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Michael Hudson’s landmark 2015 book “Killing the Host” exposed how the empires of finance, insurance and real estate captured the global economy through neo-liberalism and sold us down the road to neo-feudalism. Michael returns to the show to describe why the current global economic demise is the fruit of consummate greed, crony politics and rapacious finance – and what we must do if we are to ever get off this road. On a very positive note that shows that The People aren’t taking all this lying down, Ellen talks with one of the team members behind California’s new infrastructure bank bill, AB 310, which may set a national example for accelerating implementation of new state public banks.

EHB-Michael Hudson intervw – IOM show #132.mp3, July 20, 2020.

https://itsourmoney.podbean.com/e/it-s-our-money-with-ellen-brown-killing-the-host/

Ellen Brown: [00:00:00] My guest today is Dr. Michael Hudson, who we’re delighted to have on our Public Banking Institute Advisory Board, and who really should be advising the Federal Reserve and the Treasury, but BlackRock seems to have gotten the job. Paul Craig Roberts, who is former Assistant Treasury Secretary under Reagan, called Michael Hudson the greatest economist on the planet. He’s a Wall Street financial analyst, Professor of Economics at the University of Missouri, Kansas City, and author of over two dozen books, including Killing the Host and one called … and Forgive Them Their Debts, which are both particularly relevant today. So it’s great to be speaking with you, Michael.

Michael Hudson: [00:00:43] It’s good to be back, Ellen.

Ellen Brown: [00:00:45] Thanks. So, you recently wrote in The Washington Post the Corona virus outbreak is serving as a mind expansion exercise, making hitherto unthinkable solutions thinkable. Debts that can’t be paid, won’t be. A debt jubilee may be the best way out. So, for anyone who hasn’t heard you explain this before, could you explain what you mean by a debt jubilee, and why it may be the best way out, and what the real crisis is that it’s the best way out of?

Michael Hudson: [00:01:21] Well, there was the debt problem that’s been mounting up ever since World War II. Every economic recovery, every business cycle since 1945 has started from a higher level of debt. Most people thought they were getting rich off debt because most bank credit – 80 percent of bank loans – are mortgage loans. They’re made against real estate. Banks have sought to expand the market, and have lent more and more against real estate. In the 1960s when I first bought a house, you had to have debt service absorb not more than 25 percent of your income. You had to put down 30 percent of the price of the house. So basically, a house was worth whatever a bank would lend.

But by the time that the economy collapsed in 2008 – or rather, by the time the financial system collapsed – banks were making loans with zero down payment. You didn’t need 30 percent. The requirement that mortgage payment be affordable – 25 percent of your income – went out the window. Banks would lend any amount of money, regardless of what you were making. And even the interest didn’t have to be paid. Instead of having a self-amortizing mortgage where you’d own the house after 30 years of paying the bank, you’d pay the bank after 30 years and you wouldn’t own any more at all, because you wouldn’t be paying any amortization.

So basically, banks lent so much money against housing, inflating it up to such a high price, that after paying the mortgage costs – or, if you can’t afford a house, if you’re a renter – after paying the debt service and the credit card debt, the other debt, and after paying the insurance costs and taxes, you really don’t have much left for basic goods and services that you produce, except for the bare minimum of food, clothing and transportation.

So a point was reached already by the time the virus broke out of how the economy can continue to grow. For 95 percent of the population, the economy stopped growing in 2008, when Obama bailed out the banks and left all the bad debts in place. Since 2008, all the growth of GDP – all the increase in national income – has accrued just to the wealthiest five percent of the population. That means that for 95 percent of the population the economy hasn’t been growing at all. It’s been shrinking.

The question is, how are you going to grow if you leave all of the debt service in place, if you leave all of the debt pyramided housing in place? Bonds and stocks are so high-priced that they don’t yield an income for retirement anymore. The economy reached a point already by the beginning of this year that it had to choose either to pay all the debts, continue paying the growth in income to the five percent that basically are the creditor and financial class, or write down the debts and let the economy grow again.

The basic issue is, who is the economy going to be run for? Is it going to be run for the banks and Wall Street, or for Main Street? Well, you said I should be a adviser to the Federal Reserve and Treasury. They wouldn’t pay any attention to anything I say, because they run the economy for Wall Street. As you’ve just seen, the Federal Reserve has created a virus of quantitative easing since 2008. First, four and a half trillion dollars for the Obama bailout, and then another two trillion that is set to go up to 10 trillion, essentially just to buy stocks and bonds and push up the prices of assets that the five percent own.

ORDER IT NOW

So the Federal Reserve basically is working against Main Street. It’s working only for its constituency, which are the commercial banks, instead of trying to think how can the economy free itself from this debt overhead? It certainly can’t work its way out of debt because nobody’s earning enough money to amortize, that is to pay off the principal. All they can do is try to pay the current interest charges. So the economy has painted itself into a corner. And that’s the problem that I address in Killing the Host and all the books that I write and all the interviews that I do.

Ellen Brown: [00:06:51] I totally agree with all that. You mentioned this four and a half trillion, which is levered up. I just wondered, how do they get away with that? I mean, it’s not a bank. Why did they figure ten to one? Tthey could do 100 to one. The Federal Reserve can issue whenever it wants. I guess one of my basic questions about the Federal Reserve is that people say they could actually go bankrupt, their balance sheet doesn’t balance, and all that. Do they actually have a balance sheet that counts?

Michael Hudson: [00:07:25] Sure they have a balance sheet. The question is, what is a balance sheet? You have assets on the left-hand side and liabilities and net worth on the right-hand side. The Federal Reserve can create a credit / deposit, just like a bank does. If you go to a bank and want to borrow money, the bank will create an account for you just on the computer. “Here’s $100,000 we’re putting in your checking account. Go buy a house or do anything.” In exchange, the bank has an asset, a claim on you for repayment with interest. Well, the Federal Reserve also can do anything on its balance sheet. It can tell corporations and the banks, “We’re the Statue of Liberty: Give us your poor junk loans, give us your bad debts, give us all of the junk, and we will create a deposit – 100 cents on the dollar for it – and we will pick up all of your bad loans. And we know that the loans can’t be paid, because the economy can’t pay.”

