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From Chalkbeat New York:

It’s official: New York’s prospective teachers will no longer have to pass controversial literacy exam

By Monica Disare Mar 13, 2017, 4:04pm EDT

State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.

Prospective teachers will no longer have to take the Academic Literacy Skills Test, an exam designed to measure reading and writing ability. The decision marks a significant rollback of the state’s certification requirements, but officials said the literacy test had become an unnecessary hurdle for prospective teachers.

“The issue is not that literacy is not important, literacy is everything,” said Regent Kathleen Cashin, who chairs the board’s committee on higher education. “It’s just that if you have a flawed test, does that raise standards or does that lower standards?”

She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites. Who ever heard of such a thing? That’s utterly anomalous.

The literacy test, which became mandatory in 2014, was one of several requirements the state added to overhaul teacher preparation in 2009. Regents hoped that a slate of more rigorous exams would help better prepare teachers for the real-life demands of the job and make for a more qualified teaching force.

In total, teachers have had to clear four certification hurdles, including the literacy exam. The other exams ask teachers to demonstrate their teaching skills, content knowledge, and understanding of students with particular needs.

Though the intent was to create a more qualified teaching workforce, officials argued Monday the overhaul did not work out as planned — providing an unnecessary roadblock for prospective teachers. The exam faced legal challenges after a low percentage of black and Hispanic students passed the test. Only 38 percent of aspiring black teachers and 46 percent of aspiring Hispanic teachers passed the test between September 2013 and June 2016, compared to 69 percent of their white peers, according to the state education department officials.

Well! I never!

 
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  1. Anonymous[264] • Disclaimer says:

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.

    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.

    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    • Replies: @Alfa158
    @Anonymous

    The people who set that standard issued an explanation of why. In brief:

    Asians, Blacks, Latinos, Jews etc, are real people with a distinctive culture and identity. People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity. They are officially described as people who subscribe to the delusion that they are something called white, therefore the word is not capitalized.

    At least that’s the the official explanation, in actuality the people who conform to this standard are happy do so because they believe Whites, or at least Whites other than Whites like themselves, are evil and inferior.

    Replies: @El Dato, @Polistra, @Reg Cæsar

    , @Buzz Mohawk
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    It's because if you capitalize us, we become really, really dangerous, like, we might circumnavigate the globe, go to the Moon, invent stuff and basically make everyone else look like the losers they are.

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?
     
    Oh sure they do, but now they go by Anonymous[265], Anonymous[266] and Anonymous[267].

    Replies: @Redmen

    , @bomag
    @Anonymous

    Svigor: last comment 2/6/21

    (((owen))): last comment 4/30/21

    Lot: last comment 5/25/21 (thanks, Greenwich Mean Time).

    , @kaganovitch
    @Anonymous

    Lot posted just today in the attention span thread. I guess you got bored b4 you saw it?

    , @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    In case you're not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    Replies: @photondancer, @Anonymous, @Jonathan Mason, @Triteleia Laxa, @JerseyJeffersonian

    , @Neuday
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    There is a certain group of people who, if White were capitalized, would hear cossack hoofbeats and boxcars opening. When they said "Never again", this is what they meant.
    , @Foreign Expert
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    What’s the justification for referring to Asians as Asians but not referring to Africans as Africans?
  2. The regents comprise 17 members elected by the State Legislature for 5 year terms: 1 from each of the State’s 13 judicial districts and 4 members who serve at large.

    They look like a bunch of diverse soccer moms.

    Not that I care about those nitwit regents, but they’re a bunch of politically connected, left wing doctors (of education, psychology, etc.), ex-educrats, and lawyers.

    Even if the NY Board of Regents were comprised of the Harvard Club of NYC, the NYS public education system would still suck. The schools are governed by thousands of regulations. The two worst are compulsory attendance (everyone has to go to school) and the 180d school @6+ hrs school “year” (school needs v to be expensive).

  3. “Regents hoped that a slate of rigorous exams would help better prepare teachers for real life demands of the job and make for a more qualified teaching force.” In many of the schools, they’d be better off rigorously training for a black belt in one of the various martial arts to prepare for REAL life demands. And deeper into the black hole we go…

  4. We are already seeing trends of parents moving from blue states to red states because of this bullshit, but, no matter what state you’re in, the Federal Government and Woke Capitalism is a motherfucker. I wonder if we will eventually see significant trends of parents moving their families out of America.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @JimDandy

    Where’d you’d think they’d try to go?

    Replies: @John Derbyshire

    , @Shel100
    @JimDandy

    The same thing is going on in most other western countries.

    , @Rob
    @JimDandy

    I think that a right-leaning government in South America, perhaps when Argentina has one, will try to get US whites to immigrate as the screws tighten in America. Thing is, the screws are tightening already, but we do not seem to realize it. The younger you are, and the lower on the class ladder you are, the faster the screws are tightening. Young white men from the working class have pretty much zero chance of going to an Ivy, a ‘hidden Ivy’ or one of the exclusive private colleges. The ambitious ones see blacks with much less ability going to great schools. This breeds a lot of resentment from smart guys who are not pro-man class or higher. Rich whites are not the victims of AA, middle and working clsss white guys are. I think this led to the alt right MAGA phenomenon.

    Maybe try learning some Spanish? My dad wanted to move to Argentina when I was a kid. My mom did not, though. There is a fairly large American community in Argentina. They send their kids to schools that are half in Spanish and half in English. They probably make less money than equivalent Americans here, but they sure do live pleasant lives. Lots of steak dinners lasting until late at night. Servants if they want them, because unskilled labor is really cheap there. The inflation was crazy, but if you keep your assets in America or soon, China, you can build wealth.

    I do not know, however, how South America will turn out as America declines. Argentina has potential,nthough. With millions of American whites, it would be first world again in no time.

    It would be somewhat ironic for conservative whites, many of whom are against immigration, to become immigrants themselves. I think that we recognize the difference between immigrants who bring value, both genetic and cultural. And those with subpar nature and nurture. If five million Japanese wanted to immigrate to America, I would probably welcome them. They are smart and civilized. Contact with Japanese culture could improve aspects of our culture. Five million Guatemalan peasants? I would prefer it if they stayed home. Or migrated to Mexico, a country with similar Indio peasant stock.

    Replies: @Alden, @JimDandy, @vhrm

  5. Yet another objective measure falls by the wayside. BTW it’s not too reassuring that only 69 percent of white teachers passed

    • Replies: @Polistra
    @Known Fact

    Indeed. The stupidity of many teachers--particularly in places like New York--is a real impediment blocking 'education reform'.


    The literacy test, which became mandatory in 2014, was one of several requirements the state added to overhaul teacher preparation in 2009. Regents hoped that a slate of more rigorous exams would help better prepare teachers for the real-life demands of the job and make for a more qualified teaching force.
     
    Just sounds racist, dunnit?
    , @Thomm
    @Known Fact


    BTW it’s not too reassuring that only 69 percent of white teachers passed
     
    It is a female-dominated profession. What do you expect?
    , @AnotherDad
    @Known Fact


    Yet another objective measure falls by the wayside.
     
    This is your nation on minoritarianism. Objective measures need not apply.


    (Seriously we had that sort of "objective measures" "white bread" nation in 1960--it was prosperous and pleasant. But the special people found it scary ... so it had to go.)
  6. There is a cheaper and more accurate test to judge a teacher candidate and it only takes a glance to administer.

    • LOL: Old Prude
    • Replies: @Old Prude
    @UNIT472

    It's funny, because its true.

  7. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    The people who set that standard issued an explanation of why. In brief:

    Asians, Blacks, Latinos, Jews etc, are real people with a distinctive culture and identity. People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity. They are officially described as people who subscribe to the delusion that they are something called white, therefore the word is not capitalized.

    At least that’s the the official explanation, in actuality the people who conform to this standard are happy do so because they believe Whites, or at least Whites other than Whites like themselves, are evil and inferior.

    • Agree: Element59
    • Replies: @El Dato
    @Alfa158

    "Exterminate all the white brutes!"

    , @Polistra
    @Alfa158

    Exactly so, yet it still perplexes me when I see "Black and brown" together in a sentence.

    Hey! Those are two colors of bear. Can we start calling ourselves Polar People?

    Replies: @Triteleia Laxa

    , @Reg Cæsar
    @Alfa158


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    Because Asia is a continent and white is a race. Do I have to pull out my 1920s Fowler's to explain it? If it was good enough for Stoddard and Grant, it's good enough for me.

    The new fad derives from the Johnson clan of Jet, Ebony, and Essence fame. Peter Brimelow jokes that all of today's bad ideas originate in Canada, but many of them come from Chicago. House music or capitalization, don't be a Chiwigger.


    People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity.
     
    We have dozens.


    https://anesi.com/rmap2.jpg


    Ours is called "American", with no qualifiers.

    Replies: @Anon

  8. Anon[109] • Disclaimer says:

    OT

    Progressive writer Robert Wright, cofounder of Bloggingheads with Mickey Kaus, hilariously did today what Steve will never do (and probably couldn’t do because of his reputation): He directly contacted that anthropology professor that wrote the Darvin cancellation piece in Science and asked him to back up specific assertions.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/and-then-they-came-for-darwin/

    Agustin Fuentes, an anthropologist at Princeton, contended that Darwin’s 1871 book The Descent of Man “offers a racist and sexist view of humanity” and is “often problematic, prejudiced, and injurious.”

    As a progressive Wright doesn’t completely disagree with everything Fuentes wrote, but it’s clear he caught Fuentes in a number of major exagerations and tendentious stretches at the very least, something you’d have expected the editors at Nature to have ferreted out.

    Here’s the assertion by Fuentes that, so far as I can tell, is flat-out wrong. After (accurately) writing that Darwin “asserted evolutionary differences between races,” he adds: “He went beyond simple racial rankings, offering justification of empire and colonialism, and genocide, through ‘survival of the fittest.’ ”

    I’ve read a fair amount of Darwin, and I don’t remember him defending imperialism or genocide. So I asked Fuentes on Twitter if he could back up that claim by providing actual quotes from The Descent of Man. He didn’t oblige me, but he did direct me to chapter 7. So I pulled my copy of Descent off my bookshelf and took a look…..

    Anyone who wants to join Fuentes in arguing that Darwin is trying to justify genocide runs into a couple of problems.

    I won’t quote Wright’s long piece in detail. Here it is:

    https://nonzero.substack.com/p/the-truth-about-darwin

    Wright points out changes in language over time (which most versions of Darwin explain in marginal annotations).

    (An important note on three words Darwin uses that were in those days technical terms within anthropology: “savages” were what we would call hunter-gatherers; “barbarians” were people who had agriculture but not a system of writing; “civilized” people had writing.)

    There used to be courses in Darwin in universities, where students would work through Descent or Origin cover to cover, and study it both as biology and as history/biography. This is a great way to approch seminal works by great scientists and is a lot of fun, since you get to change modes during the class. It’s too bad that these kinds of courses are out of style (or #cancelled), and it’s too bad that the current crop of professors is too dumb to even teach them, if Fuentes is any example.

    • Replies: @notsaying
    @Anon

    Thanks for letting me know about this. I thought Robert Wright's piece was on the money and an excellent brief defense of Darwin. It is clear that Darwin was a noticer.

    I never knew "savages," "barbarians" and "civilized" were once technical terms that had specific meanings.

    Wright points out that Darwin was considered progressive in his day and yet he would seen as just the opposite today. Those people so quick to dismiss people in the past due to their "sins" should keep in mind that they will be "sinners" in the future, too, even though they see themselves as saints.

    , @eric
    @Anon

    While Darwin never advocated imperialism and genocide, his reasoning could be used to explain it.


    At some future period, not very distant as measured by centuries, the civilised races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace throughout the world the savage races.
     
    For many, it is morally good to accelerate history by 'breaking a few eggs,' because any time spent on the way to a destination is a suboptimal state. If Charles Murray is canceled for arguing blacks have a 1 standard deviation lower IQ, but strenuously adds that we should still treat people individually, all are morally equal, etc., it doesn't matter, because some people could use this assumption to justify old-fashioned racism. Wright could use such reasoning to defend Murray but never has or would, and so one could easily criticize Wright by pointing out his hypocrisy.

    Further, while Darwin believed all humans are the same species, that didn't mean he thought they were anything near equal. He thought Africans and Australian aborigines were between apes and Caucasians, with a progressive ordering of complexity, efficiency, and morality.

    Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    , @Redmen
    @Anon

    The video someone posted last week of Fuentes's "rebuttal" of Charles Murray at Notre Dame was one of the most depressing things I've seen in a while.

    It's hard to fathom that someone like Fuentes is teaching at the top universities in America. He'd be a lightweight instructor at most private schools 25 years ago.

    , @ben tillman
    @Anon

    Is this the Robert Wright who wrote The Moral Animal?

    Wright:

    There are things about this essay I like. For example: I understood it, which distinguishes it from many things written by contemporary anthropologists.

    Ha ha ha ha ha!

  9. Why not drop the degree requirements and improve the test?

  10. Ability read beyond 3rd grade level is clear and present evidence of racism and White supremacy.

    San Francisco police department was ordered by some federal court to create an applicant test that did not require reading at all. The questions and answers were a recording . “ Answer A blah blah. If you think the answer is A fill in the A bubble with your pencil. “

    Blacks did much worse on the audio test.

    Back when National Review was pro White, not conservative, it had excellent affirmative action articles. I remember one. NYPD sergeants rest. For a solid year NYPD had training classes for black and Hispanics. Every single one flunked.

    The state department foreign service officers has to add 40 points to the score of blacks to get them up to 80 on the written test. If hired, they needn’t pass the foreign language test for 5 years and given intensive tutoring.

    Friend got a teacher’s credential. Math test went up to Algebra 1 and geometry. She said the algebra was on the level of; 2 + X = 3 what is X?

    Thing is more and more school districts are going full laptop no books. And the laptops are complete learning programs. The laptop and google math programs are so clear and easily understood compared to the the text books and teachers.

    Soooo maybe the education departments figure the kids can learn from laptops starting age 4 and the affirmative action teachers can just stay out of the way and earn big salaries. Kids can learn how to use the laptops in computer lab and teach themselves.

    • Thanks: Clyde
    • Replies: @Anon
    @Alden


    The laptop and google math programs
     
    Does Google now offer math programs?

    Replies: @Alden

    , @Peter Akuleyev
    @Alden

    The state department foreign service officers has to add 40 points to the score of blacks to get them up to 80 on the written test.

    I have lived overseas for a cumulative total of 20 years, including stints in Asia, Russia, and Western Europe. Went to my fair share of embassy functions, met embassy staff all over the world. I have never, to the best of my memory, ever met a black American foreign service officer, even during the Obama years. Maybe they all get sent to Africa?

    Replies: @Alden

  11. When Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas one of his major initiatives was passage of a teacher testing law. It was a chance for him to show a conservative side in a conservative state. Most people in the state correctly understood that teacher testing was needed to weed out the many incompetent black teachers.
    The Arkansas teacher’s union was vehemently opposed. They skirted the racial aspect of the issue and argued it was ridiculous and insulting to give simple literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate.
    The fact that we do indeed need simple literacy tests to weed out people with MA’s who can’t read and write and do simple math is another measure of how corrupt our universities and our government have become. Race tribalism is enormously corrupting.
    Of course now the Clintons will be opposed to the “racist” teacher testing laws they themselves passed decades ago.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @rebel yell

    One book I’m especially loath to try reading is Bill Clinton’s autobiography. (I’ve read much on Obama and by Obama so I might as well.) The book is a monster of a file but may have some interesting material on a wide assortment of historical developments; mainly the trajectory of the Democratic Party after the 1960s.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FC1RJQ/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i2

    Maybe cheeky Bill left some vague allusions to Jeffrey Epstein?

    Replies: @Curle

    , @J
    @rebel yell

    It cannot be denied that it is insulting to give elementary literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate. The need to re-certify teachers means that the education system is worthless. It also means that there must be a need to re-examine other professionals too. Doctors, maybe.

    , @ScarletNumber
    @rebel yell


    They skirted the racial aspect of the issue and argued it was ridiculous and insulting to give simple literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate.
     
    It is, which is why when these laws are passed and standards are raised, people who are currently doing the job are generally grandfathered in.
  12. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    It’s because if you capitalize us, we become really, really dangerous, like, we might circumnavigate the globe, go to the Moon, invent stuff and basically make everyone else look like the losers they are.

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Oh sure they do, but now they go by Anonymous[265], Anonymous[266] and Anonymous[267].

    • Thanks: Redneck farmer
    • LOL: Polistra, Redmen
    • Replies: @Redmen
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Along these lines. Last night I tried to forward the iSteve thread on the "Flight From White" discussing the vanishing white students in the San Mateo high schools. My friend (who is Chinese) has a daughter in one of the high schools there, and I wanted to get his take on it. Facebook messenger blocked it. I tried 4 times, and it was blocked each time.

    Does anyone know if Facebook has officially blocked Steve or Unz?

    I never go on Facebook, but do keep in touch with a few college friends via the FB messenger. But I've never had a URL link blocked by it before.

  13. More good news. NYC is the central capital of the enemy. That they are destroying their city should please us. Yes, innocents are harmed, but when haven’t they been harmed in war?

    • Agree: fish
    • Replies: @Redmen
    @Daniel H

    I'm a lifelong New Yorker, and I definitely feel a bit like I'm living behind enemy lines during a civil war. But I can't afford to leave NY. Being a fifth columnist is my only possible aspiration.

    I wish we could develop some sort of sign where we could identify like minded people without revealing our bad thinking.

    Replies: @Jack D, @sayless

  14. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    Svigor: last comment 2/6/21

    (((owen))): last comment 4/30/21

    Lot: last comment 5/25/21 (thanks, Greenwich Mean Time).

  15. State department issued approval for all overseas embassies consulates and other buildings to fly the black lives matter flag on St Floyd the hideous day.

    • Replies: @Polistra
    @Alden

    https://izquotes.com/quotes-pictures/quote-every-normal-man-must-be-tempted-at-times-to-spit-on-his-hands-hoist-the-black-flag-and-begin-h-l-mencken-125674.jpg

  16. Anon[109] • Disclaimer says:

    New York state teaching praxis exam requirements whipsaw in a sine wave every five or ten years or so. There is a pattern of “there are no teachers that look like me” shifting to “why are the better teachers (meaning white teachers who passed the praxis exams) at the white schools?,” back and forth.

    This is from 2014:

    New York State saw a significant drop in the number of candidates who passed teacher certification tests last year as tougher exams were introduced, state officials said on Wednesday, portraying the results as a long-needed move to raise the level of teaching and the performance of teacher preparation schools.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/20/nyregion/teacher-certifications-decline-as-new-york-state-uses-tougher-exams.html

    This is from 2017:

    Just years after New York began requiring prospective teachers to pass a tough new exam, the state’s top education policy makers are lowering the score needed to enter the classroom.

    The move could open the door to more teachers of color, who have failed the exam in disproportionate numbers since the state began requiring it in 2014.

    The Board of Regents voted Tuesday to drop the passing score on the edTPA — a test that requires prospective teachers to submit a portfolio of work including a video of themselves teaching — from 41 to 38 starting in January 2018. The state will then slowly raise that mark until it reaches 40 in 2022.

    https://ny.chalkbeat.org/2017/9/12/21100903/new-york-s-most-controversial-teacher-certification-exam-is-now-a-little-easier-to-pass

  17. EducationRealist has done some superb research and analysis on black and Hispanic teachers (or the reasons for the substantial shortage of them.) Most couldn’t meet the wave of new credentialism starting in the late 1990s and were eventually phased out.

    https://educationrealist.wordpress.com/2014/09/08/ed-schools-and-affirmative-action/

  18. @JimDandy
    We are already seeing trends of parents moving from blue states to red states because of this bullshit, but, no matter what state you're in, the Federal Government and Woke Capitalism is a motherfucker. I wonder if we will eventually see significant trends of parents moving their families out of America.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Shel100, @Rob

    Where’d you’d think they’d try to go?

    • Replies: @John Derbyshire
    @Kronos

    Uruguay! https://www.johnderbyshire.com/Opinions/Diaries/2020-05.html#04

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  19. Hungary, Poland, Russia, Czechcetera? I don’t know, actually.

  20. @Alden
    Ability read beyond 3rd grade level is clear and present evidence of racism and White supremacy.

    San Francisco police department was ordered by some federal court to create an applicant test that did not require reading at all. The questions and answers were a recording . “ Answer A blah blah. If you think the answer is A fill in the A bubble with your pencil. “

    Blacks did much worse on the audio test.

    Back when National Review was pro White, not conservative, it had excellent affirmative action articles. I remember one. NYPD sergeants rest. For a solid year NYPD had training classes for black and Hispanics. Every single one flunked.

    The state department foreign service officers has to add 40 points to the score of blacks to get them up to 80 on the written test. If hired, they needn’t pass the foreign language test for 5 years and given intensive tutoring.

    Friend got a teacher’s credential. Math test went up to Algebra 1 and geometry. She said the algebra was on the level of; 2 + X = 3 what is X?

    Thing is more and more school districts are going full laptop no books. And the laptops are complete learning programs. The laptop and google math programs are so clear and easily understood compared to the the text books and teachers.

    Soooo maybe the education departments figure the kids can learn from laptops starting age 4 and the affirmative action teachers can just stay out of the way and earn big salaries. Kids can learn how to use the laptops in computer lab and teach themselves.

    Replies: @Anon, @Peter Akuleyev

    The laptop and google math programs

    Does Google now offer math programs?

    • Replies: @Alden
    @Anon

    Not really but covid hoax the kids aren’t in school. They call it bed school because they lie in bed with their laptop. They do the math problems on the test on their phones and type the answer into the lap top.

    Google doesn’t just give the answers All the search answers do the calculations. Seeing the calculations done in a clear and easy to understand manner; the kids learn math.

    Example 5 + X = 7 7 - 5 = 2. So X is 2

    The books and teachers don’t show the simple calculations to solve math problems So using a phone or another computer to cheat teaches the kids how to solve math problems better than the teachers and text books can.

    Replies: @Curle

  21. If literacy is “everything” wouldn’t it be better to measure it with a flawed test than to ignore it altogether?

  22. “Well I never!” I hope old-timey expressions like this come back. People like that retro stuff, right? We got retro (cheap-ass, China-made) Osterizer blenders, retro Camaros, Mustangs, and Chargers, and even retro 1970s inflation coming (a wage/price spiral without the “wage” part). Yeah, sure let’s have retro expressions, such as:

    “You don’t say?!”. It was a good one to use on the old-time 1990s non-robotic telemarketers. Answer everything they say with “you don’t say?”, and they may even hang up on YOU!

