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Is the Christchurch Atrocity Blowback from Kosovo War of 20 Years Ago?
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Perhaps this is just a coincidence, but the Christchurch terrorist chose the closest Friday (March 15, 2019) to the 20th anniversary of the signing of the Rambouillet Agreement on March 18, 1999 by the US, UK, and Albania to break up Yugoslavia (i.e., Serbia) and have 30,000 NATO troops deploy through Belgrade and occupy Kosovo.

This accord led to the NATO bombing war on Yugoslavia that began March 24, 1999 and ran until June.

From Balkan Insight:

New Zealand Mosque Gunman ‘Inspired by Balkan Nationalists’
Maja Zivanovic BelgradeBIRN March 15, 2019

A gunman who killed 49 people in a terror attack on two mosques in Christchurch in New Zealand is believed to be an admirer of Balkan nationalists and historical figures, and he played a song honouring Radovan Karadzic before opening fire. …

A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.

Ahead of the killings, the user of the Brenton Tarrant account posted a 73-page ‘manifesto’ which said the motive for the attack was to “create fear”, and included anti-migrant hate speech, calls for killings of Muslims, and white supremacist rhetoric.

This whole thing has a pro-Serb (or, more generally, pro-Balkan Christian) / anti-American air. Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War, but it wouldn’t be too surprising if some people were still sore about it.

The text also contained a section about the Kosovo conflict.

“Balkanization will also reduce the USA’s ability to project power globally, and thereby ensure that never again can such a situation as the US involvement in Kosovo ever occur again (where US/NATO forces fought beside Muslims and slaughtered Christian Europeans attempting to remove there Islamic occupiers from Europe),” it said. …

Pictures showing weaponry used in the shooting were also marked with the name of Montenegrin military leader Marko Miljanov Popovic, who led his tribe in the fight against the Ottoman Empire.

The weapons were also marked with the name of Bajo Pivljanin, a commander who also fought against the Ottoman Empire in Bosnia and Montenegro. …

Another name marked on the weaponry was Novak Vujosevic, who fought on the Montenegrin side in the Battle of Fundina against the Ottoman Empire’s forces. …

It’s not unknown for terrorists to choose anniversaries, such as the Palestinian terrorist choosing the 1st anniversary of Israel launching the Six Days War to assassinate RFK, or Oklahoma City being on the 2nd anniversary of Waco.

But it could still be a coincidence.

 
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  1. According to his manifesto, it was blowback for a lot of things, including Rotherham. But he says he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

    • Replies: @gate666
    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.
    , @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    , @YetAnotherAnon
    "he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden"

    I remember seeing a photo of the girl post-attack. Not nice.
    , @Pericles


    the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

     

    I assume this was Ebba Åkerlund, the twelve year old girl run over by the muslim truck terrorist in Stockholm. From the one picture I've seen, it looked like her leg had been torn off at the hip and deposited a short distance away.

    Her grave is apparently being desecrated now and then by a man who will be deported ("any day now!"). At the latest count, thirty times. The police are, of course, powerless to do a damn thing.

    https://samtiden.nu/2018/11/ebbas-gravplats-fortsatt-skandad-av-utvisningsdomd-man/
    (In Swedish)
    , @Anonymous
    Have you actually read his manifesto? Looks like you haven't.
    , @RobRich
    How a self-confessed anti-Trump gun-control eco-Fascist Maoist terrorist deeds are blamed on Trump and gun ownership by CNN, newspapers, academics, etc. is yet more proof the far-left academia/media real war is with facts.
    , @Olorin
    Her name was Ebba Akerlund. With one of those little haloes on the A.

    I urge you to remember it, and also look up the easily found photo of her Islamification.
  2. @Dave Pinsen
    According to his manifesto, it was blowback for a lot of things, including Rotherham. But he says he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    "The American Right" manages to be less helpful, honest or descriptive than "the Jews" or "old money" here; are you talking about Dennis Hastert, Tom DeLay, Strom Thurmond, House Bush, and sundry other people who today would be voting to reject the border emergency?
    , @Mr. Anon

    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.
     
    Really? Which "right" was that? The Pat Buchanan right? Or the Bill Kristol right?
    , @Kevin O'Keeffe

    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.
     
    Neocons, maybe. I was a right-wing nationalist back in the 90s, and me and all the guys I knew were 100 percent pro-Belgrade* at that time.

    *except for the ethnic Croat-Americans, I suppose

  3. Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,

    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I’ve hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    • Agree: Jay Fink, JMcG, Denis
    • Replies: @Svigor
    Allow me to give you credit for ur wokeness. Seriously, not kidding here. By my standards, you were really paying attention; 9/11 was my wake-up call. Everyone heard about that one. "Our" bombing of the Serbs is pretty obscure, by comparison.
    , @Dave Pinsen
    It was also sort of an early end to the "end of history" honeymoon of the '90s. It refuted one of Tom Friedman's banalities from only a few years before (if memory serves) that countries with McDonald's franchises don't go to war with each other. The Wall Street Journal had an article about how McDonald's franchises in Serbia were trying to navigate the anti-American sentiment stemming from American bombs falling on the country.
    , @anon1
    Agree 100%.
    , @Anonymous

    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I’ve hated McCain and Kristol ever since.
     
    Me as well. I also came to realize why the empire needed to create a “professional military” who will enthusiastically carry out the slaughter of people who have not aggressed on the U.S. or any Americans and believe this slaughter is not only justified but even virtuous. Now we’re required to give them standing ovations at professional sports games and special privileges.
    , @Anonymous

    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I’ve hated McCain and Kristol ever since.
     
    Me as well. I often wonder if those U.S. pilots, who dropped cluster bombs and slaughtered Christians who trying to protect their families and children from KLA terrorists, sometimes reflect on their horrific damnable acts?
    , @Jay Fink
    I was paying attention too at the time and it really upset me that the U.S was bombing Serbia. Justin Raimondo from antiwar.com was all over it with some excellent articles that were very critical of our bombings and the motives behind it.
    , @Hail
    I had a similar reaction to the Balkan interventions as you did, istevefan, but mine was delayed until the mid 2000s or so, when I came to reappraise the Balkan/Kosovo situation after the Iraq War. By this time, online fora of various kinds were popping up more and more, and people on them were willing to "go there," whereas no one had been in the curated version of reality from the pre-Internet era.

    What is the lesson of Kosovo? It is this: The same liars would, did, and would again, side with Muslim thugs against European-Christians, whom they would bomb (U.S. bombs killed 1,200 Serb civilians), carve a Muslim dependency out of a Christian state, handing land, power, and prestige to illegal migrants against natives (from what I understand, most 'Kosovars,' or Kosovo-resident Albanians, were of mid-20th-century-or-later migrant origin to the area). Everything about this episode was shameful.

    , @LondonBob
    Thatcherite MP Alan Clark was very good on the Balkan intervention.

    http://www.lalkar.org/article/2025/conflict-in-the-balkans-alan-clarks-view

    The assertion that human rights within the boundaries of a sovereign nationare best defended by a sustained bombardment of its own civilian populationis, to put it most kindly, Orwellian. The notion that because a war is ‘just’ (by the aggressor’s definition) it can be prosecuted immediately, and without deference to international opinion is highly dangerous. It is to prevent exactly this that the UN’s Security Council mechanism came into being. Nato was conceived as a defensive alliance, its terms of engagement narrowly drawn; not as a ‘policeman’ surrogate for the UN; never as an apparatus for intervention in a civil war.

    What amazes me about the Yugoslav crisis is the credulity of the Left, and of progressive thinkers, who seem to get a vicarious thrill from seeing B52s taking off from Fairford.

    I address them: How have you swallowed whole the CIA-funded propaganda that demonises the Serbs? Are you not familiar with the duplicity and intimidation of United States foreign policy? That Ambassador Walker, in charge of monitoring forces in Bosnia, was financing the Contras? Have you no recall of that ‘Free World’ crap that embraced Battista, Noriega, Syngman Rhee, Bao Dai, Lee Van Thieu and Sukarno?

    If you read Michael Rose’s Despatch you will see that the Bosnians mortared their own bread queue for a horror shot. If you talked to British soldiers you would learn that the KLA are gangsters indistinguishable (my analogy) from any warlord in Mogadishu.

    In Yugoslavia there is a civil war. British soldiers are not mercenaries for one side or another where there is no threat to our citizens. The safest rule in such circumstances is, stick to humanitarian aid. What do you imagine so far is the cost? How much aid might this have funded?
     
    , @KenH
    And all the Muslim loons and whiners who complain about the Islamophobia of the U.S. government forget that the U.S. served as the air force for the murderous Albanian Muslim KLA. Unfortunately, Russia was still reeling from the collapse of the Soviet Union and too prostrate to render very much assistance to the embattled Christian Serbs.
    , @Abe
    Clintons bomb Serbia into submission until it amputates its province of Kosovo, at which point Kosovar Albanians ethnically cleanse it of all Serbs. This is explicitly done, in part, to get Muslims to better like the US by showing it will bomb Christians. In revenge, Serbia sends young men to America to shoot 3 pointers. In gratitude, Albania sends young men to America to shoot-up Fort Dix.
    , @Jus' Sayin'...
    I also began questioning US policy about that time. However, it wasn't until the US abetted ethnic cleansing of Serbs in Kosovo and its transformation into a rump, narco-terrorist state in the "soft underbelly of Europe" that I started my pilgrimage to wokeness.
    , @Olorin
    I knew neocons were bad news but couldn't put my finger on it with much precision till around this time and event...and then it was next to impossible to talk about it in my circles at the time, which were statist-academic careerist Democrat. I had very few people I could talk politics with, except a handful online and irl.

    Does anyone else remember this 1997 piece from Salon.com?

    The Waco Holocaust
    A disturbing new documentary suggests that the first ATF raid on the Branch Davidian compound was a publicity stunt that went terribly wrong -- and the FBI's raid was a blatant act of revenge.

    https://www.salon.com/1997/04/18/waco970418/
    http://archive.is/zgFf8
    https://web.archive.org/web/20190319092128/https://www.salon.com/1997/04/18/waco970418/

    I do. I brought it up with various lib/left friends and was basically sneered out of the room. Besides, who cared if "bible freaks" were being immolated? Served them right. Hicks. Also they raped children. Janet Reno said.

    That was one of my first sledgehammers to the head about how deeply flowed the leftist love of overweening state authority.

    Anyone else remember this 2003 Freep entry departing from Michael Savage's 1999 interview of Gail Sheehy on Hillary's role in Kosovo...and subsequent discussion (including a tidy list of pro-Kosovo-bombing public figures)?

    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/931921/posts
    https://web.archive.org/web/20190319101953/http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/931921/posts

    Dave Pinsen mentions the "honeymoon of the '90s." I have no idea what that means.

    Gulf War 1, 1990-1991
    Ongoing Iraqi operations, 1991 on
    Ruby Ridge, 1992
    Somali Civil War involvement, 1992-1995
    Bosnian War, 1992-1995
    Battle of Mogadishu, 1995
    Waco, 1993
    WTC bombing, 1993
    Haiti involvement, 1994-1995
    Oklahoma City, 1995
    Kosovo, 1998-1999
    Sudan, Afghanistan, etc., 1998 to forever it seems

    Seemed to me a constant nightmare of militarization and government at war with its own people. Maybe more people woke up to this in and after September of 2001. Maybe the PATRIOT Act helped with that.

    Finally, responding to Jay Fink, Raimondo wrote a book in the early '90s about the "Old Right," that well described my own dad and grandfather. Part of what bothered me about the neocons I knew was that they not only didn't know about this current of American politics/history, they didn't care to know or remember. Today I realize why that is...but back then it was painfully confusing. And hard to sort out at the time.

  4. @Dave Pinsen
    According to his manifesto, it was blowback for a lot of things, including Rotherham. But he says he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn’t-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He’s someone else’s problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow.
     
    Your take-home point is the mirror image of LOTB's:

    I appreciate the fact that, unlike American white nationalists, this guy isn’t obsessed with Jews. The only mention of Jews in his manifesto is this:

    Were/are you an anti-semite?

    No. A jew living in israel is no enemy of mine, so long as they do not seek to subvert or harm my people.
     

    There’s still a whiff of dislike of Jews in that statement, but like I said, at least he’s not obsessed with Jews.
     
    , @Dtbb
    Where can the video be seen?
    , @gabriel alberton

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow.
     
    Have you in the past supported that people should be gunned down, murdered, or otherwise harmed? Did you ever write, say, post something that would make anyone not insane in the head to interpret it as a call for others to be killed or hurt? If not, why would you feel any need to disavow the shooter, had him said Jews/Israel were his enemies?
    , @LondonBob
    It does sound like he was more influenced by the Pamela Gellers of this world.
    , @El Dato

    Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn’t-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.
     
    It's the 21st, man. It's like cyberpunk, only with mobile phones and better lighting.

    But this pales with the daily dropping of bombs on women and children. Nobody cares about THAT.

    “The sky above the port was the color of a YouTube channel, saying something about a missing plugin.”


    A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.
     
    Was that the accordion guy clip?
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    I agree with you Svigor, and I doubt you'll be surprised that your comment will awaken the hordes of insecure virtue signalers.

    This guy ain't the US's problem. That won't stop the usual suspects from attempting to make him ours.
    , @anonymous

    explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((
     
    Aren't there other whitey nationalist mofers who say something similar (Tommy Robinson...)? So, how are you mofers really different from each other?

    I feel no need to disavow.
     
    Yeah, like you lowlifes will actually disavow those dirty Whitey Terrorists, who are also anti-joomofers.

    He’s someone else’s problem.
     
    Keep deluding your accursed self. The more you rot your soul, the worse the comeuppance, and the greater our schadenfreude.

    May the Almighty One will a pox on your racist lowlife kind, and soon enough, into the worst recesses of Hell you all go.

  5. The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    To their credit, Serbs do not bear much of a grudge for it against Americans generally.

    Like the Syrian civil war, the best option was “stay out.”

    But Clinton and Obama instead actively supported the wrong side in those conflicts.

    • Replies: @Svigor

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.
     
    MAN, that is a bold statement. I mean, there's a LOOOOOOT (no pun intended, "Lot") of competition for that title. I would have to think bretty hurd about what deserves that title. Spoiled for choice here.
    , @anon1
    America had absolutely no right at all to attack Serbia. Serbia had not attacked America or threatened to do so. It had neither attacked or threatened to attack any American ally. It was just the USA being its typical bully asshole self.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.
     
    Bill Clinton was a major league lots-of-things, but only a minor league Roosevelt or Truman.
    , @donut
    " the most shameful episode of American history of the past century."

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .
    , @Anonymous

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.
     
    What is your reasoning behind that assessment?
  6. Never seen anything like that.

    Correction: never seen anything remotely in the same solar system as that.

    Serious question: is that a first? Has there ever been footage of a mass shooter like that?

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Not a mass shooter, AFAIK, but IIRC that fired black newscaster shot and killed the white woman newscaster while filming it first person shooter style.
    , @Anon
    Some time ago Liveleak had a video of Muslim terrorists shooting up worshippers in a mosque. Some brave soul inside the mosque held up his cell phone and kept it on the attackers the entire time. That was pretty intense.
    , @Headless Horseman
    Why are mass shootings newsworthy while mass beheadings not so much. Western lives matter?
    https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/new-isis-video-shows-mass-beheading-of-christians-399613507644
  7. @Lot
    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    To their credit, Serbs do not bear much of a grudge for it against Americans generally.

    Like the Syrian civil war, the best option was “stay out.”

    But Clinton and Obama instead actively supported the wrong side in those conflicts.

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    MAN, that is a bold statement. I mean, there’s a LOOOOOOT (no pun intended, “Lot”) of competition for that title. I would have to think bretty hurd about what deserves that title. Spoiled for choice here.

    • Replies: @Lot
    “MAN, that is a bold statement.“

    Iraq and Vietnam were worse, for both us and them.

    But the South Viets and Kurds didn’t deserve to live under communism or Saddam’s vicious government. We at least were on the right side of wars we should not have entered. These were foolish, dysfunctional, and reckless wars, but not evil.

    But bombing Serbia was just completely evil.
    , @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    Serbian Chetniks saved American pilots who got shot down by the Germans/Italians over Yugoslavia!

    And "we" repaid them for this by bombing them!
  8. It’s like when there’s a bad storm and someone blames it on global warming if it’s a summer storm and proof of global cooling if it is a winter storm. You can’t tell from just one storm, but the preponderance of data suggests (1) slight uptick in number of storms and (2) increased severity, especially rapid intensification of tropical cyclone due to warming.

    I use the climate change analogy b/c (reason alert) severity of droughts affects crop yields and creates need for imported water; you import water by importing grain products that need water to grow. That all these attacks are being painted as proof of the warrior nature of Islam (akin to heating) or the incivility of Aryans (akin to cooling) is just the sideshow. Mass migrations are due to climate effects (Gwynne Dyer – Climate Wars) caused mostly by us “whites” and hangers onners too.

    Climate affects will create a population bottleneck and those of us most deserving of passing through are (ironically) the same as those of us that will have created said narrow spot in the population pipeline b/c we are the only one capable of forging a new, better world on the other side. This ethical decision is based on the question: Which is better for the children of tomorrow? To be able to continue to advance, or to revert to tribal thought patterns and bamboo huts? It is too soon to turn liberal; we should wait until after the bottleneck, then mourn appropriately, then forge a better world. Those missing the boat to get here one hundred years ago (irony alert) have missed the boat completely.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    It’s like when there’s a bad storm and someone blames it on global warming if it’s a summer storm and proof of global cooling if it is a winter storm.
     
    Actually, they blame it on global warming in either event.
  9. Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn’t worth shit.

    There’s a huge disconnect in how our “leaders” respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    • Agree: YetAnotherAnon
    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    There’s a huge disconnect in how our “leaders” respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.
     
    Indeed. I don't remember condemnation of orthodox Jews after this atrocity:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cave_of_the_Patriarchs_massacre

    Not in the West, that is. The Muslim World is another matter. Of course, the West is now becoming part of the Muslim World.
    , @istevefan
    After muslim massacres in the West, victim's families are expected to call for peace and to not blame all muslims, etc . I don't think we've had retaliatory attacks unless you count the establishment using it as justification for more interventions in muslim lands.

    muslims aren't so forgiving. There will be retaliatory attacks in the West over Christchurch. The sad thing is liberals will justify this next attack(s) as payback for Christchurch. But they will never link Christchurch to 9-11, San Bernardino, Madrid, London, Bataclan, London again, etc., etc.

    It's like they never link the Crusades to jihadi aggression. The Crusades are seen alone as aggressive and not in the context of muslim aggression.

    , @Anon
    I agree. What happened at the Bataclan was certainly about 100 times worse than the mosque shooting in New Zealand. Witnesses said they were torturing people at the Bataclan before they killed them.
    , @Ali Choudhury
    Well, it was somewhat overshadowed by the invasion of Iraq four years later.
    , @Hapalong Cassidy
    Muslims from Albania/Kosovo/Bosnia are a different animal altogether from Muslims in the rest of the world. Pretty much indistinguishable in appearance and attitude from their Christian Balkan neighbors. I’ve met a few Bosnians and they are mostly no different than Serbs or Croats. In fact, I think they are descended mostly from Serbs and Croats that converted to Islam to gain preferential treatment under the occupying Ottomans. Granted, the non-Slavic Albanians are different, and seem to have a tendency towards organized crime. But not terrorism, and certainly not like say, the Chechens.
    , @Clyde

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.
     
    In Europe the four highest recent Muslim terrorism body counts>>>>
    The heavy delivery truck driven through crowds in the South of France killed 80 plus at Nice on Bastille Day
    the explosion and gunfire at the Ariel Grande concert in Manchester killed "only 22"
    then Bataclan with Eagles of Death metal just short of 100 killed.
    Then of course 12 killed at Charlie Hebdo and other smaller mass murders by Euro-Jihadists

    Outside Europe such as Kenya and India there were mass killings by the Jihad

    On 2 April 2015, gunmen stormed the Garissa University College in Garissa, Kenya, killing 148 people, and injuring 79 or more. The militant group and Al-Qaeda offshoot, Al-Shabaab, which the gunmen claimed to be from, took responsibility for the attack. The Somali gunmen took over 700 students hostage, freeing Muslims and killing those who identified as Christians.
     
    , @Kevin O'Keeffe

    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.
     
    I'm not sure whether you recall this, but "Muslim gratitude", in order to to secure a Palestinian peace deal, was part of the Clinton administration's (absurd) justification for the series of U.S./NATO war crimes commonly referenced as "the Kosovo War".
    , @Anonymous

    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.
     
    The husband and father should be grateful to you for only raping his wife and not his daughter, too.
  10. “anti-American air.”

    I read or scanned the whole manifesto. It wasn’t anti-American, or antisemitic, or anti-African American or anti-Abo for that matter.

    I also watched the video, which was eerily like the first-person shooters/GTA I played as a teen. I don’t recommend either of them, but morbid curiosity is a thing.

    • Replies: @passive-aggressivist
    I'm severely desensitized in many ways,
    but I feel there is absolutely nothing to gain from watching that video.
    , @Anonymous
    What was his motivation and ultimate goal?
  11. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Allow me to give you credit for ur wokeness. Seriously, not kidding here. By my standards, you were really paying attention; 9/11 was my wake-up call. Everyone heard about that one. “Our” bombing of the Serbs is pretty obscure, by comparison.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    One side of the family is Orthodox, not Serbian, but Orthodox nonetheless. Though I don't practice that faith, bombing Orthodox Christian Serbs shocked me. It awakened a tribal reaction in me similar to the one I had when Reginald Denny got his skull bashed in during the LA riots.
    , @Mr. Anon
    I didn't turn against the program until around 2004 or 2005, when we were still stomping around in Afghanistan and Iraq with - seemingly - not a f**king clue as to what our war aims even were. I had no enthusiasm for G.W. (aka "The Chimp") but I still voted for him in 2004. By 2008, I despised the Republican Party just about everybit as much as the Democrats. I certainly couldn't stand that blood-thirsty, traitorous old war-monger, McCain and I'd sooner vote for the Devil than for him.

    And I have since come to the point of view that any kind of endgoal in war-fighting is almost beside the point. To paraphrase Orwell "The purpose of war IS war." War is a state of affairs that a lot of people with power prefer, for a variety of reasons.

    , @Anonymous
    9/11 was my wake-up call.

    What did 9/11 wake you up to?
  12. I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: “This sort of thing isn’t supposed to happen in New Zealand.”

    • Replies: @Clifford Brown

    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: “This sort of thing isn’t supposed to happen in New Zealand.”
     
    You should be in shock. That is a healthy and sane reaction. By any standard in any society, the shooting was a horrendous atrocity. Rue the day when such a massacre is not shocking for then you have lost your humanity.

    New Zealand is a land uniquely blessed by God. Cherish your land and your compassionate, peaceful and free people.

    Insist on a thorough and uncensored investigation, one that is as transparent as possible. There is much that was bizarre in the entire episode.

    Take perspective and do not act too brashly. Do not sacrifice your values and freedoms in light of what is hopefully an extremely isolated incident. At the same time, do not allow your politicians to manipulate your shock and righteous grief over this atrocity to push for detrimental policies.

    Always remember that New Zealand does not walk alone.
    , @gabriel alberton
    Which naturally leads to the question: are there countries/places where this sort of thing is supposed to happen?
    , @anon
    I remember when the only news out of N.Z. was mass shootings of 6 or 8 people.
    Was there in 1975, jugs were all plastic in the pubs, due to people using them as weapons.
    It's a nasty place, race hate isn't far from the surface.
    , @Anonymous
    Friggin Zealots....
    , @Anonymous

    The country is in a state of shock with people saying: “This sort of thing isn’t supposed to happen in New Zealand.”
     
    What is significant about this observation?
  13. No offense to my fellow commenters, who, like Steve, will attempt with an admirable, if misplaced, Boomer earnestness to parse the underlying pro-Serb loyalties of the shooter, but you’re way off.

    It’s all about the memes.

    A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.

    The song in question, generally known amongst /pol/tards and their online fellow travelers as either “Serbia Strong” or “Remove Kebab,” has long been a staple of image board culture, especially among those with nationalist or fascist sympathies.

    https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/serbia-strong-remove-kebab

    This is not to say, of course, that the shooter did not/does not admire the Serbs as emblematic of armed resistance against Muslims, but the conflict itself was, I would wager, about as inconsequential in pushing him to commit the act that he did as are Candace Owens, Pewdiepie, or what is known as the “Navy Seal Copypasta,” all of which were referenced in either his manifesto or his comments just prior to the shooting, as recorded on the live stream.

    In short, y’all n****z got trolled.

    • Agree: Kevin O'Keeffe
    • Troll: MikeatMikedotMike
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    I don't disagree with your comment, but quantity and prominence of esoteric Balkan stuff was notable.

    If it were purely meme warfare, I would expect a more random distribution of references. So, yes, a lot of people are probably not seeing the trolling aspect, but Steve may still have a point.
  14. @Lot
    “anti-American air.”

    I read or scanned the whole manifesto. It wasn’t anti-American, or antisemitic, or anti-African American or anti-Abo for that matter.

    I also watched the video, which was eerily like the first-person shooters/GTA I played as a teen. I don’t recommend either of them, but morbid curiosity is a thing.

    I’m severely desensitized in many ways,
    but I feel there is absolutely nothing to gain from watching that video.

  15. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    It was also sort of an early end to the “end of history” honeymoon of the ’90s. It refuted one of Tom Friedman’s banalities from only a few years before (if memory serves) that countries with McDonald’s franchises don’t go to war with each other. The Wall Street Journal had an article about how McDonald’s franchises in Serbia were trying to navigate the anti-American sentiment stemming from American bombs falling on the country.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    Yes, I recall that observation that no two nations with a Mickie D's ever went to war. They also threw in no two democracies had gone to war, and no two nations with free trade had gone to war.

    Pat Buchanan at that time pointed out that the USA had free trade among the states in 1861.
    , @Digital Samizdat
    The McDonald's Theory was already wrong even when Tom Friedman first stated it in the early 90s. Britain and Argentina, to name an obvious counterexample, both had McDonald's in 1982 during the Falkland/Malvinas War.
  16. Anonymous[238] • Disclaimer says:

    k

  17. @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow.

    Your take-home point is the mirror image of LOTB’s:

    I appreciate the fact that, unlike American white nationalists, this guy isn’t obsessed with Jews. The only mention of Jews in his manifesto is this:

    Were/are you an anti-semite?

    No. A jew living in israel is no enemy of mine, so long as they do not seek to subvert or harm my people.

    There’s still a whiff of dislike of Jews in that statement, but like I said, at least he’s not obsessed with Jews.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    I appreciate the fact that, unlike American white nationalists, this guy isn’t obsessed with Jews. The only mention of Jews in his manifesto is this:
     
    In other words, "Is it good for the Jews?"
  18. @Svigor

    Never seen anything like that.
     
    Correction: never seen anything remotely in the same solar system as that.

    Serious question: is that a first? Has there ever been footage of a mass shooter like that?

    Not a mass shooter, AFAIK, but IIRC that fired black newscaster shot and killed the white woman newscaster while filming it first person shooter style.

    • Replies: @Ragno
    He killed a few people, IIRC.
  19. Perhaps this is just a coincidence, but the Christchurch terrorist chose the closest Friday (March 15, 2019)

    It’s also the Ides of March.

    (As any Cæsar could tell you.)

    • Replies: @utu
    And last Friday before Purim.
    , @Hodag
    2063 years ago...and the bastard had it coming.
  20. @Svigor
    Allow me to give you credit for ur wokeness. Seriously, not kidding here. By my standards, you were really paying attention; 9/11 was my wake-up call. Everyone heard about that one. "Our" bombing of the Serbs is pretty obscure, by comparison.

    One side of the family is Orthodox, not Serbian, but Orthodox nonetheless. Though I don’t practice that faith, bombing Orthodox Christian Serbs shocked me. It awakened a tribal reaction in me similar to the one I had when Reginald Denny got his skull bashed in during the LA riots.

    • Replies: @James Speaks

    It awakened a tribal reaction in me similar to the one I had when Reginald Denny got his skull bashed in during the LA riots.
     
    Similar to the reaction I had watching the video of a preying mantis kill and eat a humming bird? (Primitives should not kill and eat advanced species.)
  21. Anonymous[112] • Disclaimer says:

    The wiki pages on New Zealand and the prime minister nanny are depressing. Whites 70% of pop and dropping fast. Huge spike of immigration recently.

    Kiwis are ruled by another socialist witch just like all over Europe. She has a boyfriend and a new baby out of wedlock. WINNING.

    NZ is much further down the road to de-christianization than we are. Stats are ugly.

    • Replies: @Hail

    Whites 70% of pop and dropping fast
     
    Actually they are at 60% White as of 2019, with births as of the early 2010s at 50% White. The 60%-White figure is for full-Whites; higher figures include anyone reporting partial White ancestry. 'White,' in our terms, means full-White, which in New Zealand is now at 60%.

    There are certain striking parallels with the much-bigger USA's racial situation, and White share is one of them; see a comment at Anatoly Karlin's thread on the Christchurch attack (currently #72):


    – 2,900,000 Full-Whites of ethnic-Christian origin (of which, NW-European ancestry, esp. British Isles, constitutes a very comfortable majority) [60%]

    – 10,000 Jews? [0.2%] (7,000 specifically answered ‘Jewish’ to religion question on Census 2013)

    – 72,500 Muslims [1.5%] (see above)

    – 675,000 Maori, including mixed Maori-White [14%] (perhaps a third of the aggregate ancestry here is actually European; there are presumably still ~pure Maori but they are likely quite a small share of the overall pop., far below this 14% figure)
     


    – 350,000 Pacific Islander, including mixed White-Pacific [7%] (this population has a substantially lower degree of European admixture than the ‘Maori’ population)

    – 250,000 Chinese [5%]

    – 150,000? non-Chinese, East(ern) Asian [3%] (i.e., those from all points east of Bangladesh in Asia, excluding China)

    – 150,000? Hindus and Sikhs [3%]

    – <25,000 Blacks [0.5%] — Presumably entirely of refugee origin. NZ passed a refugee quota law in 1987 (somewhat restricted in 1997), which also jump-started Muslim growth.

    – 50,000 Other misc. [1%]

    – 200,000+ Mixed race, n.o.c. [4%] (incl. up to 20,000 White-EastAsian mixed-race individuals; White-Asian mixes, both East and South, were at 1.9% in the under-age-5 cohort in 2013 — full-Whites were at 50.3% and Maori and European+Maori were at 20.8% for the under-age-5 cohort.
     


    Comments: For NZ births from March 2008 to March 2013, full-Whites were a narrow majority of just above 50.0%, nearly exactly the same as the USA for the same period. Another coincidence is that U.S. Black and NZ Maori figures are so similar is percentage terms.

    The Muslim figure for NZ and the USA may also be just about the same (1.5%). It’s hard to tell how many Muslims are in the USA because that question has been so politicized for years, with Jewish activists tending to police the question and downplay Muslim numbers to make sure they are below Jewish numbers.
     

  22. Anonymous[208] • Disclaimer says:

    Let’s see. What is the appropriate response?

    White Nationalist Leaders In New Zealand Are Fearful That Their Communities Will Experience A Backlash

    Leaders of the biggest White Nationalist community centres said they have been working from the early hours to reassure community members.

    Oh to have community centers! Surely having such an exclusionary thing would be a hate crime of some description.

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/aishagani/fears-of-backlash-against-muslims-after-manchester-attack

    Oh, and this is just part and parcel of living in a big city, right?

    It seems most net-savvy males have seen far worse and except for boomer politicians, people watching this don’t really feel much of anything, except to laugh at things like the inclusion of the R3move [email protected] music. Realistically there are thousands of non-muslims killed by muslims each year, and we are supposed to feel compassion the rare occasion when they get some death visited upon them?

    Even Trump, who as the manifesto suggests is worth little more than as an icon of resurgent white awakening, had a curious non-denial denial – white nationalists are a small group of people who have very serious problems apparently. That’s one way of putting it, sure.

    I found it hard to disagree with sentiment behind most of what BT wrote, except:
    -the (((elephant))) in the room is strangely ignored, just hinted at, why?
    -is it realistic to expect that this will be the catalyst to spark a chain reaction? Even thought the Koran instructs a crescendo of terror as the Muslim population grows and establishes itself through Hejira, trying to one-up this guy will lead to radicalization of white people, so my guess is that this mostly won’t happen. It could I suppose.
    -not enough emphasis on what we can personally do to increase birthrates, i.e. have children ourselves and lead by example. This guy has sacrificed his genes now and the best hope he has is of some luck with some prison guards, I guess.
    -I don’t really trust accelerationism. I could be wrong on that though. Seems like a good way to get disarmed and in a worse situation.

    My way would be to peacefully raise children and raise awareness. However, we are in what is effectively a war of genocide against us, tracked by guys like Potok. The point he made about being a uniformed partisan, and also similar to Mandela, he’s not exactly wrong IMO. I thought it was an interesting take.

    And Candace Owens, lol! Bringing the bantz.

  23. @istevefan
    One side of the family is Orthodox, not Serbian, but Orthodox nonetheless. Though I don't practice that faith, bombing Orthodox Christian Serbs shocked me. It awakened a tribal reaction in me similar to the one I had when Reginald Denny got his skull bashed in during the LA riots.

    It awakened a tribal reaction in me similar to the one I had when Reginald Denny got his skull bashed in during the LA riots.

    Similar to the reaction I had watching the video of a preying mantis kill and eat a humming bird? (Primitives should not kill and eat advanced species.)

    • Replies: @Paco Wové
    Vertebrates rule! Arthropods drool!
  24. Who-Whom knows?

    Maybe the Christchurch terrorist was inspired by Bari Weiss’ five millennia long history of neurotic blotting out and dot-connecting which forced him to believe it’s always
    Purimfest 1946 ?

  25. Still don’t believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    • Replies: @istevefan
    You might just inspire someone yet.
    , @James Speaks
    You seethe with hate as you lay the blame on others. Irony. Get someone to explain it to you.
    , @MEH 0910

    Read Adam Serwer
     
    I subscribed to PewDiePie.
    , @KenH
    It wasn't "hate speech" that drove the NZ shooter to kill all those Muslims. It was reading the numerous stories about Muslim violence against white Europeans in the U.K., Scandinavia and Western Europe.

    Funny how we never hear the need for hate speech laws when non-whites or deranged anti-white leftists kill or maim white people.

    You're still a moron.
    , @Anon
    Its important not to paint with such broad strokes. 99.9% of white nationalist never commit violence. By lumping all white nationalists together with this guy , we risk rationalizing the moderate white nationalists which are 99.9% of the white nationalist population.

    As bad as this event was , it would be a far worse tragedy to stigmatize innocent, Moderate white nationalists and sacrifice the role they play in a diverse multicultural society.
    , @El Dato

    Blood is on your hands
     
    Wear gloves. Safety first!
    , @Anonymous
    Actually, the blood is on the hands of multi-culturalists like you. Muslims are raping and killing whites all over the West which provoked an all too predictable reaction. The blood on both sides is on the hands of the Tribe and their golems. This also includes the carnage in the ME.
  26. @Dave Pinsen
    It was also sort of an early end to the "end of history" honeymoon of the '90s. It refuted one of Tom Friedman's banalities from only a few years before (if memory serves) that countries with McDonald's franchises don't go to war with each other. The Wall Street Journal had an article about how McDonald's franchises in Serbia were trying to navigate the anti-American sentiment stemming from American bombs falling on the country.

    Yes, I recall that observation that no two nations with a Mickie D’s ever went to war. They also threw in no two democracies had gone to war, and no two nations with free trade had gone to war.

    Pat Buchanan at that time pointed out that the USA had free trade among the states in 1861.

  27. @Svigor
    Allow me to give you credit for ur wokeness. Seriously, not kidding here. By my standards, you were really paying attention; 9/11 was my wake-up call. Everyone heard about that one. "Our" bombing of the Serbs is pretty obscure, by comparison.

    I didn’t turn against the program until around 2004 or 2005, when we were still stomping around in Afghanistan and Iraq with – seemingly – not a f**king clue as to what our war aims even were. I had no enthusiasm for G.W. (aka “The Chimp”) but I still voted for him in 2004. By 2008, I despised the Republican Party just about everybit as much as the Democrats. I certainly couldn’t stand that blood-thirsty, traitorous old war-monger, McCain and I’d sooner vote for the Devil than for him.

    And I have since come to the point of view that any kind of endgoal in war-fighting is almost beside the point. To paraphrase Orwell “The purpose of war IS war.” War is a state of affairs that a lot of people with power prefer, for a variety of reasons.

    • Replies: @Anon
    Good observations.
  28. @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    Where can the video be seen?

    • Replies: @Kylie
    The shooter's livestream video was sent to me via Facebook Messenger. It's still there but apparently it's been yanked from a lot of sites.

