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From CNN:

Shops set ablaze, looted as xenophobic attacks spread in South Africa
By Faith Karimi and Diana Magnay, CNN
Updated 10:05 PM ET, Fri April 17, 2015

Johannesburg (CNN)South African police fired rubber bullets Friday to disperse crowds setting immigrant businesses ablaze as attacks against foreigners spread to Johannesburg.

Chanting and singing, machete-armed residents burned down shops owned by foreigners, including a Nigerian dealership in the nation’s largest city.

Immigrants carrying bricks accused police of not doing enough to protect them as businesses smoldered.

Violence targeting immigrant shops started recently in the port city of Durban, where two foreigners and three South Africans were killed. Residents have accused African immigrants of taking their jobs and committing crimes. The unemployment rate in South Africa is 25%, according to government figures.

Back in 2009 in Taki’s Magazine, I pointed out that the Best Picture-nominated District 9 by Boer refugee Neill Blomkamp wasn’t wholly the “apartheid allegory” that American reviewers automatically assumed. Blomkamp kept explaining that his movie was also a metaphor for black v. black tensions over immigration in Johannesburg. Here’s an interview in Salon from the time:

O’Hehir: “You know, these images are pretty uncomfortable, especially for Americans who tend to be so careful in public discussions of race: Here’s a white guy from South Africa making a movie with scary, murderous black African villains.”

Blomkamp: “Sure, I’m totally aware of that. … Unfortunately, that’s the reality of it, and it doesn’t matter how politically correct or politically incorrect you are. The bottom line is that there are huge Nigerian crime syndicates in Johannesburg. I wanted the film to feel real, to feel grounded, and I was going to incorporate as much of contemporary South Africa as I wanted to, and that’s just how it is.

“… I wanted these impoverished black citizens of South Africa to have this disdain for another group.

“… Another part of recent South African history that isn’t world news is that the collapse of Zimbabwe has introduced millions of illegal Zimbabwean immigrants into South African cities. … Now you have this powder-keg situation, with black against black … [W]e woke up one morning to find out that Johannesburg was eating itself alive. Impoverished South Africans had started murdering impoverished Zimbabweans, necklacing them and burning them and chopping them up.”

 
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  1. Premature immigration patriots.

  2. bomag [AKA "doombuggy"] says:

    Let’s see: a group of people organized along ethnic/racial/tribal lines tries to protect its economic interests. Oh! I thought this was the thread about Marin county residents quashing the importation of low income people.

  3. I now think the flow of immigrants across the southern border will finally be halted not by Anglo Americans, but by Nortenos who don’t want those lousy Mayans/Guatemalans/Salvadorans coming in and taking their jobs.

    I did some research into the immigrant children issue last year, and I found that many of the Salvadoran commenters complained of racism in the US. It turned out that they weren’t talking about racism coming from whites, but rather from fairer skinned Mestizos who looked down on their little brown neighbors to the south.

    • Replies: @The Z Blog
    @Bill P

    Many of the latest batch of migrants don't speak Spanish, they speak Mam or one of the other Mayan languages. It does not appear that they are being driven out of their lands and sent to the US, but it would not be surprising if there was some of that. The volume of migration from these areas in Guatemala suggests something awful is happening in the source country.

    But, it could simply be a new racket. We know that the US is actively recruiting migrants from this area. Obama has a new program where DHS sends planes down to these countries in the isthmus to pickup migrants and fly them to the US for "reunification" with their families.

    As far as this being halted, it will never be halted. It will accelerate over the coming decades.

    , @Big Bill
    @Bill P


    I found that many of the Salvadoran commenters complained of racism in the US. It turned out that they weren’t talking about racism coming from whites, but rather from fairer skinned Mestizos who looked down on their little brown neighbors to the south.
     
    Yet black folks are silent (collectively) about the Mexican invasion of the US. Since Barbara Jordan, no significant leader of blacks has spoken out against open borders or the obvious black job loss. Where is Booker T. Washington ("cast down your buckets") when you need him?

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  4. White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    • Replies: @unit472
    @Lot

    The world wasn't going to let the whites of South Africa have an Anglo/Boer state in Africa. It would have been successful and would be a source of embarrassment for the rest of black Africa. South Africa might have survived as an Israeli style ethno state for awhile but it would have been even more isolated than Israel and with borders almost impossible to defend.

    Now the rest of Africa is fighting over the carcass of the only advanced nation on the African continent and 5 million whites did not leave enough for even the 40 million non white South Africans to live off of much less the tens of millions of outsiders seeking to live there. The Boers are moving to Western Australia.

    Replies: @Jfr

    , @Neutral
    @Lot

    Assuming that whites in South Africa actually did what you said (they are just as liberal and uncaring for their own group as in America and Europe), this could never work. A white nation in Africa would be intolerable for most of the world, it would be under an economic blockade from most states, it will face the problem of millions of Africans that would want to get in, the current regime in America would probably consider military actions against it.

    Unlike a certain country in the middle east that can get billions from America and complete immunity from the UN and other international bodies, a white African state would not last five years before it is dismantled.

    , @foxy
    @Lot

    do you recommend any articles about independent White Johannesburg

    , @Bob
    @Lot

    Haven't we learned yet that the only place all negros find tolerable to live is among white racist oppressors?

    Their doom is that oppression is going extinct or escaping. They must pursue it. Why should any white South African's imaginary lines give sanctuary?

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Lot

    , @ABN
    @Lot

    I wonder whether people will say something similar about America (South Africa del Norte) 50 years from now.

    One of the chronic worries that I have is that there may be no way out for those of us with a national-conservative vision for the country. In this scenario, we'll keep telling ourselves year after year that the Sailer Strategy is still viable even as it becomes less and less so with every passing year. The demographic and political position of the generic American nation is worse today than it was 5, 10, 15 years ago. It will probably be even worse 5, 10, 15 years hence. We'll keep pointing out how full of crap the Narrative is, and the Narrative will just be cranked up to 11.

    Who's going to be President in 2017? Hillary? Jeb Bush? Rubio? The GOP and the USA may both be irreparable.

    I can very easily imagine Core-Americans saying a half century from now, "If only we had given up parts of the West Coast and southern borderlands, the Bos-NY-Wash corridor, and some interior enclaves like Chicagoland, we could have retained sovereign control over the vast majority of the country's historical extent."

    The question I ask myself is, if this is indeed the trajectory we're locked into, then wouldn't it be better to act sooner rather than later or never? Call me a romantic, but I'd like to hold onto as much of that shining sea and purple mountains' majesty as possible.

    Replies: @AnAnon

    , @Trumpenprole
    @Lot


    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.
     
    Bull! South Africa was a country, and they lost their country the same way we are losing ours. When white men voted to give suffrage to women it was as if they took western civilization outside and shot it in the head. Generally speaking women are, physically, mentally and morally weaker than men. They are irrational and illogical. They care more about feelings and sentiment then about truth. Immediately after getting the vote, they began voting against the interests of their own people, and against their own men. They, along with white knights, hold together the coalition of the fringes. Do you think white South African men would have voted for the dissolution of their country? Do you doubt that we wouldn't have illegal immigration if men were in charge like THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE?
    , @G Pinfold
    @Lot

    It's a nice thought but I believe you fail to take account of the historical context.

    The 'two state solution' would have needed to be brokered, or at least administered, during the high Cold War decades post WW2. The ANC was a pan-African movement, in which historically warring tribes coalesced to oppose a greater enemy. The ideological glue that held such an unlikely thing in place was Marxism - at the time, not effete Cultural Marxism, but full blooded Soviet/Maoist Communism. It a footnote now that Mandela was voted president in 1994 as head of the ANC/SACP alliance - an ironic start to the 'End of History'.

    It's impossible to see the cozy fraternal relations between a solid CIA proxy and a bitterly contested neighbour. If 'SA Noir' did somehow manage to remain pro-Western, its blackness would in no way have appeased the usual suspects. Internally, the result would be perpetual civil war. Externally, 'SA Blanc' would be a pariah and 'SA Noir' would be denounced as a puppet state and subjected to relentless destabilisation.

    , @Terry
    @Lot

    I worked in Bantu homeland in the 1950's. Verwoerd would not allow private enterprise to develop these areas nor would he allow private ownership of the farmland. This is what Dr. Eiselen who was one of the architects of Apartheid said after he retired:
    'Dr Werner Eiselen, a leading Broederbond theorist and Verwoerd's Secretary of Native Affairs, resigned his post in 1960 and became High Commissioner for Bophutha Tswana. Some said it was because of his general disillusionment that so little had been done to promote genuine separate development. Some time later he gave an interview to a French journalist who wanted to know why the government had not practised what it had preached. "My dear sir, you can't imagine the bitterness of our internal political struggles. The opposition criticizes us when we put into practice what they demand in theory, that it to say when we improve the lot of the Bantu. The farmers lose sight of our aim, they do not think ahead. When the state purchases land for the Bantu they say: ' Perhaps it is my farm they are going to buy up tomorrow. ' Our people... only think of their daily comfort. They accept the theory. But at the same time they want comfort. Obviously a generous theory and unchallenged comfort are incompatible.

    Replies: @PV van der Byl

    , @Daniel H
    @Lot

    Lot,

    Your analysis is 100% correct. White South Africans have themselves to blame for losing their country. They couldn't imagine a world without cheap servile labor. Well now they have nothing.

    As far as the notion that the world would not have accepted this partitioned white homeland, well, the world would have had to accept it because South Africans would have had a clean motive to fight and defend it. Besides, what is this "world" that we talk of? The west is dying, demographically and economically. Russia and China would have no qualms about doing business with a white South African state and would have likely sought them as allies to counter the west. White westerners, we are our own worst enemies.

    Replies: @Tr

  5. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    It’s strange but I haven’t heard one single word of condemnation uttered by the lefties against these ‘appalling heartless racist xenophobic attacks’ against ‘poor innocent migrants who have only come to enrich South Africa and to seek better lives’.

    Evidently, the Totem Pole works here too, and blacks being the supreme deities of the cult of victimology can never have their names taken in vain, even if the gods in their capricious sport, start murdering one another.

    Compare and contrast the incessant vilification, hatred, contempt, ridicule, abuse, verbal and physical attacks etc meted out in UKIP by all sections of British society from the BIG bastards of the Daily Mail, BBC, The Times, Telegraph, The Sun etc who have made common cause with the the hardest of hardest lefties in doing everything humanly possible to try to derail and defuse UKIP ahead of May’s General Election. Their big tactic now is to deliberately talk down UKIP’s poll ratings in order to dissuade voters from voting for them, in a kind of self fulfilling prophecy.

    The irony is that UKIP are the mildest and gentlest of nationalist parties, and first and foremost democratic parliamentarians who value law and order above all else.

    • Replies: @22pp22
    @Anonymous

    I have noticed that, too. The BBC , UK Polling report and Wikipedia all have running averages that show UKIP's vote as flat. The Telegraph's poll of polls shows it falling. The DT used to be a great paper. Now it's even more of a syphilitic rag than the Guardian.

    , @Jfr
    @Anonymous

    Actually, in South Africa, most lefties (and most South Aftican whites, who are decidedly not lefties, at least not in private) have been extremely vociferous in vilifying and condemning the "xenophobia" of local blacks in exactly those terms, along with the white-oriented English-language media.

    The government, whose incompetence and corruption in enforcing migration policy leads to periodic explosions has been pushing hard to shut down discussion, with the ANC premier of Gautemg province tweeting that any attempts to "intellectualise" the attacks are "political opportunism". South African blacks outside the ruling party have been more ambivalent. The ANC is making belated moves to tighten up on migration, but shrill voices from its own left-wing prevent too much of that. A suggestion that refugee camps be set up for newly arrived "refugees" was greeted with hysterical accusations of "apartheid" by lefties close to the party (why refugees from places like Somalia and Bangladesh need to travel all the way to a South Africa is another mystery).

    It is an interesting situation- SA whites are taking the side of foreigners over their own countrymen. Part of this is self interest, since foreign blacks form a useful buffer, but a lot of it has to do with the fact that foreign blacks are perceived as more docile, and because South African whites buy into the "hard working illegal immigrant taking the initiative" narrative (which is true to some extent, but beside the point).

    South African whites are also likely to complain about massive black unemployment (25% or higher), about crime, and about the massive welfare bill, but fail to make the connection to illegal immigration.

  6. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    What do these black South Africa fools know?

    Don’t they know that ‘it has been proven’ that there is ‘absolutely no link whatsoever’ between unemployment and immigration – ‘lump of labor fallacy’ and all that – by some very, very clever economists, and that they should kiss the asses of the immigrants whom they despise for ‘creating wealth and thus work opportunities’ with their ‘hard work’.
    At least that’s what that ‘clever’ man in ‘The Economist’ keeps lecturing me nonstop, and ‘my’ politicians are dumb enough to believe it.

    • Replies: @The Z Blog
    @Anonymous

    Please. Everyone knows that studies prove that when it comes to immigration, the laws of supply and demand do not apply. http://www.vox.com/2015/4/12/8387003/i-am-an-immigrant


    Studies done in the United States show that immigration raises average incomes of native-born Americans, including native-born Americans with low skill levels. Immigration is, of course, even better for the incomes of the immigrants themselves, which makes reduced barriers to migration one of the biggest possible game changers for overall global growth. What's more, as the Economist's Ryan Avent has recently shown, more immigration could be a highly effective fix to the currently hot topic of secular stagnation.
     
    As an aside, is there a more poorly designed site than Vox?
  7. These events are the result of countries to the north of SA producing more people than they can employ locally.

    • Replies: @ren
    @5371

    How about we change our foreign policy such that the only form of foreign aid we will give is birth control.

    Replies: @5371

  8. Derb has spoken of the demographic hell hole that is Africa, what happens when those overloaded boats start crossing the Atlantic? Will the immigration fantasists have finally come to their senses? One can only hope.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Blobby5

    Dream on.

    Overloaded boats are already making their way across the Med to Italy... and all the Left can do is bitch because the EU is not doing enough to help them make it across safely.

  9. @Bill P
    I now think the flow of immigrants across the southern border will finally be halted not by Anglo Americans, but by Nortenos who don't want those lousy Mayans/Guatemalans/Salvadorans coming in and taking their jobs.

    I did some research into the immigrant children issue last year, and I found that many of the Salvadoran commenters complained of racism in the US. It turned out that they weren't talking about racism coming from whites, but rather from fairer skinned Mestizos who looked down on their little brown neighbors to the south.

    Replies: @The Z Blog, @Big Bill

    Many of the latest batch of migrants don’t speak Spanish, they speak Mam or one of the other Mayan languages. It does not appear that they are being driven out of their lands and sent to the US, but it would not be surprising if there was some of that. The volume of migration from these areas in Guatemala suggests something awful is happening in the source country.

    But, it could simply be a new racket. We know that the US is actively recruiting migrants from this area. Obama has a new program where DHS sends planes down to these countries in the isthmus to pickup migrants and fly them to the US for “reunification” with their families.

    As far as this being halted, it will never be halted. It will accelerate over the coming decades.

  10. @Anonymous
    What do these black South Africa fools know?

    Don't they know that 'it has been proven' that there is 'absolutely no link whatsoever' between unemployment and immigration - 'lump of labor fallacy' and all that - by some very, very clever economists, and that they should kiss the asses of the immigrants whom they despise for 'creating wealth and thus work opportunities' with their 'hard work'.
    At least that's what that 'clever' man in 'The Economist' keeps lecturing me nonstop, and 'my' politicians are dumb enough to believe it.

