The Unz Review: An Alternative Media Selection
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 BlogviewJohn Derbyshire Archive
Cecil the Lion and the Goodwhite-Badwhite Cold Civil War
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New ReplyRead More
ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
AgreeDisagreeThanksLOLTroll
These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Thanks, LOL, or Troll with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used three times during any eight hour period.
Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

adX48efQ3arAEpsQe5LS_simba-the-lion-king-30983414-292-400[1] The subject of our latest Two Minutes Hate: 55-year-old Dr. Walter Palmer, a dental practitioner from the Minneapolis suburb of Eden Prairie. Early in July, Dr. Palmer, on a hunting vacation in Zimbabwe, killed a lion. Now he’s in hiding, his office is under siege by furious mobs, and his patients have all deserted him.

All the emotional stops have been pulled out for this one. The mobs around Dr. Palmer’s office are weeping and rending their garments. Mothers are taking their little kiddies—known in lion-speak as “midnight snacks“—to lay bouquets of flowers on Dr. Palmer’s doorstep in memoriam for the lion.

I suppose the tots have images of Simba in their silly Disneyfied heads. Come to think of it, probably the “adults” do, too.

Sentimentality about animals is not a new thing in the world, of course. I can remember my sister, back in the Truman administration, crying when the hunters shot Bambi’s mother.

That was fiction, though; my sister was five; our fellow-countrymen had just gotten through reducing Hamburg and Berlin to piles of rubble; and anyway Bambi’s Mom was a herbivore. This fuss over the lion is way more preposterous.

Latest news as we go to tape: this incident—which happened in Zimbabwe, remember—is now a federal case, literally. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service announced on Thursday that it is investigating the killing. They will, they tell us, quote, “go where facts lead.” [US Fish & Wildlife Service Investigating Killing Of Cecil The Lion « CBS Minnesota, June 30, 2015]

Why all the hullabaloo? What are the facts? Let’s take a look.

This wasn’t just any lion. This was Cecil, a star attraction in Hwange National Park. That’s a huge safari park—it’s about eighty miles across—in the west of Zimbabwe.

The late Cecil was 13 years old at time of death, equivalent to mid-fifties in human years. He was named after 19th-century empire-builder Cecil Rhodes—as indeed was Zimbabwe, when it used to be called Rhodesia. Concerning Rhodes, historian James Morris had this to say in 1968:

article-1338791-0C7E429E000005DC-684_634x415[1] Rhodes died in 1902, and was buried at a site of his own choosing in the Matopo Hills in Rhodesia, which he called The World’s View. There, in a place of silent beauty, he lies with his friend Jameson and the dead of Allan Wilson’s Shangani patrol—all the heroes of Rhodesia, awaiting one fears not the Last Trump but the next regime. [Pax Britannica: Climax of an Empire, p. 298]

Rhodes was the man who said, “To be born an Englishman is to win first prize in the lottery of life.” He was not the man who said,” If you don’t like black people, don’t come to live in Africa,” That was Sir Roy Welensky, premier, until 1963, of what is now Zimbabwe.

So anyway, this lion Cecil was killed by Dr. Palmer of Minneapolis. What’s wrong with that?

Well, nothing per se. Shooting lions is legal in Zimbabwe, provided the proper formalities are observed. Lots of people, big game hunters, go there for just that purpose, as Dr. Palmer did.

Problem is, the formalities were not observed. Cecil was shot a few hundred yards outside the park, on privately owned land that had not been assigned a lion quota. That’s the main point of illegality.

Cecil wore a radio collar because he was being tracked by an Oxford University research project. That’s OK: It is not illegal to shoot a collared lion. He was drawn out of the park by bait and shot initially with a bow and arrow. He staggered off, was tracked for several miles, and was then dispatched with a rifle shot. None of that is illegal either. However, the hunting guide who lured the lion so Dr. Palmer could shoot it, tried to destroy the collar when he saw it. That is a secondary illegality.

So the illegality here is pretty technical stuff: no lion quota on the private land where Cecil was shot, attempted destruction of the tracking collar. Dr. Palmer tells us, very plausibly, that he had all necessary permits and relied on the guide and the landowner to ensure everything was legal. From what I’ve read so far, I don’t see any way he can be faulted on this.

The killing happened, furthermore, in Zimbabwe, a country not best known for firm adherence to rule of law, property rights, and governmental integrity. The place is, in fact, a miserable black African slum r uled by an aged despot who has murdered his political opponents, banned dissent, and allowed his family and friends to loot the economy, what’s left of it.

Freedom House ranks nations on a four-point scale: Free, Partly Free, Not Free, and Worst of the Worst. Zimbabwe is ranked Not Free. Starting 15 years ago, white farmers have been driven off their land, frequently with violence, and their farms have been handed over to blacks with political connections. Only about 300 farms are still white-owned, down from 4,500.

Zimbabwe is an economic disaster zone. Six years ago the currency bottomed out after years of hyperinflation. For a while the national bank was issuing $100 trillion bills, each one worth around 33 cents U.S. The currency has since been recalibrated, but the economy hasn’t improved much.

The latest report on Zimbabwe from Human Rights Watch makes pretty devastating reading. You can read it for yourself on the Internet. That’s humanrights.

And people—Americans—are worked up about animal rights in this hell-hole?

If you insist on discussing animal rights in Zimbabwe, start from the rampant poaching since whites lost control of the country. Poaching has severely depleted wildlife stocks, to the enrichment of the poachers and of their friends and relatives in Zimbabwe’s ruling class. This is Africa, for crying out loud.

ORDER IT NOW

National Geographic reported in 2007 that 60 percent of Zimbabwe’s total wildlife had been killed off in just the previous seven years. [Zimbabwe’s Wildlife Decimated by Economic Crisis, by Nick Wadhams, August 1, 2007] The surprising thing in the Cecil story is not that a guy shot a lion, but that there are any lions left to shoot.

So, once again, why the massive nationwide hysteria over a lion killed in a remote, badly misgoverned country, under some rather technical issues of local illegality, by a hunter who plausibly was not aware of those issues?

Because, inevitably, the whole incident became refracted through the lens of current public discourse in the U.S.A. into a skirmish in what I call the Cold Civil War: that is, the everlasting struggle between, on the one hand, the Progressive goodwhites who dominate our country’s mainstream culture—the Main Stream Media, the universities and law schools, big corporations, the federal bureaucracy—and, on the other hand, the ignorant gap-toothed hillbilly redneck badwhites clinging to their gun s and religion out on the despised margins of civilized society.

Dr. Palmer is, of course, a badwhite. The evidence for this in in his actions. Hunting charismatic megafauna for sport is a thing only badwhites do. Big game trophy hunting is in fact as typically, characteristically badwhite as shopping at Whole Foods, or patronizing microbreweries, or listening to NPR are characteristically goodwhite.

For a full catalog of typical goodwhite lifestyle choices I refer you to Christian Landers’ 2008 book Stuff White People Like—slightly out of date now, but still reliable on most points. I have occasionally entertained the notion of putting out an updated version to be titled Stuff Goodwhites Like, with a companion volume titled, of course, Stuff Badwhites Like. Big game trophy hunting—indeed, hunting of all kinds—would definitely be listed in that latter volume, along with commercial beer, pickup trucks, Protestant Christianity, side-clip suspenders, NASCAR, and other badwhite favorites.

So we now have our badwhite antihero: this leocidal dentist, Walter Palmer. Who will step up to do battle for the goodwhites?

Jimmy Kimmel, that’s who.

Kimmel’s is one of those names that floats around on the outer fringes of my awareness. I know he has a late-night talk show, but I’ve never actually watched it. Looking him up, I see that he’s a 47-year-old native of Brooklyn of mixed German and Italian ancestry who’s been busy in radio and TV all his adult life. Hey, good luck to him.

Now there’s a clip of Jimmy Kimmel on his TV show the other day putting the goodwhite viewpoint on the Cecil story with exceptional clarity. Samples:

[Kimmel]: The big question is: Why are you shooting a lion in the first place? I mean, I’m honestly curious to know why a human being would feel compelled to do that. How is that fun? Is it that difficult for you to get an erection that you need to kill things? [Prolonged applause.]

Note the instant recourse to sexual insult. It is an article of faith with goodwhites that badwhites have unsatisfactory sex lives, and that the discontent badwhites feel in this regard explains their otherwise incomprehensible tastes and viewpoints.

Whether badwhites actually do have less happy sex lives than goodwhites, I have no data. This ought to be a matter that can be settled by rigorous empirical enquiry—although given the difficulty of finding out what couples actually experience in the privacy of their chambers, there are some knotty problems of methodology to sort out. Pending reliable research studies, I stand agnostic.

But I can think of some facts that might be taken as counter-indications. On genetic evidence, for example, Genghis Khan seems to have enjoyed an exceptionally vigorous sex life, yet there surely can’t be many topics on which the great conqueror would agree with a modern Progressive goodwhite, certainly not big game hunting.

And then there is the fact—I’m pretty sure it’s a fact—that goodwhites’ fertility is way lower than badwhites’.

Whatever the underlying truth of the matter, what is undeniably on display here with Kimmel and his audience is the psychic need among goodwhites to feel, not only morally superior to badwhites, but also sexually superior. Just listen to the studio audience whooping and applauding in approval there. The thought they’re taking away, and that you are supposed to take away too, is something like: “If only Dr. Palmer were as sexually liberated and fulfilled as we are, he wouldn’t want to hunt and kill animals.”

For full penetration here, Kimmel follows up with a Viagra joke, followed in quick succession by a Bill Cosby joke:

Kimmel: If that’s the case, they have a pill for that. It works great. [Laughter.] Just stay home and swallow it, and you save yourself a lifetime of being the most hated man in America who never advertised Jell-O Pudding on television. [Laughter, applause.]

Kimmel’s performance strategy here seems to be: First, go for the broad goodwhite audience with a joke about erectile dysfunction among badwhite males. Then pivot to the feminists with a joke about Bill Cosby, who is now a hate figure to them.

Kimmel needs a deft touch here, as Cosby is black and you don’t want the audience to catch a whiff of racism. Cosby’s accusers, though, to judge from the 35 of them pictured on the cover of New York magazine, are almost exclusively white. And thirty or so white females trump one old black guy who hasn’t had a hit show since way, way back in the remote past, before Facebook came up.

Cosby anyway made a name for himself—I mean, before the Trial Lawyers Association got to work making a different name for him—by telling his fellow blacks to shape up and stop complaining. So he’s not, like, authentically black. So hey, screw him!

This is, remember, the Cold Civil War between two white armies. Blacks can be trucked in as auxiliaries when needed, to score points off the other side, but nobody cares what they think.

There follows a gesture from Kimmel towards multiculturalism:

And by the way, I’m not against hunting, if you’re hunting to eat or help keep the animal population healthy or to … part of your culture or something, that’s one thing …

Multicultural considerations do not extend to badwhites, though. They have no culture, being little better than animals themselves:

… but here’s some a-hole dentist who wants a lion’s head over the fireplace in his man-cave so his douchebag buddies can gather around it and drink scotch and tell him how awesome he is, that’s just vomitous …

“A-hole,” “douchebag,” “vomitous,” … Just listen to the language there! This is the grand old tradition of dehumanizing ideological vituperation, in direct line of descent from Thomas More’s ravings against Luther, or the names Karl Marx called Ferdinand Lasalle, both of which I’ll leave you to look up for yourselves, this being a family website.

The Chinese language is slightly more delicate in these matters, so I can tell you what Mao Tse-tung called his ideological enemies, quote: “bloodsuckers, parasites, smiling tigers, piles of garbage, cow ghosts and snake demons.” End quote.

ORDER IT NOW

OK, Kimmel has us pointed in the right ideological direction. Where is the Social Justice angle, though? How do we translate our righteous anger at the counter-revolutionary wrecker Walt Palmer into political action? To use the term Marx himself would have used: how do we incorporate our revolutionary impulses into praxis?

Kimmel tells us:

In the meantime I think it’s important to have some good come out of this disgusting tragedy. So this is the website for the Wildlife Conservation Research Unit at Oxford:wildcru.org. These are the researchers who put the collar on Cecil in the first place. They track the animals and study them. If you want to do something … If you want to make this into a positive …

Here the tragic aspect of this, quote, “disgusting tragedy” seizes control of Kimmel’s pure but sensitive heart. In orations of this kind, you see, it is not enough to merely make verbal gestures towards feminism. The speaker must show us his own feminine side. Thus, for a moment, Kimmel loses control over his emotions:

… you can, er … [Voice breaks] … sorry. I, um … I … I … OK, I’m good.

Beautifully done! Just a glimpse of proper empathy; then stern self-control resumes its mastery. Or mistressy …

Er, make a donation and support them. At the very least …

Yes? Yes? Tell us, Jimmy! What, at the very least, can we do?

Er, maybe … maybe we can show the world that not all Americans are like this jackhole here, this dentist … [Cheers, tumultuous applause.]

Yes! Heaven forbid the world should think we are all callous brutes like Dr. Palmer. We, er …

Wait a minute, I need the goodwhite phrasebook here. I can never remember the approved form of words in the progressive liturgy. What am I searching for here?

Right, got it! This is not who we are.

John Derbyshire [email him] writes an incredible amount on all sorts of subjectsfor all kinds of outlets. (This no longer includes National Review, whose editors had some kind of tantrum and fired him. ) He is the author of We Are Doomed: Reclaiming Conservative Pessimism and several other books. His most recent book, published by VDARE.com com is FROM THE DISSIDENT RIGHT (also available in Kindle).His writings are archived at JohnDerbyshire.com.

(Republished from VDare by permission of author or representative)
 
• Category: Ideology • Tags: Africa, Hunting, Zimbabwe 
Hide 182 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
Trim Comments?
    []
  1. Sunbeam says:

    Hmmm.

    Let me share with you my philosophy. The purpose of hunting is to eat.

    Nothing more. If you can’t eat it, you shouldn’t kill it. There is an exception to this of course. If the death of the animal in question is useful in some manner.

    (And let me share something else. The purpose of gardening is to eat. You should only grow edible or useful plants.)

    I do not kill snakes I see a couple of mile from my house. I kill them if they are around my house. If I could identify snakes reliably, I’d let something like a kingsnake live, but I cannot, so I kill them all.

    If a coyote is hanging out around my house, I’d kill him because he might kill my dogs or get in someone’s chicken coop.

    Deer are kind of complicated because their populations are too high in the eastern US (we’ve killed all their predators that cull their populations). So man has to step in to cull the herd.

