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From the Washington Post:
Why we have to stop telling Jewish jokes
By Michelle Van Loon April 8
Sometimes it takes a while for a bad punchline to sink in. To wit, after a handful of comedian (to use the term loosely) Trevor Noah’s cringe-worthy anti-Semitic, misogynist tweets from 2009 surfaced about a week and a half ago.
Last night, “The Daily Show” host Jon Stewart spoke out in support of Noah, who is slated to replace Stewart on the Comedy Central show later this year. But Noah still faces several comedy critiques.
On Wednesday, the American Jewish Congress launched an online campaign calling for Comedy Central to send Noah packing. And the Chicago Tribune’s Clarence Page wrote on Wednesday about the unwritten rules of comedy etiquette.
“It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes, than to punch down,” Page writes. “Deflating the pompous and powerful can be hilarious. Ridiculing the weak is just sad.”
Who? Whom?
The New Republic declared Jewish humor officially finis in light of the Internet tempest over Lena Dunham’s recent cringe-inducing New Yorker quiz entitled “Dog or Jewish Boyfriend: A Quiz.” Dunham’s piece had an odd, 1967-ish throwback tone to it, leaning hard on the stereotype of a spoiled hypochondriac Jewish-American Prince. Picture a young Woody Allen with an Instagram account and a case of gout.
TNR’s piece contends that at this point in history, most American Jews are basically assimilated white people. According to its author Phoebe Malz Bovy, the tug of war between assimilation and Jewish identity is over. America won.
But if that were true, Dunham and Noah wouldn’t have captured the attention they did. …
Whose attention?
If Jewish people were truly integrated into American culture, those trusty toxic stereotypes would be fading. Not long ago, I ran into a guy I hadn’t seen for more than two decades. He was a leader in his Israel-loving, conservative evangelical church, yet within 30 seconds of saying hello to me, he slung his arm around my neck like a noose and said, “Hey, I have a great Jewish joke for you.”
Maybe, like Bryan Cranston as Watley the Dentist, he converted, just for the jokes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jG6B9Pt_ug
Before I could extricate myself from his grip, he proceeded to unload a mean-spirited, borderline anti-Semitic bomb on me. I thought I’d made it clear two decades ago I didn’t think his jokes were funny. His material hadn’t improved one bit since then.
The point made in TNR’s piece that Jews have been assimilated might be stretching the point a bit, as various corners of our culture use “You people are not us” language. It may come out of earnest innocence (“Some of my best friends are Jewish!”) or more nefarious old stereotypes (News flash! We Jews don’t have All The Money). …
The rise in anti-Semitism in Europe has shifted the context into which Dunham, Noah and my old friend are doing their lounge acts. While we Jews enjoy great freedom in this country, millennia of history in the marrow of our bones tells us that things could change for us at any time.
The first sign just might be when we become the punchline.
Michelle Van Loon is the author of three books, and a regular contributor to Christianity Today’s Her.meneutics blog. She maintains her own blog, Pilgrim’s Road Trip, at Patheos.com.
Like I’ve been saying, 2015’s Muslim massacres of Jews in Europe has prodded a few of the smarter, funnier, more self-aware American Jews toward an agonizing reappraisal of their ancestral Diversity Uber Alles ideology. Has it hit diminishing returns?
But, mostly, as in this example, Muslims slaughtering Jews just encourages the dumber, more humorless, less self-aware American Jews to double down on the traditionally successful habit of guilt-tripping nice white gentile Americans about how at any minute they could start a new Holocaust, just like they did on June 6, 1944. (Oh, wait, maybe my historical analogy needs work … But my point is, basically, that I’m holding the Megaphone and you aren’t.)
How all this will deter homicidal Muslims is not obvious, but, hey, it’s enjoyable, easy, and risk-free in terms of career, so why not keep on keeping on?
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As if there are no stereotypes about other white ethnics, regional whites, or even the entire lot of us.
We can’t tell Jewish jokes because “It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes.”
The large number of Christians in Indiana and Arkansas who had their religious freedom law overturned by Marc Benioff will be surprised, as will any Protestant with a case before the US Supreme Court.
Van Loon. What an appropriate name.
The “guy I haven’t seen in more than 20 years greets me with a Jewish joke” sounds bizarre and made up.
What I want to point up is the negligence of the EDITOR of this WaPo piece--and the general editorial malfeasance across the board that permits this low-level of writing to be published. Any solid editor would have called her on that anecdote--"Sounds too perfect, sweetheart; can you show me that it really happened?"--and would have struck it before publication/broadcast.
Because they're mostly invisible to the reader, editors are not called to account in our media culture. But a lot of the lousiness of expression and style in today's media would, in former days, have never made it through an editorial gatekeeper. If our side started calling out the ones who let this drivel through, we might see less of it.Replies: @Jonathan Silber
I confess, I love Jewish jokes. The ones they tell about themselves I mean. The good ones in other words.
“Picture a young Woody Allen with an Instagram account and a case of gout.”
Hard to picture, since gout is usually associated with obesity.
Anyhow, there’s another subtext here: as most Jews have become more secular and assimilated, negative stereotypes about Jews have been perpetuated by some Jews as a (bizarre) means of maintaining cultural identity. That may sound crazy, but check out this YouTube campaign from several years ago by a Jewish organization in Philadelphia:
alinsky rule 5
>“Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions.<
called for rain
It immediately disarms the speaker, as it is the last thing expected after being ridiculed.
Ridicule is about triggering a response--anger, embarrassment, whatever... It is defeated by being (or reacting) as impervious to it--not being sucked into it's intention. A little self-confidence and determination go a long way. Not being thin-skinned helps.
Jewish jokes are not necessarily offensive or at least they should not be. But joking about emulating an event where millions of people were slaughtered like cattle is offensive and reason enough for Comedy Central to tell this guy to take a walk. The joke was not even close to being funny which only makes it seem that much more offensive.
Consider if a white comedian told a joke about black people dying on slave ships. They would not have hesitated to fire him in less than a minute of reflection. And Those murders happened hundreds of years ago rather than within many living peoples lifetimes.
Joking about Jewish parsimony or Jewish women refusing to perform certain types of sexual favors should be accepted as healthy ribbing. Some of these jokes can be amusing and should not be banned by the politically correct police.
Other white ethnic groups are allowed to take ribbing as well.
I am really bothered by people calling the joke about fat girls as “misogynist.” That screams of politically correct thought police. We’re not allowed to acknowledge that there are some women who are overweight that like to believe they are God’s gift to the Earth? That is a crime against womanhood?
That tweet no more "makes light of the Holocaust" than any Black comedian talking about being nervous in the Deep South makes light of slavery. The idea that Germans are predisposed to violence towards Jews, and that Jews are nervous about that (sometimes incorrectly) has been a staple of Western comics since the 1950's: not least being featured in virtually every Woody Allen and/or Jewish comedy routine I have ever seen. Even classic modern films (e.g., Big Lebowski) make reference to the potential for German-Jewish animus.
I will grant you that only in the past 15 years or so can one see portrayals of Germans in American culture who are not automatically anti-Semites or warmongers, but that says more about prejudicial stereotypes about Germans than Jews or the Holocaust.Replies: @Wizard of Oz
And Jews are really, really weak.Why, did you know that Jews comprise only 17.46 of the 2013 FORBES World’s Billionaire’s List*?Even worse, they only comprise 34.75 of the names in the 2012 FORBES 400 richest Americans list**
Elite Jews have been following an anti-European Christian strategy for a long time now.They are comfortable with it.It feels good.It’s got inertia on its side.It’s going to take something really massive for them to change direction now
*http://racehist.blogspot.com/2013/04/ethnic-origins-of-forbes-world.html
**http://racehist.blogspot.com/2013/04/2012-forbes-400-by-ethnic-origins.html#more
Money is something. It can buy you the last plane out, an escape hatch, a bribe to get out of there. Fundamentally it cannot by itself command an army or even a mob. Ask all those rich Jews who died in places like Thierenbad thinking their money could get them out. At a certain point the money is meaningless. Money is only something that dates back to 700 BC in Lydia. Its still pretty new. It is good to have money. But don't confuse it with power. Power gets you money. Not the other way around.
---------------------------
Lena Dunham must be a piece of work. She's about 80 lbs or so overweight, at least, fairly ugly, with an abrasive personality, ugly tats making her even more ugly, and she's surprised her actual rock star boyfriend is looking elsewhere? So she figures the best way to keep him is ... insult him?
Rather than lose that 80 lbs, remove those tats, act more feminine, and get plastic surgery?
This attitude, by fat women who ought to be grateful they have a man at all, is fairly typical. I've seen it many times. It does not sadly seem to be confined to any regional, ethnic, or occupational group.Replies: @Hibernian
“I ran into a guy I hadn’t seen for more than two decades. He was a leader in his Israel-loving, conservative evangelical church, yet within 30 seconds of saying hello to me, he slung his arm around my neck like a noose and said, “Hey, I have a great Jewish joke for you.”
I think you missed the punchline of this story. “The guy’s name was Haven Monahan.”
I have to admit I find jokes about ethnic groups to be almost universally lame. Ethnic groups and nationalities are too big to be good targets for jokes most of the time. So a joke about Jewish bike couriers or Jewish real estate agents is more likely to be funny than a joke about Jews generally. The same thing applies to other ethnic groups too, obviously.
Really – who could be more up in America then the Jews!
Translation: It's only OK to make fun of whites.
The Yiddish in that clip is sehr Deutsch, much more German sounding than I am used to hearing. But then the Yiddish speakers I have known were usually far Galitzyaners (West Ukrainians).
The premise of the article seems absurd and alarmist to me. I realize that people like Jeffrey Goldberg will nurse bullying from their childhood but I am relatively certain this is uncommon. I guess you have to be in certain parts of the country.
On Wednesday, the American Jewish Congress launched an online campaign calling for Comedy Central to send Noah packing. That’s not surprising.
And the Chicago Tribune’s Clarence Page wrote on Wednesday about the unwritten rules of comedy etiquette.
The “punch up, punch down” that Page is referencing has to with “Jews, other minorities, and women.” To say that Jews are “weak” in American society is nonsense.
Look, the reason Noah is in trouble is because his references to Jews are ultimately references to Israel, and Israel must be perceived as weak because otherwise its conduct is called more into question. Nor is criticism of Israel necessarily anti-Semitic; any country that portrayed itself as a first world nation would come into similar criticism if it was controlling the lives of an almost equal number of non-citizens. And that’s ultimately the reason why the AJC wants him out.
The internal contradictions involved in Israel’s control over millions of non-Jews isn’t going to go away by proscribing Jewish jokes. Nor even by forbidding an open discussion of these problems.
It is easy too see the premise(s) you rely on to argue for that conclusion but I suggest you consider that the same could have been said of Jews in Germany in 1930 for much the same reasons. So actual feelings of weakness by some of America's small population of Jews are not invalidated.Replies: @SPmoore8
You can do better than this, Steve! You imply here that American Jews are holding the so-called megaphone via the Washington Post. But the Post is owned by Amazon’s Jeff Bezos and Michelle van Loon is a convert to Christianity, albeit an unusual one. She can hardly claim to speak for anyone but herself, and she is not a dumb Jew who hasn’t clued in to the Muslim menace–she isn’t Jewish. In fact, the real question is: why is it in the interest of billionaires to keep spewing out this multicultural agitation and convoluted drivel?
Consider if a white comedian told a joke about black people dying on slave ships. They would not have hesitated to fire him in less than a minute of reflection. And Those murders happened hundreds of years ago rather than within many living peoples lifetimes.
Joking about Jewish parsimony or Jewish women refusing to perform certain types of sexual favors should be accepted as healthy ribbing. Some of these jokes can be amusing and should not be banned by the politically correct police.
Other white ethnic groups are allowed to take ribbing as well.
I am really bothered by people calling the joke about fat girls as "misogynist." That screams of politically correct thought police. We're not allowed to acknowledge that there are some women who are overweight that like to believe they are God's gift to the Earth? That is a crime against womanhood?Replies: @SPMoore8, @ben tillman, @ben tillman, @Anon, @tsotha
The tweet in question is: “Almost bumped a Jewish kid crossing the road. He didn’t look b4 crossing but I still would hav felt so bad in my german car!”
That tweet no more “makes light of the Holocaust” than any Black comedian talking about being nervous in the Deep South makes light of slavery. The idea that Germans are predisposed to violence towards Jews, and that Jews are nervous about that (sometimes incorrectly) has been a staple of Western comics since the 1950’s: not least being featured in virtually every Woody Allen and/or Jewish comedy routine I have ever seen. Even classic modern films (e.g., Big Lebowski) make reference to the potential for German-Jewish animus.
I will grant you that only in the past 15 years or so can one see portrayals of Germans in American culture who are not automatically anti-Semites or warmongers, but that says more about prejudicial stereotypes about Germans than Jews or the Holocaust.
Still, I would be interested to know if anyone could generate Holocaust equivalents. Perhaps just very fleeting references to say Theresienstadt and Treblinka sounding nice as a Jewish family plans a holiday in 1938. But then it had better be a Californian family displaying their total ignorance if the world outside America and it should be a Jewish comedian making fun of them. Right?Replies: @SPMoore8
““It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes, than to punch down,””
Translation: It’s only OK to make fun of whites.
Hard to picture, since gout is usually associated with obesity.
