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L.A. Dodgers History: the Heroic Era vs. the Unheroic Era
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L.A. Dodgers history divides in half:

The Heroic Years from 1958-1988: only a .546 winning percentage in regular seasons, but 5 championships in 9 World Series.

The Unheroic Years from 1989-2020: a .538 winning percentage, but only 0-2 in World Series so far.

Many of L.A. Dodgers’ World Series wins were improbable and/or heroic: a mediocre 1959 team led by Wally Moon, Sandy Koufax’s self-imposed 1965 Yom Kippur sitdown, Fernando Valenzuela carrying a tired 1981 team, the battered, not very good 1988 squad beating Canseco’s Steroid Kids on Kirk Gibson’s homer and Orel Hersheiser’s pitching.

Why the difference in the two eras? First, due to expansion from 16 teams in 1959 to 30 since the 1990s, it’s harder to win world championships.

But it is probably mostly just luck.

 
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  1. Way OT but we have been reviewing undocumented shopping. Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront. Loss at this store averages $1000 per day. SF is now a cess pool. Misdemeander for theft of $950 or less, appearance ticket, no prosecution. Car break ins in excess of 30,000 incidents last year. In the miscreants defense, if you pass a law that basically says you can steal a little less than $1000, why wouldn’t you. Article at SF Gate. Ok, back to baseball and don’t forget The Masters in a few weeks.

    • Thanks: Patrick in SC
    • Replies: @prosa123
    @Buffalo Joe

    Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront.

    That no-confrontation rule is true for basically every retailer everywhere.

    Replies: @Tim Smith

    , @D. K.
    @Buffalo Joe

    SOLUTION: Re-price all items in the store at something over $1000.00 each, and make a purchaser use a Walgreens Balance Rewards card in order to buy anything in the store for less than $1000.00.

    Replies: @Muggles

    , @SunBakedSuburb
    @Buffalo Joe

    "SF is now a cess pool."

    With every cess pool comes opportunity: rents are dropping as we speak and housing prices are also on the downward trend. Good news for jerks like me who had to move out of the city due to the influx of Silicon Valley cyborgs with deep pockets. I'm looking for a house in the Richmond or Sunset districts, the west side of the city. Hoping to buy low and live in it whilst SF repairs itself; which will take a while.

    , @M_Young
    @Buffalo Joe

    LOL. I went to a Walgreens in SF...or was it Oakland. Literally everything was locked up.

  2. No. The Dodgers are a moneyball team. And that approach fails in the post season. As does calling up minor leaguers in what amounts to a 100 man roster in the regular season.

    Dodgers are the limits of moneyball.

  3. Why the difference in the two eras? First, due to expansion from 16 teams in 1959 to 30 since the 1990s, it’s harder to win world championships.

    Or even pretend they’re “world” championships. One franchise in Canada hardly makes you international.

    And why is it the Society for American Baseball Research? What about the Caribbean? Asia? That four-out inning George Will wrote about took place in Cuba.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    @Reg Cæsar


    And why is it the Society for American Baseball Research? What about the Caribbean? Asia? That four-out inning George Will wrote about took place in Cuba.
     
    You italicized the wrong word, dipshit.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  4. The thing about Gibson’s homer is it’s only the second most exciting moment in Los Angeles Dodgers history although it is the most exciting by a Dodger. Number one is Reggie Jackson’s 3 homers off 3 different pitchers to win the series in 1977 the day he became Mister October.

  5. @Buffalo Joe
    Way OT but we have been reviewing undocumented shopping. Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront. Loss at this store averages $1000 per day. SF is now a cess pool. Misdemeander for theft of $950 or less, appearance ticket, no prosecution. Car break ins in excess of 30,000 incidents last year. In the miscreants defense, if you pass a law that basically says you can steal a little less than $1000, why wouldn't you. Article at SF Gate. Ok, back to baseball and don't forget The Masters in a few weeks.

    Replies: @prosa123, @D. K., @SunBakedSuburb, @M_Young

    Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront.

    That no-confrontation rule is true for basically every retailer everywhere.

    • Replies: @Tim Smith
    @prosa123

    It's effectively imposed by their insurers, who are willing to lose small amounts regularly rather than possibly losing large chunks in the courts semi-regularly. The retailers cannot get insured if they don't impose a non-confrontation rule.

    There was a story in the NYPost a few weeks back about some of the high-end retailers installing doors that you cannot open from the inside (a security guard can open it to let you out). That can keep the grab and dash crowd from stealing large amounts easily, but what do they do about someone who just wants to make a scene about "racial justice" or whatever inside the store?

    Replies: @res

  6. @Buffalo Joe
    Way OT but we have been reviewing undocumented shopping. Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront. Loss at this store averages $1000 per day. SF is now a cess pool. Misdemeander for theft of $950 or less, appearance ticket, no prosecution. Car break ins in excess of 30,000 incidents last year. In the miscreants defense, if you pass a law that basically says you can steal a little less than $1000, why wouldn't you. Article at SF Gate. Ok, back to baseball and don't forget The Masters in a few weeks.

    Replies: @prosa123, @D. K., @SunBakedSuburb, @M_Young

    SOLUTION: Re-price all items in the store at something over $1000.00 each, and make a purchaser use a Walgreens Balance Rewards card in order to buy anything in the store for less than $1000.00.

    • Replies: @Muggles
    @D. K.


    SOLUTION: Re-price all items in the store at something over $1000.00 each, and make a purchaser use a Walgreens Balance Rewards card in order to buy anything in the store for less than $1000.00.
     
    Elaborate idea. But how does it stop undocumented shopping? These zombies go in, grab stuff and stroll out with armfuls of it. Not stopping at the checkout.

    They're not concerned about the sticker price nor collecting Balance Rewards.

    This idea only works if burly armed guards at the door check every customer and verify their Balance Rewards card info.

    Far easier to find a location with fewer zombies. Or none.

    Replies: @D. K.

