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Roe V. Wade: Were the Beatles English Protestants or Irish Catholics?
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The Roe v. Wade decision was issued on January 22, 1973 by a Supreme Court quite different from the current one. It was of course all male, although — contrary to feminist theory — that didn’t stop the Court from voting 7-2 to legalize abortion largely unchecked through six months of pregnancy.

Indeed, perhaps the most ardently pro-abortion Justice, environmentalist mountain climber, William O. Douglas, was on his fourth wife. In his mid 60s, he’d married in rapid succession two 23-year olds.

Douglas is forgotten today. And the ardent civil libertarian would likely be cancelled in about 30 minutes now, but he was the largest personality on the Court in his time. He was constantly on book tours to promote the 30 books he published — I read one as a lad about mountains he’d climbed — and squabbling with his fellow Justices and his own law clerks. Although he served longer on the Supreme Court than anyone else at 36 years, he seemed to think a cruel fate had sidelined him to the Supreme Court and kept him out of the White House, thus wasting his life. He might have been right.

But the Supreme Court that legalized abortion also differed in that it had eight mainline Protestants and one Catholic, in comparison to the current one with six Catholics (five Republicans and Sonia Sotomayor), two Jews, and one Anglican who used to be Catholic.

Six of the nine judges who voted on Roe 49 years ago were nominated by Republican Presidents, but Eisenhower had picked Irish Catholic Democrat William J. Brennan Jr. in 1956 as a re-election gimmick, so only five were Republicans.

Religion Nominated by Party State (high school) Children
Pro-Roe
Harry Blackmun Methodist Nixon GOP Minnesota 3
Warren E. Burger Presbyterian Nixon GOP Minnesota 2
William O. Douglas Presbyterian FDR Dem Washington 2
William J. Brennan Jr. Catholic Eisenhower Dem New Jersey 3
Potter Stewart Episcopalian Eisenhower GOP Ohio 3
Thurgood Marshall Episcopalian LBJ Dem Maryland 2
Lewis F. Powell Jr. Presbyterian Nixon GOP Virginia 4
Anti-Roe
Byron White Episcopalian JFK Dem Colorado 2
William Rehnquist Lutheran Nixon GOP Wisconsin 3

The less than magisterial majority opinion (almost nobody who has read it carefully finds it terribly persuasive on why the Court has 100% chosen privacy, or to use more recent language choice, over the fetus or life) was written by Harry Blackmun, one of the Minnesota Twins who had attended the same elementary school in St. Paul as Chief Justice Warren Burger.

The nominee of the football crazy JFK, Justice Whizzer White, who had led the NFL in rushing yards in 1938 and 1940, wrote in dissent:

The Court simply fashions and announces a new constitutional right for pregnant women and, with scarcely any reason or authority for its action, invests that right with sufficient substance to override most existing state abortion statutes. The upshot is that the people and the legislatures of the 50 States are constitutionally disentitled to weigh the relative importance of the continued existence and development of the fetus, on the one hand, against a spectrum of possible impacts on the woman, on the other hand. As an exercise of raw judicial power, the Court perhaps has authority to do what it does today; but, in my view, its judgment is an improvident and extravagant exercise of the power of judicial review that the Constitution extends to this Court.

What’s striking is that way back in 1973, legalizing abortion could carry seven out of these nine members of the Establishment in high standing. Granted, Douglas was a sort of Trump of the Left, a loose cannon, and a civil libertarian fundamentalist, Brennan was the Svengali of the Warren Court, and Marshall was beholden to leftist interests. In contrast, there was only one representative of modern conservatism in young Rehnquist.

But still, legalizing abortion carried all four votes of the non-Goldwaterite Republicans (Blackmun, Stewart, Powell, and Burger), while not carrying the centrist Democrat White. By the standards of a half century later, that deserves explication.

Granted, it’s not clear that the GOP Justices quite understood what they were voting for in Roe. They seemed to see it as a sort of Doctor’s Lib, getting respectable GOP-voting doctors out from under the thumb and threat of prosecution by (largely) Democratic prosecutors and legislators of more dubious provenance.

Nobody can remembers today, but it can make sense to consider the Roe decision as a Protestant ethnic victory over rising Catholic power.

Consider Roe’s most influential predecessor, the 1965 Griswold case in which Douglas invented a “right to privacy” that invalidated Connecticut’s law against contraception. Conservatives often point out that people in Connecticut could obviously obtain contraception despite the law. On the other hand, you couldn’t put up a sign advertising contraception. At root, the law represented a cultural power struggle between Connecticut’s increasingly large Catholic population and its original Connecticut Yankees.

Today, when Catholics have moderated on contraception while evangelical Protestants have come to agree with the Pope that abortion is rather gruesome, few remember this long-lasting struggle. But Blackmun’s majority opinion holds:

There has always been strong support for the view that life does not begin until live birth. This was the belief of the Stoics. It appears to be the predominant, though not the unanimous, attitude of the Jewish faith. It may be taken to represent also the position of a large segment of the Protestant community, insofar as that can be ascertained; organized groups that have taken a formal position on the abortion issue have generally regarded abortion as a matter for the conscience of the individual and her family.

He then goes on to wrestle with Catholic views, never realizing that some of the traditionally most anti-Catholic Protestants were soon going to come around to agreeing that the Catholics had a point.

I can’t prove this, but my guess is that Roe v. Wade was seen, consciously or unconsciously, by pro-abortion Republican justices as sort of Culture War response by low birthrate Protestant Republicans against highly fertile Roman Catholic Democrats whose Pope opposed contraception: legalized abortion was seen by them as contraception for Catholics too backward to use contraception:

The 9 Justices in 1973 had a total of 24 children, or 2.67 apiece, not a huge number for the nine most successful men in a highly stable profession that, for some of them, overlapped with the Baby Boom. (In contrast, Robert F. Kennedy had 11 children.)

The Protestant Republican worry that Catholics Democrats were outbreeding them might help explain why GOP dynasties like the Rockefellers and Bushes were so into population control. Similarly, Protestants in Canada and Northern Ireland were concerned that they were losing the War of the Cradle to their Catholic co-nationals.

If so, what the Justices didn’t anticipate was:

A. That Catholic birthrates would fall rapidly as Catholic wives took up the Pill (whether or not they mentioned it to their husbands).

B. That, amazingly, the more downscale half of Protestantism would come to agree that the Papists were right about abortion being grotesque.

The second is one of the more extraordinary American developments of the latter half of the 20th Century, but nobody remembers it because nobody remembers how strong the Protestant vs. Catholic rivalry was up until JFK’s martyrdom put him in the pantheon of American heroes and more or less satisfied Catholic desire for representation at the highest level in American national mythology.

About a decade and a half ago, the Atlantic Monthly conducted a poll of historians to determine the 100 most influential Americans. Only three were Catholics: newspaper editor James Gordon Bennett, baseball slugger Babe Ruth, and jazz legend Louis Armstrong. That’s really not many.

But finally, a Catholic was elected President. Then, in likely the single most memorable moment of the second half of the 20th Century, a dirty Commie murdered him in front of his beautiful wife.

Most observers agree that what we think of as The Sixties didn’t start until JFK’s assassination, but almost nobody can explain why. My guess is that 11/22/1963 ended the old Catholic Question, which suddenly allowed new ones, such as the Generational Question, to flourish when the Beatles arrives a few months later.

Were the Beatles English Protestants or Irish Catholics? That’s an interesting question, but not one that came up much after JFK’s death.

If so, it’s hardly surprising that Supreme Court Justices in 1973 were not aware that the Protestant vs. Catholic divide in which they’d grown up was ancient history.

 
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  1. “My guess is that 11/22/1963 ended the old Catholic Question, which suddenly allowed new ones, such as the Generational Question, to flourish when the Beatles arrives a few months later.”

    The Generational Question was already front and center in the mid. ’50’s with the advent of Rock and Roll, which was prominently led by Elvis (who was Protestant).

    Until they opened their mouths about Jesus in ’66, the Beatles weren’t nearly considered as controversial as Elvis in the ’50’s. Accusations of “vulgar”, “lewd”, and “degenerate” were thrown around in Presley’s direction. In some ways, the fame of Elvis as the first rock and roller star to be largely created by the new medium of television. The parents were strongly vs. him, and that was good enough for the teenagers. Pat Boone was favored by the parents and thus was considered to be square and uncool. Not quite sure where Ricky Nelson landed on the cool vs. square spectrum, although he too benefitted from being on television (his family’s network show).

    Back in the day with only three network stations, just getting on national television was an accomplishment. During the mid. ’60’s the Beatles were all over US television which suggests that they owed their initial fame to TV (just like Elvis).

    In the late ’60’s, Elvis revived his career…by appearing on television.

  2. Blackmun very likely had had a stroke before writing Roe, or at least did subsequently afterwards.

    Blackmun’s bizarre, emotion-laden, maudlin switch to Marxist politics post-Roe and his turning Roe into his bizarre judicial lodestar — he would cite Roe in any case he could, even ones not even touching on it — bespeaks of one of four things: a head injury, stroke, mental illness, or else severe blackmail. His personality changed so much he turned against long time friend (and best man at his wedding) Chief Justice Burger. By the end, Blackmun so out of it mentally (but not emotionally) he was letting his clerks write everything for him and he would sign his name (of course the Marxists ruthlessly protected Blackmun’s reputation on this, always pretending he was perfectly mentally competent).

    Shades of Joe Biden: everyone around him knew he was gone, but he could still read a speech coherently, so as long as you stopped him from babbling too much you could prop him up.

    In short, Blackmun lost it, perhaps due to the enormous hate he deservedly got from making babykilling a national “right”, but it was definitely something mental (or blackmail, as I said). In the 19th Century Chief Justice Taney suffered severely and personally from his hated Dred Scott decision, so Blackmun receiving such hate and cracking is feasible.

    My bet is the pressure, before or after, caused him to stroke out. Most federal judges are not very good in the public eye and prefer to be quietly anonymous on the bench, e.g. Taft was miserable as president but the “cheeriest of Chief Justices.” Exceptions like Hughes or Warren or Douglas can be found, but the cloaked power of the bench is appealing to many introvers and tends to draw more bookish legal minds who like writing and research more than speaking and propagandizing (e.g. Souter, who never used a computer, wrote everything by hand, is a confirmed non-gay bachelor, and falls asleep at night to slow-moving British history shows).

    Blackmun became a lightning rod for the decision –“Blackmun the Babykiller” was easy alliteration –and I think the older Blackmun (he was 65 when he wrote Roe) really couldn’t handle that kind of pressure, as he really had never been a center-of-attention kind of guy, either as a lawyer or as a judge on the 8th Circuit. Hence the stroke theory.

  3. “Every Sperm is Sacred” came 10 years later.

    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
  4. Anon[361] • Disclaimer says:

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

  5. Anonymous[388] • Disclaimer says:

    They were Irish Protestants.

    Initially the evangelists of pop.

    Later, McCartney took a more catholic turn with ostentation and pageantry while Lennon took a more protestant turn, stark and stripped down.

    Paul was content as pope of pop while Lennon wanted to start anew(and found his mary with Babono).

    Harrison’s penchant for Hindu stuff seems a variation on catholicist outlook.

  6. @Billy Shears

    From a group only propped up because they supported Marxism ideals and were anti-Christian, and said group contained not only a homosexual sex-trafficking pedophile, Graham Chapman:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2275935/Monty-Python-film-Sex-pranks-bottles-gin-day--new-movie-Graham-Chapman-doesnt-mention-darkest-secret.html

    But cute, innocent looking member Michael Palin is a nasty hateful anti-Christian (even more so than miserable John Cleese), always part of the most anti-Christian sketches and moments, including his post-Python work such as The Missionary, which he wrote and starred in, where a Christian preacher happily abandons his faith for a prostitute:

    https://infogalactic.com/info/The_Missionary

    The more I learn about the Pythons, and the more I look at their work with a cold jaundiced eye, the less I enjoy what I once found uproarious. These guys were swimming in evil.

  7. tyrone says:
    @Anon

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

    ………so you get no entertainment value from seeing the left chimp-out.

    • LOL: Abe, PhysicistDave
  8. SFG says:

    Yeah, the further back in time you go the less these things make sense in terms of the Current Year, though some things wind up being on one side or the other due to random chance-now both Jefferson’s slaveholding and his embrace of free speech would be considered bad by the left, for instance.

    The whole Protestant-Catholic thing was one of the major questions of the 19th and early 20th centuries in this country (and further back in Europe of course), but it’s been pretty much forgotten. But Pat Buchanan’s culture war speech that brought in the term was probably influenced by the original Kulturkampf in Germany, which was Bismarck being anti Catholic.

    How the Catholics got so many blue collar Protestants against abortion is another story. Lefties will tell you it came out of wanting to defend segregated schools, but I will bet there’s more to it than that.

    • Replies: @FPD72
    , @Curle
    , @Emslander
  9. SFG says:
    @Anon

    It isn’t. Kind of like Trunp riling up feminists with his behavior but removing tax deductibility for alimony, this will enrage feminists who will blame all men for a pro-life movement that’s half female. They’ll probably remove presumption of innocence for rape cases like they do in Spain now or something.

  10. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:

    Good post.
    It seems that elite Protestantism simply fell apart.
    Was this simply an intellectual failure or was there some cultural factor that pushed this result?
    Obviously many of the founding fathers of this country were intellectual Protestants of some sort, so it does seem there is a story to tell here.

    • Replies: @Shlomo Washington
  11. Were the Beatles English Protestants or Irish Catholics?

    In Belfast Catholics/Republicans paint Beatles murals. Protestants/Unionists- not so.

    • Agree: Gordo
    • Replies: @Hibernian
    , @Anon
  12. SFG says:
    @R.G. Camara

    They always did lean left; humorists of the right tend to be forgotten. A lot of the random humor was in tune with the Sixties rebellion, and a some of it is topical humor whose referents have been forgotten (the sketch with the Frenchmen and the flying sheep is a joke about the Concorde, which was supposed to be a big example of Anglo-French cooperation).

    Also, it’s sort of turned into this geek in joke where being able to quote Monty Python was the way you proved you were a real geek. Despite having watched way too much TNG and played too many old D&D computer games, I never got into Monty Python for some reason. Gatekeeping’s gotten a bad rap with Millennials and below as a way to keep women out, so the geek shibboleth is not as much of a thing as it was-besides, it’s way too easy to look stuff up on the Internet now.

    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
    , @Anon
    , @Reg Cæsar
  13. MEH 0910 says:
    @R.G. Camara

    https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2019/may/29/john-cleese-criticised-for-saying-london-is-no-longer-an-english-city

    • Replies: @quewin
    , @Wielgus
    , @Curmudgeon
  14. jejej says:
    @Anon

    I don’t know who you are so how can I answer such a dumb question? Twitter was made for people like you.

    Nonetheless I am a fool so I will answer anyway.

    In the likely event that you are a male and that you feel that women have been dumping too much estrogen into public life it may please you to know that they have been given the backhand.

    I am proud to come out as a misogynist.

    I was quite the opposite of a misogynist most of my life but one-too-many knocks on the head by toxic femininity has left me either loopy or discovering some fundamental truth about how badly things can go when women are unshackled by law, custom, judgement and privilege.

    My own view is that any large demographic granted such freedoms would soon run roughshod over others, be they Men, Germans, Parents, Jews, Children, Farmers or Macaroni makers.

    All you would need in any demographic were for the most toxic 10% to be themselves and walla! Everyone else goes to the wall.

    So, like most Western Humans, I believe that women have gone a tad overboard in their new position and that therefore – In The West, writing in English – I am proud to call myself a misogynist.

    And while I DID foresee and write about the coming LGBTQIASTD+ing of America after watching George Bush surrendering common sense on the subject to John Kerry in 2004, I do not presently see what effect if any may happen due to overturning Roe.

    But the international sentiment that allowed it to happen I DO see. It is the sense that women have gotten too big for their britches and maybe should not be encouraged to “have it all”.

    Perhaps, just perhaps, for the happiness of all birds it’s important that each have their talons clipped if they grow too long.

  15. Most observers agree that what we think of as The Sixties didn’t start until JFK’s assassination, but almost nobody can explain why. My guess is that 11/22/1963 ended the old Catholic Question, which suddenly allowed new ones, such as the Generational Question, to flourish when the Beatles arrives a few months later.

    Were the Beatles English Protestants or Irish Catholics? That’s an interesting question, but not one that came up much after JFK’s death.

    We lost our hero in Dallas, then Brian Epstein’s group came across the ocean and gave us new heroes.

  16. FPD72 says:
    @Anon

    “Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?”

    The Long decision did not ban abortion. It returns the issue of abortion to the states, where it resided until Roe in 1973.

    The Long decision and the decision concerning New York gun law were based on the text and intent of the Constitution. The Constitution is silent on abortion and therefore the Court should be as well. The Constitution explicitly states that the right of citizens “to keep and bare arms shall not be infringed.” Justice Thomas’ decision was consistent with both the founders’ intent as well as the intent of the 14th Amendment.

    How do these decisions benefit you? A return to originalism might be the first step to overturning the Affirmative Action/anti-white regime that now rules DC. All state actions that discriminate against whites are clear violations of the text of the Constitution that address such issues as “equal justice” and “immunities and privileges.” We can only hope but Long might be a good first step.

    Too obtuse? I don’t know anything about your family but maybe “banning abortion” will keep a daughter-in-law from killing a grandchild. Maybe overturning Roe will help to support a human life and dignity culture that will protect you from being processed into Soylent Green when you hit 70 years old.

    More to the point: maybe it won’t benefit you at all but it will certainly benefit thousands of babies every year whose mothers are deterred from having them killed and dismembered.

  17. @SFG

    They always did lean left; humorists of the right tend to be forgotten.

    Nah, its just that the Marxists seized the cultural levers during this period and really promoted leftist comedy (Carlin, Pryor, Python, Woody Allen, etc.). Such Marxists still have power, which is why right-winger Bob Hope is alternatively not mentioned (despite being the greatest and most successful comedian of the 20th Century) or else castigated bizarrely as “not funny”, and right-winger Red Skelton, whom Groucho Marx stated bluntly was the “heir to Charlie Chaplin” and who had a hit TV show for 10 years in the 60s-70s, is almost never mentioned except in late night infomercials hawking his videos or in minor retrospective moments.

    I had never heard of Skelton till I accidentally stumbled on one of his VHS greatest hits in a thrift store. I could not believe how hilarious and talented that man was. But the Marxists buried him like a bone.

    • Thanks: SFG
    • Replies: @SFG
    , @martin_2
    , @Thoughts
  18. Protestants didn’t care about abortion much until the Protestant Francis Schaeffer and his son Frank made a documentary on abortion.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0011cpq

    https://theintercept.com/2022/05/12/abortion-roe-v-wade-francis-schaeffer-evangelical-christians/

  19. When you think of it- Christianity as the religion of Europeans is something strange.

    It wouldn’t be strange as some Middle Eastern sect; also, Islam is “natural” for the Middle East. Buddhism also is easily acceptable in the east Asia.

    Christianity in Europe? Strange.
    Islam in India & Indonesia? Strange.
    Islam in Iran? Not so strange, but a bit off.
    Islam in Afghanistan? Very strange.

    • Agree: Kratoklastes
    • Disagree: Alyosha
  20. Here’s an interesting point I’ve not seen made often–the new fake protestants are perhaps the only integrated churches. Perhaps it’s not made often because our media class has never been to one.

    I first went to a not-quite-mega church in that vein with an ex’s family in Texas. Her parents were from working class backgrounds but her father was a self-made millionaire in sales (the “Dow chemical is my personal client” kind of sales).

    This church was in some auditorium and had a giant screen projector nd a rock band and all that tacky stuff id never seen in person. But what struck me is at had Mexicans, some blacks, working class whites and mcmansion whites. Basically I’d say it reflected the demographics of this town pretty damn closely.

    (Speaking of lower class religions-hispanics are more likely to be evangelical than Catholics at this point but nobody has noticed bc, as Steve points out, none of these talking heads have any interest in the hundred million Latinos they sometimes mention in the abstract. Speaking of which, by pop culture impressions of people who don’t live in Chicago, what percentage Hispanic would the average American guess it is? I guarantee they have zero clue.)

    • Replies: @Anymike
  21. FPD72 says:
    @SFG

    Catholics were not of first importance in moving Protestants against abortion. I was on the staff of an evangelical campus ministry in January 1973. Before the year was over we were handing out anti-abortion materials on campus.

    Besides already present opposition to abortion, it was Francis Schaeffer who is mainly responsible for moving evangelicals to an anti-abortion posture. His book “Whatever Happened to the Human Race” played a major role in forming the thinking of evangelical leaders. Going back further, although he died almost ten years before Roe, C.S, Lewis’ “The Abolition of Man” helped to lay an intellectual foundation for the pro-life movement.

    Did Catholics play a role? Undoubtedly, but it was not the primary role implied by your question.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
    , @Rogue
  22. Hhsiii says:
    @Anonymous

    McCartney and Harrison were baptized Catholic, although McCartney’s dad was Protestant agnostic and he was raised non-denominational. He had the happiest upbringing, aside from his mother dying young, which gave him a certain bond with Lennon.

    Lennon was raised Anglican. He had the most middle-class upbringing of the Beatles. Aunt Mimi hated Harrison’s heavy scouse accent and rocker scruffiness as a youngster.

    Ringo was raised Evangelical Anglican. Very poor growing up.

    • Thanks: kahein
  23. George says:

    Timeline of reproductive rights legislation
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_reproductive_rights_legislation#17th_century%E2%80%9319th_century

    Will Roe v Wade change the dynamic of business moving out of places like the West Coast, Illinois, and the East Coast North of DC. Recently Caterpillar moved it’s HQ from near Chicago to Texas. Having extremely similar laws in all American states made such moves much simpler, being based on taxes and weather plus business opportunities.

    Will abortion laws be imposed on the rich in the same way as the not rich? On solution would be to allow significant but expensive exemptions for the rich, to allow HQs to move, while strict enforcement on the less rich to make the anti abortion crowd think they achieved something.

    Can the US of A afford this? Maybe abortion laws were necessary to make the explosion of military and other government spending after WWII plus an explosion in consumer spending possible. What’s the plan for financing all Down’s syndrome and other sad cases that would have been terminated?

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  24. Stephen Leavitt’s argument that legal abortion reduces crime is, while not true in fact, very close to the major unspoken reason for Roe v. Wade, as Ruth Ginsburg later acknowledged. Burger and Blackmun, the “Minnesota Twins,” were put on the court by Nixon to reverse the Warren Court’s destruction of the criminal law and the consequent explosion in crime rates. They found they could not do that, due either to the force of precedent backing the Warren criminal law decisions or sentiment among their fellow justices. The Court remained very unpopular due to these decisions.

    Legalizing abortion seemed like a Constitutional trifecta. It was popular, as indicated by the move toward legalization taking place in legislatures around the country. It was supposedly a gift to women, who were the hot objects of favor in the early 70s, and especially upper-middle-class women, who were very vocal and precisely the sort of women who married Supreme Court justices, and it seemed the ideal way to drain the gene pool of potential criminals who were running amok under post-Warren crime enforcement.

    I think those three factors were much more important than any residual Protestant-Catholic rivalry.

    • Replies: @Prester John
    , @bomag
    , @Tall Tim
  25. Mike Tre says:

    “Granted, it’s not clear that the GOP Justices quite understood what they were voting for in Roe. ”

    I find that difficult to accept. Who has agency if not SC justices?

    These guys facilitated the deaths of more humans than Hitler and Stalin combined.

  26. It’s all a Putin plot, I tell you!

    “Putin needs Americans to be divided and too caught up with our own politics so he can continue his march into Ukraine than into Poland and beyond. He knows the only way to defeat the Americans is by turning them against each other. Don’t fall for it.”

    • Agree: profnasty
  27. Paul Rise says:

    I’ve always felt one of the reasons the Beatles made such a splash in the US was embracing them allowed people, especially youth, to let go of some of the feelings of horror the asassination and bizarre aftermath created. You could turn on the TV and see something that provoked joy.

  28. You call Byron White a “centrist Democrat” but remember that he was the one who wrote a (remarkably angry) majority opinion holding that the State has a compelling interest in invading the bedrooms of consenting adults and telling them which parts of their bodies they are and are not permitted to bring into contact with each other.

    White framed it as a prohibition against homosexuality, and along with Burger used religion as a justification. But in fact the statute in question outlawed (e.g.) oral sex between husband and wife.

    Blackmun wrote in dissent:

    “That certain, but by no means all, religious groups condemn the behavior at issue gives the State no license to impose their judgments on the entire citizenry. The legitimacy of secular legislation depends, instead, on whether the State can advance some justification for its law beyond its conformity to religious doctrine.”

  29. Wokechoke says:

    Teh Beatles were Anglo-Irish fusion folk music.

  30. Wokechoke says:
    @Hhsiii

    Lancashire was a Catholic bastion. The Beatles were in retrospect the fusion of a certain Anglo-Irish folk lyrical forms.

    I suspect that popular music is a sort of industrial Death Scream, like the sounds of the Quarries, Pits, Mills and Docks translated into a song or beat. Then they vanish. Gone for good.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    , @Curle
  31. martin_2 says:

    That sketch from “The Meaning of Life” seems so dated, since these days its Secular versus Muslim (no-one dares make jokes about that), and no-one cares about Protestants and Catholics. Its the same with the “Four Yorkshirmen” sketch. The stereotypes are from another era.

    I don’t agree about the Pythons being anti Christian. In the Pythons’ heyday Christianity was the only religion in town and the only legitimate target. Yanks have to understand that British humour is morally, spiritually and intellectually superior to foreign efforts since in British humour everyone is an idiot doing and saying daft things whereas elsewhere its us sensible goody goodies laughing at them.

    • Agree: Charon
    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  32. From Woodstrong’s THE BRETHREN: “As [Potter] Stewart saw it, abortion was becoming one reasonable solution to population control.” Stewart had also been told that “women were coming into their own” by his daughter Harriet, “a strong, independent woman.”

    • Replies: @mocissepvis
  33. Well here’s one for the old Department of Irony, in his day “newspaper editor James Gordon Bennett” was lambasted as a minion of Satan himself for running ads in the 1840s and later in his great New York Herald placed by Madame Restell, the most prominent abortionist in the city. She’s one of those really fascinating take-no-shit characters this country once produced. She also provided home remedies to end unwanted pregnancies, which were coyly offered in the nationally circulated Weekly Herald as “speedy relief for married ladies suffering from menstrual obstruction”, i.e. the presence of a fetus. Not surprisingly, New York Archbishop Hughes had a long-standing feud with her; the Catholic Church has always hated and feared sexual pleasure, the greatest antidote there is to its death cult pie-in-the-sky folderol. When St. Patrick’s Cathedral was under construction, Restell outbid the archdiocese for the adjoining lot and there built the most sumptuous bordello ever seen in New York City. The forces of prudishness eventually destroyed her, but the memory of her courage remains and inspires.

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    , @TWS
  34. quewin says:
    @MEH 0910

    “Oh? And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned ’round on you, where would you hide, [Cleese], the laws all being flat? This country is planted thick with laws, from coast to coast, Man’s laws, not God’s! And if you cut them down, and you’re just the man to do it, do you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I’d give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety’s sake!”

  35. Dchjk says:

    This Boomer obsession with Elvis, the Beatles, and Monty Python will die a merciful death soon, and good riddance.

  36. Hodag says:

    Who else beside Whizzer White filled the NFL to appellate justice pipeline? The two I can think of is Alan Page, if the Purple People Eaters and later The Bears who was in the Minnesota Supreme Court. A teammate of Page on the Bears was kicker Bob Thomas, who ended up chief justice of the Illinois Supreme Court.

  37. Wielgus says:
    @MEH 0910

    John Cleese was in the SDP in the 1980s, which later merged with the Liberals to form the Liberal Democrats, the most pro-EU of the political parties in Britain. It may be that his politics have changed since then.

    • Replies: @Hereward the Woke
  38. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    The effect of television upon American society almost beggars description. One can argue that television (along with the automobile and the PC) is one of the three most important inventions of the twentieth century.

    • Replies: @AnotherDad
  39. Abe says:

    Great post, Steve. The past truly is a different country, and sadly I am old enough now to actually recall the inflection points of this transformation. Much more to say on this, but at the risk of tempting the forces of Arkanicide, would you consider posting something like this or starting a meme of similar import on TWITTER ?

    Congratulations this weekend to Hillary Clinton. It turned out her historical mission was much greater than becoming the first female President. It was to play THE crucial part in overturning abortion rights in America.

    #HillaryVSRoe

    On second thought, skip it. Such gloating will ensure she’s in the White House by 2025 and by 2026 presenting a slate of 107 new rabidly pro-choice justices for confirmation to the Senate after all the male Catholic ones have expired in mysterious accidental shootings by the Capital Police.

  40. @Henry Canaday

    Roe v. Wade was almost certainly informed by a feminist movement which, by that point, was in full swing led by upper middle-class college educated women many of whom with unstated grievances towards men (which accounts for the heavy Jewish involvement). The fetus was (and remains) secondary–a mini-football to be moved up and down the field by people who have bigger fish to fry.

    Frankly I never thought of the Catholic-Protestant dichotomy as a factor. Interesting. Leave it to iSteve to throw a changeup.

    • Replies: @Daniel H
    , @Houston 1992
  41. Jack D says:

    At root, the law represented a cultural power struggle between Connecticut’s increasingly large Catholic population and its original Connecticut Yankees.

    Is this true? The original anti-contraception crusader was Anthony Comstock, himself a Connecticut Yankee. Comstock, who started out in the Grant Administration, was in his later years admired by a young J. Edgar Hoover, another Protestant.

    Although Catholics were against contraception, they were on the pro-alcohol side of Prohibition, another Protestant driven moral crusade.

    • Replies: @Ian M.
  42. Thank you for this magisterial post.

    • Agree: Daniel H
  43. Anonymous[658] • Disclaimer says:

    I found a billionaire family fortune with its roots in antebellum New Orleans, then the largest city in the south by a large measure. Founded 1848 by Alexandere Weill. Not unlike Lehman in its model but very international and under the radar. They will have thrived in part from the booming slave and ag based economy in that period. Generally associated with the french branch of the merchant bank/ advisory through much of the 20the century. The bank listed shares about 20 years ago and his last descendant to serve as CEO died last week with about 2.5 billion in shares, real estate and art.

    FT has his obit as does NYT

    https://www.ft.com/content/50510e42-71f5-4959-b6e4-01f9dabe9721

    Symbol LAZ Nasdaq

    They like the Lehmans were not gung ho wealthy southern men who were expected to fight, and risk their great estates to arm their kinsfolk and state. They are gone with the wind and often died in war.

  44. Anon[180] • Disclaimer says:

    Beginning to think the media wants to see a couple of Supreme Court Justices murdered so Biden can get a couple of appointments, and thus get the rulings that they want on everything, specifically Vax mandates for everybody and paper ballots forever.

    • Replies: @Peter D. Bredon
  45. AndrewR says:
    @R.G. Camara

    I have to take your word on this, but here’s a question that I would like answered. If your claims about Blackmun are true then why didn’t the pro life movement ever use these claims? Pure incompetence?

    • Replies: @The Real World
  46. Anon[849] • Disclaimer says:

    Current Supreme Court children:

    Kagan-0
    Sotomayor-0

    Thomas-1
    Roberts-2
    Alito-2
    Gorsuch-2
    Kavanaugh-2

    Breyer-3

    Coney-Barrett-5 (not counting adopted kids)

    You immediately notice the liberal women don’t have kids. Coney-Barrett, the one female conservative, has outbred everyone on the court.

    • Replies: @Dr. X
    , @Reverend Goody
  47. My aunt used to tell of how the Norwegian boys and the German boys would go into town on the weekend and fight. The adults put a stop to the fighting when one of her cousins, perhaps 2nd or 3rd, got his eye poked out. This was about 1920 so she was a young girl and did not witness the fighting but rather heard her parents and other adults discussing it. I always wondered why they were still fighting since the Germans had recently been defeated in the war. A couple years ago, when I was telling this story to a guy from La Crosse, Wisconsin, he said that back in the 50’s when he was young, the Catholics and the Lutherans in his area of La Crosse had their own neighborhoods and the boys would fight. So perhaps the fights at Cashton, Wisconsin were not Norwegians versus Germans but rather Lutheran Norwegians versus Catholic Germans.

    • Replies: @Dutch Boy
    , @Ian M.
  48. @SFG

    “…this will enrage feminists who will blame all men for a pro-life movement that’s half female.”

    Bingo!!

  49. Anonymous[196] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hhsiii

    They all felt SAVED by rock n roll.

    • LOL: Hhsiii
  50. @R.G. Camara

    John Cleese seems to be conservative, or at the very least anti-woke. Michael Palin and Eric Idle are by-the-book liberals. Not sure about the two Terrys, but based on the films he directed (especially “Brazil”), Terry Gilliam might be a closeted conservative.

  51. @Anon

    It’s not “banned,” Idiot. It’s legal where the vast majority of American women reside, and a mere Uber or Lyft ride away for the rest. Even in Mississippi, it’s legal for at least 15 weeks. By 1960’s standards, that makes MS a “You Rape ‘Em, We Scrape “Em” jurisdiction.

  52. Dr. X says:

    The Protestant Republican worry that Catholics Democrats were outbreeding them might help explain why GOP dynasties like the Rockefellers and Bushes were so into population control.

    I think a more likely explanation was that the rich elites were getting plenty of extramarital action after a few drinks at the country club, and their daughters were coming home from college and prep school to inform Mom that they had had an “accident.”

    Certainly the elites had ways of making “problems” “go away” if they knew the right people on the hush. Roe was seen as legalizing what they had already been doing on the sly.

