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Did Pompeo Dupe Trump Into the Soleimani Hit??
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Donald Trump is under the illusion that the fracas with Iran is over. He thinks that Iran’s pinprick missile strikes on US bases in Iraq have assuaged Tehran’s thirst for revenge. But he’s wrong. The missile strikes were merely the first salvo in an epic cage match between Iran’s Axis of Resistance and its 70 year-long nemesis, the United States. As Iran’s Supreme Leader said on Wednesday, the missile attacks were not sufficient payback for the assassination of Iran’s most decorated military hero, Qassem Soleimani. They were just “a slap”, just Round One in what will surely be a long and bloody campaign aimed at driving the US out of the Middle East.

I wonder if Trump has any idea of what he’s done? It’s one thing to hector, threaten, coerce and sanction a rival nation, especially a nation that sits on an ocean of oil in a strategically-located area like the Middle East. But it’s another thing to assassinate the country’s highest-ranking and most revered military commander, an Iranian Rommel, whose tireless devotion to service spans a 40 year-long period. That’s not something that can be shrugged off or swept under the rug. That’s an act of war that requires a muscular response from the state. No country can allow its military leaders to be killed with impunity. Iran will have to fight back, and they will fight back. The question is “how”?

Iran will likely intensify the strategy that Soleimani perfected; hybrid, 4th Generation unconventional warfare conducted via Iran’s proxies in Syria, Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan and Lebanon. They will forgo using their bulging arsenal of long-range ballistic missiles and, instead, implement an asymmetrical strategy aimed at roiling markets, blocking shipping lanes, demolishing petrochemical plants and wasting oil tankers. The objective will be to wreak havoc across the region making the US presence less and less tenable while invoking plausible deniability as to the perpetrator. It will be a war that is largely conducted in the shadows. The Middle East is a target-rich environment for those who have the proxies, the weapons and the inclination to create mayhem. This is a war that Iran is prepared to fight and this is a war that Iran can win.

Iran also has more extreme options as illustrated in this excerpt from an article at DW:

“The IRGC can threaten shipping lanes in the Gulf, Gulf of Oman and the Caspian Sea through the application of a wide variety of assets it has at its disposal, including submarines, smart torpedoes, smart mine capability, and land-based, long-range anti-ship missiles strategically based on the mainland, islands, and ships”…Such attacks could put a halt to the world’s oil transport network, at least for a time. One-fifth of global oil production is shipped through the strait between Iran and the Arabian Peninsula. If the Strait of Hormuz were to become unsafe for ship passage, it would not only affect the United States but also a large number of countries around the world. The US would be under great pressure to end any war with Iran as quickly as possible….” (“Iran-US conflict: Tehran’s asymmetrical approach”, dw.com)

Did Trump mull-over any of these grim scenarios before he ordered the assassination of Soleimani? Was he told that both Obama and G.W. Bush opted not to kill Soleimani because they knew the backlash would be too great? Did Trump even know that Soleimani helped the US defeat ISIS and al Qaida in Iraq and Syria?

How much did Trump actually know about Soleimani or was he intentionally kept in the dark by his fanatical neocon advisors like Mike Pompeo? That doesn’t excuse Trump or make him any less culpable for his decision, but it does suggest that his sources of information might be tainted by conflicting political agendas. A recent article in the New York Times titled “Pompeo Upended Middle East by Pushing Trump to Kill Iranian General” appears to support this theory. Here’s an excerpt:

“Last week, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo was the loudest voice in the administration pushing President Trump to kill Iran’s most important general….The strike against the Iranian general has affirmed Mr. Pompeo’s position as the second-most powerful official in the Trump administration…… as the man at the center of the argument to launch the drone strike that killed Maj. Gen. Qassim Suleimani — and who pushed Mr. Trump to withdraw from the landmark Iran nuclear deal in 2018 — he is in the unusual role of shaping national security policy…

Mr. Pompeo, 56, could become known as the man who helped lead the United States into another conflict in the Middle East — breaking one of Mr. Trump’s key campaign promises just as the president faces re-election..

Mr. Pompeo said he and other American officials “evaluated the relevant risks” that the strike against General Suleimani might bring. He cited “continuing efforts on behalf of this terrorist to build out a network of campaign activities that were going to lead potentially to the death of many more Americans.”…(“Pompeo Upended Middle East by Pushing Trump to Kill Iranian General”, New York Times)

This simply isn’t true. Soleimani did not organize any “campaign activities” to kill American soldiers. That’s baloney. He was in Baghdad working on a peace agreement with his Saudi counterpart when he was incinerated by a missile launched from an American drone. Pompeo has produced no hard evidence to back this spurious claim.

Nor is there any proof that there was an “imminent threat”. That’s another one of Pompeo’s howlers. The only threat that materialized was the threat that an Iranian General on a peace mission would be senselessly obliterated by a bloodthirsty cabal in Washington. Here’s more from the Times:

“…no major attack against the sprawling and heavily-fortified diplomatic compound in Baghdad’s Green Zone is “imminent,” even though Mr. Pompeo has asserted that repeatedly, said the official, who discussed administration deliberations only on the condition of anonymity. Some Pentagon officials had said earlier that there was no intelligence revealing any unusual threats.

On Tuesday, Mr. Pompeo did not repeat his assertions that the United States had intelligence about an “imminent” attack and instead pointed to recent violent episodes.

“If you’re looking for imminence, you need look no further than the days that led up to the strike that was taken against Suleimani,” Mr. Pompeo said, apparently referring to the rocket attack by an Iranian-backed militia that killed an American interpreter, Nawres Hamid, in Iraq on Dec. 27.” (New York Times)

So rather than admit that he was lying, the cagey Pompeo simply diverts attention to the American contractor who was killed last week. That’s called bait-and-switch, a tactic that’s typically used by hucksters and charlatans. The fact is, there was no indication that an attack was imminent. None. Soleimani posed no threat to US troops or US assets at all. He was killed for nothing or, rather, he was killed because Trump and Pompeo wanted him dead. That’s the bottom line. Here’s more from the same article:

“Pompeo… is a chief architect of the rising tensions between the United States and Iran. As Mr. Trump’s first C.I.A. director, he created a special center to deal with Iran…Days after becoming secretary of state in 2018, Mr. Pompeo pushed Mr. Trump to withdraw from the nuclear agreement and reimpose strict sanctions on Iran. He has nurtured closer partnerships with Israel, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, enemies of Iran that sometimes have agendas that run counter to American interests….

In April, he advised Mr. Trump to designate as a foreign terrorist organization the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps, an arm of the Iranian military that includes General Suleimani’s elite Quds Force. It was the first time the United States had applied that label to a part of another government.

And after the Dec. 31 breach of the American Embassy in Baghdad, Mr. Pompeo pushed harder for the strike against Mr. Suleimani, which Defense Department officials had presented to Mr. Trump as an extreme and not particularly palatable option only days earlier….

Last year, on a trip to Israel, Mr. Pompeo invoked the Bible in saying Mr. Trump was a modern-day Queen Esther sent by God to save the Jews from Iran.” (New York Times)

Let’s summarize:

  1. Pompeo was the biggest and most outspoken supporter of assassination.
  2. It was Pompeo “who pushed Mr. Trump to withdraw from the landmark Iran nuclear deal.”…
  3. It was also Pompeo who convinced Trump that the benefits of killing Solemani outweighed the risks
  4. It was also Pompeo who justified the assassination by stating that there was a “imminent threat” against US assets, a claim for which there is no evidence.
  5. It was also Pompeo who persuaded Trump to designate the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps as a terrorist organization.”
  6. Pompeo is the “chief architect” of the administration’s failed Iran policy which includes the ongoing economic strangulation and the abandoning of Washington’s obligations under the terms of the nuclear agreement.
  7. And, it will also be Pompeo who– like his ideological twin, George W Bush–will be “known as the man who helped lead the United States into another conflict in the Middle East.”

Again, none of this justifies Trump’s monstrous decision to kill Soleimani, but it does show how Pompeo’s ingratiating “apple-polishing” behavior has helped him to advance his own political agenda, an agenda that appears to be far more tilted in Tel Aviv’s favor than Washington’s. How does that fit with Trump’s “America First” doctrine?

It doesn’t fit at all, in fact, it strongly suggests that Pompeo’s loyalties lie elsewhere. Why else would he put the US on a path to a military confrontation with Iran, a confrontation that will undoubtedly have catastrophic implications for the United States? How does that benefit America?

And what would the outcome of such a hellish, region-wide conflagration be? Here’s how “Grand Chessboard” geostrategist Zbigniew Brzezinski summed it up more than a decade ago:

“An attack on Iran would be an act of political folly, setting in motion a progressive upheaval in world affairs. With the U.S. increasingly the object of widespread hostility, the era of American preponderance could even come to a premature end. Although the United States is clearly dominant in the world at the moment, it has neither the power nor the domestic inclination to impose and then to sustain its will in the face of protracted and costly resistance.”

This is the nightmare scenario, the end of America brought to you by the two biggest dunderheads to ever to serve in public office: Donald Trump and Mike Pompeo.

Is there any way to stop this train-wreck?

 
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  1. cynic says:

    President Trump’s approach to diplomacy is innovative – and unique. No other leader would place an $80m price on his own head as a result of a perfidious murder of another country’s national hero engaged in a diplomatic mission which he had claimed to support. He has greatly increased his chances of meeting a violent death. Even after he leaves politics in five years time he will always be looking over his shoulder, wondering if all his guards love him more than they love money. Whenever he plays golf he will have to wonder whether the green will explode under him. If he takes a stroll, surrounded by guards, he will have to consider whether this will be the time when death falls on him out of the sky. Even if he visits one of his own hotels he must consider the risk that it might collapse around his ears.

    People have already pointed out that Trump and his generals looked scared at his recent media appearance. Those men are probably calculating their retirement pay and their chances of living to enjoy much of it. No low level troops were killed, but vengeance may be coming to the men at the top.

  2. Derer says:

    I cannot stand this hypocritical fatso constantly lying to American people and construing truth. Where is Trump’s sound foreign policies that got him elected. One cannot continue this hypocritical policies of defending Israel state terrorism in stolen land of Palestine. Furthermore, US friend Saudi Arabia is the biggest financier of Muslims terrorism worldwide, including ISIS. We prefer to pay for oil to Saudi king family instead of the backyard cheaper oil from Venezuela – pathetic.

    • Replies: @RBY
    , @MarkinLA
    , @anonymous
  3. lloyd says: • Website

    The Iranians could get over it. They might mark it down as the will of Allah. Soeimani is now an exalted martyr. That is if it serves Iranian objectives. Generational vengence is not usually Islamic. It belongs to the Old Testament and tribal utu.

    • Replies: @padre
  4. The summary missed:
    “I was the Director of the CIA. I lied, I cheated and I stole.”

    As for the “intelligence” and the rocket attack by an Iranian backed group (which denied responsibility) that started it all, my best guess is that both had their genesis in Tel Aviv.

    • Agree: journey80
    • Replies: @Johnny Rico
  5. IvyMike says:

    Okay, Trump joins the list with W and Obama as Presidents so ignorant they were easily duped by marginal psychopaths. Testament to the fact that Lawyers and Businessmen are some of the least educated adults in the U.S.

    • Agree: Michael888
    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Jeff Davis
  6. Anon[974] • Disclaimer says:

    “It strongly suggests that Pompeo’s loyalties lie elsewhere.”

    Pompeo, Trump’s first CIA director (January 23, 2017–April 26, 2018, shorter even than Schlesinger’s tenure, just long enough to get briefed in CIA’s way,) during a critical period of insubordination before Trump reversed his decision to faithfully execute ARCA. Hmm.

    Who greased Pompeo in at State, anyway? He got installed by the skin of his teeth. Ultimately by a curly ginger one of Chris Coons’, Republican soi disant “bearded Marxist,” himself the beneficiary of a Remarkable Turnaround™ in his campaign to succeed CIA kleptocrat Joe Biden. Tainted by Kenya, just like that other fake CIA commie, Barack Obama, Coons went to charm school not at BIC, as Obama did, but at the Ford/Rockefeller/Carnegie laundered I mean funded, Investor Responsibility Research Center, controlled opposition from the days when Mandela was still an official terrorist. Coons’ later legislative chores:

    – Backstabbed Debo Adegbile with an astonishingly blatant obeisance to police impunity.
    – CAATSA.
    – Rare Disease Congressional Caucus, sort of like Rush Holt except for ANTHRAX.

    Coons stands for impunity and coercive interference, CIA’s vital interests, the things they’ll kill for.

    So here we see how CIA focal points get greased in.

  7. You make three observations that are central:

    1. evidence is required to demonstrate that the man in question was

    a. responsible for any attacks against US personnell
    b. that there was any evidence that he intended any attacks in the future

    2. that the US intel has a habit of manufacturing a case and has been unreliable

    3. It’s not over — as history demonstrates among players in the region — they have very very very long memories.

  8. How did this idiot graduate from high school?

    “There is no doubt that there were a series of imminent attacks that were being by plotted by Soleimani,” Pompeo said. “We don’t know precisely when and we don’t know precisely where — but it was real.”

    https://www.informationliberation.com/?id=61096

  9. All this ‘reasonable’ stuff is tiresome. Monkeys can figure out what’s going on here. Apart from huffing and blustering what’s going to actually get done? The U.S. aims to sanction Iran to ruin. The U.S. aims to bomb the place to bits. Got it. So exactly what – if anything – is Iran and any other party going to do about it? Because if the U.S. gets away with this then China and Russia look like gutless wimps. So frightened of the almighty America that they are paralyzed when it takes out another state. The world sees they are weak and lose respect. Then, it will be their turn.

  10. Fat Mike Pompeo sees himself as a modern-day Archangel Michael, advocating and defending Israel from the Princes of Nations.

  11. sally says:

    i just watched a C span discussion with Huawei head of security. It was about Trumps refusal to allow Huawei to come into the USA markets, the Huawei lawsuit alleges the FCC acted unconstitutionally because it is support Trumps block on the Huawei competition because the Huawei refuses to put back doors in to the Huawei software and hardware, like all USA approved manufacturers apparently do, and because the Huawei network hardware and software is far superior to firms that Americans invest in. Quite interesting discussion.

    read for yourselves.
    https://e.huawei.com/en/solutions/enterprise-networks and
    https://en.prnasia.com/releases/apac/huawei-recognized-as-an-october-2019-gartner-peer-insights-customers-choice-for-data-center-networking-262287.shtml

    This C span discussion suggest that these trade wars are not about fair trade but instead are about monopoly in trade.

    Thing I admire about Pompeo, his yarns are consistently absurd all the time, every time?

    • Replies: @Tlotsi
    , @sally
    , @ivan
  12. “Last year, on a trip to Israel, Mr. Pompeo invoked the Bible in saying Mr. Trump was a modern-day Queen Esther sent by God to save the Jews from Iran.” (New York Times)”

    Whitney quotes the above from the Times but he does not make anything of it when calculating Pompeo’s motivations. That is probably because Whitney – like most of us on this site – doesn’t worry a whole lot about what the Bible says. But we ought to get over that because we have a well organized 5th column in this country called Evangelicals and Pompeo is one of them. Because Evangelicals believe that a horrible conflagration of some sort – “End Time” – in the ME is going to bring Jesus back, they’ll sign off on Israeli warmongering. Of course Israel wants the US at war with Iran.

    But actually who needs Pompeo when we have Jarvanka – Jared and Ivanka – two Orthodox Jews who are members of our other well organized 5th column- Jewish Power? I heard somewhere that Jared’s synagogue is calling Ivanka “Queen Esther” The biblical Esther is a Jewess who marries a Persian King who enables her to kill 75, 000 anti semitic Persians. The Persians are the ancestors of the Iranians and Ivanka and Jared celebrate this mass murder every year at the Orthodox Jewish feast of Purim. Welcome to Trump family values.

    • Replies: @9/11 Inside job
    , @Wally
  13. @cynic

    People have already pointed out that Trump and his generals looked scared at his recent media appearance.

    They’re all a pack of cowards. And they’re all marked men; but so are the rest of us. This only happened a week ago; we haven’t seen nothing yet (sorry for the double negative). The blow back will continue for a long time and unfortunately many innocent people will be at the wrong place at the wrong time; maybe just out for a stroll, a concert, shopping, or on the bus home.

    Whatever Soleimani was guilty of in life, cowardice was not one of them. He was known to be at the front lines of fighting leading his men.

    • Replies: @Steve Naidamast
  14. There’s no question about whether Pompeo is a weasel, but the question is whether he unduly influenced the decision maker in chief.

    No one seems to take note that the Iranians, Chinese, and Russians had just concluded joint military exercises, then Iran’s top general is assassinated?

    Coincidentally, then, a Ukraine airliner, Russian, for all intents and purposes, is destroyed on takeoff from Tehran. Another coincidence. I think not.

    All of these events have the unmistakable hallmark of the CIA, and it puts Tehran back in their place. I wouldn’t want to be their enemy.

  15. snag says:

    Pompeo happen to be a rabid Israel-firster and neo-con artist I would be surprised if he haven’t.

    Mr. Pres Sir, get rid of those warmongers or start packing because you’re starting to look like a zionist’s puppet.
    —————————-
    https://original.antiwar.com/porter/2006/02/23/how-neocons-sabotaged-irans-help-on-al-qaeda/

  16. Ed Nguen says:

    You people are seeing this from different perspective. Consider this.
    Soleimani was coordinating forces in the aftermath of the US defeat and pullback. The General was building the strategy and alliances to force the US out of the region. Pompeo and his crew know that if General Soleimani marshaled that force, before too long the US forces would only be able to take losses while retreating under fire, surrender, or be killed. It would be like one giant Niger ambush. Look that up on YouTube. But they killed a man of Persian history, nay, world history. Pompeo is Martial Petain.
    And it’s game on.

