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If you only follow the Portland riots online, you can see a lot of footage like this:
Graphic: #Antifa rioters throw a Molotov cocktail in direction of police in SE Portland. It lands next to people, setting one on fire. Video by @TaylerUSA. #PortlandRiots pic.twitter.com/NJfEURKfkC
— Andy Ngô (@MrAndyNgo) September 6, 2020
But if instead you watch non-Fox national network news, you evidently get 99 and 44/100ths Peaceful Protestors being brutalized by fascists.
How the sausage is made:
From Reason:
‘You’re Not Allowed To Film’: The Fight To Control Who Reports From Portland
Both sides are getting their information through purposely bottlenecked media reports, and the results are predictably distorted and dangerous.
NANCY ROMMELMANN | 9.4.2020 4:15 PM“YOU’RE NOT ALLOWED TO FILM!” is a cry you hear incessantly at protests in Portland, Oregon, always shouted at close range to your face by after-dark demonstrators. …
I cannot say who came up with these anti-camera battle cries. But it’s easy to understand why protesters use them: to shape the narrative the country sees about the protests. And that narrative, in my estimation after many weeks covering street clashes in a city where I lived for 15 years, is 90 percent bullshit.
… The IPC is an organized group in league with the activists, and it is usually their footage you see streamed online and recycled on the news: mostly innocent protestors being harassed and beaten by police.
… With the PRESS crew recording part of the story and the “YOU’RE NOT ALLOWED TO FILM!” crew harassing other journalists, the result can be a misleading view of the protests. It’s a revolution via the cellphone video they allow you to see.
The IPC and other documentarians who are deemed sympathetic to the activists’ cause agree on certain principles. You do not show activists’ faces. You only show activists in a defensive position: responding to, rather than inciting, violence. You enhance what can appear to be police brutality, e.g., activists defending themselves with homemade shields, often bearing the anarchist circle-A, against police. …
Reporters seen as not sufficiently sympathetic to the cause—which is defined by the Ten Demands for Justice, and includes most notably the abolition of the police—will be followed, be harassed, have their notes photographed and their phones blocked or stolen. (All these things have happened to me in the last month. A photographer friend has been repeatedly doxxed and placed on a list of “enemies.”)
If you forget any of these rules, you can just refer to the handy Google spreadsheet of approved journalists and suggested behavior. The spreadsheet contains names, Twitter handles, and ways to financially support the journos who make the cut.
Note who the people on this activist-approved list are writing for. Sergio Olmos, who made IPC’s list of approved journalists, is freelancing as a man on the ground for The New York Times. …
blm/antifa passed Lord of the Flies and perhaps Animal Farm pretty quickly. 1984, Mao, Pol Pot, stalin and Hitler seem too well organized for them, so maybe the next step is more like Rwanda, Liberia or Sierra Leone.
I hope Andy Ngo lives long enough to write about it.
https://youtu.be/-M4mrUoJy0c
Antifa is all about “peace and love” baby!
So the MSM really is anti-American. Who knew?
Click on both photos.
Bill’s expression is just funny in the first picture (see below).
Epstein kept this picture of Clinton in his house.
Epstein also kept this picture of Bush in his house.
If so, it's a small world after all.
https://i.postimg.cc/6QT55sKb/d69d0444a192e42c9d2d5c00e039808704a99d5dfc6bc1ea536d7ffa17ad24ab.jpgReplies: @JohnnyWalker123
https://twitter.com/BecketAdams/status/1302281254767861764Replies: @AndrewR, @J.Ross
Ol’ Hotfoot’s dance sure is gonna be funny to watch once the internet sets it to the right music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QCRyZ6zWGA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C0Z8dh83Ro
That video is a great “proof of concept” piece for an athlete’s foot commercial.
Something from which I’m certain many of those poor wretched incel’s are suffering.
Also, I’m confident enough to declare it as the funniest BLM video of the month, and I challenge ANYone to beat it!
https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1302387282188685313
Bill's expression is just funny in the first picture (see below).
https://e6q8f5d4.ssl.hwcdn.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/EhKeYefWoAM_Se--680x375.jpg
Epstein kept this picture of Clinton in his house.
https://news.artnet.com/app/news-upload/2019/08/Petrina-Ryan-Kleid-Parsing-Bill.jpg
Epstein also kept this picture of Bush in his house.
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/08/16/04/17342302-7362569-image-a-3_1565925741812.jpgReplies: @wren, @Mike Tre, @MEH 0910
What’s your take on Kamala’s sister joining the Podestas and Mr. Comet Ping Pong for a pizza party? Is this true?
If so, it’s a small world after all.
https://www.infowars.com/wikileaks-emails-show-kamala-harris-sister-attended-hillary-clinton-podesta-pizza-party/https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/maya-harris-pizza-email.png
Here's what I don't understand.
Why is a pizza parlor owner (James Alefantis) such a powerful man in Washington DC? Why do so many powerful people want to hang out with him?
Ron Unz has pointed out that GQ Magazine ranked Alefantis as one of the 50 most powerful people in DC. Was the pizza really that good?
None of this makes sense. There's something deeply unsettling about this axis of power that includes James Alefantis.
Then there's Marina Abramovich.Replies: @wren, @CorkyAgain
There’s a hell of a lot of self-proclaimed “Press” and even somewhat valid press that are Antifa supporters, and Twitter allows them to have an account while they provide support/encouragement for rioters. Again, there’s a lot of them, and are well organized.
Here’s an example of cranking up a narrative that is prescribed by a Portland Tribune “reporter”:
A different angle of the flaming duck walk:
Question: If someone is about to toss a Molotov cocktail, is it legal for cops/civilians to “light them up”? Seems like a deadly weapon.
Seems like a great idea …
There … FIFY …
Tim Pool shocked to discover that ADL says there is no left-wing extremism going on in the US:
It’s all part of a larger scheme called, no doubt ironically, the Transition Integrity Project, which seeks to ensure that no matter who actually wins the election, Trump loses.
https://unlimitedhangout.com/2020/09/investigative-reports/bipartisan-washington-insiders-reveal-their-plan-for-chaos-if-trump-wins-the-election/
The imperative “You’re not allowed [by whom?] to film!” is a reminder that we need a verb to refer to recording moving images without using film. Got any suggestions?
This is not new. The 1960s Civil Rights movement was filmed the same way: always make the Numinous Negroes seem like virginal innocents and the whites who know better as ogres.
I know what will solve all this. I
We need to keep smugly ranting about it on the internet. Maybe the President can even tweet LAW AND ORDER again. The left would have no defense against that.
Actually going out there and [redacted] leftists and their enablers DEFINITELY would not work.
Vote for right wing 3rd party candidates, or write-in Tucker Carlson.
Take good care of yourself. As a red-pilled White man, you are a rare and precious resource.
No, it definitely would not work. The riots are a trap. It is exactly where they want you fighting them. The real enemies are the rich donors and organizers and government officials with titles like mayor, governor and district attorney, not the people in the street.Replies: @anon
If Trump is serious about taking on Antifa now with the feds, conspiracy charges against these journalists (and/or their outlets) are something he should consider. (Or criminal antitrust, if DOJ wants to get creative.)
Like with Putin, the caricature drawn by Trump's opponents is so graphic, and broadcast nonstop at such a volume, that people tend to either believe the caricature or its polar opposite--that of a patriot valiantly fighting the Deep State. These stereotypes demand such attention that little energy remains to consider what Trump's people have actually been doing in government; an educated guess is that this suits Trump just fine.
