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From my column in Taki’s Magazine:

Racial Revenge?
Steve Sailer

May 13, 2020

Last Friday, the day after two whites in Georgia were arrested in the vastly publicized killing of the black jogger/prowler Ahmaud Arbery, a young black gunman murdered two octogenarian whites, Paul and Lidia Marino, while they were visiting their son’s grave at a veterans’ cemetery in Delaware. After a six-hour firefight with the police, the shooter, a 29-year-old black man, was dead—whether at police hands or his own remains unknown.

In contrast to Arbery’s shooting, this second interracial killing case has gotten virtually zero national media attention through Tuesday morning, even though it’s fairly spectacular in scale and quite curious in motive. For example, an eyewitness speculated that the killer appeared to have brought extra ammunition for his planned shoot-out to the death with the police.

The cops don’t have an explanation for the killer’s actions yet. It wasn’t a robbery. It doesn’t sound like a contract killing. (I can’t rule that out, but I did check if the victims, a retired lithographer and a housewife, were close relatives of any mafioso of the same surname, but found zero connections.) It could be some kind of personal beef, but nobody has found a connection between the killer and the killed at this point.

No confession note, social media, or interviews with the shooter’s family have yet emerged to explain his motivations. Although, to be frank, the press doesn’t seem to be all that motivated to get to the bottom of this seemingly random slaughter.

Read the whole thing there.

 
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  1. Do you people EVER listen to People of Color?

    As LEBRON JAMES whites are literally hunting down Black Men for racially motivated reasons

    This is false equivalency to compare the Delaware shooting. One is based on head of white violence. The other is a rare occurrence

    You guys are forgetting who enslaved who

    Who engages in white flight and gentrification?

    Who refuses to pay more taxes regulate guns teach real history and not be selfish?

    Men of Color are usually interested in having romantic relations with white girls. That in and of itself proves that there is no anti white animus

    The tide is turning. Just look at the demographics. Read the twitter of white girls and Justin Moss

  2. The privilege of not learning from one’s mistakes is one of the sadder aspects of this grim story of race and (the control of the) resources (=discourses).

    • Agree: Desiderius
  3. “Racial Revenge?”

    Yes.

    C’mon, gimme a hard one.

    • LOL: YetAnotherAnon
  4. I vaguely recall being told that it is not possible for black folk to be racist, so how could this be racial revenge?

    Black people can be prejudiced as hell, just like any other group of people. As a matter of fact, I think all humans are prejudiced in one way or another. But just because a black person hurt your feelings that one time doesn’t mean you’ve experienced racism.

    This is where I’m going to lose some of you: I don’t believe that people of color can be racist in America.

    Doyin Richards
    Columnist
    HuffPo

    source: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/opinion-can-black-people-be-racist_n_5c3e5e8be4b01c93e00e8764?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9kdWNrZHVja2dvLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAADcz0oGGHQjok0W-L34H-OY_T_Zm0bAAWQKptqnnpfkKkvBGbUOj3n0b-smPEwqQf9zodZixUS2560lBm8aA7MeF3WMVkcrbCT0-vGlZh2fTeVQD1lHtumaGD2tbxDK1G7SXajkGJxrx9beN8WJOBmM9RsHt4QIdhzyNDF5ySpFf

  5. And since Whites aren’t going to do anything to assert their rights beyond voting for Trump things can carry on like this forever. Frankly I’m starting to think that BadWhites might as well give up, adopt Swedish views of what is a proper society and accept the Supremacy of the liberal Managerial State because only after Liberals achieved total victory will they be willing to consider that there could be something wrong with their policies.

  6. Steve, I will enjoy (I usually do) reading your column soon. First, I’d just like to state that Paul Kersey, on this very website now, covers lots of these cases, including this one. His posting on this carnage does get to the point of monotony, but that’s because these black racial murders happen on a near-daily basis.

    Maybe you already knew that, and this doesn’t detract from your point that in the excerpt that the national Lyin’ Press won’t mention that case in Deleware. That would provide too much perspective for the readers and viewers.

    • Replies: @Ragno
  7. Anon[269] • Disclaimer says:

    OT

    The New York Times says, Yes, you need a pulse oximeter, in extremely long and detailed installment of Tara Parker-Pope’s Ask Well column.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/24/well/live/coronavirus-pulse-oximeter-oxygen.html

    Most health technicians will place the device on the index fingers, but a study of 37 volunteers found that the highest reading came from the third finger on the dominant hand. A close second was the dominant thumb. So if you are right-handed, use the right middle finger. If you are left-handed, use the left middle finger. The difference between fingers is small, so if you prefer the index finger, that’s fine.

    Wouldn’t the goal be not to game the thing to get a high reading, but rather to use the normal method to get a standard reading to compare to population norms?

    Also, n=37 for a complicated result like “middle finger … but of dominant hand”? How many left handers were among the 37? Four?

  8. black sea says:

    Black on Black crime is boringly routine, and receives little attention in the media unless one or both parties happen to be celebrities.

    Black on White crime is seen as a dangerous and potentially volatile storyline to be downplayed as much as possible.

    White on Black crime is seen as a precious resource to be magnified and sensationalized as much as possible, i.e. “hunting Black men.”

    White self defense against Black perpetrators can easily be re-cast into White on Black crime, particularly when a White policeman is involved.

  9. The New York Times: Whites Die In Darkness

  10. J.Ross says:

    If the newsmedia ever called attention to black rage killings of whites, then whites would hazily and slowly just begin to make the connection to the twenty-four-seven calls for rage killings of whites by newsmedia, and the entertainment media, and pop music, and plebbit, and establishmentarian youtube personalities, and probably like puppets or something.
    ——–
    On an evil online white radical note I like how our every move is watched, our hardware store purchases are analyzed, and every respectable voice decries imagined influence and radicalization, but meanwhile normative black men stand ready to drop everything and go werwolf if you walk past them humming the right three bars.

    • Agree: BenKenobi
  11. King Baeksu says: • Website

    Things one mustn’t talk about: The negative externalities of moral preening and reality denial by “bien pensant” whites, such as a growing mountain of bullet-riddled black, white, brown and Asian corpses. After all, it’s the thought that counts.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
  12. That’s even more saturation coverage than the Times normally devotes to late-breaking developments in the Emmett Till case.

    Ha! See, I knew I’d like it – lots of humor in addition to all the truth.

    It made me think of how your 2 favorite media outlets might handle this:

    NY Times: “There has been more speculation about the Emmett Till case just today. See The Atlantic for an expose on what kind of hemp rope Emmett Till would likely have been hanged with, had he not been shot or bashed over the head.” A link to the NY Times is embedded.

    The Atlantic: “There has been additional speculation on the recent Emmett Till lynching, with today’s short article in the NY Times.” A link to the NY Times blurb above is embedded.

    If they put these 2 out at the same time, it will be an infinite loop for many readers that will keep them occupied for hours. More clicks, more site visits, more page views, and hemp rope – it’s a win/win!

  13. @Anon

    I gave the health technicians the middle finger. Was that wrong?

    • Replies: @Reactionary Utopian
  14. Anon[270] • Disclaimer says:

    How does the media distortion matrix work?

    They needn’t explicitly lie: that is, report “verifiably false” information. Rather, they achieve the exact same effect of having lied by simply selectively reporting events.

    For example, say group A does one bad deed for every ten good deeds they do and group B does ten bad for every one good. And, say that the media loves group B and hates groups A.

    The media, by simply choosing to ignore the good deeds of group A while focusing endless polemical coverage on their one bad deed (while doing the exact opposite with group B), can create a backwards or “upside down” perception in the public mind: that group B does much more good than group A, when the opposite is in fact true.

    The media could have employed the much more naive strategy of simply fabricating false libels to demonize group A, or invent good deeds to lionize group B. But, this would make the media much more vulnerable to being accused of publishing falsehoods. Instead, they achieve the exact same effect by simply waiting around until group A eventually does something bad, and then reporting on it endlessly.

    In science this is known as “sample bias.” It can get devastatingly harmful drugs approved for the treatment of diseases they don’t cure and it can render miracle drugs seemingly useless and thus unused. Needless to say, it’s an extremely dangerous error to make. Unfortunately, the media has still never gotten around to employing the kind of scientific processes that exist in medicine and the hard sciences to ensure that it creates accurate perceptions of reality in the minds of the public. This has catastrophic policy consequences in a “democracy” where the public votes based on the perception of reality that is created for them by television and the press.

    On the other hand, it’s very beneficial to the monopolist billionaires who control the media to be able to steer the public to support policies which the monopolists, and their co-ethnics, themselves benefit from. It’s better to understand “democracy”, where monopoly capital controls the information and propaganda channels, as an autocracy by the media owners. That explains why policy, in the long run, almost always goes their way: policies which would have been thought of as crazy and impossible if you had informed, say, General Patton, or the men who died under his command, of their eventual implementation.

    • Agree: Joseph Doaks
  15. Anonymous[349] • Disclaimer says:

    The people who run the media hate white people, and they aren’t going to stop these libels anytime soon. The people who have been told they are the victims are sadly too stupid to stop buying into whatever the media slops on their plates.

    It is a pointless argument. The only thing to do is convince everyone else of the falsehoods. We can do that by pointing out obvious contradictions with real, not hypothetical, cases. Here’s a good one.

    Brock Turner. If you recall the Brock Turner case, he was forcibly held against his will by two Swedes on bicycles. He was in the process of digitally penetrating a woman who at some point had lost consciousness.

    Potential lessons from the eager hate mob in the media regarding Arbery are as follows:

    – Just because A.A. was trespassing, you have no proof from a court of law that he did anything felonious inside the property. He could just be a curious well-wisher.

    – Even if A.A. did commit a felony, citizens have no right to intervene, that is what we have police for

    – A.A. had a right to use deadly force against his pursuers because they were trying to infringe on his right to bodily autonomy and free movement and may have felt threatened. This is the only explanation for excusing Arbery’s attempt to get the gun. A struggle for a weapon is always a deadly force situation.

    Parallels for the Brock Turner case would go something like this:

    – Just because Brock’s date was very drunk and possibly unconscious, she could have signed consent-to-have-drunk-sex forms at a previous and sober time. The Swedes had no proof from a court of law that Brock Turner was doing anything illegal. He could have been her husband and this is their kink. The Swedes had no clue.

    – Even if Brock Turner kidnapped and drugged the victim who he was violently raping, the Swedes had no right to intervene. That’s what we have police for.

    – At the moment the Swedes used physical force to infringe on Brock Turner’s free movement, Brock had the right to use deadly force against the cyclists because his rights were violated and he felt threatened.

    Is that how the story was laid out in the media? Obviously not. The cycling Swedes were lauded as heroes. Why? Because Brock Turner is white, and Ahmoud Arbery was black.

  16. One intrinsically fascinating aspect of the story of the Delaware kilings described above, is that it was a “six-hour firefight”

    Moral questions aside, that is something technically impressive and rare to pull off, against heavily-armed police and swat teams who would soon be on the scene

    For gun owners, the details of actual gunfights are hugely interesting, and educationally important for self-defense knowledge (or preparing for civil war boogaloo), contrasting heavily with the ridiculously stylised and often improbable portrayals of gun battles in Hollywood movies and television

    Maybe the most spectactular street gunfight ever, was the North Hollywood bank shoot-out of 28 February 1997, with two guys holding a large army of police officers at bay, with something like about 1700 shots fired by both sides, the robbers apparently inspired by the 1995 hit film ‘Heat’

    One thing you learn from real gunfights, is that it is often unrealistic, and perhaps fatal, to tell someone with a knife or gun to ‘drop it’, even from behind him, as you often can’t react fast enough to his shooting or throwing the knife, hence your best chance to survive is to shoot him immediately without giving warning

    And likewise, you may well have time to draw your own gun and kill your attacker, before he can react, even tho the gun is already in his hand pointing at you

    A much-better-than-usual portrayal of street gunfighting, showing the power of surprise against reaction time in an armed menace, was this superb 2-minute scene from Tom Cruise’s ‘Collateral’

  17. First, excellent work, Mr. Sailer. I think you very slightly tilt the evidence in a couple instances, but over all you present a direct, calm and effective remonstrance to the awful propaganda of racist resentment that the major news operations put out. Today’s NYT, for example, has two op-eds about the Arbery case, one of which fantastically protests that black people are not allowed to jog in the United States, especially in “lily-white” Eugene, Oregon, where jogging supposedly originated. This is the heading and subheading on that piece: “Jogging Has Always Excluded Black People:
    Born in lily-white Oregon, it’s a sport that’s long claimed to be for everyone — even as African-American joggers have been persistently subjected to harassment and worse.” The author’s name is Natalia Mehlman Petrzela.

  18. @Knowingbetter

    How does TD so often get pole position on these things? I can offer a conspiracy theory if anyone wants. Which is to say, if it’s not obvious.

    • Replies: @ATate
  19. @The Alarmist

    What a surprise … a huffpo writer knows absolutely nothing about the crime stats in this country over the past hundred years.

  20. @brabantian

    Here’s my 2006 review of Stephen Hunter’s nonfiction book about the Puerto Rican nationalist attempt to assassinate Harry Truman in 1950, “American Gunfight,” which you might enjoy:

    https://vdare.com/articles/american-gunfight

  21. Here is how to make this seemingly insane media circus make logical sense. People with sub-Saharan African ancestry tend on average, due to the population differences in genetic variation, have lower average intelligence and more tendency toward violence. These two difficult facts are increasing obvious to those willing to take a hard and honest look at the evidence, but anathema to the worldview of many people including a vast majority of those working in the media. Many people cannot tolerate this difficult aspect of the reality that they live in, and must hide from it at all costs. Selectively distorting the news by, for example, changing a random killing of a suspicious young black male into a racist vendetta by remnants of the KKK, while ignoring stronger parallel killings of innocent whites is part of their subconscious campaign to alter the reality in which they live rather than face the facts of the world as it really is.

    • Replies: @megabar
    , @Currahee
  22. @brabantian

    I might be wrong about saying the firefight between the killer and the cops went on for 6 hours. To be precise, the cops found his dead body after about 6 hours. They may have waited several hours to approach it after he was already dead.

    But one witness said there was a considerable volume of gunfire exchanged and he speculated that the killer had picked out a fairly secure location ahead of time and had extra ammunition.

    Not quite the North Hollywood bank robbery of the late 1990s, but a more interesting event than the perfunctory national coverage suggests.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    , @David In TN
  23. Rob McX says:
    @Steve Sailer

    They may have waited several hours to approach it after he was already dead.

    Seems to be standard procedure these days. A shooter may leave a bomb at the scene for posthumous revenge, or booby-trap his own home.

    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
  24. Anonymous[349] • Disclaimer says:

    What really puzzles me about this current Arbery media shark feeding frenzy, ritual wailing and gnashing of teeth, clothes rending, sackcloth and ashes, scarification rites etc etc – as an aside this peculiarly American phenomenon of periodic ritualistic purging and atonement foisted onto whites by the media/political establishment would make an excellent study for sociologist/psychologist/philosopher/student-of-religions, one is forcefully reminded of the ancient Hebrew practice of the ‘Scapegoat’, transmogrified into vicarious sacrifice – is that is occurring right slap-bang-in-the-middle of the biggest civil crisis in modern US history.

    To me it seems like certain quarters are stirring it up, not that they need much of an excuse, but perhaps unconsciously to divert from the angst and tedium of lock down.
    Perhaps their frustrations are *sooooo* desperately in need of an outlet that only the shedding of white blood – the blood of the hated fit for sacrifice race – can satiate their satanic list.

  25. Anonymous[349] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    As an addendum, what do you think that the ‘Gladiatorial Games’ were originally all about?

    Perhaps they later degenerated into ‘sport’, but the original idea was to shed human blood to appease dark spirits.

  26. Inverness says:
    @Anonymous

    Brock Turner is a bizarre choice if you’re trying to construct an analogy.

  27. Inverness says:
    @Tono Bungay

    It’s true though. Whenever black people try to go jogging they are set upon by hordes of cracker-ass crackers, armed with shotguns. You think this story is rare? Happens every day up in here. And the media just looks the other way.

    • LOL: Joe Magarac
    • Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome
  28. Rob McX says:
    @brabantian

    For gun owners, the details of actual gunfights are hugely interesting, and educationally important for self-defense knowledge (or preparing for civil war boogaloo), contrasting heavily with the ridiculously stylised and often improbable portrayals of gun battles in Hollywood movies and television.

    The laws of physics are suspended for Hollywood shootouts and car chases.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
  29. OT,but is one reason so many people in nursing homes are dying is because so many of the staff are black?

    • Agree: James Speaks
    • Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome
    , @Kronos
  30. ronehjr says:

    By the way, Trump completely muffed out on this issue, so don’t look for any help from him this time.

    • Replies: @V. Hickel
    , @MBlanc46
  31. Pericles says:
    @The Alarmist

    It’s the campus definition of racism, which is a cobweb of questionable assertions, but boils down to whatever is done, you racist, not me.

    So Doyin Richards can be an angry, overpromoted, illiterate moron who hates and attacks whites because of their race … but at least she ain’t no racist. Because that’s what Professor Blatzenberg said. One may assume Editor Bergblatz agrees with him.

  32. Inverness says:
    @Knowingbetter

    Oh yeah LeBron, I remember him. Said some racists had vandalized the gates at his mansion in Brentwood. And somehow the security cameras aimed right at the gates didn’t see them.

    Here’s CNN: “Social activism!
    His statement Wednesday is not the first time that the 33-year-old NBA superstar has been candid about race.”

    • Replies: @Unladen Swallow
  33. Anonymous[371] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    but a study of 37 volunteers found that the highest reading came from the third finger on the dominant hand. A close second was the dominant thumb. So if you are right-handed, use the right middle finger.

    Is the third finder on a hand the ring finger, or is it the middle finger?

  34. Look, I watched the video. I’m sure that Arbery, with his criminal record, was up to no good. He was spotted by the father and son at the construction site peering into a window of an unfinished house and maybe casing it for tools he could sell or whatever. Then he continues running down the road. So the father and son drive past him and decide to do a “citizen’s arrest.” They get out of the truck with their guns. The son positions himself in front of the truck to the left with his gun to stop Arbery as he jogs past the right of the truck while the father is up in the back of the truck with his own gun, presumably covering for the son. Arbery spots the son (and maybe the father, too), who’s in plain sight from a distance and crosses in front of the trunk, tries to wrest the gun out of the son’s hands and punches him. Then, it seems, the father (coming to the son’s defense) or the son, or both, shoot Arbery and kill him.

    I’m sorry, but both father and son acted like idiots. A “citizen’s arrest” over someone casing a place and then jogging off? Really? Sure, Arbery might have been up to no good, but the only crime they actually saw committed was a minor trespass: stepping onto private property. Just for starters, how did they know Arbery wasn’t armed himself?

    And frankly, if some rando non-cop with a gun trained on me tried to stop me on a public road by telling me I was “under arrest,” I’d say, “Eff you!” And I’d feel perfectly justified in punching him out and grabbing the gun, if I could. People are under no obligation to submit to being stopped by armed randos, “citizen’s arrest” or no “citizen’s arrest.” They’re entitled to fight back.

    Again, I’m sure that Arbery was up to no good. And I’m not sure that either McMichael committed a crime–although manslaughter is a distinct possibility. But the two acted like morons. This was not the Trayvon Martin case: nighttime, on private property, peering into people’s homes, jumping Zimmerman to the ground. It was broad daylight on a public road.

    Sure, Arbery was not the holy martyr that the press has made him out to be. But the McMichaels don’t deserve a lot of sympathy, either.

  35. nebulafox says:
    @black sea

    Last night, I read an article from 1995 by a black journalist from the Washington Post by the name of Keith Richburg. He was stationed in Africa for three years during the absolute worst of the continent’s post-Cold War woes: Rwanda, the Congo, Somalia, etc. In a particularly illuminating passage, he mentioned feeling far more at home in Westernized South Africa-just then dismantling apartheid for good-than anywhere else on the continent, something he would have never dreamed of in his younger days.

    Even back then, he was denounced as some self-loathing racist for pointing how American blacks have no more connection to the continent than a typical white American does with Europe, why, in the context of the horrors of Africa, that was a good thing, and the dangers of pursuing sectarian politics. And Richburg was no Sowell, no Thomas: he was a Washington Post reporter who has standard issue liberal views.

    This was 25 years ago, back when the Overton Window was still somewhat sane.

    For anybody interested, it is a good read:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/inatl/longterm/richburg/richbrg1.htm

  36. Thoughts says:
    @Anonymous

    If the Swedes had not stopped Brock Turner, he and ‘Chanel’ would have woken up on the grass together, had a good laugh and gone out to breakfast.

    Two years later there would have been a wedding.

    And that is why Brock should spend everyday of his low-wage earning life thanking God that the Swedes put a stop to that s—t.

    (I read some of her interviews…she just be cray cray on the feminist assault stuff. Asian women just go to the power)

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  37. anonymous[400] • Disclaimer says:

    Who knows, the only person that could answer the question of motive is dead. Unless he left a note or messaged someone we can only guess. Perhaps he just felt like killing some white people that day regardless of what was in the news. The media of course will make excuses for him were it forced to cover the story a bit more: he was traumatized, victim of waycism, abused as a child, etc etc.

  38. turns out the pennslyvania trans-shim removed its mother from her nursing home while the state was implementing its plan to kill all seniors via bringing covid to nursing homes. could be a big story.