    • Replies: @Greg Bacon
    , @Bjørn Keldur
  17. Momus says:

    Soleimani, high on hubris, was trying to rub American noses in it by attempting another US embassy takeover aka Teheran and Bhengazi.

    Trump had Soleimani killed for this impudence and along with him his right hand man, and at the same time in different locations, several other ranking Iraqi anti US militia leaders.

    People are saying Pompeo and Trump have no plan. They have just executed part 1 of it and scored a difficult to understate strategic and tactical victory, restored deterrence and left the Iranians in no doubt that it is they who now have no plan.

    • Disagree: AnonStarter
    • Troll: L.K, Twodees Partain
  18. roonaldo says:

    Naw, Trump is lying nonstop and willingly participated to set up Soleimani and he’ll continue lying to promote war; as Braawk I’llbombya lied for numerous regime change wars; as Dubya lied about WMD and 9/11 to attack the whole damn planet; as Slick Willie lied to dismember Yugoslavia, expand NATO, subvert Russia and brutalize Iraq; as Papa Bush lied to set up the invasion of Iraq and God knows what all else; as Reagan lied to set up death squads galore; as Nixon lied when he prolonged the Vietnam War and expanded it into Laos and Cambodia; as LBJ lied about the Gulf of Tonkin (non) Incidents; as Truman lied to justify killing millions of Koreans and to nuke Hiroshima and Nagasaki; as FDR lied about Pearl Harbor being a “surprise”; as Woodrow Wilson lied about not intending to enter WWI; as McKinley lied to go to war with Spain; as they all lie about being unaware of CIA overthrows and assassinations. Forgive me for missing a few, as I’m workin’ from memory and my head is numb from over-exercise. It’s just an essential part of the job description to lie, cheat, and steal for the Empire.

    • Replies: @Art
  19. Given the power imbalance yo ran’s strategic regional ambitions, it makes no sense for Iran to attack the US.

    Politically, I can see interventionists leveraging impeachment conviction votes to encourage the executive to bend to their way of thinking.

    —————
    A more cynical side of me can see the whole thing as theater to manipulate gin up monel peace prizes —

  20. joe2.5 says:

    Very good but please get an editor who knows the difference in meaning and usage between immanent and imminent.

    • Replies: @bluedog
  21. RBY says:
    @Derer

    You are absolutely correct in all your statement says..AND…basically, Trump’s an idiot when it comes to dealing with people….certainly he must have people around him who do not live their lives out of decency, respect for others, or love for one another but rather, out of fear, deceipt, dishonesty a loathing for others or at the very least, a distrust of nearly all other people…..D Trump is a failed president…..one does not get much higher of a pole from which to tumble from….he may just become a casualty of assassination himself. All because of his own crippled mind…..he has no business being president of the united states….

    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @Anon
    , @follyofwar
  22. Realist says:

    Did Pompeo Dupe Trump Into the Soleimani Hit??

    No, Trump hired Pompeo. Trump and Pompeo are both Deep State supporters. Many people are trying to cover for Trump saying Trumped was duped or Trump is playing some kind of multidimensional chess. The fact is Trump has hired Deep State warmongers because he is one of them. If he is reelected he will be free to wreak havoc on the world.

    Let’s summarize:

    Pompeo was the biggest and most outspoken supporter of assassination.
    It was Pompeo “who pushed Mr. Trump to withdraw from the landmark Iran nuclear deal.”…
    It was also Pompeo who convinced Trump that the benefits of killing Solemani outweighed the risks
    It was also Pompeo who justified the assassination by stating that there was a “immanent threat” against US assets, a claim for which there is no evidence.
    It was also Pompeo who persuaded Trump to designate the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps as a terrorist organization.”
    Pompeo is the “chief architect” of the administration’s failed Iran policy which includes the ongoing economic strangulation and the abandoning of Washington’s obligations under the terms of the nuclear agreement.
    And, it will also be Pompeo who– like his ideological twin, George W Bush–will be “known as the man who helped lead the United States into another conflict in the Middle East.”

    You forgot Trump hired Pompeo.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Hail
  23. Anonymous[830] • Disclaimer says:
    @cynic

    I don’t know about Americans but British PMs already pay far more attention to their personal security than they used to. In the 1980s members of the public could easily walk down Downing Street, and I did, even in the time of Thatcher who was and is not exactly uncontroversial.
    Nowadays there is a fence and checkpoint preventing entry and you need police permission to go into the street.

    • Replies: @Just passing through
  24. Realist says:
    @IvyMike

    Okay, Trump joins the list with W and Obama as Presidents so ignorant they were easily duped by marginal psychopaths. Testament to the fact that Lawyers and Businessmen are some of the least educated adults in the U.S.

    All three are dumb bastards, but they were not duped…they are all culpable in warmongering.

  25. KA says:
    @Carlton Meyer

    “ we lie ,we cheat,we steal “
    at CIA , Pompeo.

    When challenged by UN ,or ICJ,he might say “ we lie we cheat and steal but only to American and from Americans and I graduated from American high school . Cheating was one of the lessons that I mastered d well”

  26. deschutes says:

    Mike Whitney has found his new home here at Unz.com, i.e. with all the haters, homophobes and right wing wackjobs 😀

    • Disagree: journey80
    • Troll: Digital Samizdat
    • Replies: @Ozzcript
  27. @edward ludlam

    Yes, the situation is very simple indeed. Iran is acting as a buffer for both Russia and China. North Korea as well, to a lesser extent. Once Iran and North Korea fall, China and Russia will certainly be next.

    And once China and Russia fall, make no mistake, the world will fall. The Jews will have total control and dominance over every land and people on the planet, just as they’ve always wished. The JWO will be complete. The transition will be quick and brutal. Any dissenters will be mowed down mercilessly. There will be no more nations, no more peoples. Only an indistinguishable mass of dark brown slaves serving Israel.

    I also tend to agree that China and Russia act too passively when their allies are attacked, including each other. But I do understand their strategy to some extent. They are looking to avoid an outbreak of war at any cost.

    Why? Because the USA is inevitably set for destruction. A society of multiracial, feminized, purposeless, and degenerate people cannot survive. It has never happened and it cannot happen. Eventually, the implosion of American society will affect its ability to send soldiers to fight for the Jews.

    When will the tipping point be? 5 years from now? 10? 20? 30? 40? 50? Nobody can know for sure.

    That’s why the Jews have been relentless in their attempts to both provoke and demonize Iran, China, and Russia over the past few years. They are desperate to start a major war. They need to destroy China and Russia especially before their American golem becomes useless.

    And they know the low-intelligence populations of their slave-states will be gung-ho for war after years of relentless propaganda against the countries they wish to destroy.

    • Agree: Digital Samizdat, snag
  28. Realist says:
    @Realist

    Should say…saying Trump was duped…

  29. journey80 says:
    @cynic

    Trump and his generals had just learned Bibi’s plan for the next Mossad false flag.

    • Replies: @cynic
  30. Ozzcript says:
    @deschutes

    There are no many homes for the right left. The left burn the right one down

  31. @Curmudgeon

    How does your guessing work? Do you use a dartboard or something more complicated like an algorithm?

    • Replies: @Curmudgeon
  32. @Achilles Wannabe

    “Bombshell report : Jared Kushner confirmed as Israeli agent ” newspunch.com :
    “…So Trump’s eminence grise [Kushner] , the wunderkind , who some people have called the President-in-law , is really Israel’s man inside the Whitehouse …One final note to the Never-Trumper
    resistance : if a foreign state actor is blackmailing this President…it’s probably not Russia ”
    The last thing that this administration wants is peace in the Middle East , peace is not good for the MIC and Pompeo and Pence are pushing for the “Apoclaypse ” , Pompeo in a speech has referred to the “rapture” and Pence is said to belong to a “Doomsday” cult which can’t wait for the “Apocalypse ” .

  33. Greg Bacon says: • Website
    @cynic

    President Trump’s approach to diplomacy is innovative – and unique.

    When I read this hilarious BS, I almost coughed up my coffee due to my laughing so hard.
    Trump is just another neo-CON thug, who has a rabid pack of mindless acolytes following him around, and almost deifies the man. He’s a con artist, a murderer and the King of Nepotism, making sure his darling Princess Bimbo and her slippery hubby make plenty of money during their predatory stay in the WH.

    People voted for Trump because he was the anti-Hillary, promising to end these costly and stupid wars for Wall Street and Israel, but now we’re finding out he’s just an Obama in white-face, a male version of Hillary.

    TDS goes both ways, those who can’t stand Trump and those who are so blinded by their own ignorance they think he can do no wrong, even when his asinine actions push the USA closer to WWIII.

    Bring the troops home as he promised? The only way those troops get to come home is in a body bag.

    • Agree: renfro
    • Replies: @renfro
  34. Greg Bacon says: • Website
    @Ed Nguen

    Martial Petain.

    An apt description of the lardass boobus Pompeo. Pompeo, like Petain, is a caretaker over an emasculated nation in service to a foreign power. Will Pompeo meet the same fate as Petain and get condemned to death in court, but have the sentence stalled due to his age?

    One thing I can’t understand is why so many Americans chortle and relish the murder of someone 8,000 miles away in a nation that we LIED about to invade and have been lying ever since to stay there.
    Guess I don’t have a homicidal mindset that seems SOP for so many American Christians.

    • Replies: @George F. Held
  35. @cynic

    Where will Trump be able to travel after he leaves office where he is not in danger of arrest at the request of Interpol if Iraq seeks to have him arrested on a murder charge?

    • LOL: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Herald
  36. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ghan-buri-Ghan

    Right, the Chinese Army Chief of Staff publicly stated something like fifteen or twenty years ago (reported by Bill Gertz at the time), that a war with the US was already inevitable and that, although China would surely lose at that time, they would be rapidly building their capability [with money and technology ultimately supplied by the Jews on Wall Street as happened in Bolshevik Russia], expecting an intersection of their ability to beat the US on the battlefield with the crippling moral collapse of the US at home in around the year 2020.

    Today’s kosher msm-manufactured, socio-political civil war brewing in the US is almost prophetic since it’s now 2020, while at the state level states like Virginia are coordinating the disarmament of citizens in preparation for martial law. Fighting a war against Iran at this time will fulfill the first part of the general’s projection, crippling the US so that it cannot sustain anything like a limited war with China in the Pacific and Russia in Europe.

    Once the price of oil goes through the roof to $300 a bbl, the US economy will implode faster than a burst balloon. There’s also a very good chance Pompeo set the President up to take a fall over the scripted, intemperate remarks to destroy the world’s civilizational heritage in Iran in order to cast the President as a madman who should be removed from office in the next election and replaced by Israeli water boy Pence. Pompeo is intimately familiar with this scenario if not its architect, apparently willing to sacrifice America on the altar of a misreading of the Bible.

    • Replies: @Greg Bacon
  37. bjondo says:

    Dress Pompeo and Bolton in orange.
    Throw both over to Iran.

    5ds

    • Replies: @bjondo
  38. @Ed Nguen

    Really now, these selective parallels to history or theology bare no resemblance to the complete idiocracy of modern day events and that complete nincompoop from Kansas. You seem to forget that even President Trump acknowledged that invading Iraq was the biggest foreign policy mistake in American history. This mistake was only compounded by:

    (1) The failure to maintain Iraq’s existing military, rather than recreate the wheel, while the disenfrachised republican guard spent their time in retirement by making IEDs to kill and cripple our sons and daughters, and
    (2) The lack of any plan to take and hold ground. Ever hear of Fallujah?

    The US has only brought pain, suffering, and misery to the region despite Dubyuh’s promise to bring peace and stability to the middle east. General Soleimani didn’t have to build any or alliance to force the US out of the region. We did that to ourselves by launching a war based on lies and deceit. Regrettably, the whole world (including President Trump) knows it.

  39. Anonymous[245] • Disclaimer says:

    Pompeo is an intelligent man but his actions are strongly tainted by his religious beliefs. Those beliefs are essentially Christian Evangelical: support for Israel, the Rapture and all that nonsense. And now he has the ear of the President.

  40. Anon[421] • Disclaimer says:
    @RBY

    I don’t think your statement “he has no business being president of the united state” is accurate.
    Trump was duly elected on the basis of many reasonable campaign promises which involved
    putting “America first.” But there was always that nagging suspicion: he had an undue fixation on Israel, a nation which called adversaries “terrorists” and engaged targeted assassinations.
    The military and intelligence complex has eaten Trump for lunch. And yet the Dems are probably worse.

    • Replies: @RBY
    , @follyofwar
  41. When Pompeo uses the word “imminent” he is not using it in its original meaning but in the context of the Bethlehem Doctrine. A legal opinion by an Israeli lawyer and former advisor to Netanyahoo, David Bethlehem, hired by the British to justify their invasion of Iraq and the pre-emptive extra-judicial killings.

    “Bethlehem argues that for an attack to be ‘imminent’ does not require it to be ‘soon’. Indeed you can kill to avert an ‘imminent attack’ even if you have no information on when and where it will be. You can instead rely on your target’s ‘pattern of behaviour’; that is, if he has attacked before, it is reasonable to assume he will attack again and that such an attack is ‘imminent’.”

    The Bethlehem Doctrine is the formal policy position on assassination of Israel, the U.S. and the U.K. governments.

    This represents the weaponization of law for political purposes, lawfare, which the Israelis and their coreligionists in the U.S. have, not surprisingly, used for years. The Brookings Institute’s Lawfare Group originated the expansive concept of “obstruction of justice” used by the Mueller investigation and debunked by Barr and the DOJ. The same Lawfare Group weaponized the impeachment process and were even formally hired by the Democrats as legal counsels and interrogators.

    Craig Murray’s excellent article on the Bethlehem Doctrine:

    https://consortiumnews.com/2020/01/09/lies-the-bethlehem-doctrine-the-illegal-murder-of-soleimani/

    • Replies: @SolontoCroesus
  42. Truth3 says:

    Pompeo is a complete asshole. Puppet for the Jooz in every way.

    Treason is the only description for the Make Israel Great Again crowd.

    • Agree: snag
  43. Somehow I just can’t get past the feeling this whole thing was just another “made for TV drama” with all parties involved somehow being in cahoots and somehow benefiting. Perhaps a “wag the dog” moment for Trump; A re-kindling of the “hate the Muslim’s” fire in America; The best way to unite the people of Iran under the Ayatollah’s; A way to give Iraq a reason to demand America to get out; And, to keep our beloved Bibi Nutanyahoo deeply involved in Israeli foreign affairs and out of jail.
    Absolutely no proof here, only the ramblings of one who has learned to question the statements/agendas of known liars.

    • Agree: Beefcake the Mighty
    • Replies: @9/11 Inside job
  44. @RBY

    Commenters should not casually throw around the “A” word. If there is anything guaranteed to lead to the annihilation of Iran, even if Iran had nothing to do with it, that would be it. I don’t want 4 more years of Trump any more than you, Mr. Whitney, or most of the other commenters here do, but I, for one, do not wish to see any president assassinated, and I’m not saying that you do either. (This country has never recovered from the assassination of JFK 56 years ago.) Despite Trump’s awful cartoonish rhetoric, I still maintain that a president Pence, an Evangelical clone of Pompeo, would be worse.

    I root for the dissolution of the Empire, which Trump’s incompetence may hasten. His murder would cause the US populace to rally ’round the flag for yet more war. That is the last thing that the world needs.

    • Replies: @RBY
  45. “Iran will have to fight back, and they will fight back. The question is “how”?”

    They can just shoot down a few more airliners full of Iranians and the West will be on its knees!

    Did you happen to notice that your link to Deutsche Welle is labeled as an advertisement? Even they wouldn’t print that without being paid.

  46. RBY says:
    @Anon

    I agree the Dems are probably worse.

  47. @Chet Roman

    In other words, the Bethlehem Doctrine is Rise and Kill First,

    https://www.c-span.org/video/?456776-2/rise-kill-first

    by Ronen German

    the same Jewish writer (aka zionist mouthpiece) who explained to Brian Williams (???) on the occasion of the assassination of an Iranian nuclear scientist that “Israel has used assassination more than any other state — not even Stalin and Hitler . . . to achieve its goals.”

    http://www.nbcnews.com/video/rock-center/46318982

    Rock Center | February 08, 2012

    Assassination wielded as ‘a weapon’
    Israel has long used assassination against its enemies, “hoping that by taking out individuals, they can alter, change the course of history,” says Ronen Bergman, an Israeli commentator and author of “Israel’s Secret War with Iran” and an upcoming book tentatively titled “Mossad and the Art of Assassination.”

    Berman continued (iirc): “If Israel identifies someone as a Hitler, then it is moral to kill him.”

    Chabad teaches a theological (where theo– refers to the genocidal god of the Jews) doctrine around the concept:

    The Jew’s Double Standard By Yanki Tauber [version of Taubman?]
    https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/3220/jewish/The-Jews-Double-Standard.htm

    “The same Torah that tells us that G‑d placed a spark of Himself in every human being, thereby bestowing upon his or her physical existence a G‑dly, infinite worth — that same Torah also tells us that G‑d has granted free choice to every person. Including the choice — and the power — to corrupt his or her G‑d-given vitality and turn it against itself, using it to destroy life.
    A person can choose to turn himself into a murderer — someone who is prepared to destroy life in order to achieve his aims. In which case he is no longer a life, but an anti-life.
    To kill an anti-life is not a life-destroying act, it is a life-preserving act.
    It is not a violation of the commandment “Do not kill,” but its affirmation. Without the law, “If someone is coming to kill you, rise against him and kill him first,” the principle of life’s infinite value is nothing more than an empty slogan, a mere idea.
    Judaism is not an idea. It is a way of life — G‑d’s ideas made real.

