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  1. Will Mohammed Atta be included? He lived out his life here, so by definition he was an immigrant.

    And nobody contributed more to Bush’s reelection. Not even John Kerry’s surf shop.

    • Agree: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @AnotherDad
    @Reg Cæsar

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I'm a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd--twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew's image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he's a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @nebulafox, @JosephB, @Lot, @Diversity Heretic

  2. Of course George W. Bush helped pour gasoline on the fire in terms of the world’s most important graph.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President%27s_Emergency_Plan_for_AIDS_Relief

    That man (and administration) really was a walking disaster. His mortgage polices on the Great Recession, the Iraq/Afghanistan War, you name it and he made it worse. He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
    • Replies: @Wilkey
    @Kronos


    He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.
     
    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal - expansion of Medicare, No Child Left Behind, boosting minority home ownership. Hell, even the Iraq War was based on this ridiculous notion that we could turn some shithole quasi-white Muslim country into a forward-looking Western democracy.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Pincher Martin, @Mr. Anon, @Cloudbuster

    , @Corvinus
    @Kronos

    Decidedly better than Trump.

  3. It’s funny that politicians like George W. Bush keep feeling the need to recognize the contributions of immigrants based on their status as immigrants but never feel the need to recognize the value of Americans based on our status as Americans. If an immigrant does something useful, worthy, or important his contributions point to the value of all immigrants. But if an American does something important it only reflects on him, not Americans as a group.

    • Agree: Ben tillman, Rob McX
    • Replies: @bro3886
    @Wilkey

    Except in the "minds" of the Bushes no white American ever does anything useful, worthy, or important unless it is in service to non-whites or billionaires.

  4. His has been the longest, most publicized effort to perfect freshman art major portraiture as a genre.

    • LOL: Wilkey
    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @Buzz Mohawk

    "freshman art major"

    Throw your shade, money-man. The sad face portraits produced by the grandson of Alistair Crowley fetch Thomas Kinkade prices in the Abramovic circle.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

  5. @Kronos
    Of course George W. Bush helped pour gasoline on the fire in terms of the world’s most important graph.

    https://youtu.be/MxbT11QlCe8

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President%27s_Emergency_Plan_for_AIDS_Relief

    https://www.takimag.com/wp-content/uploads/The-Worlds-Most-Important-Graph-2020-1-768x580.png

    That man (and administration) really was a walking disaster. His mortgage polices on the Great Recession, the Iraq/Afghanistan War, you name it and he made it worse. He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.

    Replies: @Wilkey, @Corvinus

    He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.

    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal – expansion of Medicare, No Child Left Behind, boosting minority home ownership. Hell, even the Iraq War was based on this ridiculous notion that we could turn some shithole quasi-white Muslim country into a forward-looking Western democracy.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Wilkey

    I believe it was the GOP Neoconservatives attempt at Bill Clinton’s “Triangulation” strategy. Of course if you try to meet someone halfway over a big ravine on a rickety bridge bad things may happen.

    https://winningprogressivedotcom.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/triangulation-copy.png?w=500

    Replies: @Charlotte, @Sol

    , @Pincher Martin
    @Wilkey


    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal...
     
    And even Dubya's judges are no longer looking like an unalloyed good. Roberts is now a clear moderate who's unpredictable in what side he will vote with.

    Alito is still a pretty solid conservative, but he was Bush's second choice after Harriet Miers. If conservatives hadn't rebelled against his first nominee, we would now be stuck with her and Roberts on the High Court.

    , @Mr. Anon
    @Wilkey


    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal,.............
     
    Ever heard of Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts?
    , @Cloudbuster
    @Wilkey

    He shares with Nixon the distinction of being one of the Presidents most effective at achieving leftist policy goals.

    Replies: @Hunsdon

  6. My family has been in this country for 350 years, and I fought in his stupid war in Iraq, and came out disabled. Guess he won’t do a painting of me, the worthless son of a bitch…

    • Thanks: Sol, Voltarde
    • Replies: @Diversity Inclusion Equality Youth Team
    @Stahlhelm

    Thank you for your service, and personal sacrifice.
    - a multiple generation military family.

  7. Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history. Perhaps Biden’s pick will turn out to be another.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Impolitic

    Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history.

    For some people I know, that "choice" was their introduction to the concept of the Deep State. G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time. He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was. In an early 1980 campaign speech in front of Republican Party donors, Bush suddenly pulled a small revolver out of his pocket and began raving about how the US needs to "ban guns like these!". He was elected in 1988 in part due to "No New Taxes" and "No New Gun Laws" then proceeded to break both these slogans. The Deep State may be canny and clever but its sock puppets are not always very smart.

    In the 90 - 92 time frame his genius Karl Rove managed to alienate Vermont gun owners with a totally unsuitable candidate, then told Vermonters "You have no one else to vote for! Where you gonna go?" with the result that Socialist Sanders went to Washington...where he was reliably anti immigration and neutral to pro on guns...demonstrating that yeah, Vermont voters did have somewhere else to go. And so? Both Rove and Bush apparently cannot learn from experience, either. Although GW had some limited ability to learn from Daddy's gun debacle.

    Then recently we find out G H W Bush was handsy with all the girls around him for decades. Like Biden, only more subtle and below the waist. When was the last time anyone remotely close to normal ran for President?

    Replies: @Art Deco

    , @Pater
    @Impolitic

    Poppy was about as establishment/country-club republican as it gets and besides minus Bush Sr on the veep ticket his CIA buddies wouldn't have undermined President Carter's Iran hostage initiative which was a big factor in the election

    , @prime noticer
    @Impolitic

    "Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history."

    agree that it was one of the most consequential events of the last century. it cursed the Bush clan on America. but Reagan didn't get a choice about that. Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford. being the nominee in 80 was conditional on him taking on Bush as VP.

    neocons were already largely influential by the late 70s and were helping to pick and choose the company man. Bush was who they wanted - Bush was just getting clobbered by Reagan in popularity among the voters.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Kronos

    , @Sparkon
    @Impolitic

    In truth, the worst choice for VP was made by John Kennedy when he accepted Lyndon Johnson as his running mate in 1960. Because of the Billy Sol Estes and Bobby Baker scandals, there was a very good chance LBJ was going to end up in hot water, if not in prison, and it's quite possible that JFK would not have selected him again in 1964, had he lived that long.

  8. From Bush 43’s new book: “This is Juan. He makes my tacos. I like tacos, and when our toilet is clogged, we call Jesús. He is named after my Lord and Saviour. Without our Mexicans, Laura and I would be lost.”

  9. As they’ve gotten older, it’s become increasingly clear to me that neither one of the Bush brothers — Dubya and Jeb — ever cared that much for politics. Dubya was supposed to be a dummy, but in hindsight it seems more and more like he wasn’t dumb — just uninterested in Washington minutiae. He was on autopilot throughout his presidency not because he was stupid, but because he was bored. Remember on one of his vacations during his presidency, he read Albert Camus’s “The Stranger?” That doesn’t seem like the choice of a guy who spends a lot of his waking life thinking about Beltway issues.

    Both the younger Bushes seem like they would have been much happier if they had been left alone to explore other interests, instead of being pushed into joining the family dynasty.

    America, too, would probably have been much happier. As a general rule, it doesn’t seem like America has gotten a whole lot out good out of of politicians who were forced into politics by the egos of their parents.

    • Agree: Not Only Wrathful
    • Replies: @Johnny Smoggins
    @Mr. Blank

    I'm surprised he read Camus. I'd have thought Tom Clancy or John Grisham would be more to his liking, if he read at all.

    It was probably a lame attempt to make him appear deeper than he actually was.

  10. @Wilkey
    @Kronos


    He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.
     
    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal - expansion of Medicare, No Child Left Behind, boosting minority home ownership. Hell, even the Iraq War was based on this ridiculous notion that we could turn some shithole quasi-white Muslim country into a forward-looking Western democracy.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Pincher Martin, @Mr. Anon, @Cloudbuster

    I believe it was the GOP Neoconservatives attempt at Bill Clinton’s “Triangulation” strategy. Of course if you try to meet someone halfway over a big ravine on a rickety bridge bad things may happen.

    • Replies: @Charlotte
    @Kronos

    Bill Clinton did some things, like welfare reform, that pleased ordinary people with a conservative bent. It seems to me that Dubya’s efforts at triangulation mainly pleased a subset of elite progressives. For instance, every teacher I knew hated NCLB. The man did not have good political instincts.

    , @Sol
    @Kronos

    Jeb is retired for good? I hope he doesn't return in 2024.

    Replies: @tyrone

  11. @Reg Cæsar
    Will Mohammed Atta be included? He lived out his life here, so by definition he was an immigrant.

    And nobody contributed more to Bush's reelection. Not even John Kerry's surf shop.

    Replies: @AnotherDad

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I’m a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd–twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew’s image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he’s a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @AnotherDad

    One reason I vote third-party so often is to feel clean the next morning. It's also the first vote in the next election.

    I even managed to vote for Gerald Ford on a third-party line. That set the precedent.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna

    , @nebulafox
    @AnotherDad

    Don't feel too bad, a lot of us made that mistake, even those of us who were nowhere near voting age at the time. I was not the same kind of foreign policy realist I am now when I was in primary school, believe me: I was mad as hell after 9/11 and wanted blood vengeance. Of course, as I got older, I changed my opinions according to the evidence and admitted my mistakes. That's what normal adults do. The Beltway is not populated by normal adults.

    I don't think Dubya was a bad guy-a lot of the men around him, from Powell to Rove, are another matter-but he absolutely no business, zero, being in the White House. Should have stuck to owning the Texas Rangers or something. America still hasn't recovered from his Presidency, and I'm not sure it is going to any time soon. If the MSM's rehabilitation of him because Against Orange Man doesn't illustrate their fundamental bankruptcy, liberals with a shred of honesty left, I'm not sure what will.

    >Shat all over the Republican brand.

    It's deeply hard to envision a President Obama-himself someone who didn't exactly have the resume you'd expect of a Presidential candidate-were it not for Bush II's trainwrecks. Just as Obama's real legacy is Trump, Bush II's real legacy was Obama.

    Replies: @Redneck farmer, @Ben tillman

    , @JosephB
    @AnotherDad

    Don't feel so bad, I not only voted for his reelection but was in favor of the war on terror. There was much craziness then.

    Then again, I saw step #1 in the WOT as forging an alliance with Russia. Heck, we probably could have made a deal with China back in 2003 based on the problem of pissed off Muslims. Sigh...missed opportunities.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt

    , @Lot
    @AnotherDad

    Agree.

    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.

    I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    Jeb raised and banked $110 million a year before the primary started, and was carefully following W’s 2000 primary playbook. It could have worked.

    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Boethiuss, @Mr. Anon

    , @Diversity Heretic
    @AnotherDad

    I have to go even further in self-flagellation and admit that I contributed money to his first campaign. But, like you, I've regretted my support of him over and over.