    Replies: @The Z Blog

    Please. Everyone knows that studies prove that when it comes to immigration, the laws of supply and demand do not apply. http://www.vox.com/2015/4/12/8387003/i-am-an-immigrant

    Studies done in the United States show that immigration raises average incomes of native-born Americans, including native-born Americans with low skill levels. Immigration is, of course, even better for the incomes of the immigrants themselves, which makes reduced barriers to migration one of the biggest possible game changers for overall global growth. What’s more, as the Economist’s Ryan Avent has recently shown, more immigration could be a highly effective fix to the currently hot topic of secular stagnation.

    As an aside, is there a more poorly designed site than Vox?

  11. Mike Smith from the blog “Mike Smith’s political commentary” had posted a rant about this on his blog and he’s from South Africa, it could be interesting to see it from a South African point of view.
    http://mikesmithspoliticalcommentary.blogspot.ca/2015/04/xenofobia-sweeps-through-durban-what.html

  12. “How white people created the conditions for anti-immigrant riots in South Africa”
    http://qz.com/384403/white-people-created-the-conditions-for-anti-immigrant-riots-in-south-africa/

  13. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    The world wasn’t going to let the whites of South Africa have an Anglo/Boer state in Africa. It would have been successful and would be a source of embarrassment for the rest of black Africa. South Africa might have survived as an Israeli style ethno state for awhile but it would have been even more isolated than Israel and with borders almost impossible to defend.

    Now the rest of Africa is fighting over the carcass of the only advanced nation on the African continent and 5 million whites did not leave enough for even the 40 million non white South Africans to live off of much less the tens of millions of outsiders seeking to live there. The Boers are moving to Western Australia.

    • Replies: @Jfr
    @unit472

    The idea that Boers are moving to Western Australia is often heard, and many whites are indeed leaving South Africa for Australia, NZ and Canada, but they won't be able to preserve their Boerness for long in those countries. Australia has high English language requirements, tested by means of an exam, and limited opportunities for Afrikaans education. Afrikaners or Boers will have to assimilate, which is tough for a people who value their language so highly.

  14. • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    @Dave Pinsen

    It looks like that African Harvard professor may have deleted the tweet I linked to there, but here's the Quartz article hus tweet had linked to, which makes the same point: http://qz.com/384403

  15. OT:

    More media triumphalism on White America’s death.

    • Replies: @Jefferson
    @anon

    "OT:

    More media triumphalism on White America’s death.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TMrJDHu_TU"

    Notice how they bring up the KKK in that video as they try to paint that organization as the epitome/face of White America. They completely ignore the fact that out of 195 million White Americans, only a mere 5 thousand are members of the KKK which is not even a blip on the radar. I have been to World Wrestling Entertainment events that have drawn way more people than that. ISIS has way more members than the KKK. MS-13 also has way more members than the KKK. Yet the Left Wing are paranoid enough to be believe that the KKK is still the true threat to world peace, lol.

    Also I find it funny that they say in the video that Blacks are forced to live in high crime neighborhoods, as if these neighborhoods will always have high crime no matter what demographic inhabits that area. As if the houses and buildings commit crimes and not the actual residents who inhabit these areas. If you replace the population in Houston, Texas's predominantly Black 5th Ward neighborhood for example with mostly Italian American or Jewish American residents, I guarantee the 5th Ward would lose it's reputation of being a high crime neighborhood that White people should avoid at all costs.

  16. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    Assuming that whites in South Africa actually did what you said (they are just as liberal and uncaring for their own group as in America and Europe), this could never work. A white nation in Africa would be intolerable for most of the world, it would be under an economic blockade from most states, it will face the problem of millions of Africans that would want to get in, the current regime in America would probably consider military actions against it.

    Unlike a certain country in the middle east that can get billions from America and complete immunity from the UN and other international bodies, a white African state would not last five years before it is dismantled.

  17. @Dave Pinsen
    White people to blame: https://twitter.com/calestous/status/589294501765771264

    Replies: @Dave Pinsen

    It looks like that African Harvard professor may have deleted the tweet I linked to there, but here’s the Quartz article hus tweet had linked to, which makes the same point: http://qz.com/384403

  18. South Africa is facing a backlash from the rest of the continent over the targeting of immigrants in a wave of xenophobic violence.

    South African vehicles were pelted with stones in Mozambique on Friday and South African companies are reportedly being threatened with closure in Nigeria. Protests have been held at various South African embassies across the continent, and several South African musicians have been forced to cancel concerts abroad.

    At least SA should be used to dealing with cultural boycotts. Plus ça change…

  19. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    do you recommend any articles about independent White Johannesburg

  20. The article I saw had pictures of angry black immigrants with machetes. Machete wielding is an act of love.

  21. fnn says: • Website

    And it was for *this* that Nelson Mandela was forced to blow up innocent civilians with terrorist bombs?

    The “international community” can turn anyone into a “hero”-especially when they can blind the masses with POC-worshiping gibberish. A more curious case is the post-1970 (more or less) bombers of IRA/Sinn Fein. Wasn’t that operation a transparent blend of Sopranos-style gangsterism, Marxism-Leninism and fake tribalism? Yet many or most of them got away with it and went on to enjoy conventional political careers. There’s the old saw about every cause degenerating into a racket-but this was simultaneously a cause and a racket early on.

  22. Funny how black Africans hate colonialism, but yet can’t get enough of it. Why else move to South Africa?

  23. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    White population in South Africa has grown from 4.3 million in 2000 to 4.5 million presently.

    The ANC has done a good job of not taking any radical action economically especially with regard to redistributing white wealth. In turn whites have shown confidence in the future of South Africa based on increasing numbers.

  24. Off topic. Are you familiar with this episode of Good Times?

    It’s about iq tests

  25. @Bill P
    I now think the flow of immigrants across the southern border will finally be halted not by Anglo Americans, but by Nortenos who don't want those lousy Mayans/Guatemalans/Salvadorans coming in and taking their jobs.

    I did some research into the immigrant children issue last year, and I found that many of the Salvadoran commenters complained of racism in the US. It turned out that they weren't talking about racism coming from whites, but rather from fairer skinned Mestizos who looked down on their little brown neighbors to the south.

    Replies: @The Z Blog, @Big Bill

    I found that many of the Salvadoran commenters complained of racism in the US. It turned out that they weren’t talking about racism coming from whites, but rather from fairer skinned Mestizos who looked down on their little brown neighbors to the south.

    Yet black folks are silent (collectively) about the Mexican invasion of the US. Since Barbara Jordan, no significant leader of blacks has spoken out against open borders or the obvious black job loss. Where is Booker T. Washington (“cast down your buckets”) when you need him?

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Big Bill


    Yet black folks are silent (collectively) about the Mexican invasion of the US.
     
    As with "gay marriage", Jesse and Al told them to shut up about it, and they did.

    Black leadership is even more corrupt than white.
  26. One of the books Cochran recommended, “Washing of the Spears” on the rise and fall of the Zulu nation, is quite revealing – this kind of slaughter is hardly a new phenomenon among South African Bantu.

  27. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factor"] says:

    Things must be really bad in other African countries if people there go to South Africa for a better life. South Africa with astronomical unemployment rate.

    Why is it okay for a people to resist imperialism but not okay to resist immiperialism–demographic imperialism via massive immigration–when the latter is clearly more dangerous?

    After all, Hindus got rid of Brits and Viets got rid of the French, but Serbs lost Kosovo and Palestinians lost Palestine forever. Why? Immiperialism. Demography is destiny.

    I don’t like violence. But I support blacks in SA using whatever means necessary to keep the invaders out.

    Resisters and defenders of the nation are more honorable than chickenshit white-flag-wavers like Europeans and American Cons who can’t even defend Indiana from the globo-homo agenda.

    In THE SEARCHERS Ethan is angry that Debbie’s white womb will be used to create baby warriors for the tribe that wiped out his brother’s family.

    The GOP, the political womb of American Conservatism, has been totally hijacked and is being used to hatch the very forces that only further the death of White America,

    Ethan thought it better that Debbie die than live as sex slave of the reds.

    GOP is a sex slave of the globo/homo forces.

    It’s best to put it out of its shame and misery.

    • Replies: @BB753
    @Priss Factor

    "GOP is a sex slave of the globo/homo forces.

    It’s best to put it out of its shame and misery."

    Well put! GOP should be abolished, to use leftist speech, so the American regime stands naked for all the world to see in its ugly despotism and corruption.

  28. “Let’s see: a group of people organized along ethnic/racial/tribal lines tries to protect its economic interests.”

    So, what “tribe” do Americans belong to?

    “White people to blame…”

    They assuredly contributed to the current problem with their past practices, but I say it is primarily on the shoulders of Zulus who, like any group, is looking out for their own interests.

    “It’s strange but I haven’t heard one single word of condemnation uttered by the lefties…”

    Yes, typical. BUT, Do you condemn Christians when they butcher Muzzies? condemn darkies when they butcher whities? condemn non-Jews who butcher Jews? etc. etc. etc.

  29. This is a really interesting way to fight back against the Zeitgeist. As it happens, I just chose a news a report about this as a listening exercise at my school.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQJ3DXbo8xU

    It’s good for the students to see blacks behaving badly toward blacks. Otherwise, they just absorb the party line from the other teachers and lesson materials, which are overwhelmingly leftist.

  30. It’s specifically Zulus who are doing the killing, hence why the violence is concentrated in north Johannesburg and Durban.

  31. The blacks in South Africa know what happens when you allow in millions of immigrants and allow them to vote; they take over your country. They are just trying to keep what they did to the whites happen to them.

    • Replies: @Drapetomaniac
    @Nathan Wartooth

    "The blacks in South Africa know what happens when you allow in millions of immigrants and allow them to vote; they take over your country."

    Just what happened to the freedom and individualism that was the basis for America.

    Liberty minded people are in a numerical position towards the rest of the world that is similar to what the early settlement people were versus the hunter-gatherers.
    Unfortunately the freedom culture isn't competing with low tech savages, but a chain of command hierarchy that controls most of the world economy.

    America was anomalous, successful, and doomed to fail.

  32. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    Haven’t we learned yet that the only place all negros find tolerable to live is among white racist oppressors?

    Their doom is that oppression is going extinct or escaping. They must pursue it. Why should any white South African’s imaginary lines give sanctuary?

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Bob

    Barbados is run by 'white racist oppressors'?

    Replies: @Bob, @Jefferson

    , @Lot
    @Bob

    Thanks for all the responses. Maybe the far left would have a problem, but under my scenario the middle 55-60% of the country would become completely independent with its own military etc. it would likely need to main friendly relations with its richer whiteish neighbor, which would a far more formidable army of its own.

    Doing this in the early 80s would mean, not gaining favor of the left, but of Reagan and thatcher, who were quite OK with white minority rule.

    The new government probably would have been pretty liberal in most respects, fully democratic, but want some border walls and internal controls. It would be something like 45% white, 30% colored, and 25% black. The standard of living of the local blacks would be so much higher they'd likely oppose further black immigration, just as they do now.

    The same thing might have worked in Algeria: reduce the colony to a walled area around Algiers and part of the fertile coastal strip that would have been 80+% white.

    Israel has shown the way that a group of whites can successfully colonize a nonwhite area in the 20th century. It requires more than anything large white majorities, minimal use of nonwhite labor, and keeping the size realistically small.

  33. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Off topic, but an example of the blessings of bad immigration policy:

    “IT services firm alleged to have overwhelmingly South Asian workforce in U.S.”, Patrick Thibodeau, Computerworld, Apr 15, 2015:

    “An IT worker is accusing Tata Consultancy Services (TCS) of discriminating against American workers…

    …95% of the 14,000 people Tata employs in the U.S. are South Asian or mostly Indian. It says this practice has created a “grossly disproportionate workforce.”

    …the company hires large numbers of H-1B workers. Over from 2011 to 2013, Tata sponsored nearly 21,000 new H-1B visas…

    …the lawsuit describes a miserable experience during his 20-month employment period, despite a bachelor’s degree in economics, a master’s degree in IT, numerous certifications, nearly two decades of experience, and “service with distinction” in the U.S. Army’s 101st Airborne Division.

    …shuffled around to jobs that “often involved only menial responsibilities” and experienced “substantial anti-American sentiment” along the way. The lawsuit contends that one top Tata HR manager instructed recruiters to focus on hiring Indians, and that this official “has expressed his dislike for American workers,” and “believes Indians were smarter and better qualified than Americans.”

    …With this lawsuit, Conroy said, “we can start the process of exonerating the American IT workforce who have been relentlessly denigrated in order to hide the tech industry’s widespread practice of discriminating against Americans.” …”

    “substantial anti-American sentiment.” The blessings of diversity!

    Diversity === deprecate, disparage, and denigrate American IT workers and Americans.

  34. I got this hobby of looking at real estate web pages. I have done it for years. And you can determine the economic health of a place using big house as the bellweather indicator. I sort of start in New York, then Los Angeles, Miami, Vegas (still sucks), then Mexico, Colombia, Brazil, Paris, then often I use Engels Volkers, this German firm for a world wide glance at the bigs. Houses and apartments from 700-1000 sq meters (7700-11000) are not all that common. They exists but are some percentage smaller than 1% on most of these pages, which are the elite of real estate listings. As you would expect, the US, UK, France, Italy, all dominate the top priced listings. New York has gotten ridiculous even by New York standards. The good stuff in Miami has sold and now what’s left is far north of Miami Beach like Aventura. LA is very ridiculous and now the best pages are showing Tarzana where in 2009 it was all L.A proper. Vegas still sucks.

    At the bottom typically, in price are Chile (lots of big houses surrounding Santiago, Dominican Republic (particularly older big houses in Casa de Campo but mostly it is an American retiree destination as fares as the economy fares. Newer stuff on the north coast of the DR do well), a lot of junk ugly stuff in Costa del Col and the Barcelona coasts in Spain, some older stuff in Mallorca (Spain in general still hasn’t recovered). And surprisingly Belgium kept popping up with some really neat attractive big lofts, neat renovations in villas, particularly in Flanders, and in Antwerp like stuff that would sell for 15,000,000 in Paris goes for 2.5-3.0 million in Antwerp. Go figure.

    Then there is South Africa.

    Before getting all iSteve educated, I would see those South Africa houses and not notice. I figured, “yeah well Africa or something. Maybe Cheap land. Cheap Labor.” But then there is this recent news about Kill The Boers, all the murders of the “settlers” the rape rate, and last night I noticed something.

    It is a dumping ground. It is beyond just cheap houses. Houses costs what houses cost. Labor is labor. Land is land. But there is a limit. A door costs what a door costs. Windows same. And especially in a place like South Africa, Chile, the DR that aren’t famous for making sinks, bathtubs, stoves, ovens, even windows, those things can even be more expensive because they often are brought in. Colombia is surprising “costly”. A big house in Bogota is cheaper than the US and UK, but often is 3 million for 600 mts and competes with a US house outside of those big famous areas. Cali is cheap, Cartagena, Barranquilla are not. Heck, there is still an unresolved war going in Colombia. Yet I would consider it in a heartbeat before ever thinking of South Africa.

    And South Africa is beyond cheap and it is sheer numbers of those big houses in those pages. Engels Volkers is a German company, there 4400 German listings, 1500 Lux properties in the US and Italy. There are 6600 in South Africa.

    And the number of big properties, larger than 700 mts is staggering. 260 out of 1200 worldwide. Almost 1 in 5. Literally once you get below the 2 million euro level in Engels Volkers, 90% of the listings for page after page in houses 700-1000 meters are South African. It is beyond just that they can build them cheaper. I read these pages so often, for so long, you can recognize hardship and dumpage vs even a slump or an affordable market.

    It is a like a whole country is doing what white homeowners in Ferguson, Mo are doing. Except the Fergie people are gonna lose their shirts. The Boers, at best will lose their country and many will lose their lives.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Mark Minter

    Parts of Brazil are very similar. Homes in the nicest parts of cities like Rio and Sao Paulo that sell for US$1 million are complete rubbish compared to what that price tag could buy you in Los Angeles. Heck, a $250,000 apartment in LA is often much nicer than a $750,000 apartment in Rio.