Nope. Dead end. The black-clad cult kids made the mistake of accepting guidance from intelligence-associated personages in regards to the structure of their revolt. If the Feds get serious, which is doubtful because DOJ/FBI is still an Eric Holder Joint, the fatties and trannies can be RICO'd. But Portland will remain a sad mess: the town and environs for at least two decades has been a magnet for mentally-ill white youth from across the country. It will continue; like black grievance.
This is surprising. Journalists come across as the only group with any real sense of cohesion – to the point of offering “solidarity” when one of them turned out to have grown up with convicted people traffickers. (Look it up.) Wouldn’t attacking the media be a catastrophic mistake?
Only to those that are not paying attention.
Journalists come across as the only group with any real sense of cohesion .
Lol. What century are you commenting from? Journo-lists are a tribe, many are downright (((tribal))) but there are larger loyalties. A lot of journo-lists are leftards and fully in sympathy with the Antifa.
Wouldn’t attacking the media be a catastrophic mistake?
"Some" and "all" are not synonyms, and the attacks are not uniform. The Portland Antifa are being the tribe here. Jorno-lists can join the Antifa and be treated nice, or they can oppose the Antifa and be treated badly. See how that works? It's like grade school playground politics, surprised it's difficult for anyone to grasp.
"Do as we tell you and you won't get hurt" is pretty basic.
So some journo-lists will be attacked and some will not, depending on how well they serve their Antifa comrades. It's nothing even remotely new. There is no middle ground. No one is an unbiased observer on the streets of Portland now.
Repeat:
There is no middle ground around Antifa. This is what Liberteenians cannot understand.
Maybe if the Reason drone just explained the Non-Aggression Principle a few hundred times to the girl lasing the camera and the dudes with the incendiaries / bats / bullhorns / strobe lights / rocks / bear spray / etc. all the Antifa setting fire to stuff in Portland would suddenly come around. Sure, that's gotta work! How could it possibly fail?
And they say white guys can’t dance.
https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1302387282188685313
Bill's expression is just funny in the first picture (see below).
https://e6q8f5d4.ssl.hwcdn.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/EhKeYefWoAM_Se--680x375.jpg
Epstein kept this picture of Clinton in his house.
https://news.artnet.com/app/news-upload/2019/08/Petrina-Ryan-Kleid-Parsing-Bill.jpg
Epstein also kept this picture of Bush in his house.
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/08/16/04/17342302-7362569-image-a-3_1565925741812.jpgReplies: @wren, @Mike Tre, @MEH 0910
Perhaps that was a self portrait of Bush.
My impression is nobody with an IQ over 85 believes that. Some may say it, but they don’t believe it.
Although, there may be intelligent head cases with 57 genders who live in a kind of schizophrenic dreamworld where they can change their reality daily.
A healthy Establishment would get them the help they need. Ours gave them reality TV shows.
Something else the approved media does not want you to see.
https://politicalpatrol.com/2020/09/05/this-is-where-they-house-the-rioters-city-of-portland-houses-some-antifa-rioters-destroying-the-city/
Fat chance; the NYT is pretty shitty at reporting the news, but nonetheless wields great power because the paper is deeply integrated with the US Govt–same as with the Big Tech monopolies silencing conservatives and many others. Personnel is policy: if the Donald had ever been serious about carrying out a populist program, do you think he’d have stuffed his administration full with establishment hacks?
Like with Putin, the caricature drawn by Trump’s opponents is so graphic, and broadcast nonstop at such a volume, that people tend to either believe the caricature or its polar opposite–that of a patriot valiantly fighting the Deep State. These stereotypes demand such attention that little energy remains to consider what Trump’s people have actually been doing in government; an educated guess is that this suits Trump just fine.
https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1302387282188685313
Bill's expression is just funny in the first picture (see below).
https://e6q8f5d4.ssl.hwcdn.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/EhKeYefWoAM_Se--680x375.jpg
Epstein kept this picture of Clinton in his house.
https://news.artnet.com/app/news-upload/2019/08/Petrina-Ryan-Kleid-Parsing-Bill.jpg
Epstein also kept this picture of Bush in his house.
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/08/16/04/17342302-7362569-image-a-3_1565925741812.jpgReplies: @wren, @Mike Tre, @MEH 0910
https://twitter.com/BecketAdams/status/1302281254767861764
"The Russians," all 150 million of them, make a perfect scapegoat for our anti-white elite.
What's amazing is how quick the about-face was. Many people may recall how Mitt Romney was mocked by much of the elite class in 2012 for suggesting that Russia was our greatest geopolitical rival. By 2016 Russophobia was universal among anyone who hated Trump.
Every once in a while the libertarians wake up. For a while it seemed they were all going corporatist, and some of them still are. More seem to think that hard left cultural expression is harmless and doesn’t lead to the gulags. Reason in particular has lost a lot of the quality it had back in the 90s when Virginia Postrel was running things, reasonably.
So when you generalize about libertarians keep in mind that aside from a few think tank exceptions (none in DC) what you are talking about isn't representative of the broader libertarian community.
So far as I know there are no other actual libertarian or sympathetic billionaires (like the dozens on the prog/left) who support financially libertarians doing media work. Even the conservatives have far more independent funding.
All opinion journalism is bought and paid for by funders. Free market, pro capitalist pro free speech libertarians are the poor relations in this business. There is a story there but who can afford to write that and still eat?Replies: @anon
I just saw Ford Fischer just got locked out of his Facebook account. Also as an independent reporter, he has never been able to get a twitter blue check mark. Once the tech titans take down the the independent press, the narrative should be easy to control. Now the narrative is the violence is white supremacists. Apparently the the Trump administration is going to play along with that . It certainly helps that some obscure right wing groups mysteriously show up for the optics of being there.
Rommelmann is probably the best reporter in Portland right now.
For a group seemingly terrified of cameras, Antifa is sure odd. They had a cameraman videotape Danielson’s shooting. They got the meth head killed and one of his co-conspirators arrested.
https://twitter.com/BecketAdams/status/1302281254767861764Replies: @AndrewR, @J.Ross
“The Russians”
“The Russians,” all 150 million of them, make a perfect scapegoat for our anti-white elite.
What’s amazing is how quick the about-face was. Many people may recall how Mitt Romney was mocked by much of the elite class in 2012 for suggesting that Russia was our greatest geopolitical rival. By 2016 Russophobia was universal among anyone who hated Trump.
I emailed the Ford Foundation and asked why they are so generously funding black terrorism, white despair, and the disintegration of what was a relatively free and open society. I’m still waiting for a response.
“conspiracy charges against these journalists”
Nope. Dead end. The black-clad cult kids made the mistake of accepting guidance from intelligence-associated personages in regards to the structure of their revolt. If the Feds get serious, which is doubtful because DOJ/FBI is still an Eric Holder Joint, the fatties and trannies can be RICO’d. But Portland will remain a sad mess: the town and environs for at least two decades has been a magnet for mentally-ill white youth from across the country. It will continue; like black grievance.
So the revolution really won’t be televised.
Sure it will...by the revolutionaries. And only by them.Replies: @Svigor
‘Mostly peaceful’ seems to be the stablemate of ‘highly likely’—another vague expression in Newspeak which is used in case of bogus assertions that have no factual base at all.
Sad to observe the deterioration of the English language which once was a tool of linguistic precision and certainty with its vast pool of terminology covering all shades of nuances—not only in engineering but in social sciences as well. The language, it appears, degenerates in tandem with society. When people’s minds are uncertain the language gets unclear as well.
Can’t share on Facebook. Other users reported this content as “abusive.” They are nothing if not committed to—well I wouldn’t call it a cause, but—something.
