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The Racial Reckoning Comes for the Veterinarians
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Here’s an amusing example of an Asian lady journalist cranking out a fill in the blanks story from the template of Why the White Racism-Caused Shortage of Black ________ Is a Crisis. From Time:

Pet Owners Are Diverse, but Veterinarians Are Overwhelmingly White. Black Veterinarians Want to Change That

BY MELISSA CHAN OCTOBER 21, 2020 8:35 AM EDT

As a child, Tierra Price was mesmerized by Dr. Dolittle, portrayed by Eddie Murphy in the 1998 film—not only because he could talk to dogs and sad circus tigers, but because he was a person of color who treated animals. “That resonated deeply with me,” says Price, who wore an oversized white coat and carried around a stuffed Dalmatian for her first-grade career day. “I grew up thinking that I was going to be one of the first Black veterinarians because I had never seen any,” says Price, now 26.

There were no Black doctors at vet clinics near her Louisville, Ky. home or at the local animal shelter where she volunteered. Price didn’t see her first real Black veterinarian until she was 19 and participating in a veterinary program for minority undergraduates. By the time she started veterinary school, she felt like an outcast. In 2018, Price created an online networking group for Black vets just to connect and commiserate with people who looked like her. “I was going into a profession I didn’t really belong in,” she says.

Years later, not much has changed. Veterinarians are projected to be among the most in-demand workers in the next decade. As more people of all races own pets, the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) predicts jobs for vets and vet technicians will grow 16% by 2029. Nearly 65% of white households have pets, 61% of Hispanic households have pets, and almost 37% of Black households have pets, according to the most recent industry data. Yet pet lovers are faced with a predominantly white world once it’s time to see a vet. Of the more than 104,000 veterinarians in the nation, nearly 90% are white, less than 2% are Hispanic and almost none are Black, according to 2019 BLS figures.

“In this day and time, you don’t stay that way unless you’re ignorant to the fact that diversity is good.”

This spring, Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian in Birmingham, Ala., to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely—named after civil rights activist Stokely Carmichael—and to serve as a role model for her two children, who attend predominantly white schools. After scouring the internet and Facebook groups for Black pet owners, she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

Stark disparities have permeated the vet world for decades, advocates say, long before George Floyd’s death in May sparked a national movement for racial justice. In 2013, the profession was dubbed the whitest in America. “It has always been a problem,” says Annie J. Daniel, who founded the nonprofit National Association for Black Veterinarians (NABV). “This was just the wake-up call.”

Despite youth outreach efforts at schools and community partnerships to grow the number of Black veterinarians, the group has barely moved the needle since it was formed in 2016. In fact, the number of Black vets dropped from 2.1% of the total vet population in 2016 to below 1% in 2019, which Daniel says is largely due to systemic racism.

Or the precipitous drop over just three years was due to small sample sizes in the estimates.

“In this day and time, you don’t stay that way unless you’re ignorant to the fact that diversity is good,” Daniel says. “Or,” she adds, “you just don’t care that you’re purposefully omitting a group of people.”

A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.

 
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  1. I wouldn’t trust a black vet with my pet. Blacks are mean to animals and insensitive to the feelings of others in general.

    • Replies: @Anon
    @Anon


    I wouldn’t trust a black vet with my pet.
     
    Joggers are scared of dogs, ghosts and registered mail. They can't be vets.
    , @Anon1492
    @Anon

    The title of this clip speaks for itself.

    A former vet tech admits to killing a dog on purpose due to the owner being "a very bad person"

    https://video.link/w/7cxsb

  2. One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.

    • Agree: BB753
    • Replies: @Anon
    @Redneck farmer


    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.
     
    If you're a bird owner you quickly discover that there are weirdly few avian vets considering the number of people with pet birds. The reason for this?: Most avian vets work in the poultry industry.

    A dog and cat vet can work on gerbils, but it's striking how many such vets do not so much as know how to safely hold a delicate bird, and forget about their staff.

    Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @bomag, @Buffalo Joe

    , @Almost Missouri
    @Redneck farmer

    Kind of agree, but I wouldn't say it's so much "affirmative action for white males" as that most women and non-white vets go into the higher pay lower stress pets-and-horsies type of vet practice rather than the difficult, dirty and occasionally dangerous mass-food-animal-in-a-mechanized-environment type of vet practice, so those latter practices become disproportionately male and white because they are the only vets left who will do them.

    Like farming and ranching (#2 on bruce county's hit list), the work that veterinarians originally came into being to support, this kind of agriculture work sounds fun at a distance, but the reality is difficult, dirty, dangerous and not very well paid. In other words, only gentile whites and Asians will do it. (P.S., whites + (Siberian) Asians converging 500 years ago in the New World = "Hispanics".)

    Replies: @Art Deco

    , @bruce county
    @Redneck farmer


    Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.
     
    There seem to be a lot that like to work on sybians too.🤣
  3. Rather than pointing out that vets don’t even much money or enjoy much status, or that blacks are net beneficiaries of discrimination, or that even a country without any discrimination would still benefit blacks at the expense of whites, just say that in an all black country all the vets would be black and ask how we can work together to create the all black country you want. Push them in the direction they’re already going, don’t try to stop and then reverse them.

    • Replies: @PennTothal
    @Guy De Champlagne


    vets don’t even (make) much money or enjoy much status
     
    The job of a veterinary surgeon is much more lucrative and less stressful than that of a human surgeon.

    All services are rendered on a simple cash payment (usually upfront). No having to fight an insurance company and their auditors to get payed.

    There are fewer regulators second-guessing the veterinary surgeon's judgement.

    And if the patient does poorly from the operation, then they are simply euthanized (at which time another cash payment is often collected.)

    Replies: @notsaying

    , @AndrewR
    @Guy De Champlagne

    They don't want to live in an all-black society any more than plantation owners in Georgia in 1850 wanted to live in an all-White society. Black America's loudest and most influential voices are virtually all black supremacists. They want to enslave us, albeit in a different manner than their ancestors were enslaved.

  4. Anonymous[315] • Disclaimer says:

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.

    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it’s not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it’s not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it’s considered a fairly bad profession and doesn’t pay that well. There’s lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It’s not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it’s mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    “Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows”
    “As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers.”

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    • Agree: Black-hole creator
    • Thanks: Escher
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Anonymous

    Thanks.

    , @Anon
    @Anonymous


    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it’s considered a fairly bad profession and doesn’t pay that well, There’s lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It’s not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.
     
    This is more true for pet shop employees (back before the "adoption" craze), who have to deal with "excess inventory," than with vets. Vets give a lot of shots and do routine exams. They also counsel owners of pets who have died, which comes more naturally to women. When they put down pets, it's usually long past when the pets should have been put down. Pets cannot say "I'm living in hell, please let me die!" like we can, or at least like we can if we aren't already intubated. Prospective vet should work a while for a vet practice. You don't need any particular training.
    , @Cortes
    @Anonymous

    “The vast majority of people would hate programming.”

    Recently I was told of a young guy who’d successfully applied for re-admission as a firefighter after spending less than six months as a train driver. In returning to firefighting his take-home pay is less than half of what he earned as a train driver. Moreover, he forfeited a couple of years seniority by making the short term move to the higher paying job and was fortunate to have a sponsor for readmission who recognised his outstanding merit. He’d had to go through a suite of psychological suitability tests to become a train driver, but the sheer monotony of the job was too much for him.

    “Be careful what you wish for” is cruel because it’s true in many cases.

    Replies: @Mark in BC, @Dratmes

    , @Johnny Smoggins
    @Anonymous


    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it’s considered a fairly bad profession and doesn’t pay that well.
     
    I guess that depends where you live. In most parts of urban/suburban America a (pet) vet makes nearly as much as a doctor and is just about as respected too.
    , @Michael S
    @Anonymous


    They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it’s mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time.
     
    Not exactly. They portray it as a sinecure that is mostly sitting in front of a computer screen for hours at a time reading The Guardian, goofing off on social media, complaining about the lack of _____ representation at the company, and occasionally tapping out half a dozen lines of code, which may or may not compile, often with the help of a coworker.

    And they're not entirely wrong, because the companies are very happy to put them in these positions in order to fill the diversity quotas that theoretically do not exist while preventing them from doing any real damage. Unfortunately the tax isn't just their salary, it's the productivity of all the other workers who have to route around them and fix the gigantic mess they create after doing idiotic things like replacing all instances of "he" and "him" with "they" and "them" so you now have a bunch of references to "ttheyme" and "sthem". I'm exaggerating, but only a little.

    You have to understand how Marxists think. When they say they want more female programmers or black vets, they don't actually want more female programmers or black vets, they want more women and blacks with the title, pay and respect of programmers and vets, without having to do any of the work, because they don't believe that work is actually a thing that exists. Electricity comes from the socket, food comes from the supermarket, software comes from the internet (which also comes from the socket), and vets make animals better by bringing them into a secret room or perhaps chanting something to break the voodoo curse.

    The point is, they don't care about the actual work these professions do, because they don't do any work and don't even comprehend that there is work to be done. The only important work worth doing is taking other people's money and social status, AKA correcting systemic injustices.

    Replies: @photondancer, @The Wild Geese Howard

    , @Prosa123
    @Anonymous

    I suppose being a veterinarian for farm animals is less depressing. Probably a lot less euthanizing animals - if that has to be done I would assume the farmers usually shoot the animals - and in any event they're livestock, not pets, and in most cases would end up in slaughterhouses at some point.

    , @AndrewR
    @Anonymous

    I can't speak for any vets but, while putting down perfectly healthy animals would be depressing, putting suffering creatures out of their misery has got to be fulfilling on some level. And spaying and neutering animals must feel good because it reduces overpopulation. And then there is the joy that comes from healing an ill/injured pet. I imagine vets experience basically the same emotions as pediatricians: occasional sadness overshadowed by great joys.

    , @Jimi
    @Anonymous

    Vets need 8 years of expensive education and make less money than people in fields with similar education.

    I would not encourage a young ambitious black person (or any person) to pursue veterinary medicine as a career.

    , @Rosie
    @Anonymous


    Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.
     
    But I have been so grateful to the vets (mostly, but not all, women) who have helped me cope with loss over the years. One in particular provided a surgery at a very reasonable cost that kept my pet alive and comfortable for a few precious months together and then helped me decide exactly when it was time. In other words, they're not just providing a service to animals, but also their humans.

    Nonetheless, your point stands, of course. It takes a very special sort to be a veterinarian. I am in awe of people who can do that job well.

  5. “A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.”

    And a whole lot of cute, cuddly little critters like White girls.

    Blacks, not so much.

    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @theMann


    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.
     
    This might be the best battlefield to brake the back of wokeness, animal welfare. Micheal Vick got destroyed for animal crudity, perhaps the only sin worse than racism. (That and if blacks ever protested pumpkin spice lattes for racist something.)

    https://youtu.be/cbT-iKgOzEQ

    Replies: @black sea, @Johnny Smoggins

    , @Ozymandias
    @theMann


    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.
     
    Reminds me of Pinky. "He's a very loving cat."
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=okZW3_5Gr4s
  6. Price was mesmerized by Dr. Dolittle, portrayed by Eddie Murphy in the 1998 film

    Who hasn’t based his or her life goals on an Eddie Murphy film?

    Price created an online networking group for [b]lack vets just to connect and commiserate with people who looked like her.

    Wait, according to scripture this just means she’s some incel loser who can’t cope with her crappy life.

    Of the more than 104,000 veterinarians in the nation, nearly 90% are [W]hite.

    Wait, the NBA is 90% bLACK! According to scripture this is just proof of superiority and dominance.

    Am I doing it right? Don’t forget to wear your mask, all ye faithful.

  7. They are starting at the top of the list.

    • Thanks: Voltarde, Achmed E. Newman
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    I look forward to Ms. Chan's upcoming article about how white racism is keeping blacks from being mining machine operators.

    I feel like I could write a parody article referencing John Henry vs. the Steam-Shovel...

    Replies: @photondancer, @Almost Missouri, @RebelWriter, @Buffalo Joe

    , @Clyde
    @bruce county

    As far as small engine mechanics go I am sure there are many Hispanics in this field. They are decent at this, plus look all the lawn/landscaping services that are Hispanic owned and run with mostly Hispanic workers. They must maintain their equipment and make simple repairs right at the work site. Though at my locale I see many of the workers are Caribbean blacks, I think Haitian? But they are working for "The Hispanic Man".

    Replies: @bomag

    , @Redneck farmer
    @bruce county

    They don't get Western Civilization is a white thing, do they?

    , @Almost Missouri
    @bruce county

    Reminder to everyone to use all your Frequent Flier Miles before they get to #9 on that list.

    , @Twinkie
    @bruce county

    Where did you get this data?

    According to this site: https://datausa.io/profile/soc/veterinarians

    Vets are 64.9% female. Whites are 85.9% (Asians are 6.18%). Average age 44.5. Average salary $107,870.

    Replies: @bruce county, @res

    , @William Badwhite
    @bruce county

    Interesting. IOW, the people that know how to do useful things are overwhelmingly white. The worthless chattering classes, do nothing government agencies, etc are filled with POC. This gives white people tremendous power if they'd decide to use it.

    Replies: @Whiskey, @JMcG, @Art Deco

    , @George Taylor
    @bruce county

    Millwrights, sheet metal and steel workers. I wonder when they will go after Elon Musk and SpaceX, building those new stainless steel rockets down in south Texas.

  8. The Tuskegee University College of Veterinary Medicine (TUCVM)

    https://www.tuskegee.edu/programs-courses/colleges-schools/cvm/cvm-about-the-college

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    70% of black veterinarians are trained at Tuskegee, which was founded by Booker T. Washington to give blacks practical skills.

    Replies: @Elmer T. Jones, @JMcG

  9. It’s almost as if Blacks don’t realize that they’re a (shrinking) minority and that no matter what they do, there are gonna be fewer Blacks at any given job and walk of life. Do the math.

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    @BB753


    Do the math.
     
    That’s easy for you to say, Whitey!
    , @Almost Missouri
    @BB753

    Sorry to break it to you, but blacks are not a shrinking minority in the US.

    Blacks are a growing minority.

    https://www.unz.com/anepigone/electoral-democratic-civil-war/#comment-3693558

    Combine open borders with Steve's Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.

    Replies: @BB753, @AnotherDad

  10. And about goddamn time, too. The average veterinarian is a white shitlib female who would greatly enjoy seeing every participant on this blog ruined for not being a self hating subhuman just like her. Kudos to Ms. Chan for siccing the dogs onto this disgusting clade, no pun intended.

  11. …and almost 37% of Black households have pets, according to the most recent industry data.

    Does that include the Michael Vick household?

    to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely—named after civil rights activist Stokely Carmichael

    Prone, Stokely! Prone!

    “Good boy! Here’s yo’ chit’lin’s!”

    • Replies: @reactionry
    @Reg Cæsar

    R.C. has worked in that Carmichael quip at least twice before, but I don't believe that he has yet mentioned speculation (which this Boomer recalls) that S.C. had been thinking of the *supine*, i.e., face-up position. (The other meaning, "mentally or morally slack," might also be applicable here). Then again, maybe Stokely had in mind doggy style.

    See also: Whiskey doesn't know beans about Stokely van camps

  12. And Tiger Moms aren’t gonna let all their hard work go to waste in veterinarian school.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    @Billy Shears

    Our white female vet had a perky young Asian gal helping fill in one time -- the Asian girl ably explained several points the regular vet had never been able to clearly articulate. She also had a retired but still powerfully built white guy fill in one time and he handled our dog much more crisply than the full-time all-female staff (We had a great old-school make vet for 10 years but finally moved too far away)

    , @Twinkie
    @Billy Shears


    And Tiger Moms aren’t gonna let all their hard work go to waste in veterinarian school.
     
    Asians are slightly overrepresented among vets compared to their general population fraction (East Asians are likely much more overrepresented since they are about half of the total Asian population in the U.S. and probably account for most of the Asian vets - you never run into South Asian vets).
  13. @bruce county
    The Tuskegee University College of Veterinary Medicine (TUCVM)


    https://www.tuskegee.edu/programs-courses/colleges-schools/cvm/cvm-about-the-college

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    70% of black veterinarians are trained at Tuskegee, which was founded by Booker T. Washington to give blacks practical skills.

    • Replies: @Elmer T. Jones
    @Steve Sailer

    Not to brag, but I share a common ancestor with Booker and Mohamad Ali about 250 years ago. As does George C. Marshall, who looks unnervingly like my old man.

    , @JMcG
    @Steve Sailer

    And syphilis.

    Replies: @Rob McX

  14. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    I look forward to Ms. Chan’s upcoming article about how white racism is keeping blacks from being mining machine operators.

    I feel like I could write a parody article referencing John Henry vs. the Steam-Shovel…

    • Replies: @photondancer
    @Steve Sailer

    I was taken aback by how most of the items on that list were skilled trades. Suddenly a lot of the comments I see on Unz and elsewhere made more sense.

    , @Almost Missouri
    @Steve Sailer

    David Alan Grier did a bit on the Adam Corolla podcast back in the day about black aversion to working in mines.

    Nowadays the podcast is paywalled and DAG has denounced Adam for insufficient wokeness. Ah, well...

    , @RebelWriter
    @Steve Sailer

    Do it!

    , @Buffalo Joe
    @Steve Sailer

    Steve, 24 years as a union ironworker and just one black co worker. Ironworkers are not really considered skilled tradesmen but the pay was about the same. People in the black community have little knowlege about careers, although there are training programs galore in every mid and major city.Blame that on public education.

  15. Dogs of all colors hate Blacks.

    • Agree: Chris Mallory
  16. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    Thanks.

  17. Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

    And little Stokely breathed a huge sigh of relief.

    • LOL: bruce county
    • Replies: @bruce county
    @black sea

    Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

    I call bullshit.

    How could it have possibly have taken her two months of searching? Was her internet down?
    Was she afraid to ask a white clinic if they knew of one?

    Replies: @bomag, @RebelWriter, @mc23

  18. @black sea

    Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …
     
    And little Stokely breathed a huge sigh of relief.

    Replies: @bruce county

    Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

    I call bullshit.

    How could it have possibly have taken her two months of searching? Was her internet down?
    Was she afraid to ask a white clinic if they knew of one?

    • Agree: By-tor
    • Replies: @bomag
    @bruce county

    She searches like I do.

    It took me two months to find a common pipe fitting at the local Home Depot; meaning I worked around no water in the bathroom sink for two months before I did something about it.

    , @RebelWriter
    @bruce county

    Well, it's not like any black vets have a TV series.

    Oh, wait.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yedpR5n5Cik

    , @mc23
    @bruce county

    If anyone spent two months searching for any available white veterinarian they would be called
    1. A terrible racist bigot
    2. Someone who can't find their backside with 2 hands

  19. Anon[426] • Disclaimer says:
    @Redneck farmer
    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.

    Replies: @Anon, @Almost Missouri, @bruce county

    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.

    If you’re a bird owner you quickly discover that there are weirdly few avian vets considering the number of people with pet birds. The reason for this?: Most avian vets work in the poultry industry.

    A dog and cat vet can work on gerbils, but it’s striking how many such vets do not so much as know how to safely hold a delicate bird, and forget about their staff.

    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
    @Anon

    Bird is the word.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WNrx2jq184

    Replies: @Clyde

    , @bomag
    @Anon


    there are weirdly few avian vets
     
    From my limited understanding, there are few interventionist procedures for birds. It's all about prevention.
    , @Buffalo Joe
    @Anon

    FourTwoSix, hard to believe, but I have two female neighbors who are pet bird vets. One owns a clinic on our main street, Route 5, with the signage reading, "Clinic for Avian and Exotic Pets." The other's vanity license plate reads "Bird Vet."

