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An upcoming movie about a good journalist (James Norton as Gareth Jones, who broke the story of Stalin’s Ukraine famine) and a bad journalist (Peter Sarsgaard as Walter Duranty, who won the Pulitzer Prize for covering it up):

 
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  1. Anonymous[269] • Disclaimer says:

    Probably meant to be an anti-Russian movie, one that presents Ukraine as noble victim nation, America’s closest ally.

    True, Ukraine suffered, but it’d be a stretch to primarily blame Russians who were, like Ukrainians, under the tyranny of the little Georgian and the Tribe. I doubt if the movie will mention the Tribe’s role in the mass deaths. I doubt Kaganovich will be mentioned.

  2. Polynikes says:

    Looks like another DNC ploy to rob Bernie of nomination!

    Seriously though, commies had a nice run in Hollywood. They were the bell of the ball for almost a century.

    • LOL: PhysicistDave
  3. Bill B. says:

    Promising. I shall probably try to see it.

    To my ear the dialogue sounds very modern in this brief excerpt. It could be a contemporary political who-done-it.

    • Replies: @Bill B.
  4. Bill B. says:
    @Bill B.

    And surely Mr Jones should have a strong Welsh accent?

  5. Anon[380] • Disclaimer says:

    “Speaks to our current global condition.” Climate change? Russiagate? Historical movies with no black people?

    “Inspired by true events” sound even less reassuring than “Based on a true story,” but a little better than “The Human Centipede” ad copy of “100 percent medically accurate.”

    • Agree: jim jones
    • Replies: @International Jew
  6. “good journalist”

    “bad journalist”

    iSteve eDitorializes, either as ironic inversion of the Narrative or legitimate commentary on same.

    Telling when scientojournalists who mock the liberal establishment’s value judgments suddenly flex their moral muscles as the spirit moves them.

  7. Anonymous[240] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    Was this Tribe of which you speak operating in a demonstrably organized fashion, or were they just the far right tail of the IQ bell curve alongside some descending goyische nobles? Do you mention them beside the Little Georgian to imply that the two were aligned, or simply to appeal to the Steve-adorer’s presumed bigotry? (Georgian & Tribe = exotic = bad; Russian = occidental, almost = good)

    • Replies: @anon
    , @ben tillman
  8. This can’t tell the total truth, otherwise it could never have been made but I still look forward to seeing it. Peter Sarsgaard is excellent in every movie’s he’s in (faves of mine: as Charles Lane in Shattered Glass and Michael Scheuer in The Looming Tower).

  9. johnd001 says: • Website

    there are too many white directors in Hollywood spreading thier fascist propaganda!..
    Four legs good, two legs bad.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    , @S. Anonyia
  10. Ano says:

    Sorry, is this a re-make of Mr Schiff?

    You know, the film where a heroic lone crusader to reveal the truth reveals to the world the cover up of the horrific Ukrainian starvation of millions of US-taxpayer military aid by ruthless oppressive dictator. the man of steal(ing elections), Trumplin?

    Did it ever get a theatrical release? I just saw it on TV recently. (Boy, was it long!)
    But that Adam Schiff, fantastic actor!

    • Replies: @GRCicotte
    , @GRCicotte
  11. @Anonymous

    Yeah I suspect this got through as anti-Russia/pro-Ukraine, but it’ll be hard for it to not be at least impliedly anti-Communist.

  12. TheBoom says:

    I assume Durante will be the hero and Jones the villain.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  13. J.Ross says:

    On the one hand, how the hell did this make it past Lies, Inc? On the other hand, anything with Peter Sarsgaard is worth a look.

  14. So what did the NYT do to anger the people making the film?

    • Replies: @JimDandy
  15. @Simon in London

    Simon in London wrote:

    Yeah I suspect this got through as anti-Russia/pro-Ukraine, but it’ll be hard for it to not be at least impliedly anti-Communist.

    Agreed.

    Maybe it is the very beginning of social acceptability for telling the truth about what “actually existing socialism” actually did to actual human beings.

    Socialism really was tried, at the expense of hundreds of millions of human beings, and it is about time that we be free to say so.

    I’m old enough to remember how gays and black folks were treated before the civil-rights revolutions: it was not good.

    But comparing it to the mass murder that occurred under socialism is simply obscene.

    (Wake up, Bernie Bros!)

    • Replies: @hhsiii
  16. LondonBob says:
    @Bill B.

    Well if it is a choice between no accent or Robert Downey Jr.’s Welsh accent in Dr Doolittle I say don’t attempt it.

  17. Agnieszka Holland? One of the greatest living directors.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  18. Graham says:
    @Bill B.

    Not at that period, or not necessarily. People in the UK who moved up in the world, or who were already in the higher tiers of society, tended to use what at the time was referred to as standard English or good English. See for example H C Wyld’s ‘The growth of English : an elementary account of the present form of our language, and its development’ (1923 edition), p. 47 (https://archive.org/details/growthofenglishe00wylduoft/page/46/mode/2up):

    “certain classes, known as the upper and educated classes, in every province of England, no longer speak the local. Regional Dialect, but speak a Class Dialect, which is practically the same, at the present day, in all parts of the country.”

    It is clear from the context that by ‘England’ Wyld means Britain. That was not exceptionable at the time.

  19. nebulafox says:
    @Anonymous

    The Soviet system treated everybody badly.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Kronos
  20. anon[319] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    The Tribe was comically overrepresented in the Soviet state during its most violent years. Putin once noted that the first Communist government was overwhelmingly Jewish (80%). (This was before the 2016 Election when he became the World’s Most Evil White Man, so no one thought anything of the statement, btw.)