  7. Other than that really dark-skinned and demonstrative black guy who plays right field, are the Dodgers the whitest team in baseball? They look that way to me…

  8. @D. K.
    @Buffalo Joe

    SOLUTION: Re-price all items in the store at something over $1000.00 each, and make a purchaser use a Walgreens Balance Rewards card in order to buy anything in the store for less than $1000.00.

    Replies: @Muggles

    SOLUTION: Re-price all items in the store at something over $1000.00 each, and make a purchaser use a Walgreens Balance Rewards card in order to buy anything in the store for less than $1000.00.

    Elaborate idea. But how does it stop undocumented shopping? These zombies go in, grab stuff and stroll out with armfuls of it. Not stopping at the checkout.

    They’re not concerned about the sticker price nor collecting Balance Rewards.

    This idea only works if burly armed guards at the door check every customer and verify their Balance Rewards card info.

    Far easier to find a location with fewer zombies. Or none.

    • Replies: @D. K.
    @Muggles

    My point was that any theft of merchandise from a San Francisco Walgreens thereby would be legally prosecutable, despite the current insanity. Facing a charge of grand theft for shoplifting a $1000.00 canister of Pringles might give pause to a hungry miscreant, even if store personnel were restrained by company policy from stopping such a miscreant from leaving the store with such a snack.

    Replies: @Muggles

  9. @Muggles
    @D. K.


    SOLUTION: Re-price all items in the store at something over $1000.00 each, and make a purchaser use a Walgreens Balance Rewards card in order to buy anything in the store for less than $1000.00.
     
    Elaborate idea. But how does it stop undocumented shopping? These zombies go in, grab stuff and stroll out with armfuls of it. Not stopping at the checkout.

    They're not concerned about the sticker price nor collecting Balance Rewards.

    This idea only works if burly armed guards at the door check every customer and verify their Balance Rewards card info.

    Far easier to find a location with fewer zombies. Or none.

    Replies: @D. K.

    My point was that any theft of merchandise from a San Francisco Walgreens thereby would be legally prosecutable, despite the current insanity. Facing a charge of grand theft for shoplifting a $1000.00 canister of Pringles might give pause to a hungry miscreant, even if store personnel were restrained by company policy from stopping such a miscreant from leaving the store with such a snack.

    • Replies: @Muggles
    @D. K.

    Okay, and thanks for your clarification. I wasn't thinking of the legal technicalities.

    Those legalisms, while a nice thought, are totally beside the point.

    The current SF District Attorney is Chesa Boudin, the Red diaper daughter of two convicted SDS 60s bombers. Now Obama buds.

    She is no more likely to prosecute your notional $1,000.00 can of Pringles undocumented shopper and scofflaw for felony theft than she is to vote for Donald Trump.

    My reactionary take on her is that she is a Red Guard/Soros product. Walgreens is the capitalist criminal in her warped ideology, not the thief.

    "Pringles Should Be Free To The Oppressed !"

    That Balance Rewards card there is about as useful as your SF City election ballot.

    Replies: @Ganderson, @SunBakedSuburb

  10. @D. K.
    @Muggles

    My point was that any theft of merchandise from a San Francisco Walgreens thereby would be legally prosecutable, despite the current insanity. Facing a charge of grand theft for shoplifting a $1000.00 canister of Pringles might give pause to a hungry miscreant, even if store personnel were restrained by company policy from stopping such a miscreant from leaving the store with such a snack.

    Replies: @Muggles

    Okay, and thanks for your clarification. I wasn’t thinking of the legal technicalities.

    Those legalisms, while a nice thought, are totally beside the point.

    The current SF District Attorney is Chesa Boudin, the Red diaper daughter of two convicted SDS 60s bombers. Now Obama buds.

    She is no more likely to prosecute your notional $1,000.00 can of Pringles undocumented shopper and scofflaw for felony theft than she is to vote for Donald Trump.

    My reactionary take on her is that she is a Red Guard/Soros product. Walgreens is the capitalist criminal in her warped ideology, not the thief.

    “Pringles Should Be Free To The Oppressed !”

    That Balance Rewards card there is about as useful as your SF City election ballot.

    • Replies: @Ganderson
    @Muggles

    Uh- Boudin’s a boy!

    The rest of your observations are spot on.

    Replies: @Mr. Grey

    , @SunBakedSuburb
    @Muggles

    "Chesa Boudin"

    He needs to be removed in order for SF to return to its gorgeous self. London Breed, the mayor, is actually pretty level-headed for a black lady leftist. She can stay. Some enterprising young lads should take the demonic DA with the fruity name for a boat ride out to the Farallon Islands. Those waters are filled with great white sharks.

  11. Never liked the Hollywood Dodgers, especially when Lasorda was there. My first great sports disappointment was the ‘65 Series, which made me a Dodger hater for life.

    I will say they have the best uniforms in the Majors- and I like the fact that they don’t have 9 different sets. What do they have, 3? I dunno, as I’ve not been able to muster much interest in Covid ball- I just checked in long enough to see the Twins extend their playoff losing streak.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    @Ganderson

    The Dodgers do have lovely classic uniforms. The Giants also look quite sharp at times but have too many changes and variations, some of them pretty clownish, similar story for the Buccos

    BTW do you LA fans know there was a 15,000-seat minor league ballpark there in the 1920s, designed much like Chicago's Wrigley Field -- for a minor league team that I think was owned by Wrigley. Mannix filmed a 1969 scene at the abandoned and decrepit stadium.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Ganderson

  12. @Muggles
    @D. K.

    Okay, and thanks for your clarification. I wasn't thinking of the legal technicalities.

    Those legalisms, while a nice thought, are totally beside the point.

    The current SF District Attorney is Chesa Boudin, the Red diaper daughter of two convicted SDS 60s bombers. Now Obama buds.

    She is no more likely to prosecute your notional $1,000.00 can of Pringles undocumented shopper and scofflaw for felony theft than she is to vote for Donald Trump.

    My reactionary take on her is that she is a Red Guard/Soros product. Walgreens is the capitalist criminal in her warped ideology, not the thief.

