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“The strange sight of liberal America participating in a neo-McCarthyite assault on Trump appointees, not on the grounds of their inherent racism and stupidity, but because they have contacts with Russia, is among the more surreal spectacles of modern political history.”

— John Steppling, Are You Now, or Have You Ever Been, a Secret Agent of Vladimir Putin?, CounterPunch

If Donald Trump is found guilty of illegal behavior in his connections with Russia, then he should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But shouldn’t the same rule apply to Obama? Shouldn’t Obama be held responsible if he authorized an illegal investigation of the Trump campaign in order to destroy a political enemy?

A widely-circulated article in the New York Times casts suspicion on the Trump campaign’s alleged ties to Russia. The article titled “Obama Administration Rushed to Preserve Intelligence of Russian Election Hacking” strongly insinuates that Russian “tampering” might have helped the campaign “tip the election in Mr. Trump’s favor.”

These are serious charges and Congress is currently taking steps to investigate whether there’s any substance to the allegations or not.

But a careful reading of the Times article also reveals disturbing details about the overzealous manner in which the White House attempted to build its case against Trump. Here’s an excerpt from the piece:

“In the Obama administration’s last days, some White House officials scrambled to spread information about Russian efforts to undermine the presidential election — and about possible contacts between associates of President-elect Donald J. Trump and Russians — across the government.” (“Obama Administration Rushed to Preserve Intelligence of Russian Election Hacking”, New York Times)

The opening sentence sounds innocent enough until we get more background later in the article. Halfway through the piece, we see that things are much more murky than they seem. Check it out:

“At intelligence agencies, there was a push to process as much raw intelligence as possible into analyses, and to keep the reports at a relatively low classification level to ensure as wide a readership as possible across the government — and, in some cases, among European allies. This allowed the upload of as much intelligence as possible to Intellipedia, a secret wiki used by American analysts to share information….There was also an effort to pass reports and other sensitive materials to Congress.” (New York Times)

Let’s paraphrase and readers can decide whether they think my analysis is fair or not:

In the final days of the Obama administration, White House officials made a concerted effort to spread unsubstantiated information about Russia’s alleged attempts to influence the 2016 election. The administration also tried to uncover contacts between associates of Trump and Russia that could be used in future investigations or impeachment proceedings. Presumably, the contacts would be used to create the impression that Trump or his lieutenants were guilty of criminal wrongdoing even though, so far, there is no evidence of any impropriety. Since there was no proof that Trump or his colleagues were involved in anything nefarious, most people would be inclined to call the Obama investigation a “fishing expedition” which is an unfocused probe aimed at uncovering incriminating evidence.

Aside from the fact that the Intel agencies were spying on the members of a presidential campaign without probable cause and without any evidence of criminal wrongdoing; the fact that they decided to release “raw intelligence” that was re-classified so that it could be disseminated as widely as possible, suggests that someone may have acted improperly if not illegally. At the very least, we must assume that higher-ups in the administration (The DOJ?) authorized the Intel agencies to “dig up dirt” on a political enemy in order to roll back the results of the 2016 presidential election.

Is that a fair reading of the two paragraphs in the Times?

More from the NYT: “There was also an effort to pass reports and other sensitive materials to Congress” (and to) ” European allies.”

Who made that decision? Someone (Obama, the DOJ, the CIA?) sought to disseminate as much damaging information as possible to as many people as possible to undermine the new administration and create a legal foundation for impeachment proceedings. The fact that the information they were disseminating was “raw intelligence”– which was not necessarily reliable– suggests that the primary objective was not to reveal the truth, but to use whatever tools that were available to sabotage the Trump presidency.

More from the NYT:

“Mr. Trump has denied that his campaign had any contact with Russian officials, and at one point he openly suggested that American spy agencies had cooked up intelligence suggesting that the Russian government had tried to meddle in the presidential election. Mr. Trump has accused the Obama administration of hyping the Russia story line as a way to discredit his new administration.”(New York Times)

Trump has denied the allegations because, so far, there’s been no evidence to verify the claims. None of the Intel agents who leaked to the media have identified themselves. None of the Intel agencies have come forward and verified the claims of their agents. None of the alleged connections with Russia suggest that a felony or even a misdemeanor was committed. And none of the leaks provide any proof that Russia was behind the alleged “hacks” at the DNC. So far, there is no proof of anything; no eyewitnesses, no corroborating evidence, and no indication that Trump or anyone in his campaign broke the law.

The whole fiasco appears to be a very desperate and sloppily constructed smear campaign based on the flimsy belief that Trump and his team collaborated with Moscow to steal the election. The Times even admits as much in this one revealing sentence in the article:

“It also reflected the suspicion among many in the Obama White House that the Trump campaign might have colluded with Russia on election email hacks — a suspicion that American officials say has not been confirmed.” (New York Times)

The Obama administration (or someone at the DOJ?) launched a full-blown investigation including the wiretapping of phones– on the mere “suspicion” of foul play? (Note: The New York Times admitted in a February 14, 2017 headline article that intelligence officials had “intercepted calls” and “communications” from members of the Trump campaign. Then, again, in a January 19, 2017 article the Times admitted that “wiretapped communications had been provided to the White House” although investigators had “found no conclusive evidence of wrongdoing, the officials said.”)

