How to Think About Replacing Hillary
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When I say “how to think,” I don’t mean “what to think.” I’m an old staff guy and my natural inclination is to figure out how to simplify the possible choices for the line guys, not make the decision myself.
How to think about rearranging the Democratic ticket is to have three categories based on what happens to Tim Kaine. If Hillary drops out, then:
A) If Kaine is promoted to the top of the ticket, the Democrats would need a new VP nominee
B) If Kaine is left as the VP, the Democrats would need a new Presidential nominee
C) If Kaine is dropped, the Democrats would need two new nominees
That’s still a pretty complicated problem, but at least it’s less amorphous when you think about it this way.
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I’d like to be the guy who goes up to Biden and tells him the team needs him – to run for VP again.
I don’t see Kaine being completely dropped; I think that would seem like too much disarray in the campaign. I hadn’t considered the idea of Kaine staying on as a VP, though.
The problem I see is that there’s no way to please everyone. No one is excited for Hillary, but everyone has at this point accepted her coronation. If Kaine gets promoted to presidential candidate, Berniebros feel like they’ve been screwed over by the DNC TWICE. Kaine probably doesn’t bring out the minorities and especially women the way Clinton does (advantage Trump) and I’m not sure he will win back any of Trump’s white guy supporters.
If they run Bernie as president and Kaine as VP, you can expect Sanders to get exactly as much of the minority vote as he did in the primaries. I don’t think he offsets this by bringing enthusiasm or more white voters, though he certainly provides greater quantities than Kaine. There’s also the question of whether he even wants it anymore. I hear life is comfortable under Clinton’s heel.
A Joe Biden sudden entrace as Presidential candidate would allow Obama to more directly sell his legacy (Obama is still bafflingly popular) and probably could compete with those crucial working whites guys against Trump. No woman or minority card on that ticket unless Kaine gets the axe, though, and I can’t see Dems running 2 white guys ever again.
Its worth considering the factions among the DNC as well. I predict if Clinton does need to be replaced we see something of a (figurative) civil war. I don’t see the smooth transition to a candidate who will flawlessly crush Trump the way so many people here believe will happen. If such a person existed, he would’ve run.
I'm no expert, but I expect that there would be huge, poorly-understood legal complications to replacing the main candidate this far along.
Every state has its own ballot access laws, typically designed to make it painful for anyone to get on the ballot last-minute to keep third parties off the ballot. (It will be a delicious irony if this year, Gary Johnson is on more states' ballots than the Democratic candidate.). Even if the election authorities want to waive those rules, doing so will likely trigger a bunch of lawsuits.
I think campaign finance laws also limit any money transfers from Hillary to some other replacement candidate. Even if she's 100% on board with being replaced, I'm not sure what kind of complications up w.r.t. her existing huge pile of funds. Again, this seems like a fertile field for a decade of legal challenges.
Most likely this will all blow over. Hillary will hold it together for the rest of the campaign, since most likely she's just a 70 year old lady who's been overdoing it to win the election, not someone hiding some massive medical secret. But if she really does have some bigger problem, the whole election could be thrown into a decade's worth of lawsuits and allegations of wrongdoing. More interestingly, whose justice department investigates any claimed wrongdoing will depend on the election outcome.Replies: @Jack D, @Jack D, @TangoMan
Biden is old and if Hillary really does need to be replaced, senescence will be on everyone's mind as a thing to avoid.
We can still have the Year of the Hispanic if we can get one or both of the San Antonio Castro brothers to head up the Democrat ticket. Go bold or not at all!
16 years as vice president
I don’t think he ever did. He was in it to make a point and seemed scared to death at the prospect of actually taking on that kind of responsibility. Interestingly, candidates who become president, despite not really wanting to, often make pretty good presidents. And the inverse is also true, hence the horror of Clinton. I don’t agree with Sanders’ politics, but at least he seems like a decent human being.
As a Senator for the most Corporate-Lawless State the lootings were better.
He's now reduced to having his spawn rob the Ukrainians.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2014/05/14/hunter-bidens-new-job-at-a-ukrainian-gas-company-is-a-problem-for-u-s-soft-power/
The problem for the media filth is not, of course, the corruption, it's the perception.
It’s fairly simple. The electors will be the same, even in those states where you can no longer change the ballot, and the media will explain ad nauseum that if you vote “Hillary Clinton” it will be a vote for x, who is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being we’ve ever collectively known in our lives, and this coverage will make it seem like x is running unopposed.
What’s complicated would be if there was a similar succession problem in the GOP. Oh, the concerned, worried frowns. Oh, this person has not been vetted by a primary process. Oh, it would be problematic to reward this shenaniganizing, and a vote for the new guy might be an endorsement of the alt-right. Tsk, tsk …
(for some reason, I keep envisioning the scene in the movie Dodgeball, where the Dodgeball chancellor struggles to rip the scepter/trophy from White Goodman’s hands yelling “It’s a by-law!” The good thing for the country is Clinton will never give up what she’s eaten dirt for her entire adult life while she is still alive.)
Bernie Sanders seems like he would be the world’s greatest campaign surrogate for a politician who held all of Bernie Sanders’ positions who wasn’t actually Bernie Sanders
Keep Kaine as VP nominee, put in Biden who promises to serve a single term.
I can see not elevating Kaine to the top of the ticket, but why the hell would they toss him? Do they want to tip Virginia red?
Isn’t fun that we’re seriously talking about this? And why do all my sentences end with question marks?
Or we get King Barak I, as he stays on to handle the national emergency brought upon us by this and certain other Russian machinations that made it all come together this way.
Tim Kaine looks like a stand-up comic on the microphone. He’s not funny, but he gives off enough nervous energy to power a small town. This takes its toll. I doubt he has the stamina to go the term. He has ‘burn-out’ written all over him.
Biden is too frail and flaky. Democraps, having just gotten rid of ill Hillary, are not going take a chance on elderly Biden.
Steve:
They don’t need to. It’s all layed out in the Robert Heinlein book “Double Star”.
A President too sick to hold office gets a body double to take their place.
I think you can pretty much rule out C. What reason could you give for taking Kaine off the ballot? It would show a real lack of continuity. Either Kaine moves up (doubtful – I doubt he polls well enough) or stays as VP (more likely). Normally the thing to do in such a situation is to bring in the elder statesman/proven winner/familiar face guy (e.g. Launtenberg in NJ) who would be Biden but Biden is a little flakey. Still he may be the best that they’ve got.
However, I’m guessing that they are going to somehow patch up Hillary enough to drag her across the finish line. The “stumble” will be forgotten in a few days for everyone except hard core Hillary haters who weren’t going to vote for her in the 1st place. They will find something Trump says or does and blow that up instead.
I can not see Hillary dropping out even if she drops dead. Her ego and will to power are extreme. She won't go and they can't make her. She can cancel the debates. And just run commercials, including highly edited "talks with the American people"--which can be from months back. Whatever it is will be deemed temporary. "Vote for her and she'll be fine on inauguration day. And if by some "fluke" she isn't Tim Kaine will be ready. You'll have stopped that Nazi Donald Trump from becoming president."Replies: @JL
This is all based on the premise that she is still alive. I suppose that’s the way to bet. Or they could just run her “double”. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Was_Monty%27s_Double_(film)
They don't need to. It's all layed out in the Robert Heinlein book "Double Star".
A President too sick to hold office gets a body double to take their place.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @I, Libertine, @NOTA, @fish, @SteveRogers42
“Double Star” is really a good short sci-fi novel. Heinlein was pushing 50 and very much in his prime. The plot is very clever and Heinlein is hugely informative on two disparate topics: acting and parliamentary politics. As an American, I don’t know that much about parliamentary politics, but at least I’ve read “Double Star.”
Heinlein, with his libertarian-lite approach and Americana politics, is a good ideological fount for the alt-right (until they of course become the "right")..Replies: @The most deplorable one, @guest
Have you read his address to the Brigade of Midshipmen at the Naval Academy?
On my IP home page there’s a story reporting that Clinton campaign ‘insiders’ state that she has ‘many talents’ but that staying hydrated is not one of them. She doesn’t drink enough water and this caused her recent problem! Talk about spin and damage control, she’s just dehydrated according to the spinmeisters. It’s probably too late now, they’ll pump her up with whatever drugs she needs and do whatever is necessary to make her appear normal. They’ll take her off the ventilator in the van and bring her out to make a statement that she’s feeling great and then go back in. As long as they can trick the public and get elected then afterwards whatever happens can take place. Kaine is certainly a compliant party man ready to carry out the will of the .1% whilst throwing bones to the sexually obsessed weirdo constituency. Should she die before the election then they’re sunk. Sanders is off with his new house and probably couldn’t be coaxed back while Biden is such an embarrassing moron that every time he opens his mouth it’s a cringeworthy event. Warren looks like the best bet. It’ll be the highlight of the year to see Clinton fall out and collapse during the debates.
She seems to drink plenty of water to help silence her coughing fits. Though, there's an article from slate stating that apparently she hates drinking water. I wonder why? Will too much water cause her to melt?
From the article:http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/09/12/does_hillary_clinton_really_hate_water.htmlReplies: @Chrisnonymous, @Anonymous
It's the battle of the uninhibited blowhards!Replies: @The most deplorable one
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
Characterizing that collapse as a "stumble" however...
I knew it, she caught rabies!
Actually, best to leave Hillary right where she is, assuming she doesn’t croak. Hate to energize the Democrat base with a new candidate. Still and all, Democrats are going to vote Democrat, Trumpers will vote Trump. I’d say the lines are well and truly drawn this time, few or likely no crossovers this year. Perhaps some Democrat men, worn down by Hillary’s incessant cackle and their wives high-fiving each other over Hillary may cheat and vote Trump. Minorities, and especially females that vote Democrat, forget them, they’re lost and damned souls. Only thing that matters is who and how many show up in November.
I’d go with Kaine as president and Warren as vp.
If Hillary dies she should remain at the top of the ticket. This would be as good a place as any to end this charade.
The quibble I’d have is the people making the decisions would not use that process. The committee that would vote on a replacement is 400+ people with personal agendas. The inner core, the Super Delegates, would have their own agenda so the core of people involved would not be all 400+, but it would still include a lot of people who hate each other.
The Assembly of Notables would look unified by comparison.
“On my IP home page there’s a story reporting that Clinton campaign ‘insiders’ state that she has ‘many talents’ but that staying hydrated is not one of them.”
She seems to drink plenty of water to help silence her coughing fits. Though, there’s an article from slate stating that apparently she hates drinking water. I wonder why? Will too much water cause her to melt?
From the article:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/09/12/does_hillary_clinton_really_hate_water.html
This would explain the metal falling out of her pants too: a clip holding together her fake skin!!!!!
Now why didn't I think of that!
http://youtu.be/uQJ8WrKnLUs
In the Washington Post:
“The man who discovered CTE thinks Hillary Clinton may have been poisoned”
“Bennet Omalu, the forensic pathologist who has made the NFL so uncomfortable with his discovery of chronic traumatic encephalopathy in the brains of deceased players, suggests that Hillary Clinton’s campaign be checked for possible poisons after her collapse Sunday in New York.”
. . .
“‘I do not trust Mr. Putin and Mr. Trump. With those two all things are possible.’”
So, a modern folk hero, a black doctor, is talking about Clinton’s health, suggesting there is more going on then is being said, and suggesting a way that it is Putin’s and Trump’s fault. A conspiracy of hidden health problems. A conspiracy of causing those problems. Do these campaigns need some Turkish advisors?
Let's take a look at what an actual medical journal has to say on when CTE was first discovered.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2995699/Also, I'm sure this won't be a huge surprise, but I thought this part of Omalu's Wikipedia page might be interesting to readers of this blog.
Sanders would do much better with blacks in the general election, simply because he’d be running as a Democrat, and blacks vote about 90% Democratic. His problem would probably be turnout–lack of enthusiasm for Bernie wouldn’t win Trump votes, but it might deprive Bernie and down ticket Dems of some votes.
I’m no expert, but I expect that there would be huge, poorly-understood legal complications to replacing the main candidate this far along.
Every state has its own ballot access laws, typically designed to make it painful for anyone to get on the ballot last-minute to keep third parties off the ballot. (It will be a delicious irony if this year, Gary Johnson is on more states’ ballots than the Democratic candidate.). Even if the election authorities want to waive those rules, doing so will likely trigger a bunch of lawsuits.
I think campaign finance laws also limit any money transfers from Hillary to some other replacement candidate. Even if she’s 100% on board with being replaced, I’m not sure what kind of complications up w.r.t. her existing huge pile of funds. Again, this seems like a fertile field for a decade of legal challenges.
Most likely this will all blow over. Hillary will hold it together for the rest of the campaign, since most likely she’s just a 70 year old lady who’s been overdoing it to win the election, not someone hiding some massive medical secret. But if she really does have some bigger problem, the whole election could be thrown into a decade’s worth of lawsuits and allegations of wrongdoing. More interestingly, whose justice department investigates any claimed wrongdoing will depend on the election outcome.
Still, I agree that the most likely scenario is that the antibiotics will kick in, they will play with the rest of her meds and with a little bit of luck and careful stage management she will last at least until Election Day and beyond. But it's a crap shoot - her handlers are literally (in their atheist way) praying that there won't be more days like Sunday.
It will be interesting to see what conditions the DNC will demand for the debates that are tailored to Hillary's medical condition - studio kept below 70, no bright lights, bathroom breaks, etc. They will also ask for a rule that the candidates not leave their podiums but even if they get it, Trump will ignore it. Trump will leave his podium to contrast with Hillary who will be afraid to do so. He won't get in Hillary's personal space which will be seen as attacking a weak woman but he will symbolically approach the audience instead.Replies: @You Can't Buy Me Hot Dog MAN!, @rod1963, @SteveRogers42
Laws are for little people. We have laws banning foreign contributions to campaigns and Obama turned off geographic location data for credit card contributions. Against the law and no punishment.
Law is not a rational endeavor, rather it's a rationalizing endeavor.Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson
They don't need to. It's all layed out in the Robert Heinlein book "Double Star".
A President too sick to hold office gets a body double to take their place.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @I, Libertine, @NOTA, @fish, @SteveRogers42
I thought that was Dave.
They don't need to. It's all layed out in the Robert Heinlein book "Double Star".
A President too sick to hold office gets a body double to take their place.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @I, Libertine, @NOTA, @fish, @SteveRogers42
You know, we really missed our best chance of a Double Star scenario when Sarah Palin didn’t wind up as VP. Tina Fey would have made a *great* double for her.
I still go with the idea that the election will be postponed until such time as the process is stabilized to ensure a fair and meaningful contest. This means, by necessity, that Obama will remain as ‘acting’ president for the foreseeable future – by that I mean, delay after delay.
Since the Constitution is now nothing but a ‘scrap of paper’ whose meaning is whatever the powers-that-be want it to mean, it should not stand in the way. Then, too, the federal government has become a democrat stronghold for all intents and purposes.
The states run the elections, and they won't all go along with a dictate from the central government. Some would go along, but that would essentially be a boycott of the election that would apparently deprive them of the ability to submit electoral votes. Then, Trump/Pence would win (presuming the House speaker does not take the Democrats' side), and the Democrats would ignore the Constitution and applicable statute to declare the election void. That's not the same as postponing it.