Matt Taibbi wrote an article calling for Biden to have a Sister Souljah moment with Vicky Osterweil. Perhaps Taibbi is a reader of yours, Steve.
Related OT story today:
It seems that every single institution is controlled by the global, oligarchic, billionaire, anti-American Left.
The following is just another example of an institutional lie, in this case being told even by a department in an exective branch ostensibly led by a president who would disagree with the lie:
Drafts of a DHS report call white supremacists the ‘most persistent and lethal’ terror threat in the US: report
Drafts of a DHS report call white supremacists the 'most persistent and lethal' terror threat in the US: reportReplies: @Jim Don Bob
Trump should find and fire everyone involved in this lie.
https://twitter.com/BecketAdams/status/1302281254767861764Replies: @AndrewR, @J.Ross
Living with Hillary must be like that one scene in the original Manchurian Candidate where Lawrence Harvey is begging Angela Landsbury to just stop talking.
Why are the people who want to make a massive issue out of a huge of riots and shootings have decided to not care about the over 190k deaths due to Covid-19.
Is getting yelled at while sitting at a restaurant really worse than dying from Covid-19. If having to avoid the Magnificiant mile due to looting the really same of million of people being laid off due to Covid-19. Or is it the small issues are easier to understand than large issues.
If not, I have grave doubts as to your sanity.Replies: @guest007
Trump easily benefits as the “law and order” candidate and with re-election promises to clamp down on the riots.
The Democrats (Clinton Neoliberals) have essentially jack-sh!t to offer the Bernie Bro faction and/or black voters in terms of economic support. So, the Democrats are being super cheap and trying to encourage those voters to vote on principle. Thus the focus on the riot/protests as a moral crusade against blank. They’re trying to invigorate those voters so much that voting for “the good choice” will be it’s own reward.
(This is the most pure Bernie Bro podcast that I’m aware of and it’s good to listen to occasionally.)
https://youtu.be/FFY6AFJnu-c
The looting is way, way, way more important, because it signifies that our minoritarian "elites" are willing to blithely toss out the rule-of-law in order to continue the attack on/delegitimization of their one serious potential opponent to their control--i.e. the popular resistance by white men.
Rule-of-law is one of the critical pillars of civilization. It's one of the key reasons the Anglo-sphere is better, freer, more prosperous than even other places with high IQ populations, much less 3rd world joints where everyone has their hand out and "justice" is inherently political.
That our elites are now openly trashing rule-of-law, the same way they have openly trashed the other critical government function--borders, protection from invasion and population replacement--is a super-important deal. We can't have civilization if we can't stop this or destroy these elites.
In contrast, the Xi virus b.s. however painful is a pipsqueak.Replies: @guest007
Here’s an apparent BLM transitional person, and self-proclaimed “codependent journalist” who was caught lying about the chaos in Portland. When Andy Ngo called him out, he immediately deleted his tweet and locked down his account. Seems quite unusual for a “journalist” to lock the public out of his/her account. Maybe his inner lesbian demanded it if him.
Also note his/her qualifying bio splash in his/her header. Not something to inspire confidence outside of the twilight zone.
Is getting yelled at while sitting at a restaurant really worse than dying from Covid-19. If having to avoid the Magnificiant mile due to looting the really same of million of people being laid off due to Covid-19. Or is it the small issues are easier to understand than large issues.Replies: @Hibernian, @Ian Smith, @Che Guava, @Kronos, @AnotherDad
The death toll is highly inflated because it deliberately ignores comorbidities. The layoffs are real and the result of deliberate overreaction by leftwing governors and mayors.
The canard that used to get floated about how "it's really the lockdowns causing all the deaths" -- promulgated by moronic posts like this one -- lost its lustre once the lockdowns were eased and the death toll started increasing (whereupon the very same nitwits who helped promulgate that canard came back around and tried to have it both ways).I know that won't convince the true believers. Like the liberals who don't care about SAT scores, and IQ, numbers and data will never dissuade them from what they really, really cross-their-hearts-and-pixie-dust want to be true (especially when so many mean and nasty people are on the other side). Alas, the lockdown that supposedly causes an overall surge of deaths when it is applied, and then another hump of excess death after it is eased is about as believable as the magic/tragic dirt that suffices to explain how black people get left behind. It's about as believable as grandpa's fabled walks to school in the bitter rain and snow back when he was a young 'un, that went uphill both ways.Replies: @Hibernian
Once again , the Republicans refusal to deal with Covid-19 is why the Republicans are going to lose seats in the Senate, in the House, and in state and local races. Too many people have decided that the Republicans are idiots that cannot deal with a problem when it is right in front of them.
Image if President Trump had the approval rating of Mike Dewine. President Trump would be coasting to re-election instead of having to scare everyone about riots and brown people.
Is getting yelled at while sitting at a restaurant really worse than dying from Covid-19. If having to avoid the Magnificiant mile due to looting the really same of million of people being laid off due to Covid-19. Or is it the small issues are easier to understand than large issues.Replies: @Hibernian, @Ian Smith, @Che Guava, @Kronos, @AnotherDad
You can think that COVID is dangerous AND oppose riotous orcs.
This is surprising.
Only to those that are not paying attention.
Journalists come across as the only group with any real sense of cohesion .
Lol. What century are you commenting from? Journo-lists are a tribe, many are downright (((tribal))) but there are larger loyalties. A lot of journo-lists are leftards and fully in sympathy with the Antifa.
Wouldn’t attacking the media be a catastrophic mistake?
“Some” and “all” are not synonyms, and the attacks are not uniform. The Portland Antifa are being the tribe here. Jorno-lists can join the Antifa and be treated nice, or they can oppose the Antifa and be treated badly. See how that works? It’s like grade school playground politics, surprised it’s difficult for anyone to grasp.
“Do as we tell you and you won’t get hurt” is pretty basic.
So some journo-lists will be attacked and some will not, depending on how well they serve their Antifa comrades. It’s nothing even remotely new. There is no middle ground. No one is an unbiased observer on the streets of Portland now.
Repeat:
There is no middle ground around Antifa. This is what Liberteenians cannot understand.
Maybe if the Reason drone just explained the Non-Aggression Principle a few hundred times to the girl lasing the camera and the dudes with the incendiaries / bats / bullhorns / strobe lights / rocks / bear spray / etc. all the Antifa setting fire to stuff in Portland would suddenly come around. Sure, that’s gotta work! How could it possibly fail?
I can’t watch twitter videos they don’t work for me, whether it’s because I have no account or just my outdated browser I refuse to update. I think I found that first vid on youtube though.
Some of these people are so ridiculously stupid. The guy is like, oh my legs are on fire? Awesome, lets start can can dancing this will look amazing. Apparently he thought an extremely energetic goose step would blow the flames out.
It would have looked way more impressive if he did a Russian dance instead.
So the revolution really won’t be televised.
Sure it will…by the revolutionaries. And only by them.
One wonders whether, in their methodology, blocking traffic on freeways was accounted, violent or nonviolent?
Is getting yelled at while sitting at a restaurant really worse than dying from Covid-19. If having to avoid the Magnificiant mile due to looting the really same of million of people being laid off due to Covid-19. Or is it the small issues are easier to understand than large issues.Replies: @Hibernian, @Ian Smith, @Che Guava, @Kronos, @AnotherDad
One must hope you are just being a troll.
If not, I have grave doubts as to your sanity.
What is insane is pursing a political positions that is supported by a well less than 50% of Americans and believing that one will win in a rout.
I thought this did a pretty good job summing it up.
The revolution will not be televised.