    Don’t forget, Nelson Rockefeller, who signed abortion into law in NY three years prior to Roe, died in 1979 while banging his 50-years-younger “secretary.” JFK was said to have banged just about anything with a pulse, including a young intern who then allegedly had an abortion.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
  53. I think the state religion of just about all 1960s’ pop music was atheism. Harrison’s Hinduism fetish was the exception

  54. countenance says: • Website

    It’s why I say all these militant left wingers who want to attack Catholic parishes and priests are decades out of date. Official type American Catholicism, while it started out as the chief locus of the energy of the pro-life movement, has not been that way for a long time. By my reading of the history, it was some time in the first half of the ’80s that the locus changed to other than High Protestants. If these left wingers take out after, say, the First Baptist Church of the White Bread and Mayo Outer Suburbs, that would make more temporal political sense, though it would be just as wrong and criminal.

  55. @SFG

    I think abortion as practiced in America today is horrid.

    Also: participation at any level in the current abortion controversy not only is not in my interest in any way but directly counter to my interests. The people in power want a huge fight over very little. This is very very very close to that dead felon Floyd bullshit.

    • Thanks: JR Ewing
  56. Abe says: • Website

    Most observers agree that what we think of as The Sixties didn’t start until JFK’s assassination, but almost nobody can explain why. My guess is that 11/22/1963 ended the old Catholic Question,

    Martin Luther King Jr. was in jail for civil disobedience in 1960, making his fate a hot issue of that year’s Presidential campaign, with both Nixon and Kennedy vying for his endorsement or at least desperate to be seen as pro-MLK .

    When JFK or maybe it was Bobby called or maybe it was visited in person “Big Daddy” King to ask for his endorsement, in a move that would have caused your typical 2004-2016 vintage SWPL liberal to gush hot tears of grateful, relieved joy, as by the grace of his picayune bigotry their crushing guilt over their own white racism was suddenly made bearable, MLK Sr. paused and then started hemming and hawing: “Well, I don’t know if I can support a Catholic… “

    I think one of the real turning points in our recent history was the 1994 election which made both parties much more ideologically and culturally monolithic . Until 1994 there was nothing unusual in having regional variations on major political and cultural issues in either party, and so you had rich socially liberal, pro-abortion, pro-environment (pro-eugenics too, but you’re rich and so don’t need to say that part out loud) Republicans like Christie Todd Whitman, and pro-union, pro-life Democratic Catholics like Gov. Casey in Pennsylvania. Things changed after that, with Republicans becoming a bit more downscale, more religious, less Christian sectarian, and Democrats becoming less white ethnic, more pro-business (ultimately grooming themselves to put on that I-HEART-THE-CIA HulkBuster class of full-on GloboHomo armor). None of this if 1994 had not really started the process of putting specimens like Dick Gephardt (anti-abortion, pro-union, anti-NAFTA, German Missouri Catholic) out to pasture.

    • Agree: Houston 1992
    • Replies: @kahein
  57. Good article. From the viewpoint of 2022 it is hard to believe that back in 1972 Catholics were not supposed to use contraception, and that the birth control pill had only been around for a decade.

    From 1980 onwards, contraception in the form of a condom became a crucial aspect of public health policy due to the AIDS epidemic, and the prospect of giving birth to AIDS babies.

    Historical context is everything.

    Hopefully all 50 states will now review their abortion laws in a responsible manner and strike a balance between practical common sense and humanitarianism in the light of 2022 medical technology and religious dogma.

    None of the Beatles were religious. Secular postwar working class Liverpudlian was their religion.

    • Agree: kahein
    • Thanks: ginger bread man, Abe
  58. Jack D says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    From 1980 onwards, contraception in the form of a condom became a crucial aspect of public health policy due to the AIDS epidemic, and the prospect of giving birth to AIDS babies.

    You realize that (in the US at least) AIDS was a mainly gay thing and was rarely spread by heterosexual sex? The attempt to induce fear of AIDS among heterosexuals was an intentional effort to blur the lines so that gays would not be singled out for stigma.

    Hopefully all 50 states will now review their abortion laws in a responsible manner and strike a balance between practical common sense and humanitarianism in the light of 2022 medical technology and religious dogma.

    Ha, ha, ha. Responsibility, common sense and humanitarianism are the things are are in the lowest supply in American politics. They are harder to find than baby formula.

    • Replies: @Hangnail Hans
  59. @Hodag

    “whizzer white”

    What? Can’t we use the guy’s real name? I’ve heard much of Byron White (capital W), but the whizzer thing made me have to stop and look up who we’re talking about.

    Like when people write about Hizzoner, or whatever, and I think let’s just use someone’s name and stop trying to be cute.

    Pet peeve. No offense Mr. H.

  60. Spud Boy says:

    Thank you Steve for not suggesting that JFK was killed by anyone other than Lee Harvey Oswald. I’ve studied the evidence, and reviewed all the conspiracy theories, and IMHO JFK was assassinated by LHO acting alone.

    • Disagree: Abe
    • Replies: @Aleksander
    , @Up2Drew
  61. @Anon

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

    It depends on whether you are a fetus.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  62. Jack D says:
    @R.G. Camara

    Some of the hardest laughs of my life have been induced by the Pythons and every moment of laughter is a blessing in this vale of tears, so I don’t care if they are a bunch of Bolshevik child molesters when they are off stage. The work stands on its own outside of their personal lives. Most entertainers, especially comedians, have messed up personal lives – this very dysfunction is often the fuel that fires their comedic boilers. Someone who is happy and content is not going to seek attention from others by making a literal fool of himself on stage. I am sick of cancel culture.

    • Troll: R.G. Camara
    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
  63. in front of his beautiful wife

    Realizing that I’m completely missing the point, I would say that while the future Mrs. Onassis was regal, I don’t know why she is considered to be beautiful. Perhaps because she followed Eleanor Roosevelt, Bess Truman, and Mamie Eisenhower.

    • Agree: BB753
    • Replies: @Whereismyhandle
    , @Jack D
  64. Kunstler approaches RvW with a different perspective.

    https://kunstler.com/clusterfuck-nation/the-time-of-our-time/

    His dystopia is increasingly unavoidable, it seems.

    • Replies: @Intelligent Dasein
  65. Jack D says:
    @Anon

    You do understand that the Supreme Court did nothing to ban abortion? All they did was return this decision to the state legislatures where it had been for the 200 years previous to Roe.

    If you don’t think that banning abortion would benefit you, please make your view known to your state legislators so they can vote accordingly.

    Generally speaking, many Americans favor permitting abortion at least up to some point and the laws in most states will reflect that. There may be a few states where the consensus is against it.

    Our nation was created as a group of States that United together for certain common purposes such as defense but the scheme was intended to allow the people of each state to make their own decisions on matters such as abortion. The notion that the Federal government should force a uniform (generally Leftist) policy concerning every social issue on all the states is profoundly undemocratic and make break the Union (again).

    Nor is this notion really in the best interests of Leftists themselves. New York and California may wish to impose their notions concerning abortion on demand on the people of Texas and Mississippi but they sure don’t like it when the notions of the people of Texas and Mississippi regarding gun ownership and carrying are imposed on them. Federal control of everything is a double edged sword.

    • Agree: Beach Jim
    • Thanks: The Anti-Gnostic
  66. Although [W.O. Douglas] served longer on the Supreme Court than anyone else at 36 years

    Sadly his retirement came 11 months too late, as he was debilitated by a stroke in December 1974. His fellow justices informally decided that if any cases had him as the deciding vote, the case would be postponed until he could be convinced to retire.

    Once he did retire in November 1975, he tried to maintain senior status on the court by hearing cases and writing briefs. Chief Justice Burger had to order the staff to stop assisting him so he would get the hint.

    • Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
  67. William O. Douglas, was on his fourth wife… He was constantly on book tours to promote the 30 books he published

    I’m disappointed you didn’t explicitly connect these two statements, as he was constantly writing books and promoting them precisely because he had four wives to support.

    • LOL: Bardon Kaldian
    • Replies: @James J. O'Meara
  68. This really highlights how near-complete the effacement of the old mainline establishment has been. If the Supreme Court is a lagging indicator of the composition of the ruling class, it will be interesting to see what it looks like in 20 or 30 years.

  69. countenance says: • Website

    Just thought of something else. Here’s proof that the Catholic-Protestant divide that used to be such a big thing in America is now so long in the past and so forgotten and gotten over:

    The Catholicism of the first Catholic President was a big deal.

    The Catholicism of the second Catholic President was/is all but totally unmentioned.

    OTOH, if America ever gets a second black or black-mixed President, that will get touted to the ends of the universe.

  70. I suspect the moon landing might have been a bit more memorable than the JFK assassination; advances in medicine have strengthened the pro-life cause with astounding visual proof of how quickly the child develops in utero; and the sectarian detente has a lot to do with the emergence of a common enemy in post-modernism and the God-hating cultural revolution.

  71. Anon[392] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    “You do understand that the Supreme Court did nothing to ban abortion?”

    Yes, it’s the states passing laws that ban abortion. How do those laws benefit me?

    • Replies: @Jack D
    , @The Anti-Gnostic
  72. @ScarletNumber

    Whereas I don’t get why JFK was considered handsome.

    Either way, looks like their genetics worked for JFK, Jr.

  73. @R.G. Camara

    From a group only propped up because they supported Marxism ideals and were anti-Christian, and said group contained not only a homosexual sex-trafficking pedophile

    Sounds like the Catholic Church: a bunch of pro-Marxist pedophiles. (Anti-Christian? Ask any authentic Evangelical: the Pope of Rome is the Antichrist).

  74. In the absence of Roe v. Wade abortion rights probably would have been steadily liberalized through legislation during the 70’s on the then-prevalent view that it was mostly just another form of contraception. At that time the left would see it as liberating women, the right would see it as eugenic, and the libertarians would see it as furthering sexual freedom.

    But I think Roe produced a judicial version of the Streisand Effect, raising the salience of abortion as a moral issue that the anti-60s reaction could coalesce around. That’s when what you might call “the Fetus-Rights movement” seems to have been born. (no pun intended).

    It will be interesting to see what happens to the positions of both parties now that they can’t virtue signal costlessly on abortion as an abstract issue. Now they will have to defend or oppose actual nuanced legislation. What week of gestation is too late? What age should require parental notification? Does the father have any standing in the decision? How much should the circumstances of conception (e.g. rape) matter?

    Getting real about these questions is bound to scramble up the left-right political coalitions a bit.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    , @Jonathan Mason
  75. @ScarletNumber

    Same thing happened to Alan Watts. He actually despised “hippies” and “free love,” and while more swinging that the average Episcopal priest (as he was one in the 40s), he married three times and had about 17 children and grandchildren. (*)

    To support this brood without a “square” job, he was constantly touring — not so much to promote his books as to deliver lectures, participate in “workshops” and debates, etc. A shy Britisher, he endured it only through massive consumption of vodka, which may — along with exhaustion — have led to his early death at 57.

    OTOH, he may have “voluntarily discorporated,” like the Buddha, to escape from all those commitments.

    (*) Puts to shame about 99.9% of those whining about “White replacement.”

  76. @Jack D

    The problem is that the cost of additional black children in Mississippi, Alabama and Missouri will be shared nationwide.

    • Agree: Alden
  77. @R.G. Camara

    It’s poetic justice that the Pythons hate the world they had a part in creating, they miss the institutions that they ridiculed and the culture they killed which nevertheless rewarded them for their comedy. It’s just a damn shame that we have to suffer along with the Left.

    I didn’t know about Chapman being a grooming predator, but I’m not surprised that it’s not common knowledge.

    • Agree: Daniel H
    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
  78. J.Ross says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Justice Thomas recently quipped about Americans being less interested in their Constitution than their iPhones. In the 2A ruling historical references were made, familiar to me and I suspect other pro-2A people, possibly puzzling to the folks who want America to be Canada. We are approaching a confrontation over the fact that a decisive minority of Americans know nothing in the way of civics or history.

    • Agree: Dr. X
    • Replies: @Curle
  79. peterike says:

    but nobody remembers it because nobody remembers how strong the Protestant vs. Catholic rivalry was

    Because in the end it was a totally meaningless side-show. While there may have been some Kulturkampf between P and C in the mid-sixties, that was also precisely when Jewish cultural hegemony was coming to the fore. It had been strong for a very long time (even going back into the 19th century), but by the mid 60s Jews had effectively gained complete control of the American cultural apparatus.

    Going forward, nearly all cultural/political movements were now Jewish led and Jewish created: civil rights, 2nd wave feminism, gay rights, open borders, blah blah blah. It’s Jews all the way down. Both Protestants and Catholics gave up cultural control without so much as a squeak, and the cultural ratchet has moved only Leftward now for at least 70 years, and it shows no signs of slowing down. It only gets crazier and more degenerate.

    • Agree: Robert Dolan
    • Replies: @Peter D. Bredon
  80. @Anon

    I don’t think we should necessarily support only those laws from which we personally benefit.

    The argument for criminalizing abortion is based on moral claims not group benefits: the state should criminalize murder; since human life begins at conception, abortion is murder; justice demands the equal protection of the laws.

  81. @countenance

    The Catholicism of the second Catholic President was/is all but totally unmentioned.

    Ironically Biden is a more devout and observant Catholic than JFK. It is testifies to the waning power of cultural Catholicism and the deep split in the American Church over abortion and woke culture wars that Biden is not viewed as a „real Catholic“ by significant numbers of the church hierarchy, or the American public. In JFK‘s time it was far more important to be loyal to the Church as an institution, but your personal beliefs and behavior could be all over the map, as long as you didn’t make a show of it. This is no longer the case. The idea that shadowy Satanic forces in the Vatican can call the shots has also lost potency among American Evangelicals as many far more compelling conspiracy theories have emerged.

  82. @Anon

    Can you explain what kind of answer you’re looking for? You’ve asked this question on several comment threads…

  83. Jack D says:
    @ScarletNumber

    Jackie Kennedy still in the flower of her youth when she became the First Lady. She was 31 when her husband took office. Mamie Eisenhower was in her mid-fifties. Bess Truman was 60. Eleanor was 49 and by the time her husband left office was over 60. So any comparison of their relative beauty was overshadowed by the difference in their ages when they became fixed in our memories.

    For example, here are young Mamie and Ike at the time of their wedding. Like most people, they are a more handsome couple than they would be 40 years later.

    • Thanks: Hhsiii
  84. @ScarletNumber

    Burger should have just given Douglas the briefs and record in a case that was denied cert and told him to work up an opinion. Then he could die happy thinking he’s still in the mix.

    I wonder if that’s why Bruce Willis’s family and friends let him keep making schlocky, direct-to-streaming movies until he couldn’t even manage a single line of dialogue or instruction. Maybe it kept him happy and he could tell everyone he was still “making movies.” Here’s a picture of his wife when it dawns on her that her lover, husband, breadwinner, and father of her children is no longer there and she’s just lugging a large, aged child around.

    Most professional service firms have clauses in their partnership agreements to usher you gently out the door by age 65, but for some reason we can’t even debate age limits for public officials.

    It’s not just cognitive decline; beyond age 65 you really are from a different country. The governing class needs to be from people still in the mix: active taxpayers and decision-makers.

    • Agree: Hangnail Hans
    • Thanks: Bill Jones
    • Replies: @kaganovitch
  85. Jack D says:
    @countenance

    There’s no doubt that the Catholics have become “white”. While Joos (based on the comments here) appear to be an ongoing obsession of white nationalists (for example being blamed for Roe even though they were not involved with the case in any meaningful way) Catholics no longer seem to get any blame and are even accepted among the ranks of WNs.

    In contrasts, the 1920s KKK was anti-Catholic as much or more than it was anti-Jewish. Just as Jews continue to be accused of dual loyalty to Israel, Catholics were once believed to value their loyalty to the Pope above American interests. That all seems to have disappeared for the Catholics. Even the most virulent opponents of Joe Biden did not accuse him of being loyal to Rome.

    • Replies: @SFG
    , @BB753
  86. @Jack D

    Some of the hardest laughs of my life have been induced by the Pythons and every moment of laughter is a blessing in this vale of tears, so I don’t care if they are a bunch of Bolshevik child molesters when they are off stage.

    Your moral emptiness and depravity is noted, fed. All fed needs is a good chuckle, and you can rape little boys!

    The work stands on its own outside of their personal lives.

    When one is kidnapping and raping little boys, and other is using every 3rd moment to hatefully blaspheme my religion, yeah, it doesn’t stand on its own.

    Most entertainers, especially comedians, have messed up personal lives – this very dysfunction is often the fuel that fires their comedic boilers

    This isn’t a sad drunk or irascible turd ferguson; this is kidnapping, religious bigotry, and child rape. You do get the difference, don’t you, glowie?

    • Agree: WHAT
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  87. I’ve posted that clip here and elsewhere (perhaps inspiring iSteve?) to suggest the unlikelihood that E. Michael Jones or Nick Fuentes will make any headway in using current issues as leverage to “cunningly” trick heritage Americans into submitting to their Throne and Altar fantasies of a return to the Middle Ages.

    Catholicism is a LARPing fantasy; at the time JFK was elected, the suspiciously named John Kennedy Toole was writing A Confederacy of Dunces, presenting us with Ignatius Reilly, the alt-right incel avant le lettre.

    Also, it shows that the Nativists and Know Nothings like Bill the Butcher were right to oppose Irish (i.e. Catholic) immigration. What the the Know Nothings didn’t know was that the reverse would happen, and Catholics would protestantize themselves — an actual literal heresy, “Americanism”, condemned by one of those Pope Piuses. Opposition to abortion won’t save you from Hell if you support separation of Church and State as well.

    The joke in that clip, of course, is that Chapman’s Protestant seems uninterested in his being “free to wear a rubber device on my John Thomas” other than as a symbol of his freedom from “the principle of alien episcopal supremacy.” To the EMJ crowd, “privacy” and “freedom” are just the latest iteration of the Protestant principle, and America will not be redeemed until it licks the toes of the Pope.

    The two households, also, symbolize the stereotype, or fact, of Catholic countries being overpopulated, dirty, poor and backward, Protestant countries being enterprising , lean and socially, scientifically and economically progressive. If true, as it seems to be, which way does the causality flow?

    Heritage Americans put America squarely in the latter camp, much to the hatred of the Ignatius Reillys of the EMJ crowd, who consider the USA to be part of the vast Illuminati/Freemasonic/Satanist/Jewish conspiracy of the Antichrist.

    And notice, the clip is about contraception, not abortion. As Gregory Hood pointed out on a Counter-Currents podcast, abortion moves beyond mere privacy to involve another life; those who support advertising contraception or reading “dirty” books on grounds of privacy may go along with banning abortion but won’t give up their rubber devices, so the dreams of “repealing all the Warren Court advances” are just that, dreams; just like the idea of bringing back the Middle Ages.

    Once again we see the simlarity of Marxism and Catholicism: the EMJ types are like the Frankfurt School, deploring the actual workers who “betrayed” the revolution and were satisfied with refrigerators, big cars, new houses and other worldly goods; they have accepted the temptations of Satan! In the same way, Heritage Americans want to keep the nice things Protestantism has brought them, and to Hell with alien episcopal supremacy.

    • Replies: @Bill
    , @Hibernian
    , @Dutch Boy
  88. In contrast, Robert F. Kennedy had 11 children.

    At first I thought you were confusing RFK with his Dad, Joe, but you’re right. Dang. I don’t know RFK was so prolific. I see his Dad had 9 kids, with Robert the 7th.

    Great blog entry, btw.

  89. @Hodag

    Byron White reminds me of Bill Bradley – pro athlete turned lawyer turned political figure.

    I’m going to go a little fanboy here: White was a truly remarkable human. He graduated Summa Cum Laude from Yale Law (a feat which has only been repeated once in history) and lead the NFL in rushing for two seasons (another singular feat). Supposedly while enrolled at Yale, students were given personal butlers to carry their books, do their laundry and follow them around. Byron sparred and boxed with his butler when he was too poor to afford a personal trainer to keep in shape during the off season.

    Apparently there was a basketball court in the Supreme Court building located in the floor above where the court sessions would take place, which was dubbed the “highest court in the land”. Byron complete dominated the other justices and clerks even in his old age

    • Replies: @Lysias
    , @Anon
  90. Marquis says:
    @Jack D

    This is the real answer for pragmatists who cares nothing about the morality of abortion. A return to real federalism is not only ideal, in my humble opinion, but the one true way this Union has of surviving the increasingly diverse and fragmentation of society.

    If California wants to about the unborn, smoke dope all day, and tax themselves it’s no concern of mine as a resident of Ohio.

    • Agree: Abe
    • Replies: @nebulafox
  91. Dutch Boy says:

    The WASP elite were the biggest promoters of eugenics pre-WWII. Post-war, with eugenics in disrepute, the movement segued to birth control, which picked up important Jewish support but still focused on those other pesky groups the WASPs disliked but who continued to out-procreate them. The various social engineering decisions (e.g., Roe) were aimed at these same groups, especially those annoying Catholics who promoted the working class solidarity so loathed by the economic elite. The elite WASPS and the Jews who now own them have gotten their way and the mess they have created is all around us. The old Democratic Party, which was once the political vehicle of the Catholic working class, is now their avowed enemy.

    • Replies: @Charles Martel France
  92. so, similar to Prohibition then?

    Douglas was a straight up nut job who wrote rambling nonsense for decades. yeah, the country was better back in the old days, but thankfully we’ve never seen anybody that crazy before or since on the Supreme Court. imagine if the affirmative action justices today who can’t write and can’t make sense on any topic actually wrote lots of the opinions for the dissent. so that pretty often the official, on record text of the outvoted justices was incoherent nonsense, or worse, they felt the need to write their own separate dissent, which seemed to be Douglas’ thing.

    i’ll be glad when the boomers are gone and i never have to hear about the Beatles again. by far the most overrated musicians in the history of the world. somehow for boomers everything can be tied back to the Beatles. my dad’s sister went to see them in 1964 at their only appearance ever in Pittsburgh. thank god all my old relatives correctly rated the Beatles as very good, but hardly worth going on and on about for 60 years, so i never had to hear about them constantly like i do in the Prestige Press.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
  93. Flip says:

    Although he served longer on the Supreme Court than anyone else at 36 years, he seemed to think a cruel fate had sidelined him to the Supreme Court and kept him out of the White House, thus wasting his life. He might have been right.

    Supposedly the party elders told FDR in 1944 that the leftist VP Henry Wallace had to go. FDR said he would accept Truman or Douglas, so Douglas may have been right.

    • Replies: @Acilius
  94. Another related point that Steve has mentioned in the past is that anti-Catholic sentiment at one point largely outweighed anti-Jewish sentiment in the public sphere. Catholics with the pope at its head filled the role a shady international cabal that sought to control America for its own benefit.

    I think the anti-contraception/abortion crusade fit into this paradigm way back when

  95. Pete Best? Give me a break.

  96. SFG says:
    @Jack D

    Jews are still a large portion of the money and brains behind most of the modern Left, even the social Justice movement that’s gradually kicking them out of it.

    I am sick of the oven memes as well but they don’t come from nowhere. The best we can do is turn as many Jews to the right as possible-guys like Breitbart, Drudge, Levant, Miller are worth quite a bit. Use our strengths in media and finance (here at least we can admit there is a biological component in terms of verbal IQ and probably some mathematical as well) for good rather than evil. I am not eager to jump into the oven but turning back Critical Race Theory and disparate impact is another story. 1990s or 1950s America is still preferable to Brazil.

    • Replies: @ginger bread man
  97. @Peter Akuleyev

    It’s quite possible that sex with consequences will cause lower class blacks to find other means of birth control.

  98. @Hypnotoad666

    Indeed. Everybody is very pessimistic about this, but it could be an opportunity for the red States to show that they are capable of making an appeal to swing voters, and that they could become a humane, sensible, and progressive party to lead the US to greater things in the 21st century and appeal to all demographics.

  99. Were the Beatles English Protestants or Irish Catholics?

    To paraphrase Ringo Starr, no, they were mockers.

    There were many questions about the Beatles…

  100. @Jack D

    The attempt to induce fear of AIDS among heterosexuals was an intentional effort to blur the lines so that gays would not be singled out for stigma.

    The effort was to get people to care about something even if it didn’t yet affect them personally. Words like prudence and empathy come to mind.

    Gays were already — massively — singled out for stigma, though IV drug users were every bit as much at risk.

  101. @Jack D

    Our nation was created as a group of States that United together for certain common purposes such as defense but the scheme was intended to allow the people of each state to make their own decisions on matters such as abortion.

    Should be most matters, barring clear and convincing arguments to the contrary, but it’s not. (Nearly all matters, some say.)

    And the nation was indeed created as a voluntary confederation of otherwise autonomous states, but the war of 1861-65 laid that notion to rest for good.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  102. @R.G. Camara

    I can’t prove this, but my guess is that Roe v. Wade was seen, consciously or unconsciously, by pro-abortion Republican justices as sort of Culture War response by low birthrate Protestant Republicans against highly fertile Roman Catholic Democrats whose Pope opposed contraception: legalized abortion was seen by them as contraception for Catholics too backward to use contraception:

    This is an interesting hypothesis (to say the least).

    And then this:

    The nominee of the football crazy JFK, Justice Whizzer White, who had led the NFL in rushing yards in 1938 and 1940, wrote in dissent:

    The Court simply fashions and announces a new constitutional right for pregnant women and, with scarcely any reason or authority for its action, invests that right with sufficient substance to override most existing state abortion statutes.

    – What a straightforward (=bafflingly straightforward!) juridical discourse this was!

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  103. Indeed, perhaps the most ardently pro-abortion Justice, environmentalist mountain climber, William O. Douglas, was on his fourth wife. In his mid 60s, he’d married in rapid succession two 23-year olds.

    1973 was a big year for men on their fourth wives. Minoru Yamasaki completed his World Trade Center, the tallest and second-tallest structures buildings in the world until Chicago Bengali Fazlur Khan topped him on the summer solstice the next year. Who’d’ve guessed that Roe would survive it by decades?

    Yama’s fourth wife happened to be his first. He had married a couple of blondes in his second childhood. In 1969, Mrs Y (I & IV) told a reporter that she would thenceforth try harder to be a “good Japanese wife”. As opposed to “American”, I guess; both were Seattle natives. Yama himself was apologetic: “I’m just going to be nicer to her.”

    Back on-topic, elective abortion and the WTC were both pet projects of the Rockefeller brothers. Indeed, their highest priorities at the time.

    • Replies: @Anon
  104. That’s kind of a bait-and-switch title there, Steve.

  105. Precious says:
    @Anon

    The Moloch worshipers like Hillary Clinton and Dick’s Sporting Goods execs won’t be able to gain as much evil power from child sacrifice. Planned Parenthood won’t be able to donate as much to Democrats, unless trans surgeries make up for the drop in their bottom line. And… maybe you will get more grandchildren in your old age?

  106. @Jonathan Mason

    From the viewpoint of 2022 it is hard to believe that back in 1972 Catholics were not supposed to use contraception.

    Catholics are never supposed to use contraception, ever. Nor is anyone else. The natural law does not change, unlike the positive law of passing nations and peoples.

    And yes, birth control pills and IUDs are abortifacients and likewise need to be banned.

  107. anon[216] • Disclaimer says:

    I agree with Steve on the outsized significance of Protestant-versus-Catholic birthrate concerns in America circa 1970. I remember well the opinions at the time of my mother and her father, born circa 1935 and 1900 respectively, though both were baptized Episcopalians turned agnostic.

    What seems to have escaped Americans and Canadians of the era is that an old-world culture like that of working-class Liverpool, long a natural flashpoint for the Catholic-Protestant divide, had moved on. The religious backgrounds of the Beatles’ eight parents seem to strongly express a preference for music, dance halls and good times over dour religion and its squabbles, among both Catholic and Protestant representatives. Perhaps that amalgamation and transcendence were a big part of the Beatles’ success.

  108. @Dieter Kief

    What a straightforward (=bafflingly straightforward!) juridical discourse this was!

    Daniel K Williams, in his excellent (and balanced) history of the pre-Roe right-to-life movement, explains that Harry Blackmun constructed his argument, as pilots say, “by the seat of his pants”.* He knew the result he wanted, and just cobbled together whatever bricks would hold his edifice. (Pardon the mixed metaphors.)

    (One originalist legal scholar, pro-gun-rights himself, made this accusation against Antonin Scalia after Heller. He called that decision based on “faux originalism”.)

    *What is the German counterpart of this expression? Or the French or Italian or Russian, for that matter? I bet they can be quite interesting.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  109. bomag says:
    @Henry Canaday

    …It was supposedly a gift to women, who were the hot objects of favor in the early 70s

    This.

  110. Anon[146] • Disclaimer says:
    @SFG

    I can remember back in the 1970s kids in my junior high raving about Monty Python or Pythin, however the frick they pronounce it. Anyway, it was clear my schoolmates didn’t know what the hell they were talking about. I have to say I don’t get British humor.

    • Replies: @Mike Tre
    , @tyrone
  111. BB753 says:
    @Jack D

    That’s because after Council Vatican II in 1965, the Catholic Church quickly became a New Age movement with the Pope as a kind of traveling Dalai Lama no longer preaching a Christian Gospel.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    , @Jim Don Bob
  112. anon[424] • Disclaimer says:

    What % of current day America even knows what the words “Protestant” and “Catholic” mean?

  113. kahein says:
    @Abe

    moderately honest abe makes some points, but the “pre-berrigan/post-berrigan” schism in catholic social activism goes much deeper than this — and certainly includes biden, at least penumbrally

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Berrigan

  114. @Anon

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

    It’s going make you politically active? It’s going to peel away the economically libertarian from the religious conservatives?

    It’s interesting how Dan Proft and Shaun Thompson on WIND-AM have taken up the pro-life banner and run with that from their Catholic upbringing. Jeanne Ives who ran for IL Governor said that the “Bump stock” ban was “REASONABLE GUN CONTROL” on her campaign site and a few months ago was running radio ads on WIND-AM mentioning super-anti-gunner William Lipinski.

    Seems the strange bedfellows libertarians and religious conservatives insofar as electorial politics is concerned will be heading for a breakup at some point in the future.

  115. “Court from voting 7-2 to legalize abortion largely unchecked through six months of pregnancy.”
    original ruling was 3 months? if so, another case of give the left an inch, they take a mile.

    View post on imgur.com

  116. Guest007 says:
    @Jack D

    In 2025 when the Republicans have control of the House, the Senate, and the White House, banning abortion at the national level will be their first priority even before an unfunded tax cut. Then all those who are currently talking about state control and state’s rights will have to disavow all of those discussions.

    • Disagree: Houston 1992
    • Thanks: kahein
  117. Anon[146] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hhsiii

    Indeed. Lennon’s father had Irish Catholic
    ancestry, where as McCartney and Harrison had maternal Irish Catholic ancestry. Don’t know about Richard Starkey.

    • Replies: @Hhsiii
  118. There’s no need for abortions anymore anyway. Women just aren’t getting pregnant.

    https://igorchudov.substack.com/p/depopulation-of-taiwan

  119. Ian Smith says:
    @Anonymous

    Ringo is Catholic AF:

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  120. @R.G. Camara

    Are you sure Souter was not gay? He kept the Supremes from hearing the appeal of Gregg Smart’s widow. Mr Smart was confronted by two burglars in his home. He knock down one and the other shot him dead. He never knew they were gay lovers and never knew they were armed. Among gays, the killer is a hero and if Smart had lived he would have been charged with as many crimes as possible. He did not, so his widow was charged. The gays have been covering up this for the last 30 years. This verdict should have been overturned years ago. The gay judges of NH is preventing this.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    , @Rich
  121. @SFG

    They always did lean left; humorists of the right tend to be forgotten.

    Many of the satirists we remember are of the right– Aristophanes, Juvenal, Swift, Waugh. Chaucer, Machiavelli, and Molière are harder to classify, but certainly had friends in high places. George Orwell and Al Capp were drifting toward a populist right late in life, choosing to savage the Left. (Capp lived in Cambridge, Mass– how could he not?)

    George Carlin and John Cleese could be described as virulent centrists. Then there’s Norm Macdonald…

  122. kahein says:

    as the recent pew survey indicated, there is only one group of xtrians in this country who decisively supported the overturning of roe, and that’s evangelicals — basically frontier big-box xtrianity that has nothing to do with respectability and is closer to west-african animism than what a northeast-establishment prot would have countenanced in 1950

    a slight catholic majority was fine with roe, though the hardened, embittered core of mass-every-sunday catholics (probably pushing 75 to 80 on average) was sharply (70%) against. catholicism seems to have discarded every aspect of its former urban-white-democrat social identity except for abortion opposition (and the desire for municipal payola). no more antiwar or labor activism here. among the online young the faith functions as a kind of septic tank for various strands of declasse and therefore baste reactionary cultural material

    protestantism was once aligned with political progressivism to its core — with social contract and the right to a private, autonomous moral sphere. that’s looking awfully quaint — not to say, preferable — these days, compared with the satanic synthesis of snake-charming holy-roller catholics like coney barrett

  123. Mike Tre says:
    @Anon

    It’s there chauvinism. They got bombed in WWII, don’t you know that! That’s literally the worst thing ever! Boom make baby Cleese so sad!

    Nevermind the fact that of European Nations actively involved in WWII, England was by far and away the least scathed and they pretty much started the damn thing.

  124. Jack D says:
    @Anon

    The law in states where you don’t live mostly don’t concern you at all. As for your state, not all laws benefit you. We live in a democracy and some laws will benefit you and piss off others and some laws vice versa – that’s how it goes. Like Churchill said, it’s the worst possible system except for all of the others.

  125. Bill says:
    @Hangnail Hans

    AIDS illustrates one reason it’s a good idea to stigmatize gays. And, by the way, IV drug users are and were stigmatized.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  126. Jack D says:
    @BB753

    Is that really true or is that just charitable spin? John Paul II didn’t seem New Agey to me – he even helped bring down the Soviet Union.