  39. Anonymous[371] • Disclaimer says:
    @black sea

    Black on White crime is seen as a dangerous and potentially volatile storyline to be downplayed as much as possible.

    Publicizing Black on White crime could lead to group feelings among Whites. Group feelings among Whites could lead to another Holocaust.

    White on Black crime is seen as a precious resource to be magnified and sensationalized as much as possible, i.e. “hunting Black men.”

    White self defense against Black perpetrators can easily be re-cast into White on Black crime, particularly when a White policeman is involved.

    White on Black “crime” can often easily be recast—often in fact is—White self-defense against Blacks.

  40. nebulafox says:
    @King Baeksu

    One should never speak of fellow citizens (if you are an ROK citizen visiting our US-centric blog, forgive the “fellow” part) as problems, but it is hard to deny that a lot of our issues as a nation revolve around our swollen upper-middle class. It’s easy to call out the billionaires for their venality or the masses for their irresponsibility, and no doubt both are issues. But in order to prop up a more precarious, but wealthy and demographically stronger UMC, we’ve hollowed out the middle class beneath them. Having a society of the Saved and the Damned is not a good idea, especially since the Saved will resort to increasingly stringent methods to prevent their offspring from becoming damned.

    And the bien-pensants stemming from this demographic are indeed mostly-though not always-white. They spout the rhetoric of liberalism mostly out of a mixture of guilt and narcissism, reducing non-Europeans to derivatives of themselves with mirrors of their own concerns: and naturally, none of the inherent moral ambiguity that is a part of human nature, no matter where in the world you go. It’s really the White Man’s Burden all over again, just a lot more simpering, weak, and viewing non-upstream whites as responsible for the ills of the world rather than recalcitrant non-whites. Kipling was what he was, no apologies for it, and took honest responsibility for outcomes as a partisan of the ruling class of his day. It poorly reflects on today’s cultural elites, many of whom are deluded enough to not view themselves as elites at all.

  41. Pericles says:
    @brabantian

    A negro robbed by a white man. You don’t see that every day.

  42. Blacks will never be held to the same standards as Whites because no one thinks Blacks are moral agents on the same level. Just like no one is shocked when a dog bites a man, but is outraged when a man hurts a dog.

    Which is why some form of segregation will come back.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  43. Pericles says:
    @Steve Sailer

    I read a couple of novels by Stephen Hunter. Massive, enormous, nay, gargantuan shitlib who hates the toothless white scum and loves the blameless negro, often jailed for life for some trivial reason by the southern white devils.

    Vengeance on the badwhites in these novels was executed by one ‘Earl Swagger’, an honest working class man who just happened to also be an invincible fighting shitlib (in the story weighed down with medals from terminating hundreds of small japanese men during WW2). That’s who you could have been, badwhites. But no, now you all have to die while exhibiting your lack of character and good breeding.

    Somewhat oddly, Stephen Hunter also worked for 40 years at the Baltimore Sun. He didn’t notice anything out of the ordinary while there, I take it.

  44. @Charlotte Allen

    I’m sorry, but both father and son acted like idiots.

    Because they are idiots, which is why this becomes an international media sensation and a sterling opportunity to hammer whitey and further compromise his rights.

    Likely there’s a history in the neighborhood of just this kind of ‘casing the joints’ before burglaries and we’ll never hear about that, or Arbery’s history, or anything else that might compromise the Narrative.

    But we can expose just a little bit of truth here and there without deciding to die on this particular hill.

    • Replies: @hooodathunkit
  45. nebulafox says:

    Can’t we all just agree that murder is bad?

    Yes, I get the media is only interested in certain kinds of murders: after all, your typical 13 year old black girl who gets hit by a stray bullet in South Chicago is no more likely to make the news than the Marinos or Zemir Begic or a Korean grocer being targeted by a South LA mob or Craig Hicks when it turned out he was an atheist with vaguely left-wing politics rather than the redneck Jesus-loving good ‘ol boy the MSM initially counted. But call me old fashioned or not down with the times: I don’t understand why this is so difficult. Murder is wrong. It should be punished. The race of the victim and the race of the perp doesn’t matter. End of story. And regardless of Arbery’s background, I have yet to see any evidence that McMichaels deserves any sympathy for a “citizen’s arrest” gone wrong where someone ended up dead. That’s manslaughter at the least, possibly murder. I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same. And I probably wouldn’t have ended up shot: let’s be real about this.

  46. ATate says:
    @Meretricious

    My thoughts exactly. Although if you follow that thread/thought seriously, there’s immense doubt it’s actually our host(s) in disguise.

    But if you’d have told me that Steve would react like he has to COVID-19 I’d have called you a liar. So now anythings up for “interpretation”.

  47. @brabantian

    The 1986 FBI shootout in Miami is fascinating. Somewhere I have the FOIA FBI report on it. I also read a shot by shot account from another source (can’t remember) that included lots of detail.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  48. @brabantian

    The 1986 FBI shootout in Miami is fascinating. Somewhere I have the FOIA FBI report on it. I also read a shot by shot account from another source (can’t remember) that included lots of detail.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout

    • Replies: @craig henry
    , @V. Hickel
  49. KenH says:

    It’s almost a certainty that the media racial demagoguery and yellow journalism over the Arbery case is what motivated the black Delaware shooter to hunt down two white people and kill them especially since it came on the heels of a propaganda blitz about the Arbery shooting.

    Reverse the races and Ivanka would have treated us to a race lecture via tweet and like Steve said president Trump would attend the funeral or at minimum be personally en route to comfort any surviving family members to show black America that he really cares and should get on board the KAG train in 2020.

    Instead, Trump’s turned into Obama and his DOJ is considering possible hate crime charges when there’s zero evidence that the McMichael’s were motivated by race or intended to to have a violent confrontation with Arbery.

    • Replies: @Manfred Arcane
  50. We’re literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes! Can’t even go to a damned cemetery. Like WTF man are you kidding me?!?!?!?!?!? No man fr ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!!!! I’m sorry Marinos (Rest In Paradise) and my prayers and blessings sent to the…..

  51. Jake says:

    During the Late Obama Era cop murders by Numinous Negroes, a number of Numinous Negroes were happy to go on camera and equate cops killing a black murder or rape suspect who kept resisting arrest with violence and blacks ambushing a policeman. To hordes of blacks, those are the same in morality.

    Numinous Negroes tend to think, to reason, and then to act like not merely a combination of tantrum tossing two old with childish 10 year old with hormone-raging 16 year old, but also with the quintessential spoiled brat who expects that the ‘adults’ adore his antics for their cute entertainment value and always cover for him, always make certain he gets most of what he demands.

  52. If US are to survive as a country, the entire black-centered narrative has to go.

    Although, I don’t know any mixed-race country has, ever, lasted long (without functioning core population being at least 75%). Methinks, the only way out is a soft segregation, natural distancing which is at work in Brazil or similar countries (true, highly dysfunctional).

    I don’t see how a country which has greed as the only true glue can survive (the rest are weird religions & entertainment). Historical American culture, highbrow & lowbrow, is publicly demonized or marginalized & what is offered as the substitute is anti-white grievance mythology, with blacks and Jews as eternal saints and victims (and colored others as fellow-travelers).

    Can such a country survive for long? Despite its enormous wealth & influence? I don’t think so.

    • Agree: Harry Baldwin
  53. @Anon

    Wouldn’t the goal be not to game the thing to get a high reading, but rather to use the normal method to get a standard reading to compare to population norms?

    Depends, I suppose, on your reasons for measuring your oxygen blood saturation. If you’re after statistical comparisons, sure, measure in exactly the same way, as nearly as possible, every time. If you’re concerned about how well your breathing system is working, comparison to population norms seems beside the point. If all is well, yours should be north of 97%. Otherwise, it might be time to think about getting some medical attention. Depending, of course, on how low it is, how you’re feeling, if you’re paralyzed by fear of pathogens in the great outside world, etc.

    Before I retired, I made my living as an optical engineer by measuring things. For some quantities being measured, the effects of measurement error are equally likely to make the reported value err larger or smaller. That’s usually the case, and then you do want to try to avoid “gaming the system;” instead, you get multiple measurements and combine them (mean, median, mode, RSS, whatever’s proper), and report that combined result, along with the uncertainty, expressed perhaps as standard deviation. But some things don’t work that way. For example, you might be using an interferometer to measure wavefront error in an imaging system, such as a telescope, or a camera lens. That’s a case in which both the systematic error sources (aberration in the interferometer’s optics, for example) and the random sources (disturbances in the air in the optical path, vibration getting into the optical bench) all work to make the wavefront worse, never better. So the proper thing is to grab interferogram after interferogram until you’re satisfied that you’ve got the one with the lowest wavefront error, consistent with the impossibility of spending your whole life in the lab, and report that one. That’s not gaming the system; that’s knowing how the sources of measurement error work.

    Also, n=37 for a complicated result like “middle finger … but of dominant hand”? How many left handers were among the 37? Four?

    Testify! I’d be pretty skeptical of NY Times “Ask Well” columnist Tara Parker-Pope’s numeracy. “A close second?” How close? You’d think, if measurements on a vast volunteer (self-selected) sample of 37 (!) are worth reporting in the first place (which, probably not), the reporter could make a simple table of mean readings vs. finger choice so that her readers could judge for themselves what the significance of the variations might be.

    Sorry about the comment length. As they say, “don’t get me started.”

    • Thanks: Jim Don Bob
  54. @Charlotte Allen

    Charlotte Allen: Yes, they were idiots. What I don’t get is why they’re charged with murder rather than some sort of manslaughter. As I see it, the affair illustrates one of the downsides of being armed with guns. There’s no “low” or “medium” setting on the dang things. Once the two got grappling with each other, it wouldn’t have been easy to come to a nonlethal ending.

  55. @The Alarmist

    Jesse Jackson 30 years ago said that black people can’t be racist because they don’t have the power. Whatever that means.

    • LOL: Hibernian
  56. @Charlotte Allen

    I’m gonna answer you by quoting myself from another comment on another thread.

    “Speaking of Arbery; recently some photos in the news have showed black males well armed with assault rifles parading down a street somewhere in Georgia in protest. What if the situation were reversed and a white guy were to run out onto the street and attempt to wrestle a rifle away from one of these righteous warriors? What would we expect the black guy to do? What would we accept as his rightful response? Let him take it away? And so on. I think you get the picture.“

    Once again; Arbery did not have to run towards the guy holding the gun. He could simply have turned right and run off the road or he could have stopped and turned back. Not only did he make no atttempt to avoid conflict, but he initiated it.

    What about that is so hard to understand? How can the white guy be guilty of murder when he was trying to keep his assailant from taking his gun away from him? All the rest is simply irrelevant. It’s not illegal in Georgia to stand in the middle of the street with a gun in your hands.

  57. Rich says:
    @nebulafox

    You may be unaware of the extremely high number of both violent and property crimes committed by black males. It’s insanely disproportionate to their population levels. Blacks are notorious for casing quiet White neighborhoods to not only steal, but to rape. There was a report of a black Male breaking into a house in their neighborhood and these two brave men decided to do what was once very common, confront the thief. Nowadays, because most of you grow up in “safe” neighborhoods and grow soft as a result, you are unaware of what actual men do when a criminal prowls through their town.
    I also can’t help but wonder if you’d react the same way, dismissing a criminal’s past behavior, if he was White. You “goodwhites” have been completely brainwashed into always sympathizing with the negro. It’s very sad.

  58. njguy73 says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Steve, you wrote a piece entitled Racial Revenge.

    I got two words and a number for you: Crown. Heights. 1991.

  59. @Achmed E. Newman

    Again, I do not rate an automated LOL, nor a “thanks.” So, manually: LOL! Thanks!

  60. Anon[269] • Disclaimer says:

    This incident is similar to the Covington Kids incident, in that left-wing stereotypes of white non-left wingers caused their brains to short circuit.

    In the case of the Covington Kids, it was the smug white boy face, reeking of privilege. You didn’t even have to know any facts to know he was a Nazi. The video image capture was enough evidence.

    In the case of this father and son duo, they look like homely, overweight Southern klansmen, and they have guns and drive pickups. Forget about any questions about the timeline or the facts or who did what when or the black jogger aesthetic of khaki cargo shorts hip-hop jogging wear. The images of the father and son in the video image capture and mug shots is enough evidence.

    By the way, the local paper, the Brunswick News, if you catch the articles before they go behind the paywall, is quite good on the facts. They had the additional video information before anyone else (simply by making the effort to read the prosecutor’s statement, a public record), and they had some hilarious quotes from the victim’s mom, including to the effect that she “didn’t think he had commited any crime on that particular day.”

    • Replies: @Obamahotep
  61. megabar says:
    @Anonymous

    The one big difference — and it is significant — is that AA was not immediately threatening anybody at the time the McMichaels decided to act.

    My best guess is that AA was casing the property, and the MM duo’s intent was to detain AA until the cops got there, and AA’s actions were the ones that that committed this incident to be a tragedy.

    But it’s probably true that the MMs, by grabbing and brandishing their guns, escalated the situation and made death a more likely outcome.

    Incidentally, it’s possible that if everyone acted the way the MMs did, we’d have far less crime, and a bit more death. Is that a worthy tradeoff? It depends on the numbers involved. 1 more death for no crime, obviously yes. 10x the deaths for 5% reduction in crime, obviously no.

  62. nebulafox says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    BTW, your post from back on November on how Europe started to recover in 1000 AD: I’ve done some-very basic, not doctoral level stuff obviously-studying of the period, and I fully agree with you now: my view was overly simplistic and didn’t really account for the profound differences between Europe during the Dark Ages and the classical medieval period, to say the least, as well as the degree of continuity with the Renaissance. It’s also not hard to detect a lot of “Western distinctiveness” originating from around the same time period. Very fascinating stuff that I plan on going into deeper detail on in the next few years.

    I just get annoyed on how Byzantium always seems to get the shaft in being remembered and appreciated, whether you are talking to liberals or conservatives. Even at the pits during the 700s, Constantine V was writing eruditely on theology and political administration when he wasn’t busy campaigning, at a time where Charlemagne was learning how to write his own name as an adult.

    • Replies: @Charlotte Allen
  63. Thought exercise – assume that all the video you have seen of Ahmaud is accurate and true – the shooting played out with his attack, the gun was discharged unintentionally, and he was in fact casing/robbing the houses.

    Also assume that one or more of the “hunters” are guilty of hate crimes.

    What believable scenario can you construct to explain this evidence, again, assuming Ahmaud was a petty criminal AND the ruralistos are guilty of state or federal hate crimes.

  64. @nebulafox

    Can’t we all just agree that murder is bad?

    Sure, murder as defined as the actus reus of causing the unlawful death of someone with the requisite mens rea of wanting to do so or, to a lesser degree, with a sufficient degree of foreseeable negligence is a wrong that must be punished.

    Running over someone while trying to flee for one’s own safety is manslaughter at best under Virginia law, punishable by a few years in prison at most rather than several centuries, so the guy got railroaded for the sake of politics, The punishment here is the greater wrong vis à vis the larger society.

  65. @Knowingbetter

    “Men of Color are usually interested in having romantic relations with white girls.”

    Okay Tiny, let’s make a deal; “men of color” get all the black and White women, White men get all the Asian and Hispanic women.

    Everyone wins!

  66. @nebulafox

    “I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same. And I probably wouldn’t have ended up shot: let’s be real about this.”

    You would have rushed an armed man with a shotgun, punched him in the face and tried to take it? And you believe he wouldn’t have shot you because of your race? So he would have been like “here’s my gun fellow white man.”

    How are you a poster on here? LMFAO

    • Agree: Redman, Stan d Mute
  67. Pericles says:

    I’ve read that this brouhaha also is useful for getting the dropped prosecution of Gen. Flynn out of the news. Whew!

    • Replies: @Peripatetic Commenter
  68. Jack D says:
    @Knowingbetter

    Who engages in white flight and gentrification?

    It’s bad when white people leave the neighborhood and it’s bad when they come back again. White people are just bad, period.

  69. @megabar

    I don’t recall the exact wording of the GA statute, and I’m too lazy to look it up, but I believe these guys had to catch AA in the act of committing a felony. Tracking him down after committing a felony is at best a grey area. These guys are toast in the current environment: As unlawful death was reasonably foreseeable when brandishing a shotgun, second degree murder or its equivalent is not hard to make, but I’d be surprised, given the narrative about how the father knew AA was a bad guy, if they don’t get first degree murder. Does that qualify for the chair or needle in GA?

    • Replies: @Richard B
  70. Phoenix1 says:

    The press does care if they insite crimes against whites. If someone was to say that that was part of the plan, I wouldn’t argue.

    The media has blatantly lied so bad about this case that I wonder if the FCC would have grounds to intervene based on public safety and the public interest in general. Anyone know anything about the subject?

    There’s no way of maintaining any type of free society when the media has turned completely into an unregulated propaganda machine with the capability to reach virtually everyone, while censoring dissident voices into irrelevancey.

  71. megabar says:
    @Peter Johnson

    > These two difficult facts are increasing obvious to those willing to take a hard and honest look at the evidence, but anathema to the worldview of many people including a vast majority of those working in the media.

    At the end of the day, I think this is the central issue of Western society — we reject reality.

    That some component of the striation of the races is innate; that men and women are different; that gender dysphoria is a mental disorder; that a homogeneous society has advantages over multiculturalism, and so forth.

    I think it’s overly simplistic to say we do this because we’re rich enough to afford it, though that’s part of it. I think it also has to do with the structure of our society, which permits activists to hold the megaphone.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  72. Jack D says:
    @Hugo Silva

    accept the Supremacy of the liberal Managerial State because only after Liberals achieved total victory will they be willing to consider that there could be something wrong with their policies.

    Ask the people of Venezuela how that is working out for them. When Leftist measures go wrong, to a Leftist that just means that they haven’t been applied rigorously enough and it is necessary to redouble your efforts in the name of achieving perfect equality.

    • Agree: JMcG
    • Replies: @International Jew
  73. The media aren’t helping, but the root cause is TNB in the DNA.

  74. Jack D says:
    @megabar

    we do this because we’re rich enough to afford it,

    Democrat governors say, “Too rich? No problem. I hereby proclaim all profit making activities to be illegal. Oh, and Federal government, could you cut us a check for $3,000,000,000,000.00 please since we can no longer skim the profits of private business.”

    • Agree: Desiderius
    • Replies: @Jus' Sayin'...
  75. @nebulafox

    “let’s be real about this.”

    And let’s be real about this boomer, we’re in the mess we’re in because of people like you talking about moral equivalence when we’re in a fucking race war.

    • Agree: Stan d Mute
  76. black sea says:
    @Jack D

    He hates us coming and going.

  77. @Hugo Silva

    No.

    That’s not how this works.

    They want you gone.

  78. Currahee says:
    @Tono Bungay

    Well, yes indeed.
    But the Negro Delusion Bubble is massive and seemingly impenetrable.

  79. @Knowingbetter

    It’s good to have the old TD back again, sounding just authentic enough but so over the top as to be a perfect lampoon of non-White, prog duckspeak https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/duckspeak

  80. @Anon

    Anon, I bought a Pulse Oximeter when they were first mentioned here at iSteve’s (Walmart $39 plus tax) I take my readings from my left index finger just like they do at my doctor’s office, But I tried different fingers and got a range of 97 to 99, hardly a big difference. And wouldn’t the third finger of my dominant, right, hand be my ring finger? Next up on the NYT::” Pulse Oximeters deserts and does skin color tilt your PO reading?”

    • Replies: @Desiderius
  81. @Charlotte Allen

    My intellectual compass is predicated on judging working-class whites, and their desire to protect their modest plots of land.

    If the races were reversed in Abery-McMichaels — and it were a Black father and son who shot a repeat-felon White methhead looking to steal copper — it would be kind of quaint, since it means the father is still in the home. It would give me the same feeling that I get when I donate to charter schools.

    • LOL: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  82. Dan Smith says:
    @Tono Bungay

    Yes! That is why so many East African distance runners are gunned down each year by gun-toting Bubbas in pickup trucks.

  83. @nebulafox

    Please.

    The reality you can’t bring yourself to face is why we’re talking about this in the first place.

    Coward.

    • Agree: Neuday
    • Replies: @nebulafox
  84. “But controlling the media means that you also don’t learn from your mistakes.”

    Mr. Sailer, is this not just a restatement of the Taranto Principle?

    https://www.nysun.com/opinion/the-taranto-principle/86573/

  85. Seneca44 says:

    The Peter like attempt by the English family, who owns the house under construction that the late Mr. Arbery was casing, to deny any association with this entire incident is interesting. They hired an attorney who is obviously a local yokel and not one of the polished race baiters we will see on national news for many news cycles. Anyway, the interview with this attorney is hilarious as she makes it clear that the English family is on the side of the Goodwhites and that nothing was ever stolen from their property. I guess they installed a video camera with a motion sensor just for entertainment value. I suspect that the McMichael’s defense attorney will find that things were indeed stolen from that property and that there are police reports to document it.

    It is very obvious and understandable that the English family does not want to be doxxed by TPTB and definitely does not want a figurative cross burned in their yard by the new Klan by different letters such as BLM, NAACP, SPLC, etc.

