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From Crain’s New York Business:

In backing legalization, de Blasio slams ‘Big Marijuana’
JONATHAN LAMANTIA, December 20, 2018 03:35 PM

Bloomberg News
Mayor Bill de Blasio is all for legalizing recreational use of marijuana, as long as corporations don’t get rich in the process.

The mayor on Thursday announced his support for a state plan to make recreational marijuana accessible to adults, but his instructions for Gov. Andrew Cuomo were clear—don’t let corporate cannabis take over the market.

Instead, de Blasio said, the industry should be led by local small businesses, and efforts should be made to promote the involvement of black and Hispanic residents who have accounted for a disproportionate number of arrests for possession of marijuana despite similar consumption rates as white New Yorkers.

If we are going to have legal drugs, I don’t want highly efficient giant corporations using the magic of the market to sell a pound of Lipton brand marijuana for $24.99 at Walmart or a quarter kilo of Coca-Cola brand cocaine at Costco for $199.99, I want America served by dingy shops owned and operated by characters out of a 1970s Cheech & Chong movie. I want the full might of the regulatory state focused on the marijuana industry to be as diverse as imaginable, with physically handicapped shelf-stockers and mentally handicapped bookkeepers.

iSteve commenter Andrew M writes:

Be careful what you wish for. In the Netherlands, which decriminalized pot way back in the 1970s, the only sales channel is through small “coffee shops”, staffed by stoners themselves. The result is that they’re rather cool places to be: the vibe is relaxed, the staff are knowledgeable and interested in their product, and there isn’t that modern restaurant habit of trying to make you pay and leave as quickly as possible.

While that would be great in a restaurant, it’s probably not a good thing to have a cannabis store which is actually a more enjoyable place than a Starbucks. I’d rather have pot sold under the DMV model: bored black women serving slow-moving lines in a gray-brown office, 9-5 only. Obtaining drugs shouldn’t be enjoyable.

Maybe the Department of Motor Vehicles should have a monopoly on the prostitution business as well? “You want what? That’s disgusting. Okay, stand in this line. … Or maybe that line. You figure it out.”

 
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  1. Bill came up with this idea in college.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @ThreeCranes
  2. Dan Hayes says:

    Steve,

    NYC’s bodega owners are chomping at the bit to sell marijuana at their mom-and-pop stores. They argue since they are already authorized to sell beer and lotto tickets, why not weed? Their claims are regarded as perfectly logical and moral in Sodom & Gomorrah On The Hudson!

    • Replies: @Clifford Brown
  3. Andrew M says:

    Be careful what you wish for. In the Netherlands, which decriminalized pot way back in the 1970s, the only sales channel is through small “coffee shops”, staffed by stoners themselves. The result is that they’re rather cool places to be: the vibe is relaxed, the staff are knowledgeable and interested in their product, and there isn’t that modern restaurant habit of trying to make you pay and leave as quickly as possible.

    While that would be great in a restaurant, it’s probably not a good thing to have a cannabis store which is actually a more enjoyable place than a Starbucks. I’d rather have pot sold under the DMV model: bored black women serving slow-moving lines in a gray-brown office, 9-5 only. Obtaining drugs shouldn’t be enjoyable.

    • Replies: @Gilbert Ratchet
    , @Jack D
  4. Moshe says:

    General Alaadin joke received!

  5. Anon[145] • Disclaimer says: • Website

    From Melting Pot to Smoking Pot.

    • Replies: @AnotherDad
  6. Anon1 says:

    Vietnamese are going to monopolize this space.

  7. Yeah marijuana legalization is about the peak of libertarian stupidity. The problem with libertarians is they think if something doesn’t hurt anyone else then it should be allowed because muh freedom.

    This is dumb. Unless you are living as a hermit on an island literally everything you do has a small positive or negative effect on other people. Literally everything. The pothead with amotivational syndrome who sits in the basement all day isn’t just hurting himself. By failing to actively contribute to society he makes that society poorer and more dysfunctional. A society of potheads would rapidly collapse.

    I mean if everyone in a society wanted to lobotomize themselves libertarians would probably think that was A-1 super as long as they didn’t lobotomize anyone else without their consent. Of course they never look two or three steps ahead to see that after a while either 1.) the non lobotomized would need to be feeding the lobotomized 2.) the lobotomized would starve 3.) the lobotomized would forcibly take stuff from the non-lobotomized. You know what an even better option would be? 4.) Outlawing self-lobotomization.

    And before “but alcohol” yes I also think there should be more restrictions on alcohol. And before “I smoke pot daily and I’m super-duper successful” we’re talking about averages here. I mean Paul Erdot took amphetamines every day and was incredibly successful, should we therefore legalize amphetamines? And before “but my chronic pain” I actually think marijuana should be legal for those over 40 for precisely this reason. I personally think it’s better than opioids for chronic pain. But that’s different than selling it to bored healthy teenagers.

  8. @SimpleSong

    What part of eugenic cleansing don’t you understand?

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
  9. Steve, the terms are “physically handicapable” and “cognitively different”. I thought you already knew!

  10. Yeah marijuana legalization is about the peak of libertarian stupidity

    Marijuana is the greatest thing… ever! Smoking it doesn’t harm you at all in fact it’s good for you? you can drive with it, you don’t get addicted, no one get’s addicted! It helps cure cancer! It’s racist to object to it. Arresting minorities for smoking it is racist. It has no harmful effects on the body and mind at all!