Anyhow, there's another subtext here: as most Jews have become more secular and assimilated, negative stereotypes about Jews have been perpetuated by some Jews as a (bizarre) means of maintaining cultural identity. That may sound crazy, but check out this YouTube campaign from several years ago by a Jewish organization in Philadelphia:
https://youtu.be/D0ucSnsbtYkReplies: @syonredux, @Anonymous
Yeah, that’s something that I’ve witnessed from time to time.Indeed, some of the most hyper ethno-patriotic Jews that I have encountered have a tendency to positively revel in the most OTT Jewish stereotypes. For example, the only time that I have ever heard anyone (actually heard: not on TV, radio, etc) make a “Jewish nose” reference was when I was talking to a Jewish guy that I met some years back. He said that he spotted me for a “landsman” when he saw my “Jew nose.”
For example, when I needed help correcting a form problem on my squats, I went to see this Starting Strength coach in New York, who, it turned out, was Jewish: http://www.wolfstrength.com/about-index/about-michael-wolf/
And he's not the only one. Jews seem to be overrepresented among Starting Strength coaches.
I swear, I've brought this up before, and it may not be scientific.
But look at old photos from the 30's, 40's and earlier.
You see a ton of people with great big honking schnozzes.
Where did they all go?
Sometimes I think Lysenko was on to something.
As long as Jews are the topic again, I wish a family of them would pull out the family album (well non intermixed jews, otherwise it doesn't support my point).
I want them to check out great grandpa's nose, and the rest of the family. Then track the shrinking noses generation by generation. I'd like to see 100% gigantic noses circa 1930 or so, then the direct descendants of those gigantic proboscis' converge to "American Standard Nose Size."
So in other words, "From gigantic honkers to average size ones, in a couple generations."Replies: @BurplesonAFB, @syonredux, @Bill
Completely. He should at least make some effort to sound convincing.
Hard to picture, since gout is usually associated with obesity.
Anyhow, there's another subtext here: as most Jews have become more secular and assimilated, negative stereotypes about Jews have been perpetuated by some Jews as a (bizarre) means of maintaining cultural identity. That may sound crazy, but check out this YouTube campaign from several years ago by a Jewish organization in Philadelphia:
https://youtu.be/D0ucSnsbtYkReplies: @syonredux, @Anonymous
That’s just self-deprecation, which is different.
Consider if a white comedian told a joke about black people dying on slave ships. They would not have hesitated to fire him in less than a minute of reflection. And Those murders happened hundreds of years ago rather than within many living peoples lifetimes.
Joking about Jewish parsimony or Jewish women refusing to perform certain types of sexual favors should be accepted as healthy ribbing. Some of these jokes can be amusing and should not be banned by the politically correct police.
Other white ethnic groups are allowed to take ribbing as well.
I am really bothered by people calling the joke about fat girls as "misogynist." That screams of politically correct thought police. We're not allowed to acknowledge that there are some women who are overweight that like to believe they are God's gift to the Earth? That is a crime against womanhood?Replies: @SPMoore8, @ben tillman, @ben tillman, @Anon, @tsotha
For the record, the crew had a higher mortality rate than the cargo.
Consider if a white comedian told a joke about black people dying on slave ships. They would not have hesitated to fire him in less than a minute of reflection. And Those murders happened hundreds of years ago rather than within many living peoples lifetimes.
Joking about Jewish parsimony or Jewish women refusing to perform certain types of sexual favors should be accepted as healthy ribbing. Some of these jokes can be amusing and should not be banned by the politically correct police.
Other white ethnic groups are allowed to take ribbing as well.
I am really bothered by people calling the joke about fat girls as "misogynist." That screams of politically correct thought police. We're not allowed to acknowledge that there are some women who are overweight that like to believe they are God's gift to the Earth? That is a crime against womanhood?Replies: @SPMoore8, @ben tillman, @ben tillman, @Anon, @tsotha
Duplicate deleted.
Should read:
“Deflating who the pompous and powerful tell you are safe to make fun of is hilarious.”
Otherwise, how is Zuckerberg’s Jewishness (or insert any number of Jewish billionaires here) not funny while anything about white trash is hilarious?
Some of the stereotypes also apply more narrowly than those perpetuating them realize. I.e., they’re not stereotypes about Jews per se but about a subset of Jews those Jews hung out with in the local Democratic Party headquarters or whatever.
For example, when I needed help correcting a form problem on my squats, I went to see this Starting Strength coach in New York, who, it turned out, was Jewish: http://www.wolfstrength.com/about-index/about-michael-wolf/
And he’s not the only one. Jews seem to be overrepresented among Starting Strength coaches.
“It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes, than to punch down,” Page writes. “Deflating the pompous and powerful can be hilarious. Ridiculing the weak is just sad.”
Does this mean that it is no longer acceptable for Jewish comedians to make fun of white Christians who live in trailer parks in Appalachia? Or are white Appalachians considered to be among the pompous and powerful?
My grandmother lived in a trailer for several years after her retirement. She and her neighbours were actually perfectly pleasant people. (Maybe they were an anomaly?)
I just got the feeling that they were normal people who didn't have a lot of money for housing, but country types, who weren't well suited to 'apartment living '.
That people who are liberal, and otherwise socially aware would label another human being 'trash' so casually, has always bothered me, there's just something very 'off' about it.
I've actually called people out on this a few times (and spoiled a few otherwise pleasant evenings)Replies: @Bill
If Jewish people were truly integrated into American culture, those trusty toxic stereotypes would be fading
I guess the Irish must not be integrated either since it is common to hear people make jokes about drunken Irishmen. Of course, a lot of the people making those jokes are Jewish.
The mayor’s stand-up act fell flat Wednesday night when he told a crowd at the American Irish Historical Society that he’s used to seeing drunks hanging out the windows of its Fifth Avenue headquarters, around the corner from his town house on East 79th Street, the Irish Central Web site reported.
“I live in the neighborhood, right around the corner,” the mayor said. “Normally, when I walk by this building, there are a bunch of people that are totally inebriated hanging out the window. I know that’s a stereotype about the Irish, but nevertheless, we Jews around the corner think this.”
Consider if a white comedian told a joke about black people dying on slave ships. They would not have hesitated to fire him in less than a minute of reflection. And Those murders happened hundreds of years ago rather than within many living peoples lifetimes.
Joking about Jewish parsimony or Jewish women refusing to perform certain types of sexual favors should be accepted as healthy ribbing. Some of these jokes can be amusing and should not be banned by the politically correct police.
Other white ethnic groups are allowed to take ribbing as well.
I am really bothered by people calling the joke about fat girls as "misogynist." That screams of politically correct thought police. We're not allowed to acknowledge that there are some women who are overweight that like to believe they are God's gift to the Earth? That is a crime against womanhood?Replies: @SPMoore8, @ben tillman, @ben tillman, @Anon, @tsotha
Id say the ratio of over-confident fat girls is running at about a 1:6 ratio with Dark Enlightnment nerds that seem to bear some strange grudge against them. It’s pretty easy really if a fat chick has a bad attitude avoid her. Don’t get drunk don’t have sex with her don’t even talk to her. Now admittedly that means some people are going to have to go home with their right hands that night but then you are the one who has a problem with fat chicks so that shouldn’t be a problem. Maybe it’s one of those things like how if the only car you could ever drive is a Tercel you’d probally start thinking Tercels were a bunch of over-confident compact cars and resenting them. Is it really about the Tercel though?
They have come to get Curley, but they really want Thomas Jefferson.
I agree with e. e. cummings, the heart of humor is the twist, like the old vaudeville joke:
“Would you hit a woman with a child?”
“No. I’d hit her with a brick.”
(back away from the keyboard, that’s a quote, six nonlectures, IIRC)
The use of group stereotypes (ethnic, racial, sexual, etc.) just adds to the irony. It’s not about punching up or down.
As did paying passengers, who had paid in advance. The slaves were only valuable alive.
I don’t think the objection to mortality on slave ships is based on the mortality rate.
“The rise in anti-Semitism in Europe…”
We may never know the cause.
Telling a joke about Jews by anyone other than Jews has always been fraught with danger, and was only successfully performed by masters of comedic delivery (witness Louis C.K. below). Since it’s all about delivery, trying it on Twitter is an incredibly bad idea.
I agree that there we’re witnessing a knee-jerk reaction right now by secular liberal Jews who are choosing to double down on traditional ideas (oh the irony) of everybody everywhere waiting with pitchforks to form pogroms out of some uncontrollable sickness with absolutely no predictability. This is much more palatable than thinking rationally about the consequences of mass immigration.
Back when Louis C.K. was younger and edgier, he walked very close to precipice:
Now he’s much more nuanced, but the genius of his comedy is that he can take a story in so many directions that the listener is amused at the controversial subject, while not being able to pinpoint if he’s poking fun of Jewish media hegemony (Schindler’s List on every channel, all the time), or stoking Jewish feelings of righteousness as the ultimate oppressed group (the “Goodbye Jew” story must be real, so Spielberg reservedly fit it in the movie).
Jerrod Carmichael does a braver job of joking about sensitive topics (such as rape and domestic abuse) than Louis C.K. does about the Holocaust there, IMO. I've mentioned this guy here before, but now his recent HBO standup special is available free on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3iR_mj-bw8&feature
He starts his rape joke at about 50 minutes in. There's also a bit about abused women, that I think comes later.
Also some stuff the iSteve crowd will likely appreciate.Replies: @Flinders Petrie
Can anyone imagine a Gentile getting away with making a biting satire of the social scene in Manhattan’s Upper West Side? Neither can I. The Royal Tenenbaums is as close as it comes and that’s too quirky and defanged to count.
If I ever had my idea for a cartoon come to fruition, one of the characters would be a Mizrahi immigrant from Israel who absolutely loathes Ashkenazis. For example, he puts on a production of “Merchant of Venice” where the bad guy’s name is changed to Shylockstein and in the end instead of forcibly being converted to Christianity he is forced to change to using the Sephardic right.
Granted, very few people would get the joke, but Big Bang Theory is popular, and I would wager that a lot of the jokes on that fly over the heads of people not interested in science.
Michelle Van Loon: Is she any relation to the twentieth-century, Dutch-American historian and writer of popular history books, Hendryk Van Loon (Fall of the Dutch Republic, The Story of Mankind, The Story of Art, etc.)? If so it’s a sad case of regression to the mean.
I’m curious. Do Jews think the rest of us sit around all day long and think about Jews and make up jokes about them?
Jews are in lots of places. But it’s not like they jump up and down and shout “HELLO!? Jew Here!!!”
Maybe it’s different in New York. But in my experience Jews do… whatever it is they do.
They just aren’t the ethnic group that worries or preoccupies most people.
“The rise in anti-Semitism in Europe has shifted the context into which Dunham, Noah and my old friend are doing their lounge acts.”
But Trevor Noah is one-quarter Jewish (on his mother’s side — maybe his mother’s mother?) and Lena Dunham’s mother is Jewish, which makes her Jewish according to Jewish custom. And Lena Dunham has said that she identifies as Jewish (or half-Jewish, at least) so her unfunny bit about Jewish boyfriends is probably something she knows from experience. If these are our anti-Semites, Lenny Bruce must have been a Nazi.
My dad was one-quarter Norwegian, the rest English and Scots-Irish. Being Norwegian was more meaningful in Wisconsin, so he identified as a Norwegian-American. He used to tell Ole and Lena (not Dunham) jokes and refer to himself deprecatingly as “just a dumb Norwegian” (this despite Norway ranking #1 in Blue-Eyed Privilege). Who knew that, all along, my dad was a raving anti-Norskite?
So someone named Michelle Van Loon who writes for Christianity Today is Jewish?
Thank god those people haven’t gotten into everything yet.
Do you know how many Jewish comedians it takes to screw in a light bulb?
None. They’re not allowed.
Okay, I admit that wasn’t too funny, but I’m no Jackie Mason, either.
How about:
How many Jewish mothers does it take to screw in a light bulb? “None, don’t worry about me, I’ll just sit here alone in the dark.”
How many libertarians does it take to screw in a light bulb? “None. The free market will take care of it.”
How many Caucasians does it take to screw in a light bulb? “None. White privilege does it for them.”
In defense of Jewish women, it is my personal experience that they have no aversion to that fairly standard sexual practice most men love more than the grand finale. It masters (mistresses?), however, are Japanese women, especially those from 30 up.
“For example, the only time that I have ever heard anyone (actually heard: not on TV, radio, etc) make a “Jewish nose” reference was when I was talking to a Jewish guy that I met some years back. He said that he spotted me for a “landsman” when he saw my “Jew nose.”
I swear, I’ve brought this up before, and it may not be scientific.
But look at old photos from the 30’s, 40’s and earlier.
You see a ton of people with great big honking schnozzes.
Where did they all go?
Sometimes I think Lysenko was on to something.
As long as Jews are the topic again, I wish a family of them would pull out the family album (well non intermixed jews, otherwise it doesn’t support my point).
I want them to check out great grandpa’s nose, and the rest of the family. Then track the shrinking noses generation by generation. I’d like to see 100% gigantic noses circa 1930 or so, then the direct descendants of those gigantic proboscis’ converge to “American Standard Nose Size.”
So in other words, “From gigantic honkers to average size ones, in a couple generations.”
That's a lot, enough to explain the phenomenon you are talking about. Better looking noses is definitely a noticeable change from the US of 30 or 40 years ago. Another striking change is straighter, whiter teeth. It's amazing how much people can be induced to spend on trivia like this.Replies: @Sunbeam
This is special pleading, and I don’t even believe it. Your friend told a Jewish joke and it was offensive? If you won’t print it I don’t believe it. i.e. “Pics or it didn’t happen.”