    Communism, both ideologically and in practice, was a Jewish movement, which found a home in Russia. In terms of a “demonstrably organized fashion”, it is well-established by now. Ashkenazi Jews were both the ideators and the ideological shock troops for spreading communism world-wide in the 20th century.

    Question for Jewish readers: In most societies, people typically reflect on the shortcomings or excesses of their forefathers. Some examples: Americans on racism, the British on class, the French on the Revolution, etc. Is there any equivalent reflection or contrition in the Jewish community for the spread of communism?

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/putin-first-soviet-government-was-mostly-jewish/

  21. Watched the trailer. Expected White Helmets to appear at any moment.

  22. …good journalist…

    My suspension of disbelief is already strained. Unless it means good in the Phil Sheridan sense of the word.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  23. How many serious movies have been made about the horrors of Soviet collectivism? Not many – and certainly not in comparison to movies about Nazis. That is the greater significance.

    OT – Finally saw Richard Jewell – very well done and easily Eastwood’s best movie since Unforgiven.

    • Agree: bigdicknick
    • Replies: @bigdicknick
  24. @Simon in London

    According to IMDB one of the production companies is the Ukrainian State Film Agency. However, I didn’t hear the word Russian spoken in the trailer, only the term Soviet. Hopefully people will make the distinction.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
    , @anon
    , @J1234
  25. Hibernian says:
    @Cloudbuster

    It was Sherman, not Sheridan, who said that the only good Indian is a dead Indian.

  26. Anonymous[161] • Disclaimer says:

    Most “upscale” American architecture seems to be mock-Spanish/Latin American. I suppose it evokes connections to the “Old World” as Hispanic culture seems much more connected to Europe, particularly Spain, than Anglo culture is.

  27. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Simon in London

    Yeah I suspect this got through as anti-Russia/pro-Ukraine

    Yep. And you can expect lots more movies about the essential evilness of the Russians. Lots more retconning of history to make it clear that the Russians have always been the bad guys. Cold War 2.0 is in full swing.

    We have always been at war with Eurasia.

  28. @MikeatMikedotMike

    socialism is the enslavement of the individual to the state. It is every bit as evil as nazism and our educational system should be teaching people that.

    Instead it lets ignoramuses tell people that if only their special brand of socialism was attempted and allowed to flourish it wouldn’t turn out like it always does.

    • Replies: @bigdicknick
  29. @anon

    The Tribe was comically overrepresented in the Soviet state during its most violent years. Putin once noted that the first Communist government was overwhelmingly Jewish (80%). (This was before the 2016 Election when he became the World’s Most Evil White Man, so no one thought anything of the statement, btw.)

    Communism, both ideologically and in practice, was a Jewish movement, which found a home in Russia. In terms of a “demonstrably organized fashion”, it is well-established by now. Ashkenazi Jews were both the ideators and the ideological shock troops for spreading communism world-wide in the 20th century.

    Putin is, as usual- bullshitting.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenin%27s_First_and_Second_Government

    Lenin’s First and Second Government

    And the rest is SOB (Standard Operational Bullshit), too.

  30. Well, our current President is also an admirer of the USSR, or at least he was back in 1987 and he seems fond enough of Putin, a creature of the USSR. Trump is certainly opposed to Trostky-ite internationalists like Bernie but there are enough fans of Stalin’s national greatness patriotism, anti-Semitism and social conservatism on the Right these days that it is becoming acceptable for main stream liberals to flaunt their anti-Stalinist credentials.

    • Troll: West Reanimator
    • Replies: @Desiderius
    , @WJ
    , @Kyle
  31. @bigdicknick

    also worth noting socialism’s bodycount is far higher than nazism’s.

    We are told “never again,” but when it comes to socialism we are told “it’ll work this time”

  32. Why is this always described as the Ukrainian famine rather than the Soviet famine? Do the others not count?

    Soviet famine of 1932–33
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_famine_of_1932%E2%80%9333

    • Replies: @ben tillman
  33. GRCicotte says:
    @Ano

    Wow. Definitely blockbuster material. Never knew Schiff was a lone crusader. If he was, then how can anything the President does to anyone else (e.g., for violating classification protocols, military officers disobeying direct orders of superiors, objecting to implementation of foreign policy with which they disagreed while responsible for saying “yes, sir,” etc.), possibly be retaliation?

    Did Schiff crusade against “Tell Vladimir I’ll have more flexibility after the [2012] election,” or was that reverse psychology so the President could implement foreign policy by sending arms to Ukraine? Oh, wait! That was blankets in 2012-2016. Ukraine didn’t get defensive missiles from us until 2017 or so.

  34. Ian Smith says:
    @Anonymous

    It’s anti-Communist, anti-NYT, and sheds light on something that public schools NEVER talk about. Jones was a hero and I’m glad to see they’ve made a film to honor him. The fact that Vanessa Kirby is in it makes me want to see it even more!

    • Agree: jim jones
  35. Ian Smith says:
    @anon

    Putin has been a villain ever since he put (((Khodorkovsky))) in the clink.

  36. So, Holdomor is the new Holocaust?

    Is anyone else as sick of the Ukraine as I am?

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
  37. Mr. Anon says:

    Duranty’s first big journalistic coup – and one of the reasons he was so widely respected – was the personal interview he got with Stalin. Journalists really love this kind of stuff. You can still see this now. Sean Hannity thinks himself a fearless ace reporter because he gets one-on-one sitdowns with President Trump.

    However, why should the rest of us – non-journalists – see this as some kind of feat? Gee, you got a powerful politician to use you as a conduit for his line of propaganda. Wow. Impressive.

