RSS
Nominally, that $700 million is the biggest contract in the history of sports, bigger even that Lionel Messi’s with Barcelona in 2017. It’s not really $70 million per season, though, because more than half of the payments will be deferred until some point in the future. But no details have been released yet, so you can’t yet calculate the net present value of the deal.
Over the last three seasons, Japan’s unique pitcher-slugger has been worth 28.5 wins above a replacement-quality player (i.e., a fill-in player that could be readily obtained from the minor leagues or from another team). Half is from his value as a starting pitcher, half from his slugging as a designated hitter.
That’s a huge figure for modern baseball outside of the steroid level. For example, from 1990-1992, a pre-PED Barry Bonds in his prime was worth 26.7 and in the same years, Roger Clements was worth 27.0.
I don’t think the following list includes all the examples of star players going back to the 1940s with a three year stretch of spectacular Wins Above Replacement, but it includes a lot of them. It show that Ohtani’s 2021-2023 run ranks among the legends.
| Star | Years | WAR |
| Willie Mays | 1963-1965 | 32.9 |
| Barry Bonds PEDs | 2001-2003 | 32.8 |
| Mickey Mantle | 1955-1957 | 32.6 |
| Ted Williams | 1941-1946 | 31.0 |
| Bob Gibson | 1968-1970 | 30.5 |
| Wilbur Wood | 1971-1973 | 30.0 |
| Joe Morgan | 1974-1976 | 29.2 |
| Shohei Ohtani | 2021-2023 | 28.5 |
| Roger Clements PEDs | 1996-1998 | 27.8 |
| Mike Trout | 2014-2016 | 27.8 |
| Stan Musial | 1948-1950 | 27.7 |
| Randy Johnson | 2000-2002 | 27.7 |
| Albert Pujols | 2007-2009 | 27.7 |
| Alex Rodriguez | 2000-2002 | 27.5 |
| Ernie Banks | 1958-1960 | 27.4 |
| Robin Roberts | 1952-1954 | 27.2 |
| Hank Aaron | 1961-1963 | 27.1 |
| Roger Clemens pre-PEDs | 1990-1992 | 27.0 |
| Barry Bonds pre-PEDs | 1991-1993 | 26.9 |
| Mookie Betts | 2016-2018 | 26.6 |
| Phil Niekro | 1977-1979 | 26.3 |
| Jackie Robinson | 1949-1951 | 26.3 |
| Tom Seaver | 1971-1973 | 26.0 |
| Sandy Koufax | 1963-1965 | 26.0 |
| Cal Ripken | 1989-1991 | 25.7 |
| Mike Schmidt | 1974-1976 | 25.5 |
| Greg Maddux | 1994-1996 | 25.4 |
| Roberto Clemente | 1966-1968 | 25.4 |
| Wade Boggs | 1985-1987 | 25.4 |
| Ken Griffey Jr. | 1996-1998 | 25.4 |
| Ferguson Jenkins | 1969-1971 | 24.6 |
| Robin Yount | 1982-1984 | 23.7 |
| Curt Schilling | 2001-2003 | 23.3 |
| Clayton Kershaw | 2013-2015 | 23.1 |
| Max Scherzer | 2016-2018 | 21.4 |
| Aaron Judge | 2021-2023 | 21.1 |
| Jacob DeGrom | 2017-2019 | 20.9 |
| Pete Rose | 1972-1974 | 20.2 |
| Marcus Semien | 2021-2023 | 20.2 |
| Bryce Harper | 2015-2017 | 16.1 |
| Gerrit Cole | 2021-2023 | 15.6 |
Baseball appears to be getting harder to dominate for three years in a row the way Ohtani has. If you go back to the beginning of the 20th Century, fireballer Walter Johnson had 40.0 WAR from 1912-1914 and Babe Ruth 34.1 from 1926-1928. In contrast, Bryce Harper is considered a superstar of the current game, but his best three year stretch only adds up to 16.1.
Probably the most forgotten name on the above list is knuckleballer Wilbur Woods who pitched an insane number of innings for the Chicago White Sox in the early 1970s.
In any case, it’s a risky deal for the Dodgers because it’s not clear if Shohei Ohtani will ever pitch again. He’ll take next year off from pitching due to surgery late last season. He apparently will be able to swing the bat in 2024. Last season he was the best hitter in the American League.
On the other hand, when not pitching, Ohtani has been playing designated hitter. And it’s not all that hard to get a lot of production out of the DH spot. For example, last season the Dodgers signed aged slugger J.D. Martinez to a one year deal for $10 million and got a ton of power out of him.
If Ohtani is washed up as a pitcher, he presumably can play left or right field and be a modest defensive asset on top of his bat, and let somebody less athletic DH.
Ohtani is 2.5 years younger than when Albert Pujols signed his disastrous 10-year-deal with the California Angels in 2012.
The Dodgers, a very smart franchise, presumably have theories for how they will pay Ohtani’s huge contract. Presumably, they figure on extracting revenue from Japanese in Japan in various ways.
The Los Angeles Dodgers made a fortune off of Mexican pitcher Fernando Valenzuela by making the Dodgers even more popular with Mexican-Americans in Southern California than they had already been. Before that, Sandy Koufax had gladdened Southern California’s large Jewish population.
The Japanese-American population isn’t that big, but perhaps the Dodgers think Ohtani will galvanize the Asian-American population in general, both in SoCal and nationally.
On the other hand, Ohtani doesn’t speak much English, is a private person who doesn’t go out much (I recall a news story that Ohtani going out to a restaurant during the mid-season All Star break was the first time he’d set foot in a restaurant since spring training), and cultivates a pleasantly boring image. The most famous thing about him off the field is that during the off-season he works out six hours per day and sleeps 12 hours per day.
All in all, I expect a ticket to Dodger Stadium will be even less affordable than it already is.
English
Arabic
Chinese (Simplified)
Dutch
French
German
Hebrew
Hindi
Italian
Japanese
Korean
Persian
Polish
Portuguese
Russian
Spanish
Swedish
Turkish
Vietnamese
Now tell us how much the billionaire club owners are pulling down.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/die-in-the-air/#comment-6299859
Oh, Canada!
Failing to do that if caught results in large fines and possible individual license revocation.
No other solo buyers admitted to doing that (it can be easily checked online).
Needless to say I didn't trust such a buyer for my clients.
Ignoring the rules/laws when you can get away with that is a hallmark of subcon ethics. Not all of them of course but part of their homeland's culture.
Something like 80% of stock exchange businesses in India are family controlled. A real marker of a low trust, poor ethics society.
Stock markets in Western societies were created so you didn't have to solely rely on family members for capital. For that you have to trust non family not to cheat you.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @Reg Cæsar
Massively OT:
Get a load of this:
UPDATE: Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I have no idea of her story, and I would expect that if she was as decorated and awarded as she was that she at least had some significant merit beyond just being a black woman. But it appears that Navy sister cracked up in a big way.
Maybe she just cracked up on her own, but we’ve seen too many veterans (many with remarkably suspicious ties to military intelligence: OKC bomber, Beltway Sniper, etc.) commit atrocities over the decades to dismiss outright the possibility that this was part of some kind of false-flag/psyop.
She may well have mental issues, but the chance she was encouraged by other unknown actors (who saw her as a useful idiot) is real.
Was this yet another “hate hoax” gone wrong?
To sum up…all gimmes nothing of note.
Guaranteed she was looking to get whitey blamed for the arson.
Way OT: Get a load of this
Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I would guess that with her level of awards and decorations she has some merit and accomplishment besides being a token black woman but who knows what her story is. It seems that our Navy sister cracked up in a big way.
"Henderson received a national defense service medal and good conduct medal during her service. She was also given the Navy “E” ribbon among other awards."
National Defense is given to every single armed forces recruit who shows up for boot camp. The Good Conduct is awarded for three of service without getting into trouble. The E Ribbon is assigned to all personnel assigned to duty on a ship that wins some sort of efficiency award.
So she signed up, showed up, and didn't get in trouble. Move over Audie, we've got an honest to god true American hero on our hands.Replies: @J.Ross, @Ganderson
What is the effect upon team spirit of having a player with that size contract (who uses a translator) in the dugout, on the team plane, etc. This is not golf; it’s a team, and I wonder whether this is an intangible. If I were Mookie, I might be thinking, Hey, I bowled a 300 game.
I'd be gifting him alcohol and a lot of it.
It would be great if a white player like Bryce Harper started bringing a translator to his press conferences, and insisted that the question be given to the translator, after which the translator would repeat the question to Harper in English, Harper would then answer the translator in English, and then finally the translator would relay the answer back the the media.
Just to show how absurd the entire fake affair is.
Straya.
He can be pitched around if the ‘matchup’ doesn’t work for the opposing pitcher. Yes he’s a wonderful talent but in this game you don’t have to deal with him, if you don’t want to.
LAD paid lots, but were they bidding against themselves?
Or hoping for more ticket sales to local Japanese? Did the Angels get that?
Yes, all Japanese study English in school and if he hasn’t built on that at all, it is intentional. I suspect Ohtani wanrs to go back to Japan, and the Dodgers needed this big deal to prevent that, but the payoffs are in the future, so he can’t collect $200m and go home after 3 years. I bet he goes home early and gets underpayed.
He can be pitched around if the ‘matchup’ doesn’t work for the opposing pitcher. Yes he’s a wonderful talent but in this game you don’t have to deal with him (a DH), if you don’t want to.
LAD paid lots: but were they bidding against themselves?
If he can’t speak English clearly, he’ll have a hard time making big endorsement money. Steph Curry sounds like he’s on tranquilizers, but he’s all over my TV, maybe because he went to college here in NC.
https://live.staticflickr.com/2485/4225405176_414629363d.jpg
Also famous in Japan for playing in American leagues.
I’m guessing tourists from Japan would be a bigger payoff than local Japanese-Americans, but the Dodger front office probably has calculated that question.
I think the payoff would mostly depend whether Ohtani excites non-Japanese Asian-Americans as the Asian superstar and makes the Dodgers the national favorite of the 20 million Asian Americans. That’s not a trivial market.
Asian-American might get excited about an Asian-American athlete (e.g. Jeremy Lin), but I haven't seen much evidence that they get all that excited by a foreign Asian player, especially one that comes from an ethnic group that is fading in size and salience among "Asians" in America.
The two largest Asian sub-groups in America are 1) the Chinese (who likely harbor anti-Japanese sentiments if anything) and 2) the Indians, who care nothing about sports, except maybe cricket (highly unpopular in the U.S.).Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Rich
This video does a pretty good job explaining the economic impact of having Ohtani on your team.
Spoiler Alert: He seems worth it.
He’s the anti-Babe. Babe Ruth didn’t work out at all and he partied 12 hours a night.
I don’t think Ohtani will be playing much outfield next season. He’s not washed up as a pitcher, but he needs to rest his arm for a year. Having to make hard throws from the outfield would put too much stress on the arm. The Dodgers won’t be taking any risks with their 700 million dollar investment.
Most Asian-Americans don’t have pan-Asian sentiments as blacks do about blackness as such. Nor do they speak a common language as Hispanics do.
Asian-American might get excited about an Asian-American athlete (e.g. Jeremy Lin), but I haven’t seen much evidence that they get all that excited by a foreign Asian player, especially one that comes from an ethnic group that is fading in size and salience among “Asians” in America.
The two largest Asian sub-groups in America are 1) the Chinese (who likely harbor anti-Japanese sentiments if anything) and 2) the Indians, who care nothing about sports, except maybe cricket (highly unpopular in the U.S.).
https://www.amazon.com/Japans-Holocaust-History-Imperial-Murder-ebook/dp/B0CLKZNPTCJapanese conservatives will protest this book, but that's just going to increase its notoriety. CCP and its propagandists (many of whom these days are non-Chinese, but rather white, Jewish and Indian) will also promote this book.Replies: @SFG, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
I don't think Ohtani will be playing much outfield next season. He's not washed up as a pitcher, but he needs to rest his arm for a year. Having to make hard throws from the outfield would put too much stress on the arm. The Dodgers won't be taking any risks with their 700 million dollar investment.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @deep anonymous
“Babe Ruth didn’t work out at all”
After his disgraceful 1925 season, Ruth hired a personal trainer and worked out all winter. This helped him enjoy a massively productive additional decade.
1965 was Johnny Keane's first (and only full) season as Yankees manager, and they had a losing record of 77-85, 25 games behind the Minnesota Twins.
The Yankees only losing season in between was the aforementioned 1925, when they went 69-85, 28½ games behind the Washington Senators. It is worth noting that Ruth still had the highest OPS on the team, with a slash of .290/.393/.543 with 25 HR and 67 RBI in 98 games.
Bringing it back to a common iSteve topic, one of the Yankee coaches in 1925 was Fred Merkel.
https://twitter.com/datepsych/status/1733586251289161956Replies: @Almost Missouri
Presumably their definition of “children” includes ripe 16- and 17-year-olds.
Here’s Britney Spears to explain:
at age ~15.
If you are Australian, you just joined 15.1%. If you are not Australian, you just joined ~97%. Why are Australians so gay?
[h/t Anglin]
https://imgur.com/a/Sf71MQB
https://imgur.com/a/RPHRyga
I have no idea if the results are representative of the general population.
And they will still lose in the playoffs.
Next, they sign the ghost of Sandy Koufax for 7 trillion dollars, with a tie-in to dead Dodgers fans.
And they will still lose in the playoffs.
...... but go ahead - pick next years' World Series winner.Replies: @RadicalCenter
I don't think Ohtani will be playing much outfield next season. He's not washed up as a pitcher, but he needs to rest his arm for a year. Having to make hard throws from the outfield would put too much stress on the arm. The Dodgers won't be taking any risks with their 700 million dollar investment.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @deep anonymous
We already have a similar data point with the way the Phillies eased Bryce Harper back into their lineup while he was rehabbing from a similar injury. With, as you point out, the added massive factor of Ohtani’s value as a pitcher hanging in the balance. So no doubt you are correct, Ohtani will “play” DH this season. The bigger question long term is whether he will resume pitching as a starter, or maybe become a closer/high leverage pitcher.
That wouldn’t be the first time “children” was given an expansive interpretation for, arguably, polemical reasons. Just look at how modern leftists harp incessantly about feral Black! teenage criminals as “Dey was just keeedz!” And we hear regularly about the “epidemic” of “children” who are “murdered by handguns.” The reality of course is that teenage Black! males are heavily involved in serious crimes and they pack heat. Which they frequently direct at each other.
Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I would guess that with her level of awards and decorations she has some merit and accomplishment besides being a token black woman but who knows what her story is. It seems that our Navy sister cracked up in a big way.Replies: @Skyler the Weird, @HammerJack, @Mike Tre
Caught doing a false flag for Antifa. That leftist anti police ‘protest’ is starting to peter out. I imagine burning down the martyrs ancestral home would have reignited it.
In a salary-cap league, such a signing is high-risk, and thus a good option for teams that know their scouting/development is bad. If you’re probably going to be bad, rolling the dice is a good option.
In baseball, it’s less clear how disastrous such an amount of money will be if he declines (which he almost assuredly will to some degree).
As a boring person, I always enjoy seeing other boring people excel.
Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I would guess that with her level of awards and decorations she has some merit and accomplishment besides being a token black woman but who knows what her story is. It seems that our Navy sister cracked up in a big way.Replies: @Skyler the Weird, @HammerJack, @Mike Tre
I’d assumed she was just trying to raise awareness.
Could Ohtani warm up as a reliever in the bullpen while hitting as a DH, who is supposed to be sitting in the dugout? Does he run back and forth between dugout and bullpen every half inning? If he were playing right field, he couldn’t warm-up at all, except for his eight practice throws on the mound when he comes in.
Unless you are Mariano Rivera, relief pitchers don’t accumulate a lot of WAR. It sounds simpler and about as profitable just to have him play right field every day.
2023 Baltimore Orioles Statistics Top 12 Players
Your larger point may well be correct though. I had not thought in detail about the mechanics of how Ohtani could move from DH to the bullpen to the mound within a single game, for example. And it also would depend on how good a defender he is.Replies: @Steve Sailer
Next, they sign the ghost of Sandy Koufax for 7 trillion dollars, with a tie-in to dead Dodgers fans.
And they will still lose in the playoffs.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Old Virginia
Sandy Koufax would have to die first, and every time I see him waving to fans lately, he looks like he’ll outlive Henry Kissinger.