    In my opinion, the American people must demand of their legislators that this concept and those who advocate it and practice it, be rooted out of our community, by whatever means necessary.

    Rise and kill first, FIRST.

    • Replies: @renfro
  48. Israel and the zionists which infest the ZUS government call the shots in everything that Trump does and one of his handlers is Kushner, Pompeo is just another zionist messenger for the Rothschilds ie the real power behind the throne.

    Israel is going to get its war with Iran and Russia , it is just a matter of time, and pull the ZUS into the kosher butcher shop in the mideast.

    See the book By Way of Deception by former Mossad agent Victor Ostrovsky.

  49. Iran tried to do what US does.
    And that is a big NO NO ( See Peter Sellers in Revenge of the Pink Panther .

  50. @Anon

    Sadly, Trump has always had a fixation on Iran also. He campaigned on tearing up the Iran deal, saying it was the worst deal ever negotiated, yet never attempted to explain what was so bad about it. From the start, I suspected that, if his name was on it instead of Obama’s, he would have praised it to high heavens.

    I was willing to overlook his obsession with Iran because Trump wasn’t Hillary. She would have been worse in many ways, but it is doubtful if she would have abrogated Obama’s only significant foreign policy achievement.

    • Agree: Old and grumpy
    • Replies: @anastasia
    , @anonymous
  51. An excellent article with photograph and NY Times sourcing. It seem to elevate the porcine Pompeo to the Rasputin role of Trump’s new Cheney. Commenters have quickly deduced the man’s sinister motives: He’s either just the latest in an opportunistic procession of venal politicians hot on the well-trodden trail of ever bigger Benjamins or he is a perhaps treasonous evangelical Israel-Firster yearning to fulfill some obscure biblical prophesy on a global scale. What does Pompeo the strategist really want? And will he be content to remain just the second man in our new Rome?

    Pompeo is obviously a lot smarter than the average bear, and not without charisma. Graduated at the top of his West Point class of 1986, he notched a juris doctor from Harvard before entering Congress. Posts as Trump’s CIA director and State Department boss followed in quick successsion. He has also gathered about him an admiring clique of lesser West Pointers who occupy key posts in the Trump administration. And suddenly he emerges here in print as the principal architect of Trump’s unorthoodox militaristic strategy. Clearly, Pompeo is armed with a vision and a plan.

    War is but a subspecies of politics, wrote Clausewitz. No philosopher, Pompeo may wish to reverse that order of primacy. His formative military schooling and five years in the peacetime officer corps could have persuaded him that the cult of Mars trumps the art of politics. After all, the ideal role models for every seriously ambitious cadet once stared down at Pompeo daily from West Point’s gigantic mess-hall mural depicting the Great Captains of history, each at his moment of triumph. Certainly the young Pompeo must also have dreamed of carving out his own place beside Alexander and Charles Martel in that glorious pantheon of conquerers.

    Destiny has smiled on Pompeo. He now finds himself in the exactly right place and at the right time to make history. U.S. society has scarcely ever been so deeply divided against itself and about its own elected president, powerful foreign foes seem to hurl insolent challenges, even sullen allied client states talk of mutiny. The long American era of world domination has never before seemed so fragile and threatened by deadly geopolitical uncertainty. If the political arts of bribery and diplomacy no longer bear their predictable fruit, Michael Pompeo may have concluded the time is propitious for total war, winner take all. In that case, as another West Pointer, the near-deified Gen. MacArthur, once reminded a mess hall full of enraptured West Point cadets, “there is no substitute for victory”.

    It’s crucial to know whether Pompeo, the man of action, is now committed primarily to his alma mater’s hallowed credo of duty, honor, country or whether his current martial vision at the hub of empire may be clouded by quasi-religious beliefs or some quirky political ideology. Nevertheless, this Pompeo the Great is ambitious. And as we know, “Such men are dangerous.”

    • Replies: @gsjackson
  52. @Johnny Walker Read

    Agree that this could possibly be another “made for TV drama ” with all sides benefiting . The UK’s Daily Mail, the mouthpiece of the British deep state , just published a picture of Soleimani’s wallet which somehow survived the missile strike and having previously published a picture of his hand with ring and finger attached – how convenient . It’s the same MO as the 9/11 psyop where conveniently the passport of an alleged hijacker showed up “just blocks from the WTC crash site” per CNN.

    • Replies: @Johnny Walker Read
  53. Pompeo, the neocons, Netanyahu, et al. are repulsive beyond belief, no question. But right now, Trump and Iran are reading from a script, nothing else makes any sense.

  54. MLK says:

    Donald Trump is under the illusion that the fracas with Iran is over.

    The President has never said anything even suggesting this is his thinking. Which is why you don’t even attempt to substantiate this middle school social studies class, assertion. That you opened your piece with this is embarrassing beyond belief. I say this as someone who has read your writing for years and taken you seriously.

    I wonder if Trump has any idea of what he’s done?

    Then you should have gotten some more sleep and perhaps consulted some adults about your confusion. It’s impossible to overstate your confusion. Trump ain’t just some guy, he’s the POTUS. I can’t believe I have to point this out to someone over the age of eight.

    No country can allow its military leaders to be killed with impunity. Iran will have to fight back. . .

    You set up the straw man and then knocked it down. Good for you! All that this conventional wisdom achieves is disparaging the Iranian leadership by implication. Sovereign states, at least those with a sober, non-self-destructive, command structure, don’t collectively think the way you believe they do. It certainly wasn’t the way Putin/Russia responded when Turkey shot down a Russian fighter jet, to cite just one example of recent vintage.

    Soleimani was commanding that “perfected” regional force when he was killed along with his Iraqi militia proxies, planning to attack and take hostage American embassy personnel. That made him a legitimate, defensive target.

    . . . hybrid, 4th Generation unconventional warfare conducted via Iran’s proxies in Syria, Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan and Lebanon. They will forgo using their bulging arsenal of long-range ballistic missiles and, instead, implement an asymmetrical strategy . . .

    Uh huh. Trump has brilliantly neutralized this longstanding Iranian tactic. The USG immediately took credit for the drone strikes; and Trump personally announced the 52 targets already selected, including “culture.” Of course, everyone and his sister blew a gasket, labeling any such action a war crime. Even though he’s done it before, because it makes his critics feel bad about themselves, no one will concede that he quickly achieved his objective of getting the Iranian government on record that much of its asymmetrical strategy is verboten under international law, and this POTUS was going to hold Iran accountable for any attacks it carried out using cut-outs and proxies.

    Today Iran conceded that it was responsible for shooting down the Ukrainian commercial jet.

    That is the context in which the Iranian leadership has to decide how to proceed.

    Even the Iranian government repeatedly conceded publicly before the Soleimani strike that POTUS Trump didn’t want war with Iran. If the President’s critics listened to him more, you would know that he is well aware of the dire position Maximum Pressure has put Iran. He isn’t pursuing regime change, and I’m confident he’s aware of the Japan before green lighting the Pearl Harbor attack danger of pushing Iran’s economic situation too far, wherein it concludes it must lash out.

    Indeed, that is the common sense explanation for these recent events. For the seizure of American Embassy hostages, in a replay of what sunk Carter’s reelection is so obviously a game changer solution to both Iran’s and the Democrats problems, you have to be some kind of an idiot to speak of “no hard evidence” or “proof there was an “imminent threat.”

    Now, Democrats and people like you, have effectively abandoned Iran, for whom you profess concern. I’m sorry, but it is so obviously not in Iran’s interest for the USG to detail what operations it believes it was planning. It won’t help both parties to use this as a turning point.

    • Agree: Ozymandias
    • Replies: @MLK
  55. (Zigh) What a simpleton title is Whitney’s article.

    How can a duper Secretary of State “dupe” a completely zionized Commander in Chief? 😦

  56. RBY says:
    @follyofwar

    Being a 1st year college student at the time JFK was murdered and then having been thrown into Nam, Jan 1969(against my will) I’m fully aware of what happens when a state head is murdered. I’m not advocating Trump be assassinated. I am saying, live by the sword….could easily die by the sword….seems the path he is setting for himself. Trump berates anyone and everyone who calls him on the carpet. I’ll not vote in the coming Pres election….Dem’s are no better…..looks as though the dissolution of the Empire is close….and is anyone’s guess what then happens….

  57. @Anonymous

    The IRA was the one that really started getting politicians sweating. The Brighton Hotel bombing and the IRA mortar attack on Downing street are two notable events which lead to an upping of security for politicians. The IRA were also the reason why there are no longer any bins at major train stations, as they could be used to hide explosive devices. The mass immigration of Muslims and subsequent regime-change wars just kept up the neccessity for security even after the IRA faded into memory. It is now likely the threat from White Nationalist terror is also growing with the murder of Jo Cox and also the murder of Walter Lubcke in Germany.

    Ultimately they have brought this upon theirselves. I was reading Max Hastings; Catastrophe 1914: Europe Goes to War and there was a little anecdote about Asquith giving a little boy a lift home in his car, when the PM was on the way back from his country retreat to Downing Street. How times change.

  58. Hbm says:

    I still bet that my hunch that Israel killed Soleimani without US permission is correct. Soleimani was invited to talks, by Washington, just as Iran claimed. But he wasn’t betrayed because the US didn’t kill him.

    Where is the drone footage? We usually see it for actions featuring even less important targets.

    Answer: Tel Aviv, which is why we haven’t seen it.

    It explains the obvious impotent theater of the Iranian retaliation. It explains Netanyahu distancing Israel from the alleged US action.

    And this recent story about America trying but failing to kill some guy in Yemen on the same day is disinformation to buttress the original lie, so more cover for Israel.

  59. anon[238] • Disclaimer says:

    You assume, like other ‘Unz tigers’, three things: that Iran’s leaders thirst to revenge Soleimani in the short term (months), to openly best the USA in the intermediate term (years), and are capable of both. All three assumptions are wrong.

    Right now, Iran looks exactly like the second-world, mid-IQ nation it is: a revered leader was openly assassinated on the world stage, and hundreds of precious (check out Iran’s fertility) young Iranian lives were snuffed out in the twin stupidities of a stampede and an impulsive missile strike. Not exactly what they need if they wish to continue the rise of a modernized Persian Empire to dominate the region, a trend that has favored them overall since at least 2003.

    If they were so impetuously thirsty for violent revenge, why would they strike a few acres of tarmac?

    Iran’s leaders have taken a page from Trump himself. They know very well that revenge is best served cold, perhaps so cold it does not even taste like revenge. In their context that means escaping the economically crippling effects of sanctions, modernizing their engineering and cooling their hotheads. Testing the accuracy of their missiles in a hot situation is the one positive thing they have accomplished in the last week (verdict: not bad but could be better – one thing I bet they are thirsty for is testing one of their cruise missiles in hot circumstances).

    In regard to cooling their hotheads, it is quite clear that some faction within Iran does not miss what Soleimani represents at all; may even have conspired on the hit. That faction is playing the long term (decades), because that has worked well for them so far.

  60. MarkinLA says:
    @Derer

    We owe the Saudi’s for keeping oil priced in dollars which is the main reason the dollar is the world’s reserve currency. It is hard to back out of our mutual interests now.

    • Replies: @Greg Bacon
  61. nsa says:

    Anyone else notice the similarity between the crypto JooTV porkers, Pompberg and Trumpstein, and the allegorical Squealor and Napolean? Another example of life (reality TV) mimicking art? And who could possibly represent Boxer and Clover…….the forever gullible gentile American public?

  62. @9/11 Inside job

    I always loved the “magical passports”, If I remember correctly there was one found at Shanksville and one in NYC.

    • Replies: @Desert Fox
    , @NoseytheDuke
  63. Z-man says:

    I would agree with the assumption of the headline “Did Pompeo Dupe Trump Into the Soleimani Hit??” Just look at the shit eating grin/ zealot look on Pompeo’s lard face. The meat head is a Christian Zionist, which is very dangerous when one is also Sec. of State. He should be removed with extreme prejudice.

  64. “Did Pompeo Dupe Trump Into the Soleimani Hit?”

    It does seem to me an almost meaningless question.

    Although Trump and Pompeo come at the topic of Israel from slightly different perspectives – Pompeo really being almost an Evangelical and Trump an a rather irreligious figure – they both are dedicated to its service. Absolutely dedicated.

    I do not see how that could be any clearer.

    And I do think the assassination was manipulated by Israel.

  65. Wally says:
    @Achilles Wannabe

    Note that agenda driven Marxist Whitney says nothing of Obama’s numerous & “monstrous” drone attacks.

    Whitney says nothing of wannabe-President Hillary Clinton’s “monstrous” desire for war with Russia.

    • Replies: @bluedog
  66. @IvyMike

    There is nothing marginal about Pompeo’s psychopathic condition. Some defective humans have an irresistible impulse to dominate wedded to a total lack of empathy. Pompeo is a monster in human form. John Wayne Gacy as Secretary of State.

    Look at him. I mean ***really look at him*** & evaluate his demeanor and ***the way*** he lies. He knows the words he has to say to get the result he wants and he just says them. There is not the slightest shred of concern for truthfulness, nor the slightest shame at lying. No conscience at all. He manifests a total lack of what a ***normal*** human being would consider an ethical center.

    I’ve been a Trump supporter — drain the swamp, get us out of stupid wars, etc — but if he doesn’t promptly fire Pompeo & pull out of Iraq & Syria, no frikkin way he gets my vote in 2020.

    • Replies: @Wally
  67. mp says:

    When events looked like they were getting out of control, Bibi started to walk it back, telling anyone who would listen that Israel had no dog in the fight, and that it was strictly a US-Iran thing. That fact should have been enough to convince even the most rabid Zio supporter that Israel is NOT our greatest ally. Demonstrating that Jews are basically cowards who won’t accept any responsibility for their behavior, and instead do the ‘hide and whine’ when things get tough.

    It should have been enough to convince, but unfortunately most Zionist supporting Americans, and that’s a lot of them, are too stupid to ever figure it out.

  68. Z-man says:
    @cynic

    People have already pointed out that Trump and his generals looked scared at his recent media appearance. Those men are probably calculating their retirement pay and their chances of living to enjoy much of it. No low level troops were killed, but vengeance may be coming to the men at the top.

    LOL, did you see the look on Milley’s face, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs? Besides being a humorless sort his face is saying ‘why didn’t I just stay a colonel.’ ROFL!!!

    • Troll: Momus
    • Replies: @cynic
  69. ΑΖ says:

    Listen to what this zio-protestant says:

    We cheat, we lie, we steal !!!!!

    I have just to add then: Congratulations Mr Pompeo.

  70. Greg Bacon says: • Website
    @Anonymous

    Today’s kosher msm-manufactured, socio-political civil war brewing in the US is almost prophetic since it’s now 2020,

    Amen to that. A certain group who thinks they’ve been Chosen by a G-d they created are now behind most of this LGBTQ madness sweeping the nation, which will wind up in civil war.

    Our kids get taught in grade school about the alleged joys of homosexual sex and their inquiring minds will experiment.
    That same group is also behind the gender madness, turning science on its head and making/forcing Americans to believe that one can change their sex, which is bioilogically impossible, but many are buying this BS.
    It’s even being taught to our troops.

    This is straight out of the Commie 101 handbook for subverting nations from within. If you think it’s bad now, if these maniacs stay in power, 2020 will be remembered as the Good Ol’ Days.

  71. @Johnny Walker Read

    In the book By Way of Deception, Victor Ostrovsky tells how the Mossad manufactures passports for any country for any project, just business.

  72. @MarkinLA

    It is hard to back out of our mutual interests now.

    If all America has left to offer the world is getting in bed with the KSA head-choppers, then our democratic republic has failed.

  73. Trump has betrayed his base on everything. The only reason to support him is because he is keeping the (((Deep State))) busy fighting him.

    • Replies: @Desert Fox
  74. DaveE says:

    This whole thing is looking too much like a well-oiled machine doing exactly what it was designed to do……. start another war for The Chosen Ones.

    Now that the whole world is expecting Iran to retaliate, even though that would be suicidal for Iran, what could be better cover for Israel to launch 9/11 – The Sequel, blaming Iran?

    Yep, Trump is in on it, just like Bush Jr. was in on the original 9/11. Clearly, Pompous fat ass “Christian” Pompeo is even more Armageddon-lusting than Trump.

    Calling our zionist-infested government the Scum of the Earth is an insult to scum, not to mention our flying blue marble planet. Scum of Hell is more like it.

    • Agree: Desert Fox
  75. Another layer to the psyop. LOL
    Psyop Alert: Here’s the Truth About the Arrested “Iranian Terrorist” in Palm Beach, Florida
    http://itnt.news/916/

  76. and the Caspian Sea

    Ahh, DW “analysts” need to get back on their meds and start learning about the judicial state of the Caspian Sea and who can shut down it for anyone in less than 24 hours. I don’t know where those people get their ideas about Iran doing something to SLOC in the Caspian Sea. In fact, I am completely flabbergasted.

    • Replies: @Sergey Krieger
  77. Tlotsi says:
    @sally

    You’d feel better with Chinese government back doors?

    • Replies: @Herald
  78. Does it matter who duped who? A person who considers mafia-style assassination of a foreign official a viable option is a criminal. The existence of accomplices before and after the fact does not change criminal nature of the act and does not reduce the responsibility of the perpetrator.

    • Agree: Cloak And Dagger
    • Replies: @onebornfree
  79. @Roberto Masioni

    Trump is a member of the deep state, it is all a charade, deception, for the satanic zionists who rule the ZUS.