    It's not spectacularly gory or gruesome.
    , @Anon
    It's on Liveleak, or was when I viewed it there yesterday.
    , @Anon

    Where can the video be seen?
     
    You can see it at bestgore dot com

    Part and parcel of living in a great, global city is you’ve got to be prepared for these things
     
    - Sadiq Kahn - London Mayor.
    , @Svigor
    Apparently it's being taken down in most places, as soon as it goes up. I saw it in a comment thread on TRS and DLed it, but have no idea if the link is still up. I'd try a bittorrent search engine, if I had to find it now.
    , @Macumazahn
    The torrent hash-ID
    E0511A1ACE47AEE00082ADD078A60630B7D3691A
    is your friend.
  29. @22pp22
    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: "This sort of thing isn't supposed to happen in New Zealand."

    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: “This sort of thing isn’t supposed to happen in New Zealand.”

    You should be in shock. That is a healthy and sane reaction. By any standard in any society, the shooting was a horrendous atrocity. Rue the day when such a massacre is not shocking for then you have lost your humanity.

    New Zealand is a land uniquely blessed by God. Cherish your land and your compassionate, peaceful and free people.

    Insist on a thorough and uncensored investigation, one that is as transparent as possible. There is much that was bizarre in the entire episode.

    Take perspective and do not act too brashly. Do not sacrifice your values and freedoms in light of what is hopefully an extremely isolated incident. At the same time, do not allow your politicians to manipulate your shock and righteous grief over this atrocity to push for detrimental policies.

    Always remember that New Zealand does not walk alone.

    • Replies: @anon1
    Now would be the time to change or end immigration.
    , @captflee
    Sir;

    Your comment fairly jumped off the screen, such is its concise, calm, rational, and compassionate power. Well done, sir, well done.
    , @Anonymous

    By any standard in any society, the shooting was a horrendous atrocity. Rue the day when such a massacre is not shocking for then you have lost your humanity.
     
    Are U.S. bombings and drone strikes horrendous atrocities?
    , @ben tillman

    You should be in shock. That is a healthy and sane reaction. By any standard in any society, the shooting was a horrendous atrocity. Rue the day when such a massacre is not shocking for then you have lost your humanity.
     
    Atrocious murders in far greater numbers are routinely ignored or excused. It didn't shock me.
  30. I’m not a Serb, and have no tribal identification with them. Mostly what I see here is human scum (the shooter) murdering innocent human beings, just as Satan wanted him to.

    I’m not entirely surprised that someone who identifies with Serbs would imitate Serb terrorism and mass murder Moslems:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

    Filming a massacre in progress also has a Serbian precedent:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre#2005:_Release_of_Scorpions_massacre_video

    • Replies: @Ron Mexico
    Have you been given the full picture of Srebrenica or The Narrative?
    http://tenc.net/sreb/mem.htm
    , @Dieter Kief
    "Civil Wars" - an essay by Hans Magnus Enzensberger, in which he predicts the worldwide increase of molecular civil wars.

    In Hans Magnus Enzensberger - Civil Wars - From L. A. to Bosnia - available at amazon.com

    , @Anonymous

    I’m not a Serb, and have no tribal identification with them. Mostly what I see here is human scum (the shooter) murdering innocent human beings, just as Satan wanted him to.
     
    Was the killing of hundreds of thousands Iraqis by the US invasion and occupation the murder of innocent human beings? Was Satan behind you when you did it?
  31. March 15th is the aniversary of a number of things:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_15

  32. This should cost at least one parasite his job – namely, Peter Dutton, the racist authoritarian fuckwit who fancies himself as Reichsleiter of the Australian Sicherheitsdienst.

    Dutton’s recent schtick has been all about justifying, on the basis of the need to ‘identify the bad guys’, the massive expansion of domestic surveillance power – including the tech-industry-destroying forced-crippling of security.

    And yet all the King’s Horses, and all the King’s Men, and all the billions upon billions of taxpayer dollars spent on the “national security” bondoggle… couldn’t identify Tarrant before he acted.

    I’ve asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.

    Getting hold of the weapons he used (and the ammo) is not a trivial task in NZ – and would also bring you onto the radar of Five Eyes.

    Then again, I am a skeptic about Breivik, too, because I know how hard it is to carry weapons and ammo sufficient to do what he supposedly did. Ditto Martin Bryant. Those two guys pulled off stats that the best operators could not achieve in a training drill.

    I’m perfectly aware of Hanlon’s Razor: given that it’s staffed by third decile morons, there’s a significant likelihood that the Oz/NZ “national security” alphabet soup simply dropped the ball.

    But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place – if he wasn’t on Five Eyes radar, then they should de-fund the whole thing because it’s worse than useless.

    • Replies: @Lot
    “But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place“

    Young Australians, in general, are all over the place.

    It is part of white Australian culture to wander around. High wages and generous leave policy helps.
    , @Father O'Hara
    I heard the NZ security guys were being advised by Scott Israel.
    , @Mr. Anon

    I’ve asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.
     
    Young Australians are known for wanderlust. There was even a song about it:

    Down Under
    , @anon
    Peter Dutton has also been deporting paroled murderers back to New Zealan.
    You wouldn't be cranky about that, by some chance?
  33. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    There’s a huge disconnect in how our “leaders” respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    Indeed. I don’t remember condemnation of orthodox Jews after this atrocity:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cave_of_the_Patriarchs_massacre

    Not in the West, that is. The Muslim World is another matter. Of course, the West is now becoming part of the Muslim World.

  34. @James Speaks
    It's like when there's a bad storm and someone blames it on global warming if it's a summer storm and proof of global cooling if it is a winter storm. You can't tell from just one storm, but the preponderance of data suggests (1) slight uptick in number of storms and (2) increased severity, especially rapid intensification of tropical cyclone due to warming.

    I use the climate change analogy b/c (reason alert) severity of droughts affects crop yields and creates need for imported water; you import water by importing grain products that need water to grow. That all these attacks are being painted as proof of the warrior nature of Islam (akin to heating) or the incivility of Aryans (akin to cooling) is just the sideshow. Mass migrations are due to climate effects (Gwynne Dyer - Climate Wars) caused mostly by us "whites" and hangers onners too.

    Climate affects will create a population bottleneck and those of us most deserving of passing through are (ironically) the same as those of us that will have created said narrow spot in the population pipeline b/c we are the only one capable of forging a new, better world on the other side. This ethical decision is based on the question: Which is better for the children of tomorrow? To be able to continue to advance, or to revert to tribal thought patterns and bamboo huts? It is too soon to turn liberal; we should wait until after the bottleneck, then mourn appropriately, then forge a better world. Those missing the boat to get here one hundred years ago (irony alert) have missed the boat completely.

    It’s like when there’s a bad storm and someone blames it on global warming if it’s a summer storm and proof of global cooling if it is a winter storm.

    Actually, they blame it on global warming in either event.

    • Replies: @James Speaks

    Actually, they blame it on global warming in either event.
     
    Depends on which they you are talking about. Climate scientists talk about increased amplitude of the polar jet stream that allows the deep loops to invade the middle latitudes; ergo, climate change allows record cold in some locations even though the global averages for those months are still higher than normal. Climate shaman call this voodoo climate science and claim that the sun is cooling. Ergo, cold weather. (Akshually, the decrease in solar forcing is a few orders of magnitude less than the increase in forcing from CO2, but I digress.)

    Remember: the point of my discussion is to allude to how a bigger trend is causing local effects.
  35. @Svigor

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.
     
    MAN, that is a bold statement. I mean, there's a LOOOOOOT (no pun intended, "Lot") of competition for that title. I would have to think bretty hurd about what deserves that title. Spoiled for choice here.

    “MAN, that is a bold statement.“

    Iraq and Vietnam were worse, for both us and them.

    But the South Viets and Kurds didn’t deserve to live under communism or Saddam’s vicious government. We at least were on the right side of wars we should not have entered. These were foolish, dysfunctional, and reckless wars, but not evil.

    But bombing Serbia was just completely evil.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    I had a foreign language "sampler" channel when we bombed the Chinese embassy; those were the bright days of early globalism, so it had a wierd mix of programming like Legend of the Galactic Heroes in Arabic or the Madhuri Dikshit show*.
    Almost all the standard languages were covered by Deutsche Welle, so what the German "news" said and showed would be reiterated on the same soundstage by a different guy.
    But not French. The French had this gorgeously cinematic and futuristic news set. Deutsche Welle is something like Voice of Germany, NPR specifically for foreigners, but the French one was France Channel 2 and once showed an excited and uncensored bull in a story about agriculture.
    The Germans and everyone else (here including the US MSM outside the globalism channel):
    The US bombed the Chinese embassy. The CIA said, sorry, our maps were like old or something, we wanted the building next door which was totally like so legitimate a tarzhey.
    The French:
    The building next door? You mean the tree? Because the Chinese embassy is in a small park.
    And then the French became the only people who showed a little illustration, at a time when every newspaper had an asinine computer generator space-taking pseudo-informative graphic for stuff like annual rainfall. Nobody who saw all that green space around the buildings of the complex could buy anything else coming out of DC.
    *Like a once-standard American sitcom placing a female celebrity as an ordinary housewife, but they have an episode about how the Indian police are utterly useless and organized crime is rampant.
    , @EldnahYm
    The Kurds fought on both sides of the Iran Iraq War, ethnically cleansed and massacred Assyrians who had more right to territory than they did, and have been a pain in the neck to every other people in the Middle East. Atrocities against them were predictable and not something any other capable authoritarian in that region wouldn't have done. We weren't on the right side, we shouldn't have even been fighting in the Middle East.

    In Iraq we caused more trouble in the area that existed previously, and neither the people we opposed there or the people were supported were any good.
    , @Svigor
    Yeah, it depends on how you approach the question. It's like the Aztecs vs. the Mongols. The Mongols murdered far more people - a great many of them innocents - than the Aztecs did. And I'm confident they did plenty of torturing, mutilating, and maiming along the way. But they just didn't come anywhere close to the Aztecs in terms of vileness - in the purely evil nature of their culture. The Aztecs are in a class of their own, on that score. The Mongols did evil as a means to an end, but for the Aztecs, it was a religion and a way of life.

    But dead is dead, and the Mongols killed way more people. I have to give the nod to scale and score them @ #1. Let's just say I call them "the worst," avoiding the question of evil.

    Similarly, we killed an awful lot of people in Vietnam. We helped the Vietnamese kill an awful lot of people in Vietnam.

  36. @gate666
    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.

    “The American Right” manages to be less helpful, honest or descriptive than “the Jews” or “old money” here; are you talking about Dennis Hastert, Tom DeLay, Strom Thurmond, House Bush, and sundry other people who today would be voting to reject the border emergency?

    • Replies: @Matra
    Bob Dole always had very close ties to Albanian lobbyists. John McCain (of course!) was also big on bombing Serbs. Neocons too. "Moderate" Internationalist Republicans were generally in favour of NATO action as well. So basically the "Right" American voters preferred to anti-war Buchanan and libertarians.
  37. @gate666
    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.

    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.

    Really? Which “right” was that? The Pat Buchanan right? Or the Bill Kristol right?

    • Agree: Hail
  38. White Nationalist, if you find yourself having to choose between on the one hand keeping your head down and raising loads of healthy, well-adjusted white children, and on the other hand reducing the number of Muslims in the world by 0.00000005%, think of the children.

  39. The first part of the manifesto expresses a concern over immigration and the impending destruction of European people’s homelands.

    Globalists for Open Borders tell a man his (white) life doesn’t matter and then they are outraged when he rises up in indignation and lashes out at the people who are his designated replacements?

    What I am about to say is neither a threat nor a warning; rather, it is a prediction. As Globalists, Liberals and Leftists continue their war on the White Lives Matter movement, these attacks will escalate.

    As he says, “I could no longer ignore the attacks. They were attacks on my people, attacks on my culture, attacks on my faith and attacks on my soul. They would not be ignored.”

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    It’s a weird coincidence that we have a terrorist lamenting low birth rates the same week Buffalo Wild Wings was pushing vasectomies.

    https://twitter.com/shavedharambee/status/1106259197350563846?s=21
  40. Perhaps this is just a coincidence, but the Christchurch terrorist chose the closest Friday (March 15, 2019) to the 20th anniversary of the signing of the Rambouillet Agreement on March 18, 1999 by the US, UK, and Albania to break up Yugoslavia (i.e., Serbia) and have 30,000 NATO troops deploy through Belgrade and occupy Kosovo.

    The shooting was also the 19th Anniversary of the release of the video game Spyro the Dragon 3.

    I just made that up, but this guy was all over the map. He seems to be motivated to bring in as many Internet references as possible in order to justify a massive new round of censorship.

    As for our beloved Bari Weiss, this is the Shabbat immediately before Purim. The Baruch Goldstein Mosque massacre took place on Purim in 1994.

  41. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Agree 100%.

  42. Some other shootings give reason to be suspicious (especially when an autopsy reveals massive unnatural chemical anomalies, or a government seals all the information for a century, or one-of-a-kind vehicle is staged in an unjustifiable location in advance) but, if they keep up long enough, we encounter the most compelling reason to thank our deep state for its attacks on us and the Constitution: that law of criminal science which dictates that once a novel crime is deep enough in the public consciousness, some idiot who is not a spook with an agenda will copycat it for real.

  43. @22pp22
    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: "This sort of thing isn't supposed to happen in New Zealand."

    Which naturally leads to the question: are there countries/places where this sort of thing is supposed to happen?

    • Replies: @BB753
    France and Great Britain. It's strange nothing of the sort has happened there in retaliation.
    , @Almost Missouri
    Which then naturally leads to the question: does importing people from where this sort of thing is supposed to happen to where it isn't supposed to happen change where it is supposed to happen?
  44. @Lot
    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    To their credit, Serbs do not bear much of a grudge for it against Americans generally.

    Like the Syrian civil war, the best option was “stay out.”

    But Clinton and Obama instead actively supported the wrong side in those conflicts.

    America had absolutely no right at all to attack Serbia. Serbia had not attacked America or threatened to do so. It had neither attacked or threatened to attack any American ally. It was just the USA being its typical bully asshole self.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    Recall we originally stated that the rules of engagement only involved Serb forces in Kosovo itself, which was still a violation of Serbian sovereignty. However, after a few weeks when they did not yield, we started bombing bridges and infrastructure in the rest of Serbia. We even took out a passenger train if I recall. We even managed to hit the Chinese embassy in Belgrade.
  45. Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War, but it wouldn’t be too surprising if some people were still sore about it.

    In Serbia they are still sore about the 1389 Kosovo War.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kosovo

    • Replies: @Hail
    All Europeans should be sore about the Ottoman presence in Europe all those centuries. A highly negative net effect. Certainly the Balkans' historical problems can be blamed on Ottomans / Islam in no small part.
  46. @Clifford Brown

    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: “This sort of thing isn’t supposed to happen in New Zealand.”
     
    You should be in shock. That is a healthy and sane reaction. By any standard in any society, the shooting was a horrendous atrocity. Rue the day when such a massacre is not shocking for then you have lost your humanity.

    New Zealand is a land uniquely blessed by God. Cherish your land and your compassionate, peaceful and free people.

    Insist on a thorough and uncensored investigation, one that is as transparent as possible. There is much that was bizarre in the entire episode.

    Take perspective and do not act too brashly. Do not sacrifice your values and freedoms in light of what is hopefully an extremely isolated incident. At the same time, do not allow your politicians to manipulate your shock and righteous grief over this atrocity to push for detrimental policies.

    Always remember that New Zealand does not walk alone.

    Now would be the time to change or end immigration.

    • Agree: Hail
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    This, Baruch Goldstein style events are inevitable on both sides and will increase with the numbers, regardless of efforts wasted on irrelevant scapegoats. It's exactly like diversity in prisons: except for California you don't force mixing because forced mixing guarantees violence.
    One way to have diversity without violence would be to actually acknowledge the existence of the People politicians nominally work for, get Their okay, and only let people in under strict controls.
    , @Clifford Brown
    Personally, I think that New Zealand is overpopulated as it is, but that is just me. I think they need some more national parks in fact.

    Still, up to the people of New Zealand.
    , @europeasant
    "Now would be the time to change or end immigration"

    Good idea but our rulers have deemed that the population has to/will continue to expand due to financial reasons.

    If White people will not expand the population then the people from Asia/Africa will have to be brought in to continue that expansion.

    Apparently only White people got the memo about overpopulation.
    , @ben tillman

    Now would be the time to change or end immigration.
     
    Indeed. The only justification for immigration, ever, is to prevent immigration by others less similar to you.
  47. It’s not unknown for terrorists to choose anniversaries

    Whether a date is an anniversary depends on which calendar you’re using.

  48. anonymous[751] • Disclaimer says:

    Another war we were certainly on the wrong side of

  49. it’s possible but tbh i’ve been expecting stuff like this as a result of the social media censorship campaign making people believe there’s no political solution

    twitter, facebook, google etc

  50. The bully USA had NO RIGHT to attack Serbia in 1999. Shame on the USA.

    As for Muslim “gratitude” just two years later the twin towers were destroyed.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    It's worse than that. 9-11 was Saudis. We bombed Serbs for Albanians. Yet Albanians plotted to kill US soldiers at Ft. Dix. Some gratitude.
  51. @Lot
    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    To their credit, Serbs do not bear much of a grudge for it against Americans generally.

    Like the Syrian civil war, the best option was “stay out.”

    But Clinton and Obama instead actively supported the wrong side in those conflicts.

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    Bill Clinton was a major league lots-of-things, but only a minor league Roosevelt or Truman.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Truman did what he did within memory of Hitler and in the growing shadow of Stalin. Clinton did what he did without any global militarized totalitarian threat, for the worst reason, because he could.
  52. @Lot
    “MAN, that is a bold statement.“

    Iraq and Vietnam were worse, for both us and them.

    But the South Viets and Kurds didn’t deserve to live under communism or Saddam’s vicious government. We at least were on the right side of wars we should not have entered. These were foolish, dysfunctional, and reckless wars, but not evil.

    But bombing Serbia was just completely evil.

    I had a foreign language “sampler” channel when we bombed the Chinese embassy; those were the bright days of early globalism, so it had a wierd mix of programming like Legend of the Galactic Heroes in Arabic or the Madhuri Dikshit show*.
    Almost all the standard languages were covered by Deutsche Welle, so what the German “news” said and showed would be reiterated on the same soundstage by a different guy.
    But not French. The French had this gorgeously cinematic and futuristic news set. Deutsche Welle is something like Voice of Germany, NPR specifically for foreigners, but the French one was France Channel 2 and once showed an excited and uncensored bull in a story about agriculture.
    The Germans and everyone else (here including the US MSM outside the globalism channel):
    The US bombed the Chinese embassy. The CIA said, sorry, our maps were like old or something, we wanted the building next door which was totally like so legitimate a tarzhey.
    The French:
    The building next door? You mean the tree? Because the Chinese embassy is in a small park.
    And then the French became the only people who showed a little illustration, at a time when every newspaper had an asinine computer generator space-taking pseudo-informative graphic for stuff like annual rainfall. Nobody who saw all that green space around the buildings of the complex could buy anything else coming out of DC.
    *Like a once-standard American sitcom placing a female celebrity as an ordinary housewife, but they have an episode about how the Indian police are utterly useless and organized crime is rampant.

    • Replies: @Anon
    ATM, Franceinfo, the 24-hur news channel run by the French government for internal consumption, broadcasts "sports" and "culture", while RT France, Ruptly, and Sputnik France broadcast Champs Elysee burnings and fights. The Russian channels have 7K viewers each on Youtube, while Frenchy-French one has 700.

    For the moment, it looks as if the French cannot control the message any longer. But the fact is the French still elected that clown. There is a lot of time until the next elections, and legitimacy is the only concern of the French establishment.

    Also, Russia's propaganda can be easily excised off the internet if they persist on using US platforms.

  53. @anon1
    Now would be the time to change or end immigration.

    This, Baruch Goldstein style events are inevitable on both sides and will increase with the numbers, regardless of efforts wasted on irrelevant scapegoats. It’s exactly like diversity in prisons: except for California you don’t force mixing because forced mixing guarantees violence.
    One way to have diversity without violence would be to actually acknowledge the existence of the People politicians nominally work for, get Their okay, and only let people in under strict controls.

  54. Anonymous[396] • Disclaimer says:

    Watching the MSM reaction to the Christchurch Massacre is like watching the Bizarro-World reaction to Islamic Massacres.

    1) As soon as it happened everyone started calling the perpetrator a terrorist, which was 100% accurate given his elaborate streaming setup. But a Muslim can hack people to death while shouting Allahu Ackbar and we really need to wait until all the facts are in, preferably until people forget about it.

    2) Muslim terrorists are lone wolves who have noting to do with Islam but any time a white(or even partly-white guy) engages in terrorist behaviour, it’s part of a worldwide movement that somehow combines Islamophobes, White Nationalists, incels and 4chan, no matter how tenuous the links are.

    In fact, many Islamic terrorists in the west are the exact equivalent of Breivik and apparently this guy-people who got all their ideas from a specific messed-up corner of the internet but never attended a training camp of any kind or are part of a large network of co-conspirators.

    3) MSM gatekeepers are doing their best not to give viewers any information that might cast Islam in a negative light. During a Canadian round-table on the CBC, the talking heads pointed out the unmistakable reference to Alexandre Bissionette on the terrorist’s gun case, while leaving viewers to wonder what “For Rotherham” meant.

    • Replies: @gregor
    When Muslims do something, the media’s sole concern is preventing “backlash” against Muslims. Whenever a white guy does something, they are suddenly unconcerned with this and in fact act as ringleaders to stir up maximal backlash against whites.
    , @Wilkey
    Muslim terrorists are lone wolves who have noting to do with Islam but any time a white(or even partly-white guy) engages in terrorist behaviour, it’s part of a worldwide movement that somehow combines Islamophobes, White Nationalists, incels and 4chan, no matter how tenuous the links are.

    Which of course is bullshit, as everyone knows. Islamic terrorists often have little difficulty finding collaborators, or at least people who will keep their mouths shut. Hell, the San Bernardino attack involved a man and his wife. Omar Mateen's wife may have known about his plans but did nothing to try to stop him. The November 2015 Paris attacks involved at least 9 terrorists. The 9/11 attacks included at least 20 terrorists just in the US.

    Right-wing terrorists usually act alone.
    , @Days of Broken Arrows
    Great post! Stories about the recent college admissions scandal are also taking a Bizarro World turn.

    The original story looked at how the one percent were cheating to get their kids into top schools and screwing the middle class over. But now this Yahoo story has reversed that and blames the middle class. Why? Because "privilege" due to "redlining" that happened decades ago.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/collegeadmissions-scandal-why-the-meritocracy-should-look-in-the-mirror-160000745.html
  55. They are moving very strongly to censor social media and criminalize speech. BBC Radio in the immediate aftermath talked about the need to monitor thought in almost those words. No one considers that people might be reacting to what they see around them with their own eyes — there is always this faith that folks are captured by some conjuration and mighty magic, in other words, the thoroughly trashed premise of the SPLC and the ADL which led them to attack Gibson’s Passion of the Christ and Bavarian Easter celebrations. The mainstream national and international news already censors crimes against whites, and police agencies across Western Europe spent about half a year pretending that nothing happened on New Year’s Eve in Cologne. They must be looking at places like this next.

    • Replies: @gregor
    Their ideas are so alien and unnatural they can only become dominant with years of uncontested indoctrination. And even then they know it only takes a few hours of exposure to “far right” ideas (i.e., real talk and common sense) to wipe it all out. Their only option is suppression.
  56. @anon1
    Now would be the time to change or end immigration.

    Personally, I think that New Zealand is overpopulated as it is, but that is just me. I think they need some more national parks in fact.

    Still, up to the people of New Zealand.

    • Replies: @22pp22
    I think the population is fine as it is. I don't want it to grow any more. On the drive from Invercargill to Christchurch, we don't pass through a large settlement. I like it that way.

    Half of the population of four and a half million lives in or around Auckland. I almost never go there. My wife and I will be spending our anniversary in Melbourne. It's cheaper to get here.

  57. @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow.

    Have you in the past supported that people should be gunned down, murdered, or otherwise harmed? Did you ever write, say, post something that would make anyone not insane in the head to interpret it as a call for others to be killed or hurt? If not, why would you feel any need to disavow the shooter, had him said Jews/Israel were his enemies?

    • Replies: @Svigor
    That's a good question. I mean it's not like Muslims have to disavow their terrorists, or Jews theirs, or blacks theirs, etc.

    I am going to enjoy telling everyone this awful racist (Islam isn't a race!) Islamophobic hater shooter terrorist guy loved Jews.

    , @Anonymous

    Have you in the past supported that people should be gunned down, murdered, or otherwise harmed? Did you ever write, say, post something that would make anyone not insane in the head to interpret it as a call for others to be killed or hurt?
     
    Did you ever support the US killing in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Yemen, and Somalia? Did you ever support the Zionist conquest of Palestine?
  58. @Tiny Duck
    Still don't believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    You might just inspire someone yet.

  59. @Tiny Duck
    Still don't believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    You seethe with hate as you lay the blame on others. Irony. Get someone to explain it to you.

  60. @Mr. Anon

    It’s like when there’s a bad storm and someone blames it on global warming if it’s a summer storm and proof of global cooling if it is a winter storm.
     
    Actually, they blame it on global warming in either event.

    Actually, they blame it on global warming in either event.

    Depends on which they you are talking about. Climate scientists talk about increased amplitude of the polar jet stream that allows the deep loops to invade the middle latitudes; ergo, climate change allows record cold in some locations even though the global averages for those months are still higher than normal. Climate shaman call this voodoo climate science and claim that the sun is cooling. Ergo, cold weather. (Akshually, the decrease in solar forcing is a few orders of magnitude less than the increase in forcing from CO2, but I digress.)

    Remember: the point of my discussion is to allude to how a bigger trend is causing local effects.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Climate scientists talk about increased amplitude of the polar jet stream that allows the deep loops to invade the middle latitudes; ergo, climate change allows record cold in some locations even though the global averages for those months are still higher than normal.
     
    If you believe the way that NOAA, GISS, and Hadley/CRU process and re-process temperature data. There are good reasons not to.

    Climate shaman call this voodoo climate science and claim that the sun is cooling. Ergo, cold weather.
     
    It has nothing to do with the Sun "cooling". The Sun doesn't cool - not appreciably. It might have something to do with solar magnetic cycles, via the mechanism of cosmic-ray induced cloud formation. Or maybe not - but it's probably worth looking into.

    Remember that almost the entire community of paleontologists were wrong about catastropic extinction events. And they were the guys who were supposed to be the experts on the subject
  61. @Dtbb
    Where can the video be seen?

    The shooter’s livestream video was sent to me via Facebook Messenger. It’s still there but apparently it’s been yanked from a lot of sites.

    It’s not spectacularly gory or gruesome.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Do not share it. I would suggest downloading it out of militant anti-censorship, but once you have it, do not upload it anywhere else. Loud little birds are saying that people posting this video are getting more than put on a list. Numerous video sites that exist to get around YouTube censorship are either taking this video down or not allowing it to be posted.
    Also it is claimed that the YouTube app will force close if you type the triple parentheses, I can't confirm that as I don'thave the app. Expect heavy-handedness, they have their excuse to go Chinese.
  62. @anon1
    America had absolutely no right at all to attack Serbia. Serbia had not attacked America or threatened to do so. It had neither attacked or threatened to attack any American ally. It was just the USA being its typical bully asshole self.

    Recall we originally stated that the rules of engagement only involved Serb forces in Kosovo itself, which was still a violation of Serbian sovereignty. However, after a few weeks when they did not yield, we started bombing bridges and infrastructure in the rest of Serbia. We even took out a passenger train if I recall. We even managed to hit the Chinese embassy in Belgrade.

  63. Anonymous[155] • Disclaimer says:
    @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I’ve hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Me as well. I also came to realize why the empire needed to create a “professional military” who will enthusiastically carry out the slaughter of people who have not aggressed on the U.S. or any Americans and believe this slaughter is not only justified but even virtuous. Now we’re required to give them standing ovations at professional sports games and special privileges.

    • Replies: @anon1
    Professional militaries = wars of choice.
  64. @Reg Cæsar

    Perhaps this is just a coincidence, but the Christchurch terrorist chose the closest Friday (March 15, 2019)
     
    It's also the Ides of March.

    (As any Cæsar could tell you.)

    And last Friday before Purim.

  65. Anonymous[155] • Disclaimer says:
    @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I’ve hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Me as well. I often wonder if those U.S. pilots, who dropped cluster bombs and slaughtered Christians who trying to protect their families and children from KLA terrorists, sometimes reflect on their horrific damnable acts?

  66. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    I was paying attention too at the time and it really upset me that the U.S was bombing Serbia. Justin Raimondo from antiwar.com was all over it with some excellent articles that were very critical of our bombings and the motives behind it.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    Hope Raimondo beats his illness.
  67. @ThreeCranes
    The first part of the manifesto expresses a concern over immigration and the impending destruction of European people's homelands.

    Globalists for Open Borders tell a man his (white) life doesn’t matter and then they are outraged when he rises up in indignation and lashes out at the people who are his designated replacements?

    What I am about to say is neither a threat nor a warning; rather, it is a prediction. As Globalists, Liberals and Leftists continue their war on the White Lives Matter movement, these attacks will escalate.

    As he says, "I could no longer ignore the attacks. They were attacks on my people, attacks on my culture, attacks on my faith and attacks on my soul. They would not be ignored."

    It’s a weird coincidence that we have a terrorist lamenting low birth rates the same week Buffalo Wild Wings was pushing vasectomies.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
    A friend of mine went to Buffalo Wild Wings the other day and was bombarded with MSNBC. He asked the waiter if he could switch the TV over to Fox. “That’s against corporate policy,” the waiter said.

    So Fox is verboten. “You’ll watch MSNBC and you’ll like it! Now shut up and eat your wings! Don’t make me cram them down your throat!” My friend won’t be going back.

    The company that owns BWW also owns Arby’s and Sonic.
  68. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    After muslim massacres in the West, victim’s families are expected to call for peace and to not blame all muslims, etc . I don’t think we’ve had retaliatory attacks unless you count the establishment using it as justification for more interventions in muslim lands.

    muslims aren’t so forgiving. There will be retaliatory attacks in the West over Christchurch. The sad thing is liberals will justify this next attack(s) as payback for Christchurch. But they will never link Christchurch to 9-11, San Bernardino, Madrid, London, Bataclan, London again, etc., etc.

    It’s like they never link the Crusades to jihadi aggression. The Crusades are seen alone as aggressive and not in the context of muslim aggression.

    • Replies: @Lot
    “There will be retaliatory attacks in the West over Christchurch.”

    How would one tell the difference? Mass-casualty attacks on Westerners by Muslims is normal.
    , @Trevor H.
    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we'll just spare you the details.

    , @Anonymous

    After muslim massacres in the West, victim’s families are expected to call for peace and to not blame all muslims, etc .
     
    Western intervention in the Middle East since the Zionism invasion kicked into gear in the first part of the 20th Century has been a long series of massacres of Muslims and bombing campaigns.
  69. @Kratoklastes
    This should cost at least one parasite his job - namely, Peter Dutton, the racist authoritarian fuckwit who fancies himself as Reichsleiter of the Australian Sicherheitsdienst.

    Dutton's recent schtick has been all about justifying, on the basis of the need to 'identify the bad guys', the massive expansion of domestic surveillance power - including the tech-industry-destroying forced-crippling of security.

    And yet all the King's Horses, and all the King's Men, and all the billions upon billions of taxpayer dollars spent on the "national security" bondoggle... couldn't identify Tarrant before he acted.

    I've asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.

    Getting hold of the weapons he used (and the ammo) is not a trivial task in NZ - and would also bring you onto the radar of Five Eyes.

    Then again, I am a skeptic about Breivik, too, because I know how hard it is to carry weapons and ammo sufficient to do what he supposedly did. Ditto Martin Bryant. Those two guys pulled off stats that the best operators could not achieve in a training drill.

    I'm perfectly aware of Hanlon's Razor: given that it's staffed by third decile morons, there's a significant likelihood that the Oz/NZ "national security" alphabet soup simply dropped the ball.

    But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place - if he wasn't on Five Eyes radar, then they should de-fund the whole thing because it's worse than useless.

    “But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place“

    Young Australians, in general, are all over the place.

    It is part of white Australian culture to wander around. High wages and generous leave policy helps.

  70. @istevefan
    After muslim massacres in the West, victim's families are expected to call for peace and to not blame all muslims, etc . I don't think we've had retaliatory attacks unless you count the establishment using it as justification for more interventions in muslim lands.

    muslims aren't so forgiving. There will be retaliatory attacks in the West over Christchurch. The sad thing is liberals will justify this next attack(s) as payback for Christchurch. But they will never link Christchurch to 9-11, San Bernardino, Madrid, London, Bataclan, London again, etc., etc.

    It's like they never link the Crusades to jihadi aggression. The Crusades are seen alone as aggressive and not in the context of muslim aggression.

    “There will be retaliatory attacks in the West over Christchurch.”

    How would one tell the difference? Mass-casualty attacks on Westerners by Muslims is normal.

  71. @Svigor

    Never seen anything like that.
     
    Correction: never seen anything remotely in the same solar system as that.

    Serious question: is that a first? Has there ever been footage of a mass shooter like that?

    Some time ago Liveleak had a video of Muslim terrorists shooting up worshippers in a mosque. Some brave soul inside the mosque held up his cell phone and kept it on the attackers the entire time. That was pretty intense.

  72. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    I agree. What happened at the Bataclan was certainly about 100 times worse than the mosque shooting in New Zealand. Witnesses said they were torturing people at the Bataclan before they killed them.

  73. @Kylie
    The shooter's livestream video was sent to me via Facebook Messenger. It's still there but apparently it's been yanked from a lot of sites.

    It's not spectacularly gory or gruesome.

    Do not share it. I would suggest downloading it out of militant anti-censorship, but once you have it, do not upload it anywhere else. Loud little birds are saying that people posting this video are getting more than put on a list. Numerous video sites that exist to get around YouTube censorship are either taking this video down or not allowing it to be posted.
    Also it is claimed that the YouTube app will force close if you type the triple parentheses, I can’t confirm that as I don’thave the app. Expect heavy-handedness, they have their excuse to go Chinese.

    • Replies: @Kylie
    Good advice. Thank you.

    I'll pass it on to my friend who sent it to me. She didn't post it publicly, she sent it to friends privately via Facebook Messenger. But I doubt that distinction means anything to TPTB.
  74. @anon1
    The bully USA had NO RIGHT to attack Serbia in 1999. Shame on the USA.

    As for Muslim "gratitude" just two years later the twin towers were destroyed.

    It’s worse than that. 9-11 was Saudis. We bombed Serbs for Albanians. Yet Albanians plotted to kill US soldiers at Ft. Dix. Some gratitude.

  75. @Kratoklastes
    This should cost at least one parasite his job - namely, Peter Dutton, the racist authoritarian fuckwit who fancies himself as Reichsleiter of the Australian Sicherheitsdienst.

    Dutton's recent schtick has been all about justifying, on the basis of the need to 'identify the bad guys', the massive expansion of domestic surveillance power - including the tech-industry-destroying forced-crippling of security.

    And yet all the King's Horses, and all the King's Men, and all the billions upon billions of taxpayer dollars spent on the "national security" bondoggle... couldn't identify Tarrant before he acted.

    I've asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.

    Getting hold of the weapons he used (and the ammo) is not a trivial task in NZ - and would also bring you onto the radar of Five Eyes.

    Then again, I am a skeptic about Breivik, too, because I know how hard it is to carry weapons and ammo sufficient to do what he supposedly did. Ditto Martin Bryant. Those two guys pulled off stats that the best operators could not achieve in a training drill.

    I'm perfectly aware of Hanlon's Razor: given that it's staffed by third decile morons, there's a significant likelihood that the Oz/NZ "national security" alphabet soup simply dropped the ball.

    But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place - if he wasn't on Five Eyes radar, then they should de-fund the whole thing because it's worse than useless.

    I heard the NZ security guys were being advised by Scott Israel.

  76. @Dtbb
    Where can the video be seen?

    It’s on Liveleak, or was when I viewed it there yesterday.

    • Replies: @jim jones
    Not anymore, you now get 14 years in prison for sharing it:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-03-16/nz-threatens-10-years-prison-possessing-mosque-shooting-video-web-hosts-warned
  77. The good news is this puts PAID to the idea that western nations can offer asylum to Afro-Muslim migrants. That they can be shot to death in New Zealand as easily as they can be blown to bits in South Waziristan or an Iraqi mosque makes a mockery of that ‘idea’.

