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Why the Omar Kerfuffle Will be Declared Over on April 10th
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The Democratic Coalition of the Fringes is coming apart at the seams today as Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi blinked in her confrontation with hijab-wearing freshman Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-New Puntland on the Prairie).

This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other, especially as the recent Jussie Smollett and Covington fiascos have temporarily blunted the utility of ginning up hate hoaxes as the KKKrazy Glue to hold the Democrats together.

Israel is particularly fraught for American Democrats at present as the ethnonationalist Jewish state historically drifts right. Usually, Democrats don’t pay much attention to that, but with Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu being friendly with Trump and tweeting out how walls and fences really do work for keeping out Illegal Infiltrators, Bibi is finally starting to be seen by Democrats as Trump’s John the Baptist.

On the other hand, Bibi called for an election on April 9. Even though Bibi has been at or near the top in Israel since 1996, he just might lose. In the latest poll, his Likud party is supported by 30% of voters relative to the new Blue & White alliance’s 35%. (How that translates into the horsetrading necessary to put together a majority in the Knesset, don’t ask me. Likud is usually at an advantage because Israel’s unwritten rule is that while Israel’s Arab citizens are allowed to vote, their parties can’t be used to put together a majority to form a government.)

While Likud is more closely aligned with the GOP, at least one Blue & White leader, Yair Lapid, often speaks out against Bibi alienating American Democrats.

If Blue & White were to win, I would expect virtually the entire American mainstream media to declare as one that the Nice People in Israel have won, just like they will win in America in 2020, and thus there is no longer any need for Democrats to feud over Israel. Because everything will be Nice from Now On.

Amusingly, in an age of anti-Straight White Male identity politics in America, Israel is so far right these days that its center-left Blue & White coalition is led by macho straight white men. These guys who are the leaders of the left of center alliance look like the cast of a Hebrew language remake of The Expendables. In the U.S., “diversity” means the Democratic Party in the House of Representatives is now controlled by the Muslim Women in Hijabs Caucus. In Israel, “diversity” means that one of the ex-generals leading the left is not an old paratrooper. From Haaretz:

Analysis Election 2019: The One Where Liberal Israelis Fantasize About Being Ruled by a Gang of Generals

Only in Israel can three gruff military men emerge as the last line of defense against Netanyahu and his war to degrade democracy and dismantle the rule of law

Chemi Shalev
Mar 06, 2019 11:13 PM

  • Gantz’s party releases platform: Deepen separation from Palestinians, strengthen settlement blocs
  • Latest Israeli election poll gives center-left bloc edge over right …

A party led by three former generals who made their name fighting the enemy on the battlefield and exerting military control over millions of disenfranchised civilians would automatically be stereotyped, in any other context, as militarist, authoritarian and a threat to liberal values.

But this is Israel, where three gruff generals who lead a hitherto non-existent party with the appropriately patriotic name of Kahol Lavan (Hebrew for blue and white), are the dream team on which most leftists, liberals, peace supporters and human rights activists – not to mention Israeli Druze and Arabs – are pinning their hopes.

A combination of sheer desperation and the unique Israeli relationship between civilians and military has thrust former army chief of staff Benny Gantz, along with his two predecessors and sidekicks, Moshe Ya’alon and Gabi Ashkenazi, into the front lines of Israeli history. They constitute the best and possibly last chance to save Israel from Benjamin Netanyahu’s final assault on Israel’s democracy, rule of law and whatever remains of its liberal values.

Granted, the three have hardly uttered a word that should endear them to Israeli peaceniks and those who, in countries such as the U.S., would be called “liberal”. Nonetheless, even Labor Party and Meretz loyalists who bemoan the fact that Israeli moderates have anointed a military junta to rule over them will be praying for Gantz and Co. on April 9. Beggars who have lost to Netanyahu three times straight – and who haven’t notched up a decisive victory in 20 years – can’t exactly be choosers.

The joint enlistment of the military trio, amplified by their dramatic last minute union with former Finance Minister Yair Lapid, had already upended Israeli politics before the attorney general issued his decision late last week to indict Netanyahu on three charges of corruption. In less than a month, the prospects of Netanyahu losing the elections have gone from unthinkable to improbable to plausible.

And it is only because of Netanyahu’s proven record as comeback kid, the certain knowledge that he is desperate and will stop at nothing to remain in power – as well as the fact that he’s been around so long that young Israelis can’t imagine life without him – that no one would dare venture that his imminent defeat and departure might even be probable.

If Netanyahu resorted to the infamous, odious and more than vaguely racist “Arabs coming in hordes” ploy on Election Day 2015, one shudders to think what he is capable of when his own neck is on the legal line.

The stakes couldn’t be higher. If the generals lose and Netanyahu wins, liberal Israel will be defeated. Netanyahu will be given a free hand to legislate his way out of prosecution and all he has to do in exchange is sell Israel’s soul to religious and nationalist fanatics, who will change it forever.

Have you ever noticed that movie trailer voiceovers used to all start out “In a world where …”, but now they all end “… and change the world forever”? What’s the deal with that anyway?

 
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  1. >Only in Israel
    Pretty sure that Hugo Chavez, the current leader of Republic of Korea, and sundry other heads of state arguably including Putin, are veterans of elite military or police units. They love saying “only here” but there’s very few things they cite that are so unique. There are some unique things, like say the occupation, but they don’t tend to cite that.

  2. Anonymous[356] • Disclaimer says:

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other

    But there isn’t a “massive fundamental problem.”

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West’s land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world’s most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    • Agree: Autochthon, neutral
    • LOL: IHTG
    • Replies: @Autochthon
    @Anonymous

    The Orientals, in their museums about what happened to Neanderthals and the Europeans, will explain all the stuff you just did in their excellent museums of history and anthropology.

    , @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    , @nebulafox
    @Anonymous

    >The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment.

    I think all the French Jews who have made aliyah to Israel over the last decade would disagree with this one. In fact: why did they become ethno-nationalists? Unfiltered Muslim immigration and the resulting anti-Semitism.

    >Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Omar's grasp of the nuances are crass, but her fundamental intuition on the unhealthy level of Israeli influence over US foreign policy is right on the money.

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous

    , @Lot
    @Anonymous

    Jews conquered and own the Holy Land through Ashkenazi IQ and their martial virtues, and through their long and happy alliance with England and the USA, and have since repeatedly defeated Arab armies on every side. No “trading” needed.

    You: whine on the Internet, pining for a new Adolf.

    As a moral and altruistic people, many have fallen under the spell of leftist egalitarianism. But they’ve awakened to the menace of third world migration in Israel, Australia, France, England, and Canada. And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.

    Replies: @IHTG, @ATBOTL

    , @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It sounds like you and Omar agree already - the Joos run America, indeed the run the whole Western world. This sounds like a TROPE to me.

    Jews are supposed to be hard bargainers. If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East? But the Jews already have Israel and don't need to trade for it. At the very least I would a bigger territory. Throw in the Sinai, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria and then MAYBE we could talk about a trade.

    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have. I couldn't wait to get you into my car dealership - by the time we were done, I'd have you buying back your own car. However, I will give you an EXCELLENT price on an extended warranty that covers tree pollen damage.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Reg Cæsar, @istevefan

    , @Counterinsurgency
    @Anonymous


    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment.
     
    Replay of the late AD 1960s, when the Democratic Party allied itself with North Vietnam. It's an old trick.

    Counterinsurgency
  3. That looks like a promo photo for a TV show about a team of anti-heroes.

    The most impressive character is the man in brown leather, who appears ready to punch out the photographer. After he’s done, the goon on the left will apply the necessary torture techniques to get whatever they’re after.

    The tall man in the ill-fitting Patagonia jacket must be the financier who maintains contacts with “important people,” while Spectacles on the right is obviously the fixer who makes the legal problems caused by the two on the left go away.

    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

    • LOL: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    , @Sean
    @Buzz Mohawk

    No. My immediate reaction was that most formidable looking is the one on the left with a short broad face. And indeed, Barak Tells Police Former IDF Chief Ashkenazi Threatened Him.

    Bibi's brother: 'Yoni Netanyahu’s Mistake Nearly Led to Disaster': U.K. Historian Sets the Record Straight on Operation Entebbe. The Bader Mienhoffs were tipped off by him starting shooting, but being Germans they did not actually want to massacre all those Jews and just fought the commandos.

    I think that Netanyahu is begining to toy with the idea of not having a deal at all. For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it under as cover, and mean a general war with Egypt and Iran when it became clear the Palestinians were being expelled. Risky, but there is a streak of shocking recklessness in that family.

    Replies: @Lot

    , @Tex
    @Buzz Mohawk

    I was thinking they were debt collectors for the Meyer Lansky mob, and the photog owed a lotta juice to his bookie.

    , @Hypnotoad666
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The J-Team!

    "Pity the fool" who messes with Israel.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

  4. What about the theory of the violent SJW Jew who is opposed to the truth of jussie hate hoax?

    https://www.berkeleyside.com/2019/03/05/oakland-man-charged-with-3-felonies-in-uc-berkeley-assault-case

  5. Chemi Shalev

    That sounds like a weapon of sorts.

    Chemi Shalev =

    Sham vehicle.
    He calms hive.
    Heaves milch.

    But he’s a mere “journalist”. Let’s go with the guy (who would be) at the top:

    Yair Lapid =

    Daily pair.
    A daily rip.
    I pray, dial…

    Dairy pail.

    Now I’m gonna dream about some Jew who heaves milch into a dairy pail.

  6. @Buzz Mohawk
    That looks like a promo photo for a TV show about a team of anti-heroes.

    The most impressive character is the man in brown leather, who appears ready to punch out the photographer. After he's done, the goon on the left will apply the necessary torture techniques to get whatever they're after.

    The tall man in the ill-fitting Patagonia jacket must be the financier who maintains contacts with "important people," while Spectacles on the right is obviously the fixer who makes the legal problems caused by the two on the left go away.

    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

    Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose, @Sean, @Tex, @Hypnotoad666

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    • LOL: Ibound1
    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Sven's Angels, also on NBC, is about a team of shiksas who do whatever the Action Team! tells them to do, like make coffee.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna, @Redneck farmer

    , @Macon Richardson
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands. Perfect! If any of those countries get in a war and lose, people can say, "Of course they lost. It was just a bunch of girls."

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

    , @Lot
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Where is it I have I seen Miss Norway before?




    https://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Archive/Search/2012/9/27/1348743199114/Jim-Carrey-in-Dumb-and-Du-011.jpg

    , @Ibound1
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    I shouldn’t laugh. The US tax payer is defending these 4 countries with its bloated defense budget while these 4 show off their legs.

    , @Prester John
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    All Germanic ladies, yet only the German and Dutch woman are blond. What gives?

    , @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    The Israeli gentlemen look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces existential threats would look and the European ladies look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces no existential threats would look. For all the talk of the US assisting Israel, which of these two groups looks like they have spent the last 70 years lounging under an American defense umbrella and which ones look like they are prepared to do their own fighting, personally if necessary? The European ladies look like the Beverly Hills Neighborhood Watch, who can call the REAL police if something actually happens and the Israelis look like Roof Koreans.

    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don't look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe's defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Byrresheim, @nebulafox

    , @fish
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    With a hat tip to Buzz…..


    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

     

    The second set of hard asses looks a little like: Action Team! Your neighborhood Realty Professionals!
  7. The Jewish establishment has been caught completely off-guard, both domestically and in Israel.

    Give it 15 years, and there will be a seismic reordering for Jewish interests. First, the Boomers will wane in electoral impact, along with their Jewish fetish. As this generation passes, the estate tax will dry up Jewish slush funds. The triple whammy is that GenX Jews are some combination of: childless dolts, secularists who do not identify with their co-ethnics, or are husbands married to shiksas / Asians. In the US, Gen Z is the Ashkenazi genetic bookend.

    Israel’s most naturally-aligned allies in 15 years will likely be Arab autocracies that value stability in the face of plateauing oil prices. Not enviable.

    • Replies: @James Speaks
    @Debo

    The entire charade is funded by an infinitely increasing world economy.

    , @Tyrion 2
    @Debo

    Israel is, by global standards, a very liberal country. The vast majority of the world's population live in countries that are objectively far less progressive on every issue.

    Replies: @nik1975, @Colin Wright

    , @utu
    @Debo

    Even evangelical American Christians becoming anti-Zionist.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0KaQmTpX-o

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=xzedJAG0Mpo

    , @Jack D
    @Debo

    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader's consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else's hands. Of course it is nice for the Israelis to have the US as a friend but they are prepared to go it alone if necessary, even if it meant being as isolated as North Korea. Not that they would need to be - Israel maintains good relations with Russia, India, China, etc. and have no intention of eating tree bark.

    OTOH, if the US were to suddenly pull the plug on defending Europe, do those defense minister ladies look like they are ready to take up the slack tomorrow?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Debo

  8. Israel is so far right these days that its center-left Blue & White coalition is led by macho straight white men.

    Um, Jews don’t see themselves as white. Watch Mike Wallace field the question “Do you want white history month?” from Morgan Freeman about ten seconds in:

    Oh and that’s Myron Wallik, by the way. Not a white guy.

  9. Why are two of those guys dressed like Bibendum?


    …as the ethnonationalist Jewish state historically drifts right.

    Feint to the left,
    Drift to the right,
    Do the ooby dooby
    with all of your might…

    • LOL: utu
    • Replies: @PiltdownMan
    @Reg Cæsar


    Why are two of those guys dressed like Bibendum?
     
    They're mad hero buddies from military academy who got a 2 for 1 deal on those very expensive $18.99 puffer jackets.

    https://madhero.com/women-lightweight-packable-casual-solid-color-plus-size-zip-front-jackets-00159-black.html
    , @Jack D
    @Reg Cæsar

    That style of jacket is very fashionable in southern Europe now. When I was in Portugal last spring I would say that 1/2 the tourists were wearing them. They are good for travel because they can be packed down into a small space and they are just right for a mild Mediterranean winter where it gets a little chilly but never really goes below freezing. But aside from their practicality they are just the fashion of the moment. Of course as soon as "everyone" is wearing them, they are instantly past their peak and the fashion hounds will need to find something new to show that they are not one of the herd.

    I don't know why they didn't become as popular in the US . They are not really warm enough for a cold Northern winter but would be suitable for the southern third of the US. Yes they look stupid but that never stopped an item from becoming fashionable. The fact that cheap versions are available is a big black mark against them. The fashionable coat in the US is the "Canada Goose" brand that goes for $600 on up. It's a Veblen good - the fact that it is expensive makes it MORE desirable. Every year there is some item for which people get killed in the ghetto and this year it is those coats.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Reg Cæsar

  10. eah says:

    coalition pyramid of the fringes’ — it’s not a “kerfuffle” — it’s a symptom, a festering sore caused by a major pathology of American politics — and it will never be “declared over” by those who sit at the top of the pyramid (and provide 50% of the funding)

    The progressive victim stack is a myth. A black muslim women—someone who should have the most protected voice—has been shouted down and attacked for criticizing AlPAC. What we have is a jewish pyramid, where they’re on top and you’re never allowed to criticize them.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @eah

    No, being a member intersectional coalition does not protect you from your own racism against even straight white men by elected officials in mainstream parties.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16423278

    , @anonymous
    @eah

    * And thus disqualified from serving as Great White Defender

    , @donut
    @eah

    They're living the Libertarian dream .

    Replies: @Mark G.

    , @fish
    @eah

    WOW! Thats a a veritable Quadruple Royal Flush in Pokemon Victim Card Poker!

  11. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    Sven’s Angels, also on NBC, is about a team of shiksas who do whatever the Action Team! tells them to do, like make coffee.

    • LOL: Sean
    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Maybe it'll be shikses, maybe not

    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/tomi-lahren-this-is-art-people-wearing-maga-hats-being-guided-around-the-streets-of-la-on-a-leash

    , @Redneck farmer
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Since no one had permission to talk about the new shows, you'll be hearing from legal soon.

  12. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands. Perfect! If any of those countries get in a war and lose, people can say, “Of course they lost. It was just a bunch of girls.”

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    @Macon Richardson

    Norway lost 20% of its surface fleet recently when a female navigation team put the Helge Ingstad into a tanker while the (male) captain was asleep. Not that the US can criticise, a female navigation team put the USS Fitzgerald into a cargo ship while the (male) captain was asleep.


    (And in the UK the relentless attacks on Jeremy Corbyn continue, 100% caused by his relative neutrality vis a vis Israel/Palestine. I doubt there were ANY people among his white followers who disliked Jews, but the tactic seems to be to provoke "noticing" among JC supporters, which noticing becomes in its turn the signal for another pile-on. Can't stand the guy btw)

  13. @Anonymous

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other
     
    But there isn't a "massive fundamental problem."

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West's land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world's most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Replies: @Autochthon, @Tyrion 2, @nebulafox, @Lot, @Jack D, @Counterinsurgency

    The Orientals, in their museums about what happened to Neanderthals and the Europeans, will explain all the stuff you just did in their excellent museums of history and anthropology.

  14. I can remember when my country was something more than just a venue for various middle-eastern tribes to settle their own ethnic feuds.

    Hard to believe, I know.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Mr. Anon


    I can remember when my country was something more than just a venue for various middle-eastern tribes to settle their own ethnic feuds.
     
    Oh, you are much more than a venue. It is your resources they are maneuvering for, and your lineage they are conspiring to end. See comment #2 above.
    , @Anon1
    @Mr. Anon

    So you're an Octogenarian?

  15. Minneapolis has its own Brill Building, just like New York. But this one specialized in military surplus.

    http://www.startribune.com/walter-brill-had-an-eye-for-value-and-practical-gear/13514671/

    It’s too bad he couldn’t stick around a little longer to deal in East African war surplus. Though you’d need two licenses for a Toyota retrofitted with a sub-machine gun.

    Which reminds me… A couple hundred miles downriver:

    German sub-machine gun sets record at auction

    • Replies: @donut
    @Reg Cæsar

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbxRKXKht3Y

    This FG-42 sold for $260,000 .

    , @Mr. Anon
    @Reg Cæsar

    American Surplus Store - You could hang that sign on the Statue of Liberty

    Everything Must Go!

    The whole country is just turning into one big rummage sale anyway.

  16. Anonymous [AKA "Jeeter"] says:

    I LOVE that feisty little Somali kicking up shit at the dinner table!

    “I notice an 800 pound gorilla in the room! And he stinks!”

    Indeed you do, and indeed he does, you cute little Somali girl, and you just keep speaking your mind!

    If you see something, SAY something!

  17. Anonymous[131] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Anon
    I can remember when my country was something more than just a venue for various middle-eastern tribes to settle their own ethnic feuds.

    Hard to believe, I know.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Anon1

    I can remember when my country was something more than just a venue for various middle-eastern tribes to settle their own ethnic feuds.

    Oh, you are much more than a venue. It is your resources they are maneuvering for, and your lineage they are conspiring to end. See comment #2 above.

  18. @Debo
    The Jewish establishment has been caught completely off-guard, both domestically and in Israel.

    Give it 15 years, and there will be a seismic reordering for Jewish interests. First, the Boomers will wane in electoral impact, along with their Jewish fetish. As this generation passes, the estate tax will dry up Jewish slush funds. The triple whammy is that GenX Jews are some combination of: childless dolts, secularists who do not identify with their co-ethnics, or are husbands married to shiksas / Asians. In the US, Gen Z is the Ashkenazi genetic bookend.

    Israel's most naturally-aligned allies in 15 years will likely be Arab autocracies that value stability in the face of plateauing oil prices. Not enviable.

    Replies: @James Speaks, @Tyrion 2, @utu, @Jack D

    The entire charade is funded by an infinitely increasing world economy.

  19. Get the tough guy.

  20. @Anonymous

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other
     
    But there isn't a "massive fundamental problem."

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West's land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world's most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Replies: @Autochthon, @Tyrion 2, @nebulafox, @Lot, @Jack D, @Counterinsurgency

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let’s just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn’t they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don’t even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions…

    • Replies: @neutral
    @Tyrion 2

    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves. They cannot practically turn all of Western Europe and North America to an exclusive zone for themselves, thus it is better to run it as a multic culti business zone controlled by them, but obviously not populated by them.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Ibound1

    , @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    Greater "diversity" in the West up to a certain point enhances Jewish influence and power in the West. Divide and conquer, dilutes and weakens a group Jews view as a rival, etc. Jews are not giving up much of any control. I direct you to the penultimate paragraph.

    Greater "diversity" in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Mr McKenna

    , @Gordo
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    They got both.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    , @PiltdownMan
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    Long Island and Florida by choice, and Israel as a safety backup. It's a rational strategy.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @YetAnotherAnon

    , @Citizen of a Silly Country
    @Tyrion 2

    It's perfectly rational for Jews to want the West to be multi-everything. Jews are a market dominant minority, i.e. they stick out like a sore thumb. What's safer for such a group: 1) Being 2% of an otherwise homogeneous society or 2) Being just one of many racial/ethnic/religious groups in a society when no single group holds power.

    The push by elite Jews - not a conspiracy, just various actors working independently but for the same goal - to transform the West makes perfect sense. Hell, I'd probably be on board myself if I was Jewish.

    (The growing Muslim population in Europe wasn't the best course, but, hey, you work with what you got. Muslims are nearby so it's tough to keep them out while opening the doors to everyone else.)

    Your unwillingness to acknowledge this reality always fascinates me. The seemingly pathological lack of self-awareness of Jews is amazing. It has to be an evolutionary adaptation. You guys really can't see what you're doing or why it might enrage native populations.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    , @Mr. Anon
    @Tyrion 2


    You guys don’t even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions…
     
    More projection here. You guys don't seem to do much self-inerrogation as to how the behaviors of your group could be construed as being perceived as anything from insensitive to hostile. Instead, anybody who notices the often disproportionate power of your group, and realizes that said power has consequences to our group, is just dismissed with a strawman argument (as you've done here) or smeared with insults.

    It's a dishonest tactic and people are increasingly beginning to understand it as such.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    , @BenKenobi
    @Tyrion 2

    Mendacity: The Post.

  21. @Mr. Anon
    I can remember when my country was something more than just a venue for various middle-eastern tribes to settle their own ethnic feuds.

    Hard to believe, I know.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Anon1

    So you’re an Octogenarian?

  22. @eah
    'coalition pyramid of the fringes' -- it's not a "kerfuffle" -- it's a symptom, a festering sore caused by a major pathology of American politics -- and it will never be "declared over" by those who sit at the top of the pyramid (and provide 50% of the funding)

    The progressive victim stack is a myth. A black muslim women—someone who should have the most protected voice—has been shouted down and attacked for criticizing AlPAC. What we have is a jewish pyramid, where they’re on top and you’re never allowed to criticize them.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1CBE0EUYAA-3jK.jpg

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @anonymous, @donut, @fish

    No, being a member intersectional coalition does not protect you from your own racism against even straight white men by elected officials in mainstream parties.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16423278

  23. @Debo
    The Jewish establishment has been caught completely off-guard, both domestically and in Israel.

    Give it 15 years, and there will be a seismic reordering for Jewish interests. First, the Boomers will wane in electoral impact, along with their Jewish fetish. As this generation passes, the estate tax will dry up Jewish slush funds. The triple whammy is that GenX Jews are some combination of: childless dolts, secularists who do not identify with their co-ethnics, or are husbands married to shiksas / Asians. In the US, Gen Z is the Ashkenazi genetic bookend.

    Israel's most naturally-aligned allies in 15 years will likely be Arab autocracies that value stability in the face of plateauing oil prices. Not enviable.

    Replies: @James Speaks, @Tyrion 2, @utu, @Jack D

    Israel is, by global standards, a very liberal country. The vast majority of the world’s population live in countries that are objectively far less progressive on every issue.

    • Replies: @nik1975
    @Tyrion 2

    I disagree

    Israel Palestine is a structurally segregated Apartheid State, putting it well below any claim to liberal status

    Over 1300 peaceful ethnic Israeli Palestinians were shot in one day during the great march of return a sixteen weeks ago

    shocking

    Israel is currently supporting wars in several countries including Yemen, where over one hunder thousand children under five years old have died as a direct result of hostilities

    Hardly liberal or democratic

    more like extreme genocidal and sociopathic

    , @Colin Wright
    @Tyrion 2

    'Israel is, by global standards, a very liberal country. '

    Israel is, in abstract terms, the most perfect realization ever seen of a Nazi state.

    It follows that those who support it are either (a) deluded, (b) crazed by bigotry, and/or (c) National Socialists themselves. You, of course, best know who you are.

  24. anonymous[340] • Disclaimer says:

    Noticed: ” … hijab-wearing freshman Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-New Puntland on the Prairie).” Har.

    Why, in “[t]his Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha,” aren’t we treated to such mockery of Speaker Pelosi? Would that be punching down?

  25. anonymous[340] • Disclaimer says:
    @eah
    'coalition pyramid of the fringes' -- it's not a "kerfuffle" -- it's a symptom, a festering sore caused by a major pathology of American politics -- and it will never be "declared over" by those who sit at the top of the pyramid (and provide 50% of the funding)

    The progressive victim stack is a myth. A black muslim women—someone who should have the most protected voice—has been shouted down and attacked for criticizing AlPAC. What we have is a jewish pyramid, where they’re on top and you’re never allowed to criticize them.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1CBE0EUYAA-3jK.jpg

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @anonymous, @donut, @fish

    * And thus disqualified from serving as Great White Defender

  26. @Debo
    The Jewish establishment has been caught completely off-guard, both domestically and in Israel.