    Replies: @Not Only Wrathful

  12. I’ll believe he’s an artist when he cuts off one of his ears.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @black sea


    I’ll believe he’s an artist when he cuts off one of his ears
     
    Or fills a giant bottle with his urine? "Piss Saddam"!
    , @Kronos
    @black sea

    Oh please let it be the tongue! Obama won major independent support just from speaking in a clear and sophisticated manner. It wasn’t that Connecticut/Texas twang that riled the ears of the world for eight years.

    https://youtu.be/E2Zv1T4Qdv4

    Replies: @nebulafox

  13. Anonymous[250] • Disclaimer says:

    He’s just as bad and untalented an artist as he was a bad and untalented president.

    – That in a word sums him up as succinctly as is humanly possible. I mean, just look at the clumsiness and obtuseness of his daubings in canvas.

  14. @AnotherDad
    @Reg Cæsar

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I'm a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd--twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew's image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he's a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @nebulafox, @JosephB, @Lot, @Diversity Heretic

    One reason I vote third-party so often is to feel clean the next morning. It’s also the first vote in the next election.

    I even managed to vote for Gerald Ford on a third-party line. That set the precedent.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    @Reg Cæsar

    2000 was easy: Patrick J and Ralph Nader were running.

    That would have been a much better contest than Bush v Gore.

  15. @black sea
    I'll believe he's an artist when he cuts off one of his ears.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Kronos

    I’ll believe he’s an artist when he cuts off one of his ears

    Or fills a giant bottle with his urine? “Piss Saddam”!

  16. Anonymous[325] • Disclaimer says:
    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
    @Anonymous

    Do copies of Bush's collection of paint-by-numbers quality works come with vomit bags, or do you have to buy those separately?

    Trillions of dollars borrowed from the Chicoms for a mid-East misadventure that destroyed so many lives directly and indirectly, so a yankee living in Texas could prove he really is a cowboy. Duh-byah should go back to the semi-nude self-portraits he started his career as a painter with. They're less embarrassing to himself than everything that followed.

    (Are the mouths deformed on all 43's subjects some subconscious expression of his own inability to articulate satisfactorily?)

    , @Corvinus
    @Anonymous

    Now why would Mr. Sailor want to admit that he purposely ignored that context or neglected to acknowledge that context in his hit piece?

  17. @AnotherDad
    @Reg Cæsar

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I'm a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd--twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew's image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he's a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @nebulafox, @JosephB, @Lot, @Diversity Heretic

    Don’t feel too bad, a lot of us made that mistake, even those of us who were nowhere near voting age at the time. I was not the same kind of foreign policy realist I am now when I was in primary school, believe me: I was mad as hell after 9/11 and wanted blood vengeance. Of course, as I got older, I changed my opinions according to the evidence and admitted my mistakes. That’s what normal adults do. The Beltway is not populated by normal adults.

    I don’t think Dubya was a bad guy-a lot of the men around him, from Powell to Rove, are another matter-but he absolutely no business, zero, being in the White House. Should have stuck to owning the Texas Rangers or something. America still hasn’t recovered from his Presidency, and I’m not sure it is going to any time soon. If the MSM’s rehabilitation of him because Against Orange Man doesn’t illustrate their fundamental bankruptcy, liberals with a shred of honesty left, I’m not sure what will.

    >Shat all over the Republican brand.

    It’s deeply hard to envision a President Obama-himself someone who didn’t exactly have the resume you’d expect of a Presidential candidate-were it not for Bush II’s trainwrecks. Just as Obama’s real legacy is Trump, Bush II’s real legacy was Obama.

    • Replies: @Redneck farmer
    @nebulafox

    America hasn't recovered from Truman's presidency, if you look at it clear-eyed enough.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder

    , @Ben tillman
    @nebulafox

    Bush didn’t cause Obama to be elected. The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11, and they continued to lie for him through the invasion that they so strongly supported. In other words, the media propagated the idea that Bush was a smashing success.

    How you imagine that his awful wrongdoing — which the public never heard about — caused the election of Obama is beyond me. The election was largely due to McCain’s throwing the election.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Kronos

  18. @black sea
    I'll believe he's an artist when he cuts off one of his ears.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Kronos

    Oh please let it be the tongue! Obama won major independent support just from speaking in a clear and sophisticated manner. It wasn’t that Connecticut/Texas twang that riled the ears of the world for eight years.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    "Turd Blossom".

    Replies: @Kronos

  19. Preening vanity. Like a beatific chimp looking at the people outside its cage and imagining they are simply its reflection.

    So much narcissism, from the journalists and the high-minded readers too.

    • Thanks: Sya Beerens
  20. @Kronos
    @black sea

    Oh please let it be the tongue! Obama won major independent support just from speaking in a clear and sophisticated manner. It wasn’t that Connecticut/Texas twang that riled the ears of the world for eight years.

    https://youtu.be/E2Zv1T4Qdv4

    Replies: @nebulafox

    “Turd Blossom”.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @nebulafox

    That was his nickname for Karl Rove right?

    Replies: @nebulafox

  21. @Wilkey
    @Kronos


    He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.
     
    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal - expansion of Medicare, No Child Left Behind, boosting minority home ownership. Hell, even the Iraq War was based on this ridiculous notion that we could turn some shithole quasi-white Muslim country into a forward-looking Western democracy.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Pincher Martin, @Mr. Anon, @Cloudbuster

    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal…

    And even Dubya’s judges are no longer looking like an unalloyed good. Roberts is now a clear moderate who’s unpredictable in what side he will vote with.

    Alito is still a pretty solid conservative, but he was Bush’s second choice after Harriet Miers. If conservatives hadn’t rebelled against his first nominee, we would now be stuck with her and Roberts on the High Court.

  22. @AnotherDad
    @Reg Cæsar

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I'm a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd--twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew's image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he's a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @nebulafox, @JosephB, @Lot, @Diversity Heretic

    Don’t feel so bad, I not only voted for his reelection but was in favor of the war on terror. There was much craziness then.

    Then again, I saw step #1 in the WOT as forging an alliance with Russia. Heck, we probably could have made a deal with China back in 2003 based on the problem of pissed off Muslims. Sigh…missed opportunities.

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    @JosephB

    I favored Persian Excursion 1. I learned from that and hated PE2. Don't beat yourself up over it. Fool me twice...you can't get fooled again.

  23. @Wilkey
    @Kronos


    He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.
     
    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal - expansion of Medicare, No Child Left Behind, boosting minority home ownership. Hell, even the Iraq War was based on this ridiculous notion that we could turn some shithole quasi-white Muslim country into a forward-looking Western democracy.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Pincher Martin, @Mr. Anon, @Cloudbuster

    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal,………….

    Ever heard of Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts?

  24. Late stage Korsakoff Syndrome…..

  25. Van Gogh had his sunflowers, Picasso, his Blue Period; the important thing is that Bush’s art will continue to develop and deepen. His next project could be a life size portrait of My Pet Goat in the style of George Stubbs or Mark Rothko.

    • Replies: @Cortes
    @Henry's Cat

    Restoration of a great work of art must be ahead:

    https://geoffreyjwright.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/montage-ecce-homo-borja.jpg

    Replies: @tyrone

    , @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder
    @Henry's Cat


    His next project could be a life size portrait of My Pet Goat in the style of George Stubbs or Mark Rothko.
     
    The choice you present is just a tad manichean..
  26. It must have have been difficult for George W. Bush to deign to be President of a country whose people he despised so much. His campaign slogan may as well have been “F**k you, America!”

    It’s nice that “W” found a hobby. And painting immigrants (“The Real Americans”) must be a nice change from painting all those veterans whose bodies he crippled and whose lives he destroyed with his useless, bogus, trumped up wars. The ones who weren’t killed, that is.

    Bush is a despicable chimp-like retard a**hole.

  27. @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    "Turd Blossom".

    Replies: @Kronos

    That was his nickname for Karl Rove right?

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    Yeah. As much as Dubya deserves the thrashing that he's getting here, Rove arguably did even more damage to the party specifically. The self-defeating 1994 forever mental fantasy land that the GOP currently inhabits is largely his doing: he did a lot to purge ideological objectors ranging from Scowcroft to Perot to Buchanan who were pointing out how insane GOP orthodoxy was becoming in everything from foreign relations to trade.

    Among other things, he's the guy who pioneered the "Open Borders Will Lead To Hispanics Creating Permanent Republican Majority" fantasy. To be fair to Dubya and Rove, being governor of Texas in the 1990s made this a bit more plausible, but to take that as applying to the whole country shows that far from being a political genius, Karl Rove was actually a complete idiot who ignored the very obvious reality that the survival of the GOP in the face of changing demographics would require an appeal to the Rust Belt-and thus, a turn away from the constant worship of big business. (Which would have, alongside picking up the Rust Belt, have picked up a lot of Hispanics on the side anyway, more than Chamber of Commerce policies mixed with amnesty would have. Morons.) However imperfectly and however quick he was to ditch this in power, Donald Trump... kind of, sort of did this in 2016, and it was enough.

    PS:

    Scowcroft is dead. RIP. Much as I have a dim opinion of the Bush family as a whole, always deeply respected him. People don't realize how tricky ending the Cold War really was and how much credit guys like Baker and Scowcroft-and to be fair, Bush Senior-deserve for handling that well.

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic, @Kronos

  28. @AnotherDad
    @Reg Cæsar

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I'm a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd--twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew's image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he's a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @nebulafox, @JosephB, @Lot, @Diversity Heretic

    Agree.

    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.

    I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    Jeb raised and banked $110 million a year before the primary started, and was carefully following W’s 2000 primary playbook. It could have worked.

    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Lot

    >I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    My point exactly. The Democrats were so immersed in their "New America" narrative that they didn't leave anybody minding the store in states like Pennsylvania or Michigan-and as a political party, they'd been hollowed out on a state and local level outside the big cities. Trump was the only one do what common sense dictated, precisely because he lacked an ideological attachment to the post-1994 orthodoxy which produced Bush II.

    Unfortunately, he didn't have an attachment really to anything except himself, as should have been obvious from his personal history... but the *chance* was enough for voters to breath in the fresh air disrupting a political scene that had become Brezhnevite in many ways. And yes: hell, if Clinton were elected, we might have ended up getting to a point difficult to come back from with a nuclear armed power.

    , @Boethiuss
    @Lot


    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.
     
    I'm not having this, on a couple of levels. I'm sure POTUS Hillary could have replaced Justice Scalia, but I very much doubt if she could have gotten amnesty, and in fact she might not have tried that hard for it.

    Mostly though, I'm disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Many Trump supporters tend to want to restrict immigration at any cost. But the way it's turned out, our support for Trump has cost us way more than whatever benefit we've gotten from Trump's immigration policy. I'd even venture that it's cost us more than whatever benefit we'd get if Trump actually were able to meaningfully curtail immigration, which of course he can't.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @Ben tillman, @anon, @ATBOTL

    , @Mr. Anon
    @Lot


    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.
     
    Then he went and hired Mattis, Abrams, Bolton, Pompeo, and any number of other people who either served in the Bush II administration or would have been right at home there.

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb

  29. Sadistic sense of humor is inherent to the Colonial Vempires:

    https://quod.lib.umich.edu/f/fc/13761232.0041.110/–towards-an-aesthetiquette-of-torture-polite-form-in-zero?rgn=main;view=fulltext

    Mock, Mock, Mock and pathetic “cryptic” references.