Not to mention that in 10 years, 70 million won't buy a loaf of bread.
Get a load of this:
UPDATE: Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I have no idea of her story, and I would expect that if she was as decorated and awarded as she was that she at least had some significant merit beyond just being a black woman. But it appears that Navy sister cracked up in a big way.Replies: @Paul Jolliffe, @ATate
Hmm.
Maybe she just cracked up on her own, but we’ve seen too many veterans (many with remarkably suspicious ties to military intelligence: OKC bomber, Beltway Sniper, etc.) commit atrocities over the decades to dismiss outright the possibility that this was part of some kind of false-flag/psyop.
She may well have mental issues, but the chance she was encouraged by other unknown actors (who saw her as a useful idiot) is real.
Was this yet another “hate hoax” gone wrong?
Usual weather in SoCal?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilbur_WoodReplies: @ScarletNumber
Asian-American might get excited about an Asian-American athlete (e.g. Jeremy Lin), but I haven't seen much evidence that they get all that excited by a foreign Asian player, especially one that comes from an ethnic group that is fading in size and salience among "Asians" in America.
The two largest Asian sub-groups in America are 1) the Chinese (who likely harbor anti-Japanese sentiments if anything) and 2) the Indians, who care nothing about sports, except maybe cricket (highly unpopular in the U.S.).Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Rich
Taiwanese are Japanophilic, full stop. PRC diaspora are either Japanophilic and anti-CCP, or anti-Japan and pro-CCP, very little in between.
Also, some people make big bucks out of instigating intra-Oriental enmity, like the author of this forthcoming book. I don’t think Dodgers will be promoting it
Japanese conservatives will protest this book, but that’s just going to increase its notoriety. CCP and its propagandists (many of whom these days are non-Chinese, but rather white, Jewish and Indian) will also promote this book.
My best guess is you don’t see a Yellow Pride movement because of that and the negative associations of the color in the West.Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @nebulafox
Years of post-bubble recession combined with painful economic restructuring as well as the rise of China and Korea have reduced the feeling of specialness that the Japanese used to feel in the 80’s and early 90’s. The Japanese were really quite insufferable at that time.
What, no way! People on this site have told me that success comes naturally to white people – no effort (aka grinding when Asians do it) required! 😉
Asian-American might get excited about an Asian-American athlete (e.g. Jeremy Lin), but I haven't seen much evidence that they get all that excited by a foreign Asian player, especially one that comes from an ethnic group that is fading in size and salience among "Asians" in America.
The two largest Asian sub-groups in America are 1) the Chinese (who likely harbor anti-Japanese sentiments if anything) and 2) the Indians, who care nothing about sports, except maybe cricket (highly unpopular in the U.S.).Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Rich
For some reason I work with and am acquainted with a lot of Asian people, and I lived in Asia for a year. From my experience, Koreans hate everyone except other Koreans, Japanese believe they are better than everyone else, Chinese know they are better than everyone else, Filipinos have a chip on their shoulder feeling everyone looks down on them, Indonesians can’t figure out how the Dutch abandoned them, the only Vietnamese I know escaped from the commies and feel everyone else is against them. Indians are a completely different universe. They still believe in their caste system, I’ve had several different Indians explain to me where they stand in that system, and they seem pretty happy with it. Guyanese Indians, and we have a horde of them here in NY, are more like Hispanic immigrants and barely act Indian, although they will sometimes explain how their Indian ancestors were indentured servants who were above the blacks down there in the colonies. I don’t think Ohtani is going to bring anything but a handful of Japanese tourists to buy tickets.
Koreans are truly the Irishmen of Asia. They can sing, dance, and produce soulful poetry. They hate their oppressors, but they hate their ethnic kin neighbors even more! The same kind of people as the Irish who could have conquered world were they not getting drunk and fighting one another far more viciously than the outsiders.
To paraphrase Edward I in the film Braveheart, the problem with Korea is that it is full of Koreans.Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
The Seattle Mariners did well with Ichiro bringing tourist fans from japan to seattle. Not sure what Ohtani did bringing them to see the Angels. Dodgers already draw close to 4M people a year so prob already sell out lots and not much more to add in attendance, though they can raise ticket prices. Prob lots of opportunities to sell tourist packages to japanese with visits to Dodgers stadium and Hollywood and Nat’l Parks. Prob done before with the Angels but Dodgers prob a bigger name even in Japan so maybe they do better. And don’t know how tv rights to MLB baseball work in Japan but now more interest to monetize.
Skeptical that non Japanese Asians will be int’d and care about the change from the Angels to Dodgers, or that there will be a wave of interest in American Asian Americans now moving to follow Dodgers.
OT but as an Easterner I first went to a game at Dodger Stadium about 9 years ago and really struck how Dodger Stadium is enduring and still unique and charming. It was built just prior to the many charmless cookie cutter facilities built in the 60’s for both baseball and football in NY, Phil, Pitt, STL, Cinn, etc – all thankfully since knocked down.
https://www.amazon.com/Japans-Holocaust-History-Imperial-Murder-ebook/dp/B0CLKZNPTCJapanese conservatives will protest this book, but that's just going to increase its notoriety. CCP and its propagandists (many of whom these days are non-Chinese, but rather white, Jewish and Indian) will also promote this book.Replies: @SFG, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
I’m not an expert on East Asian history (though Zhuge Liang seems pretty cool), but from what I’ve seen of opinion polls of Asians here and elsewhere, Japan is tremendously unpopular everywhere there (which granted is 3 or 5 countries depending on your definition) on account of their actions but the citizens of the actual countries tend to be more concerned about the rise of China. It’s revealing you only now see Japan and South Korea starting to cooperate with each other-comfort women, etc.
My best guess is you don’t see a Yellow Pride movement because of that and the negative associations of the color in the West.
(You can think of Vietnam’s mentality with China as being a lot like Mexico’s with the US. It’s too big to piss off and it has culturally influenced you too much to truly HATE the place. But too much of your distinct national identity has been defined in opposition to the colossus to the north and its attempts-real or perceived-to make a satellite out of or absorb you.)
I think the big difference is that Vietnam’s other dealings with foreign rule or intervention were not noticeably better than Imperial Japan: not worse, but not better. It didn’t hurt that the Japanese used the Vichy French through the war and then proceeded to eject and disarm them in 1945. Some Japanese officers would stay on and advise the Viet Minh rather than enter Allied POW camps and go back to bombed out rubble.
Also, arguably the ugliest one-off Japanese atrocity of the war took place in 1945 in Manila, and the Philippines get along fine with Japan. The Filipinos are a notoriously forgiving bunch, to be sure, but I think that does point to a significant domestic political element in China and South Korea invested in keeping anti-Japanese sentiment alive as a major political force. The former requires little explanation, but for the latter, there’s little strategic benefit. If China cuts off the shipping lanes, they’ll both be in trouble.Replies: @Jim Don Bob
Either way, they will still lose in the playoffs.
Not to mention that in 10 years, 70 million won’t buy a loaf of bread.
Exhibition games in Hawaii could be a crowd-pleaser for locals and Japanese tourists.
Obscene amount of money to play sportsball. The Dodgers, like the Atlanta Braves and the Minnesota Vikings, and Buffalo Bills traditionally CHOKE in the post season. They haven’t won a World Series title in a FULL SEASON since 1988 despite making 17 playoff appearances since then and a 11 in a row. All these post season appearances and only 1 WS title in the shortened 2020 season. Since moving to LA, the Dodgers have been in 12 World Series and won only 3.
https://youtu.be/km2g18I9NQsReplies: @Trinity
I believe Ruth chopped wood as part of his training regimen. Seems like more baseball players would benefit adding this exercise to their off season routines. Seems like a perfect fit for a baseball player who is a non pitcher.
https://twitter.com/rohanarezel/status/1733172658446188647
Oh, Canada!Replies: @Chrisnonymous, @AndrewR, @Muggles
In Japan, I met an Indian who had been living in the US and Canada who admitted to lying about skills he had. He had worked in tech in the health care industry and claimed it was easy to lie about his skills and then learn on the job and on the fly. While dishonest, I have to have a grudging respect for the ability and… chutzpah!!
If you were to attempt a similar strategy, it wouldn't work because your co-ethnics aren't going to do a fake interview for you, refuse to background check you, teach the elementary aspects of your position, and shoulder the burden of assuming tasks that you're not sufficiently competent to do.
The chutzpah doesn't work if you show up on Day 1 and don't know what you're doing. It only works if you have a large network of kinsmen who will carry you on their back and pretend you're one of the best hires in the corporation's IT department.
Ethnic networking is the way forward, whether it be the Subcontinental caste system, Chinese Guanxi, or Kosher nepotism. Sometimes, ethnic networks can take over not just industries, but entire geographic territories. We see this in South Florida (Cubans & South Americans), Beverly Hills (Persians), Dearborn (Arabs), Glendale (Armenians), etc. Back 100 years ago, the various tribes of Ellis Islanders utilized this strategy quite effectively...
Only Northern Euro White people are "dumb" (ethics, honesty, and integrity are viewed as "dumb" in most of the world...) enough to play by the rules, treat all the applicants the same, and hire by merit.
That's why you're not supposed to let a group of foreigners assume management/executive positions in your top tech companies. The potential for ethnic nepotism is unlimited. Whereas if illegal alien day laborers practice nepotism in industries like construction and house cleaning, it doesn't amount to much at the end of the day.Replies: @Anon
Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I would guess that with her level of awards and decorations she has some merit and accomplishment besides being a token black woman but who knows what her story is. It seems that our Navy sister cracked up in a big way.Replies: @Skyler the Weird, @HammerJack, @Mike Tre
The article uses “decorated” 4 times. Here are her most remarkable decorations:
“Henderson received a national defense service medal and good conduct medal during her service. She was also given the Navy “E” ribbon among other awards.”
National Defense is given to every single armed forces recruit who shows up for boot camp. The Good Conduct is awarded for three of service without getting into trouble. The E Ribbon is assigned to all personnel assigned to duty on a ship that wins some sort of efficiency award.
So she signed up, showed up, and didn’t get in trouble. Move over Audie, we’ve got an honest to god true American hero on our hands.
National Defense is being alive during war -- I was on leave for IX/XI and still got it.
Navy Commendation (which I didn't get) can be scandalously cheap in the right command.
There were ribbons people got "automatically" as a recruitment trick, but not in the Marines.
The reasoning here is when you show up at your new duty station, you're wearing your ribbons -- which your new boss has learned to read as fluently as a Tom Clancy novel -- and so certain judgments can be instantly made.
There are also unit awards. The most apologizing a good but oversold man gave in my hearing for his fruit salad was a sergeant who was pretty much an auto mechanic, but he had been somehow attached to an elite pack of operators who operated operationally, not as one of them but to service their vehicles, and he was (correctly) very quick to point this out when people inevitably observed his "accomplishments."
Our rank symbols are dumb (I would eliminate distinction by color and follow the superior Israeli model of one-for-one -- ie, an O-3 should be three bars, not two) and our medal system should be like that of the British: you pretty much should be suffering injury before you get something pretty to wear.Replies: @Mike Tre
Wonder if Emmet Till’s dad got one, too?
the team — especially younger players who have yet to reach arbitration — is likely quite happy because if he underperforms even a little bit, they can use his salary not as a benchmark for negotiations, but as a baseline.
I’d be gifting him alcohol and a lot of it.
You don’t understand the cultural dynamic between the USA and Japan. By being a famous Japanese player on an American team, he can get advertising contracts in Japan. Befote Ohtani, there was Ichiro…
Also famous in Japan for playing in American leagues.
He speaks Engrish. All he’s doing is taking a page from all the mestizos (I recall Manny Ramirez using a translator when he kept getting caught using banned subs) in the MLB. It’s a big FU to American baseball fans, the sports media enable it, and so do the fans who worship this rather dull and uninteresting player.
It would be great if a white player like Bryce Harper started bringing a translator to his press conferences, and insisted that the question be given to the translator, after which the translator would repeat the question to Harper in English, Harper would then answer the translator in English, and then finally the translator would relay the answer back the the media.
Just to show how absurd the entire fake affair is.
Senior moment?
Next, they sign the ghost of Sandy Koufax for 7 trillion dollars, with a tie-in to dead Dodgers fans.
And they will still lose in the playoffs.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Old Virginia
The Dodgers probably WILL lose in the playoffs. I’ll take the field against them.
…… but go ahead – pick next years’ World Series winner.
Stumpy slugger, Hack Wilson, was a hard drinker as well despite being built like a weightlifter at 5’6″ and 190lbs with an 18″ neck. Mickey Mantle was perhaps the fittest alcoholic on the planet in his playing days. Lawrence Taylor? Ken Stabler? Remember reading a book about Stabler where he had roomed with John Matuszak for a season. Matuszak, a physical specimen hardly trained at all and lived on bagels and Cheese Whiz and partied as hard as Stabler. Babe Ruth was certainly not anomaly in the world of sports in the 20th Century.
My best guess is you don’t see a Yellow Pride movement because of that and the negative associations of the color in the West.Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @nebulafox
That’s not true,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Japanese_sentiment
Unfortunately my own co-ethnics the Chinese, spreads this narrative about Japan– to their own detriment since most whites can’t distinguish between East Asians.
I defer to others on this subject. I’ve seen sources claim that the comfort women were better paid than Japanese generals. And I think Koreans buy into Chinese anti-Japanese propaganda, thus exacerbating their own anti-Japan sentiments.
Post-war historiography tends to focus on 1) The anti-Western aspect of Japan’s war, 2) Japan’s alliance with Nazis, 3) Japanese atrocities against other Asians.
That’s missing the point because Japan’s main aim was anti-Russia, not anti-Western. You see this especially now as Japan is Ukraine’s biggest supporter outside of West.
Japan also welcomed Jewish refugees and China was a quasi-ally of the Nazis; but that would muddle the good vs. evil narrative of WWII.
There were some Japanese atrocities but in this regard Chinese and American historians work as a tag team — to emphasize those while distracting from their own.
Beijing in 1939 under Japanese occupation. This was the Zhongnanhai pool, open to public. Ten years later CCP liberated it and became Mao’s private pool. And no more bathing suits, only Mao suits, grey or blue.
I daresay that most East Asians can't always distinguish between themselves either, UNTIL they open their mouths. As the Han Chinese have archeological footprints all throughout East Asia (referring specially in this case to Korea and Japan, as well as China) then really, what is the difference from just a sight test?
Example: A Korean, a Japanese, and a Chinese. All dressed in similar say, Western attire, and a very similar hairstyle. Take three men at the same height, age, and weight. Really, until they open their mouths to speak their own languages, daresay that some wouldn't be able to tell the three apart from one another (e.g. each individual would think that that the other two are part of his nation). Unless one wants to state that each nation carries a distinctively different body odor, there really wouldn't be a 100% foolproof way to state that "Yeah, it's obvious that these three dudes are totally different from one another."
Until of course, they open their mouths and speak their own different languages.
When then open their mouths and speak their languages, then of course the differences become obvious.
In this situation, whites have the obvious advantage of diversity in hair and eye color, whereas (North) East Asians simply do not.
Yet to see a natural born Japanese/Korean/Chinese person of generations of ancient ancestry DNA, and yet is also born with blonde hair and blue eyes (no racial admixture from Western nations, no hair dyes, and no colored contact lenses).
They simply don't exist. And thus it is easier for outsiders to confuse them. At the same time, the original point remains. take three of each group together of similar outward appearances and daresay that each of them will be unable to distinguish them apart (assuming that each tribe does not have their own body ordor).
Until of course, they open their mouths to speak their own native languages.Replies: @Che Guava, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
Didn’t Christiano Ronaldo sign a Billion dollar deal with the Saudi’s?
I don’t think that’s quite right. For example, Felix Bautista had 3.0 bWAR and Yennier Cano had 2.5 bWAR in 2023, just to take two examples with which I am familiar.
2023 Baltimore Orioles Statistics Top 12 Players
Your larger point may well be correct though. I had not thought in detail about the mechanics of how Ohtani could move from DH to the bullpen to the mound within a single game, for example. And it also would depend on how good a defender he is.
In baseball, it's less clear how disastrous such an amount of money will be if he declines (which he almost assuredly will to some degree).
