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From The Guardian:

Stephen King faces backlash over comments on Oscars diversity
Ava DuVernay and Roxane Gay criticized author after he said he ‘would never consider diversity in matters of art’

Poppy Noor

Tue 14 Jan 2020

In yet another year of Oscar nominations that saw a paucity of recognition for women and artists of colour, the response has been almost exhausted – after all, hasn’t it all already been said?

All this emotional labor is exhausting!

Stephen King took a different stance. Early on Tuesday morning, he spoke about the three Oscars categories in which he is able to nominate: best picture, adapted screenplay and original screenplay. He said that diversity is not a consideration for him when he votes as a member of the Academy. “I would never consider diversity in matters of art. Only quality. It seems to me that to do otherwise would be wrong,” he said on Twitter.

He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.

The director Ava DuVernay called King’s comments “so backward and ignorant you want to go back to bed”.

Ava DuVernay

@ava
When you wake up, meditate, stretch, reach for your phone to check on the world and see a tweet from someone you admire that is so backward and ignorant you want to go back to bed.

The writer Roxane Gay tweeted that she was disappointed that King only believed in “quality from one demographic”.

Getting out of bed is indeed exhausting for Roxane Gay. From the New York Times in 2017:

Roxane Gay, an internationally known feminist writer and professor, released a memoir on Tuesday that focused, in part, on what it is like to move through the world as an overweight woman.

So it was both annoying and somewhat fitting, she said, that she had gotten attention this week not only for her work but also for a podcast that provoked a backlash for suggesting that it was difficult to arrange an interview with Ms. Gay last month because of her weight.

“Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?” …

In the edited version of the podcast that was online on Tuesday, Ms. Freedman can be heard introducing Ms. Gay before the interview:

“You see, Roxane Gay, well, I’m searching for the right word to use here. I don’t want to say fat, so — even though she uses the word fat about herself — so I’m going to use the official medical term, super morbidly obese. There’s obese, then there’s morbidly obese, and then there is super morbidly obese. I don’t think the scale goes beyond that, quite literally. But it’s not just that Roxane’s overweight; she’s 6-foot-3, or about two meters tall. Her size is incredibly imposing. And this is a logistical nightmare for her. There’s no other way to put it.”

 
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  1. “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it’s oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    • Replies: @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)
    , @Kronos
    I think I fought her in a Boss Battle in South Park’s “The Fractured But Whole” PC game.

    https://youtu.be/iPm_b20Xm8g
    , @Change that Matters
    "At my heaviest, I weighed 577lb, or over 41st, at 6ft 3in."
    , @Art Deco
    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.
    , @Anonymous
    Good Lord!

    I've heard of the disparaging term 'thunder thighs', but this is more a case of full bore full blown tropical cyclone.
    , @AnotherDad
    This is your "culture" on minoritarianism.
    , @AnotherDad
    To old--racist, sexist, fat-shaming--me, it is ridiculous that anyone would be trotting this blob of blubber out to hold forth on anything. Her very physique screams "lazy", "sloppy", "incompetent", "ill-disciplined" and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    ~~~

    One of the noticeable aspects of life under minoritarianism is that the ugly, sick, disordered is held up over the beautiful, healthy and sound.
    , @a reader
    Please note if you download this picture, it's hideously labelled:

    roxanegay-superJumbo

    (my emphasis, not theirs, though)

    , @Pop Warner
    Absolute unit, she should be breeding the next generation of offensive linemen instead of writing about being fat
    , @Autochthon
    Roxane Gay went on to say "Bargon wan che copa. Nee choo!" before eating a frog and slithering off the stage.

    https://youtu.be/tiD-n7ewvGo
    , @Valley of the Schmolls
    I'm sure I've seen her in one of those World Star videos at Disney World using a mobility scooter/buggy as a battering ram.
    , @ThreeCranes
    Looking at that fabric stretched taut over her thighs, tent and awning maker comes to mind.
  2. The Landwhale Must Die(t).

  3. DuVernay is apparently so annoying to work with that Kevin Feige removed her from directing Black Panther. Though a part of me does wonder what an Ana DuVernay action comic book movie would look like.

    In other woke news. The new Saved By The Bell reboot has cast a trans actor to play Lexi, the popular cheerleader. Mario Lopez is apparently a producer and this decision is said to likely be his attempt to make all the bad publicity over his comments on transgender children go away. (As well as maybe all that bad noise about a history of sexual assaults) It may also make the show somewhat cancel-proof.

    https://www.revelist.com/tv/josie-totah-saved-bell-reboot/17019/mario-lopez-came-under-fire-early-2019-after-making-some-transphobic-remarks-but-hes-since-apologized/5

    The actor is Josie Totah who is of Palestinian and Lebanese descent (Though I can’t find any information on if they are a Christian family or Muslim, I presume Christian or at least atheists from a ‘Muslim background’ from ‘Josie’ and a lack of any ‘first Muslim’ stuff) who looks like the classic effeminate gay type of transgender. Could it be too shameful in his family for him to be gay? That’s what he implies in this interview.

    Here is a recent performance (Though given Totah is 16-17 here, maybe not the best representation of what he looks like now at 19 without his female getup. It’s also interesting how often Indians and Arabs get used to play each other in Hollywood) and he is so short and slight he does kind of look like a girl trying to be a boy except for the voice. So hyper-effeminate and in this instance playing a gay character.

    Here is a video from Lopez giving a first look at the production. The ‘girl’ in the pink top and green shorts is Totah. I saw the video and noticed the odd glance ‘she’ gives Lopez and I wondered if she was wary of him due to his alleged history of sexual assault but maybe Totah is still wary of Lopez on account of his previous comments.

    View this post on Instagram

    Back at The Max… #SBTB #FBF

    A post shared by Mario Lopez (@mariolopez) on

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Wait a minute, are we talkin' about the same Rebecca De Mornay here? I thought she was pretty hot in Risky Business. Man, I should keep up with these people in The National Enquirer more often... shouldn't have let that subscription lapse.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqYZIxxCEzM
    , @AndrewR
    Gonna go out on a limb and assume his family is not Muslim.

    And did Mindy Kaling really play his mother in that show? Biological mother? She lectures us about racism but is ok with people thinking Dravidians and Arabs are the same lol
    , @Autochthon
    I'm sorry, what? Were there other people in that video? All I saw were Elizabeth Berkley's hooters.
  4. I have seen women who look like Roxane who work at the DMV. If not for her color and gender, she wouldn’t be out of place at a comic book convention. Dr. Gay holds a Ph.D. from Michigan Technological University, a school I have never heard of. It is located in Houghton, which is in the western part of the Upper Peninsula. She claims to have to lose 200 pounds in order to shop at Lane Bryant.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Cannot imagine what she studied at Michigan Tech. It was founded prior to the war as a polytechnic institution. If they've been true to their foundational mission, the only research degrees you should be able to get there (if any) would be in applied science and engineering.
    , @CAL2
    Michigan Tech is a well respected engineering school up in the wilds of the Upper Peninsula. You go there to study and play hockey.
    , @Anon7
    Houghton is located in the Keweenaw peninsula at the northernmost tip of Michigan’s Upper Peninsula. Houghton gets about seventeen feet of snow in an average winter; older houses often have an additional front door located located on the second floor of the house, for use during winter.

    Dr. Gay’s shape and girth are admirably suited to survival in the Keweenaw.

    Michigan Tech is known primarily for its Engineering degree programs, but also had one of the earliest technical writing programs. I didn’t know you could get a PhD in tech writing, but apparently you can.
    , @J.Ross
    >massively overweight black woman
    >took a degree at a tech school
    >in the UP
    Not saying you're lying but I'm going to need to see transcripts and photographs before I believe this.
  5. He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.

    They aren’t mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you’ll have less quality.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    Agree.

    When I read Steve's comment, I thought, "Steve is correct logically, but the Roxane Gay-types are correct because Diversity is now Lenin-esque: You may not be interested in Diversity, but Diversity is interested in you."

    Like a virulent disease, Diversity gets into everything and affects everything. No normal actions can any longer be taken without regard for it.

    I said, "like", as if it were a simile, but in fact it is literally true.
    , @Dr Van Nostrand
    During segregation era Condoleeza Rice's dad told her she had to be twice as good as whites to be considered equal. During my segregation black out of birth wedlock was Lowe than whites and young black were more likely to hold a job than young white men. Perhaps it should have lasted an another generation so that they could truly labd on their feet when it ended. Perhaps modern self segregation is an attempt to do the same.

    Rice accomplished as she was she was still brought us the Iraq war. Credentials mean nothing when your judgement and instincts are flawed.
    , @Jack D
    To the left, "quality" does not exist in isolation. Diversity is itself a component of quality - unless a movie, university, etc. is "diverse" (which is just a code word for "has lots of black people in it") then it is not of the highest possible quality. King's notion that there is such a thing as "quality" that is independent of diversity is a old white man's way of looking at things and will soon be dead.
    , @Paleo Liberal
    Not necessarily.

    There have been great works of art (paintings, music, film, plays, etc., etc., etc.) which have had influences from different cultures.

    One example: a very strong case can be made that American music came about from a fusion of various European, West African and Native (*) cultures, in unequal amounts. American music has been the most influential music in the world for over 100 years.

    Another example, again with popular music: some European (such as George Harrison) and American (such as Paul Simon) popular music composers incorporated non-European and non-American musical traditions into their music.

    In the case of the late great George Harrison, I am not only referring to "Within You and Without You". I remember seeing a YouTube clip of Dhani Harrison (the late George's son) in the studio with Sir George Martin, going over the original tapes of "Here Comes the Sun". The younger Mr. Harrison pointed out the Indian influences in the song. Mr. Martin replied: "you are just like your dad".

    So, it is not only possible, but often very likely, for greater diversity to increase the quality. Of course, this sort of thing is now criticized as "cultural appropriation", so you can't win.




    (*) Native cultures doesn't only mean Native American. There have been some great Native Hawaiian musicians. I don't know enough to say if there have been great Inuit musicians, but that is very possible.
    , @Pop Warner
    It's a tacit admission by King's critics that diversity and quality are two different things

    Before it was "diversity will bring more great quality you never would have seen otherwise!" in the opening salvos of #OscarsSo(((white))) but now they openly call for diversity OVER quality. Really the only solution is to boycott the entire industry and let the pedophiles and communists running it go broke or change their tune when the Chinese become the chief backers of quality film
    , @SunBakedSuburb
    The Stephen King Corporation has been infected by the Black Lady Virus (BLV). Schadenfreude. The SailerSimulation is throwing a bone to the suckers who never really existed.
  6. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    I wouldn’t want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    • Replies: @iffen
    Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.

    You're okay in my book. At least you didn't try to push him in front of a trolley.
    , @Art Deco
    Like at 4:54?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xv2VIEY9-A8
    , @bomag

    ...just in time to save my life
     
    We need a comment tag for this one:
    Holy sh*t.
    , @Morton's toes
    Thank you for posting that.

    Next time somebody asks me to sit right next some extremely fat person I will just tell them I don't think it looks safe. That chair or seat or whatever looks to me like it is about to explode.

    If it is on an airplane the first employee that hears me quietly say that might explode shit into their pants.
    , @Kronos
    If you tried, your hands and arms would’ve been crushed into powder. If that happened, you wouldn’t be typing.
    , @Charon

    The 400 lb man was unhurt
     
    That's just it though. These people have so much padding, they never get hurt. It's always the rest of us.
    , @The Plutonium Kid
    There is no need to apologize to those who demand the impossible of you.
  7. Why are blacks so prone to obesity?

    And: Hollywood has nothing to do with “art”, define art as you wish…

    • Replies: @CCZ
    RACISM !!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouz2R-CQi8A
    , @Kronos
    They eat a high sugar/carbohydrate diet. Also, they never evolved a genetic tolerance for sugar. Europeans and Asians possessed alcohol, wheat, rice, etc for thousands of years. Italians have a much lower rate of alcoholism than native Americans likely due to countless generations of natural selection. The real bingers likely died off years ago.

    Also, pointing out black obesity is racist. Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    https://youtu.be/XA62refAB2w
    , @Dorcas
    Poor impulse control and inability to conceptualize future consequences from present actions.
  8. Roxane Gay, an internationally known feminist writer and professor, released a memoir on Tuesday that focused, in part, on what it is like to move through the world as an overweight woman.

    (Reader recalls many an old episode of The Simpsons featuring Fat Homer.)

  9. All he has to say is “I worship a mountain-sized negro in GREEN MILE as god and an old negress in THE STAND as christ.”

  10. Off topic, but a Guardian piece suggests the UK Labour Party need to continue it’s Reverse Sailer Strategy (‘if, at any time between 1964 and 1997 I heard of a Khan, Saleem or Iqbal who did not support Labour I was both outraged and astonished’) and write off those losers in the former industrial towns of the North. You know, the people the Labour Party was founded by and for.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/11/labour-heartlands-gone-away-northern-towns

    “In speeches and newspaper articles these days, Labour’s heartlands are almost always characterised as “traditional” or “working class”, “industrial” or “ex-industrial”, “northern” or “in the Midlands”. When specific places are cited, they are often former mining villages, or left-behind towns – places where Labour voters can be quite socially conservative, culturally and racially homogeneous, and suspicious of dramatic shifts in the party’s direction. The implication is that these are the voters the party should rebuild itself around.”

    And that just won’t do! Labour’s the party for life’s winners, whether they be property developers or more recently arrived Kosovars.

    “successful political parties watch and draw lessons from the way the world is changing – and Britain’s cities have often been where new political and social forces first emerge, from multiculturalism to feminism and environmentalism. When Labour is influenced by such movements, it gains fresh energy”

    They became more vibrant!

    “When Jeremy Corbyn became the MP for Islington’s scruffier northern portion in 1983, his constituency was largely white and working class. Labour had held it since the 1930s, but often only with a modest majority, which had shrunk to under 5,000 in 1979. The area had high unemployment, poor housing, and a local Labour party that was seen as complacent and ineffective. Many of its members and voters were defecting to the newly formed SDP. It seemed possible Labour would soon lose the seat altogether.

    Instead, the opposite happened. As Islington North gentrified, it attracted waves of incomers, from bankers to migrant businessmen to refugees – few of them “traditional” Labour voters, and Corbyn got to know them and was often influenced by them. Amid Labour’s crushing defeat last month, his majority was 26,188.”

    You see? All we have to do is make the rest of the UK more like Islington North!

  11. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.

    You’re okay in my book. At least you didn’t try to push him in front of a trolley.

    • LOL: kaganovitch
  12. Anon[286] • Disclaimer says:

    Jesse Singal on Roxane Gay last year in New York Magazine:

    Inside the Near Meltdown of Roxane Gay and Christina Hoff Sommers’s Australian Mini-Tour The conversation series didn’t turn out as planned.

    http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/04/inside-the-near-meltdown-of-the-feminist-tour-in-australia.html

    Gay made it to Australia (chartered Antonov An-225?) and came onstage in jeans, a man’s XXXXXXXL shirt rolled up to expose deck hand tattoos, and running shoes. That sofa leg looks like it’s about to snap, and the petite, ladylike, handbag carrying Ms. Sommers is hoping she isn’t catapulted into the cheap seats if Gay scoots a little to her right:

    Singal interviewed the local event producer and his experiences with Gay’s “management team.”

    Given his previous work covering subjects like Islamic extremism and atheism, Desh probably didn’t anticipate that a conversation between two American feminists, both frequent contributors to mainstream publications, would spark one of his career’s messiest episodes, complete with legal threats and prolonged negotiations over whether the event’s video footage would be released.

    Singal is a writer who really does the work and doesn’t just give us his hot take. He interviewed everyone who would talk to him and listened to audio of the event. He’s Pinkeresque, in that he skirts the border of cancellation, but manages to stay employed. I subscribe to his newsletter, which is really good, although sometimes TL;DR.

  13. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    I think I fought her in a Boss Battle in South Park’s “The Fractured But Whole” PC game.

    • LOL: Achmed E. Newman
  14. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    At my heaviest, I weighed 577lb, or over 41st, at 6ft 3in.”

  15. Get Greenpeace to roll her back in the water.

    • Agree: SunBakedSuburb
  16. Nature was about to make three angry black women but decided to roll them all into one.

    • LOL: Harry Baldwin, Abe
    • Replies: @ChrisZ
    Rob: are you echoing Goethe?

    “Nature, alas, made only one being out of you, although there was material for both a good man and a rogue.”

    (From “Faust.” But full disclosure: I only know it as the last line of the Sherlock Holmes novel, “The Sign of Four.”)

    , @SunBakedSuburb
    "Nature"

    That was Steve's idea.
  17. Have you heard of Berkson’s paradox? It’s about how it can be possible to observe a negative correlation between features of a sub-population that does not exist in the whole population.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkson%27s_paradox

    In this context, consider if Academy Awards voters change how they consider movies to a criterion based on quality and diversity, rather than juts quality alone. Choosing films on this basis can, through Berkson’s paradox, mean that the movies you select have a negative correlation between quality and diversity. This is because for a less diverse movie to be select it must be that much higher in quality, and vice-versa. People may begin to notice that the better movies are the least diverse ones.

    • Thanks: notsaying
    • Replies: @Stebbing Heuer
    That's interesting. Thanks.
  18. “No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.”
    Correct.
    Diversity can or should never be the end for any artist project. However, in some contexts diversity may be an appropriate means to artistic ends.
    Those who criticise this are politicians not “artists”.(Or worse – mere virtue signallers – ie wankers)

  19. Rather OT, but this is a show biz/racism thread…

    When that movie “Green Book” first came out, I just sort of assumed it would be a dreary vinegar-soaked “They call me MISTER Tibbs!” lecture about Black Genius Vs. the Evil South, so I committed a racism and declined to see it.

    But it’s been on cable TV a lot lately, so I gave it a chance, and surprisingly, it’s quite good. The two leads, the writers and director all bring their best game and manage to rise above the laborious subject matter. Instead of being a standard-issue Whites Are Evil propaganda flick, it turns into a rather astringent craft-focused character study about two peculiar individuals stuck in a peculiar situation. It would appear that the good ship HMS Treacle-Cutter still sails the seven seas.

  20. It is hard to sympathize with Roxanne Gay due to her outwardly directed anger, which one suspects is more about her own self-loathing than racism or politics. It seems absurd to listen to a social activist who can’t even manage her own body. Jordan Peterson’s advice to “clean your room” comes to mind.

    A few days ago an iSteve commenter posted a link to a music video of Hawaiian singer Israel Kamakawiwo’ole, who had a hit with his cover of “Somewhere Over the Rainbow.” I found it moving. Israel died at 38 of congestive heart failure, brought on by what was clinically described as hyper-obesity: at 6’2″, he weighed as much as 757 pounds, for a BMI of 97.2. His similarly hyper-obese younger brother had died of the same cause at 28. Israel was a mellow, popular performer of enormous talent and is greatly missed. One wonders why someone like him can’t get control of his weight, when he knows it’s a death sentence. But then, one wonders why so many great artists and musicians are so self-destructive.

    • Replies: @PiltdownMan
    High-status morbid obesity was commonplace among elites in far- flung and quite varied Polynesian societies.
    , @Paleo Liberal
    Fantastic post, but I am in nit-picking mode right now.

    Israel's brother Skippy, who did indeed die of congestive heart failure at the age of 28, was the older, not the younger, brother. I think you meant to say that, but mis-typed.

    But that give me an excuse to repost a clip I posted in another thread, showing the two brothers when Skippy was mid 20s and Israel was late teens. Skippy is second from the left, playing the guitar. Iz is second from the right, playing the ukulele.

    Having seen them in person a few times around the time this video was made, I wanted to add -- the tiny looking guy in the middle is actually an average sized man. The guy on the far right, who appears to be average sized, is a big guy, over 6', who is just not AS big as the brothers.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdKDGRNwHks

    , @Anon
    Periodic public service announcement: Body weight is 80 percent heritable in adulthood. IQ is 50 percent.

    Other traits like self control, "getting your shit together like I did," and so on are themselves behavioral traits, also subject to heritability.
  21. Ava Duvernay, Roxanne Gay = Randy Raven ax you [for] vagena.

  22. Ms. Gay and Ms. Duvernay suffer from black privilege – the belief that everyone must take their sensitivities into account first, and then act accordingly.

    Race and identity play such an up front role in the majority of entertainment produced by or about blacks that even people like King cannot be bothered to pretend that it’s interesting.

    If they want the Academy to nominate more minority films, the answer is probably to make its membership younger – by the time even white liberals have been subjected to our culture for 5 or 6 decades they no longer really are interested in treating the Oscars as a participation trophy.