  20. Anon[957] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it’s considered a fairly bad profession and doesn’t pay that well, There’s lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It’s not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This is more true for pet shop employees (back before the “adoption” craze), who have to deal with “excess inventory,” than with vets. Vets give a lot of shots and do routine exams. They also counsel owners of pets who have died, which comes more naturally to women. When they put down pets, it’s usually long past when the pets should have been put down. Pets cannot say “I’m living in hell, please let me die!” like we can, or at least like we can if we aren’t already intubated. Prospective vet should work a while for a vet practice. You don’t need any particular training.

  21. @Reg Cæsar

    ...and almost 37% of Black households have pets, according to the most recent industry data.
     
    Does that include the Michael Vick household?

    to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely—named after civil rights activist Stokely Carmichael
     
    "Prone, Stokely! Prone!

    "Good boy! Here's yo' chit'lin's!"

    Replies: @reactionry

    R.C. has worked in that Carmichael quip at least twice before, but I don’t believe that he has yet mentioned speculation (which this Boomer recalls) that S.C. had been thinking of the *supine*, i.e., face-up position. (The other meaning, “mentally or morally slack,” might also be applicable here). Then again, maybe Stokely had in mind doggy style.

    See also: Whiskey doesn’t know beans about Stokely van camps

  22. Back when I was single, I dated a veterinarian for awhile.

    She said one of the issues they deal with is people who have pets with black fur, who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” She said they see this so, so often. And everybody who does it acts like they’re the first person in history to come up with that joke.

    And you can’t just refuse to treat the animal. It’s not the animal’s fault their owner named them that. They have to get creative sometimes to avoid using the animal’s name, she said.

    Trying to imagine how a black veterinarian would deal with that.

    • Thanks: John Milton’s Ghost
    • Troll: Ian Smith, Thoughts
    • Replies: @Mr. Blank
    @Mr. Blank

    Troll? Dude, I’ve been commenting here forever. And I wasn’t knocking Steve or anything. Just making a simple observation.

    , @MBlanc46
    @Mr. Blank

    When I was a teenager we had a black cat that I named Rastus. These days, I doubt that anyone would get it.

    , @AndrewR
    @Mr. Blank

    You got called a troll because you are clearly lying. I'm sure many people call black pets that word in private, but I can't imagine anyone responding with that name when the receptionist asks what the pet's name is. It certainly wouldn't happen more than once or twice in any vet's career.

    Also the "imagine how a black vet would respond" makes you sound like a whiny Jewish college lesbian.

    Replies: @kaganovitch

    , @riches
    @Mr. Blank

    "(people) who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” 

    Decades ago my then wife wasn't expecting the vet's young clerk to ask for our orange
    tabby's name. Given time she would have fabricated a suitable name, but in the unguarded moment she blurted her honest reply: Yes, inexplicably, the cat's name was the n-word.

    This would have been a forgotten and only mildly embarrassing event if not for the postcard that came much later reminding us, "your pet ____ [with the name handwritten in the space] is due for its distemper shot."

  23. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    “The vast majority of people would hate programming.”

    Recently I was told of a young guy who’d successfully applied for re-admission as a firefighter after spending less than six months as a train driver. In returning to firefighting his take-home pay is less than half of what he earned as a train driver. Moreover, he forfeited a couple of years seniority by making the short term move to the higher paying job and was fortunate to have a sponsor for readmission who recognised his outstanding merit. He’d had to go through a suite of psychological suitability tests to become a train driver, but the sheer monotony of the job was too much for him.

    “Be careful what you wish for” is cruel because it’s true in many cases.

    • Replies: @Mark in BC
    @Cortes

    Interesting.

    We've lived about a quarter mile from a railroad line for about 30 years. Once, when my parents were visiting from Florida, my Mom made the comment that the train horn sounded intriguing in the night.

    That got me to thinking how we only hear it for a minute or two but, those guys on the train are blowing that thing every minute or two...all the time, mile after mile, hour after hour.

    I don't know how they do it. Noise cancelling headphones?

    Replies: @Muggles, @YetAnotherAnon

    , @Dratmes
    @Cortes

    Railroading is an ideal job for men who don't miss their families, if they have them. You are on call most of your life, you work long hours and when you get off the train, you're put up in a cheap motel 300 miles from home to await a return trip. The job conditions tend to select poorly socialized men, as long as they do not break the rules printed in the book.

    There was no psychological test in my day, and I doubt its usefulness. It's not a job for normies.

  24. And if this helpful newspaper lady’s motivational tactic doesn’t work, there’s always the Raymond K. Hessel method

  25. @Anon
    I wouldn't trust a black vet with my pet. Blacks are mean to animals and insensitive to the feelings of others in general.

    Replies: @Anon, @Anon1492

    I wouldn’t trust a black vet with my pet.

    Joggers are scared of dogs, ghosts and registered mail. They can’t be vets.

  26. Got my newsletter from Nature yesterday. What was the top article?

    How LGBT+ scientists would like to be included and welcomed in STEM workplaces
    Steps that peers and institutions can take to make laboratories, conferences and lecture halls safe and inclusive spaces.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02949-3

    Because those STEM academics and commercial labs are just hotbeds of homophobia, not the exact opposite.

    ‘Invisible’: that is how many scientists from sexual and gender minorities (LGBT+) describe their status at their institution, laboratory, classroom or office. Sexual orientation and sexual and gender identity are not common topics of conversation in many science, technology, engineering and mathematics (STEM) workplaces, and these scientists argue that they should be. They say that cloaking an important part of their identity at work can have dangerous consequences for mental health and career advancement, both for individual scientists and for the disciplines that could drive them away.

    Surveys back up this sense of invisibility. Beliefs that being cisgender and hetero-sexual are the default or ‘normal’ modes — known as cis-heteronormative assumptions — often silence conversations about the wide spectrum of sexual and gender identities1. In a 2019 survey of more than 1,000 UK-based physical scientists, nearly 30% of LGBT+ scientists and half of transgender scientists said that they had considered leaving their workplace because of an unfriendly or hostile climate or because of discrimination2. And nearly 20% of LGBT+ chemists and 32% of transgender and non-binary scientists across all disciplines had experienced exclusionary, offensive or harassing behaviour at work in the previous year. About half of the respondents agree that there is an overall lack of awareness of LGBT+ issues in the workplace. And a 2016 study found that LGBT+ undergraduate students are 7% less likely to be retained in STEM fields than are their non-LGBT+ counterparts3.

    So which is it? Is sexual orientation seldom mentioned or is it a constant vector for harassment for huge numbers of LGBT scientists? Or, more likely, activists would like to make it an ‘issue’ with lots of discussion to create lots of ‘support’ (Read: Artificially better career prospects and ringfenched funding for LGBTs) because actually there isn’t a problem and there won’t be resistance.

    We can say much the same for teaching and veterinarian professions. It’s not that they’re ‘too white’ but ‘too young white woman who will do what we say’ that got them in trouble.

    Left unexamined is why white people are so disproportionate in a profession with low pay and which seems to be purely about altruism. Where are all the Asians? Why don’t we have a problem getting natives to do these jobs? Could it be that Vets don’t have as good a union that keeps the numbers of new vets graduated artificially low? Where are all the native born Asians?

    • Replies: @Mark in BC
    @Altai

    A couple things about the article you quote. First, it give percentages of LGBTQRS+ workers that "feel" a certain way. It doesn't say what percentage of the FIELD is LGBTQRS+. Second, STEM fields deal with the real world. Just because you think something doesn't mean it will work. I can see a molecular biologist declaring the material he's working with to be something that it's not because he "feels" that the material is "identifying" as such on a given day. They'd be sent to the looney bin.

  27. My vet surgery has 5-6 vets, at least 2 of which are asian, but none are male. Of course, the Melissa Chans of this world don’t even notice this lack of diversity let alone deplore the sad plight of men who just want to take their wittily named pet to a male vet (who will _understand_).

    • Replies: @slumber_j
    @photondancer


    Of course, the Melissa Chans of this world don’t even notice this lack of diversity
     
    Yeah, there are basically no male small-animal vets under the age of I dunno, 60? And US veterinary schools skew so female, and women skew so small-animal, that there has long been a growing shortage of large-animal vets in general.

    And depending on how you look at these things, large-animal vets are arguably the actually necessary ones. But now we're into the whole Pets vs. Food tussle, so never mind.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  28. @Anon
    @Redneck farmer


    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.
     
    If you're a bird owner you quickly discover that there are weirdly few avian vets considering the number of people with pet birds. The reason for this?: Most avian vets work in the poultry industry.

    A dog and cat vet can work on gerbils, but it's striking how many such vets do not so much as know how to safely hold a delicate bird, and forget about their staff.

    Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @bomag, @Buffalo Joe

    Bird is the word.

    • LOL: Achmed E. Newman
    • Replies: @Clyde
    @JohnnyWalker123

    86,543,725 views! Yikes. I am glad I despise adult cartoons, just more dumbing down. I watched first season of Simpsons and that was it. I remember Simpsons was presented as ground breaking and too cool to miss.

  29. In the UK, vet school is the most competitive of all to get into, even more so than med school.

    It doesn’t seem to be attractive to Jews or Chinese, so it’s very white simply because that’s what the (non-Jewish/Far Eastern) far right of the Bell Curve looks like.

    (A few other high-IQ jobs like actuary seem unattractive to Jews, with maybe Gail Tverberg of Our Finite World as the exception, if she’s Jewish. Perhaps they prefer to make the money rather than analyse it).

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @YetAnotherAnon

    When I was a kid 50 years ago, readers couldn't get enough of Yorkshire veterinarian James Herriot's memoirs, such as All Creatures Great and Small.

    My vague impression is that what romance is to the French -- their great contribution to world culture -- kindness to animals is to the English.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

  30. @BB753
    It's almost as if Blacks don't realize that they're a (shrinking) minority and that no matter what they do, there are gonna be fewer Blacks at any given job and walk of life. Do the math.

    Replies: @The Alarmist, @Almost Missouri

    Do the math.

    That’s easy for you to say, Whitey!

    • LOL: James Speaks
  31. Medical schools’ affirmative action dips so far down in the black talent pool, like way lower than it should, that there are virtually no blacks with the intelligence and personality to be a vet who is not being dragged through medical school.

    Much like every black smart enough to be a bank manager works for Goldman Sachs, leaving blacks who are smart enough to be tellers being affirmed into managers. To get black, vets schools would have to admit and graduate half-literate women who barely have the aptitude to be vet techs.

    Yes, affirmative action is that powerful and the black talent pool is very thin indeed. 1 in a thousand has an IQ above 130, 2% are above 115, and 16& are above the white average of 100.

    I would be very surprised if vets’ average IQ is not above 115., because vet schools reject a larger percent of their applicants than med schools. At least that was true as of 10 years ago, or so.

    Ah, according to https://whatisitliketohaveaniqof140orhigher.wordpress.com/2014/12/13/average-iq-by-occupation/ vets average 114.4, so I was close. That chart also says that surgeons average 234, so either the table is a joke, or he miskeyec 134. I’ve talked to surgeons, though. If they have 134 IQ (on average), then it must be on the performance IQ side of the ledger.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Rob

    My date for the prom in 1975 had to get a 4.0 GPA in HS to get into the UC Davis pre-vet program and then she had to get a 4.0 GPA in college to get into the UC Davis vet school. It all seemed rather exhausting to contemplate.

    Replies: @Anon

  32. I always thought for all his faults, at least Hitler was a dog lover. Now they won’t even let the poor bastard have that one.

    • Replies: @Johnny Smoggins
    @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Hitler became a vegetarian and banned vivisection in Germany because he was an animal lover.

  33. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    As far as small engine mechanics go I am sure there are many Hispanics in this field. They are decent at this, plus look all the lawn/landscaping services that are Hispanic owned and run with mostly Hispanic workers. They must maintain their equipment and make simple repairs right at the work site. Though at my locale I see many of the workers are Caribbean blacks, I think Haitian? But they are working for “The Hispanic Man”.

    • Replies: @bomag
    @Clyde


    As far as small engine mechanics go I am sure there are many Hispanics in this field.
     
    I'm rather surprised by the dearth of such.

    They are mechanically adept people, but don't seem to especially gravitate to full time tinkering.

    Seems to be many more in auto body repair and painting; more artistically focused, I suppose.

  34. @Rob
    Medical schools’ affirmative action dips so far down in the black talent pool, like way lower than it should, that there are virtually no blacks with the intelligence and personality to be a vet who is not being dragged through medical school.

    Much like every black smart enough to be a bank manager works for Goldman Sachs, leaving blacks who are smart enough to be tellers being affirmed into managers. To get black, vets schools would have to admit and graduate half-literate women who barely have the aptitude to be vet techs.

    Yes, affirmative action is that powerful and the black talent pool is very thin indeed. 1 in a thousand has an IQ above 130, 2% are above 115, and 16& are above the white average of 100.

    I would be very surprised if vets’ average IQ is not above 115., because vet schools reject a larger percent of their applicants than med schools. At least that was true as of 10 years ago, or so.

    Ah, according to https://whatisitliketohaveaniqof140orhigher.wordpress.com/2014/12/13/average-iq-by-occupation/ vets average 114.4, so I was close. That chart also says that surgeons average 234, so either the table is a joke, or he miskeyec 134. I’ve talked to surgeons, though. If they have 134 IQ (on average), then it must be on the performance IQ side of the ledger.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    My date for the prom in 1975 had to get a 4.0 GPA in HS to get into the UC Davis pre-vet program and then she had to get a 4.0 GPA in college to get into the UC Davis vet school. It all seemed rather exhausting to contemplate.

    • Replies: @Anon
    @Steve Sailer

    “My date for the prom...”

    Poignant. (No sarcasm.) As the saying goes, “High school is never over.”
    I speak as someone who didn’t marry his high-school sweetheart. I never spoke to my high-school sweetheart.

    Replies: @NickG

  35. @JohnnyWalker123
    @Anon

    Bird is the word.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WNrx2jq184

    Replies: @Clyde

    86,543,725 views! Yikes. I am glad I despise adult cartoons, just more dumbing down. I watched first season of Simpsons and that was it. I remember Simpsons was presented as ground breaking and too cool to miss.

  36. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    They don’t get Western Civilization is a white thing, do they?

  37. @theMann
    "A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough."



    And a whole lot of cute, cuddly little critters like White girls.


    Blacks, not so much.


    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Ozymandias

    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.

    This might be the best battlefield to brake the back of wokeness, animal welfare. Micheal Vick got destroyed for animal crudity, perhaps the only sin worse than racism. (That and if blacks ever protested pumpkin spice lattes for racist something.)

    • Replies: @black sea
    @Kronos

    After serving his jail time, Michael Vick played seven more years in the NFL, so I wouldn't say that his cruelty to dogs destroyed him or his career.

    Replies: @Kronos

    , @Johnny Smoggins
    @Kronos

    Most of the pit bulls adopted by millennial urban elves were abused, neglected and cast away by blacks. They treat animals even worse than people.

  38. Stark disparities have permeated the vet world for decades, advocates say, long before George Floyd’s death in May sparked a national movement for racial justice.

    Non sequitur of the day!

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    @EdwardM

    Runner up:


    This spring, Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian in Birmingham, Ala., to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely ... and to serve as a role model for her two children, who attend predominantly white schools.
     
    Wait wut? She can't find a majority black school for her children near Birmingham Alabama?!? Because a ¡Black! school would definitely be full of ¡Black! role models for her little darlings. We know this because TV keeps showing it.

    Weird how that works ... avoids blacks schools yet seeks black vet. What could explain it?

    Also, why no mention of a black father serving as a role model for her two children? What could explain that one?

    Kimberly Glover, another mind wasted by drinking too much liberal koolaid.

    Replies: @Gary in Gramercy, @By-tor

  39. @Kronos
    @theMann


    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.
     
    This might be the best battlefield to brake the back of wokeness, animal welfare. Micheal Vick got destroyed for animal crudity, perhaps the only sin worse than racism. (That and if blacks ever protested pumpkin spice lattes for racist something.)

    https://youtu.be/cbT-iKgOzEQ

    Replies: @black sea, @Johnny Smoggins

    After serving his jail time, Michael Vick played seven more years in the NFL, so I wouldn’t say that his cruelty to dogs destroyed him or his career.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @black sea

    But it broke the black-white media racial barrier amongst white liberal women. Vick became in their eyes just another asshole. In that instant they became colorblind! Race wasn’t involved in it.

  40. Maybe it is learned by example, but blacks seem to like animals less than whites do. Even aside from the strange increasing trend of whites to humanize their animals to a ridiculous degree. Growing up, none of my black friends had cats or dogs, other than a dog here or there that stayed in the yard. As we got older, pit bulls became common as a status thing, and surely not for the love of a dog. Of course, there are prominent examples to the contrary on both sides. Mike Tyson and his pigeons comes to mind. Trump seems to care less about animals. The point is that, as with male housekeepers or female miners, the is a mismatch in interest as well as talent.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @william munny

    Anglos, in England and America, seem to have led the world in love of animals.

    Maybe it wasn't always so. "King Lear" is striking in how dogs are held in contempt:

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/dogs-and-their-people/201504/william-shakespeare-hated-dogs

    https://www.drmetablog.com/2006/11/shakespeare_and.html

    I don't know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.

    Replies: @OFWHAP, @Faraday's Bobcat, @LBD

  41. @YetAnotherAnon
    In the UK, vet school is the most competitive of all to get into, even more so than med school.


    It doesn't seem to be attractive to Jews or Chinese, so it's very white simply because that's what the (non-Jewish/Far Eastern) far right of the Bell Curve looks like.

    (A few other high-IQ jobs like actuary seem unattractive to Jews, with maybe Gail Tverberg of Our Finite World as the exception, if she's Jewish. Perhaps they prefer to make the money rather than analyse it).

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    When I was a kid 50 years ago, readers couldn’t get enough of Yorkshire veterinarian James Herriot’s memoirs, such as All Creatures Great and Small.

    My vague impression is that what romance is to the French — their great contribution to world culture — kindness to animals is to the English.

    • Thanks: Thoughts
    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    @Steve Sailer

    A new series of All Creatures Great and Small is getting big TV audiences at present, they've so far managed not to retcon/shoehorn any diversity into it. It'll be on PBS I think.

    It's Channel Five's most popular program ever.

    These two things may be connected.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Creatures_Great_and_Small_(2020_TV_series)

    https://images.immediate.co.uk/production/volatile/sites/3/2020/07/All-Creatures-Great-and-Small-2020-ae9cd4c.jpg

    Replies: @Rob McX

  42. @black sea
    @Kronos

    After serving his jail time, Michael Vick played seven more years in the NFL, so I wouldn't say that his cruelty to dogs destroyed him or his career.

    Replies: @Kronos

    But it broke the black-white media racial barrier amongst white liberal women. Vick became in their eyes just another asshole. In that instant they became colorblind! Race wasn’t involved in it.

  43. @william munny
    Maybe it is learned by example, but blacks seem to like animals less than whites do. Even aside from the strange increasing trend of whites to humanize their animals to a ridiculous degree. Growing up, none of my black friends had cats or dogs, other than a dog here or there that stayed in the yard. As we got older, pit bulls became common as a status thing, and surely not for the love of a dog. Of course, there are prominent examples to the contrary on both sides. Mike Tyson and his pigeons comes to mind. Trump seems to care less about animals. The point is that, as with male housekeepers or female miners, the is a mismatch in interest as well as talent.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    Anglos, in England and America, seem to have led the world in love of animals.

    Maybe it wasn’t always so. “King Lear” is striking in how dogs are held in contempt:

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/dogs-and-their-people/201504/william-shakespeare-hated-dogs

    https://www.drmetablog.com/2006/11/shakespeare_and.html

    I don’t know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.

    • Replies: @OFWHAP
    @Steve Sailer

    This just proves that William Shakespeare was actually a Black Womyn after all!

