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The NYT Warns of the Impending Nazi Shortage: "Why Old Nazis Are Still Useful"
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From the New York Times:

Why Old Nazis Are Still Useful
By ANNA SAUERBREY MAY 1, 2015

BERLIN — THE trial of Oskar Gröning, the 93-year-old “accountant of Auschwitz,” began last week in the German city of Lüneburg.

… It is one of the last chances we will have to hear the victims and seek justice from someone who actually participated in the Holocaust. The rapid disappearance of the “Zeitzeugen,” the contemporary witnesses — both survivors and perpetrators — will change how we Germans think about ourselves. Especially the perpetrators; in a bizarre way, we will miss them when they’re gone. …

We must find a new narrative, a new way to ensure “never again.” Not through ideology, but through action — for example by more generously helping the refugees that seek asylum in our country. Instead of trying to transfer a vague feeling of inherited guilt to yet another generation, we should change from remembering what we must never forget to knowing why.

Anna Sauerbrey, an editor on the opinion page of the newspaper Der Tagesspiegel, is a contributing opinion writer.

This is a very defeatist attitude on the part of Fraulein Sauerbrey. Letting in a few hundred million of the four billion Africans of 2100 is a weak substitute for having genuine Nazis around to deplore.

Germans are good at technology, so they should drop everything to find a technological fix for keeping old Nazis alive so we will never live in an age without trials of Nazis. Find some 86-year-olds who were 16 in 1945 and resolve to keep at least one alive by all means necessary until he can be put on trial in 2050 at age 121.

Or, Germany should launch a Manhattan Project to download elderly Nazi brains to computers so the world will never run out of Nazis to prosecute.

Or clone old Nazis. Wasn’t there a movie about that?

Or keep one Nazi brain alive in a jar.

Or as Mr. Anon points out, we could invent time travel, a Time Masheen to take up back to 1939 when Charlie Chaplin tried to conquer the world.

UC Berkeley historian Yuri Slezkine explained in his award-winning 2004 book The Jewish Century the religious significance of keeping Nazis viable:

Nazism … defined evil clearly, consistently, and scientifically. It shaped a perfect theodicy for the Age of Nationalism. It created the devil in its own image.

The question of the origins of evil is fundamental to any premise of redemption. Yet all modern religions [i.e., Marxism, Freudianism, and Zionism] resembled Christianity in being either silent or confused on the subject. … Marxism gave no clear answer; Leninism did not foresee a massive regeneration of the exterminated enemies; and Stalin’s willing executioners were never quite sure why they were executing some people and not others.

Nazism was unique in the consistency and simplicity of its theodicy. … A universe presided over by Man received an identifiable and historically distinct group of human beings as its first flesh-and-blood devil. The identity of the group might change, but the humanization and nationalization of evil proved durable. When the Nazi prophets were exposed as impostors and slain in the apocalypse they had unleashed, it was they who emerged as the new devil in a world without God — the only absolute in the Post-Prophetic Age.

 
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  1. Ironically, a better headline for that essay would be “The Banality of Propaganda.”

    • Replies: @Olorin
    "Ironically, a better headline for that essay would be “The Banality of Propaganda.”"

    And who better to consult on that than the founder of modern propaganda and the entire PR industry, Edward Bernays?

    You know, Anna Freud's boychik:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

    We know so little of the actual history and truths of the 20th century in Europe thanks to the fact that Bernays and his buds owned and controlled so much of the automated mass mind engineering even then.

    When I was taking my Ph.D. in mass comms research, I was stunned even then by how the entire field--research, media corporations, academe, NGOs and the foundations/individuals who funded them--were so closely held.

    The irony is that, today, lefty types can assert that Germans will always be "nazis" because genome.

    Try to get them to see that's the case for the Gentle Giants and St. Sandwiches, and they'll screech their heads off.

    (Not that I believe Germans are nazis. In fact, since leaving academe I've grown sizeable doubts about every bit of received wisdom on all that. I'm also starting to suspect that Bernays and his friends were peeved because Leni and Joe were better propagandists in the filmic media.)

    Blacks learned from the Chosenites how to play the role of the Biggest Victims in the History of Ever...even with the common meme of having once been slaves.

    I think we should put both races in a jar, telling one, yes, we believe all your We Were Slaves in Egypt stuff, and the other, yes, we believe all that You Built The Pyramids By Flying stuff, so were in charge of Egypt and all those slaves. Make some popcorn. Shake the jar. Sit back.

    We've been held hostage by these entities for long enough.

  2. Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing progeny, the Islamists … *stamps foot* … unacceptable! /sarc off

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing progeny, the Islamists

    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing ancestors, the Zionists.
  3. Opinion writer… I think one day there will be no straightforward reporters in newspapers or tv. Sabrina Rubin Erdely is probably opinion reporter. Will opinion forecasts replace weather forecasts?

  4. I would not say that an anti-immigration position today is ideological nearer to Nazism than an pro-immigration position. It is rather the opposite. Nazis hated clever jews, they even hated physics and medicine, because both had large contributions from jews. Thus they preferred some kind of dumb “folk-medicine” over good evidence-based medicine. They did not value high IQ and science. Same can be said about pro-immigration people today: science had no value for them, it is all about souls and feelings. Nazis were antisemitic but were bemused by western European “racism” towards people of color. Mainly because Nazis had very few experiences with colonialism. Nazis were social darwinist, they thought the strong should take “Lebensraum” and the weak should die. Quite similar to pro-immigration arguments today: Europeans are ridiculous and old from their point of view and should be replaced by fertile Africans, who just need the place. Nazis invented narratives of guilt and hidden intrigues. They thought the jews conspired against them and would hurt them in magical ways, that is why they were guilty in their eyes. Pro-immigration positions today also often rely on such narratives, like that racism somehow hurts people in subsaharan africa in an invisible way, so they are detained from developing their countries. They also invent huge guilt connections between colonialism and today. Nazis were socialists, same is true for most pro-immigration people. And last but not least anti-immigration people often like and respect jews and israel, especially the immigration policy of israel while pro-immigration guys are more often critical of israel.

  5. It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    • Replies: @Lex
    They were so Catholic that Catholics didn't want to vote on them:

    http://romanchristendom.blogspot.com/2008/10/face-it-protestant-areas-voted-for.html
    , @fnn
    You could easily look this stuff up before you spout off:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideology_of_the_SS#SS_versus_religion


    In the struggle for total control over German minds and bodies, the SS developed an anti-clerical agenda.[9] No chaplains were allowed in its units (although they were allowed in the regular army). Himmler established a special unit in the Sicherheitsdienst (SD) to identify and eliminate Catholic influences. The SS decided the German Catholic Church was a serious threat to its hegemony and while it was too strong to be abolished it had to be stripped of its influence, for example by closing its youth clubs and publications.[10]

    Himmler used the Jesuits as the model for the SS, since he found they had the core element absolute obedience and the cult of the organisation.[11] Hitler is also said to have called Himmler "my Ignatius of Loyola".[11] As an order, the SS needed a coherent doctrine that would set it apart. Himmler attempted to construct such an ideology, and to this purpose he deduced a "pseudo-Germanic tradition"[12] from history. In a 1936 memorandum, Himmler set forth a list of approved holidays based on pagan and political precedents meant to wean SS members from their reliance on Christian festivities. However, these attempts were not entirely successful. Historian Höhne observes that the "neo-pagan customs" Himmler introduced into the SS "...remained primarily a paper exercise".[13]

    Atheism was banned within the SS with all SS men being required to list themselves as Protestant, Catholic or "believer in God" (German: gottgläubig).[14] Atheism was outlawed within the SS as Himmler believed it to be a form of egotism that placed the individual at the center of the universe, and thus constituted a rejection of the SS principle of valuing the collective over the individual.[15]
     

    , @fnn
    Waffen SS runic graves in Russia:

    http://imagehost.epier.com/47593/516(5).jpg

    http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/attachments/history-research-third-reich-ww2/28201d1235128778-ss-grave-regulation-manual-ss-runic-birchwood-graves-resize.jpg
    , @Seth Largo
    I won't speak for the other Nazi elite, since I don't think their religious views are nearly as well documented, but no one can say "Hitler was a Christian" with a straight face:

    http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Adolf_Hitler

    It's pretty clear Christianity was for Hitler a tool for the Reich, nothing more, nothing less. There are also gems like this one:

    "You see, it's been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didn't we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion too would have been more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?"
    , @Sean

    Germans officially registered as Catholics, Protestants or Jews pay a religious tax of 8 or 9 percent of their annual tax bill. They can avoid this by declaring to their local tax office that they are leaving their faith community.
     
    Germans are deserting Catholicism in such numbers that its collapse in Germany is inevitable. Hitler didn't have any kids, neither did Chancellor Merkel or her predecessor. Even the members of Hitler's SS did not have more children than the average German so no ideology will raise the birth-rate. Currently a quarter of GERMAN MEN SAY THE IDEAL NUMBER OF CHILDREN IS ZERO.


    A relative married to an army officer lived in Germany DURING the 60's and 70's. The local women told her that they danced for joy when Germany surrendered. In Germany green energy and anti nuclear power has become received wisdom, which no one can really understand as it doesn't make economic sense. Of course it is basically a legacy from the Cold War and fear that the next war will be a nuclear war fought on German soil.. The anti-nuclear energy lobby is basically a female lobby. It's the old story of getting ready to fight the last war, and being ambushed by reality; the next war for Germany will never come. The demographic disaster is already underway and accelerating, between 2000 and 2013, Germany's birth rate dropped by 11 per cent. By 2060 the population of ethnic Germans will have fallen 19 per cent.

    As Gunnar Heinsohn persuasively argues, Hitler came to power because of a youth bulge, so you can bet that the politics under a youth deficit will be the opposite of Hitler. PEGIDA rallies are consistently outnumbered by counter-protests .

    , @Lex
    http://romanchristendom.blogspot.com/2008/10/face-it-protestant-areas-voted-for.html
    , @anonymous

    The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic
     
    As a prisoner Goering was extensively interviewed. One of his interviewers (story was in DailyMail couple years ago) wrote about it later. He queried him about his beliefs. Goering supposedly said that Jesus "was just another clever Jew".
    , @Anonymous
    Puh-Lease, Nazi ideology was explicitly Neo-Pagan. Christianity was viewed as a Jewish plot (not unreasonably, Jesus was a Jew) to weaken the Nordic numb nuts. Did they use public rhetoric that referenced Christian themes and try to coopt the Church in Germany to Nazi aims, to help nudge the masses along and keep them loyal? Yes. Were numerous leaders raised in various sects of Christianity? Of course, damn, Germany was a part of Christendom, what did you expect them to be raised as? But to assert that ethnically Catholic leaders were true believers and devout because of that is absurd. This is like believing that Obama is sincere in his electorally convenient Black Christianity just because he attended Wright's church. NO, its because he understood that to become authentically American Black, and to gain control of the black lumpen masses, he had to publicly show a little of that old time religion that birthed MLK, Reverand Jesse, Rev Al Shapton etc. It has worked well for him, and it worked well for the Nazi's, but it does not indicate a sincerity of belief, only a Machiavelian twist of rhetoric. Damn, what a clueless post.
    , @Anonymous

    It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.
     
    Ignatius Loyola? It's a Jesuit conspiracy! Even Chief Rabbi Israel Zolli was secretly Catholic and was later outed and forced to became Catholic.
    , @Chris
    Ah, a good old fashioned Catholic Church conspiracy theory.
    , @Hippopotamusdrome
    Catholics and the Nazi vote 1932
    Two interesting maps of Germany. On the first, the black areas are those with the highest concentration of Catholics according to the 1934 census:
    On the second map, the black areas show the highest concentration of Nazi votes in the 1932 election (white the lowest)
    , @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    , @rod1963
    The Nazis were socialists and competitors with the Communists for power. As for religion it was a tool for them, they had no qualms tossing Catholic nuns and priests into the death camps who broke the rules.

    As for Hitler, he openly despised Christianity(he considered it a religion for weaklings) and did plan to eradicate Catholicism when he had the opportunity. Also he admired Islam very much and considered it a warriors religion and was buddies the Mufti of Jerusalem.

    Many high ranked Nazis were occultists as well.
    , @bossel
    "Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic."

    Hitler was Catholic. Goebbels was born Catholic, but became Atheist. Himmler was born Catholic, but adhered to some pseudo-Germanic religion. Göring was Protestant, FWIK.
    , @Peter Akuleyev
    Most Nazis despised Christianity. That is hardly a "myth". Hitler's dislike of the Catholic Church is well documented. As a young Habsburg subject growing up in Austria, like many pan-German nationalists, Hitler saw the Catholic church as a foreign entity that catered to Slavic minorities and undermined the "natural" destiny of Germans to rule. Most 19th century and early 20th century German nationalists tended to favor Lutheranism as being a more truly German church. However, Hitler himself doesn't seem to have ever been particularly sympathetic to Lutheranism, which tended to be socially too liberal. Hitler was certainly no atheist, he believed apparently in some sort of divine Providence, but he was not a believing Christian in any meaningful sense of the word. Other Nazis were all over the map. A few were devout Christians, some were atheists, many, like Hitler, believed in a vague divine power of some sort, but not in Jesus, some of the more enthusiastic Nazis tried to restore pre-Christian German pagan beliefs, although Hitler himself thought neo-pagans were clowns. (For a German nationalist, Hitler himself seemed very uninterested in ancient Germanic culture. Nazi symbolism was mostly based on Roman or even Hindu (like the Swastika), not proto Germanic.) What liberals like to ignore is that Nazism was not very "conservative", in many ways it was a philosophy that was supposed to propel a backwards agrarian society, as Hitler saw it, ahead of the more advanced Anglo Saxon societies. In that sense Hitler was a lot like Stalin or Mao.
    , @Doug
    The arch-architect of Nazi ideology Alfred Rosenberg vehemently rejected traditional Christianity:

    "Rosenberg argued for a new "religion of the blood", based on the supposed innate promptings of the Nordic soul to defend its noble character against racial and cultural degeneration. He believed that this had been embodied in early Indo-European religions...He rejected Christianity for its universality, for its doctrine of original sin (at least for Germans whom he declared on one occasion were born noble), and for its teachings on the immortality of the soul.[26] Indeed, absorbing Christianity enfeebled a people.[27] Publicly, Rosenberg affected to deplore Christianity's degeneration owing to Jewish influence.[28] Following Chamberlain's ideas, he condemned what he called "negative Christianity" (the orthodox beliefs of Protestant and Catholic churches), arguing instead for a so-called "positive" Christianity[29][30]"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Rosenberg

    As the NSDAP became popular, they realized they couldn't win the broader German electorate while being explicitly anti-Christian:

    "Positive Christianity (German: Positives Christentum) was a movement within Nazi Germany which blended ideas of racial purity and Nazi ideology with elements of Christianity. Hitler included use of the term in Article 24[1] of the 1920 Nazi Party Platform, stating "the Party represents the standpoint of Positive Christianity". Non-denominational, the term could be variously interpreted, but allayed fears among Germany's Christian majority as to the expressed hostility towards the established churches of large sections of the Nazi movement.[2] In 1937, Hans Kerrl, the Nazi Minister for Church Affairs, explained "Positive Christianity" as not "dependent upon the Apostle's Creed", nor in "faith in Christ as the son of God", upon which Christianity relied...

    Positive Christianity differed from orthodox Christianity in that Positive Christianity:

    Rejected the Jewish-written parts of the Bible (including the entire Old Testament)
    Claimed "Aryanhood" and non-Jewishness for Christ
    Promoted the political objective of national unity, to overcome confessional differences, to eliminate Catholicism, and to unite Protestantism into a single unitary Positive Christian church[10]"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_Christianity

    "During the war Alfred Rosenberg formulated a thirty-point program for the National Reich Church, which included:

    The National Reich Church claims exclusive right and control over all Churches.
    The National Church is determined to exterminate foreign Christian faiths imported into Germany in the ill-omened year 800.
    The National Church demands immediate cessation of the publishing and dissemination of the Bible.
    The National Church will clear away from its altars all Crucifixes, Bibles and pictures of Saints.
    On the altars there must be nothing but Mein Kampf and to the left of the altar a sword.[38]"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Nazi_Germany#Denominational_trends_during_the_Nazi_period
    , @5371
    [Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola.]