    • Agree: Almost Missouri
    • Replies: @dr kill
    I quite enjoy the various cultures represented by third wave feminists. In Dr. Gay's case I would say Agri - cultural.
  23. I’ve always thought that for the woke diversity is a synonym for ‘blacks’ and diverse is a synonym for Black. So in their minds, King is saying he only considers quality in his voting and never considers Blacks.

  24. But, but, what about her hair?…..

  25. I’d enjoy seeing her on “My 600 Pound Life.”

  26. Roxanne needs to take a year off, get a personal trainer and nutritionist to make much needed changes in her life. Her size is grotesque.

  27. It’s always good to see the left eating one of their own. Stephen King has been a whiny shitlib and hasn’t written a good book for decades.

    • Agree: jim jones, fish
    • Replies: @Kevin O'Keeffe

    Stephen King has been a whiny shitlib and hasn’t written a good book for decades.
     
    King has always been a shitlib, but 2017's Gwendy's Button Box was a very good read.
    , @JohnnyD
    "It's always good to see the left eating one of their own." Was that an intentional pun about Roxanne Gay's weight?
  28. @International Jew

    He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.
     

     
    They aren't mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you'll have less quality.

    Agree.

    When I read Steve’s comment, I thought, “Steve is correct logically, but the Roxane Gay-types are correct because Diversity is now Lenin-esque: You may not be interested in Diversity, but Diversity is interested in you.”

    Like a virulent disease, Diversity gets into everything and affects everything. No normal actions can any longer be taken without regard for it.

    I said, “like”, as if it were a simile, but in fact it is literally true.

    • Agree: Prester John
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Except selecting defenses in the NFL. Then its like Diversimicate ?
  29. Samoan , black and Hispanic(mestizo) hyper obesity is most likely to their genes unable to manage lactose based and other foods with which they were historically unfamiliar . The food desert theory was debunked I believe. Of course poor impulse control and feminism played it’s part too.

  30. He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    How dumb are these people really? Are there lower limits?

    Roxane Gay, an internationally known feminist writer and professor, released a memoir on Tuesday that focused, in part, on what it is like to move through the world as an overweight woman.

    Einstein writes and publishes “Zur Elektrodynamik bewegter Körper”
    Gay writes and publishes “Zur generellen Dynamik grotesk-fettleibiger Körper”

    When nature tells you that human bones are not made to carry your fat around, you better listen.

  31. Her features from what I can make of them seem attractive. What a pity. At 6’3 a light skinned black woman with somewhat Caucasian features could made something of herself if she didn’t let herself go like this. And of course her hair is nice too. From what I can tell it’s straightish.

  32. @International Jew

    He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.
     

     
    They aren't mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you'll have less quality.

    During segregation era Condoleeza Rice’s dad told her she had to be twice as good as whites to be considered equal. During my segregation black out of birth wedlock was Lowe than whites and young black were more likely to hold a job than young white men. Perhaps it should have lasted an another generation so that they could truly labd on their feet when it ended. Perhaps modern self segregation is an attempt to do the same.

    Rice accomplished as she was she was still brought us the Iraq war. Credentials mean nothing when your judgement and instincts are flawed.

  33. In the words of Frederick Nietzsche (1883) on “slave morality”:

    “The invalids are the great danger to humanity—not the evil men, not the ‘predatory animals.’ Those people who are, from the outset, failures, oppressed, broken—they are the ones, the weakest, who most undermine life among human beings, who in the most perilous way poison and question our trust in life, in humanity, in ourselves….They wander around among us like personifications of reproach, like warnings to us, as if health, success, strength, pride, and a feeling of power were inherently depraved things, for which people must atone some day, atone bitterly. How they thirst to be hangmen! Among them there are plenty of people disguised as judges seeking revenge. They always have the word ‘Justice’ in their mouths, like poisonous saliva, with their mouths always pursed, constantly ready to spit at anything which does not look discontented and goes on its way in good spirits….They are all men of resentment, these physiologically impaired and worm-eaten men, a totally quivering earthly kingdom of subterranean revenge, inexhaustible, insatiable in its outbursts against the fortunate, and equally in its masquerades of revenge, its pretexts for revenge. When would they attain their ultimate, most refined, most sublime triumph of revenge? Undoubtedly, if they could succeed in pushing their own wretchedness, all misery in general, into the consciences of the fortunate, so that the latter one day might begin to be ashamed of their good fortune and perhaps would say to themselves, ‘It’s shameful to be fortunate. There’s too much misery!’”

    https://merionwest.com/2020/01/14/enough-empathy-the-case-for-punching-down/

  34. @Almost Missouri
    Agree.

    When I read Steve's comment, I thought, "Steve is correct logically, but the Roxane Gay-types are correct because Diversity is now Lenin-esque: You may not be interested in Diversity, but Diversity is interested in you."

    Like a virulent disease, Diversity gets into everything and affects everything. No normal actions can any longer be taken without regard for it.

    I said, "like", as if it were a simile, but in fact it is literally true.

    Except selecting defenses in the NFL. Then its like Diversimicate ?

  35. There’s just one kind of labor Roxane Gay does- and it ain’t emotional…

    Super-obese black women: quantity from one demographic

    • Replies: @MEH 0910
    RIP Mr. Creosote:

    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1219970423233896448
  36. Commence pointing and sputtering!

    Who are the great underappreciated black novelists? What about inventors? Black intellectuals whose contributions don’t revolve around what it’s like to be black black blackety black?

    and why doesn’t this suppression of black talent effect musicians?

  37. @Harry Baldwin
    It is hard to sympathize with Roxanne Gay due to her outwardly directed anger, which one suspects is more about her own self-loathing than racism or politics. It seems absurd to listen to a social activist who can't even manage her own body. Jordan Peterson's advice to "clean your room" comes to mind.

    A few days ago an iSteve commenter posted a link to a music video of Hawaiian singer Israel Kamakawiwo'ole, who had a hit with his cover of "Somewhere Over the Rainbow." I found it moving. Israel died at 38 of congestive heart failure, brought on by what was clinically described as hyper-obesity: at 6'2", he weighed as much as 757 pounds, for a BMI of 97.2. His similarly hyper-obese younger brother had died of the same cause at 28. Israel was a mellow, popular performer of enormous talent and is greatly missed. One wonders why someone like him can't get control of his weight, when he knows it's a death sentence. But then, one wonders why so many great artists and musicians are so self-destructive.

    High-status morbid obesity was commonplace among elites in far- flung and quite varied Polynesian societies.

  38. Anybody remember a “Seinfeld” episode involving an obese and *angry* black chick named Rebecca DuMornay?

    I thought it was a lame joke at the time: a mild irony that such a person should share the classy-sounding name of a svelte white actress. But was it instead a reference to this woman? Has she been around that long?

    (If so, the joke would still be lame as comedy, but admirably wicked as satire.)

    • Replies: @Marty
    That Seinfeld episode (the black woman in question wasn’t really obese, just ordinary fat for 40+) was spectacularly unrealistic for one reason: her mouthy black anger gets returned in kind by Elaine. In real life, never happens.
  39. Ava Duvernay is much worse than a simple racial bean-counter; her tireless work in helping free five gang-rapists (and fetching them a $40 million payday besides) is probably the #1 most-effective battering ram in not merely freeing felons as social policy, but obliterating the concept of bail for any number of crimes against society. Whenever idiots convene to deface our civilization through the shocking barbarity of Equality of Outcome, one of their patron saints will be this stupid, malicious woman and her “teleplay”.

    Like far too many of her fellow hottentots, Duvernay’s “success” is built upon the rock of Money for Nothing, hastily (and clumsily) dressed up as renumeration for accomplishment of some sort. If you’d like a gruesome close-up of what monsters such ‘activists’ are, try and shut off Ava’s money faucet for any reason – and then stand back.

  40. I guess Roxanne is Samoan rather than black. She seems to be sporting Samoan patterns on her arms.

  41. @Rob McX
    Nature was about to make three angry black women but decided to roll them all into one.

    Rob: are you echoing Goethe?

    “Nature, alas, made only one being out of you, although there was material for both a good man and a rogue.”

    (From “Faust.” But full disclosure: I only know it as the last line of the Sherlock Holmes novel, “The Sign of Four.”)

  42. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.

    • Replies: @Prester John
    A neighbor of ours, grossly obese like that woman, passed at +/- 45 years of age. Like our neighbor, her cruise through life may end a lot sooner than later.
    , @Anonymous

    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.
     
    She needs to accidentally run over a member of a gypsy family who puts a curse on her.

    http://d28hgpri8am2if.cloudfront.net/book_images/onix/cvr9781501143762/thinner-9781501143762_hr.jpg
     
    , @Alec Leamas (hard at work)

    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.
     
    Maybe you haven't heard, but conventional weight standards are a form of white supremacy and heteronormativity.

    Checkmate, bigot.
  43. The centurions at the end = iSteve and commentariat

  44. @ScarletNumber
    I have seen women who look like Roxane who work at the DMV. If not for her color and gender, she wouldn't be out of place at a comic book convention. Dr. Gay holds a Ph.D. from Michigan Technological University, a school I have never heard of. It is located in Houghton, which is in the western part of the Upper Peninsula. She claims to have to lose 200 pounds in order to shop at Lane Bryant.

    Cannot imagine what she studied at Michigan Tech. It was founded prior to the war as a polytechnic institution. If they’ve been true to their foundational mission, the only research degrees you should be able to get there (if any) would be in applied science and engineering.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    That doesn't matter. You don't give A-'s to black women that weigh 400 lb, Art. Get out of the house once in a while...
    , @PiltdownMan
    From Wikipedia:

    She attended high school at Phillips Exeter Academy in New Hampshire.

    Gay began her undergraduate studies at Yale University but dropped out in her junior year to pursue a relationship in Arizona.She later completed her undergraduate degree at Vermont College of Norwich University and also earned an MA with an emphasis in creative writing from the University of Nebraska–Lincoln.In 2010, Gay received a Ph.D. in Rhetoric and Technical Communication from Michigan Technological University;
     
    , @Bill Jones
    Wouldn't her getting out of a chair qualify as a study in advanced mechanical engineering?
  45. @Altai
    DuVernay is apparently so annoying to work with that Kevin Feige removed her from directing Black Panther. Though a part of me does wonder what an Ana DuVernay action comic book movie would look like.

    In other woke news. The new Saved By The Bell reboot has cast a trans actor to play Lexi, the popular cheerleader. Mario Lopez is apparently a producer and this decision is said to likely be his attempt to make all the bad publicity over his comments on transgender children go away. (As well as maybe all that bad noise about a history of sexual assaults) It may also make the show somewhat cancel-proof.

    https://www.revelist.com/tv/josie-totah-saved-bell-reboot/17019/mario-lopez-came-under-fire-early-2019-after-making-some-transphobic-remarks-but-hes-since-apologized/5

    The actor is Josie Totah who is of Palestinian and Lebanese descent (Though I can't find any information on if they are a Christian family or Muslim, I presume Christian or at least atheists from a 'Muslim background' from 'Josie' and a lack of any 'first Muslim' stuff) who looks like the classic effeminate gay type of transgender. Could it be too shameful in his family for him to be gay? That's what he implies in this interview.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBmakndkAI0

    Here is a recent performance (Though given Totah is 16-17 here, maybe not the best representation of what he looks like now at 19 without his female getup. It's also interesting how often Indians and Arabs get used to play each other in Hollywood) and he is so short and slight he does kind of look like a girl trying to be a boy except for the voice. So hyper-effeminate and in this instance playing a gay character.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OO226wyNvw

    Here is a video from Lopez giving a first look at the production. The 'girl' in the pink top and green shorts is Totah. I saw the video and noticed the odd glance 'she' gives Lopez and I wondered if she was wary of him due to his alleged history of sexual assault but maybe Totah is still wary of Lopez on account of his previous comments.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/B7J0IZ9H79g/

    Wait a minute, are we talkin’ about the same Rebecca De Mornay here? I thought she was pretty hot in Risky Business. Man, I should keep up with these people in The National Enquirer more often… shouldn’t have let that subscription lapse.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    Did someone mention Rebecca De Mornay?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lg5fezriN8
  46. @Art Deco
    Cannot imagine what she studied at Michigan Tech. It was founded prior to the war as a polytechnic institution. If they've been true to their foundational mission, the only research degrees you should be able to get there (if any) would be in applied science and engineering.

    That doesn’t matter. You don’t give A-‘s to black women that weigh 400 lb, Art. Get out of the house once in a while…

  47. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    Like at 4:54?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Thank you, Art! One time I spent 10-15 minutes looking for this one. Someone must have put it back up. I hope you know I was joking in my reply to you above, BTW.
    , @International Jew
    No, he was way bigger than that. This guy's 250 tops. That guy, as it happens, later became the mayor of a city in California.
  48. @ScarletNumber
    I have seen women who look like Roxane who work at the DMV. If not for her color and gender, she wouldn't be out of place at a comic book convention. Dr. Gay holds a Ph.D. from Michigan Technological University, a school I have never heard of. It is located in Houghton, which is in the western part of the Upper Peninsula. She claims to have to lose 200 pounds in order to shop at Lane Bryant.

    Michigan Tech is a well respected engineering school up in the wilds of the Upper Peninsula. You go there to study and play hockey.

  49. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    …just in time to save my life

    We need a comment tag for this one:
    Holy sh*t.

  50. It would be worth it taking a gal like Roxanne to a Chinese buffet just to see the look on the staff’s faces.

    “Horry shit! We go banklupt!”

    Speaking of diversity, OT but very iSteve-esque….
    Recently inserted in the classic Guns n Roses “November Rain” video is a brief shot of a rainbow banner in the wedding vows portion at the 2:18 mark.

    • Replies: @Clifford Brown
    https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/6Feu-0pTjQh8gUXJTLN2Up85RbY=/0x0:3100x2067/920x613/filters:focal(1302x786:1798x1282)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/65633100/GettyImages_453671180.0.jpg

    That is the signage for the Rainbow Bar and Grill, a famous rock n roll bar, on the Sunset Strip in West Hollywood that was a favorite of the likes of Guns N Roses and Motorhead.
  51. @Art Deco
    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.

    A neighbor of ours, grossly obese like that woman, passed at +/- 45 years of age. Like our neighbor, her cruise through life may end a lot sooner than later.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    Whenever I see a morbidly obese person, the first thing that always come to my mind is "how do they wipe their butt?"
  52. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    Good Lord!

    I’ve heard of the disparaging term ‘thunder thighs’, but this is more a case of full bore full blown tropical cyclone.

  53. @Art Deco
    Cannot imagine what she studied at Michigan Tech. It was founded prior to the war as a polytechnic institution. If they've been true to their foundational mission, the only research degrees you should be able to get there (if any) would be in applied science and engineering.

    From Wikipedia:

    She attended high school at Phillips Exeter Academy in New Hampshire.

    Gay began her undergraduate studies at Yale University but dropped out in her junior year to pursue a relationship in Arizona.She later completed her undergraduate degree at Vermont College of Norwich University and also earned an MA with an emphasis in creative writing from the University of Nebraska–Lincoln.In 2010, Gay received a Ph.D. in Rhetoric and Technical Communication from Michigan Technological University;

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    In 2010, Gay received a Ph.D. in Rhetoric and Technical Communication from Michigan Technological University;
     
    As the guy in the Blink-182 video says:

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/--mZvTa4f_uY/UOyhcKMWefI/AAAAAAAAFTI/SxTkl78Jdxc/w1200-h630-p-nu/tom-delonge.jpg

    Follows Wiki link to MTU Humanities Dept....

    https://digitalcommons.mtu.edu/humanities-etd/#year_2010/


    “BECAUSE WE HAVE CHOSEN A LIFE OF PEACE”: A QUANTITATIVE AND QUALITATIVE STUDY OF VEGAN FOOD NARRATIVES

    STORIES FEEDING HISTORY IN THE RÍO DE LA PLATA: NEOLIBERAL CULTURAL APPROPRIATION IN ESPINOSA’S CARLOTA PODRIDA (2009) AND COHN AND DUPRAT’S EL CIUDADANO ILUSTRE (2016)

    THE IMPLICATIONS OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY FOR CHINESE WOMEN: A CULTURAL STUDY OF THE CHINESE ERA OF REFORMS
     
    As the great philosopher-poet Butthead once stated:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BcHSt3J1hs
    , @Barnard
    The Michigan Tech Humanities department doesn't sound any different than any other woke state school. They have examples on their website:

    -develop a feminist analysis of the ways in which media representations impact women’s agency in contemporary Ghana

    -critique the ambiguous role of comedians as public intellectuals in media representations of scientific controversies

    -research the impact of biometric verification technologies on political communication and democratic processes in a contemporary post-colonial context

    -study the challenges associated with developing writing centers in non-Western contexts
     
    I'm sure she could find a way to fit into that department. Wikipedia also says her family is Haitian and she was born in Omaha. What kind of connections do they have that got into Phillips Exeter and Yale?
  54. @ScarletNumber
    I have seen women who look like Roxane who work at the DMV. If not for her color and gender, she wouldn't be out of place at a comic book convention. Dr. Gay holds a Ph.D. from Michigan Technological University, a school I have never heard of. It is located in Houghton, which is in the western part of the Upper Peninsula. She claims to have to lose 200 pounds in order to shop at Lane Bryant.

    Houghton is located in the Keweenaw peninsula at the northernmost tip of Michigan’s Upper Peninsula. Houghton gets about seventeen feet of snow in an average winter; older houses often have an additional front door located located on the second floor of the house, for use during winter.

    Dr. Gay’s shape and girth are admirably suited to survival in the Keweenaw.

    Michigan Tech is known primarily for its Engineering degree programs, but also had one of the earliest technical writing programs. I didn’t know you could get a PhD in tech writing, but apparently you can.

    • Replies: @Ragno

    Michigan Tech is known primarily for its Engineering degree programs, but also had one of the earliest technical writing programs. I didn’t know you could get a PhD in tech writing, but apparently you can.
     
    You can if they're trying to kill two birds with one stone. Particularly if one of the birds is 41 stone.

    Although some shameful part of me looks forward to the prolix virtue-signaller Stephen King forced to publicly bow his head and submissively lick the hand of this wildebeeste. (Look on the bright side, Steve - there's probably barbecue sauce on that paw.)
  55. A bit OT but–the late English-American journalist, Alistair Cook (of “Omnibus” and “Masterpiece Theater” fame), once wrote that one of the road signs signalling a society in headlong decline is when what was heretofore considered freakish and bizarre becomes accepted–indeed CELEBRATED–behavior. Cultural historian Jacques Barzun made the same point in his book “Dawn to Decadence”, though in the latter case he suggested that once the bottom is reached (wherever that may be), the clock is re-wound as it were–a departure from the traditional linear view of history but food for thought nevertheless.

    • Replies: @Daniel Chieh

    A bit OT but–the late English-American journalist, Alistair Cook (of “Omnibus” and “Masterpiece Theater” fame), once wrote that one of the road signs signalling a society in headlong decline is when what was heretofore considered freakish and bizarre becomes accepted–indeed CELEBRATED–behavior.
     
    The demons have won.
  56. Steven King made God a black woman in The Stand, and even that doesn’t help him.

    • Replies: @Morris Applebaum IV
    There is no room for White men on the left. The bewildering thing is why so many haven't figured it out. Stephen King has two sons, he should show a little foresight.
  57. I would hate to be the EMT that responds to that 911 call .

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Que_Sera_Sera_(House)
  58. @PiltdownMan
    From Wikipedia:

    She attended high school at Phillips Exeter Academy in New Hampshire.

    Gay began her undergraduate studies at Yale University but dropped out in her junior year to pursue a relationship in Arizona.She later completed her undergraduate degree at Vermont College of Norwich University and also earned an MA with an emphasis in creative writing from the University of Nebraska–Lincoln.In 2010, Gay received a Ph.D. in Rhetoric and Technical Communication from Michigan Technological University;
     

    In 2010, Gay received a Ph.D. in Rhetoric and Technical Communication from Michigan Technological University;

    As the guy in the Blink-182 video says:

    Follows Wiki link to MTU Humanities Dept….

    https://digitalcommons.mtu.edu/humanities-etd/#year_2010/

    “BECAUSE WE HAVE CHOSEN A LIFE OF PEACE”: A QUANTITATIVE AND QUALITATIVE STUDY OF VEGAN FOOD NARRATIVES

    STORIES FEEDING HISTORY IN THE RÍO DE LA PLATA: NEOLIBERAL CULTURAL APPROPRIATION IN ESPINOSA’S CARLOTA PODRIDA (2009) AND COHN AND DUPRAT’S EL CIUDADANO ILUSTRE (2016)

    THE IMPLICATIONS OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY FOR CHINESE WOMEN: A CULTURAL STUDY OF THE CHINESE ERA OF REFORMS

    As the great philosopher-poet Butthead once stated:

  59. @Art Deco
    Cannot imagine what she studied at Michigan Tech. It was founded prior to the war as a polytechnic institution. If they've been true to their foundational mission, the only research degrees you should be able to get there (if any) would be in applied science and engineering.