Can the president spy on a political opponent because he has a ‘hunch’ that his opponent might be up to something? Is that the standard we apply in authorizing the tapping of phones or other unknown types of electronic surveillance that might have been used in this case? Whatever happened to “probable cause”? Has that legal concept been jettisoned along with the rest of the Forth Amendment?

If the Obama administration was spying on Trump or members of his campaign, the Loretta Lynch Justice Department would have had to have gotten a warrant from the secretive FISA court first. But according to George Washington University Law Professor Jonathan Turley, “the standards for FISA are so low and easily satisfied that it is difficult to establish any illegality under the law.”

“The President can technically request the warrant but it still has to go through the process. Obama couldn’t authorize it on his own. The Attorney General still has to sign off and the FISA judge still has to authorize the warrant,” said Bradley Moss, an attorney and national security expert.

So there is a legal process that prevents the president from acting independently, but the standards for procuring a warrant are considerably lower those of a normal court, which means that someone’s civil rights are going to be violated. The FISA system is, in fact, a shadow justice system that was created to protect the interests of the state. Now it is being used to target political enemies. (Note: NSA whistleblower Bill Binney, thinks that Trumps phones were bugged by the NSA without a warrant. Also, when former Attorney General Michael Mukasey was asked on ABC’s “This Week” on Sunday whether Donald Trump had been the “the target of surveillance ordered up by his predecessor”? Mukasey said that he thought Trump was “right in that there was surveillance and that it was conducted at the behest of the attorney of the Justice Department through the FISA court.” In other words, Mukasey believes that Trump Tower was bugged via some form of electronic surveillance.)

What we need to know is whether Obama or the DOJ had probable cause for the extraordinarily intrusive investigation that was authorized. We also need to know who was involved in the decision to allow the Intel agencies to disseminate “raw intelligence” not only to other government officials and the European allies, but also to members of the media who were expected to compose unsourced articles that would inflict maximum damage on Trump and his administration.

Like I said earlier, if Trump is found guilty of illegal behavior in his connections with Russia, then he should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But if Obama or the DOJ abused their authority by using the Intelligence agencies and the media to conduct a politically-motivated witch hunt aimed at crushing a political rival and reversing the results of the election, then they should be held accountable.

Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

MIKE WHITNEY lives in Washington state. He is a contributor to Hopeless: Barack Obama and the Politics of Illusion (AK Press). Hopeless is also available in a Kindle edition. He can be reached at [email protected].

(Republished from Counterpunch by permission of author or representative)
• Category: Ideology • Tags: Donald Trump, Government Surveillance, Russia 
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  1. Hear’s the new deal. The details don’t matter any more. I know which side I’m on. I hate the other side and want to destroy them. They feel exactly the same way about me. That’s American politics today. The Nationalists and the Globalists. One of them must die. This is war.

  2. Renoman says:

    Yis ll need a real big jail down there!

  3. Trump should be looking into this with the goal of some clown being up for a Treason trial.

    A good hanging would do the world of good to the leftist filth.

  4. For those unaware they are bombarded by fake news, watch this short video that cites major media reports about Obama administration spying on the Trump campaign. When Trump recently complained, the major media announced Trump is nuts and has no evidence.

    • Replies: @RobinG
  5. nickels says:

    Agreed, although I don’t think you have to give so much up.
    We know that any attempt to depose Trump would be a kangeroo court.
    There is zero trust in the utterly corrupt washington system.
    Our patriotism requires we support our president no matter what.

  6. @WorkingClass

    Yes. that is rather how things are coming down to. The Hilary/Neocon/Cops/Intelligence/1%/WallSt./Military/Deep state crowd figure they hold all the cards. Generals without an army. Regular folk can bring them down. We become very non-compliant. You don’t have the numbers. And your ranks will split. A country paralyzed. You can’t make us work. We can bring the temple roof down over your heads. We just won’t buy. No money for you. Whatever you got, we don’t want. You have made sure we don’t have good jobs and can’t afford it. We can look to ourselves for some time. You, not for a day. So, we’re on strike. No dealings with you. No business. No buying. Trade internally.

    Crash the system.

    • Replies: @Diversity Heretic
  7. RobinG says:
    @Carlton Meyer

    Excellent, thanks for that.

    Here’s Bill Binney elaborating on why “President Trump is absolutely right.”

    NSA Whistleblower William Binney on The Sean Hannity Radio Show

    • Replies: @Art
  8. utu says:

    If Donald Trump is found guilty of illegal behavior in his connections with Russia, then he should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But shouldn’t the same rule apply to Obama? Shouldn’t Obama be held responsible if he authorized an illegal investigation of the Trump campaign in order to destroy a political enemy?

    For whom this paragraph was written? Do you have large readership among idiots?

    • Agree: The Anti-Gnostic
  9. reading the comments, it feels like people are getting personal, about a politician :()

  10. @WorkingClass

    Sadly, I’m inclined to agree. We’re beyond the “rule of law,” and into “whose side are you on?” This is now Mad Max World and the question is simple: “Who run Bartertown?”