    , @Bert
    @Mark Minter

    Are you familiar with the Internet term tl:dr?

    Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson

    , @Jfr
    @Mark Minter

    The ZAR is a weak and volatile currency, which is why high-end property is so cheap in South Africa currently (it isn't particularly cheap by local standards). The South African government has started preparing legislative restrictions on foreign agricultural land ownership for this reason-too many rich Europeans were supposedly snapping up Cape wine farms for a song.

    There is also the fact that estate agents actively market properties overseas (which is why South African estate agents panicked when they got wind of the foreign ownership restrictions, and the government had to issue a quick clarification that they were intended to apply only to agri land). South Africa is a strange country like that: third world savagery coupled with sophisticated property and financial markets.

    You are probably experiencing some kind of sampling bias because of this. I wouldn't read too much into those real estate listings.

  35. It amuses me how Corvinus doesn’t know how to use Blockquote.

  36. How did they not get the message that the immigrants are fellow Oppressed People of Color and that they will naturally ally to overthrow the evil white oppressor?

  37. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    I wonder whether people will say something similar about America (South Africa del Norte) 50 years from now.

    One of the chronic worries that I have is that there may be no way out for those of us with a national-conservative vision for the country. In this scenario, we’ll keep telling ourselves year after year that the Sailer Strategy is still viable even as it becomes less and less so with every passing year. The demographic and political position of the generic American nation is worse today than it was 5, 10, 15 years ago. It will probably be even worse 5, 10, 15 years hence. We’ll keep pointing out how full of crap the Narrative is, and the Narrative will just be cranked up to 11.

    Who’s going to be President in 2017? Hillary? Jeb Bush? Rubio? The GOP and the USA may both be irreparable.

    I can very easily imagine Core-Americans saying a half century from now, “If only we had given up parts of the West Coast and southern borderlands, the Bos-NY-Wash corridor, and some interior enclaves like Chicagoland, we could have retained sovereign control over the vast majority of the country’s historical extent.”

    The question I ask myself is, if this is indeed the trajectory we’re locked into, then wouldn’t it be better to act sooner rather than later or never? Call me a romantic, but I’d like to hold onto as much of that shining sea and purple mountains’ majesty as possible.

    • Replies: @AnAnon
    @ABN

    I think the country does break up, though Core Americans will be on different sides of the various lines when it does.

  38. @Bob
    @Lot

    Haven't we learned yet that the only place all negros find tolerable to live is among white racist oppressors?

    Their doom is that oppression is going extinct or escaping. They must pursue it. Why should any white South African's imaginary lines give sanctuary?

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Lot

    Barbados is run by ‘white racist oppressors’?

    • Replies: @Bob
    @Art Deco

    Please continue .... Barbados and ...

    When you compare one island with the billions, literal billions, you have proved my point.

    , @Jefferson
    @Art Deco

    "Barbados is run by ‘white racist oppressors’?"

    Barbados is such a small country that their population size is similar to that of the city of Reno, Nevada. The only Black country on the planet that is not a total 3rd world toilet, but make no bones about it the only reason they are better off than other Negroid countries is because their population is so miniscule.

    Even the least populated state in the U.S Wyoming still has a larger population than Barbados.

  39. @Bob
    @Lot

    Haven't we learned yet that the only place all negros find tolerable to live is among white racist oppressors?

    Their doom is that oppression is going extinct or escaping. They must pursue it. Why should any white South African's imaginary lines give sanctuary?

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Lot

    Thanks for all the responses. Maybe the far left would have a problem, but under my scenario the middle 55-60% of the country would become completely independent with its own military etc. it would likely need to main friendly relations with its richer whiteish neighbor, which would a far more formidable army of its own.

    Doing this in the early 80s would mean, not gaining favor of the left, but of Reagan and thatcher, who were quite OK with white minority rule.

    The new government probably would have been pretty liberal in most respects, fully democratic, but want some border walls and internal controls. It would be something like 45% white, 30% colored, and 25% black. The standard of living of the local blacks would be so much higher they’d likely oppose further black immigration, just as they do now.

    The same thing might have worked in Algeria: reduce the colony to a walled area around Algiers and part of the fertile coastal strip that would have been 80+% white.

    Israel has shown the way that a group of whites can successfully colonize a nonwhite area in the 20th century. It requires more than anything large white majorities, minimal use of nonwhite labor, and keeping the size realistically small.

  40. “The standard of living of the local blacks would be so much higher they’d likely oppose further black immigration, just as they do now.”
    If only Mexican-Americans opposed immigration for the same reason.

  41. Africa is a disaster, and the ethnic cleansing/riots/looting/killing are a symptom of the larger cause.

    1. South Africa is not a country. It is a bunch of African tribes, nearly all who hate each other, jockeying for power amidst massive economic decline as White talented people leave: South Africa’s utility Eskom faces rolling blackouts. There is no shared nationalism based on tribe and history as say, Rwanda under Paul Kagame has as a defacto majority Tutsi nation.

    2. The rest of Africa is a disaster — population increase but no jobs or income from farming, herding, or factory work to provide self-support. Hence the migrations into South Africa as the most intact lifeboat.

    The verdict on decolonization of Africa is definitive. It has failed, as Africans left to their own devices have been unable to even feed their own people; or produce societies that don’t depend on massive exports of surplus people as a viable solution. Unlike the 19th Century there are no frontiers in America and Australia to support Irish-style mass population exports (or earlier, German and later, Italian and Eastern European).

    Already, police in Malawi are shooting on sight would-be abductors of Albinos, so many have been abducted, killed, and eaten.

    Western liberals like to ignore reality, but sooner or later it will be simply too big and close by to ignore.

  42. @Blobby5
    Derb has spoken of the demographic hell hole that is Africa, what happens when those overloaded boats start crossing the Atlantic? Will the immigration fantasists have finally come to their senses? One can only hope.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Dream on.

    Overloaded boats are already making their way across the Med to Italy… and all the Left can do is bitch because the EU is not doing enough to help them make it across safely.

  43. I didn’t think black Africans were incapable of hate, intolerance and xenophobia. I thought once the white man was deposed and apartheid ended that negro ANC ruled S.Africa would be a literal heaven on earth and a model of interracial tolerance, amity and economic progress.

    We need Ivy league researchers to explain why this isn’t so.

  44. Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…

    • Replies: @AnotherDad
    @International Jew


    Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…
     
    "Xenophobia" is of course completely natural and rational. People have made great sacrifices to acquire territory for themselves--their family, tribe, nation, race--and quite rationally don't want to share it.

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck--literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate--e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.--middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It's effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    I'll grant that in Africa the local population seems so hopeless\inferior at providing services that you start to think ... wouldn't they be better off even if the Indians were there? But even in Africa that's still not the case. Absent the middle man, there would be smart blacks able to step up and provide such services--admittedly not as well. And it's out of them doing so that you'd eventually develop a competent indigenous commercial class. Middle man minorities just eliminate that and leave the host population *permanently* dependent and impoverish.

    ~~~

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the "community". (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    There is likely a tribal element here, where even though "black", the foreigners are not really the same people.

    But beyond that i think the shopkeepers are just a visible face of the foreign incursion, so attacking them serves the purpose of saying "foreigner get out"--an entirely understandable desire.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Anonymous, @Anonymous, @Ted

    , @anonymous
    @International Jew

    Don't overlook the power of jealousy which sometimes overshadows any rational calculation, that is, if they're capable of rational calculation to begin with. Primordial emotions are not gone at all, just usually dormant.

    , @pork pie hat
    @International Jew

    Oh man - want concrete illustration of this, watch Africa Addio, an Italian documentary of the de-colonization of Kenya (and environs) around 1964 - 1966. It rightly has a reputation for shockingness but it's informative as well. And, Roger Ebert railed against it as racist, so you know it's good. One interesting side thing is that the hutus and tutsis ('Watutsis') were fighting even then. Genocide, hand-chopping, massacres of Arab immigrants in Tanzania, cannibalism - none of it new.

    , @Steve Sailer
    @International Jew

    A few years back there was a big anti-Chinese shopkeeper pogrom on Guadalcanal. The next afternoon the hungover rioters showed up, hungry, at the burnt-out shops wondering who was going to sell them food.

    Replies: @International Jew

  45. @International Jew
    Competition in the labor market doesn't explain all of this "xenophobla". There's also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn't have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch...

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @anonymous, @pork pie hat, @Steve Sailer

    Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…

    “Xenophobia” is of course completely natural and rational. People have made great sacrifices to acquire territory for themselves–their family, tribe, nation, race–and quite rationally don’t want to share it.

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck–literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate–e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.–middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It’s effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    I’ll grant that in Africa the local population seems so hopeless\inferior at providing services that you start to think … wouldn’t they be better off even if the Indians were there? But even in Africa that’s still not the case. Absent the middle man, there would be smart blacks able to step up and provide such services–admittedly not as well. And it’s out of them doing so that you’d eventually develop a competent indigenous commercial class. Middle man minorities just eliminate that and leave the host population *permanently* dependent and impoverish.

    ~~~

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the “community”. (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    There is likely a tribal element here, where even though “black”, the foreigners are not really the same people.

    But beyond that i think the shopkeepers are just a visible face of the foreign incursion, so attacking them serves the purpose of saying “foreigner get out”–an entirely understandable desire.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @AnotherDad


    Furthermore middle man minorities suck–literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate–e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.–middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It’s effectively looting, even if the service is superior.
     
    This is complete nonsense.

    Replies: @TSTCLRFRTTDE

    , @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    Maybe you mean market-dominant minorities, not middle-man minorities. They're different concepts.

    , @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren't that rational though, since they'll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1519701/posts?page=1

    " Zimbabwe: Govt to cede land to Chinese"


    GOVERNMENT is next week expected to sign an agricultural agreement with China that could see vast tracts of land being ceded to the fast-growing nation.

    The deal, envisaged to boost agricultural production, should be signed on November 8 and will be guaranteed by the Ministry of Finance.

    ...

    Government's chaotic land reform programme that involved the forcible take over of white-owned commercial farms to "correct colonial land ownership imbalances" has been a recipe for disaster. It has reduced Zimbabwe from a net grain exporter to a net importer in a space of five years.

    Agricultural production levels dropped sharply as commercial farmers took their skills to countries as far flung as Nigeria, Zambia and Mozambique.
     

    Replies: @Kylie, @Nathan Wartooth, @Fredrik, @Wilkey

    , @Ted
    @AnotherDad


    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the “community”. (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)
     
    It isn't only Bantu migrants. Pakistani and Indian migrants also impregnate and marry black women and live in townships (much to the horror of South African Indians, who were conditioned under apartheid to not view blacks sexually).
  46. @International Jew
    Competition in the labor market doesn't explain all of this "xenophobla". There's also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn't have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch...

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @anonymous, @pork pie hat, @Steve Sailer

    Don’t overlook the power of jealousy which sometimes overshadows any rational calculation, that is, if they’re capable of rational calculation to begin with. Primordial emotions are not gone at all, just usually dormant.

  47. South Africa is pretty much a walking rebuke to every aspect of “the narrative”.

    So the best policy is to ignore it as much as possible.

  48. @AnotherDad
    @International Jew


    Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…
     
    "Xenophobia" is of course completely natural and rational. People have made great sacrifices to acquire territory for themselves--their family, tribe, nation, race--and quite rationally don't want to share it.

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck--literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate--e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.--middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It's effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    I'll grant that in Africa the local population seems so hopeless\inferior at providing services that you start to think ... wouldn't they be better off even if the Indians were there? But even in Africa that's still not the case. Absent the middle man, there would be smart blacks able to step up and provide such services--admittedly not as well. And it's out of them doing so that you'd eventually develop a competent indigenous commercial class. Middle man minorities just eliminate that and leave the host population *permanently* dependent and impoverish.

    ~~~

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the "community". (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    There is likely a tribal element here, where even though "black", the foreigners are not really the same people.

    But beyond that i think the shopkeepers are just a visible face of the foreign incursion, so attacking them serves the purpose of saying "foreigner get out"--an entirely understandable desire.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Anonymous, @Anonymous, @Ted

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck–literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate–e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.–middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It’s effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    This is complete nonsense.

    • Replies: @TSTCLRFRTTDE
    @silviosilver

    Come on now, it's not complete nonsense.

  49. “O’Hehir: You know, these images are pretty uncomfortable, especially for Americans who tend to be so careful in public discussions of race: Here’s a white guy from South Africa making a movie with scary, murderous black African villains.”

    South Africa is 79 percent Black and another 9 percent Coloured/Mulatto types who look like Eric Holder and Hussein Obama. By American standards South Africa is 88 percent Black. Why is it racist to for a film about South Africa to portray the scary murderous villains as being Black when South Africa is nowhere close to being a Whitopia.

  50. @International Jew
    Competition in the labor market doesn't explain all of this "xenophobla". There's also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn't have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch...

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @anonymous, @pork pie hat, @Steve Sailer

    Oh man – want concrete illustration of this, watch Africa Addio, an Italian documentary of the de-colonization of Kenya (and environs) around 1964 – 1966. It rightly has a reputation for shockingness but it’s informative as well. And, Roger Ebert railed against it as racist, so you know it’s good. One interesting side thing is that the hutus and tutsis (‘Watutsis’) were fighting even then. Genocide, hand-chopping, massacres of Arab immigrants in Tanzania, cannibalism – none of it new.

  51. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Italy is clearly starting to get feed up with Open Borders style immigration non-policy:

    “Mediterranean migrant deaths: EU faces renewed pressure”, BBC, 19 April 2015:

    “Italian PM Matteo Renzi has led calls for more European Union action on sea migration…

    …The 20m (70ft) long boat was believed to be carrying up to 700 migrants, and only 28 survivors have been rescued. …

    …Up to 1,500 migrants are now feared to have drowned this year alone. …

    Mr Renzi… said more rescue boats was not the issue, rather it was stopping the boats from departing.”

    Seriously, if there’s no stop to this, maybe all those old colonialists were right. It’s a crime for these immigrants to live in a place ruled by people like themselves, a horror worthy of asylum. By that logic, wouldn’t it be best to rule these people’s countries for them? Is it a crime to deny them the benefit of Western rule?

    Better to say clearly “good fences make good neighbors”, “clean your own house first”, “live in the bed you make”, etc.. With a lot of willingness to help, but not just by helping them loot the place and flee… and then, of course, be willing to tell us how racist we are, over and over.

    • Replies: @David
    @anonymous

    1500 this year? Ha! 12,000 children under the age of 5 die every day in Africa.

    The grim reaper reaps by the bushel. If every soul were a grain of rice (that's about 2mm souls to the bushel), the only exceptionally heavy lift in our lifetimes is the Dec 26, 2004 tsunami.

    Replies: @Brutusale

  52. The Atlantic on the getting rid of Jackson on the 20 campaign:

    http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2015/04/erasing-andrew-jackson/390825/

    • Replies: @anonymous-antimarxist
    @syonredux

    Got rid of The Atlantic 12 years ago after being a subscriber for over 15 years. Can't believe anybody wastes any time on it any more. A once great and nearly essential magazine for over a 150 years is now just clickbait barely above Gawker or Salon level of seriousness. Don't even read their free stuff.

    Sorry Syon unless you fill me in on what the The Atlantic is saying, I have nothing to add because I refuse to go there.

    Replies: @SPMoore8, @Jim Don Bob

  53. @AnotherDad
    @International Jew


    Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…
     
    "Xenophobia" is of course completely natural and rational. People have made great sacrifices to acquire territory for themselves--their family, tribe, nation, race--and quite rationally don't want to share it.

