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"TV Tropes" Asks: Is "Great White Defendant" Too Rare on TV to be a Trope?
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TV Tropes is a user-created wiki website with an absolutely astonishing amount of content on countless screenwriting cliches. For instance, “Chekhov’s Gun” (a valuable storytelling rule of thumb credited to the great Anton Chekhov: “If you say in the first chapter that there is a rifle hanging on the wall, in the second or third chapter it absolutely must go off. If it’s not going to be fired, it shouldn’t be hanging there”) comes with hundreds if not thousands of examples.

But when it comes to its proposed entry for “Great White Defendant,” the contributors have been pretty stumped at finding examples in TV, movies, video games, comic books, etc. in the eight years since it was first put forward:

Examples:

Literature

The Bonfire Of The Vanities : the trope namer.

Real life

The district attorney in the Duke lacrosse case[1], Mike Nifong[2], seems to have thought he’d found one in the lacrosse team

Then in the comments, contributors wrangle over whether it’s bad form to list real life examples:

  • It might be a good idea to avoid Real Life examples in this trope. …
  • Yeah, definitely stay away from Real Life examples. Especially since it’s still kind of contentious whether the Duke boys are in fact innocent. I think this may be Too Rare To Trope.
  • In an episode of Ghost In The Shell Stand Alone Complex this accusation is reversed somewhat. Togusa ends up trying to stop a young man (and full body cyborg) from killing a girl who turned him down (he fails since the man plays dead and then shoots her out of spite) and he ( colluding with the defence and the prosecutor, who wants to blackmail Section 9) tries to accuse Togusa of being prejudiced against cyborgs.

I have a bad weakness for a movie reviewer: My eyes glaze over at plot descriptions longer than Man Bites Dog. (Oddly, Man Bites Dogs is not a TV Trope either.) I got to “full body cyborg” and that was it for my attention span …

  • Yeah, it seems to me that this is the very rare inverse of a common trope* in which a minority scapegoat is sought by the police when a significant crime goes down. In any case, the wiki does seem to lack a trope for mundane race-based legal scapegoating. Maybe that’s a place to start, and if lots of examples accrue, a split could be considered down the line.
  • Hmm. Surely there’s a Law And Order example, since the show’s been on so long.

Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.

 
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  1. I would bet all the blood in my veins that the ignoramous who is holding out hope for a secret “gang rape and also lacrosse” club at Duke is a self-appointed debunker of conspiracy theories who relishes snopes.

    • LOL: Simon in London
  2. “If you say in the first chapter that there is a rifle hanging on the wall, in the second or third chapter it absolutely must go off.”

    Oh Calcutta! applied this reasoning to clothes.

    “If it’s not going to be fired, it shouldn’t be hanging there.”

    That sounds more like The Vagina Monologues.

  3. Yeah, you’re right but they way things are right now we can’t get any traction with that.

    It occurred to me a few months ago that the biggest dividing line in American culture isn’t necessarily Right vs. Left, or even globalist vs. nationalist, it’s normies vs. cranks. At the very least that one packs the biggest punch relative to any kind of public discourse about it. And that’s what we have here.

    The American people would like to dial down the political correctness in America, the blame whitey games and all the rest of it. And the Republican Party would like to do that. But the priority for normies is getting rid of Trump. That’s the priority over anything we can offer them, so we should be expecting crap like this to continue unabated until that happens.

    • Replies: @El Dato

    That’s the priority over anything we can offer them, so we should be expecting crap like this to continue unabated until that happens.
     
    And after that happens it's back to normie priorities anyway, an acausal world in which Smurfs can play peacefully together.
  4. And thus the expression: “95% of NYC murders are committed by blacks and Hispanics; the rest are on Law and Order.”

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.

    • Replies: @Danindc
    Never heard that. Lol
    , @Forbes
    In NYC, 98% of all gun crimes are committed by blacks and Hispanics, while on L&O, 98% of the gun crimes are committed by whites...
    , @Kratoklastes

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life.
     
    Almost certainly true - and largely a function of just how few murders there are in NYC (only 290 for 2017).

    Slightly OT, but it's almost as if being a pig in NYC is about 1000x safer than everyone is led to believe.

    The stats say that once you ignore fatalities due to lifestyle (e.g., stroke and heart attack) and incompetence (single-vehicle car crashes) the risk of being a pig is about the same as the all-mortaility risk of being an 11 year old girl.

    In any case, if you think that the over-representation of white murderers on US TV is bad, consider UK series like Miss Marple, Lord Peter Wimsey, Hercule Poirot and Father Brown; with the exception of Poirot they're all set in rural villages, where there would rarely be one murder every 2 generations.

    For the Francophones, at least Maigret is set in Paris - where a single detective might genuinely investigate 100 murders over a 40 year career (Simenon's Maigret series runs to 76 book and 28 short stories, most of them involving a murder: published between 1931 and 1972 - hence the '40 year career').

    I also bet there were fewer dismembered bad guys in Miami in every season of Dexter, than in real life. More's the pity.
    , @Hail

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.
     
    This sounds too good to be true but turns out to look plausible, maybe even likely.

    First episode original air date: Sept. 1990
    Last episode original air date: May 2010

    Recorded murders in NYC, 2005-2010
    - 2005: 539
    - 2006: 596
    - 2007: 496
    - 2008: 523
    - 2009: 471
    - 2010: 536
    = Sum: 3,161 (over six calendar years)

    - Percent committed by Whites, <5%?
    - - if 5%, Whites committed 158 murders, 2005-2010
    - - if 2.5%, Whites committed 79 murders, 2005-2010

    Law and Order episodes aired Jan. 2005 to May 2010: 120. Share with White villain: At least two thirds? (8o or more) in 4.5 years (Jan. 2005 to May 2010, last episode).

    = The claim that "During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life" is plausible.
  5. L’Occitane en Provence will find you a great white deodorant.

    https://usa.loccitane.com/V2/pages/common/Search.aspx?search=deodorant&c=82&l=1

    There are a couple of buildings in Prague that’ll introduce you to great white defenestrants.

    http://www.onceatraveler.com/overlooking-the-defenestration-of-prague
    https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/defenestration-of-prague-window

    Nebula Haze will teach you great white defoliation:

    https://www.growweedeasy.com/defoliation

    The whites of Brazil are great at deforestation, but it looks like the Indonesians surpass them:

    https://www.conservation.org/stories/Pages/11-deforestation-facts-you-need-to-know.aspx

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    When asked about what they dislike about their country, Singaporeans invariably complain about the Sumatran forest fires every year across the strait. Creates tons of smog that makes everybody hack and wheeze.
  6. There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn’t especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    • Replies: @Humbles
    Dennis Farina is a great contribution to any production. He was a Chicago cop before he started acting, and his Chicago accent and no bullshit attitude comes off in every scene.
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    Is this the one with SVU or am I thinking of CSI? There are TV channels with nothing but Law&Order on. They said "Law and Order" so much that I first thought I'd caught the History Channel with footage of a Richard Nixon campaign.

    It'd do them a lot of good to branch out like Legos, well not really like Legos, but like that other show CSI. Instead of L&O-Miami, and L&O-Traverse City, they could go racial with it: L&O-black rape victims, L&O-white lady carjackers, L&O-Mexican insider trading, like that.

    Either way, I'm still not watching any TV, so you're going to have to burn me some DVD's at a buck a pop in China for me before I'm gonna lift a finger.
    , @Clyde
    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.
    , @Clyde
    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.
    , @Bill H
    L&O SVU has become ridiculously entrenched in the SJW camp. In a recent episode they did a segment having to do with Marissa Hargitay going all out to fight the separation of immigrant children from their parents, in New York City no less, several months after the practice had ended at the border.

    The actions and "laws" depicted in the segment were utterly detached from reality and, as the SJW cause usually does, presented the freeing of one child while leaving the rest of them huddled, freezing and starving in the infamous "cage" as some sort of major accomplishment for moral right, humanity and social justice.
    , @kimchilover
    Dennis Farina, Get Shorty: "They say the fucking smog is the fucking reason you have such beautiful fucking sunsets." He was sublime in that role.
  7. I remember when I submitted that back in the day, after I’d read you mentioning it a few times. I couldn’t come up with many examples either, (or they were all “real life”) so the page never got added officially.

  8. I’m sure Law & Order thought they were being kind to POC but from a jobs perspective they weren’t. Those were white actors getting those jobs and muscling out blacks. Some of them like Stephen Colbert used it to advance their careers. It’s actually kinda perfect for liberals; you get to create your Whitetopia while claiming to be concerned about ethnic stereotyping.

  9. Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.

    Yes. Years ago I had a girlfriend from another country. We were watching L&O one day and she said “It’s that guy,” pointing to the older, wealthy white guy. “How do you know?” I asked. She said “Whenever there’s an obvious woman or minority suspect the actual criminal is always the old white guy.”

    • Replies: @Lurker
    For the last few years in any TV production - as soon as a black suspect is even hinted at you know he dindu nuffin. For me at that point it's only a matter of the reveal - which white person did it and why.
    , @415 reasons
    It doesn’t really embody the trope though. Per Bonfire of the Vanities, and real life, the trope is prosecutors unethically pursuing dubious white suspects because of a perceived demand among their constituents for justice against racist villains. Law and Order just happens to be set in a universe where stereotypes are not just wrong, they’re backwards, and murder and rape are far more common among upper class whites than lower class minorities.
    , @hhsiii
    It works the same on Scooby Doo, except it's the ghost or monster turns out to be the old white man. And he would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for you meddling kids.
    , @Harry Baldwin
    Other things being satisfactory, sounds like good marriage material.
    , @stillCARealist
    It's been more or less this way in all crime dramas since the late 60's. Why do people bother to watch anymore?

    I mean, I know there's big crime bosses and all, but crime is never glamorous or sexy. The perps are almost always losers, drug heads, or deeply mentally unstable. Remember the preppy murder in Central Park? Well it was just a big loser drug addict in an oxford shirt.

    Someone here directed us to Michael Thevis, whose story I read completely. What a sleezy scumbag.

    http://www.newser.com/story/244452/he-was-peep-machine-kingpin-then-the-murders-began.html

    But TV would portray him as a suave and sexy WASP.

    Has anyone else seen Loving Pablo? I watched it the other night and was impressed by the realistic way the ultimate bad guy (Pablo Escobar) was portrayed: ugly, fat, disgusting, totally unlovable.

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4682788/
  10. “It’s still kind of contentious whether the Duke boys are in fact innocent”? What the fark? Their accuser admitted she lied, and then she went to prison for murder, and the the DA was disbarred. What is contentious, again?

    • Replies: @gabriel alberton
    They reportedly used racial slurs against the two strippers. So they're not innocent. They can't be. They hired strippers, after all. No one who's innocent does that.

    They traumatized Mangum, so she defensively created a narrative so to be believed by the racist police. She was the victim. They might not have raped her, but they made dirty jokes. That's enough. Not innocent. If there was justice, they'd be found guilty. Mind rapists, pretty much.

    That murder conviction, well, she's just a flawed human being. Aren't we all? The Duke white boys are probably partly to blame for that, too.

    Can't fix nuts.
    , @Anonymous
    Lead cop who helped frame them, offed himself.
    , @Anonymous
    By no means a minority (pardon the pun) opinion. Sarah Jeong said similar:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/sarah-jeong-the-duke-lacrosse-team-was-guilty/

    Those guys were lucky that incident happened when it did; the whole thing was near-universally recognized as bogus and the victims were recognized as victims and allowed to reintegrate into normal society. If it happened today they'd still be considered vaguely guilty by a large percentage (probably the majority) of right-thinking people, solely for the fact of being young white guys with sex drives who were accused of something bad by a poor black woman.
  11. @Lot
    There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn't especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    http://akns-images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013622/rs_560x415-130722103723-1024.2farina.ls.72213_copy.jpg

    Dennis Farina is a great contribution to any production. He was a Chicago cop before he started acting, and his Chicago accent and no bullshit attitude comes off in every scene.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    I love the taxi trick he does in Get Shorty.
    , @Anonymous
    Apparently no relation to Richard Farina, folk singer and husband of Mimi Farina, sister of Joan Baez.
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    I loved Farina in Code of Silence.
    , @njguy73
    Was a great contribution. He's been dead since 2013.
  12. 69BookWorM69 says [Oct. 6th, 2011]:

    Hmm. Surely there’s a Law And Order example, since the show’s been on so long.