As a boring person, I always enjoy seeing other boring people excel.Replies: @deep anonymous
And yet the Dodgers are more or less the exact opposite of the kind of organization you describe. It may be that they figure having a great hitter and a great pitcher in one person provides a built-in hedge. If Ohtani falters in one realm, he still probably performs exceptionally in the other. He’s a once-in-a-generation talent, that’s for sure.
Agreed. I didn't make it clear, but since MLB isn't salary-capped, and the Dodgers' pockets are deep, they likely think the cost is manageable even if he declines.
> He’s a once-in-a-generation talent, that’s for sure.
No doubt about that.Replies: @deep anonymous
Disciprine rike samurai.
https://twitter.com/rohanarezel/status/1733172658446188647
Oh, Canada!Replies: @Chrisnonymous, @AndrewR, @Muggles
Surf the kali yuga, baby
Roger Clemens not Clements. Wrong in two places, right in one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Clemens
It is interesting to look at his WAR in the 1993-1995 interval between the pre and post PED periods in your table.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/clemero02.shtml
Any idea why his 2003-2005 seasons (aged 40-42!) totaling a WAR of 17.2 don’t appear in your table?
I finally broke down and bought a subscription to The Athletic after reading yet another AI-gibberish story online (there’s a $1/month intro subscription for a year). Most of the agents they interviewed said the Ohtani contract is a no-brainer, but none of that was based on pan-Asian fan support.
I’m a Red Sox fan who’s relieved that our our richer-than-Midas cheapskate owner didn’t choose this moment to pony up. Apart from the fact we need pitching and righty power more desperately, I’m with the minority view in that article that it’s a lotta chips on a single wager.
“Ohtani is, by far, the most marketable player in the game. He netted $40 million in endorsements in 2023, according to Sportico. The next highest was Trout, who earned $5 million.”
My impression is that Japanese baseball players like Ohtani are more sellable than American players like Trout.
Why is it all California? That’s not the America I know.
I predict that Shohei Ohtani Day will eventually become a thing, just like Bobby Bonilla Day is right now.
The Dodgers will continue to lose in the playoffs. Ohtani wasn’t good enough to take the Angels to the playoffs. Yeah, I know, it’s a team sport. But then why are you paying someone 70 million dollars? At least in basketball or football the stars give you tangible results.
To say nothing of “Wilbur Woods”. He’s got Tigger on the brain!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilbur_Wood
https://twitter.com/rohanarezel/status/1733172658446188647
Oh, Canada!Replies: @Chrisnonymous, @AndrewR, @Muggles
When I was selling my single owner business upon retirement the two individual subcons (Indians) who said they were interested in buying it admitted that while they did have state mandated professional licenses, they didn’t also have the required state license to operate the business, separate from the individual credentials.
Failing to do that if caught results in large fines and possible individual license revocation.
No other solo buyers admitted to doing that (it can be easily checked online).
Needless to say I didn’t trust such a buyer for my clients.
Ignoring the rules/laws when you can get away with that is a hallmark of subcon ethics. Not all of them of course but part of their homeland’s culture.
Something like 80% of stock exchange businesses in India are family controlled. A real marker of a low trust, poor ethics society.
Stock markets in Western societies were created so you didn’t have to solely rely on family members for capital. For that you have to trust non family not to cheat you.
Imagine telling a business broker that you don't have the required license, but he should do business with you anyway. Even most unethical people would feel too ashamed to behave in such a brazen manner.
A lot of foreigners (Eastern Euros, East Asians/Chinese, Hispanics/Mexicans) might suggest such an arrangement to a business broker from their ethnic background, but they wouldn't suggest it to an American. They know Americans value rules and aren't going to "play ball" with a shyster.
Being so socially bold & openly shameless is an indicator of something.... I'm not sure what, but there's a deeper significance to these personality traits....
It goes well beyond lacking basic ethics, as is common among most foreigners. I can easily find a Russian or Chinese who wouldn't mind disregarding getting the proper license. However, few are going to be so bold in front of an American.
This reminds me of the sleazy, greasy "wheeler-dealer" personality that you frequently find in "swarthy" ethnic groups, like Italians, Greeks, Turks, Persians, Arabs, Mizrahim, Chaldeans, Copts, Lebanese, Cubans, etc.
“The Japanese-American population isn’t that big, but perhaps the Dodgers think Ohtani will galvanize the Asian-American population in general, both in SoCal and nationally.”
Maybe. Historically there was never an abundance of affection between mainland East Asians (Chinese, Koreans, SE Asians) and the Japanese, During WWII this cultural animosity devolved into outright hatred.
I love Ohtani but I find it interesting that one of his main assets, his pitching, is already shelved for next year. Sooo…what’s next?
Let’s see – discounting 2020, I count 1959,1963,1965,1981,1988.
Have you read the book Ways That Are Dark and if so what did you think of it?
Replies: @J.Ross, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
"Henderson received a national defense service medal and good conduct medal during her service. She was also given the Navy “E” ribbon among other awards."
National Defense is given to every single armed forces recruit who shows up for boot camp. The Good Conduct is awarded for three of service without getting into trouble. The E Ribbon is assigned to all personnel assigned to duty on a ship that wins some sort of efficiency award.
So she signed up, showed up, and didn't get in trouble. Move over Audie, we've got an honest to god true American hero on our hands.Replies: @J.Ross, @Ganderson
Good Cookie is three years out of jail — you can be in minor trouble and still get it.
National Defense is being alive during war — I was on leave for IX/XI and still got it.
Navy Commendation (which I didn’t get) can be scandalously cheap in the right command.
There were ribbons people got “automatically” as a recruitment trick, but not in the Marines.
The reasoning here is when you show up at your new duty station, you’re wearing your ribbons — which your new boss has learned to read as fluently as a Tom Clancy novel — and so certain judgments can be instantly made.
There are also unit awards. The most apologizing a good but oversold man gave in my hearing for his fruit salad was a sergeant who was pretty much an auto mechanic, but he had been somehow attached to an elite pack of operators who operated operationally, not as one of them but to service their vehicles, and he was (correctly) very quick to point this out when people inevitably observed his “accomplishments.”
Our rank symbols are dumb (I would eliminate distinction by color and follow the superior Israeli model of one-for-one — ie, an O-3 should be three bars, not two) and our medal system should be like that of the British: you pretty much should be suffering injury before you get something pretty to wear.
Maybe now. When I was in NJP resulted in the 3 year clock restarting as soon as punishment was handed down by the CO.
"National Defense is being alive during war — I was on leave for IX/XI and still got it."
Well the NDR was an active award up until mid 1996 and then was deactivated until 9/11. I joined in 98 and never got it until I requested an updated copy of my DD214 long after I was out and I noticed the NDR was listed under the awards section. As far as I know it has remained active since then.
Most of the ribbons/medals are BS. In work ups for deployment in 99, our MEU was training off the coast of California when the Coast Guard requested assistance in locating a missing/disabled civilian boat. The boat was found, and every last squid and jarhead on all three ships was awarded a Coast Guard MUC. That thing did attract some curious/suspicious double takes.
Even the cherished Combat Action Ribbon is handed out like strip club flyers on the Vegas strip.
One thing to remember is that he probably has subcaste co-ethnics who hired him and trained him on the job. When more difficult assignments were presented to him, probably a bright kinsman did his work.
If you were to attempt a similar strategy, it wouldn’t work because your co-ethnics aren’t going to do a fake interview for you, refuse to background check you, teach the elementary aspects of your position, and shoulder the burden of assuming tasks that you’re not sufficiently competent to do.
The chutzpah doesn’t work if you show up on Day 1 and don’t know what you’re doing. It only works if you have a large network of kinsmen who will carry you on their back and pretend you’re one of the best hires in the corporation’s IT department.
Ethnic networking is the way forward, whether it be the Subcontinental caste system, Chinese Guanxi, or Kosher nepotism. Sometimes, ethnic networks can take over not just industries, but entire geographic territories. We see this in South Florida (Cubans & South Americans), Beverly Hills (Persians), Dearborn (Arabs), Glendale (Armenians), etc. Back 100 years ago, the various tribes of Ellis Islanders utilized this strategy quite effectively…
Only Northern Euro White people are “dumb” (ethics, honesty, and integrity are viewed as “dumb” in most of the world…) enough to play by the rules, treat all the applicants the same, and hire by merit.
That’s why you’re not supposed to let a group of foreigners assume management/executive positions in your top tech companies. The potential for ethnic nepotism is unlimited. Whereas if illegal alien day laborers practice nepotism in industries like construction and house cleaning, it doesn’t amount to much at the end of the day.
A bit late for that, lol.
I wonder what will happen to Berkshire when Warren kicks the bucket. Last I saw, his top choices to take over were a Jew and an Indian. I'm sure they both are competent though. Don't worry about it, anglos.
(Me, I'm not convinced it's worth keeping Berkshire around as an entity at that point.)
Failing to do that if caught results in large fines and possible individual license revocation.
No other solo buyers admitted to doing that (it can be easily checked online).
Needless to say I didn't trust such a buyer for my clients.
Ignoring the rules/laws when you can get away with that is a hallmark of subcon ethics. Not all of them of course but part of their homeland's culture.
Something like 80% of stock exchange businesses in India are family controlled. A real marker of a low trust, poor ethics society.
Stock markets in Western societies were created so you didn't have to solely rely on family members for capital. For that you have to trust non family not to cheat you.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @Reg Cæsar
I also think there’s an element of Chutzpah.
Imagine telling a business broker that you don’t have the required license, but he should do business with you anyway. Even most unethical people would feel too ashamed to behave in such a brazen manner.
A lot of foreigners (Eastern Euros, East Asians/Chinese, Hispanics/Mexicans) might suggest such an arrangement to a business broker from their ethnic background, but they wouldn’t suggest it to an American. They know Americans value rules and aren’t going to “play ball” with a shyster.
Being so socially bold & openly shameless is an indicator of something…. I’m not sure what, but there’s a deeper significance to these personality traits….
It goes well beyond lacking basic ethics, as is common among most foreigners. I can easily find a Russian or Chinese who wouldn’t mind disregarding getting the proper license. However, few are going to be so bold in front of an American.
This reminds me of the sleazy, greasy “wheeler-dealer” personality that you frequently find in “swarthy” ethnic groups, like Italians, Greeks, Turks, Persians, Arabs, Mizrahim, Chaldeans, Copts, Lebanese, Cubans, etc.
Failing to do that if caught results in large fines and possible individual license revocation.
No other solo buyers admitted to doing that (it can be easily checked online).
Needless to say I didn't trust such a buyer for my clients.
Ignoring the rules/laws when you can get away with that is a hallmark of subcon ethics. Not all of them of course but part of their homeland's culture.
Something like 80% of stock exchange businesses in India are family controlled. A real marker of a low trust, poor ethics society.
Stock markets in Western societies were created so you didn't have to solely rely on family members for capital. For that you have to trust non family not to cheat you.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123, @Reg Cæsar
It’s also why South Asia led the world in non-monarchical female leadership. Sirimavo, Indira, Benazir, Sonia, and Khaleda were all from, or married into, important families.
Was he a form of reparations?
The Ugly, Violent Clearing Of Chavez Ravine Before It Was Home To The Dodgers
The people who gave the “order” to remove those residents and take their property should be in prison for decades. The same for the pigs in the photo enforcing the unconstitutional and unlawful “order.” More scumbaggery by LA city/county “officials” and their pig lackeys.
And we’re Dodgers fans, lol….
Legend says that Raider Fred Biletnikoff used to stub his cigarette out on his way to the field.
Get a load of this:
UPDATE: Woman Who Attempted to Burn Down Martin Luther King Jr.’s Birth Home is a Decorated U.S. Navy Veteran
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/12/update-woman-who-attempted-burn-down-martin-luther
I have no idea of her story, and I would expect that if she was as decorated and awarded as she was that she at least had some significant merit beyond just being a black woman. But it appears that Navy sister cracked up in a big way.Replies: @Paul Jolliffe, @ATate
The ribbons they list (3) for the “decorated” seaman are National Defense; EVERYONE gets it, a Good Conduct Medal;EVERYONE who does at least 3 years active duty and doesn’t get court martialed gets it, and the “E” ribbon awarded to ALL members of a ship, when the ship did what it was supposed to do over 18 months.
To sum up…all gimmes nothing of note.
Guaranteed she was looking to get whitey blamed for the arson.
> And yet the Dodgers are more or less the exact opposite of the kind of organization you describe.
Agreed. I didn’t make it clear, but since MLB isn’t salary-capped, and the Dodgers’ pockets are deep, they likely think the cost is manageable even if he declines.
> He’s a once-in-a-generation talent, that’s for sure.
No doubt about that.
“Over the last three seasons, Japan’s unique pitcher-slugger has been worth 28.5 wins above a replacement-quality player”
So with all that WAR, how many WS did Ohtani help LAA win?
Oh that’s right.
Well, with all that WAR, how many AL Pennants did Ohtani help LAA win?
Oh that’s right.
Answer to both is: 0
All that WAR does not equal actual, you know, WINS as in…a WS Championship or an AL Pennant. Something that’s actually tangible.
If the Dodgers weren’t a global brand before, thanks to Ohtani’s signing, they are now. But I would caution Steve not to naively repeat talking points and assume that just because Ohtani doesn’t speak much English automatically translates into that he doesn’t have a private life.
Is social media as big a deal in Japan the way it is in the US? Would tend to say that it is. Couple that with the fact that Japan’s number one spectator sport remains baseball, and the fact that they have their own celebrity culture, and its very likely that being a superstar in Japan that Ohtani has the best of both worlds. Since few in the West will bother him, he can enjoy his private life relatively unmolested back home, since the Japanese paparazzi aren’t going to make too much noise vs him.
I’d be glad that he’s coming to our Dodgers — except for the inevitable ticket-price increase to help defray his absurd salary.
Agreed. I didn't make it clear, but since MLB isn't salary-capped, and the Dodgers' pockets are deep, they likely think the cost is manageable even if he declines.
> He’s a once-in-a-generation talent, that’s for sure.
No doubt about that.Replies: @deep anonymous
Well, I missed an important qualification you made about salary cap. I guess following the Orioles like I do makes you think everybody else also follows a self-imposed cap. Stupid me! I suppose all teams do, but the cap for the Dodgers is a LOT bigger. Will be interesting to see how they navigate the de facto cap/luxury tax in the next few years. I guess the deferred payments are structured with that in mind.
1) this is how you do it. not the way Mike Trout did it. that’s the wrong way – taking a discount for a losing team. you take the big contract for a contender.
2) i was wrong about Ohtani losing half a billion dollars this season when he got injured. he just signed for more than that.
3) does this contract raise the ante for MLB contracts? all sports ball contracts? MLB is clearly in decline. how could teams afford to pay players more than they already are? “I want at least half of what he got.” historically this is how it has gone, so get ready to get those checkbooks out, teams.
4) the deal is so big, professional economists have been discussing whether the Dodgers can make their money back or possibly even make a profit from the singing. verdict – maybe. the details of television contracts, tickets sales, merchandise are for another post.
https://youtu.be/km2g18I9NQsReplies: @Trinity
I stand corrected. Maybe not the chokers I thought they were, certainly a grade above Buffalo Bills and the Minnesota Vikings.
“Ohtani is 2.5 years younger than when Albert Pujols signed his disastrous 10-year-deal with the California Angels in 2012.”
is he? seem to remember quite a lot of talk about nobody really knowing how old Pujols was and that maybe we was several years older than he claimed.
MLB contracts are guaranteed, so get ready to pay, Dodgers.
While Ohtani dominates Major League Baseball, Heung Min Son, a South Korean player, is breaking records in the English Premier League.
“Ted Williams 1941-1946 31.0”
wasn’t he literally playing against replacement players here? not to disparage him but this was like playing 5 straight seasons against the 1987 NFL teams.
The Dodgers have a big stadium and both an upscale suburban white fan base and a working class urban fan base to fill it. In contrast, the Chicago Cubs have the first and the Chicago White Sox have the remnants of the second, but the two don’t like each other.
2023 Baltimore Orioles Statistics Top 12 Players
Your larger point may well be correct though. I had not thought in detail about the mechanics of how Ohtani could move from DH to the bullpen to the mound within a single game, for example. And it also would depend on how good a defender he is.Replies: @Steve Sailer
Ohtani used to be in the top 10% in footspeed. I’m not sure if he is anymore. But I assume that once his arm heals by 2025 he’d be a fine rightfielder. Of course, the Dodgers already have one in Mookie Betts, but they now want to use Betts at second base all the time. But second basemen get dinged up a lot turning double plays. So putting a 30ish offensive superstar like Betts at second base is risky.