On the asset side of the balance sheet, we’ll say we have the claim against you. And we will then give you the money for it. And we will try to make sure that we don’t have to lose money on these assets that we’ve let you pledge to us, because we’re going to keep bidding up the market higher and higher. We can do that not only by buying stocks, junk bonds and packaged mortgages, but we can do financial tricks.

You mentioned Paul Craig Roberts before, former Undersecretary of the Treasury for International Affairs. He told me that what the Federal Reserve is doing these days is manipulating the forward market. It will go into Wall Street and it will say, “We promise to buy the Dow Jones average at 50 points higher than it is today, next week.” Well, once it makes a promise to buy, the speculators will see that and they will begin to bid up the prices to what the Federal Reserve promises to pay for the stocks. It can keep doing that, week after week and month after month and it can keep pushing up the stock market. That’s how it pushes up the bond market by promising to buy bonds at a higher and higher price. That means that an existing bond will yield less interest income. They can just continue to inflate the economy with credit, like a Ponzi scheme.

So the Federal Reserve is the official Ponzi scheme that keeps finance capitalism operating in the United States. Obviously, at some point every exponential growth scheme has to stop, because otherwise you’d have an infinite amount of debt. So at a certain point, the Fed will sit down with the main Wall Street firms and the main billionaires that are behind these firms, and say, “Well, you know, the game is over. We’ve got to let it go.” These investors will say, “OK, we’ll take the money and run.” That’s what a lot are all doing already. “We’re going to buy gold. We’re going to buy real estate in New Zealand, so we have somewhere to run to when the economy collapses.” They’re just going to drop everything, sell out and there will be a crash with the pension funds and the small savers who aren’t in on the game, losing whatever they have.

Ellen Brown: [00:11:27] This goes on over and over. My question about the Fed’s balance sheet, though, does their balance sheet have to balance?

Michael Hudson: [00:11:35] Every balance sheet balances, because any transaction is a balance. If you’re a physicist talking about a man falling flat on his face, that’s equilibrium. Anything can be looked at as a duality of two sides of the same coin. The two sides are assets and liabilities. And if I promise to pay you $100,000 for a broken down car, I can say that I have an asset worth $100,000, and you have a $100,000 IOU from me. That balances. It’s just not a realistic balance. So balance sheets do have to balance, but they don’t have to be realistic.

Ellen Brown: [00:12:24] Of course. I think we need a universal basic income. And you think we need a debt jubilee and we need to discuss what those are. But let’s say they’re paid by the Federal Reserve. The argument against that is that, like real helicopter money where you just drop money on the people, you can’t bring it back and therefore it would be inflationary, whereas what they do is supposedly reversible. So if you buy an asset, you’re putting money into the economy. And then if the economy overheats, as they say, then you can always sell the asset back and pull the money back and shrink the money supply. And you can’t do that with the UBI or writing off debts or all those various things. But it seems to me that they never can reverse their quantitative easing anyway. What do you say to that argument?

ORDER IT NOW

Michael Hudson: [00:13:17] You’re quite right. Remember, the Federal Reserve helicopter only flies over Wall Street. It doesn’t fly over the economy. All this $4.5 trillion of quantitative easing, and all the $2 trillion that it’s created under the Trump by the CARES Act – all this could have been spent into the real economy. It could have been spent building infrastructure. It could have been spent supporting basic income. It could have been spent on the people and Main Street. Instead, it was only spent on Wall Street. The idea is that if you buy an asset, you can always make a profit. That created the middle class from 1945 to about 2008. The way that almost all the middle-class wealth in America was accumulated was through the rising price of housing. In other words, every family that bought a house had to pay more and more of its income, and a higher and higher price to get a house. That’s enriched the people who were fortunate enough to have been able to buy real estate in 1945: white people, not blacks, not Hispanics; they were red-lined. But if you were a white person with a job, you could get onto the middle-class debt treadmill, and actually make it work for you – for a while.

Everybody thought that they could just keep borrowing money to make an even larger asset-price gain. Remember, in 2006, 07 and 08, people thought that if you borrow as much as you can, forget the interest rate, you can pay back the banks out of the rising price of the housing. But then the housing price stopped and you had nine or 10 million families lose their homes in the great Obama foreclosures. He said, “Either I can support the banks or I can support my voters. Who am I going to support? Well, the banks are my campaign contributors and I’m going to support my donor class.” He invited them to the White House and said, “I’m the guy standing between you and the mob with pitchforks.” the voters for me, the people that Hillary called the deplorables. He said, “I’ll protect you,” and he did indeed. No banker went to jail. He gave the banks enormous amounts of money, at the cost of the 10 million families that he exploited. The cost was stopping industrialization in this country, stopping the domestic market and bringing on the Obama depression.

That’s the policy that Biden is committed to follow. He committed himself in the last few days, saying that his intention to get re-elected is not to appeal to Bernie Sanders or the left or the working class, but to try to get enough Republicans to vote for him that he can beat Trump. He’s supporting the position he pushed as vice president, supporting the banks, trying to write down Social Security, cut back Social Security, cut back Medicare, cut back social spending in order to give to the donor class on Wall Street. So we’re going to see Obama with an exclamation point with the Biden-Republican program likely to come to this country.

Ellen Brown: [00:16:35] We’re in a sorry state, I think. So your proposal then would be that we have a debt jubilee. So can you describe what that is and where the term came from and how you would actually do it?

Michael Hudson: [00:16:50] The term jubilee came from the Bible. It was pronounced “yobel.” The J was pronounced Y, as in Spanish and Hebrew. “Yobel” was the term used in Leviticus 25, saying that every 50 years you will cancel the debts, and you will free the debt servants who’ve been subjected to bondage, and you’ll return all of the slaves that have been pledged to creditors as the main collateral to the debtor, and you’ll return the land that they also lost. The yobel was the horn that was blown on the jubilee to signal it. But the word that they used in addition to yobel was deror, which was a cognate to the Babylonian word andurarum. It had been used ever since the Hammurabi and the Babylonian dynasty back in 1750 BC. Hammurabi, like every other member of his dynasty, started his reign by claiming an anderarum, a clean slate, a debt cancellation. He did this because he realized that debts grew faster than the ability to pay. If you didn’t write down the debts, you would have much of the population falling into debt to the creditors, including wealthy members in the palace bureaucracy. Hammurabi and other Near Eastern rulers realized that if you let people fall into debt to the creditors, they would have to spend their labor working for the creditors on their land, and wouldn’t be able to work on the public corvée infrastructure work. They wouldn’t be able to build palaces or walls, and they wouldn’t be able to pay their crops as taxes, because they’d owe it as interest to their creditors.