    Whoosh!
    , @Art Deco
    It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists.
    --
    The Nazi's rejected Biblical religion. The 'myth' in question is your own confusion.
    , @Art Deco
    Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany
    --
    Your baptism is not invalidated by effective apostasy, but you seem to consider the Catholic Church some sort of ethnic configuration. It is not. It is perfectly irrelevant how many novenas Herman Goering's mother offered.
    , @Greenstalk

    The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic.
     
    Sorry to trip you up with annoying white mans logic, Caplan, but according to your way of thinking Communists were not "really atheists", but Jewish.
    , @Cagey Beast
    This post gets my vote for the Tar-Baby Award. Just look at all the people got caught in it. Look at all the people who'd rather speculate on Hitler's religious status than discuss the fact that the NYT plays host to a mainstream German journalist who regrets that soon there will be no more old people to star in the anti-Nazi show trials she has come to love.
    , @bp
    Are you sure that this so called Mark Caplan character isn't someone ( Derb ? ) having a laugh with a spot of mischievous bomb throwing ?

    I think that reasonably well known map of Germany showing the Nazi vote and the religion of the region shows that Nazism had it's least support in the majority Catholic regions of the country

  6. I am completely baffled by the need to prosecute someone in their 70’s and beyond for crimes committed in their early 20’s. There is no possible way you can depend on eyewitness accounts that far in the past. This is especially true when the witnesses are that old as well.

    Notice, the communists who killed millions more than the Nazis just aren’t as easy to understand and blame as evil. I guess the concept of everyone is equal or we will kill you is too difficult.

  7. > Yuri Slezkine explained… the religious significance of keeping Nazis viable

    Yes — but the excerpt clearly suggests an alternative course of action to transplanting elderly Nazi brains.

    Instead of deepening our zany, exclusive preoccupation with 1933-1945 as the only Golden Era of devil-prophets of this “universe presided over by Man”, us moderns could think of Nazis as archetypes.

    Surprisingly, it’s not that hard to find more modern, even ripped-from-the-headlines examples. Russian Gulag administrators. Pol Pot fanboys. Machete-wielding Africans. Great Leap Forward re-engineers of rural life.

    Nah… better to stick with the Nazis.

  8. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    They were so Catholic that Catholics didn’t want to vote on them:

    http://romanchristendom.blogspot.com/2008/10/face-it-protestant-areas-voted-for.html

  9. fnn says:
    @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    You could easily look this stuff up before you spout off:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideology_of_the_SS#SS_versus_religion

    In the struggle for total control over German minds and bodies, the SS developed an anti-clerical agenda.[9] No chaplains were allowed in its units (although they were allowed in the regular army). Himmler established a special unit in the Sicherheitsdienst (SD) to identify and eliminate Catholic influences. The SS decided the German Catholic Church was a serious threat to its hegemony and while it was too strong to be abolished it had to be stripped of its influence, for example by closing its youth clubs and publications.[10]

    Himmler used the Jesuits as the model for the SS, since he found they had the core element absolute obedience and the cult of the organisation.[11] Hitler is also said to have called Himmler “my Ignatius of Loyola”.[11] As an order, the SS needed a coherent doctrine that would set it apart. Himmler attempted to construct such an ideology, and to this purpose he deduced a “pseudo-Germanic tradition”[12] from history. In a 1936 memorandum, Himmler set forth a list of approved holidays based on pagan and political precedents meant to wean SS members from their reliance on Christian festivities. However, these attempts were not entirely successful. Historian Höhne observes that the “neo-pagan customs” Himmler introduced into the SS “…remained primarily a paper exercise”.[13]

    Atheism was banned within the SS with all SS men being required to list themselves as Protestant, Catholic or “believer in God” (German: gottgläubig).[14] Atheism was outlawed within the SS as Himmler believed it to be a form of egotism that placed the individual at the center of the universe, and thus constituted a rejection of the SS principle of valuing the collective over the individual.[15]

  10. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Waffen SS runic graves in Russia:

  11. @The Only Catholic Unionist
    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing progeny, the Islamists ... *stamps foot* ... unacceptable! /sarc off

    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing progeny, the Islamists

    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing ancestors, the Zionists.

    • Replies: @annamaria
    It is a sad irony of our times that an Israeli citizen has been financing neo-Nazis in Ukraine to fight a legitimate pro-federaists' movement.
    http://orientalreview.org/2014/05/14/bloodbath-in-odessa-guided-by-interim-rulers-of-ukraine/
    http://freeukrainenow.org/2015/04/27/the-key-man-behind-the-odessa-trade-unions-building-massacre-his-many-connections-to-the-white-house/
    The whole Ukrainian debacle is a gigantic slap in the faces of the still-living veterans of the WWII, considering that the US involvement led to a rise of the neo-Nazism in Ukraine up to a government level. A recent law enacted by Kiev elevates Ukrainian collaborators with Hitler's army to a level of freedom fighters:
    http://newcoldwar.org/interview-were-seeing-revival-of-nazism-fascism-in-ukraine/
    http://www.timesofisrael.com/thousands-march-to-honor-nazi-collaborator-in-kiev/
    http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-u-s-has-installed-a-neo-nazi-government-in-ukraine/5371554
  12. The holocaust was much more than a crime or a series of crimes against an an entire group of people. It was a system of hundreds of years of practice of PRESCRIPTIVE strereotyping which is practiced in order to elevate ones own dominant group to power status weath and control AND to reduce the other classes of people to inferiority to objects so that our oppression exploitation and even murder of them can be done with indifference casualness and even justification.

    Today this process is seen in continued blaming of Israel for its impossible situation, our oppression of black Americans and for us denying equal rights to women and gay people throughout the works cloaked in prescriptive stereotypes of religious freedom.

    Banality is an outcome NOT a cause of evil. Evil is allowing ourselves to become a part of this system of stereotyping and behavior

  13. Slezkine’s right.

    Hitler functions exactly as an anti-Christ for the Prog ruling caste.

    Where Christ once functioned as a lodestar guiding the character development of a hundred generations through his Imitation*, so now Hitler has replaced Him through the avoidance of anything that smacks of Hitlerism. Instead of the now hokey “what would Jesus do?” with the implication of seeking to do one’s best to do likewise, we now have “what would Hitler do?” and then doing the opposite.

    Only when it completely sinks in just how pathetic this is in both practice and effect will it pass from fashion. Either that or it’s widespread adoption by the great masses, making it hokey and freeing up the Imitation of Christ as an option again.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
    * - see:

    http://www.amazon.com/The-Imitation-Christ-Thomas-Kempis/dp/1613820364

    My copy was a gift from my (Presbyterian) pastor growing up, one of the finest men I've known; given to me as I left for seminary. It remains at my bedside.
  14. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    I won’t speak for the other Nazi elite, since I don’t think their religious views are nearly as well documented, but no one can say “Hitler was a Christian” with a straight face:

    http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Adolf_Hitler

    It’s pretty clear Christianity was for Hitler a tool for the Reich, nothing more, nothing less. There are also gems like this one:

    “You see, it’s been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didn’t we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion too would have been more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?”

  15. Bert says:

    World War II is now passing quickly into history. Most of the veterans of that conflict are dead and the ones that aren’t are bedridden or confined to nursing homes. The only world leaders from that era that are still in power are the Queen and Prince Philip, and that’s true only in the strictly technical sense.

    Some folks just can’t get over the idea that those old boogeymen are gone forever and never coming back.

  16. Sean says:
    @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Germans officially registered as Catholics, Protestants or Jews pay a religious tax of 8 or 9 percent of their annual tax bill. They can avoid this by declaring to their local tax office that they are leaving their faith community.

    Germans are deserting Catholicism in such numbers that its collapse in Germany is inevitable. Hitler didn’t have any kids, neither did Chancellor Merkel or her predecessor. Even the members of Hitler’s SS did not have more children than the average German so no ideology will raise the birth-rate. Currently a quarter of GERMAN MEN SAY THE IDEAL NUMBER OF CHILDREN IS ZERO.

    A relative married to an army officer lived in Germany DURING the 60’s and 70’s. The local women told her that they danced for joy when Germany surrendered. In Germany green energy and anti nuclear power has become received wisdom, which no one can really understand as it doesn’t make economic sense. Of course it is basically a legacy from the Cold War and fear that the next war will be a nuclear war fought on German soil.. The anti-nuclear energy lobby is basically a female lobby. It’s the old story of getting ready to fight the last war, and being ambushed by reality; the next war for Germany will never come. The demographic disaster is already underway and accelerating, between 2000 and 2013, Germany’s birth rate dropped by 11 per cent. By 2060 the population of ethnic Germans will have fallen 19 per cent.

    As Gunnar Heinsohn persuasively argues, Hitler came to power because of a youth bulge, so you can bet that the politics under a youth deficit will be the opposite of Hitler. PEGIDA rallies are consistently outnumbered by counter-protests .

  17. “Not to worry. ”

    Recently there was a holocaust workshop around here so teachers and the like could “learn” how to teach the holocaust. They have just about run out of actual people that were actually survivors, just like they are running out of actual Nazis to drag out.

    So the touring speaker that was featured in this struggle session was someone whose mother was in a camp and she was born later. And I doubt if anyone actually would vet this person to check the veracity of the claim. Anyone that looks authentic and rents a copy of Schindler’s List can make the claim to survivorship and travel around getting paid, however tenuous the connection, and lecture naive white teachers who wouldn’t know Minsk from Pinsk.

    “My mother who was born by my grandfathers third and much younger wife and he was a child cello prodigy who survived the camps because he could play Wagner at 3”. So not to worry. This can go on for quite a while.

  18. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.
  19. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic

    As a prisoner Goering was extensively interviewed. One of his interviewers (story was in DailyMail couple years ago) wrote about it later. He queried him about his beliefs. Goering supposedly said that Jesus “was just another clever Jew”.

  20. Well Ratzinger can’t be too busy these days.

  21. The “accountant of Aushwitz”. What’s next? Otto Auto, the ” mechanic of Aushwitz”? Or Deiter Ditz, the “deliveryboy of Aushwitz”?

    • Replies: @Jake grant
    How about the swimming pool attendant of Auschwitz
    , @Bill P
    How about Himmel Mannerheim, the rapist, womanizing Auschwitz lifeguard?
  22. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Puh-Lease, Nazi ideology was explicitly Neo-Pagan. Christianity was viewed as a Jewish plot (not unreasonably, Jesus was a Jew) to weaken the Nordic numb nuts. Did they use public rhetoric that referenced Christian themes and try to coopt the Church in Germany to Nazi aims, to help nudge the masses along and keep them loyal? Yes. Were numerous leaders raised in various sects of Christianity? Of course, damn, Germany was a part of Christendom, what did you expect them to be raised as? But to assert that ethnically Catholic leaders were true believers and devout because of that is absurd. This is like believing that Obama is sincere in his electorally convenient Black Christianity just because he attended Wright’s church. NO, its because he understood that to become authentically American Black, and to gain control of the black lumpen masses, he had to publicly show a little of that old time religion that birthed MLK, Reverand Jesse, Rev Al Shapton etc. It has worked well for him, and it worked well for the Nazi’s, but it does not indicate a sincerity of belief, only a Machiavelian twist of rhetoric. Damn, what a clueless post.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    Damn, what a clueless post.
     
    Mr Caplan probably thinks they were straight, too. After all, their parents were!
  23. That’s a really interesting chain of logic. Our grandfathers murdered millions of people therefore we should allow millions of third world barbarians into our country?!? Uh, okay…

  24. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Ignatius Loyola? It’s a Jesuit conspiracy! Even Chief Rabbi Israel Zolli was secretly Catholic and was later outed and forced to became Catholic.

  25. Aren’t pictures of Auschwitz itself good enough to guilt us all into letting the whole world flood in?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Aren’t pictures of Auschwitz itself good enough to guilt us all into letting the whole world flood in?

    Which pictures of Auschwitz are you referring to?
    , @Lurker
    Recently the Daily Mail had a photo of well fed children in Auschwitz, liberated by Russians. Including babes in arms. The babies themselves undermine the narrative.

    Another article - Mengele we are informed inspected every new arrival to the camp. How many people were sent to Auschwitz again?

    Its so hard to keep track given that certain facts are allowed to change freely.
  26. From 1992 to 2002, I made most of my living by translating documents for the US Justice Department’s Office of Special Investigations, the organization that deports former collaborators of Nazi Germany. I was not an OSI staff member, but I worked for a private company that had a contract to translate documents.

    I translated many verdicts from trials of German citizens who had worked in concentration camps. Such defendants could not be convicted merely for having worked in a camp. Rather, the evidence had to prove that they actually had abused, injured or killed particular inmates.

    Furthermore, the defense could offer various mitigating considerations. The defense could not say merely that the defendant had followed orders. However, the defense could point out the defendant’s low education and position, basically good character, the incidents’ circumstances, and other such mitigating considerations.

    The judges summarized all the evidence and mitigating considerations in rather long verdicts — a dozen or many more pages. I translated many such verdicts. As I remember, most of them were from trials in the 1960s and 1970s, much more than a decade after the War.

    Although many people complain that the defendants of such trials were punished only leniently or not at all, I grew to appreciate the wisdom of the restraint and limitations of such legal proceedings. These defendants were prosecuted and judged properly. Even if they were acquitted, the facts of their wartime activities were revealed publicly.

    The recent and current trials of very old men who were very young guards and clerks during the war are the work of zealots in the German legal system. These defendants are being convicted for merely working in the concentration camps, not for committing any actual, particular crimes.

    Also, some people still make their livings by maintaining and providing all the documents of Nazi atrocities. These people have to justify their organizations’ budgets to the German tax-payers.

    We see this same zealotry in the USA too. OSI deported John Demjanjuk to Germany to stand trial and be convicted at one of those kangaroo-court trials. OSI still is trying to prosecute deport extremely old men, more than 90 years old. Politicians now are trying to terminate those old men’s Social Security benefits. There is no evidence that any of those old men hurt any particular inmates in those camps.

    ———

    I do think that Demjanjuk served in a concentration camp and lied about it when he immigrated to the USA. He was guilty of fraudulent immigration and therefore basically was deported from the USA legally and correctly.

    ———

    At one point in the OSI’s prosecution of John Demjanjuk, he was deported to Israel to stand trial on charges of mass murder. Supposedly, Denjanjuk really had been a notorious Ukrainian guard called “Ivan the Terrible”, who had chased Jews into the Treblinka gas chambers and then dropped the poison into the rooms. The OSI assembled all the evidence and sent it to Israel along with Demjanuk.

    An Israeli lawyer named Yoram Sheftel was assigned to defend Demjanjuk, and so Sheftel immediately became the most hated person in all Israel. In an amazing turn of events, however, Sheftel defended Demjanjuk and won a complete acquittal. The trial lasted from November 1986 to April 1988 and ended with a conviction and death sentence for Demjanjuk.

    Sheftel appealed to the Israeli Supreme Court, which in February 1998 overturned the conviction completely. The acquittal was not based on any legal loopholes. Rather Sheftel convinced the Supreme Court — and also practically the entire public — that Demjanjuk should be acquitted on the facts. The evidence proved actually that Demjanjuk was not the so-called Ivan the Terrible and had never even stepped foot inside of the Treblinka camp.

    Sheftel later wrote a book about the trial, titled The Demjanjuk Affair: The Rise and Fall of a Show-Trial, published in 1994. It is a terrific book, especially for people who like to read stories about gritty lawyers who defend “obviously guilty” defendants and thus expose social injustice. It’s like a John Grisham novel, but it’s a true story, stranger than fiction.

    • Replies: @Mike Sylwester

    Sheftel appealed to the Israeli Supreme Court, which in February 1998 overturned the conviction completely.
     
    ... which in July 1993 overturned the conviction completely.
  27. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Ah, a good old fashioned Catholic Church conspiracy theory.

  28. @countenance
    Aren't pictures of Auschwitz itself good enough to guilt us all into letting the whole world flood in?

    Aren’t pictures of Auschwitz itself good enough to guilt us all into letting the whole world flood in?

    Which pictures of Auschwitz are you referring to?

  29. Yeah, soon they’ll need to dig them out of their graves and stage mock executions with their remains to keep interest alive.