Right, Dodger Stadium is near the Hollywood tourist district. Angel Stadium is convenient for tourists if you go to Disneyland.
No, Koreans hate each other just as much or even more. Koreans in the past 100 years have killed far more of one another than they have Japanese!
Koreans are truly the Irishmen of Asia. They can sing, dance, and produce soulful poetry. They hate their oppressors, but they hate their ethnic kin neighbors even more! The same kind of people as the Irish who could have conquered world were they not getting drunk and fighting one another far more viciously than the outsiders.
To paraphrase Edward I in the film Braveheart, the problem with Korea is that it is full of Koreans.
National Defense is being alive during war -- I was on leave for IX/XI and still got it.
Navy Commendation (which I didn't get) can be scandalously cheap in the right command.
There were ribbons people got "automatically" as a recruitment trick, but not in the Marines.
The reasoning here is when you show up at your new duty station, you're wearing your ribbons -- which your new boss has learned to read as fluently as a Tom Clancy novel -- and so certain judgments can be instantly made.
There are also unit awards. The most apologizing a good but oversold man gave in my hearing for his fruit salad was a sergeant who was pretty much an auto mechanic, but he had been somehow attached to an elite pack of operators who operated operationally, not as one of them but to service their vehicles, and he was (correctly) very quick to point this out when people inevitably observed his "accomplishments."
Our rank symbols are dumb (I would eliminate distinction by color and follow the superior Israeli model of one-for-one -- ie, an O-3 should be three bars, not two) and our medal system should be like that of the British: you pretty much should be suffering injury before you get something pretty to wear.Replies: @Mike Tre
“Good Cookie is three years out of jail — you can be in minor trouble and still get it.”
Maybe now. When I was in NJP resulted in the 3 year clock restarting as soon as punishment was handed down by the CO.
“National Defense is being alive during war — I was on leave for IX/XI and still got it.”
Well the NDR was an active award up until mid 1996 and then was deactivated until 9/11. I joined in 98 and never got it until I requested an updated copy of my DD214 long after I was out and I noticed the NDR was listed under the awards section. As far as I know it has remained active since then.
Most of the ribbons/medals are BS. In work ups for deployment in 99, our MEU was training off the coast of California when the Coast Guard requested assistance in locating a missing/disabled civilian boat. The boat was found, and every last squid and jarhead on all three ships was awarded a Coast Guard MUC. That thing did attract some curious/suspicious double takes.
Even the cherished Combat Action Ribbon is handed out like strip club flyers on the Vegas strip.
Your years for Randy Johnson are off. He ended his career in 2009 when he was 45 years old and barely above an average player, yet you list 2007-09 as the stretch where he had nearly 28 WAR. I think that his three-year peak was from 2000-02.
To be fair, most 16 & 17 year-olds are are skinny, awkward, and child-like in various ways. There’s a reason why most parents don’t let their underaged daughters date adult men.
That’s an anomaly, set up by the entertainment industry to sell precocious sexuality to “Tweens.” There’s a reason why she’s so messed up these days, as are all girls who get sexualized at an early age. It turns out parents are right to protect their young daughters from the “affection” of older men…
Here are the relevant sections.
I have no idea if the results are representative of the general population.
Thanks. I’ll fix it.
“Last season he was the best hitter in the American League.”
Dodger Stadium sabotaged Aaron Judge, who still finished a close second despite missing significant time then playing injured among a lineup of wet noodle replacement level players.
There’s no world that one would take Ohtani as a bat over Judge, Trout, Acuna Jr., Mookie Betts, Freddie Freeman &c. While the Dodgers are a smart organization and we figure they have a sound financial plan; Ohtani the unicorn is not that great an investment when it comes to between the lines.
‘Specially when playing two-ways: he fades annually by August and it’s just gonna get worse going forward as he ages.
...... but go ahead - pick next years' World Series winner.Replies: @RadicalCenter
The Dodgers seem to have at least a slightly better chance of winning playoff series if they do NOT start Clayton Kershaw. And probably also if they do NOT have Dave Roberts making pitching decisions in the final innings.
Some still talk about Bobby Cox the same way. There was a series in the '90s when Cox pulled a starter, the reliever was hit hard and the USA Today criticized Cox for pulling the starter too soon. The very next game Cox left the starter in after a mound visit, the starter got hit and the USA Today criticized Cox for leaving the starter in too long.
Robert E. Lee once said all his best generals were newspaper editors.
If you were to attempt a similar strategy, it wouldn't work because your co-ethnics aren't going to do a fake interview for you, refuse to background check you, teach the elementary aspects of your position, and shoulder the burden of assuming tasks that you're not sufficiently competent to do.
The chutzpah doesn't work if you show up on Day 1 and don't know what you're doing. It only works if you have a large network of kinsmen who will carry you on their back and pretend you're one of the best hires in the corporation's IT department.
Ethnic networking is the way forward, whether it be the Subcontinental caste system, Chinese Guanxi, or Kosher nepotism. Sometimes, ethnic networks can take over not just industries, but entire geographic territories. We see this in South Florida (Cubans & South Americans), Beverly Hills (Persians), Dearborn (Arabs), Glendale (Armenians), etc. Back 100 years ago, the various tribes of Ellis Islanders utilized this strategy quite effectively...
Only Northern Euro White people are "dumb" (ethics, honesty, and integrity are viewed as "dumb" in most of the world...) enough to play by the rules, treat all the applicants the same, and hire by merit.
That's why you're not supposed to let a group of foreigners assume management/executive positions in your top tech companies. The potential for ethnic nepotism is unlimited. Whereas if illegal alien day laborers practice nepotism in industries like construction and house cleaning, it doesn't amount to much at the end of the day.Replies: @Anon
“That’s why you’re not supposed to let a group of foreigners assume management/executive positions in your top tech companies.”
A bit late for that, lol.
I wonder what will happen to Berkshire when Warren kicks the bucket. Last I saw, his top choices to take over were a Jew and an Indian. I’m sure they both are competent though. Don’t worry about it, anglos.
(Me, I’m not convinced it’s worth keeping Berkshire around as an entity at that point.)
Dodger Stadium sabotaged Aaron Judge, who still finished a close second despite missing significant time then playing injured among a lineup of wet noodle replacement level players.
There's no world that one would take Ohtani as a bat over Judge, Trout, Acuna Jr., Mookie Betts, Freddie Freeman &c. While the Dodgers are a smart organization and we figure they have a sound financial plan; Ohtani the unicorn is not that great an investment when it comes to between the lines.
'Specially when playing two-ways: he fades annually by August and it's just gonna get worse going forward as he ages.Replies: @Steve Sailer
Ohtani has averaged 42 homers per year over the last 3 seasons while pitching. (Plus he hits a lot of triples.) When they got rid of the shift this year, he batted over .300.
Remember that Babe Ruth gave up pitching to concentrate on hitting.
Makes no sense.
Also, Babe Ruth was "persuaded" by BOS in 1918-19 to give up pitching because they needed his bat in the lineup every game as opposed to every fourth day.
BOS was going through a major overall with new owner Harry Frazee. The departure of fan favorite and HOF CF Tris Speaker in 1916, and other BOS players who were being unloaded to other teams primarily for cash (as Frazee was also a Broadway play producer and needed money to finance his shows), thus Ruth's bat in the lineup every day helped the Red Sox.
Ruth asked Frazee for a salary increase, at which Frazee balked.
"John Barrymore doesn't make that kind of money!"
"What the hell good would John Barrymore do you in the bottom of the 8th inning, with two outs and two on? Either I get the money or I don't play!"
Well, in January of 1920, Ruth got his reply, sold to NY for $125,ooo, and the rest is history.Replies: @prime noticer
wasn't he literally playing against replacement players here? not to disparage him but this was like playing 5 straight seasons against the 1987 NFL teams.Replies: @Steve Sailer
No, William’s three seasons were 1941, 1942, and 1946 against almost all the top talent except Bob Feller was in the military in 1942 and Hank Greenberg was in the military in most of 1941 and 1942. But DiMaggio and most other rivals of Williams played through 1942. The War Years in baseball were 1943-1945, which Williams missed.
2) i was wrong about Ohtani losing half a billion dollars this season when he got injured. he just signed for more than that.
3) does this contract raise the ante for MLB contracts? all sports ball contracts? MLB is clearly in decline. how could teams afford to pay players more than they already are? "I want at least half of what he got." historically this is how it has gone, so get ready to get those checkbooks out, teams.
4) the deal is so big, professional economists have been discussing whether the Dodgers can make their money back or possibly even make a profit from the singing. verdict - maybe. the details of television contracts, tickets sales, merchandise are for another post.Replies: @Steve Sailer
It’s hard to say what the Net Present Value of this deal is at this point. Interest rates are high so the nominal sum has to be discounted quite a bit, but how much remains a question?
I look at Britney at 15, I see a kid. Look at the baby face.
In 1942, Ted Williams slugged for the Triple Crown and finished SECOND in the MVP voting.
He flew for the Marines from 1943-1945.
In 1946, he was the MVP.
God only knows what he would have done during those three years he spent in the service.
I have a Dodgers-fan friend says the same thing. I’m a life long Braves fan. I hear the same thing from others about Brian Snitker.
Some still talk about Bobby Cox the same way. There was a series in the ’90s when Cox pulled a starter, the reliever was hit hard and the USA Today criticized Cox for pulling the starter too soon. The very next game Cox left the starter in after a mound visit, the starter got hit and the USA Today criticized Cox for leaving the starter in too long.
Robert E. Lee once said all his best generals were newspaper editors.
Any grown man who wants to boink a 16 year old GIRL has some serious issues.
Wilbur Wood!?
At 70 million a year for a decade this guy could feed/ help some homeless people or people in need. Spend 7 million a year, (don’t donate to some ripoff charity organization) make sure you know where the money is going. Portable showers, food, clothes, etc. This guy could become the most popular athlete in sportsball and still be super wealthy. Make greedy bastards like Beszos, Musk, etc., look like the pigs they are.
He flew for the Marines from 1943-1945.
In 1946, he was the MVP.
God only knows what he would have done during those three years he spent in the service.Replies: @deep anonymous
I’m pretty sure he also served in the Korean War in the early 50s. Imagine what his career stats would have been if he had been able to play his whole career uninterrupted.
I still don’t entirely understand why MLB mandated for teams to give up a shift. It’s perfectly legitimate defensive strategy to guard vs power hitters who pull the majority of their H’s and HR’s.
Makes no sense.
Also, Babe Ruth was “persuaded” by BOS in 1918-19 to give up pitching because they needed his bat in the lineup every game as opposed to every fourth day.
BOS was going through a major overall with new owner Harry Frazee. The departure of fan favorite and HOF CF Tris Speaker in 1916, and other BOS players who were being unloaded to other teams primarily for cash (as Frazee was also a Broadway play producer and needed money to finance his shows), thus Ruth’s bat in the lineup every day helped the Red Sox.
Ruth asked Frazee for a salary increase, at which Frazee balked.
“John Barrymore doesn’t make that kind of money!”
“What the hell good would John Barrymore do you in the bottom of the 8th inning, with two outs and two on? Either I get the money or I don’t play!”
Well, in January of 1920, Ruth got his reply, sold to NY for $125,ooo, and the rest is history.
to speed up the game. also why there is a pitch clock now. i'm not into the new rule with putting a runner on second but that's another concession to pace of play.
these things have definitely speeded up the game. not sure how much effect it's having on viewership and ticket sales though.
very low television viewers for the World Series this year, partly due to the teams involved. but MLB is probably slipping below the waterline now. after 130 years, MLB is on it's way out. like pro wrestling, it will always been hanging around in a greatly diminished form, as it still makes money. but it will never be a big deal again.Replies: @Anon
“Unfortunately my own co-ethnics the Chinese, spreads this narrative about Japan– to their own detriment since most whites can’t distinguish between East Asians.”
I daresay that most East Asians can’t always distinguish between themselves either, UNTIL they open their mouths. As the Han Chinese have archeological footprints all throughout East Asia (referring specially in this case to Korea and Japan, as well as China) then really, what is the difference from just a sight test?
Example: A Korean, a Japanese, and a Chinese. All dressed in similar say, Western attire, and a very similar hairstyle. Take three men at the same height, age, and weight. Really, until they open their mouths to speak their own languages, daresay that some wouldn’t be able to tell the three apart from one another (e.g. each individual would think that that the other two are part of his nation). Unless one wants to state that each nation carries a distinctively different body odor, there really wouldn’t be a 100% foolproof way to state that “Yeah, it’s obvious that these three dudes are totally different from one another.”
Until of course, they open their mouths and speak their own different languages.
When then open their mouths and speak their languages, then of course the differences become obvious.
In this situation, whites have the obvious advantage of diversity in hair and eye color, whereas (North) East Asians simply do not.
Yet to see a natural born Japanese/Korean/Chinese person of generations of ancient ancestry DNA, and yet is also born with blonde hair and blue eyes (no racial admixture from Western nations, no hair dyes, and no colored contact lenses).
They simply don’t exist. And thus it is easier for outsiders to confuse them. At the same time, the original point remains. take three of each group together of similar outward appearances and daresay that each of them will be unable to distinguish them apart (assuming that each tribe does not have their own body ordor).
Until of course, they open their mouths to speak their own native languages.
Tested it tonight, 100% correct from vision alone, confirmed each time by waiting to hear speech, on the telephone for the lone ones.
Several of my colleagues are Viet, two would pass as S.E.Asian Chinese or southern Chinese, of course, that isn't a blind test, but the others would not.
The world must not become a melting pot, we need to preserve our differences. Once, perhaps ten years ago, I was riding a slow train in winter, in the snow country. A mother and son boarded along the way, alit after only a few stops.
Her son, aside from being well-behaved, was very interesting looking, he had dark golden hair, I didn't stare, but sure it wasn't a dye job, also, his eyes weren't the usual very dark brown (called black here), but a kind of golden colour, and looked like a European boy, except eyes not like the red of some north Africans (like that headbutting soccer player). Since it was in a zone where skiing or instructing can make a profit, her husband must have had ultra-Nordic or Alpinic genes. Also, while eye-colour is being lost, it must be preserved, hazel, blue, grey, green eyes are so beautiful, like living gems, coloured contact lenses suit nobody but goths.
It was Messi.
That was the dude that won 20 games and lost 20 games in 1973, 24-20, and nearly did it again in ’74 at 20-19.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/w/woodwi01.shtmlReplies: @Ganderson
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilbur_WoodReplies: @ScarletNumber
Steve inadvertently proved his own point by getting the guy’s name wrong.
Wilbur Wood was like all knuckleball pitchers: nobody wanted them but they all needed them to eat innings. Look at the careers.
Hoyt Wilhelm--20 years
Wilbur Wood--17 years
Phil Niekro--24 years
Joe Niekro--22 years
Tim Wakefield--19 years
Tom Candiotte--16 years
Charlie Hough--25 years
Ted Lyons--21 years
Dutch Leonard--20 yearsReplies: @Jim Don Bob, @ScarletNumber
When Hideki Matsui played for the New York Yankees, plenty of the advertising on the outfield walls and behind the batter were in Japanese.
At 7 o’clock in New York during baseball season, it is 8 a.m. the following day in Japan. However, when it is 7 o’clock in Los Angeles during baseball season, it is 11 a.m. in Japan, which I would imagine would increase TV ratings in Japan. This put the Dodgers in a better position than the Yankees or Toronto Blue Jays.
It is unclear why the Dodgers would be in a better position to monetize this than the Angels; perhaps they are just a better-run organization.
The Bee never forgets …
https://babylonbee.com/news/ohtani-having-second-thoughts-on-dodgers-signing-after-meeting-batting-coaches
Out of the team sports, baseball is the most individualistic. The pitchers and catchers have to get along with each other, but other than that it doesn’t matter, e.g. the 77-78 New York Yankees. Reggie Jackson had exactly one friend on the team: backup catcher Fran Healy. They still won two World Series.
At 7 o'clock in New York during baseball season, it is 8 a.m. the following day in Japan. However, when it is 7 o'clock in Los Angeles during baseball season, it is 11 a.m. in Japan, which I would imagine would increase TV ratings in Japan. This put the Dodgers in a better position than the Yankees or Toronto Blue Jays.