    Give it 15 years, and there will be a seismic reordering for Jewish interests. First, the Boomers will wane in electoral impact, along with their Jewish fetish. As this generation passes, the estate tax will dry up Jewish slush funds. The triple whammy is that GenX Jews are some combination of: childless dolts, secularists who do not identify with their co-ethnics, or are husbands married to shiksas / Asians. In the US, Gen Z is the Ashkenazi genetic bookend.

    Israel's most naturally-aligned allies in 15 years will likely be Arab autocracies that value stability in the face of plateauing oil prices. Not enviable.

    Replies: @James Speaks, @Tyrion 2, @utu, @Jack D

    Even evangelical American Christians becoming anti-Zionist.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=xzedJAG0Mpo

  27. @Reg Cæsar
    Why are two of those guys dressed like Bibendum?

    https://rmsothebys-cache.azureedge.net/0/1/8/2/9/e/01829e530c0ed0e752f07117cf8aeeff7b518a7c.jpg


    https://france3-regions.francetvinfo.fr/auvergne-rhone-alpes/sites/regions_france3/files/styles/top_big/public/assets/images/2018/05/07/000_app2000072036321-3644725.jpg?itok=b6ExVmZm


    ...as the ethnonationalist Jewish state historically drifts right.
     
    Feint to the left,
    Drift to the right,
    Do the ooby dooby
    with all of your might...


    https://youtu.be/yg9a14a5OY4

    Replies: @PiltdownMan, @Jack D

    Why are two of those guys dressed like Bibendum?

    They’re mad hero buddies from military academy who got a 2 for 1 deal on those very expensive $18.99 puffer jackets.

    https://madhero.com/women-lightweight-packable-casual-solid-color-plus-size-zip-front-jackets-00159-black.html

  28. @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves. They cannot practically turn all of Western Europe and North America to an exclusive zone for themselves, thus it is better to run it as a multic culti business zone controlled by them, but obviously not populated by them.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @neutral

    Couldn't the governors of the world have secured a slightly bigger piece of land than the tiny, satirically narrow Israel?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @neutral

    , @Ibound1
    @neutral


    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves.
     
    Good for them. More please. We need more countries where the leaders love their own demographies.

    Your fantasy that the West is controlled by them is nonsense. It is indeed a multi-culti business zone but one controlled by a senile institutional elite, Jewish and Gentile and increasingly female, which now hates its own population. Ted Kennedy hated Americans (unless they were Irish). The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. The court system in the US favors non-Americans. The US immigration bureaucracy favors non-Americans. Merkel in some way must hate Germans to have let in a million middle easterners. No Jew forced her to do that.

    At least in Israel they love their own population. That is a good thing. It should be encouraged among all countries. I wish we had the equivalent of these 4 here.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @BigDickNick

  29. @Anonymous

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other
     
    But there isn't a "massive fundamental problem."

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West's land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world's most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Replies: @Autochthon, @Tyrion 2, @nebulafox, @Lot, @Jack D, @Counterinsurgency

    >The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment.

    I think all the French Jews who have made aliyah to Israel over the last decade would disagree with this one. In fact: why did they become ethno-nationalists? Unfiltered Muslim immigration and the resulting anti-Semitism.

    >Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Omar’s grasp of the nuances are crass, but her fundamental intuition on the unhealthy level of Israeli influence over US foreign policy is right on the money.

    • Replies: @neutral
    @nebulafox

    I think that Bernard Levy disagrees with you, and he is basically the most important jew in France.

    , @Anonymous
    @nebulafox


    I think all the French Jews who have made aliyah to Israel over the last decade would disagree with this one. In fact: why did they become ethno-nationalists? Unfiltered Muslim immigration and the resulting anti-Semitism.
     
    The threat to French Jews is greatly exaggerated. Indeed, how many of them have stayed?

    Whatever the case, it's a small price to pay for (a) better insulating Jews from intermarriage with Gentiles (by moving them into Israel) and (b) the destruction of the French as a distinct ethnic group (which by the way also eliminates a magnet for intermarriage).

  30. @nebulafox
    @Anonymous

    >The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment.

    I think all the French Jews who have made aliyah to Israel over the last decade would disagree with this one. In fact: why did they become ethno-nationalists? Unfiltered Muslim immigration and the resulting anti-Semitism.

    >Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Omar's grasp of the nuances are crass, but her fundamental intuition on the unhealthy level of Israeli influence over US foreign policy is right on the money.

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous

    I think that Bernard Levy disagrees with you, and he is basically the most important jew in France.

  31. On the other hand, Bibi called for an election on April 9. Even though Bibi has been at or near the top in Israel since 1996, he just might lose.

    But not because the generals are more macho.

    Benjamin Netanyahu’s image with Americans with no particular memory of Israeli history (which is most of us) tends to be that of an older gent with thinning hair. But I have a hunch most Israelis tend to picture Netanyahu as a young man, from his military days.

    Israel’s political culture tends to be macho all around, though not as macho as Russian culture.

  32. Anonymous[160] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Greater “diversity” in the West up to a certain point enhances Jewish influence and power in the West. Divide and conquer, dilutes and weakens a group Jews view as a rival, etc. Jews are not giving up much of any control. I direct you to the penultimate paragraph.

    Greater “diversity” in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    And deeper down the rationalisation hole we go...Actually not yet, why did the supposed controllers of the West settle for such a tiny strip when the West conquered the entire world?

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @Mr McKenna
    @Anonymous


    Greater “diversity” in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.
     
    As if on cue, the Ruling Tribe shows signs that it may finally tire of white women:


    If the shiksa is the one chasing Jewish men, and not the other way around, then the shiksa has defeated her own purpose, has run her course. Jewish men need a new romantic aspiration. In The Social Network, Aaron Sorkin submits a candidate. “I'm developing an algorithm to define the connection between Jewish guys and Asian girls,” says one Jewish nerd to another in the 2010 film. “I don't think it's that complicated,” the second Jewish nerd answers. “They're hot, they're smart, they're not Jewish and they can't dance.”

    The question, then, isn’t whether shiksa is a pejorative; it’s whether she’s even relevant.

    https://www.salon.com/2013/03/06/is_shiksa_an_insult_partner/

     

    Replies: @Jack D

  33. @Buzz Mohawk
    That looks like a promo photo for a TV show about a team of anti-heroes.

    The most impressive character is the man in brown leather, who appears ready to punch out the photographer. After he's done, the goon on the left will apply the necessary torture techniques to get whatever they're after.

    The tall man in the ill-fitting Patagonia jacket must be the financier who maintains contacts with "important people," while Spectacles on the right is obviously the fixer who makes the legal problems caused by the two on the left go away.

    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

    Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose, @Sean, @Tex, @Hypnotoad666

    No. My immediate reaction was that most formidable looking is the one on the left with a short broad face. And indeed, Barak Tells Police Former IDF Chief Ashkenazi Threatened Him.

    Bibi’s brother: ‘Yoni Netanyahu’s Mistake Nearly Led to Disaster’: U.K. Historian Sets the Record Straight on Operation Entebbe. The Bader Mienhoffs were tipped off by him starting shooting, but being Germans they did not actually want to massacre all those Jews and just fought the commandos.

    I think that Netanyahu is begining to toy with the idea of not having a deal at all. For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it under as cover, and mean a general war with Egypt and Iran when it became clear the Palestinians were being expelled. Risky, but there is a streak of shocking recklessness in that family.

    • Replies: @Lot
    @Sean

    “For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it”

    That is why Jordan makes itself extraordinarily inoffensive to Israel and the USA. The Saudis and Gulf Arabs by contrast enjoy their good relations with us, but still have a great deal of independence.

    Ron Unz and his fellow conspiracy nutcases think Arab terrorism is a bunch of Israeli false flags. But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe. Yet it never happens, and no Jordanians are ever caught up in mass killing terror in the West, or in Israel itself.

    The native Jordanians already have far more Palestinians than they want, and barely can keep them down now. A million more would be the end of their independence, and they’d face Palestinian retribution as well.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Sean

  34. Anonymous[160] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox
    @Anonymous

    >The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment.

    I think all the French Jews who have made aliyah to Israel over the last decade would disagree with this one. In fact: why did they become ethno-nationalists? Unfiltered Muslim immigration and the resulting anti-Semitism.

    >Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Omar's grasp of the nuances are crass, but her fundamental intuition on the unhealthy level of Israeli influence over US foreign policy is right on the money.

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous

    I think all the French Jews who have made aliyah to Israel over the last decade would disagree with this one. In fact: why did they become ethno-nationalists? Unfiltered Muslim immigration and the resulting anti-Semitism.

    The threat to French Jews is greatly exaggerated. Indeed, how many of them have stayed?

    Whatever the case, it’s a small price to pay for (a) better insulating Jews from intermarriage with Gentiles (by moving them into Israel) and (b) the destruction of the French as a distinct ethnic group (which by the way also eliminates a magnet for intermarriage).

  35. “If Blue & White were to win, I would expect virtually the entire American mainstream media to declare as one that the Nice People in Israel have won ….”

    And will those nice people declare that their wall is not who they are, tear it down, and prostrate themselves before the Palestinians???

    Wait, I’ve confused them with American Democrats.

  36. @Buzz Mohawk
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Sven's Angels, also on NBC, is about a team of shiksas who do whatever the Action Team! tells them to do, like make coffee.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna, @Redneck farmer

  37. @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    Greater "diversity" in the West up to a certain point enhances Jewish influence and power in the West. Divide and conquer, dilutes and weakens a group Jews view as a rival, etc. Jews are not giving up much of any control. I direct you to the penultimate paragraph.

    Greater "diversity" in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Mr McKenna

    And deeper down the rationalisation hole we go…Actually not yet, why did the supposed controllers of the West settle for such a tiny strip when the West conquered the entire world?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2

    I'll overlook the fact you didn't engage any of the points...


    Actually not yet, why did the supposed controllers of the West settle for such a tiny strip when the West conquered the entire world?
     
    I'm not certain I understand what you are getting at here. No one is asserting that they have "settled" for only a tiny strip. They enjoy access, influence, control in relations to a far greater area of course.

    Another benefit that I did not make explicit: outmigration of Muslims from the Middle East is like a pressure valve for Israel. It removes military age men, makes Arab youth wealthier and happier. In short, it contributes to the security of the Jewish State.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

  38. @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    Greater "diversity" in the West up to a certain point enhances Jewish influence and power in the West. Divide and conquer, dilutes and weakens a group Jews view as a rival, etc. Jews are not giving up much of any control. I direct you to the penultimate paragraph.

    Greater "diversity" in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Mr McKenna

    Greater “diversity” in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.

    As if on cue, the Ruling Tribe shows signs that it may finally tire of white women:

    If the shiksa is the one chasing Jewish men, and not the other way around, then the shiksa has defeated her own purpose, has run her course. Jewish men need a new romantic aspiration. In The Social Network, Aaron Sorkin submits a candidate. “I’m developing an algorithm to define the connection between Jewish guys and Asian girls,” says one Jewish nerd to another in the 2010 film. “I don’t think it’s that complicated,” the second Jewish nerd answers. “They’re hot, they’re smart, they’re not Jewish and they can’t dance.”

    The question, then, isn’t whether shiksa is a pejorative; it’s whether she’s even relevant.

    https://www.salon.com/2013/03/06/is_shiksa_an_insult_partner/

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Mr McKenna

    This doesn't really make sense unless you attach a malleable definition to "hot". The traditional meaning of "hot" is "looking like Marilyn Monroe". By that definition, most Asian girls are NOT hot. Maybe in 2019 "hot" has been redefined to mean "not obese" in which case a lot more Asian girls qualify.

    Now "smart" is a lot closer to it. The traditional trope concerning blondes was that they were not too bright. You could have fun with a shiksa in bed but the rest of the time you didn't have much to talk about. Jewish women are smart too but they tend to be "high maintenance" whereas Asian women tend to have more agreeable personalities. The old saying is that "opposites attract" but this is not really true - you don't want your mate to be your diametric opposite. Rather you want them to share most of your values but be JUST different enough to be interesting and not remind you of your mother.

  39. Anonymous[160] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    And deeper down the rationalisation hole we go...Actually not yet, why did the supposed controllers of the West settle for such a tiny strip when the West conquered the entire world?

    Replies: @Anonymous

    I’ll overlook the fact you didn’t engage any of the points…

    Actually not yet, why did the supposed controllers of the West settle for such a tiny strip when the West conquered the entire world?

    I’m not certain I understand what you are getting at here. No one is asserting that they have “settled” for only a tiny strip. They enjoy access, influence, control in relations to a far greater area of course.

    Another benefit that I did not make explicit: outmigration of Muslims from the Middle East is like a pressure valve for Israel. It removes military age men, makes Arab youth wealthier and happier. In short, it contributes to the security of the Jewish State.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    I'm not engaging with your random throwaway fictions. I'm merely pointing out their internal inconsistency. All you then do is add another layer of rationalisations that make the whole even less wieldy. The problem though is that then, I assume, you're no longer capable of holding all of those thoughts in your head and so failure to realise how absurdly contradictory they are.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  40. How that translates into the horsetrading necessary to put together a majority in the Knesset, don’t ask me. Likud is usually at an advantage because Israel’s unwritten rule is that while Israel’s Arab citizens are allowed to vote, their parties can’t be used to put together a majority to form a government.

    This didn’t ring true to me so I looked it up.

    First, the Arab list has already merged with “Hadash” – a mostly Jewish ultra-progressive party.

    Second, the centre parties later tried to ally with them to “share votes” and the Arab List almost accepted. The Islamic movement within in it though refused any such cooperation. The point of sharing votes was merely to maximise seats won in the election and would have been mutually beneficial. It came with no strings attached and the potential for power sharing later.

    In other words, you have this backwards. Jewish Israeli politicians were more than happy to share power with the Arab coalition. It was instead that the hardline Muslims within that coalition refused.

  41. @Buzz Mohawk
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Sven's Angels, also on NBC, is about a team of shiksas who do whatever the Action Team! tells them to do, like make coffee.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna, @Redneck farmer

    Since no one had permission to talk about the new shows, you’ll be hearing from legal soon.

  42. Lot says:
    @Anonymous

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other
     
    But there isn't a "massive fundamental problem."

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West's land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world's most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Replies: @Autochthon, @Tyrion 2, @nebulafox, @Lot, @Jack D, @Counterinsurgency

    Jews conquered and own the Holy Land through Ashkenazi IQ and their martial virtues, and through their long and happy alliance with England and the USA, and have since repeatedly defeated Arab armies on every side. No “trading” needed.

    You: whine on the Internet, pining for a new Adolf.

    As a moral and altruistic people, many have fallen under the spell of leftist egalitarianism. But they’ve awakened to the menace of third world migration in Israel, Australia, France, England, and Canada. And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.

    • Replies: @IHTG
    @Lot


    And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.
     
    I'm not sure this is really true, IIRC it was an extrapolation from (often unreliable) exit polls or something like that.

    Replies: @Lot

    , @ATBOTL
    @Lot

    "As a moral and altruistic people..."

    These neocons here are constantly in a state of self parody.

  43. This POLITICO article from July 2016 provides an informative context for this election: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/netanyahu-prime-minister-obama-president-foreign-policy-us-israel-israeli-relations-middle-east-iran-defense-forces-idf-214004

    Funny thing about Jews: The only one of the four men in that photo who isn’t an Ashkenazi Jew is the one whose last name is “Ashkenazi”.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @IHTG

    Kind of like how guys named Tex usually don't live in Texas.

    There's an actor named "Ashkenazi," right? I saw him in a pretty good Israeli film about 15 years ago.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Mike Zwick

  44. @eah
    'coalition pyramid of the fringes' -- it's not a "kerfuffle" -- it's a symptom, a festering sore caused by a major pathology of American politics -- and it will never be "declared over" by those who sit at the top of the pyramid (and provide 50% of the funding)

    The progressive victim stack is a myth. A black muslim women—someone who should have the most protected voice—has been shouted down and attacked for criticizing AlPAC. What we have is a jewish pyramid, where they’re on top and you’re never allowed to criticize them.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1CBE0EUYAA-3jK.jpg

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @anonymous, @donut, @fish

    They’re living the Libertarian dream .

    • Replies: @Mark G.
    @donut

    Living in a country with no property rights is not a Libertarian dream so your comment Somalia is Libertarian is nonsense.

    Replies: @donut

  45. @Lot
    @Anonymous

    Jews conquered and own the Holy Land through Ashkenazi IQ and their martial virtues, and through their long and happy alliance with England and the USA, and have since repeatedly defeated Arab armies on every side. No “trading” needed.

    You: whine on the Internet, pining for a new Adolf.

    As a moral and altruistic people, many have fallen under the spell of leftist egalitarianism. But they’ve awakened to the menace of third world migration in Israel, Australia, France, England, and Canada. And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.

    Replies: @IHTG, @ATBOTL

    And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.

    I’m not sure this is really true, IIRC it was an extrapolation from (often unreliable) exit polls or something like that.

    • Replies: @Lot
    @IHTG

    Was not an exit poll. And I remembered wrong, it was 58% Trump.

    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-826WyC8TrOs/WM18ROZPWEI/AAAAAAAAET4/3zwENmcdA-IYH-caYqX6YInWTXFkHr4mgCEw/s1600/5.png

    This is from Audacious Epigone’s writeup of the poll.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  46. Lot says:
    @Sean
    @Buzz Mohawk

    No. My immediate reaction was that most formidable looking is the one on the left with a short broad face. And indeed, Barak Tells Police Former IDF Chief Ashkenazi Threatened Him.

    Bibi's brother: 'Yoni Netanyahu’s Mistake Nearly Led to Disaster': U.K. Historian Sets the Record Straight on Operation Entebbe. The Bader Mienhoffs were tipped off by him starting shooting, but being Germans they did not actually want to massacre all those Jews and just fought the commandos.

    I think that Netanyahu is begining to toy with the idea of not having a deal at all. For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it under as cover, and mean a general war with Egypt and Iran when it became clear the Palestinians were being expelled. Risky, but there is a streak of shocking recklessness in that family.

    Replies: @Lot

    “For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it”

    That is why Jordan makes itself extraordinarily inoffensive to Israel and the USA. The Saudis and Gulf Arabs by contrast enjoy their good relations with us, but still have a great deal of independence.

    Ron Unz and his fellow conspiracy nutcases think Arab terrorism is a bunch of Israeli false flags. But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe. Yet it never happens, and no Jordanians are ever caught up in mass killing terror in the West, or in Israel itself.

    The native Jordanians already have far more Palestinians than they want, and barely can keep them down now. A million more would be the end of their independence, and they’d face Palestinian retribution as well.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Lot

    > But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe.

    It doesn't have to be in Israel's interest. Politicians since time immemorial tend to conflate or sacrifice national interests for domestic political reasons. That's the way things have always been and likely always will be.

    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He's not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don't buy he didn't know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he's sacrificing Israel's foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he's willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don't put much beyond him.

    Netanyahu might be supremely intelligent, but he's also a mendacious and rather reckless SOB, even on politician standards. And there's a lot of people in Israel who make him look like a flat-out peacenik. So, no, I do not find it impossible that he might accidentally set something off in an effort to keep his political boat afloat.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Anonymous, @ATBOTL

    , @Sean
    @Lot


    "Two Banks has the Jordan –

    This is ours and, that is as well."
     
    Yes Jordan knows what limitless ambition is on the the mind of the Israeli right, although their high military is far more conservative tot the extent that they are men of the past. I think Jordan is the linchpin of US policy in the Middle East and that is why the US is mounting such a build up in Jordan, having aready constructed the

    https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/pa4vqz/the-great-wall-of-jordan-how-the-us-wants-to-keep-the-islamic-state-out

    But the Syrian Civil War had the Israeli right secretly expecting an Isis infiltration into Jordan and a civil war there so Israel could have an excuse to intervene, which would have provoked a West Bank revolt. Those circumstances would have meant there could be expulsions without Israel having to do anything to bring the situation about . During the Second Gulf war Israel was asked (maybe by Jordan) for assurances that it would not use the fighting as cover for expulsions. Any hopes that Isis or something like it could destabilize Jordan have been forever dashed.

    However, perhaps it could work another way, supposing Israel staged limited but highly provocative expulsions to inveigle the Arab countries into a war with Israel. In the chaos that followed what was actually happening in the West Bank would be forgotten. Israel could say the Arab population left of its own accord out of fear of the fighting rather like they had in 1948. Trump is the one who might let them do something like that.

    Replies: @Lot

  47. @Reg Cæsar
    Minneapolis has its own Brill Building, just like New York. But this one specialized in military surplus.


    http://www.startribune.com/walter-brill-had-an-eye-for-value-and-practical-gear/13514671/


    https://hoodstarter-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/attachments/367/hero_slide_brill3.jpg


    It's too bad he couldn't stick around a little longer to deal in East African war surplus. Though you'd need two licenses for a Toyota retrofitted with a sub-machine gun.

    Which reminds me... A couple hundred miles downriver:

    German sub-machine gun sets record at auction

    Replies: @donut, @Mr. Anon

    This FG-42 sold for $260,000 .

  48. Lot says:

    “Israel’s unwritten rule is that while Israel’s Arab citizens are allowed to vote, their parties can’t be used to put together a majority to form a government.”

    That’s not really a rule, and it only is something that Labour and its predecessor parties promised, and was required for them to actually get elected.

    The right wing parties don’t need a “rule” about forming a government with the Arabs. And the main far left party is about half Arab and half Jew so obviously isn’t part of this rule.

    “I would expect virtually the entire American mainstream media to declare as one that the Nice People in Israel have won”

    I agree. But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.

    • Replies: @Gordo
    @Lot


    But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.
     
    LOL Lot
    , @Mr. Anon
    @Lot


    I agree. But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.
     
    Sure, everyone "likes" Israel - that's what the MSM tells us.

    The MSM also tells us that 30% or so of couples are interracial, that most computer nerds are black, and that most street-criminals are white guys.
  49. @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    They got both.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Gordo

    If that is the case, why can't they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America...

    How do you rationalise that from your rabbit hole?

    Replies: @Gordo, @Anonymous

  50. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    Where is it I have I seen Miss Norway before?

    [MORE]

  51. @Lot
    “Israel’s unwritten rule is that while Israel’s Arab citizens are allowed to vote, their parties can’t be used to put together a majority to form a government.”

    That’s not really a rule, and it only is something that Labour and its predecessor parties promised, and was required for them to actually get elected.

    The right wing parties don’t need a “rule” about forming a government with the Arabs. And the main far left party is about half Arab and half Jew so obviously isn’t part of this rule.

    “I would expect virtually the entire American mainstream media to declare as one that the Nice People in Israel have won”

    I agree. But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.

    Replies: @Gordo, @Mr. Anon

    But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.

    LOL Lot

  52. OT, regarding beauty inequality:

    has anyone suggested that less-attractive actors who play their looks for laughs are doomed to be retconned as uncle-toms?

    it seems honorable to me that less-attractive people should want to be treated with equal respect at work

    but does that imply homely characters can’t be funny anymore?

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @robot

    We could have a future revival of "Seinfeld" in which Kramer and George rebel against the tyranny of the symmetrical good looks of Jerry and Elaine. It will be like Joe Pesci's big scene in Goodfellas -- "Do I amuse you?" for an entire 22 minutes.

  53. @Macon Richardson
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands. Perfect! If any of those countries get in a war and lose, people can say, "Of course they lost. It was just a bunch of girls."

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

    Norway lost 20% of its surface fleet recently when a female navigation team put the Helge Ingstad into a tanker while the (male) captain was asleep. Not that the US can criticise, a female navigation team put the USS Fitzgerald into a cargo ship while the (male) captain was asleep.

    (And in the UK the relentless attacks on Jeremy Corbyn continue, 100% caused by his relative neutrality vis a vis Israel/Palestine. I doubt there were ANY people among his white followers who disliked Jews, but the tactic seems to be to provoke “noticing” among JC supporters, which noticing becomes in its turn the signal for another pile-on. Can’t stand the guy btw)

  54. @robot
    OT, regarding beauty inequality:

    has anyone suggested that less-attractive actors who play their looks for laughs are doomed to be retconned as uncle-toms?

    it seems honorable to me that less-attractive people should want to be treated with equal respect at work

    but does that imply homely characters can't be funny anymore?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    We could have a future revival of “Seinfeld” in which Kramer and George rebel against the tyranny of the symmetrical good looks of Jerry and Elaine. It will be like Joe Pesci’s big scene in Goodfellas — “Do I amuse you?” for an entire 22 minutes.

  55. @Gordo
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    They got both.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    If that is the case, why can’t they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America…

    How do you rationalise that from your rabbit hole?

    • Replies: @Gordo
    @Tyrion 2

    Polite questions elicit replies.

    , @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    If that is the case, why can’t they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America…
     
    You are usually an astute commentator, but really seem to have your blinders on in this thread.

    They have indeed taken the West Bank. More effectively in fact than many of the British colonies you cite, inasmuch as they are populating it with Jews and draining it of Arabs. And they are doing that population replacement in a way calculated to provoke the least backlash as possible and to prevent, to the extent possible, critics from gaining the moral high ground. In the fullness of time, my friend.

    Replies: @Shmendrix

  56. So let me get this straight. In Israel, the viable political parties are the far right versus the even more far right.