    "Pringles Should Be Free To The Oppressed !"

    That Balance Rewards card there is about as useful as your SF City election ballot.

    Replies: @Ganderson, @SunBakedSuburb

    Uh- Boudin’s a boy!

    The rest of your observations are spot on.

    • Replies: @Mr. Grey
    @Ganderson

    All we know is that he identifies as a boy.

  13. @prosa123
    @Buffalo Joe

    Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront.

    That no-confrontation rule is true for basically every retailer everywhere.

    Replies: @Tim Smith

    It’s effectively imposed by their insurers, who are willing to lose small amounts regularly rather than possibly losing large chunks in the courts semi-regularly. The retailers cannot get insured if they don’t impose a non-confrontation rule.

    There was a story in the NYPost a few weeks back about some of the high-end retailers installing doors that you cannot open from the inside (a security guard can open it to let you out). That can keep the grab and dash crowd from stealing large amounts easily, but what do they do about someone who just wants to make a scene about “racial justice” or whatever inside the store?

    • Replies: @res
    @Tim Smith


    There was a story in the NYPost a few weeks back about some of the high-end retailers installing doors that you cannot open from the inside (a security guard can open it to let you out).
     
    How can that meet the fire code?
  14. @Reg Cæsar

    Why the difference in the two eras? First, due to expansion from 16 teams in 1959 to 30 since the 1990s, it’s harder to win world championships.

     

    Or even pretend they're "world" championships. One franchise in Canada hardly makes you international.

    And why is it the Society for American Baseball Research? What about the Caribbean? Asia? That four-out inning George Will wrote about took place in Cuba.

    Replies: @ScarletNumber

    And why is it the Society for American Baseball Research? What about the Caribbean? Asia? That four-out inning George Will wrote about took place in Cuba.

    You italicized the wrong word, dipshit.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @ScarletNumber

    Mea culpa. To err is human.

    However, I've never sunk to the level of scatologizing a fellow commenter. Some things are beneath civilization.

  15. If winning itself is luck, then that pretty much negates the discipline of Sabermetrics. After all, a team that doesn’t follow the Moneyball principles, choosing instead to emphasize traditional stats (e.g. BA, SB, RBIs, more complete games for starting pitchers, etc) over the Three True Outcomes, has as good a chance of winning a championship as a Sabermetrically based team. Since according to randomness, no one knows anything, might as well just wing it and see what happens.

    Of course during the same eras, there was one team that consistently won championships (1958-1988, this team had 10 WS, and 5 championships; 1988-, this team currently has 7 WS and 5 championships). No matter the era, this same storied franchise has consistently won the most championships, ever since a player named Ruth signed with them in 1920.

    So perhaps for certain teams it’s not about luck but consistency.

    • Replies: @Trinity
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    New York is the largest market, therefore the Yankees bought most their titles. Yankees won two world series titles in the 1970s but it is the small market Oakland As, Cincinnati Reds and Baltimore Orioles who stand out as the teams of the 1970s. Lest we forget, the Yanks weren't all that for the first half of the decade between 1970-1975. Hell, I could have managed the Yankees and won championships during the Joe Torre years. The Braves, while being a team who can't win the big one, had a run from the early 1990s through the mid 2000s that was as impressive as the Yankees to a degree just minus the championships. While Atlanta isn't a small market, it is no LA or NYC either. Some of the most famed Yankees, etc., Alex Rodriguez, Babe Ruth, Reggie Jackson, all started out for different teams in smaller markets.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

  16. @Ganderson
    Never liked the Hollywood Dodgers, especially when Lasorda was there. My first great sports disappointment was the ‘65 Series, which made me a Dodger hater for life.

    I will say they have the best uniforms in the Majors- and I like the fact that they don’t have 9 different sets. What do they have, 3? I dunno, as I’ve not been able to muster much interest in Covid ball- I just checked in long enough to see the Twins extend their playoff losing streak.

    Replies: @Known Fact

    The Dodgers do have lovely classic uniforms. The Giants also look quite sharp at times but have too many changes and variations, some of them pretty clownish, similar story for the Buccos

    BTW do you LA fans know there was a 15,000-seat minor league ballpark there in the 1920s, designed much like Chicago’s Wrigley Field — for a minor league team that I think was owned by Wrigley. Mannix filmed a 1969 scene at the abandoned and decrepit stadium.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Known Fact

    I can remember seeing the ancient Wrigley Field minor league stadium on the way to Disneyland in the 1960s. Did the Angels play there in 1961-1964?

    Replies: @Known Fact

    , @Ganderson
    @Known Fact

    Twas the home of the PCL Angels. Where did the Hollywood Stars play?

  17. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    If winning itself is luck, then that pretty much negates the discipline of Sabermetrics. After all, a team that doesn’t follow the Moneyball principles, choosing instead to emphasize traditional stats (e.g. BA, SB, RBIs, more complete games for starting pitchers, etc) over the Three True Outcomes, has as good a chance of winning a championship as a Sabermetrically based team. Since according to randomness, no one knows anything, might as well just wing it and see what happens.

    Of course during the same eras, there was one team that consistently won championships (1958-1988, this team had 10 WS, and 5 championships; 1988-, this team currently has 7 WS and 5 championships). No matter the era, this same storied franchise has consistently won the most championships, ever since a player named Ruth signed with them in 1920.

    So perhaps for certain teams it’s not about luck but consistency.

    Replies: @Trinity

    New York is the largest market, therefore the Yankees bought most their titles. Yankees won two world series titles in the 1970s but it is the small market Oakland As, Cincinnati Reds and Baltimore Orioles who stand out as the teams of the 1970s. Lest we forget, the Yanks weren’t all that for the first half of the decade between 1970-1975. Hell, I could have managed the Yankees and won championships during the Joe Torre years. The Braves, while being a team who can’t win the big one, had a run from the early 1990s through the mid 2000s that was as impressive as the Yankees to a degree just minus the championships. While Atlanta isn’t a small market, it is no LA or NYC either. Some of the most famed Yankees, etc., Alex Rodriguez, Babe Ruth, Reggie Jackson, all started out for different teams in smaller markets.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @Trinity

    "Some of the most famed Yankees, etc., Alex Rodriguez, Babe Ruth, Reggie Jackson, all started out for different teams in smaller markets."

