The Great Exodus from Illinois
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From an agricultural economist named Dave Swenson:
Last is domestic migration (moving from one place to another in the U.S.).
Each red dot represents 10 Americans moving out of the county.
Ahhh-Oooogha!
Fellow Illinoisans, abandon state! Repeat, abandon state!
Ahhh-Oooogha!
Thanks goodness, community organizers from Illinois, such as Obama, Jarrett, Emanuel, Daley, and Duncan, were running the federal government from 2009-2017, bringing the rest of us those magic lessons that have catapulted Illinois to the top of the charts for citizens fleeing.
The one county in the northern half of Illinois that had more Americans move in is Kendall County in the southwest exurbs of Chicago. It’s like a suburb for prosperous Chicago suburbs like Naperville.
I guess Grand Rapids is doing okay these days.
And what’s going on with northern Michigan that’s causing it to gain people?
Surprised by the Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo graphics.
despite all of vdare’s and fellow travelers twitter protestions, taxes really are one of the biggest factors people pay attention to, at least that is to say, once the taxes get to a certain level, people start heading for the exits.
no, tax rates are not the only thing that matters, and the vdare crowd correctly point this out. i’m on board with that. but the last 3 years of the vdare/amren-sphere twitter people blathering about “muh tax cuts” and leering at trump “give them a tax cut, blormpf” literally every single day, are totally refuted by observing how people move.
they’re heading for the exits in droves from california, illinois, and new york.
the problem is, when they move to a new state, they keep voting the way they did before they moved.
trump slashed the corporate income tax rate, and against the predictions of literally every single economics and political writer, save a few conservative ones, we’re in the middle of the trumponomics economy.
trump raised tariffs and…little inflation. some steel even came back, which seemed impossible when POTATUS was blathering about that during campaign 2016. even i didn’t think that would happen.
these moves have mostly worked out so far. but the vdare crowd is relentless in hammering him. yes, he’s failing at other areas, BUT HE’S RIGHT ABOUT TAXES. 2 out of 3 democrat voters agree, less taxes please, and i’ll prove it with my feet.
that’s why biden is now polling higher than trump in arizona.
Yes, they do trash the Libertarians on that site too, but I'd guess it's the Reason magazine open-borders idiots that they are pointing at.
What's the deal with Portland, though? You'd think people would shop in Oregon but live in Washington, as those are the tax incentives.
I should check the phone books along the St Croix River. Neither Minnesota not Wisconsin taxes groceries, but Wisconsin taxes clothing and Minnesota does not. The grocery/haberdashery ratio may differ.
I agree that retirees are more concerned about fixed incomes, so taxes are a huge motivator to move.
I think you are underplaying the "good schools" effect of migration though.
One of the great things about mass immigration for the super-state party is that you can enact policies that make natives run like hell out of the areas you control … but still not lose population! Because, being the USA (or some other prosperous white nation) it’s still appealing enough to foreigners–who live with less prosperity in even more corruptly governed nations.
The democrats are assured right now in May 2019 of winning CA, NY, IL and MA no matter whom they run. You could probably throw in several other states as well. These are states they will not have to even spend a dime in to defend.
Yet because of the deluge of foreign immigration and White democrats fleeing Blue states, we have to fight tooth and nail just to hold onto states that should be no strainers for us.
10 units of … what? 10 people? 10 percent (percent is not a unit)? Why are there dots within counties, rather than just coloring counties? What does the position of a dot within a county signify? The position of 10 “units”? Are “units” always conterminous up to 10? And by the way, again, 10 units of … what? When units saturate a county do dot go on top of other dots but not produce a visible effect in the map?
Dave Swenson is probably not an idiot, but that map need further explanation.
And what's going on with northern Michigan that's causing it to gain people?
It’s not Detroit or Flint. It’s unspoiled. It has lots of woods and access to the Great Lakes, and it’s got cheap housing and few blacks. If you subtract the blacks, Michigan is a nice place. It’s blacks that make places unbearable.
Chiraq is notorious for its bad weather – both above and underground.
Climate Exchange is For Real;
Keep Calm,
And
They
Will
Replace
Y’all.
More important, where are they going? Are they going to solid red states? Or purple states where their votes might make a difference?
And what's going on with northern Michigan that's causing it to gain people?
For N Michigan? Very low property prices/rents?
Surprised by the Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo graphics.
Also, the regional WASP Calvinism was more than reinforced by the flood of Dutchmen in the 19th century. Western Michigan is quite well-taken-care-of outside its small cities. A revival is not surprising.
Look at that white fright, errr, flight away from downtown Minnegadishu into a whole ring of suburbs around the place (except for a small sector to the SSE). Now, THAT’S not very welcoming, nice upper-midwestern ladies; it’s darn-right rude, doncha’ know.
What do you say about this, Mr. Caesar?
They have to come into the metro area for jobs, but don't want to go in too far. They're nearer to hunting, fishing, and mom's farm home cooking, too. My brothers-in-law have done this.
The exurban blue rings are vivid around Indianapolis, Minneapolis/St Paul, Kansas City, and St Louis, and at Columbus, Madison, Grand Rapids, and Fargo they appear to help the central city as well.
Downstate Illinois shares with Wisconsin and North Dakota the ignominy of having more bars than groceries:
I kind of enjoy it (mmm strong beer and schnitzel and spaetzle), but I'm fond of anything unhealthy. It's really bad.
