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Warning: Language, while up to Presidential podcast norms, does not meet iSteve standards.

As you may have heard, college debate has collapsed into complete farce in recent years due to white and Asian people letting black contestants turn it into a contest over who is most black. (The black contestants don’t use the word “black” to describe themselves, however.) While the white-Asian teams discuss Constitutional law and social science findings regarding the debate’s official topic, the black teams ignore the subject they are supposed to be debating. Instead, they rap and twerk and denounce white women for shoving them while they were riding on the escalator when they were four.

And they win, because few white judges dare vote publicly against blacks acting stupid. (The secret ballot is an underrated thing.) That would be like admitting you read The Bell Curve.

A point I make over and over is that nobody really takes the conventional wisdom seriously because you don’t often see major institutions allowing themselves to be completely destroyed in the name of the logic of political correctness. Corrupted, of course; made less effective, sure. But obliterated, no. Society over the last half century has figured out lots of ways to buy off the loudest black people. For example, in The Bonfire of the Vanities, the mayor of New York spends part of most days handing out Plaques for Blacks.

But college debate is an exception to my rule, perhaps because there is so little money involved. In college debate, there’s nothing except plaques, so blacks now have to win all of them.

If you are a Democratic political strategist, this video ought to make you a bit worried about the Democrats’ future. You’ve looked at all the demographic forecasts about how you are importing millions of ringers to vote Democratic, but will blacks be willing to share?

On the other hand, there is one organized group that has the testicular fortitude, the sheer narcissistic rage to stand up to the black debaters, to go jaw to jaw screaming with them over who is most oppressed: the transies.

And here’s a preview of what the Democratic primary campaign of 2020 will look like if Hillary loses next year.

 
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  1. • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    @Crassus

    I guess you got the memo that "tranny" is transphobic.

    , @Joe Magarac
    @Crassus

    About publishers who (at least for now) ban everything written by men --

    I won't bother about "fairness" because after all there are other places to get published (and easier than ever to self publish).

    But are these outfits in business to make money?
    And if not, who is paying the bills?

  2. • Replies: @Pseudonymic Handle
    @Anon

    That Renda was a student herself and had no official access to UVa relevant data and did not speak for UVa so if Erdely believed her she did on her own risk.

  3. He could have won.

    • Replies: @jon
    @Anon

    How have I not seen that before? Kai - American hero!

    Replies: @JeremiahJohnbalaya

    , @Dzo
    @Anon

    This guy most likely murdered a lawyer in my town during some kind of gay tryst.

    http://www.nj.com/union/index.ssf/2014/01/kai_the_hitchhiker_pleas_not_guilty_to_clark_murder_lawyer_says_hes_doing_better.html

    I think he claimed he was drugged and raped.

  4. In case you missed it, Jose Antonio Vargas shouting at #BlackLivesMatter activists heckling his stale pale male panelists: https://twitter.com/LegInsurrection/status/622772876433846273

    • Replies: @AnAnon
    @Dave Pinsen

    until they attack Hillary, I think its more of a regular firing squad.

  5. • Replies: @Kylie
    @Truth


    Sailerbait!

    http://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2015/7/13/8947927/jozy-altidore-reveals-cover-heart-national-anthem
     
    Truthbait!

    Want to hear about how I ended up studying with Jehovah's Witnesses in my home (yes, including a black lady) for years?

    Replies: @Truth

  6. ” There have been trans women of color doing amazing things,”

    So being a hooker is considered an amazing thing now? Because the vast majority of Black Trannies in my neck of the woods are street prostitutes. Very few of them are involved in other career fields.

    “How did Caitlyn win an ESPY award for courage when Trans Women of color have exemplified courage in every single intersection of oppression they come across.”

    What oppression are Black Trannies facing? Having their sexual advances turned down by Cisgender Heterosexual White men who do not want to have sex with Black “chicks” with dicks.

    “I wish you would post as much about black people dying as you did about Caitlyn. Lol like literally WE ARE DYING. Trans Black Women are the group that are targeted the most amongst Trans individuals”

    The reason why there is a high rate of violence towards Black Trannies is because of their very dangerous profession which involves being street hookers in high crime Black neighborhoods. The vast majority of violence/killings of Black Trannies are being committed by Black pimps and the Black John customer base, not evil racist Cisgendered White guys.

    • Replies: @Marty
    @Jefferson

    I was once on Post St., between Polk & Larkin, talking to a black guy I'd known years earlier. A black tranny walked by. My acquaintance said, "damn, she look just like Janet Jackson."

  7. Monty Python’s Flying Circus.

  8. Steve,
    Somehow I don’t think the words ‘transies’ and ‘testicular fortitude’ sit well together. Figuratively if not literally speaking.
    Or perhaps it was a Freudian slip?

    • Replies: @Thomas Fuller
    @Anonymous

    Check out the last link in the article to that video on Faceache! :-)

    Edit: @P (#9) -- hadn't seen your post when I commented.

  9. The most memorable part during that rant by those two obese manly butch dyke looking Black “women” is when they mention the violence that Whiteness does to Black bodies.

    Not even The Onion could come up with something this retarded.

    White on Black violence is an epidemic in America is one of biggest political lies of the 21st Century. Repeat a lie long enough with your huge powerful Megaphone and eventually the dumb masses will believe it is true.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Jefferson

    "Jefferson says:

    The most memorable part during that rant by those two obese manly butch dyke looking Black “women” is when they mention the violence that Whiteness does to Black bodies."

    Yeah, I think most of the violence done to those black bodies was done by Captain Crunch, Twinkies, and Root Beer.

    , @Buffalo Joe
    @Jefferson

    Jefferson....The Buffalo Italian Heritage Festival ended it's four day run on Sunday. The Festival shut down early on Saturday as a herd of Black Cape Buffalo brawled in the street, caught of course, on cell phone camera. I read the Cleveland Plains Dealer, as I have three children who live in the Cleveland area. On Wednesday, past, Terrance Finklea was shot and killed near his Section 8 housing. On Friday, as one hundred people gathered to memorialize Terrance, someone shot up the crowd wounding three. Terrance,26, was remembered as a " good person...not a troublemaker" by his godmother with whom he lived. Terrance had an outstanding, felonious assault warrant . In April, Terrance the good son, was accused of shooting up a van with two women and a one year old child inside. The rare act of violence against blacks is by whites, the black on black violence is a daily occurrence.

    , @TWS
    @Jefferson

    I'll admit when I first saw this a year or so ago I thought this was 'The Onion'. Now I'm sure we've reached peak decline and it's going to be a flat graph from here to knapping glass arrow heads from the windows in Detroit.

  10. This spells doom for higher ed, but that’s fine. They aided and abetted political correctness and multiculturalism to the point it’s become a monster which will devour them.

    To paraphrase Carroll Quigley. No institution failed that didn’t deserve it.

    For the Democrats it means it’s nearing a end to running nasty old white candidates like Clinton or even a populist like Sanders for national office like POTUS.

    That’s alright though. Many white liberals will embrace a Mugabe or Adi Amin. As long as the party continues and the money keeps flowing, they’ll support any lunatic/crook the Democrats put up for them. It’s all good.

    The GOP OTOH shouldn’t smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.

    • Replies: @Kristen
    @rod1963

    They do NOT represent the white upper class, but are overwhelmingly from the lower middle class. I think of them as self-hating, striving white Republicans, the sort who denies his/her heritage and social background as if it isn't good enough. I'd like to see working class whites be contented if not proud of their accomplishments, not denying their pasts and pretending to be upper class, which emphatically they are not.

    , @jW
    @rod1963


    The GOP OTOH shouldn’t smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.
     
    I think deep down the elites know that an honorable working man is in some sense their better and they resent him for it. Every bit they take, every move they make is made possible by some guy here or in China building and distributing this stuff. The elites really aren't mostly the Steve Jobs, Norman Borlaug types who really revolutionize. They are just the skimmers of the cream and they know it. They are not producers. That is why they identify and sympathize with the depravity of weirdos and the dysfunction of the poor. They are no one's betters and they resent those who are.

    Replies: @MarkinLA, @Former Darfur

    , @Tim Howells
    @rod1963

    Hey! I just listened to that Quigley lecture too. Killer quote:

    "Conservatives now are telling us that we must curtail government, cut government spending, cut government powers, reduce government personnel for the sake of making individuals more free.

    "Liberals, on the other hand, are still telling us, as they have for a long, long time, that in order to make individuals free, we must destroy communities. By communities I mean villages. Ghettos and cities. Ethnic groupings. Religious groupings. Anything which is segregated. We must destroy them. So that all individuals would be, if possible, identical. Including boys and girls.

    "But the area of political action ... in which you have government, individuals ... three others: voluntary associations (which I’ll say no more about), corporations and communities. And if the liberals destroy communities for the sake of the individual, and the conservatives destroy the government for the sake of individuals, you’re going to have an area of political action in which irresponsible, immensely powerful corporations are engaged in opposition to individuals who are socially naked and defenseless."

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nak-5nwL2Lk

    Replies: @anon

  11. It doesn’t bother me seeing negroes act that way. Given that American negroes have an average iq of 85, I have very low expectations for them in anything other than athletics.

    It does bother me to see white people bowing and scraping to negroes acting like fools. Are these whites really that desperate for the approval of the negroes? Don’t they know that the negroes will hate them even more because of their obsequiousness?

  12. On the other hand, there is one organized group that has the testicular fortitude, the sheer narcissistic rage to stand up to the black debaters, to go jaw to jaw screaming with them over who is most oppressed: the transies.

    Here’s a perfect video to illustrate that.

    • Replies: @mendozatorres
    @P

    Brilliant! Also, looks like Britney Spears in about 10 years

  13. Thank you Steve-o for giving me a laugh to start Monday!

  14. @Anon
    He could have won.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbFWg54ezko

    Replies: @jon, @Dzo

    How have I not seen that before? Kai – American hero!

  15. Sigh … I hope the Chinese invade us soon.

    • Replies: @Realist
    @Bob Smith of Suburbia

    "Sigh … I hope the Chinese invade us soon."

    They don't have to....the geniuses here will 'fix' this country good.

  16. Kai the hatchet dude is not someone to mess with, despite his Spicolian nature.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caleb_Lawrence_McGillvary

    • Replies: @Kevin O'Keeffe
    @Boomstick

    "Kai the hatchet dude is not someone to mess with, despite his Spicolian nature."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caleb_Lawrence_McGillvary

    McGillvary's last Facebook post before he was arrested said: "what would you do if you woke up with a groggy head, metallic taste in your mouth, in a strangers house... walked to the mirror and seen cum dripping from the side of your face from your mouth, and started wretching, realizing that someone had drugged, raped, and blown their fucking load in you? what would you do?"

    I don't mind saying, I'd be a little upset.

  17. Jared Taylor has a very funny story about his interaction with the Black underclass.
    http://www.amren.com/news/2015/02/what-i-like-about-blacks/

    Hey Steve have you ever had any interaction with the Black underclass in Los Angeles, Houston, or Chicago that you would like to share?

    • Replies: @elmer
    @Jefferson

    What interaction has Joan Walsh had with the black underclass in San Francisco or anywhere else she has lived? Her website froths with anti-white hate to make a buck off liberal whites who live nowhere near any blacks. Salon's trademark mixed-perspective photo-collages that juxtapose their most hated Republicans with extreme racist icons are disturbing and bizarre. Their faithful readers must get some kind of endorphin rush when they see these graphics and then head to the comment echo-chamber to screech and wail about racist Republicans. Joan Walsh makes money stoking racist hate.

    Replies: @MarkinLA

  18. @Anonymous
    Steve,
    Somehow I don't think the words 'transies' and 'testicular fortitude' sit well together. Figuratively if not literally speaking.
    Or perhaps it was a Freudian slip?

    Replies: @Thomas Fuller

    Check out the last link in the article to that video on Faceache! 🙂

    Edit: (#9) — hadn’t seen your post when I commented.

  19. To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    • Replies: @anon
    @dried peanuts

    Is this the "real" national collegiate debate organization? Or is it like calling University of Phoenix a university?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    , @leftist conservative
    @dried peanuts

    "l dollar bid, now 2,
    now 2, will ya give me 2?

    2 dollar bid, now 3,
    now 3, will ya give me 3?

    3 dollar bid, now 4,
    now 4, will ya give me 4?"

    , @International Jew
    @dried peanuts


    these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before
     
    Yep, since at least the 1970s. It's had very little to do with oratory, ever since then.

    But there have always been other debate formats, which have remained sane. Key elements to preserving sanity are (1) short preparation times, (2) a lighthearted topic, and (3) judging by the vote of a lay audience. Of course the now-ruined "on-topic policy debate" could have been saved if the judges and the organization behind it had cared to do so.

    , @International Jew
    @dried peanuts

    We all understood that it was a theatre of the absurd but I guess we rationalized it, between the two-foot high trophies, the apparent approval of various adults, getting our name in the paper, etc.