It will be Tweeted.
Michael Reinoehl suffered an aneurysm. Anthony Huber fell and hit his head.
Joseph Rosenbaum had a Félix Faure moment while chasing Kyle Rittenhouse’s toned and sculpted rear end.
The guy found in Uncle Hugo’s/Uncle Edgar’s had just read a particularly frightening story and had a coronary.
Is getting yelled at while sitting at a restaurant really worse than dying from Covid-19. If having to avoid the Magnificiant mile due to looting the really same of million of people being laid off due to Covid-19. Or is it the small issues are easier to understand than large issues.Replies: @Hibernian, @Ian Smith, @Che Guava, @Kronos, @AnotherDad
I’d imagine it benefits both Trump and the Democrats.
Trump easily benefits as the “law and order” candidate and with re-election promises to clamp down on the riots.
The Democrats (Clinton Neoliberals) have essentially jack-sh!t to offer the Bernie Bro faction and/or black voters in terms of economic support. So, the Democrats are being super cheap and trying to encourage those voters to vote on principle. Thus the focus on the riot/protests as a moral crusade against blank. They’re trying to invigorate those voters so much that voting for “the good choice” will be it’s own reward.
(This is the most pure Bernie Bro podcast that I’m aware of and it’s good to listen to occasionally.)
I hope Andy Ngo lives long enough to write about it.Replies: @Kronos
He got knocked around quite badly a while back.
Antifa is all about “peace and love” baby!
Reason hasn’t been much more than “ghost libertarian” in decades, though sometimes has good articles, etc. As far as I know it is the only “libertarian” outfit that isn’t totally controlled by the Kochs or their surrogates. Even they get considerable funding from various Koch funders but were not founded by them. I don’t know about current management. They aren’t totally Koch dependent.
So when you generalize about libertarians keep in mind that aside from a few think tank exceptions (none in DC) what you are talking about isn’t representative of the broader libertarian community.
So far as I know there are no other actual libertarian or sympathetic billionaires (like the dozens on the prog/left) who support financially libertarians doing media work. Even the conservatives have far more independent funding.
All opinion journalism is bought and paid for by funders. Free market, pro capitalist pro free speech libertarians are the poor relations in this business. There is a story there but who can afford to write that and still eat?
http://www.libertyunbound.com/Replies: @Muggles
Only by the Comrades.
The Portland rioters are all kind of a riot in their own way too.
So when you generalize about libertarians keep in mind that aside from a few think tank exceptions (none in DC) what you are talking about isn't representative of the broader libertarian community.
So far as I know there are no other actual libertarian or sympathetic billionaires (like the dozens on the prog/left) who support financially libertarians doing media work. Even the conservatives have far more independent funding.
All opinion journalism is bought and paid for by funders. Free market, pro capitalist pro free speech libertarians are the poor relations in this business. There is a story there but who can afford to write that and still eat?Replies: @anon
How would you describe or evaluate these guys?
http://www.libertyunbound.com/
Funny you should ask. I was an original assoc. editor of Liberty in the late 80s when it came out in print. Publisher/editor Bill Bradford later kicked me out for a minor disagreement. It has been online only since the early 2000s. I have a complete print set that I'd like to host online (I have a website for that) but haven't been able to hear back from them.
The problem with this publication/website is that it was always amateur and totally controlled by (the late) Bill Bradford. Now owned by his widow (a nonprofit foundation actually) and edited by Bill's old friend Stephen Cox. Since he never paid anyone for writing, content was mixed and he tended to only run a handful of contributors. Last I looked, still the same.
Bill was a wealthy coin dealer and he paid for the entire thing. Content was pretty libertarian but also insular. It can't compare to Reason or any of the billionaire funded leftist print publications. Still not paying contributors and has remained in its own little world. Alas.
If I were doing Riot Journalism and with cameras, etc. I would recruit a “squad” of beefy big guys who are ex cops, ex military, etc. Even bikers.
The person doing the filming should be surrounded. Maybe female, even better. A woman of color ideally. Otherwise Andy Ngo, etc.
The squad would have various small items like batons or shields (like the antifa), helmets, etc as well as personal always-on radios. Also spotters in loose formation at a distance. The squad can also carry spray paint, wasp spray, kitchen oil spray, etc. to use when the reporter is pushed or attacked.
No common clothing but dressed like rioters. Colored wool hats that you will change periodically to confuse rioter/spotters. The really big guys are holding back but will swoop in when needed.
Of course tactics need to be rehearsed, etc. You can’t cover dangerous thugs alone. Some larping antifa woman won’t be a bother once she is covered in oil and spray paint. If attacked, go for the knees and shoulders hard with clubs, etc. Also carry bullhorn and marine horns in the squad for noise defense.
It is easy to write suggestions. Not sure how many independent journos have the assets for a safe set up. You want to seem invisible but can swarm protectively when needed.
Is getting yelled at while sitting at a restaurant really worse than dying from Covid-19. If having to avoid the Magnificiant mile due to looting the really same of million of people being laid off due to Covid-19. Or is it the small issues are easier to understand than large issues.Replies: @Hibernian, @Ian Smith, @Che Guava, @Kronos, @AnotherDad
No.
You’re confused about what is large and small. The looting so far this summer is less immediately damaging than the Xi virus nonsense. However the virus nonsense is inherently a transient. (Even if we’re dealing with it like the flu, with boosters every year.)
The looting is way, way, way more important, because it signifies that our minoritarian “elites” are willing to blithely toss out the rule-of-law in order to continue the attack on/delegitimization of their one serious potential opponent to their control–i.e. the popular resistance by white men.
Rule-of-law is one of the critical pillars of civilization. It’s one of the key reasons the Anglo-sphere is better, freer, more prosperous than even other places with high IQ populations, much less 3rd world joints where everyone has their hand out and “justice” is inherently political.
That our elites are now openly trashing rule-of-law, the same way they have openly trashed the other critical government function–borders, protection from invasion and population replacement–is a super-important deal. We can’t have civilization if we can’t stop this or destroy these elites.
In contrast, the Xi virus b.s. however painful is a pipsqueak.
The right's refusal to take 190k deaths, 1 million hospitalized individuals, and the disruption of the world economy seriously indicates that the right has no business being in charge of anything let alone the federal government. The Republicans belief that a total of 300k deaths is a pipsqueak issue just shows why Republicans need to change before being elected to high office again.
Also, anyone who claims that President Trump's administration is a good thing for the rule of law probably should not be involved in politics at all. If one is worried abut third world politics, then one has to look no further than the current occupants of the White House.
OT: YouTube just recommended this period piece historical fiction to me. Wow.
Its a pleasant surprise that YouTube didn't remove that fact and all the negative comments.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkIk6-tI-LM
Question: If someone is about to toss a Molotov cocktail, is it legal for cops/civilians to "light them up"? Seems like a deadly weapon.Replies: @Dago Shoes, @Ray Huffman
“Seems like a deadly weapon.”
Seems like a great idea …
There … FIFY …
If so, it's a small world after all.
https://i.postimg.cc/6QT55sKb/d69d0444a192e42c9d2d5c00e039808704a99d5dfc6bc1ea536d7ffa17ad24ab.jpgReplies: @JohnnyWalker123
Thanks for bringing this up. With all the news coming in, I almost forgot about this.
https://www.infowars.com/wikileaks-emails-show-kamala-harris-sister-attended-hillary-clinton-podesta-pizza-party/
Here’s what I don’t understand.
Why is a pizza parlor owner (James Alefantis) such a powerful man in Washington DC? Why do so many powerful people want to hang out with him?