    Wouldn’t her getting out of a chair qualify as a study in advanced mechanical engineering?

  60. What is exhausting to normies is constant bombardment of the grievance commentary by both the right and the left, which ought to be canceled.

    I would say that the average white American man and woman on the street, if you got them away from their sportsball, Instagram accounts, and hook-up activities, would not even know who the hell are the Ava DuVernay’s and Roxane Gay’s of the world.

    Normies have more important things to worry about like:

    –Trump’s continued malfeasance that Mr. Sailer remains cagey on (he just can’t afford to come clean, lest he loses his credibility among his adoring fanbois and fangirlz);
    –the treachery of the wealthy elites that threatens the existence of the middle class;
    –the rising health care costs;
    –the higher rates of depression among various age groups;
    –and many other things relevant to our lives.

    Although, given normies knack for not keeping up with the Nietzsche’s, Stoddard’s, Day’s, Murray’s, and Molyneaux’s of the world–our intellectual overlords–I suppose we need to critically analyze our anti-white proclivities lest we accelerate the impending race war of 2033. Otherwise, Normies deserve it good and hard, right?

    • Agree: notsaying
    • Troll: YetAnotherAnon
  61. @International Jew

    He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.
     

     
    They aren't mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you'll have less quality.

    To the left, “quality” does not exist in isolation. Diversity is itself a component of quality – unless a movie, university, etc. is “diverse” (which is just a code word for “has lots of black people in it”) then it is not of the highest possible quality. King’s notion that there is such a thing as “quality” that is independent of diversity is a old white man’s way of looking at things and will soon be dead.

    • Agree: El Dato, jim jones
    • LOL: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Old Prude
    OTOH most every time I notice diversity in arts and entertainment I find its appeal seriously degraded. Like a piece of feces in one’s ice cream or flatus from one’s date.
    , @istevefan
    Didn't Stalin once say that "diversity had a quality of its own"?
  62. White men are around 31% of the population in US. The stories told ‘by them’, and ‘of them’ is a vastly large percentage (60-80% maybe, more?).
    Without diversity, you can’t tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity

    I see this a lot in the business world. They have their clique and all claim that each other is the ‘best’ at everything. People hear it so often they begin to believe it

    To see this sense of white privilege from someone who many POC support because of their art is disappointing. The whole point of art is it’s diversity & it’s ability to break down & transcend all boundaries & notions of exclusion.

    If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you’re unaware

    We expect given his profile & intelligence a more thoughtful approach. We also recognise we are all working to increase understanding of complex matters. It’s not about him or you as individuals. It’s about moving our collective responsibility forward.

    • Replies: @notsaying
    "Without diversity, you can’t tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity"

    If by "diversity" you mean that works of art must include representation from all the major ethnic groups of the country where is was produced, then I have to disagree very strongly. There are many examples that prove this idea is wrong.

    "If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you’re unaware"

    You are asking that people not be tied to the place and era in which they were born and lived. You want no "bias". This is not possible. Even the most open and supposedly nonbiased people are all products of their time and place and circumstances. There are no unbiased people.
    , @MEH 0910
    https://twitter.com/nypost/status/1217940606812663815

    http://maryloukayser.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/sad-duck.jpg
    , @MEH 0910
    Tiny Duck, your comment was strip-mined for content and used in the twitter replies to an Ava DuVernay tweet by a gaggle of wokesters...with access to time travel. Ironically, the wholesale theft of your comment only ends up highlighting the lack of creativity in People of Color and their need to ape the White Man.

    https://twitter.com/ava/status/1217103032543932417

    https://twitter.com/ExtTrading/status/1217277923654238209

    https://twitter.com/authorkaye/status/1217119350873821185
    , @MEH 0910
    The First Street Journal:

    Saira Sameera Rao disappears from Twitter
    Posted by Editor on 17 December 2019, 7:00 am

    ******
    Well, you can follow those links, but you’ll find nothing, because, as reader Karolyn just informed me, Mrs Rao has discontinued her Twitter account.

    Of course, I didn’t check just her Twitter account, the thing which had first caught my attention. I checked her campaign website, and found that, as part of her biography, she stated that she co-founded In This Together Media, featuring “young adult and children’s books that feature black, brown, LGBTQ, and immigrant kids as central characters.” I have embedded the link to her campaign website, but, guess what, that’s gone, too.

    So, I checked the In This Together website, and she’s disappeared — been disappeared? — from that as well.
     
    https://twitter.com/Dana_TFSJ/status/1206936964320186368

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/federal-judge-huddled-masses-poem-isnt-technically-the-law-of-the-land-but-still-im-going-to-rule-as-if-it-were-the-zeroth-amendment/#comment-3501743
  63. @International Jew

    He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.
     

     
    They aren't mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you'll have less quality.

    Not necessarily.

    There have been great works of art (paintings, music, film, plays, etc., etc., etc.) which have had influences from different cultures.

    One example: a very strong case can be made that American music came about from a fusion of various European, West African and Native (*) cultures, in unequal amounts. American music has been the most influential music in the world for over 100 years.

    Another example, again with popular music: some European (such as George Harrison) and American (such as Paul Simon) popular music composers incorporated non-European and non-American musical traditions into their music.

    In the case of the late great George Harrison, I am not only referring to “Within You and Without You”. I remember seeing a YouTube clip of Dhani Harrison (the late George’s son) in the studio with Sir George Martin, going over the original tapes of “Here Comes the Sun”. The younger Mr. Harrison pointed out the Indian influences in the song. Mr. Martin replied: “you are just like your dad”.

    So, it is not only possible, but often very likely, for greater diversity to increase the quality. Of course, this sort of thing is now criticized as “cultural appropriation”, so you can’t win.

    (*) Native cultures doesn’t only mean Native American. There have been some great Native Hawaiian musicians. I don’t know enough to say if there have been great Inuit musicians, but that is very possible.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    I appreciate your desire to include Native American music as an influence but the truth is that, other than Hawaiian music (itself European influenced - the ukelele is from Portugal) which is more of a novelty or sideshow than a main element in American music, there is very little Native American contribution that has been incorporated into to what we think of as mainstream or popular "American" music. The musical systems were just too different.

    OTOH, the African influence on American music has been very substantial from earliest days and is fully intertwined into almost every important American musical genre, so that it is almost impossible to imagine American music without that influence. It would still exist but it would be something very different. Even genres that we think of as being mostly "white" such as bluegrass or country music have it - the banjo is an African instrument.

    Music, like athletics, is a less g loaded skill and so the African disadvantage in IQ, which has been an obstacle to their participation in so many intellectual fields, did not create the same difficulties for African participation in music.
    , @bomag
    Notice that George Harrison and Paul Simon went elsewhere; picked up the influence; and came back themselves. This is quite different than bringing the whole people and cultures over in hopes of some gain.

    Your analysis is true enough as far as it goes, but diversity is not a universal good: there are subtractive elements along with the additive ones. Adding dog doodoo to vanilla ice cream brings diversity, but not a positive experience. Sand in your engine oil adds diversity, but we're better without such.

    There is also continuum elements: an army division with just one weapon is sorely hampered; it is much better to have a diversity of weapons; but after awhile one can start to gather such a multitude of weapons that effectiveness is hampered by training and logistical considerations.
  64. “I would never consider diversity in matters of art. Only quality. It seems to me that to do otherwise would be wrong,”

    Why only “matters of art”, Stephen?

  65. After having the misfortune, out of sheer curiosity, of reading some of Roxane Gay’s work in The Guardian, I can conclusively say this for sure:

    She’s a big fat liar.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    After having the misfortune, out of sheer curiosity, of reading some of Roxane Gay’s work in The Guardian, I can conclusively say this for sure:She’s a big fat liar.





    To read one article may be regarded as a misfortune; to read two, looks like carelessness.
  66. @Art Deco
    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.

    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.

    She needs to accidentally run over a member of a gypsy family who puts a curse on her.

    • LOL: bomag
    • Replies: @Lugash
    +1
  67. @PiltdownMan
    From Wikipedia:

    She attended high school at Phillips Exeter Academy in New Hampshire.

    Gay began her undergraduate studies at Yale University but dropped out in her junior year to pursue a relationship in Arizona.She later completed her undergraduate degree at Vermont College of Norwich University and also earned an MA with an emphasis in creative writing from the University of Nebraska–Lincoln.In 2010, Gay received a Ph.D. in Rhetoric and Technical Communication from Michigan Technological University;
     

    The Michigan Tech Humanities department doesn’t sound any different than any other woke state school. They have examples on their website:

    -develop a feminist analysis of the ways in which media representations impact women’s agency in contemporary Ghana

    -critique the ambiguous role of comedians as public intellectuals in media representations of scientific controversies

    -research the impact of biometric verification technologies on political communication and democratic processes in a contemporary post-colonial context

    -study the challenges associated with developing writing centers in non-Western contexts

    I’m sure she could find a way to fit into that department. Wikipedia also says her family is Haitian and she was born in Omaha. What kind of connections do they have that got into Phillips Exeter and Yale?

    • Replies: @Hail

    Wikipedia also says her family is Haitian and she was born in Omaha. What kind of connections do they have that got into Phillips Exeter and Yale?
     
    In searching around for material related to my comment directly above on Roxane Gay's family origin, I chanced upon how she got into prestigious Phillips Exeter.

    From the best I can tell, she was admitted in 1988 and attended from Fall 1988 semester to Spring 1992 semester, a perch from which her springboard into Yale was easy enough (though did not graduate from Yale, transferring elsewhere).

    She got into Phillips Exeter through a program called "A Better Chance," one of the many 'No Whites Need Apply' programs out there, which have only proliferated in the past thirty years.


    A Better Chance helps academically-talented students of color access the best educational opportunities for middle school and high school.
     

    for over 50 years [founded in 1963 in NYC] we have specialized in helping families navigate the admissions process for college preparatory schools in order to obtain a quality education - which includes orienting families to financial aid processes and leveraging scholarship funds on their behalf.

    On average, it costs A Better Chance thousands of dollars to see each student successfully through our program. However, the services we provide to our families are free.
     

    https://www.abetterchance.org/admissions-and-programming/scholar-profile-detail/~board/timeline-and-profiles/post/roxane-gay-a-better-chance-alumna-92

    Roxane Gay, A Better Chance Alumna '92

    [A photo of Roxane Gay is internally captioned: "A woman of color looks heavenward with an amused smirk, her chin resting on her hands."]

    New York Times Best-Selling Author, Cultural Critic, Professor, and Force to be Reckoned with.

    ROXANE'S JOURNEY SINCE LEARNING OF A BETTER CHANCE

    Dr. Roxane Gay initially learned about A Better Chance from a guidance counselor at her junior high school. She went on to attend A Better Chance Member School Phillips Exeter Academy as a Scholar, graduating in 1992. After that, she studied as an undergraduate at Yale University before earning her BA from Vermont College of Norwich University. She then went on to pursue a Master of Arts from the University of Nebraska - Lincoln, and finally her PhD from Michigan Technical University.

    "I would say that A Better Chance opens up an entire world of possibility," says Roxane, on the subject of her experience.

    WHAT SHE'S UP TO NOW

    Roxane is changing the way we think about ourselves and others, especially around some of the most controversial social subjects of our time. She is well known as one of Twitter's leading lights, with well over half a million followers on that platform, and as an author whose works span fiction and nonfiction, from short story to novel to memoir to comic book. She also edited Best American Short Stories 2018, and, as Author of World of Wakanda, was the first black woman to lead a Marvel comic.

    Her other books include:

    - Ayiti
    - Bad Feminist
    - An Untamed State
    - Hunger
    - Not That Bad

    Roxane is currently an Associate Professor of Women's, Gender, and Sexuality Studies at Yale University
     

    The origins of this non-profit nonwhite-advocacy group A Better Chance are unclear but its current funding is provided through a series of huge corporate behemoths, the same ones that discriminate against White-Christians in hiring practices; see list of corporate sponsors here:

    https://www.abetterchance.org/partners/corporate-and-foundation-partners

    Top corporate funders listed are:

    ADP; American Express; BNY Mellon; Boeing; Citigroup Global Markets; Deloitte; Dodge & Cox; Ernst & Young; Fred C. and Katherine B. Andersen Foundation; Innisfree M&A Incorporated; Jockey Hollow Foundation; LightRiver Technologies; Morgan Stanley; National Basketball Association; News Corp; Nielsen; PriceWaterhouse Coopers; Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP; Stanley Black & Decker; State Street Global Advisors; TD Bank; Tesla; The Curtis W. McGraw Foundation; The John S. and James L. Knight Foundation; The Tides Foundation; UBS; Xerox.

  68. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    Thank you for posting that.

    Next time somebody asks me to sit right next some extremely fat person I will just tell them I don’t think it looks safe. That chair or seat or whatever looks to me like it is about to explode.

    If it is on an airplane the first employee that hears me quietly say that might explode shit into their pants.

  69. 6 foot 3 isn’t 2meters

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Right, I noticed that too. It'd be about 6' 9".
  70. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    If you tried, your hands and arms would’ve been crushed into powder. If that happened, you wouldn’t be typing.

  71. Drama!

    Black British Group Pens An Open Letter to the British Broadcast Media on Racism and Meghan Markle’

    http://influencher.org/index.php/2020/01/15/an-open-letter-to-the-british-broadcast-media-on-racism-and-meghan-markle/

    …Having to engage, articulate, and explain racism again and again to predominantly white hosts, white men, and white guests is draining and exhausting. It is frankly traumatizing and wearing to black people who continuously find themselves having to explain the presence and impact of racism to people who refuse to be educated.

    The concern is our emotional health. It is the toll, the emotional labour involved, the requirement of black commentators to measure and control their tone, their frustration, their exasperation, their response, even as white men disregard our experience and replace it with their non-existent expertise. It is more than just insulting. It has an impact on black people’s mental health, our emotional health. Racism is a mental health issue.

    The culture of racism in Great Britain means broadcast media are empowered to abandon the foundation of journalism—research, interviews with expertise, impartiality—and instead elevate ignorance, personal vendettas and uninformed opinion masquerading as expertise. Journalism’s rules are replaced, when it comes to race, by too many of these white hosts, without expectation of challenge.

    Professionally Aggrieved Black Women are furious that there was pushback on the Lived Experiences they relayed during discussions on British media outlets. Helpfully, they have attached a selection of the offending TV segments on to the end of their open letter, which reveal that this anger was sparked by not essentially being given free reign to wail that Britain and all its people are racist and nasty.

  72. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    This is your “culture” on minoritarianism.

  73. Who wins the actual single award if excellence is ignored in favor diversity? The whale/lady prolly prefers participation awards for the “good”-people and all others can dab her cornhole.

  74. @Harry Baldwin
    It is hard to sympathize with Roxanne Gay due to her outwardly directed anger, which one suspects is more about her own self-loathing than racism or politics. It seems absurd to listen to a social activist who can't even manage her own body. Jordan Peterson's advice to "clean your room" comes to mind.

    A few days ago an iSteve commenter posted a link to a music video of Hawaiian singer Israel Kamakawiwo'ole, who had a hit with his cover of "Somewhere Over the Rainbow." I found it moving. Israel died at 38 of congestive heart failure, brought on by what was clinically described as hyper-obesity: at 6'2", he weighed as much as 757 pounds, for a BMI of 97.2. His similarly hyper-obese younger brother had died of the same cause at 28. Israel was a mellow, popular performer of enormous talent and is greatly missed. One wonders why someone like him can't get control of his weight, when he knows it's a death sentence. But then, one wonders why so many great artists and musicians are so self-destructive.

    Fantastic post, but I am in nit-picking mode right now.

    Israel’s brother Skippy, who did indeed die of congestive heart failure at the age of 28, was the older, not the younger, brother. I think you meant to say that, but mis-typed.

    But that give me an excuse to repost a clip I posted in another thread, showing the two brothers when Skippy was mid 20s and Israel was late teens. Skippy is second from the left, playing the guitar. Iz is second from the right, playing the ukulele.

    Having seen them in person a few times around the time this video was made, I wanted to add — the tiny looking guy in the middle is actually an average sized man. The guy on the far right, who appears to be average sized, is a big guy, over 6′, who is just not AS big as the brothers.

  75. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    To old–racist, sexist, fat-shaming–me, it is ridiculous that anyone would be trotting this blob of blubber out to hold forth on anything. Her very physique screams “lazy”, “sloppy”, “incompetent”, “ill-disciplined” and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    ~~~

    One of the noticeable aspects of life under minoritarianism is that the ugly, sick, disordered is held up over the beautiful, healthy and sound.

    • Agree: Old Prude
    • Replies: @fish

    Her very physique screams “lazy”, “sloppy”, “incompetent”, “ill-disciplined” and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?
     
    Yeah....why?

    In any case, take a close look at your future....fat, stupid, and sullen!

    , @Whiskey
    That is the mark of a female society
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    "Trotting" her out? You are in better shape than this guy. Steve keeps going on about the "emotional labor", but let's get down to mechanical work. If Miss Gay were lying on a normal bed, with her center of mass, say, 2 ft. off the ground (let's make that the datum), and she stood up fully, bringing her CM up just by 1.5 ft, then that is 600 ft-lb, which is over 900 J, equaling about one fifth of a Calorie (big-C, the food ones, that equal 1 kilocalorie). That's if she got up perfectly efficiently, but I really doubt that. It's be quite a bit higher, then.

    It takes more than emotional labor to get out of bed when you have the mass of a Roxanne Gay. If she could just eat exactly what she burns during the day, then that extra getting out of bed part can reduce her weight by a lb every .... hold on ... every century and a half. You go, girl!

    , @Stebbing Heuer
    Bioleninism.
  76. @Harry Baldwin
    It is hard to sympathize with Roxanne Gay due to her outwardly directed anger, which one suspects is more about her own self-loathing than racism or politics. It seems absurd to listen to a social activist who can't even manage her own body. Jordan Peterson's advice to "clean your room" comes to mind.

    A few days ago an iSteve commenter posted a link to a music video of Hawaiian singer Israel Kamakawiwo'ole, who had a hit with his cover of "Somewhere Over the Rainbow." I found it moving. Israel died at 38 of congestive heart failure, brought on by what was clinically described as hyper-obesity: at 6'2", he weighed as much as 757 pounds, for a BMI of 97.2. His similarly hyper-obese younger brother had died of the same cause at 28. Israel was a mellow, popular performer of enormous talent and is greatly missed. One wonders why someone like him can't get control of his weight, when he knows it's a death sentence. But then, one wonders why so many great artists and musicians are so self-destructive.

    Periodic public service announcement: Body weight is 80 percent heritable in adulthood. IQ is 50 percent.

    Other traits like self control, “getting your shit together like I did,” and so on are themselves behavioral traits, also subject to heritability.

    • Replies: @Hail

    Body weight is 80 percent heritable in adulthood. IQ is 50 percent.
     
    And yet I doubt any of Roxanne Gay's grandparents were super-obese 500-pounders.

    I also understand that obesity is correlated with relatively lower IQ. Those who become obese early in life were measured to have average IQs 5+ points below those who were not obese; both must be associated with lower impulse control.
  77. @AnotherDad
    To old--racist, sexist, fat-shaming--me, it is ridiculous that anyone would be trotting this blob of blubber out to hold forth on anything. Her very physique screams "lazy", "sloppy", "incompetent", "ill-disciplined" and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    ~~~

    One of the noticeable aspects of life under minoritarianism is that the ugly, sick, disordered is held up over the beautiful, healthy and sound.

    Her very physique screams “lazy”, “sloppy”, “incompetent”, “ill-disciplined” and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    Yeah….why?

    In any case, take a close look at your future….fat, stupid, and sullen!

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna

    In any case, take a close look at your future….fat, stupid, and sullen!
     
    Also quite possibly your boss, as we noted in an earlier discussion.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-editor-after-failure-of-our-russia-mania-plan-a-weve-launched-our-racism-mania-plan-b/#comment-3396559
  78. Ava DuVernay’s Giant Five-Pound Glasses

    Ava DuVernay is bushed
    ’Cause her glasses so often need pushed.

    They slide down her nose so sebaceous,
    And she pushes them back. So tenacious!

    **********************************************************

    I never wanted to know about Ava DuVernay, but she’s all over Turner Classic Movies lately. She really does have to push up her jumbo glasses about twice a minute.

  79. @ScarletNumber
    I have seen women who look like Roxane who work at the DMV. If not for her color and gender, she wouldn't be out of place at a comic book convention. Dr. Gay holds a Ph.D. from Michigan Technological University, a school I have never heard of. It is located in Houghton, which is in the western part of the Upper Peninsula. She claims to have to lose 200 pounds in order to shop at Lane Bryant.