As an avid consumer of political comedy, I have to admit that I *long* for a Trump/Biden debate.
It’s the battle of the uninhibited blowhards!
Oh, wait. Forbes claims Trump has overestimated his net worth, and instead of it being around 9B they claim it's around 4.1B, so I guess he didn't build up a multi-billion dollar fortune in private enterprise.
Dead
Kaine will remain on the Ballot. I can’t imagine they would remove him at this point. To keep their coalition together they would try hard to get a minority or female on the ticket, thus they may need to put Kaine on the top of the ticket and someone like Corey Booker or Elizabeth Warren as VP.
by promoting Kaine to the top of the ticket it just accomplishes what would occur if Hillary was elected and passes away or becomes incapacitated in the next 12 months. Kaine could give the appearance of choosing the VP, which might help him appear more presidential. By nominating a minority he may help keep the coalition from fracturing. Since the Press is 100% against Trump, he would get significant praise from the talking heads no matter whom he “selects” as his VP.
The only place Biden belongs is in a denture commercial. That winning smile will have the great-grannies gushin’ while rushin’ to their phones.
Call in the next five minutes and we’ll throw in an extra failed administration… FOR FREE!
That story about not drinking water is pretty weird. These people are saying that Clinton keeps having health episodes simply because she won’t drink enough, even though they keep telling her she needs to drink. If taken at face value, it’s very unflattering—the story of someone who is ignorant and stubborn to the point of hazardous incompetence. That such an unflattering story is being told be her supporters, as a way of supporting her, does a lot to suggest deeper problems.
OT: some very nice photos at this link of the classic America late 40s to 60s in NYC:
http://www.realclearlife.com/2016/07/29/spring-studios-life-photo-exhibit/
You can see that “hot models” then were very similar to hot models today. As opposed to early 20th c. where the hot women were not so great.
The last photo at bottom of page is pretty amazing. Very modern appearances but it’s 1958!!! The lovely ladies look like Taylor Swift etc.
No way is she giving up the nomination voluntarily! The DNC will literally have to pry it from her cold dead hand!
As intriguing as all this is, it’s speculation. And the Clinton Machine is not going to give up this chance at grabbing the brass ring. They’ve done too much and come so far that abandoning this campaign is not going to happen. Not saying that’s a sensible position for a 68 year old woman clearly in poor health. Simply they are not going away now.
I suppose Obama can pardon her for all past crimes before leaving office, if he chooses, but I don't know if she can count on that.Replies: @Jack D
They may be stuck with two white males.
However, I'm guessing that they are going to somehow patch up Hillary enough to drag her across the finish line. The "stumble" will be forgotten in a few days for everyone except hard core Hillary haters who weren't going to vote for her in the 1st place. They will find something Trump says or does and blow that up instead.Replies: @iSteveFan, @Prof. Woland, @guest, @AnotherDad
First, I really hope Hillary stays in the race.
Second, if they don’t promote Kaine, won’t that show that they do not think he is qualified to be President? After all the VP is someone who is supposed to be qualified to take the place of the President in an emergency. By skipping Kaine, you are saying this guy doesn’t have the chops.
I would say if Hillary leaves, the choice is either A or C. Choice B would be an admission that Kaine is not presidential, and would allow the GOP to use it as an issue. Trump could ask why the democrats would pick a VP whose only real job is to takeover for the President, and then when that situation arises, point out they didn’t use him.
I don't see how you don't promote Kaine. He would have been the guy promoted if this all happened a few months later after Hillary was elected. And even a bigger embarrassment in this case, because it would be coming from Hillary's health issues, which whatever they want to claim had to be "known".
Sure there's an identity politics for the Democrats here ... but that's their own damn fault. I assume they'd fix it by tossing Fauxahontas onto the ticket. (Could be Booker or a Castro, but realistically the Democrats depend so highly on petulant female grievance and basically the state fulfilling the husband role for single women who don't yet have a husband, i really think their identity politics meter is flashing "need a woman" this year.)
I get your staff/line distinction here and it is really important. Especially important to grasp as self-reflection, since it is good to know how one approaches problems.
I wonder how well the staff/line thing works here though. Staff is more useful advising line up the line when there is a clear line up. How well does that work in an inherently politicized–indeed inherently anarchic and chaotic–organization, like a national political party? Especially one that is likely far more chaotic than the norm given the odd circumstances.
A professor of mine used to contrast executive (administrative) rationality with legislative (political) rationality. Both could aspire to rationality of a sort but since they were different they had to follow different paths.
This situation is pretty political. The idea of breaking it down first into a basic set of simple decisions like which choice prompts what next choice is valuable. But I think it will pale by comparison to the larger political questions–thanks, staff, for attempting to make this rational, but you better duck and cover since the guns are coming out.
Kaine becomes President and Obama runs as VP, with understanding Kaine will step down and allows Obama to takeover.
Obama wouldn’t have run for President, which isn’t allowed by the Constitution.
The clowns on the Supreme court would be paid to sign off on it.
Strange times we living in.
However, I'm guessing that they are going to somehow patch up Hillary enough to drag her across the finish line. The "stumble" will be forgotten in a few days for everyone except hard core Hillary haters who weren't going to vote for her in the 1st place. They will find something Trump says or does and blow that up instead.Replies: @iSteveFan, @Prof. Woland, @guest, @AnotherDad
If Kaine cannot be moved up to President because he lacks the timber then there is not point having him on the ticket as V.P. either because that is the only reason he is there anyway. If Clinton was removed and Kaine were to remain in the Veep spot he would be the political living dead.
The question is if the Democrat voters are ready for a white male candidate.
They’ve sent out absentee ballots in N Carolina already. IF they do change the ticket, what do they do about people who already voted for her?
I feel like preserving some sense of continuity and order would be priority #1. Therefore, the presidential candidate could only be Sanders, Biden, or Tim Kaine. If Sanders or Biden, then Kaine must stay on VP candidate. If Kaine moves up to the top spot, then they have more options for what to do about the vice-president.
Of the options, Biden/Kaine has a lot going for it. Sure, various persons would be annoyed that the ticket is two white men again, but the excuse is it’s an emergency! … and we’ve brought you Obama’s right hand man instead!
If it’s to be Kaine for president, how about Kaine/Condoleezza Rice? What’s she been up to lately, anyway? I’m assuming she’s a #NeverTrumper. They would lock up the neocon vote (take that, Evan McMullin). I guess I’m joking: Powell and Rice went from national darlings to fairly toxic because of destroying the Middle East.
Meanwhile, corruption still operates in DC:
http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/12/exclusive-john-kerrys-state-department-funneled-millions-to-his-daughters-nonprofit/
You would think that a guy could get parole after 8.
I mention this only because I’m sure someone at the DNC has already thought of it:
JEB!
He represents the same agenda and most of the same people as Clinton. He doesn’t explicitly support Black Lives Matter but he’ll eagerly kiss their a** because it helps destroy America.
The Democratic wing of the Uniparty could sell it as “ultimate bipartisanship” to defeat The Threat That Is Trump, who they say is JUST LIKE HITLER and hangs out with WHITE SUPREMACISTS who think Asians are smarter than they are.
They don't need to. It's all layed out in the Robert Heinlein book "Double Star".
A President too sick to hold office gets a body double to take their place.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @I, Libertine, @NOTA, @fish, @SteveRogers42
I’m not sure that Bill could keep quiet long enough to allow it to work. “Somebody” might need to arrange for adjoining plots.
As I’ve said a couple of times already, it will go like this.
If Hillary is removed for any reason, Tim Kaine will automatically advance to the top of the ticket, just as he would automatically advance to the presidency if he and Hillary had already been elected. The continuity of the ticket is precisely what the nomination process is there to ensure. If you’re voting Democrat in November, you aren’t just voting “Hillary for Prez!” and that’s that; you’re voting for the ticket that the party decided upon at the convention. I’m not sure why this simple fact isn’t sinking in with some people.
Thus, Tim Kaine will be temporarily in the catbird seat; he will have the right of first refusal. However, everyone, himself included, knows that he is not top-ticket material, so as a practical matter he will most likely cede that position to someone else. But in order for the Democrats to avoid a succession crisis, it is important that Tim Kaine stays on the ticket and that his acquiescence appear voluntary. Therefore Kaine will remain on as VP. If he does that, the party will accept whoever the new nominee is. The one thing that people cannot accept is the idea of someone just stepping in with no claim to the title. In that case men feel as if they are in the position of slaves and the political process loses its legitimacy.
Bernie will have no part in this. His loss in the primary election still registers psychologically as a loss, period. He is not a part of the ticket. Biden is the natural heir apparent, having been VP under Obama and a seasoned elder statesman in his own right.
With Hillary out it will be Biden-Kaine.
One further point. I must vehemently disagree with those expressing the hope that Hillary will stay in the race, as if the sweet justice of seeing Trump trounce her were worth the risk. Nothing so negates the possibility of a Hillary presidency as a disqualified or dead Hillary. From a political standpoint, anything that reduces that possibility is much to be preferred. Why even take a chance on it?
It's the battle of the uninhibited blowhards!Replies: @The most deplorable one
Yeah, and two guys who build up multi-billion dollar fortunes in private enterprise.
Oh, wait. Forbes claims Trump has overestimated his net worth, and instead of it being around 9B they claim it’s around 4.1B, so I guess he didn’t build up a multi-billion dollar fortune in private enterprise.
Really OT: Can anyone explain why Sam Sododeh, 48, and Barzeen Soroudi, 40, of Los Angeles would have such strong feelings about Ryan Lochte?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3786509/Ryan-Lochte-gets-rushed-protester-Dancing-Stars-performance-dramatic-season-premiere.html
Maybe they were offended on behalf of Brazil and their machismo demanded retaliation, like Brazilian soccer fans who attack refs that make decisions against their team.
Don't like it? Living without violent interruptions is white man's priviledge. Get used to Brasil Norte.
A recent PPP poll of Florida– a not-unimportant swing state, Electoral College-wise– showed 6% of Republicans planning to vote for Clinton, and 16% of Democrats planning to vote for Trump. (That is in addition to the massive advantage of Republicans, this year, in voter registrations changed from Democrat to Republican, across the country.) Is that year personal idea of “few or likely no crossovers this year,” Mr. Christian?
Lots of fast and loose played with polls. CNN likely wouldn't agree, but are they correct and your poll wrong? Fox's? ABC/WashPost? Errors of margin give them lots of wriggle-room, too. Polls are ether, not to be believed. But, if they make a body feel better..Replies: @D. K.
Three points that should be noted before further analysis: (1) If the Hildabeast does leave the race what happens after that will be decided by the dimocrat establishment. (2) Kaine was handpicked by the Hildabeast and the dimocrat establishment to “balance” a ticket headed by Clinton. (3) At this point Biden really is too worn out to invigorate a failing campaign.
Point (1) suggests that there is no way Bernie Sanders will become the dimocrat candidate unless all other options have been rejected as worse. Point (2) suggests that if the dimocratrs dump the Hildabeast they will also dump Kaine and start with a clean slate. Point (3) suggests that only desperation will lead to Biden replacing Clinton.
If Clinton does drop out, I expect Warren will be put on the slate to guarantee retaining the support of the prog feminist base. This same base is strongly represented within the dimocrat establishment that will be deciding the new slate. This just about makes her a shoo-in. Our current Negro affirmative action president had even less experience than Warren and more baggage but was elected. I could see the dimocrats taking a chance on another affirmative action candidate with sex being the operative category this time around. The VP candidate then could be just about anybody.
OTOH, the dimocrat establishment might be nervous about such an untried candidate as Warren and hope to save her for future use. THe VP slot would be good for her but they still need to pick a presidential candidate. Point (2) above suggests this will not be Kaine. Forget Sanders [see point(1) above] . No one except Biden sticks out as a possibility. The desperation slate may be Biden/Warren; or some other well known dimocrat establishment figure paired with Warren.
I started predicting a Biden/Warren ticket two years ago and that’s my prediction right now.
in one sense you’d think all considerations should be subservient to victory. does replacing kaine look not so good. maybe yes but if victory is made more likely by a risk to optics so be it.
the main problem i have is that victory for the party is also competing with victory for factions within the party for primacy, and different actors will take different risks in weighing party-partisan versus faction-partisan considerations.
thought of this way, kaine may still be the best bet for all. it seems really unlikely that the party will bring in the second place finisher bernie. i think the party hard people ruled him out for a reason–the same reason they are averse to trump, because he would be unpredictable. but the left will need to be mollified somehow and i doubt that the other likely choices like biden would do it. why not kaine? the optics are right. he is as you say the textbook choice, as the vp selection. he is certainly not as unpredictable as bernie–he is likely to use the rule book as president. but at the same time he probably really is what the right says he is–a fairly strong leftie at heart and by instinct and training.
Don’t you think that if these drugs existed that they would be using them already? The problem obviously is that they have exhausted the limits of medicine. They can’t keep her pumped up for even 2 hours in public, or rather, some days they can and sometimes they can’t. It will be a crapshoot whether the debates fall on “good days” or “bad days”.
Even though she is an evil woman, it’s still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer’s took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can’t see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.
But, as the joke goes, "they've achieved a learning curve": the meds will be re-titrated; her schedule adjusted. Already Bill and Co. are campaigning on her behalf, which probably brings in more votes anyway.
Well the nuclear option is always a daily 100mg+ dose of d-methamphetamine. Combine with high doses of diazepam to stop the crash and force sleep at the end of the day. Add in oxycodone to distract from any discomfort or pain related to whatever she has. That regiment could get a 90 lbs. terminal cancer patient to lead a punk rock group on a non-stop concert tour.
Well at least for a few months. After a 2 month binge, the patient's body would be totally wrecked and plagued with serious dependency, withdrawal, and brain damage. That's true for healthy young men, let alone a sick obese grandma. For that reason I doubt this route is considered anything except a last resort. But I'm pretty sure if Hillary *needs* to power through, modern pharmaceutical science has its ways.Replies: @Jack D, @rod1963
No, it's not.
"No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage."
No one is forcing her. This is her choice. I truly believe she'd appear in public with a leaky colostomy bag if that's what it took for her to win.
"Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer’s took hold. "
However one feels about the Reagans--and I was not a fan--they understood the concept of dignity. The Clintons do not.
In my more compassionate moments I think that is a possibility (that she is a puppet of some external handlers).
Still I cannot come up with a more plausible explanation than that this woman is a power-hungry virago who got this far by dominating weaker egos, and none of them are going to dissent, since a) siding with power leads to opportunity and b) dissent in the Clintons' circles tends to lead to peculiar demises.
I think I read double star on iSteve’s recommendation but I certainly read the Moon is a Harsh Mistress because of this site (in a single sitting to boot).
Heinlein, with his libertarian-lite approach and Americana politics, is a good ideological fount for the alt-right (until they of course become the “right”)..