Ron Unz has pointed out that GQ Magazine ranked Alefantis as one of the 50 most powerful people in DC. Was the pizza really that good?
None of this makes sense. There’s something deeply unsettling about this axis of power that includes James Alefantis.
Then there’s Marina Abramovich.
Edsel and Henry would be very sad, I believe.
The privilege does indeed run very deep in that family.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
If so, it would certainly help explain his power in DC society.
“Video” if recorded, “Stream” if live.
https://www.infowars.com/wikileaks-emails-show-kamala-harris-sister-attended-hillary-clinton-podesta-pizza-party/https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/maya-harris-pizza-email.png
Here's what I don't understand.
Why is a pizza parlor owner (James Alefantis) such a powerful man in Washington DC? Why do so many powerful people want to hang out with him?
Ron Unz has pointed out that GQ Magazine ranked Alefantis as one of the 50 most powerful people in DC. Was the pizza really that good?
None of this makes sense. There's something deeply unsettling about this axis of power that includes James Alefantis.
Then there's Marina Abramovich.Replies: @wren, @CorkyAgain
I didn’t know that Kamala’s sister was VP of the Ford Foundation.
Edsel and Henry would be very sad, I believe.
The privilege does indeed run very deep in that family.
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/09/05/20/32818130-8701591-image-a-60_1599334052995.jpg
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/09/05/20/32818134-8701591-image-a-62_1599334053013.jpg
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/09/05/20/32818144-8701591-image-a-68_1599334053127.jpg
Holiday rental. See below.So you can rent the "Jeffrey Epstein Scholarship Lodge."Imagine. You spend $98,000 ($38,000 + 60,0000) to send your daughter to this private school. Nearby, Epstein has his own lodge.So Epstein and Maxwell were on campus, walking around the place.He hosted events for the alumni at his home.So back when a Interlochen female student was a 13 years old, Epstein entrapped her into his prostitution ring.Epstein and Maxwell tried to entice another 13 year-old girl (soap star Nadia Bjorlin) into prostitution. Fortunately, they did not succeed.
Summary: The Interlochen Academy is a prestigious private school in Michigan. It costs around $100,000/yr to attend. Jeffrey Epstein donated a lot of money to the school and had an official "Scholarship Lodge" built near campus. Once a year, Epstein and his "madame" Ghislaine Maxwell visited. They were spotted walking around campus. Epstein and Maxwell enticed a 13 year-old Interlochen student into prostitution. Epstein had Interlochen alumni over to his mansion.Replies: @wren
JimDandy, you couldn’t have been more right!
The multi-color hair brigade on Trump’s side steps up and out and into the light. But there’s something different about it from the Portland crew that I can’t quite put my finger on. Lol.
We need to keep smugly ranting about it on the internet. Maybe the President can even tweet LAW AND ORDER again. The left would have no defense against that.Actually going out there and [redacted] leftists and their enablers DEFINITELY would not work.Replies: @John Gruskos, @Cloudbuster
Boycott Hollywood, academia and the mainstream media.
Vote for right wing 3rd party candidates, or write-in Tucker Carlson.
Take good care of yourself. As a red-pilled White man, you are a rare and precious resource.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkIk6-tI-LM
Question: If someone is about to toss a Molotov cocktail, is it legal for cops/civilians to "light them up"? Seems like a deadly weapon.Replies: @Dago Shoes, @Ray Huffman
In general, if you:
1) Are in a place where you have the legal right to be and
2) Reasonably perceive a threat to your life or a threat that could inflict a crippling injury (like being burned to a crisp) and
3) did nothing illegal to provoke your attackers and
4) have no safe avenue of retreat
Then absolutely, yes, you can use lethal force. Some states make the requirements less stringent, for example not requiring you to take a safe avenue of retreat which may be available to you (stand-your-ground law) but generally, those four requirements, if met, will give you the right to use lethal force in any state, or, indeed in any legal jurisdiction on earth.
I noticed that the video had 4.5k thumbs up and 12k thumbs down.
Its a pleasant surprise that YouTube didn’t remove that fact and all the negative comments.
http://www.libertyunbound.com/Replies: @Muggles
Yes, the now online Liberty magazine website (now offline since June it appears, they said for a revamp.)
Funny you should ask. I was an original assoc. editor of Liberty in the late 80s when it came out in print. Publisher/editor Bill Bradford later kicked me out for a minor disagreement. It has been online only since the early 2000s. I have a complete print set that I’d like to host online (I have a website for that) but haven’t been able to hear back from them.
The problem with this publication/website is that it was always amateur and totally controlled by (the late) Bill Bradford. Now owned by his widow (a nonprofit foundation actually) and edited by Bill’s old friend Stephen Cox. Since he never paid anyone for writing, content was mixed and he tended to only run a handful of contributors. Last I looked, still the same.
Bill was a wealthy coin dealer and he paid for the entire thing. Content was pretty libertarian but also insular. It can’t compare to Reason or any of the billionaire funded leftist print publications. Still not paying contributors and has remained in its own little world. Alas.
Edsel and Henry would be very sad, I believe.
The privilege does indeed run very deep in that family.Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
Holiday rental. See below.
So you can rent the “Jeffrey Epstein Scholarship Lodge.”
Imagine. You spend $98,000 ($38,000 + 60,0000) to send your daughter to this private school. Nearby, Epstein has his own lodge.
So Epstein and Maxwell were on campus, walking around the place.
He hosted events for the alumni at his home.
So back when a Interlochen female student was a 13 years old, Epstein entrapped her into his prostitution ring.
Epstein and Maxwell tried to entice another 13 year-old girl (soap star Nadia Bjorlin) into prostitution. Fortunately, they did not succeed.
Summary: The Interlochen Academy is a prestigious private school in Michigan. It costs around $100,000/yr to attend. Jeffrey Epstein donated a lot of money to the school and had an official “Scholarship Lodge” built near campus. Once a year, Epstein and his “madame” Ghislaine Maxwell visited. They were spotted walking around campus. Epstein and Maxwell enticed a 13 year-old Interlochen student into prostitution. Epstein had Interlochen alumni over to his mansion.
I have been hearing A LOT about the 400,000 children who go missing in the US, every year. The percent that are runaways and the number actually abducted by strangers is very often the topic of conversation in the wren household.
You can use the "more" tag to put things below the fold.
Rose Mcgowan discusses how Trump helps people show who they are.
https://youtu.be/fnYV_LqZhoo
https://www.infowars.com/wikileaks-emails-show-kamala-harris-sister-attended-hillary-clinton-podesta-pizza-party/https://dailystormer.su/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/maya-harris-pizza-email.png
Here's what I don't understand.
Why is a pizza parlor owner (James Alefantis) such a powerful man in Washington DC? Why do so many powerful people want to hang out with him?
Ron Unz has pointed out that GQ Magazine ranked Alefantis as one of the 50 most powerful people in DC. Was the pizza really that good?
None of this makes sense. There's something deeply unsettling about this axis of power that includes James Alefantis.
Then there's Marina Abramovich.Replies: @wren, @CorkyAgain
I don’t know if there’s any truth to it, but some people have claimed that Alefantis is related to the Rothschilds.
If so, it would certainly help explain his power in DC society.
“The death toll is highly inflated because it deliberately ignores comorbidities.”
No, when calculating the excess death toll (which isn’t affected by cause-of-death mislabelling) the death toll is actually even higher, though ballpark, the numbers are more or less in line, either way. Yeah, we’ve all heard about the motorcycle death attributed to COVID. But when you factor in the less publicized pneumonia deaths that never got a COVID test, it turns out mistakes like the latter are even more numerous.