    >massively overweight black woman
    >took a degree at a tech school
    >in the UP
    Not saying you’re lying but I’m going to need to see transcripts and photographs before I believe this.

  80. @Paleo Liberal
    Not necessarily.

    There have been great works of art (paintings, music, film, plays, etc., etc., etc.) which have had influences from different cultures.

    One example: a very strong case can be made that American music came about from a fusion of various European, West African and Native (*) cultures, in unequal amounts. American music has been the most influential music in the world for over 100 years.

    Another example, again with popular music: some European (such as George Harrison) and American (such as Paul Simon) popular music composers incorporated non-European and non-American musical traditions into their music.

    In the case of the late great George Harrison, I am not only referring to "Within You and Without You". I remember seeing a YouTube clip of Dhani Harrison (the late George's son) in the studio with Sir George Martin, going over the original tapes of "Here Comes the Sun". The younger Mr. Harrison pointed out the Indian influences in the song. Mr. Martin replied: "you are just like your dad".

    So, it is not only possible, but often very likely, for greater diversity to increase the quality. Of course, this sort of thing is now criticized as "cultural appropriation", so you can't win.




    (*) Native cultures doesn't only mean Native American. There have been some great Native Hawaiian musicians. I don't know enough to say if there have been great Inuit musicians, but that is very possible.

    I appreciate your desire to include Native American music as an influence but the truth is that, other than Hawaiian music (itself European influenced – the ukelele is from Portugal) which is more of a novelty or sideshow than a main element in American music, there is very little Native American contribution that has been incorporated into to what we think of as mainstream or popular “American” music. The musical systems were just too different.

    OTOH, the African influence on American music has been very substantial from earliest days and is fully intertwined into almost every important American musical genre, so that it is almost impossible to imagine American music without that influence. It would still exist but it would be something very different. Even genres that we think of as being mostly “white” such as bluegrass or country music have it – the banjo is an African instrument.

    Music, like athletics, is a less g loaded skill and so the African disadvantage in IQ, which has been an obstacle to their participation in so many intellectual fields, did not create the same difficulties for African participation in music.

    • Replies: @Old Prude
    African AMERICANS contributed mightily to American music. Africans in Africa, not exposed to the black experience in America and that particular unique culture and environment (in inimate proximity to white culture, I might add) contributed near nothing.
    , @donvonburg
    Actually, the banjo is mostly an English instrument. Blacks in America were building "twangers" with strings out of anything convenient, as blacks in Africa now build oil can guitars, but prior to the arrival of whites sub-saharan Africans had no instrument besides a drum, and it was not even a very good drum.

    Blacks went through a phase in America where a lot of black entertainers played banjos, but today virtually no blacks play banjo. It would be seen as Uncle Tom'ing. The banjos were homemade or inexpensive copies of high quality British instruments. Later on, American makers like Vega and Gibson developed a more American style of banjo for banjo orchestras and later Dixieland bands, often extremely ornate and expensive. These came in various sizes, mostly with four strings, tuned in fifths, much like mandolin family instruments. (The banjo orchestra, like the mandolin orchestra, the steel guitar orchestra, and even the accordion orchestra, was a social/musical marketing scheme now utterly forgotten. Music stores would start an Orchestra that you got in by buying your instrument from them, taking lessons and often buying a uniform, sheet music and the rest, and they would give public performances no one besides the players' families could be shanghaied into attending. Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)

    (When country music was invented the more successful country performers would have those companies make these expensive models in a five string configuration with a fifth "tag string", tuned to an open chordal tuning. Several were once popular but today open G is pretty ubiquitous. Now the vast majority of the vintage Gibson Mastertone banjos out there were made as tenor or plectrum instruments and either fitted with a whole new neck or the original neck was butchered into the five string configuration. Everyone has to have a Gibson Mastertone because that's what Earl Scruggs had when he played with Saint Bill, of course.)

    One problem was that stringed instruments require strings, either metal, carefully processed intestine, or modern synthetics like nylon monofilment. Blacks in sub saharan Africa lacked the metal working techniques to make metal wire, did not have the discipline or the inclination to make animal intestine catgut strings, and obviously no nylon or other such materials. They had vines, but a vine is not going to give a good musical note.

    Just because a thread or wire is under tension does not mean it will make a musical note anyone would recognize. Try stringing a guitar with copper wire or soft iron wire sometime. It will make a noise, but not a clear note.

    I remember a trick used by a couple of those old-Branson-style country/gospel music shows who had a promoter/emcee who actually had no musical skills or abilities whatever. They would "play" the upright bass, usually an inexpensive plywood bass they'd had a local auto body place spray some outlandish rockabilly looking paint scheme on. They would string it with regular packaging string or twine, or a thin manila or marine rope, so it would make a thump or twang with no distinct note. They just had to watch someone who actually could play bass to see more or less where the fingers went so they could look like they actually could play it. Of course, they used the same finger positions no matter what key the band was in, but only someone who could actually play double bass would notice, and they were usually kind enough not to comment.

  81. @Jack D
    To the left, "quality" does not exist in isolation. Diversity is itself a component of quality - unless a movie, university, etc. is "diverse" (which is just a code word for "has lots of black people in it") then it is not of the highest possible quality. King's notion that there is such a thing as "quality" that is independent of diversity is a old white man's way of looking at things and will soon be dead.

    OTOH most every time I notice diversity in arts and entertainment I find its appeal seriously degraded. Like a piece of feces in one’s ice cream or flatus from one’s date.

  82. Wikipedia lists 52 movies based on novels or short stories written by Stephen King. By being so prolific, he is conducting a one-man campaign to block authors of color from optioning more books about their lived experience for film.

    • Replies: @gwood
    King gives first time directors the movie rights to any of his short stories for one dollar.
  83. @Art Deco
    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.

    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.

    Maybe you haven’t heard, but conventional weight standards are a form of white supremacy and heteronormativity.

    Checkmate, bigot.

  84. @Jack D
    I appreciate your desire to include Native American music as an influence but the truth is that, other than Hawaiian music (itself European influenced - the ukelele is from Portugal) which is more of a novelty or sideshow than a main element in American music, there is very little Native American contribution that has been incorporated into to what we think of as mainstream or popular "American" music. The musical systems were just too different.

    OTOH, the African influence on American music has been very substantial from earliest days and is fully intertwined into almost every important American musical genre, so that it is almost impossible to imagine American music without that influence. It would still exist but it would be something very different. Even genres that we think of as being mostly "white" such as bluegrass or country music have it - the banjo is an African instrument.

    Music, like athletics, is a less g loaded skill and so the African disadvantage in IQ, which has been an obstacle to their participation in so many intellectual fields, did not create the same difficulties for African participation in music.

    African AMERICANS contributed mightily to American music. Africans in Africa, not exposed to the black experience in America and that particular unique culture and environment (in inimate proximity to white culture, I might add) contributed near nothing.

    • Replies: @Laurence Whelk

    African AMERICANS contributed mightily to American music
     
    Granted, but they ran out of steam in the 1980s. After nearly a century of groundbreaking stylistic revolutions their musical ship ran aground on hip-hop and has been stuck there, derelict, ever since.

    For decades they have made infantile productions using drum machines developed by the Japanese, recording and sampling technologies created by whites of various descent, butchering a language they didn’t create. All they had to offer was limited subject matter - drugs/money/guns/bitches/hate whitey and the liberal use of the N-word as noun, verb, adjective and punctuation.

    Run. Aground.
  85. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    Please note if you download this picture, it’s hideously labelled:

    roxanegaysuperJumbo

    (my emphasis, not theirs, though)

  86. @AnotherDad
    To old--racist, sexist, fat-shaming--me, it is ridiculous that anyone would be trotting this blob of blubber out to hold forth on anything. Her very physique screams "lazy", "sloppy", "incompetent", "ill-disciplined" and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    ~~~

    One of the noticeable aspects of life under minoritarianism is that the ugly, sick, disordered is held up over the beautiful, healthy and sound.

    That is the mark of a female society

  87. Just because someone is fat doesn’t mean he or she doesn’t have something to contribute. I’ve known fat people who are really smart, funny, artistic, etc.

    But Stephen King is absolutely right. When you judge art, you should ignore who created it. When I read a novel, I don’t first read a bio on the author. I don’t care if he or she was a ditch digger from Tennessee who bravely overcame racism and so on to become an artist. I mean, that might be an interesting story in its own right, but it has no relevance in the moment of my reading that novel. Or enjoying that musical composition, or painting, or sculpture.

    I love the fact that so many of the artists whose works I enjoy do have a diverse background – including the old European masters. Leonardo was a very different character than Michaelangelo. But… I don’t care about that background when I’m appreciating their art.

    I have a great appreciation for some black thinkers and artists. I think Thomas Sowell is a brilliant economist and his books make complex concepts understandable, which is a great gift and a mark of his genius. I love Zora Neale Hurston’s books. I enjoy some of the classic black jazz artists. However, I can’t stand rap, hip hop or any of that. I would rather listen to Bach. Does that make me a racist? No, it just makes me someone who has my own artistic sensibility.

    People who keep trying to inject race, gender and all of that crap into everything are morons.

  88. It’s probably too much to hope for, but wouldn’t it be great if King decided to ride this and spend some time hammering on the raw weirdness of arguing that you can’t judge the quality of a work of art without knowing what its creator looked like?

  89. @Art Deco
    Like at 4:54?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xv2VIEY9-A8

    Thank you, Art! One time I spent 10-15 minutes looking for this one. Someone must have put it back up. I hope you know I was joking in my reply to you above, BTW.

    • Replies: @duncsbaby
    Best not to incur the wrath of the Deco, he once called me a knuckle-head for my shenanigans.
  90. BTW, if you are good enough as an artist, thinker, whatever, you can overcome prejudice.

    Read up on Ramunajan. He was so d*mned brilliant, the British catered to him. Look at the history of black musicians in America. Whites would flout segregation laws and sneak into clubs to listen to the greats.

    We live in a time now where racism could theoretically play very little role in society. I am not white. When I was a kid I experienced discrimination. I’ve seen that become less and less of an issue as time goes on.

    Does it still exist? Yes. But part of the reason it still exists is that people keep harping on it. If the SJW would just give it a rest, society would basically integrate. NO ONE in our society is going to ‘dis on Aretha Franklin, for example, or Tina Turner.

    At this point in our culture, if you are a black (or brown) artist and you are actually good, you will have hordes of adoring fans of all colors flock to you.

    I think the diversity crap is being used by mediocre artists in the same way that the transgender cared is being used by mediocre male athletes. Can’t compete in a race on your own merits? CAll yourself a girl and beat the panties off of them.

    Similarly, if you’re a mediocre writer (which Coates is) then publish race-based diatribes and watch everyone sing your praises. It was like Obama – he was a mediocrity but thanks to his race he is lionized. It’s sickening.

    It’s much better for ALL of us, including blacks, to have a meritocracy. Maybe there will be fewer black paragons, but they will be sincerely appreciated. OTOH, maybe there would be more black paragons if they knew they had to hew to the same standards? That’s a fine thought, huh?

    • Replies: @notsaying
    There may be less overt racism than there used to be.

    But there are a lot of people who are getting shut out of the arts and arts-related jobs because they don't have the money to participate. They couldn't afford to go to the right schools, they don't know anyone who get get them a job, they couldn't afford to work for free as an intern. These are vital parts of getting to play the game in publishing, Hollywood, etc.

    So while I agree with King that when he judged an Oscar nominated work he shouldn't care about who did it, I think the people who complain that there's a lot of people who end up left out of Hollywood are right. It just so happens that these are people of every race and ethnic background. Just because Hollywood is dominated by whites doesn't mean that all whites have an equal chance to get a job there.
    , @Eagle Eye

    Read up on Ramunajan. He was so d*mned brilliant, the British catered to him.
     
    Sadly, the British did not literally "cater" to him - he experienced serious difficulty finding appropriate vegan cuisine in England.
  91. Seems to me Roxane has had pretty good long life for someone of her gravity. Could be she feels she needs to retain her girth to keep her status; hopefully she won’t have to pay too heavy a price.

    A few Roxane fun fat facts:

    Roxane Gay is the author of The New York Times best-selling essay collection Bad Feminist (2014), as well as the short story collection Difficult Women (2017), and the memoir Hunger (2017).

    Gay is a contributing opinion writer at The New York Times, founder of Tiny Hardcore Press, essays editor for The Rumpus, and co-editor of PANK, a nonprofit literary arts collective.

    The Butter ceased publishing in August 2015 with Gay stating she was “simply stretched too thin.

    Gay was featured in a five-minute segment of This American Life on June 17, 2016, talking about her body, and how she is perceived as a fat person.

    She also edited the book Girl Crush: Women’s Erotic Fantasies.

    In addition to her regular contributions to Salon and the now defunct HTMLGiant, her writing has appeared in Best Sex Writing 2012.

    In April 2018, Gay partnered with Medium to create a month-long pop-up magazine called Unruly Bodies.

    In 2019, Gay and Medium went on to create a new publication called “Gay Magazine”, specialising in cultural criticism.

  92. @AnotherDad
    To old--racist, sexist, fat-shaming--me, it is ridiculous that anyone would be trotting this blob of blubber out to hold forth on anything. Her very physique screams "lazy", "sloppy", "incompetent", "ill-disciplined" and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    ~~~

    One of the noticeable aspects of life under minoritarianism is that the ugly, sick, disordered is held up over the beautiful, healthy and sound.

    “Trotting” her out? You are in better shape than this guy. Steve keeps going on about the “emotional labor”, but let’s get down to mechanical work. If Miss Gay were lying on a normal bed, with her center of mass, say, 2 ft. off the ground (let’s make that the datum), and she stood up fully, bringing her CM up just by 1.5 ft, then that is 600 ft-lb, which is over 900 J, equaling about one fifth of a Calorie (big-C, the food ones, that equal 1 kilocalorie). That’s if she got up perfectly efficiently, but I really doubt that. It’s be quite a bit higher, then.

    It takes more than emotional labor to get out of bed when you have the mass of a Roxanne Gay. If she could just eat exactly what she burns during the day, then that extra getting out of bed part can reduce her weight by a lb every …. hold on … every century and a half. You go, girl!

  93. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    Absolute unit, she should be breeding the next generation of offensive linemen instead of writing about being fat

  94. I agree with you Steve but did you have to make fun of Ms. Gay’s physical appearance? Are you a 10 year old playground bully?

    • Troll: Daniel Chieh
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    Her 'appearance' is a surface manifestation of problems of concupiscence which are off the charts. You have to ask yourself about the influence of these problems on her thinking, or about what latent factors generating these problems also generate patterns in her thinking. She's a soi-disant 'feminist'.
    , @Jack D
    If, God forbid, Ms. Gay had been born with cerebral palsy or another birth defect, or even if she was mildly plump, then it would be bullying to mention her appearance. But hyper-obesity of the type that Ms. Gay exhibits is something that is within her control (if nothing else she could, and should, have bariatric surgery). And her failure to do anything about it shows an extreme character defect and is fair grounds for comment. She really is in no position to give anyone advice about anything except perhaps what the dinner special is at Friday's.
  95. @Jack D
    To the left, "quality" does not exist in isolation. Diversity is itself a component of quality - unless a movie, university, etc. is "diverse" (which is just a code word for "has lots of black people in it") then it is not of the highest possible quality. King's notion that there is such a thing as "quality" that is independent of diversity is a old white man's way of looking at things and will soon be dead.

    Didn’t Stalin once say that “diversity had a quality of its own”?

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Quantity, not diversity. Big difference between a generation of Homo sovietici making dead Germans their production and frogs laughing at Cupid's cavalry (when the Tsar sent under-armed Turkic peoples against Napoleon; Napoleon lost but not because of the affirmative action archers).
  96. @International Jew

    He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.
     

     
    They aren't mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you'll have less quality.

    It’s a tacit admission by King’s critics that diversity and quality are two different things

    Before it was “diversity will bring more great quality you never would have seen otherwise!” in the opening salvos of #OscarsSo(((white))) but now they openly call for diversity OVER quality. Really the only solution is to boycott the entire industry and let the pedophiles and communists running it go broke or change their tune when the Chinese become the chief backers of quality film

  97. @Altai
    DuVernay is apparently so annoying to work with that Kevin Feige removed her from directing Black Panther. Though a part of me does wonder what an Ana DuVernay action comic book movie would look like.

    In other woke news. The new Saved By The Bell reboot has cast a trans actor to play Lexi, the popular cheerleader. Mario Lopez is apparently a producer and this decision is said to likely be his attempt to make all the bad publicity over his comments on transgender children go away. (As well as maybe all that bad noise about a history of sexual assaults) It may also make the show somewhat cancel-proof.

    https://www.revelist.com/tv/josie-totah-saved-bell-reboot/17019/mario-lopez-came-under-fire-early-2019-after-making-some-transphobic-remarks-but-hes-since-apologized/5

    The actor is Josie Totah who is of Palestinian and Lebanese descent (Though I can't find any information on if they are a Christian family or Muslim, I presume Christian or at least atheists from a 'Muslim background' from 'Josie' and a lack of any 'first Muslim' stuff) who looks like the classic effeminate gay type of transgender. Could it be too shameful in his family for him to be gay? That's what he implies in this interview.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBmakndkAI0

    Here is a recent performance (Though given Totah is 16-17 here, maybe not the best representation of what he looks like now at 19 without his female getup. It's also interesting how often Indians and Arabs get used to play each other in Hollywood) and he is so short and slight he does kind of look like a girl trying to be a boy except for the voice. So hyper-effeminate and in this instance playing a gay character.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OO226wyNvw

    Here is a video from Lopez giving a first look at the production. The 'girl' in the pink top and green shorts is Totah. I saw the video and noticed the odd glance 'she' gives Lopez and I wondered if she was wary of him due to his alleged history of sexual assault but maybe Totah is still wary of Lopez on account of his previous comments.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/B7J0IZ9H79g/

    Gonna go out on a limb and assume his family is not Muslim.

    And did Mindy Kaling really play his mother in that show? Biological mother? She lectures us about racism but is ok with people thinking Dravidians and Arabs are the same lol

    • Replies: @Altai
    He's got a hooked nose and jet black eyes so by Hollywood rules he can play anything from an Arab to a Jew to a Turk to an Armenian to a Persian to a Sub-continental and everything inbetween.

    I just find it funny because the most famous Arab TV character of recent times was Abed on Community who was supposedly Palestinian but played but an actor of Indian descent, Danny Pudi. (Though Pudi is apparently mixed with a Polish mother and Telegu father who must have been really dark) And here we have the turnabout of an actor of Palestinian ancestry playing a character named Michael Patel.
  98. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    Roxane Gay went on to say “Bargon wan che copa. Nee choo!” before eating a frog and slithering off the stage.

    • LOL: fish
  99. @donut
    I would hate to be the EMT that responds to that 911 call .
    • Replies: @donut
    Art , if I may or would you prefer Mr. Deco ? Any way , working at an inner city hosp. in Baltimore this type of patient was not uncommon . As I recall they were not unpleasant people to deal with as so many ghetto dwellers could be . They would get put in a "big boy" bed , about a full size mattress with compartments that filled with air on an alternating sequence . Still at 500 + lbs. both butt cheeks had large decubitus ulcers and some more on the backs of their thighs , some of the males even had them on their ball sack . They would eat and pass waste , it took three people to turn them and another three to give them a perfunctory wipe down and if ordered place a half assed , no pun intended , dressing and change the sheets . It was a drill . Changed maybe twice in a 12 hour shift in the hospital what kind of care did they get at home ? Some were stoic or maybe resigned . I remember a 27 y/o female doing her best to stay ambulatory ; she had a 6 y/o daughter at home that she couldn't keep up with and knew she wouldn't live to see grow up . I know there are a lot of sorry , lazy , weak , fat ass motherf**kers out there but to get that big that young I don't know , there must be something more .
  100. Academy members award the “Best Picture” Oscar to the film they believe has the highest quality, not to the one that has the highest “diversity quotient”.

    Poor Stephen King. In times of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

  101. @Blogger
    I agree with you Steve but did you have to make fun of Ms. Gay's physical appearance? Are you a 10 year old playground bully?

    Her ‘appearance’ is a surface manifestation of problems of concupiscence which are off the charts. You have to ask yourself about the influence of these problems on her thinking, or about what latent factors generating these problems also generate patterns in her thinking. She’s a soi-disant ‘feminist’.

  102. @Foreign Expert
    6 foot 3 isn’t 2meters

    Right, I noticed that too. It’d be about 6′ 9″.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    2 m = 6' 6¾"
    , @res
    I thought you were an engineer?!
  103. Bravo to Mr. Stephen King.