    Was this meant ironically?

    TwinBird says [Oct. 6th, 2011]:

    I think this may be Too Rare To Trope.

    TwinBird, we may just be living in different worlds.

    Even by 2011, a good number of the White defendants who got national attention end up fitting the TV Trope proposed definition of Great White Defendant, “Scapegoat hunted for by a prosecutor who needs to convict a non-minority for political reasons.”

    The several years after 2011 provide almost a steady stream of Great White Defendants, with high-profile cases being Darren Wilson (the Monster of Ferguson) and ersatz-White George Zimmerman (the Mestizo Klansman-mallcop-wannabe).

    ____________

    The definition as proposed (Great White Defendant as ‘scapegoat’), if accepted, raises a question: What is the conceptual relationship between Hate Hoax and Great White Defendant? Is Great White Defendant a subcategory of Hate Hoax? Is a White defendant who is actually guilty not a ‘Great’ White Defendant?

  13. @Lot
    There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn't especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    http://akns-images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013622/rs_560x415-130722103723-1024.2farina.ls.72213_copy.jpg

    Is this the one with SVU or am I thinking of CSI? There are TV channels with nothing but Law&Order on. They said “Law and Order” so much that I first thought I’d caught the History Channel with footage of a Richard Nixon campaign.

    It’d do them a lot of good to branch out like Legos, well not really like Legos, but like that other show CSI. Instead of L&O-Miami, and L&O-Traverse City, they could go racial with it: L&O-black rape victims, L&O-white lady carjackers, L&O-Mexican insider trading, like that.

    Either way, I’m still not watching any TV, so you’re going to have to burn me some DVD’s at a buck a pop in China for me before I’m gonna lift a finger.

    • LOL: ic1000
    • Replies: @CJ
    Law & Order has been discussed on this blog forum many times. I recall a link to an interview with series creator Dick Wolf where he was asked directly about the murderers all being white professionals/businessmen. Wolf didn't deny it; his response was that very early in the series they had tried some pilots and episodes with other types of villains, but audiences didn't like it.
  14. The impression I’ve always gotten from tv tropes is that they have an entry for every tv or movie plot ever. I’ve never known them to need multiple examples to justify an entry.

  15. TV Tropes can be a pretty fun hobby. Especially once you get to the point where you’re watching a favourite show, see a trope, and check that work’s page to see if said trope has already been listed. Then do it yourself if it hasn’t been done already. Steve himself has written about how a good part of the internet is White men doing pro-bono work just because.

    I’m responsible for many tropes listed for Duckman, Trailer Park Boys and Always Sunny. I also created the entire Neon Joe Werewolf Hunter page (there have since been a few 3rd party additions — success!).

    However you can tell the user base skews very leftist. It’s not uncommon to see a lot of Huff-Po-tier editorializing contained within listed tropes.

  16. There are a lot of white defendants on tv and in the movies, but I can’t think of any Great White Defendants (which tv tropes describes, I think accurately, as “scapegoat hunted for by a prosecutor who needs to convict a non-minority for political reasons”). There’s no need to worry about not convicting enough white people on tv and in the movies, because white people on tv and in the movies commit murder all the time.

    It’s hard to criticize America’s fiction writers for repeating Tom Wolfe too much. It would be hard to criticize them for it even if they were doing it.

    • Replies: @Boethiuss

    There are a lot of white defendants on tv and in the movies, but I can’t think of any Great White Defendants (which tv tropes describes, I think accurately, as “scapegoat hunted for by a prosecutor who needs to convict a non-minority for political reasons”). There’s no need to worry about not convicting enough white people on tv and in the movies, because white people on tv and in the movies commit murder all the time.
     
    This is an important point. Ie, there is no Great White Defendant trope on TV, because the white defendants are guilty, and accordingly the prosecutors and cops are not being overzealous in going after them.

    In fact, as a couple other commenters mentioned, this often occurs after a minority is a suspect before finding the guilty white guy in a plot twist.
  17. @Reg Cæsar
    L'Occitane en Provence will find you a great white deodorant.

    https://usa.loccitane.com/V2/pages/common/Search.aspx?search=deodorant&c=82&l=1

    There are a couple of buildings in Prague that'll introduce you to great white defenestrants.

    http://www.onceatraveler.com/overlooking-the-defenestration-of-prague
    https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/defenestration-of-prague-window

    Nebula Haze will teach you great white defoliation:

    https://www.growweedeasy.com/defoliation

    The whites of Brazil are great at deforestation, but it looks like the Indonesians surpass them:

    https://www.conservation.org/stories/Pages/11-deforestation-facts-you-need-to-know.aspx

    When asked about what they dislike about their country, Singaporeans invariably complain about the Sumatran forest fires every year across the strait. Creates tons of smog that makes everybody hack and wheeze.

  18. @Altai
    They come a little close.

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WhiteGangbangers

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GenericEthnicCrimeGang

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AcceptableEthnicTargets

    I wonder if they have an entry for “black woman judge” or “black computer scientist/programmer”.

    • Replies: @Altai
    No, but they touch on it in the Judge entry.

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheJudge


    If there's a tribunal or other situation with more than one judge, both the stern black woman and the gruff older white man will usually appear, though a Bald, Black Leader Guy is a distinct possibility.
     
    It seems like they consider it as a sub-category of these tropes.
    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BlackBossLady
    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BaldBlackLeaderGuy
    , @Altai
    The latter one does exist as it's own article.

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BlackAndNerdy
    , @Richard of Melbourne
    I have it on reliable authority that, when RBG goes to meet the great Chief Justice in the Sky (not too far off now, methinks), DJT will appoint a black female to replace her on SCOTUS.
  19. I’ve watched Law & Order or CSI just a couple times. My takeaway was that the real perp is always the White man. Always. And all judges are Black women.

    Just like in real life.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    One thing that people in the Current Year flatly refuse to believe is that episodes of Perry Mason showed both black and female judges....sixty years ago.
    , @dee nile
    The old soap opera Dallas used to use Black actors for the judges every season when one of the Ewings went on trial.

    One season they used a witemale instead.

    They had to, because this judge took a bribe to let JR Ewing off.
  20. I think a lot of these police shows don’t have GWD themes. Rather, they portray police looking at minority suspects and then a twist at the end reveals it’s a white. That seems to be the pattern with CSI anyway, especially CSI: Miami.

    If you want to watch the least objectionable mindless cop drama, it’s probably NCIS.

    • Replies: @Jack Hanson
    You spelled "The Shield" funny there. Though I heard Southland was pretty good.
    , @David In TN
    Years ago when Fred Thompson played the Manhattan District Attorney, I watched several episodes. Not only where the suspects always white (usually rich) but there weren't even nonwhite suspects.
  21. @Mr. Anon
    I wonder if they have an entry for "black woman judge" or "black computer scientist/programmer".

    No, but they touch on it in the Judge entry.

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheJudge

    If there’s a tribunal or other situation with more than one judge, both the stern black woman and the gruff older white man will usually appear, though a Bald, Black Leader Guy is a distinct possibility.

    It seems like they consider it as a sub-category of these tropes.
    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BlackBossLady
    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BaldBlackLeaderGuy

  22. @Mr. Anon
    I wonder if they have an entry for "black woman judge" or "black computer scientist/programmer".

    The latter one does exist as it’s own article.

    https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BlackAndNerdy

  23. @Chrisnonymous
    I think a lot of these police shows don't have GWD themes. Rather, they portray police looking at minority suspects and then a twist at the end reveals it's a white. That seems to be the pattern with CSI anyway, especially CSI: Miami.

    If you want to watch the least objectionable mindless cop drama, it's probably NCIS.

    You spelled “The Shield” funny there. Though I heard Southland was pretty good.

    • Replies: @Kratoklastes
    I would take "The Shield" over "The Wire" every time, even though the story arc in "The Shield" was pretty predictable (they were always going to turn on one another, and the pretty-boy was going to be deaded first).

    The corrupt-cop narrative arc in the current series of 'Ray Donovan' is pretty good, too.
    , @Forbes
    Southland was good.
  24. The modernization of Chekhov’s Gun is Dogcat’s Pectoral Glue Guns:

    Dogcat: Appears in episode 20 [of Raideen the Brave, the influential mid-seventies giant robot anime]. Powers include a machine gun turret on its back with electrical dagger bullets, swimming, wrist and ankle buzzsaws, pectoral glue guns, a rainbow heat ray from the mouth, reinforced teeth, blade resistance, and burrowing.

    And you know who else tried to fight Brave Raideen?

    Biden: Appears in episode 48. Powers include flight, twin launchable spiked wheels on the shoulders, and a whip tail that fires electric bolts.

  25. @tsotha

    Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.
     
    Yes. Years ago I had a girlfriend from another country. We were watching L&O one day and she said "It's that guy," pointing to the older, wealthy white guy. "How do you know?" I asked. She said "Whenever there's an obvious woman or minority suspect the actual criminal is always the old white guy."

    For the last few years in any TV production – as soon as a black suspect is even hinted at you know he dindu nuffin. For me at that point it’s only a matter of the reveal – which white person did it and why.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna

    For the last few years in any TV production – as soon as a black suspect is even hinted at you know he dindu nuffin. For me at that point it’s only a matter of the reveal – which white person did it and why.
     
    Agreed, except I'd replace "years" with "decades" and "nuffin" with "nuffins".
  26. @Humbles
    Dennis Farina is a great contribution to any production. He was a Chicago cop before he started acting, and his Chicago accent and no bullshit attitude comes off in every scene.

    I love the taxi trick he does in Get Shorty.

  27. Technically they’re right – it’s not a TV trope. No TV show depicts prosecutors trying to railroad white guys because they’re white – the TV writer has the luxury of writing the white guys guilty.

    A world where it’s a trope is a very different and strange world – TV entertainment regularly mocking the news media’s thirst for white crime to assuage cognitive dissonance – they just know that whites must be committing lots of crimes yet every time they hear about a crime (which they then helpfully censor) it’s yet another black criminal. Mocking that concept would imply that the makers of the entertainment found it to be a strange impulse but they have the same impulse only they aren’t constrained by cases that actually exist.

    • Agree: Chrisnonymous
  28. @Humbles
    Dennis Farina is a great contribution to any production. He was a Chicago cop before he started acting, and his Chicago accent and no bullshit attitude comes off in every scene.

    Apparently no relation to Richard Farina, folk singer and husband of Mimi Farina, sister of Joan Baez.

  29. @Lurker
    For the last few years in any TV production - as soon as a black suspect is even hinted at you know he dindu nuffin. For me at that point it's only a matter of the reveal - which white person did it and why.

    For the last few years in any TV production – as soon as a black suspect is even hinted at you know he dindu nuffin. For me at that point it’s only a matter of the reveal – which white person did it and why.

    Agreed, except I’d replace “years” with “decades” and “nuffin” with “nuffins”.

    • Replies: @snorlax
    Goes back at least to the 1940s, and probably longer.
  30. @Moses
    I've watched Law & Order or CSI just a couple times. My takeaway was that the real perp is always the White man. Always. And all judges are Black women.

    Just like in real life.

    One thing that people in the Current Year flatly refuse to believe is that episodes of Perry Mason showed both black and female judges….sixty years ago.