I gre up in an overwhelmingly Jewish community (85% Jewish, 10% black and 5% the rest of us.) As a result I’m philo-Semitic. But hey, I can appreciate a good Jewish joke, the pithier the better. As could my friends–they were the ones who told them!
Maybe it was because this was a sort-of assimilated bunch of reform Jews. Or maybe it was because they didn’t have a megaphone…the Dads were dentists and accountants, not Sheldon Adelson or Jon Stewart. (Fun fact: the moms who worked were almost all teachers. My mother who was a nurse was an outlier, but then again we were in the 5%).
All this is just to say that my take is that most assimilated Jews would tell Ms. Van Loon to drop the smelling salts and get a grip.
(By the way, Steve, I’m still waiting for you to write a post about how Jews don’t tend to establish elite private schools for themselves, unlike country clubs. (Although they might send their kids to one established by Episcopalians) but rather cluster in and take over one or more “good” suburban school districts.
It’s in your wheelhouse, man!)
Jews are White too. And that’s why Dieudonne M’bala M’bala and Trevor Noah are punching down. At the White people they hate the most (high IQ Ashkenazi) but rest assured the rest of us Whites will get it too.
Of course jokes by Noah and M’bala M’bala about high IQ Whites are not funny. As bi-racial or Black African they have the power (no jokes about say, Africans proclivity for Child Sacrifice or eating Pygmies or Albinos). After all, the fact that Africans regularly butcher and eat albinos and pygmies to get “magic powers” ought to be worth some (no pun intended) black/gallows humor. If you want to go dark and edgy, well there it is.
Not to mention the child sacrifice as African business.
Power is all about who you can make jokes about. Jews are irrevocably White and thus jokes can be made endlessly about THEM by Blacks. No jokes can be made about say, Africans regrettable belief in magic, ritual human sacrifice, and cannibalism. Just as it is against the law, literally, to make jokes about the Thai Royal Family in Thailand. Even the British Royal family is the stuff of constant spoof in Britain, tell a joke about Black people and you get arrested. Heck, have a Black Sambo doll in your window and you get arrested. Yes this actually happened.
As Steve noted, Obama is pretty funny. Henpecked, his mother in law lives with him in the White House, his wife is notably shrewish, his daughters are into thug rappers (one of whom is named no kidding “Joey Bada$$ yes with the dollar signs) and Valerie Jarrett is the obvious fantasy Black Mom figure he’s always wanted. Obama is a Harvard Grad who wants to be a legit thug like Jay-Z whom he hangs out with but is hampered by his love of Golf and Mom Jeans. He’s hilarious. But no one dares make fun of him because as a Black man he has all the power.
PS the people who really, really like Hitler are octogenarian White guys like Jean Le Pen (but obviously not his daughter who is purging him) … and Dieudonne M’bala M’bala who are united in their real dislike of Jews and their liking of Hitler.
“It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes, than to punch down,” Page writes. “Deflating the pompous and powerful can be hilarious. Ridiculing the weak is just sad.”
That’s why so many (post-) Jews like to fool Steve by talking about their grandparents and country clubs.
*http://racehist.blogspot.com/2013/04/ethnic-origins-of-forbes-world.html
**http://racehist.blogspot.com/2013/04/2012-forbes-400-by-ethnic-origins.html#moreReplies: @Whiskey, @Jonathan Silber
Money is not everything. Otherwise Taft not Ike would have got the nomination. Money is not everything, otherwise Pompey, the richest man in Rome, would have beaten Caesar. Not the other way round. Money is not everything, otherwise the Oligarchs would run Moscow not Putin. Money is not everything, otherwise Krupp would have hung Hitler, not the other way round.
Money is something. It can buy you the last plane out, an escape hatch, a bribe to get out of there. Fundamentally it cannot by itself command an army or even a mob. Ask all those rich Jews who died in places like Thierenbad thinking their money could get them out. At a certain point the money is meaningless. Money is only something that dates back to 700 BC in Lydia. Its still pretty new. It is good to have money. But don’t confuse it with power. Power gets you money. Not the other way around.
—————————
Lena Dunham must be a piece of work. She’s about 80 lbs or so overweight, at least, fairly ugly, with an abrasive personality, ugly tats making her even more ugly, and she’s surprised her actual rock star boyfriend is looking elsewhere? So she figures the best way to keep him is … insult him?
Rather than lose that 80 lbs, remove those tats, act more feminine, and get plastic surgery?
This attitude, by fat women who ought to be grateful they have a man at all, is fairly typical. I’ve seen it many times. It does not sadly seem to be confined to any regional, ethnic, or occupational group.
The Tafts although not super rich were probably richer than career military farm kid Eisenhower. However, Eisenhower was the candidate of rich liberals who knew they couldn't elect a Democrat in '52 after the loss of China, the descent of the Iron Curtain, the Rosenberg case, the Soviet Bomb, and Korea. Stevenson the Democratic nominee was a sacrificial lamb. Eisenhower was the last Republican presidential nominee endorsed by the New York Times; I'm not sure if he got a repeat endorsement from them in '56.
Agreed. How convenient that just before she writes her story, she happens to run into this guy, whom she hasn’t seen for two decades. How many leaders of a “conservative evangelical church” could she possibly know? He should be easy to identify. Another telling phrase: “…he slung his arm around my neck like a noose.” Just can’t get enough of those nooses. The whole thing is pure Cosmo drivel. Put it on the pile with “I’ll ride with you,” Haven Monahan and all those college campus nooses. They are sure that Nazis with cruel, thin lips are somewhere, waiting to pounce, but since none ever appear, just to be on the safe side, make them up. Even when the whole thing is inevitably outed as bullshit, it’s all good, because it’s given us a chance to have a conversation. By the way, when are those conservative, evangelical church people going to get the message that the love doesn’t seem to be returned.
So this fellow, was his name by chance Haven Monahan Sr?
Source?
" sailor beware the Bight of the Benin, for few come out though many go in."
Also related to humor in a way I guess :
HMS Black Joke : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Black_Joke_%281827%29
In reality, of course, over the last few years Jews have slaughtered far more Muslims than Muslims have Jews – and had it not been for Obama’s tenacious stand they would slaughtered many more. Shouldn’t they be described as “homicidal Jews”? Just asking.
Implying that making fun of Jews is not “punching up” for an American gentile.
None. They're not allowed.
Okay, I admit that wasn't too funny, but I'm no Jackie Mason, either.
How about:
How many Jewish mothers does it take to screw in a light bulb? "None, don't worry about me, I'll just sit here alone in the dark."
How many libertarians does it take to screw in a light bulb? "None. The free market will take care of it."
How many Caucasians does it take to screw in a light bulb? "None. White privilege does it for them."Replies: @Gato de la Biblioteca
Bwah! Loved the Caucasian joke!
Has it hit diminishing returns?
Adding more immigrants to real estate markets allready filled to capacity creates an increase in rent proportionately larger than the incease in population.
That’s the problem, short term immigrants increase rent, long term they will influence politics. But it is rare that short term gain loses to long term problems. Didnt Lenin say something about selling capitalists the rope to hang themselves.
If you want to throw a monkey wrentch into the immigration machine, try rent control.
The politically minded Jews I’ve dealt with (need I mention they’ve all been to the Left?) have been quite mercenary about their racial affiliation. When it suits them they claim to be as white as a Haven Monahan or a Jorge Ramos. But if the advantage lies in playing the oppressed minority card, they’re instantaneously a member of an Officially Oppressed Minority Group*. The change in status can be five days apart, five minutes apart, or five sentences apart.
(Do Jews have anything to match this as far as racial self-proclamation?)
* Exactly how oppressed have Jews been in America? I know about the country club thing and US Grant’s General Order No. 11 (1862), but as oppressed minorities in the US that puts them well behind Blacks, Indians, Chinese, and Japanese. Maybe even the Irish, to hear every single person who’s ever worn green on St. Patrick’s Day tell it.
Back when the New York Stock Exchange was created by the signing of the Buttonwood agreement in 1792, 5 of 24 signatories were Jewish. This was at a time when less than 0.05 percent of Americans were Jewish.
Not only were Jews not excluded from the establishment back in the 1960s (Barry Goldwater was the first Jewish man on a presidential ticket), they weren't excluded back in the 1700s either.
Here's a quote from President George Washington:The reason it seems like anti-semitism was pervasive in the past was because anti-black sentiment was pervasive in the past. So it seems logical to think that if Americans kept blacks out of the establishment, they behaved similarly towards Jews. The reality is that not only were Jews welcomed in, Jews were historically respected (and even mildly feared) by white gentile elites.
When Jews socialized apart from white gentiles and had their own country clubs, that was NOT because white gentiles didn't want to socialize with Jews. It was because Jews didn't want to socialize with gentiles. Jews have historically been very clash and often viewed socialization as a path to assimilation and intermarriage, which they feared. Eastern European Jews were historically excluded from fancier German Jewish clubs though. So when you hear stories about Jews being excluded from clubs, it was a question of Eastern Europeans being discriminated against by Germans. Not gentiles against Jews. As Steve Sailer has pointed out, Jews historically were big on eating, but didn't care much for drinking or gold ,which were two interests of gentiles. So that's why Eastern Euro Jews wanted to join German Jewish clubs.
As for General Grant's order to excluded Jewish merchants from the North-South border, that order came because Jewish merchants were helping to evade the blockade of the South. That order was immediately rescinded. When he ran for president after the civil war, Grant apologized profusely to Jews. He even went on to run what many saw as the most pro-Jewish administration in the history of America. So even this incident of "anti-semitism" was actually a common sense policy that was controversial due to mid 1800s political correctness towards Jews.
It's pretty shameful for Jews to even bring up that incident. You would think they'd feel ashamed that their community was involved in undermining the war effort against the Confederacy, but no. They're not ashamed. It's gentiles who are supposed to feel ashamed for trying to win the civil war.
Jews may be one of the least discriminated groups in the history of America. If you read American history, it's striking how little anti-Jewish discrimination you'd find.Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi, @Glaivester
I just an excellent article in the Washington Post. I can’t believe they published it.
“America needs to curb immigration flows” by Senator Jeff Sessions.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/slow-the-immigration-wave/2015/04/09/c6d8e3d4-dd52-11e4-a500-1c5bb1d8ff6a_story.html?tid=trending_strip_6
Let me quote an excerpt:
Another excerpt:
By the way, Senator Sessions confirms what I’ve been saying about robotics taking over human labor functions.
Well said, Mr. Senator.
And one last question: Is America so devoid of comedic talent that Comedy central had to import yet one more Third Worlder to do the work that Americans just aren’t allowed to do?
Consider if a white comedian told a joke about black people dying on slave ships. They would not have hesitated to fire him in less than a minute of reflection. And Those murders happened hundreds of years ago rather than within many living peoples lifetimes.
Joking about Jewish parsimony or Jewish women refusing to perform certain types of sexual favors should be accepted as healthy ribbing. Some of these jokes can be amusing and should not be banned by the politically correct police.
Other white ethnic groups are allowed to take ribbing as well.
I am really bothered by people calling the joke about fat girls as "misogynist." That screams of politically correct thought police. We're not allowed to acknowledge that there are some women who are overweight that like to believe they are God's gift to the Earth? That is a crime against womanhood?Replies: @SPMoore8, @ben tillman, @ben tillman, @Anon, @tsotha
I agree. Telling holocaust jokes shouldn’t be illegal, but that doesn’t mean companies should let their brand be associated with that kind of humor.
To an SJW, what could be more hip than a black third world guy?
I think it had more to do with finding the right black guy for the job.
The premise of the article seems absurd and alarmist to me. I realize that people like Jeffrey Goldberg will nurse bullying from their childhood but I am relatively certain this is uncommon. I guess you have to be in certain parts of the country.
On Wednesday, the American Jewish Congress launched an online campaign calling for Comedy Central to send Noah packing. That's not surprising.
And the Chicago Tribune’s Clarence Page wrote on Wednesday about the unwritten rules of comedy etiquette.
The "punch up, punch down" that Page is referencing has to with "Jews, other minorities, and women." To say that Jews are "weak" in American society is nonsense.
Look, the reason Noah is in trouble is because his references to Jews are ultimately references to Israel, and Israel must be perceived as weak because otherwise its conduct is called more into question. Nor is criticism of Israel necessarily anti-Semitic; any country that portrayed itself as a first world nation would come into similar criticism if it was controlling the lives of an almost equal number of non-citizens. And that's ultimately the reason why the AJC wants him out.
The internal contradictions involved in Israel's control over millions of non-Jews isn't going to go away by proscribing Jewish jokes. Nor even by forbidding an open discussion of these problems.Replies: @Desiderius, @Wizard of Oz
That’s one way to put it. A lot of the bullying is general “elite” bullying of the common man and/or Yankee bullying of the Old/New South, with Jews just joining in. It’s recently taken on anti-Christian overtones when it can readily get away with it (Indiana, etc…), but again it’s as much post-Christians doing it as Jews.
No, post-Christians are really to blame. Even though post-Christians have been the movers and shakers in the US power elite ever since Thomas Jefferson and his Weird Mason Posse took over the place. Some how, some way, the people to blame have to have "Christian" or "Puritan" in their name. I mean, after all, Curtis Yarvin said so, and he has no beef with Christians, does he?
The few northern WASPs who pay much attention to the South tend to have positive feelings rather than negative. Have you ever heard of a reënactment breaking out into genuine battle?