    Zumm kotzen

  30. anonymous[194] • Disclaimer says:

    Could every last one of you who voted for this asshole in 2004 punch yourselves in the face? Punch your face three more times for voting McCain and keep punching until you lose consciousness if you voted for Romney.

  31. Did CNN forget about this footage?

    America is a theocracy now where abstract violation of propriety or taboo, being uncouth and not thinking immigrants uber alles trumps actually waging a war of aggression on a country you’d already hobbled with 12 years of sanctions after engaging is a systematic campaign of lies is considered. (If, indeed, the media ever cared believed ‘Arab Lives Matter’ when they’re in their own countries minding their own business)

  32. @Kronos
    @nebulafox

    That was his nickname for Karl Rove right?

    Replies: @nebulafox

    Yeah. As much as Dubya deserves the thrashing that he’s getting here, Rove arguably did even more damage to the party specifically. The self-defeating 1994 forever mental fantasy land that the GOP currently inhabits is largely his doing: he did a lot to purge ideological objectors ranging from Scowcroft to Perot to Buchanan who were pointing out how insane GOP orthodoxy was becoming in everything from foreign relations to trade.

    Among other things, he’s the guy who pioneered the “Open Borders Will Lead To Hispanics Creating Permanent Republican Majority” fantasy. To be fair to Dubya and Rove, being governor of Texas in the 1990s made this a bit more plausible, but to take that as applying to the whole country shows that far from being a political genius, Karl Rove was actually a complete idiot who ignored the very obvious reality that the survival of the GOP in the face of changing demographics would require an appeal to the Rust Belt-and thus, a turn away from the constant worship of big business. (Which would have, alongside picking up the Rust Belt, have picked up a lot of Hispanics on the side anyway, more than Chamber of Commerce policies mixed with amnesty would have. Morons.) However imperfectly and however quick he was to ditch this in power, Donald Trump… kind of, sort of did this in 2016, and it was enough.

    PS:

    Scowcroft is dead. RIP. Much as I have a dim opinion of the Bush family as a whole, always deeply respected him. People don’t realize how tricky ending the Cold War really was and how much credit guys like Baker and Scowcroft-and to be fair, Bush Senior-deserve for handling that well.

    • Replies: @Diversity Heretic
    @nebulafox

    I'm afraid I must part company on the ending of the Cold War. Once the Warsaw Pact dissolved there was no reason for NATO or the continued stationing of U.S. troops in Europe. Bush I, Baker and Scowcroft could have chosen normal country status for the United States. Instead, they chose empire.

    Bush II could have used 9-11 as the basis for detaining and expelling Muslims. He also chose military adventurism and empire. Both Bushes made extremely bad choices during their presidency and deserve historical excorciation.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    , @Kronos
    @nebulafox

    I thought this was a very well done video.

    https://youtu.be/Q4LejOtYiyw

    I’m a big fan of “The Saker” and his documentation of the US breaking it’s post-Cold War promises to Russia. I’m not sure if that was actually done by Bill Clinton after his 1992 victory but it’s left a mess and bad blood all around.

  33. @Lot
    @AnotherDad

    Agree.

    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.

    I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    Jeb raised and banked $110 million a year before the primary started, and was carefully following W’s 2000 primary playbook. It could have worked.

    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Boethiuss, @Mr. Anon

    >I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    My point exactly. The Democrats were so immersed in their “New America” narrative that they didn’t leave anybody minding the store in states like Pennsylvania or Michigan-and as a political party, they’d been hollowed out on a state and local level outside the big cities. Trump was the only one do what common sense dictated, precisely because he lacked an ideological attachment to the post-1994 orthodoxy which produced Bush II.

    Unfortunately, he didn’t have an attachment really to anything except himself, as should have been obvious from his personal history… but the *chance* was enough for voters to breath in the fresh air disrupting a political scene that had become Brezhnevite in many ways. And yes: hell, if Clinton were elected, we might have ended up getting to a point difficult to come back from with a nuclear armed power.

  34. @nebulafox
    @AnotherDad

    Don't feel too bad, a lot of us made that mistake, even those of us who were nowhere near voting age at the time. I was not the same kind of foreign policy realist I am now when I was in primary school, believe me: I was mad as hell after 9/11 and wanted blood vengeance. Of course, as I got older, I changed my opinions according to the evidence and admitted my mistakes. That's what normal adults do. The Beltway is not populated by normal adults.

    I don't think Dubya was a bad guy-a lot of the men around him, from Powell to Rove, are another matter-but he absolutely no business, zero, being in the White House. Should have stuck to owning the Texas Rangers or something. America still hasn't recovered from his Presidency, and I'm not sure it is going to any time soon. If the MSM's rehabilitation of him because Against Orange Man doesn't illustrate their fundamental bankruptcy, liberals with a shred of honesty left, I'm not sure what will.

    >Shat all over the Republican brand.

    It's deeply hard to envision a President Obama-himself someone who didn't exactly have the resume you'd expect of a Presidential candidate-were it not for Bush II's trainwrecks. Just as Obama's real legacy is Trump, Bush II's real legacy was Obama.

    Replies: @Redneck farmer, @Ben tillman

    America hasn’t recovered from Truman’s presidency, if you look at it clear-eyed enough.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Redneck farmer

    Dubya always said he'd be like Truman. I never expected the MSM to help in a million years, the same one that argued he should resign in November 2008 just so Saint Obama could come in already. ;)

    Really, though? His decision to drop the atomic bombs was the right one, he had the good sense to get George Marshall going, setting up containment laid the stage for a struggle that the USSR had little chance of winning (which a guy like Beria-probably a clinical sociopath, aka, literally unable to take ideology seriously-who was mentally free of Communist orthodoxy that predicated inevitable triumph could see clearly), and intervening in Korea might have helped prevent WWIII because Stalin couldn't go purge Tito in Europe with his backdoor alight. That's nothing to be sneezed at. Plus, had the decency to not take money after he left.

    I don't like the decision for Empire over Republic, but that was one taken long, long before WWII and the Cold War. Wilson's fateful-not in a good way, IMO-decision to intervene in WWI sealed the deal, but the Philippines heralded what was coming.

    , @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder
    @Redneck farmer

    The entire world has yet to recover from Wilson, frankly.

  35. @Wilkey
    @Kronos


    He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.
     
    With the irony being that, apart from judges, most of his major acts (especially the most disastrous ones) were quite liberal - expansion of Medicare, No Child Left Behind, boosting minority home ownership. Hell, even the Iraq War was based on this ridiculous notion that we could turn some shithole quasi-white Muslim country into a forward-looking Western democracy.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Pincher Martin, @Mr. Anon, @Cloudbuster

    He shares with Nixon the distinction of being one of the Presidents most effective at achieving leftist policy goals.

    • Replies: @Hunsdon
    @Cloudbuster

    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon, since, if you examine his actual record, he implemented so many inarguably leftist policies.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @William Badwhite, @Art Deco

  36. What I love is trying to work out the full title from the links at the bottom of the page, to wit

    “George W. Bush is still working on his gra”

    First of all, shouldn’t the “W” be lower case?

    Then

    Grammar?
    Grave?
    Grace and Charm?
    Grape Juice?

    • Replies: @Diversity Inclusion Equality Youth Team
    @The Alarmist

    I immediately thought of grave first lol

  37. @Reg Cæsar
    @AnotherDad

    One reason I vote third-party so often is to feel clean the next morning. It's also the first vote in the next election.

    I even managed to vote for Gerald Ford on a third-party line. That set the precedent.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna

    2000 was easy: Patrick J and Ralph Nader were running.

    That would have been a much better contest than Bush v Gore.

  38. @Anonymous
    Missing context: https://time.com/4493592/george-w-bush-art-book-paintings-veterans/

    https://api.time.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/portraits_final.jpg?w=800&quality=85

    Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin, @Corvinus

    Do copies of Bush’s collection of paint-by-numbers quality works come with vomit bags, or do you have to buy those separately?

    Trillions of dollars borrowed from the Chicoms for a mid-East misadventure that destroyed so many lives directly and indirectly, so a yankee living in Texas could prove he really is a cowboy. Duh-byah should go back to the semi-nude self-portraits he started his career as a painter with. They’re less embarrassing to himself than everything that followed.

    (Are the mouths deformed on all 43’s subjects some subconscious expression of his own inability to articulate satisfactorily?)

    • Troll: Corvinus
  39. @Redneck farmer
    @nebulafox

    America hasn't recovered from Truman's presidency, if you look at it clear-eyed enough.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder

    Dubya always said he’d be like Truman. I never expected the MSM to help in a million years, the same one that argued he should resign in November 2008 just so Saint Obama could come in already. 😉

    Really, though? His decision to drop the atomic bombs was the right one, he had the good sense to get George Marshall going, setting up containment laid the stage for a struggle that the USSR had little chance of winning (which a guy like Beria-probably a clinical sociopath, aka, literally unable to take ideology seriously-who was mentally free of Communist orthodoxy that predicated inevitable triumph could see clearly), and intervening in Korea might have helped prevent WWIII because Stalin couldn’t go purge Tito in Europe with his backdoor alight. That’s nothing to be sneezed at. Plus, had the decency to not take money after he left.

    I don’t like the decision for Empire over Republic, but that was one taken long, long before WWII and the Cold War. Wilson’s fateful-not in a good way, IMO-decision to intervene in WWI sealed the deal, but the Philippines heralded what was coming.

    • Agree: TomSchmidt
  40. @Kronos
    @Wilkey

    I believe it was the GOP Neoconservatives attempt at Bill Clinton’s “Triangulation” strategy. Of course if you try to meet someone halfway over a big ravine on a rickety bridge bad things may happen.

    https://winningprogressivedotcom.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/triangulation-copy.png?w=500

    Replies: @Charlotte, @Sol

    Bill Clinton did some things, like welfare reform, that pleased ordinary people with a conservative bent. It seems to me that Dubya’s efforts at triangulation mainly pleased a subset of elite progressives. For instance, every teacher I knew hated NCLB. The man did not have good political instincts.

  41. @Henry's Cat
    Van Gogh had his sunflowers, Picasso, his Blue Period; the important thing is that Bush's art will continue to develop and deepen. His next project could be a life size portrait of My Pet Goat in the style of George Stubbs or Mark Rothko.

    Replies: @Cortes, @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder

    Restoration of a great work of art must be ahead:

    • Replies: @tyrone
    @Cortes

    ADMIT IT! you love that painting now ! real spirit of the age stuff………….it works on so many levels.

  42. @Henry's Cat
    Van Gogh had his sunflowers, Picasso, his Blue Period; the important thing is that Bush's art will continue to develop and deepen. His next project could be a life size portrait of My Pet Goat in the style of George Stubbs or Mark Rothko.

    Replies: @Cortes, @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder

    His next project could be a life size portrait of My Pet Goat in the style of George Stubbs or Mark Rothko.

    The choice you present is just a tad manichean..

  43. @Redneck farmer
    @nebulafox

    America hasn't recovered from Truman's presidency, if you look at it clear-eyed enough.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Mike Pierson, Davenport Rector, Midfielder

    The entire world has yet to recover from Wilson, frankly.