The reason I mentioned Hammurabi and selected him is because in his laws. You have the first example of an Act of God clause. One of Hammurabi’s laws said that if there is an act of God, if the storm God Adad floods the fields with water and you can’t harvest the crop, or if there’s a drought, then you don’t have to pay the rents or tax debts. “You’re freed from the debts because we don’t want you to fall into bondage to the creditors, because then you’d pay them the surplus and we wouldn’t have it at the palace.” And in other parts of his laws he said if there’s an epidemic, if there is a sickness, or if there’s a military defeat, then debts are cancelled because the whole idea is we’re not going to let the money that people owe grow to such a large rate that the economy shrinks and people fall into bondage. He knew very well that if the population fell into bondage, then either they would defect. There was constant warfare. Either they’d go over to somebody else’s side, or there’d be a revolution and they would overthrow the ruler and cancel the debts.

Attempts to overthrow rulers who didn’t cancel the debts were made all through Greek and Roman antiquity, from the eighth century BC down to the time of the first century B.C. in Rome. There were constant debtor revolts. The question ever since Roman times has been, what do you do when the debts get too large to pay? Well, the debts were simply written down in the Near East. They were not written down in Rome. Instead, you had a small oligarchy taking over the economy and enslaving or reducing most of the population to bondage. The result was the Dark Age.

ORDER IT NOW

So to get back to your question, how do you cancel the debts? Look at what’s happening right now with the virus. A lot of people are unemployed – what’s the number 20 million or 40 million unemployed? They’re not able to pay their rents or, if they bought a house, they’re not able to pay their mortgage and other debts. So rents and mortgages are going unpaid. Beginning in July, and especially in August, there’s talk of large-scale evictions. Millions of Americans who’ve lost the job will not get any more money from the government. They’ve had to use the stimulus money just to buy food on the table and break even. So if you don’t write down the debts for these people, if you don’t cancel the rents and say, “OK, we know that you didn’t have a job, you can’t pay the rent.”

The same is true for businesses, especially for restaurants. If you don’t free them from the rents, then they’re going to go out of business and they’ll be unemployed. And, you’re going to have a gigantic homeless problem in the United States. You can just imagine the political results of all that. For one thing, now that the rents aren’t being paid, homeowners have been saying … and businesses, restaurants and stores … that they have insurance against the interruption of business. The insurance companies, which are just as crooked as the banks in this country, are saying, “Well, we can’t afford to pay you. It’s true, you got insurance, but if we paid you, then we’d go broke. So we’re not going to pay you.”

And the landlords, meanwhile, say, “Well, if we don’t get the rent, then we can’t pay the banks and the banks will foreclose.” That’s one reason why Wall Street is soaring. This is a bonanza for the really rich billionaires and multibillionaires and big companies like Blackstone. They think, “Oh, boy, there’s going to be another wave of foreclosures. Trump is doing as wonderful a job for us as Obama did.” Under Obama, homeownership fell from 57 percent to about 51 percent. And now there’s so many people who’ve been unable to pay their mortgages, that they’re going to lose their homes. The banks will sell the homes and office buildings in a convulsion of sell offs. Blackstone and other speculators are all going to be able to get rich and homeownership is going to plunge in the United States by another five points. We’ll be turning away from being a home-owning middle-class society into a rentier society that’s more and more impoverished. That is the result of what’s going to happen if the debts are not written down.

So the question is, is it really worth subjecting the economy to poverty, to homelessness, to close down businesses, to end the middle class in order to pay debts to the financial class that have made all the gains and growth since 2008? Or do we want to say, “OK, the debts can’t be paid.” That means that the mortgages won’t be paid, the loans won’t be paid, and some of these trillions of dollars that the financial sector and the Five Percent and the One Percent have made are going to be given back? Well, the One Percent says, “We’re not going to give back a penny. We are going to insist that the debts be paid. It’s worth it to us to impoverish the economy so we can get richer, even if by getting one dollar, we’re willing to make the economy lose a billion dollars because that’s all we care about.” That’s the point at which the American economy has reached today. Most of the discussions in the mainstream press don’t spell out the fact that if the economy does not write down the debts, we’re in for a chronic depression that will last until the debts are finally written down.

Ellen Brown: [00:25:47] So if you were to write them down, it would have to be up to Congress, like you say. I mean, they’re the only one with the leverage to do it. They’ve got control.

Michael Hudson: [00:25:56] Or, it can be up to the people in a revolution. In Rome there were revolutions to do it.

Ellen Brown: [00:26:01] That’s true. I think there are a few Congresspeople we could get to bring a bill or something. How would you do it? Would the banks just write off those mortgages or, you know, there are some landlords who … like little old ladies who have rented out some rooms and that’s their income, for example. I mean, there are some people that really probably don’t deserve to be in that position. But the banks, we definitely don’t seem to mind writing down their loans. I just wondered exactly, if you were to have the ability to implement such a law, how would you write it?

Michael Hudson: [00:26:38] You have to let nature take its course. You have to let the banks go under. You had a wonderful chance in 2008 for the banks to go under. We’ve spoken before on this show about what the FDIC proposed under Sheila Bair. She said, “Look, the most incompetent, worst-managed bank in the worst trouble is Citibank.” She said, “We could have taken it over.” There was enough money in Citibank to pay all the insured depositors. The speculators, stockholders and some bondholders would have been wiped out. But the bondholders are the wealthiest One Percent. We could have taken it out. And then, Citibank could have been operated as a public bank, which is what you’re talking about.

The fact is that banking should be a public utility. Privatized banking has not really helped the economy, because it makes loans basically against collateral. When you make loans against collateral – the house, real estate, corporate stocks and bonds – the effect of bank lending is to increase the price of this collateral. You end up with a high-priced economy: high housing prices, high retirement-income prices, high insurance prices. And you can’t have a viable public banking system built on the wreckage of the commercial banking system that has almost committed suicide, as you’ve described. You’re not going to be able to go forward.