Beer is liquid bread!
no, tax rates are not the only thing that matters, and the vdare crowd correctly point this out. i'm on board with that. but the last 3 years of the vdare/amren-sphere twitter people blathering about "muh tax cuts" and leering at trump "give them a tax cut, blormpf" literally every single day, are totally refuted by observing how people move.
they're heading for the exits in droves from california, illinois, and new york.
the problem is, when they move to a new state, they keep voting the way they did before they moved.
trump slashed the corporate income tax rate, and against the predictions of literally every single economics and political writer, save a few conservative ones, we're in the middle of the trumponomics economy.
trump raised tariffs and...little inflation. some steel even came back, which seemed impossible when POTATUS was blathering about that during campaign 2016. even i didn't think that would happen.
these moves have mostly worked out so far. but the vdare crowd is relentless in hammering him. yes, he's failing at other areas, BUT HE'S RIGHT ABOUT TAXES. 2 out of 3 democrat voters agree, less taxes please, and i'll prove it with my feet.
that's why biden is now polling higher than trump in arizona.
I agree with your view on taxes, P.N. However, I would hope VDare’s point (and I have read them for a long, long time) is that this immigration thing is EXISTENTIAL. If the invasion doesn’t get stopped, and even reversed, all the other factors don’t mean squat anymore, as it won’t be your country anymore to worry about. If Trump doesn’t get anything serious done on this problem, he’s failed us.
Yes, they do trash the Libertarians on that site too, but I’d guess it’s the Reason magazine open-borders idiots that they are pointing at.
Legal immigrants can probably apply for citizenship in 5 to 7 years. So the ones coming in today will haunt us in 7 years at the polling booth. While the guys from 2013 will be hammering us in 2020.
I always think of the Germans in France in June 1944. The allies averaged 35K new troops per day from D-Day to July 4, so that by that date they had a 1 million man army in France, where none had existed just a month prior. And they obviously kept landing troops beyond that date. But 1 million was definitely a significant number. No matter how many Sherman tanks were knocked out, and plenty were, unless the Germans could stop those daily landings, the fight on the Western front was lost.
Likewise, if we can't stop the landing of 2500 to 5000 immivaders per day, we are as doomed as those Germans. No amount of GDP growth, or tax cuts will save the day.
Downstate Illinois shares with Wisconsin and North Dakota the ignominy of having more bars than groceries:
http://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/assets/4416283/us_bars_groceries_100122.jpg
My understanding is it’s a German and to a lesser extent Scandinavian thing. (Look at the map…) They like their bars.
I kind of enjoy it (mmm strong beer and schnitzel and spaetzle), but I’m fond of anything unhealthy. It’s really bad.
Wisconsin and North Dakota can handle their booze. Wisconsin is just lots of large, good-natured people drinking lots and lots of beer and watching the Packers as opposed to a big Indian reservation.
Downstate Illinois shares with Wisconsin and North Dakota the ignominy of having more bars than groceries:
http://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/assets/4416283/us_bars_groceries_100122.jpg
Not a problem if it’s those bars with the huge jar of pickled eggs on the back counter
Farms have been getting hammered in Illinois and elsewhere in the Midwest:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-farmers-retirement-insight/trade-war-and-sagging-prices-push-u-s-family-farmers-to-leave-the-field-idUSKCN1S613U
Is there one for Southern California which distinguishes between “refugees” and white natives?
And what's going on with northern Michigan that's causing it to gain people?
Beauty, distance from Babylon, land.
Downstate Illinois shares with Wisconsin and North Dakota the ignominy of having more bars than groceries:
http://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/assets/4416283/us_bars_groceries_100122.jpg
Wisconsin, North Dakota, Downstate Illinois: I wonder if those people are growing enough of their own vegetables that they don’t miss grocery stores.
I kind of enjoy it (mmm strong beer and schnitzel and spaetzle), but I'm fond of anything unhealthy. It's really bad.
Having lived in both states I can vouch for this.
Wisconsin and North Dakota can handle their booze. Wisconsin is just lots of large, good-natured people drinking lots and lots of beer and watching the Packers as opposed to a big Indian reservation.
America is a large country, but unless they take a stand against the deliberate program to change the nation’s demographics, eventually whites will find there is no place left to run. Eventually you can no longer run from a problem and have to confront it head on.
Steve,
Kendal County grew because if you read the link at Wikipedia, it encompasses portions of Joliet, Aurora, and Plainfield, which all had a building boom in the 1990’s – 2000’s (Aurora is #2 in population of Illinois cities with almost 200K, Joliet is #4 at almost 150K). Oswego, Kendal County’s largest town, got a lot of people who were priced out of Naperville (Bolingbrook in Will County got the same effect) or were leery of the growing ¡Vibrancy! and falling property values in Aurora.
Portions of Kendal County, like Oswego, are within a reasonable (> 2 hr) commuting time and distance of downtown Chicago, especially by train. By car, forget it.
Speaking as a sample size of n=2, we moved to a solidly red Midwestern state in a red county. However the biggest city in the state, no surprise, is slowly turning blue.
I kind of enjoy it (mmm strong beer and schnitzel and spaetzle), but I'm fond of anything unhealthy. It's really bad.
Irish in Massachusetts and Montana
Germans going to bars: Good.