    As to the teacher literacy, Peak Stupidity, in the post Back to Skool, noted that my son’s bad handwriting was criticized by the otherwise very nice and diligent teacher with “can’t hardly ready”. The “y” was a hand-o (typo by hand), but the grammar was just “keepin’ it real”. Well, hell, the next grade’s teacher didn’t grade anything, so ….

    • Replies: @njguy73
    @Achmed E. Newman

    "Well, I never!"
    "You should, it's fun."

    "You don't say. (surprised tone) You don't say! (sad tone) You don't say."
    "Who was that?"
    "He didn't say!"

  23. @rebel yell
    When Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas one of his major initiatives was passage of a teacher testing law. It was a chance for him to show a conservative side in a conservative state. Most people in the state correctly understood that teacher testing was needed to weed out the many incompetent black teachers.
    The Arkansas teacher's union was vehemently opposed. They skirted the racial aspect of the issue and argued it was ridiculous and insulting to give simple literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate.
    The fact that we do indeed need simple literacy tests to weed out people with MA's who can't read and write and do simple math is another measure of how corrupt our universities and our government have become. Race tribalism is enormously corrupting.
    Of course now the Clintons will be opposed to the "racist" teacher testing laws they themselves passed decades ago.

    Replies: @Kronos, @J, @ScarletNumber

    One book I’m especially loath to try reading is Bill Clinton’s autobiography. (I’ve read much on Obama and by Obama so I might as well.) The book is a monster of a file but may have some interesting material on a wide assortment of historical developments; mainly the trajectory of the Democratic Party after the 1960s.

    Maybe cheeky Bill left some vague allusions to Jeffrey Epstein?

    • Replies: @Curle
    @Kronos

    “ I’ve read much on Obama and by Obama so I might as well”

    How much of it do you believe?

    Replies: @Kronos

  24. • LOL: Kronos
  25. Government teaching credentials are just as worthless as its credentials for drivers, cosmetologists, neurologists, nutritionists, and all the rest.

    • Compulsory attendance laws, the 180d @6+ hr school year, and zero tuition, juice demand for babysitters.
    • Licensing laws restrict the supply of “teachers”.
    • Class size reduction initiatives are mandates for more teachers (and even lower productivity).
    • Automatic raises based on non-economic factors such as seniority and degree accumulation.
    • Tenure (job security).

    The mighty, mighty union.

    • Agree: Travis
    • Thanks: Boomthorkell
  26. J says:
    @rebel yell
    When Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas one of his major initiatives was passage of a teacher testing law. It was a chance for him to show a conservative side in a conservative state. Most people in the state correctly understood that teacher testing was needed to weed out the many incompetent black teachers.
    The Arkansas teacher's union was vehemently opposed. They skirted the racial aspect of the issue and argued it was ridiculous and insulting to give simple literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate.
    The fact that we do indeed need simple literacy tests to weed out people with MA's who can't read and write and do simple math is another measure of how corrupt our universities and our government have become. Race tribalism is enormously corrupting.
    Of course now the Clintons will be opposed to the "racist" teacher testing laws they themselves passed decades ago.

    Replies: @Kronos, @J, @ScarletNumber

    It cannot be denied that it is insulting to give elementary literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate. The need to re-certify teachers means that the education system is worthless. It also means that there must be a need to re-examine other professionals too. Doctors, maybe.

  27. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    Lot posted just today in the attention span thread. I guess you got bored b4 you saw it?

  28. An old Will Rogers quote comes to mind:” Though a loyal Democrat, I have to oppose President Roosevelt’s radical proposal to require postmaster to be able to read”.

  29. That crazy movie Idiocracy thought it would take 500 years for America to sink to that level. How could they get it so wrong? More like five years.

  30. Anon[659] • Disclaimer says:

    It looks like so many middle-class people moved out of NYC because of Covid and the riots that the schools are having trouble hiring for next year. But NYC’s lack of punishment for criminals made have made the situation even worse. Many teachers who taught in ghetto schools realize their hoodlum students won’t be punished if they try to kill or assault the teachers.

    What’s more, there’s a big push to get rid of the school cop in NYC’s schools. That may be the final straw for teachers. Having a cop as backup is useful when a kid gets out of control. Sensible teachers are likely to quit if the cops vanish. I predict that discipline in NYC schools will go completely to pot this year if the cops vanish. Black gang members will be shooting each other in class and having gun battles in the hallways.

    Heck, you need a cop just to have someone to man the metal detector at the front door of the school.

    • Agree: sayless
  31. @Alfa158
    @Anonymous

    The people who set that standard issued an explanation of why. In brief:

    Asians, Blacks, Latinos, Jews etc, are real people with a distinctive culture and identity. People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity. They are officially described as people who subscribe to the delusion that they are something called white, therefore the word is not capitalized.

    At least that’s the the official explanation, in actuality the people who conform to this standard are happy do so because they believe Whites, or at least Whites other than Whites like themselves, are evil and inferior.

    Replies: @El Dato, @Polistra, @Reg Cæsar

    “Exterminate all the white brutes!”

    • LOL: Redneck farmer
  32. @Anon
    OT

    Progressive writer Robert Wright, cofounder of Bloggingheads with Mickey Kaus, hilariously did today what Steve will never do (and probably couldn't do because of his reputation): He directly contacted that anthropology professor that wrote the Darvin cancellation piece in Science and asked him to back up specific assertions.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/and-then-they-came-for-darwin/

    Agustin Fuentes, an anthropologist at Princeton, contended that Darwin’s 1871 book The Descent of Man “offers a racist and sexist view of humanity” and is “often problematic, prejudiced, and injurious.”
     
    As a progressive Wright doesn't completely disagree with everything Fuentes wrote, but it's clear he caught Fuentes in a number of major exagerations and tendentious stretches at the very least, something you'd have expected the editors at Nature to have ferreted out.

    Here’s the assertion by Fuentes that, so far as I can tell, is flat-out wrong. After (accurately) writing that Darwin “asserted evolutionary differences between races,” he adds: “He went beyond simple racial rankings, offering justification of empire and colonialism, and genocide, through ‘survival of the fittest.’ ”

    I’ve read a fair amount of Darwin, and I don’t remember him defending imperialism or genocide. So I asked Fuentes on Twitter if he could back up that claim by providing actual quotes from The Descent of Man. He didn’t oblige me, but he did direct me to chapter 7. So I pulled my copy of Descent off my bookshelf and took a look.....

    Anyone who wants to join Fuentes in arguing that Darwin is trying to justify genocide runs into a couple of problems.
     
    I won't quote Wright's long piece in detail. Here it is:

    https://nonzero.substack.com/p/the-truth-about-darwin

    Wright points out changes in language over time (which most versions of Darwin explain in marginal annotations).

    (An important note on three words Darwin uses that were in those days technical terms within anthropology: “savages” were what we would call hunter-gatherers; “barbarians” were people who had agriculture but not a system of writing; “civilized” people had writing.)
     
    There used to be courses in Darwin in universities, where students would work through Descent or Origin cover to cover, and study it both as biology and as history/biography. This is a great way to approch seminal works by great scientists and is a lot of fun, since you get to change modes during the class. It's too bad that these kinds of courses are out of style (or #cancelled), and it's too bad that the current crop of professors is too dumb to even teach them, if Fuentes is any example.

    Replies: @notsaying, @eric, @Redmen, @ben tillman

    Thanks for letting me know about this. I thought Robert Wright’s piece was on the money and an excellent brief defense of Darwin. It is clear that Darwin was a noticer.

    I never knew “savages,” “barbarians” and “civilized” were once technical terms that had specific meanings.

    Wright points out that Darwin was considered progressive in his day and yet he would seen as just the opposite today. Those people so quick to dismiss people in the past due to their “sins” should keep in mind that they will be “sinners” in the future, too, even though they see themselves as saints.

    • Agree: PiltdownMan
  33. @Known Fact
    Yet another objective measure falls by the wayside. BTW it's not too reassuring that only 69 percent of white teachers passed

    Replies: @Polistra, @Thomm, @AnotherDad

    Indeed. The stupidity of many teachers–particularly in places like New York–is a real impediment blocking ‘education reform’.

    The literacy test, which became mandatory in 2014, was one of several requirements the state added to overhaul teacher preparation in 2009. Regents hoped that a slate of more rigorous exams would help better prepare teachers for the real-life demands of the job and make for a more qualified teaching force.

    Just sounds racist, dunnit?

  34. @Alfa158
    @Anonymous

    The people who set that standard issued an explanation of why. In brief:

    Asians, Blacks, Latinos, Jews etc, are real people with a distinctive culture and identity. People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity. They are officially described as people who subscribe to the delusion that they are something called white, therefore the word is not capitalized.

    At least that’s the the official explanation, in actuality the people who conform to this standard are happy do so because they believe Whites, or at least Whites other than Whites like themselves, are evil and inferior.

    Replies: @El Dato, @Polistra, @Reg Cæsar

    Exactly so, yet it still perplexes me when I see “Black and brown” together in a sentence.

    Hey! Those are two colors of bear. Can we start calling ourselves Polar People?

    • LOL: vhrm
    • Replies: @Triteleia Laxa
    @Polistra

    https://images.app.goo.gl/XZkVtcgpwmL2LFot9

  35. Off Topic:

    We need to get smarter, not dumber.

    Look what we are doing now because of the increasing aggressiveness of the Chinese. I can only think we don’t have enough military planes to drop bombs one by one and not enough time and/or money to get more. So we are going to drop pallets of targeted smart missiles from cargo planes, I kid you not:

    “US Air Force discovers how to convert its 522 cargo planes into bombers by deploying cruise missiles attached to parachutes, rapidly increasing strike power should war break out with China”

    “Forbes reported that should a war break out with China, the Air Force would ‘struggle to concentrate enough strikepower in one place’ to take out their air defenses.”

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9614859/US-Air-Force-transforming-cargo-planes-bombers-rapidly-increase-strike-power.html

    • Replies: @Joe Stalin
    @notsaying


    “US Air Force discovers how to convert its 522 cargo planes into bombers by deploying cruise missiles attached to parachutes, rapidly increasing strike power should war break out with China”
     
    Pakis were blowing up Indians doing just that in 1965.

    In the 1965 Indo-Pakistani War the Antelopes dropped parachute commandos into Indian territory in a night-time mission involving three C-130B transports. Just before the 1965 war started, the squadron's commanding officer, Wing Commander Eric Gordan Hall, had the idea of making up for the PAF's deficiency in heavy bombers by modifying the Hercules to carry bombs.[2] It was converted to carry 10,000 kg of bombs, which were rolled out on pallets from the rear ramp, and over 21 night-time bombing raids were flown against Indian forces approaching for the Battles of Chawinda and Pul Kanjari. Support missions for troops in the Northern Areas were continued after the war.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No._6_Squadron_(Pakistan_Air_Force)

     

  36. @Alden
    State department issued approval for all overseas embassies consulates and other buildings to fly the black lives matter flag on St Floyd the hideous day.

    Replies: @Polistra

  37. People seem to be missing the point. The teachers still have to take credential tests. New York is not allowing illiterates to be teachers. High school/middle school academic competency tests are roughly on the level of AP exams, and elementary school tests require roughly 10th grade math knowledge.

    The article is quite accurate except this effort started long before 2009. New York has had the vision of “well-rounded, literate” teachers since 1993. First test was LAST-1 (heh), then LAST-2, both of which failed court review and were booted for being discriminatory. The actual last one, this particular test, passed court review but was removed in 2017. Not sure why Chalkbeat is announcing the news now, given that this was all thoroughly discussed back then.

    What NY did was look at the suite of tests, and saw that black and Hispanic teachers were passing the subject matter tests and the other knowledge tests, but failing the beauty contest literacy test, invented by snowflakes who wanted proper teachers, and given that black teachers get better results with black kids than “smart” teachers, that was a no-brainer. Dump the test that has nothing to do with academic content knowledge.

    Dropping this test didn’t make it any easier for an unintelligent person to become a high school teacher. It probably made it easier for someone who doesn’t need to be a genius to become an elementary school teacher, and that’s fine.

    • Thanks: Triteleia Laxa
    • Replies: @Peter Akuleyev
    @education realist

    given that black teachers get better results with black kids than “smart” teachers, that was a no-brainer.

    Great point. The smartest teachers in my high school were great at teaching AP Physics and Chemistry. But they were unable to connect with lower IQ whites in any meaningful way. The gym teacher could though. Makes perfect sense that you might be better off with a 1o5 IQ black teacher teaching black kids in elementary school than bringing in a Vasser graduate.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    , @photondancer
    @education realist

    This post would have been much more useful had you dropped some of the vituperation in order to explain what exactly it is about the literacy test that makes it a) nothing to do with literacy (given your jibe about illiterates) and b) expendable.

    , @Gary in Gramercy
    @education realist

    Your posts are usually on point, and I frequently find your blog helpful in my thinking about all sorts of educational issues (particularly on the use or nonuse of standardized tests, as the situation may warrant). You also introduced me to Kashawn Campbell, a young man years ahead of his time. (I still remember the L.A. Times article you so deftly fisked, noticing that the author never mentioned Mr. Campbell's SAT or ACT scores. Obviously if they had been worth writing home about, the journalist would have put them front center. The reader was left to guess how low Mr. Campbell's scores actually were, but today, the issue would be moot, since the University of California has banned the use of standardized test scores in toto.)

    Here, however, I agree with photondancer: this post would have been far more useful if you had included some examples from the "beauty contest literacy test" to show the kind of knowledge it tested. That way, you could more easily persuade others that it's a "no-brainer" to dump that specific test in favor of the subject matter tests as an accurate measure of teacher ability.

    What did the "beauty contest literacy test" ask of prospective teachers? The ability to discuss the respective prose styles of Conrad and Nabokov, and the degree to which each man's style had been shaped by learning English as a foreign tongue? The elements of the vulgarization of the Hegelian dialectic in Marxist philosophy? The specific scientific tests on which Einstein insisted before he would be confident in his theory of relativity, and the methods of verification for each? If that's the level of the test, then I agree with you: most college graduates couldn't pass such an exam.

    Somehow, I think the "beauty contest literacy test" expected something less than that. But how much less? A few concrete examples from the test itself might have helped readers evaluate your critique: maybe it is a ridiculous test to administer to prospective elementary school teachers, but there's no way to tell that from your post.

    Replies: @Known Fact, @education realist

    , @education realist
    @education realist

    Adding this in response to some of the comments.

    First, what vituperation? There are many comments in this thread saying that teachers are illiterate. They aren't. This is just a fact. Kronos linked in one of my articles (thanks) but I've written a lot on this topic, including average GRE and SAT scores. High school academic teachers have always had achievement scores above the average college graduate. As Kronos mentioned, the 70s and 80s saw a huge decline in what we could automatically expect from a college graduate, and states responded by instituting a credential test for elementary school credentials, and then in 2000 the feds began demanding that middle school teachers pass high school tests.

    The original elementary school credential test instantly created problems for black teacher, and Hispanics, to a degree. States responded in the 90s by granting "emergency credentials" to anyone who got an education degree but couldn't pass the credential test. The feds didn't like this and as part of the changes in NCLB and the HEA ended the emergency credential and also forced ed schools to declare the credential passing rates. Ed schools said hey, not a problem, and stopped giving ed degrees to anyone who couldn't pass the test. So in the early 2000s, there was a huge drop in black teachers (and a little fraud ring in the south to pay blacks who could pass the test to take it for those who couldn't. Cf Clarence Mumford on my site).

    So for the past 20 years states have been worried about the decline in black and Hispanic teachers, particularly given the consistent research showing that teacher test scores don't correlate with learning outcomes, but teacher race does. (I suspect there's a baseline ability line but Goldhaber has data showing that blacks who failed the test by quite a bit had better results than whites who did....with black kids).

    Now, in all that time, here's what they *never* did. They never made the academic credential tests easier. Not once. However, in New York's case, back in the 90s, they thought ladida, let's brag about how extra special literate our teachers are. I went through the history of that in the last post.

    As for this particular test, the fact that whites passed it by 70% means it wasn't a ridiculously easy test. I'm not arguing it was incredibly difficult, but if the white rate was 95% or 100% and black rate was 70%, then I'd be more worried they were letting in really low achievers--although the fact that they have to pass several other tests makes that unlikely as well.

    For those demanding "evidence"--what evidence do you need? I'm not claiming the test was unfair, nor am I disputing that a college degree is becoming close to meaningless. But a *credential test* pass is not meaningless, because those tests aren't easy, particularly for high school. (We can debate whether or not college graduates shouldn't be able to pass the ES test another time, but this is *precisely* why the ES credential test began 30 years ago, and it is effectively keeping those graduates out of teaching. Hence the fraud case.)

    All I'm saying is this: New York looked at its data and saw that some number of black and Hispanic teachers were passing all the tests needed except this one. It's not mentioned, but logically these teachers are mostly elementary school teachers (or PE or sped). It doesn't matter how many of them there were. They'd demonstrated all the subject matter competency, and this other test, which was only ever offered as an ego boost originally, was stopping them from being teachers.

    They need black and Hispanic teachers more than they need the ego boost.

    Also--as I mention in the article Kronos linked in--if you're a black teacher who can pass the tests, you are extremely high ability for a black person, particularly if the test is high school subject matter. So blacks leave teaching at a higher rate--a lot of them to become principals, where the pay is higher, but others to leave the field altogether. Yet another reason to reduce the test burden, to keep in the black teachers who are more likely to stay.

    Replies: @photondancer

    , @res
    @education realist

    This 2015 Chalkbeat article gave a bit different impression of the rigor of the other tests.
    https://ny.chalkbeat.org/2015/3/19/21092193/aspiring-teachers-struggled-on-new-tests-data-show-prompting-diversity-debate


    But more recent versions of the exam became so easy that 99 percent of test-takers passed. That changed last year with the introduction of three new tests designed align with nationally established teaching standards.
     
    Here is how they described the Academic Literacy Skills test (ALST).

    The hardest exam to pass last year, for all teachers, was the new literacy test. Called the Academic Literacy Skills test, it measures reading and writing aptitude based on the Common Core standards. Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed — though most only met a lower proficiency bar aligned to eighth-grade English standards.
     
    For the people asking for examples.

    This article has some sample questions and links to the study guide with more.
    https://www.silive.com/news/2017/03/try_these_sample_questions_can.html
    https://www.nystce.nesinc.com/Content/STUDYGUIDE/NY_SG_SRI_202.htm

    This link has an online practice test.
    https://www.testprepreview.com/nystce/academic-literacy-skills-test.htm

    Replies: @vhrm, @photondancer

  38. I guess you don’t have many readers in NYC … certainly not in years to come.

    • LOL: Triteleia Laxa
  39. @Alden
    Ability read beyond 3rd grade level is clear and present evidence of racism and White supremacy.

    San Francisco police department was ordered by some federal court to create an applicant test that did not require reading at all. The questions and answers were a recording . “ Answer A blah blah. If you think the answer is A fill in the A bubble with your pencil. “

    Blacks did much worse on the audio test.

    Back when National Review was pro White, not conservative, it had excellent affirmative action articles. I remember one. NYPD sergeants rest. For a solid year NYPD had training classes for black and Hispanics. Every single one flunked.

    The state department foreign service officers has to add 40 points to the score of blacks to get them up to 80 on the written test. If hired, they needn’t pass the foreign language test for 5 years and given intensive tutoring.

    Friend got a teacher’s credential. Math test went up to Algebra 1 and geometry. She said the algebra was on the level of; 2 + X = 3 what is X?

    Thing is more and more school districts are going full laptop no books. And the laptops are complete learning programs. The laptop and google math programs are so clear and easily understood compared to the the text books and teachers.

    Soooo maybe the education departments figure the kids can learn from laptops starting age 4 and the affirmative action teachers can just stay out of the way and earn big salaries. Kids can learn how to use the laptops in computer lab and teach themselves.

    Replies: @Anon, @Peter Akuleyev

    The state department foreign service officers has to add 40 points to the score of blacks to get them up to 80 on the written test.

    I have lived overseas for a cumulative total of 20 years, including stints in Asia, Russia, and Western Europe. Went to my fair share of embassy functions, met embassy staff all over the world. I have never, to the best of my memory, ever met a black American foreign service officer, even during the Obama years. Maybe they all get sent to Africa?

    • LOL: Muggles
    • Replies: @Alden
    @Peter Akuleyev

    They do get sent to Africa. Most are women who stay in the building and do visa applications. Or they stay in DC and get rapid promotions. Mostly stay in DC and get promotions. Obama has a black woman as UN ambassador I believe Susan something?

    Even with the extensive extensive help the foreign language requirement passing at basic level after 5 years tutoring keeps them out. They are hired on a temporary basis and given extensive English composition training too. But after a few years as temp trainee, they wash out. Full salary and benefits though.

    Then they’re offered jobs in other DC government agencies. To prevent more affirmative action lawsuits. Mostly they work in the big buildings in DC and Virginia so the department can display its diversity.

  40. @education realist
    People seem to be missing the point. The teachers still have to take credential tests. New York is not allowing illiterates to be teachers. High school/middle school academic competency tests are roughly on the level of AP exams, and elementary school tests require roughly 10th grade math knowledge.

    The article is quite accurate except this effort started long before 2009. New York has had the vision of "well-rounded, literate" teachers since 1993. First test was LAST-1 (heh), then LAST-2, both of which failed court review and were booted for being discriminatory. The actual last one, this particular test, passed court review but was removed in 2017. Not sure why Chalkbeat is announcing the news now, given that this was all thoroughly discussed back then.



    What NY did was look at the suite of tests, and saw that black and Hispanic teachers were passing the subject matter tests and the other knowledge tests, but failing the beauty contest literacy test, invented by snowflakes who wanted proper teachers, and given that black teachers get better results with black kids than "smart" teachers, that was a no-brainer. Dump the test that has nothing to do with academic content knowledge.

    Dropping this test didn't make it any easier for an unintelligent person to become a high school teacher. It probably made it easier for someone who doesn't need to be a genius to become an elementary school teacher, and that's fine.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @photondancer, @Gary in Gramercy, @education realist, @res

    given that black teachers get better results with black kids than “smart” teachers, that was a no-brainer.