    , @Faraday's Bobcat
    @Steve Sailer


    I don’t know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.
     
    Probably not; they had a lot of dogfighting in Elizabethan England. Today dogfighting would get you hanged if they still had hanging.
    , @LBD
    @Steve Sailer

    No, Shakespeare didn’t hate dogs. In Two Gentlemen of Verona there are touching scenes with a servant and his scruffy dog, “Crab”. Crab always steals the scenes and gets lots of applause.

  44. @Guy De Champlagne
    Rather than pointing out that vets don't even much money or enjoy much status, or that blacks are net beneficiaries of discrimination, or that even a country without any discrimination would still benefit blacks at the expense of whites, just say that in an all black country all the vets would be black and ask how we can work together to create the all black country you want. Push them in the direction they're already going, don't try to stop and then reverse them.

    Replies: @PennTothal, @AndrewR

    vets don’t even (make) much money or enjoy much status

    The job of a veterinary surgeon is much more lucrative and less stressful than that of a human surgeon.

    All services are rendered on a simple cash payment (usually upfront). No having to fight an insurance company and their auditors to get payed.

    There are fewer regulators second-guessing the veterinary surgeon’s judgement.

    And if the patient does poorly from the operation, then they are simply euthanized (at which time another cash payment is often collected.)

    • Agree: bruce county
    • Replies: @notsaying
    @PennTothal

    I don't know about that. It might be true in the richer neighborhoods.

    I remember reading a big article a number of years ago about vets. I think it was in the New York Times. Their biggest challenge is that while there's a big demand for their services, a lot of people with pets have no money to pay the vet. The entry level salaries aren't good and they typically have a lot of student loans to pay.

    The love of animals keeps people going into the field.

    This article made me aware of the big problem with pet owners not being able to afford the vet. It makes me wonder why when you hear about animal adoption nobody ever mentions the cost of animals and evaluating whether people can afford a pet before getting one. Of the 65% or so of whites and Hispanic families that have pets, a significant number don't have money for any kind of vet problem or even grooming. That would be especially true of the Hispanics.

    I am sad to realize how many people who can barely afford rent and bills have pets. That translates into a lot of abandoned and medically neglected animals.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Art Deco

  45. Blacks thrive in industries characterized by large scale, bureaucratic culture, and heavy government involvement. Veterinary practices are the opposite of that.

    First, vet practices are small: this exempts them from imposed affirmative action, and also means there’s no room for nonproductive management jobs. Second, it’s mostly cash on the barrel, so vets need to please their customers, rather than please insurance companies or Medicare/Medicaid; one incompetent or rude partner is all it takes to sink the business.

    • Agree: By-tor, NickG
  46. @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    70% of black veterinarians are trained at Tuskegee, which was founded by Booker T. Washington to give blacks practical skills.

    Replies: @Elmer T. Jones, @JMcG

    Not to brag, but I share a common ancestor with Booker and Mohamad Ali about 250 years ago. As does George C. Marshall, who looks unnervingly like my old man.

  47. @Anon
    @Redneck farmer


    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.
     
    If you're a bird owner you quickly discover that there are weirdly few avian vets considering the number of people with pet birds. The reason for this?: Most avian vets work in the poultry industry.

    A dog and cat vet can work on gerbils, but it's striking how many such vets do not so much as know how to safely hold a delicate bird, and forget about their staff.

    Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @bomag, @Buffalo Joe

    there are weirdly few avian vets

    From my limited understanding, there are few interventionist procedures for birds. It’s all about prevention.

  48. @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    I look forward to Ms. Chan's upcoming article about how white racism is keeping blacks from being mining machine operators.

    I feel like I could write a parody article referencing John Henry vs. the Steam-Shovel...

    Replies: @photondancer, @Almost Missouri, @RebelWriter, @Buffalo Joe

    I was taken aback by how most of the items on that list were skilled trades. Suddenly a lot of the comments I see on Unz and elsewhere made more sense.

  49. @Steve Sailer
    @YetAnotherAnon

    When I was a kid 50 years ago, readers couldn't get enough of Yorkshire veterinarian James Herriot's memoirs, such as All Creatures Great and Small.

    My vague impression is that what romance is to the French -- their great contribution to world culture -- kindness to animals is to the English.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

    A new series of All Creatures Great and Small is getting big TV audiences at present, they’ve so far managed not to retcon/shoehorn any diversity into it. It’ll be on PBS I think.

    It’s Channel Five’s most popular program ever.

    These two things may be connected.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Creatures_Great_and_Small_(2020_TV_series)

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    @YetAnotherAnon


    ...they’ve so far managed not to retcon/shoehorn any diversity into it.
     
    That is astonishing. The whole point of remaking classics these days is to inflict non-whites on the viewers in their living rooms, even if they manage to avoid diversity in real life. Maybe it dawned on the producers that diversifying this 1930s agricultural milieu might not be a good business decision.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

  50. @bruce county
    https://images.gawker.com/18addjgy80f0mjpg/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800.jpg

    Replies: @Bard of Bumperstickers

    Woof supremacist.

  51. Generally blacks make up about 4-8% of those in professional positions where occupational licensing examinations or certification examinations are required or common. The one odd exception is veterinary medicine, where blacks are so unusual the Bureau of Labor Statistics cannot through its usual methods produce an accurate count. This is what occupational choice looks like. (As we speak, north of 70% of the DVM diplomas issued each year go to women, a ‘disparity’ that doesn’t bother anyone).

    • Replies: @res
    @Art Deco

    Here is a link to their statistics.
    https://www.bls.gov/cps/cpsaat11.htm

    For veterinarians they show 104,000 total with 68.3% women and 89.8% white, 0.0% black, 6.1% Asian, and 1.6% Hispanic (so looks like I was wrong about Hispanics mattering much here).

    Mean annual wage of $104,820 and more at
    https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes291131.htm

    It is interesting to contrast that with "Veterinary assistants and laboratory animal caretakers" at 82.7% women. and 97.2% white, 2.1% black, 0.4% Asian, and 3.7% Hispanic.

    Mean annual wage of $29,690 and more at
    https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes319096.htm

  52. @Redneck farmer
    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.

    Replies: @Anon, @Almost Missouri, @bruce county

    Kind of agree, but I wouldn’t say it’s so much “affirmative action for white males” as that most women and non-white vets go into the higher pay lower stress pets-and-horsies type of vet practice rather than the difficult, dirty and occasionally dangerous mass-food-animal-in-a-mechanized-environment type of vet practice, so those latter practices become disproportionately male and white because they are the only vets left who will do them.

    Like farming and ranching (#2 on bruce county‘s hit list), the work that veterinarians originally came into being to support, this kind of agriculture work sounds fun at a distance, but the reality is difficult, dirty, dangerous and not very well paid. In other words, only gentile whites and Asians will do it. (P.S., whites + (Siberian) Asians converging 500 years ago in the New World = “Hispanics”.)

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    According to this report here:

    https://www.avma.org/sites/default/files/resources/2017-econ-rpt4-mkt-vet-services.pdf


    About 10% of the employment in veterinary practice is found in farm-only practices (which receive 10% of the revenue). About 8% are horse specialists (and receive 8% of the revenue). About 45% are small animal specialists (receiving 45% of the revenue). About 30% are general practitioners (and receive about 30% of the revenue).

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

  53. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    Reminder to everyone to use all your Frequent Flier Miles before they get to #9 on that list.

    • LOL: TTSSYF, bruce county
  54. @EdwardM

    Stark disparities have permeated the vet world for decades, advocates say, long before George Floyd’s death in May sparked a national movement for racial justice.
     
    Non sequitur of the day!

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    Runner up:

    This spring, Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian in Birmingham, Ala., to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely … and to serve as a role model for her two children, who attend predominantly white schools.

    Wait wut? She can’t find a majority black school for her children near Birmingham Alabama?!? Because a ¡Black! school would definitely be full of ¡Black! role models for her little darlings. We know this because TV keeps showing it.

    Weird how that works … avoids blacks schools yet seeks black vet. What could explain it?

    Also, why no mention of a black father serving as a role model for her two children? What could explain that one?

    Kimberly Glover, another mind wasted by drinking too much liberal koolaid.

    • Agree: Gary in Gramercy
    • Thanks: Achmed E. Newman, ic1000
    • LOL: bomag
    • Replies: @Gary in Gramercy
    @Almost Missouri

    Thanks for bringing this inconsistency to our attention in your typically trenchant manner.

    Yet in this case I think Miss Glover (assuming she's black; I didn't read the Time article) avoided drinking the entire glass of Kool-Aid. She knows all too well what awaits her children in a majority-black (or, realistically, all-black) school, and has enrolled them in "predominantly white schools" Malcolm The Tenth style, i.e., "by any means necessary." Either she moved to the predominantly white suburbs, or she spends lots of post-tax income on private schools. If every black mother cared as much about her kids' schooling, we would all be much better off as a nation.

    So good for her: but why does poor Stokely get stuck with the black vet? Because Miss Glover drank about half the glass of Kool-Aid: she really has no idea how inferior the academic qualifications of black medical students (and, by extension, veterinary students) are compared to those of their white and Asian classmates.

    Let's hope, for little Stokely's sake, that the black vet who ultimately treats him isn't an angry lesbian who seethes at the very mention of the name of the man who said, "The only position for women in SNCC is prone."

    , @By-tor
    @Almost Missouri

    There are very few, if any, veterinary clinics in black-majority neighborhoods and black-majority small cities that are in the metropolitan statistical reporting burroughs of larger cities. Doing a search of metro Birmingham, AL's veterinarian clinics, one can see where most blacks live due to the absence of veterinary medicine practices: the southwest, west and north.

  55. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it’s considered a fairly bad profession and doesn’t pay that well.

    I guess that depends where you live. In most parts of urban/suburban America a (pet) vet makes nearly as much as a doctor and is just about as respected too.

  56. @Kronos
    @theMann


    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.
     
    This might be the best battlefield to brake the back of wokeness, animal welfare. Micheal Vick got destroyed for animal crudity, perhaps the only sin worse than racism. (That and if blacks ever protested pumpkin spice lattes for racist something.)

    https://youtu.be/cbT-iKgOzEQ

    Replies: @black sea, @Johnny Smoggins

    Most of the pit bulls adopted by millennial urban elves were abused, neglected and cast away by blacks. They treat animals even worse than people.

  57. @Clyde
    @bruce county

    As far as small engine mechanics go I am sure there are many Hispanics in this field. They are decent at this, plus look all the lawn/landscaping services that are Hispanic owned and run with mostly Hispanic workers. They must maintain their equipment and make simple repairs right at the work site. Though at my locale I see many of the workers are Caribbean blacks, I think Haitian? But they are working for "The Hispanic Man".

    Replies: @bomag

    As far as small engine mechanics go I am sure there are many Hispanics in this field.

    I’m rather surprised by the dearth of such.

    They are mechanically adept people, but don’t seem to especially gravitate to full time tinkering.

    Seems to be many more in auto body repair and painting; more artistically focused, I suppose.

  58. @Almost Missouri
    @Redneck farmer

    Kind of agree, but I wouldn't say it's so much "affirmative action for white males" as that most women and non-white vets go into the higher pay lower stress pets-and-horsies type of vet practice rather than the difficult, dirty and occasionally dangerous mass-food-animal-in-a-mechanized-environment type of vet practice, so those latter practices become disproportionately male and white because they are the only vets left who will do them.

    Like farming and ranching (#2 on bruce county's hit list), the work that veterinarians originally came into being to support, this kind of agriculture work sounds fun at a distance, but the reality is difficult, dirty, dangerous and not very well paid. In other words, only gentile whites and Asians will do it. (P.S., whites + (Siberian) Asians converging 500 years ago in the New World = "Hispanics".)

    Replies: @Art Deco

    According to this report here:

    https://www.avma.org/sites/default/files/resources/2017-econ-rpt4-mkt-vet-services.pdf

    About 10% of the employment in veterinary practice is found in farm-only practices (which receive 10% of the revenue). About 8% are horse specialists (and receive 8% of the revenue). About 45% are small animal specialists (receiving 45% of the revenue). About 30% are general practitioners (and receive about 30% of the revenue).

    • Thanks: res
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    1) Being a small animal or GP vet is typically a 9-to-5 job where your clients bring your patients to you at your convenience in your comfy office. Being a large animal vet means you have to spend a lot of additional time driving around to your clients' work sites (and being rural, they are by definition not close together) beyond your normal "business hours". Not that you really have normal business hours. If puppy Stokely is sick at night, the vet's answering service takes a message and Stokely's owner gets a call back in the morning. If AgriCorp's top producing cow is having trouble calving at 3AM, the vet will be expected to answer the call and be there within the hour. In other words, farm vets work more hours in harder conditions for the "same" revenue.

    2) Most small-animal practices are sole practitioners or small partnerships where the vets are the owners and compensation is relatively egalitarian. Farm-only vet practices are more likely to be large corporate-type practices with investors and senior vets who snaffle up a chunk of that revenue before the majority staff vets see it.

    3) Assuming you are referring to Table 1 in your PDF, when encountering a table wherein every single column is precisely and eerily parallel in proportion, one may fairly wonder if the authors had their excel formulas hooked up correctly, or indeed whether they didn't simply have the proportions in mind beforehand and then distributed the results accordingly.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Anonymous

  59. It sounds like the ideal refuge for incompetent blacks. No parrot or hamster ever brought a malpractice suit.

  60. There is show on Animal Planet, The Vet Life, that features a black vet and his animal hospital. Here’s an article about it. https://www.blackenterprise.com/black-veterinarians-on-hit-tv-show-give-100-to-animals-and-people/

  61. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    I always thought for all his faults, at least Hitler was a dog lover. Now they won't even let the poor bastard have that one.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    Hitler became a vegetarian and banned vivisection in Germany because he was an animal lover.

  62. @bruce county
    @black sea

    Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

    I call bullshit.

    How could it have possibly have taken her two months of searching? Was her internet down?
    Was she afraid to ask a white clinic if they knew of one?

    Replies: @bomag, @RebelWriter, @mc23

    She searches like I do.

    It took me two months to find a common pipe fitting at the local Home Depot; meaning I worked around no water in the bathroom sink for two months before I did something about it.

  63. @Billy Shears
    And Tiger Moms aren't gonna let all their hard work go to waste in veterinarian school.

    Replies: @Known Fact, @Twinkie

    Our white female vet had a perky young Asian gal helping fill in one time — the Asian girl ably explained several points the regular vet had never been able to clearly articulate. She also had a retired but still powerfully built white guy fill in one time and he handled our dog much more crisply than the full-time all-female staff (We had a great old-school make vet for 10 years but finally moved too far away)

  64. There was a tv show a couple of months ago about the stresses involved with being a vet. One vet who quit said that the final straw was when her workmate, who at the end of her shift went to her car and injected herself with whatever euthanising drug they use. Her workmates later found her dead in the car park. I think a lot of dentists suffer from depression as well.

  65. @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    According to this report here:

    https://www.avma.org/sites/default/files/resources/2017-econ-rpt4-mkt-vet-services.pdf


    About 10% of the employment in veterinary practice is found in farm-only practices (which receive 10% of the revenue). About 8% are horse specialists (and receive 8% of the revenue). About 45% are small animal specialists (receiving 45% of the revenue). About 30% are general practitioners (and receive about 30% of the revenue).

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    1) Being a small animal or GP vet is typically a 9-to-5 job where your clients bring your patients to you at your convenience in your comfy office. Being a large animal vet means you have to spend a lot of additional time driving around to your clients’ work sites (and being rural, they are by definition not close together) beyond your normal “business hours”. Not that you really have normal business hours. If puppy Stokely is sick at night, the vet’s answering service takes a message and Stokely’s owner gets a call back in the morning. If AgriCorp’s top producing cow is having trouble calving at 3AM, the vet will be expected to answer the call and be there within the hour. In other words, farm vets work more hours in harder conditions for the “same” revenue.

    2) Most small-animal practices are sole practitioners or small partnerships where the vets are the owners and compensation is relatively egalitarian. Farm-only vet practices are more likely to be large corporate-type practices with investors and senior vets who snaffle up a chunk of that revenue before the majority staff vets see it.

    3) Assuming you are referring to Table 1 in your PDF, when encountering a table wherein every single column is precisely and eerily parallel in proportion, one may fairly wonder if the authors had their excel formulas hooked up correctly, or indeed whether they didn’t simply have the proportions in mind beforehand and then distributed the results accordingly.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    Being a small animal or GP vet is typically a 9-to-5 job where your clients bring your patients to you at your convenience in your comfy office.

    They run it that way because there are emergency services vets who are open 24/7. And our vet is open 7 to 7, btw.

    , @Anonymous
    @Almost Missouri

    Oh yes, I have a relative who is a rural vet. He has two cars, both with hundreds of thousands of miles on the clock. I have never seen cars with so much mileage on them.

  66. @Mr. Blank
    Back when I was single, I dated a veterinarian for awhile.

    She said one of the issues they deal with is people who have pets with black fur, who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” She said they see this so, so often. And everybody who does it acts like they’re the first person in history to come up with that joke.

    And you can’t just refuse to treat the animal. It’s not the animal’s fault their owner named them that. They have to get creative sometimes to avoid using the animal’s name, she said.

    Trying to imagine how a black veterinarian would deal with that.

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @MBlanc46, @AndrewR, @riches

    Troll? Dude, I’ve been commenting here forever. And I wasn’t knocking Steve or anything. Just making a simple observation.

  67. @BB753
    It's almost as if Blacks don't realize that they're a (shrinking) minority and that no matter what they do, there are gonna be fewer Blacks at any given job and walk of life. Do the math.

    Replies: @The Alarmist, @Almost Missouri

    Sorry to break it to you, but blacks are not a shrinking minority in the US.

    Blacks are a growing minority.

    https://www.unz.com/anepigone/electoral-democratic-civil-war/#comment-3693558

    Combine open borders with Steve’s Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.

    • Replies: @BB753
    @Almost Missouri

    Well, I meant authentic American Blacks. Not Caribbean or African Blacks.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    , @AnotherDad
    @Almost Missouri


    Combine open borders with Steve’s Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.
     
    Almost--

    I don't want to go book-length, but i think this is less likely than it seems right now.

    The great replacement was basically a Jewish driven strategy to displace white gentiles as a majority, buffed up by the siren call of cheap labor.

    But that's pretty much baked now. In whose interest is it to download millions of African blacks into the US?

    I think while the traditional white coherent, free and prosperous America as coherent nation has been killed by immigration, immigration politics themselves will be changing in the new America. A bunch of reasons:

    -- the progressive whiteness-hostile Jew, while still hugely powerful in America and Democratic party politics is a sharply declining part of the population and future elites; low fertility, inter-marriage. Most Jews being born today are probably Orthodox with other concerns. Having lots of Africans come here not among them.

    -- Latin American fertility is way down, heading toward replacement. Mexico probably has replacement fertility. The poorer Central American countries lag a bit and can send a few millions more, but they are trending down as well. Of course, the people in all these countries may want to come for a better deal, but the big push is done. And do American "Hispanics" want them? After their relatives are here? Do they want a huge influx of blacks? The question answers itself.

    -- Indians might like other Indians to come--well, more of their sorts of Indians. The Chinese might like more Chinese. Do either of them want more blacks?

    -- American blacks have never favored immigration to start with. They naturally favor stuff for them and are on the Jewish minoritarian train ... because that's the minoritarian train and they are a minority. (If you can mau-mau whitey into giving you stuff ... why not!) But do they want America to be flooded with Africans to make it blacker? Uh ... they don't love Africans and the feeling is mutual. And the reality is that makes the nation poorer, and they have to share black shakedown loot with someone else.

    -- The new Jewish-white-Asian elite won't be the old WASPy America. But it won't have the attitudinal issues as the Jewish elite either. It's a different beast.