  104. Brings to mind a gag from that celebrated English comedian, Jim Davidson:

    “I’m sure Linford Christie is hiding Chris Eubanks in his shorts”.

  105. He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts

    Orthogonal?

  106. @International Jew

    He has since been criticized by leading Hollywood names and authors saying his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are mutually exclusive.

    No, his argument centers on the idea that quality and diversity are different concepts.
     

     
    They aren't mutually exclusive but they certainly are competing goals. Want more diversity? You can still have quality, but you'll have less quality.

    The Stephen King Corporation has been infected by the Black Lady Virus (BLV). Schadenfreude. The SailerSimulation is throwing a bone to the suckers who never really existed.

  107. @AndrewR
    Gonna go out on a limb and assume his family is not Muslim.

    And did Mindy Kaling really play his mother in that show? Biological mother? She lectures us about racism but is ok with people thinking Dravidians and Arabs are the same lol

    He’s got a hooked nose and jet black eyes so by Hollywood rules he can play anything from an Arab to a Jew to a Turk to an Armenian to a Persian to a Sub-continental and everything inbetween.

    I just find it funny because the most famous Arab TV character of recent times was Abed on Community who was supposedly Palestinian but played but an actor of Indian descent, Danny Pudi. (Though Pudi is apparently mixed with a Polish mother and Telegu father who must have been really dark) And here we have the turnabout of an actor of Palestinian ancestry playing a character named Michael Patel.

  108. @Rob McX
    Nature was about to make three angry black women but decided to roll them all into one.

    “Nature”

    That was Steve’s idea.

  109. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    The 400 lb man was unhurt

    That’s just it though. These people have so much padding, they never get hurt. It’s always the rest of us.

  110. The principle is perfectly correct. A truism. Simple common sense.

    But Stephen King wouldn’t know quality from his asshole.

    I mean, Stephen King? Are you kidding me?

    That’s what makes this whole little fake-news, all-publicity-is-good-publicity tempest-in-a-teapot so absurd.

    Stephen King defending quality? Stephen King? Stephen King? Is this some kind of a joke?

    I can’t stop upchucking long enough to express how absurd this is.

    • Agree: Old Prude
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    This plus he has been trying to be the very Hierophant of Wokeness on Twitter for years now. He's a pseudo-intelligent money-chasing pulp hack, but he's definitely not so dumb that he shouldn't have seen this coming from as far away as that truck that hit him.
    , @fish

    I can’t stop upchucking long enough to express how absurd this is.
     
    You stopped upchucking long enough to drop by and post another one of your whiny comments.
  111. @Prester John
    A bit OT but--the late English-American journalist, Alistair Cook (of "Omnibus" and "Masterpiece Theater" fame), once wrote that one of the road signs signalling a society in headlong decline is when what was heretofore considered freakish and bizarre becomes accepted--indeed CELEBRATED--behavior. Cultural historian Jacques Barzun made the same point in his book "Dawn to Decadence", though in the latter case he suggested that once the bottom is reached (wherever that may be), the clock is re-wound as it were--a departure from the traditional linear view of history but food for thought nevertheless.

    A bit OT but–the late English-American journalist, Alistair Cook (of “Omnibus” and “Masterpiece Theater” fame), once wrote that one of the road signs signalling a society in headlong decline is when what was heretofore considered freakish and bizarre becomes accepted–indeed CELEBRATED–behavior.

    The demons have won.

  112. @Mr. Anon
    Steven King made God a black woman in The Stand, and even that doesn't help him.

    There is no room for White men on the left. The bewildering thing is why so many haven’t figured it out. Stephen King has two sons, he should show a little foresight.

    • Replies: @Clifford Brown
    Stephen King is worth hundreds of millions of dollars and lives in Maine. He has no idea as to what is going on.

    Despite his many faults, King did write and direct the film Maximum Overdrive and for that we should eternally be grateful.
  113. @Paleo Liberal
    Not necessarily.

    There have been great works of art (paintings, music, film, plays, etc., etc., etc.) which have had influences from different cultures.

    One example: a very strong case can be made that American music came about from a fusion of various European, West African and Native (*) cultures, in unequal amounts. American music has been the most influential music in the world for over 100 years.

    Another example, again with popular music: some European (such as George Harrison) and American (such as Paul Simon) popular music composers incorporated non-European and non-American musical traditions into their music.

    In the case of the late great George Harrison, I am not only referring to "Within You and Without You". I remember seeing a YouTube clip of Dhani Harrison (the late George's son) in the studio with Sir George Martin, going over the original tapes of "Here Comes the Sun". The younger Mr. Harrison pointed out the Indian influences in the song. Mr. Martin replied: "you are just like your dad".

    So, it is not only possible, but often very likely, for greater diversity to increase the quality. Of course, this sort of thing is now criticized as "cultural appropriation", so you can't win.




    (*) Native cultures doesn't only mean Native American. There have been some great Native Hawaiian musicians. I don't know enough to say if there have been great Inuit musicians, but that is very possible.

    Notice that George Harrison and Paul Simon went elsewhere; picked up the influence; and came back themselves. This is quite different than bringing the whole people and cultures over in hopes of some gain.

    Your analysis is true enough as far as it goes, but diversity is not a universal good: there are subtractive elements along with the additive ones. Adding dog doodoo to vanilla ice cream brings diversity, but not a positive experience. Sand in your engine oil adds diversity, but we’re better without such.

    There is also continuum elements: an army division with just one weapon is sorely hampered; it is much better to have a diversity of weapons; but after awhile one can start to gather such a multitude of weapons that effectiveness is hampered by training and logistical considerations.

  114. Turner Classic Movies (TCM) has been shoving Ava DuVernay down viewers’ throats for some time now. One would hope that a channel that specializes in classic films would be safe from this kind of propaganda, but no, there is nowhere they will leave us alone.

  115. @International Jew
    I wouldn't want to sit next to her. I once sat next to a 400 lb man whose chair suddenly collapsed under him, and I got out of the way just in time to save my life. (The 400 lb man was unhurt. Apologies to anyone here who thinks I should have tried to catch him.)

    There is no need to apologize to those who demand the impossible of you.

  116. OT: Is Steve going to post about Rep. Pressley revealing that she is a bald Wakandan Warrior now due to Alopecia?

  117. @Old Prude
    African AMERICANS contributed mightily to American music. Africans in Africa, not exposed to the black experience in America and that particular unique culture and environment (in inimate proximity to white culture, I might add) contributed near nothing.

    African AMERICANS contributed mightily to American music

    Granted, but they ran out of steam in the 1980s. After nearly a century of groundbreaking stylistic revolutions their musical ship ran aground on hip-hop and has been stuck there, derelict, ever since.

    For decades they have made infantile productions using drum machines developed by the Japanese, recording and sampling technologies created by whites of various descent, butchering a language they didn’t create. All they had to offer was limited subject matter – drugs/money/guns/bitches/hate whitey and the liberal use of the N-word as noun, verb, adjective and punctuation.

    Run. Aground.

    • Agree: Old Prude
  118. @Bardon Kaldian
    Why are blacks so prone to obesity?

    And: Hollywood has nothing to do with "art", define art as you wish...

    RACISM !!

  119. @Bardon Kaldian
    Why are blacks so prone to obesity?

    And: Hollywood has nothing to do with "art", define art as you wish...

    They eat a high sugar/carbohydrate diet. Also, they never evolved a genetic tolerance for sugar. Europeans and Asians possessed alcohol, wheat, rice, etc for thousands of years. Italians have a much lower rate of alcoholism than native Americans likely due to countless generations of natural selection. The real bingers likely died off years ago.

    Also, pointing out black obesity is racist. Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    This is actually kind of fascinating and it really illustrates thay whole hyper-over-confidence thing. Feminism shmeminism, women in any culture can be expected to fear rejection, and weight is a universal barometer with meaningless minor variations and a consistent rule.
    , @donut
    I remember walking out on that movie but I can't remember why .
    , @Reg Cæsar

    Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.
     
    They're also the only demographic (except perhaps American Indians) in which women have caught up to men.

    Next time some whiny wahine pulls the "79¢-to-the-$" gambit on you, ask if she would be willing to adopt the standard of living of black Americans if it meant equality for her.
  120. I’m a tolerant person. I’m not very spiteful. I am probably more “open-minded” than the median commenter here.

    I can not tolerate a person like Gay attempting to be an authority on any subject. How can you expect her to have any rigor in her work?

    • Replies: @res

    I can not tolerate a person like Gay attempting to be an authority on any subject.
     
    I can tolerate her attempting it. What I can not tolerate is the people who give her a platform because they think what she says is worthwhile.
  121. @Bardon Kaldian
    Why are blacks so prone to obesity?

    And: Hollywood has nothing to do with "art", define art as you wish...

    Poor impulse control and inability to conceptualize future consequences from present actions.

  122. @JimB
    Wikipedia lists 52 movies based on novels or short stories written by Stephen King. By being so prolific, he is conducting a one-man campaign to block authors of color from optioning more books about their lived experience for film.

    King gives first time directors the movie rights to any of his short stories for one dollar.

  123. @anonotron
    Have you heard of Berkson's paradox? It's about how it can be possible to observe a negative correlation between features of a sub-population that does not exist in the whole population.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkson%27s_paradox

    In this context, consider if Academy Awards voters change how they consider movies to a criterion based on quality and diversity, rather than juts quality alone. Choosing films on this basis can, through Berkson's paradox, mean that the movies you select have a negative correlation between quality and diversity. This is because for a less diverse movie to be select it must be that much higher in quality, and vice-versa. People may begin to notice that the better movies are the least diverse ones.

    That’s interesting. Thanks.

  124. @AnotherDad
    To old--racist, sexist, fat-shaming--me, it is ridiculous that anyone would be trotting this blob of blubber out to hold forth on anything. Her very physique screams "lazy", "sloppy", "incompetent", "ill-disciplined" and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?

    ~~~

    One of the noticeable aspects of life under minoritarianism is that the ugly, sick, disordered is held up over the beautiful, healthy and sound.

    Bioleninism.

  125. A review of GoogleScholar doesn’t reveal any actual scholarship. There are some creative pieces. It’s indicative of the ruin in higher education that there are schools offering research degrees in ‘writing’. The one she attended was founded to train mining engineers. Another indication is that she appears to have been hired-to-tenure at Perdue (which was originally a technology and engineering campus) after time at one of Illinois’ state colleges. She was dissatisfied at Purdue and was hired for a visiting position at Yale. You have two research universities in succession hiring a woman who has never published any actual research. She’s a mascot.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego_Chicken

    • Agree: Mr McKenna
  126. @Kronos
    They eat a high sugar/carbohydrate diet. Also, they never evolved a genetic tolerance for sugar. Europeans and Asians possessed alcohol, wheat, rice, etc for thousands of years. Italians have a much lower rate of alcoholism than native Americans likely due to countless generations of natural selection. The real bingers likely died off years ago.

    Also, pointing out black obesity is racist. Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    https://youtu.be/XA62refAB2w

    Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    This is actually kind of fascinating and it really illustrates thay whole hyper-over-confidence thing. Feminism shmeminism, women in any culture can be expected to fear rejection, and weight is a universal barometer with meaningless minor variations and a consistent rule.

    • Replies: @Kronos

    Feminism shmeminism, women in any culture can be expected to fear rejection, and weight is a universal barometer with meaningless minor variations and a consistent rule.
     
    https://youtu.be/9AajslFuPro
  127. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    I’m sure I’ve seen her in one of those World Star videos at Disney World using a mobility scooter/buggy as a battering ram.

  128. @Anonymous

    She needs a personal trainer and bariatric surgery. Maybe Anti-Gnostic knows someone.
     
    She needs to accidentally run over a member of a gypsy family who puts a curse on her.

    http://d28hgpri8am2if.cloudfront.net/book_images/onix/cvr9781501143762/thinner-9781501143762_hr.jpg
     

    +1

  129. @obwandiyag
    The principle is perfectly correct. A truism. Simple common sense.

    But Stephen King wouldn't know quality from his asshole.

    I mean, Stephen King? Are you kidding me?

    That's what makes this whole little fake-news, all-publicity-is-good-publicity tempest-in-a-teapot so absurd.

    Stephen King defending quality? Stephen King? Stephen King? Is this some kind of a joke?

    I can't stop upchucking long enough to express how absurd this is.

    This plus he has been trying to be the very Hierophant of Wokeness on Twitter for years now. He’s a pseudo-intelligent money-chasing pulp hack, but he’s definitely not so dumb that he shouldn’t have seen this coming from as far away as that truck that hit him.

  130. @istevefan
    Didn't Stalin once say that "diversity had a quality of its own"?

    Quantity, not diversity. Big difference between a generation of Homo sovietici making dead Germans their production and frogs laughing at Cupid’s cavalry (when the Tsar sent under-armed Turkic peoples against Napoleon; Napoleon lost but not because of the affirmative action archers).

  131. @Achmed E. Newman
    Right, I noticed that too. It'd be about 6' 9".

    2 m = 6′ 6¾”

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    You're right - doing things off the top of my head - even I can "search it up". I had 39.4 " in my head but was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard. Sorry.
  132. @obwandiyag
    The principle is perfectly correct. A truism. Simple common sense.

    But Stephen King wouldn't know quality from his asshole.

    I mean, Stephen King? Are you kidding me?

    That's what makes this whole little fake-news, all-publicity-is-good-publicity tempest-in-a-teapot so absurd.

    Stephen King defending quality? Stephen King? Stephen King? Is this some kind of a joke?

    I can't stop upchucking long enough to express how absurd this is.

    I can’t stop upchucking long enough to express how absurd this is.

    You stopped upchucking long enough to drop by and post another one of your whiny comments.

  133. @Russell Upvittles
    It would be worth it taking a gal like Roxanne to a Chinese buffet just to see the look on the staff's faces.

    "Horry shit! We go banklupt!"

    Speaking of diversity, OT but very iSteve-esque....
    Recently inserted in the classic Guns n Roses "November Rain" video is a brief shot of a rainbow banner in the wedding vows portion at the 2:18 mark.

    https://youtu.be/8SbUC-UaAxE

    That is the signage for the Rainbow Bar and Grill, a famous rock n roll bar, on the Sunset Strip in West Hollywood that was a favorite of the likes of Guns N Roses and Motorhead.

  134. @ScarletNumber
    2 m = 6' 6¾"

    You’re right – doing things off the top of my head – even I can “search it up”. I had 39.4 ” in my head but was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard. Sorry.

    • Replies: @res

    You’re right – doing things off the top of my head – even I can “search it up”. I had 39.4 ” in my head but was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard. Sorry.
     
    And you follow up with that (that whole comment is just embarrassing for someone with an engineering background, from the excuse to the the following 3.4 meters/yard idiocy, maybe next time you should look it up). What you were trying for is 3.28 feet per meter. For calculations in my head I like to remember 3.3 (+ 10% to a yard).

    P.S. I am harshing on you because you responded in a hostile fashion to me after I had the temerity to explain something in a simpler fashion than you thought was worthy of you. If you are going to act arrogantly at least try to be correct as well.
  135. @Morris Applebaum IV
    There is no room for White men on the left. The bewildering thing is why so many haven't figured it out. Stephen King has two sons, he should show a little foresight.

    Stephen King is worth hundreds of millions of dollars and lives in Maine. He has no idea as to what is going on.

    Despite his many faults, King did write and direct the film Maximum Overdrive and for that we should eternally be grateful.

  136. @Achmed E. Newman
    Wait a minute, are we talkin' about the same Rebecca De Mornay here? I thought she was pretty hot in Risky Business. Man, I should keep up with these people in The National Enquirer more often... shouldn't have let that subscription lapse.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqYZIxxCEzM

    Did someone mention Rebecca De Mornay?

  137. @Prester John
    A neighbor of ours, grossly obese like that woman, passed at +/- 45 years of age. Like our neighbor, her cruise through life may end a lot sooner than later.

    Whenever I see a morbidly obese person, the first thing that always come to my mind is “how do they wipe their butt?”

  138. @Tiny Duck
    White men are around 31% of the population in US. The stories told 'by them', and 'of them' is a vastly large percentage (60-80% maybe, more?).
    Without diversity, you can't tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity

    I see this a lot in the business world. They have their clique and all claim that each other is the 'best' at everything. People hear it so often they begin to believe it

    To see this sense of white privilege from someone who many POC support because of their art is disappointing. The whole point of art is it’s diversity & it’s ability to break down & transcend all boundaries & notions of exclusion.

    If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you're unaware

    We expect given his profile & intelligence a more thoughtful approach. We also recognise we are all working to increase understanding of complex matters. It’s not about him or you as individuals. It’s about moving our collective responsibility forward.

    “Without diversity, you can’t tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity”

    If by “diversity” you mean that works of art must include representation from all the major ethnic groups of the country where is was produced, then I have to disagree very strongly. There are many examples that prove this idea is wrong.

    “If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you’re unaware”

    You are asking that people not be tied to the place and era in which they were born and lived. You want no “bias”. This is not possible. Even the most open and supposedly nonbiased people are all products of their time and place and circumstances. There are no unbiased people.

  139. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:

    the banjo is an African instrument.

    This is one of those “facts” that somebody started and now everybody knows. It is true that Africans had an instrument made from a gourd attached to a stick and a string. But that is the end of the resemblance to the instrument we call the banjo. The African version was primarily a rhythm instrument.

    The banjo as we know it is much more closely related to all the other western stringed instruments. A hollow body with multiple strings, a neck with fingerboard or fretboard. Used primarily as a melodic or chordal instrument. Anyone with even a passing interest in music history can see how ridiculous the claim of it being an African invention is.

    But it is like the blacks inventing peanut butter thing. We know people have been grinding seeds, nuts and legumes into paste for thousands of years. But the blacks have so very little and want to claim it. It just seems petty to point out that it isn’t really theirs.

    • Agree: Old Prude
  140. @ssohara
    BTW, if you are good enough as an artist, thinker, whatever, you can overcome prejudice.

    Read up on Ramunajan. He was so d*mned brilliant, the British catered to him. Look at the history of black musicians in America. Whites would flout segregation laws and sneak into clubs to listen to the greats.

    We live in a time now where racism could theoretically play very little role in society. I am not white. When I was a kid I experienced discrimination. I've seen that become less and less of an issue as time goes on.

    Does it still exist? Yes. But part of the reason it still exists is that people keep harping on it. If the SJW would just give it a rest, society would basically integrate. NO ONE in our society is going to 'dis on Aretha Franklin, for example, or Tina Turner.

    At this point in our culture, if you are a black (or brown) artist and you are actually good, you will have hordes of adoring fans of all colors flock to you.

    I think the diversity crap is being used by mediocre artists in the same way that the transgender cared is being used by mediocre male athletes. Can't compete in a race on your own merits? CAll yourself a girl and beat the panties off of them.

    Similarly, if you're a mediocre writer (which Coates is) then publish race-based diatribes and watch everyone sing your praises. It was like Obama - he was a mediocrity but thanks to his race he is lionized. It's sickening.

    It's much better for ALL of us, including blacks, to have a meritocracy. Maybe there will be fewer black paragons, but they will be sincerely appreciated. OTOH, maybe there would be more black paragons if they knew they had to hew to the same standards? That's a fine thought, huh?

    There may be less overt racism than there used to be.

    But there are a lot of people who are getting shut out of the arts and arts-related jobs because they don’t have the money to participate. They couldn’t afford to go to the right schools, they don’t know anyone who get get them a job, they couldn’t afford to work for free as an intern. These are vital parts of getting to play the game in publishing, Hollywood, etc.

    So while I agree with King that when he judged an Oscar nominated work he shouldn’t care about who did it, I think the people who complain that there’s a lot of people who end up left out of Hollywood are right. It just so happens that these are people of every race and ethnic background. Just because Hollywood is dominated by whites doesn’t mean that all whites have an equal chance to get a job there.

  141. @Johnny Smoggins
    It's always good to see the left eating one of their own. Stephen King has been a whiny shitlib and hasn't written a good book for decades.

    Stephen King has been a whiny shitlib and hasn’t written a good book for decades.

    King has always been a shitlib, but 2017’s Gwendy’s Button Box was a very good read.

  142. @Mr McKenna

    “Will she fit into the office lift?” asked a description of the podcast, which was broadcast on Sunday and hosted by Mia Freedman, creative director of an Australian website called Mamamia. “How many steps will she have to take to get to the interview?”
     
    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2017/06/15/arts/15xp-roxanegay/14xp-roxanegay-superJumbo.jpg

    No way, by which I mean NFW, is that whale sitting on the same type of chair the other two people are. So which is it, oppression to make her try or oppression to presume (with good reason) that it will need sturdier furniture? All I know is that it's oppression.