    Great point. The smartest teachers in my high school were great at teaching AP Physics and Chemistry. But they were unable to connect with lower IQ whites in any meaningful way. The gym teacher could though. Makes perfect sense that you might be better off with a 1o5 IQ black teacher teaching black kids in elementary school than bringing in a Vasser graduate.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @Peter Akuleyev

    I'd guess it'd be also due to discipline, Peter. I don't know how many black men still teach in lower ed, or men period, but they would know how to keep the kids in line, which is the first step to getting ANY learning done. Even with black women, the black kids will have, or at least show, more respect.

  41. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    In case you’re not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    • Replies: @photondancer
    @ScarletNumber

    You think the Caucasus is a continent?

    In case you're not kidding, the practice of capitalising the names of human races (not continents) except for whites has been an ongoing topic here for some time.

    Replies: @Possumman, @Bill Jones

    , @Anonymous
    @ScarletNumber


    In case you’re not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.
     
    But Asians aren’t a continent. And neither is Caucasia.

    Replies: @ScarletNumber

    , @Jonathan Mason
    @ScarletNumber

    In Spanish adjectives which relate to place names are not capitalized, so you find words like 'puertoricano', which can be confusing at first glance.

    This indicates that it is purely a convention of the English language to capitalize adjectives that come from place names, which is fine.

    When it comes to writing, the main object is to remove as many barriers as possible to the comprehension of the reader, so, for example, one might write 'Black people' to indicate that you are using the word metaphorically in a collective sense, and not to indicate that you are talking about people who actually appear to the casual viewer to be black, because the skin is so dark that even the use of the darkest shade of brown would be misleading to the reader.

    Of course even if a person appeared to be completely black, on closer examination one might note that the palms of their hands and the soles of their feet were lighter, but when we are just describing somebody so that somebody else can recognize them, approximations will do.

    A medical textbook would not describe a color as being black if it was in fact brown. For example poop that is black is usually an indication that it contains partly digested blood, all that the person is taking iron pills, and needs to be distinguished from poop that is brown, because there is all the difference in the world.

    So Black can be useful to avoid all ambiguity.

    , @Triteleia Laxa
    @ScarletNumber

    European, Asian, African

    white, yellow, Black

    , @JerseyJeffersonian
    @ScarletNumber

    So, ScarletNumber, your posting handle is your actual, legal name? I didn't think so. Well then, what is the functional difference between the "anonymous" posting that you abominate, and the "pseudonymous" posting in which you indulge?

    And BTW, people do have reasons for posting pseudonymously; ever hear of "cancellation"? It's a thing you know, and a genuine hazard to those with a non-woke pov. But if you aren't worried about this, use your actual, legal name. Your phony distinction between "anonymous" posting (vitiated here at Unz Review through the identification of "anonymous" posters here through numbers) and "pseudonymous" posting is jejune.

  42. @education realist
    People seem to be missing the point. The teachers still have to take credential tests. New York is not allowing illiterates to be teachers. High school/middle school academic competency tests are roughly on the level of AP exams, and elementary school tests require roughly 10th grade math knowledge.

    The article is quite accurate except this effort started long before 2009. New York has had the vision of "well-rounded, literate" teachers since 1993. First test was LAST-1 (heh), then LAST-2, both of which failed court review and were booted for being discriminatory. The actual last one, this particular test, passed court review but was removed in 2017. Not sure why Chalkbeat is announcing the news now, given that this was all thoroughly discussed back then.



    What NY did was look at the suite of tests, and saw that black and Hispanic teachers were passing the subject matter tests and the other knowledge tests, but failing the beauty contest literacy test, invented by snowflakes who wanted proper teachers, and given that black teachers get better results with black kids than "smart" teachers, that was a no-brainer. Dump the test that has nothing to do with academic content knowledge.

    Dropping this test didn't make it any easier for an unintelligent person to become a high school teacher. It probably made it easier for someone who doesn't need to be a genius to become an elementary school teacher, and that's fine.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @photondancer, @Gary in Gramercy, @education realist, @res

    This post would have been much more useful had you dropped some of the vituperation in order to explain what exactly it is about the literacy test that makes it a) nothing to do with literacy (given your jibe about illiterates) and b) expendable.

    • Agree: Gary in Gramercy
  43. @rebel yell
    When Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas one of his major initiatives was passage of a teacher testing law. It was a chance for him to show a conservative side in a conservative state. Most people in the state correctly understood that teacher testing was needed to weed out the many incompetent black teachers.
    The Arkansas teacher's union was vehemently opposed. They skirted the racial aspect of the issue and argued it was ridiculous and insulting to give simple literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate.
    The fact that we do indeed need simple literacy tests to weed out people with MA's who can't read and write and do simple math is another measure of how corrupt our universities and our government have become. Race tribalism is enormously corrupting.
    Of course now the Clintons will be opposed to the "racist" teacher testing laws they themselves passed decades ago.

    Replies: @Kronos, @J, @ScarletNumber

    They skirted the racial aspect of the issue and argued it was ridiculous and insulting to give simple literacy tests to college graduates who already had a teaching certificate.

    It is, which is why when these laws are passed and standards are raised, people who are currently doing the job are generally grandfathered in.

  44. @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    In case you're not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    Replies: @photondancer, @Anonymous, @Jonathan Mason, @Triteleia Laxa, @JerseyJeffersonian

    You think the Caucasus is a continent?

    In case you’re not kidding, the practice of capitalising the names of human races (not continents) except for whites has been an ongoing topic here for some time.

    • Agree: Realist
    • Troll: ScarletNumber
    • Replies: @Possumman
    @photondancer

    Haven't you ever watched a Hallmark movie---they often involve a Prince of Caucasia moving to a small town in Vermont and meeting the love of his life--before retuning home to become king after exposing the evil Chancellor of the Exchequer that was trying to replace him.

    Replies: @photondancer

    , @Bill Jones
    @photondancer

    Even Wikipedia, that bastion of Jewish controlled wokeness capitalizes The Caucasus and Caucasian

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasus


    According to Leonti Mroveli, the 11th-century Georgian chronicler, the word Caucasian...
     
    Go thou and do likewise.
  45. The billionaire peeled off his shirt. He had been working out at the gym, and it showed!

  46. Anonymous[547] • Disclaimer says:
    @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    In case you're not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    Replies: @photondancer, @Anonymous, @Jonathan Mason, @Triteleia Laxa, @JerseyJeffersonian

    In case you’re not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    But Asians aren’t a continent. And neither is Caucasia.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous

    No, but the Caucasus is the name of a mountain range and region. They, like continents, are capitalized.

    If you and photondancer can stop being such fucking retards, it would greatly be appreciated.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  47. @Anonymous
    @ScarletNumber


    In case you’re not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.
     
    But Asians aren’t a continent. And neither is Caucasia.

    Replies: @ScarletNumber

    No, but the Caucasus is the name of a mountain range and region. They, like continents, are capitalized.

    If you and photondancer can stop being such fucking retards, it would greatly be appreciated.

    • Agree: Bill Jones
    • Troll: photondancer
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @ScarletNumber


    No, but the Caucasus is the name of a mountain range and region. They, like continents, are capitalized.
     
    But neither asians nor Caucasians are continents, mountain ranges, or regions.

    And, in any case, who is to say either were “named after” those things? Perhaps they borrowed their name from such things. “Named after” though? They are named, not named after.

    And is it not curious that Americans should be “named after” a continent on the other side of the globe? That doesn’t seem right.

    As an aside, are Blacks, Hispanics, and Jews also “named after” continents, mountain ranges, and regions?
  48. Anonymous[547] • Disclaimer says:
    @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous

    No, but the Caucasus is the name of a mountain range and region. They, like continents, are capitalized.

    If you and photondancer can stop being such fucking retards, it would greatly be appreciated.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    No, but the Caucasus is the name of a mountain range and region. They, like continents, are capitalized.

    But neither asians nor Caucasians are continents, mountain ranges, or regions.

    And, in any case, who is to say either were “named after” those things? Perhaps they borrowed their name from such things. “Named after” though? They are named, not named after.

    And is it not curious that Americans should be “named after” a continent on the other side of the globe? That doesn’t seem right.

    As an aside, are Blacks, Hispanics, and Jews also “named after” continents, mountain ranges, and regions?

  49. @Peter Akuleyev
    @education realist

    given that black teachers get better results with black kids than “smart” teachers, that was a no-brainer.

    Great point. The smartest teachers in my high school were great at teaching AP Physics and Chemistry. But they were unable to connect with lower IQ whites in any meaningful way. The gym teacher could though. Makes perfect sense that you might be better off with a 1o5 IQ black teacher teaching black kids in elementary school than bringing in a Vasser graduate.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    I’d guess it’d be also due to discipline, Peter. I don’t know how many black men still teach in lower ed, or men period, but they would know how to keep the kids in line, which is the first step to getting ANY learning done. Even with black women, the black kids will have, or at least show, more respect.

  50. I actually think there is a greater than 50% chance that the dumbing down of public schools and the attendant flight of parents of above average kids to private schools is the explicit goal of all this. Public school systems are often major players in Democratic and urban politics and the activists look at it as a political organizing tool, not a governmental institution that has an obligation to deliver a decent quality service to the public.

    The last thing they want are lots of parents who have some amount of money and political influence of their own (that may diverge from what the teachers unions want) engaging in open struggles over policy and funding that might get in the way of their political goals. So the answer is to make the schools so awful most of them leave and they get to preside over a low-IQ/low influence group of kids and parents who will dutifully follow their lead.

  51. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    There is a certain group of people who, if White were capitalized, would hear cossack hoofbeats and boxcars opening. When they said “Never again”, this is what they meant.

  52. It speaketh not well of the Moor
    That his grasp of our tongue is so poor,
    That the offspring of Spain
    Have made far swifter gain
    While he wallowed in rappers’ manure.

  53. eric says:
    @Anon
    OT

    Progressive writer Robert Wright, cofounder of Bloggingheads with Mickey Kaus, hilariously did today what Steve will never do (and probably couldn't do because of his reputation): He directly contacted that anthropology professor that wrote the Darvin cancellation piece in Science and asked him to back up specific assertions.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/and-then-they-came-for-darwin/

    Agustin Fuentes, an anthropologist at Princeton, contended that Darwin’s 1871 book The Descent of Man “offers a racist and sexist view of humanity” and is “often problematic, prejudiced, and injurious.”
     
    As a progressive Wright doesn't completely disagree with everything Fuentes wrote, but it's clear he caught Fuentes in a number of major exagerations and tendentious stretches at the very least, something you'd have expected the editors at Nature to have ferreted out.

    Here’s the assertion by Fuentes that, so far as I can tell, is flat-out wrong. After (accurately) writing that Darwin “asserted evolutionary differences between races,” he adds: “He went beyond simple racial rankings, offering justification of empire and colonialism, and genocide, through ‘survival of the fittest.’ ”

    I’ve read a fair amount of Darwin, and I don’t remember him defending imperialism or genocide. So I asked Fuentes on Twitter if he could back up that claim by providing actual quotes from The Descent of Man. He didn’t oblige me, but he did direct me to chapter 7. So I pulled my copy of Descent off my bookshelf and took a look.....

    Anyone who wants to join Fuentes in arguing that Darwin is trying to justify genocide runs into a couple of problems.
     
    I won't quote Wright's long piece in detail. Here it is:

    https://nonzero.substack.com/p/the-truth-about-darwin

    Wright points out changes in language over time (which most versions of Darwin explain in marginal annotations).

    (An important note on three words Darwin uses that were in those days technical terms within anthropology: “savages” were what we would call hunter-gatherers; “barbarians” were people who had agriculture but not a system of writing; “civilized” people had writing.)
     
    There used to be courses in Darwin in universities, where students would work through Descent or Origin cover to cover, and study it both as biology and as history/biography. This is a great way to approch seminal works by great scientists and is a lot of fun, since you get to change modes during the class. It's too bad that these kinds of courses are out of style (or #cancelled), and it's too bad that the current crop of professors is too dumb to even teach them, if Fuentes is any example.

    Replies: @notsaying, @eric, @Redmen, @ben tillman

    While Darwin never advocated imperialism and genocide, his reasoning could be used to explain it.

    At some future period, not very distant as measured by centuries, the civilised races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace throughout the world the savage races.

    For many, it is morally good to accelerate history by ‘breaking a few eggs,’ because any time spent on the way to a destination is a suboptimal state. If Charles Murray is canceled for arguing blacks have a 1 standard deviation lower IQ, but strenuously adds that we should still treat people individually, all are morally equal, etc., it doesn’t matter, because some people could use this assumption to justify old-fashioned racism. Wright could use such reasoning to defend Murray but never has or would, and so one could easily criticize Wright by pointing out his hypocrisy.

    Further, while Darwin believed all humans are the same species, that didn’t mean he thought they were anything near equal. He thought Africans and Australian aborigines were between apes and Caucasians, with a progressive ordering of complexity, efficiency, and morality.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
    @eric


    (Darwin) thought Africans and Australian aborigines were between apes and Caucasians...
     
    No, he didn't. He specifically pointed out that there was a huge gulf between the lowest human and the highest animal. For example no animal ever started fires and cooked food, no animal ever manufactured even the most basic tool, no animal ever had any kind of religious ceremony.

    He thought if babies were taken from savages and raised as English gentlemen, then they would assume the same level of civilization.

    Many years ago I knew a young black woman who had been adopted at birth by a wealthy white English couple. She had all the speech and manners of an upper class English woman.

    Replies: @eric

  54. Teechers union will be happy.

    In a new development, the Daily Mail today announced that American flight controllers will no longer have to pass a map reading test as this has been shown to be unfair to women.

    The state of Florida is has just passed a new law banishing “No Right On Red ” signs as they discriminate against people who cannot tell right from left. Or right from wrong. Replacement signs will say “Wait For Your Turn” as this will be less confusing.

    The Florida legislature leads the nation in shoot-from-the-hip legislation, in which getting a bill passed quickly is prioritized over considering what the real life effects might be. Yee-haw.

  55. anonymous[139] • Disclaimer says:

    Part of the pattern of the black/brown element of the population dragging everything down. Public education has already been trashed for many years now all over the US. This sure can’t help. In Chicago I’ve never met a public school teacher who wasn’t rather dumb, nutty, used drugs on the side, on psychiatric meds or something along those lines. Now they’ve all been throwing up barriers to going back to work, wanting to sit at home and collect a paycheck for doing nothing. Just a bunch of high-priced welfare parasites.

  56. @eric
    @Anon

    While Darwin never advocated imperialism and genocide, his reasoning could be used to explain it.


    At some future period, not very distant as measured by centuries, the civilised races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace throughout the world the savage races.
     
    For many, it is morally good to accelerate history by 'breaking a few eggs,' because any time spent on the way to a destination is a suboptimal state. If Charles Murray is canceled for arguing blacks have a 1 standard deviation lower IQ, but strenuously adds that we should still treat people individually, all are morally equal, etc., it doesn't matter, because some people could use this assumption to justify old-fashioned racism. Wright could use such reasoning to defend Murray but never has or would, and so one could easily criticize Wright by pointing out his hypocrisy.

    Further, while Darwin believed all humans are the same species, that didn't mean he thought they were anything near equal. He thought Africans and Australian aborigines were between apes and Caucasians, with a progressive ordering of complexity, efficiency, and morality.

    Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    (Darwin) thought Africans and Australian aborigines were between apes and Caucasians…

    No, he didn’t. He specifically pointed out that there was a huge gulf between the lowest human and the highest animal. For example no animal ever started fires and cooked food, no animal ever manufactured even the most basic tool, no animal ever had any kind of religious ceremony.

    He thought if babies were taken from savages and raised as English gentlemen, then they would assume the same level of civilization.

    Many years ago I knew a young black woman who had been adopted at birth by a wealthy white English couple. She had all the speech and manners of an upper class English woman.

    • Replies: @eric
    @Jonathan Mason

    The point is not that Darwin thought the gorilla-savage gap was larger than between a savage and a European, merely they were both gaps from lower to higher. He wrote that the gap between civilized man and his closest evolutionary ancestor will widen as savages and the big apes go extinct so that ultimately it will be between civilized man “and some ape as low as a baboon, instead of as at present between the negro or Australian and the gorilla.” The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are. Evolution back then was considered another word for progress, a development from lower to higher, so more evolved meant better in almost every respect.

    Darwin also wrote that the “highest races and the lowest savages” differ in “moral disposition … and in intellect.” As the father of evolution, he was not arguing this was merely cultural. He wrote that “western nations of Europe … now so immeasurably surpass their former savage progenitors and stand at the summit of civilization.” It's difficult to see how these remarks could be construed to mean he thought Europeans and Africans were equal in the modern sense. As an atheist he didn't believe they were equal in the eyes of God either.

    Replies: @Jonathan Mason

  57. @photondancer
    @ScarletNumber

    You think the Caucasus is a continent?

    In case you're not kidding, the practice of capitalising the names of human races (not continents) except for whites has been an ongoing topic here for some time.

    Replies: @Possumman, @Bill Jones

    Haven’t you ever watched a Hallmark movie—they often involve a Prince of Caucasia moving to a small town in Vermont and meeting the love of his life–before retuning home to become king after exposing the evil Chancellor of the Exchequer that was trying to replace him.

    • LOL: Realist
    • Replies: @photondancer
    @Possumman

    Surely Ruritania is on the other side of the Black Sea ;-)

    (I wonder how long it will be before the SJWs demand we rename the Black and White seas?)

  58. @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    In case you're not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    Replies: @photondancer, @Anonymous, @Jonathan Mason, @Triteleia Laxa, @JerseyJeffersonian

    In Spanish adjectives which relate to place names are not capitalized, so you find words like ‘puertoricano’, which can be confusing at first glance.

    This indicates that it is purely a convention of the English language to capitalize adjectives that come from place names, which is fine.

    When it comes to writing, the main object is to remove as many barriers as possible to the comprehension of the reader, so, for example, one might write ‘Black people’ to indicate that you are using the word metaphorically in a collective sense, and not to indicate that you are talking about people who actually appear to the casual viewer to be black, because the skin is so dark that even the use of the darkest shade of brown would be misleading to the reader.

    Of course even if a person appeared to be completely black, on closer examination one might note that the palms of their hands and the soles of their feet were lighter, but when we are just describing somebody so that somebody else can recognize them, approximations will do.

    A medical textbook would not describe a color as being black if it was in fact brown. For example poop that is black is usually an indication that it contains partly digested blood, all that the person is taking iron pills, and needs to be distinguished from poop that is brown, because there is all the difference in the world.

    So Black can be useful to avoid all ambiguity.

  59. @Achmed E. Newman
    "Well I never!" I hope old-timey expressions like this come back. People like that retro stuff, right? We got retro (cheap-ass, China-made) Osterizer blenders, retro Camaros, Mustangs, and Chargers, and even retro 1970s inflation coming (a wage/price spiral without the "wage" part). Yeah, sure let's have retro expressions, such as:

    "You don't say?!". It was a good one to use on the old-time 1990s non-robotic telemarketers. Answer everything they say with "you don't say?", and they may even hang up on YOU!

    As to the teacher literacy, Peak Stupidity, in the post Back to Skool, noted that my son's bad handwriting was criticized by the otherwise very nice and diligent teacher with "can't hardly ready". The "y" was a hand-o (typo by hand), but the grammar was just "keepin' it real". Well, hell, the next grade's teacher didn't grade anything, so ....

    Replies: @njguy73

    “Well, I never!”
    “You should, it’s fun.”

    “You don’t say. (surprised tone) You don’t say! (sad tone) You don’t say.”
    “Who was that?”
    “He didn’t say!”

  60. @education realist
    People seem to be missing the point. The teachers still have to take credential tests. New York is not allowing illiterates to be teachers. High school/middle school academic competency tests are roughly on the level of AP exams, and elementary school tests require roughly 10th grade math knowledge.

    The article is quite accurate except this effort started long before 2009. New York has had the vision of "well-rounded, literate" teachers since 1993. First test was LAST-1 (heh), then LAST-2, both of which failed court review and were booted for being discriminatory. The actual last one, this particular test, passed court review but was removed in 2017. Not sure why Chalkbeat is announcing the news now, given that this was all thoroughly discussed back then.



    What NY did was look at the suite of tests, and saw that black and Hispanic teachers were passing the subject matter tests and the other knowledge tests, but failing the beauty contest literacy test, invented by snowflakes who wanted proper teachers, and given that black teachers get better results with black kids than "smart" teachers, that was a no-brainer. Dump the test that has nothing to do with academic content knowledge.

    Dropping this test didn't make it any easier for an unintelligent person to become a high school teacher. It probably made it easier for someone who doesn't need to be a genius to become an elementary school teacher, and that's fine.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @photondancer, @Gary in Gramercy, @education realist, @res

    Your posts are usually on point, and I frequently find your blog helpful in my thinking about all sorts of educational issues (particularly on the use or nonuse of standardized tests, as the situation may warrant). You also introduced me to Kashawn Campbell, a young man years ahead of his time. (I still remember the L.A. Times article you so deftly fisked, noticing that the author never mentioned Mr. Campbell’s SAT or ACT scores. Obviously if they had been worth writing home about, the journalist would have put them front center. The reader was left to guess how low Mr. Campbell’s scores actually were, but today, the issue would be moot, since the University of California has banned the use of standardized test scores in toto.)

    Here, however, I agree with photondancer: this post would have been far more useful if you had included some examples from the “beauty contest literacy test” to show the kind of knowledge it tested. That way, you could more easily persuade others that it’s a “no-brainer” to dump that specific test in favor of the subject matter tests as an accurate measure of teacher ability.

    What did the “beauty contest literacy test” ask of prospective teachers? The ability to discuss the respective prose styles of Conrad and Nabokov, and the degree to which each man’s style had been shaped by learning English as a foreign tongue? The elements of the vulgarization of the Hegelian dialectic in Marxist philosophy? The specific scientific tests on which Einstein insisted before he would be confident in his theory of relativity, and the methods of verification for each? If that’s the level of the test, then I agree with you: most college graduates couldn’t pass such an exam.

    Somehow, I think the “beauty contest literacy test” expected something less than that. But how much less? A few concrete examples from the test itself might have helped readers evaluate your critique: maybe it is a ridiculous test to administer to prospective elementary school teachers, but there’s no way to tell that from your post.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    @Gary in Gramercy

    A Wrinkle in Time vs. The Phantom Tollbooth -- compare and contrast

    , @education realist
    @Gary in Gramercy

    See my next post. What I'm trying to say is that your question is largely irrelevant. There is another test that assesses whether or not an elementary teacher has the requisite knowledge. This was an extra test that they thought oh, wow, be cool to talk about how we make teachers do this. But back in 93 theyput in a number of new tests, and those tests already excluded anyone who couldn't read at a tenth grade level.