    When Jews do stuff like this anti-Semites are not inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt (it was said of Henry Adams that when he saw Mt. Vesuvius reddening he searched for the Jew who was stoking the fire) but here you are giving Catholics the benefit of the doubt.

    Could it be that un-Christian liberation theologists (Bolsheviks in priestly garb) are even more dangerous than the pre-Vatican II kind who rendered unto Caesar that which pertained to Caesar.

    • Replies: @BB753
  127. Ralph L says:
    @Jack D

    I hadn’t noticed before that Ike’s eyes were almost as wide-set as Jackie’s freaky ones.

  128. Anon[276] • Disclaimer says:
    @Precious

    >And… maybe you will get more grandchildren in your old age?

    Like a lot of conservative people I don’t want any of my daughters to give birth out of wedlock, so I don’t count that as a benefit.

  129. Jack D says:
    @Hangnail Hans

    Words like prudence and empathy come to mind.

    Funny because to me words like lying and distortion come to my mind.

    “Free love” and promiscuity are not good things, but getting heterosexual kids to associate sex with a painful and incurable terminal disease messed with the heads of an entire generation in a way that has not been good for our society either and was based on an intentionally false premise that AIDs spread just as easily among heterosexuals.

    • Replies: @epebble
  130. @prime noticer

    “Imagine” makes me puke. The hypocrisy is off the scale.

    “Imagine no possessions” … said the guy with a net worth of \$200 million.

    Imagine Yoko Ono, absconding with all that cash…

    • Agree: Kylie
  131. Mike Tre says:
    @Anon

    So, like what? You’re gonna spam every thread with your narcissistic trolling? I guess mommy didn’t give you enough attention back in your formative years so you come here seeking a substitute.

    • Replies: @Anon
  132. Bill says:
    @James J. O'Meara

    What the the Know Nothings didn’t know was that the reverse would happen, and Catholics would protestantize themselves — an actual literal heresy, “Americanism”, condemned by one of those Pope Piuses.

    I had a Pope Pius clock for years.

    Over time, though, I came to realize that Popes Pius have been pretty disappointing. Luckily, we have Leos to do things like condemning Americanism.

    Once again we see the simlarity of Marxism and Catholicism: the EMJ types are like the Frankfurt School, deploring the actual workers who “betrayed” the revolution and were satisfied with refrigerators, big cars, new houses and other worldly goods; they have accepted the temptations of Satan! In the same way, Heritage Americans want to keep the nice things Protestantism has brought them, and to Hell with alien episcopal supremacy.

    That’s just silly. The whole point of Marxism was providing material benefits to the workers. It’s the Marxism which betrayed the workers. OTOH, worshipping Mammon (a concern which is as old as Christianity) really is betraying God.

  133. BB753 says:
    @Jack D

    As a former Catholic ( now converted to the Orthodox Faith and a member of the genuine Catholic Church), trust me, I can assure you that John Paul II was a fake conservative, much like Reagan. For one thing, as a young bishop in the 1962-65 Vatican II Council, he was firmly on the progressive side. As a Pope, he held the Assissi ecumenical meetings, praying with Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, etc ( which is an act of apostasy and streng verboten according to Catholic Canon Law. Do I need to remind you that John Paul II kissed a copy of the Koran? ).
    https://www.crisismagazine.com/2021/the-legacy-of-assisi

    As for his Cold War Warrior status, he was just a CIA stooge, like Gorbachev.
    http://radtradthomist.chojnowski.me/2020/09/vatican-ii-and-cia-propaganda-with.html?m=1

    Although he never cared for liberation theology, Wojtyla cracked down harder on traditionalists.
    In short, John Paul II was a product of Vatican II and CIA and State Dept. policies. And certainly no saint.

    • Troll: Corvinus
    • Replies: @BB753
  134. Anonymous[526] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ian Smith

    Rockers are ‘baptists’ one way or another as country and blues are steeped spiritually in baptism, even if as blasphemy.

    Of the Gospels, John’s is most cerebral, and John Lennon was quite a wit(as well as twit).

    St. Paul rendered Early Christianity more appealing to the gentiles and masses, and Paul McCartney’s songs like “Yesterday”, “Hey Jude”, and “Let It Be” made the band appealing to adults as well as kids.

  135. Hhsiii says:
    @Anon

    Lennon even sang in the choir at St. Peter’s church in Woolton, Liverpool.

    That was the church where Lennon met McCartney at a fete. Lennon’s skiffle group was playing, The Quarrymen. McCartney says he had seen Lennon on the bus a couple of times and thought oh yeah, there’s that guy.

    McCartney was 15, a year younger. He played Eddie Cochran’s Twenty Flight Rock, Be Bop a Lula, and some Little Richard. He showed Lennon how to tune his guitar (Lennon’s mother had taught him banjo chords). A little bit later they asked him to join.

    So they may not have been religious, but the church was a social center, same as when I grew up. Youth groups, outings, etc.

    And they were playing rock and roll together almost since there was such a thing. At least as such, not just jump blues, Rocket 88 etc.

    • Replies: @Flip
  136. @Dr. X

    Ronald Reagan’s daughter Patti had a couple of abortions, one of which left her permanently infertile. Nancy knew everything – she was the one who made the arrangements.

    During his administration, Nancy consistently tried to shift Ronnie to the left on abortion. She saw it as a loser issue for the GOP.

    I have to admit my opinion of my mother changed (and not for the better) when she told me she had an abortion when I was a small child. (I was in college when she admitted it.) She claimed a man had forced himself on her but I still had a hard time accepting her decision. I always wanted a younger sibling.

    Nor did I feel much sympathy when my cousin told me she regretted aborting the baby of The One Who Got Away. She said it was the worst mistake of her life. Later she ended up having two kids with a (black) guy she didn’t really like. (They’re still together after 13 years.)

    I thought (but didn’t say), “Your body, your choice, your f**king problem.”

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
  137. @Hangnail Hans

    So Gays were singled out for stigma. This raises the definition of “Stigma”.
    Let’s go with a fairly typical
    “a strong feeling of disapproval that most people in a society have about something, especially when this is unfair:.”
    Cambridge English Dictionary.

    Shouldn’t people be entitled to a strong feeling of disapproval of people who knowingly indulge in voluntary activities which are major carriers of disease at great expense to society and who as a group act as a reservoir of diseases?
    In what way is this even remotely “Unfair”?

  138. anon[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

    It will result in your superior DNA spreading as far as you spread your seed. Thus also benefitting all humanity. We thank you in advance, O Great One.

  139. @MEH 0910

    Perhaps Cleese’s “some years ago” was roughly the last time I visited London. I’m not one of his friends, but it certainly wasn’t the “English” London I remember visiting 50 years ago.

  140. Hhsiii says:
    @Hodag

    Not NFL, but Barry Kramer was an all-America at NYU in the early ‘60s when they had a DI team, played NBA, then was a NY State Court Judge. From Schenectady, where he played with a younger Pat Riley.

  141. nebulafox says:
    @Anon

    It won’t. If there’s one thing mainstream liberals and conservatives seem to agree upon these days, it’s their feminist-friendly take on how the only acceptable male behavior being whatever is maximally convenient for women, among other things.

    That said, people are acting like this is the Handmaid’s Tale come to life. In reality, the amount of countries that unconditionally allow abortions past 20 weeks is now six, not seven. Roe was more permissive than the likes of France or Sweden. This is all a massive nothing-burger. Mississippi still allows abortions up to 15 weeks, and if they are going to allow that, other states inevitably will.

    The ruling itself isn’t really that interesting. How people and moreso institutions react to it is because it shows the coming fault lines.

    (The list of the other countries might not be what many expect: the Netherlands, Canada in some states, Singapore, Vietnam, China, North Korea.)

  142. Jay Fink says:

    The pro-choice side was decidedly upscale in the 70s and many were Republicans. Things changed sometime late in the late 70s or early in the 80s when Republicans made a big push to welcome evangelicals to their tent. It was during the rise of the moral majority (who sadly lost the culture wars for everything except abortion). I think this was a cynical yet successful way for Republicans to get more votes.

    Pro-life Christians have been a large part of the Republican base for decades now. I think they have fundementally changed the Republican party and made them more fiscally liberal. Note Republicans no longer make an attempt to reduce the welfare state. They love tax cuts but not spending cuts. I think this is related to their pro-life position as they want to shower lower socioeconomic women who give birth to (often illegitimate) children with welfare goodies.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  143. The Western Journal looks at how the Corporate Wokels have reacted to the death of Roe

    https://www.westernjournal.com/woke-companies-grotesque-reaction-fall-roe-report/

    And just as it would be for me, the temptation to lead with Dicks was just too strong to resist.

  144. Quidnunc says:

    This is a brilliant analysis that I hadn’t read before and is probably exactly right.

  145. @SFG

    Anti catholic Memes were All the rage in the 1870s:

    • Agree: Hibernian
  146. @Bill Jones

    People need to read my longish comment on the previous abortion thread (which Steve semi-shadowbanned by sticking 60% of it beneath a “more” tag) for a brief discussion of the true nature of Roe and the ramifications of this decision. I am very much in the same camp as Kunstler.

    As of now, the post has been up for 2.0 days and not a single person has responded or reacted to it.

    • Troll: kahein
    • Replies: @HFR
    , @bomag
  147. Dr. X says:
    @Anon

    Coney-Barrett, the one female conservative, has outbred everyone on the court.

    Well… take a look at them.

    Given a choice, of the three females on the Court, which one would you hit?

    • LOL: Rogue
  148. nebulafox says:
    @Marquis

    I don’t think people who haven’t seen the process up front get how much abortion can fuck with someone’s head-the emotional fallout. I’m talking hardcore partiers or druggy types of people here that I knew when I was a very different man. It’s still killing your own kid. Let’s just call a spade a spade here. Some, and oddly enough (admittedly anecdotal), especially the poor ones who couldn’t count on male support, couldn’t go through it in the end or felt massively broken after.

    I’m in my 20s, male, childless, in the recovery process from total emotional and spiritual desensitivity, and am a pretty hardcore political-cultural realist: i.e, I’m not the natural demographic here. But even I know abortion ain’t trivial in the slightest. I also know that the mixed hemming and hawing about how many months or whatever, when the fetus can do what, etc, how adoption would be preferable, is probably closest to how the normative citizen feels upon about the issue than any of the protesters would like to admit.

    • Thanks: ic1000
  149. Mr. Grey says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    It’s hard to notice now, but the Beatles ‘long hair’ in 1964 was scandalous.

    • Agree: martin_2
    • Replies: @John Pepple
  150. @Precious

    It makes perfect sense for employers to fund abortion as women who have infants usually take time off work which hampers productivity. That’s crapitalism for you, it’s all about what the boss wants, those of you who claim you like it so much should stop whining about the outcome. Maybe even consider higher taxes and unionization as an alternative to Reaganite neoliberal idiocy.

  151. Beach Jim says:
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    I’ve always thought that Terry Gilliam leaned conservative due to his films. You mention his film “Brazil”, but I think most of his films lean this way. “Time Bandits” was anti-consumerism, “12 Monkeys” was anti-government. I know he’s made several other films and I thought they also had a similar conservative lean.

    • Replies: @SFG
  152. @Prester John

    The effect of television upon American society almost beggars description. One can argue that television (along with the automobile and the PC) is one of the three most important inventions of the twentieth century.

    Excellent point about TV. Allowing Hollyweird to continually beam its ideology into Americans’ homes–basically Hollyweird’s ideology replacing peoples’ communities, neighbors, friends–has been devastating.

    I actually do not think the PC without the Internet was all that important. Interesting, but not up there with cars and TV. It is the Internet that actually makes the PC–or the phone–a shattering invention.

    And, of course, the critical fourth invention–the birth control pill. Or more generally reliable no-sweat birth control.

  153. Daniel H says:
    @Prester John

    Frankly I never thought of the Catholic-Protestant dichotomy as a factor. Interesting. Leave it to iSteve to throw a changeup.

    Steve’s right it was a huge factor. Evangelical Protestants were so primed to support/oppose anything Catholics oppose/supported that they were taken completely unawares by Roe. It really was a case of, “wait what are we doing, the Catholics are right on this one…”. It was only by the 80s that Protestants got their act together and became (and still are) more ardently anti-Roe than Catholics. I think the Pope was urging some sort of moderation the other day.

  154. @Anon

    It’s not just about abortion; it’s about rule of law. It slightly turns back the erosion of rule of law and strengthens the status of the Constitution as an actual governing document. Make no mistake, the US is still Rome circa 400, so it’s probably not going to do much. But maybe the importance of Constitutional issues will help drive a wedge between Red and Blue states and usher in a (hopefully peaceful) secession, which is really the only hope for Patriots (because California, New York et al are never coming back – that ship has sailed).

    I’m agnostic about abortion. I lean slightly pro-life simply because the Left is so evil and they are so reflectively pro-choice. But on an abstract level I highly value rule of law, and the Constitution clearly leaves abortion to the states. It’s kind of like the Rittenhouse verdict: a small and potentially meaningless victory. But in this life, maybe that’s all we get. Now where’s my expensive bourbon…

  155. epebble says:
    @Jack D

    Safe Sex awareness has been an unmitigated success. It has,

    1. Brought down unintended pregnancies, the cause behind fewer number of abortions today than in the 1980’s. There was a constant drumbeat of “Welfare mothers”, “Children having Children”, “Teenage Pregnancies” etc., on the media. All that has gone away.
    2. Brought down the rate of sexually transmitted disease, yes, even including AIDS.
    3. Reduced promiscuity. which is good for promoting general health, both physical and mental, besides being morally good for those who value it.

    When the campaign for Safe Sex awareness started in the 1980’s, not much was known about AIDS. Hence, it was prudent to advocate caution even if the risk was lower, considering the terrible consequences. I see no evidence of any “messed with the heads”.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  156. Art Deco says:
    @Guest007

    banning abortion at the national level will be their first priority even before an unfunded tax cut.

    It will not.

    • Agree: tyrone, J.Ross
    • Replies: @JR Ewing
  157. @Wielgus

    Interestingly the remnant SDP has since rebooted as a culturally conservative and anti-EU party.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  158. Jack D says:
    @Guest007

    Did you cut and paste that from a DNC fund raising email? Can you show any evidence that is what they are going to do?

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/06/27/abortion-2024-presidential-candidates/

    Trump and other potential Republican candidates (other than Pence) have taken a cautious line on abortion. Winning Alabama by 40 points instead of 20 does not help get you the White House. Swinging the votes of white suburban women in PA and Ohio, etc. DOES get you to the White House.

    Just because Dems would LIKE for Trump to act like a fool on abortion doesn’t mean that he will actually take them up on it. We already lived thru a Trump Administration and 99% of the things that Hillary supporters said that Trump would do, he never did, so no-one who is not an idiot should fall for that bullshit again.

  159. Daniel H says:

    The Republican establishment of the 60’s and early 7o’s were quite pleased with Roe. New York state legalized abortion in 1969 and at the time Governor Rockefeller crowed, “now all the issues that divide us are settled.” Ha.

    Warren Buffet and Charlie Munger are the archetypes of the old Republican establishment. Both are ardently pro-abortion. To my mind’s eye they both look like old-time abortion doctors: a cynical smile, barely concealing the ice water that flows in their veins. Two scary men.

    • Agree: Cagey Beast
  160. Shale boi says:

    Sort of a long and winding road of an essay. But in the end, well, not sure we get to the door, but still worth the read. I keep thinking that part of your appeal is the Connections style of thinking (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(British_documentary). I suspect this is associated with your quiz team background.

  161. Steve

    I come from a large Irish Catholic Family…….I find the clip from the Meaning of Life very offensive.

    Graham Chapman was a known homosexual pederast…..Eric Idle is a known enthusiast for the slaughter of Slavic Christian Russian Infants in Donbass…

    Ever here of the Sullivan Brothers? Monty Python was making fun of Irish Catholic Women such as the Sullivan Brother’s Mother…..

    If Monty Python had instead made a corresponding skit about Mrs. Muslim popping out Muslim babies on British Soil….well, you know the fate of Monty Python right afterwards….

    Monty Python is not cool anymore…..Monty Python never should have been cool…

  162. Carol says:

    Really, unless you were Catholic it didn’t seem like a big deal when Roe dropped in 1973. I followed the news but don’t recall much to-do about it.

    The men I knew weren’t sentimental about fatherhood. Hell, my father had wanted us aborted starting with No. 1 Son.

    I wonder if Time-Life’s intrauterine photographs that ran in the 1980s(?) didn’t contribute to a change of heart. Little to nothing is said about it but the photos were spectacular at the time.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Anonymous
  163. tyrone says:
    @Anon

    I don’t get British humor.

    ……What, you don’t think a man dressed as a woman is funny?, doesn’t Admiral Levine crack you up?

    • Troll: Hangnail Hans
  164. @Guest007

    In 2025 when the Republicans have control of the House, the Senate, and the White House, banning abortion at the national level will be their first priority even before an unfunded tax cut. Then all those who are currently talking about state control and state’s rights will have to disavow all of those discussions.

    Disagree.

    Conservatives have just spent the past 50 years since Roe, making the (correct) case against leftist judicial diktat specifically with Roe pointing out that it was Constitutional nonsense as the Constitution specifically leaves these sorts of issues to the people to decide in their states. Actually, making the case that this is the core of the Constitution, federalism and self-government.

    Trying to pass a Constitutionally bogus federal law would make that a joke.

    Plenty of anti-abortion folks do support some sort of pro-life constitutional amendment. But that’s going nowhere unless 3/4 of the states pass it. That is not happening. And if it was happening it would be preceded by large numbers of states passing their own abortion bans. It is a trivial dodge for Congressional Republicans to say that when states show there is sufficient support for a constitutional amendment they will pass it, and that the issue is in the state arena. (I could write reasonably compelling dodging rhetoric myself in a few minutes, certainly an hour.)

    The pressure is really now on Republican legislators in Republican states, who have electorates–or specifically their electoral coalition–that are split.

    People who care about abortion one way or another are going to have to orient their interest and energy toward state legislatures. That’s where the action is now–and where it always should have been.

    • Replies: @Guest007
    , @Hibernian
  165. Anonymous[954] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hhsiii

    McCartney and Harrison were baptized Catholic, although McCartney’s dad was Protestant agnostic and he was raised non-denominational. He had the happiest upbringing, aside from his mother dying young, which gave him a certain bond with Lennon.

    Lennon was raised Anglican. He had the most middle-class upbringing of the Beatles. Aunt Mimi hated Harrison’s heavy scouse accent and rocker scruffiness as a youngster.

    Ringo was raised Evangelical Anglican. Very poor growing up.

    From all the interviews of the boys, they seemed far more class conscious than religious. Since I was raised mostly middle-class (my parents business became very successful in my teen years), I understood their sensibilities, verbal shorthand and jokes from the start.

    I recall Ringo saying, far from living a poverty life, he got everything he asked for as a child, and was somewhat spoiled. He just didn’t ask his parents for anything crazy. That is a very middle-class thing for someone to say. I got everything I wanted, but I always begged for things I knew they could afford.

    I got numerous motorbikes, but always found old beat up used ones for my parents to buy. I talked them into a new one once, in my early teens, and was amazed that I got it. But I still asked for the cheaper one, than the one I actually wanted, because the one I wanted was too goddamned expensive, I thought.

    Very, very middle-class.

    So, I “got” the Beatles, and the Beatles got me from the get-go. McCartney is so middle-class, he’s almost retarded. He always tries to make things right. As far off the rails as Lennon got, I always knew he’d go back to his middle-class roots.

    “Now you know better than that,” was a phrase invented by the middle-class.

    I’m sure John’s Aunt Mimi said that to John, all the time. And she was right.

    • Replies: @Bill Jones
    , @Anonymous
    , @Anon
  166. Art Deco says:
    @Jack D

    Half disagree. Mrs. Kennedy was still handsome at age 60. If she had ‘work done’, her plastic surgeon was subtle and circumspect. Hair probably colored, but perhaps not. Mrs. Truman at age 34 was plain, Mrs. Roosevelt dumpy. Prior to about 1970, it was the mode for married women to make style choices that diminished their feminine charms. Mrs. Coolidge and Mrs. Kennedy were exceptions.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    , @Brutusale
  167. @Prester John

    Did this tension manifest itself elsewhere e.g. West Germany which was ~ half and half Prod vs R Catholic ….or perhaps Germany’s divisions were more regional, North vs South in addition to the Cold War partition

  168. @Hangnail Hans

    The effort was to get people to care about something even if it didn’t yet affect them personally. Words like prudence and empathy come to mind.

    No this was a disgusting orgy of lying designed to–once again–deny and hide and minimize the misbehavior of a minority group, then blame ordinary normal people for the results of that misbehavior and make them bear the cost. (See “black crime” for a good analogy.)

    Sympathy is for people who are unlucky or who make the sort of ordinary mistakes humans routinely make, but get a particularly bad result. I have appropriate sympathy for homosexuals being dealt a shitty hand–at least the ones who accept that they’ve been dealt a shitty hand and do not seek to dump that shittiness upon me or our culture.

    Neither sympathy nor empathy is no more appropriate for homosexuals–continuing to sodomize multiple partners in the midst of a serious VD epidemic–than it is for some asshole who drives 150 miles per hour on the highway and crashes into other cars. “Rot in hell” is actually the appropriate emotion.

    • Replies: @Charon
  169. Guest007 says:
    @AnotherDad

    If the feds can pass the Americans will Disability Act and make it stick in all 50 states, then the feds can pass a statute outlawing abortion/birth control/IVF/surrogacy. Since all healthcare is basically interstate commerce and practitioners in all 50 states accept Medicare/Medicaid funding and all health care providers have to worry about accreditation to get paid by the feds, there are many hooks the feds can use. Conservatives will not have to bother with an amendment.

    Also, one should not confuse the excuses given the right or the Supreme Court for overturning Case (the real precedent) and Roe versus the outcome. Alito has been planning on banning abortion for over 35 years and finally got his wish. Social Conservatives want abortion banned at the federal level and thus, it will occur or Republican office holders will be voted out of office. Either the Supreme Court will give legal personhood to fertilized eggs or abortion procedures and drugs will be outlawed at the federal level.

    • Replies: @epebble
    , @J.Ross
  170. @martin_2

    “That sketch from “The Meaning of Life” seems so dated,”

    That’s the point. Despite all the talk of Roe v. Wade at the moment, the mental atmosphere of the men who voted for it in 1973 is hard to reconstruct in 2022.

    • Agree: Houston 1992
  171. @prime noticer

    original ruling was 3 months? if so, another case of give the left an inch, they take a mile.

    The smaller headline a tiny bit down (and to the left) says “StateBansRuledOut Until Last 10 Weeks”.

  172. prosa123 says:
    @Jack D

    Photos of a young Eleanor Roosevelt make it obvious that her looks deteriorated greatly with age. She started out well enough.
    Trivia: her maiden name was also Roosevelt. Although Franklin was only her fifth cousin the connection was through the male line so the names were the same.

    • Replies: @Old Bruin
    , @JR Ewing
  173. @Anonymous

    I went to the same Grammar school as Lennon. The Masters wore robes as did the prefects. I was in the first year not to have compulsory Latin which was still taught with Greek also offered. Working class it wasn’t.

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTTTi0gDZArd7cAbiB59SfISILjWQPtQh72FvqoJ5T7KiAxWL__R68K0OJSqIb1VA8J9ro&usqp=CAU

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  174. @Observator

    “Catholic Church has always hated and feared sexual pleasure”

    Yet Catholic girls are the best girls … how so ?

  175. Joe Joe says:
    @J.Ross

    I should be surprised at this horrible injustice but it’s Minnesota 🙁
    Reverse the races and it is Derek Chauvin #2

    • Agree: HammerJack
    • Replies: @Charon
  176. Flip says:
    @Hhsiii

    Unclear if Catholic or Anglican, but it is Anglican/CofE.

  177. Dube says:
    @Whereismyhandle


    What is Grace Kelly thinking?

    • Replies: @Charon
    , @Hhsiii
  178. epebble says:
    @Guest007

    If the feds can pass the Americans will Disability Act and make it stick in all 50 states, then the feds can pass a statute outlawing abortion/birth control/IVF/surrogacy.

    If feds can pass the CARES Act and make it stick in all 50 states, then feds can pass a statute outlawing XYZ.

    XYZ = Tobacco;
    XYZ = Alcohol;
    XYZ = Coffee;
    XYZ = Teaching of Evolution;
    XYZ = Eating Kosher food;
    XYZ = Not eating Kosher food;
    XYZ = Eating Halal food;
    XYZ = Not eating Halal food;
    ???
    ???

    Asleep in the Civics Class. Huh?

  179. @Waylon Sisko

    “they miss the institutions that they ridiculed”

    In Life Of Brian there’s a scene where the PFLJ (or is it the JPLF?) are writing “Romans Go Home” in bad Latin on a wall, and the centurion who catches them makes them write it on the wall in correct Latin 20 times, or 100, I forget.

    That will mean zilch to any modern child, as AFAIK the days of being given “lines” at school and having to write the same thing out again and again have vanished.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Writing_lines

    “That will do, Bunter ! You will write out the date 1688 five hundred times after class! After which,” added Mr. Quelch, with almost ferocious sarcasm, “you will perhaps remember at least one date in English history, Bunter.”
    The prospect of remembering at least one date in English history did not seem to console Billy Bunter very much. His fat face was lugubrious, as the clock-hand crawled slowly round, until at last the welcome hour of dismissal came.

    • Replies: @James J. O'Meara
  180. J.Ross says:
    @Guest007

    What department do you work in?

  181. @Dchjk

    A thousand times YES.

    I know they had their influence, but eventually we have to let them go peacefully into the night. Does anybody still mention Dean Martin or Bing Crosby? Johnny Ray was big, but nobody knows who he was anymore.

  182. J.Ross says:
    @War for Blair Mountain

    Pretty much every entertainer ever is a piece of garbage except for their actual entertainment skill. If you choose entertainers based on what they do offstage, you’re not only doing it wrong, you’re probably being inconsistent. And people who derive their political views from entertainers are children.

  183. Anonymous[181] • Disclaimer says:

    But finally, a Catholic was elected President. Then, in likely the single most memorable moment of the second half of the 20th Century, a dirty Commie murdered him in front of his beautiful wife.

    Most observers agree that what we think of as The Sixties didn’t start until JFK’s assassination, but almost nobody can explain why. My guess is that 11/22/1963 ended the old Catholic Question, which suddenly allowed new ones, such as the Generational Question, to flourish when the Beatles arrives a few months later.

    Another interpretation of why JFK’s death marked the start of the 1960s would be that the last two factions of the New Deal standing were the Irish coalition (Internationalist Democrats) and the Jewish coalition (nameless, but essentially the Left and the Jewish influence in the labor unions and the media), the others (Polish, Italians) had been knocked out of contention by JFK’s Presidency. JFK opened with a DOJ offensive against organized crime, Jewish and Italian. That offensive ended with JFK’s death, the election of LBJ, and the offensive against the Democratic Convention. These events marked the end of the Internationalist Democrats and the ascendency of the Jewish coalition that dominated US politics until very recently, but now seems to be losing its grip.

  184. Utterly OT, but an interesting piece by a Western journalist who’s spent a lot of time in Russia and thinks intellectual opinion there is hardening even among the anti-Putin people. This bit of potted history was relevant.

    For a time, from the fall of the Soviet Union to the mid-1990s, the attitude of most of the Russian intelligentsia to the West was one of blind adulation, and the change from this went through a whole series of stages. The shift began with the decision to expand NATO, generally seen in Russia as a betrayal. Fear of NATO expansion grew with NATO’s attack on Serbia during the Kosovo War. The U.S. invasion of Iraq in 2003 was widely seen as proof that the United States wished to impose rules on others that it had no intention of keeping itself.

    A key turning point came with the offer of future NATO membership to Ukraine and Georgia in 2008, followed by the Georgian attack on Russian positions in South Ossetia, and the West’s misrepresentation of this as a Russian attack on Georgia. Western support for the Ukrainian revolution of 2014, generally seen in Russia as a nationalist coup against an elected president, finally doomed genuine rapprochement between Russian centrist intellectuals and their Western counterparts.

    However, Russian hopes for some form of limited compromise either with America or Europe lingered on for many years. Realists to the core themselves, members of the Russian establishment found it hard to understand why America, faced with intractable problems in the Middle East and the rise of a powerful China, did not seek to reduce tensions with the far less dangerous Russia. Similarly, they were bewildered by what they have seen as a European failure to understand that with Russia as a friend, they would face no military threat on their own continent.

    Three developments in particular kept these hopes alive. First, the French and German brokerage of the “Minsk II” peace agreement over the Donbas in 2015 allowed the Russians to believe in the possibility of an agreement with Paris and Berlin over Ukraine — though this hope faded as the French and Germans did nothing to get Ukraine actually to implement the agreement. Then the election of Donald Trump in 2016 gave hope of a friendlier America, a split between Europe and America, or both. And finally, the Biden administration’s prioritization of China as a threat revived hopes of diminished U.S. hostility to Russia.

    Russian hopes for co-operation with France and Germany could revive if these governments seek a compromise peace in Ukraine — with or without the United States. Failing that, however, Trenin’s article indicates that not just Putin’s inner circle, but much of the wider Russian establishment, will approach the war in Ukraine in a spirit of grim determination, at least until there is a possibility of a peace agreement that meets basic Russian conditions.

    https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2022/06/06/why-russian-intellectuals-are-hardening-support-for-war-in-ukraine/

    • Thanks: Cagey Beast
    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
  185. @Wokechoke

    I suspect that popular music is a sort of industrial Death Scream, like the sounds of the Quarries, Pits, Mills and Docks translated into a song or beat. Then they vanish. Gone for good.

    The gritty northern cities– Manchester, not Liverpool, being the prime example– spawned bubble-gummy bands like the Beatles and the Hollies, while (relatively) spoiled suburban Londoners (Stones, Who, Yardbirds) drifted toward the blues and other gritty music.

    It’s almost like they were seeking out what they didn’t have. Offhand I can’t think of any British counterparts to the Beach Boys, who celebrated the paradise they grew up in. The Bee Gees come to mind, but they, although Manx, had been living in Australia when they hit it big.

  186. J.Ross says:
    @epebble

    This isn’t true. SSE was essentially a dishonest alibi. It has an unrelated group plunged into aberrant chastity and the single most at-risk group blithely ignoring basic rules because no rules apply to them, with disastrous consequences.

    • Replies: @epebble
  187. @Hypnotoad666

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

    It depends on whether you are a fetus.

    He wanted to know how it would benefit him, not us.

    Very interesting post, Steve!

  188. Anonymous[272] • Disclaimer says:

    Further to your crypto-WASP/William O. Douglas outdoorsman theory: Look at the current media gambit from the other Warren, Liz, to operate abortion services in the national parks (with apologies to Ken Burns, but this sounds like “A Better Idea For America’s Best Idea”).

    I don’t think the bluebloods who drive the modern progressive car have deep practical understanding of modern culture/economy interconnections but they definitely haven’t lost their religion. Personally I prefer the anti-sentimentality of the Old Bostonians.

  189. @R.G. Camara

    I’m not convinced at all that Michelangelo or Leonardo engaged in buggery, but if they had, then you are forced to throw them out as well. No more Sistine Chapel or Last Supper for you. They are garbage.

  190. Anonymous[263] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    From all the interviews of the boys, they seemed far more class conscious than religious.

    They were class-aware but not class conscious. Lennon put on that angry working class mask post-Beatles for ideological cred and mark of authenticity. But he wasn’t into prole consciousness in his youth. He was usually just a hooligan, a prankster, and later a bohemian with Stu Sutcliffe as friend.

    And Lennon and McCartney cared mostly about pop culture and fashions than anything overtly to do with class.

    Brian Epstein was much more privileged, and the Beatles got along with him just fine. And at the concert before the queen, it was all jokes, no angst.

    Harrison and Ringo were mostly indifferent on social issues. Aloof and amused.

    Post-war youth culture did much to undermine class distinctions in UK as everyone, from high to low, were listening to the kind of music that made everyone rub shoulders in frenzied heat.

    As for religiosity, it affects even the irreligious, not as theology but as customs and habits. Secular Jews are still culturally Jewish, and there is a still a strain of puritanism among certain East Coast types though they’re puritanical about the latest social crazes.

  191. HFR says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    Intelligent Dasein: OK, I’ll bite. I re-read your comment on the previous abortion thread. Here’s my response: Your view that men should not let women work outside the house without chaperones made we wonder who exactly these chaperones should be. Grandmothers? And how would that work in an office setting? For waitresses? In a factory? What about the 3 female Supreme Court Justices? I think you’ve just created a new profession.

  192. Anonymous[272] • Disclaimer says:
    @jejej

    It isn’t misogynist* to observe that public reaction in the main against Dobbs has had nothing to do with pro’s/con’s or the logistical delivery of abortion. It’s patently a primal scream over diminution of status and power. The pro-choice protesters may know little of nuts and bolts of running the abortion complex but completely and intuitively grasp intersectional stacking. That is why the simpler ones are trying to force boilerplate about trans-abortions, unleashing destructive interference from the TERFs however.

    *(shallow buzzword, like “homophobe” which I haven’t heard lately — to paraphrase G. Grass, those homophobic legions are very slow in getting through the door.)

  193. Anonymous[954] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bill Jones

    I went to the same Grammar school as Lennon. The Masters wore robes as did the prefects. I was in the first year not to have compulsory Latin which was still taught with Greek also offered. Working class it wasn’t.

    English education was of a higher standard then. If you look at Lennon’s house he grew up in, that’s middle-class. If you watch Lennon’s auntie, she is solid middle-class… and she loved it.

