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I’ve been reading Nietzsche’s 1888 book On the Genealogy of Morality, which includes the famous assertion of master morality versus slave morality. In Nietzsche’s mental model of prehistory, the masters seem to be Conan the Barbarian warrior-aristocrats, blond beasts, while the slaves are the indigenous masses conquered by the Indo-European invaders. (William Jones’ 1790 announcement in Calcutta that there must have been an Indo-European protolanguage had massive consequences for how Europeans thought about themselves, since it implied that Hinduism, with its extreme social stratification, may resemble what Europeans’ ancestors may have believed.)

Interestingly, in Nietzsche, the slaves are smarter than the masters and they are also more interesting. The masters’ morality is simple-minded: good versus bad. Everything the masters value in themselves — health, hunting, dancing, conquering, etc. — is good and everything about the pathetic slaves is bad and depressing.

Slave morality resentfully reverses these values. Now the slaves are good and the masters are not bad, they are evil. Judaism and Christianity are slave moralities.

I was struck by how literal is Nietzsche’s insistent that the masters are healthy and active and the slaves are sickly and listless. This is not a psychological metaphor for Nietzsche.

These bearers of oppressive, vindictive instincts, the descendants of all European and non-European slavery, in particular of all pre-Aryan population – represent the decline of mankind! These ‘instruments of culture’ are a disgrace to man, more a grounds for suspicion of, or an argument against, ‘culture’ in general! We may be quite justified in retaining our fear of the blond beast at the centre of every noble race and remain on our guard: but who would not, a hundred times over, prefer to fear if he can admire at the same time, rather than not fear, but thereby permanently retain the disgusting spectacle of the failed, the stunted, the wasted away and the poisoned? And is that not our fate? What constitutes our aversion to ‘man’ today? – for we suffer from man, no doubt about that. – Not fear; rather, the fact that we have nothing to fear from man; that ‘man’ is first and foremost a teeming mass of worms; that the ‘tame man’, who is incurably mediocre and unedifying, has already learnt to view himself as the aim and pinnacle, the meaning of history, the ‘higher man’; – yes, the fact that he has a certain right to feel like that in so far as he feels distanced from the superabundance of failed, sickly, tired and exhausted people of whom today’s Europe is beginning to reek, and in so far as he is at least relatively successful, at least still capable of living, at least saying ‘yes’ to life . . .

Instead, most slave religions and ideologies are, in Nietzsche’s mind, reactions to pervasive physical illness (he considers depression to be a physical illness, which might be true):

For, to speak generally: with all great religions, the main concern is the fight against a certain weariness and heaviness that has become epidemic.

We can regard it as inherently probable that from time to time, at certain places on earth, almost from necessity, a physiological feeling of obstruction will rule amongst large masses of people which, however, is not consciously perceived as such, through lack of physiological knowledge, so that its ‘cause’ and its cure can be sought and tested only on the psychological-moral level (– actually, this is my most general formula for what is usually called a ‘religion’).

Nietzsche himself was not very healthy, suffering from migraines and depression, and then losing his mental powers at age 44. But he was heroically active, writing a huge number of books in a short lifetime.

Something that’s hard for 21st Century people to recognize is how concerned people in the past were with pervasive illness. For one reason, they were sick more than we are. Second, the causes of illness weren’t well understood.

“What do you think about England, this country of ours where nobody is well?” — W.H. Auden

This Auden quote from 1932 is usually treated these days as a metaphor for England as a “sick society” due to the Depression or the class system or whatever. But actually the young Auden was writing literally about people feeling ill. (Auden subscribed at the time to some crackpot theory about how illness was caused by moral repression or whatever. I can’t quite remember.)

You can see it in books like Thomas Mann’s The Magic Mountain where the main character checks himself into a tuberculosis sanatorium for years without much evidence that he actually has TB, but you know, you can never tell.

Southern California was settled from 1887 onward to a large extent by affluent people from Back East worried about TB. That’s why inland, dry Pasadena was where the money classes moved, while avoiding cool, moist Santa Monica. My parents were very concerned in 1981 about my moving to Santa Monica because the clammy Santa Monica fogs would damage my health. It took me a long time after to figure out that they were thinking of places to live in pre-penicillin terms, while I had never worried once about contracting TB.

Even in 1888, Nietzsche still seemed to subscribe to the old miasma (bad air) theory of disease causation.

What do I find absolutely intolerable? Something which I just cannot cope alone with and which suffocates me and makes me feel faint? Bad air! Bad air! That something failed comes near me, that I have to smell the bowels of a failed soul!

From Wikipedia:

The miasma theory of disease transmission held that diseases such as cholera, chlamydia, or the Black Death were caused by a miasma (μίασμα, Ancient Greek: “pollution”), a noxious form of “bad air”. The theory held that the origin of these epidemic diseases was a miasma, emanating from rotting organic matter.[5] Miasma was considered to be a poisonous vapor or mist filled with particles from decomposed matter (miasmata) that caused illnesses. The miasmatic position was that diseases were the product of environmental factors such as contaminated water, foul air, and poor hygienic conditions. Such infection was not passed between individuals but would affect individuals within the locale that gave rise to such vapors. It was identifiable by its foul smell.

This was the predominant theory of disease transmission before the germ theory of disease took hold in the last decade of the 19th century.

Nietzsche goes on to list some of his other theories for the cause of widespread illness, such as miscegenation:

– Such a feeling of obstruction can be of the most diverse descent: for example, as a result of crossing races that are too heterogeneous (or estates [classes] – estates always indicate differences in descent and race as well: the European ‘Weltschmerz’, the pessimism of the nineteenth century, is essentially the result of a foolishly sudden mixing of estates);

– or it could be brought about by unsound emigration – a race ending up in a climate for which its powers of adaptation are inadequate (the case of the Indians in India);

– or by the after-effects of a race’s age and fatigue (Parisian pessimism from 1850 on);

– or by a faulty diet (alcoholism of the Middle Ages; the nonsense of the vegetarians who at least have the authority of Sir Christopher in Shakespeare on their side);

– or by corruption of the blood, malaria, syphilis and such like (German depression after the Thirty Years’ War, which infected half of Germany with ruinous diseases and thus prepared the ground for German servility, German faint-heartedness).

I’m being unfair to Nietzsche by quoting this because in this part he sounds kind of like a crank, whereas in most of the book he sounds like a genius, although not necessarily a trustworthy one.

My impression is that one connection between Nietzsche and Hitler was a common German fear of being poisoned, whether by miasmas, bad food, or mixed blood. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden. The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.

Paul Johnson wrote in Modern Times:

Race-poisoning was a comparatively common obsession in the time of Hitler’s youth, rather as ecological poisoning became an obsession of many in the 1970s and 1980s.

 
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  1. The thing about Nietzsche is that whenever he talks about Jews what he really means is the Apostle Paul. Jacob Taubes in my mind correctly points out just how envious Nietzsche was of Paul, who Nietzsxhe conceived of as having polemically targeted and ultimately ideologically destroyed the Roman Empire.

    Ive often wondered if Paul hadn’t been afflicted with what is common identified as epilepsy and hadn’t been as sickly as he was if Nietzsche would have picked another metaphor than sickness to characterize slave morality. Also the sickness metaphor was au courrant at that period think Kierkegaard’s sickness unto death so I would be cautious about attributing too much to Nietzsche’s metaphor.

    • Agree: The Z Blog
  2. Sid says:

    Three ideas:

    1. A lot of Nietzsche’s philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer. Instead, he was sickly his entire life, and he was meek, shy, obsequious, and utterly resentful of how strong-willed men like Richard Wagner strode all over him.

    Old ladies loved keeping Nieztsche as company, because he was so sweet and polite. Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he’s known his life.

    2. The late 19th century was an especially bad time for public health. The Industrial Revolution was terrible for air quality and environmental protection as we know it didn’t exist. Meanwhile, modern medicine was only gradually coming about, so all the old diseases of the past were rampant in big, crowded cities.

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That’s when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    3. A lot of Nieztsche’s ideas sound crankish, but he, like his model Schopenhauer, were grappling with problems from a naturalistic worldview in its infancy. The modern methods we have for devising and testing ideas weren’t around, so they came up with numerous ideas without having the means to test them without just bloviating about them.

    As an addendum, Nietzsche’s writings about prehistory sound juvenile, but he was extremely well educated in the Classics, being offered a professorship at age 25, which was even more impressive then than it is today, because Classics was where some of the brightest minds in Germany were fighting tooth and nail to get into.

    • Replies: @Sam Haysom
    @Sid

    In a lot of ways Nietzsche was the anti-Teddy Roosevelt. Both suffered from physician ailments, but Teddy through sheer exertion of will overcome his while Nietzsche just kind of moped around.

    And Nietzsche was certainly a talented classicist- but birth of tradegy is full of errors and somewhat silly arguments. Still an interesting book.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    , @Erik Sieven
    @Sid

    "Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he’s known his life."
    this type of guy still exists today, writing angry posts at sluthate etc.

    , @The Man From K Street
    @Sid


    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That’s when they understood it was time for better public health measures.
     
    The same thing happened in the US later on. One of the unpleasant, shocking discoveries of the return of conscription in both 1917 and then again in 1940 was just what a huge proportion of draft-age men from rural districts were simply physically unfit for military service. 4-H? 4-F! Bones that had broken in childhood and never properly set. Hookworms. Eyes that were chronically infected. On and on. Heading into the Cold War this dent in the available manpower pool was seen as a continuing security threat, so the Hill-Burton Act of 1946 provided federal funds for rural hospital construction and accreditation. Of course, what the writers of the law couldn't anticipate in 1946 was that the rural areas of the time were soon to become the far-more densely-populated suburbs of the postwar boom, so Hill-Burton was to have a far bigger effect on the nationwide system of health care and financing then was known at the time.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @Rapparee
    @Sid


    "A lot of Nietzsche’s philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer."
     
    On Nietzsche, I always recall G.K. Chesterton's comparison with Joan of Arc:

    “Joan of Arc was not stuck at the cross-roads, either by rejecting all the paths like Tolstoy, or by accepting them all like Nietzsche. She chose a path, and went down it like a thunderbolt. Yet Joan, when I came to think of her, had in her all that was true either in Tolstoy or Nietzsche, all that was even tolerable in either of them. I thought of all that is noble in Tolstoy, the pleasure in plain things, especially in plain pity, the actualities of the earth, the reverence for the poor, the dignity of the bowed back. Joan of Arc had all that and with this great addition, that she endured poverty as well as admiring it; whereas Tolstoy is only a typical aristocrat trying to find out its secret. And then I thought of all that was brave and proud and pathetic in poor Nietzsche, and his mutiny against the emptiness and timidity of our time. I thought of his cry for the ecstatic equilibrium of danger, his hunger for the rush of great horses, his cry to arms. Well, Joan of Arc had all that, and again with this difference, that she did not praise fighting, but fought. We know that she was not afraid of an army, while Nietzsche, for all we know, was afraid of a cow. Tolstoy only praised the peasant; she was the peasant. Nietzsche only praised the warrior; she was the warrior. She beat them both at their own antagonistic ideals; she was more gentle than the one, more violent than the other. Yet she was a perfectly practical person who did something, while they are wild speculators who do nothing."
     
    , @John Derbyshire
    @Sid

    "Most of the world's work is done by people who are not feeling very well"—Churchill.

  3. My impression is that one connection between Nietzsche and Hitler was a common German fear of being poisoned, whether by miasmas, bad food, or mixed blood. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden. The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.

    Along these lines, it’s interesting to note the modern, SJW obsession with calling un-PC things “toxic”: toxic masculinity, toxic racism, etc.

    Jonathan Haidt would probably argue that this is a manifestation of the Sanctity or Purity foundation ( abhorrence for disgusting things, foods, actions; opposite of degradation) of human morality.

    Of course, this presents a bit of a complication to Haidt’s theory, as SJW’s are supposed to be deficient in the purity pole of human morality.

    • Replies: @Thursday
    @syonredux

    No, it doesn't complicate Haidt's theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.

    Left Wing Authoritarians seem to be very good at pushing ordinary left liberals' Compassion button.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_fBYROA7Hk
    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    Replies: @syonredux, @syonredux, @Abe

  4. Re: The late 19th obsession with decadence and decay,

    Max Nordau’s Degeneration (1892) is the key book to read for anyone who is interested in the topic:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degeneration_(Nordau)

    • Replies: @Anon Chief
    @syonredux

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Nordau says:


    "Nordau was at one time a staunch eugenicist."
     
  5. Time frame sickness: think Calvin Coolidge’s son death from an infection. You think health care is bad in 2017!

  6. I always look forward to what, our host, Mr. Sailer, inspires the bright minds here to share.

    Anybody see any value in trying to take it deeper in something like an iSteve inspired book discussion forum?

  7. The flu epidemic of 1918 killed as many as 100 million people worldwide.

    • Replies: @newrouter
    @Foreign Expert

    2nd that. Penicillin was a late 1920's find by happenstance.

    Replies: @Pat Boyle

  8. The English Cavaliers and other Brits and their descendants who settled in Virginia and other Southern colonies suffered from ill health well into modern times, thanks to ignorance about the role of mosquitoes and fecal contamination in spreading parasites and diseases. Given the high mortality rate and the laws which allowed women to inherit land and other assets, upper class planters made a virtue of necessity by marrying widows from similar backgrounds, despite these women’s previous sexual experience and whatever children they brought with them into the new households. Both George Washington and Thomas Jefferson picked up their respective wives this way.

    Yet I don’t know of anyone who characterizes the old Virginian society these people built as a sick or sad place because of pervasive poor health and short life expectancies. The men, especially, seemed especially vigorous when it came to seeking American independence and then establishing the new nation on a sound foundation.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
    @advancedatheist


    The view is taken (as clearly reappears later in the case of the Hobbits who have the Ring for a while) that each Kind has a natural span integral to its biological and spiritual nature. This cannot really be increased qualitatively or quantitatively; so that prolongation in time is like stretching a wire out ever tauter, or spreading butter ever thinner – it becomes an intolerable torment.
     
    The phrase "qualitatively or quantitatively" is crucial: the concept applies not just to the length of a lifespan, but alos to one's fate during that lifespan. Attempting to change it, whether by Men seeking immortality, or Elves seeking preservation, is viewed as a Bad Thing in Tolkien's diegesis.

    Perhaps the advances in medicine, sanitation, and so on approach declining marginal utility today, as we all live to become decrepit liches warehoused in nurseries to burble tapioca and have our nether regions wiped by orderlies, and even our days of vigour are squandered in overpopulated snarls of traffic, stress, and ennui.

    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman's ideas into a discussion of the great German's (I am currently steeped in the one's as Steve is the other's in my studies and reading); but I cannot help but think on this idea that modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche's own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).

    Replies: @Stan Adams, @The Anti-Gnostic, @Abe

  9. Speaking of the SoCal health food movement, I thought I shared this tweet with Steve last night, but it looks like I didn’t. Lauren Lyster is a news babe who went from RT to Yahoo Finance to ABC.
    https://twitter.com/LaurenLyster/status/871853544705368065

    • Replies: @Olorin
    @Dave Pinsen

    "Ankle deep"? Either she has no feet or somebody is overstocking their 40 square feet of land.

    Poor effing little hens.

    But apparently the new hipster foodie fashion is to be counter-hipster-foodie.

    I figure it's just a matter of time before breakfast at Cheese Penis (the name based North Berkeleyans used for Alice Waters's foodie cathedral) consists of an Eggo with Mazola margarine, a dollop of Smuckers corn-syrup-based fruit spread, and some bacon. With Dunkin' Donuts coffee on the side. And a glass of Richmond tap water.

    The important thing is that the bacon is there. It establishes a beachhead, and before you know it other things follow.

    Bacon can be wrapped around red pills like you enfold dog medications in a slice of deli ham.

    No one can stay at odds with bacon and remain sane. This is Islam's and Judaism's problem in a nutshell.

    Offer them communions of bacon, and the rest will eventually follow.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/jewish-elders-lift-6000-year-ham-ban-992

    It's not a bacon thing. It's a crispy salty smoked fat thing.

    Though CAFO-pig bacon always tastes to me like 50,000 gallons of pig squitz in a manure lagoon on a hot summer day smells.

    Wild boar bacon, not so much.

    Why the hell am I talking about bacon? I came in here to talk about Nietzsche.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/new-nietzschean-diet-lets-you-eat-whatever-you-fea-1703

    Replies: @Jack D, @Dave Pinsen

  10. Lot says:

    Something that’s hard for 21st Century people to recognize is how concerned people in the past were with pervasive illness. For one reason, they were sick more than we are.

    Lots of biographies of notable men before 1940 note they were sick for long portions of their youth, usually with no specificity.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Lot

    Yup.

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I'm not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    In general, we are pretty clueless about what kind of illness celebrities in the past suffered from (e.g., speculating about Van Gogh's mental and physical health is a cottage industry). For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @John Derbyshire, @stillCARealist, @David Davenport

  11. @Foreign Expert
    The flu epidemic of 1918 killed as many as 100 million people worldwide.

    Replies: @newrouter

    2nd that. Penicillin was a late 1920’s find by happenstance.

    • Replies: @Pat Boyle
    @newrouter

    Penicillin was not discovered by happenstance. The discoverer of penicillin was Howard Florey an Australian medical researcher at Oxford who led a team of doctors charged with developing anti-bacterials. It was a large team and a major effort. Florey set one of his team to doing a literature search. His assistant uncovered an obscure paper from 1928 of an observation of an anti-bacterial accidental result from a mold. The doctor who had made that long forgotten observation was Alexander Fleming.

    Florey who had organized the effort to find a new anti-bacterial substance and who shared the Nobel Prize with Fleming is now largely forgotten. Fleming who simply published an observation is now credited with the whole discovery.

    Replies: @res, @dearieme

  12. You should watch Jordan Peterson’s lectures on the science of personality. His lectures on conscientiousness are particularly relevant for this post. Apparently, authoritarianism in individuals and in government correlates with disease prevalence at around 0.7. Famine also has some effect. But not other deadly things, like war. So, the triumph of liberalism (and likely secularism as well) seems to be largely caused by a reduction in disease prevalence.

    The way I interpret Peterson is that in low disease prevalence people tend to end up lower in personality subtrait Orderliness. Orderliness is one of two subfactors of Big 5 Conscientiousness. It is associated with religiousness, authoritarianism, judgmentalism, cleanliness and being organized. It is also associated with conservative politics, though less so than low Openness.

    Of note: both conservative politics and religion are often based around bodily metaphors.

    I believe this is the work Peterson is referring to:
    http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0062275

    —–

    2014

    2015

    2016

    2017

    —–

    He’s a very entertaining lecturer.

    • Replies: @Jason K.
    @Thursday

    Agreed. He is very useful to listen to. Though whenever he references other fields, you should generally ignore what he says. He reliably gets important details wrong. It isn't an unusual failing for an academic, but something to be aware of.

    , @Steve Sailer
    @Thursday

    John Derbyshire wrote a piece about his mother the nurse.

    One reason married women in America didn't work all that much until the 1960s was because investing more effort in scrubbing the house clean had a payoff in reduced family mortality. But the introduction of antibiotics made housework less of a life and death matter. Combined with huge improvements in appliances and consumer packaged goods, more mothers had time for a job once their kids were in school.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    , @Ian M.
    @Thursday


    Of note: both conservative politics and religion are often based around bodily metaphors.
     
    This was one of the major themes of the late Mary Douglas, a member of that species often thought to be mythical: the conservative anthropologist.
  13. @Thursday
    You should watch Jordan Peterson's lectures on the science of personality. His lectures on conscientiousness are particularly relevant for this post. Apparently, authoritarianism in individuals and in government correlates with disease prevalence at around 0.7. Famine also has some effect. But not other deadly things, like war. So, the triumph of liberalism (and likely secularism as well) seems to be largely caused by a reduction in disease prevalence.

    The way I interpret Peterson is that in low disease prevalence people tend to end up lower in personality subtrait Orderliness. Orderliness is one of two subfactors of Big 5 Conscientiousness. It is associated with religiousness, authoritarianism, judgmentalism, cleanliness and being organized. It is also associated with conservative politics, though less so than low Openness.