    The bad news is that, as effective as this incident was, it still did not match the toll that Omar Marteen achieved in an Orlando gay nightclub and. as we have only been told, over 24,950 Muslims still reside in New Zealand as immigrants. Will ANY now leave due to fears about their safety?

    • Replies: @Hail

    over 24,950 Muslims still reside in New Zealand as immigrants
     
    The number of Muslims in New Zealand may be as high as 80,000 [1.6%] as of today, and rising steadily.

    "Why, and How, did 80,000 Muslims wind up in distant New Zealand?" one may ask, and millions probably are asking that today. As best I can tell, it is momentum from chain migration after various Muslim nationalities established beachheads during the lax refugee-intake-policy years of the 1990s. The NZ left-wing government has also recently loosened asylum laws again, I hear. ("Immigration Policy Has Consequences.")

    New Zealand looks likely to hit 2.0% Muslim by either the very early 2020s (in a high-growth scenario) or by the late 2020s (in a low-growth scenario). Under high-growth, NZ hits 5% Muslim perhaps as soon as the early 2030s. Reminder: It is already 2019, and the 2030 is around the corner...

    (See How Many Muslims are there in New Zealand?, comment-70 in another thread and a follow-up post [comment-72] in that thread.) (Comment 104 above in this thread also deals with the racial-religious situation in NZ as of the late 2010s.)

  78. @Reg Cæsar

    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.
     
    Bill Clinton was a major league lots-of-things, but only a minor league Roosevelt or Truman.

    Truman did what he did within memory of Hitler and in the growing shadow of Stalin. Clinton did what he did without any global militarized totalitarian threat, for the worst reason, because he could.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Truman did what he did within memory of Hitler and in the growing shadow of Stalin. Clinton did what he did without any global militarized totalitarian threat, for the worst reason, because he could.
     
    Didn't he do it to stop the next Hitler and prevent a Holocaust of Balkan Muslims.
  79. @Jay Fink
    I was paying attention too at the time and it really upset me that the U.S was bombing Serbia. Justin Raimondo from antiwar.com was all over it with some excellent articles that were very critical of our bombings and the motives behind it.

    Hope Raimondo beats his illness.

  80. @Kratoklastes
    This should cost at least one parasite his job - namely, Peter Dutton, the racist authoritarian fuckwit who fancies himself as Reichsleiter of the Australian Sicherheitsdienst.

    Dutton's recent schtick has been all about justifying, on the basis of the need to 'identify the bad guys', the massive expansion of domestic surveillance power - including the tech-industry-destroying forced-crippling of security.

    And yet all the King's Horses, and all the King's Men, and all the billions upon billions of taxpayer dollars spent on the "national security" bondoggle... couldn't identify Tarrant before he acted.

    I've asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.

    Getting hold of the weapons he used (and the ammo) is not a trivial task in NZ - and would also bring you onto the radar of Five Eyes.

    Then again, I am a skeptic about Breivik, too, because I know how hard it is to carry weapons and ammo sufficient to do what he supposedly did. Ditto Martin Bryant. Those two guys pulled off stats that the best operators could not achieve in a training drill.

    I'm perfectly aware of Hanlon's Razor: given that it's staffed by third decile morons, there's a significant likelihood that the Oz/NZ "national security" alphabet soup simply dropped the ball.

    But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place - if he wasn't on Five Eyes radar, then they should de-fund the whole thing because it's worse than useless.

    I’ve asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.

    Young Australians are known for wanderlust. There was even a song about it:

    Down Under

  81. The bombing of Belgrade was completely absurd and I was dead against it. Why on earth did we do it?
    1. Because Nice White Ladies saw that famous Fake News picture where they turned people waiting outside a fence for supplies into Albanian “prisoners” in a “concentration camp”?
    2. Because Madeline Albright wanted a Muslim ethnostate to camouflage ethnostate Israel after she discovered her Jewish heritage?
    3. Because the Albanian mafia had something on Bill Clinton? (I’ve met Serbs who say yes, that’s it)
    I don’t know if NZ was an “anniversary massacre”, but that pointless war had lingering bad effects. Russia quoted our words back to us almost verbatim when it came to S. Ossetia & Abkhazia. Heck, at least those places are mostly pro-Russia. Kosovars ended up being the largest group of imported fighters for ISIS.
    They’re also involved in organ harvesting from Serb and non-Albanian prisoners. I bet some rich western transsexuals are getting genitalia on the Dark Web that way.
    To paraphrase Richard Pryor, “I didn’t say it! Carla Del Ponte said it!”

    • Replies: @Clifford Brown
    After the Fall of the Soviet Union, the American Empire sought to destroy all European nationalism and ethnic strife in order to create the borderless European Superstate. Northern Ireland and Yugoslavia had to be resolved in the late 1990's so that the European Union could implement open borders and suppress all ethnonationalism on the Continent.

    The CIA and NATO also benefitted from their narcotics and terrorist network ties with the Albanians.
    , @Hail

    Madeline Albright...after she discovered her Jewish heritage
     
    Is this plausible? I mean, do we have any reason to believe her at her word that she 'discovered' her Jewish heritage late in life?

    In a thread a few weeks ago, I asked the same about John Kerry (Comment-224 and Comment-241) who likewise claimed ignorance of his 1/2-Jewish origin.
    , @Bragadocious
    Don't leave out the wickedness of the British. In analyzing dumb U.S. foreign policy moves, there's always a British connection.

    U.S. policy in the early days of the Yugoslav conflict was actually sound. We saw that massacres were occurring (and they were, there's proof of it). But, we stayed out and supported arming the Bosniaks.

    The Brits stepped in and said no, arming them would be very very bad. Douglas Hurd, perhaps reliving Britain's gun-grabbing role in Ireland, said dropping arms into Bosnia would "create a level killing field." They blocked weapons from reaching Bosnia and pressured Bosnia into accepting a settlement that would see their county dismembered.

    And whaddaya know? The massacres went on just like the British wanted them to. And these cowardly chumps, who allowed Srebrenica to happen, actually had a chance to arrest Ratko Mladic in 2004. But their soldiers pussied out even though they were armed at the time. Mladic remained free for another 7 years.
  82. @For what it's worth
    I'm not a Serb, and have no tribal identification with them. Mostly what I see here is human scum (the shooter) murdering innocent human beings, just as Satan wanted him to.

    I'm not entirely surprised that someone who identifies with Serbs would imitate Serb terrorism and mass murder Moslems:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

    Filming a massacre in progress also has a Serbian precedent:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre#2005:_Release_of_Scorpions_massacre_video

    Have you been given the full picture of Srebrenica or The Narrative?
    http://tenc.net/sreb/mem.htm

    • Replies: @Hail
    Another highly lucrative hoax (at least the version marketed to us).
    , @For what it's worth
    Just give me the elevator story, and I mean the 30-second version, in which you directly answer this question:

    Did Serb militias shoot to death a large number (1,000+) disarmed Bosnian men and boys who were in their custody and who would, under international law, be designated as prisoners?

    Yes, or No.
    , @For what it's worth
    Back in the 90s/early 2000s, I read a lot of Holocaust revisionism, and I also skimmed some Serbian claims about Srebenica. I remember that much of the Holocaust revisionist literature making clear and distinct claims. The concentration camp victims actually died of typhus, the gas chambers weren't real, etc. Even if the Holocaust revisionist claims were false, or distorted, at least their claims *grappled with the point in question*: did the Germans intentionally commit mass murder against the Jewish people?

    I remember finding the Serbian claims hard to follow. The defenses didn't seem to center on the point at issue: did Serbs massacre unarmed Bosnian Moslems in their custody at Srebenica? Yes or no? If they addressed the point, the Serb defenders would usually focus on the numbers, or imply that the massacre was deserved. Well, you don't get to massacre your enemies, even if they are guilty of massacres themselves.

    You pointed me to a website where the heading specifically talks about "refuting the charge that Serbs committed mass murder at Srebenica." Sounded promising. I read further down, and that article is about documenting Moslem crimes against Serbs. That might provide context for understanding the mass murder at Srebenica, but it does *not* refute the charge of mass murder committed by Serbs. This confirms my low opinion of the Serb counterclaims. I see this sort of irrational, reflexive changing of the subject when talking with Balkan tribalists.

    Here's another example: https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-srebrenica-massacre-was-a-gigantic-political-fraud/5321388 The author says that Srebenica was a "fraud." A Westerner like me reads that and infers that the article will deny that Serbs committed atrocities at Srebenica. Part way through the article, the author writes, "The numbers [of Bosnian Moslems] executed there [by Serbs] were probably in the order of between 500 and 1,000." So he admits that the Serbs murdered (because this would be murder; there was no trial) hundreds of unarmed people in their custody. So really the alleged fraud has to do with numbers. I repeat, the author admits that the Serbs committed a huge massacre at Srebenica, he just disputes the numbers, and lamely tries to the killings as "deaths and executions." If you're on trial for killing eight people, you don't get acquitted if you admit on the stand that you only killed four.

    If the best that pro-Serb apologists can do is say, "We murdered fewer of them, in retaliation for what they did to us," then I can see why this douchebag in New Zealand sought to emulate Serb militants in the Balkans. Kind of like Eric Holder, the motto seems to be, "When they massacre you, you massacre them back."

    There's an Eastern Catholic Jesuit priest, Archimandrite Rober Taft, S.J. (who I think now is deceased; RIP), who said that the further east you go in Europe, the less rational the people are. Meaning, decisions are generally made more reflexively, on the basis of identity/identification, not rational sifting of evidence. My experience with Balkan polemics supports this. These cultures missed out on the sort of social tranformation that the Catholic Church achieved in the West, where it produced the underpinnings for WEIRD (Western, Educated, Industrialized, Rich, Democratic) culture. Social life is still more instinctual, visceral. I suspect that's part of what's going on.

    Now, I realize that I'm being provocative and painting with a broad brush, to say the least, and obviously none of these criticisms apply to all Serbs, just like anti-Islamic criticisms don't apply to all Moslems. I just don't think people in America, which is a WEIRD country, should look to Balkan tribes for models, whether on the Albanian, Bosniak, Serbian, or Croatian sides.* They're in a different world than the one we live in, and a more primitive one. You might end up with someone like this guy trying to go Radovan Karadžić on a mosque.

    *And if you don't think that's a thing, it's part of why I stopped reading Chronicles Magazine and I got turned off to the paleocon movement. There seemed to be a sort of perverse leapfrogging of loyalties, where the Chronicles crowd went off on some Serbophile, Russophile tangent out of their disdain for contemporary America. The neocons had Israel, and that crowd had Serbia, it seemed.

  83. @22pp22
    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: "This sort of thing isn't supposed to happen in New Zealand."

    I remember when the only news out of N.Z. was mass shootings of 6 or 8 people.
    Was there in 1975, jugs were all plastic in the pubs, due to people using them as weapons.
    It’s a nasty place, race hate isn’t far from the surface.

    • Replies: @22pp22
    Really. I live in a small South Island town and am related by marriage to half the population. I hadn't noticed the problems you mention, and I rent out houses to the indigent.

    Are you talking about Aramoana. That happened in 1979. The overall murder rate is low.

    Drunkenness and foul language are the big problems. Up north they have alot of gangs, but I never come into contact with the Mongel Mob.

  84. @Dtbb
    Where can the video be seen?

    Where can the video be seen?

    You can see it at bestgore dot com

    Part and parcel of living in a great, global city is you’ve got to be prepared for these things

    – Sadiq Kahn – London Mayor.

  85. @James Speaks

    Actually, they blame it on global warming in either event.
     
    Depends on which they you are talking about. Climate scientists talk about increased amplitude of the polar jet stream that allows the deep loops to invade the middle latitudes; ergo, climate change allows record cold in some locations even though the global averages for those months are still higher than normal. Climate shaman call this voodoo climate science and claim that the sun is cooling. Ergo, cold weather. (Akshually, the decrease in solar forcing is a few orders of magnitude less than the increase in forcing from CO2, but I digress.)

    Remember: the point of my discussion is to allude to how a bigger trend is causing local effects.

    Climate scientists talk about increased amplitude of the polar jet stream that allows the deep loops to invade the middle latitudes; ergo, climate change allows record cold in some locations even though the global averages for those months are still higher than normal.

    If you believe the way that NOAA, GISS, and Hadley/CRU process and re-process temperature data. There are good reasons not to.

    Climate shaman call this voodoo climate science and claim that the sun is cooling. Ergo, cold weather.

    It has nothing to do with the Sun “cooling”. The Sun doesn’t cool – not appreciably. It might have something to do with solar magnetic cycles, via the mechanism of cosmic-ray induced cloud formation. Or maybe not – but it’s probably worth looking into.

    Remember that almost the entire community of paleontologists were wrong about catastropic extinction events. And they were the guys who were supposed to be the experts on the subject

  86. @Kratoklastes
    This should cost at least one parasite his job - namely, Peter Dutton, the racist authoritarian fuckwit who fancies himself as Reichsleiter of the Australian Sicherheitsdienst.

    Dutton's recent schtick has been all about justifying, on the basis of the need to 'identify the bad guys', the massive expansion of domestic surveillance power - including the tech-industry-destroying forced-crippling of security.

    And yet all the King's Horses, and all the King's Men, and all the billions upon billions of taxpayer dollars spent on the "national security" bondoggle... couldn't identify Tarrant before he acted.

    I've asked around, and this Tarrant dude traveled far too widely, and to far too many suspect places, for him to escape the lidded gaze of the security apparatus.

    Getting hold of the weapons he used (and the ammo) is not a trivial task in NZ - and would also bring you onto the radar of Five Eyes.

    Then again, I am a skeptic about Breivik, too, because I know how hard it is to carry weapons and ammo sufficient to do what he supposedly did. Ditto Martin Bryant. Those two guys pulled off stats that the best operators could not achieve in a training drill.

    I'm perfectly aware of Hanlon's Razor: given that it's staffed by third decile morons, there's a significant likelihood that the Oz/NZ "national security" alphabet soup simply dropped the ball.

    But Tarrant was a had been all over the fucking place - if he wasn't on Five Eyes radar, then they should de-fund the whole thing because it's worse than useless.

    Peter Dutton has also been deporting paroled murderers back to New Zealan.
    You wouldn’t be cranky about that, by some chance?

    • Replies: @Momus
    New Zealand also has mechanisms for deporting Pacific Island coconut undesirable gang bangers back to Samoa and Tonga; and they do.

    NZ is not an Island Paradise: It is a tough place full of hard men.
    , @Kratoklastes

    Peter Dutton has also been deporting paroled murderers back to New Zealan.

    You wouldn’t be cranky about that, by some chance?
     
    Nope, not even slightly.

    Well, maybe slightly cranky, but for a different reason - namely that being imprisoned for something is supposed to expunge your debt to society and that moving to a Yank "felon for life" system has extremely adverse social consequences baked in, because it is a very large disincentive to personal reform. But that's a different issue.

    I'm far more cranky that whether or not you get deported seems to be based on preparedness to pay a bribe, and/or belief in a set of Bronze Age fairy-tales - viz.,
    • a guy who served a 10-year sentence for heading up a drug cartel was out of immigration detention within 8 weeks (normal appeal time: 2 years) and had his visa restored and was allowed to remain in Australia;
    • a guy who stabbed his wife a bunch of times, served 15 years, and didn't get deported because Jesus (and LNP stacking of the Administrative Appeals Tribunal).


    If there's anything to be cranky about, it's that a large number of people convicted of drug related crimes, are not being deported.

    It's almost as if Dutton's incompetence as a detective in the Qld Drugs Squad was no accident.

    For those playing at home: the Queensland Police Force is the most corrupt in the nation, and the Drugs Squad was the most corrupt squad on the Qld Force; Dutton was a detective in the Drugs Squad, and never identified a single corrupt colleague.

    Oh - one other thing I am constantly cranky about, would be the stupendously retarded notion that politicians and bureaucrats have any place making assessments of the fitness-of-character of other individuals. Being a politician or bureaucrat is prima facie evidence of megalomania and sociopathy: these are not characteristics that imbue the holder with insight into the nuances of the human condition.
  87. @Clifford Brown
    Personally, I think that New Zealand is overpopulated as it is, but that is just me. I think they need some more national parks in fact.

    Still, up to the people of New Zealand.

    I think the population is fine as it is. I don’t want it to grow any more. On the drive from Invercargill to Christchurch, we don’t pass through a large settlement. I like it that way.

    Half of the population of four and a half million lives in or around Auckland. I almost never go there. My wife and I will be spending our anniversary in Melbourne. It’s cheaper to get here.

    • Replies: @Clifford Brown
    Americans, Canadians and Australians advise you to fight for your low population density lifestyle.

    Low population density leads to EASY LIVING which is GOOD LIVING. Once the real estate industry and the affiliated finance industry gets involved, your politics will be dominated by the perpetual growth advocates.
    , @Cowboy shaw
    I have a horrible feeling NZers are going to lose control of the population. You could fit a lot of people in the place, but as you say it's one of the few optimally populated places left. I expect there will be 50 million there one day.
  88. Hail says: • Website
    @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    I had a similar reaction to the Balkan interventions as you did, istevefan, but mine was delayed until the mid 2000s or so, when I came to reappraise the Balkan/Kosovo situation after the Iraq War. By this time, online fora of various kinds were popping up more and more, and people on them were willing to “go there,” whereas no one had been in the curated version of reality from the pre-Internet era.

    What is the lesson of Kosovo? It is this: The same liars would, did, and would again, side with Muslim thugs against European-Christians, whom they would bomb (U.S. bombs killed 1,200 Serb civilians), carve a Muslim dependency out of a Christian state, handing land, power, and prestige to illegal migrants against natives (from what I understand, most ‘Kosovars,’ or Kosovo-resident Albanians, were of mid-20th-century-or-later migrant origin to the area). Everything about this episode was shameful.

    • Agree: Joseph Doaks
    • Replies: @Hail
    The reaction today (2019) to a 'Kosovo' would, I('d like to) think, be much more negative.

    A big reason so few strayed off the reservation was it was still the analog era. Newspaper and print-magazine reading was still the main way people get info, along with some radio and of course the evening news, now a quaint notion. There was no Internet to speak of for a large majority, and not much of one for those few on it. Nothing like it became by the 2010s. Few even had cell phones in the late 1990s.

    Given these few info-chokepoints, they curated the narrative pretty effectively. Most people believed the line about "stopping genocide in the Balkans" and "Europe's last dictator."

    They repeated their con-job in 2002-2003 for Iraq, a giant fraud which was especially formative, I think, for those born in the late 1970s thru late 1980s, i.e., people now in their 30s who roughly Teenage-to-EarlyMid20s when Iraq happened.

    Perhaps Trump (before his metamorphosis into Blormpf-kushner) was already elected in 2003, at least his foreign policy plank, in the sense that anti-neocon-interventionism had become a quiet-majority opinion among the younger cohorts, hi-info voters, and the politically engaged (if not among the "Get a Brain, Morans" crowd).

    In 2007, Ron Paul came out swinging against "policing the world" and unexpectedly had success rallying a sizable, loyal support base, repeating the performance in 2011-2012. In 2015, Trump borrowed Ron Paul's foreign policy rhetoric, helping propel him forward. It was immigration, but not solely immigration. Trump was really selling a whole package.

    , @YetAnotherAnon
    The US and UK bombed Serbia to make them surrender Kosovo, a part of Serbia for six hundred years, but get their pants in a twist about the Crimea, which had been a part of Ukraine for what - 20-odd years? - and before that had been part of Russia for hundreds of years.
    , @Anonymous

    By this time, online fora of various kinds were popping up more and more, and people on them were willing to “go there,”
     
    What was the "there" during that period?
  89. Hail says: • Website
    @Hail
    I had a similar reaction to the Balkan interventions as you did, istevefan, but mine was delayed until the mid 2000s or so, when I came to reappraise the Balkan/Kosovo situation after the Iraq War. By this time, online fora of various kinds were popping up more and more, and people on them were willing to "go there," whereas no one had been in the curated version of reality from the pre-Internet era.

    What is the lesson of Kosovo? It is this: The same liars would, did, and would again, side with Muslim thugs against European-Christians, whom they would bomb (U.S. bombs killed 1,200 Serb civilians), carve a Muslim dependency out of a Christian state, handing land, power, and prestige to illegal migrants against natives (from what I understand, most 'Kosovars,' or Kosovo-resident Albanians, were of mid-20th-century-or-later migrant origin to the area). Everything about this episode was shameful.

    The reaction today (2019) to a ‘Kosovo’ would, I(‘d like to) think, be much more negative.

    A big reason so few strayed off the reservation was it was still the analog era. Newspaper and print-magazine reading was still the main way people get info, along with some radio and of course the evening news, now a quaint notion. There was no Internet to speak of for a large majority, and not much of one for those few on it. Nothing like it became by the 2010s. Few even had cell phones in the late 1990s.

    Given these few info-chokepoints, they curated the narrative pretty effectively. Most people believed the line about “stopping genocide in the Balkans” and “Europe’s last dictator.”

    They repeated their con-job in 2002-2003 for Iraq, a giant fraud which was especially formative, I think, for those born in the late 1970s thru late 1980s, i.e., people now in their 30s who roughly Teenage-to-EarlyMid20s when Iraq happened.

    Perhaps Trump (before his metamorphosis into Blormpf-kushner) was already elected in 2003, at least his foreign policy plank, in the sense that anti-neocon-interventionism had become a quiet-majority opinion among the younger cohorts, hi-info voters, and the politically engaged (if not among the “Get a Brain, Morans” crowd).

    In 2007, Ron Paul came out swinging against “policing the world” and unexpectedly had success rallying a sizable, loyal support base, repeating the performance in 2011-2012. In 2015, Trump borrowed Ron Paul’s foreign policy rhetoric, helping propel him forward. It was immigration, but not solely immigration. Trump was really selling a whole package.

    • Replies: @Gordo

    Trump was really selling a whole package.
     
    Sadly a package he had no intention of delivering.
    , @Anonymous

    In 2007, Ron Paul came out swinging against “policing the world” and unexpectedly had success rallying a sizable, loyal support base, repeating the performance in 2011-2012. In 2015, Trump borrowed Ron Paul’s foreign policy rhetoric, helping propel him forward. It was immigration, but not solely immigration. Trump was really selling a whole package.
     
    If that package has so much potential, why don't more people sell it?
  90. @Puremania
    The bombing of Belgrade was completely absurd and I was dead against it. Why on earth did we do it?
    1. Because Nice White Ladies saw that famous Fake News picture where they turned people waiting outside a fence for supplies into Albanian “prisoners” in a “concentration camp”?
    2. Because Madeline Albright wanted a Muslim ethnostate to camouflage ethnostate Israel after she discovered her Jewish heritage?
    3. Because the Albanian mafia had something on Bill Clinton? (I’ve met Serbs who say yes, that’s it)
    I don’t know if NZ was an “anniversary massacre”, but that pointless war had lingering bad effects. Russia quoted our words back to us almost verbatim when it came to S. Ossetia & Abkhazia. Heck, at least those places are mostly pro-Russia. Kosovars ended up being the largest group of imported fighters for ISIS.
    They’re also involved in organ harvesting from Serb and non-Albanian prisoners. I bet some rich western transsexuals are getting genitalia on the Dark Web that way.
    To paraphrase Richard Pryor, “I didn’t say it! Carla Del Ponte said it!”

    After the Fall of the Soviet Union, the American Empire sought to destroy all European nationalism and ethnic strife in order to create the borderless European Superstate. Northern Ireland and Yugoslavia had to be resolved in the late 1990’s so that the European Union could implement open borders and suppress all ethnonationalism on the Continent.

    The CIA and NATO also benefitted from their narcotics and terrorist network ties with the Albanians.

    • Replies: @Hail

    sought to destroy all European nationalism
     
    Pour encourager les autres.

    I'm not sure how much Albright and the gang was anti-Serb specifically. They were definitely anti-European-nationalist generally, and used the Serbs as a "whipping boy." They would've liked, perhaps, to be as charitable as possible to them, to do it without killing off 1,200 of them and creating a smelly little Islamic dependency ("The Republic of Kosovo"), but omelettes and cracked eggs, you know.
    , @Anonymous

    the American Empire sought to destroy all European nationalism and ethnic strife in order to create the borderless European Superstate.
     
    Is there any documentation of plans of this nature?
  91. @anon
    I remember when the only news out of N.Z. was mass shootings of 6 or 8 people.
    Was there in 1975, jugs were all plastic in the pubs, due to people using them as weapons.
    It's a nasty place, race hate isn't far from the surface.

    Really. I live in a small South Island town and am related by marriage to half the population. I hadn’t noticed the problems you mention, and I rent out houses to the indigent.

    Are you talking about Aramoana. That happened in 1979. The overall murder rate is low.

    Drunkenness and foul language are the big problems. Up north they have alot of gangs, but I never come into contact with the Mongel Mob.

    • Replies: @anon
    Read up on news from the 60s and 70s.
    Mass pub shootings involving shotgunswere common.
    Indigent means poor. Is that what you meant?
    A friend worked at an Invercargill meatworks in the early 60s.
    He remembered fights between Tongans using chains outside the barracks every night.
    You might also check New Zealand's rate of Rapes and Burglaries.
    It was more recently the highest per capita in the First World.
    , @captflee
    Can't say that I was ever much concerned with crime, other than a very few spots in Auckland. One must keep some perspective; I had, after all, been living in New Orleans. That said, the nature and extent of the alcohol abuse were unexpected.

    Having never managed in my nearly 40 years of seafaring to return to NZ following the five weeks I spent tramping about there, mainly on the South Island, way back in '81, I have to confess to being shocked at your transition. Certainly not the country I remember, where I am convinced that I laid eyes upon less than a handful of non-Pakeha/Maori faces. How the decades have changed us all...

    Somewhere down south I dropped my wallet, and upon my return to the USA was utterly unsurprised to find my wallet had been mailed to me intact, NZ bills exchanged for US ones. Would this be as likely to happen today?

    Pan Am thoughtfully neglected to load my backpack, so I got to spend a week in Auckland on their dime, while my pack made first westward, then eastward circumnavigations, and I was there treated to the Springbok rugby kerfuffle. Having nought to do but check in occasionally with Pan Am, I had an abundance of time to indulge my avocation of flaneur. While I can claim but few natural talents, a keen nose for finding trouble is one, so I soon enough was amongst the melee, involuntarily, and in the company of some epically Pythonesque lefties. Now, I have known some American lefties, but let me say that your lot put them to shame then, and I suspect, now. It's not really surprising that our countries have ended up on similar paths, though your politicians are certainly having to work way harder, lacking a porous land border with the third world.

    Earlier today I stumbled across a photo I shot from Mackinnon Pass, and could not help but remember what a treasure is your South Island. Now trouble has come to Paradise. You have my deepest sympathy.
  92. @22pp22
    I think the population is fine as it is. I don't want it to grow any more. On the drive from Invercargill to Christchurch, we don't pass through a large settlement. I like it that way.

    Half of the population of four and a half million lives in or around Auckland. I almost never go there. My wife and I will be spending our anniversary in Melbourne. It's cheaper to get here.

    Americans, Canadians and Australians advise you to fight for your low population density lifestyle.

    Low population density leads to EASY LIVING which is GOOD LIVING. Once the real estate industry and the affiliated finance industry gets involved, your politics will be dominated by the perpetual growth advocates.

    • Agree: Trevor H.
  93. Hail says: • Website
    @Clifford Brown
    After the Fall of the Soviet Union, the American Empire sought to destroy all European nationalism and ethnic strife in order to create the borderless European Superstate. Northern Ireland and Yugoslavia had to be resolved in the late 1990's so that the European Union could implement open borders and suppress all ethnonationalism on the Continent.

    The CIA and NATO also benefitted from their narcotics and terrorist network ties with the Albanians.

    sought to destroy all European nationalism

    Pour encourager les autres.

    I’m not sure how much Albright and the gang was anti-Serb specifically. They were definitely anti-European-nationalist generally, and used the Serbs as a “whipping boy.” They would’ve liked, perhaps, to be as charitable as possible to them, to do it without killing off 1,200 of them and creating a smelly little Islamic dependency (“The Republic of Kosovo”), but omelettes and cracked eggs, you know.

  94. Hail says: • Website
    @Puremania
    The bombing of Belgrade was completely absurd and I was dead against it. Why on earth did we do it?
    1. Because Nice White Ladies saw that famous Fake News picture where they turned people waiting outside a fence for supplies into Albanian “prisoners” in a “concentration camp”?
    2. Because Madeline Albright wanted a Muslim ethnostate to camouflage ethnostate Israel after she discovered her Jewish heritage?
    3. Because the Albanian mafia had something on Bill Clinton? (I’ve met Serbs who say yes, that’s it)
    I don’t know if NZ was an “anniversary massacre”, but that pointless war had lingering bad effects. Russia quoted our words back to us almost verbatim when it came to S. Ossetia & Abkhazia. Heck, at least those places are mostly pro-Russia. Kosovars ended up being the largest group of imported fighters for ISIS.
    They’re also involved in organ harvesting from Serb and non-Albanian prisoners. I bet some rich western transsexuals are getting genitalia on the Dark Web that way.
    To paraphrase Richard Pryor, “I didn’t say it! Carla Del Ponte said it!”

    Madeline Albright…after she discovered her Jewish heritage

    Is this plausible? I mean, do we have any reason to believe her at her word that she ‘discovered’ her Jewish heritage late in life?

    In a thread a few weeks ago, I asked the same about John Kerry (Comment-224 and Comment-241) who likewise claimed ignorance of his 1/2-Jewish origin.

    • Replies: @Trevor H.

    Is this plausible?
     
    Only if she never ever looked in the mirror.
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    Perhaps bombing Serbia allowed Clinton to distract from his extramarital scandals.

    http://www.pravdareport.com/history/127187-nato_serbia_lewinsky/
  95. Anonymous[208] • Disclaimer says:

    Tarrant is a classic Aussie sh*tposter. Even an Australian news channel were conned into repeating the Navy Seal copypasta (go to 2.5min in, if you are pressed for time).

    The most interesting thing I have noticed is that the 24 hour state news broadcasting channel (ABC 24 hour news) immediately switched out their usual non-white news anchor(s) and went with white newscasters. At first there were two white women (well, maybe one was (((white))) ) lecturing us on how horrible it all was, and what the correct attitude was. And then later they got some guy who I had literally never seen on TV before, as if some producer went scurrying down the halls and found the first white male middle manager or techie he could find to thrust him in front of the camera, maybe after a quick meeting “The natives are restless! Don’t want to dump the frog in the hot water, do we?”

    To be honest over the last year or so I had noticed the increased presence of non-whites as news anchors on the ABC. It seemed clear that there was some directive that our kind were to be phased out. I found it quite alienating, especially considering we are still majority white, but not in the two major cities AFAICT. So this sudden move was quite jarring, like watching something from They Live or The Puppet Masters or Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

  96. @simple_pseudonymic_handle

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War, but it wouldn’t be too surprising if some people were still sore about it.

     

    In Serbia they are still sore about the 1389 Kosovo War.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kosovo

    All Europeans should be sore about the Ottoman presence in Europe all those centuries. A highly negative net effect. Certainly the Balkans’ historical problems can be blamed on Ottomans / Islam in no small part.

  97. @Ron Mexico
    Have you been given the full picture of Srebrenica or The Narrative?
    http://tenc.net/sreb/mem.htm

    Another highly lucrative hoax (at least the version marketed to us).

  98. anonymous[214] • Disclaimer says:

    Mass shootings at places of worship sounds a lot like Jewish uber-troll Joshua Ryne Goldberg’s MO. Does he have internet access in the nuthouse?

  99. Hail says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    The wiki pages on New Zealand and the prime minister nanny are depressing. Whites 70% of pop and dropping fast. Huge spike of immigration recently.

    Kiwis are ruled by another socialist witch just like all over Europe. She has a boyfriend and a new baby out of wedlock. WINNING.

    NZ is much further down the road to de-christianization than we are. Stats are ugly.

    Whites 70% of pop and dropping fast

    Actually they are at 60% White as of 2019, with births as of the early 2010s at 50% White. The 60%-White figure is for full-Whites; higher figures include anyone reporting partial White ancestry. ‘White,’ in our terms, means full-White, which in New Zealand is now at 60%.

    There are certain striking parallels with the much-bigger USA’s racial situation, and White share is one of them; see a comment at Anatoly Karlin’s thread on the Christchurch attack (currently #72):

    – 2,900,000 Full-Whites of ethnic-Christian origin (of which, NW-European ancestry, esp. British Isles, constitutes a very comfortable majority) [60%]

    – 10,000 Jews? [0.2%] (7,000 specifically answered ‘Jewish’ to religion question on Census 2013)

    – 72,500 Muslims [1.5%] (see above)

    – 675,000 Maori, including mixed Maori-White [14%] (perhaps a third of the aggregate ancestry here is actually European; there are presumably still ~pure Maori but they are likely quite a small share of the overall pop., far below this 14% figure)

    [MORE]

    – 350,000 Pacific Islander, including mixed White-Pacific [7%] (this population has a substantially lower degree of European admixture than the ‘Maori’ population)

    – 250,000 Chinese [5%]

    – 150,000? non-Chinese, East(ern) Asian [3%] (i.e., those from all points east of Bangladesh in Asia, excluding China)

    – 150,000? Hindus and Sikhs [3%]

    – <25,000 Blacks [0.5%] — Presumably entirely of refugee origin. NZ passed a refugee quota law in 1987 (somewhat restricted in 1997), which also jump-started Muslim growth.

    – 50,000 Other misc. [1%]

    – 200,000+ Mixed race, n.o.c. [4%] (incl. up to 20,000 White-EastAsian mixed-race individuals; White-Asian mixes, both East and South, were at 1.9% in the under-age-5 cohort in 2013 — full-Whites were at 50.3% and Maori and European+Maori were at 20.8% for the under-age-5 cohort.

    Comments: For NZ births from March 2008 to March 2013, full-Whites were a narrow majority of just above 50.0%, nearly exactly the same as the USA for the same period. Another coincidence is that U.S. Black and NZ Maori figures are so similar is percentage terms.

    The Muslim figure for NZ and the USA may also be just about the same (1.5%). It’s hard to tell how many Muslims are in the USA because that question has been so politicized for years, with Jewish activists tending to police the question and downplay Muslim numbers to make sure they are below Jewish numbers.

    • Replies: @Hail

    NZ is much further down the road to de-christianization
     
    NZ 2013 Census, religion question:

    4,242,048 : Total people counted by Census, March 2013

    1,805,349 : Christian [42.6%]
    -- 1,272,519 : Protestant [30.0%]
    -- 492,105 : Catholic [11.6%]
    -- 40,725 : Mormon [1.0%]

    53,628 : Maori religions (Ratana & Ringatu) [1.3%], or one-in-ten people who claim Maori racial identity

    253,869: 'Immigrant' religions, total [6.0%]
    -- 89,919 : Hindu [2.1%]
    -- 19,191 : Sikh [0.5%]
    -- 58,407 : Buddhist [1.4%]
    -- 46,146 : Islam/Muslim [1.1%] -- See here for discussion on the likely number of Muslims in New Zealand as of 2019 (currently comment-70): Perhaps 75,000.
    -- 6,867 : Judaism [0.2%]
    -- 33,339 : Specific other religion [0.8%]

    1,635,348 : Answering "No Religion" [38.6%]
    520,335 : Object to answering, don't know, religion unidentifiable, response outside scope, and not stated [12.3%]
    , @Anon
    7,000 Jews. Thats not good news. That means that there are 6,999 more Jews than necessary to blame all of the countries problems on !!!!
  100. Anonymous[208] • Disclaimer says:

    http://www.unz.com/plee/how-it-all-began-the-belgrade-embassy-bombing/

    The above article has some interesting bits about the Chinese Embassy bombing. It seems it was intentional and that the CIA had their reasons.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    My theory in 1999 was that the Chinese embassy had bought the remains of the Stealth Fighter shot down by the Serbs, so the US blew up the building where it was housed to keep them from reverse engineering it.

    But that turned out not to be true. The crashed stealth fighter was mostly disassembled by Serb country people souvenir hunters and hauled away on pickups and donkey carts.

  101. @For what it's worth
    I'm not a Serb, and have no tribal identification with them. Mostly what I see here is human scum (the shooter) murdering innocent human beings, just as Satan wanted him to.

    I'm not entirely surprised that someone who identifies with Serbs would imitate Serb terrorism and mass murder Moslems:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

    Filming a massacre in progress also has a Serbian precedent:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre#2005:_Release_of_Scorpions_massacre_video

    “Civil Wars” – an essay by Hans Magnus Enzensberger, in which he predicts the worldwide increase of molecular civil wars.

    In Hans Magnus Enzensberger – Civil Wars – From L. A. to Bosnia – available at amazon.com

  102. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    Well, it was somewhat overshadowed by the invasion of Iraq four years later.

    • Replies: @Wilkey
    Cool.