ORDER IT NOW

You can’t simply return to normalcy because normalcy was a situation that brought us to this problem to begin with. You can’t simply keep lending, bailing out the banks and giving them more and more money to increase the debt more and more, because at a certain point the debt can’t be sustained. There will be a write-down of debts, one way or another. The question is, how will the debts be written down when they can’t be paid? Either you’re going to have foreclosures, which was the Obama and the Biden Democratic Party solution, or you’ll have the creditors and the banking system lose. If you were to rewrite the laws to take away all of the special tax favoritism for the financial sector, all the special deregulation and favoritism for the banks, they’d go under and the government could easily take them over and operate them as public banks, more and more like savings banks used to be. They wouldn’t necessarily be able to create credit except for public-authorized purposes. They wouldn’t be able to make the takeover loans, the predatory payday loans, and the other kinds of predatory finance that the commercial banking system has become in this country. So the problem isn’t simply a debt write-down; it’s to restructure the financial system to make it into a public utility instead of a private monopoly.

Ellen Brown: [00:29:54] Right. I totally endorse that. That sounds great. So, I saw you wrote recently about the question of whether it wouldn’t be inflationary doing all these bailouts. You said no, that we’re actually in an era of deflation, and basically the way the Fed has been doling out money to the financial sector makes the deflation issue worse. Can you explain that?

Michael Hudson: [00:30:24] There are two kinds of prices in the economy. One is prices for goods and services that people buy: the consumer price index for food, clothing, shelter; the other is the price of assets. What we have is asset-price inflation. The banks have been bailed out to lend more and more money against assets, that is, the collateral that they lend against. So banks have created this huge rise in housing prices. The basis of middle-class wealth has been created by banks increasing the price of real estate, the price of stocks and bonds. But increasing the price of real estate means that in order to buy a home of your own, or in order to rent a home, you have to pay more of your income to the financial sector, to the banks for the mortgage. Rent is for paying interest. Speculators, absentee owners, and real estate developers will borrow money from a bank in order to pay all of the rent basically for interest. What they’re after is the capital gain – the price rise. But as prices rise for real estate, stocks and bonds, the rest of the population has to pay more income, not only for housing but for a retirement income, and for monopoly goods and services. We turn into a rentier economy. More and more income is paid for economic rent, not for profits, not for wages, not for goods and services, but as a carrying charge for assets that are financed by bank credit. This is where the financial sector undercuts the economy.

This is not capitalism, in the sense that it is not industrial capitalism. It’s not what people expected in the 19th century. Finance capitalism can be thought of as the failure of industrial capitalism to free economies from rent and interest and from the legacy of feudalism. The finance capitalism that we have is the road back to feudalism. It’s neofeudalism. It’s neoserfdom. It’s turning the population into debt serfs, debt peons who have to pay all of the income that they have to the creditor, and don’t have enough money to buy goods and services. So of course, goods and services prices are actually falling, because people don’t have enough money to buy them. That’s because more and more of their income is paid for access to financialized housing, financialized public utilities and financialized monopoly services.

Ellen Brown: [00:33:09] That’s my argument too. You could pour money into the real economy in the form of universal basic income or any other kind of helicopter money, relieving student debts, etc. And because that economy is actually short on money, it would fill that gap, the difference between debt and the money available to repay it. And the money that trickles up, that goes into the other … There are actually two economies and the money that goes into the financialized economy never comes back. I wish I could prove that, but it seems to me you can just see that that’s true. There’s only so many shoes you can buy. All the rest of your big money goes to big things like bribing politicians or buying Iowans their yachts or something like that.

Michael Hudson: [00:33:57] There’s a simple explanation. The money doesn’t go back to the real economy, the production and consumption economy. The goes into the financial economy. It is recycled into bidding up the price of houses and stocks and bonds. And this price can go down and it can disappear. It can be eradicated, and always is in a financial collapse. So the question is, what is the economy? There are really two economies. There’s the production and consumption economy of workers producing goods and services, and buying what they produce. And there’s the financial economy. It’s really more than the financial economy. It’s the finance, insurance and real estate sector — the FIRE sector. When the money goes out of the goods and service economy into the rent and interest economy, it goes from the 99 Percent into the hands of the One Percent. So you can have the Main Street — the 95 or 99 percent of the population — and the financial economy that are becoming very much like the hereditary landlord class that ruled Europe off in the Middle Ages until the 19th century when industrial capitalism was supposed to free economies from this predatory class.

Industrial capitalism seemed to be taking off until World War I, but World War I changed everything. Since then, you have had a degeneration of industrial capitalism into its antithesis finance capitalism, which is really a fall back into neofeudalism and neoserfdom. Where will the Americans emigrate to when there are no jobs and they lost their houses?

Ellen Brown: [00:35:43] Yeah, they’ll go to Mexico. I saw a joke about that, something about, “Are you coming in or going out?”

Michael Hudson: [00:35:48] Well, they’d better learn Spanish.

Ellen Brown: [00:35:50] Yeah. Yeah. Saw another joke it was the Statue of Liberty said, “Another year like this and gone back to France.” Yeah, well, it’s been great talking to you.

Michael Hudson: [00:36:03] By the way, the Statue of Liberty holding the torch, that iconography occurs very early in civilization. When Hammurabi cancelled the debts, he raised the sacred torch. And the announcement “the ruler has raised the sacred torch” was a symbol in Babylonia for proclaiming a debt cancellation.

Ellen Brown: [00:36:27] Oh cool. We have that right in New York Harbor.

Michael Hudson: [00:36:30] Yes.

Ellen Brown: [00:36:31] Okay, that’s great. All right. Well, it’s been wonderful talking to you, as always.

Michael Hudson: [00:36:36] The same here. I hope we can get into more details next time.

(Republished from It's Our Money with Ellen Brown by permission of author or representative)
 
• Category: Economics • Tags: Banking Industry, Debt, Federal Reserve 
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  1. We are extremely lucky on UR to have such a giant, the best economist in the world, explaining this, telling us of our terrible peril, and explaining the simple, simple remedy that the vultures don’t want us to know. Because it would reduce them from multi-billionaires to multi-millionaires.