Granted, very few people would get the joke, but Big Bang Theory is popular, and I would wager that a lot of the jokes on that fly over the heads of people not interested in science.Replies: @whahae
There is a comedy about a Mizrahi family on Israeli television called Zagouri Empire. It includes an episode where the father of the family disdains Holocaust day because it ignores Mizrahi suffering.
Does this mean that it is no longer acceptable for Jewish comedians to make fun of white Christians who live in trailer parks in Appalachia? Or are white Appalachians considered to be among the pompous and powerful?Replies: @Anonymous
Yeah, I’ve always found it strange that some people get so much enjoyment making fun of poor whites.
My grandmother lived in a trailer for several years after her retirement. She and her neighbours were actually perfectly pleasant people. (Maybe they were an anomaly?)
I just got the feeling that they were normal people who didn’t have a lot of money for housing, but country types, who weren’t well suited to ‘apartment living ‘.
That people who are liberal, and otherwise socially aware would label another human being ‘trash’ so casually, has always bothered me, there’s just something very ‘off’ about it.
I’ve actually called people out on this a few times (and spoiled a few otherwise pleasant evenings)
Maybe the good ones charge a little more in rent and kick out any scumbags who happen to move in? Anyway, it's interesting.
What worries me is how this country forces Jewish jokes to be taken seriously.
Must we take the likes of Adelson, Erdely, Nuland, and Friedman seriously?
I don’t know what the mortality rate was , but they did have this rhyme about the trade :
” sailor beware the Bight of the Benin, for few come out though many go in.”
Also related to humor in a way I guess :
HMS Black Joke : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Black_Joke_%281827%29
(Do Jews have anything to match this as far as racial self-proclamation?)
* Exactly how oppressed have Jews been in America? I know about the country club thing and US Grant's General Order No. 11 (1862), but as oppressed minorities in the US that puts them well behind Blacks, Indians, Chinese, and Japanese. Maybe even the Irish, to hear every single person who's ever worn green on St. Patrick's Day tell it.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @Brutusale
Not oppressed at all. They’ve historically been very privileged.
Back when the New York Stock Exchange was created by the signing of the Buttonwood agreement in 1792, 5 of 24 signatories were Jewish. This was at a time when less than 0.05 percent of Americans were Jewish.
Not only were Jews not excluded from the establishment back in the 1960s (Barry Goldwater was the first Jewish man on a presidential ticket), they weren’t excluded back in the 1700s either.
Here’s a quote from President George Washington:
The reason it seems like anti-semitism was pervasive in the past was because anti-black sentiment was pervasive in the past. So it seems logical to think that if Americans kept blacks out of the establishment, they behaved similarly towards Jews. The reality is that not only were Jews welcomed in, Jews were historically respected (and even mildly feared) by white gentile elites.
When Jews socialized apart from white gentiles and had their own country clubs, that was NOT because white gentiles didn’t want to socialize with Jews. It was because Jews didn’t want to socialize with gentiles. Jews have historically been very clash and often viewed socialization as a path to assimilation and intermarriage, which they feared. Eastern European Jews were historically excluded from fancier German Jewish clubs though. So when you hear stories about Jews being excluded from clubs, it was a question of Eastern Europeans being discriminated against by Germans. Not gentiles against Jews. As Steve Sailer has pointed out, Jews historically were big on eating, but didn’t care much for drinking or gold ,which were two interests of gentiles. So that’s why Eastern Euro Jews wanted to join German Jewish clubs.
As for General Grant’s order to excluded Jewish merchants from the North-South border, that order came because Jewish merchants were helping to evade the blockade of the South. That order was immediately rescinded. When he ran for president after the civil war, Grant apologized profusely to Jews. He even went on to run what many saw as the most pro-Jewish administration in the history of America. So even this incident of “anti-semitism” was actually a common sense policy that was controversial due to mid 1800s political correctness towards Jews.
It’s pretty shameful for Jews to even bring up that incident. You would think they’d feel ashamed that their community was involved in undermining the war effort against the Confederacy, but no. They’re not ashamed. It’s gentiles who are supposed to feel ashamed for trying to win the civil war.
Jews may be one of the least discriminated groups in the history of America. If you read American history, it’s striking how little anti-Jewish discrimination you’d find.
Jews also played a major role on the side of the Confederacy.
Here's the question that's seldom ever allowed to be answered. If Jews have had an Antebellum presence (and they have) how exactly did they earn their money in the South prior to the Civil War?
There was only one main way to earn tons of wealth in the pre-Civil War South as the entire economy centered around slavery in one form or another.
It isn't as if they were getting rich simply because they had opened general store chains across the South during this time.
How did Southern Jews in pre-Civil War era earn their money?
That's a fair question, because it might go a long way to explaining how established wealthy families were living in the South in Antebellum times.Replies: @Rotten, @JohnnyWalker123
I am going to assume you mean "drinking or golf?"Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @SFG
The large number of Christians in Indiana and Arkansas who had their religious freedom law overturned by Marc Benioff will be surprised, as will any Protestant with a case before the US Supreme Court.Replies: @josh
How many Polacks does it take to do humor wrong? Seriously, isn’t the Daily Show’s whole MO punching down?
I agree that there we're witnessing a knee-jerk reaction right now by secular liberal Jews who are choosing to double down on traditional ideas (oh the irony) of everybody everywhere waiting with pitchforks to form pogroms out of some uncontrollable sickness with absolutely no predictability. This is much more palatable than thinking rationally about the consequences of mass immigration.
Back when Louis C.K. was younger and edgier, he walked very close to precipice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acs3rL45CJU
Now he's much more nuanced, but the genius of his comedy is that he can take a story in so many directions that the listener is amused at the controversial subject, while not being able to pinpoint if he's poking fun of Jewish media hegemony (Schindler's List on every channel, all the time), or stoking Jewish feelings of righteousness as the ultimate oppressed group (the "Goodbye Jew" story must be real, so Spielberg reservedly fit it in the movie).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJKEllVrlUwReplies: @Dave Pinsen, @Bill
Louis C.K. is part Jewish himself. And you’re reading a bit too much into his Schindler’s List bit. There’s nothing in there about “Jewish media hegemony”. The crux of the bit is the juxtapositions, between the solemnity of the subject of the movie and the banality of the conventions of making it, and between the sentiment of “bye Jews” and the inherent cuteness of the girl actresses auditioning the line.
Jerrod Carmichael does a braver job of joking about sensitive topics (such as rape and domestic abuse) than Louis C.K. does about the Holocaust there, IMO. I’ve mentioned this guy here before, but now his recent HBO standup special is available free on YouTube:
He starts his rape joke at about 50 minutes in. There’s also a bit about abused women, that I think comes later.
Also some stuff the iSteve crowd will likely appreciate.
Thanks for the Jerrod Carmichael link. I haven't seen his work before, but a quick perusal of that video looked promising.
I knew I was saving this for a reason:
What’s lost in “Unclean Lips” is the thrill obscenity can create. It’s the sharp dangerous edge of anarchy and when used effectively, it can BLEEP up the most carefully planned cocktail party, smashing all propriety to BLEEP
Speaking of Seinfeld, thidid you know he has your number one album of the week in Los Estados Unidos?
“It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes, than to punch down,”
surreal
Half of my Dad’s side of our family will smother you with a bowling shirt.
Anon, Flinders, and Beach: I had exactly the same thought (naturally, as an iSteve reader!). The “tell” to me is that of all the descriptions she could have used, she brings up the stereotype that most rankles liberals: Israel-loving, conservative, evangelical. And then of course, she neglects to let the reader judge the joke itself: we have only her word that it’s anti-Semetic. As a person who knows funny from not-funny, I’d say she seems too humorless to trust in this situation.
What I want to point up is the negligence of the EDITOR of this WaPo piece–and the general editorial malfeasance across the board that permits this low-level of writing to be published. Any solid editor would have called her on that anecdote–“Sounds too perfect, sweetheart; can you show me that it really happened?”–and would have struck it before publication/broadcast.
Because they’re mostly invisible to the reader, editors are not called to account in our media culture. But a lot of the lousiness of expression and style in today’s media would, in former days, have never made it through an editorial gatekeeper. If our side started calling out the ones who let this drivel through, we might see less of it.
Please.
Jerrod Carmichael does a braver job of joking about sensitive topics (such as rape and domestic abuse) than Louis C.K. does about the Holocaust there, IMO. I've mentioned this guy here before, but now his recent HBO standup special is available free on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3iR_mj-bw8&feature
He starts his rape joke at about 50 minutes in. There's also a bit about abused women, that I think comes later.
Also some stuff the iSteve crowd will likely appreciate.Replies: @Flinders Petrie
My point about Louis C.K. is that he takes the story in different directions so that it leaves open the possibility for the listener to read into what he’s saying. Yes, he’s part Jewish, and in interviews, he’s unabashedly liberal, but he’s also very smart with his comedy. His comedy doesn’t bludgeon you with his political beliefs; rather, he spends more time poking fun of his own belief system, mostly with self deprecation, but a lot of his examples of annoying others are either typically liberal, or at least not typically conservative.
Thanks for the Jerrod Carmichael link. I haven’t seen his work before, but a quick perusal of that video looked promising.
I believe the word you’re looking for is “chutzpah”.
Upon further reflection, I wonder if this plays into the “market dominant minority” theory that Steve’s written about in the past?
To wit, approximately 95% of all Jewish jokes I’ve ever heard in my life came from Jews. The other (approximately) 5% were essentially backhanded German jokes. Jews are disproportionately represented amongst comedians and comedy writers. A substantial proportion of any Jewish comedian’s routine (or sit-com) involves pointing out the humorous idiosyncrasies of growing up Jewish. Jackie Mason–>Philip Roth–>Gary Chandling–>Jerry Seinfeld–>Larry David–>Judd Apatow–>Jeff Ross/Sarah Silverman–>”The Goldbergs”. Yes, there are dozens of data points before, after and in between.
Perhaps the Jewish minority is attempting to keep dominating that particular comedy market? This closing of ranks may explain why half and quarter Jews like Dunham and Noah have suddenly had their carte blanche, for lack of a better term, revoked.
I never heard of the incident before last year. I’ve never brought it up. I’m “Jews.” But it is a part of US history, so why not mention it.
Sailer, you’ve gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don’t have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he’s a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.
For example, the reason I started posting here is because this was the only place, apart from Richard Bradley's blog, that talked about the UVA case at all.
On the the the other hand, there have been no less than six articles, with very long threads, about the shooting of Walter Scott over at The Atlantic, so why not go there?
I would never dream of going on an OT rant at the The Atlantic because they were avoiding Jackie's Story. I don't know why the non-discussion of Walter Scott here is relevant.
WRT the topic in question: Jews are not powerless, as van Loon suggested (she actually didn't even quote Page correctly.) Nor was the silly Jewish pedestrian-German car tweet a "Holocaust joke" nor even "an insensitive Holocaust joke". Therefore if someone wants to call out Noah and get him fired, it must be for some other reason. That reason is not hard to find: he has been critical of Israel. That's basically it.Replies: @Anonymous, @Sunbeam
So Steve Sailer has an "anti-Jew allergy". I don't see it. Perhaps I don't read his blog as often as someone who detects that allergy. Still it's possible I suppose that Steve's Ashkenazi genes could somehow have set off a funny immune reaction in him....
I swear, I've brought this up before, and it may not be scientific.
But look at old photos from the 30's, 40's and earlier.
You see a ton of people with great big honking schnozzes.
Where did they all go?
Sometimes I think Lysenko was on to something.
As long as Jews are the topic again, I wish a family of them would pull out the family album (well non intermixed jews, otherwise it doesn't support my point).
I want them to check out great grandpa's nose, and the rest of the family. Then track the shrinking noses generation by generation. I'd like to see 100% gigantic noses circa 1930 or so, then the direct descendants of those gigantic proboscis' converge to "American Standard Nose Size."
So in other words, "From gigantic honkers to average size ones, in a couple generations."Replies: @BurplesonAFB, @syonredux, @Bill
plastic surgery and intermarriage of those ethnics with large noses with the, you know, normal folks.
Its going to collapse under its own gravity within our lifetimes. Only question is how far the reaction will go.
I swear, I've brought this up before, and it may not be scientific.
But look at old photos from the 30's, 40's and earlier.
You see a ton of people with great big honking schnozzes.
Where did they all go?
Sometimes I think Lysenko was on to something.
As long as Jews are the topic again, I wish a family of them would pull out the family album (well non intermixed jews, otherwise it doesn't support my point).
I want them to check out great grandpa's nose, and the rest of the family. Then track the shrinking noses generation by generation. I'd like to see 100% gigantic noses circa 1930 or so, then the direct descendants of those gigantic proboscis' converge to "American Standard Nose Size."
So in other words, "From gigantic honkers to average size ones, in a couple generations."Replies: @BurplesonAFB, @syonredux, @Bill
RE: Noses changing shape over the generations:
William Dean Howells, The Rise of Silas Lapham
I guess the Irish must not be integrated either since it is common to hear people make jokes about drunken Irishmen. Of course, a lot of the people making those jokes are Jewish.Replies: @Tim Malone
One thing’s for sure about Mayor Bloomberg’s next career: It won’t be in comedy.
The mayor’s stand-up act fell flat Wednesday night when he told a crowd at the American Irish Historical Society that he’s used to seeing drunks hanging out the windows of its Fifth Avenue headquarters, around the corner from his town house on East 79th Street, the Irish Central Web site reported.