Right. And that is why it is increasingly harder for us to win the presidential election. The democrats get new immigrants to maintain their strongholds in CA, NY, IL, etc., which then frees up their Whites to internally immigrate to Red states were they start to become Purple.
The democrats are assured right now in May 2019 of winning CA, NY, IL and MA no matter whom they run. You could probably throw in several other states as well. These are states they will not have to even spend a dime in to defend.
Yet because of the deluge of foreign immigration and White democrats fleeing Blue states, we have to fight tooth and nail just to hold onto states that should be no strainers for us.
Yes, they do trash the Libertarians on that site too, but I'd guess it's the Reason magazine open-borders idiots that they are pointing at.
That point has to be rammed home. No other issue compares. If you are not making progress on that issue, you are losing. Legal immigration is bringing in an average of 2700 immigrants per day, day-in-day-out, assuming a rate of 1 million per year. Of course some years the rate is closer to 2 million, and this does not count illegals. So we are getting perhaps 5000 newcomers per day every day of the year.
Legal immigrants can probably apply for citizenship in 5 to 7 years. So the ones coming in today will haunt us in 7 years at the polling booth. While the guys from 2013 will be hammering us in 2020.
I always think of the Germans in France in June 1944. The allies averaged 35K new troops per day from D-Day to July 4, so that by that date they had a 1 million man army in France, where none had existed just a month prior. And they obviously kept landing troops beyond that date. But 1 million was definitely a significant number. No matter how many Sherman tanks were knocked out, and plenty were, unless the Germans could stop those daily landings, the fight on the Western front was lost.
Likewise, if we can’t stop the landing of 2500 to 5000 immivaders per day, we are as doomed as those Germans. No amount of GDP growth, or tax cuts will save the day.
$700 billion per year, year after, on "defense" to send ships and troops all over the world but refuses to spend $25 billion for a wall ONE TIME - for the actual invasion of this country
I’m surprised to see the bootheel of Missouri losing population. I grew up in Arkansas just across the state line from Missouri. I don’t remember the bootheel having any population to lose.
On Friday nights in high school we used to drive out to the state line looking for road kill. The highway runs through a swamp and lots of critters get hit on the highway. Also Missouri is wet with legal age 18, while Arkansas is 21, and there were several liquor stores just across the state line.
Surprised by the Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo graphics.
GR is the erstwhile furniture capital of America. The industry seems not so much to have disappeared as downscaled and upscaled, kind of like Pittsburgh, Racine, and Lowell. (Downscale and upscale sound contradictory, but one is quantitative and the other qualitative . Fewer but better Ottomans.)
Also, the regional WASP Calvinism was more than reinforced by the flood of Dutchmen in the 19th century. Western Michigan is quite well-taken-care-of outside its small cities. A revival is not surprising.
But, I also noticed that the prospering city of Grand Rapids MI elected their first female mayor in the City's history - she's typical, idiot, liberal woman now obsessed the RP police stop more Black teens than Swedes or Japanese.
This SH$#&#* usually starts with childless women with too much free time taking over politics and the church, soon it degresses to the woman Lib mayor of Cologne Germany responding to the mass North African Muslim migrant rape of local German girls with plans for education programs for the muslim migrants to educate them on the best ways to "Date" German girls.
Sorry ladies, we love you, especially our mothers and daughters - but giving you the vote was the worst things we ever did.
End women's suffrage. Haven't we all suffered enough?
On Friday nights in high school we used to drive out to the state line looking for road kill. The highway runs through a swamp and lots of critters get hit on the highway. Also Missouri is wet with legal age 18, while Arkansas is 21, and there were several liquor stores just across the state line.
The Limbaugh brothers?
Cape Girardeau was famous for its refrigerator magnets. Has that industry decamped, too? Or are America’s Frigidaires, Hotpoints, and Norges saturated?
Really, the Missouri Bootheel is considered anything that's south of the line of latitude that serves as the Missouri-Arkansas border for the most part.
What do you say about this, Mr. Caesar?
Actually, much of the exurban growth is not those escaping the city, but those escaping the country.
They have to come into the metro area for jobs, but don’t want to go in too far. They’re nearer to hunting, fishing, and mom’s farm home cooking, too. My brothers-in-law have done this.
Irish going to bars: Bad.
Germans going to bars: Good.
At the Swenson link there are several interesting graphics (in addition to this one) — and you learn they were created by a colleague.
Commenter Baron Munchhausen brought this up on a Kersey column, but since no one was murdered Kersey may not give it the play it merits:
White Woman Newscaster correctly points out that the past 3 Mayors of Baltimore were: Black, Female, Criminal and that it was time for a new leadership direction.
Loses Job because of it.
https://www.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/tv/z-on-tv-blog/bs-fe-zontv-wjz-bubala-babj-20190506-story,amp.html
Legal immigrants can probably apply for citizenship in 5 to 7 years. So the ones coming in today will haunt us in 7 years at the polling booth. While the guys from 2013 will be hammering us in 2020.
I always think of the Germans in France in June 1944. The allies averaged 35K new troops per day from D-Day to July 4, so that by that date they had a 1 million man army in France, where none had existed just a month prior. And they obviously kept landing troops beyond that date. But 1 million was definitely a significant number. No matter how many Sherman tanks were knocked out, and plenty were, unless the Germans could stop those daily landings, the fight on the Western front was lost.