It is unclear why the Dodgers would be in a better position to monetize this than the Angels; perhaps they are just a better-run organization.Replies: @Known Fact
If you’re watching a game on TV, most of those ads are superimposed projections rather than really there. So when Matsui comes up they can run the Japanese ads because that’s when Japanese viewers are sure to be looking in. When Shlabotnick comes up it might say Seinfeld Tonite at 11
1918 was Miller Huggins’ first season as Yankees manager, and they had a losing record of 60-63, 13½ games behind Babe Ruth and the Boston Red Sox.
1965 was Johnny Keane’s first (and only full) season as Yankees manager, and they had a losing record of 77-85, 25 games behind the Minnesota Twins.
The Yankees only losing season in between was the aforementioned 1925, when they went 69-85, 28½ games behind the Washington Senators. It is worth noting that Ruth still had the highest OPS on the team, with a slash of .290/.393/.543 with 25 HR and 67 RBI in 98 games.
Bringing it back to a common iSteve topic, one of the Yankee coaches in 1925 was Fred Merkel.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Clemens
It is interesting to look at his WAR in the 1993-1995 interval between the pre and post PED periods in your table.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/clemero02.shtml
Any idea why his 2003-2005 seasons (aged 40-42!) totaling a WAR of 17.2 don't appear in your table?Replies: @ScarletNumber
I would say it was inadvertently left off, as no one thought that Roger would have three discrete three-year stretches of this caliber, although he was an All Star all three seasons.
For example, Willie Mays' 1954-1962 seasons would all ALSO qualify as three separate groups of three. All over 26!
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/mayswi01.shtml
Plus 24-17 in 1972 and 16-20 in 1975. Impressive WAR over those years though. As Steve’s table showed. More here.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/w/woodwi01.shtml
I remember him quite well — an ace starter and a rubber-armed freak, all with a physique you would never confuse with a professional athlete. But who would think he sits squarely between Bob Gibson and Joe Morgan on any chart? You could win a few bets on that stat
Looking at the list and Steve’s comments I think he limited the list to single three year stretches for everyone except the obvious PEDs cases who got both before and after. And the list probably is not exhaustive.
For example, Willie Mays’ 1954-1962 seasons would all ALSO qualify as three separate groups of three. All over 26!
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/mayswi01.shtml
Koreans are truly the Irishmen of Asia. They can sing, dance, and produce soulful poetry. They hate their oppressors, but they hate their ethnic kin neighbors even more! The same kind of people as the Irish who could have conquered world were they not getting drunk and fighting one another far more viciously than the outsiders.
To paraphrase Edward I in the film Braveheart, the problem with Korea is that it is full of Koreans.Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
There are apparently around 2,000 Koreans in Montgomery, Alabama of all places. I remember thinking why the hell would you emigrate to go end up in Montgomery but I guess lots of Koreans can’t stand South Korea. Korean community in metro Atlanta had lots of Trump supporters.
https://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/2018/09/13/many-montgomerys-korean-community-alabamas-capital-city-feels-like-home-korea-immigrants-hyundai/799846002/
“Korean community in metro Atlanta had lots of Trump supporters.”
To the contrary, they despise the man.
My grandfather was a catcher and worked out during the off season. He also played as a ringer in various city leagues which was nice change back then.
The Ugly, Violent Clearing Of Chavez Ravine Before It Was Home To The Dodgers
https://scpr.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/6434218/2147483647/strip/true/crop/730x566+0+0/resize/1760x1364!/format/webp/quality/90/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fscpr-brightspot.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com%2Flegacy%2Fi%2Fe25f8a265d7696a8e0fa4b426ba56f5a%2F5bbcd664d217300008df6d94-eight.jpgReplies: @RadicalCenter
YES. Eminent domain may NOT legitimately be used for a private for-profit enterprise that is not providing essential public infrastructure such as a military base, border guard station, or interstate highway.
The people who gave the “order” to remove those residents and take their property should be in prison for decades. The same for the pigs in the photo enforcing the unconstitutional and unlawful “order.” More scumbaggery by LA city/county “officials” and their pig lackeys.
And we’re Dodgers fans, lol….
They are there because of Hyundai.
https://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/2018/09/13/many-montgomerys-korean-community-alabamas-capital-city-feels-like-home-korea-immigrants-hyundai/799846002/
“Korean community in metro Atlanta had lots of Trump supporters.”
To the contrary, they despise the man.
Koreans in Southern California are often visibly arrogant and unpleasant, in our experience. But of course that’s not a massive or scientific sampling.
Maybe we should have just enough of them here to run those all-you-can-eat KBBQ places. The “K-Pot” chain alone makes up for some of their seemingly characteristic dickheadedness 😉
https://thekpot.com/
It’s not Ohtani’s fault that his fellow superstar Mike Trout is often injured, nor that the Angels can’t seem to find and sign an adequate support cast for the two of them.
I’d be glad that he’s coming to our Dodgers — except for the inevitable ticket-price increase to help defray his absurd salary.
Makes no sense.
Also, Babe Ruth was "persuaded" by BOS in 1918-19 to give up pitching because they needed his bat in the lineup every game as opposed to every fourth day.
BOS was going through a major overall with new owner Harry Frazee. The departure of fan favorite and HOF CF Tris Speaker in 1916, and other BOS players who were being unloaded to other teams primarily for cash (as Frazee was also a Broadway play producer and needed money to finance his shows), thus Ruth's bat in the lineup every day helped the Red Sox.
Ruth asked Frazee for a salary increase, at which Frazee balked.
"John Barrymore doesn't make that kind of money!"
"What the hell good would John Barrymore do you in the bottom of the 8th inning, with two outs and two on? Either I get the money or I don't play!"
Well, in January of 1920, Ruth got his reply, sold to NY for $125,ooo, and the rest is history.Replies: @prime noticer
“I still don’t entirely understand why MLB mandated for teams to give up a shift.”
to speed up the game. also why there is a pitch clock now. i’m not into the new rule with putting a runner on second but that’s another concession to pace of play.
these things have definitely speeded up the game. not sure how much effect it’s having on viewership and ticket sales though.
very low television viewers for the World Series this year, partly due to the teams involved. but MLB is probably slipping below the waterline now. after 130 years, MLB is on it’s way out. like pro wrestling, it will always been hanging around in a greatly diminished form, as it still makes money. but it will never be a big deal again.
People complain that baseball is too random then go nuts about a full 17-game season with a single-game decider. I guess it's too bad that not all teams end up in the 5-13 wins interval because it's just so much fun to watch a garbage team getting beaten up. OK, sometimes it actually is funny like with greatest Bill Belichick this year. But that apart, predictability is what is great about sports? (Well, I guess, since last year the refs had to step in so the right team won the big game.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ways_That_Are_Dark
A lot of Chinese themselves would agree with this assessment, and that the Japanese were basically saints compare to the See See Pee.
Problem is that this was written in 1933 (Townsend was a paid Japanese agent, but its not like there weren’t scores of Soviet agent running amok in US Gov), after the Chinese got rolled over by Kwantung Army in 1931 Mukden Incident*, this fed into the arrogance of the hawkish elements of the IJA.
When two sides came to blows again in 1937, the result was a bloodbath and a stalemate. The Japanese hawks had many chances to make a truce with Chiang Kai-shek, but hubris got the best of them.
And after the war, there were people in Japan (just like in America) that write books like this about China, which invariably tells a version of truth, but there’s another side, and they failed to anticipate PRC’s emergence as industrial juggernaut.
*The architect of the Mukden Incident, Kanji Ishiwara, had this to say about the Chinese, in his 1940 Sekai Saishū Senron (世界最終戦論) “On World Final War” (as a sequel to Frederick’s Œuvres Historiques)
Japan and Nazi Germany may have won WW2 were it not for the battles that happened right there for 135 days. Incredibly this episode of the war is virtually untaught in the West, maybe because it didn't involve the West (which shows how self-centered our version of history is).
During WW2 Northeast of China had been invaded and annexed by Japan, transformed into a puppet state called Manchukuo. This place is in the extreme West of this former puppet state (which is now back to being Northeast China), on the border with Mongolia and the former Soviet Union (now the Russian border).
At the time, 1939, Japan's basic strategy for the war was "Northward Advance" (Hokushin-ron), i.e. seizing Siberia for its resources as far as Lake Baikal.
The USSR obviously begged to differ and Stalin sent General Zhukov, one of his best men (the future Marshal of the Soviet Union) on site to fight the Japanese back.
Long story short, the battles that ensued - with 200,000 soldiers on the battlefield - lastest 135 days and were the earliest large-scale 3-dimensional warfare in military history. It ended in a humiliating Japanese defeat which some Japanese historians call "the greatest defeat in the history of the Japanese army", with 54,000 casualties.
The most important consequence of the battles that were fought there is that the Japanese completely changed their strategy from "Northward Advance" to "Southward Advance", favoring seizing the resources of Southeast Asia instead of those of Siberia.
Masanobu Tsuji, the Japanese colonel most instrumental in these battles became "the most determined single protagonist in favor of war with the United States" and one of the strongest proponents of the attack on Pearl Harbor inside the Japanese army (according to postwar testimonies), having been traumatized by his experience of fighting the Russians. The US was of course the biggest power the Japanese would have to confront by pursuing the "Southward Advance" strategy since only the US Pacific Fleet stood in the way of seizing the oil-rich Dutch East Indie.
In fact the Nomonhan battles traumatized the Japanese so much that they didn't dare fight the Russians again for the remainder of WW2. Even when their ally Nazi Germany opened the Eastern front the Japanese army adopted a resolution "not to intervene in German Soviet war for the time being", leaving Hitler to fight the Soviet Union on his own, which would ultimately prove to be his demise.
So it's no exaggeration to say that had the battles there not been fought or had the Japanese won, WW2 would have most likely turned out dramatically different. Pearl Harbor wouldn't have happened, and Japan would have likely helped Nazi Germany fight the Soviet Union by opening a front to the East.
Nomonhan may in fact have been the most consequential battle of WW2!Replies: @Steve Sailer
I know Jackson was a great hitter and all – but I doubt the Yankees win either without Thurman Munson.
They didn’t win with Munson and without Jackson until ’77, didn’t win with Jackson and without Munson after ’78.
Mays had a better three-year stretch than PED Bonds did? Hard for me to believe, and makes me suspect that WAR is not quite the all-encompassing stat its defenders sometimes make it out to be. Though looking up the stats, it may be because Bonds only played 130 games in 2003.
It’s interesting to me that PED Bonds was so much more dominant than anyone else in baseball at the time, in spite of lots of other superstars also taking steroids. Why did he get such a greater benefit out of steroids than anyone else?
I guess you pointed out that the list is not comprehensive, but some obvious names missing from the list: e.g., Pedro Martinez (1998-2000: 28.8), Carl Yastrzemski (1966-1968: 28.4). And a couple active (or very recently active players) who should be on it: Justin Verlander, Miguel Cabrera.
Bryce Harper, by the way, seems to be pretty streaky year to year, and to mind has never quite lived up to the hype he got as a rookie, so it’s not surprising to me that he’s only at 16.1.
It would be a good thing if White Americans were gladdened and galvanized by White ballplayers.
Fortunately, that is likely to begin happening, as nonwhite diversity rolls like a haboob over Weimerica and impels Whites to see themselves as a racial entity deserving of pride and having interests and values separate and distinct from nonwhites. Diversity will make White Raciality salient.
If you argue that Whites won’t turn that way, you have to deny that a cultural and evolutionary boiling off process of universalist empathobesic libwhites is an impossibility.
Not all Whites are like you Steve, happy to abjure White identity for deracinated pathologically individualist suicide.
Mays absolutely tore apart the expansion National League in his early 30s from 1962-1965.
“Why did [Bonds] get such a greater benefit out of steroids than anyone else?”
Because he was better than everybody else without steroids?
Bond’s ex-girlfriend said he only started with PEDs in 1999 and didn’t get expert with them until his 73 homer 2001 season. He was clearly the best position player in baseball in 1990-1993 and if she’s telling the truth, clean, he was right up there in the first half decade of the steroid era from 1994-1998. Then he got annoyed by all the hype about McGwire and Sosa and decided to show them what a Wille Mays-like talent could do on a level playing field: hence, his absurd stats from 2001-2004.
For example, pre-steroids, some people think that Griffey was better. I don't agree, but it's at least close enough to have been a debate. With PED-Bonds, there was no one within a country mile of his performance. I think the only other time we've seen a degree of separation that large is with Ruth.
to speed up the game. also why there is a pitch clock now. i'm not into the new rule with putting a runner on second but that's another concession to pace of play.
these things have definitely speeded up the game. not sure how much effect it's having on viewership and ticket sales though.
very low television viewers for the World Series this year, partly due to the teams involved. but MLB is probably slipping below the waterline now. after 130 years, MLB is on it's way out. like pro wrestling, it will always been hanging around in a greatly diminished form, as it still makes money. but it will never be a big deal again.Replies: @Anon
Backyball seems more vulnerable. Not even the disgraceful and overpaid pros want to play it anymore. They need more resting to just get through the season, and a new team paying more dolla. But I guess backyball does have a lot of marketing bucks on its side.
People complain that baseball is too random then go nuts about a full 17-game season with a single-game decider. I guess it’s too bad that not all teams end up in the 5-13 wins interval because it’s just so much fun to watch a garbage team getting beaten up. OK, sometimes it actually is funny like with greatest Bill Belichick this year. But that apart, predictability is what is great about sports? (Well, I guess, since last year the refs had to step in so the right team won the big game.)
Turns out the NPV is a lot less than $70M per year–there are massive deferrals:
Shohei Ohtani contract: Explaining the massive $680 million deferral, why it benefits both Ohtani and Dodgers
Shohei Ohtani contract deferrals: How Dodgers are using MLB CBA to their advantage by waiting to pay $680M
The best description (mass media, but see FanGraphs link below) of Ohtani's salary I see appears at The Athletic.
https://theathletic.com/5129506/2023/12/11/dodgers-shohei-ohtani-contract-deferrals/Financial details are discussed in a series of posts on X/Twitter. Here is the culmination.
https://twitter.com/jonbecker_/status/1734361526276939784The author has a longer form piece at FanGraphs.
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/shohei-ohani-is-deferring-97-of-his-contract/
Interesting that there is no NPV discounting on the annual salary. Just the deferrals. From what I see it looks like their NPV calculation is solely based on the starting year for the deferred salary [e.g. IIUC the 2043 deferred salary is only discounted by (1 + 0.0443)^10 rather than (1 + 0.0443) ^ 20]. That would be consistent with not discounting the standard salary. It would also imply an NPV overestimate (stated NPV higher than true NPV) ranging from 0 to about 1/3 over the 10 year terms.
Also interesting how much the recent inflation spike affects the deferral numbers since they only look at the previous year.
But the important question is how the interest rates and inflation will play out over that time. Given what will happen to the economics of Social Security (and other pension plans) during that period seems like a substantial risk to me. Bonilla got lucky that his deal mostly occurred during a low inflation period.
His article references this WSJ article. I can't see it because of the paywall, but would be interested in comments from those who can. In particular, it is supposed to discuss the tax implications for Ohtani.
https://www.wsj.com/sports/baseball/shohei-ohtani-700-million-contract-deferral-067a345f
Also relevant from The Athletic link.Cuts down the risk considerably for Ohtani. Seems like a great way for stars to help keep their teams competitive within the salary cap. I suspect we will be seeing more of this. Especially if interest rates stay up favoring this calculation.
The NBA limits salary deferrals to 25% of the salary.
https://www.sportskeeda.com/basketball/news-does-nba-allow-salary-deferring-rules-explored-amid-reports-shohei-ohtani-deferring-680-million-salary
The NFL limits salary deferrals to 50/75% (under/over $2 million) of salary.
https://overthecap.com/collective-bargaining-agreement/article/26/section/6
I am not seeing information about this for the NHL.
Would have to look at the NPV calculations for each league to determine the utility of this tactic.Replies: @res
Shohei Ohtani contract: Explaining the massive $680 million deferral, why it benefits both Ohtani and Dodgers
Shohei Ohtani contract deferrals: How Dodgers are using MLB CBA to their advantage by waiting to pay $680MReplies: @Steve Sailer, @res
So Ohtani’s contract is going to get counted not as $70 million per year but as $46 million per year for purposes of calculating the luxury tax.
He won't see one dime of that deferred money.