“I live in the neighborhood, right around the corner,” the mayor said. “Normally, when I walk by this building, there are a bunch of people that are totally inebriated hanging out the window. I know that’s a stereotype about the Irish, but nevertheless, we Jews around the corner think this.”
“ridiculing the weak is just sad.”
Which is why we must never mock Sheldon Adelson, Paul Singer, Bernard Marcus, Mike Bloomberg, Haim Shaban, George Soros, David Gelbaum, or Marc Benioff.
“Deflating the pompous and powerful can be hilarious”
Which is why the character “Freakshow” from Harold And Kumar Go To White Castle is, as TAC’s Noah Millman raves, such a “rollicking good time”.
The inbred-subhuman-redneck stereotype helps deflate those pompous and powerful working class, old stock White Americans.
We should all thank Hollywood for its endless stream of movies like Deliverance and Wrong Turn.
But jokes with punchlines about frugality? Those are just plain nasty.
We should all thank Hollywood for its endless stream of movies like Deliverance and Wrong Turn.
But jokes with punchlines about frugality? Those are just plain nasty."
And if anti-Semitism ever takes root in this country, I'm sure that Jews will sit around scratching their heads about why. They'll be completely surprised, though many act like they are in constant danger alreadfy.
“It is funnier to punch up, as the old saying goes, than to punch down,”
Old saying, my ass. I never even heard the phrase “punch up” until after Obama was elected. More rewriting of history by our repulsive SJW class…
It’s obviously a lie. Christian Zionists don’t tell Jew jokes. Christian Zionists don’t know any Jews. Jews don’t know any Christian Zionists. They don’t even live in the same states. Every basis of the story is retarded. I’m sure Van Loon’s friends and relatives thought it was very funny, though.
I like these Chomsky-style lies. She does not come out and say, explicitly, that “toxic stereotypes” about Jews are not fading. Her sentence makes no sense without that “fact,” though. It’s a kind of lying by encouraging your audience to adopt a question’s false predicate. Is there a technical name for this particular type of lying? It, and relatives, are the main rhetorical techniques in “Distortions at Fourth Hand” and in the relevant sections of *Political Economy of Human Rights* where Chomsky uses them to deny the Cambodian genocide.
One of the things that makes this technique so fun is the spergsplosions it causes in a certain type of leftoid. They start out by telling you “the Cambodian genocide didn’t happen” or “Americans hold toxic stereotypes about Jews.” Asked for evidence, they produce texts with this kind of lying in them. When you point them to actual evidence that, say, the Cambodian genocide did occur or that “toxic stereotypes” about Jews are rare and rapidly fading in America, they then switch to claiming that Chomsky/Van Loon aren’t liars because they never explicitly said what, five minutes before, they were congratulating the authors for having shown them.
Obviously, the “toxic stereotypes” about Jews have been very rapidly fading from American society. Most Americans don’t even know that the Jews control Hollywood or that they control the pornography industry or that Israel is a major buyer on the human trafficking market or that Jews are the middlemen in much of the international human trafficking market or that the “Russian mafia” is Jewish.
My grandmother lived in a trailer for several years after her retirement. She and her neighbours were actually perfectly pleasant people. (Maybe they were an anomaly?)
I just got the feeling that they were normal people who didn't have a lot of money for housing, but country types, who weren't well suited to 'apartment living '.
That people who are liberal, and otherwise socially aware would label another human being 'trash' so casually, has always bothered me, there's just something very 'off' about it.
I've actually called people out on this a few times (and spoiled a few otherwise pleasant evenings)Replies: @Bill
I, too, find this interesting. There seem to be good trailer parks and bad trailer parks. I’ve been to several good ones, so I’m confident that they exist. The good ones I’ve been to are full of retirees and seemingly solid working class families. Clean, attractive trailers. Neatly tended gardens in front. No litter. Etc. Totally different from the trailer parks you see on COPS or drive by without stopping.
Maybe the good ones charge a little more in rent and kick out any scumbags who happen to move in? Anyway, it’s interesting.
I swear, I've brought this up before, and it may not be scientific.
But look at old photos from the 30's, 40's and earlier.
You see a ton of people with great big honking schnozzes.
Where did they all go?
Sometimes I think Lysenko was on to something.
As long as Jews are the topic again, I wish a family of them would pull out the family album (well non intermixed jews, otherwise it doesn't support my point).
I want them to check out great grandpa's nose, and the rest of the family. Then track the shrinking noses generation by generation. I'd like to see 100% gigantic noses circa 1930 or so, then the direct descendants of those gigantic proboscis' converge to "American Standard Nose Size."
So in other words, "From gigantic honkers to average size ones, in a couple generations."Replies: @BurplesonAFB, @syonredux, @Bill
Giant noses tend not to manifest in childhood. When they do manifest, in the teenage years, there are nosejobs. There are 250K nosejobs per year in the US. Since that is a flow rather than a stock, you want to compare it to the size of an annual birth cohort. So, the right denominator is something like 2.5 million (roughly the number of 20 year olds in 2000). That’s 10% of the population getting nose jobs. Now, it’s probably not quite that high. A few people get multiple nose jobs. There are some older people for whom nose jobs were not really a thing when they were young who are getting them now. But 10% is certainly the right order of magnitude.
That’s a lot, enough to explain the phenomenon you are talking about. Better looking noses is definitely a noticeable change from the US of 30 or 40 years ago. Another striking change is straighter, whiter teeth. It’s amazing how much people can be induced to spend on trivia like this.
I agree that there we're witnessing a knee-jerk reaction right now by secular liberal Jews who are choosing to double down on traditional ideas (oh the irony) of everybody everywhere waiting with pitchforks to form pogroms out of some uncontrollable sickness with absolutely no predictability. This is much more palatable than thinking rationally about the consequences of mass immigration.
Back when Louis C.K. was younger and edgier, he walked very close to precipice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acs3rL45CJU
Now he's much more nuanced, but the genius of his comedy is that he can take a story in so many directions that the listener is amused at the controversial subject, while not being able to pinpoint if he's poking fun of Jewish media hegemony (Schindler's List on every channel, all the time), or stoking Jewish feelings of righteousness as the ultimate oppressed group (the "Goodbye Jew" story must be real, so Spielberg reservedly fit it in the movie).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJKEllVrlUwReplies: @Dave Pinsen, @Bill
Always is a long time. It even extends back to before WWII.
Wasn’t it Groucho Marx who said, “I’d never join a club that would have me as a member”? Or was that Woody Allen?
The United States of America welcomed the chosen as members, and still some of them cannot accept that.
It’s just a big coincidence that explicit hatred of Christianity and enthusiastic embrace of deviance happened at the exact moment that Jews established control of the cultural institutions of the US.
No, post-Christians are really to blame. Even though post-Christians have been the movers and shakers in the US power elite ever since Thomas Jefferson and his Weird Mason Posse took over the place. Some how, some way, the people to blame have to have “Christian” or “Puritan” in their name. I mean, after all, Curtis Yarvin said so, and he has no beef with Christians, does he?
Must we take the likes of Adelson, Erdely, Nuland, and Friedman seriously?Replies: @Bill
No, we don’t have to take them seriously. The women and children in Donetsk with artillery raining down on their heads, they have to take them seriously. But not us.
Q: Why do Jewish men have to be circumcised?
A: Because a Jewish woman won’t touch anything that’s not at least 20% off.
Not to worry: I’m writing from my Safe Place of privilege as a member of that oppressed minority, American Jews.
*http://racehist.blogspot.com/2013/04/ethnic-origins-of-forbes-world.html
**http://racehist.blogspot.com/2013/04/2012-forbes-400-by-ethnic-origins.html#moreReplies: @Whiskey, @Jonathan Silber
I love it when the weak, oppressed comedian Sacha Baron Cohen ridicules the pompous, powerful peasants of Kazahkstan.
Sailer, you've gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don't have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he's a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.Replies: @SPMoore8, @reiner Tor, @D. K., @Rifleman, @tomv, @Anonymous
I think it’s a good idea to understand that, if you want to ventilate about this or that current issue, you have to pick your spots. That’s why there is an internet.
For example, the reason I started posting here is because this was the only place, apart from Richard Bradley’s blog, that talked about the UVA case at all.
On the the the other hand, there have been no less than six articles, with very long threads, about the shooting of Walter Scott over at The Atlantic, so why not go there?
I would never dream of going on an OT rant at the The Atlantic because they were avoiding Jackie’s Story. I don’t know why the non-discussion of Walter Scott here is relevant.
WRT the topic in question: Jews are not powerless, as van Loon suggested (she actually didn’t even quote Page correctly.) Nor was the silly Jewish pedestrian-German car tweet a “Holocaust joke” nor even “an insensitive Holocaust joke”. Therefore if someone wants to call out Noah and get him fired, it must be for some other reason. That reason is not hard to find: he has been critical of Israel. That’s basically it.
For what it's worth I just read an article and watched that videotape. There really isn't a context here as far as I can tell.
This incident is so ludicrous it's almost like someone wrote a script and filmed it.
I wonder if he discharged his taser at all or if they found fingerprints of the dead man on it. Anyway for what's it worth this one sure has the hallmarks of a wrongful killing and a cover up.
So there. Seriously this video is just plain crazy. I'd actually like to see this one go to court and see the officer and his friends get cross examined.
And before anyone gets bent out of shape, be honest. Would you want this guy in your neighborhood? Patrolling with a weapon? Why did he shoot the guy? I can't gather that one from the tape. And how did the guy in the car not see anything?
Anyway as you said it will be discussed ad infinitum.Replies: @reiner Tor
It is fairly standard for Jewish girls to get a nosejob as a birthday present during their teenage years. It’s often euphamistically referred to as getting surgery for a “deviated septum”.
Like I’ve been saying, 2015′s Muslim massacres of Jews in Europe has prodded a few of the smarter, funnier, more self-aware American Jews toward an agonizing reappraisal of their ancestral Diversity Uber Alles ideology. Has it hit diminishing returns?
A writer you haven’t yet mentioned in connection with this trend, but who’s worth keeping an eye on, is David Auerbach, Slate’s technology columnist, who became an SJW target for pointing out that when journalists responded to Gamergate by unanimously declaring that “gamers must die,” they were pretty much proving the gamers’ point.
He’s an old-fashioned left-wing literary mandarin in the Susan Sontag mold (in addition to writing for Slate, he publishes essays on polysyllabic European modernists in highbrow journals.) Watching him interact with SJWs in his writing and tweets, one gets the sense of a very smart guy becoming increasingly exasperated with nominal allies who are several standard deviations dumber than he is. The kind of nuanced theoretical distinctions you can get away with in an Ivy League seminar might as well be heresy to the lumpenintelligentsia who took a freshman sociology lecture at State U and are baying for blood.
I’m unable to get all the way through his turgid High Theory thinkpiece on social justice politics, but the gist of it seems to be the uneasy realization that encouraging a climate of hair-trigger outrage is going to be Bad For The Left in the long run.
What I want to point up is the negligence of the EDITOR of this WaPo piece--and the general editorial malfeasance across the board that permits this low-level of writing to be published. Any solid editor would have called her on that anecdote--"Sounds too perfect, sweetheart; can you show me that it really happened?"--and would have struck it before publication/broadcast.
Because they're mostly invisible to the reader, editors are not called to account in our media culture. But a lot of the lousiness of expression and style in today's media would, in former days, have never made it through an editorial gatekeeper. If our side started calling out the ones who let this drivel through, we might see less of it.Replies: @Jonathan Silber
What is the likelihood that an old friend, on running into you for the first time in twenty years, would, within thirty seconds, go right into telling a Jewish joke?
Please.
Funny how comedians like Sarah Silverman or Don Rickles can say anything about any other race, but as soon as another comedian wants to make jokes about Jews it is a different story.
Which is why we must never mock Sheldon Adelson, Paul Singer, Bernard Marcus, Mike Bloomberg, Haim Shaban, George Soros, David Gelbaum, or Marc Benioff.
"Deflating the pompous and powerful can be hilarious"
Which is why the character "Freakshow" from Harold And Kumar Go To White Castle is, as TAC's Noah Millman raves, such a "rollicking good time".
The inbred-subhuman-redneck stereotype helps deflate those pompous and powerful working class, old stock White Americans.
We should all thank Hollywood for its endless stream of movies like Deliverance and Wrong Turn.
But jokes with punchlines about frugality? Those are just plain nasty.Replies: @OilcanFloyd
“The inbred-subhuman-redneck stereotype helps deflate those pompous and powerful working class, old stock White Americans.
We should all thank Hollywood for its endless stream of movies like Deliverance and Wrong Turn.
But jokes with punchlines about frugality? Those are just plain nasty.”
And if anti-Semitism ever takes root in this country, I’m sure that Jews will sit around scratching their heads about why. They’ll be completely surprised, though many act like they are in constant danger alreadfy.
To really understand Jews you need to spend a couple of summers working at one of their summer camps – when their guard is down . I did that in the early 80s and came away knowing that they hunt as a pack and when their racial interests are at stake then it’s all-out-war.
For example, the reason I started posting here is because this was the only place, apart from Richard Bradley's blog, that talked about the UVA case at all.
On the the the other hand, there have been no less than six articles, with very long threads, about the shooting of Walter Scott over at The Atlantic, so why not go there?
I would never dream of going on an OT rant at the The Atlantic because they were avoiding Jackie's Story. I don't know why the non-discussion of Walter Scott here is relevant.
