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Guardian: "Many People – Even Many Queer People – Have Internalized the Idea That Contracting Sexually Transmitted Infections Is Bad"
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From The Guardian:

‘Is sex worth the risk?’ Monkeypox just the latest virus to threaten gay intimacy

It’s as if there might be some kind of a pattern.

‘Many people – even many queer people – have internalized the idea that contracting STIs is bad, shameful, and should be hidden.’

Decades after the Aids pandemic began, game-changing drugs restored some peace of mind. Now monkeypox puts that progress at risk

Steven W Thrasher

Steven W Thrasher, PhD, a former Guardian writer-at-large, is the author of The Viral Underclass: The Human Toll When Inequality and Disease Collide and a professor at Northwestern University
@thrasherxy
Wed 3 Aug 2022 01.00 EDT

Last week, I went to my doctor’s office for a long-scheduled sexually transmitted infection checkup, and started to cry a few minutes into my appointment.

Like many gay men, I am on a daily drug called pre-exposure prophylaxis, or PrEP, which prevents me from becoming infected by HIV, even if I were to have sex without a condom or use injection drugs. At 44 years old, I am of the generation who knew about Aids before we even knew about sex; from childhood, I conflated sexuality and fear. PrEP was a gamechanger in taking that fear away.

But last week, HIV was not much on my mind, and almost as soon as the physician’s assistant closed the door, I burst into tears.

… I was terrified that some skin bumps could be monkeypox.

Because he was so nice, I blabbered on that I would never tell anyone else to feel bad if they contracted any infection. But my book was coming out the following week, and it was about viruses, and what if I had to cancel my launch because I had contracted a virus?

… He also kindly, but very firmly, told me not to feel bad about feeling bad.

“We are all on the edge,” he said – him, me, every gay man we both knew. “It’s been a lot, for all of us.”

… And I realized how angry I was that, for the third time in my life, a viral pandemic was dictating my sex life, shaping my professional life, messing with my head, and keeping me from experiencing intimacy.

I am, of course, not alone in this. HIV, Sars-CoV-2 and now hMPXV – the virus responsible for monkeypox in humans – have all upended people’s lives, but their effects have not been felt equally. In all three cases, LGBTQ+ people were disproportionately affected.

This is the result of a few related factors, all of them closely linked to societal stigma. One is that LGBTQ+ people are, on average, more likely to be poor than straight people and thus more likely to be subjected to the confluence of conditions (incarceration, unemployment, a lack of insurance) that produce a viral underclass. Second, queer people do not get a good sexual health education, nor access to queer-specific health resources. And third, gay men have, on average, more sexual partners than straight people. Even when coupled, gay men are more likely to be openly non-monogamous.

This is nothing to be ashamed of; being trans or gay is good, and queer sex is good. But many people – even many queer people – have internalized the idea that contracting (or even talking about) STIs is bad, shameful and should be hidden.

… For the same reasons, the emerging monkeypox epidemic should be talked about as an STI, particularly in light of new research from the current London outbreak and scandalously overlooked research into the 2017 outbreak in Nigeria that suggests monkeypox may have mutated to allow for transmission through genital secretion. This does not mean that hMPXV can only be transmitted sexually, but it acknowledges that gay sex is a major way such pathogens move.

Shame should not be a factor in these discussions. “Viruses are not conscious,” said Pedro Serrano, a public health researcher. “They simply follow the mechanistic drive to replicate.”

Viruses may not be conscious, but those who choose to punish us for contracting them certainly are.

… After the Stonewall Riots of 1969, there was a brief window of time when queer men could have a lot of sex with relatively little worry.

But then, in the early 1980s, reports trickled in that young gay men were becoming marked by purple lesions and falling ill to an extremely rare form of cancer that usually only affected older men near the Mediterranean Sea. The era of Aids was upon us.

… The [monkeypox] outbreak is threatening all the progress that was made toward freeing gay men to have sex without fear.

… Shame is heaped upon gay men … When a virus like monkeypox moves in a way that can out us, the answer is not to shrink, or to hide, or to be embarrassed about the kind of sex we have.

Rather, these times demand that we refuse to be relegated to a viral underclass – and compel us to destroy the conditions that created such an underclass in the first place.

Other Steven W. Thrasher, Ph.D., classics:

Guardian: “Boyhood” Is Racist, Racist, Racist

…Being a queer person myself, when Mason wears nail polish to openly challenge the concepts of masculinity around him, I was totally cheering for him. But I was annoyed, in retrospect, to find myself so emotionally invested in the success of an average white boy as he headed off towards his manhood by the end of the film.

The gay critic is peeved that the movie got his hopes up about the dreamy adolescent boy, only to bring them down with a crash when the kid gets a girlfriend.

A Hero for Our Times

Mr. Johnson’s legal troubles began in 2013, when he was arrested after a white man he had had consensual sex with told the police he believed that Mr. Johnson had given him the virus.

It’s like if Emmett Till were gay and his accuser followed the letter of the law.

Five other men, three of them white, would later testify that Mr. Johnson had not only failed to disclose his H.I.V. status before engaging in consensual sex, but had willfully lied about it.

Four out of the six accusers were white.

Case dismissed!

 
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  1. I’m black and I’m gay, my name Heywood.
    Listen up, I got somethin’ to say good:
    Keep teabaggin’ like Tetley!
    Monkeypops isn’t detley!
    Wear the bumps as a badge of your gayhood!

  2. PaceLaw says:

    “Many people – even many queer people – have internalized the idea that contracting STIs is bad, shameful, and should be hidden.’”

    The rhetoric from dimwitted PhD‘s like Thrasher is simply mind-boggling. Why of course contracting an STI such as Monkeypox is bad, shameful and needs to be hidden because it is deviant and disgusting. Clearly, for people like Thrasher, basic human morals and honor have long exited the building. As was stated in Judges 21:25: “In those days Israel had no king; all the people did whatever seemed right in their own eyes.”

