that it is too early to declare Swedish approach superior.
    With population of 10,1 million (32 times smaller than US) by 05/03/2020 they had
    2,679 dead cases attributed to corona virus.
    Compare it with US (67,448) and adjust Swedish number for population difference
    one gets 85,728 which is over 20% larger.

    • Disagree: Robert Dolan
    • Replies: @Robert Dolan
  162. @Hail

    What is your explanation for the continuation of anything that identifies a person after death when there is no functioning brain?

  163. and adjust Swedish number for population difference one gets 85,728 which is over 20% larger.

    Whence the implied expectation that Sweden’s adjusted numbers should not be anything but much higher?

    The Chicken Littles can never keep their premises straight. They promote dire expectations in case of removing mass house arrest edicts, at the same time they publish straight-faced comparisons to a country post-lockdown (effectively), as if the immaterial differences weigh toward ChickenLittleism.

    They don’t. You’re advertising for Sweden. Are you blind? Given ChickenLittle theology, adjusted Sweden C-19 deaths should be 10x that of US after the US unlock. You guys must be getting paid to publish such rot.

  164. Hail says: • Website
    @ThomasT

    Reinfections have been logged in S Korea,

    This is another Corona Fairy-land Hoax meant to promote the idea that this flu virus is Not The Flu But Something Terrible and Unknown, a zombie virus never before seen (or whatever).

    The most likely story all along with those “reinfection” cases was false positives.

    Now it turns out, after following up with the “reinfected” individuals, that every single reported reinfection case was a false positive.

    Sorry, pro-Panic side; another day, another loss.

    ____________

    Knut Wittkowski on reinfections by the Wuhan Coronavirus:

    Someone says:

    [The] WHO is saying…this virus [is] not giving immunity to people.

    Knut Wittkowski responds (April 30):

    That‘s not what the WHO is saying. They say that there is no guarantee that every person who has antibodies is immune. I agree with them. One in a million may not be immune.

    • Agree: acementhead
    • Thanks: Dieter Kief
  165. jasmin says:

    I wouldn’t try to convince those who died and the loved ones who suffer. What you are saying is that we must sacrifice some humans in the short term in order to build a herd immunity that might be lasting or fleeting in the long run, but the sacrifice is worth the additional loss of life because at least you’ll be able to get a tattoo or a haircut or go bowling.

  166. Hail says: • Website
    @WJ

    As to the pro-Panic, pro-Lockdown side’s motivations. Many of them don’t want to hear good news.

    How do you explain this?

    Some would explain it like this: “There are true-believers with any cult.”

    • Replies: @Alfred
  167. Hail says: • Website
    @utu

    Your cost-benefit analysis is just another mambo-jumbo

    “Let’s shut down every northern hemisphere country from November through March every year. Flu Viruses…are out there! Viruses. Did you hear that? People could die! No time to think about alternatives or other costs. Full wintertime lockdown policies now! Anyone who opposes this Saving Lives policy must be another white supremacist.” [Paid for by Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whittmer for President]

    • Replies: @utu
  168. @schnellandine

    I dont know how to deal with facts like ancestral, traditional etc. “white’s do no want to be bred out of their ancestral lands”. is all fine..but nothing is permanent. at some point what you say that whites dont want will be an accomplished fact in some form of reprsentation or reality on that day

    but how do we deal with that fact now..currently?

    I dont think any people want to be bred out of their ancestral lands at all, period. but the same applies…it isnt forever, an how to del with tht fcat now, or currently? should we be concerned about it at all and proceed to live like we will indeed be here forever?

    howver Fantastic I might be I see the world as ancestral to humanity..and humanity as one species from one original evolutionary source and base spread and mutated over the planet. I see systematically the world is almost the same with capitalism dominant all over

    the worls elites appear to have achieved some sort of community of interests which expresses itself in the Wuham virus for one thing..when one discovers that they were all involved in some way with the creation of Covid-19

    then there is the fact that the Chinese Miracle of development was very much made in america..at the expense of the american working classes, and to the profit of the american elites. the western elites appread to have gotten into the Chinese revolution/the Chinese communist party, and over time shifted its leadership back into capitalist mode. so what is the real antagonish between china and america?

    its ideological betwen factions of american power who are prolly racist and white nationalist etc struggling with their elitist counterparts who move in a globalist direction are are behind the chinese BRI for example. so the worlds elites are overcoming their antipathy towards each other and making common cause…which fact, if it is a fact puts all the working people of the world in the same boat with the sme elites to deal with..everywhere

    so the white worker who thinks white divides his chances, reducing his chances by making enemy of th e working classes of color over the world. right now, currently racism is dead save as a tool in the hands of the elites that still divides workers, weakening workers cause in the worker elitist-stand off..which is the real global issue

    assuming tht ordinary people, working people prvail in the ordinary elitist stand-off, the world changes dramitcally in to popularly run democracies in which human survival on planet earth becomes the point and purpose of existence, the work of life..what happens with the human and to the human population when everyone has something, lives so to speak..what becomes of ancestral for eg?

    so properly ancestral becomes the earth relative to humanity as a whole..an the human species explodes into diversity to end all diversity eh! hahahaha.

    that is bound to happen at some point as long as humanity survives. if humanity is alive and kicking 200 years from now it presupposes capitalism/Jewish chosen crap has been defeated and humanity finnly achieved a proper, relevant course in the unverse and is on its way in good shape to whatever destiny awaits us.

    but all of this proves the temporary nature of everything but we do not think in thse terms as yet. we do not think of the rl coordinates of our sruvival how best we can do that in th conditions that gave rise to us and challenges us all the way home..on every level of existence. we must respond positively or perish.

    and it has already turned out that all we cherish does not mean zilch in nature..like race and racism..wealth ultimately, even right now. our work as a species relative to our survival in nature seems to me to be cut out already..a humungus and fraught job to solve. we must come to know nature and that is already a bigger job than we can muster. but we must muster that job if we are to survive. and all this current shit going on is preliminary. and the faster we get over the prelims the better our chances.

    but there are some people called the Chosen ones who are determined that we do not get where we must in order to go on. 25-50 million of them think they are the only ones already chosen and that there is no future for any of the rest of the rest of use other than in line with some service to them.

    that is a great glob of active and powerful ignorance that humanity has permitted to grow up in it path it will have to solve. and that already we can see wont be easy. relative to that all the marbles are on the table..right now and urgent

  169. Alden says:
    @Hail

    Hey, one good thing about China flu hysteria, we haven’t heard about global warming for months.