    But even then, I don’t want to hear how many points that buck had. I want to hear how much meat you have in the freezer.

    You might also say that hunting is pointless now. And you’d be right. I’ve seen some people hunt for meat and have it be a useful adjunct to the diet. But this trick only works because almost no one hunts now. Even with the too high deer populations, it is inconceivable that hunting is a viable food source for too many people, and we have lots and lots more than when hunter gatherers (and a lot of them farmed too) roamed the eastern US.

    Still it is a useful skill to maintain. Just in case you know.

    There is no utility in going halfway around the world to shoot lions, even if you do it with a crossbow.

    Frankly I’ve always been baffled with the whole idea of hunting trophies. I’m not an expert, but I don’t know of any animal you can’t kill pretty easily with modern weapons. If this guy wants to impress me, let him do it with a spear and no guides or helpers. I might be impressed then.

  2. guest says:
    @Sunbeam

    So, no flowers, then?

    Have you attempted to learn to distinguish the benign and lethal snakes where you live?

    Why do you feel compelled by this author’s insights about the hangups among non-hunters to share your rambling, doctrinaire ignorance?

    Or, if you were just trolling, congratulations — you bagged me, Sunbeam!

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
    , @markflag
  3. Sunbeam says:
    @guest

    Yes, and not as easy as you might think. The snake identification thing. Plus my “working set” isn’t big enough for me to keep this in my mind. I killed one at the beginning of last winter. My nephews took the head and body to someone to identify, turned out it was a “pygmy rattlesnake” or something of the the sort. I had no idea. And you don’t really have the time to run to a computer and spend 15 minutes to id something you saw for about 20 seconds. If you do, trust me the snake will be gone when you get back.

    And as for being rambling, well that shows your own limitations.

    I should think my point is obvious. Trophy hunting is silly. It shows nothing. It has no usefulness.

    The only people who are impressed by hunting trophies are … well you I guess.

    And by extension, though I did not explicitly spell it out, is that it not unreasonable to assume this… “dentist” has insecurities he tried to address by hunting this animal. A heck of a long way from home. Not that you can blame him, he looks as metrosexual as a model in an ad for eyeglasses.

    • Replies: @guest
    , @guest
    , @Chris Mallory
    , @TWS
  4. Realist says:

    “So anyway, this lion Cecil was killed by Dr. Palmer of Minneapolis. What’s wrong with that?”

    It’s not that he killed a particular lion. It that the sick little [email protected]^ wanted to kill just for the sake of killing. There is something really, really wrong with someone like that.

  5. Technomad says:

    Part of this is that, in the last fifteen or so years, the goodthinkful ones have become utterly enamored of “animal ‘rights.’” There was a time, and it wasn’t that long ago, when PETA was considered a gang of lunatics even among the ranks of the bunny-huggers; these days, it’s nearly mainstream, and a well-advised young person in the entertainment world will loudly aver that he or she lurrrves animals, and, preferably, has adopted a vegan diet. Ted Nugent can swim against this current, but someone less well-established than he had better either parrot the orthodox “I love all furry animals and would never ever hurt one or allow one to be hurt” line, or keep very quiet.

    This is no different from the much-reprehended Victorian times, when a well-advised young person on his (or occasionally, her) way up would loudly proclaim pious religious belief, and be prominently seen in a respectable church of Sundays. We’ve just replaced one object of worship with another.

    And I think I’m the only one who notices that part of the fuss is that Cecil (of whom I had not ever heard before all this brouhaha; so much for “beloved!”) was “accustomed to being around people,” and not as wary as he should have been. Hel-lo…lions are obligate carnivores and apex predators…and people are made out of meat! Familiarity breeds contempt; every year at places like Yellowstone, they have to remove, or sometimes kill, bears that have got too used to being around people, because they present a real danger to visitors to the park. If this dentist had just wanted a picture, but Cecil was having a bad mane day or was just hungrier than usual, it might have ended up with the dentist dead and Cecil almost certainly having to be put down.

  6. soren says:

    Big game hunting is too small of a niche to be trying to make this into a good white-bad white thing.

  7. @Sunbeam

    Why do you assume that the rest of care what you think about someone’s reason for hunting?

    My view is that it’s stupid to go through the bother and expense of hunting just to get some meat. Meat can be had much more cheaply and easily at the store.

    The reason for hunting is… hunting.

    Seriously, what is the difference between a guy going to Africa, legally shooting a lion or an elephant allocated on quota by the game department and giving the meat to the local blacks, and a guy going to the woods fifteen minutes from his house in Ohio, shooting a deer and donating the meat to the local food bank?

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @baldurdasche
  8. @soren

    They see it as one of the ultimate forms of “white privilege.”

    “OMG he has the money to go over to Africa and kill a lion or an elephant while a small army of blacks attends to his every need for a few weeks?”

    The blacks, by the way, are happy to have the work.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  9. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Great Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:

    The highly racialized nonwhite majority Democratic Party has murdered over two thousand Conservative Orthodox Christian Russian Speaking Ukranians over the past year…

    The Black Bear population of New Jersey is threatened by Hindu “Americans” who are moving out into the Ramapo Mountains in the State of New Jersey….

  10. guest says:
    @Sunbeam

    “The only people who are impressed by hunting trophies are … well you I guess.”

    You missed me. I don’t hunt. I do cherish the outdoors, especially reptiles and amphibians.

    My point is that you know not enough of the subject or those involved to merit your wordy judgments.

    So, tell us what “edible or useful plants” you tend when not online.

  11. guest says:
    @Sunbeam

    “The only people who are impressed by hunting trophies are … well you I guess.”

    You missed me.* I don’t hunt, and am baffled by The Great White Hunter. I do cherish the outdoors, especially reptiles and amphibians.

    My questions go to whether you know enough of the subject or those involved to merit your wordy judgments.

    So, what “edible or useful plants” do you tend when not online?

    * formerly just another “guest,” it appears I now need an ID in order to participate

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
  12. War for Blair Mountain [AKA "Great Battle for Blair Mountain"] says:

    If it was a great moral crime to kill Cecil The Lion….why is it no less of a great moral crime to import Hindus…Sihks….Muslims…Koreans…and Mexicans into the state of New Jersey knowing full-well that the imported Democratic Party Voting Bloc is generating massive suburban sprawl in New Jersey right into the last known habitat New Jersey Black Bear Population of New Jersey…All the high pitched screaming of White Liberals in New Jersey about legalized Black Bear hunting in New Jersey to cull New Jerseys’ Black Bear population after a Hindu “American” student at Rutgers University on a nature walk in the Ramapo Mountains was attacked and eaten by a 700 pound Male Black Bear in the Ramapo Mountains this past fall is phony bulls……t……………

  13. Sunbeam says:
    @guest

    “You missed me.* I don’t hunt, and am baffled by The Great White Hunter. I do cherish the outdoors, especially reptiles and amphibians.”

    I’m not sure I understand what you are driving at with this.

    “My questions go to whether you know enough of the subject or those involved to merit your wordy judgments.”

    I think the question isn’t whether I know anything about the subject, but whether any of the other posters here know anything about it at all.

    Do I need to get a hunting license, sit in a blind, and shoot a deer to satisfy you? Can I use a deer processor, or do I need to do it old school and use an axe to chop off the head? Want me to post a picture of the deer hanging upside for a while, so the blood runs out?

    I’m not really keen on bagging one without a license. Hunting season isn’t that far off. If you want I could go out and shoot a squirrel or rabbit, and skin him. I’m not really keen on how either one of those taste though. Maybe there is a trick to it, but I’ve only ever seen them stuck in a pan and fried.

    Do you know anyone who eats wild game? What’s the problem with it, and why do most people tend not to like it?

    It’s just so juicy and tender, right? Not like that store brought meat.

    I’ll leave you with a tip I’ve thought of several times. Wild pig has that gamey taste, it is just… strong is all I can tell you. But you get so much more meat it seems like off a mature hog than you do even a big buck (I think this varies, the deer can get a lot bigger if the climate is colder). But most of the swampy areas in the south are lousy with wild hogs now. And no one really hunts them much.

    Got to warn you though, you have to work to get killed by a deer. Wild hogs are a lot more dangerous. Be careful. I don’t exactly know why, but if they go feral the tusks come back, I don’t know if that applies to an escaped hog, but their descendants sure have them. Don’t ask me what is up with that.

    “So, what “edible or useful plants” do you tend when not online?”

    I don’t have a garden this year. In the past I have grown corn, tomatoes, okra, lima beans, butter beans, green beans, hot peppers, bell peppers, watermelons, peanuts, potatoes, black eyed peas (and there are more variants of this than you would think), uh a bunch more stuff. But just the typical stuff.

    I could write more than you would ever cared to read about my attempts at gardening and the problems I have encountered.

    I have tried growing things like strawberries and kiwi fruit. But I suspect my climate won’t allow some things I have experimented with. I also live in a region with miserable soil.

    • Replies: @guest
    , @Marty
  14. guest says:
    @Sunbeam

    You are prolix, if nothing else. At six lengthy comments on three different threads today on this site alone, do you have time for any outdoor activities?

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
  15. lardass says:

    Grow a pair Jimmy Kimmel. Men crying for trivial reasons is offputting to me.

  16. Sunbeam says:
    @guest

    I’m not gardening this summer. And I’m glad, it’s just too hot.

    To be blunt though, with the outlays you spend gardening it really isn’t worth your time. Even tomatoes. I think there are some things like peanuts you could really save money on though. I made a bunch of pickles one summer, that is pretty effective too. (and you can pickle just about anything if you look around on youtube)

    Six lengthy comments eh? Actually I’m cutting things short. This is a terrible medium to communicated exactly what you wish to say.

    How long does it take you to write something? I am doing some other things on the computer right now, but how many should a concerned citizen make? Wouldn’t want to go over my quota.

  17. Wyrd says:

    *Peering at a mote of dust and points to it* See that? That’s how much I give a fudge about Cecil’s death. In Africa, lions have to be culled lest they become too populous and upset the ecological balance. Any of you wailing and gnashing teeth over Cecil are farcically ridiculous. Go back to scoring SJW points over gay marriage and transgender bovine feces.

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Reg Cæsar
  18. anon • Disclaimer says:

    Black farmers have turned out to be more productive than white farmers. In Zimbabwe, the black farmers are producing more kilograms of tobacco (the main export commodity of the Zimbabwean economy) than whites ever did did save for a record year.

    This is very inconvenient to your narrative so you will ignore these truthfacts.

  19. Wyrd says:
    @anon

    That must be why Zimbabwe is currently begging white farmers to come back.

    • Replies: @Jeff Albertson
    , @anon
  20. It’s too bad what’s happened to Kimmel. Back in the late 90s and early 2000s, he and Adam Carolla hosted The Man Show, and it was very un-PC, complete with midgets, jokes about ending women’s suffrage, porn stars offering household hints, making Jimmy’s wife the butt of jokes, and even worse doing the same to Oprah the secular saint. Not to mention Juggies.

    Carolla has remained true to the character he portrayed on the show, and he is today a minor celebrity. Kimmel ditched his Man Show persona and is now a big star. Hard to say if he’s completely drunk the Kool Aid, but it sure seems like a complete 180 for the guy.

    • Agree: Travis
  21. Realist says:
    @Wyrd

    Not everyone against trophy hunting is a liberal.

    You have little pigeon holes for everyone. The problem is you don’t know what you’re talking about.

    • Replies: @Wyrd
    , @TWS
  22. Wyrd says:
    @Realist

    Baby gonna cry.

    • Agree: Hail
    • Replies: @Realist
  23. @Wyrd

    Partly because they made a big switch to tobacco because it’s a much better cash crop than maise and other vegetables, so they were experiencing food shortages, and this year the tobacco did very poorly, likely because it depletes the soil so rapidly that it only does well with constant rotation or much fertilizer. It’s also very susceptible to pests and fungi if not rotated and its very labor intensive.
    The deal under offer is for the white farmers to come back to work but not own the land. I don’t think there will be too many takers.

    • Replies: @AnAnon
  24. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Wyrd

    Do you have any evidence that Zimbabwe is begging white farmers to come back? Or have they only extended an offer to a handful of farmers to get their land back?

    Again because productive black farmers are so inconvenient to the narrative here, truthstats are being ignored. How surprising.

    • Replies: @Wyrd
  25. Realist says:
    @Wyrd

    That is childish.

    • Replies: @Wyrd
  26. WGG [AKA "World\'s Greatest Grandson"] says:
    @Realist

    And sanctimonious torch-bearers like yourself join mobs for the sake of mobbing. This is such a non-issue it is ridiculous. Now continue with your witch hunt, it never changes with you misanthropes.

    • Replies: @Realist
  27. Vinegar says:

    I’m with Kimmel and Realist.

    That dentist is a worthless cunt, who in his beta insecurity and desire to impress his dorky-douchebag friends, thinks killing majestic (and nearly endangered) wildlife will make him appear ‘masculine’.

    Most of the comments in this thread are in the same vein – the kind of closet pickle-smoochers who think watching grown Negro bucks toss a football around makes them manly.

    No, it’s not manly to shoot wildlife from a distance for “fun”. It means you’re a psychopath. It means you’re what’s wrong with this world.

    Humans have spread like a cancer over this planet, destroying and commandeering the majority of ecosystems, reaching plague proportions, subsidized with medicine and factory farming and technology – such that every scumbag who should have never reached adulthood can now have 5 children… Meanwhile the wildlife is resigned to ever-smaller patches of woods or grassland, barely making it with no help from anyone or anything… And these trophy-hunting cunts want to go kill the few remaining animals left. For fun. Fuck you.

    The latest report on Zimbabwe from Human Rights Watch makes pretty devastating reading. You can read it for yourself on the Internet. That’s humanrights.

    And people—Americans—are worked up about animal rights in this hell-hole?

    The animals are the only things I care about in that hellhole. And although what’s happened to the White farmers is tragic, aren’t they the ones who kept feeding the Black beast and allowing them to multiply beyond all reason – who then, quite naturally to them, bit the hand that fed them?

  28. Blobby5 says:

    I was very much looking forward to RadioDerb resuming broadcast as I am a big fan of Mr. Derbyshire, it pains me he spent such a large segment of his show defending this creep. More than likely big game in Africa is doomed due to population growth, regardless, it is so gratuitously cruel and indefensible what this hunter did why on earth is Derb taking a stand on this issue?