  30. Hitler will be always the enemy because him and NS Germany came the closest to defeat the NWO.

  31. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Catholics and the Nazi vote 1932
    Two interesting maps of Germany. On the first, the black areas are those with the highest concentration of Catholics according to the 1934 census:
    On the second map, the black areas show the highest concentration of Nazi votes in the 1932 election (white the lowest)

    • Replies: @SFG
    My understanding is that the Catholics thought Hitler wanted to replace God with himself, which doesn't seem too far off. After all, they replaced 'Gruss Gott' with 'Heil Hitler'.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    Catholics and the Nazi vote 1932

     

    Like FDR the same year (and thrice again), Hitler was most strongly opposed by the very kind of people who produced him:

    Yankees and the Democrat vote 1932

  32. I wrote the other day about how we are running out of Nazis to prosecute: http://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=4345

    My pet theory as to why American Progressives obsess over Nazis so much is they see their reflection when they look at that period. In the 30’s and 40’s, the American Left jumped on anti-fascism for practical reasons, but also for deeper psychological reasons. American Progressives were enamored with Mussolini in the 20’s and early 30’s. Like reformed smokers, they decided the only way to erase that stain from their psyche was to lecture everyone about the evils of fascism.

    Ironically, Progressives are right back to where they started. The Cult of Modern Liberalism is about as a close as we have come to having a genuine fascist party in this country. They’re even starting to hate Jews, starting with Israel.

  33. That Sauerbrey article was painful to read, unfortunately she’s typical of a not insignificant portion of Germans who’ve made Nazism the negative foundation myth for their multiculti, pro-immigration world view.
    Sometimes I wonder about Germans, so good at science, technology etc., but utterly spineless and conformist in their political views, always mindlessly following the currently dominant dogma (in that regard that Sauerbrey woman – and wow, is she ugly! – is more like her grandparents than she thinks). In some ways they really are pretty worthless and despicable.

  34. HA says:
    @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    “It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists.”

    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the “I was raised Catholic” clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don’t need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it’s a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I’ll let you deal with it. I’m sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don’t expect any agreement from those who aren’t already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn’t make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God — assuming he believed in anything.

    • Replies: @Eustace Tilley (not)
    "(On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.)"

    Let me attempt to satisfy your curiosity, good Father HA. Judaism is not a religion. It is an evolutionary survival strategy of a Tribe (or "ethnicity", if you will) of ancient Near Eastern/Mediterranean people. It is the public mask worn by this Tribe; how it presents itself to other ethnicities. It is the mythic glue which provides a transcendant ideology to help hold the Tribe together.

    The Nazis did the Tribe a big favor in this respect: they revitalized the mythical structure of the Tribe, infusing it with new energy and writing for it a new quasi-Biblical book: "The Lamentations of Israel". The Tribe, almost on the verge of disintegration via assimilation due to the sunny liberalism of Goethe and Moses Mendelssohn ("a German of the Hebraic persuasion"), has been given a new set of Bad Guys to replace the Egyptians and Babylonians straight out of the poetic imagination, complete with torchlight parades, black death's head caps and barbed-wire-ringed Circles of Hell straight out of Dante's Inferno.

    Judaism is not a religion because it does not offer (nor does it even pretend to offer) what true religion offers: the salvation of the soul, however that be expressed (the Upanishads call it the liberation of the "atman", for example). Gandhi blessed his assassin because he had given Gandhi what he wanted: "mukti" or liberation from the wheel of life and death. Such a "spiritual" attitude is quite foreign to Judaism, which, judging by its "Holy Book" (insert laugh track here) seems fixated upon blood, geneology, legitimacy and lineage, patriarchy, tribalism, taboo, and legalisms of the most bizarre sorts.
    , @Rob McX
    @Mark Kaplan, HA

    As I remember it, Airey Neave's book on the main Nuremberg Trial tells us that all but two - Goering and Rosenberg - of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed.

    , @Jack D
    So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to "the Jews"). Got it. No double standards here.
    , @HA
    One other related note on this is w.r.t. the Armenian genocide. At the time, it would have been wrong to claim it as an example of Islamic barbarity. Yes, the Kurdish henchmen who took part, and no doubt even some of the Young Turks who instigated it were Muslims and viewed what they did as being in perfect accordance with their faith, but claiming that Attaturk was acting as a soldier of Islam, given his overall programme, is ridiculous.

    However, given that Islamists like Erdogan are currently the primary whitewashers of that historical episode, the issue is now paradoxically becoming a Muslim cause to the extent that it was not before.

    , @Laura
    "when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic."

    The Catholic Church would disagree with you on that one. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul. Also confirmation. It is possible for a former Catholic to lose the rights and duties of a Catholic under canon law if he formally leaves the church, but just ceasing to believe is not enough. And an ex Catholic is still a Christian.

    Now if you want to deny that people who are messing around with neopaganism are Catholic in the sociological sense, you're certainly free to do that.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    On that point [genuine faith being unnecessary for Jewish identity], both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.
     
    Both also attribute the Führer's celibacy to the intensity of his devotion to the cause, rather than to more believable factors such as perversion or impotence.
  35. There’s no business like Shoah business.

  36. Crassus [AKA "Ergot"] says:

    We ought to pay the Russian surgeons do human head transplantation on old Germans and also our homegrown emblems of evil, like Officer Wilson. Wilson could get capital punishment — in that he would be decapitated — and then he could live forever in stockades, as a lesson to all future generations. Win win!

    I suspect the Russians won’t reattach anybody’s spinal cord, which would be a blessing for justice: Freddie Grey’s arresting officers would live eternally with severed spines. It would be like a vision of Hell from Dante.

    The best of all possible Hells.

  37. … in a bizarre way, we will miss them when they’re gone. …

    Will the same be written when the last WASPs are hiding in the mountains of Montana?

  38. @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    “(On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.)”

    Let me attempt to satisfy your curiosity, good Father HA. Judaism is not a religion. It is an evolutionary survival strategy of a Tribe (or “ethnicity”, if you will) of ancient Near Eastern/Mediterranean people. It is the public mask worn by this Tribe; how it presents itself to other ethnicities. It is the mythic glue which provides a transcendant ideology to help hold the Tribe together.

    The Nazis did the Tribe a big favor in this respect: they revitalized the mythical structure of the Tribe, infusing it with new energy and writing for it a new quasi-Biblical book: “The Lamentations of Israel”. The Tribe, almost on the verge of disintegration via assimilation due to the sunny liberalism of Goethe and Moses Mendelssohn (“a German of the Hebraic persuasion”), has been given a new set of Bad Guys to replace the Egyptians and Babylonians straight out of the poetic imagination, complete with torchlight parades, black death’s head caps and barbed-wire-ringed Circles of Hell straight out of Dante’s Inferno.

    Judaism is not a religion because it does not offer (nor does it even pretend to offer) what true religion offers: the salvation of the soul, however that be expressed (the Upanishads call it the liberation of the “atman”, for example). Gandhi blessed his assassin because he had given Gandhi what he wanted: “mukti” or liberation from the wheel of life and death. Such a “spiritual” attitude is quite foreign to Judaism, which, judging by its “Holy Book” (insert laugh track here) seems fixated upon blood, geneology, legitimacy and lineage, patriarchy, tribalism, taboo, and legalisms of the most bizarre sorts.

  39. @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    @Mark Kaplan, HA

    As I remember it, Airey Neave’s book on the main Nuremberg Trial tells us that all but two – Goering and Rosenberg – of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed.

    • Replies: @Anonymous Nephew
    "all but two – Goering and Rosenberg – of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed"

    I'm not sure that means Christianity informed their words and actions in power. They would have been raised in Christian culture in childhood, and in the condemned cell I can see the comfort of the ritual they were raised with. No atheists in foxholes and few on Death Row?

    I read of conflicts where badly wounded soldiers, slowly dying in no mans land, call out for their mothers. I'm not sure you can conclude that makes them "mummy's boys".

    @Mark Kaplan - are you familiar with Hitler's reported statement (by Speer) that "the Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?"
    , @Art Deco
    Stalin supposedly made his confession to an Orthodox priest at a low point during the 2d World War. Funny how the prospect of death can concentrate the mind.
  40. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    The Nazis were socialists and competitors with the Communists for power. As for religion it was a tool for them, they had no qualms tossing Catholic nuns and priests into the death camps who broke the rules.

    As for Hitler, he openly despised Christianity(he considered it a religion for weaklings) and did plan to eradicate Catholicism when he had the opportunity. Also he admired Islam very much and considered it a warriors religion and was buddies the Mufti of Jerusalem.

    Many high ranked Nazis were occultists as well.

  41. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factor"] says:

    “Or, Germany should launch a Manhattan Project to download elderly Nazi brains to computers so the world will never run out of Nazis to prosecute.”

    Don’t need to. According to Jews like Sabrina Rubin Erdely, every white male is a crypto-nazi rapist.

  42. @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to “the Jews”). Got it. No double standards here.

    • Replies: @iSteveFan

    So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to “the Jews”). Got it. No double standards here.
     
    Group guilt to a large extent is determined by the victim's frame of reference. If the victim is an Orthodox Slav and the person abusing him is a non-practicing Catholic Slav, then I assume the Catholic component is going to be key. After all the Orthodox Slav is not going to condemn all Slavs when the fault is clearly only with those Slavs who are, or were, Catholics.

    If both are Orthodox Slavs, then the abuser's communist affiliation will draw the ire of the victim.

    If the victim is an Orthodox Slav and the abuser is a non-practicing Catholic German, then I assume Germans are going to take blame.

    Likewise if a Jew, religious or not, is abusing any other ethnic group, Jews are going to take the blame.
    , @HA
    "So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents..."

    Put away your straw man. Unlike Mark Caplan, I'm not here to tar anyone, so do try and deal with what I actually said. I only point out that Christianity is about beliefs (and given the grace/works brouhaha, the extent to which beliefs without corresponding actions are worth anything). In the case of Judaism, not so much.

    If that's a double standard, then it is one that both religions seem to have accepted quite apart from any blame game about Komissars or kapos.

    In Catholicism, for example, one is called on to recite a creed (over which wars were fought and global schisms arose) and to repeat it every single week, because it's that important. With other religions, the notion of what one believes doesn't enter into the equation in the same way. As long as someone recites the Shahada a single time, and upholds the 5 pillars of Islam, he is considered a better Muslim (according to many, if not most scholars) than someone who believes that all of that is true but fails to go through the motions. You can call that a double standard, but it just demonstrates that you're the one with an axe to grind.

    Moreover, it's one thing to claim "Catholic points" for, say, the many comedians who are ex-Catholics, given that Catholicism and humor are hardly in opposition. Trying to blame or partly-blame Catholicism for, say, wiping out a third of European Jewry at a time when so many Catholics fought and died in opposition to those responsible for that, is quite another.

    Now, if ever you see me trying to play the game of claiming that Lenin's quarter-Jewish background was responsible for his career (as one commenter on this tried to do some months ago), that is the time for you to go ahead accuse me of a double standard, and indeed, of outright lunacy, but don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen.

  43. What Anna Sauerbrey is worried about is that the Jews won’t be able to guilt trip the German goy anymore over what happened in Nazi Germany in a few more years nor will Jews be able to exploit their special status as the sole victims of the Germans.

    Her solution is what I expect out of Jews on a suicide trip, import more Muslims who will be in a short time a powerful minority that will do as it pleases and one of the first things it will do is kill or expel Jews from Germany – they will finish what the Nazis started.

    France and Britain are in the same pickle. There are some places in London and other cities were local pols cannot get elected without Muslim voter approval. In France, Hollande depends on Muslim support rather than Jewish support. That will eventually spell the death knell of Jews.

    Give them 5-10 years. It could happen sooner though.

    That said, I’ve read plenty accounts of superior Jewish IQ’s. Maybe it’s true, maybe it’s not. What I do know is that the Jews are rapidly cutting their own throat by supporting groups and causes that are eradicating the only thing standing between them and ethnic cleansing – whites. Look no one else cares about their Holocaust or their supposed special status. The blacks don’t(many of them don’t like Jews at all), neither do Hispanics and the Muslims just want them all dead. For a people so good at making money and obtaining political power they’re sure doing a good job at painting themselves into a fatal corner.

    • Replies: @Anonymous Nephew
    "import more Muslims who will be in a short time a powerful minority that will do as it pleases and one of the first things it will do is kill or expel Jews from Germany"

    I'm not so sure. Jews have managed to survive (and often thrive) for centuries in otherwise monoethnic, monoreligious countries where they were objects of dislike (if not hatred). Surely it'll be easier to survive and thrive, say, with a 50/50 ethnic German/Muslim mix or an even more mixed society. Divide et impera ?

    And if the Muslims play up badly (bombs, riots etc) and become objects of dislike (if not hatred) to the ethnic Germans, well at least they won't be hating on the Jews. There's an extra bonus - ethnic Germans will be less likely to care when bad things happen to Palestinians.
    , @SFG
    There's this obsession with remembering the Holocaust. I think it gives them an excuse to say they're still victims and salves their liberal consciences which feel guilty living in the best places in and around New York, LA, and Miami.

    And yeah, they'll import lots of brownies (pun intended) and get themselves killed.

    I don't care, I'm marrying a shiksa (you really expect me to marry that feminist Scheisse?), and within a few generations my mother's identity will be a forgotten footnote.

  44. Whiskey says: • Website

    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims. Like Dieudonne M’bala M’bala. Inventer of the soft-Nazi salute, the Quenelle. THEY hate Jews as muich as old Adolf.

    Letting lots of Africans in is letting lots of poor Black Nazis into Europe. A bad idea. The lesson of Nazism is to always, always, always be armed and have as much military power as your state can buy, and act BEFORE a threat gets too big. The lesson of Hitler is quash an insane, grandiose, Roman Empire revivalist with slave empire ambitions before he can seize and re-arm an industrial nation. Pretty simple.

    • Replies: @iSteveFan

    The lesson of Hitler is quash an insane, grandiose, Roman Empire revivalist with slave empire ambitions before he can seize and re-arm an industrial nation. Pretty simple.
     
    Right Whiskey. And the way to do that is to import millions and millions of dissimilar peoples into a nation to water down and change the demographics so as to make it impossible for such a leader or movement to ever come about.

    Letting lots of Africans in is letting lots of poor Black Nazis into Europe. A bad idea.
     
    That is actually a feature not a bug of the efforts described above.

    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims.
     
    Actually, they are not Nazis. They are there to prevent the revival of real Nazis.
  45. iSteveFan says:
    @Jack D
    So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to "the Jews"). Got it. No double standards here.

    So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to “the Jews”). Got it. No double standards here.

    Group guilt to a large extent is determined by the victim’s frame of reference. If the victim is an Orthodox Slav and the person abusing him is a non-practicing Catholic Slav, then I assume the Catholic component is going to be key. After all the Orthodox Slav is not going to condemn all Slavs when the fault is clearly only with those Slavs who are, or were, Catholics.

    If both are Orthodox Slavs, then the abuser’s communist affiliation will draw the ire of the victim.

    If the victim is an Orthodox Slav and the abuser is a non-practicing Catholic German, then I assume Germans are going to take blame.

    Likewise if a Jew, religious or not, is abusing any other ethnic group, Jews are going to take the blame.

  46. An alternative theory is once a bureaucracy exists and is paying salaries and accruing pension benefits it is impossible to shut down. Shutting it down is about as easy as shutting useless military bases or ending a useless weapons program, or ending a benefit of the welfare state. War on Nazis, poverty, drugs, Cancer, IslamoTerrorWhatsIts, … it goes on forever.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    You can't shut it down but you can repurpose it. After polio was cured, the March of Dimes did not (as you say) shut down, but it was repurposed to cure birth defects or multiple scleroris or something (preferably something incurable so it would never need to be repurposed again). So the War on Nazis can be repurposed for good (the War on Islamo-fascists) or for evil (the War on White Men who sorta Look Like Nazis). Just because the bureaucracy gets repurposed doesn't answer the question. Each side will seek to seize the banner of anti-Nazism and carry it forward into the future. (BTW, the struggle is never over - the Republicans packaged themselves as the party that freed the blacks and that worked for 100 years after the Civil War but then the Democrats re-packaged themselves as the party that gives free stuff to blacks IN THE PRESENT and that worked even better - politics is all about what have you done for me LATELY). I'd say the anti-white side is winning so far.
    , @Art Deco
    An alternative theory is once a bureaucracy exists and is paying salaries and accruing pension benefits it is impossible to shut down. Shutting it down is about as easy as shutting useless military bases or ending a useless weapons program, or ending a benefit of the welfare state. War on Nazis, poverty, drugs, Cancer, IslamoTerrorWhatsIts, … it goes on forever.
    --
    The theory's kinda dumb. Military spending as a share of domestic product has varied wildly according to external circumstances since 1940 and the military itself has suffered several major shakeouts. There actually was a government commission assigned to close military bases because Congress was so hopeless at it. Only modest sums are spent controlling the drug trade and the vast bulk of the manpower could be reassigned to other sorts of policing. Medical research is pretty open-ended.
  47. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factor"] says:

    http://wchildblog.com/2015/04/30/truth-has-been-murdered/

    Even Nazis are cool if they serve the Zio-globalist cause, esp against Russia.