    With this, you made my main point: Sabermetrics doesn't really matter if a team can purchase the most dominant players, or key components, for their run to the championships. The Rays did the exact same thing in the late '90's, which resulted in their 1997 WS championship.

    "The Braves, while being a team who can’t win the big one, had a run from the early 1990s through the mid 2000s that was as impressive as the Yankees to a degree just minus the championships."

    Nobody remembers ATL's 1991-2005 consecutive Divisional titles. They do remember that in 15 yrs, they won exactly 1 championship out of 5 WS appearances, and frankly, that sucks major big time. That that was all they could do with 3 HOF first ballot pitchers (Glavine, Smoltz, Maddox) plus Every, is a disgrace and pathetic. A great bridesmaid team April thru September that choked and tanked during October. A roster filled with talent that couldn't get it done. (NY beat them in the WS of 1996 and 1999).


    "I could have managed the Yankees and won championships during the Joe Torre years."

    And I could've managed NY during their 1949-1960 yrs when they won 10 AL Pennants and 7 WS titles. Everyone thinks it looks easy.


    "New York is the largest market, therefore the Yankees bought most their titles."

    This is a flawed analogy. Because NY is the US's largest market, it should follow that all of its professional sports teams in the 4 major sports would do as well. In actuality this is not the case. Aside from the Yankees, no other NY team in the other major sports have achieved the dominance of their respective sports. Even the crosstown rivals, the Mets, aren't particularly dominant in the NL to the extent that the Yankees have achieved since 1920.

    The little secret, aside from some well publicized free agent purchases, many if not most of NY's championship teams were home grown talent.

    Example: Gehrig; DiMaggio; Berra; Mantle; Ford; Jeter; Pettite; Rivera. All were direct products of NY's farm system. While HOF GM Branch Rickey is given credit for pioneering the modern farm system it was NY that developed its own farm system as well as any MLB team. The reason that NY's dynasty ended in 1965 was due directly to two factors: 1. The new draft rule required MLB teams to draft according to their previous year's standing. So if a team ended in last place, they automatically received the top draft pick for the comming yr. 2. In the early '60's, NY allowed its existing farm system to go to seed.

    During the 1920's BOS broke up their AL pennant winning teams of the 1910's by dumping their players for cash. MLB teams could do that in those days. A practice I actually endorse and think it should be allowed to return. Example, if ANA decided to dump Trout's contract, and NY wanted to step in and purchase it, they should be allowed to directly pay ANA the cash equivalent of Trout's contract and forthwith Trout would be playing in NY.

    So regarding MLB's most dominant, most championship winning franchise in history, there is a notable exception. No matter the era, it has managed to always rise to the top and win the most championships. Is this a direct cause of Sabermetrics? For most of its history, obviously not. Does that mean that NY doesn't keep up with current Moneyball tactics while occasionally making a splashy free agent purchase? Of course not. No matter the up to date tactics regarding how to maintain dominance and continue to win championships, NY has proven more than able to meet the task.

    But again, my large point, that if winning largely depends upon luck, then the whole edifice of Sabermetrics falls apart, since one could in theory (and it has been done in recent times, as noted by Tampa's 1997 WS title) ignore most of Sabermetrics and focus on traditional stats and still come out on top with a championship title.

    Replies: @ex-banker

  18. @ScarletNumber
    @Reg Cæsar


    And why is it the Society for American Baseball Research? What about the Caribbean? Asia? That four-out inning George Will wrote about took place in Cuba.
     
    You italicized the wrong word, dipshit.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    Mea culpa. To err is human.

    However, I’ve never sunk to the level of scatologizing a fellow commenter. Some things are beneath civilization.

  19. @Known Fact
    @Ganderson

    The Dodgers do have lovely classic uniforms. The Giants also look quite sharp at times but have too many changes and variations, some of them pretty clownish, similar story for the Buccos

    BTW do you LA fans know there was a 15,000-seat minor league ballpark there in the 1920s, designed much like Chicago's Wrigley Field -- for a minor league team that I think was owned by Wrigley. Mannix filmed a 1969 scene at the abandoned and decrepit stadium.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Ganderson

    I can remember seeing the ancient Wrigley Field minor league stadium on the way to Disneyland in the 1960s. Did the Angels play there in 1961-1964?

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    @Steve Sailer

    Just their first year. But boomer fans will be impressed to learn that it's where they filmed that clunky old show Home Run Derby

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrigley_Field_(Los_Angeles)

  20. @Steve Sailer
    @Known Fact

    I can remember seeing the ancient Wrigley Field minor league stadium on the way to Disneyland in the 1960s. Did the Angels play there in 1961-1964?

    Replies: @Known Fact

    Just their first year. But boomer fans will be impressed to learn that it’s where they filmed that clunky old show Home Run Derby

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrigley_Field_(Los_Angeles)

  21. @Buffalo Joe
    Way OT but we have been reviewing undocumented shopping. Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront. Loss at this store averages $1000 per day. SF is now a cess pool. Misdemeander for theft of $950 or less, appearance ticket, no prosecution. Car break ins in excess of 30,000 incidents last year. In the miscreants defense, if you pass a law that basically says you can steal a little less than $1000, why wouldn't you. Article at SF Gate. Ok, back to baseball and don't forget The Masters in a few weeks.

    Replies: @prosa123, @D. K., @SunBakedSuburb, @M_Young

    “SF is now a cess pool.”

    With every cess pool comes opportunity: rents are dropping as we speak and housing prices are also on the downward trend. Good news for jerks like me who had to move out of the city due to the influx of Silicon Valley cyborgs with deep pockets. I’m looking for a house in the Richmond or Sunset districts, the west side of the city. Hoping to buy low and live in it whilst SF repairs itself; which will take a while.