    How come we can’t have nice things like this?

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Almost Missouri

    >How come we can’t have nice things like this?

    Demographics.

    A majority of Israelis are either descendants of those expelled from the Arab World in 1967 or former Soviets. Both groups wholly see Israel as a Jewish nation-state, much like Saudi Arabia or Egypt are Arab nation-states. Neither group is on the whole inclined to feel sympathy for the Palestinians. And that's before we even touch the haredis. Labour voting, Ha'retz reading, Holocaust survivor descended Ashkenazim have been a demographic minority for multiple decades now. A lot of older-school US Democrats-Chuck Schumer-seem to have a very outdated vision of Israel in their heads.

    (I won't touch the GOP, many of whom support Israel because Muh Values and don't bother to learn anything more about the place, nor seem to get how deeply weird-at best-most Israelis find American evangelical Christians.)

    The reason Israel doesn't give a hoot about what Brussels thinks isn't just because of diverging national interests: it is because there is genuinely little to no connection to Europe anymore among the lay public.

  57. @Lot
    @Sean

    “For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it”

    That is why Jordan makes itself extraordinarily inoffensive to Israel and the USA. The Saudis and Gulf Arabs by contrast enjoy their good relations with us, but still have a great deal of independence.

    Ron Unz and his fellow conspiracy nutcases think Arab terrorism is a bunch of Israeli false flags. But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe. Yet it never happens, and no Jordanians are ever caught up in mass killing terror in the West, or in Israel itself.

    The native Jordanians already have far more Palestinians than they want, and barely can keep them down now. A million more would be the end of their independence, and they’d face Palestinian retribution as well.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Sean

    > But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe.

    It doesn’t have to be in Israel’s interest. Politicians since time immemorial tend to conflate or sacrifice national interests for domestic political reasons. That’s the way things have always been and likely always will be.

    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He’s not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don’t buy he didn’t know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he’s sacrificing Israel’s foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he’s willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don’t put much beyond him.

    Netanyahu might be supremely intelligent, but he’s also a mendacious and rather reckless SOB, even on politician standards. And there’s a lot of people in Israel who make him look like a flat-out peacenik. So, no, I do not find it impossible that he might accidentally set something off in an effort to keep his political boat afloat.

    • Replies: @IHTG
    @nebulafox

    I don't think angering Poland was an intentional strategy by Netanyahu. It's true though that he's unable to apologize to them and make amends because of the elections.

    , @Anonymous
    @nebulafox


    If he’s willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel
     
    It isn't foreign policy gold for Israel that strong and independent European ethnic groups survive.
    , @ATBOTL
    @nebulafox


    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He’s not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don’t buy he didn’t know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he’s sacrificing Israel’s foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he’s willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don’t put much beyond him.

     

    You make an important point. Hostility to European gentiles plays well with the Jewish right in Israel. The neocons here want us to not notice that fact.
  58. @Almost Missouri
    So let me get this straight. In Israel, the viable political parties are the far right versus the even more far right.

    How come we can't have nice things like this?

    Replies: @nebulafox

    >How come we can’t have nice things like this?

    Demographics.

    A majority of Israelis are either descendants of those expelled from the Arab World in 1967 or former Soviets. Both groups wholly see Israel as a Jewish nation-state, much like Saudi Arabia or Egypt are Arab nation-states. Neither group is on the whole inclined to feel sympathy for the Palestinians. And that’s before we even touch the haredis. Labour voting, Ha’retz reading, Holocaust survivor descended Ashkenazim have been a demographic minority for multiple decades now. A lot of older-school US Democrats-Chuck Schumer-seem to have a very outdated vision of Israel in their heads.

    (I won’t touch the GOP, many of whom support Israel because Muh Values and don’t bother to learn anything more about the place, nor seem to get how deeply weird-at best-most Israelis find American evangelical Christians.)

    The reason Israel doesn’t give a hoot about what Brussels thinks isn’t just because of diverging national interests: it is because there is genuinely little to no connection to Europe anymore among the lay public.

  59. @IHTG
    This POLITICO article from July 2016 provides an informative context for this election: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/netanyahu-prime-minister-obama-president-foreign-policy-us-israel-israeli-relations-middle-east-iran-defense-forces-idf-214004

    Funny thing about Jews: The only one of the four men in that photo who isn't an Ashkenazi Jew is the one whose last name is "Ashkenazi".

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    Kind of like how guys named Tex usually don’t live in Texas.

    There’s an actor named “Ashkenazi,” right? I saw him in a pretty good Israeli film about 15 years ago.

    • Replies: @IHTG
    @Steve Sailer

    That would be Lior Ashkenazi. His family is from Turkey.

    , @Mike Zwick
    @Steve Sailer

    Norman Jewison isn't Jewish.

  60. @Steve Sailer
    @IHTG

    Kind of like how guys named Tex usually don't live in Texas.

    There's an actor named "Ashkenazi," right? I saw him in a pretty good Israeli film about 15 years ago.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Mike Zwick

    That would be Lior Ashkenazi. His family is from Turkey.

  61. @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Long Island and Florida by choice, and Israel as a safety backup. It’s a rational strategy.

    • Agree: YetAnotherAnon
    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @PiltdownMan

    Israel as a safety backup for Long Island? Do you even think before you write?

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @YetAnotherAnon
    @PiltdownMan

    Israel is a good bolt-hole when the police or courts are interested in you. In Thatcher's day there was a controversial London borough council leader called Shirley Porter (IIRC her family owned a chunk of a major supermarket) who got into trouble for IIRC shifting Labour voters out of her borough (the kind of thing US city pols seem to do a lot).

    When the sewage hit the ventilator she legged it to Israel. She never did pay the huge surcharge she was landed with.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirley_Porter#Court_cases_and_surcharge

    Replies: @Anonymous

  62. @nebulafox
    @Lot

    > But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe.

    It doesn't have to be in Israel's interest. Politicians since time immemorial tend to conflate or sacrifice national interests for domestic political reasons. That's the way things have always been and likely always will be.

    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He's not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don't buy he didn't know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he's sacrificing Israel's foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he's willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don't put much beyond him.

    Netanyahu might be supremely intelligent, but he's also a mendacious and rather reckless SOB, even on politician standards. And there's a lot of people in Israel who make him look like a flat-out peacenik. So, no, I do not find it impossible that he might accidentally set something off in an effort to keep his political boat afloat.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Anonymous, @ATBOTL

    I don’t think angering Poland was an intentional strategy by Netanyahu. It’s true though that he’s unable to apologize to them and make amends because of the elections.

  63. @Lot
    @Sean

    “For that Israel will need to expel most of the West Bank Arabs, which would need a war in Jordan to do it”

    That is why Jordan makes itself extraordinarily inoffensive to Israel and the USA. The Saudis and Gulf Arabs by contrast enjoy their good relations with us, but still have a great deal of independence.

    Ron Unz and his fellow conspiracy nutcases think Arab terrorism is a bunch of Israeli false flags. But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe. Yet it never happens, and no Jordanians are ever caught up in mass killing terror in the West, or in Israel itself.

    The native Jordanians already have far more Palestinians than they want, and barely can keep them down now. A million more would be the end of their independence, and they’d face Palestinian retribution as well.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Sean

    “Two Banks has the Jordan –

    This is ours and, that is as well.”

    Yes Jordan knows what limitless ambition is on the the mind of the Israeli right, although their high military is far more conservative tot the extent that they are men of the past. I think Jordan is the linchpin of US policy in the Middle East and that is why the US is mounting such a build up in Jordan, having aready constructed the

    https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/pa4vqz/the-great-wall-of-jordan-how-the-us-wants-to-keep-the-islamic-state-out

    But the Syrian Civil War had the Israeli right secretly expecting an Isis infiltration into Jordan and a civil war there so Israel could have an excuse to intervene, which would have provoked a West Bank revolt. Those circumstances would have meant there could be expulsions without Israel having to do anything to bring the situation about . During the Second Gulf war Israel was asked (maybe by Jordan) for assurances that it would not use the fighting as cover for expulsions. Any hopes that Isis or something like it could destabilize Jordan have been forever dashed.

    However, perhaps it could work another way, supposing Israel staged limited but highly provocative expulsions to inveigle the Arab countries into a war with Israel. In the chaos that followed what was actually happening in the West Bank would be forgotten. Israel could say the Arab population left of its own accord out of fear of the fighting rather like they had in 1948. Trump is the one who might let them do something like that.

    • Replies: @Lot
    @Sean

    Thanks for the article about the $500 million border wall we built for Jordan.

  64. @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2

    I'll overlook the fact you didn't engage any of the points...


    Actually not yet, why did the supposed controllers of the West settle for such a tiny strip when the West conquered the entire world?
     
    I'm not certain I understand what you are getting at here. No one is asserting that they have "settled" for only a tiny strip. They enjoy access, influence, control in relations to a far greater area of course.

    Another benefit that I did not make explicit: outmigration of Muslims from the Middle East is like a pressure valve for Israel. It removes military age men, makes Arab youth wealthier and happier. In short, it contributes to the security of the Jewish State.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    I’m not engaging with your random throwaway fictions. I’m merely pointing out their internal inconsistency. All you then do is add another layer of rationalisations that make the whole even less wieldy. The problem though is that then, I assume, you’re no longer capable of holding all of those thoughts in your head and so failure to realise how absurdly contradictory they are.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    I’m not engaging with your random throwaway fictions. I’m merely pointing out their internal inconsistency.
     
    You have yet to state a supposed "internal inconsistency" that is in fact inconsistent.

    Take a step back and look at how emotional and unreasonable you are being in this thread.

  65. @Tyrion 2
    @Gordo

    If that is the case, why can't they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America...

    How do you rationalise that from your rabbit hole?

    Replies: @Gordo, @Anonymous

    Polite questions elicit replies.

  66. Anonymous[378] • Disclaimer says:

  67. Anonymous[187] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @Gordo

    If that is the case, why can't they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America...

    How do you rationalise that from your rabbit hole?

    Replies: @Gordo, @Anonymous

    If that is the case, why can’t they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America…

    You are usually an astute commentator, but really seem to have your blinders on in this thread.

    They have indeed taken the West Bank. More effectively in fact than many of the British colonies you cite, inasmuch as they are populating it with Jews and draining it of Arabs. And they are doing that population replacement in a way calculated to provoke the least backlash as possible and to prevent, to the extent possible, critics from gaining the moral high ground. In the fullness of time, my friend.

    • Replies: @Shmendrix
    @Anonymous

    "Draining it of Arabs"? Pure fantasy.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  68. Anonymous[187] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox
    @Lot

    > But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe.

    It doesn't have to be in Israel's interest. Politicians since time immemorial tend to conflate or sacrifice national interests for domestic political reasons. That's the way things have always been and likely always will be.

    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He's not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don't buy he didn't know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he's sacrificing Israel's foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he's willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don't put much beyond him.

    Netanyahu might be supremely intelligent, but he's also a mendacious and rather reckless SOB, even on politician standards. And there's a lot of people in Israel who make him look like a flat-out peacenik. So, no, I do not find it impossible that he might accidentally set something off in an effort to keep his political boat afloat.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Anonymous, @ATBOTL

    If he’s willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel

    It isn’t foreign policy gold for Israel that strong and independent European ethnic groups survive.

  69. “This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha …”

    Well before the height of the Victorian era, the philoSemitism that defines WASP culture (because Anglo-Saxon Puritanism was a Judaizing heresy and Judaizing heresy always produces philoSemitic culture) had become bifurcated in England. There was the original pro-Jewish form, which remained almost exclusive among Evangelicals/Dissenting Protestants (including the Anglicans who leaned to those theologies while remaining Anglican in church membership). The new form of philo-Semitism was pro-Arab/Islamic, and it became all the rage among explorers and adventurers, including large numbers of military men.

    Primarily behind the scenes, the Brit Empire WASP Elites of the 19th century had their own battles over which form of philoSemitism would rule: Jew or Arab/Mohammedan.

    The great compromise that pleased both sides for a spell was allying with Turkey against Russia. The WASP Jew-lovers hated Russia most because the poor innocent Jews said it was a nightmare to live there and the TSAR was much worse than Stewart or any Catholic king. The WASP Arab/Mohammedan Lovers were anti-Russian because the Ottoman Empire was Mohammedan and contained the vast majority of Arabs.’

    Both sides agreed to keep defecating on non-WASP white Christians they ruled so their focus could be set on philoSemitism.

    There is a lesson there for those of you able to learn it.

  70. Anonymous[187] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    I'm not engaging with your random throwaway fictions. I'm merely pointing out their internal inconsistency. All you then do is add another layer of rationalisations that make the whole even less wieldy. The problem though is that then, I assume, you're no longer capable of holding all of those thoughts in your head and so failure to realise how absurdly contradictory they are.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    I’m not engaging with your random throwaway fictions. I’m merely pointing out their internal inconsistency.

    You have yet to state a supposed “internal inconsistency” that is in fact inconsistent.

    Take a step back and look at how emotional and unreasonable you are being in this thread.

  71. @PiltdownMan
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    Long Island and Florida by choice, and Israel as a safety backup. It's a rational strategy.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @YetAnotherAnon

    Israel as a safety backup for Long Island? Do you even think before you write?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    Israel as a safety backup for Long Island? Do you even think before you write?
     
    If it's a safety backup for the United States (see The Plot Against the United States) and for Germany, it's a backup for Long Island.
  72. @neutral
    @Tyrion 2

    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves. They cannot practically turn all of Western Europe and North America to an exclusive zone for themselves, thus it is better to run it as a multic culti business zone controlled by them, but obviously not populated by them.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Ibound1

    Couldn’t the governors of the world have secured a slightly bigger piece of land than the tiny, satirically narrow Israel?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    Couldn’t the governors of the world have secured a slightly bigger piece of land than the tiny, satirically narrow Israel?
     
    The United States, Canada, Australia, and Western Europe are pretty secure.
    , @neutral
    @Tyrion 2

    They have been grabbing ever more land for decades now. I can already see you spouting future narratives that there new "facts on the ground" in Jordan and Syria as Israel will in the future grab those lands as well.

  73. @donut
    @eah

    They're living the Libertarian dream .

    Replies: @Mark G.

    Living in a country with no property rights is not a Libertarian dream so your comment Somalia is Libertarian is nonsense.

    • Replies: @donut
    @Mark G.

    I don't think it is . But any way explain to me why you think it is nonsense .

    Replies: @Mark G.

  74. @Steve Sailer
    @IHTG

    Kind of like how guys named Tex usually don't live in Texas.

    There's an actor named "Ashkenazi," right? I saw him in a pretty good Israeli film about 15 years ago.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Mike Zwick

    Norman Jewison isn’t Jewish.

  75. Have you ever noticed that movie trailer voiceovers used to all start out “In a world where …”, but now they all end “… and change the world forever”? What’s the deal with that anyway?

    Maybe it started out that people in the entertainment industry were originally trying to create a dream world for their audience as a kind of escapism. Sort of like when they say that Green Acres, The Beverly Hillbillies, and Petticoat Junction all existed in the “same universe.” But then their egos got away from them and all this went to their heads. Probably around the time that Harvey Weinstein’s power was on the rise. So now, they want to create a world, in their image, that nobody can escape from. The precedent for all this was back when Green Acres, The Beverly Hillbillies, and Petticoat Junction were all suddenly cancelled and replaced with shows like All in the Family, which instead of providing their audiences with an escape to a surreal other world, preached to the audience in order to create guilt.

  76. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    I shouldn’t laugh. The US tax payer is defending these 4 countries with its bloated defense budget while these 4 show off their legs.

  77. @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    It’s perfectly rational for Jews to want the West to be multi-everything. Jews are a market dominant minority, i.e. they stick out like a sore thumb. What’s safer for such a group: 1) Being 2% of an otherwise homogeneous society or 2) Being just one of many racial/ethnic/religious groups in a society when no single group holds power.

    The push by elite Jews – not a conspiracy, just various actors working independently but for the same goal – to transform the West makes perfect sense. Hell, I’d probably be on board myself if I was Jewish.

    (The growing Muslim population in Europe wasn’t the best course, but, hey, you work with what you got. Muslims are nearby so it’s tough to keep them out while opening the doors to everyone else.)

    Your unwillingness to acknowledge this reality always fascinates me. The seemingly pathological lack of self-awareness of Jews is amazing. It has to be an evolutionary adaptation. You guys really can’t see what you’re doing or why it might enrage native populations.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Citizen of a Silly Country

    According to your "logic" Jews want to crowd out their own market niche?

  78. bored identity is shocked to learn that Goombah Yisrael Crew is working so hard to send Uncle Bibi to his early retirement

  79. @Buzz Mohawk
    That looks like a promo photo for a TV show about a team of anti-heroes.

    The most impressive character is the man in brown leather, who appears ready to punch out the photographer. After he's done, the goon on the left will apply the necessary torture techniques to get whatever they're after.

    The tall man in the ill-fitting Patagonia jacket must be the financier who maintains contacts with "important people," while Spectacles on the right is obviously the fixer who makes the legal problems caused by the two on the left go away.

    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

    Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose, @Sean, @Tex, @Hypnotoad666

    I was thinking they were debt collectors for the Meyer Lansky mob, and the photog owed a lotta juice to his bookie.

  80. @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    You guys don’t even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions…

    More projection here. You guys don’t seem to do much self-inerrogation as to how the behaviors of your group could be construed as being perceived as anything from insensitive to hostile. Instead, anybody who notices the often disproportionate power of your group, and realizes that said power has consequences to our group, is just dismissed with a strawman argument (as you’ve done here) or smeared with insults.

    It’s a dishonest tactic and people are increasingly beginning to understand it as such.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Mr. Anon

    It might not be your argument. I don't know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It's embarrassing.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites' fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @nebulafox, @Mr. Anon

  81. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    All Germanic ladies, yet only the German and Dutch woman are blond. What gives?

  82. @Reg Cæsar
    Minneapolis has its own Brill Building, just like New York. But this one specialized in military surplus.


    http://www.startribune.com/walter-brill-had-an-eye-for-value-and-practical-gear/13514671/


    https://hoodstarter-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/attachments/367/hero_slide_brill3.jpg


    It's too bad he couldn't stick around a little longer to deal in East African war surplus. Though you'd need two licenses for a Toyota retrofitted with a sub-machine gun.

    Which reminds me... A couple hundred miles downriver:

    German sub-machine gun sets record at auction

    Replies: @donut, @Mr. Anon

    American Surplus Store – You could hang that sign on the Statue of Liberty

    Everything Must Go!

    The whole country is just turning into one big rummage sale anyway.

  83. @Lot
    “Israel’s unwritten rule is that while Israel’s Arab citizens are allowed to vote, their parties can’t be used to put together a majority to form a government.”

    That’s not really a rule, and it only is something that Labour and its predecessor parties promised, and was required for them to actually get elected.

    The right wing parties don’t need a “rule” about forming a government with the Arabs. And the main far left party is about half Arab and half Jew so obviously isn’t part of this rule.

    “I would expect virtually the entire American mainstream media to declare as one that the Nice People in Israel have won”

    I agree. But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.

    Replies: @Gordo, @Mr. Anon

    I agree. But Muslims and the woke left don’t trust the MSM on Israel, and everyone else likes Israel, so it won’t change perceptions here much.

    Sure, everyone “likes” Israel – that’s what the MSM tells us.

    The MSM also tells us that 30% or so of couples are interracial, that most computer nerds are black, and that most street-criminals are white guys.

  84. Wait, isn’t this racist or something?

    I mean, how can Israel do that?

    Five new Knesset members renounce foreign citizenship

    Ahhh, I know. Flexible morals.

  85. “sell Israel’s soul to religious and nationalist fanatics“ Isn’t that who founded Israel? It’s like saying you are appalled that General Motors is staffed by people who produce cars.

  86. I literally had never heard the word until grad school in the mid-late 70’s, I remember looking it up the dictionary in the CU library. Of course all the English grad students, steeped in Auerbach’s “Mimesis”, used it all the time.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @nglaer


    I literally had never heard the word until grad school in the mid-late 70’s, I remember looking it up the dictionary in the CU library. Of course all the English grad students, steeped in Auerbach’s “Mimesis”, used it all the time.
     
    What did they use it to mean back then?

    Replies: @nglaer

  87. In military terms, this is turning into the Zionists’ equivalent of attempting to seize those last few acres of Stalingrad.

    Groveling submission will be displayed.

    ‘The House will vote Thursday on a resolution condemning anti-Semitism, an indirect rebuke of controversial comments by Rep. Ilhan Omar that has inflamed the Democratic Caucus all week.

    House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-Md.) made the announcement in a closed-door meeting Thursday morning…’

    However, while rubbing their nose in it may work with puppies, I’m not sure it’s a wise tactic to use on Congresspersons.

  88. @Tyrion 2
    @Debo

    Israel is, by global standards, a very liberal country. The vast majority of the world's population live in countries that are objectively far less progressive on every issue.

    Replies: @nik1975, @Colin Wright

    I disagree

    Israel Palestine is a structurally segregated Apartheid State, putting it well below any claim to liberal status

    Over 1300 peaceful ethnic Israeli Palestinians were shot in one day during the great march of return a sixteen weeks ago

    shocking

    Israel is currently supporting wars in several countries including Yemen, where over one hunder thousand children under five years old have died as a direct result of hostilities

    Hardly liberal or democratic

    more like extreme genocidal and sociopathic

  89. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @nglaer
    I literally had never heard the word until grad school in the mid-late 70's, I remember looking it up the dictionary in the CU library. Of course all the English grad students, steeped in Auerbach's "Mimesis", used it all the time.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    I literally had never heard the word until grad school in the mid-late 70’s, I remember looking it up the dictionary in the CU library. Of course all the English grad students, steeped in Auerbach’s “Mimesis”, used it all the time.

    What did they use it to mean back then?

    • Replies: @nglaer
    @Anonymous

    Still not sure.

  90. @Reg Cæsar
    Why are two of those guys dressed like Bibendum?

    https://rmsothebys-cache.azureedge.net/0/1/8/2/9/e/01829e530c0ed0e752f07117cf8aeeff7b518a7c.jpg


    https://france3-regions.francetvinfo.fr/auvergne-rhone-alpes/sites/regions_france3/files/styles/top_big/public/assets/images/2018/05/07/000_app2000072036321-3644725.jpg?itok=b6ExVmZm


    ...as the ethnonationalist Jewish state historically drifts right.
     
    Feint to the left,
    Drift to the right,
    Do the ooby dooby
    with all of your might...


    https://youtu.be/yg9a14a5OY4

    Replies: @PiltdownMan, @Jack D

    That style of jacket is very fashionable in southern Europe now. When I was in Portugal last spring I would say that 1/2 the tourists were wearing them. They are good for travel because they can be packed down into a small space and they are just right for a mild Mediterranean winter where it gets a little chilly but never really goes below freezing. But aside from their practicality they are just the fashion of the moment. Of course as soon as “everyone” is wearing them, they are instantly past their peak and the fashion hounds will need to find something new to show that they are not one of the herd.

    I don’t know why they didn’t become as popular in the US . They are not really warm enough for a cold Northern winter but would be suitable for the southern third of the US. Yes they look stupid but that never stopped an item from becoming fashionable. The fact that cheap versions are available is a big black mark against them. The fashionable coat in the US is the “Canada Goose” brand that goes for $600 on up. It’s a Veblen good – the fact that it is expensive makes it MORE desirable. Every year there is some item for which people get killed in the ghetto and this year it is those coats.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @Jack D

    Those narrow kielbasa have been a fashion statement on down jackets for a while now. They're a Patagonia staple, common in trendy, mountainy places where a lot of trust fund babies live.

    Better-looking is the one on the far left. The volumes are just right. No sausages. That's the guy who hid Walter White in New Hampshire, BTW.

    Still, you can't beat the leather look of Anthony Bourdain, second from left.

    This impressive group could be portrayed in an Action Team! comic book, to be sold right next to the new graphic novel, Jesus Freak.

    , @Reg Cæsar
    @Jack D


    Of course as soon as “everyone” is wearing them, they are instantly past their peak and the fashion hounds will need to find something new to show that they are not one of the herd.
     
    As Yogi said of Ruggeri's, the St Louis restaurant where he once waited tables, "Nobody comes here anymore. It's too crowded."


    http://www.losttables.com/ruggeris/ruggeris.htm


    http://www.losttables.com/images/ruggeris/ruggeris.jpg

  91. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    The Israeli gentlemen look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces existential threats would look and the European ladies look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces no existential threats would look. For all the talk of the US assisting Israel, which of these two groups looks like they have spent the last 70 years lounging under an American defense umbrella and which ones look like they are prepared to do their own fighting, personally if necessary? The European ladies look like the Beverly Hills Neighborhood Watch, who can call the REAL police if something actually happens and the Israelis look like Roof Koreans.

    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don’t look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don’t look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.
     
    Interesting strategy.

    Replies: @Ibound1

    , @Byrresheim
    @Jack D

    Complete nonsense that flies in the face of even what you should have learned in school if you had actually paid attention, let alone what you know if you are in the least interested in non-propaganda.

    US buyers remorse vis à vis Stalin's Bolsheviks informed US post war politics, the price for those Bundeswehr Panzerdivisionen was paid by the Germans themselves and they did play a role in keeping the Russians out.

    NATO:
    To keep the Americans in,
    the Russians out
    and the Germans down.