    • Replies: @animalogic
  11. @Ned Ludlam

    My only quibble with your post is that not all of the police and military are on the side of the Deep State, etc. Policing in the U.S. is highly decentralized and a lot of military power rests in the hands of the National Guard. When confrontation finally occurs, a lot will turn on whose orders the police and military obey.

  12. I agree about the witch hunt, and think the democrats have jumped the fascist militarist shark, joining other neocons including “W” who is going along with the effort, but therefore logically think that it already has made any “prosecution” of Trump spurious and extra-legal.

  13. This piece presumes some sort of rules, where the phrase “found guilty of illegal behavior” has some other meaning than “crushed by enemies”.

    The piece lacks cynicism. Healthy cynicism, like Mark Twain’s “never pick a fight with people who buy ink by the barrel”, or conventional wisdom: “can’t fight city hall”. That’s unfortunate. It’s fine to root for one side or the other, or to wish a pox on both houses, but taking this pose, demanding even-handed justice — in this context? That just strikes me as silly moralistic posturing…

    • Agree: Kiza
  14. @WorkingClass

    Well put. That’s it in a nutshell. Except to say that the ‘globalists’ can be fairly accurately described as what Henry Ford called “The International Jew” and their PC fellow-travellers.

  15. Art says:

    Thanks RobinG — a must listen too — Art

  16. alexander says:

    Dear Mr Whitney,

    In an un-crooked world …your “paraphrase” of events should read something more like this….

    ” In the final months (not days) of the White House a concerted effort was made to CONCEAL and DEFLECT away from the multiple treasonous felonies that STOLE the democratic nomination AWAY from Bernie Sanders, and gifted it to Queen Hillary.

    The administration sought to COVER UP these traitorous wrong doings by launching a phony baloney “Putin bashing” media blitzkrieg.

    Rather then EXPOSE or DISCUSS the grotesque corruption at the heart of our D.N.C.and its REAL undoing of “Democracy”….our complicit media ran with the wholly bogus “Red Scare”…so that even intelligent alternate media writers, like Mike Whitney, would be fooled into discussing and dissecting the WRONG SCANDAL.

    And quite obviously , it has worked like a charm.

    • Replies: @Wally
  17. @Diversity Heretic

    Given all the premises, the question is : can we DESTROY barter town & replace it with something better..

  18. sadly, the story mike is telling and the point implicit mike therein is …..death of the rule of law in america, the rise of the alphabet agency driven police state since clinton and irrefutably since the bush/cheney co-presidency.

    the arrogance of those on the left who dare call half the country that supported trump…racists, homophobes, haters of all stripe further underscores we are all living through the start of the death of the united states, something i expect to take another decade or two to complete. the left has made it crystal clear there can be no middle ground, no negotiation, no impartial rule of constitutional law if the law does not entirely agree with their political/cultural point of view.

    when you add the media and certain elements of the deep state be they corporations.banks,alphabet agencies, etc to the rabble rousing left the world outside our borders can clearly see a nation undergoing a slow motion collapse.

    europe is convulsing as well for the same reasons.

    get used to this its going to become much much worse over the next year or two as trump remains and those opposed to him become ever more hysterical at having the trough of corruption spigot turned down or even off.

    the battle america faces is fairly simple.

    1. those who deeply oppose trump have bet the farm that america can continue forward by selling more death to the rest of the world in the form of coups, wars, green revolutions etc etc.
    whether the hope and change left understand it or not….. the anti trump force is implicitly for more of the same that W and obama have given humanity for the past 16 years………..misery and suffering……anti humanity

    2. the pro trump supported want the opposite…peace, a chance at a better life going forward for themselves and their children. this is part of why he is president. trump made his fortune by building things UP. obama made his by tearing things down.

    time to choose folks!

    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
    • Replies: @alan2102
  19. Agent76 says:

    Jan 10, 2017 What I Learned From the Intelligence Report on “Russian Hacking”

    The propaganda surrounding the “Russia hacked the election” meme is, quite frankly, beneath the intelligence of The Corbett Report community. But this hodgepodge of evidence-free assertions is still driving the 24/7 fake news cycle, so today James rolls up his sleeve and shows the latest propaganda for what it is.

  20. Q:

    The Trump Investigation
    Essential Criminal Probe or Politically-Motivated Witch Hunt?

    Opera bouffe.

  21. @WorkingClass

    Something along the lines of secessio plebis? Or a more risky, fraught and decisive revolt, like, say, 1776?
    Are Americans doomed to revolt against their soi-disant masters, landlords and betters again and again, for all Eternity? (If so, I’m in, btw).

  22. Agent76 says:

    Dec 12, 2016 Georgia Official Says Homeland Security Tried To Hack Their State’s Voter Database

    While most of the country frets over Russia’s role in the 2016 election, the state of Georgia has come forward saying that they’ve traced an IP from a hack of their voter database right back to the offices of the Department of Homeland Security. Apparently we need to focus on protecting our vote from our own government.