  22. @Muggles
    @D. K.

    Okay, and thanks for your clarification. I wasn't thinking of the legal technicalities.

    Those legalisms, while a nice thought, are totally beside the point.

    The current SF District Attorney is Chesa Boudin, the Red diaper daughter of two convicted SDS 60s bombers. Now Obama buds.

    She is no more likely to prosecute your notional $1,000.00 can of Pringles undocumented shopper and scofflaw for felony theft than she is to vote for Donald Trump.

    My reactionary take on her is that she is a Red Guard/Soros product. Walgreens is the capitalist criminal in her warped ideology, not the thief.

    "Pringles Should Be Free To The Oppressed !"

    That Balance Rewards card there is about as useful as your SF City election ballot.

    Replies: @Ganderson, @SunBakedSuburb

    “Chesa Boudin”

    He needs to be removed in order for SF to return to its gorgeous self. London Breed, the mayor, is actually pretty level-headed for a black lady leftist. She can stay. Some enterprising young lads should take the demonic DA with the fruity name for a boat ride out to the Farallon Islands. Those waters are filled with great white sharks.

  23. @Trinity
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    New York is the largest market, therefore the Yankees bought most their titles. Yankees won two world series titles in the 1970s but it is the small market Oakland As, Cincinnati Reds and Baltimore Orioles who stand out as the teams of the 1970s. Lest we forget, the Yanks weren't all that for the first half of the decade between 1970-1975. Hell, I could have managed the Yankees and won championships during the Joe Torre years. The Braves, while being a team who can't win the big one, had a run from the early 1990s through the mid 2000s that was as impressive as the Yankees to a degree just minus the championships. While Atlanta isn't a small market, it is no LA or NYC either. Some of the most famed Yankees, etc., Alex Rodriguez, Babe Ruth, Reggie Jackson, all started out for different teams in smaller markets.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    “Some of the most famed Yankees, etc., Alex Rodriguez, Babe Ruth, Reggie Jackson, all started out for different teams in smaller markets.”

    With this, you made my main point: Sabermetrics doesn’t really matter if a team can purchase the most dominant players, or key components, for their run to the championships. The Rays did the exact same thing in the late ’90’s, which resulted in their 1997 WS championship.

    “The Braves, while being a team who can’t win the big one, had a run from the early 1990s through the mid 2000s that was as impressive as the Yankees to a degree just minus the championships.”

    Nobody remembers ATL’s 1991-2005 consecutive Divisional titles. They do remember that in 15 yrs, they won exactly 1 championship out of 5 WS appearances, and frankly, that sucks major big time. That that was all they could do with 3 HOF first ballot pitchers (Glavine, Smoltz, Maddox) plus Every, is a disgrace and pathetic. A great bridesmaid team April thru September that choked and tanked during October. A roster filled with talent that couldn’t get it done. (NY beat them in the WS of 1996 and 1999).

    “I could have managed the Yankees and won championships during the Joe Torre years.”

    And I could’ve managed NY during their 1949-1960 yrs when they won 10 AL Pennants and 7 WS titles. Everyone thinks it looks easy.

    “New York is the largest market, therefore the Yankees bought most their titles.”

    This is a flawed analogy. Because NY is the US’s largest market, it should follow that all of its professional sports teams in the 4 major sports would do as well. In actuality this is not the case. Aside from the Yankees, no other NY team in the other major sports have achieved the dominance of their respective sports. Even the crosstown rivals, the Mets, aren’t particularly dominant in the NL to the extent that the Yankees have achieved since 1920.

    The little secret, aside from some well publicized free agent purchases, many if not most of NY’s championship teams were home grown talent.

    Example: Gehrig; DiMaggio; Berra; Mantle; Ford; Jeter; Pettite; Rivera. All were direct products of NY’s farm system. While HOF GM Branch Rickey is given credit for pioneering the modern farm system it was NY that developed its own farm system as well as any MLB team. The reason that NY’s dynasty ended in 1965 was due directly to two factors: 1. The new draft rule required MLB teams to draft according to their previous year’s standing. So if a team ended in last place, they automatically received the top draft pick for the comming yr. 2. In the early ’60’s, NY allowed its existing farm system to go to seed.

    During the 1920’s BOS broke up their AL pennant winning teams of the 1910’s by dumping their players for cash. MLB teams could do that in those days. A practice I actually endorse and think it should be allowed to return. Example, if ANA decided to dump Trout’s contract, and NY wanted to step in and purchase it, they should be allowed to directly pay ANA the cash equivalent of Trout’s contract and forthwith Trout would be playing in NY.

    So regarding MLB’s most dominant, most championship winning franchise in history, there is a notable exception. No matter the era, it has managed to always rise to the top and win the most championships. Is this a direct cause of Sabermetrics? For most of its history, obviously not. Does that mean that NY doesn’t keep up with current Moneyball tactics while occasionally making a splashy free agent purchase? Of course not. No matter the up to date tactics regarding how to maintain dominance and continue to win championships, NY has proven more than able to meet the task.

    But again, my large point, that if winning largely depends upon luck, then the whole edifice of Sabermetrics falls apart, since one could in theory (and it has been done in recent times, as noted by Tampa’s 1997 WS title) ignore most of Sabermetrics and focus on traditional stats and still come out on top with a championship title.

    • Replies: @ex-banker
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi


    my large point, that if winning largely depends upon luck, then the whole edifice of Sabermetrics falls apart
     
    This is ridiculous. A well-executed sabermetrics strategy moves the odds in one's favor, but it doesn't guarantee success, in the same way higher spending on their farm systems improved the odds of the Yankees' and Dodgers through the mid-60s, but didn't guarantee WS titles every year. Pocket aces don't always hold up.