    , @nebulafox
    @Jack D

    > I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    I think we could have had today's state of affairs with a lot less death and destruction, and a more psychologically healthy and productive Europe if it wasn't in part for the neocons of 1917. All without the US footing the bill.

    The EU today is more or less the German dominated entity that would have been the end result if the US didn't intervene in WWI and the Western Front had ended in some kind of compromise deal-as it would have had to eventually without US intervention. Had that happened: probably no Bolsheviks, definitely no Fascism, and Adolf Hitler would have died as the embittered, probably somewhat autistic loser (I know what I'm talking about) at society's fringes he really was, assuming he doesn't preferably just get his in the trenches in this timeline.

    Needless to say, without WWII as we know it, none of the nonsense that has effected Europe for the past several decades would exist.

    Replies: @Jack D

  92. @Lot
    @Anonymous

    Jews conquered and own the Holy Land through Ashkenazi IQ and their martial virtues, and through their long and happy alliance with England and the USA, and have since repeatedly defeated Arab armies on every side. No “trading” needed.

    You: whine on the Internet, pining for a new Adolf.

    As a moral and altruistic people, many have fallen under the spell of leftist egalitarianism. But they’ve awakened to the menace of third world migration in Israel, Australia, France, England, and Canada. And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.

    Replies: @IHTG, @ATBOTL

    “As a moral and altruistic people…”

    These neocons here are constantly in a state of self parody.

  93. @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    You guys keeping repeating this fantasy to each other and have somehow come to think that it makes sense. Let's just take all of your wildly speculative assumptions (the kindest way I can describe) at face value and then ask ordinary follow up questions.

    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?

    Also, if Jews have owned the West in the past, why couldn't they just take a lot more. The West took practically the whole of the New World, Asia, Africa, Australasia and more!

    You guys don't even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions...

    Replies: @neutral, @Anonymous, @Gordo, @PiltdownMan, @Citizen of a Silly Country, @Mr. Anon, @BenKenobi

    Mendacity: The Post.

  94. @nebulafox
    @Lot

    > But the war that really would be in Israel’s interest is just what you describe.

    It doesn't have to be in Israel's interest. Politicians since time immemorial tend to conflate or sacrifice national interests for domestic political reasons. That's the way things have always been and likely always will be.

    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He's not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don't buy he didn't know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he's sacrificing Israel's foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he's willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don't put much beyond him.

    Netanyahu might be supremely intelligent, but he's also a mendacious and rather reckless SOB, even on politician standards. And there's a lot of people in Israel who make him look like a flat-out peacenik. So, no, I do not find it impossible that he might accidentally set something off in an effort to keep his political boat afloat.

    Replies: @IHTG, @Anonymous, @ATBOTL

    Recently, Bibi blew up the inspired Visegrad strategy that Israel spent years trying to cultivate for stupid WWII-rehash tantrums. He’s not a dumb guy-his academic record should be more than enough to prove that-so I don’t buy he didn’t know the risk of that. My guess is that his corruption problems at home mean he’s sacrificing Israel’s foreign policy interest to keep his domestic political base with him, as is the case for politicians the world-over. If he’s willing to sacrifice a multi-year effort that is very much foreign policy gold for Israel to appease the hard-right at home, I don’t put much beyond him.

    You make an important point. Hostility to European gentiles plays well with the Jewish right in Israel. The neocons here want us to not notice that fact.

  95. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    The Israeli gentlemen look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces existential threats would look and the European ladies look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces no existential threats would look. For all the talk of the US assisting Israel, which of these two groups looks like they have spent the last 70 years lounging under an American defense umbrella and which ones look like they are prepared to do their own fighting, personally if necessary? The European ladies look like the Beverly Hills Neighborhood Watch, who can call the REAL police if something actually happens and the Israelis look like Roof Koreans.

    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don't look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe's defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Byrresheim, @nebulafox

    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don’t look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    Interesting strategy.

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    @Anonymous

    This is an insane strategy
    We don’t need to defend Europe for any reason.
    It’s crushing us with debt while we fail to defend our own border. And all troops in the world can’t stop the Islamification of Europe. 20% of French children born last year had Muslim names.
    We have no defense strategy or posture except to spend money.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  96. @Debo
    The Jewish establishment has been caught completely off-guard, both domestically and in Israel.

    Give it 15 years, and there will be a seismic reordering for Jewish interests. First, the Boomers will wane in electoral impact, along with their Jewish fetish. As this generation passes, the estate tax will dry up Jewish slush funds. The triple whammy is that GenX Jews are some combination of: childless dolts, secularists who do not identify with their co-ethnics, or are husbands married to shiksas / Asians. In the US, Gen Z is the Ashkenazi genetic bookend.

    Israel's most naturally-aligned allies in 15 years will likely be Arab autocracies that value stability in the face of plateauing oil prices. Not enviable.

    Replies: @James Speaks, @Tyrion 2, @utu, @Jack D

    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands. Of course it is nice for the Israelis to have the US as a friend but they are prepared to go it alone if necessary, even if it meant being as isolated as North Korea. Not that they would need to be – Israel maintains good relations with Russia, India, China, etc. and have no intention of eating tree bark.

    OTOH, if the US were to suddenly pull the plug on defending Europe, do those defense minister ladies look like they are ready to take up the slack tomorrow?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands.
     
    There's no reason that prescription shouldn't hold for Gentile groups as well. What's good for the goose, is good for the gander. And it would seem to justify putting limits on Jewish influence and representation in Gentile nation-states. In the USA, European nations, etc.

    Regarding that Jewish attitude though, is there anything Jews wouldn't do to preserve "control of their destiny"? Would they kill Gentiles or destroy Gentile groups for it?

    Replies: @Peripatetic Commenter, @Jack D

    , @Debo
    @Jack D

    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader's consciousness as well. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence, does it?

    Israel's modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer. Israel understands that if this were to occur, a fragmented Islamic Middle East has a centripetal cause uniting it, similar to the Pan-Arabism of the 1960's. The key difference being such a conflict will likely rely on asymmetric warfare, playing against Israel's strength (organized army and nuclear deterrence) and playing to the Arab world's strength (willingness to die).

    Such a conflict provides outside powers, like China, an immediate in with petro states, bartering espionage capabilities for oil.

    The only thing that has kept this from happening is a large US presence in the region, Islamic autocracies using oil revenue to placate their people, and an inflammed Sunni/Shiite divide. Remove these three things and Israel is quickly exposed.

    Replies: @Jack D, @nebulafox

  97. Without having a dog in this fight, I’d say the Haaretz article read as rather desperate.

    Only in Israel can three gruff military men emerge as the last line of defense against Netanyahu and his war to degrade democracy and dismantle the rule of law

    -last line of defense
    -war to degrade democracy
    -dismantle the rule of law

    Sounds like US Democrats railing against Trump.

    Probably not sporting to call Netayahu Hitler…but it doesn’t stop US media, other pols, twits on Twitter from doing so with Trump.

  98. Muslims in the West has been disastrous for Jews. Britain and France went from allies building their nuke force and jointly invading Egypt to very hostile with their own nukes.

    Jews have been purged out of Paris and the Riviera. Both very nice places. Much of Israel is not very nice.

    There is too much nazi larping here. Diaspora Jews got high on hopium and believed their own bs in a desperate attempt to stay as they are. Educated urban professionals unable and unwilling to grasp the reality that only nationalism backed by hard military force keeps 6 billion hostile non Whites from killing you and taking your stuff.

    Here in the US Jews are being expelled from Hollywood via metoo and in politics and media by non Whites who hate them. Jews are no different than stupid boomer Cucks who get high on hopium. It’s the same thing. Extreme atomization encourages hopium addiction. People need meaning to their lives and military heritage fighting is too hard for urbanites.

    Would you jump out of airplanes?

    Re Bibi reckless its common in a Israeli because of the small size and lack of strategic depth. Aggressive stuff to play off lack of men and space

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Whiskey


    There is too much nazi larping here.
     
    There is hardly any on the iSteve site.

    I remember however that you used to go in for a lot of scots-irish larping, until it became obvious that you didn't even know what the term means. So you dropped it from your patter, and now just stick to your weird brand of passive-agressive hasbara propaganda.
  99. @Anonymous

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other
     
    But there isn't a "massive fundamental problem."

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West's land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world's most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Replies: @Autochthon, @Tyrion 2, @nebulafox, @Lot, @Jack D, @Counterinsurgency

    It sounds like you and Omar agree already – the Joos run America, indeed the run the whole Western world. This sounds like a TROPE to me.

    Jews are supposed to be hard bargainers. If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East? But the Jews already have Israel and don’t need to trade for it. At the very least I would a bigger territory. Throw in the Sinai, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria and then MAYBE we could talk about a trade.

    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have. I couldn’t wait to get you into my car dealership – by the time we were done, I’d have you buying back your own car. However, I will give you an EXCELLENT price on an extended warranty that covers tree pollen damage.

    • LOL: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D

    Predictably, you reply with straw man.

    Jews position in relation to Palestine could certainly be improved, couldn't it? Jews in the US and Israel certainly seem to think so, as one must infer from the money and energy they pour into lobbying for it before the US government and the US public, and before other countries, and from their bellicosity in the Middle East.

    There are other perceived benefits to Jews from this trade, which have been commented on above. Diminishment of the power, solidarity, and appeal of European and Christian groups, for example.

    , @Reg Cæsar
    @Jack D


    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have.
     
    Gun rights advocates make this point all the time, about "compromises" they're offered.

    I remember a story about a beginning filmmaker continually reassuring a potential investor, "You'll get your money back." The investor finally told him, "I already have my money."

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @istevefan
    @Jack D


    If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East?
     
    Because that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East has historic significance for your people. Additionally the current state of affairs allows for Jews to control that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East while benefiting from living in the European world.

    But the Jews already have Israel and don’t need to trade for it.
     
    Just because the Jews already have Israel doesn't mean they always will have it. As you have seen Whites are in the process of losing their lands in the New World, or at the very least of being seriously watered down. Even in Europe itself, Europeans are on a trend that could lead to some of them losing their territory.

    Nothing is settled so long as there are people who are willing to contest the status quo.

    Jews realize this and know they cannot take the future of Israel for granted. So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Johann Ricke

  100. @Jack D
    @Reg Cæsar

    That style of jacket is very fashionable in southern Europe now. When I was in Portugal last spring I would say that 1/2 the tourists were wearing them. They are good for travel because they can be packed down into a small space and they are just right for a mild Mediterranean winter where it gets a little chilly but never really goes below freezing. But aside from their practicality they are just the fashion of the moment. Of course as soon as "everyone" is wearing them, they are instantly past their peak and the fashion hounds will need to find something new to show that they are not one of the herd.

    I don't know why they didn't become as popular in the US . They are not really warm enough for a cold Northern winter but would be suitable for the southern third of the US. Yes they look stupid but that never stopped an item from becoming fashionable. The fact that cheap versions are available is a big black mark against them. The fashionable coat in the US is the "Canada Goose" brand that goes for $600 on up. It's a Veblen good - the fact that it is expensive makes it MORE desirable. Every year there is some item for which people get killed in the ghetto and this year it is those coats.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Reg Cæsar

    Those narrow kielbasa have been a fashion statement on down jackets for a while now. They’re a Patagonia staple, common in trendy, mountainy places where a lot of trust fund babies live.

    Better-looking is the one on the far left. The volumes are just right. No sausages. That’s the guy who hid Walter White in New Hampshire, BTW.

    Still, you can’t beat the leather look of Anthony Bourdain, second from left.

    This impressive group could be portrayed in an Action Team! comic book, to be sold right next to the new graphic novel, Jesus Freak.

  101. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @Debo

    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader's consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else's hands. Of course it is nice for the Israelis to have the US as a friend but they are prepared to go it alone if necessary, even if it meant being as isolated as North Korea. Not that they would need to be - Israel maintains good relations with Russia, India, China, etc. and have no intention of eating tree bark.

    OTOH, if the US were to suddenly pull the plug on defending Europe, do those defense minister ladies look like they are ready to take up the slack tomorrow?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Debo

    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands.

    There’s no reason that prescription shouldn’t hold for Gentile groups as well. What’s good for the goose, is good for the gander. And it would seem to justify putting limits on Jewish influence and representation in Gentile nation-states. In the USA, European nations, etc.

    Regarding that Jewish attitude though, is there anything Jews wouldn’t do to preserve “control of their destiny”? Would they kill Gentiles or destroy Gentile groups for it?

    • Replies: @Peripatetic Commenter
    @Anonymous

    Well, if Ron Unz is to be believed, they did kill JFK and a bunch of people on 9/11.

    , @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It says in the Talmud: "If someone comes to kill you, rise up and kill him first". All nations (that are not insane) have a right of self-defense. "Control of their destiny" (your words) is much too vague. Israel will kill or destroy those who pose a great and imminent threat to Jewish lives. The greater the potential threat, the less imminent it has to be (and vice versa). So if you are an Iranian nuclear scientist, I suggest that you switch to agronomy and in the meantime keep watching for motorcyclists in your rearview mirror.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Joe Stalin

  102. Amusingly, in an age of anti-Straight White Male identity politics in America, Israel is so far right these days that its center-left Blue & White coalition is led by macho straight white men.

    They look like a bunch of good fellas, you know what I mean? GOODFELLAS!

  103. “… Nancy Pelosi blinked in her confrontation with hijab-wearing freshman Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-New Puntland on the Prairie).”

    The orange cuck in chief cucked before Pelosi on the wall.

    The GOP cucks better get ready. 2040 is here and it’s only going to get more interesting.

  104. @neutral
    @Tyrion 2

    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves. They cannot practically turn all of Western Europe and North America to an exclusive zone for themselves, thus it is better to run it as a multic culti business zone controlled by them, but obviously not populated by them.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Ibound1

    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves.

    Good for them. More please. We need more countries where the leaders love their own demographies.

    Your fantasy that the West is controlled by them is nonsense. It is indeed a multi-culti business zone but one controlled by a senile institutional elite, Jewish and Gentile and increasingly female, which now hates its own population. Ted Kennedy hated Americans (unless they were Irish). The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. The court system in the US favors non-Americans. The US immigration bureaucracy favors non-Americans. Merkel in some way must hate Germans to have let in a million middle easterners. No Jew forced her to do that.

    At least in Israel they love their own population. That is a good thing. It should be encouraged among all countries. I wish we had the equivalent of these 4 here.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Ibound1


    At least in Israel they love their own population. That is a good thing. It should be encouraged among all countries.
     
    Jews discourage it in other countries.
    , @BigDickNick
    @Ibound1

    "The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. "

    Have you ever looked into who funds the democrats? If so, what group is providing the majority of their money?

    Replies: @Anonymous

  105. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It sounds like you and Omar agree already - the Joos run America, indeed the run the whole Western world. This sounds like a TROPE to me.

    Jews are supposed to be hard bargainers. If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East? But the Jews already have Israel and don't need to trade for it. At the very least I would a bigger territory. Throw in the Sinai, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria and then MAYBE we could talk about a trade.

    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have. I couldn't wait to get you into my car dealership - by the time we were done, I'd have you buying back your own car. However, I will give you an EXCELLENT price on an extended warranty that covers tree pollen damage.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Reg Cæsar, @istevefan

    Predictably, you reply with straw man.

    Jews position in relation to Palestine could certainly be improved, couldn’t it? Jews in the US and Israel certainly seem to think so, as one must infer from the money and energy they pour into lobbying for it before the US government and the US public, and before other countries, and from their bellicosity in the Middle East.

    There are other perceived benefits to Jews from this trade, which have been commented on above. Diminishment of the power, solidarity, and appeal of European and Christian groups, for example.

  106. @Mr McKenna
    @Anonymous


    Greater “diversity” in the West also makes the Gentile population of the West less appealing to Jews from the standpoint of assimilation and intermarriage. Which is what Jewish leaders have historically been most concerned with, despite the fearmomgering about physical threats they apply to their followers.
     
    As if on cue, the Ruling Tribe shows signs that it may finally tire of white women:


    If the shiksa is the one chasing Jewish men, and not the other way around, then the shiksa has defeated her own purpose, has run her course. Jewish men need a new romantic aspiration. In The Social Network, Aaron Sorkin submits a candidate. “I'm developing an algorithm to define the connection between Jewish guys and Asian girls,” says one Jewish nerd to another in the 2010 film. “I don't think it's that complicated,” the second Jewish nerd answers. “They're hot, they're smart, they're not Jewish and they can't dance.”

    The question, then, isn’t whether shiksa is a pejorative; it’s whether she’s even relevant.

    https://www.salon.com/2013/03/06/is_shiksa_an_insult_partner/

     

    Replies: @Jack D

    This doesn’t really make sense unless you attach a malleable definition to “hot”. The traditional meaning of “hot” is “looking like Marilyn Monroe”. By that definition, most Asian girls are NOT hot. Maybe in 2019 “hot” has been redefined to mean “not obese” in which case a lot more Asian girls qualify.

    Now “smart” is a lot closer to it. The traditional trope concerning blondes was that they were not too bright. You could have fun with a shiksa in bed but the rest of the time you didn’t have much to talk about. Jewish women are smart too but they tend to be “high maintenance” whereas Asian women tend to have more agreeable personalities. The old saying is that “opposites attract” but this is not really true – you don’t want your mate to be your diametric opposite. Rather you want them to share most of your values but be JUST different enough to be interesting and not remind you of your mother.

    • Agree: Captain Tripps
  107. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ibound1
    @neutral


    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves.
     
    Good for them. More please. We need more countries where the leaders love their own demographies.

    Your fantasy that the West is controlled by them is nonsense. It is indeed a multi-culti business zone but one controlled by a senile institutional elite, Jewish and Gentile and increasingly female, which now hates its own population. Ted Kennedy hated Americans (unless they were Irish). The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. The court system in the US favors non-Americans. The US immigration bureaucracy favors non-Americans. Merkel in some way must hate Germans to have let in a million middle easterners. No Jew forced her to do that.

    At least in Israel they love their own population. That is a good thing. It should be encouraged among all countries. I wish we had the equivalent of these 4 here.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @BigDickNick

    At least in Israel they love their own population. That is a good thing. It should be encouraged among all countries.

    Jews discourage it in other countries.

  108. @Jack D
    @Reg Cæsar

    That style of jacket is very fashionable in southern Europe now. When I was in Portugal last spring I would say that 1/2 the tourists were wearing them. They are good for travel because they can be packed down into a small space and they are just right for a mild Mediterranean winter where it gets a little chilly but never really goes below freezing. But aside from their practicality they are just the fashion of the moment. Of course as soon as "everyone" is wearing them, they are instantly past their peak and the fashion hounds will need to find something new to show that they are not one of the herd.

    I don't know why they didn't become as popular in the US . They are not really warm enough for a cold Northern winter but would be suitable for the southern third of the US. Yes they look stupid but that never stopped an item from becoming fashionable. The fact that cheap versions are available is a big black mark against them. The fashionable coat in the US is the "Canada Goose" brand that goes for $600 on up. It's a Veblen good - the fact that it is expensive makes it MORE desirable. Every year there is some item for which people get killed in the ghetto and this year it is those coats.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Reg Cæsar

    Of course as soon as “everyone” is wearing them, they are instantly past their peak and the fashion hounds will need to find something new to show that they are not one of the herd.

    As Yogi said of Ruggeri’s, the St Louis restaurant where he once waited tables, “Nobody comes here anymore. It’s too crowded.”

    http://www.losttables.com/ruggeris/ruggeris.htm

  109. @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It sounds like you and Omar agree already - the Joos run America, indeed the run the whole Western world. This sounds like a TROPE to me.

    Jews are supposed to be hard bargainers. If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East? But the Jews already have Israel and don't need to trade for it. At the very least I would a bigger territory. Throw in the Sinai, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria and then MAYBE we could talk about a trade.

    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have. I couldn't wait to get you into my car dealership - by the time we were done, I'd have you buying back your own car. However, I will give you an EXCELLENT price on an extended warranty that covers tree pollen damage.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Reg Cæsar, @istevefan

    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have.

    Gun rights advocates make this point all the time, about “compromises” they’re offered.

    I remember a story about a beginning filmmaker continually reassuring a potential investor, “You’ll get your money back.” The investor finally told him, “I already have my money.”

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Reg Cæsar


    I remember a story about a beginning filmmaker continually reassuring a potential investor, “You’ll get your money back.” The investor finally told him, “I already have my money.”
     
    Jews don't exactly behave like they are confident about Israel or Jews safety in the West from Nazis (or about intermarriage)...

    ...oh wait, so is that why they have the United States pay for everything?
  110. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar
    @Jack D


    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have.
     
    Gun rights advocates make this point all the time, about "compromises" they're offered.

    I remember a story about a beginning filmmaker continually reassuring a potential investor, "You'll get your money back." The investor finally told him, "I already have my money."

    Replies: @Anonymous

    I remember a story about a beginning filmmaker continually reassuring a potential investor, “You’ll get your money back.” The investor finally told him, “I already have my money.”

    Jews don’t exactly behave like they are confident about Israel or Jews safety in the West from Nazis (or about intermarriage)…

    …oh wait, so is that why they have the United States pay for everything?

  111. anonymous[739] • Disclaimer says:

    The Zionists here , there and everywhere know how to play the media like skilled Jewish musicians know how to play the violin.

    Reflex Lib Leftist “Talk” against Israel is just that, just talk – usually by some old washed up actor or Pink Floyd rock star.

    With Saudi Arabia and Israel/Zionist on 99% agreement on everything that counts, Israel and the Jews have little to fear from Liberals/Leftists or really anyone.

    The Arab and Muslim masses just want entry in to White societies.

    Virtually all the Jews that count support this – they want to see poor and working class Whites replaced or even killed off through Opiod addiction.

    @*$&@ worst Jewish Neo Conservative Bill Kristol and arch Jew Lib Leftist Tim Wise or rather open about this wish.

  112. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @PiltdownMan

    Israel as a safety backup for Long Island? Do you even think before you write?

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Israel as a safety backup for Long Island? Do you even think before you write?

    If it’s a safety backup for the United States (see The Plot Against the United States) and for Germany, it’s a backup for Long Island.

  113. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @neutral

    Couldn't the governors of the world have secured a slightly bigger piece of land than the tiny, satirically narrow Israel?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @neutral

    Couldn’t the governors of the world have secured a slightly bigger piece of land than the tiny, satirically narrow Israel?

    The United States, Canada, Australia, and Western Europe are pretty secure.

  114. Have you ever noticed that movie trailer voiceovers used to all start out “In a world where …”, but now they all end “… and change the world forever”? What’s the deal with that anyway?

    Don LaFontaine, the “trailer voice guy” whose signature that “in a world where…” line was, died in 2008.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_LaFontaine

  115. istevefan says:
    @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It sounds like you and Omar agree already - the Joos run America, indeed the run the whole Western world. This sounds like a TROPE to me.

    Jews are supposed to be hard bargainers. If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East? But the Jews already have Israel and don't need to trade for it. At the very least I would a bigger territory. Throw in the Sinai, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria and then MAYBE we could talk about a trade.

    Only a goyische kop would trade for something that you already have. I couldn't wait to get you into my car dealership - by the time we were done, I'd have you buying back your own car. However, I will give you an EXCELLENT price on an extended warranty that covers tree pollen damage.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Reg Cæsar, @istevefan

    If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East?

    Because that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East has historic significance for your people. Additionally the current state of affairs allows for Jews to control that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East while benefiting from living in the European world.

    But the Jews already have Israel and don’t need to trade for it.

    Just because the Jews already have Israel doesn’t mean they always will have it. As you have seen Whites are in the process of losing their lands in the New World, or at the very least of being seriously watered down. Even in Europe itself, Europeans are on a trend that could lead to some of them losing their territory.

    Nothing is settled so long as there are people who are willing to contest the status quo.

    Jews realize this and know they cannot take the future of Israel for granted. So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @istevefan


    So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.
     
    That's not true. Wise leaders (as opposed to myopic dictators) look for win-win opportunities where their actions are in their own best interest AND in the best interest of their allies. It's not at ALL immaterial. Yes, when push comes to shove you have to look out for #1, but if you can accomplish your goal without causing unnecessary collateral damage to your allies, you do it (because that in itself is in your LONG TERM best interest).

    Some people here seem to think that Israeli leaders wake up every day thinking, "How can I harm the goyim today?" This is the furthest thing from their minds.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @Johann Ricke
    @istevefan


    Jews realize this and know they cannot take the future of Israel for granted. So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.
     
    You mean Europeans aren't open to doing whatever it takes to keep Europe? Is there a single European leader who doesn't know that admitting tens of millions of Muslim refugees will make the place a lot more anti-semitic? Maybe in their minds, this is a plus, not a minus.
  116. @Anonymous
    @nglaer


    I literally had never heard the word until grad school in the mid-late 70’s, I remember looking it up the dictionary in the CU library. Of course all the English grad students, steeped in Auerbach’s “Mimesis”, used it all the time.
     
    What did they use it to mean back then?

    Replies: @nglaer

    Still not sure.

  117. @IHTG
    @Lot


    And in the US the process is slower but still happening as well: 55% of married Jewish men voted for Trump.
     
    I'm not sure this is really true, IIRC it was an extrapolation from (often unreliable) exit polls or something like that.

    Replies: @Lot

    Was not an exit poll. And I remembered wrong, it was 58% Trump.