  23. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    Trump needs to go ‘Stickman’.

    Ramzpaul is the guru on MANY things.

  24. TG says:

    Yes, well said.

    The key is that the surveillance of Donald Trump and associates was almost certainly not illegal. Whether whitewashed by the FISA courts, or authorized under some omnibus law that lets the government do whatever it wants in the ‘national interest,’ Obama had a perfectly legal right to spy on anyone and anything.

    But I hope that those people who think that the government needs the power to spy on everyone, to be able to root around in your cellphones and emails, to keep us ‘safe,’ are starting to realize just how stupid that idea is (perhaps even Trump will come to realize this. One can hope).

    If the president can wiretap all the communications of a political opponent during an election (to look for non-existent Russian spies, or maybe Martian invaders, or violations of the terms of flood insurance) and then use these communications for any purpose, and distribute them widely to the government and press… well? Is that really something we need to fight ‘terrorism?’

    In fact, as regards real national security, letting the government spy on anyone and distribute the information widely is clearly going to make the nation less safe. With tens of thousands (?) of government employees (and maybe foreign contractors?) having unlimited access to everyone’s data, that is such an obvious security risk. For every Snowden there simply must be dozens of foreign spies or people with criminal associations… Even a hard-boiled cold warrior patriot knows that intelligence should not be scattered to the four winds.

    • Replies: @Agent76
  25. @Diversity Heretic

    There was a time when an ex-Marine friend of mine (I don’t care to argue about former vs. ex, OK?) asked me if I would consider joining a militia as he and his colleagues in the militia felt the country was going to Hell and gone. I declined then and would decline now if asked again.

    But a big part of the reason I declined then was my believe that the U.S. armed forces would dutifully follow the orders of an American president and, like Sherman’s march through the South, would be merciless towards those who revolted.

    I’m not so sure anymore with Trump in the White House. Indeed, I doubt the U.S. military would support him.


  26. In a poker game the players keep their their cards close to the chest.
    MSM requires of Trump to to prove his allegation of wiretapping.
    That would be the same thing as a demand for a player to put his cards on the table before the bets are in.

    • Replies: @chris moffatt
  27. Agent76 says:

    This is what they do not want folks they schooled in government schools to know. Please share this with others knowledge is power after all.

    January 10, 2014 *500* Years of History Shows that Mass Spying Is Always Aimed at Crushing Dissent

    *It’s Never to Protect Us From Bad Guys* No matter which government conducts mass surveillance, they also do it to crush dissent, and then give a false rationale for why they’re doing it.

    • Replies: @jacques sheete

    How can America support Trump vs Globalist ,….when Trump is not standing
    Against the new emerging Fascism reach.

    I’ve heard rumors the above legislation is tabled in some 26 other States.
    This will dramatically change America.

    The Police Serve and Protection theme is now Enforcement, ….dressed up
    Like they are military.
    The Military on America’s streets is serious foreboding.
    The system keeps running drills with the Military and State guards.

  29. @Longfisher

    You may be right, my point is only that there’s a lot of “U.S. military:” fifty state national guards in addition to active duty Army, Navy, etc. And big city police forces may be more effectively “military” in the domestic context than Navy carrier groups or submarines. A lot of these commanders will have to decide whose orders to follow. Active duty military may fire on “militia,” but would they fire on a state National Guard deployed to resist them, who know their capabilities and have weapons similar to their own?

  30. @Ilyana_Rozumova

    They just need to read the NYTimes article of Jan 19/2017 by Michael Schmidt and others. It’s in there.

    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
  31. “Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 Amendments Act of 2008

    The 2008 amendment of FISA gave telecoms immunity, increased the time allotted for warrantless surveillance, and adds provisions for emergency eavesdropping.

    On June 20, 2008, the House of Representatives passed the amendment with a vote of 293 to 129. It passed in the Senate 69 to 28 on July 9, 2008 after a failed attempt to strike Title II from the bill by Senator Dodd. On July 10, 2008, President Bush signed it into law.”

    The President doesn’t need a warrant in case of emergency. What’s an emergency? Anything he says it is.

  32. @Agent76

    “ Thus, the State is a coercive criminal organization that subsists by a regularized large-scale system of taxation-theft, and which gets away with it by engineering the support of the majority (not, again, of everyone) through securing an alliance with a group of opinion-moulding intellectuals whom it rewards with a share in its power and pelf.”

    -Murray N. Rothbard, The State versus Liberty

  33. Alden says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    On the other hand, most big city police departments are heavily affirmative action black brown and female trash.
    I don’t know much about demographics of the National Guard. But they are military and obey orders.
    A comparison of the French national guard, city police and army during the French Revolution is not valid because the revolutionary leaders had spent at least 5 years infiltrating those forces and bringing them over to the revolutionary side.

    I don’t think the black, brown and female big city police departments would do a thing to protect Whites.

    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
  34. Alden says:

    I agree the military will follow orders. It was wise of you to not join a militia. I believe they are creations of ADL, SPLC, FBI, and especially ATF. They are more for anti White propaganda purposes than actually finding some deranged neo Nazi KKK types.