  29. AnAnon says:
    @Jeff Albertson

    I’m pretty sure that if they offered the land back there wouldn’t be many takers.

    To the article:
    “Freedom House ranks nations on a four-point scale: Free, Partly Free, Not Free, and Worst of the Worst. Zimbabwe is ranked Not Free.” – what, pray tell, is worst of the worst?

    “Whether badwhites actually do have less happy sex lives than goodwhites, I have no data. This ought to be a matter that can be settled by rigorous empirical enquiry—although given the difficulty of finding out what couples actually experience in the privacy of their chambers, there are some knotty problems of methodology to sort out. Pending reliable research studies, I stand agnostic.” – We can assume that they are simply projecting.

  30. Wyrd says:
    @anon

    Beyond your caucasion tears, you mean? (boo-how!)

  31. @Sunbeam

    A quick and dirty way to ID poisonous snakes, unless you are talking about a coral snake, the rest of the poisonous snakes in the US are pit vipers. Their heads are wider than their bodies, delta or triangular shaped. Non poisonous snakes have spoon shaped heads, close to the same width as their bodies. Coral snakes are brightly colored, look up the rhyme.

    Really, it isn’t up to you to decide if something is useful or not.

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
    , @Drapetomaniac
  32. Vinegar says:

    On this whole goodwhite/badwhite/left/right thing…

    I noticed a long time ago that, seemingly by design and to keep the split 50-50, each side had points they were right about and wrong about. As a result, I never sided with either. Both sides were idiots, for different reasons. Most people being ignorant, stupid sheep and incapable of reason or independent thought, simply picked a side based on their ‘pet issue’ or to fit in with friends and family.

    For example, the left is generally correct about:

    – anti-religion, atheism
    – abortion (abhorrent but necessary, although not for the reasons the left claims; ie “womens’ rights” -it is however necessary due to overpopulation and eugenics)
    – animal rights and environmental protection (global warming hysteria aside)
    – legalization of the less harmful drugs

    The right is correct about:

    – race, immigration, etc.
    – limited government
    – guns
    – pro-family (which means not embracing homosexuality to a ridiculous extent)

    The above list isn’t comprehensive… just off the top of my head.

    But I think it illustrates the point. Intelligent people don’t fall neatly into one side or the other.

  33. Wyrd says:
    @Realist

    That is childish.

    Lol! That spells M-O-O-N, laws yes!

    • Replies: @Realist
  34. Sunbeam says:
    @Chris Mallory

    “Really, it isn’t up to you to decide if something is useful or not.”

    Have to do it every day bub. Just like everyone else.

    And as far as id’ing the snakes goes… how confident do you feel about that? And why? Would you take the chance of being wrong?

    The snake I mentioned that I killed was black like a kingsnake, and didn’t have rattlers (no idea why the guy said it was a rattlenake). But I decided to kill him anyway.

    Maybe you have training in herpetology or something, but I’m not taking a chance.

    Anyway I don’t kill anything without a reason. I steer around snakes I see on the road (most people try to hit them), unless they are around my house.

    I kind of wonder about you guys. Do you ever have to do anything outside at night? With a flashlight or something? Have you ever looked at your tool or utility shed and thought about how many places a snake might like to curl up? I do.

    Heck I’ve stepped out on the porch in the morning and seen one curled up before.

    Where the heck do you guys live? Seattle? Oregon? Michigan?

    I bet the first time you saw one, and it occurred to you how easily you could step on it, or your aged mother, or a young child could you might think differently.

    Believe you me, if I could I would mail you every snake I’ve ever encountered (and it sure seems like a lot now that I think about it), and I’d hope you were all very happy together.

    Here’s a fun little trivia question for you. If a cat fights a snake, who wins? Not that you can count on Fluffy for anything, but still. And we are talking about American snakes. The biggest I have ever seen personally couldn’t have been much over four feet long.

    Since you are Joe Herpetology I bet you know the answer.

  35. Vinegar says:
    @Sunbeam

    Dude… are you a chick or something? Learning disability?

    How hard is it to spend an hour learning to identify snakes?

    That kingsnake you killed? You know why it’s called a kingsnake? Because it’s the king of snakes. It eats venomous snakes.

    And even if you see a venomous snake. Leave it alone. It will, most likely, just go away. Did you know that most envenomations occur when a person is trying to kill a snake?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_snake_bites_in_the_United_States

    I live in Texas. I’ve walked out my front door and seen a large coral snake. The minute it saw me, it scrammed. They just want to be left alone. Sure, you can cold-bloodedly murder the snake… but another will come along and fill the niche. You’ll always have to pay attention to where you step or put your hand regardless.

    People like you want to irrationally exterminate every little thing that you think might pose even the slightest threat to you, like little beneficial spiders or non-venomous snakes or mud daubers… when all you need to do is grow a pair and spend a few hours reading and learning.

    Frankly, it’s nauseating, and infuriating.

  36. @Chris Mallory

    “Really, it isn’t up to you to decide if something is useful or not.”

    Just you, government, or God – right?

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  37. @Vinegar

    Left, right, and libertarians emphasize the moral foundations differently.

    Other than that, rights are made up and the left and right are the two hands of the Governmentalism Party.

  38. Given this safari dentist commotion I’m surprised nobody has brought up the Little Shop of Horrors song:

  39. @Wyrd

    In Africa, lions have to be culled lest they become too populous and upset the ecological balance

    Um, the lion population has been shrinking and the human population exploding for decades. How far do you want to carry this?

  40. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Sunbeam

    A lot of venison from deer hunters ends up going to the needy. Plenty of local organizations facilitate that.

  41. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Vinegar

    “And although what’s happened to the White farmers is tragic, aren’t they the ones who kept feeding the Black beast”

    Untrue. Now that black farmers are producing more tobacco than white farmers, black people have more income to purchase food.

    • Replies: @William BadWhite
  42. jamie b. says:
    @Sunbeam

    I was born and raised in Nebraska, and I’ve lived in Colorado, Iowa, California, Nevada, Texas, and Washington. I have encountered (and as a kid, played with) snakes all the time. Very rarely have I encountered a venomous snake (usually rattlers), and never have I felt the need to kill one. I’m guessing that you simply weren’t raised to recognize friend from foe the way I was as a kid. Do you feel the same way about spiders?

    Also, there’s no shortage of rattlers in Oregon.

  43. Everybody calm down, according to a daily Australian paper ‘The Age’ they report in their ‘odd spot’ that an ‘animal communicator’ and ‘psychic’ Karen Anderson – has contacted Cecil the Lion in the afterlife, apparently Cecil is ‘fine’ and wanted humans to “put an end to greed” You read right, so just do like Cecil wants.

  44. Hunters’ fees pay the bills to maintain wildlife habitat.

    Trophy Hunting Can Help African Conservation, Study Says

    According to a recent study, in the 23 African countries that allow sport hunting, 18,500 tourists pay over $200 million (U.S.) a year to hunt lions, leopards, elephants, warthogs, water buffalo, impala, and rhinos.

    Private hunting operations in these countries control more than 540,000 square miles (1.4 million square kilometers) of land, the study also found. That’s 22 percent more land than is protected by national parks.

    “To justify the continued existence of [protected] areas in the context of increasing demand for land, wildlife has to pay for itself and contribute to the economy, and hunting provides an important means of achieving this,” Lindsey said.

    Trophy Hunting Is Big Business in South Africa

    The hunting industry in South Africa brings in more than $744 million each year. The industry employs about 70,000 people.

    “The only way there will be incentive for those landowners to protect and keep on investing in rhino is if they have an economic value. They can only have an economic value if there is an end-user that is willing to pay for that and that is the trophy hunter.”

  45. Realist says:
    @Honorary Thief

    Your concern for the blacks in Africa is so touching. LOL

    So this shit for brains dentist was feeding poor blacks? Where did you read that???

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @Honorary Thief
  46. Mike Zwick [AKA "dahinda"] says:

    I know a lot of people that would be lumped in the ignorant gap-toothed hillbilly redneck badwhites category by the MSM that enjoy microbreweries, craft beer and even home brewing. This article makes a great point about the two “official” sides in the war that they want everybody to be fighting in but reality sometimes is much more nuanced.

  47. @Honorary Thief

    Are you really aware of the world? Food banks don’t take ‘donated’ wild meat.

    There’s a very real risk of contamination and the resulting lawsuits would put someone (and another ‘badwhite’ profession – the legal one) on easy street.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
    , @GFC
    , @TWS
  48. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Realist

    So what do you think happened to the $60 G’s he paid to bag his lion?

    • Replies: @Realist
  49. Travis says:

    while the Media is obsessed over a lion hunt in Africa, they remain silent on the Polar bear hunters amongst us……

  50. Realist says:
    @Wyrd

    It spells you’re an asshole.

  51. Realist says:
    @WGG

    “This is such a non-issue it is ridiculous.”

    Ask the dickwad dentist if it is a non-issue.

    • Replies: @TWS
  52. Realist says:
    @Vinegar

    Very good, well said. Especially the comment about blacks and football.

  53. Realist says:
    @Anonymous

    So you answer my question with a question?

  54. @baldurdasche

    @Baldurdasche

    Food banks often take donated meat from hunters, at least that’s what many of the hunters I know tell me. Homeless shelters do the same.

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
  55. JD I’m disappointed that you couldn’t assume the right kind of snobbery and simply, as a matter of taste, if not of class, disdain this wretched dentist (after all dentists are fair game) for his crass misuse of money and opportunity.

    Of course it makes hardheaded good sense to use the bogans’ money to pay for conservation at the expense of a few Cecils but it doesn’t mean we should let them off from our contempt, especially …… and here I come to the hair-raisingly weird thing about the comments you have provoked or facilitated. Not a word about cruelty. Not a word about the outrageous consequence of Palmer’s egocentric game with bow and arrow. Would you be happy to buy your favourite meat from his hobby farm knowing that slaughter was by single arrow followed up by a gun shot when someone got round to it finishing off the killing? Illegal in civilised countries of course.

    • Replies: @TWS
  56. @anon

    Your statement about black farmers having produced more tobacco is totally useless either as information or in support of what seems to be your argument without a lot more facts. In particular it says nothing about profitability, productivity or the tax yield to the country. It says nothing about other crops or livestock and their relative value..

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  57. Sunbeam says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    “Food banks often take donated meat from hunters, at least that’s what many of the hunters I know tell me. Homeless shelters do the same.”

    I would have doubted this, but due to this thread and something I saw on another board made me look up the range of wild pigs in America.

    In Texas meat from wild pigs can be shipped to China. So maybe you can donate this to a homeless shelter somewhere.

    I know you can’t where I live, but maybe the rules are different in other states. I wouldn’t have expected this though.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
  58. @Sunbeam

    @Sunbeam

    I’m not a hunter, but the hunters I know regularly donate meat from the deer and wild pigs they kill. They take the animals to meat processors like many small farmers do, so there are standards. The meat is always cut up, wrapped in butcher paper and labeled like anything else you’d buy from a butcher. It can’t be any worse than the stuff McDonald’s sells or anything sold under the label Hormel or Smithfield.

    • Replies: @Dahlia
  59. @Sunbeam

    I live in rural Kentucky. I have had to deal with copperheads, rattle snakes, and on a few occasions cotton mouths. Every one of them had a head that was wider than it’s body, an arrowhead shape.

    I have black racers living on my property. In the early summer I sat over the top of one, he crawled out from under the strawbale, through my feet and into the brush. He didn’t bother me and I didn’t bother him. He was easily six foot long.

    I trained my daughter to leave snakes alone. Don’t touch them and they will get away from you as soon as possible.

    Cat vs a snake? Depends on the snake and the cat. My outside cats kill snakes fairly regularly. But then we don’t have giant constrictors.

  60. @anon

    All this nonsense about productive black farmers (why did they wait until now, after thousands and thousands of years of not having any ability to farm productively?) makes me wonder – are you really James Brown? I thought you had died.

    “Stock market goin’ up, jobs are goin’ down, And ain’t no funking jobs to be found
    Taxes keep goin’ up, I changed from a glass, Now I drink from a paper cup, gettin’ bad

    People, people, we got to get over…Before we go under

    Listen to me, let’s get together and raise
    Let’s get together, get some land
    Raise our food like the man
    Save our money like the Mob
    Put up [Incomprehensible] on the job

    Read more: James Brown – Funky President (People It’s Bad) [Single Version] Lyrics | MetroLyrics

  61. Sean says:

    Affluence allows one to display the mark of socially superiority: munificence and magnanimity. Being mistaken for the lower orders of their own race is the ultimate nightmare for progressive goodwhites.

    • Replies: @TWS
  62. Nah this one won’t fly Derb. Cernovich:”Most “rich white men” live pitiable lives, balls kept in a jar by wife, live in denial of their instincts. Sad life. “

  63. pyrrhus says:
    @Realist

    Boy, the SJWs are thick on the ground in these comments, with their disgusting carping and hypocritical moralizing…If the Zimbabweans want to sell their aging (13 is exceptionally old for a male lion, and the Park people were probably feeding him to keep him alive) wildlife for western currency, that’s their right. Meanwhile, the aforesaid SJWs are living because of the slaughter of both domestic animals for food and wild animals, whom they are displacing.

  64. pyrrhus says:

    Vintage piece Derb!

  65. Seneca says:

    As a badwhite living in a sea of goodwhites (DC area), I am constantly amazed at the lack of introspection my goodwhite colleagues exhibit in explaining just why they feel so strongly about the issue of the day. Most genuinely seem to lamely accept whatever drivel they hear from NPR, HuffPo, Salon, etc with little analysis beyond circular arguments like, “Abortion should be legal because we should not interfere with a Woman’s right to choose!” They are ill prepared to defend their religiously held beliefs about gay rights, abortion, gun control, immigration, and race relations. The conversations seem to devolve into predictable epithets directed at badwhites with the underlying assumption that if badwhites were just not so dumb, they would understand the obvious superiority of the goodwhite position.

    In the case of the much maligned Dr. Palmer, why exactly is hunting bad? I am a non-hunter and certainly don’t like killing innocents, but is big game hunting inherently evil? The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/07/29/rich-american-tourists-kill-hundreds-of-lions-each-year-and-its-all-legal/)reports that some 600 lions have been killed in Africa this year. Are Dr. Palmer’s actions more heinous? Or is this another Kony episode where a bad situation replicated all over the African continent is fanned into crisis mode by news agencies?