A couple of things stand out:
1. The naive view that if you jumble enough computing power together it will become sentient.
2. The totally uninformed by any studies of real humans (or evolutionary principles) views about how marriage and sexual relations will occur on the moon. Totally blank-slate thinking.Replies: @NOTA
In that case we can switch to "Starship Troopers."
If we swerve to become hippies, there's "Stranger in a Strange Land."
Slate: Facts are Racist
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/06/29/reuters_hillary_clinton_supporters_are_pretty_racist_too.html
The racial makeup of the city was 82.5% White, 5.8% African American, 0.2% Native American, 6.9% Asian, 2.1% from other races, and 2.5% from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 5.3% of the population.
I'm no expert, but I expect that there would be huge, poorly-understood legal complications to replacing the main candidate this far along.
Every state has its own ballot access laws, typically designed to make it painful for anyone to get on the ballot last-minute to keep third parties off the ballot. (It will be a delicious irony if this year, Gary Johnson is on more states' ballots than the Democratic candidate.). Even if the election authorities want to waive those rules, doing so will likely trigger a bunch of lawsuits.
I think campaign finance laws also limit any money transfers from Hillary to some other replacement candidate. Even if she's 100% on board with being replaced, I'm not sure what kind of complications up w.r.t. her existing huge pile of funds. Again, this seems like a fertile field for a decade of legal challenges.
Most likely this will all blow over. Hillary will hold it together for the rest of the campaign, since most likely she's just a 70 year old lady who's been overdoing it to win the election, not someone hiding some massive medical secret. But if she really does have some bigger problem, the whole election could be thrown into a decade's worth of lawsuits and allegations of wrongdoing. More interestingly, whose justice department investigates any claimed wrongdoing will depend on the election outcome.Replies: @Jack D, @Jack D, @TangoMan
As you say, the ballot laws are geared toward keeping 3rd party candidates off the ballot. They are NOT geared toward depriving one of the two major parties from a position on the ballot. When one of the major parties gets caught up in some technicality intended to thwart 3rd parties, the courts tend to excuse the slip up because giving the people a choice between a Republican and a Democrat is a fundamental feature of our system, especially in a Presidential election. Even though the 2 party system (ANY party system) is not Constitutionally enshrined, it forms part of our “unwritten constitution”.
The media could spend the last weeks saying: "Vote for Hillary anyway, and get the new DNC choice, who's really great, trust us," but that's an impossible sell. It'd be like a website telling people to order the Galaxy 7 anyway, even though it's being recalled, and they'll just substitute a different model. And why should anyone trust them now, after they hid Hillary's health problems for this long?
I think the election might be over. Get ready for President Trump.
The Democratic party replacing their headline nominee at the 11th hour is wishful thinking. I wouldn’t bet on it.
Would this crowd mind heading over to Wonkette.com and making some obvious Steve Sailer points to that crowd? I did and got perma-banned, but it was quite entertaining.
“That’s still a pretty complicated problem, but at least it’s less amorphous when you think about it this way.”
You won’t get anywhere if you don’t stop using that White Man’s Logic. As Vox says, it’s a real blind spot that prevents progress.
Maybe Hill’s doctors could straight-up merge her with the van, like Ng in Snowcrash. She’d never have to leave, no more embarrassing collapses—problem solved.
I'm no expert, but I expect that there would be huge, poorly-understood legal complications to replacing the main candidate this far along.
Every state has its own ballot access laws, typically designed to make it painful for anyone to get on the ballot last-minute to keep third parties off the ballot. (It will be a delicious irony if this year, Gary Johnson is on more states' ballots than the Democratic candidate.). Even if the election authorities want to waive those rules, doing so will likely trigger a bunch of lawsuits.
I think campaign finance laws also limit any money transfers from Hillary to some other replacement candidate. Even if she's 100% on board with being replaced, I'm not sure what kind of complications up w.r.t. her existing huge pile of funds. Again, this seems like a fertile field for a decade of legal challenges.
Most likely this will all blow over. Hillary will hold it together for the rest of the campaign, since most likely she's just a 70 year old lady who's been overdoing it to win the election, not someone hiding some massive medical secret. But if she really does have some bigger problem, the whole election could be thrown into a decade's worth of lawsuits and allegations of wrongdoing. More interestingly, whose justice department investigates any claimed wrongdoing will depend on the election outcome.Replies: @Jack D, @Jack D, @TangoMan
My guess is both. She’s not 70 BTW, but 68. She looks a lot worse than a lot of 68 year old women. She looks like someone who is 68 AND has serious medical problems. Nowadays there are a lot of healthy and vigorous 68 year olds but she is not one of them.
Still, I agree that the most likely scenario is that the antibiotics will kick in, they will play with the rest of her meds and with a little bit of luck and careful stage management she will last at least until Election Day and beyond. But it’s a crap shoot – her handlers are literally (in their atheist way) praying that there won’t be more days like Sunday.
It will be interesting to see what conditions the DNC will demand for the debates that are tailored to Hillary’s medical condition – studio kept below 70, no bright lights, bathroom breaks, etc. They will also ask for a rule that the candidates not leave their podiums but even if they get it, Trump will ignore it. Trump will leave his podium to contrast with Hillary who will be afraid to do so. He won’t get in Hillary’s personal space which will be seen as attacking a weak woman but he will symbolically approach the audience instead.
It's a hollowed out piece of wood
Throw it on the ground
https://youtu.be/gAYL5H46QnQ
It doesn't address the fact she had two medics in attendance with her at the 9/11 memorial - the brunette pulse taker and the big black guy(aka: Mr. Epipen).
Add in the fact her staff wasn't shocked by her having a seizure and not taking to a ER shows that it must be a common occurrence with her.
According to MD's it points to neurological problems - probably Parkingsons.
She won't get better and the drugs she's taking do lose their effectiveness over time as the disease progresses. I think she is betting on them working well enough until election day.
If she bets wrong, she's finished.
It will also be very interesting to see how she pulls off a debate Trump with her deteriorating condition.
http://nation.foxnews.com/2016/09/11/judge-jeanine-your-apology-isnt-going-work-hillary
"Healthy and vigorous" indeed!
I actually find this plausible assuming she is incontinent and wearing a catheter and/or Depends. In those circumstances it seems reasonable (if risky) to try minimizing water consumption. I doubt dehydration is her only problem (and still want more detail released concerning her medical records), but I can see how dehydration would not help her response to other issues (making the dehydration statement a classic Clintonian “literally true” misdirection).
Characterizing that collapse as a “stumble” however…
The best thing for Democrats now is to leave Kaine in the VP slot and run Michael Bloomberg in Hillary’s place. He will blunt Trump’s appeal as the law and order candidate and give middle of the road Republicans a reason to defect. The Democrats will have to give up on Hillary appointing the first Muslim Supreme court justice, but that will come soon since Bloomberg will complete the project of installing a permanent progressive majority by refusing to end third world mass immigration and colluding with the Republican leadership to finally deliver on Amnesty.
Heinlein, with his libertarian-lite approach and Americana politics, is a good ideological fount for the alt-right (until they of course become the "right")..Replies: @The most deplorable one, @guest
I have read The Moon is a Harsh Mistress several times, separated by more than 30 years between the first and then subsequent readings.
A couple of things stand out:
1. The naive view that if you jumble enough computing power together it will become sentient.
2. The totally uninformed by any studies of real humans (or evolutionary principles) views about how marriage and sexual relations will occur on the moon. Totally blank-slate thinking.
How would a Hillary exit affect immigration policy during the next 4 years? I am assuming the democrat wins. I can understand open border for Hispanics. They are our neighbors, same hemisphere, not much of a threat to the primacy of whites, more than a few are assimilating. Kaine likes them a lot. But what about Muslim immigration. Is there a faction of democrat interest groups who do not want Muslims moving to the US?
AIPAC. And that is some deep pockets, bro.
Off topic but you may find this interesting.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/13/expel-hungary-from-eu-for-hostility-to-refugees-says-luxembourg
We can only pray that Orban is right when he says:
A week ago, Orbán continued this argument at a press conference with the rightwing Polish politician Jarosław Kaczyński, in which he called for Europe and its institutions to be reworked in favour of a rightwing vision. “We are at a historic cultural moment,” said Orbán. “There is a possibility of a cultural counter-revolution right now.”
They knew she was sick which suggests they were okay with Kaine replacing her mid-term
(which suggests the dirt they have on him is pretty extreme)
however I doubt they’d want him as the candidate in the election.
Their best bet in the circumstances is probably Biden but two white dudes might not enthuse the coalition.
So Biden-Kaine maybe or Biden-Castro if they think they can get away with changing both.
It’s too early for this. I don’t like all this talk of Hillary’s health. You can’t depend on your opponent dropping dead to win elections. Most of our attention should be focused on defeating her ideologically and demographically. Once the right wins, then we can discuss ways to make an example of her.
and in reality the media are the real opposition.Replies: @Jim Don Bob
What about replacing Hillary with Chelsea?
They’re not going to pick Bernie. He’s more palatable to the power structure than Trump, but not by very much.
Biden is old and if Hillary really does need to be replaced, senescence will be on everyone’s mind as a thing to avoid.
He can run for “12 years a Vice President.”
It would still involve convincing 50 states and who knows how many counties, many run by Republicans, to change their laws at the last minute for the benefit of the Democrats. Ballots have already been prepared. It’s too late for a do-over.
The media could spend the last weeks saying: “Vote for Hillary anyway, and get the new DNC choice, who’s really great, trust us,” but that’s an impossible sell. It’d be like a website telling people to order the Galaxy 7 anyway, even though it’s being recalled, and they’ll just substitute a different model. And why should anyone trust them now, after they hid Hillary’s health problems for this long?
I think the election might be over. Get ready for President Trump.
Bespoke rebootic prosthetics are being designed as we type to keep her vertical during debates
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-geR-e20NWw0/ViVAYjNQUAI/AAAAAAAADbQ/w-LG1JwCTx8/s1600/lecter.jpg
As I’m not American, I’m surprised that a and b are even options. Kaine was selected by a specific presidential candidate for VP; he wasn’t elected/chosen by the public or his party. It is anti-democratic to upgrade Kaine to the presidential candidate or to keep him on as VP, (unless the next Democrat presidential candidate also selects him for VP).
Two new candidates (or Kaine as VP as above) must emerge, and there has to be some process akin to the primaries, where the Democrats vote for a new presidential candidate. To make this process fair, early votes must be nullified, and the November elections must be postponed for the time it takes to carry out this process fairly. In the meantime, there is an interim government, with someone in government who typically has a ceremonial or symbolic kind of role temporarily standing in as president. In my country, the prime minister is the key leader; the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?
Even the mere thought that Obama or Biden (or Michelle! or Chelsea!!) stand in during an interim government must be obliterated. Any lingering damage in delaying the November elections is far less severe than permitting Obama (or any president) to govern a minute over his elected term(s). America is not a monarchy or a dictatorship.
Here's how it would go: Clinton dies in September. In November people go to the polls and check the box for Clinton/Kaine. Although Clinton and Kaine's names are on the ballot, the people are actually voting for a slate of electors who have pledged their loyalty to Clinton/Kaine. Now let's say that turnout is 106% in Philly and "Clinton" wins the election. She wasn't actually the winner; her electors were. Then in December electors from the 50 states and DC meet to elect the president. The ones loyal to Trump/Pence vote for Trump for president and Pence for VP (note the they don't have to, and on very rare occasions a few electors actually vote for someone else)
Ok but Clinton is dead, so the electors loyal to her have to come up with an alternative. Who will they vote for? Almost certainly they will vote for whomever the Democratic party elite chose to replace Clinton back in September or October.
This seems like a crazy system, but it makes sense. One of the goals was to avoid the tragedy of Athens. The Athenian people voted for an ever expanding empire. Eventually they voted to fight Sparta and were crushed. So the elector system is to prevent democracy.
"the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?"
Well is was supposed to be the president... except that at the time the US was vulnerable to its more centralized rivals. Cincinnatus was a big inspiration and in fact George Washington was called the American Cincinnatus. Cincinnatus had been a very powerful man but after setbacks he had to become a poor farmer. Then when the Roman Republic was in trouble they elected him supreme dictator for the purpose of winning a war. He won the war and after fifteen days he went back to plowing his field. Then pretty much the same thing happened again.
The US started our with a parliamentary system called the Continental Congress. The president of the CC was what we would now call a prime minister. The system was untested (remember that this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn't get one for 43 more years). So the system was deemed too weak to survive a vengeful Britain. Thus the new system had a stronger president as commander in chief. The idea was that a powerful president would be able to win wars that a prime minister might not be able to.
So one of the major roles of the President is to always be available to fend off enemies. This means that there can never be a time without one, and so the system is designed to ensure that there always is one. The system (electors voting for anyone rather than the public voting for candidates on a ballot) is set up so that elections never need to be delayed and never have been, even during the brutal Civil War. There was also the election of 1812 which happened during the War of 1812 in which Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians.Replies: @AnotherGuessModel, @Kylie, @dearieme, @Nico
OT
Senior EU commissar Jean Asselborn (Assholeborn) is threatening to throw the state of Hungary out of the EU – because Hungary has doubts about the wisdom of Hungarians by Afro/Asians.
‘It’s not European to resist giving up your national home to third world aliens who feel entitled to it’ snorts Assholeborn (in effect).
Anyhow, note how bigtime EU commissars feel free to bully,humiliate, sneer at and tyrannize economically weaker former eastern bloc states.
They would never have dared do that to Britain when Britain used to stand up for itself.
The irony is that the vulnerable former communist east European states joined the EU partly because they thought it would give them a voice with the strong, and parity of esteem.
How wrong they were.
It is as plain as paint that the EU puts a higher priority on the lives of black/brown invaders of Europe – to the point where they will inevitably take over, than it does on protecting the integrity of the ancient peoples of Europe.
The EU is evil. Pure evil.
Brexit was right. And courageous.
Hydrophobia!
I knew it, she caught rabies!
How about this as a scenario:
The Deep State has always tried to play both sides of the street. Donald J. Trump is as much their pawn as Hillary. They know they need to pull the country back before it becomes completely unstable, and Trump is the “unifier” who can bring the forces of conservatism out of the woodwork again. I know, right now “Unifier” is the last thing that comes to mind with DJT, but that’s part of the subterfuge. Actually he is rousing the Silent Majority, those demoralized middle Americans who have been sullenly watching “their” country brought low by the de-stabilizing programs of the Left. They need these folks to become engaged again in the process, and Trump is unifying and energizing them.
As I said, the Deep State operates on both sides of the street, and they needed a reliable opponent for Trump, a stalking horse who would be a foil with a fatal flaw. Hillary is the perfect candidate. They know how fanatically ambitious she is, and given her head, she’d eventually throw herself on the pyre. She’s increasingly febrile, and the campaign trail is long and grueling, so they’ve pumped her up with plenty of money, and dangled the dream in front of her constantly. But anyone could see, at least now looking back, she had these disabilities. She’s very likely an epileptic. That stiff-as-a-board moment tumbling into the van in New York City on Sunday was bizarre, to say the least. The Zeiss Z1 blue sunglasses are the prescription for an epileptic.