    The last 10 and 15 of the last 20 teams to reach the WS have been heavy users of traditional sabermetrics. The only exceptions were the Giants, Tigers and Royals. The Giants were a player-development story, the Tigers a trade-value exploitation story and the Royals were player-development/innovative (sabermetric?) talent deployment story. I don't think anyone is ignoring sabermetrics today.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

  24. @Buffalo Joe
    Way OT but we have been reviewing undocumented shopping. Walgreens is closing another store in San Francisco due to shop lifting. The thieves brazenly walk in, steal and walk out. Staff instructed not to confront. Loss at this store averages $1000 per day. SF is now a cess pool. Misdemeander for theft of $950 or less, appearance ticket, no prosecution. Car break ins in excess of 30,000 incidents last year. In the miscreants defense, if you pass a law that basically says you can steal a little less than $1000, why wouldn't you. Article at SF Gate. Ok, back to baseball and don't forget The Masters in a few weeks.

    Replies: @prosa123, @D. K., @SunBakedSuburb, @M_Young

    LOL. I went to a Walgreens in SF…or was it Oakland. Literally everything was locked up.

  25. @Tim Smith
    @prosa123

    It's effectively imposed by their insurers, who are willing to lose small amounts regularly rather than possibly losing large chunks in the courts semi-regularly. The retailers cannot get insured if they don't impose a non-confrontation rule.

    There was a story in the NYPost a few weeks back about some of the high-end retailers installing doors that you cannot open from the inside (a security guard can open it to let you out). That can keep the grab and dash crowd from stealing large amounts easily, but what do they do about someone who just wants to make a scene about "racial justice" or whatever inside the store?

    Replies: @res

    There was a story in the NYPost a few weeks back about some of the high-end retailers installing doors that you cannot open from the inside (a security guard can open it to let you out).

    How can that meet the fire code?

  26. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @Trinity

    "Some of the most famed Yankees, etc., Alex Rodriguez, Babe Ruth, Reggie Jackson, all started out for different teams in smaller markets."

    With this, you made my main point: Sabermetrics doesn't really matter if a team can purchase the most dominant players, or key components, for their run to the championships. The Rays did the exact same thing in the late '90's, which resulted in their 1997 WS championship.

    "The Braves, while being a team who can’t win the big one, had a run from the early 1990s through the mid 2000s that was as impressive as the Yankees to a degree just minus the championships."

    Nobody remembers ATL's 1991-2005 consecutive Divisional titles. They do remember that in 15 yrs, they won exactly 1 championship out of 5 WS appearances, and frankly, that sucks major big time. That that was all they could do with 3 HOF first ballot pitchers (Glavine, Smoltz, Maddox) plus Every, is a disgrace and pathetic. A great bridesmaid team April thru September that choked and tanked during October. A roster filled with talent that couldn't get it done. (NY beat them in the WS of 1996 and 1999).


    "I could have managed the Yankees and won championships during the Joe Torre years."

    And I could've managed NY during their 1949-1960 yrs when they won 10 AL Pennants and 7 WS titles. Everyone thinks it looks easy.


    "New York is the largest market, therefore the Yankees bought most their titles."

    This is a flawed analogy. Because NY is the US's largest market, it should follow that all of its professional sports teams in the 4 major sports would do as well. In actuality this is not the case. Aside from the Yankees, no other NY team in the other major sports have achieved the dominance of their respective sports. Even the crosstown rivals, the Mets, aren't particularly dominant in the NL to the extent that the Yankees have achieved since 1920.

    The little secret, aside from some well publicized free agent purchases, many if not most of NY's championship teams were home grown talent.

    Example: Gehrig; DiMaggio; Berra; Mantle; Ford; Jeter; Pettite; Rivera. All were direct products of NY's farm system. While HOF GM Branch Rickey is given credit for pioneering the modern farm system it was NY that developed its own farm system as well as any MLB team. The reason that NY's dynasty ended in 1965 was due directly to two factors: 1. The new draft rule required MLB teams to draft according to their previous year's standing. So if a team ended in last place, they automatically received the top draft pick for the comming yr. 2. In the early '60's, NY allowed its existing farm system to go to seed.

    During the 1920's BOS broke up their AL pennant winning teams of the 1910's by dumping their players for cash. MLB teams could do that in those days. A practice I actually endorse and think it should be allowed to return. Example, if ANA decided to dump Trout's contract, and NY wanted to step in and purchase it, they should be allowed to directly pay ANA the cash equivalent of Trout's contract and forthwith Trout would be playing in NY.

    So regarding MLB's most dominant, most championship winning franchise in history, there is a notable exception. No matter the era, it has managed to always rise to the top and win the most championships. Is this a direct cause of Sabermetrics? For most of its history, obviously not. Does that mean that NY doesn't keep up with current Moneyball tactics while occasionally making a splashy free agent purchase? Of course not. No matter the up to date tactics regarding how to maintain dominance and continue to win championships, NY has proven more than able to meet the task.

    But again, my large point, that if winning largely depends upon luck, then the whole edifice of Sabermetrics falls apart, since one could in theory (and it has been done in recent times, as noted by Tampa's 1997 WS title) ignore most of Sabermetrics and focus on traditional stats and still come out on top with a championship title.

    Replies: @ex-banker

    my large point, that if winning largely depends upon luck, then the whole edifice of Sabermetrics falls apart

    This is ridiculous. A well-executed sabermetrics strategy moves the odds in one’s favor, but it doesn’t guarantee success, in the same way higher spending on their farm systems improved the odds of the Yankees’ and Dodgers through the mid-60s, but didn’t guarantee WS titles every year. Pocket aces don’t always hold up.

    The last 10 and 15 of the last 20 teams to reach the WS have been heavy users of traditional sabermetrics. The only exceptions were the Giants, Tigers and Royals. The Giants were a player-development story, the Tigers a trade-value exploitation story and the Royals were player-development/innovative (sabermetric?) talent deployment story. I don’t think anyone is ignoring sabermetrics today.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @ex-banker

    “This is ridiculous”

    No it isn’t. I was directly commenting on a line that Steve mentioned toward the end of his post, namely, that IF winning championships largely depends upon luck, then Sabermetrics is largely useless when determining who will win a WS championship. For nearly an entire century, MLB has little to no direct experience with the discipline of Sabermetrcs and yet teams still managed to find ways to win championships, some teams achieved consistency regarding winning while one team in particular dominated the league in WS championships.