Likewise, if we can't stop the landing of 2500 to 5000 immivaders per day, we are as doomed as those Germans. No amount of GDP growth, or tax cuts will save the day.
of course your govt can do this easily, they just choose not to
$700 billion per year, year after, on “defense” to send ships and troops all over the world but refuses to spend $25 billion for a wall ONE TIME – for the actual invasion of this country
White Woman Newscaster correctly points out that the past 3 Mayors of Baltimore were: Black, Female, Criminal and that it was time for a new leadership direction.
Loses Job because of it.
https://www.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/tv/z-on-tv-blog/bs-fe-zontv-wjz-bubala-babj-20190506-story,amp.html
Thanks.
Downstate Illinois shares with Wisconsin and North Dakota the ignominy of having more bars than groceries:
http://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/assets/4416283/us_bars_groceries_100122.jpg
Ignominy?!
Beer is liquid bread!
What’s driving Illinois’ $111 billion pension crisis
Government-worker pensions already consume one-fourth of the state’s budget. And every day Illinois goes without a solution to its pension crisis, the state’s pension debt grows by over $20 million…The state’s pension crisis threatens to burden taxpayers with massive, ever-escalating taxes to bail out a system that is simply not sustainable…The bigger problem facing Illinois’ five state-run pension funds is the unaffordable pension benefits politicians have given away to government workers and government unions over the past several decades.
no, tax rates are not the only thing that matters, and the vdare crowd correctly point this out. i'm on board with that. but the last 3 years of the vdare/amren-sphere twitter people blathering about "muh tax cuts" and leering at trump "give them a tax cut, blormpf" literally every single day, are totally refuted by observing how people move.
they're heading for the exits in droves from california, illinois, and new york.
the problem is, when they move to a new state, they keep voting the way they did before they moved.
trump slashed the corporate income tax rate, and against the predictions of literally every single economics and political writer, save a few conservative ones, we're in the middle of the trumponomics economy.
trump raised tariffs and...little inflation. some steel even came back, which seemed impossible when POTATUS was blathering about that during campaign 2016. even i didn't think that would happen.
these moves have mostly worked out so far. but the vdare crowd is relentless in hammering him. yes, he's failing at other areas, BUT HE'S RIGHT ABOUT TAXES. 2 out of 3 democrat voters agree, less taxes please, and i'll prove it with my feet.
that's why biden is now polling higher than trump in arizona.
You can look forward to a country of low-taxed brown people then.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-farmers-retirement-insight/trade-war-and-sagging-prices-push-u-s-family-farmers-to-leave-the-field-idUSKCN1S613U
I like the way these articles imply we’d be back to making money if it wasn’t for the tariffs on imports. We were losing money before Trump, but that gets minimized.
On Friday nights in high school we used to drive out to the state line looking for road kill. The highway runs through a swamp and lots of critters get hit on the highway. Also Missouri is wet with legal age 18, while Arkansas is 21, and there were several liquor stores just across the state line.
Missouri’s drinking age was always 21.
Government-worker pensions already consume one-fourth of the state’s budget. And every day Illinois goes without a solution to its pension crisis, the state’s pension debt grows by over $20 million...The state’s pension crisis threatens to burden taxpayers with massive, ever-escalating taxes to bail out a system that is simply not sustainable...The bigger problem facing Illinois’ five state-run pension funds is the unaffordable pension benefits politicians have given away to government workers and government unions over the past several decades.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/25/State_and_local_taxes_Per_capita_by_type.png/300px-State_and_local_taxes_Per_capita_by_type.png
Hmm. So California is actually a low tax state, like Florida, going by bigger picture “effective” tax rate?
Okay, but what are they doing in northern Michigan? No one’s starting up farming these days, so what jobs are they taking? All of the reasons you guys have mentioned thus far are not really “pull factors” aside from a generic “beauty.”
The northwest coast of the lower peninsula of Michigan is likely the most beautiful place in the Midwest, with big sand dunes along Lake Michigan and cool weather in summer. A large number of golf courses were built there in late 20th century.
https://www.grandtraverseresort.com/golf/wolverineLots of good restaurants and vineyards in the area. The local breweries and distilleries are solid. Farm to table places exist at reasonable prices. Plenty of places to go antiquing or shopping for unique art with the missus. Unfortunately, noted libtard Michael Moore does own a theater in downtown TC.Tons of boating, fishing, and other watersports opportunities as well. Lots of scenic lakeside state parks where one can stay cheaply. Hemingway was known to hang out a bit farther north around Torch and Walloon Lakes.TC itself was narrowly spared from being designated a sanctuary city by the Donald's election.
Downstate Illinois shares with Wisconsin and North Dakota the ignominy of having more bars than groceries:
http://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/assets/4416283/us_bars_groceries_100122.jpg
Ignominy?? shame on you
no, tax rates are not the only thing that matters, and the vdare crowd correctly point this out. i'm on board with that. but the last 3 years of the vdare/amren-sphere twitter people blathering about "muh tax cuts" and leering at trump "give them a tax cut, blormpf" literally every single day, are totally refuted by observing how people move.
they're heading for the exits in droves from california, illinois, and new york.
the problem is, when they move to a new state, they keep voting the way they did before they moved.
trump slashed the corporate income tax rate, and against the predictions of literally every single economics and political writer, save a few conservative ones, we're in the middle of the trumponomics economy.
trump raised tariffs and...little inflation. some steel even came back, which seemed impossible when POTATUS was blathering about that during campaign 2016. even i didn't think that would happen.
these moves have mostly worked out so far. but the vdare crowd is relentless in hammering him. yes, he's failing at other areas, BUT HE'S RIGHT ABOUT TAXES. 2 out of 3 democrat voters agree, less taxes please, and i'll prove it with my feet.
that's why biden is now polling higher than trump in arizona.