Hillary’s candidacy now falls of its own weight. Trump is a shark, Hillary is a clown fish. He’ll have her for lunch in the debates. Trump holds presidential summit meetings with the President of Mexico, and Hillary collapses “from the heat” on a pleasant fall outing in NYC. Hillary and her defenders will become more and more shrill as the election looms closer, and they will begin to look smaller and smaller as Trumpism swells to sweep the country.
Heinlein, with his libertarian-lite approach and Americana politics, is a good ideological fount for the alt-right (until they of course become the "right")..Replies: @The most deplorable one, @guest
“until they of course become the ‘right’”
In that case we can switch to “Starship Troopers.”
If we swerve to become hippies, there’s “Stranger in a Strange Land.”
However, I'm guessing that they are going to somehow patch up Hillary enough to drag her across the finish line. The "stumble" will be forgotten in a few days for everyone except hard core Hillary haters who weren't going to vote for her in the 1st place. They will find something Trump says or does and blow that up instead.Replies: @iSteveFan, @Prof. Woland, @guest, @AnotherDad
Biden may be an elder statesman, because he’s old, but he’s not a proven winner. Everyone forgets he was a presidential hopeful way back when, and crashed and burned. For good reason.
The only reason he’s relatively popular now, aside from the sob stories of widowerhood, is that he seems like a real person and he’s free to occasionally speak the truth. But he’s only free to do so because he doesn’t matter. Were he to be the nominee he’d have to shut up, and suddenly he’d be as interesting as a pet rock.
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
That’s the thing, just casually tossed in the van and taken to Chelsea’s apartment, like it’s routine.
But, as the joke goes, “they’ve achieved a learning curve”: the meds will be re-titrated; her schedule adjusted. Already Bill and Co. are campaigning on her behalf, which probably brings in more votes anyway.
You’ve got it all wrong.
The key part of how to think about this is who is crazy enough to get in the cage with Trump after Hillary staggers off mortally wounded?
Trump’s got a pretty good record, like 17-0 or something, on opponents in this election so far and really hasn’t ever broken a sweat yet.
Maybe they could get that dude they nominated for the Supreme Court. That doesn’t seem to be going anywhere for him.
Steve, OT, but wanted to make you aware of this in today’s WSJ (if you weren’t already aware):
How the Beach Boys Made Their No. 1 Hit ‘Good Vibrations’
Members of the Beach Boys recall creating their 1966 hit, ‘Good Vibrations,’ the euphoric flower-power love song with densely layered instrumentals and vocal harmonies
http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-the-beach-boys-made-their-no-1-hit-good-vibrations-1473713273
Converges some of your recent themes re: Brian Wilson, 1960’s musical innovation, et al.
Still, I agree that the most likely scenario is that the antibiotics will kick in, they will play with the rest of her meds and with a little bit of luck and careful stage management she will last at least until Election Day and beyond. But it's a crap shoot - her handlers are literally (in their atheist way) praying that there won't be more days like Sunday.
It will be interesting to see what conditions the DNC will demand for the debates that are tailored to Hillary's medical condition - studio kept below 70, no bright lights, bathroom breaks, etc. They will also ask for a rule that the candidates not leave their podiums but even if they get it, Trump will ignore it. Trump will leave his podium to contrast with Hillary who will be afraid to do so. He won't get in Hillary's personal space which will be seen as attacking a weak woman but he will symbolically approach the audience instead.Replies: @You Can't Buy Me Hot Dog MAN!, @rod1963, @SteveRogers42
That’s not a podium!
It’s a hollowed out piece of wood
Throw it on the ground
The Dems need a young hispanic guy. They should have chosen one from the start.
Still, I agree that the most likely scenario is that the antibiotics will kick in, they will play with the rest of her meds and with a little bit of luck and careful stage management she will last at least until Election Day and beyond. But it's a crap shoot - her handlers are literally (in their atheist way) praying that there won't be more days like Sunday.
It will be interesting to see what conditions the DNC will demand for the debates that are tailored to Hillary's medical condition - studio kept below 70, no bright lights, bathroom breaks, etc. They will also ask for a rule that the candidates not leave their podiums but even if they get it, Trump will ignore it. Trump will leave his podium to contrast with Hillary who will be afraid to do so. He won't get in Hillary's personal space which will be seen as attacking a weak woman but he will symbolically approach the audience instead.Replies: @You Can't Buy Me Hot Dog MAN!, @rod1963, @SteveRogers42
Antibiotics don’t fix seizures or her need to wear those blue tinted anti-seizure glasses.
It doesn’t address the fact she had two medics in attendance with her at the 9/11 memorial – the brunette pulse taker and the big black guy(aka: Mr. Epipen).
Add in the fact her staff wasn’t shocked by her having a seizure and not taking to a ER shows that it must be a common occurrence with her.
According to MD’s it points to neurological problems – probably Parkingsons.
She won’t get better and the drugs she’s taking do lose their effectiveness over time as the disease progresses. I think she is betting on them working well enough until election day.
If she bets wrong, she’s finished.
It will also be very interesting to see how she pulls off a debate Trump with her deteriorating condition.
Is that like Twelve Years a Slave?
Posted this on wrong thread before
>>>>>>
Uh, by using the logic of the Vox piece posted yesterday we can simplify and cut right to chase.
Answer: if Hillary drops out WE NEED TO INTERROGATE THE BLINDSPOT CREATED BY WHITENESS.
These same executives reportedly see Kaepernick as a “traitor.” The vitriol highlights how diversity is hollow without a commitment to interrogating blind spots created by whiteness and a dedication to fostering societal transformation.
See how all the answers are right there in front of you, comrade?
However, I'm guessing that they are going to somehow patch up Hillary enough to drag her across the finish line. The "stumble" will be forgotten in a few days for everyone except hard core Hillary haters who weren't going to vote for her in the 1st place. They will find something Trump says or does and blow that up instead.Replies: @iSteveFan, @Prof. Woland, @guest, @AnotherDad
This.
I can not see Hillary dropping out even if she drops dead. Her ego and will to power are extreme. She won’t go and they can’t make her. She can cancel the debates. And just run commercials, including highly edited “talks with the American people”–which can be from months back. Whatever it is will be deemed temporary. “Vote for her and she’ll be fine on inauguration day. And if by some “fluke” she isn’t Tim Kaine will be ready. You’ll have stopped that Nazi Donald Trump from becoming president.”
16 as VP + 36 as US Senator means he never held a meaningful job with grunt work for 52 years.
Are there any BernieBros left after his sellout? How much loyalty could he command today from his original Free Shit Army?
Agree that Biden would be the biggest threat to Trump because he’s the closest thing to a normal human being that the Dems could put up to bat. But I have learned to call off my old, tired logic.
Why did Hillary pick PedoFace in the first place? A total unknown, a stale, pale male, and completely lacking in charisma. Wouldn’t it have been a better bet to try to galvanize the NAMs with Booker or Castro?
My guess: Pocohantas/PedoFace 2016!
SES is one of the founding Kpop groups. Just irresistible.
English translation:
Here I am with open arms
waiting for my boy to come to me
And when my baby’s here with all his charms
I’ll whisper to his ear in secrecry
baby…
*Chorus*
Funny how all dreams come true
Like a fool I’m into you
The day we met I lost my sanity
Funny how I feel for you
Like a fool I’m into you
You washed away my insecurities
Here we lie heart to heart
the perfect night for keeping you so near
And we’ll let all the world drift far apart
As I hear you whisper to my ear
baby…
*Chorus*
Funny how all dreams come true
Like a fool I’m into you
The day we met I lost my sanity
Funny how I feel for you
Like a fool I’m into you
Dreams come true
Like a fool I’m into you
The day we met I lost my sanity
Funny what our love can do
Like a fool I’m into you, boy
Dreams come true
Like a fool I’m into you
The day we met I lost my sanity
Funny how I feel for you
Like a fool I’m into you
You washed away my insecurities
Bill Clinton crowed that Hillary “looked like a million bucks this morning.” Not an especially astute description given everyone’s mental image of Hillary raking in millions in speaking fees and access tolls.
Still, I agree that the most likely scenario is that the antibiotics will kick in, they will play with the rest of her meds and with a little bit of luck and careful stage management she will last at least until Election Day and beyond. But it's a crap shoot - her handlers are literally (in their atheist way) praying that there won't be more days like Sunday.
It will be interesting to see what conditions the DNC will demand for the debates that are tailored to Hillary's medical condition - studio kept below 70, no bright lights, bathroom breaks, etc. They will also ask for a rule that the candidates not leave their podiums but even if they get it, Trump will ignore it. Trump will leave his podium to contrast with Hillary who will be afraid to do so. He won't get in Hillary's personal space which will be seen as attacking a weak woman but he will symbolically approach the audience instead.Replies: @You Can't Buy Me Hot Dog MAN!, @rod1963, @SteveRogers42
By way of contrast, Judge Jeanine is 65. She and Hillary don’t even look like the same species:
http://nation.foxnews.com/2016/09/11/judge-jeanine-your-apology-isnt-going-work-hillary
“Healthy and vigorous” indeed!
Bill Clinton crowed that Hillary “looked like a million bucks this morning.” Not a very politically shrewed assessment given everyone’s image of Hillary raking in millions in speaking fees and access tolls.
One question that needs to be answered is does Hillary have a living will and what are its terms. We could face a situation where Hillary is incapacitated or even in a vegetative state but if only Bill Clinton controls her medical care and the on/off switch to the respirator he, in effect, is president again.
1. They thought the disease would progress much less rapidly it has.
2. They planned to get her elected and then invoke the 25 Amendment, ushering in President Kaine.
3. Hillary was thought to be the most electable Democrat and/or enough women would have felt insulted if anyone but her had been chosen. And with factor 1 also in operation, they thought it better to risk the run.
Still, it's all pretty incredible if it's true.Replies: @Jack D, @anon
"Hill, blink once for starting the launch sequence; blink twice to stand down."
Excellent reference! Heinlein’s novels and short stories from 1946-1966 are valuable on many levels and just plain fun! Even his so-called “juvenile” novels are well worth reading and re-reading.
Have you read his address to the Brigade of Midshipmen at the Naval Academy?
They don't need to. It's all layed out in the Robert Heinlein book "Double Star".
A President too sick to hold office gets a body double to take their place.Replies: @Steve Sailer, @I, Libertine, @NOTA, @fish, @SteveRogers42
Quite a bit of speculation going on about the “Hillary” who emerged from Chelsea’s apartment with a new lease on life. This version looks to be about 50 lbs. lighter than the original. Also, there is a professional Clinton impersonator who is about 6 inches shorter than Bill’s wife…which is maybe why she emerged alone and stood without the traditional phalanx of SS around her. Nobody to compare sizes with, before-and-after.
I agree that dropping Kaine would add even more disruption–unlikely in my view.
And no way Bernie will be allowed at the top of the ticket.
I don’t see Biden agreeing to run for VP again, and not sure he has the desire to be President, but he might agree to be on the top of the ticket.
I think that given the circumstances, the Democrats COULD get away with two white males this election, but a woman on the ticket who can “carry Hillary’s torch” would perhaps recoup some energy. No idea who that would be.
So, two options:
1. Biden/Kaine
2. Kaine/Sanders or Kaine/female TBD
My question, if this really is Parkinson’s or something of similar seriousness is: Why did she run? It seems they may have had some inkling of the problem for five years. Possible factors:
1. They thought the disease would progress much less rapidly it has.
2. They planned to get her elected and then invoke the 25 Amendment, ushering in President Kaine.
3. Hillary was thought to be the most electable Democrat and/or enough women would have felt insulted if anyone but her had been chosen. And with factor 1 also in operation, they thought it better to risk the run.
Still, it’s all pretty incredible if it’s true.
under other circumstances against a standard GOPe candidate the woman card would probably have worked as a one-off "historical" thing
so it was a gamble that would likely have paid off against someone like Jub - or... forgot their names.
The reasons you give are exactly WHY she picked him. You want to pick a VP who will not be an attractive alternative to you – this is called impeachment insurance. Might even cut down on assassination attempts.
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
> Don’t you think that if these drugs existed that they would be using them already?
Well the nuclear option is always a daily 100mg+ dose of d-methamphetamine. Combine with high doses of diazepam to stop the crash and force sleep at the end of the day. Add in oxycodone to distract from any discomfort or pain related to whatever she has. That regiment could get a 90 lbs. terminal cancer patient to lead a punk rock group on a non-stop concert tour.
Well at least for a few months. After a 2 month binge, the patient’s body would be totally wrecked and plagued with serious dependency, withdrawal, and brain damage. That’s true for healthy young men, let alone a sick obese grandma. For that reason I doubt this route is considered anything except a last resort. But I’m pretty sure if Hillary *needs* to power through, modern pharmaceutical science has its ways.
Hillary actually asked about this in a email while SofS in 2011.
https://wikileaks.org/clinton-emails/emailid/25404
It is used off label to fight Parkingson's and used by military pilots when they pull extended duty hours. It's much better than meth when used for the later.
You can bet she'll be pumped to gills with it on debate night.
Kudos to Market-ticker for pointing this out.
https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231499
You know at one time the MSM would go nuts over smoking gun like this. Really why is the SofS inquiring about such a drug in the first place? 99% of people have never heard of it nor have any use of it.Replies: @Daniel Williams
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
Jack, you’re a better Christian than i am 😉 Neighbors, work colleagues, boys and parents in my scout troop all say and treat me like i’m a nice guy … but i’m not this nice!
My thinking here is way more “Old Testament”. “Pride goeth before the fall.”
No one “forced” Hillary to live out her dotage on the public stage, she eagerly and arrogantly thrust herself forward to do it. She’s offering nothing as a candidate–more money and power to the Wall-Street\Washington kleptocracy, plus hate whitey identity politics–that hundreds of other Democrats could not off. And there’s no reason she’s a particularly credible candidate in the first place, but then clearly her health deteriorated quite a bit with the “concussion” or whatever it was a few years back. She could have announced her departure, said nice things about the Democratic party and its prospective candidates and bowed out to an exceedingly well padded and private retirement. She would not do it. Too much ego and will to power. Hillary *will* be the first woman president … if she has to embarrass herself and screw the country in the process.
In return … i *want* her embarrassed, humiliated. Just like i *want* murderers hung, robbers whipped and jailed, drunk drivers and women popping out illegitimate kids put in the stocks and humiliated, and Angela Merkel toss in a cage with 72 middle eastern migrant men, then–after a suitable interval–drawn, quartered and burned.
Hillary being tossed around like a sad sack of potatoes … straight outta Shakespeare. I love it.
One of my foreign friends who is not a US citizen mentioned how the Clinton's hubris and in general the audacity of the Left in the USA has grown because it has not been punished. As she put it (she is a wise lady), the Clintons started out stealing a $100,000 in cattle futures and stealing furniture and silverware from the White House now they are selling government favors and access for literally hundreds of millions of dollars.
Basically, her point is that you have to punish bad behavior or you just get more of it (and it becomes more flagrant and abusive ).
According to her American public apparently has not learned that lesson.
How many bad things has Hillary and her husband gotten away with that should have ruined their careers or landed them in jail?
Even their policy decisions have been disastrous for American citizens.