    Kinda like this Mia Freedman chick.

    https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/5/21/1400641619630/bd69c2c5-7c5b-4ad2-8176-bf6549054fc0-1360x2040.jpeg

    Looking at that fabric stretched taut over her thighs, tent and awning maker comes to mind.

  143. @Kronos
    They eat a high sugar/carbohydrate diet. Also, they never evolved a genetic tolerance for sugar. Europeans and Asians possessed alcohol, wheat, rice, etc for thousands of years. Italians have a much lower rate of alcoholism than native Americans likely due to countless generations of natural selection. The real bingers likely died off years ago.

    Also, pointing out black obesity is racist. Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    https://youtu.be/XA62refAB2w

    I remember walking out on that movie but I can’t remember why .

    • Replies: @Kronos
    Any recollection if it was something about the movie or maybe a “I left the oven on” kinda sudden realization? I watched the film 3-4 years ago and liked it.
  144. @Blogger
    I agree with you Steve but did you have to make fun of Ms. Gay's physical appearance? Are you a 10 year old playground bully?

    If, God forbid, Ms. Gay had been born with cerebral palsy or another birth defect, or even if she was mildly plump, then it would be bullying to mention her appearance. But hyper-obesity of the type that Ms. Gay exhibits is something that is within her control (if nothing else she could, and should, have bariatric surgery). And her failure to do anything about it shows an extreme character defect and is fair grounds for comment. She really is in no position to give anyone advice about anything except perhaps what the dinner special is at Friday’s.

  145. @Arclight
    Ms. Gay and Ms. Duvernay suffer from black privilege - the belief that everyone must take their sensitivities into account first, and then act accordingly.

    Race and identity play such an up front role in the majority of entertainment produced by or about blacks that even people like King cannot be bothered to pretend that it's interesting.

    If they want the Academy to nominate more minority films, the answer is probably to make its membership younger - by the time even white liberals have been subjected to our culture for 5 or 6 decades they no longer really are interested in treating the Oscars as a participation trophy.

    I quite enjoy the various cultures represented by third wave feminists. In Dr. Gay’s case I would say Agri – cultural.

  146. ” There’s obese, then there’s morbidly obese, and then there is super morbidly obese. I don’t think the scale goes beyond that…”

    Yeah it does. It goes all the way to Fatter Than a Mofo, and that heifer might even be mo’ fatter than that.

  147. “I would never consider diversity in matters of art. Only quality.”

    !!!

    Stick with diversity, Stephen. There might be a small place for you, as repentant white trash.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    He’s been practicing for that role for a while now...

    https://youtu.be/ybWAcHZpTEk
  148. @ChrisZ
    Anybody remember a “Seinfeld” episode involving an obese and *angry* black chick named Rebecca DuMornay?

    I thought it was a lame joke at the time: a mild irony that such a person should share the classy-sounding name of a svelte white actress. But was it instead a reference to this woman? Has she been around that long?

    (If so, the joke would still be lame as comedy, but admirably wicked as satire.)

    That Seinfeld episode (the black woman in question wasn’t really obese, just ordinary fat for 40+) was spectacularly unrealistic for one reason: her mouthy black anger gets returned in kind by Elaine. In real life, never happens.

  149. @Art Deco
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Que_Sera_Sera_(House)

    Art , if I may or would you prefer Mr. Deco ? Any way , working at an inner city hosp. in Baltimore this type of patient was not uncommon . As I recall they were not unpleasant people to deal with as so many ghetto dwellers could be . They would get put in a “big boy” bed , about a full size mattress with compartments that filled with air on an alternating sequence . Still at 500 + lbs. both butt cheeks had large decubitus ulcers and some more on the backs of their thighs , some of the males even had them on their ball sack . They would eat and pass waste , it took three people to turn them and another three to give them a perfunctory wipe down and if ordered place a half assed , no pun intended , dressing and change the sheets . It was a drill . Changed maybe twice in a 12 hour shift in the hospital what kind of care did they get at home ? Some were stoic or maybe resigned . I remember a 27 y/o female doing her best to stay ambulatory ; she had a 6 y/o daughter at home that she couldn’t keep up with and knew she wouldn’t live to see grow up . I know there are a lot of sorry , lazy , weak , fat ass motherf**kers out there but to get that big that young I don’t know , there must be something more .

    • Replies: @Jack D
    Nowadays, a lot can be done with bariatric surgery. It doesn't work for everyone (and some people it kills - it killed my cleaning lady who was not even morbidly obese - some doctor must have talked it into her because the Medicaid was paying and his kid needed a new BMW) but for some people like that it is literally life saving.
  150. @ssohara
    BTW, if you are good enough as an artist, thinker, whatever, you can overcome prejudice.

    Read up on Ramunajan. He was so d*mned brilliant, the British catered to him. Look at the history of black musicians in America. Whites would flout segregation laws and sneak into clubs to listen to the greats.

    We live in a time now where racism could theoretically play very little role in society. I am not white. When I was a kid I experienced discrimination. I've seen that become less and less of an issue as time goes on.

    Does it still exist? Yes. But part of the reason it still exists is that people keep harping on it. If the SJW would just give it a rest, society would basically integrate. NO ONE in our society is going to 'dis on Aretha Franklin, for example, or Tina Turner.

    At this point in our culture, if you are a black (or brown) artist and you are actually good, you will have hordes of adoring fans of all colors flock to you.

    I think the diversity crap is being used by mediocre artists in the same way that the transgender cared is being used by mediocre male athletes. Can't compete in a race on your own merits? CAll yourself a girl and beat the panties off of them.

    Similarly, if you're a mediocre writer (which Coates is) then publish race-based diatribes and watch everyone sing your praises. It was like Obama - he was a mediocrity but thanks to his race he is lionized. It's sickening.

    It's much better for ALL of us, including blacks, to have a meritocracy. Maybe there will be fewer black paragons, but they will be sincerely appreciated. OTOH, maybe there would be more black paragons if they knew they had to hew to the same standards? That's a fine thought, huh?

    Read up on Ramunajan. He was so d*mned brilliant, the British catered to him.

    Sadly, the British did not literally “cater” to him – he experienced serious difficulty finding appropriate vegan cuisine in England.

  151. @J.Ross
    Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    This is actually kind of fascinating and it really illustrates thay whole hyper-over-confidence thing. Feminism shmeminism, women in any culture can be expected to fear rejection, and weight is a universal barometer with meaningless minor variations and a consistent rule.

    Feminism shmeminism, women in any culture can be expected to fear rejection, and weight is a universal barometer with meaningless minor variations and a consistent rule.

  152. Roxane Gay has had weight-loss surgery. The pictures used here are somewhat out of date. I’m surprised all the online searches here didn’t find this.

    • Replies: @duncsbaby
    Perhaps she has but a duckduckgo image search does not yield up much evidence of it.

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Roxanne+Gay&atb=v60-1&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images
  153. @Anon
    Periodic public service announcement: Body weight is 80 percent heritable in adulthood. IQ is 50 percent.

    Other traits like self control, "getting your shit together like I did," and so on are themselves behavioral traits, also subject to heritability.

    Body weight is 80 percent heritable in adulthood. IQ is 50 percent.

    And yet I doubt any of Roxanne Gay’s grandparents were super-obese 500-pounders.

    I also understand that obesity is correlated with relatively lower IQ. Those who become obese early in life were measured to have average IQs 5+ points below those who were not obese; both must be associated with lower impulse control.

    • Replies: @Anon
    Re her grandparents: Remember the corn analogy. Or Steve's short North Koreans point. Genotype is expressed in a phenotype that depends on environment. 80 percent heritable body weight applies only in the current time frame in the developed world, which is twice as "obesigenic" as the 1980s. If her grandparents grew up in the 1950s or 60s, the environment was even less obesigenic, with regularly scheduled home meals, fewer fast food outlets, smaller markets, high school campuses you couldn't leave during the day and with no vending machines, social norms against public snacking, and so on.

    Gay's siblings are not obese. Heritability is probabilistic.

    In general, you'd benefit from reading Robert Plomin's book Blueprint, including the footnotes. It's built around the recent 1 million genome GWAS papers, and to avoid controversy he uses body weight instead of IQ in his examples.
  154. @donut
    I remember walking out on that movie but I can't remember why .

    Any recollection if it was something about the movie or maybe a “I left the oven on” kinda sudden realization? I watched the film 3-4 years ago and liked it.

    • Replies: @donut
    No but I did leap up out of my dentist's chair once convinced that I had left the oven on . I hadn't .
  155. @Reg Cæsar

    “I would never consider diversity in matters of art. Only quality."
     
    !!!

    Stick with diversity, Stephen. There might be a small place for you, as repentant white trash.

    He’s been practicing for that role for a while now…

  156. The only one who should be complaining of exhaustion is Ms. Gay’s chair.

  157. @Anonymous
    After having the misfortune, out of sheer curiosity, of reading some of Roxane Gay's work in The Guardian, I can conclusively say this for sure:

    She's a big fat liar.

    After having the misfortune, out of sheer curiosity, of reading some of Roxane Gay’s work in The Guardian, I can conclusively say this for sure:She’s a big fat liar.

    To read one article may be regarded as a misfortune; to read two, looks like carelessness.

  158. @Altai
    DuVernay is apparently so annoying to work with that Kevin Feige removed her from directing Black Panther. Though a part of me does wonder what an Ana DuVernay action comic book movie would look like.

    In other woke news. The new Saved By The Bell reboot has cast a trans actor to play Lexi, the popular cheerleader. Mario Lopez is apparently a producer and this decision is said to likely be his attempt to make all the bad publicity over his comments on transgender children go away. (As well as maybe all that bad noise about a history of sexual assaults) It may also make the show somewhat cancel-proof.

    https://www.revelist.com/tv/josie-totah-saved-bell-reboot/17019/mario-lopez-came-under-fire-early-2019-after-making-some-transphobic-remarks-but-hes-since-apologized/5

    The actor is Josie Totah who is of Palestinian and Lebanese descent (Though I can't find any information on if they are a Christian family or Muslim, I presume Christian or at least atheists from a 'Muslim background' from 'Josie' and a lack of any 'first Muslim' stuff) who looks like the classic effeminate gay type of transgender. Could it be too shameful in his family for him to be gay? That's what he implies in this interview.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBmakndkAI0

    Here is a recent performance (Though given Totah is 16-17 here, maybe not the best representation of what he looks like now at 19 without his female getup. It's also interesting how often Indians and Arabs get used to play each other in Hollywood) and he is so short and slight he does kind of look like a girl trying to be a boy except for the voice. So hyper-effeminate and in this instance playing a gay character.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OO226wyNvw

    Here is a video from Lopez giving a first look at the production. The 'girl' in the pink top and green shorts is Totah. I saw the video and noticed the odd glance 'she' gives Lopez and I wondered if she was wary of him due to his alleged history of sexual assault but maybe Totah is still wary of Lopez on account of his previous comments.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/B7J0IZ9H79g/

    I’m sorry, what? Were there other people in that video? All I saw were Elizabeth Berkley’s hooters.

  159. @Kronos
    They eat a high sugar/carbohydrate diet. Also, they never evolved a genetic tolerance for sugar. Europeans and Asians possessed alcohol, wheat, rice, etc for thousands of years. Italians have a much lower rate of alcoholism than native Americans likely due to countless generations of natural selection. The real bingers likely died off years ago.

    Also, pointing out black obesity is racist. Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    https://youtu.be/XA62refAB2w

    Blacks are the only demographic where women are more obese than men.

    They’re also the only demographic (except perhaps American Indians) in which women have caught up to men.

    Next time some whiny wahine pulls the “79¢-to-the-$” gambit on you, ask if she would be willing to adopt the standard of living of black Americans if it meant equality for her.

  160. Poppy Noor

    Poppy Noor? Seriously?

    At least nature “gifted” her with hair, so she won’t be riding us about that.

    How the welfare state helped homeless Poppy to win a place at Cambridge University

    Why I worry about men who marry women 40 years younger than them
    Poppy Noor

    She has a sister named Fizzy. They should do Alka Seltzer commercials.

    Talking to my sister about racism: ‘People your age seem so much more aware’

  161. NB: actually, a whale shark. Couldn’t ask for a nicer fish. Can you say that about Roxane?

  162. @Jack D
    I appreciate your desire to include Native American music as an influence but the truth is that, other than Hawaiian music (itself European influenced - the ukelele is from Portugal) which is more of a novelty or sideshow than a main element in American music, there is very little Native American contribution that has been incorporated into to what we think of as mainstream or popular "American" music. The musical systems were just too different.

    OTOH, the African influence on American music has been very substantial from earliest days and is fully intertwined into almost every important American musical genre, so that it is almost impossible to imagine American music without that influence. It would still exist but it would be something very different. Even genres that we think of as being mostly "white" such as bluegrass or country music have it - the banjo is an African instrument.

    Music, like athletics, is a less g loaded skill and so the African disadvantage in IQ, which has been an obstacle to their participation in so many intellectual fields, did not create the same difficulties for African participation in music.

    Actually, the banjo is mostly an English instrument. Blacks in America were building “twangers” with strings out of anything convenient, as blacks in Africa now build oil can guitars, but prior to the arrival of whites sub-saharan Africans had no instrument besides a drum, and it was not even a very good drum.

    Blacks went through a phase in America where a lot of black entertainers played banjos, but today virtually no blacks play banjo. It would be seen as Uncle Tom’ing. The banjos were homemade or inexpensive copies of high quality British instruments. Later on, American makers like Vega and Gibson developed a more American style of banjo for banjo orchestras and later Dixieland bands, often extremely ornate and expensive. These came in various sizes, mostly with four strings, tuned in fifths, much like mandolin family instruments. (The banjo orchestra, like the mandolin orchestra, the steel guitar orchestra, and even the accordion orchestra, was a social/musical marketing scheme now utterly forgotten. Music stores would start an Orchestra that you got in by buying your instrument from them, taking lessons and often buying a uniform, sheet music and the rest, and they would give public performances no one besides the players’ families could be shanghaied into attending. Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)

    (When country music was invented the more successful country performers would have those companies make these expensive models in a five string configuration with a fifth “tag string”, tuned to an open chordal tuning. Several were once popular but today open G is pretty ubiquitous. Now the vast majority of the vintage Gibson Mastertone banjos out there were made as tenor or plectrum instruments and either fitted with a whole new neck or the original neck was butchered into the five string configuration. Everyone has to have a Gibson Mastertone because that’s what Earl Scruggs had when he played with Saint Bill, of course.)

    One problem was that stringed instruments require strings, either metal, carefully processed intestine, or modern synthetics like nylon monofilment. Blacks in sub saharan Africa lacked the metal working techniques to make metal wire, did not have the discipline or the inclination to make animal intestine catgut strings, and obviously no nylon or other such materials. They had vines, but a vine is not going to give a good musical note.

    Just because a thread or wire is under tension does not mean it will make a musical note anyone would recognize. Try stringing a guitar with copper wire or soft iron wire sometime. It will make a noise, but not a clear note.

    I remember a trick used by a couple of those old-Branson-style country/gospel music shows who had a promoter/emcee who actually had no musical skills or abilities whatever. They would “play” the upright bass, usually an inexpensive plywood bass they’d had a local auto body place spray some outlandish rockabilly looking paint scheme on. They would string it with regular packaging string or twine, or a thin manila or marine rope, so it would make a thump or twang with no distinct note. They just had to watch someone who actually could play bass to see more or less where the fingers went so they could look like they actually could play it. Of course, they used the same finger positions no matter what key the band was in, but only someone who could actually play double bass would notice, and they were usually kind enough not to comment.

    • Replies: @Old Prude
    I was going to say that but you beat me to it.
    , @Jack D
    The Grove Musical Dictionary says:

    [R]ecent research into West African plucked lute traditions ... has identified at least six traditional plucked lutes whose necks are made from a thick stalk of papyrus, known throughout the Senegambian region by the Mande term “bang” (also “bangoe,” “bangjolo,” “bangjulo,” “bung,” “bungo”).

    So they had some kind of plucked instrument that they called by a similar name.
    With respect to the kora, a similar instrument, Wikipedia says that "Strings were traditionally made from thin strips of hide, for example cow or antelope skin."

    Now what may have happened, as happened with the "yam" in American which is a sweet potato and completely unrelated to the African tuber that is also called a yam, is that when the slaves saw the American instrument, they called it by the African name and the African name (and only the name) stuck to it even though the object itself was completely different.


    Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)
     
    Philadelphia has a tradition of "Mummers" and "string bands" to this very day which more or less fits that description:

    https://youtu.be/wr7eIQNd44M?t=176

    , @Anonymous
    Lee Mace didn't even bother to put the string on-he actually "played" a bass with no strings at all! The backline had a guy with an electric bass that actually played the notes. He had had the bridge glued onto the top apparently.
  163. @Achmed E. Newman
    Thank you, Art! One time I spent 10-15 minutes looking for this one. Someone must have put it back up. I hope you know I was joking in my reply to you above, BTW.

    Best not to incur the wrath of the Deco, he once called me a knuckle-head for my shenanigans.

  164. @fish

    Her very physique screams “lazy”, “sloppy”, “incompetent”, “ill-disciplined” and impeaches the quality of anything she would have to say. Why look to insight from such a person?
     
    Yeah....why?

    In any case, take a close look at your future....fat, stupid, and sullen!

    In any case, take a close look at your future….fat, stupid, and sullen!

    Also quite possibly your boss, as we noted in an earlier discussion.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-editor-after-failure-of-our-russia-mania-plan-a-weve-launched-our-racism-mania-plan-b/#comment-3396559

  165. @Tiny Duck
    White men are around 31% of the population in US. The stories told 'by them', and 'of them' is a vastly large percentage (60-80% maybe, more?).
    Without diversity, you can't tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity

    I see this a lot in the business world. They have their clique and all claim that each other is the 'best' at everything. People hear it so often they begin to believe it

    To see this sense of white privilege from someone who many POC support because of their art is disappointing. The whole point of art is it’s diversity & it’s ability to break down & transcend all boundaries & notions of exclusion.

    If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you're unaware

    We expect given his profile & intelligence a more thoughtful approach. We also recognise we are all working to increase understanding of complex matters. It’s not about him or you as individuals. It’s about moving our collective responsibility forward.

    • LOL: Mr McKenna
  166. @anonymous
    Roxane Gay has had weight-loss surgery. The pictures used here are somewhat out of date. I'm surprised all the online searches here didn't find this.

    Perhaps she has but a duckduckgo image search does not yield up much evidence of it.

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Roxanne+Gay&atb=v60-1&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images

  167. @Tiny Duck
    White men are around 31% of the population in US. The stories told 'by them', and 'of them' is a vastly large percentage (60-80% maybe, more?).
    Without diversity, you can't tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity

    I see this a lot in the business world. They have their clique and all claim that each other is the 'best' at everything. People hear it so often they begin to believe it

    To see this sense of white privilege from someone who many POC support because of their art is disappointing. The whole point of art is it’s diversity & it’s ability to break down & transcend all boundaries & notions of exclusion.

    If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you're unaware

    We expect given his profile & intelligence a more thoughtful approach. We also recognise we are all working to increase understanding of complex matters. It’s not about him or you as individuals. It’s about moving our collective responsibility forward.

    Tiny Duck, your comment was strip-mined for content and used in the twitter replies to an Ava DuVernay tweet by a gaggle of wokesters…with access to time travel. Ironically, the wholesale theft of your comment only ends up highlighting the lack of creativity in People of Color and their need to ape the White Man.

  168. Anon[143] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hail

    Body weight is 80 percent heritable in adulthood. IQ is 50 percent.
     
    And yet I doubt any of Roxanne Gay's grandparents were super-obese 500-pounders.

    I also understand that obesity is correlated with relatively lower IQ. Those who become obese early in life were measured to have average IQs 5+ points below those who were not obese; both must be associated with lower impulse control.

    Re her grandparents: Remember the corn analogy. Or Steve’s short North Koreans point. Genotype is expressed in a phenotype that depends on environment. 80 percent heritable body weight applies only in the current time frame in the developed world, which is twice as “obesigenic” as the 1980s. If her grandparents grew up in the 1950s or 60s, the environment was even less obesigenic, with regularly scheduled home meals, fewer fast food outlets, smaller markets, high school campuses you couldn’t leave during the day and with no vending machines, social norms against public snacking, and so on.

    Gay’s siblings are not obese. Heritability is probabilistic.

    In general, you’d benefit from reading Robert Plomin’s book Blueprint, including the footnotes. It’s built around the recent 1 million genome GWAS papers, and to avoid controversy he uses body weight instead of IQ in his examples.