  86. @Buffalo Joe

    The point is to detect whether you’re heading south of 95% (really 90%, but 95 tells you to start paying attention). People were showing up at the hospital in the 50s, which shouldn’t even be possible.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
  87. Paul Kersey here at Unz reliably points out these black-on-white atrocities, and sure enough he’s already on the Delaware slaughter along with Steve. But the same superficial and slanted news outlets that warned me “outrage was building” over the Georgia killing have made no mention of these whites getting offed.

  88. @nebulafox

    You should read Mr. Richburg’s whole book, NF, Out of America, reviewed conveniently for you by Peak Stupidity right here – Part 1 and Part 2

  89. @Anon

    No doubt they will only use them when the cameras are rolling just like these guys:

  90. @black sea

    It is interesting that the most heinous White on Black crimes they can come up with always involve blacks who are up to no good at the time.

  91. @Charlotte Allen

    I think you nailed it. Usually in cases like this, juries will give the idiots who start the incident some benefit of doubt. Prosecutors know this and usually try to rollover cases like this with lenient plea deals.

    In response The MSM have taken to organizing what amount to legalized lynchings, at least in the rare cases where the person who ends up dead is a Negro, prog, or some other protected class and the persons who kill him are White.

  92. Cortes says:

    Wide publicity for the Marino cemetery killings would be potentially catastrophic for morale among serving military personnel and their families, I imagine. Let’s hope that focused investigation of the incident will be possible to get to the likely motive or motives behind such a dreadful event.

  93. JosephB says:
    @Hugo Silva

    This approach might work in a racially homogeneous society. While homogeneous, Sweden learned welfare states have inherent problems. With the influx of Muslim immigrants, they’re realizing the problems of racially heterogeneous societies fairly early in the game.

    I’m not at all optimistic their lessons can be learned in the US at this point.

  94. nebulafox says:
    @Desiderius

    No, I’m just honest enough to not buy into ideology at the expense of denying reality, something truly omnipresent all over the political spectrum in the modern United States. If some jumped up idiot with delusions of grandeur tried to pull “a citizen’s arrest” on me for trespassing on his yard without warning-no asking me to leave-I’d attack him or flee. Under arrest from what authority? And if he’s toting a shotgun, I’d assume he’s deeply psychotic and do whatever it takes to get out alive.

    Was Arbery the misunderstood saint the MSM is trying to portray him as? No: he had a criminal record. But the only crime he committed at the time of the video was, at most, petty trespassing: the truth is, we have no idea what was going through his mind, anymore than anyone else does. Maybe he was planning a burglary, and maybe he was just jogging. Doesn’t matter. Going Leeroy Jenkins on unwanted lawn guests in broad daylight because they *might* be planning further crimes works great in movies, but in real life can lead to off-script consequences. In this case, it will: and the McMichaels deserve it.

    Seems as though everybody believes in “innocent until proven guilty”, until they don’t.

  95. @Jack D

    I’m terrified that our ruling class has apparently surrendered to the notion that printing and distributing trillions (perhaps to be quadrillions within our lifetimes) of dollars is the solution to every problem. Governments that do this inevitably destroy their currency and economy, inflict untold miseries on their citizens, and eventually fail in some violent way. IMHO, our current ruling class is already far enough down this path that very soon there will be no turning back. The last straw will be the $2,000 per person per month guaranteed income that is even now being seriously bruited about inside and outside the Beltway.

  96. anonymous[400] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox

    your typical 13 year old black girl who gets hit by a stray bullet in South Chicago is no more likely to make the news than the Marinos or Zemir Begic or a Korean grocer

    No, they make a big deal about black kids getting hit by stray bullets here in Chicago. It’s the lead story on the nightly news whenever it happens and they spend plenty of time agonizing about it. Begic or some Arab grocer not much at all. They even named a park after a 15 year old black girl, Pendleton Park, who was hit and killed by a stray bullet. Don’t have to do much to get something named after you, no discoveries or explorations, just be black and get killed by chance. Shootings are continuing apace so there’s always new material for the media to work with.

  97. @megabar

    If police triage property crimes and “suspicious persons” downward, and if every Vibrant Body is paid to exist and can wander wherever they want, then inevitably communal borders will be enforced by McMichaels with shotguns.

    You see, what the owners in that subdivision should have done is sell their homes to the next suckers in the US FIRE/Ponzi scheme and mortgaged themselves to the hilt to price away the Diversity somewhere else. But they can’t; homes in that subdivision are valued around $270K. It’s too downscale for buyers who can move to the Golden Isles where there’s one long highway in and out, and over-priced relative to the demographics on the shore side. That’s why the people living there are retired cops and blue collars who’ve sunk every penny they have. They like the hunting and fishing, the coastal cachet, and it’s warm and the taxes are low. They’ve “arrived,” and there’s nowhere else to go.

    It will all end in tears.

  98. craig henry says: • Website
    @Steve Sailer

    That’s a great book. Hunter and his researcher really did a fine job with the details and mechanics of that gunfight.

  99. @nebulafox

    tl;dr

    I can’t believe you of all people are falling for this.

    Completely unreal.

    This is why we can’t have nice things.

    Split the difference-ism now the strongest force known to man. MUST.BE.ABOVE.IT.ALL. They’re destroying your country empowered by your own vanity.

    If you think I’m talking about some ideology for God’s sake pull your head out of your ass. Why in the world would I care about some random case in podunk Georgia. I don’t let people who hate me decide what I care about. Why do you?

    • Replies: @nebulafox
  100. You gotta admit that some whites are asking for trouble. This was on facebook, on the supermarket’s own review page, and her name really is Karen:

    Karen Heckmann I went to Tops in Carmel, NY yesterday and two customers were not wearing masks. I was yelling at them where is your fn masks. I want to sucker punch them, so told one of the employees about this and they said they can’t make customers wear masks. I am so fn done with Tops Friendly Markets and they still have no toilet paper,paper towels etc.

    • Replies: @Harry Baldwin
  101. Anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox

    I have yet to see any evidence that McMichaels deserves any sympathy for a “citizen’s arrest” gone wrong where someone ended up dead. That’s manslaughter at the least, possibly murder. I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same.

    Arbery attacked them and was trying to shoot one of them.

  102. @Desiderius

    Desi, Thank you and the PO comes with instructions so the average person doesn’t need to be looking for a “better” reading, just one that stays in the norms. I would think at 50% or less your toe nails and finger nails would be blue black. Stay safe.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
  103. @nebulafox

    Yes, Byzantine civilization was extraordinary–and it’s way misunderstood and under-appreciated, partly because so few people learn Greek and so are able to read the records. Its writers produced not just theology but magnificent poetry and chivalric romances. The Byzantines had a sophisticated legal system based on Roman law, although going in a different direction from Justinian’s code. Constantinople was known for its shipbuilding and military strategy. Hagia Sophia isn’t just an architectural masterpiece but an acoustic wonder, as acoustics specialists are only now discovering. We owe it to Byzantine scribes for all the classical Greek literature that we have–and Byzantine artists also carried on the classical, naturalistic artistic tradition when using Greek-mythological themes in their carvings. The food alone in Constantinople must have been great. Most of today’s Greek/Turkish dishes, such as moussaka, are actually Byzantine in origin.

    I don’t know much about Charlemagne’s own literacy level, but he did fill his court with learned monks (from England, such as Alcuin) who introduced classical education to Europe and also the rigorous study of Latin grammar; Latin writing had become quite sloppy during the preceding couple of centuries.

  104. Anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    And frankly, if some rando non-cop with a gun trained on me tried to stop me on a public road by telling me I was “under arrest,” I’d say, “Eff you!” And I’d feel perfectly justified in punching him out and grabbing the gun, if I could.

    At that point you’ve used a firearm to put them in reasonable fear for their lives and you’ve basically forced them to shoot you.

  105. nebulafox says:
    @Anonymous

    But here’s the thing: Brock Turner was a spoiled little prick (trust me, I have personal grounds for knowing this) who, when needing to assert his truthfulness, repeatedly lied to the court about his prior alcohol and drug use when he tried to use lack of experience with alcohol as an alibi. The dude was found on top of an unconscious lady behind a dumpster: odd place to be giving a lady CPR. Yes, plenty of innocent college-age males are accused falsely of sexual assault and aren’t given the same “innocent until proven guilty” treatment-something that used to be a hallmark of our legal system-that Joe Biden, one of the authors of those measures, now hypocritically demands for himself. That doesn’t translate automatically into Turner being innocent, nor does it mean that there weren’t any sexual assault problems with campus culture *at all*, before the Left inflated and twisted a real issue in service of their ideology.

    Jesus Christ, you people really need to learn that just because someone is being attacked by the media because they fit Their Narrative doesn’t mean they are worth defending. McMichaels, Turner, really? There are enough innocent people who actually deserve to be defended against the PC lynch mobs that you don’t need to make excuses for people who actually did bad things.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @AnotherDad
  106. craig henry says: • Website
    @Captain Tripps

    This is a pretty good book by the FBI agent who ended the gunfight.

    • Thanks: Captain Tripps
  107. When the bad guys get in trouble they can always rely on the fact that what we all really care about in our heart of hearts is that no one mistakes us for a redneck and that we’ll chase that goddamned squirrel all the live long day.

  108. @Buffalo Joe

    You too, man. You’re good people.

    A little scary here being immune suppressed but nice of everyone to leave the great outdoors to me and my boys.

  109. @Hugo Silva

    Being liberal means never admitting your wrong.

    • Replies: @Hugo Silva
  110. @nebulafox

    Exactly. Why, just the other day, I was on my customary hammer-jog through what some philistines might call “the hood,” stopping to admire the interiors of all the cars along the way. (I am a car buff). I soon found myself accosted by several angry young lads (some of them quite strapping, let me tell you) who said, and I will attempt to quote, “Get yo pasty white cracka ass outta heah!,” followed by a term I dare not repeat on this family forum.

    Well, you can imagine my dudgeon at their effrontery. I quickly pulled out my copies of Locke’s Treatises and LaFave’s Substantive Criminal Law and proceeded to give them all a good talking-to. Jackanapes!

    • Replies: @RSDB
  111. Mr Mox says:

    Scott Adams tested/trolled the twitterati after the AA incident. Many took the bait.

  112. nebulafox says:
    @Desiderius

    Etiam si omnes, ego non. I refuse to be dragged down to their level and respond to identity politics with counter-identity politics: that can be a road to a true, vicious hell that most Americans cannot contemplate in their worst nightmare. If it were up to me, all identity politics-regardless of origin-would be neutered.

    I call things as I see them. I’m not always right, but I’m always genuine, and I don’t let anybody dictate what I think. Clear?

    • Agree: utu
  113. Redman says:
    @nebulafox

    Would you have attacked a guy asking you to stop with a shotgun in his hand? I’m assuming no, since that is simply idiocy any way you look at it.

    If you did, I’m sure you would end up dead too. To me that’s this silly whole story in a nutshell and everything else is window dressing.

  114. @nebulafox

    I refuse to be dragged down to their level and respond to identity politics with counter-identity politics

    You may not be interested in identity politics but identity politics is interested in you!

  115. Anonymous[220] • Disclaimer says:
    @Captain Tripps

    The 1986 FBI shootout in Miami is fascinating. Somewhere I have the FOIA FBI report on it. I also read a shot by shot account from another source (can’t remember) that included lots of detail.

    Yeah, this case is a textbook case at Quantico and every new FBI recruit learns about it in training.

    You can get the made-for-TV movie about this shootout on YouTube (free). This was a great movie that made a huge impression on me when it came out. I once had a [one-month] job driving an armored car full of money around the time of the shootout. This is a very well-done movie with great acting (stars David Soul and Michael Gross).

    In the Line of Duty: The F.B.I. Murders (NBC, 1988)

    • Thanks: Captain Tripps
  116. JosephB says:
    @nebulafox

    The video really is a Rorschach inkblot: you can use it to justify whatever ideological bias you have. I certainly concur that a video of someone charging at two men with guns is a reasonable action if you think they’re hunting you. Even Derbyshire, someone who is usually level headed, hasn’t keyed into that aspect.

    That said, we have a guy with priors and limited information in that we don’t know what happened out of frame of the video (and no sound). It’s probably manslaughter, but I could imagine a good defense attorney arguing all kinds of things.

    • Replies: @Redman
    , @Hippopotamusdrome
  117. OT:

    Sumo wrestler outbreak news (from the SF Chronicle):

    SUMO WRESTLER DIES: A 28-year-old Japanese sumo wrestler died Wednesday from the coronavirus. Shoubushi, whose real name was Kiyotaka Suetake, is the first sumo wrestler known to have died from the virus and is among the youngest victims in Japan. He developed a fever on April 4 but could not get a test or find a hospital until four days later. Japan has set a very high bar for testing due to a lack of capacity. Avoiding close contact with others is a challenge in sumo, where wrestlers live together and train and eat together. Several other wrestlers have also been infected. The Summer Grand Sumo Tournament scheduled to start May 24 was canceled earlier this month.

  118. Dave3 says:

    Considering your chances of getting a fair trial, your best bet in dealing with “joggers” is to shoot, shovel, and shut up. And live in a rural area where people shoot guns all the time.

    Racism will prevail because it is essential for long-term survival. If you think your DNA is nothing special, why bother having children? The Anglo-Jewish progressive liberalism that presently holds the whip over us is contracepting itself out of existence. Thus North America reverts to tribalism, solving the woman problem, the nigger problem, and the Jew problem in one fell swoop.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  119. Jack D says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    He was spotted by the father and son at the construction site peering into a window of an unfinished house

    He did much more than that. He entered into the house and walked around. However, he did not take anything (that was visible to the security camera that recorded it all). Maybe that’s because he didn’t see anything worth taking (that he could carry in his own hands and jog home with and not get stopped – most joggers don’t have a good explanation for why they are carrying a chop saw on their back).

    That being said, it was at most criminal trespass. It was not a good idea for father and son to take it upon themselves to make a citizen’s arrest for such a minor crime and it was an even less good idea to shoot him unless they can prove that they were acting in self-defense (the video of the shooting doesn’t look promising in that regard). Citizen’s arrest is lawful in GA but as you can see, even if they get off from the murder claim (and it’s not clear that they will) they have bought themselves a whole lot of bother and cost for very little gain. They should have just let the cops handle this. Given that he didn’t take anything, Arbergy would have gotten off with a ticket or maybe even just a warning. I confess that (long ago – the statute of limitations has already expired) I may have once or twice visited houses under construction just out of curiosity and I am glad that nobody killed me for doing so.

  120. res says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    And frankly, if some rando non-cop with a gun trained on me tried to stop me on a public road by telling me I was “under arrest,” I’d say, “Eff you!” And I’d feel perfectly justified in punching him out and grabbing the gun, if I could.

    So you would charge someone holding a gun while someone else with a gun covers him?

    Even by the typical standards of “internet tough guys” that is hilarious.

    This 35 minute video provides a thoughtful discussion of the incident. It also gives substantial background for anyone who wants to be informed to discuss the incident with others.

    For those with a short attention span, this 13 second video shows Arbery charging McMichael.

    P,S, I would be interested to hear what the Arbery apologists here (Looks like Charlotte Allen, Hugo Silva, nebulafox, and JosephB; any others? TD or his doppleganger in the first comment is not worth engaging with) have to say after watching these videos.

  121. @nebulafox

    I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same. And I probably wouldn’t have ended up shot: let’s be real about this.

    You don’t think there is a real possibility that you would be shot in a situation where you attack someone who believes that you are a burglar, and also try to take his gun? My guess is that if Arbery had kept walking, the police would have been called.

    • Replies: @anon
  122. @Hypnotoad666

    Nonzero chance it’s some kind of elaborate psyop toward that purpose. I’m not falling for it again, whatever it is.

    Our adversaries are saying “this is what we should be talking about.” If you say “no it’s not” you’ve already lost. If you start talking about it you’re aiding and abetting. Unwittingly is the whole point.

    Time to get your wits about you.

    As usual Steve is leading the way. They bring a knife you bring a gun. Only way this gets better.

  123. res says:
    @nebulafox

    Please watch the video I linked. It is clear you don’t know the background of this. And shooting off your mouth while making multiple incorrect assumptions just makes you look like an idiot who is dumb enough to uncritically believe the media narrative.

  124. res says:
    @nebulafox

    I call things as I see them. I’m not always right, but I’m always genuine, and I don’t let anybody dictate what I think. Clear?

    An admirable sentiment. Even more admirable when one is willing to take the time to be informed about the things they are calling. And most admirable of all when one is willing to admit to being wrong after learning more about a situation.

  125. Whiskey says: • Website

    Steve – Remember Soon Da Jue and Latasha Harlins?

    It has long been a point of law that Black people have a right to steal your stuff. And use deadly force if anyone resists.

    This is the law.

    Also, since OJ it has been the law that Black people have the right if angry to kill any White person for any reason.

    This is also the law.

    These laws have held during a non Depression era. Stuff could be replaced.

    Now it can’t. Lose your car you may never get another.

    We rapidly approach civil war, hot version.

    Money papers over conflicts. And we ran out of money.

  126. @res

    res,

    You’re falling into the same trap they are. For our purposes the first and last word in their defense is the presumption of innocence.

    We have the right to remain silent. We have duty to return fire in kind. Follow Steve’s lead.

  127. @Hypnotoad666

    In all of the cases I can think of that caused a national outcry, whether a policeman was exonerated or disciplined, or even convicted of murder, the black “victim” caused his own death by resisting arrest or failing to obey police orders. Regardless of the legality of a policeman’s actions, the only sensible response to someone legally empowered to use lethal force against you is to comply — but no, the black “victims” always refused to comply!

  128. International Jew [AKA "Hebrew National"] says:
    @Jack D

    Americans should be paying a lot more attention to Venezuela. We still have this idea that we’ll always be a rich country. Venezuela shows how far and fast a rich country can fall.

    • Agree: Joseph Doaks
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    , @epochehusserl
  129. Anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    it was an even less good idea to shoot him unless they can prove that they were acting in self-defense (the video of the shooting doesn’t look promising in that regard)

    Arbery charged them, punched one of the men multiple times in the head, and tried to take one of their guns and shoot them.

  130. @nebulafox

    I agree with most of your points, but I think that you miss something important here — not in the incident itself (which you have described fairly) but rather in the follow-on media blitz turning this unfortunate little incident into a headline-grabbing multi-day crusade against the white power structure murdering innocent blacks out jogging. Rather, it was two working class white men messing up badly by confronting someone who may or may not have been casing houses for burglary (assume not, to keep it simple). Just a random dumb slip-up in a world full of random dumb slip-ups every day. Meanwhile, young black men murder whites at a shockingly disproportionate rate, and never a wimper from the media. The media want to create a vision of a world that does not exist, in which the faults of the black underclass (which are actually genetically caused at the deepest level of explanation) are the fault of the white power structure. So it is part of a subconscious media campaign to create a false vision of the world. You miss that in your discussion, and that is the main problem that Sailer is addressing here, not the details of the incident.

    • Agree: Joseph Doaks
  131. Nebula: we’ve stopped beating our wives, it’s those dirty white trash rednecks who are the problem, as usual. Honest, occifer!

    res: no, look at this, looks like their wives had it coming

    Me: where’s the probable cause?

    • Replies: @res
  132. @Steve Sailer

    Thanks for the re-up of that classic.

    “Torresola and Collazo, apparently decided to move the assassination up five days and headed for Washington. This acceleration of the schedule probably kept it from succeeding”

    One downside of the assassination’s failure: if it had succeeded, might the US have done what it should have in 1898 and cut PR loose?

    I like Truman as much as the next guy, but as you point out, the annexation of Puerto Rico has probably been a net negative for both countries. Therefore one can countenance losing Truman if the lives of many anons are saved.

    But probably independence wouldn’t have happened. Rather the reverse: the assassination would have solidified resolve to “keep” Puerto Rico even though no one could any longer articulate the reason it was necessary. After all, to do anything else would be “letting the terrorists win”.

    Puerto Rican annexation and the coronavirus response share a leitmotif with many other government policies: an early semi-rational action partly succeeds and partly fails. (In the era of unstable global hegemony, a strongpoint east of the Panama made some sense for coal-fueled ships. Facing an infection of ambiguous virality, preemptive quarantines are a drill in prudence.) But as the benefit of success diminishes, and the cost of failure increases, those who implemented the initial semi-rational policy gradually double-, triple-, and quadruple-down on it even as the benefits evaporate and the costs escalate. As the status quo becomes increasingly fragile and nonsensical, correspondingly increasing measures must be taken to ensure its continuation, lest the admission of any small error expose the existence of—and responsibility for—much larger calamity.

    There should probably be a name for this process.

    Puerto Rican annexation, the coronavirus response, the War on Terror, the welfare state, Civil Rights™ legislation, affirmative action, tax code elaboration, immigration, etc., the pattern is eternal.

    God save us all from big government solutions.

  133. donut says:
    @brabantian

    I read a comment somewhere by a police officer . He said he had aced every training exercise and range requirement . Then he and some other officers got into a real gunfight with some bad men . He said that training went right out the window and they were all just blasting away . At one point his clip was empty he says he was aware that his gun needed a new clip in a vague way but he kept on pulling the trigger rather than reload . His point was that nothing can prepare you that life or death moment except being in one and surviving it .

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
  134. Redman says:
    @Jack D

    Police are essentially reactionary to crimes already committed. Some police are better than others at responding to a reported crime. IMO- Actual crime prevention is more a function of citizen involvement and trust, not policing. In places where guns are legal, that likely increases the importance of citizen crime enforcement and prevention (knowing not just police are armed has a deterrent effect on criminal conduct).