    This is from Audacious Epigone’s writeup of the poll.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Lot


    Was not an exit poll. And I remembered wrong, it was 58% Trump.
     
    Is that 59% those who identify religiously or ethnically?

    The overall jewish vote in 2016 was 70% for the Democrat, which is about what it always is.

    https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/clinton-won-majority-of-jewish-american-vote-polls-say-1.5459522

    In fact, Trump got a smaller share of that vote than Romney did.

    Replies: @IHTG

  118. @Tyrion 2
    @neutral

    Couldn't the governors of the world have secured a slightly bigger piece of land than the tiny, satirically narrow Israel?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @neutral

    They have been grabbing ever more land for decades now. I can already see you spouting future narratives that there new “facts on the ground” in Jordan and Syria as Israel will in the future grab those lands as well.

  119. @Jack D
    @Debo

    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader's consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else's hands. Of course it is nice for the Israelis to have the US as a friend but they are prepared to go it alone if necessary, even if it meant being as isolated as North Korea. Not that they would need to be - Israel maintains good relations with Russia, India, China, etc. and have no intention of eating tree bark.

    OTOH, if the US were to suddenly pull the plug on defending Europe, do those defense minister ladies look like they are ready to take up the slack tomorrow?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Debo

    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness as well. Doesn’t exactly inspire confidence, does it?

    Israel’s modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer. Israel understands that if this were to occur, a fragmented Islamic Middle East has a centripetal cause uniting it, similar to the Pan-Arabism of the 1960’s. The key difference being such a conflict will likely rely on asymmetric warfare, playing against Israel’s strength (organized army and nuclear deterrence) and playing to the Arab world’s strength (willingness to die).

    Such a conflict provides outside powers, like China, an immediate in with petro states, bartering espionage capabilities for oil.

    The only thing that has kept this from happening is a large US presence in the region, Islamic autocracies using oil revenue to placate their people, and an inflammed Sunni/Shiite divide. Remove these three things and Israel is quickly exposed.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Debo


    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness as well. Doesn’t exactly inspire confidence, does it?
     
    Masada would have turned out differently if the Judeans had nuclear missiles and Rome was in range.

    Replies: @Byrresheim

    , @nebulafox
    @Debo

    >Israel’s modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer.

    Not true at all these days. Most Middle Eastern governments that used to want to drive the Jews into the sea might not have affection for Israel, but they've come to accept it. Ironically enough, the exceptions back then have become the exceptions now, most notably Iran, which has historically been a rather philo-Semitic place from Cyrus to the Pahlavis.

    Outside of Western Europe (and Poland because Bibi through a hissy-fit about Warsaw quite reasonably refusing to kiss Israeli ass on historical narratives), Israel has never been more secure than it has been over the past decade. Russia and India have governments latently ideologically sympathetic to Likud, relations with China are just fine-most Chinese I've met have a very positive, if not PC, opinion of Jews. Syria, Libya, and Iraq have ceased to exist for all intents and purposes, the cold peaces with Egypt and Jordan still hold, and the Sauds are now tacit allies.

    This is way better than things were in 1973. Israel doesn't have to care about what Brussels thinks anymore, and due to changed demographics, there's little political incentive for Israeli politicians to care. The US isn't near as ignorable, obviously, but nor is it as indispensable as it was during the 1970s.

    Replies: @ATBOTL

  120. @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don’t look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.
     
    Interesting strategy.

    Replies: @Ibound1

    This is an insane strategy
    We don’t need to defend Europe for any reason.
    It’s crushing us with debt while we fail to defend our own border. And all troops in the world can’t stop the Islamification of Europe. 20% of French children born last year had Muslim names.
    We have no defense strategy or posture except to spend money.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Ibound1


    This is an insane strategy
    We don’t need to defend Europe for any reason.
    It’s crushing us with debt while we fail to defend our own border. And all troops in the world can’t stop the Islamification of Europe. 20% of French children born last year had Muslim names.
    We have no defense strategy or posture except to spend money.
     
    It's a good strategy for the Jews. It keeps German men emasculated, which in manifold ways leads to porous borders and below-replacement German fertility.

    Replies: @Ibound1

  121. @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands.
     
    There's no reason that prescription shouldn't hold for Gentile groups as well. What's good for the goose, is good for the gander. And it would seem to justify putting limits on Jewish influence and representation in Gentile nation-states. In the USA, European nations, etc.

    Regarding that Jewish attitude though, is there anything Jews wouldn't do to preserve "control of their destiny"? Would they kill Gentiles or destroy Gentile groups for it?

    Replies: @Peripatetic Commenter, @Jack D

    Well, if Ron Unz is to be believed, they did kill JFK and a bunch of people on 9/11.

  122. Benny Ganz looks pretty tall which seems like a tie breaker when people are choosing a leader.

  123. Benny Gantz looks pretty tall which seems like a tie breaker when people are choosing a leader.

  124. @Ibound1
    @neutral


    Because the jews want a specially reserved ethnic zone for themselves.
     
    Good for them. More please. We need more countries where the leaders love their own demographies.

    Your fantasy that the West is controlled by them is nonsense. It is indeed a multi-culti business zone but one controlled by a senile institutional elite, Jewish and Gentile and increasingly female, which now hates its own population. Ted Kennedy hated Americans (unless they were Irish). The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. The court system in the US favors non-Americans. The US immigration bureaucracy favors non-Americans. Merkel in some way must hate Germans to have let in a million middle easterners. No Jew forced her to do that.

    At least in Israel they love their own population. That is a good thing. It should be encouraged among all countries. I wish we had the equivalent of these 4 here.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @BigDickNick

    “The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. ”

    Have you ever looked into who funds the democrats? If so, what group is providing the majority of their money?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @BigDickNick


    “The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. ”

    Have you ever looked into who funds the democrats? If so, what group is providing the majority of their money?
     
    According to some reports, Jews supply at least half.
  125. @PiltdownMan
    @Tyrion 2


    E.g if Jews own the West then why would they swap it for a tiny strip of land in the Middle East?
     
    Long Island and Florida by choice, and Israel as a safety backup. It's a rational strategy.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @YetAnotherAnon

    Israel is a good bolt-hole when the police or courts are interested in you. In Thatcher’s day there was a controversial London borough council leader called Shirley Porter (IIRC her family owned a chunk of a major supermarket) who got into trouble for IIRC shifting Labour voters out of her borough (the kind of thing US city pols seem to do a lot).

    When the sewage hit the ventilator she legged it to Israel. She never did pay the huge surcharge she was landed with.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirley_Porter#Court_cases_and_surcharge

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @YetAnotherAnon


    When the sewage hit the ventilator she legged it to Israel. She never did pay the huge surcharge she was landed with.
     
    How did she manage to get let in? Isn't Porter a Gentile name?
  126. @Tyrion 2
    @Debo

    Israel is, by global standards, a very liberal country. The vast majority of the world's population live in countries that are objectively far less progressive on every issue.

    Replies: @nik1975, @Colin Wright

    ‘Israel is, by global standards, a very liberal country. ‘

    Israel is, in abstract terms, the most perfect realization ever seen of a Nazi state.

    It follows that those who support it are either (a) deluded, (b) crazed by bigotry, and/or (c) National Socialists themselves. You, of course, best know who you are.

  127. @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    If there is one thing that is burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness, it is that the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands.
     
    There's no reason that prescription shouldn't hold for Gentile groups as well. What's good for the goose, is good for the gander. And it would seem to justify putting limits on Jewish influence and representation in Gentile nation-states. In the USA, European nations, etc.

    Regarding that Jewish attitude though, is there anything Jews wouldn't do to preserve "control of their destiny"? Would they kill Gentiles or destroy Gentile groups for it?

    Replies: @Peripatetic Commenter, @Jack D

    It says in the Talmud: “If someone comes to kill you, rise up and kill him first”. All nations (that are not insane) have a right of self-defense. “Control of their destiny” (your words) is much too vague. Israel will kill or destroy those who pose a great and imminent threat to Jewish lives. The greater the potential threat, the less imminent it has to be (and vice versa). So if you are an Iranian nuclear scientist, I suggest that you switch to agronomy and in the meantime keep watching for motorcyclists in your rearview mirror.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    “Control of their destiny” (your words) is much too vague.
     
    Your words actually:

    the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands.

    So Jews will kill in order that their fate not be in someone else's hands. If the will kill, they will probably lie. That is much too vague.
    , @Joe Stalin
    @Jack D

    Poor Mr. Bull! Didn't know the Israeli rules, I'm afraid.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwpzLRKe-NE

    Replies: @Jack D

  128. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @YetAnotherAnon
    @PiltdownMan

    Israel is a good bolt-hole when the police or courts are interested in you. In Thatcher's day there was a controversial London borough council leader called Shirley Porter (IIRC her family owned a chunk of a major supermarket) who got into trouble for IIRC shifting Labour voters out of her borough (the kind of thing US city pols seem to do a lot).

    When the sewage hit the ventilator she legged it to Israel. She never did pay the huge surcharge she was landed with.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirley_Porter#Court_cases_and_surcharge

    Replies: @Anonymous

    When the sewage hit the ventilator she legged it to Israel. She never did pay the huge surcharge she was landed with.

    How did she manage to get let in? Isn’t Porter a Gentile name?

  129. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It says in the Talmud: "If someone comes to kill you, rise up and kill him first". All nations (that are not insane) have a right of self-defense. "Control of their destiny" (your words) is much too vague. Israel will kill or destroy those who pose a great and imminent threat to Jewish lives. The greater the potential threat, the less imminent it has to be (and vice versa). So if you are an Iranian nuclear scientist, I suggest that you switch to agronomy and in the meantime keep watching for motorcyclists in your rearview mirror.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Joe Stalin

    “Control of their destiny” (your words) is much too vague.

    Your words actually:

    the Jews should never again let their own fate rest in someone else’s hands.

    So Jews will kill in order that their fate not be in someone else’s hands. If the will kill, they will probably lie. That is much too vague.

  130. @istevefan
    @Jack D


    If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East?
     
    Because that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East has historic significance for your people. Additionally the current state of affairs allows for Jews to control that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East while benefiting from living in the European world.

    But the Jews already have Israel and don’t need to trade for it.
     
    Just because the Jews already have Israel doesn't mean they always will have it. As you have seen Whites are in the process of losing their lands in the New World, or at the very least of being seriously watered down. Even in Europe itself, Europeans are on a trend that could lead to some of them losing their territory.

    Nothing is settled so long as there are people who are willing to contest the status quo.

    Jews realize this and know they cannot take the future of Israel for granted. So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Johann Ricke

    So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.

    That’s not true. Wise leaders (as opposed to myopic dictators) look for win-win opportunities where their actions are in their own best interest AND in the best interest of their allies. It’s not at ALL immaterial. Yes, when push comes to shove you have to look out for #1, but if you can accomplish your goal without causing unnecessary collateral damage to your allies, you do it (because that in itself is in your LONG TERM best interest).

    Some people here seem to think that Israeli leaders wake up every day thinking, “How can I harm the goyim today?” This is the furthest thing from their minds.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D

    Just so we're clear. You would support Gentile nations imposing limitations on Jewish influence and control (quotas?) in order that the fate of Gentiles in those countries not rest in Jewish hands? Because that seems to be the privilege you support for Jews vis a vis Israel.

    Replies: @Jack D

  131. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Buzz Mohawk

    cf. Defense ministers of Norway, Sweden, Germany and the Netherlands.

    https://helanonline.cn/sites/helanonline.nl/files/utextnt.jpg

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Macon Richardson, @Lot, @Ibound1, @Prester John, @Jack D, @fish

    With a hat tip to Buzz…..

    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

    The second set of hard asses looks a little like: Action Team! Your neighborhood Realty Professionals!

  132. @eah
    'coalition pyramid of the fringes' -- it's not a "kerfuffle" -- it's a symptom, a festering sore caused by a major pathology of American politics -- and it will never be "declared over" by those who sit at the top of the pyramid (and provide 50% of the funding)

    The progressive victim stack is a myth. A black muslim women—someone who should have the most protected voice—has been shouted down and attacked for criticizing AlPAC. What we have is a jewish pyramid, where they’re on top and you’re never allowed to criticize them.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1CBE0EUYAA-3jK.jpg

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @anonymous, @donut, @fish

    WOW! Thats a a veritable Quadruple Royal Flush in Pokemon Victim Card Poker!

  133. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @BigDickNick
    @Ibound1

    "The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. "

    Have you ever looked into who funds the democrats? If so, what group is providing the majority of their money?

    Replies: @Anonymous

    “The entire Democratic field clearly favors non-US citizens over Americans. ”

    Have you ever looked into who funds the democrats? If so, what group is providing the majority of their money?

    According to some reports, Jews supply at least half.

  134. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @istevefan


    So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.
     
    That's not true. Wise leaders (as opposed to myopic dictators) look for win-win opportunities where their actions are in their own best interest AND in the best interest of their allies. It's not at ALL immaterial. Yes, when push comes to shove you have to look out for #1, but if you can accomplish your goal without causing unnecessary collateral damage to your allies, you do it (because that in itself is in your LONG TERM best interest).

    Some people here seem to think that Israeli leaders wake up every day thinking, "How can I harm the goyim today?" This is the furthest thing from their minds.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Just so we’re clear. You would support Gentile nations imposing limitations on Jewish influence and control (quotas?) in order that the fate of Gentiles in those countries not rest in Jewish hands? Because that seems to be the privilege you support for Jews vis a vis Israel.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    Jews are less than 2% of the US population (and in other Western nations even less). How is it possible that the fate of the West rests in the hands of this tiny minority, except in your paranoid fantasies? Just because mice worry about being trampled by elephants doesn't make it rational for elephants to worry about being trampled by mice.

    Replies: @Byrresheim, @Anonymous

  135. @istevefan
    @Jack D


    If I controlled the whole Western world why would I trade it for a little swatch of dessert in the Middle East?
     
    Because that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East has historic significance for your people. Additionally the current state of affairs allows for Jews to control that little swatch of dessert in the Middle East while benefiting from living in the European world.

    But the Jews already have Israel and don’t need to trade for it.
     
    Just because the Jews already have Israel doesn't mean they always will have it. As you have seen Whites are in the process of losing their lands in the New World, or at the very least of being seriously watered down. Even in Europe itself, Europeans are on a trend that could lead to some of them losing their territory.

    Nothing is settled so long as there are people who are willing to contest the status quo.

    Jews realize this and know they cannot take the future of Israel for granted. So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Johann Ricke

    Jews realize this and know they cannot take the future of Israel for granted. So yes, they will always be open to trading or making alliances or doing whatever is necessary to keep Israel. Whether that is in the best interests of Europeans is immaterial.

    You mean Europeans aren’t open to doing whatever it takes to keep Europe? Is there a single European leader who doesn’t know that admitting tens of millions of Muslim refugees will make the place a lot more anti-semitic? Maybe in their minds, this is a plus, not a minus.

  136. @Mark G.
    @donut

    Living in a country with no property rights is not a Libertarian dream so your comment Somalia is Libertarian is nonsense.

    Replies: @donut

    I don’t think it is . But any way explain to me why you think it is nonsense .

    • Replies: @Mark G.
    @donut

    Somalia would not be an example of libertarianism but it would be an example of a failed state. The basis of libertarianism is that all transactions are voluntary and don't involve the initiation of force. If various clans in Somalia are trying to kill each other off or take each other's property then that would involve non-voluntary transactions. Governments have traditionally used force to benefit the ruler and his followers. Starting with writers like Locke, libertarians have argued that a government is only libertarian if it protects the life, liberty and property of its subjects and that is the only time government force is justified. The form of government isn't what is most important. A democracy where a majority oppresses a minority is no better than a dictator or king oppressing his subjects. Civilization is only really possible where people can be productive and have secure property rights and don't have to worry about what they produce being taken away from them. Various free market or conservative think tanks like Cato, Fraser or Heritage regularly put out rankings of countries based on economic freedom. You usually don't see Somalia even listed on these rankings because you can't rank a government where there is no government. I find it interesting to compare these rankings with country rankings of life expectancy or per capita income. You can usually see a close relationship. Somalia has unfortunately suffered under the oppressive Barre dictatorship followed by a power struggle to replace him which created anarchic conditions. This has retarded the ability of the country to advance economically.

  137. Glad to see Sailer admitting that Jews are white. But the commentariat here remains certain they’re not. That’s the one thing that doesn’t change at Unz.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @ricpic


    Glad to see Sailer admitting that Jews are white. But the commentariat here remains certain they’re not. That’s the one thing that doesn’t change at Unz.
     
    Seeing as Jews claim their nation-state is Israel, the commentariat should be forgiven for its confusion.
  138. “In a world where…” is from the era of original movies in Hollywood. They actually had to set up the premise for you.

    “…and change the world forever” is how today’s Hollywood fluffs their endless remakes for sequels. You already know the “world where” but it’s gonna be different next time, promise.

  139. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @ricpic
    Glad to see Sailer admitting that Jews are white. But the commentariat here remains certain they're not. That's the one thing that doesn't change at Unz.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Glad to see Sailer admitting that Jews are white. But the commentariat here remains certain they’re not. That’s the one thing that doesn’t change at Unz.

    Seeing as Jews claim their nation-state is Israel, the commentariat should be forgiven for its confusion.

  140. @Buzz Mohawk
    That looks like a promo photo for a TV show about a team of anti-heroes.

    The most impressive character is the man in brown leather, who appears ready to punch out the photographer. After he's done, the goon on the left will apply the necessary torture techniques to get whatever they're after.

    The tall man in the ill-fitting Patagonia jacket must be the financier who maintains contacts with "important people," while Spectacles on the right is obviously the fixer who makes the legal problems caused by the two on the left go away.

    Action Team! Coming to NBC on April 9th.

    Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose, @Sean, @Tex, @Hypnotoad666

    The J-Team!

    “Pity the fool” who messes with Israel.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @Hypnotoad666

    Exactly.

  141. @Citizen of a Silly Country
    @Tyrion 2

    It's perfectly rational for Jews to want the West to be multi-everything. Jews are a market dominant minority, i.e. they stick out like a sore thumb. What's safer for such a group: 1) Being 2% of an otherwise homogeneous society or 2) Being just one of many racial/ethnic/religious groups in a society when no single group holds power.

    The push by elite Jews - not a conspiracy, just various actors working independently but for the same goal - to transform the West makes perfect sense. Hell, I'd probably be on board myself if I was Jewish.

    (The growing Muslim population in Europe wasn't the best course, but, hey, you work with what you got. Muslims are nearby so it's tough to keep them out while opening the doors to everyone else.)

    Your unwillingness to acknowledge this reality always fascinates me. The seemingly pathological lack of self-awareness of Jews is amazing. It has to be an evolutionary adaptation. You guys really can't see what you're doing or why it might enrage native populations.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    According to your “logic” Jews want to crowd out their own market niche?

  142. @Hypnotoad666
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The J-Team!

    "Pity the fool" who messes with Israel.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

    Exactly.

  143. @Mr. Anon
    @Tyrion 2


    You guys don’t even do basic self-interrogation, nevermind questioning deeper assumptions…
     
    More projection here. You guys don't seem to do much self-inerrogation as to how the behaviors of your group could be construed as being perceived as anything from insensitive to hostile. Instead, anybody who notices the often disproportionate power of your group, and realizes that said power has consequences to our group, is just dismissed with a strawman argument (as you've done here) or smeared with insults.

    It's a dishonest tactic and people are increasingly beginning to understand it as such.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites’ fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.
     
    You've failed to point out a single clear flaw in the argument. (I encourage you to try.) You claimed an inconsistency that was clearly not there. The rest of your contribution to this thread has consisted of insults and point and sputter.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    , @nebulafox
    @Tyrion 2

    I agree that the idiot blood-and-soil contingent does Unz.com no favors when they are busy making arguments out of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. But for the love of God, you aren't an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two, possibly as a reaction to the anti-Semitic bilge that you sometimes see here.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Mr. Anon

    , @Mr. Anon
    @Tyrion 2


    It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.
     
    Lots of arguments feature here. You are ascribing to all of them your own interpretation of them – i.e., you are constructing strawmen.

    I mean, just look at the replies!
     
    Yeah. There are people disagreeing with you. The effrontery!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites’ fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.
     
    Is it your contention then that there is one People in the World – and only one People – who when acting as a group, or acting in a group-characteristic way, are completely blameless. Always. Forever. In every social transaction, they are never at fault.

    How likely is that?
  144. @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    It says in the Talmud: "If someone comes to kill you, rise up and kill him first". All nations (that are not insane) have a right of self-defense. "Control of their destiny" (your words) is much too vague. Israel will kill or destroy those who pose a great and imminent threat to Jewish lives. The greater the potential threat, the less imminent it has to be (and vice versa). So if you are an Iranian nuclear scientist, I suggest that you switch to agronomy and in the meantime keep watching for motorcyclists in your rearview mirror.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Joe Stalin

    Poor Mr. Bull! Didn’t know the Israeli rules, I’m afraid.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Joe Stalin

    You may not be interested in Israeli rules but Israeli rules are interested in you.

    PS Maybe it was the Israelis, maybe it wasn't.

  145. @Anonymous

    This Zionist vs. Islamist brouhaha exemplifies the massive fundamental problem besetting the Democrats’ coalition of folks who basically hate each other
     
    But there isn't a "massive fundamental problem."

    The Jews are giving Muslims and other POCs a significant share of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and Europe.

    In exchange for Palestine.

    That is a fantastic deal for Muslims and POCs. They get massively greater access to the West's land, females, natural resources, economic wealth, social capital, and political power. At the cost of a tiny piece of marginal land that they barely have any control over anyways.

    Perhaps most importantly, that prying open of access seems to be having the effect of destroying one of the world's most talented racial/ethnic groups. In other words, it destroys a very strong competitor.

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment. Ilhan Omar and others will sooner rather than later come to realize this.

    Replies: @Autochthon, @Tyrion 2, @nebulafox, @Lot, @Jack D, @Counterinsurgency

    The interests of Muslims, POCs, and ethnonationalist Jews are in fact in fundamental alignment.

    Replay of the late AD 1960s, when the Democratic Party allied itself with North Vietnam. It’s an old trick.

    Counterinsurgency

  146. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ibound1
    @Anonymous

    This is an insane strategy
    We don’t need to defend Europe for any reason.
    It’s crushing us with debt while we fail to defend our own border. And all troops in the world can’t stop the Islamification of Europe. 20% of French children born last year had Muslim names.
    We have no defense strategy or posture except to spend money.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    This is an insane strategy
    We don’t need to defend Europe for any reason.
    It’s crushing us with debt while we fail to defend our own border. And all troops in the world can’t stop the Islamification of Europe. 20% of French children born last year had Muslim names.
    We have no defense strategy or posture except to spend money.

    It’s a good strategy for the Jews. It keeps German men emasculated, which in manifold ways leads to porous borders and below-replacement German fertility.

    • Replies: @Ibound1
    @Anonymous

    German men have emasculated themselves. They had children in the 1960s. They stopped. They voted for Merkel - they call her Mutti. They let their society and women be overrun by Muslims. In fact I would say the fact they are so emasculated is the exact reason we should not defend them. I have zero interest in defending people who have no interest in defending themselves.

  147. @Sean
    @Lot


    "Two Banks has the Jordan –

    This is ours and, that is as well."
     
    Yes Jordan knows what limitless ambition is on the the mind of the Israeli right, although their high military is far more conservative tot the extent that they are men of the past. I think Jordan is the linchpin of US policy in the Middle East and that is why the US is mounting such a build up in Jordan, having aready constructed the

    https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/pa4vqz/the-great-wall-of-jordan-how-the-us-wants-to-keep-the-islamic-state-out

    But the Syrian Civil War had the Israeli right secretly expecting an Isis infiltration into Jordan and a civil war there so Israel could have an excuse to intervene, which would have provoked a West Bank revolt. Those circumstances would have meant there could be expulsions without Israel having to do anything to bring the situation about . During the Second Gulf war Israel was asked (maybe by Jordan) for assurances that it would not use the fighting as cover for expulsions. Any hopes that Isis or something like it could destabilize Jordan have been forever dashed.

    However, perhaps it could work another way, supposing Israel staged limited but highly provocative expulsions to inveigle the Arab countries into a war with Israel. In the chaos that followed what was actually happening in the West Bank would be forgotten. Israel could say the Arab population left of its own accord out of fear of the fighting rather like they had in 1948. Trump is the one who might let them do something like that.

    Replies: @Lot

    Thanks for the article about the $500 million border wall we built for Jordan.

  148. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tyrion 2
    @Mr. Anon

    It might not be your argument. I don't know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It's embarrassing.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites' fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @nebulafox, @Mr. Anon

    It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.

    You’ve failed to point out a single clear flaw in the argument. (I encourage you to try.) You claimed an inconsistency that was clearly not there. The rest of your contribution to this thread has consisted of insults and point and sputter.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Anonymous

    What argument?

  149. @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    If that is the case, why can’t they properly take the West Bank? I mean Britain, at points, took Africa from North to South, South Asia, Australasia and North America…
     
    You are usually an astute commentator, but really seem to have your blinders on in this thread.

    They have indeed taken the West Bank. More effectively in fact than many of the British colonies you cite, inasmuch as they are populating it with Jews and draining it of Arabs. And they are doing that population replacement in a way calculated to provoke the least backlash as possible and to prevent, to the extent possible, critics from gaining the moral high ground. In the fullness of time, my friend.