  194. @Anon

    If abortion restrictions make women take sex more seriously, then they would be salutary. If abortion restrictions mean more K-selected couples have children, then they would be eugenic. But if abortion restrictions mean more r-selected women have children, then they would be dysgenic.

    I really don’t know whether abortion is eugenic or dysgenic. For that matter, I don’t know whether birth control is eugenic or dysgenic. There is an argument that birth control de-selects for people with foresight and ability to plan.

    My personal view is that abortion coarsens society in a very awful and warped way. Notice how we are masking and jabbing young children and teaching them that humans are biological weapons to each other, just so meemaw can draw another year of Medicare and Social Security.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  195. ” to legalize abortion largely unchecked through six months of pregnancy.”

    six months? How about nine. Did even one parental consent law ever pass muster? That was the most galling thing of all. Not only can you not stop a 12 yo from getting an abortion … you can’t even require the doctor to notify her parents.

    Pure genocide.

    • Agree: Hibernian
  196. @War for Blair Mountain

    Ever here [sic] of the Sullivan Brothers?

    You mean those five thugs from small-town Iowa who insisted on serving on the same ship, and paid for it? Perhaps the end of their lives was noble, but little else about them was. The sixth brother remained at home. If he was the “white sheep”, this was eugenics in action.

    My grandfather and five of his six brothers served in the previous war. There isn’t much difference between the two families, except ours wasn’t hated by the neighbors.

  197. J1234 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Until they opened their mouths about Jesus in ’66, the Beatles weren’t nearly considered as controversial as Elvis in the ’50’s. Accusations of “vulgar”, “lewd”, and “degenerate” were thrown around in Presley’s direction.

    Negative perceptions about popular music existed well before Elvis. When I was a teenager in the 1970’s, it was popular for the media to portray rock and roll from the 1950’s (which had become popular again due to a huge nostalgia craze) as being opposed by a post-war “puritanism” that sought to suppress sexual content in music. There was some truth to that, but I think it may have been exaggerated a bit in the ’70’s to give these older performers a “relevance” to counter-culture 1960’s music, which was still fresh in the public’s ears. However, being that the music of Elvis was fairly black in style and content, it actually was (by nature) kind of vulgar, lewd and degenerate.

    Nevertheless, it’s a little surprising how asexual the Beatles’ music was, at least when compared to earlier singers like Elvis. Of course, huge numbers of teenage girls were attracted to the Beatles back in the day, and they existed in a pop culture environment that would evolve/devolve into so called “free love”, but even love songs like Something seem somewhat detached from aggressive sexuality when compared to ’50’s music.

    I think that young white audiences of the early to mid-1960’s had tired of overly emotive and more overtly black influenced rock and roll of the 1950’s, being drawn to a more intelligent (or at least intelligently constructed) music that they could better relate to. A similar movement away from black pop music happened in the early 1980’s when New Wave and the like kind of copped the style and vibe of mid-60’s British Invasion groups.

  198. @J.Ross

    I’m attacking Monty Python for what they did in MEANING OF LIFE…

  199. By my estimate, The Beatles were each at least 70% Catholic by their roots. George seemed to be the one who was the most identifiably Catholic, and Ringo the least. But I later ran across the fact that Starkey is an Irish name. And an Irish-Catholic name.

    “Starkey The name, with its variant forms Starkie and Starkey, is in Ireland since the 14th Century”

    (pre Reformation). Indeed the Wiki-famous Walter Starkie, W. J. M. Starkie, and Edyth Starkie are all Catholics.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  200. Anon[957] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mike Tre

    I don’t see anything narcissistic or pathological about asking how proposed policy changes in my country benefit me as a citizen and a voter. One of the reasons I decided I didn’t like the Left was that I noticed they were encouraging everyone else to form groups to lobby for their interests while I’m supposed to be driven by some selfless universalistic morality.

  201. epebble says:
    @J.Ross

    Safe Sex education teaches one to be careful who one has sex with and use protection. What harm can come out of it? I haven’t seen any disastrous consequences. Where are you seeing them?

  202. Anonymous[332] • Disclaimer says:
    @MEH 0910

    But Gilliam is responsible for some very bad movies.

  203. @Reg Cæsar

    You could have picked thousands of other Irish Catholic Families during WW2(such as your mother or grandmother)….Monty Python would never never have had made a skit mocking Pakistani Muslim Mothers popping out Muslim babies-this is the point jackass…..

    • Replies: @martin_2
  204. TWS says:
    @Observator

    No. You’d be surprised what is and is not allowed between a married couple as long as the goal is not contraception.

  205. Anonymous[332] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jay Fink

    Not just protestant vs catholic.

    Race factor too as welfare made black single mothers a thing. They were having babies out of wedlock like crazy, and abortion was one way of controlling black birth rates.

  206. Anonymous[110] • Disclaimer says:

    The second is one of the more extraordinary American developments of the latter half of the 20th Century, but nobody remembers it because nobody remembers how strong the Protestant vs. Catholic rivalry was up until JFK’s martyrdom put him in the pantheon of American heroes and more or less satisfied Catholic desire for representation at the highest level in American national mythology.

    This is a good point. One of the major books in the ’50s was “American Freedom and Catholic Power”, which reflected the worry that the waning WASP establishment along with liberal and non-Catholic intellectuals like John Dewey, Einstein, and Bertrand Russell had about Catholic demographics and influence at the time:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Freedom_and_Catholic_Power

    American Freedom and Catholic Power is an anti-Catholic[1] book by American writer Paul Blanshard, published in 1949 by Beacon Press. Blanshard asserted that America had a “Catholic problem” in that the Church was an “undemocratic system of alien control”. The book has been described as propaganda[2] and as “the most unusual bestseller of 1949–1950”.[3] Some reviewers thought that the book incorporated nativist sentiments into its anti-Catholicism, including that the Church was a foreign power in America determined to dominate the world.[4][5] In the prologue, Blanshard said that he was not opposed to the Catholic religion or to Catholic Americans, but that the church’s hierarchy had an undue influence on legislation, education and medical practice.

    The book began as a controversial series of articles in The Nation that set the Archbishop of New York against Eleanor Roosevelt. Despite some resistance, it became a bestseller, winning praise from well-known intellectuals. Catholic writers denounced it as bigoted and based on longstanding Protestant bias.

    • Replies: @Peter D. Bredon
  207. Anonymous[378] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dchjk

    Elvis, Beatles, and Monty were special.

    What will Zoomers look back on as markers of y0uth? Now, that is a depressing thought.

    • LOL: Kylie
  208. Right_On says:

    what we think of as The Sixties didn’t start until JFK’s assassination.

    Coincidentally, The Beatles’ second album, With The Beatles, was released in the UK that same day (22nd Nov 63).
    The final year of the (cultural) Sixties should perhaps be 1974, when Patty Hearst (“Tania”) was kidnapped by the Symbionese [sic] Liberation Army; the sex ‘n’ drugs ‘n’ radical leftism of the previous ten years culminating in a nihilistic dead end.

    • Replies: @Curle
  209. Anonymous[154] • Disclaimer says:

    It’s hard to believe today, but Donald Trump’s pastor at Marble Collegiate Church, the late Norman Vincent Peale, who is now associated with Positive Thinking and woolly headed, soft and tolerant Christianity, was a vehement anti-Catholic in the 50s/60s and opposed JFK on those grounds. Nixon also attended Marble Collegiate when he practiced law in New York, and Peale officated at the Eisenhower/Nixon wedding:

    https://www.nytimes.com/1993/12/26/obituaries/norman-vincent-peale-preacher-of-gospel-optimism-dies-at-95.html

    Although still a vast commercial success in the 1960’s, Dr. Peale’s public power was diminished with the election of President John F. Kennedy, whom he had opposed, citing fear of Vatican interference. During the 1960 Presidential campaign, Dr. Peale attended several meetings with other prominent Protestant clergyman to rally concern about the possibility of a Roman Catholic in the White House.

    When the sessions were disclosed, other religious leaders, including Reinhold Niebuhr and Rabbi Maurice N. Eisendrath, accused Dr. Peale and the others of “blind prejudice.”

    Dr. Peale was quoted as saying at that time: “Faced with the election of a Catholic, our culture is at stake,” but he was later to withdraw this opinion, although he still clearly favored Richard M. Nixon in the election.

    In 1962 Mr. Nixon lost the California gubernatorial election and moved to New York to practice law. Mr. Nixon had first worshiped at Marble Collegiate while serving in the Navy during the war, and he now took his family to the church, although he was still nominally a member of a Quaker congregation in California. Some political analysts have suggested that Mr. Nixon gained the strength for his 1968 comeback from listening to Dr. Peale’s familiar message about overcoming doubts.

    After Mr. Nixon’s election, Dr. Peale officiated at the wedding of David Eisenhower and Julie Nixon at Marble Collegiate on Dec. 22, 1968. In 1969 President Nixon sent Dr. Peale as a special envoy to Vietnam, and the minister remained a family friend during the Watergate investigations.

  210. Mike Tre says:

    Oh, and by the way, Steve posted this mostly to promote his inference from the previous abortion post that jews had nothing, nothing! to do with the legalization of abortion. The reference to the Beatles was merely a little more smoke in the screen.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    , @Bardon Kaldian
  211. Rich says:
    @flyingtiger

    Souter, apparently, was beaten up in a DC park in the middle of the night while looking for a date in the public restrooms. These are the types of people who make the major decisions that affect our country. Degenerates and political hacks held up as wise scholars. Imagine, a man who by day was sitting on the Supreme Court, was spending his nights on his knees in dirty men’s rooms. Disgraceful.

  212. Hibernian says:

    …That, amazingly, the more downscale half of Protestantism would come to agree that the Papists were right about abortion being grotesque.

    Right reason.

    The natural law that can be known by people of all faiths or no faith at all.

    Faith illuminated by Reason and Reason illuminated by Faith.

    • Replies: @kahein
    , @Peter D. Bredon
  213. Philip Neal says: • Website
    @Reg Cæsar

    The songs of the Kinks, from a rather later era Madness, and (for those with ears to hear) the Rolling Stones – all from the outer London suburbs – are suffused with the sheer self-satisfaction which is the birthright of every freeborn English humbug.

  214. Art Deco says:
    @Dchjk

    Monty Python was not broadcast in the United States until 1974. It can be appreciated by anyone, but its strongest appeal is to junior high populations, i.e. post-Boomer.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Ian M.
  215. Hibernian says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    McCartney is a ringer for my ambulance chasing cousin.

  216. J.Ross says:

    OT — OH NO NO NO NO

  217. Hibernian says:
    @FPD72

    This man played a role and it began before Roe:

    https://henrycenter.tiu.edu/programs/harold-o-j-brown-award-for-student-scholarship/harold-o-j-brown/

    He worked together with Catholics.

    There was a liberal trend in conservative denominations at that time and also some people were wary of getting involved in what waas viewed as a Catholic cause.

  218. Ian Smith says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Islam perfectly suits Afghanistan, especially Pashtun. Violent, simplistic, obsessed with vengeance. Indeed, the only problem the average Afghan male has with the Taliban is the ban on Bacha Bazi.

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  219. kahein says:
    @Guest007

    yeah, ofc they will. this reversal literally has no other point than as a raw assertion of christian-theocratic power. not one person will change their morality on account of it. maybe there’ll be few humiliores who are more careful about unprotected sex because of the increased pain in the ass of discarding the potential issue — but that’s literally the opposite of morality

    • Troll: R.G. Camara
  220. SFG says:
    @R.G. Camara

    Yeah, you explained what I was alluding to. Thanks for the hints-I will try to find them on YouTube!

  221. kahein says:
    @Hibernian

    not one person will become christian or ‘moral’ because of this ruling, or lol “acquire faith.” in what?

    the objective and essentially completed decline of christianity as a viable spiritual enterprise will not be reversed; scientific, technological, economic trends will not even register this as a blip; not one vote will be gained (but many, potentially, lost, as the country is overwhelming against this decision, most importantly — 60% of registered independents)

    basically a handful of people at the absolute bottom of the social-economic scale will be hassled or intimidated into having a child they don’t want — and that’s it

    meanwhile, a new generation of already fully secularized kids will be radicalized, as every stereotype they have of you as obsolete regressive hinterlands freaks will be confirmed

    remember, stereotypes are true! right, steve?

  222. Ian M. says:
    @Jack D

    Is this true? The original anti-contraception crusader was Anthony Comstock, himself a Connecticut Yankee. Comstock, who started out in the Grant Administration, was in his later years admired by a young J. Edgar Hoover, another Protestant.

    Indeed, but Margaret Sanger changed everything. She consciously attempted to win Protestants over to the birth control cause with a two-pronged strategy: 1) attack the Catholic Church; 2) align herself with the Progressive Eugenics Movement. Both of these appealed to mainline Protestants, and she was ultimately very successful in manipulating them into supporting her cause. For the most part, she ignored more conservative Protestant churches (although the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod was a notable exception) that continued also to denounce contraception, focusing the preponderance of her attacks on the Catholic Church.

    https://www.touchstonemag.com/archives/article.php?id=24-01-039-f&readcode=&readtherest=true#therest

    From the linked article, a couple passages that support Sailer’s thesis, except as applied to contraception rather than to abortion:

    Liberal Christians needed little convincing [of the benefits of eugenics], though, for eugenics played directly into the ideals of the Social Gospel, especially the post-millennial goal of creating the Kingdom of God on earth through human action and social reform. Eugenics allowed leading Protestants to reconcile their fear of being displaced by Roman Catholics with the optimism of the Social Gospel. Birth control would be their tool. While few Protestants openly called for family limitation among Roman Catholics and other “inferior” peoples, this was their implicit goal. Eugenics gave them scientific, “progressive” cover.

    And:

    Considering the higher fecundity of Roman Catholics when compared to Protestants, [William R. Inge, the dean of St. Paul’s Cathedral in London] proclaimed that a “high birth-rate always indicates a low state of civilization,” which he saw in Ireland, Italy, Poland, and other Catholic lands. In the face of primitive Catholic fecundity and with “England now breeding from the slums,” the eugenic case for birth control grew urgent. Inge traveled to America in early 1925, lecturing on behalf of eugenic groups.

  223. Ian M. says:
    @R.G. Camara

    Good take. Yes, Python can be hilarious, but they were clearly a subversive group and enemies of Christian civilization.

    • Agree: Rogue
  224. Anonymous[204] • Disclaimer says:
    @War for Blair Mountain

    I come from a large Irish Catholic Family…….I find the clip from the Meaning of Life very offensive.

    You missed the point then, as it’s lampooning not just of Irish Catholics but English Protestants as well.

    It’s mocking the Puritanical, middle-class English Prod types who were traditionally stereotyped as being sexless, bloodless, joyless grinds obsessed with working, thrift, profit, saving.

  225. Hibernian says:
    @AnotherDad

    I think a law against interstate abortion trafficking (not women deciding on their own to go to another state but advertised bus tours like those to casinos etc.) would be a good idea but nothing further.

  226. SFG says:
    @Beach Jim

    At the time of production, those were liberal viewpoints. Conservatives still believed in the free market.

  227. Hibernian says:
    @James J. O'Meara

    blockquote>Also, it shows that the Nativists and Know Nothings like Bill the Butcher were right to oppose Irish (i.e. Catholic) immigration.

    Mr. O’ Meara, do you perhaps have some family issues?

  228. I am not Russell Brand’s biggest fan, and he doesn’t always get things right in his Youtube podcast, but this is a pretty darn good analysis of the politics of Roe vs Wade, and focuses on how many politicians including Clinton, George Bush, and Biden have changed their publicly expressed opinions over the years, presumably for reasons of political expediency.

    Like Steve Sailer he notes the interesting way in which party alignment on the issue, which hardly existed at the time of the original ruling, has gradually acted like a deteriorating battery with chemical reactions corroding both poles.

  229. Art Deco says:
    @Mike Tre

    Again, the Justices who issued the two decisions, the counsel for the plaintiffs, and the straw plaintiffs themselves had one thing in common: none were Jewish. At the time of the Casey decision 19 years later, again, there were no Jews on the court. The list of counsel for the petitioner was long: Thomas E. Zemaitis, Stephen J. Cipolla, Jody Kathleen Marcus, Linda Wharton, Kathryn Kolbert, Roger K.Evans, Dara Klassel, and Seth Kreimer. (Marcus, Kolbert, Klassel, and Kreimer are Jewish).

  230. Old Bruin says:
    @prosa123

    Although Franklin was only her fifth cousin the connection was through the male line so the names were the same.

    Eleanor Roosevelt’s father, Elliott Roosevelt, and Franklin D Roosevelt were fifth cousins, making Eleanor Roosevelt and FDR fifth cousins, once removed. Elliott Roosevelt’s older brother happened to be Teddy Roosevelt, so TR and FDR were also fifth cousins.

    Elliott Roosevelt died young at age 34, so when it came time for Eleanor to marry FDR, it was none other than Teddy Roosevelt who walked her down the aisle to give away to Franklin Delano Roosevelt—perhaps foreshadowing a symbolic passing of the torch.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
  231. @Anon

    Can someone explain how banning abortion is going to benefit me?

    According to this Rowan Atkinson sketch, it may well save your life (starts at :29 sec.)

  232. @Hangnail Hans

    …the scheme was intended to allow the people of each state to make their own decisions on matters such as abortion.

    Should be most matters, barring clear and convincing arguments to the contrary, but it’s not. (Nearly all matters, some say.)

    Uh… tell that to Vice President Johnson. No, not Lyndon and not Andrew, but Richard M. He sent his men to invade Ohio to retrieve his runaway livestock, which happened to include the nieces of his late wife. Had they made it to Upper Canada, he probably would have respected that territory’s sovereignty, such as it were.

    Then there was the case of Peggy Garner, who murdered her daughter in front of multiple witnesses, again in Ohio. But another powerful man, again in Kentucky, managed to abscond her back across the river, and she ended up living out her life in a plush mansion in New Orleans. A stellar example of both sovereignty and justice!!

    And the nation was indeed created as a voluntary confederation of otherwise autonomous states, but the war of 1861-65 laid that notion to rest for good.

    If you think coercion began in 1861, you haven’t been paying attention. You can’t pin it on Alexander Hamilton, either. He refused to cast a single vote at the Constitutional Convention. Why he didn’t is quite telling. Look it up.

    CSA soldiers were not allowed internment in national cemeteries. Yet when I visited the one in Nashville, where my great-great-granduncle is buried, three years ago, there were a striking number of Tennessee boys laid to rest therein. Almost all were from the eastern counties. The “voluntary confederation” didn’t take into account their volition.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Hibernian
    , @Jack D
  233. Alyosha says:
    @Ian M.

    I was actually going bring up Margaret Sanger independently from you after reading this blog post from Steve. It’s notable that she was Ethnically Irish Catholic and grew up in an Irish Catholic family on both sides, and was number 51 on the Atlantic’s list of 100 most influential Americans. There was a trend of Ethnic Irish Catholic women and other ethnic white Catholic women of becoming progressives who tended to partially or fully disavowed their heritage and agree with the WASPs values, of course there were even more Jewish women who did this at the same time period though they tended to disavow their Jewishness less explicitly and just focus on the Progressive part.

    So Steve there were more than 3 ethnic Catholics on the 100 most influential Americans when you consider cases like the Irish Catholic Sanger. Number 88 Enrico Fermi was another baptized Catholic gentile Italian, but non-practicing, so that’s 5 at least.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  234. S Johnson says:
    @J1234

    The asexuality as well as the suits were the idea of the gay Brian Epstein who seemed to have a pretty good sense of what would most appeal to pubescent girls (e.g., keeping Lennon’s marriage quiet). The early Stones also wore suits but then seem to have realized that they were better off undercutting the Beatles as the sexy bad boy alternative.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  235. Nobody can remembers today, but it can make sense to consider the Roe decision as a Protestant ethnic victory over rising Catholic power.

    I mentioned Daniel K Williams’s history of the years preceding Roe above. From his depiction it is really quite striking how united Catholics, Protestants, and Jews were at the time- internally.

    •Catholics followed their Church and accepted the existing laws, which, interestingly enough, were written decades before by progressive Protestants. Their role was to block any change, and their help was likely appreciated by the few old-school Protestants remaining in the Northeastern states. (By the way, Rhode Island and Connecticut were the only states not to ratify Prohibition. Think about that for a moment.)

    •Jews, across their spectrum, generally held to the rabbinical teaching that the mother’s interests trump the developing child’s. Those who opposed liberal abortion policy did so more for societal reasons.

    •Likewise, Protestants both mainline and low-church were in the muddy middle, working for liberalization but not legalization. (There is a big difference there.) They generally found abortion distasteful and potentially corrupting, but were quite open to expanding the existing loopholes a bit. This is what the bill Reagan signed in California did, and all it did.

    What you didn’t see were the vast gulfs within these religious communities that we see now.

  236. @S Johnson

    The early Stones also wore suits but then seem to have realized that they were better off undercutting the Beatles as the sexy bad boy alternative.

    This was all Andrew Loog Oldham’s doing. Giorgio Gomelsky had managed them before and had left them to their own devices. The Stones are basically Loog Oldham’s creation, or re-creation:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Loog_Oldham#The_Rolling_Stones

    John Strausbaugh interviewed Gomelsky for his book Rock Till You Drop, and this offers up a lot of detail about the pre-Loog Oldham Stones. For one thing, Jagger himself called the boys of that day “sweet”.

  237. Wielgus says:
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    Terry Gilliam seemed to find the USA (his original country) to be uncongenial during the Vietnam War and he moved to Britain, which is how he ended up as part of Python. Brazil strikes me as rather subversive of the established order – police arrest people suddenly and truss them up to a ludicrous degree that almost seems a prophecy of Guantanamo and the “war on terror”, and it is noticeable that they like to threaten people they arrest with damage to their credit rating, which sounds to me like a rather sledgehammer critique of capitalism.

  238. @Spud Boy

    Riiiiightt….

    Reviewed all the evidence, have you?

    Bull hockey, my boy. You’d have to be 200 years old to “review all the evidence.” What a dork.

    Of course, the Zapruder head shot is so clearly uncharacteristic from the others, and with the limosine conveniently slowing to a crawl, an expert military-trained sniper with a scope had plenty of time to blow JFK’s head off from the grassy knoll.

    But, of course, all the witnesses to the grassy knoll shot were struck by bolts of lightning and were never able to be interviewed.

    Kinda like Lee Harvey Oswald leaving our company a bit too early.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  239. Anonymous[151] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bill

    To catch AIDS you almost always had to (a) be the subject in violent anal sex; (b) inject drugs carelessly with a syringe previously used by someone with AIDS; or, rarely, (c) be an unlucky hemophiliac who randomly gets his transfusion with blood from (a) or (b).

    The joke was: What’s the hardest thing about telling your mother you have AIDS? Answer: Convincing her you’re a Haitian.

    In AIDS circles there was overlap between a and b, so that would have made it even easier to zero in on the actual diseased and endangered population, quarantined ’em, whatever. But the idea of Fauci and his industry was to scare everybody, put everyone at risk, and…. well, sort of like today with Corona measures.

    They wanted to start AIDS “safe sex” training in kindergartens–literally. But teachers in Ding Dong School settings rebelled at exposing kids (and themselves) to talk of blood, death, condoms, “dental dams” etc., so in those days that kind of idea died. Today you have to pass a law or anything goes.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  240. Anon[360] • Disclaimer says:
    @Art Deco

    He didn’t specify American Boomers. There are absolutely tons of British Boomers who love Monty Python, and plenty of American ones as well.

  241. Wielgus says:
    @Hereward the Woke

    And is also totally fringe. I am a little intrigued that they claim the SDP’s logo and legacy while bearing so little resemblance to the original incarnation. The original SDP is not even remembered by anyone under the age of 50.

  242. @Tom Scarlett

    “Stewart had also been told that “women were coming into their own” by his daughter Harriet, “a strong, independent woman.”

    One who ended her life as a lonely spinster cat lady, one assumes?

  243. @The Anti-Gnostic

    It’s not just cognitive decline; beyond age 65 you really are from a different country. The governing class needs to be from people still in the mix: active taxpayers and decision-makers.

    Ach quatsch! Look at Joe Biden, 79 yrs. old and just entering the prime of his life.

    • Agree: Wielgus
    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  244. Wielgus says:
    @War for Blair Mountain

    Monty Python was pretty middle class. The line from Monty Python And The Holy Grail about “tiny-brained wipers of other peoples’ bottoms” was less funny for me after a relative got a job as a nurse looking after people unable to see to their own hygiene needs. Clearly Monty Python members never had to find such work.

    • Agree: Houston 1992
    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  245. Curle says:
    @SFG

    I imagine that it came to be associated with the sexual licentiousness that grew out of the hippy movement and beyond. Not only were sexual norms falling but babies were paying with their lives because of it.

    • Agree: Thoughts
    • Replies: @Thoughts
  246. Curle says:
    @J.Ross

    A decisive minority knows nothing and an absolute majority knows things that aren’t true about our history.

  247. James Morris on Birth Control
    https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4915692/james-morris-birth-control

    That’s a one minute video of the busybody who started the ball rolling with the Griswold case.

    The ‘biblical view’ that’s younger than the Happy Meal
    https://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/2012/02/18/the-biblical-view-thats-younger-than-the-happy-meal/

    Few people know that until quite recently Evangelicals didn’t give a hoot about the issue of abortion. So what turned them into fanatics?

    Broken words : the abuse of science and faith in American politics
    https://archive.org/details/brokenwordsabuse0000dudl

    That little book tells the story of how some extremely clever agents of the Vatican used the issue of All-American Racism to do the trick.

    Packing the Supreme Court with fanatical Catholics was all it took to satisfy the brand new doctrine of the Precious Unborn.

    • Thanks: kahein
  248. Curle says:
    @Right_On

    Also the same year Jefferson Airplane disbanded and Jefferson Starship was formed.

    • Thanks: Right_On
  249. ATBOTL says:

    The deeper history is that strongly anti-Catholic Protestants in the 1800’s tended to be pro-zionist and anti-white. Anti-Catholic and anti-Irish sentiment was usually found among the same people who supported radical reconstruction and Chinese immigration. Pro-white Protestants, such as Protestant labor leaders and politicians who opposed non-white immigration, tended not to be strongly anti-Catholic. Protestant Democrats and Irish and German immigrants overthrew the Radical Republicans and ended the Asian coolie immigration invasion in the 1880’s era.

    Once you understand this background, things happening now make more sense. The same types of Protestant white people are in the same roles, but have switched parties.

    The larger pattern goes back to early English Puritans being hostile to the Catholic church and valorizing jews and muslims in their writings. Anyone who was in conflict with Catholics was good by their reasoning. This lead to things like some Protestants fighting for muslims against Christians in Eastern Europe and later Protestant/liberal actions against Christian interests like the Crimean war and the Iraq Invasion. By the same logic, pagan Chinese and muslim Malay immigrants were preferable to white Catholic immigrants to some WASP elite types after the Civil War.

  250. Acilius says: • Website
    @Flip

    Years ago I read a book about the 1944 presidential election which reported that FDR’s representatives actually tried to reach Douglas to offer him the second spot on the ticket. But the Justice was hiking in a remote part of Oregon, and by the time he got back to general store where they’d left his telephone messages Truman had been nominated.

    • Replies: @Anymike
  251. @Art Deco

    Mrs. Onassis did age well, considering that at 45 she was a widow twice over. She died young at 64 and left an estate of \$43.7 million.

    • Replies: @Curle
    , @Buzz Mohawk
  252. @Old Bruin

    TR and FDR were also fifth cousins

    Teddy’s son Teddy III was appointed Governor-General of the Philippines by Herbert Hoover in February 1932 after stints as Governor of Puerto Rico and Assistant Secretary of the Navy. When FDR was elected that November, Teddy III was asked how he was related to the president elect. He responded “Fifth cousin, about to removed”. Indeed, FDR did replace Teddy III that July in favor of a Frank Murphy, a Democrat and future Attorney General and Supreme Court Justice.

    Teddy III eventually died in Méautis, France, in July 1944, and is buried in Normandy.

  253. Charon says:
    @Joe Joe

    Yeah, especially if she was overdosing on illegal drugs, violently resisting arrest, with a rap sheet half a mile long, etc etc.

    And Derek Chauvin did shoot Floyd completely without provocation, right? Yeah, I think that’s what I’ve read.

    • Agree: Joe Joe, HammerJack
  254. Charon says:
    @Dube

    What is Grace Kelly thinking?

    “I bet I could land this stud, if only I didn’t have this stupid mop on my head.”

    • Replies: @Dube
  255. duncsbaby says:
    @J.Ross

    Noor shot an unarmed woman dead and gets out of jail after only a couple years. Chauvin has his knee to the back of the neck of a counterfeiter dying of a fentanyl overdose and gets 20 years.

    • Replies: @HammerJack
    , @HammerJack
  256. Charon says:
    @AnotherDad

    This kind of wanton hatemongering is why the likes of you and Jack D are being consigned to the dustbin of history. Hope y’all have fun there!

  257. Wielgus says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Eastern Tennessee had a fair number of Unionists, a number of whom were executed by Confederate forces after attempting a rebellion. More pro-Confederate western Tennessee rather ironically fell under Union control relatively early.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  258. Karl1906 says:

    Obummer and his Dermocrats promised to hammer Roe vs. Wade into stone back in 2008. And they had a super-majority to push it through. Instead they did jack shit and continued to blame the Republicans (and the “right”) at every opportunity ever since. Now they need the “prohibition” of child murder in the news and screaming – female – child muderers on the streets to make their election fraud in November at least a BIT more believable. A tiny bit.

    So, don’t fall for this show! Roe vs. Wade was a fraud and lie from the get-go and it remains so until it is finally dumped in the trashcash of (American) history. And all of these self-confessed child murderers could attempt… contraception for once. Something their parents should have done.

    • Agree: Ron Mexico
  259. @Anonymous

    Indeed, many Protestants supported public schools as a counter weight to the papist Catholic schools. This supported lasted long after the Marxists had captured the public schools and those “public” schools were hostile to all Christian faiths and WASP DNA …….but the Prods remained fighting the last war [against popery] while a new more powerful enemy was devouring them

  260. Anonymous[361] • Disclaimer says:

    Meanwhile, in what must be the cleanest example of Sailer’s Law of Trans, a 29 year old male pervert CRUSHES his teenage girl competitors in a skateboarding competition…..

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10958359/Trans-skateboarder-claimed-prize-girl-13-divorced-ex-Navy-dad-three.html

  261. Rogue says:
    @FPD72

    South Africa (where I’m from and still reside) is a mostly Protestant country, though does have a sizeable Catholic church as well.

    I’ve been (loosely speaking) an evangelical Protestant Christian for the last 40 years.

    I cannot remember anytime over this time span when evangelical churches were indifferent to abortion. They’ve always been opposed.

    For myself, whilst I accept that life begins at conception, I don’t accept that an embryo is a human being. It’s a potential human being. Embryos can be frozen and remain viable – this is obviously not possible for human beings of any age.

    So whilst aborting a perfectly healthy 3 month old is clearly infanticide (and where the mother’s health is in no danger, and it’s not incest or rape etc), I am not an absolutist about abortion.

    Make no mistake, I am definitely in the pro-life camp, and think the current US Supreme Court has certainly made the right decision – but to suggest a couple of days old embryo has the same rights as a walking, talking human being (or 5 month old baby in the womb for that matter) is just plain absurd.

    At which point after conception does an actual human life begin by my reasoning? Obviously, this is something that God alone knows, but He has also given us minds to reason with.

    Maybe the Texas heart-beat law is a reasonable cut-off point. Certainly, it should be sooner rather than later – and ideally not at all.

    In any event, I am firmly opposed to abortion on the grounds that it’s simply a woman’s right to choose – especially when it’s considered just another means of contraception.

  262. @Ian Smith

    Afghanistan’s dominant religion was Vajrayana Buddhism. Contemporary Mongols’ dominant religion is Vajrayana Buddhism.

    • Replies: @Marcion
    , @Ian Smith
  263. Wielgus says:
    @Anonymous

    The late Jack T. Chick, producer and often artist behind a lot of Christian cartoons, was virulently anti-Catholic. His other traits like Christian Zionism and anti-Communism were not controversial but his belief that the Catholic Host is a “death cookie” raised a few eyebrows…

    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
  264. Anon[223] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Why is Christianity a strange thing in Europe?

    When you start to look at religion in a racial context perhaps you can ask yourself why has every White nation on earth been Christian?

    Why is Islam prevalent in nations that have a large admix of people?

    Once you start to do so the answers will become clear.

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  265. Anonymous[797] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic

    But if abortion restrictions mean more r-selected women have children, then they would be dysgenic.

    Number of R selected babies is determined independently of the women involved. It is determined by the amount of food/housing/clothing/heat/medical care available. A non-optimal clutch size (# of children in this case) simply reduces the number of 2nd generation descendants (grandchildren in this case).

    Welfare (R selected) populations tend to live in cities and collect welfare. Total welfare expenditures (direct and indirect) thus determine number of R offspring. Try for more than that and the mortality rate increases.

    Here’s the way it was, before welfare and productive Western industrialization:
    https://www.zerohedge.com/personal-finance/what-time-be-alive
    There is a reasonably large chance that the bad times are returning.

    Everybody knows this on some level. It’s encoded in nursery rhymes, which remember bad times over the generations.

    There was an old lady
    who lived in a shoe.
    She had so many children she didn’t know what to do!

    She gave them some broth
    without any bread
    and whipped them all soundly and sent them to bed.

    Note that there is an attempt still being made to erase the memory by changing the last verse to:
    She gave them some broth
    with plenty of bread
    and kissed them all fondly and sent them to bed.

    which is inconsistent with the first verse, of course, but also serves to point out that the bad times (all of previous human history) are gradually being forgotten.

    • Thanks: The Anti-Gnostic
  266. Hhsiii says:
    @Dube

    “This hat oughta catch his eye.”