    It’s amazing how much I smell it, every day, in NYC. I see hospital and constructions workers on break smoking it – and these are the ones stupid enough to smoke it in public -zero enforcement – yet if you light up a cigarette in a bar the cops will be there in 15 minutes (unless it’s cop bar).

  11. @Andrew M

    “it’s probably not a good thing to have a cannabis store which is actually a more enjoyable place than a Starbucks. I’d rather have pot sold under the DMV model: bored black women serving slow-moving lines in a gray-brown office, 9-5 only. Obtaining drugs shouldn’t be enjoyable.”

    For the longest time, bars (“hotels”) in Ontario operated on this principle. Drinking was bad and not to be encouraged.

    • Replies: @captflee
  12. bomag says:

    Whenever I encounter someone making an earnest argument for drug legalization, I’ll work around to asking them if they want corporate titans such as P&G and Unilever unleashing modern marketing techniques on the addictive drug market. A reliable show stopper.

    • Agree: ACommenter
  13. tyrone says:

    How about white dudes open the pot stores and black dudes rob them………it just seams right don’t you know.

    • Replies: @Anon
  14. wiseguy says:

    Blacks should be given the right to sell official N-word passes instead.

    • LOL: Harry Baldwin
  15. nebulafox says:

    I’ve got a better idea: why not let the inner-city black underclass have drugs like Indians have casinos, in exchange for giving up any claims to reparations or whatever? It could be a pretty lucrative biz, and the state could even regulate it-just like prostitution, which I’m also in favor of legalizing. There’s their ticket for getting some economic power going within the ghetto, and with the War on Drugs presumably ending, it might start paving the road for normal societal mechanisms to take hold again. This is to be strictly the domain of those whose ancestors were slaves and who are trapped at the bottom of American society: no African or Caribbean immigrants, no black bourgeoisie, this is their thing. Added bonus: this screws the cartels over, big time.

    All it’ll take is willingness for them to throw white liberals under the bus and cut a deal with the (presumably New Right) President offering this. The white liberals deep down think it’ll never happen, because to them, blacks are benevolent children who need to be protected from the bad children by them, the wise adults whom *everybody* else should trust and know their place around. But I strongly suspect your average working-class black dude isn’t operating according to that calculus.

  16. Jack D says:
    @Andrew M

    Funny you should say that, because in Pennsylvania (where the liquor stores are owned by the state to this very day) that’s exactly what the liquor stores used to be like. They were set up like pharmacies with the bored black clerk standing behind a counter taking orders from the slow moving line. You had to know what you wanted because nothing was on display. Clerks were not allowed to make recommendations because the state was concerned about kickbacks from vendors. “A pint of MD 20/20 please” and the clerk would disappear into the back and come out 10 minutes later. “We’re out of MD 20/20” (actually there is plenty but it’s still in a carton in the back and the clerk doesn’t feel like moving any boxes). OK, then, a pint of Pink Ripple. Cash only accepted – buying liquor on credit (cards) was thought to lead to unaffordable purchases.

    Maybe this really did cut down on drinking in the poorer sections (though I doubt it) but for the middle class consumer it meant that shopping for wine was almost as much fun as shopping for toilet paper in the USSR.

  17. Jack D says:
    @SimpleSong

    I think there should be regulation on THC content. In my younger days I would smoke a joint now and then and the leafy Mexican pot would produce a mild but pleasant buzz that did not disable you. It was comparable to drinking two or three beers. But on the rare occasions I have tried in more recent times, pot nowadays, thru the wonder of plant breeding and improvements in planting practice, consists of incredibly concentrated resinous buds that hit you (or at least me) like a 2×4 and send the room spinning. It’s more like downing half a dozen double martinis.

    Maybe when pot is legalized (and for all I know this exists already) they will produce some kind of retro 1970s grass for geezers.

    • Agree: ThreeCranes
    • Replies: @Lot
    , @Erik L
    , @Stan d Mute
  18. @Ghost of Bull Moose

    “Strabismus is a condition in which the eyes point in different directions. Usually one eye is pointed straight ahead and the other is pointed in, out, up, or down. With normal vision, both eyes are aimed at the same target and the brain blends the 2 similar pictures into one clear, three-dimensional picture (called binocular vision). With strabismus, 2 different pictures are sent to the brain. In a young child, the brain starts to ignore the picture from one of the eyes, and the child loses vision in this eye. This loss of vision is called amblyopia, or lazy eye. People who develop strabismus as adults often have double vision because the brain is used to processing 2 pictures and cannot easily ignore the picture from the turned eye. Some types of strabismus are:
    Esotropia or “crossed eye”: an eye turns in.
    Exotropia or “wall-eye”: an eye turns out.

    “No Bill, over here.” No wonder he’s confused. He sees two of the same thing and mistakes that for alleged liberal impartiality, the ability to see the both sides of every issue.

    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
  19. anon[217] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    WOW, I was just going to say exactly that about Ontario, so I guess they had the same model. Ontario had a lot of other weird rules, like separate sides of the same building for bars (single men, hard drinkers, sawdust on the floor) and taverns (tables, food, ladies), and curtains on the windows (so people wouldn’t be “tempted” to go in, or so that ladies wouldn’t faint?).

    Beer was sold in govt. “beer stores” on the outskirts of town, like a modern Costco.

    “Obtaining drugs shouldn’t be enjoyable.”