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  2. Speculators, absentee owners, and real estate developers will borrow money from a bank in order to pay all of the rent basically for interest. What they’re after is the capital gain – the price rise.

    Gee, and here I’ve been investing for total return all this time. I didn’t know I was required to be severely overleveraged to play the game, except that there is ample evidence that there is little downside for the 0.1% to go down that path.

    The finance capitalism that we have is the road back to feudalism. It’s neofeudalism. It’s neoserfdom. It’s turning the population into debt serfs, debt peons who have to pay all of the income that they have to the creditor, and don’t have enough money to buy goods and services.

    Perhaps, but if private finance is the road to serfdom for most, public finance would be the superhighway to serfdom for nearly all but a few of the current crop of criminal elite. Who do you think will be running public finance? The same criminal elite running today’s financial capitalism.

    There might be some pockets of deflation, chiefly in debt assets, but in the real consumer economy you are going to see the mother of all inflation bombs hit as money shaken off the Magic Money Tree (nothing of value traded for value) chases a reduced supply of real goods that were produced with correspondingly lower inputs of real and human capital (value for value).

    As for jubilee, it might let off some steam, but it is nothing more than letting one corner of the criminal elite continue to hold onto the reigns of power and plunder by letting another corner of the criminal elite take it in the shorts. In a functioning capitalist society, this would work its way out in bankruptcy courts on the margins in individual cases, i.e. a “market” mechanism that might hurt a few, rather than a political broadsword that hurts most.

    • Agree: mark tapley
  3. barr says:

    I wonder if Mr Hudson can throw some light on the angles around the sex,debt and the sin . How did sex come to occupy such a central place in Bible and how did the debt get banished from the New Testament as an issue of the prime importance ?

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  4. Jubilee is not that complicated. Debts that are owed directly to the government, like student loans, can be directly written off by the government. This is jubilee like the ancient kind.

    For private debts, the treasury can create as much electronic money as it needs. Treasury can issue direct payments to the debt holders in the name of the debtors, paying off the debt, without violating any private contacts. Bonus: the money never even enters the consumer economy to cause inflation.

    Creation of public banks and common sense reforms of mortgage underwriting laws, anti usury laws, bankruptcy laws, and so on, could prevent it from getting this bad again.

    Where is any of this even being mentioned in the popular narrative? Using their media megaphone, they have hijacked everyone’s brains with countless distractions.

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  5. There is always in every society those that do not want to compete in the market but rather use their connections to make society work for them. This is the situation now with the global banking cartel and our unconstitutional central bank. Congress has given them sovereign immunity from prosecution as evident in the bailout for billionaire programs of -08-09 and again now in their thefts under the cover of the fake virus to steal trillions for their friends on Wall St.

    The inflationary cycles created by the central bank as before the Great Depression and before the housing boom cause a misallocation in the market that is used by the politically connected to their advantage. The fiat money system also moves the wealth to the top since they are the first to gain access to the money before it filters on down through the economy. The banking cartel’s control of fiat money allows for the permanent warfare – welfare state because instead of taxing the goyim directly for our never ending Wars For Greater Israel that the people would revolt against or facing the inability to borrow (issue bonds) the Zionists just use the indirect and most insidious method to finance their rackets.

    If we had remained on a system where money was gold and silver as demanded for market transactions, every bank would have to stand or fall on its own integrity and normal market forces would control prices, not a cartel of financial criminals. Money is too important to be put in the hands of any group and that includes the so called “public banks” which would still be under the banking cartel as we are now.

    The debt forgiveness that Hudson refers to is dealing with ancient subsistence agriculture for the most part. Not a situation where some college kid racks up 100,000 in debt to be a fashion designer or someone is trying to get rich flipping houses. It’s easy to overload the wagon with debt but the fiat monetary inflationary system causes a maladjustment in the market and leads to the boom and bust cycles that make sound decisions more difficult. Who would lend money if the gov. could arbitrarily abolish the debt. Access to capitol is critical for business development and the government needs to be kept out of our business dealings as the founders intended.

    Government needs to be off our back and out of our pockets. For the gov. to have any power other than to perform very basic functions as outlined in our original constitution is just an invitation to further corruption. A good example of government at work is not only the massive military waste for the Israeli Foreign Legion (U.S. military) but the 15 trillion in welfare spending since shabbos goy LBJ began the Great Society Programs in the 60’s to eliminate poverty. Poverty is now worse than ever. How can you fight poverty by robbing money from the productive members of society and giving it to non producers to subsidize their nonproductively. Now we have the new program of eliminating millions of jobs and businesses for a fake virus that has not even been scientifically identified.

    • Replies: @paranoid goy
  6. @Jedi Night

    There’s no free lunch. Once the government got involved in student loans things started getting out of control just like in the medical system. If the gov had stayed out of both the market would have provided the best deal at the best price. And kids would have been more careful about borrowing money for worthless courses. The same is true for housing. This bubble was planned all the way back to Reagan. The Too Big to Fail Bankers with full gov. cooperation set up the derivative racket knowing they could short sell the fraud and then get their flunkies in Congress to bail them out so they could pay off the rich 1% bondholders. Yeah lets get the gov. more involved.

  7. @barr

    The Parable of the Talents is found in Matt. 25:14-30. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 and 1 Timothy 1:8-11 deal with sexual sin but there are several others in the New Testament. Matt.18:21-35 deals with debt from the Christian perspective. Whereas the Law of Moses (for the Jewish Nation only before the coming of Christ) just rolled sins forward through the offering of sacrifices and was specific in the letter of the law (do this don’t do that) the New Law of Christ is more of an adoption of principles by example. Debt is covered but the New Testament is very concise. The aim of the writers was not to give financial advice but to guide one to accept the Gospel Of Christ.

    • Replies: @Barr
  8. Asset inflation is all Wall Street knows since Maestro Greenspan leveraged our futures with 30 years of successive Greenspan Puts which in turn allowed Wall Street to further leverage the dark pool derivatives universe.

    The dark pool derivatives universe is Professor Hudson’s undoing in so far as the investment banks and bank holding companies have all of their investments tied to these dark pools via derivatives.

    Bailing out the dark pool derivatives universe is absolutely impossible as they are running a betting empire that is vastly larger than the entire world GDP combined.