    • Agree: TomSchmidt
    • Disagree: Corvinus
  44. @Kronos
    @Wilkey

    I believe it was the GOP Neoconservatives attempt at Bill Clinton’s “Triangulation” strategy. Of course if you try to meet someone halfway over a big ravine on a rickety bridge bad things may happen.

    https://winningprogressivedotcom.files.wordpress.com/2017/01/triangulation-copy.png?w=500

    Replies: @Charlotte, @Sol

    Jeb is retired for good? I hope he doesn’t return in 2024.

    • Agree: Kronos
    • Replies: @tyrone
    @Sol

    Not a fan of zombies I see.

    Replies: @Kronos

  45. I thought Shithead was still making funny videos about WMDs –

  46. Michelle gets a signed copy …..that should cheer her up.

  47. @Cortes
    @Henry's Cat

    Restoration of a great work of art must be ahead:

    https://geoffreyjwright.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/montage-ecce-homo-borja.jpg

    Replies: @tyrone

    ADMIT IT! you love that painting now ! real spirit of the age stuff………….it works on so many levels.

  48. @Sol
    @Kronos

    Jeb is retired for good? I hope he doesn't return in 2024.

    Replies: @tyrone

    Not a fan of zombies I see.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @tyrone

    Zombie Reagan was overrated...

    https://youtu.be/SoCQO90-0zQ

    https://youtu.be/WtteTQwzk7Q

  49. In my opinion George W. Bush is the worst potus of my lifetime, I’m 42. Obama is preferable.

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    @Ed

    Yes. There's no question about that. People who complain about Trump to me as the worst President ever then get to defend W. They really cannot.

  50. Future trivia question: Which famous painter of the 21st century was previously one of the last presidents of the United States? /wink

  51. @Cloudbuster
    @Wilkey

    He shares with Nixon the distinction of being one of the Presidents most effective at achieving leftist policy goals.

    Replies: @Hunsdon

    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon, since, if you examine his actual record, he implemented so many inarguably leftist policies.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Hunsdon

    Nixon was largely indifferent to domestic policy and handed it off to John Ehrlichman, who was a Seattle-style Republican with moderately liberal views. Nixon's instinctual domestic tendencies mostly leaned toward heterodox centrism-not to be confused with "moderate"-so the arrangement worked out fine.

    Always found it amusing how the media lumped him and Haldeman together as Siamese twins. The two were really very different, both as personalities and as ideological influences. In many respects, they were rivals.

    , @William Badwhite
    @Hunsdon


    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon
     
    Leftists in the know hate Nixon because of Nixon's aggressive pursuit of the communist Alger Hiss while on the House Unamerican Activities Committee. Most of the other leftists (like my fat brain dead cousin) hated him because they were told to.
    , @Art Deco
    @Hunsdon

    1. Nixon was awkward. High school never ends for some people.

    2. The Nixon family exemplified a fairly standard conception of domestic standards and practices, as did the Agnews. Everything about them suggested they were at home with everyday American life. (Three of the Agnew kids had problems and living, but in only one case did these hit the papers)

    3. Agnew in particular was an acidulous critic of obnoxious college students and feral slum bums. No excuses offered or accepted.

    4. Nixon was always quite clear that there were boundaries to legitimate discourse in this country and that certain people should be debarred from public employment, and that included public higher education. If Nixon had his druthers, any Howard Zinn working for a public institution would have been put out on the curb. Liberals are quite content to see conservatives run out of higher education (while lying to themselves and others about what is happening), but running red-haze twits out is beyond the pale.

  52. @Mr. Blank
    As they've gotten older, it's become increasingly clear to me that neither one of the Bush brothers — Dubya and Jeb — ever cared that much for politics. Dubya was supposed to be a dummy, but in hindsight it seems more and more like he wasn't dumb — just uninterested in Washington minutiae. He was on autopilot throughout his presidency not because he was stupid, but because he was bored. Remember on one of his vacations during his presidency, he read Albert Camus's "The Stranger?" That doesn't seem like the choice of a guy who spends a lot of his waking life thinking about Beltway issues.

    Both the younger Bushes seem like they would have been much happier if they had been left alone to explore other interests, instead of being pushed into joining the family dynasty.

    America, too, would probably have been much happier. As a general rule, it doesn't seem like America has gotten a whole lot out good out of of politicians who were forced into politics by the egos of their parents.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    I’m surprised he read Camus. I’d have thought Tom Clancy or John Grisham would be more to his liking, if he read at all.

    It was probably a lame attempt to make him appear deeper than he actually was.

  53. Lotta portraits of dudes in that studio pic. Seems kinda gay.

  54. The interesting thing about Bush is that he was elected to important public offices four times, yet he seems to be a bubble-dweller with no real rapport with (or respect for) his supposed constituency. Over the last seven years, one instance after another of abusive behavior by the Democratic Party and the permanent government has come to light (starting with Lois Lerner and the IRS scandal) and they said not one bloody thing that anyone outside a trade association audience paying them six-figure sums for confidential droning would know anything about. They finally emerge and it’s to throw darts at the Republican presidential candidate and give us another installment of how little regard they have for the native-born population. A previous installment was reviewed here.

    https://vdare.com/articles/john-derbyshire-concludes-jeb-bush-just-doesn-t-like-americans-very-much

    And, for some bizarre reason, they welcomed Bill Clinton into their circle of friends. Why would anyone want the Clintons around?

    • Thanks: Johann Ricke
  55. He isn’t even painting those generic portraits. Cleanest looking painter Ive ever seen, and of course his brush is safely in the top corner of a completed work.

    “Come onnnn, mannnnn”

    • Agree: Cortes
  56. @AnotherDad
    @Reg Cæsar

    Just more confirmation of his utter, arrogant POSness.

    I'm a deeply embarassed that i voted for this turd--twice. (On the general principle of voting against the people who openly want to kill me.)

    W did terrible damage to America, the West. Shat all over the Republican brand. Making it harder for actual nation preserving conservatives to win. (Though i guess he also shat all over his own crew's image/popularity making Trump possible.)

    Terrible man. Who still does not seemingly have any understanding of why he's a disloyal POS.

    Anyway my error, my failure.

    Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.

    Never again!

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @nebulafox, @JosephB, @Lot, @Diversity Heretic

    I have to go even further in self-flagellation and admit that I contributed money to his first campaign. But, like you, I’ve regretted my support of him over and over.

    • Replies: @Not Only Wrathful
    @Diversity Heretic

    Ha, I have you beat.

    As an admittedly literal child, I (precociously) fully supported the Iraq war on the basis that it'd be absurdly racist to think that Iraqis wouldn't do like the Germans and Japanese did after WW2 and create incredible world beating economies and live as part of the super friends' group.

    Only this would be better as the Iraqis would obviously be cognizant of the German and Japanese examples and would immediately throw down their arms as soon as we did them the favour of invading.

    I would also have questioned whether your assumptions were racist if you disagreed.

    To be fair to me, I wasn't wholly wrong on that last part. After all, other than the Iraqis not being made of the same stuff as the Germans and Japanese, what explains their orgy of murdering each other, tremendous corruption and absolute failure since?

    Anti-racism was my motivating force in supporting the Iraq war, as it was for many others. Amazing how that is conveniently forgotten about.

    Replies: @anon

  57. “George W. Bush Still Working on His Grand Strategy of Invade the World / Invite the World”

    Yet another false premise, Mr. Sailer. Meanwhile, other, more important news is conveniently escaping your alleged pattern recognition capabilities.

    From someone you know…Motor Sich’s technology is *specifically* technology the U.S. government says it doesn’t want Russia or China to have. But Prince’s Chinese-backed company was fine, to Trump. Now he says he’s blocking TikTok to protect U.S. national security from China. No—it doesn’t add up.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/security-contractor-erik-prince-is-in-talks-to-acquire-ukraines-motor-sich-11572949809

    • Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @Corvinus

    Oh, good, you're here.

    Replies: @Corvinus

  58. @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    Yeah. As much as Dubya deserves the thrashing that he's getting here, Rove arguably did even more damage to the party specifically. The self-defeating 1994 forever mental fantasy land that the GOP currently inhabits is largely his doing: he did a lot to purge ideological objectors ranging from Scowcroft to Perot to Buchanan who were pointing out how insane GOP orthodoxy was becoming in everything from foreign relations to trade.

    Among other things, he's the guy who pioneered the "Open Borders Will Lead To Hispanics Creating Permanent Republican Majority" fantasy. To be fair to Dubya and Rove, being governor of Texas in the 1990s made this a bit more plausible, but to take that as applying to the whole country shows that far from being a political genius, Karl Rove was actually a complete idiot who ignored the very obvious reality that the survival of the GOP in the face of changing demographics would require an appeal to the Rust Belt-and thus, a turn away from the constant worship of big business. (Which would have, alongside picking up the Rust Belt, have picked up a lot of Hispanics on the side anyway, more than Chamber of Commerce policies mixed with amnesty would have. Morons.) However imperfectly and however quick he was to ditch this in power, Donald Trump... kind of, sort of did this in 2016, and it was enough.

    PS:

    Scowcroft is dead. RIP. Much as I have a dim opinion of the Bush family as a whole, always deeply respected him. People don't realize how tricky ending the Cold War really was and how much credit guys like Baker and Scowcroft-and to be fair, Bush Senior-deserve for handling that well.

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic, @Kronos

    I’m afraid I must part company on the ending of the Cold War. Once the Warsaw Pact dissolved there was no reason for NATO or the continued stationing of U.S. troops in Europe. Bush I, Baker and Scowcroft could have chosen normal country status for the United States. Instead, they chose empire.

    Bush II could have used 9-11 as the basis for detaining and expelling Muslims. He also chose military adventurism and empire. Both Bushes made extremely bad choices during their presidency and deserve historical excorciation.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Diversity Heretic

    Bush I, Baker and Scowcroft could have chosen normal country status for the United States. Instead, they chose empire.

    There is no empire, and there never was. While we're at it, the ratio of military expenditure to domestic product declined almost without interruption over the period running from 1985 to 2000. American military billets in Europe have been declining for 50 years.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  59. @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    Yeah. As much as Dubya deserves the thrashing that he's getting here, Rove arguably did even more damage to the party specifically. The self-defeating 1994 forever mental fantasy land that the GOP currently inhabits is largely his doing: he did a lot to purge ideological objectors ranging from Scowcroft to Perot to Buchanan who were pointing out how insane GOP orthodoxy was becoming in everything from foreign relations to trade.

    Among other things, he's the guy who pioneered the "Open Borders Will Lead To Hispanics Creating Permanent Republican Majority" fantasy. To be fair to Dubya and Rove, being governor of Texas in the 1990s made this a bit more plausible, but to take that as applying to the whole country shows that far from being a political genius, Karl Rove was actually a complete idiot who ignored the very obvious reality that the survival of the GOP in the face of changing demographics would require an appeal to the Rust Belt-and thus, a turn away from the constant worship of big business. (Which would have, alongside picking up the Rust Belt, have picked up a lot of Hispanics on the side anyway, more than Chamber of Commerce policies mixed with amnesty would have. Morons.) However imperfectly and however quick he was to ditch this in power, Donald Trump... kind of, sort of did this in 2016, and it was enough.