    Of note: both conservative politics and religion are often based around bodily metaphors.

    I believe this is the work Peterson is referring to:
    http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0062275

    -----

    2014
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH9-xsuPiUk

    2015
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt90JwDHh-Y
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35e5i6FQuMw

    2016
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q15eTySnWxc

    2017
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBWyBdUYPgk&t

    -----

    He's a very entertaining lecturer.

    Replies: @Jason K., @Steve Sailer, @Ian M.

    Agreed. He is very useful to listen to. Though whenever he references other fields, you should generally ignore what he says. He reliably gets important details wrong. It isn’t an unusual failing for an academic, but something to be aware of.

  14. @Sid
    Three ideas:

    1. A lot of Nietzsche's philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer. Instead, he was sickly his entire life, and he was meek, shy, obsequious, and utterly resentful of how strong-willed men like Richard Wagner strode all over him.

    Old ladies loved keeping Nieztsche as company, because he was so sweet and polite. Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he's known his life.

    2. The late 19th century was an especially bad time for public health. The Industrial Revolution was terrible for air quality and environmental protection as we know it didn't exist. Meanwhile, modern medicine was only gradually coming about, so all the old diseases of the past were rampant in big, crowded cities.

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That's when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    3. A lot of Nieztsche's ideas sound crankish, but he, like his model Schopenhauer, were grappling with problems from a naturalistic worldview in its infancy. The modern methods we have for devising and testing ideas weren't around, so they came up with numerous ideas without having the means to test them without just bloviating about them.

    As an addendum, Nietzsche's writings about prehistory sound juvenile, but he was extremely well educated in the Classics, being offered a professorship at age 25, which was even more impressive then than it is today, because Classics was where some of the brightest minds in Germany were fighting tooth and nail to get into.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom, @Erik Sieven, @The Man From K Street, @Rapparee, @John Derbyshire

    In a lot of ways Nietzsche was the anti-Teddy Roosevelt. Both suffered from physician ailments, but Teddy through sheer exertion of will overcome his while Nietzsche just kind of moped around.

    And Nietzsche was certainly a talented classicist- but birth of tradegy is full of errors and somewhat silly arguments. Still an interesting book.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Sam Haysom

    Nietzsche wrote a lot more books than I have. He didn't write after age 44, but I recognize the names of 8 or 10 of his books.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom

  15. @Sam Haysom
    @Sid

    In a lot of ways Nietzsche was the anti-Teddy Roosevelt. Both suffered from physician ailments, but Teddy through sheer exertion of will overcome his while Nietzsche just kind of moped around.

    And Nietzsche was certainly a talented classicist- but birth of tradegy is full of errors and somewhat silly arguments. Still an interesting book.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    Nietzsche wrote a lot more books than I have. He didn’t write after age 44, but I recognize the names of 8 or 10 of his books.

    • Replies: @Sam Haysom
    @Steve Sailer

    Certainly very proflic if prone to recycling ideas. I'd say you've written more words than he has- but I wasn't really speaking to his output. I was speaking to the previous commenters point about how Nietzsche let his bitterness and wish fulfillment get the better of him. Compared to a man like TR who went on became the dashing adventurer he wanted.

    Replies: @Anonymous Nephew

  16. @syonredux

    My impression is that one connection between Nietzsche and Hitler was a common German fear of being poisoned, whether by miasmas, bad food, or mixed blood. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden. The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.
     
    Along these lines, it's interesting to note the modern, SJW obsession with calling un-PC things "toxic": toxic masculinity, toxic racism, etc.

    Jonathan Haidt would probably argue that this is a manifestation of the Sanctity or Purity foundation ( abhorrence for disgusting things, foods, actions; opposite of degradation) of human morality.

    Of course, this presents a bit of a complication to Haidt's theory, as SJW's are supposed to be deficient in the purity pole of human morality.

    Replies: @Thursday

    No, it doesn’t complicate Haidt’s theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.

    Left Wing Authoritarians seem to be very good at pushing ordinary left liberals’ Compassion button.

    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    • Replies: @syonredux
    @Thursday


    No, it doesn’t complicate Haidt’s theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.
     
    Thanks. That seems to explain the use of the disgust-sanctity dimension by SJWs.
    , @syonredux
    @Thursday


    Immigrant Screening (.58) (PC-Egalitarians feel we shouldn't be allowed to screen for any of those)
    Countries should be allowed to screen immigrants and/or refugees for:
    Race.
    Education and skills.
    Marital status and children.
    Religion.
    Gender.

    Wealth.
     
    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    As I feel that we should be able to screen for all of those things, I'm clearly not very egalitarian....
    , @Abe
    @Thursday


    No, it doesn’t complicate Haidt’s theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.
     
    Yes, hasn't everyone here noticed by now that the whole edifice of ant-racism virtue signaling is centered on milking that disgust reflex for all it's worth? Some BBC honcho once described his outfit as 'hideously' white. Dumbo Ben Affleck has called racism 'gross'. Anyone with politically incorrect views is routinely trashed as 'disgusting'.

    As I've often said, one of the more evil genius aspects of the Hillary Clinton campaign (and she almost pulled it off) was to try to rope in centrist and mildly-conservative voters with appeals to faux patriotism ('America which has founded by Muslims has always been great!') and to start really pushing the gag reflex on all the normies out there, now that they've been thoroughly marinated in PC culture for 25 years. These certainly aren't your dad's free-spirited, anarchic, bohemian liberals anymore.
  17. @Thursday
    You should watch Jordan Peterson's lectures on the science of personality. His lectures on conscientiousness are particularly relevant for this post. Apparently, authoritarianism in individuals and in government correlates with disease prevalence at around 0.7. Famine also has some effect. But not other deadly things, like war. So, the triumph of liberalism (and likely secularism as well) seems to be largely caused by a reduction in disease prevalence.

    The way I interpret Peterson is that in low disease prevalence people tend to end up lower in personality subtrait Orderliness. Orderliness is one of two subfactors of Big 5 Conscientiousness. It is associated with religiousness, authoritarianism, judgmentalism, cleanliness and being organized. It is also associated with conservative politics, though less so than low Openness.

    Of note: both conservative politics and religion are often based around bodily metaphors.

    I believe this is the work Peterson is referring to:
    http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0062275

    -----

    2014
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH9-xsuPiUk

    2015
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt90JwDHh-Y
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35e5i6FQuMw

    2016
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q15eTySnWxc

    2017
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBWyBdUYPgk&t

    -----

    He's a very entertaining lecturer.

    Replies: @Jason K., @Steve Sailer, @Ian M.

    John Derbyshire wrote a piece about his mother the nurse.

    One reason married women in America didn’t work all that much until the 1960s was because investing more effort in scrubbing the house clean had a payoff in reduced family mortality. But the introduction of antibiotics made housework less of a life and death matter. Combined with huge improvements in appliances and consumer packaged goods, more mothers had time for a job once their kids were in school.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @Steve Sailer

    No way. People's theory of microbiotic causation of disease and its prevention wasn't that developed/widespread. Anyway, America wasn't like Japan, where they literally scrubbed the floors daily.

    Replies: @TWS

  18. @Lot

    Something that’s hard for 21st Century people to recognize is how concerned people in the past were with pervasive illness. For one reason, they were sick more than we are.
     
    Lots of biographies of notable men before 1940 note they were sick for long portions of their youth, usually with no specificity.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    Yup.

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I’m not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    In general, we are pretty clueless about what kind of illness celebrities in the past suffered from (e.g., speculating about Van Gogh’s mental and physical health is a cottage industry). For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Steve Sailer


    For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related
     
    .

    Syphillis is no protection against the stroke, though - and vice versa.

    Replies: @Autochthon

    , @John Derbyshire
    @Steve Sailer

    Lewis Thomas' book The Youngest Science is a good read in this area. Aside from elementary repairs like tooth-pulling, suturing, and bone-setting and a very small number of effective drugs (quinine, digitalis … that was about it) and narcotics, medicine was basically useless until the 1930s.

    Replies: @Pat Boyle

    , @stillCARealist
    @Steve Sailer

    Post partum depression lasts years? Most new mothers who get it, including myself, only have it for weeks or a few months. The longest I've seen was one year and she was actively fighting it by working hard at a productive life.

    I think it more likely that the old-time new mothers contracted infections that never went away. I asked the pediatrician once what would happen if we never took antibiotics for ear infections. He said it would eventually clear up but that it would takes months. Dang, by that time a kid could get another infection going in the other ear.

    , @David Davenport
    @Steve Sailer

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I’m not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    Old label: neurasthenia. Currently called: fibromyalgia.

    Fibromyalgia
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Fibromyalgia

    Symptoms Widespread pain, feeling tired, sleep problems[2][3]
    Usual onset Middle age[4]
    Duration Long term[2]
    Causes Unknown[3][4]
    Diagnostic method Based on symptoms after ruling out other potential causes[3][4]
    Similar conditions Polymyalgia rheumatica, rheumatoid arthritis, osteoarthritis, thyroid disease[5]

    ( Huh? OA and RA are definitely non-psychological maladies. -DD )
    Treatment Sufficient sleep and exercise, healthy diet[4]
    Medication Duloxetine, milnacipran, pregabalin[4]
    Prognosis Normal life expectancy[4]
    Frequency 2–8%[3]

    Fibromyalgia (FM) is a medical condition characterised by chronic widespread pain and a heightened pain response to pressure.[2] Other symptoms include tiredness to a degree that normal activities are affected, sleep problems, and troubles with memory.[3] Some people also report restless legs syndrome, bowel or bladder problems, numbness and tingling, and sensitivity to noise, lights or temperature.[4] Fibromyalgia is frequently associated with depression, anxiety, and posttraumatic stress disorder. Other types of chronic pain are also frequently present.[3]

    The cause of fibromyalgia is unknown; however, it is believed to involve a combination of genetic and environmental factors with half the risk attributed to each.[3][4] The condition runs in families and many genes are believed to be involved.[6] Environmental factors may include psychological stress, trauma, and certain infections.[3] The pain appears to result from processes in the central nervous system and the condition is referred to as a "central sensitization syndrome".[2][3] Fibromyalgia is recognized as a disorder by the US National Institutes of Health and the American College of Rheumatology.[4][7] There is no specific diagnostic test.[4] Diagnosis involves first ruling out other potential causes and verifying that a set number of symptoms are present.[3][4]

    The treatment of fibromyalgia can be difficult. Recommendations often include getting enough sleep, exercising regularly, and eating a healthy diet.[4] Cognitive behavioral therapy may also be helpful.[3] The medications duloxetine, milnacipran, or pregabalin may be used.[4] Use of opioid pain medication is controversial with some stating their use is poorly supported by evidence[4][8] and others saying that weak opioids may be reasonable if other medications are not effective.[9] Dietary supplements also lack evidence to support their use. While fibromyalgia can last a long time, it does not result in death or tissue damage.[4]

    Fibromyalgia is estimated to affect 2–8% of the population. Females are affected about twice as often as males. Rates appear similar in different areas of the world and among different cultures. Fibromyalgia was first defined in 1990 with updated criteria in 2011.[3] There is controversy about the classification, diagnosis, and treatment of fibromyalgia.[10][11] While some feel the diagnosis of fibromyalgia may negatively affect a person, other research finds it to be beneficial.[3] The term "fibromyalgia" is from New Latin, fibro-, meaning "fibrous tissues", Greek μυώ myo-, "muscle", and Greek άλγος algos, "pain"; thus the term literally means "muscle and fibrous connective tissue pain".[12]

    Replies: @Old Palo Altan

  19. @Thursday
    @syonredux

    No, it doesn't complicate Haidt's theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.

    Left Wing Authoritarians seem to be very good at pushing ordinary left liberals' Compassion button.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_fBYROA7Hk
    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    Replies: @syonredux, @syonredux, @Abe

    No, it doesn’t complicate Haidt’s theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.

    Thanks. That seems to explain the use of the disgust-sanctity dimension by SJWs.

  20. “a race ending up in a climate for which its powers of adaptation are inadequate”

    White Protestants in the South? Spanish Catholics at least have siesta.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @utu

    Germans in California went crazy during the hippie era: May Day year round.

    Replies: @utu, @Dave Pinsen, @The Man From K Street

    , @Dave Pinsen
    @utu

    Brits in India had hill stations; the Portuguese royals in Brazil had something similar with their summer residence in Petropolis.

  21. @Steve Sailer
    @Sam Haysom

    Nietzsche wrote a lot more books than I have. He didn't write after age 44, but I recognize the names of 8 or 10 of his books.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom

    Certainly very proflic if prone to recycling ideas. I’d say you’ve written more words than he has- but I wasn’t really speaking to his output. I was speaking to the previous commenters point about how Nietzsche let his bitterness and wish fulfillment get the better of him. Compared to a man like TR who went on became the dashing adventurer he wanted.

    • Replies: @Anonymous Nephew
    @Sam Haysom

    So Roosevelt was a lot more Nietzscheian than Nietzsche hmself.

  22. utu says:

    Race-poisoning?

    Friedrich Nietzsche, […] , declared several times in his writings not only to have had Polish ancestors, but also to feel Polish, deep inside his soul and in his most basic instincts.
    http://culture.pl/en/article/was-nietzsche-polish

    I am a Polish nobleman pure sang, in whom there is not the slightest admixture of bad blood, least of all German.

    Self hating German?

    • Replies: @Anon 2
    @utu

    It appears that Nietzsche was not so much a self-hating German
    as a self-hating Prussian. He renounced his Prussian citizenship,
    and remained stateless for much of his life. For most of its history
    Germany was an assemblage of states and principalities, known
    collectively as the Holy Roman Empire that was, as Voltaire famously
    pointed out, neither Holy, nor Roman, nor an Empire. The Empire
    was then brought to an end by Napoleon in 1806. Nevertheless his
    anti-German animus and his claims of Polish ancestry were well known,
    and resulted in very low sales of his books during his lifetime.

    Perhaps some of his psychological problems can be traced to the fact
    that he was effectively raised without a father. His father died when
    he was 5, leaving him surrounded by 5 women - his mother, sister,
    and 3 female relatives. It's been said that his closest relationship
    with a woman was with his younger sister who idolized him, and
    took care of him in his declining years.

    Re: Nietzsche's Polish ancestry. He expressed his conviction that he
    was descended from Polish nobility in 5 different places in his collected
    works. Presumably his sister had the detailed genealogy. There seems to be no
    definite proof one way or the other. However, considering the fact that
    that the region between the Elbe-Saale rivers and the Oder (basically
    coincident with East Germany) was occupied by Western Slavs (specifically
    Polabian Slavs) since the 6th century, and since Charlemagne's death was
    subject to German settlement (Ostsiedlung), it would make sense that
    millions of people in eastern Germany and western Poland would have
    mixed ancestry. Nietzsche wrote, " Germany is a great nation only because
    its people have so much Polish blood in their veins." We forget that until the
    19th century, Poland as the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was indeed
    widely regarded as a great nation, certainly the largest in Europe for 200 years;
    a democracy surrounded by despotic powers hellbent on military expansionism.
    Some people go as far as to claim that Nietzsche's concept of the Übermensch
    was based on his analysis of the Polish nobility (top 10%) in the 16th century
    when Poland after 700 years of existence reached the apex of its power

  23. @utu
    "a race ending up in a climate for which its powers of adaptation are inadequate"

    White Protestants in the South? Spanish Catholics at least have siesta.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Dave Pinsen

    Germans in California went crazy during the hippie era: May Day year round.

    • Replies: @utu
    @Steve Sailer

    California has no humidity.

    Replies: @Anon

    , @Dave Pinsen
    @Steve Sailer

    I've wondered about the broader psychological effect of sunny California weather. A few times per year, mostly in May or September, the NYC area gets California-like weather and locals take to Twitter about how nice it is. It's something to appreciate, something to look forward to, and you could always move to California and enjoy it most of the time. But if you're already in California, you have no California to go to.

    Replies: @Old Palo Altan, @Anon 2

    , @The Man From K Street
    @Steve Sailer

    Tom Wolfe had some great line somewhere about about Herbert Marcuse arriving on California campuses both before and after the war and finally seeing the kind of young men and women that he had heretofore only seen on strike posters in Europe*...only to realize with dismay that they were mostly interested in beach volleyball and marijuana, not Marxism.

    *Orwell, among others noted the gap between the art of the 1930s posters and the reality of actual workers, and realized it was all crap. Real proletarians were chain-smoking, smelly, unhealthy, pasty-skinned wretches.

  24. My grandfather died of TB at age 23. His grandfather survived a convict ship voyage where half the prisoners died – he lived into his 70’s. It’s luck, or something.

    • Replies: @donut
    @Paul Walker - Most beautiful man ever...

    Mostly it's genes I think . Luck can really only protect one from lightening strikes and one's own stupidity . Of course I can only speak from my own personal experience .

  25. @advancedatheist
    The English Cavaliers and other Brits and their descendants who settled in Virginia and other Southern colonies suffered from ill health well into modern times, thanks to ignorance about the role of mosquitoes and fecal contamination in spreading parasites and diseases. Given the high mortality rate and the laws which allowed women to inherit land and other assets, upper class planters made a virtue of necessity by marrying widows from similar backgrounds, despite these women's previous sexual experience and whatever children they brought with them into the new households. Both George Washington and Thomas Jefferson picked up their respective wives this way.

    Yet I don't know of anyone who characterizes the old Virginian society these people built as a sick or sad place because of pervasive poor health and short life expectancies. The men, especially, seemed especially vigorous when it came to seeking American independence and then establishing the new nation on a sound foundation.

    Replies: @Autochthon

    The view is taken (as clearly reappears later in the case of the Hobbits who have the Ring for a while) that each Kind has a natural span integral to its biological and spiritual nature. This cannot really be increased qualitatively or quantitatively; so that prolongation in time is like stretching a wire out ever tauter, or spreading butter ever thinner – it becomes an intolerable torment.

    The phrase “qualitatively or quantitatively” is crucial: the concept applies not just to the length of a lifespan, but alos to one’s fate during that lifespan. Attempting to change it, whether by Men seeking immortality, or Elves seeking preservation, is viewed as a Bad Thing in Tolkien’s diegesis.

    Perhaps the advances in medicine, sanitation, and so on approach declining marginal utility today, as we all live to become decrepit liches warehoused in nurseries to burble tapioca and have our nether regions wiped by orderlies, and even our days of vigour are squandered in overpopulated snarls of traffic, stress, and ennui.

    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman’s ideas into a discussion of the great German’s (I am currently steeped in the one’s as Steve is the other’s in my studies and reading); but I cannot help but think on this idea that modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche’s own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
    @Autochthon

    Speaking of Roosevelt, how'd you like to contract polio, lose the use of your legs, and spend the rest of your life in a wheelchair? He was a vigorous, athletic man in his youth.

    All things considered, I'd rather live in a century in which diarrhea is not (necessarily) a death sentence.

    Replies: @Kylie

    , @The Anti-Gnostic
    @Autochthon


    modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche’s own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).
     
    I have been thinking about this for some time. Steve makes the point about beating back infectious disease; another big milestone is cheap calories. Practically speaking, we have abolished Scarcity. The poor can afford the vices of the Biblical rich, and end up with the ailments of the ancient affluent: diabetes, obesity, fatty liver. We generate enough surplus wealth that we can toss it at feral populations so they can smoke weed, buy guns, and shoot each other, all day, every day. Or we toss it to higher g individuals so they can work in elaborate, useless sinecures and organize protests.

    Struggle applies selection pressures for vigorous traits like physical courage, self-discipline, objectivity. Remove struggle, and we get a public sphere dominated by high verbal IQ, virtue-signalling, and sycophancy. It's apparently an endless cycle. Hard times make hard people. Hard people make soft times. Soft times make soft people. Soft people make hard times.

    Glubb Pasha made the same observations in his monograph "The Fate of Empires." Without exception, they last around two-and-one-half centuries and go thru five epochs: The Age of Pioneers, The Age of Conquests, The Age of Commerce, The Age of Affluence, The Age of Intellect, The Age of Decadence.