    • Replies: @Hail
    , @TomSchmidt
  170. @Alfred

    Can you provide a link to that Paul Allen on Bill Gates video that works please.

    • Replies: @Alfred
    , @anon
  171. Alden says:
    @450.org

    I know little about Sweden. But I doubt that pornographic sadist series about the dragon tattoo girl have anything to do with reality. And wasn’t her monstrous father Russian?

  172. Most infected people are asymptomatic. They do not feel sick whatsoever, and the only reason they are aware they have had COVID-19 is the results of the test.

    So the majority, by far, have the ability to repel the virus with their own immune system. That’s the way we are designed, and that’s how we made it from cave dwellers thousands or years before any kind of medical knowledge, much less vaccines.

    COVID-19 is highly infectious but minimally dangerous. There has been millions infected, but a few thousand that actually died from it. And most of those that do die from it had serious underlying medical issues and a compromised immune system.

    This virus is less deadly than last year’s flu, where 80,000 Americans died. We didn’t shut down the country over that, and we should not have. Nor should we have this time either

    What are we going to do, overreact in this insane fashion every flu season? The government and Big Pharma have an agenda. It’s giving the government the opportunity to take greater control of the citizenry, and of course insure Big Pharma an endless revenue stream from a vaccine-of-the-month club mandate.

  173. SteveK9 says:

    Herd Immunity —> Population Immunity. Problem solved.

  174. utu says:
    @Hail

    Your hysterical hyperbolic ad absurdum argument won’t do. How would you use your cost-benefit analysis in your personal life? Let’s suppose your spouse requires a prolonged medical treatment and your insurance and money is running out. What the cost-benefit analysis is telling you what to do? Euthanasia or abandonment? Or should society do something to help you out? What society do you want to live in? The one that does a callous cost-benefit analysis you seem to be advocating for the last two months?

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    , @Emslander
  175. @Salcio

    You don’t understand.

    Sweden can do what they are doing LONG TERM. They are on the way to herd immunity.
    And their economy has not been destroyed.

    The lockdowns cannot be done long term without catastrophic effects, and it’s likely the virus will simply spread when the lockdown is lifted.

    The lockdowns prolonged the epidemic and there is no exit strategy.

    Once again, and it tires me to have to have to repeat this…..the lockdowns were NOT meant to REDUCE the total death rate over time. The lockdowns were supposed to lower infections so that hospitals would not be slammed. In other words, there was an acceptance of the reality that the virus is HERE and it’s going to make the rounds eventually. Whether is makes the rounds quickly (Sweden)
    or slowly (the US) the same number of people will still get the virus when the lockdown is over.

    Of course now they have moved the goal posts and the left wants a permanent lockdown until we “get a vaccine,” which makes it OBVIOUS their goal is goyim control and not virus mitigation.

  176. @obwandiyag

    I have always fancied myself as somewhat of a pacifist and sought peaceful solutions to conflict resolutions and all the world’s problems. But on the balance of it all, I think that the only answer is a bloody revolution and let it lead to wherever, even disappointment and betrayal. It is painful to watch this amorphous mass of humanity being led like sheep to the slaughter while looking up in adoration to arrogant and ignorant millionaire celebrities and soaking up whatever lies and promises the politicians and their propaganda MSM machine serve up to them daily, obediently following those without an iota of interest for anybody but their own miserable selves. The only hope is that one day the people will wake up from their hypnotic slumber and realise that they have been hoodwinked, and that their anger, rage and fury will erupt like a volcano to start hacking from the top of the social pyramid to wherever it stops. What else is there to wait for? Still hoping, still dreaming.

    In the meantime … we can keep arguing about which politician, system or regime is the lesser evil, which religion is better or worse, which football team we prefer, who should or shouldn’t post on UR, and so on. But ultimately it is … just let it rip with no concern for tomorrow because they have stolen all our tomorrows.

    • Agree: Parfois1
  177. Hail says: • Website
    @Alden

    we haven’t heard about global warming for months

    I made a sighting of it a few days ago:

    ______________

    The current “Way to Justify Anything,” in two to three easy steps:

    (1) call [thing] “flattening a curve;” (2) toss up a vague graph; (3) (if possible) use media and state apparatus to suppress dissent; (4) reap rewards.

    “Flattening the climate curve in the post-COVID world”
    World Economic Forum
    April 27, 2020

    • LOL: schnellandine
  178. Hail says: • Website
    @Hail

    As the population approaches, there will be no huge second spike.

    This should read:

    “As the population approaches herd immunity, there will be no huge second spike.”

  179. Alfred says:
    @Cargill

    Australia succeeded by going early and going hard. It was the right model

    Australia is heading into the winter season. The nutters in the various governments want to keep lockdowns almost forever. As soon as they let people travel, the virus will come back. It is inevitable until they attain herd immunity.

    Maybe Australia should revert to using sailing ships to transport people and goods internationally. I suspect it would cost $100,000 for a return trip from Sydney to London and take 6 months. 🙂

  180. Alfred says:
    @Been_there_done_that

    bad news for Sweden because their current ratio of deaths among the concluded cases is one of the highest in the world, at around 73%

    Quoting ridiculous number without an official source proves that you are a doomer. As several people have shown here, the number of new cases in Sweden has collapsed. They have already attained their herd immunity.