    • Replies: @Jimbo
    Oh, go on with you. Everyone knows that slavery was abolished in 1988 and women were banned from law, medical and business schools until the following year!
    , @Forbes
    Jimbo makes a good (tongue-in-cheek) point. I sometimes regal people with the story that my grandmother graduated from college--before World War One.

    It seems many believe women never attended college until the women's Lib movement demanded it in the '70s.
  31. Anonymous [AKA "Tequila mockingbird"] says:

    1st ever was Bob Ewell (drunk white trash dad) in To kill a Mockingbird?

  32. Yeah, the jury’s still out on whether or not the Duke boys raped that lying murderess whore. Oh, wait, NEWSFLASH: the jury came back! The Duke Boys were found innocent and the prosecutor was disbarred for fraud and the non-victim went on to falsely accuse yet another man after she killed him as he was running away from her! How come none of this has ever been reported? Spread the word!

    • Replies: @Trevor H.
    Just as we keep recounting ballots until the Democrat wins, we'll keep retrying race hate hoaxes (in social media and such) until people are convinced that the white man dunnit. Wait for the made-for-tv movie.
  33. @Boethiuss
    Yeah, you're right but they way things are right now we can't get any traction with that.

    It occurred to me a few months ago that the biggest dividing line in American culture isn't necessarily Right vs. Left, or even globalist vs. nationalist, it's normies vs. cranks. At the very least that one packs the biggest punch relative to any kind of public discourse about it. And that's what we have here.

    The American people would like to dial down the political correctness in America, the blame whitey games and all the rest of it. And the Republican Party would like to do that. But the priority for normies is getting rid of Trump. That's the priority over anything we can offer them, so we should be expecting crap like this to continue unabated until that happens.

    That’s the priority over anything we can offer them, so we should be expecting crap like this to continue unabated until that happens.

    And after that happens it’s back to normie priorities anyway, an acausal world in which Smurfs can play peacefully together.

    • Replies: @Boethiuss

    And after that happens it’s back to normie priorities anyway, an acausal world in which Smurfs can play peacefully together.
     
    It's a risk to be sure, but the normies will give us a fair hearing. And we're selling a product they want to buy. The normies don't want unfettered immigration from Mexico, or a bunch of L&O-style DoubleSpeak about crime, at least not in real life. It's just that Orange Man Bad is drowning out everything else, and the normies have made their priorities very clear on that score.

    On the flip side, we are in a turtle mentality that's afraid of the rest of the world and can't meaningfully talk to it. And by the rest of the world, I don't mean other countries I mean the rest of America as well. So we can't get what's available in our own best interest.
  34. @Lot
    There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn't especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    http://akns-images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013622/rs_560x415-130722103723-1024.2farina.ls.72213_copy.jpg

    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
    Farina played an FBI guy in Mann’s Manhunter (1986), starring William S. Petersen:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qobWh_RiUTM&t=110s
    , @Stan Adams
    Farina played an FBI guy in Michael Mann’s Manhunter (1986):
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qobWh_RiUTM&t=110s
    , @Svigor
    Farina was great in Midnight Run.

    Oh, and Snatch too.

  35. @Lot
    There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn't especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    http://akns-images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013622/rs_560x415-130722103723-1024.2farina.ls.72213_copy.jpg

    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.

  36. OT:

    Political violence in Germany:

    German AfD MP brutally beaten in ‘politically-motivated attempted assassination’ (GRAPHIC)

    Fred Flintstone banging on the door, shouting “Weimaaar!!!!”

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    Sounds like there's an organised campaign. From the far-left Guardian

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/08/german-far-right-mp-frank-magnitz-injured-in-politically-motivated-attack


    Police are looking for three people suspected of having carried out the attack and have appealed for witnesses. They said they had little doubt the attack was politically motivated. Since mid-December, police have recorded eight attacks on AfD offices.
     
    In France, the boxer who took on the police has been given a lot of money by the public.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/08/114000-euros-raised-french-boxer-clash-police-gilets-jaunes-protest


    The online fundraising platform Leetchi received €114,000 for Christophe Dettinger before the site closed the donation page after politicians expressed outrage on Tuesday. Leetchi said the funds were intended only for legal fees.

    Dettinger handed himself in to police after clashing with officers on a bridge in Paris during an anti-government protest on Saturday. The incident was cited by the government as a sign of the violent turn demonstrations against Emmanuel Macron have taken.

    The 37-year-old, a French light-heavyweight champion in 2007 and 2008 who retired from the sport in 2013, said in a video that he had “boiled over” after being teargassed with his wife on his eighth Saturday protest. “I reacted badly. Yes, I reacted badly,” he said, adding he had seen the “repression” of the police towards protesters.

    He added: “I’m demonstrating for all the pensioners, for the future of my children, for single women, for everything we’re fighting for. I am a gilet jaune. I have the anger of the people in me … it’s always the little people who pay.”
     

  37. @Mr. Anon
    I wonder if they have an entry for "black woman judge" or "black computer scientist/programmer".

    I have it on reliable authority that, when RBG goes to meet the great Chief Justice in the Sky (not too far off now, methinks), DJT will appoint a black female to replace her on SCOTUS.

    • Replies: @IHTG
    Janice Rogers Brown?
    , @Lurker
    In the sky? Wouldn't she be headed in the opposite direction?
    , @Malcolm X-Lax
    While there will always be disagreements, I hope he appoints the youngest, whitest, male-est, most right-wing judge he can find.
  38. OT

    The holocaust industry looking for new sources of revenue … will they force arabs to cough up by threatening with US sanctions? That is a rhetorical question.

    Israel to seek $250bn from Arab countries that expelled Jews to ‘restore their rightful property’

    The money will go into a special “fund” … probably towards wall building and JDAM buying.

    • Replies: @songbird
    $250 billion? I didn't know they had to give up oil fields, just homes in the Middle East, which would seem to overvalue the real estate considerably.
  39. Clever & funny … same tune as John Denver’s ‘Almost heaven, West Virginia, country roads, take me home, to the place, where I belong’

    ‘It was almost heaven, California …
    Then the floodgates opened, multi-cultural disease

    Borders closed, send ’em home, to the place, where they belong! …’

    At 1:42, actually quite touching –
    ‘I heard a voice in our darkest hour, he calls us
    Donald Trump reminds me of our home in better days …’

    3 min

    If Trump builds the wall, that will quite secure his legacy for many people

  40. The “Great White Defendant” looks like stage #24 in Propp’s scheme:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Propp

    Not to worry, children, it all turns out right in the end…

  41. It’s probably rare enough in Anime, Pro Wrestling and Video Games not to be noticed by the people who contribute to TV Tropes, yes.

  42. Would Michael Skakel qualify as a real-life great white defendant?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/07/nyregion/michael-skakel-case.html

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Not sure what you mean. The local police wasted valuable time chasing two other (implausible) suspects before they started pursuing the Skakel brothers.
  43. Rarer even than Great White Defendants: great black classicists:
    https://www.chronicle.com/article/After-Racist-Incidents-Mire-a/245430
    Rarer yet: great black classicists whose main interest is actually classics.

  44. @Clyde
    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.

    Farina played an FBI guy in Mann’s Manhunter (1986), starring William S. Petersen:

  45. I suppose it goes without saying that anyone who sent in one too many examples of Great White Defendants would be promptly banned from the site?

  46. @Clyde
    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.

    Farina played an FBI guy in Michael Mann’s Manhunter (1986):

  47. @Humbles
    Dennis Farina is a great contribution to any production. He was a Chicago cop before he started acting, and his Chicago accent and no bullshit attitude comes off in every scene.

    I loved Farina in Code of Silence.

  48. @Moses
    I've watched Law & Order or CSI just a couple times. My takeaway was that the real perp is always the White man. Always. And all judges are Black women.

    Just like in real life.

    The old soap opera Dallas used to use Black actors for the judges every season when one of the Ewings went on trial.

    One season they used a witemale instead.

    They had to, because this judge took a bribe to let JR Ewing off.

    • Replies: @Lurker
    In current year UK soap operas all major crimes must be investigated by a female detective. If a white male policeman appears its because its either a minor offence or he's just there to drive his female boss around. Bonus points for her youth, lesbian status and being non-white.

    If a white man does appear to be in charge of a major investigation thats a sure sign it's false in some way or the storyline is about to veer off into police racism, violence or corruption (or all three!) In the last iteration I was aware of - the seemingly important white male cop was the ex-husband of a saintly female doctor and the story turned into one of domestic violence.

  49. @Humbles
    Dennis Farina is a great contribution to any production. He was a Chicago cop before he started acting, and his Chicago accent and no bullshit attitude comes off in every scene.

    Was a great contribution. He’s been dead since 2013.

  50. Obligatory TV Tropes xkcd.

    (At least where I work it would be obligatory — don’t see xkcd quite so much in these parts).

  51. @Thurston
    Would Michael Skakel qualify as a real-life great white defendant?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/07/nyregion/michael-skakel-case.html

    Not sure what you mean. The local police wasted valuable time chasing two other (implausible) suspects before they started pursuing the Skakel brothers.

    • Replies: @Thurston
    @Art Deco:

    ) Skakel was charged 25 years after the murder.
    ) His conviction was overturned and he is now free (although if the DA elects to do so he could be retried).

    Does that qualify him as A Great White Defendant?
  52. @Richard of Melbourne
    I have it on reliable authority that, when RBG goes to meet the great Chief Justice in the Sky (not too far off now, methinks), DJT will appoint a black female to replace her on SCOTUS.

    Janice Rogers Brown?

    • Replies: @Forbes
    She retired from the DC Circuit Court of Appeals in 2017, and likely would be too old to consider--she'll be 70 this year.
  53. Way back in 1976, in Taxi Driver, the pimp ‘Sport’ (played by Harvey Keitel) was originally written as black. There’s a real desperation to make not just fiction, but the real world, into a liberal vision. Last week it was revealed that a competitive female gamer was a hoax: http://www.espn.co.uk/esports/story/_/page/overwatchelliecolumn/ellie-social-experiment-setback-women-esports

    • Replies: @Cloudbuster
    I saw that. I found it amusing. All the guy had to do was slap on a dress and some makeup and insist that he was transitioning, and that he does indeed identify as a woman, haters. If we have men masquerading as women and allowed to legally compete in real sports, there's no reason they wouldn't have felt obligated to acknowledge it in e-sports.

    The emasculating humiliation of doing so was probably too great for him to be willing to go all in.
    , @Whitey Whiteman III
    Can he not identify as a woman?
  54. @JimDandy
    Yeah, the jury's still out on whether or not the Duke boys raped that lying murderess whore. Oh, wait, NEWSFLASH: the jury came back! The Duke Boys were found innocent and the prosecutor was disbarred for fraud and the non-victim went on to falsely accuse yet another man after she killed him as he was running away from her! How come none of this has ever been reported? Spread the word!

    Just as we keep recounting ballots until the Democrat wins, we’ll keep retrying race hate hoaxes (in social media and such) until people are convinced that the white man dunnit. Wait for the made-for-tv movie.

  55. @Art Deco
    Not sure what you mean. The local police wasted valuable time chasing two other (implausible) suspects before they started pursuing the Skakel brothers.

    ) Skakel was charged 25 years after the murder.
    ) His conviction was overturned and he is now free (although if the DA elects to do so he could be retried).

    Does that qualify him as A Great White Defendant?

    • Replies: @David In TN
    A day ago the U.S. Supreme Court announced they would not hear Connecticut's motion to reinstate Michael Skakel's conviction, leaving him free on bail. The DA can still try Skakel again.

    The Connecticut Supreme Court judge who overturned the conviction indicated he thought Tommy Skakel was the killer, which the defense didn't bring out. Of course, the Skakels weren't paying Sherman to point the finger at another family member.