    Trying to remember what international incidents involving Muslims and the West happened between the Kosovo War (1999) and the Iraq Invasion (2003). Can't think of any.
  103. Hail says: • Website
    @Hail

    Whites 70% of pop and dropping fast
     
    Actually they are at 60% White as of 2019, with births as of the early 2010s at 50% White. The 60%-White figure is for full-Whites; higher figures include anyone reporting partial White ancestry. 'White,' in our terms, means full-White, which in New Zealand is now at 60%.

    There are certain striking parallels with the much-bigger USA's racial situation, and White share is one of them; see a comment at Anatoly Karlin's thread on the Christchurch attack (currently #72):


    – 2,900,000 Full-Whites of ethnic-Christian origin (of which, NW-European ancestry, esp. British Isles, constitutes a very comfortable majority) [60%]

    – 10,000 Jews? [0.2%] (7,000 specifically answered ‘Jewish’ to religion question on Census 2013)

    – 72,500 Muslims [1.5%] (see above)

    – 675,000 Maori, including mixed Maori-White [14%] (perhaps a third of the aggregate ancestry here is actually European; there are presumably still ~pure Maori but they are likely quite a small share of the overall pop., far below this 14% figure)
     


    – 350,000 Pacific Islander, including mixed White-Pacific [7%] (this population has a substantially lower degree of European admixture than the ‘Maori’ population)

    – 250,000 Chinese [5%]

    – 150,000? non-Chinese, East(ern) Asian [3%] (i.e., those from all points east of Bangladesh in Asia, excluding China)

    – 150,000? Hindus and Sikhs [3%]

    – <25,000 Blacks [0.5%] — Presumably entirely of refugee origin. NZ passed a refugee quota law in 1987 (somewhat restricted in 1997), which also jump-started Muslim growth.

    – 50,000 Other misc. [1%]

    – 200,000+ Mixed race, n.o.c. [4%] (incl. up to 20,000 White-EastAsian mixed-race individuals; White-Asian mixes, both East and South, were at 1.9% in the under-age-5 cohort in 2013 — full-Whites were at 50.3% and Maori and European+Maori were at 20.8% for the under-age-5 cohort.
     


    Comments: For NZ births from March 2008 to March 2013, full-Whites were a narrow majority of just above 50.0%, nearly exactly the same as the USA for the same period. Another coincidence is that U.S. Black and NZ Maori figures are so similar is percentage terms.

    The Muslim figure for NZ and the USA may also be just about the same (1.5%). It’s hard to tell how many Muslims are in the USA because that question has been so politicized for years, with Jewish activists tending to police the question and downplay Muslim numbers to make sure they are below Jewish numbers.
     

    NZ is much further down the road to de-christianization

    NZ 2013 Census, religion question:

    4,242,048 : Total people counted by Census, March 2013

    1,805,349 : Christian [42.6%]
    — 1,272,519 : Protestant [30.0%]
    — 492,105 : Catholic [11.6%]
    — 40,725 : Mormon [1.0%]

    53,628 : Maori religions (Ratana & Ringatu) [1.3%], or one-in-ten people who claim Maori racial identity

    253,869: ‘Immigrant’ religions, total [6.0%]
    — 89,919 : Hindu [2.1%]
    — 19,191 : Sikh [0.5%]
    — 58,407 : Buddhist [1.4%]
    — 46,146 : Islam/Muslim [1.1%] — See here for discussion on the likely number of Muslims in New Zealand as of 2019 (currently comment-70): Perhaps 75,000.
    — 6,867 : Judaism [0.2%]
    — 33,339 : Specific other religion [0.8%]

    1,635,348 : Answering “No Religion” [38.6%]
    520,335 : Object to answering, don’t know, religion unidentifiable, response outside scope, and not stated [12.3%]

    • Replies: @istevefan
    Hail,

    I am not trying to minimize the situation in New Zealand, only to point out the absurdity of what has happened to the USA. Your stats on NZ show that Whites have fallen to 60%. But flipping NZ was not a giant task given that it's population was under 5 million. Their population was probably around 3 million during WW2. So a nation that small can be demographically flipped with not much effort.

    The fact that the USA is in the same boat as NZ is what should boggle the mind. Instead of flipping 3 to 4 million Whites into minority status, post 1965 they have flipped a then-nation of 200 million, of which about 175 million were White, into one that when it hits 360 million in a 15 or 20 years will be about 50% White. How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe? In fact at the time only China, India and the USSR had more people than the USA. And probably no nations up to that point in time other than China, India and the USSR ever had more people than 1965 USA.

    Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact.

  104. @gabriel alberton
    Which naturally leads to the question: are there countries/places where this sort of thing is supposed to happen?

    France and Great Britain. It’s strange nothing of the sort has happened there in retaliation.

  105. anon[300] • Disclaimer says:
    @22pp22
    Really. I live in a small South Island town and am related by marriage to half the population. I hadn't noticed the problems you mention, and I rent out houses to the indigent.

    Are you talking about Aramoana. That happened in 1979. The overall murder rate is low.

    Drunkenness and foul language are the big problems. Up north they have alot of gangs, but I never come into contact with the Mongel Mob.

    Read up on news from the 60s and 70s.
    Mass pub shootings involving shotgunswere common.
    Indigent means poor. Is that what you meant?
    A friend worked at an Invercargill meatworks in the early 60s.
    He remembered fights between Tongans using chains outside the barracks every night.
    You might also check New Zealand’s rate of Rapes and Burglaries.
    It was more recently the highest per capita in the First World.

    • Replies: @22pp22
    Things must have changed. I am 54 and the 1960s are a bit before my time. Maybe rape is more common here than in most countries, but if the UK dealt with grooming gangs the way it should, then it would soar up the international rankings. According to Nationmaster, it is just behind the US. Is the US really so rape-prone? I looked up the burglary statistics which showed NZ to be far worse that Costa Rica, which is a joke. I have lived in Costa Rica and I loved the place, but people live behind iron bars and razor wire. You really cannot leave your door unlocked. Here, I don't know anyone who has bars on their windows.

    There are things I hate about New Zealand. The foul-mouthed verbal assaults usually delivered by women are my number one pet hate along the pressure to conform. The fear of being though stuck up leads many Kiwis to act in ways that are unworthy of their education or intelligence. Also the binge drinking is pretty sickening.

    I am sorry you had such a bad experience of the place.
  106. @Lot
    The American bombing of Serbia during the Kosovo war is the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.

    To their credit, Serbs do not bear much of a grudge for it against Americans generally.

    Like the Syrian civil war, the best option was “stay out.”

    But Clinton and Obama instead actively supported the wrong side in those conflicts.

    ” the most shameful episode of American history of the past century.”

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .

    • Replies: @JMcG
    I used up my agree, but boy do I agree.
    , @Anon

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .
     
    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty and killed 8x more Americans. I guess you want to bomb the shit out of Lebanin 8x harder or maybe 20x harder because it was more recent , one of your own criteria. But I don't expect you to live up to your own rules.
  107. This whole thing has a pro-Serb (or, more generally, pro-Balkan Christian) / anti-American air. Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War, but it wouldn’t be too surprising if some people were still sore about it.

    The whole ‘remove kebab’ thing is a meme from years back on /pol/. In his manifesto the killer says he is of ‘Irish, Scottish and English’ ancestry. I haven’t read the whole thing, but it doesn’t read like it’s going to get very angry over Kosovo.

  108. @Anonymous
    http://www.unz.com/plee/how-it-all-began-the-belgrade-embassy-bombing/

    The above article has some interesting bits about the Chinese Embassy bombing. It seems it was intentional and that the CIA had their reasons.

    My theory in 1999 was that the Chinese embassy had bought the remains of the Stealth Fighter shot down by the Serbs, so the US blew up the building where it was housed to keep them from reverse engineering it.

    But that turned out not to be true. The crashed stealth fighter was mostly disassembled by Serb country people souvenir hunters and hauled away on pickups and donkey carts.

    • Replies: @Bill P
    Before that bombing there was a very intense anti-American media campaign in China over the Serbia caampaign. It was so bad I decided it was time to get out, fast (you get a feel for those things in China -- a lot of Westerners have started leaving recently, too). So I got on a plane and flew back to Seattle, and the embassy strike happened the next day. There were scenes of Chinese attacking the US embassy, and I was friends with some of those marine guards who had to go through that. Westerners were getting chased by mobs, etc. It was extremely upsetting to me. It felt like I was still there when I saw it on TV, and I could imagine my poor friends hunkering down in their apartments not daring to show their faces in public. I was also angry at the US for the bombing, because it was so obviously deliberate and so provocative.

    My take on it at the time was that it was simply a big FU to the Chinese for supporting the Serbs so vigorously, along with a "what are you going to do about it?" attitude. Using a stealth bomber sent a pretty clear message: "we can hit you and there's nothing you can do to stop us."

    I still don't think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn't do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.
    , @El Dato
    Cited in

    http://www.unz.com/plee/how-it-all-began-the-belgrade-embassy-bombing/

    we have reasonable-sounding scenario:

    FAIR contacted journalists at both the Observer and Politiken. According to the Observer’s U.S. correspondent, Ed Vulliamy, its foreign editor, Peter Beaumont, and Politiken reporter Jens Holsoe, their sources included the following:

    –A European NATO military officer serving in an operational capacity at the four-star level – a source at the highest possible level within NATO–confirmed three things: (1) That NATO targeted the Chinese embassy deliberately; (2) That the embassy was emitting Yugoslav military radio signals; and (3) That the target was not approved through the normal NATO channels but through a second, “American-only” track.

    –A European NATO staff officer at the two-star level in the Defense Intelligence office confirmed the same story.–

    Two U.S. sources: A very high-ranking former senior American intelligence official connected to the Balkans – “about as high as you can get,” according to one reporter — confirmed that the embassy was deliberately targeted. A mid-ranking current U.S. military official, also connected to the Balkans, confirmed elements of the story and pointedly refused to deny that the embassy had been bombed deliberately.

    –A NATO flight controller based in Naples and a NATO intelligence officer monitoring Yugoslav radio broadcasts from Macedonia each confirmed that NATO’s signals intelligence located Yugoslav military radio signals coming from the Chinese embassy in Belgrade. When they informed their superiors, they were told that the matter would be handled further up in the chain of command. Two weeks later, the embassy was bombed.

    –An official at the U.S. National Imagery and Mapping Agency told the reporters that NATO’s official explanation, which involves a faulty map of Belgrade, is a “damned lie.”
     
  109. Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad? The music/meme/8chan background point towards the alt-right but most of his talking points (including the apparent absence of antisemitism) seem to come straight from the counter-jihad playbook. Perhaps an unholy meld of the two.

    It’s interesting that journalists etc seem more keen to write about the alt-right. There are books by Hawley, Wendling, Nagle etc. But the only book about the counter-jihad I know of is Soldiers of a Different God by Othen, a British writer. It’s difficult to say why there’s this imbalance but I suspect it’s something to do with the establishment types who support the counter-jihad in America. It’s harder to investigate something that has lots of money and good lawyers.

    • Replies: @Grahamsno(G64)

    Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad?
     
    I read his manifesto fully, he's all over the place White nationalism, Robert Spencer/Gates of Vienna type Counter Jihad, Bernie Sanders type Socialism and Environmentalism, he rails against corporations a lot and primarily blames them for the 'invasion' as he puts it. He should be considered Alt-right because his primary obsession is with the declining White demographics. Hilariously he claims the fundamental person responsible for his radicalization is Candace Owens!!

    He claims to have met with Breivik's organization and got blessings from them before the massacre.

    He justifies murder of Children by saying that that's one less adult for your children to kill. Interestingly he says that he picked out Muslims for this massacre because they're universally reviled and that he hoped to garner sympathy for the attack.

    All said the manifesto reveals him to be an sensitive, intelligent man who felt that his cold blooded massacre was not just justified but absolutely necessary. A sensitive, intelligent Monster.
  110. Robert F. Kennedy Jr. does not believe that Sirhan Sirhan fired the shots that killed his father. He read the trial transcript, evaluated what evidence there was, and interviewed him in prison.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Robert KennedyJr was a drug addict from his teen years till 60. Among other things, he almost died from a heroin overdose on a plane enroute to protest an oil field.

    He’s neither an Investigator nor an attorney. Anyone can read a trial transcript. He was drunk and showing off to his drunk buddies by driving very recklessly and a passenger was crippled for life.

    Had he not been a member of a rich family he would have been incarcerated in Massachusetts juvenile reform schools due to his criminal behavior all over Cape Cod.

    Because of bad grades bad behavior, and drug use he was expelled from several high schools.

    He, like every other person in the country who got through 5th grade, could read a trial transcript.

    BFD
    , @Anonymous

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. does not believe that Sirhan Sirhan fired the shots that killed his father. He read the trial transcript, evaluated what evidence there was, and interviewed him in prison.
     
    There are people who do not believe that Arabs crashed planes into the WTC and the Pentagon.
  111. He explains his political evolution:

    “Did you always hold these views? No, when I was young I was a communist, then an anarchist and finally a libertarian before coming to be an eco-fascist.”

    Does that sound like a natural political evolution or an unstable man with violent fantasies shopping around for a radical ideology to fit his thoughts? It does sound like he fixated on the Balkans conflict but it could have been anything else.

    There are quite a lot of Balkans types in Australia. A friend of mine moved to Australia from Russia in the nineties when she was young, she had to have English classes with the Balkan types who were looking to tear each others heads off in the classes.

  112. @Dave Pinsen
    According to his manifesto, it was blowback for a lot of things, including Rotherham. But he says he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

    “he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden”

    I remember seeing a photo of the girl post-attack. Not nice.

  113. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Thatcherite MP Alan Clark was very good on the Balkan intervention.

    http://www.lalkar.org/article/2025/conflict-in-the-balkans-alan-clarks-view

    The assertion that human rights within the boundaries of a sovereign nationare best defended by a sustained bombardment of its own civilian populationis, to put it most kindly, Orwellian. The notion that because a war is ‘just’ (by the aggressor’s definition) it can be prosecuted immediately, and without deference to international opinion is highly dangerous. It is to prevent exactly this that the UN’s Security Council mechanism came into being. Nato was conceived as a defensive alliance, its terms of engagement narrowly drawn; not as a ‘policeman’ surrogate for the UN; never as an apparatus for intervention in a civil war.

    What amazes me about the Yugoslav crisis is the credulity of the Left, and of progressive thinkers, who seem to get a vicarious thrill from seeing B52s taking off from Fairford.

    I address them: How have you swallowed whole the CIA-funded propaganda that demonises the Serbs? Are you not familiar with the duplicity and intimidation of United States foreign policy? That Ambassador Walker, in charge of monitoring forces in Bosnia, was financing the Contras? Have you no recall of that ‘Free World’ crap that embraced Battista, Noriega, Syngman Rhee, Bao Dai, Lee Van Thieu and Sukarno?

    If you read Michael Rose’s Despatch you will see that the Bosnians mortared their own bread queue for a horror shot. If you talked to British soldiers you would learn that the KLA are gangsters indistinguishable (my analogy) from any warlord in Mogadishu.

    In Yugoslavia there is a civil war. British soldiers are not mercenaries for one side or another where there is no threat to our citizens. The safest rule in such circumstances is, stick to humanitarian aid. What do you imagine so far is the cost? How much aid might this have funded?

    • Replies: @anon1
    Clark was also a first rate historian too. His writings on the eastern front of both WW1 & 2 were some of the best material on the subject i have ever read.
  114. @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    It does sound like he was more influenced by the Pamela Gellers of this world.

    • Replies: @James Forrestal

    It does sound like he was more influenced by the Pamela Gellers of this world.
     
    Yeah, that's one of the more suspicious aspects of it. See also @105

    Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad? The music/meme/8chan background point towards the alt-right but most of his talking points (including the apparent absence of "antisemitism") seem to come straight from the counter-jihad playbook.
     
    So -- an Australian is:

    >Angry enough about the non-White/ Muslim invasion to gun down 50 hajis, but

    >Completely ignores the Tribe's role in promoting that invasion. For example:

    https://lukeford.net/blog/?p=82232

    "Isi Leiber is an internationally known Jewish leader and former chairman of the board of directors of the World Jewish Congress and the former leader of the Executive Council of Australian Jewry. He was major proponent of multiculturalism, open borders, and cultural Marxism in Australia. He moved to Israel in 1999 and still advocates multiculturalism for Australia while advocating nationalism and homogeneity in Israel at the same time."

    https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2012/08/13/the-war-on-white-australia-a-case-study-in-the-culture-of-critique-part-1-of-5/

    "The national editor of the Australian Jewish News, Dan Goldberg proudly acknowledges this, noting that: “In addition to their activism on Aboriginal issues, Jews were instrumental in leading the crusade against the White Australia policy..."

    >The memes and music are largely chan culture (though "Remove Kebab" is kinda stale), but he throws in a lot of (((counterjihad)))-type references -- Tours, Vienna, heavy emphasis on Islam vs. Christianity even though not a Christian himself...

    Kinda like Breivik with some added shitposts.
  115. @Hail
    I had a similar reaction to the Balkan interventions as you did, istevefan, but mine was delayed until the mid 2000s or so, when I came to reappraise the Balkan/Kosovo situation after the Iraq War. By this time, online fora of various kinds were popping up more and more, and people on them were willing to "go there," whereas no one had been in the curated version of reality from the pre-Internet era.

    What is the lesson of Kosovo? It is this: The same liars would, did, and would again, side with Muslim thugs against European-Christians, whom they would bomb (U.S. bombs killed 1,200 Serb civilians), carve a Muslim dependency out of a Christian state, handing land, power, and prestige to illegal migrants against natives (from what I understand, most 'Kosovars,' or Kosovo-resident Albanians, were of mid-20th-century-or-later migrant origin to the area). Everything about this episode was shameful.

    The US and UK bombed Serbia to make them surrender Kosovo, a part of Serbia for six hundred years, but get their pants in a twist about the Crimea, which had been a part of Ukraine for what – 20-odd years? – and before that had been part of Russia for hundreds of years.

    • Replies: @El Dato
    If you want consistency, you need to buy ready-made dough.

    (In the times of Bismark, one had at least meaningful Realpolitik, not chaos under the veil of World-Saving Derangement Complex. Well, it ended all in a European Suicide pact caused by Serbian Nationalists but that's another story.)

    , @Cowboy shaw
    It's almost as if someone who doesn't have our best interests at heart has wrested control of our foreign policy in the past couple of decades. I suspect the distance of time will illuminate this quite clearly for future historians.
  116. “Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War, but it wouldn’t be too surprising if some people were still sore about it.”

    It’s not out of the realm of possibility, as many folks in that corner of the world are walking around with chips on their shoulders that date back up to a millenium ago.

    Then again, maybe it was retribution for the assassination of Julius Caesar.

  117. @Steve Sailer
    My theory in 1999 was that the Chinese embassy had bought the remains of the Stealth Fighter shot down by the Serbs, so the US blew up the building where it was housed to keep them from reverse engineering it.

    But that turned out not to be true. The crashed stealth fighter was mostly disassembled by Serb country people souvenir hunters and hauled away on pickups and donkey carts.

    Before that bombing there was a very intense anti-American media campaign in China over the Serbia caampaign. It was so bad I decided it was time to get out, fast (you get a feel for those things in China — a lot of Westerners have started leaving recently, too). So I got on a plane and flew back to Seattle, and the embassy strike happened the next day. There were scenes of Chinese attacking the US embassy, and I was friends with some of those marine guards who had to go through that. Westerners were getting chased by mobs, etc. It was extremely upsetting to me. It felt like I was still there when I saw it on TV, and I could imagine my poor friends hunkering down in their apartments not daring to show their faces in public. I was also angry at the US for the bombing, because it was so obviously deliberate and so provocative.

    My take on it at the time was that it was simply a big FU to the Chinese for supporting the Serbs so vigorously, along with a “what are you going to do about it?” attitude. Using a stealth bomber sent a pretty clear message: “we can hit you and there’s nothing you can do to stop us.”

    I still don’t think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn’t do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
    It was probably Wesley Clark’s idea.

    When Russian troops occupied the Pristina airport at the end of the war, Clark ordered British NATO forces to attack. The Brits refused, citing the probability that such an altercation would spark World War 3.

    Clark was Bill and Hill’s homeboy.
    , @Mr. Anon

    I still don’t think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn’t do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.
     
    Especially after Bill Clinton got all that campaign dough from the Chinese too.
    , @Hunsdon
    I recall that we didn't like it much when the Japanese did it.
  118. Years ago one or two people here (perhaps in Steve’s pre-Unz days) recommended in the comments books on the history and breakup of Yugoslavia from a not-the-usual-narrative point of view.

    IIRC the books were touted as being “fair” but somewhat sympathetic to the Serb side.

    Can anyone name these books?

    (A search of iSteve pulls down too many references.)

    • Replies: @El Dato
    I liked:

    First Do No Harm: Humanitarian Intervention and the Destruction of Yugoslavia

    That war was too confusing for those times. I tried to keep track from what was being said in normie (incl. Der Economist) and commie newspapers and on normie TV but it was all too confusing and dragged on for years with various provocations and atrocities and false flags and Miss Clinton and military medal hounds and faggot Netherlands UN troops looking like hippies in uniforms. In the end I was convinced intervention was required. A mistake.
    , @Lugash
    IIRC correctly 'Unholy Terror' by John R Schindler was pretty good.
  119. @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn’t-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    It’s the 21st, man. It’s like cyberpunk, only with mobile phones and better lighting.

    But this pales with the daily dropping of bombs on women and children. Nobody cares about THAT.

    “The sky above the port was the color of a YouTube channel, saying something about a missing plugin.”

    A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.

    Was that the accordion guy clip?

    • Replies: @El Dato
    > Was that the accordion guy clip?

    Checking on YouTube:

    Anyone else here after the Christichurch shooting where the guy played this song while live-streaming his shooting.
     
    1.9K likes.
    , @James Forrestal

    Was that the accordion guy clip?
     
    Yeah, it was Remove Kebab/ Serbia Strong.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocW3fBqPQkU

    Sounds like Mr. Sailer may not be aware of how big that meme was a few years back, or how important the Serbia thing was in waking a lot of people up. Not necessarily at the time, but in combination with the Iraq invasion.

    Other music on the video:

    british grenadiers march

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGrxHO-B2TY

    Fallschirmjäger Grün ist unser Fallschirm Remix

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLXsFqSvy0M

    Arthur Brown - Fire

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8

    Manuel - Gas Gas Gas

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atuFSv2bLa8


    None of which seems particularly Balkan, to say the least.
  120. @istevefan
    After muslim massacres in the West, victim's families are expected to call for peace and to not blame all muslims, etc . I don't think we've had retaliatory attacks unless you count the establishment using it as justification for more interventions in muslim lands.

    muslims aren't so forgiving. There will be retaliatory attacks in the West over Christchurch. The sad thing is liberals will justify this next attack(s) as payback for Christchurch. But they will never link Christchurch to 9-11, San Bernardino, Madrid, London, Bataclan, London again, etc., etc.

    It's like they never link the Crusades to jihadi aggression. The Crusades are seen alone as aggressive and not in the context of muslim aggression.

    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we’ll just spare you the details.

    • Replies: @Clyde
    French Government Forced To Admit It "Suppressed News Of Gruesome Torture" At Bataclan Massacre
    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-07-15/french-government-forced-admit-it-suppressed-news-gruesome-torture-bataclan-massacre

    NY Post published the same ...also....
    Via UK Daily Mail https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3692359/French-government-suppressed-gruesome-torture-Bataclan-victims-official-inquiry-told-castrated-eyes-gouged-ISIS-killers.html
    , @Mr. Anon

    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we’ll just spare you the details.
     
    Snopes.com is reporting that accounts of torture and mutilations during the Bataclan massacre are untrue.

    So I am more persuaded that it did in fact happen.
  121. @El Dato

    Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn’t-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.
     
    It's the 21st, man. It's like cyberpunk, only with mobile phones and better lighting.

    But this pales with the daily dropping of bombs on women and children. Nobody cares about THAT.

    “The sky above the port was the color of a YouTube channel, saying something about a missing plugin.”


    A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.
     
    Was that the accordion guy clip?

    > Was that the accordion guy clip?

    Checking on YouTube:

    Anyone else here after the Christichurch shooting where the guy played this song while live-streaming his shooting.

    1.9K likes.

  122. @Bill B.
    Years ago one or two people here (perhaps in Steve's pre-Unz days) recommended in the comments books on the history and breakup of Yugoslavia from a not-the-usual-narrative point of view.

    IIRC the books were touted as being "fair" but somewhat sympathetic to the Serb side.

    Can anyone name these books?

    (A search of iSteve pulls down too many references.)

    I liked:

    First Do No Harm: Humanitarian Intervention and the Destruction of Yugoslavia

    That war was too confusing for those times. I tried to keep track from what was being said in normie (incl. Der Economist) and commie newspapers and on normie TV but it was all too confusing and dragged on for years with various provocations and atrocities and false flags and Miss Clinton and military medal hounds and faggot Netherlands UN troops looking like hippies in uniforms. In the end I was convinced intervention was required. A mistake.

    • Replies: @Bill B.
    Thanks. I will read it.

    I had no smart insights at the time. I had trouble working out who the good guys were I remember.

    One thing I did recognize was that Yugoslavia was a viper's nest. Later, idiotically, I half-heartedly supported going into Iraq, but I again wondered who would want to jump into that such messy situation.

    I have, at least for the last couple of decades, had trouble understanding where the confidence of our leaders comes from strolling, so to speak, into extraordinarily tense and ugly bars in very dark and strange parts of town expecting to be welcomed and praised. And thinking they knew what was going on.

  123. @YetAnotherAnon
    The US and UK bombed Serbia to make them surrender Kosovo, a part of Serbia for six hundred years, but get their pants in a twist about the Crimea, which had been a part of Ukraine for what - 20-odd years? - and before that had been part of Russia for hundreds of years.

    If you want consistency, you need to buy ready-made dough.

    (In the times of Bismark, one had at least meaningful Realpolitik, not chaos under the veil of World-Saving Derangement Complex. Well, it ended all in a European Suicide pact caused by Serbian Nationalists but that’s another story.)

  124. @anon
    Read up on news from the 60s and 70s.
    Mass pub shootings involving shotgunswere common.
    Indigent means poor. Is that what you meant?
    A friend worked at an Invercargill meatworks in the early 60s.
    He remembered fights between Tongans using chains outside the barracks every night.
    You might also check New Zealand's rate of Rapes and Burglaries.
    It was more recently the highest per capita in the First World.

    Things must have changed. I am 54 and the 1960s are a bit before my time. Maybe rape is more common here than in most countries, but if the UK dealt with grooming gangs the way it should, then it would soar up the international rankings. According to Nationmaster, it is just behind the US. Is the US really so rape-prone? I looked up the burglary statistics which showed NZ to be far worse that Costa Rica, which is a joke. I have lived in Costa Rica and I loved the place, but people live behind iron bars and razor wire. You really cannot leave your door unlocked. Here, I don’t know anyone who has bars on their windows.

    There are things I hate about New Zealand. The foul-mouthed verbal assaults usually delivered by women are my number one pet hate along the pressure to conform. The fear of being though stuck up leads many Kiwis to act in ways that are unworthy of their education or intelligence. Also the binge drinking is pretty sickening.

    I am sorry you had such a bad experience of the place.

    • Replies: @Trevor H.
    No place is perfect or even close. But New Zealand is about as good as it gets IMHO. Yes the trends may be troubling but that's true pretty much everywhere now. Maybe Hungary, but I haven't been there.
    , @Cowboy shaw
    NZ women... Bleugh
  125. @Hail

    Madeline Albright...after she discovered her Jewish heritage
     
    Is this plausible? I mean, do we have any reason to believe her at her word that she 'discovered' her Jewish heritage late in life?

    In a thread a few weeks ago, I asked the same about John Kerry (Comment-224 and Comment-241) who likewise claimed ignorance of his 1/2-Jewish origin.

    Is this plausible?

    Only if she never ever looked in the mirror.

  126. @22pp22
    Things must have changed. I am 54 and the 1960s are a bit before my time. Maybe rape is more common here than in most countries, but if the UK dealt with grooming gangs the way it should, then it would soar up the international rankings. According to Nationmaster, it is just behind the US. Is the US really so rape-prone? I looked up the burglary statistics which showed NZ to be far worse that Costa Rica, which is a joke. I have lived in Costa Rica and I loved the place, but people live behind iron bars and razor wire. You really cannot leave your door unlocked. Here, I don't know anyone who has bars on their windows.

    There are things I hate about New Zealand. The foul-mouthed verbal assaults usually delivered by women are my number one pet hate along the pressure to conform. The fear of being though stuck up leads many Kiwis to act in ways that are unworthy of their education or intelligence. Also the binge drinking is pretty sickening.

    I am sorry you had such a bad experience of the place.

    No place is perfect or even close. But New Zealand is about as good as it gets IMHO. Yes the trends may be troubling but that’s true pretty much everywhere now. Maybe Hungary, but I haven’t been there.

    • Replies: @Romanian
    Cough cough! ;)
  127. @Reg Cæsar

    Perhaps this is just a coincidence, but the Christchurch terrorist chose the closest Friday (March 15, 2019)
     
    It's also the Ides of March.

    (As any Cæsar could tell you.)

    2063 years ago…and the bastard had it coming.

    • Replies: @Hail

    2063 years ago
     
    Isn't it 44 BC two-thousand and sixty-two (2,062) years ago back from 2019 AD?

    (No Year 0.)

  128. anonymous[215] • Disclaimer says:

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War

    Killing thousands of people somewhere overseas by dumping bombs on them is just another day in the life of most Americans and can’t be expected to be noted let alone remembered. That particular atrocity may have marked the ushering-in of full-spectrum propaganda 24/7, lying on a grand scale. The saturation on every level was complete and propaganda stories abounded. The US along with other allies armed and trained Muslim terrorists and Clinton flew foreign jihadis in who gained a reputation for committing atrocities against Christian prey. The full story is ugly and showed how the media is just a vehicle for the government in selling lies to the public in support of the armed aggression of the moment.

  129. @Tiny Duck
    Still don't believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    Read Adam Serwer

    I subscribed to PewDiePie.

  130. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    And all the Muslim loons and whiners who complain about the Islamophobia of the U.S. government forget that the U.S. served as the air force for the murderous Albanian Muslim KLA. Unfortunately, Russia was still reeling from the collapse of the Soviet Union and too prostrate to render very much assistance to the embattled Christian Serbs.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    You nailed it. We effectively were their air force.
  131. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    Muslims from Albania/Kosovo/Bosnia are a different animal altogether from Muslims in the rest of the world. Pretty much indistinguishable in appearance and attitude from their Christian Balkan neighbors. I’ve met a few Bosnians and they are mostly no different than Serbs or Croats. In fact, I think they are descended mostly from Serbs and Croats that converted to Islam to gain preferential treatment under the occupying Ottomans. Granted, the non-Slavic Albanians are different, and seem to have a tendency towards organized crime. But not terrorism, and certainly not like say, the Chechens.

  132. @Tiny Duck
    Still don't believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    It wasn’t “hate speech” that drove the NZ shooter to kill all those Muslims. It was reading the numerous stories about Muslim violence against white Europeans in the U.K., Scandinavia and Western Europe.

    Funny how we never hear the need for hate speech laws when non-whites or deranged anti-white leftists kill or maim white people.

    You’re still a moron.

  133. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    In Europe the four highest recent Muslim terrorism body counts>>>>
    The heavy delivery truck driven through crowds in the South of France killed 80 plus at Nice on Bastille Day
    the explosion and gunfire at the Ariel Grande concert in Manchester killed “only 22”
    then Bataclan with Eagles of Death metal just short of 100 killed.
    Then of course 12 killed at Charlie Hebdo and other smaller mass murders by Euro-Jihadists

    Outside Europe such as Kenya and India there were mass killings by the Jihad

    On 2 April 2015, gunmen stormed the Garissa University College in Garissa, Kenya, killing 148 people, and injuring 79 or more. The militant group and Al-Qaeda offshoot, Al-Shabaab, which the gunmen claimed to be from, took responsibility for the attack. The Somali gunmen took over 700 students hostage, freeing Muslims and killing those who identified as Christians.

  134. @Trevor H.
    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we'll just spare you the details.

  135. @Ron Mexico
    Have you been given the full picture of Srebrenica or The Narrative?
    http://tenc.net/sreb/mem.htm

    Just give me the elevator story, and I mean the 30-second version, in which you directly answer this question:

    Did Serb militias shoot to death a large number (1,000+) disarmed Bosnian men and boys who were in their custody and who would, under international law, be designated as prisoners?

    Yes, or No.

    • Replies: @peterAUS
    If I may:
    "Yes".

    Caveat: "boys".
    Anyone over 13, then and there, was a fair game.
    A 13 years old boy can hold an AK-47.

    The region has a culture of "boy soldiers".
    If confused, please read up about Khmer Rouges and various African militias.
    , @J.Ross
    No. Are you talking about the "mass graves" that totally contradicted NATO's claims?
    Protip: when a Musim speaks to a sub-Muslim, especially about a claimed grievance, he's not trying to communicate, he's trying to manipulate. You don't lay out facts to a horse, you bark at it to carry you faster.
  136. @Allan Mitchell
    Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad? The music/meme/8chan background point towards the alt-right but most of his talking points (including the apparent absence of antisemitism) seem to come straight from the counter-jihad playbook. Perhaps an unholy meld of the two.

    It's interesting that journalists etc seem more keen to write about the alt-right. There are books by Hawley, Wendling, Nagle etc. But the only book about the counter-jihad I know of is Soldiers of a Different God by Othen, a British writer. It's difficult to say why there's this imbalance but I suspect it's something to do with the establishment types who support the counter-jihad in America. It's harder to investigate something that has lots of money and good lawyers.

    Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad?

    I read his manifesto fully, he’s all over the place White nationalism, Robert Spencer/Gates of Vienna type Counter Jihad, Bernie Sanders type Socialism and Environmentalism, he rails against corporations a lot and primarily blames them for the ‘invasion’ as he puts it. He should be considered Alt-right because his primary obsession is with the declining White demographics. Hilariously he claims the fundamental person responsible for his radicalization is Candace Owens!!

    He claims to have met with Breivik’s organization and got blessings from them before the massacre.

    He justifies murder of Children by saying that that’s one less adult for your children to kill. Interestingly he says that he picked out Muslims for this massacre because they’re universally reviled and that he hoped to garner sympathy for the attack.

    All said the manifesto reveals him to be an sensitive, intelligent man who felt that his cold blooded massacre was not just justified but absolutely necessary. A sensitive, intelligent Monster.

  137. @Bill P
    Before that bombing there was a very intense anti-American media campaign in China over the Serbia caampaign. It was so bad I decided it was time to get out, fast (you get a feel for those things in China -- a lot of Westerners have started leaving recently, too). So I got on a plane and flew back to Seattle, and the embassy strike happened the next day. There were scenes of Chinese attacking the US embassy, and I was friends with some of those marine guards who had to go through that. Westerners were getting chased by mobs, etc. It was extremely upsetting to me. It felt like I was still there when I saw it on TV, and I could imagine my poor friends hunkering down in their apartments not daring to show their faces in public. I was also angry at the US for the bombing, because it was so obviously deliberate and so provocative.

    My take on it at the time was that it was simply a big FU to the Chinese for supporting the Serbs so vigorously, along with a "what are you going to do about it?" attitude. Using a stealth bomber sent a pretty clear message: "we can hit you and there's nothing you can do to stop us."

    I still don't think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn't do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.

    It was probably Wesley Clark’s idea.

    When Russian troops occupied the Pristina airport at the end of the war, Clark ordered British NATO forces to attack. The Brits refused, citing the probability that such an altercation would spark World War 3.

    Clark was Bill and Hill’s homeboy.

  138. @Lot
    “MAN, that is a bold statement.“

    Iraq and Vietnam were worse, for both us and them.

    But the South Viets and Kurds didn’t deserve to live under communism or Saddam’s vicious government. We at least were on the right side of wars we should not have entered. These were foolish, dysfunctional, and reckless wars, but not evil.

    But bombing Serbia was just completely evil.

    The Kurds fought on both sides of the Iran Iraq War, ethnically cleansed and massacred Assyrians who had more right to territory than they did, and have been a pain in the neck to every other people in the Middle East. Atrocities against them were predictable and not something any other capable authoritarian in that region wouldn’t have done. We weren’t on the right side, we shouldn’t have even been fighting in the Middle East.

    In Iraq we caused more trouble in the area that existed previously, and neither the people we opposed there or the people were supported were any good.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    It's almost a law that "our guys" are reliably worthless because we start with our ability to control them (which we never secure anyway).
  139. The people murdered appear to be refugees from New Zealand’s middle east wars, which is to say New Zealand destroyed whole cities, financed and armed the ISIS crazies killing millions and destroying the lives of tens of millions. Mr Tarrents murder spree was unauthorized. His lifetime in prison could be considered his equivalent of a government pension.