    • Replies: @Sam Haysom
  38. Mr. Anon says:
    @johnd001

    That movie Bitter Harvest looks to be to Stalin’s Collectivization campaign and the Ukrainian famine what the movie Pearl Harbor was to Pearl Harbor.

  39. @Peter Akuleyev

    Trump has more in common with FDR than anyone would like to admit. The film is anti-communism finally getting its long overdue cultural cachet. If that took widespread TDS inanity/the Bernie surge to bring it far enough down the earth for what passes for elites to finally grasp it so be it.

    • Agree: Redneck farmer
  40. @MikeatMikedotMike

    Two steps forward, one back. Present day Ukraine is akin to the aftermath of our own Cuban Missile Crisis. Saving face will require a great deal of cultural effort along these lines.

  41. @Hibernian

    It was Sherman who said that journalists are worthless drunks. Sherman’s 200 birthday was Saturday.

  42. Anonymous[425] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    One of the greatest living directors.

    No way.

    But her SECRET GARDEN was excellent.

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  43. Dutch Boy says:

    The Ukrainian famine and resulting mass death was an open secret to the foreign press in the Soviet Union but was suppressed by them because revealing it would result in deportation and the loss of their cushy jobs in Moscow. Malcolm Muggeridge discusses the situation well in his autobiography (Chronicles of Wasted Time). Muggeridge evaded censorship about the famine by smuggling out news stories in diplomatic bags.

  44. anon[702] • Disclaimer says:
    @nebulafox

    The Soviet system treated everybody badly.

    False.
    Some people were treated very, very well.
    Read Solzhenitsyn.
    Start with The First Circle.

    (Peter Sarsgaard as Walter Duranty, who won the Pulitzer Prize for covering it up)

    Walter Duranty’s Pulitzer is still in a place of honor inside the New York Times building with the other Pulitzers. They still revere him. It cannot be said too often.

    The NY Times still reveres Stalin’s mouthpiece, his coverup artist who airbrushed genocide.

    • Agree: Liza
  45. @Hibernian

    “It was Sherman, not Sheridan, who said that the only good Indian is a dead Indian.”

    I’m afraid you got that bass ackwards, Hibernian.

  46. @Hibernian

    It was Sheridan who put Sherman’s dictum into practice.

  47. anon[240] • Disclaimer says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    According to IMDB one of the production companies is the Ukrainian State Film Agency.

    Looking at the details of last year’s movie about Midway the Chinese government played a role. As a result, the mass killing of Chinese people in 1942 by the Imperial Japanese Army after the Doolittle raid on Tokyo finally is told in a Western film.

    It must be a bit alarming to certain people in Hollywood, that these other stories are working their way into the US movie market. But bringing in foreign money or other assistance will always come with strings attached. That’s how globalism has affected everyone else in the US, there’s no reason for Hollywood to be exempt.

    • Replies: @Dissident
  48. J.Ross says:
    @Simon in London

    There is this very funny thing happening where they want it both ways, probably less because they honestly expect such a tortured idea to work than because their own ideological rigidity has backed them into a corner. The self-appointed intelligentsia worshipped the Soviet Union and still advocate for Marxism. Starting a decade or more after the official fall of communism, which they still contort apologetics for, they attempted to appeal to the worst anti-Russian hate, more severe than anything in the Cold war, when the Soviet Union had an aggressive international terrorism program. So it’s not only an objective and undeniable case of love communism and hate ethnic Russians, it’s far stupider than that: they want you to hate ethnic Russians for communism, but still love communism. Yezhov and Beria were the fault of Ivan Ivanovich, you see.
    There are several examples of this: the career ending bomb rape film Red Sparrow, but especially Chernobyl, which was very successful and was almost certainly the major influence of, or the thing that convinced producers to back, this film. Chernobyl is literally a worst case scenario illustration of the criminal stupidity of Lenin’s government of intellectuals and dungeons. The disaster never would have happened without Soviet secrecy and “Poli Sci” majors trying to tell real scientists what to do. Mazin’s miniseries maligns Dyatlatov almost to the point of blaming him entirely, and changes history to make him look more badguyish, but also has a great illustration of a brainless political pseudo-functionary such as our diversity officers exposing people to preventable harm (“our time to shine”). Among Trump Derangement Syndrome sufferers, it’s as “powerful” a satirical indictment of the Bad Orange Man as Handmaid’s Tale.
    So “communism good, but Russians bad, in fact so bad that they can screw up communism” is a faith article of theirs, a mystery to be accepted.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    , @Lagertha
  49. anon[350] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    No stretch at all, since the percentage of Russians who consider the Little Georgian the greatest Russian leader in history, and the Soviet Union the absolute best iteration of Mother Russia, has never fallen below 60%, while reaching 70% or more at times.

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
    , @Dissident
  50. @Anonymous

    The Holodomor a/k/a “The Ukrainian Holocaust” has never gotten the coverage it deserved. Hannah Arendt was right when she described the Nazis under The Bohemian Corporal and the Communists under the man they called “Koba” as nothing more than aspects of each other–two sides of the same coin.

  51. Simon says:

    It looks as if Mr. Jones has its heart in the right place, and I see that it also stars Vanessa Kirby, the extraordinarily sexy actress who played the young Princess Margaret in The Crown. Two good reasons to see it.

  52. donut says:
    @anon

    “. Is there any equivalent reflection or contrition in the Jewish community for the spread of communism? ”
    Only regret .