  48. I just found out that The Prussian Blue girls have given up their racist politics and become, in their words, more liberal. This happened after they started smoking pot. Nazis are not a reliable object of hate anymore.

    • Replies: @Ivy
    How about the St. Pauli Girls? They always seemed so wholesome.
  49. HA says:
    @Jack D
    So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to "the Jews"). Got it. No double standards here.

    “So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents…”

    Put away your straw man. Unlike Mark Caplan, I’m not here to tar anyone, so do try and deal with what I actually said. I only point out that Christianity is about beliefs (and given the grace/works brouhaha, the extent to which beliefs without corresponding actions are worth anything). In the case of Judaism, not so much.

    If that’s a double standard, then it is one that both religions seem to have accepted quite apart from any blame game about Komissars or kapos.

    In Catholicism, for example, one is called on to recite a creed (over which wars were fought and global schisms arose) and to repeat it every single week, because it’s that important. With other religions, the notion of what one believes doesn’t enter into the equation in the same way. As long as someone recites the Shahada a single time, and upholds the 5 pillars of Islam, he is considered a better Muslim (according to many, if not most scholars) than someone who believes that all of that is true but fails to go through the motions. You can call that a double standard, but it just demonstrates that you’re the one with an axe to grind.

    Moreover, it’s one thing to claim “Catholic points” for, say, the many comedians who are ex-Catholics, given that Catholicism and humor are hardly in opposition. Trying to blame or partly-blame Catholicism for, say, wiping out a third of European Jewry at a time when so many Catholics fought and died in opposition to those responsible for that, is quite another.

    Now, if ever you see me trying to play the game of claiming that Lenin’s quarter-Jewish background was responsible for his career (as one commenter on this tried to do some months ago), that is the time for you to go ahead accuse me of a double standard, and indeed, of outright lunacy, but don’t hold your breath waiting for that to happen.

  50. HA says:
    @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    One other related note on this is w.r.t. the Armenian genocide. At the time, it would have been wrong to claim it as an example of Islamic barbarity. Yes, the Kurdish henchmen who took part, and no doubt even some of the Young Turks who instigated it were Muslims and viewed what they did as being in perfect accordance with their faith, but claiming that Attaturk was acting as a soldier of Islam, given his overall programme, is ridiculous.

    However, given that Islamists like Erdogan are currently the primary whitewashers of that historical episode, the issue is now paradoxically becoming a Muslim cause to the extent that it was not before.

  51. Laura says:
    @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    “when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic.”

    The Catholic Church would disagree with you on that one. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul. Also confirmation. It is possible for a former Catholic to lose the rights and duties of a Catholic under canon law if he formally leaves the church, but just ceasing to believe is not enough. And an ex Catholic is still a Christian.

    Now if you want to deny that people who are messing around with neopaganism are Catholic in the sociological sense, you’re certainly free to do that.

    • Replies: @HA
    "Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul."

    Yes, and a priest is a priest forever, by order of Melchizedek. I get it. What Mark Caplan was asking about was why Hitler and Nazism were considered atheistic, which is clearly a question of beliefs, not of whether those responsible had ever been baptized, or what Catholic doctrine has to say about the consequences.

    I know all about the "once a Catholic..." line, but face it, when someone tells you "I'm an atheist Catholic", feel free to assume he thinks he's some kind of special flower, and to inform him that the correct term is "ex-Catholic", baptism or not.

    However, if someone tells you he's an atheist Jew, well, it's not that big a deal. In Judaism, ethnicity and religion coincide to an extent that they do not with Christianity (and since I mentioned Ron Unz's comments on Bolshevism, I should also note that he was clearly referring to ethnicity, given that he was not only measuring it by surnames, but also considering it primarily in the context of positive achievements, i.e., math skills.).

    Anyway, if that's a double standard, it's not the Christians who are solely responsible. If Jack D wants to decree that only those Jews holding to certain beliefs and obeying certain rituals are actually Jews, and no one else is, and all the credit/blame for Bolshevism and those Nobel Prizes is henceforth to be divvied up on that metric alone, his main opponents in that fight are going to be other Jews, or those who insist on calling themselves such.

    , @Chris
    True. But this falls into the "of those who are given more, more is expected". The Last Day will be a bit of a challenge for apostates.
    , @HA
    "The Catholic Church would disagree with you [that when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic]. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul."

    More to the point, one might also ask what the Nazis themselves believed about that. There is the case of Edith Stein, who was not only baptized, but a nun, for crying out loud. But to the Nazis, she was still just a Jew, and whatever mark she had by virtue of her baptism was apparently insufficient to cleanse her from the indelible taint of Judaism (a doctrine that more likely came from Darwin than from some catechism, though I'm not blaming Charles Darwin for the Nazis, either).

    I wonder what did Hitler's little Ignatius had to say about that?
  52. Anonymous • Disclaimer says: • Website

    Judge the Left by their total lack of contrition regarding the untold tens of millions exterminated by them in the 20th century.

    That is where the rubber meets the road.

    The culture war is always and forever about steering the world away from the long history of left-wing, internationalist murder. Lenin, Stalin, Mao etc were 1. Unclear on their own concepts 2. Inept 3. Full of good intentions.

    >>>Marxism gave no clear answer; Leninism did not foresee a massive regeneration of the exterminated enemies; and Stalin’s willing executioners were never quite sure why they were executing some people and not others.<<<

  53. It’s worth doing an image search using the authoress’ name. Anna Sauerbrey looks like the stereotypical Little Miss Bossyboots and teacher’s pet. She’s a “good German” I suppose; a good little German making a living in America’s empire 70yrs after the Allies shook hands at the Elbe. Why does it seem like the Germans who ended up in the East Bloc are poorer but less mindf****ed? Ms. Sauerbrey herself provides an answer for that in an earlier NYT article:

    Though Pegida has drawn support in western Germany, it is strongest in the former East Germany. In the East, xenophobic attitudes are still more common than in the West, for a complex mix of reasons, including higher unemployment rates, but also because of feelings of inferiority.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/23/opinion/what-does-pegida-say-about-germany.html?_r=0

  54. “Polynices says:

    That’s a really interesting chain of logic. Our grandfathers murdered millions of people therefore we should allow millions of third world barbarians into our country?!? Uh, okay…”

    That chain even goes this far: Our grandfathers fought a war to stop a regime that murdered millions of people, therefore we should allow millions of third-world barbarians into our country.

  55. “We must find a new narrative”

    The Left’s new slogan.

  56. “Nazism … defined evil clearly, consistently, and scientifically. ”

    “Evil” is a wonderfully convenient word. It exempts you from the moral imperative of trying to understand that which you have labeled evil. When it’s decided that something is evil, all serious investigation of it ceases. So evil is very freeing, in that sense.

  57. “Or clone old Nazis. Wasn’t there a movie about that?”

    Or Nazi dinosaurs. There was also a movie about that:

    The Time Masheen

  58. HA says:
    @Laura
    "when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic."

    The Catholic Church would disagree with you on that one. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul. Also confirmation. It is possible for a former Catholic to lose the rights and duties of a Catholic under canon law if he formally leaves the church, but just ceasing to believe is not enough. And an ex Catholic is still a Christian.

    Now if you want to deny that people who are messing around with neopaganism are Catholic in the sociological sense, you're certainly free to do that.

    “Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul.”

    Yes, and a priest is a priest forever, by order of Melchizedek. I get it. What Mark Caplan was asking about was why Hitler and Nazism were considered atheistic, which is clearly a question of beliefs, not of whether those responsible had ever been baptized, or what Catholic doctrine has to say about the consequences.

    I know all about the “once a Catholic…” line, but face it, when someone tells you “I’m an atheist Catholic”, feel free to assume he thinks he’s some kind of special flower, and to inform him that the correct term is “ex-Catholic”, baptism or not.

    However, if someone tells you he’s an atheist Jew, well, it’s not that big a deal. In Judaism, ethnicity and religion coincide to an extent that they do not with Christianity (and since I mentioned Ron Unz’s comments on Bolshevism, I should also note that he was clearly referring to ethnicity, given that he was not only measuring it by surnames, but also considering it primarily in the context of positive achievements, i.e., math skills.).

    Anyway, if that’s a double standard, it’s not the Christians who are solely responsible. If Jack D wants to decree that only those Jews holding to certain beliefs and obeying certain rituals are actually Jews, and no one else is, and all the credit/blame for Bolshevism and those Nobel Prizes is henceforth to be divvied up on that metric alone, his main opponents in that fight are going to be other Jews, or those who insist on calling themselves such.

    • Replies: @SFG
    Victory has a thousand fathers, defeat is an orphan. Look at the way everyone who's a quarter Irish calls themselves Irish-American.

    Einstein on relativity:

    By an application of the theory of relativity to the taste of readers, today in Germany I am called a German man of science, and in England I am represented as a Swiss Jew. If I come to be represented as a bête noire, the descriptions will be reversed, and I shall become a Swiss Jew for the Germans and a German man of science for the English!
  59. @Mike Sylwester
    From 1992 to 2002, I made most of my living by translating documents for the US Justice Department's Office of Special Investigations, the organization that deports former collaborators of Nazi Germany. I was not an OSI staff member, but I worked for a private company that had a contract to translate documents.

    I translated many verdicts from trials of German citizens who had worked in concentration camps. Such defendants could not be convicted merely for having worked in a camp. Rather, the evidence had to prove that they actually had abused, injured or killed particular inmates.

    Furthermore, the defense could offer various mitigating considerations. The defense could not say merely that the defendant had followed orders. However, the defense could point out the defendant's low education and position, basically good character, the incidents' circumstances, and other such mitigating considerations.

    The judges summarized all the evidence and mitigating considerations in rather long verdicts -- a dozen or many more pages. I translated many such verdicts. As I remember, most of them were from trials in the 1960s and 1970s, much more than a decade after the War.

    Although many people complain that the defendants of such trials were punished only leniently or not at all, I grew to appreciate the wisdom of the restraint and limitations of such legal proceedings. These defendants were prosecuted and judged properly. Even if they were acquitted, the facts of their wartime activities were revealed publicly.

    The recent and current trials of very old men who were very young guards and clerks during the war are the work of zealots in the German legal system. These defendants are being convicted for merely working in the concentration camps, not for committing any actual, particular crimes.

    Also, some people still make their livings by maintaining and providing all the documents of Nazi atrocities. These people have to justify their organizations' budgets to the German tax-payers.

    We see this same zealotry in the USA too. OSI deported John Demjanjuk to Germany to stand trial and be convicted at one of those kangaroo-court trials. OSI still is trying to prosecute deport extremely old men, more than 90 years old. Politicians now are trying to terminate those old men's Social Security benefits. There is no evidence that any of those old men hurt any particular inmates in those camps.

    ---------

    I do think that Demjanjuk served in a concentration camp and lied about it when he immigrated to the USA. He was guilty of fraudulent immigration and therefore basically was deported from the USA legally and correctly.

    ---------

    At one point in the OSI's prosecution of John Demjanjuk, he was deported to Israel to stand trial on charges of mass murder. Supposedly, Denjanjuk really had been a notorious Ukrainian guard called "Ivan the Terrible", who had chased Jews into the Treblinka gas chambers and then dropped the poison into the rooms. The OSI assembled all the evidence and sent it to Israel along with Demjanuk.

    An Israeli lawyer named Yoram Sheftel was assigned to defend Demjanjuk, and so Sheftel immediately became the most hated person in all Israel. In an amazing turn of events, however, Sheftel defended Demjanjuk and won a complete acquittal. The trial lasted from November 1986 to April 1988 and ended with a conviction and death sentence for Demjanjuk.

    Sheftel appealed to the Israeli Supreme Court, which in February 1998 overturned the conviction completely. The acquittal was not based on any legal loopholes. Rather Sheftel convinced the Supreme Court -- and also practically the entire public -- that Demjanjuk should be acquitted on the facts. The evidence proved actually that Demjanjuk was not the so-called Ivan the Terrible and had never even stepped foot inside of the Treblinka camp.

    Sheftel later wrote a book about the trial, titled The Demjanjuk Affair: The Rise and Fall of a Show-Trial, published in 1994. It is a terrific book, especially for people who like to read stories about gritty lawyers who defend "obviously guilty" defendants and thus expose social injustice. It's like a John Grisham novel, but it's a true story, stranger than fiction.

    http://www.amazon.com/Demjanjuk-Affair-Rise-Fall-Show-trial/dp/0575057955/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1430488097&sr=8-1&keywords=demjanjuk+affair

    Sheftel appealed to the Israeli Supreme Court, which in February 1998 overturned the conviction completely.

    … which in July 1993 overturned the conviction completely.

  60. @rod1963
    What Anna Sauerbrey is worried about is that the Jews won't be able to guilt trip the German goy anymore over what happened in Nazi Germany in a few more years nor will Jews be able to exploit their special status as the sole victims of the Germans.

    Her solution is what I expect out of Jews on a suicide trip, import more Muslims who will be in a short time a powerful minority that will do as it pleases and one of the first things it will do is kill or expel Jews from Germany - they will finish what the Nazis started.

    France and Britain are in the same pickle. There are some places in London and other cities were local pols cannot get elected without Muslim voter approval. In France, Hollande depends on Muslim support rather than Jewish support. That will eventually spell the death knell of Jews.

    Give them 5-10 years. It could happen sooner though.

    That said, I've read plenty accounts of superior Jewish IQ's. Maybe it's true, maybe it's not. What I do know is that the Jews are rapidly cutting their own throat by supporting groups and causes that are eradicating the only thing standing between them and ethnic cleansing - whites. Look no one else cares about their Holocaust or their supposed special status. The blacks don't(many of them don't like Jews at all), neither do Hispanics and the Muslims just want them all dead. For a people so good at making money and obtaining political power they're sure doing a good job at painting themselves into a fatal corner.

    “import more Muslims who will be in a short time a powerful minority that will do as it pleases and one of the first things it will do is kill or expel Jews from Germany”

    I’m not so sure. Jews have managed to survive (and often thrive) for centuries in otherwise monoethnic, monoreligious countries where they were objects of dislike (if not hatred). Surely it’ll be easier to survive and thrive, say, with a 50/50 ethnic German/Muslim mix or an even more mixed society. Divide et impera ?

    And if the Muslims play up badly (bombs, riots etc) and become objects of dislike (if not hatred) to the ethnic Germans, well at least they won’t be hating on the Jews. There’s an extra bonus – ethnic Germans will be less likely to care when bad things happen to Palestinians.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    I am much more concerned about France than I am about Germany. The real question is the power and anger of the mob vs. the control of the state. In many parts of France even today, to walk down the street in visibly Jewish attire is to invite a beating or worse and there is never a cop when you need one. Jewish institutions are being protected 'round the clock for the time being by the state at no small expense but at some point they will tire or the Muslims will choose a soft target like another kosher supermarket instead of a Jewish school and there will be more violence. Germany got the better deal than France in that most of their Muslims are Turkish rather than African and N. African.
  61. @George
    An alternative theory is once a bureaucracy exists and is paying salaries and accruing pension benefits it is impossible to shut down. Shutting it down is about as easy as shutting useless military bases or ending a useless weapons program, or ending a benefit of the welfare state. War on Nazis, poverty, drugs, Cancer, IslamoTerrorWhatsIts, ... it goes on forever.

    You can’t shut it down but you can repurpose it. After polio was cured, the March of Dimes did not (as you say) shut down, but it was repurposed to cure birth defects or multiple scleroris or something (preferably something incurable so it would never need to be repurposed again). So the War on Nazis can be repurposed for good (the War on Islamo-fascists) or for evil (the War on White Men who sorta Look Like Nazis). Just because the bureaucracy gets repurposed doesn’t answer the question. Each side will seek to seize the banner of anti-Nazism and carry it forward into the future. (BTW, the struggle is never over – the Republicans packaged themselves as the party that freed the blacks and that worked for 100 years after the Civil War but then the Democrats re-packaged themselves as the party that gives free stuff to blacks IN THE PRESENT and that worked even better – politics is all about what have you done for me LATELY). I’d say the anti-white side is winning so far.