WRT the topic in question: Jews are not powerless, as van Loon suggested (she actually didn't even quote Page correctly.) Nor was the silly Jewish pedestrian-German car tweet a "Holocaust joke" nor even "an insensitive Holocaust joke". Therefore if someone wants to call out Noah and get him fired, it must be for some other reason. That reason is not hard to find: he has been critical of Israel. That's basically it.Replies: @Anonymous, @Sunbeam
What is this…’meanwhile a black guy was gunned down by dirty cop’ stuff really all about?
Psychologically, many Jews see themselves as that poor black guy. You’re very invested in being a victim of that brutish white authority figure.
But it’s a completely skewed view of reality, nobody (including blacks) see it this way. You are much more akin to the powerful cop now, than his innocent victim.
This is the truth. As hard as it may be for you to process, it’s reality.
>“Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions.<
called for rainReplies: @Forbes, @Jacobite
Actually, there is a defense. I respond with: “That’s the nicest thing you ever said about me.”
It immediately disarms the speaker, as it is the last thing expected after being ridiculed.
Ridicule is about triggering a response–anger, embarrassment, whatever… It is defeated by being (or reacting) as impervious to it–not being sucked into it’s intention. A little self-confidence and determination go a long way. Not being thin-skinned helps.
Back when the New York Stock Exchange was created by the signing of the Buttonwood agreement in 1792, 5 of 24 signatories were Jewish. This was at a time when less than 0.05 percent of Americans were Jewish.
Not only were Jews not excluded from the establishment back in the 1960s (Barry Goldwater was the first Jewish man on a presidential ticket), they weren't excluded back in the 1700s either.
Here's a quote from President George Washington:The reason it seems like anti-semitism was pervasive in the past was because anti-black sentiment was pervasive in the past. So it seems logical to think that if Americans kept blacks out of the establishment, they behaved similarly towards Jews. The reality is that not only were Jews welcomed in, Jews were historically respected (and even mildly feared) by white gentile elites.
When Jews socialized apart from white gentiles and had their own country clubs, that was NOT because white gentiles didn't want to socialize with Jews. It was because Jews didn't want to socialize with gentiles. Jews have historically been very clash and often viewed socialization as a path to assimilation and intermarriage, which they feared. Eastern European Jews were historically excluded from fancier German Jewish clubs though. So when you hear stories about Jews being excluded from clubs, it was a question of Eastern Europeans being discriminated against by Germans. Not gentiles against Jews. As Steve Sailer has pointed out, Jews historically were big on eating, but didn't care much for drinking or gold ,which were two interests of gentiles. So that's why Eastern Euro Jews wanted to join German Jewish clubs.
As for General Grant's order to excluded Jewish merchants from the North-South border, that order came because Jewish merchants were helping to evade the blockade of the South. That order was immediately rescinded. When he ran for president after the civil war, Grant apologized profusely to Jews. He even went on to run what many saw as the most pro-Jewish administration in the history of America. So even this incident of "anti-semitism" was actually a common sense policy that was controversial due to mid 1800s political correctness towards Jews.
It's pretty shameful for Jews to even bring up that incident. You would think they'd feel ashamed that their community was involved in undermining the war effort against the Confederacy, but no. They're not ashamed. It's gentiles who are supposed to feel ashamed for trying to win the civil war.
Jews may be one of the least discriminated groups in the history of America. If you read American history, it's striking how little anti-Jewish discrimination you'd find.Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi, @Glaivester
And the irony of course, is that Eastern European Jews faced some of their biggest discrimination from other Jews, namely, the German Jews who had been here for much longer and were on their way to near full assimilation. Some of the derogatory terms used toward Jews originated from German Jews, by the way as Thomas Sowell among others have written.
Jews also played a major role on the side of the Confederacy.
Here’s the question that’s seldom ever allowed to be answered. If Jews have had an Antebellum presence (and they have) how exactly did they earn their money in the South prior to the Civil War?
There was only one main way to earn tons of wealth in the pre-Civil War South as the entire economy centered around slavery in one form or another.
It isn’t as if they were getting rich simply because they had opened general store chains across the South during this time.
How did Southern Jews in pre-Civil War era earn their money?
That’s a fair question, because it might go a long way to explaining how established wealthy families were living in the South in Antebellum times.
The Confederate flag's original design was changed due to fear of offending Jews.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-politically-correct-origin-of-the-confederate-battle-flag/
Benjamin P. Judah was the Confederate Secretary of State.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judah_P._Benjamin
Lehman Brothers was founded by Southern Jews and was actively involved in the slave trade
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehman_Brothers
Sailer, you've gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don't have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he's a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.Replies: @SPMoore8, @reiner Tor, @D. K., @Rifleman, @tomv, @Anonymous
Bemused, Steve Sailer didn’t jump on the frat boys’ story very quickly. He checked the facts a lot, commented six times on Bradley’s blog, before bringing in Bradley’s blog post. I think there’s a good chance that the MSM has a point in the Walter Scott case, namely that Walter Scott was indeed shot unlawfully. At least it’s quite possible that unlike Michael Brown etc. Walter Scott wasn’t a criminal. And if so, why should Steve blog about it? He’s not a replication of the MSM, he only writes about what the MSM distorts or doesn’t report at all.
As to Liz Seccuro, it’s not quite sure what has happened to her. What is sure is that some badness did happen, because the guy felt he mistreated her, and that she regretted the thing the next day. Losing her virginity was also a big deal for her, she mentioned it several times.
However, badness doesn’t mean rape. Her story has many glaring holes. She claims to have gone to the campus administration, to the campus police, and to the hospital, and that she was ignored by all of these parties. Of course her visits have no official records, and nobody else remembers them. The alleged rapist went back to the scene some time (maybe a few days) later, because he left his leather jacket there, but he didn’t meet her because she happened to have been away from her room.
So it turns out that there’s an alcoholic who – as part of a, by the way, totally pseudoscientific or unscientific therapy – wrote down all the bad deeds he’s ever done in his life, and was told to “right the wrongs”, i.e. to at least apologize. He did apologize for having taken advantage of an inexperienced woman under certain circumstances (i.e. when both of them were drunk and probably sleepy at a late hour) and having had sex with her. He only realized from her answers that she claimed to have been raped.
Besides the alcoholic’s admission (which wasn’t really an admission) and her claims (which she didn’t pursue in any documented way for two decades), there really was no evidence that anything bad ever happened to her other than losing her virginity at a drunken night. But bad sex, even if it’s a first sex for one of the parties, is not even close to a real crime.
Nor was the silly Jewish pedestrian-German car tweet a “Holocaust joke” nor even “an insensitive Holocaust joke”.
Sara Silvermann would never do one of those!
Sailer, you've gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don't have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he's a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.Replies: @SPMoore8, @reiner Tor, @D. K., @Rifleman, @tomv, @Anonymous
Are you truly that dense, or just pretending? The Brown case became a cause célèbre because the cop was never charged for what some (lying) witnesses claimed was a summary public execution of an “innocent teen” by a “racist cop.” In this recent case, the officer was charged with murder. What exactly are you whining about so bemusedly?
In case you are unaware, there are a lot of Black cops in this country– and they, too, shoot a fair number of people, Black and White, and often under far-more-dubious circumstances than in that South Carolina shooting, let alone in the infamous Ferguson shooting. Some of those types of shootings have occured, in fact, during and after the Ferguson debacle. Why are you not bemused by those Black cops’ having avoided criminal charges?
For example, the reason I started posting here is because this was the only place, apart from Richard Bradley's blog, that talked about the UVA case at all.
On the the the other hand, there have been no less than six articles, with very long threads, about the shooting of Walter Scott over at The Atlantic, so why not go there?
I would never dream of going on an OT rant at the The Atlantic because they were avoiding Jackie's Story. I don't know why the non-discussion of Walter Scott here is relevant.
WRT the topic in question: Jews are not powerless, as van Loon suggested (she actually didn't even quote Page correctly.) Nor was the silly Jewish pedestrian-German car tweet a "Holocaust joke" nor even "an insensitive Holocaust joke". Therefore if someone wants to call out Noah and get him fired, it must be for some other reason. That reason is not hard to find: he has been critical of Israel. That's basically it.Replies: @Anonymous, @Sunbeam
“On the the the other hand, there have been no less than six articles, with very long threads, about the shooting of Walter Scott over at The Atlantic, so why not go there?”
For what it’s worth I just read an article and watched that videotape. There really isn’t a context here as far as I can tell.
This incident is so ludicrous it’s almost like someone wrote a script and filmed it.
I wonder if he discharged his taser at all or if they found fingerprints of the dead man on it. Anyway for what’s it worth this one sure has the hallmarks of a wrongful killing and a cover up.
So there. Seriously this video is just plain crazy. I’d actually like to see this one go to court and see the officer and his friends get cross examined.
And before anyone gets bent out of shape, be honest. Would you want this guy in your neighborhood? Patrolling with a weapon? Why did he shoot the guy? I can’t gather that one from the tape. And how did the guy in the car not see anything?
Anyway as you said it will be discussed ad infinitum.
I have no difficulty believing that finally this one case is one where the black victim really is a victim and the cop really is a (racist?) killer. I think the picture might get different after a while. For example the cop seems to have been extremely stupid if he thought after Ferguson that he could get away with shooting a black guy in the back without reason, and especially planting evidence. Either he's really that stupid (well, there must be some really stupid people out of hundred-and-whatever million whites in America) or there's something to the story which we are not told nor shown (but what could it be?), in any event I have no difficulty believing that there might be at least one case where finally the MSM gets at least the ground facts right, namely that it was murder.Replies: @anonymous
Gold.
That's a lot, enough to explain the phenomenon you are talking about. Better looking noses is definitely a noticeable change from the US of 30 or 40 years ago. Another striking change is straighter, whiter teeth. It's amazing how much people can be induced to spend on trivia like this.Replies: @Sunbeam
I had no idea that many people got nose jobs every year.
For what it's worth I just read an article and watched that videotape. There really isn't a context here as far as I can tell.
This incident is so ludicrous it's almost like someone wrote a script and filmed it.
I wonder if he discharged his taser at all or if they found fingerprints of the dead man on it. Anyway for what's it worth this one sure has the hallmarks of a wrongful killing and a cover up.
So there. Seriously this video is just plain crazy. I'd actually like to see this one go to court and see the officer and his friends get cross examined.
And before anyone gets bent out of shape, be honest. Would you want this guy in your neighborhood? Patrolling with a weapon? Why did he shoot the guy? I can't gather that one from the tape. And how did the guy in the car not see anything?
Anyway as you said it will be discussed ad infinitum.Replies: @reiner Tor
As Steve Sailer wrote several times, the US is a big country and some bad things are bound to happen in it. I’m sure there must be cases of black people being killed by white people because racism. What’s amazing is that so often they can’t seem to find even one case, and for one reason or another they keep pressing the few cases where the white defendant turns out to be obviously innocent and acting in self-defense and the black ‘victim’ turns out to have been a habitual criminal.
I have no difficulty believing that finally this one case is one where the black victim really is a victim and the cop really is a (racist?) killer. I think the picture might get different after a while. For example the cop seems to have been extremely stupid if he thought after Ferguson that he could get away with shooting a black guy in the back without reason, and especially planting evidence. Either he’s really that stupid (well, there must be some really stupid people out of hundred-and-whatever million whites in America) or there’s something to the story which we are not told nor shown (but what could it be?), in any event I have no difficulty believing that there might be at least one case where finally the MSM gets at least the ground facts right, namely that it was murder.
A: Because a Jewish woman won't touch anything that's not at least 20% off.Not to worry: I'm writing from my Safe Place of privilege as a member of that oppressed minority, American Jews.Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
It would’ve been interesting if Noah had tweeted it to view the response. That kind of joke even some comics would have to concede ‘Yeah, that was kind of funny.’ Somewhere in those tweets of his, he must’ve told a few nuggets.
Sailer, you've gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don't have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he's a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.Replies: @SPMoore8, @reiner Tor, @D. K., @Rifleman, @tomv, @Anonymous
Jesse Leroy Mathews…..**crickets***………
Jews also played a major role on the side of the Confederacy.
Here's the question that's seldom ever allowed to be answered. If Jews have had an Antebellum presence (and they have) how exactly did they earn their money in the South prior to the Civil War?
There was only one main way to earn tons of wealth in the pre-Civil War South as the entire economy centered around slavery in one form or another.
It isn't as if they were getting rich simply because they had opened general store chains across the South during this time.
How did Southern Jews in pre-Civil War era earn their money?
That's a fair question, because it might go a long way to explaining how established wealthy families were living in the South in Antebellum times.Replies: @Rotten, @JohnnyWalker123
Lehman Bros, that investment bank that nearly took down the world economy, was founded by Jews in Alabama as a slave trading concern.
The other side does not worry about “details” and they are winning. At some point you have to fight on the terrain that is given.
I have no difficulty believing that finally this one case is one where the black victim really is a victim and the cop really is a (racist?) killer. I think the picture might get different after a while. For example the cop seems to have been extremely stupid if he thought after Ferguson that he could get away with shooting a black guy in the back without reason, and especially planting evidence. Either he's really that stupid (well, there must be some really stupid people out of hundred-and-whatever million whites in America) or there's something to the story which we are not told nor shown (but what could it be?), in any event I have no difficulty believing that there might be at least one case where finally the MSM gets at least the ground facts right, namely that it was murder.Replies: @anonymous
If you slug a cop or try to combat them they’ll kill you. That’s the rules of the game. They just say the standard ‘in fear for their life’ line, used over and over again. Cops are more robotic these days; in the old days they would just beat you up. Why I don’t know, perhaps it’s the militarization of everything, the hiring process picking a colder personality, violent video games influencing the attitudes of youth, who can tell. Cops will go ballistic when provoked and it doesn’t take much.