No, I stand by my statement. Steve worships Tiger Woods and tongue-bathed him on a regular basis when he was on top. In my mind’s eye, I can see Steve cringing every time I quote Dan Jenkins, whose early jaundiced view of Woods’ personality was ultimately proven correct.
Wilbur Wood was like all knuckleball pitchers: nobody wanted them but they all needed them to eat innings. Look at the careers.
Hoyt Wilhelm–20 years
Wilbur Wood–17 years
Phil Niekro–24 years
Joe Niekro–22 years
Tim Wakefield–19 years
Tom Candiotte–16 years
Charlie Hough–25 years
Ted Lyons–21 years
Dutch Leonard–20 years
The pitcher on your list who really benefitted from hanging on was Joe Niekro, who won a World Series in his last full season in MLB, starting 18 games for the 1987 Minnesota Twins, where he was 5½ years older than his manager, Tom Kelly. He started two games the following year, giving up 7 runs in the first and 5 in the second to earn his release.Replies: @Brutusale
I daresay that most East Asians can't always distinguish between themselves either, UNTIL they open their mouths. As the Han Chinese have archeological footprints all throughout East Asia (referring specially in this case to Korea and Japan, as well as China) then really, what is the difference from just a sight test?
Example: A Korean, a Japanese, and a Chinese. All dressed in similar say, Western attire, and a very similar hairstyle. Take three men at the same height, age, and weight. Really, until they open their mouths to speak their own languages, daresay that some wouldn't be able to tell the three apart from one another (e.g. each individual would think that that the other two are part of his nation). Unless one wants to state that each nation carries a distinctively different body odor, there really wouldn't be a 100% foolproof way to state that "Yeah, it's obvious that these three dudes are totally different from one another."
Until of course, they open their mouths and speak their own different languages.
When then open their mouths and speak their languages, then of course the differences become obvious.
In this situation, whites have the obvious advantage of diversity in hair and eye color, whereas (North) East Asians simply do not.
Yet to see a natural born Japanese/Korean/Chinese person of generations of ancient ancestry DNA, and yet is also born with blonde hair and blue eyes (no racial admixture from Western nations, no hair dyes, and no colored contact lenses).
They simply don't exist. And thus it is easier for outsiders to confuse them. At the same time, the original point remains. take three of each group together of similar outward appearances and daresay that each of them will be unable to distinguish them apart (assuming that each tribe does not have their own body ordor).
Until of course, they open their mouths to speak their own native languages.Replies: @Che Guava, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
You may daresay it, and 100% is impossible, but there are definite physiognomic cues. With no language and no fashion cues, I pick correctly over 90% of the time. With a group, again with no cues but facial and body appearance, 100% correct.
Tested it tonight, 100% correct from vision alone, confirmed each time by waiting to hear speech, on the telephone for the lone ones.
Several of my colleagues are Viet, two would pass as S.E.Asian Chinese or southern Chinese, of course, that isn’t a blind test, but the others would not.
The world must not become a melting pot, we need to preserve our differences. Once, perhaps ten years ago, I was riding a slow train in winter, in the snow country. A mother and son boarded along the way, alit after only a few stops.
Her son, aside from being well-behaved, was very interesting looking, he had dark golden hair, I didn’t stare, but sure it wasn’t a dye job, also, his eyes weren’t the usual very dark brown (called black here), but a kind of golden colour, and looked like a European boy, except eyes not like the red of some north Africans (like that headbutting soccer player). Since it was in a zone where skiing or instructing can make a profit, her husband must have had ultra-Nordic or Alpinic genes. Also, while eye-colour is being lost, it must be preserved, hazel, blue, grey, green eyes are so beautiful, like living gems, coloured contact lenses suit nobody but goths.
He had quite a run from 1971-1974 winning 20 or more games in each year. Finished third behind Vida Blue & Mickey Lolich in voting for the Cy Young Award in 1971. Wood posted an ERA of 1.91, much lower than Lolich. Blue had his best year ever posting a record of 24-8 and an ERA of 1.82. Lolich set a record of 376 innings pitched in 1971 only to be topped by Wood with 376 2\3 the next year.
I see baseball, but always find it boring, Spalding company’s variation on rounders to sell things. Also, Otani is massively popular in media in Japan, has performed so well, perhaps he is real, and isn’t taking steroids, both Matsui and Ichiro gained much longer and more solid jaws and transformed faces in their times as M.L.B. stars.
I daresay that most East Asians can't always distinguish between themselves either, UNTIL they open their mouths. As the Han Chinese have archeological footprints all throughout East Asia (referring specially in this case to Korea and Japan, as well as China) then really, what is the difference from just a sight test?
Example: A Korean, a Japanese, and a Chinese. All dressed in similar say, Western attire, and a very similar hairstyle. Take three men at the same height, age, and weight. Really, until they open their mouths to speak their own languages, daresay that some wouldn't be able to tell the three apart from one another (e.g. each individual would think that that the other two are part of his nation). Unless one wants to state that each nation carries a distinctively different body odor, there really wouldn't be a 100% foolproof way to state that "Yeah, it's obvious that these three dudes are totally different from one another."
Until of course, they open their mouths and speak their own different languages.
When then open their mouths and speak their languages, then of course the differences become obvious.
In this situation, whites have the obvious advantage of diversity in hair and eye color, whereas (North) East Asians simply do not.
Yet to see a natural born Japanese/Korean/Chinese person of generations of ancient ancestry DNA, and yet is also born with blonde hair and blue eyes (no racial admixture from Western nations, no hair dyes, and no colored contact lenses).
They simply don't exist. And thus it is easier for outsiders to confuse them. At the same time, the original point remains. take three of each group together of similar outward appearances and daresay that each of them will be unable to distinguish them apart (assuming that each tribe does not have their own body ordor).
Until of course, they open their mouths to speak their own native languages.Replies: @Che Guava, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
The same statement can be made about an Englishman, a German and a Russian. Sometimes even an Englishman, an Ashkenazi Jew and a Turk.
Northern Europeans have diversity in hair and eye color. Southern Euros much less so.
The gene for blondism itself came from northern Asia. There have been many incidences of light hair and eyes recorded in Chinese history.
East Asia is topographically shaped like a basin and in the latter half of second millennium has been relatively isolated, and there’s no caste system like South Asia, hence the perception of homogeneity.
American occupation forces were schooled in respect for Japanese culture and each was given a textbook to make sure they remembered. Sure, it was guys in their 20’s and they could, and did, act like idiots, but it was benign compared to Japanese behavior in Korea, China, and anywhere else you guys set foot, and Americans never tried to destroy Japanese culture like you guys tried in Korea. A Korean once told me, to this day, parents will tell misbehaving kids “You better be good or those Japanese will get you!!”.
Wilbur Wood was like all knuckleball pitchers: nobody wanted them but they all needed them to eat innings. Look at the careers.
Hoyt Wilhelm--20 years
Wilbur Wood--17 years
Phil Niekro--24 years
Joe Niekro--22 years
Tim Wakefield--19 years
Tom Candiotte--16 years
Charlie Hough--25 years
Ted Lyons--21 years
Dutch Leonard--20 yearsReplies: @Jim Don Bob, @ScarletNumber
What did Dan Jenkins say about Tiger?
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf-tiger-jenkins-0218
https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2014/11/18/7243479/tiger-woods-letter-dan-jenkins-golf-digest-articleReplies: @Jim Don Bob, @Truth
I presume that MLB players have advisers who tell them carefully what they can take and what they can’t.
But, yeah, Ohtani despite being massive still facially resembles an anime character.
American League managers in the early 1970s had their aces pitch insane numbers of innings. I thought this was due to the DH discouraging pinch-hitting for pitchers, but it really was going crazy two years before the DH in 1973. Indeed, the DH rule was instigated in 1973 because the AL in 1972 had such low offense, like a little 1968. Apparently, having your ace throw 300+ innings worked.
As an aside, Bill James once made the observation in one of his Abstracts that the Sporting News, when publishing team offensive totals, would rank them by batting average. Bill correctly thought this was preposterous, as the object of baseball is to score runs, not have a high batting average per se.
Shohei Ohtani contract: Explaining the massive $680 million deferral, why it benefits both Ohtani and Dodgers
Shohei Ohtani contract deferrals: How Dodgers are using MLB CBA to their advantage by waiting to pay $680MReplies: @Steve Sailer, @res
Very interesting. Thanks!
The best description (mass media, but see FanGraphs link below) of Ohtani’s salary I see appears at The Athletic.
https://theathletic.com/5129506/2023/12/11/dodgers-shohei-ohtani-contract-deferrals/
Financial details are discussed in a series of posts on X/Twitter. Here is the culmination.
The author has a longer form piece at FanGraphs.
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/shohei-ohani-is-deferring-97-of-his-contract/
Interesting that there is no NPV discounting on the annual salary. Just the deferrals. From what I see it looks like their NPV calculation is solely based on the starting year for the deferred salary [e.g. IIUC the 2043 deferred salary is only discounted by (1 + 0.0443)^10 rather than (1 + 0.0443) ^ 20]. That would be consistent with not discounting the standard salary. It would also imply an NPV overestimate (stated NPV higher than true NPV) ranging from 0 to about 1/3 over the 10 year terms.
Also interesting how much the recent inflation spike affects the deferral numbers since they only look at the previous year.
But the important question is how the interest rates and inflation will play out over that time. Given what will happen to the economics of Social Security (and other pension plans) during that period seems like a substantial risk to me. Bonilla got lucky that his deal mostly occurred during a low inflation period.
His article references this WSJ article. I can’t see it because of the paywall, but would be interested in comments from those who can. In particular, it is supposed to discuss the tax implications for Ohtani.
https://www.wsj.com/sports/baseball/shohei-ohtani-700-million-contract-deferral-067a345f
Also relevant from The Athletic link.
Cuts down the risk considerably for Ohtani. Seems like a great way for stars to help keep their teams competitive within the salary cap. I suspect we will be seeing more of this. Especially if interest rates stay up favoring this calculation.
The NBA limits salary deferrals to 25% of the salary.
https://www.sportskeeda.com/basketball/news-does-nba-allow-salary-deferring-rules-explored-amid-reports-shohei-ohtani-deferring-680-million-salary
The NFL limits salary deferrals to 50/75% (under/over $2 million) of salary.
https://overthecap.com/collective-bargaining-agreement/article/26/section/6
I am not seeing information about this for the NHL.
Would have to look at the NPV calculations for each league to determine the utility of this tactic.
https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2023/12/12/23998355/shohei-ohtani-700-million-contract-deferred-money-los-angeles-dodgers
For example. And who knows what the CA top tax rate will be in 2034-2043!FWIW I think Ohtani may be underestimating the possibility CA will find a way to tax that money anyway. Which makes me wonder if the 10 year periods are not a coincidence.
https://lslcpas.com/avoiding-california-tax-on-retirement-distributions-when-retiring-outside-of-california/
One other point I have not seen mentioned. Given the way the NPV calculations only seem to look at the first year of the term it makes sense to front load the contracts (here by having them be flat with no interest or yearly increase).Replies: @prime noticer
The best description (mass media, but see FanGraphs link below) of Ohtani's salary I see appears at The Athletic.
https://theathletic.com/5129506/2023/12/11/dodgers-shohei-ohtani-contract-deferrals/Financial details are discussed in a series of posts on X/Twitter. Here is the culmination.
https://twitter.com/jonbecker_/status/1734361526276939784The author has a longer form piece at FanGraphs.
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/shohei-ohani-is-deferring-97-of-his-contract/
Interesting that there is no NPV discounting on the annual salary. Just the deferrals. From what I see it looks like their NPV calculation is solely based on the starting year for the deferred salary [e.g. IIUC the 2043 deferred salary is only discounted by (1 + 0.0443)^10 rather than (1 + 0.0443) ^ 20]. That would be consistent with not discounting the standard salary. It would also imply an NPV overestimate (stated NPV higher than true NPV) ranging from 0 to about 1/3 over the 10 year terms.
Also interesting how much the recent inflation spike affects the deferral numbers since they only look at the previous year.
But the important question is how the interest rates and inflation will play out over that time. Given what will happen to the economics of Social Security (and other pension plans) during that period seems like a substantial risk to me. Bonilla got lucky that his deal mostly occurred during a low inflation period.
His article references this WSJ article. I can't see it because of the paywall, but would be interested in comments from those who can. In particular, it is supposed to discuss the tax implications for Ohtani.
https://www.wsj.com/sports/baseball/shohei-ohtani-700-million-contract-deferral-067a345f
Also relevant from The Athletic link.Cuts down the risk considerably for Ohtani. Seems like a great way for stars to help keep their teams competitive within the salary cap. I suspect we will be seeing more of this. Especially if interest rates stay up favoring this calculation.
The NBA limits salary deferrals to 25% of the salary.
https://www.sportskeeda.com/basketball/news-does-nba-allow-salary-deferring-rules-explored-amid-reports-shohei-ohtani-deferring-680-million-salary
The NFL limits salary deferrals to 50/75% (under/over $2 million) of salary.
https://overthecap.com/collective-bargaining-agreement/article/26/section/6
I am not seeing information about this for the NHL.
Would have to look at the NPV calculations for each league to determine the utility of this tactic.Replies: @res
More here.
https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2023/12/12/23998355/shohei-ohtani-700-million-contract-deferred-money-los-angeles-dodgers
For example. And who knows what the CA top tax rate will be in 2034-2043!
FWIW I think Ohtani may be underestimating the possibility CA will find a way to tax that money anyway. Which makes me wonder if the 10 year periods are not a coincidence.
https://lslcpas.com/avoiding-california-tax-on-retirement-distributions-when-retiring-outside-of-california/
One other point I have not seen mentioned. Given the way the NPV calculations only seem to look at the first year of the term it makes sense to front load the contracts (here by having them be flat with no interest or yearly increase).
i remember when the doyers got chan ho park and hideo nomo, and there was a big asian pop in the fan base.
that is when you first saw yoshinoya beef bowls being sold at dodger stadium.
even though plently of asians play mlb now, this ohtani thing will be more nuts, i imagine, since the asian population has only increased bigly over the last 30 years.
also, the angels down in disneyland have no pop, and their owner doesn’t care to make his players popular. he doesn’t do marketing down there. so ohtani to the dodgers is going to be way more epic.
will it all work out? who knows. it’s baseball, shit happens, and this is the NY-LA Bums we are talking about. they always find a way to bum it.
Ohtani is deferring $68M/year (of his $70M/yr) so that in his prime playing window the Dodgers can pursue other great players.
The deferred funds will be payable to Ohtani after his career is over (in the late 2030s and 2040s).
Ohtani makes $50M/yr in endorsements, so giving the Dodgers the “tom brady” contract deal makes some sense. And apparently this was mostly his idea (at least according to his agent).
Honestly heroic – the Dodgers are gonna be must see tv from April through October.
looks like the steal of the century now that the details are out. Dodgers got the best player in the sport for 2 million a year. not even Brady took discounts that big. will the Dodgers make money on this deal? uh, yes. the money is deferred 10 years WITHOUT INTEREST. Ohtani will begin taking 68 million a year in 2034. Dodgers can now go sign another high dollar player.
is this legal? per MLB rules, yes. deferred money is unlimited.
Finance website Market Watch explains the numbers
HBD angle? probably, and major. Japanese guy does not feel need to buy 50 million dollar American mansion or drive 10 sports cars, accepts 2 million a year as good enough money and came to win a World Series, not rack up stats or gold chains.
“They’ll STILL lose in the playoffs!” maybe. odds are getting better for them now though.
MLB rules question – if he dies, do Dodgers still have to pay…somebody? anybody?
speaking of that if Bobby Bonilla dies do Mets still have to keep paying?
typo in Market Watch link fixed.
Market Watch Ohtani contract
https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2023/12/12/23998355/shohei-ohtani-700-million-contract-deferred-money-los-angeles-dodgers
For example. And who knows what the CA top tax rate will be in 2034-2043!FWIW I think Ohtani may be underestimating the possibility CA will find a way to tax that money anyway. Which makes me wonder if the 10 year periods are not a coincidence.
https://lslcpas.com/avoiding-california-tax-on-retirement-distributions-when-retiring-outside-of-california/
One other point I have not seen mentioned. Given the way the NPV calculations only seem to look at the first year of the term it makes sense to front load the contracts (here by having them be flat with no interest or yearly increase).Replies: @prime noticer
“FWIW I think Ohtani may be underestimating the possibility CA will find a way to tax that money”
there’s no way they won’t try, plus now every player in every sport sees ‘the way to avoid paying taxes in California’, so lots of them might try this next. so if there’s not a law against it today, there will be soon. you won’t be allowed to defer your way out of paying California taxes.
indeed, deferring half your paycheck makes A LOT of sense for african players in particular – every agent may advise their clients to always defer the big contract extension every time, the way most football teams these days always defer if they win the coin toss. it will become the standard move, the new common sense.
defer limits for NFL and NBA are suddenly highly relevant.