  62. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    “Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic.”

    Hitler was Catholic. Goebbels was born Catholic, but became Atheist. Himmler was born Catholic, but adhered to some pseudo-Germanic religion. Göring was Protestant, FWIK.

  63. @Laura
    "when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic."

    The Catholic Church would disagree with you on that one. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul. Also confirmation. It is possible for a former Catholic to lose the rights and duties of a Catholic under canon law if he formally leaves the church, but just ceasing to believe is not enough. And an ex Catholic is still a Christian.

    Now if you want to deny that people who are messing around with neopaganism are Catholic in the sociological sense, you're certainly free to do that.

    True. But this falls into the “of those who are given more, more is expected”. The Last Day will be a bit of a challenge for apostates.

  64. IBC says:

    Steve, I’m not sure how she feels about refugees from Chad, but otherwise this sounds like a technical challenge right up the alley of your old classmate Martine Rothblatt.

    Rothblatt’s “mind cloning” is the next logical development of the concepts featured in They Saved Hitler’s Brain. This technology could offer a sort of reverse, digital “final solution” to the moral inconvenience posed by the impending death of the world’s last Nazis: a truly disruptive, 21st century answer to one of the great problems of our age.

    Besides streamlining the international extradition process, the scalability of mind clones would allow the war criminal market to migrate beyond international tribunals to the enterprise and even consumer social justice segments. Mass-adoption could provide an almost perpetual source for low-cost, convenient, and continual calibration of personal moral compasses around the world.

    And Steve, here’s a slogan you can use on Kickstarter if Rothblatt decides not to come on board with the idea: Mind clones: the killer app. that will forever change the way we hunt Nazis!*

    http://www.dailydot.com/technology/martine-rothblatt-bina-mind-clone/

    http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/they_saved_hitlers_brain/

    *Batteries not included.

  65. @Anonymous Nephew
    "import more Muslims who will be in a short time a powerful minority that will do as it pleases and one of the first things it will do is kill or expel Jews from Germany"

    I'm not so sure. Jews have managed to survive (and often thrive) for centuries in otherwise monoethnic, monoreligious countries where they were objects of dislike (if not hatred). Surely it'll be easier to survive and thrive, say, with a 50/50 ethnic German/Muslim mix or an even more mixed society. Divide et impera ?

    And if the Muslims play up badly (bombs, riots etc) and become objects of dislike (if not hatred) to the ethnic Germans, well at least they won't be hating on the Jews. There's an extra bonus - ethnic Germans will be less likely to care when bad things happen to Palestinians.

    I am much more concerned about France than I am about Germany. The real question is the power and anger of the mob vs. the control of the state. In many parts of France even today, to walk down the street in visibly Jewish attire is to invite a beating or worse and there is never a cop when you need one. Jewish institutions are being protected ’round the clock for the time being by the state at no small expense but at some point they will tire or the Muslims will choose a soft target like another kosher supermarket instead of a Jewish school and there will be more violence. Germany got the better deal than France in that most of their Muslims are Turkish rather than African and N. African.

    • Replies: @SFG
    That and if some Muslim kills a Jew in Germany the New York Times will start ranting about the return of Hitler (all the time not mentioning real Germans aren't behind it), so the Germans keep a tighter lid on these guys.
  66. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Most Nazis despised Christianity. That is hardly a “myth”. Hitler’s dislike of the Catholic Church is well documented. As a young Habsburg subject growing up in Austria, like many pan-German nationalists, Hitler saw the Catholic church as a foreign entity that catered to Slavic minorities and undermined the “natural” destiny of Germans to rule. Most 19th century and early 20th century German nationalists tended to favor Lutheranism as being a more truly German church. However, Hitler himself doesn’t seem to have ever been particularly sympathetic to Lutheranism, which tended to be socially too liberal. Hitler was certainly no atheist, he believed apparently in some sort of divine Providence, but he was not a believing Christian in any meaningful sense of the word. Other Nazis were all over the map. A few were devout Christians, some were atheists, many, like Hitler, believed in a vague divine power of some sort, but not in Jesus, some of the more enthusiastic Nazis tried to restore pre-Christian German pagan beliefs, although Hitler himself thought neo-pagans were clowns. (For a German nationalist, Hitler himself seemed very uninterested in ancient Germanic culture. Nazi symbolism was mostly based on Roman or even Hindu (like the Swastika), not proto Germanic.) What liberals like to ignore is that Nazism was not very “conservative”, in many ways it was a philosophy that was supposed to propel a backwards agrarian society, as Hitler saw it, ahead of the more advanced Anglo Saxon societies. In that sense Hitler was a lot like Stalin or Mao.

  67. “Jack D says:

    Nephew

    I am much more concerned about France than I am about Germany. The real question is the power and anger of the mob vs. the control of the state. In many parts of France even today, to walk down the street in visibly Jewish attire is to invite a beating or worse and there is never a cop when you need one.”

    And what about french gentiles? They might feel the same way. I guess they don’t count. Perhaps you should take up your concerns with Barbara Lerner Spectre.

  68. iSteveFan says:
    @Whiskey
    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims. Like Dieudonne M'bala M'bala. Inventer of the soft-Nazi salute, the Quenelle. THEY hate Jews as muich as old Adolf.

    Letting lots of Africans in is letting lots of poor Black Nazis into Europe. A bad idea. The lesson of Nazism is to always, always, always be armed and have as much military power as your state can buy, and act BEFORE a threat gets too big. The lesson of Hitler is quash an insane, grandiose, Roman Empire revivalist with slave empire ambitions before he can seize and re-arm an industrial nation. Pretty simple.

    The lesson of Hitler is quash an insane, grandiose, Roman Empire revivalist with slave empire ambitions before he can seize and re-arm an industrial nation. Pretty simple.

    Right Whiskey. And the way to do that is to import millions and millions of dissimilar peoples into a nation to water down and change the demographics so as to make it impossible for such a leader or movement to ever come about.

    Letting lots of Africans in is letting lots of poor Black Nazis into Europe. A bad idea.

    That is actually a feature not a bug of the efforts described above.

    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims.

    Actually, they are not Nazis. They are there to prevent the revival of real Nazis.

    • Replies: @Jack D

    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims.

    Actually, they are not Nazis. They are there to prevent the revival of real Nazis.
     
    This is the question. We know that "Nazi" is a ruined brand - the most ruined of all ruined brands, the ultimate in vilification. So who can we stick the "Nazi" brand on once all the real Nazis are dead?

    Whiskey says that Africans are the new Nazis, iSteveFan says that whites are the new Nazis. Who is more likely to win this fight in the press? Who looks more like a Nazi to you?
  69. That’s a really interesting chain of logic. Our grandfathers murdered millions of people therefore we should allow millions of third world barbarians into our country?!? Uh, okay…

    Works for me: the Hebrews worked genocides against several indigenous peoples; ergo, Israel should be swamped with non-Jewish, non-European immigrants. Makes perfect sense. Buuuut if Israel isn’t going to do her duty in this regard, then why should anyone else?

  70. @Rob McX
    @Mark Kaplan, HA

    As I remember it, Airey Neave's book on the main Nuremberg Trial tells us that all but two - Goering and Rosenberg - of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed.

    “all but two – Goering and Rosenberg – of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed”

    I’m not sure that means Christianity informed their words and actions in power. They would have been raised in Christian culture in childhood, and in the condemned cell I can see the comfort of the ritual they were raised with. No atheists in foxholes and few on Death Row?

    I read of conflicts where badly wounded soldiers, slowly dying in no mans land, call out for their mothers. I’m not sure you can conclude that makes them “mummy’s boys”.

    @Mark Kaplan – are you familiar with Hitler’s reported statement (by Speer) that “the Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?”

    • Replies: @Jack D
    Apparently the Mufti of Jerusalem (Arafat's uncle) got along swimmingly with the Nazis. They took him to see at least one concentration camp and he liked what he saw.
  71. @iSteveFan

    The lesson of Hitler is quash an insane, grandiose, Roman Empire revivalist with slave empire ambitions before he can seize and re-arm an industrial nation. Pretty simple.
     
    Right Whiskey. And the way to do that is to import millions and millions of dissimilar peoples into a nation to water down and change the demographics so as to make it impossible for such a leader or movement to ever come about.

    Letting lots of Africans in is letting lots of poor Black Nazis into Europe. A bad idea.
     
    That is actually a feature not a bug of the efforts described above.

    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims.
     
    Actually, they are not Nazis. They are there to prevent the revival of real Nazis.

    There are plenty of NEW NAZIS. Of course, they tend to be African or North African Muslims.

    Actually, they are not Nazis. They are there to prevent the revival of real Nazis.

    This is the question. We know that “Nazi” is a ruined brand – the most ruined of all ruined brands, the ultimate in vilification. So who can we stick the “Nazi” brand on once all the real Nazis are dead?

    Whiskey says that Africans are the new Nazis, iSteveFan says that whites are the new Nazis. Who is more likely to win this fight in the press? Who looks more like a Nazi to you?

  72. Lazar Kaganovitch @ Wikipedia

    Lazar Moiseyevich Kaganovich was a Soviet politician and administrator and one of the main associates of Joseph Stalin.

    Kaganovich was born in 1893 to Jewish parents in the village of Kabany, Radomyshl uyezd, Kiev Governorate, Russian Empire.

    Responsibility for 1932–33 famine

    Kaganovich (together with Vyacheslav Molotov) participated with the All-Ukrainian Party Conference of 1930 and were given the task of implementation of the collectivization policy that caused a catastrophic 1932–33 famine (known as the Holodomor in Ukraine). He also personally oversaw grain confiscations during the same time periods. Similar policies also inflicted enormous suffering on the Soviet Central Asian republic of Kazakhstan, the Kuban region, Crimea, the lower Volga region, and other parts of the Soviet Union. As an emissary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party, Kaganovich traveled to Ukraine, the central regions of the USSR, the Northern Caucasus, and Siberia demanding the acceleration of collectivization and repressions against the Kulaks, who were generally blamed for the slow progress of collectivization. Attorney Rafael Lemkin in his work The Soviet Genocide in Ukraine tried to present the fact of Holodomor to the Nuremberg trials as a genocide of a totalitarian regime.[2]

    On January 13, 2010, Kiev Appellate Court posthumously found Kaganovich, Postyshev, Kosior and other Soviet Communist Party functionaries guilty of genocide against Ukrainians during the catastrophic Holodomor famine.[3] Though they were pronounced guilty as criminals, the case was ended immediately according to paragraph 8 of Article 6 of the Criminal Procedural Code of Ukraine.[4] The importance of the case is its historical aspect that legally explains the particularity of that historical event[clarification needed]. By New Years Day, the Security Service of Ukraine had finished pre-court investigation and transferred its materials to the Prosecutor General of Ukraine. The materials consist of over 250 volumes of archive documents (from within Ukraine as well as from abroad), interviews with witnesses, and expert analysis of several institutes of National Academies of Sciences. Oleksandr Medvedko, the Prosecutor General, confirmed that the material gives clear evidence of the genocide occurring in Ukraine

    […]

    From 1935 to 1937, Kaganovich worked as Narkom (minister) for the railways. Even before the start of the Great Purges, he organized the arrests of thousands of railway administrators and managers as supposed “saboteurs”.

    From 1937 to 1939, Kaganovich served as Narkom for Heavy Industry. During 1939–1940, he served as Narkom for the Oil Industry. Each of his assignments was associated with arrests in order to improve discipline and compliance with Stalin’s policies.

    In all Party conferences of the later 1930s, he made speeches demanding increased efforts in the search for and prosecution of “foreign spies” and “saboteurs”. For his ruthlessness in the execution of Stalin’s orders, he was nicknamed “Iron Lazar”. During the period of Great Terror starting in 1936 Kaganovich’s signature appears on 188 out of 357 documented execution lists.

    […]

    Kaganovich survived to the age of 97, dying in 1991, just before the events that resulted in the end of the USSR. He is buried in the famed Novodevichy Cemetery in Moscow.

    […]

    Kaganovich seems to have been responsible for the “eggs and omelette” metaphor commonly attributed to Stalin himself.

    This swine died in his bed, of natural causes. It would be interesting to find out how many lamentations of that fact there are from certain parties, ostensibly obsessed with justice for mass murderers.

  73. @Anonymous Nephew
    "all but two – Goering and Rosenberg – of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed"

    I'm not sure that means Christianity informed their words and actions in power. They would have been raised in Christian culture in childhood, and in the condemned cell I can see the comfort of the ritual they were raised with. No atheists in foxholes and few on Death Row?

    I read of conflicts where badly wounded soldiers, slowly dying in no mans land, call out for their mothers. I'm not sure you can conclude that makes them "mummy's boys".

    @Mark Kaplan - are you familiar with Hitler's reported statement (by Speer) that "the Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?"

    Apparently the Mufti of Jerusalem (Arafat’s uncle) got along swimmingly with the Nazis. They took him to see at least one concentration camp and he liked what he saw.

    • Replies: @Jim
    So the mufti of Jerusalem (who it now emerges was also Arafat's uncle) consorted with Hitler and liked concentration camps. From a modem propaganda perspective, that is a really fortunate set of linkages.
  74. So if an atheist Komissar with Catholic parents and an atheist Komissar with Jewish parents are both beating a kulak, the first guy is a Communist (for whom Catholics bear no guilt or responsibility) and the second guy is a Jew (and his acts can be attributed to “the Jews”). Got it. No double standards here.

    If German commissar, a Scottish commissar, a Japanese commissar, and a Jewish commissar are all beating kulaks, no, we don’t get to debate whether they’re “true” Germans, Scots, Japs, or Jews, though of course we can debate whether they’re actually of German, Scottish, Japanese, or Jewish ancestry.

    Judge the Left by their total lack of contrition regarding the untold tens of millions exterminated by them in the 20th century.

    Well said. This right-winger feels as guilty over the Nazis as your garden variety leftist feels over the commies. As in, not at all. He also feels as hostile toward the Nazis as your garden variety leftist does toward the commies.

    However, if someone tells you he’s an atheist Jew, well, it’s not that big a deal. In Judaism, ethnicity and religion coincide to an extent that they do not with Christianity (and since I mentioned Ron Unz’s comments on Bolshevism, I should also note that he was clearly referring to ethnicity, given that he was not only measuring it by surnames, but also considering it primarily in the context of positive achievements, i.e., math skills.).

    You’re in the ball park, but you don’t quite seem to get it, either. It’s not a deal at all. The bulk of Jewry is ethnic Jewry, i.e., an ethnicity, not a religion. What the remains of religious Jewry feel about that is not germane. E.g., Einstein, a “non-observant,” Jew who was basically a deist, is a Jew in the eyes of the vast majority of Jews, regardless of what he believed, because they’re talking about his ethnicity, not his religion.

    Anyway, if that’s a double standard, it’s not the Christians who are solely responsible.

    You keep saying that. I don’t see WTF Christians have to do with it at all, except as observers.

  75. HA says:
    @Laura
    "when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic."

    The Catholic Church would disagree with you on that one. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul. Also confirmation. It is possible for a former Catholic to lose the rights and duties of a Catholic under canon law if he formally leaves the church, but just ceasing to believe is not enough. And an ex Catholic is still a Christian.

    Now if you want to deny that people who are messing around with neopaganism are Catholic in the sociological sense, you're certainly free to do that.

    “The Catholic Church would disagree with you [that when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic]. Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul.”

    More to the point, one might also ask what the Nazis themselves believed about that. There is the case of Edith Stein, who was not only baptized, but a nun, for crying out loud. But to the Nazis, she was still just a Jew, and whatever mark she had by virtue of her baptism was apparently insufficient to cleanse her from the indelible taint of Judaism (a doctrine that more likely came from Darwin than from some catechism, though I’m not blaming Charles Darwin for the Nazis, either).

    I wonder what did Hitler’s little Ignatius had to say about that?

  76. Yes, Christian baptism and being a “Jew for Jesus” seem to be the only way to get any substantial number of Jews to start talking about apostasy. E.g., Buddhist Jews seem to still be Jews in the eyes of Jewry. But being an embarrassment (“No True Scotsman” a la Kaganovitch & company) would seem to be much more common.