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck--literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate--e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.--middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It's effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    I'll grant that in Africa the local population seems so hopeless\inferior at providing services that you start to think ... wouldn't they be better off even if the Indians were there? But even in Africa that's still not the case. Absent the middle man, there would be smart blacks able to step up and provide such services--admittedly not as well. And it's out of them doing so that you'd eventually develop a competent indigenous commercial class. Middle man minorities just eliminate that and leave the host population *permanently* dependent and impoverish.

    ~~~

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the "community". (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    There is likely a tribal element here, where even though "black", the foreigners are not really the same people.

    But beyond that i think the shopkeepers are just a visible face of the foreign incursion, so attacking them serves the purpose of saying "foreigner get out"--an entirely understandable desire.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Anonymous, @Anonymous, @Ted

    Maybe you mean market-dominant minorities, not middle-man minorities. They’re different concepts.

  54. South Africa’s open borders nightmare under the ANC is pretty well covered in Louis Theroux’s BBC documentary which was made a year before District 9 in 2008.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_and_Disorder_in_Johannesburg

    Louis Theroux Law and Disorder in Johannesburg YouTube

    The Cultural Marxist Media has been willfully blind on SA.

    Well worth an hour’s time.

  55. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    “Italian PM Matteo Renzi has led calls for more European Union action on sea migration…”

    “…Mr Renzi said… the trafficking was “a plague in our continent – the slavery of the 21st Century“. …

    …Maltese PM Joseph Muscat told the BBC: “…if the global community continues to turn a blind eye… we will all be judged in the same way that history has judged Europe when it turned a blind eye to the genocide of this century and last century.”

    …Spanish PM Mariano Rajoy said: “…Words won’t do any more.” …

    …One survivor… said there were as many as 950 people on board… He said many were locked below decks and not allowed to leave.

    …Last year, a record 170,000 people made the perilous crossing to Italy. Thousands died on the journey.”

  56. @syonredux
    The Atlantic on the getting rid of Jackson on the 20 campaign:


    http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2015/04/erasing-andrew-jackson/390825/

    Replies: @anonymous-antimarxist

    Got rid of The Atlantic 12 years ago after being a subscriber for over 15 years. Can’t believe anybody wastes any time on it any more. A once great and nearly essential magazine for over a 150 years is now just clickbait barely above Gawker or Salon level of seriousness. Don’t even read their free stuff.

    Sorry Syon unless you fill me in on what the The Atlantic is saying, I have nothing to add because I refuse to go there.

    • Replies: @SPMoore8
    @anonymous-antimarxist

    It's just the same old silly argument about how Jackson has to be removed from the $20 bill and replaced by a woman because of Indian Removal, Trail of Tears, etc., which I consider complete nonsense since he was hardly the prime mover and everyone wanted it to happen (I think I might have had ancestors victimized by the way so it's not like I'm trying to downplay it.) Even so, as unjust as it may have been, it was hardly a "genocide".

    However, you have missed the best suggestion, which is to replace Jackson' visage with a picture of Mohammed. I am totally down with that.

    , @Jim Don Bob
    @anonymous-antimarxist

    Yep. The Atlantic went straight down the toilet after Micheal Kelly got killed in Iraq. They hired Andrew Sullivan and fired Mark Steyn.

  57. Whatever trouble happens in Africa – anti-immigrant riots in SA, anarchy in Libya, starvation just about everywhere – it will ultimately lead to more of them fleeing to Europe. Over the next 35 years, Africa will add an average of a million to its population every ten or eleven days. Europe faces genocide if it doesn’t take action to stop the surplus population heading its way.

  58. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad
    @International Jew


    Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…
     
    "Xenophobia" is of course completely natural and rational. People have made great sacrifices to acquire territory for themselves--their family, tribe, nation, race--and quite rationally don't want to share it.

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck--literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate--e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.--middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It's effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    I'll grant that in Africa the local population seems so hopeless\inferior at providing services that you start to think ... wouldn't they be better off even if the Indians were there? But even in Africa that's still not the case. Absent the middle man, there would be smart blacks able to step up and provide such services--admittedly not as well. And it's out of them doing so that you'd eventually develop a competent indigenous commercial class. Middle man minorities just eliminate that and leave the host population *permanently* dependent and impoverish.

    ~~~

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the "community". (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    There is likely a tribal element here, where even though "black", the foreigners are not really the same people.

    But beyond that i think the shopkeepers are just a visible face of the foreign incursion, so attacking them serves the purpose of saying "foreigner get out"--an entirely understandable desire.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Anonymous, @Anonymous, @Ted

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1519701/posts?page=1

    ” Zimbabwe: Govt to cede land to Chinese”

    GOVERNMENT is next week expected to sign an agricultural agreement with China that could see vast tracts of land being ceded to the fast-growing nation.

    The deal, envisaged to boost agricultural production, should be signed on November 8 and will be guaranteed by the Ministry of Finance.

    Government’s chaotic land reform programme that involved the forcible take over of white-owned commercial farms to “correct colonial land ownership imbalances” has been a recipe for disaster. It has reduced Zimbabwe from a net grain exporter to a net importer in a space of five years.

    Agricultural production levels dropped sharply as commercial farmers took their skills to countries as far flung as Nigeria, Zambia and Mozambique.

    • Replies: @Kylie
    @Anonymous


    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:
     
    Exactly. We saw something similar here when the rioting by blacks in Ferguson included burning and looting black-owned and run businesses.

    Saying this violence has to do with economic conditions, etc. is ascribing a level of abstract thought to the participants that I suspect is largely absent. I would characterize it as opportunistic in origin rather than economic.
    , @Nathan Wartooth
    @Anonymous

    Noam Chomsky was on NPR today with Tavis Smiley, so naturally it was all about how evil white people are.

    He was talking about the USAs plan to let Europe have Africa and exploit it for resources. I was laughing and said to myself "and now the Chinese are going to rule Africa with an iron fist." I hope Africans like their new Chinese overlords.

    Replies: @Drogger

    , @Fredrik
    @Anonymous

    "These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food"

    Zimbabwe was perfectly rational. Mugabe is still president and that is all that matters.

    , @Wilkey
    @Anonymous

    "These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous."

    Because South Africans, unemployment rate 25%, are doing so splendidly now.

    The attacks on immigrants will accelerate South Africa's decline, but it doesn't alter the destination. Whether or not these attacks continue, fifty years from now South Africa will be no better than any other African country.

  59. @ABN
    @Lot

    I wonder whether people will say something similar about America (South Africa del Norte) 50 years from now.

    One of the chronic worries that I have is that there may be no way out for those of us with a national-conservative vision for the country. In this scenario, we'll keep telling ourselves year after year that the Sailer Strategy is still viable even as it becomes less and less so with every passing year. The demographic and political position of the generic American nation is worse today than it was 5, 10, 15 years ago. It will probably be even worse 5, 10, 15 years hence. We'll keep pointing out how full of crap the Narrative is, and the Narrative will just be cranked up to 11.

    Who's going to be President in 2017? Hillary? Jeb Bush? Rubio? The GOP and the USA may both be irreparable.

    I can very easily imagine Core-Americans saying a half century from now, "If only we had given up parts of the West Coast and southern borderlands, the Bos-NY-Wash corridor, and some interior enclaves like Chicagoland, we could have retained sovereign control over the vast majority of the country's historical extent."

    The question I ask myself is, if this is indeed the trajectory we're locked into, then wouldn't it be better to act sooner rather than later or never? Call me a romantic, but I'd like to hold onto as much of that shining sea and purple mountains' majesty as possible.

    Replies: @AnAnon

    I think the country does break up, though Core Americans will be on different sides of the various lines when it does.

  60. I think the country does break up, though Core Americans will be on different sides of the various lines when it does

    Which I’m sure has been the plan all along. If they were all on one side none of this would be happening.

  61. Priss Factor [AKA "The Priss Factor"] says:

    Thought Experiment:

    What would happen if Honkocaust were to happen in South Africa?

    Suppose the crazy Negroes get extra crazy and wipe out all the ‘honkeys’.

    How would the globo-homo media respond to that? What would the Narrative say?

    How would conservatives respond?

    My guess. Narrative will go on as usual, and even Cons will say, “Well, whites sort of deserved it cuz they were ‘racist’.” Time to move on… with the latest news on Kanye West and Kardashian.

    So, we’ve gone from “Genocide is inexcusable because the perpetrators are ‘racist’” to “Genocide is excusable because the victims are ‘racist’.”

    Consider how NYT covered the deaths of Eugene Terreblanche and the white victims of Omar Thorton. And the Bosnian victim of black violence in Ferguson. And UVA frat was attacked as if it was Hitler’s bunker.

    No outrage when whites are killed by certain favored ‘victim’ groups.

    Get ready.

  62. @Mark Minter
    I got this hobby of looking at real estate web pages. I have done it for years. And you can determine the economic health of a place using big house as the bellweather indicator. I sort of start in New York, then Los Angeles, Miami, Vegas (still sucks), then Mexico, Colombia, Brazil, Paris, then often I use Engels Volkers, this German firm for a world wide glance at the bigs. Houses and apartments from 700-1000 sq meters (7700-11000) are not all that common. They exists but are some percentage smaller than 1% on most of these pages, which are the elite of real estate listings. As you would expect, the US, UK, France, Italy, all dominate the top priced listings. New York has gotten ridiculous even by New York standards. The good stuff in Miami has sold and now what's left is far north of Miami Beach like Aventura. LA is very ridiculous and now the best pages are showing Tarzana where in 2009 it was all L.A proper. Vegas still sucks.

    At the bottom typically, in price are Chile (lots of big houses surrounding Santiago, Dominican Republic (particularly older big houses in Casa de Campo but mostly it is an American retiree destination as fares as the economy fares. Newer stuff on the north coast of the DR do well), a lot of junk ugly stuff in Costa del Col and the Barcelona coasts in Spain, some older stuff in Mallorca (Spain in general still hasn't recovered). And surprisingly Belgium kept popping up with some really neat attractive big lofts, neat renovations in villas, particularly in Flanders, and in Antwerp like stuff that would sell for 15,000,000 in Paris goes for 2.5-3.0 million in Antwerp. Go figure.

    Then there is South Africa.

    Before getting all iSteve educated, I would see those South Africa houses and not notice. I figured, "yeah well Africa or something. Maybe Cheap land. Cheap Labor." But then there is this recent news about Kill The Boers, all the murders of the "settlers" the rape rate, and last night I noticed something.

    It is a dumping ground. It is beyond just cheap houses. Houses costs what houses cost. Labor is labor. Land is land. But there is a limit. A door costs what a door costs. Windows same. And especially in a place like South Africa, Chile, the DR that aren't famous for making sinks, bathtubs, stoves, ovens, even windows, those things can even be more expensive because they often are brought in. Colombia is surprising "costly". A big house in Bogota is cheaper than the US and UK, but often is 3 million for 600 mts and competes with a US house outside of those big famous areas. Cali is cheap, Cartagena, Barranquilla are not. Heck, there is still an unresolved war going in Colombia. Yet I would consider it in a heartbeat before ever thinking of South Africa.

    And South Africa is beyond cheap and it is sheer numbers of those big houses in those pages. Engels Volkers is a German company, there 4400 German listings, 1500 Lux properties in the US and Italy. There are 6600 in South Africa.

    And the number of big properties, larger than 700 mts is staggering. 260 out of 1200 worldwide. Almost 1 in 5. Literally once you get below the 2 million euro level in Engels Volkers, 90% of the listings for page after page in houses 700-1000 meters are South African. It is beyond just that they can build them cheaper. I read these pages so often, for so long, you can recognize hardship and dumpage vs even a slump or an affordable market.

    It is a like a whole country is doing what white homeowners in Ferguson, Mo are doing. Except the Fergie people are gonna lose their shirts. The Boers, at best will lose their country and many will lose their lives.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Bert, @Jfr

    Parts of Brazil are very similar. Homes in the nicest parts of cities like Rio and Sao Paulo that sell for US$1 million are complete rubbish compared to what that price tag could buy you in Los Angeles. Heck, a $250,000 apartment in LA is often much nicer than a $750,000 apartment in Rio.

  63. @anonymous-antimarxist
    @syonredux

    Got rid of The Atlantic 12 years ago after being a subscriber for over 15 years. Can't believe anybody wastes any time on it any more. A once great and nearly essential magazine for over a 150 years is now just clickbait barely above Gawker or Salon level of seriousness. Don't even read their free stuff.

    Sorry Syon unless you fill me in on what the The Atlantic is saying, I have nothing to add because I refuse to go there.

    Replies: @SPMoore8, @Jim Don Bob

    It’s just the same old silly argument about how Jackson has to be removed from the $20 bill and replaced by a woman because of Indian Removal, Trail of Tears, etc., which I consider complete nonsense since he was hardly the prime mover and everyone wanted it to happen (I think I might have had ancestors victimized by the way so it’s not like I’m trying to downplay it.) Even so, as unjust as it may have been, it was hardly a “genocide”.

    However, you have missed the best suggestion, which is to replace Jackson’ visage with a picture of Mohammed. I am totally down with that.

  64. Italy is clearly starting to get feed up with Open Borders style immigration non-policy

    Yes: The leader of the anti-immigrant Northern League party, Matteo Salvini, called for an immediate naval blockade of the coast of Libya while Daniela Santanche, a prominent member of Silvio Berlusconi’s Forza Italia party said Italy’s navy must “sink all the boats.”

    Hundreds drown off Libya

    But have no fear the Papists are on the case. Pope Francis is calling on the rest of Europe to help Italy deal with the refugee invasion. Of course, he doesn’t mean help Italy sink the boats full of invaders; he means welcome them to our towns and cities. The Catholic Church hates Europeans.

    • Replies: @ABN
    @Matra

    There's really only three choices:

    1. The status quo, in which Europeans send mixed signals to illegal immigrants/asylum-seekers. People keep coming to Europe by the back door, and keep dying by the dozen or hundred in these Mediterranean episodes. Pretty much everyone agrees that this situation shouldn't continue.

    2. Europeans disambiguate their policy on migrants by welcoming the asylum-seekers formally. Nobody pays human smugglers or makes a dangerous crossing. An inexhaustible flow of migrants swamps Europe until European living standards are scarcely better than those in Africa. The end result is the cultural, demographic, economic, and political destruction of the European nations. And in the long run the number of poor people in Africa won't even be reduced because fertility rates are more than high enough to pick up the slack of emigration.

    3. Europeans disambiguate their policy on migrants by making it absolutely clear that nobody coming over on the boats has any chance of remaining in Europe. Send the boats back, maybe with a gift basket full of food, water, and condoms. Migrants who land ashore would be sent back after being jailed, caned, or given some other incentive not to try again. They would then be returned to their home country or seaport of origin. Apply this policy rigorously over a period of a couple years, with no exceptions.

    Harsh? Maybe, but the end result is no mass drowning events, unlike with today's non-policy. As for option #2, people who subscribe to that view should explain why they either (1) don't think this ends in the ruination of Europe or (2) don't care that that this ends in the ruination of Europe. Someone needs to challenge the Vatican on this; is Christianity a national suicide pact? Or is self-preservation something that gets rendered to Caesar?

    , @HA
    @Matra

    "The Catholic Church hates Europeans."

    Give me a break. The Catholic Church has been one of the rare voices in the modern world arguing against the birth dearth and urging Europeans to put an end to it. If Catholic Spaniards and Italians were more devout, then there’d be a lot more of them (and the canard about how we have to import immigrants to beef up the work force would be even more obviously false).