    You are probably living in a lockup. I hope you enjoy your self-imposed imprisonment. The Swedes are now free to enjoy one of the pleasantest month of the year in their country. 🙂

    People who repeat utter nonsense here are clearly trolls in the pay of Bill Gates.

    • Replies: @Been_there_done_that
  181. Alfred says:
    @Brás Cubas

    Well, this is one of those occasions in which I rejoice in being wrong

    Thank you for being prepared to change your mind when presented with the data. Unfortunately, this site is now infested by trolls who are determined to denigrate the achievement of Sweden at any cost. Bringing in the immigrant story and accusing Swedish women of preferring African partners and so on merely proves that these individuals are trolls. They are trying to stop the truth from getting out.

    The truth is that this virus is normally called the flu. The media has been orchestrated to turn an elephant out of a fly – a Russian idiom. 🙂

  182. An excellent article, which succinctly and factually shows that the Swedish strategy was and is the most common sense approach. These have been my thought for a while now after reading and watching copious amounts of Covid-19 related articles from all sides of the debate. Unfortunately, I attempted to share this article to my Facebook timeline and through messenger for my friends, but it was declined by Facebook overlords because “some people had complained it was abusive”! Censorship is alive and kicking in the world of Zuckerberg!

  183. Sadasivan says: • Website

    Indeed,Sweden has succeeded. Congratulations are due.But ,has the restriction in TRAVEL in other European nations,helped it a bit?

  184. Alfred says:
    @Agent76

    To me, this “NYC ICU doctor” looks Jewish. If you believe anything he says, you have been tricked. That is my opinion. I far prefer the opinions of those California doctors whose video has been banned by Youtube.

    I would be very interested to see data on the fatality rates for this virus from Jewish hospitals in NYC. I am 100% sure that there is a wide discrepancy between their outcomes with that of public hospitals.

    If that fake “doctor” were truthful, we would also have similar problems all over the USA.

    Coronavirus Fears Leave Hospitals Empty, Healthcare Workers Worried

    • Replies: @anon
  185. Alfred says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Can you provide a link to that Paul Allen on Bill Gates video that works please

    The link works in Europe and the USA. You can search for the title on Youtube.com

    Here is the article I got it from.

    60 Minutes Interview of Paul Allen – Partner of Bill Gates

  186. There is simply no way to determine if any one country got it right. At least not based on all the unknowns. . If the lockdowns prevents the spread an China in my view had the most intense lockdown protocol, then we cannot know the consequences of not locking a community own, because it simply was not an option that was chosen. Would Sue have gotten pregnant had frank not used protection on Sept 21, 1995 — who knows protection was utilized. We might make some rational conclusions based on her cycle, but beyond that – there simply is no telling. My scenario is based on her ovulation cycle and Frank being absolutely normal. We do know that not having relations prevents pregnancy.

    I the primary mechanism for spreading the virus was human to human contact, then clearly denying that avenue of infection would yield some benefit. Hard to know with airborne viruses.

    A comment on herd —- a;so a risky assessment. What heard immunity really means is that most o an given population is immune for any number of reasons. Anyone contending that herd immunity is a solution must also admit that most the herd could die in that process. The immunity would only apply to the remaining population that survived and that they in return would pass along that immunity to the next generations. It’s a calculated risk and part of that risk is the long term cost benefit. And those calculations may vary from society to society, even community to community.

    About the Swedish economy an I bet there are some other counties — in similar circumstance, with fairly closed financial systems in which they generally ensure there is more coming in than going out and most of the same population has access to some degree to what’s coming in — if may take some broader analytics than merely comparing what they did or did not do.

    It’s z curious suggestion that the world economy would be shut down and Sweden would be unaffected, unless,

    a. the amount of business they conduct was enough to provide for their community

    b. they had sufficient reserves to withstand these kinds of global economic slumps, with just a bruise

    c. a combination of a & b some variation

    In either case a country that manages its wealth to sustain for the overall population is better off than those with high debt ratio’s and dependent on others for any number of reasons. If there’s a lesson to be learned — it’s not about virus management.

    • Replies: @Hegar
  187. I would also note this simple truth

    The deaths from the virus has always been relatively slight from its earliest days. What is ever increasing is the ability for news of to travel loaded with fear inducing scenarios — prepped by a lot of films for nearly three decades what one day will be a severe an catastrophic pandemic, maybe this is the precursor and perhaps not, but from the beginning, substantially more people survived that died from the illness.

    Laughing . . . I take it however that most people are not all that happy with attending weddings conduct online and they would like to actually see their loved one’s and friends off to the next life in person.

  188. New Zealand had chosen for lockdown in four levels which as far as we can see has been quite successful. Last week we went from level 4 to 3, which in fact was not a very big change. The authorities are extremely cautious. NZ has a population of 5 million. The number of deaths right now is 20. To day for the first time there were no new cases and no one in IC. Most of the death were elderly and from nursing homes. However the economy is for a large part in tatters. NZ depends for 20 percent on tourism and with the borders closed, tourism is dead. Unemployment is staggering high. It will take a long time to return to normalcy. I am not sure what scenario woulld have been best. China had something in between. The epicentrum situated in Wuhan was locked down However the remainder of China was functioning as normal. Although China had a serious setback, the most part of the countries economy was not effected and therefore able to continue as usual, ensuring a more speedy total recovery.

  189. Alfred says:
    @obwandiyag

    You fucking scumbag

    It seems I was correct in my diagnosis. 🙂

    A miserable youth ends up being a grumpy old man who can only swear online. He knows that I would knock his head off if he did to my face.

    Did you actually follow these young people back to the homes of their grandparents?

    You know nothing about them. You just want everyone else to live like an old rat because you do.

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
  190. Hegar says:
    @EliteCommInc.

    No one has said Sweden’s economy would be unaffected. Definitely not people in Sweden, as numbers show the economy going down. But less so than it could have been.