    It's hard to see any real constituency for sustained mass immigration from Africa into the United States. Once whitey has been dethroned and the new confused order is in place, we're going to see some different political alliances and alignments. And the immigration issue will change as well.

    The bottom line is immigration--which is fundamentally population replacement--is never in the host population's interest. What actually happened in the early history of the United States was recruiting more people from essentially the conquesting population's own people to help finish the conquest. (Not immigration, but conquest.)

    Absent the particularly characteristics of Jewish anti-white immigration enthusiasm and with a more diverse population--none of which find the available African immigration in their interest--it's hard to see how the immigration insanity continues down that road.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

  68. @photondancer
    My vet surgery has 5-6 vets, at least 2 of which are asian, but none are male. Of course, the Melissa Chans of this world don't even notice this lack of diversity let alone deplore the sad plight of men who just want to take their wittily named pet to a male vet (who will _understand_).

    Replies: @slumber_j

    Of course, the Melissa Chans of this world don’t even notice this lack of diversity

    Yeah, there are basically no male small-animal vets under the age of I dunno, 60? And US veterinary schools skew so female, and women skew so small-animal, that there has long been a growing shortage of large-animal vets in general.

    And depending on how you look at these things, large-animal vets are arguably the actually necessary ones. But now we’re into the whole Pets vs. Food tussle, so never mind.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @slumber_j

    Yeah, there are basically no male small-animal vets under the age of I dunno, 60?

    There is one at the regular practice we use and I've seen one of late at the emergency practice we use. I checked again. About 80% of DVM degrees are awarded to women as we speak. This doesn't interest the diversicrats at all.

  69. I used to listen to a lot of stupid prank calls on YouTube. One recurring victim was the Anti-Obama Veterinarian, who included the following message in her voicemail greeting: “If you voted for Obama, I believe you voted against God and country, and would prefer it if you would call someone else.”

    Naturally, trolls called her constantly, professing their undying love for the Magnificent Mulatto.

    [MORE]

  70. Pet Owners Are Diverse, but Veterinarians Are Overwhelmingly White. Black Veterinarians Want to Change That

    I can’t fucking read that. Fucking shit: I can’t even read beyond the headlines anymore on iSteve.

    • Agree: sayless
  71. @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    I look forward to Ms. Chan's upcoming article about how white racism is keeping blacks from being mining machine operators.

    I feel like I could write a parody article referencing John Henry vs. the Steam-Shovel...

    Replies: @photondancer, @Almost Missouri, @RebelWriter, @Buffalo Joe

    David Alan Grier did a bit on the Adam Corolla podcast back in the day about black aversion to working in mines.

    Nowadays the podcast is paywalled and DAG has denounced Adam for insufficient wokeness. Ah, well…

  72. @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    I look forward to Ms. Chan's upcoming article about how white racism is keeping blacks from being mining machine operators.

    I feel like I could write a parody article referencing John Henry vs. the Steam-Shovel...

    Replies: @photondancer, @Almost Missouri, @RebelWriter, @Buffalo Joe

    Do it!

  73. @bruce county
    @black sea

    Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

    I call bullshit.

    How could it have possibly have taken her two months of searching? Was her internet down?
    Was she afraid to ask a white clinic if they knew of one?

    Replies: @bomag, @RebelWriter, @mc23

    Well, it’s not like any black vets have a TV series.

    Oh, wait.

  74. The feel when the only person who sounds sane & to the point is the black guy whose response to “Blacks who are undecided or won’t vote BIDEN are illogical and lazy” Twitter rage has this to say:

    “And also what makes you believe hes gonna change anything he messed up in a past when he spent 8 years in the White House fixing none of it tripped me once shame on you tricked me twice shame on me tricked me 3 times I put a bullet i put a bullet in your ass the American way”

  75. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it’s mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time.

    Not exactly. They portray it as a sinecure that is mostly sitting in front of a computer screen for hours at a time reading The Guardian, goofing off on social media, complaining about the lack of _____ representation at the company, and occasionally tapping out half a dozen lines of code, which may or may not compile, often with the help of a coworker.

    And they’re not entirely wrong, because the companies are very happy to put them in these positions in order to fill the diversity quotas that theoretically do not exist while preventing them from doing any real damage. Unfortunately the tax isn’t just their salary, it’s the productivity of all the other workers who have to route around them and fix the gigantic mess they create after doing idiotic things like replacing all instances of “he” and “him” with “they” and “them” so you now have a bunch of references to “ttheyme” and “sthem”. I’m exaggerating, but only a little.

    You have to understand how Marxists think. When they say they want more female programmers or black vets, they don’t actually want more female programmers or black vets, they want more women and blacks with the title, pay and respect of programmers and vets, without having to do any of the work, because they don’t believe that work is actually a thing that exists. Electricity comes from the socket, food comes from the supermarket, software comes from the internet (which also comes from the socket), and vets make animals better by bringing them into a secret room or perhaps chanting something to break the voodoo curse.

    The point is, they don’t care about the actual work these professions do, because they don’t do any work and don’t even comprehend that there is work to be done. The only important work worth doing is taking other people’s money and social status, AKA correcting systemic injustices.

    • Replies: @photondancer
    @Michael S

    Word. I've only lately come to realise this myself. Being forced to do real work for a while, not just talking, would probably do wonders for knocking some sense into these people.

    , @The Wild Geese Howard
    @Michael S


    because they don’t believe that work is actually a thing that exists. Electricity comes from the socket, food comes from the supermarket, software comes from the internet (which also comes from the socket)
     
    Nailed it.

    Marxist morons also believe that they are going to live in green bliss, charging up their Teslas before cruising down to Starbucks for soy lattes and picking up some Impossible burgers at Trader Joe's, right after they shut down the oil industry and eliminate the last deplorable.
  76. Veterinary medicine is a Western creation and veterinary schools are Western institutions. So instead of gnashing their teeth over it, maybe the POCs should show a little gratitude to Whites and their culture for making this and other fine institutions.

    Historically black colleges are free to set up veterinary schools. But, hey, why go thru the trouble of creating your own institutions and competing with the White ones when you can parasitize the White ones and in that way steel Whitey’s inheritance?

  77. Due to COVID-1984, petowners don’t even go into our vet’s office anymore — a staffer comes out to the parking lot, takes the pet inside, brings it back out and takes your bank card inside.

    Now I can see some benefits of keeping customers at a distance like that for routine tests and shots, but some vets might fimd it all very dreary and impersonal, a job-satisfaction negative. Plus many shelter fundraisers like Strut-Your-Mutt and dogwashes have been canceled or cut back, and I know our vet enjoyed schmoozing at those with current and prospective customers.

  78. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    Where did you get this data?

    According to this site: https://datausa.io/profile/soc/veterinarians

    Vets are 64.9% female. Whites are 85.9% (Asians are 6.18%). Average age 44.5. Average salary $107,870.

    • Replies: @bruce county
    @Twinkie

    Where did you get this data?

    I had some numbers in a hat. That was the one i pulled out.
    We have a winner!!!!

    , @res
    @Twinkie

    This appears to be the source.
    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/2020/05/racism-in-veterinary-medicine/

    I do not see a further source given. Given this statement there I believe they are counting Hispanics as white.


    Over 95% of veterinarians are white in a country where about 80% of the workforce is white.
     
    Your source lists Hispanics as the third most common race for veterinarians which explains some of the discrepancy. Not sure about the rest.

    The disingenuous use (or non use) of the Hispanic category is all too common (as in the original source you were questioning).

    P.S. Here are 2018 labor force statistics for comparison. Note the way they use (or not) the Hispanic category as they see fit. They estimate the workforce as 78% white (which appears to include Hispanics).
    https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/race-and-ethnicity/2018/home.htm

    Replies: @Twinkie

  79. @Billy Shears
    And Tiger Moms aren't gonna let all their hard work go to waste in veterinarian school.

    Replies: @Known Fact, @Twinkie

    And Tiger Moms aren’t gonna let all their hard work go to waste in veterinarian school.

    Asians are slightly overrepresented among vets compared to their general population fraction (East Asians are likely much more overrepresented since they are about half of the total Asian population in the U.S. and probably account for most of the Asian vets – you never run into South Asian vets).

  80. Why so many women vets? Easy.

    What a deal – you wear the prestigious white coat, people call you “doctor” and you don’t ever take real responsibility for human lives.

    Even more importantly, time was, if your cat was sick, and you went to the vet, HE would say “Sorry, your cat is old and dying. That’ll be ten bucks.”

    Nowadays, you take your cat to the vet and SHE says “Based on extensive medical testing, your cat has cancer. That’ll be $1,250 for testing and the treatment is $1,500 per month. You DO love your cat, right?”

    Surefire moneyspinner, lots of prestige and no real responsibility? Sounds like a female dream come true.

    • Agree: 3g4me
    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    @Anon7


    Nowadays, you take your cat to the vet and SHE says “Based on extensive medical testing, your cat has cancer. That’ll be $1,250 for testing and the treatment is $1,500 per month. You DO love your cat, right?”
     
    True dat. I worked with a woman whose cat had cancer. She spent $20k on the cat and it lived a few years longer. I love my dog, but . . .
  81. @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    1) Being a small animal or GP vet is typically a 9-to-5 job where your clients bring your patients to you at your convenience in your comfy office. Being a large animal vet means you have to spend a lot of additional time driving around to your clients' work sites (and being rural, they are by definition not close together) beyond your normal "business hours". Not that you really have normal business hours. If puppy Stokely is sick at night, the vet's answering service takes a message and Stokely's owner gets a call back in the morning. If AgriCorp's top producing cow is having trouble calving at 3AM, the vet will be expected to answer the call and be there within the hour. In other words, farm vets work more hours in harder conditions for the "same" revenue.

    2) Most small-animal practices are sole practitioners or small partnerships where the vets are the owners and compensation is relatively egalitarian. Farm-only vet practices are more likely to be large corporate-type practices with investors and senior vets who snaffle up a chunk of that revenue before the majority staff vets see it.

    3) Assuming you are referring to Table 1 in your PDF, when encountering a table wherein every single column is precisely and eerily parallel in proportion, one may fairly wonder if the authors had their excel formulas hooked up correctly, or indeed whether they didn't simply have the proportions in mind beforehand and then distributed the results accordingly.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Anonymous

    Being a small animal or GP vet is typically a 9-to-5 job where your clients bring your patients to you at your convenience in your comfy office.

    They run it that way because there are emergency services vets who are open 24/7. And our vet is open 7 to 7, btw.

  82. @Twinkie
    @bruce county

    Where did you get this data?

    According to this site: https://datausa.io/profile/soc/veterinarians

    Vets are 64.9% female. Whites are 85.9% (Asians are 6.18%). Average age 44.5. Average salary $107,870.

    Replies: @bruce county, @res

    Where did you get this data?

    I had some numbers in a hat. That was the one i pulled out.
    We have a winner!!!!

    • Troll: Twinkie
  83. @slumber_j
    @photondancer


    Of course, the Melissa Chans of this world don’t even notice this lack of diversity
     
    Yeah, there are basically no male small-animal vets under the age of I dunno, 60? And US veterinary schools skew so female, and women skew so small-animal, that there has long been a growing shortage of large-animal vets in general.

    And depending on how you look at these things, large-animal vets are arguably the actually necessary ones. But now we're into the whole Pets vs. Food tussle, so never mind.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    Yeah, there are basically no male small-animal vets under the age of I dunno, 60?

    There is one at the regular practice we use and I’ve seen one of late at the emergency practice we use. I checked again. About 80% of DVM degrees are awarded to women as we speak. This doesn’t interest the diversicrats at all.

  84. @Redneck farmer
    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.

    Replies: @Anon, @Almost Missouri, @bruce county

    Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.

    There seem to be a lot that like to work on sybians too.🤣

  85. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    Interesting. IOW, the people that know how to do useful things are overwhelmingly white. The worthless chattering classes, do nothing government agencies, etc are filled with POC. This gives white people tremendous power if they’d decide to use it.

    • Agree: SimpleSong, Andy
    • Replies: @Whiskey
    @William Badwhite

    But reality shows the reverse. Chattering beats accomplishments every time.

    , @JMcG
    @William Badwhite

    I’ve read that many labor unions had to purge their commies in the fifties. The IBEW, the Teamsters, the Steamfitters were all targeted by the Soviets with an eye toward crippling the US industrial sector if the time ever came. Even today, it’s frightening what a relative handful of guys could do to some pretty vital infrastructure.

    , @Art Deco
    @William Badwhite

    Per the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 82% of the 'reporters, editors &c' are white. Hispanics of any race make up 9%. About 75% of post-secondary teachers are white; about 15% are Oriental or East Indian; 8% are hispanics of any race.

    Replies: @William Badwhite

  86. @Steve Sailer
    @william munny

    Anglos, in England and America, seem to have led the world in love of animals.

    Maybe it wasn't always so. "King Lear" is striking in how dogs are held in contempt:

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/dogs-and-their-people/201504/william-shakespeare-hated-dogs

    https://www.drmetablog.com/2006/11/shakespeare_and.html

    I don't know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.

    Replies: @OFWHAP, @Faraday's Bobcat, @LBD

    This just proves that William Shakespeare was actually a Black Womyn after all!

  87. IINM many veterinarians practicing in the US studied at schools in the Caribbean. Looking only at the gender skew in US schools isn’t giving the full picture.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    @prosa123


    IINM many veterinarians practicing in the US studied at schools in the Caribbean.
     
    One of my daughter's friends was hot to be a vet but could not get into a US school, so she spent $250k to go to a school in the Caribbean. She trained to be a large animal vet but couldn't make enough money even in the Virginia horse country to pay off her loans, so now she gives shots to Fluffy and Rocco.
  88. @William Badwhite
    @bruce county

    Interesting. IOW, the people that know how to do useful things are overwhelmingly white. The worthless chattering classes, do nothing government agencies, etc are filled with POC. This gives white people tremendous power if they'd decide to use it.

    Replies: @Whiskey, @JMcG, @Art Deco

    But reality shows the reverse. Chattering beats accomplishments every time.

  89. @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    70% of black veterinarians are trained at Tuskegee, which was founded by Booker T. Washington to give blacks practical skills.

    Replies: @Elmer T. Jones, @JMcG

    And syphilis.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    @JMcG

    This piece by Jared Taylor corrects a lot of the myths about the syphilis "guinea pigs".

  90. @William Badwhite
    @bruce county

    Interesting. IOW, the people that know how to do useful things are overwhelmingly white. The worthless chattering classes, do nothing government agencies, etc are filled with POC. This gives white people tremendous power if they'd decide to use it.

    Replies: @Whiskey, @JMcG, @Art Deco

    I’ve read that many labor unions had to purge their commies in the fifties. The IBEW, the Teamsters, the Steamfitters were all targeted by the Soviets with an eye toward crippling the US industrial sector if the time ever came. Even today, it’s frightening what a relative handful of guys could do to some pretty vital infrastructure.

  91. @William Badwhite
    @bruce county

    Interesting. IOW, the people that know how to do useful things are overwhelmingly white. The worthless chattering classes, do nothing government agencies, etc are filled with POC. This gives white people tremendous power if they'd decide to use it.

    Replies: @Whiskey, @JMcG, @Art Deco

    Per the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 82% of the ‘reporters, editors &c’ are white. Hispanics of any race make up 9%. About 75% of post-secondary teachers are white; about 15% are Oriental or East Indian; 8% are hispanics of any race.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
    @Art Deco


    Per the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 82% of the ‘reporters, editors &c’ are white
     
    The main point - the people that know how to do useful stuff such as be millwrights or fly airplanes are overwhelmingly white - stands.

    Your comment takes care of the worthless chattering classes. Now lets see a similar breakdown for deadweight affirmative action roles as well as government chairwarmers at places like the DMV or TSA checkpoints.

  92. @bruce county
    @black sea

    Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian . . . she finally received a suggestion from a college classmate, but the clinic was too far away. …

    I call bullshit.

    How could it have possibly have taken her two months of searching? Was her internet down?
    Was she afraid to ask a white clinic if they knew of one?

    Replies: @bomag, @RebelWriter, @mc23

    If anyone spent two months searching for any available white veterinarian they would be called
    1. A terrible racist bigot
    2. Someone who can’t find their backside with 2 hands

    • Agree: bruce county, NickG
  93. @Twinkie
    @bruce county

    Where did you get this data?

    According to this site: https://datausa.io/profile/soc/veterinarians

    Vets are 64.9% female. Whites are 85.9% (Asians are 6.18%). Average age 44.5. Average salary $107,870.

    Replies: @bruce county, @res

    This appears to be the source.
    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/2020/05/racism-in-veterinary-medicine/

    I do not see a further source given. Given this statement there I believe they are counting Hispanics as white.

    Over 95% of veterinarians are white in a country where about 80% of the workforce is white.

    Your source lists Hispanics as the third most common race for veterinarians which explains some of the discrepancy. Not sure about the rest.

    The disingenuous use (or non use) of the Hispanic category is all too common (as in the original source you were questioning).

    P.S. Here are 2018 labor force statistics for comparison. Note the way they use (or not) the Hispanic category as they see fit. They estimate the workforce as 78% white (which appears to include Hispanics).
    https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/race-and-ethnicity/2018/home.htm

    • Replies: @Twinkie
    @res


    The disingenuous use (or non use) of the Hispanic category is all too common (as in the original source you were questioning).
     
    Those numbers didn’t pass the smell test.
  94. this is basically the reverse of an HBD awakening. the Critical Race Theory awakening that our enemy is foisting on the general public.

    the enemy is smart. i didn’t completely anticipate this move. introducing the normal people to HBD from the enemies’ reversed perspective – europeans do everything of value, but that’s bad, not good, so let’s get rid of them.

    i think it matters a lot who the first person is to introduce you to a new major concept and how they can shape your perspective on it.

    Cultural Marxism is a little different and more simple- that’s mainly about promoting all the non-europeans at the expense of the europeans. CRT is more advanced and dangerous. it suggest a framework for how the world works, and why european domination of human accomplishment is a huge negative to be rectified.

    both are attempts to form the Krazy Koaltion, but CM is a more basic, loop and repeat strategy, whereas CRT gets vulnerable europeans on your side and gets them to hate themselves too, and gives all of the Koalition members a bigger, longer term, more concrete goal – total elimination of europeans.

  95. @Steve Sailer
    @Rob

    My date for the prom in 1975 had to get a 4.0 GPA in HS to get into the UC Davis pre-vet program and then she had to get a 4.0 GPA in college to get into the UC Davis vet school. It all seemed rather exhausting to contemplate.

    Replies: @Anon

    “My date for the prom…”

    Poignant. (No sarcasm.) As the saying goes, “High school is never over.”
    I speak as someone who didn’t marry his high-school sweetheart. I never spoke to my high-school sweetheart.

    • Replies: @NickG
    @Anon

    A feint heart never won a woman.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob

  96. @Art Deco
    Generally blacks make up about 4-8% of those in professional positions where occupational licensing examinations or certification examinations are required or common. The one odd exception is veterinary medicine, where blacks are so unusual the Bureau of Labor Statistics cannot through its usual methods produce an accurate count. This is what occupational choice looks like. (As we speak, north of 70% of the DVM diplomas issued each year go to women, a 'disparity' that doesn't bother anyone).

    Replies: @res

    Here is a link to their statistics.
    https://www.bls.gov/cps/cpsaat11.htm

    For veterinarians they show 104,000 total with 68.3% women and 89.8% white, 0.0% black, 6.1% Asian, and 1.6% Hispanic (so looks like I was wrong about Hispanics mattering much here).

    Mean annual wage of $104,820 and more at
    https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes291131.htm

    It is interesting to contrast that with “Veterinary assistants and laboratory animal caretakers” at 82.7% women. and 97.2% white, 2.1% black, 0.4% Asian, and 3.7% Hispanic.