Her and her husband through NAFTA and entry of China into the WTO (both signed by Bill) and the recent foreign wars presided over by Hillary as Secretary of State have destroyed the lives of many many US citizens all to pay off their benefactors.
Her comeuppance is a cause of rejoining not pity.
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
“Even though she[Clinton] is an evil woman, it’s still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes.”
No, it’s not.
“No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage.”
No one is forcing her. This is her choice. I truly believe she’d appear in public with a leaky colostomy bag if that’s what it took for her to win.
“Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer’s took hold. ”
However one feels about the Reagans–and I was not a fan–they understood the concept of dignity. The Clintons do not.
Out of curiosity, do any public (or private) institutions have legal recourse for fraud if it is revealed that Hillary had been diagnosed with a serious illness all this time? If she doesn’t drop out of the race and is elected president, and then damaging medical information is brought to light, could she be impeached over lying about her health during the campaign?
Should she croak, her embalmers will roll out El SIS and she’ll charge across the Hampton sands to vanquish the doubts of her critics and make sure that any outside hopes lingering in Bernie are sent on a permanent weekend outing. Her doctor will diagnose her with “walking” pneumonia and not allow public exposure except for spins in a pexi-glass pope mobile. Like an old fashion Sicilian Saint Mary procession, she’ll with the aid of hidden hydraulics, wave and smile at the crowds, and “Clutch Cargo” style “TALK” with a fixed gaze that her suck-o-phants interpret as “she’s talking to me, she’s got to be talking to me because she’s looking at me.” The debates will be conducted remotely by the same rationale, and the dems Hollywood buddies will put on an Oscar worthy performance of Special Effects that will bring her to life like she never was in real life.
Technology has come a long way since they propped up that old stiff FDR so a real stiff shouldn’t be a problem for the party that specializes in dead voters.
I agree on your general point but Hillary’s health is a useful tool to show how corrupt the media are
and in reality the media are the real opposition.
Where is Pat Paulsen when the Democrats truly need him?
"The man who discovered CTE thinks Hillary Clinton may have been poisoned"
"Bennet Omalu, the forensic pathologist who has made the NFL so uncomfortable with his discovery of chronic traumatic encephalopathy in the brains of deceased players, suggests that Hillary Clinton’s campaign be checked for possible poisons after her collapse Sunday in New York."
. . .
"'I do not trust Mr. Putin and Mr. Trump. With those two all things are possible.'"
So, a modern folk hero, a black doctor, is talking about Clinton's health, suggesting there is more going on then is being said, and suggesting a way that it is Putin's and Trump's fault. A conspiracy of hidden health problems. A conspiracy of causing those problems. Do these campaigns need some Turkish advisors?Replies: @anonymous
Another “discovery”.
Let’s take a look at what an actual medical journal has to say on when CTE was first discovered.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2995699/
Also, I’m sure this won’t be a huge surprise, but I thought this part of Omalu’s Wikipedia page might be interesting to readers of this blog.
Hillary being brought to the debates
I’m with you Mr. Fan.
I don’t see how you don’t promote Kaine. He would have been the guy promoted if this all happened a few months later after Hillary was elected. And even a bigger embarrassment in this case, because it would be coming from Hillary’s health issues, which whatever they want to claim had to be “known”.
Sure there’s an identity politics for the Democrats here … but that’s their own damn fault. I assume they’d fix it by tossing Fauxahontas onto the ticket. (Could be Booker or a Castro, but realistically the Democrats depend so highly on petulant female grievance and basically the state fulfilling the husband role for single women who don’t yet have a husband, i really think their identity politics meter is flashing “need a woman” this year.)
Rod Dreher reacts to Charles Murray’s snobby libertarian dismissal of Trump:
Of the options, Biden/Kaine has a lot going for it. Sure, various persons would be annoyed that the ticket is two white men again, but the excuse is it's an emergency! ... and we've brought you Obama's right hand man instead!
If it's to be Kaine for president, how about Kaine/Condoleezza Rice? What's she been up to lately, anyway? I'm assuming she's a #NeverTrumper. They would lock up the neocon vote (take that, Evan McMullin). I guess I'm joking: Powell and Rice went from national darlings to fairly toxic because of destroying the Middle East.Replies: @Nico
Given what Barack Obama did in Libya I’m fairly certain that can be glossed over.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/06/29/reuters_hillary_clinton_supporters_are_pretty_racist_too.htmlReplies: @Hunsdon
Well bless his heart.
The racial makeup of the city was 82.5% White, 5.8% African American, 0.2% Native American, 6.9% Asian, 2.1% from other races, and 2.5% from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 5.3% of the population.
KGB Agent Sailer let this slip out a in a post yesterday and now the Woodward and Bernstein at the Washington Post are hot on the the Litvinenko-style poisoning of Hillary by Trump, Putin, and the Russian FSB. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2016/09/12/the-man-who-discovered-cte-thinks-hillary-clinton-may-have-been-poisoned/
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
I agree with AnotherDad and Kylie: no one is forcing her or ever has forced her to live out her dotage on the public stage. As Thomas Fleming wrote nine years ago in regards to Paris Hilton, people who seek infamy and exalt in their infamy forfeit whatever deference normal standards of propriety would oblige us to respect, and there is no reason to let the Mrs. Grundys of the world forbid us to mock where mockery is due. I have absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for Hillary Clinton, Princess Diana, Ségolène Royal, Valérie Trierweiler and so forth.
I think it’s too early to ponder replacements for Hillary. They’ll inject her with whatever drugs they need to in order to make her appear “healthy” prior to the election, and many voters will buy it. And that would include some form of amphetamine or whatever.
OTOH, I said several days ago that Steve was making too much of Hillary’s coughing fit in Cleveland, so maybe you shouldn’t listen to me. 🙂
Sanders is done imo. You can only betray kiddie idealists once – althought that’s part of Clinton’s problem as they have drifted to Greens and (under the radar) Trump.
I think they picked Kaine because he has their idea of a blue collar peasant face (like Kasich for GOPe) whereas to normal people he looks like he does a lot of charity work with orphanages in remote regions – and maybe he does.
Yes, that’s pretty much the only reason. I don’t think he’d be much good but to the average person he probably comes across vaguely normal.
To be considered assimilated they only need to vote D.
1. They thought the disease would progress much less rapidly it has.
2. They planned to get her elected and then invoke the 25 Amendment, ushering in President Kaine.
3. Hillary was thought to be the most electable Democrat and/or enough women would have felt insulted if anyone but her had been chosen. And with factor 1 also in operation, they thought it better to risk the run.
Still, it's all pretty incredible if it's true.Replies: @Jack D, @anon
First of all you have to define who “they” is. We all know Hillary’s penchant for secrecy . If she does have Parkinson’s or some other debilitating disease (as seems increasingly likely) then almost certainly the knowledge was held within some very small inner circle and the rest were kept in the dark. We saw this yesterday with the overheating/pneumonia bs stories – it’s clear that the campaign staff /mouthpieces were blindsided and made to look like fools.
2nd, someone as powerful as Hillary begins to really believe that she can control not only other mortals but the gods themselves. She will “power through” (to coin a phrase) and ORDER her body to do her bidding. She does not take no for an answer. Chances are that her doctors advised her strongly against running (even though she surely doctor shopped to find a flunky doctor who would do her bidding and keep her pumped up) but she only heard what she wanted to hear. In other words, hubris and we know how the gods deal with humans who attempt to defy fate.
You know that she had her doctor with her at the 9/11 ceremony? Who but someone on death’s door travels with a doctor with them at all times?
Good points about the lower-level staffers and the presence of the doctor.
Barry the Kenyan.
1. They thought the disease would progress much less rapidly it has.
2. They planned to get her elected and then invoke the 25 Amendment, ushering in President Kaine.
3. Hillary was thought to be the most electable Democrat and/or enough women would have felt insulted if anyone but her had been chosen. And with factor 1 also in operation, they thought it better to risk the run.
Still, it's all pretty incredible if it's true.Replies: @Jack D, @anon
mix of 1 and 3
under other circumstances against a standard GOPe candidate the woman card would probably have worked as a one-off “historical” thing
so it was a gamble that would likely have paid off against someone like Jub – or… forgot their names.
Well the nuclear option is always a daily 100mg+ dose of d-methamphetamine. Combine with high doses of diazepam to stop the crash and force sleep at the end of the day. Add in oxycodone to distract from any discomfort or pain related to whatever she has. That regiment could get a 90 lbs. terminal cancer patient to lead a punk rock group on a non-stop concert tour.
Well at least for a few months. After a 2 month binge, the patient's body would be totally wrecked and plagued with serious dependency, withdrawal, and brain damage. That's true for healthy young men, let alone a sick obese grandma. For that reason I doubt this route is considered anything except a last resort. But I'm pretty sure if Hillary *needs* to power through, modern pharmaceutical science has its ways.Replies: @Jack D, @rod1963
That regimen may keep you “powered” up temporarily but it’s not going to cure Parkinson’s Disease. If you are losing control of your swallowing reflex and aspirating into your lungs, meth ain’t gonna do nothin’ for you. It’s not a cure all.
Obama wouldn't have run for President, which isn't allowed by the Constitution.
The clowns on the Supreme court would be paid to sign off on it.Replies: @Manchurian Take Out
Kinda of like (but not quite) the waltz Putin did to stay in power with his little puppet buddy by trading places with his #2 for a term. Didn’t Obama allegedly say to Putin once that “wait till my 2nd term when I will have more latitude” in the context of something he didn’t think was possible without running the risk of jeopardizing a 2nd term. You might be on to something that if you’d ask me 20 years ago I’d say you have to be on acid.
Strange times we living in.
I can not see Hillary dropping out even if she drops dead. Her ego and will to power are extreme. She won't go and they can't make her. She can cancel the debates. And just run commercials, including highly edited "talks with the American people"--which can be from months back. Whatever it is will be deemed temporary. "Vote for her and she'll be fine on inauguration day. And if by some "fluke" she isn't Tim Kaine will be ready. You'll have stopped that Nazi Donald Trump from becoming president."Replies: @JL
It’s actually rather amusing to imagine the conversations and back room dealings currently taking place among the Democratic party mandarins. They have two incredibly difficult, absolutely thankless tasks. First, they must realize that Clinton, if not yet an actual corpse, is already a political one. She has to go, so the first task is to get her to do it on her own before she publicly embarrasses herself again. The second task is coming up with a replacement ticket and all the attendant ramifications. Lots of fun and sleepless nights!
I already saw a headline in the WaPo about how her pneumonia could have her sidelined until the end of October. Convenient, right? No debates, but all chipper and ready to go come election day. I guess it was a trial balloon, though ultimately full of lead. I’m as cynical as the next person, but, really, the public is just over saturated with BS at this point.
How to think? The way to think about it is the 25th amendment and succession. Lets face it, there simply isn’t enough time for her to die before the election. Or, it is a very low probability event.
“NEW YORK (The Borowitz Report)—In a positive development for the Democratic nominee for President, a new poll released on Sunday reveals that likely voters find an unconscious Hillary Clinton “substantially more fit” to be President than a conscious Donald Trump.
In a hypothetical matchup between a Clinton who has been rendered completely unconscious and a fully sentient Trump, voters chose an inert Clinton over an ambulatory Trump by a margin of nine percentage points.
A spokesperson for the Clinton campaign hailed the findings. “We have every reason to believe that Hillary Clinton will be a fully conscious President,” the spokesperson said. “But even if she is not, she is still the far better choice.”
So, to answer the question — the Democrats promote the concept of established succession, and extend it to the pre inauguration period to the extent needed. After Jan 20, Kaine becomes president and it actually IS the 25th amendment.
If her health issues get bad enough, then they should keep her on the ticket and send Kaine to the debates as her successor.
The problem the Democrats have is timing. They need something that will work under various scenarios regarding Clinton’s health and the timing of the worsening of her health issues. It is already too late to do anything major.
Obama’s popularity has improved to almost 60%, and they would haul him in to pitch a message that Dems/Clinton/Kaine are an extension of his presidency.
As far as the real issue of today, I think Trump has done a full court press regarding a Fed rate hike in September and lost. But there is something going on.
At some point, a rock star like Hillary is surrounded by sycophants and yes (wo)men who will literally allow their master to kill herself rather than reign them in. See Michael Jackson, Elvis, Prince, etc. Now none of these guys were as evil as Hillary but I still feel pity for those who are trapped in such a web even if it is partly (mostly ) of their own making.
Crooked Hildabeast is not a rock star because she is not cool from a pop culture standpoint. Most Millennials are not voting for her because they believe she has mad swag charisma like Barack Hussein Obama. Most Millennials are voting for Crooked Hildabeast because they believe she is the lesser of 2 evils compared to Donald Trump. With Barack it wasn't a lesser of 2 evils vote, Millennials truly like him and see him as the coolest Black guy in the world.
Crooked Hildabeast is not seen as the coolest old woman in the world, Betty White is. Crooked Hildabeast is a total stiff square. Just watch her God awful dancing on Ellen.
https://youtu.be/X_GURqPdHJY
Crooked Hildabeast is so uncool she makes Bob Dole look like Bob Saget.
Mostly OT, but speaking of health, it turns out that Simone Biles and Serena Williams are likely doping under the guise of medical exemptions. Biles has a diagnosis of ADHD.
http://wtop.com/fitness/2016/08/the-training-keys-to-simone-biles-explosive-gymnastics/
As it turns out, Ritalin. From a different article about why ritalin is banned for atheletes:
The stimulant methylphenidate (Ritalin), for example, is often prescribed to treat ADHD in children and young adults but its use is prohibited in sport by the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) because it may enhance explosiveness, power, strength or stamina.
From last July:
Merely put, Biles is probably the strongest, most explosive gymnast on the planet, with incomparable athleticism that provides her a pure step up on her competitors.
http://capitaldom.com/simone-biles-coach-explains-the-moment-she-realized-biles-was-a-gymnastics-prodigy-at-age-6
If the public is falling for Hillary’s allergies and now pneumonia, will they fall for Biles’ ADHD?
Right, because those who disagree get fired, so the yes men predominate. The Romans had a tradition of having a slave ride with the Emperor in parades to whisper Memento Mori (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memento_mori) in his ear. HRC has no such person.
No offense, Jack D, but it should be “rein them in”, as in horses.
Well the nuclear option is always a daily 100mg+ dose of d-methamphetamine. Combine with high doses of diazepam to stop the crash and force sleep at the end of the day. Add in oxycodone to distract from any discomfort or pain related to whatever she has. That regiment could get a 90 lbs. terminal cancer patient to lead a punk rock group on a non-stop concert tour.
Well at least for a few months. After a 2 month binge, the patient's body would be totally wrecked and plagued with serious dependency, withdrawal, and brain damage. That's true for healthy young men, let alone a sick obese grandma. For that reason I doubt this route is considered anything except a last resort. But I'm pretty sure if Hillary *needs* to power through, modern pharmaceutical science has its ways.Replies: @Jack D, @rod1963
Try Provigil
Hillary actually asked about this in a email while SofS in 2011.
https://wikileaks.org/clinton-emails/emailid/25404
It is used off label to fight Parkingson’s and used by military pilots when they pull extended duty hours. It’s much better than meth when used for the later.