Way wait. Soros now owns Lehman Bros? When did that happen?
Sailer, you've gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don't have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he's a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.Replies: @SPMoore8, @reiner Tor, @D. K., @Rifleman, @tomv, @Anonymous
Is Michelle Van Loon Jew-baiting? Is Michael Weinreb? Sabrina Erdely? If nobody read these people, they would not have a job. But God forbid if anyone read them and disagreed or, worse still, noticed a pattern. You would rather we shut up and take the messages at face value.
Which raises a question: Are you Jew-baiting? Do you have any idea how badly you come across? And to the extent that you are taking offense on behalf of your tribe (as Van Loon is), you make it look bad as well.
Walter Scott’s case has the full weight of the media-governmental establishment behind it. And for once, it seems to in the right. The cop has been fired and is being tried for murder. What is there to talk about? You project a lot of your ethnocentrism, but no, this place would not be Walter Scott Central if he were white. Steve was personally involved in the case of white teen who was fatally shot by DEA agents and whose family was later awarded $3 M in compensation. Steve first mentioned it during the Trayvon Martin’s saga, two years after he went to the scene to play amateur detective and encouraged the family to sue. Go ahead and read Steve’s level-headed take. He could even reprise it for the present occasion.
The frat boys were simply falsely accused, as were Darren Wilson and the Duke Lacrosse players. But the acknowledgements from the parties that tried capitalize on these false accusations were extremely grudging. No mention of Haven Monahan, for example, and even here you still call the accused “vicious” based apparently on vague misdeeds that other frat boys are supposed to have committed some time, somewhere. The kind of extrapolation would get one branded “anti-semite” if done against Jews. Heck, according to you, we can’t even call out the very Jews who all but flaunt their silly shticks like Van Loon.
Once again, Who? Whom? So I ask again, are you Jew-bating?
Sailer, you've gone nuts. Your Jew-allergy has blossomed into full blown loathing. This website has become basically Jew-Baiting Central. Like all classic Jew-baiters, you don't have to say anything. You just wave the baton and your well-trained chorus sings in perfect harmony.
BTW, in the real world, a black man was shot in the back by a white cop. Unlike Michael Brown, this 50 year old father of four, honorably discharged from the Coast Guard, was no threat. It appears he may have been antsy because he owes $18K in child support.
Bad bad black man! Well, maybe not so. Maybe he's a beleaguered guy who fell behind and was persecuted by an unjust, anti-Dad system. You would certainly be saying that if he were white.
If Walter Scott were white, this would be Walter Scott Central, 24/7, instead of whining endlessly about some vicious frat boys who got smeared by Rolling Stone.
And can frat boys be vicious? Google Liz Seccuro, or Jon Hamm.Replies: @SPMoore8, @reiner Tor, @D. K., @Rifleman, @tomv, @Anonymous
@Bemused
So Steve Sailer has an “anti-Jew allergy”. I don’t see it. Perhaps I don’t read his blog as often as someone who detects that allergy. Still it’s possible I suppose that Steve’s Ashkenazi genes could somehow have set off a funny immune reaction in him….
It’s original name was Amalgamated Slave Holdings.
Link?
The premise of the article seems absurd and alarmist to me. I realize that people like Jeffrey Goldberg will nurse bullying from their childhood but I am relatively certain this is uncommon. I guess you have to be in certain parts of the country.
On Wednesday, the American Jewish Congress launched an online campaign calling for Comedy Central to send Noah packing. That's not surprising.
And the Chicago Tribune’s Clarence Page wrote on Wednesday about the unwritten rules of comedy etiquette.
The "punch up, punch down" that Page is referencing has to with "Jews, other minorities, and women." To say that Jews are "weak" in American society is nonsense.
Look, the reason Noah is in trouble is because his references to Jews are ultimately references to Israel, and Israel must be perceived as weak because otherwise its conduct is called more into question. Nor is criticism of Israel necessarily anti-Semitic; any country that portrayed itself as a first world nation would come into similar criticism if it was controlling the lives of an almost equal number of non-citizens. And that's ultimately the reason why the AJC wants him out.
The internal contradictions involved in Israel's control over millions of non-Jews isn't going to go away by proscribing Jewish jokes. Nor even by forbidding an open discussion of these problems.Replies: @Desiderius, @Wizard of Oz
“To say that Jews are weak in American society is nonsense”.
It is easy too see the premise(s) you rely on to argue for that conclusion but I suggest you consider that the same could have been said of Jews in Germany in 1930 for much the same reasons. So actual feelings of weakness by some of America’s small population of Jews are not invalidated.
That tweet no more "makes light of the Holocaust" than any Black comedian talking about being nervous in the Deep South makes light of slavery. The idea that Germans are predisposed to violence towards Jews, and that Jews are nervous about that (sometimes incorrectly) has been a staple of Western comics since the 1950's: not least being featured in virtually every Woody Allen and/or Jewish comedy routine I have ever seen. Even classic modern films (e.g., Big Lebowski) make reference to the potential for German-Jewish animus.
I will grant you that only in the past 15 years or so can one see portrayals of Germans in American culture who are not automatically anti-Semites or warmongers, but that says more about prejudicial stereotypes about Germans than Jews or the Holocaust.Replies: @Wizard of Oz
“Jokes” ‘making light of slavery’ prompts the imagination. And that makes one look at different classes or subclasses of humour. There is sheer absurdity, for example. Let’s say the captain of the slave ship who is of bookish disposition is getting bored and so “invites” a couple of the apparently smarter and more mature captives (would they already be “slaves”) to dine with him. Whether or not it raises a laugh it could pass I think. Likewise relying on the premise of ridiculous ignorance as in a discussion of the menus to be offered or which were imagined as offered to the captives on a slave ship. That could perhaps raise a superior laugh at the pig ignorance of those having the discussion. Cf. Pete and Dud including earnest discussions that totally miss the point.
Still, I would be interested to know if anyone could generate Holocaust equivalents. Perhaps just very fleeting references to say Theresienstadt and Treblinka sounding nice as a Jewish family plans a holiday in 1938. But then it had better be a Californian family displaying their total ignorance if the world outside America and it should be a Jewish comedian making fun of them. Right?
Don’t tease us. Stories, please!
It is easy too see the premise(s) you rely on to argue for that conclusion but I suggest you consider that the same could have been said of Jews in Germany in 1930 for much the same reasons. So actual feelings of weakness by some of America's small population of Jews are not invalidated.Replies: @SPmoore8
No one is disputing that some American Jews feel “weak”, in the sense that they think another Nazi breakout is right around the corner. I know the sentiment, I have heard it all my life. But I don’t think it’s valid.
The point is that Loon sought to argue that Clarence Page argued that one shouldn’t tell Jewish jokes because Jews were “weak” — as in powerless, impotent, unable to defend themselves, etc. We both know that is nonsense.
As to the larger point, that many Jews still feel weak; well, sure. But feelings are not reality and more than one person here has pointed out that American Jews are no longer a weak minority and should stop acting as though they are, or that their interests coincide with less advantaged minorities.
Still, I would be interested to know if anyone could generate Holocaust equivalents. Perhaps just very fleeting references to say Theresienstadt and Treblinka sounding nice as a Jewish family plans a holiday in 1938. But then it had better be a Californian family displaying their total ignorance if the world outside America and it should be a Jewish comedian making fun of them. Right?Replies: @SPMoore8
Where exactly are you going with all this?
Did you read the tweet of Trevor Noah under discussion? Do you consider it an insensitive joke about the Holocaust?
Have you ever seen a Woody Allen movie? Ever head a Lenny Bruce routine? Ever seen a Mel Brooks movie? This is absurd.
Trevor Noah make a silly joke associating Jewish victims and German perpetrators. As has been done thousands of times in the past 60 years, usually by Jews, and usually in a manner that is stereotypical and prejudicial to Germans.
But now, all of a sudden, when a South African tells an extremely mild joke in that vein, he is suddenly “emulating the Holocaust.” That claim has zero credibility.
As for making fun of slavery, you should check out some David Chapelle’s skits before his burnout.
Back when the New York Stock Exchange was created by the signing of the Buttonwood agreement in 1792, 5 of 24 signatories were Jewish. This was at a time when less than 0.05 percent of Americans were Jewish.
Not only were Jews not excluded from the establishment back in the 1960s (Barry Goldwater was the first Jewish man on a presidential ticket), they weren't excluded back in the 1700s either.
Here's a quote from President George Washington:The reason it seems like anti-semitism was pervasive in the past was because anti-black sentiment was pervasive in the past. So it seems logical to think that if Americans kept blacks out of the establishment, they behaved similarly towards Jews. The reality is that not only were Jews welcomed in, Jews were historically respected (and even mildly feared) by white gentile elites.
When Jews socialized apart from white gentiles and had their own country clubs, that was NOT because white gentiles didn't want to socialize with Jews. It was because Jews didn't want to socialize with gentiles. Jews have historically been very clash and often viewed socialization as a path to assimilation and intermarriage, which they feared. Eastern European Jews were historically excluded from fancier German Jewish clubs though. So when you hear stories about Jews being excluded from clubs, it was a question of Eastern Europeans being discriminated against by Germans. Not gentiles against Jews. As Steve Sailer has pointed out, Jews historically were big on eating, but didn't care much for drinking or gold ,which were two interests of gentiles. So that's why Eastern Euro Jews wanted to join German Jewish clubs.
As for General Grant's order to excluded Jewish merchants from the North-South border, that order came because Jewish merchants were helping to evade the blockade of the South. That order was immediately rescinded. When he ran for president after the civil war, Grant apologized profusely to Jews. He even went on to run what many saw as the most pro-Jewish administration in the history of America. So even this incident of "anti-semitism" was actually a common sense policy that was controversial due to mid 1800s political correctness towards Jews.
It's pretty shameful for Jews to even bring up that incident. You would think they'd feel ashamed that their community was involved in undermining the war effort against the Confederacy, but no. They're not ashamed. It's gentiles who are supposed to feel ashamed for trying to win the civil war.
Jews may be one of the least discriminated groups in the history of America. If you read American history, it's striking how little anti-Jewish discrimination you'd find.Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi, @Glaivester
As Steve Sailer has pointed out, Jews historically were big on eating, but didn’t care much for drinking or gold ,which were two interests of gentiles. So that’s why Eastern Euro Jews wanted to join German Jewish clubs.
I am going to assume you mean “drinking or golf?”
I meant "drinking or golf."
Of course, historically the stereotype was that Jews were *very* interested in gold.Replies: @reiner Tor
Jews also played a major role on the side of the Confederacy.
Here's the question that's seldom ever allowed to be answered. If Jews have had an Antebellum presence (and they have) how exactly did they earn their money in the South prior to the Civil War?
There was only one main way to earn tons of wealth in the pre-Civil War South as the entire economy centered around slavery in one form or another.
It isn't as if they were getting rich simply because they had opened general store chains across the South during this time.
How did Southern Jews in pre-Civil War era earn their money?
That's a fair question, because it might go a long way to explaining how established wealthy families were living in the South in Antebellum times.Replies: @Rotten, @JohnnyWalker123
You want to hear something interesting?
The Confederate flag’s original design was changed due to fear of offending Jews.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-politically-correct-origin-of-the-confederate-battle-flag/
Benjamin P. Judah was the Confederate Secretary of State.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judah_P._Benjamin
Lehman Brothers was founded by Southern Jews and was actively involved in the slave trade
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehman_Brothers
I am going to assume you mean "drinking or golf?"Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @SFG
Yes. Typo.
I meant “drinking or golf.”
I am a little puzzled that the distinction isn’t made at the outset between
1. anti-Semitic Jewish jokes of the kind which would not have been invented by Jews;
2. Great jokes invented by Jews which have Jewish characters in them and Jewish themed or flavoured behaviour as in the marvellous one I heard privately from a non-Jewish comedian rewarding me for one almost as good which has a Talmudic scholar in a train from Odessa to Moscow when a difficult-to-acquire permit was needed for a Jew to make the journey wondering about the young man who has just got in at a station near a Jewish district. He thinks and thinks in words the joke relates but the first speech is:
Young Man: Would you mind if I opened the window?
Talmudic Scholar: Not at all, Dr. Kovacs.
YM (astonished): How did you know my name?
TS; Oh it was obvious!
and, perhaps
3. Jews’ Jewish jokes which make fun of some Jewish stereotypes which may include those which Jews don’t necessarily think fair to Jews but know that other people tend to apply. Told by a gentile these would, unless very clever, come across as anti-Semitic.
An example and illustration of the stereotypes of Jewish meanness with money/avarice etc being used by Jews comes to mind as a memory of my (gentile) daughter on the phone with a Jewish school friend who wanted her to come to some event which would require her to get some money from me. I hear “I think Dad will say it’s too expensive” followed by giggling. I asked her what the giggle was about.
“Oh Sarah said to tell you not to be so Jewish”. I was wondering if it could be two way. The answer I guess is that it can be if friendship or trust is strong. But I would still imagine myself being careful, as in “You really do have trouble with meeting the Jewish stereotype don’t you Sam” as another bottle of vintage champagne was opened after the tennis game. Or maybe “We are going to have to rely on your Jewish genes if we’re to make any money out of this fund raiser!” (To put that in context I raised a laugh at a gentile friend’s birthday party when I recalled earlier days when he could be relied on to spend as little as possible on food to make sure our organisation’s fundraising event made a profit).