    Glubb thought the mass influx of foreigners, the welfare state, and the weakening of religion signalled the terminal stage of empire. The modern Whig view is that technological advancement has arrested this cycle, enabling society to scale up globally and individuals to indulge in whatever diversions they can dream up.
    , @Abe
    @Autochthon


    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman’s ideas into a discussion of the great German’s (I am currently steeped in the one’s as Steve is the other’s in my studies and reading)
     
    I had a snarky little remark prepared a while back which I've never found a good opportunity to use about how our elites need to go back to reading the classics to regain some grounding, and given their current level of intellectual sophistication, they'd better start with something they can readily digest like THE LION, THE WITCH, AND THE WARDROBE.

    Seriously. As I recall (a bit shaky now since it's been so long since I last read it to one of my kids) the Christ-like lion sacrifices himself because the evil Witch is able to ensnare him on some point of primordial, ancient law, which- if not followed- would lead to the collapse of the entire world into chaos and nothingness, making questions of good and evil moot at that point. I wish Obama's Three Harpies of the Apocalypse had kept this in mind before overthrowing Gadaffi. Q'had'fe-fe was, sure, not a "good guy" by most standards, but he kept order in his country. And more importantly by snuffing-out a leader who had just made so many concessions for better relations with the West (including scrapping a supposed nuclear weapons program) on the thinest of pretexts (Power's crazy catlady notions of right-to-protect, Hillary's need for a big notch on her strap-on going into 2016) they dealt a YUGE bodyblow to the international order, showing that America's word is fickle, and that the only real security is in bigger, more dangerous weapons.

  26. @utu
    "a race ending up in a climate for which its powers of adaptation are inadequate"

    White Protestants in the South? Spanish Catholics at least have siesta.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Dave Pinsen

    Brits in India had hill stations; the Portuguese royals in Brazil had something similar with their summer residence in Petropolis.

  27. @Thursday
    @syonredux

    No, it doesn't complicate Haidt's theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.

    Left Wing Authoritarians seem to be very good at pushing ordinary left liberals' Compassion button.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_fBYROA7Hk
    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    Replies: @syonredux, @syonredux, @Abe

    Immigrant Screening (.58) (PC-Egalitarians feel we shouldn’t be allowed to screen for any of those)
    Countries should be allowed to screen immigrants and/or refugees for:
    Race.
    Education and skills.
    Marital status and children.
    Religion.
    Gender.

    Wealth.

    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    As I feel that we should be able to screen for all of those things, I’m clearly not very egalitarian….

  28. @Steve Sailer
    @utu

    Germans in California went crazy during the hippie era: May Day year round.

    Replies: @utu, @Dave Pinsen, @The Man From K Street

    California has no humidity.

    • Replies: @Anon
    @utu

    I was working on a software project in San Francisco. One of the developers had just relocated from Arizona and could not stop complaining about the humidity in SF. To him it was Houston.

  29. @Steve Sailer
    @utu

    Germans in California went crazy during the hippie era: May Day year round.

    Replies: @utu, @Dave Pinsen, @The Man From K Street

    I’ve wondered about the broader psychological effect of sunny California weather. A few times per year, mostly in May or September, the NYC area gets California-like weather and locals take to Twitter about how nice it is. It’s something to appreciate, something to look forward to, and you could always move to California and enjoy it most of the time. But if you’re already in California, you have no California to go to.

    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
    @Dave Pinsen

    We woke up to snow on the ground exactly once in my time in PA.
    Sensational excitement, and not just for the kids,
    But the great thing is that the humidity of a New York summer is unknown there.

    Replies: @Marty

    , @Anon 2
    @Dave Pinsen

    Similarly, in Boston you get nearly perfect weather
    from mid-August to mid-October but otherwise winters
    are miserable (sometimes you don't get to see the sun
    the entire month of February), and summers are oppressively
    hot and humid. As in NYC, May is generally nice.

    Speaking of People's Republic of Santa Monica, the city is
    now regarded as one of the most desirable locations in
    Southern California (until Silicon Beach gets done with it)
    but an older friend of mine who lived only 10-15 blocks
    from the Ocean in SM, was always complaining about humidity
    and felt she'd improve her health if she moved farther inland.
    If so, how can people in Malibu stand living practically on the
    beach? Doesn't the humidity aggravate any pre-existing arthritic
    conditions? (I'm obviously not an MD). At least the wealthy in
    San Francisco have the good sense to live at higher elevations
    than the hoi polloi (if any hoi polloi are left in SF at this point)

  30. Eden Ahbez was one of the original Nature Boys, he even wrote the song.

    Father Yod and The Source Family had an extremely successful health food restaurant on the Sunset Strip during the Age of Aquarius, and a semi-successful New Age Sex Cult in the Hollywood Hills.

    As California cults go, I’m kind of partial to Olde Father Yod.

    http://globalwahrman.blogspot.com/2013/03/father-yod-at-source-restaurant.html

  31. ‘Germans fear poison by mixed-blood’.

    – Certainly not – if the events of late 2015 are anything to go by.

  32. anon • Disclaimer says:

    You can see it in books like Thomas Mann’s The Magic Mountain where the main character checks himself into a tuberculosis sanatorium for years without much evidence that he actually has TB, but you know, you can never tell.

    It’s hard to believe that was ever a popular book. It’s a project.

    It took a long time for the germ theory of disease to totally catch on in America. Lewis’s Arrowsmith (1925) was roughly the period when it became ‘common knowledge’. Meanwhile, the Rockefeller Institute and the largest Life Insurance companies were behind the implementation of a lot of public health practices.

    The Flexner Report (1910) marked the period that medical education became regulated, with basic sciences required. http://archive.carnegiefoundation.org/pdfs/elibrary/Carnegie_Flexner_Report.pdf

    Flexner is pretty open about his objective to reduce the number of practicing doctors to increase income levels — which he felt was necessary to justify the required education. A classic example of rent seeking, &c. However, when I read the book, it was hard to really emotionally oppose the ‘reform’.

    • Replies: @Olorin
    @anon

    Even more interesting is that "the germ theory of disease" was, at bottom, an explosively transformative new level of understanding of microbial biology, microbial/zoonotic ecology, population biology, and population genetics.

    Or anyway, it was the first toe in the door. To understand that there are more things in the cracks of our floorboards than were at the time dreamt of in our philosophies.

    The reason I find this all fascinating is that we're at a similar juncture--with the explosive new levels of understanding whooshing out of the instrumentation and data processing revolutions of the past 40 years--with genetics, particle physics, and planet-scale systems analysis.

    Interesting to note that Abe Flexner was the first native born generation--German Jewish parents who settled in KY. I seem to recall he kept entering degree programs but not finishing them, instead floating from place to place and thing to thing. Bright, but rather a drifting malcontent.

    His views as magnified by The Flexner Report were published by the then-new Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching, which rose around the same time to try to professionalize education/schooling. Yielding the Ed Biz.

    No surprise that two of the biggest problems we're facing at present are the massive concentrations of power there and in Big Pharma, which is trying to monetarize our very mortality for speculative gain.

    There is quite an economic incentive in all that to have a stupider and sicker population base to keep the engine of intervention/hand holding going. This is precisely what the kerfuffle at The Evergreen State College is about. The college going that direction, Bret Weinstein having had the temerity to both name and question it.

    , @HA
    @anon

    "It took a long time for the germ theory of disease to totally catch on in America. Lewis’s Arrowsmith (1925) was roughly the period when it became ‘common knowledge’."

    I would push the date back 10 years, when Rockefeller funded studies showing that hookworms/roundworms/whipworms (and poor latrine management) were a key factor in making Southerners "slow".


    ... in [1909-1915] millionaire John D. Rockefeller set out to profit from southern industry, but was stymied by the lack of productivity from an unenergetic workforce. Rockefeller funded studies that discovered the cause: a microscopic hookworm which could travel up to 4 feet in soil from a site of defecation. The “germ of laziness,” as they called it, infected a new host through their bare feet and migrated to the intestine, resulting in anemia, malnutrition and poor worker performance.
     
    The study came out just in time for the Nazis and Communists to incorporate it into their woldviews, and the notion that parasitic entities (be they Jews in general, as Nazis would have it, or Jewish capitalists and kulaks, as Communists saw it) are literally sucking the blood and the vitality out from their victims became a common theme in both ideologies.
  33. @Steve Sailer
    @Lot

    Yup.

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I'm not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    In general, we are pretty clueless about what kind of illness celebrities in the past suffered from (e.g., speculating about Van Gogh's mental and physical health is a cottage industry). For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @John Derbyshire, @stillCARealist, @David Davenport

    For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related

    .

    Syphillis is no protection against the stroke, though – and vice versa.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
    @Dieter Kief

    Indeed, it is the stroke which causes syphilis, no?

    Forgive me; I couldn't resist. I really should take such childish nonsense over to TakiMag where the degenerate commenters live....

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

  34. @Sid
    Three ideas:

    1. A lot of Nietzsche's philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer. Instead, he was sickly his entire life, and he was meek, shy, obsequious, and utterly resentful of how strong-willed men like Richard Wagner strode all over him.

    Old ladies loved keeping Nieztsche as company, because he was so sweet and polite. Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he's known his life.

    2. The late 19th century was an especially bad time for public health. The Industrial Revolution was terrible for air quality and environmental protection as we know it didn't exist. Meanwhile, modern medicine was only gradually coming about, so all the old diseases of the past were rampant in big, crowded cities.

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That's when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    3. A lot of Nieztsche's ideas sound crankish, but he, like his model Schopenhauer, were grappling with problems from a naturalistic worldview in its infancy. The modern methods we have for devising and testing ideas weren't around, so they came up with numerous ideas without having the means to test them without just bloviating about them.

    As an addendum, Nietzsche's writings about prehistory sound juvenile, but he was extremely well educated in the Classics, being offered a professorship at age 25, which was even more impressive then than it is today, because Classics was where some of the brightest minds in Germany were fighting tooth and nail to get into.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom, @Erik Sieven, @The Man From K Street, @Rapparee, @John Derbyshire

    “Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he’s known his life.”
    this type of guy still exists today, writing angry posts at sluthate etc.

  35. Nietzsche fucked up. He spent half of his life thinking that Christianity was a slave religion which repressed the blonde beast within, but in trying to become the ubermensch, he had repressed his own humanity. That’s why he collapsed when seeing a horse being whipped. His lofty brittle arrogance created a fragile shell around an empty centre.

  36. It reminds me of a (locally) famed radio series from 1938, translated as Filth-Sweden. The reporter travelled through Sweden considering the many unmodernized parts which were cramped, filthy and lacked electricity or running water. Part of the health problem was of course the lack of modern toilets, which were preceded by shared outhouses of questionable hygiene. We should also remember that cities were population sinks until recently, basically because of all the diseased filth that accumulated.

    The series might have unofficially been part of a government drive to get people to upgrade their housing and lives, mostly successful even if some complained about how they were depicted. This was in the middle of Sweden’s 100-year economic boom, which ended only in the 1970s, so it was probably a good time to do it.

  37. It’s nice to see Steve still does read all the comments, even when it gets a few hundred comments long.

    Particulate pollution, as from coal or wood burning for heat, is definitely a cause for poor health. It’s very similar in effect to cigarette smoking which we definitely know is bad. Asthma, emphysema, the protracted cold and flu we get when there is a lot of mucus produced and this mucus gets infected. In cities it’s going to be even worse because of population density. I wonder how many deaths from asthma there actually were.

    It seemed the Hitler was rather provincial, and this certainly contributed to his downfall. He made the mistake of thinking that just because a country like Belarus was small in population (9M in 1939) and could not fight being absorbed into the Soviet Union, that they liked that state of affairs and would not resist it. I wonder how much of that was due to Nietzsche’s influence and thinking of them as slaves.

  38. Monty Python. Meaning Of Life/Death/Nietzsche.

  39. The death rate in colonial New England must have been less than we imagine, judging by my extensive genealogical records. There were many large families where nine or ten children survived until adulthood. Low population density?

  40. @Autochthon
    @advancedatheist


    The view is taken (as clearly reappears later in the case of the Hobbits who have the Ring for a while) that each Kind has a natural span integral to its biological and spiritual nature. This cannot really be increased qualitatively or quantitatively; so that prolongation in time is like stretching a wire out ever tauter, or spreading butter ever thinner – it becomes an intolerable torment.
     
    The phrase "qualitatively or quantitatively" is crucial: the concept applies not just to the length of a lifespan, but alos to one's fate during that lifespan. Attempting to change it, whether by Men seeking immortality, or Elves seeking preservation, is viewed as a Bad Thing in Tolkien's diegesis.

    Perhaps the advances in medicine, sanitation, and so on approach declining marginal utility today, as we all live to become decrepit liches warehoused in nurseries to burble tapioca and have our nether regions wiped by orderlies, and even our days of vigour are squandered in overpopulated snarls of traffic, stress, and ennui.

    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman's ideas into a discussion of the great German's (I am currently steeped in the one's as Steve is the other's in my studies and reading); but I cannot help but think on this idea that modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche's own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).

    Replies: @Stan Adams, @The Anti-Gnostic, @Abe

    Speaking of Roosevelt, how’d you like to contract polio, lose the use of your legs, and spend the rest of your life in a wheelchair? He was a vigorous, athletic man in his youth.

    All things considered, I’d rather live in a century in which diarrhea is not (necessarily) a death sentence.

    • Replies: @Kylie
    @Stan Adams

    Tanaquil Le Clercq suffered a worse fate than Franklin Roosevelt's.

    She was a principal dancer with the New York City Ballet when she contracted polio at age 27 in 1956. She became paralyzed from the waist down and was confined to a wheelchair for the rest of her life. She lost her mobility, her career and eventually her husband (legendary choreographer George Balanchine who divorced her to pursue a ballerina who could still dance). She lived another 44 years.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanaquil_Le_Clercq

  41. @Dieter Kief
    @Steve Sailer


    For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related
     
    .

    Syphillis is no protection against the stroke, though - and vice versa.

    Replies: @Autochthon

    Indeed, it is the stroke which causes syphilis, no?

    Forgive me; I couldn’t resist. I really should take such childish nonsense over to TakiMag where the degenerate commenters live….

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Autochthon

    Being a little light headed every now and then is part of the gay science - and the amor fati.

  42. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden.

    Everybody grew vegetable gardens in the Chicago Area when I was growing up there. The Italians in Oak Park and elsewhere usually grew gigantic gardens and canned or froze much of the produce.
    http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/01/08/168895084/finding-chicago-s-hidden-farms

  43. @Sid
    Three ideas:

    1. A lot of Nietzsche's philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer. Instead, he was sickly his entire life, and he was meek, shy, obsequious, and utterly resentful of how strong-willed men like Richard Wagner strode all over him.

    Old ladies loved keeping Nieztsche as company, because he was so sweet and polite. Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he's known his life.

    2. The late 19th century was an especially bad time for public health. The Industrial Revolution was terrible for air quality and environmental protection as we know it didn't exist. Meanwhile, modern medicine was only gradually coming about, so all the old diseases of the past were rampant in big, crowded cities.

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That's when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    3. A lot of Nieztsche's ideas sound crankish, but he, like his model Schopenhauer, were grappling with problems from a naturalistic worldview in its infancy. The modern methods we have for devising and testing ideas weren't around, so they came up with numerous ideas without having the means to test them without just bloviating about them.

    As an addendum, Nietzsche's writings about prehistory sound juvenile, but he was extremely well educated in the Classics, being offered a professorship at age 25, which was even more impressive then than it is today, because Classics was where some of the brightest minds in Germany were fighting tooth and nail to get into.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom, @Erik Sieven, @The Man From K Street, @Rapparee, @John Derbyshire

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That’s when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    The same thing happened in the US later on. One of the unpleasant, shocking discoveries of the return of conscription in both 1917 and then again in 1940 was just what a huge proportion of draft-age men from rural districts were simply physically unfit for military service. 4-H? 4-F! Bones that had broken in childhood and never properly set. Hookworms. Eyes that were chronically infected. On and on. Heading into the Cold War this dent in the available manpower pool was seen as a continuing security threat, so the Hill-Burton Act of 1946 provided federal funds for rural hospital construction and accreditation. Of course, what the writers of the law couldn’t anticipate in 1946 was that the rural areas of the time were soon to become the far-more densely-populated suburbs of the postwar boom, so Hill-Burton was to have a far bigger effect on the nationwide system of health care and financing then was known at the time.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @The Man From K Street

    Actually, the tale of a huge percentage of Edwardian Britons being 'unfit' for military service due to the supposedly poor living conditions of the British working class - actually the best fed and most prosperous proletariat in the world at that time - is a persistent canard brought about by a misunderstanding.

    The truth was that a huge proportion of potential recruits to the British army were rejected solely due to bad and rotten teeth. Army regulations at that time required good, strong natural teeth, due to the demand that soldiers had to sustain themselves on 'hard tack' a granite hard double baked biscuit bread during times of scarcity. In a battle between rotten teeth and hard tack, teeth would always leave.
    At that time - some would say even today - the British nation had terrible teeth. Dental hygiene was hardly practised, and Victorian/Edwardian Britons had a prodigious appetite for sugar, whether as candy, cakes, soda or sugared tea.
    Apparently false teeth, weren't allowed by the army in those days, but I have a strong suspicion that the rule was changed in 1914 to 18.

    As recently as the 1950s it was reckoned that around 40% of the adult British population was wholly toothless. Which lead to a classic newspaper headline concerning 'Edentine Edenites' sitting in the front row of the Conservative Party conference.
    Anthony Eden was a 1950s Tory Prime Minister.

  44. @Sid
    Three ideas:

    1. A lot of Nietzsche's philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer. Instead, he was sickly his entire life, and he was meek, shy, obsequious, and utterly resentful of how strong-willed men like Richard Wagner strode all over him.

    Old ladies loved keeping Nieztsche as company, because he was so sweet and polite. Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he's known his life.

    2. The late 19th century was an especially bad time for public health. The Industrial Revolution was terrible for air quality and environmental protection as we know it didn't exist. Meanwhile, modern medicine was only gradually coming about, so all the old diseases of the past were rampant in big, crowded cities.

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That's when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    3. A lot of Nieztsche's ideas sound crankish, but he, like his model Schopenhauer, were grappling with problems from a naturalistic worldview in its infancy. The modern methods we have for devising and testing ideas weren't around, so they came up with numerous ideas without having the means to test them without just bloviating about them.

    As an addendum, Nietzsche's writings about prehistory sound juvenile, but he was extremely well educated in the Classics, being offered a professorship at age 25, which was even more impressive then than it is today, because Classics was where some of the brightest minds in Germany were fighting tooth and nail to get into.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom, @Erik Sieven, @The Man From K Street, @Rapparee, @John Derbyshire

    A lot of Nietzsche’s philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer.

    On Nietzsche, I always recall G.K. Chesterton’s comparison with Joan of Arc:

    “Joan of Arc was not stuck at the cross-roads, either by rejecting all the paths like Tolstoy, or by accepting them all like Nietzsche. She chose a path, and went down it like a thunderbolt. Yet Joan, when I came to think of her, had in her all that was true either in Tolstoy or Nietzsche, all that was even tolerable in either of them. I thought of all that is noble in Tolstoy, the pleasure in plain things, especially in plain pity, the actualities of the earth, the reverence for the poor, the dignity of the bowed back. Joan of Arc had all that and with this great addition, that she endured poverty as well as admiring it; whereas Tolstoy is only a typical aristocrat trying to find out its secret. And then I thought of all that was brave and proud and pathetic in poor Nietzsche, and his mutiny against the emptiness and timidity of our time. I thought of his cry for the ecstatic equilibrium of danger, his hunger for the rush of great horses, his cry to arms. Well, Joan of Arc had all that, and again with this difference, that she did not praise fighting, but fought. We know that she was not afraid of an army, while Nietzsche, for all we know, was afraid of a cow. Tolstoy only praised the peasant; she was the peasant. Nietzsche only praised the warrior; she was the warrior. She beat them both at their own antagonistic ideals; she was more gentle than the one, more violent than the other. Yet she was a perfectly practical person who did something, while they are wild speculators who do nothing.”