    Replies: @Shmendrix

    “Draining it of Arabs”? Pure fantasy.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Shmendrix


    “Draining it of Arabs”? Pure fantasy.
     
    It's been happening since 1947.
  150. @Anonymous
    @Jack D

    Just so we're clear. You would support Gentile nations imposing limitations on Jewish influence and control (quotas?) in order that the fate of Gentiles in those countries not rest in Jewish hands? Because that seems to be the privilege you support for Jews vis a vis Israel.

    Replies: @Jack D

    Jews are less than 2% of the US population (and in other Western nations even less). How is it possible that the fate of the West rests in the hands of this tiny minority, except in your paranoid fantasies? Just because mice worry about being trampled by elephants doesn’t make it rational for elephants to worry about being trampled by mice.

    • Replies: @Byrresheim
    @Jack D

    Judging by your other comments, you, sir, are a keen self parodist.

    Please let us know the hasbara response to a non hasbarist describing jews as mice.

    That would make for some comic relief, would it not?

    , @Anonymous
    @Jack D

    Don't avoid the question, Jack. Do you support quotas on Jews or their disenfranchisement to safeguard the self-determination of Gentiles in Gentile countries? Your logic as to Israel would seem to lead ineluctably to a justification for such measures.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  151. @Joe Stalin
    @Jack D

    Poor Mr. Bull! Didn't know the Israeli rules, I'm afraid.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwpzLRKe-NE

    Replies: @Jack D

    You may not be interested in Israeli rules but Israeli rules are interested in you.

    PS Maybe it was the Israelis, maybe it wasn’t.

  152. @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    The Israeli gentlemen look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces existential threats would look and the European ladies look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces no existential threats would look. For all the talk of the US assisting Israel, which of these two groups looks like they have spent the last 70 years lounging under an American defense umbrella and which ones look like they are prepared to do their own fighting, personally if necessary? The European ladies look like the Beverly Hills Neighborhood Watch, who can call the REAL police if something actually happens and the Israelis look like Roof Koreans.

    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don't look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe's defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Byrresheim, @nebulafox

    Complete nonsense that flies in the face of even what you should have learned in school if you had actually paid attention, let alone what you know if you are in the least interested in non-propaganda.

    US buyers remorse vis à vis Stalin’s Bolsheviks informed US post war politics, the price for those Bundeswehr Panzerdivisionen was paid by the Germans themselves and they did play a role in keeping the Russians out.

    NATO:
    To keep the Americans in,
    the Russians out
    and the Germans down.

  153. @Debo
    @Jack D

    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader's consciousness as well. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence, does it?

    Israel's modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer. Israel understands that if this were to occur, a fragmented Islamic Middle East has a centripetal cause uniting it, similar to the Pan-Arabism of the 1960's. The key difference being such a conflict will likely rely on asymmetric warfare, playing against Israel's strength (organized army and nuclear deterrence) and playing to the Arab world's strength (willingness to die).

    Such a conflict provides outside powers, like China, an immediate in with petro states, bartering espionage capabilities for oil.

    The only thing that has kept this from happening is a large US presence in the region, Islamic autocracies using oil revenue to placate their people, and an inflammed Sunni/Shiite divide. Remove these three things and Israel is quickly exposed.

    Replies: @Jack D, @nebulafox

    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness as well. Doesn’t exactly inspire confidence, does it?

    Masada would have turned out differently if the Judeans had nuclear missiles and Rome was in range.

    • Replies: @Byrresheim
    @Jack D

    They do have those missiles and Rome is in range. As is Berlin.

    That explains a lot, don't you think?

  154. @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    Jews are less than 2% of the US population (and in other Western nations even less). How is it possible that the fate of the West rests in the hands of this tiny minority, except in your paranoid fantasies? Just because mice worry about being trampled by elephants doesn't make it rational for elephants to worry about being trampled by mice.

    Replies: @Byrresheim, @Anonymous

    Judging by your other comments, you, sir, are a keen self parodist.

    Please let us know the hasbara response to a non hasbarist describing jews as mice.

    That would make for some comic relief, would it not?

  155. @Jack D
    @Debo


    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader’s consciousness as well. Doesn’t exactly inspire confidence, does it?
     
    Masada would have turned out differently if the Judeans had nuclear missiles and Rome was in range.

    Replies: @Byrresheim

    They do have those missiles and Rome is in range. As is Berlin.

    That explains a lot, don’t you think?

  156. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @Anonymous

    Jews are less than 2% of the US population (and in other Western nations even less). How is it possible that the fate of the West rests in the hands of this tiny minority, except in your paranoid fantasies? Just because mice worry about being trampled by elephants doesn't make it rational for elephants to worry about being trampled by mice.

    Replies: @Byrresheim, @Anonymous

    Don’t avoid the question, Jack. Do you support quotas on Jews or their disenfranchisement to safeguard the self-determination of Gentiles in Gentile countries? Your logic as to Israel would seem to lead ineluctably to a justification for such measures.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Anonymous


    @Jack D

    Don’t avoid the question, Jack. Do you support quotas on Jews or their disenfranchisement to safeguard the self-determination of Gentiles in Gentile countries? Your logic as to Israel would seem to lead ineluctably to a justification for such measures.
     
    The answer to your question always amounts to "It's different for us. Because. Reasons." I believe that commenter even stated he was open to tossing the 1st amendment because it might adversely impact his people. Their principles are sacrosanct. Ours are negotiable.
  157. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Shmendrix
    @Anonymous

    "Draining it of Arabs"? Pure fantasy.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    “Draining it of Arabs”? Pure fantasy.

    It’s been happening since 1947.

  158. It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.

    Lots of arguments feature here. You are ascribing to all of them your own interpretation of them – i.e., you are constructing strawmen.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Yeah. There are people disagreeing with you. The effrontery!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites’ fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    Is it your contention then that there is one People in the World – and only one People – who when acting as a group, or acting in a group-characteristic way, are completely blameless. Always. Forever. In every social transaction, they are never at fault.

    How likely is that?

  159. @Anonymous
    @Jack D

    Don't avoid the question, Jack. Do you support quotas on Jews or their disenfranchisement to safeguard the self-determination of Gentiles in Gentile countries? Your logic as to Israel would seem to lead ineluctably to a justification for such measures.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Don’t avoid the question, Jack. Do you support quotas on Jews or their disenfranchisement to safeguard the self-determination of Gentiles in Gentile countries? Your logic as to Israel would seem to lead ineluctably to a justification for such measures.

    The answer to your question always amounts to “It’s different for us. Because. Reasons.” I believe that commenter even stated he was open to tossing the 1st amendment because it might adversely impact his people. Their principles are sacrosanct. Ours are negotiable.

  160. @Lot
    @IHTG

    Was not an exit poll. And I remembered wrong, it was 58% Trump.

    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-826WyC8TrOs/WM18ROZPWEI/AAAAAAAAET4/3zwENmcdA-IYH-caYqX6YInWTXFkHr4mgCEw/s1600/5.png

    This is from Audacious Epigone’s writeup of the poll.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Was not an exit poll. And I remembered wrong, it was 58% Trump.

    Is that 59% those who identify religiously or ethnically?

    The overall jewish vote in 2016 was 70% for the Democrat, which is about what it always is.

    https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/clinton-won-majority-of-jewish-american-vote-polls-say-1.5459522

    In fact, Trump got a smaller share of that vote than Romney did.

    • Replies: @IHTG
    @Mr. Anon

    Considering Trump's general underperformance with all college-educated suburban whites, he probably still did relatively well with Jews. Compare the Trump-Romney numbers with George W Bush's 19 years ago.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  161. @Whiskey
    Muslims in the West has been disastrous for Jews. Britain and France went from allies building their nuke force and jointly invading Egypt to very hostile with their own nukes.

    Jews have been purged out of Paris and the Riviera. Both very nice places. Much of Israel is not very nice.

    There is too much nazi larping here. Diaspora Jews got high on hopium and believed their own bs in a desperate attempt to stay as they are. Educated urban professionals unable and unwilling to grasp the reality that only nationalism backed by hard military force keeps 6 billion hostile non Whites from killing you and taking your stuff.

    Here in the US Jews are being expelled from Hollywood via metoo and in politics and media by non Whites who hate them. Jews are no different than stupid boomer Cucks who get high on hopium. It's the same thing. Extreme atomization encourages hopium addiction. People need meaning to their lives and military heritage fighting is too hard for urbanites.

    Would you jump out of airplanes?

    Re Bibi reckless its common in a Israeli because of the small size and lack of strategic depth. Aggressive stuff to play off lack of men and space

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    There is too much nazi larping here.

    There is hardly any on the iSteve site.

    I remember however that you used to go in for a lot of scots-irish larping, until it became obvious that you didn’t even know what the term means. So you dropped it from your patter, and now just stick to your weird brand of passive-agressive hasbara propaganda.

  162. @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    The Israeli gentlemen look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces existential threats would look and the European ladies look like the way you would expect the leaders of a nation that faces no existential threats would look. For all the talk of the US assisting Israel, which of these two groups looks like they have spent the last 70 years lounging under an American defense umbrella and which ones look like they are prepared to do their own fighting, personally if necessary? The European ladies look like the Beverly Hills Neighborhood Watch, who can call the REAL police if something actually happens and the Israelis look like Roof Koreans.

    I for one am GLAD that German military leaders don't look like hard men who would not hesitate to tear your fingernails out. I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe's defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Byrresheim, @nebulafox

    > I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    I think we could have had today’s state of affairs with a lot less death and destruction, and a more psychologically healthy and productive Europe if it wasn’t in part for the neocons of 1917. All without the US footing the bill.

    The EU today is more or less the German dominated entity that would have been the end result if the US didn’t intervene in WWI and the Western Front had ended in some kind of compromise deal-as it would have had to eventually without US intervention. Had that happened: probably no Bolsheviks, definitely no Fascism, and Adolf Hitler would have died as the embittered, probably somewhat autistic loser (I know what I’m talking about) at society’s fringes he really was, assuming he doesn’t preferably just get his in the trenches in this timeline.

    Needless to say, without WWII as we know it, none of the nonsense that has effected Europe for the past several decades would exist.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @nebulafox

    I agree that WWI was the pivot point. 300 years from now, the Chinese history book writers (there won't be any other kind) will point to it as the beginning of the end for Western Civilization. Not only was the war itself botched but the peace was too. But that's all water under the bridge - we have no time machine to redo it. From the perspective of 1945, the question on the mind of Truman and Stalin was, "How do we prevent Germany from starting WWIII?" And the answer was a 50+ year occupation and a defanged Germany where young boys yearn to be folk singers instead of getting their dueling scars. This occupation was expensive for the occupying powers (perhaps broke the USSR)* but not without its benefits, the #1 of which was that it worked and there was no WWIII.


    *I think it is hilarious that folks here are so excited over the piddling few billion of military aid that goes to Israel (since it is sent in kind, the $ gets recycled right back into the US economy) but ignore the fact that what makes it possible for all those Aryan nations to have "defense ministers" who look like fashion models is the trillions that the US has spent on making it possible for them to treat defense as a joke. Not that I would want it any other way.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Johann Ricke

  163. @Debo
    @Jack D

    Masada is also burned into every Israeli leader's consciousness as well. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence, does it?

    Israel's modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer. Israel understands that if this were to occur, a fragmented Islamic Middle East has a centripetal cause uniting it, similar to the Pan-Arabism of the 1960's. The key difference being such a conflict will likely rely on asymmetric warfare, playing against Israel's strength (organized army and nuclear deterrence) and playing to the Arab world's strength (willingness to die).

    Such a conflict provides outside powers, like China, an immediate in with petro states, bartering espionage capabilities for oil.

    The only thing that has kept this from happening is a large US presence in the region, Islamic autocracies using oil revenue to placate their people, and an inflammed Sunni/Shiite divide. Remove these three things and Israel is quickly exposed.

    Replies: @Jack D, @nebulafox

    >Israel’s modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer.

    Not true at all these days. Most Middle Eastern governments that used to want to drive the Jews into the sea might not have affection for Israel, but they’ve come to accept it. Ironically enough, the exceptions back then have become the exceptions now, most notably Iran, which has historically been a rather philo-Semitic place from Cyrus to the Pahlavis.

    Outside of Western Europe (and Poland because Bibi through a hissy-fit about Warsaw quite reasonably refusing to kiss Israeli ass on historical narratives), Israel has never been more secure than it has been over the past decade. Russia and India have governments latently ideologically sympathetic to Likud, relations with China are just fine-most Chinese I’ve met have a very positive, if not PC, opinion of Jews. Syria, Libya, and Iraq have ceased to exist for all intents and purposes, the cold peaces with Egypt and Jordan still hold, and the Sauds are now tacit allies.

    This is way better than things were in 1973. Israel doesn’t have to care about what Brussels thinks anymore, and due to changed demographics, there’s little political incentive for Israeli politicians to care. The US isn’t near as ignorable, obviously, but nor is it as indispensable as it was during the 1970s.

    • Replies: @ATBOTL
    @nebulafox

    The governments who are friendly to Israel are all American backed dictators. A Democratic Arab world will see Israel like Iran does.

  164. @Anonymous
    @Tyrion 2


    It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.
     
    You've failed to point out a single clear flaw in the argument. (I encourage you to try.) You claimed an inconsistency that was clearly not there. The rest of your contribution to this thread has consisted of insults and point and sputter.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    What argument?

  165. @Tyrion 2
    @Mr. Anon

    It might not be your argument. I don't know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It's embarrassing.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites' fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @nebulafox, @Mr. Anon

    I agree that the idiot blood-and-soil contingent does Unz.com no favors when they are busy making arguments out of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. But for the love of God, you aren’t an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two, possibly as a reaction to the anti-Semitic bilge that you sometimes see here.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @nebulafox


    But for the love of God, you aren’t an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two
     
    Your statement here is made up of two parts. The first is obviously true.

    The second may also be true, but it is rather lost in the deluge of "Israel is the apex of evil","Jews control my mind" comments.

    And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn't, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don't see it. Israel's behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    From back when the London Evening Standard was a serious right of centre newspaper and not a free sheet:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/the-secret-report-at-heart-of-bbc-s-gaza-paranoia-6870301.html

    *I don't have an explanation for the financial aid piece. It seems like a hangover from the cold war that has taken on a life of its own, like NATO, or Russophobia. Government has a weird way of doing that. Just last year the UK was found to still be giving foreign aid to China.

    Replies: @Jack D, @nebulafox

    , @Mr. Anon
    @nebulafox


    There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two, possibly as a reaction to the anti-Semitic bilge that you sometimes see here.
     
    No, they do it because they find it tactically useful. My advice to you is that you should stop taking their side. Take your own side instead.
  166. @Mr. Anon
    @Lot


    Was not an exit poll. And I remembered wrong, it was 58% Trump.
     
    Is that 59% those who identify religiously or ethnically?

    The overall jewish vote in 2016 was 70% for the Democrat, which is about what it always is.

    https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/clinton-won-majority-of-jewish-american-vote-polls-say-1.5459522

    In fact, Trump got a smaller share of that vote than Romney did.

    Replies: @IHTG

    Considering Trump’s general underperformance with all college-educated suburban whites, he probably still did relatively well with Jews. Compare the Trump-Romney numbers with George W Bush’s 19 years ago.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @IHTG

    He did pretty much the same as any other Republican - no more than 30%. It's one of those fundmental constants of American politics. Jews are a Democratic Party voting block.

  167. @nebulafox
    @Tyrion 2

    I agree that the idiot blood-and-soil contingent does Unz.com no favors when they are busy making arguments out of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. But for the love of God, you aren't an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two, possibly as a reaction to the anti-Semitic bilge that you sometimes see here.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Mr. Anon

    But for the love of God, you aren’t an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two

    Your statement here is made up of two parts. The first is obviously true.

    The second may also be true, but it is rather lost in the deluge of “Israel is the apex of evil”,”Jews control my mind” comments.

    And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn’t, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don’t see it. Israel’s behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    From back when the London Evening Standard was a serious right of centre newspaper and not a free sheet:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/the-secret-report-at-heart-of-bbc-s-gaza-paranoia-6870301.html

    *I don’t have an explanation for the financial aid piece. It seems like a hangover from the cold war that has taken on a life of its own, like NATO, or Russophobia. Government has a weird way of doing that. Just last year the UK was found to still be giving foreign aid to China.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Tyrion 2

    Link not working. I don't have any explanation for why the world is so obsessed with Joos. Half the resolutions ever passed by the UN concern Joos although there are a hundred other places with vastly worse human rights issues. Something about the Holy Land captures the imagination in a way that Tajikistan and the Congo do not. You see it here on isteve - any post that involves Joos has 4x the comments of any post on any other subject.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @nebulafox
    @Tyrion 2

    >The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don’t see it. Israel’s behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Unlike in Europe, though, the anti-Israel people do not hold much in the way of practical power. That's going to possibly change in the coming decades. The left-wing in the US is indeed becoming more like Europe: and that includes the changing attitude to Israel. Once Schumer and Company die off, I expect the US Left to be a lot more openly pro-Palestinian, especially as Israel gets ever more right-wing for its own reasons. But the right-wing in the US is a different story. Have you ever watched a GOP debate when Israel is discussed? We've gotten to the point where when Donald Trump's attitude-whom no one can seriously accuse of being anti-Semitic, let alone anti-Israeli-was deemed insufficiently deferential, and Rubio and Cruz spend the next hour bending over backwards over who could praise Israel more. Even supporters of Israel, which is most of the GOP base, can find this more than a little tiring-especially when it is implied that America might end up in another Middle East conflict. The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi's behest really, really hurt him.

    It gets a little frustrating when you keep seeing your so-called "conservative" politicians more actively defend the interests of another country rather than your own.

    >And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn’t, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    Hey, I call things how I see them, on this topic as much as any other. Since I don't see much of a point in talking to commentators who seriously believe Da Joos Duh Great Evil, and as I myself am not Jewish and am mostly indifferent to Israel, do not find much of an emotional impulse to rebut them, in the context of iSteve's foreign policy discussions, I usually get in the Buchananist camp of questioning the "special relationship" with Israel: and questioning why we didn't de-militarize in general when the USSR collapsed and there was no further need.

    I happen to believe that Israeli behavior is not particularly noxious on global standards, and I've found that Israelis are far more rational and down-to-earth in discussing their country than Americans tend to be. Israel has a right to pursue their national interests like anyone else, and I don't begrudge Israelis for fighting for their team. I appreciate that it is a highly liberal, successful place (a rarity in that region) that treats loyal Arabs better than most Arab countries do, and there is something of a double standard from the post-1960s Left on Israel vs. the Palestinians. I believe the Palestinians are screwed, to put it bluntly, and that pro-Palestinian activists in the West are just prolonging their misery and making their lot worse by allowing them to have any hope in meaningful assistance from abroad. If the alt-right were smarter, they'd court Israel, not attack it. I do not think American Jews are at the head of some organized conspiracy, nor do I think they are a hive mind: most post-Soviet Jews who emigrated here in the 1990s have views that would make Pat Buchanan blush. I know that left-wing American Jews-at least those my age-tend to see Israel as more of an embarassment than anything else, which is part of why I'm convinced the days of the Six Day War boosting Democrat are coming to a close. The people who really support Israel in the US are white, evangelical Christians. I've repeatedly pointed out that European Jews are fully connected to the reality that in the 21st Century, the real anti-Semitic threats are going to come from Muslims, not white gentiles: to say nothing of the Israelis.

    I also happen to also believe that Israel's over-the-top influence on Capitol Hill is a deeply negative thing for American interests that nobody in the MSM, let alone FOX News, has the balls to discuss due not least to an intimidatory atmosphere set up by AIPAC and its ilk. I think a more normal, for lack of a better word, relationship between the US and Israel would benefit both countries in the long run. I believe that in a saner world, Netanyahu would have been chased out of town on a rail rather than applauded for daring to try and interfere with American state policy, whatever the merits of Obama's deal-and that he has serious chutzpah for implying that America has no moral right to deal with Iran, considering Israel's dealings with China and Russia. As for the US, American Jews, on average, tend to be very left-wing, and have a very, very tiresome and hypocritical persecution complex that unfortunately the rest of us have to deal with, considering disproprationate Jewish influence in the media. American Jews are not victims, end of story. If anything, they are far more "privileged" than any other ethnic group-and I think their grandparents earned it, often over quite real discrimination. Just look at the legions of brilliant Jewish scientists in academia-they were the Asians of their day. But nevertheless, modern America is probably the least anti-Semitic place that has a major Jewish minority, and a lot of American Jews are going to have a rude awakening in for them when they discover that America's newer citizens view them as the whitest of all whites rather than fellow oppressed "allies".

    And yes, Israel is *notorious* in the intelligence community for its activity against the USA. My father is about as pro-Israel as it gets: hard-right wing Christian former officer, deeply admires everything about them. But he'll bluntly tell you about incessant, aggressive Israeli efforts to convince him to give over sensitive material, and why you never let the Israelis-very cheerful guys who understand that it was just business, nothing personal-out of their "minders" sights for a second. They don't even have to be circumspect about it, unlike the Chinese or Russians, because there are a lot of clowns in the Beltway who insist that Israel can do no wrong and that US and Israeli interests are identical.

    That's the surface level-complicated issues be complicated. Agree and disagree with what you will.

    (I treat Islam the same way, for what it is worth. I am no scholar, but I am generally familiar with the theology and history. More importantly, though, I've lived with Muslim roommates and have had Muslim friends, I've lived in Muslim countries, and have had sex with/dated Muslim women. I know them as people enough to understand that the modern Left/media's concern with "Islamophobia" over radical Islam is obnoxiously flatulant at best and-especially in Europe-actively dangerous at worst. I also believe that Islamic societies, on average, tend to be pretty messed up places that I wouldn't want to live in for long, and I definitely know for a fact that most run-of-the-mill Muslims in the Islamic World-I'm not talking Dr. Khan the successful doctor and his kids who drink on the down-low at college-tend to hold beliefs that Western liberals would find deeply shocking, to say the least, especially when it concerns Jews, atheism, or feminism. But I also know that most of these people also aren't demonic monsters seething with hatred for all things infidel, and on closer inspection, tend to be ordinary human beings: for better or for worse, as ordinary human beings can be hateful, violent, hypocritical, and tribal. I know that, having much more skin in the game than most Westerners, some of them are willing to state blunt truths about jihadis or the Sauds or the dangers of importing millions of low-IQ young Mirpuri men than you won't see Western bien-pensants in the press saying any time soon. And just like any other religion, culture drives the faith, not the other way around.)

    >Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    Indeed. As I've mentioned, European Jews tend to be a lot more connected to reality than American Jews thanks to the realities of mass Muslim underclass immigration in Europe.

    Just as my background as an American shapes mine. I once attended a school that flew the Israeli flag next to the American and Texan ones and grew up with FOX News on 24/7, with that type of constant over-the-top adulation of Israel that most Israelis privately find a little weird.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Tyrion 2

  168. @Anonymous
    @Ibound1


    This is an insane strategy
    We don’t need to defend Europe for any reason.
    It’s crushing us with debt while we fail to defend our own border. And all troops in the world can’t stop the Islamification of Europe. 20% of French children born last year had Muslim names.
    We have no defense strategy or posture except to spend money.
     
    It's a good strategy for the Jews. It keeps German men emasculated, which in manifold ways leads to porous borders and below-replacement German fertility.

    Replies: @Ibound1

    German men have emasculated themselves. They had children in the 1960s. They stopped. They voted for Merkel – they call her Mutti. They let their society and women be overrun by Muslims. In fact I would say the fact they are so emasculated is the exact reason we should not defend them. I have zero interest in defending people who have no interest in defending themselves.

  169. @Tyrion 2
    @nebulafox


    But for the love of God, you aren’t an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two
     
    Your statement here is made up of two parts. The first is obviously true.

    The second may also be true, but it is rather lost in the deluge of "Israel is the apex of evil","Jews control my mind" comments.

    And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn't, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don't see it. Israel's behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    From back when the London Evening Standard was a serious right of centre newspaper and not a free sheet:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/the-secret-report-at-heart-of-bbc-s-gaza-paranoia-6870301.html

    *I don't have an explanation for the financial aid piece. It seems like a hangover from the cold war that has taken on a life of its own, like NATO, or Russophobia. Government has a weird way of doing that. Just last year the UK was found to still be giving foreign aid to China.

    Replies: @Jack D, @nebulafox

    Link not working. I don’t have any explanation for why the world is so obsessed with Joos. Half the resolutions ever passed by the UN concern Joos although there are a hundred other places with vastly worse human rights issues. Something about the Holy Land captures the imagination in a way that Tajikistan and the Congo do not. You see it here on isteve – any post that involves Joos has 4x the comments of any post on any other subject.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    I don’t have any explanation for why the world is so obsessed with Jews.
     
    Maybe the world is onto something.
  170. @donut
    @Mark G.

    I don't think it is . But any way explain to me why you think it is nonsense .

    Replies: @Mark G.