    A couple of year's ago, Robert Kennedy Jr., perhaps the Family's most annoying living member, wrote a book pinning Martha Moxley's murder on a black guy.
    , @Art Deco
    Again, I don't think so. They weren't pursuing the Skakel for racial-political reasons. He was one of two plausible perpetrators. The other was his brother.
  56. The Great Black Defender(of Whites).

  57. Truth about black crime is ‘hate’ or hatesphemy. Negroes are holy.

  58. @Chrisnonymous
    I think a lot of these police shows don't have GWD themes. Rather, they portray police looking at minority suspects and then a twist at the end reveals it's a white. That seems to be the pattern with CSI anyway, especially CSI: Miami.

    If you want to watch the least objectionable mindless cop drama, it's probably NCIS.

    Years ago when Fred Thompson played the Manhattan District Attorney, I watched several episodes. Not only where the suspects always white (usually rich) but there weren’t even nonwhite suspects.

    • Replies: @Forbes
    The audience for L&O skews educated white, and whites (mostly) have no interest in watching the squalid story-lines of the crimes typically committed by low-IQ NAMs.

    That's what COPS is for.
  59. I’ve lived in Manhattan for 31 years. And I’ve racked my brain to think of any famous whites (or any whites) convicted for murder in New York County.

    The only one I can think of was Joel Steinberg, a lawyer in the 1980s who beat his adopted daughter so badly she died. His trial was televised, and the black judge was so incompetent they immediately ceased televising trials here.

    Bernie Getz pulled a gun on 4 black kids who were trying to rob him, but IIRC none of them were killed. He later ran for mayor and had a significant following.

    There were some kids who killed a teen about 20 years ago during a St. Patrick’s Day fight. But that was likely manslaughter I’m guessing.

    There was a disgruntled employee who shot his old boss near the Empire State Building, and then the cops proceeded to shoot and wound 3-4 innocent bystanders trying to take the gunman down in a wild melee.

    I must be missing at least one??

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Wasn't there a 105 year old rich lady whose butler was suspected of poisoning her? Okay, now that I typed it out that sounds like an impossible trial for a prosecutor: the only reason the 105 year old lady is dead is because of foul play!
    , @Coag
    Here’s a recent one that will surely become a classic Manhattan crime.

    https://www.nypost.com/2019/01/07/killer-tried-to-frame-9-year-old-daughter-for-wifes-murder-prosecutors/amp/
    , @Harry Baldwin
    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).

    https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/michael-griffith-died-fleeing-white-mob-howard-beach-1986-article-1.2917533
    , @Trevor H.
    Robert Chambers "Preppie Murderer"
  60. How about that Great Black Quarterback trope? Oh yeah, another one — “greatest college quarterback ever?” — went down hard last night, and the Jesus loving white guy won big time.

  61. @Redman
    I’ve lived in Manhattan for 31 years. And I’ve racked my brain to think of any famous whites (or any whites) convicted for murder in New York County.

    The only one I can think of was Joel Steinberg, a lawyer in the 1980s who beat his adopted daughter so badly she died. His trial was televised, and the black judge was so incompetent they immediately ceased televising trials here.

    Bernie Getz pulled a gun on 4 black kids who were trying to rob him, but IIRC none of them were killed. He later ran for mayor and had a significant following.

    There were some kids who killed a teen about 20 years ago during a St. Patrick’s Day fight. But that was likely manslaughter I’m guessing.

    There was a disgruntled employee who shot his old boss near the Empire State Building, and then the cops proceeded to shoot and wound 3-4 innocent bystanders trying to take the gunman down in a wild melee.

    I must be missing at least one??

    Wasn’t there a 105 year old rich lady whose butler was suspected of poisoning her? Okay, now that I typed it out that sounds like an impossible trial for a prosecutor: the only reason the 105 year old lady is dead is because of foul play!

  62. @Thurston
    @Art Deco:

    ) Skakel was charged 25 years after the murder.
    ) His conviction was overturned and he is now free (although if the DA elects to do so he could be retried).

    Does that qualify him as A Great White Defendant?

    A day ago the U.S. Supreme Court announced they would not hear Connecticut’s motion to reinstate Michael Skakel’s conviction, leaving him free on bail. The DA can still try Skakel again.

    The Connecticut Supreme Court judge who overturned the conviction indicated he thought Tommy Skakel was the killer, which the defense didn’t bring out. Of course, the Skakels weren’t paying Sherman to point the finger at another family member.

    A couple of year’s ago, Robert Kennedy Jr., perhaps the Family’s most annoying living member, wrote a book pinning Martha Moxley’s murder on a black guy.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    The Skakel trial was held in the courthouse next door to my dentist's office at the time. The Dr. told me that he and his staff watched out their windows facing the parking lot as Michael came and went each day with a driver and bodyguard.

    Kennedys were unpopular punks here (this was Prescott Bush/Greenwich WASP country) so it kind of fits that Connecticut keeps trying to put the guy in prison. If this were Massachusetts, he might be governor by now.

    , @Art Deco
    Kennedy's previous gambit was attempting to pin it on a local schoolteacher, one of the two people the municipal police squandered their time investigating before they turned their attention to the Skakels.

    IIRC, Jack Dunphy offered the opinion some years ago that an experienced police force would have cracked the case in about 3 weeks. Greenwich, Ct. hadn't seen a homicide in 38 years and the two cops assigned to the case had no experience in what they were attempting to do. Where the Connecticut state police were to be found is a puzzle to the laymen. The thing is, the murder weapon was one of the late Mrs. Skakel's golf clubs and the brothers were generally thought wild in the neighborhood. Thomas Skakel was the last person seen with Martha Moxley. OTOH, it was Michael, not Thomas, who had a reputation for flying into rages. One of the neighbors tells Mrs. Moxley, "I'll give you Michael any day of the week". No inquiries into the Skakels were made for months while they pestered a business school student who lived with his family next door to the Moxleys and then harassed said schoolteacher (invading his classroom etc).
  63. My question, as always, is: do they know what they’re doing?

    Surely even the teens and twentysomethings with a touch of autism who make up the TV Tropes editors should at some level of consciousness have an idea about the feverish excitement in the media when a white man seems to have done something, as opposed to the collective yawn when he’s black? Surely? Suuuuuuurely?

    If they do, it appeals to my cynicism, if they don’t it appeals to my sense of superiority.

  64. Tom Wolfe treated “great white defendant” as irony, real life examples abound. But TV treats it as earnest, just the way things are. The cops and prosecutors don’t have to seek them out, they just fall off the trees. Though ubiquitous, it is as invisible to the viewer as water is to the fish.

  65. @David In TN
    A day ago the U.S. Supreme Court announced they would not hear Connecticut's motion to reinstate Michael Skakel's conviction, leaving him free on bail. The DA can still try Skakel again.

    The Connecticut Supreme Court judge who overturned the conviction indicated he thought Tommy Skakel was the killer, which the defense didn't bring out. Of course, the Skakels weren't paying Sherman to point the finger at another family member.

    A couple of year's ago, Robert Kennedy Jr., perhaps the Family's most annoying living member, wrote a book pinning Martha Moxley's murder on a black guy.

    The Skakel trial was held in the courthouse next door to my dentist’s office at the time. The Dr. told me that he and his staff watched out their windows facing the parking lot as Michael came and went each day with a driver and bodyguard.

    Kennedys were unpopular punks here (this was Prescott Bush/Greenwich WASP country) so it kind of fits that Connecticut keeps trying to put the guy in prison. If this were Massachusetts, he might be governor by now.

    • LOL: snorlax, Corn
    • Replies: @Hibernian
    Connecticut seems to be increasingly run by the same type of goons who run MA, RI, NY, and NJ. Think it goes back to Tom Dodd.
    , @David In TN
    To the local people attending (and following) the Skakel trial, Michael Skakel didn't come across as a sympathetic figure. Aside from the evidence against him, he seemed to be just the kind of creep who could beat a girl to death with a golf club.
  66. @Mr McKenna

    For the last few years in any TV production – as soon as a black suspect is even hinted at you know he dindu nuffin. For me at that point it’s only a matter of the reveal – which white person did it and why.
     
    Agreed, except I'd replace "years" with "decades" and "nuffin" with "nuffins".

    Goes back at least to the 1940s, and probably longer.

  67. @tsotha

    Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.
     
    Yes. Years ago I had a girlfriend from another country. We were watching L&O one day and she said "It's that guy," pointing to the older, wealthy white guy. "How do you know?" I asked. She said "Whenever there's an obvious woman or minority suspect the actual criminal is always the old white guy."

    It doesn’t really embody the trope though. Per Bonfire of the Vanities, and real life, the trope is prosecutors unethically pursuing dubious white suspects because of a perceived demand among their constituents for justice against racist villains. Law and Order just happens to be set in a universe where stereotypes are not just wrong, they’re backwards, and murder and rape are far more common among upper class whites than lower class minorities.

    • Agree: Forbes, David In TN
  68. @Redman
    I’ve lived in Manhattan for 31 years. And I’ve racked my brain to think of any famous whites (or any whites) convicted for murder in New York County.

    The only one I can think of was Joel Steinberg, a lawyer in the 1980s who beat his adopted daughter so badly she died. His trial was televised, and the black judge was so incompetent they immediately ceased televising trials here.

    Bernie Getz pulled a gun on 4 black kids who were trying to rob him, but IIRC none of them were killed. He later ran for mayor and had a significant following.

    There were some kids who killed a teen about 20 years ago during a St. Patrick’s Day fight. But that was likely manslaughter I’m guessing.

    There was a disgruntled employee who shot his old boss near the Empire State Building, and then the cops proceeded to shoot and wound 3-4 innocent bystanders trying to take the gunman down in a wild melee.

    I must be missing at least one??

    Here’s a recent one that will surely become a classic Manhattan crime.

    https://www.nypost.com/2019/01/07/killer-tried-to-frame-9-year-old-daughter-for-wifes-murder-prosecutors/amp/

  69. @Humbles
    “It’s still kind of contentious whether the Duke boys are in fact innocent”? What the fark? Their accuser admitted she lied, and then she went to prison for murder, and the the DA was disbarred. What is contentious, again?

    They reportedly used racial slurs against the two strippers. So they’re not innocent. They can’t be. They hired strippers, after all. No one who’s innocent does that.

    They traumatized Mangum, so she defensively created a narrative so to be believed by the racist police. She was the victim. They might not have raped her, but they made dirty jokes. That’s enough. Not innocent. If there was justice, they’d be found guilty. Mind rapists, pretty much.

    That murder conviction, well, she’s just a flawed human being. Aren’t we all? The Duke white boys are probably partly to blame for that, too.

    Can’t fix nuts.

    • Replies: @Forbes
    Probably want to up your daily dosage of cynicism--it's not really coming through.
  70. @Lot
    There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn't especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    http://akns-images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013622/rs_560x415-130722103723-1024.2farina.ls.72213_copy.jpg

    L&O SVU has become ridiculously entrenched in the SJW camp. In a recent episode they did a segment having to do with Marissa Hargitay going all out to fight the separation of immigrant children from their parents, in New York City no less, several months after the practice had ended at the border.

    The actions and “laws” depicted in the segment were utterly detached from reality and, as the SJW cause usually does, presented the freeing of one child while leaving the rest of them huddled, freezing and starving in the infamous “cage” as some sort of major accomplishment for moral right, humanity and social justice.

    • Replies: @Lot
    Saw that one. I loled at your description of the end of the episode.
  71. @Redman
    I’ve lived in Manhattan for 31 years. And I’ve racked my brain to think of any famous whites (or any whites) convicted for murder in New York County.

    The only one I can think of was Joel Steinberg, a lawyer in the 1980s who beat his adopted daughter so badly she died. His trial was televised, and the black judge was so incompetent they immediately ceased televising trials here.

    Bernie Getz pulled a gun on 4 black kids who were trying to rob him, but IIRC none of them were killed. He later ran for mayor and had a significant following.