  3. OT: Chetty-like analysis of personality data

    https://bigthink.com/strange-maps/geopsychology-regional-personality-variation/

    Geopsychology: Your personality depends on where you live

    The scholarly article is behind a pay barrier. It is not clear if the authors controlled for race.

    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1745691621998326

    • Replies: @James N. Kennett
  4. Daniel H says:

    And third, gay men have, on average, more sexual partners than straight people. Even when coupled, gay men are more likely to be openly non-monogamous.

    Of course, but we all have to pretend otherwise.

  5. Under ideal conditions, Covid can survive 3 days on non porous surfaces. The CDC has said, that Monkeypox has been found in a patient’s home that had been unoccupied for 15 days and can survive weeks in water, soil and food. MP can also survive months to years under scabs.

    But no, we can’t quarantine these homosexuals who are spreading the disease.

    On the plus side, it needs broken skin or a mucous membrane to infect you. So wash your hands before you touch your eyes, nose or mouth or go to the bathroom.

    Note, I am not a doctor and none of this is medical advice.

    • Replies: @Kaz
    , @Reactive Reaction
  6. ‘Many people – even many queer people – have internalized the idea that contracting STIs is bad, shameful, and should be hidden.’

    Um, contracting STIs is bad. For your health, but I’ve never heard anyone in the mainstream population say they should be hidden. That seems to be what homosexual people advocate. Homosexual people got really upset when the mainstream population explicitly told them they shouldn’t hide their disease, but on the contrary, disclose and inform sexual partners and other people who might be at risk. Hiding them is bad, because infecting other people with your diseases is bad. Now we’re back to the bad old days in many places where AIDs infection is no longer required to be disclosed — apparently, in the homosexual community, hiding your disease until it is too late is good. Don’t hang that on us normies.

    • Replies: @Sick n' Tired
  7. Gay men are wealthier, on average, than straight men. They are also more likely to have a college degree.
    It isn’t poverty that is plaguing them, it’s a series of bad choices. And if you expect others to pay for your bad choices (such as subsidized drugs like PREP), then maybe you should feel bad about catching an STI.

  8. I am, of course, not alone in this. HIV, Sars-CoV-2 and now hMPXV – the virus responsible for monkeypox in humans – have all upended people’s lives, but their effects have not been felt equally. In all three cases, LGBTQ+ people were disproportionately affected.

    This is the result of a few related factors, all of them closely linked to societal stigma. One is that LGBTQ+ people are, on average, more likely to be poor than straight people and thus more likely to be subjected to the confluence of conditions (incarceration, unemployment, a lack of insurance) that produce a viral underclass.

    Um, I don’t have the statistics in front of me but I distinctly remember a breakdown showing that homosexuals are, on average, more affluent than average.

    Ah, here’s one:

    Gay Couples More Educated, Higher-Income Than Heterosexual Couples

    So point 1 is inaccurate,or at least, contestable.

    Second, queer people do not get a good sexual health education, nor access to queer-specific health resources.M

    Right. Everyone here remembers in school when we had the health and sex ed classes how all the homosexual kids would be shuffled away to a different room and prevented from doing anything except read fashion magazines while all us straights learned the secrets of sexual health. And we all know how when you go to buy a book, visit a website or register for a class on sexual health — even “queer” sexual health how they ask if you are homosexual and then if you say yes they refuse to share the secret wisdom with you.

    I have a feeling that if they did get honest “queer-specific health resources” they wouldn’t like what they were told: “Buttsex is really bad for you. Don’t do it. You will get diseases, and possibly do irreparable damage to your colon and rectum.”

    And third, gay men have, on average, more sexual partners than straight people. Even when coupled, gay men are more likely to be openly non-monogamous.

    So, your behavior has consequences. And whose fault is that? And telling you to modify your behavior to avoid the bad consequences is … bad?

  9. martin_2 says:

    In 1993 my then wife was diagnosed with an incurable heart condition with a very poor prognosis. I went to my local library, – Islington Central Library in the Borough of Islington, London, a big library – to learn what I could about her illness. In the said library there were over fifty, OVER FIFTY, books on AIDS, and there were two books on heart disease. I swear this is true, I counted them. Yet AIDS sufferers were “marginalised” and “oppressed”.

    (For the record, it turned out that she had been completely misdiagnosed and after open heart surgery made a complete recovery!)

    • Replies: @TyRade
    , @Paleo Liberal
  10. Ben Kurtz says:

    This guy’s a riot.

    He starts by channelling a fire-n-brimestone Christian preacher, spelling out all the obvious reasons the modern fast-lane gay lifestyle should shock and disgust any normal person (the rampant infidelity! the recurring infections with new and exciting venereal diseases! the narcissistic and overly emotional self-centeredness!)… But then at the last second his mind veers and he slaps on the incongruous conclusion of “no, no, it’s the lifestyle that’s good and any negative attitudes towards are are what’s bad. Really! Because Science!!!”

    The conclusions bear no logical relationship to the facts and premises that he recites.

    A lifestyle that, *every single time,* leads to mass disease and sterility and degeneracy simply *is* shocking and disgusting to normal people. To understand why just ask Darwin. All the Guardian articles in the world won’t change that.

    And from the shrill tone of the piece, I think the author knows that too.

  11. Russ says:

    Gee. It’s almost as if chastity/celibacy is the best option for the same-sex attracted.

  12. @James N. Kennett

    This is a preprint of an earlier version (2019) of the same work.

    https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/244350/1/1690198702.pdf

    The maps for the USA look the same as those scraped from the scholarly publication for the bigthink article, although using a different color scheme. The only mention of “race” is:

    Table 2 reports the correlations between the personality and PESH indicators for counties, CBSAs, and states when partialling out gender, median age, income, race, and urbanity.

    i.e. the author attempted to correlate known variables in his Table 2 (such as education and voting preferences) with regional personality scores. The “partialling out” appears to be an acknowledgement both that regional differences in gender, median age, income, race, and urbanity are important variables that influence local personality scores, and also that the data in the maps is not corrected for these.