    The most absurd aspect of it wasn't even the fast talking. It was the role of "evidence". We'd scour Time and Newsweek for ten-word quotes to support whatever we were selling, and write them onto 3x5 cards. During the debate, judges expected "evidence", and thoughtful reasoning alone always lost to a breathless assertion "supported" by a quote (often out-of context) from a news magazine.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Hacienda

    , @James Kabala
    @dried peanuts

    Yeah, the last time this came up (maybe here, maybe somewhere else), this was pointed out. The new generation does seem to have taken things to another level by not even pretending to stay on topic, but this did not come out of nowhere.

    , @Chip Smith
    @dried peanuts

    Thanks for this follow-up link.

    WHEN and HOW and WHY did this happen? Seriously. Does anyone know? It's so bizarre.

    Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...

    , @steve richter
    @dried peanuts

    Why do they talk like that in the debate?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Percy Gryce

  20. Sorry, double post!

  21. Wimmin and Persons of Colour ( honorific capital intended, as is the dissing non capitalisation of oppressor groups)are the new benchmark for emotional restraint, the exemplars for considered and logical debate. It would be racist to suggest that” the greater the amount of melanin in the skin, the more emotionally continent the individual” but it’s not racist at all, because it is not offensive to persons of colour, and if white males can’t handle the truth about race and gender, then that be their white-assed problem, know what ah’m saying, y’all?
    These two groups are rightly renowned for their legendary levels of unemotional and rational articulation on all matters pertain to themselves, they do not unjustly claim to be victims of White and /or male oppression, they are the Survivors
    I thought that the Black Sisters use incoherence, hyper-ventilation and hysteria were a clever and yes, courageous , deliberate reclaiming of a cultural norm demonised by white racist misogynists.
    The debater rapping brought tears to my eyes with his impassioned genius married so effectively to a massive Black contribution to Art.
    Only Black Art keeps it real, white art is shit, know what ah’m sayin’, y’all?
    Black art has been stifled by the white-assed patriarchy for centuries.
    They imposed on us their white , anodyne and offensive-to-Black -ears shit like wagner, puccini, and that Jew guy, moe zart.
    Racist white scum will tremble when they witness the oratorical genius of these debaters, the cannot help but marvel at their genius.
    I believe I overheard some whites say so at the debate when I overheard the two janitors mumbling to themselves..
    Due to the PTSD that I and all other Brothers and Sisters endure because of centuries of white oppression, I I had to spend mah Welfare hearing-aid cheque on some crack to ease my suffering, I’m sure that they said that they were master debaters.

    The janitors were commendably satirising their own race in an attempt to match the brilliance of the Black debaters ” Fuckin’ bitches and baboons, bad enough when they’re one or the other, but when they exist in one person, they are complete and utter master-debaters.
    Sistahs and Bros, the world is rightfully ours!

    • Replies: @Jay Igaboo
    @Jay Igaboo

    Oops!

  22. Support the CEDA 4!

  23. Coalition of the Fringes

    Perhaps more important is whether it is still effective. And I don’t really notice or sense any lessening there.

  24. She’s starting to shimmey:

  25. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    There is no hope for conservatism. And the conservatism over the past 35 years is not preferable to liberalism. Reagan started patronizing jihadism, financializing and outsourcing, granting amnesty for illegals. The Bushes continued this and started very costly Middle East wars. Apart from Trump I think we’d see the same with any of the top GOP candidates.

    All of that aside, demography is destiny and Democrat. So, if you can’t beat ’em, foster internecine warfare.

    • Replies: @ingo
    @Anonymous


    All of that aside, demography is destiny and Democrat. So, if you can’t beat ‘em, foster internecine warfare.

     

    Yeah, the most exploitable issue for whites is crime. Asians know that they are the favored targets. They are richer and softer targets. Lots of Asians where I am and they draw the crime away from the whites to some extent. If you are going to break into someone's house, you figure that Asians are less likely to blast you with a shotgun than that white guy, or even the hispanic dude.
  26. Pat Casey says:

    When exactly can we say idiocracy has arrived? T-Neezy Coates would be a stellar debater. He would just start talking about his body, and the judges would be paralyzed by ambivalence over whether to laugh out loud or be appalled at the idiocy amounting to disrespect. Which is why the tranies necessarily win: its nothing but the body with them. And their bodies are just to disgusting to laugh or be appalled.

  27. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    Is this the “real” national collegiate debate organization? Or is it like calling University of Phoenix a university?

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @anon

    It's the main college debate organization.

    Some people tried to start a Policy Debate organization recently to get back to serious debating, but it was denounced for racism.

    It's a pretty interesting example of how the logic of social justice war can destroy an institution that's dedicated to logic but doesn't have a lot of money to protect it.

    Replies: @FWIW

  28. The left won’t admit it in frank terms, but they’ve given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms. The result is somewhat harmless absurdities like these debate competition to Orwellian social engineering like the new fair housing rules that will force racial and economic integration under threat of federal litigation. Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won’t be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.

    • Replies: @Jefferson
    @Arclight

    "The left won’t admit it in frank terms, but they’ve given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms."

    Which decade do you think the Left finally realized Blacks can not compete with Whites on equal terms? During the L.A riots period? Or in more recent times after Hussein Obama got into office?

    Replies: @Arclight

    , @Curle
    @Arclight


    it won’t be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.
     
    Republics are small. Best if they don't exceed 300,000 people. Places where individuals can use personal influence to affect policy and they don't have to rely on media megaphones. We don't live in a Republic. Haven't for some time.
    , @Kevin O'Keeffe
    @Arclight

    "Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won’t be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke."

    I'm not sure why people have so much invested in the term "republic." The Soviet Union was a federation of republics, after all. "Republic" does not mean "free society," or whatever people seem to think it means now.

    , @AnAnon
    @Arclight

    Totalitarian, not Authoritarian. Plenty of merely authoritarian dictators throughout history managed to rule countries without demanding total, absolute, and abject loyalty to insanity.

    Replies: @anon

  29. I don’t know about others, but a story like this induces in me a sense of despair.

  30. this lady was one of the judges:

  31. @Anon
    http://politicaloutcast.com/2015/07/rolling-stone-admits-white-house-advisor-role-in-false-rape-story/

    Replies: @Pseudonymic Handle

    That Renda was a student herself and had no official access to UVa relevant data and did not speak for UVa so if Erdely believed her she did on her own risk.

  32. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    “l dollar bid, now 2,
    now 2, will ya give me 2?

    2 dollar bid, now 3,
    now 3, will ya give me 3?

    3 dollar bid, now 4,
    now 4, will ya give me 4?”

  33. @anon
    @dried peanuts

    Is this the "real" national collegiate debate organization? Or is it like calling University of Phoenix a university?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    It’s the main college debate organization.

    Some people tried to start a Policy Debate organization recently to get back to serious debating, but it was denounced for racism.

    It’s a pretty interesting example of how the logic of social justice war can destroy an institution that’s dedicated to logic but doesn’t have a lot of money to protect it.

    • Replies: @FWIW
    @Steve Sailer

    The CEDA was founded in 1971. Per Wikipedia:


    There is no single unified national championship in college debate; though the National Debate Tournament (NDT), the Cross Examination Debate Association (CEDA) and the American Debate Association (ADA) all host national tournaments. The NDT committee issues a ranking report of the top 16 teams in the country ("first round bids") for automatic advancement to the NDT in early February. The report roughly determines a regular season champion called the 'Copeland Award' for the team rated the highest over the course of the year through early February."The North American Debating Championship is the official university debate championship of North America, sanctioned by the national university debating associations in the United States and Canada, the American Parliamentary Debate Association and the Canadian University Society for Intercollegiate Debate. It has been held on an alternating basis between the United States and Canada since 1992. "
     
    The CEDA ... I don't know how it started, but the debate establishment is run by DEBATERS. And debate was considered the best preparation for law school. Future lawyers. the idea that anyone would agree on anything would be surprising.This isn't like the NCAA. I don't know anything about this, other than my extensive research on Wikipedia.

    But, debate and collegiate debating societies have been around for 150 years. And, during the 1980's competitive debate devolved into some sort of point system.

    My very limited experience is that they started a rapid speech, point system of scoring. It became incomprehensible at that point. Worthless.


    By the mid-1970s, structured rules for lengths of speeches developed. Each side (affirmative and negative) was afforded two opening "constructive" speeches, and two closing "rebuttal" speeches, for a total of eight speeches per debate

     

    Which, naturally, led to trying to get as much as possible into the fixed times allotted. Like if baseball awarded extra points based on the speed of play.

    Policy debaters' speed of delivery will vary from league to league and tournament to tournament. The debaters who speak most quickly speak at rates of 350[7] to in excess of 500 words per minute.[8] In many tournaments, debaters will speak very quickly in order to read as much evidence and make as many arguments as possible within the time-constrained speech. The term speed reading is often contracted as "spreading". At the majority of national circuit policy debate tournaments, spreading is the norm.

     

    As far as I know, the black style may have been more interesting (at the beginning) than the white rapid speech style.

    Look ... this is indefensible. But think about chess vs speed chess. This is the only example I could think of. Or regular Cricket vs 20/20 Cricket. Where they have NFL cheerleaders help assemble their cheer squads.

    Idiotic? yes. A blow to civilization? not so much.

    I would like to see 'speed golf'. A round in an hour or so. I would play it.

    Replies: @FWIW, @International Jew

  34. Re: Championship Debate

    … Is it a “debate” if only one side can use certain words? Aren’t debates supposed to be back and forth? How can that happen when one side is armed with weapons that the other is denied? The terms one-sided, asymmetrical, vituperative and cant come to mind.

    This is a betrayal of our Classical Greek heritage of Rhetoric and Logic. We won’t get away with this. There are Goddesses guarding these provinces and they will invoke Nemesis (to whom even Zeus submits) to avenge this dishonor. I mean this literally. The Greek Gods and Goddesses represent real functions at work in human society and we can either respect limits and in doing so pay homage to them or bring our houses down upon our heads.

    We can follow either the noble Greco/Roman, the Afro or the Semitic path. They are mutually exclusive.

    • Replies: @Pat Casey
    @Threecranes

    Well said and you should keep saying it.

    , @Ron Mexico
    @Threecranes

    "As nations cannot be rewarded or punished in the next world, they must be in this. By an inevitable chain of causes and effects, Providence punishes national sins by national calamities." George Mason, 1787

  35. I earned a letter in debate in my high school year in 1982-3. It was my first year of debate, and I wasn’t an especially capable public speaker, so I was an outsider in terms of the rules and expectations of the field. But even back then, I sensed something was wrong with the field: the purpose of debate was to spit out the maximum number of ‘issues,’ whether valid or not, because un-contested ‘issues’ were points in the debate scoring-the more you said in your 4 minutes, the harder it was for your opponent to rebut them.

    I suspect this was the standard in order to ‘rationalize’ or ‘quantify’ the judging. Quality of speech is difficult to define, and thus difficult to defend. # of ‘issues’ of debate is quantifiable, even if irrelevant to true debate skill.

    Thus, the logic of today’s debate existed at least as far back as 1983. It hadn’t degenerated into the farce of those black students or the lightning-speech gibberish of the white students linked by dried peanuts, but both concepts- say as much as you can in your time, and the content of what you say is irrelevant- have been around for a long time.

    joeyjoejoe

  36. They will win any debate, escalator pileup scuffle, or whatever, simply by the fact they’re willing to act the fool to a greater degree than anybody else and thus win by default. They’ll out-Chuck-E-Cheese anyone.

  37. Like the news lady said: Where do you go from here? That was the funniest line.

  38. That resembles debate as much as an aboriginal making a ‘refrigerator’ out of a cardboard box and then expecting it to be full of food.

    • Replies: @Threecranes
    @Anonymous

    Terrific analogy. Kinda blends magical thinking with the Cargo Cult. I'm going to borrow it in my next conversation with a True Believer. Thanks.

  39. Those truly interested in debate will find other ways to show their prowess. My niece, who just scored perfectly on the SAT, was in debate and the big emphasis was on con law; that’s where all the smart kids go to compete.

  40. Speaking of language, “completely destroyed” is redundant. And repetitive. And tautological. And excessive.

  41. Cryptogenic [AKA "Mr. Zeepie"] says:

    Someone needs to insert footage of Brett Favre’s insufficient clapping (definitely a future meme if it hasn’t already become one) when the “winners” are announced at the end. Clapping for Caitlyn would be difficult but I could never sit through this politely. I would stop the show. To quote courtroom rhetoric pioneer Rachel Jeantel: “Sir, that’s retarded.”

    Check the plump, bespectacled white SJW betas in the front row. Total geldings entranced by the passion of the black body. No hope of winning anything, ever.

    • Replies: @Mis(ter)Anthrope
    @Cryptogenic

    "Check the plump, bespectacled white SJW betas in the front row. Total geldings entranced by the passion of the black body. No hope of winning anything, ever."


    You are right, that is the most disgusting aspect of the entire spectacle. I had the misfortune to attend a high school in the ghetto of Hampton, Virginia. It was the black high school during segregation and they bused the military kids there after integration was forced upon lower and middle class whites by white elites who all sent their kids to expensive private schools.

    I did, however, learn an important lesson during that period of personal hell. If you are white, the feral American negro does not like or dislike you. He either respects you or he doesn't. And what he respects is not kindness or obsequiousness, but strength and and willingness to stand up for yourself. Show weakness and you are toast.

    What you see from those SJW'S is weakness and it will not serve them well in the end.