    It is interesting that the PM of New Zealand sees the need for new fire arms legislation but not the death penalty. It is kind of clear at this point that in a multicultural world the death penalty might be a necessity. The history of the death penalty in NZ sort of follows multiculturalism. The death penalty is eliminated at the height of monoculturalism 1961.

  140. @Dave Pinsen
    It’s a weird coincidence that we have a terrorist lamenting low birth rates the same week Buffalo Wild Wings was pushing vasectomies.

    https://twitter.com/shavedharambee/status/1106259197350563846?s=21

    A friend of mine went to Buffalo Wild Wings the other day and was bombarded with MSNBC. He asked the waiter if he could switch the TV over to Fox. “That’s against corporate policy,” the waiter said.

    So Fox is verboten. “You’ll watch MSNBC and you’ll like it! Now shut up and eat your wings! Don’t make me cram them down your throat!” My friend won’t be going back.

    The company that owns BWW also owns Arby’s and Sonic.

  141. @22pp22
    I think the population is fine as it is. I don't want it to grow any more. On the drive from Invercargill to Christchurch, we don't pass through a large settlement. I like it that way.

    Half of the population of four and a half million lives in or around Auckland. I almost never go there. My wife and I will be spending our anniversary in Melbourne. It's cheaper to get here.

    I have a horrible feeling NZers are going to lose control of the population. You could fit a lot of people in the place, but as you say it’s one of the few optimally populated places left. I expect there will be 50 million there one day.

  142. @Hail
    The reaction today (2019) to a 'Kosovo' would, I('d like to) think, be much more negative.

    A big reason so few strayed off the reservation was it was still the analog era. Newspaper and print-magazine reading was still the main way people get info, along with some radio and of course the evening news, now a quaint notion. There was no Internet to speak of for a large majority, and not much of one for those few on it. Nothing like it became by the 2010s. Few even had cell phones in the late 1990s.

    Given these few info-chokepoints, they curated the narrative pretty effectively. Most people believed the line about "stopping genocide in the Balkans" and "Europe's last dictator."

    They repeated their con-job in 2002-2003 for Iraq, a giant fraud which was especially formative, I think, for those born in the late 1970s thru late 1980s, i.e., people now in their 30s who roughly Teenage-to-EarlyMid20s when Iraq happened.

    Perhaps Trump (before his metamorphosis into Blormpf-kushner) was already elected in 2003, at least his foreign policy plank, in the sense that anti-neocon-interventionism had become a quiet-majority opinion among the younger cohorts, hi-info voters, and the politically engaged (if not among the "Get a Brain, Morans" crowd).

    In 2007, Ron Paul came out swinging against "policing the world" and unexpectedly had success rallying a sizable, loyal support base, repeating the performance in 2011-2012. In 2015, Trump borrowed Ron Paul's foreign policy rhetoric, helping propel him forward. It was immigration, but not solely immigration. Trump was really selling a whole package.

    Trump was really selling a whole package.

    Sadly a package he had no intention of delivering.

    • Agree: Hail
  143. That RFK comment tho.

  144. @YetAnotherAnon
    The US and UK bombed Serbia to make them surrender Kosovo, a part of Serbia for six hundred years, but get their pants in a twist about the Crimea, which had been a part of Ukraine for what - 20-odd years? - and before that had been part of Russia for hundreds of years.

    It’s almost as if someone who doesn’t have our best interests at heart has wrested control of our foreign policy in the past couple of decades. I suspect the distance of time will illuminate this quite clearly for future historians.

  145. @22pp22
    Things must have changed. I am 54 and the 1960s are a bit before my time. Maybe rape is more common here than in most countries, but if the UK dealt with grooming gangs the way it should, then it would soar up the international rankings. According to Nationmaster, it is just behind the US. Is the US really so rape-prone? I looked up the burglary statistics which showed NZ to be far worse that Costa Rica, which is a joke. I have lived in Costa Rica and I loved the place, but people live behind iron bars and razor wire. You really cannot leave your door unlocked. Here, I don't know anyone who has bars on their windows.

    There are things I hate about New Zealand. The foul-mouthed verbal assaults usually delivered by women are my number one pet hate along the pressure to conform. The fear of being though stuck up leads many Kiwis to act in ways that are unworthy of their education or intelligence. Also the binge drinking is pretty sickening.

    I am sorry you had such a bad experience of the place.

    NZ women… Bleugh

  146. When the Balkans problems were ongoing my primary news source was NPR. I grew dismayed with the emotional dribble coming over that source as there was no rhyme or reason shared, no background, no connection made with US interests.

    Consequently, to this day I understand very little of what happened there.

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?

    • Replies: @peterAUS

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?
     
    Assuming, hard, that's the question asked in good faith, my 2 cents:
    There is NO such book.

    I'd go a big step further: there is NO single truth about all that.

    Each ethnic group there has its own perception or reality and, consequently, the Truth.
    Each of them.

    You can spend a week with top thinkers from each group and walk from that experience more confused than before. Probably bordering, or ...hehe...even over it...crazy.

    Or...perhaps...it's not so hard to understand.
    A small piece of land contested by several groups for centuries. "We want to live here".
    All the rest is the result of it.
    , @notanon

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?
     
    no but iirc the gist was Serbia was the biggest part of Yugoslavia so Tito redrew the internal borders to equalize things which meant chunks of Serbia were attached to the other regions.

    when Yugoslavia broke up that led to civil war and ethnic cleansing over where the borders should be.

    this could have been sorted out by some international agreement but neocons wanted to blame it all on the Serbs for reasons connected with the middle east - attacking the Serbs was basically a PR stunt to try and appease the muslim world over US bases in Saudi Arabia

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_withdrawal_from_Saudi_Arabia
  147. Christchurch is definitely a hard-luck town, what with the earthquake and now this shooting. And at least for me, the only place Christchurch previously occupied in my awareness was through pop culture, specifically Peter Jackson’s “Heavenly Creatures”, which dealt with the true life story of two Christchurch teenage girls who bludgeoned one of their mothers to death with a rock. One of those girls ended up being a successful writer later in life (the one played by a pre-Titanic Kate Winslett in the film).

    • Replies: @Cowboy shaw
    Christchurch is probably going to be one of those places where things tend to happen, despite being otherwise completely unremarkable. It has that feel about it. I drank 9 jugs of beer at the Carlton pub there in 1989, and I've never come close to that since. That's got to tell you something.

    Karl Popper wrote 'The Open Society and its Enemies' in Christchurch where he was excited during the war. I believe he was pretty bored.

  148. @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    I agree with you Svigor, and I doubt you’ll be surprised that your comment will awaken the hordes of insecure virtue signalers.

    This guy ain’t the US’s problem. That won’t stop the usual suspects from attempting to make him ours.

  149. @Dtbb
    Where can the video be seen?

    Apparently it’s being taken down in most places, as soon as it goes up. I saw it in a comment thread on TRS and DLed it, but have no idea if the link is still up. I’d try a bittorrent search engine, if I had to find it now.

    • Replies: @larry lurker
    Still up on The Pirate Bay - just search "christchurch". The file is 60-something megs.

    Might be a good idea to download it on public WiFi.
  150. @gabriel alberton

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow.
     
    Have you in the past supported that people should be gunned down, murdered, or otherwise harmed? Did you ever write, say, post something that would make anyone not insane in the head to interpret it as a call for others to be killed or hurt? If not, why would you feel any need to disavow the shooter, had him said Jews/Israel were his enemies?

    That’s a good question. I mean it’s not like Muslims have to disavow their terrorists, or Jews theirs, or blacks theirs, etc.

    I am going to enjoy telling everyone this awful racist (Islam isn’t a race!) Islamophobic hater shooter terrorist guy loved Jews.

  151. @Ron Mexico
    Have you been given the full picture of Srebrenica or The Narrative?
    http://tenc.net/sreb/mem.htm

    Back in the 90s/early 2000s, I read a lot of Holocaust revisionism, and I also skimmed some Serbian claims about Srebenica. I remember that much of the Holocaust revisionist literature making clear and distinct claims. The concentration camp victims actually died of typhus, the gas chambers weren’t real, etc. Even if the Holocaust revisionist claims were false, or distorted, at least their claims *grappled with the point in question*: did the Germans intentionally commit mass murder against the Jewish people?

    I remember finding the Serbian claims hard to follow. The defenses didn’t seem to center on the point at issue: did Serbs massacre unarmed Bosnian Moslems in their custody at Srebenica? Yes or no? If they addressed the point, the Serb defenders would usually focus on the numbers, or imply that the massacre was deserved. Well, you don’t get to massacre your enemies, even if they are guilty of massacres themselves.

    You pointed me to a website where the heading specifically talks about “refuting the charge that Serbs committed mass murder at Srebenica.” Sounded promising. I read further down, and that article is about documenting Moslem crimes against Serbs. That might provide context for understanding the mass murder at Srebenica, but it does *not* refute the charge of mass murder committed by Serbs. This confirms my low opinion of the Serb counterclaims. I see this sort of irrational, reflexive changing of the subject when talking with Balkan tribalists.

    Here’s another example: https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-srebrenica-massacre-was-a-gigantic-political-fraud/5321388 The author says that Srebenica was a “fraud.” A Westerner like me reads that and infers that the article will deny that Serbs committed atrocities at Srebenica. Part way through the article, the author writes, “The numbers [of Bosnian Moslems] executed there [by Serbs] were probably in the order of between 500 and 1,000.” So he admits that the Serbs murdered (because this would be murder; there was no trial) hundreds of unarmed people in their custody. So really the alleged fraud has to do with numbers. I repeat, the author admits that the Serbs committed a huge massacre at Srebenica, he just disputes the numbers, and lamely tries to the killings as “deaths and executions.” If you’re on trial for killing eight people, you don’t get acquitted if you admit on the stand that you only killed four.

    If the best that pro-Serb apologists can do is say, “We murdered fewer of them, in retaliation for what they did to us,” then I can see why this douchebag in New Zealand sought to emulate Serb militants in the Balkans. Kind of like Eric Holder, the motto seems to be, “When they massacre you, you massacre them back.”

    There’s an Eastern Catholic Jesuit priest, Archimandrite Rober Taft, S.J. (who I think now is deceased; RIP), who said that the further east you go in Europe, the less rational the people are. Meaning, decisions are generally made more reflexively, on the basis of identity/identification, not rational sifting of evidence. My experience with Balkan polemics supports this. These cultures missed out on the sort of social tranformation that the Catholic Church achieved in the West, where it produced the underpinnings for WEIRD (Western, Educated, Industrialized, Rich, Democratic) culture. Social life is still more instinctual, visceral. I suspect that’s part of what’s going on.

    Now, I realize that I’m being provocative and painting with a broad brush, to say the least, and obviously none of these criticisms apply to all Serbs, just like anti-Islamic criticisms don’t apply to all Moslems. I just don’t think people in America, which is a WEIRD country, should look to Balkan tribes for models, whether on the Albanian, Bosniak, Serbian, or Croatian sides.* They’re in a different world than the one we live in, and a more primitive one. You might end up with someone like this guy trying to go Radovan Karadžić on a mosque.

    *And if you don’t think that’s a thing, it’s part of why I stopped reading Chronicles Magazine and I got turned off to the paleocon movement. There seemed to be a sort of perverse leapfrogging of loyalties, where the Chronicles crowd went off on some Serbophile, Russophile tangent out of their disdain for contemporary America. The neocons had Israel, and that crowd had Serbia, it seemed.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    The reason other Europeans no longer massacre each other Balkan-style is that they now have ethnically homogeneous countries.
    , @Anonymous

    Well, you don’t get to massacre your enemies, even if they are guilty of massacres themselves.
     
    Does the Torah say "An Eye for an Eye"?
  152. @Hail

    Madeline Albright...after she discovered her Jewish heritage
     
    Is this plausible? I mean, do we have any reason to believe her at her word that she 'discovered' her Jewish heritage late in life?

    In a thread a few weeks ago, I asked the same about John Kerry (Comment-224 and Comment-241) who likewise claimed ignorance of his 1/2-Jewish origin.

    Perhaps bombing Serbia allowed Clinton to distract from his extramarital scandals.

    http://www.pravdareport.com/history/127187-nato_serbia_lewinsky/

    • Replies: @RationalExpressions

    Perhaps bombing Serbia allowed Clinton to distract from his extramarital scandals.
     
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wag_the_Dog
  153. Anon[409] • Disclaimer says:
    @J.Ross
    I had a foreign language "sampler" channel when we bombed the Chinese embassy; those were the bright days of early globalism, so it had a wierd mix of programming like Legend of the Galactic Heroes in Arabic or the Madhuri Dikshit show*.
    Almost all the standard languages were covered by Deutsche Welle, so what the German "news" said and showed would be reiterated on the same soundstage by a different guy.
    But not French. The French had this gorgeously cinematic and futuristic news set. Deutsche Welle is something like Voice of Germany, NPR specifically for foreigners, but the French one was France Channel 2 and once showed an excited and uncensored bull in a story about agriculture.
    The Germans and everyone else (here including the US MSM outside the globalism channel):
    The US bombed the Chinese embassy. The CIA said, sorry, our maps were like old or something, we wanted the building next door which was totally like so legitimate a tarzhey.
    The French:
    The building next door? You mean the tree? Because the Chinese embassy is in a small park.
    And then the French became the only people who showed a little illustration, at a time when every newspaper had an asinine computer generator space-taking pseudo-informative graphic for stuff like annual rainfall. Nobody who saw all that green space around the buildings of the complex could buy anything else coming out of DC.
    *Like a once-standard American sitcom placing a female celebrity as an ordinary housewife, but they have an episode about how the Indian police are utterly useless and organized crime is rampant.

    ATM, Franceinfo, the 24-hur news channel run by the French government for internal consumption, broadcasts “sports” and “culture”, while RT France, Ruptly, and Sputnik France broadcast Champs Elysee burnings and fights. The Russian channels have 7K viewers each on Youtube, while Frenchy-French one has 700.

    For the moment, it looks as if the French cannot control the message any longer. But the fact is the French still elected that clown. There is a lot of time until the next elections, and legitimacy is the only concern of the French establishment.

    Also, Russia’s propaganda can be easily excised off the internet if they persist on using US platforms.

  154. @Lot
    “MAN, that is a bold statement.“

    Iraq and Vietnam were worse, for both us and them.

    But the South Viets and Kurds didn’t deserve to live under communism or Saddam’s vicious government. We at least were on the right side of wars we should not have entered. These were foolish, dysfunctional, and reckless wars, but not evil.

    But bombing Serbia was just completely evil.

    Yeah, it depends on how you approach the question. It’s like the Aztecs vs. the Mongols. The Mongols murdered far more people – a great many of them innocents – than the Aztecs did. And I’m confident they did plenty of torturing, mutilating, and maiming along the way. But they just didn’t come anywhere close to the Aztecs in terms of vileness – in the purely evil nature of their culture. The Aztecs are in a class of their own, on that score. The Mongols did evil as a means to an end, but for the Aztecs, it was a religion and a way of life.

    But dead is dead, and the Mongols killed way more people. I have to give the nod to scale and score them @ #1. Let’s just say I call them “the worst,” avoiding the question of evil.

    Similarly, we killed an awful lot of people in Vietnam. We helped the Vietnamese kill an awful lot of people in Vietnam.

  155. @gate666
    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.

    dont forget the american right generally supported the albanians.

    Neocons, maybe. I was a right-wing nationalist back in the 90s, and me and all the guys I knew were 100 percent pro-Belgrade* at that time.

    *except for the ethnic Croat-Americans, I suppose

  156. @J.Ross
    Do not share it. I would suggest downloading it out of militant anti-censorship, but once you have it, do not upload it anywhere else. Loud little birds are saying that people posting this video are getting more than put on a list. Numerous video sites that exist to get around YouTube censorship are either taking this video down or not allowing it to be posted.
    Also it is claimed that the YouTube app will force close if you type the triple parentheses, I can't confirm that as I don'thave the app. Expect heavy-handedness, they have their excuse to go Chinese.

    Good advice. Thank you.

    I’ll pass it on to my friend who sent it to me. She didn’t post it publicly, she sent it to friends privately via Facebook Messenger. But I doubt that distinction means anything to TPTB.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Follow-up, don't download it if you're there: the NZ government, raging in its impotence, will attempt to prosecute people who are believed to have seen the video.
    https://postimg.cc/QFhvLKYn
    Anyone with a copy may face ten years in prison. Police also asking that you report friends.
  157. Another name marked on the weaponry was Novak Vujosevic, who fought on the Montenegrin side in the Battle of Fundina against the Ottoman Empire’s forces.

    Truly, genetics are powerful, as those people are still fighting the Ottoman Empire.

    Secondly, that is why accepting people from vastly different cultures (which usually means races) is such a stupid thing because:

    A. You don’t know what stupid genes they may be bringing into your country, and

    B. You don’t know what past wars and enmities they are bringing into your country.

    • Replies: @Dtbb
    Yeah. Just the other day I saw a Hindu store owner get into it with his Pakistani vendor. I said "ain't diversity great"; and I thought they were going to turn on me. Nothing unites the diverse like the anglo.
    , @Corvinus
    "Secondly, that is why accepting people from vastly different cultures (which usually means races) is such a stupid thing because: A. You don’t know what stupid genes they may be bringing into your country, and B. You don’t know what past wars and enmities they are bringing into your country."

    Now you know how the WASPs felt when the Italians, Slavs, and Poles came here en masse in the late 1800 and early 1900's.

    In Woodrow Wilson’s History of the American People (1902), he compared the "men of the sturdy stock of the north of Europe" with the "more sordid and hopeless elements [of southern and eastern Europe]".

    Kenneth Roberts, a journalist and novelist, believed that immigration laws had to be revised to admit fewer Polish Jews who were "human parasites". He believed immigration had to be restricted because it would inevitably produce "a hybrid race of people as worthless and futile as the good-for-nothing mongrels of Central America and South Eastern Europe … If America doesn’t keep out the queer alien mongrelized people of Southern and Eastern Europe, her crop of citizens will eventually be dwarfed and mongrelized in turn".

    And, of course, who can ever forget Madison Grant (1916) --> The man of the old stock is being crowded out of many country districts by foreigners, just as he is today being literally driven off the streets of New York City by swarms of Polish Jews. These immigrants adopt the same language of the Native American, they wear his clothes, they steal his name and they are beginning to take his women, but seldom adopt his religion or understand his ideals…older immigrants are skilled, thrifty, hardworking like native born Americans and recent immigrants from southern and eastern Europe are unskilled, ignorant, predominantly Catholic or Jewish and not easily assimilated into American culture.

    But my personal favorite is Hiram Wesley Evans, Grand Imperial Wizard, who made his position abundantly clear: "The vast horde of immigrants who have reached our shores…Italian immigrants, Irish catholic malcontents, Russian Jews, Finns, Letts, Lithuanians [are] of the lowest class".

    Indeed, these groups posed the greatest threat to American society and culture that, in 1907, the Dillingham Commission was formed to recommend literacy tests be put into place. Many people thought if they could just get rid of the "new " immigrants, life would return to their slow paced "Golden Age" of their fore fathers.

    They have to go back. It's just who we are.

  158. @J.Ross
    They are moving very strongly to censor social media and criminalize speech. BBC Radio in the immediate aftermath talked about the need to monitor thought in almost those words. No one considers that people might be reacting to what they see around them with their own eyes -- there is always this faith that folks are captured by some conjuration and mighty magic, in other words, the thoroughly trashed premise of the SPLC and the ADL which led them to attack Gibson's Passion of the Christ and Bavarian Easter celebrations. The mainstream national and international news already censors crimes against whites, and police agencies across Western Europe spent about half a year pretending that nothing happened on New Year's Eve in Cologne. They must be looking at places like this next.

    Their ideas are so alien and unnatural they can only become dominant with years of uncontested indoctrination. And even then they know it only takes a few hours of exposure to “far right” ideas (i.e., real talk and common sense) to wipe it all out. Their only option is suppression.

  159. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    Clintons bomb Serbia into submission until it amputates its province of Kosovo, at which point Kosovar Albanians ethnically cleanse it of all Serbs. This is explicitly done, in part, to get Muslims to better like the US by showing it will bomb Christians. In revenge, Serbia sends young men to America to shoot 3 pointers. In gratitude, Albania sends young men to America to shoot-up Fort Dix.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    This is explicitly done, in part, to get Muslims to better like the US by showing it will bomb Christians.
     
    It was done to weaken a very talented White Christian ethnic group.
  160. @donut
    " the most shameful episode of American history of the past century."

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .

    I used up my agree, but boy do I agree.

  161. @Svigor

    Never seen anything like that.
     
    Correction: never seen anything remotely in the same solar system as that.

    Serious question: is that a first? Has there ever been footage of a mass shooter like that?

    Why are mass shootings newsworthy while mass beheadings not so much. Western lives matter?
    https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/new-isis-video-shows-mass-beheading-of-christians-399613507644

    • Replies: @Pericles
    Who/whom.
  162. Trump’s administration should take this opportunity to bring to America more Serbs, Croats, Bosnians, Herzegovinians, Montenegrins, Macedonians, Slovenians, Kosovars, and Vojvodinians so they can all together teach us a few lessons about the everlasting endurance of multiculturalism.

  163. @Puremania
    The bombing of Belgrade was completely absurd and I was dead against it. Why on earth did we do it?
    1. Because Nice White Ladies saw that famous Fake News picture where they turned people waiting outside a fence for supplies into Albanian “prisoners” in a “concentration camp”?
    2. Because Madeline Albright wanted a Muslim ethnostate to camouflage ethnostate Israel after she discovered her Jewish heritage?
    3. Because the Albanian mafia had something on Bill Clinton? (I’ve met Serbs who say yes, that’s it)
    I don’t know if NZ was an “anniversary massacre”, but that pointless war had lingering bad effects. Russia quoted our words back to us almost verbatim when it came to S. Ossetia & Abkhazia. Heck, at least those places are mostly pro-Russia. Kosovars ended up being the largest group of imported fighters for ISIS.
    They’re also involved in organ harvesting from Serb and non-Albanian prisoners. I bet some rich western transsexuals are getting genitalia on the Dark Web that way.
    To paraphrase Richard Pryor, “I didn’t say it! Carla Del Ponte said it!”

    Don’t leave out the wickedness of the British. In analyzing dumb U.S. foreign policy moves, there’s always a British connection.

    U.S. policy in the early days of the Yugoslav conflict was actually sound. We saw that massacres were occurring (and they were, there’s proof of it). But, we stayed out and supported arming the Bosniaks.

    The Brits stepped in and said no, arming them would be very very bad. Douglas Hurd, perhaps reliving Britain’s gun-grabbing role in Ireland, said dropping arms into Bosnia would “create a level killing field.” They blocked weapons from reaching Bosnia and pressured Bosnia into accepting a settlement that would see their county dismembered.

    And whaddaya know? The massacres went on just like the British wanted them to. And these cowardly chumps, who allowed Srebrenica to happen, actually had a chance to arrest Ratko Mladic in 2004. But their soldiers pussied out even though they were armed at the time. Mladic remained free for another 7 years.

  164. And in one masterful stroke New Zealand jumps to the head of the list of mass shootings per capita!

    • Replies: @Cowboy shaw
    We are masters of per capita tables.
  165. @Anonymous
    Watching the MSM reaction to the Christchurch Massacre is like watching the Bizarro-World reaction to Islamic Massacres.

    1) As soon as it happened everyone started calling the perpetrator a terrorist, which was 100% accurate given his elaborate streaming setup. But a Muslim can hack people to death while shouting Allahu Ackbar and we really need to wait until all the facts are in, preferably until people forget about it.

    2) Muslim terrorists are lone wolves who have noting to do with Islam but any time a white(or even partly-white guy) engages in terrorist behaviour, it's part of a worldwide movement that somehow combines Islamophobes, White Nationalists, incels and 4chan, no matter how tenuous the links are.

    In fact, many Islamic terrorists in the west are the exact equivalent of Breivik and apparently this guy-people who got all their ideas from a specific messed-up corner of the internet but never attended a training camp of any kind or are part of a large network of co-conspirators.

    3) MSM gatekeepers are doing their best not to give viewers any information that might cast Islam in a negative light. During a Canadian round-table on the CBC, the talking heads pointed out the unmistakable reference to Alexandre Bissionette on the terrorist's gun case, while leaving viewers to wonder what "For Rotherham" meant.

    When Muslims do something, the media’s sole concern is preventing “backlash” against Muslims. Whenever a white guy does something, they are suddenly unconcerned with this and in fact act as ringleaders to stir up maximal backlash against whites.

  166. The lesson to be learned here is that Muslim immigration begets terrorism which begets retaliation. Our elites are either morons or vindictive assholes for promoting it.

  167. @gabriel alberton
    Which naturally leads to the question: are there countries/places where this sort of thing is supposed to happen?

    Which then naturally leads to the question: does importing people from where this sort of thing is supposed to happen to where it isn’t supposed to happen change where it is supposed to happen?

  168. @Wilkey
    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    Gratitude from Muslims isn't worth shit.

    There's a huge disconnect in how our "leaders" respond to these atrocities. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism they do nothing to suppress Islam tell us we need to do things to help Muslims like us more.

    When a right-winger commits the (rare) right-wing act of terorrism, they seek to suppress and outlaw those on the right, including the vast majority of us who oppose violence. No effort is made to make the right-wing like them more.

    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.

    I’m not sure whether you recall this, but “Muslim gratitude”, in order to to secure a Palestinian peace deal, was part of the Clinton administration’s (absurd) justification for the series of U.S./NATO war crimes commonly referenced as “the Kosovo War“.

    • Replies: @JerseyJeffersonian
    That was a smoke screen; the US couldn't give a flying fuck about the Palestinians. So what were the genuine motivations?

    The outcome of the war ended with the creation of the enormous, and strategically significant military base, Camp Bondsteel (the southern pincher in the ongoing encirclement of the western border of the Russians and their formerly-Soviet allies), the humiliation of a potential Russian ally in Serbia (never stop kicking them when they are down...yet, ironically, even drunkard Yeltsin authorized [or at least didn't stand in the way of] an operation to seize a strategic airfield and snatch it away from hubristic Gen. Clark, and this incident may also have been the final, eye-opening insult that led to the concerted Russian effort to rise again from their low point), and with cowing our European poodles still further into submission to neocon policy goals.

    Not to be forgotten, many of the neocon driving forces were Jews happy to give Russia a poke in the eye following the logic that Orthodox Christian Serbs = Russians = Cossacks, so while the policy apparatus was in their hands, it was time to strike their traditional enemy. This, coupled with the largely Jewish looting of Russia during Yeltsin's misrule, had to be a galvanizing moment that informed their national policies, domestic and foreign. But then, history has made them take the long view, and in consequence they never give up.

    A side point: in relation to the bombing of the Chinese embassy, I have always suspected that this was in retaliation for Chinese military/intelligence passing along useful information to the Serbs during the NATO bombing. This may have led to the Serbian shoot down of the F-117, and perhaps to the Serbs passing wreckage to the Chinese for reverse engineering. Pissed the US off, leading to the transparently false story about misidentification of the embassy leading to the bombing.

  169. @Hodag
    2063 years ago...and the bastard had it coming.

    2063 years ago

    Isn’t it 44 BC two-thousand and sixty-two (2,062) years ago back from 2019 AD?

    (No Year 0.)

    • Replies: @El Dato
    There are also disagreements in counting somewhere in the Middle Ages IIRC. So let's apply error bars.
  170. @Memelord
    No offense to my fellow commenters, who, like Steve, will attempt with an admirable, if misplaced, Boomer earnestness to parse the underlying pro-Serb loyalties of the shooter, but you're way off.

    It's all about the memes.

    A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.

    The song in question, generally known amongst /pol/tards and their online fellow travelers as either "Serbia Strong" or "Remove Kebab," has long been a staple of image board culture, especially among those with nationalist or fascist sympathies.

    https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/serbia-strong-remove-kebab

    This is not to say, of course, that the shooter did not/does not admire the Serbs as emblematic of armed resistance against Muslims, but the conflict itself was, I would wager, about as inconsequential in pushing him to commit the act that he did as are Candace Owens, Pewdiepie, or what is known as the "Navy Seal Copypasta," all of which were referenced in either his manifesto or his comments just prior to the shooting, as recorded on the live stream.

    In short, y'all n****z got trolled.

    I don’t disagree with your comment, but quantity and prominence of esoteric Balkan stuff was notable.

    If it were purely meme warfare, I would expect a more random distribution of references. So, yes, a lot of people are probably not seeing the trolling aspect, but Steve may still have a point.

  171. @istevefan

    Barely anybody in the US remembers our 1999 Kosovo War,
     
    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I've hated McCain and Kristol ever since.

    I also began questioning US policy about that time. However, it wasn’t until the US abetted ethnic cleansing of Serbs in Kosovo and its transformation into a rump, narco-terrorist state in the “soft underbelly of Europe” that I started my pilgrimage to wokeness.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    After the bombing, which was supposed to prevent ethnic cleansing stopped, NATO sat back and watched the Albanians ethnically cleanse Serbs and other enthnicities from Kosovo and did nothing. I can't find it now, but there was an article in the BBC which quoted some NATO official as being disappointed at this new ethnic cleansing, but in the end he was resigned to accept it because once it was completed, there would no longer be any problems of ethnic strife.
  172. @Bill P
    Before that bombing there was a very intense anti-American media campaign in China over the Serbia caampaign. It was so bad I decided it was time to get out, fast (you get a feel for those things in China -- a lot of Westerners have started leaving recently, too). So I got on a plane and flew back to Seattle, and the embassy strike happened the next day. There were scenes of Chinese attacking the US embassy, and I was friends with some of those marine guards who had to go through that. Westerners were getting chased by mobs, etc. It was extremely upsetting to me. It felt like I was still there when I saw it on TV, and I could imagine my poor friends hunkering down in their apartments not daring to show their faces in public. I was also angry at the US for the bombing, because it was so obviously deliberate and so provocative.

    My take on it at the time was that it was simply a big FU to the Chinese for supporting the Serbs so vigorously, along with a "what are you going to do about it?" attitude. Using a stealth bomber sent a pretty clear message: "we can hit you and there's nothing you can do to stop us."

    I still don't think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn't do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.

    I still don’t think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn’t do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.

    Especially after Bill Clinton got all that campaign dough from the Chinese too.

  173. @Clifford Brown

    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: “This sort of thing isn’t supposed to happen in New Zealand.”
     
    You should be in shock. That is a healthy and sane reaction. By any standard in any society, the shooting was a horrendous atrocity. Rue the day when such a massacre is not shocking for then you have lost your humanity.

    New Zealand is a land uniquely blessed by God. Cherish your land and your compassionate, peaceful and free people.

    Insist on a thorough and uncensored investigation, one that is as transparent as possible. There is much that was bizarre in the entire episode.

    Take perspective and do not act too brashly. Do not sacrifice your values and freedoms in light of what is hopefully an extremely isolated incident. At the same time, do not allow your politicians to manipulate your shock and righteous grief over this atrocity to push for detrimental policies.

    Always remember that New Zealand does not walk alone.

    Sir;

    Your comment fairly jumped off the screen, such is its concise, calm, rational, and compassionate power. Well done, sir, well done.

  174. In related news–for us anyway–the Daily Mail published this piece about the immivasion of the Iberian peninsula lo those many years ago. And they didn’t make such a hash of the story as the NYTimes did.

    The NYTimes crowd can’t or won’t see the connection between the story of the shooting in NZ and the successful usurpation of male farmers in Iberia.

    Yoga, the word, means “to bind”. To bring the two together. It is just this capacity that the Left lacks. They can’t hold the two events together simultaneously in their minds.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-6814183/How-men-Spain-completely-wiped-4-500-4-000-years-ago.html

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    The NYTimes crowd can’t or won’t see the connection between the story of the shooting in NZ and the successful usurpation of male farmers in Iberia.
     
    Please spell it out. What is the connection?
  175. @Trevor H.
    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we'll just spare you the details.

    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we’ll just spare you the details.

    Snopes.com is reporting that accounts of torture and mutilations during the Bataclan massacre are untrue.

    So I am more persuaded that it did in fact happen.

    • Agree: Trevor H.
    • Replies: @Pericles
    From what I recall, the official hearing mentioned torture and mutilated victims. But maybe the weed loving hooker of Snopes knows better.
  176. @El Dato

    Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn’t-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.
     
    It's the 21st, man. It's like cyberpunk, only with mobile phones and better lighting.

    But this pales with the daily dropping of bombs on women and children. Nobody cares about THAT.

    “The sky above the port was the color of a YouTube channel, saying something about a missing plugin.”


    A video also showed that before the shooting, the gunman played a song honouring Bosnian Serb wartime political leader Radovan Karadzic, whose final verdict for genocide and war crimes is due to be delivered next week.
     
    Was that the accordion guy clip?

    Was that the accordion guy clip?

    Yeah, it was Remove Kebab/ Serbia Strong.

    Sounds like Mr. Sailer may not be aware of how big that meme was a few years back, or how important the Serbia thing was in waking a lot of people up. Not necessarily at the time, but in combination with the Iraq invasion.

    Other music on the video:

    british grenadiers march

    Fallschirmjäger Grün ist unser Fallschirm Remix

    Arthur Brown – Fire

    Manuel – Gas Gas Gas

    None of which seems particularly Balkan, to say the least.

    • Replies: @El Dato
    That last one would be something I would play back in my CS days (would you believe I learned about CS via review article in The Economist)

    Today I'm older and more relaxed.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=regl4vTld5E
  177. @Hail

    2063 years ago
     
    Isn't it 44 BC two-thousand and sixty-two (2,062) years ago back from 2019 AD?

    (No Year 0.)

    There are also disagreements in counting somewhere in the Middle Ages IIRC. So let’s apply error bars.

  178. Anon[164] • Disclaimer says:
    @donut
    " the most shameful episode of American history of the past century."

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .

    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty and killed 8x more Americans. I guess you want to bomb the shit out of Lebanin 8x harder or maybe 20x harder because it was more recent , one of your own criteria. But I don’t expect you to live up to your own rules.

    • Replies: @James Forrestal

    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty...
     
    A patch of dirt bombed the US Marines (and the French)? How exactly does that work again?


    Meanwhile, back in the real world:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1983_Beirut_barracks_bombings

    1. "A group called Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the bombings."

    2. "According to Caspar Weinberger, then United States Secretary of Defense, there is no knowledge of who did the bombing."

    3. Why were US troops in Lebanon in the first place?

    Because of the (US-supported) Israeli invasion of Lebanon, of course

    4. US forces were stationed in Lebanon, and involved in active military operations. For example:

    https://www.nytimes.com/1983/09/09/world/us-ships-enter-lebanon-fighting-shelling-hill-site.html


    Compare to the deliberate Israeli sneak attack on USS Liberty.

    1. Israelis were pretending to be our "allies" at the time -- as they continue to do today.

    2. USS Liberty was in international waters at the time of the cowardly sneak attack.

    3. The ship was almost entirely unarmed (just a couple of .50 cals)

    4. The Israeli sneak attack was clearly planned and directed by high levels of the Israeli military/ government.

    http://i66.tinypic.com/28s269w.png


    No comparison.
    , @EldnahYm
    Not comparable. The USS Liberty was a technical research ship in international waters. The Lebanon attack happened against soldiers in Lebanese territory.

    Donut doesn't go far enough. Israel should not have been allowed to exist as a country after USS Liberty.
    , @El Dato, @JMcG
    Interesting. Both the Marine bombing in Lebanon and the attack on the USS Liberty were committed by terrorist organizations, so I see your point.
  179. @LondonBob
    It does sound like he was more influenced by the Pamela Gellers of this world.

    It does sound like he was more influenced by the Pamela Gellers of this world.

    Yeah, that’s one of the more suspicious aspects of it. See also @105

    Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad? The music/meme/8chan background point towards the alt-right but most of his talking points (including the apparent absence of “antisemitism”) seem to come straight from the counter-jihad playbook.

    So — an Australian is:

    >Angry enough about the non-White/ Muslim invasion to gun down 50 hajis, but

    >Completely ignores the Tribe’s role in promoting that invasion. For example:

    https://lukeford.net/blog/?p=82232

    “Isi Leiber is an internationally known Jewish leader and former chairman of the board of directors of the World Jewish Congress and the former leader of the Executive Council of Australian Jewry. He was major proponent of multiculturalism, open borders, and cultural Marxism in Australia. He moved to Israel in 1999 and still advocates multiculturalism for Australia while advocating nationalism and homogeneity in Israel at the same time.”

    https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2012/08/13/the-war-on-white-australia-a-case-study-in-the-culture-of-critique-part-1-of-5/

    “The national editor of the Australian Jewish News, Dan Goldberg proudly acknowledges this, noting that: “In addition to their activism on Aboriginal issues, Jews were instrumental in leading the crusade against the White Australia policy…”

    >The memes and music are largely chan culture (though “Remove Kebab” is kinda stale), but he throws in a lot of (((counterjihad)))-type references — Tours, Vienna, heavy emphasis on Islam vs. Christianity even though not a Christian himself…

    Kinda like Breivik with some added shitposts.