  191. PeterMX says:

    Sweden did not succeed while others failed. This is a live updated chart of Corona Virus cases and Sweden ranks tenth highest in the world for deaths per 1 million population. Most of the world does far better than Sweden.

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

    • Disagree: Robert Dolan
  192. “No one has said Sweden’s economy would be unaffected. Definitely not people in Sweden, as numbers show the economy going down. But less so than it could have been.”

    Same response matter of degree.

    • Replies: @EliteCommInc.
  193. @EliteCommInc.

    Looking across the expanse on time it would be interesting to see how the Swedish economy has operated over time during international and regional downturns. Because the key maybe that the sustainability has more to do with the Structuration and operation of the same rather than this particular response to his particular event.

    News out Sweden this weekend, a spike in deaths from the virus n more expected, reference Business Insider

    • Replies: @Alfred
  194. Alfred says:
    @Hail

    Many of them don’t want to hear good news.

    You are dealing with paid trolls here. They probably have some sort of commission. They have lost the argument. That is why they have turned to using the F word against me.

    With these people, it is impossible to rationalize. Once they know that they are losing, they start insulting Sweden by accusing Swedish women of preferring Africans or that their men have no pride for letting their girls get their fun elsewhere or that the Swedes are congenitally stupid and so on.

    The reality is the the average IQ in Sweden is way higher than in the USA. Take away the people of German and Scandinavian descent from the the USA and the national IQ would plummet. The greater number of Jews in the USA would make little difference.

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  195. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Can you provide a link to that Paul Allen on Bill Gates video that works please.

    Works for me but try below instead.

  196. @PeterMX

    and Sweden ranks tenth highest in the world for deaths per 1 million

    That’s your rebuttal? According to the Chicken Little religion, Sweden should be 20x fatalities of the worst lockdown country. And you’re publishing laudatory numbers as evidence of shame. Screwy.

    BTW, propagandist, Sweden is post-lockdown. Post-lockdown—you know, that event which is supposed to launch another wave of blip death.

    If Sweden were 5x the worst lockdown country right now, it would not prove they weren’t correct. That’s what fools will never understand. The real death wave in most of the world is still prettily beyond the horizon, absent from the brains of the absent-brained.

    • Agree: acementhead
  197. @PeterMX

    Just stop it you moron.

    Sweden did the RIGHT thing and it’s OBVIOUS if you actually go into the details.

    Sweden is not facing the end of a lockdown with a spike in infections. Sweden’s path is long term sustainable, while ours is not.

    Once the virus has arrived it is GOING TO SPREAD, PERIOD.

    Quick spread or short spread, it is going to spread. Lockdown SLOWS the virus down a bit, but when the lockdown is lifted you’re back to the start. In other words, the lockdown prolonged the epidemic.
    Sweden is now approaching herd immunity while we worry about what is going to happen if people go back to work.

    Not sure why this is so hard to understand because it seems obvious if you have any brain cells at all.

    Death is built into the lockdown models. It was ACCEPTED that lifting the lockdown would simply continue the spread. The goal of the lockdown was NOT to lower the overall death rates but to SLOW the spread so that hospitals would not be overwhelmed. In other words, the lockdowns simply prolonged the epidemic, except in Sweden’s case where they are building herd immunity.

    Quick spread in Sweden….slower spread with lockdown…..continued spread after lockdown…..the death rates will be about the same….but Sweden comes out on top long term.

    The Swedish model is sustainable long term, while our lockdown is NOT sustainable.

    • Agree: geokat62, acementhead
  198. @Alfred

    You clearly don’t understand how herd immunity works. As soon as those who are most sociable or those who deal most with the public have antibodies, the virus stops dead in its tracks.

    What is so difficult for you to understand?

    That assumes that super-spreaders are always the same people. As noted for a lot of superspread occasions, it wasn’t individual people but the occasion. Funeral in Georgia. Bar mitzvah in New Rochelle. It wasn’t the PERSON that made it a super-spreader, it was the event. Those two event types also include a lot of older people mixing with younger.

    You basically cannot have ANY of those events in places like Norway until the virus is gone everywhere. In Sweden, yes.

  199. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Alfred

    I would be very interested to see data on the fatality rates for this virus from Jewish hospitals in NYC. I am 100%

    It is interesting how the corona virus death rate is much higher in NY and much higher in NYC than the rest of NY state.

    One probable cause in Democrat Governor Andrew Cuomo forcing nursing homes to admit those testing positive for Covid-19. Note that nursing homes contain the most susceptible group to Covid-19.

    Also, Medicare compensation is over double for patients with Covid-19. This means that if a patient is diagnosed with pneumonia, a hospital can over double its medicare compensation if they claim this patient has Covid-19. Due to this high compensation disparity, I would think that falsely claiming a patient has Covid-19 would be a difficult temptation to resist – especially in the notoriously corrupt state and especially the city of NY.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/04/24/fact-check-medicare-hospitals-paid-more-covid-19-patients-coronavirus/3000638001/

    • Agree: Alfred
  200. Alfred says:
    @EliteCommInc.

    News out Sweden this weekend, a spike in deaths from the virus n more expected, reference Business Insider

    Why don’t you use the official government statistics of Sweden. They are above.

    Business Insider, like the NYT, FT, WaPO, WSJ etc. is part of the effort to denigrate Sweden. We all know that the mainstream media has lied about Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, 9/11, Russia, Cuba, Iran, China and many other places and events.

    Why the sudden apparent trust in these sources? Are you a troll? If not, why have you lost your good sense?

    Are you a hysterical personality? 🙂

  201. @Alden

    It was abnormally cold in April in NYC. Lack of heat from lessened economic activity? My guess is we put out a LOT less carbon in March and April due to the lockdown. The anti-CO2 people got their wishes, and it caused widespread misery, albeit it not having been done explicitly for CO2 reasons.

    The lockdown thus gives people opposed to climate hysteria a tool to argue with and hit most people in the gut: do you want to continue the economy of the lockdown? Of course, some people have been financially better off, those that Noonan called the “protected” versus the “unprotected.” Many a politician has enjoyed his role as Ozymandias: look on his works, and despair!