  53. GRCicotte says:
    @Ano

    Wow. Definitely blockbuster material. Never knew Schiff was a lone crusader. If he was, then how can anything the President does to anyone else (e.g., for violating classification protocols, military officers disobeying direct orders of superiors, objecting to implementation of foreign policy with which they disagreed while responsible for saying “yes, sir,” etc.), possibly be retaliation?

  54. hhsiii says:
    @anon

    The first Council of People’s Commissars had one jew out of 16/17. Trotsky. Lenin was 1/4 jewish via his maternal grandfather. There may have been some others with some jewish ancestry but overwhelmingly non-jewish. And yes, Stalin was Georgian. Beria also Georgian Orthodox.

    But then you have Kaganovich, Kamenev, Zinoviev, Yagoda. Nevertheless, I wouldn’t say the bolshies were especially jewish at first, although they were a large part of anti-czar contingent, naturally. More among the Socialist Revolutionary Party and more still among the Mensheviks.

    But 80-85%? Putin was just blowing smoke.

    • Replies: @bigdicknick
    , @gcochran
  55. @Simon in London

    but it’ll be hard for it to not be at least impliedly anti-Communist.

    It would be hard not to be implicitly anti-New York Times, as well. However, I imagine Duranty will be portrayed as some kind of freelancer, or as working for a generic newspaper.

  56. hhsiii says:
    @PhysicistDave

    How bad did gays have it? I was born in 1964 and knew gay adults (not completely out but understood) in the ‘burbs, and certainly in New York City, in the ’70s. My godfather’s Uncle (we called him Uncle, too, although not related by blood) was Julius Monk, a rather well-known club-owner and impresario back in the 1950s and early 1960s. He was pretty openly gay in the ’70s. Not sure what life was like in the 1950s but I presume he got on fine, Rock Hudson, too. My mothers said she knew gay relatives and family friends in the 1940s. You couldn’t be OUT out but people knew, and you weren’t treated like blacks in the South

  57. @Anonymous

    This film is not anti-Communist. It is anti-Stalin.

    Stalin = Putin.

    Simple.

    • Agree: Dan Hayes
    • Replies: @Desiderius
  58. WJ says:
    @Peter Akuleyev

    More of the absurd “Trump likes/colluded with Putin” silliness. Don’t you Dems ever tire of that insanity? It’s the Dem version of the birther conspiracy for their low IQ mouth breathing members, who apparently dominate the party these days. But wait there’s more – according to your last sentence, the American right are now fans of Stalin??

  59. BB753 says:

    It’s safe to say that Duranty was a spy for both the Soviets and the Anglo-Americans. Played both sides. Also, it wasn’t in the interest of Britain or the USA to portray Stalin as a bad guy in those times.

  60. Kronos says:
    @nebulafox

    But some a LOT worse than others…

  61. JimDandy says:
    @Redneck farmer

    The new NYT is perfectly happy to throw the old NYT under the bus to further its Neocon mission to demonize Russia. “We are acknowledging the faults of our long-dead colleagues who we never knew.
    Isn’t that big of us?” they can proudly proclaim.

    • Agree: Liza
  62. @TheBoom

    I assume Durante will be the hero and Jones the villain.

    • LOL: hhsiii
  63. J.Ross says:

    Communism remains popular among people who think they have a right to be stupid (notice the stylized rose, not the one the Spanish use but nevertheless the same symbol):
    https://postimg.cc/hf3Jd7wq

  64. An upcoming movie about a good journalist…

    The term for that is reporter. The term for a bad reporter is journalist.

    As for Duranty, he was a Liverpudlian, like Arthur Wynne, who is still celebrated in New York press circles. But where does the name Duranty come from?

    • Agree: Desiderius
  65. @Old Palo Altan

    It will likely be anti-Communist as well. They’re trying to stop Bernie and convert the neocons now and old Cold Warriors/McCainiacs.

  66. J1234 says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike

    According to IMDB one of the production companies is the Ukrainian State Film Agency. However, I didn’t hear the word Russian spoken in the trailer, only the term Soviet. Hopefully people will make the distinction.

    I agree, Mike. Unless the trailer is intentionally being manipulated to convey an alternate interpretation of the movie, it sounds like the Soviet Union is at least one target of the film, if not the main target. I understand that there are some people within today’s nationalist Russia who are attempting to resurrect the historical image of Stalin, so it’s possible that there could be some parallels made to modern Russia, but it’s impossible to know before seeing the movie.

    It’s also possible that Duranty will be portrayed as someone corrupted by Soviet power/money rather than a false ideology. Again, I’ll have to wait for the movie.

    One of my favorite movies is The Way Back, which was based on a true story about a group of gulag prisoners (led by a Pole) who escaped Stalinist Russia during WW2. Because of conflicting reports about who actually made up the group of escapees (a book written about the event called The Long Walk contained some falsehoods from the person who claimed to be the Pole) there was a mythology circulating around that the story wasn’t true. The story was almost certainly true because a British officer in India remembered interviewing the survivors of the escape attempt after the war. It’s just not known who actually made up the group of escapees, so director Peter Weir used fictitious names in the movie, but not in an attempt to portray the story as fiction.

    The extent to which (if any) the mythology about the story and film being untrue was promoted by media leftists isn’t known. It will be interesting to see if the media will try to negate Mr. Jones. If that happens, I’m guessing that, “Oh no…another all white historical movie,” (as others have mentioned) will be part of it.

    • Thanks: MikeatMikedotMike
  67. @Bill B.

    Why, because Jones is a Welsh name?

    Lemme tell you how all that plays out in my market. In America, we recognize two kinds of British accents: the kind we can understand (King’s English, other educated speech from Australia, Scotland and South Africa), and the kind we need subtitles for.