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west. If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK, and there are pozzed European countries with hardly any Jews.
  180. @Hail

    Whites 70% of pop and dropping fast
     
    Actually they are at 60% White as of 2019, with births as of the early 2010s at 50% White. The 60%-White figure is for full-Whites; higher figures include anyone reporting partial White ancestry. 'White,' in our terms, means full-White, which in New Zealand is now at 60%.

    There are certain striking parallels with the much-bigger USA's racial situation, and White share is one of them; see a comment at Anatoly Karlin's thread on the Christchurch attack (currently #72):


    – 2,900,000 Full-Whites of ethnic-Christian origin (of which, NW-European ancestry, esp. British Isles, constitutes a very comfortable majority) [60%]

    – 10,000 Jews? [0.2%] (7,000 specifically answered ‘Jewish’ to religion question on Census 2013)

    – 72,500 Muslims [1.5%] (see above)

    – 675,000 Maori, including mixed Maori-White [14%] (perhaps a third of the aggregate ancestry here is actually European; there are presumably still ~pure Maori but they are likely quite a small share of the overall pop., far below this 14% figure)
     


    – 350,000 Pacific Islander, including mixed White-Pacific [7%] (this population has a substantially lower degree of European admixture than the ‘Maori’ population)

    – 250,000 Chinese [5%]

    – 150,000? non-Chinese, East(ern) Asian [3%] (i.e., those from all points east of Bangladesh in Asia, excluding China)

    – 150,000? Hindus and Sikhs [3%]

    – <25,000 Blacks [0.5%] — Presumably entirely of refugee origin. NZ passed a refugee quota law in 1987 (somewhat restricted in 1997), which also jump-started Muslim growth.

    – 50,000 Other misc. [1%]

    – 200,000+ Mixed race, n.o.c. [4%] (incl. up to 20,000 White-EastAsian mixed-race individuals; White-Asian mixes, both East and South, were at 1.9% in the under-age-5 cohort in 2013 — full-Whites were at 50.3% and Maori and European+Maori were at 20.8% for the under-age-5 cohort.
     


    Comments: For NZ births from March 2008 to March 2013, full-Whites were a narrow majority of just above 50.0%, nearly exactly the same as the USA for the same period. Another coincidence is that U.S. Black and NZ Maori figures are so similar is percentage terms.

    The Muslim figure for NZ and the USA may also be just about the same (1.5%). It’s hard to tell how many Muslims are in the USA because that question has been so politicized for years, with Jewish activists tending to police the question and downplay Muslim numbers to make sure they are below Jewish numbers.
     

    7,000 Jews. Thats not good news. That means that there are 6,999 more Jews than necessary to blame all of the countries problems on !!!!

    • Replies: @Hail
    7,000 people checked off 'Jewish' on the census form (see comment-104 above for summary of the results of NZ Census 2013's religion question).

    I suspect the actual number of ethnic-Jews could be double that, with the remainder answering 'No Religion.' A full 50% of NZers either answered 'No Religion' or refused to answer the religion question.

    It is the "No-Religion Jews" that are most prone to a certain kind of activism.
    , @jbwilson24
    "7,000 Jews. Thats not good news. That means that there are 6,999 more Jews than necessary to blame all of the countries problems on !!!!"

    Ah yes, the old straw man that seeks to absolve Jews of any responsibility or criticism for anything they could possibly ever do. Baruch Goldstein shooting up a mosque? Never happened, you anti-semite.
  181. Anon[164] • Disclaimer says:
    @Tiny Duck
    Still don't believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    Its important not to paint with such broad strokes. 99.9% of white nationalist never commit violence. By lumping all white nationalists together with this guy , we risk rationalizing the moderate white nationalists which are 99.9% of the white nationalist population.

    As bad as this event was , it would be a far worse tragedy to stigmatize innocent, Moderate white nationalists and sacrifice the role they play in a diverse multicultural society.

    • Agree: Anonym
  182. NYU students accused Chelsea Clinton of sparking the terror in NZ by calling Ilhan Omar’s comment on Israel and Jewish money “anti-Semitic”, thereby stoking Islamophobia.

    Couldn’t have happened to a nicer hypocrite.

    • Replies: @Anon
    These students are Islamic supremacists. I do not remember them making vigils for the 30 victims killed in the surabaya church bombings that occured almost 1 year ago.
    , @Pericles
    I couldn't stop smirking for quite a while.
  183. @Dave Pinsen
    It was also sort of an early end to the "end of history" honeymoon of the '90s. It refuted one of Tom Friedman's banalities from only a few years before (if memory serves) that countries with McDonald's franchises don't go to war with each other. The Wall Street Journal had an article about how McDonald's franchises in Serbia were trying to navigate the anti-American sentiment stemming from American bombs falling on the country.

    The McDonald’s Theory was already wrong even when Tom Friedman first stated it in the early 90s. Britain and Argentina, to name an obvious counterexample, both had McDonald’s in 1982 during the Falkland/Malvinas War.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    And arguably Ford factories are more capitalistic and democratizing than a McDonald's, but having a few didn't stop Hitler from declaring war on both Henry Ford's country and ancestral homeland.
  184. You’re a troll but I’ll answer you anyway . If you’re referring to the Marine Barracks bombing in Beirut it was a case of US troops being in a place where we had no national interests and no business being . Once again whose interests were we serving by being there ? Maybe you shouldn’t have brought that example up . Anyway no I wouldn’t have bombed Lebanon for that . Actually now that you mention it we should have bombed Israel in that case too for starting all that shit .

    We should have cut off all aid to Israel after The Lavon affair in 1955 . A plan to discredit Egypt’s government, then headed by Gamal Abdel Nasser, by bombing theaters, post offices and U.S. and British institutions, and making it seem as though Egypt was behind the bombings. The thinking in Israel at the time was that if the British were to give up control of the Suez Canal, it would be left in Egypt’s hands, putting Cairo in a better position to exert pressure on Israel.

    The agents were told “to undermine the West’s trust in the [Egyptian] government by causing public insecurity” while concealing Israel’s role in the sabotage.

    “The foursome — like all the other heroes of ‘the mishap’ — were born and brought up in Egypt, but they never regarded themselves — nor were they ever regarded by others — as Egyptians. . . .They were typical members of Egypt’s Jewish community. . . .It was a community with shallow roots. The Jews reached Egypt during the second half of the nineteenth century or the beginning of the twentieth. . . .[T]hey could not read or write Arabic, and spoke no more of the language than was necessary for the simplest daily needs. . . .All of Egypt’s Jews could have been considered Zionists — or, to be more precise, ‘lovers of Zion.”

    Sound familiar ?

  185. @Anon

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .
     
    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty and killed 8x more Americans. I guess you want to bomb the shit out of Lebanin 8x harder or maybe 20x harder because it was more recent , one of your own criteria. But I don't expect you to live up to your own rules.

    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty…

    A patch of dirt bombed the US Marines (and the French)? How exactly does that work again?

    Meanwhile, back in the real world:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1983_Beirut_barracks_bombings

    1. “A group called Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the bombings.”

    2. “According to Caspar Weinberger, then United States Secretary of Defense, there is no knowledge of who did the bombing.”

    3. Why were US troops in Lebanon in the first place?

    Because of the (US-supported) Israeli invasion of Lebanon, of course

    4. US forces were stationed in Lebanon, and involved in active military operations. For example:

    https://www.nytimes.com/1983/09/09/world/us-ships-enter-lebanon-fighting-shelling-hill-site.html

    Compare to the deliberate Israeli sneak attack on USS Liberty.

    1. Israelis were pretending to be our “allies” at the time — as they continue to do today.

    2. USS Liberty was in international waters at the time of the cowardly sneak attack.

    3. The ship was almost entirely unarmed (just a couple of .50 cals)

    4. The Israeli sneak attack was clearly planned and directed by high levels of the Israeli military/ government.

    No comparison.

    • Agree: ben tillman
    • Replies: @Anon
    Actually the US troops were part of an international peace keeping force.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.

    By comparison the marine barracks bombing was a deliberate act carried out by Lebanon and Iran and the various terror groups that are part and parcel of their government including hezbiola ,Islamic jihad ans others.

    Iran erected a monument to the attackers in Tehran not far from where Iran publicly hanged Mona Mahmudinejad and 19 other female Bahai school teachers ,some as young as teenagers.
  186. @Anon

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .
     
    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty and killed 8x more Americans. I guess you want to bomb the shit out of Lebanin 8x harder or maybe 20x harder because it was more recent , one of your own criteria. But I don't expect you to live up to your own rules.

    Not comparable. The USS Liberty was a technical research ship in international waters. The Lebanon attack happened against soldiers in Lebanese territory.

    Donut doesn’t go far enough. Israel should not have been allowed to exist as a country after USS Liberty.

    • Replies: @Anon

    The Lebanon attack happened against soldiers in Lebanese territory
     
    A suicide bombing on an international peace keeping force. Seems legit !!!!

    Israel should not have been allowed to exist as a country after USS Liberty.
     
    Lmao !!
  187. File under extreme intersectional LULZ and everybody’s racist except me. Also, the solidarity truck will arrive shortly:

    Muslim activist tears into Chelsea Clinton’s ‘caucasity’ at NZ victims’ vigil

    Clinton, apparently taken aback by the accusations flung at her, can be seen apologizing profusely for what she argues was an unintended offense.

    “It certainly was never my intention, I do believe words matter, I believe we have to show solidarity,” Clinton says.

    “This, right here is the result of a massacre stoked by people like you and the words that you put out into the world!” the activist says, adding that she wants Clinton to “feel deep inside” her guilt in what happened to the victims.

    “Forty-nine people are dead because of the rhetoric that you put out there,” she charged.

    A video of the confrontation was posted by a friend of the activist on Twitter, who then deleted the footage and most of her tweets.

    The activist who faced off with Clinton took to Twitter herself, saying that the invitation to the vigil extended to Clinton made her “viscerally angry” and she was not going to apologize for her outburst.

  188. @James Forrestal

    Was that the accordion guy clip?
     
    Yeah, it was Remove Kebab/ Serbia Strong.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocW3fBqPQkU

    Sounds like Mr. Sailer may not be aware of how big that meme was a few years back, or how important the Serbia thing was in waking a lot of people up. Not necessarily at the time, but in combination with the Iraq invasion.

    Other music on the video:

    british grenadiers march

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGrxHO-B2TY

    Fallschirmjäger Grün ist unser Fallschirm Remix

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLXsFqSvy0M

    Arthur Brown - Fire

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZuzZpS8

    Manuel - Gas Gas Gas

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atuFSv2bLa8


    None of which seems particularly Balkan, to say the least.

    That last one would be something I would play back in my CS days (would you believe I learned about CS via review article in The Economist)

    Today I’m older and more relaxed.

  189. @Peripatetic Commenter

    Another name marked on the weaponry was Novak Vujosevic, who fought on the Montenegrin side in the Battle of Fundina against the Ottoman Empire’s forces.
     
    Truly, genetics are powerful, as those people are still fighting the Ottoman Empire.

    Secondly, that is why accepting people from vastly different cultures (which usually means races) is such a stupid thing because:

    A. You don't know what stupid genes they may be bringing into your country, and

    B. You don't know what past wars and enmities they are bringing into your country.

    Yeah. Just the other day I saw a Hindu store owner get into it with his Pakistani vendor. I said “ain’t diversity great”; and I thought they were going to turn on me. Nothing unites the diverse like the anglo.

  190. @J.Ross
    "The American Right" manages to be less helpful, honest or descriptive than "the Jews" or "old money" here; are you talking about Dennis Hastert, Tom DeLay, Strom Thurmond, House Bush, and sundry other people who today would be voting to reject the border emergency?

    Bob Dole always had very close ties to Albanian lobbyists. John McCain (of course!) was also big on bombing Serbs. Neocons too. “Moderate” Internationalist Republicans were generally in favour of NATO action as well. So basically the “Right” American voters preferred to anti-war Buchanan and libertarians.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    lmfao. Albania has lobbyists ?
  191. @Anon

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .
     
    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty and killed 8x more Americans. I guess you want to bomb the shit out of Lebanin 8x harder or maybe 20x harder because it was more recent , one of your own criteria. But I don't expect you to live up to your own rules.
  192. @22pp22
    Really. I live in a small South Island town and am related by marriage to half the population. I hadn't noticed the problems you mention, and I rent out houses to the indigent.

    Are you talking about Aramoana. That happened in 1979. The overall murder rate is low.

    Drunkenness and foul language are the big problems. Up north they have alot of gangs, but I never come into contact with the Mongel Mob.

    Can’t say that I was ever much concerned with crime, other than a very few spots in Auckland. One must keep some perspective; I had, after all, been living in New Orleans. That said, the nature and extent of the alcohol abuse were unexpected.

    Having never managed in my nearly 40 years of seafaring to return to NZ following the five weeks I spent tramping about there, mainly on the South Island, way back in ’81, I have to confess to being shocked at your transition. Certainly not the country I remember, where I am convinced that I laid eyes upon less than a handful of non-Pakeha/Maori faces. How the decades have changed us all…

    Somewhere down south I dropped my wallet, and upon my return to the USA was utterly unsurprised to find my wallet had been mailed to me intact, NZ bills exchanged for US ones. Would this be as likely to happen today?

    Pan Am thoughtfully neglected to load my backpack, so I got to spend a week in Auckland on their dime, while my pack made first westward, then eastward circumnavigations, and I was there treated to the Springbok rugby kerfuffle. Having nought to do but check in occasionally with Pan Am, I had an abundance of time to indulge my avocation of flaneur. While I can claim but few natural talents, a keen nose for finding trouble is one, so I soon enough was amongst the melee, involuntarily, and in the company of some epically Pythonesque lefties. Now, I have known some American lefties, but let me say that your lot put them to shame then, and I suspect, now. It’s not really surprising that our countries have ended up on similar paths, though your politicians are certainly having to work way harder, lacking a porous land border with the third world.

    Earlier today I stumbled across a photo I shot from Mackinnon Pass, and could not help but remember what a treasure is your South Island. Now trouble has come to Paradise. You have my deepest sympathy.

  193. @Bill B.
    Years ago one or two people here (perhaps in Steve's pre-Unz days) recommended in the comments books on the history and breakup of Yugoslavia from a not-the-usual-narrative point of view.

    IIRC the books were touted as being "fair" but somewhat sympathetic to the Serb side.

    Can anyone name these books?

    (A search of iSteve pulls down too many references.)

    IIRC correctly ‘Unholy Terror’ by John R Schindler was pretty good.

    • Replies: @Bill B.

    IIRC correctly ‘Unholy Terror’ by John R Schindler was pretty good.
     
    Thanks. It looks promising; the reviews on Amazon are good too.
  194. The neoliberal world order shows itself yet again unable to deal with or address what happens when you engage in “invade the world invite the world”.

    Instead, doubling down on shaming language and using the tools of the state to enforce good think is all they have, and look how well its working out.

    You throw people in prison for protesting their government inviting aliens into their neighborhood and what did you think was going to happen?

  195. 20th anniversary of the signing of the Rambouillet Agreement on March 18, 1999

    Speaking about the Rambouillet Agreement it is always good to keep this in mind.

    The Europeans, earnestly, sought an agreement that both sides could accept. But they also agreed with the Americans that any peace agreement would have to be enforced by an international military presence.

    The leading allies were agreed that this force would have to be a Nato force. None wanted to repeat the very bruising experience of the UN Protection Force (Unprofor) in neighbouring Bosnia during the 1990s.

    The Americans knew that because it had to be Nato, the chances of the Serbs accepting the deal were very small. They had a second acceptable outcome in mind.

    “That meant the Serbs rejecting the plan and the Albanians accepting it,” Assistant Secretary of State Jamie Rubin told me.

    Then, he added, there would be clarity where previously there had been confusion, clarity as to who was to blame, as to who Nato should oppose and who Nato should support.

    It took weeks, but the US finally persuaded the Albanians to accept the plan. The Serbs rejected it. The European allies found themselves committed to the use of force against a sovereign European state.

    So in other words the Americans, who were supposed to be an honest broker, actually helped broker a plan no one wanted, but told the Albanians to accept it because once the Serbs rejected it, the Serbs would be the bad guys. This is like bidding on a government contract where the government gives all the inside info to one party trying to ensure that party wins the contract.

    • Replies: @Pericles

    This is like bidding on a government contract where the government gives all the inside info to one party trying to ensure that party wins the contract.

     

    Even more so because the party supported are muslims.
    , @Anonymous

    So in other words the Americans, who were supposed to be an honest broker, actually helped broker a plan no one wanted, but told the Albanians to accept it because once the Serbs rejected it, the Serbs would be the bad guys. This is like bidding on a government contract where the government gives all the inside info to one party trying to ensure that party wins the contract.
     
    Probably a similar dynamic was at play when the Clinton Administration made a show of "trying" to broker a peace agreement between Israel and the Palestinians.
  196. @Lugash
    IIRC correctly 'Unholy Terror' by John R Schindler was pretty good.

    IIRC correctly ‘Unholy Terror’ by John R Schindler was pretty good.

    Thanks. It looks promising; the reviews on Amazon are good too.

  197. @Dtbb
    Where can the video be seen?

    The torrent hash-ID
    E0511A1ACE47AEE00082ADD078A60630B7D3691A
    is your friend.

  198. The bombing of Serbia was led by the neocons. Neocons only care about Israel. Turkey before the rise of Erdogan was a close ally of Israel and the US. Turkey and Albanians have cultural and religious ties. The neocons were defending Israeli interests by using American military power to protects Turkish interests in Kosovo. The interesting question is if the same circumstances occurred today would Nato bomb Serbia. My educated guess is no. Turkey pursues an independent foreign policy under Erdogan. It refuses to kowtow to Israel and the US.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    The importance of Turkey in regards to US intervention in the Balkans is usually not acknowledged.
  199. @Hapalong Cassidy
    Christchurch is definitely a hard-luck town, what with the earthquake and now this shooting. And at least for me, the only place Christchurch previously occupied in my awareness was through pop culture, specifically Peter Jackson’s “Heavenly Creatures”, which dealt with the true life story of two Christchurch teenage girls who bludgeoned one of their mothers to death with a rock. One of those girls ended up being a successful writer later in life (the one played by a pre-Titanic Kate Winslett in the film).

    Christchurch is probably going to be one of those places where things tend to happen, despite being otherwise completely unremarkable. It has that feel about it. I drank 9 jugs of beer at the Carlton pub there in 1989, and I’ve never come close to that since. That’s got to tell you something.

    Karl Popper wrote ‘The Open Society and its Enemies’ in Christchurch where he was excited during the war. I believe he was pretty bored.

    • Replies: @Bill B.

    Karl Popper wrote ‘The Open Society and its Enemies’ in Christchurch where he was excited during the war. I believe he was pretty bored.
     
    Popper's epic misreading of nationalism might be one of the sources of our present misunderstandings and problems. Can that be blamed partly on Christchurch?

    Soros is often touted as some kind of evil genius stirring up a wizard's poison for the West yet he appears to have merely lifted his ideas from Popper (which he admits).

    “Nation-states do not exist, simply because the so-called 'nations'' or 'peoples' of which the nationalists dream do not exist. There are no, or hardly any, homogenous ethnic groups long settled in countries with natural borders. Ethnic and linguistic groups (dialects often amount to linguistic barriers) are closely intermingled everywhere. Masaryk's Czechoslovakia was founded upon the principle of national self-determination. But as soon as it was founded, the Slovaks demanded, in the name of this principle, to be free from Czech domination; and ultimately it was destroyed by its German minority, in the name of the same principle. Similar situations have arisen in practically every case in which the principle of national self-determination has been applied to fixing the borders of a new state: in Ireland, in India, in Israel, in Yugoslavia. There are ethnic minorities everywhere. The proper aim cannot be to 'liberate' all of them; rather, it must be to protect all of them. The oppression of national groups is a great evil; but national selfdetermination is not a feasible remedy. Moreover, Britain, the United States, Canada, and Switzerland, are four obvious examples of states which in many ways violate the nationality principle. Instead of having its borders determined by one settled group, each of them has managed to unite a variety of ethnic groups. So the problem does not seem insoluble.
    Yet, in the face of all these obvious facts, the principle of national self-determination continues to be widely accepted as an article of our moral faith; and it is rarely challenged outright. A Cypriot appealed recently, in a letter to The Times, to this principle. He described it as a universally accepted principle of morality. The defenders of this principle, he proudly claimed, were defending the sacred human values and the natural rights of man (apparently even when terrorizing their own dissenting countrymen). The fact that this letter did not mention the ethnic minority of Cyprus; the fact that it was printed; and the fact that its moral doctrines remained completely unanswered in a long sequence of letters on this subject, all go a long way towards proving my first thesis. Indeed, it seems to me certain that more people are killed out of righteous stupidity than out of wickedness.”
    Karl Popper, 'The History of Our Time: An Optimist's View' (1956), can be found in 'Conjectures and Refutations'.
     
  200. During the bombing of Serbia there were a lot of horror stories about the Serbs being used to justify the bombings. On April 21, 1999, then Secretary of State Albright testified before Congress and stated the following which is now archived at the US Secretary of State’s website:

    Many of the refugees streaming out of Kosovo have reported Serb war crimes and crimes against humanity. These reported abuses include the widespread and systematic destruction of entire settlements, the burning of homes, the seizure of civilians for use as human shields and human blood banks, the rape of ethnic Albanian women and girls, and the systematic separation and execution of military-aged men.

    Serbs using people as ‘human blood banks’ is a nice touch. I suppose it was to elicit images of Count Dracula.

    • Replies: @El Dato

    Serbs using people as ‘human blood banks’ is a nice touch. I suppose it was to elicit images of Count Dracula.
     
    "It is difficult to have negotiations with people who are prone to confuse Serbia and Romania"

    Interestingly, the allegation that organ theft is rife in Kosovo hasn't stopped.
  201. @Peripatetic Commenter
    And in one masterful stroke New Zealand jumps to the head of the list of mass shootings per capita!

    We are masters of per capita tables.

  202. @Jus' Sayin'...
    I also began questioning US policy about that time. However, it wasn't until the US abetted ethnic cleansing of Serbs in Kosovo and its transformation into a rump, narco-terrorist state in the "soft underbelly of Europe" that I started my pilgrimage to wokeness.

    After the bombing, which was supposed to prevent ethnic cleansing stopped, NATO sat back and watched the Albanians ethnically cleanse Serbs and other enthnicities from Kosovo and did nothing. I can’t find it now, but there was an article in the BBC which quoted some NATO official as being disappointed at this new ethnic cleansing, but in the end he was resigned to accept it because once it was completed, there would no longer be any problems of ethnic strife.

  203. @anon1
    Now would be the time to change or end immigration.

    “Now would be the time to change or end immigration”

    Good idea but our rulers have deemed that the population has to/will continue to expand due to financial reasons.

    If White people will not expand the population then the people from Asia/Africa will have to be brought in to continue that expansion.

    Apparently only White people got the memo about overpopulation.

  204. @Anon
    NYU students accused Chelsea Clinton of sparking the terror in NZ by calling Ilhan Omar's comment on Israel and Jewish money "anti-Semitic", thereby stoking Islamophobia.

    Couldn't have happened to a nicer hypocrite.

    These students are Islamic supremacists. I do not remember them making vigils for the 30 victims killed in the surabaya church bombings that occured almost 1 year ago.

  205. @Broadsman
    When the Balkans problems were ongoing my primary news source was NPR. I grew dismayed with the emotional dribble coming over that source as there was no rhyme or reason shared, no background, no connection made with US interests.

    Consequently, to this day I understand very little of what happened there.

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?

    Assuming, hard, that’s the question asked in good faith, my 2 cents:
    There is NO such book.

    I’d go a big step further: there is NO single truth about all that.

    Each ethnic group there has its own perception or reality and, consequently, the Truth.
    Each of them.

    You can spend a week with top thinkers from each group and walk from that experience more confused than before. Probably bordering, or …hehe…even over it…crazy.

    Or…perhaps…it’s not so hard to understand.
    A small piece of land contested by several groups for centuries. “We want to live here”.
    All the rest is the result of it.

  206. Anon[164] • Disclaimer says:
    @James Forrestal

    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty...
     
    A patch of dirt bombed the US Marines (and the French)? How exactly does that work again?


    Meanwhile, back in the real world:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1983_Beirut_barracks_bombings

    1. "A group called Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the bombings."

    2. "According to Caspar Weinberger, then United States Secretary of Defense, there is no knowledge of who did the bombing."

    3. Why were US troops in Lebanon in the first place?

    Because of the (US-supported) Israeli invasion of Lebanon, of course

    4. US forces were stationed in Lebanon, and involved in active military operations. For example:

    https://www.nytimes.com/1983/09/09/world/us-ships-enter-lebanon-fighting-shelling-hill-site.html


    Compare to the deliberate Israeli sneak attack on USS Liberty.

    1. Israelis were pretending to be our "allies" at the time -- as they continue to do today.

    2. USS Liberty was in international waters at the time of the cowardly sneak attack.

    3. The ship was almost entirely unarmed (just a couple of .50 cals)

    4. The Israeli sneak attack was clearly planned and directed by high levels of the Israeli military/ government.

    http://i66.tinypic.com/28s269w.png


    No comparison.

    Actually the US troops were part of an international peace keeping force.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.

    By comparison the marine barracks bombing was a deliberate act carried out by Lebanon and Iran and the various terror groups that are part and parcel of their government including hezbiola ,Islamic jihad ans others.

    Iran erected a monument to the attackers in Tehran not far from where Iran publicly hanged Mona Mahmudinejad and 19 other female Bahai school teachers ,some as young as teenagers.

    • Replies: @JerseyJeffersonian
    No, the bombing of the U.S.S. Liberty was no accident, rather a deliberate act. I regularly follow Col. (Ret.) Lang's blog, and from what he has said (he was very high in the DIA with primary responsibility in southwest asia at the time, and was cleared to, and did, study all of the radio intercepts surrounding that incident, including those of our bestest little pals, the Israelis), it was clearly a deliberate, prolonged, and murderous attack, even including machine gunning of the crew members trying to abandon ship. Admiral McCain (John's father) twice was preparing a launch of warplanes from the carrier under his command in the eastern Mediterranean to defend the Liberty, and was twice told to stand down while crew members were being murdered. This was an obviously politically-motivated decision from the SecDef and/or President. Just as obvious was the concerted coverup; a proper investigation was thwarted by political intervention.

    So yeah, peddle that crap somewhere else.

    The bombing of the Marine base (and unmentioned, the French base, too) was during the much later Lebanese conflict, and had nothing to do with the bombing of the U.S.S. Liberty. We should not have been there at all, but once we were, we had done our level best to antagonize the Shia, even lobbing shells into the hills above Beirut where they lived from the U.S.S. New Jersey stationed off the Lebanese coast.

    So, asymmetrical warfare, it's a thing. The ones to blame for this carnage were our brainless, neocon leaders. Why should the Shia have put up with this aggression in support of Israel, and not attacked those who were attacking them?

    Hizbullah has defended Lebanon against outside aggression, whether from the West, or from Israel. They kicked Israel's quisling South Lebanon Army to the curb, and then when the Israelis tried invasion, they shot them to pieces. Of course, the Israelis' "moral army" then petulantly bombed the infrastructure of Lebanon for this temerity, and dropped submunition bomblets all over to deny the Lebanese access to their own country, not incidentally killing civilians in the aftermath.

    Hasbara fail.
    , @captflee
    In what universe does the US and Israeli governments agreeing on a story mean the story is true?
    , @Mr. Anon

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.
     
    No, not at all. The American government - under Lyndon Johnson, as directed by Johnson, and to the degree that Johnson directed them - "agreed" that it was an accident. Plenty of Americans, including senior military and intelligence officers and members of Johnson's own cabinet, thought it was not merely "an accident".
    , @El Dato

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.
     
    And Ghadaffi did Pan Am Flight 103, upon which everyone agrees, even the BBC.

    Iran erected a monument to the attackers in Tehran not far from where Iran publicly hanged Mona Mahmudinejad and 19 other female Bahai school teachers ,some as young as teenagers.
     
    This one?

    A hardline Iranian group on Thursday [Dec 2, 2004] unveiled a monument at Tehran's main cemetery in memory of the "martyrs" who carried out the 1983 bombing of a US marine barracks in Beirut that killed 241 troops.

     

    "Hardline Iranian group" is not "Iran" and "not far from" something completely does not increase my belief that Iran is Teh Evil all that much.

    Anyway:

    https://www.unz.com/nfinkelstein/to-live-or-to-perish/


    North: What do you think happened to the USS Liberty?

    I corresponded with one of the surviving crew members, James Ennis, who wrote a book on the attack indicting Israel. His account was totally credible.

    For example, a 5-by-8-foot American flag hoisted on the Liberty was fluttering in the wind on a crystalline summer day. Ennis recalled that before the assault an Israeli pilot overhead was flying so low they even waved to each other. So how could Israeli pilots have missed the flag?

    It’s ingenious—or hilarious—how Oren explains away this inconvenient fact. He says, “But Israeli pilots were not looking for the Liberty, but rather for Egyptian submarines.” In other words, the pilots didn’t see what was staring them in the face above the water because they were in search of a vessel beneath the water. This explanation must have deeply impressed the Los Angeles Times, which awarded him the newspaper’s annual book prize in history.

    North: The reason for the attack?

    None of the standard explanations hold up. I have my own hunch but I readily admit it’s highly speculative and unorthodox.

    Weiss: The conventional theory is the Liberty had radio surveillance and knocking out the Liberty allowed Israel to continue the war another two days.

    It’s alleged that the Liberty had gotten wind of the fact that Israel was going to seize the Golan, so Israel attacked it. But this theory doesn’t hold up on close inspection.

    My own hypothesis is, this is Israel’s big moment, the climactic of the Jewish people, a collective paroxysm-cum-orgasm. All the armed services want to get a piece of the action. The air force, the army, the navy.

    The navy hadn’t yet seen real combat. As the war was winding down, they were probably anxious to be part of this glorious chapter. To play their part in the Jewish people’s revenge on the goyim.

    Remember, the Israelis don’t just hate Arabs. They’re in an eternal war with all the goyim. All the goyim wanted the Jews dead. Just read Daniel Goldhagen if you have any doubts. The Americans are goyim. They refused entry to Jews fleeing the Holocaust; they didn’t bomb the railway tracks to Auschwitz; they, too, wanted all the Jews dead. Now they’re butting into our war, dispatching a spy ship into our waters, trying to restrain us in our moment of glory. Fuck the Americans! Fuck the goyim! Long live the Jews!

    Besides the Israeli air assault on the USS Liberty, the Israeli navy torpedoed the vessel. It got to share in the mock heroics and avenge the millennial suffering of the Jews. Everyone got their 15 minutes of drawing blood, in memoriam of the Jewish martyrs.

    I am the first to admit gaps in my hypothesis but it probably gets closer to the truth than positing a rational motive.
     
    , @ben tillman

    Actually the US troops were part of an international peace keeping force.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.
     
    Any American who believes that believes it because he was lied to.
  207. @For what it's worth
    Just give me the elevator story, and I mean the 30-second version, in which you directly answer this question:

    Did Serb militias shoot to death a large number (1,000+) disarmed Bosnian men and boys who were in their custody and who would, under international law, be designated as prisoners?

    Yes, or No.

    If I may:
    “Yes”.

    Caveat: “boys”.
    Anyone over 13, then and there, was a fair game.
    A 13 years old boy can hold an AK-47.

    The region has a culture of “boy soldiers”.
    If confused, please read up about Khmer Rouges and various African militias.

  208. @EldnahYm
    Not comparable. The USS Liberty was a technical research ship in international waters. The Lebanon attack happened against soldiers in Lebanese territory.

    Donut doesn't go far enough. Israel should not have been allowed to exist as a country after USS Liberty.

    The Lebanon attack happened against soldiers in Lebanese territory

    A suicide bombing on an international peace keeping force. Seems legit !!!!

    Israel should not have been allowed to exist as a country after USS Liberty.

    Lmao !!

  209. Liberal loon prime minister of New Zealand is going around wearing a hijib in the wake of the shooting. Good lord, she really knows how to overdo things.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-asia-47592358/new-zealand-pm-we-are-united-in-our-grief

    • Replies: @anon
    She's doing what she's told.
    Soon, the message will be: We can't give in to the Terrorists. Terrorists in this case meaning anyone daring to question Immigration.
    That will be her excuse to open the Immigration floodgates in New Zealand.
    , @Cowboy shaw
    There are scarcely words to describe how idiotic she is. She makes Justin Trudeau look smart. It's a very odd set of political accidents that put her in the job, but it amounts to one of the strangest experiments in leadership in human history.

    Incidentally the local rugby team in Christchurch, the most succesful on the planet for the past couple of decades, is called the Crusaders. Inevitably there are now calls to change the name.
    , @El Dato
    She looks like she's suffering, Samantha Power style.
  210. @istevefan
    During the bombing of Serbia there were a lot of horror stories about the Serbs being used to justify the bombings. On April 21, 1999, then Secretary of State Albright testified before Congress and stated the following which is now archived at the US Secretary of State's website:

    Many of the refugees streaming out of Kosovo have reported Serb war crimes and crimes against humanity. These reported abuses include the widespread and systematic destruction of entire settlements, the burning of homes, the seizure of civilians for use as human shields and human blood banks, the rape of ethnic Albanian women and girls, and the systematic separation and execution of military-aged men.
     
    Serbs using people as 'human blood banks' is a nice touch. I suppose it was to elicit images of Count Dracula.

    Serbs using people as ‘human blood banks’ is a nice touch. I suppose it was to elicit images of Count Dracula.

    “It is difficult to have negotiations with people who are prone to confuse Serbia and Romania”

    Interestingly, the allegation that organ theft is rife in Kosovo hasn’t stopped.

  211. Anonymous[337] • Disclaimer says:
    @22pp22
    I live in NZ. The country is in a state of shock with people saying: "This sort of thing isn't supposed to happen in New Zealand."

    Friggin Zealots….

  212. Anonymous[337] • Disclaimer says:
    @Matra
    Bob Dole always had very close ties to Albanian lobbyists. John McCain (of course!) was also big on bombing Serbs. Neocons too. "Moderate" Internationalist Republicans were generally in favour of NATO action as well. So basically the "Right" American voters preferred to anti-war Buchanan and libertarians.

    lmfao. Albania has lobbyists ?

  213. @Tiny Duck
    Still don't believe we need hate speech laws?

    This monster was inspired by white supremacist rhetoric like this site

    Blood is on your hands

    Read Adam Serwer

    Blood is on your hands

    Wear gloves. Safety first!

  214. @El Dato
    I liked:

    First Do No Harm: Humanitarian Intervention and the Destruction of Yugoslavia

    That war was too confusing for those times. I tried to keep track from what was being said in normie (incl. Der Economist) and commie newspapers and on normie TV but it was all too confusing and dragged on for years with various provocations and atrocities and false flags and Miss Clinton and military medal hounds and faggot Netherlands UN troops looking like hippies in uniforms. In the end I was convinced intervention was required. A mistake.

    Thanks. I will read it.

    I had no smart insights at the time. I had trouble working out who the good guys were I remember.

    One thing I did recognize was that Yugoslavia was a viper’s nest. Later, idiotically, I half-heartedly supported going into Iraq, but I again wondered who would want to jump into that such messy situation.

    I have, at least for the last couple of decades, had trouble understanding where the confidence of our leaders comes from strolling, so to speak, into extraordinarily tense and ugly bars in very dark and strange parts of town expecting to be welcomed and praised. And thinking they knew what was going on.

  215. As someone who has lived in Christchurch, it doesn’t surprise me this mosque has been singled out for attack by a white with traditionalist or nationalist views. The city is still recovering from a big earthquake back in 2011, and its iconic Anglican cathedral is still in ruins (probably never to be re-built). Meanwhile you have this large mosque with a big gold dome plonked close to the city centre (no doubt built in part with Saudi money). To a traditionalist or nationalist it’s a powerful visual illustration of white western decline.

    Christchurch is also a bit of a white flight town for whites who have left expensive, multi-cultural Auckland, and sometimes gets knocked by snobbish liberal journalists for attracting “trashy” whites.

    What does surprise me is the nature of the attack. I wouldn’t have been surprised by a fire bombing or other symbolic action, but not a mass killing on this scale.