    In the case of NY, it was not based on luck. It was total dominance. 29 AL Pennants (20 WS championships) in 45 yrs is not luck-that’s roughly two and a half generations of MLB fans that grew up with only experiencing winning baseball in NY. Basically NY averaged a WS appearance at least every third year. That isn’t luck, that’s dominance to the max.

    Contrary to myth, NY’s farm system wasn’t any more expensive than STL, or
    BRN/LA’s. They were better at developing their home grown talent.

    Another thing not remarked upon is that in those days (prior to the mid. 60s), there was free agency in the draft—a prospect could sign with whatever club he chose to. After their winning championships began in the ‘20s, the Yankees started to develop their farm system. Having a reputation for winning helped aid them in getting many top prospects (but not all of them obviously).

    NY also had a knack for getting an extra piece of the puzzle, a spare part for the pennant run. Not every club was so adept.

    While one could argue that these aspects would help develop some concepts of what became known as Sabermetrics, the fact remains that for most of the 20th century the discipline did not directly play a role in teams winning championships, most particularly in the greatest team in MLB history ( per number of WS titles won).

    Replies: @ex-banker

  27. @Ganderson
    @Muggles

    Uh- Boudin’s a boy!

    The rest of your observations are spot on.

    Replies: @Mr. Grey

    All we know is that he identifies as a boy.

  28. I would like to see a list, maybe a top-ten list of the best baseball teams that never won a championship. I’m sure there were some teams that, although they never quite won it all, were better than some other more fortunate teams who did win a World Series. Now that i think of it, a better list might be made in the NBA or NFL or especially the NHL, where luck plays a bigger role in going all the way. Until recently, baseball had a long season and limited playoffs, so you really had to be good to win it all.

  29. @ex-banker
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi


    my large point, that if winning largely depends upon luck, then the whole edifice of Sabermetrics falls apart
     
    This is ridiculous. A well-executed sabermetrics strategy moves the odds in one's favor, but it doesn't guarantee success, in the same way higher spending on their farm systems improved the odds of the Yankees' and Dodgers through the mid-60s, but didn't guarantee WS titles every year. Pocket aces don't always hold up.

    The last 10 and 15 of the last 20 teams to reach the WS have been heavy users of traditional sabermetrics. The only exceptions were the Giants, Tigers and Royals. The Giants were a player-development story, the Tigers a trade-value exploitation story and the Royals were player-development/innovative (sabermetric?) talent deployment story. I don't think anyone is ignoring sabermetrics today.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    “This is ridiculous”

    No it isn’t. I was directly commenting on a line that Steve mentioned toward the end of his post, namely, that IF winning championships largely depends upon luck, then Sabermetrics is largely useless when determining who will win a WS championship. For nearly an entire century, MLB has little to no direct experience with the discipline of Sabermetrcs and yet teams still managed to find ways to win championships, some teams achieved consistency regarding winning while one team in particular dominated the league in WS championships.

    In the case of NY, it was not based on luck. It was total dominance. 29 AL Pennants (20 WS championships) in 45 yrs is not luck-that’s roughly two and a half generations of MLB fans that grew up with only experiencing winning baseball in NY. Basically NY averaged a WS appearance at least every third year. That isn’t luck, that’s dominance to the max.

    Contrary to myth, NY’s farm system wasn’t any more expensive than STL, or
    BRN/LA’s. They were better at developing their home grown talent.

    Another thing not remarked upon is that in those days (prior to the mid. 60s), there was free agency in the draft—a prospect could sign with whatever club he chose to. After their winning championships began in the ‘20s, the Yankees started to develop their farm system. Having a reputation for winning helped aid them in getting many top prospects (but not all of them obviously).

    NY also had a knack for getting an extra piece of the puzzle, a spare part for the pennant run. Not every club was so adept.

    While one could argue that these aspects would help develop some concepts of what became known as Sabermetrics, the fact remains that for most of the 20th century the discipline did not directly play a role in teams winning championships, most particularly in the greatest team in MLB history ( per number of WS titles won).

    • Replies: @ex-banker
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi


    While one could argue that these aspects would help develop some concepts of what became known as Sabermetrics, the fact remains that for most of the 20th century the discipline did not directly play a role in teams winning championships, most particularly in the greatest team in MLB history ( per number of WS titles won).
     
    So teams won championships before anyone used Saberbmetrics, therefore they're overrated. Got it.

    With respect to NY dominance of most of the 20th century, it was largely in 8 team leagues. Roughly half as difficult to win a pennant in a 30 team league. Further, luck is much less of a factor in the single berth playoff over 154 games than in a multi-round playoff. The Yankees' winning three out of four from 1996-2000 and reaching five straight through 2001 is more impressive (and lucky?) than winning five in a row from 1949-53.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

  30. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @ex-banker

    “This is ridiculous”

    No it isn’t. I was directly commenting on a line that Steve mentioned toward the end of his post, namely, that IF winning championships largely depends upon luck, then Sabermetrics is largely useless when determining who will win a WS championship. For nearly an entire century, MLB has little to no direct experience with the discipline of Sabermetrcs and yet teams still managed to find ways to win championships, some teams achieved consistency regarding winning while one team in particular dominated the league in WS championships.

    In the case of NY, it was not based on luck. It was total dominance. 29 AL Pennants (20 WS championships) in 45 yrs is not luck-that’s roughly two and a half generations of MLB fans that grew up with only experiencing winning baseball in NY. Basically NY averaged a WS appearance at least every third year. That isn’t luck, that’s dominance to the max.

    Contrary to myth, NY’s farm system wasn’t any more expensive than STL, or
    BRN/LA’s. They were better at developing their home grown talent.

    Another thing not remarked upon is that in those days (prior to the mid. 60s), there was free agency in the draft—a prospect could sign with whatever club he chose to. After their winning championships began in the ‘20s, the Yankees started to develop their farm system. Having a reputation for winning helped aid them in getting many top prospects (but not all of them obviously).