  267. How to explain that in a Protestant country the composition of SCOTUS changed from overwhelmingly Protestant to 6 Catholic and 3 News, so no Protestants. The number of children of the 1970s Justices points to part of the explanation. Yes, smart Protestants started having fewer children and having them later at least two generations before Catholics. The most fertile white Protestants are probably White Trash or religious dimwits who follow dubious leaders
    But it occurs to me that it is not just numbers of bright people that count. It is family structure too. The same effect is apparent in Australia if not quite so notably. My best (born Catholic) friend of recent times on the Australian High[est] Court was one of six children of an Irish Catholic publican. In short she needed to make her own way. Contrast the easy life family money can provide for the children of a prosperous two child family. Similar observations can be made about the Jewish families that produced Nobel Prize or similar achievers in the first generation of City College graduates but gentlemanly property or securities lawyers in the next when there was no trouble finding the capital for the only son to buy into a partnership.

    • Replies: @Ian Smith
  268. In the past 50 years we have learned a lot more about the developing fetus, being able to actually see it alive and kicking, showing emotion and such. It would be interesting to know if the 1973 Supreme Court would’ve voted any different today having been exposed to today’s knowledge.

  269. JR Ewing says:
    @prosa123

    Trivia: her maiden name was also Roosevelt.

    The mother of an old high school friend of mine had the same maiden name as her married name: “Mathews,” the less common spelling with just one ‘t’. I’ve always thought that was kind of unusual.

    I found this out the first time he took me to visit his maternal grandparents’ house. I saw their last name somewhere in the house and thought he had mistakenly taken me to his father’s parents house instead.. except his mom’s parents (whom I had previously met) were there in the house.

    It was very confusing until he explained the oddity to me that both sets of grandparents had the same last name.

    I do not know if they were related, but they probably had to have been given that they both grew up within 150 miles of each other in the same region of West Texas.

  270. JR Ewing says:
    @Art Deco

    I don’t know if a national ban will be their FIRST priority, but McCarthy was already talking about it by Friday afternoon, which I thought to be tone-deaf and misguided.

    Leave it to the GOP to always do the wrong thing when given the chance.

  271. @Carol

    I recall a young religion free relation saying that the images of the foetus in his wife’s womb made him understand people bring against abortion.

  272. Alyosha says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Buddhism in China, Korea, and Japan is far stranger than Christianity in Europe. The fact that you don’t realize this suggests you don’t know that much about religious and cultural history. Europe is far closer to the Eastern Mediterranean shore/Israel/Palestine than Korea, Japan, and the Chinese Heartland is to North Central India.

  273. Anonymous[998] • Disclaimer says:

    B. That, amazingly, the more downscale half of Protestantism would come to agree that the Papists were right about abortion being grotesque.

    The second is one of the more extraordinary American developments of the latter half of the 20th Century,

    Steve calls this “amazing” and “extraordinary” but never tells us why. Seems to be just more anti-Protestant bigotry from Steve.

  274. Anonymous[998] • Disclaimer says:
    @Carol

    The men I knew weren’t sentimental about fatherhood. Hell, my father had wanted us aborted starting with No. 1 Son.

    If he had wanted you aborted, you would have been aborted.

  275. Jimmy1969 says:

    Steve your problem is that you set up too many red herrings. To respond to your rantings would take a page to slay each false flag dragon that you set up. Suffice it to say that any 2nd rate University Professor could demolish most things you write about. Like most people on this site you provide some interesting facts and make some comments about topics that no one wants to talk about and that is great; but then you ramble on with non connected nonsense. As an aside I would like to say one thing about the Beatles and abortion. I have made dozens of comments over the years about this: what if the parents of the British invasion had elected for abortion? Where would the Stones, the Beatles, the Who, Purple, Zeppelin etc have been…non existent. Moreover I have often used the example of ww1 and 2: if those band members were born a few years earlier or so, they likewise might not have made it. Think of how many great white Protestant Catholic cream of the crop leaders were wiped out in both wars from Europe. Ditto that for the zillions of children of upper middle class white American and Canadian women who had abortions.

  276. Anon[566] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    You don’t know what you’re talking about at all. John Lennon was middle class but the rest were lower middle class at best, and Ringo was certainly below average, a poor or working class family. Posted below is his childhood home, which was one of the most violent, poor, and oldest inner city districts of Liverpool.

    The other two lived in similar tiny tiny homes that were semi-dilapidated. McCartney’s family moved into a somewhat better home when he was 12 but still nowhere near Lennon’s solidly middle class home.

    • Replies: @hhsiii
  277. @War for Blair Mountain

    Steve

    You need to let this comment through….Reg Caesar disgustingly trashed the Sullivan Brothers and their Parents…

  278. @War for Blair Mountain

    Steve

    Let this comment through…it is the right thing to do….

  279. The moderate Protestant Prime Minister of Northern Ireland, Terence O’Neill, said words to the effect that, if Catholics were treated decently and given adequate housing and job opportunities, they would start behaving like Protestants and have less children. Hard-Line Protestants rejected his reasoning, but, arguably, time proved him to be correct.

    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
  280. @Mr. Grey

    Thank you. Yes, this is the way I remember it. I was quite astonished at the extreme reaction that the older generation had when I and other teenage boys decided we wanted “long” hair. Even five years later, in 1969 when I graduated from high school, they were still nuts. My best friend started growing a beard, and the principal didn’t want to let him graduate. They called in his father, but his father was also growing a beard. That stumped them, but they decided that he could graduate, but wouldn’t let him be in the ceremony. Which he didn’t care about anyway, so it was a win-win for him.

    Anyway, that is when what I think of as the 60s began: with my generation demanding the freedom to have certain hairstyles. But other people I have talked to have different memories, of course.

  281. Anon[294] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    He had married a couple of blondes in his second childhood.

    *fake blondes

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  282. bomag says:
    @Intelligent Dasein

    Okay, I imbibed.

    Good comment; we would do well to put some sacredness back into intimacy.

    Even the Left is troubled. They shout rape! and incest! knowing those account for about one percent of procedures; and have no intention of limiting it to that cohort; it’s a coping mechanism.

    That being said, I suppose one could argue that public policy includes the killing of innocents: every road, car, industrial product, etc. carries that implicit price tag. Yes, abortion is explicit, but that is a quibble.

  283. Hibernian says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    CSA soldiers were not allowed internment in national cemeteries.

    If thwy were POWs held at Rock Island, and died on the site, during the War, they had their own. About 2 or 3 miles east of where I grew up, and on the other (Illinois) side from us.

  284. One hundred thirty five (135) countries in the world do not permit abortion on request according to the Indian newspaper The Hindu. Mexico, Brazil, Japan, Israel, India, all predominantly Muslim countries, and almost all countries in Africa and South America, do not permit abortion upon request.

    https://www.thehindu.com/data/data-how-many-countries-allow-abortion-on-request-where-is-abortion-completely-prohibited-and-more/article61967288.ece

    Following is color coded map:

    https://reproductiverights.org/maps/worlds-abortion-laws/

    One can make up of this what one will.

    • Thanks: bomag
  285. Hibernian says:
    @Alyosha

    …Ethnic Irish Catholic women and other ethnic white Catholic women of becoming progressives who tended to partially or fully disavowed their heritage and agree with the WASPs values…

    If the disavowal is partial they may be on the Parish Council at some Catholic parishes.

    One such woman is Speaker of the House.

  286. Che Guava says:
    @Anonymous

    Babono?

    I suppose you refer to Lennon’s second wife.

    She was very unpopular in Japan until quite recently, the thinking was that if Lennon was to have married a Japanese woman, it should have been one without her history of mental illness.

    OTOH, some of her art, static works, before she met Lennon was very good, and I am not much of a fan of ‘transgressive performance art’, and suspect that Abramovich woman in N.Y. is a satanist, Ono got to much the same point without the satanism decades earlier with her ‘Cut Piece’.

    In any case, people who really cared are dead or in their dotage, Ono founding the massive John Lennon Museum as a tourist attraction in Saitama pretty much changed the media tone for her.

    Needless to say, I have never been to the museum, but have seen several examples of her pre-Lennon static art, she made some interesting works.

    • Replies: @Curle
  287. @Dutch Boy

    Hear! hear !!!

    The WASP elite were the biggest promoters of eugenics pre-WWII. Post-war, with eugenics in disrepute, the movement segued to birth control, which picked up important Jewish support but still focused on those other pesky groups the WASPs disliked but who continued to out-procreate them.

    The various social engineering decisions (e.g., Roe) were aimed at these same groups, especially those annoying Catholics who promoted the working class solidarity so loathed by the economic elite. The elite WASPS and the Jews who now own them have gotten their way and the mess they have created is all around us. The old Democratic Party, which was once the political vehicle of the Catholic working class, is now their avowed enemy.

    A muslim is permitted by religion to have 4 wives at one time in addition to unlimited number of slaves described as ” which your right hand possesses “. This is what is narrated about the prophet of Islam :

    Narrated Qatada:

    Anas bin Malik said, “The Prophet (ﷺ) used to visit all his wives in a round, during the day and night and they were eleven in number.” I asked Anas, “Had the Prophet (ﷺ) the strength for it?” Anas replied, “We used to say that the Prophet (ﷺ) was given the strength of thirty (men).” And Sa`id said on the authority of Qatada that Anas had told him about nine wives only (not eleven).

    In the West you have people ( vehemently anti-religion and pro-abortion ) who want to get married and divorced several times while maintaining a promiscuous life . For some of those people that is not enough because if they could get their own way they would like to legalize paedophilia and incest. If you are wondering where I got this things from I would like to refer you to a multilingual leader of the Green movement in Europe who once stated that he wouldn’t have any problem adults having sex with children as long as there is mutual consent. That is why I believe American conservatives should take the leadership both internally and globally to stop the perverts from taking the world into total destruction.

  288. Mr Sailer is quite right about how recently the rivalry between Catholics and Protestants mattered and how thinking about it helps us understand the world we inherited. As a Gen-X Protestant Irish-Canadian, I remember teachers and relatives telling me how it recently used to matter a lot whether someone was Protestant or Catholic and how much better things are today. Getting past that rivalry was considered a success story for secular liberalism and a template for future social projects, like making mass exotic immigration and multiculturalism work.

    As a side note, both of my parents and I were raised in communities where people we knew were either Catholic or Anglican (Church of Ireland). There were Nonconformist neighbours, of course, but in retrospect I don’t get the impression their worldview rubbed off on us much at all. I remember telling my father about the concepts of “once saved, always saved” and predestination. He said “they actually believe that stuff? We didn’t have many people like that in the army, so we never talked about that sort of thing”.

  289. @kaganovitch

    70s are new 50s and 80s are new 60s.

    Ask Silvio.

  290. What never fails to amaze me about SCOTUS rulings is the absence of underlying legal principles behind the rulings. Explains why Roe v Wade can be overwhelmingly approved by one group of Justices and later overturned by a later group with almost the same majority.

    • Replies: @Curle
  291. Have you ever looked at the Zaprooder film, and at Jackie in particular as the fatal head shot connects? It looks like she is putting a gun under his chin and blowing his brains right out the back. This explains why she was not hurt/killed despite being so close to him.

    • Replies: @JR Ewing
  292. @Mike Tre

    Steve is hiding Jewish nefariousness because he’s either a crypto-Jew or has a bunch of Jewish mistresses whose sensibilities he’s got to respect.

    Happily, we have evalion – she missed a few things, but was hilarious with:

    1. Shaniqa
    2. Ha-ha, I tricked you ….

    https://video.nobodyhasthe.biz/w/8574324f-1235-4404-9bd7-ec3c9afe6267

  293. Che Guava says:
    @R.G. Camara

    I have the Japanese edition of The Meaning of Life DVD, some of the ‘deleted scenes’ sure support what you say, a boring Jewish comedian, I forget what
    that was about, and a really bad skit about Martin Luther, but they *were* deleted scenes.

    Still think it’s funny as released in theatres, clearly anti-U.S. in parts, but to me, that is a feature, not a bug.

  294. “Then, in likely the single most memorable moment of the second half of the 20th Century, a dirty Commie murdered him in front of his beautiful wife.”

    A descendant of the same dirty Commie bastards who had assassinated the beautiful Romanovs in Russia … they and their equally filthy capitalists cousins are now in control of the world.

  295. @Ian M.

    Have you read the Pivot of Civilization? She brings up some pretty good points about ignorant immigrants and their folk medicine. Getting those poor women to take hygiene seriously wasn’t a bad cause at all. There was no mention in there about abortion; it was all about contraception and proper health for a new mother. Yes, she was utterly condescending, but she was working with people in those tenements and likely saw things unimaginable.

    It would be a good read for the SS book club that he should organize… couple of posts per book… maybe 1 or 2 months for each book, depending on the length. His book reviews are great, but they aren’t in depth and need the good discussion that some people here can generate from actually reading the same book at the same time.

    • Replies: @Ian M.
  296. @YetAnotherAnon

    Thanks. I recently re-watched this interview with William Burns, the current head of the CIA. He says one interesting and revealing thing after another. At one point he concedes that there’s really no getting along with “Putin’s Russia” because it refuses to accept American global leadership. A lot of people and countries don’t accept American global leadership and I suppose they will be brought low in turn.

    Russia just doesn’t get it and neither do Trump supporters or Canadian truckers or China or India or people who voted for Marine Le Pen or side with Assange or ….

    • Replies: @MEH 0910
  297. Ian M. says:
    @Art Deco

    Yeah, I would associate Monty Python mainly with Gen X, although I know plenty of my generation (Millennial) who like them. I can’t think of many Boomers I know who like them (I can’t imagine my father liking them).

    The Beatles are the only one of the three mentioned (Elvis, Beatles, Python) who I would might characterize as a Boomer obsession. (Although again, I know a lot of Millennials who like them). Elvis seems like more of a museum piece at this point than a living memory.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  298. For those states were abortion is illegal, illegals will now breed more anchor babies than a Tortilla factory, and if you thought there weren’t enough fatherless black aspiring gangsta rappers, just wait until the next generation of black gangster rapping thugs turn 8 years old.
    Personally I would like to see a drug cartel that specializes in population reduction by selling morning after drugs and offering ovarian gland removal for mothers of future wetback leeches, black hoodrat thugs and 2SLGBTQQIAHPWXYZ freaks.
    The sooner we can abort those three parasites from America, the better.
    Signed,
    CQ – Grand Inquisitor

  299. @Reg Cæsar

    It’s quite ironic that the late-50s to mid-60s were a time of great tremendous opportunity for young Brits – wages were increasing, cars/bikes becoming more affordable, housing very cheap. The time of Macmillan’s “You’ve never had it so good”.

    The response of many British youth was to LARP as poor Chicago slumdwellers or Mississippi sharecroppers and the British Blues Boom was born.

    Now, many young Brits, especially in the cities, really do lead lives more like Chicago slumdwellers. Living standards are falling, drug consumption and crime rising, relationships breaking down, absent fathers – and blues music is a niche middle class thing.

  300. jsm says:
    @Anon

    If the intelligent women of your people don’t have babies (and raise them well), but abort them instead so the gals can “pursue careers,” you are going to find it difficult to find a doctor in your old age. So doctors from foreign countries (who will probably secretly despise you) will be deciding whether to give you the scarce medicine, such as dialysis, etc., you need.

    • Replies: @Anon
  301. @Reg Cæsar

    …explains that Harry Blackmun constructed his argument, as pilots say, “by the seat of his pants”.* He knew the result he wanted, and just cobbled together whatever bricks would hold his edifice. (Pardon the mixed metaphors.)
    *What is the German counterpart of this expression?

    Windbeutel, Bluffer, argumentativer Kutzenstreicher, Luftikus, swiss: Än luschtige Maa (a funny character), Bangart (Bankert), Sirupmänlin, Saffranirer, Klügel, Sackpfeiffer, Klisistisisten (those last six are all from Johann Fischarts German version of Gargantua (=Grandgoschier Gorgellana (= big mouth super swallower, Fischart) et Pantagruel.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    , @Reg Cæsar
  302. Emslander says:
    @SFG

    How the Catholics got so many blue collar Protestants against abortion is another story.

    Abortion has always been considered the most vile of murders. More than three quarters of the voting population, according to polls taken in 1973, were opposed to legalized abortion. Children, families and motherhood were the award medals of the American experiment.

    I was at the Berkeley law school in 1973 and not even the radical women in my classes could figure out how abortion had become a women’s issue. The valedictorian of my class was a mother of four young children who brought them to the library when she couldn’t find a babysitter. She went on to clerk for Justice Douglas.

    Roe was a victory for horny lawyers screwing their secretaries. They figured they could come up with a special lawyer inside opinion that would solidify their rejection of responsibility for seduction. They didn’t expect it to take on much significance, because American women would always prefer to be mothers.

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  303. Consider Roe’s most influential predecessor, the 1965 Griswold case in which Douglas invented a “right to privacy” that invalidated Connecticut’s law against contraception. Conservatives often point out that people in Connecticut could obviously obtain contraception despite the law. On the other hand, you couldn’t put up a sign advertising contraception. At root, the law represented a cultural power struggle between Connecticut’s increasingly large Catholic population and its original Connecticut Yankees.

    We’re somewhat primed to see these culture war battles as between blue haired womyns’ studies majors on one side and red hat, pickup-driving brutes on the other.

    But so many of these things really do seem to have their genesis in the echo of pre-1920s immigration consisting heavily of Catholics, arriving in the U.S. and inhabiting a U.S. Catholic Church dominated by Irish Catholics. Catholics, due in large part to their bumper crops of kids, came to accumulate enormous political power by the 1940s-1950s. They were organizing into labor unions which naturally ticked off the people who profited by purchasing labor in the market. One response was to “desegregate” Northern U.S. Cities by massive internal migrations of low skilled black workers from the South, disintegrating ethnic Catholic neighborhoods and thereby dissipating their power by driving them into the suburbs by means fair and foul, including urban violent crime. The other reaction was to attack the primacy of the family via legalized contraception and abortion – cut down the Catholics’ fecundity and thereby dissipate their political influence.

    Naturally, if you’ve moved from a tight knit urban ethnic enclave centered around a Catholic parish where it is relatively easy to pool childcare with relatives and like-minded coethnics to a leafy diffuse suburb where you need two incomes and two cars and no one trustworthy is close for you to share childcare with, you’re going to have fewer children per couple. (N.B. Theories about laws requiring car seats versus the size of an affordable family car yielding a reduction in children per woman). Now you have to make sure that you don’t have more than 2.5 children, thoughtfully spaced.

  304. BB753 says:
    @Jim Don Bob

    Popes John XXIII, Paul VI, John Paul II and Benedict XVII weren’t as openly heretical and progressive as Pope Francis, but deep down they were just as bad, as the record shows.

  305. Anon[180] • Disclaimer says:

    Americans love a drama and so they discard one just in time for another. The public must never be allowed to get bored. Now to abortion.

    Ladies and Non-ladies. If you take cock without protection you increase the chance of pregnancy. Riding bareback involves risks pregnancy being the least. You also, if you are a Bantu increase the chance that Daddy will disappear leaving you with yet another kid.However the good news is that another man will soon appear on your doorstep, new love so to speak, who will love you and your 10 kids all from different fathers until it is his turn to vanish.

    Therefore use condoms. They are not expensive. Otherwise keep those panties on and your legs closed. If the man is insistent lay back and open your mouth. As for Roe versus Wade or Wade versus Roe dont despair. If you decide to keep that baby this is a non issue.

    If you decide you want an abortion, this is legal in Mexico and Canada so you have a choice. North or South ?

    There, case solved and closed. Now next shall we get all excited about ?

    NB: This applies to Blacks and Whites

  306. Jack D says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    [Hamilton] refused to cast a single vote at the Constitutional Convention.

    This is not true. Hamilton favored the Constitution. In fact he wanted an even stronger Federal government. However, the rules of the NY delegation required that at least 2 of the 3 NY delegates had to be present in order to vote. The other 2 delegates, Lansing and Yates, left the convention in protest against its obvious intention to consolidate the United States under one powerful central government so Hamilton was not able to vote on behalf of NY. In the end he did sign the Constitution itself after it was ratified.

    • Thanks: Curle, Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  307. Dutch Boy says:
    @Richard from the Kickapoo

    My Catholic grandmother lived in a Minnesota town with numerous Scandinavian Lutherans. A Catholic got himself elected to the school board and one of grandma’s Protestant neighbors commented to her: “You caught us napping this time, Ann but it won’t happen again.”

  308. @Anon

    They can’t pass anything in the Senate right now, how could they confirm any justices before the election?

  309. Dutch Boy says:
    @prime noticer

    Who says A, must say B. Once you get people to believe its okay to kill unborn children, they will not be finicky about just when it is done. Eventually, the pro-aborts were okay with jamming scissors into the necks of 8 month fetuses.

  310. @YetAnotherAnon

    I watch “reaction” video on YT to keep up with “what the kids think.” Recently, some German girl was watching Life of Brian, and cracked up over the “People named Romanes they go home” scene, recalling her own Latin classes. So some kids do recall learning Latin even today, although not sure if the exact 100 times method is still in use.

    The scene right before it, OTOH, is downright prescient: Eric Idle’s character wants to be addressed as she/her because she wants to be a woman, and when Cleese asks him why, says because he wants to have a baby, which nonplusses Cleese even more: “What are you going to do, keep the fetus in a box?” To accommodate him, they begin using he/she, man/woman, etc. in all their discussions, which slows everything down (see recent Steve piece about wokeness wrecking leftist groups).

    Rather than prescience, I assume they just thought of the stupidest thing they could, as a premise. Another example of how comedy is no longer possible, since reality is dumb.

    • Replies: @martin_2
  311. @Anonymous

    Elite Protestantism did not fall apart, it converted en mass to cultural Judaism.
    Aristocratic WASP Americans were already functionally atheist, and only needed a secular, intellectual alternative society to which they could migrate. Antisemitism vanished during this same, post-war, time period.

    • Replies: @Houston 1992
  312. @Hapalong Cassidy

    Do we know who wrote what, as opposed to who played what? I never had the patience or interest to watch all those “Pythons sitting around discussing the show” shows. Cleese always seemed to specialize in exasperated “conservatives,” either working class, middle class or upper class.

    It’s like assuming an actor is just like his character; that’s missing the point of acting. Or expecting a comedian to be funny in “real life”. There’s also the factor that a comedy writer could be “presenting” as a liberal, to get along, or as a deliberate strategy.

    I knew a guy in NYC back in the 90s who quit his job where I was to join his Harvard pals writing The Simpsons; we attended meetings of the NY Conservative Party at the Plaza Hotel, but you’d hardly know it from his comedy writing.

    I was recently amazed to hear that Mike Nelson of MST3k and Rifftrax was an evangelical Christian; he made some disparaging remark about transgenders on a podcast and folks were trying to get him cancelled. This illustrates my two points: you can’t tell from their work, and they may have good reason not to make it public.

  313. Agent76 says:

    May 4 , 2011 Norma McCorvey (Jane Roe from Roe v. Wade) Becomes Prolife

    A lot of people from the era of Roe v. Wade are turning prolife. Jane Roe from Roe v. Wade and Jane Doe from Doe v. Bolton (Roe’s sister case) are both prolife as well as Bernard Nathanson who cofounded NARAL and owned what was at the time the western hemisphere’s largest abortion clinics.

    SEPTEMBER 21, 1957 MIKE WALLACE INTERVIEW WITH MARGARET SANGER

    Margaret Sanger: “I think the greatest sin in the world is bringing children into the world…
    Mrs. Sanger qualifies. She means children who have “no chance of being human beings, practically” or children who may become “delinquent.”

    https://www.c-span.org/video/?288555-1/mike-wallace-interview-margaret-sanger

  314. @Whereismyhandle

    Old Catholic ladies in my childhood reminisced about “what a lovely head of hair” he had, so he had that going for him. That may be connected to his aversion to hats, even at his inaugural, which supposedly had a fatal effect on the men’s hat industry.

  315. @peterike

    Conversely, perhaps the success of “fascism” in Catholic countries (Bavaria, Italy, Spain and Portugal, until the 70s) is due to traditional Catholicism’s aversion to Jews, unlike Protestantism, which is crypto-Jewish itself.

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  316. martin_2 says:
    @R.G. Camara

    How is Monty Python left wing?

  317. martin_2 says:
    @War for Blair Mountain

    But Islam and Muslims was not a thing at all when The Meaning of Life came out. That’s why I wrote earlier that the sketch is so dated. These days Catholic Protestant rivalry is a relic from the past.

  318. @Anonymous

    Blanshard asserted that America had a “Catholic problem” in that the Church was an “undemocratic system of alien control”…Some reviewers thought that the book incorporated nativist sentiments into its anti-Catholicism, including that the Church was a foreign power in America determined to dominate the world.

    From the clip: “But they, they never made the great leap out of the Dark Ages, and the principle of alien episcopal supremacy!”

  319. @Hibernian

    Ironically, the “faith” of these “moral” anti-abortionists is adherence to the Whore of Babylon, the Man of Sin, aka the Pope of Rome, who is even now laying the groundwork for the revelation of the Antichrist.

    Without the True Faith, their works are but filthy rags in the sight of Jehovah God.

    When Christ comes, with ten thousand of His saints, to enact fiery vengeance, they will say “But Lord, we worked to overturn Roe v. Wade,” and He will say “Begone, you workers of iniquity! I never knew ye!”

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  320. Corrupt says:
    @Jack D

    Eleanor was ugly at any age you might choose.

  321. martin_2 says:
    @James J. O'Meara

    My brother used to joke “Never marry a woman”. No-one’s laughing now.

  322. Anon7 says:

    Speaking of Roe v Wade, I’d like to update my previous comment that this clinches the upcoming election for Democrats. They now have a likely way to shoot themselves in the foot, snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, etc.

    The Dems could insist on unlimited abortion on demand, for healthy mothers and fetuses, right up to the moment of birth. Most people would not vote to support such a measure.

    So, the obvious strategy is to force Democrat candidates to declare explicitly what they support. Pull out actual cases in which healthy mothers at 30 weeks had healthy fetuses aborted. That’s healthy fetuses, not anencephalic fetuses (fetuses which developed without brains and will probably be stillborn, or die after a few weeks and \$200K in medical expenses, and much pain for the families).

    It has to be made explicit, because most Democrats would say “Oh, come on, nobody means that abortion should be made available right up to the moment of birth. That’s ridiculous.” No, it’s not ridiculous, that’s exactly what the radical feminists, Leftists and Democrats are insisting on. So make them say it.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  323. @J.Ross

    If I wanted to get opinions from someone who plays with a ball, I’d ask my dog.

  324. @martin_2

    But Islam and Muslims was not a thing at all when The Meaning of Life came out. That’s why I wrote earlier that the sketch is so dated. These days Catholic Protestant rivalry is a relic from the past.

    In 40 years Pakistanis (“Asians”) have gone from a tiny curiosity in the cosmopolitan areas of London and now more or less rule entire small cities, towns and boroughs in the UK where British law doesn’t really reach anymore. So it would seem to me that the Palin, Cleese and the other reprobates and their followers weren’t even sincere about the grounds of their mockery. It was all class-based self-aggrandizement masquerading as social commentary.

    Now Cleese will say that he doesn’t recognize and can’t walk freely in parts of London and can’t figure out how that happened. He will not today take any part in a send-up of “Asians” and their backwards practices – including serial intergenerational first cousin marriages burdening the NHS with horrific congenital diseases – and, of course, prodigious breeding that puts the Irish to shame. That would be declasse!

    • Agree: Bardon Kaldian
    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  325. Jack D says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    It’s not at all strange. Religions often end up far from their point of origin.

  326. Anon[355] • Disclaimer says:
    @jsm

    Intelligent women are not the ones aborting their babies. Please familiarize yourself with abortion patient statistics.

    • Agree: S. Anonyia
  327. The assassinations of the three K’s and other troublemakers circa 1963-68 by the MICIMATT was the end of liberal democracy in the West.

    Our two highest ranking politicians in the Congress and White House are Catholics who pimp for war and force deadly drugs on toddlers to shield the drug companies from liability. The Episcopal Church is joined at the hip spiritually, politically and culturally with the imperial MICIMATT and it’s decades of brutal imperial wars of theft, destruction and conquest, and these days can be found smugly patting itself on the back for “anti-war activism” that includes cheering on neo-Nazis and World War III in Eastern Europe.

    And JFK never was allowed to get to the part where he did any real Catholic stuff. The MICIMATT shut him down before he had the chance to splinter them into a thousand pieces and scatter them to the winds.

  328. @prime noticer

    Fascinating front page; on the same day as Roe v Wade, there was also:

    – LBJ’s death; note the subheading on the far right: “Apparent heart attack as country mourns Truman”; this was 3 weeks after Harry Truman died in December 1972. I remember it, because the adults were animatedly discussing it.

    – George Foreman defeats Joe Frazier in 2 rounds in Jamaica for the heavyweight title; both were undefeated going in.

    – Black Muslim extremist murder spree.

    – Kissinger in Paris meeting with Le Duc Tho negotiating a peace agreement that included complete American withdrawal from Vietnam in exchange for release of American POWs.

  329. @martin_2

    All the members of Monty Python hate the Native English and are on board with importing Pakistani Muslims….They are degenerate rootless cosmopolitan filth….Michael Palin was involved with resettling African Muslims in England…

    • Replies: @gatobart
    , @Jack D
  330. @Anon

    I don’t think in “racial” terms.

    Historically, Europeans are Greeks & Romans, various Celts, Germans & Slavs (plus some others).

    Greek religion is the most developed, although Roman & Nordic are more Indo-European in origin.

    These religions, at various level of development & subtlety, have these characteristics:

    * they don’t bother with holy scriptures & their religious life is not dictated by dogmas. In fact, the very idea that God(s) write books looks silly to them

    * intellectually & spiritually, they’ve been developed by poets, authors & thinkers, not by some priestly class

    * they are polytheistic for masses & monist for intellectuals. They are not ethical monotheism

    * their heresies are marginal & mostly socially induced; as such, they are not prone to religious fanaticism

    * the idea of chosenness (Hebrew, Iranian, Christian, Muslim..) is alien to them

    * they’re relaxed about sex

    * their morality does not stem from God’s decrees, but either from custom & habit or from free ethical investigations (later phases)

    * they don’t think that their God(s) have any big plan for them, nor humanity, so they live without wasting their lives in fear of (un)fulfilling God’s will; also, the dichotomy of determinism & free will is alien to them

    * they treat taboos as taboos, mostly communal stuff, not something divinely ordained

    That’s what one can see from their mythologies & ways of life

  331. epebble says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Christianity in Europe? Strange.

    Hmm, New Testament was written in Greek, not Hebrew or Aramaic. Paul, the Apostle, who pretty much created/invented Christianity, almost singlehandedly, was from Tarsus, Roman Empire, now Turkey.

    BTW, Europe, comes from Europa, a girl in Lebanon, who was kidnapped by Greek god Zeus (by becoming a bull).

    So, if you think Christianity is Middle Eastern, Europe, the name is Middle Eastern too!

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  332. @Ian M.

    Considering the higher fecundity of Roman Catholics when compared to Protestants, [William R. Inge, the dean of St. Paul’s Cathedral in London] proclaimed that a “high birth-rate always indicates a low state of civilization,” which he saw in Ireland, Italy, Poland, and other Catholic lands. In the face of primitive Catholic fecundity and with “England now breeding from the slums,” the eugenic case for birth control grew urgent.

    The Python clip is basically a skit based on this quote. And he’s not wrong, is he? Inge was a great scholar of Neoplatonism, btw.

    There is an analogous problem on the “Dissident Right” which seems to be all about ignoring Heritage American traditions (based on Congregational versions of Protestantism) and pimping beardo-weirdos from Catholic/Orthodox Europe (Evola, Guenon, Dugin, Codreanu, etc.) who are supposed to contain superior “wisdom” to good old Locke.

    Like proto-incel Ignatius Reilly, America needs “more theology and geometry,” only the masses of actual voters are too dumb to get it. America’s problems arise from its Heritage Americans who need to be replaced by Hispanics and other fertile, “natural conservatives.” And so the Left and Right join hands against the voters, again.

    As Iron Man would say, not a good strategy.

  333. Why in the heated debate about Roe vs Wade everyone studiously avoids seeing the elephant in the room?

    Here is the situation. Due to Dems’ remarkably stupid internal and foreign policies inflation is raging in the US. It’s even worse in most imperial vassals, particularly in Europe. Even a moron sees that the price of gas in the US doubled on their watch. Many states closed the loopholes for election fraud used by the Dems in 2020. Thus, Dems were heading to a crushing defeat in November elections.

    How to prevent the inevitable? Divert the attention to one of the very few issues where the majority of the public agrees with Dems – abortion. Here comes the Supreme Court decision, just in time to accomplish that.

    This might save the Dems yet. It would doom the country in the process, but who thinks this far, except Putin?

  334. @Anonymous

    https://counter-currents.com/2016/03/the-secret-of-trumps-a-peale/

    “The Secret of Trump’s A Peale: Traditionalism Triumphant! Or: He’s Our Evola, Only Better?”

    “Personally, I find the Apostle Paul appealing and the Apostle Peale appalling.” — Adlai Stevenson on hearing Norman Vincent Peale was supporting Eisenhower.

    “I know that with God’s help I can sell vacuum cleaners.” — Rev. Norman Vincent Peale

  335. @J1234

    I think that young white audiences of the early to mid-1960’s had tired of overly emotive and more overtly black influenced rock and roll of the 1950’s, being drawn to a more intelligent (or at least intelligently constructed) music that they could better relate to. A similar movement away from black pop music happened in the early 1980’s when New Wave and the like kind of copped the style and vibe of mid-60’s British Invasion groups.