The canard that used to get floated about how “it’s really the lockdowns causing all the deaths” — promulgated by moronic posts like this one — lost its lustre once the lockdowns were eased and the death toll started increasing (whereupon the very same nitwits who helped promulgate that canard came back around and tried to have it both ways).
I know that won’t convince the true believers. Like the liberals who don’t care about SAT scores, and IQ, numbers and data will never dissuade them from what they really, really cross-their-hearts-and-pixie-dust want to be true (especially when so many mean and nasty people are on the other side). Alas, the lockdown that supposedly causes an overall surge of deaths when it is applied, and then another hump of excess death after it is eased is about as believable as the magic/tragic dirt that suffices to explain how black people get left behind. It’s about as believable as grandpa’s fabled walks to school in the bitter rain and snow back when he was a young ‘un, that went uphill both ways.
It probably depends on who was doing the blocking.
And don’t forget how the anti-war protests featured plenty of hammer & sickle flags that somehow never made onto a TV screen.
Virginia Postrel was awful.
The canard that used to get floated about how "it's really the lockdowns causing all the deaths" -- promulgated by moronic posts like this one -- lost its lustre once the lockdowns were eased and the death toll started increasing (whereupon the very same nitwits who helped promulgate that canard came back around and tried to have it both ways).I know that won't convince the true believers. Like the liberals who don't care about SAT scores, and IQ, numbers and data will never dissuade them from what they really, really cross-their-hearts-and-pixie-dust want to be true (especially when so many mean and nasty people are on the other side). Alas, the lockdown that supposedly causes an overall surge of deaths when it is applied, and then another hump of excess death after it is eased is about as believable as the magic/tragic dirt that suffices to explain how black people get left behind. It's about as believable as grandpa's fabled walks to school in the bitter rain and snow back when he was a young 'un, that went uphill both ways.Replies: @Hibernian
Which you assume were all caused by COVID.
She’s committing the crime of conspiracy.
“Which you assume were all caused by COVID.”
No, that’s the point. The deaths that were falsely attributed to COVID when they shouldn’t have been (e.g. the one from the motorcycle accident) are LESS numerous than the ones that should have been classified as COVID but were classified solely as bacterial pneumonia or organ failure or something else because they didn’t even have COVID tests at the time or else the test they applied gave a false negative, or some other reason. Despite what you may have heard, not every municipality everywhere is assuming every single death in every nursing home or ER has been due to COVID. (In fact, I’m pretty sure none of them are doing it that way.)
Again, the rationale for claiming there’s an undercount is based on the fact that the excess-mortality calculation (which isn’t affected by creative cause-of-death mislabelling) gives us a slightly higher number.
If something this basic this is already hard to follow, or needs to be spelled out yet again, it is probably not the topic for you to get disputatious about.
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/09/05/20/32818130-8701591-image-a-60_1599334052995.jpg
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/09/05/20/32818134-8701591-image-a-62_1599334053013.jpg
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/09/05/20/32818144-8701591-image-a-68_1599334053127.jpg
Holiday rental. See below.So you can rent the "Jeffrey Epstein Scholarship Lodge."Imagine. You spend $98,000 ($38,000 + 60,0000) to send your daughter to this private school. Nearby, Epstein has his own lodge.So Epstein and Maxwell were on campus, walking around the place.He hosted events for the alumni at his home.So back when a Interlochen female student was a 13 years old, Epstein entrapped her into his prostitution ring.Epstein and Maxwell tried to entice another 13 year-old girl (soap star Nadia Bjorlin) into prostitution. Fortunately, they did not succeed.
Summary: The Interlochen Academy is a prestigious private school in Michigan. It costs around $100,000/yr to attend. Jeffrey Epstein donated a lot of money to the school and had an official "Scholarship Lodge" built near campus. Once a year, Epstein and his "madame" Ghislaine Maxwell visited. They were spotted walking around campus. Epstein and Maxwell enticed a 13 year-old Interlochen student into prostitution. Epstein had Interlochen alumni over to his mansion.Replies: @wren
Yes, I have a family member who is very up to date on the latest child trafficking news, so I am always hearing about it, whether I ask or not. We also have family friends whose children both went to Interlochen summer programs at the same time Epstein was doing his thing there, but we never heard anything sinister about it. I suppose they were lucky.
I have been hearing A LOT about the 400,000 children who go missing in the US, every year. The percent that are runaways and the number actually abducted by strangers is very often the topic of conversation in the wren household.
You can use the “more” tag to put things below the fold.
Rose Mcgowan discusses how Trump helps people show who they are.
It will be Tweeted.Replies: @Cato
Maybe. But pray God that sanity will be restored and that there will be no revolution.
eh? Wyatt a male? And why so much obesity in this group?
https://i.postimg.cc/bwGqn8CX/Eh-N2-S09-U8-AAe-Gpn.jpgReplies: @Cato
At the very least you have to be using an estimate of the percentage of the non-COVID tested people who died of pnuemonia whose pneumonia resulted from COVID. Maybe you might like to give that estimate and the basis for it.
Sure it will...by the revolutionaries. And only by them.Replies: @Svigor
Counter-revolutionaries. Antifa, BLM…these are counter-revolutionary forces. They work for the (((regime))). Which is obvious from how they’ve been indulged and patronized and coddled and supported and enabled for five months and more.
These people don’t want to overthrow anything, except figments of their imagination (delusion is great for LARPing); they believe exactly what the ADL and WaPo and NYT and academe and the board of McDonald’s believe.
Their job is suppressing and terrorizing the White population.
https://youtu.be/NnzPEyTpByUReplies: @Svigor
Is there anything gayer than the GOP of 2020?
“At the very least you have to be using an estimate of the percentage of the non-COVID tested people who died of pnuemonia whose pneumonia resulted from COVID.”
No, in doing the excess-mortality calculation, all you have to count is the number of people who died in a given month. The causes of their death is not included. The number of dead is then subtracted from the expected number of deaths for that month and municipality before being added up, but those expected averages are all calculated using data for years when there was no COVID. As it turns out, that excess-mortality estimate of X is a number slightly larger than the count of the number of people who died with “COVID” stamped on their pathologist’s or coroner’s report. You can check the official figures for the latest value of both estimates of X — my link is a few months old. Yes, the latter estimate of X contains both people that shouldn’t be in the count, but it also misses other people that should be, and as a result seems to be an undercount (though ballpark, it’s pretty close).
Really, at this point, I shouldn’t have to be explaining any of this, if you’ve been paying attention, and if you haven’t, then why are you even arguing over this?
I don’t know why so many corona-truthers seem to have suddenly forgotten about excess mortality. It resulted in flood of comment ink back when this hapless “expert” was clamoring with pages and pages of comments about how the excess mortality graphs showed that there is “no sudden skyrocketing of total mortality rates even among the most-at-risk-cohort,…which corroborates the skeptics’ view”. I.e., it was just the flu, bro. Unfortunately for him, just a few weeks later (i.e. just about the average time it takes to die of COVID after getting infected) we started seeing the alarming spikes in those excess mortality graphs, one of which I linked to in my earlier comment. Now, that same expert is no longer posting much on these pages, for some completely unrelated reasons, I’m sure. And people like you seem to need repeated reminding of what excess mortality graphs are about despite what a hot-button topic it was back when it was touted as clear evidence that the experts were all lying to us. It’s weird how that works.
To my eye, Casey is the antifa mug of the evening:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qyau1FeeVuc
Some of these people are so ridiculously stupid. The guy is like, oh my legs are on fire? Awesome, lets start can can dancing this will look amazing. Apparently he thought an extremely energetic goose step would blow the flames out.