    PS:

    Scowcroft is dead. RIP. Much as I have a dim opinion of the Bush family as a whole, always deeply respected him. People don't realize how tricky ending the Cold War really was and how much credit guys like Baker and Scowcroft-and to be fair, Bush Senior-deserve for handling that well.

    Replies: @Diversity Heretic, @Kronos

    I thought this was a very well done video.

    I’m a big fan of “The Saker” and his documentation of the US breaking it’s post-Cold War promises to Russia. I’m not sure if that was actually done by Bill Clinton after his 1992 victory but it’s left a mess and bad blood all around.

  60. When will Dubya release his portrait of the Dancing Israelis?

    • Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    Perhaps more importantly, we must ask, when will he urge his social friends to release Geronimo's skull to the Apache?

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/29265600/ns/us_news-life/t/geronimos-kin-sue-skull-bones

    Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin

  61. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    When will Dubya release his portrait of the Dancing Israelis?

    http://www.renegadetribune.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/1-Five_Dancing_Israelis_TV.jpg

    Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    Perhaps more importantly, we must ask, when will he urge his social friends to release Geronimo’s skull to the Apache?

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/29265600/ns/us_news-life/t/geronimos-kin-sue-skull-bones

    • Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin
    @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    The Apaches could demonstrate their greatness and magninimity by allowing S&B to keep Geronimo's skull in exchange for 41's.

  62. @Corvinus
    "George W. Bush Still Working on His Grand Strategy of Invade the World / Invite the World"

    Yet another false premise, Mr. Sailer. Meanwhile, other, more important news is conveniently escaping your alleged pattern recognition capabilities.

    From someone you know...Motor Sich's technology is *specifically* technology the U.S. government says it doesn't want Russia or China to have. But Prince's Chinese-backed company was fine, to Trump. Now he says he's blocking TikTok to protect U.S. national security from China. No—it doesn't add up.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/security-contractor-erik-prince-is-in-talks-to-acquire-ukraines-motor-sich-11572949809

    Replies: @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    Oh, good, you’re here.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    I take it that your response is an admittance that you cannot muster up a coherent rebuttal to the source I provided.

  63. People like George Bush seriously make everyone want to give up on life

    If that’s a former President….

    What’s the point?

    Obviously Intelligence Means Nothing To Success

  64. I would literally vote for the abolition of the GOP and monoparty Soviet-style rule than I would vote for a George W. Bush or anything remotely resembling him again.

  65. @Lot
    @AnotherDad

    Agree.

    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.

    I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    Jeb raised and banked $110 million a year before the primary started, and was carefully following W’s 2000 primary playbook. It could have worked.

    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Boethiuss, @Mr. Anon

    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.

    I’m not having this, on a couple of levels. I’m sure POTUS Hillary could have replaced Justice Scalia, but I very much doubt if she could have gotten amnesty, and in fact she might not have tried that hard for it.

    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Many Trump supporters tend to want to restrict immigration at any cost. But the way it’s turned out, our support for Trump has cost us way more than whatever benefit we’ve gotten from Trump’s immigration policy. I’d even venture that it’s cost us more than whatever benefit we’d get if Trump actually were able to meaningfully curtail immigration, which of course he can’t.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    • Agree: Alexander Turok
    • Replies: @AnotherDad
    @Boethiuss


    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    ...

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.
     

    And you continue to be oblivious.

    Immigration restriction is basically the only policy that does matter.

    A hint: You're on a HBD blog.

    Replies: @Boethiuss, @Alexander Turok

    , @Ben tillman
    @Boethiuss


    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that.
     
    There is no “price tag”. Immigration restriction is a financial bonanza. And how has our support for Trump cost us anything?

    Replies: @Boethiuss

    , @anon
    @Boethiuss

    Though it was unintentional, Trump has caused immigration to completely stop in 2020 and will be greatly reduced,if it happens at all, next year. There are no visas being issued by embassies and international travel has shut down. Whatever one may think of in terms of Covid, Trump has used it to advance many good policies. If he is reelected in, we might see negligible immigration next 4 years.

    , @ATBOTL
    @Boethiuss

    Where is this gibberish coming from? Immigration restriction is the goal. Nothing else matters. No cost is too high. Looks like shills are now trying to move the dissident right away from opposing immigration.

    Replies: @Boethiuss

  66. Anonymous[341] • Disclaimer says:

    This election reminds me of 2004. Bush fooled a lot of retireds into thinking he was some kind of hero for middle America. “The media HATES Bush, this PROVES he’s one of us.” What’s different is that those people, they all called themselves Republicans. This time, the Trumper Armada thinks it’s something else. They don’t see that the rhetoric is identical, almost word-for-word, from what Bush supporters used in 2004.

  67. @Diversity Heretic
    @nebulafox

    I'm afraid I must part company on the ending of the Cold War. Once the Warsaw Pact dissolved there was no reason for NATO or the continued stationing of U.S. troops in Europe. Bush I, Baker and Scowcroft could have chosen normal country status for the United States. Instead, they chose empire.

    Bush II could have used 9-11 as the basis for detaining and expelling Muslims. He also chose military adventurism and empire. Both Bushes made extremely bad choices during their presidency and deserve historical excorciation.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    Bush I, Baker and Scowcroft could have chosen normal country status for the United States. Instead, they chose empire.

    There is no empire, and there never was. While we’re at it, the ratio of military expenditure to domestic product declined almost without interruption over the period running from 1985 to 2000. American military billets in Europe have been declining for 50 years.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco


    There is no empire, and there never was. While we’re at it, the ratio of military expenditure to domestic product declined almost without interruption over the period running from 1985 to 2000. American military billets in Europe have been declining for 50 years.
     
    But there still are american military billets in Europe - after 75 years. To say nothing of the vast military infrastructure we maintain elsewhere. And the many embassies full of arrogant busy-bodies who push the "American Way of Life" (i.e. degeneracy) on countries around the globe. Of course there is an empire. Only a smug, prating idiot like you is incapable of noticing it.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  68. anon[285] • Disclaimer says:
    @Impolitic
    Reagan's choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history. Perhaps Biden's pick will turn out to be another.

    Replies: @anon, @Pater, @prime noticer, @Sparkon

    Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history.

    For some people I know, that “choice” was their introduction to the concept of the Deep State. G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time. He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was. In an early 1980 campaign speech in front of Republican Party donors, Bush suddenly pulled a small revolver out of his pocket and began raving about how the US needs to “ban guns like these!”. He was elected in 1988 in part due to “No New Taxes” and “No New Gun Laws” then proceeded to break both these slogans. The Deep State may be canny and clever but its sock puppets are not always very smart.

    In the 90 – 92 time frame his genius Karl Rove managed to alienate Vermont gun owners with a totally unsuitable candidate, then told Vermonters “You have no one else to vote for! Where you gonna go?” with the result that Socialist Sanders went to Washington…where he was reliably anti immigration and neutral to pro on guns…demonstrating that yeah, Vermont voters did have somewhere else to go. And so? Both Rove and Bush apparently cannot learn from experience, either. Although GW had some limited ability to learn from Daddy’s gun debacle.

    Then recently we find out G H W Bush was handsy with all the girls around him for decades. Like Biden, only more subtle and below the waist. When was the last time anyone remotely close to normal ran for President?

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @anon

    G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time.

    For one year. Nixon and Ford used him as a utility man, putting him in four different posts over a period of six years.


    He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was.

    About 1.4 million people were in Dallas or Tarrant County that day, among them people on business trips. I gather you expected George Bush to be a man of Kantian discipline and maintain all of his appointment diaries filed away for decades. Does he need to keep boxes of receipts too?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Sparkon

  69. On 9/11 Bush cowered in fear then he got turned by the nixon re-tread neo-cons and contributed vastly to the current state of affairs.
    He also must have increased muslim immigration tenfold after 9/11 – that’ll show them!
    A dry drunk and a disgrace to America and the presidency.

    • Agree: Kolya Krassotkin
  70. George W. Bush was a horrible President. He was also the only possible route for White people. As were his policies.

    After Bush, in 2008, Dems/Media were not demanding abolishing the Police. Cities were not in flames. The NFAC people were not marching around beating up White motorists. Anti Fa and BLM were not toppling statues. Catholic Churches were not vandalized, or set aflame (during Mass) and statues of Jesus and Mary were not destroyed. Nor were Black people demanding the destruction of said statues. After Bush, the Dems did not abolish the Electoral College. Nor did they nuke the filibuster. After Bush, safe Republican Seats in Kentucky and South Carolina held by bad Senators who were mostly indifferent to mildly hostile to White interests were not replaced by hard core get Whitey BLACK Senators with an agenda for punishment of Whites particularly White men. After Bush there was no call for Reparations, and no legalization of Street Reparations. After Bush the laws were not changed to allow Black criminals to avoid being charged with anything. After Bush we did not have an anti-White frenzy that permeates all levels of society.

    [MORE]

    Trump makes George W. Bush look like George Washington, as he has enraged the centers of power without actually doing anything.

    Democrats are now talking about what had been a fringe position of Bill Ayers, permanent “labor camps” for White men — and there is massive purge, in Hollywood, in the media, in corporate offices, in the police of White men. THAT is Trump’s legacy.

    And the MONUMENTAL ERROR Steve and most of the commentors here make is that VOTING MATTERS. It DOES NOT.

    Power, real power, does not lie in the Presidency. The President can provoke the REAL POWER or he can make peace with it, but he himself does not wield real power. THAT POWER resides in:
    A. The FBI, as we have seen
    B. The Career Justice Department Officials
    C. The Career Intelligence officials including but not limited to the CIA
    D. The Media and powerful figures in the Media
    E. Corporate Oligarchs like Bezos, Gates, Buffett, and various hedge fund barons like Soros
    F. Corporate HR departments which can fire even founders who own the company
    G. Universities and academics
    H. Medical professionals who are profoundly hostile to ordinary White people being mostly non-White themselves
    I. The Joint Chiefs of Staff (who threatened to remove Trump after his walk to the Church in Lafayette Park) and the Colonels and Commanders who report to them directly.
    J. Hollywood and social media influencers and other junk celebrities
    K. Feminists who wield enormous influence at corporations, government, and among White women.
    L. Big City mayors who can set national policy more easily than Governors as they have direct control over much of the population
    M. Black activists and intellectuals who Whites bend the knee to by instinct.
    N. White women as a group.

    NOTHING these power centers oppose can get done. Seen any giant wall built lately? Of course not. The Joint Chiefs oppose it, so do everyone else listed above. They would never permit it. Indeed MOAR IMMIGRATION like Bush is what ALL the power centers want.*

    BUSH WAS BETTER. He did not unduly antagonize White women. There was no Pussy Hat of Rage March on Washington during his Presidency. White women were not massively in favor of something like Black Lives Matter as they are now. White women were not reflexively anti-White.

    *There is a GIANT and ever expanding permanent Government and Corporate bureaucracy that is rewarded for every more anti-White action they take and so gets ever more anti-White by the day. Christopher Caldwell noted that well. And in response the move by the above power centers to prevent the US from being the Congo is to turn it into Mexico. With Mass Mexican/Central American immigration. That’s bad. But its not Congo bad. Its what the power centers above want — black insurance.