  80. DFC says:

    I think Trump & clan do not know how weak is the position of the US armed forces in the ME, they should have prepared better before strike Soleimani. Save the use of nukes, Iran have the good cards

    I have been wargaming in the case of an all-out war between Iran + PMU vs US, so if I were the Iranian Chieff of Staff I would impose the following strategy (script), for the best possible use of resources and forces at hand:

    1) The absolutely first priority of Allies (Iran & PMU) should be the US air bases, specifically to deny US the use of their air bases in the Middle East for their jets as much as possible, making them depending of long range bombers (which they have in much less numbers) and cruise missiles (long range bomber and cruise missiles fired from far away cannot give close air support to the surrounded bases and troops).

    2) Other critical strategy for the Allies(I&PMU) is to maintain far away the Carrier Strikes Groups, using some shots of long range ballistics and cruise missiles (Soumar&others) to maintain them far enough from the Iranian shores. If the CSG’s are more than 2.000Km away from Iran in the Indian Ocean, the distances between the CSG’s and the west part of Iran, where the main Allied Missile Forces are allocated, will be around 3.600Km or more, so out of range of the Tomahawks missiles (1.700 Km), so only the US subs could fire them approaching the Iranian coast, but may be the Allies could have some surprises for them (in the form of mines or destroyers). The US could try to put the CSG’s in the Mediterranean Sea to strike the West of Iran, but they could be targeted also by the Allies, and the ruskies in Syria will not be glad to have some hundreds Tomahawks flying above their heads. Not easy.

    3) To deny the use of the air bases with the better use of resources the Allies have to make a division of labour:
    a. The air bases in Iraq will be attacked almost exclusively by the PMU using a hell of MLRS and mortars. The first step is to cut all road supplies to the bases (gasoline is the most fundamental material to be cut).
    b. In Iraq the first priorities of the barrages of rockets and mortars should be the fuel storages, second the airstrips (to prevent jets from landing and taking-off), third the ammo storages, and fourth the command and communication areas. The estimation of the number of rockets Iran has is in the range of 5 digits (only the estimation for Hezbollah is 100.000 and Iran is much stronger oponent)
    c. The barrages must be “Hezbollah style”, massive and almost non-stop, to prevent them repairing of the airstrips to be used again by the jets. The PMU have to assume they will have many casualties, but it is a war. The commander in the US bases have to choice if the maintenance teams will be exposed to the barrages to repair the airstrips, or remain in the shelters but then the jets cannot use the base. If the PMU are resolute, any jet will land or take-off.
    d. To combat the helicopters the Allied need to have in Iraq many thousands on MANPAD, and to prevent the rescue teams of the US to rescue some “Blackhawk Down”, they will use the Hezbollah tactics: modern tandem warhead ATGM’s, modern tandem warhead RPG, modern anti-material rifles and modern MANPAD, they should have now in the thousands in Iraq. After some good ambushes the US bases will not rescue anybody and remain locked in their bases trying to survive under the barrages and asking to be airlifted from the hell in helicopters, of course under the fire (by rockets, mortar and MANPAD when in air).
    e. Just in case the rockets of the PMU are not enough, Iran could lob in to the more close US base the heavy unguided rockets they have: Fajr-3, Fajr-5, Zelzal 1-2-3 (600mm diameter)

    4) For the air base in Kuwait (Ali Al Salem), the distance to Iraq is 62Km and to Iran 117Km, so is close enough to be targeted again by heavy rocket artillery (not by mortar or small rockets) to repeat the same strategy than the case of Iraq, in this case the Allied cannot cut the road supplies and they have to shot from longer distances, so the degrading process will take much longer to put the base out of service, in this case the heavy Fajr-5, Zelzal 2 and 3 artillery rockets will be the weapons of choice to destroy the airstrips and fuel storages, probably some help for more accurate missiles will be required (they have many many thousands of un-guided missiles but much less guided, so the priority will be to use the un-guided, the war could last longtime).

    5) For the US air bases in the Southern shores of the Persian Gulf the task to KO them will be exclusively for Iran, and they have to use the Zelzal-3 MLRS to smash the airstrips and above all the guided missiles, again to strike in the first priority the fuel storages, second command and control centers, third ammo storages, fourth hangars and spare parts storage. The distances of the US bases are in the range of the heavy rockets of Iran (Zelzal-3 and Fajr-5C, etc…): Al Udeid is at 265Km from Iran, Saikh Isa at 240Km and Al Dhafra at 245Km, somebody did not thought some 50 years ago that these bases could be used to confront Iran, which is just in front of them all along the coast. All of them will burn.

    6) For the air bases in Jordan and Turkey, the long range missiles should be used, but the distance, again, matter a lot, the airplanes cannot be too much time in the Iraqi and much less in the Iranian airspace (to refuel) and they need, before attack the Iranian soil, to take down the Iranian air defenses, but probably they have not enough fire power to do that, and also the political resistances from Turkey and in less degree Jordan could be quit hard to avoid. Erdogan could decide to not allow more attacks to the Allies from Incirlik, and them the war is over for the US (at least the conventional war…).

    7) Secondary targets will be the ships in the Persian Gulf, above all that armed with Tomahawks (frigates and destroyers) that can shot to Iran, attacked by supersonic missiles (that Iran has in large amounts). On the other hand the USN in the Persian Gulf it is expected they will run out of missiles quickly and without re-supply they cannot continue fighting, but if you cannot land a single big transport plane, because all the airstrips are damaged, and you cannot have a ship passing the Strait of Hormuz, how in the hell could you re-supply your troops and maintain them fighting to a more numerous and close to his land enemy?

    In this strategy is very important the Allies focus in the air bases, and not deviate to attack other perceived as “good” targets (“normal” military bases, naval bases, oil refineries, oil platforms, Israel, etc…) even if US destroy the oil refineries of Iran. The Allied should avoid the error of Hitler in the Battle of England when after Churchill ordered the RAF to bomb Hamburg, the Lufwaffe started to bomb the English cities when they were wining attacking only the British air bases. The Lufwaffe lost the Battle of England because they forget the strategic priority targets and focus in other political and tactic targets.

    The US has started the chess game in a very poor position, with the pawns and horses deployed too forward in the chessboard, and the USA military leadership are in a very bad situation, if they try to send massive troops and equipment reinforcement Iran will not sit iddle waiting how US is preparing to destroy them as the stupid Saddam did in 1991 and again in 2003, no, Iran will start the war with any pretext before new troops & equipment is deployed in significant amounts.
    On the other hand, if Iran escalate, the CENTCOM cannot support the “lost” garrison in Iraq and Kuwait, they do not have enough forces deployed in the theater, and a rotor-airlift operation of this magnitude under fire is very dangerous and a road ride through hundreds of miles through hostile terrain under harassment from Iranians and PMU troops “Hezbollah style” (as IDF suffer in 2006), and without heavy armored escort and close air support will be almost suicidal.

    Iranian have been preparing for a war with USA from 1979, but now the situation is better than ever, I do not give a cent on USA now if they do not retreat quickly from Syria and Iraq (if Trump is enough intelligent it will order soon, but I am afraid he wants to play poker once more), and stop to make threats and provocations.
    But they “cannot” retreat, you know, is an electoral year and Trump want to be re-elected above all.

    Checkmate!

    • LOL: Momus
  81. jsigur says:

    I love how Trump supporters try and imagine that what they do is the fault of some compromised ad visor. It was Trump who hired on the compromised adviser which then makes us assume Trump is compromised.
    Don’t expect to find an answer on the left-right dynamic dominating our politics. They are both sold out. This was why Hitler didn’t seek to join established parties in 1920 but started his own

  82. scrub says:

    A name that hasn’t been mentioned is that of Trump son in law Jared Kushner who sees his father in law on a daily (or maybe even hourly) basis. This is far more contact than Pompeo had. There is no way this attack could have taken place without Kushner’s (probably enthusiastic) approval. None.

    If the now vulnerable Netanyahu had desired this assassination (which he most certainly did if for no other t reason than to divert attention away from his present criminal indictment), the idea would have been conveyed to Trump either directly or covertly through Kushner, not Pompeo.

    The unfortunate thing is that as Trump becomes more and more isolated, embattled, paranoid and impulsive, a rabid support of Israel (and genuine security risk) like Kushner seems to only increase his influence over our naive and hapless president.

    The NYT article might have only been written to divert attention away from its true architect. Kushner is now is now able to slip back into the shadows while Pompeo get the blame.

    • Replies: @renfro
    , @Achilles Wannabe
  83. @Johnny Rico

    Those of us, old enough to be politically aware at the time of the First Gulf War, were also aware of Victor Ostrovsky’s book By Way Of Deception
    https://www.amazon.com/Victor-Ostrovsky/e/B000APKS9I%3Fref=dbs_a_mng_rwt_scns_share

    His follow-up provided more detail on how Mossad operates in the ME. Even the Zionized US Military had concluded, prior to 9/11 that Israel had the capability of attacking and placing the blame on Arabs.
    https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2001/sep/10/20010910-025319-6906r/

    Michael Collins Piper produced a list of Mossad attacks: https://rense.com/general50/blame.htm
    and there was a strong possibility one of the “bombers” of the WTC in 1993, which the FBI allowed to happen, was recruited by Mossad.
    http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/mossad_wtc.html

    Although they originally denied it, Israel assassinated Gerald Bull in Brussels, for building a “super gun” for Iraq. When Ariel Sharon was indicted for war crimes, the witnesses were liquidated. Israel has never followed international law, and along with the US, routinely break it. Their objective, for over a century has been Eretz Israel – from the Nile to the Euphrates. The methods to obtain it have changed, the objective hasn’t.
    https://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/5324815

    • Replies: @Johnny Rico
  84. Omegabooks [AKA "Anon"] says:

    I hope and pray that some day Christian Zionists who support this Pompeo-esque notion of going to war against Iran on behalf of Israel which is too cowardly to do it themselves (800 gentile slaves per Jew and all that…they can’t fight their own battles because they have the US–the 800 gentile slaves per Jew–to do it for them!) because it’ll bring about their bogus “rapture” repent of this nonsense. So the murders of millions of innocents (including their sons and daughters as well) to bring about the “second coming” of Christ (they do know the anti-Christ comes first, right?) is going to sit well with the Christ they claim to believe in?

    And Christian Zionism actually began as a noble cause–to try to convert Jews to Jesus. Well how’s that working out for ya? Seems to me Jews are converting these Christian Zionists to Judaism! The Talmud, the most anti-Christ book out there! (Tractate Gitten 57–Christ is burning in Hell for eternity in his own hot excrement)

    • Agree: Old and grumpy
    • Replies: @Herald
  85. @freedom-cat

    Though I agree with your intentions, I do not believe that Iran will be targeting innocent civilians. So far this has not shown to be a tactical doctrine of theirs…

    Besides, why roil the pot with innocent deaths when it is the US military that is the target?

    • Replies: @freedom-cat
  86. @Greg Bacon

    Any analogy between Petain and Pompeo is completely bogus. General Petain was in charge of a defeated country. He and nearly all the other Frenchmen cooperated with the Germans because they had to. The Germans moreover treated their defeated foes as honorably and decently as they could. Petain was a good and brave man. Pompeo is a POS and a cowardly traitor. He works for our enemies, the Jews, not because he has to but because he enjoys power and evildoing.

    • Agree: ChuckOrloski
  87. MLK says:
    @MLK

    Hey ‘Beefcake the Mighty,’ you rather obviously don’t know what a troll is. What kind of an idiot, whether he agrees with me or not, adjudges my comment as trivial, off-topic, and intended to distract from the topic at hand?

    By the way — and I bet I’m not the only commenter who receives this middle schooler response thusly: I take it as a sure sign that my argument consternates those like yourself who are incapable of responding intelligently.

    Yet and still, I will be beneficent toward you: Ask yourself what you would do if you were the POTUS under the totality of these circumstances. Would you, like Whitney, apparently, declare these risks to American personnel “not proven,” and wait to see what happened?

    • Troll: Beefcake the Mighty
    • Replies: @cassandra
  88. Amanda says:

    Totally agree with everything you said!!

    Also, the US has been at war for 222 years, and the list of all of them is here:

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/america-has-been-at-war-93-of-the-time-222-out-of-239-years-since-1776/5565946

  89. padre says:
    @lloyd

    It is not just revenge, if they get over it, that means that they are willing to get over everything the USA does to them!

  90. anonymous[582] • Disclaimer says:
    @Derer

    Furthermore, US friend Saudi Arabia is the biggest financier of Muslims terrorism worldwide

    What “Muslims terrorism”?!

    You say, “US friend Saudi Arabia.” I say US’ lickspittle Saudi Regime.

    The Holy Quran, The Book of Islam, says;

    O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies [those of the Islamophobic kind]. They are [in fact] allies of one another [doesn’t current reality prove this?]. And whoever is an ally to them among you – then indeed, he is [one] of them [Saudi regime]. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people. Holy Quran 5:51

    Are those who are the lickspittle and mercenaries of the worst enemy of True Monotheism, namely AmeriKKKa, “Muslims”?

  91. @Desert Fox

    Ostrovsky means man from the island.

    • Replies: @Desert Fox
  92. gsjackson says:
    @St-Germain

    Well, Pompeo certainly doesn’t have that lean and hungry look, so maybe he isn’t so dangerous … to us. If it’s a war he’s commanding, maybe we can hold out hope that it’s against nefarious international deep state, and not simply anyone who poses an obstacle to Israel’s designs.

  93. Herald says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Much as I would love to see Trump face trial for murder, I tend to the view that an avenging sniper’s bullet would likely be the main danger, with or without the generous reward on offer.

    Those that want war with Iran, might see the killing of Trump as the ideal (false flag) event, which would then give them the middle eastern conflagration that they so crave.

    Hopefully from now on, Trump won’t be resting that easy or sleeping too soundly ever again.

  94. At some point can we retire the notion Trump is a hostage to his administration? He not only hired Pompeo as CIA chief, but Trump gave him a promotion to Secretary of State. However if Trump, Pence, and Pelosi get snuffed out I will concede Pompeo is the bigly mastermind of our stable genius.

  95. Good article Mike. It clearly draws the picture of another neo-con’s plot pushing idiot president to create a disaster in oil rich region that certain industries can take advantage of. The answer might be that we should continue to separate ourselves from that energy source and those industries.

  96. anonymous[582] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ghan-buri-Ghan

    Why? Because the USA is inevitably set for destruction. A society of multiracial, feminized, purposeless, and degenerate people cannot survive.

    What does “society of multiracial” have to do with AmeriKKKa’s evil?

    Most of the evil elite in control of the Great Satan –except for a few “house-ni88as”… Powell, Condi, Obama– responsible for spreading much suffering, destruction and death around the world are whitrash mofers. It has always been that way. Heck, this essay focuses on one such minion of the accursed Satan himself. Does he look multiracial to you?

    The more your kind try to obfuscate such facts, the rot continues to deepen, which of course totally works for me. I hope and pray this rot has reached a point-of-no-return for the most evil entity mankind has witnessed. God willing.

  97. Is it remotely possible the Iranian leadership wanted the general killed in order to shore up its lagging popularity using a back channel? I wouldn’t put it past the crafty old ayatollahs who know the religiosity of the Iranian public is so deep that they will accept anything out of Qom hook, line and sinker.

    • Replies: @freedom-cat
    , @Herald
  98. onebornfree says: • Website
    @AnonFromTN

    AnonFromTN says: ” Does it matter who duped who? A person who considers mafia-style assassination of a foreign official a viable option is a criminal. ”

    Then there’s this : “Under Donald Trump, drone strikes far exceed Obama’s numbers”:

    “This administration has not only surpassed the previous one’s drone strike volume overseas, it has made the drone wars even more secretive, if that’s possible.”
    https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/2019/5/8/18619206/under-donald-trump-drone-strikes-far-exceed-obama-s-numbers

    And so it goes…….

    Regards,onebornfree

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  99. All of the conjecture about who specifically is the sellout is absurd.

    ALL of them are sellouts, shabbos goy sellouts, and neocon jews doing the jewing that you would expect neocon jews to do.

    And Trump hired them all.

    Face it, we are screwed. Our votes do not matter.

    Jewing on the left of me, jewing on the right, here I am, stuck in the middle with jews.

    • Replies: @ChuckOrloski
  100. @Steve Naidamast

    It won’t necessarily be Iran. Could be a lone wolf terrorist or a gang of them, taking out their anger on innocent people, anyplace in the world. Low impulse control and emotionalism are apparently characteristics of less intelligent people who tend to remain at the bottom of the economic pool according to many of the articles on this site; those are the people I’m talking about. Although Trump and Pompeo appear to be an exception to that rule.

  101. Sometimes, you just gotta laugh at the state of US politics.

  102. anastasia says:

    Well, Pompeo could have duped him into it. In late 2015, Trump was asked about Soleimani, and he acted as if he did not know who it was, and when he learned who he was, he referred to him as an Arab.

    How can Trump make his own decisions when his knowledge is so sorely lacking, and there is no way he can, without the influence of his advisers, get himself up to speed. He doesn’t like to read. He skims, which tells me he does not even have the chance of scrutinizing what his advisers report to him. On top of that, he is surrounded by neocons, making them his closest advisers. It’s truly a lost cause.

    This assassination is completely repugnant. The bombing of Syria 24 hours after the so-called chemical attack, without an investigation, was repugnant. His telling the Syrian people one week before they bombed Syria, “the bombs are coming” is probably one of the most callous and sickest things I ever heard. I cannot imagine what I would be thinking if I heard Putin say, “the bombs are coming.”