    There were some kids who killed a teen about 20 years ago during a St. Patrick’s Day fight. But that was likely manslaughter I’m guessing.

    There was a disgruntled employee who shot his old boss near the Empire State Building, and then the cops proceeded to shoot and wound 3-4 innocent bystanders trying to take the gunman down in a wild melee.

    I must be missing at least one??

    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).

    https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/michael-griffith-died-fleeing-white-mob-howard-beach-1986-article-1.2917533

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Again, von Bulow was accused of attempting to murder his wife. When a woman is killed (outside slum zones, about 3/4 of the time the perpetrator is demonstrably a member of the household, a close relative, or a paramour. The puzzle in the von Bulow case was whether or not she'd been assaulted by anyone. If you posit she had been, he'd have been on the top of the suspect list.
    , @CJ

    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).
     
    Good list, but it's a time capsule from the 1980s. Any 21st century white NYC murderers? Seems to be slim pickings.
    , @Forbes
    Von Bulow incidents happened in Newport, RI--so not a NYC white murder, as in the Redman post.
  72. Anonymous [AKA "jaygon"] says:
    @Humbles
    “It’s still kind of contentious whether the Duke boys are in fact innocent”? What the fark? Their accuser admitted she lied, and then she went to prison for murder, and the the DA was disbarred. What is contentious, again?

    Lead cop who helped frame them, offed himself.

  73. A new trope in the Law and Order franchise is the heel-turn for black suspects who initially appear to guilty until a great white defendant emerges to show the viewer just how prejudiced they really are.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    Reviewing all 279 classic 5-0 episodes, the thing that leaps out is that circa 1968-1980 there apparently were no black people in Hawaii whatsoever -- except a couple of episodes with laughable black pimps.. Nancy Wilson played a junkie and Ossie Davis played a crooked banker and that's about it. Lots of evil white guys, especially bankers, lawyers and business moguls. Plus a fair share of female killers. But plenty of sinister Asians too.

    There was some white-native Hawaiian ethnic tension and resultant virtue-signaling on the series. In a 1969 ep a Hawaiian suspect is on the run until McGarrett figures out that creepy young Christopher Walken was the killer.

  74. @bgates
    There are a lot of white defendants on tv and in the movies, but I can't think of any Great White Defendants (which tv tropes describes, I think accurately, as "scapegoat hunted for by a prosecutor who needs to convict a non-minority for political reasons"). There's no need to worry about not convicting enough white people on tv and in the movies, because white people on tv and in the movies commit murder all the time.

    It's hard to criticize America's fiction writers for repeating Tom Wolfe too much. It would be hard to criticize them for it even if they were doing it.

    There are a lot of white defendants on tv and in the movies, but I can’t think of any Great White Defendants (which tv tropes describes, I think accurately, as “scapegoat hunted for by a prosecutor who needs to convict a non-minority for political reasons”). There’s no need to worry about not convicting enough white people on tv and in the movies, because white people on tv and in the movies commit murder all the time.

    This is an important point. Ie, there is no Great White Defendant trope on TV, because the white defendants are guilty, and accordingly the prosecutors and cops are not being overzealous in going after them.

    In fact, as a couple other commenters mentioned, this often occurs after a minority is a suspect before finding the guilty white guy in a plot twist.

  75. @dee nile
    The old soap opera Dallas used to use Black actors for the judges every season when one of the Ewings went on trial.

    One season they used a witemale instead.

    They had to, because this judge took a bribe to let JR Ewing off.

    In current year UK soap operas all major crimes must be investigated by a female detective. If a white male policeman appears its because its either a minor offence or he’s just there to drive his female boss around. Bonus points for her youth, lesbian status and being non-white.

    If a white man does appear to be in charge of a major investigation thats a sure sign it’s false in some way or the storyline is about to veer off into police racism, violence or corruption (or all three!) In the last iteration I was aware of – the seemingly important white male cop was the ex-husband of a saintly female doctor and the story turned into one of domestic violence.

    • Replies: @Forbes
    Not merely UK, and not merely cop/police procedure shows. The white male lead appears to have disappeared from TV/cable/Netflix...

    And the exceptions, like Richard Madden in BBC's Bodyguard (playing on Netflix), leaves him surrounded by female co-stars in Keeley Hawes (the protected gov't minister), and the police commanders Gina McKee and Pippa Haywood, non-white Nina Toussaint-White as a detective, and his estranged wife Sophie Rundle. Non-white male Ash Tandon plays the lead investigator.

    White males with screen time are either duplicitous seat warmers, or criminal perpetrators.

  76. @Richard of Melbourne
    I have it on reliable authority that, when RBG goes to meet the great Chief Justice in the Sky (not too far off now, methinks), DJT will appoint a black female to replace her on SCOTUS.

    In the sky? Wouldn’t she be headed in the opposite direction?

  77. @Mr McKenna
    One thing that people in the Current Year flatly refuse to believe is that episodes of Perry Mason showed both black and female judges....sixty years ago.

    Oh, go on with you. Everyone knows that slavery was abolished in 1988 and women were banned from law, medical and business schools until the following year!

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    I wonder if Netflix will stream Perry Mason some time.

    Who even looks at the tiny type reading MCMLIX etc?
  78. @El Dato

    That’s the priority over anything we can offer them, so we should be expecting crap like this to continue unabated until that happens.
     
    And after that happens it's back to normie priorities anyway, an acausal world in which Smurfs can play peacefully together.

    And after that happens it’s back to normie priorities anyway, an acausal world in which Smurfs can play peacefully together.

    It’s a risk to be sure, but the normies will give us a fair hearing. And we’re selling a product they want to buy. The normies don’t want unfettered immigration from Mexico, or a bunch of L&O-style DoubleSpeak about crime, at least not in real life. It’s just that Orange Man Bad is drowning out everything else, and the normies have made their priorities very clear on that score.

    On the flip side, we are in a turtle mentality that’s afraid of the rest of the world and can’t meaningfully talk to it. And by the rest of the world, I don’t mean other countries I mean the rest of America as well. So we can’t get what’s available in our own best interest.

  79. @David In TN
    A day ago the U.S. Supreme Court announced they would not hear Connecticut's motion to reinstate Michael Skakel's conviction, leaving him free on bail. The DA can still try Skakel again.

    The Connecticut Supreme Court judge who overturned the conviction indicated he thought Tommy Skakel was the killer, which the defense didn't bring out. Of course, the Skakels weren't paying Sherman to point the finger at another family member.

    A couple of year's ago, Robert Kennedy Jr., perhaps the Family's most annoying living member, wrote a book pinning Martha Moxley's murder on a black guy.

    Kennedy’s previous gambit was attempting to pin it on a local schoolteacher, one of the two people the municipal police squandered their time investigating before they turned their attention to the Skakels.

    IIRC, Jack Dunphy offered the opinion some years ago that an experienced police force would have cracked the case in about 3 weeks. Greenwich, Ct. hadn’t seen a homicide in 38 years and the two cops assigned to the case had no experience in what they were attempting to do. Where the Connecticut state police were to be found is a puzzle to the laymen. The thing is, the murder weapon was one of the late Mrs. Skakel’s golf clubs and the brothers were generally thought wild in the neighborhood. Thomas Skakel was the last person seen with Martha Moxley. OTOH, it was Michael, not Thomas, who had a reputation for flying into rages. One of the neighbors tells Mrs. Moxley, “I’ll give you Michael any day of the week”. No inquiries into the Skakels were made for months while they pestered a business school student who lived with his family next door to the Moxleys and then harassed said schoolteacher (invading his classroom etc).

  80. @Thurston
    @Art Deco:

    ) Skakel was charged 25 years after the murder.
    ) His conviction was overturned and he is now free (although if the DA elects to do so he could be retried).

    Does that qualify him as A Great White Defendant?

    Again, I don’t think so. They weren’t pursuing the Skakel for racial-political reasons. He was one of two plausible perpetrators. The other was his brother.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Again, I don’t think so.
     
    Again, again with the "again". What's with always starting your sentences with "again"? It makes you sound like a pompous prating ass.

    Oh, that's right - I keep forgetting - you ARE a pompous, prating ass.
  81. @Harry Baldwin
    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).

    https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/michael-griffith-died-fleeing-white-mob-howard-beach-1986-article-1.2917533

    Again, von Bulow was accused of attempting to murder his wife. When a woman is killed (outside slum zones, about 3/4 of the time the perpetrator is demonstrably a member of the household, a close relative, or a paramour. The puzzle in the von Bulow case was whether or not she’d been assaulted by anyone. If you posit she had been, he’d have been on the top of the suspect list.

  82. @Richard of Melbourne
    I have it on reliable authority that, when RBG goes to meet the great Chief Justice in the Sky (not too far off now, methinks), DJT will appoint a black female to replace her on SCOTUS.

    While there will always be disagreements, I hope he appoints the youngest, whitest, male-est, most right-wing judge he can find.

  83. Maybe no Great White Defendant but the Great White Troll is everywhere.

    From 2 hr mark to 4:20 is the greatest thing ever on Youtube.

  84. How about Moby Dick as the Great Wite Defendant?

    • Replies: @David In TN
    In Tom Wolfe's novel. the Bronx DA was seen by his underlings as a kind of Captain Ahab in pursuit of The Great White Whale (Defendant).
  85. @El Dato
    OT

    The holocaust industry looking for new sources of revenue ... will they force arabs to cough up by threatening with US sanctions? That is a rhetorical question.

    Israel to seek $250bn from Arab countries that expelled Jews to ‘restore their rightful property’

    The money will go into a special "fund" ... probably towards wall building and JDAM buying.

    $250 billion? I didn’t know they had to give up oil fields, just homes in the Middle East, which would seem to overvalue the real estate considerably.

  86. @tsotha

    Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.
     
    Yes. Years ago I had a girlfriend from another country. We were watching L&O one day and she said "It's that guy," pointing to the older, wealthy white guy. "How do you know?" I asked. She said "Whenever there's an obvious woman or minority suspect the actual criminal is always the old white guy."

    It works the same on Scooby Doo, except it’s the ghost or monster turns out to be the old white man. And he would have gotten away with it too if it weren’t for you meddling kids.

  87. @Art Deco
    Again, I don't think so. They weren't pursuing the Skakel for racial-political reasons. He was one of two plausible perpetrators. The other was his brother.

    Again, I don’t think so.

    Again, again with the “again”. What’s with always starting your sentences with “again”? It makes you sound like a pompous prating ass.

    Oh, that’s right – I keep forgetting – you ARE a pompous, prating ass.

  88. @TelfoedJohn
    Way back in 1976, in Taxi Driver, the pimp 'Sport' (played by Harvey Keitel) was originally written as black. There's a real desperation to make not just fiction, but the real world, into a liberal vision. Last week it was revealed that a competitive female gamer was a hoax: http://www.espn.co.uk/esports/story/_/page/overwatchelliecolumn/ellie-social-experiment-setback-women-esports

    I saw that. I found it amusing. All the guy had to do was slap on a dress and some makeup and insist that he was transitioning, and that he does indeed identify as a woman, haters. If we have men masquerading as women and allowed to legally compete in real sports, there’s no reason they wouldn’t have felt obligated to acknowledge it in e-sports.

    The emasculating humiliation of doing so was probably too great for him to be willing to go all in.

  89. @tsotha

    Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.
     
    Yes. Years ago I had a girlfriend from another country. We were watching L&O one day and she said "It's that guy," pointing to the older, wealthy white guy. "How do you know?" I asked. She said "Whenever there's an obvious woman or minority suspect the actual criminal is always the old white guy."

    Other things being satisfactory, sounds like good marriage material.

  90. @Achmed E. Newman
    Is this the one with SVU or am I thinking of CSI? There are TV channels with nothing but Law&Order on. They said "Law and Order" so much that I first thought I'd caught the History Channel with footage of a Richard Nixon campaign.