  77. Doug says:
    @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    The arch-architect of Nazi ideology Alfred Rosenberg vehemently rejected traditional Christianity:

    “Rosenberg argued for a new “religion of the blood”, based on the supposed innate promptings of the Nordic soul to defend its noble character against racial and cultural degeneration. He believed that this had been embodied in early Indo-European religions…He rejected Christianity for its universality, for its doctrine of original sin (at least for Germans whom he declared on one occasion were born noble), and for its teachings on the immortality of the soul.[26] Indeed, absorbing Christianity enfeebled a people.[27] Publicly, Rosenberg affected to deplore Christianity’s degeneration owing to Jewish influence.[28] Following Chamberlain’s ideas, he condemned what he called “negative Christianity” (the orthodox beliefs of Protestant and Catholic churches), arguing instead for a so-called “positive” Christianity[29][30]”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Rosenberg

    As the NSDAP became popular, they realized they couldn’t win the broader German electorate while being explicitly anti-Christian:

    “Positive Christianity (German: Positives Christentum) was a movement within Nazi Germany which blended ideas of racial purity and Nazi ideology with elements of Christianity. Hitler included use of the term in Article 24[1] of the 1920 Nazi Party Platform, stating “the Party represents the standpoint of Positive Christianity”. Non-denominational, the term could be variously interpreted, but allayed fears among Germany’s Christian majority as to the expressed hostility towards the established churches of large sections of the Nazi movement.[2] In 1937, Hans Kerrl, the Nazi Minister for Church Affairs, explained “Positive Christianity” as not “dependent upon the Apostle’s Creed”, nor in “faith in Christ as the son of God”, upon which Christianity relied…

    Positive Christianity differed from orthodox Christianity in that Positive Christianity:

    Rejected the Jewish-written parts of the Bible (including the entire Old Testament)
    Claimed “Aryanhood” and non-Jewishness for Christ
    Promoted the political objective of national unity, to overcome confessional differences, to eliminate Catholicism, and to unite Protestantism into a single unitary Positive Christian church[10]”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_Christianity

    “During the war Alfred Rosenberg formulated a thirty-point program for the National Reich Church, which included:

    The National Reich Church claims exclusive right and control over all Churches.
    The National Church is determined to exterminate foreign Christian faiths imported into Germany in the ill-omened year 800.
    The National Church demands immediate cessation of the publishing and dissemination of the Bible.
    The National Church will clear away from its altars all Crucifixes, Bibles and pictures of Saints.
    On the altars there must be nothing but Mein Kampf and to the left of the altar a sword.[38]”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Nazi_Germany#Denominational_trends_during_the_Nazi_period

  78. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    [Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola.]

    Whoosh!

    • Replies: @SFG
    Wasn't Himmler the one who was really into the whole occult pre-Christian Aryan thing, with runes in the SS and so on?

    I think if we had just travelled back in time and gotten them all hooked on Dungeons & Dragons we would have saved the world a lot of trouble.
  79. The comments in this thread so far prove that Hitler is the ultimate tar-baby. One comment early on about Hitler’s alleged Catholicism and you’re all lining up to get stuck in. What will all talk about when the last Nazi dies?

    Actually people will still be squabbling and calling each other Hitler long after Skynet takes over and we’re all hiding underground from the killer androids.

  80. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists.

    The Nazi’s rejected Biblical religion. The ‘myth’ in question is your own confusion.

  81. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany

    Your baptism is not invalidated by effective apostasy, but you seem to consider the Catholic Church some sort of ethnic configuration. It is not. It is perfectly irrelevant how many novenas Herman Goering’s mother offered.

  82. @Hippopotamusdrome
    Catholics and the Nazi vote 1932
    Two interesting maps of Germany. On the first, the black areas are those with the highest concentration of Catholics according to the 1934 census:
    On the second map, the black areas show the highest concentration of Nazi votes in the 1932 election (white the lowest)

    My understanding is that the Catholics thought Hitler wanted to replace God with himself, which doesn’t seem too far off. After all, they replaced ‘Gruss Gott’ with ‘Heil Hitler’.

  83. SFG says:
    @rod1963
    What Anna Sauerbrey is worried about is that the Jews won't be able to guilt trip the German goy anymore over what happened in Nazi Germany in a few more years nor will Jews be able to exploit their special status as the sole victims of the Germans.

    Her solution is what I expect out of Jews on a suicide trip, import more Muslims who will be in a short time a powerful minority that will do as it pleases and one of the first things it will do is kill or expel Jews from Germany - they will finish what the Nazis started.

    France and Britain are in the same pickle. There are some places in London and other cities were local pols cannot get elected without Muslim voter approval. In France, Hollande depends on Muslim support rather than Jewish support. That will eventually spell the death knell of Jews.

    Give them 5-10 years. It could happen sooner though.

    That said, I've read plenty accounts of superior Jewish IQ's. Maybe it's true, maybe it's not. What I do know is that the Jews are rapidly cutting their own throat by supporting groups and causes that are eradicating the only thing standing between them and ethnic cleansing - whites. Look no one else cares about their Holocaust or their supposed special status. The blacks don't(many of them don't like Jews at all), neither do Hispanics and the Muslims just want them all dead. For a people so good at making money and obtaining political power they're sure doing a good job at painting themselves into a fatal corner.

    There’s this obsession with remembering the Holocaust. I think it gives them an excuse to say they’re still victims and salves their liberal consciences which feel guilty living in the best places in and around New York, LA, and Miami.

    And yeah, they’ll import lots of brownies (pun intended) and get themselves killed.

    I don’t care, I’m marrying a shiksa (you really expect me to marry that feminist Scheisse?), and within a few generations my mother’s identity will be a forgotten footnote.

  84. @Rob McX
    @Mark Kaplan, HA

    As I remember it, Airey Neave's book on the main Nuremberg Trial tells us that all but two - Goering and Rosenberg - of the 23 defendants requested Christian Last Rites before being executed.

    Stalin supposedly made his confession to an Orthodox priest at a low point during the 2d World War. Funny how the prospect of death can concentrate the mind.

    • Replies: @SFG
    Stalin? A confession? That must have taken a while.
  85. SFG says:
    @5371
    [Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola.]

    Whoosh!

    Wasn’t Himmler the one who was really into the whole occult pre-Christian Aryan thing, with runes in the SS and so on?

    I think if we had just travelled back in time and gotten them all hooked on Dungeons & Dragons we would have saved the world a lot of trouble.

  86. @Jack D
    I am much more concerned about France than I am about Germany. The real question is the power and anger of the mob vs. the control of the state. In many parts of France even today, to walk down the street in visibly Jewish attire is to invite a beating or worse and there is never a cop when you need one. Jewish institutions are being protected 'round the clock for the time being by the state at no small expense but at some point they will tire or the Muslims will choose a soft target like another kosher supermarket instead of a Jewish school and there will be more violence. Germany got the better deal than France in that most of their Muslims are Turkish rather than African and N. African.

    That and if some Muslim kills a Jew in Germany the New York Times will start ranting about the return of Hitler (all the time not mentioning real Germans aren’t behind it), so the Germans keep a tighter lid on these guys.

  87. @George
    The "accountant of Aushwitz". What's next? Otto Auto, the " mechanic of Aushwitz"? Or Deiter Ditz, the "deliveryboy of Aushwitz"?

    How about the swimming pool attendant of Auschwitz

  88. SFG says:
    @HA
    "Baptism is held to make an indelible mark on the soul."

    Yes, and a priest is a priest forever, by order of Melchizedek. I get it. What Mark Caplan was asking about was why Hitler and Nazism were considered atheistic, which is clearly a question of beliefs, not of whether those responsible had ever been baptized, or what Catholic doctrine has to say about the consequences.

    I know all about the "once a Catholic..." line, but face it, when someone tells you "I'm an atheist Catholic", feel free to assume he thinks he's some kind of special flower, and to inform him that the correct term is "ex-Catholic", baptism or not.

    However, if someone tells you he's an atheist Jew, well, it's not that big a deal. In Judaism, ethnicity and religion coincide to an extent that they do not with Christianity (and since I mentioned Ron Unz's comments on Bolshevism, I should also note that he was clearly referring to ethnicity, given that he was not only measuring it by surnames, but also considering it primarily in the context of positive achievements, i.e., math skills.).

    Anyway, if that's a double standard, it's not the Christians who are solely responsible. If Jack D wants to decree that only those Jews holding to certain beliefs and obeying certain rituals are actually Jews, and no one else is, and all the credit/blame for Bolshevism and those Nobel Prizes is henceforth to be divvied up on that metric alone, his main opponents in that fight are going to be other Jews, or those who insist on calling themselves such.

    Victory has a thousand fathers, defeat is an orphan. Look at the way everyone who’s a quarter Irish calls themselves Irish-American.

    Einstein on relativity:

    By an application of the theory of relativity to the taste of readers, today in Germany I am called a German man of science, and in England I am represented as a Swiss Jew. If I come to be represented as a bête noire, the descriptions will be reversed, and I shall become a Swiss Jew for the Germans and a German man of science for the English!

  89. @flyingtiger
    I just found out that The Prussian Blue girls have given up their racist politics and become, in their words, more liberal. This happened after they started smoking pot. Nazis are not a reliable object of hate anymore.

    How about the St. Pauli Girls? They always seemed so wholesome.

  90. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three — Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler — were Catholic.

    Sorry to trip you up with annoying white mans logic, Caplan, but according to your way of thinking Communists were not “really atheists”, but Jewish.

  91. @Art Deco
    Stalin supposedly made his confession to an Orthodox priest at a low point during the 2d World War. Funny how the prospect of death can concentrate the mind.

    Stalin? A confession? That must have taken a while.

  92. Reading Sauerbrey (and Caplan) brings to mind these famous words by Orwell:

    “If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face–for ever. And remember that it is for ever. The face will always be there to be stamped upon. The heretic, the enemy of society, will always be there, so that he can be defeated and humiliated over again. Everything that you have undergone since you have been in our hands–all that will continue, and worse. The espionage, the betrayals, the arrests, the tortures, the executions, the disappearances will never cease. It will be a world of terror as much as a world of triumph. The more the Party is powerful, the less it will be tolerant: the weaker the opposition, the tighter the despotism. Goldstein and his heresies will live for ever. Every day, at every moment, they will be defeated, discredited, ridiculed, spat upon and yet they will always survive. This drama that I have played out with you during seven years will be played out over and over again generation after generation, always in subtler forms. ”

    Nazis are far too useful for the modern totalitarian state to allow their mere failure to exist to be any sort of impediment.

  93. “SFG says:

    May 1, 2015 at 10:01 pm GMT

    Stalin? A confession? That must have taken a while.”

    Perhaps his only regret was that he didn’t kill more people.

    He probably had the priest shipped off to the Gulag or executed afterwords.

  94. “Cagey Beast says:

    Actually people will still be squabbling and calling each other Hitler long after Skynet takes over and we’re all hiding underground from the killer androids.”

    Tag…..you’re Hitler!

    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    At least Skynet in the first few Terminator films is straightforward: it wants to wipe out humanity. The New York Times and it's ilk wants to mess with our minds, make us somehow owe them something, always be in the dog house and under a cloud.

    The NYT is an important piece of the grey big grey blob that hangs over the West and shoots needling critiques at us from on high. It reminds me of the Greek meaning of name given to the Devil: " διάβολος or diábolos = slanderer or accuser)". Skynet is sportsmanlike and above board by comparison.

    The American-led West offers Germany nothing but another 70yrs of guilt-tripping and mental abuse while Putin offers them a way forward:
    Putin Remembers Family’s WWII Past in an ‘Intimate’ Op-Ed http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150430/1021553742.html
    I know which I'd choose.

  95. @Anonymous
    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing progeny, the Islamists

    Without live Nazis, why we might actually have to face up to their living, breathing ancestors, the Zionists.

    It is a sad irony of our times that an Israeli citizen has been financing neo-Nazis in Ukraine to fight a legitimate pro-federaists’ movement.
    http://orientalreview.org/2014/05/14/bloodbath-in-odessa-guided-by-interim-rulers-of-ukraine/
    http://freeukrainenow.org/2015/04/27/the-key-man-behind-the-odessa-trade-unions-building-massacre-his-many-connections-to-the-white-house/
    The whole Ukrainian debacle is a gigantic slap in the faces of the still-living veterans of the WWII, considering that the US involvement led to a rise of the neo-Nazism in Ukraine up to a government level. A recent law enacted by Kiev elevates Ukrainian collaborators with Hitler’s army to a level of freedom fighters:
    http://newcoldwar.org/interview-were-seeing-revival-of-nazism-fascism-in-ukraine/
    http://www.timesofisrael.com/thousands-march-to-honor-nazi-collaborator-in-kiev/
    http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-u-s-has-installed-a-neo-nazi-government-in-ukraine/5371554

  96. @George
    The "accountant of Aushwitz". What's next? Otto Auto, the " mechanic of Aushwitz"? Or Deiter Ditz, the "deliveryboy of Aushwitz"?

    How about Himmel Mannerheim, the rapist, womanizing Auschwitz lifeguard?

  97. @George
    An alternative theory is once a bureaucracy exists and is paying salaries and accruing pension benefits it is impossible to shut down. Shutting it down is about as easy as shutting useless military bases or ending a useless weapons program, or ending a benefit of the welfare state. War on Nazis, poverty, drugs, Cancer, IslamoTerrorWhatsIts, ... it goes on forever.

    An alternative theory is once a bureaucracy exists and is paying salaries and accruing pension benefits it is impossible to shut down. Shutting it down is about as easy as shutting useless military bases or ending a useless weapons program, or ending a benefit of the welfare state. War on Nazis, poverty, drugs, Cancer, IslamoTerrorWhatsIts, … it goes on forever.

    The theory’s kinda dumb. Military spending as a share of domestic product has varied wildly according to external circumstances since 1940 and the military itself has suffered several major shakeouts. There actually was a government commission assigned to close military bases because Congress was so hopeless at it. Only modest sums are spent controlling the drug trade and the vast bulk of the manpower could be reassigned to other sorts of policing. Medical research is pretty open-ended.

  98. @Mr. Anon
    "Cagey Beast says:

    Actually people will still be squabbling and calling each other Hitler long after Skynet takes over and we’re all hiding underground from the killer androids."

    Tag.....you're Hitler!

    At least Skynet in the first few Terminator films is straightforward: it wants to wipe out humanity. The New York Times and it’s ilk wants to mess with our minds, make us somehow owe them something, always be in the dog house and under a cloud.

    The NYT is an important piece of the grey big grey blob that hangs over the West and shoots needling critiques at us from on high. It reminds me of the Greek meaning of name given to the Devil: ” διάβολος or diábolos = slanderer or accuser)”. Skynet is sportsmanlike and above board by comparison.

    The American-led West offers Germany nothing but another 70yrs of guilt-tripping and mental abuse while Putin offers them a way forward:
    Putin Remembers Family’s WWII Past in an ‘Intimate’ Op-Ed http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150430/1021553742.html
    I know which I’d choose.

  99. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    This post gets my vote for the Tar-Baby Award. Just look at all the people got caught in it. Look at all the people who’d rather speculate on Hitler’s religious status than discuss the fact that the NYT plays host to a mainstream German journalist who regrets that soon there will be no more old people to star in the anti-Nazi show trials she has come to love.

  100. Don’t worry. There are an astounding number of children of “Holocaust Survivors” running around in the USA willing to share their (second hand) stories.

    Of course by “Holocaust survivor” – we basically mean anyone Jewish who lived in Europe and the USSR in 1933. I know of one radio talk show host whose family left Germany in 1934 for the USA who bills them as “Holocaust survivors”.

  101. @Anonymous
    Puh-Lease, Nazi ideology was explicitly Neo-Pagan. Christianity was viewed as a Jewish plot (not unreasonably, Jesus was a Jew) to weaken the Nordic numb nuts. Did they use public rhetoric that referenced Christian themes and try to coopt the Church in Germany to Nazi aims, to help nudge the masses along and keep them loyal? Yes. Were numerous leaders raised in various sects of Christianity? Of course, damn, Germany was a part of Christendom, what did you expect them to be raised as? But to assert that ethnically Catholic leaders were true believers and devout because of that is absurd. This is like believing that Obama is sincere in his electorally convenient Black Christianity just because he attended Wright's church. NO, its because he understood that to become authentically American Black, and to gain control of the black lumpen masses, he had to publicly show a little of that old time religion that birthed MLK, Reverand Jesse, Rev Al Shapton etc. It has worked well for him, and it worked well for the Nazi's, but it does not indicate a sincerity of belief, only a Machiavelian twist of rhetoric. Damn, what a clueless post.

    Damn, what a clueless post.

    Mr Caplan probably thinks they were straight, too. After all, their parents were!