    And of course people who live in urban areas are urbane.

  13. “I am, of course, not alone in this. HIV, Sars-CoV-2 and now hMPXV”

    You mean, monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox monkeypox?

    • Replies: @Joe Stalin
  14. He might be a PhD and always conflated sex with fear but he ain’t so smart. He has to take a drug to protect himself from a disease which is a result of his aberrant sexual behavior. Shame is not always a bad thing. It can often be quite instructive.

    • Agree: AceDeuce
    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
  15. notsaying says:

    I feel stigmatized by monkeypox.

    I am one of the anonymous, countless straight millions that all these monkeypox articles end up blaming for what is going on.

    I don’t believe straight people are at fault for gay guys getting monkeypox. Blah blah blah stigma, blah blah blah not our fault, the gays say. But guess what? Blah blah blah, not my fault either.

    If these guys cannot stop from having sex with a lot of strangers and cannot accept that their own actions are leading to getting and spreading this disease, there is not a darn thing I or the rest of the straight people of America can do about it. If they want to pretend they don’t know any better because they lack special gay sexual health education that straight people deprived them of (please), they can do that too.

    We are going to continue to see these articles for months. I am already sick to death of seeing the word stigma. Soon we will see the articles complaining about straight people not accepting their excuses because they are anti-gay. No, it is because I have a brain in my head

    • Agree: JR Ewing
    • Replies: @HammerJack
  16. @notsaying

    Yes. And intimacy isn’t the first word that comes to my mind when I hear of guys having sex with hundreds of people they don’t actually even know.

    • Agree: Harry Baldwin
    • Replies: @notsaying
  17. Elli says:

    This is the result of a few related factors, all of them closely linked to societal stigma….third, gay men have, on average, more sexual partners than straight people. Even when coupled, gay men are more likely to be openly non-monogamous.
    “Closely linked.” Any direction of causation?

    Viruses may not be conscious, but those who choose to punish us for contracting them certainly are.
    It is not yet known if those who choose high-risk sexual behavior are conscious. They are certainly not responsible. Also, those who would let the pain of monkeypox be the punishment for courting monkeypox are responsible for the pain of monkeypox.

    These times demand that we refuse to be relegated to a viral underclass – and compel us to destroy the conditions that created such an underclass in the first place.
    Like promiscuity and perversity that would make Caligula blush?

  18. Mike Tre says:

    Nature is going to get tired of trying of nicely asking (HIV, colorectal cancer, and now MP) homosexuals to stop seeking sexual pleasure through the rectum. Pretty soon it’s going to unleash some ebola style prolapse inducing sternum bursting Alien like plague upon the homos like nothing ever seen before.

    • Agree: JR Ewing
  19. Second, queer people do not get a good sexual health education, nor access to queer-specific health resources.

    Huh???? Everything about “sexual health education” is on the INTERNET, accessible to anyone with a computer, WiFi or even your local library!

  20. Thrasher has always been a bit of a Dickensian head case, and I suspect that most of what he writes is tongue-in-cheek.

    I would like to speak up for drunken drivers and alcoholics who seem to be stigmatised just because they kill a lot of strangers by crashing their cars.

    The fault should really be laid at the door of public health officials who practice hate speech against anybody who causes death, disease, and premature death of no matter what type.

  21. Arclight says:

    It’s remarkable about how much of progressive politics revolves around the idea that humans need to be freed from the consequences of their actions, even when they have huge negative externalities. Most dedicated leftist believe if their policies and preferences were followed we’d have a more advanced and free society, but the behavior they are willing to tolerate only leads to barbarity.

    • Agree: Farenheit
    • Replies: @ForeverCARealist
  22. Bill P says:

    I am already sick to death of seeing the word stigma

    Stigmata (plural of stigma) are blessed wounds that replicate the ordeal of Christ. Clearly, associating lesions that are the consequence of rampant sodomy with stigmata is blasphemous in the extreme.

    Now I, personally, haven’t formed an opinion on stigmata and their validity, but consider how these people use the term. There’s no avoiding the fact that they are associating the consequences of sodomy with the martyrdom of Jesus Christ, and whether or not you adhere to the Christian faith, you have to admit that this is extraordinarily offensive to Christians, and could only have been cooked up by their implacable enemies.

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @James N. Kennett
  23. LGBTQ+ people are, on average, more likely to be poor than straight people

    Really? Aren’t they all terribly fabulous with their Pride parades and international sex parties and media jobs? How many straight people would be comforted by their doctor at the possibility of having to cancel their book launch? But perhaps Steven W. Thrasher likes rough trade – which might explain why he feels it so necessary to keep himself on a permanent regime of prophylactic medication.

  24. Dmon says:

    My employer has recently reinstated mandatory masking on company premises, due to an increasing number of covid cases. Seeing as how the State of California has declared a public health emergency due to Monkeypox, shouldn’t the Gay orgy events be subject to at least the same degree of caution? When getting buttfu\$&ed by multiple strangers, wear a mask!

  25. Fortunately, this individual’s genes aren’t going to be passed on….

  26. “… And I realized how angry I was that, for the third time in my life, a viral pandemic was dictating my sex life, shaping my professional life, messing with my head, and keeping me from experiencing intimacy.”

    This man has no idea what intimacy is. He and his ilk have eliminated intimacy and love from sex.

    “I am, of course, not alone in this. HIV, Sars-CoV-2 and now hMPXV – the virus responsible for monkeypox in humans – have all upended people’s lives, but their effects have not been felt equally. In all three cases, LGBTQ+ people were disproportionately affected.”

    A disparate impact argument? Well, why not? black megalomaniacs have gotten away with it for years, why shouldn’t homosexual megalomaniacs get away with it, too?

    Oh, and he asserts that homosexuals are typically poorer than normal people. For years, militant homosexualists have told us that their group is more affluent than normal people. These guys need to get their lies straight.