    Yes Bush sucked. He got into two wars he had no intention of winning, just as Truman had no intention of winning in Korea (for fear of global nuclear war with Stalin). Bush did not want to win as he feared provoking a global Jihad with Muslims. Entering a war to “manage” it has been a disaster since Korea and Vietnam but is built into the DNA of the US Military and Political Leadership. Bush was not astute enough to recognize this like Reagan and take only short, sharp, guaranteed wins like Grenada. So instead of White men’s status rising as victors they declined as victims. But Bush for all his faults did not stimulate Dems into openly talking about putting people like you and me in forced labor camps to be worked to death making Nikes. He did not manage to create a total wipeout of Senate Republicans who while bad will be replaced by far worse, nor get a wipeout of all Republican Governors. Bush made peace with the power centers and did not provoke them much. He tried to stuff money into people’s pockets to keep non-Whites who hate us from contemplating genocide. It did not work but bought us some time. All Trump did was fire up people who view Pol Pot as a role model.

    • Troll: Kolya Krassotkin
  71. Will he paint portraits of all the dead Iraqis?

  72. @Art Deco
    @Diversity Heretic

    Bush I, Baker and Scowcroft could have chosen normal country status for the United States. Instead, they chose empire.

    There is no empire, and there never was. While we're at it, the ratio of military expenditure to domestic product declined almost without interruption over the period running from 1985 to 2000. American military billets in Europe have been declining for 50 years.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    There is no empire, and there never was. While we’re at it, the ratio of military expenditure to domestic product declined almost without interruption over the period running from 1985 to 2000. American military billets in Europe have been declining for 50 years.

    But there still are american military billets in Europe – after 75 years. To say nothing of the vast military infrastructure we maintain elsewhere. And the many embassies full of arrogant busy-bodies who push the “American Way of Life” (i.e. degeneracy) on countries around the globe. Of course there is an empire. Only a smug, prating idiot like you is incapable of noticing it.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    And the many embassies full of arrogant busy-bodies who push the “American Way of Life” (

    Mostly paper pushers.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  73. @Lot
    @AnotherDad

    Agree.

    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.

    I don’t think anyone else but Trump could have won the general in 2016, because the rest had voluntarily smeared themselves in W’s putridness.

    Jeb raised and banked $110 million a year before the primary started, and was carefully following W’s 2000 primary playbook. It could have worked.

    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @Boethiuss, @Mr. Anon

    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.

    Then he went and hired Mattis, Abrams, Bolton, Pompeo, and any number of other people who either served in the Bush II administration or would have been right at home there.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @Mr. Anon

    Pompeo runs the neocon desk in the Blumpft! administration. Say what you will about the Obama, Rice, Kerry foreign policy: after they rid themselves of Mother of Darkness Hillary they pretty much sidelined the neoconservative scumbags.

  74. @Impolitic
    Reagan's choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history. Perhaps Biden's pick will turn out to be another.

    Replies: @anon, @Pater, @prime noticer, @Sparkon

    Poppy was about as establishment/country-club republican as it gets and besides minus Bush Sr on the veep ticket his CIA buddies wouldn’t have undermined President Carter’s Iran hostage initiative which was a big factor in the election

  75. @Diversity Heretic
    @AnotherDad

    I have to go even further in self-flagellation and admit that I contributed money to his first campaign. But, like you, I've regretted my support of him over and over.

    Replies: @Not Only Wrathful

    Ha, I have you beat.

    As an admittedly literal child, I (precociously) fully supported the Iraq war on the basis that it’d be absurdly racist to think that Iraqis wouldn’t do like the Germans and Japanese did after WW2 and create incredible world beating economies and live as part of the super friends’ group.

    Only this would be better as the Iraqis would obviously be cognizant of the German and Japanese examples and would immediately throw down their arms as soon as we did them the favour of invading.

    I would also have questioned whether your assumptions were racist if you disagreed.

    To be fair to me, I wasn’t wholly wrong on that last part. After all, other than the Iraqis not being made of the same stuff as the Germans and Japanese, what explains their orgy of murdering each other, tremendous corruption and absolute failure since?

    Anti-racism was my motivating force in supporting the Iraq war, as it was for many others. Amazing how that is conveniently forgotten about.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Not Only Wrathful

    As an admittedly literal child, I (precociously) fully supported the Iraq war on the basis that it’d be absurdly racist to think that Iraqis wouldn’t do like the Germans and Japanese did after WW2 and create incredible world beating economies and live as part of the super friends’ group.

    Legit. I used to know really old guys, like WW II guys, who took the same position. Makes total sense in the Blank Slate universe where most of us grew up. Except for that pesky "reality" thing.

    When the various tribes of Mesopotamia failed to immediately form a Federal republic complete with Vermont town meetings and bi-cameral provincial assemblies...did you find yourself reconsidering some premises?

    Did you know anyone who went to the sandbox as a trigger puller? I did / do. What they told me totally iced my blank slate delusions.

    Replies: @Not Only Wrathful

  76. @anon
    @Impolitic

    Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history.

    For some people I know, that "choice" was their introduction to the concept of the Deep State. G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time. He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was. In an early 1980 campaign speech in front of Republican Party donors, Bush suddenly pulled a small revolver out of his pocket and began raving about how the US needs to "ban guns like these!". He was elected in 1988 in part due to "No New Taxes" and "No New Gun Laws" then proceeded to break both these slogans. The Deep State may be canny and clever but its sock puppets are not always very smart.

    In the 90 - 92 time frame his genius Karl Rove managed to alienate Vermont gun owners with a totally unsuitable candidate, then told Vermonters "You have no one else to vote for! Where you gonna go?" with the result that Socialist Sanders went to Washington...where he was reliably anti immigration and neutral to pro on guns...demonstrating that yeah, Vermont voters did have somewhere else to go. And so? Both Rove and Bush apparently cannot learn from experience, either. Although GW had some limited ability to learn from Daddy's gun debacle.

    Then recently we find out G H W Bush was handsy with all the girls around him for decades. Like Biden, only more subtle and below the waist. When was the last time anyone remotely close to normal ran for President?

    Replies: @Art Deco

    G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time.

    For one year. Nixon and Ford used him as a utility man, putting him in four different posts over a period of six years.

    He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was.

    About 1.4 million people were in Dallas or Tarrant County that day, among them people on business trips. I gather you expected George Bush to be a man of Kantian discipline and maintain all of his appointment diaries filed away for decades. Does he need to keep boxes of receipts too?

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @Art Deco

    You and Steve are the last two Americans who accept the Warren Commission narrative.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @nebulafox

    , @Sparkon
    @Art Deco

    Ask any adult American alive at the time what they were doing when they learned Pres. Kennedy had been assassinated, and most will give you a detailed account of where they were, what they were doing, and how they first learned of the assassination.

    George and Barbara Bush were registered at a Dallas hotel on Nov. 22, 1963, but George apparently couldn't remember where he was at the time, or what the heck he was doing. There are plenty of details about that for another time.

    But anyway, how does a guy who was head of the CIA for just one year get the CIA's headquarters named after himself?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @sayless

  77. @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco


    There is no empire, and there never was. While we’re at it, the ratio of military expenditure to domestic product declined almost without interruption over the period running from 1985 to 2000. American military billets in Europe have been declining for 50 years.
     
    But there still are american military billets in Europe - after 75 years. To say nothing of the vast military infrastructure we maintain elsewhere. And the many embassies full of arrogant busy-bodies who push the "American Way of Life" (i.e. degeneracy) on countries around the globe. Of course there is an empire. Only a smug, prating idiot like you is incapable of noticing it.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    And the many embassies full of arrogant busy-bodies who push the “American Way of Life” (

    Mostly paper pushers.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco


    Mostly paper pushers.
     
    Sure, paper pushers who destablize nations and help to foment civil wars. Paper pushers who threated economic sanctions against sovereign nations unless they adopt the LGTB agenda.

    But don't worry, I have no doubt but that you yourself are an ineffectual paper-pusher.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  78. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan

    Perhaps more importantly, we must ask, when will he urge his social friends to release Geronimo's skull to the Apache?

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/29265600/ns/us_news-life/t/geronimos-kin-sue-skull-bones

    Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin

    The Apaches could demonstrate their greatness and magninimity by allowing S&B to keep Geronimo’s skull in exchange for 41’s.

  79. @Stahlhelm
    My family has been in this country for 350 years, and I fought in his stupid war in Iraq, and came out disabled. Guess he won’t do a painting of me, the worthless son of a bitch...

    Replies: @Diversity Inclusion Equality Youth Team

    Thank you for your service, and personal sacrifice.
    – a multiple generation military family.

  80. @Buzz Mohawk
    His has been the longest, most publicized effort to perfect freshman art major portraiture as a genre.

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb

    “freshman art major”

    Throw your shade, money-man. The sad face portraits produced by the grandson of Alistair Crowley fetch Thomas Kinkade prices in the Abramovic circle.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @SunBakedSuburb

    I prefer dogs playing poker.

    https://cdn.wallpapersafari.com/9/1/y8YHJ0.jpg

  81. @tyrone
    @Sol

    Not a fan of zombies I see.

    Replies: @Kronos

    Zombie Reagan was overrated…

  82. @Art Deco
    @anon

    G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time.

    For one year. Nixon and Ford used him as a utility man, putting him in four different posts over a period of six years.


    He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was.

    About 1.4 million people were in Dallas or Tarrant County that day, among them people on business trips. I gather you expected George Bush to be a man of Kantian discipline and maintain all of his appointment diaries filed away for decades. Does he need to keep boxes of receipts too?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Sparkon

    You and Steve are the last two Americans who accept the Warren Commission narrative.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @SunBakedSuburb

    In your imagination only. I'm not a buff and off the top of my head I can think of three who have vigorously debunked the entire body of conspirazoid literature: Gerald Posner, John McAdams, and the late Vincent Bugliosi.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    , @nebulafox
    @SunBakedSuburb

    Why are people so averse to believing that one angry, ideologically motivated young loser with a gun really can shake history? Just look at Gavrilo Princip.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt

  83. @The Alarmist
    What I love is trying to work out the full title from the links at the bottom of the page, to wit

    "George W. Bush is still working on his gra"

    First of all, shouldn't the "W" be lower case?

    Then

    Grammar?
    Grave?
    Grace and Charm?
    Grape Juice?

    Replies: @Diversity Inclusion Equality Youth Team

    I immediately thought of grave first lol

  84. @Mr. Anon
    @Lot


    Trump’s first moment of greatness was attacking W. Nobody should forget that even in 2015, that was extremely taboo in the GOP establishment.
     
    Then he went and hired Mattis, Abrams, Bolton, Pompeo, and any number of other people who either served in the Bush II administration or would have been right at home there.

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb

    Pompeo runs the neocon desk in the Blumpft! administration. Say what you will about the Obama, Rice, Kerry foreign policy: after they rid themselves of Mother of Darkness Hillary they pretty much sidelined the neoconservative scumbags.

  85. Voted for W in 2000. Watched him get captured by the neocon crowd & then he started yapping for amnesty. Did not vote for him in 2004 or any other republican until Trump in 2016.

  86. @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    And the many embassies full of arrogant busy-bodies who push the “American Way of Life” (

    Mostly paper pushers.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Mostly paper pushers.