  45. @Autochthon
    @advancedatheist


    The view is taken (as clearly reappears later in the case of the Hobbits who have the Ring for a while) that each Kind has a natural span integral to its biological and spiritual nature. This cannot really be increased qualitatively or quantitatively; so that prolongation in time is like stretching a wire out ever tauter, or spreading butter ever thinner – it becomes an intolerable torment.
     
    The phrase "qualitatively or quantitatively" is crucial: the concept applies not just to the length of a lifespan, but alos to one's fate during that lifespan. Attempting to change it, whether by Men seeking immortality, or Elves seeking preservation, is viewed as a Bad Thing in Tolkien's diegesis.

    Perhaps the advances in medicine, sanitation, and so on approach declining marginal utility today, as we all live to become decrepit liches warehoused in nurseries to burble tapioca and have our nether regions wiped by orderlies, and even our days of vigour are squandered in overpopulated snarls of traffic, stress, and ennui.

    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman's ideas into a discussion of the great German's (I am currently steeped in the one's as Steve is the other's in my studies and reading); but I cannot help but think on this idea that modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche's own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).

    Replies: @Stan Adams, @The Anti-Gnostic, @Abe

    modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche’s own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).

    I have been thinking about this for some time. Steve makes the point about beating back infectious disease; another big milestone is cheap calories. Practically speaking, we have abolished Scarcity. The poor can afford the vices of the Biblical rich, and end up with the ailments of the ancient affluent: diabetes, obesity, fatty liver. We generate enough surplus wealth that we can toss it at feral populations so they can smoke weed, buy guns, and shoot each other, all day, every day. Or we toss it to higher g individuals so they can work in elaborate, useless sinecures and organize protests.

    Struggle applies selection pressures for vigorous traits like physical courage, self-discipline, objectivity. Remove struggle, and we get a public sphere dominated by high verbal IQ, virtue-signalling, and sycophancy. It’s apparently an endless cycle. Hard times make hard people. Hard people make soft times. Soft times make soft people. Soft people make hard times.

    Glubb Pasha made the same observations in his monograph “The Fate of Empires.” Without exception, they last around two-and-one-half centuries and go thru five epochs: The Age of Pioneers, The Age of Conquests, The Age of Commerce, The Age of Affluence, The Age of Intellect, The Age of Decadence.

    Glubb thought the mass influx of foreigners, the welfare state, and the weakening of religion signalled the terminal stage of empire. The modern Whig view is that technological advancement has arrested this cycle, enabling society to scale up globally and individuals to indulge in whatever diversions they can dream up.

  46. @Steve Sailer
    @utu

    Germans in California went crazy during the hippie era: May Day year round.

    Replies: @utu, @Dave Pinsen, @The Man From K Street

    Tom Wolfe had some great line somewhere about about Herbert Marcuse arriving on California campuses both before and after the war and finally seeing the kind of young men and women that he had heretofore only seen on strike posters in Europe*…only to realize with dismay that they were mostly interested in beach volleyball and marijuana, not Marxism.

    *Orwell, among others noted the gap between the art of the 1930s posters and the reality of actual workers, and realized it was all crap. Real proletarians were chain-smoking, smelly, unhealthy, pasty-skinned wretches.

  47. One hundred years ago the 18 year old Hart Crane had this to say against the fickle French response to Nietzsche: “one may envy Nietzsche a little; think of being so elusive,–so mercurial, as to be first swallowed whole, then coughed up, and still remain a mystery!” First they loved N. (who had effusively praised their culture), then they blamed his influence for the German aggression that led to World War I. But N. expressly condemned Prussian militarism as a brainless form of collectivism, the enactment of Hegelian delusions.

    But, why is N. so thoroughly misunderstood? Probably there are several reasons. His response to epistemological skepticism was mainly literary, since he considered the philosophical systems erected by Kant and Hegel to be failures, and failures by necessity. He mistrusted philosophical systematizing, thought it a dishonest approach that forced everything into the system by whatever trick of language or bad logic. But a philosopher who does not organize his thought into a system will risk self-contradiction. N. deems this preferable to the lack of intellectual integrity displayed by the systematizers. Freezing thought into a permanent certainty he associates with death: “Shedding One’s Skin: The snake that cannot shed its skin perishes. So do the spirits who are prevented from changing their opinions; they cease to be spirit.” How many times did N. shed his skin? A consistent pursuit of self-development leads to inconsistent statements in the course of life. The American analog is Whitman’s boast: “Do I contradict myself?/Very well then I contradict myself/I am large, I contain multitudes.”

    The literary response N. formulated to overlay the barren wastes of philosophical skepticism is aestheticism, a frank acknowledgement that our interpretation of the world is individual and arbitrary, including our interpretation of moral values. This also means that logic is not the sole arbiter of philosophical disputes: the various arts and suasions of rhetoric, of poetry, of personal authority also come into play. He finds more affirmation of life in art than in philosophy, since art is multi-perspectival in its nature whereas most philosophy seeks to impose a single (arbitrary) truth. N. wants art to be humanity’s “metaphysical activity”–not traditional metaphysics.

  48. @Thursday
    You should watch Jordan Peterson's lectures on the science of personality. His lectures on conscientiousness are particularly relevant for this post. Apparently, authoritarianism in individuals and in government correlates with disease prevalence at around 0.7. Famine also has some effect. But not other deadly things, like war. So, the triumph of liberalism (and likely secularism as well) seems to be largely caused by a reduction in disease prevalence.

    The way I interpret Peterson is that in low disease prevalence people tend to end up lower in personality subtrait Orderliness. Orderliness is one of two subfactors of Big 5 Conscientiousness. It is associated with religiousness, authoritarianism, judgmentalism, cleanliness and being organized. It is also associated with conservative politics, though less so than low Openness.

    Of note: both conservative politics and religion are often based around bodily metaphors.

    I believe this is the work Peterson is referring to:
    http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0062275

    -----

    2014
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH9-xsuPiUk

    2015
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt90JwDHh-Y
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35e5i6FQuMw

    2016
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q15eTySnWxc

    2017
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBWyBdUYPgk&t

    -----

    He's a very entertaining lecturer.

    Replies: @Jason K., @Steve Sailer, @Ian M.

    Of note: both conservative politics and religion are often based around bodily metaphors.

    This was one of the major themes of the late Mary Douglas, a member of that species often thought to be mythical: the conservative anthropologist.

  49. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:

    “The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.”

    The genesis of which may have been the so-called “Wandervoegel” Movement–Teutonic hippies really–which emerged in pre-WWI Germany (based in part upon Rousseau’s obsession with nature and the “Noble Savage” etc).

    (Sorry, but it should read “Wandervogel” with an umlaut over the”o”. Can’t do umlauts though. Damn!)

    • Replies: @Venator
    @Anonymous

    Wandervogel is fine, it's singular.

    @ all

    Lots of interesting thoughts in that thread. My take on the topic of purity is that liberals, recognizing the power of the word, strive for purity of thought: It doesn't matter who you are if you don't think toxic thoughts and speak toxic words. Hence, Puritans.

    Conservatives want purity of behaviour: It doesn't matter what you think if you keep your private life private. Words will never hurt me, your queer gender-bending will.


    Germans, a people of country- and small-city-dwellers, famously feared being poisoned by the metropolis. So, out of the bad air of the city (full of socialists, Jews, and degenerates), into the magic air of the woods! Of course, the German's old Ostsiedlung-genes can't completely abide the wilderness. Therefore, after having completely exhausted himself hiking, he stops by a rustic Landgasthaus to restore himself with the nourishment of a settled people: beer and pork.


    (Caution: Lots of happy fashy girls!)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSnQXNu1H_o

    , @jim jones
    @Anonymous

    Hold down the ALT key and type 0246

  50. @Paul Walker - Most beautiful man ever...
    My grandfather died of TB at age 23. His grandfather survived a convict ship voyage where half the prisoners died - he lived into his 70's. It's luck, or something.

    Replies: @donut

    Mostly it’s genes I think . Luck can really only protect one from lightening strikes and one’s own stupidity . Of course I can only speak from my own personal experience .

  51. Anonymous [AKA "Phaedrus"] says:

    Steve, regarding Nietzsche I have a few observations.

    First, I must admit it has been several decades since I have read the Genealogy of Morals. When I read it I also read the Birth of Tragedy, and both works are often sold in one volume. If you do not have the Birth of Tragedy I would recommend you read it next, as the ideas therein fit well with Morals. To bring this back to your post, I think both works together show that what Nietzsche was really getting at was not health in the sense that we 21st century Americans define that term – but strength, both in a physical and moral (or psychological, if you prefer) sense. This theme carries through into his other works, especially Zarathustra.

    The perfect example of this comes (IIRC) from the Birth of Tragedy (but maybe its in Morals): Nietzsche weaves a tale of his ideal aristocratic warriors as being like giant eagles who like to feast on tasty lambs who live on the mountainside. The lambs moan and complain as they eagles hunt them that the eagles are evil because they are not weak like the lambs and feast on them. The eagles reply that this is what eagles do, and they see it as the greatest good to feast on weak lambs because they are so delicious.

    The attitude to strength, in other words, is what separates the slave from master morality. The slaves are weak either because they are physically incapable of being strong, or because they are passive, inactive, indecisive. The masters never think twice, never consider restraint, they just do what they do. If you think about it, Nietzsche could really be read here as the first red pill philosopher describing gammas and alphas.

    A couple more quick comments. Nietzsche’s family was steeped in Lutheranism. His father and both grandfathers were Lutheran ministers, and he was very pious as a youth. He lost his faith, of course, and thus his hatred of Christianity becomes understandable. His upbringing also heavily influenced his thinking and writing, and he advocated his ideas as zealously as any preacher. As an aside, my father, who served in WWII, had a friend who was a Pole who became drafted into the German army and later came to America after the war. This friend told the story that the most fervent Nazis were previously the most committed communists. This is also true of Nietzsche.

    This brings us to the nazi question. I have no doubt that, had he lived to see it, Nietzsche would have despised the nazis and everything they stood for. At his heart Nietzsche was an elitist. This would seem to fit the nazi mold, but recall that the nazis went a long way to mold and rally public support. Nietzsche would have loathed that, seen it as groveling to the ignorant masses.

    Enjoy the blog. Write more about philosophy.

  52. the blond beast at the centre of every noble race

    Come on Steve, that was a Haven Monahan softball there.

  53. My impression is that one connection between Nietzsche and Hitler was a common German fear of being poisoned, whether by miasmas, bad food, or mixed blood. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden. The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.

    This has transferred to today into the fear of CO2 poisoning. They outrageously call CO2 a pollutant, same as nitrogen oxides, ozone and what comes out of smokestacks in Chinese factories. CO2 killing, illing them and the planet via global warming. Same German “electrifying” drive for purity which has a positive pole and negative pole.
    The continental Europeans are behind all these global warming schemes and agreements, intended to morph into hard guidelines in Hillary and Merkel governed administrative states. To become de facto one-world-government type treaties. And who is the driver of the EU? Germany is, in league with its surrounding Germanic nations such as Holland, Austria and Belgium. Notice how many EU honchos have German names. Example Jean Claude Juncker, who going by his full name is half German and half French. (not looking at wikipedia)

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Clyde

    Juncker is from Luxembourg, a tiny country wedged between France and Germany where most people speak both German and French, not to mention Luxembourgish.

    But usually when you see someone with a German last name and a French 1st name, that person is from Alsace, another border region that has gone back and forth between Germany and France.

    , @psmith
    @Clyde

    https://newscenter.lbl.gov/2012/10/17/elevated-indoor-carbon-dioxide-impairs-decision-making-performance/

  54. @Steve Sailer
    @Thursday

    John Derbyshire wrote a piece about his mother the nurse.

    One reason married women in America didn't work all that much until the 1960s was because investing more effort in scrubbing the house clean had a payoff in reduced family mortality. But the introduction of antibiotics made housework less of a life and death matter. Combined with huge improvements in appliances and consumer packaged goods, more mothers had time for a job once their kids were in school.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    No way. People’s theory of microbiotic causation of disease and its prevention wasn’t that developed/widespread. Anyway, America wasn’t like Japan, where they literally scrubbed the floors daily.

    • Replies: @TWS
    @Chrisnonymous

    Don't talk about what you don't know. My grandmother kept the house so clean you could have done surgery on the kitchen floor. My great grandmother was even more careful.

    My great grandmother learned how to take care of things before Semmelweis' crackpot theories were accepted. Americans were big on cleanliness.

  55. Austrian Kurt Gödel had an obsessive fear of being poisoned.

    https://plus.maths.org/content/goumldel-and-limits-logic

    But Gödel was not promoted to professor until 1953 — the same year he was elected to membership in the National Academy of Sciences — in part because his expressed fear that poison gases were escaping from his refrigerator aroused continuing concern about his mental stability.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_G%C3%B6del#Later_life_and_death

    Later in his life, Gödel suffered periods of mental instability and illness. He had an obsessive fear of being poisoned; he would eat only food that his wife, Adele, prepared for him. Late in 1977, she was hospitalized for six months and could no longer prepare her husband’s food. In her absence, he refused to eat, eventually starving to death.[26] He weighed 65 pounds (approximately 30 kg) when he died. His death certificate reported that he died of “malnutrition and inanition caused by personality disturbance” in Princeton Hospital on January 14, 1978.[27] He was buried in Princeton Cemetery. Adele’s death followed in 1981.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @MEH 0910

    In line with Steve's theme, Gödel was said to suffer from frequent episodes of "poor health," which would continue for his entire life.

    I'm guessing that a lot of what was called "poor health" in the past was a euphemism for mental disease or depression at a time when mental illness was stigmatized. It would have been more acceptable to say that you were staying in bed because you were "sick" than to say that you couldn't get out of bed because you were depressed.

    On the other hand, in the days before antibiotics, people really did get sick more and more seriously. People would get infections and die all the time.

  56. I’ve never read Big N, nor ever been tempted to. Have I missed much?

  57. @Sam Haysom
    @Steve Sailer

    Certainly very proflic if prone to recycling ideas. I'd say you've written more words than he has- but I wasn't really speaking to his output. I was speaking to the previous commenters point about how Nietzsche let his bitterness and wish fulfillment get the better of him. Compared to a man like TR who went on became the dashing adventurer he wanted.

    Replies: @Anonymous Nephew

    So Roosevelt was a lot more Nietzscheian than Nietzsche hmself.

  58. The “health food” movement in America goes back surprisingly far.

    In the 19th century, you have Sylvester Graham as early as the 1830s and later the Kellogg brothers of cereal fame. They all believed that an all vegetarian/cereal diet was healthy because it would tamp down sexual urges (especially self-abuse).

    A very influential figure who is now largely forgotten is Bernarr Macfadden, a sort of proto- Jack LaLanne.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernarr_Macfadden

    • Replies: @res
    @Jack D

    Macfadden was an interesting man. I actually have a complete set of the 1942 edition of his Encyclopedia of Health (1933 version at https://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Health-Physical-Culture-Eight/dp/B001BET52I more information at http://www.bernarrmacfadden.com/ency/). It looks like there is some good information in there, but I haven't really delved into it enough to draw good conclusions. Most of that literature (e.g. your Kellogg example) has a mix of both good and bad ideas accompanied by good and bad reasons/explanations which makes it hard to use or evaluate.

  59. @Dave Pinsen
    @Steve Sailer

    I've wondered about the broader psychological effect of sunny California weather. A few times per year, mostly in May or September, the NYC area gets California-like weather and locals take to Twitter about how nice it is. It's something to appreciate, something to look forward to, and you could always move to California and enjoy it most of the time. But if you're already in California, you have no California to go to.

    Replies: @Old Palo Altan, @Anon 2

    We woke up to snow on the ground exactly once in my time in PA.
    Sensational excitement, and not just for the kids,
    But the great thing is that the humidity of a New York summer is unknown there.

    • Replies: @Marty
    @Old Palo Altan

    But what about Pinsen's observation about sunshine and psychology? When you were in PA, didn't the constantly dark sky get you down? I only spent two days there one October and was instantly depressed. And I'm from Daly City.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Old Palo Altan

  60. @Clyde

    My impression is that one connection between Nietzsche and Hitler was a common German fear of being poisoned, whether by miasmas, bad food, or mixed blood. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden. The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.
     
    This has transferred to today into the fear of CO2 poisoning. They outrageously call CO2 a pollutant, same as nitrogen oxides, ozone and what comes out of smokestacks in Chinese factories. CO2 killing, illing them and the planet via global warming. Same German "electrifying" drive for purity which has a positive pole and negative pole.
    The continental Europeans are behind all these global warming schemes and agreements, intended to morph into hard guidelines in Hillary and Merkel governed administrative states. To become de facto one-world-government type treaties. And who is the driver of the EU? Germany is, in league with its surrounding Germanic nations such as Holland, Austria and Belgium. Notice how many EU honchos have German names. Example Jean Claude Juncker, who going by his full name is half German and half French. (not looking at wikipedia)

    Replies: @Jack D, @psmith

    Juncker is from Luxembourg, a tiny country wedged between France and Germany where most people speak both German and French, not to mention Luxembourgish.

    But usually when you see someone with a German last name and a French 1st name, that person is from Alsace, another border region that has gone back and forth between Germany and France.

  61. @Sid
    Three ideas:

    1. A lot of Nietzsche's philosophy is wish-fulfillment. He wished he could have been a healthy, dashing adventurer. Instead, he was sickly his entire life, and he was meek, shy, obsequious, and utterly resentful of how strong-willed men like Richard Wagner strode all over him.

    Old ladies loved keeping Nieztsche as company, because he was so sweet and polite. Meanwhile, he was writing febrile tomes about the destruction of contemporary morality and its replacement with something grander, seething with rage at countless people he's known his life.

    2. The late 19th century was an especially bad time for public health. The Industrial Revolution was terrible for air quality and environmental protection as we know it didn't exist. Meanwhile, modern medicine was only gradually coming about, so all the old diseases of the past were rampant in big, crowded cities.

    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That's when they understood it was time for better public health measures.

    3. A lot of Nieztsche's ideas sound crankish, but he, like his model Schopenhauer, were grappling with problems from a naturalistic worldview in its infancy. The modern methods we have for devising and testing ideas weren't around, so they came up with numerous ideas without having the means to test them without just bloviating about them.

    As an addendum, Nietzsche's writings about prehistory sound juvenile, but he was extremely well educated in the Classics, being offered a professorship at age 25, which was even more impressive then than it is today, because Classics was where some of the brightest minds in Germany were fighting tooth and nail to get into.

    Replies: @Sam Haysom, @Erik Sieven, @The Man From K Street, @Rapparee, @John Derbyshire

    “Most of the world’s work is done by people who are not feeling very well”—Churchill.

  62. @Steve Sailer
    @Lot

    Yup.

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I'm not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    In general, we are pretty clueless about what kind of illness celebrities in the past suffered from (e.g., speculating about Van Gogh's mental and physical health is a cottage industry). For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @John Derbyshire, @stillCARealist, @David Davenport

    Lewis Thomas’ book The Youngest Science is a good read in this area. Aside from elementary repairs like tooth-pulling, suturing, and bone-setting and a very small number of effective drugs (quinine, digitalis … that was about it) and narcotics, medicine was basically useless until the 1930s.

    • Replies: @Pat Boyle
    @John Derbyshire

    There was a 'Masterpiece Theater' (PBS British TV imports) show about twenty of thirty years ago where the plot was a medical mystery. These Edwardian gentlemen were arguing about drugs and medicine. One of the characters asserts that there were no drugs whatsoever that had any beneficial effect. His opponent slips some laudanum into his wine glass and he fails to notice a crime (or some other plot twist).

    Modern people find the notion that there are no effective drugs inconceivable. I take nearly twenty pills everyday of my life as well as a couple injections. But apparently only about a century ago reasonable people could deny that there were any effective medicines.

  63. Dahlia says:

    Steve,
    I, too, have been thinking a lot about genetic fitness and to a lesser extent, illness, lately. I can tell you unequivocally for me, it is because of Twitter lifting the lid off of the Morlock leaders and the Morlocks they lead. Is it for you?

    Here is Taki:
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/journalists-have-lot-answer-for/

    In the past, Taki and other conservatives would catalogue well journalists’ liberal biases and how they manipulate. Twitter exposed what they look like, their dirty habits, and their jealousies.