It would have looked way more impressive if he did a Russian dance instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vfx0OcammHUReplies: @sayless
That reaction was physiological. His mind was sidelined.
The arguments you made weren’t limited to excess mortality analysis, and I countered one of them. Now you’re focusing on excess mortality. How is the expected mortality rate derived? Who calculates it? Is it at least partially based on last year’s mortality rate at the same time of year? If there are other factors, what are they? I notice you haven’t provided any graphs or statistics of your own. Also you employ straw man argumentation, putting the statements of some not very bright people ( “it was just the flu, bro.”) into the mouths of all skeptics.
We need to keep smugly ranting about it on the internet. Maybe the President can even tweet LAW AND ORDER again. The left would have no defense against that.Actually going out there and [redacted] leftists and their enablers DEFINITELY would not work.Replies: @John Gruskos, @Cloudbuster
Actually going out there and [redacted] leftists and their enablers DEFINITELY would not work.
No, it definitely would not work. The riots are a trap. It is exactly where they want you fighting them. The real enemies are the rich donors and organizers and government officials with titles like mayor, governor and district attorney, not the people in the street.
Indeed the riots are a trap, and Antifa is a much more organized force than most people understand. This pic is literally worth 1,000 words.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EhLtqP7UYAAcPtV.jpg
The cancellation of the SWSX festival was not due to any politician. The layoffs in the airline industry is not due to Democratic governors. The refusal of many countries to not let Americans come to the country is not due to the MSM in the U.S.
Once again , the Republicans refusal to deal with Covid-19 is why the Republicans are going to lose seats in the Senate, in the House, and in state and local races. Too many people have decided that the Republicans are idiots that cannot deal with a problem when it is right in front of them.
Image if President Trump had the approval rating of Mike Dewine. President Trump would be coasting to re-election instead of having to scare everyone about riots and brown people.
If not, I have grave doubts as to your sanity.Replies: @guest007
HOw is it sane to believe that Covid-19 is massively overated but our civilization depends upon cracking the heads of Antifa in Portland?
What is insane is pursing a political positions that is supported by a well less than 50% of Americans and believing that one will win in a rout.
The looting is way, way, way more important, because it signifies that our minoritarian "elites" are willing to blithely toss out the rule-of-law in order to continue the attack on/delegitimization of their one serious potential opponent to their control--i.e. the popular resistance by white men.
Rule-of-law is one of the critical pillars of civilization. It's one of the key reasons the Anglo-sphere is better, freer, more prosperous than even other places with high IQ populations, much less 3rd world joints where everyone has their hand out and "justice" is inherently political.
That our elites are now openly trashing rule-of-law, the same way they have openly trashed the other critical government function--borders, protection from invasion and population replacement--is a super-important deal. We can't have civilization if we can't stop this or destroy these elites.
In contrast, the Xi virus b.s. however painful is a pipsqueak.Replies: @guest007
Along with the rule of law is public health. The 20th century had many public health victories, extended the life expectancy of those in the west, and made life much easier for much of the population.
The right’s refusal to take 190k deaths, 1 million hospitalized individuals, and the disruption of the world economy seriously indicates that the right has no business being in charge of anything let alone the federal government. The Republicans belief that a total of 300k deaths is a pipsqueak issue just shows why Republicans need to change before being elected to high office again.
Also, anyone who claims that President Trump’s administration is a good thing for the rule of law probably should not be involved in politics at all. If one is worried abut third world politics, then one has to look no further than the current occupants of the White House.
He also appears to be allocating the entire increment of excess mortality to COVID, without support for the generous allocation.
“The arguments you made weren’t limited to excess mortality analysis, and I countered one of them.
By pointing out something that isn’t even relevant. If I’m counting birds, and you ask me if I’ve corrected for the number that have a wing missing, your “counter” is a groundless non sequitur, as it is in this case. In neither of the methods discussed, be it A) excess mortality, or B) count of those whose official cause of death was COVID, do we rely on “estimates of non-COVID tested people who died of pneumonia.” We know it must have affected the number obtained via method B, along with other overcounts and undercounts, but it’s not used in either method, and would be completely worthless in and of itself (i.e. without a detailed list of all the other overcounts and undercounts).
“Now you’re focusing on excess mortality.”
I brought up excess mortality (and as I noted, it was the corona-truthers who initially chose to make hay of that) specifically because its calculation isn’t affected by mislabeling the cause of death. That’s why it’s an effective counter to bogus claims like yours about how mislabeling is causing the reported death toll count to be inflated (when in fact it seems that overall, mislabeling actually resulted in an undercount). The fact that the excess-mortality figures give a death toll that is more or less consistent with the one obtained simply by counting the number of dead whose official cause of death is listed as COVID indicates that the mislabeling errors (which, again, produce both overcounts and undercounts) cancel out more or less (but overall, the cumulative error results in an undercount). Why is that so hard for you to understand? And given that it is, why are you arguing over it? Can’t you stick with Irish history or some topic you’ve actually taken the effort to research?
“How is the expected mortality rate derived? Who calculates it?”
A simple internet search would answer your question, but you seem to be too lazy to bother to do your own research, which says a lot. Regardless, as a gesture of goodwill, you can consult the thread here, which isn’t very old. To recap what was said there, the two flagship models for excess mortality (used in both the US and UK) are a quasi-Poisson-regression method developed by Paddy Farrington and subsequently improved by others, and also the EARS method. If you search for “Farrington flexible” you can download the code yourself and give it a go. I’m less sure about what goes into EARS, but Farrington flexible was used for the paper in that earlier thread. You can also check the link in my previous message when excess mortality figures were introduced into iSteve by that blogger who initially regarded it as a perfect gotcha argument showing us all that COVID was a nothingburger. (As noted subsequently, it didn’t turn out well for him, but that guy has a real talent for putting his foot right where his mouth is about to wind up).
Again, if you were paying attention, you wouldn’t need me to tell you any of this, and if you aren’t paying attention, you really need to find another topic to argue about.
The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will reduce the deaths due to COVID-19. It is dishonest to pretend otherwise. We could bring them to zero by draconian measures no one would accept (even hypocritical interlocutors - mostly Democrats but also Mitt Romney).
The argument is that the costs of lockdowns are greater than the benefits. And that calculation requires a tally of costs and benefits on both sides of the ledger. You want to count the opportunity costs that subtract from lockdowns as if they were additions to the lockdown argument. Nice try, but even a cursory review would not support your position.
The excess deaths, even if none were due to COVID-19, would all count as COVID-19 under your superficial analysis. Your argument is a non-starter. My question for you is why are you pretending that you have identified a productive prescription when you have as your main point such an obvious error?Replies: @HA, @HA
No, it definitely would not work. The riots are a trap. It is exactly where they want you fighting them. The real enemies are the rich donors and organizers and government officials with titles like mayor, governor and district attorney, not the people in the street.Replies: @anon
The riots are a trap. It is exactly where they want you fighting them.
Indeed the riots are a trap, and Antifa is a much more organized force than most people understand. This pic is literally worth 1,000 words.
https://i.postimg.cc/bwGqn8CX/Eh-N2-S09-U8-AAe-Gpn.jpgReplies: @Cato
He’s hurting. We all will be safer if he remembers his hurt. One might just hope that it is an especially salient hurt.
“He also appears to be allocating the entire increment of excess mortality to COVID, without support for the generous allocation.”
Ah yes, and here we go again with another round of “the extra deaths are mostly due to lockdowns!”. But I’ve already addressed that.