  35. You are correct.
    This is likely to be about FISA court abuse.
    However, with the lax standards and the very high approval rate, the court itself is an abuse.
    If the FISA court did approve, it will be very hard to show wrong as it will have been “technically legal”.
    It seems pretty clear what happened here, with plausible deniability by/ for Obama.
    Trump needs to clean house.

    • Replies: @woodNfish
  36. Now here’s something Trump should have the FBI have a look at: the Clinton’s money laundering operation

    “I can’t say for certain that it’s illegal because I don’t have access to all the financial information but at best they are skating along the edge,” the source added. “They get away with it because the major media outlets are too lazy to look into it but the [Congressional] Benghazi Committee has access to the key information, and so do government agencies like the IRS, the SEC and the FEC. If you put together the information that all of these agencies have it’s obvious that the foundation is a fraud.”

    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
  37. gustafus says:

    My sister – surrounded by Aspen style liberals – said she was getting a gun. This is extraordinary on many levels. No one in our family is military since a single grand father served in WWI.

    There are no police, military or even hunters in our extended family. NO GUNS anywhere. We don’t even fish.

    Ever since she was spied as a poll watcher for Trump, she has had to move her horse, change health clubs, and resign from several boards. She came unglued on the phone, telling me she thought it was time to start shooting “these bastards”.

    My 32 year old daughter dressed to “The View” for the last decade. A few weeks ago she announced that she hates Whoopie Goldberg and Joy Behar … “Mom, they hate us. They hate all white people and Trump voters. How could I have watched that crap for so many years?”

    Her husband has a gay mother who ‘came out’ when the kids were grown. He voted Trump, and can’t convince her that Muslims are NOT her friends.

    Another daughter has closed her facebook account, saying she just hates everyone now. She’s a strident Trump supporter.

    The common theme here is HATE …. HATRED…. and LET:S JUST KILL EM ALL.

    I’m in. It is kill or be killed time. And not just in the USA. Wholesale genocide is the only thing that will save Western Civilization because the mean IQ of the planet is plunging as we SAVE THE CHILDREN of Africa and Latin America… while they breed like roaches and poach the wildlife to extinction.

    I vote Giraffes- and let the toddlers die. And if that doesn’t work – we must be more pro active.

  38. Ivy says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    One indication of the conservative nature of many in law enforcement and the military is the popularity of websites such as

  39. Sam J. says:

    “Obama Administration Rushed to Preserve Intelligence of Russian Election Hacking”

    I had a very disturbing thought. I think it’s reasonable to assume that there was voter fraud in the primaries with Hillary stealing votes from Bernie. All the Democrats were SURE that Hillary would win. No matter what she would win. Why was that? Maybe they were going to jiggle the electronic voting in the general election and …some one stopped them. Someone actually hacked the machines to honestly count the votes and lock out the the vote changes. What if…it WAS RUSSIA? It could also have very well been the deep state within the deep state that doesn’t like the deep state. Plenty of people in the security forces know that they CIA and NSA are up to no good. That they in no way are in the interest of the American people. If there’s back doors in the voting machines who says they couldn’t use them their selves and the Democrats, never having much in the way of competition, were locked out of their own hack.

    • Replies: @NoldorElf
    , @RobinG
    , @Ivy
  40. woodNfish says:

    I think Patton’s murderous attack on peacefully protesting veterans in DC in 1916 is more correct than Sherman’s march.

    • Replies: @Ilyana_Rozumova
  41. woodNfish says:

    The judiciary has been abusing the constitution and us since the day it was formed. That is why we have 9 justices now rather than the original 3 as created in the constitution. The legal system is totally corrupt from the top to the bottom. There is no other way to explain how Berkeley cops stand by while violent rioters assault people and destroy property which violated their oaths to uphold the law and public safety.

    Trump is a big cop supporter. I’m not. Cops are just as corrupt as the judges and more likely to murder you.

    • Replies: @Alden
  42. Warrants? We don’t need no stinking warrants!

    Seriously, it is far easier to ask for forgiveness than it is to ask for permission.

  43. NoldorElf says:
    @Sam J.

    I agree. It is almost certain they did rig it against Bernie Sanders. The Wiki leaks emails said that Clinton was being referred to as the candidate as early as 2015. That was before anything else happened. Then there is the matter that the Democratic National Committee chair had to resign in disgrace, then their following successor chair apparently resigned from CNN having leaked the debate questions for the Democratic Primary to Clinton. For sure there is a lot of dirt behind the scenes that we don’t know about.

    Oh and there is a large double standard as Whitney points out. Why does Obama get off so easily?

    Bottom line is that we have a lot of plutocrats lining their own pockets rather than serving the public.

  44. @Longfisher

    Indeed, I doubt the U.S. military would support him.

    We sweat to defend the Constitution of The United States of America, against all enemies, foreign and domestic. So, who are the domestics enemies as of now.? I don’t consider the President to be a domestic enemy. He won the election, thus he is the legitimate leader of our Nation, and the Commander of the Armed Forces. Since we Sear to obey the orders of those appointed over us, (military), his orders are to be obeyed as long as they are lawful. There is the response to your doubts.