  102. @Hippopotamusdrome
    Catholics and the Nazi vote 1932
    Two interesting maps of Germany. On the first, the black areas are those with the highest concentration of Catholics according to the 1934 census:
    On the second map, the black areas show the highest concentration of Nazi votes in the 1932 election (white the lowest)

    Catholics and the Nazi vote 1932

    Like FDR the same year (and thrice again), Hitler was most strongly opposed by the very kind of people who produced him:

    Yankees and the Democrat vote 1932

  103. @HA
    "It’d be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists."


    Christianity is a credal religion. Deal with it. Despite all the "I was raised Catholic" clichés or the Andrew Greely handwaving about ethnic Catholicism, when one stops believing in Catholicism, one stops being a Catholic. You don't need a writ of excommunication.

    The same cannot be said for, say, Judaism. (On that point, both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.) So while it's a stretch, as Ron Unz noted a day or so ago, to claim that none of Bolsheviks were Jews, claiming that Hitler or Himmler were Catholics at a time when the Pope was composing Mit Brennender Sorge is an outright canard. For all I know, that may well be nothing more than you trying to come up with something to feel better about the fact that so many Bolsheviks were Jews. Again, I'll let you deal with it. I'm sure the Hitchens/Dawkins crowd will cheer you on, but don't expect any agreement from those who aren't already in the business of pointing fingers.

    Muslims believe in Jesus, too. It doesn't make them Christians. The same can be said of whatever Nietzschean for Fichtean or Hegelian concept that Hitler believed in once he stopped believing in Christianity but still kept referring to when he mentioned Providence or God -- assuming he believed in anything.

    On that point [genuine faith being unnecessary for Jewish identity], both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.

    Both also attribute the Führer’s celibacy to the intensity of his devotion to the cause, rather than to more believable factors such as perversion or impotence.

    • Replies: @Peter Akuleyev
    There is also evidence that the Füher's "celibacy" was a myth, useful both for Hitler and later for his enemies. He was no JFK to be sure, but he and Eva most likely had a normal sexual relationship from the early 1930s on. Hitler made a lot of effort to cover up most of his personal life, including his WWI life and his youth in Vienna, so evidence of any visits to prostitutes or early girfriends probably got scrubbed.
  104. This lady – Rabbi Laura Janner-Klausner – was on the BBC in January arguing that ex-SS guards should hunted down and prosecuted no matter what.

    Meanwhile, her father is in the news:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3046992/Why-Labour-Peer-Lord-Janner-not-prosecuted-dementia-19-defendants-suffering-disease-convicted-sex-crimes-TEN-past-year.html#ixzz3YBiCMy3W

    It seems that he wont be charged, too ill you see.

    Even if true one has stand back in awe of the chutzpah of Rabbi Laura Janner-Klausner and the BBC in talking to her on the matter.

    • Replies: @Olorin
    Rabbi Laura is transparent. She has learned something very useful.

    If you want to get even with Dad, blame Nazis. But give Dad a pass. Blood is thicker than law.
  105. @Desiderius
    Slezkine's right.

    Hitler functions exactly as an anti-Christ for the Prog ruling caste.

    Where Christ once functioned as a lodestar guiding the character development of a hundred generations through his Imitation*, so now Hitler has replaced Him through the avoidance of anything that smacks of Hitlerism. Instead of the now hokey "what would Jesus do?" with the implication of seeking to do one's best to do likewise, we now have "what would Hitler do?" and then doing the opposite.

    Only when it completely sinks in just how pathetic this is in both practice and effect will it pass from fashion. Either that or it's widespread adoption by the great masses, making it hokey and freeing up the Imitation of Christ as an option again.

    * – see:

    My copy was a gift from my (Presbyterian) pastor growing up, one of the finest men I’ve known; given to me as I left for seminary. It remains at my bedside.

  106. @Mark Caplan
    It'd be interesting to trace the origin of the myth that the Nazis were atheists. The Nazis positioned themselves as the antithesis and blood enemy of the Communists, who of course really were atheists. Of the big four of Nazi Germany, three -- Hitler, Goebbels, and Himmler -- were Catholic. Himmler was so Catholic that Hitler used to jokingly refer to him as my Ignatius Loyola. The fourth bigshot, Goering, was almost certainly Catholic. His mother was Catholic and he came from an overwhelmingly Catholic region of Germany. In their writings and speeches, God and Divine Providence are mentioned often enough to erase any doubt they believed in Him. And certainly the vast majority of their devoted followers were believers too.

    Are you sure that this so called Mark Caplan character isn’t someone ( Derb ? ) having a laugh with a spot of mischievous bomb throwing ?

    I think that reasonably well known map of Germany showing the Nazi vote and the religion of the region shows that Nazism had it’s least support in the majority Catholic regions of the country

  107. @Reg Cæsar

    On that point [genuine faith being unnecessary for Jewish identity], both Jews and anti-Semites are in curious agreement.
     
    Both also attribute the Führer's celibacy to the intensity of his devotion to the cause, rather than to more believable factors such as perversion or impotence.

    There is also evidence that the Füher’s “celibacy” was a myth, useful both for Hitler and later for his enemies. He was no JFK to be sure, but he and Eva most likely had a normal sexual relationship from the early 1930s on. Hitler made a lot of effort to cover up most of his personal life, including his WWI life and his youth in Vienna, so evidence of any visits to prostitutes or early girfriends probably got scrubbed.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    …so evidence of any visits to prostitutes or early girfriends probably got scrubbed.
     
    …or boyfriends. Christopher Isherwood famously blurted, "Berlin means boys!" Vienna and Munich probably offered the same, if not quite to the world champion level of Berlin.
  108. The prosecution of the SS officer who served as an accountant at Auschwitz-Birkenau is beyond groteque. He never sought to hide what he had done and even gave presentations about it to schoolchildren, as a “Don’t make the same mistakes I did,” type of lesson. And now facing prosecution in his 90s. Even some of the witnesses have said they don’t favor jail time. Except to continue to demonize Germans in general, I see no purpose in this action. But, leaving all the religious symbolism aside, the Nazis seem to be everyone’s perfect villain. Here in France there is a television program about some aspect of the Second World War (almost never the Pacific Theater) every third night. Granted we are near the 70 year anniversary of the end of World War II, which might account for some of it, but it seems to me that there’s definitely an agenda here.

    • Replies: @HA
    "He never sought to hide what he had done and even gave presentations about it to schoolchildren,..."

    His memoir was written as a reaction against Holocaust deniers:


    He retired in the mid-nineteen-eighties.... A devoted philatelist, he got to know a fellow stamp collector who, it turned out, was a Holocaust denier. The collector gave him a pamphlet called “The Auschwitz Lie.” Gröning felt compelled to point out that the supposed “lies” were true; all the horrors that were said to have taken place at Auschwitz had indeed happened. He should know, since he was there. Gröning sent the pamphlet back to the collector, with his comments. A few months later, the comments appeared as a letter to the editor in an extreme right-wing magazine. Gröning, the onetime Nazi, began getting phone calls from incensed neo-Nazis.

    Gröning set out to write a chronicle of what he had seen...
     

    http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/02/16/last-trial
  109. “Nazism was unique in the consistency and simplicity of its theodicy. … A universe presided over by Man received an identifiable and historically distinct group of human beings as its first flesh-and-blood devil. The identity of the group might change, but the humanization and nationalization of evil proved durable. When the Nazi prophets were exposed as impostors and slain in the apocalypse they had unleashed, it was they who emerged as the new devil in a world without God — the only absolute in the Post-Prophetic Age.”

    And the people bowed and prayed………

    ………………..to the Nazi God they made.

  110. “Art Deco says:

    The theory’s kinda dumb. Military spending as a share of domestic product has varied wildly according to external circumstances since 1940 and the military itself has suffered several major shakeouts.”

    An unsurprisingly incorrect statement, coming from you that is.

    No, George’s theory isn’t dumb. Your casually thoughtless dismissal of it is, though. Since 1950, military spending has fluctuated about a mean that is higher than that of most of the rest of our history. Cold war, hot war, war on terror – whatever – military spending in real dollars is much higher than it was for most of the time prior to 1940. Eisenhower himself, who was a product of the military industrial complex, warned the nation against the entrenched bureaucracy that the Pentagon had become. And he knew a good deal about the subject. Certainly a lot more than you do.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Eisenhower himself, who was a product of the military industrial complex, warned the nation against the entrenched bureaucracy that the Pentagon had become. And he knew a good deal about the subject. Certainly a lot more than you do.
    --
    Eisenhower presided over a peace-time military which consumed (in 1956) north of 11% of gross domestic product. He spent most of his professional career in a military which consumed 1%. Yes, he noticed the contrast. Military spending as a share of domestic product declined almost monotonically from 1953 to 1978. It declined during the VietNam War after the first two years. It increased again from 1978 to 1985, then declined from 1985 to 2000, then increased for seven years, then declined for seven years. At 3.8% of domestic product, it's very near a post-1940 nadir (and a shade over a third of what it was when Eisenhower made that speech).
  111. M says:

    Afaik, the Nazis came from the Catholic parts of the country while being voted for by the modernist and Prussianised parts of the country.

    Interesting mix of ideologies from those areas for that reason ( the stuff that looks modernist like eugenics or militarist comes from the north an east, while the traditionalism came from the south).

  112. more generously helping the refugees that seek asylum in our country

    It’s tragically ironic that in their neurotic efforts to expiate their grandfathers’ crimes against the Jews, these idiots are importing a new population that will finally render Europe (western Europe anyway) judenrein.

    Slezkine is interesting but I’m never sure, when reading him, if I’m reading history or epic poetry.

  113. There’s no business like Shoah business!

  114. Matra says:

    In Russia this week a toy store was searched by police because they supposedly had German toy soldiers. That was deemed to be inciting hate and offending the dignity of Soviet veterans. Link

    Also in Russia a journalist was convicted and fined for showing an historic photo of German soldiers standing by a swastika.

    The further away we get from WW2 the more hysterical the world gets. It’s the same with slavery and segregation. The Nazis and racists of the past are just too useful for some to let go.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    I always thought the Russians weren't as flakey about the whole Nazi thing as western countries...
  115. @Peter Akuleyev
    There is also evidence that the Füher's "celibacy" was a myth, useful both for Hitler and later for his enemies. He was no JFK to be sure, but he and Eva most likely had a normal sexual relationship from the early 1930s on. Hitler made a lot of effort to cover up most of his personal life, including his WWI life and his youth in Vienna, so evidence of any visits to prostitutes or early girfriends probably got scrubbed.

    …so evidence of any visits to prostitutes or early girfriends probably got scrubbed.

    …or boyfriends. Christopher Isherwood famously blurted, “Berlin means boys!” Vienna and Munich probably offered the same, if not quite to the world champion level of Berlin.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The spectacle of Christopher Isherwood being quoted to prove a (shamelessly false) point about Adolf Hitler is too ludicrous for more than a few words:
    Hitler hated Berlin, precisely because it was such a den of iniquity and, don't forget, Communism as well. Neither Munich (which he loved) nor Vienna (which he hated even more than Berlin) were more vicious than any other large city of the time.
    But it would be true to say that the Führer was not much bothered about homosexuality: Röhm and his boys were killed, not for their habits, but because they had got in the way of that famous will to power.
  116. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    …so evidence of any visits to prostitutes or early girfriends probably got scrubbed.
     
    …or boyfriends. Christopher Isherwood famously blurted, "Berlin means boys!" Vienna and Munich probably offered the same, if not quite to the world champion level of Berlin.

    The spectacle of Christopher Isherwood being quoted to prove a (shamelessly false) point about Adolf Hitler is too ludicrous for more than a few words:
    Hitler hated Berlin, precisely because it was such a den of iniquity and, don’t forget, Communism as well. Neither Munich (which he loved) nor Vienna (which he hated even more than Berlin) were more vicious than any other large city of the time.
    But it would be true to say that the Führer was not much bothered about homosexuality: Röhm and his boys were killed, not for their habits, but because they had got in the way of that famous will to power.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    Hitler hated Berlin, precisely because it was such a den of iniquity and, don’t forget, Communism as well.
     
    Jimmy Swaggart thought the same of New Orleans, but that didn't stop him from visiting the locals in the city's motels.

    I wasn't suggesting that Hitler was queer-- no one knows which kind of pervert he was-- just that if you're going to bring up the subject of prostitution, you have to look at both kinds.
  117. @Ryan Andrews
    Ironically, a better headline for that essay would be "The Banality of Propaganda."

    “Ironically, a better headline for that essay would be “The Banality of Propaganda.””

    And who better to consult on that than the founder of modern propaganda and the entire PR industry, Edward Bernays?

    You know, Anna Freud’s boychik:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

    We know so little of the actual history and truths of the 20th century in Europe thanks to the fact that Bernays and his buds owned and controlled so much of the automated mass mind engineering even then.

    When I was taking my Ph.D. in mass comms research, I was stunned even then by how the entire field–research, media corporations, academe, NGOs and the foundations/individuals who funded them–were so closely held.

    The irony is that, today, lefty types can assert that Germans will always be “nazis” because genome.

    Try to get them to see that’s the case for the Gentle Giants and St. Sandwiches, and they’ll screech their heads off.

    (Not that I believe Germans are nazis. In fact, since leaving academe I’ve grown sizeable doubts about every bit of received wisdom on all that. I’m also starting to suspect that Bernays and his friends were peeved because Leni and Joe were better propagandists in the filmic media.)

    Blacks learned from the Chosenites how to play the role of the Biggest Victims in the History of Ever…even with the common meme of having once been slaves.

    I think we should put both races in a jar, telling one, yes, we believe all your We Were Slaves in Egypt stuff, and the other, yes, we believe all that You Built The Pyramids By Flying stuff, so were in charge of Egypt and all those slaves. Make some popcorn. Shake the jar. Sit back.

    We’ve been held hostage by these entities for long enough.

  118. The Nazi’s … the gift that keeps on giving.

    As many have noted, if Hitler didn’t exist they’d have had to invent him.

    ~~~

    A couple quickies:

    As many responders to Mark Caplan’s i-really-hate-Christians! comment (yes, Mark we know; we know) have pointed out, the Nazi’s were not actually right-wing in the traditional European “traditionalist” or “conservative” sense. They were rabidly anti-communist\Jewish, but still big-staters themselves and not fond of Europe’s traditional institutions–the Church or other civil society. They were in fact, tear-it-down-and-do-over radicals. (I’m fairly ignorant of Spanish history, but if you want a dictator of the era who was right-wing in a traditionalist sense–Franco is closer to fitting the bill.)

    The best analogy to the Nazi’s today, i’d say, are the homos of the homintern, who have torn up the ultimate traditionalist tradition–marriage–to remake as something else, and are now busy using state power to hunt down and humiliate, dispossess any traditionalist holdouts. (Fortunately they don’t have camps yet–though mandatory “re-education” for dissidents, taking away their children for “child abuse”, that sort of thing coming down the road in a few years wouldn’t surprise me.)

    Secondly, the Nazi’s\WWII has been used by the left\Jews\globalists to delegitimate “nationalism”. And while the Nazi’s were certainly anti-communist and German nationalist, the lesson of WWII really should have been to delegitimate *imperialism*–as that’s what was going on. Although the (Euro) resistance groups were often communist, the basic popular resistance–and the whole Allied war effort–was basically a nationalist one: German (or Japanese) invader get the @%#*@&# outta my country!

    The simplest explanation for the world war that gets at the kernel of it:
    “Two nations of highly competent peoples–Germany and Japan–were late to the imperialism party and the early movers had gobbled up the best loot. They launched a war of conquest to create empires of their own, befitting the status they believed the deserved.”

  119. @Lurker
    This lady - Rabbi Laura Janner-Klausner - was on the BBC in January arguing that ex-SS guards should hunted down and prosecuted no matter what.

    https://youtu.be/iwRdLCUJ_rg?t=649

    Meanwhile, her father is in the news:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3046992/Why-Labour-Peer-Lord-Janner-not-prosecuted-dementia-19-defendants-suffering-disease-convicted-sex-crimes-TEN-past-year.html#ixzz3YBiCMy3W

    It seems that he wont be charged, too ill you see.

    Even if true one has stand back in awe of the chutzpah of Rabbi Laura Janner-Klausner and the BBC in talking to her on the matter.

    Rabbi Laura is transparent. She has learned something very useful.

    If you want to get even with Dad, blame Nazis. But give Dad a pass. Blood is thicker than law.