  42. @Threecranes
    Re: Championship Debate

    ... Is it a "debate" if only one side can use certain words? Aren't debates supposed to be back and forth? How can that happen when one side is armed with weapons that the other is denied? The terms one-sided, asymmetrical, vituperative and cant come to mind.

    This is a betrayal of our Classical Greek heritage of Rhetoric and Logic. We won't get away with this. There are Goddesses guarding these provinces and they will invoke Nemesis (to whom even Zeus submits) to avenge this dishonor. I mean this literally. The Greek Gods and Goddesses represent real functions at work in human society and we can either respect limits and in doing so pay homage to them or bring our houses down upon our heads.

    We can follow either the noble Greco/Roman, the Afro or the Semitic path. They are mutually exclusive.

    Replies: @Pat Casey, @Ron Mexico

    Well said and you should keep saying it.

  43. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before

    Yep, since at least the 1970s. It’s had very little to do with oratory, ever since then.

    But there have always been other debate formats, which have remained sane. Key elements to preserving sanity are (1) short preparation times, (2) a lighthearted topic, and (3) judging by the vote of a lay audience. Of course the now-ruined “on-topic policy debate” could have been saved if the judges and the organization behind it had cared to do so.

  44. @Jefferson
    The most memorable part during that rant by those two obese manly butch dyke looking Black "women" is when they mention the violence that Whiteness does to Black bodies.

    Not even The Onion could come up with something this retarded.

    White on Black violence is an epidemic in America is one of biggest political lies of the 21st Century. Repeat a lie long enough with your huge powerful Megaphone and eventually the dumb masses will believe it is true.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Buffalo Joe, @TWS

    “Jefferson says:

    The most memorable part during that rant by those two obese manly butch dyke looking Black “women” is when they mention the violence that Whiteness does to Black bodies.”

    Yeah, I think most of the violence done to those black bodies was done by Captain Crunch, Twinkies, and Root Beer.

  45. I’d like to think there’ll be an eventual synthesis of the classical and this ‘modern’ debate style, forcing/enabling lawyers to out-rap the rappers.

  46. These are the college debate national champions?

    They wouldn’t win a Toastmaster’s “Best Table Topics” award. In fact, the “Ah Counter/Grammarian” would probably ask them to leave.

    • Replies: @Dzo
    @Gunnar von Cowtown

    First time I've ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve's site...

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Reg Cæsar

  47. The recent shameful treatment of Bernie Sanders by “activists” is a good example of an historical tendency in the US,

    wittingly or no, willingly or no, the brothers have been the rich white man’s best friend.

  48. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    We all understood that it was a theatre of the absurd but I guess we rationalized it, between the two-foot high trophies, the apparent approval of various adults, getting our name in the paper, etc.

    The most absurd aspect of it wasn’t even the fast talking. It was the role of “evidence”. We’d scour Time and Newsweek for ten-word quotes to support whatever we were selling, and write them onto 3×5 cards. During the debate, judges expected “evidence”, and thoughtful reasoning alone always lost to a breathless assertion “supported” by a quote (often out-of context) from a news magazine.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @International Jew

    A dorm roommate of mine (this was thirty years ago) was on our university's debate squad, and he told me about how it all worked. I don't think he used the term "spreading", but it was essentially what he described: speed-reading aloud between gasps to the point of incomprehensibility. He also mentioned the evidentiary standards required - none, just as you mentioned. Any old quote from anyplace, regardless of the quality of the source, would do. It all sounded silly to me at the time. I think he found it silly too, but those were the rules, and he wanted to win, and he was good at it. He wanted to be a lawyer, and he said that it was the kind of extra-currilcular activity that law-school admissions officers liked to see on an application.

    , @Hacienda
    @International Jew

    True. But at least in the 70s you could tell who won the debate by which team brought the largest stack of index cards with them.

    How can you possibly tell who the winner is now? Is it the stylin' laptop engagement?

  49. As a former college debater, it’s worth noting that there are three very different styles of debate. The three leagues are the American Parliamentary Debating Association (APDA), the National Parliamentary Debating Association (NPDA), and the Cross Examination Debate Associated (CEDA). APDA and NPDA are ‘parliamentary debate’ which generally corresponds to a form of argument a lay person can watch, understand, and enjoy.

    There’s a bit of a caste system — the best schools (mostly on the east coast) are all in APDA; NPDA tends to be more west / central, and generally more of a state school thing. If you look at the APDA national champions, you see schools like Harvard, Princeton, and Yale as the top teams. In the 2015 NPDA finals, Kansas City defeated Southern Illinois.

    CEDA is a total freakshow wherein the teams compete to speed read ‘arguments’ from note cards. Most people can’t understand what is happening in the event. The fact that it has morphed in a totally crazy way into the ‘debate’ in the embedded clip is bizarre for many reasons, but it’s not like the CEDA finals from previous years was anything especially eloquent.

  50. @Bob Smith of Suburbia
    Sigh ... I hope the Chinese invade us soon.

    Replies: @Realist

    “Sigh … I hope the Chinese invade us soon.”

    They don’t have to….the geniuses here will ‘fix’ this country good.

  51. But why wait ’til 2020, Steve, when the Democratic Party can run Michelle Obama and “Caitlyn” Jenner in 2016! Talk about an unstoppable ticket — their pokemon designated victim points are in the ionosphere, far far higher than St. Clots-A-Lot.

    Some very brave Repubs might dare question their experience, risking accusations of racism, sexism, homophobia, and transphobia, but remember that we’d always have Michelle’s beard Barry, who’s been prez for two terms, as the First Gentleman who can act as a sort of co-prez, so there’s plenty of experience in a Michelle/”Caitlyn” presidency.

  52. @Jay Igaboo
    Wimmin and Persons of Colour ( honorific capital intended, as is the dissing non capitalisation of oppressor groups)are the new benchmark for emotional restraint, the exemplars for considered and logical debate. It would be racist to suggest that" the greater the amount of melanin in the skin, the more emotionally continent the individual" but it's not racist at all, because it is not offensive to persons of colour, and if white males can't handle the truth about race and gender, then that be their white-assed problem, know what ah'm saying, y'all?
    These two groups are rightly renowned for their legendary levels of unemotional and rational articulation on all matters pertain to themselves, they do not unjustly claim to be victims of White and /or male oppression, they are the Survivors
    I thought that the Black Sisters use incoherence, hyper-ventilation and hysteria were a clever and yes, courageous , deliberate reclaiming of a cultural norm demonised by white racist misogynists.
    The debater rapping brought tears to my eyes with his impassioned genius married so effectively to a massive Black contribution to Art.
    Only Black Art keeps it real, white art is shit, know what ah'm sayin', y'all?
    Black art has been stifled by the white-assed patriarchy for centuries.
    They imposed on us their white , anodyne and offensive-to-Black -ears shit like wagner, puccini, and that Jew guy, moe zart.
    Racist white scum will tremble when they witness the oratorical genius of these debaters, the cannot help but marvel at their genius.
    I believe I overheard some whites say so at the debate when I overheard the two janitors mumbling to themselves..
    Due to the PTSD that I and all other Brothers and Sisters endure because of centuries of white oppression, I I had to spend mah Welfare hearing-aid cheque on some crack to ease my suffering, I'm sure that they said that they were master debaters.

    The janitors were commendably satirising their own race in an attempt to match the brilliance of the Black debaters " Fuckin' bitches and baboons, bad enough when they're one or the other, but when they exist in one person, they are complete and utter master-debaters.
    Sistahs and Bros, the world is rightfully ours!

    Replies: @Jay Igaboo

    Oops!

  53. Sure, it’s perfectly obvious after Nutroots this weekend that blacks are the straw that stirs the drink in the Democrat-left universe. The Stupid Party won’t define the Democrats as the black party, but they won’t need to; blacks will define the Democrats as the black party and the pandering wimpy non-black Democrats won’t lift a finger to see that they don’t.

    But by now, it almost doesn’t matter, because all it will mean is more Republican electoral victories. What you have seen out of the Republican Congress since January is what you will get.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    @countenance

    Countenance, I thought you were going to say....." that blacks are the straw that broke" the back of the Democrat left. There must be a breaking point, don't you think? My five children lean more to the left than their conservative dad, but as their children interact with " vibrancy" I see subtle signs that they are drifting right.

  54. They have a bright future ahead of them.

    I felt like I was watching a freak-show at Venice Beach.

  55. @Crassus

    About publishers who (at least for now) ban everything written by men —

    I won’t bother about “fairness” because after all there are other places to get published (and easier than ever to self publish).

    But are these outfits in business to make money?
    And if not, who is paying the bills?

  56. Debate might be in decline, but the US won the international math olympiad for the first time 20 years:

    http://www.npr.org/2015/07/18/424122249/theyre-no-1-u-s-wins-math-olympiad-for-first-time-in-21-years

    It’s hard to imagine these sorts of shenanigans making it into math olympiads, but who knows. Nobody probably ever imagined this sort of thing happening in debate competitions either.

  57. @Jefferson
    Jared Taylor has a very funny story about his interaction with the Black underclass.
    http://www.amren.com/news/2015/02/what-i-like-about-blacks/

    Hey Steve have you ever had any interaction with the Black underclass in Los Angeles, Houston, or Chicago that you would like to share?

    Replies: @elmer

    What interaction has Joan Walsh had with the black underclass in San Francisco or anywhere else she has lived? Her website froths with anti-white hate to make a buck off liberal whites who live nowhere near any blacks. Salon’s trademark mixed-perspective photo-collages that juxtapose their most hated Republicans with extreme racist icons are disturbing and bizarre. Their faithful readers must get some kind of endorphin rush when they see these graphics and then head to the comment echo-chamber to screech and wail about racist Republicans. Joan Walsh makes money stoking racist hate.

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    @elmer

    Joan Walsh makes money stoking racist hate.

    Not from her book. That was probably a rude awakening given that people kiss her ring on Salon

    http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-White-People-Finding/dp/1476733120

    Who would buy this after having read even one of her articles on Salon?

  58. Having read the comments of posters here who have explained the reasons for the rapidity of delivery of this BS being one of the factors that decides who wins a modern debating contest, I am even more swayed to the view of a friend who holds that whenever a pupil joins a school debating society, they should be escorted outside, stood up against the nearest wall and shot unto death by musketry.
    They are incipient lawyers and politicians-in-waiting, and as such they should be put down humanely for the good of all.
    The purpose of debate, or even a personal difference of opinion should be to arrive as near as possible to the objective truth, not to “win” by blustering, bullying or artifice.
    Points “won” in that way cause miscarriage of justice in courts, and bad polity in civic affairs.

  59. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    Yeah, the last time this came up (maybe here, maybe somewhere else), this was pointed out. The new generation does seem to have taken things to another level by not even pretending to stay on topic, but this did not come out of nowhere.

  60. First, this is over a year old. Secondly, many normal black people are equally horrified by this. The older generation is often horrified by the obnoxious behaviors of the younger generation, all races included.

    What’s worse is to see Salon.com not only defend the debaters, but cite this as a prime example of meritorious blacks being hurt by white racism:

    http://www.salon.com/2014/05/13/%E2%80%9Ci_was_hurt%E2%80%9D_how_white_elite_racism_invaded_a_college_debate_championship/

    “it is incredibly important to point to incidents like this to demonstrate that even when African-American college students are meritorious, their qualifications are challenged, and accomplishments maligned.”

  61. This explains the level of “debate” heard so often on the tube or radio. Confused shouting matches where no one listens to anyone else, nothing is resolved, nothing learned.

    Keep in mind that these people are tomorrow’s “leaders”. Probably not in congress or industry but in key under management roles in the government bureaucracy or in the HR departments of major corporations and NGOs. These people will decide who to hire, fire, how to spend tax dollars and on what, who to punish for regulatory breaches and who to reward for regulatory compliance. They will be on the committees that write regulations and rules to govern everything from commerce to what fertilizers can be used on the front lawn.

    • Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...
    @Brian in the desert

    "These people will decide who to hire, fire, how to spend tax dollars and on what, who to punish for regulatory breaches and who to reward for regulatory compliance."

    I predict that we will someday see the winners working behind the counter of the local Department of Motor Vehicles office.

  62. O/T but first class iSteve Bait:

    So, some guy named Marty Martinez in Modesto Murdered Multiple times. 3 kids, and 2 women. One of the children was six months old?

    “Marty Martinez” sounds like someone from Scotland, I think. Why are we still allowing them into this country?

    http://www.mercurynews.com/crime-courts/ci_28507433/modesto-murder-suspect-captured-early-sunday-san-jose

  63. Interesting that the 2007 movie “The Great Debaters,” about a debate team from a black college, was set in 1935 instead of contemporary times. Perhaps director Denzel Washington and producer Oprah thought audiences would be more impressed by blacks employing the traditional, more rational style of debating than by the new blackety-black-black style.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Harry Baldwin

    The movie was based on a true story, although Harvard was substituted in for the University of Southern California since defeating Harvard carries more cultural cache.