    “and the like”: The much denigrated “Yacht Rock” of Steely Dan, The Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, the Doobie Brothers

    “White Rock III: Towards an Aesthetic of Musical Softness”
    https://counter-currents.com/2019/09/white-rock-iii/

    “You might hear – and sneer at – “soft rock,” but Oates is talking about synthesizers, digital technology; the previous reviewer noted “influenced by jazz and R&B without being jazz or R&B,” meaning, I would say, a de-emphasis on rhythm while maintaining a sophisticated approach to chords and harmonies; sounds like the sort of thing I was highlighting some years ago, in an essay entitled “I’ll Have a White Rock, Please: Implicit Whiteness, Aryan Futurism, and the Godlike Genius of Scott Walker,”[11] I discussed, among other things, New Age music as implicitly white, and suggested a new genre of Aryan New Age which would emphasize technical innovation and de-emphasize “rhythm” and other African elements.”

    Even blacks were tired of RnB and had their own Yacht Rock or Yacht RnB, known as “Quiet Fire.”

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  336. Justice William O. Douglas is only unremembered, unread, and disrespected by people who don’t remember him, haven’t read him and so have no grounds to respect him. Those who do, do.

  337. Lysias says:
    @ginger bread man

    I was not given a personal butler when I studied at Yale Law School.

    • Replies: @ginger bread man
  338. @Jon Halpenny

    “The moderate Protestant Prime Minister of Northern Ireland, Terence O’Neill, said …”.

    The American WASP chauvinists here will have trouble wrapping their minds around the idea that someone can be Protestant and have an Irish name like O’Neill. It’s very important to them that the Protestants of Ireland are as racially different from the Catholics as the Belgians were from the Congolese.

    • LOL: Hibernian
    • Replies: @Anon
  339. Jimmy1969 says:

    White Protestant Men like me and our Women, and a few Catholics built the USA; other groups have ruined it.

  340. OT:

    Another Americanism makes its appearance in the “anti-Russia” that Ukraine has become: they’ve stopped capitalising the word “Russian”:

    I guess the Russians are White now or rather “white”.

  341. @Shlomo Washington

    seems plausible.
    Do you have any data on the rate of WASP intermarrying with Jews? At first the children of those mixed marriages were raised in a nominal Christian religion e.g. Unitarianism, but today the children seem more likely to be raised Jewish and even a Christian lite religion wont suffice……but I have no hard data on that

  342. @Stan Adams

    It is not a random sample. For one thing the woman doesn’t have to tell anybody except the doctor she wants an abortion. Nevertheless the women I have known who told me about aborting fetuses were all unhappy about it. I have never known in real life one of this tribe of women who tells everybody on twitter or whatever that they are glad they had an abortion.

    It just seems crass.

    Like somebody who came back from the war and talked to civilians about all the people they killed. I have heard of it but I have never heard it.

  343. gatobart says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    During the mid. ’60’s the Beatles were all over US television which suggests that they owed their initial fame to TV (just like Elvis).

    Not so. Like Sergio Leone’s spaghetti Westerns, the Beatles were already world famous even before they had set foot on U.S. soil. And they didn’t need TV to become so, not even U.S. TV. In South America only a tiny minority of people had TV sets at the beginning of the 1960 and so it was the radio who made them uber famous, not to mention their singles and albums. And the same in the rest of the world. The U.S. of A is not the center of the Universe you know, not even that of the Solar System.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  344. JR Ewing says:
    @Jeffrey Freeman

    I have to say, I thought I had heard every theory on the JFK assassination, but… I guess not.

  345. gatobart says:
    @War for Blair Mountain

    One of the greatest mysteries of life, one that I am quite sure I wont be able to unravel even to the day of my final demise, is why, why, why so many people in this world finds this so called Comedy Troupe funny. The hidden humor in Biggus Dickus represents to me a far greater enigma than the missing mass of the Universe and worldwide sushi’s popularity.

  346. Curle says:
    @ScarletNumber

    Too bad she didn’t teach John jr to stay away from Doctor Killers.

  347. Rahan says:

    A very refreshing article, thanks!

  348. Art Deco says:
    @Ian M.

    My rough impression is that The Beatles constituency tends to be weighted toward the scions bourgeois households outside the South, whereas the Elvis constituency tends to have a more vigorous blue-collar and Southern segment.

    A couple of things hit you when you look at the lists of hit singles from that era. One is that in regard to singles, what you’d call lounge or adult contemporary was competing with rock music quite well. Another is that scads of people made bank for a short run and then disappeared. One performer after another I don’t recognize.

    • Replies: @Curle
  349. LeoXamine says:

    More than half of US abortions are done by the abortion pill. That means the fetus is less than 10 weeks old. In fact it’s not even a fetus, it’s an embryo. It’s nothing.

  350. gatobart says:
    @Whereismyhandle

    Whereas I don’t get why JFK was considered handsome.

    At the time most of the world didn’t even have TVs sets and the only images they got of JFK were in B&W newsreels in movie house screens before the main feature, or in newspapers or magazines, and even in the US I guess many if not most people had only B&W TV sets. I am saying this because I was used to see him only in B&W and the first time I saw him in color it was quite a shock, really, no offense, but that orange hue…

    • Replies: @Jack D
  351. @Wielgus

    Speaking of Jack Chick content:

  352. Tall Tim says:
    @Henry Canaday

    The Beatles were a fake band (they could play well enough to sell it). Why? To steer the youth away from traditional culture and start the Luciferian new age to replace Christianity. Their songs, movies and heavy symbolism were big clues. Ringo has kept his mouth shut (and always plays with another drummer- hint, hint), so is still around. Billy, who replaced Paul, is writing a series of very symbolic books to spill the beans.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  353. @Zachary Smith

    Not to be confused with the other James Morris, who practiced the most effective birth control of all.

  354. Jack D says:
    @Anon7

    I don’t know what you are talking about since Roe always said that abortions after viability could be banned. All a Dem has to say is that they want the rule of Roe restored. Maybe they really want what you say (I doubt that many do, but I’m sure if you did hard enough for crazies you can find them just as you can find “when the sperm meets the egg” absolutists on the other side, who would not even allow the morning after pill) but they are not going to publicly admit it – they will just dance around the issue .

    • Agree: kahein
    • Replies: @SafeNow
    , @Reg Cæsar
  355. @Jack D

    That was my point. Hamilton never opposed the Constitution; he did not vote after returning from a business sabbatical because Lansing and Yates opposed the Constitution, intensely enough to have stormed out in the meantime.

    Those two were decades ahead of Dixie in opposing centralized government. The latter only did once it ceased to work in their favor.

    Democrats are notoriously forgiving of Republican crimes (Reconstruction, stealing Hawaii and Puerto Rico) for the same reason.

  356. Anon[159] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Nothing strange about any of these religions spreading to various regions. They all provided the institutional ‘technology’ that pre industrial societies needed. They did the job well. Also as long as rituals are demanded by people they are still the best ‘technology’ available.

  357. anon[528] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Roe v Wade was just another hammer-blow, in the demonstration of expanded power by those who had set out to destroy American morals.

  358. Jack D says:
    @War for Blair Mountain

    They are degenerate rootless cosmopolitan filth

    I didn’t know that the Pythons were Jewish!

    Please tell us how you really feel. Don’t be so wish-washy!

  359. Anon[799] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    The evidence suggests that they were likely of Irish Catholic stock as the vast majority of the Irish of Liverpool came during the Great Hunger, they were the poorest of the poor who could only get passage across the Irish Sea as opposed to crossing the Atlantic. There names also suggest an Irish as opposed to a settler origin.

  360. Marcion says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    BK
    I am familiar with this. What source do you have for Vajrayana being in Afghanistan, anything besides Herbert Guenther?

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  361. Curle says:

    “The Protestant Republican worry that Catholics Democrats were outbreeding them might help explain why GOP dynasties like the Rockefellers and Bushes were so into population control.”

    No kidding. When I was young everyone knew about the family down the street with nine kids. I hung out with an family of six kids. Nobody had to ask the religion. And, of course, overpopulation was always presented as an looming catastrophe, particularly for the environment.

    I do think the Osmonds and Jacksons helped music enthusiasts from small families temper that concern with envy that they didn’t have an ready made band.

    • Replies: @nsa
    , @Poco
  362. Curle says:
    @Art Deco

    Living as an >10 child in Memphis in the late ‘60s, not far from Graceland, and having an uncle who lived in Hendersonville (home of Johnny Cash), I queried my mother as to why the Beatles didn’t live in Tennessee. Even in Memphis Beatles got more airplay.

  363. Anon[799] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Exactly, Lennon also wrote a song supporting Irish independence.

    • Replies: @loren
  364. R2b says:

    According to John Coleman, it was Theodore Wiesengrund Adorno who was behind the Beatles.
    And for a mature being, that must be obvious, as the music is absolutely unbearable!
    It is part of a Frankfurt schul new age psy-op, if that is true, and I believe it is.
    The Stones is just another harsher version, all of which is just meant to destabilize and induce anxiety and meninglessness.
    Abortion is part of eugenics and Malthusianism, and an overall Darwinistic wiew of life, that tries to culminate now. Man acting as God.
    The work of those who have the Devil as their father, is almost complete, and only a Christian revival can postpone the inevitable.

  365. @Alec Leamas (hard at work)

    https://www.takimag.com/article/nazis_vs_muslims_who_hateth_the_most_david_cole/

    Poor Curt Schilling. Last week, the legendary pitcher dared to tweet about the two things you just dont tweet about (or talk about or whisper about or describe via charades): Muslims and Nazis. Schilling tweeted, “It’s said that only 5″-10% of Muslims are extremists. In 1940, only 7% of Germans were Nazis. How”d that go?”
    ………………………………………
    Professor Peter Merkl’s landmark study “Political Violence Under the Swastika: 581 Early Nazis” (Princeton University Press, 1975) used contemporaneous biographical studies and personal documents to profile five hundred and eighty-one early, founding members of the Nazi Party (the hardcore Nazis who shaped the party and brought it to power). Merkl provided statistical analysis of the founding Nazis” political, societal, and religious views: 33.3% of these Nazi Party members showed no interest in anti-Semitism. 14.3% expressed “mild verbal cliches” regarding Jews. 19.1% displayed “moderate”disdain for Jewish cultural influence in Germany. But only 12.9% advocated “violent countermeasures” against Jews.

    If you take Merkl’s findings and measure them against the Pew survey results, you”re left with a truly startling conclusion: There are more Muslims in today’s world who support violence in the name of defending Islam than there were founding members of the Nazi Party who supported violence against Jews.

    The average Rahman-in-the-street is more likely, today, to think you should die for being an infidel than the average veteran Nazi Party member, back in the “30s, was likely to think a Jew should die for being a Jew. That’s stunning, and very, very ominous.

  366. Thoughts says:
    @R.G. Camara

    Red Skeleton was very physical

    Physical comedy is exceptionally hard

    It’s easier to do high iq verbal ranting comedy

  367. @Zachary Smith

    Evangelical Protestants were anti-abortion from 1517 until sometime in the early to mid 1900s, than became pro or indifferent to abortion for a few decades in the early to mid 1900s, than became anti-abortion again in the 1980s. The fact that you don’t know we’ve been anti-abortion for centuries and were only indifferent or for abortion for a few decades before switching back to our original correct position shows that you’re an ignoramus and probably not very religious.

    • Agree: Alyosha
    • Replies: @Zachary Smith
  368. Curle says:
    @Irish Savant

    Why do you consider the rejection or adoption of federalism something other than an underlying legal principle?

  369. SafeNow says:
    @Jack D

    Roe always said that abortions after viability could be banned.

    But wasn’t there always an exception for health of the mother, which included mental health? My guess is that such an exception will survive in red states. The best that red states could do would be to strengthen the documentation requirement of the shrink. But this might be enough. Women might have trouble finding a shrink willing to comply with the enhanced documentation rules in a red state. So, as a practical matter, women will be forced to go out of state.

  370. @ScarletNumber

    I once knew a woman who had worked at the same publishing house in Manhattan as Jackie. She thought it was funny that Jackie brought her lunch to work in a paper sack.

    • LOL: ScarletNumber
    • Replies: @gatobart
    , @Art Deco
  371. MEH 0910 says:
    @Cagey Beast

    The Putin Files | FRONTLINE playlist:
    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL_pPc6-qR9Zzqyps3_JmrNG6h2kMXGfEE

    INTRODUCING: The Putin Files | FRONTLINE Transparency Project

    Oct 25, 2017

    Now, you can see what we’ve seen – hours of reporting – from everyone we’ve interviewed, on the record, at your fingertips. This is “The Putin Files” – the complete archive from the FRONTLINE’s documentary, “Putin’s Revenge” – part of FRONTLINE’s Transparency Project. Explore here:
    https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/interview-collection/the-putin-files/

    The Putin Files: Victoria Nuland

    Oct 25, 2017

    Watch former U.S. ambassador to NATO Victoria Nuland’s candid, full interview on Putin and allegations of Russian interference in the 2016 U.S. election –all part of “The Putin Files”, FRONTLINE’s media transparency project. Explore Nuland’s full interview and interactive transcript here: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/interview/victoria-nuland/

    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
  372. Interestingly it is now obvious, or rather it was ‘obvious’ then but now is confirmed, that a number of the ‘Justices’ LIED during Senate testimony regarding Roe v Wade. ‘Stare decisis’ and all that. So US SCOTUS apparatchiki are happy to lie, under oath I presume. ‘The Rule of Law’ in all its Majesty.

  373. @MEH 0910

    Yes I watched hours of those interviews and came away amazed at how much of a monoculture they’ve created in Washington. No one seemed to come at the problem from a fresh angle or strongly questioned any of the “respectable” positions on anything.

    Many of them were well aware of the Russians concerns, they just always thought those concerns were unfounded, borderline paranoid and more than a little comical. I suppose it’s the same kind of self-confidence that kept Hillary Clinton from campaigning in Wisconsin.

    • Agree: MEH 0910
  374. Dube says:
    @Charon

    Lol, I guess that hat worn by Grace Kelly came with her title of Princess of Monaco. When I first saw that picture in 1962, I too thought of it as polite sexual regard. But now that I’m older, cigars can be cigars, and I realize that not only is she here a matron of mature judgment, but an actor who studies character – to at least the following extent, as drawn from her Wikipedia article:

    Kelly worked with some of the most prominent leading men of the era, including Gary Cooper, Clark Gable, Ray Milland, James Stewart, Bing Crosby, William Holden, Cary Grant, Alec Guinness, and Frank Sinatra.

    Now those are not men with the aphrodisiac of political power, but she was not lacking for comparisons with male character. Back then I discussed this photo with an actor friend, and he suggested that JFK’s magnetism in this shot derives partly from his attention being directed elsewhere than toward her, allowing her frank attention, in the manner of a cat looking at a king.

    I was interested to learn that Grace Kelly, though Catholic, was Irish-German, so presumably her interest here is more complex than just the ethnic Irish ascendancy.

    Yeah, the hat looks like wardrobe for Indonesian dance, but I’d have to see how well she carries it. She had the wherewithal. In that time I can think of no other woman who’d be ranked in comparison with Jackie O.

  375. @Tall Tim

    To steer the youth away from traditional culture and start the Luciferian new age to replace Christianity.

    Huh? Luther and Calvin beat them by centuries. John and Paul didn’t toss a pentad of sacraments into the bin. A certain other Englishman did. And knew perfectly well why it was wrong to do so:

    [MORE]

  376. @Wielgus

    More pro-Confederate western Tennessee rather ironically fell under Union control relatively early.

    It doesn’t pay to be flat. Ask any Belgian or Pole.

  377. @AndrewR

    Probably because of this. Repasting my own reply below to someone on another thread. There was no large or well-funded pro-life movement for quite awhile after RvW. By the time it came about, people would have said, “Harry” who? Also, as you can tell, I’m sure – it is a hugely emotion-driven topic and is intentionally sold that way. Trying to articulate legalese to average people wouldn’t have registered.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~

    The GOP and their voters were not very concerned about abortion for at least a couple of decades after RvW. There was no massive push about it or huge propaganda pumping out all the time.

    It is very obvious to me that what changed was the evangelical church crowd sinking their clutches into the GOP regarding that topic. And since they are a huge voting bloc and tend to be obedient to their preachers or priests, the Repub Party had to pay attention and start obeying or they’d lose an enormous amount of donors, voters, volunteers, the whole shebang.

    So, largely, the GOP got coerced. That’s politics – it’s ugly. Btw, most Repubs I know support abortion access, with limits.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  378. @Dieter Kief

    “Flying by the seat of one’s pants” does not mean bluffing, though it might involve some in social situations. It means, in general, figuring out what to do as you go along. Somewhere in-between “learning on the job” and “baptism of fire”.

  379. @jejej

    Yakkety, yakkety, yak, yak.

    In abbreviated summation: jejej had a nasty or neglectful Mother. He has not recovered from that and, therefore, hates women.

    Furthering his problems, his misogyny means he doesn’t relate well or decently to women so, they reject him.

    You could have just admitted that ^^^ and we’d have gotten your deal.

    • Replies: @IreneAthena
  380. @Anon

    17/9 = 1.89 not even close to replacement. 15 White kids vs. 3 Black kids (Thomas’ child and Barrett’s adoptees. Weird future.

  381. GenFranco says:
    @countenance

    “The Catholicism of the first Catholic President was a big deal.”

    That’s because Catholicism had not yet been completely ground down into a sticky, palatable paste to please Masons, Protestants, and Jews. The Catholic faith still had some “heft” left over from the Catechism of Trent days. Bishops, Cardinals, and popes actually believed.

    “The Catholicism of the second Catholic President was/is all but totally unmentioned.”

    Who would mention it? Only a few straggling faithful, who don’t yet understand that making George Floyd a Saint is the only thing that matters to Jesus.

  382. @gatobart

    Well, the Slavic Children of Donbas don’t find Monty Python very funny. Everyone of the remaning members of Monty Python support the bombing and murder of Slavic Russian Children in Donbas…

  383. @Reg Cæsar

    The Bee Gees come to mind, but they, although Manx, had been living in Australia when they hit it big.

    That’s interesting. I never knew they were Manx. I hear pain/loss/and “Tragedy” in their music.

    Off-hand I can’t think of any British counterparts to the Beach Boys, who celebrated the paradise they grew up in.

    It’s because there was nothing like the United States. I expect there will be a musical renaissance in Russia in a few years.

    It was the Beatles, though, whose Rubber Soul influenced the Beach Boys that bitter-sweet was better than sweet. So they reeled off Pet Sounds.

    • Thanks: Curle
  384. @LutherandWittenberg

    Abortion in Early America
    https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1300/J013v04n02_05?needAccess=true

    Abstract

    This piece describes abortion practices in use from the 1600s to the 19th century among the inhabitants of North America. The abortive techniques of women from different ethnic and racial groups as found in historical literature are revealed. Thus, the point is made that abortion is not simply a “now issue” that effects select women. Instead, it is demonstrated that it is a widespread practice as solidly rooted in our past as it is in the present.

    An interesting bit from the first link:

    The only exclusively female function in slavery was to reproduce the slave labor force (Ryan, 1975). Between 1790 and 1850, the slave population doubled twice, primarily due to the fertility rate of black women, who continued to be forced to bear “eight children in a lifetime”

    Neat. Modern women get to join the pre-war Black Female Slaves in discovering the joys of Compulsory Child Production. Just as Slaveowner Rape was used with the slave women, modern Alabama, Arkansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, Ohio, Oklahoma, Tennessee and Texas all find rape to be quite acceptable for Forced Childbirth in 2022.

    Benjamin Franklin wrote a little medical book which included a section to take care of the problem of “the suppression of the courses”.

    “[The book] starts to prescribe basically all of the best-known herbal abortifacients and contraceptives that were circulating at the time,” Farrell said. “It’s just sort of a greatest hits of what 18th-century herbalists would have given a woman who wanted to end a pregnancy early.”

    “It’s very explicit, very detailed, [and] also very accurate for the time in terms of what was known … for how to end a pregnancy pretty early on.”

    https://www.npr.org/2022/05/18/1099542962/abortion-ben-franklin-roe-wade-supreme-court-leak

    The book can be found at https://collections.nlm.nih.gov/ext/dw/8111161/PDF/8111161.pdf and the relevant part begins on page 44.

    Farrell said the book was immensely popular, and she did not find any evidence of objections to the inclusion of the section.

    “It didn’t really bother anybody that a typical instructional manual could include material like this,” she said. “It just wasn’t something to be remarked upon. It was just a part of everyday life.”

    By the way, I couldn’t help but notice you forgot to provide any sources for your own claims.

    • Disagree: Alyosha
    • Thanks: kahein
    • Replies: @LutherandWittenberg
    , @Poco
  385. Without a genetic test there’s no certainty if Sonia Sotomayor is a Crypto-Jewess.

    All circumstantial evidence suggests she is a Marrano (or Converso).

    How many crypto-jews have already been in the white house.

    Lyndon Johnson was a Crypto, there’s a very strong well founded belief that Nixon (Milhaud) and Eisenhower were crypto-Jews.

    This con-game over Protestants and Catholics is used by Sailer to deflect attention from Jewish-Crypsis, on which Kevin MacDonald and Andrew Joyce have extensively published before.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  386. nsa says:
    @Curle

    “overpopulation was presented as a looming capacity”
    Contraception, sterilization, and abortion services should be readily available and free to all. There should be a Planned Parenthood clinic on every corner instead of crap McDonalds poisoning everyone.

    • Replies: @Curle
  387. Anonymous[973] • Disclaimer says:
    @Father Coughlin

    Ringo’s Irish ancestry is of the Orange kind. (He has spoken of having relatives who were actual Orangemen.)

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  388. IreneAthena says: • Website

    I’m racking my brain to see if I can dredge up a Beatles song on the topic of pregnancies, babies, or children…..

  389. IreneAthena says: • Website

    There’s that Clare (Clair) song, which always kind of creeped me out. But was that even the Beatles? Now I’ve got a bunch of earbugs invading….Isn’t She Lovely (Stevie Wonder), She’s Having My Baby (Anka?), oh well. Lost cause, I guess.

  390. Anymike says:
    @jejej

    Most toxic ten percent? You said a mouthful. Now, with several most toxic ten percents running around, look at the pickle we’re in.

  391. Anymike says:
    @Acilius

    Justice was hiking in a remote part of Oregon, and by the time he got back to general store where they’d left his telephone messages Truman had been nominated.

    What? He was out of cellphone range?

  392. IreneAthena says: • Website

    Baby you can drive my car. Bingo.

  393. Anymike says:
    @Whereismyhandle

    Interesting you bring up that most of the media has never been to an Evangelical church. During the 2008 presidential campaign, Barack Obama was reported as saying of Trinity United Church of Christ (of Jeremiah Wright) fame that there were millionaires, ex-convicts, model students, gang members all in the pews. Undoubtedly true, but did he or the media know that the same is true of almost any large Evangelical church in America? The only ones that are not racially integrated are the ones that are in communities that have only white people living in them. But darn that Obama was great salesman. I doubt there ever had been a Sunday morning when there were not any white people at Trinity UCC, if only the spouses or partners of one of the black members.

    I did say one thing on Obama’s behalf. Some people complained, referring the Rev, Wright’s more more hateful ruminations, how could someone go to a church for 20 years and not know what was being said from the pulpit What I said about that is that anyone who would think that someone couldn’t go to a church for 20 years and not know what was being said obviously has never been there.

  394. @Anon

    *fake blondes

    Your source for Peggy Watty?

    • Replies: @Anon
  395. IreneAthena says: • Website
    @The Real World

    “Yakkety yak:”

    I’ve said something relevant, at last.

    * Drives away *

    “Beep, beep, mmm, beep, beep, YEAH!”

  396. @Dieter Kief

    I may have found the German equivalent to flying “by the seat of one’s pants”:

    Beraterslang.de: mit der Hand am Arm

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  397. @Lysias

    https://www.artofmanliness.com/character/manly-lessons/lessons-in-manliness-from-byron-whizzer-white/

    You’re right, it wasnt Yale:

    At Oxford, he was barred from playing on the university’s teams because he had shed his amateur status, and thus had to look for other ways to exercise. Each Oxford student was assigned a manservant, sort of like a personal butler. White would regularly clear furniture from his sitting room and have nightly knock-down-drag-out wrestling matches with his manservant. It was an unorthodox breach of class lines, which would have gotten him reprimanded had administrators found out.

  398. @jejej

    It is the sense that women have gotten too big for their britches and maybe should not be encouraged to “have it all”.

    Women probably have less political power today than at any other point in US history. Certainly less than 105 years ago, when they got the Eighteenth Amendment through 46 states, the without having a vote in half of them.

    Women rarely get credit for the things they do accomplish. E.g., the miraculous stopping of the ERA in its tracks on the verge of its ratification.

    • Agree: IreneAthena
  399. Dutch Boy says:
    @James J. O'Meara

    The liberal project has devolved inexorably to its natural end: war, sodomy, and usury. It is fading before our eyes and something must replace it. Jones’s idea of what should replace it is far from the worst and we are certainly not returning to the “Americanism” that got us in this mess in the first place.

  400. Curle says:
    @Che Guava

    Yasuda Zenjirō , ( November 25, 1838 – September 28, 1921) was a Japanese entrepreneur from Toyama, Etchu Province (present-day Toyama Prefecture) who founded the Yasuda zaibatsu. His adopted son Yasuda Zenzaburō is the maternal grandfather of Yoko Ono.

    Yasuda zaibatsu was a financial conglomerate owned and managed by the Yasuda clan. One of the four major zaibatsu of Imperial Japan, it was dissolved at the end of World War II.

    • Replies: @Che Guava
  401. Curle says:
    @Wokechoke

    I dunno, Steven Foster’s songs hold up pretty well.

  402. Anon[212] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    The source is the black roots and the black eyebrows.

    Gotta hand it to hair bleach. Fools unz.com commenters every time.

  403. BB753 says:
    @BB753

    Corvinus, the influence of the CIA in Vatican II and the real role off John Paul II have been documented in scholarly books.
    https://www.fidelitypress.org/book-products/john-courtney-murray-timelife-and-the-american-proposition

  404. @Jack D

    just as you can find “when the sperm meets the egg” absolutists on the other side

    “When the manroot meets the inner sanctum” would be a more logical standard.

    Forget rights; we should be talking about responsibility. The fetus is a decade or two from any, so let’s concentrate on the “adults”.

    • Replies: @Che Guava
  405. @Reg Cæsar

    I see.
    What about hemdsärmelig then?

    Mit der Hand am Arm means – straightforward. The attitude is: Take no prisoners… – risk to say what you think is necessary and don’t think twice…risk being blamed afterwards but DON’T bother now, because the imperative is to avoid the crash landing by – keepin on keepin on
    Bluffers are not necessarily swindlers. And Windbeutel are quite good at times in – getting the deal done…

  406. @Marcion

    Not only him, but from what I know from the past, Vajrayana was dominant (Evans Wentz says so too, but he’s not a scholar); also, there were strong elements of Manichaeism and other offshoots of Zoroastrianism.

    Also, Padmasambhava was from Afghanistan (although that may not be crucial): https://www.jstor.org/stable/40017721?seq=4

  407. @epebble

    No, not the language.

    Just, Europeans are not “natural” goatfuckers.

  408. @J1234

    “However, being that the music of Elvis was fairly black in style and content, it actually was (by nature) kind of vulgar, lewd and degenerate“

    In the case of Elvis it’s a little more nuanced. Elvis didn’t just sing black music. He also moved around and shook his waist (and pelvis, hence his nickname in the press) on stage. He stated that many of his movements on stage came from white gospel musicians that he listened to and attended their shows.

    With Elvis specifically, the lewdness, degenerate factor was due in large part to his live shows, and in particular while performing live on television. Here was a young man singing a new style of music (to white mainstream ears) and shaking, moving around like he was masturbating in public. The songs Elvis sang in the ‘50’s for the most part, weren’t all that controversial—what brought the controversy was the manner in which they were performed.

    After all, Pat Bone’s initial success was due to having covered Chuck Berry and Fats Domino songs, and he met with very little controversy from parents, authorities, etc. compared to Elvis. So clearly the songs content wasn’t that big of a deal compared to their live performances.

    When Elvis returned from the army in 1960, a new performer was in place. No more lewd, vulgar, degenerate. From an album/singles standpoint, the 1960-62 period was one of the most commercially successful periods of his career. Blue Hawaii’s soundtrack, for example, was one of the biggest selling albums of the ‘60’s, was #1 for 20 consecutive weeks (more weeks at number one than Sgt. Pepper), and was Elvis’s biggest selling album during his life. Can’t Help Falling in Love, from Blue Hawaii, became one of signature songs.

    Television helped create the initial fame of Elvis, as well as the Beatles and others during the 50’s-70’s era.

  409. @Zachary Smith

    White women were forced to bear their children in Europe and America as well. That’s why so many families in America and Europe had 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and even more children, even though there were so many miscarriages and early infant/child deaths. Thomas Jefferson had 10 children, Daniel Boone had 10 children, Davy Crockett had 6 children despite dying at 49, even John Adams had 5.

    Since you’re asking for sources, here’s some sources. John Calvin’s commentary on Exodus 21, 1542 AD:

    “…for the foetus, though enclosed in the womb of its mother, is already a human being, (homo,) and it is almost a monstrous crime to rob it of the life which it has not yet begun to enjoy. If it seems more horrible to kill a man in his own house than in a field, because a man’s house is his place of most secure refuge, it ought surely to be deemed more atrocious to destroy a foetus in the womb before it has come to light. On these grounds I am led to conclude, without hesitation, that the words, “if death should follow,” must be applied to the foetus as well as to the mother. Besides, it would be by no means reasonable that a father should sell for a set sum the life of his son or daughter. Wherefore this, in my opinion, is the meaning of the law, that it would be a crime punishable with death, not only when the mother died from the effects of the abortion, but also if the infant should be killed; whether it should die from the wound abortively, or soon after its birth.”

    [MORE]

    etc., link below:
    https://biblehub.com/commentaries/calvin/exodus/21.htm

    Martin Luther in his 1535-1545 commentary on Genesis, when discussing Chapter 25 Verses 1-4:

    “How great, therefore, the wickedness of human nature is! How many girls there are who prevent conception and kill and expel tender fetuses, although procreation is the work of God! Indeed, some spouses who marry and live together in a respectable manner have various ends in mind, but rarely children.’ The God who declares that we are to be fruitful and multiply regards it as a great evil when human beings destroy their offspring.”

    link here: https://books.google.com/books?id=aIU10D1ZkKsC&pg=PA149&lpg=PA149&dq=%22How+great,+therefore,+the+wickedness+of+human+nature+is!+How+many+girls+there+are+who+prevent+conception+and+kill+and+expel+tender+fetuses,+although+procreation+is+the+work+of+God!+Indeed,+some+spouses+who+marry+and+live+together+in+a+respectable+manner+have+various+ends+in+mind,+but+rarely+children%22&source=bl&ots=CIZetHO28z&sig=ACfU3U21NHUmeQdEGhZfk0htYhxVRQZG2Q&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiR35W20vvgAhUk9IMKHT17D1UQ6AEwAHoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=%22How%20great%2C%20therefore%2C%20the%20wickedness%20of%20human%20nature%20is!%20How%20many%20girls%20there%20are%20who%20prevent%20conception%20and%20kill%20and%20expel%20tender%20fetuses%2C%20although%20procreation%20is%20the%20work%20of%20God!%20Indeed%2C%20some%20spouses%20who%20marry%20and%20live%20together%20in%20a%20respectable%20manner%20have%20various%20ends%20in%20mind%2C%20but%20rarely%20children%22&f=false

    Finally, Martin Luther in 1544 severely condemned a woman who had another person jump on her belly to cause an abortion.

    • Agree: Alyosha
    • Thanks: R2b
    • LOL: kahein
    • Replies: @J.Ross
  410. Cking says:

    The US nation was mourning, shocked by the assassination of JFK; the arrival of the MSM driven Beatles phenom seemed to provide needed distraction. The Beatles and the subsequent ‘British Invasion’ was the British Liberal, driven, Sex, Drugs, Rock and Roll, PsyOp offensive conducted against America, and the ‘Free World’, targeting its’ youth and the vain in particular. Our present degenerate culture was seeded here.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  411. Che Guava says:
    @Curle

    I knew that. Yoko’s family was still very wealthy and not in a straitened situation during her upbringing.

    • Replies: @Curle
  412. Jack D says:
    @Aleksander

    Have you been to the site?

    The reason the limo was slowed to a crawl is that it had just made a turn off of the city street grid. The “grassy knoll” is a slightly enlarged road shoulder. Oswald (who was, BTW, a military-trained shooter with a scope) had an easy 80 meter shot from a high angle.

    Once you have seen the spot with your own eyes it becomes clear. Mythical places become enlarged in our minds but the whole setting is very compact. Oswald could have almost made these shots with a pistol let alone a rifle.

    • Troll: gatobart
  413. Che Guava says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    It really shocked me to read of U.S. leftist Democrat pols speaking of ‘full-term abortion’, just gratuitous infanticide.

    IIRC, it was made legal in some places, though I am not sure.

    Truly grotesque and bizarre.

    I can understand the old practise of exposure, used for population control and eugenics in old Japan, ancient Greece and Rome, among many others, it wasn’t nice because conjunction of time of birth and season must have played a huge role in results, but it wasn’t totally irrational, either.

    No way does it match U.S. leftists recently expressed desire to slice and dice newborns, I know most commentors here are not stupid, so know what ‘full-term abortion’ means.