  202. @utu

    Is your argument that a society cannot use cost-benefit analysis at all? It’s standard policy in the USA: the value of one human life is somewhere south of $10,000,000. If you object to this, I assume you have written your Congressman to object… or planned to move.

  203. “The Swedish model is sustainable long term, while our lockdown is NOT sustainable.”

    Interesting small population, one would have thought that the supposed full exposure would have resulted in fatalities much sooner than now. Furthermore, your reference to sustainability does not address sustainability of what. Te purpose of a lockdown is prevent sustaining the virus, while maintaining the population. Furthermore there’s no evidence that a massive infection has occurred in Sweden tat impacts the entire population or even most of the population to determine immunity. The best means of immunity is not quick and full but gradual and long term . . . hence why inoculations work, they introduce a tiny virulent that over time allows the body to develop an immunity.

  204. Dumbo says:
    @anonymous

    Wrong. He’s Bosnian or Croatian.

  205. @Alfred

    No, you wouldn’t. You’re a sissy. Living in his mother’s basement. Googling pictures. Typical trolling. Incapable of rational thought.

  206. Dumbo says:
    @Beau Nydle

    Yes, this would also explain this “male club for feminists”. Only in Sweden, as they say:

    https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20200429-swedens-male-only-supper-clubsfor-feminists

  207. @Alfred

    You keep going on about this herd immunity as if it’s an established fact when it comes to coronaviruses. Where is the herd immunity for the common cold (a type of coronavirus) and the flu, and humanity has been exposed to them since forever? You’d have thought we would have achieved it by now after millennia of exposure. The only herd immunity for the flu is that of the vaccinated herd and not the non-vaccinated one, and you need a new shot each year to maintain it. Even then it doesn’t guarantee that you won’t catch the flu. They haven’t yet developed a vaccine for the common cold coronavirus so what chance is there that there will ever be a vaccine for this Covid-19 coronavirus? We’ll just have to accept the fact that seasonal deaths due to the flu (Covid-19 included) will be higher each season. You’re just parroting nonsense some experts are spewing out when they should know better.

  208. Dumbo says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Yes, I have never been to Sweden but in Europe in general I haven’t seen many white women with Africans or Arabs (maybe some fat German women with North Africans), at least compared to the U.S. and Canada.

    Except in France.

    The French love race-mixing and métissage (coincidentally or not, it was in Quebec where I saw the most inter-racial couples).

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  209. @Dumbo

    The French love race-mixing and métissage (coincidentally or not, it was in Quebec where I saw the most inter-racial couples).

    Unfortunately, you’re right.

  210. geokat62 says:
    @utu

    My personal belief is that Sweden is indeed cooking the data.

    Excerpts from, Swedish epidemiologist Anders Tegnell the target of praise, criticism over handling of COVID-19 pandemic:

    Those who know Dr. Tegnell dismiss the critics and say he has shown nothing but integrity and commitment during the COVID-19 crisis. “He has done admirably well,” said Johan Giesecke the former chief scientist at the European Centre for Disease Control who hired Dr. Tegnell as the state epidemiologist. “Sweden is doing it right. Everyone else is wrong.”

    Paul Franks, an epidemiologist at Lund University in Malmo… gives Dr. Tegnell high marks for being straight with Swedes. “He’s been quite honest that they’ve clearly chosen a path and they are sticking to it.”

    Polls show that the vast majority of Swedes back Dr. Tegnell and believe in what he’s doing.

    https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-swedish-epidemiologist-anders-tegnell-the-target-of-praise-criticism/

  211. vot tak says:

    “Why Sweden Succeeded While Others Failed”

    The title is incomplete, therefore misleading. Needs fixing.

    Why Sweden Succeeded in killing more of their people, While Others Failed to achieve sweden’s dubious success.

    That’s better.

    And sweden is still killing more:

    1 May 67, 2 May 16, 3 May 10, 4 May 90.

    While finland suffered 7, 2, 10, 10 respectively and norway 0, 1, 0, 3.

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

    • Replies: @anon
  212. @Alfred

    People who repeat utter nonsense here…

    I clearly stated that the data were based on the then most current figures from Worldometer, which gets its information from official sources. My cited ratio of 73% (deaths per concluded cases), which is a simple calculation one has to perform from the given data, has gone down to 40.6% in the meantime because they must have transformed a few thousand formerly pending cases as now recovered.

    Yet adding so many recovered cases in only one or two days suggests that the official reporting by the government is inconsistent or unreliable. This leaves the conclusion that the “utter nonsense” is coming from the Swedish government itself. Swedish officials may have an interest in manipulating the figures.

    So-called “herd immunity” can only be proven by reliable anti-body tests of a statistically significant cross-section of the population, yielding high percentages. This has likely not been proven in any country.

    I am also not in lockdown. All the allegations you made were unwarranted – or “utter nonsense“.

  213. Bat Soup says:

    As various Sweden fans keep repeating their bogus talking points, it’s time to repeat what they keep ignoring:

    * Stockholm county ahead of the rest of the country and also the most densely populated, by far. About 20% of all Swedes live in this county on less than 1% of the land area of all of Sweden, not counting sparsely populated rural parts of Stockholm county, which exist as well. What happens in Stockholm county gets hidden if averages are taken over the whole of Sweden. But there is a Swedish Website, c19.se, that collates official Swedish figures per county. They state 1463 dead in Stockholm county at the time of this writing as compared to about 2500 for the country as a whole. That’s still fewer deaths per capita in Stockholm than in New York City. But NYC is far more packed with people than Stockholm and the Stockholm figures are probably more faked. Other regions in Sweden are still catching up, the second in line, predictably, being Västra Götaland. That’s the county where Sweden’ second-biggest city, Gothenburg, is located. So let’s say Sweden will manage to kill about 2000 Stockholm inhabitants with its approach, just about 25% in addition to the ones that are already acknowledged to have been killed there. The Stockholm metropolitan area has about 2 million inhabitants, so about 1 in 1000 would have been killed in the end. Translating this fantastic success to the US, that would mean close to 400000 US deaths due to Covid-19.