    Movie characters who speak British usually aren’t playing British characters. A British accent is the accepted convention for “foreign”, for example Sean Connery’s Soviet submarine captain.

    • Replies: @Liza
  68. @Anon

    Historical movies with no black people?

    This one would have been a perfect opportunity to cast a black actor in the role of Paul Robeson. Except that would violate the rule that black characters can’t be suck-ups to villains.

  69. @hhsiii

    you weren’t treated like blacks in the South

    Blacks in the South weren’t treated especially poorly. They just weren’t allowed to wreck cities and wantonly attack whites.

    Looking at things such as illegitimacy and violent crime rates, they have much it worse today than pre Civil Privileges Era.

    • Replies: @Hhsiii
  70. @Anonymous

    Was this Tribe of which you speak operating in a demonstrably organized fashion, or were they just the far right tail of the IQ bell curve alongside some descending goyische nobles?

    Well, it can’t be the latter, since the defining characteristics of the Bolshevik leadership were psychopathy, misanthropy, and evil rather than intelligence.

  71. George says:

    Mark Tauger is an agricultural academic who takes a more nuanced view of the Holodomor. search on Mark Tauger Holodomor for links. One of his areas of interest is historical famines, not just Ukraine.

    Review of Anne Applebaum’s “Red Famine: Stalin’s War on Ukraine”
    https://historynewsnetwork.org/article/169438

  72. Hhsiii says:
    @William Badwhite

    your random gay didn’t go to segregated schools or be denied service. My family is North Carolina, both sides. Not buying they didn’t have it bad. Most got along ok, sure, and not talking quality of life. But I’m just talking relative treatment.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
  73. Asked why they accepted the roles, James Norton and Peter Sarsgaard replied “We all want to be big, big stars—but we’ve got different reasons for that….”

  74. Veracitor says:

    I haven’t found the New York Times’ review yet, so I wonder… how will they square the circle?

    Of course if the movie makes Duranty or Stalin look bad, then the movie is bad. But if the movie portrays Ukrainians as victims of Russians then it is good. Will the New York Times’ writers and computers succumb to the Kirk Effect?

  75. Jones’s mother was the governess to John Hughes’ grandchildren in Donetsk, then Hughesovka. Eastern Ukrainian was industrialised by Welsh engineers. Jones spoke perfect Russian. His father was military. He went to school in Wales. He thus probably spoke in a relatively shallow Welsh accent (I do myself). Huw Edwards who reads the BBC News would be a good example. Anthony Hopkins another. So James Norton is in with a chance. That said one of my son’s friends has refused to go to see the film in Swansea on Wednesday because he can’t stand fake Welsh accents.

    I’ve read Jones’ reports. He at no time claims there was an attempt to starve Ukrainians specifically. He did think that the Kulaks were targeted. He had made a previous trip to the Lower Volga during another famine with the heir to the Heinz fortune who was investigating how to reduce famine. He was a political Liberal. His family still are, so he was not inclined to admire the Bolsheviks. In that, the film will probably be accurate. Kruschaev boasted of having personally arrested many of the Welsh owners and managers of the Donbass mines, steelworks and metal factories.

    Duranty was the Peter Lavelle of his day.

    Jones was murdered in Manchuria by two or three hundred NKVD troops who crossed the border to get him. Ian Fleming was in Moscow with Jones and Jones is one of the many people mashed up into James Bond.

  76. @hhsiii

    First politburo was 4/7 jewish and lenin was also a member.
    First troika was 2/3rds Jewish.
    So of the 3 most powerful people in 1922-1925 USSR 2 were jews.

    I’d say that’s a pretty high level of cohencidences.

    • Replies: @hhsiii
  77. Where are the persons of color? Idris Elba isn’t portraying a Ukrainian peasant swinging a sickle and schwitzing like a schwarzte? Can’t expect American woke folk to get upset over some flaxen-haired, blue-eyed Ukrainians dying of starvation and documented cannibalism.

    #holodmor-so-white https://www.rferl.org/a/holodomor-ukraine/25174454.html

    After all, it’s not as if they lynched the victims, by crikey. To commit a thought crime, try to be objective and take in the numbers at the following WikiPedia pages:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_in_the_United_States#Statistics

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_famines

  78. Neoconned says:

    The Holomodor is haunting. There are photos online of parents having cannibalized their kids to survive…

  79. @Simon

    We Calvinists are watching The Crown Season 3 right now, and although it’s still very well-made and at times excellent (e.g. the episode on the 1966 Aberfan mining disaster), the wholesale swap-out of the original cast for the current bunch is not a success.

    Olivia Coleman is, in one sense, a marvel: yes, she’s a good actress, but she’s actually older and not as attractive as the woman she’s playing — how often does that happen in the movies and TV?

    And yes, although Bellatrix Bonham-Carter is very good as Princess Margaret, she’s also far older and less pretty. Vanessa Kirby had nailed the part, and looked fantastic.

    Season 3’s events begin in the mid-1960s, when the Queen would have been coming up on 40, and Princess Margaret only in her mid-30s. Clair Foy is currently 35, and Vanessa Kirby is 31. Couldn’t they have been kept on for at least one more season of the show? I gather the later episodes in Season 3 are set in the 1970s, but I for one would have been happy to mentally add a few years to Vanessa Kirby’s charming visage to satisfy the demands of historical verisimilitude.

    • Agree: Veracitor
  80. Kyle says:
    @Peter Akuleyev

    That’s absurd. How do you reconcile these thoughts in your head?

  81. @Philip Owen

    Good post.

    Reminds me of John Scott’s Behind the Urals, which was often required reading for American students learning Slavic languages during the Cold War.