    Can’t speak for the liquor stores (LCBO’s, for Liquor Control Board of Ontario) but the beer stores led to people simply buying more per trip; instead of a 6-pack, they’d (we’d) buy a “suitcase” of 24. These are the Molson boxes you see in the background of Doug & Bob Mackensie’s living room on SCTV.

    Weirdly, the drinking age was lower than in Michigan (18 vs. 21). I guess they felt secure enough with all the other rules. So of course, teenagers from Detroit would go over to Windsor to drink; great idea, encourage drinking AND driving.

  20. Wally says:
    @SimpleSong

    said:
    “Yeah marijuana legalization is about the peak of libertarian stupidity. The problem with libertarians is they think if something doesn’t hurt anyone else then it should be allowed because muh freedom.
    This is dumb. Unless you are living as a hermit on an island literally everything you do has a small positive or negative effect on other people. Literally everything.
    The pothead with amotivational syndrome who sits in the basement all day isn’t just hurting himself. By failing to actively contribute to society he makes that society poorer and more dysfunctional. A society of potheads would rapidly collapse.”

    Except the “potheads” can do all of that because of the free ride they are given via ‘government’ / taxpayers handouts.

    Libertarians oppose the seizure of taxpayers money for such enabling, anti-society, employment discouraging handouts.

    Cheers.

    • Replies: @ACommenter
    , @SimpleSong
  21. Lot says:
    @Jack D

    THC content has gone from about 5% up until about 1995 to 25% now, or 50-100% in legally sold extracts.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  22. Janus says:
    @Jack D

    I remember you could only buy beer in Pennsylvania by the case at the state-run stores. Seemed like a strange way to discourage excessive drinking.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  23. Jack D says:
    @Lot

    What the difference between “legally sold extracts” and what used to be called hashish or hash?

    • Replies: @BenKenobi
    , @Stan d Mute
  24. just wanted to point out, yet again – the war on drugs doesn’t end because of this. in fact, it gets worse in some ways.

    new york state sees taxes to collect – so that raises the price of their supplied marijuana. i’m an enterprising young entrepreneur, and i think i can undercut their prices. by bringing in my marijuana from mexico. or canada. or my 100 acre farm in the middle of nowhere, flyover country.

    how does new york state keep my marijuana out? does drug interdiction drop to zero? or does the state now have to monitor all the marijuana in the entire area, to make sure nobody is undercutting them and interfering in their number 1 function – the power to tax you.

    because the state is now the only authorized supplier, a dozen entrepreneurs will be gunning to undercut them, except, they can’t do it legally, like any other industry. so it’s all illegal. which is what every state that has legalized this stuff is going thru. and they get less tax revenue from this than they expected. because they are getting undercut at every turn. plus, they have to maintain their drug interdiction budgets and operations anyway.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    , @ACommenter
  25. There is no simple solution, simplesong. Libs think, “Legalize!” and Cons think, “Enforce!” and we seem to wind up with neither.

    I’ve been saying all along, and so far it’s true in CA, that the state will spend far more enforcing laws concerning legal pot than it ever did trying to enforce laws against illegal pot.

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
  26. NJ is closer to legalizing pot than NY. Senator Scutari’s bill here required marijuana workers to be unionized–a very clever way to take the industry from black and brown hands and put it into white union members hands, who form the backbone of the Dem state party’s constituency. Too old to longshore or plow snow? Here, we’ll give you a nice job dispensing pot all day.

    • Replies: @Anon
  27. Think of how much good having a liquor store on every corner has done for the black community.

    Might as well add weed. What could possibly go wrong?

    • Replies: @AndrewR
  28. densa says:
    @SimpleSong

    Good point about the libertarian blind spot. It applies to free markets, too. While markets as free as possible are a good thing, it doesn’t follow that letting those with the power to buy congress do whatever they want works for the country as a whole. That’s the missing part: individuals exist in society, by necessity. So, serving the individual requires having a healthy, functioning society.

    Here’s a current example. President Kushner is getting the band together for Trump’s newest hit called MAGA Immigration. The Grifter gets together a bunch of outsized corporate job creators (just ask them) to explain how they need to bring in millions of immigrants to do the jobs that Americans are, apparently, too stoned to do.

    On drums is Select Milk Producers, a consortium of 92 supersized dairies in TX, IN, MI, and WI. They need lots of slave labor, but their industry complains that most of them are illegal, and they have horrid regulations like providing housing for the legal ones. Close to half of their workers are immigrants.

    Course, I want to know about how much these workers are paid and how much of their salary we pay in providing housing, education for their many children, healthcare, food stamps, welfare and such.

    So, Select goes into business with Glanbia plc. and some others to create Spartan Michigan, LLC., which promptly announces that it is creating 249 jobs. It doesn’t mention that it is petitioning the White House to bring in more immigrants because it’s currently possible that 125 jobs might go to the natives.

    Not mentioned is why do American dairy farmers need a partner in Ireland? Right, so they can avoid paying taxes to support their subsidized importation of labor.

    And of course there is no connection between mega-corporate dairies and the continued problem of smaller producers who actually provide jobs being driven out of business by tax-dodging pseudo-job providers who swear they believe in free markets.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @SimpleSong
  29. Jack D says:
    @anon

    Ontario and PA had virtually the same system. In PA it was (is) the PLCB and in Ontario the LCBO
    (Liquor Control Board). Some other states (and provinces) did too. Emphasis on Control. Beer was also sold only by “beer distributors” and you could not buy less than a case of 24. How this was supposed to discourage drinking I don’t know.