  66. @Realist

    I’ve read numerous accounts on hunting forums and a few safari books (fascinating subject). Common practice is for the staff to take a small amount of meat back to the camp to eat throughout the duration of the safari and the locals are brought in to take the rest. The meat does not last long.

    What did you think they did? Just left it to rot on the ground?

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
    , @TWS
  67. Marty [AKA "wick"] says:
    @Sunbeam

    I had wild pig a few years ago, shot by a friend in Northern California. It wan’t the least bit gamey, and I liked it better than most of the beefsteak I eat. Since you were wrong on that one, is your entire viewpoint invidated?

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
  68. Sunbeam says:
    @Honorary Thief

    Cat meat? I guess it is protein, but I don’t think I have ever heard of anyone eating this.

    Maybe it is one of those common things that Americans just don’t know about.

  69. Sunbeam says:
    @Marty

    Funny I’ve had it too. And it was gamey.

    So we have what is called a contretemps.

    Now a reasonable man might ask you some things. Like how old the hog was. What the diet was. What cut you ate. How you fixed it.

    But let’s not do that. Instead let’s introduce you to a new feature, the Ignore button.

    Goodbye. I will be having the last word in our very brief relationship.

    • Replies: @Crawfurdmuir
  70. @Sunbeam

    Supposedly, it is not bad. Lean and tender. As far as its palatability to the blacks of Africa, well, beggars can’t be choosers anyway.

  71. Dahlia says:
    @Vinegar

    That dentist is a worthless cunt, who in his beta insecurity and desire to impress his dorky-douchebag friends, thinks killing majestic (and nearly endangered) wildlife will make him appear ‘masculine’.

    Except for the coarse language, my thoughts exactly. Lots of rednecks on my mom’s side of the family plus both stepparents fully redneck with lots of hunters and fishermen… None of them would ever do anything like this. They didn’t go all Native American Indian and pray over their slain beasts, but they would never kill just for the sake of killing. I’ve known many, many, MANY hunters and this would be a major violation of their ethics.

    I personally knew a big game hunter, second cousin on wealthier non-redneck side of the family, who made treks to Africa in the 80s: not a nice man. It seems to combine sociopathy, lack of confidence, and wealth for a terrible LARPy stew.

    Agree with all the others who think Derbyshire is erroneously making big game hunting into a tribal “Bad White” thing.

  72. Dahlia says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    I’m not a hunter, but the hunters I know regularly donate meat from the deer and wild pigs they kill. They take the animals to meat processors like many small farmers do, so there are standards. The meat is always cut up, wrapped in butcher paper and labeled like anything else you’d buy from a butcher. It can’t be any worse than the stuff McDonald’s sells or anything sold under the label Hormel or Smithfield.

    Surprised about the food bank only because all hunters I’m aware of have a loooong list of takers for their kills. One of my stepbrothers barters with his venison.

    I’ve been telling the hunters in my circle (DH isn’t one, sadly) for the past couple years that I want some venison, and badly! Someone, a very wealthy friend who just likes hunting, has finally promised us his first deer this upcoming season for only the processing fee 🙂

  73. Dahlia says:
    @Dahlia

    Forgot to add that the witch hunt against this dentist is far worse than anything he ever did IMHO. I don’t know this man’s heart, can only speculate, but whatever flaws he has pale in comparison to what is possessing his lynchers.

    He is douchy, but his lynchers are utterly rabid.

  74. SPMoore8 says:

    I don’t actually have a problem with hunting, except that I don’t really like killing mammals.

    I think the issue in this case — along with the slow news days of summer — is that it is symptomatic of the wiping out of the larger fauna all over the developing and overpopulating world. For example, I have some distaste looking at this dentist with a dead lion, but the accompanying picture, of the dentist smiling over a rhinoceros he had slain, made me mad.

    I get that there are many people who have zero concern for the survival of non-human species. But I do. And I think for most of us our objection to this kill is on that level.

    On the other hand, I also know there are those who think that non-human species should never be allowed to have a seat at the world’s table, that they are “just animals” unlike that supreme species, homo sapiens. I won’t be around to see how that song is sung when there are 2 billion people living in the United States.

  75. @Dahlia

    “Lots of rednecks on my mom’s side of the family plus both stepparents fully redneck with lots of hunters and fishermen… None of them would ever do anything like this. They didn’t go all Native American Indian and pray over their slain beasts, but they would never kill just for the sake of killing.”

    If you know any ranchers you know there are a number of animals that are pests or worse and are kill on sight. I don’t know if that qualifies as killing “just for the sake of killing” though. Killing wild pigs prevents them from tearing apart every stream bed on your property, shooting coyotes (and here in Florida, alligators) keeps them from killing calves.

    Wild pigs are a destructive pest and have no real natural enemies. They multiply quickly and are a pain-in-the-ass. They tear up everything in sight. The boar meat (once the boar has matured) is gamey and unless you let it cure for several weeks, not very good. I know a guy who manages a 7,500 acre cattle ranch on the edge of Lake Okeechobee in Florida. (A lot of people don’t know but Florida is a huge cattle ranching state. It doesn’t rate that high in the beef cattle production stats because most FL ranches sell the cattle when they’re about a year old and they’re trucked off to CO or NE or OK or wherever to gain weight). I’ve read that if you counted juveniles, FL is 2nd only to TX in cattle production). Few city people know this because as the ranch manger I know said “there’s nobody up here but us rednecks and some Indians. And redneck Indians”. Few tourists have ever been through Hendry or Glades county.

    Anyway, this guy I know leases access to his property to hunters. If someone shoots a sow or a juvenile, the meat is quite good. If someone shoots a boar they drag it to a corner of the ranch and let it rot or the coyotes will eat it. Same with a coyote. Same with the gators. You don’t even need a hunting license or a tag to shoot a hog or a coyote. You’re supposed to for gators but they don’t really enforce it on private land.

    Interestingly it will be the panthers soon too. People in urban Florida make a big deal about the “Florida Panther” and get the license plate but don’t seem to know there’s nothing different about them any other mountain lion. They just live in Florida. A few years ago the state brought in some Texas females hoping the Florida males would breed them. For whatever reason they didn’t. So they brought in some Texas males and that worked and now the rural parts of Florida have a fair amount of “florida panthers”. Some say way too many. On these huge ranches they kill calves quite frequently. The state will not compensate ranchers for the loss so I’ve heard of ranchers shooting them on sight as well. Since you’d get in trouble for it nobody talks about it much.

    People can object to “killing for the sake of killing” but lets not kid ourselves that what’s all this Cecil hysteria is about. This is a chance for SWPL whites to subject their greatest enemy – non SWPL whites – to the mob.

    • Replies: @Dahlia
  76. GFC says: • Website
    @baldurdasche

    Are you really aware of the world? Food banks don’t take ‘donated’ wild meat.

    You can look at Hunters for the Hungry, internet smart guy. http://www.h4hungry.org

    This organization serves the state of Virginia alone and last year provided 238,972 pounds of venison which yielded 955,888 quarter pound servings.

    There’s a number of slack-jawed faggots in this thread – Sunbeam, Realist, Vinegar. Shameful.

  77. Svigor says:

    Never mind those dead babies made into Soylent Greenbacks, look a squirrel!

    The dentist should’ve just walked Cecil the Lion through Philly. Then nobody would have shit to say, and everyone would be trying to cover up the crime.

    The subject of our latest Two Minutes Hate: 55-year-old Dr. Walter Palmer, a dental practitioner from the Minneapolis suburb of Eden Prairie. Early in July, Dr. Palmer, on a hunting vacation in Zimbabwe, killed a lion. Now he’s in hiding, his office is under siege by furious mobs, and his patients have all deserted him.

    All the emotional stops have been pulled out for this one. The mobs around Dr. Palmer’s office are weeping and rending their garments. Mothers are taking their little kiddies—known in lion-speak as “midnight snacks“—to lay bouquets of flowers on Dr. Palmer’s doorstep in memoriam for the lion.

    This. I’m glad there’s at least one intellectual left with some balls.

    Sentimentality about animals is not a new thing in the world, of course. I can remember my sister, back in the Truman administration, crying when the hunters shot Bambi’s mother.

    I can’t watch that, but assuming it’s actually Bambi we’re talking about – obviously that’s a whole other thing, as you go on to say. It’s perfectly natural to empathize with anthropomorphic talking animals in animated films. Then you leave the theater and come back to reality. A man can cry for Old Yeller, Bambi, or Simba, then go out and gut a deer or a lion.

    Well, nothing per se. Shooting lions is legal in Zimbabwe, provided the proper formalities are observed. Lots of people, big game hunters, go there for just that purpose, as Dr. Palmer did.

    Problem is, the formalities were not observed. Cecil was shot a few hundred yards outside the park, on privately owned land that had not been assigned a lion quota. That’s the main point of illegality.

    I’ve seen internet ‘tards on non-political forums saying the Dentist should be sent to prison and gang-raped for his “crimes.” Which amount to not getting a hunting license. These are the same shitbirds who will go to the mat to defend mestizos’ “right” to break our immigration laws en masse.

    The killing happened, furthermore, in Zimbabwe, a country not best known for firm adherence to rule of law, property rights, and governmental integrity. The place is, in fact, a miserable black African slum r uled by an aged despot who has murdered his political opponents, banned dissent, and allowed his family and friends to loot the economy, what’s left of it.

    This is really the take-home point for me. Africa is full of murder, slaughter, slavery, rape, cannibalism, organ poaching, and horrible depravity and violence of every kind imaginable, but these cretins ignore it all as a matter of routine. Now they pay attention? Quintessential lack of introspection from the SJW social media mob.

    [Kimmel]: The big question is: Why are you shooting a lion in the first place? I mean, I’m honestly curious to know why a human being would feel compelled to do that. How is that fun? Is it that difficult for you to get an erection that you need to kill things? [Prolonged applause.]

    This is what I really like about SJWs: they have no clue how anyone could have an opinion that differs from that of the SJW herd, and they feel perfectly free to punish those who act in a way they don’t understand. Happy little totalitarians, the lot of them.

    Note the instant recourse to sexual insult. It is an article of faith with goodwhites that badwhites have unsatisfactory sex lives, and that the discontent badwhites feel in this regard explains their otherwise incomprehensible tastes and viewpoints.

    Projection. They have limp libidos, so the bad people must really be enervated. Helps them avoid thinking about unreconstructed white men giving their little ladies an unrestrained rogering (which only badwhites do, as seen in American History X).

    P.S., SJWs can’t tell the difference between commercial beer and microbrews without the labels to distinguish them.

  78. Svigor says:

    The slapfight between bleeding hearts over snakes is amusing.

    Hmmm.

    Let me share with you my philosophy. The purpose of hunting is to eat.

    Nothing more. If you can’t eat it, you shouldn’t kill it. There is an exception to this of course. If the death of the animal in question is useful in some manner.

    Here’s my thought-through philosophy. The purpose of hunting is to train in a survival skill. Waiting until you need to hunt to survive before learning to hunt is not optimal. Hence, the entire sport of hunting is justified, in and of itself, quite apart from whether or not any given animal is eaten or not.

    But even then, I don’t want to hear how many points that buck had. I want to hear how much meat you have in the freezer.

    Because having fun exercising a survival skill is bad-bad-bad. You know, some people just aren’t into liberal guilt.

    You might also say that hunting is pointless now. And you’d be right.

    Wrong. Ask the Jews who had to survive in the forests of Poland about that. I’ll make no claims as to how likely all the plates in the air (AKA, civilization) are to come crashing down. But that’s what they are – plates spinning in the air.

    Still it is a useful skill to maintain. Just in case you know.

    Lol. Make up your mind already.

    There is no utility in going halfway around the world to shoot lions, even if you do it with a crossbow.

    Yes, there’s a point to enjoying what you do.

    Frankly I’ve always been baffled with the whole idea of hunting trophies. I’m not an expert, but I don’t know of any animal you can’t kill pretty easily with modern weapons. If this guy wants to impress me, let him do it with a spear and no guides or helpers. I might be impressed then.

    He killed it with a bow. LOL.

    I personally am not into the hunting trophy thing. I’m not impressed by trophies. I also refrain from being “baffled” by something I have made no effort to understand or investigate.

    Do I need to get a hunting license, sit in a blind, and shoot a deer to satisfy you? Can I use a deer processor, or do I need to do it old school and use an axe to chop off the head? Want me to post a picture of the deer hanging upside for a while, so the blood runs out?

    At least you’d have experienced the process you’re condemning.

    Not everyone against trophy hunting is a liberal.

    You have little pigeon holes for everyone. The problem is you don’t know what you’re talking about.

    True, some non-liberals have liberal opinions on this issue or that. It’s very common, actually.

    Do you have any evidence that Zimbabwe is begging white farmers to come back? Or have they only extended an offer to a handful of farmers to get their land back?

    Again because productive black farmers are so inconvenient to the narrative here, truthstats are being ignored. How surprising.

    It’s common knowledge that the rise of black rule in Zimbabwe has been a disaster for that country’s agricultural output. You have shown zero evidence to the contrary.

    “This is such a non-issue it is ridiculous.”

    Ask the dickwad dentist if it is a non-issue.

    I think what he meant to say was, you and your fellow liberal turds are mobbing this guy over a non-issue.

    Not a word about cruelty. Not a word about the outrageous consequence of Palmer’s egocentric game with bow and arrow. Would you be happy to buy your favourite meat from his hobby farm knowing that slaughter was by single arrow followed up by a gun shot when someone got round to it finishing off the killing? Illegal in civilised countries of course.

    Don’t lions frequently eat their prey alive? I think Cecil, for one, totally “understood” the “cruelty.”

    Affluence allows one to display the mark of socially superiority: munificence and magnanimity. Being mistaken for the lower orders of their own race is the ultimate nightmare for progressive goodwhites.

    Mental affluence allows the display of doing one’s own thinking.

    What did you think they did? Just left it to rot on the ground?

    Why don’t SJWs (including the ones in this thread) give a shit about the widespread African practice of eating “bush meat”? I.e., killing our fellow primates for food?

    Because blacks do it.

    I think the issue in this case — along with the slow news days of summer — is that it is symptomatic of the wiping out of the larger fauna all over the developing and overpopulating world. For example, I have some distaste looking at this dentist with a dead lion, but the accompanying picture, of the dentist smiling over a rhinoceros he had slain, made me mad.

    I get that there are many people who have zero concern for the survival of non-human species. But I do.