    I read about the Kennedy Administration and about the heinous and criminal proposals that were being made to that President by his Pentagon and the security agencies. At least that President had the presence of mind to respond – – “And they call us human beings.”

    Trump doesn’t have what Kennedy had – a sufficient working conscience to even have a heart felt reaction to such proposals.

    In my opinion, it really doesn’t matter who is in that office. If you combed through all that has happened in the last 20 years, it has been a slow escalation toward war. There is no way this relationship is going to get better. And it’s a shame. I see nothing wrong with these Iranians, and I am not even disturbed in the least by their religious in the seats of power. They sound reasonable to me. And it is clear enough, they are alot smarter.

  103. sally says:
    @sally

    @ Tlotsi both governments, are franchise holders in the global nation state system. Neither is a democratic government, both operate behind closed doors, both spy on their citizens, both use rule of law to create and to vest monopoly powers in their investors (as in a feudal system), both have large armies in foreign lands, both punish whistle blowers, and neither serves the interest of its domestic governed; instead the leaders in these two governments represent the interest of global investors, bankers, money lenders and manufacturers and such leaders use their governmental powers to hold the governed still while these non human interest rape them.

    I would prefer a democratic government, one with equal rights for all and a system of government that refuses to abuse or infringe human rights. Wouldn’t you?

  104. @Ilyana_Rozumova

    I have the book and am rereading it for the second time and probably will have to reread it 3 or 4 times to digest all the information in this book, the main conclusion I have come to that the government of Israel is a criminal state just like the ZUS.

  105. anastasia says:
    @follyofwar

    Yeah, Trump did explain what was so bad about the deal. He complained bitterly about it and often.
    He complained about the money that was given them, and nothing else.

    That is why it made absolutely no sense for him to back out of the deal. We already fulfilled our part – we gave them the money. The only performance left on the contract was Iran’s performance. Trump had to know that by backing out of the deal, he wasn’t going to get the money back. So why would he do it?

    Sanctions. He wanted to reimpose the sanctions, so the escalation toward their planned war would continue.

    And can you really call it a war? Our men are certainly not going to fight. They are going to do what they did in Iraq and in Syria – bomb – They are going to bomb another country to smithereens, a country with an ancient culture with buildings and artifacts that are beyond belief precious to anyone who wants to have any sense of identity about who they are and about where they came from. In Syria, churches built 100 years after Christ were bombed and have disappeared….forever. But that’s nothing when we contemplate on the hundreds of thousands who will again lose their lives.

    • Agree: follyofwar
    • Replies: @renfro
    , @Tucker
  106. Rurik says:

    WTF

    Under pressure, Iran admits it shot down jetliner by mistake

    https://apnews.com/21f4a92a2dfbc38581719664bdf6f38e

    This changes everything.

    I really don’t have time today, to post, but I was occasionally checking in at Unz just to confirm this disastrous news, and get some reactions, but there’s nothing here on Unz about this game-changing development.

    So now it seems that the Iranian regime (yes, regime), are nothing more than a den of lying, perfidious, dangerously incompetent cunts.

    If Israel hacked their defenses, then say so! And if they’re too cowardly to admit incompetence, then they deserve to suffer the condemnation of the entire world, including their former allies in the West, and especially by the Iranian people, who must now demand their ouster.

    I was certain Iran was telling the truth, because I equated the Iranian shooting down the jet, with Assad’s “chemical attacks” on his own people, on the day inspectors were arriving in Syria to investigate chemical attacks.

    It would be too stupid to comprehend such an act, and I felt the same way about Iran shooting down its own airliner.

    OK, so it was incompetence, but they lied about it.

    And destroyed any semblance of credibility.

    Now they must go, and this also bolsters Trump’s demand that they never be allowed to possess nuclear weapons, because they can’t be trusted to use surface to air missiles without shooting down their own airliners !

    I’m having an existential crisis over this news. I was at a place where I considered everything the ZUS (or Canada, etc..) said about everything was lies, and that Iran was far, far more credible.

    And then at this moment when the whole world is watching Iran under a microscope, they try to cover up a major catastrophe, and lie about it.

    If it was the Mossad, then say so, assholes. Being incompetent is a thousand times better than being duplicitous and treacherous.

    Anyways, with this act, the Iranian regime has, (at least for me), destroyed all its former credibility, and now I (amazingly) agree with Trump and the Zio-scum, (and I suspect, the overwhelming majority of Iranians) that they must go.

  107. renfro says:
    @SolontoCroesus

    Agree.

    “What do you do when there is an evil you cannot defeat by just means? Do you stain your hands with evil to destroy evil? Or do you remain steadfastly just and righteous even if it means surrendering to evil?” ― Lelouch Vi Britannia

    I have encountered people who say good people must not become like the monsters they oppose. That they must protect their souls by not becoming evil in a fight against evil.They usually ascribe this belief to their religion. Some profess this position because of their idea of themselves as being more moral then the monsters.

    I cant agree with them. Of course in the fight of good vr evil or evil vr evil what it really comes down to is the motives of the opponents. Whose motives are really moral and done in good faith? ‘Thou shall not kill’….except when? And what if the opponents both believe they are the moral ones fighting the immoral?

    Well then you have to have some universally agreed upon definition of right -wrong, moral and immoral. Thou shall not kill, steal, bear false witness seem to be the basics.
    Rise and Kill ‘First’ is not moral….rise and kill to defend yourself if someone comes to kill you is moral.. And what if they they aren’t killing you but innocent others? So what do you do about the Rise and Kill First people when they are killing outside of any actual attack on them?

    Lets apply the above raw bone basic morality to ISIS, Israel,Saudi, the US. All alike in their desire to impose their will on people for whatever gain to themselves and willing to kill, starve and oppress to do it.

    Then along comes the ‘greater good’….if we assume the greater good is peaceful lives, absence of violence, starvation and oppression for the world’s people . Can we then justify evil acts..i.e. killing for the greater good?

    I think so , as long as we correctly identify the evil doers according to the universal moral basics.

    There are those who will say ‘now you’ve become a monster just like them’. That may be so but the question at the very tail end is whether it is more moral to sacrifice yourself as a monster to defeat evil for the greater good or to surrender to evil.

  108. @Curmudgeon

    You guessed wrong on that one. I was quite politically aware in 1990. I’ve also read that book. Long time ago. I’ll fetch my copy if you need me to look up something for you.

    Rule #1 when you find yourself in a hole. Stop digging.

    Even some Iranians know that. That’s why they admitted shooting down the plane.

    That, of course, brings up the awkward need for a bunch of UNZ Review writers and commenters to do some splainin.

    • Replies: @follyofwar
  109. @Rurik

    The Iranian air defence system is quite decentralised and each battery has its own free rein. It is not improbable that the Iranians were just saying it was an accident as far as they knew while they got their details correct and interviewed battery commanders and soldiers to get an idea of what went on, even the USA and its lackeys were saying it was an accident immediately after the crash, but somehow their tune changed later.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  110. @Rurik

    Nope. It changed nothing. It only confirmed a bunch of things.

  111. @Rurik

    Stopped at a coffee shop this morning; overheard a few people at another table discussing the Iranian plane crash (3 white guys, to be specific; all professionals, upper-40s or 50s — kids in college; all fathers with children, all travel internationally for work & pleasure).

    They were impressed that the Iranian government ‘fessed up.
    They said it was not outside the realm of the possible that in the chaotic and threatening environment, that such a mistake could have been made.
    They said that they probably would have thought twice about boarding a plane in such circumstances.

    They despise Trump.
    Two of the three are genuinely sympathetic toward Iran; the third guy spent a lot of time listening with tight lips, but does hate Trump. I would not peg them as Democrats, just disgusted w/ government in general.


    I had just listened to Jamil Jaffer of George Mason Univ. Highly skilled propagandist; he discussed Iran’s cyber capabilities.
    https://www.c-span.org/video/?467914-3/washington-journal-jamil-jaffer-discusses-iranian-cyber-threats
    From the context of his comments; for as fast as he talked, and for his ability to turn every question/statement into “Israel good (without saying Israel) Iran bad,” I figure he’s Jewish. For example, (and the only time he said the word “Israel”), the Stuxnet attack was mentioned: Jaffer talked all around it, not conceding the obvious, that US and Israel did it, only saying, “It has been alleged that —-”
    Bullshit.
    But later, he could not resist displaying his technical expertise and described how the Stuxnet “crossed the air barrier” between systems.

    Putting together Jaffer’s commentary and the events regarding the downed plane, I think it should be asked — insistently — whether Israel and or US interfered with the aircraft’s systems.

    • Replies: @Avery
  112. renfro says:
    @scrub

    Jared’s boy friend is now the Special Envoy to Israel. Take a look, you will die laughing and also of embarrassment that this little boy is representing the US

    • Replies: @renfro
  113. renfro says:
    @anastasia

    He complained about the money that was given them, and nothing else.

    We didn’t give Iran any money. The money was Iran’s oil money payments to begin with, it had been seized by the US and held by the UN……all Obama did was order it released to Iran as part of the deal.

  114. @Rurik

    They won’t go because, if not entirely on the Zio-American team, they’re at least cozying up to the Trump, realist faction. Probably what happened with the plane is, someone that all sides (there’s more players here than just the Iranians and ZUSA) wanted dead was on it.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  115. @Robert Dolan

    Harmonic & comical to the lyric of old pop song, Lol, (Zigh) and thanks a lot Robert Dolan!

    P.S.: Laughter in ZUS makes life livable.

    • Agree: Robert Dolan
  116. @cynic

    Iran has a simple deterrant available if it truly has the ability to hit Israel, as it claims. Personally I doubt it, but a credible threat to strike back at the source of the problem would surely deter any American president. I’m not talking about the ability to launch a skirmish here or there but a serious missile attack that gets through.
    Again, I seriously doubt Iran could really launch such an attack. They are pretty much helpless which explains their harmless ‘response.’

    • Replies: @cynic
  117. Anon[112] • Disclaimer says:

    The only threat that materialized was the threat that an Iranian General on a peace mission would be senselessly obliterated by a bloodthirsty cabal in Washington.

    This kind of language is a turnoff. It doesn’t seem likely that these people are actually bloodthirsty.

    Last year, on a trip to Israel, Mr. Pompeo invoked the Bible in saying Mr. Trump was a modern-day Queen Esther sent by God to save the Jews from Iran.” (New York Times)

    There you have it. This is the true face of Christian Zionism. It is about protecting Jewish people, and sometimes other peoples, from the next Holocaust. Nothing more, nothing less. It might be wrong in the end, but it is not something that cannot be understood or forgiven.

    I don’t know how many times I have to say it to anti-Christian zealots who insist that US Middle-Eastern policy is about Evangelicals trying to accelerate the apocalypse or something. (Christians are actually supposed to decelerate the apocalypse by evangelizing, but that is another matter).

    I am not a Christian, by the way. I just hate the injustice done to them by their ignorant critics.

    • LOL: Crazy Horse
    • Replies: @Achilles Wannabe
  118. Art says:
    @roonaldo

    as LBJ lied about the Gulf of Tonki

    A million in Vietnam dead — 66,000 Americans – America’s culture forever changed – all for nothing.

    • Replies: @Art
    , @roonaldo
  119. Repeating what I’ve said before! When 2 Mindless Fat Men and a Baby(MbS) get together the whole world goes to shit! Actually there’s a third Fat Man too but let’s leave him out for the time being!

  120. Wally says:
    @Jeff Davis

    said:
    “I’ve been a Trump supporter — drain the swamp, get us out of stupid wars, etc — but if he doesn’t promptly fire Pompeo & pull out of Iraq & Syria, no frikkin way he gets my vote in 2020.”

    Then who will you vote for?

    [MORE]

    Trump Has Appointed 25% Of All Circuit Court Judges: https://dailycaller.com/2019/11/08/donald-trump-circuit-court-judges/
    “President Donald Trump has appointed more judges in less than three years to the circuit courts than any of his two-term predecessors going back to Ronald Reagan.”

    Here’s How Much Red Tape Trump Has Cut: https://www.heritage.org/government-regulation/commentary/heres-how-much-red-tape-trump-has-cut

    • Replies: @Herald
    , @Jeff Davis
  121. Herald says:
    @Really No Shit

    All things are possible, but some of them highly unlikely. I hope that answers your question.

  122. And you just know that this was presented as:

    “And remember that It was Jimmy Carter’s weak reaction to the Iranian attack on the Teheran Embassy that cost him re-election. We have to act strongly———“

    • Replies: @snag
  123. @Johnny Rico

    Occam’s Razor would indicate that Iran shot down the plane by accident (fog of war). A larger question is why were civilian flights allowed to take off from Teheran airport when Iranian rockets were bombing military bases inside Iraq?

  124. cassandra says:
    @MLK

    Would you, like Whitney, apparently, declare these risks to American personnel “not proven,” and wait to see what happened?

    But where does such alacrity cross the line into over-reaction? You invoke a justification for a totally paranoid foreign policy.

    • Replies: @MLK
  125. Herald says:
    @Wally

    Many voted for Trump on the basis that he just had to be better than than the corrupt and ailing Hillary. Almost unbelievably, that contention is now in much doubt. In the highly likely absence of a genuine peace candidate it seems sensible to not bother voting.

    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
  126. Art says:
    @Art


    Now 17 years and we will not leave.

    Think Peace!

  127. @onebornfree

    You got that right, every drone strike is a crime of murder (if it succeeds) or attempted murder (if it doesn’t): no due process is ever involved.

    Maybe Obama ordered fewer of those than Trump, I don’t know. What I do know is that every US president who ordered drone strikes, Obama included, exceeded the tally of Jack the Ripper.

  128. Mark Hunter says: • Website

    Other people have mentioned this but here is a fuller quote and a reference:

    During his April [2019] lecture at Texas A&M University, Pompeo shared a personal anecdote as “a bit of an aside” how he came to defy his West Point honor code stating that “a cadet will not lie, cheat, steal, or tolerate those who do.” He admitted: “I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole. It was like we had entire training courses … it reminds you of the glory of the American experiment.”

    What?

  129. Herald says:

    Many voted for the unknown quantity of Trump on the basis that he just had to be better than than the corrupt and ailing Hillary. Almost unbelievably, that seemingly safe bet is today in great doubt. In the highly likely absence of a genuine peace candidate, it seems better not bothering to vote.

  130. renfro says:
    @Greg Bacon

    There’s nothing innovative about Trump.
    He’s a greasy NY gutter rat who cant live without adoration from the other rats and revenge on anyone who makes fun of him.

    He’s so stupid he thinks statements like this make him a tough guy…..he thinks mafia dons are cool and imitates them.

    “We have a lot of their money. We have 35 billion dollars of their money right now sitting in an account. And I think they’ll agree to pay. I think they’ll agree to pay. Otherwise we’ll stay there.”

    “We have a very good relationship with Saudi Arabia—I said, listen, you’re a very rich country. You want more troops? I’m going to send them to you, but you’ve got to pay us. They’re paying us. They’ve already deposited $1B in the bank.”

  131. renfro says:

    The US state department placed an ad in the Washington Post offering a $15 million reward for information about Iranian military activity in Yemen.

    They placed this ad this week. You can collect the 15 mil if you can make up some story and fabricate enough evidence for Trump’s honchos to feed it to the public.

    I am sure the 15 mil will extract information as good as their waterboarding Iraqis did.

  132. @Wally

    Then who will you vote for?

    I’d vote for a Yang/Gabbard ticket, but that’s unlikely to happen. Otherwise I just stay home. It won’t make a difference in any case.

    Reagan’s Neocon CIA Director William Casey infamously said, “We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false.”

    His program is complete.

    I look around at today’s USA and I see the result of Casey’s progam. A very substantial portion of the American people — judging from commenters on this and myriad other sites — are completely disconnected from reality. A person or a country befuddled in this way cannot function effectively. The US has been destroyed by the failure of democracy. Money has corrupted it. We now have perception management of a controlling percentage of the 99% on behalf of the 1%. Congress bought by corporate interests and foreign countries, specifically Israel, through it’s AIPAC, Neocon, & US Jewish community fifth column.

    China is rising and the US is in terminal decline. We’ve entered the last stage. with the looters cannibalizing the last bits of value.

    The American experiment is over.

    • Agree: Biff
    • Replies: @bluedog
    , @Miro23
  133. President Washington warned against foreign entanglement. Yet at the end of 2019 in a secret deal the US signed an agreement with Israel to defend it against foreign attack.
    On January 2, Israel, Cyprus and Greece signed an agreement for a gas pipeline from Israel to Europe.
    Merely hours later, early morning January 3rd, using Israeli generated false intelligence–fake chatter Neocons dupe Trump into killing the Iranian diplomatic party involved in peaceful negotiations with Saudi Arabia arriving in Baghdad. The intent was to provoke Iran’s response of blocking the Straits of Hormuz. Israel would thus be left as the “only realiable supplier of energy” to Europe in the Middle East, and Saudi Arabia left screwed in the dirt and betrayed in a regional war with Iran.
    Russian intelligence intercepted and debunked “the false chatter” and, in an effort to calm the waters, quietly presented Trump–and Saudi Arabia–with the truth. Responsibly, Trump agreed to a gravel-pounding solution with Iran, whereby it would destroy infrastructure but not kill American soldiers. Later president Trump would repeat the U.S. would not permit Iran to pursue nuclear power.
    Pompeo, Esper, Bolton and the “bomb, bomb, bomb Iran” Neocons have tried carrying out false flags in order to provoke Iran’s closure of the Straits of Hormuz. Iran knows better…
    Sadly, America the great has been thoroughy infiltrated by a foreign power. Among others, professors Walt and Meirshimer warned of this. This is true in key areas mainly at the financial, judicial, and legislative level, and just like a stately mansion in a terminal stage of termite infestation, its collapse is but a matter of time…Hopefully, Americans will wake up to this sad reality…Go figure…

  134. Avery says:
    @SolontoCroesus

    {They were impressed that the Iranian government ‘fessed up}

    In contrast, when USS Vincennes shot down Iran Air flight 655, killing all 290 civilians aboard, US kept lying and trying to put the blame on the airliner* for the shootdown. It took US years, after Iran sued, to pay about $130 million to the families of the dead and such.