Yes, it is true that there are excess suicides and delays in cancer treatment, etc., that are also killing people, but no sane person at this point believes that the lockdowns are killing more than they are saving. And the reason we believe they’re saving more than they’re killing is because when the lockdowns are eased, death rates INCREASE. You can’t have it both ways — these magic/tragic lockdowns that the truthers invoke in their whack-a-mole games of shifting the argument around every time they get cornered are a fiction. If they supposedly cause a (net) increase in death rates when they’re applied, and then another (net) increase in death rates when they’re lifted, then you need to get your arguments straight, because they’re about as believable as old grandpa’s barefoot walks to and from school that went uphill both ways.
So yeah, there’s definitely excess deaths due to the lockdowns, but given the deaths that the lockdowns are holding back, they’re not going to help your case.
I never said anything about lockdowns. I want to know how you calculate excess mortality. Mortality has a variety of causes, any one of which may contribute to the excess. You have not demonstrated the validity of the assumption that all of the excess is caused by COVID-19.
“I want to know how you calculate excess”
Well, then do some research. Are you really that helpless? Check the “Farrington flexible” thread I linked to in the previous comment (though actually, you’ll have to click on the comment that I was replying to, not the comment itself, in order to get a link to the CDC methodology). As noted, you can download the Farrington model yourself, if you’re so inclined.
You could also — and I know this is going to blow your mind given that I apparently have to explain it to you — simply type the words “how is excess mortality calculated” into a search engine. Again, just do your own research. Just to get you started, here’s the top link I found when I did that.
“You have not demonstrated the validity of the assumption that all of the excess is caused by COVID-19.”
If this spikes in question are as obvious and steep as this and if the increases just happen to be roughly in line with the number of COVID stamps appearing on cause-of-death certifications, then trying to pretend that there’s some other 5oo-pound-gorilla who might have also just come out of nowhere at the very same time that the COVID gorilla did and that it’s this other one who might also be responsible for that missing bunch of bananas is just arguing in bad faith.
I mean, really, who do you think you’re kidding?
Wow! What an amazing exhibition of prestidigitation! You are counting the opportunity costs as if they were in the choice made. That’s a great trick, isn’t it? The same people that would not be dying from suicide, domestic violence, unperformed surgery, and despair without the lockdown all count as COVID-19 deaths under your analysis.
The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will reduce the deaths due to COVID-19. It is dishonest to pretend otherwise. We could bring them to zero by draconian measures no one would accept (even hypocritical interlocutors – mostly Democrats but also Mitt Romney).
The argument is that the costs of lockdowns are greater than the benefits. And that calculation requires a tally of costs and benefits on both sides of the ledger. You want to count the opportunity costs that subtract from lockdowns as if they were additions to the lockdown argument. Nice try, but even a cursory review would not support your position.
The excess deaths, even if none were due to COVID-19, would all count as COVID-19 under your superficial analysis. Your argument is a non-starter. My question for you is why are you pretending that you have identified a productive prescription when you have as your main point such an obvious error?
"The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will reduce the deaths due to COVID-19...even a cursory review would not support your position."You go ahead and repeat a stupid statement like that however times you want. It won't make it less stupid. Again, see the previous paragraph. (And while you're at it, try typing "what is the purpose of lockdowns" into any search engine. That's a pretty cursory review, and I'm seeing plenty of support for my position. If it doesn't work for you, you have a lame search engine.)
The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will reduce the deaths due to COVID-19. It is dishonest to pretend otherwise. We could bring them to zero by draconian measures no one would accept (even hypocritical interlocutors - mostly Democrats but also Mitt Romney).
The argument is that the costs of lockdowns are greater than the benefits. And that calculation requires a tally of costs and benefits on both sides of the ledger. You want to count the opportunity costs that subtract from lockdowns as if they were additions to the lockdown argument. Nice try, but even a cursory review would not support your position.
The excess deaths, even if none were due to COVID-19, would all count as COVID-19 under your superficial analysis. Your argument is a non-starter. My question for you is why are you pretending that you have identified a productive prescription when you have as your main point such an obvious error?Replies: @HA, @HA
“The same people that would not be dying from suicide, domestic violence, unperformed surgery, and despair without the lockdown all count as COVID-19 deaths under your analysis.”
Wait, people that would NOT BE DYING are being classified as covid DEATHS? I don’t get where you’re going with that at all. I’m simply saying that something is causing all those steep sudden spikes in excess mortality I linked to earlier, that happen to be occurring — man, what are the odds? — right about the time that a novel virus is reported to be migrating out from China. That being the case, I’m going to suggest that the two likeliest candidates that seem to come up are 1) coronavirus and 2) lockdowns and responses to the coronavirus. If you’ve got something else in mind, that’s on you. Run the numbers and get them published somewhere, and we’ll talk again. For now, I’m sticking with those two.
Now, if it were the lockdowns that were causing those spikes, then easing them should cause deaths to go down to normal. That’s generally how it works. But that didn’t happen. In fact, deaths rates went up in numerous areas where lockdowns were eased, even though it was summertime when viruses generally slack off, and even though (according to many truthers) we were nearly at herd immunity, etc. Therefore, I’m left with 1). It’s as simple as that. Sure, the lockdowns are killing some (suicides, etc.) and saving others (delayed elective surgery, etc.). Overall, for reasons just mentioned, I’m going to say they’re reducing the death toll, overall, and therefore they aren’t the cause of those massive spikes in mortality.
“The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will reduce the deaths due to COVID-19…even a cursory review would not support your position.”
You go ahead and repeat a stupid statement like that however times you want. It won’t make it less stupid. Again, see the previous paragraph. (And while you’re at it, try typing “what is the purpose of lockdowns” into any search engine. That’s a pretty cursory review, and I’m seeing plenty of support for my position. If it doesn’t work for you, you have a lame search engine.)
The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will reduce the deaths due to COVID-19. It is dishonest to pretend otherwise. We could bring them to zero by draconian measures no one would accept (even hypocritical interlocutors - mostly Democrats but also Mitt Romney).
The argument is that the costs of lockdowns are greater than the benefits. And that calculation requires a tally of costs and benefits on both sides of the ledger. You want to count the opportunity costs that subtract from lockdowns as if they were additions to the lockdown argument. Nice try, but even a cursory review would not support your position.
The excess deaths, even if none were due to COVID-19, would all count as COVID-19 under your superficial analysis. Your argument is a non-starter. My question for you is why are you pretending that you have identified a productive prescription when you have as your main point such an obvious error?Replies: @HA, @HA
“The argument against lockdowns has never been that it will [NOT] reduce the deaths due to COVID-19…”
I just realized that the reason the original version of the above statement seemed so ludicrous was that it probably contained a typo, and what you probably mean to say was the corrected version above.
While less absurd, the typo-corrected version is still wrong. In fact, there were numerous arguments that lockdowns were indeed causing more deaths than they were saving — see for example the one here. Many truthers genuinely believed that apart from a small, just-the-flu-bro contribution caused by coronavirus itself, the bulk of the death toll was due to either mislabeling or the lockdowns (or to people that were so near death’s door, that their deaths in February or March would be balanced out by a REDUCTION of deaths in the following months given that those deaths had occurred a bit earlier — that reduction didn’t happen either, at least not so far).
And when the lockdowns were eased in places like Florida, there were numerous voices saying this was over and done with and if everyone else would follow suit, all would be well and we could get back to normal. Of course, as time went on, and it was clear they were wrong, those voices dwindled, but pretending that they were never there will not work for anyone paying attention.