You offered no proof that taxes are driving the exodus out of Illinois. I do agree though the vdare crowd is kind of annoying. Trump is a good president and as good as it is ever going to get for that crowd.
If so it is probably misleadingly due to 1) Prop 13, passed in the 1970s, which capped property taxes for held properties; 2) lower than average sales tax: California has a lower state sales tax than 84.6% of states, and 3) many poor people who pay low or no state income tax (CA has 10 income brackets, but the highest top marginal rate).
$700 billion per year, year after, on "defense" to send ships and troops all over the world but refuses to spend $25 billion for a wall ONE TIME - for the actual invasion of this country
One of several reasons why the Department of Defense is misnamed. It does the bidding of corrupt plutocrats and much of that work is overseas.
Or not a problem if they give away snappy beer cheese and saltines.
Sarnia and Windsor representing for Canada. Woo hoo!
I get Myrtle Beach, but what’s up with Lexington, Kentucky and Knoxville, Tennessee on the bars vs. groceries map? And where’s Nashville?
They aren’t doing anything for a living anymore. They’re retirees. You can sell a house in Hoffman Estates and buy a place in Traverse City, Michigan and The Villages, Florida with some walking around money left over. They’re doing it by the thousands.
Kendal County grew because if you read the link at Wikipedia, it encompasses portions of Joliet, Aurora, and Plainfield, which all had a building boom in the 1990’s - 2000’s (Aurora is #2 in population of Illinois cities with almost 200K, Joliet is #4 at almost 150K). Oswego, Kendal County’s largest town, got a lot of people who were priced out of Naperville (Bolingbrook in Will County got the same effect) or were leery of the growing ¡Vibrancy! and falling property values in Aurora.
Portions of Kendal County, like Oswego, are within a reasonable (> 2 hr) commuting time and distance of downtown Chicago, especially by train. By car, forget it.
Also, there are a lot of jobs in the Southwest Suburbs of Chicago that are easy to get to. Somebody could live in Oswego and drive to Naperville to work. These people might get into the city once a year to go to a concert or a Cubs Game.
I am glad to see that the commenters here were generally nice to Illinois. Living in Illinois all you hear is what a shithole it is and are always asked “why do you stay?” The reality is that Illinois isn’t that bad, it just had had a combination of high taxes and and a lot of negative news coverage. If you look at the statistics, the places that the people leaving Illinois are going to, have lower taxes but an overall higher cost of living. So these people are not necessarily better off.
Not sure how your statement “places . . . have lower taxes but an overall higher cost of living” meshes with what my wife and I see.
Taking national chain department stores (Walmart, Target, Best Buy, etc.) and large ticket items sold nationally (like new automobiles) out of the mix, since prices should be similar before taxes state to state, the things that have the biggest impact to me cost less in my new home state than they did in Illinois:
* My new house is bigger and cost $25K less to buy than my old house in Illinois.
* My property tax bill is $10K less than than my last bill (2017) in Illinois.
* I don’t have toll roads to drive on until I cross the border into Illinois.
* My office is literally (not figuratively) a 15 - 20 minute drive to my house. It took me 20 minutes to drive to the train station the next town over back in Illinois.
* No nearly $200/month train ticket to get to the Loop and back for work.
* No $3 daily parking at the train station.
* Gasoline prices are less per gallon than back in Illinois.
* Traffic is much more manageable than in Illinois, especially the nightmare that is the Chicago highway/tollway system. Are there no traffic jams? No, but rush hour is truly only an hour versus the Hell that is the Stevenson, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Dan Ryan, or Tri-State any given hour of the day in Chicago. (Spoken as someone who drove the expressways and tollways for over ten years to get to and from work)
* Food and alcohol taxes are much lower than in Illinois. It’s especially noticeable when we travel back and have dinner or visit a microbrewery in Illinois.
* Speaking of alcohol: Beer, wine, and hard liquor prices are much lower than in Illinois. Last time we went back to our favorite microbrewery in Illinois, a growler of the their beer cost me $26. I pay anywhere from $9 - $16 in my new home state, and can get a growler filled for $6-10 on Economy nights at some breweries.
When I moved I took a slight pay cut to take a job in my new home state. This year I am making what I made when I left Illinois. My money definitely goes farther, and it’s a lower cost of living here than in Illinois.
I was born and raised in Illinois and studied, lived and worked only there until two years ago. I agree with you there are very nice places in my old home state, but I can definitely tell you our leaving was a vast improvement in quality of life compared to staying and getting soaked. Your mileage may vary.
But Cape Girardeau County itself is gaining population.
Really, the Missouri Bootheel is considered anything that’s south of the line of latitude that serves as the Missouri-Arkansas border for the most part.
Grocery stores in towns under 1,500 are having trouble staying open in the midwest. The residents are used to driving to bigger towns to get what they need that enough of them pick up groceries while they are there. I don’t know about downstate Illinois, but North Dakota and Wisconsin are both huge drinking states. It isn’t unusual for a small town to have one grocery store and three bars.