    Mean annual wage of $29,690 and more at
    https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes319096.htm

  97. @Cortes
    @Anonymous

    “The vast majority of people would hate programming.”

    Recently I was told of a young guy who’d successfully applied for re-admission as a firefighter after spending less than six months as a train driver. In returning to firefighting his take-home pay is less than half of what he earned as a train driver. Moreover, he forfeited a couple of years seniority by making the short term move to the higher paying job and was fortunate to have a sponsor for readmission who recognised his outstanding merit. He’d had to go through a suite of psychological suitability tests to become a train driver, but the sheer monotony of the job was too much for him.

    “Be careful what you wish for” is cruel because it’s true in many cases.

    Replies: @Mark in BC, @Dratmes

    Interesting.

    We’ve lived about a quarter mile from a railroad line for about 30 years. Once, when my parents were visiting from Florida, my Mom made the comment that the train horn sounded intriguing in the night.

    That got me to thinking how we only hear it for a minute or two but, those guys on the train are blowing that thing every minute or two…all the time, mile after mile, hour after hour.

    I don’t know how they do it. Noise cancelling headphones?

    • Replies: @Muggles
    @Mark in BC


    That got me to thinking how we only hear it for a minute or two but, those guys on the train are blowing that thing every minute or two…all the time, mile after mile, hour after hour.

    I don’t know how they do it. Noise cancelling headphones?
     
    I don't know what the medical/psychological term is for this, but when you repeatedly hear a loud noise or sound, over time you start to un-hear it.

    Your ear still receives the sound waves but your brain does some kind of editing that keeps it from denoting it as something you actually "hear."

    Years back our second story bedroom faced a railroad track that was about three miles distant. At first we heard every train horn, several times at night. After a few months we never noticed it at all.

    Of course if the regular noise is too loud, your hearing will diminish. These days train workers may well wear hearing protection.

    [This concludes your iSteve commenting mansplaining moment.]
    , @YetAnotherAnon
    @Mark in BC

    "my Mom made the comment that the train horn sounded intriguing in the night"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC39wENWA34

  98. @Steve Sailer
    @william munny

    Anglos, in England and America, seem to have led the world in love of animals.

    Maybe it wasn't always so. "King Lear" is striking in how dogs are held in contempt:

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/dogs-and-their-people/201504/william-shakespeare-hated-dogs

    https://www.drmetablog.com/2006/11/shakespeare_and.html

    I don't know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.

    Replies: @OFWHAP, @Faraday's Bobcat, @LBD

    I don’t know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.

    Probably not; they had a lot of dogfighting in Elizabethan England. Today dogfighting would get you hanged if they still had hanging.

  99. @Altai
    Got my newsletter from Nature yesterday. What was the top article?

    How LGBT+ scientists would like to be included and welcomed in STEM workplaces
    Steps that peers and institutions can take to make laboratories, conferences and lecture halls safe and inclusive spaces.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02949-3

    Because those STEM academics and commercial labs are just hotbeds of homophobia, not the exact opposite.

    ‘Invisible’: that is how many scientists from sexual and gender minorities (LGBT+) describe their status at their institution, laboratory, classroom or office. Sexual orientation and sexual and gender identity are not common topics of conversation in many science, technology, engineering and mathematics (STEM) workplaces, and these scientists argue that they should be. They say that cloaking an important part of their identity at work can have dangerous consequences for mental health and career advancement, both for individual scientists and for the disciplines that could drive them away.

    Surveys back up this sense of invisibility. Beliefs that being cisgender and hetero-sexual are the default or ‘normal’ modes — known as cis-heteronormative assumptions — often silence conversations about the wide spectrum of sexual and gender identities1. In a 2019 survey of more than 1,000 UK-based physical scientists, nearly 30% of LGBT+ scientists and half of transgender scientists said that they had considered leaving their workplace because of an unfriendly or hostile climate or because of discrimination2. And nearly 20% of LGBT+ chemists and 32% of transgender and non-binary scientists across all disciplines had experienced exclusionary, offensive or harassing behaviour at work in the previous year. About half of the respondents agree that there is an overall lack of awareness of LGBT+ issues in the workplace. And a 2016 study found that LGBT+ undergraduate students are 7% less likely to be retained in STEM fields than are their non-LGBT+ counterparts3.
     

    So which is it? Is sexual orientation seldom mentioned or is it a constant vector for harassment for huge numbers of LGBT scientists? Or, more likely, activists would like to make it an 'issue' with lots of discussion to create lots of 'support' (Read: Artificially better career prospects and ringfenched funding for LGBTs) because actually there isn't a problem and there won't be resistance.

    We can say much the same for teaching and veterinarian professions. It's not that they're 'too white' but 'too young white woman who will do what we say' that got them in trouble.

    Left unexamined is why white people are so disproportionate in a profession with low pay and which seems to be purely about altruism. Where are all the Asians? Why don't we have a problem getting natives to do these jobs? Could it be that Vets don't have as good a union that keeps the numbers of new vets graduated artificially low? Where are all the native born Asians?

    Replies: @Mark in BC

    A couple things about the article you quote. First, it give percentages of LGBTQRS+ workers that “feel” a certain way. It doesn’t say what percentage of the FIELD is LGBTQRS+. Second, STEM fields deal with the real world. Just because you think something doesn’t mean it will work. I can see a molecular biologist declaring the material he’s working with to be something that it’s not because he “feels” that the material is “identifying” as such on a given day. They’d be sent to the looney bin.

    • Agree: Dissident
  100. @Almost Missouri
    @EdwardM

    Runner up:


    This spring, Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian in Birmingham, Ala., to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely ... and to serve as a role model for her two children, who attend predominantly white schools.
     
    Wait wut? She can't find a majority black school for her children near Birmingham Alabama?!? Because a ¡Black! school would definitely be full of ¡Black! role models for her little darlings. We know this because TV keeps showing it.

    Weird how that works ... avoids blacks schools yet seeks black vet. What could explain it?

    Also, why no mention of a black father serving as a role model for her two children? What could explain that one?

    Kimberly Glover, another mind wasted by drinking too much liberal koolaid.

    Replies: @Gary in Gramercy, @By-tor

    Thanks for bringing this inconsistency to our attention in your typically trenchant manner.

    Yet in this case I think Miss Glover (assuming she’s black; I didn’t read the Time article) avoided drinking the entire glass of Kool-Aid. She knows all too well what awaits her children in a majority-black (or, realistically, all-black) school, and has enrolled them in “predominantly white schools” Malcolm The Tenth style, i.e., “by any means necessary.” Either she moved to the predominantly white suburbs, or she spends lots of post-tax income on private schools. If every black mother cared as much about her kids’ schooling, we would all be much better off as a nation.

    So good for her: but why does poor Stokely get stuck with the black vet? Because Miss Glover drank about half the glass of Kool-Aid: she really has no idea how inferior the academic qualifications of black medical students (and, by extension, veterinary students) are compared to those of their white and Asian classmates.

    Let’s hope, for little Stokely’s sake, that the black vet who ultimately treats him isn’t an angry lesbian who seethes at the very mention of the name of the man who said, “The only position for women in SNCC is prone.”

  101. If every black mother cared as much about her kids’ schooling, we would all be much better off as a nation.

    Then wouldn’t that fill white schools with too many blacks. Again!!!

  102. @YetAnotherAnon
    @Steve Sailer

    A new series of All Creatures Great and Small is getting big TV audiences at present, they've so far managed not to retcon/shoehorn any diversity into it. It'll be on PBS I think.

    It's Channel Five's most popular program ever.

    These two things may be connected.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Creatures_Great_and_Small_(2020_TV_series)

    https://images.immediate.co.uk/production/volatile/sites/3/2020/07/All-Creatures-Great-and-Small-2020-ae9cd4c.jpg

    Replies: @Rob McX

    …they’ve so far managed not to retcon/shoehorn any diversity into it.

    That is astonishing. The whole point of remaking classics these days is to inflict non-whites on the viewers in their living rooms, even if they manage to avoid diversity in real life. Maybe it dawned on the producers that diversifying this 1930s agricultural milieu might not be a good business decision.

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    @Rob McX

    "The whole point of remaking classics these days is to inflict non-whites on the viewers in their living rooms, even if they manage to avoid diversity in real life."

    The producer of Midsomer Murders was sacked after saying


    "We just don't have ethnic minorities involved. Because it wouldn't be the English village with them. It just wouldn't work.

    Suddenly we might be in Slough. Ironically, Causton (one of the main centres of population in the show) is supposed to be Slough. And if you went into Slough you wouldn't see a white face there.

    We're the last bastion of Englishness and I want to keep it that way."
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midsomer_Murders#Controversy
  103. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    I suppose being a veterinarian for farm animals is less depressing. Probably a lot less euthanizing animals – if that has to be done I would assume the farmers usually shoot the animals – and in any event they’re livestock, not pets, and in most cases would end up in slaughterhouses at some point.

  104. @JMcG
    @Steve Sailer

    And syphilis.

    Replies: @Rob McX

    This piece by Jared Taylor corrects a lot of the myths about the syphilis “guinea pigs”.

    • Thanks: Almost Missouri
  105. @Almost Missouri
    @EdwardM

    Runner up:


    This spring, Kimberley Glover spent nearly two months searching for a Black veterinarian in Birmingham, Ala., to care for her 2-year-old puppy Stokely ... and to serve as a role model for her two children, who attend predominantly white schools.
     
    Wait wut? She can't find a majority black school for her children near Birmingham Alabama?!? Because a ¡Black! school would definitely be full of ¡Black! role models for her little darlings. We know this because TV keeps showing it.

    Weird how that works ... avoids blacks schools yet seeks black vet. What could explain it?

    Also, why no mention of a black father serving as a role model for her two children? What could explain that one?

    Kimberly Glover, another mind wasted by drinking too much liberal koolaid.

    Replies: @Gary in Gramercy, @By-tor

    There are very few, if any, veterinary clinics in black-majority neighborhoods and black-majority small cities that are in the metropolitan statistical reporting burroughs of larger cities. Doing a search of metro Birmingham, AL’s veterinarian clinics, one can see where most blacks live due to the absence of veterinary medicine practices: the southwest, west and north.

  106. @PennTothal
    @Guy De Champlagne


    vets don’t even (make) much money or enjoy much status
     
    The job of a veterinary surgeon is much more lucrative and less stressful than that of a human surgeon.

    All services are rendered on a simple cash payment (usually upfront). No having to fight an insurance company and their auditors to get payed.

    There are fewer regulators second-guessing the veterinary surgeon's judgement.

    And if the patient does poorly from the operation, then they are simply euthanized (at which time another cash payment is often collected.)

    Replies: @notsaying

    I don’t know about that. It might be true in the richer neighborhoods.

    I remember reading a big article a number of years ago about vets. I think it was in the New York Times. Their biggest challenge is that while there’s a big demand for their services, a lot of people with pets have no money to pay the vet. The entry level salaries aren’t good and they typically have a lot of student loans to pay.

    The love of animals keeps people going into the field.

    This article made me aware of the big problem with pet owners not being able to afford the vet. It makes me wonder why when you hear about animal adoption nobody ever mentions the cost of animals and evaluating whether people can afford a pet before getting one. Of the 65% or so of whites and Hispanic families that have pets, a significant number don’t have money for any kind of vet problem or even grooming. That would be especially true of the Hispanics.

    I am sad to realize how many people who can barely afford rent and bills have pets. That translates into a lot of abandoned and medically neglected animals.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @notsaying

    You can get financing to buy a pet. Interest rates are in 3 figures.

    Replies: @Adam Smith

    , @Art Deco
    @notsaying

    This article made me aware of the big problem with pet owners not being able to afford the vet. I

    No, it made you aware of the line the reporter wanted to push. If there isn't much of a problem, he and his assignment editor would have to run an observational piece that wasn't some sort of alarm or some sort of indictment of the world in which they live. The Sulzberger minions do not do that.


    The entry level salaries aren’t good

    Annual cash compensation for veterinarians earning at the 10th percentile of the profession is currently about $58,000 per year. That for high school teaches at the 10th percentile is $40,000; for chemists, $44,000; for optometrists, $59,000; architects, $49,000; civil engineers, $55,000. You'll do better as a dentist ($80,000) or a pharmacist ($88,000).

  107. @Mark in BC
    @Cortes

    Interesting.

    We've lived about a quarter mile from a railroad line for about 30 years. Once, when my parents were visiting from Florida, my Mom made the comment that the train horn sounded intriguing in the night.

    That got me to thinking how we only hear it for a minute or two but, those guys on the train are blowing that thing every minute or two...all the time, mile after mile, hour after hour.

    I don't know how they do it. Noise cancelling headphones?

    Replies: @Muggles, @YetAnotherAnon

    That got me to thinking how we only hear it for a minute or two but, those guys on the train are blowing that thing every minute or two…all the time, mile after mile, hour after hour.

    I don’t know how they do it. Noise cancelling headphones?

    I don’t know what the medical/psychological term is for this, but when you repeatedly hear a loud noise or sound, over time you start to un-hear it.

    Your ear still receives the sound waves but your brain does some kind of editing that keeps it from denoting it as something you actually “hear.”

    Years back our second story bedroom faced a railroad track that was about three miles distant. At first we heard every train horn, several times at night. After a few months we never noticed it at all.

    Of course if the regular noise is too loud, your hearing will diminish. These days train workers may well wear hearing protection.

    [This concludes your iSteve commenting mansplaining moment.]

  108. In Texas the main vet school is at Texas A&M.

    Reportedly harder to gain admission to that than to med school.

    Some time ago I read that they were gaming the admissions to produce more farm and ranch vets (mainly men, of course, but not all) since too many vets just wanted to do the house pets.

    Country vets do put down animals, and a lot of other ugly messy work. It takes a lot of strength and stamina to wrangle even small livestock that are in pain or need to be examined while suffering or injured. Plus attend to births of valuable stock, inseminations, etc. And they live out in the rural areas away from large city amenities.

    So few women want to do that. Many simply can’t do the physical part. Cows aren’t cuddly.

    Also, I wonder how many Muslims do small animal vet work? Supposedly they dislike dogs (because Mohammad did) so I would think few would want to work with them. That may be mainly an Arab Muslim thing but it is part of the Prophet’s teachings (dogs being “unclean”).

    But if you have a sick camel, your Muslim vet is the go-to person. For that you want Middle Eastern, not Asian Muslims.

  109. @Rob McX
    @YetAnotherAnon


    ...they’ve so far managed not to retcon/shoehorn any diversity into it.
     
    That is astonishing. The whole point of remaking classics these days is to inflict non-whites on the viewers in their living rooms, even if they manage to avoid diversity in real life. Maybe it dawned on the producers that diversifying this 1930s agricultural milieu might not be a good business decision.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

    “The whole point of remaking classics these days is to inflict non-whites on the viewers in their living rooms, even if they manage to avoid diversity in real life.”

    The producer of Midsomer Murders was sacked after saying

    “We just don’t have ethnic minorities involved. Because it wouldn’t be the English village with them. It just wouldn’t work.

    Suddenly we might be in Slough. Ironically, Causton (one of the main centres of population in the show) is supposed to be Slough. And if you went into Slough you wouldn’t see a white face there.

    We’re the last bastion of Englishness and I want to keep it that way.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midsomer_Murders#Controversy

  110. @Mark in BC
    @Cortes

    Interesting.

    We've lived about a quarter mile from a railroad line for about 30 years. Once, when my parents were visiting from Florida, my Mom made the comment that the train horn sounded intriguing in the night.

    That got me to thinking how we only hear it for a minute or two but, those guys on the train are blowing that thing every minute or two...all the time, mile after mile, hour after hour.

    I don't know how they do it. Noise cancelling headphones?

    Replies: @Muggles, @YetAnotherAnon

    “my Mom made the comment that the train horn sounded intriguing in the night”

  111. @Art Deco
    @William Badwhite

    Per the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 82% of the 'reporters, editors &c' are white. Hispanics of any race make up 9%. About 75% of post-secondary teachers are white; about 15% are Oriental or East Indian; 8% are hispanics of any race.

    Replies: @William Badwhite

    Per the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 82% of the ‘reporters, editors &c’ are white

    The main point – the people that know how to do useful stuff such as be millwrights or fly airplanes are overwhelmingly white – stands.

    Your comment takes care of the worthless chattering classes. Now lets see a similar breakdown for deadweight affirmative action roles as well as government chairwarmers at places like the DMV or TSA checkpoints.

  112. Nearly 65% of white households have pets, 61% of Hispanic households have pets, and almost 37% of Black households have pets

    A pet ownership gap crisis too!? Hopefully they will tackle this issue as well.

  113. @res
    @Twinkie

    This appears to be the source.
    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/2020/05/racism-in-veterinary-medicine/

    I do not see a further source given. Given this statement there I believe they are counting Hispanics as white.


    Over 95% of veterinarians are white in a country where about 80% of the workforce is white.
     
    Your source lists Hispanics as the third most common race for veterinarians which explains some of the discrepancy. Not sure about the rest.

    The disingenuous use (or non use) of the Hispanic category is all too common (as in the original source you were questioning).

    P.S. Here are 2018 labor force statistics for comparison. Note the way they use (or not) the Hispanic category as they see fit. They estimate the workforce as 78% white (which appears to include Hispanics).
    https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/race-and-ethnicity/2018/home.htm

    Replies: @Twinkie

    The disingenuous use (or non use) of the Hispanic category is all too common (as in the original source you were questioning).

    Those numbers didn’t pass the smell test.

  114. @Steve Sailer
    @bruce county

    I look forward to Ms. Chan's upcoming article about how white racism is keeping blacks from being mining machine operators.

    I feel like I could write a parody article referencing John Henry vs. the Steam-Shovel...

    Replies: @photondancer, @Almost Missouri, @RebelWriter, @Buffalo Joe

    Steve, 24 years as a union ironworker and just one black co worker. Ironworkers are not really considered skilled tradesmen but the pay was about the same. People in the black community have little knowlege about careers, although there are training programs galore in every mid and major city.Blame that on public education.

  115. This could be the straw that breaks the camel’s back. Imagine all the White females who think blacks are Gods gift to humankind suddenly view black veterinarians as the worst ever when they can’t save little Fluffy from whatever.

  116. @Anon
    @Redneck farmer


    One area where there is affirmative action for white males is food animal veterinarians. Too many women want to just work on horsies and kitties.
     
    If you're a bird owner you quickly discover that there are weirdly few avian vets considering the number of people with pet birds. The reason for this?: Most avian vets work in the poultry industry.

    A dog and cat vet can work on gerbils, but it's striking how many such vets do not so much as know how to safely hold a delicate bird, and forget about their staff.

    Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @bomag, @Buffalo Joe

    FourTwoSix, hard to believe, but I have two female neighbors who are pet bird vets. One owns a clinic on our main street, Route 5, with the signage reading, “Clinic for Avian and Exotic Pets.” The other’s vanity license plate reads “Bird Vet.”

  117. Diversity, diversity, diversity! Like a magic spell, it improves everything just by the fact of a veterinarian’s skin color. Just like racism, only somehow the opposite.

    • Thanks: sayless
  118. @Cortes
    @Anonymous

    “The vast majority of people would hate programming.”

    Recently I was told of a young guy who’d successfully applied for re-admission as a firefighter after spending less than six months as a train driver. In returning to firefighting his take-home pay is less than half of what he earned as a train driver. Moreover, he forfeited a couple of years seniority by making the short term move to the higher paying job and was fortunate to have a sponsor for readmission who recognised his outstanding merit. He’d had to go through a suite of psychological suitability tests to become a train driver, but the sheer monotony of the job was too much for him.

    “Be careful what you wish for” is cruel because it’s true in many cases.