You can bet she’ll be pumped to gills with it on debate night.
Kudos to Market-ticker for pointing this out.
https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231499
You know at one time the MSM would go nuts over smoking gun like this. Really why is the SofS inquiring about such a drug in the first place? 99% of people have never heard of it nor have any use of it.
And it's better than meth only in the sense that, say, caffeine is better than meth (in that it doesn't have horrible side effects); the two are not in the same league as stimulants.
Yeah, OK–by “they” I meant her inner circle of family and senior advisers.
Good points about the lower-level staffers and the presence of the doctor.
Dreher is very pessimistic:
It’s much harder to build than destroy but the first rule of holes is to stop digging – we can at least do that much. We have to start by taking away Hillary’s shovel.
I wouldn’t dignify libertardianism by calling it a philosophy. Lots of people described Ayn Rand as a cult leader during her lifetime. I think of it as a cult.
She seems to drink plenty of water to help silence her coughing fits. Though, there's an article from slate stating that apparently she hates drinking water. I wonder why? Will too much water cause her to melt?
From the article:http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/09/12/does_hillary_clinton_really_hate_water.htmlReplies: @Chrisnonymous, @Anonymous
This could mean not much. Very Clintonian
Lizard!!!!!!
This would explain the metal falling out of her pants too: a clip holding together her fake skin!!!!!
As a non-American you might not realize that the general populace does not actually vote for president. We vote for electors who then vote for president. It is actually possible for 100% of the populace to vote for one candidate and have a completely different person end up being president, though of course that would never happen. Thus there is actually no problem if Clinton dies before the elections because technically she isn’t actually a candidate for the election held in November. She’s running for the election held in December. The electors will vote for whomever they want on Dec 13th. They can vote for anyone who meets the requirements (age 35+, etc…) and do it doesn’t actually matter who is on the ballots in November.
Here’s how it would go: Clinton dies in September. In November people go to the polls and check the box for Clinton/Kaine. Although Clinton and Kaine’s names are on the ballot, the people are actually voting for a slate of electors who have pledged their loyalty to Clinton/Kaine. Now let’s say that turnout is 106% in Philly and “Clinton” wins the election. She wasn’t actually the winner; her electors were. Then in December electors from the 50 states and DC meet to elect the president. The ones loyal to Trump/Pence vote for Trump for president and Pence for VP (note the they don’t have to, and on very rare occasions a few electors actually vote for someone else)
Ok but Clinton is dead, so the electors loyal to her have to come up with an alternative. Who will they vote for? Almost certainly they will vote for whomever the Democratic party elite chose to replace Clinton back in September or October.
This seems like a crazy system, but it makes sense. One of the goals was to avoid the tragedy of Athens. The Athenian people voted for an ever expanding empire. Eventually they voted to fight Sparta and were crushed. So the elector system is to prevent democracy.
“the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?”
Well is was supposed to be the president… except that at the time the US was vulnerable to its more centralized rivals. Cincinnatus was a big inspiration and in fact George Washington was called the American Cincinnatus. Cincinnatus had been a very powerful man but after setbacks he had to become a poor farmer. Then when the Roman Republic was in trouble they elected him supreme dictator for the purpose of winning a war. He won the war and after fifteen days he went back to plowing his field. Then pretty much the same thing happened again.
The US started our with a parliamentary system called the Continental Congress. The president of the CC was what we would now call a prime minister. The system was untested (remember that this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn’t get one for 43 more years). So the system was deemed too weak to survive a vengeful Britain. Thus the new system had a stronger president as commander in chief. The idea was that a powerful president would be able to win wars that a prime minister might not be able to.
So one of the major roles of the President is to always be available to fend off enemies. This means that there can never be a time without one, and so the system is designed to ensure that there always is one. The system (electors voting for anyone rather than the public voting for candidates on a ballot) is set up so that elections never need to be delayed and never have been, even during the brutal Civil War. There was also the election of 1812 which happened during the War of 1812 in which Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians.
This was a very succinct explanation that I was able to understand. Thank you.
"Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians": it was essentially a raid, partly in revenge for US troops having burned Toronto (then called York).Replies: @Spoons
I wonder how the Neoreactionary boys would react to finally getting a king.
by promoting Kaine to the top of the ticket it just accomplishes what would occur if Hillary was elected and passes away or becomes incapacitated in the next 12 months. Kaine could give the appearance of choosing the VP, which might help him appear more presidential. By nominating a minority he may help keep the coalition from fracturing. Since the Press is 100% against Trump, he would get significant praise from the talking heads no matter whom he "selects" as his VP.Replies: @dearieme
“By nominating a minority “: does a Cherokee count?
Ex-prosecutor Lionel is on top of the Hillary Health Crisis:
Rather than being, as Derb says, a Horse-Girl of the Apocalypse, maybe she will be the Clever Hanah of the Apocalypse, responding to cues from Bill Clinton…
“Hill, blink once for starting the launch sequence; blink twice to stand down.”
The Deep State has always tried to play both sides of the street. Donald J. Trump is as much their pawn as Hillary. They know they need to pull the country back before it becomes completely unstable, and Trump is the "unifier" who can bring the forces of conservatism out of the woodwork again. I know, right now "Unifier" is the last thing that comes to mind with DJT, but that's part of the subterfuge. Actually he is rousing the Silent Majority, those demoralized middle Americans who have been sullenly watching "their" country brought low by the de-stabilizing programs of the Left. They need these folks to become engaged again in the process, and Trump is unifying and energizing them.
As I said, the Deep State operates on both sides of the street, and they needed a reliable opponent for Trump, a stalking horse who would be a foil with a fatal flaw. Hillary is the perfect candidate. They know how fanatically ambitious she is, and given her head, she'd eventually throw herself on the pyre. She's increasingly febrile, and the campaign trail is long and grueling, so they've pumped her up with plenty of money, and dangled the dream in front of her constantly. But anyone could see, at least now looking back, she had these disabilities. She's very likely an epileptic. That stiff-as-a-board moment tumbling into the van in New York City on Sunday was bizarre, to say the least. The Zeiss Z1 blue sunglasses are the prescription for an epileptic.
Hillary's candidacy now falls of its own weight. Trump is a shark, Hillary is a clown fish. He'll have her for lunch in the debates. Trump holds presidential summit meetings with the President of Mexico, and Hillary collapses "from the heat" on a pleasant fall outing in NYC. Hillary and her defenders will become more and more shrill as the election looms closer, and they will begin to look smaller and smaller as Trumpism swells to sweep the country.Replies: @JimboHarambe
It would nice for me to be on the same side as the deep state for once.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3786509/Ryan-Lochte-gets-rushed-protester-Dancing-Stars-performance-dramatic-season-premiere.htmlReplies: @Chrisnonymous, @IA, @Perspective
Are they Brazilian? Iranian? American?
Maybe they were offended on behalf of Brazil and their machismo demanded retaliation, like Brazilian soccer fans who attack refs that make decisions against their team.
Don’t like it? Living without violent interruptions is white man’s priviledge. Get used to Brasil Norte.
As an old Line guy (derivatives) I’d have died to have a old Staff guy like you around.
OT bleg — In July or August, on an iSteve post concerning BLM, a left-of-center person wrote an eloquent and frank comment, walking through the reasoning for the liberal point-of-view on race and crime. This comment attracted many replies, perhaps 5 or 10.
My son just started a social-justice themed English class, treading cautiously as he figures out his own views. I’d like to point him to that thread.
If you wrote that comment or a reply, could you point me to it?
https://www.unz.com/isteve/is-trump-un-american-for-saying-americans-have-a-right-to-choose-which-immigrants-we-want-to-take/#comment-1556125
But I don't recall where the "race and crime" comment is.Replies: @ic1000
https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-artificial-intelligences-white-guy-problem/#comment-1467515
I find it pretty hard to figure who might be chosen to replace Hillary.
I’d have to plunk down for Biden, just because he is at least a known entity to the public — well enough known to be a plausible choice for President for voters who have no real time to get comfortable with a new face. Kaine of course is that new face.
But there’s going to be a big problem, I’d think, with Bernie voters. They will rightly resent the hell out of a decision to go over the head of the guy who got the second most votes in the primaries, and who was so close to Hillary in the end. I think that the DNC pretty well detests Bernie and his movement, and won’t seriously consider him for the role.
It’s hard for me to judge how effective Biden would be as a candidate at this late stage. He wouldn’t have Hillary’s negatives – at least at first. But the guy had removed himself from running for President, and it’s going to be hard to convince the public that he is anything more than a stopgap.
Everything about such a process and such a selection is going to seem half-cocked, and one thing that means a lot to voters in the middle is a sense of solidity and predictability. Somewhat surprisingly, and very much to his credit (and that of his campaign managers) Trump is starting to project some of this. If Trump can continue to restrain his hyper-reactivity, and measure twice and cut once before he talks, I think he’s going to be a good position to win this thing, no matter who his opponent might be.
Bagman Biden has always been in it for the money.
As a Senator for the most Corporate-Lawless State the lootings were better.
He’s now reduced to having his spawn rob the Ukrainians.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2014/05/14/hunter-bidens-new-job-at-a-ukrainian-gas-company-is-a-problem-for-u-s-soft-power/
The problem for the media filth is not, of course, the corruption, it’s the perception.
Since the Constitution is now nothing but a 'scrap of paper' whose meaning is whatever the powers-that-be want it to mean, it should not stand in the way. Then, too, the federal government has become a democrat stronghold for all intents and purposes.Replies: @ben tillman
That old passive voice! Who will postpone it? And how?
The states run the elections, and they won’t all go along with a dictate from the central government. Some would go along, but that would essentially be a boycott of the election that would apparently deprive them of the ability to submit electoral votes. Then, Trump/Pence would win (presuming the House speaker does not take the Democrats’ side), and the Democrats would ignore the Constitution and applicable statute to declare the election void. That’s not the same as postponing it.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3786509/Ryan-Lochte-gets-rushed-protester-Dancing-Stars-performance-dramatic-season-premiere.htmlReplies: @Chrisnonymous, @IA, @Perspective
Andy Warhol meets Tower of Babel, the movie.
Nice zinger…
https://twitter.com/johndurant/status/774992221611360260
My son just started a social-justice themed English class, treading cautiously as he figures out his own views. I'd like to point him to that thread.
If you wrote that comment or a reply, could you point me to it?Replies: @ben tillman, @Harry Baldwin, @candid_observer
Frizzled wrote something on immigration here:
https://www.unz.com/isteve/is-trump-un-american-for-saying-americans-have-a-right-to-choose-which-immigrants-we-want-to-take/#comment-1556125
But I don’t recall where the “race and crime” comment is.
A couple of things stand out:
1. The naive view that if you jumble enough computing power together it will become sentient.
2. The totally uninformed by any studies of real humans (or evolutionary principles) views about how marriage and sexual relations will occur on the moon. Totally blank-slate thinking.Replies: @NOTA
Heinlein was into the idea of varying family structures. Maybe it could work–I don’t know for sure it wouldn’t. But it sure looked a lot nor plausible when I was 18 than now that I’m pushing 50….
I think she has about 10 more days to drop out with a decent chance of getting her replacement on all 50 state ballots. A number of states begin early voting 45-46 days before the election, and a number of states (including Michigan) require that the electors cast their votes for the candidate on the ballot. That could be a problem for Dems if she waits until October to drop out. All this improves the odds for Kaine who is on the ballot already and therefore is the only legit late replacement possibility.
Betcha they’d find something to complain about.
This election is over for all intents and purposes.
So there are two options:
– Keep Hillary going Weekend at Bernie’s style
– Have someone (either President or VP) fall on their sword for a defeated run
Could we really expect an ambitious politician to run on a 2016 ticket that almost certainly will result in defeat? What DNC-favored backbencher could they put up who is willingly going to march into defeat? The only scenario I can see for this one is if there is a big favor that this person can call in at a later date. A failed candidate risks losing popularity and political capital. Maybe it would be someone with one foot out the door already. Probably would need to be non-white too in order to prevent a GOP supermajority. I’m sure they can find some no-name black or Hispanic who can fill in who, thanks to demographics, will never have to worry losing a re-election.
Nah, my money is on the first option. Limit her exposure to telephone and video interviews. Maybe have her give 1-2 rallies a week. Have Democratic hotshots campaign for her. Have the media push the narrative that she is just fine. They know that Hillary will lose but it’s her loss. In the meantime, they have to prop her up, sometimes literally. Hillary will run on her deathbed if need be.
ADHD prescriptions for Ritalin/Adderall for major league ballplayers are pretty common.
“At some point, a rock star like Hillary”
Crooked Hildabeast is not a rock star because she is not cool from a pop culture standpoint. Most Millennials are not voting for her because they believe she has mad swag charisma like Barack Hussein Obama. Most Millennials are voting for Crooked Hildabeast because they believe she is the lesser of 2 evils compared to Donald Trump. With Barack it wasn’t a lesser of 2 evils vote, Millennials truly like him and see him as the coolest Black guy in the world.
Crooked Hildabeast is not seen as the coolest old woman in the world, Betty White is. Crooked Hildabeast is a total stiff square. Just watch her God awful dancing on Ellen.
Crooked Hildabeast is so uncool she makes Bob Dole look like Bob Saget.
I feel dehydrated after a night of binge drinking. Did I read that she is dehydrated every day?
Slightly OT
Here’s a better angle of Hillary collapsing while getting “helped” into the van on 9/11
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3786509/Ryan-Lochte-gets-rushed-protester-Dancing-Stars-performance-dramatic-season-premiere.htmlReplies: @Chrisnonymous, @IA, @Perspective
They really need to get a life, Ryan Lochte does have a bit of an unlikable d-bag persona about him, but the fact grown men would waste time “protesting” someone who lied is sad and hypocritical.
The MSM vs. iSteve-
Hillary’s in great health!
So that’s why she keep passing out, falling over, and incessantly coughing.
She’s just dehydrated.
That’s why she has been skipping out on important court proceedings and many PR appearances for years, and particularly absent for the last year. And spazzed out, nodded incessantly, became extremely distracted.
Uh, I mean she temporarily has pneumonia! But she still has gone to some recent events and given talks!
And coughed. And coughed. And passed out. And she’s been doing this over and over. And spazzing out, and been looking up Parkinson’s meds. And been mostly MIA for a year.
Shes’s , uh, stoic!
I thought you said she was in great health?
She’s a minority and you’re white men! You’re deplorable! End of conversation!!!!
Here's how it would go: Clinton dies in September. In November people go to the polls and check the box for Clinton/Kaine. Although Clinton and Kaine's names are on the ballot, the people are actually voting for a slate of electors who have pledged their loyalty to Clinton/Kaine. Now let's say that turnout is 106% in Philly and "Clinton" wins the election. She wasn't actually the winner; her electors were. Then in December electors from the 50 states and DC meet to elect the president. The ones loyal to Trump/Pence vote for Trump for president and Pence for VP (note the they don't have to, and on very rare occasions a few electors actually vote for someone else)
Ok but Clinton is dead, so the electors loyal to her have to come up with an alternative. Who will they vote for? Almost certainly they will vote for whomever the Democratic party elite chose to replace Clinton back in September or October.