  216. @EldnahYm
    The Kurds fought on both sides of the Iran Iraq War, ethnically cleansed and massacred Assyrians who had more right to territory than they did, and have been a pain in the neck to every other people in the Middle East. Atrocities against them were predictable and not something any other capable authoritarian in that region wouldn't have done. We weren't on the right side, we shouldn't have even been fighting in the Middle East.

    In Iraq we caused more trouble in the area that existed previously, and neither the people we opposed there or the people were supported were any good.

    It’s almost a law that “our guys” are reliably worthless because we start with our ability to control them (which we never secure anyway).

  217. @For what it's worth
    Just give me the elevator story, and I mean the 30-second version, in which you directly answer this question:

    Did Serb militias shoot to death a large number (1,000+) disarmed Bosnian men and boys who were in their custody and who would, under international law, be designated as prisoners?

    Yes, or No.

    No. Are you talking about the “mass graves” that totally contradicted NATO’s claims?
    Protip: when a Musim speaks to a sub-Muslim, especially about a claimed grievance, he’s not trying to communicate, he’s trying to manipulate. You don’t lay out facts to a horse, you bark at it to carry you faster.

  218. @Broadsman
    When the Balkans problems were ongoing my primary news source was NPR. I grew dismayed with the emotional dribble coming over that source as there was no rhyme or reason shared, no background, no connection made with US interests.

    Consequently, to this day I understand very little of what happened there.

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?

    Can any one recommend a solid history book to explain the fall of Yugoslavia, the aftermath, and the deep background?

    no but iirc the gist was Serbia was the biggest part of Yugoslavia so Tito redrew the internal borders to equalize things which meant chunks of Serbia were attached to the other regions.

    when Yugoslavia broke up that led to civil war and ethnic cleansing over where the borders should be.

    this could have been sorted out by some international agreement but neocons wanted to blame it all on the Serbs for reasons connected with the middle east – attacking the Serbs was basically a PR stunt to try and appease the muslim world over US bases in Saudi Arabia

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_withdrawal_from_Saudi_Arabia

  219. @Kevin O'Keeffe

    Funny how little gratitude our support for the Muslim side in the Kosovo War bought us.
     
    I'm not sure whether you recall this, but "Muslim gratitude", in order to to secure a Palestinian peace deal, was part of the Clinton administration's (absurd) justification for the series of U.S./NATO war crimes commonly referenced as "the Kosovo War".

    That was a smoke screen; the US couldn’t give a flying fuck about the Palestinians. So what were the genuine motivations?

    The outcome of the war ended with the creation of the enormous, and strategically significant military base, Camp Bondsteel (the southern pincher in the ongoing encirclement of the western border of the Russians and their formerly-Soviet allies), the humiliation of a potential Russian ally in Serbia (never stop kicking them when they are down…yet, ironically, even drunkard Yeltsin authorized [or at least didn’t stand in the way of] an operation to seize a strategic airfield and snatch it away from hubristic Gen. Clark, and this incident may also have been the final, eye-opening insult that led to the concerted Russian effort to rise again from their low point), and with cowing our European poodles still further into submission to neocon policy goals.

    Not to be forgotten, many of the neocon driving forces were Jews happy to give Russia a poke in the eye following the logic that Orthodox Christian Serbs = Russians = Cossacks, so while the policy apparatus was in their hands, it was time to strike their traditional enemy. This, coupled with the largely Jewish looting of Russia during Yeltsin’s misrule, had to be a galvanizing moment that informed their national policies, domestic and foreign. But then, history has made them take the long view, and in consequence they never give up.

    A side point: in relation to the bombing of the Chinese embassy, I have always suspected that this was in retaliation for Chinese military/intelligence passing along useful information to the Serbs during the NATO bombing. This may have led to the Serbian shoot down of the F-117, and perhaps to the Serbs passing wreckage to the Chinese for reverse engineering. Pissed the US off, leading to the transparently false story about misidentification of the embassy leading to the bombing.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    I found accounts of the dismantling of the downed Stealth Fighter by local farmers. It appears that it didn't occur to anybody on the spot in the first 24 hours to try to sell it to the Russians or Chinese, so it got chopped up into souvenir sized pieces.

    Also, it had been 19 years since the US revealed the existence of stealth technology, so it wasn't that cutting edge anymore.

  220. @Ali Choudhury
    Well, it was somewhat overshadowed by the invasion of Iraq four years later.

    Cool.

    Trying to remember what international incidents involving Muslims and the West happened between the Kosovo War (1999) and the Iraq Invasion (2003). Can’t think of any.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    That's Ali, he's like Art Deco at his worst but without Art's relevant knowledge: always letter perfect in fact and Learian nonsense in point.
  221. @Hail

    NZ is much further down the road to de-christianization
     
    NZ 2013 Census, religion question:

    4,242,048 : Total people counted by Census, March 2013

    1,805,349 : Christian [42.6%]
    -- 1,272,519 : Protestant [30.0%]
    -- 492,105 : Catholic [11.6%]
    -- 40,725 : Mormon [1.0%]

    53,628 : Maori religions (Ratana & Ringatu) [1.3%], or one-in-ten people who claim Maori racial identity

    253,869: 'Immigrant' religions, total [6.0%]
    -- 89,919 : Hindu [2.1%]
    -- 19,191 : Sikh [0.5%]
    -- 58,407 : Buddhist [1.4%]
    -- 46,146 : Islam/Muslim [1.1%] -- See here for discussion on the likely number of Muslims in New Zealand as of 2019 (currently comment-70): Perhaps 75,000.
    -- 6,867 : Judaism [0.2%]
    -- 33,339 : Specific other religion [0.8%]

    1,635,348 : Answering "No Religion" [38.6%]
    520,335 : Object to answering, don't know, religion unidentifiable, response outside scope, and not stated [12.3%]

    Hail,

    I am not trying to minimize the situation in New Zealand, only to point out the absurdity of what has happened to the USA. Your stats on NZ show that Whites have fallen to 60%. But flipping NZ was not a giant task given that it’s population was under 5 million. Their population was probably around 3 million during WW2. So a nation that small can be demographically flipped with not much effort.

    The fact that the USA is in the same boat as NZ is what should boggle the mind. Instead of flipping 3 to 4 million Whites into minority status, post 1965 they have flipped a then-nation of 200 million, of which about 175 million were White, into one that when it hits 360 million in a 15 or 20 years will be about 50% White. How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe? In fact at the time only China, India and the USSR had more people than the USA. And probably no nations up to that point in time other than China, India and the USSR ever had more people than 1965 USA.

    Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact."

    OR, most Americans, of their own free will, believe that there has been no "invasion", but rather a cycle of our history by which "newcomers" enter and assimilate, albeit with much kicking and screaming.

    Remember, the true "Heritage Americans"--WASPs--were noticeably upset when hordes of Eastern and Southern Europeans entered our shores with their alien customs. It made little difference to WASPS that Italians, Poles, and Slavs were European; it made all of the difference that these groups would pollute the gene pool.

    The bottom line is some deranged man engaged in horrific violence and he ought to be condemned for it. That incidence should be reviled, not celebrated (not saying you specifically are jumping up and down in joy).

    Of course, for some of the fine posters here who are armchair warriors, there is a hidden jealousy here, as they secretly wish they were that man who had the gumption and guile to pull off a St. Breivik.

    , @Hail

    How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe?
     
    I think there are several answers to this question, several of which New Zealand and the USA have in common. To highlight one set of them:

    Low population densities. (The legacy of) empty land ripe for settlement. Cultural-historical narratives based in frontier-settler psychology.

    As 'facts on the ground,' all the above kind of trailed off by the end of the 19th century (not sure when NZ was "fully settled," but that applies to the USA). The psychology has remained, and long past its usefulness-expiration-date. In our case in the USA, when (e.g.) Blacks moved up from the Deep South to northern urban areas in the late 1910s to 1950s, local Whites could much more easily just move on. There was always a place to 'flee' to, both psychologically and physically (due to low pop. densities).

    You are, of course, right that New Zealand is much smaller in scale, and the equivalent of a mere few hundred extended families from Bangladesh and Pakistan would already register on the demographic radar in New Zealand. Even so, regarding the failure to launch morally-serious immigration restriction programs ala Hungary (or Steve Sailer's favorite, Denmark) once it started to become clear the situation was getting out of hand, there might be a great deal of overlap with our case given comparable settler-frontier psychologies.

    Now, that is admittedly not the whole story. It cannot, e.g., explain the immigration problems in Western Europe at all. There are definitely certain USA-specific reasons why we were 'targeted,' no doubt about it. To some extent, the little-guys like New Zealand (and the medium-sized guy, Australia) kind of had to follow suit once the USA turned in that direction, as did Western Europe. We're all in it together, really.

    Some anti-US Europeans have been known to blame the USA's influence for their own nascent immigration-fueled domestic "race problems." To some extent, they are probably right. (Just don't blame Middle America White-Christians. It really wasn't us.)

    _______________

    Bing tells me that New Zealand's pop. density is half the USA's; an impressive 30% of land in New Zealand is protected and not for settlement, vs. 14% in the USA.)

    New Zealand, land area -- 101,000 sq. mi. (slightly smaller than Colorado)
    New Zealand, population -- 4,850,000 (est.) -- official numbers out in April 2019
    New Zealand, pop. density: 48 people/sq. mi. (68/sq. mi. if excluding protected areas)

    USA Lower 48, land area -- 2,959,000 sq. mi.
    USA Lower 48, population -- 325,000,000?
    USA, pop. density: 110 people/sq. mi.

  222. @Wilkey
    Cool.

    Trying to remember what international incidents involving Muslims and the West happened between the Kosovo War (1999) and the Iraq Invasion (2003). Can't think of any.

    That’s Ali, he’s like Art Deco at his worst but without Art’s relevant knowledge: always letter perfect in fact and Learian nonsense in point.

  223. @Anonymous
    Watching the MSM reaction to the Christchurch Massacre is like watching the Bizarro-World reaction to Islamic Massacres.

    1) As soon as it happened everyone started calling the perpetrator a terrorist, which was 100% accurate given his elaborate streaming setup. But a Muslim can hack people to death while shouting Allahu Ackbar and we really need to wait until all the facts are in, preferably until people forget about it.

    2) Muslim terrorists are lone wolves who have noting to do with Islam but any time a white(or even partly-white guy) engages in terrorist behaviour, it's part of a worldwide movement that somehow combines Islamophobes, White Nationalists, incels and 4chan, no matter how tenuous the links are.

    In fact, many Islamic terrorists in the west are the exact equivalent of Breivik and apparently this guy-people who got all their ideas from a specific messed-up corner of the internet but never attended a training camp of any kind or are part of a large network of co-conspirators.

    3) MSM gatekeepers are doing their best not to give viewers any information that might cast Islam in a negative light. During a Canadian round-table on the CBC, the talking heads pointed out the unmistakable reference to Alexandre Bissionette on the terrorist's gun case, while leaving viewers to wonder what "For Rotherham" meant.

    Muslim terrorists are lone wolves who have noting to do with Islam but any time a white(or even partly-white guy) engages in terrorist behaviour, it’s part of a worldwide movement that somehow combines Islamophobes, White Nationalists, incels and 4chan, no matter how tenuous the links are.

    Which of course is bullshit, as everyone knows. Islamic terrorists often have little difficulty finding collaborators, or at least people who will keep their mouths shut. Hell, the San Bernardino attack involved a man and his wife. Omar Mateen’s wife may have known about his plans but did nothing to try to stop him. The November 2015 Paris attacks involved at least 9 terrorists. The 9/11 attacks included at least 20 terrorists just in the US.

    Right-wing terrorists usually act alone.

  224. @Kylie
    Good advice. Thank you.

    I'll pass it on to my friend who sent it to me. She didn't post it publicly, she sent it to friends privately via Facebook Messenger. But I doubt that distinction means anything to TPTB.

    Follow-up, don’t download it if you’re there: the NZ government, raging in its impotence, will attempt to prosecute people who are believed to have seen the video.
    https://postimg.cc/QFhvLKYn
    Anyone with a copy may face ten years in prison. Police also asking that you report friends.

    • Replies: @El Dato
    Woah are they going full Himmler on this.

    "Du hast ein Video? Schnell! Raus!!"
  225. @Bill P
    Before that bombing there was a very intense anti-American media campaign in China over the Serbia caampaign. It was so bad I decided it was time to get out, fast (you get a feel for those things in China -- a lot of Westerners have started leaving recently, too). So I got on a plane and flew back to Seattle, and the embassy strike happened the next day. There were scenes of Chinese attacking the US embassy, and I was friends with some of those marine guards who had to go through that. Westerners were getting chased by mobs, etc. It was extremely upsetting to me. It felt like I was still there when I saw it on TV, and I could imagine my poor friends hunkering down in their apartments not daring to show their faces in public. I was also angry at the US for the bombing, because it was so obviously deliberate and so provocative.

    My take on it at the time was that it was simply a big FU to the Chinese for supporting the Serbs so vigorously, along with a "what are you going to do about it?" attitude. Using a stealth bomber sent a pretty clear message: "we can hit you and there's nothing you can do to stop us."

    I still don't think there was anything more to that airstrike than deliberate humiliation, which matters a whole lot to Chinese. What I would like to know is who came up with the idea, because it strikes me as a very dishonorable action, and it doesn't do the American people any good to be associated with that kind of shameful sneak attack.

    I recall that we didn’t like it much when the Japanese did it.

  226. @Mr. Anon
    I didn't turn against the program until around 2004 or 2005, when we were still stomping around in Afghanistan and Iraq with - seemingly - not a f**king clue as to what our war aims even were. I had no enthusiasm for G.W. (aka "The Chimp") but I still voted for him in 2004. By 2008, I despised the Republican Party just about everybit as much as the Democrats. I certainly couldn't stand that blood-thirsty, traitorous old war-monger, McCain and I'd sooner vote for the Devil than for him.

    And I have since come to the point of view that any kind of endgoal in war-fighting is almost beside the point. To paraphrase Orwell "The purpose of war IS war." War is a state of affairs that a lot of people with power prefer, for a variety of reasons.

    Good observations.

  227. @Dave Pinsen
    Not a mass shooter, AFAIK, but IIRC that fired black newscaster shot and killed the white woman newscaster while filming it first person shooter style.

    He killed a few people, IIRC.

  228. @istevefan
    Hail,

    I am not trying to minimize the situation in New Zealand, only to point out the absurdity of what has happened to the USA. Your stats on NZ show that Whites have fallen to 60%. But flipping NZ was not a giant task given that it's population was under 5 million. Their population was probably around 3 million during WW2. So a nation that small can be demographically flipped with not much effort.

    The fact that the USA is in the same boat as NZ is what should boggle the mind. Instead of flipping 3 to 4 million Whites into minority status, post 1965 they have flipped a then-nation of 200 million, of which about 175 million were White, into one that when it hits 360 million in a 15 or 20 years will be about 50% White. How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe? In fact at the time only China, India and the USSR had more people than the USA. And probably no nations up to that point in time other than China, India and the USSR ever had more people than 1965 USA.

    Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact.

    “Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact.”

    OR, most Americans, of their own free will, believe that there has been no “invasion”, but rather a cycle of our history by which “newcomers” enter and assimilate, albeit with much kicking and screaming.

    Remember, the true “Heritage Americans”–WASPs–were noticeably upset when hordes of Eastern and Southern Europeans entered our shores with their alien customs. It made little difference to WASPS that Italians, Poles, and Slavs were European; it made all of the difference that these groups would pollute the gene pool.

    The bottom line is some deranged man engaged in horrific violence and he ought to be condemned for it. That incidence should be reviled, not celebrated (not saying you specifically are jumping up and down in joy).

    Of course, for some of the fine posters here who are armchair warriors, there is a hidden jealousy here, as they secretly wish they were that man who had the gumption and guile to pull off a St. Breivik.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    Of course, for some of the fine posters here who are armchair warriors, there is a hidden jealousy here, as they secretly wish they were that man who had the gumption and guile to pull off a St. Breivik.
     
    He was a dumbass. If I admire anyone at all in this field it's Mickey Gubitosi, or even to a limited extent Charles Harrelson, since had he used proper tradecraft he'd have walked.

    They should have executed Breivik by any means needed.
  229. @JerseyJeffersonian
    That was a smoke screen; the US couldn't give a flying fuck about the Palestinians. So what were the genuine motivations?

    The outcome of the war ended with the creation of the enormous, and strategically significant military base, Camp Bondsteel (the southern pincher in the ongoing encirclement of the western border of the Russians and their formerly-Soviet allies), the humiliation of a potential Russian ally in Serbia (never stop kicking them when they are down...yet, ironically, even drunkard Yeltsin authorized [or at least didn't stand in the way of] an operation to seize a strategic airfield and snatch it away from hubristic Gen. Clark, and this incident may also have been the final, eye-opening insult that led to the concerted Russian effort to rise again from their low point), and with cowing our European poodles still further into submission to neocon policy goals.

    Not to be forgotten, many of the neocon driving forces were Jews happy to give Russia a poke in the eye following the logic that Orthodox Christian Serbs = Russians = Cossacks, so while the policy apparatus was in their hands, it was time to strike their traditional enemy. This, coupled with the largely Jewish looting of Russia during Yeltsin's misrule, had to be a galvanizing moment that informed their national policies, domestic and foreign. But then, history has made them take the long view, and in consequence they never give up.

    A side point: in relation to the bombing of the Chinese embassy, I have always suspected that this was in retaliation for Chinese military/intelligence passing along useful information to the Serbs during the NATO bombing. This may have led to the Serbian shoot down of the F-117, and perhaps to the Serbs passing wreckage to the Chinese for reverse engineering. Pissed the US off, leading to the transparently false story about misidentification of the embassy leading to the bombing.

    I found accounts of the dismantling of the downed Stealth Fighter by local farmers. It appears that it didn’t occur to anybody on the spot in the first 24 hours to try to sell it to the Russians or Chinese, so it got chopped up into souvenir sized pieces.

    Also, it had been 19 years since the US revealed the existence of stealth technology, so it wasn’t that cutting edge anymore.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    He's garbling two legitimate points:
    --Chinese did study our lightly used tech like Japanese auto engineers at a car show. They combed the desert in the very early nineties looking for leftovers from our first dance with Saddam (on top of the plenty they got and get from spying).
    --Serbia was supposed to be Clinton's holy orgasm of moral righteousness, just like the more clumsy and honest GWB would spell out in a later adventure: you're with us or you are our enemies. GWB was criticized for that but it was hardly a new idea. Serbia was supposed to be The Not Sees and Milosevic was supposed to be Hitler Himself. It's not that the Chinese helped Serbia in any specific way, it's that they had the gall to not stand and clap with the rest of the congregation.
  230. @unit472
    The good news is this puts PAID to the idea that western nations can offer asylum to Afro-Muslim migrants. That they can be shot to death in New Zealand as easily as they can be blown to bits in South Waziristan or an Iraqi mosque makes a mockery of that 'idea'.

    The bad news is that, as effective as this incident was, it still did not match the toll that Omar Marteen achieved in an Orlando gay nightclub and. as we have only been told, over 24,950 Muslims still reside in New Zealand as immigrants. Will ANY now leave due to fears about their safety?

    over 24,950 Muslims still reside in New Zealand as immigrants

    The number of Muslims in New Zealand may be as high as 80,000 [1.6%] as of today, and rising steadily.

    Why, and How, did 80,000 Muslims wind up in distant New Zealand?” one may ask, and millions probably are asking that today. As best I can tell, it is momentum from chain migration after various Muslim nationalities established beachheads during the lax refugee-intake-policy years of the 1990s. The NZ left-wing government has also recently loosened asylum laws again, I hear. (“Immigration Policy Has Consequences.”)

    New Zealand looks likely to hit 2.0% Muslim by either the very early 2020s (in a high-growth scenario) or by the late 2020s (in a low-growth scenario). Under high-growth, NZ hits 5% Muslim perhaps as soon as the early 2030s. Reminder: It is already 2019, and the 2030 is around the corner…

    (See How Many Muslims are there in New Zealand?, comment-70 in another thread and a follow-up post [comment-72] in that thread.) (Comment 104 above in this thread also deals with the racial-religious situation in NZ as of the late 2010s.)

  231. @Peripatetic Commenter

    Another name marked on the weaponry was Novak Vujosevic, who fought on the Montenegrin side in the Battle of Fundina against the Ottoman Empire’s forces.
     
    Truly, genetics are powerful, as those people are still fighting the Ottoman Empire.

    Secondly, that is why accepting people from vastly different cultures (which usually means races) is such a stupid thing because:

    A. You don't know what stupid genes they may be bringing into your country, and

    B. You don't know what past wars and enmities they are bringing into your country.

    “Secondly, that is why accepting people from vastly different cultures (which usually means races) is such a stupid thing because: A. You don’t know what stupid genes they may be bringing into your country, and B. You don’t know what past wars and enmities they are bringing into your country.”

    Now you know how the WASPs felt when the Italians, Slavs, and Poles came here en masse in the late 1800 and early 1900’s.

    In Woodrow Wilson’s History of the American People (1902), he compared the “men of the sturdy stock of the north of Europe” with the “more sordid and hopeless elements [of southern and eastern Europe]”.

    Kenneth Roberts, a journalist and novelist, believed that immigration laws had to be revised to admit fewer Polish Jews who were “human parasites”. He believed immigration had to be restricted because it would inevitably produce “a hybrid race of people as worthless and futile as the good-for-nothing mongrels of Central America and South Eastern Europe … If America doesn’t keep out the queer alien mongrelized people of Southern and Eastern Europe, her crop of citizens will eventually be dwarfed and mongrelized in turn”.

    And, of course, who can ever forget Madison Grant (1916) –> The man of the old stock is being crowded out of many country districts by foreigners, just as he is today being literally driven off the streets of New York City by swarms of Polish Jews. These immigrants adopt the same language of the Native American, they wear his clothes, they steal his name and they are beginning to take his women, but seldom adopt his religion or understand his ideals…older immigrants are skilled, thrifty, hardworking like native born Americans and recent immigrants from southern and eastern Europe are unskilled, ignorant, predominantly Catholic or Jewish and not easily assimilated into American culture.

    But my personal favorite is Hiram Wesley Evans, Grand Imperial Wizard, who made his position abundantly clear: “The vast horde of immigrants who have reached our shores…Italian immigrants, Irish catholic malcontents, Russian Jews, Finns, Letts, Lithuanians [are] of the lowest class”.

    Indeed, these groups posed the greatest threat to American society and culture that, in 1907, the Dillingham Commission was formed to recommend literacy tests be put into place. Many people thought if they could just get rid of the “new ” immigrants, life would return to their slow paced “Golden Age” of their fore fathers.

    They have to go back. It’s just who we are.

  232. @MikeatMikedotMike
    Perhaps bombing Serbia allowed Clinton to distract from his extramarital scandals.

    http://www.pravdareport.com/history/127187-nato_serbia_lewinsky/

    Perhaps bombing Serbia allowed Clinton to distract from his extramarital scandals.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wag_the_Dog

  233. @Anon
    7,000 Jews. Thats not good news. That means that there are 6,999 more Jews than necessary to blame all of the countries problems on !!!!

    7,000 people checked off ‘Jewish’ on the census form (see comment-104 above for summary of the results of NZ Census 2013’s religion question).

    I suspect the actual number of ethnic-Jews could be double that, with the remainder answering ‘No Religion.’ A full 50% of NZers either answered ‘No Religion’ or refused to answer the religion question.

    It is the “No-Religion Jews” that are most prone to a certain kind of activism.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Christchurch also had Mossad activity and a possible operation exposed by the recent earthquake. One of the things antipodals do right is sovereignty -- unlike the US, office holders cannot collect extra citizenships and passports are actually protected. About ten years ago NZ was mad at Israel for using fake Kiwi passports for their clumsy and camera-happy assassins. As tempting as it is to ask what the hell is in Maori country that an Israeli could care about, Chabad has a facility in Thailand, ostensibly to help Jewish honeymooners with theology (golden triangle? What golden triangle? You mean like the two in the Magen David?). There was an Israeli missile barrage on Gaza around the time of the NZ massacre, but it was not a major operation like Cast Lead. I don't think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There's a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.
  234. Got to love this guy. Can you picture a democrat or republican senator or congressman doing this?

    • Replies: @anon
    Further to that, he was then harangued and abused at the airport by a Pacific Islander.
    Prime Minister Scott Morrison has called for Senator Anning to ''feel the full force of the law'' over his assault on the teenage ''egger'', who has been released without charge by Police.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/17/full-force-of-the-law-should-apply-to-fraser-anning-after-egging-incident-morrison-says
    , @Macumazahn
    That left hook was ill-advised. A straight right would have been far more effective, driving the phone into the punk's face.
    That being said, I can certainly picture the Democrats' new American champion, Alexandria Occasional-Cortex, popping some white boy in the face. Absolutely.
    , @L Woods
    "Child."
    , @El Dato
    What's it with overexcited kids thinking they are in the Justice League of Woke Causes nowadays?

    Guess it's too much TV.
  235. @Dave Pinsen
    According to his manifesto, it was blowback for a lot of things, including Rotherham. But he says he was prompted in particular by the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

    the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

    I assume this was Ebba Åkerlund, the twelve year old girl run over by the muslim truck terrorist in Stockholm. From the one picture I’ve seen, it looked like her leg had been torn off at the hip and deposited a short distance away.

    Her grave is apparently being desecrated now and then by a man who will be deported (“any day now!”). At the latest count, thirty times. The police are, of course, powerless to do a damn thing.

    https://samtiden.nu/2018/11/ebbas-gravplats-fortsatt-skandad-av-utvisningsdomd-man/
    (In Swedish)

    • Replies: @Dave Pinsen
    Yes, she was the one.
    , @Hail

    Her grave is apparently being desecrated now and then by a man who will be deported (“any day now!”)
     
    That is just bizarre. What motivation? What goal?
  236. @Headless Horseman
    Why are mass shootings newsworthy while mass beheadings not so much. Western lives matter?
    https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/new-isis-video-shows-mass-beheading-of-christians-399613507644

    Who/whom.

  237. @istevefan
    Hail,

    I am not trying to minimize the situation in New Zealand, only to point out the absurdity of what has happened to the USA. Your stats on NZ show that Whites have fallen to 60%. But flipping NZ was not a giant task given that it's population was under 5 million. Their population was probably around 3 million during WW2. So a nation that small can be demographically flipped with not much effort.

    The fact that the USA is in the same boat as NZ is what should boggle the mind. Instead of flipping 3 to 4 million Whites into minority status, post 1965 they have flipped a then-nation of 200 million, of which about 175 million were White, into one that when it hits 360 million in a 15 or 20 years will be about 50% White. How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe? In fact at the time only China, India and the USSR had more people than the USA. And probably no nations up to that point in time other than China, India and the USSR ever had more people than 1965 USA.

    Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact.

    How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe?

    I think there are several answers to this question, several of which New Zealand and the USA have in common. To highlight one set of them:

    Low population densities. (The legacy of) empty land ripe for settlement. Cultural-historical narratives based in frontier-settler psychology.

    As ‘facts on the ground,’ all the above kind of trailed off by the end of the 19th century (not sure when NZ was “fully settled,” but that applies to the USA). The psychology has remained, and long past its usefulness-expiration-date. In our case in the USA, when (e.g.) Blacks moved up from the Deep South to northern urban areas in the late 1910s to 1950s, local Whites could much more easily just move on. There was always a place to ‘flee’ to, both psychologically and physically (due to low pop. densities).

    You are, of course, right that New Zealand is much smaller in scale, and the equivalent of a mere few hundred extended families from Bangladesh and Pakistan would already register on the demographic radar in New Zealand. Even so, regarding the failure to launch morally-serious immigration restriction programs ala Hungary (or Steve Sailer’s favorite, Denmark) once it started to become clear the situation was getting out of hand, there might be a great deal of overlap with our case given comparable settler-frontier psychologies.

    Now, that is admittedly not the whole story. It cannot, e.g., explain the immigration problems in Western Europe at all. There are definitely certain USA-specific reasons why we were ‘targeted,’ no doubt about it. To some extent, the little-guys like New Zealand (and the medium-sized guy, Australia) kind of had to follow suit once the USA turned in that direction, as did Western Europe. We’re all in it together, really.

    Some anti-US Europeans have been known to blame the USA’s influence for their own nascent immigration-fueled domestic “race problems.” To some extent, they are probably right. (Just don’t blame Middle America White-Christians. It really wasn’t us.)

    _______________

    Bing tells me that New Zealand’s pop. density is half the USA’s; an impressive 30% of land in New Zealand is protected and not for settlement, vs. 14% in the USA.)

    New Zealand, land area — 101,000 sq. mi. (slightly smaller than Colorado)
    New Zealand, population — 4,850,000 (est.) — official numbers out in April 2019
    New Zealand, pop. density: 48 people/sq. mi. (68/sq. mi. if excluding protected areas)

    USA Lower 48, land area — 2,959,000 sq. mi.
    USA Lower 48, population — 325,000,000?
    USA, pop. density: 110 people/sq. mi.

    • Replies: @Desiderius

    Just don’t blame Middle America White-Christians. It really wasn’t us
     
    No, to our shame, it was, and is.
    , @Kaiju
    Distinguish between North and South Island, aside from Christchurch, the recent post 80s immigration wave basically ignored South Island, based on population growth figures, and demographics even in big towns like Invercargill, Nelson, and Blenheim, where the population is around 95 percent white or Maori, and annual population growth is around 0.5 percent or less, vs. 2 percent for NZ as a whole.
  238. @Mr. Anon

    Interesting that you should mention Bataclan. Turns out there were a large number of gruesome tortures during that particular slaughterfest, which the MSM went out of their way to obscure from view.

    Of course, the French authorities did their part too, refusing to permit parents to recover the bodies of the most extreme cases. Saying that the vivisections were likely the result of explosions and shrapnel, and we’ll just spare you the details.
     
    Snopes.com is reporting that accounts of torture and mutilations during the Bataclan massacre are untrue.

    So I am more persuaded that it did in fact happen.

    From what I recall, the official hearing mentioned torture and mutilated victims. But maybe the weed loving hooker of Snopes knows better.

  239. @For what it's worth
    Back in the 90s/early 2000s, I read a lot of Holocaust revisionism, and I also skimmed some Serbian claims about Srebenica. I remember that much of the Holocaust revisionist literature making clear and distinct claims. The concentration camp victims actually died of typhus, the gas chambers weren't real, etc. Even if the Holocaust revisionist claims were false, or distorted, at least their claims *grappled with the point in question*: did the Germans intentionally commit mass murder against the Jewish people?

    I remember finding the Serbian claims hard to follow. The defenses didn't seem to center on the point at issue: did Serbs massacre unarmed Bosnian Moslems in their custody at Srebenica? Yes or no? If they addressed the point, the Serb defenders would usually focus on the numbers, or imply that the massacre was deserved. Well, you don't get to massacre your enemies, even if they are guilty of massacres themselves.

    You pointed me to a website where the heading specifically talks about "refuting the charge that Serbs committed mass murder at Srebenica." Sounded promising. I read further down, and that article is about documenting Moslem crimes against Serbs. That might provide context for understanding the mass murder at Srebenica, but it does *not* refute the charge of mass murder committed by Serbs. This confirms my low opinion of the Serb counterclaims. I see this sort of irrational, reflexive changing of the subject when talking with Balkan tribalists.

    Here's another example: https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-srebrenica-massacre-was-a-gigantic-political-fraud/5321388 The author says that Srebenica was a "fraud." A Westerner like me reads that and infers that the article will deny that Serbs committed atrocities at Srebenica. Part way through the article, the author writes, "The numbers [of Bosnian Moslems] executed there [by Serbs] were probably in the order of between 500 and 1,000." So he admits that the Serbs murdered (because this would be murder; there was no trial) hundreds of unarmed people in their custody. So really the alleged fraud has to do with numbers. I repeat, the author admits that the Serbs committed a huge massacre at Srebenica, he just disputes the numbers, and lamely tries to the killings as "deaths and executions." If you're on trial for killing eight people, you don't get acquitted if you admit on the stand that you only killed four.

    If the best that pro-Serb apologists can do is say, "We murdered fewer of them, in retaliation for what they did to us," then I can see why this douchebag in New Zealand sought to emulate Serb militants in the Balkans. Kind of like Eric Holder, the motto seems to be, "When they massacre you, you massacre them back."

    There's an Eastern Catholic Jesuit priest, Archimandrite Rober Taft, S.J. (who I think now is deceased; RIP), who said that the further east you go in Europe, the less rational the people are. Meaning, decisions are generally made more reflexively, on the basis of identity/identification, not rational sifting of evidence. My experience with Balkan polemics supports this. These cultures missed out on the sort of social tranformation that the Catholic Church achieved in the West, where it produced the underpinnings for WEIRD (Western, Educated, Industrialized, Rich, Democratic) culture. Social life is still more instinctual, visceral. I suspect that's part of what's going on.

    Now, I realize that I'm being provocative and painting with a broad brush, to say the least, and obviously none of these criticisms apply to all Serbs, just like anti-Islamic criticisms don't apply to all Moslems. I just don't think people in America, which is a WEIRD country, should look to Balkan tribes for models, whether on the Albanian, Bosniak, Serbian, or Croatian sides.* They're in a different world than the one we live in, and a more primitive one. You might end up with someone like this guy trying to go Radovan Karadžić on a mosque.

    *And if you don't think that's a thing, it's part of why I stopped reading Chronicles Magazine and I got turned off to the paleocon movement. There seemed to be a sort of perverse leapfrogging of loyalties, where the Chronicles crowd went off on some Serbophile, Russophile tangent out of their disdain for contemporary America. The neocons had Israel, and that crowd had Serbia, it seemed.

    The reason other Europeans no longer massacre each other Balkan-style is that they now have ethnically homogeneous countries.

  240. @Hail
    7,000 people checked off 'Jewish' on the census form (see comment-104 above for summary of the results of NZ Census 2013's religion question).

    I suspect the actual number of ethnic-Jews could be double that, with the remainder answering 'No Religion.' A full 50% of NZers either answered 'No Religion' or refused to answer the religion question.

    It is the "No-Religion Jews" that are most prone to a certain kind of activism.

    Christchurch also had Mossad activity and a possible operation exposed by the recent earthquake. One of the things antipodals do right is sovereignty — unlike the US, office holders cannot collect extra citizenships and passports are actually protected. About ten years ago NZ was mad at Israel for using fake Kiwi passports for their clumsy and camera-happy assassins. As tempting as it is to ask what the hell is in Maori country that an Israeli could care about, Chabad has a facility in Thailand, ostensibly to help Jewish honeymooners with theology (golden triangle? What golden triangle? You mean like the two in the Magen David?). There was an Israeli missile barrage on Gaza around the time of the NZ massacre, but it was not a major operation like Cast Lead. I don’t think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There’s a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.

    • Replies: @Hail

    I don’t think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There’s a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.
     
    I, too, see no plausible 'Mossad' angle, at all. No benefit to Israel from the Christchurch mosque attack. As for local Jews: Going on general trends it's likely they support the various avenues of Third World settlement in New Zealand because Diversity (including, but not limited to or specifically for, Muslims).

    the Christchurch mosque
     
    I wonder if the attacker chose this particular city specifically because this phrase would appear around the world thereafter. A troll-within-a-terror-attack. Kind of surreal, but would fit his m.o.
    , @Alden
    Chabad’s is all over the world, ostensibly to help vacationing and traveling Jews with kosher food, religious services other Travelers Aid help, sort of like a Jewish consular service or medieval pilgrim’s hostels
  241. @Anon
    NYU students accused Chelsea Clinton of sparking the terror in NZ by calling Ilhan Omar's comment on Israel and Jewish money "anti-Semitic", thereby stoking Islamophobia.

    Couldn't have happened to a nicer hypocrite.

    I couldn’t stop smirking for quite a while.

  242. @istevefan

    20th anniversary of the signing of the Rambouillet Agreement on March 18, 1999
     
    Speaking about the Rambouillet Agreement it is always good to keep this in mind.

    The Europeans, earnestly, sought an agreement that both sides could accept. But they also agreed with the Americans that any peace agreement would have to be enforced by an international military presence.

    The leading allies were agreed that this force would have to be a Nato force. None wanted to repeat the very bruising experience of the UN Protection Force (Unprofor) in neighbouring Bosnia during the 1990s.

    The Americans knew that because it had to be Nato, the chances of the Serbs accepting the deal were very small. They had a second acceptable outcome in mind.

    "That meant the Serbs rejecting the plan and the Albanians accepting it," Assistant Secretary of State Jamie Rubin told me.

    Then, he added, there would be clarity where previously there had been confusion, clarity as to who was to blame, as to who Nato should oppose and who Nato should support.


    It took weeks, but the US finally persuaded the Albanians to accept the plan. The Serbs rejected it. The European allies found themselves committed to the use of force against a sovereign European state.
     