The city of Chicago’s population is down slightly but the composition is changing with blacks leaving and young whites continuing to come for jobs downtown and the urban lifestyle. The gentrification that’s been going on has been amazing.
no, tax rates are not the only thing that matters, and the vdare crowd correctly point this out. i'm on board with that. but the last 3 years of the vdare/amren-sphere twitter people blathering about "muh tax cuts" and leering at trump "give them a tax cut, blormpf" literally every single day, are totally refuted by observing how people move.
they're heading for the exits in droves from california, illinois, and new york.
the problem is, when they move to a new state, they keep voting the way they did before they moved.
trump slashed the corporate income tax rate, and against the predictions of literally every single economics and political writer, save a few conservative ones, we're in the middle of the trumponomics economy.
trump raised tariffs and...little inflation. some steel even came back, which seemed impossible when POTATUS was blathering about that during campaign 2016. even i didn't think that would happen.
these moves have mostly worked out so far. but the vdare crowd is relentless in hammering him. yes, he's failing at other areas, BUT HE'S RIGHT ABOUT TAXES. 2 out of 3 democrat voters agree, less taxes please, and i'll prove it with my feet.
that's why biden is now polling higher than trump in arizona.
Within living memory, New Jersey and Connecticut were once tax havens from New York. They were the New Hampshire, Tennessee, Florida, and (state of) Washingtons of the day. No income tax.
What’s the deal with Portland, though? You’d think people would shop in Oregon but live in Washington, as those are the tax incentives.
I should check the phone books along the St Croix River. Neither Minnesota not Wisconsin taxes groceries, but Wisconsin taxes clothing and Minnesota does not. The grocery/haberdashery ratio may differ.
Communist puritan fascists!
I kind of enjoy it (mmm strong beer and schnitzel and spaetzle), but I'm fond of anything unhealthy. It's really bad.
It’s the Catholic areas of Minnesota which show on this map.
What do you say about this, Mr. Caesar?
Is white flight even a “thing” anymore? We’ve cleared out of the worst cities, Detroit, Baltimore, Newark, New Orleans, etc., except for a few historic districts. The more moderately non-white cities, and the more segregated (e.g., Chicago), have lots of nice old housing stock that white folks just won’t give up on, and are even rediscovering.
The main demographic change news in Minneapolis is the white-led gentrification around, and even penetrating, North Minneapolis, the only true black ghetto in the state.
When we lived in St Paul, my son’s Cub Scout pack was in Minneapolis (we didn’t have a car his first year, and a quirk in the bus routes made it more convenient to cross the river). Every kid in the pack had at least one white parent. The immigrant and diverse (which actually were diverse, i.e., mixed) neighborhoods were adjacent to theirs, and the families found the proximity quite tolerable.
Not ideal, but nothing to run away from, either, considering the benefits of staying. Like, you don’t have to drive your kids anywhere. Plus, Minnesota was a leader in charter schools and school choice, and now has shall-issue concealed carry. Education and crime are less of an issue.
A certain notorious Lib Leftist, open borders immigration ethnic group that we're not supposed to mention has lost a lot of key spots, their numbers are down. Al Frankin isn't a Senator anymore.
Mass Somalian immigration tends to Red Pill most folks, including Liberals.
Wish some populist GOP governor political leader would campaign, win on issues of promoting Ice Hockey, lower beer drinking age and ending international Cold Wars with hockey playing countries like Russia.
"Muhammed don't play Ice Hockey".
Dave Swenson is probably not an idiot, but that map need further explanation.
1 red dot equals a gain of 10 people, 1 blue dot equals a loss of 10 people. The location of the dot doesn’t matter, only that it’s in the boundaries of the county. The greater density of dots the more people gained or lost in that county.
Mike,
Not sure how your statement “places . . . have lower taxes but an overall higher cost of living” meshes with what my wife and I see.
Taking national chain department stores (Walmart, Target, Best Buy, etc.) and large ticket items sold nationally (like new automobiles) out of the mix, since prices should be similar before taxes state to state, the things that have the biggest impact to me cost less in my new home state than they did in Illinois:
* My new house is bigger and cost $25K less to buy than my old house in Illinois.
* My property tax bill is $10K less than than my last bill (2017) in Illinois.
* I don’t have toll roads to drive on until I cross the border into Illinois.
* My office is literally (not figuratively) a 15 – 20 minute drive to my house. It took me 20 minutes to drive to the train station the next town over back in Illinois.
* No nearly $200/month train ticket to get to the Loop and back for work.
* No $3 daily parking at the train station.
* Gasoline prices are less per gallon than back in Illinois.
* Traffic is much more manageable than in Illinois, especially the nightmare that is the Chicago highway/tollway system. Are there no traffic jams? No, but rush hour is truly only an hour versus the Hell that is the Stevenson, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Dan Ryan, or Tri-State any given hour of the day in Chicago. (Spoken as someone who drove the expressways and tollways for over ten years to get to and from work)
* Food and alcohol taxes are much lower than in Illinois. It’s especially noticeable when we travel back and have dinner or visit a microbrewery in Illinois.
* Speaking of alcohol: Beer, wine, and hard liquor prices are much lower than in Illinois. Last time we went back to our favorite microbrewery in Illinois, a growler of the their beer cost me $26. I pay anywhere from $9 – $16 in my new home state, and can get a growler filled for $6-10 on Economy nights at some breweries.