    I don’t. Until the SJWs stop guffawing at the very idea of a War on Whites, non-white invasion of white living spaces, the rightness of preserving (inter alia) the white race(s), etc., every last lion and rhino and spotted owl can burn for all I care.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  79. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhodesia

    While as Rhodesia, the country was once considered the breadbasket of Africa. Today, Zimbabwe is a net importer of foodstuffs, with the European Union and United States providing emergency food relief as humanitarian aid on a regular basis.[133] The nation has suffered profound economic and social decline in the past twenty years. Part of the issue is due to a marked decrease in agricultural production as fertile farmland once cultivated by trained white farmers and their employees sometimes from other African countries has been forcibly relocated to black Zimbabweans by political background rather than farming experience, many whom are untrained in agricultural land management, as compensation for military service and/or political loyalty. In such cases, production usually falls to less than half of its estimated capacity and fertile land lies fallow due to neglect. Not only is production reduced, but the jobs associated with operating a viable enterprise are lost. The Zimbabwe government blame the economy’s failures on sanctions imposed by Western governments on high-ranking Zimbabwean ministers and officials to force a regime change. Recently the agriculture sector has started to do well since the availability of expertise and machines has improved supported mainly by China.[134][135]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Zimbabwe

    Agriculture in Zimbabwe can be divided into two parts: industrialized farming of crops such as cotton, tobacco, coffee, peanuts and various fruits and subsistence farming with staple crops such as maize or wheat. The former of the two was almost exclusively in the hands of the white minority until the highly controversial and disastrous land redistribution program that started in 2000. This part of the agricultural economy was highly profitable and large amounts of the produce were exported. Subsistence farming is important for the black majority and has gained importance under the land redistribution program.

    Industrialized farming was once the backbone of the domestic Zimbabwean economy and contributed up to 40% of the exported produce. The result of large scale eviction of competent commercial white farmers, the government’s land reform efforts and the severing of economic ties with Mozambique, means that was no longer the case.[21]

    Reliable crop estimates are no longer available since the agricultural marketing system collapsed. The Government banned maize imports, stating record crops for the year of 2004.[22] The University of Zimbabwe estimated in 2008 that between 2000 and 2007 agricultural production decreased by 51%.[23]

    Maize was the country’s largest domestic crop prior to the farm evictions. Tobacco was the largest export crop followed by cotton. Poor government has exacerbated meagre harvests caused by drought and floods, resulting in significant food shortfalls beginning in 2001[citation needed]. Land reform has found considerable support in Africa and a few supporters among African-American activists,[citation needed] but Jesse Jackson commented during a visit to South Africa in June 2006, “Land redistribution has long been a noble goal to achieve but it has to be done in a way that minimises trauma. The process has to attract investors rather than scare them away. What is required in Zimbabwe is democratic rule, democracy is lacking in the country and that is the major cause of this economic meltdown.”[24]

  80. Svigor says:

    There’s a number of slack-jawed faggots in this thread

    They could use some chaw.

  81. Dahlia says:
    @William BadWhite

    If you know any ranchers you know there are a number of animals that are pests or worse and are kill on sight. I don’t know if that qualifies as killing “just for the sake of killing” though.

    My dad is a Florida rancher. We had issues with wild dogs, it was horrible.
    My stepdad lived in Clewiston in the 80s and had penned some wild boars: crazy scary creatures! People don’t realize how wild and rural the interior of south Florida is.

    • Replies: @William BadWhite
  82. @Dahlia

    The difference between a deer hunter and someone who travels to Africa to hunt lions and elephants is money. Stop spewing emotional nonsense.

    • Replies: @Dahlia
  83. Vinegar says:

    Hunting for meat, or survival, is one thing; and certainly more admirable than purchasing factory-farmed meat at the store – most of which was raised downright inhumanely (and for this reason I buy only grass-fed, free-range type products, for which I’ll gladly pay double). What’s worse — I once read that something like a third of that meat in the grocery store spoils and goes to waste.

    On the other hand, if everyone hunted for their meat, the wildlife would disappear in about a week. Nevertheless, deer are abundant in the Texas hill country (as their predators were all killed off by greedy ranchers who destroyed much of the land through overgrazing), and it would behoove me to hone my hunting and field-dressing skills.

    Back to Africa and the weak argument that trophy-hunting pays for conservation. If these jerks cared about conservation, they would donate the money outright without killing a threatened or endangered species. Clearly the implication here is that Africans have no desire to save these animals of their own volition – and this seems to be the root of the problem. So, let’s fix that problem?

    Call me a pussy for caring about animals. Fine. The disdain is mutual. Calling me a social justice warrior? That wouldn’t be accurate. I think most humans are scumbags and wouldn’t lift a finger to help them — even though I do have a tremendous amount of empathy. I just don’t think most people deserve my empathy – particularly those who couldn’t give a rat’s ass about wildlife and view them as objects to be slaughtered at will. I see it as my duty to protect the innocent. Animals are innocent. They don’t know any better. People should know better.

  84. Dee says:

    The badwhites probably need the hunting skills to keep goodwhites from easily hunting them down when the goodwhites decide that’s what’s needed to deal with badwhites…..probably within my lifetime…

  85. I first heard about this from my girlfriend, and what she told me is that the guy tortured the lion extensively before killing it. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but if she believes it, so do millions of others, and that would explain the outrage. If the mere killing of a lion by a rich white guy on a safari were enough to work the SJWs into a frenzy, it would have happened long ago.

  86. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    It’s a response to the argument (and you will find it a lot on this website) that blacks would not be able to use the land after whites were evicted. It is useful to point out this argument is wrong.

    Obviously small farms are not as productive as commercial farms–no one is engaged in such an argument.

  87. @Dahlia

    “My dad is a Florida rancher. We had issues with wild dogs, it was horrible.”

    Wild dogs can be terrifying. There’s another animal that should be shot on sight.

    “My stepdad lived in Clewiston in the 80s and had penned some wild boars: crazy scary creatures!”

    The ranch manager I know explained how to make boar meat more palatable: “you use dogs to run the male down, you wanna get ’em before his balls have dropped. Then tie ’em up and quick as a cat you cut his ballsack open and out pop the testicles. He’ll lose all interest in sows and just gain weight after that. And he won’t have no testosterone to taint the meat. You let him grow like that a couple of years then gut ’em. Only thing is, after you’ve cut his balls out, afore you untie him you wanna be up on something or in your truck cuz he’s gonna be pissed and looking for trouble”

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  88. Dahlia says:
    @Honorary Thief

    The difference between a deer hunter and someone who travels to Africa to hunt lions and elephants is money. Stop spewing emotional nonsense.

    ???
    I’m the daughter and granddaughter of ranchers and my mother’s side has redneck hunters… these views aren’t out of the mainstream for people like us (others may respectfully disagree and I’m fine with that). Look, I’m a country person, this is my background, and I’m just calling them like I see them: yes, when I see a suburban upper-middle class, balding guy spending some $$$ to go hunt in Africa, it strikes me as LARPing.

    But that doesn’t mean he’s evil. LARPing is all he’s guilty of that I can tell and while he makes people like us roll our eyes, that lynch mob is insane. Those people frighten me and if I discovered anybody in my life had participated in this, I’d seek to get away from them.

    To others, I do remember one form of killing that wasn’t for eradicating pests (and some people mount those if they’re interesting enough) or for food, entertainment I guess you could say: when you catch what you may suspect is the largest fish or bass you’ll ever see or a fish that is rare for you, and get it mounted.

    My stepdad and moms’ place was totally redneck chic: 3 mounted bass on the wall (caught during tournaments at Lake Okeechobee), two deer heads, a pair of antlers, a deerskin, and the skin of the largest rattlesnake he ever killed was set atop their couch!

  89. Svigor says:

    If the mere killing of a lion by a rich white guy on a safari were enough to work the SJWs into a frenzy, it would have happened long ago.

    LOL, you give waaay too much credit to the leftist social media mob. Most of them are worked into a frenzy because a few of them got worked into a frenzy and it snowballed.

  90. TWS says:
    @Sunbeam

    Nope a good trophy is a wonderful home decoration and if it is bearskin type useful as well. A lion skin would be an incredibly badass as a rug or wall hanging. Nobody who hunts cares what you SWPL folks care about. Going straight to the sex stuff? Weak tea. Plus when I started hunting I didn’t know what sex was I couldn’t be compensating for anything because I didn’t know what I was or wasn’t supposed to have. It’s like calling people who don’t want to see sodomites sodomizing each other ‘homophobic’ as if they were afraid of the sodomites rather than disgusted by the acts.

    If you can’t tell the difference between a rattlesnake of any kind and a non-rattlesnake, get better glasses or bother to learn. It’ll save you and the snakes. That actually is me caring.

  91. TWS says:
    @Realist

    No it’s called legal recreational sport hunting. There’s something really, really wrong with someone that wants humans to quit their naturally evolved behavior. Do you have a problem with homosexuals? Because hunting is far more natural a behavior.

  92. TWS says:
    @Realist

    Not everyone against trophy hunting is a liberal.

    No just a totalitarian.

  93. TWS says:
    @baldurdasche

    Are you really aware of the world? Food banks don’t take ‘donated’ wild meat.

    I’d just start commenting under another tag. You’ve really beclowned yourself. Many food banks take wild meat. Some don’t. One prison used to use wild game for their culinary training program. Liberal douches shut it down.

  94. TWS says:
    @Realist

    So this would be a non-issue but people like you are determined to make it one?

    You’re so totalitarian you want to be able to regulate every facet of everyone’s life? Good job with that the Stasi would have loved you.

  95. TWS says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Illegal in civilised countries of course.

    Is legal and does happen all the time in ‘civilized countries’. Are you people really so pig ignorant?

    And sure I’d eat the meat.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  96. TWS says:
    @Sean

    Pure identity politics. Upper class SWPL vs other whites. Still fun to see how ignorant they are of subjects they are happy to pontificate about.

  97. TWS says:
    @Honorary Thief

    Cougar is delicious. The tribes where I live can take two a year along with black bear good meat too!

  98. TWS says:
    @Dahlia

    Nobody kills just for killing if they are hunting. It is a skill that takes practice and is emotional primal satisfaction. If they want to kill they can go work for PETA. PETA kills more than 90% of its ‘rescued’ animals.

  99. TWS says:
    @Vinegar

    Animals are not innocent. Animals are not guilty. You are as superstitious and foolish as the people who used to put animals on trial when they killed a human.

    Animals are property or part of the ‘commons’ and can be harvested in any legal manner. Quit assuming that people who do not agree with you are not or cannot be conservationists. Legal hunters are the most effective and motivated conservationists the world has.

    If you have empathy problems with your fellow humans and project your needs and emotions onto animals you really have never gotten past the animist stage of human development. You’re medieval.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  100. BobX [AKA "Bob who is of Badwhite stock"] says:

    Hunting doesn’t hold a lot of charm for me so I haven’t gone since I was a teenager. When my younger brother drops off some venison it still tastes great. You have to be a nut job to believe that choosing not to hunt makes you morally superior to someone that does. You want to be a vegan or a PETA crack pot have at it, but it is a personal choice not a more morally defensible position. If trophy hunting makes you happy, get to it. It keeps the taxidermist busy.

  101. @Vinegar

    If these jerks cared about conservation, they would donate the money outright without killing a threatened or endangered species.

    They don’t care about the animals out of the kindness of their hearts. They care about them because their hobby requires their continued existence.

    Clearly the implication here is that Africans have no desire to save these animals of their own volition – and this seems to be the root of the problem. So, let’s fix that problem?

    Yeah, All We Have To Do Is fix Africans. That shouldn’t be too hard…

  102. @Sunbeam

    “Funny I’ve had it too. And it was gamey.”

    Whether it is a boar or a sow makes a difference to the taste. Domestic male hogs are gelded unless they are being kept for breeding, because the meat of an intact boar will have a strong flavor. Sows and gelded males are raised for meat.

    The feral hogs that populate many rural parts of the U.S. are descendants of domestic pigs and there is nothing that makes them inherently “gamey” compared to a domestic pig raised in the old-fashioned way and allowed to root for at least some of its food. A feral sow will taste better than a feral boar.

  103. @TWS

    I said “illegal in all civilised countries of course” and you denied this. I guess you may be the commonest kind of opinionated blogger, ie. the sort who doesn’t read and interpret the words and meaning of others carefully and fairly. Or you may just be wrong and surprisingly ignorant.

    Name me a First World country (a reasonable proxy for “civilised”) which doesn’t regulate the slaughter of animals for meat? (Even halal). Name me one which does not have laws against cruelty to animals which would have caught the dentist’s use of bow and arrow to kill unless the kill was swift.

    • Replies: @TWS
  104. @Svigor

    …non-white invasion of white living spaces,…

    I believe this started in 1619, somewhere in the Tidewater.

  105. unit472 says:

    Some mindless things ‘Goodwhites’ do.

    Climb Mount Everest. How many poor Sherpas have had to die to cater to that whim. Besides K-2 is supposed to be the more difficult mountain and its not crowded.

    Row across the Atlantic or Pacific Ocean. “Sonya Baumstein, 30, was rescued by the Japan Coast Guard a week after she began…” She wanted to be the first women to do it so she bulked up ( Got fat) but instead of a trim sun bronzed heroine gliding under the Golden Gate Bridge she’s just a fat chick some Japanese men had to pull out of the ocean.

    Get taken hostage by Islamic State, Taliban etc. You don’t see ‘badwhites’ thinking they have a get out of jail free card ( though liberals will plead with their government to spend millions or send in some badwhites to rescue them if their good intentions fail them!)

    Catch ebola and request a private jet ambulance to evacuate them to the finest bio hazard medical facilities in their homeland and put their fellow citizens at risk. OTOH they have no problem insisting ‘Badwhites’ be ordered into the plague zone to set up hospitals and provide security for their heroic endeavors.

    Date hoodrats and beg 911 to send some ‘badwhites’ when their hoodrat chimps out on them.

    • Replies: @Honorary Thief
  106. markflag says:
    @guest

    Except for being three-dimensional and jutting out of what should be a pleasingly flat surface big game hunting trophies are no different from the photos that decorate many an office showing the office holder with a variety of names, both political and of the entertainment industry. Both scream I matter, I have been to (name of safari country or state) vs. I have met (photo). I am guessing that Mr Kimmel has rows and rows of photos of his with notables as his own form of little blue pill. Hmmm, little blue pill, blue state, help getting it up and keeping it there. There is a parody in all that.

  107. Liberals always assume they have more fulfilling sex lives than conservatives simply because they talk about sex more than conservatives. However doing and talking are two different things.