    Now, I realize you might want elementary school teachers who know more than a tenth grade level, but the fact is that if you are in most schools, you have those teachers. Most white and Asian college grads by definition have college level reading skills (the ones who fail the test often have dyslexia or some other processing disorder).

    But you don't need more than that (as is obvious by the fact that black teachers don't have noticeably worse results and better results with black kids).

    So I'm not trying to convince you that the "beauty contest" asked relevant questions. Another test already did. The beauty contest test was harder than the ES credential test, which is what teachers need to know to teach ES. Or maybe it wasn't harder and just different. Whatever the reason, blacks and Hispanics who were passing one test--the test that everyone agreed tested relevant content knowledge--were failing the ALST, and that made ALST a luxury they no longer cared about.

  61. @Anon
    OT

    Progressive writer Robert Wright, cofounder of Bloggingheads with Mickey Kaus, hilariously did today what Steve will never do (and probably couldn't do because of his reputation): He directly contacted that anthropology professor that wrote the Darvin cancellation piece in Science and asked him to back up specific assertions.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/and-then-they-came-for-darwin/

    Agustin Fuentes, an anthropologist at Princeton, contended that Darwin’s 1871 book The Descent of Man “offers a racist and sexist view of humanity” and is “often problematic, prejudiced, and injurious.”
     
    As a progressive Wright doesn't completely disagree with everything Fuentes wrote, but it's clear he caught Fuentes in a number of major exagerations and tendentious stretches at the very least, something you'd have expected the editors at Nature to have ferreted out.

    Here’s the assertion by Fuentes that, so far as I can tell, is flat-out wrong. After (accurately) writing that Darwin “asserted evolutionary differences between races,” he adds: “He went beyond simple racial rankings, offering justification of empire and colonialism, and genocide, through ‘survival of the fittest.’ ”

    I’ve read a fair amount of Darwin, and I don’t remember him defending imperialism or genocide. So I asked Fuentes on Twitter if he could back up that claim by providing actual quotes from The Descent of Man. He didn’t oblige me, but he did direct me to chapter 7. So I pulled my copy of Descent off my bookshelf and took a look.....

    Anyone who wants to join Fuentes in arguing that Darwin is trying to justify genocide runs into a couple of problems.
     
    I won't quote Wright's long piece in detail. Here it is:

    https://nonzero.substack.com/p/the-truth-about-darwin

    Wright points out changes in language over time (which most versions of Darwin explain in marginal annotations).

    (An important note on three words Darwin uses that were in those days technical terms within anthropology: “savages” were what we would call hunter-gatherers; “barbarians” were people who had agriculture but not a system of writing; “civilized” people had writing.)
     
    There used to be courses in Darwin in universities, where students would work through Descent or Origin cover to cover, and study it both as biology and as history/biography. This is a great way to approch seminal works by great scientists and is a lot of fun, since you get to change modes during the class. It's too bad that these kinds of courses are out of style (or #cancelled), and it's too bad that the current crop of professors is too dumb to even teach them, if Fuentes is any example.

    Replies: @notsaying, @eric, @Redmen, @ben tillman

    The video someone posted last week of Fuentes’s “rebuttal” of Charles Murray at Notre Dame was one of the most depressing things I’ve seen in a while.

    It’s hard to fathom that someone like Fuentes is teaching at the top universities in America. He’d be a lightweight instructor at most private schools 25 years ago.

  62. The Academic Literacy Skills Test is not a big mountain to climb. For such large percentages (White, Hispanic and black) who went thru 4 years of college and now can’t pass the test, then what were they learning all that time on campus?

  63. @Gary in Gramercy
    @education realist

    Your posts are usually on point, and I frequently find your blog helpful in my thinking about all sorts of educational issues (particularly on the use or nonuse of standardized tests, as the situation may warrant). You also introduced me to Kashawn Campbell, a young man years ahead of his time. (I still remember the L.A. Times article you so deftly fisked, noticing that the author never mentioned Mr. Campbell's SAT or ACT scores. Obviously if they had been worth writing home about, the journalist would have put them front center. The reader was left to guess how low Mr. Campbell's scores actually were, but today, the issue would be moot, since the University of California has banned the use of standardized test scores in toto.)

    Here, however, I agree with photondancer: this post would have been far more useful if you had included some examples from the "beauty contest literacy test" to show the kind of knowledge it tested. That way, you could more easily persuade others that it's a "no-brainer" to dump that specific test in favor of the subject matter tests as an accurate measure of teacher ability.

    What did the "beauty contest literacy test" ask of prospective teachers? The ability to discuss the respective prose styles of Conrad and Nabokov, and the degree to which each man's style had been shaped by learning English as a foreign tongue? The elements of the vulgarization of the Hegelian dialectic in Marxist philosophy? The specific scientific tests on which Einstein insisted before he would be confident in his theory of relativity, and the methods of verification for each? If that's the level of the test, then I agree with you: most college graduates couldn't pass such an exam.

    Somehow, I think the "beauty contest literacy test" expected something less than that. But how much less? A few concrete examples from the test itself might have helped readers evaluate your critique: maybe it is a ridiculous test to administer to prospective elementary school teachers, but there's no way to tell that from your post.

    Replies: @Known Fact, @education realist

    A Wrinkle in Time vs. The Phantom Tollbooth — compare and contrast

  64. @Buzz Mohawk
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    It's because if you capitalize us, we become really, really dangerous, like, we might circumnavigate the globe, go to the Moon, invent stuff and basically make everyone else look like the losers they are.

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?
     
    Oh sure they do, but now they go by Anonymous[265], Anonymous[266] and Anonymous[267].

    Replies: @Redmen

    Along these lines. Last night I tried to forward the iSteve thread on the “Flight From White” discussing the vanishing white students in the San Mateo high schools. My friend (who is Chinese) has a daughter in one of the high schools there, and I wanted to get his take on it. Facebook messenger blocked it. I tried 4 times, and it was blocked each time.

    Does anyone know if Facebook has officially blocked Steve or Unz?

    I never go on Facebook, but do keep in touch with a few college friends via the FB messenger. But I’ve never had a URL link blocked by it before.

  65. @Daniel H
    More good news. NYC is the central capital of the enemy. That they are destroying their city should please us. Yes, innocents are harmed, but when haven't they been harmed in war?

    Replies: @Redmen

    I’m a lifelong New Yorker, and I definitely feel a bit like I’m living behind enemy lines during a civil war. But I can’t afford to leave NY. Being a fifth columnist is my only possible aspiration.

    I wish we could develop some sort of sign where we could identify like minded people without revealing our bad thinking.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Redmen

    You could hold up three fingers like the Jeopardy guy:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/16/business/media/jeopardy-hand-gesture-maga-conspiracy.html

    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/05/16/business/16BenSmith-01/merlin_187668381_e557304b-efee-4567-ad17-b7ad5b5c69c4-jumbo.jpg?quality=90&auto=webp


    It would be hilarious if in fact it BECAME the secret badthinker sign even though the guy meant only to indicate that he had won 3 times. And if anyone questioned you, you could deny it - "what are you - one of those conspiracy nuts? Even the NY Times doesn't believe that crap!"

    , @sayless
    @Redmen

    Same situation here, Redmen, not in a position to leave, and it's getting nastier by the month. You know, there are several U.R. readers in the five boroughs and surrounds and it would be interesting to meet one another. We'd be infiltrated, but who cares.

    I will be the one wearing a wide-brimmed hat covered in tinfoil.

  66. All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”
    All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”
    All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”
    All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”
    All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”
    All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”
    All disparate impacts are caused by “racism.”

  67. @Polistra
    @Alfa158

    Exactly so, yet it still perplexes me when I see "Black and brown" together in a sentence.

    Hey! Those are two colors of bear. Can we start calling ourselves Polar People?

    Replies: @Triteleia Laxa

    • Thanks: Polistra
    • LOL: vhrm
  68. eric says:
    @Jonathan Mason
    @eric


    (Darwin) thought Africans and Australian aborigines were between apes and Caucasians...
     
    No, he didn't. He specifically pointed out that there was a huge gulf between the lowest human and the highest animal. For example no animal ever started fires and cooked food, no animal ever manufactured even the most basic tool, no animal ever had any kind of religious ceremony.

    He thought if babies were taken from savages and raised as English gentlemen, then they would assume the same level of civilization.

    Many years ago I knew a young black woman who had been adopted at birth by a wealthy white English couple. She had all the speech and manners of an upper class English woman.

    Replies: @eric

    The point is not that Darwin thought the gorilla-savage gap was larger than between a savage and a European, merely they were both gaps from lower to higher. He wrote that the gap between civilized man and his closest evolutionary ancestor will widen as savages and the big apes go extinct so that ultimately it will be between civilized man “and some ape as low as a baboon, instead of as at present between the negro or Australian and the gorilla.” The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are. Evolution back then was considered another word for progress, a development from lower to higher, so more evolved meant better in almost every respect.

    Darwin also wrote that the “highest races and the lowest savages” differ in “moral disposition … and in intellect.” As the father of evolution, he was not arguing this was merely cultural. He wrote that “western nations of Europe … now so immeasurably surpass their former savage progenitors and stand at the summit of civilization.” It’s difficult to see how these remarks could be construed to mean he thought Europeans and Africans were equal in the modern sense. As an atheist he didn’t believe they were equal in the eyes of God either.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
    @eric


    The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are.
     
    I still don't think that is the case.

    Of course Darwin knew nothing of genes and nothing of DNA.

    Darwin and Lorenz both believed that domestic dogs were descended from yellow jackals, with maybe a bit of wolf mixed in, but DNA testing has shown that dogs are all wolf and that jackals are cousins from higher up in the family tree that have co-evolved and look a hell of a lot like dogs.

    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don't have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

    However neanderthals are usually regarded as lowbrows, so that admixture could be taken as a positive or as a negative in evolving away from apes


    Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.

    So far from genetic outlying tribes dying out, they are being merged into more dominant tribes, and their genes will live through their descendants forever instead of being an evolutionary dead end.

    Replies: @ben tillman, @eric, @Curle

  69. I oppose the big government activity of credentialing, i.e. granting privileges through (restrictive) licensing. I support scrapping the entire test. Really.

    The office of Public School Teacher should be filled by popular election. True, that could result in illiterates being elected to teach English.

    We’d be no worse off.

    [MORE]

    For better or worse, officeholders are restricted to eligible voters, e.g. ages 18 and up. I’ve seen 17’ers work very well with teaching young kids, so there’d be no need to raise the voting age.

  70. @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    In case you're not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    Replies: @photondancer, @Anonymous, @Jonathan Mason, @Triteleia Laxa, @JerseyJeffersonian

    European, Asian, African

    white, yellow, Black

  71. @Redmen
    @Daniel H

    I'm a lifelong New Yorker, and I definitely feel a bit like I'm living behind enemy lines during a civil war. But I can't afford to leave NY. Being a fifth columnist is my only possible aspiration.

    I wish we could develop some sort of sign where we could identify like minded people without revealing our bad thinking.

    Replies: @Jack D, @sayless

    You could hold up three fingers like the Jeopardy guy:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/16/business/media/jeopardy-hand-gesture-maga-conspiracy.html

    It would be hilarious if in fact it BECAME the secret badthinker sign even though the guy meant only to indicate that he had won 3 times. And if anyone questioned you, you could deny it – “what are you – one of those conspiracy nuts? Even the NY Times doesn’t believe that crap!”

  72. @education realist
    People seem to be missing the point. The teachers still have to take credential tests. New York is not allowing illiterates to be teachers. High school/middle school academic competency tests are roughly on the level of AP exams, and elementary school tests require roughly 10th grade math knowledge.

    The article is quite accurate except this effort started long before 2009. New York has had the vision of "well-rounded, literate" teachers since 1993. First test was LAST-1 (heh), then LAST-2, both of which failed court review and were booted for being discriminatory. The actual last one, this particular test, passed court review but was removed in 2017. Not sure why Chalkbeat is announcing the news now, given that this was all thoroughly discussed back then.



    What NY did was look at the suite of tests, and saw that black and Hispanic teachers were passing the subject matter tests and the other knowledge tests, but failing the beauty contest literacy test, invented by snowflakes who wanted proper teachers, and given that black teachers get better results with black kids than "smart" teachers, that was a no-brainer. Dump the test that has nothing to do with academic content knowledge.

    Dropping this test didn't make it any easier for an unintelligent person to become a high school teacher. It probably made it easier for someone who doesn't need to be a genius to become an elementary school teacher, and that's fine.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @photondancer, @Gary in Gramercy, @education realist, @res

    Adding this in response to some of the comments.

    First, what vituperation? There are many comments in this thread saying that teachers are illiterate. They aren’t. This is just a fact. Kronos linked in one of my articles (thanks) but I’ve written a lot on this topic, including average GRE and SAT scores. High school academic teachers have always had achievement scores above the average college graduate. As Kronos mentioned, the 70s and 80s saw a huge decline in what we could automatically expect from a college graduate, and states responded by instituting a credential test for elementary school credentials, and then in 2000 the feds began demanding that middle school teachers pass high school tests.

    The original elementary school credential test instantly created problems for black teacher, and Hispanics, to a degree. States responded in the 90s by granting “emergency credentials” to anyone who got an education degree but couldn’t pass the credential test. The feds didn’t like this and as part of the changes in NCLB and the HEA ended the emergency credential and also forced ed schools to declare the credential passing rates. Ed schools said hey, not a problem, and stopped giving ed degrees to anyone who couldn’t pass the test. So in the early 2000s, there was a huge drop in black teachers (and a little fraud ring in the south to pay blacks who could pass the test to take it for those who couldn’t. Cf Clarence Mumford on my site).

    So for the past 20 years states have been worried about the decline in black and Hispanic teachers, particularly given the consistent research showing that teacher test scores don’t correlate with learning outcomes, but teacher race does. (I suspect there’s a baseline ability line but Goldhaber has data showing that blacks who failed the test by quite a bit had better results than whites who did….with black kids).

    Now, in all that time, here’s what they *never* did. They never made the academic credential tests easier. Not once. However, in New York’s case, back in the 90s, they thought ladida, let’s brag about how extra special literate our teachers are. I went through the history of that in the last post.

    As for this particular test, the fact that whites passed it by 70% means it wasn’t a ridiculously easy test. I’m not arguing it was incredibly difficult, but if the white rate was 95% or 100% and black rate was 70%, then I’d be more worried they were letting in really low achievers–although the fact that they have to pass several other tests makes that unlikely as well.

    For those demanding “evidence”–what evidence do you need? I’m not claiming the test was unfair, nor am I disputing that a college degree is becoming close to meaningless. But a *credential test* pass is not meaningless, because those tests aren’t easy, particularly for high school. (We can debate whether or not college graduates shouldn’t be able to pass the ES test another time, but this is *precisely* why the ES credential test began 30 years ago, and it is effectively keeping those graduates out of teaching. Hence the fraud case.)

    All I’m saying is this: New York looked at its data and saw that some number of black and Hispanic teachers were passing all the tests needed except this one. It’s not mentioned, but logically these teachers are mostly elementary school teachers (or PE or sped). It doesn’t matter how many of them there were. They’d demonstrated all the subject matter competency, and this other test, which was only ever offered as an ego boost originally, was stopping them from being teachers.

    They need black and Hispanic teachers more than they need the ego boost.

    Also–as I mention in the article Kronos linked in–if you’re a black teacher who can pass the tests, you are extremely high ability for a black person, particularly if the test is high school subject matter. So blacks leave teaching at a higher rate–a lot of them to become principals, where the pay is higher, but others to leave the field altogether. Yet another reason to reduce the test burden, to keep in the black teachers who are more likely to stay.

    • Disagree: Abolish_public_education
    • Replies: @photondancer
    @education realist

    All that text and you still didn't explain what it is about the test itself that makes it useless. So I can only presume that it's the fact that the test results display the dreaded disparate impact that upsets you. Since I don't accept that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness, I vote this test remain in use until I see actual reasons why it shouldn't.

    P.S. if black students will only study when taught by black teachers, as the results you cite suggest, then that is clear proof of their racism and it ought to be vigorously opposed. It won't be, of course.

    Replies: @vhrm, @education realist

  73. @eric
    @Jonathan Mason

    The point is not that Darwin thought the gorilla-savage gap was larger than between a savage and a European, merely they were both gaps from lower to higher. He wrote that the gap between civilized man and his closest evolutionary ancestor will widen as savages and the big apes go extinct so that ultimately it will be between civilized man “and some ape as low as a baboon, instead of as at present between the negro or Australian and the gorilla.” The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are. Evolution back then was considered another word for progress, a development from lower to higher, so more evolved meant better in almost every respect.

    Darwin also wrote that the “highest races and the lowest savages” differ in “moral disposition … and in intellect.” As the father of evolution, he was not arguing this was merely cultural. He wrote that “western nations of Europe … now so immeasurably surpass their former savage progenitors and stand at the summit of civilization.” It's difficult to see how these remarks could be construed to mean he thought Europeans and Africans were equal in the modern sense. As an atheist he didn't believe they were equal in the eyes of God either.

    Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are.

    I still don’t think that is the case.

    Of course Darwin knew nothing of genes and nothing of DNA.

    Darwin and Lorenz both believed that domestic dogs were descended from yellow jackals, with maybe a bit of wolf mixed in, but DNA testing has shown that dogs are all wolf and that jackals are cousins from higher up in the family tree that have co-evolved and look a hell of a lot like dogs.

    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don’t have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

    However neanderthals are usually regarded as lowbrows, so that admixture could be taken as a positive or as a negative in evolving away from apes

    Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.

    So far from genetic outlying tribes dying out, they are being merged into more dominant tribes, and their genes will live through their descendants forever instead of being an evolutionary dead end.

    • Replies: @ben tillman
    @Jonathan Mason



    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than [are] Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don’t have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

     

    Cites?
    , @eric
    @Jonathan Mason

    I think you have to distinguish between what Darwin said and thought, versus what modern evolutionary theorists think. No one today thinks Africans or Australian aborigines are lower than Caucasians, or closer to apes, but that is what Darwin thought.

    Replies: @iDeplorable

    , @Curle
    @Jonathan Mason

    “ Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.”

    Rahzib Khan addressed this topic in the past on his old blog gene expression. He points out that races have always mixed and the relevant number is the percent mixing against the total and that the much greater explosion in non-mixed populations compared to mixed populations worldwide gives the lie to this mostly western conceit. You can have a notable but still comparatively small increase in the number of mixed race couples in certain American coastal enclaves and this demographic in total numbers will be dwarfed by increases in non-mixed populations coming from Africa and China alone.

    The real peak of race mixing was the 17-19th centuries in central and South America.

  74. Wonder if this female math teacher passed the literacy test…

    Pictures too! Yep.

    Marion County teacher, 2 others arrested in homicide

    https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/05/22/3-people-including-marion-county-teacher-arrested-in-connection-with-alachua-county-death/

    A Marion County teacher was one of three people arrested in connection with a murder in Alachua County on Monday, according to the Alachua County Sheriff’s Office.

    The teacher, 30-year-old Martesha Williams Johnson, along with 32-year-old Jasmine Webb and 36-year-old Doug Heath were taken into custody following the murder of 44-year-old Tyerune G. Blocker, deputies said.

    Deputies said Webb, Heath and Johnson went to 1307 Northwest 223rd Lane in Brooker after an ongoing argument on social media and phone between Heath, Webb and a secondary victim.
    Gunshots were fired from a vehicle Webb, Heath and Johnson were riding in, and all three fled the scene, deputies said…

    A math teacher at Fort King Middle School, Williams is on paid administration leave pending the outcome of the investigation, according to Marion County Schools.

    • Replies: @Abolish_public_education
    @E. Rekshun

    A bullet is fired horizontally with an initial velocity 'v'. If the gun muzzle was at a height 'h', how far would the bullet travel before it hits the ground?

    (Assume no air resistance, living obstructions, etc.)

    Replies: @James Speaks

    , @William Badwhite
    @E. Rekshun


    The secondary victim was the intended target and was in close proximity to Blocker,
     
    More black marksmanship.
  75. Accelerationism to the moon!

  76. @Anon
    OT

    Progressive writer Robert Wright, cofounder of Bloggingheads with Mickey Kaus, hilariously did today what Steve will never do (and probably couldn't do because of his reputation): He directly contacted that anthropology professor that wrote the Darvin cancellation piece in Science and asked him to back up specific assertions.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/and-then-they-came-for-darwin/

    Agustin Fuentes, an anthropologist at Princeton, contended that Darwin’s 1871 book The Descent of Man “offers a racist and sexist view of humanity” and is “often problematic, prejudiced, and injurious.”
     
    As a progressive Wright doesn't completely disagree with everything Fuentes wrote, but it's clear he caught Fuentes in a number of major exagerations and tendentious stretches at the very least, something you'd have expected the editors at Nature to have ferreted out.

    Here’s the assertion by Fuentes that, so far as I can tell, is flat-out wrong. After (accurately) writing that Darwin “asserted evolutionary differences between races,” he adds: “He went beyond simple racial rankings, offering justification of empire and colonialism, and genocide, through ‘survival of the fittest.’ ”

    I’ve read a fair amount of Darwin, and I don’t remember him defending imperialism or genocide. So I asked Fuentes on Twitter if he could back up that claim by providing actual quotes from The Descent of Man. He didn’t oblige me, but he did direct me to chapter 7. So I pulled my copy of Descent off my bookshelf and took a look.....

    Anyone who wants to join Fuentes in arguing that Darwin is trying to justify genocide runs into a couple of problems.
     
    I won't quote Wright's long piece in detail. Here it is:

    https://nonzero.substack.com/p/the-truth-about-darwin

    Wright points out changes in language over time (which most versions of Darwin explain in marginal annotations).

    (An important note on three words Darwin uses that were in those days technical terms within anthropology: “savages” were what we would call hunter-gatherers; “barbarians” were people who had agriculture but not a system of writing; “civilized” people had writing.)
     
    There used to be courses in Darwin in universities, where students would work through Descent or Origin cover to cover, and study it both as biology and as history/biography. This is a great way to approch seminal works by great scientists and is a lot of fun, since you get to change modes during the class. It's too bad that these kinds of courses are out of style (or #cancelled), and it's too bad that the current crop of professors is too dumb to even teach them, if Fuentes is any example.

    Replies: @notsaying, @eric, @Redmen, @ben tillman

    Is this the Robert Wright who wrote The Moral Animal?

    Wright:

    There are things about this essay I like. For example: I understood it, which distinguishes it from many things written by contemporary anthropologists.

    Ha ha ha ha ha!