When I moved I took a slight pay cut to take a job in my new home state. This year I am making what I made when I left Illinois. My money definitely goes farther, and it’s a lower cost of living here than in Illinois.
I was born and raised in Illinois and studied, lived and worked only there until two years ago. I agree with you there are very nice places in my old home state, but I can definitely tell you our leaving was a vast improvement in quality of life compared to staying and getting soaked. Your mileage may vary.
The democrats are assured right now in May 2019 of winning CA, NY, IL and MA no matter whom they run. You could probably throw in several other states as well. These are states they will not have to even spend a dime in to defend.
Yet because of the deluge of foreign immigration and White democrats fleeing Blue states, we have to fight tooth and nail just to hold onto states that should be no strainers for us.
Becoming impossible to imagine a scenario where another Republican is elected president. But the Republicans did just about everything in their power to bring this situation about.
Lol, so Indiana and Ohio are doing just as bad as Illinois (if not worse in the rural areas) but this is the blacks’ and Crook countys’ fault, as usual.
Let’s be a little bit more intellectually rigorous here.
I think there are many causes. High taxes (that are going to rise even higher soon) to pay for unconscionable public sector union “benefits”, political corruption, as well as a dramatic demographic shift (most “top” suburban high schools are only 60% - 75% white; it was +90% 25 years ago) that has restricted the number of “livable” suburbs and drastically increased housing prices. Finally, many Baby Boomers are getting out of dodge, some for weather or lifestyle reasons, others for those already mentioned.
You find out when you come, I ain’t sayin nothin.
AD, and that is why the Citizen question should stay on the Census form.
Good at what exactly? I’m no lefty, but I am fairly disillusioned with him lately. Tell me why VDare, Coulter, etc. shouldn’t be mad at him?
no, tax rates are not the only thing that matters, and the vdare crowd correctly point this out. i'm on board with that. but the last 3 years of the vdare/amren-sphere twitter people blathering about "muh tax cuts" and leering at trump "give them a tax cut, blormpf" literally every single day, are totally refuted by observing how people move.
they're heading for the exits in droves from california, illinois, and new york.
the problem is, when they move to a new state, they keep voting the way they did before they moved.
trump slashed the corporate income tax rate, and against the predictions of literally every single economics and political writer, save a few conservative ones, we're in the middle of the trumponomics economy.
trump raised tariffs and...little inflation. some steel even came back, which seemed impossible when POTATUS was blathering about that during campaign 2016. even i didn't think that would happen.
these moves have mostly worked out so far. but the vdare crowd is relentless in hammering him. yes, he's failing at other areas, BUT HE'S RIGHT ABOUT TAXES. 2 out of 3 democrat voters agree, less taxes please, and i'll prove it with my feet.
that's why biden is now polling higher than trump in arizona.
Do they have age demographics with this too?
I agree that retirees are more concerned about fixed incomes, so taxes are a huge motivator to move.
I think you are underplaying the “good schools” effect of migration though.
And what's going on with northern Michigan that's causing it to gain people?
Boomers retiring “up north”, where they spent their summer vacations all their lives. Also the business that year-round residents attract, that tourists don’t.
My Oak Park, IL dad spent his boyhood summers in a cabin in Western Michigan. The prevailing wind blows from west to east across Lake Michigan, so the Michigan coast is cooler than the Illinois/Wisconsin coast.
Let's be a little bit more intellectually rigorous here.
I think the point is that people are leaving rural areas for urban/suburban areas in all parts of the country. But Illlinois, which has one of the country’s preeminent cities and one of the largest and best established web of suburbs, is hemorrhaging people.
I think there are many causes. High taxes (that are going to rise even higher soon) to pay for unconscionable public sector union “benefits”, political corruption, as well as a dramatic demographic shift (most “top” suburban high schools are only 60% – 75% white; it was +90% 25 years ago) that has restricted the number of “livable” suburbs and drastically increased housing prices. Finally, many Baby Boomers are getting out of dodge, some for weather or lifestyle reasons, others for those already mentioned.
Also the winters are warmer on the east side… and snowier, with all the lake-effect.
Grand Traverse Resort just outside Traverse City has two courses designed by some schlubs named Jack Nicklaus and Gary Player.
https://www.grandtraverseresort.com/golf/bear
https://www.grandtraverseresort.com/golf/wolverine
Lots of good restaurants and vineyards in the area. The local breweries and distilleries are solid. Farm to table places exist at reasonable prices. Plenty of places to go antiquing or shopping for unique art with the missus. Unfortunately, noted libtard Michael Moore does own a theater in downtown TC.
Tons of boating, fishing, and other watersports opportunities as well. Lots of scenic lakeside state parks where one can stay cheaply. Hemingway was known to hang out a bit farther north around Torch and Walloon Lakes.
TC itself was narrowly spared from being designated a sanctuary city by the Donald’s election.
That’s why we often refer to the GOP as controlled opposition.
What’s the matter with Kansas?
I type on my keyboard as A Citizen of The World. Let me be clear. Because those bitter clingers stopped clinging to their home towns and moved away, I will succeed faster with my plan to replace people like my Grandmother (a typical white person) with Citizens of other countries from around the world.
Now, I want no labeling. Because I always say, avoid dangerous mindsets reminiscent of the darkest, most shameful periods in American history, I want to be clear on that, I surely do.