    It'd do them a lot of good to branch out like Legos, well not really like Legos, but like that other show CSI. Instead of L&O-Miami, and L&O-Traverse City, they could go racial with it: L&O-black rape victims, L&O-white lady carjackers, L&O-Mexican insider trading, like that.

    Either way, I'm still not watching any TV, so you're going to have to burn me some DVD's at a buck a pop in China for me before I'm gonna lift a finger.

    Law & Order has been discussed on this blog forum many times. I recall a link to an interview with series creator Dick Wolf where he was asked directly about the murderers all being white professionals/businessmen. Wolf didn’t deny it; his response was that very early in the series they had tried some pilots and episodes with other types of villains, but audiences didn’t like it.

    • Replies: @Whitey Whiteman III
    It isn't like they don't love demonizing Whites, but middle-aged white women don't watch The Wire
  91. @TelfoedJohn
    Way back in 1976, in Taxi Driver, the pimp 'Sport' (played by Harvey Keitel) was originally written as black. There's a real desperation to make not just fiction, but the real world, into a liberal vision. Last week it was revealed that a competitive female gamer was a hoax: http://www.espn.co.uk/esports/story/_/page/overwatchelliecolumn/ellie-social-experiment-setback-women-esports

    Can he not identify as a woman?

  92. Anonymous[339] • Disclaimer says:
    @Humbles
    “It’s still kind of contentious whether the Duke boys are in fact innocent”? What the fark? Their accuser admitted she lied, and then she went to prison for murder, and the the DA was disbarred. What is contentious, again?

    By no means a minority (pardon the pun) opinion. Sarah Jeong said similar:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/sarah-jeong-the-duke-lacrosse-team-was-guilty/

    Those guys were lucky that incident happened when it did; the whole thing was near-universally recognized as bogus and the victims were recognized as victims and allowed to reintegrate into normal society. If it happened today they’d still be considered vaguely guilty by a large percentage (probably the majority) of right-thinking people, solely for the fact of being young white guys with sex drives who were accused of something bad by a poor black woman.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    If it happened today they’d still be considered vaguely guilty by a large percentage (probably the majority) of right-thinking people, solely for the fact of being young white guys with sex drives who were accused of something bad by a poor black woman.

    They were considered that way at the time. What was embarrassing was that among the most stubborn adherents to the notion that they were culpable (aside from blatantly ignorant and malicious people like Amanda Marcotte) were a subset of social conservatives. It kind of persuaded me that some of the people I'd considered allies were fundamentally silly. One of these characters was an official of the Claremont Institute named Julie Ann Ponzi, who evidently thought a year's worth of anxiety and public vilification and hundreds-of-thousands of dollars in legal fees were condign punishment for having been present during a five minute strip show. Another evangelical distaff type goes on and on to me about how what they did was terribly imprudent and they bear some responsibility for blah blah. IOW, she fancies it was forseeable that a stripper you've crossed paths with will make up a cock-and-bull story while improvising to avoid a civil committment order and accuse you at random of being a rapist, and also forseeable that a prosecutor on the make will spend 8 months preparing to take you to trial after he's been informed by a laboratory director that the stripper in question had the DNA of 4 men in her orifices, none of them Lacrosse players.

  93. @tsotha

    Actually, the vast L&O franchise largely consists of the Hunt for the Great White Defendant.
     
    Yes. Years ago I had a girlfriend from another country. We were watching L&O one day and she said "It's that guy," pointing to the older, wealthy white guy. "How do you know?" I asked. She said "Whenever there's an obvious woman or minority suspect the actual criminal is always the old white guy."

    It’s been more or less this way in all crime dramas since the late 60’s. Why do people bother to watch anymore?

    I mean, I know there’s big crime bosses and all, but crime is never glamorous or sexy. The perps are almost always losers, drug heads, or deeply mentally unstable. Remember the preppy murder in Central Park? Well it was just a big loser drug addict in an oxford shirt.

    Someone here directed us to Michael Thevis, whose story I read completely. What a sleezy scumbag.

    http://www.newser.com/story/244452/he-was-peep-machine-kingpin-then-the-murders-began.html

    But TV would portray him as a suave and sexy WASP.

    Has anyone else seen Loving Pablo? I watched it the other night and was impressed by the realistic way the ultimate bad guy (Pablo Escobar) was portrayed: ugly, fat, disgusting, totally unlovable.

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4682788/

    • Replies: @Marty
    re Thevis:

    During the sexual revolution of the 1970s, the peep machine racket would earn an estimated $2 billion. In the conservative Deep South, Mafia-like firms battled for its obscene profits, as Atlanta became America’s murder capital.

    Talk about some lousy journalism. Atlanta was America's murder capital? And became so over peep show machines? Naw.
  94. Great white defendant is not good vocabulary for what you are trying to say.
    We need a better agreed upon term for this complex idea. Whats so great about it. And why a defendant, defendant makes it sound like a legal trope.
    If you were to say something like, White Burglar in home security commercial, people would instantly know what you were saying, and the context in which you were saying it. But that isn’t good vocabulary for our desired trope either because it isn’t a trope, its simply every ADT commercial ever produced.
    So we still need better vocabulary for our trope, and I can’t come up with any

  95. @Harry Baldwin
    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).

    https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/michael-griffith-died-fleeing-white-mob-howard-beach-1986-article-1.2917533

    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).

    Good list, but it’s a time capsule from the 1980s. Any 21st century white NYC murderers? Seems to be slim pickings.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Was there any particular big high-profile crime event challenging Giuliani's reforms? I wonder if there were crimes appearing in other cities as a result of criminals trying to avoid Giuliani.
  96. @CJ

    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).
     
    Good list, but it's a time capsule from the 1980s. Any 21st century white NYC murderers? Seems to be slim pickings.

    Was there any particular big high-profile crime event challenging Giuliani’s reforms? I wonder if there were crimes appearing in other cities as a result of criminals trying to avoid Giuliani.

    • Replies: @Forbes
    The high profile crime event preceding Giuliani's reforms were 2,000+ murders per year. Basic police investigation, arrest, prosecute & jail was the need. Getting perpetrators off the street was the objective to reduce crime. There were years under Giuliani where 50% of the reduction in crime in the US was attributable to NYC crime reduction. If perps went elsewhere to commit their crime, it would've been impossible to disentangle from the data.
  97. @Anonymous
    By no means a minority (pardon the pun) opinion. Sarah Jeong said similar:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/sarah-jeong-the-duke-lacrosse-team-was-guilty/

    Those guys were lucky that incident happened when it did; the whole thing was near-universally recognized as bogus and the victims were recognized as victims and allowed to reintegrate into normal society. If it happened today they'd still be considered vaguely guilty by a large percentage (probably the majority) of right-thinking people, solely for the fact of being young white guys with sex drives who were accused of something bad by a poor black woman.

    If it happened today they’d still be considered vaguely guilty by a large percentage (probably the majority) of right-thinking people, solely for the fact of being young white guys with sex drives who were accused of something bad by a poor black woman.

    They were considered that way at the time. What was embarrassing was that among the most stubborn adherents to the notion that they were culpable (aside from blatantly ignorant and malicious people like Amanda Marcotte) were a subset of social conservatives. It kind of persuaded me that some of the people I’d considered allies were fundamentally silly. One of these characters was an official of the Claremont Institute named Julie Ann Ponzi, who evidently thought a year’s worth of anxiety and public vilification and hundreds-of-thousands of dollars in legal fees were condign punishment for having been present during a five minute strip show. Another evangelical distaff type goes on and on to me about how what they did was terribly imprudent and they bear some responsibility for blah blah. IOW, she fancies it was forseeable that a stripper you’ve crossed paths with will make up a cock-and-bull story while improvising to avoid a civil committment order and accuse you at random of being a rapist, and also forseeable that a prosecutor on the make will spend 8 months preparing to take you to trial after he’s been informed by a laboratory director that the stripper in question had the DNA of 4 men in her orifices, none of them Lacrosse players.

    • Replies: @David In TN
    "They were considered that way at the time."

    Yes, that's how it was. The Court TV talking heads were mostly all-in on the Lacrosse players being guilty. After it was over, one of the Court TV hosts said something like:

    "No matter what, these players are still punks."
  98. “I have a bad weakness for a movie reviewer: My eyes glaze over at plot descriptions …”

    The best plots are impervious to description. So that’s a strength, not a weakness. And that is why you are one of my fave film crickets.

  99. @MarcB.
    A new trope in the Law and Order franchise is the heel-turn for black suspects who initially appear to guilty until a great white defendant emerges to show the viewer just how prejudiced they really are.

    Reviewing all 279 classic 5-0 episodes, the thing that leaps out is that circa 1968-1980 there apparently were no black people in Hawaii whatsoever — except a couple of episodes with laughable black pimps.. Nancy Wilson played a junkie and Ossie Davis played a crooked banker and that’s about it. Lots of evil white guys, especially bankers, lawyers and business moguls. Plus a fair share of female killers. But plenty of sinister Asians too.

    There was some white-native Hawaiian ethnic tension and resultant virtue-signaling on the series. In a 1969 ep a Hawaiian suspect is on the run until McGarrett figures out that creepy young Christopher Walken was the killer.

  100. @stillCARealist
    It's been more or less this way in all crime dramas since the late 60's. Why do people bother to watch anymore?

    I mean, I know there's big crime bosses and all, but crime is never glamorous or sexy. The perps are almost always losers, drug heads, or deeply mentally unstable. Remember the preppy murder in Central Park? Well it was just a big loser drug addict in an oxford shirt.

    Someone here directed us to Michael Thevis, whose story I read completely. What a sleezy scumbag.

    http://www.newser.com/story/244452/he-was-peep-machine-kingpin-then-the-murders-began.html

    But TV would portray him as a suave and sexy WASP.

    Has anyone else seen Loving Pablo? I watched it the other night and was impressed by the realistic way the ultimate bad guy (Pablo Escobar) was portrayed: ugly, fat, disgusting, totally unlovable.

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4682788/

    re Thevis:

    During the sexual revolution of the 1970s, the peep machine racket would earn an estimated $2 billion. In the conservative Deep South, Mafia-like firms battled for its obscene profits, as Atlanta became America’s murder capital.

    Talk about some lousy journalism. Atlanta was America’s murder capital? And became so over peep show machines? Naw.

  101. @CJ
    Law & Order has been discussed on this blog forum many times. I recall a link to an interview with series creator Dick Wolf where he was asked directly about the murderers all being white professionals/businessmen. Wolf didn't deny it; his response was that very early in the series they had tried some pilots and episodes with other types of villains, but audiences didn't like it.

    It isn’t like they don’t love demonizing Whites, but middle-aged white women don’t watch The Wire

  102. @El Dato
    OT:

    Political violence in Germany:

    German AfD MP brutally beaten in ‘politically-motivated attempted assassination’ (GRAPHIC)

    Fred Flintstone banging on the door, shouting "Weimaaar!!!!"

    Sounds like there’s an organised campaign. From the far-left Guardian

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/08/german-far-right-mp-frank-magnitz-injured-in-politically-motivated-attack

    Police are looking for three people suspected of having carried out the attack and have appealed for witnesses. They said they had little doubt the attack was politically motivated. Since mid-December, police have recorded eight attacks on AfD offices.

    In France, the boxer who took on the police has been given a lot of money by the public.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/08/114000-euros-raised-french-boxer-clash-police-gilets-jaunes-protest

    The online fundraising platform Leetchi received €114,000 for Christophe Dettinger before the site closed the donation page after politicians expressed outrage on Tuesday. Leetchi said the funds were intended only for legal fees.

    Dettinger handed himself in to police after clashing with officers on a bridge in Paris during an anti-government protest on Saturday. The incident was cited by the government as a sign of the violent turn demonstrations against Emmanuel Macron have taken.