  120. Another aspect of this article–it’s another demonstration of the disaster of empowering women in politics.

    Women have many fine qualities–their nurturing instinct among them. And they can be quite level-headed, pragmatic, even bloody-minded when it comes to immediate, tangible concerns involving the well being of their own children.

    But they are not generally logical thinkers–almost none are numeric thinkers–have little big picture sense. And while women can help “civilize” a man–bring him to his place in the civilized order–women do not actually *create* civilization; men do. Women have little idea why their nation is civilized–orderly, safe, comfortable–and what is required to maintain it. They tend toward rather narrow, specific, *personal* reactions to events. And are suckers for emotional leftist “unfair” and “we need to help” narratives; completely missing any larger thoughts of incentives and imperatives of societal functioning. Their distinguishing features from men–emotionalism and nurturing–are just *terrible* qualities for political thought and maintaining a civilization.

    Anna Sauerbray looks like a reasonably attractive, if bookish, woman in her fertile years. And no doubt has a decent verbal IQ. If confined to Kinder, Küche, Kirche, managing three or four kinder she’d no doubt be doing a good job, be a fine “PTA mom”, would actually be helping Germany instead of hurting it and would almost certainly be happier. But instead of doing what she was built for–and would be good at–she’s been given a job lecturing Germans with her lemming like, tedious inanities. Absent children–i’m betting–her nurturing instincts contorted into a (standard issue) pathological altruism that is destroying her nation.

    ~~

    Note: i’m well aware that noting any of this, does not advance the nationalist cause or help save the West\white man from the abyss. Nationalists like myself have to convince folks–including women. And today’s feminist indoctrinated women generally can’t take any criticism that suggest males are actually superior at anything–that females aren’t god’s chosen. But … that’s sure how things look. Though the US still looked like a sane society in 1960 after several decades of female suffrage, I think we jumped onto a slippery slide when the franchise expanded beyond male property owners. The men who keep civilization civilized are the ones who are fit to make decisions about its direction. As the passengers start calling the shots the ship starts to founder.

    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    An excellent post. I think universal female suffrage was doing alright until around the 1960s because mass broadcast media hadn't really taken hold until then. Cheaper TVs, transistor radios and mass circulation glossy magazines gave the flatterers and panderers a foot in the door like never before in human history. For straight, White, Gentile men the mass media acts as the slanderer, the accuser; for everyone else it's the flatterer and panderer.
    , @JSM
    Hi, Another Dad...

    When you get done analyzing the faults of us women (for which I *am* grateful), could you kindly SPEAK to your young men?

    Because, HOLY COW, White young, unmarried, men managed to ONLY vote against B. Obama 52%. 52%. In view of the fact that White, young, unmarried men are taking the brunt of feminist/anti-White policies, it should have been NINETY percent against Obama, if young, White, unmarried men had any sense.


    (Meanwhile, married White women voted against Obama 63%.)

    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2012/10/obama-v-romney-demographics-draw-your.html
  121. @countenance
    Aren't pictures of Auschwitz itself good enough to guilt us all into letting the whole world flood in?

    Recently the Daily Mail had a photo of well fed children in Auschwitz, liberated by Russians. Including babes in arms. The babies themselves undermine the narrative.

    Another article – Mengele we are informed inspected every new arrival to the camp. How many people were sent to Auschwitz again?

    Its so hard to keep track given that certain facts are allowed to change freely.

  122. @AnotherDad
    Another aspect of this article--it's another demonstration of the disaster of empowering women in politics.

    Women have many fine qualities--their nurturing instinct among them. And they can be quite level-headed, pragmatic, even bloody-minded when it comes to immediate, tangible concerns involving the well being of their own children.

    But they are not generally logical thinkers--almost none are numeric thinkers--have little big picture sense. And while women can help "civilize" a man--bring him to his place in the civilized order--women do not actually *create* civilization; men do. Women have little idea why their nation is civilized--orderly, safe, comfortable--and what is required to maintain it. They tend toward rather narrow, specific, *personal* reactions to events. And are suckers for emotional leftist "unfair" and "we need to help" narratives; completely missing any larger thoughts of incentives and imperatives of societal functioning. Their distinguishing features from men--emotionalism and nurturing--are just *terrible* qualities for political thought and maintaining a civilization.

    Anna Sauerbray looks like a reasonably attractive, if bookish, woman in her fertile years. And no doubt has a decent verbal IQ. If confined to Kinder, Küche, Kirche, managing three or four kinder she'd no doubt be doing a good job, be a fine "PTA mom", would actually be helping Germany instead of hurting it and would almost certainly be happier. But instead of doing what she was built for--and would be good at--she's been given a job lecturing Germans with her lemming like, tedious inanities. Absent children--i'm betting--her nurturing instincts contorted into a (standard issue) pathological altruism that is destroying her nation.

    ~~

    Note: i'm well aware that noting any of this, does not advance the nationalist cause or help save the West\white man from the abyss. Nationalists like myself have to convince folks--including women. And today's feminist indoctrinated women generally can't take any criticism that suggest males are actually superior at anything--that females aren't god's chosen. But ... that's sure how things look. Though the US still looked like a sane society in 1960 after several decades of female suffrage, I think we jumped onto a slippery slide when the franchise expanded beyond male property owners. The men who keep civilization civilized are the ones who are fit to make decisions about its direction. As the passengers start calling the shots the ship starts to founder.

    An excellent post. I think universal female suffrage was doing alright until around the 1960s because mass broadcast media hadn’t really taken hold until then. Cheaper TVs, transistor radios and mass circulation glossy magazines gave the flatterers and panderers a foot in the door like never before in human history. For straight, White, Gentile men the mass media acts as the slanderer, the accuser; for everyone else it’s the flatterer and panderer.

  123. @Mr. Anon
    "Art Deco says:

    @George

    The theory’s kinda dumb. Military spending as a share of domestic product has varied wildly according to external circumstances since 1940 and the military itself has suffered several major shakeouts."

    An unsurprisingly incorrect statement, coming from you that is.

    No, George's theory isn't dumb. Your casually thoughtless dismissal of it is, though. Since 1950, military spending has fluctuated about a mean that is higher than that of most of the rest of our history. Cold war, hot war, war on terror - whatever - military spending in real dollars is much higher than it was for most of the time prior to 1940. Eisenhower himself, who was a product of the military industrial complex, warned the nation against the entrenched bureaucracy that the Pentagon had become. And he knew a good deal about the subject. Certainly a lot more than you do.

    Eisenhower himself, who was a product of the military industrial complex, warned the nation against the entrenched bureaucracy that the Pentagon had become. And he knew a good deal about the subject. Certainly a lot more than you do.

    Eisenhower presided over a peace-time military which consumed (in 1956) north of 11% of gross domestic product. He spent most of his professional career in a military which consumed 1%. Yes, he noticed the contrast. Military spending as a share of domestic product declined almost monotonically from 1953 to 1978. It declined during the VietNam War after the first two years. It increased again from 1978 to 1985, then declined from 1985 to 2000, then increased for seven years, then declined for seven years. At 3.8% of domestic product, it’s very near a post-1940 nadir (and a shade over a third of what it was when Eisenhower made that speech).

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    In real dollars (i.e. fixed dollars) the average post-war military budget is much higher than it typically was before 1940. Real dollars buy real bullets. It is not clear to me why defence spending should track GDP. One should spend enough for an adequate defence (or even a more than adequate defence) and no more. Our military spending is way out of proportion to what we need to defend ourselves. We spend as much as we do because we are an empire that seeks to push the rest of the world around. It doesn't make us safer. Quite the contrary.
  124. HA says:
    @Diversity Heretic
    The prosecution of the SS officer who served as an accountant at Auschwitz-Birkenau is beyond groteque. He never sought to hide what he had done and even gave presentations about it to schoolchildren, as a "Don't make the same mistakes I did," type of lesson. And now facing prosecution in his 90s. Even some of the witnesses have said they don't favor jail time. Except to continue to demonize Germans in general, I see no purpose in this action. But, leaving all the religious symbolism aside, the Nazis seem to be everyone's perfect villain. Here in France there is a television program about some aspect of the Second World War (almost never the Pacific Theater) every third night. Granted we are near the 70 year anniversary of the end of World War II, which might account for some of it, but it seems to me that there's definitely an agenda here.

    “He never sought to hide what he had done and even gave presentations about it to schoolchildren,…”

    His memoir was written as a reaction against Holocaust deniers:

    He retired in the mid-nineteen-eighties…. A devoted philatelist, he got to know a fellow stamp collector who, it turned out, was a Holocaust denier. The collector gave him a pamphlet called “The Auschwitz Lie.” Gröning felt compelled to point out that the supposed “lies” were true; all the horrors that were said to have taken place at Auschwitz had indeed happened. He should know, since he was there. Gröning sent the pamphlet back to the collector, with his comments. A few months later, the comments appeared as a letter to the editor in an extreme right-wing magazine. Gröning, the onetime Nazi, began getting phone calls from incensed neo-Nazis.

    Gröning set out to write a chronicle of what he had seen…

    http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/02/16/last-trial

  125. Off Topic:

    Steve can you do a post about all these Americans that need rescuing in the Middle East and other places?

    Something tells me some of these people are immigrants that went back to their country of origin. After all how many real American non, Oil Company, DOD or State Department people can their possible be in places like Yemen? Do we really owe these people some kind of “emergency evacuation” insurance?

  126. @Art Deco
    Eisenhower himself, who was a product of the military industrial complex, warned the nation against the entrenched bureaucracy that the Pentagon had become. And he knew a good deal about the subject. Certainly a lot more than you do.
    --
    Eisenhower presided over a peace-time military which consumed (in 1956) north of 11% of gross domestic product. He spent most of his professional career in a military which consumed 1%. Yes, he noticed the contrast. Military spending as a share of domestic product declined almost monotonically from 1953 to 1978. It declined during the VietNam War after the first two years. It increased again from 1978 to 1985, then declined from 1985 to 2000, then increased for seven years, then declined for seven years. At 3.8% of domestic product, it's very near a post-1940 nadir (and a shade over a third of what it was when Eisenhower made that speech).

    In real dollars (i.e. fixed dollars) the average post-war military budget is much higher than it typically was before 1940. Real dollars buy real bullets. It is not clear to me why defence spending should track GDP. One should spend enough for an adequate defence (or even a more than adequate defence) and no more. Our military spending is way out of proportion to what we need to defend ourselves. We spend as much as we do because we are an empire that seeks to push the rest of the world around. It doesn’t make us safer. Quite the contrary.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    It is not clear to me why defence spending should track GDP.
    --
    Because of technological advancements and increasing compensation in the non-military sector. No, the military is not going to pay 1940 wages to its recruits.
  127. … they should drop everything to find a technological fix for keeping old Nazis alive so we will never live in an age without trials of Nazis… …we could invent time travel, a Time Masheen to take us back to 1939 when Charlie Chaplin tried to conquer the world.

    Steve,

    You’re not thinking big enough.

    In the collection of alt history sci fi stories called Hitler Victorious, there’s a story about a future when technology is so advanced and SJWs are so dominant that they go back in time to kidnap/arrest the villains of history to put them on trial in the future.

    Why keep any old Nazis alive when we could put Hitler on trial any time we want?

  128. @Jack D
    Apparently the Mufti of Jerusalem (Arafat's uncle) got along swimmingly with the Nazis. They took him to see at least one concentration camp and he liked what he saw.

    So the mufti of Jerusalem (who it now emerges was also Arafat’s uncle) consorted with Hitler and liked concentration camps. From a modem propaganda perspective, that is a really fortunate set of linkages.

  129. @Mr. Anon
    In real dollars (i.e. fixed dollars) the average post-war military budget is much higher than it typically was before 1940. Real dollars buy real bullets. It is not clear to me why defence spending should track GDP. One should spend enough for an adequate defence (or even a more than adequate defence) and no more. Our military spending is way out of proportion to what we need to defend ourselves. We spend as much as we do because we are an empire that seeks to push the rest of the world around. It doesn't make us safer. Quite the contrary.

    It is not clear to me why defence spending should track GDP.

    Because of technological advancements and increasing compensation in the non-military sector. No, the military is not going to pay 1940 wages to its recruits.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    Right, and that alone explains why we have a military presence in a hundred or more countries.

    Your explanation - as usual - explains nothing.
  130. JSM says:
    @AnotherDad
    Another aspect of this article--it's another demonstration of the disaster of empowering women in politics.

    Women have many fine qualities--their nurturing instinct among them. And they can be quite level-headed, pragmatic, even bloody-minded when it comes to immediate, tangible concerns involving the well being of their own children.

    But they are not generally logical thinkers--almost none are numeric thinkers--have little big picture sense. And while women can help "civilize" a man--bring him to his place in the civilized order--women do not actually *create* civilization; men do. Women have little idea why their nation is civilized--orderly, safe, comfortable--and what is required to maintain it. They tend toward rather narrow, specific, *personal* reactions to events. And are suckers for emotional leftist "unfair" and "we need to help" narratives; completely missing any larger thoughts of incentives and imperatives of societal functioning. Their distinguishing features from men--emotionalism and nurturing--are just *terrible* qualities for political thought and maintaining a civilization.

    Anna Sauerbray looks like a reasonably attractive, if bookish, woman in her fertile years. And no doubt has a decent verbal IQ. If confined to Kinder, Küche, Kirche, managing three or four kinder she'd no doubt be doing a good job, be a fine "PTA mom", would actually be helping Germany instead of hurting it and would almost certainly be happier. But instead of doing what she was built for--and would be good at--she's been given a job lecturing Germans with her lemming like, tedious inanities. Absent children--i'm betting--her nurturing instincts contorted into a (standard issue) pathological altruism that is destroying her nation.

    ~~

    Note: i'm well aware that noting any of this, does not advance the nationalist cause or help save the West\white man from the abyss. Nationalists like myself have to convince folks--including women. And today's feminist indoctrinated women generally can't take any criticism that suggest males are actually superior at anything--that females aren't god's chosen. But ... that's sure how things look. Though the US still looked like a sane society in 1960 after several decades of female suffrage, I think we jumped onto a slippery slide when the franchise expanded beyond male property owners. The men who keep civilization civilized are the ones who are fit to make decisions about its direction. As the passengers start calling the shots the ship starts to founder.

    Hi, Another Dad…

    When you get done analyzing the faults of us women (for which I *am* grateful), could you kindly SPEAK to your young men?

    Because, HOLY COW, White young, unmarried, men managed to ONLY vote against B. Obama 52%. 52%. In view of the fact that White, young, unmarried men are taking the brunt of feminist/anti-White policies, it should have been NINETY percent against Obama, if young, White, unmarried men had any sense.

    (Meanwhile, married White women voted against Obama 63%.)

    http://isteve.blogspot.com/2012/10/obama-v-romney-demographics-draw-your.html

  131. @Art Deco
    It is not clear to me why defence spending should track GDP.
    --
    Because of technological advancements and increasing compensation in the non-military sector. No, the military is not going to pay 1940 wages to its recruits.

    Right, and that alone explains why we have a military presence in a hundred or more countries.

    Your explanation – as usual – explains nothing.

  132. @Anonymous
    The spectacle of Christopher Isherwood being quoted to prove a (shamelessly false) point about Adolf Hitler is too ludicrous for more than a few words:
    Hitler hated Berlin, precisely because it was such a den of iniquity and, don't forget, Communism as well. Neither Munich (which he loved) nor Vienna (which he hated even more than Berlin) were more vicious than any other large city of the time.
    But it would be true to say that the Führer was not much bothered about homosexuality: Röhm and his boys were killed, not for their habits, but because they had got in the way of that famous will to power.

    Hitler hated Berlin, precisely because it was such a den of iniquity and, don’t forget, Communism as well.

    Jimmy Swaggart thought the same of New Orleans, but that didn’t stop him from visiting the locals in the city’s motels.

    I wasn’t suggesting that Hitler was queer– no one knows which kind of pervert he was– just that if you’re going to bring up the subject of prostitution, you have to look at both kinds.

  133. @Matra
    In Russia this week a toy store was searched by police because they supposedly had German toy soldiers. That was deemed to be inciting hate and offending the dignity of Soviet veterans. Link

    Also in Russia a journalist was convicted and fined for showing an historic photo of German soldiers standing by a swastika.

    The further away we get from WW2 the more hysterical the world gets. It's the same with slavery and segregation. The Nazis and racists of the past are just too useful for some to let go.

    I always thought the Russians weren’t as flakey about the whole Nazi thing as western countries…

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