  77. @Known Fact
    Yet another objective measure falls by the wayside. BTW it's not too reassuring that only 69 percent of white teachers passed

    Replies: @Polistra, @Thomm, @AnotherDad

    BTW it’s not too reassuring that only 69 percent of white teachers passed

    It is a female-dominated profession. What do you expect?

  78. @UNIT472
    There is a cheaper and more accurate test to judge a teacher candidate and it only takes a glance to administer.

    Replies: @Old Prude

    It’s funny, because its true.

  79. @Jonathan Mason
    @eric


    The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are.
     
    I still don't think that is the case.

    Of course Darwin knew nothing of genes and nothing of DNA.

    Darwin and Lorenz both believed that domestic dogs were descended from yellow jackals, with maybe a bit of wolf mixed in, but DNA testing has shown that dogs are all wolf and that jackals are cousins from higher up in the family tree that have co-evolved and look a hell of a lot like dogs.

    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don't have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

    However neanderthals are usually regarded as lowbrows, so that admixture could be taken as a positive or as a negative in evolving away from apes


    Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.

    So far from genetic outlying tribes dying out, they are being merged into more dominant tribes, and their genes will live through their descendants forever instead of being an evolutionary dead end.

    Replies: @ben tillman, @eric, @Curle

    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than [are] Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don’t have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

    Cites?

  80. @Known Fact
    Yet another objective measure falls by the wayside. BTW it's not too reassuring that only 69 percent of white teachers passed

    Replies: @Polistra, @Thomm, @AnotherDad

    Yet another objective measure falls by the wayside.

    This is your nation on minoritarianism. Objective measures need not apply.

    (Seriously we had that sort of “objective measures” “white bread” nation in 1960–it was prosperous and pleasant. But the special people found it scary … so it had to go.)

  81. res says:
    @education realist
    People seem to be missing the point. The teachers still have to take credential tests. New York is not allowing illiterates to be teachers. High school/middle school academic competency tests are roughly on the level of AP exams, and elementary school tests require roughly 10th grade math knowledge.

    The article is quite accurate except this effort started long before 2009. New York has had the vision of "well-rounded, literate" teachers since 1993. First test was LAST-1 (heh), then LAST-2, both of which failed court review and were booted for being discriminatory. The actual last one, this particular test, passed court review but was removed in 2017. Not sure why Chalkbeat is announcing the news now, given that this was all thoroughly discussed back then.



    What NY did was look at the suite of tests, and saw that black and Hispanic teachers were passing the subject matter tests and the other knowledge tests, but failing the beauty contest literacy test, invented by snowflakes who wanted proper teachers, and given that black teachers get better results with black kids than "smart" teachers, that was a no-brainer. Dump the test that has nothing to do with academic content knowledge.

    Dropping this test didn't make it any easier for an unintelligent person to become a high school teacher. It probably made it easier for someone who doesn't need to be a genius to become an elementary school teacher, and that's fine.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @photondancer, @Gary in Gramercy, @education realist, @res

    This 2015 Chalkbeat article gave a bit different impression of the rigor of the other tests.
    https://ny.chalkbeat.org/2015/3/19/21092193/aspiring-teachers-struggled-on-new-tests-data-show-prompting-diversity-debate

    But more recent versions of the exam became so easy that 99 percent of test-takers passed. That changed last year with the introduction of three new tests designed align with nationally established teaching standards.

    Here is how they described the Academic Literacy Skills test (ALST).

    The hardest exam to pass last year, for all teachers, was the new literacy test. Called the Academic Literacy Skills test, it measures reading and writing aptitude based on the Common Core standards. Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed — though most only met a lower proficiency bar aligned to eighth-grade English standards.

    For the people asking for examples.

    This article has some sample questions and links to the study guide with more.
    https://www.silive.com/news/2017/03/try_these_sample_questions_can.html
    https://www.nystce.nesinc.com/Content/STUDYGUIDE/NY_SG_SRI_202.htm

    This link has an online practice test.
    https://www.testprepreview.com/nystce/academic-literacy-skills-test.htm

    • Replies: @vhrm
    @res

    Those questions aren't total gimmes and some of the answers imo are arguable. e.g. in the "testprepreview" one i got one question wrong where i think they're reading things a bit too narrowly. In another case i got one "right" that i actually disagreed with but guessed which thing they'd be looking for. Probably with some practice i'd get better at figuring out how the game works.

    But yeah, i can definitely imagine a certain number of teachers, especially elementary school ones not doing so hot on these.

    The reading choices are nicely of the current political tastes:

    First off is a short short story “The Story of an Hour” by Kate Chopin hat appeared in 1894 in Vogue. (https://www.katechopin.org/the-story-of-an-hour/#questions )

    It's about a woman who is besides herself with joy as she imagines just how awesome her life will be now that her husband died in a train accident (and she gets to have his money but not deal with him) because even though she loved him sometimes, and he loved her and treated her well, marriage is inherently oppressive... to women.

    The second was a speech about the negative impact of school absences on children, especially children of color, and that it takes a village to raise a child, especially a black child, and get them to school every day. Oh, and change begins with all of us. (yes that ",especially..." parenthetical is in there though i can't find a link to that specific piece )

    , @photondancer
    @res

    Thank you!

    I have only looked at the first link so far. It's not an easy test. One might argue, as education_realist seems to be doing, that being able to teach small children doesn't require this level of reading. But I see no reason why we should inflict mediocre and ill-educated teachers on children of any age. I still recall my disillusionment on the occasion when I realised, around age 10 that the teacher I was disputing a result with was stupider than me. A smart teacher pulls children of all abilities up.

    I wonder how many of the AWFLs cheering on the dumbing down of USAian teachers also fall in with the fashionable tendency to laud Finnish teachers, who have to pass strict tests?

    Replies: @education realist

  82. @notsaying
    Off Topic:

    We need to get smarter, not dumber.

    Look what we are doing now because of the increasing aggressiveness of the Chinese. I can only think we don't have enough military planes to drop bombs one by one and not enough time and/or money to get more. So we are going to drop pallets of targeted smart missiles from cargo planes, I kid you not:

    "US Air Force discovers how to convert its 522 cargo planes into bombers by deploying cruise missiles attached to parachutes, rapidly increasing strike power should war break out with China"

    "Forbes reported that should a war break out with China, the Air Force would 'struggle to concentrate enough strikepower in one place' to take out their air defenses."

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9614859/US-Air-Force-transforming-cargo-planes-bombers-rapidly-increase-strike-power.html

    Replies: @Joe Stalin

    “US Air Force discovers how to convert its 522 cargo planes into bombers by deploying cruise missiles attached to parachutes, rapidly increasing strike power should war break out with China”

    Pakis were blowing up Indians doing just that in 1965.

    In the 1965 Indo-Pakistani War the Antelopes dropped parachute commandos into Indian territory in a night-time mission involving three C-130B transports. Just before the 1965 war started, the squadron’s commanding officer, Wing Commander Eric Gordan Hall, had the idea of making up for the PAF’s deficiency in heavy bombers by modifying the Hercules to carry bombs.[2] It was converted to carry 10,000 kg of bombs, which were rolled out on pallets from the rear ramp, and over 21 night-time bombing raids were flown against Indian forces approaching for the Battles of Chawinda and Pul Kanjari. Support missions for troops in the Northern Areas were continued after the war.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No._6_Squadron_(Pakistan_Air_Force)

  83. @Gary in Gramercy
    @education realist

    Your posts are usually on point, and I frequently find your blog helpful in my thinking about all sorts of educational issues (particularly on the use or nonuse of standardized tests, as the situation may warrant). You also introduced me to Kashawn Campbell, a young man years ahead of his time. (I still remember the L.A. Times article you so deftly fisked, noticing that the author never mentioned Mr. Campbell's SAT or ACT scores. Obviously if they had been worth writing home about, the journalist would have put them front center. The reader was left to guess how low Mr. Campbell's scores actually were, but today, the issue would be moot, since the University of California has banned the use of standardized test scores in toto.)

    Here, however, I agree with photondancer: this post would have been far more useful if you had included some examples from the "beauty contest literacy test" to show the kind of knowledge it tested. That way, you could more easily persuade others that it's a "no-brainer" to dump that specific test in favor of the subject matter tests as an accurate measure of teacher ability.

    What did the "beauty contest literacy test" ask of prospective teachers? The ability to discuss the respective prose styles of Conrad and Nabokov, and the degree to which each man's style had been shaped by learning English as a foreign tongue? The elements of the vulgarization of the Hegelian dialectic in Marxist philosophy? The specific scientific tests on which Einstein insisted before he would be confident in his theory of relativity, and the methods of verification for each? If that's the level of the test, then I agree with you: most college graduates couldn't pass such an exam.

    Somehow, I think the "beauty contest literacy test" expected something less than that. But how much less? A few concrete examples from the test itself might have helped readers evaluate your critique: maybe it is a ridiculous test to administer to prospective elementary school teachers, but there's no way to tell that from your post.

    Replies: @Known Fact, @education realist

    See my next post. What I’m trying to say is that your question is largely irrelevant. There is another test that assesses whether or not an elementary teacher has the requisite knowledge. This was an extra test that they thought oh, wow, be cool to talk about how we make teachers do this. But back in 93 theyput in a number of new tests, and those tests already excluded anyone who couldn’t read at a tenth grade level.

    Now, I realize you might want elementary school teachers who know more than a tenth grade level, but the fact is that if you are in most schools, you have those teachers. Most white and Asian college grads by definition have college level reading skills (the ones who fail the test often have dyslexia or some other processing disorder).

    But you don’t need more than that (as is obvious by the fact that black teachers don’t have noticeably worse results and better results with black kids).

    So I’m not trying to convince you that the “beauty contest” asked relevant questions. Another test already did. The beauty contest test was harder than the ES credential test, which is what teachers need to know to teach ES. Or maybe it wasn’t harder and just different. Whatever the reason, blacks and Hispanics who were passing one test–the test that everyone agreed tested relevant content knowledge–were failing the ALST, and that made ALST a luxury they no longer cared about.

  84. Yeah, but Chalkbeat is wrong. There has never once been a credential test with a 99% pass rate. In fact, anyone who thinks about it knows that there is not a single standardized test on the planet that has a 99% pass rate for all races. That statement doesn’t pass the smell test and notice there isn’t a link. All through the 2000s there were articles about the dearth of black and Hispanic teachers, including in New York. The idea that 99% of blacks were passing a credential test during that time is ludicrous.

    What Chalkbeat probably means to say, but doesn’t understand, is that all education majors have to pass the test. Therefore yes, 99% of teachers who got credentialed passed the test.

    But lot of people start out to be ed majors and don’t get that far because they don’t pass one of the tests. Others try to enter a credential program post-graduation after a non ed major or go through an alt-cert program and won’t get in because they fail the test. None of those are counted. Only people who pass the test are counted and become teachers, so yes, 99% pass rate is expected.

    Back in the 90s, that wasn’t the case. People could have gotten an ed degree without the credential test. But no more (see earlier posts).

    • Replies: @res
    @education realist


    Yeah, but Chalkbeat is wrong.
     
    Evidence?

    there is not a single standardized test on the planet that has a 99% pass rate for all races.
    ...
    The idea that 99% of blacks were passing a credential test during that time is ludicrous.
     
    Nice logic fail. The statement was an overall pass rate of 99%. That does not imply blacks passed with the same 99% rate.

    What Chalkbeat probably means to say, but doesn’t understand, is that all education majors have to pass the test. Therefore yes, 99% of teachers who got credentialed passed the test.

    But lot of people start out to be ed majors and don’t get that far because they don’t pass one of the tests. Others try to enter a credential program post-graduation after a non ed major or go through an alt-cert program and won’t get in because they fail the test.
     

    You are probably onto something there, but if there are multiple successive hurdles then for each one you only give the pass/fail rate for that hurdle/test. In this case I see no sign that comparing 99% to the 48/56/75% black/Hispanic/white pass rates for the newer test is an unfair comparison.

    This articles discusses the test pass rates and makes a similar point to yours.
    https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/n-y-data-on-new-teacher-licensing-exams-show-higher-failure-rates/2014/11


    Across the United States, about 96 percent of teacher-candidates pass their licensing tests, according to federal data. (Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)
     
    The relevant metric I see is what percentage of people taking the test pass (IMHO kind of the definition of pass rate for a test). Do you have any evidence the 99% figure is inaccurate given this metric?

    I looked for more data on NYSTCE pre-2014 pass rates, but did not find anything. If anyone knows of some, please post.

    P.S. Your tone of utter certainty is pretty funny given the blatant logic failure I noted. That also leaves me less willing to trust your other undocumented assertions.

  85. @JimDandy
    We are already seeing trends of parents moving from blue states to red states because of this bullshit, but, no matter what state you're in, the Federal Government and Woke Capitalism is a motherfucker. I wonder if we will eventually see significant trends of parents moving their families out of America.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Shel100, @Rob

    The same thing is going on in most other western countries.

  86. @Kronos
    @JimDandy

    Where’d you’d think they’d try to go?

    Replies: @John Derbyshire

    • Thanks: Kronos
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @John Derbyshire




    ...parents moving their families out of America.
     
    Where’d you’d think they’d try to go?
     
    Uruguay!
     
    The Beatles never performed in South America. Thanks to Uruguay, they didn't have to:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruguayan_Invasion

    "Pics, or it didn't happen!". Okay:



    https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51J1jmYKeWL.jpg

    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/IpxMhbjqTGk/hqdefault.jpg

    https://img.discogs.com/vOR3DAVi93D9D_-VUwkX71sZ50U=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-6444888-1424695663-5495.jpeg.jpg

    Replies: @duncsbaby

  87. @Alfa158
    @Anonymous

    The people who set that standard issued an explanation of why. In brief:

    Asians, Blacks, Latinos, Jews etc, are real people with a distinctive culture and identity. People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity. They are officially described as people who subscribe to the delusion that they are something called white, therefore the word is not capitalized.

    At least that’s the the official explanation, in actuality the people who conform to this standard are happy do so because they believe Whites, or at least Whites other than Whites like themselves, are evil and inferior.

    Replies: @El Dato, @Polistra, @Reg Cæsar

    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    Because Asia is a continent and white is a race. Do I have to pull out my 1920s Fowler’s to explain it? If it was good enough for Stoddard and Grant, it’s good enough for me.

    The new fad derives from the Johnson clan of Jet, Ebony, and Essence fame. Peter Brimelow jokes that all of today’s bad ideas originate in Canada, but many of them come from Chicago. House music or capitalization, don’t be a Chiwigger.

    People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity.

    We have dozens.

    Ours is called “American”, with no qualifiers.

    • Replies: @Anon
    @Reg Cæsar


    Because Asia is a continent and white is a race.
     
    But Asians aren’t a continent.

    Asians aren’t a race either. Hindus and Han the same race? Really?
  88. @John Derbyshire
    @Kronos

    Uruguay! https://www.johnderbyshire.com/Opinions/Diaries/2020-05.html#04

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    …parents moving their families out of America.

    Where’d you’d think they’d try to go?

    Uruguay!

    The Beatles never performed in South America. Thanks to Uruguay, they didn’t have to:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruguayan_Invasion

    “Pics, or it didn’t happen!”. Okay:

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @duncsbaby
    @Reg Cæsar

    The Ramones on the other hand had a big following in South America. Here's video of the fans after a concert in Uruguay in 1994. Definitely the demographics that warm the cockles of this Man of Unz's cold heart.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RhKmmpdX-0

  89. @E. Rekshun
    Wonder if this female math teacher passed the literacy test...

    Pictures too! Yep.

    Marion County teacher, 2 others arrested in homicide

    https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/05/22/3-people-including-marion-county-teacher-arrested-in-connection-with-alachua-county-death/

    A Marion County teacher was one of three people arrested in connection with a murder in Alachua County on Monday, according to the Alachua County Sheriff’s Office.

    The teacher, 30-year-old Martesha Williams Johnson, along with 32-year-old Jasmine Webb and 36-year-old Doug Heath were taken into custody following the murder of 44-year-old Tyerune G. Blocker, deputies said.

    Deputies said Webb, Heath and Johnson went to 1307 Northwest 223rd Lane in Brooker after an ongoing argument on social media and phone between Heath, Webb and a secondary victim.
    Gunshots were fired from a vehicle Webb, Heath and Johnson were riding in, and all three fled the scene, deputies said...

    A math teacher at Fort King Middle School, Williams is on paid administration leave pending the outcome of the investigation, according to Marion County Schools.
     

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education, @William Badwhite

    A bullet is fired horizontally with an initial velocity ‘v’. If the gun muzzle was at a height ‘h’, how far would the bullet travel before it hits the ground?

    (Assume no air resistance, living obstructions, etc.)

    • Replies: @James Speaks
    @Abolish_public_education

    Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft^2/sec

    v(t) = -32.2 * t ft/sec

    y(t) = h - 16.1t^2 ft

    set y(t) = 0

    h = 16.1t^2

    h/16.1 = t^2

    (sqrt(h)/4) = t = 4.01 sec

    Horizontal

    x(t) = "v" * 4.01 ft

    Replies: @James Speaks

  90. @photondancer
    @ScarletNumber

    You think the Caucasus is a continent?

    In case you're not kidding, the practice of capitalising the names of human races (not continents) except for whites has been an ongoing topic here for some time.

    Replies: @Possumman, @Bill Jones

    Even Wikipedia, that bastion of Jewish controlled wokeness capitalizes The Caucasus and Caucasian

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasus

    According to Leonti Mroveli, the 11th-century Georgian chronicler, the word Caucasian…

    Go thou and do likewise.

  91. • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    @Desiderius

    Maybe Freddie's an iSteve reader. His reasoning here sounds a lot like arguments that I, among others, have been making here for years:


    I suspect that placing all of the blame for historical crimes on white people is strangely comforting for white leftists: it advances a vision of the world where only white people matter. It says that the sun rises and sets with white people. It suggests that white people wrote history. It assures white people that, no matter what else is true, they are the masters of the world. That all of this is framed in terms of judgment against the abstraction “white people” is incidental. I think if you could strip people down to their most naked self-interest and ask them, “would you be willing to take all the blame, if it meant you got all the power?,” most would say yes. And of course in this narrative people of color are sad little extras, unable even to commit injustice, manipulated across the chessboard by the omnipotent white masters whose interests they can’t even begin to oppose. All of this to score meaningless political points in debates about inequality and injustice.
     
    He's getting close to the deeper underlying truth, i.e. that 'white leftists' are indeed so in love with their own perceived power and goodness that they believe they can not only condescend to PoC and relieve them of their agency, they can 'save' PoC by raising them up to be just like good white leftists.

    Replies: @Desiderius

  92. @ScarletNumber
    @Anonymous


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    In case you're not kidding, Asians are named after Asia, which is a continent. Continents are capitalized. In a similar vein, Caucasian is also capitalized.

    Unz, I beg you, please disallow anonymous commenting.

    Replies: @photondancer, @Anonymous, @Jonathan Mason, @Triteleia Laxa, @JerseyJeffersonian

    So, ScarletNumber, your posting handle is your actual, legal name? I didn’t think so. Well then, what is the functional difference between the “anonymous” posting that you abominate, and the “pseudonymous” posting in which you indulge?

    And BTW, people do have reasons for posting pseudonymously; ever hear of “cancellation”? It’s a thing you know, and a genuine hazard to those with a non-woke pov. But if you aren’t worried about this, use your actual, legal name. Your phony distinction between “anonymous” posting (vitiated here at Unz Review through the identification of “anonymous” posters here through numbers) and “pseudonymous” posting is jejune.

  93. vhrm says:
    @res
    @education realist

    This 2015 Chalkbeat article gave a bit different impression of the rigor of the other tests.
    https://ny.chalkbeat.org/2015/3/19/21092193/aspiring-teachers-struggled-on-new-tests-data-show-prompting-diversity-debate


    But more recent versions of the exam became so easy that 99 percent of test-takers passed. That changed last year with the introduction of three new tests designed align with nationally established teaching standards.
     
    Here is how they described the Academic Literacy Skills test (ALST).

    The hardest exam to pass last year, for all teachers, was the new literacy test. Called the Academic Literacy Skills test, it measures reading and writing aptitude based on the Common Core standards. Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed — though most only met a lower proficiency bar aligned to eighth-grade English standards.
     
    For the people asking for examples.

    This article has some sample questions and links to the study guide with more.
    https://www.silive.com/news/2017/03/try_these_sample_questions_can.html
    https://www.nystce.nesinc.com/Content/STUDYGUIDE/NY_SG_SRI_202.htm

    This link has an online practice test.
    https://www.testprepreview.com/nystce/academic-literacy-skills-test.htm

    Replies: @vhrm, @photondancer

    Those questions aren’t total gimmes and some of the answers imo are arguable. e.g. in the “testprepreview” one i got one question wrong where i think they’re reading things a bit too narrowly. In another case i got one “right” that i actually disagreed with but guessed which thing they’d be looking for. Probably with some practice i’d get better at figuring out how the game works.

    But yeah, i can definitely imagine a certain number of teachers, especially elementary school ones not doing so hot on these.

    The reading choices are nicely of the current political tastes:

    First off is a short short story “The Story of an Hour” by Kate Chopin hat appeared in 1894 in Vogue. (https://www.katechopin.org/the-story-of-an-hour/#questions )

    It’s about a woman who is besides herself with joy as she imagines just how awesome her life will be now that her husband died in a train accident (and she gets to have his money but not deal with him) because even though she loved him sometimes, and he loved her and treated her well, marriage is inherently oppressive… to women.

    The second was a speech about the negative impact of school absences on children, especially children of color, and that it takes a village to raise a child, especially a black child, and get them to school every day. Oh, and change begins with all of us. (yes that “,especially…” parenthetical is in there though i can’t find a link to that specific piece )

  94. Rob says: • Website
    @JimDandy
    We are already seeing trends of parents moving from blue states to red states because of this bullshit, but, no matter what state you're in, the Federal Government and Woke Capitalism is a motherfucker. I wonder if we will eventually see significant trends of parents moving their families out of America.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Shel100, @Rob

    I think that a right-leaning government in South America, perhaps when Argentina has one, will try to get US whites to immigrate as the screws tighten in America. Thing is, the screws are tightening already, but we do not seem to realize it. The younger you are, and the lower on the class ladder you are, the faster the screws are tightening. Young white men from the working class have pretty much zero chance of going to an Ivy, a ‘hidden Ivy’ or one of the exclusive private colleges. The ambitious ones see blacks with much less ability going to great schools. This breeds a lot of resentment from smart guys who are not pro-man class or higher. Rich whites are not the victims of AA, middle and working clsss white guys are. I think this led to the alt right MAGA phenomenon.