    Charles Brack of the Neuropolitics site (which unfortunately has now disappeared) displayed some data indicating that conservatives tend to have the most partnered sex, while liberals and libertarians had the highest masturbation rates. The reason for the higher rates of partnered sex among conservatives was that they were more likely to be married, and were more likely to marry at a younger age than liberals.

  108. Side-Clip Suspenders! Hilarious

  109. @Sunbeam

    One story my dad brought back from Vietnam was about the VN eating cats. It seems to be common outside the civilized world.

  110. I think Lefties not only want to feel sexual superior, it is them who introduced the idea of sexual superiority / inferiority in the first place. Thus they do not only want to win the game, they invented it. In a conservative setting a man has value when he feeds a family and builds something. In a lefty / feminist setting a man has value when he is sexual attractive for females. Also having big genitalia is important for lefties, and lefties love to mock conservatives for small genitalia.
    Of course there are differences between the importance of those things between the big human races, and the modern, lefty western ideology converges to the subsaharan African model.

    • Replies: @unpc downunder
  111. @soren

    well the story was headline from Helsinki to Lisbon, from Australia to Alaska. Big game hunting might be a small niche, but the talking about it isn´t. Thats the point of those exemplary outcries anyway. They always take some rathe irrelevant thing to show something with it. Ferguson / Zimmerman / Cecil / Donald Sterling and so on and so on

  112. @Vinegar

    I would have probably taken the exactly same points like you. I think we should integrate the good parts of lefty ideology to a new right synthesis

    • Agree: Vinegar
  113. Rurik says:
    @Vinegar

    Excellent!

    This isn’t about Rhodesia vs. Zimbabwe. That’s a separate debate.

    This is about a man (and all those like him) so pathetic in his skin that he wants to kill a magnificent animal~ and do so in a cowardly way. If he wanted to enter into a coliseum and fight the lion with a knife or spear or something, so that it was a contest, then that’d be something I suppose. But what these omega men do is go on organized trips and are surrounded by men with guns so that at no time whatsoever are they in the slightest danger. Heavens no! – So they can end the life of one of the few remaining wonders of creation that our specie’s blind greed hasn’t yet shoved off the planet to make room for a few billion more waddling consumer ape$.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  114. Biff says:

    Yea, I get the irony of Zimbabwe as a country in disrepair, and everyone is worked up about one lion, but good whites vs. bad whites mantra is a waste of bandwidth. Why is everyone so concerned about race on this site? Being an asshole is an equal opportunity enterprise – does anyone think it’s relegated to one race, or half of one race?

    Also, I’m an avid hunter(for food) and fisherman to boot – I could careless what a talk-show host has to say about my habits. My brother is a catch-and-release fisherman, and I can’t understand why he wastes his time fishing at all, but I don’t go out of my way bashing his lifestyle.(he’s an idiot).

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  115. @Rurik

    The lion isn’t threatened by “our specie’s [sic] blind greed”, but by one particular subspecies‘ blind fecundity.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  116. @Biff

    Uh, whether America holds 400m, 600m, or 800m inhabitants depends on whether–and when– badwhites defeat goodshites* on some issues. And you think it’s a waste of bandwidth?

    *that was an honest slip of the finger on my phone– S is right under W. But it looks so appropriate that I won’t correct it.

  117. @Realist

    Presumably then, that “really, really wrong” something was shared by Theodore Roosevelt, Madison Grant, William Tecumseh Sherman, Gifford Pinchot, Frederick Russell Burnham, Frederick Courteney Selous, and Aldo Leopold.

    In the event those names are all unfamiliar to you, try using Wikipedia.

  118. @anon

    Zimbabweans living in South Africa in dire poverty? Because Zimbabwean farmers are so productive?

    If Zimbabwean tobacco yields are up over the 1965-1980 period it’s only because sanctions were lifted. Before 1965, the vast majority of Rhodesia’s tobacco was exported. Tobacco output declined afterwards as farmers switched to maize, wheat, and other crops to serve the domestic market.

    What has happened to the production of other agricultural products?

    • Replies: @PV van der Byl
  119. Flower says:

    Blah, blah, blah. In this wonderful, enlightened, and oh so trendy 21st century, the only thing cheaper than human life is human speech.

  120. Rurik says:
    @TWS

    Animals are property or part of the ‘commons’ and can be harvested in any legal manner

    the only difference between humans and the rest of the animal kingdom is one of degree, not one of kind

    We
    are animals too my friend. We just like to kid ourselves that we’re special and better and oh so smart as we overrun this planet in a blind frenzy of mindless breeding in our bovine stupor. We won’t relent until this planet is a barren and dead rock.

    Maybe we’re unique in that we can write on Internet weblogs, but what we write is no better than the animalistic instincts for tribal hegemony. The moments when we’re most sublimely like the Gods and less like the beasts is when we come to realize just how humble we actually are, and how it’s our compassion and ‘humanity” that we show for each other and for creation that redeems us in the slightest. Otherwise we’re just as brutish and stupid as the animals we so cruelly mistreat.

    • Replies: @BobX
  121. @Vinegar

    Wow. Where to begin? I suppose with these comments:

    thinks killing majestic (and nearly endangered) wildlife will make him appear ‘masculine’.

    Lions are not endangered in Zimbabwe or any other country with legal lion hunting (e.g. South Africa, Zambia). Lion populations have declined markedly in those countries where, as Americans like to say, they are “protected” such as Kenya and West African countries.

    No, it’s not manly to shoot wildlife from a distance for “fun”. It means you’re a psychopath. It means you’re what’s wrong with this world.

    So, Teddy Roosevelt , Gifford Pinchot, Frederick Russell Burnham, and Aldo Leopold were “psychopaths”?

    ……the wildlife is resigned to ever-smaller patches of woods or grassland, barely making it with no help from anyone or anything…

    That lion was killed on the border of Hwange National Park, bigger than Connecticut and half again as large as Yellowstone, the biggest park in the US. Hwange is contiguous with the Kavango–Zambezi Transfrontier Conservation Area (444,000 square kilometers, bigger than California and more than three times the size of England).

    And these trophy-hunting cunts want to go kill the few remaining animals left. For fun. Fuck you.

    The only places wild lion populations have increased significantly over the last three decades have been on privately owned land (i.e. farms) in southern Africa. Few of these would exist without trophy hunting. All that would be left would a few very upscale private game reserves like MalaMala where guests spend over $1000 a day.

    And people—Americans—are worked up about animal rights in this hell-hole? The animals are the only things I care about in that hellhole.

    In that case, you should support trophy hunting on privately owned (with secure legal titles) land in Africa. Those places, usually organized into “conservancies” are where all the wildlife population growth has come from.

    • Replies: @Vinegar
  122. Rurik says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    that blind fecundity is overrunning every continent on the planet

    our elites and our economic system depend on more people to create more demand for more housing and more consumers so that we can service ever more debt

    it doesn’t matter to our elites what level of melanin the subspecies have, so long as there’s always more of them

  123. Brain Guy says:

    This is the grand old tradition of dehumanizing ideological vituperation, in direct line of descent from Thomas More’s ravings against Luther

    You forgot to mention that your source shows Luther to be something of a deserving target.

  124. @Vinegar

    Wow—just wow. You live in Texas.

    I didn’t expect you to know much about Africa but I’d have thought you were not totally ignorant about your home state.

    So, you believe that “greedy ranchers” in Texas have overgrazed their own lands? Where? Who did that?

    Overgrazing is a problem in the American West on US government-owned lands (i.e. Bureau of Land Management, Forest Service). It’s never a problem on privately owned lands and, apart from Big Bend and a few other places, Texas is virtually all privately owned.

    Because of private ownership of land and the land-owners right to profit from fee-hunting (not a right in many states), Texas has become a haven for all sorts of hoofed animals endangered in their native countries.

    Just to pick one, the Indian blackbuck was first imported to central Texas in the 1930s. I believe the YO Ranch was the first.

    These animals were imported for trophy hunting and no other purpose. They were never in a US national park.

    But, guess what? There are now more of them in Texas than in India and Pakistan combined where they are “protected” in national parks and reserves. Hunting them in the subcontinent has been strictly illegal for 65 years.

    The King Ranch did essentially the same thing with the Nilgai except they got their animals from the San Antonio Zoo which was about to put them all down for lack of funds during the Depression.

    • Replies: @Vinegar
  125. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Honorary Thief

    And even happier not to have the lion around anymore. @ Honary Thief

  126. Svigor says:

    I believe this started in 1619, somewhere in the Tidewater.

    More like 1865.

  127. Svigor says:

    the only difference between humans and the rest of the animal kingdom is one of degree, not one of kind

    We are animals too my friend. We just like to kid ourselves that we’re special and better and oh so smart as we overrun this planet in a blind frenzy of mindless breeding in our bovine stupor. We won’t relent until this planet is a barren and dead rock.

    More leftist schizophrenia. Overrunning the planet is what any species does, given the opportunity.

    P.S., negroes are far more guilty of the sins you abhor.

    • Replies: @Vinegar
  128. GeorgeV says:
    @anon

    Except that your narrative came from your own imagination: http://wgbhnews.org/post/zimbabwe-may-give-land-back-some-white-farmers

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
  129. @PV van der Byl

    Somehow I managed to cut off the beginning of my first sentence.

    It should have read:

    “Why are two million Zimbabweans living in South Africa in dire poverty?”

  130. Sunbeam says:
    @GeorgeV

    Reading that link… it just boggles my mind that anyone would have stayed in Zimbabwe. One in 300 farmers is still there? A lot higher than I would have thought. Those bitter enders must be old or crazy.

    I guess they want the old farmers to come back. My guess is they are going to wind up with corporate agriculture from China though.

  131. BobX [AKA "Bob who~is impatient with asshats"] says:
    @Rurik

    Rurik you misguided miscreant it is a meaningless truth that we are animals in the context of this discussion about trophy hunting. Of course we are animals. Perhaps I misunderstood, are you suggesting a new hunting season on the species? You talk of compassion and humanity after just declaring our existence to be bovine breeding stupor, with the implication that there should be less people or the world will become barren and dead. You arrogant Malthusians & Ehrlichians never come out and say just who you think it is that should not be but clearly it is not Rurik as you are still here to comment. I suggest if this is truly your belief that you act on it and start with yourself. Before you go so far you might want to look at the replacement rates in the major industrialized nations of the world.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  132. Technomad says:

    I used to not be much interested in hunting (tried it as a kid, didn’t do any finding, and got bored with it) but after all this self-righteous breast-beating, I want to buy another Marlin .45-70 lever action (to replace one I had stolen) and go down to Texas (can’t afford Zimbabwe) and shoot wild pigs and nilgai.

    • Replies: @Vinegar
  133. TWS says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Wrong again. I did read your nonsense and confusing two issues with one thing. I just chose to ignore your nonsense. So now I’ll rub your nose it it.

    You’re conflating two very different issues. All first world countries have laws regarding agriculture, slaughter, hunting, cruelty to animals etc. That is not this issue.

    The bow hunt is legal. The waiting to track until day light was legal. Bowhunting or missing your shot and wounding prey isn’t illegal at least in the US. Since we’ve separated your nonsense because the two are not the same. Animal cruelty is illegal. Hunting is legal as long as the laws are followed (which is what happens when you accidentally wound an animal even if you used that nasty evil bow). You may think what happened was torture or cruelty but it is not nor is it illegal.

    Let’s see the US for one. Bad shoots happen all the time with or without bowhunting. It’s still legal. Having prey get away/ bleed out days later happens occasionally in the US and is perfectly legal with or without a bow. Bows take game much larger than lions every year.

    I guess the US isn’t civilized enough for you. What would happen if Queen Elizabeth were to wound a quail and it was found the next day whereupon she broke it’s neck? Would she be guilty of a crime? Would the UK be uncivilized? She used to be quite the hunter in her day. Is the quail different than the lion?

    So that’s two for you instead of one.

    You really, really do not understand hunting laws or even have any idea of what can and does occur every hunting season. It’s unfortunate when an animal is wounded and doesn’t bleed out quickly it doesn’t make it illegal.

    So he missed his shot. Still legal. Followed the animal when it was day light and safe. Still legal.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  134. Rurik says:
    @BobX

    You arrogant Malthusians & Ehrlichians never come out and say just who you think it is that should not be

    Now, now Bob, settle down

    I’m not for killing anyone. My point is that we are mindlessly overpopulating the planet into a barren desolation. I see it everywhere. Everywhere they are building and destroying natural habitats and all wild places. I believe that wild places and wild things deserve to exist for their own sake. You call me arrogant, but I can’t think of anything more pathetically arrogant than the idea that creation exits especially and exclusively for you- to consume it and rape it dry to the last extinct non-human life form that isn’t on a farm and existing for the sole benefit of humans.

    But forget that I think the natural world has a right to exist for its own sake. Perhaps you figure it was all put here especially for you. Because your God loves you that much. OK, fine. But how do you justify wiping out all the natural wonders of the world that the next generations of God’s special beings won’t be able to enjoy. What kind of a world is it going to be when there are no more wild lions on the earth?

    But then again, I think there are a lot of you that would personally shoot the last living lion on the planet with a bow and arrow just to feel all manly.

    That’s what we’re doing. Species are going extinct every day. There’s like four white rhinos left on the planet. How much would you pay to kill them?

    Look at it this way .. Imagine that the whole world is like Haiti, and that you’re a Haitian. Now imagine that you have in your possession the Jewel of the Caribbean. The most beautiful and lush place known to man. Now what would be the smart thing to do? Do you want to maintain this fabulous place for your progeny for perpetuity? So that they too can live in such magnificent splendor? Or do you want to mindlessly and greedily overpopulate the place until it’s nothing but a stinking mud pit of poverty and despair. Now just extrapolate what the Haitians did to Haiti to what humanity is doing to the rest of the planet.

    All we need to do is recognize that there is a problem. Then fund family planning in the Third World. And yes, of course close our borders to the teaming hoards and Europe and Scandinavia and North America and Oceana’s problems would be solved overnight.

    But instead we’re too blind and greedy and arrogant. It’s a terrible shame and a terrible sin.

  135. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @William BadWhite

    That was the second best story in this whole thread! chears..

  136. Vinegar says:
    @PV van der Byl

    Lions are not endangered in Zimbabwe or any other country with legal lion hunting (e.g. South Africa, Zambia). Lion populations have declined markedly in those countries where, as Americans like to say, they are “protected” such as Kenya and West African countries.