    I’m no cop and have never held a gun. But I lived in NYC for 30 years, and have stopped several crimes and tried to stop several others unsuccessfully. My 5’4″ mother broke up a mugging of a 5’1″ Asian deliver man by screaming at the top of her lungs, scaring off 3 young black hoods. I would hope others would be brave enough to do the same for me.

    Neither you or I know much of anything about the McMichaels at this point. The only thing I know is what I saw in the video: a young black man running full boar at a white man holding a shotgun. Would seem to be a very poor choice by Mr. Arbury. Everything else surrounding this is pabulum from the usual suspects in the race hustling MSM.

    • Replies: @anon
  135. Neuday says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    And frankly, if some rando non-cop with a gun trained on me tried to stop me on a public road by telling me I was “under arrest,” I’d say, “Eff you!” And I’d feel perfectly justified in punching him out and grabbing the gun, if I could. People are under no obligation to submit to being stopped by armed randos, “citizen’s arrest” or no “citizen’s arrest.”

    When confronted by an armed robber, are you equally as brave? After reading your comment I scrolled up to see your name. “Charlotte”; another bias confirmed.

    • Replies: @Charlotte Allen
  136. The Democrat media love talking about Gold Star parents, but only if the parent is some Muslim guy waving his pocket Constitution in our faces and scolding us that we don’t understand it.

  137. Anonymous[349] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox

    You misunderstood the post. It’s not about praising Brock Turner. It’s about showing how ridiculous it would be if we did.

  138. Separate nations.

    Minoritarianism–minorities good, suffering, virtuous; majorities bad, oppressive, evil–has poisoned the well. Blacks–higher time preference, lower IQ, conscientiousness, cooperation relative to whites–are going to be more criminal. But this sort of racial revenge stuff comes from 50+ years of minoritarianism carefully cultivating black grievance against the white majority.

    The plain reality is the fringe–blacks, Jews, muslims, Mexicans, Asians, immigrants, homos, trannies, cat ladies, etc. etc.–lives, and lives well!, off of the nation’s “white bread” core.

    We in the core do not need any of these people. White gentiles have created the most prosperous and pleasant–or at least “used to be pleasant”–nations on the earth. (Not in any way dissing fine efforts by others.)

    We simply do not require “the fringe”. We do not require their labor. We aren’t “oppressing” them–at all. (All these people are coddled.)

    Americans willing to adopt to the norms and culture of the American white gentile core–i.e. assimilate–and put shoulder to wheel … no issue.

    “Americans” who want to bitch and whine about their imaginary “oppression” or who spout nonsense–“diversity is our greatest strength”, “nation of immigrants”, “white privilege”, etc.–to try and delegitimize my people and the nation my ancestors built… there’s the door.

    Separate nations.

    If the American white gentile core is actually the “oppressive” problem then the fringe should have no issues with cutting them loose. Right? So what’s the hold up?

    C’mon minorities … you have nothing to lose but your chains!

    • Agree: Anonymous Jew
    • Replies: @anon
  139. Truth says:

    Hold your horses Steve!

    A friend of mine with the Delaware state police gave me the REAL scoop:

    He said the two old white people went to the cemetary without wearing masks which put the lives of untold people in danger. The good Samaritan attempted his social responsibility which was to kindly remind them that their behavior was selfish as well as possibly against statute, and he did it in the correct way with his loaded 9mm pointed at the while he admonished them.

    They became irate, at which point they were breaking statutes for causing a public nuisance, disturbing the peace and civil unrest; at which point the citizen did what Good Americans like him do he attempted to uphold the law by attempting a citizen’s arrest.

    A struggle ensued which unfortunately resulted in the death of the two aspiring polka musicians.

  140. KenH says:
    @nebulafox

    Seems as though everybody believes in “innocent until proven guilty”, until they don’t.

    Says the guy who just judged the McMichael’s guilty just because you had a visceral reaction to the video and had your sensibilities offended.

  141. Truth says:
    @Anonymous

    Well now, one is Criminal Sexual Penetration, and one is trespassing… I mean I’m just sayin’.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  142. Anonymous[802] • Disclaimer says:

    Two possibilities:

    1/. The sub nematode ‘brains’ of the NYT/Economist media establishment are just tooo fucking dumb to realise the damage they are doing by deliberately stirring up blacks.
    2/. The are just pure evil and are deliberately doing it to inflict pain and hatred upon those whites whom they look down upon and habitually describe as ‘trash’.

    Both eminently plausible, perhaps in combination, but, on balance, I would plump for explanation #2.

  143. donut says:

    While this is an Ohio story I know that a lot of people have migrated from Ohio to Florida so “same same , five fingers one hand” as the Ni**gers overseas , correction down the block in every store I go into would tell me when they didn’t have the item I was looking for .

  144. res says:
    @Jack D

    Jack, I agree with some of that, but you are missing substantial background. Please watch the video I linked. 35 minutes is long, but it is very informative and IMHO a must watch if you want to have a serious conversation about this incident.

  145. Truth says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Well, not exactly.

    • Replies: @anonymous
    , @J1234
  146. Ragno says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Kersey and Colin Flaherty are invaluable, actual journalists. Without their tireless travails into the swamps of abject misery (even to contemplate the soul-crushing agony of The Ignored and Despised – for there is no other way to characterize the surviving family of blameless whites executed by blacks they’d never met until they were murdered by them – on a daily basis has to be damaging not only to psyche and soul, but one’s physical health as well) NO ONE would bother to note these victims’ passing, or even that they were ever here at all.

    Talk about doing a job that most Americans won’t do!

  147. res says:
    @Desiderius

    res: no, look at this, looks like their wives had it coming

    No.

    res: watch the videos

    If we want to have a substantive discussion after that, fine.

    P.S. The ironic thing is that by stating “where’s the probable cause?” without further comment you made clear you have not watched the longer video.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
  148. @Rob McX

    “The laws of physics are suspended for Hollywood shootouts and car chases.”

    Because most civilian killing by gun is close-up. Professional killers avoid cowboy situations. Michael Mann aims for a blend of reality and Hollywood and usually succeeds. Martin Scorsese is closer to the mark in two of his mob pictures: Goodfellas (1990) and the incredibly entertaining Casino (1995).

    • Replies: @Tom-in-VA
  149. Bucky says:

    And in other news, Chinese-American Weijia Jiang, who is playing her part in the multiracial coalition and accusing Trump of racism, is married to a…can we guess?

  150. Anon[204] • Disclaimer says:

    Sheldon C. Francis is the name of the shooter who killed two people, and had a 6 hour gunfight with police.

    His name is missing too much in my opinion. It needs to be repeated very often. Its a shame that Sheldon Francis would have probably had to have killed a couple of cops for this story to have been picked up begrudgingly nationally. Sheldon Francis’ computer and phone activity should be made known.

  151. Nobody seems to ask about where Arbery lived. How far away from the neighborhood where he was shot did he actually live? Brunswick isn’t a very jogger or cyclist friendly town.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    , @Art Deco
  152. Anonymous[349] • Disclaimer says:

    A few questions for legal experts: how much does Arbery’s guilt of an immediately prior crime affect the liability of the McMichaels actions?

    So many people keep saying they would have behaved just like Arbery if someone tried to detain them for police. First of all, no you wouldn’t, but secondly, it seems an entirely different ball of wax depending on whether it is a justified arrest or a false arrest; i.e. was Arbery actually guilty of a crime? Arbery’s guilt will be a hard sale now, only because he is dead by his own hand- struggle for the gun. Had he lived with minor wounds, we could expect the owner of the stolen hammer (which was thrown down) to testify. Now all attempts to prove his guilt will look petty, regardless of their truth and merit.

    Second question for legal experts- is their a legal scenario in which both sides of a given combat would be justified in using deadly force? Winner take all? Something like a 3-on-1 barfight against a drunk guy with a knife? Both sides could equally feel their life threatened. And the fight could have escalated quickly from a minor incident. How do the courts assign blame during a 5 second arms race?

  153. @res

    Even by the typical standards of “internet tough guys” that is hilarious.

    And yet it is absolutely typical of negro behavior.

    With each other, with cops, this incident, the context does not seem to matter.

  154. @Rob McX

    When they discovered the Unabomber’s tiny, home-made, no-running water cabin, the FBI took a number of days to investigate it because they were so worried about booby traps.

    However, the FBI knew at the time how high an IQ and how careful Kaczynski was, and how vicious he was, so their caution was justified.

    I’ve not heard that average criminal shootout has the same booby trap features. Is that true? And is it because they watch so many movies?

    • Replies: @Rob McX
  155. Art Deco says:
    @International Jew

    Venezuela was not a rich country. It was a middle income country with large natural resource deposits and an incompetent government.

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @JMcG
    , @Achmed E. Newman
  156. Art Deco says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    As far as I can tell from noodling around with GoogleMaps, somewhere between 8 miles and 15 miles away. It’s not clear to me whether he was entirely on foot or had a vehicle parked somewhere. By some accounts, he was carrying a hammer.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
  157. @res

    Here’s what I have to say:

    Charge someone holding a gun? You know what they say: Run toward a gun, away from a knife.

    It’s not unreasonable to charge a guy who’s holding a gun on you. In fact, some say that had the teachers in the Sandy Hook school massacre tried to charge crazy Adam Lanza, they could have saved some children’s lives.

    I watched that video again, for the umpteenth time. It does not show Arbery “chasing down” Gregory McMichael. What it shows is Arbery running toward McMichael, who holds his ground until Arbery gets to the median line, then backs up. There is a scuffle–over McMichael’s gun, presumably, and it looks as though Arbery punches McMichael (a little hard to tell–as the action has moved to the far left of the video camera).

    There were some break-ins and thefts (or at least two) in the McMichaels’ neighborhood in the months preceding the incident. There was no evidence–evidence, not suspicion–to connect Arbery with those burglaries. Old man McMichael suspected that Arbery, whom he knew had a prior theft conviction–of being the burglar, and then he saw Arbery walking through a house under construction. Maybe his suspicion was well-grounded and Arbery had been hoping to find something to steal. But suspicion–as McMichael should have known as a cop trained in proper procedure–isn’t enough to justify an arrest, even a police arrest. And trying to make an armed “citizen’s arrest” of someone whose sole crime of which you have actual evidence is misdemeanor trespassing is just plain stupid, especially for someone in law enforcement who should have known better.

    I’m not an apologist for Arbery. He was probably a no-good who had it coming. Perhaps the McMichaels will be able to make a convincing case that they feared for their lives. But legal cases aren’t decided on how unfair it is for the press to vilify white people. They’re decided on actual evidence.

    • Replies: @JMcG
    , @ThreeCranes
    , @Redman
    , @res
  158. @Jack D

    My mistake about his merely looking through a window. But even if he entered the unfinished house, the crime was trespassing. It’s not uncommon for unfinished houses to lure the curious. There was a lot of this right after the 2008 housing bust, when developers abandoned unfinished projects all over the place.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @anonymous
  159. @Hugo Silva

    Frankly I’m starting to think that BadWhites might as well give up, adopt Swedish views of what is a proper society and accept the Supremacy of the liberal Managerial State because only after Liberals achieved total victory will they be willing to consider that there could be something wrong with their policies.

    Their worldview is that white genes are the source of original sin. Where the liberal state’s policies fail to achieve utopia, they will perceive that whites genes are the problem factor. So your solution is just a route to genocide of some kind.

    • Replies: @Hugo Silva
  160. JMcG says:
    @Art Deco

    The US currently has two of those three characteristics. Currently.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  161. @Neuday

    I don’t know what you’re getting at. I was named after my paternal grandmother.

    I don’t know about my bravery, either. I did manage long ago to scare off a home-invading, knife-wielding would-be rapist by screaming a lot. The best thing to do when confronted with a criminal is to take some action if you can.

  162. JMcG says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    Who the hell says “Charge a gun?” The point of teachers charging a gun is that their deaths might save the lives of some of the children in their charge. That’s what charging a gun does.

  163. Lurker says:
    @brabantian

    It certainly highlights the ever present problem of BadWhites randomly terrorising PoC.

  164. Redman says:
    @JosephB

    We’ll never know what Aubery thought. And I highly doubt the prosecution will have any admissible evidence to support what anyone “speculates” he thought. So it’s sort of irrelevant.

    But do you think they were “hunting” him?

  165. @Inverness

    They could try **gging in black neighborhoods to be safe from white ant-**gger patrols then.

  166. @brabantian

    Collateral was of course directed by the same man who directed Heat, Michael Mann.

  167. anonymous[402] • Disclaimer says:

    Steve,

    Are there any studies as to which populations are the most mentally healthy and least anxious based solely on their media consumption habits?

    It is too easy to claim that the relatively well informed Red Pilled are better off for being so. Yeah, I know some Blue Pilled white folks who are crushed by White Guilt, but others seem perfectly content in their bubble if they have money at least.

    And can anyone really claim to be fully Red Pilled unless they have revisited all of the WWII and Holocaust propaganda they were raised on and why. Being a Holocaust skeptic means that all authority figures and 90 percent of the population will judge you mentally suspect.

    Do Obama, Hillary or even Trump really buy into this BLM nonsense? I doubt it. I think they are just so damaged by Zionist Kompromot pressures they feel they have no alternative. If any of them spoke out against BLM, the Jewish media would destroy them and their families and they know it.

    The assassination of the Marinos has really sadden me in a way that all the other BLM inspired murders have not. My father was the son Italian immigrants and died a few years ago at 92 so that is part of it.

    I honestly pray everyday that we are delivered from this ZOG controlled insane world.

  168. @Father O'Hara

    Corona-chan is a bookkeeping phantom. Blacks live in Democrat controlled urban areas. Democrats have more enthusiasm for the Corona scam than Republicans. Hence more phantom black corona casualties.

  169. @Charlotte Allen

    “Charge a gun, run from a knife.” Is not Law. And I believe it was Norman Mailer who said it in a Playboy interview and not “Jimmy Hoffa”, as someone else had asserted in an earlier comment on a different thread here at Unz.

    Why do you guys keep bringing this canard up?

    I guess it’s all you have.

    • Replies: @Uilleam yr Alban
  170. Fool you once (Zimmerman), shame on them.

    Fool you twice (Wilson), shame on you.

    Fool you three times, you’re all shameless.

    • Agree: Manfred Arcane
  171. anon[310] • Disclaimer says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    The police had been called.
    How far away they were, who knows?
    Greg and Travis were just keeping tabs on him and asking him to stop until police arrived.
    If they hadn’t done that, Arbery was likely to enter a house, kill some woman, and steal her car so he could get back home, 12 miles away.

  172. JimB says:

    As I commented elsewhere on unz.com, there are about a dozen similarities between the Arbery and Trayvon killings. It’s almost as though Google or Chinese AI is sifting through a mountain of US local news data trying to discover an event where peak SJW outrage can be pumped up by Soros rent-a-mobs and the pro-Chinese corporate media in time to have maximum impact on US presidential elections. Manchurian Candidate ver 3.0 must be elected for China to continue rising.

  173. @Charlotte Allen

    A “citizen’s arrest” over someone casing a place and then **gging off? Really?

    Yes, really. We need to train **ggers to keep their criminal mischeif in their own neighborhoods and not spill over into the surrounding communities.

    the only crime they actually saw committed was a minor trespass: stepping onto private property

    Some might call that “breaking and entering”.

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  174. anon[310] • Disclaimer says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    There is more video of Arbery inside unfinished houses at night at least twice.
    That particular house had had materials stolen previously. If Arbery was the innocent you posit, all he had to do was wait til the police showed up to sort it out.
    Have a look at the vid of the encounter again. Arbery was running with a claw hammer in his hand. He dropped the hammer before he got to the pickup, ran around the pickup and then executed a surprise attack on Travis.
    What do you think he was more likely to do if he got possession of that shotgun-disable it and wait for the cops, or commit multiple murders with it?

    • Replies: @Jack D
  175. @res

    Of course I haven’t. It’s none of my goddamned business, nor yours, nor that of the idiot current occupant of the Sulzberger throne who hath decreed that it shall be discussed among all bien pissants.

    That’s what juries are for, and all the other rigamarole that kicks in if the juries screw it up.

    The probable cause line refers to the fect that it’s really you and I and Nebula here on trial, not some random rednecks. It’s a show trial on trumped-up charges with not even the pretense any more of legitimacy, and yet still y’all insist on pleading your own case without counsel.

    • Replies: @res
  176. anonymous[402] • Disclaimer says:
    @Truth

    Tragic but murders of children by parent and even parent by child happen all too frequently. Murders of one spouse or partner by the other is even more common. Even then I am sure that crime statics will show that in the vast majority of these case where the crime was interracial, the perpetrator was black or Hispanic and the victim white.

    This virus lockdown is not helping.

    What really matters for the stability of a society are murders between victim and stranger. In those cases we know that blacks murder whites in far far greater numbers.

    • Agree: Redman
    • Replies: @Truth
  177. RSDB says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic

    Did they chase you a considerable distance and then corner you?

    • Replies: @The Anti-Gnostic
  178. @nebulafox

    I feel you man, I really do, and it may turn out that we can muddle along and get there along that line as much from pure dumb luck as anything. Just understand that it makes you (and all of those associated with you) look viscerally weak. All the eloquence in the world is unlikely to be enough to overcome that.

    Steve’s not responding with his own identity politics, he’s responding with the truth. Massive difference. That that truth is so painful to them that they may well be forced to abandoned their lies if forced thereby to confront it is no argument against advancing it with enthusiasm.

  179. @Steve Sailer

    Undoubtedly the cops were cautious. After all, the MSM might well make them the villains had they decided to “notice” the event.

    The murder of Paul and Lidia Marino has already faded from the news.

    To no one’s surprise French, Dreher, and company have not deigned to comment as far as I know.

  180. JimB says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    A punch to the head is a deadly assault. It’s a justified homicide.

  181. @Knowingbetter

    “Men of Color are usually interested in having romantic relations with white girls. That in and of itself proves that there is no anti white animus.”
    I always know I am dealing with a nit-wit, when someone tells me that the black male determination to mount white women is proof that the penile-primates-in-pursuit have “no anti-white animus.” (This was actually used by the defense team in the Channon Christian/Christopher Newsome case, to suggest that, because one of the blacks involved in the murders had a white girlfriend, he could not have committed a “hate crime.”) When black men pursue white women, it is almost always an act of war, desecration and defilement. What better way to get racial revenge against whites than to degrade our women and leave them with tormented mulattoes to raise?

  182. What’s funny about black people is that they’re just a distraction. They are, as a race, so hideously dependent on others that they are never a threat to the established order-something they cannot live without, and something they cannot themselves replace.

    Asians and indians, on the other hand, CAN live without whites. And, they CAN create their own systems and self reliant societies. These people are the true threat, not some black weirdos guilt tripping their way through life.

    Whites will never be displaced by blacks. But they can be displaced by Asians.

    • Replies: @Peter Johnson
  183. @KenH

    “Trump’s turned into Obama” on this latest Trayvonish incident is a BS statement. He’s been pretty quiet about it, as he should be, making a few sympathetic noises when interviewers demand his opinion on it, but also saying that he trusts Georgia to see that the right thing is done, etc. Obama would have held a press conference by now, to announce a full hate crime prosecution, while also making some remarks about how Ahmaud could have been his son.

    • Agree: Desiderius
    • Replies: @KenH
  184. @Art Deco

    It was not rich like 1960s America, but it was the crown jewel of South America in the 1980s, Art.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  185. @Charlotte Allen

    I pretty much agree. The McMichaels were beyond stupid. The “citizen’s arrest” is largely a myth.

    A gun is not a magic wand that will automatically make someone do what you tell him. Did the intrepid duo think (obviously not) what would happen if the “jogger” resisted and consider their situation if they shot him? Blacks (felons or not) frequently attack a uniformed police officer fists swinging in such a situation. Many such happenings have caught on Body Cam.

    This is why years ago Obama and friends discouraged Body Cams.

    • Replies: @V. Hickel
  186. Redman says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    Actually reasonable suspicion (a fairly low standard: in NY it is only a belief that criminality is afoot) is enough to make a “stop” of a citizen to ask questions that might lead to probable cause to then make an “arrest.”

    Based on the video, it appears they were making a stop but didn’t have the opportunity to ask questions, because Aubery attacked them.

  187. “Men of Color are usually interested in having romantic relations with white girls. That in and of itself proves that there is no anti white animus.”
    I always know I am dealing with a nit-wit, when some tells me that the black male determination to mount white women is proof that the penile-primates-in-pursuit have “no anti-white animus.” When black men pursue white women, it is almost always an act of war, desecration and defilement. (This was actually used by the defense team in the Channon Christian/Christopher Newsome case, to suggest that, because one of the blacks involved in the murders had a white girlfriend, he could not have committed a “hate crime.”)What better way to get racial revenge against whites than to degrade our women and leave them with tormented mulattoes to raise?

    • Agree: Bardon Kaldian
  188. anon[555] • Disclaimer says:

    This comment thread clearly shows that the M$M strategy is working. Media zombies, led by the nose away from the actual topic and right to the current “squirrel!” shiny-object topic. Because we sure can’t be allowed to think too much about the deliberate, cold blooded murder of an elderly couple right over their son’s grave because of the color of their skin.