    Moreover, whereas the Pope is always going to encourage Catholics to be charitable towards those with less, it’s ultimately up to the layman to determine how much of his paycheck he or she will fork over and when enough is enough – any authority the Pope has does not extend to usurping that final decision. And there’s nothing un-Christian with arguing that there are better solutions to the refugee problem than draining Africa of its most entrepreneurial citizens and turning them into Europe’s underclass and/or its new Bosnias.

  65. @anon
    OT:

    More media triumphalism on White America's death.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TMrJDHu_TU

    Replies: @Jefferson

    “OT:

    More media triumphalism on White America’s death.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TMrJDHu_TU”

    Notice how they bring up the KKK in that video as they try to paint that organization as the epitome/face of White America. They completely ignore the fact that out of 195 million White Americans, only a mere 5 thousand are members of the KKK which is not even a blip on the radar. I have been to World Wrestling Entertainment events that have drawn way more people than that. ISIS has way more members than the KKK. MS-13 also has way more members than the KKK. Yet the Left Wing are paranoid enough to be believe that the KKK is still the true threat to world peace, lol.

    Also I find it funny that they say in the video that Blacks are forced to live in high crime neighborhoods, as if these neighborhoods will always have high crime no matter what demographic inhabits that area. As if the houses and buildings commit crimes and not the actual residents who inhabit these areas. If you replace the population in Houston, Texas’s predominantly Black 5th Ward neighborhood for example with mostly Italian American or Jewish American residents, I guarantee the 5th Ward would lose it’s reputation of being a high crime neighborhood that White people should avoid at all costs.

  66. “But have no fear the Papists are on the case. Pope Francis is calling on the rest of Europe to help Italy deal with the refugee invasion. Of course, he doesn’t mean help Italy sink the boats full of invaders he means welcome them to our towns and cities. The Catholic Church hates Europeans.”

    Since the current Pope is from Argentina, I hope he is also open to Argentina receiving masses of Sub Saharan African and MENA Muslim immigrants so that Argentina can quickly lose it’s Catholic European majority. After all I am sure The Pope agrees that DIEversity trumps Catholicism.

  67. European restrictionists should campaign to build a Great Wall of Sahara along the southern borders of the N. African Arab countries and pay the Arabs to police it. While N. African immigration is obviously a huge problem too, for now it’s more important to split the ranks of the anti-white coalition. It is reasonable to believe that pointing out to the Arabs that building the wall would also contribute to sparing N. Africa the cruel fate of negrification could see them change their allegiance from anti-white to anti-black.

  68. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    “These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous.”

    It’s irrational to think that humans are rational, not rationalizing, creatures, as the man said, so this claim is probably irrational. And xenophobia might actually be more rational then trade calculations from the point-of-view of your gametes. What do they care if you are more prosperous now, but 5 generations on they have been displaced?

    Then, of course, these outbursts are probably rational by calculation of the people who are literally in economic competition with the new-comers. Why shouldn’t the losers escalate from economic competition to violent competition? What have they got to lose? It’s all a rational calculation, right?

  69. @International Jew
    Competition in the labor market doesn't explain all of this "xenophobla". There's also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn't have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch...

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @anonymous, @pork pie hat, @Steve Sailer

    A few years back there was a big anti-Chinese shopkeeper pogrom on Guadalcanal. The next afternoon the hungover rioters showed up, hungry, at the burnt-out shops wondering who was going to sell them food.

    • Replies: @International Jew
    @Steve Sailer

    Heh.
    In VS Naipaul's _A Bend in the River_, after the foreign shops are, by edict, "Africanized", the existing inventory is sold and consumed, and after that nothing gets restocked.

  70. @Art Deco
    @Bob

    Barbados is run by 'white racist oppressors'?

    Replies: @Bob, @Jefferson

    Please continue …. Barbados and …

    When you compare one island with the billions, literal billions, you have proved my point.

  71. @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren't that rational though, since they'll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1519701/posts?page=1

    " Zimbabwe: Govt to cede land to Chinese"


    GOVERNMENT is next week expected to sign an agricultural agreement with China that could see vast tracts of land being ceded to the fast-growing nation.

    The deal, envisaged to boost agricultural production, should be signed on November 8 and will be guaranteed by the Ministry of Finance.

    ...

    Government's chaotic land reform programme that involved the forcible take over of white-owned commercial farms to "correct colonial land ownership imbalances" has been a recipe for disaster. It has reduced Zimbabwe from a net grain exporter to a net importer in a space of five years.

    Agricultural production levels dropped sharply as commercial farmers took their skills to countries as far flung as Nigeria, Zambia and Mozambique.
     

    Replies: @Kylie, @Nathan Wartooth, @Fredrik, @Wilkey

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    Exactly. We saw something similar here when the rioting by blacks in Ferguson included burning and looting black-owned and run businesses.

    Saying this violence has to do with economic conditions, etc. is ascribing a level of abstract thought to the participants that I suspect is largely absent. I would characterize it as opportunistic in origin rather than economic.

  72. @Mark Minter
    I got this hobby of looking at real estate web pages. I have done it for years. And you can determine the economic health of a place using big house as the bellweather indicator. I sort of start in New York, then Los Angeles, Miami, Vegas (still sucks), then Mexico, Colombia, Brazil, Paris, then often I use Engels Volkers, this German firm for a world wide glance at the bigs. Houses and apartments from 700-1000 sq meters (7700-11000) are not all that common. They exists but are some percentage smaller than 1% on most of these pages, which are the elite of real estate listings. As you would expect, the US, UK, France, Italy, all dominate the top priced listings. New York has gotten ridiculous even by New York standards. The good stuff in Miami has sold and now what's left is far north of Miami Beach like Aventura. LA is very ridiculous and now the best pages are showing Tarzana where in 2009 it was all L.A proper. Vegas still sucks.

    At the bottom typically, in price are Chile (lots of big houses surrounding Santiago, Dominican Republic (particularly older big houses in Casa de Campo but mostly it is an American retiree destination as fares as the economy fares. Newer stuff on the north coast of the DR do well), a lot of junk ugly stuff in Costa del Col and the Barcelona coasts in Spain, some older stuff in Mallorca (Spain in general still hasn't recovered). And surprisingly Belgium kept popping up with some really neat attractive big lofts, neat renovations in villas, particularly in Flanders, and in Antwerp like stuff that would sell for 15,000,000 in Paris goes for 2.5-3.0 million in Antwerp. Go figure.

    Then there is South Africa.

    Before getting all iSteve educated, I would see those South Africa houses and not notice. I figured, "yeah well Africa or something. Maybe Cheap land. Cheap Labor." But then there is this recent news about Kill The Boers, all the murders of the "settlers" the rape rate, and last night I noticed something.

    It is a dumping ground. It is beyond just cheap houses. Houses costs what houses cost. Labor is labor. Land is land. But there is a limit. A door costs what a door costs. Windows same. And especially in a place like South Africa, Chile, the DR that aren't famous for making sinks, bathtubs, stoves, ovens, even windows, those things can even be more expensive because they often are brought in. Colombia is surprising "costly". A big house in Bogota is cheaper than the US and UK, but often is 3 million for 600 mts and competes with a US house outside of those big famous areas. Cali is cheap, Cartagena, Barranquilla are not. Heck, there is still an unresolved war going in Colombia. Yet I would consider it in a heartbeat before ever thinking of South Africa.

    And South Africa is beyond cheap and it is sheer numbers of those big houses in those pages. Engels Volkers is a German company, there 4400 German listings, 1500 Lux properties in the US and Italy. There are 6600 in South Africa.

    And the number of big properties, larger than 700 mts is staggering. 260 out of 1200 worldwide. Almost 1 in 5. Literally once you get below the 2 million euro level in Engels Volkers, 90% of the listings for page after page in houses 700-1000 meters are South African. It is beyond just that they can build them cheaper. I read these pages so often, for so long, you can recognize hardship and dumpage vs even a slump or an affordable market.

    It is a like a whole country is doing what white homeowners in Ferguson, Mo are doing. Except the Fergie people are gonna lose their shirts. The Boers, at best will lose their country and many will lose their lives.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Bert, @Jfr

    Are you familiar with the Internet term tl:dr?

    • Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson
    @Bert

    How about you work on your attention span? Or did I lose you after the first three syllables?

  73. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:


    Maybe you mean market-dominant minorities, not middle-man minorities. They’re different concepts

    No, I think he got his point across. Interlopers. Peoples who insinuate themselves into high-trust societies to cull all they can while marveling at that own superiority over the people who created the very society, the only society, in which these interlopers can excel.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Anonymous

    He is talking about Africa, not high trust societies. How did you get that idea?

    Anotherdad appears confused. Middle man minorities are those who facilitate corruption and do not create wealth. They broker deals between a government and a buyer of a mining license for instance.

    Merchant minorities are market dominant minorities who are wealthy because they create wealth like opening a retail shop that competes with other retail shops in the area, driving down the cost of living for all consumers.

    That is these African shopkeepers in South Africa do. Anotherdad's comments are dumb.

  74. @Matra
    Italy is clearly starting to get feed up with Open Borders style immigration non-policy

    Yes: The leader of the anti-immigrant Northern League party, Matteo Salvini, called for an immediate naval blockade of the coast of Libya while Daniela Santanche, a prominent member of Silvio Berlusconi's Forza Italia party said Italy's navy must "sink all the boats."

    Hundreds drown off Libya

    But have no fear the Papists are on the case. Pope Francis is calling on the rest of Europe to help Italy deal with the refugee invasion. Of course, he doesn't mean help Italy sink the boats full of invaders; he means welcome them to our towns and cities. The Catholic Church hates Europeans.

    Replies: @ABN, @HA

    There’s really only three choices:

    1. The status quo, in which Europeans send mixed signals to illegal immigrants/asylum-seekers. People keep coming to Europe by the back door, and keep dying by the dozen or hundred in these Mediterranean episodes. Pretty much everyone agrees that this situation shouldn’t continue.

    2. Europeans disambiguate their policy on migrants by welcoming the asylum-seekers formally. Nobody pays human smugglers or makes a dangerous crossing. An inexhaustible flow of migrants swamps Europe until European living standards are scarcely better than those in Africa. The end result is the cultural, demographic, economic, and political destruction of the European nations. And in the long run the number of poor people in Africa won’t even be reduced because fertility rates are more than high enough to pick up the slack of emigration.

    3. Europeans disambiguate their policy on migrants by making it absolutely clear that nobody coming over on the boats has any chance of remaining in Europe. Send the boats back, maybe with a gift basket full of food, water, and condoms. Migrants who land ashore would be sent back after being jailed, caned, or given some other incentive not to try again. They would then be returned to their home country or seaport of origin. Apply this policy rigorously over a period of a couple years, with no exceptions.

    Harsh? Maybe, but the end result is no mass drowning events, unlike with today’s non-policy. As for option #2, people who subscribe to that view should explain why they either (1) don’t think this ends in the ruination of Europe or (2) don’t care that that this ends in the ruination of Europe. Someone needs to challenge the Vatican on this; is Christianity a national suicide pact? Or is self-preservation something that gets rendered to Caesar?

  75. @Priss Factor
    Things must be really bad in other African countries if people there go to South Africa for a better life. South Africa with astronomical unemployment rate.

    Why is it okay for a people to resist imperialism but not okay to resist immiperialism--demographic imperialism via massive immigration--when the latter is clearly more dangerous?

    After all, Hindus got rid of Brits and Viets got rid of the French, but Serbs lost Kosovo and Palestinians lost Palestine forever. Why? Immiperialism. Demography is destiny.

    I don't like violence. But I support blacks in SA using whatever means necessary to keep the invaders out.

    Resisters and defenders of the nation are more honorable than chickenshit white-flag-wavers like Europeans and American Cons who can't even defend Indiana from the globo-homo agenda.

    In THE SEARCHERS Ethan is angry that Debbie's white womb will be used to create baby warriors for the tribe that wiped out his brother's family.

    The GOP, the political womb of American Conservatism, has been totally hijacked and is being used to hatch the very forces that only further the death of White America,

    Ethan thought it better that Debbie die than live as sex slave of the reds.

    GOP is a sex slave of the globo/homo forces.

    It's best to put it out of its shame and misery.

    Replies: @BB753

    “GOP is a sex slave of the globo/homo forces.

    It’s best to put it out of its shame and misery.”

    Well put! GOP should be abolished, to use leftist speech, so the American regime stands naked for all the world to see in its ugly despotism and corruption.

  76. @5371
    These events are the result of countries to the north of SA producing more people than they can employ locally.

    Replies: @ren

    How about we change our foreign policy such that the only form of foreign aid we will give is birth control.

    • Replies: @5371
    @ren

    You'll have to check that it isn't being used the same way as in "Scoop".

  77. @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren't that rational though, since they'll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1519701/posts?page=1

    " Zimbabwe: Govt to cede land to Chinese"


    GOVERNMENT is next week expected to sign an agricultural agreement with China that could see vast tracts of land being ceded to the fast-growing nation.

    The deal, envisaged to boost agricultural production, should be signed on November 8 and will be guaranteed by the Ministry of Finance.

    ...

    Government's chaotic land reform programme that involved the forcible take over of white-owned commercial farms to "correct colonial land ownership imbalances" has been a recipe for disaster. It has reduced Zimbabwe from a net grain exporter to a net importer in a space of five years.

    Agricultural production levels dropped sharply as commercial farmers took their skills to countries as far flung as Nigeria, Zambia and Mozambique.
     

    Replies: @Kylie, @Nathan Wartooth, @Fredrik, @Wilkey

    Noam Chomsky was on NPR today with Tavis Smiley, so naturally it was all about how evil white people are.

    He was talking about the USAs plan to let Europe have Africa and exploit it for resources. I was laughing and said to myself “and now the Chinese are going to rule Africa with an iron fist.” I hope Africans like their new Chinese overlords.

    • Replies: @Drogger
    @Nathan Wartooth

    I'd imagine the African despots will love their new Chinese overlords. Why, without human rights requirements and Western NGO's no longer up their ass about poverty and abuse, I think they will get along just fine with a China that cares not a damn about those people.

    The Chinese are like Leopold II. Whereas the Belgians eventually grew a soul and realized Colonialism wasn't the hottest shit on the block the Chinese won't.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  78. @Art Deco
    @Bob

    Barbados is run by 'white racist oppressors'?

    Replies: @Bob, @Jefferson

    “Barbados is run by ‘white racist oppressors’?”

    Barbados is such a small country that their population size is similar to that of the city of Reno, Nevada. The only Black country on the planet that is not a total 3rd world toilet, but make no bones about it the only reason they are better off than other Negroid countries is because their population is so miniscule.

    Even the least populated state in the U.S Wyoming still has a larger population than Barbados.

  79. Uh-Oh Part 33 1/3: Truth goes into hiding.

  80. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    “A few years back there was a big anti-Chinese shopkeeper pogrom on Guadalcanal.”

    Being ignorant of all this, I googled, and I found more peace on earth. It turns out that Australia had to play colonialist, apparently very soft-voiced or with a well-managed press strategy, to overcome immigration problems getting out of hand on Guadalcanal…

    “Five Out of Ten: A Performance Report on the Regional Assistance Mission to the Solomon Islands (RAMSI)”, CIS (Centre for Independent Studies–Ideas for a better Australia), Gaurav Sodhi, 31 January 2008:

    “…Large numbers of migrants moved from the island of Malatia to Guadalcanal in search of better economic opportunities, and came to be resented by Guadalcanalese who claimed the Malaitans were taking their land and jobs. From the mid-1990s, civil unrest turned to violence, with open fighting bringing economic decline and finally triggering collapse. In April 2003, then Prime Minister… requested Australian assistance. …an Australian-led assistance package became the Regional Assistance Mission to the Solomon Islands (RAMSI).