  414. @Art Deco

    I did not make a mistake. What you have linked to is the Bill Spenser version of events. He was a perverted newscaster who wanted to bang the widow before the funeral. When he was thrown out, he vowed vengeance. He owns the case, so his lies are repeated over and over. No one ever talks to the friends of Gregg and Pamela.
    My statements are based on the physical evidence left at the scene of the crime and by the testimony of the two killers. The proclaimed killer stated that Pamela never told him to kill her husband and he never told her afterwards. This was under oath. If you look into the case, you will probably state the case for her innocence better than I can. Remember, just because the New York Times had bought her guilty verdict doesn’t meant that she is guilty.
    For many of us, this case was the first time that the news media deliberately lied to the public. It took us a while to understand that the boys were gay lovers and the gays in NH were covering this up. I honestly thought she might be released this pride month.. The gay faced States Attorney had other ideas. He grandstanded with a 55 page document that mocked and ridiculed the widow. He never discussed the legal issues.
    The important issue in this case was one of self defense. If Gregg had lived, NH would have charged him with as many crimes as possible. They charge his widow instead.

  415. Curle says:
    @nsa

    “. . . as a looming concern” was the comment. You’ve reproduced it as capacity rather than concern.

    Of course, to the degree population grew it wasn’t for the reasons prophesied in the ‘60s. We are overpopulated, but not because of internal population growth, therefore overpopulation is an poor justification for abortion.

  416. @Bardon Kaldian

    Just, Europeans are not “natural” goatfuckers.

    So Europeans are natural bullfuckers instead?

    It’s odd to me that you don’t recognize the Eastern Mediterranean at the meeting of Europe and near Asia as an early “cradle of civilization” from which ideas and customs radiated in all directions. Christianity makes it beyond its Levantine origins and into a more mainstream Hellenic culture and thereby to Rome, and Rome expands, conquers, and its Western Empire is the predecessor of Europe. It’s no more odd than Western Europe having the alphabet, and all of its languages save Greek itself being expressed in the Roman alphabet with minor regional additions and modifications.

    • Replies: @epebble
  417. They were neither. Whilst ethnically there was a strong Irish strain in them, these were post war kids indoctrinated with Communism. Look at the lyrics of Imagine, for example. George at least had some spiritual sensibilities, but would probably not seen himself as typically Christian.

  418. gatobart says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Jackie O…working….? Someone must be pulling someone else’s leg. And what date was that, exactly when she was spotted…working…?

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  419. BB753 says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    I’ll tell you what is unnatural: Islam spreading in the Middle East and Northern Africa, areas which used to be Christian.
    As to why there’s Christianity on Europe: well St. Paul and St. Peter converted Greeks and Romans during their apostolates. After Roman Emperor Theodosius made Christianity the official religion of the empire, it was just a matter of centuries before it spread to all corners of the Empire, including Europe.

  420. Steve:

    Blackmun himself commented to the effect that conservatives should be pleased with his Roe opinion because abortion was (is) more prevalent among the lower classes (blacks), keeps their birth rate down, etc.

  421. @George

    It’s Down Syndrome, not Down’s Syndrome, and the honest word is “killed”, not this evasive evil euphemism “terminated.”

    As a practical matter, the revenue needed to care for all severely mentally retarded fellow Americans is but a small fraction of what the US rulers waste on foreign aid in a year, or on a portion of our 700-plus far-flung military bases abroad, or for the cost of one more obsolete sitting-duck aircraft carrier.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
  422. @Wielgus

    Python Terry Jones created the British TV series The Crusades, which wrongly attributed all the fault to, wait for it, Christians!

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades_(TV_series)

  423. @The Real World

    Nope. The GOP cynically took the evangelicals’ money and votes and then did nothing. Their stock refrain was, “Of course, I’m pro-life, but SCOTUS has ruled so there’s nothing I can do really.”

    It will be interesting to see how many of these guys were telling the truth now that they might have to, you know, actually cast a vote.

    2) Evangelicals thought the poor used abortion as birth control, and they disliked having their tax dollars pay for something they thought was little short of murder.

    • Agree: IreneAthena
  424. Curle says:
    @IreneAthena

    Hey Jude was written to a child.

    • Replies: @IreneAthena
  425. @Jack D

    Oswald could have almost made these shots with a pistol let alone a rifle.

    250 feet with a pistol? Color me skeptical. Maybe with a pistol caliber carbine. But that would be a long arm.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @J.Ross
    , @Jack D
  426. @R.G. Camara

    Didn’t Justice Blackmun also pen the Bakke decision, pulling the “diversity is a compelling state interest” justification for AA right out of thin air?

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  427. Art Deco says:
    @Buzz Mohawk

    She never got heavy. With a bag lunch, you control the portions. You also cut back on the time you spend in diners, where photographers can snap your picture.

  428. Art Deco says:
    @gatobart

    She worked for publishing houses from 1975 until she fell ill in 1994. She was a magazine photographer from 1951 to 1953. IIRC, one of the houses she worked for was Viking.

  429. IreneAthena says: • Website
    @Curle

    Ah, so it was, according to Paul, who said he had written it to Julian to help him cope with John’s divorce from his mother.

    I wonder what the dismembered babies on one of the album covers was all about. https://taylormarshall.com/2014/01/beatles-butcher-album-abortion.html

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  430. Wielgus says:
    @Anonymous

    Liverpool used to have a sectarian divide between Catholics and Protestants, with the former being mostly from Ireland and the latter predominantly indigenous English, but some of the latter were probably Irish Protestants. It extended into politics with Catholics tending to vote Labour (although an actual Irish Nationalist won a Liverpool constituency and held it for a long time) and Protestants, even working-class ones, voted Tory.

  431. Wielgus says:
    @Johann Ricke

    Me too. I have never fired a pistol (I have fired bolt-action rifles) but I have never seen pistol shooting at targets more distant than 50 metres or yards. And of course the target is stationary.

  432. epebble says:
    @Alec Leamas (working from home)

    Christianity makes it beyond its Levantine origins

    Christianity, as we know it today, is Greek (Roman Empire) in origin. Though the seed may be from Israel/Palestine, the tree itself is European. Somewhat (crudely) like Statue of Liberty is distinctly American though it was designed by Frederic Bartholdi and Built by Gustave Eiffel in France.

  433. IreneAthena says: • Website

    As awareness of the neoconservative Project for a New American Century and its promotion of wars-of-choice grew, a fair number of people with a “consistent pro-life ethic” started identifying as independents or libertarians rather than as Republicans.

    As a result, today there is an increased concentration of people with a “consistent anti-life ethic” (pro-NATO-expansion, pro-expansion-of-abortion) in the population of people who strongly identify as Republicans, although there are still pro-life Republicans, having varying degrees of “pro-life ethic” consistency.

    For anti-life ethic consistency, though, nothing beats the current Democratic Party.

  434. Curle says:
    @Che Guava

    I find it interesting, and perhaps not coincidental, that the Beatle’s fortunes improved after John and Paul married into elite families, Linda’s father being Wall Street.

    • Replies: @Che Guava
  435. @IreneAthena

    When I’m 64 (grandchildren), Ob–la-di Ob-la-da, Good Night (written for John’s son Julian), John’s solo “Dear Boy” written for son Sean. Probably more, I’m not familiar with much of Paul or George’s solo work.

    The Beatles broke up before they started having children, except for John’s first son. Fatherhood likely wasn’t at the forefront of their minds throughout their career. (And I can’t think of many pop songs about pregnancies, except Stevie Wonder’s “Isn’t She Lovely?”. If you’ve ever seen a delivery, it’s not a fun, romantic subject.)

    Anyway, pop music lyrics aren’t meant to be taken strictly literally. You could take many of their songs and interpret them to apply to children and pregnancies if you wish. (“Got To Get You Into my Life”?)

    • Thanks: IreneAthena
  436. @Jim Don Bob

    The GOP cynically took the evangelicals’ money and votes and then did nothing.

    The GOP cynically took the evangelicals’ money and votes and then did nothing for as long as they could get away with it. Eventually, however… FIFY.

    In the states that had/have RvW trigger laws in place, and it’s something like 13 – maybe more, it was GOP legislators who passed those laws. And plenty of GOP Governors signed them.

    Without the evangelicals hammering the GOP, year in/year out, and financially supporting them – that wouldn’t have happened. Nor would Trump have won without their support and he appointed 3 of those SCOTUS votes.

    2) Evangelicals tend to buy whatever their preacher or priest is selling. His viewpoint or motivations become theirs. He tells them that God will look rightly upon them if they support banning abortion. They believe that will help them get to heaven. That is the REAL story there.

  437. @James J. O'Meara

    Steely Dan were not “hu-wwwhite.” They were (((white))). And I really wouldn’t classify them as “yacht-rock.”. Underneath the taut arrangements and lush melodies, their music was actually pretty bleak and caustic. (Their biggest hit, “Rikki Don’t Lose That Number,” for example, is about a socially awkward loser struggling to get a girl to go out with him. The way he veers from desperate cringe (“We could stay inside and play games, I don’t know…”) to defensive dismissiveness (“You don’t even know your mind…”) is painful to listen to.)

  438. @RadicalCenter

    Actually both forms of the name are correct.

    The syndrome was named after British doctor John Langdon Down, who fully described the syndrome in 1866.

    I suspect that Down’s is more common in the UK and Down in the USA.

    Down was a very distinguished physician, and he and his wife made a vast contribution towards the humane care of the mentally handicapped.

    However, he believed that various forms of abnormalities were related to racial characteristics, and in fact he described what is now known as Down(‘s) syndrome as Mongolism, because he thought that the people with this chromosome abnormality had the facial features of Mongols. He regarded this as evidence that the human race were all one species.

    The chromosomal abnormality that we now call Down syndrome was known as Mongolism as recently as to be in my memory.

    The actual cause of Down syndrome was not discovered until 1959.

    Strangely enough Down’s own grandson was born with the syndrome.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    , @Che Guava
  439. @Emslander

    Abortion has always been considered the most vile of murders.

    Really, more vile than serial killers who kill for the purposes of sexual gratification?  Who may even engage in practices such as necrophilia or cannibalism? 

    More than three quarters of the voting population, according to polls taken in 1973, were opposed to legalized abortion.

    Do you have a citation for this?  According to Gallup polls, in 1975 (the earliest year the link goes back to), 75% of the population approved of abortion “under any or only under certain cumstances.”. (21% “any,” 54% “certain”)

    https://news.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

    Performing abortions “under certain circumstances” (which I presume refers mostly to the timeframe in which the procedure is undergone) requires legal authorization.

    Roe was a victory for horny lawyers screwing their secretaries.

    This gets at a fascinating study I recently read in an Evolutionary Psychology journal. Apparently the primary psychological trait which makes one a conservative is “sexual disgust.” I’ll try to dig up the study.

    Personally, I considered Roe a victory for freedom, personal responsibility and the eugenic improvement of the population.

    • Replies: @Emslander
  440. J.Ross says:
    @Johann Ricke

    There are certain topics on which JD should not make the attempt and it is hilariously well established that boomsticks crown this category.

  441. J.Ross says:
    @LutherandWittenberg

    John Calvin: Stop, do not rob that foetus of the life which it has not yet begun to enjoy!
    Time-travelling AOC: But this baby is not predestined and will never be one of your elect!
    Calvin: [sweating]

    • LOL: BB753
    • Replies: @BB753
  442. Jack D says:
    @Johann Ricke

    I said almost. In any case there are people who claim to be able to place large caliber pistol shots at 100 yards. It’s not impossible.

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
  443. Anon[146] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    I think John, Paul and George were at least half Irish Catholic stock with the rest being Welsh or English. Not sure about Rich.

  444. Anon[146] • Disclaimer says:
    @Cagey Beast

    With the name O’Neill he no doubt had ancestors who were Catholics. Most likely an ancestor from the 17th century who had to renounce his Catholic faith in order to keep
    ancestral lands. On the other hand his Protestant faith may have come about by intermarriage somewhere along the line. Either way O’Neill is not a name from The Borders.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Wizard of Oz
  445. I said almost. In any case there are people who claim to be able to place large caliber pistol shots at 100 yards. It’s not impossible.

    You’re right. When anyone says pistol, I assume off hand shooting with iron sights. But with a rest and a scope, I could see it happening. And, IIRC, that’s exactly how he used his rifle.

  446. Jack D says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    Strangely enough Down’s own grandson was born with the syndrome.

    Even stranger, Lou Gehrig died of Lou Gehrig’s Disease.

  447. @Jack D

    And the way that Oswald made that ole bullet swerve and sway so that, fired from behind, it entered Kennedy’s head from the front. Man, dem Commies sure is clever!

  448. Poco says:
    @Curle

    My father had 13 brothers and sisters. My mother-in-law had 17. Not a Catholic in sight or allowed in those days.

    • Replies: @Curle
  449. @duncsbaby

    An unarmed white woman. That’s allowed since Noor is 1) an immigrant and 2) one of those Whose Lives Matter. The rules are different for the Privileged.

    Did the streets of Minneapolis erupt after her murder, in cold blood? Not to mention the streets of the entire western world?

    Are they erupting now, after he’s freed since he only killed some stupid white woman? That tells you something. Are the MSM even mentioning this? Lots of agitprop, right?

  450. Poco says:
    @Zachary Smith

    Compulsory child production. Your emotional incontinence is an embarassment.

  451. Anonymous[387] • Disclaimer says:
    @jejej

    You will note that some birds always appear with talons longer than others can ever have.

  452. Ian M. says:
    @stillCARealist

    I have not read it, thanks for the suggestion.

  453. Ian M. says:
    @Richard from the Kickapoo

    My uncle grew up in Detroit and says that when he was a boy, the Lutheran boys and Catholic boys in his neighborhood would throw rocks at each other.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Anonymous
  454. Hibernian says:
    @White Nation

    A lot of people are about as Jewish as Elizabeth Warren is Indian. Big deal. AOC is proud to be a marrano, that is, if she really is one.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  455. @Jim Don Bob

    The GOP cynically took the evangelicals’ money and votes and then did nothing.

    The GOP cynically took the evangelicals’ money and votes and then did nothing for as long as they could get away with it. Eventually, however….
    FIFY.

    In the states that had/have RvW trigger laws in place, and it’s something like 13 – maybe more, it was GOP legislators who passed those laws. And plenty of GOP Governors signed them.

    Without the evangelicals hammering the Repubs, year in/year out, and financially supporting them – that wouldn’t have happened. Nor would Trump have won without their support and he appointed 3 of those SCOTUS votes.

    2) Evangelicals tend to buy whatever their preacher or priest is selling. His viewpoint or motivations become theirs. He tells them that God will look rightly upon them if they support banning abortion. They believe that will help them get to heaven. That is the reality for many.

  456. Wielgus says:
    @Anonymous

    My recollection was that they did their best to promote AIDS as a threat to heterosexuals who did not use dirty needles to inject anything. I even remember a British TV drama in the mid or late 1980s that had the principal male character develop AIDS and die after a single sexual encounter with a (female) prostitute in which he did not use a condom. Maybe the programme was sponsored by a company manufacturing condoms but more likely they wanted to put a scare into people not in the genuinely threatened groups.

  457. Wielgus says:
    @Ian M.

    How did they tell each other apart?
    In Britain, as a child who often wore a school uniform I or my brother occasionally encountered difficulties with pupils from other schools, but without the school uniform nobody would have been any the wiser.

  458. Wielgus says:
    @Anon

    Conversely, several of the IRA hunger strikers who died in 1981 did not have classically Irish Catholic names. This was certainly true of Bobby Sands and Francis Hughes.
    A particularly brutal Loyalist gunman was named Lennie Murphy. He had a Catholic father and seems to have been trying to live it down. Trying hard to prove that he hated “Taigs” just as much as his fellows did…

    • Thanks: Hibernian
    • Replies: @Evocatus
  459. @gatobart

    “Not so.”

    100% absolutely so, you know.

    “Like Sergio Leone’s spaghetti Westerns, the Beatles were already world famous even before they had set foot on U.S. soil.”

    They weren’t world famous until ’64, after they conquered the US. America, home to the world’s rock and roll, pop music in the English language, made them world famous. Before that, they were a really big UK band. Before 1963, they weren’t even all that big in England. 1963 made them superstars in the UK. Beatlemania, and all the hype that went with it that made them bigger than Elvis, and God, in some folks minds, started in 1964, beginning with their US tour. If the Beatles had flopped in America, there’s a very good chance that they wouldn’t have been world famous. Or they would’ve ended up like pop star Cliff Richard: Somewhat world famous, but never could close the deal by becoming big in the US.

    “And they didn’t need TV to become so, not even U.S. TV.”

    Of course they did. In ’63 they were all over the telly in the UK, which helped to solidify their national success. As there were fewer TV stations back then, even fewer in the UK, just getting on television helped a band’s career immensely.

    • Replies: @gatobart
    , @Wielgus
  460. Art Deco says:
    @ginger bread man

    I think that was Justice Powell.

  461. BB753 says:
    @J.Ross

    Yeah, there’s something weird about the Calvinist theory of predestination, whereby God brings people to this world for eternal damnation except for the elect few. Calvin stole the idea from St. Augustine and ran with it, although the latter said there was no way to know if you were elected and that Faith alone did not save you.
    It’s one of the condemned ideas of St. Augustine by the early Church, an old heresy revived by Calvin as is the protestant habit.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  462. @IreneAthena

    The “butcher” cover was a dig at their American record company who would “butcher” their early albums by resequencing or removing songs, throwing in non-LP singles, outtakes, etc. It had nothing to do with abortion or divorce. The baby dolls were either a reference to Vietnam or meant something like, “our songs our like our children, not pieces of meat to be chopped.”

    Much like the Sgt. Pepper cover, marijuana rather than careful consideration was the dominating factor here. (For instance, John added Hitler to the Sgt. Pepper “audience” just to be “naughty,” not to convey any sort of message. Incidentally, the Beatles didn’t actually pick most of the personages for the cover. Only about 30-40% of them.)

    Crazy how the “Beatles are a Communist/Satanic plot” crowd are still around after 60 years. It’s just a Scouse rock n’ roll combo, FFS.

    • Thanks: kahein
    • Replies: @BB753
    , @IreneAthena
  463. BB753 says:
    @Punch Brother Punch

    “Incidentally, the Beatles didn’t actually pick most of the personages for the cover.”

    Ok, who picked up famous satanist Aleister Crowley for the cover?

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  464. Curle says:
    @Poco

    Was this post 60s? Was it an urban community? That’s the time frame relevant to Sailer’s comment. Also, were you in the kind of community likely to produce supreme court justices?

    My grandfather had that kind of family, Protestants. But all subsequent generations, no. I don’t recall ever meeting an Protestant family of that size growing up where the siblings were born after 1890s or thereabouts.

  465. kahein says:

    the beatles dealt with the embittered failed-bourgeois grifter-men of unz long ago

  466. Anonymous[973] • Disclaimer says:
    @Cking

    America was in mourning again in 1966 due to the Whitman Texas tower massacre. The Beatles with their ‘bigger than Jesus’ attitude made perfect scapegoats, even though there’s no evidence the shooter was into their music (or rock & roll music generally. He seems to have been what was called a ‘square’)

  467. Anonymous[973] • Disclaimer says:

    As I understand it, the traditional Protestant attitude to abortion is that it was permissible up to the point where the baby began to move in the womb.

    However modern technology allows us to see the baby moving long before such movement can be felt by the mother. By their own logic therefore, Protestants have become anti-abortion absolutists little different from Catholics.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  468. Up2Drew says:
    @jejej

    Agreed. In the immortal words of philosopher (and Kiss guitarist) Paul Stanley:

    “Fame doesn’t change you. It just allows you to become the a*****e you are.”

    Most of us need boundaries. Even me.

  469. Jack D says:
    @gatobart

    JFK took corticosteroids for his Addison’s Disease, which had the effect of puffing him up. This puffed up look actually suited him – he was kind of scrawny looking beforehand. He looked more like his brother Bobby until he filled out.

    • Replies: @Johann Ricke
  470. Anon[242] • Disclaimer says:
    @ginger bread man

    Great points but Whizzer didn’t graduate summa, but magna cum laude, slightly more common (Ted Cruz did the same). What made him a hero was his dedication to football and just being a Chad in general. A total renaissance man blended with gritty athleticism. One of my heroes.

  471. Jack D says:
    @Hibernian

    You don’t get it. Everything bad is done by the Joos. Therefore if a person is bad he (or she) must be Jooish. If they don’t appear to be Jooish, it’s just that they are somehow hiding it. Thank God we have DNA testing nowadays and the curtain will soon be lifted from all the evil crypto-Jews like Johnson, Nixon and Eisenhower.

    Once you accept the premise that the Joos (and the Joos alone) are the root of all evil, everything else follows from that. If you can’t reconcile your premise with the facts, the facts (as we know them) must be wrong because your premise cannot be wrong. Sure Sotomayor APPEARS to be Puerto Rican but since she is evil she must in fact be secretly Jooish.

    Now you might be able to spot the logical flaw here but people are blind to the flaws in their own thinking process.

    • Thanks: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Curle
    , @Che Guava
  472. @R.G. Camara

    Whether Blackmun was impaired or not is not the reason Roe has been considered to be an erroneous decision. Roe was primarily criticized because it found that the constitution provided a right to privacy citing 5 or 6 different amendments. In every case it was like putting a round peg in a square hole.

    This was noted in the recent case that just overturned Roe.

    But the Constitution clearly does provide a right to privacy under the third amendment. The third amendment has never been litigated by the Supreme Court.

    The third amendment forbids the government from requiring an owner of a house to quarter a soldier in the owner’s home in times of peace and only permits it in times of war as prescribed by law.

    There can be no greater invasion of privacy that being forced to quarter a soldier in your home.

    Roe got the reasoning right but chose the wrong amendment to support the reasoning.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
    , @Wizard of Oz
  473. @FPD72

    If you really cared about originalism you might like to know that the third amendment to the Constitution clearly grants a right to privacy. It is the amendment that prohibits the government from quartering a soldier in an owner’s house. The third amendment has never been litigated by the Supreme Court.

    There can be no greater invasion of privacy than having to quarter a soldier in your house. Roe had the right reason but the wrong amendments to support it.

    Since you support originalism so much surely you must support a woman’s right to privacy, which of course includes her right to keep her medical affairs of all kinds private.

  474. Curle says:
    @Jack D

    One of them being flawed characterizations of competing positions. You pushing the fallacy that influence, good or bad, can’t be sufficient but has to be exclusive to be dangerous or disfavored. If ethnic Russian Leftists on their own weren’t capable of organizing the Bolshevik Revolution does it matter that the addition of Jewish money, organizational capability and propaganda capability took them over the top? Yes, it matters.

    • Replies: @kahein
  475. @Jack D

    JFK took corticosteroids for his Addison’s Disease, which had the effect of puffing him up. This puffed up look actually suited him – he was kind of scrawny looking beforehand. He looked more like his brother Bobby until he filled out.

    What, me worry? I think we’ve resolved the mystery of the real person behind Mad Magazine’s mascot.

  476. liverpool has about 4o catholic secondary schools. Lennon and McCartney went to quarry bank comprehensive (middle class area), Harrison went to the institute (inner area, selective). Ringo was in the year above my mum, at Dingle vale comprehensive(worked at my local chippy,’ Daves dingle diner’, where id scrounge chips on stick as a kid, free if you asked and I did). All south end state schools . Not Roman Catholic.
    That’s the distinction there. They had no catholic schooling to speak of , their colleagues were not catholics. Anybody who gave a shit could get a place at a RC school. Half the population in the ‘home of the Celts in England’ are not catholic or Irish origin. Only a small proportion are English stock at all.

    • Replies: @Cking
  477. @BB753

    I don’t think it’s known for sure, but most people assume it was John.

    Satanism was briefly trendy among hippies in the late 60s, along with stuff like Transcendental Meditation and the I-Ching.

    John, out of rebelliousness, gravitated toward what would shock, but with his Northern cynicism and short attention span it’s unlikely he took a deep interest in Crowley (or Nietzsche, whom he also proposed for the cover even though he couldn’t pronounce his name, referring to him as “Neitch.” Or Karl Marx, who made the cover. It’s not feasible that any of The Beatles were poring over Das Kapital. They just chose notable people on a whim. Jesus was also proposed but nixed for fear of provoking more controversy.)

    • Thanks: BB753
    • Replies: @BB753
  478. Up2Drew says:
    @Spud Boy

    Having been to the Book Depository multiple times, the one observation I would make is that the difficulty of Oswalds’ task is vastly, vastly overstated. The limo was driving away in a nearly linear progression from the shooter’s window, and in terms of rifle proficiency, the shot was not particularly difficult or distant.

    I know decent duck hunters who would have hit two of those three shots 99.9% of the time.

  479. I recall a rather entertaining novel by Philip Roth entitled “The Plot Against America” detailing the rise of Catholics and America First Lindbergh types during the Pre-WW2 period. I imagine those two groups represented some rather objectionable outcomes for WASPS politically, but particularly for the people with tiny hats.

    Catholics and America Firsters were then – and are now, to some degree – often smeared by Neocons as being isolationist and, therefore, somehow vaguely Anti-Semitic. As such, Roth’s book is a sort of contemporary retelling of the fears of the time. Plus, Jews have historically done a fine job of selling such fears to any coalition willing to listen.

    At any rate, this is highly entertaining and insightful piece, Mr. Sailer.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  480. IreneAthena says: • Website
    @Punch Brother Punch

    The baby dolls were either a reference to Vietnam or meant something like, “our songs our like our children, not pieces of meat to be chopped.”— Punch Brother Punch

    …and you don’t know which, if either, of these meanings was the real message intended to be conveyed by the Butcher album artwork, do you? The artwork was intended not so much to promote a particular point of view, but rather to be provocative, to increase the number of conversations about the Beatles (“Is Paul dead???”), and so to increase album sales.

    Earlier laws restricting abortion in the UK were reversed in 1968 with The Abortion Act, which legalized abortion under certain conditions. It isn’t far-fetched at all to imagine the Butcher album cover art being a reference to — among references to other provocative topics—-that contemporary event.

  481. Ian Smith says:
    @Wizard of Oz

    If you want a social conservative with brains, get a Catholic. Fewer Southern Baptists or Pentecostals get into top law schools.

    • Replies: @anarchyst
  482. IreneAthena says: • Website
    @IreneAthena

    Edit that missed the deadline: The cover art on their albums generally, not just Butcher, was intended to be provocative.

  483. Hibernian says:
    @davidgmillsatty

    So the unborn child is a soldier? This sounds like “evictionism,” the pro-abortion rationalization of Walter Block, a libertarian, of Loyola New Orleans.

    • Replies: @davidgmillsatty
  484. @davidgmillsatty

    I am ambivalent about implied rights in constitutions because I welcomed Australia’s High Court finding an implied right of political speech during an election which IIRC helped my side of politics which needed to advertise expensively. However….

    A “right to privacy” screams out for definition which includes exceptions. Like…

    “Except where the welfare of the community is likely to be adversely affected”.

    Not producing enough soldiers for the next generation’s wars might count.

    “Except where a deliberate or predictable non trivial harm is likely to be done to an innocent party”

    That was OK by the Roe v. Wade judges who I think were at one on not treating the foetus as a person. As a matter of interest the great Thomas Aquinas (following Aristotle IIRC) , said male foetuses were “ensouled” at 60 days from conception and female at 90 days. No soul, no person. God didn’t tell a Pope to fix that for close to 700 years.

    FWIW I have always pointed out that saying life begins at conception is just a linguistic choice that is not compelled by any facts. The zygote and embryo like sperm and egg ar, if functional, alive. If you want then (a choice God didn’t make easier by giving corre t advice to Aristotle) to say a human being is then created (even without the rights of a member of the human community) you face to deal with the fact that there fertilised entity may split from being just Alfred to being Alfred and Arthur and in a few weeks go back to being just Alfred – or Albert).

  485. kahein says:
    @Curle

    the only real flaw i see is that we’re too nice and allow you to stick around as breeding stock. also we need your sons to fix our cars and float fentanyl profits, and your daughters to get reamed on video

    • Replies: @Curle
  486. J.Ross says:
    @Anonymous

    So even in the womb Protestants believe in busywork and puttering, and conflate relaxation or rumination with sin.

  487. @Wizard of Oz

    Your side needed to advertise expensively (ie buy the result-how ‘democratic’). Zapristi!!! You’re a Clive Palmer apparatchik. Paint me unsurprised.
    ‘Not producing enough soldiers for the next generation’s war’. You old war-lover, you, Wizz. I can see you, in the front rank, driving women into their breeding stalls, a bit like Nazi Germany. Artificial insemination, of course-we don’t want those hussies getting pleasure out of doing their service to the Volk, now do we. I’m sure you’ll donate your own Precious Bodily Essences to The Cause, what with your superior ‘vitality’. Your little lecture on embryology is a classic-keep up the good work.

    • Replies: @Wizard of Oz
  488. @IreneAthena

    The artwork was intended… to be provocative, to increase the number of conversations about the Beatles (“Is Paul dead???”), and so to increase album sales

    I think it’s more likely they deliberately sent their record company an album cover they knew would be unreleasable in order to waste the company’s money and send a message.

    It was not uncommon for artists in the 60s to give the middle finger to their record companies like this.  A few years
    later, when Van Morrison was told he was contractually obligated to produce another album for his company, he sent them a bunch of trash songs about tapeworms and nose-blowing.

    A few years after that, the Rolling Stones (who had endured a similar kerfuffle with their label over an album cover depicting a graffiti-covered public toilet) were trying to get out of their contract.  Informed they owed one more single, they dashed off an almost unlistenable pornographic song titled “C***s***er Blues”

    It isn’t far-fetched at all to imagine the Butcher album cover art being a reference to — among references to other provocative topics—-that contemporary event.

    I’d be more willing to credit this if there was evidence that at any other time The Beatles had been stridently pro-abortion. Putting butchered baby dolls on your album cover as a pro-abortion message is pretty serious business. If they cared so much about this issue, surely there must be other occasions when they promoted the cause.

    • Replies: @IreneAthena
  489. Evocatus says:
    @Wielgus

    Hughes is originally a Gaelic surname though; it’s an anglicization of Ó hAodha (descendant of Hugh) in the North and Midlands. In the South of Ireland, it’s usually rendered as Hayes. Perhaps swap out Francis Hughes for Gerry Adams and you would have a better example.

  490. Anonymous[973] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ian M.

    Well kids like to fight. Any excuse will do. (School and college sports are a sublimation of this, accounting for the intense emotions they tend to arouse.)

  491. @Anon

    I recall from some strange recess of my brain that O’Neil had a son Patrick who went to Eton which would be unusual for a Catholic. I think it was wife/mother Jean I met on holiday and was not Catholic I am confident.

  492. @mulga mumblebrain

    It’s good of you to give me something to contradict right at the beginning. I didn’t say and I didn’t mean that my side of politics regularly needs to spend up on advertising.

  493. Che Guava says:
    @Curle

    Well, McCartney seems to have been addicted to Jewish wives, so you may have a point there.

  494. BB753 says:
    @Punch Brother Punch

    Marx and Crowley, less controversial than Jesus?

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  495. Che Guava says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    The Down Down’s is very much an example of Jewish crypsis.

    In the same timeframe as plain words like ‘senile dementia’, ‘senility’, ‘senile’, it became ‘Alzheimer’s disease’, Down’s became Down in U.S. English.

    Alzheimer having been Jewish, unlike Down, the new term required a posessive apostrophe, to falsely imply some kind of new discovery.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
  496. Emslander says:
    @Punch Brother Punch

    You obviously know nothing because you attended some US government school and were born after the year 1997.

    I repeat, no one had any desire for abortion as a right in 1973. Children, family and a woman in charge of both from her home was the ideal at the time and it had been achieved by the vast majority of middle- and lower-income people by 1969.

    The valedictorian of my law school class in 1973 was a married mother of four children and she went on to clerk for Justice Douglas.

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  497. Che Guava says:
    @Jack D

    Eisenhauer is on record as referring to himself as a Swedish Jew.

    The record of his post-war massacres of German soldiers and civilians is clear.

    Combined with the U.S.S.R., it all goes far beyond anything by the Wehrmacht and S.S.

    … and post-surrender!

    Actually, the death toll for Germans, post-surrender, even far exceeds that from firebombs and two nuclear bombs in Japan.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  498. gatobart says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Bullshit, that you believe that the Milky Way turns around the U.S. of A doesn’t make it a reality. It is no use arguing with people like you who think that God created the world in six days starting the Fourth of July of 1776. I was there, in the Southern cone of the Americas where we, contrary to what was happening in Amerrica at the time, used to welcome and enjoy the pop music from the entire world, not only from the U.S. but also from Latin America, Europe and even Asia.

    I don’t think for example that we need Amerrican authorization or acceptance for the most popular Japanese pop song of the era, Sukiyaki, by Kiu Sakamoto, to become a top hit also in our countries as it was in the rest of the world at the time. Neither did we need it for French artists like Adamo, Herve Vilard. Gilbert Becaud, Charles Aznavour, Alain Barriere to become household names in our neck of the woods, people which most likely most Americans were not even aware of their existence. Nether was the case with Italians like Nicola Di Bari, Domenico Modugno, Rafaella Carra, Nada, Dalida, Adriano Celentano, Eduardo Vianello, Or with Spanish singers like Manuel Serrat, Manolo Galvan, Camilo Sesto, Mocedades, Julio Iglesias, Mari Trini, Raphael. Or British ones like Elton John, Engelbart Humperdinck or Tom Jones either. And I am not even mentioning those from Latin America itself and from our own national crop.

    Not a single one of all the singers I have listed needed to appear in Amerrican TV to become world famous, household names in several continents. Not one of them. All they needed was the radio, the TV in more developed countries, and the vinyl record. And of course some movie here and there. But of course, for you at least, the Beatles were the one exception to this rule. They were born, and came to existence the day they appeared in U.S. Tv, hadn’t they crossed the Atlantic the world would have remained blissfully unaware of their existence. Amerrica made them…!

    “If the Beatles had flopped in America, there’s a very good chance that they wouldn’t have been world famous.”