    * The real success stories to be compared to Sweden are Norway and most notably Finland. These countries all have very similar population densities overall, similar population distributions when comparing rural and urban areas, similar styles of urban planning, similar life styles and mentalities, similar political and socio-economic circumstances. The only real difference is Sweden’s far higher population of third-world migrants but even that cannot account for Sweden’s far higher death toll, both when averaged out over the whole country and even more so when just looking at Stockholm. Norway’s and Finland’s death counts are miniscule when compared to Sweden’s. These countries adopted far more stringent measures but they did not go into full lockdown either. The point that Sweden fans are consistently missing is that lockdown or anything approaching it was never meant to be a policy for anything but the short term. Swedish rhetoric about not wanting to impose any restrictions that cannot be maintained in the long run is totally bogus. It’s part of the whitewashing strategy applied to under-preparedness, ignorance, opportunism, and cynical disregard for the elderly – just overall failure.

    * Sweden got lucky also since most of the initial spread was brought by relatively young and healthy skiing tourists. Skiing trips to the alps are popular among Stockholm yuppies. These circumstances concentrated the initial spread, mitigated the death count, and led to the skew that still exists.

    * Sweden and in particular Stockholm have a high proportion of people who live alone. That’s a sociology that actually extends to older people as well.

    * Sweden’s economy is very knowledge-based, so there are lots of people who can work from home. The biggest group of professionals in the wider Stockholm region (Stockholm county plus the surrounding counties around lake Mälaren) consists of software developers! In general everything in Sweden is very digitized, allowing even more people to work from home. When it comes to industrial production, Sweden is also a leader in industrial automation, which means fewer people who have to work close together.

    The bottom line is that Sweden just cannot be compared to any other countries but its immediate neighbors. There are too many special circumstances both with regard to the general situation and the specific way in which the spread has occurred. Sweden is also getting a free pass due to the Sweden bonus that surprisingly still seems to exist in many people’s minds even on the right. Compared to Finland and Norway, the Swedish performance with regard to Covid-19 is absolutely abysmal. Why are right-wingers suddenly so complacent about a social democratic country screwing up so mightily?

    • Agree: Levtraro
    • Thanks: Parfois1
  214. Spect3r says:

    A country with 9 million people and over 2600 deaths can hardly be called a success.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  215. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @vot tak

    And sweden is still killing more:

    1 May 67, 2 May 16, 3 May 10, 4 May 90.

    While finland suffered 7, 2, 10, 10 respectively and norway 0, 1, 0, 3.

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

    Why are you using the bogus numbers from discredited site worldometers (see post 97 for details) instead of the official daily death numbers numbers from the Swedish Ministry Of Public Health here here?

    Why are you omitting Denmark’s numbers?

    Note that Sweden’s official numbers are trending down whereas your numbers for Norway and Finland, which I haven’t verified are trending up. Note that Norway, Finland and Denmark have less than half the population of Sweden.

    Official Swedish daily death numbers are:

    27/04/2020 62
    28/04/2020 45
    29/04/2020 45
    30/04/2020 33
    01/05/2020 22
    02/05/2020 19
    03/05/2020 20
    04/05/2020 3

    • Replies: @Bat Soup
  216. Bat Soup says:
    @anon

    Swedish death figures for 4 May and 5 May are 89 and 90+, respectively.

    The Swedish themselves have never really disputed the much lower death figures in Finland and Norway per capita.

    Sweden has about 10.5 million inhabitants; Denmark, Norway, and Finland taken together have about 15 million inhabitants.

    Swedish death count per million according to Worldometer: 283
    Denmark: 87 per million
    Norway: 39 per million
    Finland: 44 per million

    Stockholm death count per million according to c19.se: ~750

    @anon and others, explain in which way Sweden has succeeded here?

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Parfois1
  217. anon[230] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bat Soup

    Swedish death figures for 4 May and 5 May are 89 and 90+, respectively.

    Why do you continue to quote these bogus numbers from discredited worldometer instead of the official Swedish Ministry of Health numbers which show declining death rates?

  218. Alfred says:
    @Spect3r

    A country with 9 million people and over 2600 deaths can hardly be called a success

    Look at some news from that bastion of Jewish power – New York. A region with a comparable population to Sweden.

    Of course, you can be absolutely certain that none of these nursing homes are for Jews.

    New York Confirms Another 1,700 Unreported Nursing Home Deaths Caused By COVID-19

  219. @Hegar

    This makes about as much sense as saying that “we can’t afford the flu spreading in every western City forever.” We already have that. Calm down.

    Where … is … your … actual … evidence … that this virus has a terrible fatality rate compared to most flu strains? Where is reliable honest data about deaths caused by the virus rather than merely deaths of people who tested positive for this virus but already were elderly and weak, immunocompromised, and/or breathing-impaired to begin with?

    How about the frightening police-state power that governments have granted on the pretext of this “pandemic”? Wouldn’t the ability to get away with such a power grab without much opposition from an unduly frightened public, be a strong incentive for governments to exaggerate and direct doctors to lie?

    How about the massive wealth transferred to big banks and corporations directly by the US bailout bill? Wouldn’t the ability to get away with that transfer be a strong incentive for our bought-and-paid-for rulers to exaggerate or lie?

    How about the massive transfer of business — revenue and market share — from tens of thousands of small family businesses to the huge corporations still operating (in the USA especially Amazon, eBay, Walmart, Target)? Wouldn’t that also provide a strong incentive for our paid-off rulers (themselves often quite wealthy) to exaggerate or lie?