    Professor Hudson knows that violent revolution is the only course of action to take since Lehman imploded in 08. Marx predicted violent revolution, professor. Why are you advocating for debt forgiveness when violent revolution is the only rational choice?

    RW

    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    , @mark tapley
  9. @Robert White

    There is actually another alternative–very nasty but it has been very common throughout history.

    A military dictator takes charge, and decrees who shall get what.

    Anyone who insists they have been treated unfairly (whether justified or not) gets to continue their debate with a firing squad.

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  10. ” Obviously, at some point every exponential growth scheme has to stop, because otherwise you’d have an infinite amount of debt.”

    Nut of one reads the Fed’s policy papers they will state openly that debt is how n economy is run. The point of money circulation and expansion is based on lending. The argument seems to be not whether one can have infinite debt, but how large that deb can be and still have an operating economy.

    As long as there is growth . . .

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  11. @Robert White

    The derivatives have were a big money maker for the sovereign banking cartel of member To Big To Fail banks. Set up front companies to short the junk derivatives while taking the bond investors money. Then get the shabbos goy lackies in Congress to bail out the wealthy bond holders.

    The middle class has already been pretty much wiped out by the fiat financial system operating since it was installed by puppet actor Woodrow Wilson in 1913 under his Jew handlers. Marx (Moses Mordecai Levy) was the agent for these monopoly capitalists. He advocated this very system.

    There will be no revolution against the banking cartel. Very few people have any understanding of the fiat money racket. The goyim were scammed for trillions in 08-09 and now again under the cover of the fake virus. People that believe in mythical viruses with fake tests and made up numbers are way to stupid to revolt against clever predatory financial criminals. They will just keep sucking their exhaled Co2 back in as they are gradually herded into the U.N. planned Agenda 2030-21.

    • Replies: @Robert White
  12. @EliteCommInc.

    It depends on the size of the economy. Under the monopoly banking cartel in power, without credit mostly issued by the member banks there would be no money. This scheme allows for the fiat funding of permanent war for Greater Israel while also funding the continued expansion of the Zionist controlled big government. In a large economy as in Jewmerica this process can go as it has for a long time. Since the banking cartel in the U.S. was set up by the Rothschild partner Paul Warburg in 1910 and maneuvered through Congress by Nelson Aldrich in 1913 (Nelson Aldrich Rockefeller’s grand father) the rate of inflation (depreciation) has been ap. 50% every 17 years. It will increase now after so much recent theft by the global bankers for their friends on Wall St.

    It is only because Jewmerica has had such a dynamic economy built on free enterprise that this continuous inflationary theft has been able to continue so long without ruining the economic engine of real growth, Now that the once preeminent middle class of America has been hollowed out by the Zionist socialists in control, Jewmerica can soon be more comfortably merged with the other third world countries on our journey into the socialist tyranny of global government.

  13. Barr says:
    @mark tapley

    “The aim of the writers was not to give financial advice but to guide one to accept the Gospel Of Christ.”

    Back in those days, church was the source of all necessary advices Church leaders were the h teachers and guides . They should have done their jobs a little better than they did .
    You cant know much about acceptance of Jeuss if those with one could buy you and turn you into slaves and then out of sheer contempt make fun of Jesus -the savior. You need money

    Also Church advised a lot about sex and sex and fornication . That had nothing to do with accepting Jeuss

    I just wanted to see the connection between debt and sin and evolution of teh idea

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  14. @Barr

    I think you are confusing the first century Church as laid out in the New Testament with the Catholic Church that did not appear until over 200 years later and subverted the Gospel. The New Testament authorizes only Elders or as they were sometimes called Bishops as leaders of individual autonomous congregations. Not over more than one. There are no priests authorized because Christ is the advocate and intercedes on behalf of those who are in his body or his Church.

    The only advice a true Elder of the Church could give on any religious matter would be what is contained in the scriptures. Nothing more or less.

    Revelations: 22-18-19
    18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

    19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    • Replies: @anon
  15. @mark tapley

    You have no idea of what transpired March 10th 2008 around 11:00am Bear Stearns time New York City. The Securities and Exchange Commission-SEC will never reveal who shorted Bear Stearns in the REPO market as they imploded into financial oblivion. You have no idea that the financial establishment was completely eviscerated March 10th 08. You blame the Jews for the architectural implosion that emanated post-Lehman debacle, but you fail to grasp that they had no logical reason to destroy the financial architecture of the Western Empire of Fractional Reserve Banking.

    Bear Stearns was murdered outright on March 10th 08 for strategic purposes that enabled the next in line to be slaughtered outright September 11th 2008 which is exactly seven years to the day of 911 where the CIA imploded the WTC 1, 2, and Building 7 via Controlled Demolition.

    March 10th 08 was the Western Empire’s day of comeuppance whereby the entire global banking architecture was imploded via Wall Street connectivity and their poorly thought out finance calculus.

    Lastly, I realize that you are a frustrated individual, but there is really no call to blame the Jews for the murder of Bear Stearns et al. The Jews didn’t implode the Western Empire of Fraction Reserve Banking via Bear Stearns March 10th 2008 around 11:00am time NYC.

    Not even the Jews know what manifested that fateful morning of March 10th 08. Furthermore, if I catch you promulgating racism towards Jews one more time I will no longer interact with you, or your minions of hate towards human beings that live in this world.

    Sincerely, Robert

    • Replies: @mark tapley
  16. @Justvisiting

    The scenario you refer to is the course intended by the Zionists as taught by the Frankfurt School. They cannot achieve their goal of a global socialist tyranny of the elite unless governments are converted into Zionist Jew controlled “Democracies” by demoralizing and then destabilizing the goyim. This process has been underway in Jewmerica for over 100 years.

    First all of the former societies traditions, culture, teachings, mores and symbols of the target country must be vilified and thrown out to be replaced by the new politically correct ideology. This is to be accompanied by widespread desecration, looting, assaults and general lawlessness on the prevailing society. Once the situation deteriorates sufficiently the people will demand the gov. do something. This is when the dictatorship is revealed and martial law declared. Then the looters and agitators will be swept from the streets as planned all along and the new order established.