So Steve, what about turning your pen, not only to the distinctions and nuance but also to the trouble gentiles can sense when about to tell great, category 2. Jewish jokes to Jews?
Is it that the Jews to whom one is speaking, not being close buddies, may be struck by their own srereotype of gentiles telling Jewish jokes? Are they anticipating a category 1 or 3 version? Or are they saying to themselves that they are about to hear from this otherwise pleasant civilised-seeming person something which shows that he really doesn’t get it (perhaps e.g. that a Jew wouldn’t see the joke in the way he does or wouldn’t tell it in the same circumstances)?
And how does all this differ from other ethnic jokes. BTW Steve, to which country/ethnicity do you attach the classic one with the punchline “And all because I **** one lousy goat!”??
There are much more interesting van Loons to choose from.
>“Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions.<
called for rainReplies: @Forbes, @Jacobite
Saul Alinsky and George Soros. Two Jewish jokes that aren’t very funny, but immensely instructional for gentiles. As far as assimilation, New York City is as alien to this Mid-Westerner as San Francisco or Tijuana.
Can you name an instance of an actual Yankee “bullying” the New South in the last fifty or so years? The closest I can come is Rick Barry’s not suiting up for the Virginia Squires because he didn’t want his kids acquiring the Tidewater accent.
The few northern WASPs who pay much attention to the South tend to have positive feelings rather than negative. Have you ever heard of a reënactment breaking out into genuine battle?
While channel-surfing recently, I came across Woody Allen’s “Hannah and her Sisters”. In that movie, Allen tries to convert to Catholocism, and they showed him coming home and taking a bunch of items out of a bag: a bible, a picture of Jesus, some rosary beads, a jar of mayonaise and a loaf of wonderbread. The implied snide jab at gentiles is pretty obvious, although why catholocism should be equated with bland food is unclear to me. France and Italy are (or at least were) catholic countries, and their cuisines have a well-deserved reputation for greatness. And when I think of appetizing food, a kosher deli is not the first place that comes to mind (gefiltefish, anyone?).
As usual, the media will pretend that American culture is on a par with what could be found in Der Sturmer and Der Voelkische Beobachter, and that it is simply rife with crude anti-semitic slurs, while casually retailing anti-gentile propaganda.
This Seinfeld episode is on right now, on WPIX TV in New York (delayed 2.5 hours due to the 7 hour Yankee game).
As usual, the media will pretend that American culture is on a par with what could be found in Der Sturmer and Der Voelkische Beobachter, and that it is simply rife with crude anti-semitic slurs, while casually retailing anti-gentile propaganda.Replies: @black sea, @SFG
Actually, that’s pretty funny.
It is easy to explain those jokes from Noah: there is a shortage of comedy writing talent in South. Africa, so stereotypes are the easiest jokes for South African comics to produce themselves. Noah won’t face that problem on The Daily Show.
I think this kerfuffle is to remind gentiles that they can be squashed if they transgress.
Incidentally, what is the “2015 massacre of European Jews”?
(Do Jews have anything to match this as far as racial self-proclamation?)
* Exactly how oppressed have Jews been in America? I know about the country club thing and US Grant's General Order No. 11 (1862), but as oppressed minorities in the US that puts them well behind Blacks, Indians, Chinese, and Japanese. Maybe even the Irish, to hear every single person who's ever worn green on St. Patrick's Day tell it.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @Brutusale
They seem the revel in it. As I pointed out to a middle-aged Jewish friend at the gym one day, the only people who would wear a Lakers game jersey in a Boston-area gym are either Jewish or black. He was quite pleased by that observation.
Quite. Steve ruminates and looks for an interesting take AFTER all the conflicting reports are manifest.
1. anti-Semitic Jewish jokes of the kind which would not have been invented by Jews;
2. Great jokes invented by Jews which have Jewish characters in them and Jewish themed or flavoured behaviour as in the marvellous one I heard privately from a non-Jewish comedian rewarding me for one almost as good which has a Talmudic scholar in a train from Odessa to Moscow when a difficult-to-acquire permit was needed for a Jew to make the journey wondering about the young man who has just got in at a station near a Jewish district. He thinks and thinks in words the joke relates but the first speech is:
Young Man: Would you mind if I opened the window?
Talmudic Scholar: Not at all, Dr. Kovacs.
YM (astonished): How did you know my name?
TS; Oh it was obvious!
and, perhaps
3. Jews' Jewish jokes which make fun of some Jewish stereotypes which may include those which Jews don't necessarily think fair to Jews but know that other people tend to apply. Told by a gentile these would, unless very clever, come across as anti-Semitic.
An example and illustration of the stereotypes of Jewish meanness with money/avarice etc being used by Jews comes to mind as a memory of my (gentile) daughter on the phone with a Jewish school friend who wanted her to come to some event which would require her to get some money from me. I hear "I think Dad will say it's too expensive" followed by giggling. I asked her what the giggle was about.
"Oh Sarah said to tell you not to be so Jewish". I was wondering if it could be two way. The answer I guess is that it can be if friendship or trust is strong. But I would still imagine myself being careful, as in "You really do have trouble with meeting the Jewish stereotype don't you Sam" as another bottle of vintage champagne was opened after the tennis game. Or maybe "We are going to have to rely on your Jewish genes if we're to make any money out of this fund raiser!" (To put that in context I raised a laugh at a gentile friend's birthday party when I recalled earlier days when he could be relied on to spend as little as possible on food to make sure our organisation's fundraising event made a profit).
So Steve, what about turning your pen, not only to the distinctions and nuance but also to the trouble gentiles can sense when about to tell great, category 2. Jewish jokes to Jews?
Is it that the Jews to whom one is speaking, not being close buddies, may be struck by their own srereotype of gentiles telling Jewish jokes? Are they anticipating a category 1 or 3 version? Or are they saying to themselves that they are about to hear from this otherwise pleasant civilised-seeming person something which shows that he really doesn't get it (perhaps e.g. that a Jew wouldn't see the joke in the way he does or wouldn't tell it in the same circumstances)?
And how does all this differ from other ethnic jokes. BTW Steve, to which country/ethnicity do you attach the classic one with the punchline "And all because I **** one lousy goat!"??Replies: @reiner Tor
You forgot that there are Jewish jokes where Jews make fun of or denigrate gentiles. For example there are the goyishe kop jokes.
Of course there’s true self-irony where a people is making fun of itself. Jewish jokes of this kind do exist, but it’s difficult to tell them apart from jokes by gentiles who dislike Jews, and also you just complained about gentiles telling such jokes, so let me share a joke which we Hungarians tell about ourselves.
Patton Oswalt: Welcome to comedy in 2015
As usual, the media will pretend that American culture is on a par with what could be found in Der Sturmer and Der Voelkische Beobachter, and that it is simply rife with crude anti-semitic slurs, while casually retailing anti-gentile propaganda.Replies: @black sea, @SFG
He goofed. Italian food in particular is excellent. He’s conflating Catholic (rosary beads) and Protestant (white bread and mayonnaise) stereotypes. English food has always been known to be awful…
I am going to assume you mean "drinking or golf?"Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @SFG
Actually, gold seems to be favored by the Glenn Beck types, who tend to be gentiles.
Of course, historically the stereotype was that Jews were *very* interested in gold.
I am more of a partisan of French food, but of course Italian cuisine is among the best, too. As is Spanish food (perhaps less famous, but it’s also excellent, the Basque Country has I think more Michelin stars per capita than any other region in the world), and I heard also Portuguese food (although I have no personal experience here).
Have you had tempura? The you've had Portuguese food. They introduced it to Japan.
Of course, historically the stereotype was that Jews were *very* interested in gold.Replies: @reiner Tor
Libertarians tend to be gold bugs, and libertarianism is predominantly gentile, as far as I can tell. But there are Jewish gold bugs as well, like Alan Greenspan. (Well, this also means that probably even I could have been a Federal Reserve chair during his tenure. Maybe even the janitor could have done his job.)
Nice joke. I think you deserve one told by the German Ambassador’s wife in London.
Frenchman, German and Englishman condemned to die are invited to state their wishes for their last meal. The Frenchmen says that he wants to give the orders to the chef. The German says he wishes to make the after-dinner speech. And the Englishman says that he wants to die as soon as dinner is over.
And do you have any theory as to why I may have correctly sensed uneasiness on the part of Jews when a gentile offers enthusiastically what he says is a good Jewish joke?
You may be write about libertarians mostly being gentiles. But it may also depend on definitions and (sub) classifications.
After all someone recently claimed (I think in the Unz Review) that five of the six leading libertarians were Jewish. Hayek was the exception and the others I remember as von Mises, Ayn Rand, Milton Friedman, Murray Rothbard and one other.
Their sub-class is bookwriting intellectuals. There may be many more people you would appropriately call “llibertarians” who are not intellectuals or widely influential.
Hayek was part jewish.
“SFG says:
He goofed. Italian food in particular is excellent. He’s conflating Catholic (rosary beads) and Protestant (white bread and mayonnaise) stereotypes.”
Catholics, Protestants………I guess our religions all look alike.
“English food has always been known to be awful…”
German/Swiss/Austrian food is pretty good, but then the Germanophone world is at least half-Catholic. As you observed, Catholics do seem to have more joi-de-vivre than do Protestants.
You can do better than is/you’re better than this is simply a more sophisticated version of “that’s racist!” (so stop noticing things, stop commenting on them, just shut up and continue to go quietly into the night, now there’s a nice white man).
I have to make the observation, in the middle of a thread on Jews, that Portuguese cuisine, with its emphasis on pork and shellfish, is the least kosher in the world. I recommend a nice cataplana of linguica and shellfish with a nice vinho verde.
Have you had tempura? The you’ve had Portuguese food. They introduced it to Japan.
It’s original name was Amalgamated Slave Holdings.
Link?
After all someone recently claimed (I think in the Unz Review) that five of the six leading libertarians were Jewish. Hayek was the exception and the others I remember as von Mises, Ayn Rand, Milton Friedman, Murray Rothbard and one other.
Hayek was part jewish.
I stand corrected.
I guess they feel vulnerable. And they may be. However, nobody has a right never to feel uneasy. Jews are now a major component of the elite. Do you think it’s a reasonable demand that a major component of the elite not be criticized?
or not be ridiculed?
Of course jokes by Noah and M'bala M'bala about high IQ Whites are not funny. As bi-racial or Black African they have the power (no jokes about say, Africans proclivity for Child Sacrifice or eating Pygmies or Albinos). After all, the fact that Africans regularly butcher and eat albinos and pygmies to get "magic powers" ought to be worth some (no pun intended) black/gallows humor. If you want to go dark and edgy, well there it is.
Not to mention the child sacrifice as African business.
Power is all about who you can make jokes about. Jews are irrevocably White and thus jokes can be made endlessly about THEM by Blacks. No jokes can be made about say, Africans regrettable belief in magic, ritual human sacrifice, and cannibalism. Just as it is against the law, literally, to make jokes about the Thai Royal Family in Thailand. Even the British Royal family is the stuff of constant spoof in Britain, tell a joke about Black people and you get arrested. Heck, have a Black Sambo doll in your window and you get arrested. Yes this actually happened.
As Steve noted, Obama is pretty funny. Henpecked, his mother in law lives with him in the White House, his wife is notably shrewish, his daughters are into thug rappers (one of whom is named no kidding "Joey Bada$$ yes with the dollar signs) and Valerie Jarrett is the obvious fantasy Black Mom figure he's always wanted. Obama is a Harvard Grad who wants to be a legit thug like Jay-Z whom he hangs out with but is hampered by his love of Golf and Mom Jeans. He's hilarious. But no one dares make fun of him because as a Black man he has all the power.
PS the people who really, really like Hitler are octogenarian White guys like Jean Le Pen (but obviously not his daughter who is purging him) ... and Dieudonne M'bala M'bala who are united in their real dislike of Jews and their liking of Hitler.Replies: @Udolpho
Words fail me but not as badly as they fail you.
Now, Pleasureman, try to get along with the other kids.
Money is something. It can buy you the last plane out, an escape hatch, a bribe to get out of there. Fundamentally it cannot by itself command an army or even a mob. Ask all those rich Jews who died in places like Thierenbad thinking their money could get them out. At a certain point the money is meaningless. Money is only something that dates back to 700 BC in Lydia. Its still pretty new. It is good to have money. But don't confuse it with power. Power gets you money. Not the other way around.
---------------------------
Lena Dunham must be a piece of work. She's about 80 lbs or so overweight, at least, fairly ugly, with an abrasive personality, ugly tats making her even more ugly, and she's surprised her actual rock star boyfriend is looking elsewhere? So she figures the best way to keep him is ... insult him?
Rather than lose that 80 lbs, remove those tats, act more feminine, and get plastic surgery?
This attitude, by fat women who ought to be grateful they have a man at all, is fairly typical. I've seen it many times. It does not sadly seem to be confined to any regional, ethnic, or occupational group.Replies: @Hibernian
“Money is not everything. Otherwise Taft not Ike would have got the nomination.”
The Tafts although not super rich were probably richer than career military farm kid Eisenhower. However, Eisenhower was the candidate of rich liberals who knew they couldn’t elect a Democrat in ’52 after the loss of China, the descent of the Iron Curtain, the Rosenberg case, the Soviet Bomb, and Korea. Stevenson the Democratic nominee was a sacrificial lamb. Eisenhower was the last Republican presidential nominee endorsed by the New York Times; I’m not sure if he got a repeat endorsement from them in ’56.