    { whether Israel and or US interfered with the aircraft’s systems.}

    The whole thing is very suspicious, but how would interfering with the 737’s systems trigger a missile launch from the IRI air defense systems?

    The crew that was operating the air defense missiles, would have seen the 737 slowly climbing on their radar. I.e. not an attacking jet or a drone. And a 737 would shine like a torchlight on the AA radar.

    My guesses:
    1. Inexperienced, trigger happy crew. (…the officer in charge should be jailed)
    2. Disposable agent withing the crew, who deliberately fired at the passenger airliner.
    3. Some foreign power, most likely Israel, having previously sabotaged the AA systems computers, and used the opportunity to cause a launch.

    _________________________
    * [Reagan, who was spending the Fourth of July holiday at Camp David, said the Iranian aircraft “was headed directly for the Vincennes” and had “failed to heed repeated warnings.” The cruiser, he said, fired “to protect itself against possible attack.”

    The notion that the flight was “headed directly for the Vincennes” comes from crew testimony suggesting the plane was descending, as an attacking plane would, as it approached the area of their ship. Records automatically collected by the ship’s Aegis Combat System, however, later demonstrated that the radar on the Vincennes indicated it had been climbing, not descending — something described by the Department of Defense investigation as “the most puzzling mistake.”]

  135. Mark Hunter says: • Website

    “There are no more neoconservatives of influence in Washington.  Despite claims otherwise, they have zero influence over Trump.”
    — Victor Davis Hanson,  in a January 3rd National Review article.

    Was there ever such a learnèd phony?

  136. bluedog says:
    @joe2.5

    And please quit posting the last thing this site needs is a teacher who can’t see the tree for the forest.!!!

  137. Hillbob says:

    How about the blowing up of the Air Cubana plane off Barbados in 1976? The culprits? Cubano mafiosi based in Miami. Backed by the CIA and the masterminds lived to ripe old age in the UUUUSA, despite requests to have them extradited to Cuba. Dozens died from various nationalities….

  138. MLK says:
    @cassandra

    But where does such alacrity cross the line into over-reaction?

    Good question. It very well have in the instant case but, as I think the readily available, undisputed facts argue, the USG and POTUS had good reason to take Soleimani out. In other words, not doing so then was not a risk he should have taken.

    It’s a hell of a thing being the POTUS. He’s formally at the head of a sovereign with personnel that span the globe. Trump is doing the heavy-lifting of rebuilding American deterrence when it comes to protecting government personnel abroad, after its degradation under his figurehead predecessors.

    I doubt anyone here disagrees with me when I note that the USG ain’t cute and cuddly. Neither is the Iranian regime or Soleimani for that matter.

    • Replies: @sally
  139. Sovereignty matters. And before I look to Israel a secular nation with respect to the political arena , I am going to exercise concerns about the US first.

    And the US citizens are incapable of making the distinction between the word of go and Israel and the political manifestations of the secular well, we will just have to disagree.

  140. onebornfree says: • Website

    Pompeo: I Lied About Soleimani ‘Imminent Attacks’”:

    “……Speaking on the Laura Ingraham program, Mike Pompeo admitted that the neocon idea of “imminent ” and the normal idea of “imminent ” are two very different things.

    “We don’t know precisely when and we don’t know precisely where (the attacks might take place), but it was real,” he told Ingraham.

    But if you don’t know when and don’t know where (and presumably don’t know how), on what basis did Pompeo and the Trump Administration sell the idea that he had to be killed immediately lest untold numbers of Americans be killed?……”;

    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2020/01/daniel-mcadams/pompeo-i-lied-about-soleimani-imminent-attacks/

    Regards, onebornfree

    • Replies: @Desert Fox
  141. @Rurik

    /I’m having an existential crisis over this news./

    You’re way too upset over this.

    Follyofwar has the most concisely accurate response to it: fog of war (#128). Such incidents are a great embarrassment, which, along with the inevitable domestic backlash, explains the reluctance to reveal the truth.

    Now if the American regime was as honest about its own misdeeds — most of which don’t qualify as mistakes — would our public hold its feet to the fire, or would it just change the channel and throw another burrito in the microwave?

    Having an existential crisis over this news?

    You’re better than this, Rurik.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  142. bluedog says:
    @Wally

    Nice try but it won’t cut the mustard if you can’t stay on the same page at least try to stay in the same book.!!!!

  143. renfro says:
    @renfro

    Jared Kushner’s real family name is Berkowitz and they were from Poland not Germany.

    https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/who-is-jared-kushner

    ”After the Second World War, anti-Semitic immigration laws sharply limited the number of Jews allowed into the United States. In 1949, in order to increase his chances of obtaining an American visa, Rae’s husband and Jared’s grandfather, Yossel Berkowitz, posed as his father-in-law’s son, listing Kushner as his name on U.S. immigration paperwork, and renaming himself Joseph Kushner. As a result, his son Charles was called Charles Kushner, not Charles Berkowitz, and his grandson was Jared Kushner, not Jared Berkowitz. Jared’s wife’s married name would be Ivanka Kushner, not Ivanka Berkowitz.”

    So I wonder if Avi Berkowitz, the new Special Envoy to Israel and pictured with Jared in post 116 above is a relative.

    • Replies: @snag
  144. Yeah, Pompeo called the shots. That’s the ticket!

    Pompeo. (((No one else.)))

  145. Trip says:

    https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2020/01/09/the-kerfuffle-war-trumps-iran-de-escalation-succeeds/

    Trump did not order the assasinations. Rogue DoD staff under Mark Esper ordered the hit in an act of mutinous treason and have been sacked pending consequences.

    Dear Mr Unz please read the article i have appended to this comment.

  146. Christian Zionist Pompeo Duped Zion-stooge Drumpf?

    Drumpf hired Pompeo.

    which happened first?

  147. bluedog says:
    @Jeff Davis

    THANKS that just about in in a nutshell,I didn’t vote in the last election for the simply reason you had two crazy people running,I looked at Trumps background .I think the Godfather was based on that,then Clinton, we came we saw he died.Now just who in their right mind would vote for either of those two NOT ME.!!!!>!!

    • Agree: Herald
  148. Wrong! Khomenei wanted Salmonela gone. He was getting to big for his britches. Look for relation between Iran and US to improve. We will leave Iraq soon.

  149. @onebornfree

    Pompeo is an agent of Israel as is Trump and the ZUS government.

    • Replies: @onebornfree
  150. @Carlton Meyer

    Reminds me of : “There are known known, known unknowns and unknown unknowns.” There must be a school to learn this nonsensical doublespeak.

  151. Too bad it’s all real. Otherwise, the guy would be a hoot.

    ‘Pompeo: Soleimani Strike Was Part of Larger U.S. Strategy on Iran
    Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said Tuesday that President Trump’s decision to kill Maj. Gen. Qassem Soleimani was legal and part of a larger U.S. strategy against Iran.’

    Well, of course it was only part of a larger strategy. Provoking Iran into attacking us is only the first step. That goes without saying.

  152. sally says:
    @MLK

    @ Avery quite a Theory, excellent starting point.. for uncovering the thinking going on in Iran. Such a theory might lead to understanding confirmation that the disaster came from one of Iranians’ own.. When you consider the tone of the message that accompanied the announcement of the insider error, you see unusual behaviors and hear tones of voices.. such things as promises to punish those 8 officers that did it, The message was vindictive, suggested suppressed, disgusted anger, very uncharacteristic of Iranian leadership. . I thought when I heard it.. You may have explained why.. the disaster might have been the work of Trojan insider working for the outside.. that would explain Leader’s anger.. and it would also explain why Iran did not own up to the mistake much earlier, why they called on everyone to help, because they were trying to keep hidden the ongoing investigation into the possibility of a Trojan in their mist?

    In light of that theory, it could be postulated that the downing of a civilian aircraft was a part of the extermination of Soleimani plan; knowing full well that Iran would respond, and when they did, they would be treated to a commercial airline disaster. <far out, but needs to be discounted by facts before it can be removed as a possibility.

    @ MLK the USG is a corporation, with 527 salaried officers, that are suppose to reflect American will and wishes; as paid corporate servants, they are charged to provide for the security and quality of life of Americans. Unless I am wrong, employees of the constitutionally restricted corporation (USA) are not authorized to deny anyone due process except in time of war. I would love to hear what Soleimani might say in his defense?

    What legitimate interest in the middle east do Americans have? AFAICT the USA may have adopted the interest of investors, bankers and corporations, those who conduct commercial and privatization activities in foreign far away places as being an interest of Americans. Are commercial entities conducted by Americans in foreign places protected by the constitution? If so, it would seem certain activities, conducted in foreign places, could start a war at any moment, in any place, for a platter of possible reasons? Supporting investors in foreign places seems to be both an unnecessary risk to America and an expense which domestic Americans should not be forced to pay?

    My understanding is Soleimani was taking out head choppers, he was an officer in the guard, the guard is, as I understand it, a protector of all Islam, where-ever Islamic's are. Looking at Soleimani's job in the chain of command, Soleimani seems to have been in a chain of command that is somewhat separate ( independent of ) from Iran's normal military chain of command. He was in the religious arm, I think, and his job was about Islam, not advancing the interest of Iran per se. Please anyone correct me with facts if I am wrong because i am trying to understand all of this.. I am no expert i just asking questions.

  153. Pompeo the crypto commie jew did not lure Trump of the jewish israeli russian mob…to do anything

    Putin and Bibi ordered it and the bitches follow their rabbinical dictate

  154. Pompeo is christ-cuck scum.

    This is a true Christian.

  155. @Urban Moving

    I could never imagine what garbed gibberish would look like. Thanks for providing a clear example.

  156. Hail says: • Website
    @Realist

    If he is reelected he will be free to wreak havoc on the world.

    And we all know a second-term Trump Amnesty is coming.

    If he wins, he’ll do it, he’ll pull the trigger on amnestying-in millions of them (his track record up to now suggests it), with his usual bravado talk to dress it up. I think we all sense this is coming.

    For opponents of “Invade The World, Invite the World,” Trump must lose. I only reluctantly came to this conclusion and say it with no great joy.

    • Agree: Realist
    • Replies: @Desert Fox
  157. @Johnny Walker Read

    I didn’t know about the one at Shanksville but I believe that yet another magic passport was found amid the wreckage of the London tube bombings.

    • Replies: @9/11 Inside job
  158. @Hail

    Agree, Trump is a tool of the zionist NWO agenda and zero borders and unlimited immigration is a part of this diabolical plan.

  159. Anon[228] • Disclaimer says:

    Target Iran Operation:

    This is Sibel Edmonds, reporting on the ground from Turkey.

    https://www.newsbud.com/2020/01/05/target-iran-operations-on-pause-heres-why-2/

  160. @Anon

    “I am not a Christian, by the way. I just hate the injustice done to them by their ignorant critics.”

    Oh we know you’re are not a Christian, you hasbara clown. And we know you do not give a fu#k
    about injustices done to Christians whatever those injustices may be.

  161. snag says:
    @renfro

    From the link:

    “After years in the ghetto and that winter in the forest—during which they lived in ziemiankas, holes in the ground covered by trees—some twelve hundred Jewish partisans made their way back home to Novogrudok”

    Nice story almost like the one about those ‘heroic’ Bielski Brothers in Hollywood movie ‘Defiance’ 😉 … Bielski Bandits description would be more accurate. 
    ———————— 
    https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2011/10/06/jewish-partisan-warfare-during-wwii/  

    Once a bandit and crook always a bandit and crook.
    ————————
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2007/oct/14/usa.secondworldwar

    • Agree: Beefcake the Mighty
  162. @scrub

    “Kushner seems to only increase his influence over our naive and hapless president.”

    Oh give it up, will you? Trump is Shabbos Goy . Has been shabbos goy since day one. That is why his 3 biggest backers are Zionist Jews like the casino magnate and Paul Singer who just recently destroyed that Nebraska town’s industry in one of his usurious ventures. That is why Trump has this Joshua wannabe, Orthodox Jew Kushner for a son in law. I know you can’t legally tell your daughter who to marry in the modern world, but Trump could have said, “There is the question of my will dear” and Ivanka would have quickly found some wealthy gentile for matrimony.

    Actually I think the real question is: Is Trump crypto? Trump’s older brother said their father was. That brother pledged a JEWISH fraternity. See David Kay Johnson, The Making of Donald Trump

  163. snag says:
    @Bill Jones

    Really, not because of the artificially created recession and double digit interest rate imposed by jewish bankers as a payback for Camp David Accords that the Israelis hated so much?

    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/jimmy-carter-deserves-our-thanks-not-our-scorn-2015-08-20

    • Replies: @Bill Jones
  164. Crazy Horse says: • Website
    @Carlton Meyer

    What? Did Pompass drop CIA’s favorite drug of choice before that interview? I can see Philip K Dick spinning in his grave right now since he sounds like a character out of Minority Report.

  165. cynic says:
    @journey80

    Yes; he ‘volunteered’ them!

  166. cynic says:
    @Z-man

    This may be the first time any of them realised that their aggressive actions could bring very personal consequences. They’ve just murdered the Iranian equivalent of St. George. It’s too late to say ‘Sorry’!

    • Replies: @Bill Jones
  167. ivan says:
    @sally

    What do the Chicoms know about Constitutional rule. One may or may not like Trump. But compared to Chicom thugs he is smells like roses. The Koreans have already rolled out 5G. Leaving everyone but movie pirates unimpressed. 5G is going to ruin your head, since the mobile devices have too many antennas.

    • Troll: Ghan-buri-Ghan
  168. cynic says:
    @jack daniels

    Yes, they are not as strong as the USA/Israel. However, they are spiritual cousins of the Assassins and may be feared for the same ability to eventually bring revenge to leaders who think themselves secure, rather than killing low level troops or causing random incidents of terror.

  169. Herald says:
    @Omegabooks

    The anti-Christ is already here and he inhabits the White House.

    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
  170. @Urban Moving

    Maybe . see dutchanarchy.com” Vladamir Putin :”The Chabad Lubavitch mobster who would be the Globalist Messiah …Trump and Putin , both agents of Chabad Lubavitch “

    • Replies: @Paul C.
  171. @snag

    You are confusing the reason and the mechanism.

  172. @NoseytheDuke

    Yes there was a “magic passport” found in the London Tube false flag/psyop bombings , see “10 Anomalies and Conspiracies surrounding the 7/7 London bombings ” By Marcus Lowth , listverse.com
    “…#4 Passports and other documentation found .As is the case with many other [false flag] terrorist incidents, investigators would claim to have found passport and other documents identifying the bombers”

    • Thanks: NoseytheDuke
  173. @cynic

    I’ve long thought that it would be a great movie to have a movement (domestic? Foreign?) realizing that the way to reign in the US Government thugs is to target the families. Nothing so crude as exploding Mohammad’s but precise, carefully and obviously target strikes against wife and kids.

    Imagine the emotional tear-jerking when some McCainish blowhard having bravely disdained the risk to himself – a la the stroll through a Baghdad Market (carefully cleared and searched beforehand and surrounded by two hidden platoons) takes the job only to see his childhood sweetheart bride gunned down. I’d add a daughter in law too just to widen the perception of risk and induce social isolation.

    Rinse and repeat a couple of times and then the families of the senior warmongers are all gathered into a DC version of the Baghdad green zone, alternately widely dispersed and incognito across the country- a Witless Protection Pogrom. Lots to play with there, don’t you think?

  174. Miro23 says:
    @Jeff Davis

    The US has been destroyed by the failure of democracy. Money has corrupted it. We now have perception management of a controlling percentage of the 99% on behalf of the 1%. Congress bought by corporate interests and foreign countries, specifically Israel, through its AIPAC, Neocon, & US Jewish community fifth column.

    It looks like the whole of the Liberal elite is in on it – the outsourcing and open frontiers corporations, all the lobbies from the MIC to healthcare to agriculture – logically friendly with the Zionists, because they’re also looting the US (but from different directions), and they need Jewish MSM protection.

    It’s questionable if the bubble can be inflated any further (US taxpayers pay more interest) but they’ll probably give it a try. Extra $ trillions of debt for an Iran war would be the real test.

  175. Tucker says:
    @anastasia

    “He complained about the money that was given them, and nothing else. ”

    Even this is pure bull manure. The ‘money’ all of these jewish neocons and their mentally insane, psychopathic, war mongering stooges keep whining about – was Iran’s money in the first place. Money that those dumb rubes stupidly decided to deposit inside banks which were either in the US or elsewhere, and which were owned and controlled by jewish Zionists, who are their mortal enemies.

    Can anyone offer me an example of a decision that would top that one for sheer and inexcusable stupidity?

    Those Iranian assets were ‘frozen’ by the Zionists over some pissing contest and were being held to punish Iran, which is a sick obsession of Israel and their treasonous lap dogs here in the USA. That was the money that Obama unfroze and gave to Iran.

    Not an Obama voter or fan. I loathed that SOB. But, facts are still facts.

    • Agree: bluedog
    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  176. No Pompeo did not dupe Trump into the assassination of Soleimani , the US and Israel had been attempting and planning to assassinate him for over a year and “Israeli intel helped the US assassinate Soleimani … ” according to the Jerusalem Post , January 12,2020 .