    Replies: @Mark in BC, @Dratmes

    Railroading is an ideal job for men who don’t miss their families, if they have them. You are on call most of your life, you work long hours and when you get off the train, you’re put up in a cheap motel 300 miles from home to await a return trip. The job conditions tend to select poorly socialized men, as long as they do not break the rules printed in the book.

    There was no psychological test in my day, and I doubt its usefulness. It’s not a job for normies.

  119. One thing about vets is their patients can’t describe their symptoms. When I noticed our cat was lethargic and there was no stool in his litter box I knew he had a problem. Our vet x-rayed him and showed me the x-rays. The cat was constipated. An enema and a laxative to take home and a recommendation for different cat food. A dishonest vet could have told me the cat had a ‘blockage’ and needed surgery. When he put my other cat down, years ago, he said…”We don’t do kidney transpalnts or dialysis and your cat is suffering.” Getting back to Ms Glover, who waits two months to get their pet treated?

    • Agree: By-tor
  120. @Almost Missouri
    @BB753

    Sorry to break it to you, but blacks are not a shrinking minority in the US.

    Blacks are a growing minority.

    https://www.unz.com/anepigone/electoral-democratic-civil-war/#comment-3693558

    Combine open borders with Steve's Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.

    Replies: @BB753, @AnotherDad

    Well, I meant authentic American Blacks. Not Caribbean or African Blacks.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    @BB753

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s (the inception of the welfare state), four or five decades before Carib and African immigration started kicking in.

    And note that the descendants of immigrant blacks will consider themselves "authentic American Blacks" and assimilate to "authentic American black" cultural norms.

    So no matter how you slice it, the US future's looking dark.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @BB753

  121. I would wager if 1000 black high school sophomores were asked if they were interested in Vet School you might get 4. Then tell them you need a 4.0 average and it would be zero. Just like differential calculus filters out those wanting an engineering degree, the 4.0 is a filtering process.

  122. This is all vaguely but very morbidly amusing.

    I am vehemently and unapologetically racist with respect to blacks. I mean, let’s not even get into it.

    One of the few actual blacks (as opposed to opportunistic quadroons) I have dealt with who has my respect is a certain black veterinarian in the San Francisco Bay Area.

    The thing is, once upon a time I could say, ‘she didn’t get her job because she’s black — and ‘hey, she’s pretty good.’

    No more. Now we can make certain reasonable assumptions.

  123. Anonymous[344] • Disclaimer says:

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.

    Exactly, and this is probably in large part an indirect result of one of the late 20th-century progressive movement’s greatest (and least harmful) victories: encouraging many more girls to study biochemistry and biology in the hopes of becoming physicians than could ever get into med school. This led to loads of people with life sciences degrees but not smart and/or diligent enough to compete with tiger cubs for the coveted med school spots.

    What else are they to do? There are the Caribbean med schools, but I get the impression that’s mostly an Indian immigrant kid thing. Over the years I’ve seen posters for those plastered across various universities and the model in the white jacket holding the clipboard is always a pretty Indian lady.

  124. @BB753
    @Almost Missouri

    Well, I meant authentic American Blacks. Not Caribbean or African Blacks.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s (the inception of the welfare state), four or five decades before Carib and African immigration started kicking in.

    And note that the descendants of immigrant blacks will consider themselves “authentic American Blacks” and assimilate to “authentic American black” cultural norms.

    So no matter how you slice it, the US future’s looking dark.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s

    It's bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century. Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.

    Replies: @Prester John, @Almost Missouri

    , @BB753
    @Almost Missouri

    They might grow but not as fast as Latinos and "others", so they could remain 15 % of the population. That doesn't mean that Whites will be soon less than 50 % of the population. But "Latin" , East Asians, South Asians, Middle Easterners of every brand and hue, etc will ensure Blacks remain a minority foreverer, unless the UN forces the USA to welcome 20 million African "refugees" or more.
    BTW, that's how I believe our elites want to solve the problem posed by the World's Most Important Graph© (Copyright Steve Sailer): resettle Africans by the millions in the West. For instance: United Nations to Italy or Poland: "please welcome 5 million Africans within your borders during the next 10 years or else (FMI intervention or NATO bombing campaign, you choose)" , and so on with every client state of the USA, and eventually, America itself. President Kamasutra Harris will say one day: we need 50 millions Africans in the USA ASAP or the GDP will plummet!" Basically, this is happening right now but in slow motion.

  125. @Mr. Blank
    Back when I was single, I dated a veterinarian for awhile.

    She said one of the issues they deal with is people who have pets with black fur, who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” She said they see this so, so often. And everybody who does it acts like they’re the first person in history to come up with that joke.

    And you can’t just refuse to treat the animal. It’s not the animal’s fault their owner named them that. They have to get creative sometimes to avoid using the animal’s name, she said.

    Trying to imagine how a black veterinarian would deal with that.

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @MBlanc46, @AndrewR, @riches

    When I was a teenager we had a black cat that I named Rastus. These days, I doubt that anyone would get it.

  126. @theMann
    "A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough."



    And a whole lot of cute, cuddly little critters like White girls.


    Blacks, not so much.


    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Ozymandias

    I would pay money to see anybody take one of my cats to a Black Vet.

    Reminds me of Pinky. “He’s a very loving cat.”

  127. @notsaying
    @PennTothal

    I don't know about that. It might be true in the richer neighborhoods.

    I remember reading a big article a number of years ago about vets. I think it was in the New York Times. Their biggest challenge is that while there's a big demand for their services, a lot of people with pets have no money to pay the vet. The entry level salaries aren't good and they typically have a lot of student loans to pay.

    The love of animals keeps people going into the field.

    This article made me aware of the big problem with pet owners not being able to afford the vet. It makes me wonder why when you hear about animal adoption nobody ever mentions the cost of animals and evaluating whether people can afford a pet before getting one. Of the 65% or so of whites and Hispanic families that have pets, a significant number don't have money for any kind of vet problem or even grooming. That would be especially true of the Hispanics.

    I am sad to realize how many people who can barely afford rent and bills have pets. That translates into a lot of abandoned and medically neglected animals.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Art Deco

    You can get financing to buy a pet. Interest rates are in 3 figures.

    • Replies: @Adam Smith
    @Steve Sailer

    https://i0.wp.com/boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/money_problems21.jpg

    https://static.wixstatic.com/media/5897e0_c3fad46029dc4069befb17c3e7cf3aae~mv2_d_2886_2206_s_2.jpg/v1/fill/w_980,h_750,al_c,q_90/5897e0_c3fad46029dc4069befb17c3e7cf3aae~mv2_d_2886_2206_s_2.jpg

  128. @Michael S
    @Anonymous


    They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it’s mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time.
     
    Not exactly. They portray it as a sinecure that is mostly sitting in front of a computer screen for hours at a time reading The Guardian, goofing off on social media, complaining about the lack of _____ representation at the company, and occasionally tapping out half a dozen lines of code, which may or may not compile, often with the help of a coworker.

    And they're not entirely wrong, because the companies are very happy to put them in these positions in order to fill the diversity quotas that theoretically do not exist while preventing them from doing any real damage. Unfortunately the tax isn't just their salary, it's the productivity of all the other workers who have to route around them and fix the gigantic mess they create after doing idiotic things like replacing all instances of "he" and "him" with "they" and "them" so you now have a bunch of references to "ttheyme" and "sthem". I'm exaggerating, but only a little.

    You have to understand how Marxists think. When they say they want more female programmers or black vets, they don't actually want more female programmers or black vets, they want more women and blacks with the title, pay and respect of programmers and vets, without having to do any of the work, because they don't believe that work is actually a thing that exists. Electricity comes from the socket, food comes from the supermarket, software comes from the internet (which also comes from the socket), and vets make animals better by bringing them into a secret room or perhaps chanting something to break the voodoo curse.

    The point is, they don't care about the actual work these professions do, because they don't do any work and don't even comprehend that there is work to be done. The only important work worth doing is taking other people's money and social status, AKA correcting systemic injustices.

    Replies: @photondancer, @The Wild Geese Howard

    Word. I’ve only lately come to realise this myself. Being forced to do real work for a while, not just talking, would probably do wonders for knocking some sense into these people.

  129. @Almost Missouri
    @BB753

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s (the inception of the welfare state), four or five decades before Carib and African immigration started kicking in.

    And note that the descendants of immigrant blacks will consider themselves "authentic American Blacks" and assimilate to "authentic American black" cultural norms.

    So no matter how you slice it, the US future's looking dark.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @BB753

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s

    It’s bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century. Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.

    • Replies: @Prester John
    @Art Deco

    For every two that emerge the womb, one will eventually be returned to the womb of Mother Earth as a result of being on the receiving end of a bullet.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    , @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    The black portion of the US population was above 20% at US independence. From there it steadily declined to below 10% by 1930. Then it suddenly reversed course and began it's relentless increase which continues today as it passes 13%.

    To look only at the bottom point of that giant V-shape and say, "It’s bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century" is at best misleading, and might be more accurately described as willful blindness.


    Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.
     
    They're more fecund than everyone but recent Hispanics at this point.

    And as I repeatedly have to remind the TFR-spergs, when your generation length includes 15-year-old mothers and 30-year-old grandmothers, TFR doesn't capture the population growth advantage that rapid generations confer.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  130. @notsaying
    @PennTothal

    I don't know about that. It might be true in the richer neighborhoods.

    I remember reading a big article a number of years ago about vets. I think it was in the New York Times. Their biggest challenge is that while there's a big demand for their services, a lot of people with pets have no money to pay the vet. The entry level salaries aren't good and they typically have a lot of student loans to pay.

    The love of animals keeps people going into the field.

    This article made me aware of the big problem with pet owners not being able to afford the vet. It makes me wonder why when you hear about animal adoption nobody ever mentions the cost of animals and evaluating whether people can afford a pet before getting one. Of the 65% or so of whites and Hispanic families that have pets, a significant number don't have money for any kind of vet problem or even grooming. That would be especially true of the Hispanics.

    I am sad to realize how many people who can barely afford rent and bills have pets. That translates into a lot of abandoned and medically neglected animals.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Art Deco

    This article made me aware of the big problem with pet owners not being able to afford the vet. I

    No, it made you aware of the line the reporter wanted to push. If there isn’t much of a problem, he and his assignment editor would have to run an observational piece that wasn’t some sort of alarm or some sort of indictment of the world in which they live. The Sulzberger minions do not do that.

    The entry level salaries aren’t good

    Annual cash compensation for veterinarians earning at the 10th percentile of the profession is currently about $58,000 per year. That for high school teaches at the 10th percentile is $40,000; for chemists, $44,000; for optometrists, $59,000; architects, $49,000; civil engineers, $55,000. You’ll do better as a dentist ($80,000) or a pharmacist ($88,000).

  131. I’m guessing that Ms. Price had chosen a black dog, which she naturally called Nigga, as blacks tend to call other blacks. I suppose that she needed to find a black vet who wouldn’t be discomfited when she introduced her pet to the vet.

  132. @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s

    It's bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century. Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.

    Replies: @Prester John, @Almost Missouri

    For every two that emerge the womb, one will eventually be returned to the womb of Mother Earth as a result of being on the receiving end of a bullet.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Prester John

    About 4% of black men die by homicide, not 1/3. For black women (IIRC) the proportion is more like 1%.

  133. @Guy De Champlagne
    Rather than pointing out that vets don't even much money or enjoy much status, or that blacks are net beneficiaries of discrimination, or that even a country without any discrimination would still benefit blacks at the expense of whites, just say that in an all black country all the vets would be black and ask how we can work together to create the all black country you want. Push them in the direction they're already going, don't try to stop and then reverse them.

    Replies: @PennTothal, @AndrewR

    They don’t want to live in an all-black society any more than plantation owners in Georgia in 1850 wanted to live in an all-White society. Black America’s loudest and most influential voices are virtually all black supremacists. They want to enslave us, albeit in a different manner than their ancestors were enslaved.

  134. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    I can’t speak for any vets but, while putting down perfectly healthy animals would be depressing, putting suffering creatures out of their misery has got to be fulfilling on some level. And spaying and neutering animals must feel good because it reduces overpopulation. And then there is the joy that comes from healing an ill/injured pet. I imagine vets experience basically the same emotions as pediatricians: occasional sadness overshadowed by great joys.

  135. @Mr. Blank
    Back when I was single, I dated a veterinarian for awhile.

    She said one of the issues they deal with is people who have pets with black fur, who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” She said they see this so, so often. And everybody who does it acts like they’re the first person in history to come up with that joke.

    And you can’t just refuse to treat the animal. It’s not the animal’s fault their owner named them that. They have to get creative sometimes to avoid using the animal’s name, she said.

    Trying to imagine how a black veterinarian would deal with that.

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @MBlanc46, @AndrewR, @riches

    You got called a troll because you are clearly lying. I’m sure many people call black pets that word in private, but I can’t imagine anyone responding with that name when the receptionist asks what the pet’s name is. It certainly wouldn’t happen more than once or twice in any vet’s career.

    Also the “imagine how a black vet would respond” makes you sound like a whiny Jewish college lesbian.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    @AndrewR

    You got called a troll because you are clearly lying.

    Not necessarily, could be the woman he was dating lied to him.

  136. @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s

    It's bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century. Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.

    Replies: @Prester John, @Almost Missouri

    The black portion of the US population was above 20% at US independence. From there it steadily declined to below 10% by 1930. Then it suddenly reversed course and began it’s relentless increase which continues today as it passes 13%.

    To look only at the bottom point of that giant V-shape and say, “It’s bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century” is at best misleading, and might be more accurately described as willful blindness.

    Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.

    They’re more fecund than everyone but recent Hispanics at this point.

    And as I repeatedly have to remind the TFR-spergs, when your generation length includes 15-year-old mothers and 30-year-old grandmothers, TFR doesn’t capture the population growth advantage that rapid generations confer.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    when your generation length includes 15-year-old mothers and 30-year-old grandmothers, TFR doesn’t capture the population growth advantage that rapid generations confer.

    TFR captures it fine. It's calculated from fertility in particular age sets. While we're at it, the median age at which a black woman has her first child is 23.0 years. About the same as it was for white women ca. 1964 and precisely the age my mother was when her first child was born. They have their children a few years earlier than do whites. They don't have large numbers of children, on average.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

  137. As for large animal vets, the money is only in zoo animals, prize winning fine breed stud horses and bulls and the like. A friend who is a small time (60 head) east coast beef cattle rancher on inherited family farm tells me that they learned a long time ago to take care as best they could of injured, sick and distressed cattle as in nine out of ten times when the vet did a “house call” they wound up with a $700.00 vet bill and a dead animal that might have brought $700.00 (if healthy) at the auction.

  138. @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    The black portion of the US population was above 20% at US independence. From there it steadily declined to below 10% by 1930. Then it suddenly reversed course and began it's relentless increase which continues today as it passes 13%.

    To look only at the bottom point of that giant V-shape and say, "It’s bounced around 13% since the mid-19th century" is at best misleading, and might be more accurately described as willful blindness.


    Blacks are not particularly fecund; the total fertility rate is 2.1 children per woman per lifetime.
     
    They're more fecund than everyone but recent Hispanics at this point.

    And as I repeatedly have to remind the TFR-spergs, when your generation length includes 15-year-old mothers and 30-year-old grandmothers, TFR doesn't capture the population growth advantage that rapid generations confer.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    when your generation length includes 15-year-old mothers and 30-year-old grandmothers, TFR doesn’t capture the population growth advantage that rapid generations confer.

    TFR captures it fine. It’s calculated from fertility in particular age sets. While we’re at it, the median age at which a black woman has her first child is 23.0 years. About the same as it was for white women ca. 1964 and precisely the age my mother was when her first child was born. They have their children a few years earlier than do whites. They don’t have large numbers of children, on average.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    Annual growth rate of US non-Hispanic white population as of the last census: 0.1%

    Annual growth rate of US black population as of the last census: 1.2%

    Art Deco: "TFR captures it fine. ... my mother ... blah, blah, blah ... go back to sleep!"

    Reality: Black pop growing 10× faster than white pop.

    It's almost like you're trying to hide something.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  139. @Steve Sailer
    @notsaying

    You can get financing to buy a pet. Interest rates are in 3 figures.

    Replies: @Adam Smith

  140. @Prester John
    @Art Deco

    For every two that emerge the womb, one will eventually be returned to the womb of Mother Earth as a result of being on the receiving end of a bullet.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    About 4% of black men die by homicide, not 1/3. For black women (IIRC) the proportion is more like 1%.

  141. @Anon
    I wouldn't trust a black vet with my pet. Blacks are mean to animals and insensitive to the feelings of others in general.

    Replies: @Anon, @Anon1492

    The title of this clip speaks for itself.

    A former vet tech admits to killing a dog on purpose due to the owner being “a very bad person”

    https://video.link/w/7cxsb

  142. @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    1) Being a small animal or GP vet is typically a 9-to-5 job where your clients bring your patients to you at your convenience in your comfy office. Being a large animal vet means you have to spend a lot of additional time driving around to your clients' work sites (and being rural, they are by definition not close together) beyond your normal "business hours". Not that you really have normal business hours. If puppy Stokely is sick at night, the vet's answering service takes a message and Stokely's owner gets a call back in the morning. If AgriCorp's top producing cow is having trouble calving at 3AM, the vet will be expected to answer the call and be there within the hour. In other words, farm vets work more hours in harder conditions for the "same" revenue.

    2) Most small-animal practices are sole practitioners or small partnerships where the vets are the owners and compensation is relatively egalitarian. Farm-only vet practices are more likely to be large corporate-type practices with investors and senior vets who snaffle up a chunk of that revenue before the majority staff vets see it.

    3) Assuming you are referring to Table 1 in your PDF, when encountering a table wherein every single column is precisely and eerily parallel in proportion, one may fairly wonder if the authors had their excel formulas hooked up correctly, or indeed whether they didn't simply have the proportions in mind beforehand and then distributed the results accordingly.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Anonymous

    Oh yes, I have a relative who is a rural vet. He has two cars, both with hundreds of thousands of miles on the clock. I have never seen cars with so much mileage on them.

  143. @Mr. Blank
    Back when I was single, I dated a veterinarian for awhile.

    She said one of the issues they deal with is people who have pets with black fur, who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” She said they see this so, so often. And everybody who does it acts like they’re the first person in history to come up with that joke.

    And you can’t just refuse to treat the animal. It’s not the animal’s fault their owner named them that. They have to get creative sometimes to avoid using the animal’s name, she said.

    Trying to imagine how a black veterinarian would deal with that.

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @MBlanc46, @AndrewR, @riches

    “(people) who think it’s hilarious to name their pet “N-word.” 

    Decades ago my then wife wasn’t expecting the vet’s young clerk to ask for our orange
    tabby’s name. Given time she would have fabricated a suitable name, but in the unguarded moment she blurted her honest reply: Yes, inexplicably, the cat’s name was the n-word.

    This would have been a forgotten and only mildly embarrassing event if not for the postcard that came much later reminding us, “your pet ____ [with the name handwritten in the space] is due for its distemper shot.”

  144. @Michael S
    @Anonymous


    They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it’s mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time.
     
    Not exactly. They portray it as a sinecure that is mostly sitting in front of a computer screen for hours at a time reading The Guardian, goofing off on social media, complaining about the lack of _____ representation at the company, and occasionally tapping out half a dozen lines of code, which may or may not compile, often with the help of a coworker.

    And they're not entirely wrong, because the companies are very happy to put them in these positions in order to fill the diversity quotas that theoretically do not exist while preventing them from doing any real damage. Unfortunately the tax isn't just their salary, it's the productivity of all the other workers who have to route around them and fix the gigantic mess they create after doing idiotic things like replacing all instances of "he" and "him" with "they" and "them" so you now have a bunch of references to "ttheyme" and "sthem". I'm exaggerating, but only a little.