I think the popularity of the deferral approach will end up turning on details. In particular, how the relative valuations for the player, the team ($), and the salary cap relate. In the Ohtani case I think the CBA NPV calculation overvalues the NPV (in particular by only looking at the first year correction for both periods, also by using an interest rate lower than I think is common in those calculations, also given my inflation expectations for that period but that is speculation). Unclear how Ohtani and the Dodgers respectively value the NPV. If the 10 year terms are necessary for the CA tax benefits (from the link I gave I think only the deferral period needs to be 10 years or longer) that may be a constraint as well.
I suspect a major counter force will be the time orientation of most players. Which is sad because that is a big part of what makes it useful for them (substitute for self control) as you observe.
P.S. I don't know how the NBA and NFL compute NPV.
I don’t know for sure, but as a matter of contract law, it would seem that Bonilla’s estate still gets paid because Bonilla completed his performance of the contract. For Ohtani it’s trickier, but presumably the Dodgers would owe some pro rata amount. With the huge money at stake it wouldn’t surprise me if the contract spells out what would happen. I think it’s more a matter of contract than MLB rule.
Replies: @J.Ross, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
I will always love the bit where he essentially set out to write down everything bad which can reasonably be said about Chinese, but, when he gets to the subject of food, he is one hundred per cent positive, he cannot priaise it enough, and recommends (as do I) that if the reader ever has a chance to eat Chinese food in China, he pursueth to the last spicy bony fish or eyeball shrimp or sweet potato vine or wood ear.
Probably by at least 1/3.
Stupid fool.
He won’t see one dime of that deferred money.
Jenkins was merciless toward Woods, as Woods never sat for an interview with the most influential golf writer ever; per Woods’ manager, there was no upside for Tigger to talk to Jenkins. So Jenkins simply wrote the things that were true, but that Tigger’s camp in no way wanted to be discussed in public. Once Jenkins really got under Woods’ extremely thin skin, and Tigger decided to chirp back. It didn’t end well.
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf-tiger-jenkins-0218
https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2014/11/18/7243479/tiger-woods-letter-dan-jenkins-golf-digest-article
And it is still amazing the way people still slobber over Tiger, but I've read that TV ratings go up Big Time when he plays. The strangest thing about his infidelity is that all of his paramours looked they came from an Appalachian Walmart.Replies: @Ganderson, @Brutusale, @res
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/w/woodwi01.shtmlReplies: @Ganderson
Takes a pretty good pitcher to lose 20 games. I also think Wilbur once won both ends of a twin bill, maybe more than once.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilbur_Wood#All-Star_workhorse_(1971%E2%80%9375)Also see this.
https://prestonjg.wordpress.com/2009/09/12/a-thorough-account-of-pitchers-who-have-started-both-games-of-a-doubleheader-in-the-major-leagues/
https://prestonjg.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/screenhunter_08-nov-25-15-34.gif
An earlier example is a nice example of managerial gamesmanship.Another earlier example.A surprising number of earlier examples follow with a table of all the instances of a pitcher starting both games of a doubleheader since 1901 at the end.Replies: @Ganderson
Wilbur Wood was like all knuckleball pitchers: nobody wanted them but they all needed them to eat innings. Look at the careers.
Hoyt Wilhelm--20 years
Wilbur Wood--17 years
Phil Niekro--24 years
Joe Niekro--22 years
Tim Wakefield--19 years
Tom Candiotte--16 years
Charlie Hough--25 years
Ted Lyons--21 years
Dutch Leonard--20 yearsReplies: @Jim Don Bob, @ScarletNumber
Sorry, I didn’t get the Wilbur/Tiger connection there.
The pitcher on your list who really benefitted from hanging on was Joe Niekro, who won a World Series in his last full season in MLB, starting 18 games for the 1987 Minnesota Twins, where he was 5½ years older than his manager, Tom Kelly. He started two games the following year, giving up 7 runs in the first and 5 in the second to earn his release.
At least he wasn't misgendered!
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf-tiger-jenkins-0218
https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2014/11/18/7243479/tiger-woods-letter-dan-jenkins-golf-digest-articleReplies: @Jim Don Bob, @Truth
Thanks for those links. Dan Jenkins was a funny guy. I remember reading Baja Oklahoma years ago which, IIRC, contains the immortal list of The Ten Stages of Drunkenness.
And it is still amazing the way people still slobber over Tiger, but I’ve read that TV ratings go up Big Time when he plays. The strangest thing about his infidelity is that all of his paramours looked they came from an Appalachian Walmart.
As Jenkins wrote, Tigger is YUGE with the "You Da Man" and "Get in the Hole" idiots.
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/the-comedy-issue-the-story-behind-the-10-stages-of-drunkenness
In 1968 the NL averaged 6.86 runs per game, while the AL averaged 6.81 runs per game, less than a 1 percent difference. In 1969 the mound was lowered to improve offense. By 1972 the NL had improved to 7.81 while the AL only improved to 6.93. As Steve mentioned, this caused the AL to implement the DH. The following year, the AL improved to 8.56 with the NL only improving to 8.30. It is unclear why the NL had such a large jump, since they were playing under the same rules in 1972 and 1973.
As an aside, Bill James once made the observation in one of his Abstracts that the Sporting News, when publishing team offensive totals, would rank them by batting average. Bill correctly thought this was preposterous, as the object of baseball is to score runs, not have a high batting average per se.
I didn’t use Munson because he was the captain of the Yankees, he had the respect of all of his teammates as well as his manager, Billy Martin. Jackson, on the other hand, was generally despised.
I really don't think they win back-to-back without him.
And it is still amazing the way people still slobber over Tiger, but I've read that TV ratings go up Big Time when he plays. The strangest thing about his infidelity is that all of his paramours looked they came from an Appalachian Walmart.Replies: @Ganderson, @Brutusale, @res
I have a theory, mostly based on casual observation, that guys with hot wives are more likely to cheat. Eldrick was married to one of the most beautiful women in the world.
The pitcher on your list who really benefitted from hanging on was Joe Niekro, who won a World Series in his last full season in MLB, starting 18 games for the 1987 Minnesota Twins, where he was 5½ years older than his manager, Tom Kelly. He started two games the following year, giving up 7 runs in the first and 5 in the second to earn his release.Replies: @Brutusale
Wibur’s surname is Wood. Tigger’s surname is Woods. Tigger occupies an inordinate amount of space in Steve’s gray matter, so he misnamed Wilbur.
At least he wasn’t misgendered!
And it is still amazing the way people still slobber over Tiger, but I've read that TV ratings go up Big Time when he plays. The strangest thing about his infidelity is that all of his paramours looked they came from an Appalachian Walmart.Replies: @Ganderson, @Brutusale, @res
And it is still amazing the way people still slobber over Tiger, but I’ve read that TV ratings go up Big Time when he plays.
As Jenkins wrote, Tigger is YUGE with the “You Da Man” and “Get in the Hole” idiots.
"Henderson received a national defense service medal and good conduct medal during her service. She was also given the Navy “E” ribbon among other awards."
National Defense is given to every single armed forces recruit who shows up for boot camp. The Good Conduct is awarded for three of service without getting into trouble. The E Ribbon is assigned to all personnel assigned to duty on a ship that wins some sort of efficiency award.
So she signed up, showed up, and didn't get in trouble. Move over Audie, we've got an honest to god true American hero on our hands.Replies: @J.Ross, @Ganderson
My dad spent the second half of 1945 in the Po Valley bunking at the guardhouse; he had been involved in an…errr… disagreement with his company commander. It never occurred to me growing up to question why, on his OD woolen shirts and his Ike jacket one could see the shadow of his T/Sgt stripes. It wasn’t until my mom died that we got the story- as I had noticed on his separation papers, which had to be produced to get mom buried at Fort Snelling National Cemetery, that his rank at discharge had been PFC. But yet, there among his memorabilia was a Good Conduct Medal.
Wonder if Emmet Till’s dad got one, too?
I’ve never liked the Yankees, can’t imagine wanting to but Thurman Munson was the man. I’m told saber metrics explain every value of a player and there’s no such thing as intangibles. There are some things that are unmeasurable. Munson had numbers but besides was a good man, the captain, as you say – and he was the catcher. You gotta have a great catcher.
I really don’t think they win back-to-back without him.
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf-tiger-jenkins-0218
https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2014/11/18/7243479/tiger-woods-letter-dan-jenkins-golf-digest-articleReplies: @Jim Don Bob, @Truth
Brute, don’t be Jelly.
The second two books of Jenkins' Billy Clyde Puckett trilogy dealt with the eternal question of what to do when I grow up. All retired NFL RB Puckett could see in his future was giving speeches and falling asleep dead drunk on the podium. Tigger, with his proclivity for drugs (he had FIVE, including weed, on board when he was arrested), might have a bigger problem.
Let's hope he makes it to the Senior Tour intact.Replies: @Truth
Only for a few years long ago did I have a really hot girlfriend. It was only during that time that any other really hot girls would flirt with me. The hottest girls compete with each other. I think a lot of guys in that circumstance give in to the heightened temptation.
Agreed with all of that.
I think the popularity of the deferral approach will end up turning on details. In particular, how the relative valuations for the player, the team ($), and the salary cap relate. In the Ohtani case I think the CBA NPV calculation overvalues the NPV (in particular by only looking at the first year correction for both periods, also by using an interest rate lower than I think is common in those calculations, also given my inflation expectations for that period but that is speculation). Unclear how Ohtani and the Dodgers respectively value the NPV. If the 10 year terms are necessary for the CA tax benefits (from the link I gave I think only the deferral period needs to be 10 years or longer) that may be a constraint as well.
I suspect a major counter force will be the time orientation of most players. Which is sad because that is a big part of what makes it useful for them (substitute for self control) as you observe.
P.S. I don’t know how the NBA and NFL compute NPV.
Thanks. Here is what I see.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilbur_Wood#All-Star_workhorse_(1971%E2%80%9375)
Also see this.
https://prestonjg.wordpress.com/2009/09/12/a-thorough-account-of-pitchers-who-have-started-both-games-of-a-doubleheader-in-the-major-leagues/
An earlier example is a nice example of managerial gamesmanship.
Another earlier example.
A surprising number of earlier examples follow with a table of all the instances of a pitcher starting both games of a doubleheader since 1901 at the end.
And it is still amazing the way people still slobber over Tiger, but I've read that TV ratings go up Big Time when he plays. The strangest thing about his infidelity is that all of his paramours looked they came from an Appalachian Walmart.Replies: @Ganderson, @Brutusale, @res
That needs a link.
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/the-comedy-issue-the-story-behind-the-10-stages-of-drunkenness
Replies: @J.Ross, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
Nomonhan (also known as the site of the battles of Khalkhin Gol), where the Soviet Union defeated Japan in 1939, which changed the course of the war.
Japan and Nazi Germany may have won WW2 were it not for the battles that happened right there for 135 days. Incredibly this episode of the war is virtually untaught in the West, maybe because it didn’t involve the West (which shows how self-centered our version of history is).
During WW2 Northeast of China had been invaded and annexed by Japan, transformed into a puppet state called Manchukuo. This place is in the extreme West of this former puppet state (which is now back to being Northeast China), on the border with Mongolia and the former Soviet Union (now the Russian border).
At the time, 1939, Japan’s basic strategy for the war was “Northward Advance” (Hokushin-ron), i.e. seizing Siberia for its resources as far as Lake Baikal.
The USSR obviously begged to differ and Stalin sent General Zhukov, one of his best men (the future Marshal of the Soviet Union) on site to fight the Japanese back.
Long story short, the battles that ensued – with 200,000 soldiers on the battlefield – lastest 135 days and were the earliest large-scale 3-dimensional warfare in military history. It ended in a humiliating Japanese defeat which some Japanese historians call “the greatest defeat in the history of the Japanese army”, with 54,000 casualties.
The most important consequence of the battles that were fought there is that the Japanese completely changed their strategy from “Northward Advance” to “Southward Advance”, favoring seizing the resources of Southeast Asia instead of those of Siberia.
Masanobu Tsuji, the Japanese colonel most instrumental in these battles became “the most determined single protagonist in favor of war with the United States” and one of the strongest proponents of the attack on Pearl Harbor inside the Japanese army (according to postwar testimonies), having been traumatized by his experience of fighting the Russians. The US was of course the biggest power the Japanese would have to confront by pursuing the “Southward Advance” strategy since only the US Pacific Fleet stood in the way of seizing the oil-rich Dutch East Indie.
In fact the Nomonhan battles traumatized the Japanese so much that they didn’t dare fight the Russians again for the remainder of WW2. Even when their ally Nazi Germany opened the Eastern front the Japanese army adopted a resolution “not to intervene in German Soviet war for the time being”, leaving Hitler to fight the Soviet Union on his own, which would ultimately prove to be his demise.
So it’s no exaggeration to say that had the battles there not been fought or had the Japanese won, WW2 would have most likely turned out dramatically different. Pearl Harbor wouldn’t have happened, and Japan would have likely helped Nazi Germany fight the Soviet Union by opening a front to the East.
Nomonhan may in fact have been the most consequential battle of WW2!
Japan and Nazi Germany may have won WW2 were it not for the battles that happened right there for 135 days. Incredibly this episode of the war is virtually untaught in the West, maybe because it didn't involve the West (which shows how self-centered our version of history is).
During WW2 Northeast of China had been invaded and annexed by Japan, transformed into a puppet state called Manchukuo. This place is in the extreme West of this former puppet state (which is now back to being Northeast China), on the border with Mongolia and the former Soviet Union (now the Russian border).
At the time, 1939, Japan's basic strategy for the war was "Northward Advance" (Hokushin-ron), i.e. seizing Siberia for its resources as far as Lake Baikal.
The USSR obviously begged to differ and Stalin sent General Zhukov, one of his best men (the future Marshal of the Soviet Union) on site to fight the Japanese back.
Long story short, the battles that ensued - with 200,000 soldiers on the battlefield - lastest 135 days and were the earliest large-scale 3-dimensional warfare in military history. It ended in a humiliating Japanese defeat which some Japanese historians call "the greatest defeat in the history of the Japanese army", with 54,000 casualties.
The most important consequence of the battles that were fought there is that the Japanese completely changed their strategy from "Northward Advance" to "Southward Advance", favoring seizing the resources of Southeast Asia instead of those of Siberia.
Masanobu Tsuji, the Japanese colonel most instrumental in these battles became "the most determined single protagonist in favor of war with the United States" and one of the strongest proponents of the attack on Pearl Harbor inside the Japanese army (according to postwar testimonies), having been traumatized by his experience of fighting the Russians. The US was of course the biggest power the Japanese would have to confront by pursuing the "Southward Advance" strategy since only the US Pacific Fleet stood in the way of seizing the oil-rich Dutch East Indie.
In fact the Nomonhan battles traumatized the Japanese so much that they didn't dare fight the Russians again for the remainder of WW2. Even when their ally Nazi Germany opened the Eastern front the Japanese army adopted a resolution "not to intervene in German Soviet war for the time being", leaving Hitler to fight the Soviet Union on his own, which would ultimately prove to be his demise.
So it's no exaggeration to say that had the battles there not been fought or had the Japanese won, WW2 would have most likely turned out dramatically different. Pearl Harbor wouldn't have happened, and Japan would have likely helped Nazi Germany fight the Soviet Union by opening a front to the East.
Nomonhan may in fact have been the most consequential battle of WW2!Replies: @Steve Sailer
It would have made sense for Hitler to learn from his Japanese ally’s defeat by Zhukov in 1939 that the Soviets were tougher than they looked, and therefore the Germans should coordinate with the Japanese on a southern strategy: the Japanese take Dutch oil in Indonesia, and the Germans take British oil in Iraq and Iran and the Axis links up in India.