    I guess nebulafox gets a partial pass since he’s theoretically still in Singapore, but others don’t. Anyone immersed in the media swamp in the US should have already learned to see through it. Yeah, ok, I get that Boomers still want Uncle Walter to come and tell them the news, but c’mon, how many media liestorms have we seen in just the last 10 years? How many?

    Free clue: the murder of two elderly wipipo over their son’s grave is more emblematic of inter-racial crime than the Georgia case. Far more common, about 50% of murders in the US are committed by black Americans, and the most likely murderer of a young black man is — another young black man. Truth will deny this, but flat-earthers aren’t in touch with reality anyway.

    This hate fact brought to you by the FBI crime statistics and the CDC death stats.

  189. Rob McX says:

    One important fact of life that people like the McMichaels need to know: Blacks will resist even if they’re unarmed and you have a gun. The whole BLM movement was founded on such cases. Once this happens, you have to shoot — there’s no other option, otherwise your assailant may take your gun and use it on you. You may feel you’re morally right, but once you pull that trigger, your life as you know it is over. From then on it’s homicide charges, death threats, civil suits, etc.

  190. Anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @RichardTaylor

    Which is why some form of segregation will come back.

    Why would that lead to the return of segregation.

    • Replies: @JerseyJeffersonian
  191. martin_2 says:
    @Jack D

    How on Earth can you say the video doesn’t prove self defence! What was he supposed to do, let the jogger take the gun from him?

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  192. @JosephB

    The video really is a Rorschach inkblot

    Yeah, psychiatrists could use it diagnose mental retardation if the subject sympathizes with the **gger.

  193. Anonymous[296] • Disclaimer says:
    @Truth

    But the Swedes did not KNOW it was criminal sexual penetration, as they did not KNOW their whole arrangement or situation. She wasn’t asking for help, they just ASSUMED it was criminal. As I said, Brock could have been her husband or had explicit written consent. What happened to staying out of other peoples bedroom? Minding your own business? These are Devil’s Advocate questions because BOTH Turner and Arbery deserved to be held until police arrived. If Turner had been black, he would have assaulted the Swedes and *they would still be in prison because the sexual victim would fear speaking against Turner, and would have gone along with the mob to lynch the “racist” Swedes.

    Brock is a scummy guy and so is Arbery. They were both held by private citizens on suspicion of criminal behavior. One was dumb enough to go for another man’s gun. He chose his own demise.

    • Replies: @Truth
  194. Now, some wealthy conservative needs to put up some dough for a talented conservative guy to make a video. The theme? What I outlined above.

    You hire a dozen black actors who dress up in current revolutionary black power stuff to parade down the street, four abreast, while brandishing AK47’s. Some crisis actor (tip of the hat to Paul Craig Roberts) White peoples line the sidewalks screaming and shaking their fists at the black soldiers. One white person sporting a MAGA hat bolts from the sidewalk and takes on one of the black warriors, trying to wrestle his long gun from his hands. The black panther manages to break free enough to shoot the protesting white far-right extremest, killing him. (Apparently, it’s all stage acting)

    Now the video is made available to the MSM. They go hog wild. Here’s a crazed Trump fanatic attacking an innocent black man who is simply exercising his Constitutional Rights to peaceful assembly and freedom of expression. They take the bait.

    And then all is revealed as being a hoax. Simply an inversion of the current madness. Egg on face of our media.

    C’mon, Let’s go for it. We’re not winning battles any other way, by being respectful of the truth or being nice guys. Maybe it’s time we took a page from their playbook, went on the offensive. What have we got to lose? If we can’t blind them with our brilliance, we can at least baffle them with THEIR OWN bullshit.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
  195. res says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    Charge someone holding a gun? You know what they say: Run toward a gun, away from a knife.

    Something to be said for that if you know they intend to shoot (as in the example you gave). But you seem to have forgotten (which I mentioned explicitly in my comment) about the other man covering the situation with another gun. Are YOU really going to charge in that situation? It’s not like you are going after Adam Lanza and trying to save kid’s lives by risking your own. Once you charge two armed men it is highly likely someone is going to die. And it would probably be you.

    I watched that video again, for the umpteenth time.

    Did you watch the longer video? Because that had several important details.

    There were some break-ins and thefts (or at least two) in the McMichaels’ neighborhood in the months preceding the incident. There was no evidence–evidence, not suspicion–to connect Arbery with those burglaries.

    There is a reason I keep saying to watch the longer video. I guess there was no evidence if you don’t count video. There are also more McMichaels – Arbery connections which should be of interest to anyone concerned with actually trying to understand what happened.

    But legal cases aren’t decided on how unfair it is for the press to vilify white people. They’re decided on actual evidence.

    That is true (hopefully). What I am passing judgment on is the press trying to use a situation like this to vilify white people.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  196. res says:
    @Desiderius

    Of course I haven’t. It’s none of my goddamned business, nor yours, nor that of the idiot current occupant of the Sulzberger throne who hath decreed that it shall be discussed among all bien pissants.

    Which is why you are here making comments based on your lack of knowledge of the situation.

    That’s what juries are for, and all the other rigamarole that kicks in if the juries screw it up.

    That’s the theory. Which is why it so so infuriating that the media is making a spectacle out of the incident based on their false narrative of it. And it is such the coincidence that we are getting this six months before an election.

    The probable cause line refers to the fect that it’s really you and I and Nebula here on trial, not some random rednecks. It’s a show trial on trumped-up charges with not even the pretense any more of legitimacy, and yet still y’all insist on pleading your own case without counsel.

    Not sure what exactly you mean here (your oblique style becomes tiresome after a while). But are you saying we should just stand aside and let the media do what they are doing here without comment?

    • Replies: @Desiderius
  197. Anonymous[198] • Disclaimer says:

    “It’s not illegal in Georgia to stand in the middle of the street with a gun in your hands.”
    No, I guess not, but that is not what happened. The white guys “initiated conflict” when they pursued him with two vehicles and tried to trap him while displaying guns.

    At that point, his choices were to :

    -run away and hope they didn’t shoot him in the back or run him over with a truck

    -allow himself to be taken prisoner by two angry strangers with guns, and trust them not to do violence to him

    -actively confront them

    He chose Door Number 3, to his misfortune.
    He may have done this because he was foolish, impulsive, high on something, terrified, had a bad temper, a guilty conscience, or something else. We will never know.

    I agree that a murder charge is a stretch, but the decision not to arrest these fellows immediately is just plain embarrassing.

  198. anonymous[198] • Disclaimer says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    “It’s not uncommon for unfinished houses to lure the curious.”

    Well, now we know who was at fault. The house.

    Finished houses also lure the curious. This is known as burglary.

  199. @Anon

    The technique you describe is old enough to have its own Latin tag

    Suppressio veri, suggestio falsi
    Ballentine’s Law Dictionary
    Definition:
    The suppression of truth is the suggestion of falsehood.

  200. @bigdicknick

    turns out the pennslyvania trans-shim removed its mother from her nursing home while the state was implementing its plan to kill all seniors via bringing covid to nursing homes. could be a big story.

    That sounds interesting. But to whom are you referring, please?

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  201. In contrast to Arbery’s shooting…

    Man bites dog.

    this second interracial killing case has gotten virtually zero national media attention through Tuesday morning…

    Dog bites man.

    …even though it’s fairly spectacular in scale and quite curious in motive.

    This kind of curiosity can also kill a cat.

  202. @Hugo Silva

    BadWhites shouldn’t give up because GoodWhites will never realize their mistakes even as that mistake is sawing off their head with a rusty knife. BadWhites need to become REALLYBadWhites once again

    • Replies: @Hugo Silva
  203. vinteuil says:

    Brilliant column, SS.

    The MSM’s constant fanning of the flames of racial resentment is just about as wicked & foolish as it gets.

    Somebody needs to write a book about it.

    Suggested title: Fanning the Flames.

    Suggested author: You.

    Through a series of unfortunate events in my family, including three deaths, one of them a bloody murder, I have recently come into a little money, and I’m wondering what it would cost me to get you to meld all of the great stuff you’ve already written on these issues into a finished & polished book.

    No kidding – I’m quite serious.

  204. @Anon

    In both the Covington kids and Ahmaud, there is a video that shows the exact opposite of what the left first claims it does.

    In this case, the ahmaud video, it obviously shows a suspcious black man running down the street chucking stolen goods down. Then he attacks and tries to wrest the gun that is being legally carried from a law abdiding citizen.

    Its hard to imagine what else could have been going on to turn the two shooters into murderers.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  205. @Art Deco

    As far as I can tell from noodling around with GoogleMaps, somewhere between 8 miles and 15 miles away.

    That would mean that he would have jogged between 16 and 30 miles had he finished. It would be interesting to know the route that he took just to see how jogger friendly it is.

    • Replies: @Barnard
  206. Art Deco says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    Searches for his mother turn up ‘Brunswick, Ga’ as an address. The nearest point of the City of Brunswick to the Satilla Shores neighborhood is six miles. However, Satilla Shores is in a neighboring zone the postal service also refers to as ‘Brunswick, Ga’, so he could have been living closer.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
  207. J1234 says:
    @Truth

    Oh yeah…that story really fits the profile of white on black killings (dad kills daughter.)

    On a different topic, I just came upon this story:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/13/us/louisville-police-emt-killed-trnd/index.html

    The “Kentucky EMT” portion of the headline and the picture of the woman in her EMT uniform gave me the initial impression that an EMT worker was killed by the cops in the line of duty. Which isn’t good.

    But wait…this killing wasn’t in the line of duty. She was killed when her boyfriend engaged in a shootout with police at her house. They had a warrant, and the boyfriend had been previously charged with attempted murder against a police officer…and was being allowed to take a home incarceration option until his trial in late June (presumably because of the coronavirus threat, though I can’t say for sure.)

    So when did a black person’s job become relevant within the context of a headline after a police action or shooting? I mean, there’s only so much space in a headline…you’d think that it would be reserved for the most critical pieces of information, so I’m wondering why CNN thought one of the most important or critical pieces of information in this case was that the woman worked as an EMT? Did Freddie Gray or Eric Garner have their occupation (or lack of one) included in headlines of their stories from CNN? Or Walter Scott?

    It’s true that if a physician or serviceman is killed they might include the occupation in the headline, but for more ordinary jobs like EMT, not so much. Anyway, when someone tallies up the number of killings that happen because violent suspects needed to be protected against the pandemic, it’ll be shocking. In the meantime, the media thinks the world’s greatest travesty of justice is that Paul Manafort has been released to home because confinement of the coronavirus.

  208. Anon[230] • Disclaimer says:

    Greg McMichael will be found guilty and jailed or you can expect mass violence, basically sanctioned by the MSM. Elites had to make sure blacks were fired up to vote in November, and those two gave em’ all the help the elite’ needed.
    Sheldon C Francis is responsible for twice as many deaths as Greg McMichael, and he tried to take many more (of cops), but nobody will remember his name.

  209. @Pop Warner

    I totally agree with you that BadWhites need to become Really BadWhites but I don’t see any perspective of that happening.

  210. Anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @res

    Thank you, res.

  211. @JMcG

    How about saving one’s own life?

    • Replies: @JMcG
  212. Anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    I agree that a murder charge is a stretch, but the decision not to arrest these fellows immediately is just plain embarrassing.

    They clearly acted in self defense.

  213. Whiskey says: • Website
    @JMcG

    Not necessarily true. Research the Tueller Drill. San Diego cop who came up with it. Within 20 feet an attacker with a knife can fatally stab a cop before he fires.

    There are defensive moves… flop on your back and shoot, shoulder roll and shoot. But most cops are terrible at these tactics and shooting in general.

    • Agree: JMcG
  214. Art Deco says:
    @JMcG

    No, we don’t. We’re not a middle income country (we are nearly the most affluent), extractive industries account for just 3% of value-added in this economy, and the economic performance we’ve had over the last 25 years bears no resemblance to what happened in Venezuela over the period running from 1970 to 1995.

    • Replies: @JMcG
  215. Jack D says:
    @anon

    It’s like “pre-crime”. It’s always best to shoot unarmed **ggers ahead of time, BEFORE they have a chance to grab your gun and shoot you. If you shoot all passing **ggers, they’ll never be able to commit multiple murders, not once.

    If Arbery was planning to execute a surprise attack on Travis (a man who could be clearly seen carrying a shotgun), why would he have dropped the only weapon that he had before charging at him?

    **= jo

    Honestly, I don’t know who was planning to do what to whom that evening, but if everyone had stayed home they would have all been better off.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
  216. @Old and Grumpy

    Well, it means never admitting to a Conservative that you’re wrong, among themselves they might be more flexible once their principles aren’t being challenged anymore.

  217. @Art Deco

    Searches for his mother turn up ‘Brunswick, Ga’ as an address. The nearest point of the City of Brunswick to the Satilla Shores neighborhood is six miles. However, Satilla Shores is in a neighboring zone the postal service also refers to as ‘Brunswick, Ga’, so he could have been living closer.

    I don’t know the exact neighborhood where Arbery was killed, but from the map I saw, it appears to be across the Sidney Lanier Bridge, which I don’t think allows joggers. I’m not sure how one would get all the way out to near Jekyll Island from Brunswick without crossing that bridge, without taking a good detour around the marshes and swamps. There may be some back roads that I don’t know, but it wouldn’t be a simple straight shot.

    People who run 12 or more miles usually run regularly, so it would be interesting to know if ran the local races. He would be know if he did.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  218. Art Deco says:
    @Anonymous

    We will never know

    Actually, we kinda do know. Since he came up from behind the truck, he could see papa in the bed of the truck, armed. He tangles with the son knowing the father is covering the son. ‘Impetuous’ might be the word you’d use.

    • Replies: @anonymous
  219. Tom-in-VA says:
    @SunBakedSuburb

    Don’t forget the infamous Police Squad shootout of 1982.

  220. Jack D says:
    @Obamahotep

    If you were going to attack someone who was carrying a gun (a risky endeavor to begin with, especially if he is with a friend who is also carrying a gun) then why would you first throw down your only weapon (supposedly the stolen item was a hammer)? To make it a more sporting fight? I realize that Arbery was perhaps not the sharpest knife in the drawer but that doesn’t seem like the thing to do in such a situation. Either you throw away the stolen item and run (excuse me, jog) like hell or else you attack the guy with the gun but not both.

    • Replies: @Inverness
  221. anon[414] • Disclaimer says:

    This is all I have to say, if white people don’t get it after reading well that’s too bad…

    “White women, if you’re married to a black man and have children, here’s a newsflash: You’re still white. You don’t get an honorary black card, black membership or black pass. I don’t care what your husband or his family says. You’re not black. Stop with the we are oppressed nonsense. You’re not oppressed. You don’t experience racism. You’re not one of us.”
    https://medium.com/@LeciaMichelle/dear-white-women-married-to-black-men-we-didnt-give-you-a-black-card-6b78ad05f591


    ‘We are black men. That means we make babies’
    They’re known as ‘baby fathers’ – black men who have children with more than one partner. But while some white women lust after them, many black women have had enough. Yasmin Alibhai-Brown reports”
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2000/apr/13/gender.uk1

  222. V. Hickel says:
    @ronehjr

    He did refer cryptically to a “missing” part of the tape. Perhaps referring to the part where they were off to the left for a couple seconds. Nothing of consequence happened there; the part I wish I could have seen is what happened when he got to the front corner of the truck. Was TM aiming the shotgun at him? To me, that is the crux of the whole encounter.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  223. V. Hickel says:
    @Captain Tripps

    go to Paul Harrel’s Youtube channel he does a very good analysis of it

  224. @fatmanscoop

    Or once they have eliminated rightwing opposition they don’t have to promote anti-white agitation anymore and can stop with the bullshit.
    The Cuban ruling class is pretty white compared with the population that they rule and they don’t put up with Negro agitation, because once you have a ruling class which claims to rule on behalf of the oppressed you can get away with a lot of things you wouldn’t get away as a rightist, so I wouldn’t rule out the possibility that in a Liberal America White Liberal rulers would control the Blacks with tough measures while professing their dedication to Liberal ideals.

    • Replies: @International Jew
  225. @RSDB

    Of course not! After my 30 minute lecture on common law and public easements and the particulars of criminal trespass, they gratefully accepted my good faith gift of Rothbard’s magisterial Man, Economy and State. Last I saw, they were huddled together on the curb reading it! I bade them good day as a free man on the land and continued my hammer-jog.

    • LOL: Achmed E. Newman
    • Replies: @RSDB
  226. @Jack D

    White people are just bad, period.

  227. Rob McX says:
    @R.G. Camara

    I know the 2012 “Joker shooter” James Holmes booby-trapped his apartment, although he did warn the police about it when arrested.

    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
  228. Jack D says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    He could have taken the Old Jacksonville Highway, but honestly the “jogger” story is just bullshit. He was a jogger like Trayvon was a “college student”. These ghetto types always get promoted posthumously when the media is trying to make martyrs out of them.

    Most likely he had a vehicle or an accomplice (who is never going to come forward) parked at some distance and was there to see whether there was anything worth stealing (maybe he was casing the joint first and was going to come back with his truck and the accomplice to help him load if there was anything worth stealing) but this did not entitle the neighbors to shoot him. You would like to be able to shoot pesky Negroes who constantly come ’round your neighborhood to steal stuff but that’s not how the law works unless you catch them inside your house while you are home and can plausibly claim self-defense.

    So what we have are two more or less equally bullshit narratives and each side is going to claim that their bullshit is the truth.

  229. @Hippopotamusdrome

    “Some might call that “breaking and entering”.”

    Generally breaking and entering requires some degree of force (which can as little as opening a door). It is my understanding that there was none here.

  230. Art Deco says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Per capita product in real terms declined by 45% during the period running from 1974 to 1998. The net change in this metric between 1964 to 1998 was nil.

    Some of this is attributable to changes in the terms of trade, but that points out one problem: their affluence was a function of a natural resource bonanza, not of embedded development of human capital.

    The share of their nominal gross domestic product attributable to fuel and mineral exports in Venezuela was 33% in 1970; 43% in 1974; 32% in 1980; 20% in 1985 (after the OPEC crash); 31% in 1990; and 15% in 1998. For Chile, that ratio varied between 9% and 13% during that run of years. For Argentina and Uruguay, it was always less than 1%.

    If you bracket out the fuel and mineral exports, per capita product in Argentina and Uruguay in 1985 was higher than that in Venezuela and Chile’s only about 20% lower (NB, Chile was in the midst of an economic depression in 1985).

    How it differed from much of Latin America in 1985 was that it had had 26 years of electoral politics without interruption and Freedom House had adjudged it Latin America’s freest country bar Costa Rica. See Mark Falcoff’s commentary on Chavez election in 1998. Venezuelans from all walks of life had the idea that wealth comes from resources rather than human capital. The place was an exemplar of the resource curse thesis. You had Brobdingnagian corruption among the political class while Irene Saez was winning plaudits for her success at municipal service delivery (derived from insisting municipal workers actually pick up the trash regularly).

    • Replies: @International Jew
  231. @Anonymous

    Anon, the MSM has a captive audience of locked in Americans, TV veiwership has probably doubled. Why not hammer your agenda when there are so many eyes on the screen?

  232. 1. Arbery had a basic right to be alarmed and defensive. Two strange, clearly hostile white men had rolled up on him in a truck, in a rather aggressive manner, and came out with shotguns. If they’d had any brains, they would have stayed home. If they’d had only half a brain, they would have followed him at a distance and not gotten out of the truck. A lot depends on how legal it was for them to get out of the truck, given the circumstances. Maybe Georgia law says it’s legal. To my non- Southern mind, it looks like unlawful detainment at gunpoint with neither sanctioned authority nor a good reason, viz it looks like a species of kidnaping.

    2. But also, Arbery had mens rea: he had been snooping around illegally and had done it before,had been confronted, and fled. He knew he’d done something wrong, had been caught illegally snooping around. It doesn’t matter to the MMs if he didn’t steal anything, a strange man lurking around on private property is not entitled to the presumption of benevolent intentions; they didn’t and couldn’t know what he had or hadn’t done. Maybe he’d hidden a dead body in there, who knows? Their aggressive pursuit does not sound justified, but their suspicions were totally understandable.

    3. Both parties were in an overheated state of mind, and explicably so: the MMs were annoyed b/c of the history of continuing thefts and burglaries. They thought they had caught the wascally wabbit, and unfortunately went supercop-fantasy when they should have let the real cops handle it. Arbery was both justified in feeling nervous and angry about these threatening weirdos with guns, but was also nervous because he knew he was up to no good.

    4. It would be telling to find out what was said during the confrontation. It’s possible (and historically inferable) that these two guys with guns were less than polite in introducing themselves. If they barked orders at Arbery, and he responded with annoyance, the whole thing quickly turns into a hind-brain instinct-driven jungle dominance-display instead of a rational interaction. Who will be the mightiest monkey in the forest? From there to the fight to the gunshot is just a short step.

    5. Arbery is dead over a stupid interaction, and the MMs have their lives destroyed even if they get off, also over a stupid interaction.

    6. Main lesson: when involved in a heated interaction, do everything in your power to slow things down. The more slowly events unfold, the more chances people have to come to their senses and de-escalate.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
  233. anon[414] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    But he was on video and was shot in self defense when he tried to grab the other man’s weapon that wasn’t pointed at him 🙁 oh bother whatever should we do? Even the detectives house was burgaled of a gun along with a string of other robberies. The shooting is unfortunate, he could have just proved his innocence without trying to take a weapon that he appeared to be willing to use.