    You have to understand how Marxists think. When they say they want more female programmers or black vets, they don't actually want more female programmers or black vets, they want more women and blacks with the title, pay and respect of programmers and vets, without having to do any of the work, because they don't believe that work is actually a thing that exists. Electricity comes from the socket, food comes from the supermarket, software comes from the internet (which also comes from the socket), and vets make animals better by bringing them into a secret room or perhaps chanting something to break the voodoo curse.

    The point is, they don't care about the actual work these professions do, because they don't do any work and don't even comprehend that there is work to be done. The only important work worth doing is taking other people's money and social status, AKA correcting systemic injustices.

    Replies: @photondancer, @The Wild Geese Howard

    because they don’t believe that work is actually a thing that exists. Electricity comes from the socket, food comes from the supermarket, software comes from the internet (which also comes from the socket)

    Nailed it.

    Marxist morons also believe that they are going to live in green bliss, charging up their Teslas before cruising down to Starbucks for soy lattes and picking up some Impossible burgers at Trader Joe’s, right after they shut down the oil industry and eliminate the last deplorable.

  145. @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    when your generation length includes 15-year-old mothers and 30-year-old grandmothers, TFR doesn’t capture the population growth advantage that rapid generations confer.

    TFR captures it fine. It's calculated from fertility in particular age sets. While we're at it, the median age at which a black woman has her first child is 23.0 years. About the same as it was for white women ca. 1964 and precisely the age my mother was when her first child was born. They have their children a few years earlier than do whites. They don't have large numbers of children, on average.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    Annual growth rate of US non-Hispanic white population as of the last census: 0.1%

    Annual growth rate of US black population as of the last census: 1.2%

    Art Deco: “TFR captures it fine. … my mother … blah, blah, blah … go back to sleep!”

    Reality: Black pop growing 10× faster than white pop.

    It’s almost like you’re trying to hide something.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    The black population stood at about 10% of the total in 1940 and 12.6% in 2010. You should turn your attention to some other issue.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

  146. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    Vets need 8 years of expensive education and make less money than people in fields with similar education.

    I would not encourage a young ambitious black person (or any person) to pursue veterinary medicine as a career.

  147. @bruce county
    They are starting at the top of the list.

    https://skeptvet.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/IMage-1.png

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Clyde, @Redneck farmer, @Almost Missouri, @Twinkie, @William Badwhite, @George Taylor

    Millwrights, sheet metal and steel workers. I wonder when they will go after Elon Musk and SpaceX, building those new stainless steel rockets down in south Texas.

  148. @AndrewR
    @Mr. Blank

    You got called a troll because you are clearly lying. I'm sure many people call black pets that word in private, but I can't imagine anyone responding with that name when the receptionist asks what the pet's name is. It certainly wouldn't happen more than once or twice in any vet's career.

    Also the "imagine how a black vet would respond" makes you sound like a whiny Jewish college lesbian.

    Replies: @kaganovitch

    You got called a troll because you are clearly lying.

    Not necessarily, could be the woman he was dating lied to him.

  149. @Almost Missouri
    @BB753

    Sorry to break it to you, but blacks are not a shrinking minority in the US.

    Blacks are a growing minority.

    https://www.unz.com/anepigone/electoral-democratic-civil-war/#comment-3693558

    Combine open borders with Steve's Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.

    Replies: @BB753, @AnotherDad

    Combine open borders with Steve’s Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.

    Almost–

    I don’t want to go book-length, but i think this is less likely than it seems right now.

    The great replacement was basically a Jewish driven strategy to displace white gentiles as a majority, buffed up by the siren call of cheap labor.

    But that’s pretty much baked now. In whose interest is it to download millions of African blacks into the US?

    I think while the traditional white coherent, free and prosperous America as coherent nation has been killed by immigration, immigration politics themselves will be changing in the new America. A bunch of reasons:

    — the progressive whiteness-hostile Jew, while still hugely powerful in America and Democratic party politics is a sharply declining part of the population and future elites; low fertility, inter-marriage. Most Jews being born today are probably Orthodox with other concerns. Having lots of Africans come here not among them.

    — Latin American fertility is way down, heading toward replacement. Mexico probably has replacement fertility. The poorer Central American countries lag a bit and can send a few millions more, but they are trending down as well. Of course, the people in all these countries may want to come for a better deal, but the big push is done. And do American “Hispanics” want them? After their relatives are here? Do they want a huge influx of blacks? The question answers itself.

    — Indians might like other Indians to come–well, more of their sorts of Indians. The Chinese might like more Chinese. Do either of them want more blacks?

    — American blacks have never favored immigration to start with. They naturally favor stuff for them and are on the Jewish minoritarian train … because that’s the minoritarian train and they are a minority. (If you can mau-mau whitey into giving you stuff … why not!) But do they want America to be flooded with Africans to make it blacker? Uh … they don’t love Africans and the feeling is mutual. And the reality is that makes the nation poorer, and they have to share black shakedown loot with someone else.

    — The new Jewish-white-Asian elite won’t be the old WASPy America. But it won’t have the attitudinal issues as the Jewish elite either. It’s a different beast.

    It’s hard to see any real constituency for sustained mass immigration from Africa into the United States. Once whitey has been dethroned and the new confused order is in place, we’re going to see some different political alliances and alignments. And the immigration issue will change as well.

    The bottom line is immigration–which is fundamentally population replacement–is never in the host population’s interest. What actually happened in the early history of the United States was recruiting more people from essentially the conquesting population’s own people to help finish the conquest. (Not immigration, but conquest.)

    Absent the particularly characteristics of Jewish anti-white immigration enthusiasm and with a more diverse population–none of which find the available African immigration in their interest–it’s hard to see how the immigration insanity continues down that road.

    • Thanks: Dissident
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    @AnotherDad

    Thanks for the thoughtful reply, AnotherDad. Everything you write seems rational, and I partly agree with what you write, but...


    In whose interest is it to download millions of African blacks into the US?
     
    In whose interest was it to download any blacks into the US since slavery ended? No one's that I can see, yet here they are and they keep coming in their millions. Indeed, Africa is the fastest growing source of immigration to the US.

    However it is that African immigration got started, despite no one obviously desiring it, today it has become a self-sustaining chain-reaction. Most African immigration today is driven simply by being related (or claiming to be related) to Africans already here. In other words, African immigrants are now their own interest group, and that is all that is necessary to have more immigrants.

    As a general observation, unintended consequences happen, and programs carry on long after their original purpose was fulfilled. NATO is an example. The Cold War was won three decades ago, yet NATO—explicitly created to oppose a nation that no longer exists leading an alliance that no longer exists—still exists, and expands! The most recent President finally proposed the obvious: do away with this white elephant. Yet his proposal died, while NATO lives and grows. Even worse, a large swathe of elites who opposed NATO when it had a real purpose, now support NATO now that it has none.

    As a personal observation, I have known quite a few African immigrants to the US. Every single one arrived under the banner of a "temporary" visa program meant to impart something or other that they were supposed to take back to Africa. Every single one never returned. Some stayed here and got citizenship. Some stayed illegally. But they all stayed. Likable guys mostly. But that doesn't change the fact that they shouldn't technically be here.


    the progressive whiteness-hostile Jew, while still hugely powerful in America and Democratic party politics is a sharply declining part of the population and future elites; low fertility, inter-marriage. Most Jews being born today are probably Orthodox with other concerns.
     
    As I've written elsewhere, the end of American Jews via low fertility and inter-marriage (which I've been hearing about for a couple of decades) is an illusion caused by Gentiles mostly being familiar only with the secularized, deracinated, outermost layer of the Jew-o-sphere (if I can coin that term). They forget that the inner layers of the Jewosphere consist of very high fertility non-intermarrying Orthodox who quickly repopulate those outer layers with new secularizing, deracinting Jews, whom the Gentiles watch assimilating and mistakenly conclude that that assimilation will be the end, forgetting that there is a burgeoning core of Orthodox from whom new layers of seculars can slough off without depleting the source population.

    American blacks ... don’t love Africans and the feeling is mutual.
     
    True, but they generally will not say this publicly. And what doesn't get said publicly doesn't get included in political sausage making.

    And the reality is that makes the nation poorer, and they have to share black shakedown loot with someone else.
     
    Also true, but do you know any blacks who make this calculation? I don't, and I've known quite a few blacks. Indeed, I think the few who do calculate about it figure that while they may not especially like immigrant Africans, the immigrants do big up black numbers and therefore advance the black political agenda. And even if they don't calculate thus, the Democrat leadership is there to calculate thus for them.

    The bottom line is immigration–which is fundamentally population replacement–is never in the host population’s interest.
     
    Right. And yet it happened anyway, and happened to an extreme and fatal degree. And having so happened, what is it to let in a few more million Africans?

    it’s hard to see how the immigration insanity continues down that road.
     
    In 1963 it was hard to see how immigration would go down the insane road it then went down, yet it did. Insanity can no longer be considered a barrier.

    Replies: @Dissident

  150. @Anonymous

    A whole lot of white girls want to become vets, so the competition is tough.
     
    Sort of like how a lot of boys want to be police officers or soldiers. When they grow up, they find that it's not the greatest profession. Girls who grow up and seriously consider pursuing vet medicine often learn that it's not such a great profession and change ambitions.

    Being a vet sounds glamorous but it's considered a fairly bad profession and doesn't pay that well. There's lots of professional dissatisfaction among vets and depression and suicide rates are very high. Part of the reason is that a lot of what vets do is just put down animals. It's not like heroic human medicine where you try to save and extend lives. Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    This article reminds me of the push to promote blacks and women into coding. They portray computer programming as some sort of super glamorous, exciting profession when it's mostly sitting in front of a computer screen in silent concentration for hours at a time. The vast majority of people would hate programming. Just like most people would hate euthanizing dogs and cats for a living, which is the job description for most vets.

    "Veterinarians far more likely to die by suicide than other Americans, research shows"
    "As more women have become vets, their suicide risk has risen sharply, according to CDC researchers."

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/veterinarians-far-more-likely-die-suicide-other-americans-research-confirms-n950671

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Anon, @Cortes, @Johnny Smoggins, @Michael S, @Prosa123, @AndrewR, @Jimi, @Rosie

    Your job is basically being Dr. Krevorkian for animals, day after day.

    But I have been so grateful to the vets (mostly, but not all, women) who have helped me cope with loss over the years. One in particular provided a surgery at a very reasonable cost that kept my pet alive and comfortable for a few precious months together and then helped me decide exactly when it was time. In other words, they’re not just providing a service to animals, but also their humans.

    Nonetheless, your point stands, of course. It takes a very special sort to be a veterinarian. I am in awe of people who can do that job well.

    • Agree: bruce county
  151. @Anon
    @Steve Sailer

    “My date for the prom...”

    Poignant. (No sarcasm.) As the saying goes, “High school is never over.”
    I speak as someone who didn’t marry his high-school sweetheart. I never spoke to my high-school sweetheart.

    Replies: @NickG

    A feint heart never won a woman.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    @NickG


    A feint heart never won a woman.
     
    Unless you're a fencer, neither did a faint heart. En Gauarde!
  152. @AnotherDad
    @Almost Missouri


    Combine open borders with Steve’s Most Important Graph in the World, and it looks like a permanent guaranteed bull market for blackness.
     
    Almost--

    I don't want to go book-length, but i think this is less likely than it seems right now.

    The great replacement was basically a Jewish driven strategy to displace white gentiles as a majority, buffed up by the siren call of cheap labor.

    But that's pretty much baked now. In whose interest is it to download millions of African blacks into the US?

    I think while the traditional white coherent, free and prosperous America as coherent nation has been killed by immigration, immigration politics themselves will be changing in the new America. A bunch of reasons:

    -- the progressive whiteness-hostile Jew, while still hugely powerful in America and Democratic party politics is a sharply declining part of the population and future elites; low fertility, inter-marriage. Most Jews being born today are probably Orthodox with other concerns. Having lots of Africans come here not among them.

    -- Latin American fertility is way down, heading toward replacement. Mexico probably has replacement fertility. The poorer Central American countries lag a bit and can send a few millions more, but they are trending down as well. Of course, the people in all these countries may want to come for a better deal, but the big push is done. And do American "Hispanics" want them? After their relatives are here? Do they want a huge influx of blacks? The question answers itself.

    -- Indians might like other Indians to come--well, more of their sorts of Indians. The Chinese might like more Chinese. Do either of them want more blacks?

    -- American blacks have never favored immigration to start with. They naturally favor stuff for them and are on the Jewish minoritarian train ... because that's the minoritarian train and they are a minority. (If you can mau-mau whitey into giving you stuff ... why not!) But do they want America to be flooded with Africans to make it blacker? Uh ... they don't love Africans and the feeling is mutual. And the reality is that makes the nation poorer, and they have to share black shakedown loot with someone else.

    -- The new Jewish-white-Asian elite won't be the old WASPy America. But it won't have the attitudinal issues as the Jewish elite either. It's a different beast.


    It's hard to see any real constituency for sustained mass immigration from Africa into the United States. Once whitey has been dethroned and the new confused order is in place, we're going to see some different political alliances and alignments. And the immigration issue will change as well.

    The bottom line is immigration--which is fundamentally population replacement--is never in the host population's interest. What actually happened in the early history of the United States was recruiting more people from essentially the conquesting population's own people to help finish the conquest. (Not immigration, but conquest.)

    Absent the particularly characteristics of Jewish anti-white immigration enthusiasm and with a more diverse population--none of which find the available African immigration in their interest--it's hard to see how the immigration insanity continues down that road.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    Thanks for the thoughtful reply, AnotherDad. Everything you write seems rational, and I partly agree with what you write, but…

    In whose interest is it to download millions of African blacks into the US?

    In whose interest was it to download any blacks into the US since slavery ended? No one’s that I can see, yet here they are and they keep coming in their millions. Indeed, Africa is the fastest growing source of immigration to the US.

    However it is that African immigration got started, despite no one obviously desiring it, today it has become a self-sustaining chain-reaction. Most African immigration today is driven simply by being related (or claiming to be related) to Africans already here. In other words, African immigrants are now their own interest group, and that is all that is necessary to have more immigrants.

    As a general observation, unintended consequences happen, and programs carry on long after their original purpose was fulfilled. NATO is an example. The Cold War was won three decades ago, yet NATO—explicitly created to oppose a nation that no longer exists leading an alliance that no longer exists—still exists, and expands! The most recent President finally proposed the obvious: do away with this white elephant. Yet his proposal died, while NATO lives and grows. Even worse, a large swathe of elites who opposed NATO when it had a real purpose, now support NATO now that it has none.

    As a personal observation, I have known quite a few African immigrants to the US. Every single one arrived under the banner of a “temporary” visa program meant to impart something or other that they were supposed to take back to Africa. Every single one never returned. Some stayed here and got citizenship. Some stayed illegally. But they all stayed. Likable guys mostly. But that doesn’t change the fact that they shouldn’t technically be here.

    the progressive whiteness-hostile Jew, while still hugely powerful in America and Democratic party politics is a sharply declining part of the population and future elites; low fertility, inter-marriage. Most Jews being born today are probably Orthodox with other concerns.

    As I’ve written elsewhere, the end of American Jews via low fertility and inter-marriage (which I’ve been hearing about for a couple of decades) is an illusion caused by Gentiles mostly being familiar only with the secularized, deracinated, outermost layer of the Jew-o-sphere (if I can coin that term). They forget that the inner layers of the Jewosphere consist of very high fertility non-intermarrying Orthodox who quickly repopulate those outer layers with new secularizing, deracinting Jews, whom the Gentiles watch assimilating and mistakenly conclude that that assimilation will be the end, forgetting that there is a burgeoning core of Orthodox from whom new layers of seculars can slough off without depleting the source population.

    American blacks … don’t love Africans and the feeling is mutual.

    True, but they generally will not say this publicly. And what doesn’t get said publicly doesn’t get included in political sausage making.

    And the reality is that makes the nation poorer, and they have to share black shakedown loot with someone else.

    Also true, but do you know any blacks who make this calculation? I don’t, and I’ve known quite a few blacks. Indeed, I think the few who do calculate about it figure that while they may not especially like immigrant Africans, the immigrants do big up black numbers and therefore advance the black political agenda. And even if they don’t calculate thus, the Democrat leadership is there to calculate thus for them.

    The bottom line is immigration–which is fundamentally population replacement–is never in the host population’s interest.

    Right. And yet it happened anyway, and happened to an extreme and fatal degree. And having so happened, what is it to let in a few more million Africans?

    it’s hard to see how the immigration insanity continues down that road.

    In 1963 it was hard to see how immigration would go down the insane road it then went down, yet it did. Insanity can no longer be considered a barrier.

    • Replies: @Dissident
    @Almost Missouri


    They forget that the inner layers of the Jewosphere consist of very high fertility non-intermarrying Orthodox who quickly repopulate those outer layers with new secularizing, deracin[a]ting Jews, whom the Gentiles watch assimilating and mistakenly conclude that that assimilation will be the end, forgetting that there is a burgeoning core of Orthodox from whom new layers of seculars can slough off without depleting the source population.
     
    Some rather ambitious claims there. Do you have any data to back them up?

    Specifically: Roughly what percentage of those born into Orthodox Jewish homes leave Orthodoxy for a secular lifestyle? And how long do such Jews retain any Jewish identity of any strength or consequence? What is the intermarriage rate for Jews who leave Orthodoxy?

    These are critical questions for which I found answers conspicuously absent-- here, as well as in the past comment of yours that you linked-to and others on the topic in that Audacious Epigone thread from January.

    I also found no mention of the reverse phenomenon, i.e., of secular-raised Jews who embrace Orthodoxy at some point in their life. (This happens to be my path.)

  153. @Almost Missouri
    @AnotherDad

    Thanks for the thoughtful reply, AnotherDad. Everything you write seems rational, and I partly agree with what you write, but...


    In whose interest is it to download millions of African blacks into the US?
     
    In whose interest was it to download any blacks into the US since slavery ended? No one's that I can see, yet here they are and they keep coming in their millions. Indeed, Africa is the fastest growing source of immigration to the US.

    However it is that African immigration got started, despite no one obviously desiring it, today it has become a self-sustaining chain-reaction. Most African immigration today is driven simply by being related (or claiming to be related) to Africans already here. In other words, African immigrants are now their own interest group, and that is all that is necessary to have more immigrants.

    As a general observation, unintended consequences happen, and programs carry on long after their original purpose was fulfilled. NATO is an example. The Cold War was won three decades ago, yet NATO—explicitly created to oppose a nation that no longer exists leading an alliance that no longer exists—still exists, and expands! The most recent President finally proposed the obvious: do away with this white elephant. Yet his proposal died, while NATO lives and grows. Even worse, a large swathe of elites who opposed NATO when it had a real purpose, now support NATO now that it has none.

    As a personal observation, I have known quite a few African immigrants to the US. Every single one arrived under the banner of a "temporary" visa program meant to impart something or other that they were supposed to take back to Africa. Every single one never returned. Some stayed here and got citizenship. Some stayed illegally. But they all stayed. Likable guys mostly. But that doesn't change the fact that they shouldn't technically be here.


    the progressive whiteness-hostile Jew, while still hugely powerful in America and Democratic party politics is a sharply declining part of the population and future elites; low fertility, inter-marriage. Most Jews being born today are probably Orthodox with other concerns.
     
    As I've written elsewhere, the end of American Jews via low fertility and inter-marriage (which I've been hearing about for a couple of decades) is an illusion caused by Gentiles mostly being familiar only with the secularized, deracinated, outermost layer of the Jew-o-sphere (if I can coin that term). They forget that the inner layers of the Jewosphere consist of very high fertility non-intermarrying Orthodox who quickly repopulate those outer layers with new secularizing, deracinting Jews, whom the Gentiles watch assimilating and mistakenly conclude that that assimilation will be the end, forgetting that there is a burgeoning core of Orthodox from whom new layers of seculars can slough off without depleting the source population.