  45. @chris moffatt

    Sorry! The article is not a proof.

  46. @Alden

    You are confused! The whites would be the ones coming with guns if something would happen to Trump.

    • Replies: @Alden
  47. @woodNfish

    Patton was still a baby in 1916

  48. Wally says:

    These are what need investigating:

    Undercover video shows Democrat operatives admitting they incited violence at Trump rallies

    Obama’s Feds Tried to Hack Indiana’s Election System While
    The attacks are the second confirmed IT scanning assault by DHS officials against states that resisted Obama

    • Replies: @Anon
  49. RobinG says:
    @Sam J.

    Please. They may have cheated, but not by “hacking.” The voting machines are not connected to the internet.

    • Replies: @Sam J.
  50. woodNfish says:

    You really need a history lesson.

    • Replies: @res
  51. res says:

    History lessons all around? Are you referring to Patton and the Bonus Army protests in 1932 or was there a different incident in 1916?

    • Agree: Seamus Padraig
  52. Alden says:

    Citizens with hunting rifles and no transport, food supply, medics, and organization are no match for big city police forces with their SWAT teams, helicopters etc. And citizens with rifles are no match for the National Guard.

    How would Whites even get themselves as an organized force to Washington DC to defend Trump?.

    • Replies: @Sam J.
    , @Ilyana_Rozumova
  53. Alden says:

    The judiciary seized power over the executive and legislative branches in 1804, Marbury vs Madison. President Madison could have defied the Supreme Court but he chose not to and the judiciary have ruled ever since.

  54. Ivy says:
    @Sam J.

    Maybe Obama rushing to preserve intelligence about Russian hackers was a smokescreen. Maybe he found out about the CIA breach and was responding. He could have signed the order for all agencies to get all hands on deck to deal with that, and the smear was really more red meat for the media and sad puppy Hillary supporters.

  55. Sam J. says:

    Hacking is not just related to being connected to the internet but a 15 second search came up with,”…Older machines (Shouptronic, AVC Advantage, AccuVote OS, Optech-III Eagle) can be hacked by anyone with physical access; newer machines (almost anything else in use today) can be hacked by anyone with physical access, and are vulnerable to attacks from the Internet…”

    I think the whole hanging chads fiasco in Florida was nothing more than an op to get electronic voting machines into a important pivotal election State.

  56. Sam J. says:

    “…Citizens with hunting rifles and no transport, food supply, medics, and organization are no match for big city police forces with their SWAT teams, helicopters etc. And citizens with rifles are no match for the National Guard. …”

    You’re wrong. The reason is they don’t have the man power. Most cities have how many helicopters? Big city maybe two, three, max. It’s not many and they’re not armored and can be shot down easily. How many swat team members are there in a big city? The Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD) has only 9,843 officers. You think all these are on the streets at the same time? I bet they couldn’t raise a thousand at one time for all of Los Angeles that could actually hit the streets. It’s the same for the US military. There’s more people registered to hunt in the State of just Pennsylvania than the whole entire military. The forces they can mount I bet are less than 100,000 front line soldiers with weapons in a sustained battle. I bet it’s less than that. That’s why we can’t take Iraq and Afghanistan. We don’t have the people. Remember these wise words.

    “And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?… The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin’s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If…if…We didn’t love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation…. We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”

    Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Diversity Heretic
  57. @Alden

    You do not consider this most important factor. There is very distinct division of US society.
    Democrats were winning in large cities. Republicans were wining in all rural areas.

    • Replies: @Alden
  58. This Progressive makes some good sense.

  59. Alden says:
    @Sam J.

    The counter revolutionaries fought hard for about 7 years after the revolution Many were veterans of the Czarist military. They lost to the revolutionary armies police and the Cheka.

    There is no organized White Resistance. As far as Los Angeles goes, Whites are a minority and most of the Whites are recent Armenian, Russian, Persian, and Israeli immigrants.
    I agree that LAPD and the sheriff couldn’t do much the first 2 days of a riot. But the rioters would be brown and black looters, not White Nationalists.

  60. @Sam J.

    A lot might depend on county sheriffs in rural areas. County sheriffs usually have the power to deputize citizens and organize possees. It sounds very “Old West,” but it could be useful. County sheriffs are often elected officials. I agree that citizens with hunting rifles (or even military look-a-like carbines) would be little match for an organized military or even police force. But imagine a national guard of a group of states, with a pre-existing military organization and chain of command, backed by county sheriffs who have organized possees as auxiliaries.

    There’s actually a historical parallel. In America’s War for Independence, militias armed with hunting weapons could not stand against British regulars. But the Continental Army put the militia up front as skirmishers and told them their only mission was to fire two aimed shots, at which point they could retreat; the fight was then taken up by Continental Army regulars. In the meantime, officers and NCOs grabbed the retreating militiamen and got them reorganized. In the Battle of the Cowpens, the reorganized militia attacked the British flank and the U.S. got a rare tactical and strategic victory. I know that the weapons and tactics of today are different, but a combination of regular and auxiliary troops might be quite formidable.