    Just pure, unadulterated bullshit. Just one word: ABBA, ABBA became world famous and one of the most popular pop bands in History thanks to European TV. They made their big breakthrough in Eurovision and from there they conquered the world. Just like Leone’s Western conquered it from the movie Studios of Italy and the sierras of Spain.

    Well, I’ll let you go now so you can continue watching your navel in all peace and tranquility.

    • Agree: BB753
    • Replies: @Curle
  499. Curle says:
    @kahein

    “the only real flaw i see is that we’re too nice and allow you to stick around as breeding stock.”

    Weirdly evasive reply.

  500. Che Guava says:

    Also the claims of Jewish people. It is all really a hideous bad joke.

  501. Wielgus says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Just two, maybe three channels at the time.

    • Agree: Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  502. Art Deco says:
    @Bridgeport_IPA

    often smeared by Neocons as being isolationist and, therefore,

    Yeah, Irving Kristol was busy in 1940 trashing the reputation of Charles Lindbergh.

  503. anarchyst says:
    @Ian Smith

    Yeah, they are too busy handling snakes or concentrating on one Bible passage while elevating and deifying the jews as their masters.

  504. Wielgus says:
    @BB753

    Calvinism has influenced the Scottish national character, which was probably more similar to that of the Catholic Irish before it prevailed. Robert Burns satirised predestination thus, quoting from memory – “Send one to heaven and ten to hell, and no for any harm they’ve done ye”.

    • Agree: BB753
  505. Curle says:

    “Yeah, Irving Kristol was busy in 1940 trashing the reputation of Charles Lindbergh.”

    Kristol was an Jewish Trotskyite at a time Jewish mobsters were facing off against anti-war America Firsters and by extension Lindberg. At age 20 or thereabouts it is unlikely he was influential. But, assuming Trotsky’s Jewish supporters were as anti-neutrality as the Jewish mob and Jews in general it is not outside the realm of possibility or even probability that he was deeply opposed to Lindberg. Better example would have been Meyer Lansky who was committing acts of violence against those promoting neutrality.

    • Agree: IreneAthena
    • Replies: @Patrick McNally
  506. Curle says:
    @gatobart

    Ok, how many of the other British acts that didn’t do as well in the US made it big in Latin America? No need to stop at the British Invasion. How big was Gary Glitter, for instance? Ian Drury? Cliff Richard?

    • Replies: @gatobart
  507. With the new Elvis biopic out, looking forward to reading Steve’s review of it. A few years back he was totally engrossed about the film about Brian Wilson.

    Just a hunch, mind you, but I do tend to think that Elvis Presley’s footprint was substantially weightier upon late 20th century’s popular music than Brian Wilson and thus a review on the new film would be worth the reading.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  508. IreneAthena says: • Website
    @Punch Brother Punch

    Putting butchered baby dolls on your album cover as a pro-abortion message is pretty serious business. — Punch Brother Punch

    I wouldn’t have thought so, not in the UK just a year before The Abortion Act was passed.

    In any event, the original “Beatles Yesterday And Today” cover art was offensive enough to sensibilities generally–I’d assume mainly in the US–that the album was withdrawn shortly after release. For the new cover art, the Beatles shed the lab coats (or butcher coats, or–whatever they were supposed to be), and replaced them with blazers and ties. The sole prop is an unadorned, open footlocker.

    Enlarged pictures of actual aborted babies, now that really would’ve been outré. That was stiff competition for the protesters on the opposite side of the street, with their “just-a-clump-of-cells” slogans, and as a result of that vivid imagery, some of them (and not particularly religious, either, at the time) crossed over.

    • Replies: @Punch Brother Punch
  509. @Hibernian

    Try making a constitutional argument about the right to privacy.

  510. The Beatles, all of them were / are jews.

  511. @Wizard of Oz

    You may be ambivalent about the implied rights of the Constitution but the US Supreme Court has consistently said the Constitution has both. And as I mentioned, the Supreme Court has never litigated the 3rd.

    Even the second amendment is ambiguous as to the right of the people to keep and bear arms since that clause did not pass by itself and needed the militia clause for it to pass. So you can’t make the argument that the 2nd is an express right due to the ambiguity created by the militia clause. Without the militia clause it would have been. Thus the 2nd has taken some twisted interpretation as well. In fact, today’s arms have orders of magnitude more firepower than they did in 1790 and militias have not been seen as a adequate substitute for a standing army since the war of 1812.

    So the 2nd seems far more outdated than the 3rd.

    The primary reason the 3rd has never been litigated is because its meaning is so non controversial.

  512. The American in Monty Python found out Americans were laughing at the wrong things. That is why Junior high children thought they were funny. I first saw MP after I graduated from college. I felt you needed a knowledge of British and European history to understand the jokes. Without this you may not understand why the Cardinal Richelieu imposter is funny.
    My local PBS station played Dave Allen after MP. I found him to be funnier. His was more of a straight comedy show, except you could joke about religion and automobiles.
    Now: “May your gods go with you.”

    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Wielgus
    , @J.Ross
  513. @BB753

    Remember, this was right after the whole “bigger than Jesus” mess. The Beatles also wanted to include Gandhi but their record company objected out of fear it would offend the group’s Indian fans.

    I wonder if the average person in 1967 would have recognized Crowley, maybe that’s why he was allowed. I’m surprised about Marx, though, as there were already conspiracy theories about The Beatles (and hippies and rock n’ roll in general) being part of a Communist plot. The sheer randomness of the members of the “audience” (everyone from Fred Astaire to T.E. Lawrence to Laurel and Hardy to Carl Jung) makes it difficult to lend much significance to any one selection, however. As I said, they were chosen at whim. Perhaps to counter Marx, the cover also features Sir Robert Peel, 19th century Prime Minister, one of the founders of the modern British Conservative Party.

    • Thanks: BB753
  514. @Emslander

    I repeat, no one had any desire for abortion as a right in 1973.

    And I repeat, do you have any evidence for this apart from personal anecdotes? I sent you a poll indicating that by 1975 a substantial majority of the U.S. population approved of abortion under “any circumstances” or under “certain circumstances.” Did it have 0% approval in 1973 but then shot up in two years?

    Human beings have been practicing abortion for at least 3000 years according to archeological evidence. The ancient Egyptians practiced it. There exist artistic representations of abortion in bas relief at Angkor Wat (c. 1150). Aristotle advocated for it (within a time limit). The Catholic Church didn’t begin aggressively condemning abortion until the 19th century. Hell, Frank Sinatra’s mother performed illegal abortions, becoming quite popular and a political power in her New Jersey neighborhood as a result.

    Many human beings have always recognized that family planning and not forcing people to bring to term or raise unwanted children are damn good things.

    You obviously know nothing because you attended some US government school and were born after the year 1997.

    LOL. I was born in 1978. And it’s impossible to know anything if you went to a government school? You can’t study algebra or calculus at any of them? You can’t take a foreign language or a science class? You can’t read books or access information in your spare time? It’s literally impossible to know anything?

    Typical Conservative extreme black-and-white thinking. (And I did go to government schools, although my high school was one of the better ones in my city – it was in an upper-middle class, heavily Jewish part of town. They even still taught Latin.)

    • Agree: davidgmillsatty
    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  515. @Curle

    Trotsky taught his supporters that the war between the Allies and Germany was an inter-imperialist war and that they should seek to mobilize the working class against the Roosevelt administration. The Smith Act was used to prosecute the leaders of the Socialist Workers Party in November 1941 before Pearl Harbor had even occurred. As for Irving Kristol, he had been a follower of Max Schachtman when Schachtman and Burnham were expelled from the SWP. But to be fair, Schachtman adhered to Trotsky’s analysis of the Allied war as imperialist and never supported Roosevelt. Only much later in life would Kristol come to associate himself with support for US wars. Schachtman became a supporter of Nixon in Indochina towards the end of his life. But in 1941 they were all clear that the US was fighting an imperialist war in Eurasia and the Pacific.

    • Thanks: Curle
    • Replies: @Wielgus
  516. @IreneAthena

    I wouldn’t have thought so, not in the UK just a year before The Abortion Act was passed.

    “Yesterday any Today” was a U.S.-only release. Not sure why they would make some sort of statement about a U.K. law on a U.S.-only album cover.

    • Replies: @IreneAthena
  517. gatobart says:
    @Curle

    The Rolling Stones did great in the U.S. , probably after their appearance in the Ed Sullivan Show the 25th of October 1964, following the footsteps of the Beatles who had been there Feb., 09, and yet they remained practically unknown for years in South America, specifically in the South Cone. I got to know because at that time I had become a teenager and every kid at the time was crazy about the Beatles and some even started their own rock bands inspired by them, one of my friends did exactly that, and yet we seemed to be living in a world where there were no other big rock bands Amerrican or British, let alone the Rolling Stones. For us THE British Invasion was The Beatles, period. That, once again, to prove that your obsession about the rest of the world following the U.S. lead when it comes to the things they like or worship has nothing to do with reality. The Rolling Stone followed on the Beatles footsteps to achieve U.S. and I guess world fame yet they remained mostly ignored in Southern South America and I can understand why. Because the Beatles fitted better the middle class tastes & sensibilities of most of our local populace. The Rolling Stones looked and sounded too wild, too out of control, even crazy, and being the Southern Cone of the Americas populated by a predominantly devoted Catholic middle class people stayed away from them while rallying behind the clean cut Beatles even if moms objected a bit to their long hair. There are quite a few cases of big groups or individual stars of the popular music in North America of which existence I became only aware when I came myself to live in Canada, and even that, simply because they didn’t fit the tastes of our predominant middle class. For example I only became aware of the existence of a band called The Doors after watching Apocalypse Now.

    Once again, the rest of the world doesn’t follow the U.S. lead, at least at that time it didn’t, when it comes to artistic or even sports preferences (soccer is the proof) as they stay with what best fits their own cultural inclinations, sensibilities, preferences, etc. That is why Elvis Presley never became an icon in that neck of the woods, because his appeal was above all among the lower strata of society, the working class, and that served to establish an intrinsic form of social differentiation: if you were of the educated middle class you loved the Beatles and you would have never been caught listening to Elvis because that was for the lower strata, the uneducated underclass. Neither the Rolling Stones. Or Little Richard.

    I can tell you what Amerrican individual singer and groups became famous in the 50s, 60s and 70s, in South America and I can tell you why. For ex. The Mamas and the Papas became well known not because they were such a big deal in the U.S, but simply because they had a few singles that everyone loved; California Dream, Monday, Monday and others. Jefferson Airplane stayed completely out of our radar because they didn’t have a single song that people would love or relate to. The same with Peter Paul and Mary, Bob Dylan, Joan Baez, The Doors, etc. On the other hand Chicago, The Four Seasons, Dion and His Diamonds, Santana became household name among us. But even before them, in the 50s, Ray Charles, Nat King Cole, Bill Haley and his Comets, The Platters were wildly popular while no one had even heard of Buddy Holly, Chuck Berry or The Everly Brothers. Let alone country singers as Johnny Cash or Willy Nelson. When still a kid I loved Ricky Nelson and Dean Reed myself but I never even heard the names of Jerry Lee Lewis, Sam Cook or The Drifters.

    All this to debunk your belief that the U.S. stands tall in the midst of global popular culture deciding which artists, bands, songs, will become famous and which will not; which will be those loved and worshiped by the people of the world and which will be rejected. That could be the case now when there is pretty little artistic production either in Europe or Latin America, where native cultures seem to have died out, and where most of what is produced in the U.S. is garbage anyway, but that wasn’t the case until at least the 70s. At the time every country, people, culture decided by themselves what they loved and the freedom of choice reached even the individual level, as in my case.

    • Thanks: davidgmillsatty
  518. IreneAthena says: • Website
    @Punch Brother Punch

    If the intent of the “Beatles Yesterday and Today” album cover art version 1 (Beatles in lab coats festooned with with bloody beheaded baby dolls) was to stick it to Capitol, by shocking—in the North American continent where it was released, of course— to such an extent that retailers would demand a recall, then… mission accomplished, right?

    In order for that scheme to have been successful for an album release in the UK— at the time already ahead of the US by seven years in terms of wearing down resistance to abortion— the baby dolls would have had to be replaced by images of actual aborted babies.

  519. Wielgus says:
    @flyingtiger

    Cardinal Richelieu singing “Don’t Sleep In The Subway Baby”.

  520. Wielgus says:
    @Patrick McNally

    The small number of Trotskyists in Britain at the time stuck to the “imperialist war” line even after the start of Barbarossa.
    There were calls for them to be banned and it was brought up in the House of Commons, but an MP opposing the idea said there were very few of them and it was not worth it. He compared Trotskyists to “Wee Frees” (ultra-Calvinists in Scotland with a reputation for doctrinaire sectarianism) sticking to a line that the Communist Party had held before the German invasion of the USSR but abandoned.

  521. Wielgus says:
    @flyingtiger

    I liked Monty Python for a long time and still like some of their material today though I have gone off other examples of it. I was a rather bookish child in the 1970s and certainly did get stuff like the Cardinal Richelieu joke at the time.
    I remember watching Dave Allen – I did not find him funnier than MP, but to use today’s language he was “edgier” – an Irish comedian and I was watching him on British TV at the height of the Troubles. He gave strong suggestions of religious scepticism without openly saying religion was bunk.
    Another Irish comedian whose name I have forgotten was found to have deserted from the British Army several decades before. I think the British decided not to press charges.

  522. @Punch Brother Punch

    In the pharmacopeias of tribal people worldwide, considerable numbers of mostly plant abortifacients and contraceptives are known. And I believe some of the great apes utilise certain foods for females only, as well.

    • Thanks: davidgmillsatty
    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  523. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    I saw the trailer for the Elvis movie and I was underwhelmed. A fat Tom Hanks plays Colonel Parker.

    • Thanks: Houston 1992
  524. @Che Guava

    Alzheimer’s disease was previously regarded as a form of presenile dementia as recognized by Dr Alois Alzheimer.

    At some point in time it was realized that what was previously called senile dementia was the same thing. In the 1970s we still called it senile dementia.

    Usually diseases that are named after the physician who first described them get an apostrophe. It seems to me that helps to avoid ambiguity.

    If the surname of the doctor is the same as a place name, there could be confusion. For example there is a County Down in Ireland, but the syndrome is not associated with that area.

    But if you had a disease named after a Doctor Washington, it would certainly be confusing to call it Washington disease as many people would probably think it was associated with the city or the state.

    • Troll: Che Guava
  525. Cking says:
    @Saint Ewart

    Because of its’ Irish population, Liverpool was once nominally known as the capital of Ireland.

    • Replies: @Saint Ewart
  526. J.Ross says:
    @Che Guava

    Not to hand but somewhere I have an image of the page from the West Point yearbook calling Ike a “Swedish Jew;” it also says that he is an unexcelled champion taker of naps. It’s a yearbook bio, it’s clearly satirical, and flippant throughout. Few if any of the violently anti-German Americans during WWI were Jewish. Germans gave the Americans furthest removed from Judaism reasons to commit atrocities and victory is a pass for atrocity. Eisenhower was ethnically German yet this background does not seem to have mattered since he considered himself to be an American and not ein Deutscher. He also wasn’t religious until he needed to be for political reasons. There is no way to call Ike a self-identifying Jew, certainly not on record.

    • Troll: Che Guava
    • Replies: @Wielgus
    , @Che Guava
  527. R2b says:

    ”The Beatles Yesterday and Today”- album is interesting, and shouldn’t be taken lightly.

    (Maybe someone could load it as I’m unable.)

    Beatles is a psyop with hypnotic texts and rythm.
    It’s air-wave sound-pollution.
    It’s…..the Monty Python Adorno Crowley-show!

    • Replies: @Che Guava
  528. Anonymous[376] • Disclaimer says:

    We could have a similar discussion about U2, which has a similar ethnic mixture among its members with roots on both sides of the Irish Sea.

  529. Hibernian says:
    @Wielgus

    But for Thy eternal Glory.

  530. @Wielgus

    Interesting poem by Robert Burns. However, predestination is at least compatible with genetics. I am no fan of free will. Highly overrated concept. Nature trumps nurture very consistently. It is even anciently Biblical in the sense of Cain and Able. Would we even have the story if the two were identical twins? I seriously doubt it.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  531. @Cking

    There are more welsh speakers in Liverpool than In Cardiff. scouse actually means mix up, as in Lob scouse , which is a load of vegetables and lamb, boiled to death. Many scottish dropped down too, en route to the new world …it was the Heathrow of the C19th. Got friends with blue eyes who are pretty black by definition. West Indian origin. But we’re all scousers.

    People are more dramatic and showy than the English. Certainly faster in thinking as per port towns everywhere. Anybody can get off a boat, and meet a local girl and get a family going. just don’t try that in Nebraska 🙂

  532. @Anon

    What mattered in America at least was not that they were part-Irish or part Catholic, but that they had Liverpool accents, which don’t sound like British toffs, but more like normal people. The accent sounds vaguely Irish, which gives it a certain gritty charm, but it doesn’t have that awful braying sound of a real brogue.

  533. Curle says:
    @Jim Don Bob

    I’m not surprised. I suspect Elvis was an natural as an interpreter, song selector and vocal stylist. He had great taste in music and that shows on his albums and the songs he popularized. But, that was the entirety of his talents. Wilson, on the other hand . . .

  534. @mulga mumblebrain

    Lemurs, such as the ruffed lemur, use abortifacients.

  535. Wielgus says:
    @J.Ross

    Jews were often somewhat pro-German in WW1, reacting to Tsarist Russia being in the Entente. A Jew of Russian origin in the British Army defected to the Germans a few days before the Somme offensive in 1916. He was only a private but told them what little he knew about the coming British attack. I do not know his subsequent fate, whether he stayed in Germany after the war or returned to Britain or if he even survived to the end (a German file mentioning him was discovered by a British historian about a decade or two ago).
    The “Swedish Jew” stuff, and even more it being taken seriously, is just part of this site’s charm.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  536. Wielgus says:
    @davidgmillsatty

    The notably cheerful and optimistic nature of the Scots owes much to Calvinism (joke).

    • Replies: @davidgmillsatty
  537. Che Guava says:
    @J.Ross

    Read the history on ‘Ike’s’ treatment of capured military and defeated civilians, also Gen. Patton’s comments on it before his assassination,

    I would guess that you already know the truth in what I say, but only intend to mislead people.

    That is the same for the other moronic propagandist who replied.

    • Thanks: anarchyst
    • Replies: @J.Ross
  538. J.Ross says:
    @Wielgus

    Not only Russia. The current top Amalek then was — France! And beyond that, Germany was not only opposed to two Amaleks, Germany was the most philo-Semitic country in the world, and permitted Jews to serve as officers earlier. Somewhere I have a family account of Jewish officers granted liberty during the Franco-Prussian war of all times to go home and celebrate the High Holy Days. A holocaust historian said, if you told a cryosleeper about the holocaust but did not say who did it, he would probably react, “I didn’t think the French could stoop so low.”

  539. J.Ross says:
    @flyingtiger

    The big albatross with Python isn’t that you have to look up a term — if anything, that’s exactly how you win a loyal and nerdy audience. It’s that Americans encountering them out of context twenty years later see them as comedic geniuses creating ex nihilo. In fact, Python was as lazy as any other comedy troop, and as guilty of simply sending-up whatever had been on the telly last week. Something the two decade removed American would not have fresh in memory. But if you do that right, the parody can outlive the parodied.

  540. J.Ross says:
    @Jim Don Bob

    Can a Baz Lurhrmann make a good movie about Elvis? Their tempraments are too far away.

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  541. Patricus says:
    @Dchjk

    Elvis and the Beatles were massive talents. The best days of popular music are behind us.

  542. J.Ross says:
    @Che Guava

    I’m 80% with you but Ike wasn’t Jewish and never self-identified on record as a Jew.

  543. Che Guava says:
    @J.Ross

    What nonsense. Same with your next post. Uneven, sure, also brilliant at times.

    The Goons, likewise. Sellers was the one who made Hollywood fame, but could you for a second say that he was not brilliant in Lolita, Strangelove, or even most of The Party? … and more.

    Milligan, a genius, copied by John Lennon in the latter’s attempts at writing and film. Harry Secombe, who was fat but his voice set my mother’s heart a flutter. Cook, I don’t know so much, seems to have been a good actor.

    All before my time, but all published, filmed, or recorded, so you can say it is all crap or enjoy the best of it.

  544. loren says:
    @Anon

    no paul wrote n sang
    https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Give_Ireland_Back_to_the_Irish
    Give Ireland Back to the Irish – Wikipedia
    ” Give Ireland Back to the Irish ” is the debut single by the British-American rock band Wings that was released in February 1972. It was written by Paul McCartney and his wife Linda in response to the events of Bloody Sunday, on 30 January that year, when British troops in Northern Ireland shot dead thirteen civil rights protestors.
    https://www.the-paulmccartney

    • Replies: @Che Guava
  545. @J.Ross

    To the US, even more funnier than MP, judging by TV ratings, was traditional musical hall comedy as as exemplified in Benny Hill. Unlike the elitist MP, people of all education levels understood the comedy of Benny Hill–it’s more visceral, and direct, while occasionally being sublime. If you look at the US ratings at the time for their favorite overseas comedy, Hill wins hands down over MP.

    • Replies: @Che Guava
    , @Jonathan Mason
  546. Che Guava says:
    @loren

    Yes, I have heard it, a bit of a crap song, but considerably more radical in politics than Lennon Ono’s efforts at the time.

    Since I first heard it, and read the part of the lyrics I was unable to decipher, Uncle Albert Admiral Halsey, which wasn’t bad, very late period Beatles style, seems like one of the nastiest band break-up songs ever, considering that Halsey had banners saying ‘Kill Japs’ and much worse along that line on the decks of his carriers.

  547. Che Guava says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Benny Hill was not ‘traditional music hall’ at all, he was going along the lines of the Carry on … films. IIRC by Ealing Studios.

    Good point to make, though.

  548. @Wielgus

    I was raised Presbyterian in the US. Went to college at a small liberal arts and sciences Presbyterian college. I remember studying Calvin in Sunday School in the 7th grade. The teacher did everything she could to walk away from predestination. Despite going to a Presbyterian college, we never studied Presbyterianism. The problem with the Scottish is that they must have the odds reversed. Nine out of ten of us are good, not the other way around. But that one ten. sure sticks out.

    • Replies: @BB753
  549. FKA Max says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Naturally, I absolutely love this blog post and discussion!

    In this context, I would highly recommend to fellow readers/commenters to revisit/review the Strauss–Howe generational theory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory


    Source: https://andrewhening.medium.com/how-a-pandemic-and-an-obscure-theory-of-american-history-is-giving-me-hope-4dc9ffbd6a73 or https://archive.ph/0SLHD

    Tony Robbins https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Robbins recently interviewed Neil Howe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_Howe , fascinating conversation:

    The Fourth Turning: What past generations can teach us about our future
    Jul 1, 2022

    “Howe and his co-author William Strauss wrote two extremely impactful books – Generations (published in 1991) and The Fourth Turning (published in 1997).

    Strauss’ and Howe’s theory considers the 4-stage cycle that repeats every 80-100 years (approximately the length of a human life, also referred to as a saeculum).

    Their books suggest four turnings of history:
    1. A High
    2. An Awakening
    3. An Unravelling
    4. (Culminating in) A Crisis
    […]
    Additionally, one can consider four generational archetypes (a fancy word for patterns) of people born in the same era and coming of age shaped by the same historical events. The four archetypes Strauss and Howe use to describe generational cohorts are: Prophets, Nomads, Heroes, and Artists. So, for example, Millennials fall into the Hero archetype, while Gen Xers are Nomads, and Baby Boomers are Prophets. The generation born in or after 2005 are Artists. As each archetypal generation reaches the end of its 80-year lifespan, the cycle repeats.”

    Happy Fourth!

  550. @Hhsiii

    According to a biography of the Beatles, at the end of his life Harrison returned to traditional catholicism.

    Interesting that his family gave permission to talk about all the scandals of his life but forbade the author from discussing his return to Catholic faith

    • Replies: @mulga mumblebrain
  551. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Nope. The whole point about Monty Python was that it appealed to the university-educated and so it was different from the usual dross on TV comedy featuring cleaned up versions of night club acts, so was watched by people who wouldn’t normally watch TV.

    I don’t think it was written originally with an American audience in mind at all and the characters, humor, references, and viewpoint are very British.

    Incidentally when John Lennon said The Beatles were more famous than Jesus, this was just a sardonic comment on the over the top reception The Beatles received in the US from adults in the media when they arrived in the US.

    They were not regarded as Gods in Britain at the time, except by teenage girls, perhaps, and adults in the UK certainly didn’t take them seriously.

    The Jesus remark created no stir in the UK.

  552. Anonymous[402] • Disclaimer says:
    @R.G. Camara

    Reminds me of the Muslim guy who refused to listen to Mozart’s music because Mozart was a ‘dirty little pervert.’

  553. @My Comment

    George was a while a-dying, so an each-way bet is a good idea.

  554. @FKA Max

    None of these previous generations faced planetary ecological collapse. I note with interest that the far Right is using this inflationary crisis to agitate for the environment to be absolutely and utterly ignored, and environmentalists demonised as a threat to our ‘standard of living’. A thoroughly expected development, as is the increasing criminalisation and suppression of environmental protests, as pathetic and ineffectual as they are.

    • Replies: @anarchyst
  555. @J.Ross

    Luhrman is a total fraud. I can take about five minutes of his bilge before I enter a rictus of cringing embarrassment.

    • Agree: Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  556. They were neither, they were commies.

  557. anarchyst says:
    @mulga mumblebrain

    “Ecological collapse” is a false doctrine that is used by “greenies” on the left to usher in a bolshevik communist society in which they are the exalted ones that “the rest of us” have to obey.
    The earth is much more resilient than most people (and all greenies) realize.
    One active volcano spews more pollutants than in all of mankind’s history. Let’s not forget the deep sea “vents” that are presently spewing out sulfuric and hydrocarbon compounds and have been doing so since earth’s creation. Ever hear of the La Brea tar pits?
    Mankind has done much more to “clean up” its own pollution sources, a good thing, but is no match for what the earth spews out of its depths on a daily basis.
    Environmentalism is about CONTROL–nothing more.
    There are billions of dollars to be made on the phony, false concept of “globull warming” (oops, I mean “climate change”). Attention greenies: Climate is ALWAYS changing…
    Environmentalists are not content with promoting clean water, air and land, but are hell-bent on controlling human behavior, and yes, promoting extermination plans for much of humanity as these anointed types consider mankind to be a pestilence (except for themselves) to be reduced in population by any means necessary.
    Environmentalists HATE the God-given concept of private property and have imposed government-backed and enforced land use controls on private property owners without compensation, clearly an unconstitutional taking of private property.
    If environmentalists want to control land use, let them purchase it themselves, not by government force. Today the only method of negating government-imposed land use restrictions is shoot, shovel, and shut up.
    If environmentalists have their way, the earth’s human population will be reduced by approximately 90%, (utilizing plandemics and poison “jabs”) with the remainder to (be forced) to live in cities, in soviet-style high rise apartments, utilizing bicycles, buses and trains for transportation. The use of automobiles and access to pristine wilderness (rural) areas will be off-limits to us mere mortals, and will only be available for these anointed environmentalists. Long-distance travel by personal conveyances will be severely restricted or eliminated.
    In a nutshell, today’s environmentalism IS bolshevik communism like watermelon-green on the outside and red (communist) on the inside.
    It is interesting to note that communist and third-world countries have the WORST environmental conditions on the planet. Instead of the USA and other developed countries spending billions to get rid of that last half-percent of pollution, it would behoove the communist countries to improve their conditions first. Here is a question for you environmentalists: Why is there a push for restrictive environmental regulations, but only on the developed first-world countries, and not the gross polluters such as India and China?

  558. gatobart says:
    @Jonathan Mason

    British humor is like British haute cuisine, like Amerrican humility, German self criticism and Russian sobriety.

  559. @FKA Max

    What you wrote and pasted/posted has absolutely nothing to do with my original post. Man, that’s such a gift, being able to turn the conversation into something totally different than what was originally commented upon. Keep it up, keep it up. Will have to remember to return the favor some day.

    “Additionally, one can consider four generational archetypes (a fancy word for patterns) of people born in the same era and coming of age shaped by the same historical events. The four archetypes Strauss and Howe use to describe generational cohorts are: Prophets, Nomads, Heroes, and Artists. So, for example, Millennials fall into the Hero archetype, while Gen Xers are Nomads, and Baby Boomers are Prophets. The generation born in or after 2005 are Artists. As each archetypal generation reaches the end of its 80-year lifespan, the cycle repeats.”

    It depends on where you start dating the whole cohorts. It does appear arbitrary to suggest that the slacker Millennials would fall into the Hero archetype, when they, just like Gen. X, could both fall into the Nomad archetype. Again, it does appear to be arbitrary, and thus subjective, as to what to label each generation.

  560. @Jonathan Mason

    “The whole point about Monty Python was that it appealed to the university-educated”

    And Benny Hill appealed to the lower classes, the working classes (and the masses in general). Though he didn’t make feature films, Benny Hill’s specials were well watched, especially in the US. One would wonder if from a TV ratings standpoint, if Benny Hill outdrew MP during his lifetime. He certainly was as big a superstar in the UK as MP.

    MP’s humor was subtle, satirical, one had to be somewhat familiar with the reverence points to understand some of the jokes, whereas Hill’s humor was visceral, direct, and people of all walks of life could readily understand the humor–usually the key to great artistry (e.g. Chaplin, Keaton, Lloyd, etc)
    Real comedy shouldn’t be “difficult” or too subtle to understand. The Bard of Stafford understood this and readily included jokes for the groundlings to keep their attention while watching his Histories, Dramas, and Comedies.

    “They were not regarded as Gods in Britain at the time, except by teenage girls, perhaps, and adults in the UK certainly didn’t take them seriously.”

    What’s actually droll, if you will, is that a case can be made that Elvis sold more units in the UK than the Beatles ever did. Elvis certainly was near idolized, if not deified, by various sectors of British society, something that came as a total surprise. Examples including, Elvis had a few more hits in the UK of released singles that essentially went nowhere in the US. “Wooden Heart”, for one, was a #1 hit in the uK for 6 weeks when it wasn’t released as a single in the US (at the time). Many of his US hit singles charted higher in the UK than they did in the US. Obviously, Elvis did very well in the US as it was his home base. But that he had lasting success in the UK, for just as long a period time when he never even toured there says a lot about UK’s support for the King of Rock and Roll.

    “The Jesus remark created no stir in the UK.”

    Wasn’t talking about how the comment was received in the UK, but in the US. Interesting that they actually burned their albums after the comment was highlighted in the US, something that didn’t occur with Elvis’s albums.

  561. @Jim Don Bob

    Supposedly the film omits Elvis’s other romances, (e.g. Ann-Margret, Linda Thompson, Ginger Alden, etc), but then, the Elvis Estate gave full backing support to the film, so maybe that was the quid pro quo.

    I’m sorry, but the actor playing Elvis resembles John Travolta in Saturday Night Fever.

    • Replies: @BB753
  562. BB753 says:
    @davidgmillsatty

    “Despite going to a Presbyterian college, we never studied Presbyterianism”

    Are there still Christian colleges out there still teaching Christianity ( even heretical forms of Christianity like Calvinism)?

  563. BB753 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    It’s strange that they couldn’t find an Elvis lookalike who could act in a country with over 100,000 Elvis professional impersonators.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  564. @BB753

    An excellent point. Though to be fair, most of the impersonators largely cover the last 3-4 yrs of his life. There really doesn’t seem to be any Elvis impersonators that focus exclusively on his post-army/movie years, even though that was one of his most commercially successful periods of his career.

    Also, Elvis Presley Enterprises/Graceland, the business side of the estate has a specific agenda and wants to make certain that its idealized image of the biggest music icon in the 20th century is portrayed in a specific manner.

    Can’t wait for Steve’s review of the film Elvis, one of this summer’s biggest block busters. Supposedly there’s already some best actor Oscar buzz for the actor, Austin Butler.

    • Replies: @BB753
  565. BB753 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    It seems to me that the Elvis Estate wants to revive the image of an idol who has lost his lustre. Seriously, the younger generations don’t know who Elvis is or don’t care. That’s their target.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  566. @BB753

    I disagree. The younger generations definitely know who Elvis is, but they don’t think he matters anymore. They identify him with their parents/grandparents. And the same thing is beginning to happen to the Beatles as well. They broke up over fifty years ago. At age 80, Paul isn’t relevant, he should consider retiring soon.

    Eventually it happens to all bands/recording artists. Rock is a young man’s game.

    The other thing about Elvis is that people now associate him with the impersonators, which isn’t a good look.

    But during his lifetime, Elvis was the biggest thing in the music business and commanded the respect across the board from his peers. And that’s the best compliment that can ever be given to a recording artist.

    • Replies: @BB753
  567. BB753 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    I’m not sure if zoomers are more familiar with Elvis than with Pat Boone, for instance. As you say, time is not your friend.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  568. @BB753

    Yes, but with the new Elvis film out this summer doing good box office, it’s an opportunity to expose him to the younger generations. Millennial actor heartthrob Austin Butler plays him, and it also has a soundtrack with younger artists that zoomers definitely can relate to (e.g. Eminem, Doja Cat, etc).

  569. hhsiii says:
    @Anon

    Yeah, I just heard a clip of Ringo (Happy birthday on July 7) on Sirius Beatles Channel, and he was saying John had a very posh upbringing compared to the other 3. But he said they didn’t make much of it. He was sickly, in hospital for months. And I think his stepdad was nicer. But yeah, he grew up in the Dingle, supposedly a rougher hood.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  570. @hhsiii

    John: “Where you from?”

    Ringo: “Dingle.”

    George: “How do you stay alive down there?”

    Ringo: “They’re just cheeky working class people.”

    From Birth of the Beatles (1979)

    • Thanks: hhsiii

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