    RAMSI landed military, police, and civilian personnel in the Solomon Islands in 2003. The immediate objective was to restore law and order by confiscating firearms… Those responsible for the worst of the violence were to be brought to justice.

    The RAMSI intervention marked a turning point for Australia’s relationship… After years of high aid flows that tried to assist development, Australia was reluctantly forced to, in effect, take over the running of one of its closest neighbours.

    This year will mark five years since RAMSI’s forces landed in the Solomon Islands, and their success to date has been mixed. The Australian Defence Forces’ pacification effort has been enormously successful. Over 6,000 militiamen have been arrested, over 9,000 charges have been laid, and more than 3,000 guns have been confiscated. Civil stability has returned, but the security gains will prove temporary if the underlying economic stagnation that led to the civil unrest is not addressed. …

    …most people do not even participate in the cash economy… More than 85% of Solomon Islanders live subsistence lives in rural areas. …

    …Honiara teems with unemployed youth idling in the shade, despondent and restless because they have no present and no future….

    …There is no indigenous informal sector. Chinese shopkeepers and other expatriates dominate commercial opportunities.”

    The Australians are probably never going to live down this evil imperialist colonial adventure. Patterns, patterns, everywhere, and not a thought to think!

  81. @Nathan Wartooth
    @Anonymous

    Noam Chomsky was on NPR today with Tavis Smiley, so naturally it was all about how evil white people are.

    He was talking about the USAs plan to let Europe have Africa and exploit it for resources. I was laughing and said to myself "and now the Chinese are going to rule Africa with an iron fist." I hope Africans like their new Chinese overlords.

    Replies: @Drogger

    I’d imagine the African despots will love their new Chinese overlords. Why, without human rights requirements and Western NGO’s no longer up their ass about poverty and abuse, I think they will get along just fine with a China that cares not a damn about those people.

    The Chinese are like Leopold II. Whereas the Belgians eventually grew a soul and realized Colonialism wasn’t the hottest shit on the block the Chinese won’t.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Drogger

    This is an incoherent comparison.

    Belgians held Congo as a personal fiefdom and colony. As in it was a military occupation. Belgians at gunpoint enslaved and bled the subject people.

    China is an investor in Congo. It pays wages to local to be miners in its mines.

    Very low grade analysis in a lot of these thread comments.

    Replies: @Bert, @ABN

  82. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    A bit more context on that modern island paradise, Guadalcanal, and its immigration problems with neighboring island of Malaita and with the Chinese:

    “Regional Assistance Mission to Solomon Islands”:

    “…also known as Operation Helpem Fren…

    …international security contingent of 2,200 police and troops, led by Australia…

    …On 18 April 2006 Snyder Rini was elected Prime Minister of the Solomon Islands in a general election. This sparked rioting in Honiara amidst allegations that the election was fixed with the aid of money from Chinese businessmen. Parts of Honiara were razed and looted, with Chinese-owned property particularly targeted. With up to 90% of their shops burnt down in Chinatown, most Chinese have evacuated the country in fear of their personal safety. …

    …The last Australian infantry returned to Australia on 1 August 2013…

    …After arriving on 24 July 2003, a total of 7,270 Australian personnel deployed during that country’s support to RAMSI. …”

    These things do get expensive:

    “…Australian government spending on RAMSI is calculated at $2.6 billion in real terms to date…”

  83. Trumpenprole [AKA "Pseudonomous"] says:
    @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    Bull! South Africa was a country, and they lost their country the same way we are losing ours. When white men voted to give suffrage to women it was as if they took western civilization outside and shot it in the head. Generally speaking women are, physically, mentally and morally weaker than men. They are irrational and illogical. They care more about feelings and sentiment then about truth. Immediately after getting the vote, they began voting against the interests of their own people, and against their own men. They, along with white knights, hold together the coalition of the fringes. Do you think white South African men would have voted for the dissolution of their country? Do you doubt that we wouldn’t have illegal immigration if men were in charge like THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE?

  84. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    It’s a nice thought but I believe you fail to take account of the historical context.

    The ‘two state solution’ would have needed to be brokered, or at least administered, during the high Cold War decades post WW2. The ANC was a pan-African movement, in which historically warring tribes coalesced to oppose a greater enemy. The ideological glue that held such an unlikely thing in place was Marxism – at the time, not effete Cultural Marxism, but full blooded Soviet/Maoist Communism. It a footnote now that Mandela was voted president in 1994 as head of the ANC/SACP alliance – an ironic start to the ‘End of History’.

    It’s impossible to see the cozy fraternal relations between a solid CIA proxy and a bitterly contested neighbour. If ‘SA Noir’ did somehow manage to remain pro-Western, its blackness would in no way have appeased the usual suspects. Internally, the result would be perpetual civil war. Externally, ‘SA Blanc’ would be a pariah and ‘SA Noir’ would be denounced as a puppet state and subjected to relentless destabilisation.

  85. The positive side to this Zulu xenophobia and Africans drowning in the Mediterranean is that Trevor Noah has lots of topical material to joke about on the Daily Show. He might even want to bring up why Obama is so concerned about Iranian nuclear enrichment when South Africa refuses to turn over almost 500 lbs of bomb grade enriched uranium they inherited from the Boer regime.

  86. @Nathan Wartooth
    The blacks in South Africa know what happens when you allow in millions of immigrants and allow them to vote; they take over your country. They are just trying to keep what they did to the whites happen to them.

    Replies: @Drapetomaniac

    “The blacks in South Africa know what happens when you allow in millions of immigrants and allow them to vote; they take over your country.”

    Just what happened to the freedom and individualism that was the basis for America.

    Liberty minded people are in a numerical position towards the rest of the world that is similar to what the early settlement people were versus the hunter-gatherers.
    Unfortunately the freedom culture isn’t competing with low tech savages, but a chain of command hierarchy that controls most of the world economy.

    America was anomalous, successful, and doomed to fail.

  87. @anonymous
    Italy is clearly starting to get feed up with Open Borders style immigration non-policy:

    "Mediterranean migrant deaths: EU faces renewed pressure", BBC, 19 April 2015:


    "Italian PM Matteo Renzi has led calls for more European Union action on sea migration...

    ...The 20m (70ft) long boat was believed to be carrying up to 700 migrants, and only 28 survivors have been rescued. ...

    ...Up to 1,500 migrants are now feared to have drowned this year alone. ...

    Mr Renzi... said more rescue boats was not the issue, rather it was stopping the boats from departing."

     

    Seriously, if there's no stop to this, maybe all those old colonialists were right. It's a crime for these immigrants to live in a place ruled by people like themselves, a horror worthy of asylum. By that logic, wouldn't it be best to rule these people's countries for them? Is it a crime to deny them the benefit of Western rule?

    Better to say clearly "good fences make good neighbors", "clean your own house first", "live in the bed you make", etc.. With a lot of willingness to help, but not just by helping them loot the place and flee... and then, of course, be willing to tell us how racist we are, over and over.

    Replies: @David

    1500 this year? Ha! 12,000 children under the age of 5 die every day in Africa.

    The grim reaper reaps by the bushel. If every soul were a grain of rice (that’s about 2mm souls to the bushel), the only exceptionally heavy lift in our lifetimes is the Dec 26, 2004 tsunami.

    • Replies: @Brutusale
    @David

    The WHO says 25,000, not 12,000. Proving your point to the nth degree.

    I used to have a colleague from India, and whenever there was some sort of disaster there where a few hundred died, he'd say that no one there cared, that it takes 1,000+ deaths to get any Indian's attention.

  88. Middle Men exist as a function of the FAILURE of the host population to do anything requiring intelligence, hard work, and deferred gratification. For example, South Korea, Japan, Finland, Scotland, Sweden, New Zealand, Australia, and Canada do not have a long history of middle men taking up positions in say, retail; finance; banking; baking-pastries; and transport to name a few.

    Populations prefer to ghost dance and look for scapegoats. Germany in the 1920s, rather than face the facts that the German military was superb save for logistics where it was a miserable failure and ended up fighting in the Western Front, Eastern Front, Italian Front (Alps), Balkans, and Turkey/the ME, preferred to blame Jews instead of over-reach and fundamental flaws in the military. Neither were fixed disastrously years later.

    Barack Obama has a passage in Dreams from My Father: A STORY OF RACE AND INHERITANCE that Steve quotes repeatedly. In it, Obama and his half-sister sit in a Nairobi restaurant run by Indian Emigres and get lousy service mistaken for poor tipping natives compared to White tourists who get great service. Obama then muses in print how it would be good for his father’s dream of expulsion of all non-Blacks from Kenya even if it meant total economic chaos and poverty.

    Syriza in Greece feeds off the same instinct: kick out the Germans, IMF, ECB, etc. and all will be daisies and roses. After all, the EU means the Germans give Greeks money and Greeks spend it however they want, right?

    It is pretty unlikely that Africa will ever be a High Tech Hub but serious reforms by the people themselves could make them profitable exporters of chocolate, coffee, textiles, and other high labor input industries. Under investment, conflict, war, disease have cut places like Ghana, Ivory Coast, etc. output of chocolate to a fraction of its potential and has led Nestle to invest in SE Asia and Latin America for chocolate farming/production.

  89. I think that the Boers should do whatever the hell they can to get away from that disgusting continent. There might not be much time left.

  90. Ironically, with the fall of apartheid, Black South Africans lost control of their border and their country, as hundreds of thousands of foreign Africans poured into the country, mostly from Zimbabwe, Nigeria, Somalia, Congo, Mozambique, Malawi and Ethiopia -to the tune of 5 million. Apparently, the foreigners completely dominate small retail and the informal economy in the black townships where unemployment is very high. The ruling ANC elite are not doing anything to stem the tsunami of illegals because they are ideologically vested into the notion of pan african nationalism. To make matters worse, illegal pakistanis, bangladeshis and CHINESE have also started showing up in South Africa in droves so now even the long established Indian and Malay South Africans are mad too!

    Native black south Africans are looting the foreign black owned businesses, and driving the immigrants out with violence, much of it which is terrible. Youtube has some pretty grisly videos of these xenophobic attacks.

    The ANC is sitting on a tinderbox, because the native Blacks were promised free housing and jobs once apartheid ended, and instead they got 5 million desperate, harder working, independent minded, mostly English speaking aggressive (think Somalis and Nigerians) competitors running circles around them. The only ones who are terrified seem to be White South Africans elite because those folks are thinking, “if the natives can do this to their fellow African brothers, what else are they capable off?” and “are we next?”.

    Black Africans have always had a deep resentment towards the Brown immigrant entrepreneurs class that the colonial powers had hoisted on them-the
    South asians (by the British), and Lebanese (by the French). Africans, especially Christian Africans in particular, resented how these foreigners dominated urban small businesses down to the SLUM level. The natives could only brew and sell beer. Africans were used to the traditional, female dominated, laid-back barter trade system, and could not yet compete with the foreigners. In muslim black africa, the threat from outsiders was not as much, as muslim africans were already experienced global traders-especially the Somali and Swahili. In time, native Africans eventually picked up modern business skills once they became urbanized. For example, now, the Kikuyu (Kenya) and Ibo (Nigeria) consider themselves like “Jews” , and in fact have become successful businessman who can better compete with the south indians and Lebanese (In Uganda, the natives inhumanely kicked out the Indians- a different story). The Somalis and coastal Africans simply intermarried with their Yemeni competitors, and that was the end of that. In the new South Africa, it is Africans immigrants that have become the new hated foreign small businessman. Adding insult to injury, African foreigners are also actually “taking away” low skill jobs from the natives because many White South African businesses consider them cheaper, and more RELIABLE than the native blacks. It also does not help that Nigerians criminals run the drug trade, and all kinds of scams.

    It does not get much attention in the media, but there is a massive movement of Africans going on in the world, into Europe, the Middle East, Asia.

    It is out of Africa all over again.

  91. Even in 2006 when I was on Vacation, many of the blacks in SA were complaining about the never ending flow of “immigrants”. Shanty towns were everywhere and the streets of Johannesburg were lined with these illegals like the Mexicans at the border selling trinkets and gum.

  92. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    I worked in Bantu homeland in the 1950’s. Verwoerd would not allow private enterprise to develop these areas nor would he allow private ownership of the farmland. This is what Dr. Eiselen who was one of the architects of Apartheid said after he retired:
    ‘Dr Werner Eiselen, a leading Broederbond theorist and Verwoerd’s Secretary of Native Affairs, resigned his post in 1960 and became High Commissioner for Bophutha Tswana. Some said it was because of his general disillusionment that so little had been done to promote genuine separate development. Some time later he gave an interview to a French journalist who wanted to know why the government had not practised what it had preached. “My dear sir, you can’t imagine the bitterness of our internal political struggles. The opposition criticizes us when we put into practice what they demand in theory, that it to say when we improve the lot of the Bantu. The farmers lose sight of our aim, they do not think ahead. When the state purchases land for the Bantu they say: ‘ Perhaps it is my farm they are going to buy up tomorrow. ‘ Our people… only think of their daily comfort. They accept the theory. But at the same time they want comfort. Obviously a generous theory and unchallenged comfort are incompatible.

    • Replies: @PV van der Byl
    @Terry

    Terry,

    Your comments are extremely valuable.

    The last opportunity may have been forfeit in 1956 when Verwoerd (and almost all the rest of the NP influential) rejected the recommendations of the Tomlinson Commission. Tomlinson was a Stellenbosch professor and Broeder who believed that two steps were absolutely essential if the homelands were to be viable for the black population. #1 was government and private sector (including foreign) investment in industry in the homelands and #2 was transformation of all the then communally (i.e. controlled by chiefs) owned farmland in the Bantustans into private property owned by individual black farmers.

    I don't much care for William Beinert (retired UCT professor) but his account of the Tomlinson Commission supports your remarks closely:


    In 1956, the apartheid government was presented with the report of the Tomlinson Commission. It was an ambitious prospectus for the development of the African reserves, which this Stellenbosch professor of Agricultural Economics believed was essential if apartheid was to succeed. Only through massive state investment in rural development could the prospective homelands ever take off. Only in this way could the surge of African migration to the major cities be stopped Tomlinson was clear about the alternatives: either his plan was implemented or apartheid would fail.

    He suggested investment of over £100 million (73 times that much now). Three amongst many key proposals stand out. African landholding should be consolidated and privatised. Private investment, including foreign investment, should be allowed. And rapid rural industrialisation should be funded by the state.

    It is often thought that Tomlinson shaped homeland policy, but this is only partly true. Verwoerd had then been Minister of Native Affairs for six years. Hugely energetic, he had expanded his department to become a state within a state. He resented this well-publicised commission, appointed by his predecessor, which was not directly under his control. Verwoerd is often seen as an ideologue and relentless protagonist for ‘separate development’. But he was also a pragmatist concerned about power. Verwoerd rejected these three central recommendations partly because he thought they went too far for the white electorate, but also because the vision of individual landholdings would have put paid to his policy of devolving power to African chiefs. He believed that apartheid could best be built around a conservative, traditionalist rural hierarchy and wanted to keep chiefs as his clients. They were to be the primary mechanism through which the Afrikaner nationalists would control black rural South Africa and secure compliant satellite statelets.

    Tomlinson’s proposals would have been very disruptive, possibly created much poverty in the short term by under-cutting access to land for hundreds of thousands of families. It is doubtful that the state could ever have invested sufficient to secure systematic industrialisation. But at least Tomlinson saw the potential of the rural areas and offered a route to modernity and development. Verwoerd won, entrenching an ossified traditional leadership, customary law and a semi-functional and patriarchal system of local government.
     
  93. @Bert
    @Mark Minter

    Are you familiar with the Internet term tl:dr?

    Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson

    How about you work on your attention span? Or did I lose you after the first three syllables?

  94. Nate: I think that the Boers should do whatever the hell they can to get away from that disgusting continent. There might not be much time left.