    Sure, paper pushers who destablize nations and help to foment civil wars. Paper pushers who threated economic sanctions against sovereign nations unless they adopt the LGTB agenda.

    But don’t worry, I have no doubt but that you yourself are an ineffectual paper-pusher.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    Sure, paper pushers who destablize nations and help to foment civil wars.

    You'd have a hard time locating a foreign country 'destabilized' by Foreign Service officers, much less one where a civil war was manufactured by them. These boards are shot through with people who sound like the bozos who founded the Institute for Policy Studies (but garnish that discourse with a hatred of blacks and Jews).

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  87. @Art Deco
    @anon

    G H W Bush was head of the CIA for a time.

    For one year. Nixon and Ford used him as a utility man, putting him in four different posts over a period of six years.


    He was in Dallas, Texas on the day Kennedy was assassinated but no one apparently can account for exactly where he was.

    About 1.4 million people were in Dallas or Tarrant County that day, among them people on business trips. I gather you expected George Bush to be a man of Kantian discipline and maintain all of his appointment diaries filed away for decades. Does he need to keep boxes of receipts too?

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @Sparkon

    Ask any adult American alive at the time what they were doing when they learned Pres. Kennedy had been assassinated, and most will give you a detailed account of where they were, what they were doing, and how they first learned of the assassination.

    George and Barbara Bush were registered at a Dallas hotel on Nov. 22, 1963, but George apparently couldn’t remember where he was at the time, or what the heck he was doing. There are plenty of details about that for another time.

    But anyway, how does a guy who was head of the CIA for just one year get the CIA’s headquarters named after himself?

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Sparkon

    There is a fair amount of evidence that George H.W. Bush's offshore oil company in Mexico provided logistical support for the Bay of Pigs landing.

    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Sparkon

    , @sayless
    @Sparkon

    George H. W. said he couldn't remember. That simply isn't credible. Especially since his father was a senator.

    Not speculating on why he was lying. But he was certainly lying--say, did anyone ever ask Barbara Bush where she was, what she was doing on that day?

    Art Deco is strangely passionate on this subject.

    Replies: @dcthrowback, @flyingtiger

  88. @Anonymous
    Missing context: https://time.com/4493592/george-w-bush-art-book-paintings-veterans/

    https://api.time.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/portraits_final.jpg?w=800&quality=85

    Replies: @Kolya Krassotkin, @Corvinus

    Now why would Mr. Sailor want to admit that he purposely ignored that context or neglected to acknowledge that context in his hit piece?

  89. @Kronos
    Of course George W. Bush helped pour gasoline on the fire in terms of the world’s most important graph.

    https://youtu.be/MxbT11QlCe8

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President%27s_Emergency_Plan_for_AIDS_Relief

    https://www.takimag.com/wp-content/uploads/The-Worlds-Most-Important-Graph-2020-1-768x580.png

    That man (and administration) really was a walking disaster. His mortgage polices on the Great Recession, the Iraq/Afghanistan War, you name it and he made it worse. He was also the president smug cultural Marxist teachers trained the little “wokelings” to hate during the 2000s. Bush II sure made it easy for them.

    Replies: @Wilkey, @Corvinus

    Decidedly better than Trump.

  90. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    @Corvinus

    Oh, good, you're here.

    Replies: @Corvinus

    I take it that your response is an admittance that you cannot muster up a coherent rebuttal to the source I provided.

  91. @SunBakedSuburb
    @Buzz Mohawk

    "freshman art major"

    Throw your shade, money-man. The sad face portraits produced by the grandson of Alistair Crowley fetch Thomas Kinkade prices in the Abramovic circle.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

    I prefer dogs playing poker.

  92. @SunBakedSuburb
    @Art Deco

    You and Steve are the last two Americans who accept the Warren Commission narrative.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @nebulafox

    In your imagination only. I’m not a buff and off the top of my head I can think of three who have vigorously debunked the entire body of conspirazoid literature: Gerald Posner, John McAdams, and the late Vincent Bugliosi.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco

    He meant "intelligent Americans" - which you are clearly not.

  93. @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco


    Mostly paper pushers.
     
    Sure, paper pushers who destablize nations and help to foment civil wars. Paper pushers who threated economic sanctions against sovereign nations unless they adopt the LGTB agenda.

    But don't worry, I have no doubt but that you yourself are an ineffectual paper-pusher.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    Sure, paper pushers who destablize nations and help to foment civil wars.

    You’d have a hard time locating a foreign country ‘destabilized’ by Foreign Service officers, much less one where a civil war was manufactured by them. These boards are shot through with people who sound like the bozos who founded the Institute for Policy Studies (but garnish that discourse with a hatred of blacks and Jews).

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco


    You’d have a hard time locating a foreign country ‘destabilized’ by Foreign Service officers,
     
    Not really. Just need a map and some darts.

    You are a fool and an idiot.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  94. this guy in retirement is almost as bad as Obama. thankfully he’ll be dead in 10 years or so and we’ll never have to hear from him again. Obama will be around for decades.

    bottom 5 President of all time.

    i wonder what will happen first? Bush dies or the US leaves Afghanistan. now that’s an interesting bet.

    Roberts, Iraq, Afghanistan, another 10 million Mexicans, take your shoes off to get on airplanes, Islam is a religion of peace, the amount of long lasting permanent damage this guy caused is astronomical.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @prime noticer

    his guy in retirement is almost as bad as Obama. thankfully he’ll be dead in 10 years or so and we’ll never have to hear from him again. Obama will be around for decades.

    The life expectancy of a generic man his age is about 12 years. He isn't carrying any excess weight and his parents both lived past 90, as did one of his grandparents. Three of his seven aunts and uncles are still alive; the youngest of them is 89. Bet you he'll be around a while.

    In re Obama, life expectancy for a generic man his age is 22 years. Three of his grandparents lived past 80, but his parents didn't make it past 60. He isn't carrying any excess weight, but he does smoke cigarettes.

  95. anon[109] • Disclaimer says:
    @Not Only Wrathful
    @Diversity Heretic

    Ha, I have you beat.

    As an admittedly literal child, I (precociously) fully supported the Iraq war on the basis that it'd be absurdly racist to think that Iraqis wouldn't do like the Germans and Japanese did after WW2 and create incredible world beating economies and live as part of the super friends' group.

    Only this would be better as the Iraqis would obviously be cognizant of the German and Japanese examples and would immediately throw down their arms as soon as we did them the favour of invading.

    I would also have questioned whether your assumptions were racist if you disagreed.

    To be fair to me, I wasn't wholly wrong on that last part. After all, other than the Iraqis not being made of the same stuff as the Germans and Japanese, what explains their orgy of murdering each other, tremendous corruption and absolute failure since?

    Anti-racism was my motivating force in supporting the Iraq war, as it was for many others. Amazing how that is conveniently forgotten about.

    Replies: @anon

    As an admittedly literal child, I (precociously) fully supported the Iraq war on the basis that it’d be absurdly racist to think that Iraqis wouldn’t do like the Germans and Japanese did after WW2 and create incredible world beating economies and live as part of the super friends’ group.

    Legit. I used to know really old guys, like WW II guys, who took the same position. Makes total sense in the Blank Slate universe where most of us grew up. Except for that pesky “reality” thing.

    When the various tribes of Mesopotamia failed to immediately form a Federal republic complete with Vermont town meetings and bi-cameral provincial assemblies…did you find yourself reconsidering some premises?

    Did you know anyone who went to the sandbox as a trigger puller? I did / do. What they told me totally iced my blank slate delusions.

    • Replies: @Not Only Wrathful
    @anon


    When the various tribes of Mesopotamia failed to immediately form a Federal republic complete with Vermont town meetings and bi-cameral provincial assemblies…did you find yourself reconsidering some premises?
     
    Yes, there were two options.

    Remove Iraqis' agency from them, and lay the blame for their decision to slaughter each other at the feet of America, while conveniently forgetting that somehow invasion did not create the same effect elsewhere.

    Or, accept that Iraqis may not be, on average, the same in outlook as Germans, but were still free-willed humans.

    It felt that the latter both fit the facts better and did not alienate me from my (Iraqi) fellow man.

    Furthermore, I am not so lacking in self-insight that I am unable to consciously conceive of the impulse to glory, honour and fun in pursuing old grudges in Mesopotamian tribal fashion.

    Did you know anyone who went to the sandbox as a trigger puller? I did / do. What they told me totally iced my blank slate delusions
     
    Yes, and paradoxically, they are also the people best placed to empathise with the Iraqis. They "other" them less, because at least they understand the differences, rather than pretending such differences can't exist.
  96. @Impolitic
    Reagan's choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history. Perhaps Biden's pick will turn out to be another.

    Replies: @anon, @Pater, @prime noticer, @Sparkon

    “Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history.”

    agree that it was one of the most consequential events of the last century. it cursed the Bush clan on America. but Reagan didn’t get a choice about that. Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford. being the nominee in 80 was conditional on him taking on Bush as VP.

    neocons were already largely influential by the late 70s and were helping to pick and choose the company man. Bush was who they wanted – Bush was just getting clobbered by Reagan in popularity among the voters.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @prime noticer

    Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.


    Reagan was the GOP boss. There was no shadowy corps of people blackmailing him.

    , @Art Deco
    @prime noticer

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford.

    There is no agent named 'GOP' which dictates the results of Republican primary campaigns. He lost because he didn't have the votes. Both he and Ford won convention votes from slated delegations, so it's doubtful you can attribute Ford's win to people like Richard Rosenbaum. Ford also won a plurality of popular ballots in the 30 states that had competitive contests. Reagan tried to shake loose a few delegate votes by announcing Richard Schweiker would be his vp pick, but the gambit backfired on him.

    , @Kronos
    @prime noticer

    Roger Stone contends that George H.W. Bush was behind the Iran-Contra scandal in order to replace Reagan with himself.

    https://www.amazon.com/Nixons-Secrets-Untold-President-Watergate-ebook/dp/B00L4FSW1E


    More importantly, Haig clashed immediately and publicly with Vice President George H. W. Bush over amendments that would clarify the presidential line of succession in the event that President Reagan was incapacitated. Bush was actively planning Reagan’s ouster, where I believe he set Reagan up in the Iran-Contra Scandal, which briefly threatened Reagan’s presidency. “I was out of the loop,” Bush famously said when questioned about his role in the administration’s backdoor efforts to trade arms for hostages. Haig would lose this clash, and Reagan would approve the clarification Bush sought that would allow him to assume power if John Hinkley had succeeded in murdering Reagan or Reagan had been impeached or resigned in the Iran-Contra matter.
     

    Replies: @nebulafox

  97. @Impolitic
    Reagan's choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history. Perhaps Biden's pick will turn out to be another.

    Replies: @anon, @Pater, @prime noticer, @Sparkon

    In truth, the worst choice for VP was made by John Kennedy when he accepted Lyndon Johnson as his running mate in 1960. Because of the Billy Sol Estes and Bobby Baker scandals, there was a very good chance LBJ was going to end up in hot water, if not in prison, and it’s quite possible that JFK would not have selected him again in 1964, had he lived that long.