    This is the bottom line:

    “Lions are dying off rapidly across Africa. These cats once ranged across the continent and into Syria, Israel, Iraq, Pakistan, Iran, and even northwest India; 2,000 years ago more than a million lions roamed the Earth. Since the 1940s, when lions numbered an estimated 450,000, lion populations have blinked out across the continent. Now they may total as few as 20,000 animals. Scientists connect the drastic decreases in many cases to burgeoning human populations.”
    http://animals.nationalgeographic.com/animals/big-cats-initiative/lion-decline-map/

    Killing more, “for fun”, is despicable and inexcusable.

    I don’t care if the killing takes place on private or pubic land, on a reserve or not. It’s irrelevant to the big picture. People who kill lions (except in legitimate self-defense) should be dealt with harshly.

    I am in favor of large conservation areas patrolled by armed security to deal with poachers. In the case of Africa, the people and the leadership are so thoroughly intellectually-and-morally bankrupt that I’m in favor of returning to a colonial system whereby White countries collectively administer the place – especially before the Chinese get their rapacious claws into it. The only reason there are any wildlife left in Africa is due to the totally disorganized and ineffectual nature of Black Africans as a whole.

    • Replies: @PV van der Byl
    , @TWS
  137. Vinegar says:
    @Technomad

    self-righteous breast-beating

    Who’s being self-righteous:

    – the people who want to stop the killing of animals for reasons other than self-defense or food

    – the people who want to kill animals “for fun” without respect to their dwindling populations and habitat – because they apparently just don’t give a shit about Nature or preserving the ecosystems that sustain life on this planet. If they want to preserve it at all, the reason they give is “so they can continue their hobby, which is killing more animals.”

    The pseudo-machismo from the fake alphas in this thread is astounding.

    Completely self-centered. No empathy for other living things whatsoever – except for the feigned empathy or lip service for other humans (because they don’t have the balls or brains to speak the truth – which is that most humans are effing scum and there are far too many of us). These are the kind of people that won’t be happy until there are no forests left in America. No wild, unfenced grasslands.

    Somebody said I’m “medieval.” Again, the opposite is true. Most of you are the anachronisms. You have this ‘abundance mentality’ that might have been true and useful 300 years ago in America, or 3000 years ago in Europe. The idea that game and unspoiled land are abundant and we need to go conquer it. It’s clearly a genetic disposition that was useful then, but destroying the planet now.

    You don’t get it, presumably because, you can’t get it. You won’t get it until, like the Easter Islanders, the last tree is cut down so to speak. It’s like a congenital myopia combined with ignorance and selfishness.

  138. Vinegar says:
    @Svigor

    More leftist schizophrenia. Overrunning the planet is what any species does, given the opportunity.

    P.S., negroes are far more guilty of the sins you abhor.

    Yes, and in Nature, after a particular organism overshoots the carrying capacity of the ecological system that sustains it, the population collapses.

    A few of us are trying to sound the alarm. You idiots are cheering it on.

    Meanwhile, from what I can discern, the shadow global government more-or-less agrees with me, and is orchestrating a controlled collapse – – probably motivated more by a desire to stay in power as actual concern for Earth.

    That’s not to say that we couldn’t sustain 7 billion humans indefinitely on half the amount of land we’ve already commandeered for human use — we could — but only under ‘wise management’ using permaculture techniques. But, why should we continue to subsidize and sponsor the fertility of billions of imbeciles?

    Call me an arrogant prick. Whatever. I speak the truth.

    I only hope their impending ‘Judgment Day’ does a good job of sparing people like Erik Seiven, Realist, and Rurik.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  139. Vinegar says:
    @PV van der Byl

    but I’d have thought you were not totally ignorant about your home state.

    So, you believe that “greedy ranchers” in Texas have overgrazed their own lands? Where? Who did that?

    First, zoom in on various parts of Texas from satellite maps. You’ll see that very few contiguous patches of forest are left – where once The Big Thicket covered the entire eastern third of the state. 98% of the state is now divided into barren acre-sized squares, mostly fenced.

    Everywhere I go in this state I see farms and ranches. Almost without exception, the grazed land is thick with juniper, mesquite and prickly pear, and very little grass.

    “Many of the deeper, more fertile soils of the Rolling Plains have been converted to row crops, but the majority of the area consists of native sod that has a long history of overgrazing by domestic livestock. Native grasses such as hairy grama (Bouteloua hirsuta), three-awns (Aristida species), and sand dropseed (Sporobolus cryptandrus) have replaced climax native grasses, and woody species such as mesquite, lotebush, and red-berry juniper have increased”

    Look how many more times overgrazing is mentioned in the article exceprted above about the various grassland regions in Texas: https://tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/gqg01

    Even in the once-forested areas that get abundant rainfall, land that used to support lush vegetation has been denuded, soils, severly compacted, and minerals/fertility depleted such that now it’s barely able to grow anything.

    Then you consider the areas under cultivation, and I think this article best explains it:

    Harpers: THE OIL WE EAT
    http://www.resilience.org/stories/2004-05-23/oil-we-eat-following-food-chain-back-iraq

    • Replies: @Realist
    , @PV van der Byl
  140. @unit472

    I think it’s mostly badwhites that climb Everest. Also, it’s the daughters of poor badwhites that mostly date the negroes.

  141. @Vinegar

    You are simply a willfull ignoramus.

    In all the countries mentioned in your citation, where lion populations have collapsed, lion hunting is illegal and has been for half a century or more.

    In those few countries where it is legal, lion populations are stable or increasing.

    That is the bottom line.

    • Replies: @Vinegar
  142. Realist says:
    @Vinegar

    You make elegant arguments, but you are casting pearls before swine.

    • Replies: @Realist
  143. @Vinegar

    You simply abandon one silly argument for another when called out on your nonsense.

    So, it’s only “contiguous” forest land that counts as healthy? In other words, no houses, roads, railways, telephone lines, or sewers to interrupt the contiguity? Nothing that would provide a high standard of living?

    You’d have to go back to about 1836 to see when the Big Thicket covered a third of East Texas. And when the population of Texas was something like 50,000 and when many of those lived at a subsistence level.

    38% of the state is still forest land:

    http://texasalmanac.com/topics/environment/forest-resources

    That hasn’t changed much in decades.

    Of course, successful human settlement leads to some land clearance and some changes in vegetation. So what. Texas produces about 20% of the beef cattle in the US and more than any other state. They are not living on mesquite.

    • Replies: @Vinegar
  144. Vinegar says:
    @PV van der Byl

    I understand what you’re saying, which is essentially that — under the current paradigm — the only way to preserve even a few lions in Africa is to bribe some local warlord/government goon to keep people off the land and prevent them from killing the endangered wildlife. In other words, by appealing to their greed rather than their [nonexistent] desire to preserve Nature for its own sake. Of course, if some Chinese merchant offers the warlord and his crew of lion poachers/protectors big money for lion parts so they can concoct some ridiculous potion to sell in China, then what does he care if a few dozen more lions or rhinos are killed ‘off the books’. Laws are obviously meaningless to Africans unless backed up by deadly force.

    My position remains: Change the paradigm altogether and stop the killing of lions. If that means a return to ‘colonialism’, so be it. Self-rule has unequivocally been a disaster to Africans and African wildlife.

    On that note, we Whites have been terrible stewards of the Earth too. But, we’re also the only group with a sizeable cohort of people who have both the means, the wisdom, and the desire to do it right (and for no other reason than out of the goodness of our hearts) – our leadership and people in this thread not withstanding.

    • Replies: @fnn
  145. @TWS

    Thank you for a small extension to my knowledge from your own limited store on a subject which does not much interest me. Maybe some of what you say about the law in the US is correct (and I note that, though you are characteristically American in your indifference to the rest of the world’s standards, the variety to be found in the laws of 50 states plus Puerto Rico, DC etc is complex beyond your simple version) but my online searches show hunting with bow and arrow to be illegal in the UK, illegal for native animals in Australia and arguably caught by anti-cruelty laws in Australia according to the RSPCA’s view of the matter. So, cruelty it is, by the standards of civilised jurisdictions that condemns the dentist. He might only have escaped zealous prosecutors if he could show that Cecil’s lingering fate was the result of the most unusual and unpredictable chance events that he had taken every conscientious effort to avoid – and even then it might have been “guilty but no conviction recorded” or the local variant).

    But, yes, you are right. I don’t regard the US as more than patchily civilised. I enjoy visiting the great barbarian empire because of the 5 to 10 per cent of the equivalent of educated Greek speaking Romans in the Roman Empire and some of their learned institutions – and I admire the vigour of enterprise against increasing odds. But in a multi- point system of assessing civilisation there is a lot from drug and drug laws and wars, mandatory sentences, three strikes laws, incarceration rates, murder rates, capital punishments, a criminal justice system that depends on coerced plea deals, politics corrupted by money, the antiquated grand jury farce, healthcare costs, life expectancy and much else to offset what draws me back to the new Rome.

    I don’t share Americans’ curious fascination with royalty which they unfortunately replaced with a system that gives too much power to often inadequate heads of state so I shan’t bother with discussing Queen Elizabeth and her family’s outdoor avocations.

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
    , @TWS
  146. fnn says:

    It likely will be only a few more years before the African Wild Dog (in an entirely different genus from wolves, dogs and coyotes) becomes extinct in the wild. Maybe they could be rescued to predate upon Pronghorn Antelope in North America, they clearly have no future in Africa.

  147. Vinegar says:
    @PV van der Byl

    So, it’s only “contiguous” forest land that counts as healthy? In other words, no houses, roads, railways, telephone lines, or sewers to interrupt the contiguity? Nothing that would provide a high standard of living?

    I would like at least half of the land voluntarily returned to Nature, and many of the fences torn down. We could still produce more than enough to feed ourselves, particularly if people would grow their own vegetable gardens, and eat less grain & meat — and all while still maintaining a high standard of living.

    38% of the state is still forest land:

    http://texasalmanac.com/topics/environment/forest-resources

    That hasn’t changed much in decades.

    Google earth tells the full story. Most of that ‘forest land’ is merely rows of pine plantation that will be chopped down again, or at best, a few decades of regrowth since it was clear-cut. Zoom in and see. These are not rich and diverse fully-functioning forest ecosystems that support a wide variety of plant and animal species as they once did.

    Guess what percent of land in Texas is old-growth forest?

    Zero.

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  148. fnn says:
    @Vinegar

    If that means a return to ‘colonialism’, so be it. Self-rule has unequivocally been a disaster to Africans and African wildlife.

    Yeah, decolonization was a terrible mistake. It was a product of the radical egalitarian hysteria of the post-Hitler era of Cold War competition with the cynical pretend champions of the oppressed of the Soviet Bloc. Puppet states set up mainly to pay off local elites to maintain their quiescence would have been a far superior solution.

  149. Vinegar says:

    I want to re-post this article one more time. I implore all of you to read it in its entirety!

    One of my favorite of all time.

    Plato wrote of his country’s farmlands:

    What now remains of the formerly rich land is like the skeleton of a sick man. …Formerly, many of the mountains were arable, The plains that were full of rich soil are now marshes. Hills that were once covered with forests and produced abundant pasture now produce only food for bees. Once the land was enriched by yearly rains, which were not lost, as they are now, by flowing from the bare land into the sea. The soil was deep, it absorbed and kept the water in loamy soil, and the water that soaked into the hills fed springs and running streams everywhere. Now the abandoned shrines at spots where formerly there were springs attest that our description of the land is true.

    Plato’s lament is rooted in wheat agriculture, which depleted his country’s soil and subsequently caused the series of declines that pushed centers of civilization to Rome, Turkey, and western Europe. By the fifth century, though, wheat’s strategy of depleting and moving on ran up against the Atlantic Ocean. Fenced-in wheat agriculture is like rice agriculture. It balances its equations with famine. In the millennium between 500 and 1500, Britain suffered a major “corrective” famine about every ten years; there were seventy-five in France during the same period. The incidence, however, dropped sharply when colonization brought an influx of new food to Europe.

    http://www.resilience.org/stories/2004-05-23/oil-we-eat-following-food-chain-back-iraq

    • Replies: @TWS
  150. joe webb says:

    embarrassed to contribute to this bitchfest…but. the whole show biz here is about White Men Bad, no matter what they do. African poachers , thousand of them, chainsaw rhino horn for chinks, and elephant tusks for a probably Asian market for carvings. Don’t forget tiger penis for chinks as well.

    Real Bad White Man. Joe Webb

  151. @Erik Sieven

    The sexualisation of modern society probably has more to do with capitalism and technology than left vrs right. Both men and women today place greater importance on sexual attractiveness than they did in previous generations.

    Urbanisation, increasing affluence, contraception, advertising, pornography, and the widening gap in attractiveness between attractive elites and ordinary citizens probably just as big a part as feminism and changing social mores.

    • Replies: @5371
  152. Realist says:
    @Realist

    As well as eloquent arguments.

  153. @Wizard of Oz

    I note that, though you are characteristically American in your indifference to the rest of the world’s standards,

    As an American I am proud to say that the rest of the world can eliminate liquid from their bodies up a piece of braided hemp.

  154. @Vinegar

    I would like at least half of the land voluntarily returned to Nature,

    And what if the property owners don’t share your desires? Do you send men with guns to take the land from them?

    There is nothing magical about “old growth forests”.

  155. 5371 says:
    @unpc downunder

    [the widening gap in attractiveness between attractive elites and ordinary citizens]

    Yes, that Gina Rinehart is smoking hawt.

    • Replies: @unpc downunder
  156. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Lol, white supremists,

    the animals that have gone extinct here in southern africa were hunted to extinction by europeans. Europeans are bad for africa.

  157. Rurik says:
    @Vinegar

    fertility of billions of imbeciles?

    but they are consumer imbeciles!

    you don’t need brains or character to buy Nike tennis shoes, in fact brains and character are net downsides from the perspective of the elites who farm the deliberately dumbed-down waddling consumer ape$

    something could be done

    A tiny fraction of the money and effort that is being spent on the Global Warming swindle could have just as well been used to alert and educate the human race about the dire consequences of exponentially exploding numbers of imbeciles. But that wouldn’t have put any lucre in Goldman Sach’s coffers.

    At one time the Sierra Club started to make the connection between Third World immigration and the effects of overpopulation on the environment and wildlife, and then right on cue, some hate-crazed tribal scumfuck sent them a hundred million dollars to never mention immigration again.