This seems like a crazy system, but it makes sense. One of the goals was to avoid the tragedy of Athens. The Athenian people voted for an ever expanding empire. Eventually they voted to fight Sparta and were crushed. So the elector system is to prevent democracy.
"the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?"
Well is was supposed to be the president... except that at the time the US was vulnerable to its more centralized rivals. Cincinnatus was a big inspiration and in fact George Washington was called the American Cincinnatus. Cincinnatus had been a very powerful man but after setbacks he had to become a poor farmer. Then when the Roman Republic was in trouble they elected him supreme dictator for the purpose of winning a war. He won the war and after fifteen days he went back to plowing his field. Then pretty much the same thing happened again.
The US started our with a parliamentary system called the Continental Congress. The president of the CC was what we would now call a prime minister. The system was untested (remember that this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn't get one for 43 more years). So the system was deemed too weak to survive a vengeful Britain. Thus the new system had a stronger president as commander in chief. The idea was that a powerful president would be able to win wars that a prime minister might not be able to.
So one of the major roles of the President is to always be available to fend off enemies. This means that there can never be a time without one, and so the system is designed to ensure that there always is one. The system (electors voting for anyone rather than the public voting for candidates on a ballot) is set up so that elections never need to be delayed and never have been, even during the brutal Civil War. There was also the election of 1812 which happened during the War of 1812 in which Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians.Replies: @AnotherGuessModel, @Kylie, @dearieme, @Nico
Thank you for such a wonderfully clear and detailed reply on American history and government.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/is-trump-un-american-for-saying-americans-have-a-right-to-choose-which-immigrants-we-want-to-take/#comment-1556125
But I don't recall where the "race and crime" comment is.Replies: @ic1000
Excellent tip; I was looking for Frizzled’s comment of June 25th. Thanks!
Could Bill stand as veep?
I don’t see why not:
“Section 1. No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once. But this article shall not apply to any person holding the office of President when this article was proposed by the Congress, and shall not prevent any person who may be holding the office of President, or acting as President, during the term within which this article becomes operative from holding the office of President or acting as President during the remainder of such term.”
I don’t see why not:"
The Vice President has to meet the same qualifications as the President. Bill Clinton, George W Bush, and Obama are disqualified from election for both President and Vice President.
She seems to drink plenty of water to help silence her coughing fits. Though, there's an article from slate stating that apparently she hates drinking water. I wonder why? Will too much water cause her to melt?
From the article:http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/09/12/does_hillary_clinton_really_hate_water.htmlReplies: @Chrisnonymous, @Anonymous
“Will too much water cause her to melt?”
Now why didn’t I think of that!
http://youtu.be/uQJ8WrKnLUs
Marco Rubio? At least he’ll be hydrated.
Hillary actually asked about this in a email while SofS in 2011.
https://wikileaks.org/clinton-emails/emailid/25404
It is used off label to fight Parkingson's and used by military pilots when they pull extended duty hours. It's much better than meth when used for the later.
You can bet she'll be pumped to gills with it on debate night.
Kudos to Market-ticker for pointing this out.
https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231499
You know at one time the MSM would go nuts over smoking gun like this. Really why is the SofS inquiring about such a drug in the first place? 99% of people have never heard of it nor have any use of it.Replies: @Daniel Williams
Plenty of people use Provigil/Modafinil for the more innocuous purpose of staying awake. (Quacks imagine it to have nootropic effect, as well). Hearing “Provigil” and thinking “Parkinson’s” is like hearing “aspirin” and thinking “heart disease”, instead of its more common use against aches and pains.
And it’s better than meth only in the sense that, say, caffeine is better than meth (in that it doesn’t have horrible side effects); the two are not in the same league as stimulants.
Amen brother. I agree with your comment 100%.
One of my foreign friends who is not a US citizen mentioned how the Clinton’s hubris and in general the audacity of the Left in the USA has grown because it has not been punished. As she put it (she is a wise lady), the Clintons started out stealing a $100,000 in cattle futures and stealing furniture and silverware from the White House now they are selling government favors and access for literally hundreds of millions of dollars.
Basically, her point is that you have to punish bad behavior or you just get more of it (and it becomes more flagrant and abusive ).
According to her American public apparently has not learned that lesson.
How many bad things has Hillary and her husband gotten away with that should have ruined their careers or landed them in jail?
Even their policy decisions have been disastrous for American citizens.
Her and her husband through NAFTA and entry of China into the WTO (both signed by Bill) and the recent foreign wars presided over by Hillary as Secretary of State have destroyed the lives of many many US citizens all to pay off their benefactors.
Her comeuppance is a cause of rejoining not pity.
It wouldn’t shock me if someone was blackmailing her.
Here's how it would go: Clinton dies in September. In November people go to the polls and check the box for Clinton/Kaine. Although Clinton and Kaine's names are on the ballot, the people are actually voting for a slate of electors who have pledged their loyalty to Clinton/Kaine. Now let's say that turnout is 106% in Philly and "Clinton" wins the election. She wasn't actually the winner; her electors were. Then in December electors from the 50 states and DC meet to elect the president. The ones loyal to Trump/Pence vote for Trump for president and Pence for VP (note the they don't have to, and on very rare occasions a few electors actually vote for someone else)
Ok but Clinton is dead, so the electors loyal to her have to come up with an alternative. Who will they vote for? Almost certainly they will vote for whomever the Democratic party elite chose to replace Clinton back in September or October.
This seems like a crazy system, but it makes sense. One of the goals was to avoid the tragedy of Athens. The Athenian people voted for an ever expanding empire. Eventually they voted to fight Sparta and were crushed. So the elector system is to prevent democracy.
"the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?"
Well is was supposed to be the president... except that at the time the US was vulnerable to its more centralized rivals. Cincinnatus was a big inspiration and in fact George Washington was called the American Cincinnatus. Cincinnatus had been a very powerful man but after setbacks he had to become a poor farmer. Then when the Roman Republic was in trouble they elected him supreme dictator for the purpose of winning a war. He won the war and after fifteen days he went back to plowing his field. Then pretty much the same thing happened again.
The US started our with a parliamentary system called the Continental Congress. The president of the CC was what we would now call a prime minister. The system was untested (remember that this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn't get one for 43 more years). So the system was deemed too weak to survive a vengeful Britain. Thus the new system had a stronger president as commander in chief. The idea was that a powerful president would be able to win wars that a prime minister might not be able to.
So one of the major roles of the President is to always be available to fend off enemies. This means that there can never be a time without one, and so the system is designed to ensure that there always is one. The system (electors voting for anyone rather than the public voting for candidates on a ballot) is set up so that elections never need to be delayed and never have been, even during the brutal Civil War. There was also the election of 1812 which happened during the War of 1812 in which Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians.Replies: @AnotherGuessModel, @Kylie, @dearieme, @Nico
Wow. If only I’d had you as my history teacher, I might have learned something. I’ve always loved history but have a very hard time remembering specifics and overarching themes.
This was a very succinct explanation that I was able to understand. Thank you.
OT – Obama was campaigning for Hillary today and said this:
Then how does Obama explain his 95 percent polling among blacks?
The Poseidon Adventure has several scenes that are instructive. For those who do not want to watch this great movie – there are 9, and only 9, living Democratic party individuals who have won nation-wide approbation through fairly counted votes (directly for the presidential candidates, indirectly for the VP picks) and who are not constitutionally precluded from taking the oath of office in January of next year. Jimmy Carter…Walter Mondale…M. Dukakis…John Kerry…Al Gore…. Edwards (sorry, I forgot his first name) ….Joe Lieberman….Biden…Kaine. Carter 2016!!!! One weeps for the Southern Baptists…..Carter was pro-choice every day of his presidency, in the pride of life, as if he had never even heard of the Book of Proverbs.
Some people think Hillary is already dead since that obviously wasn’t her coming out of Chelsea’s place, unless it was old stock footage of a much younger Hillary. Bill is apparently going to campaign for her, since he’s saying she’s not completely dead. She might be pining for the fnords, if that illuminati thing is true.
Tim Kaine doesn’t have what it takes, unless he’s willing to put on a dress. This whole election is supposed to be a Historic Female thing. Of course, with Debbie Wasserman Schulz out and Donna Brazile in as Party Chairman, her list will be diverse with the only common denominator being black.
Biden probably wants in, since he’s already irrelevant. You don’t want this guy being another Algore and dressing funny and being some sort of activist. He could probably do less damage by ruining his career running for President.
Lizzie Warren would be the obvious choice to replace Hillary, but she’s just an Indian. If she claimed she was part black she might get on the list now.
” Who but someone on death’s door travels with a doctor with them at all times?”
Barry the Kenyan.
and in reality the media are the real opposition.Replies: @Jim Don Bob
Right. There would have been NO video of Hillary’s collapse Sunday if it had been up to the MSM. HRC’s people told the press to leave them alone, and pussies that they are, they complied. We would have nothing except for a guy with his cell phone.
Pat Paulsen died in 1997, but that should not be a problem for the Ds.
There are at least 2, maybe 3 angles of it. More than one person recording for sure. Not MSM though it seems (unless instantly destroyed).
Kaine projects like Roy Clark, has that same roly poly, good natured harmlessness to his visage.
My elderly father didn’t like drinking water because he hated having to get up at night multiple times to pee. I assume Hillary has the same issue.
Hillary's got a catheter, she can feel free to whiz away night or day, even during the middle of a Presidential debate.
I think Hillary’s handlers know that we won’t buy the BS the MSM feeds us about Hillary’s health. It’s all for damage control with her supporters. They just want a semi-plausible excuse to pay no attention to their lyin’ eyes.
“My elderly father didn’t like drinking water because he hated having to get up at night multiple times to pee. I assume Hillary has the same issue.”
Hillary’s got a catheter, she can feel free to whiz away night or day, even during the middle of a Presidential debate.
I’m sure that Hillary is concerned that if she loses this election there’s a possibility she may be prosecuted for her crimes. Being president is a great “Get Out of Jail Free” card. Notice all those people who helped her with her server pleading the Fifth today, and the one who didn’t even bother responding to the subpoena? I’m sure they’re counting on her election, after which all will be forgotten.
I suppose Obama can pardon her for all past crimes before leaving office, if he chooses, but I don’t know if she can count on that.
Or perhaps she can’t hold it in, even in the daytime.
From the point of view of the Clinton Crime Family, the most logical replacement for Hillary would be Terry McAuliffe. Governor of Virginia, former head of the DNC and chairman of Hillary’s 2008 presidential campaign. He guaranteed the mortgage on the Clinton’s house in Chappaqua.
He’s their Tom Hagen.
I suppose Obama can pardon her for all past crimes before leaving office, if he chooses, but I don't know if she can count on that.Replies: @Jack D
Too soon now, but if Snowden/Russia release further emails between now and election day, Obama could make a deal – a pardon in exchange for withdrawing her candidacy. I think this is pretty far fetched, but we live in unusual times.
Hillary has this thing, and it’s effing golden!
The nomination is hers. No matter how bad the polling looks post-NYC meltdown, the DNC can’t just unhorse her. If anyone is to take over, Hillary first has to agree to step down, give the tearful – but not too tearful – speech, anointing her successor.
This gives her leverage. If her health is as bad as all that, and if the polling is truly heading south, she can approach the DNC saying “give me the names of six acceptable stand-ins”. She can negotiate the price of the nomination with them. I’d think it would start at nine figures and go up from there, depending if the payout is to the Clintons personally or to their Foundation.
If you were George Soros (for example), how much would you pay to appoint the next President of the United States? How much would you pay to OWN the next President of the United States? The payment would go to Bill and Hillary Clinton, private citizens, under no obligation to release their 2016 tax returns to anyone. No public disclosure necessary at all, really. The new President would know that Soros bought them the office, and Soros would know that they knew. He’d also have all the documents to prove it. The man could not be denied anything he desired.
Obviously Hillary would prefer to be President herself. But if that dream starts to slip away, she is in a position to monetize the Democratic nomination in a way never before seen.
Tim Kaine doesn't have what it takes, unless he's willing to put on a dress. This whole election is supposed to be a Historic Female thing. Of course, with Debbie Wasserman Schulz out and Donna Brazile in as Party Chairman, her list will be diverse with the only common denominator being black.
Biden probably wants in, since he's already irrelevant. You don't want this guy being another Algore and dressing funny and being some sort of activist. He could probably do less damage by ruining his career running for President.
Lizzie Warren would be the obvious choice to replace Hillary, but she's just an Indian. If she claimed she was part black she might get on the list now.Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
I want a T-shirt that says:
Hillary 2016
Powering Through
or
Pining for the Fjords?
Your also right, I never saw that movie though.
> Is there a faction of democrat interest groups who do not want Muslims moving to the US?
AIPAC. And that is some deep pockets, bro.
I'm no expert, but I expect that there would be huge, poorly-understood legal complications to replacing the main candidate this far along.
Every state has its own ballot access laws, typically designed to make it painful for anyone to get on the ballot last-minute to keep third parties off the ballot. (It will be a delicious irony if this year, Gary Johnson is on more states' ballots than the Democratic candidate.). Even if the election authorities want to waive those rules, doing so will likely trigger a bunch of lawsuits.
I think campaign finance laws also limit any money transfers from Hillary to some other replacement candidate. Even if she's 100% on board with being replaced, I'm not sure what kind of complications up w.r.t. her existing huge pile of funds. Again, this seems like a fertile field for a decade of legal challenges.
Most likely this will all blow over. Hillary will hold it together for the rest of the campaign, since most likely she's just a 70 year old lady who's been overdoing it to win the election, not someone hiding some massive medical secret. But if she really does have some bigger problem, the whole election could be thrown into a decade's worth of lawsuits and allegations of wrongdoing. More interestingly, whose justice department investigates any claimed wrongdoing will depend on the election outcome.Replies: @Jack D, @Jack D, @TangoMan
I think campaign finance laws
Laws are for little people. We have laws banning foreign contributions to campaigns and Obama turned off geographic location data for credit card contributions. Against the law and no punishment.
Law is not a rational endeavor, rather it’s a rationalizing endeavor.
My son just started a social-justice themed English class, treading cautiously as he figures out his own views. I'd like to point him to that thread.
If you wrote that comment or a reply, could you point me to it?Replies: @ben tillman, @Harry Baldwin, @candid_observer
I remember the comment you’re referring to. The idea was that even if we know the truth about racial differences, we’re better off not acknowledging them because we can’t do anything about it and maybe talking about them would only exacerbate the acrimony. Not that I agree.
Minorities in Philly went for Hilary big over Bernie. Name recognition of Clinton meant Sanders didn’t stand a chance.
First time I heard that was a long time ago (Nick DiPaolo I think).
Laws are for little people. We have laws banning foreign contributions to campaigns and Obama turned off geographic location data for credit card contributions. Against the law and no punishment.
Law is not a rational endeavor, rather it's a rationalizing endeavor.Replies: @Charles Erwin Wilson
Your assertion is a modern innovation. It reduces the rule of law to a nullity. And anarchy not only will follow, anarchy must follow. But the Libs and Democrats are the first to invoke the rule of law when anarchy bites them. It will be incomprehensible when the rest of us do not kneel in obeisance to their regal presence.