    NY also had a knack for getting an extra piece of the puzzle, a spare part for the pennant run. Not every club was so adept.

    While one could argue that these aspects would help develop some concepts of what became known as Sabermetrics, the fact remains that for most of the 20th century the discipline did not directly play a role in teams winning championships, most particularly in the greatest team in MLB history ( per number of WS titles won).

    Replies: @ex-banker

    While one could argue that these aspects would help develop some concepts of what became known as Sabermetrics, the fact remains that for most of the 20th century the discipline did not directly play a role in teams winning championships, most particularly in the greatest team in MLB history ( per number of WS titles won).

    So teams won championships before anyone used Saberbmetrics, therefore they’re overrated. Got it.

    With respect to NY dominance of most of the 20th century, it was largely in 8 team leagues. Roughly half as difficult to win a pennant in a 30 team league. Further, luck is much less of a factor in the single berth playoff over 154 games than in a multi-round playoff. The Yankees’ winning three out of four from 1996-2000 and reaching five straight through 2001 is more impressive (and lucky?) than winning five in a row from 1949-53.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @ex-banker

    Sounds like you don't like NY. Got it.

    "The Yankees’ winning three out of four from 1996-2000 and reaching five straight through 2001 is more impressive (and lucky?) than winning five in a row from 1949-53."

    Opinion. Duly stated. Winning 5 WS has only been done once, and that's from 49-53. Five consecutive WS is impressive no matter the era, period. Especially since it's only been done once in history.

    "Roughly half as difficult to win a pennant in a 30 team league"

    Dude, the AL has never had 30 teams in its league. Come on.

    Another main point: No matter the era, pre or during Sabermetrics, NY has always found a way to win the most Championships, period. Since 1920, they've gone to the WS 40 times and won 27, and that's not luck. It's pure dominance. Luck is once or twice, not 27 times, or even 5 times in a row.

    "Further, luck is much less of a factor in the single berth playoff over 154 games"

    From 1903-68, the NL had best of three playoffs in 1946; 1951; 1959; and 1962.

    The AL had a single game playoff in 1948.

    That was the only time pre 1969 that the AL had a playoff game. So during NY's 1920-64 era of dominance, there was only one yr where there was a playoff game played (BOS vs CLE, and CLE won).

    I fully agree it was much harder during those days. Teams were listed top to bottom. The "first division" was first thru fourth place, while the "second division" was fifth through eighth (and later tenth). Teams had 154 (and later 162) game season to finish first. Either a team could do it over that amount of time or they could not, and it was their problem if they couldn't. That's life.

  31. @ex-banker
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi


    While one could argue that these aspects would help develop some concepts of what became known as Sabermetrics, the fact remains that for most of the 20th century the discipline did not directly play a role in teams winning championships, most particularly in the greatest team in MLB history ( per number of WS titles won).
     
    So teams won championships before anyone used Saberbmetrics, therefore they're overrated. Got it.

    With respect to NY dominance of most of the 20th century, it was largely in 8 team leagues. Roughly half as difficult to win a pennant in a 30 team league. Further, luck is much less of a factor in the single berth playoff over 154 games than in a multi-round playoff. The Yankees' winning three out of four from 1996-2000 and reaching five straight through 2001 is more impressive (and lucky?) than winning five in a row from 1949-53.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Sounds like you don’t like NY. Got it.

    “The Yankees’ winning three out of four from 1996-2000 and reaching five straight through 2001 is more impressive (and lucky?) than winning five in a row from 1949-53.”

    Opinion. Duly stated. Winning 5 WS has only been done once, and that’s from 49-53. Five consecutive WS is impressive no matter the era, period. Especially since it’s only been done once in history.

    “Roughly half as difficult to win a pennant in a 30 team league”

    Dude, the AL has never had 30 teams in its league. Come on.

    Another main point: No matter the era, pre or during Sabermetrics, NY has always found a way to win the most Championships, period. Since 1920, they’ve gone to the WS 40 times and won 27, and that’s not luck. It’s pure dominance. Luck is once or twice, not 27 times, or even 5 times in a row.

    “Further, luck is much less of a factor in the single berth playoff over 154 games”

    From 1903-68, the NL had best of three playoffs in 1946; 1951; 1959; and 1962.

    The AL had a single game playoff in 1948.

    That was the only time pre 1969 that the AL had a playoff game. So during NY’s 1920-64 era of dominance, there was only one yr where there was a playoff game played (BOS vs CLE, and CLE won).

    I fully agree it was much harder during those days. Teams were listed top to bottom. The “first division” was first thru fourth place, while the “second division” was fifth through eighth (and later tenth). Teams had 154 (and later 162) game season to finish first. Either a team could do it over that amount of time or they could not, and it was their problem if they couldn’t. That’s life.

  32. @Known Fact
    @Ganderson

    The Dodgers do have lovely classic uniforms. The Giants also look quite sharp at times but have too many changes and variations, some of them pretty clownish, similar story for the Buccos

    BTW do you LA fans know there was a 15,000-seat minor league ballpark there in the 1920s, designed much like Chicago's Wrigley Field -- for a minor league team that I think was owned by Wrigley. Mannix filmed a 1969 scene at the abandoned and decrepit stadium.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Ganderson

    Twas the home of the PCL Angels. Where did the Hollywood Stars play?

  33. https://nypost.com/2020/10/26/world-series-2020-crotch-chopping-dodgers-fan-steals-the-show/

    Nobody was more excited during Dodgers’ win than this crotch-chopping fan | New York Post

    If you’re not down with the Dodgers, this fan has two words for you.

    After Los Angeles reliever Victor Gonzalez got out of an eighth-inning jam during the Dodgers’ World Series Game 5 win over the Rays Sunday night, the Fox broadcast cut to a very hyped fan in a Hawaiian shirt who gave emphatic “suck it” crotch-chop gestures, to celebrate the Dodgers holding onto their two-run lead.

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