    • Replies: @Hail
    I agree with your qualifications of the 80% genetic figure and the phenotype/genotype distinction. The "80 percent heritable body weight" is best stated as propensity to obesity is 80% genetic but the actual outcome will depend mainly on other things such as prevailing food-culture, ingredients (corn syrup), and other cultural conditions. The exact same person will end up with very different weight outcomes by simply moving from one first-world country to another with no particular effort at all.

    FWIW, Roxane Gay was born in Oct. 1974, meaning her parents were probably b.1940s or likely early 1950s at latest; her grandparents would then be likely b.1910s or b.1920s. The strange factoid on Roxane Gay that has gone without mention in this thread, except in a brief comment by Barnard above:


    Gay was born in Omaha, Nebraska,[3] to a family of Haitian descent.[12] She attended high school at Phillips Exeter Academy in New Hampshire
     
    From the Guardian in 2014:

    Gay was born in Nebraska to Haitian parents who had moved to the US when they were both 19, building a successful life for themselves and their children. She is the oldest of three, and is close to her two younger brothers; her parents were loving but strict, forbidding sleepovers, and the siblings bonded as a result.

    Her father worked as a civil engineer, constructing tunnels, and his job took the family across the country, to Colorado, Illinois, Virginia and New Jersey. Shifting from state to state, Gay found solace in books, reading and rereading voraciously. She started writing when she was four. "I was a loner, shy and awkward," she says, "and I wasn't good at making friends, so in some ways the moving didn't matter."
     

    So Roxane Gay is not even a (US-)American, by recent origin. Not a DOAS (Descendant of American Slaves).

    Here is evidence for her strong Haitian-ancestral identity:


    In 2014, Gay published her debut novel, An Untamed State, which centers around Mireille Duval Jameson, a Haitian-American woman who is kidnapped for ransom.
     
    I wonder if there is anything to be said on the Haiti connection and her obesity. As in, lower selective pressure against propensity to obesity? Blacks of Roxane Gay's SES in the US simply do not become 500-pound food monsters, so something is going on.
  169. @Achmed E. Newman
    Right, I noticed that too. It'd be about 6' 9".

    I thought you were an engineer?!

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Not as much lately as I'd like to/ought to be doing. Yes, though.
  170. @Anonymous
    I’m a tolerant person. I’m not very spiteful. I am probably more “open-minded” than the median commenter here.

    I can not tolerate a person like Gay attempting to be an authority on any subject. How can you expect her to have any rigor in her work?

    I can not tolerate a person like Gay attempting to be an authority on any subject.

    I can tolerate her attempting it. What I can not tolerate is the people who give her a platform because they think what she says is worthwhile.

  171. @Achmed E. Newman
    You're right - doing things off the top of my head - even I can "search it up". I had 39.4 " in my head but was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard. Sorry.

    You’re right – doing things off the top of my head – even I can “search it up”. I had 39.4 ” in my head but was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard. Sorry.

    And you follow up with that (that whole comment is just embarrassing for someone with an engineering background, from the excuse to the the following 3.4 meters/yard idiocy, maybe next time you should look it up). What you were trying for is 3.28 feet per meter. For calculations in my head I like to remember 3.3 (+ 10% to a yard).

    P.S. I am harshing on you because you responded in a hostile fashion to me after I had the temerity to explain something in a simpler fashion than you thought was worthy of you. If you are going to act arrogantly at least try to be correct as well.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    I just looked back at that thread in which I originally just pointed out something I didn't like with the graph - not your graph. There was nothing hostile there till you started complaining to me that that wasn't the point. It was my point, and if you didn't think it important, you didn't have to reply. Nothing in there from me was hostile, Res - go look.

    Yes, I'll look it up next time, cause I'll admit it was stupid to write that quickly. Some of the old unit stuff is just leaving my memory, Ooops, yeah, never mind the whole thing.. Yeah, almost 4 extra inches in the meter vs. a yard was what I was getting at the 2nd time - 39.37 of em.

  172. @donvonburg
    Actually, the banjo is mostly an English instrument. Blacks in America were building "twangers" with strings out of anything convenient, as blacks in Africa now build oil can guitars, but prior to the arrival of whites sub-saharan Africans had no instrument besides a drum, and it was not even a very good drum.

    Blacks went through a phase in America where a lot of black entertainers played banjos, but today virtually no blacks play banjo. It would be seen as Uncle Tom'ing. The banjos were homemade or inexpensive copies of high quality British instruments. Later on, American makers like Vega and Gibson developed a more American style of banjo for banjo orchestras and later Dixieland bands, often extremely ornate and expensive. These came in various sizes, mostly with four strings, tuned in fifths, much like mandolin family instruments. (The banjo orchestra, like the mandolin orchestra, the steel guitar orchestra, and even the accordion orchestra, was a social/musical marketing scheme now utterly forgotten. Music stores would start an Orchestra that you got in by buying your instrument from them, taking lessons and often buying a uniform, sheet music and the rest, and they would give public performances no one besides the players' families could be shanghaied into attending. Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)

    (When country music was invented the more successful country performers would have those companies make these expensive models in a five string configuration with a fifth "tag string", tuned to an open chordal tuning. Several were once popular but today open G is pretty ubiquitous. Now the vast majority of the vintage Gibson Mastertone banjos out there were made as tenor or plectrum instruments and either fitted with a whole new neck or the original neck was butchered into the five string configuration. Everyone has to have a Gibson Mastertone because that's what Earl Scruggs had when he played with Saint Bill, of course.)

    One problem was that stringed instruments require strings, either metal, carefully processed intestine, or modern synthetics like nylon monofilment. Blacks in sub saharan Africa lacked the metal working techniques to make metal wire, did not have the discipline or the inclination to make animal intestine catgut strings, and obviously no nylon or other such materials. They had vines, but a vine is not going to give a good musical note.

    Just because a thread or wire is under tension does not mean it will make a musical note anyone would recognize. Try stringing a guitar with copper wire or soft iron wire sometime. It will make a noise, but not a clear note.

    I remember a trick used by a couple of those old-Branson-style country/gospel music shows who had a promoter/emcee who actually had no musical skills or abilities whatever. They would "play" the upright bass, usually an inexpensive plywood bass they'd had a local auto body place spray some outlandish rockabilly looking paint scheme on. They would string it with regular packaging string or twine, or a thin manila or marine rope, so it would make a thump or twang with no distinct note. They just had to watch someone who actually could play bass to see more or less where the fingers went so they could look like they actually could play it. Of course, they used the same finger positions no matter what key the band was in, but only someone who could actually play double bass would notice, and they were usually kind enough not to comment.

    I was going to say that but you beat me to it.

  173. @Anon
    Re her grandparents: Remember the corn analogy. Or Steve's short North Koreans point. Genotype is expressed in a phenotype that depends on environment. 80 percent heritable body weight applies only in the current time frame in the developed world, which is twice as "obesigenic" as the 1980s. If her grandparents grew up in the 1950s or 60s, the environment was even less obesigenic, with regularly scheduled home meals, fewer fast food outlets, smaller markets, high school campuses you couldn't leave during the day and with no vending machines, social norms against public snacking, and so on.

    Gay's siblings are not obese. Heritability is probabilistic.

    In general, you'd benefit from reading Robert Plomin's book Blueprint, including the footnotes. It's built around the recent 1 million genome GWAS papers, and to avoid controversy he uses body weight instead of IQ in his examples.

    I agree with your qualifications of the 80% genetic figure and the phenotype/genotype distinction. The “80 percent heritable body weight” is best stated as propensity to obesity is 80% genetic but the actual outcome will depend mainly on other things such as prevailing food-culture, ingredients (corn syrup), and other cultural conditions. The exact same person will end up with very different weight outcomes by simply moving from one first-world country to another with no particular effort at all.

    FWIW, Roxane Gay was born in Oct. 1974, meaning her parents were probably b.1940s or likely early 1950s at latest; her grandparents would then be likely b.1910s or b.1920s. The strange factoid on Roxane Gay that has gone without mention in this thread, except in a brief comment by Barnard above:

    Gay was born in Omaha, Nebraska,[3] to a family of Haitian descent.[12] She attended high school at Phillips Exeter Academy in New Hampshire

    From the Guardian in 2014:

    Gay was born in Nebraska to Haitian parents who had moved to the US when they were both 19, building a successful life for themselves and their children. She is the oldest of three, and is close to her two younger brothers; her parents were loving but strict, forbidding sleepovers, and the siblings bonded as a result.

    Her father worked as a civil engineer, constructing tunnels, and his job took the family across the country, to Colorado, Illinois, Virginia and New Jersey. Shifting from state to state, Gay found solace in books, reading and rereading voraciously. She started writing when she was four. “I was a loner, shy and awkward,” she says, “and I wasn’t good at making friends, so in some ways the moving didn’t matter.”

    So Roxane Gay is not even a (US-)American, by recent origin. Not a DOAS (Descendant of American Slaves).

    Here is evidence for her strong Haitian-ancestral identity:

    In 2014, Gay published her debut novel, An Untamed State, which centers around Mireille Duval Jameson, a Haitian-American woman who is kidnapped for ransom.

    I wonder if there is anything to be said on the Haiti connection and her obesity. As in, lower selective pressure against propensity to obesity? Blacks of Roxane Gay’s SES in the US simply do not become 500-pound food monsters, so something is going on.

  174. @Barnard
    The Michigan Tech Humanities department doesn't sound any different than any other woke state school. They have examples on their website:

    -develop a feminist analysis of the ways in which media representations impact women’s agency in contemporary Ghana

    -critique the ambiguous role of comedians as public intellectuals in media representations of scientific controversies

    -research the impact of biometric verification technologies on political communication and democratic processes in a contemporary post-colonial context

    -study the challenges associated with developing writing centers in non-Western contexts
     
    I'm sure she could find a way to fit into that department. Wikipedia also says her family is Haitian and she was born in Omaha. What kind of connections do they have that got into Phillips Exeter and Yale?

    Wikipedia also says her family is Haitian and she was born in Omaha. What kind of connections do they have that got into Phillips Exeter and Yale?

    In searching around for material related to my comment directly above on Roxane Gay’s family origin, I chanced upon how she got into prestigious Phillips Exeter.

    From the best I can tell, she was admitted in 1988 and attended from Fall 1988 semester to Spring 1992 semester, a perch from which her springboard into Yale was easy enough (though did not graduate from Yale, transferring elsewhere).

    She got into Phillips Exeter through a program called “A Better Chance,” one of the many ‘No Whites Need Apply’ programs out there, which have only proliferated in the past thirty years.

    A Better Chance helps academically-talented students of color access the best educational opportunities for middle school and high school.

    for over 50 years [founded in 1963 in NYC] we have specialized in helping families navigate the admissions process for college preparatory schools in order to obtain a quality education – which includes orienting families to financial aid processes and leveraging scholarship funds on their behalf.

    On average, it costs A Better Chance thousands of dollars to see each student successfully through our program. However, the services we provide to our families are free.

    https://www.abetterchance.org/admissions-and-programming/scholar-profile-detail/~board/timeline-and-profiles/post/roxane-gay-a-better-chance-alumna-92

    Roxane Gay, A Better Chance Alumna ’92

    [A photo of Roxane Gay is internally captioned: “A woman of color looks heavenward with an amused smirk, her chin resting on her hands.”]

    New York Times Best-Selling Author, Cultural Critic, Professor, and Force to be Reckoned with.

    ROXANE’S JOURNEY SINCE LEARNING OF A BETTER CHANCE

    Dr. Roxane Gay initially learned about A Better Chance from a guidance counselor at her junior high school. She went on to attend A Better Chance Member School Phillips Exeter Academy as a Scholar, graduating in 1992. After that, she studied as an undergraduate at Yale University before earning her BA from Vermont College of Norwich University. She then went on to pursue a Master of Arts from the University of Nebraska – Lincoln, and finally her PhD from Michigan Technical University.

    “I would say that A Better Chance opens up an entire world of possibility,” says Roxane, on the subject of her experience.

    WHAT SHE’S UP TO NOW

    Roxane is changing the way we think about ourselves and others, especially around some of the most controversial social subjects of our time. She is well known as one of Twitter’s leading lights, with well over half a million followers on that platform, and as an author whose works span fiction and nonfiction, from short story to novel to memoir to comic book. She also edited Best American Short Stories 2018, and, as Author of World of Wakanda, was the first black woman to lead a Marvel comic.

    Her other books include:

    Ayiti
    Bad Feminist
    An Untamed State
    Hunger
    Not That Bad

    Roxane is currently an Associate Professor of Women’s, Gender, and Sexuality Studies at Yale University

    The origins of this non-profit nonwhite-advocacy group A Better Chance are unclear but its current funding is provided through a series of huge corporate behemoths, the same ones that discriminate against White-Christians in hiring practices; see list of corporate sponsors here:

    https://www.abetterchance.org/partners/corporate-and-foundation-partners

    Top corporate funders listed are:

    ADP; American Express; BNY Mellon; Boeing; Citigroup Global Markets; Deloitte; Dodge & Cox; Ernst & Young; Fred C. and Katherine B. Andersen Foundation; Innisfree M&A Incorporated; Jockey Hollow Foundation; LightRiver Technologies; Morgan Stanley; National Basketball Association; News Corp; Nielsen; PriceWaterhouse Coopers; Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP; Stanley Black & Decker; State Street Global Advisors; TD Bank; Tesla; The Curtis W. McGraw Foundation; The John S. and James L. Knight Foundation; The Tides Foundation; UBS; Xerox.

  175. @Johnny Smoggins
    It's always good to see the left eating one of their own. Stephen King has been a whiny shitlib and hasn't written a good book for decades.

    “It’s always good to see the left eating one of their own.” Was that an intentional pun about Roxanne Gay’s weight?

  176. @donut
    Art , if I may or would you prefer Mr. Deco ? Any way , working at an inner city hosp. in Baltimore this type of patient was not uncommon . As I recall they were not unpleasant people to deal with as so many ghetto dwellers could be . They would get put in a "big boy" bed , about a full size mattress with compartments that filled with air on an alternating sequence . Still at 500 + lbs. both butt cheeks had large decubitus ulcers and some more on the backs of their thighs , some of the males even had them on their ball sack . They would eat and pass waste , it took three people to turn them and another three to give them a perfunctory wipe down and if ordered place a half assed , no pun intended , dressing and change the sheets . It was a drill . Changed maybe twice in a 12 hour shift in the hospital what kind of care did they get at home ? Some were stoic or maybe resigned . I remember a 27 y/o female doing her best to stay ambulatory ; she had a 6 y/o daughter at home that she couldn't keep up with and knew she wouldn't live to see grow up . I know there are a lot of sorry , lazy , weak , fat ass motherf**kers out there but to get that big that young I don't know , there must be something more .

    Nowadays, a lot can be done with bariatric surgery. It doesn’t work for everyone (and some people it kills – it killed my cleaning lady who was not even morbidly obese – some doctor must have talked it into her because the Medicaid was paying and his kid needed a new BMW) but for some people like that it is literally life saving.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    No matter what may or may not be 'wrong' with her, I guarantee you that if I stuck her on a desert isle with only assorted greens in a small garden, mangos and papayas on the trees, and a spear and small net for catching fish, she'd be down to a tolerable weight within a month or two. Safer, cheaper, and far healthier than bariatric surgery (Given that an actual desert isle is not required). Note to Roxanne, please pay attention: I said "desert isle" not "dessert aisle"...
    , @donut
    I forgot to give her weight . At 27 y/o she was 475lbs. And though she requested bariatric surgery it was denied by medicaid .
  177. @res

    You’re right – doing things off the top of my head – even I can “search it up”. I had 39.4 ” in my head but was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard. Sorry.
     
    And you follow up with that (that whole comment is just embarrassing for someone with an engineering background, from the excuse to the the following 3.4 meters/yard idiocy, maybe next time you should look it up). What you were trying for is 3.28 feet per meter. For calculations in my head I like to remember 3.3 (+ 10% to a yard).

    P.S. I am harshing on you because you responded in a hostile fashion to me after I had the temerity to explain something in a simpler fashion than you thought was worthy of you. If you are going to act arrogantly at least try to be correct as well.

    I just looked back at that thread in which I originally just pointed out something I didn’t like with the graph – not your graph. There was nothing hostile there till you started complaining to me that that wasn’t the point. It was my point, and if you didn’t think it important, you didn’t have to reply. Nothing in there from me was hostile, Res – go look.

    Yes, I’ll look it up next time, cause I’ll admit it was stupid to write that quickly. Some of the old unit stuff is just leaving my memory, Ooops, yeah, never mind the whole thing.. Yeah, almost 4 extra inches in the meter vs. a yard was what I was getting at the 2nd time – 39.37 of em.

    • Replies: @res

    Nothing in there from me was hostile, Res – go look.
     
    This is what I had in mind. From the comment I linked.

    I have an engineering background, Res, so you don’t need to spell out Newton’s laws to me.
     
    Keep in mind you continue that paragraph with words like stupid and asinine. Even if those words were not directed at me they still prime me to read the rest of your comment as hostile. (pro tip: if you don't want your comments to seem hostile, maybe go easier on words like "stupid" and "asinine")

    As I noted then, I was also not impressed by your only response to an information laden comment being to nitpick the y axes which went from 8-60 rather than 0-60. Oh, and the units they chose to use. Which just happen to be a standard in that field--for right or wrong. But at least you found International Jew's masturbation joke funny. Priorities.

    Nothing to say about your feet/yard confusion in "was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard"? That in combination with your 3.3 vs. 3.4 error and unit misordering (should have been 3.3 feet per meter, not meter first) was an epic trifecta--especially using so few words. That it was also your attempt at a comeback from your initial error was hilarious.

    To reiterate. If you are going to be critical and and a bit of a know it all (see that other thread), please make an effort to be accurate in the things you write.

    P.S. It is also funny that after all of this you still don't seem to understand that the easy conversion from meters is to add 10% and you have yards. No need to multiply out numbers with four significant digits for most purposes. An engineer should have learned that long ago.

    P.P.S. This is what a hostile comment from me looks like. I am genuinely curious what you considered so hostile about my initial response to you in the other thread.
  178. @res
    I thought you were an engineer?!

    Not as much lately as I’d like to/ought to be doing. Yes, though.

  179. @donvonburg
    Actually, the banjo is mostly an English instrument. Blacks in America were building "twangers" with strings out of anything convenient, as blacks in Africa now build oil can guitars, but prior to the arrival of whites sub-saharan Africans had no instrument besides a drum, and it was not even a very good drum.

    Blacks went through a phase in America where a lot of black entertainers played banjos, but today virtually no blacks play banjo. It would be seen as Uncle Tom'ing. The banjos were homemade or inexpensive copies of high quality British instruments. Later on, American makers like Vega and Gibson developed a more American style of banjo for banjo orchestras and later Dixieland bands, often extremely ornate and expensive. These came in various sizes, mostly with four strings, tuned in fifths, much like mandolin family instruments. (The banjo orchestra, like the mandolin orchestra, the steel guitar orchestra, and even the accordion orchestra, was a social/musical marketing scheme now utterly forgotten. Music stores would start an Orchestra that you got in by buying your instrument from them, taking lessons and often buying a uniform, sheet music and the rest, and they would give public performances no one besides the players' families could be shanghaied into attending. Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)

    (When country music was invented the more successful country performers would have those companies make these expensive models in a five string configuration with a fifth "tag string", tuned to an open chordal tuning. Several were once popular but today open G is pretty ubiquitous. Now the vast majority of the vintage Gibson Mastertone banjos out there were made as tenor or plectrum instruments and either fitted with a whole new neck or the original neck was butchered into the five string configuration. Everyone has to have a Gibson Mastertone because that's what Earl Scruggs had when he played with Saint Bill, of course.)

    One problem was that stringed instruments require strings, either metal, carefully processed intestine, or modern synthetics like nylon monofilment. Blacks in sub saharan Africa lacked the metal working techniques to make metal wire, did not have the discipline or the inclination to make animal intestine catgut strings, and obviously no nylon or other such materials. They had vines, but a vine is not going to give a good musical note.

    Just because a thread or wire is under tension does not mean it will make a musical note anyone would recognize. Try stringing a guitar with copper wire or soft iron wire sometime. It will make a noise, but not a clear note.

    I remember a trick used by a couple of those old-Branson-style country/gospel music shows who had a promoter/emcee who actually had no musical skills or abilities whatever. They would "play" the upright bass, usually an inexpensive plywood bass they'd had a local auto body place spray some outlandish rockabilly looking paint scheme on. They would string it with regular packaging string or twine, or a thin manila or marine rope, so it would make a thump or twang with no distinct note. They just had to watch someone who actually could play bass to see more or less where the fingers went so they could look like they actually could play it. Of course, they used the same finger positions no matter what key the band was in, but only someone who could actually play double bass would notice, and they were usually kind enough not to comment.