    Over time the beer distributors (like car dealers) became a wealthy and powerful force of political donors at the state level and they have stood in the way of any reform. Also the workforce in the state liquor stores is unionized so they are another choke point. Exactly the kind of rent seeking that you would expect from such a system.

  30. @Wally

    …except that ‘libertarians’ mysteriously only advocate legalizing drugs, not ending affirmative action quotas, lunch counter laws and other progressive idols.

    if an ethno religious group (no one in particular comes to mind) advocated multiculturalism for everyone but advocated in group ethnic solidarity would they really be multicultural?

    Libertarians advocate the left site of libertarianism rarely, if at all, the right.

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
  31. Jack D says:
    @prime noticer

    One of the famous cases of a black getting killed by police in NY involved a guy on a street corner selling individual cigarettes (loosies) because ghetto blacks can no longer afford to buy a whole pack at once. Untaxed cigarettes are big business in NY and a lot of police resources are devoted to suppressing this crime against the state’s fiscal interest. The product itself is fully legal – the crime is not giving the state its cut. How is this different from a protection racket using the cops as the muscle?

    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
  32. Jack D says:
    @Janus

    Your memory is slightly confused. Beer was indeed sold only by the case but at PRIVATELY run “beer distributors”, which sold only beer and soft drinks but not wine or liquor. The state stores sold wine and spirits but NOT beer (or anything else). Oddities (barleywine, mead, sake, soju) would cause the bureaucrats heads to explode.

    • Replies: @Janus
  33. @prime noticer

    new york’s (corrupt) control of the liqour industry means that all alcohol has be bought through authorized distributors- so trader joes must sell it’s two buck chuck to a distributor and then buy it from them to sell it at their wine shop in NYC (thus it is 2.99 chuck) – and they are only permitted one one shop -special interests make sure of that.

  34. Erik L says:
    @Jack D

    That but the important thing to do is regulate it so that they don’t do what the tobacco and food industry did, i.e. figure out ways to make the product super addictive. If there is profit to be made in selling more cannabis, scientists over time, will find ways.

  35. ATBOTL says:

    Notice how the establishment has shifted the concept of legalization from letting people grow their own to having only licensed businesses being allowed to do it. My prediction is that this model will come under attack soon from younger liberals and we will have true legalization, where marijuana is treated like tomatoes. Legalization of psychedelics is next.

    • Replies: @Anon
  36. @SimpleSong

    1) Leaving other people alone is the best contribution anyone can make to society. Maybe you should try it.
    2) Amphetamines were legal in the late 1940’s, 1950’s, and 1960’s only made illegal in 1971. They were widely used by people in many areas of society and are still used by the US military.

    I do miss the era in American history when people like you were tarred, feathered and carried out of town on a rail. Unless you were a Puritan. The Puritans loved control freaks like yourself. A dirty shame they did not secede in 1812.

    • Agree: Stan d Mute
  37. This is anti-libertarian. You should be ashamed of yourselves.

  38. captflee says:
    @Gilbert Ratchet

    Yes indeed, Gilbert!

    The history of the “Six O’clock Swill” down under is a cautionary tale, as well. It even affected ‘hotel’ architecture; one may still encounter pubs with bathroom floor tile up to shoulder level, the easier to hose away the inevitable chunder, blood, and broken teeth which a mass of working lads seeking ethanolic oblivion in the less than one hour betwixt departing their places of employ and the chiming of six is wont to produce.

    If I recall correctly, in most jurisdictions across NZ and the Lucky Land, per capita consumption actually rose, and appreciably so, after passage. Aversion therapy via legislation apparently can be not just useless, but actually counterproductive………Who knew?

  39. @Anon

    From Melting Pot to Smoking Pot.

    I couldn’t use LOL button because i didn’t laugh.

    But you’ve hit on some real truth value there in essentially what’s been the de-nationalization of the US. We’re no longer a nation, just a big agglomeration of atomized “consumers” which makes one feel most of the time like “gee a might as well get stoned”.

    • Replies: @Anon
  40. anonymous[422] • Disclaimer says:

    Asians are taking over the dispensary market. Instead of opening a 7-11 or a dry cleaners, asians are getting into pot.

  41. Janus says:
    @Jack D

    Now that you mention it, I do recall the stores being separate for wine/spirits and beer. Was wine always behind the counter? I rarely drank much other than beer, but I recall once buying a jug of wine. It will always stick in my memory because as soon as I stepped four feet outside I slipped on the ice, broke the bottle, and had to go back in and get another. I could swear I picked it up off the shelf and took it to the counter myself. This was in the mid 90s. I also seem to remember that if you wanted less than a case of beer you could go into certain bars and they’d sell you a to go six-pack in a paper bag for a discount to what you would have paid buying singles. It all seemed needlessly complicated.

    • Replies: @Jack D
  42. @Steve Sailer

    Pretty sure this is Steve on the left with his high school buds

  43. I am not taking sides and, having just downed a peanut butter porter, may not be in a condition to anyway. Just noting that this came in the mail last month:

    Marijuana, Mental Illness, and Violence

  44. @Jack D

    An interesting point, but the bodegas in nyc sell loosies ( illegally) too. If you know where to go (Arabs) you can buy a tax-free pack as well.

  45. @ThreeCranes

    Figures Bill has a lazy eye, every other part of him is lazy.

  46. Kyle says:

    A pound for 24.99? At that price we’ll start to discover there really is such a thing as marijuana overdose. I don’t like the idea of giant corporations controlling the drug market either. I think it’s good that one sixteenth of a pound costs over $100. It’s good that you can’t just go to a store whenever you want and buy a pound of pot. Our society woul start having serious problems if that were possible.