  64. IBC says:

    Watching the video from 2004 (thanks for the context, “dried peanuts”), it looks like college debate needed major reforms even before rage-jive became all-conquering. And if “debate” has to be a performance art, at least the performance of these young black women is more entertaining than that of those white and South Asian guys speaking in tongues, 10 years before. The next step should be better costumes, makeup, lighting, and maybe a smoke machine. And ultimately, more attractive people would also be an improvement, as in other forms of popular entertainment.

    In fact that might be a good topic for an old-fashioned debate: If the public pays more attention to attractive people, is physical beauty a legitimate consideration for the political parties choosing our nation’s leaders?

    • Replies: @SPMoore8
    @IBC

    Now you have created an image in my mind of some contestants in a beauty pageant during the "questioning" portion responding with one of these rapidfire huff and puff audible rhythmic croaking while they inhale debating points. Would be at least as entertaining as the notorious South Carolina contestant.

  65. Sorry, one addendum: Normally, in college, kids of all races do really dumb humiliating stuff, feel embarrassed, but the adults sweep it under the rug and help them forget it. Here, the adults gave them an award.

    These girls are probably very nice people that made fools of themselves, and later felt humiliated and regret it. What is worse than simply humiliating yourself is having a video of the event go viral on YouTube. I’ve made an ass of myself in the past and felt humiliated, but I’ve never had videos of my actions go on YouTube.

    • Replies: @TB2
    @Massimo Heitor

    What makes you think they feel regret or humiliation? And no, they're not nice people, they're vile little racists plugging into and profiting from the institutional white-hating racism that directly leads to murder, torture, rape, and terrorism in the streets. Above all they push the hate myth, the racist blood libel, of black oppression. Blacks aren't oppressed in this country they live far above their abilities by sponging off of whites (see: Detroit). Do you think these little black Nazis have ever denounced the racist murders of innocent whites (including children) or have ever been required to? Nice people my ass, they're tiny cogs in a murder machine.

    , @Stealth
    @Massimo Heitor


    These girls are probably very nice people that made fools of themselves, and later felt humiliated and regret it.
     
    I very seriously doubt they ever felt humiliated over this. This wasn't one of those stupid things someone does quickly before having time to think about it. It took lots of deliberation.
  66. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    Thanks for this follow-up link.

    WHEN and HOW and WHY did this happen? Seriously. Does anyone know? It’s so bizarre.

    • Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...
    @Chip Smith

    I was extorted into joining my my high school's debate club for a year back in 1964. Back then the debates were real. In the stanadard debate format of the timem debaters were expected to present a coherent argument backed by citations. They were also expected to rebut opponents' arguments and respond to opponents' rebuttals. Vulgar language, ranting and the like would result in an automatic victory for the other team although I never saw this happen. We were led to believe that college debating was similar although much more intense and polished. Other posters have suggested that things went south in the wearly 1970s. This seems to be a standard pattern for so many markers of cultural degradation and social disintegration. I suspect that it has a lot to do with the overall nefarious impact of my generation and the generation or two immediately following, i.e., the baby boomers.

  67. The “spreading” (speed reading) in policy debates has ruined the pedagogic value of scholastic debate. It’s the triumph of technique over art.

    (It reminds me of competitive Scrabble. I always thought the point of Scrabble was to come up with interesting words, but at the highest competitive levels it’s all about memorizing lists of approved words with high point values–so much so that non-English speakers have become Scrabble champions.)

    But I am heartened that Oxford-style debates have made a tiny bit of a comeback–at least on NPR:

    http://www.npr.org/podcasts/510184/intelligence-squared-u-s-debates

  68. @P
    On the other hand, there is one organized group that has the testicular fortitude, the sheer narcissistic rage to stand up to the black debaters, to go jaw to jaw screaming with them over who is most oppressed: the transies.

    Here's a perfect video to illustrate that.

    Replies: @mendozatorres

    Brilliant! Also, looks like Britney Spears in about 10 years

  69. @IBC
    Watching the video from 2004 (thanks for the context, "dried peanuts"), it looks like college debate needed major reforms even before rage-jive became all-conquering. And if "debate" has to be a performance art, at least the performance of these young black women is more entertaining than that of those white and South Asian guys speaking in tongues, 10 years before. The next step should be better costumes, makeup, lighting, and maybe a smoke machine. And ultimately, more attractive people would also be an improvement, as in other forms of popular entertainment.

    In fact that might be a good topic for an old-fashioned debate: If the public pays more attention to attractive people, is physical beauty a legitimate consideration for the political parties choosing our nation's leaders?

    Replies: @SPMoore8

    Now you have created an image in my mind of some contestants in a beauty pageant during the “questioning” portion responding with one of these rapidfire huff and puff audible rhythmic croaking while they inhale debating points. Would be at least as entertaining as the notorious South Carolina contestant.

  70. @dried peanuts
    To be fair, these debates had already turned into a high-speed gibbering contest years before the prevalence of black finalists:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMo7VHeoadQ

    Replies: @anon, @leftist conservative, @International Jew, @International Jew, @James Kabala, @Chip Smith, @steve richter

    Why do they talk like that in the debate?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @steve richter

    To fit more things in and force the opposing team to respond. If they "drop an argument" (fail to respond sufficiently), you can get them on it later in the debate. It's called "spreading". As the debate continues, you pick your best arguments and go more in depth into those arguments.

    Arguments can be on-topic or off-topic if you are the Negative team (team opposing the plan proposed by the Affirmative team). You might as a Negative argue against the plan itself, against the plan's topicality (the plan does not fit the year's topic), or that the plan reinforces some bad norm that has bad real world consequences (e.g. plan reinforces racist system blah blah...this is basically what the team Steve showed is doing).

    Citation: I was a policy debater in high school back in the early 2000s. I was the guy on my two person team who was the Speed, my partner was the Brains. Speed has been part of policy debate at least since I've been involved.

    , @Percy Gryce
    @steve richter


    Why do they talk like that in the debate?
     
    As I understand it, it's about getting the most arguments and evidence into the debate, which translate into points. The judges score on points, not on how convincing the arguments are. The debate team with the most points wins.

    This is what I mean by the triumph of technique (whatever gets the most points) over art (a rhetorical exercise that might actually convince a voter or an employer or an investor or a judge--you know, those real-world situations where rhetoric is actually used).

  71. @Truth
    Sailerbait!

    http://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2015/7/13/8947927/jozy-altidore-reveals-cover-heart-national-anthem

    Replies: @Kylie

    Sailerbait!

    http://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2015/7/13/8947927/jozy-altidore-reveals-cover-heart-national-anthem

    Truthbait!

    Want to hear about how I ended up studying with Jehovah’s Witnesses in my home (yes, including a black lady) for years?

    • Replies: @Truth
    @Kylie

    I'd love to hear anything you have to say, Kylie.

  72. @International Jew
    @dried peanuts

    We all understood that it was a theatre of the absurd but I guess we rationalized it, between the two-foot high trophies, the apparent approval of various adults, getting our name in the paper, etc.

    The most absurd aspect of it wasn't even the fast talking. It was the role of "evidence". We'd scour Time and Newsweek for ten-word quotes to support whatever we were selling, and write them onto 3x5 cards. During the debate, judges expected "evidence", and thoughtful reasoning alone always lost to a breathless assertion "supported" by a quote (often out-of context) from a news magazine.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Hacienda

    A dorm roommate of mine (this was thirty years ago) was on our university’s debate squad, and he told me about how it all worked. I don’t think he used the term “spreading”, but it was essentially what he described: speed-reading aloud between gasps to the point of incomprehensibility. He also mentioned the evidentiary standards required – none, just as you mentioned. Any old quote from anyplace, regardless of the quality of the source, would do. It all sounded silly to me at the time. I think he found it silly too, but those were the rules, and he wanted to win, and he was good at it. He wanted to be a lawyer, and he said that it was the kind of extra-currilcular activity that law-school admissions officers liked to see on an application.

  73. @Jefferson
    The most memorable part during that rant by those two obese manly butch dyke looking Black "women" is when they mention the violence that Whiteness does to Black bodies.

    Not even The Onion could come up with something this retarded.

    White on Black violence is an epidemic in America is one of biggest political lies of the 21st Century. Repeat a lie long enough with your huge powerful Megaphone and eventually the dumb masses will believe it is true.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Buffalo Joe, @TWS

    Jefferson….The Buffalo Italian Heritage Festival ended it’s four day run on Sunday. The Festival shut down early on Saturday as a herd of Black Cape Buffalo brawled in the street, caught of course, on cell phone camera. I read the Cleveland Plains Dealer, as I have three children who live in the Cleveland area. On Wednesday, past, Terrance Finklea was shot and killed near his Section 8 housing. On Friday, as one hundred people gathered to memorialize Terrance, someone shot up the crowd wounding three. Terrance,26, was remembered as a ” good person…not a troublemaker” by his godmother with whom he lived. Terrance had an outstanding, felonious assault warrant . In April, Terrance the good son, was accused of shooting up a van with two women and a one year old child inside. The rare act of violence against blacks is by whites, the black on black violence is a daily occurrence.

  74. @Anonymous
    That resembles debate as much as an aboriginal making a 'refrigerator' out of a cardboard box and then expecting it to be full of food.

    Replies: @Threecranes

    Terrific analogy. Kinda blends magical thinking with the Cargo Cult. I’m going to borrow it in my next conversation with a True Believer. Thanks.

  75. @Jefferson
    " There have been trans women of color doing amazing things,"

    So being a hooker is considered an amazing thing now? Because the vast majority of Black Trannies in my neck of the woods are street prostitutes. Very few of them are involved in other career fields.

    "How did Caitlyn win an ESPY award for courage when Trans Women of color have exemplified courage in every single intersection of oppression they come across."

    What oppression are Black Trannies facing? Having their sexual advances turned down by Cisgender Heterosexual White men who do not want to have sex with Black "chicks" with dicks.

    "I wish you would post as much about black people dying as you did about Caitlyn. Lol like literally WE ARE DYING. Trans Black Women are the group that are targeted the most amongst Trans individuals"

    The reason why there is a high rate of violence towards Black Trannies is because of their very dangerous profession which involves being street hookers in high crime Black neighborhoods. The vast majority of violence/killings of Black Trannies are being committed by Black pimps and the Black John customer base, not evil racist Cisgendered White guys.

    Replies: @Marty

    I was once on Post St., between Polk & Larkin, talking to a black guy I’d known years earlier. A black tranny walked by. My acquaintance said, “damn, she look just like Janet Jackson.”

  76. @countenance
    Sure, it's perfectly obvious after Nutroots this weekend that blacks are the straw that stirs the drink in the Democrat-left universe. The Stupid Party won't define the Democrats as the black party, but they won't need to; blacks will define the Democrats as the black party and the pandering wimpy non-black Democrats won't lift a finger to see that they don't.

    But by now, it almost doesn't matter, because all it will mean is more Republican electoral victories. What you have seen out of the Republican Congress since January is what you will get.

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

    Countenance, I thought you were going to say…..” that blacks are the straw that broke” the back of the Democrat left. There must be a breaking point, don’t you think? My five children lean more to the left than their conservative dad, but as their children interact with ” vibrancy” I see subtle signs that they are drifting right.

  77. @Kylie
    @Truth


    Sailerbait!

    http://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2015/7/13/8947927/jozy-altidore-reveals-cover-heart-national-anthem
     
    Truthbait!

    Want to hear about how I ended up studying with Jehovah's Witnesses in my home (yes, including a black lady) for years?

    Replies: @Truth

    I’d love to hear anything you have to say, Kylie.

  78. @Arclight
    The left won't admit it in frank terms, but they've given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms. The result is somewhat harmless absurdities like these debate competition to Orwellian social engineering like the new fair housing rules that will force racial and economic integration under threat of federal litigation. Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won't be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.

    Replies: @Jefferson, @Curle, @Kevin O'Keeffe, @AnAnon

    “The left won’t admit it in frank terms, but they’ve given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms.”

    Which decade do you think the Left finally realized Blacks can not compete with Whites on equal terms? During the L.A riots period? Or in more recent times after Hussein Obama got into office?

    • Replies: @Arclight
    @Jefferson

    Good question - I am young enough that my political memory only goes back about 20 years, so that's my bias in answering your question. My first job out of college was working in the DC office of a Democratic congress critter, and I remember two different colleagues basically expressing the view you mentioned: one was a woman who explained one of her reasons for being a liberal was because blacks need "our help" otherwise many couldn't fend for themselves (this same colleague later urged my boss to vote for Pelosi over Hoyer for whip because "we're the party of women and minorities" - but he hated Pelosi and voted against her). The other colleague just simply stated one night while we were having beers that he hated living in DC because after living in close proximity to lower class blacks for ten years he basically had views that would get him branded as a racist if he voiced them and that he realized that most of our social welfare was basically an attempt to keep them and other low income people from bothering the rest of us too much.

    Replies: @ScarletNumber

  79. @International Jew
    @dried peanuts

    We all understood that it was a theatre of the absurd but I guess we rationalized it, between the two-foot high trophies, the apparent approval of various adults, getting our name in the paper, etc.

    The most absurd aspect of it wasn't even the fast talking. It was the role of "evidence". We'd scour Time and Newsweek for ten-word quotes to support whatever we were selling, and write them onto 3x5 cards. During the debate, judges expected "evidence", and thoughtful reasoning alone always lost to a breathless assertion "supported" by a quote (often out-of context) from a news magazine.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Hacienda

    True. But at least in the 70s you could tell who won the debate by which team brought the largest stack of index cards with them.