  234. @Jack D

    He could have taken the Old Jacksonville Highway, but honestly the “jogger” story is just bullshit.

    Taking HWY 303 from Brunswick is the long way around to get to what appears to be a neighborhood across the Sidney Lanier Bridge, near Jekyll Island. If you’ve ever driven that way out of Brunswick, you’d know it’s not runner friendly. Apparently, it is legal to run across the SLB, but it’s not advisable on a normal day, and I’ve never seen anyone do it.

    So what we have are two more or less equally bullshit narratives and each side is going to claim that their bullshit is the truth.

    As far as I know, the McMichaels never said that they wanted to shoot anyone. Apparently, they just wanted to hold the guy until the police arrived, which is risky, but not obvious bullshit. If they had just wanted to shoot Arbery, I would think they would have immediately started shooting, which they didn’t.

  235. @Jack D

    It’s like “pre-crime”. It’s always best to shoot unarmed **ggers ahead of time, BEFORE they have a chance to grab your gun and shoot you. If you shoot all passing **ggers, they’ll never be able to commit multiple murders, not once.

    Not only joggers, but naggers too.

    • LOL: Bardon Kaldian
    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
  236. @martin_2

    “How on Earth can you say the video doesn’t prove self defence! What was he supposed to do, let the jogger take the gun from him?”

    You generally lose the right of self-defense when you are engaged in a criminal act. For example if you are robbing a store and the shopkeeper tries to grab your gun you can’t shoot him and claim self defense.

    In this case there have been claims that the McMichaels were attempting to make a citizen’s arrest. If this is the case and they had no legal right to make a citizen’s arrest then they were probably engaged in a criminal act and had lost the right to claim self defense.

    I should note I am not a lawyer and that the law is different in every state. But absent a statement to the contrary from someone familiar with Georgia law I think it is possible that the McMichaels could have lost the right to claim self defense by their prior actions.

  237. Barnard says:
    @OilcanFloyd

    A 15 to 30 mile round trip on foot to steal assorted tools seems absolutely crazy, even for a low IQ criminal. He had to either have a vehicle stashed somewhere or an accomplice who was waiting nearby. This still seems like a long way to go to steal hand tools. Has anyone tried to figure out what all he was stealing and who he was selling to?

  238. Richard B says:
    @Knowingbetter

    Men of Color are usually interested in having romantic relations with white girls. That in and of itself proves that there is no anti white animus

    This comment alone deserves it’s own LOL!

  239. Hibernian says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    Citizen’s arrest goes back to the time when LEOs were few and far between and rode horses, and there were no phones. Should still be on the books because it’s still needed in certain places at certain times under certain circumstances. It should be very limited. Trespassing in daylight on unoccupied property and suspicion of conspiring with oneself and possibly others to commit a future robbery doesn’t cut it.

  240. Richard B says:
    @The Alarmist

    These guys are toast in the current environment:

    All Whites are. Most just don’t know it yet, and maybe never will.

    Even when the water reaches their lower lip.

    But, your poiut still stands. They’re toast.

    Remember that husband and wife who got 15 and 12 years respectively after using racial slurs and flying the Confederate flag past the house of some blacks who just moments before were hurling rocks and racial slurs at the couple?

  241. fish says:
    @Knowingbetter

    My name is Lenderp Pittz and I approve this message……and hot man on boy akshun wit Tinys.

  242. @nebulafox

    Jesus Christ, you people really need to learn that just because someone is being attacked by the media because they fit Their Narrative doesn’t mean they are worth defending. McMichaels, Turner, really? There are enough innocent people who actually deserve to be defended against the PC lynch mobs that you don’t need to make excuses for people who actually did bad things.

    Tossing in the McMichaels with Brock Turner is ridiculous

    Brock Turner was fingering a passed out woman. (I can’t quite wrap my head around what that’s supposed to accomplish?) That woman seems of low character to me–out to “have fun”, i.e. cheat on her boyfriend, getting drunk and canoodling then going off with Turner, then tediously preening about her victimhood. But when she has passed out Turner shouldn’t be molesting her.

    The McMichaels were engaged in a public spirited, “protect our neighborhood” endeavor.

    Easy in hindsight to criticize some of their decisions. I’d say they were probably ill advised to pull their weapons out. Given the minoritarian poisoning of our society, amping up black hostility there was a good chance this could lead to trouble, so having the shotgun out might not have been optimal. Since they had two men and a 3rd in another truck, simply driving along side Arbery or one of them getting out and doing “can we talk to you man?”–and if he ran off just keeping up with him until the police came–strikes me as a better approach.

    But what the McMichaels were trying to do is what good citizens are supposed to do: join with your neighbors to keep your community pleasant and safe–not just ignore trouble and hope the police (i.e. the government) will magically “take care of it” for you.

  243. @Rob McX

    Eh, perhaps, but I’m unconvinced most criminals do such a thing. The Joker/Unabomber guys were both planned extremists with higher-than-average IQs and overarching societal messages to purposefully send. They were more akin to political terrorists (Unabomber, for example, considered himself a political/social terrorist, as his manifesto dictated).

    Almost all violent criminals, even desperate suicide-by-cop types, are below-average IQ with backgrounds where “future planning” was not taught or expected. They don’t do the sort of stuff Joker/Unabomber/serial killer-in-movie does. Most violent criminals are impulsive and are not going to have a plan beyond their emotional needs of the moment.

    So unless this guy was a crank with a political axe grinding away daily, a decent IQ, and a computer full of his own manifestos and videos about his pet issue–and he might have been, but its unlikely—there’s likely nothing.

  244. Anonymous[296] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    No, you got it wrong.

    It goes like this.

    A. Arbery is to Brock Turner
    as
    McMichaels are to Swedes.

    McMichaels placing citizens arrest is just like Bicycling Swedes placing citizens arrest.

    Except the Swedes were media heroes and McMichaels are convicted and lambasted in the media.

    Brock Turner and A. Arbery were not committing similar crimes. But what the Swedes and McMichaels did were almost exactly the same- intervening in an ambiguous police matter. Except they were treated completely opposite. It is because the arrestee in one case is black (favored) and the arrestee in the other is white (publicly defamed.)

    What they actually want is a Hall Pass for Blacks to commit most crimes south of murder with no consequences. It’s called anarcho-tyranny and it works well for the elites because instead of paying the welfare class not to riot, they let them take it out of the working class through theft.

    • Replies: @Truth
    , @utu
  245. ATBOTL says:

    I’m shocked at how many boomer type conservatives have uncritically swallowed the narrative being peddled by the “liberal media” on this story. Most comments on Breitbart and Free Republic are like this. It’s hard to believe that after all the race hoaxes and all the videos of blacks attacking whites, the average conservative’s response is still to join the anti-white lynch mob. Most of these types are doubling down as the narrative falls apart. I think blump’s sucking up to blacks has a lot to do with this. Since blump came on the scene, conservative media has stopped covering black on white violence stories. Those were a mainstay of online conservative media in the Obama era, when the cons had to lure whites back to the scam. Now, those same clickbait conservative sites are full of nonsense about blump getting the black vote.

    How can conservatives be so stupid? It’s truly a new low for these cretins.

    • Agree: Hugo Silva
    • Replies: @Hugo Silva
  246. Dave Pinsen says: • Website
    @Jack D

    No one’s claiming that the man was entitled to shoot Aubery because he may have cased a construction site. They’re claiming he was entitled shoot Aubery because Aubery tried to grab the shotgun from him while punching him in the head.

  247. ATBOTL says:
    @nebulafox

    I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same.

    Less true words have never been written.

  248. Anonymous[248] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer

    It’s quite good.

    With better training and better weapons the Puerto Ricans would have succeeded, without question.

    The astonishing thing is that although gunfights have been “a thing” since the adoption of repeating firearms, the initial application of any scientific study of how to prevail in one didn’t start until the 1920s, and wasn’t widely disseminated until individuals like Jeff Cooper and Massad Ayoob had a forum in firearms publications in the 1970s.

    Both tactics and hardware needed changing. In some cases it was all about the little details. The Colt 1911 had been around since, obviously, 1911, but was not a specially good tool until many little tweaks were applied. My father went to his grave believing they were worthless junk since he had been issued one in the military and ‘you couldn’t hit the side of a barn with one’. You couldn’t with the one he was issued, as issued.

    Protection procedures and tactics for VVIP protected are orders of magnitude better now, but at much greater expense. Decapitation of a society’s leadership is no longer a feasible idea for nonstate actors. ( The Empire tried bumping humble old Fidel off dozens of times and bodged it.) Depeditation-killing the front line agents, each of whom is replaceable but at increasing costs, as that tasty pension gets less appealing when you factor in the odds you won’t get it, you’ll be dead and your wife will remarry some guy who has no balls or stomach for a fight and they’ll live on the benefits happily thereafter-is the sine qua non of asymmetric warfare. All 80 IQ Achmed has to do is fuck the wife, have ten kids, five are boys, one maybe two go to jihad. Achmed Jr has cost his society what, nothing. He has a few years of school at maybe a hundred dollars a year. He is handed a Kalashnikov made the year they shot Francis Gary Powers down. He kills 1LT Jones, United States Army, USMA Class of 2016. Between four years at West Point and his widow’s and orphan’s benefits, Achmed Jr has cost the Americans several million. Go ahead, launch a drone and blow Achmed Jr to bits. The Afghans will make more.

    The drone costs several million dollars. It is good for maybe 100, maybe 200 flights. Prorate it, every flight still costs more than one Achmed will generate, could generate, if he lived to ninety.

  249. @res

    I understand the relevant situation perfectly. You’re being played, badly, and should know better.

    The only way to win is not to play the game (that they want us to play*). And there’s nothing oblique about it. For us it’s exactly akin to trying to answer the “when did you stop beating your wife” question as if it were straight.

    * – the vast majority of the target audience for this shit is already annoyed as hell that you end up being right about everything. Adding another log to that fire just hastens the day you get burnt.

    Again, the whole topic this thread is supposed to be about is an example of how we can play a different game entirely. Why can’t you follow Sailer’s lead?

  250. V. Hickel says:
    @David In TN

    Ahrobbed ARby’s stole a 9mm pistol from Travis in January. Ahrobbed Arby’s was seen on the same property by Travis a couple weeks prior, when he reached into his pants as if to draw said pistol. Arby’s was previously arrested for unlawful possession of a pistol, and prosecuted by the office of George McMichael. They had every reason to suspect that he was armed. And he was in fact armed the second he put his hands on that shotgun.

  251. Truth says:
    @Anonymous

    Lmfao!

    What if A.A was jaywalking, or making a turn without signaling? They are crimes.

  252. @donut

    donut, after some Civil War battles they found that many muzzle loaders on the battlefield were packed with powder and ball on top of powder and ball on top of powder and ball. Reload,reload,reload, never fired.

  253. @Thoughts

    I read some of her interviews

    Where are they? I never even saw her name mentioned.

  254. I’ll allow that you personally res are doing the Lord’s work in trying to stop the circular firing squad, but again getting everyone on the same page with a counter strategy would be far more productive in achieving that goal.

    • Replies: @res
  255. Mrs. Joe and I drove down through Amish country today. There is a fertile farm area called the Eden Valley where the Amish have taken root. The have their own way of dressing and speaking and a deep rooted culture and yet, unlike another group that has their own way of speaking and dressing and culture, they are a joy to visit. Just an observation.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  256. @nebulafox

    Neb,

    As Achmed E. Newman noted, you ought to read Richburg’s book.

    However, Ach left out Richburg’s stunning conclusion (paraphrased and criticized here in the Baltimore Sun):

    “BOSTON — In his new, widely publicized book “Out of America: A Black Man Confronts Africa,” author Keith Richburg of the Washington Post sees the corpses of massacred Africans and writes, “If things had been different, I might have been” one of them. “So I thank God my ancestor survived that voyage.”

    At another point, he visits the place where Africans were loaded for the voyage: Goree Island in Senegal. Many African-Americans cry when they visit Goree. Mr. Richburg writes that he felt “little personal connection or pain.” He asks, “Would I have been better off if this great tragedy, this crime of slavery, had not occurred?”

    In yet another passage he writes, “I am quietly celebrating the passage of my ancestor who made it out. . . . Had my ancestor not made it out of here . . . maybe I would have been one of those bodies, arms and legs bound together, washing over the waterfall in Tanzania. Or maybe my son would have been set ablaze by soldiers. Or I would be limping now from the torture I received in some rancid police cell.”

    His bottom line is: Thank God my ancestor got out, because now I am not one of them. Thank God I am an American.”

    No wonder the MSM demonized and then ignored Richburg’s look at the hell that is contemporary sub-Saharan Africa – he completely destroyed their narrative.

  257. @Red Blooded American Boomer

    …since it means the father is still in the home.

    I do kind of a double take whenever I see a black man with kids. You don’t see it very often, yet having two parents around is one of the best predictors for good child outcomes.

  258. @Barnard

    It’s called “nothing better to do.” Stupid, impulsive people can go on meandering drives just to see if something isn’t nailed down somewhere because we pay them for existing.

    Kind of hard to believe that in living memory, cops enforced vagrancy laws.

  259. @Charlotte Allen

    Agreed.

    The fact that they did all of this over some construction site is especially idiotic. It was the son’s neighborhood, so I suspect he initiated the chase and dragged his father into it. The father should have stood up to his stupid son and told him to lay off.

    The son looks low IQ in photos, doesn’t appear to have any wife/family and isn’t a cop like his Dad was (suggesting he couldn’t make the cut even for their modest standards).

    Really, they are total idiots who deserve jail time for that alone. The son even continues to pursue/confront when Arbery tries to ditch to the right and get away from the truck. Shooting some wandering loafer over the equivalent of DR Horton’s construction site is asinine.

  260. utu says:
    @Anonymous

    The testimony of the properly incentivized camera man will bury McMichaels. That McMichaels did not want to make the citizen arrest. They wanted to provoke the guy to the point they could kill him. Murder I and conspiracy to commit murder. The camera man will get a suspended sentence. McMichaels have no defense. They won’t testify because they would be caught on lies, so they have no story to tell. The only story is the video and the incentivized camera man.

    • Replies: @anon
  261. @Knowingbetter

    I am interested in “romantic relations” with blacks and hispanics, but I would vote to exclude both groups from my political community. Explain that!!

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  262. Slimer says:
    @black sea

    Black on White crime is seen as a dangerous and potentially volatile storyline to be downplayed as much as possible.

    Plastering TV screens with stories of black on white crime will incite mob violence on black churches and businesses and miscellaneous acts of terrorism against black elected officials, all of which plays into the hands of the Russians. When white America establishes normal relations with its white nationalist utopian state the news media can freely cover these stories. As for now, the situation is a little more than “potentially” volatile.

    • Replies: @black sea
  263. @Buzz Mohawk

    That is a perfect example of a microaggression according to its actual definition and not how it is commonly used. The joke is not that somebody said a bad word but that once it’s revealed an innocuous word could solve the puzzle, the man’s choice is seen to reveal his beliefs about annoyingness vis-a-vis race.

  264. Slimer says:

    BTW, white people have never had to organize protests to get the police to investigate a black on white shooting. Meanwhile, whites can kill blacks with impunity.

    • LOL: Malcolm X-Lax
    • Replies: @Kronos
  265. Stan says:

    The jewish controlled press is the marketing, publicity and propaganda arm of the Democratic party. These incidents are trumpeted by the press during election years when the Democrat party wants to excite black voters to show up for polls. 2012 Trayvon Martin. 2014 Michael Brown. 2o2o Ahmaud Arbery.

  266. anon[256] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox

    Can’t we all just agree that murder is bad?

    Dunno. Can we agree that shooting 80-something year old parents on top of their son’s grave is bad? I know it is bad, in fact it is evil, but I’m not sure if you do. Your silence on that is puzzling, given it’s the main topic.

    I wonder what the killer’s social media looks like. Likely he had a Facebook account, maybe Instagram, or Twitter, what’s on there? Probably won’t know, because reasons.

    I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same.

    Let’s say you went for a run in Singapore and some Chinese citizens mistook you for a thief, started giving chase while yelling, and you ran around a corner & found a man in a suit pointing a gun at you and ordering you to stop in a couple of languages. You’re seriously claiming that you’d go for the disarm of that plainclothes cop in Singapore?

    lol. No way.

    • Replies: @RSDB
    , @Anonymous
  267. @Chrisnonymous

    https://www.amren.com/news/2016/08/a-white-teacher-speaks-out/

    A White Teacher Speaks Out

    …………..

    What about black boys and white girls? No one is supposed to notice this or talk about it but it is glaringly obvious: Black boys are obsessed with white girls. White parents would do well to keep their daughters well away from black schools. I’ve witnessed the following drama countless times. A black boy saunters up to a white girl. The cocky black dances around her, not really in a menacing way. It’s more a shuffle than a threat. As he bobs and shuffles he asks, “When you gonna go wit’ me?”

    There are two kinds of reply. The more confident white girl gets annoyed, looks away from the black and shouts, “I don’t wanna go out with you!” The more demure girl will look at her feet and mumble a polite excuse but ultimately say no. There is only one response from the black boy: “You racis’.” Many girls — all too many — actually feel guilty because they do not want to date blacks. Most white girls at my school stayed away from blacks, but a few, particularly the ones who were addicted to drugs, fell in with them.

    There is something else that is striking about blacks. They seem to have no sense of romance, of falling in love. What brings men and women together is sex, pure and simple, and there is a crude openness about this. There are many degenerate whites, of course, but some of my white students were capable of real devotion and tenderness, emotions that seemed absent from blacks — especially the boys.

  268. Kronos says:
    @Anonymous

    It’s no accident that these white-on-black “attacks” are blown out of proportion during Presidential/Congressional election years. From the Rodney King Riots to Ferguson 2014, Democratic operators find that these psychodramas stimulate black turnout without needing to bribe blacks with material goods. It’s the closest they have on voting on principle.

  269. anon[414] • Disclaimer says:
    @utu

    Did both the McMichaels shoot the guy? Who shot him? Did all the shots come from the son’s shot gun? Did the father and camera man shoot him? How many people should be charged for murder in a case of self defense?

  270. Kronos says:
    @Father O'Hara

    It’s a interesting point thats likely correct. If you watch this trailer the paralyzed French guy could’ve died on three separate occasions. (Fork in the eye was my favorite) Some caretakers might very well spill hot water on paralyzed people’s limbs for kicks as well.

  271. anon[144] • Disclaimer says:

    Oh good, a normal topic of discussion.

  272. res says:
    @Desiderius

    The counter strategy I advocate is to make an effort to inform oneself and be honest. Then try to have real conversations about controversial issues.

    Fat chance. I know. I wonder if anyone in the thread actually watched the longer video I linked (or has an equivalent level of knowledge from other sources). I am quite sure most of the people who most needed to did not.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
    , @Desiderius
  273. @ATBOTL

    Trump is Fake Right, his role is just to get the recalcitrant Whites to restore their allegiance to the established regime by making them to believe that their man is in power and their concerns are being addressed while he is leading them to a political dead end.

  274. @Pericles

    I’ve read that this brouhaha also is useful for getting the dropped prosecution of Gen. Flynn out of the news. Whew!

    Well, not really, because Judge Sullivan has reversed his previous stance and now is prepared to accept amicus briefs in relation to the case.

    Some argue that he wants to keep the Flynn case open though the lead up to the election in November.

  275. @ThreeCranes

    The Hoffa character says it in the Irishman. That’s the only place I’ve ever encountered it.

    • Replies: @ThreeCranes
  276. @nebulafox

    I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same. And I probably wouldn’t have ended up shot: let’s be real about this.

    I would have kept my hands in plain view, made no sudden movements, tried to talk my way out of it and (if that failed) waited for the cops if I were innocent and even if I was caught red handed pilfering stuff from the construction site.

    If I am displaying a gun and you attack me, you will get shot…no matter what you look like. Just keeping it real, Chief.

  277. @James B. Shearer

    James, last year in San Francisco there were over 30,000 thefts from vehicles. Even though, in most cases, a window or two were broken it was not breaking and entering unless you, the victim, could prove the car was locked. New DA in town not going to prosecute a lot of property crimes.

    • Agree: Bubba
  278. dimples says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    I’ve read zillions of comments saying ‘I woulda grabbed the gun too!’. Yeah right.

    • Replies: @anon
  279. @The Germ Theory of Disease

    germ, well thought out and almost the same conversation over at the Root. Just kidding.

  280. dimples says:
    @nebulafox

    “I don’t blame Arbery for reacting how he did: I’d do the same. ”

    Another ‘I woulda grabbed the gun too!’ fantasist. Sheesh.

  281. @Charlotte Allen

    I’m sorry, but both father and son acted like idiots. A “citizen’s arrest” over someone casing a place and then jogging off?

    Sure, why not? Apparently under Georgia law, the arrest is legal:

    https://www.georgialegalaid.org/resource/rights-during-arrest

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/12/us/citizens-arrest-what-is-explained-trnd/index.html

    Perhaps you should focus your apprehension 😉 on the law rather than the conduct of the McMichaels, who were following the law.

    Just for starters, how did they know Arbery wasn’t armed himself?

    Duh. That’s one reason the MMs were armed, silly. Not to mention that unarmed perps can be dangerous. George Zimmerman found that out up close and personal, if he didn’t know it already.