    Maybe try learning some Spanish? My dad wanted to move to Argentina when I was a kid. My mom did not, though. There is a fairly large American community in Argentina. They send their kids to schools that are half in Spanish and half in English. They probably make less money than equivalent Americans here, but they sure do live pleasant lives. Lots of steak dinners lasting until late at night. Servants if they want them, because unskilled labor is really cheap there. The inflation was crazy, but if you keep your assets in America or soon, China, you can build wealth.

    I do not know, however, how South America will turn out as America declines. Argentina has potential,nthough. With millions of American whites, it would be first world again in no time.

    It would be somewhat ironic for conservative whites, many of whom are against immigration, to become immigrants themselves. I think that we recognize the difference between immigrants who bring value, both genetic and cultural. And those with subpar nature and nurture. If five million Japanese wanted to immigrate to America, I would probably welcome them. They are smart and civilized. Contact with Japanese culture could improve aspects of our culture. Five million Guatemalan peasants? I would prefer it if they stayed home. Or migrated to Mexico, a country with similar Indio peasant stock.

    • Replies: @Alden
    @Rob

    Fine, give your job your home and your business and your children’s jobs homes and businesses to Japanese immigrants and see how they improve your life.

    This common good socialism and Christian worrying about what’s best for America is why White Americans are stampeding off a cliff into rocks and high tide surf.

    America hates you, your White children and all Whites. Time to dump patriotism and the common good and fight to survive. Moving to S America bring a big dowry and marry into a family with connections. Otherwise you won’t survive as an English teacher S Americans aren’t stupid and don’t open up their businesses and professions to foreignersZ

    , @JimDandy
    @Rob

    And it's grass-fed steak. I think you're on to something with this Argentina stuff.

    , @vhrm
    @Rob

    But what would young white working class Americans do for work in Argentina? Is there a demand there for them?

    Replies: @Rob

  95. @Reg Cæsar
    @Alfa158


    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?
     
    Because Asia is a continent and white is a race. Do I have to pull out my 1920s Fowler's to explain it? If it was good enough for Stoddard and Grant, it's good enough for me.

    The new fad derives from the Johnson clan of Jet, Ebony, and Essence fame. Peter Brimelow jokes that all of today's bad ideas originate in Canada, but many of them come from Chicago. House music or capitalization, don't be a Chiwigger.


    People who identify as “white” people in fact have no culture or identity.
     
    We have dozens.


    https://anesi.com/rmap2.jpg


    Ours is called "American", with no qualifiers.

    Replies: @Anon

    Because Asia is a continent and white is a race.

    But Asians aren’t a continent.

    Asians aren’t a race either. Hindus and Han the same race? Really?

  96. @Anon
    @Alden


    The laptop and google math programs
     
    Does Google now offer math programs?

    Replies: @Alden

    Not really but covid hoax the kids aren’t in school. They call it bed school because they lie in bed with their laptop. They do the math problems on the test on their phones and type the answer into the lap top.

    Google doesn’t just give the answers All the search answers do the calculations. Seeing the calculations done in a clear and easy to understand manner; the kids learn math.

    Example 5 + X = 7 7 – 5 = 2. So X is 2

    The books and teachers don’t show the simple calculations to solve math problems So using a phone or another computer to cheat teaches the kids how to solve math problems better than the teachers and text books can.

    • Replies: @Curle
    @Alden

    Best thing for learning fractions like muscle memory was to get a job working one of the old fashion cash machines where you had to calculate tax in your head and input it separately. Starting as I did at age 16 allowed me to become reflexively proficient by 16 and one-half. Once you can figure fractions almost instantly, you open up more time for problem solving concentration when working on more complex problems on time limited tests.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  97. @Peter Akuleyev
    @Alden

    The state department foreign service officers has to add 40 points to the score of blacks to get them up to 80 on the written test.

    I have lived overseas for a cumulative total of 20 years, including stints in Asia, Russia, and Western Europe. Went to my fair share of embassy functions, met embassy staff all over the world. I have never, to the best of my memory, ever met a black American foreign service officer, even during the Obama years. Maybe they all get sent to Africa?

    Replies: @Alden

    They do get sent to Africa. Most are women who stay in the building and do visa applications. Or they stay in DC and get rapid promotions. Mostly stay in DC and get promotions. Obama has a black woman as UN ambassador I believe Susan something?

    Even with the extensive extensive help the foreign language requirement passing at basic level after 5 years tutoring keeps them out. They are hired on a temporary basis and given extensive English composition training too. But after a few years as temp trainee, they wash out. Full salary and benefits though.

    Then they’re offered jobs in other DC government agencies. To prevent more affirmative action lawsuits. Mostly they work in the big buildings in DC and Virginia so the department can display its diversity.

  98. @Rob
    @JimDandy

    I think that a right-leaning government in South America, perhaps when Argentina has one, will try to get US whites to immigrate as the screws tighten in America. Thing is, the screws are tightening already, but we do not seem to realize it. The younger you are, and the lower on the class ladder you are, the faster the screws are tightening. Young white men from the working class have pretty much zero chance of going to an Ivy, a ‘hidden Ivy’ or one of the exclusive private colleges. The ambitious ones see blacks with much less ability going to great schools. This breeds a lot of resentment from smart guys who are not pro-man class or higher. Rich whites are not the victims of AA, middle and working clsss white guys are. I think this led to the alt right MAGA phenomenon.

    Maybe try learning some Spanish? My dad wanted to move to Argentina when I was a kid. My mom did not, though. There is a fairly large American community in Argentina. They send their kids to schools that are half in Spanish and half in English. They probably make less money than equivalent Americans here, but they sure do live pleasant lives. Lots of steak dinners lasting until late at night. Servants if they want them, because unskilled labor is really cheap there. The inflation was crazy, but if you keep your assets in America or soon, China, you can build wealth.

    I do not know, however, how South America will turn out as America declines. Argentina has potential,nthough. With millions of American whites, it would be first world again in no time.

    It would be somewhat ironic for conservative whites, many of whom are against immigration, to become immigrants themselves. I think that we recognize the difference between immigrants who bring value, both genetic and cultural. And those with subpar nature and nurture. If five million Japanese wanted to immigrate to America, I would probably welcome them. They are smart and civilized. Contact with Japanese culture could improve aspects of our culture. Five million Guatemalan peasants? I would prefer it if they stayed home. Or migrated to Mexico, a country with similar Indio peasant stock.

    Replies: @Alden, @JimDandy, @vhrm

    Fine, give your job your home and your business and your children’s jobs homes and businesses to Japanese immigrants and see how they improve your life.

    This common good socialism and Christian worrying about what’s best for America is why White Americans are stampeding off a cliff into rocks and high tide surf.

    America hates you, your White children and all Whites. Time to dump patriotism and the common good and fight to survive. Moving to S America bring a big dowry and marry into a family with connections. Otherwise you won’t survive as an English teacher S Americans aren’t stupid and don’t open up their businesses and professions to foreignersZ

  99. @Rob
    @JimDandy

    I think that a right-leaning government in South America, perhaps when Argentina has one, will try to get US whites to immigrate as the screws tighten in America. Thing is, the screws are tightening already, but we do not seem to realize it. The younger you are, and the lower on the class ladder you are, the faster the screws are tightening. Young white men from the working class have pretty much zero chance of going to an Ivy, a ‘hidden Ivy’ or one of the exclusive private colleges. The ambitious ones see blacks with much less ability going to great schools. This breeds a lot of resentment from smart guys who are not pro-man class or higher. Rich whites are not the victims of AA, middle and working clsss white guys are. I think this led to the alt right MAGA phenomenon.

    Maybe try learning some Spanish? My dad wanted to move to Argentina when I was a kid. My mom did not, though. There is a fairly large American community in Argentina. They send their kids to schools that are half in Spanish and half in English. They probably make less money than equivalent Americans here, but they sure do live pleasant lives. Lots of steak dinners lasting until late at night. Servants if they want them, because unskilled labor is really cheap there. The inflation was crazy, but if you keep your assets in America or soon, China, you can build wealth.

    I do not know, however, how South America will turn out as America declines. Argentina has potential,nthough. With millions of American whites, it would be first world again in no time.

    It would be somewhat ironic for conservative whites, many of whom are against immigration, to become immigrants themselves. I think that we recognize the difference between immigrants who bring value, both genetic and cultural. And those with subpar nature and nurture. If five million Japanese wanted to immigrate to America, I would probably welcome them. They are smart and civilized. Contact with Japanese culture could improve aspects of our culture. Five million Guatemalan peasants? I would prefer it if they stayed home. Or migrated to Mexico, a country with similar Indio peasant stock.

    Replies: @Alden, @JimDandy, @vhrm

    And it’s grass-fed steak. I think you’re on to something with this Argentina stuff.

  100. @Possumman
    @photondancer

    Haven't you ever watched a Hallmark movie---they often involve a Prince of Caucasia moving to a small town in Vermont and meeting the love of his life--before retuning home to become king after exposing the evil Chancellor of the Exchequer that was trying to replace him.

    Replies: @photondancer

    Surely Ruritania is on the other side of the Black Sea 😉

    (I wonder how long it will be before the SJWs demand we rename the Black and White seas?)

  101. @Jonathan Mason
    @eric


    The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are.
     
    I still don't think that is the case.

    Of course Darwin knew nothing of genes and nothing of DNA.

    Darwin and Lorenz both believed that domestic dogs were descended from yellow jackals, with maybe a bit of wolf mixed in, but DNA testing has shown that dogs are all wolf and that jackals are cousins from higher up in the family tree that have co-evolved and look a hell of a lot like dogs.

    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don't have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

    However neanderthals are usually regarded as lowbrows, so that admixture could be taken as a positive or as a negative in evolving away from apes


    Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.

    So far from genetic outlying tribes dying out, they are being merged into more dominant tribes, and their genes will live through their descendants forever instead of being an evolutionary dead end.

    Replies: @ben tillman, @eric, @Curle

    I think you have to distinguish between what Darwin said and thought, versus what modern evolutionary theorists think. No one today thinks Africans or Australian aborigines are lower than Caucasians, or closer to apes, but that is what Darwin thought.

    • Replies: @iDeplorable
    @eric


    No one today thinks Africans or Australian aborigines are lower than Caucasians
     
    Well, except for the non-retarded and anyone else with basic observational skills.
  102. @education realist
    @education realist

    Adding this in response to some of the comments.

    First, what vituperation? There are many comments in this thread saying that teachers are illiterate. They aren't. This is just a fact. Kronos linked in one of my articles (thanks) but I've written a lot on this topic, including average GRE and SAT scores. High school academic teachers have always had achievement scores above the average college graduate. As Kronos mentioned, the 70s and 80s saw a huge decline in what we could automatically expect from a college graduate, and states responded by instituting a credential test for elementary school credentials, and then in 2000 the feds began demanding that middle school teachers pass high school tests.

    The original elementary school credential test instantly created problems for black teacher, and Hispanics, to a degree. States responded in the 90s by granting "emergency credentials" to anyone who got an education degree but couldn't pass the credential test. The feds didn't like this and as part of the changes in NCLB and the HEA ended the emergency credential and also forced ed schools to declare the credential passing rates. Ed schools said hey, not a problem, and stopped giving ed degrees to anyone who couldn't pass the test. So in the early 2000s, there was a huge drop in black teachers (and a little fraud ring in the south to pay blacks who could pass the test to take it for those who couldn't. Cf Clarence Mumford on my site).

    So for the past 20 years states have been worried about the decline in black and Hispanic teachers, particularly given the consistent research showing that teacher test scores don't correlate with learning outcomes, but teacher race does. (I suspect there's a baseline ability line but Goldhaber has data showing that blacks who failed the test by quite a bit had better results than whites who did....with black kids).

    Now, in all that time, here's what they *never* did. They never made the academic credential tests easier. Not once. However, in New York's case, back in the 90s, they thought ladida, let's brag about how extra special literate our teachers are. I went through the history of that in the last post.

    As for this particular test, the fact that whites passed it by 70% means it wasn't a ridiculously easy test. I'm not arguing it was incredibly difficult, but if the white rate was 95% or 100% and black rate was 70%, then I'd be more worried they were letting in really low achievers--although the fact that they have to pass several other tests makes that unlikely as well.

    For those demanding "evidence"--what evidence do you need? I'm not claiming the test was unfair, nor am I disputing that a college degree is becoming close to meaningless. But a *credential test* pass is not meaningless, because those tests aren't easy, particularly for high school. (We can debate whether or not college graduates shouldn't be able to pass the ES test another time, but this is *precisely* why the ES credential test began 30 years ago, and it is effectively keeping those graduates out of teaching. Hence the fraud case.)

    All I'm saying is this: New York looked at its data and saw that some number of black and Hispanic teachers were passing all the tests needed except this one. It's not mentioned, but logically these teachers are mostly elementary school teachers (or PE or sped). It doesn't matter how many of them there were. They'd demonstrated all the subject matter competency, and this other test, which was only ever offered as an ego boost originally, was stopping them from being teachers.

    They need black and Hispanic teachers more than they need the ego boost.

    Also--as I mention in the article Kronos linked in--if you're a black teacher who can pass the tests, you are extremely high ability for a black person, particularly if the test is high school subject matter. So blacks leave teaching at a higher rate--a lot of them to become principals, where the pay is higher, but others to leave the field altogether. Yet another reason to reduce the test burden, to keep in the black teachers who are more likely to stay.

    Replies: @photondancer

    All that text and you still didn’t explain what it is about the test itself that makes it useless. So I can only presume that it’s the fact that the test results display the dreaded disparate impact that upsets you. Since I don’t accept that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness, I vote this test remain in use until I see actual reasons why it shouldn’t.

    P.S. if black students will only study when taught by black teachers, as the results you cite suggest, then that is clear proof of their racism and it ought to be vigorously opposed. It won’t be, of course.

    • Replies: @vhrm
    @photondancer

    He has mentioned that there is:
    " consistent research showing that teacher test scores don’t correlate with learning outcomes," for this test.

    If true, that mean this test is not good at discriminating who should be allowed to teach and who shouldn't.

    Like one could say that all teachers should be 6' tall or over, and there's nothing wrong with that except that it reduces the pool of available teachers for little to no discernible teaching value.

    In another article of his i found, among other quotes:



    But as Dan Goldhaber himself observed,

    ..we see that Black and other minority students appear to benefit from being matched with a Black teacher regardless of how well or poorly that teacher performed on the Praxis tests, and these positive effects due to matching with Black teachers are comparable in magnitude to having the highest-performing White teachers in the classroom. Removing the lowest of performers on the exam would necessarily remove some of the teachers that appear to be most effective for this segment of the student population.

     

    ...

    And RAND found less than that:


    The results show large differences in teacher quality across the school district, but measured teacher characteristics explain little of the difference. Teacher licensure test scores are unrelated to teacher success in the classroom. Similarly, student achievement is unaffected by whether classroom teachers have advanced degrees. Student achievement increases with teacher experience, but the linkage is weak and largely reflects poor outcomes for teachers during their first year or two in the classroom.
     
    https://educationrealist.wordpress.com/2013/10/31/teacher-quality-report-lacking-a-certain-quality/

     

    (those quotes have sources in the original)

    Anyway, i don't know enough the subject to really take strong positions, but seems reasonable...
    , @education realist
    @photondancer

    @vhrm is correct.

    You seem incapable of grasping my point, since I'm not upset by the test and I explained very clearly why the people who decided to do away with it made that decision. I did not say that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness.

    In fact, quite the contrary: ALL the credential tests have different passing rates and thus disparate impact. But New York rightly felt that tests of teacher knowledge were too important to dismiss. However, the literacy test does *not* test content knowledge needed for the class, it is more of a statement of what New York wanted teachers to have. Until they realized that they also wanted black and Hispanic teachers who had content knowledge but couldn't pass the test. So they dumped the test.

    Replies: @photondancer

  103. @Rob
    @JimDandy

    I think that a right-leaning government in South America, perhaps when Argentina has one, will try to get US whites to immigrate as the screws tighten in America. Thing is, the screws are tightening already, but we do not seem to realize it. The younger you are, and the lower on the class ladder you are, the faster the screws are tightening. Young white men from the working class have pretty much zero chance of going to an Ivy, a ‘hidden Ivy’ or one of the exclusive private colleges. The ambitious ones see blacks with much less ability going to great schools. This breeds a lot of resentment from smart guys who are not pro-man class or higher. Rich whites are not the victims of AA, middle and working clsss white guys are. I think this led to the alt right MAGA phenomenon.

    Maybe try learning some Spanish? My dad wanted to move to Argentina when I was a kid. My mom did not, though. There is a fairly large American community in Argentina. They send their kids to schools that are half in Spanish and half in English. They probably make less money than equivalent Americans here, but they sure do live pleasant lives. Lots of steak dinners lasting until late at night. Servants if they want them, because unskilled labor is really cheap there. The inflation was crazy, but if you keep your assets in America or soon, China, you can build wealth.

    I do not know, however, how South America will turn out as America declines. Argentina has potential,nthough. With millions of American whites, it would be first world again in no time.

    It would be somewhat ironic for conservative whites, many of whom are against immigration, to become immigrants themselves. I think that we recognize the difference between immigrants who bring value, both genetic and cultural. And those with subpar nature and nurture. If five million Japanese wanted to immigrate to America, I would probably welcome them. They are smart and civilized. Contact with Japanese culture could improve aspects of our culture. Five million Guatemalan peasants? I would prefer it if they stayed home. Or migrated to Mexico, a country with similar Indio peasant stock.

    Replies: @Alden, @JimDandy, @vhrm

    But what would young white working class Americans do for work in Argentina? Is there a demand there for them?

    • Replies: @Rob
    @vhrm

    As yet, there is no demand, and that is why they aren’t going, even though things are getting worse here. It is also possible that as America declines, obviously caused by immigration, even though the media will never say so here, foreign media in other languages may be quite clear about why the US failed.

    I’m sorry, I was not clear. AA is hurting lower middle and working class whites, but they do not have the means to escape to foreign countries. When AA/woke starts hurting upper middle class whites and the lower upper class, who do have capital and skills that can transfer to a foreign country, then we will see the beginning of an exodus, if anyone is willing to take immigrants, having seen what’s happening to the US.

    Capable, entrepreneurial Americans will make Argentina thrive. The American rich might prefer American workers, allowing the people most hurt by woke to escapes. It is possible that they won’t. Argentina has docile servants aplenty, but for technical work, Americans are a better bet, I think.

    It is also possible I am wrong. Once Democrats have total control, they may cut immigration to near zero. It is possible that Americans will continue living better in the US than they could anywhere else, and no one will leave. It is possible that woke is not permanent, and the black crime will drive many non-whites into the conservative camp, I am pretty sure the Mexican-Americans will not want African immigrants, and may be a strongly anti-immigration constituency in the future.

    I think the best thing that would stop the coalition of the fringes is that they’ll get minorities in such numbers that they kick out white women. Having women back on our side would just be fantastic. It is why I think we should support measures that make work from home and such easier. WfH is much easier the higher up the ladder someone is, in general. If the Mexican and black lower classes still have to show up to work every day, but smart female college grads can go in a couple days a week, then that makes kids and commuting long distances much easier.

  104. @res
    @education realist

    This 2015 Chalkbeat article gave a bit different impression of the rigor of the other tests.
    https://ny.chalkbeat.org/2015/3/19/21092193/aspiring-teachers-struggled-on-new-tests-data-show-prompting-diversity-debate


    But more recent versions of the exam became so easy that 99 percent of test-takers passed. That changed last year with the introduction of three new tests designed align with nationally established teaching standards.
     
    Here is how they described the Academic Literacy Skills test (ALST).

    The hardest exam to pass last year, for all teachers, was the new literacy test. Called the Academic Literacy Skills test, it measures reading and writing aptitude based on the Common Core standards. Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed — though most only met a lower proficiency bar aligned to eighth-grade English standards.
     
    For the people asking for examples.

    This article has some sample questions and links to the study guide with more.
    https://www.silive.com/news/2017/03/try_these_sample_questions_can.html
    https://www.nystce.nesinc.com/Content/STUDYGUIDE/NY_SG_SRI_202.htm

    This link has an online practice test.
    https://www.testprepreview.com/nystce/academic-literacy-skills-test.htm

    Replies: @vhrm, @photondancer

    Thank you!

    I have only looked at the first link so far. It’s not an easy test. One might argue, as education_realist seems to be doing, that being able to teach small children doesn’t require this level of reading. But I see no reason why we should inflict mediocre and ill-educated teachers on children of any age. I still recall my disillusionment on the occasion when I realised, around age 10 that the teacher I was disputing a result with was stupider than me. A smart teacher pulls children of all abilities up.

    I wonder how many of the AWFLs cheering on the dumbing down of USAian teachers also fall in with the fashionable tendency to laud Finnish teachers, who have to pass strict tests?

    • Replies: @education realist
    @photondancer

    One might argue, as education_realist seems to be doing, that being able to teach small children doesn’t require this level of reading. But I see no reason why we should inflict mediocre and ill-educated teachers on children of any age."

    Because, as I've said a bunch of times,and vhrm mentioned, there's no evidence that raising the standard for teachers improves results, and quite a bit of evidence that black teachers in particular have good results with black kids. And it's not "mediocre and ill-educated". They just aren't smart enough for you. Oh, well.


    "I wonder how many of the AWFLs cheering on the dumbing down of USAian teachers also fall in with the fashionable tendency to laud Finnish teachers, who have to pass strict tests?"

    The average intellect of high school teachers has remained the same for 50 years or so. Average intellect of elementary school teachers is much higher than it used to be.

  105. @Desiderius
    https://freddiedeboer.substack.com/p/people-of-color-have-agency

    Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist

    Maybe Freddie’s an iSteve reader. His reasoning here sounds a lot like arguments that I, among others, have been making here for years:

    I suspect that placing all of the blame for historical crimes on white people is strangely comforting for white leftists: it advances a vision of the world where only white people matter. It says that the sun rises and sets with white people. It suggests that white people wrote history. It assures white people that, no matter what else is true, they are the masters of the world. That all of this is framed in terms of judgment against the abstraction “white people” is incidental. I think if you could strip people down to their most naked self-interest and ask them, “would you be willing to take all the blame, if it meant you got all the power?,” most would say yes. And of course in this narrative people of color are sad little extras, unable even to commit injustice, manipulated across the chessboard by the omnipotent white masters whose interests they can’t even begin to oppose. All of this to score meaningless political points in debates about inequality and injustice.