    • Agree: Kylie
    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
  27. It’s as if there might be some kind of a pattern.

    LOL. Classic Sailer deadpan.

    … And I realized how angry I was that, for the third time in my life, a viral pandemic was dictating my sex life, shaping my professional life, messing with my head, and keeping me from experiencing intimacy.

    Uh, dude–moron, whatever–what you are talking about is not “intimacy”.

    In all three cases, LGBTQ+ people were disproportionately affected.

    This is the result of a few related factors, all of them closely linked to societal stigma. …

    Oh geez. Even I–normal boring old white guy–can explain why homosexuals are disproportionally affected. (But this is a family blog.) Too much social stigma has absolutely nothing to do with it. Perhaps more social societal stigma might help–modestly.

    I’m a sort of live and let live kind of guy–you stay over there, and let me live normally over here. So I’m not into these primitive muzzie solutions to these problems. But this guy is begging for a flight plan.

    • Agree: Harry Baldwin
  28. Anon[372] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bill P

    Thank you.

  29. The plain as day deal here–this isn’t AIDS which sets up shop for good. The homosexuals could knock this thing out absolutely trivially by just being monogamous for about a month.

    That’s it. All it takes. The homo community could just organize and enforce a campaign “only one ass in August” and it would be over.

    • Replies: @JR Ewing
  30. LadyTheo says:

    Gay men: Anyone who condemns us for relentlessly indulging our base, animal appetites is an oppressor! How dare you shame us for behaving like rutting animals! Seeking orgasms above everything else in life is GOOD!!! Sex with strangers is “intimacy!”

    Me: Yeah, I no longer care if you die. In fact, please hurry up. You are an embarrassment to the human race.

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
  31. Anon[156] • Disclaimer says:

    Strangers you don’t talk to and will never see again, in a dark room = intimacy?!

  32. more minors testing positive for monkeypox than women so far, from what i can tell.

    early monkeypox numbers may give an idea of the rate at which homosexuals abuse minors.

  33. JR Ewing says:
    @AnotherDad

    Totally agree, that not being promiscuous for a brief period could cause the Gaypox to fizzle out, but they’ll never do it.

    Not because they like having gay sex too much – even though they do – but because accepting any kind of agency over their behavior gives away the game. They’ve succeeded over the years at convincing nice whites ladies that their behavior is beyond individual control and therefore is a “civil rights issue” just like skin color.

    Limiting that behavior now might cause the nice white ladies to have unapproved thoughts that maybe the gays can control it after all. And if they can control it, maybe there’s room to judge that behavior.

    Hell, it might get newly groomed recruits thinking the same thing, and that would be terrible for the movement.

    • Agree: kaganovitch
  34. @the one they call Desanex

    Ah slept with a hunky
    He was cute but kinda chunky
    I shoulda known he was funky
    Got a pain in my ass,oh snap its the Monkey!

  35. Is this a fucking parody?

    • Replies: @Angharad
  36. Kaz says:
    @Chris Mallory

    I feel like this idea of monkeypox surviving on surfaces for months is some weird exaggerated bullshit.

    Monkeypox should be hitting normal people like a truck at this point if that was the case.

    • Replies: @That Would Be Telling
  37. notsaying says:
    @HammerJack

    I know what you mean. But intimacy is probably the best word they could come up with. As time goes by, the doctors may be able to be more specific but that will cause a new set of arguments and problems too, I am sure.

  38. Rob says:

    Who exactly are the LGBTQI+ are at high risk of monkeypox? “Classic” gay/MSM of course, but what about the effeminate and autogynephilic trans women?

    Trans men? Lots of trans women work in sex industry. I don’t think that’s true for trans men, as most people who want a male partner would just go gay. Maybe the testosterone trans men take makes them promiscuous? It’d be hard for a trans man to compete with gay men for masculinity and “easiness.”

    What about “genderqueer” folx? I think they are mostly AFAB, and so far as I know, don’t engage in hormonal shenanigans that might drastically change behavior.

    If HIV provides any clue for the monkeypox epidemic, lesbians are fairly safe behaviorally, not (to my knowledge) having dozens of partners in a weekend, all of whom then fly back home all over the country/world. Mechanically, though, the way sex works, MPIED (monkeypox infectious epidemic disease) lesbians are not in the clear like they were with HIV. I’d bet the oral-genital transmission path would work for lesbians, and dental dams are no fun.

    Bisexuals? Bisexual men are fairly rare. At least, they didn’t infect many women with HIV back then. Plus, there’s a lot less pressure for gay men to have “beards” in Current Year. Bisexual women are, according to the stereotypes, more promiscuous than lesbians, but I can’t imagine they compare to gay men.

    Are intersex people even a “community” in the sexual-ecological sense? They are not a mostly-closed group who have sex with each other.

    [MORE]

    What really causes pandemics to spread so awfully among gay men is traveling for sex. Remember when they talked about choir practices being covid “superspreader” events? Well, imagine if those choir members flew in from all over the country, then spend hours more mingling, talking, and shouting to dozens of people. Then, all those lovely voices fly home. When they get home they go to more choir practices!

    How quickly does one become contagious after exposure to monkeypox? Let’s say some flesh was rubbed a lot with an appendage that had the beginning of monkeypox sores, but not bad enough to interfere with Pride, how quickly is the new exposee contagious? It could be really fast. If the virus is replicating in the outer cells of a mucus membrane, new virions will be in extracellular fluid probably within hours.

    I realize vaccinia is not monkeypox (though they are related) and monkey kidney cells are not people, but One-step growth curves for vaccinia virus in cultures of monkey kidney cells suggests that few viruses are released in the 24 hours after infection, but then?

    The multiplication of vaccinia virus in cultures of monkey kidney cells has been studied. One-step growth curves indicate that the virus particles in eclipse are responsible for replication, that the eclipse period for vaccinia virus lasts 8–10 hours, that the increase of infectious virus is exponential, and that the yield is 300 plaque-forming units per infected cell at 24 hours. Few particles are released by this time.