    And frankly, if some rando non-cop …

    Ahem. The MMs weren’t randos, they were residents of a criminally targeted neighborhood. Would you prefer residents, including a former cop, punt vigilant responsibility and then later hear about a neighborhood girl getting raped in her house by an intruder?

    “Well, it’s too bad she got raped by that construction jogger, but I’m still glad we didn’t detain him the week before… imagine if people called us racist? Or stupid or something? Yikes.”

    … with a gun trained on me tried to stop me on a public road by telling me I was “under arrest,” I’d say, “Eff you!” And I’d feel perfectly justified in punching him out and grabbing the gun, if I could.

    Again, it seems you have a problem with Georgia’s citizen’s arrest law… your comments would be more coherent if you targeted that law, rather than casting aspersions on the MMs, who appear to have been following the law.

    People are under no obligation to submit to being stopped by armed randos, “citizen’s arrest” or no “citizen’s arrest.” They’re entitled to fight back.

    “People” (i.e., perps) “fight back” all the time against arresting officers and get justifiably popped on the regular. Should perps be entitled to beat up/kill law-abiding civilians?

    But the McMichaels don’t deserve a lot of sympathy, either.

    Of course they deserve sympathy. Like George Zimmerman, they were eventually arrested due to racial politics, not because they broke the law. Not only that, but the MMs (and Zimmerman) provided a valuable public service by legally putting down dangerous roaming wildlife, and at great risk to themselves. They should each get a municipal medal, not a show trial.

    • Agree: Bubba
    • Replies: @Charlotte Allen
  282. anon[701] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    Agree – and look at what minoritarianism is doing to our great experiment in democracy.
    Democracy must have debate and reason to survive. Debate requires a diversity of opinions, but paradoxically also requires understanding among the debate participants – like baseball, where teams compete but do so under common rules and cooperating with each other at key moments (as the pitcher and batter tacitly agreeing when the pitch will begin).
    Minoritarianism destroys any possiblility of common understanding and tacit cooperation. You can’t debate with Antifa thugs and Black Lives Matter snipers. You can’t debate with Jewish autocrats who deplatform their opponents.

  283. @nebulafox

    Can’t we all just agree that murder is bad?

    Sure, but in the Arbery case, he was simply shot and killed: There was no murder; it looks to be justifiable homicide.

    I have yet to see any evidence that McMichaels deserves any sympathy for a “citizen’s arrest” gone wrong where someone ended up dead.

    LOL, wut? If a violent criminal resists arrest and is killed, that’s an arrest gone right.

    And I probably wouldn’t have ended up shot: let’s be real about this.

    Of course not—you wouldn’t have charged in the first place. You’d piss yourself if confronted by someone with a gun. You’d squeeeal like a piggy on command. NTTAWWT… different strokes for different folks, etc. etc.

  284. @James B. Shearer

    I should note I am not a lawyer and that the law is different in every state.

    You don’t have to be a lawyer, Google has been around for awhile:

    https://www.georgialegalaid.org/resource/rights-during-arrest

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/12/us/citizens-arrest-what-is-explained-trnd/index.html

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  285. Aside from all the fog and emotion, salient aspects:

    1) Difficult to ignore fog and emotion. Most of the drivel from MSM is just that, fog and emotion.

    2) Knee jerk assumption that badwhites hunted and murdered goodblack.

    3) Video clearly shows goodblack casing the unoccupied house. No good reasons come to mind unless he wasan aspiring architect. *

    4) Goodblack was running, not jogging.

    5) Goodblack attacked badwhite, grabbing his shotgun and hitting him in head.

    6) No sympathy for badwhites who have had their lives ruined by goodblack jogger.

    *Meaning that he had turned his life around and had already succeeded as a rap star.

  286. @Barnard

    This seems like an awful long way to go to steal hand tools. Has anyone tried to figure out what all he was stealing and who he was selling to?

    I doubt the jogger story also. As far as I know, nobody has tried to figure out what all Arbery could have been up to, and who he associated with. I don’t think it’s uncommon for petty thieves to wander around looking for opportunities. My guess is that under most circumstances a twenty minute drive is a small price against the risk he would take in getting caught stealing in his own neighborhood.

  287. Anonymous[282] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hugo Silva

    * Liberals live in cities.

    * Liberals are resorting to extreme measures to demonstrate their control over cities.

    * These measures ( lockdown, borrowing money to replace missed pay, abandoning rule of law so as to assert individual diktat ) are making cities uninhabitable.

    * These measures have left Liberals legally vulnerable.

    * The countryside is not making itself uninhabitable, nor has it made itself legally vulnerable.

    * Therefore: The Liberals have lost already. They just don’t know it (already dead, just too dumb to lie down).

    • Replies: @Hugo Silva
  288. @James B. Shearer

    Ship of Theseus question. When does a construction site become a house? When the carpet is installed?

    Looks like you’re right. The garage door is open, no breaking, so it’s fair game.

    “WTF are you doing in my house? I’m calling the cops”

    “But you left the garage door open”

    “Oh, yeah. Then sit down on the couch and I’ll make you some lemonaide.”

    • Replies: @Kronos
    , @James B. Shearer
  289. @Uilleam yr Alban

    Ah, thanks. But whoever said it, I first heard it in the 1970’s.

  290. @Inverness

    Yeah, almost forgot about that, you never heard another word about those “vandals” and their graffitti, what a surprise.

  291. Kronos says:
    @James B. Shearer

    How on Earth can you say the video doesn’t prove self defence! What was he supposed to do, let the jogger take the gun from him?”

    Keep in mind they’re not being honest and arguing in good faith. Those advocating the “murdered jogger” story are well aware that the black guy had “sketchy as hell” criminal record and recklessly charged a guy with a gun. (Something 98% of criminal whites and Hispanics understand is a dumb ass move.)

    Can’t the Woke Media just find one “To Kill a Mockingbird” like situation wear the black dude was utterly innocent and the whites were in the wrong!? (But please don’t say OJ Simpson.)

  292. Kronos says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Apparently, the black dude entered that house numerous times at odd hours. They have security footage of him in the house under construction.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
  293. MBlanc46 says:
    @ronehjr

    Don’t look to Trump for help on much of anything.

    • Agree: Hugo Silva
  294. @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “Raped….”

    You have a vivid imagination.

    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
  295. MBlanc46 says:
    @nebulafox

    Yeah. Murder us bad. Definitionally. Murder is wrongful killing. Got anything else?

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  296. @Anonymous

    He said “some form”, not a reinstitution of Jim Crow, or sundown towns. If I were to hazard a guess, I would guess that that was an oblique way of posing separation as a solution.

    If the disparity in attitudes and behaviors is too extreme, the current societally, and legally forced association is not viable.

    One group is being set up to lose their right to be who they are, and their right to self respect and confidence. We whites are being trained up to reflexively conform to this program, this loss of self respect and confidence, through the purposeful instilling of collective, perpetual, and inherent guilt, because the minoritarians who push this – hard – want to appropriate for themselves what we, at our best, have built as a people and a culture. But, still more perniciously, they also want us, as a self-consciously – and justly – self-assured people to just hurry up and die, not only materially, but even more maliciously, spiritually. This is a genocidal program.

    • Agree: RichardTaylor
  297. @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “You don’t have to be a lawyer, Google has been around for awhile:”

    Sure but it is dangerous for laymen to attempt to interpret legal statues. The CNN link itself links to a site which states (with disclaimers) that a section of the Georgia code says:

    “A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.”

    How this applies to the Arbery case is unclear. What is an offense exactly? Does non-criminal trespass qualify? Even if it does how would the McMichaels know (or is it enough to have a reasonable suspicion even though this isn’t a felony) Arbery didn’t have permission to be on the property? Even if the McMichaels were allowed to make a citizen’s arrest were they allowed to threaten deadly force while doing so? No doubt there is a bunch of case law that bears on these issues that a Georgia lawyer might know but I don’t.

    My point is pretty simple, if you are going to possibly kill someone while attempting to make a citizen’s arrest you better be pretty certain you had a legal right to make such an arrest because if you didn’t and you do kill somebody you are going to be in big trouble. Of course even if you do have a theoretic legal right you may be in big trouble anyway if it appears to most people that you acted unreasonably.

  298. anonymous[198] • Disclaimer says:
    @Art Deco

    I could also have said “Bewitched, bothered and bewildered” but I thought six descriptive words was enuf.

    I think you are right, though, Mr. Deco. The few ex-cons I have known seemed to have a real problem with impulse control; you never knew what they would do next, especially in response to some perceived slight. Some of that might have been just a display to rattle those around them. If so, it worked on me.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  299. anon[189] • Disclaimer says:
    @dimples

    I’ve read zillions of comments saying ‘I woulda grabbed the gun too!’. Yeah right.

    Those are people who have never even tried to grab a Super Soaker. Fantasyland dwellers.

    • Agree: David In TN
  300. anonymous[198] • Disclaimer says:
    @JMcG

    Michael Brown charged a gun.
    It did not work out too well for him.

  301. I think the Wuhan Special has the elite media off its game.

    Why aren’t we being inundated with pictures of Arbery at 12 years old?

  302. @Hippopotamusdrome

    “Looks like you’re right. The garage door is open, no breaking, so it’s fair game.”

    Not necessarily but it isn’t breaking and entering.

  303. @anonymous

    I heard an anecdote second hand from a guy who works at the L.A. County jail. He was trying to get an inmate who was threatening to murder another inmate to calm down. The agitated inmate explained to him: “You just don’t know what it’s like when another man tries to tell you what to do!”

  304. @James B. Shearer

    Citizen’s Arrest laws seem like one of those ideas that sounds simple in concept but a can of worms in practice. For example, if you haven’t done anything wrong, but somebody tries to citizen arrest you, can you citizen arrest them for unlawful detainment?

    Also, what does “upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion” mean? Does “probable” mean you need at least 51% chance the person you are trying to citizen arrest is guilty?

    Didn’t the elder McMichael use to be a cop? He was probably acting like he still was a cop rather than a mere citizen now.

  305. @MBlanc46

    “… Murder is wrongful killing. …”

    Actually murder is a certain category of unlawful killing which isn’t exactly the same thing.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    , @MBlanc46
  306. @Anonymous

    “I agree that a murder charge is a stretch, but the decision not to arrest these fellows immediately is just plain embarrassing.”

    One of the two instigators in the Knoxville Horror was not charged with murder for TWELVE YEARS. Do you find that “embarrassing?”

    The individual I refer to provided the vehicle used for the carjack-kidnapping. He had the longest rap sheet of the group. He was originally convicted in federal court as accessory after the fact.

    • Replies: @anonymous
  307. Truth says:
    @Anonymous

    Well my friend, It doesn’t take Magnus Carlsson to deduce that a man who has his finger up the cooz of a woman who is not moving, behind a dumpster is probably not in a good situation.

    Now, if the retard twins has seen Aubury dragging a dead body into the house, we really wouldn’t be having much of an argument here.

    • Replies: @anon
  308. Truth says:
    @anonymous

    Yes, now. But as the bible says, “a day to God is a thousand years to man”, and blacks have a WHOLE lot of catching up to do.

  309. Warner says:
    @Anonymous

    You should read Rene Girard on the social purpose of the scapegoat. Very instructive!

  310. @Steve Sailer

    Maybe citizens should just form their own version of the FISA Court, so they can give themselves permission to do whatever they want and not tell anybody. If government can do it, they can do it. Problem solved.

    Or maybe citizens could label arrestees as “Enemy Combatants” or “Terrorists.” Then they could do anything they want to them.

  311. @Steve Sailer

    A book by a specialist (Massad Ayoob) on this subject, “In the Gravest Extreme: The Role of the Firearm in Personal Protection,” has a chapter titled “The Dangerous Myth of Citizen’s Arrest.”

    This paperback is obtainable through used book services. Chapter Three explains how citizen’s arrest is a “can of worms in practice.”

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  312. @black sea

    ‘… White on Black crime is seen as a precious resource to be magnified…’

    ! That strikes me as a rather bloodthirsty and definitely racist proposition, but we can brainstorm about it, if you like.

  313. anon[370] • Disclaimer says:
    @Truth

    You have not commented on the actual topic, the murder of the Marino couple over the grave of their son. Why is that? Surely you have much to say. Let’s see it.

    • Replies: @Truth
  314. @Charlotte Allen

    “Raped….”

    You have a vivid imagination.

    Eh, no more vivid than yours:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/my-new-column-racial-revenge/#comment-3893750

    I did manage long ago to scare off a home-invading, knife-wielding would-be rapist by screaming a lot.

    Hmm. Was it an Arbery look-alike? Or maybe Haven Monahan?

    • Replies: @Charlotte Allen
  315. @James B. Shearer

    Sure but it is dangerous for laymen to attempt to interpret legal statues.

    Hardly: It’s safe to say that Lady Justice is quite the looker (despite the blindfold).

    But seriously, more information needed: What is the statute and who’s the interpreter? You may prudently recuse yourself, due to your ignorance of the law, from taking action. But the more knowledgable citizen down the street may have no such qualms.

    My point is pretty simple, if you are going to possibly kill someone while attempting to make a citizen’s arrest you better be pretty certain you had a legal right to make such an arrest because if you didn’t and you do kill somebody you are going to be in big trouble.

    Of course; that goes without saying. But why do you assume the McMichaels were as ignorant, as you admit you are, of the law?

    You haven’t made the case that the MMs acted illegally. You may find their actions toxically masculine, or gauche, or impolite, but both of the links I provided (from arguably ‘liberal’ sources, no less) back up the argument that their actions were legal. But with you, it seems to be a matter of ‘taste’ rather than of substance.

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  316. RSDB says:
    @anon

    Your silence on that is puzzling

    The other guy:

    murder is bad

  317. duncsbaby says:
    @bigdicknick

    Rachel Levine, Pennsylvania Secretary of Health. My early nominee for the iSteve (Woah)Man of the Year Award.

  318. Increasingly this all seems like just bitching to me. We have long known that there is no such thing as black on white crime in the media, the university culture, the entertainment industry. We all see our race realists routinely denouncing this liberal identitarianism on sites like Tacki and Vdare .. But what we never see on these sites is a straight up criticism of a particular ethnic group that is enormously powerful in all of our media and educational outlets and has long sought to undermine the position of Euro whites in our society and nation. What we never get is our race realism leavened by ethnic realism.

    Until we do, we are just bitching. and nothing will change. But do we want it to change? Or has bitching become a way of life for some of us ? Perhaps a comfortable one providing of course that the odd bullet or knife doesn’t strike close to home. Odds are it won’t where we live. But aren’t we
    finally finding all this lachrymosity tedious after awhile?

    • Replies: @Achilles Wannabe
  319. black sea says:
    @Slimer

    all of which plays into the hands of the Russians.

    I retract my previous comment, in the interests of maintaining the anti-Russia propaganda campaign.

  320. @res

    No one needed to watch it. You’ve got that Gold Star for a reason.

  321. Anonymous[220] • Disclaimer says:
    @David In TN

    Public libraries can get it for you on inter library loan. Since criminal justice students commonly read books on the subject it will not flag you as a bad thinker. Ayoob’s and Cooper’s books are fairly common in library systems.

  322. Anonymous[220] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    First, a white man in Singapore is a stranger in a strange land and should at all times conduct himself accordingly.

    Secondly, anyone who has a sidearm in Nazi Singapore is almost certainly a state agent authorized to have it and is probably very well trained. Your chances of a successful disarm are quite low and he will kill you with impunity. Even if you succeed, you will be captured and probably shot or jailed a long time and caned to boot.

    Personally, Singapore for me has cooties. Not going there. Ever. It’s an artificial total environment where two disparate groups of nonwhites can interact to the liking of one.

    If you have any interest in tropical fish, look up the story of Wonder Water sometime.

  323. The Craw says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    “What brings men and women together is sex, pure and simple, and there is a crude openness about this. There are many degenerate whites, of course, but some of my white students were capable of real devotion and tenderness, emotions that seemed absent from blacks — especially the boys.”

    About 20 years ago I had the misfortune of spending a part of my career working in the paternity/child support division of the Cook County,Illinois court system. The division was charged with the job of adjudicating the paternity of what used to be known in the law as bastards, and imposing financial responsibility in the form of child support orders on the fathers. The docket was overwhelmingly filled with cases involving blacks. There were a smaller number of cases involving hispanics. The white litgants were as rare as unicorns. The overwhelming majority of such cases were brought by the State in the name of the mother and child in an effort to try to recoup from the father public aid payments made to the mother.

    The conversations with the black putative fathers were always the same. They described their sexual encounter(s) wth the mother with a kind of blasé ordinariness that was completely foriegn to me. The prospect of being ordered to pay for the support of a child they in all likelihood fathered annoyed and angered them. FYI, paternity would be established via DNA testing.

    Their attitude was very similar to that evinced by folks in a fender bender: “Here I was minding my own business having sex, and BAM, nine months later she has a baby . Now this bitch wants me to pay for her kid.”

    • Thanks: Bardon Kaldian
  324. Anon[264] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer

    That law is a little verbose, and kind of internally contradictory, but my suspicion is that any judge would interpret the standard as “reasonable suspicion,” a massively litigated standard used to judge police detentions and searches. A criminal law hornbook like LaFave will have a well-document definition, with case cites. Wikipedia and YouTube both have less reliable definitions. Basically, it’s a weaker standard than probable cause. Which is why I said “internally contradictory,” because it almost seems like it wants to apply both reasonable suspicion AND probable cause, but this is stupid, because each is a separate point on a linear continuum. It’s a great example of the little hooks that attorneys use to appeal cases. Common sense says reasonable suspicion, but the rule of levity might say probable cause, to benefit the defendant … But weirdly the normal defendant is dead and the actual defendants are the shooters. In the former case probable cause is more lenient; in the latter, reasonable suspicion, since the defendants want to show they had the right to detain the “jogger.” I hope the MMs get a good attorney, unlike that poor guy in Charlottesville. This is the sort of stuff that lets you end run juries. Jury findings of fact are not appealable, but statutory interpretations by the judge are.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  325. International Jew [AKA "Hebrew National"] says:
    @Art Deco

    I already knew V was never as wealthy as the US, and didn’t know until now just how much their wealth, such as it was, relied on oil.

    So let’s just say, if the US were to undergo a drop in living standards proportional to what’s happened to V this century, we’d consider it a catastrophe.

    And, as you say, what ruined V was terrible government. Terrible government consisting of leaders who turn the state’s powers against their opposition, who arrange for cheerleading from the news media, who unleash street criminals to act as their auxiliary, who suppress investment and innovation by making it clear that no private property is safe. I think the parallels to the US are pretty clear.

    The USSR was misgoverned in some of the same ways, but never sank as deep into poverty and misery despite seventy years of trying, and a terrible war. Maybe that was because Russia had a lot of high-quality human capital. A Communist USA might have been Soviet-poor like that.

    But today, whatever our latent human capital, if we continue promoting the likes of Kimmeka Corbett, then in time our standard of living will resemble what it would have been if the top ten “American inventors” really had been as Google says. With a government, of course, dedicated to “equitable” distribution of the little that’s left.

  326. International Jew [AKA "Hebrew National"] says:
    @Hugo Silva

    California is already under undisputed control of a left-wing supermajority, but I don’t see any signs of this race realism you predict. Quite the contrary.

    And even if you’re right, don’t count on any particular white man (you, for instance) getting invited into the white ruling class.

    • Replies: @Truth
  327. @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “… But the more knowledgable citizen down the street may have no such qualms.”

    Well, we will see how things work out for them.

    “… But why do you assume the McMichaels were as ignorant, as you admit you are, of the law?”

    That would be the way to bet.

    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
  328. @Anonymous

    Trump was elected by mobilizing the BadWhites vote but beyond giving them a false sense of security hasn’t done anything to reverse their dispossession, by 2028 at the latest the Democrats will be back and this time they will achieve a definitive victory, the complete marginalization of Conservatism in American polítical and cultural life. So the BadWhites have lost already they just don’t know it yet.

  329. @allahu akbar

    “Whites will never be displaced by blacks. ”

    Not true of whites in Europe, where exponential population growth in sub-Saharan Africa is on course to overwhelm the continent of Europe via migration over the next several decades.

  330. @Anon

    Citizen’s Arrest laws seem like they stem from an era when you had to send a second person on, at best, a horse to get the police on horseback. Today, you have police cars, cellphones, 911, camera phones, and facial recognition technology.

    • Agree: Hibernian
  331. Anonymous[229] • Disclaimer says:
    @Knowingbetter

    No,I don’t listen to People of Color. Unless they are really good guitar players. But I’m not dumb enough to pay attention to what they SAY. Duh.

  332. Rob McX says:
    @James B. Shearer

    To confuse things even more, homicide isn’t necessarily illegal. It can be planned for years and be fully legal. “Homicide” is what they enter as the cause of death on death certificates of executed prisoners, at least in Virginia.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  333. anonymous[410] • Disclaimer says:
    @David In TN

    “One of the two instigators in the Knoxville Horror was not charged with murder for TWELVE YEARS. Do you find that “embarrassing?”

    That is the kind of retort I would call a “Whattabout?” It is closely related to “Look, a squirrel!” but is at least sincere.

    The two cases have nothing to do with each other. All of the perpetrators in the Knoxville case should have experienced That Last IV years ago…that does not make what the shooters did in the Aubery (Avery?) case right.