  17. @Robert White

    Bear Stearns was just one Wall St. player. The frauds I am referring to were the the short positions taken by the Jews at Golman Sachs. They set up the front company and placed the short positions and made over a billion Then the tax payers covered their wealthy bondholders. Citi Bank I believe got the biggest bailout even though they like the other To Big to Fail Banks all had the money to cover their regular depositors. They should have been left to fail and then someone else would have taken over. The principles of these fraudulent banks should have been prosecuted not handed huge payoffs. By the next year they were already giving million dollar bonuses. They have sovereign immunity from prosicution from our shabbos goy aIPAC controlled Congress and the Jews at Goldman Sachs were the biggest culprits. They could afford the 550 million fine when they had gained way over a billion from their fraud.

    These big banks and others are some of the owners of the FED and they knew that their fraud would be picked up by the taxpayers. They had been changing the rules for investment banking since the Jew Greenspan and the puppet actor Reagan.

    As far as my comments on Wilson you can check out who really ran the operation for yourself. He was put in power by the Wall St. gang by using their operative Teddy Roosevelt in the phony Bull Moose party to pull votes from Taft. Wilson was controlled by Rothschild operative Col House, Bernard Baruch and Eugene Meyer. He was practically comatose for almost his entire second term. Wilson also was forced to nominate the rabid Zionist Jew Louis Brandis to the Supreme Court. During the administration of this syphilitic puppet Wilson, Jew Rothschild partner James Warburg authored the so called Federal Reserve Act that was ushered through the Congress by Senator Nelson Aldrich (Maternal grand father of Nelson Aldrich Rockefeller) that was the precursor for all the theft and corruption since then by the global banking cartel.

    There was no big catastrophe. If the To Big To Fail Banks would not have gotten the bailouts from the taxpayers obligating our children and their children then contrary to what the bank theives and the Jew controlled MSM said it would have only been a catastrophe for those banks (as I said regular deposits were covered) and for the 1% bondholders. No one else.

    Let me clarify my position. on the Jews because you bring up a point that many people would probably take the same way but that is not my intention. I am referring to the Zionist Jews only. I just don’t spell it all out every time because most people probably know that. There are many Jews that are opposed to The Jewish nationalism that is the foundation for the criminal syndicate that founded the so called FED and has driven the world wars as they now do with the “War on Terror” to fulfill the Yinnon Plan for Greater Israel. Their are many gentiles also involved. A good example is the senile crook and self described Zionist Joe Biden. Trump has always been controlled by this group. Pelosi is even on video stating her father “was a shabbos goy.” I never discussed Bear Stearns. I was referring to the activities of Goldman Sachs.

    The banking cartel fiat monopoly is the Zionists no.1 tool to conquer the nations and ruin the people. This racket gives the criminal syndicate financial control over the country. Once that is accomplished the rest of the globalist Agenda is just a matter of time. As James Warburg (member of the global banking controlled CFR) told Congress in 1950 “We shall have world government, wether or not we like it.

    • Replies: @Jedi Night
  18. anon[327] • Disclaimer says:
    @mark tapley

    Revelations: 22-18-19
    18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy o…..
    19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book ..

    Who cares ?

    Are you saved? Have you accepted Jesus ? No I haven’t .

    I have other pressing issue than forgiving some psychos like Bush Obama Trump or Reagan who think they are saved just because they accepted Jesus .
    What difference is there between this Biblical testimony and the ritual based paganism that also promises salvation to killers and rapist in exchange for sacrifices or acceptance ?

  19. There are many that profess Christianity. James 2:19 says Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble and Matt. 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. The New Testament is clear we cannot continue in sin. Luke 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. Romans 14:11 for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. Finally Mark 8:36 or what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

    • Replies: @Anon
  20. @Ann Nonny Mouse

    What simple remedy? Who is going to risk making a loan if the debt is absolved and the contract nullified? Do you think wiping the slate clean will make profligate spenders do better next time? Hudson’s solution is to raise real estate taxes (unearned income) on the financial class in order to prevent debt deflation as a result of the rentiers bidding up real estate values and therefore requiring the big majority of people to have to commit more of their money to the FIRE sector. I realize that lots of this money goes to bid up further real estate investments but that’s still better than giving it to the gov. We need to drastically cut the size and scope of gov. not give them more power and money.

    Hudsons debt Jubille helped maintain the subsistence agriculture peasants loyalty to the ruling aristocracy but would have a very negative effect on savings and investment in a more advanced society.

    Business owners as well as Hudson’s Rentiers many times take advantage of the depreciation allowance. If not for this lots of businesses would not be viable as in many other ways they are often a tax target.

    Had we stayed on course with our original form of government where there was no fiat money banking cartel and no income tax (both planks of Marx- Moses Mordecai Levy) then the big crony government that we have today could not have developed. A lot of damage had been inflicted by the socialists tyranny of Lincoln and the northern radicals but things had returned to a more normal state except for the push by the preeminent social and economic forces of the late 1800’s of the Rockefeller and Morgan (both tied to the Rothschilds) to implement monopoly capitalism with them at the helm.

    Had we stayed on course with free market money of gold and silver and a Republic of sovereign States with a very limited national gov. as a mere agent for the states then taxes would be apportioned according to population and would be very low across the board as the founders intended. Then no one could complain about unfair advantages.

    Yes Hudson is a great economist but I think his debt Jubilee would have a seriously negative effect on investment capital. In a low tax environment everyone could maximize their saving and investment and thats the mainspring of process.

    • Replies: @Jedi Night
  21. @mark tapley

    Jubilee doesn’t involve cancellation of contacts. Debts would be cancelled by being paid.

    I used to be libertarian too, so please don’t take my comments as hostile, but all your arguments are basically pointless. Yes, it’s true that none of these problems exist if limited government was followed. Ok, granted. Does that make you feel better? Now, what solution do you offer for today?

    The economy is exploited by a financial oligarchy to enrich themselves, creating a positive feedback loop enhancing their political power which they use to further enhance their economic position. Now, what is your solution?

    If your solution involves returning to the 18th century, you’ll be sent back to the children’s table.

    Seriously, I’ll just put a gold star on your essay, ok. Your libertarian solution sounds great, you’ve done a great intellectual job of pointing out the advantages of a system that existed hundreds of years ago.