    But after that? Particles get released to infect new cells. Looks like a three-day weekend gives (Friday afternoon to Saturday afternoon. (1 step) Saturday afternoon to Sunday afternoon. (2 steps) Then, for guys who took Monday off from work, there Sunday afternoon to Monday afternoon. Possibility for 3 viral interhost generations at every Pride party!

    I cannot believe how lax and halfassed the government’s response to monkeypox has been. Coming right off of covid, they should have fucking learned. Remember the Diamond Princess? It was the cruise ship that stranded in the middle of nowhere for weeks because of covid. Turns out, the close quarters and likely heavily recycled air aboard a cruise ship is a great place to be if you are a respiratory virus. Public health officials should have realized through reasoning by analogy that a sexually transmitted disease would spread fairly well on sex cruises. Maybe, um, shut down the sex cruises for maybe a month? Crush the curve!

    I mean, yeah, MPV is kinda rough optics for gay men, but the smaller the epidemic, won’t it be less stigmatizing for gay men than if half of the gay men end up with serious facial scarring? But really? Anyone who cared to either think or look at data has already realized that gay men are promiscuous. But, if they stopped monkeypox in its tracks, that would cover the gay community in glory, would it not?

    I mean, monkeypox could either become much deadlier or spread to the heterosexual population. I don’t think it will, because I don’t think poxviruses can evolve to be more/less deadly very easily, but smallpox evolved from something that did not infect us. The fact that there were 2 varieties of smallpox, major and minor, with 30% and 1% death rates, respectively. That’s a huge difference! As far as I know (interesting question). Both were gone before modern bio really got going, but sources seem to say they were hard to distinguish, ‘cept by death rate. That’s a 30-fold range of lethality! Both seem to have been stable, at least major was, for maybe 2000 years. Why the huge difference? Kinda-sorta-maybe looks like poxvirus get stuck at a certain level of virulence even when turning virulence up/down would help “the” virus.

    Also saw somewhere that the infectious dose of smallpox was small, but that might be minimum pfu to cause an infection, not an indication that the typical infecting dose is small.

    • Replies: @That Would Be Telling
  39. @JR Ewing

    One of the most effective tricks of cultural Marxism over the last century is the movie/TV/song drama about the “poor oppressed minority X” who suffers all sorts of wrongs in their life due to “bigotry” and yet emerge triumphant.

    Catnip, hypnosis, and brain washing to generations of women enthralled by the talking picture boxes and silver screens.

  40. Altai says:

    scandalously overlooked research into the 2017 outbreak in Nigeria that suggests monkeypox may have mutated to allow for transmission through genital secretion.

    Mutated or a virus whose outbreak zone is deeply rural West and Central Africa never quite found itself the same fertile ground for condomless sexual transmission as when one emigre returned to London with a souvenir?

    Also for the record, lots of viruses shed in seminal fluid. Including Ebola which has been observed remaining in a recovered asymptomatic individual at least 530 after the cessation of symptoms or was detected in his blood. So, that might be something for Mr. Thrasher to think about.

    If we’re really committed to just not shaming gay men for not using a condoms with strangers and gay men having lots of sex with strangers, then I’d suggest gay doctors or volunteers be banned from going to Ebola or Marburg outbreaks if I were Mr. Thrasher.

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
  41. @JR Ewing

    A lot of post-Roe blather has this quality too, a sense that unintended pregnancy is beyond anyone’s reasonable control.

    • Agree: JR Ewing
  42. TyRade says:

    While, the expert says, monkeypox etc etc etc “simply follow the mechanistic drive to replicate”, almost all their domiciles ‘simply fail to follow the mechanistic drive to replicate’. It’s as if the viruses have read their Darwin and benefitted from it. While those who ‘un-naturally select’ have a lot to learn, painfully.

  43. @Joe S.Walker

    Yesterday I went to Michaels and I was struck by the large quantity of Pride(TM) items available in the clearance bin. I was tempted to pick up a rainbow flag – for the lulz.

    The Pride(TM) section was marked by a large sign professing solidarity with the oppressed LGBTLMAOWTF community. Even in an arts-and-crafts store you can’t get away from this crap.

    The stores are going into full Halloween mode at the moment. Dollar Tree even has a couple of Christmas items on the shelf.

    • Replies: @That Would Be Telling
  44. @martin_2

    Great ending to the story.

    May both of you have a long and healthy life.

    • Agree: Bardon Kaldian, Dnought
    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  45. Another type of behavior, not having anything with gays, is continually swept under the rug. I tried a few articles to find- finally- how the perpetrator looked like …

    https://lawandcrime.com/crime/indiana-man-charged-with-murder-allegedly-fired-rifle-at-police-officer-at-least-36-times-during-traffic-stop/

    Indiana Man Charged with Murder Allegedly Fired Rifle at Police Officer at Least 36 Times During Traffic Stop

    Fox was silent ….

    https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxAUgdIGuO01OWEKBhuXn827NfORr9yLF3

  46. If you want to have rampant sexual encounters with strangers, fine. But, don’t come to me looking for sympathy when you get an STD. This, by the way, applies to any and all sexual identities. Just what, exactly, do you think is going to happen?

    • Agree: Jonathan Mason
  47. @Chris Mallory

    This event provides a window into a certain aspect of gay male psychology which somehow was missed the first time around in the period 1982-1985.

    That is, how or why something which is entirely someone’s own fault becomes the fault of society at large, so much so that it is society which must feel guilt and not only bear that burden, but must finance enormous scientific and social projects to provide recompense.

    The play “Angels in America”, by now a relic of a bygone age, illustrates the point to anyone who has seen it.

    The head of CDC – THE HEAD OF CDC – sent a letter to all doctors on their mailing list urging them to take pain in monkeypox seriously and to be sure to provide full-scope pain management services.