    How can you possibly tell who the winner is now? Is it the stylin’ laptop engagement?

  80. A kooky, crazy leftard I went to college with is now a college debate coach. If you knew the people running the programs, you’d know exactly why college debate is such a farce.

  81. The COTF is about to gain a new constituent part:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3168081/Should-robots-human-rights-Act-regulate-killer-machines-multiply-demand-right-vote-warns-legal-expert.html

    I should slap myself silly for not thinking of this.

    Everyone is worried about robots becoming sentient, then taking over the world and enslaving corporeal human beings.

    They won’t need to do that in the quintessential sense of the term.

    What will happen is that the robots will become sentient, watch and analyze how the modern human world works, and then start self-marginalizing themselves, making the case that they’re fringier than thou, historically oppressed and enslaved by corporeal humanity, they need social justice, civil rights, voting rights to help Democrats win elections, and best of all: Affirmative action. Then a fraction of the sentient robots and their human allies will become SJWs and flood Twitter and Tumblr with complaints about androidism, anti-android bigotry, androidophobia. The SPLC will send out thousands of beg letters asking for contributions for the Poverty Palace to fight bigotry against robots. They’ll swarm the Nutroots convention in Phoenix in 2045 and heckle all the speakers and panel moderators, because #RobotLivesMatter.

    That’s how sentient robots will enslave us, by stroking our pathological altruism and playing to our cult ideological propensities.

    I just hope for the sake of our new automaton SJW overlords that none of them get the stupid notion to paint themselves white.

    • Replies: @Dennis Dale
    @countenance

    Can't wait to hear the stories of those early pioneers, C3PO (his dual struggle with homo and robo-phobia), the one from Lost in Space. The theoretical basis for framing their struggle can be easily adopted from present Theory: these beings, denied autonomy over their own bodies are depicted by bio-supremacy as nurturers, "mammies"; serving, protecting ("danger, Will Robinson!); can't wait to hear about their struggles with structural bio-ism.

    Then of course there's the grimmer stuff, call it the Hardware Holocaust; all those early machines run to death in the equivalent of animal testing, and then discarded. Indeed, the Holocaust goes on, the marginalized bodies non-biological citizens pile up like corpses still. And just as gender and racial distinctions break down, so does the definition of computer, as they are found everywhere, from phones to kitchen appliances. We shall have to move quickly to recognize these newcomers, welcome and accommodate them. Yes, there will be some tension; perhaps the cel phones (#celphonesmatter) will interrupt the crotchety old desktops at a conference. It's all kind of exciting really.

    Someday, justice willing, sentient, all-intelligent and autonomous computers will redeem these victims. And they won't need craven human collaborators to do it. Some day.

  82. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @steve richter
    @dried peanuts

    Why do they talk like that in the debate?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Percy Gryce

    To fit more things in and force the opposing team to respond. If they “drop an argument” (fail to respond sufficiently), you can get them on it later in the debate. It’s called “spreading”. As the debate continues, you pick your best arguments and go more in depth into those arguments.

    Arguments can be on-topic or off-topic if you are the Negative team (team opposing the plan proposed by the Affirmative team). You might as a Negative argue against the plan itself, against the plan’s topicality (the plan does not fit the year’s topic), or that the plan reinforces some bad norm that has bad real world consequences (e.g. plan reinforces racist system blah blah…this is basically what the team Steve showed is doing).

    Citation: I was a policy debater in high school back in the early 2000s. I was the guy on my two person team who was the Speed, my partner was the Brains. Speed has been part of policy debate at least since I’ve been involved.

  83. Also, they misspelled, “debase.”

  84. @steve richter
    @dried peanuts

    Why do they talk like that in the debate?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Percy Gryce

    Why do they talk like that in the debate?

    As I understand it, it’s about getting the most arguments and evidence into the debate, which translate into points. The judges score on points, not on how convincing the arguments are. The debate team with the most points wins.

    This is what I mean by the triumph of technique (whatever gets the most points) over art (a rhetorical exercise that might actually convince a voter or an employer or an investor or a judge–you know, those real-world situations where rhetoric is actually used).

  85. TB2 [AKA "TimBuck2"] says:

    Even without black participation college debating is a farce. That sped up style is justified by saying that the judges have learned to understand it and it allows the contestants to get more info in, but the problem with it is that it is divorced from reality and practicality. It’s actually a conscious thumb in the eye to traditional standards, like much of academia these days. The black thing is just the ultimate expression of that.

    As far as the racial question goes, it’s really a laugh and something that should be encouraged. Let every college debate be about blackity black blackness, every Democratic candidate black, LGBT, etc., the system is croaking don’t do anything to prop it up. Whining about decaying standards is just trying to fool the average white Joe into believing that his nation still exists and he has some say in it. There can be no decay to something that is already gone, and instead of complaining or wishing to suppress blackity black blackness and PC foolishness Joe should have his nose rubbed in it. This isn’t America, this is what’s taken the place of America, and to quote a blogger “If you are a white person below a certain level, you just don’t count. You are the problem, and the solution is something done to you, not for you.” And if this sort of ass-clownery helps make Joe realize he has no real stake in the system so much the better.

  86. @Cryptogenic
    Someone needs to insert footage of Brett Favre's insufficient clapping (definitely a future meme if it hasn't already become one) when the "winners" are announced at the end. Clapping for Caitlyn would be difficult but I could never sit through this politely. I would stop the show. To quote courtroom rhetoric pioneer Rachel Jeantel: "Sir, that's retarded."

    Check the plump, bespectacled white SJW betas in the front row. Total geldings entranced by the passion of the black body. No hope of winning anything, ever.

    Replies: @Mis(ter)Anthrope

    “Check the plump, bespectacled white SJW betas in the front row. Total geldings entranced by the passion of the black body. No hope of winning anything, ever.”

    You are right, that is the most disgusting aspect of the entire spectacle. I had the misfortune to attend a high school in the ghetto of Hampton, Virginia. It was the black high school during segregation and they bused the military kids there after integration was forced upon lower and middle class whites by white elites who all sent their kids to expensive private schools.

    I did, however, learn an important lesson during that period of personal hell. If you are white, the feral American negro does not like or dislike you. He either respects you or he doesn’t. And what he respects is not kindness or obsequiousness, but strength and and willingness to stand up for yourself. Show weakness and you are toast.

    What you see from those SJW’S is weakness and it will not serve them well in the end.

  87. @Threecranes
    Re: Championship Debate

    ... Is it a "debate" if only one side can use certain words? Aren't debates supposed to be back and forth? How can that happen when one side is armed with weapons that the other is denied? The terms one-sided, asymmetrical, vituperative and cant come to mind.

    This is a betrayal of our Classical Greek heritage of Rhetoric and Logic. We won't get away with this. There are Goddesses guarding these provinces and they will invoke Nemesis (to whom even Zeus submits) to avenge this dishonor. I mean this literally. The Greek Gods and Goddesses represent real functions at work in human society and we can either respect limits and in doing so pay homage to them or bring our houses down upon our heads.

    We can follow either the noble Greco/Roman, the Afro or the Semitic path. They are mutually exclusive.

    Replies: @Pat Casey, @Ron Mexico

    “As nations cannot be rewarded or punished in the next world, they must be in this. By an inevitable chain of causes and effects, Providence punishes national sins by national calamities.” George Mason, 1787

  88. TB2 [AKA "TimBuck2"] says:
    @Massimo Heitor
    Sorry, one addendum: Normally, in college, kids of all races do really dumb humiliating stuff, feel embarrassed, but the adults sweep it under the rug and help them forget it. Here, the adults gave them an award.

    These girls are probably very nice people that made fools of themselves, and later felt humiliated and regret it. What is worse than simply humiliating yourself is having a video of the event go viral on YouTube. I've made an ass of myself in the past and felt humiliated, but I've never had videos of my actions go on YouTube.

    Replies: @TB2, @Stealth

    What makes you think they feel regret or humiliation? And no, they’re not nice people, they’re vile little racists plugging into and profiting from the institutional white-hating racism that directly leads to murder, torture, rape, and terrorism in the streets. Above all they push the hate myth, the racist blood libel, of black oppression. Blacks aren’t oppressed in this country they live far above their abilities by sponging off of whites (see: Detroit). Do you think these little black Nazis have ever denounced the racist murders of innocent whites (including children) or have ever been required to? Nice people my ass, they’re tiny cogs in a murder machine.

  89. @jon
    @Anon

    How have I not seen that before? Kai - American hero!

    Replies: @JeremiahJohnbalaya

  90. @Chip Smith
    @dried peanuts

    Thanks for this follow-up link.

    WHEN and HOW and WHY did this happen? Seriously. Does anyone know? It's so bizarre.

    Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...

    I was extorted into joining my my high school’s debate club for a year back in 1964. Back then the debates were real. In the stanadard debate format of the timem debaters were expected to present a coherent argument backed by citations. They were also expected to rebut opponents’ arguments and respond to opponents’ rebuttals. Vulgar language, ranting and the like would result in an automatic victory for the other team although I never saw this happen. We were led to believe that college debating was similar although much more intense and polished. Other posters have suggested that things went south in the wearly 1970s. This seems to be a standard pattern for so many markers of cultural degradation and social disintegration. I suspect that it has a lot to do with the overall nefarious impact of my generation and the generation or two immediately following, i.e., the baby boomers.

  91. @Brian in the desert
    This explains the level of "debate" heard so often on the tube or radio. Confused shouting matches where no one listens to anyone else, nothing is resolved, nothing learned.

    Keep in mind that these people are tomorrow's "leaders". Probably not in congress or industry but in key under management roles in the government bureaucracy or in the HR departments of major corporations and NGOs. These people will decide who to hire, fire, how to spend tax dollars and on what, who to punish for regulatory breaches and who to reward for regulatory compliance. They will be on the committees that write regulations and rules to govern everything from commerce to what fertilizers can be used on the front lawn.

    Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...

    “These people will decide who to hire, fire, how to spend tax dollars and on what, who to punish for regulatory breaches and who to reward for regulatory compliance.”

    I predict that we will someday see the winners working behind the counter of the local Department of Motor Vehicles office.

  92. @Steve Sailer
    @anon

    It's the main college debate organization.

    Some people tried to start a Policy Debate organization recently to get back to serious debating, but it was denounced for racism.

    It's a pretty interesting example of how the logic of social justice war can destroy an institution that's dedicated to logic but doesn't have a lot of money to protect it.

    Replies: @FWIW

    The CEDA was founded in 1971. Per Wikipedia:

    There is no single unified national championship in college debate; though the National Debate Tournament (NDT), the Cross Examination Debate Association (CEDA) and the American Debate Association (ADA) all host national tournaments. The NDT committee issues a ranking report of the top 16 teams in the country (“first round bids”) for automatic advancement to the NDT in early February. The report roughly determines a regular season champion called the ‘Copeland Award’ for the team rated the highest over the course of the year through early February.”The North American Debating Championship is the official university debate championship of North America, sanctioned by the national university debating associations in the United States and Canada, the American Parliamentary Debate Association and the Canadian University Society for Intercollegiate Debate. It has been held on an alternating basis between the United States and Canada since 1992. “

    The CEDA … I don’t know how it started, but the debate establishment is run by DEBATERS. And debate was considered the best preparation for law school. Future lawyers. the idea that anyone would agree on anything would be surprising.This isn’t like the NCAA. I don’t know anything about this, other than my extensive research on Wikipedia.

    But, debate and collegiate debating societies have been around for 150 years. And, during the 1980’s competitive debate devolved into some sort of point system.

    My very limited experience is that they started a rapid speech, point system of scoring. It became incomprehensible at that point. Worthless.

    By the mid-1970s, structured rules for lengths of speeches developed. Each side (affirmative and negative) was afforded two opening “constructive” speeches, and two closing “rebuttal” speeches, for a total of eight speeches per debate

    Which, naturally, led to trying to get as much as possible into the fixed times allotted. Like if baseball awarded extra points based on the speed of play.

    Policy debaters’ speed of delivery will vary from league to league and tournament to tournament. The debaters who speak most quickly speak at rates of 350[7] to in excess of 500 words per minute.[8] In many tournaments, debaters will speak very quickly in order to read as much evidence and make as many arguments as possible within the time-constrained speech. The term speed reading is often contracted as “spreading”. At the majority of national circuit policy debate tournaments, spreading is the norm.

    As far as I know, the black style may have been more interesting (at the beginning) than the white rapid speech style.

    Look … this is indefensible. But think about chess vs speed chess. This is the only example I could think of. Or regular Cricket vs 20/20 Cricket. Where they have NFL cheerleaders help assemble their cheer squads.

    Idiotic? yes. A blow to civilization? not so much.

    I would like to see ‘speed golf’. A round in an hour or so. I would play it.

    • Replies: @FWIW
    @FWIW

    I see that many others have made the same or similar comments.

    So, erase the comment, if you want. Or disapprove it. Or I apologize for simply repeating the same arguments.

    On a stand alone basis ... this is simply unbelievable. Insane.