I know that by replacing “B” grade Americans with other citizens of the world will, I know, by almost every measure, make America a better, stronger place than it was when I started.
I am who we were waiting for.
Indeed, and it’s well beyond sad that we as a people are violently opposed by both of the major parties in our own nation’s political system. Well, it used to be our own nation.
Trump won a lot of the fastest small counties in the US many of them in Texas or Florida. Usually, this publication talks way too much on Trump winning Obama supporters in the Midwest. Actually, this people are not as supportive of him as those in the 100 fastest growing counties in the US, mainly in North Dakota, Texas, and Florida. Places like Midland, Kaufman Texas, Manatee Texas. Business insider shows that domestic migration is to these places. They have decent job prospects since they income range of the fastest growing smaller counties is 49,000 to 75,000. Poverty rates are not high, range from 7 percent to 13 percent. Texas and Florida in the smaller counties are picking up whites and even Midland Texas which has a lot of Mexicans are more native born Mexicans.
Yes, this is true.
The epicenter of most all of these terrible Lib, Obama, BlackLivesMatter, Valerie Jarret, Arnie Duncan, David Axelrod, Rahm Emannuel Chicago politics/policies is my neighborhood:
The University of Chicago/Hyde Park
Obama made it his base of Operations, same as the Nation of Islam – nice, good looking, relatively low crime (University of Chicago police), safe place. But close enough to the Black ‘Hood that Community activists can’t be accused of selling out, moving to the ‘burbs.
Usually these PC Lib, Black Elites don’t want to mess up their/our local lakefront nice place, but somehow the powers that be are grabbing a huge chunk of the free and open Lakefront Public Park “Jackson Park” (Named after Andrew Jackson not Jessie Jackson) for
The Obama Presidential Center
It’s not in anyway a Presidential Library, you won’t be able to check out a book, instead it’s a 22 story high rise to be built in the Park, looks like a temple to worship Barack Obama and a center for all the policies associated with/around Obama like BlackLivesMatter, Holder SH#&*@.
White liberal park lovers are very angry.
Also, the regional WASP Calvinism was more than reinforced by the flood of Dutchmen in the 19th century. Western Michigan is quite well-taken-care-of outside its small cities. A revival is not surprising.
Yes, I noticed this revival of the State of Michigan outside of the worst parts of Detroit, Flint etc.
But, I also noticed that the prospering city of Grand Rapids MI elected their first female mayor in the City’s history – she’s typical, idiot, liberal woman now obsessed the RP police stop more Black teens than Swedes or Japanese.
This SH$#&#* usually starts with childless women with too much free time taking over politics and the church, soon it degresses to the woman Lib mayor of Cologne Germany responding to the mass North African Muslim migrant rape of local German girls with plans for education programs for the muslim migrants to educate them on the best ways to “Date” German girls.
Sorry ladies, we love you, especially our mothers and daughters – but giving you the vote was the worst things we ever did.
End women’s suffrage. Haven’t we all suffered enough?
Minnesota would be my best bet to flip from Lib Blue to prosperous, environmentalist Red like Wisconsin and Ohio.
A certain notorious Lib Leftist, open borders immigration ethnic group that we’re not supposed to mention has lost a lot of key spots, their numbers are down. Al Frankin isn’t a Senator anymore.
Mass Somalian immigration tends to Red Pill most folks, including Liberals.
Wish some populist GOP governor political leader would campaign, win on issues of promoting Ice Hockey, lower beer drinking age and ending international Cold Wars with hockey playing countries like Russia.
“Muhammed don’t play Ice Hockey”.
Chicago is a beautiful city and the North Shore has beautiful villages like Glencoe but the state is a corrupt fiscal mess. When my father-in-law died several years ago, I encouraged my husband to sell his childhood home because the future looked dire. Back then, the property taxes were $23k for a house worth $1M. Twice what my state would assess in property taxes. Couple that with the several billion in unpaid bills, the massive ticking bomb of pensions, and the PC madness gripping the state govt, there is no good reason to stay. And the situation is getting worse, look at who the low IQ voters are voting for, race baiting imbeciles like Kim Foxx, who is letting minority criminals get away with a slap on the wrist.
And what's going on with northern Michigan that's causing it to gain people?
Forest and pastureland and native plants and animals that upscale boomers can rape into their magazine-photo notions of the ideal life, a la Conde Nast.
You know, cut down all the trees, mow the undergrowth flat, turn it into irrigated grass and landscaped non-native garden beds around a 6,000 sf McMansion with four car garage and two storey “shop” full of the latest top-of-the-line power tools (muh tractor muh chain saw muh generator muh etc.), all registered as a new age church to avoid paying the much lower real estate taxes while driving up those of everyone around them, fence the wildlife out from crossing it, let 15 giant or squeaky-rat dogs run loose.
Then vote for the usual Dem crap. While waving muh microfarm muh backyard chickens muh two sheep in each others’ faces on Facebook.
Northern Michigan is white. And if there’s one thing boomer PC/SJW types want, it’s to live among white people. Just so long as they get to whizz up the leg of their local, non prosperous/hard working/frugal/simple living white people as inferior. And get to trade their daughters for tacos. (Ew, a white daughter–who needs that!?)
We have the same thing happening in the rapidly suburbanizing hinterlands of Pugetopolis.