    The 37-year-old, a French light-heavyweight champion in 2007 and 2008 who retired from the sport in 2013, said in a video that he had “boiled over” after being teargassed with his wife on his eighth Saturday protest. “I reacted badly. Yes, I reacted badly,” he said, adding he had seen the “repression” of the police towards protesters.

    He added: “I’m demonstrating for all the pensioners, for the future of my children, for single women, for everything we’re fighting for. I am a gilet jaune. I have the anger of the people in me … it’s always the little people who pay.”

  103. @FPD72
    And thus the expression: “95% of NYC murders are committed by blacks and Hispanics; the rest are on Law and Order.”

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.

    Never heard that. Lol

  104. @FPD72
    And thus the expression: “95% of NYC murders are committed by blacks and Hispanics; the rest are on Law and Order.”

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.

    In NYC, 98% of all gun crimes are committed by blacks and Hispanics, while on L&O, 98% of the gun crimes are committed by whites…

  105. @FPD72
    And thus the expression: “95% of NYC murders are committed by blacks and Hispanics; the rest are on Law and Order.”

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life.

    Almost certainly true – and largely a function of just how few murders there are in NYC (only 290 for 2017).

    Slightly OT, but it’s almost as if being a pig in NYC is about 1000x safer than everyone is led to believe.

    The stats say that once you ignore fatalities due to lifestyle (e.g., stroke and heart attack) and incompetence (single-vehicle car crashes) the risk of being a pig is about the same as the all-mortaility risk of being an 11 year old girl.

    In any case, if you think that the over-representation of white murderers on US TV is bad, consider UK series like Miss Marple, Lord Peter Wimsey, Hercule Poirot and Father Brown; with the exception of Poirot they’re all set in rural villages, where there would rarely be one murder every 2 generations.

    For the Francophones, at least Maigret is set in Paris – where a single detective might genuinely investigate 100 murders over a 40 year career (Simenon’s Maigret series runs to 76 book and 28 short stories, most of them involving a murder: published between 1931 and 1972 – hence the ’40 year career’).

    I also bet there were fewer dismembered bad guys in Miami in every season of Dexter, than in real life. More’s the pity.

  106. @FPD72
    And thus the expression: “95% of NYC murders are committed by blacks and Hispanics; the rest are on Law and Order.”

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.

    This sounds too good to be true but turns out to look plausible, maybe even likely.

    First episode original air date: Sept. 1990
    Last episode original air date: May 2010

    Recorded murders in NYC, 2005-2010
    – 2005: 539
    – 2006: 596
    – 2007: 496
    – 2008: 523
    – 2009: 471
    – 2010: 536
    = Sum: 3,161 (over six calendar years)

    – Percent committed by Whites, <5%?
    – – if 5%, Whites committed 158 murders, 2005-2010
    – – if 2.5%, Whites committed 79 murders, 2005-2010

    Law and Order episodes aired Jan. 2005 to May 2010: 120. Share with White villain: At least two thirds? (8o or more) in 4.5 years (Jan. 2005 to May 2010, last episode).

    = The claim that “During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life” is plausible.

    • Replies: @Kratoklastes

    Percent committed by Whites, <5%?
     
    6.9%, according to the NYPD Law Enforcement Report, 2017. (the relevant table is on Page 1)

    Whitey punches below their weight - weak as, bro.

    My previous guess was that it was likely true that there were more Whitey killers on L&O than IRL in NYC.

    Then something happened.

    Mid-morning my beloved mother rang and asked me to help her decide if she and Dad should buy a magnetic water conditioner.

    I did the proper thing - donned my skeptic hat, and found a bunch of proper data on magnetic water conditioners (they're bullshit - so sayeth Lawrence Livermore Labs and the US Army Corps of Engineers) ...

    Chastened at my non-sciencey acceptance of the "Whitey don't kill folks" trope, I decided to be a good data-boy and have a look at some numbers.

    Before I found homicide by offender-race stats for NYC specifically, from broader data "more Whitey killers on L&O than IRL in NYC" seemed significantly less likely than I thought. Turned out that unless NYC whites are waaaaaay less murder-y than their counterparts elsewhere in the US, they would have beaten L&O easily.

    Nationwide, Whitey commits 48% of homicides. (Source for "YT more murder-y than Shaneequa and Tyrell": FBI, "2014 Crime in the United States", Expanded Homicide Data Table 6 - Murder: Race, Ethnicity, and Sex of Victim by Race, Ethnicity, and Sex of Offender, 2014 single victim, single offender).

    Using your data, replication of national numbers would imply that Whitey would be the perp for ~500 IRL-NYC murders, just for 2009-2010.

    I know L&O pumped out about a trillion episodes, but probably not more than one every weekday.

    However then I got the NYPD report, and lo and behold, White Noo Yawkers, for all their bluster and bullshit and posturing, are absolutely pissweak at murdering.

    My Pacific Islander brethren continue to display our proud tradition of extreme interpersonal violence; there are less of 'em in NYC than there are Jews in Idaho, and yet my Polynesian cousins were 5.4% of murder arrestees.

    You other races need to lift your game, cuzzie!!

  107. @Jack Hanson
    You spelled "The Shield" funny there. Though I heard Southland was pretty good.

    I would take “The Shield” over “The Wire” every time, even though the story arc in “The Shield” was pretty predictable (they were always going to turn on one another, and the pretty-boy was going to be deaded first).

    The corrupt-cop narrative arc in the current series of ‘Ray Donovan‘ is pretty good, too.

  108. @Mr McKenna
    One thing that people in the Current Year flatly refuse to believe is that episodes of Perry Mason showed both black and female judges....sixty years ago.

    Jimbo makes a good (tongue-in-cheek) point. I sometimes regal people with the story that my grandmother graduated from college–before World War One.

    It seems many believe women never attended college until the women’s Lib movement demanded it in the ’70s.

  109. @Jack Hanson
    You spelled "The Shield" funny there. Though I heard Southland was pretty good.

    Southland was good.

  110. @IHTG
    Janice Rogers Brown?

    She retired from the DC Circuit Court of Appeals in 2017, and likely would be too old to consider–she’ll be 70 this year.

  111. @David In TN
    Years ago when Fred Thompson played the Manhattan District Attorney, I watched several episodes. Not only where the suspects always white (usually rich) but there weren't even nonwhite suspects.

    The audience for L&O skews educated white, and whites (mostly) have no interest in watching the squalid story-lines of the crimes typically committed by low-IQ NAMs.

    That’s what COPS is for.

  112. @Harry Baldwin
    Claus von Bülow? Convicted, but then the conviction was overturned.

    David Berkowitz

    Mark David Chapman

    Joel Rifkin (serial killer)

    The Howard Beach incident (1986).

    https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/michael-griffith-died-fleeing-white-mob-howard-beach-1986-article-1.2917533

    Von Bulow incidents happened in Newport, RI–so not a NYC white murder, as in the Redman post.

  113. @gabriel alberton
    They reportedly used racial slurs against the two strippers. So they're not innocent. They can't be. They hired strippers, after all. No one who's innocent does that.

    They traumatized Mangum, so she defensively created a narrative so to be believed by the racist police. She was the victim. They might not have raped her, but they made dirty jokes. That's enough. Not innocent. If there was justice, they'd be found guilty. Mind rapists, pretty much.

    That murder conviction, well, she's just a flawed human being. Aren't we all? The Duke white boys are probably partly to blame for that, too.

    Can't fix nuts.

    Probably want to up your daily dosage of cynicism–it’s not really coming through.

  114. @Lurker
    In current year UK soap operas all major crimes must be investigated by a female detective. If a white male policeman appears its because its either a minor offence or he's just there to drive his female boss around. Bonus points for her youth, lesbian status and being non-white.

    If a white man does appear to be in charge of a major investigation thats a sure sign it's false in some way or the storyline is about to veer off into police racism, violence or corruption (or all three!) In the last iteration I was aware of - the seemingly important white male cop was the ex-husband of a saintly female doctor and the story turned into one of domestic violence.

    Not merely UK, and not merely cop/police procedure shows. The white male lead appears to have disappeared from TV/cable/Netflix…

    And the exceptions, like Richard Madden in BBC’s Bodyguard (playing on Netflix), leaves him surrounded by female co-stars in Keeley Hawes (the protected gov’t minister), and the police commanders Gina McKee and Pippa Haywood, non-white Nina Toussaint-White as a detective, and his estranged wife Sophie Rundle. Non-white male Ash Tandon plays the lead investigator.

    White males with screen time are either duplicitous seat warmers, or criminal perpetrators.

  115. @J.Ross
    Was there any particular big high-profile crime event challenging Giuliani's reforms? I wonder if there were crimes appearing in other cities as a result of criminals trying to avoid Giuliani.

    The high profile crime event preceding Giuliani’s reforms were 2,000+ murders per year. Basic police investigation, arrest, prosecute & jail was the need. Getting perpetrators off the street was the objective to reduce crime. There were years under Giuliani where 50% of the reduction in crime in the US was attributable to NYC crime reduction. If perps went elsewhere to commit their crime, it would’ve been impossible to disentangle from the data.

  116. @Bill H
    L&O SVU has become ridiculously entrenched in the SJW camp. In a recent episode they did a segment having to do with Marissa Hargitay going all out to fight the separation of immigrant children from their parents, in New York City no less, several months after the practice had ended at the border.

    The actions and "laws" depicted in the segment were utterly detached from reality and, as the SJW cause usually does, presented the freeing of one child while leaving the rest of them huddled, freezing and starving in the infamous "cage" as some sort of major accomplishment for moral right, humanity and social justice.

    Saw that one. I loled at your description of the end of the episode.

  117. @Lot
    There have been about 1000 episodes of the various law and order franchises.

    The first eight seasons or so of the original wasn't especially PC, even though of course rich white Manhattanites did most of the murders, still many relatively realistic NAM proles engaging in typical petty and random violence.

    they did have one episode involving a hate hoax: a minority on minority killing at a restaurant the perp tried to make look was a white supremacist terror crime.

    An older episode featured a serial killer of black middle school boys that initially focused on a white suspect, when the killer was actually a schizophrenic black security guard, played by Charles S Dutton if my vague memory is correct.

    More typical is the most recent episode I watched: the killer of a man and his theee children were, not the initial Hispanic nanny suspect, but his corporate accounting firm partner wife.

    Probably the high point of L&O conservativism, after the gritty first season, was when Dennis Farina played a hard core conservative bon vivant lead detective.

    http://akns-images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2013622/rs_560x415-130722103723-1024.2farina.ls.72213_copy.jpg

    Dennis Farina, Get Shorty: “They say the fucking smog is the fucking reason you have such beautiful fucking sunsets.” He was sublime in that role.

  118. @Hail

    During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life. This was especially true in the cases of high income whites.
     
    This sounds too good to be true but turns out to look plausible, maybe even likely.

    First episode original air date: Sept. 1990
    Last episode original air date: May 2010

    Recorded murders in NYC, 2005-2010
    - 2005: 539
    - 2006: 596
    - 2007: 496
    - 2008: 523
    - 2009: 471
    - 2010: 536
    = Sum: 3,161 (over six calendar years)

    - Percent committed by Whites, <5%?
    - - if 5%, Whites committed 158 murders, 2005-2010
    - - if 2.5%, Whites committed 79 murders, 2005-2010

    Law and Order episodes aired Jan. 2005 to May 2010: 120. Share with White villain: At least two thirds? (8o or more) in 4.5 years (Jan. 2005 to May 2010, last episode).

    = The claim that "During the last few years of the series, more whites committed murder in NYC on L&O than in real life" is plausible.

    Percent committed by Whites, <5%?

    6.9%, according to the NYPD Law Enforcement Report, 2017. (the relevant table is on Page 1)

    Whitey punches below their weight – weak as, bro.