    No use. The eternal pattern will continue. Whites build up a country, blacks drag it down. Whites leave, blacks eventually follow them – more or less. As the last Boers are chased out of SA, it will finally revert to savagery, and many of its blacks will end up heading for Europe. If we don’t close our borders, we’ll all be Boers.

  95. @Anonymous
    It's strange but I haven't heard one single word of condemnation uttered by the lefties against these 'appalling heartless racist xenophobic attacks' against 'poor innocent migrants who have only come to enrich South Africa and to seek better lives'.

    Evidently, the Totem Pole works here too, and blacks being the supreme deities of the cult of victimology can never have their names taken in vain, even if the gods in their capricious sport, start murdering one another.

    Compare and contrast the incessant vilification, hatred, contempt, ridicule, abuse, verbal and physical attacks etc meted out in UKIP by all sections of British society from the BIG bastards of the Daily Mail, BBC, The Times, Telegraph, The Sun etc who have made common cause with the the hardest of hardest lefties in doing everything humanly possible to try to derail and defuse UKIP ahead of May's General Election. Their big tactic now is to deliberately talk down UKIP's poll ratings in order to dissuade voters from voting for them, in a kind of self fulfilling prophecy.

    The irony is that UKIP are the mildest and gentlest of nationalist parties, and first and foremost democratic parliamentarians who value law and order above all else.

    Replies: @22pp22, @Jfr

    I have noticed that, too. The BBC , UK Polling report and Wikipedia all have running averages that show UKIP’s vote as flat. The Telegraph’s poll of polls shows it falling. The DT used to be a great paper. Now it’s even more of a syphilitic rag than the Guardian.

  96. The irony is that UKIP are the mildest and gentlest of nationalist parties, and first and foremost democratic parliamentarians who value law and order above all else.

    Yeah, law and order, it is like that Magna Carta thingie. Yeah, vibrant folks do not get that concept, at all.

  97. @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren't that rational though, since they'll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1519701/posts?page=1

    " Zimbabwe: Govt to cede land to Chinese"


    GOVERNMENT is next week expected to sign an agricultural agreement with China that could see vast tracts of land being ceded to the fast-growing nation.

    The deal, envisaged to boost agricultural production, should be signed on November 8 and will be guaranteed by the Ministry of Finance.

    ...

    Government's chaotic land reform programme that involved the forcible take over of white-owned commercial farms to "correct colonial land ownership imbalances" has been a recipe for disaster. It has reduced Zimbabwe from a net grain exporter to a net importer in a space of five years.

    Agricultural production levels dropped sharply as commercial farmers took their skills to countries as far flung as Nigeria, Zambia and Mozambique.
     

    Replies: @Kylie, @Nathan Wartooth, @Fredrik, @Wilkey

    “These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food”

    Zimbabwe was perfectly rational. Mugabe is still president and that is all that matters.

  98. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Drogger
    @Nathan Wartooth

    I'd imagine the African despots will love their new Chinese overlords. Why, without human rights requirements and Western NGO's no longer up their ass about poverty and abuse, I think they will get along just fine with a China that cares not a damn about those people.

    The Chinese are like Leopold II. Whereas the Belgians eventually grew a soul and realized Colonialism wasn't the hottest shit on the block the Chinese won't.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    This is an incoherent comparison.

    Belgians held Congo as a personal fiefdom and colony. As in it was a military occupation. Belgians at gunpoint enslaved and bled the subject people.

    China is an investor in Congo. It pays wages to local to be miners in its mines.

    Very low grade analysis in a lot of these thread comments.

    • Replies: @Bert
    @Anonymous


    Very low grade analysis in a lot of these thread comments.
     
    Well aren't we a special little snowflake.
    , @ABN
    @Anonymous

    In defense of the Belgians, the Congo Free State was a "personal fiefdom" of Leopold but not a Belgian colony. It became a Belgian colony precisely because of the atrocities that occurred in the lawless, profiteering period prior to 1908.

  99. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    @AnotherDad
    Maybe you mean market-dominant minorities, not middle-man minorities. They’re different concepts
     
    No, I think he got his point across. Interlopers. Peoples who insinuate themselves into high-trust societies to cull all they can while marveling at that own superiority over the people who created the very society, the only society, in which these interlopers can excel.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    He is talking about Africa, not high trust societies. How did you get that idea?

    Anotherdad appears confused. Middle man minorities are those who facilitate corruption and do not create wealth. They broker deals between a government and a buyer of a mining license for instance.

    Merchant minorities are market dominant minorities who are wealthy because they create wealth like opening a retail shop that competes with other retail shops in the area, driving down the cost of living for all consumers.

    That is these African shopkeepers in South Africa do. Anotherdad’s comments are dumb.

  100. @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren't that rational though, since they'll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous. Zimbabwe for example drove away a lot of its white farmers, which resulted in its food production collapsing. The country subsequently had trouble feeding its citizens and turned to the Chinese in desperation to grow more food:

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1519701/posts?page=1

    " Zimbabwe: Govt to cede land to Chinese"


    GOVERNMENT is next week expected to sign an agricultural agreement with China that could see vast tracts of land being ceded to the fast-growing nation.

    The deal, envisaged to boost agricultural production, should be signed on November 8 and will be guaranteed by the Ministry of Finance.

    ...

    Government's chaotic land reform programme that involved the forcible take over of white-owned commercial farms to "correct colonial land ownership imbalances" has been a recipe for disaster. It has reduced Zimbabwe from a net grain exporter to a net importer in a space of five years.

    Agricultural production levels dropped sharply as commercial farmers took their skills to countries as far flung as Nigeria, Zambia and Mozambique.
     

    Replies: @Kylie, @Nathan Wartooth, @Fredrik, @Wilkey

    “These sort of xenophobic outbursts probably aren’t that rational though, since they’ll repel investment and trade and make the rioters less prosperous.”

    Because South Africans, unemployment rate 25%, are doing so splendidly now.

    The attacks on immigrants will accelerate South Africa’s decline, but it doesn’t alter the destination. Whether or not these attacks continue, fifty years from now South Africa will be no better than any other African country.

  101. @ren
    @5371

    How about we change our foreign policy such that the only form of foreign aid we will give is birth control.

    Replies: @5371

    You’ll have to check that it isn’t being used the same way as in “Scoop”.

  102. You can buy a used copy of District 9 on Amazon for almost nothing plus postage

  103. @Anonymous
    @Drogger

    This is an incoherent comparison.

    Belgians held Congo as a personal fiefdom and colony. As in it was a military occupation. Belgians at gunpoint enslaved and bled the subject people.

    China is an investor in Congo. It pays wages to local to be miners in its mines.

    Very low grade analysis in a lot of these thread comments.

    Replies: @Bert, @ABN

    Very low grade analysis in a lot of these thread comments.

    Well aren’t we a special little snowflake.

  104. John Dolan / The War Nerd wrote a good piece that uses these South African riots to discuss low-level ethnic cleansing wars. Worth reading:

    http://pando.com/2015/04/19/the-war-nerd-the-art-of-turf-war/

    He claims there have been only 6 total deaths so far.

  105. @silviosilver
    @AnotherDad


    Furthermore middle man minorities suck–literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate–e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.–middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It’s effectively looting, even if the service is superior.
     
    This is complete nonsense.

    Replies: @TSTCLRFRTTDE

    Come on now, it’s not complete nonsense.

  106. @Big Bill
    @Bill P


    I found that many of the Salvadoran commenters complained of racism in the US. It turned out that they weren’t talking about racism coming from whites, but rather from fairer skinned Mestizos who looked down on their little brown neighbors to the south.
     
    Yet black folks are silent (collectively) about the Mexican invasion of the US. Since Barbara Jordan, no significant leader of blacks has spoken out against open borders or the obvious black job loss. Where is Booker T. Washington ("cast down your buckets") when you need him?

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    Yet black folks are silent (collectively) about the Mexican invasion of the US.

    As with “gay marriage”, Jesse and Al told them to shut up about it, and they did.

    Black leadership is even more corrupt than white.

  107. @Steve Sailer
    @International Jew

    A few years back there was a big anti-Chinese shopkeeper pogrom on Guadalcanal. The next afternoon the hungover rioters showed up, hungry, at the burnt-out shops wondering who was going to sell them food.

    Replies: @International Jew

    Heh.
    In VS Naipaul’s _A Bend in the River_, after the foreign shops are, by edict, “Africanized”, the existing inventory is sold and consumed, and after that nothing gets restocked.

  108. @Terry
    @Lot

    I worked in Bantu homeland in the 1950's. Verwoerd would not allow private enterprise to develop these areas nor would he allow private ownership of the farmland. This is what Dr. Eiselen who was one of the architects of Apartheid said after he retired:
    'Dr Werner Eiselen, a leading Broederbond theorist and Verwoerd's Secretary of Native Affairs, resigned his post in 1960 and became High Commissioner for Bophutha Tswana. Some said it was because of his general disillusionment that so little had been done to promote genuine separate development. Some time later he gave an interview to a French journalist who wanted to know why the government had not practised what it had preached. "My dear sir, you can't imagine the bitterness of our internal political struggles. The opposition criticizes us when we put into practice what they demand in theory, that it to say when we improve the lot of the Bantu. The farmers lose sight of our aim, they do not think ahead. When the state purchases land for the Bantu they say: ' Perhaps it is my farm they are going to buy up tomorrow. ' Our people... only think of their daily comfort. They accept the theory. But at the same time they want comfort. Obviously a generous theory and unchallenged comfort are incompatible.

    Replies: @PV van der Byl

    Terry,

    Your comments are extremely valuable.

    The last opportunity may have been forfeit in 1956 when Verwoerd (and almost all the rest of the NP influential) rejected the recommendations of the Tomlinson Commission. Tomlinson was a Stellenbosch professor and Broeder who believed that two steps were absolutely essential if the homelands were to be viable for the black population. #1 was government and private sector (including foreign) investment in industry in the homelands and #2 was transformation of all the then communally (i.e. controlled by chiefs) owned farmland in the Bantustans into private property owned by individual black farmers.

    I don’t much care for William Beinert (retired UCT professor) but his account of the Tomlinson Commission supports your remarks closely:

    In 1956, the apartheid government was presented with the report of the Tomlinson Commission. It was an ambitious prospectus for the development of the African reserves, which this Stellenbosch professor of Agricultural Economics believed was essential if apartheid was to succeed. Only through massive state investment in rural development could the prospective homelands ever take off. Only in this way could the surge of African migration to the major cities be stopped Tomlinson was clear about the alternatives: either his plan was implemented or apartheid would fail.

    He suggested investment of over £100 million (73 times that much now). Three amongst many key proposals stand out. African landholding should be consolidated and privatised. Private investment, including foreign investment, should be allowed. And rapid rural industrialisation should be funded by the state.

    It is often thought that Tomlinson shaped homeland policy, but this is only partly true. Verwoerd had then been Minister of Native Affairs for six years. Hugely energetic, he had expanded his department to become a state within a state. He resented this well-publicised commission, appointed by his predecessor, which was not directly under his control. Verwoerd is often seen as an ideologue and relentless protagonist for ‘separate development’. But he was also a pragmatist concerned about power. Verwoerd rejected these three central recommendations partly because he thought they went too far for the white electorate, but also because the vision of individual landholdings would have put paid to his policy of devolving power to African chiefs. He believed that apartheid could best be built around a conservative, traditionalist rural hierarchy and wanted to keep chiefs as his clients. They were to be the primary mechanism through which the Afrikaner nationalists would control black rural South Africa and secure compliant satellite statelets.

    Tomlinson’s proposals would have been very disruptive, possibly created much poverty in the short term by under-cutting access to land for hundreds of thousands of families. It is doubtful that the state could ever have invested sufficient to secure systematic industrialisation. But at least Tomlinson saw the potential of the rural areas and offered a route to modernity and development. Verwoerd won, entrenching an ossified traditional leadership, customary law and a semi-functional and patriarchal system of local government.

  109. @Anonymous
    @Drogger

    This is an incoherent comparison.

    Belgians held Congo as a personal fiefdom and colony. As in it was a military occupation. Belgians at gunpoint enslaved and bled the subject people.

    China is an investor in Congo. It pays wages to local to be miners in its mines.

    Very low grade analysis in a lot of these thread comments.

    Replies: @Bert, @ABN

    In defense of the Belgians, the Congo Free State was a “personal fiefdom” of Leopold but not a Belgian colony. It became a Belgian colony precisely because of the atrocities that occurred in the lawless, profiteering period prior to 1908.

  110. @David
    @anonymous

    1500 this year? Ha! 12,000 children under the age of 5 die every day in Africa.

    The grim reaper reaps by the bushel. If every soul were a grain of rice (that's about 2mm souls to the bushel), the only exceptionally heavy lift in our lifetimes is the Dec 26, 2004 tsunami.

    Replies: @Brutusale

    The WHO says 25,000, not 12,000. Proving your point to the nth degree.

    I used to have a colleague from India, and whenever there was some sort of disaster there where a few hundred died, he’d say that no one there cared, that it takes 1,000+ deaths to get any Indian’s attention.

  111. @Lot
    White South Africans missed their chance to have their own country out of the greed of their upper classes who did not want to give up cheap black labor nor their extensive land holdings in the very black areas.

    In the early 80s the tide was obviously runing against them, but they could have broken off the NE 1/5 of the country around Johannesburg where they had a bare majority, plus the Western 1/4 which was majority Coloured but still had more whites than blacks.

    They made a half hearted attempt at this with the bantustans, but they were too small and did not have real independence. Having the small white populations leave the center 55% of the country would have made them even stronger in the 45% they might reasonably have kept. They then could have dismantled apartheid withouf losing their country and would have had the friendly support of Reagan and Thatcher.

    Replies: @unit472, @Neutral, @foxy, @Bob, @ABN, @Trumpenprole, @G Pinfold, @Terry, @Daniel H

    Lot,

    Your analysis is 100% correct. White South Africans have themselves to blame for losing their country. They couldn’t imagine a world without cheap servile labor. Well now they have nothing.

    As far as the notion that the world would not have accepted this partitioned white homeland, well, the world would have had to accept it because South Africans would have had a clean motive to fight and defend it. Besides, what is this “world” that we talk of? The west is dying, demographically and economically. Russia and China would have no qualms about doing business with a white South African state and would have likely sought them as allies to counter the west. White westerners, we are our own worst enemies.

    • Replies: @Tr
    @Daniel H

    A few commenters are painting South African whites as victims who "lost" their country. It's a common trope, especially on the internet, but South African whites enjoy their positions on top of the socio-economic heap in South Africa and are milking their status as the cognitive elite, and gatekeepers to the middle class, without any of the responsibility of ruling over masses of restive natives.

    Sure, SA whites have lost political power, and love whining about it, but they have triumphed in every other meaningful way, and have managed to keep the majoritarian impulses of the ANC in check (only South Africa's long-standing and smaller Indian community has arguably done better since the demise of apartheid). Things are probably better for whites in South Africa than any time since the 1960s. Some whites do whine about affirmative action and Black Economic Empowerment (online especially), but those were the tools that created the small black middle class that safeguards the white position. A case in point is the impending retirement of Helen Zille, leader of the white-dominated Democratic Alliance. Her annoited successor is black, but there is very little disquiet about this fact in the ranks-he won't rock the boat.

    In the medium-long term SA whites will become Africanised, and they have already taken up the black culture of non-payment with gusto (etolls), but for the foreseeable future, their futures are secure (unless a syphilitic populist like Julius Malema gets into power, then all bets are off).