    I’ve been pretty obsessed lately with these folks on two fronts: a. how did people smart enough to get into the Ivies or near Ivies not understand the polls and ended up so shocked and b. why do they have such seething hatred for conservatives.

    Ted Kaczynski, Jon Haidt, Agnostic (akinokure.blogspot.com) have helped me so much in these regards. But it was twitter that exposed the patterns and reality and helped formulate the questions to ask.

    One more time, here’s Ted:

    10. By “feelings of inferiority” we mean not only inferiority feelings in the strict sense but a whole spectrum of related traits; low self-esteem, feelings of powerlessness, depressive tendencies, defeatism, guilt, self-hatred, etc. We argue that modern leftists tend to have some such feelings (possibly more or less repressed) and that these feelings are decisive in determining the direction of modern leftism.

    13. Many leftists have an intense identification with the problems of groups that have an image of being weak (women), defeated (American Indians), repellent (homosexuals) or otherwise inferior. The leftists themselves feel that these groups are inferior. They would never admit to themselves that they have such feelings, but it is precisely because they do see these groups as inferior that they identify with their problems. (We do not mean to suggest that women, Indians, etc. ARE inferior; we are only making a point about leftist psychology.)

    Further on, Kaczynski explains how their “activism” is poor at the purported purpose, but instead is engaged in to meet the psychological needs of the leftist: to rage at and hurt the person/people they’re jealous of.

    http://www.davesag.com/unabomber/2leftism.html

    Do we have more of these types than in the past and why, or have they always been with us? I wonder if we aren’t living in interesting times where IQ has been strongly selected for over the centuries, and especially in the last century with modern medicine, to the detriment of intuition and health. But have we been plateauing in the last 40 or so years?

    • Replies: @Dahlia
    @Dahlia

    Bravery is another virtue that I see much anxiety about in our politics. Unlike Good Genes, anxiety about this can be seen on the Right as well today.

    I have more trouble understanding this one, maybe because I'm a woman. My sense is that the politics that have been ascendant for a long time, neolib/neocon meritocracy selected for men who are intelligent and believe in a system and Rule of Law where bravery can be outsourced; this is especially good for them because they lack said bravery.

    Donald Trump and the return of populism cuts at the core of their beings. Populism and brave men being successful would be painful and must be sabotaged at every corner; its success would mean they really were "cucks". Right now, Donald Trump is *not* popular (and neither is Corbyn, his Leftist counterpart, in Britain). I see this as a function more of the switching of the collective's mindset at the very beginning of a populist realignment than a judgment on these men personally.

    , @Anon
    @Dahlia

    The US has been since the 1960s or so, a country that promotes meritocracy. We are dedicated to giving scholarships to the underpriviledged, as well as allowing students with high SAT scores but who do not come from established and wealthy WASP families places in college. This means students coming up from the traditional lower classes are able to form connections and gain power. Many of these people are very ambitious and hard driving, and when you get enough of them gathered together, you get some strange social phenomenon.

    It never seems to occur to anybody that if you give opportunities to a lot of people in the lower classes, you end up with a bunch of people at or near the top of society with all the emotional baggage of the lower classes. People are lower class not just because they don't have money, but because they're very disfunctional. They're psychologically messed up and prone to mental illnesses and abberant and self-defeating behaviors. They were often raised by messed-up parents, and they can't get over their disastrous upbringing. Many of them have lousy genes and poisonous personalities. They are often insanely jealous of anyone who had it easier. They don't get over their psychological problems. Promote enough of these people up the social ladder and you get an entire caste of messed-up people who think the same way. They can be totally destructive to the health of a society if there are enough of them and if they are given too much power.

    Think of a peasant village filled with petty resentments; jealousy of everyone else's money, looks, brains, cool, or social connections; stupid and petty quarrels; and gossip that is constantly aimed at bringing others down whom they hate and resent (notice the resemblance to what's being directed at Trump and his administration via the constant harping on the Russian thing?). Now make all these peasants into the aristocratic class that rules over you. You've got liberals in a nutshell.

    It never seems to occur to anyone that scholarships and opportunities should ONLY be given to students not just with good grades, but who pass a test indicating good psychological health and emotional adjustment. There are reasons why people who are emotionally confident and privileged end up running society. They do a better job of it. They don't get bogged down in stupid crap, and they don't try to destroy other people because they're jealous of those people, and they don't have a paranoid mentally that thinks everyone is out to get them, thus causing them to hunt down and squash every speck of opposition, either ideological (notice our SJWers trying to totally control all media and public discourse,) or personal (you say anything out of line they'll try to get you fired).

    People born to privilege are confident instead of insecure, and they tend to think everyone below them likes and admires them. They usually believe in leaving people alone to live their lives as they see fit (which leads to a philosophy of laissez-faire capitalism and libertarianism), and which is the opposite of the paranoid and resentful mentality. Their confidence makes them believe that it's normal to let everyone air their views instead of having them crushed, and this leads to greater consensus and the creation of democratic governments.

    If you raise up hard-driving men from the lower classes who have a lot of emotional baggage , you can get a Joseph Stalin or a Chairman Mao, who spend their lives trying to destroy the upper classes and middle classes, because they see both as their personal oppressors, and who they're exceedingly jealous of and angry at, and they'll destroy anyone else who annoys them for any reason. Liberals, (and men like Stalin and Mao) never recognize their own emotional unfitness to rule. They don't have the insight to understand that their emotional baggage makes them tyrants, not small-d democrats.

    Replies: @Romanian, @snorlax, @The Last Real Calvinist

  64. Dahlia says:
    @Dahlia
    Steve,
    I, too, have been thinking a lot about genetic fitness and to a lesser extent, illness, lately. I can tell you unequivocally for me, it is because of Twitter lifting the lid off of the Morlock leaders and the Morlocks they lead. Is it for you?

    Here is Taki:
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/journalists-have-lot-answer-for/

    In the past, Taki and other conservatives would catalogue well journalists' liberal biases and how they manipulate. Twitter exposed what they look like, their dirty habits, and their jealousies.

    I've been pretty obsessed lately with these folks on two fronts: a. how did people smart enough to get into the Ivies or near Ivies not understand the polls and ended up so shocked and b. why do they have such seething hatred for conservatives.

    Ted Kaczynski, Jon Haidt, Agnostic (akinokure.blogspot.com) have helped me so much in these regards. But it was twitter that exposed the patterns and reality and helped formulate the questions to ask.

    One more time, here's Ted:

    10. By "feelings of inferiority" we mean not only inferiority feelings in the strict sense but a whole spectrum of related traits; low self-esteem, feelings of powerlessness, depressive tendencies, defeatism, guilt, self-hatred, etc. We argue that modern leftists tend to have some such feelings (possibly more or less repressed) and that these feelings are decisive in determining the direction of modern leftism.

     


    13. Many leftists have an intense identification with the problems of groups that have an image of being weak (women), defeated (American Indians), repellent (homosexuals) or otherwise inferior. The leftists themselves feel that these groups are inferior. They would never admit to themselves that they have such feelings, but it is precisely because they do see these groups as inferior that they identify with their problems. (We do not mean to suggest that women, Indians, etc. ARE inferior; we are only making a point about leftist psychology.)

     

    Further on, Kaczynski explains how their "activism" is poor at the purported purpose, but instead is engaged in to meet the psychological needs of the leftist: to rage at and hurt the person/people they're jealous of.

    http://www.davesag.com/unabomber/2leftism.html

    Do we have more of these types than in the past and why, or have they always been with us? I wonder if we aren't living in interesting times where IQ has been strongly selected for over the centuries, and especially in the last century with modern medicine, to the detriment of intuition and health. But have we been plateauing in the last 40 or so years?

    Replies: @Dahlia, @Anon

    Bravery is another virtue that I see much anxiety about in our politics. Unlike Good Genes, anxiety about this can be seen on the Right as well today.

    I have more trouble understanding this one, maybe because I’m a woman. My sense is that the politics that have been ascendant for a long time, neolib/neocon meritocracy selected for men who are intelligent and believe in a system and Rule of Law where bravery can be outsourced; this is especially good for them because they lack said bravery.

    Donald Trump and the return of populism cuts at the core of their beings. Populism and brave men being successful would be painful and must be sabotaged at every corner; its success would mean they really were “cucks”. Right now, Donald Trump is *not* popular (and neither is Corbyn, his Leftist counterpart, in Britain). I see this as a function more of the switching of the collective’s mindset at the very beginning of a populist realignment than a judgment on these men personally.

  65. Blond beasts? Nature Boy? Also sprach Zarathustra?

    RIC FLAIR COMPLETES THE SYSTEM OF GERMAN IDEALISM

  66. Perhaps Nietzsche instinctively knew the eternal truth of baboons, that more power increases dopamine.
    “Submissiveness and dominance have their effects on the same reward circuits of the brain as power and cocaine”
    from here:
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/9228257/Like-baboons-our-elected-leaders-are-literally-addicted-to-power.html

    Nietzsche just wanted to get high.

  67. @Steve Sailer
    @Lot

    Yup.

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I'm not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    In general, we are pretty clueless about what kind of illness celebrities in the past suffered from (e.g., speculating about Van Gogh's mental and physical health is a cottage industry). For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @John Derbyshire, @stillCARealist, @David Davenport

    Post partum depression lasts years? Most new mothers who get it, including myself, only have it for weeks or a few months. The longest I’ve seen was one year and she was actively fighting it by working hard at a productive life.

    I think it more likely that the old-time new mothers contracted infections that never went away. I asked the pediatrician once what would happen if we never took antibiotics for ear infections. He said it would eventually clear up but that it would takes months. Dang, by that time a kid could get another infection going in the other ear.

  68. @Clyde

    My impression is that one connection between Nietzsche and Hitler was a common German fear of being poisoned, whether by miasmas, bad food, or mixed blood. For example, my Germanophone Swiss grandfather moved from Oak Park, IL to Altadena, CA in 1929 because he was a health food nut and in SoCal he could grow a lot of his own food in his garden. The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood.
     
    This has transferred to today into the fear of CO2 poisoning. They outrageously call CO2 a pollutant, same as nitrogen oxides, ozone and what comes out of smokestacks in Chinese factories. CO2 killing, illing them and the planet via global warming. Same German "electrifying" drive for purity which has a positive pole and negative pole.
    The continental Europeans are behind all these global warming schemes and agreements, intended to morph into hard guidelines in Hillary and Merkel governed administrative states. To become de facto one-world-government type treaties. And who is the driver of the EU? Germany is, in league with its surrounding Germanic nations such as Holland, Austria and Belgium. Notice how many EU honchos have German names. Example Jean Claude Juncker, who going by his full name is half German and half French. (not looking at wikipedia)

    Replies: @Jack D, @psmith

  69. bored identity wonders if this pleasantly-meandering reading was maybe Salier’s Reject for his Taki column?

    Having said that, bored identity feels melancholic and miasmatically sick to the bone;

    Is there a better proof that our Anational Class of Academia Lemmings is maniacally monorailing towards the cliff, than the fact that this
    highbrow aggregator
    will never reprint any of Sailer’s haute musings on sports, cinematography, philosophy…?

    McMuffinpedia describes Arts & Letters Daily as:

    Arts & Letters Daily is a web portal which links to a diverse array* of news stories, features and reviews from across the humanities, each introduced with a short blurb or teaser.
    The site is owned by The Chronicle of Higher Education; a major news service in United States academic affairs.

    (…)

    According to founder and former editor Denis Dutton, Arts & Letters Daily was inspired by the Drudge Report, but was meant to reach “the kinds of people who subscribe to the New York Review of Books, who read Salon and Slate and The New Republic—people interested in ideas“.

    (…)

    “Arts & Letters Daily does for ideas what the Bloomberg service does for commerce.
    It watches developments, sorts things out, tells you what you need to know.”

    (…)

    Arts & Letters Daily slogan: Veritas odit moras (“Truth hates delay”)

    *Array of Truth that Hates Delay includes Al Jazeera, Jerusalem Post, Salon, National Review, Forbes, Jacobin, Armed Forces Journal, Dissent …with obviously no space left for Unz & Sailer because they create and edit content for ‘the people that are not interested in ideas’.

    If Nietzsche were – Der Tote Gott Forbid!- somehow timemachined and teamed up with Milius in modern day Hollywood, they would end up with this working title script:

    Conan The Librarian and 99 Khmer Rouge Myopia Deniers Walk Hard to Revision The Chronicle of Higher Education.

  70. People become obsessed with purity when they have no control. This is reflected in the notion of “control” in experimental groups. If you have controls, you can try all kinds of wild things and still glean some causal laws from the noisy world that invades even the most pristine lab where everyone wears white coats. Given how nasty even that controlled environment is to truth seekers, is it any wonder people get “extreme” when it comes to an utter loss of control of the human ecologies within which they live while being harangued by social “scientists” that it is all settled science among The Great and The Good like Lewontin and Gould?

  71. @Anonymous
    "The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood."

    The genesis of which may have been the so-called "Wandervoegel" Movement--Teutonic hippies really--which emerged in pre-WWI Germany (based in part upon Rousseau's obsession with nature and the "Noble Savage" etc).

    (Sorry, but it should read "Wandervogel" with an umlaut over the"o". Can't do umlauts though. Damn!)

    Replies: @Venator, @jim jones

    Wandervogel is fine, it’s singular.

    @ all

    Lots of interesting thoughts in that thread. My take on the topic of purity is that liberals, recognizing the power of the word, strive for purity of thought: It doesn’t matter who you are if you don’t think toxic thoughts and speak toxic words. Hence, Puritans.

    Conservatives want purity of behaviour: It doesn’t matter what you think if you keep your private life private. Words will never hurt me, your queer gender-bending will.

    Germans, a people of country- and small-city-dwellers, famously feared being poisoned by the metropolis. So, out of the bad air of the city (full of socialists, Jews, and degenerates), into the magic air of the woods! Of course, the German’s old Ostsiedlung-genes can’t completely abide the wilderness. Therefore, after having completely exhausted himself hiking, he stops by a rustic Landgasthaus to restore himself with the nourishment of a settled people: beer and pork.

    (Caution: Lots of happy fashy girls!)

  72. @syonredux
    Re: The late 19th obsession with decadence and decay,

    Max Nordau's Degeneration (1892) is the key book to read for anyone who is interested in the topic:


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degeneration_(Nordau)

    Replies: @Anon Chief

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Nordau says:

    “Nordau was at one time a staunch eugenicist.”

  73. Real philosphers don’t have nervous breakdowns. If they do, you can count on all their philosphical thinking being based on extreme emotional neuroticism and leftover immaturity. Their muddled conclusions can be dismissed with a wave of contempt.

  74. Anonymous • Disclaimer says:
    @The Man From K Street
    @Sid


    The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That’s when they understood it was time for better public health measures.
     
    The same thing happened in the US later on. One of the unpleasant, shocking discoveries of the return of conscription in both 1917 and then again in 1940 was just what a huge proportion of draft-age men from rural districts were simply physically unfit for military service. 4-H? 4-F! Bones that had broken in childhood and never properly set. Hookworms. Eyes that were chronically infected. On and on. Heading into the Cold War this dent in the available manpower pool was seen as a continuing security threat, so the Hill-Burton Act of 1946 provided federal funds for rural hospital construction and accreditation. Of course, what the writers of the law couldn't anticipate in 1946 was that the rural areas of the time were soon to become the far-more densely-populated suburbs of the postwar boom, so Hill-Burton was to have a far bigger effect on the nationwide system of health care and financing then was known at the time.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Actually, the tale of a huge percentage of Edwardian Britons being ‘unfit’ for military service due to the supposedly poor living conditions of the British working class – actually the best fed and most prosperous proletariat in the world at that time – is a persistent canard brought about by a misunderstanding.

    The truth was that a huge proportion of potential recruits to the British army were rejected solely due to bad and rotten teeth. Army regulations at that time required good, strong natural teeth, due to the demand that soldiers had to sustain themselves on ‘hard tack’ a granite hard double baked biscuit bread during times of scarcity. In a battle between rotten teeth and hard tack, teeth would always leave.
    At that time – some would say even today – the British nation had terrible teeth. Dental hygiene was hardly practised, and Victorian/Edwardian Britons had a prodigious appetite for sugar, whether as candy, cakes, soda or sugared tea.
    Apparently false teeth, weren’t allowed by the army in those days, but I have a strong suspicion that the rule was changed in 1914 to 18.

    As recently as the 1950s it was reckoned that around 40% of the adult British population was wholly toothless. Which lead to a classic newspaper headline concerning ‘Edentine Edenites’ sitting in the front row of the Conservative Party conference.
    Anthony Eden was a 1950s Tory Prime Minister.

  75. @Old Palo Altan
    @Dave Pinsen

    We woke up to snow on the ground exactly once in my time in PA.
    Sensational excitement, and not just for the kids,
    But the great thing is that the humidity of a New York summer is unknown there.

    Replies: @Marty

    But what about Pinsen’s observation about sunshine and psychology? When you were in PA, didn’t the constantly dark sky get you down? I only spent two days there one October and was instantly depressed. And I’m from Daly City.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Marty

    If it's sunny every day you don't appreciate it as much. On a day in PA where the weather lines up perfectly you feel like you've hit the jackpot. (We've been having an exceptionally cloudy spring here but I don't mind because it's been mild - in a bad year PA goes right from icy cold to burning hot and humid.) Anyway compared to much of Northern and Eastern Europe, PA gets a lot more sun. There are parts of E. Europe that have 90% cloud cover every day all winter.

    Replies: @Autochthon

    , @Old Palo Altan
    @Marty

    Well, I was a child, and children have nothing to compare their environment with. Anyway I don't remember Palo Alto in that way at all. I remember adventures at San Francisquito Creek and Lake Lagunita, biking everywhere, from the bay to the campus, buying stamps for my collection on a side street downtown, singing in the church choir, discovering first the children's zoo and then that fabled library; that, and much more, and all of it in brilliant sunlight. The rain I remember was always light and mysterious: I loved to go out into it and just walk along under the magnolia trees.

    I have lived since in places with dawn at 10 am and dusk at 3:30 pm, with cold and damp, and endless days of vertical, heavy, relentless rain - now that is what I would call depressing.

    Replies: @Faraday's Bobcat, @res

  76. Anon • Disclaimer says:
    @Dahlia
    Steve,
    I, too, have been thinking a lot about genetic fitness and to a lesser extent, illness, lately. I can tell you unequivocally for me, it is because of Twitter lifting the lid off of the Morlock leaders and the Morlocks they lead. Is it for you?

    Here is Taki:
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/journalists-have-lot-answer-for/

    In the past, Taki and other conservatives would catalogue well journalists' liberal biases and how they manipulate. Twitter exposed what they look like, their dirty habits, and their jealousies.

    I've been pretty obsessed lately with these folks on two fronts: a. how did people smart enough to get into the Ivies or near Ivies not understand the polls and ended up so shocked and b. why do they have such seething hatred for conservatives.

    Ted Kaczynski, Jon Haidt, Agnostic (akinokure.blogspot.com) have helped me so much in these regards. But it was twitter that exposed the patterns and reality and helped formulate the questions to ask.

    One more time, here's Ted:

    10. By "feelings of inferiority" we mean not only inferiority feelings in the strict sense but a whole spectrum of related traits; low self-esteem, feelings of powerlessness, depressive tendencies, defeatism, guilt, self-hatred, etc. We argue that modern leftists tend to have some such feelings (possibly more or less repressed) and that these feelings are decisive in determining the direction of modern leftism.

     


    13. Many leftists have an intense identification with the problems of groups that have an image of being weak (women), defeated (American Indians), repellent (homosexuals) or otherwise inferior. The leftists themselves feel that these groups are inferior. They would never admit to themselves that they have such feelings, but it is precisely because they do see these groups as inferior that they identify with their problems. (We do not mean to suggest that women, Indians, etc. ARE inferior; we are only making a point about leftist psychology.)

     

    Further on, Kaczynski explains how their "activism" is poor at the purported purpose, but instead is engaged in to meet the psychological needs of the leftist: to rage at and hurt the person/people they're jealous of.

    http://www.davesag.com/unabomber/2leftism.html

    Do we have more of these types than in the past and why, or have they always been with us? I wonder if we aren't living in interesting times where IQ has been strongly selected for over the centuries, and especially in the last century with modern medicine, to the detriment of intuition and health. But have we been plateauing in the last 40 or so years?