  82. @johnd001

    Looks interesting, but it’s only being made now because it’s suddenly politically expedient to attack Russia. Expect them to emphasize how different Stalin was than their good guy Lenin at some point.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    , @Lagertha
  83. @Anonymous

    People who look at this movie as if it depicts “history” do not understand the nature of movies.

    Listen up, class.

    Movies are always about the times they are made in. Always. No matter what time they are set in, they never have anything to do with the time they are set in. They are always and forever about their now.

    Just sayin’.

    • Agree: dfordoom
  84. @anon

    Gee, and I wonder why that is. Couldn’t possibly be anything Stalin and the Soviet Union did that makes people love them so extremely and devotedly. No, that’s not possible.

    You people are hypocrites. You use that exact same argument in another context, except in that argument it’s completely possible.

    • Replies: @Sam Haysom
  85. @Mr. Anon

    People here are so retarded. In what world does Hannity (who sucks by the way) exude even a hint of that characterization. For a guy pulling down eight figures he’s positively humble. So funny how boomers to a man use chick-like gestalt criticism. “I don’t like that guy so he has all the bad characteristics I can think of.”

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
  86. @obwandiyag

    Im assuming your 2nd paragraph is intentionally elliptical. What is the hypocrisy you are criticizing exactly? Or are you just mad that the typical rhetorical hot foot that Russophiles here ponderously tap out “Russians aren’t Soviets man” is pretty much a spurious distinction. If George Wallace were still the most popular politician in Alabama then the white supremacy critique might make sense. Scratch a Russian and you are going to get a someone broadly sympathetic to Stalinism.

    • Replies: @obwandiyag
  87. @Philip Owen

    He thus probably spoke in a relatively shallow Welsh accent (I do myself). Huw Edwards who reads the BBC News would be a good example. Anthony Hopkins another. So James Norton is in with a chance.

    Liam Dutton?

    • LOL: Philip Owen
  88. @J.Ross

    So “communism good, but Russians bad, in fact so bad that they can screw up communism” is a faith article of theirs, a mystery to be accepted.

    Well put!

  89. Mr. Anon says:
    @Sam Haysom

    People here are so retarded.

    Well, you are, but I wouldn’t generalize.

    In what world does Hannity (who sucks by the way) exude even a hint of that characterization. For a guy pulling down eight figures he’s positively humble.

    He has much to be humble about. As Lawrence Auster said of him: “He looks stupid. He sounds stupid. He is stupid.”

    • Replies: @Sam Haysom
  90. hhsiii says:
    @bigdicknick

    Ah, thanks to you and Gcochran for pointing that out. 4/7ths also killed on Stalin’s orders. Or 5/7ths.

    Still, 80% is kinda random. And the broad-based party not as concentrated as the leadership. Nevertheless, I stand corrected.

    • Replies: @bigdicknick
  91. @Mr. Anon

    Lol you are witless. No wonder you like Lawrence Auster so much. Another womanly thinker. You are dumber, poorer, uglier, and fuck less than hannity and yet you are laughably arrogant. What gives?

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
  92. @Anonymous

    Here we disagree completely. In my view, she is one of the 10-15 greatest directors alive.

    Coen brothers , Tarantino, … need not apply.

  93. @S. Anonyia

    Jones was a Liberal with a capital L. No way did he sympathize with the Bolsheviks. His mother lost fiends to them.

  94. @Hhsiii

    your random gay didn’t go to segregated schools or be denied service

    “Segregated” schools just means they were sent to school with other blacks and denied access to whites. Blacks weren’t denied service at black-owned establishments, just at white-owned ones. Nothing whites did prevented them from building their own societies.

    The alternative to treating blacks “badly” is treating whites badly, by forcing whites to interact with them and to allow blacks to destroy things. And in this scenario, blacks still live with other blacks and go to school with other blacks, so they’re not escaping their dysfunction, just spreading it onto others. They’re still not being educated, they’re still murdering and robbing each other.

    Often there is no perfect outcome and you have to go with the less bad one. By your logic, not allowing a wolf to live in your house is treating the wolf poorly.

    Not buying they didn’t have it bad

    I’m not buying they don’t still have it bad. The difference between us is I know that what makes it bad for them is innate, not something whites do.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
    , @Hhsiii
  95. @William Badwhite

    Putting it another way, the treatment blacks have received from whites whether before Civil Privileges or after, is vastly better than what they would have received from each other if left on their own. Thus they weren’t treated badly by whites, but were and are being treated well. We’re just discussing degrees of how well. Whites treat them well by tolerating them at all.

    • Replies: @ben tillman
  96. Mr. Anon says:
    @Sam Haysom

    Opening a sentence with LOL is a marker for idiocy. Auster was an intelligent guy. You are not. You’ve never written a sentence here that wasn’t stupid. Hannity is the kind of “journalist” that morons like you deserve.

  97. @hhsiii

    yes the vast majority of the jews were eventually purged and the USSR got way less horrifically violent over time. A lot of the jews were into the whole world wide socialism thing. I.e. using russia as a base to launch a permanent war until communism was violently imposed worldwide.

    • Replies: @Hhsiii
  98. MEH 0910 says:

    • Replies: @MEH 0910
  99. @William Badwhite

    Back in the 1920’s, of every $15 spent on the education of black children in South Carolina’s segregated schools, $14 came from white taxpayers.

    • Thanks: William Badwhite
  100. Anonymous[285] • Disclaimer says:

    “Ukranian famine?”

    I’m sorry but I think you mean Ukranian Holocaust. As defined in the 20th century, a Holocaust is a deliberate murder of a mass number of the same group of people with common lineage, especially as performed by that group’s own legal government.