    Now, your assignment is to explain why that system changed, and why it cannot be resurrected today. Until you get a passing grade on that essay, you really aren’t qualified to discuss things at the grown-up table, because you aren’t yet engaged with reality.

    P.S., your graduate level assignment is to research how the modern libertarian movement and philosophy is in fact a front, a Judas goat, a false opposition, which actually is serving the interests of the oligarchy.

    I realize that this is probably just a waste of time, that you have found your intellectually satisfying end point in libertarianism, and that you have no inclination towards change or growth. You are probably right now penning your aggressive and derogatory response. I’ve been down this road with libertarians before. I can only say, I was once a libertarian too, and this is offered in the humble hope that you can outgrow your conditioning too.

  22. @mark tapley

    You are obviously a smart and well read man and deep Christian, and we have much in common. Let me cut directly to what I perceive as our point of fundamental disagreement. You say “The banking cartel fiat monopoly is the Zionists no.1 tool to conquer the nations and ruin the people.”

    My basic point is that the best most workable solution to that problem is to democratize that institution. That is, make the power of sovereign money serve the interests of the people, not the oligarchy.

    The simple reality is that fiat money is not going to disappear. In fact, it has tremendous potential for good. The oligarchy fears nothing more than the democratization of monetary policy.

    Above all, remember this, friend: Jubilee is God’s idea, it is part of His economic plan. I was preaching Jubilee before Steven Keen, Michael Hudson, or Ellen Brown, because I take the Word seriously and I figured out how it could work in our world today.

  23. Dear Jedi Night: I appreciate your sincerity. But like the Apostle Paul before his conversion on the road to Damascus, he was sincerely wrong. You can’t take an inherently corrupt system and make it honest. That is why it was used in the first place.

    Money is a standard of measurement. It cannot be “democratized.” It either meets the criteria for real money within the market as with gold and silver or it does not as is the case with a fiat “elastic” system of financial fraud. That is why it is one of the planks of Marx (Moses Mordecai Levy) Communist Manifesto. It will always be abused by those in control. There are no angels in this world that can be trusted with managing a country’s money, only hard money currency in a free market. There has never been any good come from the banking cartel’s control of fiat money and credit. They can temporarily stimulate the market like a dope addict can get his fix. In the long run the currency is debased using the boom and bust cycle and the wealth is moved to the top. That was the plan all along.

    Now for the arcane idea of the debt Jubilee. This was one of the many things employed during the Law of Moses for the Jewish nation. It was God’s plan then but not today. We are under the Law of Christ and the Law of Moses has been fulfilled and is no longer in effect for either the Jews or the Gentiles. God through the Prophets led the Jews until they demanded to have a king like all the peoples around them. For the rest of their history until God finally divorced them symbolized by the tearing of the veil in their temple they were almost always under the lion’s paw of a foreign ruler or had a despot of their own.

  24. @Jedi Night

    How would the debts be paid? By the banking cartel dumping more fiat money? Yeah, lets just let the unborn pick up the tab while we start the process all over again. Who is going to save and invest in such a financial universe? No serious investor or business owner, thats for sure.

    The financial principles applicable to the 18th century are still just as relevant today. The Bank of England’s monetary fraud started in 1690 has not really changed. The Bank’s fiat money fraud is what led to the American Revolution as confirmed by Franklin. The attempt to force this fraud back on the new country was the reason for the War of 1812 confirmed by Nathan Rothschild. We are under this fraudulent fiat money cartel today.

    This global monetary swindle is not a political issue for those that understand it’s purpose and methods. It is not a left or right issue. It is a basic freedom to have honest money rather than a scam run by financial criminals for the aggrandizement of themselves and their partners in crime. Just because it has been going on for a long time and is sanctioned by their friends and co-conspirators in the government with a legal facade does not redeem it. I don’t think your sarcasm is relevant. Jesus drove the money changers out of the temple because of their iniquity. We need to do the same thing today. I am not gazing out from ivory tower. I did not say it would be easy.

    The global banking cartel has financial control, but they are after total control. As one of their chief culprits James Warburg said in 1950 “we shall have world government, wether or not we like it.” Those of us who oppose this tyranny are not fronts for a false opposition. Exposing them does not serve their interests. When the courageous Congressmen Wright Patman and Jerry Vorhis who felt just as I do were able to put strict limits on their massive interest collection that most people are not even aware of, they were not offering controlled opposition. They and other real Americans have delt the FED real damage. It is you with your snide remarks that plays into the Zionists hands. I will never bow down and rationalizing their financial sin.

  25. @mark tapley

    All behold! We are honoured today by a brand new AI persona, Mark Tapley. Whomever owns this machine, congratulations, it almost passes the Turing test!
    I hope you paid lots for it…

  26. Anon[891] • Disclaimer says:
    @mark tapley

    That’s why those believers – some 70 % signed up for Bush ( aparently no longer a Christian by your book ) wars and later Obama wars . They are still very quiet on the mischiefs Trump has been wrecking in middl East .

    Per your definition, it seems only Christian left is – well none actually.

  27. @Jedi Night

    “The economy is exploited by a financial oligarchy to enrich themselves, creating a positive feedback loop enhancing their political power which they use to further enhance their economic position.”

    Quite right.

    “Testing Theories of American Politics: Elites, Interest Groups, and Average Citizens
    Martin Gilens and Benjamin I. Page
    Each of four theoretical traditions in the study of American politics—which can be characterized as theories of Majoritarian Electoral Democracy, Economic-Elite Domination, and two types of interest-group pluralism, Majoritarian Pluralism and Biased Pluralism—offers different predictions about which sets of actors have how much influence over public policy: average citizens; economic elites; and organized interest groups, mass-based or business-oriented. A great deal of empirical research speaks to the policy influence of one or another set of actors, but until recently it has not been possible to test these contrasting theoretical predictions against each other within a single statistical model. We report on an effort to do so, using a unique data set that includes measures of the key variables for 1,779 policy issues. Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent influence. The results provide substantial support for theories of Economic-Elite Domination and for theories of Biased Pluralism, but not for theories of Majoritarian Electoral Democracy or Majoritarian Pluralism. “
    https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/mgilens/files/gilens_and_page_2014_-testing_theories_of_american_politics.doc.pdf

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