    There are some very unsavory motivations for the continued despoliation of the planet.

    It’s a pleasure reading your comments

    • Replies: @BobX
  158. BobX [AKA "Bob who~is a misanthrope"] says:
    @Rurik

    I am by nature a misanthrope, but I have more sympathy for Cherifa & Yasmina as they pump out their 6.89 babies/woman in Niger than I do for pompous self-absorbed clowns like Rurik & Vinegar. They spout reams of words, yet at core their argument is I don’t like it so it should stop and I am superior and all those I judge inferior should not exist so that the world can be more the way I like it.

    Change is the constant. There never was a magical golden age. We are on the verge of bringing extinct creatures back from their oblivion. We have not seriously pushed anywhere near the limits of the human carrying capacity of this little dirt ball let alone the infinite universe. I choose a bigger brighter future for my children and will have no truck with those that would condemn them to a smaller life. If they would like to remove themselves from the gene pool I am good with that and Cherifa, Yasmina, and my children will get by without them.

    The world has lots of real problems. Trophy hunters paying $60k a trip are not on that list though.

    https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2127rank.html

    • Replies: @Rurik
  159. 5371 says:

    [We are on the verge of bringing extinct creatures back from their oblivion.]

    Bullshit.

    [We have not seriously pushed anywhere near the limits of the human carrying capacity of this little dirt ball let alone the infinite universe.]

    Sayonara.

  160. guest says:
    @Sunbeam

    “You should only grow edible or useful plants.”

    So no one ought to grow for the heck of it, for instance, or because gardens please them aesthetically? Or maybe gardens are “useful” as works of art according to your definition. Then why can’t killing lions be useful for sporting purposes? Because, I imagine, you don’t think sport is a legitimate object, for reasons unstated and having nothing to do with your usefulness argument.

    Your post demonstrates the sort of mad rationalism I despise.

    • Replies: @Sunbeam
  161. Rurik says:
    @BobX

    inferior should not exist

    don’t take it too personal Bob

    no one wants to condemn anyone to a smaller life

    But when we humans have destroyed the last wild things on this planet to make room for more Burger Kings and Walmarts and their denizens, your progeny will surely curse you in your graves for your short-sighted, small minded stupidity and selfish, egoistic blindness.

    The very kind of selfish, cowardly, puerile swagger of a ‘big man hunter’ who shoots rare animals from total safety, so he can prove how brave and virile he is!

    I wonder how many of these brave “hunters” would hunt a lion using only a bow and arrow and their wits and sans the ‘several men with guns- just in case’ protection?

    Yea, that’s what I figured ..

  162. TWS says:
    @Vinegar

    Okay we get it you’re a totalitarian. You don’t like something so you want it banned.

  163. TWS says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    You literally know nothing about what laws I do or do not know and in what jurisdictions. You understand that in the US, the states get to set most of the game laws? That means they vary from state to state. I’ve enforced game laws in multiple jurisdictions. I’ve caught poachers. You, you got your twitter and facebook account covered in pictures of your little Cecil. What have you personally done to stop illegal hunting (which we are not discussing with the dead lion) or animal cruelty, or animal welfare or hell anything worth while.

    So ignore the answers to your question that you don’t like. So it wasn’t the Queen that shot the quail it was a gardener lawfully recreating. The poor thing was found the next day and dispatched by the gardener. So is the quail different than the lion. Do you want to prosecute the gardener?

    Now bring in some smoke and squid ink to change the subject. No I answered your questions but you don’t have the stones to answer mine. Change the subject some more. Or go hug your wet pillow with the salty tears shed for Cecil.
    The lion is no different than a deer in a field. I’m sure his meat was appreciated by everyone who got some.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  164. TWS says:
    @Vinegar

    [It’s not good policy to write numerous, relatively short comments, which tend to clutter up a comment-thread. Instead, you should combine them together into one or two much longer and more substantial ones.]

    Join the club of Rome. Come tell me how were going to run out of arable land and food ‘real soon now’. There is so much farmland and grazing land lying fallow that the US could probably feed the world.

  165. @5371

    I said attractive elites – models, movie stars, TV presenters, women in public relations, et al. Most men and women are getting fatter, while people who are born relatively attractive are spending more and more time and money on personal appearance, fitness etc. Fifty years ago there wasn’t such be a big gulf between the average person and those in the media.

  166. dcite says:

    Lately most SWPL/SJW causes repel me, but I have to admit, I was on Cecil’s side here. Because there’s no reason to go thousands of miles just to kill — slowly — a beautiful animal who was also a money maker. Now if Cecil were going to make a snack of someone, well, that’s a different story. But such was not the case. He was minding his own business and some man from thousands of miles away pays what is a fortune to a Zimbabwean, just to kill him. Yeah, I wouldn’t put it above the persecuted, dispersed and useful white farmers, but it’s pretty bad.
    Tormenting animals is depraved. I don’t care about Walter what’is’name at all.

  167. Sunbeam says:
    @guest

    “Then why can’t killing lions be useful for sporting purposes? Because, I imagine, you don’t think sport is a legitimate object, for reasons unstated and having nothing to do with your usefulness argument.”

    What sport? The dentist in question shot the lion with a bow (actually I thought he used a crossbow but I was wrong). Do you actually think he risked his life? That he told his guides and companions on the hunt to put away their weapons, this was mano a liono?

    That isn’t covered in the writeups on this incident, but I’m pretty sure of how this guy did it. There was no risk to him. I’d imagine he was in more danger from getting bitten by a snake than a lion (yeah snakes again).

    Not that I can blame him, it would be stupid to do it any other way. But at that point what exactly is the sport? To shoot him with a bow? What is the fricking difference between using a gun in this situation? So the lion could run off wounded?

    And for what exactly? So the guy could have a picture? Or a head mounted on a backboard? Silly.

    The bow thing is kind of a red herring. Most animals are killed with guns. There are some bowhunters, but most kills are done with guns. Do you really think the outcome is in doubt?

    Let’s put this another way. Say I hid in a blind. Or found a nice spot for an ambush. Then you walk along and I shoot you.

    Would that be sport? Leaving aside all the laws that would be broken. Would it be sport?

    I wouldn’t say so. I’d say it was an ambush. And the whole idea of it was to “avoid” sport and have absolutely no risk to me.

    But fear not. I have absolutely no interest in eating you.

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  168. @Sunbeam

    Do you actually think he risked his life?

    Yes, I would say he did.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTQm4AU3caY

    To shoot him with a bow? What is the fricking difference between using a gun in this situation?

    Using a bow requires more skill and being at a closer range to the animal.

    Here you go, 25 of the biggest animals hunted with a bow.

    http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/hunting/2010/04/biggest-bow/?image=25

  169. Sunbeam says:

    Uh huh. And I’m to believe that there weren’t a few scopes on this lion in case something went pear shaped.

    But on a sort of unrelated note, it occurred to me that lions were once found in the middle east and even further away. The greeks for example had references to lions, so they knew what they were. The one I am thinking of was “The Nemedian Lion,” but you’d think some were around Greece proper since they had such good imagery of it.

    Exactly how far back to you have to go if you place the existence of animals as something that has to weigh in for consideration? Is that only going forward? Because Aurochs and Cave Bears are no longer around in Europe. Wolves ranged in some parts of the UK as late as the 1700’s. I think.

    Just how far do you have to go with this sort of thing? And do you get a pass if your ancestors were the ones that got rid of some of these, instead of you doing the deed?

    Then there is the fact that elephants may actually be… self-aware for lack of a better word. That is kind of woo woo, but from what I’ve read this is a real possibility. I mean if you could demonstrate that elephants had the reasoning ability of say an IQ 40 individual, what does that mean?

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  170. @Sunbeam

    Man is the top predator. Only a fool would leave other large predators to roam where he lives. Wolves, lions and bears were killed off in Europe because our ancestors were not fools.

  171. As any zookeeper can tell you, lions breed rapidly and with large litters when circumstances allow. They are not endangered even today, although certain subspecies like the famous Barbary lion are either extinct or nearly so in the wild. When our family was in the pet shop business in the sixties and seventies we were constantly beseiged with people offering us lion cubs, which were the one big cat not on the endangered list in the later days of our business. (When we started, we could get any cat you wanted, even cheetahs, which are the one big cat that actually isn’t insane to keep as a pet, but which are exceedingly tough to breed in captivity.)

    Habitat destruction and poaching are the enemies of all African megafauna, not wealthy safari hunters, who in fact do more to keep the species continuing than anyone else.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  172. @Realist

    There’s something really, really wrong with a self righteous man who assumes a dentist who trophy hunts is a sick little [email protected]^ without ever having met with the man, talked with him, or asked him why he likes to hunt. No one more enjoys dehumanizing the opposition than a goodwhite.

    I’m sure there are many antelope and other animals that are very grateful there is one less lion in their world.

    • Replies: @dcite
  173. One of Cecil’s cubs has been killed by a would-be successor.

  174. Rurik says:
    @Former Darfur

    Habitat destruction and poaching are the enemies of all African megafauna

    not just African, but the entire world’s

    wealthy safari hunters, who in fact do more to keep the species continuing than anyone else.

    No, it’s the people who fund preserves and are committed to the preservation of our ecology and wildlife that do the most, but they can only do so much when faced with so much greed and apathy and tribal myopia. Not to mention pseudo “manly men” (of both genders) who get off on killing magnificent animals for the sake of doing it.

    Personally I have no quarrel with people who hunt, especially for food or to protect livestock or even for the thrill, provided it’s done in as humane a way possible. But for those people, usually wealthy western men- completely disconnected to any real appreciation for the profoundness of nature, and especially the rare and ethereal kind of nature you find on the African savannas, to just go and pay money to kill a venerable animal so they can say they did, and have their equally vapid buddies coo over their ‘trophy’, just disgusts me on a visceral level. I think it’s how most people felt when they saw the sailors in the movie Mutiny on the Bounty shooting the dolphins for fun. Or perhaps the way the venerable Jacque Cousteau felt when he went from being a fisherman to being a naturalist. He grew to revere the life in the sea, and wanted to study it and most of all preserve it, once he had come to appreciate it. I suppose I feel the same way about clueless, shallow manly men wanting to “hunt” lions (from safety in a controlled, farcical stunt) as Mr Cousteau would feel about wealthy businessmen killing whales for the fun of it. – Just imagine, you could pay a small fortune to man the harpoon gun personally! They could take you to a known blue whale breeding waters, or perhaps hook one and drag him in the water for you to aim at, you could pull the trigger and kill him yourself! Gosh, just think, you could cut off it’s dick and mount it in your den! (this has actually been done) You’d be the envy of all your buddies and the talk of the town!

  175. dcite says:
    @A Pseudonymic Handle

    Maybe not so much sick as contemptible. Since there are still people who pay to kill animals that are not doing any harm, or needed for food, I guess this is going to be controversial. Sick too strong a word? Let’s just say a bit lacking in empathy and appropriateness, and yes I know empathy would not be on the table if Cecil were attacking someone. But such was not the case, nor going to be the case. This cowardly hunter with a gun would just shoot him and crow.

    Lions killing antelopes is necessary for food. They cull the herd, and not that many are got anyway.
    As for not knowing Walter the Lion Killer personally, maybe it’s a bit of profiling, but I think we know all I’d ever want to know about him.

    Let’s just say I wouldn’t want him for my dentist.

  176. Robert Mugabe eats a zoo for ‘obscene’ 91st birthday party

    The ZANU-PF leader saw in his 92nd year with the slaughter of wild animals, including an elephant, which were cooked and served to his guests.

    His party took place at an exclusive lodge, spa and golf course in Victoria Falls, and it was estimated to have cost $1million (£648,000).

    His guests were fed a young elephant, and two buffaloes, two sables and five impalas

    He also threw in a lion and a crocodile to be stuffed as an extra gift for Mugabe.

    The ZANU-PF leader saw in his 92nd year with the slaughter of wild animals, including an elephant, which were cooked and served to his guests.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    , @Rurik
  177. @Hippopotamusdrome

    On the other hand, Mugabe’s offer to come to Washington, kneel and propose to Barack Obama– that’s just the tonic this country needs right now. Give him a visa!

  178. @TWS

    I appreciate the rare commenter who writes about something he knows about reliably, and more than others do, so I am happy to call you as an expert witness on the practice of enforcing hunting laws in several states of the US. (I note that you acknowledge the truth of my assertion or assumption that hunting laws – and laws on cruelty to animals – can vary widely amongst the several states). But for counsel to address the court I need someone who sees what the issues are and can make a logical argument, grounded in both case and statute law, that will persuade the court.

    I think you are too immersed in details close to your heart. The issue that you may find most concerns most people is whether it is cruel to kill an animal by wounding it and only catching it up to finish off hours later. That it is a large mammal rather than a quail may affect people’s emotional reactions and their willingness to see people prosecuted and convicted but has no logical relationship to what the laws of civilised countries say about cruelty to animals. If you don’t understand that then please make sure that there is counsel as well as expert testimony in any case you are concerned with.

  179. Rurik says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Had the dentist put the arrow into Mugabe, I can’t imagine a soul on earth that wouldn’t be singing his praises.

  180. Friedrich says:
    @Sunbeam

    I am inclined to agree with the statement “you only hunt to eat”, as well as other limited reasons to kill animals i.e. culling, disease, etc., but to hunt a Lion with a gun shows a lack of virtue.

    To travel halfway around the world and hunt a Lion is, in my opinion, despicable. Just so this big man can have a Lions head on his office wall. Bravo old chap (can you hear the sound of one hand clapping fool?)

    The only way this could be condoned is if this hero hunter would have gone into a fight with this Lion with only his bare hands. If he won, then he would have won fairly. Likewise if he lost, which is likely to have been the outcome, it would have been a fight to the death with bare…paws and hands.

    Using a man-made object like a rifle to shoot a defenceless animal (well, Cecil didn’t have a gun did he?), gives the human a distinct advantage where he didn’t need to engage the Lion up close. Therefore what this big man did was unnecessarily cruel and harks back to the days of the great white hunter mindset. Something we could have done without in the current zeitgeist.

Current Commenter
says:

Leave a Reply - Comments on articles more than two weeks old will be judged much more strictly on quality and tone


 Remember My InformationWhy?
 Email Replies to my Comment
Submitted comments become the property of The Unz Review and may be republished elsewhere at the sole discretion of the latter
Subscribe to This Comment Thread via RSS Subscribe to All John Derbyshire Comments via RSS