    He’s getting close to the deeper underlying truth, i.e. that ‘white leftists’ are indeed so in love with their own perceived power and goodness that they believe they can not only condescend to PoC and relieve them of their agency, they can ‘save’ PoC by raising them up to be just like good white leftists.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
    @The Last Real Calvinist

    (Re-)create the other in their image.

    Yeah a lot of us have been saying this for a long time.

  106. @Abolish_public_education
    @E. Rekshun

    A bullet is fired horizontally with an initial velocity 'v'. If the gun muzzle was at a height 'h', how far would the bullet travel before it hits the ground?

    (Assume no air resistance, living obstructions, etc.)

    Replies: @James Speaks

    Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft^2/sec

    v(t) = -32.2 * t ft/sec

    y(t) = h – 16.1t^2 ft

    set y(t) = 0

    h = 16.1t^2

    h/16.1 = t^2

    (sqrt(h)/4) = t = 4.01 sec

    Horizontal

    x(t) = “v” * 4.01 ft

    • Replies: @James Speaks
    @James Speaks

    *Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft^2/sec

    Apologies. This is what happens when you try to remember in lieu of thinking.

    *Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft/sec^2

  107. @Kronos
    @rebel yell

    One book I’m especially loath to try reading is Bill Clinton’s autobiography. (I’ve read much on Obama and by Obama so I might as well.) The book is a monster of a file but may have some interesting material on a wide assortment of historical developments; mainly the trajectory of the Democratic Party after the 1960s.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FC1RJQ/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i2

    Maybe cheeky Bill left some vague allusions to Jeffrey Epstein?

    Replies: @Curle

    “ I’ve read much on Obama and by Obama so I might as well”

    How much of it do you believe?

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Curle

    I try to read akin to a lawyer trying to find weaknesses to an opposing sides evidence. Also, if I find something interesting I might make note of it in the comments section. The Obama biographers I most respect are David Garrow’s and Steve Sailer’s work on Obama. Both were superb in decrypting Obama’s esoteric writing style and overall life. Obama is a good writer himself but of course carries the vagueness of a politician.

  108. @The Last Real Calvinist
    @Desiderius

    Maybe Freddie's an iSteve reader. His reasoning here sounds a lot like arguments that I, among others, have been making here for years:


    I suspect that placing all of the blame for historical crimes on white people is strangely comforting for white leftists: it advances a vision of the world where only white people matter. It says that the sun rises and sets with white people. It suggests that white people wrote history. It assures white people that, no matter what else is true, they are the masters of the world. That all of this is framed in terms of judgment against the abstraction “white people” is incidental. I think if you could strip people down to their most naked self-interest and ask them, “would you be willing to take all the blame, if it meant you got all the power?,” most would say yes. And of course in this narrative people of color are sad little extras, unable even to commit injustice, manipulated across the chessboard by the omnipotent white masters whose interests they can’t even begin to oppose. All of this to score meaningless political points in debates about inequality and injustice.
     
    He's getting close to the deeper underlying truth, i.e. that 'white leftists' are indeed so in love with their own perceived power and goodness that they believe they can not only condescend to PoC and relieve them of their agency, they can 'save' PoC by raising them up to be just like good white leftists.

    Replies: @Desiderius

    (Re-)create the other in their image.

    Yeah a lot of us have been saying this for a long time.

  109. vhrm says:
    @photondancer
    @education realist

    All that text and you still didn't explain what it is about the test itself that makes it useless. So I can only presume that it's the fact that the test results display the dreaded disparate impact that upsets you. Since I don't accept that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness, I vote this test remain in use until I see actual reasons why it shouldn't.

    P.S. if black students will only study when taught by black teachers, as the results you cite suggest, then that is clear proof of their racism and it ought to be vigorously opposed. It won't be, of course.

    Replies: @vhrm, @education realist

    He has mentioned that there is:
    ” consistent research showing that teacher test scores don’t correlate with learning outcomes,” for this test.

    If true, that mean this test is not good at discriminating who should be allowed to teach and who shouldn’t.

    Like one could say that all teachers should be 6′ tall or over, and there’s nothing wrong with that except that it reduces the pool of available teachers for little to no discernible teaching value.

    In another article of his i found, among other quotes:

    But as Dan Goldhaber himself observed,

    ..we see that Black and other minority students appear to benefit from being matched with a Black teacher regardless of how well or poorly that teacher performed on the Praxis tests, and these positive effects due to matching with Black teachers are comparable in magnitude to having the highest-performing White teachers in the classroom. Removing the lowest of performers on the exam would necessarily remove some of the teachers that appear to be most effective for this segment of the student population.

    And RAND found less than that:

    The results show large differences in teacher quality across the school district, but measured teacher characteristics explain little of the difference. Teacher licensure test scores are unrelated to teacher success in the classroom. Similarly, student achievement is unaffected by whether classroom teachers have advanced degrees. Student achievement increases with teacher experience, but the linkage is weak and largely reflects poor outcomes for teachers during their first year or two in the classroom.

    https://educationrealist.wordpress.com/2013/10/31/teacher-quality-report-lacking-a-certain-quality/

    (those quotes have sources in the original)

    Anyway, i don’t know enough the subject to really take strong positions, but seems reasonable…

  110. @Jonathan Mason
    @eric


    The implication is clearly that Africans and Australians are more closely related to apes than the Europeans are.
     
    I still don't think that is the case.

    Of course Darwin knew nothing of genes and nothing of DNA.

    Darwin and Lorenz both believed that domestic dogs were descended from yellow jackals, with maybe a bit of wolf mixed in, but DNA testing has shown that dogs are all wolf and that jackals are cousins from higher up in the family tree that have co-evolved and look a hell of a lot like dogs.

    DNA testing has also shown that Africans and Australians are not more closely related to apes than Europeans, except that there is evidence that Europeans have a small proportion of Neanderthal hominid genes in their DNA that Africans don't have, so perhaps that is what you are referring to.

    However neanderthals are usually regarded as lowbrows, so that admixture could be taken as a positive or as a negative in evolving away from apes


    Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.

    So far from genetic outlying tribes dying out, they are being merged into more dominant tribes, and their genes will live through their descendants forever instead of being an evolutionary dead end.

    Replies: @ben tillman, @eric, @Curle

    “ Actually the opposite of what Darwin predicted has occurred and is occurring, because the races are mixing in many parts of the world, and also because the races living together in many parts of the world and not continuing to separate.”

    Rahzib Khan addressed this topic in the past on his old blog gene expression. He points out that races have always mixed and the relevant number is the percent mixing against the total and that the much greater explosion in non-mixed populations compared to mixed populations worldwide gives the lie to this mostly western conceit. You can have a notable but still comparatively small increase in the number of mixed race couples in certain American coastal enclaves and this demographic in total numbers will be dwarfed by increases in non-mixed populations coming from Africa and China alone.

    The real peak of race mixing was the 17-19th centuries in central and South America.

  111. @Curle
    @Kronos

    “ I’ve read much on Obama and by Obama so I might as well”

    How much of it do you believe?

    Replies: @Kronos

    I try to read akin to a lawyer trying to find weaknesses to an opposing sides evidence. Also, if I find something interesting I might make note of it in the comments section. The Obama biographers I most respect are David Garrow’s and Steve Sailer’s work on Obama. Both were superb in decrypting Obama’s esoteric writing style and overall life. Obama is a good writer himself but of course carries the vagueness of a politician.

  112. res says:
    @education realist
    Yeah, but Chalkbeat is wrong. There has never once been a credential test with a 99% pass rate. In fact, anyone who thinks about it knows that there is not a single standardized test on the planet that has a 99% pass rate for all races. That statement doesn't pass the smell test and notice there isn't a link. All through the 2000s there were articles about the dearth of black and Hispanic teachers, including in New York. The idea that 99% of blacks were passing a credential test during that time is ludicrous.

    What Chalkbeat probably means to say, but doesn't understand, is that all education majors have to pass the test. Therefore yes, 99% of teachers who got credentialed passed the test.

    But lot of people start out to be ed majors and don't get that far because they don't pass one of the tests. Others try to enter a credential program post-graduation after a non ed major or go through an alt-cert program and won't get in because they fail the test. None of those are counted. Only people who pass the test are counted and become teachers, so yes, 99% pass rate is expected.

    Back in the 90s, that wasn't the case. People could have gotten an ed degree without the credential test. But no more (see earlier posts).

    Replies: @res

    Yeah, but Chalkbeat is wrong.

    Evidence?

    there is not a single standardized test on the planet that has a 99% pass rate for all races.

    The idea that 99% of blacks were passing a credential test during that time is ludicrous.

    Nice logic fail. The statement was an overall pass rate of 99%. That does not imply blacks passed with the same 99% rate.

    What Chalkbeat probably means to say, but doesn’t understand, is that all education majors have to pass the test. Therefore yes, 99% of teachers who got credentialed passed the test.

    But lot of people start out to be ed majors and don’t get that far because they don’t pass one of the tests. Others try to enter a credential program post-graduation after a non ed major or go through an alt-cert program and won’t get in because they fail the test.

    You are probably onto something there, but if there are multiple successive hurdles then for each one you only give the pass/fail rate for that hurdle/test. In this case I see no sign that comparing 99% to the 48/56/75% black/Hispanic/white pass rates for the newer test is an unfair comparison.

    This articles discusses the test pass rates and makes a similar point to yours.
    https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/n-y-data-on-new-teacher-licensing-exams-show-higher-failure-rates/2014/11

    Across the United States, about 96 percent of teacher-candidates pass their licensing tests, according to federal data. (Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)

    The relevant metric I see is what percentage of people taking the test pass (IMHO kind of the definition of pass rate for a test). Do you have any evidence the 99% figure is inaccurate given this metric?

    I looked for more data on NYSTCE pre-2014 pass rates, but did not find anything. If anyone knows of some, please post.

    P.S. Your tone of utter certainty is pretty funny given the blatant logic failure I noted. That also leaves me less willing to trust your other undocumented assertions.

  113. @Alden
    @Anon

    Not really but covid hoax the kids aren’t in school. They call it bed school because they lie in bed with their laptop. They do the math problems on the test on their phones and type the answer into the lap top.

    Google doesn’t just give the answers All the search answers do the calculations. Seeing the calculations done in a clear and easy to understand manner; the kids learn math.

    Example 5 + X = 7 7 - 5 = 2. So X is 2

    The books and teachers don’t show the simple calculations to solve math problems So using a phone or another computer to cheat teaches the kids how to solve math problems better than the teachers and text books can.

    Replies: @Curle

    Best thing for learning fractions like muscle memory was to get a job working one of the old fashion cash machines where you had to calculate tax in your head and input it separately. Starting as I did at age 16 allowed me to become reflexively proficient by 16 and one-half. Once you can figure fractions almost instantly, you open up more time for problem solving concentration when working on more complex problems on time limited tests.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Curle


    Best thing for learning fractions like muscle memory was to get a job working one of the old fashion cash machines where you had to calculate tax in your head and input it separately.
     
    Could you provide an example?

    Once you can figure fractions almost instantly
     
    What do you mean by “figure fractions”?
  114. @James Speaks
    @Abolish_public_education

    Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft^2/sec

    v(t) = -32.2 * t ft/sec

    y(t) = h - 16.1t^2 ft

    set y(t) = 0

    h = 16.1t^2

    h/16.1 = t^2

    (sqrt(h)/4) = t = 4.01 sec

    Horizontal

    x(t) = "v" * 4.01 ft

    Replies: @James Speaks

    *Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft^2/sec

    Apologies. This is what happens when you try to remember in lieu of thinking.

    *Vertical
    a(t) =- -32.2ft/sec^2

  115. @Reg Cæsar
    @John Derbyshire




    ...parents moving their families out of America.
     
    Where’d you’d think they’d try to go?
     
    Uruguay!
     
    The Beatles never performed in South America. Thanks to Uruguay, they didn't have to:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruguayan_Invasion

    "Pics, or it didn't happen!". Okay:



    https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51J1jmYKeWL.jpg

    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/IpxMhbjqTGk/hqdefault.jpg

    https://img.discogs.com/vOR3DAVi93D9D_-VUwkX71sZ50U=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-6444888-1424695663-5495.jpeg.jpg

    Replies: @duncsbaby

    The Ramones on the other hand had a big following in South America. Here’s video of the fans after a concert in Uruguay in 1994. Definitely the demographics that warm the cockles of this Man of Unz’s cold heart.

  116. @Redmen
    @Daniel H

    I'm a lifelong New Yorker, and I definitely feel a bit like I'm living behind enemy lines during a civil war. But I can't afford to leave NY. Being a fifth columnist is my only possible aspiration.

    I wish we could develop some sort of sign where we could identify like minded people without revealing our bad thinking.

    Replies: @Jack D, @sayless

    Same situation here, Redmen, not in a position to leave, and it’s getting nastier by the month. You know, there are several U.R. readers in the five boroughs and surrounds and it would be interesting to meet one another. We’d be infiltrated, but who cares.

    I will be the one wearing a wide-brimmed hat covered in tinfoil.

  117. @E. Rekshun
    Wonder if this female math teacher passed the literacy test...

    Pictures too! Yep.

    Marion County teacher, 2 others arrested in homicide

    https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/05/22/3-people-including-marion-county-teacher-arrested-in-connection-with-alachua-county-death/

    A Marion County teacher was one of three people arrested in connection with a murder in Alachua County on Monday, according to the Alachua County Sheriff’s Office.

    The teacher, 30-year-old Martesha Williams Johnson, along with 32-year-old Jasmine Webb and 36-year-old Doug Heath were taken into custody following the murder of 44-year-old Tyerune G. Blocker, deputies said.

    Deputies said Webb, Heath and Johnson went to 1307 Northwest 223rd Lane in Brooker after an ongoing argument on social media and phone between Heath, Webb and a secondary victim.
    Gunshots were fired from a vehicle Webb, Heath and Johnson were riding in, and all three fled the scene, deputies said...

    A math teacher at Fort King Middle School, Williams is on paid administration leave pending the outcome of the investigation, according to Marion County Schools.
     

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education, @William Badwhite

    The secondary victim was the intended target and was in close proximity to Blocker,

    More black marksmanship.

  118. @eric
    @Jonathan Mason

    I think you have to distinguish between what Darwin said and thought, versus what modern evolutionary theorists think. No one today thinks Africans or Australian aborigines are lower than Caucasians, or closer to apes, but that is what Darwin thought.

    Replies: @iDeplorable

    No one today thinks Africans or Australian aborigines are lower than Caucasians

    Well, except for the non-retarded and anyone else with basic observational skills.

    • Agree: Adam Smith
  119. Rob says:
    @vhrm
    @Rob

    But what would young white working class Americans do for work in Argentina? Is there a demand there for them?

    Replies: @Rob

    As yet, there is no demand, and that is why they aren’t going, even though things are getting worse here. It is also possible that as America declines, obviously caused by immigration, even though the media will never say so here, foreign media in other languages may be quite clear about why the US failed.

    I’m sorry, I was not clear. AA is hurting lower middle and working class whites, but they do not have the means to escape to foreign countries. When AA/woke starts hurting upper middle class whites and the lower upper class, who do have capital and skills that can transfer to a foreign country, then we will see the beginning of an exodus, if anyone is willing to take immigrants, having seen what’s happening to the US.

    Capable, entrepreneurial Americans will make Argentina thrive. The American rich might prefer American workers, allowing the people most hurt by woke to escapes. It is possible that they won’t. Argentina has docile servants aplenty, but for technical work, Americans are a better bet, I think.

    It is also possible I am wrong. Once Democrats have total control, they may cut immigration to near zero. It is possible that Americans will continue living better in the US than they could anywhere else, and no one will leave. It is possible that woke is not permanent, and the black crime will drive many non-whites into the conservative camp, I am pretty sure the Mexican-Americans will not want African immigrants, and may be a strongly anti-immigration constituency in the future.

    I think the best thing that would stop the coalition of the fringes is that they’ll get minorities in such numbers that they kick out white women. Having women back on our side would just be fantastic. It is why I think we should support measures that make work from home and such easier. WfH is much easier the higher up the ladder someone is, in general. If the Mexican and black lower classes still have to show up to work every day, but smart female college grads can go in a couple days a week, then that makes kids and commuting long distances much easier.

    • Thanks: vhrm
  120. “Nice logic fail. The statement was an overall pass rate of 99%. That does not imply blacks passed with the same 99% rate.”

    It’s not a logic fail. I’m just not careful or precise unless I’m writing an article, and am indifferent to impressing you or indeed most folks in blog comments.

    Blacks are 8% of New York teachers. Hispanics are 7%. Whites are 80%. Figure Asians and others are 5%.

    If everyone else passed the test–if 85% of the testers had 100% pass rate, then blacks would still need to have had a 90% pass rate in order for the overall pass rate to be 99.2%. I think 88% would give an overall pass rate of 99.04%.

    Now, there’s no way that Hispanics had a 100% pass rate, so that ups what blacks would need. And so on.

    My larger point, which I thought was obvious to anyone familiar with tests in the US, is that it is not possible to design a test in which the gap was so small that it would have a 99% pass rate despite a lower black pass rate. Hell, forget blacks. It’s very unlikely that any standardized test in the US hfor college graduates has a 100% or even 99% pass rate for any race. Anyone reading the 99% pass rate should be instantly skeptical.

    ” if there are multiple successive hurdles then for each one you only give the pass/fail rate for that hurdle/test. In this case I see no sign that comparing 99% to the 48/56/75% black/Hispanic/white pass rates for the newer test is an unfair comparison.”

    and

    “The relevant metric I see is what percentage of people taking the test pass (IMHO kind of the definition of pass rate for a test). Do you have any evidence the 99% figure is inaccurate given this metric”

    No, I’m talking only about the pass rate for the test.

    Saying that the New York pass rate for the test is 99% is like saying “NY lawyers have a 99% pass rate for bar exams, therefore it’s too easy.” But wait, you say, you can’t become a lawyer without passing the bar exam. Dingdingding.

    What I’m saying is that the people who are saying that the test has a 99% pass rate look only at credentialed teachers–who need to pass the test. They are looking at the number that ed schools publish as part of their title 2 reporting, not the pass rates published by the test companies.

    The only real data for test pass rates is the test companies themselves. This data is available. Reporters aren’t very knowledgeable about it.

    Stephen Sawchuk (author of the article you cited in edweek) does know better, because I told him about it back in 2012, when I wrote this article in response to his work and we emailed about it. That’s when he understood why the cut score was 1sd below the average and he has been excellent on credential stuff since, once he knew what to look for.

    This sentence, here:

    “(Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)” is similar to the one I made because we discussed it at various times.

    • Replies: @res
    @education realist


    It’s not a logic fail. I’m just not careful or precise unless I’m writing an article
     
    In other words, a logic fail. Look, if you don't want to be careful or precise in a discussion with me (or hopefully anyone) then leave off with your tone of complete certainty. And think hard about whether you want to engage in a numerical argument ; )

    Blacks are 8% of New York teachers. Hispanics are 7%. Whites are 80%. Figure Asians and others are 5%.

    If everyone else passed the test–if 85% of the testers had 100% pass rate, then blacks would still need to have had a 90% pass rate in order for the overall pass rate to be 99.2%. I think 88% would give an overall pass rate of 99.04%.
     
    First, consider that 98.5% rounds to 99%.

    Second, do you understand the difference between stock and flow variables? Because total numbers of teachers is a stock variable and number of new teachers taking a test in a given year is a flow variable. The best data I could find was page 39 of this document which indicates that New York State Educator Preparation Program Enrollment, 2016-17 was 39% non-white and 61% white. Better data welcomed.
    http://www.nysed.gov/common/nysed/files/programs/educator-quality/educator-diversity-report-december-2019.pdf

    Third, this Chalkbeat article gives enough numbers to check your theory. For 2013-14 we have: "48 percent of aspiring black teachers and 56 percent of aspiring Hispanic teachers passed a new, more rigorous literacy exam, compared to 75 percent of their white peers, according to the data. ... Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed"
    Using your numbers and guessing Asians and others passed at the white rate (feel free to change that assumption, does not move the numbers much)
    0.8 * 75% + 0.08 * 48% + 0.07 * 56% + 0.05 * 75% = 71.5%
    That is substantially (half the distance between the overall and white pass rates) different from 68%. Thus it seems clear your demographic numbers are off target for test takers.

    That is the kind of analysis I would expect someone who is "smart for a neurosurgeon" to be able to come up with. So hopefully you will at least be able to understand it.

    What I’m saying is that the people who are saying that the test has a 99% pass rate look only at credentialed teachers–who need to pass the test. They are looking at the number that ed schools publish as part of their title 2 reporting, not the pass rates published by the test companies.
     
    If this is so then why do they quote lower pass rates for the ALST? Do you have access to the actual pass rates to check?

    Stephen Sawchuk (author of the article you cited in edweek) does know better, because I told him about it back in 2012, when I wrote this article in response to his work and we emailed about it. That’s when he understood why the cut score was 1sd below the average and he has been excellent on credential stuff since, once he knew what to look for.
     
    Thanks for including that background. I think your comment about the gap and cut line is on target.

    “(Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)” is similar to the one I made because we discussed it at various times.
     
    Hopefully you were more careful and precise in your emails with him. Because that sentence still seems flawed with respect to the definition of pass rate as I discussed in my earlier comment.

    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?

    Replies: @vhrm

  121. @photondancer
    @education realist

    All that text and you still didn't explain what it is about the test itself that makes it useless. So I can only presume that it's the fact that the test results display the dreaded disparate impact that upsets you. Since I don't accept that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness, I vote this test remain in use until I see actual reasons why it shouldn't.

    P.S. if black students will only study when taught by black teachers, as the results you cite suggest, then that is clear proof of their racism and it ought to be vigorously opposed. It won't be, of course.

    Replies: @vhrm, @education realist

    is correct.

    You seem incapable of grasping my point, since I’m not upset by the test and I explained very clearly why the people who decided to do away with it made that decision. I did not say that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness.

    In fact, quite the contrary: ALL the credential tests have different passing rates and thus disparate impact. But New York rightly felt that tests of teacher knowledge were too important to dismiss. However, the literacy test does *not* test content knowledge needed for the class, it is more of a statement of what New York wanted teachers to have. Until they realized that they also wanted black and Hispanic teachers who had content knowledge but couldn’t pass the test. So they dumped the test.

    • Replies: @photondancer
    @education realist

    You keep saying the teachers had 'content knowledge' even as they fail the literacy test. I took both practice tests res posted links to. They were testing for English comprehension, vocabulary and understanding of nuance. I'm at a loss as to how one could say these were not content knowledge for a teacher, somebody who needs to be able to explain concepts and procedures to pupils of widely differing vocabulary, experience and ability.