    Somalia would not be an example of libertarianism but it would be an example of a failed state. The basis of libertarianism is that all transactions are voluntary and don’t involve the initiation of force. If various clans in Somalia are trying to kill each other off or take each other’s property then that would involve non-voluntary transactions. Governments have traditionally used force to benefit the ruler and his followers. Starting with writers like Locke, libertarians have argued that a government is only libertarian if it protects the life, liberty and property of its subjects and that is the only time government force is justified. The form of government isn’t what is most important. A democracy where a majority oppresses a minority is no better than a dictator or king oppressing his subjects. Civilization is only really possible where people can be productive and have secure property rights and don’t have to worry about what they produce being taken away from them. Various free market or conservative think tanks like Cato, Fraser or Heritage regularly put out rankings of countries based on economic freedom. You usually don’t see Somalia even listed on these rankings because you can’t rank a government where there is no government. I find it interesting to compare these rankings with country rankings of life expectancy or per capita income. You can usually see a close relationship. Somalia has unfortunately suffered under the oppressive Barre dictatorship followed by a power struggle to replace him which created anarchic conditions. This has retarded the ability of the country to advance economically.

  171. @Tyrion 2
    @nebulafox


    But for the love of God, you aren’t an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two
     
    Your statement here is made up of two parts. The first is obviously true.

    The second may also be true, but it is rather lost in the deluge of "Israel is the apex of evil","Jews control my mind" comments.

    And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn't, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don't see it. Israel's behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    From back when the London Evening Standard was a serious right of centre newspaper and not a free sheet:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/the-secret-report-at-heart-of-bbc-s-gaza-paranoia-6870301.html

    *I don't have an explanation for the financial aid piece. It seems like a hangover from the cold war that has taken on a life of its own, like NATO, or Russophobia. Government has a weird way of doing that. Just last year the UK was found to still be giving foreign aid to China.

    Replies: @Jack D, @nebulafox

    >The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don’t see it. Israel’s behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Unlike in Europe, though, the anti-Israel people do not hold much in the way of practical power. That’s going to possibly change in the coming decades. The left-wing in the US is indeed becoming more like Europe: and that includes the changing attitude to Israel. Once Schumer and Company die off, I expect the US Left to be a lot more openly pro-Palestinian, especially as Israel gets ever more right-wing for its own reasons. But the right-wing in the US is a different story. Have you ever watched a GOP debate when Israel is discussed? We’ve gotten to the point where when Donald Trump’s attitude-whom no one can seriously accuse of being anti-Semitic, let alone anti-Israeli-was deemed insufficiently deferential, and Rubio and Cruz spend the next hour bending over backwards over who could praise Israel more. Even supporters of Israel, which is most of the GOP base, can find this more than a little tiring-especially when it is implied that America might end up in another Middle East conflict. The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi’s behest really, really hurt him.

    It gets a little frustrating when you keep seeing your so-called “conservative” politicians more actively defend the interests of another country rather than your own.

    >And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn’t, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    Hey, I call things how I see them, on this topic as much as any other. Since I don’t see much of a point in talking to commentators who seriously believe Da Joos Duh Great Evil, and as I myself am not Jewish and am mostly indifferent to Israel, do not find much of an emotional impulse to rebut them, in the context of iSteve’s foreign policy discussions, I usually get in the Buchananist camp of questioning the “special relationship” with Israel: and questioning why we didn’t de-militarize in general when the USSR collapsed and there was no further need.

    I happen to believe that Israeli behavior is not particularly noxious on global standards, and I’ve found that Israelis are far more rational and down-to-earth in discussing their country than Americans tend to be. Israel has a right to pursue their national interests like anyone else, and I don’t begrudge Israelis for fighting for their team. I appreciate that it is a highly liberal, successful place (a rarity in that region) that treats loyal Arabs better than most Arab countries do, and there is something of a double standard from the post-1960s Left on Israel vs. the Palestinians. I believe the Palestinians are screwed, to put it bluntly, and that pro-Palestinian activists in the West are just prolonging their misery and making their lot worse by allowing them to have any hope in meaningful assistance from abroad. If the alt-right were smarter, they’d court Israel, not attack it. I do not think American Jews are at the head of some organized conspiracy, nor do I think they are a hive mind: most post-Soviet Jews who emigrated here in the 1990s have views that would make Pat Buchanan blush. I know that left-wing American Jews-at least those my age-tend to see Israel as more of an embarassment than anything else, which is part of why I’m convinced the days of the Six Day War boosting Democrat are coming to a close. The people who really support Israel in the US are white, evangelical Christians. I’ve repeatedly pointed out that European Jews are fully connected to the reality that in the 21st Century, the real anti-Semitic threats are going to come from Muslims, not white gentiles: to say nothing of the Israelis.

    I also happen to also believe that Israel’s over-the-top influence on Capitol Hill is a deeply negative thing for American interests that nobody in the MSM, let alone FOX News, has the balls to discuss due not least to an intimidatory atmosphere set up by AIPAC and its ilk. I think a more normal, for lack of a better word, relationship between the US and Israel would benefit both countries in the long run. I believe that in a saner world, Netanyahu would have been chased out of town on a rail rather than applauded for daring to try and interfere with American state policy, whatever the merits of Obama’s deal-and that he has serious chutzpah for implying that America has no moral right to deal with Iran, considering Israel’s dealings with China and Russia. As for the US, American Jews, on average, tend to be very left-wing, and have a very, very tiresome and hypocritical persecution complex that unfortunately the rest of us have to deal with, considering disproprationate Jewish influence in the media. American Jews are not victims, end of story. If anything, they are far more “privileged” than any other ethnic group-and I think their grandparents earned it, often over quite real discrimination. Just look at the legions of brilliant Jewish scientists in academia-they were the Asians of their day. But nevertheless, modern America is probably the least anti-Semitic place that has a major Jewish minority, and a lot of American Jews are going to have a rude awakening in for them when they discover that America’s newer citizens view them as the whitest of all whites rather than fellow oppressed “allies”.

    And yes, Israel is *notorious* in the intelligence community for its activity against the USA. My father is about as pro-Israel as it gets: hard-right wing Christian former officer, deeply admires everything about them. But he’ll bluntly tell you about incessant, aggressive Israeli efforts to convince him to give over sensitive material, and why you never let the Israelis-very cheerful guys who understand that it was just business, nothing personal-out of their “minders” sights for a second. They don’t even have to be circumspect about it, unlike the Chinese or Russians, because there are a lot of clowns in the Beltway who insist that Israel can do no wrong and that US and Israeli interests are identical.

    That’s the surface level-complicated issues be complicated. Agree and disagree with what you will.

    (I treat Islam the same way, for what it is worth. I am no scholar, but I am generally familiar with the theology and history. More importantly, though, I’ve lived with Muslim roommates and have had Muslim friends, I’ve lived in Muslim countries, and have had sex with/dated Muslim women. I know them as people enough to understand that the modern Left/media’s concern with “Islamophobia” over radical Islam is obnoxiously flatulant at best and-especially in Europe-actively dangerous at worst. I also believe that Islamic societies, on average, tend to be pretty messed up places that I wouldn’t want to live in for long, and I definitely know for a fact that most run-of-the-mill Muslims in the Islamic World-I’m not talking Dr. Khan the successful doctor and his kids who drink on the down-low at college-tend to hold beliefs that Western liberals would find deeply shocking, to say the least, especially when it concerns Jews, atheism, or feminism. But I also know that most of these people also aren’t demonic monsters seething with hatred for all things infidel, and on closer inspection, tend to be ordinary human beings: for better or for worse, as ordinary human beings can be hateful, violent, hypocritical, and tribal. I know that, having much more skin in the game than most Westerners, some of them are willing to state blunt truths about jihadis or the Sauds or the dangers of importing millions of low-IQ young Mirpuri men than you won’t see Western bien-pensants in the press saying any time soon. And just like any other religion, culture drives the faith, not the other way around.)

    >Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    Indeed. As I’ve mentioned, European Jews tend to be a lot more connected to reality than American Jews thanks to the realities of mass Muslim underclass immigration in Europe.

    Just as my background as an American shapes mine. I once attended a school that flew the Israeli flag next to the American and Texan ones and grew up with FOX News on 24/7, with that type of constant over-the-top adulation of Israel that most Israelis privately find a little weird.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @nebulafox


    The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi’s behest really, really hurt him.
     
    I doubt this. I don't think that most Americans had that perception to begin with and even if they did, most people who were inclined to vote for Romney anyway are also down with any foreign wars that our leadership tells us are necessary. Right wing isolationism is just not a popular position in the US outside of unz.com. Don't confuse the way that you feel personally with the perceptions of the average Republican voter. Around here, neocon is a dirty word but among mainstream Republicans they are not really discredited. I think that if you find yourself agreeing with Ilhan Omar a little too often that should maybe cause you to rethink whether you are really right because it's hard to believe that she is right about anything.

    Replies: @nebulafox

    , @Tyrion 2
    @nebulafox

    Thank you for your considered post. I don't absolutely agree with it but my differences with it are of opinion on exactly how big each effect is (quantity) bit any particular qualitative statement. In other words, I can see your post being true.


    I also happen to also believe that Israel’s over-the-top influence on Capitol Hill is a deeply negative thing for American interests that nobody in the MSM, let alone FOX News, has the balls to discuss due not least to an intimidatory atmosphere set up by AIPAC and its ilk
     
    In what way? From a realpolitik perspective, Israel seems pretty useful to the US. Certainly Israel gets more than it gives, but the relationship is not only one way. I mean how much did those bases in Germany cost to run, and yet, for decades in the Middle East, there was a force capable of holding its own in the Cold War on the US side. Previously there was also Iran but that fell to something else entirely in '79.

    I also get that some might blame Arab Nationalism's alignment with the USSR on Israel but I imagine that'd be a long and complicated counter-factual debate. I'd suggest that, given what happens with similar movements in Africa, this was not the case.

    Now I'm more of "the world is too complicated better not to touch it and instead build a big wall" kind of person, but I wouldn't say Israel is why America engages in world management. There are endless conflicts that America tries to shape and influence that have nothing to do with Israel.
  172. @nebulafox
    @Jack D

    > I suppose that 70 years of carrying Europe’s defense budget is a small price to pay for preventing the Germans from starting a third world war.

    I think we could have had today's state of affairs with a lot less death and destruction, and a more psychologically healthy and productive Europe if it wasn't in part for the neocons of 1917. All without the US footing the bill.

    The EU today is more or less the German dominated entity that would have been the end result if the US didn't intervene in WWI and the Western Front had ended in some kind of compromise deal-as it would have had to eventually without US intervention. Had that happened: probably no Bolsheviks, definitely no Fascism, and Adolf Hitler would have died as the embittered, probably somewhat autistic loser (I know what I'm talking about) at society's fringes he really was, assuming he doesn't preferably just get his in the trenches in this timeline.

    Needless to say, without WWII as we know it, none of the nonsense that has effected Europe for the past several decades would exist.

    Replies: @Jack D

    I agree that WWI was the pivot point. 300 years from now, the Chinese history book writers (there won’t be any other kind) will point to it as the beginning of the end for Western Civilization. Not only was the war itself botched but the peace was too. But that’s all water under the bridge – we have no time machine to redo it. From the perspective of 1945, the question on the mind of Truman and Stalin was, “How do we prevent Germany from starting WWIII?” And the answer was a 50+ year occupation and a defanged Germany where young boys yearn to be folk singers instead of getting their dueling scars. This occupation was expensive for the occupying powers (perhaps broke the USSR)* but not without its benefits, the #1 of which was that it worked and there was no WWIII.

    *I think it is hilarious that folks here are so excited over the piddling few billion of military aid that goes to Israel (since it is sent in kind, the $ gets recycled right back into the US economy) but ignore the fact that what makes it possible for all those Aryan nations to have “defense ministers” who look like fashion models is the trillions that the US has spent on making it possible for them to treat defense as a joke. Not that I would want it any other way.

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Jack D


    *I think it is hilarious that folks here are so excited over the piddling few billion of military aid that goes to Israel (since it is sent in kind, the $ gets recycled right back into the US economy)
     
    This is an oft repeated lie. Israel is permitted to spend up to about a quarter of that money on procurement from Israeli companies. In any event, it is still money given outright to a foreign nation - money that they were going to spend anyway which now frees up other money for them to use on other things. It is no less a gift.

    And how long to you expect this gift to continue? In perpetuity? AIPAC would like the military subsidy to increase, and they might well get their wish. Factor in the money the U.S. has spent on wars in the middle east over the last twenty years - wars that benefit Israel, not the people of the U.S. - and we'll be approaching the amount the U.S. has spend on NATO.

    America has already spent plenty on Israel, in blood and treasure.
    , @Johann Ricke
    @Jack D


    I agree that WWI was the pivot point. 300 years from now, the Chinese history book writers (there won’t be any other kind) will point to it as the beginning of the end for Western Civilization. Not only was the war itself botched but the peace was too.
     
    Barbara Tuchman's interpretation has become holy writ for some strange reason perhaps related to Keynes's canonization as an economic and geopolitical genius. While the Chinese perspective is likely to be that the West erred in not striving for total victory, it would also hold that the peace was insufficiently harsh.

    Assuming Britain and France lacked the will to sacrifice its young men at the rate they were lost during the war, the aim of Versailles should have been to cripple the German war machine until Germany was literally helpless. At that point, the perspective from actual Chinese history is that Britain and France should have invaded again, killed the entire leadership and massacred some or most of Germany's army. A viable alternative would have been to send a good chunk of Germany's elites and soldiery into exile in their African and Asian holdings to consolidate the metropole's grip on those lands, while nipping in the bud nascent Independence movements there.

    The real bottom line is that the Chinese perspective is very different from anything a Westerner might dream up, because they think in dynastic terms and these are expected to last centuries. And a big part of that perspective is that anything that fails to literally obviate an aggressive enemy's leadership and soldiery, either via execution or exile, is an invitation for problems in the near future.
  173. Anonymous[327] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @Tyrion 2

    Link not working. I don't have any explanation for why the world is so obsessed with Joos. Half the resolutions ever passed by the UN concern Joos although there are a hundred other places with vastly worse human rights issues. Something about the Holy Land captures the imagination in a way that Tajikistan and the Congo do not. You see it here on isteve - any post that involves Joos has 4x the comments of any post on any other subject.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    I don’t have any explanation for why the world is so obsessed with Jews.

    Maybe the world is onto something.

  174. @nebulafox
    @Tyrion 2

    >The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don’t see it. Israel’s behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Unlike in Europe, though, the anti-Israel people do not hold much in the way of practical power. That's going to possibly change in the coming decades. The left-wing in the US is indeed becoming more like Europe: and that includes the changing attitude to Israel. Once Schumer and Company die off, I expect the US Left to be a lot more openly pro-Palestinian, especially as Israel gets ever more right-wing for its own reasons. But the right-wing in the US is a different story. Have you ever watched a GOP debate when Israel is discussed? We've gotten to the point where when Donald Trump's attitude-whom no one can seriously accuse of being anti-Semitic, let alone anti-Israeli-was deemed insufficiently deferential, and Rubio and Cruz spend the next hour bending over backwards over who could praise Israel more. Even supporters of Israel, which is most of the GOP base, can find this more than a little tiring-especially when it is implied that America might end up in another Middle East conflict. The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi's behest really, really hurt him.

    It gets a little frustrating when you keep seeing your so-called "conservative" politicians more actively defend the interests of another country rather than your own.

    >And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn’t, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    Hey, I call things how I see them, on this topic as much as any other. Since I don't see much of a point in talking to commentators who seriously believe Da Joos Duh Great Evil, and as I myself am not Jewish and am mostly indifferent to Israel, do not find much of an emotional impulse to rebut them, in the context of iSteve's foreign policy discussions, I usually get in the Buchananist camp of questioning the "special relationship" with Israel: and questioning why we didn't de-militarize in general when the USSR collapsed and there was no further need.

    I happen to believe that Israeli behavior is not particularly noxious on global standards, and I've found that Israelis are far more rational and down-to-earth in discussing their country than Americans tend to be. Israel has a right to pursue their national interests like anyone else, and I don't begrudge Israelis for fighting for their team. I appreciate that it is a highly liberal, successful place (a rarity in that region) that treats loyal Arabs better than most Arab countries do, and there is something of a double standard from the post-1960s Left on Israel vs. the Palestinians. I believe the Palestinians are screwed, to put it bluntly, and that pro-Palestinian activists in the West are just prolonging their misery and making their lot worse by allowing them to have any hope in meaningful assistance from abroad. If the alt-right were smarter, they'd court Israel, not attack it. I do not think American Jews are at the head of some organized conspiracy, nor do I think they are a hive mind: most post-Soviet Jews who emigrated here in the 1990s have views that would make Pat Buchanan blush. I know that left-wing American Jews-at least those my age-tend to see Israel as more of an embarassment than anything else, which is part of why I'm convinced the days of the Six Day War boosting Democrat are coming to a close. The people who really support Israel in the US are white, evangelical Christians. I've repeatedly pointed out that European Jews are fully connected to the reality that in the 21st Century, the real anti-Semitic threats are going to come from Muslims, not white gentiles: to say nothing of the Israelis.

    I also happen to also believe that Israel's over-the-top influence on Capitol Hill is a deeply negative thing for American interests that nobody in the MSM, let alone FOX News, has the balls to discuss due not least to an intimidatory atmosphere set up by AIPAC and its ilk. I think a more normal, for lack of a better word, relationship between the US and Israel would benefit both countries in the long run. I believe that in a saner world, Netanyahu would have been chased out of town on a rail rather than applauded for daring to try and interfere with American state policy, whatever the merits of Obama's deal-and that he has serious chutzpah for implying that America has no moral right to deal with Iran, considering Israel's dealings with China and Russia. As for the US, American Jews, on average, tend to be very left-wing, and have a very, very tiresome and hypocritical persecution complex that unfortunately the rest of us have to deal with, considering disproprationate Jewish influence in the media. American Jews are not victims, end of story. If anything, they are far more "privileged" than any other ethnic group-and I think their grandparents earned it, often over quite real discrimination. Just look at the legions of brilliant Jewish scientists in academia-they were the Asians of their day. But nevertheless, modern America is probably the least anti-Semitic place that has a major Jewish minority, and a lot of American Jews are going to have a rude awakening in for them when they discover that America's newer citizens view them as the whitest of all whites rather than fellow oppressed "allies".

    And yes, Israel is *notorious* in the intelligence community for its activity against the USA. My father is about as pro-Israel as it gets: hard-right wing Christian former officer, deeply admires everything about them. But he'll bluntly tell you about incessant, aggressive Israeli efforts to convince him to give over sensitive material, and why you never let the Israelis-very cheerful guys who understand that it was just business, nothing personal-out of their "minders" sights for a second. They don't even have to be circumspect about it, unlike the Chinese or Russians, because there are a lot of clowns in the Beltway who insist that Israel can do no wrong and that US and Israeli interests are identical.

    That's the surface level-complicated issues be complicated. Agree and disagree with what you will.

    (I treat Islam the same way, for what it is worth. I am no scholar, but I am generally familiar with the theology and history. More importantly, though, I've lived with Muslim roommates and have had Muslim friends, I've lived in Muslim countries, and have had sex with/dated Muslim women. I know them as people enough to understand that the modern Left/media's concern with "Islamophobia" over radical Islam is obnoxiously flatulant at best and-especially in Europe-actively dangerous at worst. I also believe that Islamic societies, on average, tend to be pretty messed up places that I wouldn't want to live in for long, and I definitely know for a fact that most run-of-the-mill Muslims in the Islamic World-I'm not talking Dr. Khan the successful doctor and his kids who drink on the down-low at college-tend to hold beliefs that Western liberals would find deeply shocking, to say the least, especially when it concerns Jews, atheism, or feminism. But I also know that most of these people also aren't demonic monsters seething with hatred for all things infidel, and on closer inspection, tend to be ordinary human beings: for better or for worse, as ordinary human beings can be hateful, violent, hypocritical, and tribal. I know that, having much more skin in the game than most Westerners, some of them are willing to state blunt truths about jihadis or the Sauds or the dangers of importing millions of low-IQ young Mirpuri men than you won't see Western bien-pensants in the press saying any time soon. And just like any other religion, culture drives the faith, not the other way around.)

    >Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    Indeed. As I've mentioned, European Jews tend to be a lot more connected to reality than American Jews thanks to the realities of mass Muslim underclass immigration in Europe.

    Just as my background as an American shapes mine. I once attended a school that flew the Israeli flag next to the American and Texan ones and grew up with FOX News on 24/7, with that type of constant over-the-top adulation of Israel that most Israelis privately find a little weird.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Tyrion 2

    The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi’s behest really, really hurt him.

    I doubt this. I don’t think that most Americans had that perception to begin with and even if they did, most people who were inclined to vote for Romney anyway are also down with any foreign wars that our leadership tells us are necessary. Right wing isolationism is just not a popular position in the US outside of unz.com. Don’t confuse the way that you feel personally with the perceptions of the average Republican voter. Around here, neocon is a dirty word but among mainstream Republicans they are not really discredited. I think that if you find yourself agreeing with Ilhan Omar a little too often that should maybe cause you to rethink whether you are really right because it’s hard to believe that she is right about anything.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Jack D

    > Right wing isolationism is just not a popular position in the US outside of unz.com.

    I disagree with this, partly out of personal experience with average Republican voters and seeing how they changed over the course of a decade. I don't think they'd go as far as Buchanan-style isolationism, and they are definitely hawks in the sense of going hard against people who'd attack the US, but enthusiasm for Middle East adventures to spread democracy just isn't flying with voters like it did in 2003. Public distaste for Operation SYRIAN FREEDOM was already there in 2013, despite the backing of both parties on Capitol Hill and the Obama Administration at the time, and played a part in Obama backing down from his "red line".


    It's not because they are anti-Israel, per se. Far form it, they are very pro-Israel. They view the Palestinians mostly as terrorists. But they don't wars on another country's behalf, even Israel's. Iraq saw to that. Romney's campaign had access to the data of Ohio swing voters that turned down their approval dials as much as possible with the "no daylight" comment, yet still continued to pursue those positions. That tells you a lot about the institutionalized mental escapism that dominated the GOP in the Dubya and post-Dubya eras, which of course, is part of why we've got President Trump.

    Not only that, you've got to look a couple decades in the future as the Baby Boomers begin to die off. It is probably going to explode in popularity. The coming generation will not remember a self-confident America in its Cold War age, it will have the failures of a state that chose to spend trillions of dollars on losing wars of choice and having adventures in countries most Congressmen can't point to on a map when we could have had high-speed rail or mass nuclear plants or blah blah blah... and they have been directly, negatively impacted by it, being the first generation that can except to be worse off than their parents.

    >Around here, neocon is a dirty word but among mainstream Republicans they are not really discredited.

    Donald Trump's success in South Carolina in February of 2016 would show otherwise, despite the booing of the donor-packed audience, and despite being in the most aggregate reactionary, military-friend state in the USA. He slaughtered his competition-explicitly attacking George W. Bush, labeling Iraq as a mistake, pointing out the logical incoherence of the Syrian interventionists, and being dumped on for having the temerity to suggest that American couldn't simply take on all rivals with maximum aggression at once. That, and most Americans aren't dedicated political followers or ideologues, period, meaning their positions are far from consistent and subject to change.

    Moreover, they are a mostly intellectual group with limited cachet outside of that, to donors or the the Great Unwashed, and could be easily sacrificed as such by a so-inclined candidate. Trump is fundamentally a lazy putz, so he's OK with having people like Bolton floating around, but I doubt the next populist insurgent-and make no mistake, there will be one, because the GOP has learned jack-all from the last quarter century-will fail to take notice of where his political interests would lie. Who knows, maybe he'll also give a hoot about what is best for the United States, for once.

    >I think that if you find yourself agreeing with Ilhan Omar a little too often that should maybe cause you to rethink whether you are really right because it’s hard to believe that she is right about anything.

    How often is "a little too often"? Ever? More than just once? Half the time? Reality isn't so black and white. James Clerk Maxwell didn't believe in evolution, that doesn't mean his electrodynamics equations are wrong. Think the sort of opposite here: ah, what's the phrase, "a broken clock is right twice a day"?

    More specifically, I don't think it is "all about the Benjamins", and you'll find Jewish plutocrats-Soros-who despise Likud and Netanyahu as much as you'll find those who love him. But I do think Israel's influence over American foreign policy decision making needs to be dialed back, big time, and that AIPAC needs to be put in its place.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  175. @Jack D
    @nebulafox


    The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi’s behest really, really hurt him.
     
    I doubt this. I don't think that most Americans had that perception to begin with and even if they did, most people who were inclined to vote for Romney anyway are also down with any foreign wars that our leadership tells us are necessary. Right wing isolationism is just not a popular position in the US outside of unz.com. Don't confuse the way that you feel personally with the perceptions of the average Republican voter. Around here, neocon is a dirty word but among mainstream Republicans they are not really discredited. I think that if you find yourself agreeing with Ilhan Omar a little too often that should maybe cause you to rethink whether you are really right because it's hard to believe that she is right about anything.

    Replies: @nebulafox

    > Right wing isolationism is just not a popular position in the US outside of unz.com.

    I disagree with this, partly out of personal experience with average Republican voters and seeing how they changed over the course of a decade. I don’t think they’d go as far as Buchanan-style isolationism, and they are definitely hawks in the sense of going hard against people who’d attack the US, but enthusiasm for Middle East adventures to spread democracy just isn’t flying with voters like it did in 2003. Public distaste for Operation SYRIAN FREEDOM was already there in 2013, despite the backing of both parties on Capitol Hill and the Obama Administration at the time, and played a part in Obama backing down from his “red line”.