That subset is different is each racial group and tends to be largest in a couple of groups I can think of.
In support of that, CBS Radio had lots of big shots like Jeh Johnson yammering about how Putin will hack for Trump or something, so “we had better do something.”
There is a subset of every population for whom the law is always used to their advantage.
That subset is different is each racial group and tends to be largest in a couple of groups I can think of.
Who’d they poll? Where? How’d they contact them? I don’t buy one damned poll anymore because until I know who paid for the poll and their motivations and methodology, I have no idea where the truth lies in that poll, nor do you. Nobody tells the truth to pollsters in sufficient numbers to draw accuracy anyway. Nonetheless, a fairer statement on my part might have been to state that from the outset of Trump’s nomination, the lines were drawn. I do believe men are going to go Trump that didn’t claim Republican affiliation last election, but that’s not a Party vote, it’s a gender vote and not one that’s admitted to a pollster, especially in the presence of one’s wife. Never-Trump “Republicans” are only 6%? They announced themselves a long time ago. And who polled them? That number ought to be higher, is it not indeed higher on Capitol Hill? Where are the crossover Democrats to Trump on the Hill? There ought to be a few, if not 16%.
Lots of fast and loose played with polls. CNN likely wouldn’t agree, but are they correct and your poll wrong? Fox’s? ABC/WashPost? Errors of margin give them lots of wriggle-room, too. Polls are ether, not to be believed. But, if they make a body feel better..
The party breakouts at issue are about half the way down, in this copious documentation of the poll results.
Absent the polls, all you have is your intuition. I will take my intuition over yours, Mr. Christian, thanks just the same.
“Could Bill stand as veep?
I don’t see why not:”
The Vice President has to meet the same qualifications as the President. Bill Clinton, George W Bush, and Obama are disqualified from election for both President and Vice President.
I now realize that those bulky burlap sack smocks she has been wearing are actually ileostomy bags disguised as ugly clothing. Not only are they designed to force people to look the other way but they hold more than the standard pantsuit.
The Daily Mail is pushing the Hillary body-double theory:
Does Hillary Clinton have a BODY DOUBLE?
Things are moving along smartly at present . . . .
Would this crowd mind heading over to Wonkette.com and making some obvious Steve Sailer points to that crowd? I did and got perma-banned, but it was quite entertaining.Replies: @Fester P. Librage
Wonkette is the schutzstaffel HQ for unattractive white women. The instant they detect that you’re a sane human being they won’t even waste time playing with you.
Even though she is an evil woman, it's still really sad and pathetic to see her humiliated like this, tossed around like a sack of potatoes. No one should be forced to live out their dotage on the public stage. Nancy very carefully shielded Reagan from the public once his Alzheimer's took hold. Of course Hillary herself wants to go on to her dying breath, but if she were surrounded by people that truly cared for her instead of enablers in it for themselves, they would intervene. We saw the same sad sequence with Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. This campaign may literally kill her or if she manages to make it to the Oval Office, the Presidency surely will. Even if she is elected and kept shielded as much as possible from the day that she takes office, I can't see how she will be able to last 4 more years in that job.Replies: @bomag, @Doug, @AnotherDad, @Kylie, @Nico, @Olorin
If she is “forced” as you say, it would be good to know by whom.
In my more compassionate moments I think that is a possibility (that she is a puppet of some external handlers).
Still I cannot come up with a more plausible explanation than that this woman is a power-hungry virago who got this far by dominating weaker egos, and none of them are going to dissent, since a) siding with power leads to opportunity and b) dissent in the Clintons’ circles tends to lead to peculiar demises.
…And the first tranche of the wikileaks dump hit
http://mattforney.com/dnc-leak/
http://mattforney.com/dnc-leak-voter-fraud/
I got my primary ballot!
Gosh, I’d forgotten all about Mlle Threewheeler. He’s a rogue, that Hollande, but unlike Slick Willie he doesn’t seem to have gone in for rape and sexual assault.
Here's how it would go: Clinton dies in September. In November people go to the polls and check the box for Clinton/Kaine. Although Clinton and Kaine's names are on the ballot, the people are actually voting for a slate of electors who have pledged their loyalty to Clinton/Kaine. Now let's say that turnout is 106% in Philly and "Clinton" wins the election. She wasn't actually the winner; her electors were. Then in December electors from the 50 states and DC meet to elect the president. The ones loyal to Trump/Pence vote for Trump for president and Pence for VP (note the they don't have to, and on very rare occasions a few electors actually vote for someone else)
Ok but Clinton is dead, so the electors loyal to her have to come up with an alternative. Who will they vote for? Almost certainly they will vote for whomever the Democratic party elite chose to replace Clinton back in September or October.
This seems like a crazy system, but it makes sense. One of the goals was to avoid the tragedy of Athens. The Athenian people voted for an ever expanding empire. Eventually they voted to fight Sparta and were crushed. So the elector system is to prevent democracy.
"the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?"
Well is was supposed to be the president... except that at the time the US was vulnerable to its more centralized rivals. Cincinnatus was a big inspiration and in fact George Washington was called the American Cincinnatus. Cincinnatus had been a very powerful man but after setbacks he had to become a poor farmer. Then when the Roman Republic was in trouble they elected him supreme dictator for the purpose of winning a war. He won the war and after fifteen days he went back to plowing his field. Then pretty much the same thing happened again.
The US started our with a parliamentary system called the Continental Congress. The president of the CC was what we would now call a prime minister. The system was untested (remember that this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn't get one for 43 more years). So the system was deemed too weak to survive a vengeful Britain. Thus the new system had a stronger president as commander in chief. The idea was that a powerful president would be able to win wars that a prime minister might not be able to.
So one of the major roles of the President is to always be available to fend off enemies. This means that there can never be a time without one, and so the system is designed to ensure that there always is one. The system (electors voting for anyone rather than the public voting for candidates on a ballot) is set up so that elections never need to be delayed and never have been, even during the brutal Civil War. There was also the election of 1812 which happened during the War of 1812 in which Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians.Replies: @AnotherGuessModel, @Kylie, @dearieme, @Nico
“this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn’t get one for 43 more years”: I suspect you’re referring to the title “Prime Minister” rather than the reality. Historians reckon the first PM in reality was Sir Robert Walpole, in office 1721–42.
“Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians”: it was essentially a raid, partly in revenge for US troops having burned Toronto (then called York).
No I am referring to the Reform Act of 1832, which (among other things) took away the choice of PM from the king and gave it to parliament. Previous PMs could be appointed and dismissed at will by the king and thus were instruments through which he wielded his royal power. Starting in 1832 the PM's power was largely independent of the king. The king tried to choose the PM in 1834 but it didn't work out and since then PMs have been chosen by parliament without royal interference.Replies: @Desiderius, @dearieme
He's their Tom Hagen.Replies: @John Mansfield
The president and vice-president have to be from different states, though. There was a problem about Cheney having moved to Texas (for Haliburton?). I suppose that was solved by moving his residence back to Wyoming. It’s probably a little late for one of the Virginia governors to change residence now. McAuliffe with Kaine wouldn’t work, so you’re probably thinking of a ticket without Kaine.
Someone unrelated to a famous person who looks so much like him that his mother wouldn’t know the difference is one of my least favorite Hollywood-Neverland conventions. Right between somebody being clunked on the head and suffering no symptoms other than the loss of memories concerning their own identity, and of course, the classic: The Reading of the Will.
Lots of fast and loose played with polls. CNN likely wouldn't agree, but are they correct and your poll wrong? Fox's? ABC/WashPost? Errors of margin give them lots of wriggle-room, too. Polls are ether, not to be believed. But, if they make a body feel better..Replies: @D. K.
http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2015/PPP_Release_FL_90716.pdf
The party breakouts at issue are about half the way down, in this copious documentation of the poll results.
Absent the polls, all you have is your intuition. I will take my intuition over yours, Mr. Christian, thanks just the same.
He should have changed his first name to Col.
First time I heard that was a long time ago (Nick DiPaolo I think).
If she does have a body double, you can bet that we will never hear about it from the MSM. It’ll take some guy like the one on Sunday with his cell phone camera.
There seems to be no SS dudes in those photos. They were probably all guarding the near corpse up in Chelsea's apartment.
My son just started a social-justice themed English class, treading cautiously as he figures out his own views. I'd like to point him to that thread.
If you wrote that comment or a reply, could you point me to it?Replies: @ben tillman, @Harry Baldwin, @candid_observer
Harry Baldwin’s comment here described the comment in a little more detail, and I remember I indirectly responded to it, so I was able to track it down:
https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-artificial-intelligences-white-guy-problem/#comment-1467515
http://mattforney.com/dnc-leak/Replies: @Peripatetic commenter
Isn’t he a bit melodramatic?
http://mattforney.com/dnc-leak-voter-fraud/
I got my primary ballot!
"Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians": it was essentially a raid, partly in revenge for US troops having burned Toronto (then called York).Replies: @Spoons
“I suspect you’re referring to the title “Prime Minister” rather than the reality. Historians reckon the first PM in reality was Sir Robert Walpole, in office 1721–42.”
No I am referring to the Reform Act of 1832, which (among other things) took away the choice of PM from the king and gave it to parliament. Previous PMs could be appointed and dismissed at will by the king and thus were instruments through which he wielded his royal power. Starting in 1832 the PM’s power was largely independent of the king. The king tried to choose the PM in 1834 but it didn’t work out and since then PMs have been chosen by parliament without royal interference.
To think that the whole Watergate scandal could have been avoided if Nixon had just told Woodward and Bernstein to stop following them.
The nomination is hers. No matter how bad the polling looks post-NYC meltdown, the DNC can't just unhorse her. If anyone is to take over, Hillary first has to agree to step down, give the tearful - but not too tearful - speech, anointing her successor.
This gives her leverage. If her health is as bad as all that, and if the polling is truly heading south, she can approach the DNC saying "give me the names of six acceptable stand-ins". She can negotiate the price of the nomination with them. I'd think it would start at nine figures and go up from there, depending if the payout is to the Clintons personally or to their Foundation.
If you were George Soros (for example), how much would you pay to appoint the next President of the United States? How much would you pay to OWN the next President of the United States? The payment would go to Bill and Hillary Clinton, private citizens, under no obligation to release their 2016 tax returns to anyone. No public disclosure necessary at all, really. The new President would know that Soros bought them the office, and Soros would know that they knew. He'd also have all the documents to prove it. The man could not be denied anything he desired.
Obviously Hillary would prefer to be President herself. But if that dream starts to slip away, she is in a position to monetize the Democratic nomination in a way never before seen.Replies: @SteveRogers42
This sounds more-than-plausible.
Do you think the Secret Service would have let her wander around by herself last Sunday after she allegedly recovered?
There seems to be no SS dudes in those photos. They were probably all guarding the near corpse up in Chelsea’s apartment.
No. It was total Astro Turf, with or without a body double. Cute little girl just happens to have flowers, etc. Gag me with a spoon.
If she has a body double, you can bet that Bill Clinton has already banged her just for the kicks.
No I am referring to the Reform Act of 1832, which (among other things) took away the choice of PM from the king and gave it to parliament. Previous PMs could be appointed and dismissed at will by the king and thus were instruments through which he wielded his royal power. Starting in 1832 the PM's power was largely independent of the king. The king tried to choose the PM in 1834 but it didn't work out and since then PMs have been chosen by parliament without royal interference.Replies: @Desiderius, @dearieme
And dearieme was speaking of the balance of real power, which was never with the throne after the passing of William, with the possible exception of Victoria at the height of her popularity. The founders certainly had the Walpole (and even more so, Pitt) administration in mind while creating the office of the Presidency, as well as preventing another Lord North.
No I am referring to the Reform Act of 1832, which (among other things) took away the choice of PM from the king and gave it to parliament. Previous PMs could be appointed and dismissed at will by the king and thus were instruments through which he wielded his royal power. Starting in 1832 the PM's power was largely independent of the king. The king tried to choose the PM in 1834 but it didn't work out and since then PMs have been chosen by parliament without royal interference.Replies: @Desiderius, @dearieme
“Previous PMs could be appointed and dismissed at will by the king and thus were instruments through which he wielded his royal power”: not really. There was little point a King appointing a PM who could not command a majority in the two Houses of Parliament. In particular, the Commons controlled the purse strings, and Parliament controlled the army. This didn’t leave much leeway for the king. He could, however, bugger up Parliament by refusing to sign legislation that it had passed: the obvious example was George III suddenly refusing to sign the Act to remove civil disqualifications on Roman Catholics. Pitt the Younger resigned as PM over that.
It was the famous body double’s body double who you saw.
Here's how it would go: Clinton dies in September. In November people go to the polls and check the box for Clinton/Kaine. Although Clinton and Kaine's names are on the ballot, the people are actually voting for a slate of electors who have pledged their loyalty to Clinton/Kaine. Now let's say that turnout is 106% in Philly and "Clinton" wins the election. She wasn't actually the winner; her electors were. Then in December electors from the 50 states and DC meet to elect the president. The ones loyal to Trump/Pence vote for Trump for president and Pence for VP (note the they don't have to, and on very rare occasions a few electors actually vote for someone else)
Ok but Clinton is dead, so the electors loyal to her have to come up with an alternative. Who will they vote for? Almost certainly they will vote for whomever the Democratic party elite chose to replace Clinton back in September or October.
This seems like a crazy system, but it makes sense. One of the goals was to avoid the tragedy of Athens. The Athenian people voted for an ever expanding empire. Eventually they voted to fight Sparta and were crushed. So the elector system is to prevent democracy.
"the president only has a ceremonial role, except for liminal political situations precisely like Hillary prospectively dropping out of the race at the last minute. In the USA, who would that be? The Speaker?"
Well is was supposed to be the president... except that at the time the US was vulnerable to its more centralized rivals. Cincinnatus was a big inspiration and in fact George Washington was called the American Cincinnatus. Cincinnatus had been a very powerful man but after setbacks he had to become a poor farmer. Then when the Roman Republic was in trouble they elected him supreme dictator for the purpose of winning a war. He won the war and after fifteen days he went back to plowing his field. Then pretty much the same thing happened again.
The US started our with a parliamentary system called the Continental Congress. The president of the CC was what we would now call a prime minister. The system was untested (remember that this was before the modern conception of a prime minister existed, the UK didn't get one for 43 more years). So the system was deemed too weak to survive a vengeful Britain. Thus the new system had a stronger president as commander in chief. The idea was that a powerful president would be able to win wars that a prime minister might not be able to.
So one of the major roles of the President is to always be available to fend off enemies. This means that there can never be a time without one, and so the system is designed to ensure that there always is one. The system (electors voting for anyone rather than the public voting for candidates on a ballot) is set up so that elections never need to be delayed and never have been, even during the brutal Civil War. There was also the election of 1812 which happened during the War of 1812 in which Washington DC was captured by the British/Canadians.Replies: @AnotherGuessModel, @Kylie, @dearieme, @Nico
Does Obama’s rule amount to dereliction of duty or treason?