    Let us use precise terminology in an evolving language, please. I can think of no valid reason not to.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
  101. @Sam Haysom

    Just another idiot who doesn’t know what I’m talking about, too stupid to figure out, and yet presumes to pass judgment. Hardehar.

  102. Liza says:
    @International Jew

    Movie characters who speak British usually aren’t playing British characters. A British accent is the accepted convention for “foreign”, for example Sean Connery’s Soviet submarine captain.

    Thank you. Everybody I know gets all upset when an actor who speaks real British English plays the role of a foreigner. I try telling them that the only other option is to have the film full of foreign actors speaking their mother tongue to make the film more “authentic”. Which would necessitate subtitles. Etc.

    • Replies: @hhsiii
  103. Dissident says:
    @anon

    But bringing in foreign money or other assistance will always come with strings attached.

    True, as it is for all money and assistance; these inevitably come with strings attached. There’s No Free Lunch (TNFL) The moment a man accepts a gift or a favor from anyone, he is no longer completely his own man.

    • Replies: @Lagertha
  104. Hhsiii says:
    @William Badwhite

    I still think gays weren’t treated that badly, which is my main point.

    • Replies: @William Badwhite
  105. Hhsiii says:
    @bigdicknick

    Yes, that was a putative conflict between Stalin and Trotsky, socialism in Russian sphere versus world revolution.

  106. Dissident says:
    @anon

    No stretch at all, since the percentage of Russians who consider the Little Georgian the greatest Russian leader in history, and the Soviet Union the absolute best iteration of Mother Russia, has never fallen below 60%, while reaching 70% or more at times.

    How accurate are those figures? Would someone such as, say, Anatoly Karlin, accept them?

  107. Interesting that after the “Russian hacking” nonsense from the 2016 elections, suddenly the Russians are the bad guys. I’m sure back during the cold war, the mostly leftist movie industry would not dare make an anti-soviet movie.

  108. Hirflawdd says:

    I read a fair amount of Jones’s journalism years ago. One thing is evident from his wirk is that this was a widespread famine, not just restricted to the Ukraine but equally devastating elsewhere. If the film makes this a Russia v Ukraine thing then it’s a nonsense.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    , @guest
  109. @Anonymous

    According to Jones’s work it was not a Ukranian Holocaust. It was a Soviet straticide. The targets were the remaining Kulaks and Stolylpin peasants. The whole Black Earth was affected.

    • Replies: @guest
  110. @Hirflawdd

    Dywed teulu Jones fod y ffilm yn wir ar y cyfan.

    Roedd yng Nghaerdydd. It was the premiere. His great nephew spoke. I am going to the film tonight though (Cinema & Co Swansea – book on Eventbrite).

  111. guest says:

    Not be moment too soon!

    Meanwhile, Ted Turner’s Gone with the Wind Network (TCM) Continues running Stalinist propaganda movies like the North Star.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  112. guest says:
    @Hirflawdd

    Except there was a Russia vs. Ukraine thing, and they can make a movie about that if they want to.

    It’s really neither here nor there that people also died in Azerbaijan or wherever. Unless they explicitly state people ONLY starved in the Ukraine. But why would they?

    If you want to make a movie about the U.S. at war with Japan, you don’t also have to show Japan fighting China or Russia fighting Germany. Though these things occurred simultaneously.

  113. @Hhsiii

    I still think gays weren’t treated that badly

    Yes I agree with you on that.

  114. guest says:
    @Philip Owen

    Yeah, and Nazis killed more than just Jews, yet somehow they get their own Holocaust.

    There definitely was a war against non-Russian nationalism, and Ukraine was a big threat in that arena. And they also had a lot of kulaks, or rather people who could be called kulaks.

    I don’t know what you have in mind for what qualifies as a holocaust, but this definitely fits the U.N. definition of genocide.

    • Replies: @hhsiii
  115. Anonymous[411] • Disclaimer says:
    @Philip Owen

    If you want to hear an example of a Welsh accent, play The Velvet’s “The Gift” with the left channel muted.

  116. hhsiii says:
    @guest

    When I was telling my friend who has a bit of a thing for Soviet evil that my wife’s grandmother’s family in Ukraine had 2 cows back during the war, he said “definitely kulaks.”

    She, my grandmother-in-law, told us that the germans came and occupied her family farm, and then told them to go hide in the woods. When they came back the germans had all been killed and the partisans had burned their farm. Her brother then joined the partisans and they never saw him again.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
  117. hhsiii says:
    @Liza

    Death of Stalin. All yanks and brits, only russian accents with the walk-on type cast.

    • Thanks: Liza
  118. MEH 0910 says:
    @MEH 0910

    THE FRENCH DISPATCH | Official Trailer

    THE FRENCH DISPATCH brings to life a collection of stories from the final issue of an American magazine published in a fictional 20th-century French city. It stars Benicio del Toro, Adrien Brody, Tilda Swinton, Léa Seydoux, Frances McDormand, Timothée Chalamet, Lyna Khoudri, Jeffrey Wright, Mathieu Amalric, Stephen Park, Bill Murray and Owen Wilson.

    Directed by: Wes Anderson

  119. I finally saw the film “Mr Jones” at Cinema&Co in Swansea. it is still not on general release but the Curzon Cinema chain is doing a general release in the UK in April. It was shown in Cardiff last week. The first few showings sold out. There is still a screening tomorrow at Chapter Arts Centre.

    Most other people in the audience were from the Swansea Ukrainian Association plus some Latvians and Estonians with their spouses. Most of the rest were Welsh people who had relatives in Hughesovka. Not all of them survived the Bolsheviks. I think that everyone in the audience was a specialist. I ended up wearing a Ukrainian poppy.