    Replies: @Dahlia, @Anon

    The US has been since the 1960s or so, a country that promotes meritocracy. We are dedicated to giving scholarships to the underpriviledged, as well as allowing students with high SAT scores but who do not come from established and wealthy WASP families places in college. This means students coming up from the traditional lower classes are able to form connections and gain power. Many of these people are very ambitious and hard driving, and when you get enough of them gathered together, you get some strange social phenomenon.

    It never seems to occur to anybody that if you give opportunities to a lot of people in the lower classes, you end up with a bunch of people at or near the top of society with all the emotional baggage of the lower classes. People are lower class not just because they don’t have money, but because they’re very disfunctional. They’re psychologically messed up and prone to mental illnesses and abberant and self-defeating behaviors. They were often raised by messed-up parents, and they can’t get over their disastrous upbringing. Many of them have lousy genes and poisonous personalities. They are often insanely jealous of anyone who had it easier. They don’t get over their psychological problems. Promote enough of these people up the social ladder and you get an entire caste of messed-up people who think the same way. They can be totally destructive to the health of a society if there are enough of them and if they are given too much power.

    Think of a peasant village filled with petty resentments; jealousy of everyone else’s money, looks, brains, cool, or social connections; stupid and petty quarrels; and gossip that is constantly aimed at bringing others down whom they hate and resent (notice the resemblance to what’s being directed at Trump and his administration via the constant harping on the Russian thing?). Now make all these peasants into the aristocratic class that rules over you. You’ve got liberals in a nutshell.

    It never seems to occur to anyone that scholarships and opportunities should ONLY be given to students not just with good grades, but who pass a test indicating good psychological health and emotional adjustment. There are reasons why people who are emotionally confident and privileged end up running society. They do a better job of it. They don’t get bogged down in stupid crap, and they don’t try to destroy other people because they’re jealous of those people, and they don’t have a paranoid mentally that thinks everyone is out to get them, thus causing them to hunt down and squash every speck of opposition, either ideological (notice our SJWers trying to totally control all media and public discourse,) or personal (you say anything out of line they’ll try to get you fired).

    People born to privilege are confident instead of insecure, and they tend to think everyone below them likes and admires them. They usually believe in leaving people alone to live their lives as they see fit (which leads to a philosophy of laissez-faire capitalism and libertarianism), and which is the opposite of the paranoid and resentful mentality. Their confidence makes them believe that it’s normal to let everyone air their views instead of having them crushed, and this leads to greater consensus and the creation of democratic governments.

    If you raise up hard-driving men from the lower classes who have a lot of emotional baggage , you can get a Joseph Stalin or a Chairman Mao, who spend their lives trying to destroy the upper classes and middle classes, because they see both as their personal oppressors, and who they’re exceedingly jealous of and angry at, and they’ll destroy anyone else who annoys them for any reason. Liberals, (and men like Stalin and Mao) never recognize their own emotional unfitness to rule. They don’t have the insight to understand that their emotional baggage makes them tyrants, not small-d democrats.

    • Replies: @Romanian
    @Anon

    This is a very interesting comment. I hadn't thought of this. But what are we to do then? Strive to achieve intergenerational mobility, rather than glorify high jumps?

    , @snorlax
    @Anon

    Very interesting comment. I haven't decided whether I agree with it yet, but it's certainly thought-provoking and exactly the kind of thing I read the comments here for.

    Just on the face of it, I think there is something to the idea that rapid upwards social mobility is associated with the neuroticism/resentment/paranoia/self-defeating-behavior nexus in individuals (Bill Clinton, Steve Jobs, entertainment celebrities) and groups (Jews, Irish, Asians, etc).

    But on the other hand I'm not 100% convinced my own examples there aren't cherry-picking to suit the thesis, or that the mechanism that causes this personality type isn't rapid upwards social mobility itself rather than lower-class culture.

    , @The Last Real Calvinist
    @Anon

    Agreed with other commenters; this is an interesting theory.

    But what do you mean by 'lower class(es)'?

    In my experience, the people who really go hard left were all raised middle to upper-middle class. My prolish range of acquaintance has tended to stay more sane.

  77. Abe says: • Website
    @Autochthon
    @advancedatheist


    The view is taken (as clearly reappears later in the case of the Hobbits who have the Ring for a while) that each Kind has a natural span integral to its biological and spiritual nature. This cannot really be increased qualitatively or quantitatively; so that prolongation in time is like stretching a wire out ever tauter, or spreading butter ever thinner – it becomes an intolerable torment.
     
    The phrase "qualitatively or quantitatively" is crucial: the concept applies not just to the length of a lifespan, but alos to one's fate during that lifespan. Attempting to change it, whether by Men seeking immortality, or Elves seeking preservation, is viewed as a Bad Thing in Tolkien's diegesis.

    Perhaps the advances in medicine, sanitation, and so on approach declining marginal utility today, as we all live to become decrepit liches warehoused in nurseries to burble tapioca and have our nether regions wiped by orderlies, and even our days of vigour are squandered in overpopulated snarls of traffic, stress, and ennui.

    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman's ideas into a discussion of the great German's (I am currently steeped in the one's as Steve is the other's in my studies and reading); but I cannot help but think on this idea that modern man has traded glory and life for safety and existence when you mention the onerous conditions of our superiour forefathers and their thriving despite (because of?) their travails, in light of Neitsche's own emphasis on courage, boldness, and action (even as he eschewed them in his own life, relegated as they were to mere bookish exhortations rather than the lived truths of Roosevelt).

    Replies: @Stan Adams, @The Anti-Gnostic, @Abe

    I beg pardon for interjecting the great Englishman’s ideas into a discussion of the great German’s (I am currently steeped in the one’s as Steve is the other’s in my studies and reading)

    I had a snarky little remark prepared a while back which I’ve never found a good opportunity to use about how our elites need to go back to reading the classics to regain some grounding, and given their current level of intellectual sophistication, they’d better start with something they can readily digest like THE LION, THE WITCH, AND THE WARDROBE.

    Seriously. As I recall (a bit shaky now since it’s been so long since I last read it to one of my kids) the Christ-like lion sacrifices himself because the evil Witch is able to ensnare him on some point of primordial, ancient law, which- if not followed- would lead to the collapse of the entire world into chaos and nothingness, making questions of good and evil moot at that point. I wish Obama’s Three Harpies of the Apocalypse had kept this in mind before overthrowing Gadaffi. Q’had’fe-fe was, sure, not a “good guy” by most standards, but he kept order in his country. And more importantly by snuffing-out a leader who had just made so many concessions for better relations with the West (including scrapping a supposed nuclear weapons program) on the thinest of pretexts (Power’s crazy catlady notions of right-to-protect, Hillary’s need for a big notch on her strap-on going into 2016) they dealt a YUGE bodyblow to the international order, showing that America’s word is fickle, and that the only real security is in bigger, more dangerous weapons.

  78. @Dave Pinsen
    Speaking of the SoCal health food movement, I thought I shared this tweet with Steve last night, but it looks like I didn't. Lauren Lyster is a news babe who went from RT to Yahoo Finance to ABC.
    https://twitter.com/LaurenLyster/status/871853544705368065

    Replies: @Olorin

    “Ankle deep”? Either she has no feet or somebody is overstocking their 40 square feet of land.

    Poor effing little hens.

    But apparently the new hipster foodie fashion is to be counter-hipster-foodie.

    I figure it’s just a matter of time before breakfast at Cheese Penis (the name based North Berkeleyans used for Alice Waters’s foodie cathedral) consists of an Eggo with Mazola margarine, a dollop of Smuckers corn-syrup-based fruit spread, and some bacon. With Dunkin’ Donuts coffee on the side. And a glass of Richmond tap water.

    The important thing is that the bacon is there. It establishes a beachhead, and before you know it other things follow.

    Bacon can be wrapped around red pills like you enfold dog medications in a slice of deli ham.

    No one can stay at odds with bacon and remain sane. This is Islam’s and Judaism’s problem in a nutshell.

    Offer them communions of bacon, and the rest will eventually follow.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/jewish-elders-lift-6000-year-ham-ban-992

    It’s not a bacon thing. It’s a crispy salty smoked fat thing.

    Though CAFO-pig bacon always tastes to me like 50,000 gallons of pig squitz in a manure lagoon on a hot summer day smells.

    Wild boar bacon, not so much.

    Why the hell am I talking about bacon? I came in here to talk about Nietzsche.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/new-nietzschean-diet-lets-you-eat-whatever-you-fea-1703

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Olorin

    The bacon fad seems overdone to me. Time for the next fad.

    If your religion does not permit bacon, insanity need not follow. Smoked duck or goose gets you just about the same the crispy/salty/smoky/fatty thing and duck fat is probably healthier than bacon drippings. Speaking of which, goose was once an important food items that seems to have completely disappeared from our diet and is due for a hipster revival. Short bacon and go long on goose.

    , @Dave Pinsen
    @Olorin

    Last time I was in the Bay Area, I went to Alice Waters' restaurant (the upstairs one you could get into without a long wait for a reservation). I was underwhelmed. It was pretty bland.

  79. “The British found, during the Boer War, that most of their citizenry was physically unable to participate in war. That’s when they understood it was time for better public health measures.”

    The above written by Mr. Sid is exactly how I feel about all the White drug addict zombies wandering around in the United States. As it is now, the White drug addicts are a cash cow for the addiction industry and the legal industry. These stupid drug addict dopes of all IQ levels will have to be spartanized rather quickly when Civil War II hits.

    The drug scourge weakness has hobbled both low- and high-IQ people in New Hampshire. A dean of students at a local school was arrested for possession of both heroin and steroids. She was arrested while at the school. Damn dope.

    When the globalized central banks lose control of the asset bubbles they have created and Civil War II breaks out, those White drug addicts who are salvageable will have to go through a cold turkey period of withdrawal before they will be able to assist in the fight against the globalizers.

  80. res says:
    @Jack D
    The "health food" movement in America goes back surprisingly far.

    In the 19th century, you have Sylvester Graham as early as the 1830s and later the Kellogg brothers of cereal fame. They all believed that an all vegetarian/cereal diet was healthy because it would tamp down sexual urges (especially self-abuse).

    A very influential figure who is now largely forgotten is Bernarr Macfadden, a sort of proto- Jack LaLanne.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernarr_Macfadden

    Replies: @res

    Macfadden was an interesting man. I actually have a complete set of the 1942 edition of his Encyclopedia of Health (1933 version at https://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Health-Physical-Culture-Eight/dp/B001BET52I more information at http://www.bernarrmacfadden.com/ency/). It looks like there is some good information in there, but I haven’t really delved into it enough to draw good conclusions. Most of that literature (e.g. your Kellogg example) has a mix of both good and bad ideas accompanied by good and bad reasons/explanations which makes it hard to use or evaluate.

  81. “Perhaps the advances in medicine, sanitation, and so on approach declining marginal utility today, as we all live to become decrepit liches warehoused in nurseries to burble tapioca and have our nether regions wiped by orderlies, and even our days of vigour are squandered in overpopulated snarls of traffic, stress, and ennui.”

    The above written by Mr. Autochthon is dreadfully cynical; and dreadfully true. Managerial Consumerism is the summit of which man has climbed. At least Clint Eastwood had some beer up top courtesy of the foresightedness of George Kennedy.

  82. @Anonymous
    "The proto-hippie Nature Boy movement in Southern California in the 1940s started out among long-haired sandal wearers hanging out at a German couple’s health food store in West Hollywood."

    The genesis of which may have been the so-called "Wandervoegel" Movement--Teutonic hippies really--which emerged in pre-WWI Germany (based in part upon Rousseau's obsession with nature and the "Noble Savage" etc).

    (Sorry, but it should read "Wandervogel" with an umlaut over the"o". Can't do umlauts though. Damn!)

    Replies: @Venator, @jim jones

    Hold down the ALT key and type 0246

  83. @anon

    You can see it in books like Thomas Mann’s The Magic Mountain where the main character checks himself into a tuberculosis sanatorium for years without much evidence that he actually has TB, but you know, you can never tell.
     
    It's hard to believe that was ever a popular book. It's a project.

    It took a long time for the germ theory of disease to totally catch on in America. Lewis's Arrowsmith (1925) was roughly the period when it became 'common knowledge'. Meanwhile, the Rockefeller Institute and the largest Life Insurance companies were behind the implementation of a lot of public health practices.

    The Flexner Report (1910) marked the period that medical education became regulated, with basic sciences required. http://archive.carnegiefoundation.org/pdfs/elibrary/Carnegie_Flexner_Report.pdf

    Flexner is pretty open about his objective to reduce the number of practicing doctors to increase income levels -- which he felt was necessary to justify the required education. A classic example of rent seeking, &c. However, when I read the book, it was hard to really emotionally oppose the 'reform'.

    Replies: @Olorin, @HA

    Even more interesting is that “the germ theory of disease” was, at bottom, an explosively transformative new level of understanding of microbial biology, microbial/zoonotic ecology, population biology, and population genetics.

    Or anyway, it was the first toe in the door. To understand that there are more things in the cracks of our floorboards than were at the time dreamt of in our philosophies.

    The reason I find this all fascinating is that we’re at a similar juncture–with the explosive new levels of understanding whooshing out of the instrumentation and data processing revolutions of the past 40 years–with genetics, particle physics, and planet-scale systems analysis.

    Interesting to note that Abe Flexner was the first native born generation–German Jewish parents who settled in KY. I seem to recall he kept entering degree programs but not finishing them, instead floating from place to place and thing to thing. Bright, but rather a drifting malcontent.

    His views as magnified by The Flexner Report were published by the then-new Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching, which rose around the same time to try to professionalize education/schooling. Yielding the Ed Biz.

    No surprise that two of the biggest problems we’re facing at present are the massive concentrations of power there and in Big Pharma, which is trying to monetarize our very mortality for speculative gain.

    There is quite an economic incentive in all that to have a stupider and sicker population base to keep the engine of intervention/hand holding going. This is precisely what the kerfuffle at The Evergreen State College is about. The college going that direction, Bret Weinstein having had the temerity to both name and question it.

  84. @utu
    @Steve Sailer

    California has no humidity.

    Replies: @Anon

    I was working on a software project in San Francisco. One of the developers had just relocated from Arizona and could not stop complaining about the humidity in SF. To him it was Houston.

  85. @MEH 0910
    Austrian Kurt Gödel had an obsessive fear of being poisoned.

    https://plus.maths.org/content/goumldel-and-limits-logic

    But Gödel was not promoted to professor until 1953 — the same year he was elected to membership in the National Academy of Sciences — in part because his expressed fear that poison gases were escaping from his refrigerator aroused continuing concern about his mental stability.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_G%C3%B6del#Later_life_and_death

    Later in his life, Gödel suffered periods of mental instability and illness. He had an obsessive fear of being poisoned; he would eat only food that his wife, Adele, prepared for him. Late in 1977, she was hospitalized for six months and could no longer prepare her husband's food. In her absence, he refused to eat, eventually starving to death.[26] He weighed 65 pounds (approximately 30 kg) when he died. His death certificate reported that he died of "malnutrition and inanition caused by personality disturbance" in Princeton Hospital on January 14, 1978.[27] He was buried in Princeton Cemetery. Adele's death followed in 1981.
     

    Replies: @Jack D

    In line with Steve’s theme, Gödel was said to suffer from frequent episodes of “poor health,” which would continue for his entire life.

    I’m guessing that a lot of what was called “poor health” in the past was a euphemism for mental disease or depression at a time when mental illness was stigmatized. It would have been more acceptable to say that you were staying in bed because you were “sick” than to say that you couldn’t get out of bed because you were depressed.

    On the other hand, in the days before antibiotics, people really did get sick more and more seriously. People would get infections and die all the time.

  86. TWS says:
    @Chrisnonymous
    @Steve Sailer

    No way. People's theory of microbiotic causation of disease and its prevention wasn't that developed/widespread. Anyway, America wasn't like Japan, where they literally scrubbed the floors daily.

    Replies: @TWS

    Don’t talk about what you don’t know. My grandmother kept the house so clean you could have done surgery on the kitchen floor. My great grandmother was even more careful.

    My great grandmother learned how to take care of things before Semmelweis’ crackpot theories were accepted. Americans were big on cleanliness.

  87. @newrouter
    @Foreign Expert

    2nd that. Penicillin was a late 1920's find by happenstance.

    Replies: @Pat Boyle

    Penicillin was not discovered by happenstance. The discoverer of penicillin was Howard Florey an Australian medical researcher at Oxford who led a team of doctors charged with developing anti-bacterials. It was a large team and a major effort. Florey set one of his team to doing a literature search. His assistant uncovered an obscure paper from 1928 of an observation of an anti-bacterial accidental result from a mold. The doctor who had made that long forgotten observation was Alexander Fleming.

    Florey who had organized the effort to find a new anti-bacterial substance and who shared the Nobel Prize with Fleming is now largely forgotten. Fleming who simply published an observation is now credited with the whole discovery.

    • Replies: @res
    @Pat Boyle

    Thanks, I did not know that. It is amazing how credit gets channeled to a single person sometimes.

    More about Florey: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Florey

    He was on the Australian $50 bank note from 1973-95. Nice to have a culture that recognizes people like that.

    , @dearieme
    @Pat Boyle

    I disagree. The meaning of the verb 'to discover' in English seems to me to imply that Fleming was the discoverer. Florey was enormously important and justly shared the Nobel Prize, but that doesn't make him the discoverer.

    A couple of decades ago there was a biopic on the telly about the Florey team. I commend it warmly.

    P.S. This was one case where the limitation of the Prize to three winners gave a rather harsh result, in that one of the key men in Florey's team, Heatley, didn't share the prize. In 1990 Oxford gave him an Honorary Doctorate in Medicine, the first given in Oxford’s 800-year history. Heatley wasn't medically qualified: hats off to whoever at Oxford thought of this singular honour for him.

    Replies: @res

  88. @Anon
    @Dahlia

    The US has been since the 1960s or so, a country that promotes meritocracy. We are dedicated to giving scholarships to the underpriviledged, as well as allowing students with high SAT scores but who do not come from established and wealthy WASP families places in college. This means students coming up from the traditional lower classes are able to form connections and gain power. Many of these people are very ambitious and hard driving, and when you get enough of them gathered together, you get some strange social phenomenon.

    It never seems to occur to anybody that if you give opportunities to a lot of people in the lower classes, you end up with a bunch of people at or near the top of society with all the emotional baggage of the lower classes. People are lower class not just because they don't have money, but because they're very disfunctional. They're psychologically messed up and prone to mental illnesses and abberant and self-defeating behaviors. They were often raised by messed-up parents, and they can't get over their disastrous upbringing. Many of them have lousy genes and poisonous personalities. They are often insanely jealous of anyone who had it easier. They don't get over their psychological problems. Promote enough of these people up the social ladder and you get an entire caste of messed-up people who think the same way. They can be totally destructive to the health of a society if there are enough of them and if they are given too much power.

    Think of a peasant village filled with petty resentments; jealousy of everyone else's money, looks, brains, cool, or social connections; stupid and petty quarrels; and gossip that is constantly aimed at bringing others down whom they hate and resent (notice the resemblance to what's being directed at Trump and his administration via the constant harping on the Russian thing?). Now make all these peasants into the aristocratic class that rules over you. You've got liberals in a nutshell.

    It never seems to occur to anyone that scholarships and opportunities should ONLY be given to students not just with good grades, but who pass a test indicating good psychological health and emotional adjustment. There are reasons why people who are emotionally confident and privileged end up running society. They do a better job of it. They don't get bogged down in stupid crap, and they don't try to destroy other people because they're jealous of those people, and they don't have a paranoid mentally that thinks everyone is out to get them, thus causing them to hunt down and squash every speck of opposition, either ideological (notice our SJWers trying to totally control all media and public discourse,) or personal (you say anything out of line they'll try to get you fired).