    When was the last time Rochelle Walensky sent a mail blast to MDs about making sure to check blood sugar in diabetics or to provide statins to cardiac patients?

    Monkeypox is making an effort to revive “gay rage” as a political force. The grandchildren of early AIDS patients know how to recite “Ronald Reagan never said AIDS!!!”

  48. Despite copious ingestion of prophylactic drugs, shoving private parts in shit is still unhealthy— who’d a thunk?

  49. Do African homos actually screw monkeys? Is that how all these STIs of primate origin keep spreading from down there?

  50. AceDeuce says:

    I’ve long said, if cigarettes that, just 25 years ago, were \$3-4 a pack (and 50 years ago 40 cents a pack) and are now \$10-15 in many big cities are touted by Big Brother in DC as a valid way of paying for lung cancer in smokers (yeah, right)
    then why not slap a \$200 per person cover charge for ghey bathhouses, and a mandatory minimum of \$50 spent in ghey bars to offset the myriad of diseases that butt pirates seem to fall “victim” to.

  51. @Enemy of Earth

    The author has a PhD, which almost certainly means he is well schooled. But from the illogicalities of his article it is clear that well educated he is not.

    (Probably spent too many years in grad school being indoctrinated to have time to become well educated.)

  52. @Bill P

    There is no blasphemy here.

    “Stigma” is a Greek word meaning “mark”. In the plural (“stigmata”), the most common usage in English refers to Christ’s wounds. In the singular, many other usages are possible, and are not references to Christ. For example, it is a botanical term.

    • Thanks: ic1000
  53. Higher types of homosexuals will always survive. They know how to behave.

    Lower types- not quite ….

  54. @Joe S.Walker

    Pre-exposure Prophylaxis (PrEP) has given gay men a new and false sense of invulerability, and so they now engage in all sorts of high risk behaviours, which lead to the development of new strains of pathogens or new found resistance to anti-biotics in old ones.

    Many gay men are now walking petri dishes.

  55. jon says:

    HIV, Sars-CoV-2 and now hMPXV

    Gays: Monkeypox is stigmatizing, we need a new name. Doctors: How about if we use the twitter spelling of monkeypox, MPX, and we bracket it with h(i)V)? Gays: Looks great!

    for the third time in my life, a viral pandemic was dictating my sex life … and keeping me from experiencing intimacy.

    I am not far off in age from Mr. Thrasher, but none of these pandemics have had much impact on my ability to experience intimacy. Of course, I don’t define intimacy as taking 50 miles of cock at an orgy, so there’s that …

    In all three cases, LGBTQ+ people were disproportionately affected … And third, gay men have, on average, more sexual partners

    Is that the third factor? Really? Shouldn’t it be out first by a mile? And shouldn’t there be a fourth factor – something about large objects, small holes, and tearing? As with AIDS, the G’s are doing a lot of the work towards that disproportionate effect on the LGBTQIAA+ community, while the Ls are somehow being spared.

  56. The ruling class left is now promoting VD.
    As such, not a side effect of some other policy.

    Once again out in the open about something conspiracy theorists have been saying for decades.

  57. Gordo says:

    One gets the idea that Mister Thresher is not writing entirely in good faith.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
  58. “Intimacy”
    You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

  59. @Arclight

    It’s society’s fault. If only society were perfect, then none of us would have to be good. Really, this is how they think. This guys is dying for respect, but he’s not respectable. So he berates and demands and beats his fists against immovable realities like viruses and bacteria.

    Nature is a harsh teacher, but she always gets the last laugh.

  60. Steven William Thrasher = I am ill where sharts vent

  61. jon says:

    One is that LGBTQ+ people are, on average, more likely to be poor than straight people

    Since we are simultaneously told this, and also that the gays are wealthier, more educated, and living their best life, I decided to look this one up. Some highlights from this 2013 paper ( https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/publications/lgb-patterns-of-poverty/ ):

    male same-sex couples have lower overall poverty rates than married different-sex couples

    Comparisons of poverty for LGB adults and heterosexual adults in national surveys mostly showed higher rates of LGB poverty, although most of those differences are not statistically significant.

    The poverty rates for lesbian and gay adults in California are lower than for heterosexual people

    children of LGB parents are especially vulnerable to poverty

    The difference in poverty rates for black and white couples is disproportionately higher in same-sex compared to different-sex couples

    The tl:dr summary – Most data shows that LGBTQIAA+ are, on average, better off than us straights. And the evidence that shows they are worse off isn’t statistically significant. The are only two exceptions. One, children of LGBTQIAA+ couples are much worse off – because these people are horrible parents – and, two, LGBTQIAA+ couples where both partners are black – because when it comes to bad decision making, sometimes 2+2=5.

    • Thanks: That Would Be Telling
    • Replies: @eternal anglophile
  62. kanga says:

    Hey Thrasher, think of it as a teachable moment.

  63. George says:

    “Contracting Sexually Transmitted Infections Is Bad”

    If contracting a disease is bad, how about transmitting it?

    Back in the Typhoid Mary days, if I have the facts straight, the, usually Protestant, NYC health authorities eventually decided that they would have to give financial assistance to, often Irish immigrant, typhoid sufferers so enable them to find occupations not related to food preparation. I wonder if financial assistance, and maybe heroine, should be given to, often Black, male prostitutes to keep them out of the so-called Gay Circuit scene for like half a year to flatten and hopefully crush the M-pox curve.

  64. In the meantime, one Kai Tupferschmidt, “a science journalist based in Berlin,” tells NY TImes readers that “public health officials in many places seem so unsure of how to talk about this disease in a nonstigmatizing way that they prefer to speak only in vague terms. Some — whether out of complacency, callousness or homophobia — just do not seem to see much urgency.” Mr. Sailer’s point, that homosexual men are too politically powerful to blame, is not even considered.