    In your posts you repeatedly call these skills useless aesthetics, a mere beauty contest.But the ability to understand nuance, make fine distinctions and have more mental categories makes for better thinking and a larger world view. I am very suspicious of anybody who disdains these qualities. To be sure, I was already suspicious from your flat refusal to explain your position, merely iterating at length that the test was bad (but we just had to take your word for it).

    Replies: @education realist

  122. @photondancer
    @res

    Thank you!

    I have only looked at the first link so far. It's not an easy test. One might argue, as education_realist seems to be doing, that being able to teach small children doesn't require this level of reading. But I see no reason why we should inflict mediocre and ill-educated teachers on children of any age. I still recall my disillusionment on the occasion when I realised, around age 10 that the teacher I was disputing a result with was stupider than me. A smart teacher pulls children of all abilities up.

    I wonder how many of the AWFLs cheering on the dumbing down of USAian teachers also fall in with the fashionable tendency to laud Finnish teachers, who have to pass strict tests?

    Replies: @education realist

    One might argue, as education_realist seems to be doing, that being able to teach small children doesn’t require this level of reading. But I see no reason why we should inflict mediocre and ill-educated teachers on children of any age.”

    Because, as I’ve said a bunch of times,and vhrm mentioned, there’s no evidence that raising the standard for teachers improves results, and quite a bit of evidence that black teachers in particular have good results with black kids. And it’s not “mediocre and ill-educated”. They just aren’t smart enough for you. Oh, well.

    “I wonder how many of the AWFLs cheering on the dumbing down of USAian teachers also fall in with the fashionable tendency to laud Finnish teachers, who have to pass strict tests?”

    The average intellect of high school teachers has remained the same for 50 years or so. Average intellect of elementary school teachers is much higher than it used to be.

  123. @education realist
    @photondancer

    @vhrm is correct.

    You seem incapable of grasping my point, since I'm not upset by the test and I explained very clearly why the people who decided to do away with it made that decision. I did not say that disparate results are ipso facto proof of uselessness.

    In fact, quite the contrary: ALL the credential tests have different passing rates and thus disparate impact. But New York rightly felt that tests of teacher knowledge were too important to dismiss. However, the literacy test does *not* test content knowledge needed for the class, it is more of a statement of what New York wanted teachers to have. Until they realized that they also wanted black and Hispanic teachers who had content knowledge but couldn't pass the test. So they dumped the test.

    Replies: @photondancer

    You keep saying the teachers had ‘content knowledge’ even as they fail the literacy test. I took both practice tests res posted links to. They were testing for English comprehension, vocabulary and understanding of nuance. I’m at a loss as to how one could say these were not content knowledge for a teacher, somebody who needs to be able to explain concepts and procedures to pupils of widely differing vocabulary, experience and ability.

    In your posts you repeatedly call these skills useless aesthetics, a mere beauty contest.But the ability to understand nuance, make fine distinctions and have more mental categories makes for better thinking and a larger world view. I am very suspicious of anybody who disdains these qualities. To be sure, I was already suspicious from your flat refusal to explain your position, merely iterating at length that the test was bad (but we just had to take your word for it).

    • Replies: @education realist
    @photondancer

    "I’m at a loss as to how one could say these were not content knowledge for a teacher, somebody who needs to be able to explain concepts and procedures to pupils of widely differing vocabulary, experience and ability."

    Focus hard: there is more than one test, as I've said four times. Elementary school teachers take a test showing they have the grammar and vocabulary knowledge, reading comprehension, math, some science basics. Already.

    This was an ADDITIONAL test that ALSO tested them on stuff, probably at a higher level. So there were black and Hispanic teachers who COULD pass the content knowledge test but could NOT pass the second test (which was harder material). As I've said some twenty times, the state decided they would rather have more black and Hispanic teachers than slightly more literate white teachers, given that white teachers tend not to want to teach in inner city schools but black and Hispanic teachers did.

  124. Anonymous[635] • Disclaimer says:
    @Curle
    @Alden

    Best thing for learning fractions like muscle memory was to get a job working one of the old fashion cash machines where you had to calculate tax in your head and input it separately. Starting as I did at age 16 allowed me to become reflexively proficient by 16 and one-half. Once you can figure fractions almost instantly, you open up more time for problem solving concentration when working on more complex problems on time limited tests.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Best thing for learning fractions like muscle memory was to get a job working one of the old fashion cash machines where you had to calculate tax in your head and input it separately.

    Could you provide an example?

    Once you can figure fractions almost instantly

    What do you mean by “figure fractions”?

  125. res says:
    @education realist
    "Nice logic fail. The statement was an overall pass rate of 99%. That does not imply blacks passed with the same 99% rate."

    It's not a logic fail. I'm just not careful or precise unless I'm writing an article, and am indifferent to impressing you or indeed most folks in blog comments.

    Blacks are 8% of New York teachers. Hispanics are 7%. Whites are 80%. Figure Asians and others are 5%.

    If everyone else passed the test--if 85% of the testers had 100% pass rate, then blacks would still need to have had a 90% pass rate in order for the overall pass rate to be 99.2%. I think 88% would give an overall pass rate of 99.04%.

    Now, there's no way that Hispanics had a 100% pass rate, so that ups what blacks would need. And so on.

    My larger point, which I thought was obvious to anyone familiar with tests in the US, is that it is not possible to design a test in which the gap was so small that it would have a 99% pass rate despite a lower black pass rate. Hell, forget blacks. It's very unlikely that any standardized test in the US hfor college graduates has a 100% or even 99% pass rate for any race. Anyone reading the 99% pass rate should be instantly skeptical.


    " if there are multiple successive hurdles then for each one you only give the pass/fail rate for that hurdle/test. In this case I see no sign that comparing 99% to the 48/56/75% black/Hispanic/white pass rates for the newer test is an unfair comparison."

    and

    "The relevant metric I see is what percentage of people taking the test pass (IMHO kind of the definition of pass rate for a test). Do you have any evidence the 99% figure is inaccurate given this metric"

    No, I'm talking only about the pass rate for the test.

    Saying that the New York pass rate for the test is 99% is like saying "NY lawyers have a 99% pass rate for bar exams, therefore it's too easy." But wait, you say, you can't become a lawyer without passing the bar exam. Dingdingding.

    What I'm saying is that the people who are saying that the test has a 99% pass rate look only at credentialed teachers--who need to pass the test. They are looking at the number that ed schools publish as part of their title 2 reporting, not the pass rates published by the test companies.

    The only real data for test pass rates is the test companies themselves. This data is available. Reporters aren't very knowledgeable about it.


    Stephen Sawchuk (author of the article you cited in edweek) does know better, because I told him about it back in 2012, when I wrote this article in response to his work and we emailed about it. That's when he understood why the cut score was 1sd below the average and he has been excellent on credential stuff since, once he knew what to look for.

    This sentence, here:

    "(Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)" is similar to the one I made because we discussed it at various times.

    Replies: @res

    It’s not a logic fail. I’m just not careful or precise unless I’m writing an article

    In other words, a logic fail. Look, if you don’t want to be careful or precise in a discussion with me (or hopefully anyone) then leave off with your tone of complete certainty. And think hard about whether you want to engage in a numerical argument ; )

    Blacks are 8% of New York teachers. Hispanics are 7%. Whites are 80%. Figure Asians and others are 5%.

    If everyone else passed the test–if 85% of the testers had 100% pass rate, then blacks would still need to have had a 90% pass rate in order for the overall pass rate to be 99.2%. I think 88% would give an overall pass rate of 99.04%.

    First, consider that 98.5% rounds to 99%.

    Second, do you understand the difference between stock and flow variables? Because total numbers of teachers is a stock variable and number of new teachers taking a test in a given year is a flow variable. The best data I could find was page 39 of this document which indicates that New York State Educator Preparation Program Enrollment, 2016-17 was 39% non-white and 61% white. Better data welcomed.
    http://www.nysed.gov/common/nysed/files/programs/educator-quality/educator-diversity-report-december-2019.pdf

    Third, this Chalkbeat article gives enough numbers to check your theory. For 2013-14 we have: “48 percent of aspiring black teachers and 56 percent of aspiring Hispanic teachers passed a new, more rigorous literacy exam, compared to 75 percent of their white peers, according to the data. … Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed”
    Using your numbers and guessing Asians and others passed at the white rate (feel free to change that assumption, does not move the numbers much)
    0.8 * 75% + 0.08 * 48% + 0.07 * 56% + 0.05 * 75% = 71.5%
    That is substantially (half the distance between the overall and white pass rates) different from 68%. Thus it seems clear your demographic numbers are off target for test takers.

    That is the kind of analysis I would expect someone who is “smart for a neurosurgeon” to be able to come up with. So hopefully you will at least be able to understand it.

    What I’m saying is that the people who are saying that the test has a 99% pass rate look only at credentialed teachers–who need to pass the test. They are looking at the number that ed schools publish as part of their title 2 reporting, not the pass rates published by the test companies.

    If this is so then why do they quote lower pass rates for the ALST? Do you have access to the actual pass rates to check?

    Stephen Sawchuk (author of the article you cited in edweek) does know better, because I told him about it back in 2012, when I wrote this article in response to his work and we emailed about it. That’s when he understood why the cut score was 1sd below the average and he has been excellent on credential stuff since, once he knew what to look for.

    Thanks for including that background. I think your comment about the gap and cut line is on target.

    “(Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)” is similar to the one I made because we discussed it at various times.

    Hopefully you were more careful and precise in your emails with him. Because that sentence still seems flawed with respect to the definition of pass rate as I discussed in my earlier comment.

    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?

    • Replies: @vhrm
    @res


    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?
     
    i have no idea about his intent specifically, but when replying to the last comment on a story it's really easy to just reply in the thread comment box w/o having hit the "reply" button first. I've done it several times and i've seen others do it as well. My impression is that that's a much more likely sequence of events than someone going out of there way to write a lengthy reply but not reply directly on purpose.

    Replies: @res, @education realist

  126. vhrm says:
    @res
    @education realist


    It’s not a logic fail. I’m just not careful or precise unless I’m writing an article
     
    In other words, a logic fail. Look, if you don't want to be careful or precise in a discussion with me (or hopefully anyone) then leave off with your tone of complete certainty. And think hard about whether you want to engage in a numerical argument ; )

    Blacks are 8% of New York teachers. Hispanics are 7%. Whites are 80%. Figure Asians and others are 5%.

    If everyone else passed the test–if 85% of the testers had 100% pass rate, then blacks would still need to have had a 90% pass rate in order for the overall pass rate to be 99.2%. I think 88% would give an overall pass rate of 99.04%.
     
    First, consider that 98.5% rounds to 99%.

    Second, do you understand the difference between stock and flow variables? Because total numbers of teachers is a stock variable and number of new teachers taking a test in a given year is a flow variable. The best data I could find was page 39 of this document which indicates that New York State Educator Preparation Program Enrollment, 2016-17 was 39% non-white and 61% white. Better data welcomed.
    http://www.nysed.gov/common/nysed/files/programs/educator-quality/educator-diversity-report-december-2019.pdf

    Third, this Chalkbeat article gives enough numbers to check your theory. For 2013-14 we have: "48 percent of aspiring black teachers and 56 percent of aspiring Hispanic teachers passed a new, more rigorous literacy exam, compared to 75 percent of their white peers, according to the data. ... Statewide, 68 percent of teachers passed"
    Using your numbers and guessing Asians and others passed at the white rate (feel free to change that assumption, does not move the numbers much)
    0.8 * 75% + 0.08 * 48% + 0.07 * 56% + 0.05 * 75% = 71.5%
    That is substantially (half the distance between the overall and white pass rates) different from 68%. Thus it seems clear your demographic numbers are off target for test takers.

    That is the kind of analysis I would expect someone who is "smart for a neurosurgeon" to be able to come up with. So hopefully you will at least be able to understand it.

    What I’m saying is that the people who are saying that the test has a 99% pass rate look only at credentialed teachers–who need to pass the test. They are looking at the number that ed schools publish as part of their title 2 reporting, not the pass rates published by the test companies.
     
    If this is so then why do they quote lower pass rates for the ALST? Do you have access to the actual pass rates to check?

    Stephen Sawchuk (author of the article you cited in edweek) does know better, because I told him about it back in 2012, when I wrote this article in response to his work and we emailed about it. That’s when he understood why the cut score was 1sd below the average and he has been excellent on credential stuff since, once he knew what to look for.
     
    Thanks for including that background. I think your comment about the gap and cut line is on target.

    “(Those results are considered to be somewhat inflated, though, because they usually represent only program completers, not all enrolled candidates.)” is similar to the one I made because we discussed it at various times.
     
    Hopefully you were more careful and precise in your emails with him. Because that sentence still seems flawed with respect to the definition of pass rate as I discussed in my earlier comment.

    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?

    Replies: @vhrm

    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?

    i have no idea about his intent specifically, but when replying to the last comment on a story it’s really easy to just reply in the thread comment box w/o having hit the “reply” button first. I’ve done it several times and i’ve seen others do it as well. My impression is that that’s a much more likely sequence of events than someone going out of there way to write a lengthy reply but not reply directly on purpose.

    • Replies: @res
    @vhrm

    You make a good point. I do that all too often (but usually then delete my comment and resubmit a reply).

    That is why I phrased my PS as a question: At what point...?

    At the moment ER has seven comments in this thread. One is not a reply. Four are replies (using Reply) to others. Two are replies (not using Reply) to me.

    I think that is sufficient for my PS comment--especially phrased as a question. If you disagree, then at what point...? I am guessing we will have more data points soon ; )

    P.S. You might not be aware that ER and I have some history. I linked to a relevant comment above.
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/great-moments-in-affirmative-action-2/#comment-3086501
    I think this exchange gives an idea of what might be considered intentional and what is not.



    I honestly don’t remember you at all.
     
    Oh really? How do you explain your comment 179 above then? If you are going to outright lie like that then better to do it in a thread where you haven’t already provided contrary evidence.
     
    Note that apparently late moderation renumbered the comments so the relevant comment ended up being 181 not 179. That was the same comment where ER accused me of using a sock puppet.

    Replies: @vhrm

    , @education realist
    @vhrm

    I did it with all of the responses. Draw your own conclusions.

    Replies: @vhrm

  127. @Anonymous

    State officials voted to make it easier to become a New York state teacher on Monday by knocking off one of the state’s main teacher certification requirements.
     
    Good.

    She can tell it’s flawed because blacks and Latinos don’t score as high on it as Asians and whites.
     
    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    O/T What happened to Svigor, Lot, and Owen? Do they post anymore?

    Replies: @Alfa158, @Buzz Mohawk, @bomag, @kaganovitch, @ScarletNumber, @Neuday, @Foreign Expert

    What is the justification for capitalizing “Asian” but not “White”?

    What’s the justification for referring to Asians as Asians but not referring to Africans as Africans?

  128. res says:
    @vhrm
    @res


    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?
     
    i have no idea about his intent specifically, but when replying to the last comment on a story it's really easy to just reply in the thread comment box w/o having hit the "reply" button first. I've done it several times and i've seen others do it as well. My impression is that that's a much more likely sequence of events than someone going out of there way to write a lengthy reply but not reply directly on purpose.

    Replies: @res, @education realist

    You make a good point. I do that all too often (but usually then delete my comment and resubmit a reply).

    That is why I phrased my PS as a question: At what point…?

    At the moment ER has seven comments in this thread. One is not a reply. Four are replies (using Reply) to others. Two are replies (not using Reply) to me.

    I think that is sufficient for my PS comment–especially phrased as a question. If you disagree, then at what point…? I am guessing we will have more data points soon ; )

    P.S. You might not be aware that ER and I have some history. I linked to a relevant comment above.
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/great-moments-in-affirmative-action-2/#comment-3086501
    I think this exchange gives an idea of what might be considered intentional and what is not.

    I honestly don’t remember you at all.

    Oh really? How do you explain your comment 179 above then? If you are going to outright lie like that then better to do it in a thread where you haven’t already provided contrary evidence.

    Note that apparently late moderation renumbered the comments so the relevant comment ended up being 181 not 179. That was the same comment where ER accused me of using a sock puppet.

    • Thanks: vhrm
    • Replies: @vhrm
    @res

    i was not aware.


    Anyone who jumps into exchanges to “explain” another person is memorable, for all the wrong, creepy reasons. Which is why your assurance that you aren’t a sock puppet isn’t at all convincing.
     
    [from an ER message upthread in the 2019 the thread you linked]

    Maybe i shouldn't have jumped in here... I don't want to be creepy and wrong!

  129. vhrm says:
    @res
    @vhrm

    You make a good point. I do that all too often (but usually then delete my comment and resubmit a reply).

    That is why I phrased my PS as a question: At what point...?

    At the moment ER has seven comments in this thread. One is not a reply. Four are replies (using Reply) to others. Two are replies (not using Reply) to me.

    I think that is sufficient for my PS comment--especially phrased as a question. If you disagree, then at what point...? I am guessing we will have more data points soon ; )

    P.S. You might not be aware that ER and I have some history. I linked to a relevant comment above.
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/great-moments-in-affirmative-action-2/#comment-3086501
    I think this exchange gives an idea of what might be considered intentional and what is not.



    I honestly don’t remember you at all.
     
    Oh really? How do you explain your comment 179 above then? If you are going to outright lie like that then better to do it in a thread where you haven’t already provided contrary evidence.
     
    Note that apparently late moderation renumbered the comments so the relevant comment ended up being 181 not 179. That was the same comment where ER accused me of using a sock puppet.

    Replies: @vhrm

    i was not aware.

    Anyone who jumps into exchanges to “explain” another person is memorable, for all the wrong, creepy reasons. Which is why your assurance that you aren’t a sock puppet isn’t at all convincing.

    [from an ER message upthread in the 2019 the thread you linked]

    Maybe i shouldn’t have jumped in here… I don’t want to be creepy and wrong!

  130. @photondancer
    @education realist

    You keep saying the teachers had 'content knowledge' even as they fail the literacy test. I took both practice tests res posted links to. They were testing for English comprehension, vocabulary and understanding of nuance. I'm at a loss as to how one could say these were not content knowledge for a teacher, somebody who needs to be able to explain concepts and procedures to pupils of widely differing vocabulary, experience and ability.

    In your posts you repeatedly call these skills useless aesthetics, a mere beauty contest.But the ability to understand nuance, make fine distinctions and have more mental categories makes for better thinking and a larger world view. I am very suspicious of anybody who disdains these qualities. To be sure, I was already suspicious from your flat refusal to explain your position, merely iterating at length that the test was bad (but we just had to take your word for it).

    Replies: @education realist

    “I’m at a loss as to how one could say these were not content knowledge for a teacher, somebody who needs to be able to explain concepts and procedures to pupils of widely differing vocabulary, experience and ability.”

    Focus hard: there is more than one test, as I’ve said four times. Elementary school teachers take a test showing they have the grammar and vocabulary knowledge, reading comprehension, math, some science basics. Already.

    This was an ADDITIONAL test that ALSO tested them on stuff, probably at a higher level. So there were black and Hispanic teachers who COULD pass the content knowledge test but could NOT pass the second test (which was harder material). As I’ve said some twenty times, the state decided they would rather have more black and Hispanic teachers than slightly more literate white teachers, given that white teachers tend not to want to teach in inner city schools but black and Hispanic teachers did.

  131. @vhrm
    @res


    P.S. At what point should I take your non-use of the Reply function with me (notice how you used it elsewhere in this thread, like in your very next comments) as passive aggressive avoidance?
     
    i have no idea about his intent specifically, but when replying to the last comment on a story it's really easy to just reply in the thread comment box w/o having hit the "reply" button first. I've done it several times and i've seen others do it as well. My impression is that that's a much more likely sequence of events than someone going out of there way to write a lengthy reply but not reply directly on purpose.

    Replies: @res, @education realist

    I did it with all of the responses. Draw your own conclusions.

    • Agree: res
    • Replies: @vhrm
    @education realist


    I did it with all of the responses. Draw your own conclusions.
     
    Thanks for clearing it up. It's disappointing that you're going that way. With the amount of effort you put into your site and some of the posts and replies here, the pugnacious approach (to res esp. but also the "declarative steamroller" tone sometimes in evidence) seems detrimental, at least in what is mostly friendly territory. That you stay in it to defend your points is great, but the personally pugnacious part detracts from the experience.

    (yes, you're all here for my benefit and thus care what i think )

    Replies: @res

  132. vhrm says:
    @education realist
    @vhrm

    I did it with all of the responses. Draw your own conclusions.

    Replies: @vhrm

    I did it with all of the responses. Draw your own conclusions.

    Thanks for clearing it up. It’s disappointing that you’re going that way. With the amount of effort you put into your site and some of the posts and replies here, the pugnacious approach (to res esp. but also the “declarative steamroller” tone sometimes in evidence) seems detrimental, at least in what is mostly friendly territory. That you stay in it to defend your points is great, but the personally pugnacious part detracts from the experience.

    (yes, you’re all here for my benefit and thus care what i think )

    • Replies: @res
    @vhrm

    If you really want to see ER being pugnacious then search ER's comments for "Twinkie"

    BTW, notice the lack of substantive response to my points in this thread (e.g. the recent numerical discussion). The pugnaciousness appears to be compensation for an inability to engage with my arguments on their merits. Kind of sad really.

    P.S. “declarative steamroller” is a good description. Thanks.

  133. @vhrm
    @education realist


    I did it with all of the responses. Draw your own conclusions.
     
    Thanks for clearing it up. It's disappointing that you're going that way. With the amount of effort you put into your site and some of the posts and replies here, the pugnacious approach (to res esp. but also the "declarative steamroller" tone sometimes in evidence) seems detrimental, at least in what is mostly friendly territory. That you stay in it to defend your points is great, but the personally pugnacious part detracts from the experience.

    (yes, you're all here for my benefit and thus care what i think )

    Replies: @res

    If you really want to see ER being pugnacious then search ER’s comments for “Twinkie”

    BTW, notice the lack of substantive response to my points in this thread (e.g. the recent numerical discussion). The pugnaciousness appears to be compensation for an inability to engage with my arguments on their merits. Kind of sad really.

    P.S. “declarative steamroller” is a good description. Thanks.

  134. Only 38 percent of aspiring black teachers and 46 percent of aspiring Hispanic teachers passed the test between September 2013 and June 2016, compared to 69 percent of their white peers, according to the state education department officials.

    Isn’t a 69 percent literacy rate pretty low for aspiring teachers?

    How did Asians do on this “flawed” test? I wonder why that figure was left out.

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