    American blacks ... don’t love Africans and the feeling is mutual.
     
    True, but they generally will not say this publicly. And what doesn't get said publicly doesn't get included in political sausage making.

    And the reality is that makes the nation poorer, and they have to share black shakedown loot with someone else.
     
    Also true, but do you know any blacks who make this calculation? I don't, and I've known quite a few blacks. Indeed, I think the few who do calculate about it figure that while they may not especially like immigrant Africans, the immigrants do big up black numbers and therefore advance the black political agenda. And even if they don't calculate thus, the Democrat leadership is there to calculate thus for them.

    The bottom line is immigration–which is fundamentally population replacement–is never in the host population’s interest.
     
    Right. And yet it happened anyway, and happened to an extreme and fatal degree. And having so happened, what is it to let in a few more million Africans?

    it’s hard to see how the immigration insanity continues down that road.
     
    In 1963 it was hard to see how immigration would go down the insane road it then went down, yet it did. Insanity can no longer be considered a barrier.

    Replies: @Dissident

    They forget that the inner layers of the Jewosphere consist of very high fertility non-intermarrying Orthodox who quickly repopulate those outer layers with new secularizing, deracin[a]ting Jews, whom the Gentiles watch assimilating and mistakenly conclude that that assimilation will be the end, forgetting that there is a burgeoning core of Orthodox from whom new layers of seculars can slough off without depleting the source population.

    Some rather ambitious claims there. Do you have any data to back them up?

    Specifically: Roughly what percentage of those born into Orthodox Jewish homes leave Orthodoxy for a secular lifestyle? And how long do such Jews retain any Jewish identity of any strength or consequence? What is the intermarriage rate for Jews who leave Orthodoxy?

    These are critical questions for which I found answers conspicuously absent– here, as well as in the past comment of yours that you linked-to and others on the topic in that Audacious Epigone thread from January.

    I also found no mention of the reverse phenomenon, i.e., of secular-raised Jews who embrace Orthodoxy at some point in their life. (This happens to be my path.)

  154. Well, this was supposed to be about blacks, not Jews, but I understand that you have a special interest here, so …

    Here’s the US Jewish population according to the Jewish Virtual Library:

    https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jewish-population-in-the-united-states-nationally

    I believe it was in the 1980s that I first heard that “Jews were intermarrying and doomed to extinction” meme. At the time there were fewer than six million Jews in the US. Today there are over seven million. So obviously, on it’s face, this claim about secularization ending US Jewry is false.

    The US Jewish population is growing, not shrinking. And it has been growing at a pretty healthy clip for a long time. Indeed, for most of history the US Jewish population growth rate was (and still is) above the US non-Hispanic white population growth rate. So this whole Chronicle of a Death Foretold for Jews has been wrong for a long time and continues to be wrong now.

    As regards Orthodox Jewish birth rates, what do you think they are? I am non-rhetorically asking for your input, because it is not so easy to find figures for the US. But here are are some numbers for Israel:

    https://isteve.blogspot.com/2013/08/israeli-jewish-total-fertility-rates.html

    There is much more space and real estate is relatively cheaper in the US vs. Israel, so the numbers may be higher here. But let us be conservative and assume the numbers are a little lower. So, say TFR of six. Are the Orthodox tripling every generation? They do seem to be a growing population, but tripling? Yet TFR six implies tripling. So if they are not tripling that means the difference is sloughing off into secularized, semi-assimilated layers. Those layers themselves may be below replacement fertility, but it doesn’t matter because they are getting replenished from deeper within the Sphere. This can be confirmed anecdotally by asking low-TFR secular Jewish people about their ancestors. In my experience, most can name a recent Orthodox forbearer, which is another way of saying that their germline has recently migrated out from the more fertile core of the Sphere. In other words, secular Jews don’t exist so much as a discrete and continuing population, but rather as the outermost shell of the expanding core Jewish population. And as such, they are not in danger of going extinct, because they were never self-sustaining in the first place.

    • Replies: @Dissident
    @Almost Missouri

    Please accept my apologies for the long delay in responding. I appreciate your taking the time to reply in detail.


    So obviously, on it’s face, this claim about secularization ending US Jewry is false.
     
    That is not the claim I ever made. What I have stated, in numerous comments, is that secular and non-Orthodox Jews, specifically, as a result of their low rates of birth and high rates of intermarriage and assimilation, are heading toward extinction and being replaced by the highly fertile and endogamous Jews of the Orthodox variety. I base this claim on data that is found in this article.

    As regards Orthodox Jewish birth rates, what do you think they are?
     
    In addition to some data at the link I provided above, there is more at the following article which is linked from the above:
    Jews and Jewish Birthrate Excerpt:

    Not only do the Orthodox suffer many fewer losses from intermarriage, but their fertility rate is far above the Jewish norm. As against the overall average of 1.86 children per Jewish woman, an informed estimate gives figures ranging upward from 3.3 children in “modern Orthodox” families to 6.6 in Haredi or “ultra-Orthodox” families to a whopping 7.9 in families of Hasidim. These numbers are, of course, difficult to pin down definitively, but anecdotal evidence is compelling.
     
    I can add a little largely anecdotal evidence. Among at least large segments within the more traditional Orthodox known as Haredim or "Ultra-Orthodox"*, the norm is for the males to be married by as young as 20 and the females as young as 18. The practice of contraception is pretty rare, mostly limited to cases in which pregnancy or birth would create serious problems for the mother. Add to that a very low divorce rate.

    As one moves toward the Modern-Orthodox end of the spectrum, there is an overall trend toward higher ages-at-marriage, as well as increases in rates of contraceptive use; divorce; and intermarriage and assimilation. And a decreasein birth rates. But even at the left-/liberal-**most end of Modern-Orthodoxy, birth rates remain considerably higher than the those of the general population-- certainly when adjusted for socioeconomic status.

    *Note that in the infographics at the first link I provide Centrist Orthodox is the practical equivalent of Modern-Orthodox, and Hasidic/Yeshiva Orthodox is the practical equivalent of Ultra-Orthodox.

    I consider "Ultra-Orthodox" a tendentious and even pejorative term but most within the demographics it covers will use it when expedient without much, if any thought. Also note that all Hasidim fall within this subset of Orthodoxy but the converse is not true; not all Haredim are Hasidim.
    **Left/liberal here being used in the specific context of Jewish religious practice, which does not necessarily correlate with the generally understood left-right spectrum in politics and other areas.

    So if they are not tripling that means the difference is sloughing off into secularized, semi-assimilated layers. Those layers themselves may be below replacement fertility, but it doesn’t matter because they are getting replenished from deeper within the Sphere. This can be confirmed anecdotally by asking low-TFR secular Jewish people about their ancestors. In my experience, most can name a recent Orthodox forbearer,
     
    What do you call recent?

    Let me quote an email response I got from a friend whom I pointed to your post. I edited slightly for clarity and present-ability, and also to add emphasis at various points.

    It is indeed hard to get very solid numbers for any of these trends. There are lots of confounds. My sense is that there is a substantial number of modern orthodox Jews who go OTD* in college. However they tend (not exclusively of course)to be from the very leftmost wing of Modern orthodoxy and their level of observance was not overwhelming to start with. I think that is the group that conforms most closely to Almost Missouri's scenario. That group will tend to slide into secular Jewish intelligentsia society, (they weren't all that distant from it in the first place) and be sort of a replacement farm team, if you will, for the children secular Jews aren't having. However ,1- They aren't such a large group all things considered, and 2 - Their fertility rate, while higher than secular Jews, is not very high by Orthodox standards.

    Insofar as the OTD problem exists in the Haredi community, the cohort that goes OTD tends not to be elite (i.e. high-IQ; high levels of education, etc.) and is not a very good fit with secular Jewish intelligentsia, and to a surprising degree often maintain many "non progressive" Haredi sensibilities and attitudes despite their abandoning observance. I don't think that cohort will bolster the failing ranks of Secular Jewish society much, if at all.
     
    *OTD = off-the-derekh (path). This is a term that Orthodox Jews use for Jews who leave Orthodoxy.

    Well, this was supposed to be about blacks, not Jews, but I understand that you have a special interest here, so …
     
    Special interest or not, you had made specific claims in the course of what was an entire, substantial paragraph that you wrote on the topic. In light of that, I find it entirely reasonable for me to have responded as I did. My initial response was far from being of inordinate length. This one was and I threfore made use of the MORE! tag.
  155. @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    Annual growth rate of US non-Hispanic white population as of the last census: 0.1%

    Annual growth rate of US black population as of the last census: 1.2%

    Art Deco: "TFR captures it fine. ... my mother ... blah, blah, blah ... go back to sleep!"

    Reality: Black pop growing 10× faster than white pop.

    It's almost like you're trying to hide something.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    The black population stood at about 10% of the total in 1940 and 12.6% in 2010. You should turn your attention to some other issue.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    @Art Deco

    You seem to have plenty of attention to spare for this issue, if only negative attention. Why so eager to bury this subject?

    P.S. Black pop was below 10% in 1940 and in the space of two (white) generations had grown by a quarter as portion of the US and nearly tripled in absolute terms without significant immigration. If you think that the astonishing growth of the most dysfunctional part of the population is of no concern, well, you could use your comment allotment to address more important topics, whatever those may be. Strangely, you're burning comment after comment to insist this doesn't matter.

  156. @Art Deco
    @Almost Missouri

    The black population stood at about 10% of the total in 1940 and 12.6% in 2010. You should turn your attention to some other issue.

    Replies: @Almost Missouri

    You seem to have plenty of attention to spare for this issue, if only negative attention. Why so eager to bury this subject?

    P.S. Black pop was below 10% in 1940 and in the space of two (white) generations had grown by a quarter as portion of the US and nearly tripled in absolute terms without significant immigration. If you think that the astonishing growth of the most dysfunctional part of the population is of no concern, well, you could use your comment allotment to address more important topics, whatever those may be. Strangely, you’re burning comment after comment to insist this doesn’t matter.

  157. IME, veterinary medicine is inundated by lesbians, so why do they need POCs too?

  158. @Anon7
    Why so many women vets? Easy.

    What a deal - you wear the prestigious white coat, people call you "doctor" and you don't ever take real responsibility for human lives.

    Even more importantly, time was, if your cat was sick, and you went to the vet, HE would say "Sorry, your cat is old and dying. That'll be ten bucks."

    Nowadays, you take your cat to the vet and SHE says "Based on extensive medical testing, your cat has cancer. That'll be $1,250 for testing and the treatment is $1,500 per month. You DO love your cat, right?"

    Surefire moneyspinner, lots of prestige and no real responsibility? Sounds like a female dream come true.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob

    Nowadays, you take your cat to the vet and SHE says “Based on extensive medical testing, your cat has cancer. That’ll be $1,250 for testing and the treatment is $1,500 per month. You DO love your cat, right?”

    True dat. I worked with a woman whose cat had cancer. She spent $20k on the cat and it lived a few years longer. I love my dog, but . . .

  159. @prosa123
    IINM many veterinarians practicing in the US studied at schools in the Caribbean. Looking only at the gender skew in US schools isn't giving the full picture.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob

    IINM many veterinarians practicing in the US studied at schools in the Caribbean.

    One of my daughter’s friends was hot to be a vet but could not get into a US school, so she spent $250k to go to a school in the Caribbean. She trained to be a large animal vet but couldn’t make enough money even in the Virginia horse country to pay off her loans, so now she gives shots to Fluffy and Rocco.

  160. @NickG
    @Anon

    A feint heart never won a woman.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob

    A feint heart never won a woman.

    Unless you’re a fencer, neither did a faint heart. En Gauarde!

  161. @Steve Sailer
    @william munny

    Anglos, in England and America, seem to have led the world in love of animals.

    Maybe it wasn't always so. "King Lear" is striking in how dogs are held in contempt:

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/dogs-and-their-people/201504/william-shakespeare-hated-dogs

    https://www.drmetablog.com/2006/11/shakespeare_and.html

    I don't know whether Shakespeare was idiosyncratic in his dislike of dogs in 1600 or not.

    Replies: @OFWHAP, @Faraday's Bobcat, @LBD

    No, Shakespeare didn’t hate dogs. In Two Gentlemen of Verona there are touching scenes with a servant and his scruffy dog, “Crab”. Crab always steals the scenes and gets lots of applause.

  162. @Almost Missouri
    @BB753

    The black portion of the US population has been growing since the 1930s (the inception of the welfare state), four or five decades before Carib and African immigration started kicking in.

    And note that the descendants of immigrant blacks will consider themselves "authentic American Blacks" and assimilate to "authentic American black" cultural norms.

    So no matter how you slice it, the US future's looking dark.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @BB753

    They might grow but not as fast as Latinos and “others”, so they could remain 15 % of the population. That doesn’t mean that Whites will be soon less than 50 % of the population. But “Latin” , East Asians, South Asians, Middle Easterners of every brand and hue, etc will ensure Blacks remain a minority foreverer, unless the UN forces the USA to welcome 20 million African “refugees” or more.
    BTW, that’s how I believe our elites want to solve the problem posed by the World’s Most Important Graph© (Copyright Steve Sailer): resettle Africans by the millions in the West. For instance: United Nations to Italy or Poland: “please welcome 5 million Africans within your borders during the next 10 years or else (FMI intervention or NATO bombing campaign, you choose)” , and so on with every client state of the USA, and eventually, America itself. President Kamasutra Harris will say one day: we need 50 millions Africans in the USA ASAP or the GDP will plummet!” Basically, this is happening right now but in slow motion.

  163. @Almost Missouri
    Well, this was supposed to be about blacks, not Jews, but I understand that you have a special interest here, so ...

    Here's the US Jewish population according to the Jewish Virtual Library:

    https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jewish-population-in-the-united-states-nationally

    I believe it was in the 1980s that I first heard that "Jews were intermarrying and doomed to extinction" meme. At the time there were fewer than six million Jews in the US. Today there are over seven million. So obviously, on it's face, this claim about secularization ending US Jewry is false.

    The US Jewish population is growing, not shrinking. And it has been growing at a pretty healthy clip for a long time. Indeed, for most of history the US Jewish population growth rate was (and still is) above the US non-Hispanic white population growth rate. So this whole Chronicle of a Death Foretold for Jews has been wrong for a long time and continues to be wrong now.

    As regards Orthodox Jewish birth rates, what do you think they are? I am non-rhetorically asking for your input, because it is not so easy to find figures for the US. But here are are some numbers for Israel:

    https://isteve.blogspot.com/2013/08/israeli-jewish-total-fertility-rates.html

    There is much more space and real estate is relatively cheaper in the US vs. Israel, so the numbers may be higher here. But let us be conservative and assume the numbers are a little lower. So, say TFR of six. Are the Orthodox tripling every generation? They do seem to be a growing population, but tripling? Yet TFR six implies tripling. So if they are not tripling that means the difference is sloughing off into secularized, semi-assimilated layers. Those layers themselves may be below replacement fertility, but it doesn't matter because they are getting replenished from deeper within the Sphere. This can be confirmed anecdotally by asking low-TFR secular Jewish people about their ancestors. In my experience, most can name a recent Orthodox forbearer, which is another way of saying that their germline has recently migrated out from the more fertile core of the Sphere. In other words, secular Jews don't exist so much as a discrete and continuing population, but rather as the outermost shell of the expanding core Jewish population. And as such, they are not in danger of going extinct, because they were never self-sustaining in the first place.

    Replies: @Dissident

    Please accept my apologies for the long delay in responding. I appreciate your taking the time to reply in detail.

    So obviously, on it’s face, this claim about secularization ending US Jewry is false.

    That is not the claim I ever made. What I have stated, in numerous comments, is that secular and non-Orthodox Jews, specifically, as a result of their low rates of birth and high rates of intermarriage and assimilation, are heading toward extinction and being replaced by the highly fertile and endogamous Jews of the Orthodox variety. I base this claim on data that is found in this article.

    [MORE]

    As regards Orthodox Jewish birth rates, what do you think they are?

    In addition to some data at the link I provided above, there is more at the following article which is linked from the above:
    Jews and Jewish Birthrate Excerpt:

    [MORE]

    Not only do the Orthodox suffer many fewer losses from intermarriage, but their fertility rate is far above the Jewish norm. As against the overall average of 1.86 children per Jewish woman, an informed estimate gives figures ranging upward from 3.3 children in “modern Orthodox” families to 6.6 in Haredi or “ultra-Orthodox” families to a whopping 7.9 in families of Hasidim. These numbers are, of course, difficult to pin down definitively, but anecdotal evidence is compelling.

    I can add a little largely anecdotal evidence. Among at least large segments within the more traditional Orthodox known as Haredim or “Ultra-Orthodox”*, the norm is for the males to be married by as young as 20 and the females as young as 18. The practice of contraception is pretty rare, mostly limited to cases in which pregnancy or birth would create serious problems for the mother. Add to that a very low divorce rate.

    As one moves toward the Modern-Orthodox end of the spectrum, there is an overall trend toward higher ages-at-marriage, as well as increases in rates of contraceptive use; divorce; and intermarriage and assimilation. And a decreasein birth rates. But even at the left-/liberal-**most end of Modern-Orthodoxy, birth rates remain considerably higher than the those of the general population– certainly when adjusted for socioeconomic status.

    *Note that in the infographics at the first link I provide Centrist Orthodox is the practical equivalent of Modern-Orthodox, and Hasidic/Yeshiva Orthodox is the practical equivalent of Ultra-Orthodox.

    I consider “Ultra-Orthodox” a tendentious and even pejorative term but most within the demographics it covers will use it when expedient without much, if any thought. Also note that all Hasidim fall within this subset of Orthodoxy but the converse is not true; not all Haredim are Hasidim.
    **Left/liberal here being used in the specific context of Jewish religious practice, which does not necessarily correlate with the generally understood left-right spectrum in politics and other areas.

    So if they are not tripling that means the difference is sloughing off into secularized, semi-assimilated layers. Those layers themselves may be below replacement fertility, but it doesn’t matter because they are getting replenished from deeper within the Sphere. This can be confirmed anecdotally by asking low-TFR secular Jewish people about their ancestors. In my experience, most can name a recent Orthodox forbearer,

    What do you call recent?

    Let me quote an email response I got from a friend whom I pointed to your post. I edited slightly for clarity and present-ability, and also to add emphasis at various points.

    It is indeed hard to get very solid numbers for any of these trends. There are lots of confounds. My sense is that there is a substantial number of modern orthodox Jews who go OTD* in college. However they tend (not exclusively of course)to be from the very leftmost wing of Modern orthodoxy and their level of observance was not overwhelming to start with. I think that is the group that conforms most closely to Almost Missouri‘s scenario. That group will tend to slide into secular Jewish intelligentsia society, (they weren’t all that distant from it in the first place) and be sort of a replacement farm team, if you will, for the children secular Jews aren’t having. However ,1- They aren’t such a large group all things considered, and 2 – Their fertility rate, while higher than secular Jews, is not very high by Orthodox standards.

    Insofar as the OTD problem exists in the Haredi community, the cohort that goes OTD tends not to be elite (i.e. high-IQ; high levels of education, etc.) and is not a very good fit with secular Jewish intelligentsia, and to a surprising degree often maintain many “non progressive” Haredi sensibilities and attitudes despite their abandoning observance. I don’t think that cohort will bolster the failing ranks of Secular Jewish society much, if at all.

    *OTD = off-the-derekh (path). This is a term that Orthodox Jews use for Jews who leave Orthodoxy.

    Well, this was supposed to be about blacks, not Jews, but I understand that you have a special interest here, so …

    Special interest or not, you had made specific claims in the course of what was an entire, substantial paragraph that you wrote on the topic. In light of that, I find it entirely reasonable for me to have responded as I did. My initial response was far from being of inordinate length. This one was and I threfore made use of the MORE! tag.

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