  47. Anon7 says:

    Once Big Pot is involved, the actual cost of a joint will come down to – free! Big Tobacco makes cigarettes for a few pennies each.

    Why so expensive? Branding, which costs millions to do properly. Taxes, don’t get me started. And of course addiction, which keeps them coming back for more.

    So, let me try again.

    Once Big Pot is involved, a joint will cost – five bucks! Just like it does now, except that rather than the money going to a multinational criminal gang (with Uncle Sam taxing you annually to fight it), the money will go to a multinational criminal gang (Big Tobacco) and Uncle Sam taxing you at point-of-sale!

    Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose.

  48. @anon

    I spent some time in New Brunswick and the bars wee totally depressing . Since Canada was once a province of the Motherland they adopted many of the rules the pubs had in Great Britain as to women, closing times etc., but the pubs I had an ale in were not depressing.

  49. AndrewR says:
    @SimpleSong

    Yikes! I hope this is a troll post.

  50. Jack D says:
    @Janus

    Yes, you remember correctly. Outside the ghetto, by the 90s they had self service stores. And yes you could buy by the sixpack at certain restaurants/bars that had a takeout license. This loophole has since been enlarged and many supermarkets have “restaurants” and takeout licenses to sell both beer and wine. The system still sucks.

    • Replies: @Johann Ricke
  51. AndrewR says:
    @Hypnotoad666

    Weed has its downsides but it’s objectively less harmful than alcohol in almost every respect. It’s astounding that alcohol prohibition lasted only 13 years but cannabis prohibition has lasted 100 years.

  52. BenKenobi says:
    @Jack D

    Jack, look up something called “shatter”. Extracts are so-called because they are the result of chemically extracting all THC from marijuana buds with a solvent, usually butane. The final product is an amber-coloured translucent glass-like substance that is basically pure THC.

    Smoking a cubic millimetre of shatter is like smoking 2 joints in a matter of seconds. Judging by what you said further upthread the stuff would probably put you on the moon.

  53. @Jack D

    This loophole has since been enlarged and many supermarkets have “restaurants” and takeout licenses to sell both beer and wine. The system still sucks.

    That’s presumably why privately-owned liquor stores must sell food and have seating for 30 customers:

    https://www.philly.com/philly/news/crime/beer-delis-safety-windows-licenses-inspections-letter-state-house-bill-20180213.html

    Do you recall whether the state overrode Philly’s law against bulletproof windows in beer delis?

  54. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:

    Los Angeles already has equity pot. But so far none of the blacks have managed to get through the arduous permit licensing process

    There is also the fact that pot shop permits can only be issued in very restricted areas in already existing retail stores.

    What is this pot? It’s weed.

    My opinion; the legal weed business in Ca will never get off the ground. 40% sales tax, no shops anywhere near “ where children congregate” which in the opinion of zoning codes and homeowners is everywhere, only in existing retail shops a more severe inspection and health code than the FDA ardous licensing and permit process for the growers I firmly believe weed growing and distribution will go right back underground.

    Most of the black equity weed entrepreneurs are trying to set up in black neighborhoods. Even if they preserve for the 5 year licensing process before they make a single sale how many White hispanic and Asian weed buyers will go to the most dangerous neighborhoods in the city? And how many black weed users be able to pay the 4o% tax.
    The weed shop owners have to find a store and sign the lease before they apply for their permit Granting the permit can take years
    Meanwhile they’re paying thousands a month rent in the shop.

    California government destroys everything it touches including the once flourishing weed industry
    by 1980 the agriculture department realized weed was California’s biggest crop By 2010 weed surpassed grapes cotton rice and produce combined.
    Government gets involved and it all goes bust.

    Standard net profit from 99 medical plants was about $110k a year. It was hard work but only 20 hours a week work except during harvest. Biggest problem was finding a salesman willing to deal with the druggie medical pot ship owners.

    Who needs college

  55. @Jack D

    Maybe this really did cut down on drinking in the poorer sections (though I doubt it) but for the middle class consumer it meant that shopping for wine was almost as much fun as shopping for toilet paper in the USSR.

    Similar approach to casinos in the UK. You could gamble in a casino, but you had to obtain a (free) “membership” and wait 24 hours for it to be activated before you could enter and gamble. This was supposed to stop impulse gambling. No alcohol was served in casinos, and no advertising was allowed.

    The idea was to meet the existing demand for gambling, rather than open the door to illegal gambling dens, but not to promote it to new customers. I attended a casino in Liverpool in the 70’s. Most of the clientele seemed to be Chinese restaurant owners who were busy laundering their profits.

  56. @Dan Hayes

    A fair percentage of “bodega” owners in New York are Yemenese. Perhaps we should adopt an arabic word at this point.

    The Yemenese are infamous for selling an illegal Chinese imported drug called “Spice” to homeless people for $2 a pop.

    It’s disgusting.

    • Agree: Dan Hayes
  57. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @SimpleSong

    With all their blather the libertarians don’t believe an employer should be able to hire whoever he wants to hire but must obey the restrictive government race gender gay employment laws that forbid the employment the very demographic libertarians belong to, White men.