  65. Senator Demands California Monkeypox State of Emergency, Defends Weekend Kink Street Fest

    Was, of course a supporter of Church Lockdowns.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2022-08-03/sf-sen-scott-wiener-demands-monkeypox-state-emergency-defends-weekend-kinkfetish

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
  66. For thousands of years, people have felt that a life devoted to lust is a moral weakness.

  67. @Rob

    I realize vaccinia is not monkeypox (though they are related) and monkey kidney cells are not people, but One-step growth curves for vaccinia virus in cultures of monkey kidney cells suggests that few viruses are released in the 24 hours after infection, but then?

    This is useful data, but in vitro experiments necessarily leave out the suppressive effects of the immune system. Here starting with the innate, if a cell is being stressed enough kill it dead etc. The adaptive systems take a minimum of eight days to start learning a new pathogen, and for the US essentially nobody under 50 may have lingering immunity from smallpox vaccination. Subtract up to eight years for the rest of the world. On the other hand plenty of “at risk” people are getting vaccinated with one that’s had some observational testing in the Congo.

    won’t it be less stigmatizing for gay men than if half of the gay men end up with serious facial scarring?

    Have not looked hard at this, in part for obvious reasons, but I don’t get the impression monkeybox creates hardly as many pustules as smallpox did or could. Fortunately still not well adapted to humans. And we ought to have good data on scaring by now or pretty soon..

    • Replies: @The Plutonium Kid
  68. “being trans or gay is good, and queer sex is good.”

    Why?

  69. @Paleo Liberal

    A weird association ….

    Perhaps 2 decades ago, a man in Texas was diagnosed with cancer & given a few months to live. He decided to “spend” the rest of his life by plunging into debauchery, over-eating & all kinds of hyper-hedonistic extreme stuff. After maybe 2-3 months he became disgusted with carnal “pleasures” & with the whole life, so he committed suicide.

    Autopsy showed he hadn’t had cancer.

    • Replies: @Bill Jones
  70. possumman says:

    Where is that heavy cotton gin fan when you need it?

  71. Can we afford homosexuals?

  72. Rob McX says:

    Queer people “internalize” a lot of things.

    • LOL: Kylie
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  73. Dream says:

    Why can’t homosexuals be chaste virgins?

  74. @Cloudbuster

    “Homosexual people got really upset when the mainstream population explicitly told them they shouldn’t hide their disease, but on the contrary, disclose and inform sexual partners and other people who might be at risk. Hiding them is bad, because infecting other people with your diseases is bad.”

    Unless you’re a bug chaser, then it might even help get you laid. It wouldn’t surprise me the least bit to learn there are gay men out there actively trying to get “the ‘Pox”.

    https://theconversation.com/do-some-people-really-want-to-get-hiv-i-spoke-to-bug-chasers-around-the-world-to-find-out-103609

    https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Bug%20Party

    https://marksking.com/my-fabulous-disease/the-hiv-bug-chaser-who-changed-his-mind/

  75. @That Would Be Telling

    And we ought to have good data on scaring by now or pretty soon.

    I assume you meant “scarring.”

  76. That was a tediously long display of cognitive dissonance.

  77. This is nothing to be ashamed of; being trans or gay is good, and queer sex is good.

    Sounds like you’re trying to convince yourself; keep saying it, pal, maybe one day you’ll believe it.

    Shame should not be a factor in these discussions. “Viruses are not conscious,” said Pedro Serrano, a public health researcher. “They simply follow the mechanistic drive to replicate.”

    Precisely. Viruses don’t know that gays are good, better than straights even. They just spread more easily in the filthy, dangerous conditions created by promiscuous gay behavior. ‘Viruses are not conscious’ is not the checkmate they think it is.

  78. It’s like if Emmett Till were gay and his accuser followed the letter of the law.

    I’m impressed with the way you seamlessly invoked the name of His Holiness into a discussion about Monkeypox. You get three Monkeypox points.

    1) Not gratuitous use of Emmet Till. Not gratuitous at all.
    2) The covert monkey illusion.
    3) Other clever stuff.

  79. …queer sex is good.

    “Queer sex” isn’t even sex.

    Mr. Johnson’s…

    Tiger Mandingo’s. Never mind the mixed continental metaphor.

  80. @Rob McX

    Queer people “internalize” a lot of things.

    Usually via the :

    • Replies: @Rob McX
  81. Escher says:

    Maybe viruses are homophobic.

    Or maybe performing unnatural acts with random strangers in areas with high microbial loads is inherently a risky endeavor.

  82. Dr. Thrasher writes that gays get more STIs because they are poor, ignorant, and promiscuous.

    Making a claim that is one-third true is respectably above-average for woke discourse.

  83. @Nicholas Stix

    What could be more intimate than sticking your member through a glory hole into an invisible stranger?

  84. @Kaz

    I feel like this idea of monkeypox surviving on surfaces for months is some weird exaggerated bullshit.

    I find it at best interesting; it’s an enveloped virus, meaning it is surrounded by a lipid cell membrane and is therefore relatively fragile. We should also be very careful … OK, if it isn’t a tabulation of data, the CDC isn’t reliable, but drill down to whom they might be citing if not public health authorities.

    And drill down to make sure they aren’t saying “monkeypox!!!” based on clinical level PCR testing because that typically only looks for 2-3 bits of a virus’s genome. Which especially being hardy DNA vs. fragile RNA like for COVID, you’d expect to hang around in strands for a longer time (then again RNA does well enough for sewage monitoring, but that’s something of bulk thing you might say). Recovery of a full genome you can sequence is a better proxy for viable monkeypox viruses, but the acid test is seeing if you can get it to replicate in cell culture.

    OK, doing that is not as hardly as dangerous as for infinitely more lethal COVID which requires(ed) BSL-3 facilities, at least prior to vaccines being available. Even then, doing this sort of thing can create much more virus than it needed for normal transmission, and you must keep in mind that the sample might be some other virus.

    Monkeypox should be hitting normal people like a truck at this point if that was the case.