    • Replies: @Alden
  61. @Ilyana_Rozumova

    He’s probably thinking of Patton’s attack on the Bonus Army in 1932.

  62. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    James O’Keeffe and Alex Jones. Good sources. What’s the weather like in that wingnut bubble?

  63. alan2102 says:

    “the pro trump [group] wants…peace, a chance at a better life going forward for themselves and their children.”

    And President Trump is supporting that desire by dismantling environmental protections, radically increasing the “defense” (war) budget, undermining the public schools, etc., etc.

  64. res says:

    To be clear, this is false as woodNfish indicated. Patton was born November 11, 1885 (Veteran’s Day, how appropriate). Patton was 20 for most of 1916 and served in Mexico both as an aide to General Pershing and in combat. Very much not a “baby.” See Wiki link in my comment above for more detail.

    • Replies: @res
  65. Alden says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    The committees of correspondence and other secret societies began organizing for a revolution in 1760. The revolution was fomented by the wealthiest Americans.

    Today there is no real organization. And the wealthiest Americans are totally committed to endless non White immigration and the extermination of White Americans.

    During the revolution Boston, Philladelphia, Charleston and other big cities were at the forefront of revolution.
    Today the big cities are black, brown, democrat and anti White.

    Wars and revolutions are not won until the cities are conquered. I don’t see how a disorganized army of hunters and shooters could possibly conquer a city defended by the military and well armed police. The police department of Beverly Hills has a tank. The military has been giving tanks, helicopters and other weaponry to even small cities for years.

    On the other hand, most of the LAPD uniformed patrol I see are affirmative action Hispanic.

  66. res says:

    Argh. That will teach me to do math when tired. He was 30.

  67. Svigor says:

    If the Obama administration was spying on Trump or members of his campaign, the Loretta Lynch Justice Department would have had to have gotten a warrant from the secretive FISA court first.

    What I read suggests that is not the case. That FISA is a rather narrow avenue (none of the accusations against Trump qualify as FISA-worthy), and there are many other ways to skin the surveillance cat.

    “the standards for FISA are so low and easily satisfied that it is difficult to establish any illegality under the law.”

    Again, what I read is to the contrary. That FISA has pretty high standards, and involves imminent and direct military or terrorist threats against the country, not election-rigging or mere political skullduggery. And the evidence seems to indicate that a FISA court rejected the first, above-board attempt by the Hussein administration to use it against Trump (one of very few rejections in FISA court history).

    The key is that the surveillance of Donald Trump and associates was almost certainly not illegal. Whether whitewashed by the FISA courts, or authorized under some omnibus law that lets the government do whatever it wants in the ‘national interest,’ Obama had a perfectly legal right to spy on anyone and anything.

    Perhaps not a crime in and of itself, but combined with later actions, it could be a different story.

    How can America support Trump vs Globalist ,….when Trump is not standing
    Against the new emerging Fascism reach.

    Mind-slave of globo-left thinks he is opposing globo-left by using their language (“fascism”).

    If the FISA court did approve, it will be very hard to show wrong as it will have been “technically legal”.

    Not if the Hussin administration lied on their paperwork, which seems very likely. In that case, someone may be in deep shit.

    Citizens with hunting rifles and no transport, food supply, medics, and organization are no match for big city police forces with their SWAT teams, helicopters etc. And citizens with rifles are no match for the National Guard.

    “Goat-herders with Kalashnikovs are no match for the US military.”

    Meanwhile, many Americans have chemistry or engineering degrees. Ask Hadji how useful they’d have been in the sandbox. And American citizens have more AR-15s than they do any other rifle, these days. And the ROE on domestic soil will be far different than in MENA.

    The insurgency discussion always misses the point; Americans are not willing to mount a determined and sustained insurgency, not by a long shot; but if and when they ever are, the American military will not be effective against them.

    Maybe Obama rushing to preserve intelligence about Russian hackers was a smokescreen. Maybe he found out about the CIA breach and was responding. He could have signed the order for all agencies to get all hands on deck to deal with that, and the smear was really more red meat for the media and sad puppy Hillary supporters.

    Maybe you could present a scenario that makes any sense at all?

  68. annamaria says:

    meanwhile, the northern neighbor Canada jumps up and down on the State Dept. orders, encouraged by the Nazi/Banderite progeny who finally found an outlet for their rabid Russophobia. “Canada’s Russian Aggression:”
    “A Nazi Skeleton in the Family Closet:”
    On Jan. 10, 2017, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau replaced Foreign Minister Stephane Dion with Chrystia Freeland, a rabid Russophobe.
    “Freeland portrays her grandparents as World War II victims, but that is not the real story. Her grandfather, Mykhailo Chomiak, faithfully served Nazi Germany right up to its surrender Mykhailo Chomiak was not a victim of the war – he was on the side of the German aggressors who collaborated with Ukrainian nationalists in killing Russians, Jews, Poles and other minorities.
    Mikhailo Chomiak comfortably settled his family into a former Jewish apartment in Krakow. The editorial offices for Krakivski Visti also were taken from a Jewish owner, Krakow’s Polish-language Jewish newspaper Nowy Dziennik. Its editor at the time was forced to flee Krakow for Lviv, where he was captured following the occupation of Galicia and sent to the Belzec extermination camp, where he was murdered along with 600,000 other Jews. Freeland’s grandfather was given a prestigious job to spread Nazi propaganda, praising Hitler from a publishing house stolen from Jews and given to Ukrainians who shared the values of Nazism. On April 24, 1940, Krakivski Visti published a full-page panegyric to Adolf Hitler dedicated to his 51st birthday (four days earlier). Chomiak also hailed Governor-General Hans Frank: “The Ukrainian population were overjoyed to see the establishment of fair German authority, the bearer of which is you, Sir Governor-General. The Ukrainian people expressed this joy not only through the flowers they threw to the German troops entering the region, but also through the sacrifices of blood required to fight Polish usurpers.” (Because of Frank’s role in the Holocaust, the Nuremberg Tribunal found him guilty of crimes against humanity and executed him.) Beyond extolling Hitler and his henchmen, Chomiak rejoiced over Nazi military victories, including the terror bombings of Great Britain.
    Editorial selections from Chomiak’s newspaper can be found in Holocaust museums around the world, such as the one in Los Angeles, California.”

    Canadian Foreign Minister Chrystia Freeland is an idiot, a very ambitious and opportunistic but still an idiot who was caught, easily, on lying. Meanwhile, the presstituting Canadian MSM have began an aggressive campaign at whitewashing the incredible story.
    Moreover, “The reason the Polish Government is now investigating Freeland is that Chomiak’s wartime record not only victimized Galician Jews, but also the Polish citizens of Cracow.”

  69. annamaria says:

    Nice! – “Russia’s Largest Bank Confirms Hiring Podesta Group To Lobby For Ending Sanctions:”
    “…the discovery of high-profile Democrats like Podesta being paid lucrative fees for lobbying to lift U.S. sanctions on Russia contrasts with charges from Democrats that President Donald Trump and his key aides are soft on Russia while the Obama administration was tough on Moscow.” Podesta is one of the Democrat’s highest profile lobbyists who enjoys close personal and business connections to former Presidents Obama and Bill Clinton. John Podesta was chief of staff in Clinton’s White House and special counselor in the Obama White House.”

  70. annamaria says:

    “One thing the WikiLeaks files accomplished is they made and and all accusations of Russian hacking, and of links between Trump and Russia, utterly meaningless in one fell swoop.”
    “… because Trump has to start to realize he’s going to need very broad support, and soon, be a president for all Americans so to speak, to fend off the CIA et al, and in what may be the hardest thing to do, he needs to invoke transparency, explain to people exactly what he does, and why, to drain the deep swamp. If he fails in all this, and for now the odds point in that direction, those who protest him today will feel validated, right, and winners. They will be tragically wrong. Because if Trump loses this, the CIA wins. And then we will all live in 1984 for as far into the future as we can see.”

  71. @Alden

    If some sort of uprising would happen it would happen in countryside.
    By the time it would reach cities there would be several thousand people.
    Nether police nor army would start to shoot into such a mas of people.
    As an example once black people lead by that MLK reached critical mass, police become helpless,
    and had to put away guns and clubs.

  72. annamaria says:

    This is interesting:
    The “rogue Deep State” quietly aided Donald Trump (by subtly undermining Hillary Clinton’s campaign) as the last best chance to save the nation from the neocon’s over-reach that the Establishment’s Wall Street-funded leadership (Bush, Clinton, Obama, et al.) has overseen–including granting the CIA and its allies virtually unlimited powers unhindered by any effective oversight.
    This profound split in the Deep State has now broken into open warfare. The first salvo was the absurd propaganda campaign led by Establishment mouthpieces The New York Times and The Washington Post claiming Russian agents had “hacked” the U.S. election to favor Trump. This fact-free propaganda campaign failed–having no evidence didn’t work quite as well as the NYT and Wapo expected– and so the propaganda machine launched the second salvo, accusing Trump of being a Russian patsy. The evidence for this claim was equally laughable, and that campaign has only made the Establishment, its propaganda mouthpieces and the neocon Deep State look desperate and foolish on the global and domestic stages.
    The desperate neocon Deep State and its Democratic Party allies went to absurd lengths to undermine Trump via the “Boris ad Natasha” strategy of accusing Trump of collaborating with the Evil Russkies, even going so far as to briefly exhume former President G.W. Bush from deep-freeze to make a fool of himself, saying the Trump-Evil Russkies connection should be “investigated.”
    Now the rogue elements have launched a counterstrike–Vault 7.”
    “The CIA Just Got Nuked!” The Legendary John McAfee on ‘Vault 7’ Revelation:

  73. @Diversity Heretic

    Let us hope that our soldiers and police have as much identification with the people they supposedly serve as their USSR counterparts 25 years ago. Frankly, there are a large number of soldiers and police that scare me. They seem to think they serve a corporate entity called the Federal government more so than the citizens that finance it.

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