    Same with conservatives they totally ignore the affirmative action and race replacement that’s destroying Whites but endlessly fret about tattoos and brown and black abortion and favor
    HI-B allegedly skilled immigration and endless wars in countries that never did America any harm

    • Replies: @ACommenter
  58. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @joel townsley rogers

    Maybe Monsanto, Kern County Land Company , Newhall Corp, Gallo, Miller, King, Borden and other mega agriculture companies plan on getting monopolies for growing weed.

    What’s it called Sunland? The company that owns 7 11 can set up a nationwide chain of pot shops that drives the rest out of business

    Maybe we’ll see independent growers hunted down like moonshiners used to be.

  59. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    I bet the sanctimonious holier than thou Quakers thought that up.

  60. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @densa

    Meat packing plants in Nebraska and Iowa that employed unionized Americans were all located in counties that had a very very low welfare population
    The plants closed for a year for extensive remodeling. When they re opened not a single worker cane back. Central American illegals were brought in.

    Suddenly those counties had the highest percentage of IQ 80 children who spoke neither English or Spanish in the schools and the highest welfare rolls in the state. And 12 years later when those cute little boys grew up the county was afflicted with MS 13 and other criminal gangs.

  61. @Redneck farmer

    Comment is too cryptic so not sure I understand–are you referring to pulling a Duerte?

    Alternatively are you suggesting there is active selection against drug use? My observations have been the opposite (and I really really see this up close…) thanks to modern healthcare active drug users are most definitely not undergoing a Darwinian selection process. If anything propensity to drug use seems to increase the number of offspring.

    The people being selected against are those that play by the rules, pay 40% of their income in taxes and then fail to reproduce because they can’t afford a house because of the aformentioned tax burden as well as the other negative externalities imposed by the parasitic elements of society.

  62. The Notorious AOC already addressed the racism and inequity inherent in the marijuana industry. African Americans should be granted the exclusive right to distribute marijuana as reparations for slavery. At minimum, there should be Weed Affirmative Action.

  63. @Wally

    So an ambulance brings a guy to the ED with drug overdose. Clearly homeless. Clearly no assets or insurance and won’t be paying his medical bill. Also unlikely that he ever paid much tax in the past, nor will he in the future. Either the doctors and nurses aren’t going to get paid, or the taxpayer is going to pay for the attempt at saving this guys life.

    Are you OK if the physicians just decide to let him die? Or if revived, he gets made into a debt slave until his bill is paid?

    And if you are OK with this, will you advocate for this just as strongly as you advocate for drug legalization? Because I hear lots of libertarians yammering on about MJ but they never seem to advocate for the letting people die in the streets part of the equation, which is pretty much a necessary condition for the libertarian project to work.

    Not really a hypothetical here as this happens hundreds of times a day in the US.

    I agree that taxes are too high and government is too big, but I sure as hell don’t want no government. I want a smaller government.

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
  64. @densa

    Yeah open borders is a corporate dream, also looked upon favorably by their useful idiots, the libertarians.

    A stable state must consist of a coherent ethic core, and business must be made subservient to the state and thus the people, through appropriate regulation. This is completely consistent with the principles of capitalism and in fact is the only way to prevent capitalism from self-destructing.

    • Replies: @IstvanIN
  65. Indians get the gambling licenses, blacks get the weed licenses. Who gets the hookers?

    Asians probably have a head start, but there will be stiff competition.

    • Replies: @ACommenter
  66. @Chris Mallory

    Amphetamines are still used by the general public. Ritalin is an amphetamine. But you need a prescription. Likewise the army isn’t going to give it to you because it’s Saturday night and you want to party. If you believe in freedom, shouldn’t that be allowed? Shouldn’t we just leave people alone and let them make their own choices? Isn’t leaving people alone the best contribution anyone can make to society?

    Are the Sacklers big heroes of yours? After all, clearly there was a huge amount of latent demand for strong opioid painkillers. And clearly there was a (small) subset of doctors who wanted to write lots of prescriptions for these opioids. The Sacklers provided a product, the marketing, and a bunch of dubious studies that gave the docs and the patients cover for prescribing elephant sized doses of oxycontin. I mean, what heroes! They gave people freedom! These people just wanted to be left alone to take their oxycontin and/or make a fortune writing oxycontin scripts. Why can’t we just leave them alone to make their own choices? Isn’t leaving people alone the best contribution anyone can make to society?

    Regarding tarring and feathering people who wanted to regulate psychoactive substances: are you referring to the Whiskey rebellion? That is the only episode I can think of in which something like that occurred, and that was an issue of taxation, not prohibition. Yes, that episode was stamped out by a tyrant who claimed emergency powers and raised a militia to restore order. The tyrant’s name…was George Washington. The true American heroes were definitely the idiot drunks on the frontier, and not George Washington. They were on the right side of history. They wanted to be advocate for everyone being left alone, which is the best contribution anyone can make to society.

    • Replies: @ACommenter
    , @Anon
  67. @Chris Mallory

    >Unless you were a Puritan. The Puritans loved control freaks like yourself. A dirty shame they did not secede in 1812.

    This is the funniest part of your comment to me. My family is from Kentucky/Tennessee back to the early 19th century. So definitely no tribal loyalties to Yankees. But let’s think about this critically.

    As a youth I took a trip to Queensland Australia, which has a subtropical climate and agricultural economy similar to Dixie. The streets were safe and clean, people were friendly, healthcare free. Public transit worked and was convenient (although it was mostly buses as the cities are relatively small, but still.) Settled by the English, of course, with a smattering of other Northern Europeans. Just like the South in so many ways, but had developed so differently. Why was this place so much nicer than my home? One day it hit me: this is what the South would have been like if no Negroes had never been imported.