    Let’s keep looking at medical data when reliable data is even available, and watch events unfold further. But let’s do it without the hysteria and gullible, uncritical acceptance of what we are told by people who are not our friends and usually have very different interests and values than we do (government, corporate, financial, and medical establishments).

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  220. @obwandiyag

    Do we say all this about other flu strains in other years? No, because it would be ridiculous and overblown. As it seems to be so far with regard to this virus.

    The Young people whom you observe may indeed be heartless, selfish jerks who think they’re invincible and also don’t care about other people. Hey, we live in L.A., the capital of that attitude. I don’t have much faith in younger people here, or in my country’s Cities especially, in the event of a truly unusually deadly pandemic.

    This doesn’t yet seem to be any such thing. So even if those were nice, considerate, caring, upstanding, responsible Young people, it could make sense for them to be doing what they’re doing: living life because there’s no proof that that’s unwise for their sake or ours.

  221. Cassandra says:
    @Der Mann ohne Eigenschaften

    Add Greece to the list of successes. Locked down early, tested, traced, and very few cases or deaths.

    • Replies: @Parfois1
    , @Wielgus
    , @Alfred
  222. Parfois1 says:
    @Bat Soup

    The other day I raised the same question about the “Swedish success story” bandied about by some pundits for a reason that still escapes me but I may guess it to be the apparent bolstering of the “born frees” retards’ anarchist vision of “freedom” and defiance to legitimate authority for the commonwealth. If anything, the Swedish example shows that the people, if properly led, respond responsibly to a situation that requires voluntary social co-operation, solidarity and herd behaviour without coercion, exactly the opposite of what they claim.

    They also claim that the “cost-benefit” analysis indicates that the “herd immunity” concept/theory is a worthwhile choice for some pain now but greater future gain. By dint of some prophylactic exposure, the Swedes will be blessed with a perfect shield against the CV-19 scourge for ever! Nevermind the little beast’s prolific capacity for mutations and adaptations no new host environments and potential novel imports from abroad, unless they permanently close off any interaction with the outsiders. I think it’s a red herring because we don’t know yet the full properties of the virus, whether it will conform with statisticians’ models or Big Pharma’s wishes list.

    I have no axe to grind on how each country deals with this issue – which should be discussed as a matter of social concern, not a political point-scoring contest – but it stares you in the face that they have nothing to crow about. As I looked up the worldometer table, I noticed that the nearest European countries to Sweden were Ireland and Portugal and also noticed that Sweden’s and Portugal’s populations are almost identical (about 10.2 million each) and compared their death “scores” per million (as of today): Sweden 283, Portugal 105 (latest one day deaths: Sw 85, Pt 11). The only corrections I would think of are the latter’s greater population density (111/km2 vs 22/km2, think of Belgium and Netherlands horrendous figures!) and exposure by tourist visitors (13 million vs 7.5 million), hence expected higher morbidity in Portugal, but the figures are the opposite of the expected prediction!

    One admission though: I don’t know the reality on the ground, that is, whether the “lockdown” in one and the “freepass” in the other are the full quid but reports from Sweden indicate there at least a partial lockdown and, from my understanding of the Portuguese people’s character, they are fairly anarchic (the way they drive and park their cars!) and like to snub their noses at authority.

  223. Parfois1 says:
    @Cassandra

    Add Greece to the list of successes. Locked down early, tested, traced, and very few cases or deaths.

    Indeed. It has been noticed. My comment above made a comparison between Sweden and Portugal because they are next to each other on the list of number of cases. Greece has a similar population (10.5 million) and offers another contrast to Sweden’s “success”.

    By the way, I did comment earlier about the European West/East divide, that imaginary line from Greece to the Baltic Sea as if the Western side was hit with the virulent type (L) and the Eastern with the softer (S) variety and my tongue-in-cheek jibe at the Slavs’ superior resistance to CV-19, although the Russians are coming up pretty fast to disabuse me.

    It is mere idle speculation but that dividing line is also the frontier of the dominant European haplogroups R1b (West, Bell Beaker Culture) and R1a (East, Corded Ware Culture) suggesting that, indeed as suspected in the back of curious minds, the bug may have genetic attraction to some populations and reveal its man-made source and design.

    PS – Not suggesting, of course, that Greece is part of the Slavonic world. It’s a bit of a genetic mixed bag, probably of mythical origin!

  224. Wielgus says:
    @Cassandra

    I would disagree with the testing and tracing – the latest figure I have for testing in Greece is about 70,000 in a a country with a population of about ten million. The Greek health system is not very good and probably not up to mass testing and tracing, so they just locked everything down, with some mitigation in the last 10 days before they started to lift it on May 4. The lockdown was implemented early.

  225. Alfred says:
    @Cassandra

    Greece and Sweden have somewhat different climates in March/April. I would suspect that has a big effect on this version of influenza.

    Egypt has very few cases and deaths. A country of 100 million that has a very poor health system. Athens is only 5 degrees north of Cairo. Stockholm is 20 degrees north of Athens. Surely that has some significance?

    Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine – Global Covid-19 Case Fatality Rates

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Parfois1
  226. Corvinus says:
    @RadicalCenter

    It certainly makes it easier for you to say that the “establishment” on many fronts cannot be trusted, and thus Covid-19 from your perspective is essentially a hoax. The actual evidence is there. The reliable honest data is there. You just refuse to believe it is accurate.

    • Disagree: Alfred
  227. Wielgus says:
    @Alfred

    Since getting out of lockdown in Athens, I have managed to become a little bit sunburned, not so easy in northern Europe, lockdown or not. There has been speculation that sunlight complicates things for the Covid-19 virus though it does not necessarily kill it off, and indeed warm sunny weather tends to see most types of flu decline. Why some places are more affected than others is still something of a mystery – I am wondering whether it does not show up so much in some places like Egypt simply because other illnesses are more dangerous. If you lack access to clean drinking water and mosquitoes are important disease vectors, Covid-19 is going to get lost in all the bilharzia, malaria etc.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  228. Alfred says:
    @Wielgus

    There has been speculation that sunlight complicates things for the Covid-19 virus though it does not necessarily kill it off

    My apologies, but killing the virus is not the important thing. Sunlight on your skin is like a dose of vitamin D. It improves your immune system.