    So in other words the Americans, who were supposed to be an honest broker, actually helped broker a plan no one wanted, but told the Albanians to accept it because once the Serbs rejected it, the Serbs would be the bad guys. This is like bidding on a government contract where the government gives all the inside info to one party trying to ensure that party wins the contract.

    This is like bidding on a government contract where the government gives all the inside info to one party trying to ensure that party wins the contract.

    Even more so because the party supported are muslims.

  243. @Steve Sailer
    I found accounts of the dismantling of the downed Stealth Fighter by local farmers. It appears that it didn't occur to anybody on the spot in the first 24 hours to try to sell it to the Russians or Chinese, so it got chopped up into souvenir sized pieces.

    Also, it had been 19 years since the US revealed the existence of stealth technology, so it wasn't that cutting edge anymore.

    He’s garbling two legitimate points:
    –Chinese did study our lightly used tech like Japanese auto engineers at a car show. They combed the desert in the very early nineties looking for leftovers from our first dance with Saddam (on top of the plenty they got and get from spying).
    –Serbia was supposed to be Clinton’s holy orgasm of moral righteousness, just like the more clumsy and honest GWB would spell out in a later adventure: you’re with us or you are our enemies. GWB was criticized for that but it was hardly a new idea. Serbia was supposed to be The Not Sees and Milosevic was supposed to be Hitler Himself. It’s not that the Chinese helped Serbia in any specific way, it’s that they had the gall to not stand and clap with the rest of the congregation.

  244. @Anon
    7,000 Jews. Thats not good news. That means that there are 6,999 more Jews than necessary to blame all of the countries problems on !!!!

    “7,000 Jews. Thats not good news. That means that there are 6,999 more Jews than necessary to blame all of the countries problems on !!!!”

    Ah yes, the old straw man that seeks to absolve Jews of any responsibility or criticism for anything they could possibly ever do. Baruch Goldstein shooting up a mosque? Never happened, you anti-semite.

  245. @Anon
    Actually the US troops were part of an international peace keeping force.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.

    By comparison the marine barracks bombing was a deliberate act carried out by Lebanon and Iran and the various terror groups that are part and parcel of their government including hezbiola ,Islamic jihad ans others.

    Iran erected a monument to the attackers in Tehran not far from where Iran publicly hanged Mona Mahmudinejad and 19 other female Bahai school teachers ,some as young as teenagers.

    No, the bombing of the U.S.S. Liberty was no accident, rather a deliberate act. I regularly follow Col. (Ret.) Lang’s blog, and from what he has said (he was very high in the DIA with primary responsibility in southwest asia at the time, and was cleared to, and did, study all of the radio intercepts surrounding that incident, including those of our bestest little pals, the Israelis), it was clearly a deliberate, prolonged, and murderous attack, even including machine gunning of the crew members trying to abandon ship. Admiral McCain (John’s father) twice was preparing a launch of warplanes from the carrier under his command in the eastern Mediterranean to defend the Liberty, and was twice told to stand down while crew members were being murdered. This was an obviously politically-motivated decision from the SecDef and/or President. Just as obvious was the concerted coverup; a proper investigation was thwarted by political intervention.

    So yeah, peddle that crap somewhere else.

    The bombing of the Marine base (and unmentioned, the French base, too) was during the much later Lebanese conflict, and had nothing to do with the bombing of the U.S.S. Liberty. We should not have been there at all, but once we were, we had done our level best to antagonize the Shia, even lobbing shells into the hills above Beirut where they lived from the U.S.S. New Jersey stationed off the Lebanese coast.

    So, asymmetrical warfare, it’s a thing. The ones to blame for this carnage were our brainless, neocon leaders. Why should the Shia have put up with this aggression in support of Israel, and not attacked those who were attacking them?

    Hizbullah has defended Lebanon against outside aggression, whether from the West, or from Israel. They kicked Israel’s quisling South Lebanon Army to the curb, and then when the Israelis tried invasion, they shot them to pieces. Of course, the Israelis’ “moral army” then petulantly bombed the infrastructure of Lebanon for this temerity, and dropped submunition bomblets all over to deny the Lebanese access to their own country, not incidentally killing civilians in the aftermath.

    Hasbara fail.

    • Replies: @Anon
    Wrong. United States government considers it an accident. When you have the juice we will give credence to your conspiracy theories.
    , @Romanian
    Everybody forgets that Lebanon was over 80% Christian when the Ottoman Empire fell and dropped at one point to 25%. Most of its diaspora, twice the size of the country, is Christian. If it is defending anything, then Hezbollah is defending its conquest and spoils.
  246. @Anon
    Actually the US troops were part of an international peace keeping force.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.

    By comparison the marine barracks bombing was a deliberate act carried out by Lebanon and Iran and the various terror groups that are part and parcel of their government including hezbiola ,Islamic jihad ans others.

    Iran erected a monument to the attackers in Tehran not far from where Iran publicly hanged Mona Mahmudinejad and 19 other female Bahai school teachers ,some as young as teenagers.

    In what universe does the US and Israeli governments agreeing on a story mean the story is true?

    • Replies: @Anon
    Oh yes sorry. Truth is determined by anonymous YouTube videos and dorks that live 24/7 every waking second on the internet. My apologies.
  247. @KenH
    And all the Muslim loons and whiners who complain about the Islamophobia of the U.S. government forget that the U.S. served as the air force for the murderous Albanian Muslim KLA. Unfortunately, Russia was still reeling from the collapse of the Soviet Union and too prostrate to render very much assistance to the embattled Christian Serbs.

    You nailed it. We effectively were their air force.

  248. Hail says: • Website
    @J.Ross
    Christchurch also had Mossad activity and a possible operation exposed by the recent earthquake. One of the things antipodals do right is sovereignty -- unlike the US, office holders cannot collect extra citizenships and passports are actually protected. About ten years ago NZ was mad at Israel for using fake Kiwi passports for their clumsy and camera-happy assassins. As tempting as it is to ask what the hell is in Maori country that an Israeli could care about, Chabad has a facility in Thailand, ostensibly to help Jewish honeymooners with theology (golden triangle? What golden triangle? You mean like the two in the Magen David?). There was an Israeli missile barrage on Gaza around the time of the NZ massacre, but it was not a major operation like Cast Lead. I don't think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There's a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.

    I don’t think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There’s a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.

    I, too, see no plausible ‘Mossad’ angle, at all. No benefit to Israel from the Christchurch mosque attack. As for local Jews: Going on general trends it’s likely they support the various avenues of Third World settlement in New Zealand because Diversity (including, but not limited to or specifically for, Muslims).

    the Christchurch mosque

    I wonder if the attacker chose this particular city specifically because this phrase would appear around the world thereafter. A troll-within-a-terror-attack. Kind of surreal, but would fit his m.o.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Last big story about the al-Noor mosque was claims it was radicalizing people. Imam says it a good billin, it dindu nuffin.
    http://archive.is/7sStb
  249. @Svigor
    Apparently it's being taken down in most places, as soon as it goes up. I saw it in a comment thread on TRS and DLed it, but have no idea if the link is still up. I'd try a bittorrent search engine, if I had to find it now.

    Still up on The Pirate Bay – just search “christchurch”. The file is 60-something megs.

    Might be a good idea to download it on public WiFi.

    • Replies: @istevefan
    Do muslims face this much trouble sharing jihadi videos of beheadings and other atrocities? Are their slave-for-sale websites taken down as fast?
  250. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @Corvinus
    "Most Americans (not you obviously) have still not come to terms with that fact."

    OR, most Americans, of their own free will, believe that there has been no "invasion", but rather a cycle of our history by which "newcomers" enter and assimilate, albeit with much kicking and screaming.

    Remember, the true "Heritage Americans"--WASPs--were noticeably upset when hordes of Eastern and Southern Europeans entered our shores with their alien customs. It made little difference to WASPS that Italians, Poles, and Slavs were European; it made all of the difference that these groups would pollute the gene pool.

    The bottom line is some deranged man engaged in horrific violence and he ought to be condemned for it. That incidence should be reviled, not celebrated (not saying you specifically are jumping up and down in joy).

    Of course, for some of the fine posters here who are armchair warriors, there is a hidden jealousy here, as they secretly wish they were that man who had the gumption and guile to pull off a St. Breivik.

    Of course, for some of the fine posters here who are armchair warriors, there is a hidden jealousy here, as they secretly wish they were that man who had the gumption and guile to pull off a St. Breivik.

    He was a dumbass. If I admire anyone at all in this field it’s Mickey Gubitosi, or even to a limited extent Charles Harrelson, since had he used proper tradecraft he’d have walked.

    They should have executed Breivik by any means needed.

  251. @Hail

    I don’t think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There’s a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.
     
    I, too, see no plausible 'Mossad' angle, at all. No benefit to Israel from the Christchurch mosque attack. As for local Jews: Going on general trends it's likely they support the various avenues of Third World settlement in New Zealand because Diversity (including, but not limited to or specifically for, Muslims).

    the Christchurch mosque
     
    I wonder if the attacker chose this particular city specifically because this phrase would appear around the world thereafter. A troll-within-a-terror-attack. Kind of surreal, but would fit his m.o.

    Last big story about the al-Noor mosque was claims it was radicalizing people. Imam says it a good billin, it dindu nuffin.
    http://archive.is/7sStb

  252. @larry lurker
    Still up on The Pirate Bay - just search "christchurch". The file is 60-something megs.

    Might be a good idea to download it on public WiFi.

    Do muslims face this much trouble sharing jihadi videos of beheadings and other atrocities? Are their slave-for-sale websites taken down as fast?

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    No. But you see, Muslim terrorists justifying their every action with Quranic verses and mainstream jurisprudence experts are not representative of Islam, whereas all white gentiles are crypto-Nazis waiting for the Signal to kill everyone around them.
  253. @Digital Samizdat
    The McDonald's Theory was already wrong even when Tom Friedman first stated it in the early 90s. Britain and Argentina, to name an obvious counterexample, both had McDonald's in 1982 during the Falkland/Malvinas War.

    And arguably Ford factories are more capitalistic and democratizing than a McDonald’s, but having a few didn’t stop Hitler from declaring war on both Henry Ford’s country and ancestral homeland.

  254. @istevefan
    Do muslims face this much trouble sharing jihadi videos of beheadings and other atrocities? Are their slave-for-sale websites taken down as fast?

    No. But you see, Muslim terrorists justifying their every action with Quranic verses and mainstream jurisprudence experts are not representative of Islam, whereas all white gentiles are crypto-Nazis waiting for the Signal to kill everyone around them.

  255. @sayless
    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. does not believe that Sirhan Sirhan fired the shots that killed his father. He read the trial transcript, evaluated what evidence there was, and interviewed him in prison.

    Robert KennedyJr was a drug addict from his teen years till 60. Among other things, he almost died from a heroin overdose on a plane enroute to protest an oil field.

    He’s neither an Investigator nor an attorney. Anyone can read a trial transcript. He was drunk and showing off to his drunk buddies by driving very recklessly and a passenger was crippled for life.

    Had he not been a member of a rich family he would have been incarcerated in Massachusetts juvenile reform schools due to his criminal behavior all over Cape Cod.

    Because of bad grades bad behavior, and drug use he was expelled from several high schools.

    He, like every other person in the country who got through 5th grade, could read a trial transcript.

    BFD

    • Replies: @sayless
    But this trial was the trial of the man accused of murdering his father. He tried to get to the bottom of what had happened and he went beyond just reading the transcript. His personal history isn’t relevant.
  256. @J.Ross
    Christchurch also had Mossad activity and a possible operation exposed by the recent earthquake. One of the things antipodals do right is sovereignty -- unlike the US, office holders cannot collect extra citizenships and passports are actually protected. About ten years ago NZ was mad at Israel for using fake Kiwi passports for their clumsy and camera-happy assassins. As tempting as it is to ask what the hell is in Maori country that an Israeli could care about, Chabad has a facility in Thailand, ostensibly to help Jewish honeymooners with theology (golden triangle? What golden triangle? You mean like the two in the Magen David?). There was an Israeli missile barrage on Gaza around the time of the NZ massacre, but it was not a major operation like Cast Lead. I don't think they would bother with distractions for something they do every month. There's a certain amount of Israeli stuff but none of it unseats the official story.

    Chabad’s is all over the world, ostensibly to help vacationing and traveling Jews with kosher food, religious services other Travelers Aid help, sort of like a Jewish consular service or medieval pilgrim’s hostels

  257. Clearly, we need more immigration to deal with this issue.

  258. anon[275] • Disclaimer says:
    @jill
    Got to love this guy. Can you picture a democrat or republican senator or congressman doing this?

    https://twitter.com/RohitKachrooITV/status/1106854689604276225

    Further to that, he was then harangued and abused at the airport by a Pacific Islander.
    Prime Minister Scott Morrison has called for Senator Anning to ”feel the full force of the law” over his assault on the teenage ”egger”, who has been released without charge by Police.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/17/full-force-of-the-law-should-apply-to-fraser-anning-after-egging-incident-morrison-says

  259. @Anonymous

    Our bombing of the Christian Serbs is what flipped me against US foreign policy and woke me up to the fact the neocons were bad news. I finally could see the split between guys I admired like Pat Buchanan and the neocons. It was in front of me, but it took the bombing of Christians for the benefit of the descendants of collaborators to make me see the light. I’ve hated McCain and Kristol ever since.
     
    Me as well. I also came to realize why the empire needed to create a “professional military” who will enthusiastically carry out the slaughter of people who have not aggressed on the U.S. or any Americans and believe this slaughter is not only justified but even virtuous. Now we’re required to give them standing ovations at professional sports games and special privileges.

    Professional militaries = wars of choice.

  260. @LondonBob
    Thatcherite MP Alan Clark was very good on the Balkan intervention.

    http://www.lalkar.org/article/2025/conflict-in-the-balkans-alan-clarks-view

    The assertion that human rights within the boundaries of a sovereign nationare best defended by a sustained bombardment of its own civilian populationis, to put it most kindly, Orwellian. The notion that because a war is ‘just’ (by the aggressor’s definition) it can be prosecuted immediately, and without deference to international opinion is highly dangerous. It is to prevent exactly this that the UN’s Security Council mechanism came into being. Nato was conceived as a defensive alliance, its terms of engagement narrowly drawn; not as a ‘policeman’ surrogate for the UN; never as an apparatus for intervention in a civil war.

    What amazes me about the Yugoslav crisis is the credulity of the Left, and of progressive thinkers, who seem to get a vicarious thrill from seeing B52s taking off from Fairford.

    I address them: How have you swallowed whole the CIA-funded propaganda that demonises the Serbs? Are you not familiar with the duplicity and intimidation of United States foreign policy? That Ambassador Walker, in charge of monitoring forces in Bosnia, was financing the Contras? Have you no recall of that ‘Free World’ crap that embraced Battista, Noriega, Syngman Rhee, Bao Dai, Lee Van Thieu and Sukarno?

    If you read Michael Rose’s Despatch you will see that the Bosnians mortared their own bread queue for a horror shot. If you talked to British soldiers you would learn that the KLA are gangsters indistinguishable (my analogy) from any warlord in Mogadishu.

    In Yugoslavia there is a civil war. British soldiers are not mercenaries for one side or another where there is no threat to our citizens. The safest rule in such circumstances is, stick to humanitarian aid. What do you imagine so far is the cost? How much aid might this have funded?
     

    Clark was also a first rate historian too. His writings on the eastern front of both WW1 & 2 were some of the best material on the subject i have ever read.

  261. @Anon
    Liberal loon prime minister of New Zealand is going around wearing a hijib in the wake of the shooting. Good lord, she really knows how to overdo things.


    https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-asia-47592358/new-zealand-pm-we-are-united-in-our-grief

    She’s doing what she’s told.
    Soon, the message will be: We can’t give in to the Terrorists. Terrorists in this case meaning anyone daring to question Immigration.
    That will be her excuse to open the Immigration floodgates in New Zealand.

  262. @Hail

    How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe?
     
    I think there are several answers to this question, several of which New Zealand and the USA have in common. To highlight one set of them:

    Low population densities. (The legacy of) empty land ripe for settlement. Cultural-historical narratives based in frontier-settler psychology.

    As 'facts on the ground,' all the above kind of trailed off by the end of the 19th century (not sure when NZ was "fully settled," but that applies to the USA). The psychology has remained, and long past its usefulness-expiration-date. In our case in the USA, when (e.g.) Blacks moved up from the Deep South to northern urban areas in the late 1910s to 1950s, local Whites could much more easily just move on. There was always a place to 'flee' to, both psychologically and physically (due to low pop. densities).

    You are, of course, right that New Zealand is much smaller in scale, and the equivalent of a mere few hundred extended families from Bangladesh and Pakistan would already register on the demographic radar in New Zealand. Even so, regarding the failure to launch morally-serious immigration restriction programs ala Hungary (or Steve Sailer's favorite, Denmark) once it started to become clear the situation was getting out of hand, there might be a great deal of overlap with our case given comparable settler-frontier psychologies.

    Now, that is admittedly not the whole story. It cannot, e.g., explain the immigration problems in Western Europe at all. There are definitely certain USA-specific reasons why we were 'targeted,' no doubt about it. To some extent, the little-guys like New Zealand (and the medium-sized guy, Australia) kind of had to follow suit once the USA turned in that direction, as did Western Europe. We're all in it together, really.

    Some anti-US Europeans have been known to blame the USA's influence for their own nascent immigration-fueled domestic "race problems." To some extent, they are probably right. (Just don't blame Middle America White-Christians. It really wasn't us.)

    _______________

    Bing tells me that New Zealand's pop. density is half the USA's; an impressive 30% of land in New Zealand is protected and not for settlement, vs. 14% in the USA.)

    New Zealand, land area -- 101,000 sq. mi. (slightly smaller than Colorado)
    New Zealand, population -- 4,850,000 (est.) -- official numbers out in April 2019
    New Zealand, pop. density: 48 people/sq. mi. (68/sq. mi. if excluding protected areas)

    USA Lower 48, land area -- 2,959,000 sq. mi.
    USA Lower 48, population -- 325,000,000?
    USA, pop. density: 110 people/sq. mi.

    Just don’t blame Middle America White-Christians. It really wasn’t us

    No, to our shame, it was, and is.

    • Agree: L Woods
    • Replies: @Hail
    In brief, if we had control of our own cultural apparatus and foreign policy, IMO it wouldn't have happened.
  263. @Pericles


    the killing of a young girl in Sweden.

     

    I assume this was Ebba Åkerlund, the twelve year old girl run over by the muslim truck terrorist in Stockholm. From the one picture I've seen, it looked like her leg had been torn off at the hip and deposited a short distance away.

    Her grave is apparently being desecrated now and then by a man who will be deported ("any day now!"). At the latest count, thirty times. The police are, of course, powerless to do a damn thing.

    https://samtiden.nu/2018/11/ebbas-gravplats-fortsatt-skandad-av-utvisningsdomd-man/
    (In Swedish)

    Yes, she was the one.

  264. anonymous[389] • Disclaimer says:
    @Svigor
    That. This is what happens in (((multicultural societies))).

    Still kind of amazed that this guy livestreamed the whole thing. I DLed it yesterday and only had a couple of minutes to scan through it and came away thinking it was some kind of hacked thing with a video game overlay. It was only today that I had time to watch it again and realized it was a genuine livestream made by the killer. Holy shit, that was insane. I mean shouldn't-be-possible levels of insane. Never seen anything like that.

    My take-home point on this thing is that the killer explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren't his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((. I feel no need to disavow. He's someone else's problem. Maybe (((Big Media))) should go and interrogate Little Green Footballs, or Frank Gaffney/Richard Perle/John Podhoretz, or something.

    explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((

    Aren’t there other whitey nationalist mofers who say something similar (Tommy Robinson…)? So, how are you mofers really different from each other?

    I feel no need to disavow.

    Yeah, like you lowlifes will actually disavow those dirty Whitey Terrorists, who are also anti-joomofers.

    He’s someone else’s problem.

    Keep deluding your accursed self. The more you rot your soul, the worse the comeuppance, and the greater our schadenfreude.

    May the Almighty One will a pox on your racist lowlife kind, and soon enough, into the worst recesses of Hell you all go.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    May the Almighty One will a pox on your racist lowlife kind, and soon enough, into the worst recesses of Hell you all go.

    Hell is just a quaint Judeo socio-religious construct.
  265. @jill
    Got to love this guy. Can you picture a democrat or republican senator or congressman doing this?

    https://twitter.com/RohitKachrooITV/status/1106854689604276225

    That left hook was ill-advised. A straight right would have been far more effective, driving the phone into the punk’s face.
    That being said, I can certainly picture the Democrats’ new American champion, Alexandria Occasional-Cortex, popping some white boy in the face. Absolutely.

    • Replies: @Pericles

    I can certainly picture the Democrats’ new American champion, Alexandria Occasional-Cortex, popping some white boy in the face. Absolutely.

     

    That would be lolworthy, because she'd probably break her hand in the process. OMG, white supremacy!
  266. @Anon
    Liberal loon prime minister of New Zealand is going around wearing a hijib in the wake of the shooting. Good lord, she really knows how to overdo things.


    https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-asia-47592358/new-zealand-pm-we-are-united-in-our-grief

    There are scarcely words to describe how idiotic she is. She makes Justin Trudeau look smart. It’s a very odd set of political accidents that put her in the job, but it amounts to one of the strangest experiments in leadership in human history.

    Incidentally the local rugby team in Christchurch, the most succesful on the planet for the past couple of decades, is called the Crusaders. Inevitably there are now calls to change the name.

  267. @Anon
    It's on Liveleak, or was when I viewed it there yesterday.
    • Replies: @El Dato

    "It is clear that people are worried and we really understand that... It is truly terrible what happened yesterday. It is hard to put into any form of words," said Assistant Chief Constable Russ Jackson [something something UK], who added "We have nothing to suggest any threat locally, but none of this can diminish how people feel and that is why we want to be there to offer more support at this difficult time."
     
    Sounds like someone talking after the assassination of Franz Ferdinand. They really know that they are riding the tiger.

    The next step up is to release Prozac into the water supply.
    , @Pericles
    Shut it down! Shut it down!
  268. @Hail

    How on Earth can one flip a nation so large without an armed invasion, outbreak of plague or some other catastrophe?
     
    I think there are several answers to this question, several of which New Zealand and the USA have in common. To highlight one set of them:

    Low population densities. (The legacy of) empty land ripe for settlement. Cultural-historical narratives based in frontier-settler psychology.

    As 'facts on the ground,' all the above kind of trailed off by the end of the 19th century (not sure when NZ was "fully settled," but that applies to the USA). The psychology has remained, and long past its usefulness-expiration-date. In our case in the USA, when (e.g.) Blacks moved up from the Deep South to northern urban areas in the late 1910s to 1950s, local Whites could much more easily just move on. There was always a place to 'flee' to, both psychologically and physically (due to low pop. densities).

    You are, of course, right that New Zealand is much smaller in scale, and the equivalent of a mere few hundred extended families from Bangladesh and Pakistan would already register on the demographic radar in New Zealand. Even so, regarding the failure to launch morally-serious immigration restriction programs ala Hungary (or Steve Sailer's favorite, Denmark) once it started to become clear the situation was getting out of hand, there might be a great deal of overlap with our case given comparable settler-frontier psychologies.

    Now, that is admittedly not the whole story. It cannot, e.g., explain the immigration problems in Western Europe at all. There are definitely certain USA-specific reasons why we were 'targeted,' no doubt about it. To some extent, the little-guys like New Zealand (and the medium-sized guy, Australia) kind of had to follow suit once the USA turned in that direction, as did Western Europe. We're all in it together, really.

    Some anti-US Europeans have been known to blame the USA's influence for their own nascent immigration-fueled domestic "race problems." To some extent, they are probably right. (Just don't blame Middle America White-Christians. It really wasn't us.)

    _______________

    Bing tells me that New Zealand's pop. density is half the USA's; an impressive 30% of land in New Zealand is protected and not for settlement, vs. 14% in the USA.)

    New Zealand, land area -- 101,000 sq. mi. (slightly smaller than Colorado)
    New Zealand, population -- 4,850,000 (est.) -- official numbers out in April 2019
    New Zealand, pop. density: 48 people/sq. mi. (68/sq. mi. if excluding protected areas)

    USA Lower 48, land area -- 2,959,000 sq. mi.
    USA Lower 48, population -- 325,000,000?
    USA, pop. density: 110 people/sq. mi.

    Distinguish between North and South Island, aside from Christchurch, the recent post 80s immigration wave basically ignored South Island, based on population growth figures, and demographics even in big towns like Invercargill, Nelson, and Blenheim, where the population is around 95 percent white or Maori, and annual population growth is around 0.5 percent or less, vs. 2 percent for NZ as a whole.

  269. @anon
    Peter Dutton has also been deporting paroled murderers back to New Zealan.
    You wouldn't be cranky about that, by some chance?

    New Zealand also has mechanisms for deporting Pacific Island coconut undesirable gang bangers back to Samoa and Tonga; and they do.

    NZ is not an Island Paradise: It is a tough place full of hard men.

  270. @James Forrestal

    It does sound like he was more influenced by the Pamela Gellers of this world.
     
    Yeah, that's one of the more suspicious aspects of it. See also @105

    Does the guy behind this attack count as alt-right (broadly speaking) or counter-jihad? The music/meme/8chan background point towards the alt-right but most of his talking points (including the apparent absence of "antisemitism") seem to come straight from the counter-jihad playbook.
     
    So -- an Australian is:

    >Angry enough about the non-White/ Muslim invasion to gun down 50 hajis, but

    >Completely ignores the Tribe's role in promoting that invasion. For example:

    https://lukeford.net/blog/?p=82232

    "Isi Leiber is an internationally known Jewish leader and former chairman of the board of directors of the World Jewish Congress and the former leader of the Executive Council of Australian Jewry. He was major proponent of multiculturalism, open borders, and cultural Marxism in Australia. He moved to Israel in 1999 and still advocates multiculturalism for Australia while advocating nationalism and homogeneity in Israel at the same time."

    https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2012/08/13/the-war-on-white-australia-a-case-study-in-the-culture-of-critique-part-1-of-5/

    "The national editor of the Australian Jewish News, Dan Goldberg proudly acknowledges this, noting that: “In addition to their activism on Aboriginal issues, Jews were instrumental in leading the crusade against the White Australia policy..."

    >The memes and music are largely chan culture (though "Remove Kebab" is kinda stale), but he throws in a lot of (((counterjihad)))-type references -- Tours, Vienna, heavy emphasis on Islam vs. Christianity even though not a Christian himself...

    Kinda like Breivik with some added shitposts.

    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west. If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK, and there are pozzed European countries with hardly any Jews.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    It seems that even in areas with few Jews, the Jews that are there attempt to dominate the media. And the Hollywood influence is pervasive globally.
    , @Mr. Anon

    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west.
     
    Negligable in numbers, but in influence?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Key

    If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK,.......
     
    Do they really lean to the right, or do they just vote Tory? There is a difference. Are they all of a sudden keen on preserving traditional Britain, or have they switched allegiance because of Labour's hostility towards Israel? And the Tories really aren't all that "right" anymore, are they?
    , @Matra
    If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK,

    But not on immigration. The most prominent Jewish supporters of the Conservative Party, particularly in media, have been pro-mass immigration for decades. They were especially vigilant on this at The Times (then the UK's 'paper of record' and read by most prominent Conservatives) in the years after 9/11.
    , @ben tillman

    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west.
     
    Which is laughably facile reasoning.
    , @Dave Pinsen
    A question for @Anonymous, @Mr.Anon, @Matra, and @ben tillman:

    Why do you think the Christchurch terrorist didn't criticize Jews in his manifesto? Do you think he took the time to read about obscure Serbian knights, but never saw that video clip of Barbara Lerner Spectre? Do you think he's a Mossad asset intended to steer future far right terrorists away from anti-Jewish sentiment?
  271. @anonymous

    explicitly stated that Jews/Israel aren’t his enemies, ergo he was not )))our guy(((
     
    Aren't there other whitey nationalist mofers who say something similar (Tommy Robinson...)? So, how are you mofers really different from each other?

    I feel no need to disavow.
     
    Yeah, like you lowlifes will actually disavow those dirty Whitey Terrorists, who are also anti-joomofers.

    He’s someone else’s problem.
     
    Keep deluding your accursed self. The more you rot your soul, the worse the comeuppance, and the greater our schadenfreude.

    May the Almighty One will a pox on your racist lowlife kind, and soon enough, into the worst recesses of Hell you all go.

    May the Almighty One will a pox on your racist lowlife kind, and soon enough, into the worst recesses of Hell you all go.

    Hell is just a quaint Judeo socio-religious construct.

  272. @Dave Pinsen
    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west. If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK, and there are pozzed European countries with hardly any Jews.

    It seems that even in areas with few Jews, the Jews that are there attempt to dominate the media. And the Hollywood influence is pervasive globally.

  273. @Stan
    The bombing of Serbia was led by the neocons. Neocons only care about Israel. Turkey before the rise of Erdogan was a close ally of Israel and the US. Turkey and Albanians have cultural and religious ties. The neocons were defending Israeli interests by using American military power to protects Turkish interests in Kosovo. The interesting question is if the same circumstances occurred today would Nato bomb Serbia. My educated guess is no. Turkey pursues an independent foreign policy under Erdogan. It refuses to kowtow to Israel and the US.

    The importance of Turkey in regards to US intervention in the Balkans is usually not acknowledged.

  274. @Alden
    Robert KennedyJr was a drug addict from his teen years till 60. Among other things, he almost died from a heroin overdose on a plane enroute to protest an oil field.

    He’s neither an Investigator nor an attorney. Anyone can read a trial transcript. He was drunk and showing off to his drunk buddies by driving very recklessly and a passenger was crippled for life.

    Had he not been a member of a rich family he would have been incarcerated in Massachusetts juvenile reform schools due to his criminal behavior all over Cape Cod.

    Because of bad grades bad behavior, and drug use he was expelled from several high schools.

    He, like every other person in the country who got through 5th grade, could read a trial transcript.

    BFD

    But this trial was the trial of the man accused of murdering his father. He tried to get to the bottom of what had happened and he went beyond just reading the transcript. His personal history isn’t relevant.

    • Replies: @sayless
    He is an attorney, also a law professor.
  275. @Anon

    Not bombing the shit out of Israel after the Liberty attack is pretty high up there in my opinion .

    Now say something about that being ancient history .
     
    The marine bombing by Lebanon was a lot more recent than the liberty and killed 8x more Americans. I guess you want to bomb the shit out of Lebanin 8x harder or maybe 20x harder because it was more recent , one of your own criteria. But I don't expect you to live up to your own rules.

    Interesting. Both the Marine bombing in Lebanon and the attack on the USS Liberty were committed by terrorist organizations, so I see your point.

  276. @James Speaks

    It awakened a tribal reaction in me similar to the one I had when Reginald Denny got his skull bashed in during the LA riots.
     
    Similar to the reaction I had watching the video of a preying mantis kill and eat a humming bird? (Primitives should not kill and eat advanced species.)

    Vertebrates rule! Arthropods drool!

  277. @sayless
    But this trial was the trial of the man accused of murdering his father. He tried to get to the bottom of what had happened and he went beyond just reading the transcript. His personal history isn’t relevant.

    He is an attorney, also a law professor.

  278. @jill
    Got to love this guy. Can you picture a democrat or republican senator or congressman doing this?

    https://twitter.com/RohitKachrooITV/status/1106854689604276225

    “Child.”

  279. @Anon
    Actually the US troops were part of an international peace keeping force.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.

    By comparison the marine barracks bombing was a deliberate act carried out by Lebanon and Iran and the various terror groups that are part and parcel of their government including hezbiola ,Islamic jihad ans others.

    Iran erected a monument to the attackers in Tehran not far from where Iran publicly hanged Mona Mahmudinejad and 19 other female Bahai school teachers ,some as young as teenagers.

    Americans and Israel agree that the liberty incident was an accident.

    No, not at all. The American government – under Lyndon Johnson, as directed by Johnson, and to the degree that Johnson directed them – “agreed” that it was an accident. Plenty of Americans, including senior military and intelligence officers and members of Johnson’s own cabinet, thought it was not merely “an accident”.

    • Replies: @Anon
    Official position is it was an accident. Continue larping if it pleases you.
    , @MEH 0910
    It will be interesting to see what Robert Caro digs up about the USS Liberty incident for his fifth volume of The Years of Lyndon Johnson (if he lives long enough to finish it).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Caro#The_Years_of_Lyndon_Johnson

    5. In November 2011, Caro announced that the full project had expanded to five volumes with the fifth requiring another two to three years to write.[16][17][18] It will cover Johnson and Vietnam, the Great Society and civil rights era, his decision not to run in 1968, and eventual retirement. As of May 2017, Caro has completed 400 typed manuscript pages (roughly corresponding to the "passage of the Voting Rights Act, Medicare, Medicaid and more than a dozen separate education bills" in 1965) and most of the research for the book. He intends to embark on a major research trip to Vietnam in the near future.[19] In an interview with The New York Review of Books in January 2018, Caro indicated he did not know when the book would be finished, mentioning anywhere from two to ten years.[20]
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Years_of_Lyndon_Johnson#Book_five

    In an interview with The New York Review of Books in January 2018, Caro said that he was writing about 1965 and 1966 and a non-chronological section about the relationship between Johnson and Bobby Kennedy. Asked if he still planned to visit Vietnam soon, Caro replied: "Not yet, no. This is a very long book. And there's a lot to do before that's necessary. I'm getting close to it now."[15] In December 2018, it was reported that Caro is still "several years from finishing" the volume.[16]
     
  280. @J.Ross
    Follow-up, don't download it if you're there: the NZ government, raging in its impotence, will attempt to prosecute people who are believed to have seen the video.
    https://postimg.cc/QFhvLKYn
    Anyone with a copy may face ten years in prison. Police also asking that you report friends.

    Woah are they going full Himmler on this.

    “Du hast ein Video? Schnell! Raus!!”

  281. @Steve Sailer
    My theory in 1999 was that the Chinese embassy had bought the remains of the Stealth Fighter shot down by the Serbs, so the US blew up the building where it was housed to keep them from reverse engineering it.

    But that turned out not to be true. The crashed stealth fighter was mostly disassembled by Serb country people souvenir hunters and hauled away on pickups and donkey carts.

    Cited in

    http://www.unz.com/plee/how-it-all-began-the-belgrade-embassy-bombing/

    we have reasonable-sounding scenario:

    FAIR contacted journalists at both the Observer and Politiken. According to the Observer’s U.S. correspondent, Ed Vulliamy, its foreign editor, Peter Beaumont, and Politiken reporter Jens Holsoe, their sources included the following:

    –A European NATO military officer serving in an operational capacity at the four-star level – a source at the highest possible level within NATO–confirmed three things: (1) That NATO targeted the Chinese embassy deliberately; (2) That the embassy was emitting Yugoslav military radio signals; and (3) That the target was not approved through the normal NATO channels but through a second, “American-only” track.

    –A European NATO staff officer at the two-star level in the Defense Intelligence office confirmed the same story.–

    Two U.S. sources: A very high-ranking former senior American intelligence official connected to the Balkans – “about as high as you can get,” according to one reporter — confirmed that the embassy was deliberately targeted. A mid-ranking current U.S. military official, also connected to the Balkans, confirmed elements of the story and pointedly refused to deny that the embassy had been bombed deliberately.

    –A NATO flight controller based in Naples and a NATO intelligence officer monitoring Yugoslav radio broadcasts from Macedonia each confirmed that NATO’s signals intelligence located Yugoslav military radio signals coming from the Chinese embassy in Belgrade. When they informed their superiors, they were told that the matter would be handled further up in the chain of command. Two weeks later, the embassy was bombed.

    –An official at the U.S. National Imagery and Mapping Agency told the reporters that NATO’s official explanation, which involves a faulty map of Belgrade, is a “damned lie.”

  282. @Dave Pinsen
    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west. If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK, and there are pozzed European countries with hardly any Jews.

    Maybe seeeing Muslim immigrants establish a foothold in Christchurch, of all places, in New Zealand, which has a negligible Jewish population, suggested to him that Jews weren’t the primary drivers of Muslim immigration to the west.

    Negligable in numbers, but in influence?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Key

    If you listen to Luke Ford, you know he’s pointed out that Jews lean right in places like the UK,…….

    Do they really lean to the right, or do they just vote Tory? There is a difference. Are they all of a sudden keen on preserving traditional Britain, or have they switched allegiance because of Labour’s hostility towards Israel? And the Tories really aren’t all that “right” anymore, are they?

  283. @Anon
    Liberal loon prime minister of New Zealand is going around wearing a hijib in the wake of the shooting. Good lord, she really knows how to overdo things.


    https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-asia-47592358/new-zealand-pm-we-are-un