    You know what the best thing to happen to the South would have been? If some busybody New England Puritan in the 17th century had put a stop to the slave trade before it really took off. Stuck their nose in other people’s business. That would have been the greatest thing to happen to the south, ever. Today it would be a larger, richer version of Queensland.

    Well the south isn’t as nice as Queensland Australia but it is at least not as bad as Brazil. Why is that? Because those busybody Yankees absolutely smashed the south and put a stop to slavery. In Brazil the whole institution ran its natural course for another 20 years–another 20 years of intentionally importing and breeding Africans–before petering out for economic reasons. Brazil ended up even blacker than the American South and hence more dysfunctional. Because they didn’t have busybodies.

    The big losers in all this were the Yankees. If New England had managed to secede in 1812 they would likely be a Switzerland-like whitopia today. Instead the formerly-great Yankee cities of Philadelphia, Boston, and New York have had their cores taken over by parasitic blacks that were brought here by idiot planters.

    Don’t try to tell me that the vice of cowardice is the virtue of ‘minding your own business.’

    • Agree: ACommenter
  68. @ACommenter

    Exactly. We completely lack freedom of association in this country. It doesn’t exist. And that is probably the most important freedom there is, ahead of speech press or religion. Despite their obsession with freedom I have never heard a libertarian advocate for freedom of association. I think they’re all just toadies for the Koch Bros.

  69. @stillCARealist

    Yeah sometimes its best to just let it be a black market. Some really interesting comments above about taxation and enforcement mechanisms and new problems that are going to arise. Does anybody think anything through anymore? It’s like the Unz commentariat does more thoughtful policy analysis than actual policymakers.

    I’ve also heard through the grapevine that the Humboldt county growers in CA were against legalization. For what it’s worth.

    It’s also just a really weird thing to be passionate about marijuana legalization. I’ve met a lot of people who are really into this. Like the people who want to Save the Whales, I get that. I get why they would be emotional. Getting emotional about the drug stuff, I don’t get.

    • Replies: @stillCARealist
  70. @SimpleSong

    I should addend this–I realize nobody OD’s on MJ like that, but a consistent libertarian worldview would permit drug use as the user sees fit, not limited to MJ/alcohol/coffee.

  71. RonaldB says:

    It’s pretty obvious that one of the factors in the degeneration of our society and culture is the attack on a culture of identification. Trump, as populist, began to reverse the trend of worshiping the lower price-per-unit, and reinstituting the concept that local jobs and community trumped the lowest possible cost.

    It would be beneficial for people to have a place to gather and engage with similar people. Starbucks was actually a prototype, before they went collectively insane and declared that any black, any time, in any physical condition, could spend unlimited time in a Starbucks without actually buying anything. Those Starbucks not closing immediately, lost their community ambiance.

    So, it might be a very good idea to encourage the existence of places where people can chill, sharing a common culture. Marijuana is the least desirable glue of culture, but hopefully the very personalized mom-and-pop marijuana stores will set an example for more culturally homogeneous gathering places focused on more wholesome activity. And by the way, for such places to flourish, there has to be a relaxation of the PC policing. It might turn out a black wandering into a Polish culture gathering place, would feel a distinct chill in the air…and visa versa.

    I think de Blasio got this one right, even if for the wrong reasons.

  72. @Chris Mallory

    1) Leaving other people alone is the best contribution anyone can make to society. Maybe you should try it.

    Wrong, this is the exact opposite of what a society is. An isolated and atomized people will easily be subverted and conquered by an organized and motivated enemy.

    A society is based upon laws, norms and rules. A GOOD society cares about the well being of its citizens. Addiction and drug abuse undermine the wealth, heath and happiness of a society. A Moral and Good governance promotes the health and well being of our fellow man.

    Libertarianism is at best a naive self-delusion, at worst, an excuse by the nefarious to exploit the weak.

  73. IstvanIN says:
    @SimpleSong

    I think you are referring to Laissez-faire capitalism, which simply leads to the destruction of the middle class.

  74. @SimpleSong

    Unless you are living as a hermit on an island literally everything you do has a small positive or negative effect on other people. Literally everything.

    So literally everything should be regulated? Did you run this comment by anyone other than Steve?

    The problem with marijuana isn’t its legality, but its attraction. Washington grew hemp, but didn’t inhale it. To relax, he distilled his own whisky.

    This federal revenue stamp is from 1945:

  75. @Anon

    yep. They also champion laws for stuff like global warming and restricting US fishing BUT then hit the ceiling if we try to ban imports of illegally fished tuna from Asia.

    They are only anti-environmental when it restricts the race replacement agenda (Such as building Matt Yglesis’s fantasy super dense housing)

  76. @Ghost of Bull Moose

    if they are (soon to be legal next) underage white girls I believe that honor goes to muslims.

  77. @SimpleSong

    Are the Sacklers big heroes of yours? After all, clearly there was a huge amount of latent demand for strong opioid painkillers. And clearly there was a (small) subset of doctors who wanted to write lots of prescriptions for these opioids. The Sacklers provided a product, the marketing, and a bunch of dubious studies that gave the docs and the patients cover for prescribing elephant sized doses of oxycontin. I mean, what heroes! They gave people freedom!

    if germans are collectively guilty for 1930s-40s (and I don’t think they should be nor should they continue to be demonized) then the destruction and death that the collective Jewish elite in america has caused 2000-’10’s far exceeds it (and I don’t think Jews should be collectively blamed but many are literally guilty of capital offenses. We continue to jail 97 year old germans because they were camp guards for a month when they were 19, or octarians who deny the holocaust (while the media cheers on) but murderers like Max Boot and the Sackler family continue to be adorned.