  112. anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    Blacks in the USA have launched onslaughts against non-black shopkeepers in just about every one of their riots. Andrew Young even had the temerity to insult Asian and Arab shopkeepers when he had a job as a mouthpiece for Walmart. Foreign Zulus taking things to the next level that domestic ones can only dream of. Small shopkeepers of course don’t take jobs away since the locals don’t run shops as it is. Without the Koreans blacks would have to travel long distances for their hair weave kits. It’s just some primordial jealousy bubbling up.

    • Replies: @Jfr
    @anonymous

    Blacks in South Africa have had shops called "spazas" for a long time. In fact, during apartheid, those were one of the only sources of black capital formation, and even led to a few millionaires (the original Wabenzis).

    But it is hard for a spaza owner supporting a family and small staff in South Africa to compete with traders from China, Somalia or Bangladesh, who have multiple cousins living in their storerooms, who manage to avoid paying taxes, and who remit all their money. I recall reading during the Soweto "xenophobia" recently about ethnic cartels undercutting locals to drive them out of business.- it is probably apocraphyl but not entirely unlikely either.

    South African blacks have not given up [*] the way that indolent American blacks who attack Korean shopkeepers have, but they have been squeezed out, in many sectors or the economy by people who are almost impossible to compete with.

    [*] although, to be entirely honest, a significant number of brighter South African blacks have found it more profitable to get involved in various forms of government corruption, aka "tenderpreneurism".

  113. @Anonymous
    It's strange but I haven't heard one single word of condemnation uttered by the lefties against these 'appalling heartless racist xenophobic attacks' against 'poor innocent migrants who have only come to enrich South Africa and to seek better lives'.

    Evidently, the Totem Pole works here too, and blacks being the supreme deities of the cult of victimology can never have their names taken in vain, even if the gods in their capricious sport, start murdering one another.

    Compare and contrast the incessant vilification, hatred, contempt, ridicule, abuse, verbal and physical attacks etc meted out in UKIP by all sections of British society from the BIG bastards of the Daily Mail, BBC, The Times, Telegraph, The Sun etc who have made common cause with the the hardest of hardest lefties in doing everything humanly possible to try to derail and defuse UKIP ahead of May's General Election. Their big tactic now is to deliberately talk down UKIP's poll ratings in order to dissuade voters from voting for them, in a kind of self fulfilling prophecy.

    The irony is that UKIP are the mildest and gentlest of nationalist parties, and first and foremost democratic parliamentarians who value law and order above all else.

    Replies: @22pp22, @Jfr

    Actually, in South Africa, most lefties (and most South Aftican whites, who are decidedly not lefties, at least not in private) have been extremely vociferous in vilifying and condemning the “xenophobia” of local blacks in exactly those terms, along with the white-oriented English-language media.

    The government, whose incompetence and corruption in enforcing migration policy leads to periodic explosions has been pushing hard to shut down discussion, with the ANC premier of Gautemg province tweeting that any attempts to “intellectualise” the attacks are “political opportunism”. South African blacks outside the ruling party have been more ambivalent. The ANC is making belated moves to tighten up on migration, but shrill voices from its own left-wing prevent too much of that. A suggestion that refugee camps be set up for newly arrived “refugees” was greeted with hysterical accusations of “apartheid” by lefties close to the party (why refugees from places like Somalia and Bangladesh need to travel all the way to a South Africa is another mystery).

    It is an interesting situation- SA whites are taking the side of foreigners over their own countrymen. Part of this is self interest, since foreign blacks form a useful buffer, but a lot of it has to do with the fact that foreign blacks are perceived as more docile, and because South African whites buy into the “hard working illegal immigrant taking the initiative” narrative (which is true to some extent, but beside the point).

    South African whites are also likely to complain about massive black unemployment (25% or higher), about crime, and about the massive welfare bill, but fail to make the connection to illegal immigration.

  114. @Daniel H
    @Lot

    Lot,

    Your analysis is 100% correct. White South Africans have themselves to blame for losing their country. They couldn't imagine a world without cheap servile labor. Well now they have nothing.

    As far as the notion that the world would not have accepted this partitioned white homeland, well, the world would have had to accept it because South Africans would have had a clean motive to fight and defend it. Besides, what is this "world" that we talk of? The west is dying, demographically and economically. Russia and China would have no qualms about doing business with a white South African state and would have likely sought them as allies to counter the west. White westerners, we are our own worst enemies.

    Replies: @Tr

    A few commenters are painting South African whites as victims who “lost” their country. It’s a common trope, especially on the internet, but South African whites enjoy their positions on top of the socio-economic heap in South Africa and are milking their status as the cognitive elite, and gatekeepers to the middle class, without any of the responsibility of ruling over masses of restive natives.

    Sure, SA whites have lost political power, and love whining about it, but they have triumphed in every other meaningful way, and have managed to keep the majoritarian impulses of the ANC in check (only South Africa’s long-standing and smaller Indian community has arguably done better since the demise of apartheid). Things are probably better for whites in South Africa than any time since the 1960s. Some whites do whine about affirmative action and Black Economic Empowerment (online especially), but those were the tools that created the small black middle class that safeguards the white position. A case in point is the impending retirement of Helen Zille, leader of the white-dominated Democratic Alliance. Her annoited successor is black, but there is very little disquiet about this fact in the ranks-he won’t rock the boat.

    In the medium-long term SA whites will become Africanised, and they have already taken up the black culture of non-payment with gusto (etolls), but for the foreseeable future, their futures are secure (unless a syphilitic populist like Julius Malema gets into power, then all bets are off).

  115. @anonymous
    Blacks in the USA have launched onslaughts against non-black shopkeepers in just about every one of their riots. Andrew Young even had the temerity to insult Asian and Arab shopkeepers when he had a job as a mouthpiece for Walmart. Foreign Zulus taking things to the next level that domestic ones can only dream of. Small shopkeepers of course don't take jobs away since the locals don't run shops as it is. Without the Koreans blacks would have to travel long distances for their hair weave kits. It's just some primordial jealousy bubbling up.

    Replies: @Jfr

    Blacks in South Africa have had shops called “spazas” for a long time. In fact, during apartheid, those were one of the only sources of black capital formation, and even led to a few millionaires (the original Wabenzis).

    But it is hard for a spaza owner supporting a family and small staff in South Africa to compete with traders from China, Somalia or Bangladesh, who have multiple cousins living in their storerooms, who manage to avoid paying taxes, and who remit all their money. I recall reading during the Soweto “xenophobia” recently about ethnic cartels undercutting locals to drive them out of business.- it is probably apocraphyl but not entirely unlikely either.

    South African blacks have not given up [*] the way that indolent American blacks who attack Korean shopkeepers have, but they have been squeezed out, in many sectors or the economy by people who are almost impossible to compete with.

    [*] although, to be entirely honest, a significant number of brighter South African blacks have found it more profitable to get involved in various forms of government corruption, aka “tenderpreneurism”.

  116. @Mark Minter
    I got this hobby of looking at real estate web pages. I have done it for years. And you can determine the economic health of a place using big house as the bellweather indicator. I sort of start in New York, then Los Angeles, Miami, Vegas (still sucks), then Mexico, Colombia, Brazil, Paris, then often I use Engels Volkers, this German firm for a world wide glance at the bigs. Houses and apartments from 700-1000 sq meters (7700-11000) are not all that common. They exists but are some percentage smaller than 1% on most of these pages, which are the elite of real estate listings. As you would expect, the US, UK, France, Italy, all dominate the top priced listings. New York has gotten ridiculous even by New York standards. The good stuff in Miami has sold and now what's left is far north of Miami Beach like Aventura. LA is very ridiculous and now the best pages are showing Tarzana where in 2009 it was all L.A proper. Vegas still sucks.

    At the bottom typically, in price are Chile (lots of big houses surrounding Santiago, Dominican Republic (particularly older big houses in Casa de Campo but mostly it is an American retiree destination as fares as the economy fares. Newer stuff on the north coast of the DR do well), a lot of junk ugly stuff in Costa del Col and the Barcelona coasts in Spain, some older stuff in Mallorca (Spain in general still hasn't recovered). And surprisingly Belgium kept popping up with some really neat attractive big lofts, neat renovations in villas, particularly in Flanders, and in Antwerp like stuff that would sell for 15,000,000 in Paris goes for 2.5-3.0 million in Antwerp. Go figure.

    Then there is South Africa.

    Before getting all iSteve educated, I would see those South Africa houses and not notice. I figured, "yeah well Africa or something. Maybe Cheap land. Cheap Labor." But then there is this recent news about Kill The Boers, all the murders of the "settlers" the rape rate, and last night I noticed something.

    It is a dumping ground. It is beyond just cheap houses. Houses costs what houses cost. Labor is labor. Land is land. But there is a limit. A door costs what a door costs. Windows same. And especially in a place like South Africa, Chile, the DR that aren't famous for making sinks, bathtubs, stoves, ovens, even windows, those things can even be more expensive because they often are brought in. Colombia is surprising "costly". A big house in Bogota is cheaper than the US and UK, but often is 3 million for 600 mts and competes with a US house outside of those big famous areas. Cali is cheap, Cartagena, Barranquilla are not. Heck, there is still an unresolved war going in Colombia. Yet I would consider it in a heartbeat before ever thinking of South Africa.

    And South Africa is beyond cheap and it is sheer numbers of those big houses in those pages. Engels Volkers is a German company, there 4400 German listings, 1500 Lux properties in the US and Italy. There are 6600 in South Africa.

    And the number of big properties, larger than 700 mts is staggering. 260 out of 1200 worldwide. Almost 1 in 5. Literally once you get below the 2 million euro level in Engels Volkers, 90% of the listings for page after page in houses 700-1000 meters are South African. It is beyond just that they can build them cheaper. I read these pages so often, for so long, you can recognize hardship and dumpage vs even a slump or an affordable market.

    It is a like a whole country is doing what white homeowners in Ferguson, Mo are doing. Except the Fergie people are gonna lose their shirts. The Boers, at best will lose their country and many will lose their lives.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Bert, @Jfr

    The ZAR is a weak and volatile currency, which is why high-end property is so cheap in South Africa currently (it isn’t particularly cheap by local standards). The South African government has started preparing legislative restrictions on foreign agricultural land ownership for this reason-too many rich Europeans were supposedly snapping up Cape wine farms for a song.

    There is also the fact that estate agents actively market properties overseas (which is why South African estate agents panicked when they got wind of the foreign ownership restrictions, and the government had to issue a quick clarification that they were intended to apply only to agri land). South Africa is a strange country like that: third world savagery coupled with sophisticated property and financial markets.

    You are probably experiencing some kind of sampling bias because of this. I wouldn’t read too much into those real estate listings.

  117. @AnotherDad
    @International Jew


    Competition in the labor market doesn’t explain all of this “xenophobla”. There’s also the targeting of the foreign shopkeepers, who far from competing with the locals are providing services they otherwise wouldn’t have. But this is how it worked in Kenya and Uganda and elsewhere after independence. Some kind of instinct for destroying civilization root and branch…
     
    "Xenophobia" is of course completely natural and rational. People have made great sacrifices to acquire territory for themselves--their family, tribe, nation, race--and quite rationally don't want to share it.

    Furthermore middle man minorities suck--literally. Assuming the middle man minority is ethnically separate--e.g. Jews, oversea Chinese, Lebanese, Koreans in South Central, etc. etc.--middle man minorities are *not* positive for the host populations. They serve as capital and skills (and more esoterically genetic selection for middle man skills, inc. IQ) *leaving* the community, rather than building in it. It's effectively looting, even if the service is superior.

    I'll grant that in Africa the local population seems so hopeless\inferior at providing services that you start to think ... wouldn't they be better off even if the Indians were there? But even in Africa that's still not the case. Absent the middle man, there would be smart blacks able to step up and provide such services--admittedly not as well. And it's out of them doing so that you'd eventually develop a competent indigenous commercial class. Middle man minorities just eliminate that and leave the host population *permanently* dependent and impoverish.

    ~~~

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the "community". (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    There is likely a tribal element here, where even though "black", the foreigners are not really the same people.

    But beyond that i think the shopkeepers are just a visible face of the foreign incursion, so attacking them serves the purpose of saying "foreigner get out"--an entirely understandable desire.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Anonymous, @Anonymous, @Ted

    All that said, in this case where the foreigners are fellow Bantu who will likely stay in SA and would likely marry into the host population within a generation or two, any wealth and skills they build will mostly remain in the “community”. (The exception would be those who just remit everything and intend to use the wealth back in their home country.)

    It isn’t only Bantu migrants. Pakistani and Indian migrants also impregnate and marry black women and live in townships (much to the horror of South African Indians, who were conditioned under apartheid to not view blacks sexually).

  118. HA says:
    @Matra
    Italy is clearly starting to get feed up with Open Borders style immigration non-policy

    Yes: The leader of the anti-immigrant Northern League party, Matteo Salvini, called for an immediate naval blockade of the coast of Libya while Daniela Santanche, a prominent member of Silvio Berlusconi's Forza Italia party said Italy's navy must "sink all the boats."

    Hundreds drown off Libya

    But have no fear the Papists are on the case. Pope Francis is calling on the rest of Europe to help Italy deal with the refugee invasion. Of course, he doesn't mean help Italy sink the boats full of invaders; he means welcome them to our towns and cities. The Catholic Church hates Europeans.

    Replies: @ABN, @HA

    “The Catholic Church hates Europeans.”

    Give me a break. The Catholic Church has been one of the rare voices in the modern world arguing against the birth dearth and urging Europeans to put an end to it. If Catholic Spaniards and Italians were more devout, then there’d be a lot more of them (and the canard about how we have to import immigrants to beef up the work force would be even more obviously false).

    Moreover, whereas the Pope is always going to encourage Catholics to be charitable towards those with less, it’s ultimately up to the layman to determine how much of his paycheck he or she will fork over and when enough is enough – any authority the Pope has does not extend to usurping that final decision. And there’s nothing un-Christian with arguing that there are better solutions to the refugee problem than draining Africa of its most entrepreneurial citizens and turning them into Europe’s underclass and/or its new Bosnias.

  119. @unit472
    @Lot

    The world wasn't going to let the whites of South Africa have an Anglo/Boer state in Africa. It would have been successful and would be a source of embarrassment for the rest of black Africa. South Africa might have survived as an Israeli style ethno state for awhile but it would have been even more isolated than Israel and with borders almost impossible to defend.

    Now the rest of Africa is fighting over the carcass of the only advanced nation on the African continent and 5 million whites did not leave enough for even the 40 million non white South Africans to live off of much less the tens of millions of outsiders seeking to live there. The Boers are moving to Western Australia.

    Replies: @Jfr

    The idea that Boers are moving to Western Australia is often heard, and many whites are indeed leaving South Africa for Australia, NZ and Canada, but they won’t be able to preserve their Boerness for long in those countries. Australia has high English language requirements, tested by means of an exam, and limited opportunities for Afrikaans education. Afrikaners or Boers will have to assimilate, which is tough for a people who value their language so highly.

  120. @anonymous-antimarxist
    @syonredux

    Got rid of The Atlantic 12 years ago after being a subscriber for over 15 years. Can't believe anybody wastes any time on it any more. A once great and nearly essential magazine for over a 150 years is now just clickbait barely above Gawker or Salon level of seriousness. Don't even read their free stuff.

    Sorry Syon unless you fill me in on what the The Atlantic is saying, I have nothing to add because I refuse to go there.

    Replies: @SPMoore8, @Jim Don Bob

    Yep. The Atlantic went straight down the toilet after Micheal Kelly got killed in Iraq. They hired Andrew Sullivan and fired Mark Steyn.

  121. It might be late to post this one, but a old saying said better late then never. I saw this clip on Youtube where a guy wonder if is South Africa heading to an IMF bailout?
    http://www.news24.com/Live/Lifestyle/Books/Is-South-Africa-heading-towards-an-IMF-bailout-20150525

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