    My previous guess was that it was likely true that there were more Whitey killers on L&O than IRL in NYC.

    Then something happened.

    Mid-morning my beloved mother rang and asked me to help her decide if she and Dad should buy a magnetic water conditioner.

    I did the proper thing – donned my skeptic hat, and found a bunch of proper data on magnetic water conditioners (they’re bullshit – so sayeth Lawrence Livermore Labs and the US Army Corps of Engineers) …

    Chastened at my non-sciencey acceptance of the “Whitey don’t kill folks” trope, I decided to be a good data-boy and have a look at some numbers.

    Before I found homicide by offender-race stats for NYC specifically, from broader data “more Whitey killers on L&O than IRL in NYC” seemed significantly less likely than I thought. Turned out that unless NYC whites are waaaaaay less murder-y than their counterparts elsewhere in the US, they would have beaten L&O easily.

    Nationwide, Whitey commits 48% of homicides. (Source for “YT more murder-y than Shaneequa and Tyrell“: FBI, “2014 Crime in the United States“, Expanded Homicide Data Table 6Murder: Race, Ethnicity, and Sex of Victim by Race, Ethnicity, and Sex of Offender, 2014 single victim, single offender).

    Using your data, replication of national numbers would imply that Whitey would be the perp for ~500 IRL-NYC murders, just for 2009-2010.

    I know L&O pumped out about a trillion episodes, but probably not more than one every weekday.

    However then I got the NYPD report, and lo and behold, White Noo Yawkers, for all their bluster and bullshit and posturing, are absolutely pissweak at murdering.

    My Pacific Islander brethren continue to display our proud tradition of extreme interpersonal violence; there are less of ’em in NYC than there are Jews in Idaho, and yet my Polynesian cousins were 5.4% of murder arrestees.

    You other races need to lift your game, cuzzie!!

  119. @Jimbo
    Oh, go on with you. Everyone knows that slavery was abolished in 1988 and women were banned from law, medical and business schools until the following year!

    I wonder if Netflix will stream Perry Mason some time.

    Who even looks at the tiny type reading MCMLIX etc?

  120. It might be a good idea to avoid Real Life examples in this trope. Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgement and all.

    I clicked the link in that first TVTropes comment and boy oh boy was this a rabbit hole I did not need to go down.

    In the table underneath the Rule of Cautious Editing article, ‘The Talmud’ is listed as the Next Page, and on there we learn more about the irredeemable wickedness of anti-Semites and how they use the book “to imply that the Talmud is anti-Christian.”

    And in case anyone had any questions:

    It Makes Sense in Context: A claim often made by scholars about some of the parts modern readers would find more outlandish, This example contains a YMMV entry. It should be moved to the YMMV tab.Squick-inducing, or outright morally abhorrent. Problem is, there is a LOT of context.

    Of course…

  121. @Buzz Mohawk
    The Skakel trial was held in the courthouse next door to my dentist's office at the time. The Dr. told me that he and his staff watched out their windows facing the parking lot as Michael came and went each day with a driver and bodyguard.

    Kennedys were unpopular punks here (this was Prescott Bush/Greenwich WASP country) so it kind of fits that Connecticut keeps trying to put the guy in prison. If this were Massachusetts, he might be governor by now.

    Connecticut seems to be increasingly run by the same type of goons who run MA, RI, NY, and NJ. Think it goes back to Tom Dodd.

    • Replies: @Joe Joe
    That's why they call it "Corrupticut"!
    , @Trevor H.
    With increasingly few and far-flung exceptions, Connecticut is becoming a pisshole much like its neighbors. Places like Hartford and New Haven are largely ghetto, Bridgeport is almost all barrio, and Fairfield (and even Litchfield) have been overrun by obnoxious, pushy New Yorkers. But I repeat myself.
    , @Buzz Mohawk
    Oh we're a mess now. Typical Democrat blue state that can barely pay its bills. Some of the highest taxes and prices in the country, when you add them all together, and not much to show for it.

    CT used to not have any income tax. Think about that. Now our top tier, which a lot of us end up paying, is 6.99%. Doesn't that remind you of a slick, retail price, designed to trick your brain into thinking "six" instead of "seven"?

    And we just elected another Democrat governor, who plans to raise taxes further and put toll booths on our highways, because our leaders spent too much so we have to come up with the money somehow.

    Stupid high gas taxes too. And lots of weird immigrants not too far away, even when you live in an expensive, 99% white town. CT is either rich white or poor colored. There is no in-between, and it's all miniature, like Europe, so nothing is very far away from its opposite.

    Our property taxes are outrageous, and we don't get anything for it. Until recently, I owned the old family house out west, and the property taxes were miniscule compared to here, and the services and roads and schools and pretty much all other things were better. I think I pay a rate about four times that here, for nothing.

    CT sucks, in my honest opinion, but hey, I made more money here than anywhere else, and I met and married a really cool woman from Europe who happened to be here. So here we are...halfway between my world and hers, paying way too much for everything and occasionally seeing my old friend, the Sun, on rare occasions but not today.

  122. @Hibernian
    Connecticut seems to be increasingly run by the same type of goons who run MA, RI, NY, and NJ. Think it goes back to Tom Dodd.

    That’s why they call it “Corrupticut”!

  123. @Redman
    I’ve lived in Manhattan for 31 years. And I’ve racked my brain to think of any famous whites (or any whites) convicted for murder in New York County.

    The only one I can think of was Joel Steinberg, a lawyer in the 1980s who beat his adopted daughter so badly she died. His trial was televised, and the black judge was so incompetent they immediately ceased televising trials here.

    Bernie Getz pulled a gun on 4 black kids who were trying to rob him, but IIRC none of them were killed. He later ran for mayor and had a significant following.

    There were some kids who killed a teen about 20 years ago during a St. Patrick’s Day fight. But that was likely manslaughter I’m guessing.

    There was a disgruntled employee who shot his old boss near the Empire State Building, and then the cops proceeded to shoot and wound 3-4 innocent bystanders trying to take the gunman down in a wild melee.

    I must be missing at least one??

    Robert Chambers “Preppie Murderer”

    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
    That's a good one. Perfect for a TV movie and TV episode.

    In 1989, the Chambers case was the basis of a TV movie titled The Preppie Murder, starring William Baldwin as Chambers and Lara Flynn Boyle as Levin. In 1990, the television series Law & Order based the episode "Kiss the Girls and Make Them Die" on the case.
     
  124. @Hibernian
    Connecticut seems to be increasingly run by the same type of goons who run MA, RI, NY, and NJ. Think it goes back to Tom Dodd.

    With increasingly few and far-flung exceptions, Connecticut is becoming a pisshole much like its neighbors. Places like Hartford and New Haven are largely ghetto, Bridgeport is almost all barrio, and Fairfield (and even Litchfield) have been overrun by obnoxious, pushy New Yorkers. But I repeat myself.

  125. @Hibernian
    Connecticut seems to be increasingly run by the same type of goons who run MA, RI, NY, and NJ. Think it goes back to Tom Dodd.

    Oh we’re a mess now. Typical Democrat blue state that can barely pay its bills. Some of the highest taxes and prices in the country, when you add them all together, and not much to show for it.

    CT used to not have any income tax. Think about that. Now our top tier, which a lot of us end up paying, is 6.99%. Doesn’t that remind you of a slick, retail price, designed to trick your brain into thinking “six” instead of “seven”?

    And we just elected another Democrat governor, who plans to raise taxes further and put toll booths on our highways, because our leaders spent too much so we have to come up with the money somehow.

    Stupid high gas taxes too. And lots of weird immigrants not too far away, even when you live in an expensive, 99% white town. CT is either rich white or poor colored. There is no in-between, and it’s all miniature, like Europe, so nothing is very far away from its opposite.

    Our property taxes are outrageous, and we don’t get anything for it. Until recently, I owned the old family house out west, and the property taxes were miniscule compared to here, and the services and roads and schools and pretty much all other things were better. I think I pay a rate about four times that here, for nothing.

    CT sucks, in my honest opinion, but hey, I made more money here than anywhere else, and I met and married a really cool woman from Europe who happened to be here. So here we are…halfway between my world and hers, paying way too much for everything and occasionally seeing my old friend, the Sun, on rare occasions but not today.

  126. @Buzz Mohawk
    The Skakel trial was held in the courthouse next door to my dentist's office at the time. The Dr. told me that he and his staff watched out their windows facing the parking lot as Michael came and went each day with a driver and bodyguard.

    Kennedys were unpopular punks here (this was Prescott Bush/Greenwich WASP country) so it kind of fits that Connecticut keeps trying to put the guy in prison. If this were Massachusetts, he might be governor by now.

    To the local people attending (and following) the Skakel trial, Michael Skakel didn’t come across as a sympathetic figure. Aside from the evidence against him, he seemed to be just the kind of creep who could beat a girl to death with a golf club.

  127. @The Alarmist
    How about Moby Dick as the Great Wite Defendant?

    In Tom Wolfe’s novel. the Bronx DA was seen by his underlings as a kind of Captain Ahab in pursuit of The Great White Whale (Defendant).

  128. @Art Deco
    If it happened today they’d still be considered vaguely guilty by a large percentage (probably the majority) of right-thinking people, solely for the fact of being young white guys with sex drives who were accused of something bad by a poor black woman.

    They were considered that way at the time. What was embarrassing was that among the most stubborn adherents to the notion that they were culpable (aside from blatantly ignorant and malicious people like Amanda Marcotte) were a subset of social conservatives. It kind of persuaded me that some of the people I'd considered allies were fundamentally silly. One of these characters was an official of the Claremont Institute named Julie Ann Ponzi, who evidently thought a year's worth of anxiety and public vilification and hundreds-of-thousands of dollars in legal fees were condign punishment for having been present during a five minute strip show. Another evangelical distaff type goes on and on to me about how what they did was terribly imprudent and they bear some responsibility for blah blah. IOW, she fancies it was forseeable that a stripper you've crossed paths with will make up a cock-and-bull story while improvising to avoid a civil committment order and accuse you at random of being a rapist, and also forseeable that a prosecutor on the make will spend 8 months preparing to take you to trial after he's been informed by a laboratory director that the stripper in question had the DNA of 4 men in her orifices, none of them Lacrosse players.

    “They were considered that way at the time.”

    Yes, that’s how it was. The Court TV talking heads were mostly all-in on the Lacrosse players being guilty. After it was over, one of the Court TV hosts said something like:

    “No matter what, these players are still punks.”

  129. @Clyde
    Michael Mann and Farina both from Chicago. The great 1985 Crime Story TV series was where Dennis Farina got his first big role. Farina was great to watch in anything he was in such as Get Shorty where he does comedy.

    Farina was great in Midnight Run.

    Oh, and Snatch too.

  130. @Trevor H.
    Robert Chambers "Preppie Murderer"

    That’s a good one. Perfect for a TV movie and TV episode.

    In 1989, the Chambers case was the basis of a TV movie titled The Preppie Murder, starring William Baldwin as Chambers and Lara Flynn Boyle as Levin. In 1990, the television series Law & Order based the episode “Kiss the Girls and Make Them Die” on the case.

  131. Perhaps Audacious Epigone or even La Griffe could look at the correlation between size of trust fund, wanness and homicidal tendencies in Sodom on Hudson.

  132. A few days ago, I watched an interview of Peter Stormare, (most famous for playing a ruthless murderer in the movie, Fargo) wherein he says that when he arrived in Hollywood, all the minorities were picketing, with signs, about how they didn’t want to be portrayed as criminals in movies. So the powers that be, said “Hmm, what do we do?” They decided that Russians were totally acceptable as “Badies”. Stormare was asked if he could do a Russian accent, he, of course said, “Yes” and has been working steadily with some of our best directors. So, thousands of minorities have been out of jobs for years and Europeans, are laughing all the way to the bank.

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