  78. @SimpleSong

    I’ve known a couple of people for whom pot was a religion. They smoked it every single day and were just in love with and worshiping the stuff. Actually three people, now that I think about it.

    Remember George Michael? The girly-man pop star? I read an interview with him only a few years before his death and he was talking on and on about all the pot he smoked and how wonderful it was. He was another member of that faith.

  79. @Jack D

    Maybe when pot is legalized (and for all I know this exists already) they will produce some kind of retro 1970s grass for geezers.

    There is a growing market for nostalgia weed. Stuff like DJ Short’s Blueberry strain is coming back along with old time strains like Michigan’s Monkey Paw. https://www.djgenetics.com/

    Back in the 70’s and 80’s, the typical Mexican brown, gold, or red bud was maybe 5% THC. Popular strains today are pushing 30% or higher. This is offset by cost however with premium flowers selling at $20/g or higher.

    A bigger worry, if worry one must, is the extract business. One can buy 90% THC oils and waxes for vaping and there are 100% THC metered inhalers on the market. With legalization allowing us to grow our own, one can easily make his own extracts of 75% THC or higher for vaping or with decarboxylation for eating/drinking. This is where things can get interesting. Dosing becomes trial & error with homemade extracts since one has no lab results on potency either of the original flower or the resulting extract and weighing each dose (in a batch of brownies for instance) is impossible.

    One hopes that the users are responsible enough to set aside a few hours or a day (for edibles) with no plans to go for a rush hour drive.

    But then we’ve got irresponsible people popping hydrocodone, oxycodone, hydromorphone, oxymorphone, fentanyl, and good old heroin then operating cars/trucks/machinery. We’ve never been able to stop people from self-medicating. In that light, it’s arguably better they’re high on THC than high on PCP..

    And besides, one can purchase everything (except seeds – coming soon!) needed to establish and operate a modern hydroponic cannabis farming and extract production effort from Amazon. Bezos is gonna need that money to keep the really funny photos from being released.

  80. @anon

    Weirdly, the drinking age was lower than in Michigan (18 vs. 21). I guess they felt secure enough with all the other rules. So of course, teenagers from Detroit would go over to Windsor to drink; great idea, encourage drinking AND driving.

    Well how else would one get good at drunk driving if not to practice on the Ambassador Bridge? And to my knowledge, nobody ever did drive off the bridge into the Detriot River (I know I didn’t anyway). There was that Yugo that drove off the Mackinac Bridge ..

    https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1989-10-03-8901190020-story.html

  81. @Jack D

    What the difference between “legally sold extracts” and what used to be called hashish or hash?

    Hash was the product of hand rubbing the trichomes which contain the THC off the cannabis flowers then rubbing one’s hands together to produce balls of the granular product containing THC, cellulose, and human skin. @BenKenobi describes the method of producing extracts above, but for commercial use butane (or alcohol) has largely been replaced with CO2 (oh no! climate change stoners!) solvent-less extracts. A modern analogue of hash is “live resin” which is simply pressed from flowers using a hydraulic press and moderate heat.

  82. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @tyrone

    The stores mostly have armed security guards. Could be a Seth Rogan movie stoned armed guards stoned clerks stoned armed robbers. Nobody gets hurt they get into the Thai stick they all pass out.

  83. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @ATBOTL

    The state of California seems to plan to treat weed not like s plant but a drug. There’s already inspectors who go into the shops take samples and analyze them for whatever. The regulations are very strict and began January first.

    Worse, the state wants to regulate the grow houses not like a farm under agricultural regulations but like a drug manufacture laboratory. The growers will be forbidden from doing what other farm associations do like deciding on what size of apples is most profitable nd marketable or what size potato goes through the machines in a potato chip factory.

    Of course these inspectors have to be hired and trained standards have to be set, labs have to be set up. Meanwhile the growers closed up shop.

    Supposedly there’s a 40% tax as well. Maybe it will cut way down on pot smoking. Maybe the whole business will go underground I hope so. 40% tax just to support inspectors

  84. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D

    I bet the Wasp quakers came up with that system It couldn’t have been the Germans and Scots Irish

  85. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @AnotherDad

    A boarding house of squabbling nationalities as Ted Rooosevelt called it.

  86. Anon[257] • Disclaimer says:
    @SimpleSong

    I agree so much with you about the whiskey rebellion . America borrowed I forget the amount and not going to look it up but about 11 billion in 1770 English pounds from France to pay for the revolution
    As per usual much of the money stayed in France to pay for the armaments and ships that brought over the soldiers and arms to help us against the British.

    So the revolution ends and we’re supposed to pay back France. But we had no federal taxes and no money for repayment anyway .

    So Hamilton comes up with the whiskey tax and Washington led more troops against the whiskey rebels than he led against the English.

    They were hunted down and executed. I don’t think we ever did repay France.

    That’s what influenced me to despise greedy elites at a young age.

    It also helped create the “ White trash”
    Southerners are so fond of denigrating.

    Get you a copper kettle
    Get you a copper coil
    Get you some new made corn mash
    And never more will you toil

    My Pappy made whiskey
    Grandpappy did too
    We ain’t paid no whiskey tax
    Since 1792.

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