  177. onebornfree says: • Website
    @Desert Fox

    “To me, it doesn’t matter if your scapegoats are the Jews, the homosexuals, the male sex, the Masons, the Jesuits, the Welfare Parasites, the Power Elite, the female sex, the vegetarians, or the Communist Party. To the extent that you need a scapegoat, you simply have not got your brain programmed to work as an efficient problem-solving machine.” Robert Anton Wilson

    Regards, onebornfree

    • Replies: @Desert Fox
  178. @onebornfree

    In my opinion , to get to the the root of the problem, it is the zionist bankers ie the Rothschilds, Warburgs, Rockerfellers etc., that control the central banks of the world including the FED and thereby control all the governments of the world.

    • Replies: @DaveE
  179. anonymous[116] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    America is occupied territory, and the “Bill of Rights” means fuckall. Americans should be brave and look reality in the face. Another few years down this road will lead to a nuclear war and a worldwide holocaust.
    People like Pompeo, and Trump are conditioned by their upbringing to consider just short term gains as are most westerners. This is due to a hedonistic conditioning brought about by jettisoning all traditions and spiritual practices.
    I know this reads like a ‘Luddite rant’ but its true.

    On another topic

    The Vice President Mike Pence is a curious specimen. None have commented on his frozen countenance and the reason for it. Is it a result of ‘full Botox’ or is he just struggling with his eternal anal retention?

  180. Paul C. says:
    @9/11 Inside job

    Good website. He’s very awake to our reality.

  181. @Tucker

    So, Obama broke long-standing American tradition: “steal and never return the loot”. After the US illegally stole billions of Iranian money, they stole billions of Libyan money (which conveniently “disappeared” from a “safe” European bank), and then more than $10 billion of Venezuelan money. Now Trump threatens to steal ~$35 billion of Iraqi money. The thieves want more and more loot, which is being stolen under various false pretexts. Basically, anyone keeping his money in banks controlled by the Empire and its vassals is an idiot. Some countries have already made that obvious conclusion.

  182. Mike Plumpeo’s abject grovelling and ridiculous levels of public subservience to Israel are nearly unmatched in the entire US government. He even puts Lindsey Graham to shame. Does anyone else suspect that Plumpeo might be under Israeli blackmail? We can see from his obesity that he has trouble controlling bodily urges. Did an Epstein-style blackmail operation snag him?

    • Agree: Desert Fox, JamesinNM
    • Replies: @DaveE
  183. JamesinNM says:

    Prosecute Pompeo for war crimes and treason. If found guilty, consider public execution in Tehran by beheading.

  184. @JamesinNM

    Public beheadings are the trademark of ISIS and “our dear friends the Saudis”.

    • Replies: @Beefcake the Mighty
  185. @AnonFromTN

    They’re also too good for the likes of Pompeo.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  186. Avery says:
    @JamesinNM

    {Prosecute Pompeo for war crimes and treason}

    Can you please tell us which jurisdiction, which court, which country is going to prosecute Pompeo? What kind of world do you think we live in?

    Bona fide war criminal* Tony Blair, for example, was appointed Middle East peace (!) envoy in 2007. That is the real world we live in, not the kind many of us wish we did. BIG criminals are the same people who run the International kangaroo “courts” which, for example, jail and kill small fry like Milošević on false, manufactured charges.

    _______________________
    * I wrote Blair, because his Deputy PM at the time of the invasion, John Prescott, said a couple years ago that the invasion was illegal. It goes without saying that Bush the Lesser would be in the same chair, IF there was any kind of so-called International Law (sic). Not that we needed Prescott to know the invasion was illegal on its face.

  187. DaveE says:
    @Desert Fox

    Absolutely right. Without their theft of the money supply (i.e. control of the entire banking systems of all major industrialized countries) the Chosen Ones would whither and blow away like tumbleweeds.

    End industrial usury…….. and….. back to the ghetto We do go.

    Can’t happen soon enough.

    • Agree: Based Inquisitor
    • Replies: @Desert Fox
  188. @Beefcake the Mighty

    If I believed in Hell, I’d say that Plumpeo deserves being slowly roasted for eternity. He’d have a pretty good company: virtually every US official in the last 30 years would have been in the same place. Too bad there is no Hell where these bastards would get their deserts.

    • Agree: Beefcake the Mighty
  189. DaveE says:
    @Based Inquisitor

    “Did an Epstein-style blackmail operation snag him?”

    Possible, but not necessary. Pompeo is such a stupid, arrogant “Christian” zionist moron that his twisted, dirty evangelical worldview has rendered him a catatonic, brain-dead puppet to his Chosen masters.

    The Jews did the work a LONG time ago, turning Christ’s teachings into just another Jewish perversion…. via the industrial brainwashing operation commonly known as “the Church.” So now they can rest on their bloated behinds…. not worrying about douche-bags like Pompeo ever catching on, which he is clearly incapable of.

  190. @edward ludlam

    So frightened of the almighty America that they are paralyzed when it takes out another state. The world sees they are weak and lose respect. Then, it will be their turn.

    Respectfully disagree with your assertion.

    The ‘mighty’ US army went to Nam and lost
    The ‘mighty’ US army went to Afghanistan and lost
    The ‘mighty’ US army went to Iraq and lost
    The ‘mighty’ US army went to Syria and lost
    +
    The ‘mighty’ US army won’t attack Iran.

    What on earth makes you believe Russian an China are afraid?

    Russia proves it has gear that works [in the Syrian ToO], plus it’s light-years ahead in EW.

  191. @Ghan-buri-Ghan

    Once Iran and North Korea fall, China and Russia will certainly be next.

    The US simply doesn’t have the means, men and money to take on Iran, let alone Russia and China.

    You’re swallowing MSM’s BS. Not an advisable thing to do.

    Think logistics, build-up etc., right where Iran can target anything to and of its liking. Nightmare scenario.

  192. @DaveE

    Not only that, but the zionist banking kabal owns the central bank of central banks, the BIS, the bank of international settlements, and they create money out of thin air and loan it to the governments at interest, the biggest damn scam in the world, and they love financing wars, with ether created fiat money.

  193. @Herald

    If ever there was a time made for a 3rd party candidate, this is it.

  194. @Herald

    Many Catholics now think Pope Francis is the anti-Christ.

    • Replies: @Herald
  195. @Desert Fox

    @ Desert Fox,

    OT.

    I was wrong about the Ukrainian plane having engine failure. Because HUMINT was right aboout the plane being intact and he neither saw the missile or the crash, I simply assumed it couldn’t have been shot down by a missile.

    Needless to say, I couldn’t have been more wrong about the incident. Therefore, apologies.

    Also needless to say, the above doesn’t do the perished 176 men, women and children any good.

  196. @JamesinNM

    I believe that Iran hangs people as its form of capitol punishment.

  197. Rurik says:
    @Just passing through

    The Iranian air defence system is quite decentralised and each battery has its own free rein.

    I’m not a weapons expert by any stretch. Hardly. But where are guys like the Unz’s own Andrei Martyanov, or even RTW or that ‘Smoothie’ guy?

    Because I find it rather incomprehensible that a modern anti-aircraft, anti-missile system that would be deployed in the heart of Iran’s capital, Tehran, right next to its airport and military installations (especially considering the off-the-charts levels of hostility towards Iran by ((regional)) and non-regional (US) rogue nations, would not be able to distinguish between a commercial passenger jet- having recently taken off from Iran’s own airport, vs. an incoming foreign cruise missile.

    It’s as if we’ve being asked to believe that the level of sophistication of Iran’s air defenses, amount to a guy standing there with a shoulder launched Stinger, and no radar.

    It beggars belief.

    The narrative I’m reading is that it’s all ‘America’s’ fault because our sabre rattling caused Iran to be on hair-trigger alert. But this is a nation that many believe has ever right to seek nuclear weapons, (and I used to agree), but if they can’t tell their own passenger jets from a incoming hostile missile, then WTF?

    It is not improbable that the Iranians were just saying it was an accident as far as they knew while they got their details correct and interviewed battery commanders and soldiers to get an idea of what went on…

    Are they ready for nukes?

    • Replies: @Sparkon
    , @Daniel Rich
  198. Rurik says:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    they’re [Iran] at least cozying up to the Trump, realist faction. Probably what happened with the plane is, someone that all sides (there’s more players here than just the Iranians and ZUSA) wanted dead was on it.

    This is the only scenario that makes any sense to me.

  199. Pompeo is just a continuation of the neocon/neolib Secretaries of State under Obama. The MidEast and African roiling destruction could not be accomplished while a President was under attack for three years:

    Have people forgotten the assassination of Libya’s leader and Her chortling?
    Obama’s and Kerry’s support of Saudi genocide in Yemen to lessen Saudi objections to their ill-fated Iran nuclear deal (gone regardless of who won the Presidency)?
    The overthrow of democratically elected leaders like Morsi in Egypt, Yanukovych in Ukraine, Zelaya in Honduras (Hillary: “it wasn’t a coup” because that would cut off all funding of the death squads; Honduras is just another CIA narcostate now)?
    The illegal uninvited invasion of Syria ostensibly to fight the CIA’s proxy army ISIS?
    Obama’s National Emergencies (sanctions and thus wars) against Syria, Libya, Yemen, Ukraine, Venezuela, Sudan, Somalia, Burundi, Central African Republic (and the unannounced actions against neighboring African countries)?

    Not surprisingly the NY Times, the official rag of the DNC/CIA, “forgets” to put the smarmy Pompeo’s actions in perspective. Compared to batsh!t crazy Hillary and John Bolton, Pompeo seems almost sane.
    Sadly not much of an article, nothing beyond the official narrative.

  200. Rurik says:
    @AnonStarter

    I’m having an existential crisis over this news.

    You’re way too upset over this.

    It’s not that I’m checking into any facilities, or heading to San Francisco to wander the streets mumbling to myself.

    But in the context of Iran, per se, everything I thought I knew, now has crumpled away like so much illusionary false hope.

    the inevitable domestic backlash, explains the reluctance to reveal the truth.

    Now if the American regime was as honest about its own misdeeds —

    But you see, there’s the rub.

    Because I’ve known, (and considered it a foundational part of my philosophies) that the ZUS lies with its every feculent breath. If Pompeo is talking, he’s lying. If Bolton or some Senator or political pundit is on TV, and their mouth is moving, lies are spewing out.

    We all know that. (duh)

    But Iran was supposed to be different.

    I’ll put it like this, with an anecdote. A few years back, a relative of mine disappointed me by bending the truth, when I asked him something. Now, if he were a teenager, or very young man, I’d have let it go. But he was in his later twenties, and I figured I should have a talk with him about it. I’m a businessman, and I explained to him, that perhaps the most important quality you have to cultivate in business, it trust. If people can’t trust you, they’re not going to write a check for a deposit on a job. They must know, that your word (your integrity) is iron, and that the only thing that would break your promise, is your death, and then even so, they’d get their money back.

    If a man’s word is not iron, (I explained to him), then it’s mud. It’s (he’s) little more than dog puke in the dirt.

    But if people know that when you say something, they can all take it to the bank, then you might be successful in business, (and relationships and so on).

    It’s no different when it comes to governments. Everybody knows the US is a lying cunt. A rotten vessel full of lies and perfidy. We all know that.

    But many of us used to think Iran was different, just as today, I still harbor a sense than Putin’s Russia is the adult on the world’s stage, because I think most world leaders, (in spite of the hysteria of lies coming from the (((West))), still consider Putin to practice statecraft, which requires a bit of trust. Whereas the ZUS relies on bullying and bribes.

    If Putin were to shoot down a passenger jet, by mistake or otherwise, like for instance MH17, and then lie about it, the way the West did, then I would have my little existential crisis over that as well.

    I’m not saying Iran should repudiate the revolution, and return to a vassal of Zion, like the Shah was. Hell no.

    All I’m saying is that the current regime, has squandered its credibility with this recent lie- of great enormity, (about something of great consequence). And since Iran is such a critical linchpin in the geopolitical struggle against the drooling fiend, that the men running the show, right now, who’ve lied to us all, are counterproductive now, as their credibility is mud.

    For many people, honesty still matters.

    When Iran decided to lie about it, they betrayed the victims of that tragedy. They betrayed their loved ones, the people of Iran, the people of the world that supported them, and they betrayed God, did they not?

    What, after all, does Allah have to say about lying? Especially to ones own faithful, even if there might be some “inevitable domestic backlash”?

    Peace.

    • Agree: Desert Fox
    • Replies: @Daniel Rich
  201. Sparkon says:
    @Rurik

    I’m not a weapons expert by any stretch. Hardly. But where are guys like the Unz’s own Andrei Martyanov, or even RTW or that ‘Smoothie’ guy?

    Because I find it rather incomprehensible that a modern anti-aircraft, anti-missile system that would be deployed in the heart of Iran’s capital, Tehran, right next to its airport and military installations … would not be able to distinguish between a commercial passenger jet- having recently taken off from Iran’s own airport, vs. an incoming foreign cruise missile.

    Yes, that’s the crux of the issue. Please see my comment here:

    https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/killing-inside-iraq-to-punish-iran/#comment-3657769

    Where I speculate that there may have been some kind of electronic spoofing going on to fool the Iranians manning the SAM battery to misidentify the 737 as a cruise missile.

    The really incredible error begging some further explanation is how the Iranian SAM crew mistook the Ukrainian 737-800 for a cruise missile at all, when there should have been nothing extraordinary or alarming about this particular 737 to distinguish it from those that had passed safely through this same airspace earlier.

    According to Western reports, numerous aircraft had safely departed Tehran international airport in the wake of the Iranian attack on U.S. bases in Iraq before the Ukrainian 737 was shot down.

    BTW, I think “Smoothie” was/is Mr. Martyanov.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  202. Rurik says:
    @Sparkon

    there may have been some kind of electronic spoofing going on to fool the Iranians manning the SAM battery to misidentify the 737 as a cruise missile.

    Very excellent conjectures, Sparkon.

    From your link:

    remember also the incident from Sept. 17, 2018, where a Russian Il-20 was shot down by a Syrian SAM after IAF jets played peek-a-boo, hiding behind the Russian turboprop, and fooling the Syrians into firing at it.

    That all makes perfect sense. It aligns symmetrically with everything we know about all the players.

    (One wonders who was on that plane?)

    But then to my other conundrum, why lie about it?

    Obviously, the West is going to lie, because they lie about everything.

    But why did Iran demand and insist, in no uncertain terms, that whatever happened to the plane, ‘what we can tell you with absolute certainty, is that the plane was not shot down!’

    And this was days after it was, when they would have known, by then, that is was shot down.

    Were they stupid enough to think they could have covered it up? With a gazillion foreign spy satellites, staring down at Tehran?!

    By lying about it, they lose the public support they would have had by telling the truth, even if it meant their defenses had been tricked, which makes perfect sense.

    If it was a Western, zio trick, then the blame (and recompense) for the lost lives, would be on Israel and the ZUS, rather than on Iran, for whom there is no sympathy, because we all know they lied, and by doing so, destroyed any possible sympathy for the regime that might have been there.

    I’m glad you agree that Iran’s air defenses are more sophisticated that a guy with a Stinger.

    I’m figuring that their systems can identify the make, model, speed, past trajectory, future computer-theorized potential trajectories, provenance of, and many other characteristics of all flying objects of any significance in its air space. Including especially commercial passenger jets!

    I think I recently read where the Ukrainian jet was affiliated with Israeli/Ukrainian oligarch Ihor Kolomoyskyi. And I couldn’t help but remember his reaction to the downing of MH17, and the hundreds of lives lost, as “a trifle”.

    For him, shooting down passenger jets for reasons of international intrigue, is an amusement.

    Perhaps the passenger jet was outfitted with special electronics, remotely turned on- for the purpose of fooling Iran’s SAMs systems, and perhaps to off a few inconvenient people in the process.

    A win/win for the Zionists, and the J-supremacists in Ukraine, who’re running that nation as their private little fiefdom today. Perhaps it all ties in.

    Rurik ~ the conspiracy theorist

  203. Ron Unz says:
    @Rurik

    This changes everything.

    I really don’t have time today, to post, but I was occasionally checking in at Unz just to confirm this disastrous news, and get some reactions, but there’s nothing here on Unz about this game-changing development.

    So now it seems that the Iranian regime (yes, regime), are nothing more than a den of lying, perfidious, dangerously incompetent cunts.

    Well, “Rurik” is sometimes correct about various things. But his comments usually come across as those of a ranting lunatic…

    • Replies: @Rurik
  204. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    ranting lunatic…

    I prefer deranged, Mr. Unz

    If it’s all the same to you.

    (also, between you and I, since I’m not a ‘respected’ persona, and subject to the usual etiquettes of polite society, I do- with your indulgence- occasionally use a measured ‘frothing’, to add a certain ‘flair’ to my prose. It’s a sort of calculated ‘train wreck’ stratagem, to get otherwise incurious lurkers to get edified by ‘accident’- so to speak).

    Also, please consider, I got three!, of your exalted ‘yellow star’ commenters, to either disagree with that post with the button, or by reply, and our host, (you Sir) to do so by both!

    No mean feat that, I’d say.

    Nevertheless, I still think the decision of Iran to lie about the incident, will prove catastrophic to their regime’s credibility, and possibly their resilience.

    (also, I’ll concede, that there are some people I know who go to me to get the goods on geopolitical events, knowing as they do that our media lie. And when they asked me about the plane crash, I told them in no uncertain terms that Canada was lying, and then I heard someone say ‘It was a Russian missile that Iran used to down the plane’, and I frothed at the time, “Are they kidding me?! Just like Rhoam Emanual (or whatever his name is) said, exploit every crisis for maximum agenda.. Blah, blah.