    The Grove Musical Dictionary says:

    [R]ecent research into West African plucked lute traditions … has identified at least six traditional plucked lutes whose necks are made from a thick stalk of papyrus, known throughout the Senegambian region by the Mande term “bang” (also “bangoe,” “bangjolo,” “bangjulo,” “bung,” “bungo”).

    So they had some kind of plucked instrument that they called by a similar name.
    With respect to the kora, a similar instrument, Wikipedia says that “Strings were traditionally made from thin strips of hide, for example cow or antelope skin.”

    Now what may have happened, as happened with the “yam” in American which is a sweet potato and completely unrelated to the African tuber that is also called a yam, is that when the slaves saw the American instrument, they called it by the African name and the African name (and only the name) stuck to it even though the object itself was completely different.

    Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)

    Philadelphia has a tradition of “Mummers” and “string bands” to this very day which more or less fits that description:

  180. @Achmed E. Newman
    I just looked back at that thread in which I originally just pointed out something I didn't like with the graph - not your graph. There was nothing hostile there till you started complaining to me that that wasn't the point. It was my point, and if you didn't think it important, you didn't have to reply. Nothing in there from me was hostile, Res - go look.

    Yes, I'll look it up next time, cause I'll admit it was stupid to write that quickly. Some of the old unit stuff is just leaving my memory, Ooops, yeah, never mind the whole thing.. Yeah, almost 4 extra inches in the meter vs. a yard was what I was getting at the 2nd time - 39.37 of em.

    Nothing in there from me was hostile, Res – go look.

    This is what I had in mind. From the comment I linked.

    I have an engineering background, Res, so you don’t need to spell out Newton’s laws to me.

    Keep in mind you continue that paragraph with words like stupid and asinine. Even if those words were not directed at me they still prime me to read the rest of your comment as hostile. (pro tip: if you don’t want your comments to seem hostile, maybe go easier on words like “stupid” and “asinine”)

    As I noted then, I was also not impressed by your only response to an information laden comment being to nitpick the y axes which went from 8-60 rather than 0-60. Oh, and the units they chose to use. Which just happen to be a standard in that field–for right or wrong. But at least you found International Jew’s masturbation joke funny. Priorities.

    Nothing to say about your feet/yard confusion in “was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard”? That in combination with your 3.3 vs. 3.4 error and unit misordering (should have been 3.3 feet per meter, not meter first) was an epic trifecta–especially using so few words. That it was also your attempt at a comeback from your initial error was hilarious.

    To reiterate. If you are going to be critical and and a bit of a know it all (see that other thread), please make an effort to be accurate in the things you write.

    P.S. It is also funny that after all of this you still don’t seem to understand that the easy conversion from meters is to add 10% and you have yards. No need to multiply out numbers with four significant digits for most purposes. An engineer should have learned that long ago.

    P.P.S. This is what a hostile comment from me looks like. I am genuinely curious what you considered so hostile about my initial response to you in the other thread.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    It’s not like the confusion between lb-mass and lb-force. In this case, using kg for force is stupid. Yes, I’ve seen tire pressure gauges with this garbage on em too (kg/m^2), but that’s asinine too, as kPa are the appropriate unit for pressure in SI (kilo for the values of tire pressure, at least).
     
    I can't argue with myself on this. Those units aren't the right ones to use. As you correctly stated, the disparagement wasn't directed at you.

    Yes, I was too quick to do stuff in my head that I used to do more easily. I do have to check my posts more (been finding too many typos after the 5-minute window).

    I put the .37 digits on the end, as 4 inches may have set you on edge. It's just 3 significant digits in that I'm taking it off a yard (exactly 36" of course), so 3.37. Any fewer and I was bound to hear from you.

    Can you just stop writing to me, Res? For good? In return, I promise never to write you back again. I will take your advice under advisement, though, as I do comment too much, too quickly sometimes. You are right about that but are really kind of a dickhead. (There's that hostility, finally!)

  181. @Jack D
    Nowadays, a lot can be done with bariatric surgery. It doesn't work for everyone (and some people it kills - it killed my cleaning lady who was not even morbidly obese - some doctor must have talked it into her because the Medicaid was paying and his kid needed a new BMW) but for some people like that it is literally life saving.

    No matter what may or may not be ‘wrong’ with her, I guarantee you that if I stuck her on a desert isle with only assorted greens in a small garden, mangos and papayas on the trees, and a spear and small net for catching fish, she’d be down to a tolerable weight within a month or two. Safer, cheaper, and far healthier than bariatric surgery (Given that an actual desert isle is not required). Note to Roxanne, please pay attention: I said “desert isle” not “dessert aisle”…

  182. @donvonburg
    Actually, the banjo is mostly an English instrument. Blacks in America were building "twangers" with strings out of anything convenient, as blacks in Africa now build oil can guitars, but prior to the arrival of whites sub-saharan Africans had no instrument besides a drum, and it was not even a very good drum.

    Blacks went through a phase in America where a lot of black entertainers played banjos, but today virtually no blacks play banjo. It would be seen as Uncle Tom'ing. The banjos were homemade or inexpensive copies of high quality British instruments. Later on, American makers like Vega and Gibson developed a more American style of banjo for banjo orchestras and later Dixieland bands, often extremely ornate and expensive. These came in various sizes, mostly with four strings, tuned in fifths, much like mandolin family instruments. (The banjo orchestra, like the mandolin orchestra, the steel guitar orchestra, and even the accordion orchestra, was a social/musical marketing scheme now utterly forgotten. Music stores would start an Orchestra that you got in by buying your instrument from them, taking lessons and often buying a uniform, sheet music and the rest, and they would give public performances no one besides the players' families could be shanghaied into attending. Its purpose was to sell instruments to people who wanted the opportunity to socialize and play music, light arrangements of popular songs requiring little skill . No one with any real talent ever joined.)

    (When country music was invented the more successful country performers would have those companies make these expensive models in a five string configuration with a fifth "tag string", tuned to an open chordal tuning. Several were once popular but today open G is pretty ubiquitous. Now the vast majority of the vintage Gibson Mastertone banjos out there were made as tenor or plectrum instruments and either fitted with a whole new neck or the original neck was butchered into the five string configuration. Everyone has to have a Gibson Mastertone because that's what Earl Scruggs had when he played with Saint Bill, of course.)

    One problem was that stringed instruments require strings, either metal, carefully processed intestine, or modern synthetics like nylon monofilment. Blacks in sub saharan Africa lacked the metal working techniques to make metal wire, did not have the discipline or the inclination to make animal intestine catgut strings, and obviously no nylon or other such materials. They had vines, but a vine is not going to give a good musical note.

    Just because a thread or wire is under tension does not mean it will make a musical note anyone would recognize. Try stringing a guitar with copper wire or soft iron wire sometime. It will make a noise, but not a clear note.

    I remember a trick used by a couple of those old-Branson-style country/gospel music shows who had a promoter/emcee who actually had no musical skills or abilities whatever. They would "play" the upright bass, usually an inexpensive plywood bass they'd had a local auto body place spray some outlandish rockabilly looking paint scheme on. They would string it with regular packaging string or twine, or a thin manila or marine rope, so it would make a thump or twang with no distinct note. They just had to watch someone who actually could play bass to see more or less where the fingers went so they could look like they actually could play it. Of course, they used the same finger positions no matter what key the band was in, but only someone who could actually play double bass would notice, and they were usually kind enough not to comment.

    Lee Mace didn’t even bother to put the string on-he actually “played” a bass with no strings at all! The backline had a guy with an electric bass that actually played the notes. He had had the bridge glued onto the top apparently.

  183. @res

    Nothing in there from me was hostile, Res – go look.
     
    This is what I had in mind. From the comment I linked.

    I have an engineering background, Res, so you don’t need to spell out Newton’s laws to me.
     
    Keep in mind you continue that paragraph with words like stupid and asinine. Even if those words were not directed at me they still prime me to read the rest of your comment as hostile. (pro tip: if you don't want your comments to seem hostile, maybe go easier on words like "stupid" and "asinine")

    As I noted then, I was also not impressed by your only response to an information laden comment being to nitpick the y axes which went from 8-60 rather than 0-60. Oh, and the units they chose to use. Which just happen to be a standard in that field--for right or wrong. But at least you found International Jew's masturbation joke funny. Priorities.

    Nothing to say about your feet/yard confusion in "was thinking of 3.4 meters/yard"? That in combination with your 3.3 vs. 3.4 error and unit misordering (should have been 3.3 feet per meter, not meter first) was an epic trifecta--especially using so few words. That it was also your attempt at a comeback from your initial error was hilarious.

    To reiterate. If you are going to be critical and and a bit of a know it all (see that other thread), please make an effort to be accurate in the things you write.

    P.S. It is also funny that after all of this you still don't seem to understand that the easy conversion from meters is to add 10% and you have yards. No need to multiply out numbers with four significant digits for most purposes. An engineer should have learned that long ago.

    P.P.S. This is what a hostile comment from me looks like. I am genuinely curious what you considered so hostile about my initial response to you in the other thread.

    It’s not like the confusion between lb-mass and lb-force. In this case, using kg for force is stupid. Yes, I’ve seen tire pressure gauges with this garbage on em too (kg/m^2), but that’s asinine too, as kPa are the appropriate unit for pressure in SI (kilo for the values of tire pressure, at least).

    I can’t argue with myself on this. Those units aren’t the right ones to use. As you correctly stated, the disparagement wasn’t directed at you.

    Yes, I was too quick to do stuff in my head that I used to do more easily. I do have to check my posts more (been finding too many typos after the 5-minute window).

    I put the .37 digits on the end, as 4 inches may have set you on edge. It’s just 3 significant digits in that I’m taking it off a yard (exactly 36″ of course), so 3.37. Any fewer and I was bound to hear from you.

    Can you just stop writing to me, Res? For good? In return, I promise never to write you back again. I will take your advice under advisement, though, as I do comment too much, too quickly sometimes. You are right about that but are really kind of a dickhead. (There’s that hostility, finally!)

    • Replies: @res

    I put the .37 digits on the end, as 4 inches may have set you on edge. It’s just 3 significant digits in that I’m taking it off a yard (exactly 36″ of course), so 3.37. Any fewer and I was bound to hear from you.
     
    You say that, yet my comment emphasizes that I consider the 10% meters to yards adjustment to be close enough. That's a little less than 1% off, or two significant digits. I'm an engineer. I believe in using as much accuracy as necessary.

    Can you just stop writing to me, Res? For good? In return, I promise never to write you back again
     
    That sounds like a good deal. I will give that a try after this comment (and you get last word if you want, as long as you aren't TOO obnoxious about it). But I have to note that this all started because of your nitpicky response to my grip strength comment.

    You are right about that but are really kind of a dickhead. (There’s that hostility, finally!)
     
    Fair enough. Right back at you.

    It is good that you can admit when you are wrong, but when you immediately follow it with an insult and/or excuse it devalues the gesture. This thread has multiple examples of that behavior.

    P.S. When two people find each other to be dickheads it is worth thinking for a few moments about which of the two is more often found to be one by other people. Most of the time people find me to be a dickhead I think it is because I refuse to take their shit quietly. Some of the time it is because I am right and they are wrong and it upsets them when I demonstrate that in public. And some of the time I am just having an irritable day. I believe in treating people the way they treat me. In game theory terms think of my strategy as tit for tat with forgiveness.

    P.P.S. And if you want to make sure I keep up my end of the bargain, please try not to make quite so many stupid mistakes. I have little patience for people who claim expertise then do that.

  184. @Anon7
    Houghton is located in the Keweenaw peninsula at the northernmost tip of Michigan’s Upper Peninsula. Houghton gets about seventeen feet of snow in an average winter; older houses often have an additional front door located located on the second floor of the house, for use during winter.

    Dr. Gay’s shape and girth are admirably suited to survival in the Keweenaw.

    Michigan Tech is known primarily for its Engineering degree programs, but also had one of the earliest technical writing programs. I didn’t know you could get a PhD in tech writing, but apparently you can.

    Michigan Tech is known primarily for its Engineering degree programs, but also had one of the earliest technical writing programs. I didn’t know you could get a PhD in tech writing, but apparently you can.

    You can if they’re trying to kill two birds with one stone. Particularly if one of the birds is 41 stone.

    Although some shameful part of me looks forward to the prolix virtue-signaller Stephen King forced to publicly bow his head and submissively lick the hand of this wildebeeste. (Look on the bright side, Steve – there’s probably barbecue sauce on that paw.)

  185. @Tiny Duck
    White men are around 31% of the population in US. The stories told 'by them', and 'of them' is a vastly large percentage (60-80% maybe, more?).
    Without diversity, you can't tell stories with quality. Maybe one, or two, but not many. You need diversity

    I see this a lot in the business world. They have their clique and all claim that each other is the 'best' at everything. People hear it so often they begin to believe it

    To see this sense of white privilege from someone who many POC support because of their art is disappointing. The whole point of art is it’s diversity & it’s ability to break down & transcend all boundaries & notions of exclusion.

    If your inherent beliefs about art are centered around cultural preferences; your lack of desire to expand beyond those predispositions will inevitably create a hierarchy of bias and EXCLUSION. Even if you're unaware

    We expect given his profile & intelligence a more thoughtful approach. We also recognise we are all working to increase understanding of complex matters. It’s not about him or you as individuals. It’s about moving our collective responsibility forward.

    The First Street Journal:

    Saira Sameera Rao disappears from Twitter
    Posted by Editor on 17 December 2019, 7:00 am

    ******
    Well, you can follow those links, but you’ll find nothing, because, as reader Karolyn just informed me, Mrs Rao has discontinued her Twitter account.

    Of course, I didn’t check just her Twitter account, the thing which had first caught my attention. I checked her campaign website, and found that, as part of her biography, she stated that she co-founded In This Together Media, featuring “young adult and children’s books that feature black, brown, LGBTQ, and immigrant kids as central characters.” I have embedded the link to her campaign website, but, guess what, that’s gone, too.

    So, I checked the In This Together website, and she’s disappeared — been disappeared? — from that as well.


  186. @Achmed E. Newman

    It’s not like the confusion between lb-mass and lb-force. In this case, using kg for force is stupid. Yes, I’ve seen tire pressure gauges with this garbage on em too (kg/m^2), but that’s asinine too, as kPa are the appropriate unit for pressure in SI (kilo for the values of tire pressure, at least).
     
    I can't argue with myself on this. Those units aren't the right ones to use. As you correctly stated, the disparagement wasn't directed at you.

    Yes, I was too quick to do stuff in my head that I used to do more easily. I do have to check my posts more (been finding too many typos after the 5-minute window).

    I put the .37 digits on the end, as 4 inches may have set you on edge. It's just 3 significant digits in that I'm taking it off a yard (exactly 36" of course), so 3.37. Any fewer and I was bound to hear from you.

    Can you just stop writing to me, Res? For good? In return, I promise never to write you back again. I will take your advice under advisement, though, as I do comment too much, too quickly sometimes. You are right about that but are really kind of a dickhead. (There's that hostility, finally!)

    I put the .37 digits on the end, as 4 inches may have set you on edge. It’s just 3 significant digits in that I’m taking it off a yard (exactly 36″ of course), so 3.37. Any fewer and I was bound to hear from you.

    You say that, yet my comment emphasizes that I consider the 10% meters to yards adjustment to be close enough. That’s a little less than 1% off, or two significant digits. I’m an engineer. I believe in using as much accuracy as necessary.

    Can you just stop writing to me, Res? For good? In return, I promise never to write you back again

    That sounds like a good deal. I will give that a try after this comment (and you get last word if you want, as long as you aren’t TOO obnoxious about it). But I have to note that this all started because of your nitpicky response to my grip strength comment.

    You are right about that but are really kind of a dickhead. (There’s that hostility, finally!)

    Fair enough. Right back at you.

    It is good that you can admit when you are wrong, but when you immediately follow it with an insult and/or excuse it devalues the gesture. This thread has multiple examples of that behavior.

    P.S. When two people find each other to be dickheads it is worth thinking for a few moments about which of the two is more often found to be one by other people. Most of the time people find me to be a dickhead I think it is because I refuse to take their shit quietly. Some of the time it is because I am right and they are wrong and it upsets them when I demonstrate that in public. And some of the time I am just having an irritable day. I believe in treating people the way they treat me. In game theory terms think of my strategy as tit for tat with forgiveness.

    P.P.S. And if you want to make sure I keep up my end of the bargain, please try not to make quite so many stupid mistakes. I have little patience for people who claim expertise then do that.

  187. I don’t give a crap about your game theory, Res. As smart as you appear to be (and I’m the first guy to appreciate good charts and data), it’s possible you don’t realize that people think you are a dickhead just because you plain are, at least some of the time.

    I’m an engineer. I believe in using as much accuracy as necessary.

    Agreed, and, in fact, that’s another pet peeve of mine – using precision that is beyond one’s accuracy – that’s not the case here, in a units conversion – just nitpicking, I guess.

    You did get me motivated to not post so quickly, and not do numbers in my head (used to be easier when I dealt with them everyday – still yet may!) especially WHILE I’m posting quickly. So, thank you for that. Now, don’t write back, as you promised.

    • Replies: @res

    Agreed, and, in fact, that’s another pet peeve of mine – using precision that is beyond one’s accuracy – that’s not the case here, in a units conversion – just nitpicking, I guess.
     
    Remember, I said to try not to make stupid mistakes. The issue here is using a conversion so much more accurate than your source measurement (or do you measure height to 4 significant digits?). As an engineer you should understand that. Height is typically given to two significant digits (and has about that much measurement uncertainty for casual measures). Hence my <1% error is good enough point. You can use more precision for the units conversion if you like (though giving all the digits of your result can be misleading about accuracy, as again, you should know), but no real need to. If you are going to nitpick, try to be better at it (especially when dealing with someone who makes as much effort to be accurate and precise as I do). That is exactly what has been annoying me in our exchanges.

    Signing off now.

    P.S. I imagine you don't give a crap about psychological projection either. It's a useful concept for understanding the world and the people in it. As is game theory.
  188. @Art Deco
    Like at 4:54?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xv2VIEY9-A8

    No, he was way bigger than that. This guy’s 250 tops. That guy, as it happens, later became the mayor of a city in California.

  189. @Achmed E. Newman
    I don't give a crap about your game theory, Res. As smart as you appear to be (and I'm the first guy to appreciate good charts and data), it's possible you don't realize that people think you are a dickhead just because you plain are, at least some of the time.

    I’m an engineer. I believe in using as much accuracy as necessary.
     
    Agreed, and, in fact, that's another pet peeve of mine - using precision that is beyond one's accuracy - that's not the case here, in a units conversion - just nitpicking, I guess.

    You did get me motivated to not post so quickly, and not do numbers in my head (used to be easier when I dealt with them everyday - still yet may!) especially WHILE I'm posting quickly. So, thank you for that. Now, don't write back, as you promised.

    Agreed, and, in fact, that’s another pet peeve of mine – using precision that is beyond one’s accuracy – that’s not the case here, in a units conversion – just nitpicking, I guess.

    Remember, I said to try not to make stupid mistakes. The issue here is using a conversion so much more accurate than your source measurement (or do you measure height to 4 significant digits?). As an engineer you should understand that. Height is typically given to two significant digits (and has about that much measurement uncertainty for casual measures). Hence my <1% error is good enough point. You can use more precision for the units conversion if you like (though giving all the digits of your result can be misleading about accuracy, as again, you should know), but no real need to. If you are going to nitpick, try to be better at it (especially when dealing with someone who makes as much effort to be accurate and precise as I do). That is exactly what has been annoying me in our exchanges.

    Signing off now.

    P.S. I imagine you don't give a crap about psychological projection either. It's a useful concept for understanding the world and the people in it. As is game theory.

  190. @Jack D
    Nowadays, a lot can be done with bariatric surgery. It doesn't work for everyone (and some people it kills - it killed my cleaning lady who was not even morbidly obese - some doctor must have talked it into her because the Medicaid was paying and his kid needed a new BMW) but for some people like that it is literally life saving.

    I forgot to give her weight . At 27 y/o she was 475lbs. And though she requested bariatric surgery it was denied by medicaid .

  191. @Ano
    There's just one kind of labor Roxane Gay does- and it ain't emotional...

    https://youtu.be/Zx0ME65y72E

    https://youtu.be/z1QNTumAPeY

    Super-obese black women: quantity from one demographic

    RIP Mr. Creosote:

  192. @Kronos
    Any recollection if it was something about the movie or maybe a “I left the oven on” kinda sudden realization? I watched the film 3-4 years ago and liked it.

    No but I did leap up out of my dentist’s chair once convinced that I had left the oven on . I hadn’t .

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