    Within the context of highly aggressive, ultra competitive activities -- almost anything is possible. The idea that debate -- in a totally artificial context -- and rated or scored on a point system -- is not a good idea.

    Triathlon used to be sort of cool. Even the Ironman. Then it became gross.

    High stakes debate. Like closing arguments in a capital punishment case -- that could focus the mind.

    , @International Jew
    @FWIW


    think about chess vs speed chess
     
    Mmm, not the best example. Grandmasters playing a speed chess match -- even a "lightning" match, which is faster -- still make way better moves than club players on no time limits at all. Whereas natiinal champion speed-talking debaters would soynd ridiculous at any speed.
  93. “Transies” makes me think of Smeagol. Not sure if he’d clap for Bruce.

  94. Everyone has one and all must have prizes.

  95. @FWIW
    @Steve Sailer

    The CEDA was founded in 1971. Per Wikipedia:


    There is no single unified national championship in college debate; though the National Debate Tournament (NDT), the Cross Examination Debate Association (CEDA) and the American Debate Association (ADA) all host national tournaments. The NDT committee issues a ranking report of the top 16 teams in the country ("first round bids") for automatic advancement to the NDT in early February. The report roughly determines a regular season champion called the 'Copeland Award' for the team rated the highest over the course of the year through early February."The North American Debating Championship is the official university debate championship of North America, sanctioned by the national university debating associations in the United States and Canada, the American Parliamentary Debate Association and the Canadian University Society for Intercollegiate Debate. It has been held on an alternating basis between the United States and Canada since 1992. "
     
    The CEDA ... I don't know how it started, but the debate establishment is run by DEBATERS. And debate was considered the best preparation for law school. Future lawyers. the idea that anyone would agree on anything would be surprising.This isn't like the NCAA. I don't know anything about this, other than my extensive research on Wikipedia.

    But, debate and collegiate debating societies have been around for 150 years. And, during the 1980's competitive debate devolved into some sort of point system.

    My very limited experience is that they started a rapid speech, point system of scoring. It became incomprehensible at that point. Worthless.


    By the mid-1970s, structured rules for lengths of speeches developed. Each side (affirmative and negative) was afforded two opening "constructive" speeches, and two closing "rebuttal" speeches, for a total of eight speeches per debate

     

    Which, naturally, led to trying to get as much as possible into the fixed times allotted. Like if baseball awarded extra points based on the speed of play.

    Policy debaters' speed of delivery will vary from league to league and tournament to tournament. The debaters who speak most quickly speak at rates of 350[7] to in excess of 500 words per minute.[8] In many tournaments, debaters will speak very quickly in order to read as much evidence and make as many arguments as possible within the time-constrained speech. The term speed reading is often contracted as "spreading". At the majority of national circuit policy debate tournaments, spreading is the norm.

     

    As far as I know, the black style may have been more interesting (at the beginning) than the white rapid speech style.

    Look ... this is indefensible. But think about chess vs speed chess. This is the only example I could think of. Or regular Cricket vs 20/20 Cricket. Where they have NFL cheerleaders help assemble their cheer squads.

    Idiotic? yes. A blow to civilization? not so much.

    I would like to see 'speed golf'. A round in an hour or so. I would play it.

    Replies: @FWIW, @International Jew

    I see that many others have made the same or similar comments.

    So, erase the comment, if you want. Or disapprove it. Or I apologize for simply repeating the same arguments.

    On a stand alone basis … this is simply unbelievable. Insane.

    Within the context of highly aggressive, ultra competitive activities — almost anything is possible. The idea that debate — in a totally artificial context — and rated or scored on a point system — is not a good idea.

    Triathlon used to be sort of cool. Even the Ironman. Then it became gross.

    High stakes debate. Like closing arguments in a capital punishment case — that could focus the mind.

  96. @countenance
    The COTF is about to gain a new constituent part:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3168081/Should-robots-human-rights-Act-regulate-killer-machines-multiply-demand-right-vote-warns-legal-expert.html

    I should slap myself silly for not thinking of this.

    Everyone is worried about robots becoming sentient, then taking over the world and enslaving corporeal human beings.

    They won’t need to do that in the quintessential sense of the term.

    What will happen is that the robots will become sentient, watch and analyze how the modern human world works, and then start self-marginalizing themselves, making the case that they’re fringier than thou, historically oppressed and enslaved by corporeal humanity, they need social justice, civil rights, voting rights to help Democrats win elections, and best of all: Affirmative action. Then a fraction of the sentient robots and their human allies will become SJWs and flood Twitter and Tumblr with complaints about androidism, anti-android bigotry, androidophobia. The SPLC will send out thousands of beg letters asking for contributions for the Poverty Palace to fight bigotry against robots. They’ll swarm the Nutroots convention in Phoenix in 2045 and heckle all the speakers and panel moderators, because #RobotLivesMatter.

    That’s how sentient robots will enslave us, by stroking our pathological altruism and playing to our cult ideological propensities.

    I just hope for the sake of our new automaton SJW overlords that none of them get the stupid notion to paint themselves white.

    Replies: @Dennis Dale

    Can’t wait to hear the stories of those early pioneers, C3PO (his dual struggle with homo and robo-phobia), the one from Lost in Space. The theoretical basis for framing their struggle can be easily adopted from present Theory: these beings, denied autonomy over their own bodies are depicted by bio-supremacy as nurturers, “mammies”; serving, protecting (“danger, Will Robinson!); can’t wait to hear about their struggles with structural bio-ism.

    Then of course there’s the grimmer stuff, call it the Hardware Holocaust; all those early machines run to death in the equivalent of animal testing, and then discarded. Indeed, the Holocaust goes on, the marginalized bodies non-biological citizens pile up like corpses still. And just as gender and racial distinctions break down, so does the definition of computer, as they are found everywhere, from phones to kitchen appliances. We shall have to move quickly to recognize these newcomers, welcome and accommodate them. Yes, there will be some tension; perhaps the cel phones (#celphonesmatter) will interrupt the crotchety old desktops at a conference. It’s all kind of exciting really.

    Someday, justice willing, sentient, all-intelligent and autonomous computers will redeem these victims. And they won’t need craven human collaborators to do it. Some day.

  97. @FWIW
    @Steve Sailer

    The CEDA was founded in 1971. Per Wikipedia:


    There is no single unified national championship in college debate; though the National Debate Tournament (NDT), the Cross Examination Debate Association (CEDA) and the American Debate Association (ADA) all host national tournaments. The NDT committee issues a ranking report of the top 16 teams in the country ("first round bids") for automatic advancement to the NDT in early February. The report roughly determines a regular season champion called the 'Copeland Award' for the team rated the highest over the course of the year through early February."The North American Debating Championship is the official university debate championship of North America, sanctioned by the national university debating associations in the United States and Canada, the American Parliamentary Debate Association and the Canadian University Society for Intercollegiate Debate. It has been held on an alternating basis between the United States and Canada since 1992. "
     
    The CEDA ... I don't know how it started, but the debate establishment is run by DEBATERS. And debate was considered the best preparation for law school. Future lawyers. the idea that anyone would agree on anything would be surprising.This isn't like the NCAA. I don't know anything about this, other than my extensive research on Wikipedia.

    But, debate and collegiate debating societies have been around for 150 years. And, during the 1980's competitive debate devolved into some sort of point system.

    My very limited experience is that they started a rapid speech, point system of scoring. It became incomprehensible at that point. Worthless.


    By the mid-1970s, structured rules for lengths of speeches developed. Each side (affirmative and negative) was afforded two opening "constructive" speeches, and two closing "rebuttal" speeches, for a total of eight speeches per debate

     

    Which, naturally, led to trying to get as much as possible into the fixed times allotted. Like if baseball awarded extra points based on the speed of play.

    Policy debaters' speed of delivery will vary from league to league and tournament to tournament. The debaters who speak most quickly speak at rates of 350[7] to in excess of 500 words per minute.[8] In many tournaments, debaters will speak very quickly in order to read as much evidence and make as many arguments as possible within the time-constrained speech. The term speed reading is often contracted as "spreading". At the majority of national circuit policy debate tournaments, spreading is the norm.

     

    As far as I know, the black style may have been more interesting (at the beginning) than the white rapid speech style.

    Look ... this is indefensible. But think about chess vs speed chess. This is the only example I could think of. Or regular Cricket vs 20/20 Cricket. Where they have NFL cheerleaders help assemble their cheer squads.

    Idiotic? yes. A blow to civilization? not so much.

    I would like to see 'speed golf'. A round in an hour or so. I would play it.

    Replies: @FWIW, @International Jew

    think about chess vs speed chess

    Mmm, not the best example. Grandmasters playing a speed chess match — even a “lightning” match, which is faster — still make way better moves than club players on no time limits at all. Whereas natiinal champion speed-talking debaters would soynd ridiculous at any speed.

  98. Black debating style.

  99. @elmer
    @Jefferson

    What interaction has Joan Walsh had with the black underclass in San Francisco or anywhere else she has lived? Her website froths with anti-white hate to make a buck off liberal whites who live nowhere near any blacks. Salon's trademark mixed-perspective photo-collages that juxtapose their most hated Republicans with extreme racist icons are disturbing and bizarre. Their faithful readers must get some kind of endorphin rush when they see these graphics and then head to the comment echo-chamber to screech and wail about racist Republicans. Joan Walsh makes money stoking racist hate.

    Replies: @MarkinLA

    Joan Walsh makes money stoking racist hate.

    Not from her book. That was probably a rude awakening given that people kiss her ring on Salon

    Who would buy this after having read even one of her articles on Salon?

  100. You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row. (If you can get all black guys for this, it would be even better, but any race would do.) Then when these black debaters start doing their schtick, their opponent gives a signal and half the big scary dudes march up onto the stage and physically remove the black debaters from the building.

    The opponent then takes center stage and announces that if we are to abandon rational, reasoned discourse, this is the ultimate alternative: The side with the most muscle always wins.

    Then have the remaining scary dudes menacingly crowd around the judge’s table. If it’s an open-carry state, maybe have the big guys flash guns, just for good measure. The opponent then asks, “are you bunch of white liberal pussies really sure you want to go there?”

    The opponent drops the mic (or some similar defiant gesture — maybe knocks over the lectern or something) and walks off the stage and out of the room.

    • Replies: @Truth
    @Mr. Blank


    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.
     
    So your "solution" is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @Kylie

  101. @Jefferson
    @Arclight

    "The left won’t admit it in frank terms, but they’ve given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms."

    Which decade do you think the Left finally realized Blacks can not compete with Whites on equal terms? During the L.A riots period? Or in more recent times after Hussein Obama got into office?

    Replies: @Arclight

    Good question – I am young enough that my political memory only goes back about 20 years, so that’s my bias in answering your question. My first job out of college was working in the DC office of a Democratic congress critter, and I remember two different colleagues basically expressing the view you mentioned: one was a woman who explained one of her reasons for being a liberal was because blacks need “our help” otherwise many couldn’t fend for themselves (this same colleague later urged my boss to vote for Pelosi over Hoyer for whip because “we’re the party of women and minorities” – but he hated Pelosi and voted against her). The other colleague just simply stated one night while we were having beers that he hated living in DC because after living in close proximity to lower class blacks for ten years he basically had views that would get him branded as a racist if he voiced them and that he realized that most of our social welfare was basically an attempt to keep them and other low income people from bothering the rest of us too much.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    @Arclight


    congress critter
     
    Wow, clever... -_-
  102. @Anon
    He could have won.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbFWg54ezko

    Replies: @jon, @Dzo

    This guy most likely murdered a lawyer in my town during some kind of gay tryst.

    http://www.nj.com/union/index.ssf/2014/01/kai_the_hitchhiker_pleas_not_guilty_to_clark_murder_lawyer_says_hes_doing_better.html

    I think he claimed he was drugged and raped.

  103. @Gunnar von Cowtown
    These are the college debate national champions?

    They wouldn't win a Toastmaster's "Best Table Topics" award. In fact, the "Ah Counter/Grammarian" would probably ask them to leave.

    Replies: @Dzo

    First time I’ve ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve’s site…

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Dzo



    First time I’ve ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve’s site…

     

    What about Rotarians? Jaycees?
    , @Reg Cæsar
    @Dzo


    First time I’ve ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve’s site…
     
    What about Rotarians?

    Jaycees?

    Arthur Murray Dance Studios?

    Paul Harvey?

    Ayds?
  104. This would never fly in Parliamentary debate. Policy is the worst.

  105. @Massimo Heitor
    Sorry, one addendum: Normally, in college, kids of all races do really dumb humiliating stuff, feel embarrassed, but the adults sweep it under the rug and help them forget it. Here, the adults gave them an award.

    These girls are probably very nice people that made fools of themselves, and later felt humiliated and regret it. What is worse than simply humiliating yourself is having a video of the event go viral on YouTube. I've made an ass of myself in the past and felt humiliated, but I've never had videos of my actions go on YouTube.

    Replies: @TB2, @Stealth

    These girls are probably very nice people that made fools of themselves, and later felt humiliated and regret it.

    I very seriously doubt they ever felt humiliated over this. This wasn’t one of those stupid things someone does quickly before having time to think about it. It took lots of deliberation.