But Hitler wanted to go north for ideological reasons, while the Japanese wanted to go south for prudential reasons, so the Axis turned out pretty worthless.
The US occupation gave Japanese women the vote, and redistributed farm land to the peasants that worked it. American engineers were in every Japanese factory, to help it not hinder it, and provided American markets for Japanese goods. The American ban on all film formats but 35mm was the sound base for the success of Japan’s camera industry.
American occupation forces were schooled in respect for Japanese culture and each was given a textbook to make sure they remembered. Sure, it was guys in their 20’s and they could, and did, act like idiots, but it was benign compared to Japanese behavior in Korea, China, and anywhere else you guys set foot, and Americans never tried to destroy Japanese culture like you guys tried in Korea. A Korean once told me, to this day, parents will tell misbehaving kids “You better be good or those Japanese will get you!!”.
Yeah, I envy the rubber chicken he’s going to be eating and rounds of golf with obsequious old white guys he’s going to be playing at those outings for the next 20 years! Wait, he’s too much of a dick to be invited.
The second two books of Jenkins’ Billy Clyde Puckett trilogy dealt with the eternal question of what to do when I grow up. All retired NFL RB Puckett could see in his future was giving speeches and falling asleep dead drunk on the podium. Tigger, with his proclivity for drugs (he had FIVE, including weed, on board when he was arrested), might have a bigger problem.
Let’s hope he makes it to the Senior Tour intact.
Tiger Woods is worth hundreds of millions of dollars, he has to push tang away, and his strongest skill is pretty much what white guys over 40 obsess over and do for fun... playing golf.
Do you think, even with all of his issues, he'd trade places with you?Replies: @Brutusale
The second two books of Jenkins' Billy Clyde Puckett trilogy dealt with the eternal question of what to do when I grow up. All retired NFL RB Puckett could see in his future was giving speeches and falling asleep dead drunk on the podium. Tigger, with his proclivity for drugs (he had FIVE, including weed, on board when he was arrested), might have a bigger problem.
Let's hope he makes it to the Senior Tour intact.Replies: @Truth
Old Sport, let’s just settle in the real world for a second…
Tiger Woods is worth hundreds of millions of dollars, he has to push tang away, and his strongest skill is pretty much what white guys over 40 obsess over and do for fun… playing golf.
Do you think, even with all of his issues, he’d trade places with you?
It's Jenkins' life that I envy.Replies: @Truth
Agree that Bonds was better than anyone else without steroids, but the separation seemed a lot smaller than it was post-steroids.
For example, pre-steroids, some people think that Griffey was better. I don’t agree, but it’s at least close enough to have been a debate. With PED-Bonds, there was no one within a country mile of his performance. I think the only other time we’ve seen a degree of separation that large is with Ruth.
Japan, China and America were totally infiltrated by Soviet communists so were driven to war each other.
Allies victory ultimately resulted in Communist China becoming the biggest industrial juggernaut the world has ever known, more so than America in WWII.
And American media taken over communists, whom you are so disposed to show off how much cleverer you are than.
This is why I love this opinion webzine. Commenters such as yourself offer up a statement that is so over the top, so outrageous, that they/you actually believe it to be accurate.
But, I'll entertain your nuttery--what sources are you able to provide that lends support to your contention. Remember, the key phrase here is "totally infiltrated by Soviet communists".
My vague impression is that you won't respond, but maybe you'll surprise us...Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
True, but the Soviet-Japanese border clashes were relatively little reported in Europe, whereas the clumsy Soviet performance against Finland attracted a lot of attention.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilbur_Wood#All-Star_workhorse_(1971%E2%80%9375)Also see this.
https://prestonjg.wordpress.com/2009/09/12/a-thorough-account-of-pitchers-who-have-started-both-games-of-a-doubleheader-in-the-major-leagues/
https://prestonjg.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/screenhunter_08-nov-25-15-34.gif
An earlier example is a nice example of managerial gamesmanship.Another earlier example.A surprising number of earlier examples follow with a table of all the instances of a pitcher starting both games of a doubleheader since 1901 at the end.Replies: @Ganderson
Rich Chiles reference! When he played for the Twins we nicknamed him “The Duck”, because he reminded us of a duck when he ran
Tiger Woods is worth hundreds of millions of dollars, he has to push tang away, and his strongest skill is pretty much what white guys over 40 obsess over and do for fun... playing golf.
Do you think, even with all of his issues, he'd trade places with you?Replies: @Brutusale
Of course not. But I don’t envy him, either. All that money and he’s still a tortured little boy driving impaired and banging sluts. But hey, he’s black.
It’s Jenkins’ life that I envy.
Bro, can it possibly be worse that having all that money, and driving impaired...
http://www.thepostgame.com/brett-favre-southern-miss-car-accident-dui
....And chasing sluts but NOT banging them?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-11213127/Ex-Jets-host-Jennifer-Sterger-reveals-details-Brett-Favre-text-incident-amid-welfare-scandal.html
Or worse yet, having all that money and chasing sluts... and then MARRYING them?
https://www.sheknows.com/entertainment/articles/2895267/donald-trump-marla-maples-affair-michael-bolton/
https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/article/donald-trump-melania-trump-knauss-first-lady-erectionsWell, to each his own, but as the great Jean Sebilius once said:
There's never been a statue erected to honor a critic.
It's Jenkins' life that I envy.Replies: @Truth
Is that really the issue?
Bro, can it possibly be worse that having all that money, and driving impaired…
http://www.thepostgame.com/brett-favre-southern-miss-car-accident-dui
….And chasing sluts but NOT banging them?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-11213127/Ex-Jets-host-Jennifer-Sterger-reveals-details-Brett-Favre-text-incident-amid-welfare-scandal.html
Or worse yet, having all that money and chasing sluts… and then MARRYING them?
https://www.sheknows.com/entertainment/articles/2895267/donald-trump-marla-maples-affair-michael-bolton/
https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/article/donald-trump-melania-trump-knauss-first-lady-erections
Well, to each his own, but as the great Jean Sebilius once said:
There’s never been a statue erected to honor a critic.
“Japan, China and America were totally infiltrated by Soviet communists so were driven to war each other.”
This is why I love this opinion webzine. Commenters such as yourself offer up a statement that is so over the top, so outrageous, that they/you actually believe it to be accurate.
But, I’ll entertain your nuttery–what sources are you able to provide that lends support to your contention. Remember, the key phrase here is “totally infiltrated by Soviet communists”.
My vague impression is that you won’t respond, but maybe you’ll surprise us…
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Christiansen-Clausen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Branko_Vukelić_(spy)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotsumi_Ozaki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_TrepperChina:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/11/G.N._Voitrngsky.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grigori_Voitinskyhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Karl_Radek_1.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Radekhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e5/Jakob_Rudnik.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakob_Rudnikhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_BorodinReplies: @Corvinus, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
My best guess is you don’t see a Yellow Pride movement because of that and the negative associations of the color in the West.Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @nebulafox
Not in Vietnam. People fear and distrust China, not Japan.
(You can think of Vietnam’s mentality with China as being a lot like Mexico’s with the US. It’s too big to piss off and it has culturally influenced you too much to truly HATE the place. But too much of your distinct national identity has been defined in opposition to the colossus to the north and its attempts-real or perceived-to make a satellite out of or absorb you.)
I think the big difference is that Vietnam’s other dealings with foreign rule or intervention were not noticeably better than Imperial Japan: not worse, but not better. It didn’t hurt that the Japanese used the Vichy French through the war and then proceeded to eject and disarm them in 1945. Some Japanese officers would stay on and advise the Viet Minh rather than enter Allied POW camps and go back to bombed out rubble.
Also, arguably the ugliest one-off Japanese atrocity of the war took place in 1945 in Manila, and the Philippines get along fine with Japan. The Filipinos are a notoriously forgiving bunch, to be sure, but I think that does point to a significant domestic political element in China and South Korea invested in keeping anti-Japanese sentiment alive as a major political force. The former requires little explanation, but for the latter, there’s little strategic benefit. If China cuts off the shipping lanes, they’ll both be in trouble.
This is why I love this opinion webzine. Commenters such as yourself offer up a statement that is so over the top, so outrageous, that they/you actually believe it to be accurate.
But, I'll entertain your nuttery--what sources are you able to provide that lends support to your contention. Remember, the key phrase here is "totally infiltrated by Soviet communists".
My vague impression is that you won't respond, but maybe you'll surprise us...Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
US:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_espionage_in_the_United_States
Japan:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Sorge
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Christiansen-Clausen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Branko_Vukelić_(spy)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotsumi_Ozaki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_Trepper
China:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grigori_Voitinsky
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Radek
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakob_Rudnik
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Borodin
The next step is to synthesize those sources and offer a cogent argument. In other words, there needs to be a written narrative on your part to make that connection, OR a source that actually makes the connection for you.
Though Japanese culture puts great emphasis on responsibility and obligation, its too-great-an-emphasis-on-shame has created a false sense of honor that has prevented the development of true maturity. A mature person strives for higher things but also has the grace and honesty to admit when he's reached his limit, lost, or fallen. Ya gotta do what ya gotta do, but when you're beat, you're beat. You have to learn to accept defeat.
Now, just look at Japan's handling of WWII. They couldn't handle defeat though the writing was on the wall. It took two nukes to finally make them surrender. Defeat was so anathema and shameful to Japan that there was the serious likelihood that all-Japanese would commit mass-suicide with the emperor than admit defeat. No wonder McCarthur called Japan an immature nation.
Now, fast forward to Tokyo Olympics of 1964 which was supposed to celebrate the revival of Japan as a democratic nation. Yet, when the Japanese judo wrestler lost the all-around title to some a bigger Dutch guy, the whole nation was crying and babbling like babies. Worse, the judo dude committed suicide. And the Japanese marathoner who came in third place–hardly disgraceful–committed suicide too. Many Japanese regarded these suicides as acts of honor or self-atonement, but they are really acts of immaturity inoculated by a culture that has little tolerance or understanding for the human condition.
Win some, lose some, and take things in stride; that is the mature way. Over-emphasis on win-win and obey-obey leads to the kind of collective immaturity that not only led to the suicides of those athletes but collective appreciation of them as something half-decent. No wonder so many Japanese salarymen cannot face the fall from status. Same anti-humanist pathology.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Christiansen-Clausen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Branko_Vukelić_(spy)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotsumi_Ozaki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_TrepperChina:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/11/G.N._Voitrngsky.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grigori_Voitinskyhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Karl_Radek_1.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Radekhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e5/Jakob_Rudnik.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakob_Rudnikhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_BorodinReplies: @Corvinus, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
Thank you for the sources. I already know that there was communist infiltration in the U.S. and Great Britain prior and during WW2. What is unclear in those sources demonstrate a clear, convincing path that proves YOUR contention–the total infiltrated by Soviet communists that resulted in war between the U.S./Great Britain vs. the Soviet Union.
The next step is to synthesize those sources and offer a cogent argument. In other words, there needs to be a written narrative on your part to make that connection, OR a source that actually makes the connection for you.
(You can think of Vietnam’s mentality with China as being a lot like Mexico’s with the US. It’s too big to piss off and it has culturally influenced you too much to truly HATE the place. But too much of your distinct national identity has been defined in opposition to the colossus to the north and its attempts-real or perceived-to make a satellite out of or absorb you.)
I think the big difference is that Vietnam’s other dealings with foreign rule or intervention were not noticeably better than Imperial Japan: not worse, but not better. It didn’t hurt that the Japanese used the Vichy French through the war and then proceeded to eject and disarm them in 1945. Some Japanese officers would stay on and advise the Viet Minh rather than enter Allied POW camps and go back to bombed out rubble.
Also, arguably the ugliest one-off Japanese atrocity of the war took place in 1945 in Manila, and the Philippines get along fine with Japan. The Filipinos are a notoriously forgiving bunch, to be sure, but I think that does point to a significant domestic political element in China and South Korea invested in keeping anti-Japanese sentiment alive as a major political force. The former requires little explanation, but for the latter, there’s little strategic benefit. If China cuts off the shipping lanes, they’ll both be in trouble.Replies: @Jim Don Bob
What was that? Serious question.
The Japanese did bad stuff when the Americans marched on Manila. It’s in Neal Stephenson’s “Cryptonomicon.”
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Amsterdam._A_visit_of_the_Japanese_delegation.jpgReplies: @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Manila_(1945)#Intramuros_devastated
American victor’s justice against the Japanese general in the Phillipines was so marked that it became a legal doctrine
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamashita_standard
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomoyuki_Yamashita#Trial
General Friedrich Christiansen (on the left) receives the Japanese delegation. In the middle, General Yamashita and the Reich Commissioner, Dr. Arthur Seyss-Inquart and General Walter Schwabe-Dissen.
The dominant public mood in postwar Japan was astonishment that their defeated empire had not been crushed pillaged and enslaved, but instead rebuilt and installed as important junior partners in a global American system.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Amsterdam._A_visit_of_the_Japanese_delegation.jpgReplies: @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
From Meiji to the USS Missouri, Japan set itself against a complex and ferocious juggernaut to install itself as a major military and industrial world power, and the only dominant power in Asia. The United States swatted these ambitions like a fly in the space of only three and a half years, without breaking a sweat.
It’s true, I’m sure you’ve read of the horrible treatment of war prisoners. In occupied British colonies they would take a woman going into labor and bind her legs together so she would be unable to pass the baby and through her aside to die in agony while the family watched, unable to intervene. They would take an American captive, tie him to a tree and cut open his stomach so the soft bowel hung out and then release starving pigs, which are omnivorous to lap up the soft guts, while his comrades were forced to watch. The stories from American, British, and Dutch sources are all consistent.
The dominant public mood in postwar Japan was astonishment that their defeated empire had not been crushed pillaged and enslaved, but instead rebuilt and installed as important junior partners in a global American system.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Christiansen-Clausen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Branko_Vukelić_(spy)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotsumi_Ozaki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopold_TrepperChina:https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/11/G.N._Voitrngsky.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grigori_Voitinskyhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Karl_Radek_1.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Radekhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e5/Jakob_Rudnik.jpghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakob_Rudnikhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_BorodinReplies: @Corvinus, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
Japanese know how to rise but not how to fall:
Though Japanese culture puts great emphasis on responsibility and obligation, its too-great-an-emphasis-on-shame has created a false sense of honor that has prevented the development of true maturity. A mature person strives for higher things but also has the grace and honesty to admit when he’s reached his limit, lost, or fallen. Ya gotta do what ya gotta do, but when you’re beat, you’re beat. You have to learn to accept defeat.
Now, just look at Japan’s handling of WWII. They couldn’t handle defeat though the writing was on the wall. It took two nukes to finally make them surrender. Defeat was so anathema and shameful to Japan that there was the serious likelihood that all-Japanese would commit mass-suicide with the emperor than admit defeat. No wonder McCarthur called Japan an immature nation.
Now, fast forward to Tokyo Olympics of 1964 which was supposed to celebrate the revival of Japan as a democratic nation. Yet, when the Japanese judo wrestler lost the all-around title to some a bigger Dutch guy, the whole nation was crying and babbling like babies. Worse, the judo dude committed suicide. And the Japanese marathoner who came in third place–hardly disgraceful–committed suicide too. Many Japanese regarded these suicides as acts of honor or self-atonement, but they are really acts of immaturity inoculated by a culture that has little tolerance or understanding for the human condition.
Win some, lose some, and take things in stride; that is the mature way. Over-emphasis on win-win and obey-obey leads to the kind of collective immaturity that not only led to the suicides of those athletes but collective appreciation of them as something half-decent. No wonder so many Japanese salarymen cannot face the fall from status. Same anti-humanist pathology.
https://www.amazon.com/Japans-Holocaust-History-Imperial-Murder-ebook/dp/B0CLKZNPTCJapanese conservatives will protest this book, but that's just going to increase its notoriety. CCP and its propagandists (many of whom these days are non-Chinese, but rather white, Jewish and Indian) will also promote this book.Replies: @SFG, @Noviop Co-Prosperity Sphere
The Japanese started taking themselves too seriously in the mid 80’s. After all, this was the time of the bubble economy and the rising yen. This was the time when the Japanese viewed and presented themselves as a unique, divine creation; totally separate from the rest of the human race.
Years of post-bubble recession combined with painful economic restructuring as well as the rise of China and Korea have reduced the feeling of specialness that the Japanese used to feel in the 80’s and early 90’s. The Japanese were really quite insufferable at that time.