    Bet we don’t have enough data on that, monkeypox so far is not well adapted to humans, we don’t as far as I know have its transmission characteristics super well established outside of gay sex where we can just assume “bad.” Note also while cases might have been missed this Western African clade was prior to this outbreak never observed to cause human to human transmission.

    So … we need more data. Which is going to be extra hard because of the “stigma!!!” associated with the normal transmission method. That is, I’m sure more than a few cases are sending local public health authorities on wild monkey chases by lying about how they got it. And reports of community transmission might also come from such lying.

    Ah, well, given the globohomo West has absolutely no will to stop it aside from vaccinating “vulnerable” populations we’ll likely get a lot more raw data as cases climb, what? Is it exponential now, especially as testing capacity has massively expanded?

  85. @Stan Adams

    The stores are going into full Halloween mode at the moment. Dollar Tree even has a couple of Christmas items on the shelf.

    If the stuff comes from the PRC or East Asia a good reason to do this is to not wait for the last minute to get your container shipped over due to the logjams at West Coast ports. Xi’s also semi-randomly shutting down major cities as part of his Zero COVID policy so confidence about when factories there will be able to make stuff is lower.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
  86. @West reanimator

    Do African homos actually screw monkeys? Is that how all these STIs of primate origin keep spreading from down there?

    We don’t know the origin of this virus, Wikipedia is now saying it “was first identified as a distinct illness in 1958 among laboratory monkeys in Copenhagen, Denmark” thus the name. First human cases found in 1970 in unvaccinated children in “the Democratic Republic of the Congo (formerly Zaire)” during the smallpox eradication effort (successful seven years later, although we had to wait three more to be sure enough).

    In the wild it’s been identified in a couple of African rodent species and as of a while ago rodents were thought to be the animal reservoirs. But we were just not talking about very many African cases a year, maybe about a thousand identified, thus it’s hard to know. And of course of academic interest now that it’s wildly spreading through gay sexual networks.

  87. @That Would Be Telling

    Yeah, probably.

    Here at Hoarder Hovel we have enough Halloween and Christmas crap to last several lifetimes. Most of it hasn’t been touched in years. Much of it has never been opened.

    Every year I go over to Dadeland and spend a few hours gawking at the elaborate Christmas displays at Macy’s and JCPenney, and then I don’t feel any need to put up a tree of my own. If I get nostalgic I can just gaze at old photographs of the trees my grandmother used to put up.

    Of course, the way things are going, this year Macy’s will have to settle for a Charlie Brown-style tree.

  88. Rob McX says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    With all these diseases going around, a lot of them will be left with a ;

    • LOL: JR Ewing
  89. @West reanimator

    You’d think monkeypox would have been rampant in Borneo years ago, with their novelty orangutan prostitute.

    https://metro.co.uk/2018/11/26/orangutan-was-shaved-made-to-wear-jewellery-and-used-as-a-prostitute-8179714/

  90. @jon

    LGBTQIAA+ couples where both partners are black – because when it comes to bad decision making, sometimes 2+2=5

    Is this matched? I.e. compared to straight black couples? Or all couples?

    Obviously, inevitably, if this were against the general population, you would expect any configuration of two black people to be less wealthy.

  91. @Bill Jones

    This Wiener sounds like a real d**k.

  92. anon[280] • Disclaimer says:

    “… And I realized how angry I was that, for the third time in my life, a viral pandemic was dictating my sex life. . .”

    Or perhaps it is your sex life which is dictating yet another viral pandemic.

    “In all three cases, LGBTQ+ people were disproportionately affected.”

    But only in proportion to your responsibility for the spread of these diseases.

    “And third, gay men have, on average, more sexual partners than straight people. Even when coupled, gay men are more likely to be openly non-monogamous.”

    So much for the fiction of “gay” intimacy. “Sex” with an anonymous mouth on the other side of a knothole in the wall is hardly conducive to intimacy

    “Second, queer people do not get a good sexual health education. . . ”

    Nor do they want any.

    “LGBTQ+ people are, on average, more likely to be poor than straight people. . .”

    Now this is a a good one. All through the late twentieth century the “gays” used to crow that their median income was twice as high as that of the normals, the obvious result of their superior talents and intelligence. The general “dumbing-down” must be affecting them disproportionately, or maybe it’s just all that syphilis in the brain that has “victimized” them so much more terribly.

    • Agree: Rob McX
  93. congrats on noticing a trend that others have been writing about for years

  94. “Viruses are not conscious,” said Pedro Serrano, a public health researcher. “They simply follow the mechanistic drive to replicate.”

    But in 2020 government and media told us that SARS-COV-2 was sympathetic to BLM/Antifa politics and therefore those gatherings/demonstrations/riots were safe and Covid-free, whereas any other gathering of two or more people was infinitely lethal. Why is this guy contradicting The Science?

    • LOL: Angharad
  95. @Gordo

    One gets the idea that Mister Thresher is not writing entirely in good faith.

    I have read a number of his commentaries over the years, and they are usually pretty extreme.

    Thrasher is kind of like the positive to Alex Jones’s negative pole.

    If you can position yourself as the most extreme and absurd proponent of any point of view, there is usually money to be made.

    Perhaps the next step for Prof. Thrasher might be a paid appearance on the Tucker Carlson show.

  96. AceDeuce says:

    Anybody else besides me skeeved out at the thought of gheys “internalizing” things?

    Anyway, isn’t that part of the job description?

    • LOL: Angharad
  97. Rosie says:

    This was painful to read. It is becoming increasingly clear to me that these men know, on some level, that their lifestyle is not healthy because it doesn’t accord with the nature of the human body. It seems inevitable that this would engender feelings of hatred, but hatred of what?

    a. God
    b. Mainstream society
    c. Oneself
    d. all of the above

    The anguish of it all seems almost unbearable.

  98. Contracting any disease is bad. There is no need for internalization. The symptoms are enough.

  99. @Bardon Kaldian

    Nowadays he’d go down as another Covid case.

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