    People born to privilege are confident instead of insecure, and they tend to think everyone below them likes and admires them. They usually believe in leaving people alone to live their lives as they see fit (which leads to a philosophy of laissez-faire capitalism and libertarianism), and which is the opposite of the paranoid and resentful mentality. Their confidence makes them believe that it's normal to let everyone air their views instead of having them crushed, and this leads to greater consensus and the creation of democratic governments.

    If you raise up hard-driving men from the lower classes who have a lot of emotional baggage , you can get a Joseph Stalin or a Chairman Mao, who spend their lives trying to destroy the upper classes and middle classes, because they see both as their personal oppressors, and who they're exceedingly jealous of and angry at, and they'll destroy anyone else who annoys them for any reason. Liberals, (and men like Stalin and Mao) never recognize their own emotional unfitness to rule. They don't have the insight to understand that their emotional baggage makes them tyrants, not small-d democrats.

    Replies: @Romanian, @snorlax, @The Last Real Calvinist

    This is a very interesting comment. I hadn’t thought of this. But what are we to do then? Strive to achieve intergenerational mobility, rather than glorify high jumps?

  89. @John Derbyshire
    @Steve Sailer

    Lewis Thomas' book The Youngest Science is a good read in this area. Aside from elementary repairs like tooth-pulling, suturing, and bone-setting and a very small number of effective drugs (quinine, digitalis … that was about it) and narcotics, medicine was basically useless until the 1930s.

    Replies: @Pat Boyle

    There was a ‘Masterpiece Theater’ (PBS British TV imports) show about twenty of thirty years ago where the plot was a medical mystery. These Edwardian gentlemen were arguing about drugs and medicine. One of the characters asserts that there were no drugs whatsoever that had any beneficial effect. His opponent slips some laudanum into his wine glass and he fails to notice a crime (or some other plot twist).

    Modern people find the notion that there are no effective drugs inconceivable. I take nearly twenty pills everyday of my life as well as a couple injections. But apparently only about a century ago reasonable people could deny that there were any effective medicines.

  90. @Autochthon
    @Dieter Kief

    Indeed, it is the stroke which causes syphilis, no?

    Forgive me; I couldn't resist. I really should take such childish nonsense over to TakiMag where the degenerate commenters live....

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    Being a little light headed every now and then is part of the gay science – and the amor fati.

  91. Abe says: • Website
    @Thursday
    @syonredux

    No, it doesn't complicate Haidt's theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Regular left liberals are high in B5 Openness, low in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, and are high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion.

    Left Authoritarians are low in B5 Openness, high in B5 Conscientiousness subfactor Orderliness, high in B5 Agreeableness subfactor Compassion, as well as being low in IQ and high in B5 Neuroticism.

    Orderliness is what is associated with high disgust sensitivity (as well as religiousness). It typically predicts right wing and authoritarian politics.

    Left Wing Authoritarians seem to be very good at pushing ordinary left liberals' Compassion button.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_fBYROA7Hk
    https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

    Replies: @syonredux, @syonredux, @Abe

    No, it doesn’t complicate Haidt’s theory, because Left Wing Authoritarians have a personality that is different from other people on the left.

    Yes, hasn’t everyone here noticed by now that the whole edifice of ant-racism virtue signaling is centered on milking that disgust reflex for all it’s worth? Some BBC honcho once described his outfit as ‘hideously’ white. Dumbo Ben Affleck has called racism ‘gross’. Anyone with politically incorrect views is routinely trashed as ‘disgusting’.

    As I’ve often said, one of the more evil genius aspects of the Hillary Clinton campaign (and she almost pulled it off) was to try to rope in centrist and mildly-conservative voters with appeals to faux patriotism (‘America which has founded by Muslims has always been great!’) and to start really pushing the gag reflex on all the normies out there, now that they’ve been thoroughly marinated in PC culture for 25 years. These certainly aren’t your dad’s free-spirited, anarchic, bohemian liberals anymore.

    • Agree: snorlax
  92. @Marty
    @Old Palo Altan

    But what about Pinsen's observation about sunshine and psychology? When you were in PA, didn't the constantly dark sky get you down? I only spent two days there one October and was instantly depressed. And I'm from Daly City.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Old Palo Altan

    If it’s sunny every day you don’t appreciate it as much. On a day in PA where the weather lines up perfectly you feel like you’ve hit the jackpot. (We’ve been having an exceptionally cloudy spring here but I don’t mind because it’s been mild – in a bad year PA goes right from icy cold to burning hot and humid.) Anyway compared to much of Northern and Eastern Europe, PA gets a lot more sun. There are parts of E. Europe that have 90% cloud cover every day all winter.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
    @Jack D

    It's always sunny in Philadelphia.

  93. @Olorin
    @Dave Pinsen

    "Ankle deep"? Either she has no feet or somebody is overstocking their 40 square feet of land.

    Poor effing little hens.

    But apparently the new hipster foodie fashion is to be counter-hipster-foodie.

    I figure it's just a matter of time before breakfast at Cheese Penis (the name based North Berkeleyans used for Alice Waters's foodie cathedral) consists of an Eggo with Mazola margarine, a dollop of Smuckers corn-syrup-based fruit spread, and some bacon. With Dunkin' Donuts coffee on the side. And a glass of Richmond tap water.

    The important thing is that the bacon is there. It establishes a beachhead, and before you know it other things follow.

    Bacon can be wrapped around red pills like you enfold dog medications in a slice of deli ham.

    No one can stay at odds with bacon and remain sane. This is Islam's and Judaism's problem in a nutshell.

    Offer them communions of bacon, and the rest will eventually follow.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/jewish-elders-lift-6000-year-ham-ban-992

    It's not a bacon thing. It's a crispy salty smoked fat thing.

    Though CAFO-pig bacon always tastes to me like 50,000 gallons of pig squitz in a manure lagoon on a hot summer day smells.

    Wild boar bacon, not so much.

    Why the hell am I talking about bacon? I came in here to talk about Nietzsche.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/new-nietzschean-diet-lets-you-eat-whatever-you-fea-1703

    Replies: @Jack D, @Dave Pinsen

    The bacon fad seems overdone to me. Time for the next fad.

    If your religion does not permit bacon, insanity need not follow. Smoked duck or goose gets you just about the same the crispy/salty/smoky/fatty thing and duck fat is probably healthier than bacon drippings. Speaking of which, goose was once an important food items that seems to have completely disappeared from our diet and is due for a hipster revival. Short bacon and go long on goose.

  94. @Marty
    @Old Palo Altan

    But what about Pinsen's observation about sunshine and psychology? When you were in PA, didn't the constantly dark sky get you down? I only spent two days there one October and was instantly depressed. And I'm from Daly City.

    Replies: @Jack D, @Old Palo Altan

    Well, I was a child, and children have nothing to compare their environment with. Anyway I don’t remember Palo Alto in that way at all. I remember adventures at San Francisquito Creek and Lake Lagunita, biking everywhere, from the bay to the campus, buying stamps for my collection on a side street downtown, singing in the church choir, discovering first the children’s zoo and then that fabled library; that, and much more, and all of it in brilliant sunlight. The rain I remember was always light and mysterious: I loved to go out into it and just walk along under the magnolia trees.

    I have lived since in places with dawn at 10 am and dusk at 3:30 pm, with cold and damp, and endless days of vertical, heavy, relentless rain – now that is what I would call depressing.

    • Replies: @Faraday's Bobcat
    @Old Palo Altan

    I've lived most of my life in cold, dreary parts of the country. When that first warm, sunny day of the year hits, usually some time in March, people are walking on air. You can tell the weather just by looking at people's faces.

    I did live in California for seven years and loved the weather, but in SoCal sometimes I felt like the sun was just beating down on me relentlessly. I think the lack of humidity has something to do with it. It's like the sun is only about 100 feet over your head. Lack of the four-season cycle did weird things to my sense of time. Of an April I would think, "The car hasn't had an oil change since last summer" because I'd mowed the lawn on the day it was changed - only to realize the events had taken place in February.

    , @res
    @Old Palo Altan

    Worth mentioning that some people in this thread are using PA to refer to Palo Alto while (I think) others mean Pennsylvania--rather different climates.

  95. @Old Palo Altan
    @Marty

    Well, I was a child, and children have nothing to compare their environment with. Anyway I don't remember Palo Alto in that way at all. I remember adventures at San Francisquito Creek and Lake Lagunita, biking everywhere, from the bay to the campus, buying stamps for my collection on a side street downtown, singing in the church choir, discovering first the children's zoo and then that fabled library; that, and much more, and all of it in brilliant sunlight. The rain I remember was always light and mysterious: I loved to go out into it and just walk along under the magnolia trees.

    I have lived since in places with dawn at 10 am and dusk at 3:30 pm, with cold and damp, and endless days of vertical, heavy, relentless rain - now that is what I would call depressing.

    Replies: @Faraday's Bobcat, @res

    I’ve lived most of my life in cold, dreary parts of the country. When that first warm, sunny day of the year hits, usually some time in March, people are walking on air. You can tell the weather just by looking at people’s faces.

    I did live in California for seven years and loved the weather, but in SoCal sometimes I felt like the sun was just beating down on me relentlessly. I think the lack of humidity has something to do with it. It’s like the sun is only about 100 feet over your head. Lack of the four-season cycle did weird things to my sense of time. Of an April I would think, “The car hasn’t had an oil change since last summer” because I’d mowed the lawn on the day it was changed – only to realize the events had taken place in February.

  96. @Pat Boyle
    @newrouter

    Penicillin was not discovered by happenstance. The discoverer of penicillin was Howard Florey an Australian medical researcher at Oxford who led a team of doctors charged with developing anti-bacterials. It was a large team and a major effort. Florey set one of his team to doing a literature search. His assistant uncovered an obscure paper from 1928 of an observation of an anti-bacterial accidental result from a mold. The doctor who had made that long forgotten observation was Alexander Fleming.

    Florey who had organized the effort to find a new anti-bacterial substance and who shared the Nobel Prize with Fleming is now largely forgotten. Fleming who simply published an observation is now credited with the whole discovery.

    Replies: @res, @dearieme

    Thanks, I did not know that. It is amazing how credit gets channeled to a single person sometimes.

    More about Florey: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Florey

    He was on the Australian $50 bank note from 1973-95. Nice to have a culture that recognizes people like that.

  97. @Old Palo Altan
    @Marty

    Well, I was a child, and children have nothing to compare their environment with. Anyway I don't remember Palo Alto in that way at all. I remember adventures at San Francisquito Creek and Lake Lagunita, biking everywhere, from the bay to the campus, buying stamps for my collection on a side street downtown, singing in the church choir, discovering first the children's zoo and then that fabled library; that, and much more, and all of it in brilliant sunlight. The rain I remember was always light and mysterious: I loved to go out into it and just walk along under the magnolia trees.

    I have lived since in places with dawn at 10 am and dusk at 3:30 pm, with cold and damp, and endless days of vertical, heavy, relentless rain - now that is what I would call depressing.

    Replies: @Faraday's Bobcat, @res

    Worth mentioning that some people in this thread are using PA to refer to Palo Alto while (I think) others mean Pennsylvania–rather different climates.

  98. HA says:
    @anon

    You can see it in books like Thomas Mann’s The Magic Mountain where the main character checks himself into a tuberculosis sanatorium for years without much evidence that he actually has TB, but you know, you can never tell.
     
    It's hard to believe that was ever a popular book. It's a project.

    It took a long time for the germ theory of disease to totally catch on in America. Lewis's Arrowsmith (1925) was roughly the period when it became 'common knowledge'. Meanwhile, the Rockefeller Institute and the largest Life Insurance companies were behind the implementation of a lot of public health practices.

    The Flexner Report (1910) marked the period that medical education became regulated, with basic sciences required. http://archive.carnegiefoundation.org/pdfs/elibrary/Carnegie_Flexner_Report.pdf

    Flexner is pretty open about his objective to reduce the number of practicing doctors to increase income levels -- which he felt was necessary to justify the required education. A classic example of rent seeking, &c. However, when I read the book, it was hard to really emotionally oppose the 'reform'.

    Replies: @Olorin, @HA

    “It took a long time for the germ theory of disease to totally catch on in America. Lewis’s Arrowsmith (1925) was roughly the period when it became ‘common knowledge’.”

    I would push the date back 10 years, when Rockefeller funded studies showing that hookworms/roundworms/whipworms (and poor latrine management) were a key factor in making Southerners “slow”.

    … in [1909-1915] millionaire John D. Rockefeller set out to profit from southern industry, but was stymied by the lack of productivity from an unenergetic workforce. Rockefeller funded studies that discovered the cause: a microscopic hookworm which could travel up to 4 feet in soil from a site of defecation. The “germ of laziness,” as they called it, infected a new host through their bare feet and migrated to the intestine, resulting in anemia, malnutrition and poor worker performance.

    The study came out just in time for the Nazis and Communists to incorporate it into their woldviews, and the notion that parasitic entities (be they Jews in general, as Nazis would have it, or Jewish capitalists and kulaks, as Communists saw it) are literally sucking the blood and the vitality out from their victims became a common theme in both ideologies.

  99. @Dave Pinsen
    @Steve Sailer

    I've wondered about the broader psychological effect of sunny California weather. A few times per year, mostly in May or September, the NYC area gets California-like weather and locals take to Twitter about how nice it is. It's something to appreciate, something to look forward to, and you could always move to California and enjoy it most of the time. But if you're already in California, you have no California to go to.

    Replies: @Old Palo Altan, @Anon 2

    Similarly, in Boston you get nearly perfect weather
    from mid-August to mid-October but otherwise winters
    are miserable (sometimes you don’t get to see the sun
    the entire month of February), and summers are oppressively
    hot and humid. As in NYC, May is generally nice.

    Speaking of People’s Republic of Santa Monica, the city is
    now regarded as one of the most desirable locations in
    Southern California (until Silicon Beach gets done with it)
    but an older friend of mine who lived only 10-15 blocks
    from the Ocean in SM, was always complaining about humidity
    and felt she’d improve her health if she moved farther inland.
    If so, how can people in Malibu stand living practically on the
    beach? Doesn’t the humidity aggravate any pre-existing arthritic
    conditions? (I’m obviously not an MD). At least the wealthy in
    San Francisco have the good sense to live at higher elevations
    than the hoi polloi (if any hoi polloi are left in SF at this point)

  100. Was Nietzsche a genius ? That is what I have heard . And I have heard lesser men presume to make facile pronouncements interpreting his “philosophy” . But the superior man that he so desperately sought to imagine and explain and bring in to being did not reject God or good or evil . The Ubermensch is above all a practical man , a man who knows that 1+1 =2. The superior man knows that this cage that we are imprisoned in is of our own making . God and his commandments are only bars in this prison that we inhabit . Nietzsch’s great failing and the source of his madness was that he could find no exit from the poisonous and deadly trap of ego . He had the great misfortune to perceive mans desperate and miserable condition and see no way out . There is a way but his great tragedy was … was that he did not find it . For all his brilliance he was as lost a soul . We lesser beings that we are need not to be so desperately lost in the immensity of time and eternity when we know that love is standing by our side and beckoning us .

    Great is the matter of birth and death
    Life slips quickly by
    Time waits for no one
    Wake up! Wake up!
    Don’t waste a moment .

  101. Well as you all must know the donut is a madman , barking at the moon nuts . And yet how much easier it is than to grip , cling to the illusion of sanity . BTW did you know that on August 21st there will be a total eclipse of the Sun in the USA as well as a lunar eclipse 7 days before . Check out NASA’s site for the details .

  102. @Olorin
    @Dave Pinsen

    "Ankle deep"? Either she has no feet or somebody is overstocking their 40 square feet of land.

    Poor effing little hens.

    But apparently the new hipster foodie fashion is to be counter-hipster-foodie.

    I figure it's just a matter of time before breakfast at Cheese Penis (the name based North Berkeleyans used for Alice Waters's foodie cathedral) consists of an Eggo with Mazola margarine, a dollop of Smuckers corn-syrup-based fruit spread, and some bacon. With Dunkin' Donuts coffee on the side. And a glass of Richmond tap water.

    The important thing is that the bacon is there. It establishes a beachhead, and before you know it other things follow.

    Bacon can be wrapped around red pills like you enfold dog medications in a slice of deli ham.

    No one can stay at odds with bacon and remain sane. This is Islam's and Judaism's problem in a nutshell.

    Offer them communions of bacon, and the rest will eventually follow.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/jewish-elders-lift-6000-year-ham-ban-992

    It's not a bacon thing. It's a crispy salty smoked fat thing.

    Though CAFO-pig bacon always tastes to me like 50,000 gallons of pig squitz in a manure lagoon on a hot summer day smells.

    Wild boar bacon, not so much.

    Why the hell am I talking about bacon? I came in here to talk about Nietzsche.

    http://www.theonion.com/article/new-nietzschean-diet-lets-you-eat-whatever-you-fea-1703

    Replies: @Jack D, @Dave Pinsen

    Last time I was in the Bay Area, I went to Alice Waters’ restaurant (the upstairs one you could get into without a long wait for a reservation). I was underwhelmed. It was pretty bland.

  103. Anonymous [AKA "tantum"] says: • Website

    “blonde beast” = lion

    Btw, you may be aware, but since you mention the peripheral details (the migraines, the breakdown) without mentioning the underlying problem, this is an interesting paper:

    http://www.leonardsax.com/Nietzsche.pdf

  104. @utu
    Race-poisoning?

    Friedrich Nietzsche, [...] , declared several times in his writings not only to have had Polish ancestors, but also to feel Polish, deep inside his soul and in his most basic instincts.
    http://culture.pl/en/article/was-nietzsche-polish
     

    I am a Polish nobleman pure sang, in whom there is not the slightest admixture of bad blood, least of all German.
     
    Self hating German?

    Replies: @Anon 2

    It appears that Nietzsche was not so much a self-hating German
    as a self-hating Prussian. He renounced his Prussian citizenship,
    and remained stateless for much of his life. For most of its history
    Germany was an assemblage of states and principalities, known
    collectively as the Holy Roman Empire that was, as Voltaire famously
    pointed out, neither Holy, nor Roman, nor an Empire. The Empire
    was then brought to an end by Napoleon in 1806. Nevertheless his
    anti-German animus and his claims of Polish ancestry were well known,
    and resulted in very low sales of his books during his lifetime.

    Perhaps some of his psychological problems can be traced to the fact
    that he was effectively raised without a father. His father died when
    he was 5, leaving him surrounded by 5 women – his mother, sister,
    and 3 female relatives. It’s been said that his closest relationship
    with a woman was with his younger sister who idolized him, and
    took care of him in his declining years.

    Re: Nietzsche’s Polish ancestry. He expressed his conviction that he
    was descended from Polish nobility in 5 different places in his collected
    works. Presumably his sister had the detailed genealogy. There seems to be no
    definite proof one way or the other. However, considering the fact that
    that the region between the Elbe-Saale rivers and the Oder (basically
    coincident with East Germany) was occupied by Western Slavs (specifically
    Polabian Slavs) since the 6th century, and since Charlemagne’s death was
    subject to German settlement (Ostsiedlung), it would make sense that
    millions of people in eastern Germany and western Poland would have
    mixed ancestry. Nietzsche wrote, ” Germany is a great nation only because
    its people have so much Polish blood in their veins.” We forget that until the
    19th century, Poland as the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was indeed
    widely regarded as a great nation, certainly the largest in Europe for 200 years;
    a democracy surrounded by despotic powers hellbent on military expansionism.
    Some people go as far as to claim that Nietzsche’s concept of the Übermensch
    was based on his analysis of the Polish nobility (top 10%) in the 16th century
    when Poland after 700 years of existence reached the apex of its power

  105. @Jack D
    @Marty

    If it's sunny every day you don't appreciate it as much. On a day in PA where the weather lines up perfectly you feel like you've hit the jackpot. (We've been having an exceptionally cloudy spring here but I don't mind because it's been mild - in a bad year PA goes right from icy cold to burning hot and humid.) Anyway compared to much of Northern and Eastern Europe, PA gets a lot more sun. There are parts of E. Europe that have 90% cloud cover every day all winter.

    Replies: @Autochthon

    It’s always sunny in Philadelphia.