    • Replies: @David In TN
  334. Another issue here is even if the elder McMichaels had a right to make a citizen’s arrest would that right extend to his son (who didn’t personally witness any offense)?

  335. Hibernian says:
    @Rob McX

    Thus the phrases “culpable homicide” (murder or manslaughter) or justifiable homicide (always or almost always self-defense.)

  336. @Anon

    The media could have employed the much more naive strategy of simply fabricating false libels to demonize group A, or invent good deeds to lionize group B. But, this would make the media much more vulnerable to being accused of publishing falsehoods.

    I agree with your overall point, but when it comes to politics, particularly in reporting on the incumbent president, the media has shown no reluctance fabricate false libels to demonize him, the “fine people” hoax and the “inject your veins with bleach” hoax being two obvious examples.

  337. Truth says:
    @International Jew

    You mean excluding Khazars?

  338. @Known Fact

    I was yelling at them where is your fn masks.

    People like this, were they living in a community country like Cuba, would gladly volunteer to serve as neighborhood block watchers, ratting on their neighbors. Some people just love playing cop.

    BTW, I hope for her safety the people she was yelling at weren’t black. Publicly correcting the behavior of blacks can get you killed, and according to the media, you’ll have had it coming.

  339. @Servant of Gla'aki

    Google “PA health commissioner” and you will find that it is a tranny named Rachel Levine. Tucker had a segment on it last night. Evidently it took its own mother out of a nursing home while defending the guvner’s orders to send kung flu patients to nursing homes.

    • Thanks: Servant of Gla'aki
  340. @Buffalo Joe

    Joe, where is Amish country in relation to Buffalo? I saw some Amish on Route 219 driving towards Buffalo, but I think I was still in PA.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
  341. Here is a picture of the good doctor. We are indeed doomed.

  342. As someone who has had a gun pointed in his direction my immediate thoughts were not to see if I could wrestle the pistol away but to run (zig zagging)and seek cover…unfortunately circumstance didn’t allow this

  343. Truth says:
    @anon

    Well, let me begin by giving the disclaimer I gave on Malkin’s page a few days ago. I have been arguing this Arbery case strictly as a philosophical exercise out of boredom, because, it never happened.

    Every national news story that involves this sort of subject matter is fake. Every, one. This is it bit redundant because every national news story is fake. As I said on the other thread, “Arbery” got a nice check, and a little plastic surgery for this high school theatre production, So did the McMichael retards, and they will now be held in high esteem after a kangaroo court trial, amongst you folks for the rest of their lives. Never happened, nobody died.

    As for the story above, didn’t read it. I guess to old folks got done in by a negro because of 400 years of slavery or whatever. Let me give you a little hint; black criminals don’t go to jail for these sort of ephemeral causes, they go for money, sex, esteem and power. If this guy killed these two on his own it was probably because he figured they had money in their wallets, and he could take their car.

    The story is most likely fake, but if it is not I think the most likely conclusion is that a child, grandchild or business partner just got tired of waiting for them to die and wanted the will to be read so they hired someone to off them a few years early; then double-crossed him by telling the police where he was.

    • Replies: @anon
  344. JMcG says:
    @Art Deco

    We have large resource deposits as you stated in your original comment. That our government at every level is incompetent is, I think, inarguable.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  345. JMcG says:
    @Charlotte Allen

    Charging a gun WILL NOT SAVE YOUR LIFE. In case it ever comes up.

    • Replies: @Charlotte Allen
  346. anon[332] • Disclaimer says:
    @Redman

    running full boar

    Typo perfection. As in running full chimp.

    I do have the littlest modicum of sympathy for AA – feeling harried and harassed with a big ass mens rea, I can imagine having the impulse to charge the guy holding the shotgun. But impulse….control.

  347. @Jim Don Bob

    Jim Don, there are quite a few Amish living all along Rte.62 south of Buffalo, actually south of Gowanda, through the Eden Valley, through Dayton, Leon and the Conewango Valley. Harness maker, blacksmith, lumbermen and of course farmers. Lots of quilt shops and shed makers. Most of the side roads in that area lead past Amish homes and farms. There is a one room school house on Snake Hill Rd IIRC. That part of Rte 62 is designated part of NYS’ Amish trail. Then northeast of Buffalo, along Rte 104 (Ridge Rd. runs parallel to Lake Ontario, from Lewiston to Rochester and farther east) are more Amish and their farms and an Amish package store on Rte 104, near Jeddo, that we call the Amish Aldi’s. Their fields were partially plowed, but saw no one working a team, but saw one man lead a team of four, all in tact and harness, along the roadside. The horses are mostly Belgians(brown/tan) or Percheron (black.) An aquaintance of mine owns more than 20 Percherons that he lends out to the Amish and they break them to harness. He lives off Rte 104 in the Town of Hartland. A great ride on any nice day. My neighbor had a crew of Amish raise a barn for him, walking distance from my house. They secured rides to the site and then camped out. Industrious people.

    • Thanks: Jim Don Bob, Corvinus
  348. @Kronos

    Interesting, but it would have been just as good if it were half as long.

    • Replies: @Kronos
  349. Rob McX says:
    @ThreeCranes

    Interesting scenario. When libs go on about guns, they’re always thinking of white guys like the McMichaels, most of whom have had guns in their families for generations or even centuries without committing an illegal act.

  350. Inverness says:
    @Jack D

    Or perhaps we’re still not getting an accurate version of the story.

  351. Art Deco says:
    @JMcG

    Again, the ratio of ore and mineral exports to nominal domestic product in this country is < 0.01. That's true of just about any affluent occidental country, with the odd exception of Norway. And, again, there is incompetence and then there is incompetence. You can review the political economy of Venezuela over 30-odd years and you can see what thorough incompetence looks like. You've not seen anything like it here, yet.

    • Agree: JMcG
  352. KenH says:
    @Manfred Arcane

    “Trump’s turned into Obama” on this latest Trayvonish incident is a BS statement.

    You need a history lesson. Trump has condemned white nationalists in Congressional resolutions twice while in office. The first condemnation was in response to the events at Charlottesville where the “white nationalists” in attendance were forced to defend themselves against a very violent antifa and other leftists and made the mistake of winning some of those fights.

    If Trump truly had courage he would have refused to sign the resolutions until Congress added antifa and BLM to the resolution but he cucked. Of course, you’ll have an excuse for this since Trumptards always do.

    Obama would have signed the resolutions as would Hillary. Voting is a fools errand.

    • Replies: @Manfred Arcane
  353. anon[335] • Disclaimer says:
    @James B. Shearer

    Sure but it is dangerous for laymen to attempt to interpret legal statues.

    Think about that statement. We live in a democracy where we are supposed to approve the laws under which we will live. Certainly in order to follow the law we have to know what it is and understand it.
    If a laymen can’t interpret a law, how can he obey it? How can he approve it at the polls? How can he sit on a jury and decide if the law applies to the facts of the case he is deciding?
    The law in question is very much a law of the street – a law that every layman (you mean citizen) is expected to know and obey.
    As a citizen I assert my power and privelege to interpret that law. My interpretation is as valid, if not more valid, than a lawyer’s. It’s called democracy.

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  354. @Charlotte Allen

    Yeah, I made it all up.

    Come again, m’lady?

    You yourself implied your thwarting a stranger danger intruder rape was made up, by calling my reference of your experience the product of a “vivid imagination.”

  355. @James B. Shearer

    That would be the way to bet.

    Really? But what does the trend indicate? If you betted the killers* of Trayvon Martin, Eric Garner, John Crawford III, Tamir Rice, Freddie Gray, Alton Sterling, Philandro Castile, etc. etc. were ignorant of the law, you’d have been wrong.

    Put another way: On this issue (a civilian or cop killing a black doing something criminal and/or stupid), if you bet on the side of the MSM and black Twitter, particularly in cases where the initial finding resulted in no arrest, you’ll lose more often than you win.

    *I’m not using “killers” as an automatic pejorative here—also, some of those cases could be considered suicide by cop, e.g. Eric Garner, Michael Brown, Alton Sterling.

  356. @JMcG

    That’s what they said about Sandy Hook.

  357. Art Deco says:
    @Jenner Ickham Errican

    Garner was subject to an ordinary police tackle and had an idiosyncratic reaction to that. He was morbidly obese, diabetic, and asthmatic and had a heart attack and died. Very unfortunate, but it’s not something the police could be expected to anticipate. Michael Brown had an antic reaction to being told to quit walking down the middle of the road impeding traffic and use the sidewalk. NB Darren Wilson attempted to get him to stop charging by putting bullets in his arm and deltoid before shooting him in the head. Brown wasn’t suicidal; he was maniacal.

  358. Dr. X says:
    @Knowingbetter

    Men of Color are usually interested in having romantic relations with white girls.

    So rape is now considered “romantic relations”?

    • Replies: @JMcG
  359. @Art Deco

    Right, I’m using the term “suicide” loosely: I don’t claim any of the above had a tormented Hamlet soliloquy running through their heads. They probably didn’t want to die, but they didn’t care, either. IQ and temperament come to the fore in these perennial “maniacal” and “idiosyncratic” moments.

  360. @Jenner Ickham Errican

    “Really?…”

    Yes, I think the odds are they actually had no idea whether they were legally entitled to make a citizen’s arrest under the given fact pattern. They may be unpleasantly surprised to find out that they weren’t.

    Is it your opinion that it was clearly legal them to attempt to make a citizen’s arrest?

    • Replies: @Jenner Ickham Errican
  361. @Art Deco

    “Garner was subject to an ordinary police tackle and had an idiosyncratic reaction to that. …”

    Actually he was put in a chokehold which is against NYPD regulations because they are dangerous. The officer involved was eventually fired for violating this rule.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
  362. @Knowingbetter

    Can’t agree or disagree. Principally because it’s incomprehensible gibberish. I got “angery” tho’.
    Come back when you’ve lernd 2 inglish.

  363. anon[108] • Disclaimer says:
    @Truth

    Well, let me begin by giving the disclaimer I gave on Malkin’s page a few days ago. I have been arguing this Arbery case strictly as a philosophical exercise out of boredom, because, it never happened.

    As I said on the other thread, “Arbery” got a nice check, and a little plastic surgery for this high school theatre production,

    Oh, ok, you’re as delusional on this kind of issue as you are about the shape of the Earth.
    Got it. Thanks.

    • Replies: @Truth
  364. Kronos says:
    @Jim Don Bob

    Stefan Molyneux is a very methodical man. I love his stuff and news breakdowns.

    On a random note it’s interesting how many top rated HBDers have “Steve” as their first name:

    1) Steve Sailer
    2) Steve Hsu
    3) Stefan (Germanized version of Steve) Molyneux

  365. @Knowingbetter

    You guys are forgetting who enslaved who

    …in the short run.

    • Agree: Desiderius
  366. Truth says:
    @anon

    LOL, I get it bro, “It’s true, I saw it on TV!”

  367. Obama cited numerous tendentious statistics to encourage blacks to feel that their problems are the fault of white people…

    But one statistic fact conclusively proves that the problems of blacks can only be the fault of white people: there is no way they’d have gotten west of Dakar or north of Timbuktu except by the efforts of white people.

    Our “Negro problem” is not what they do, but where they are doing it. That part is the fault of whites.

    • Agree: Rob McX
  368. @res

    The wise general expends significant resources to ensure that he never needs to give battle at other than a time and a place of his own choosing.

    You and Nebula continue to rush in like Leeroy Jenkins.

  369. @anon

    “How can he sit on a jury and decide if the law applies to the facts of the case he is deciding?”

    Before the jury begins deliberating the judge will give them jury instructions that explain what the relevant laws mean. Then the jury based on the evidence presented during the trial decides the factual issues needed to decide the case. For example in a criminal case the judge might instruct that for a conviction on a particular count the state must prove A, B and C (the elements of the offense) beyond a reasonable doubt. The jury decides whether they have done so. During deliberations the jury can ask questions of the judge about the law (although they will often just get a repeat of a section of the jury instructions).

  370. @James B. Shearer

    Is it your opinion that it was clearly legal for them to attempt to make a citizen’s arrest?

    Given Georgia’s citizen’s arrest law, and the facts of the case revealed so far, yes.

  371. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:
    @V. Hickel

    Was TM aiming the shotgun at him? To me, that is the crux of the whole encounter.

    His actions indicate that he was rushing TM. In such circumstances, TM would have been justified in pointing the gun at him.

  372. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    Brock Turner was fingering a passed out woman.

    She was passed out right at that moment? According to whom? According to two guys walking by in the middle of the night who saw the couple hooking up in a sort of alleyway? How accurately could they have assessed the situation?

    And even if she had fallen into a sound asleep, how easily would that have been perceived by Brock? Is there always such a clear line between sleep and wakefulness, when two young people are laying next to each other hooking up, eyes often closed, especially when drunk?

  373. @Steve Sailer

    Some time ago I read a book called Guns and Violence: The English Experience, by Joyce Lee Malcolm.

    It was a real eye-opener. It’s easy to forget that the existence of formal, well-organized police forces is a fairly recent development. So Malcolm points out that even through the 19th century and into the early 20th, in England acting in self-defence was not just expected, it was considered a duty of citizenship. Firearm ownership was was positively encouraged at points, and when guns were widely distributed, as in 19th-century England, crime rates fell steadily, to the point that England was an almost miraculously safe country by late Victorian and Edwardian times.

    But now the idea of a citizen’s arrest seems incredibly archaic — and risky. Expectations of personal responsibility for public order and safety changed very quickly in the post WWI years.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @Kronos
  374. @Meretricious

    “Likely there’s a history in the neighborhood ” Too true, but it shows how IQ-deprived the idiots were. The son was carrying a shotgun because his pistol got stolen from his unlocked truck on the street.

    Everything was headed toward an OK resolution, but the DA –a friend of the MMs– dragged it out for a while, then decided conflict of interest and passed it on. The 2nd DA dragged it out and AA’s Mom started s*stirring so it ended up no legal action for two months. Now on DA #4, 3 months with no ‘justice’, and the national press is hot. Shoulda, coulda, woulda they got a manslaughter charge that week it’d been dismissed/advisement and we’d have never heard of it.

    Of course a week into DA#2 and MM Sr ‘remembers’ he investigated AAs case for that DA. And Sr also has some unspecified problem as a LEO resulting in ‘no firearms allowed’ rating. How you get that I don’t know. Ya can’t make this stuff up.

    Really feel for them, but it’s stupid all the way down and not a hill for me to stand on.

    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  375. @anonymous

    I’ve already written the McMichaels should NOT have confronted the “jogger.”

    My patience with the MSM and Opinion Makers ran out a long time ago. To say nothing of my utter contempt for these creatures.

  376. @Achilles Wannabe

    No replies, huh? That in itself is a reply

  377. @The Last Real Calvinist

    Gentlemen in England wore swords up until when?

    When he was 3, Adam Smith in Scotland was kidnapped by gypsies. (His biographer said, “I fear would not have made a good gypsy.”) His uncle organized the posse that got him back.

  378. RSDB says:
    @The Anti-Gnostic

    Cool, thanks. I initially thought you were posting about some sort of analogy to another situation, but I always relish these OT slice-of-life anecdotes.

  379. @Bardon Kaldian

    Given the above, truthful, information, Jim Crow was well thought out and well intentioned. Even many of the smarter blacks supported it on the grounds that it made their people more self reliant and that otherwise, there would be no black people in 200 years-they’d all be coffee colored, light mulattoes, much as in the case of Portugal today. Once a great nation that “punched above its weight”, it is now a backwater, with no significance.

  380. Anonymous[192] • Disclaimer says:
    @Dave3

    Have you actually ever dug a grave?

    Just as an exercise, assuming you do not own a backhoe or excavator, get a shovel and bury a simulated stiff sometime.

    You don’t even need a full six feet. The operators of natural-decay green cemeteries have found decay is optimal at about four feet. A little hot lime helps.

    Then see how long it takes for the hole to not stick out like a sore thumb.

    Shoot, shovel, and shut up is work enough for feral cats, hawks, and allegedly endangered fauna likely to get your property declared a protected and unusable, unsaleable area. For a deceased human you are biting off way more than you can chew unless you are experienced at and capable of hard manual labor and have the right tools, supplies, and a spot you can dig at for as long as it takes without attracting attention.

  381. JMcG says:
    @Dr. X

    It’s like the old joke:
    Q: Why do black guys have red eyes after sex?

    A: The pepper spray!

  382. @hooodathunkit

    “…And Sr also has some unspecified problem as a LEO resulting in ‘no firearms allowed’ rating. How you get that I don’t know. …”

    Apparently he blew off the 20 hours a year of training required to keep your rating current.

  383. @Anonymous

    In the state of Georgia a citizens arrest is legal.

    The moment he charged them with a hammer, he took his life into his own hands.

    You’re clearly just an angry faggot, butthurt over some guy who needed put in the ground being put in the ground *by his own actions*.

    Lol.

  384. Art Deco says:
    @James B. Shearer

    He wasn’t put in a chokehold and the baton was across his neck for all of nine seconds as he was being tackled. If he was fired, it was for political reasons.

    • Thanks: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @James B. Shearer
  385. @Art Deco

    “He wasn’t put in a chokehold and the baton was across his neck for all of nine seconds …”

    Looking at the video it appears to me that the officer had his arm around his neck. I didn’t see a baton. An internal review and the police commissioner said it was a chokehold.

    “… If he was fired, it was for political reasons.”

    The commissioner sort of conceded there was a political aspect to the officer’s termination. It was bad luck for the officer that Garner died.

  386. @KenH

    You need a civics lesson. Presidents don’t issue Congressional resolutions, nor do they sign them; I’m not sure if you’re deliberately lying or just a Chinese or Israeli troll who’s muddled about American political procedures. And as for history, remember that Trump was the only high-profile person who stood up after Charlottesville to condemn Antifa and defend some of those who were protesting the statutes’ removal–a move that is still dogging him today, with the media’s continued repetition of the “Nazis are fine people” misquote of his words.

    Trump is not a white nationalist, nor will he ever be one. He is, however, an honest civic nationalist who tries to adhere to the misguided but honorable 1950s-1960s ethos of treating all “American” racial and ethnic groups fairly, and sees nothing wrong with celebrating the historic (white) American nation and honoring its old heroes like Andrew Jackson and Teddy Roosevelt. He’s not a minoritarian despot like Obama or a globalist elitist like Hillary, both of whom actively hate the historic American majority and seek to destroy them. He’s moved the Overton window further than I’ve ever seen it move in my lifetime, and has given invaluable national exposure to people like Tucker Carlson and Stephen Miller, who are are arguably closer to the dissident right than Trump himself is.

    Of course we’re not going to get white nationalist leaders through voting. But to pretend there’s no difference between Trump and Obama as far as white interests are concerned is rank mendacity.

    • Replies: @KenH
  387. Kronos says:
    @The Last Real Calvinist

    Expectations of personal responsibility for public order and safety changed very quickly in the post WWI years.

    They (His Royal Majesty’s Government) were afraid of a Revolution after WW1 right?

  388. KenH says:
    @Manfred Arcane

    You need a civics lesson.

    So do you:
    https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/trump-signs-congressional-resolution-condemning-white-supremacists-n801506

    He could have stood strong and demanded Congress add antifa, BLM and the New Black Panther party to the resolution but he cucked under intense media and political pressure unlike campaign Trump who thumbed his nose at the establishment. Stop making excuses for him.

    Trump is not a white nationalist, nor will he ever be one.

    No sh*t, Sherlock. He’s been a socially liberal New Yorker his entire adult life, but he doesn’t hate white people like many in his class. Otherwise I agree that he’s basically just a civnat who thinks he can unite the nation by treating all racial groups fairly. However, he does treat some racial groups more fairly than others by having black and hispanic groups at the white house and praising each race and their exaggerated accomplishments to the heavens. Trump has also signed off on record levels of federal funding for historically blacks colleges and universities which is something the minority despot Obama never even did.

    When has Trump ever acknowledged the existence of white people and praised us and the fact that whites are the racial groups who founded and built America and fought all of its wars? Without whites America is just another poverty stricken third world sh*thole.

  389. Pericles says:
    @nebulafox

    McMichaels deserves any sympathy for a “citizen’s arrest” gone wrong where someone ended up dead.

    Had they been black, it would of course have been a citizen’s arrest gone tragically wrong. Perhaps this was a criminal trespass gone tragically wrong.

    Remember the naive student who got murdered in that park in New York recently by some black teens? No doubt some sort of shady deal gone tragically wrong, now move along people. No sympathy for her.

  390. Pericles says:
    @AnotherDad

    Brock Turner was fingering a passed out woman. (I can’t quite wrap my head around what that’s supposed to accomplish?) That woman seems of low character to me–out to “have fun”, i.e. cheat on her boyfriend, getting drunk and canoodling then going off with Turner, then tediously preening about her victimhood. But when she has passed out Turner shouldn’t be molesting her.

    My take at the time was that the poor, poor victim drunkenly fell asleep while Brock was being amorous. Not moaning but snoring.

  391. MBlanc46 says:
    @James B. Shearer

    “Is”of predication, not identity.

  392. @International Jew

    What you don’t understand is that for many leftists Venezuela is the destination – they want revolution. Some people were cheering Stalin as they were led off into the gulags.

  393. anon[384] • Disclaimer says:
    @JMcG

    “Run from a knife, charge a gun” Is rumored to be a quote from our beloved former head of the Teamsters union, Jimmy Hoffa. Present whereabouts unknown.

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