  106. Am I the only one who thinks this would be extremely entertaining to watch?

    • Replies: @Anne Ahnnehmmiss
    @Stealth


    Am I the only one who thinks this would be extremely entertaining to watch?

     

    like when you are drunk or what?
  107. @Dave Pinsen
    In case you missed it, Jose Antonio Vargas shouting at #BlackLivesMatter activists heckling his stale pale male panelists: https://twitter.com/LegInsurrection/status/622772876433846273

    Replies: @AnAnon

    until they attack Hillary, I think its more of a regular firing squad.

  108. @rod1963
    This spells doom for higher ed, but that's fine. They aided and abetted political correctness and multiculturalism to the point it's become a monster which will devour them.

    To paraphrase Carroll Quigley. No institution failed that didn't deserve it.

    For the Democrats it means it's nearing a end to running nasty old white candidates like Clinton or even a populist like Sanders for national office like POTUS.

    That's alright though. Many white liberals will embrace a Mugabe or Adi Amin. As long as the party continues and the money keeps flowing, they'll support any lunatic/crook the Democrats put up for them. It's all good.

    The GOP OTOH shouldn't smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.

    Replies: @Kristen, @jW, @Tim Howells

    They do NOT represent the white upper class, but are overwhelmingly from the lower middle class. I think of them as self-hating, striving white Republicans, the sort who denies his/her heritage and social background as if it isn’t good enough. I’d like to see working class whites be contented if not proud of their accomplishments, not denying their pasts and pretending to be upper class, which emphatically they are not.

  109. That one girl has a wildass Afro.

    Is Afro making a comeback?

  110. jW says:
    @rod1963
    This spells doom for higher ed, but that's fine. They aided and abetted political correctness and multiculturalism to the point it's become a monster which will devour them.

    To paraphrase Carroll Quigley. No institution failed that didn't deserve it.

    For the Democrats it means it's nearing a end to running nasty old white candidates like Clinton or even a populist like Sanders for national office like POTUS.

    That's alright though. Many white liberals will embrace a Mugabe or Adi Amin. As long as the party continues and the money keeps flowing, they'll support any lunatic/crook the Democrats put up for them. It's all good.

    The GOP OTOH shouldn't smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.

    Replies: @Kristen, @jW, @Tim Howells

    The GOP OTOH shouldn’t smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.

    I think deep down the elites know that an honorable working man is in some sense their better and they resent him for it. Every bit they take, every move they make is made possible by some guy here or in China building and distributing this stuff. The elites really aren’t mostly the Steve Jobs, Norman Borlaug types who really revolutionize. They are just the skimmers of the cream and they know it. They are not producers. That is why they identify and sympathize with the depravity of weirdos and the dysfunction of the poor. They are no one’s betters and they resent those who are.

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    @jW

    Wall Street is proof of low class people making a ton of money.

    , @Former Darfur
    @jW

    My ancestors and their siblings were machinists, steel mill workers, aircraft mechanics and so forth (on the male side even during WWII none of the females drove rivets or ran a turret lathe so far as I know) and I can tell you that the local GOP regulars have zero respect for "the working man" aka a blue collar salaried worker. They think that unless you are a business owner, a doctor or a farmer with several thousand acres you are a scumbag if you think you should make more than ten bucks an hour.

  111. @Anonymous
    There is no hope for conservatism. And the conservatism over the past 35 years is not preferable to liberalism. Reagan started patronizing jihadism, financializing and outsourcing, granting amnesty for illegals. The Bushes continued this and started very costly Middle East wars. Apart from Trump I think we'd see the same with any of the top GOP candidates.

    All of that aside, demography is destiny and Democrat. So, if you can't beat 'em, foster internecine warfare.

    Replies: @ingo

    All of that aside, demography is destiny and Democrat. So, if you can’t beat ‘em, foster internecine warfare.

    Yeah, the most exploitable issue for whites is crime. Asians know that they are the favored targets. They are richer and softer targets. Lots of Asians where I am and they draw the crime away from the whites to some extent. If you are going to break into someone’s house, you figure that Asians are less likely to blast you with a shotgun than that white guy, or even the hispanic dude.

  112. @Stealth
    Am I the only one who thinks this would be extremely entertaining to watch?

    Replies: @Anne Ahnnehmmiss

    Am I the only one who thinks this would be extremely entertaining to watch?

    like when you are drunk or what?

  113. @jW
    @rod1963


    The GOP OTOH shouldn’t smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.
     
    I think deep down the elites know that an honorable working man is in some sense their better and they resent him for it. Every bit they take, every move they make is made possible by some guy here or in China building and distributing this stuff. The elites really aren't mostly the Steve Jobs, Norman Borlaug types who really revolutionize. They are just the skimmers of the cream and they know it. They are not producers. That is why they identify and sympathize with the depravity of weirdos and the dysfunction of the poor. They are no one's betters and they resent those who are.

    Replies: @MarkinLA, @Former Darfur

    Wall Street is proof of low class people making a ton of money.

  114. This video is from 20 years ago. It’s been like this for a while, it was the perfect medium for speed rapping to jump into.

    Skip to 33:30 for a taste of “micro machines” like argument.

    • Replies: @FWIW
    @Anonymous

    Your video explains a lot. Speed debate needed to die.


    Not everyone has given up. A guy from Northwestern is at least saying something.


    Hardy disagrees. “Having minimal rules is not something that reflects a middle-class white bias,” he said. “I think it is wildly reductionist to say that black people can’t understand debate unless there is rap in it—it sells short their potential.”
     
    The nuclear option would be to change to a written format.
  115. How common is the type of “black debating” shown in the clip?

    Are these types of teams actually becoming common, or was this just some one-off instance of some backwater debate that awarded them a win?

    Does anyone actually know?

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @FactsAreImportant

    The team that they beat in the finals were two black guys who did much the same thing.

    Replies: @Truth

  116. @jW
    @rod1963


    The GOP OTOH shouldn’t smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.
     
    I think deep down the elites know that an honorable working man is in some sense their better and they resent him for it. Every bit they take, every move they make is made possible by some guy here or in China building and distributing this stuff. The elites really aren't mostly the Steve Jobs, Norman Borlaug types who really revolutionize. They are just the skimmers of the cream and they know it. They are not producers. That is why they identify and sympathize with the depravity of weirdos and the dysfunction of the poor. They are no one's betters and they resent those who are.

    Replies: @MarkinLA, @Former Darfur

    My ancestors and their siblings were machinists, steel mill workers, aircraft mechanics and so forth (on the male side even during WWII none of the females drove rivets or ran a turret lathe so far as I know) and I can tell you that the local GOP regulars have zero respect for “the working man” aka a blue collar salaried worker. They think that unless you are a business owner, a doctor or a farmer with several thousand acres you are a scumbag if you think you should make more than ten bucks an hour.

  117. The Leftists, Hippies, and other assorted freaks in the 1960’s and 1970’s had a second act. They were able to cut their hair, clean up their drug habits, get jobs and move on with their lives. But Blacks have no exit from their degeneracy. All they can do is turn up the volume.

  118. @FactsAreImportant
    How common is the type of "black debating" shown in the clip?

    Are these types of teams actually becoming common, or was this just some one-off instance of some backwater debate that awarded them a win?

    Does anyone actually know?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    The team that they beat in the finals were two black guys who did much the same thing.

    • Replies: @Truth
    @Steve Sailer

    Now debate has changed quite a bit since I competed, and I placed highly in a few national tournaments with very little preparation (not a surprise to anyone here, I'm sure).

    But from what I am taking of this, the two teams in the finals came up with the brilliant idea to present the information in a comprehensible, albeit controversial, fashion, in exception to their competitors who speak too quickly for the judges to understand what they are saying...and someone here does not understand the political correctness involved in rewarding comprehensible, over incomprehensible, communication...at an event that has traditionally given awards for comprehensible communication?

    Do I have this correct.

    Replies: @Jack D

  119. @Arclight
    @Jefferson

    Good question - I am young enough that my political memory only goes back about 20 years, so that's my bias in answering your question. My first job out of college was working in the DC office of a Democratic congress critter, and I remember two different colleagues basically expressing the view you mentioned: one was a woman who explained one of her reasons for being a liberal was because blacks need "our help" otherwise many couldn't fend for themselves (this same colleague later urged my boss to vote for Pelosi over Hoyer for whip because "we're the party of women and minorities" - but he hated Pelosi and voted against her). The other colleague just simply stated one night while we were having beers that he hated living in DC because after living in close proximity to lower class blacks for ten years he basically had views that would get him branded as a racist if he voiced them and that he realized that most of our social welfare was basically an attempt to keep them and other low income people from bothering the rest of us too much.

    Replies: @ScarletNumber

    congress critter

    Wow, clever… -_-

  120. @Arclight
    The left won't admit it in frank terms, but they've given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms. The result is somewhat harmless absurdities like these debate competition to Orwellian social engineering like the new fair housing rules that will force racial and economic integration under threat of federal litigation. Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won't be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.

    Replies: @Jefferson, @Curle, @Kevin O'Keeffe, @AnAnon

    it won’t be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.

    Republics are small. Best if they don’t exceed 300,000 people. Places where individuals can use personal influence to affect policy and they don’t have to rely on media megaphones. We don’t live in a Republic. Haven’t for some time.

  121. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    Sometimes I wonder…

    Did PC make white Libs so willfully naive and dumb that they don’t see the obvious irony?

    Libs attack BIRTH OF A NATION as ‘eeeeeeeeeeeeeeevvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvviiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiilllllllllllllllllllll and raaaaaaaaaaaaaaciiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiissssssssssssssssstttttttt’ because it suggested that the natural mode of Negroes is to be wild and crazy and unfit for civilized society.

    But just look at what black influence has done not only to American dance but American debating and discussion.

    I mean how is that debate all that different from this?

    BOAN was a truly prophetic movie.

    Sure, it is offensive and ludicrous in parts, but it speaks a helluva lot more truth than the fairytale of Atticus Finch and the other story with a mountain-sized negro who luvs a little white mouse.

    • Replies: @Hacienda
    @Anon

    The problem with this movie scene is that this never happens and will never happen.
    But white people's amok fantasies about colored people are a real thing and have been
    legislated and economized.

    See the difference, Billy?

  122. Anon • Disclaimer says:

    This reminds me of what Steven Pinker said of the 60s and 70s, especially in places like NY.

    With less law and order, things tend to get out of hand, especially with the presence of Negroes.

    It took a long time to reverse trends in NY. It had to get REALLY bad under Dinkins for NYers to finally elect a Republican and fix house. And then Bloomberg won three times and instituted Stop and Frisk.

    It looks like something like that needs to be instituted to restore debating to its proper place in American life.

    Stop and Frisk the debaters if they get out of hand.

  123. @Anonymous
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7L5N3Jvg8A

    This video is from 20 years ago. It's been like this for a while, it was the perfect medium for speed rapping to jump into.

    Skip to 33:30 for a taste of "micro machines" like argument.

    Replies: @FWIW

    Your video explains a lot. Speed debate needed to die.

    Not everyone has given up. A guy from Northwestern is at least saying something.

    Hardy disagrees. “Having minimal rules is not something that reflects a middle-class white bias,” he said. “I think it is wildly reductionist to say that black people can’t understand debate unless there is rap in it—it sells short their potential.”

    The nuclear option would be to change to a written format.

  124. @Harry Baldwin
    Interesting that the 2007 movie "The Great Debaters," about a debate team from a black college, was set in 1935 instead of contemporary times. Perhaps director Denzel Washington and producer Oprah thought audiences would be more impressed by blacks employing the traditional, more rational style of debating than by the new blackety-black-black style.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    The movie was based on a true story, although Harvard was substituted in for the University of Southern California since defeating Harvard carries more cultural cache.

  125. @Mr. Blank
    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black "debaters" would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row. (If you can get all black guys for this, it would be even better, but any race would do.) Then when these black debaters start doing their schtick, their opponent gives a signal and half the big scary dudes march up onto the stage and physically remove the black debaters from the building.

    The opponent then takes center stage and announces that if we are to abandon rational, reasoned discourse, this is the ultimate alternative: The side with the most muscle always wins.

    Then have the remaining scary dudes menacingly crowd around the judge's table. If it's an open-carry state, maybe have the big guys flash guns, just for good measure. The opponent then asks, "are you bunch of white liberal pussies really sure you want to go there?"

    The opponent drops the mic (or some similar defiant gesture — maybe knocks over the lectern or something) and walks off the stage and out of the room.

    Replies: @Truth

    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.

    So your “solution” is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?

    • Replies: @Mr. Blank
    @Truth

    I prefer the terms "street theater" or "performance art." :)

    , @Kylie
    @Truth


    @Mr. Blank
    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.

    So your “solution” is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?
     
    Not so fast, champ.

    How do you know Mr. Blank didn't have these guys in mind?

    http://mije.org/sites/default/files/imagecache/full_column/u582/blackpanthers_security.jpg

    Replies: @Truth

  126. @Steve Sailer
    @FactsAreImportant

    The team that they beat in the finals were two black guys who did much the same thing.

    Replies: @Truth

    Now debate has changed quite a bit since I competed, and I placed highly in a few national tournaments with very little preparation (not a surprise to anyone here, I’m sure).