  106. @Anon
    @Dahlia

    The US has been since the 1960s or so, a country that promotes meritocracy. We are dedicated to giving scholarships to the underpriviledged, as well as allowing students with high SAT scores but who do not come from established and wealthy WASP families places in college. This means students coming up from the traditional lower classes are able to form connections and gain power. Many of these people are very ambitious and hard driving, and when you get enough of them gathered together, you get some strange social phenomenon.

    It never seems to occur to anybody that if you give opportunities to a lot of people in the lower classes, you end up with a bunch of people at or near the top of society with all the emotional baggage of the lower classes. People are lower class not just because they don't have money, but because they're very disfunctional. They're psychologically messed up and prone to mental illnesses and abberant and self-defeating behaviors. They were often raised by messed-up parents, and they can't get over their disastrous upbringing. Many of them have lousy genes and poisonous personalities. They are often insanely jealous of anyone who had it easier. They don't get over their psychological problems. Promote enough of these people up the social ladder and you get an entire caste of messed-up people who think the same way. They can be totally destructive to the health of a society if there are enough of them and if they are given too much power.

    Think of a peasant village filled with petty resentments; jealousy of everyone else's money, looks, brains, cool, or social connections; stupid and petty quarrels; and gossip that is constantly aimed at bringing others down whom they hate and resent (notice the resemblance to what's being directed at Trump and his administration via the constant harping on the Russian thing?). Now make all these peasants into the aristocratic class that rules over you. You've got liberals in a nutshell.

    It never seems to occur to anyone that scholarships and opportunities should ONLY be given to students not just with good grades, but who pass a test indicating good psychological health and emotional adjustment. There are reasons why people who are emotionally confident and privileged end up running society. They do a better job of it. They don't get bogged down in stupid crap, and they don't try to destroy other people because they're jealous of those people, and they don't have a paranoid mentally that thinks everyone is out to get them, thus causing them to hunt down and squash every speck of opposition, either ideological (notice our SJWers trying to totally control all media and public discourse,) or personal (you say anything out of line they'll try to get you fired).

    People born to privilege are confident instead of insecure, and they tend to think everyone below them likes and admires them. They usually believe in leaving people alone to live their lives as they see fit (which leads to a philosophy of laissez-faire capitalism and libertarianism), and which is the opposite of the paranoid and resentful mentality. Their confidence makes them believe that it's normal to let everyone air their views instead of having them crushed, and this leads to greater consensus and the creation of democratic governments.

    If you raise up hard-driving men from the lower classes who have a lot of emotional baggage , you can get a Joseph Stalin or a Chairman Mao, who spend their lives trying to destroy the upper classes and middle classes, because they see both as their personal oppressors, and who they're exceedingly jealous of and angry at, and they'll destroy anyone else who annoys them for any reason. Liberals, (and men like Stalin and Mao) never recognize their own emotional unfitness to rule. They don't have the insight to understand that their emotional baggage makes them tyrants, not small-d democrats.

    Replies: @Romanian, @snorlax, @The Last Real Calvinist

    Very interesting comment. I haven’t decided whether I agree with it yet, but it’s certainly thought-provoking and exactly the kind of thing I read the comments here for.

    Just on the face of it, I think there is something to the idea that rapid upwards social mobility is associated with the neuroticism/resentment/paranoia/self-defeating-behavior nexus in individuals (Bill Clinton, Steve Jobs, entertainment celebrities) and groups (Jews, Irish, Asians, etc).

    But on the other hand I’m not 100% convinced my own examples there aren’t cherry-picking to suit the thesis, or that the mechanism that causes this personality type isn’t rapid upwards social mobility itself rather than lower-class culture.

  107. @Anon
    @Dahlia

    The US has been since the 1960s or so, a country that promotes meritocracy. We are dedicated to giving scholarships to the underpriviledged, as well as allowing students with high SAT scores but who do not come from established and wealthy WASP families places in college. This means students coming up from the traditional lower classes are able to form connections and gain power. Many of these people are very ambitious and hard driving, and when you get enough of them gathered together, you get some strange social phenomenon.

    It never seems to occur to anybody that if you give opportunities to a lot of people in the lower classes, you end up with a bunch of people at or near the top of society with all the emotional baggage of the lower classes. People are lower class not just because they don't have money, but because they're very disfunctional. They're psychologically messed up and prone to mental illnesses and abberant and self-defeating behaviors. They were often raised by messed-up parents, and they can't get over their disastrous upbringing. Many of them have lousy genes and poisonous personalities. They are often insanely jealous of anyone who had it easier. They don't get over their psychological problems. Promote enough of these people up the social ladder and you get an entire caste of messed-up people who think the same way. They can be totally destructive to the health of a society if there are enough of them and if they are given too much power.

    Think of a peasant village filled with petty resentments; jealousy of everyone else's money, looks, brains, cool, or social connections; stupid and petty quarrels; and gossip that is constantly aimed at bringing others down whom they hate and resent (notice the resemblance to what's being directed at Trump and his administration via the constant harping on the Russian thing?). Now make all these peasants into the aristocratic class that rules over you. You've got liberals in a nutshell.

    It never seems to occur to anyone that scholarships and opportunities should ONLY be given to students not just with good grades, but who pass a test indicating good psychological health and emotional adjustment. There are reasons why people who are emotionally confident and privileged end up running society. They do a better job of it. They don't get bogged down in stupid crap, and they don't try to destroy other people because they're jealous of those people, and they don't have a paranoid mentally that thinks everyone is out to get them, thus causing them to hunt down and squash every speck of opposition, either ideological (notice our SJWers trying to totally control all media and public discourse,) or personal (you say anything out of line they'll try to get you fired).

    People born to privilege are confident instead of insecure, and they tend to think everyone below them likes and admires them. They usually believe in leaving people alone to live their lives as they see fit (which leads to a philosophy of laissez-faire capitalism and libertarianism), and which is the opposite of the paranoid and resentful mentality. Their confidence makes them believe that it's normal to let everyone air their views instead of having them crushed, and this leads to greater consensus and the creation of democratic governments.

    If you raise up hard-driving men from the lower classes who have a lot of emotional baggage , you can get a Joseph Stalin or a Chairman Mao, who spend their lives trying to destroy the upper classes and middle classes, because they see both as their personal oppressors, and who they're exceedingly jealous of and angry at, and they'll destroy anyone else who annoys them for any reason. Liberals, (and men like Stalin and Mao) never recognize their own emotional unfitness to rule. They don't have the insight to understand that their emotional baggage makes them tyrants, not small-d democrats.

    Replies: @Romanian, @snorlax, @The Last Real Calvinist

    Agreed with other commenters; this is an interesting theory.

    But what do you mean by ‘lower class(es)’?

    In my experience, the people who really go hard left were all raised middle to upper-middle class. My prolish range of acquaintance has tended to stay more sane.

  108. @Steve Sailer
    @Lot

    Yup.

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I'm not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    In general, we are pretty clueless about what kind of illness celebrities in the past suffered from (e.g., speculating about Van Gogh's mental and physical health is a cottage industry). For example, Nietzsche was assumed to have been ruined by syphilis, but I just saw some doctor theorizing that it was something stroke-related.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @John Derbyshire, @stillCARealist, @David Davenport

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I’m not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    Old label: neurasthenia. Currently called: fibromyalgia.

    Fibromyalgia
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Fibromyalgia

    Symptoms Widespread pain, feeling tired, sleep problems[2][3]
    Usual onset Middle age[4]
    Duration Long term[2]
    Causes Unknown[3][4]
    Diagnostic method Based on symptoms after ruling out other potential causes[3][4]
    Similar conditions Polymyalgia rheumatica, rheumatoid arthritis, osteoarthritis, thyroid disease[5]

    ( Huh? OA and RA are definitely non-psychological maladies. -DD )
    Treatment Sufficient sleep and exercise, healthy diet[4]
    Medication Duloxetine, milnacipran, pregabalin[4]
    Prognosis Normal life expectancy[4]
    Frequency 2–8%[3]

    Fibromyalgia (FM) is a medical condition characterised by chronic widespread pain and a heightened pain response to pressure.[2] Other symptoms include tiredness to a degree that normal activities are affected, sleep problems, and troubles with memory.[3] Some people also report restless legs syndrome, bowel or bladder problems, numbness and tingling, and sensitivity to noise, lights or temperature.[4] Fibromyalgia is frequently associated with depression, anxiety, and posttraumatic stress disorder. Other types of chronic pain are also frequently present.[3]

    The cause of fibromyalgia is unknown; however, it is believed to involve a combination of genetic and environmental factors with half the risk attributed to each.[3][4] The condition runs in families and many genes are believed to be involved.[6] Environmental factors may include psychological stress, trauma, and certain infections.[3] The pain appears to result from processes in the central nervous system and the condition is referred to as a “central sensitization syndrome”.[2][3] Fibromyalgia is recognized as a disorder by the US National Institutes of Health and the American College of Rheumatology.[4][7] There is no specific diagnostic test.[4] Diagnosis involves first ruling out other potential causes and verifying that a set number of symptoms are present.[3][4]

    The treatment of fibromyalgia can be difficult. Recommendations often include getting enough sleep, exercising regularly, and eating a healthy diet.[4] Cognitive behavioral therapy may also be helpful.[3] The medications duloxetine, milnacipran, or pregabalin may be used.[4] Use of opioid pain medication is controversial with some stating their use is poorly supported by evidence[4][8] and others saying that weak opioids may be reasonable if other medications are not effective.[9] Dietary supplements also lack evidence to support their use. While fibromyalgia can last a long time, it does not result in death or tissue damage.[4]

    Fibromyalgia is estimated to affect 2–8% of the population. Females are affected about twice as often as males. Rates appear similar in different areas of the world and among different cultures. Fibromyalgia was first defined in 1990 with updated criteria in 2011.[3] There is controversy about the classification, diagnosis, and treatment of fibromyalgia.[10][11] While some feel the diagnosis of fibromyalgia may negatively affect a person, other research finds it to be beneficial.[3] The term “fibromyalgia” is from New Latin, fibro-, meaning “fibrous tissues”, Greek μυώ myo-, “muscle”, and Greek άλγος algos, “pain”; thus the term literally means “muscle and fibrous connective tissue pain”.[12]

    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
    @David Davenport

    For a wonderfully amusing portrait of this sort of (self?) afflicted person, go to Barchester Towers by Anthony Trollope. A memorable if minor character in the novel is Signora Neroni, who has come back from Italy "a cripple and a mother" as she herself puts it, and is therefore carried around the house on a divan.
    The part is brilliantly portrayed by the consistently enchanting Susan Hampshire in the BBC production from 1982. It's on Youtube, and is a good antidote to the grotesqueries of our own benighted times.

    Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist

  109. … The treatment of fibromyalgia can be difficult. Recommendations often include getting enough sleep, exercising regularly, and eating a healthy diet.[4] Cognitive behavioral therapy may also be helpful.[3] The medications duloxetine, milnacipran, or pregabalin may be used.[4] Use of opioid pain medication is controversial with some stating their use is poorly supported by evidence[4][8] and others saying that weak opioids may be reasonable if other medications are not effective.[9] …

    In other words, contemporary docs and psycho-gurus don’t know what to do about fibromyalgia.

    A wide variety of treatments in use means no really effective treatment.

    ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

    Neurasthenia/fibromyalgia similar to long ago sin of accidie?

    Wikipedia:

    Ancient depictions[edit]

    Acedia depicted by Pieter Bruegel the elder.

    Moral theologians, intellectual historians and cultural critics have variously construed acedia as the ancient depiction of a variety of psychological states, behaviors or existential conditions: primarily laziness, apathy, ennui or boredom.

    The demon of acedia holds an important place in early monastic demonology and proto-psychology. In the late fourth century Evagrius of Pontus, for example, characterizes it as “the most troublesome of all” of the eight genera of evil thoughts. As with those who followed him, Evagrius sees acedia as a temptation, and the great danger lies in giving in to it. Evagrius’ contemporary, the Desert Father John Cassian, depicted the apathetic restlessness of acedia, “the noonday demon”, in the coenobitic monk:

    He looks about anxiously this way and that, and sighs that none of the brethren come to see him, and often goes in and out of his cell, and frequently gazes up at the sun, as if it was too slow in setting, and so a kind of unreasonable confusion of mind takes possession of him like some foul darkness.[5]

    Foul darkness is the natural setting of Satan: in the medieval Latin tradition of the seven deadly sins, acedia has generally been folded into the sin of sloth. The Benedictine Rule directed that a monk displaying the outward signs of acedia

    “should be reproved a first and a second time. If he does not amend he must be subjected to the punishment of the rule so that the others may have fear.[6]

  110. @Stan Adams
    @Autochthon

    Speaking of Roosevelt, how'd you like to contract polio, lose the use of your legs, and spend the rest of your life in a wheelchair? He was a vigorous, athletic man in his youth.

    All things considered, I'd rather live in a century in which diarrhea is not (necessarily) a death sentence.

    Replies: @Kylie

    Tanaquil Le Clercq suffered a worse fate than Franklin Roosevelt’s.

    She was a principal dancer with the New York City Ballet when she contracted polio at age 27 in 1956. She became paralyzed from the waist down and was confined to a wheelchair for the rest of her life. She lost her mobility, her career and eventually her husband (legendary choreographer George Balanchine who divorced her to pursue a ballerina who could still dance). She lived another 44 years.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanaquil_Le_Clercq

  111. @Pat Boyle
    @newrouter

    Penicillin was not discovered by happenstance. The discoverer of penicillin was Howard Florey an Australian medical researcher at Oxford who led a team of doctors charged with developing anti-bacterials. It was a large team and a major effort. Florey set one of his team to doing a literature search. His assistant uncovered an obscure paper from 1928 of an observation of an anti-bacterial accidental result from a mold. The doctor who had made that long forgotten observation was Alexander Fleming.

    Florey who had organized the effort to find a new anti-bacterial substance and who shared the Nobel Prize with Fleming is now largely forgotten. Fleming who simply published an observation is now credited with the whole discovery.

    Replies: @res, @dearieme

    I disagree. The meaning of the verb ‘to discover’ in English seems to me to imply that Fleming was the discoverer. Florey was enormously important and justly shared the Nobel Prize, but that doesn’t make him the discoverer.

    A couple of decades ago there was a biopic on the telly about the Florey team. I commend it warmly.

    P.S. This was one case where the limitation of the Prize to three winners gave a rather harsh result, in that one of the key men in Florey’s team, Heatley, didn’t share the prize. In 1990 Oxford gave him an Honorary Doctorate in Medicine, the first given in Oxford’s 800-year history. Heatley wasn’t medically qualified: hats off to whoever at Oxford thought of this singular honour for him.

    • Replies: @res
    @dearieme

    Thanks for the biopic reference. Is this it (only 11 minutes)?

    The discovery of penicillin (1964)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qeZLLhx5kU

    Or how about this more recent (2009) 1:20 program?
    BBC Four - Breaking the Mould: The Story of Penicillin
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00ly0t1
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTlOEjHtkp0
    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1434927/

  112. res says:
    @dearieme
    @Pat Boyle

    I disagree. The meaning of the verb 'to discover' in English seems to me to imply that Fleming was the discoverer. Florey was enormously important and justly shared the Nobel Prize, but that doesn't make him the discoverer.

    A couple of decades ago there was a biopic on the telly about the Florey team. I commend it warmly.

    P.S. This was one case where the limitation of the Prize to three winners gave a rather harsh result, in that one of the key men in Florey's team, Heatley, didn't share the prize. In 1990 Oxford gave him an Honorary Doctorate in Medicine, the first given in Oxford’s 800-year history. Heatley wasn't medically qualified: hats off to whoever at Oxford thought of this singular honour for him.

    Replies: @res

    Thanks for the biopic reference. Is this it (only 11 minutes)?

    The discovery of penicillin (1964)

    Or how about this more recent (2009) 1:20 program?
    BBC Four – Breaking the Mould: The Story of Penicillin
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00ly0t1

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1434927/

  113. @David Davenport
    @Steve Sailer

    It was also pretty common for women who could afford servants to take to their sickbeds for years. I’m not sure what that was about: post-partum depression?

    Old label: neurasthenia. Currently called: fibromyalgia.

    Fibromyalgia
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Fibromyalgia

    Symptoms Widespread pain, feeling tired, sleep problems[2][3]
    Usual onset Middle age[4]
    Duration Long term[2]
    Causes Unknown[3][4]
    Diagnostic method Based on symptoms after ruling out other potential causes[3][4]
    Similar conditions Polymyalgia rheumatica, rheumatoid arthritis, osteoarthritis, thyroid disease[5]

    ( Huh? OA and RA are definitely non-psychological maladies. -DD )
    Treatment Sufficient sleep and exercise, healthy diet[4]
    Medication Duloxetine, milnacipran, pregabalin[4]
    Prognosis Normal life expectancy[4]
    Frequency 2–8%[3]

    Fibromyalgia (FM) is a medical condition characterised by chronic widespread pain and a heightened pain response to pressure.[2] Other symptoms include tiredness to a degree that normal activities are affected, sleep problems, and troubles with memory.[3] Some people also report restless legs syndrome, bowel or bladder problems, numbness and tingling, and sensitivity to noise, lights or temperature.[4] Fibromyalgia is frequently associated with depression, anxiety, and posttraumatic stress disorder. Other types of chronic pain are also frequently present.[3]

    The cause of fibromyalgia is unknown; however, it is believed to involve a combination of genetic and environmental factors with half the risk attributed to each.[3][4] The condition runs in families and many genes are believed to be involved.[6] Environmental factors may include psychological stress, trauma, and certain infections.[3] The pain appears to result from processes in the central nervous system and the condition is referred to as a "central sensitization syndrome".[2][3] Fibromyalgia is recognized as a disorder by the US National Institutes of Health and the American College of Rheumatology.[4][7] There is no specific diagnostic test.[4] Diagnosis involves first ruling out other potential causes and verifying that a set number of symptoms are present.[3][4]

    The treatment of fibromyalgia can be difficult. Recommendations often include getting enough sleep, exercising regularly, and eating a healthy diet.[4] Cognitive behavioral therapy may also be helpful.[3] The medications duloxetine, milnacipran, or pregabalin may be used.[4] Use of opioid pain medication is controversial with some stating their use is poorly supported by evidence[4][8] and others saying that weak opioids may be reasonable if other medications are not effective.[9] Dietary supplements also lack evidence to support their use. While fibromyalgia can last a long time, it does not result in death or tissue damage.[4]

    Fibromyalgia is estimated to affect 2–8% of the population. Females are affected about twice as often as males. Rates appear similar in different areas of the world and among different cultures. Fibromyalgia was first defined in 1990 with updated criteria in 2011.[3] There is controversy about the classification, diagnosis, and treatment of fibromyalgia.[10][11] While some feel the diagnosis of fibromyalgia may negatively affect a person, other research finds it to be beneficial.[3] The term "fibromyalgia" is from New Latin, fibro-, meaning "fibrous tissues", Greek μυώ myo-, "muscle", and Greek άλγος algos, "pain"; thus the term literally means "muscle and fibrous connective tissue pain".[12]

    Replies: @Old Palo Altan

    For a wonderfully amusing portrait of this sort of (self?) afflicted person, go to Barchester Towers by Anthony Trollope. A memorable if minor character in the novel is Signora Neroni, who has come back from Italy “a cripple and a mother” as she herself puts it, and is therefore carried around the house on a divan.
    The part is brilliantly portrayed by the consistently enchanting Susan Hampshire in the BBC production from 1982. It’s on Youtube, and is a good antidote to the grotesqueries of our own benighted times.

    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    @Old Palo Altan

    Thanks for this recommendation; it sounds excellent.

  114. @Old Palo Altan
    @David Davenport

    For a wonderfully amusing portrait of this sort of (self?) afflicted person, go to Barchester Towers by Anthony Trollope. A memorable if minor character in the novel is Signora Neroni, who has come back from Italy "a cripple and a mother" as she herself puts it, and is therefore carried around the house on a divan.
    The part is brilliantly portrayed by the consistently enchanting Susan Hampshire in the BBC production from 1982. It's on Youtube, and is a good antidote to the grotesqueries of our own benighted times.

    Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist

    Thanks for this recommendation; it sounds excellent.

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