    It’s not because they are anti-Israel, per se. Far form it, they are very pro-Israel. They view the Palestinians mostly as terrorists. But they don’t wars on another country’s behalf, even Israel’s. Iraq saw to that. Romney’s campaign had access to the data of Ohio swing voters that turned down their approval dials as much as possible with the “no daylight” comment, yet still continued to pursue those positions. That tells you a lot about the institutionalized mental escapism that dominated the GOP in the Dubya and post-Dubya eras, which of course, is part of why we’ve got President Trump.

    Not only that, you’ve got to look a couple decades in the future as the Baby Boomers begin to die off. It is probably going to explode in popularity. The coming generation will not remember a self-confident America in its Cold War age, it will have the failures of a state that chose to spend trillions of dollars on losing wars of choice and having adventures in countries most Congressmen can’t point to on a map when we could have had high-speed rail or mass nuclear plants or blah blah blah… and they have been directly, negatively impacted by it, being the first generation that can except to be worse off than their parents.

    >Around here, neocon is a dirty word but among mainstream Republicans they are not really discredited.

    Donald Trump’s success in South Carolina in February of 2016 would show otherwise, despite the booing of the donor-packed audience, and despite being in the most aggregate reactionary, military-friend state in the USA. He slaughtered his competition-explicitly attacking George W. Bush, labeling Iraq as a mistake, pointing out the logical incoherence of the Syrian interventionists, and being dumped on for having the temerity to suggest that American couldn’t simply take on all rivals with maximum aggression at once. That, and most Americans aren’t dedicated political followers or ideologues, period, meaning their positions are far from consistent and subject to change.

    Moreover, they are a mostly intellectual group with limited cachet outside of that, to donors or the the Great Unwashed, and could be easily sacrificed as such by a so-inclined candidate. Trump is fundamentally a lazy putz, so he’s OK with having people like Bolton floating around, but I doubt the next populist insurgent-and make no mistake, there will be one, because the GOP has learned jack-all from the last quarter century-will fail to take notice of where his political interests would lie. Who knows, maybe he’ll also give a hoot about what is best for the United States, for once.

    >I think that if you find yourself agreeing with Ilhan Omar a little too often that should maybe cause you to rethink whether you are really right because it’s hard to believe that she is right about anything.

    How often is “a little too often”? Ever? More than just once? Half the time? Reality isn’t so black and white. James Clerk Maxwell didn’t believe in evolution, that doesn’t mean his electrodynamics equations are wrong. Think the sort of opposite here: ah, what’s the phrase, “a broken clock is right twice a day”?

    More specifically, I don’t think it is “all about the Benjamins”, and you’ll find Jewish plutocrats-Soros-who despise Likud and Netanyahu as much as you’ll find those who love him. But I do think Israel’s influence over American foreign policy decision making needs to be dialed back, big time, and that AIPAC needs to be put in its place.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @nebulafox

    You can make all the rational arguments you want about how we (gentiles) have legitimate interests and the legitimate right to pursue them. As you may have noticed by now, none of these arguments ever wash with people like Jack D, Tyrion 2, or Lot. Have they ever made a single concession to you? Ever? Do they ever even seem like they are willing to see your point of view, or are even remotely inclined to do so? At some point, you just have to be willing to say: Well then, to Hell with you. They've pretty clearly already said as much to you.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

  176. OK, that’s it, I’m done. I’m going into websurfing detox-and with it, comment retirement. I know I’ve said this before, but this time, I’ve gotten to the point in desperation where I’ve realized that if I don’t get a handle on my compulsive habits in the next several months, I never will. It’s do or die: maybe quite literally in my case, as I’d personally rather die than live the life I’ve led for the past several years.

    It’s been fun, y’all, I’ve learned a lot. Take care of yourselves.

  177. @nebulafox
    @Debo

    >Israel’s modern foreign policy is predicated on not having overt wars with Arab nations. They have instead relied on the US as their enforcer.

    Not true at all these days. Most Middle Eastern governments that used to want to drive the Jews into the sea might not have affection for Israel, but they've come to accept it. Ironically enough, the exceptions back then have become the exceptions now, most notably Iran, which has historically been a rather philo-Semitic place from Cyrus to the Pahlavis.

    Outside of Western Europe (and Poland because Bibi through a hissy-fit about Warsaw quite reasonably refusing to kiss Israeli ass on historical narratives), Israel has never been more secure than it has been over the past decade. Russia and India have governments latently ideologically sympathetic to Likud, relations with China are just fine-most Chinese I've met have a very positive, if not PC, opinion of Jews. Syria, Libya, and Iraq have ceased to exist for all intents and purposes, the cold peaces with Egypt and Jordan still hold, and the Sauds are now tacit allies.

    This is way better than things were in 1973. Israel doesn't have to care about what Brussels thinks anymore, and due to changed demographics, there's little political incentive for Israeli politicians to care. The US isn't near as ignorable, obviously, but nor is it as indispensable as it was during the 1970s.

    Replies: @ATBOTL

    The governments who are friendly to Israel are all American backed dictators. A Democratic Arab world will see Israel like Iran does.

  178. @Tyrion 2
    @Mr. Anon

    It might not be your argument. I don't know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It's embarrassing.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites' fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @nebulafox, @Mr. Anon

    It might not be your argument. I don’t know. But I am not making a strawman. This argument features here, all of the time, from many commenters. It’s embarrassing.

    Lots of arguments feature here. You are ascribing to all of them your own interpretation of them – i.e., you are constructing strawmen.

    I mean, just look at the replies!

    Yeah. There are people disagreeing with you. The effrontery!

    Also, talk about projection. That is all they are and all the anti-Semites’ fantasies of the Jews are. How can you deny it when you have the comments all over this page? It is beyond sad.

    Is it your contention then that there is one People in the World – and only one People – who when acting as a group, or acting in a group-characteristic way, are completely blameless. Always. Forever. In every social transaction, they are never at fault.

    How likely is that?

  179. @nebulafox
    @Tyrion 2

    I agree that the idiot blood-and-soil contingent does Unz.com no favors when they are busy making arguments out of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. But for the love of God, you aren't an anti-Semite if you point out that Israel is a freaking foreign country and that American interests should take precedence over Israeli ones. There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two, possibly as a reaction to the anti-Semitic bilge that you sometimes see here.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2, @Mr. Anon

    There are people here who are way too eager to conflate the two, possibly as a reaction to the anti-Semitic bilge that you sometimes see here.

    No, they do it because they find it tactically useful. My advice to you is that you should stop taking their side. Take your own side instead.

  180. @Jack D
    @nebulafox

    I agree that WWI was the pivot point. 300 years from now, the Chinese history book writers (there won't be any other kind) will point to it as the beginning of the end for Western Civilization. Not only was the war itself botched but the peace was too. But that's all water under the bridge - we have no time machine to redo it. From the perspective of 1945, the question on the mind of Truman and Stalin was, "How do we prevent Germany from starting WWIII?" And the answer was a 50+ year occupation and a defanged Germany where young boys yearn to be folk singers instead of getting their dueling scars. This occupation was expensive for the occupying powers (perhaps broke the USSR)* but not without its benefits, the #1 of which was that it worked and there was no WWIII.


    *I think it is hilarious that folks here are so excited over the piddling few billion of military aid that goes to Israel (since it is sent in kind, the $ gets recycled right back into the US economy) but ignore the fact that what makes it possible for all those Aryan nations to have "defense ministers" who look like fashion models is the trillions that the US has spent on making it possible for them to treat defense as a joke. Not that I would want it any other way.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Johann Ricke

    *I think it is hilarious that folks here are so excited over the piddling few billion of military aid that goes to Israel (since it is sent in kind, the $ gets recycled right back into the US economy)

    This is an oft repeated lie. Israel is permitted to spend up to about a quarter of that money on procurement from Israeli companies. In any event, it is still money given outright to a foreign nation – money that they were going to spend anyway which now frees up other money for them to use on other things. It is no less a gift.

    And how long to you expect this gift to continue? In perpetuity? AIPAC would like the military subsidy to increase, and they might well get their wish. Factor in the money the U.S. has spent on wars in the middle east over the last twenty years – wars that benefit Israel, not the people of the U.S. – and we’ll be approaching the amount the U.S. has spend on NATO.

    America has already spent plenty on Israel, in blood and treasure.

  181. @nebulafox
    @Jack D

    > Right wing isolationism is just not a popular position in the US outside of unz.com.

    I disagree with this, partly out of personal experience with average Republican voters and seeing how they changed over the course of a decade. I don't think they'd go as far as Buchanan-style isolationism, and they are definitely hawks in the sense of going hard against people who'd attack the US, but enthusiasm for Middle East adventures to spread democracy just isn't flying with voters like it did in 2003. Public distaste for Operation SYRIAN FREEDOM was already there in 2013, despite the backing of both parties on Capitol Hill and the Obama Administration at the time, and played a part in Obama backing down from his "red line".


    It's not because they are anti-Israel, per se. Far form it, they are very pro-Israel. They view the Palestinians mostly as terrorists. But they don't wars on another country's behalf, even Israel's. Iraq saw to that. Romney's campaign had access to the data of Ohio swing voters that turned down their approval dials as much as possible with the "no daylight" comment, yet still continued to pursue those positions. That tells you a lot about the institutionalized mental escapism that dominated the GOP in the Dubya and post-Dubya eras, which of course, is part of why we've got President Trump.

    Not only that, you've got to look a couple decades in the future as the Baby Boomers begin to die off. It is probably going to explode in popularity. The coming generation will not remember a self-confident America in its Cold War age, it will have the failures of a state that chose to spend trillions of dollars on losing wars of choice and having adventures in countries most Congressmen can't point to on a map when we could have had high-speed rail or mass nuclear plants or blah blah blah... and they have been directly, negatively impacted by it, being the first generation that can except to be worse off than their parents.

    >Around here, neocon is a dirty word but among mainstream Republicans they are not really discredited.

    Donald Trump's success in South Carolina in February of 2016 would show otherwise, despite the booing of the donor-packed audience, and despite being in the most aggregate reactionary, military-friend state in the USA. He slaughtered his competition-explicitly attacking George W. Bush, labeling Iraq as a mistake, pointing out the logical incoherence of the Syrian interventionists, and being dumped on for having the temerity to suggest that American couldn't simply take on all rivals with maximum aggression at once. That, and most Americans aren't dedicated political followers or ideologues, period, meaning their positions are far from consistent and subject to change.

    Moreover, they are a mostly intellectual group with limited cachet outside of that, to donors or the the Great Unwashed, and could be easily sacrificed as such by a so-inclined candidate. Trump is fundamentally a lazy putz, so he's OK with having people like Bolton floating around, but I doubt the next populist insurgent-and make no mistake, there will be one, because the GOP has learned jack-all from the last quarter century-will fail to take notice of where his political interests would lie. Who knows, maybe he'll also give a hoot about what is best for the United States, for once.

    >I think that if you find yourself agreeing with Ilhan Omar a little too often that should maybe cause you to rethink whether you are really right because it’s hard to believe that she is right about anything.

    How often is "a little too often"? Ever? More than just once? Half the time? Reality isn't so black and white. James Clerk Maxwell didn't believe in evolution, that doesn't mean his electrodynamics equations are wrong. Think the sort of opposite here: ah, what's the phrase, "a broken clock is right twice a day"?

    More specifically, I don't think it is "all about the Benjamins", and you'll find Jewish plutocrats-Soros-who despise Likud and Netanyahu as much as you'll find those who love him. But I do think Israel's influence over American foreign policy decision making needs to be dialed back, big time, and that AIPAC needs to be put in its place.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    You can make all the rational arguments you want about how we (gentiles) have legitimate interests and the legitimate right to pursue them. As you may have noticed by now, none of these arguments ever wash with people like Jack D, Tyrion 2, or Lot. Have they ever made a single concession to you? Ever? Do they ever even seem like they are willing to see your point of view, or are even remotely inclined to do so? At some point, you just have to be willing to say: Well then, to Hell with you. They’ve pretty clearly already said as much to you.

    • Replies: @Tyrion 2
    @Mr. Anon


    You can make all the rational arguments you want about how we (gentiles) have legitimate interests and the legitimate right to pursue them.
     
    I've never argued that, except perhaps to dispute the idea of specifically Gentile interests. That group, composing 99.8% of the world's population, is too diffuse to have interests other than what all humans share, like clean air.

    Regardless, I always wonder: which list would be longer? That which you blame things on Jews (0.2%) or that which you blame on everyone else (99.8%)?

    Do you understand why I might object?

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  182. @Jack D
    @nebulafox

    I agree that WWI was the pivot point. 300 years from now, the Chinese history book writers (there won't be any other kind) will point to it as the beginning of the end for Western Civilization. Not only was the war itself botched but the peace was too. But that's all water under the bridge - we have no time machine to redo it. From the perspective of 1945, the question on the mind of Truman and Stalin was, "How do we prevent Germany from starting WWIII?" And the answer was a 50+ year occupation and a defanged Germany where young boys yearn to be folk singers instead of getting their dueling scars. This occupation was expensive for the occupying powers (perhaps broke the USSR)* but not without its benefits, the #1 of which was that it worked and there was no WWIII.


    *I think it is hilarious that folks here are so excited over the piddling few billion of military aid that goes to Israel (since it is sent in kind, the $ gets recycled right back into the US economy) but ignore the fact that what makes it possible for all those Aryan nations to have "defense ministers" who look like fashion models is the trillions that the US has spent on making it possible for them to treat defense as a joke. Not that I would want it any other way.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Johann Ricke

    I agree that WWI was the pivot point. 300 years from now, the Chinese history book writers (there won’t be any other kind) will point to it as the beginning of the end for Western Civilization. Not only was the war itself botched but the peace was too.

    Barbara Tuchman’s interpretation has become holy writ for some strange reason perhaps related to Keynes’s canonization as an economic and geopolitical genius. While the Chinese perspective is likely to be that the West erred in not striving for total victory, it would also hold that the peace was insufficiently harsh.

    Assuming Britain and France lacked the will to sacrifice its young men at the rate they were lost during the war, the aim of Versailles should have been to cripple the German war machine until Germany was literally helpless. At that point, the perspective from actual Chinese history is that Britain and France should have invaded again, killed the entire leadership and massacred some or most of Germany’s army. A viable alternative would have been to send a good chunk of Germany’s elites and soldiery into exile in their African and Asian holdings to consolidate the metropole’s grip on those lands, while nipping in the bud nascent Independence movements there.

    The real bottom line is that the Chinese perspective is very different from anything a Westerner might dream up, because they think in dynastic terms and these are expected to last centuries. And a big part of that perspective is that anything that fails to literally obviate an aggressive enemy’s leadership and soldiery, either via execution or exile, is an invitation for problems in the near future.

  183. @nebulafox
    @Tyrion 2

    >The rejoinder may be that the US media is shouting the other way but, other than the financial aid*, I don’t see it. Israel’s behaviour is, at worst, ordinary by global standards. Yet I see it receiving extraordinary criticism, and, yes, extraordinary defence too.

    Unlike in Europe, though, the anti-Israel people do not hold much in the way of practical power. That's going to possibly change in the coming decades. The left-wing in the US is indeed becoming more like Europe: and that includes the changing attitude to Israel. Once Schumer and Company die off, I expect the US Left to be a lot more openly pro-Palestinian, especially as Israel gets ever more right-wing for its own reasons. But the right-wing in the US is a different story. Have you ever watched a GOP debate when Israel is discussed? We've gotten to the point where when Donald Trump's attitude-whom no one can seriously accuse of being anti-Semitic, let alone anti-Israeli-was deemed insufficiently deferential, and Rubio and Cruz spend the next hour bending over backwards over who could praise Israel more. Even supporters of Israel, which is most of the GOP base, can find this more than a little tiring-especially when it is implied that America might end up in another Middle East conflict. The perception that Romney would launch Operation IRANIAN FREEDOM in 2012 on Bibi's behest really, really hurt him.

    It gets a little frustrating when you keep seeing your so-called "conservative" politicians more actively defend the interests of another country rather than your own.

    >And if one is surrounded by people screaming that the building is burning down when it isn’t, it seems strange to half-heartedly join in with comments about how some of the materials may be somewhat unsuitably flammable.

    Hey, I call things how I see them, on this topic as much as any other. Since I don't see much of a point in talking to commentators who seriously believe Da Joos Duh Great Evil, and as I myself am not Jewish and am mostly indifferent to Israel, do not find much of an emotional impulse to rebut them, in the context of iSteve's foreign policy discussions, I usually get in the Buchananist camp of questioning the "special relationship" with Israel: and questioning why we didn't de-militarize in general when the USSR collapsed and there was no further need.

    I happen to believe that Israeli behavior is not particularly noxious on global standards, and I've found that Israelis are far more rational and down-to-earth in discussing their country than Americans tend to be. Israel has a right to pursue their national interests like anyone else, and I don't begrudge Israelis for fighting for their team. I appreciate that it is a highly liberal, successful place (a rarity in that region) that treats loyal Arabs better than most Arab countries do, and there is something of a double standard from the post-1960s Left on Israel vs. the Palestinians. I believe the Palestinians are screwed, to put it bluntly, and that pro-Palestinian activists in the West are just prolonging their misery and making their lot worse by allowing them to have any hope in meaningful assistance from abroad. If the alt-right were smarter, they'd court Israel, not attack it. I do not think American Jews are at the head of some organized conspiracy, nor do I think they are a hive mind: most post-Soviet Jews who emigrated here in the 1990s have views that would make Pat Buchanan blush. I know that left-wing American Jews-at least those my age-tend to see Israel as more of an embarassment than anything else, which is part of why I'm convinced the days of the Six Day War boosting Democrat are coming to a close. The people who really support Israel in the US are white, evangelical Christians. I've repeatedly pointed out that European Jews are fully connected to the reality that in the 21st Century, the real anti-Semitic threats are going to come from Muslims, not white gentiles: to say nothing of the Israelis.

    I also happen to also believe that Israel's over-the-top influence on Capitol Hill is a deeply negative thing for American interests that nobody in the MSM, let alone FOX News, has the balls to discuss due not least to an intimidatory atmosphere set up by AIPAC and its ilk. I think a more normal, for lack of a better word, relationship between the US and Israel would benefit both countries in the long run. I believe that in a saner world, Netanyahu would have been chased out of town on a rail rather than applauded for daring to try and interfere with American state policy, whatever the merits of Obama's deal-and that he has serious chutzpah for implying that America has no moral right to deal with Iran, considering Israel's dealings with China and Russia. As for the US, American Jews, on average, tend to be very left-wing, and have a very, very tiresome and hypocritical persecution complex that unfortunately the rest of us have to deal with, considering disproprationate Jewish influence in the media. American Jews are not victims, end of story. If anything, they are far more "privileged" than any other ethnic group-and I think their grandparents earned it, often over quite real discrimination. Just look at the legions of brilliant Jewish scientists in academia-they were the Asians of their day. But nevertheless, modern America is probably the least anti-Semitic place that has a major Jewish minority, and a lot of American Jews are going to have a rude awakening in for them when they discover that America's newer citizens view them as the whitest of all whites rather than fellow oppressed "allies".

    And yes, Israel is *notorious* in the intelligence community for its activity against the USA. My father is about as pro-Israel as it gets: hard-right wing Christian former officer, deeply admires everything about them. But he'll bluntly tell you about incessant, aggressive Israeli efforts to convince him to give over sensitive material, and why you never let the Israelis-very cheerful guys who understand that it was just business, nothing personal-out of their "minders" sights for a second. They don't even have to be circumspect about it, unlike the Chinese or Russians, because there are a lot of clowns in the Beltway who insist that Israel can do no wrong and that US and Israeli interests are identical.

    That's the surface level-complicated issues be complicated. Agree and disagree with what you will.

    (I treat Islam the same way, for what it is worth. I am no scholar, but I am generally familiar with the theology and history. More importantly, though, I've lived with Muslim roommates and have had Muslim friends, I've lived in Muslim countries, and have had sex with/dated Muslim women. I know them as people enough to understand that the modern Left/media's concern with "Islamophobia" over radical Islam is obnoxiously flatulant at best and-especially in Europe-actively dangerous at worst. I also believe that Islamic societies, on average, tend to be pretty messed up places that I wouldn't want to live in for long, and I definitely know for a fact that most run-of-the-mill Muslims in the Islamic World-I'm not talking Dr. Khan the successful doctor and his kids who drink on the down-low at college-tend to hold beliefs that Western liberals would find deeply shocking, to say the least, especially when it concerns Jews, atheism, or feminism. But I also know that most of these people also aren't demonic monsters seething with hatred for all things infidel, and on closer inspection, tend to be ordinary human beings: for better or for worse, as ordinary human beings can be hateful, violent, hypocritical, and tribal. I know that, having much more skin in the game than most Westerners, some of them are willing to state blunt truths about jihadis or the Sauds or the dangers of importing millions of low-IQ young Mirpuri men than you won't see Western bien-pensants in the press saying any time soon. And just like any other religion, culture drives the faith, not the other way around.)

    >Perhaps me being British and growing up with a media class that tends to be hostile to Israel colours my perceptions?

    Indeed. As I've mentioned, European Jews tend to be a lot more connected to reality than American Jews thanks to the realities of mass Muslim underclass immigration in Europe.

    Just as my background as an American shapes mine. I once attended a school that flew the Israeli flag next to the American and Texan ones and grew up with FOX News on 24/7, with that type of constant over-the-top adulation of Israel that most Israelis privately find a little weird.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Tyrion 2

    Thank you for your considered post. I don’t absolutely agree with it but my differences with it are of opinion on exactly how big each effect is (quantity) bit any particular qualitative statement. In other words, I can see your post being true.

    I also happen to also believe that Israel’s over-the-top influence on Capitol Hill is a deeply negative thing for American interests that nobody in the MSM, let alone FOX News, has the balls to discuss due not least to an intimidatory atmosphere set up by AIPAC and its ilk

    In what way? From a realpolitik perspective, Israel seems pretty useful to the US. Certainly Israel gets more than it gives, but the relationship is not only one way. I mean how much did those bases in Germany cost to run, and yet, for decades in the Middle East, there was a force capable of holding its own in the Cold War on the US side. Previously there was also Iran but that fell to something else entirely in ’79.

    I also get that some might blame Arab Nationalism’s alignment with the USSR on Israel but I imagine that’d be a long and complicated counter-factual debate. I’d suggest that, given what happens with similar movements in Africa, this was not the case.

    Now I’m more of “the world is too complicated better not to touch it and instead build a big wall” kind of person, but I wouldn’t say Israel is why America engages in world management. There are endless conflicts that America tries to shape and influence that have nothing to do with Israel.

  184. @Mr. Anon
    @nebulafox

    You can make all the rational arguments you want about how we (gentiles) have legitimate interests and the legitimate right to pursue them. As you may have noticed by now, none of these arguments ever wash with people like Jack D, Tyrion 2, or Lot. Have they ever made a single concession to you? Ever? Do they ever even seem like they are willing to see your point of view, or are even remotely inclined to do so? At some point, you just have to be willing to say: Well then, to Hell with you. They've pretty clearly already said as much to you.

    Replies: @Tyrion 2

    You can make all the rational arguments you want about how we (gentiles) have legitimate interests and the legitimate right to pursue them.

    I’ve never argued that, except perhaps to dispute the idea of specifically Gentile interests. That group, composing 99.8% of the world’s population, is too diffuse to have interests other than what all humans share, like clean air.

    Regardless, I always wonder: which list would be longer? That which you blame things on Jews (0.2%) or that which you blame on everyone else (99.8%)?

    Do you understand why I might object?

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Tyrion 2


    I’ve never argued that, except perhaps to dispute the idea of specifically Gentile interests.
     
    I mean what is obvious from the context of America - white gentiles of european extraction.

    Regardless, I always wonder: which list would be longer? That which you blame things on Jews (0.2%) or that which you blame on everyone else (99.8%)?

    Do you understand why I might object?
     
    It doesn't matter. If the list was the least bit disproportionate with respect to the underlying numbers, you would object.
  185. @IHTG
    @Mr. Anon

    Considering Trump's general underperformance with all college-educated suburban whites, he probably still did relatively well with Jews. Compare the Trump-Romney numbers with George W Bush's 19 years ago.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    He did pretty much the same as any other Republican – no more than 30%. It’s one of those fundmental constants of American politics. Jews are a Democratic Party voting block.

  186. @Tyrion 2
    @Mr. Anon


    You can make all the rational arguments you want about how we (gentiles) have legitimate interests and the legitimate right to pursue them.
     
    I've never argued that, except perhaps to dispute the idea of specifically Gentile interests. That group, composing 99.8% of the world's population, is too diffuse to have interests other than what all humans share, like clean air.

    Regardless, I always wonder: which list would be longer? That which you blame things on Jews (0.2%) or that which you blame on everyone else (99.8%)?

    Do you understand why I might object?

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    I’ve never argued that, except perhaps to dispute the idea of specifically Gentile interests.

    I mean what is obvious from the context of America – white gentiles of european extraction.

    Regardless, I always wonder: which list would be longer? That which you blame things on Jews (0.2%) or that which you blame on everyone else (99.8%)?

    Do you understand why I might object?

    It doesn’t matter. If the list was the least bit disproportionate with respect to the underlying numbers, you would object.

  187. Second from the left looks like Frank Vincent when he was on the Sopranos.

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