    How to get vitamin D from sunlight (NHS)

    Here, in Kiev, I go for long walks in the park whenever it is sunny. I wear a short-sleeved shirt and short trousers whenever possible. With no mask of course.

    The ancestors of the Europeans came from Africa. They were dark-skinned as that is an advantage in that climate. Over many generations, those with a lighter skin survived better in Europe – because their skin allowed more UV to penetrate and create vitamin D.

    Black people living in a place like Sweden need to get more sunlight than the locals if they want to prime their immune systems. That is why this NHS page shows a girl who is mulatto.

    The instructions to people to wear masks and to hide indoors are directly contrary to their good health. Distancing is pure psychological terror as small doses of this flu activate your immune system and allow it to be able to handle bigger doses later on. It is a well-contrived way to prolong this influenza and to sicken as many people as possible. 🙁

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Dumbo
  229. Parfois1 says:
    @Alfred

    Thank you for the Case Fatality Rate table. It presents another perspective on how Cv-19 affects different countries.

    I would assume a North/South divide on the grounds of the Cv-19 preference for colder weather like the usual flu but neglected to factor in the vitamin D effects.

    But the table rips my pet theory of the East/West divide to shreds because Hungary intruded into the risky spots! As a face saving exercise, I’ll say that the Table is not truly representative because it is based on very suspect variable (cases) which depends on testing. Ranking the fatality rate based on population (a more reliable metric) would send Hungary down to where it belongs and my pride restored!

    What the heck are you doing in Kiev? Not prying of course.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  230. Wielgus says:
    @Alfred

    Whether it kills the virus (reportedly difficult to do) or boosts the immune system so illnesses are easier to resist, sunlight seems to be a good thing. During lockdown I would venture out to shop for brief periods but also to get some fresh air and sunlight, even though you had to notify the police or run the gauntlet of them if you did not. I suspect the lockdowns undermined any virus control impact they did have by confining people indoors and denying access to sunlight, in addition to damaging psychological health by separating people from employment, friends or relatives. This is not something I can prove but my suspicion that lockdowns destroyed the village in order to save it is strong.

  231. The reason Sweden didn’t adopt a lockdown is that, from their perspective, they were left with no choice in the matter.

    First, the country is near an economic breaking point due to its large dependant population.

    Second, the same “dependent population” wouldn’t have obeyed by the lockdown anyway, causing severe disturbances that the Swede government doesn’t have the mettle to appropriately tackle. When is the last time you saw riot police in Sweden’s no-go zones?

    So I wouldn’t be too quick to praise the Swedish gov’t in any way. They serendipitously were left with no other alternative but the right one.

  232. Emslander says:
    @obwandiyag

    Thank God for every person, young or old, who doesn’t give a shit if they get the virus. They are insuring that the entire flu-like hoax will pass more quickly by introducing natural immunity and they may coalesce into a voting majority that, once and for all, tells all “experts” to fuck off!

    • Agree: Achmed E. Newman
  233. Emslander says:
    @utu

    Cost/benefit analyses are only callous if you make them that way. They are actually the most charitable approach to sociable behavior. Do you spend every last cent and go into massive debt to save your or your loved one’s life for a time and condemn the rest of the family for generations to penury and worse? Or do you balance the long term good of the living against the selfish needs of the one.

    If you’re a 65 year old man with a kidney problem, do you force your wife of 50 to give up one of hers to keep you alive on daily massive drug intake and put her life in constant danger, even beyond any life you may ultimately enjoy? That’s cost/benefit analysis.

  234. Dumbo says:
    @Alfred

    That is why this NHS page shows a girl who is mulatto.

    No, that’s not the reason. That’s just the standard propaganda of immigration and miscegenation.

  235. sophia says:
    @Anon

    Your attitude is ugly and repulsive, besides being wrong.

  236. @Swedish Family

    The main goal of political propaganda is demoralization of one’s opponents. “Give up, we’ve won!” is the gist of the message, in the hopes it will become a self fulfilling prophecy. This site is full of them, as are most places where right wing commenting goes on. Some are paid hasbara trolls, others are lefties who do it for the cause or for kicks. A few may be actual demoralized people who commiserate in the hopes of getting cheered up.

    In my personal experience with Somalians, they’ve basically been considered as aliens by everyone else, and they’ve been baffled by our general attitudes. One admitted that he still thinks the earth is flat, even if he knows he’s supposed to think it’s round; he also relayed a story about some nomad relatives that visited who literally thought they had gone to heaven after experiencing self-opening doors and air conditioning. I’ve known precisely one who had a white girlfriend, despite scores of them hitting on the fat girls in hopes of getting one. One Somali woman I thought had married a Swedish man, until I realized that she meant a Somalian in Sweden. This was before I was aware of the international “refugee” trafficking going on, which opened my eyes.

    But hey, that’s just one man’s words on the internet. Take it or leave it, you have no way to know if I’m telling the truth other than if the words make sense.

    -Not a Dog

  237. Alfred says:
    @Parfois1

    What the heck are you doing in Kiev?

    It is a nice civilized place. Essentially crime-free. No Africans. Almost no Asians. I have not seen an Indian for months. People are polite. Airbnb rates have dropped a lot. A heck of a lot cheaper than London. I hardly drink but a 0.5L bottle of excellent local beer is around one dollar. They are gradually opening cafés. The photo was taken two days ago. For $1.50, you get a large local “cherry” at this place. But it is far too sweet for me.

    I am looking for a new wife. Plenty of candidates but I am rather choosy for a guy of 69. Also, I am thinking of helping some other women move to Australia by finding husbands for them. These are very smart and presentable ladies. I thought the Australian girls need a wake-up call. 🙂

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