    It is much more watchable than I expected. Given the difficult subject matter, a massive famine that killed millions, I expected it either a very worthy but boring drama documentary or a Ukrainian nationalist rant. In his writing Jones did not suggest that the Holomodor was directed at Ukrainians. He thought it was directed at independent peasants. Former Kulaks and Stolypin Peasants. With the exception of one phrase from a peasant woman, which could even have been an expression of Orthodoxy, the film avoided the nationalist/class war argument. It focussed on the Ukraine but Jones also quoted his mother about the whole Black Earth region. The film just showed the misery of the people. The locations were very similar to the real thing. I have been to the Russian Embassy in London and the Metropole Hotel in Moscow. They found very similar settings in which to film.

    I worked for AEI, the successor company to MetroVick. The Moscow scenes included the imprisonment of the 6 MetroVick engineers arrested for spying, a major furore at the time. (As far as the company was concerned it was an excuse by the SU not to pay for the turbines the SU had purchased). They also showed how foreign correspondents in Moscow could be trapped by debauchery, domestic bliss (perhaps unavailable to a crippled warhero back home) and simple blackmail. Modern journalists aware of this might be overreacting.

    The English actors who tried Welsh accents did not overdo it. They intoned in a modest Welsh inflection for a sentence or two and then slipped into standard English. No one in the audience groaned. James Nolan, the actor who played Jones spoke Russian to camera.it is a family language for him. He did not attempt to speak Welsh on camera. In his conversations with Jonees’ father, the actors were behind a window so the Welsh conversation could be dubbed. The Russian, Ukrainian and Welsh dialogues are all subtitled. The original Jones spoke Russian very well. His mother was governess to John Hughes’ grandchildren and later taught English to the workers at the factories before returning to Wales.

    I will watch it again but I am a specialist. 4 to 5 stars. The scenes of the famine in the country around Stalino/Hughesovka were a little too episodic. They could have been joined together better. There could have been more of Jones’s backstory and his mother’s adventure. His real motivations included more personal issues. He probably received support from surviving colleagues of the Welsh engineers around Hughesovka but did not reveal it to protect them.

  120. @hhsiii

    My oldest friend in Russia talked about two cows being enough for the other peasants to turn against you. The reasons are complicated. Most weren’t Kulaks. They were “Stolypin Peasants”. Peasants who took the risk of buying their own land after the Stolypin reforms rather than living the collective life of the traditional Mir (a group of peasants who farmed land and paid taxes together).

  121. Lagertha says:
    @J.Ross

    I’m waiting for a film about the people who were really behind the murder of the Romanov family, far away in a small town. All the killers’ ethnic identity should be revealed. I wonder if Chinese & Russian money is behind pulling the masks off of Hollywood/American media – because they can…Hollywood is way too dependent on globalism, financially, now, too. Oh, the irony! Maybe there will be a Spring Time for Mao!

  122. Lagertha says:
    @Dissident

    and this, this explains all of our corrupt members of Congress, CIA, NSA, etc.

  123. Lagertha says:
    @S. Anonyia

    And my pet peeve: was it necessary to kill the Romanov family? The shooters backgrounds need to be exposed. Killing of all those young women & the boy, not to mention the Czar & Czarina, today, would be the most horrific killing of innocents by guns, in a century! Gun violence propagandists killed at the wrong time in history!

  124. J.Ross says:
    @guest

    Check out if you have not Mission to Moscow. It’s Hollywood, but* literally Stalinist propaganda justifying show trials and trying to get them started in the US. There’s a show trial scene (“I deliberately contracted syphilis” — oh, wait, different movie, or was it?) and a scene where an American engineer tries to convince a member of FDR’s cabinet that American labor is bursting with Hitlerite saboteurs and needs show trials.

    *”but”

  125. @hhsiii

    hhsiii sasked me:

    How bad did gays have it? I was born in 1964 and knew gay adults (not completely out but understood) in the ‘burbs, and certainly in New York City, in the ’70s.

    Well, I am referring to the Midwest in the mid-twentieth century, and it was really strange.

    On the one hand, the publicly stated attitude was that homosexuality was a horrible evil, almost as bad as rape, and it was good it was illegal.

    On the other hand, Liberace was obviously gay (though I believe he always denied it), was generally viewed as gay, and yet was a popular entertainer even among conservative Americans.

    Of the teachers I had in junior high and high school, one was known by the other teachers to be gay, another was rather obviously gay, and a third was most probably gay. And yet all three were dedicated, serious teachers who cared about their students and who were therefore treated with respect and even fondness by everyone.

    One, an English teacher, was probably the best teacher I ever had (even better than Dick Feynman): his insistence that we strive to develop our full capabilities helped me not only in English but even in STEM courses.

    So, were the lives of gay folks simply filled with ongoing terror and despair? No, not at all.

    On the other hand, the laws were such that, potentially, their lives could be destroyed: a well-known case of this was of course Alan Turing.

    Those laws did need to be changed.

    However, I see no need to “celebrate” gayness. Simply leave them alone. And when they do something of public value, whether it is being a great teacher or physician or artist or mathematician, celebrate that achievement, independent of their personal sexual behavior.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    , @nebulafox
  126. @PhysicistDave

    I agree generally with what you said and I had similar experiences, but Alan Turing brought his troubles on himself. No one was out to persecute him.

  127. nebulafox says:
    @PhysicistDave

    Moreover, I think Turing would have rather been remembered for what he did in life than who he slept with, as would anybody who is worth knowing, gay or otherwise.

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