    But then it turns out that Trudeau and Pompeo and the ((media)) were all the ones telling the truth?!, and it was Iran that was lying. And so they also damaged my credibility as well. Maybe I sort of took that personal, on some level. Anyways, I hate liars.

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
  205. Ron Unz says:
    @Rurik

    I prefer deranged, Mr. Unz…Nevertheless, I still think the decision of Iran to lie about the incident, will prove catastrophic to their regime’s credibility, and possibly their resilience.

    Well, I don’t know about “deranged,” but you do seem awfully “excitable”…

    For example, when I first heard of the plane crash, I vaguely assumed that that the Iranians had probably shot it down accidentally due to the ultra-high state of their air-defense alert, though I though that maybe some sort of sabotage was also a possibility.

    The Iranians initially said No, and the Americans said Yes, which is just what you’d expect in this sort of situation. I thought that after a few days went by and especially once the black boxes were examined, the truth would likely come out, and that’s exactly what happened.

    These sorts of accidents happened occasionally even in far less militarily stressful situations, and personally I doubt that the Iranians were lying instead of just being initially confused and mistaken. Your wildly denounciation of the Iranians as horrific villains seemed totally nuts to me, and possibly prompted by all the FoxNews you watch or something. It’s even still possible that the US did set the whole thing up as some sort of nasty plot, though there’s obviously zero evidence.

    A good standard of comparison is that the US military accidentally shot down TWA 800 near NYC under totally peaceful conditions, and despite the absolutely overwhelming evidence our government still hasn’t admitted the mistake after almost 25 years:

    https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-the-destruction-of-twa-flight-800/

    • Agree: Based Inquisitor
    • Replies: @Rurik
    , @turtle
  206. Herald says:
    @Kolya Krassotkin

    The competition is indeed very fierce.

  207. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    you do seem awfully “excitable”…

    I’ve heard that before.

    Iranians had probably shot it down accidentally due to the ultra-high state of their air-defense alert,

    This is where I’d have to say I’d find that astonishing, and for the reasons I’ve mentioned on this thread. To wit: post 209 –

    that Iran’s air defenses are [or at least should be] more sophisticated than a guy with a Stinger.

    I’m figuring that their systems can identify the make, model, speed, past trajectory, future computer-theorized potential trajectories, provenance of, and many other characteristics of all flying objects of any significance in its air space. Including especially commercial passenger jets!

    But I’m no expert, and was openly lamenting the lack of one handy, for the purposes of a wider understanding of such things.

    (it is, after all, a ‘wider understanding of things’, for which I linger so often at your excellent site ; )

    And on cue, Sparkon availed us of some potential scenarios for how the Iranian defenses might have been fooled into thinking a passenger jet was actually a cruse missile, when it wasn’t. That I can accept.

    I though that maybe some sort of sabotage was also a possibility.

    Yes, me too, as in Mossad messing with their computers, or such.

    and especially once the black boxes were examined, the truth would likely come out, and that’s exactly what happened.

    I suppose it was when I heard of the black boxes, that I sort of got ‘excited’, because as we all know, whenever there’s an untoward incident, involving a plane crash, the first thing they do is collect the black boxes, to make sure no one is ever able to evaluate them. 9/11, Mh17, and so on. They may say they’ve examined the black boxes, and they show that is was 19 hijackers with box cutters who did the dastardly deed, or a Russia BUK anti-aircraft missile, respectively, but I think they’re lying. (yes, I know, conspiracy lunatic, but there it is).

    So when I heard that Iran had recovered the black boxes, but refused to hand them over, and this was supposed to be considered some kind of proof of ill-intent, I was ‘excited’, and thinking ‘who in their right mind would hand them over to the West’s ‘investigators’?!

    the truth would likely come out, and that’s exactly what happened

    Well, Mr. Unz, I hope at least that you can appreciate that you have some widely ranging viewpoints on your website. And in that vein, I will suggest to you that I suspect that the actual truth will likely never get out. And just as so many crimes, (Michael Hastings, Seth Rich, Gary Webb, 9/11, TWA 800, MH17, Assad’s chemical attacks, etc..) that this incident as well will be cloaked in lies for all eternity.

    If it is a simple case of ‘oops, we were scared, and so we just shot at anything that moved, and our defenses are not too sophisticated, and we can’t tell a cruise missile from a passenger jet anyways’, then I have to conceded that I am wrong, and that it was just a case of Iranian error, and shit happens. But I doubt it.

    I doubt that the Iranians were lying instead of just being initially confused and mistaken

    I would agree if it were hours after the crash. But days after? With all of Iran’s capabilities to take a look at the damaged plane, and not be able to determine if it was hit by missles, even after days?

    Or that they can’t rely upon their soldiers and military to give them a straight answer?!

    ‘What happened to the plane?’ A superior in the government demands of a military man in charge of the area, ‘We don’t know Sir, but we can guarantee you we didn’t shoot it down. No missiles were discharged during that time period’, That much we can give you a full and 100% guarantee.’

    Really?

    If so, then what does that say about Iran’s military and chain of command?

    Well, you can’t expect them to own up to something like that, at least right away. They’d be embarrassed, and scared of what their superiors might do to them. Things like this have to have investigations…

    I suppose, that might be it, but there again, I find such scenarios far fetched.

    Your wildly denounciation of the Iranians as horrific villains seemed totally nuts to me,

    Well, you weren’t alone. Others whom I respect, agreed with you.

    But for the record, the reason I denounced them, is because it don’t buy that they didn’t know what happened, for the reasons I just outlined. I think they knew, and decided to lie about it. I don’t know if that decision is more stupid, or villainous, but in either case, I considered (and consider) it a game changer.

    If they didn’t know, it means their military doesn’t feel obliged to tell them the truth about such things, in which case, they’re unfit to rule.

    If they did know (and I’m convinced they did), then they lied- to no apparent justifiable end, unless they figured they could cover it up, in which case, there again, I’d consider that beyond stupid, considering all the spying going on.

    And if they were fooled, as in Sparkon’s scenario, (or some other), then they must have been too vain or craven, to admit they were fooled. Which also doesn’t bode well for their fitness to rule.

    and possibly prompted by all the FoxNews you watch or something

    That I did not deserve. I’m one of the biggest critics of the ((media)) there is here, and that includes Fox News, which I haven’t watched since I got rid of all cable and satellite TV long ago.

    The only one I liked at Fox, is Tucker Carlson, and I do continue to watch some of his videos when I see them linked to on the Internet. As for the rest, they suck, and always have.

    It’s even still possible that the US did set the whole thing up as some sort of nasty plot

    Not even I would go that far, but I did speculate that someone in the Ukraine may have done so.

    A good standard of comparison is that the US military accidentally shot down TWA 800

    Perhaps, but that was fifty+ years ago, and the recent Iranian jet had just taken off from an Iranian airport. So the entire escapade would have been thoroughly monitored from take off to crash, with presumably some very sophisticated capabilities. At least I’d like to think so.

    What are the chances that we’ll all hear the actual cockpit recordings of the entire event from the black boxes once they’re handed over to our investigators, and the whole incident is laid out exactly as it happened, for all to hear?

    • Replies: @Desert Fox
    , @Daniel Rich
  208. @Rurik

    But where are guys like the Unz’s own Andrei Martyanov, or even RTW or that ‘Smoothie’ guy?

    I can’t answer your question, but Andrei Martyanov and Smoothiex12 are one and the same guy. I have posted your question to his web site [with a link back to your question here @ Unz] and hope Andrei either answers it here or on his own web site. In case of the latter I’ll keep you in the loop.

    Hope this helps.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  209. turtle says:
    @Ron Unz

    It’s even still possible that the US did set the whole thing up as some sort of nasty plot

    Sweet Jesus, give me a break.
    Can you say “William of Ockham?”

  210. turtle says:
    @JamesinNM

    I suggest the Pompous One might ought to visit his arsehole buddy, Mo bS, in Riyadh sometime soon, toting a Bible and sporting a crucifix tie tack.*

    *It is my understanding that adherance to any religious doctrine other than Islam in the KSA is considered to be apostasy. AFAIK, the penalty for apostasy in the KSA is death by decapitation, and right promptly.

    Good riddance to bad rubbish, IMO.

  211. @Rurik

    What, after all, does Allah have to say about lying? Especially to ones own faithful, even if there might be some “inevitable domestic backlash”?

    Although I have no argument against anything you said, I’d like to point out Iran brought out the truth within days. So, even if they were pondering the ramifications of what they did [or the guy who pushed the button], it did not stand in the way of coming clean. In the end, the truth did prevail, no?

    We’re still waiting on who really killed JFK [etc.].

  212. @Rurik

    I dated a girl who’s dad was a fighter pilot [F-16]. He said the plane could project itself [on the ‘enemy’s’ radar] 200 miles of where it actually was. That was 35 years ago. So, I have no problem imagining where ‘we’ are today [technically].

    The fact the man who films the fired missile trains his phone on a part of the sky [which would be randomly], at the exact right time, doesn’t bode well for the, “How lucky can I be, filming the exact moment a missile explodes near a Ukrainian plane, in Iran?” gambit. Also, the total lack of surprise on behalf of this calmly, smoking guy, is odd.

    It might be Iran lacks the technology to actually read whatever is on the [damaged] CVR and the FDR and refuses to send them to US [Boeing]?

    “We prefer to download the black boxes in Iran. But if we see that we can’t do that because the boxes are damaged, then we will seek help,” Ali Abedzadeh, head of Iran’s Civil Aviation Organization, told a news conference in Tehran.

    Given the FUZKUS ‘war’ machine’s penchant for symbolism, injected with shots of Talmudic inspired, dreary darkness, it might indeed be a western triggered outcome of an extremely tense situation.

    Again, this doesn’t do the 176 victims any good.

    It’s therefore that I can appreciate Iran stepping up to the plate, grab this bloodied bull by the horns and take responsibility for the killing of 176 innocent human beings [albeit accidental].

    And I’m sure you know what would’ve happened had this tragic event occurred in the US, right?

  213. roonaldo says:
    @Art

    Thanks, Art, that video reminded me of how creepy LBJ seemed to me every time he appeared on TV, and I was just a “snot-nosed kid!”

    • Thanks: Art
    • Replies: @Art
  214. anonymous[245] • Disclaimer says:
    @follyofwar

    “She would have been worse …”

    Please. Only the willfully gullible can at this point hope that the people of this country can vote the Empire out of office. What would it take for you to quit letting yourselves be played by Washington politics?

  215. Rurik says:
    @Daniel Rich

    hope Andrei either answers it here or on his own web site. In case of the latter I’ll keep you in the loop.

    Hope this helps.

    It does, thank you very much.

    … I’d like to point out Iran brought out the truth within days. So, even if they were pondering the ramifications of what they did [or the guy who pushed the button], it did not stand in the way of coming clean. In the end, the truth did prevail, no?

    Well, two things there. One is, yes, after three days of lying about it (there was even video of the plane being hit in the air by the missile). And after several governments (like Canada) took to the airwaves to say (I would have said ‘claim’, but no more), that Iran was lying, and that they had evidence that Iran had shot the plane down. Only after a massive preponderance of voices became a chorus, and no doubt Iran’s leaders were made privy to the evidence, did they finally admit what Iran had done.

    As to whether or not truth has prevailed, as I prognosticated to Mr. Unz, I doubt it ever really will. At least the whole truth. Every government, in their own way, will spin this tragedy- like they do all others, in a way that they figure suits their respective agendas. Ironically, it comes down to RT, and Russia, for me, as the most credible of all governments and media. I used to have the same level of respect for Press TV, but no more.

    Here they report that:

    Iran administration denies spreading misinformtion [sic] on plane crash

    The Iranian administration dismissed allegations of spreading misinformation following the recent unintentional downing of a Ukrainian passenger plane in Tehran.

    https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2020/01/14/616153/Iran’s-President-Rouhani-Ukrainian-plane-crash

    Umm, for days they were telling the world that the plane was definitely not shot down and calling the Americans ‘liars’.

    I don’t care if that was because their military men had lied to them, or because they cynically decided for their own reasons to lie, but “spread misinformation’ is exactly what they did. (duh, f’n duh)

    You see, how powerful people simply can’t resist the temptation to lie, in order to create their own realities? If the truth is inconvenient – Iran did spread misinformation days following the plane crash), then all you need to do is lie, and say that what is true, is not true, and then they assume their lies will be heeded. Because that is the modus operandi for powerful people. Tell lies, when the truth doesn’t suit you. And then expect those lies to be accepted by your followers, or else.

    And it usually works, only this time, they’ve miscalculated. It was bad enough, when they lied about not shooting it down, now as contrition, they’re claiming and demanding that they never “spread misinformation”. WTF?

    “It is a first good step that the Iranian Armed Forces have admitted their mistake… ”

    Did you notice that? That was the man in charge in Iran, tossing his military leaders under the bus.

    “We should now [work to] assure the people that this will not happen again,” Rouhani said, adding that his government would be “accountable to the Iranians and the nationals of other countries who lost their lives in this incident”

    That sounds to me like a 9/11 type of ‘don’t worry families, you’ll get your millions’- damage control.

    So what I get from this report, is that Iran’s leaders didn’t “spread misinformation” –

    – and that is a lie.

    Even if you accept that their military, (and they admit it wasn’t just one person – “Not just the one person who pressed the button is to blame; there are others involved. …”) made a mistake, but refused to own up to it, for several days, until the evidence was overwhelming, what the regime of Iran did, was spread misinformation. It doesn’t matter whether or not their military leaders lied to them, and they didn’t know, the fact is they spread misinformation, but STILL don’t have the integrity to admit it. This is a failing of powerful people that I personally despise. Own – the fuck- up to it! Admit what was done, and that you are human, and people might forgive you. But this damnable insistence that they never make mistakes, (‘it wasn’t us! it was our military who fucked up and then lied about it’) will eviscerate every shred of respect for this regime that exists, and the young people care about things like integrity. Who wants to follow a regime of incompetent and arrogant liars – who toss their loyal officers under the bus when the heat turns up.

    And to add insult to injury, this is all happening at exactly the moment when Iran had all the moral capital in the world, on their side. The Trump regime had just perpetrated an atrocity against Iran, the general was a beloved man, respected and admired, probably even in the West.

    So the momentum was on Iran’s side. They had the moral high ground, and then a tragedy ensues, and they squander their position, by lying to the world, about a failure of some kind.

    I still think the most logical scenario is that one or more people the regime considered inconvenient were on that plane.

    it might indeed be a western triggered outcome of an extremely tense situation.

    I certainly don’t rule that out.

    And I’m sure you know what would’ve happened had this tragic event occurred in the US, right?

    Well, that’s one of my points. We all know the ZUS are a den of cowardly scum, liars and thieves and perfidious criminals, the lot.

    But I used to have much more respect for the regime in Iran.

    And even if their systems were hacked by the Mossad, I still would have considered them blameless for this tragedy, if they simply told the truth about it. But when they lied about it, and continue to lie about it even now, and claim they never ‘spread misinformation’- when that’s exactly what they did, (and are doing), then at what point do we as honorable people reach our breaking point, and say ‘stop lying to us!, it’s insulting to our intelligence, and it makes you look like rats, no better than your lying enemies.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  216. Rurik says:
    @Rurik

    (‘it wasn’t us! it was our military who fucked up and then lied about it’) will eviscerate every shred of respect for this regime that exists, and the young people care about things like integrity. Who wants to follow a regime of incompetent and arrogant liars – who toss their loyal officers under the bus when the heat turns up.

    now it seems there is a growing rift between Iran’s regime and its military leaders..

    Iran’s military claims that it never sought to cover up its mistake and had immediately informed authorities about the incident, but that this information was withheld from the public pending further investigation into the matter.

    https://www.rt.com/news/478207-iran-plane-arrests-ukraine-shootdown/

    Some questions that remain:

    “Tehran admitted that Ukraine International Airlines Boeing 737-800 was mistaken for a projectile…”

    Is this credible. Is it possible for a modern air defense system to mistake a Boeing 737

    Having just taken off from Tehran airport less that five minutes ago..

    from this..

    which would have necessarily have come from beyond Iran’s borders..

    Is that claim credible?

    • Replies: @Sparkon
  217. Sparkon says:
    @Rurik

    This morning the Iranians have announced arrests in connection with the shoot-down of the Ukrainian 737, and have promised a full investigation.

    https://apnews.com/40f1b9bd475d23bd5d2977ff2e473d7b

    It’s plausible the Iranians were in fact looking into the possibility the SAM crew had been spoofed by some trickery into mistaking the airliner for a cruise missile during that 3-day delay in announcing their responsibility for the shoot-down. Now, with the arrests, that scenario of external manipulation or trickery of some kind seems less likely but still not entirely out of the question with reports, for example, that the 737’s transponder had shut down.

    However, the claim that the SAM crew had only 10 seconds to decide whether or not to shoot is not believable, nor is it understandable how the Tor battery could have been operating in close proximity to Tehran’s Imam Khomeini airport all by its lonesome with no communications with any higher authority. It wouldn’t surprise me if the arrests are connected to these issues, and to the party responsible for the decision to keep the airspace open in the first place, as Erebus has argued elsewhere:

    https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/killing-inside-iraq-to-punish-iran/#comment-3660211

    • Replies: @Rurik
  218. Art says:
    @roonaldo

    If you listen to those war speeches – LBJ and W sound just like Trump and Pompeo – almost the same words. An immanent homeland disaster in all three instances – is and was a big fat LIE!

    Think Peace

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