    But from what I am taking of this, the two teams in the finals came up with the brilliant idea to present the information in a comprehensible, albeit controversial, fashion, in exception to their competitors who speak too quickly for the judges to understand what they are saying…and someone here does not understand the political correctness involved in rewarding comprehensible, over incomprehensible, communication…at an event that has traditionally given awards for comprehensible communication?

    Do I have this correct.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Truth

    I think you've summed it up pretty well, but the question is, does this make you proud or does this make you want to weep before the wreckage of Western civilization?

    Replies: @Truth

  127. The big virtue of traditional policy debate was that it required its participants and judges to look seriously at the merits of both sides of an argument. It is therefore exactly the sort of cultural relic that the left is more than happy to sweep into the dustbin of history.

  128. The next front in the SJW global conquest is this:

  129. @Truth
    @Steve Sailer

    Now debate has changed quite a bit since I competed, and I placed highly in a few national tournaments with very little preparation (not a surprise to anyone here, I'm sure).

    But from what I am taking of this, the two teams in the finals came up with the brilliant idea to present the information in a comprehensible, albeit controversial, fashion, in exception to their competitors who speak too quickly for the judges to understand what they are saying...and someone here does not understand the political correctness involved in rewarding comprehensible, over incomprehensible, communication...at an event that has traditionally given awards for comprehensible communication?

    Do I have this correct.

    Replies: @Jack D

    I think you’ve summed it up pretty well, but the question is, does this make you proud or does this make you want to weep before the wreckage of Western civilization?

    • Replies: @Truth
    @Jack D

    Well Jack, what you must understand is that the only thing constant is change. There are a lot of changes in America that I don't agree with, but it is not possible to live your entire life in 1978.

  130. @Anon
    Sometimes I wonder...

    Did PC make white Libs so willfully naive and dumb that they don't see the obvious irony?

    Libs attack BIRTH OF A NATION as 'eeeeeeeeeeeeeeevvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvviiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiilllllllllllllllllllll and raaaaaaaaaaaaaaciiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiissssssssssssssssstttttttt' because it suggested that the natural mode of Negroes is to be wild and crazy and unfit for civilized society.

    But just look at what black influence has done not only to American dance but American debating and discussion.

    I mean how is that debate all that different from this?

    https://youtu.be/4-hkg3A7qls?t=34s

    BOAN was a truly prophetic movie.

    Sure, it is offensive and ludicrous in parts, but it speaks a helluva lot more truth than the fairytale of Atticus Finch and the other story with a mountain-sized negro who luvs a little white mouse.

    Replies: @Hacienda

    The problem with this movie scene is that this never happens and will never happen.
    But white people’s amok fantasies about colored people are a real thing and have been
    legislated and economized.

    See the difference, Billy?

  131. @rod1963
    This spells doom for higher ed, but that's fine. They aided and abetted political correctness and multiculturalism to the point it's become a monster which will devour them.

    To paraphrase Carroll Quigley. No institution failed that didn't deserve it.

    For the Democrats it means it's nearing a end to running nasty old white candidates like Clinton or even a populist like Sanders for national office like POTUS.

    That's alright though. Many white liberals will embrace a Mugabe or Adi Amin. As long as the party continues and the money keeps flowing, they'll support any lunatic/crook the Democrats put up for them. It's all good.

    The GOP OTOH shouldn't smirk. They openly detest their base. Policy wise the GOP is just as hostile to white working and middle-class as are the Democrats and probably worse. Outside of Trump the rest of the Republicans running only represent the white upper class and Chambers of Commerce types.

    Replies: @Kristen, @jW, @Tim Howells

    Hey! I just listened to that Quigley lecture too. Killer quote:

    “Conservatives now are telling us that we must curtail government, cut government spending, cut government powers, reduce government personnel for the sake of making individuals more free.

    “Liberals, on the other hand, are still telling us, as they have for a long, long time, that in order to make individuals free, we must destroy communities. By communities I mean villages. Ghettos and cities. Ethnic groupings. Religious groupings. Anything which is segregated. We must destroy them. So that all individuals would be, if possible, identical. Including boys and girls.

    “But the area of political action … in which you have government, individuals … three others: voluntary associations (which I’ll say no more about), corporations and communities. And if the liberals destroy communities for the sake of the individual, and the conservatives destroy the government for the sake of individuals, you’re going to have an area of political action in which irresponsible, immensely powerful corporations are engaged in opposition to individuals who are socially naked and defenseless.”

    • Replies: @anon
    @Tim Howells


    And if the liberals destroy communities for the sake of the individual, and the conservatives destroy the government for the sake of individuals, you’re going to have an area of political action in which irresponsible, immensely powerful corporations are engaged in opposition to individuals who are socially naked and defenseless.
     
    coincidence, huh
  132. anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Tim Howells
    @rod1963

    Hey! I just listened to that Quigley lecture too. Killer quote:

    "Conservatives now are telling us that we must curtail government, cut government spending, cut government powers, reduce government personnel for the sake of making individuals more free.

    "Liberals, on the other hand, are still telling us, as they have for a long, long time, that in order to make individuals free, we must destroy communities. By communities I mean villages. Ghettos and cities. Ethnic groupings. Religious groupings. Anything which is segregated. We must destroy them. So that all individuals would be, if possible, identical. Including boys and girls.

    "But the area of political action ... in which you have government, individuals ... three others: voluntary associations (which I’ll say no more about), corporations and communities. And if the liberals destroy communities for the sake of the individual, and the conservatives destroy the government for the sake of individuals, you’re going to have an area of political action in which irresponsible, immensely powerful corporations are engaged in opposition to individuals who are socially naked and defenseless."

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nak-5nwL2Lk

    Replies: @anon

    And if the liberals destroy communities for the sake of the individual, and the conservatives destroy the government for the sake of individuals, you’re going to have an area of political action in which irresponsible, immensely powerful corporations are engaged in opposition to individuals who are socially naked and defenseless.

    coincidence, huh

  133. @Boomstick
    Kai the hatchet dude is not someone to mess with, despite his Spicolian nature.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caleb_Lawrence_McGillvary

    Replies: @Kevin O'Keeffe

    “Kai the hatchet dude is not someone to mess with, despite his Spicolian nature.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caleb_Lawrence_McGillvary

    McGillvary’s last Facebook post before he was arrested said: “what would you do if you woke up with a groggy head, metallic taste in your mouth, in a strangers house… walked to the mirror and seen cum dripping from the side of your face from your mouth, and started wretching, realizing that someone had drugged, raped, and blown their fucking load in you? what would you do?”

    I don’t mind saying, I’d be a little upset.

  134. @Arclight
    The left won't admit it in frank terms, but they've given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms. The result is somewhat harmless absurdities like these debate competition to Orwellian social engineering like the new fair housing rules that will force racial and economic integration under threat of federal litigation. Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won't be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.

    Replies: @Jefferson, @Curle, @Kevin O'Keeffe, @AnAnon

    “Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won’t be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.”

    I’m not sure why people have so much invested in the term “republic.” The Soviet Union was a federation of republics, after all. “Republic” does not mean “free society,” or whatever people seem to think it means now.

  135. This is as much an example of genuine debating as the new, improved Bruce Jenner is an example of genuine womanhood.

  136. @Arclight
    The left won't admit it in frank terms, but they've given up on blacks ever competing with whites on equal terms. The result is somewhat harmless absurdities like these debate competition to Orwellian social engineering like the new fair housing rules that will force racial and economic integration under threat of federal litigation. Progressives are authoritarian to their core and it won't be long before the idea that we live in a republic will be a joke.

    Replies: @Jefferson, @Curle, @Kevin O'Keeffe, @AnAnon

    Totalitarian, not Authoritarian. Plenty of merely authoritarian dictators throughout history managed to rule countries without demanding total, absolute, and abject loyalty to insanity.

    • Replies: @anon
    @AnAnon

    An important distinction (mentioned in that Quigley lecture).

  137. But you shouldn’t judge these cretins on the color of their skin, but their total lack of character. This is the end for Sybil Rights right here. Seems the mau-maus have decided that now they’ve been patronized like the retards they are for fifty years, its OK to prove that everything the Klan said was true. Its a pity that no one in the future will ever believe it. They’ll probably think it was just CGI like the Dinosaurs in Jurassic Park. After all in the future they’ll probably be about as numerous as the Dinosaurs are now. I’m looking forward to those antelope egg rolls in New China already.

  138. @AnAnon
    @Arclight

    Totalitarian, not Authoritarian. Plenty of merely authoritarian dictators throughout history managed to rule countries without demanding total, absolute, and abject loyalty to insanity.

    Replies: @anon

    An important distinction (mentioned in that Quigley lecture).

  139. @Truth
    @Mr. Blank


    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.
     
    So your "solution" is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @Kylie

    I prefer the terms “street theater” or “performance art.” 🙂

  140. @Jack D
    @Truth

    I think you've summed it up pretty well, but the question is, does this make you proud or does this make you want to weep before the wreckage of Western civilization?

    Replies: @Truth

    Well Jack, what you must understand is that the only thing constant is change. There are a lot of changes in America that I don’t agree with, but it is not possible to live your entire life in 1978.

  141. @Truth
    @Mr. Blank


    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.
     
    So your "solution" is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?

    Replies: @Mr. Blank, @Kylie


    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.

    So your “solution” is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?

    Not so fast, champ.

    How do you know Mr. Blank didn’t have these guys in mind?

    • Replies: @Truth
    @Kylie

    They're morons too! But that guy in the foreground is King Samir Shabazz, he's pretty entertaining.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Y3Cd9gnvlw

  142. “The Coalition Of The Fringes Is Getting More Frayed”

    I always have to laugh at this conservative/Republican talking point, similar to when the liberals/Democrats several years ago declared that the Republican Party was dead when Obama was elected…and then they got their asses handed to them at the mid-term elections.

    EACH political party has their fringes they equally rely on. For the left, it’s feminists, race baiters, and SJW’s. For the right, it’s religious patriarch zealots, race baiters, and Tea Partiers. It reminds me of the Laugh O’Lympics from the 1970’s.

    • Replies: @Father O'Hara
    @Corvinus

    Race baiters on the right? Care to explicate?

  143. @Dzo
    @Gunnar von Cowtown

    First time I've ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve's site...

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Reg Cæsar

    First time I’ve ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve’s site…

    What about Rotarians? Jaycees?

  144. @Dzo
    @Gunnar von Cowtown

    First time I've ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve's site...

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Reg Cæsar

    First time I’ve ever seen Toastmasters mentioned at Steve’s site…

    What about Rotarians?

    Jaycees?

    Arthur Murray Dance Studios?

    Paul Harvey?

    Ayds?

  145. @Kylie
    @Truth


    @Mr. Blank
    You know, I wish some white or Asian debate team going up against these black “debaters” would hire a group of about 20 big, scary dudes to sit in the back row.

    So your “solution” is conspiracy to criminal assault and battery?
     
    Not so fast, champ.

    How do you know Mr. Blank didn't have these guys in mind?

    http://mije.org/sites/default/files/imagecache/full_column/u582/blackpanthers_security.jpg

    Replies: @Truth

    They’re morons too! But that guy in the foreground is King Samir Shabazz, he’s pretty entertaining.

  146. @Jefferson
    The most memorable part during that rant by those two obese manly butch dyke looking Black "women" is when they mention the violence that Whiteness does to Black bodies.

    Not even The Onion could come up with something this retarded.

    White on Black violence is an epidemic in America is one of biggest political lies of the 21st Century. Repeat a lie long enough with your huge powerful Megaphone and eventually the dumb masses will believe it is true.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Buffalo Joe, @TWS

    I’ll admit when I first saw this a year or so ago I thought this was ‘The Onion’. Now I’m sure we’ve reached peak decline and it’s going to be a flat graph from here to knapping glass arrow heads from the windows in Detroit.

  147. Interestingly, the American Conservative had an article that was similar to Steve’s:

    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/how-to-speak-gibberish-win-a-national-debate-title/

    However, if you look at the author’s updates to his own article the author came to realize that the whole debate culture is screwed up to the point where what the Towson team did was actually fairly typical of the nonsense that goes on:

    “I learned from readers that the Towson team’s bizarre display is actually well within the rules and the custom of competitive debate. So, congratulations to them, I guess. I learned something new today: Competitive debate is a completely insane phenomenon.”

    There are three updates, and observing the progression is kind of interesting.

  148. @Corvinus
    "The Coalition Of The Fringes Is Getting More Frayed"

    I always have to laugh at this conservative/Republican talking point, similar to when the liberals/Democrats several years ago declared that the Republican Party was dead when Obama was elected...and then they got their asses handed to them at the mid-term elections.

    EACH political party has their fringes they equally rely on. For the left, it's feminists, race baiters, and SJW's. For the right, it's religious patriarch zealots, race baiters, and Tea Partiers. It reminds me of the Laugh O'Lympics from the 1970's.

    Replies: @Father O'Hara

    Race baiters on the right? Care to explicate?

  149. “Race baiters on the right?”

    The John Derbyshire’s and Steve Sailer’s of the world, for starters. Hey, I don’t blame them at all. They are trying to out-do the Jesse Jackson’s and the SJW’s.

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