  98. @Boethiuss
    @Lot


    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.
     
    I'm not having this, on a couple of levels. I'm sure POTUS Hillary could have replaced Justice Scalia, but I very much doubt if she could have gotten amnesty, and in fact she might not have tried that hard for it.

    Mostly though, I'm disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Many Trump supporters tend to want to restrict immigration at any cost. But the way it's turned out, our support for Trump has cost us way more than whatever benefit we've gotten from Trump's immigration policy. I'd even venture that it's cost us more than whatever benefit we'd get if Trump actually were able to meaningfully curtail immigration, which of course he can't.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @Ben tillman, @anon, @ATBOTL

    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    And you continue to be oblivious.

    Immigration restriction is basically the only policy that does matter.

    A hint: You’re on a HBD blog.

    • Replies: @Boethiuss
    @AnotherDad


    A hint: You’re on a HBD blog.
     
    Yeah, yeah, I read the brochure, I even believe most of it.

    The way most of us think about immigration has been overtaken by events, and we have not adjusted. We like to talk about things like the economic and cultural dislocation caused by immigrants, especially immigration at scale, and how America as a society would be healthier in so many ways if we could stop it, or at least pause it.

    And that's great, but the world doesn't think about immigration that way any more. Not that they think we're wrong necessarily, they're not listening to us any more.

    We have invested ourselves in one man, Donald Trump, who has been inadequate for the responsibilities we have given him. And I have antagonized a lot of people here, for my criticism of him but given the turn of events I don't see any alternative.

    Whereas before I thought that the negatives associated with Trump were tactical and situational, now it appears they are strategic and insoluble.

    At every situation, where it looked like we could move Right politics toward substance and away from Trump's personal theatrics, Trump was there to insist otherwise, and we were there to defend him.

    As a consequence, we have been unable to make our case regarding immigration issues without being tied into supporting Trump's real estate interests or payoffs to adult movie actresses. Those things ought to be extraneous, but we have been completely unable to pull that off.
    , @Alexander Turok
    @AnotherDad


    A hint: You’re on a HBD blog.
     
    I've noticed a gradual de-emphasis on IQ, as he doesn't want to face the fact that his commenters have poorer judgment than members of better-educated groups and need stricter moral guidance from society. Steve's basic mantra is that we should just ignore all stupid, destructive, evil behavior if it comes from his readership.

    IMO, Idiocracy would not have been utopia if everyone involved were white.
  99. @prime noticer
    this guy in retirement is almost as bad as Obama. thankfully he'll be dead in 10 years or so and we'll never have to hear from him again. Obama will be around for decades.

    bottom 5 President of all time.

    i wonder what will happen first? Bush dies or the US leaves Afghanistan. now that's an interesting bet.

    Roberts, Iraq, Afghanistan, another 10 million Mexicans, take your shoes off to get on airplanes, Islam is a religion of peace, the amount of long lasting permanent damage this guy caused is astronomical.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    his guy in retirement is almost as bad as Obama. thankfully he’ll be dead in 10 years or so and we’ll never have to hear from him again. Obama will be around for decades.

    The life expectancy of a generic man his age is about 12 years. He isn’t carrying any excess weight and his parents both lived past 90, as did one of his grandparents. Three of his seven aunts and uncles are still alive; the youngest of them is 89. Bet you he’ll be around a while.

    In re Obama, life expectancy for a generic man his age is 22 years. Three of his grandparents lived past 80, but his parents didn’t make it past 60. He isn’t carrying any excess weight, but he does smoke cigarettes.

  100. @prime noticer
    @Impolitic

    "Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history."

    agree that it was one of the most consequential events of the last century. it cursed the Bush clan on America. but Reagan didn't get a choice about that. Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford. being the nominee in 80 was conditional on him taking on Bush as VP.

    neocons were already largely influential by the late 70s and were helping to pick and choose the company man. Bush was who they wanted - Bush was just getting clobbered by Reagan in popularity among the voters.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Kronos

    Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.

    Reagan was the GOP boss. There was no shadowy corps of people blackmailing him.

  101. @Sparkon
    @Art Deco

    Ask any adult American alive at the time what they were doing when they learned Pres. Kennedy had been assassinated, and most will give you a detailed account of where they were, what they were doing, and how they first learned of the assassination.

    George and Barbara Bush were registered at a Dallas hotel on Nov. 22, 1963, but George apparently couldn't remember where he was at the time, or what the heck he was doing. There are plenty of details about that for another time.

    But anyway, how does a guy who was head of the CIA for just one year get the CIA's headquarters named after himself?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @sayless

    There is a fair amount of evidence that George H.W. Bush’s offshore oil company in Mexico provided logistical support for the Bay of Pigs landing.

    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @Steve Sailer


    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.
     
    Hmm... maybe Danny was CIA.

    The contrast between personal and professional can be pretty funny. I went to college with a girl who knew G.H.W. Bush and called him Poppy. He was vice president at the time. Her father was a lifelong friend of his and had played baseball with him at Yale. Hers was another prominent American family, a household name you might see on your car or flying over the Superbowl.

    She had wonderful things to say about Poppy. He visited every Christmas and always brought presents for the children. You'd think the guy was Santa Claus.

    I think he was just an old softie who was always willing to do things for his friends -- whether that meant bringing gifts for kids or providing logistical support for an amphibious attack.

    Note, he had a dominant wife.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    , @Sparkon
    @Steve Sailer

    There is a fair amount of evidence too that the Bay of Pigs plot was hatched originally by none other than Richard Nixon and E. Howard Hunt, while Tricky Dick was Ike's VP, and Hunt was involved in covert operations at the CIA.

    Dick Nixon is another guy who had memory problems with his whereabouts on Nov. 22, 1963.

    Richard Milhouse Nixon had arrived in Dallas on Nov. 20 to participate in a conference of the American Bottlers of Carbonated Beverages as legal representative of both Pepsi Cola and Pepsi president Donald Kendall on behalf of Mudge, Nixon, et al, where Nixon was a new partner, who had attracted Pepsi as a new client. Kendall owed Nixon for getting a Pepsi into the hands of Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev in Moscow at an expo there in 1959. Pepsi subsequently won a 15-year exclusive contract for the Soviet market, and Coke was shut out.

    Nixon was a remarkable rainmaker. Big clients followed him around like puppies.

    After Pres. Kennedy was killed, Richard Nixon told several different versions of how he first learned of JFK's assassination. In all his fibs, Nixon claimed he had flown out of Dallas on the morning of Nov. 22, well before the assassination, and was riding in a cab in NYC when got the news, in one story from a man who ran across from a street corner, in another version from a woman who ran out of a house screaming and crying. There are still other versions.

    However, people who were at the Pepsi convention in Dallas said Nixon was still there when news of Pres. Kennedy's shooting was announced.

    Dick Nixon had entirely legitimate business in Dallas at the time, so there was no apparent reason for him to lie about it, except for consciousness of guilt.

    Hmm. LBJ certainly had a motive to kill the President, Poppy Bush apparently had a busy day, but couldn't remember any of it, and Tricky Dick lied to establish the fake fact that he wasn't anywhere near the scene of the crime.

    Well, Steve's article is about George W. Bush. Clearly, his paintings of immigrants are better than they look.

    Some JFK assassination researchers think young Shrub was hanging around Dealey Plaza on Nov. 22, 1963.


    https://i0.wp.com/robscholtemuseum.nl/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/George-W.-Bush-at-Dealey-Place-during-JFK-murder-foto-Before-Its-News.jpg

  102. @prime noticer
    @Impolitic

    "Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history."

    agree that it was one of the most consequential events of the last century. it cursed the Bush clan on America. but Reagan didn't get a choice about that. Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford. being the nominee in 80 was conditional on him taking on Bush as VP.

    neocons were already largely influential by the late 70s and were helping to pick and choose the company man. Bush was who they wanted - Bush was just getting clobbered by Reagan in popularity among the voters.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Kronos

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford.

    There is no agent named ‘GOP’ which dictates the results of Republican primary campaigns. He lost because he didn’t have the votes. Both he and Ford won convention votes from slated delegations, so it’s doubtful you can attribute Ford’s win to people like Richard Rosenbaum. Ford also won a plurality of popular ballots in the 30 states that had competitive contests. Reagan tried to shake loose a few delegate votes by announcing Richard Schweiker would be his vp pick, but the gambit backfired on him.

  103. @Boethiuss
    @Lot


    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.
     
    I'm not having this, on a couple of levels. I'm sure POTUS Hillary could have replaced Justice Scalia, but I very much doubt if she could have gotten amnesty, and in fact she might not have tried that hard for it.

    Mostly though, I'm disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Many Trump supporters tend to want to restrict immigration at any cost. But the way it's turned out, our support for Trump has cost us way more than whatever benefit we've gotten from Trump's immigration policy. I'd even venture that it's cost us more than whatever benefit we'd get if Trump actually were able to meaningfully curtail immigration, which of course he can't.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @Ben tillman, @anon, @ATBOTL

    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that.

    There is no “price tag”. Immigration restriction is a financial bonanza. And how has our support for Trump cost us anything?

    • Replies: @Boethiuss
    @Ben tillman


    There is no “price tag”. Immigration restriction is a financial bonanza.
     
    No, you're not getting it. You're talking about immigration restriction as if it's a thing that existed, or could exist, and evaluating the consequences on that basis. But that's exactly what we can't do.

    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.


    And how has our support for Trump cost us anything?
     
    Well, at the moment it means that we are completely disinterested in the China virus, which has cost America trillions of dollars and many thousands of lives lost, because that's how Trump is and we are with Trump.

    As a consequence, the American people see that obliviousness and lack of interest and make typical adverse judgments of us, and they're not wrong.

    Replies: @Ben tillman

  104. @nebulafox
    @AnotherDad

    Don't feel too bad, a lot of us made that mistake, even those of us who were nowhere near voting age at the time. I was not the same kind of foreign policy realist I am now when I was in primary school, believe me: I was mad as hell after 9/11 and wanted blood vengeance. Of course, as I got older, I changed my opinions according to the evidence and admitted my mistakes. That's what normal adults do. The Beltway is not populated by normal adults.

    I don't think Dubya was a bad guy-a lot of the men around him, from Powell to Rove, are another matter-but he absolutely no business, zero, being in the White House. Should have stuck to owning the Texas Rangers or something. America still hasn't recovered from his Presidency, and I'm not sure it is going to any time soon. If the MSM's rehabilitation of him because Against Orange Man doesn't illustrate their fundamental bankruptcy, liberals with a shred of honesty left, I'm not sure what will.

    >Shat all over the Republican brand.

    It's deeply hard to envision a President Obama-himself someone who didn't exactly have the resume you'd expect of a Presidential candidate-were it not for Bush II's trainwrecks. Just as Obama's real legacy is Trump, Bush II's real legacy was Obama.

    Replies: @Redneck farmer, @Ben tillman

    Bush didn’t cause Obama to be elected. The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11, and they continued to lie for him through the invasion that they so strongly supported. In other words, the media propagated the idea that Bush was a smashing success.

    How you imagine that his awful wrongdoing — which the public never heard about — caused the election of Obama is beyond me. The election was largely due to McCain’s throwing the election.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Ben tillman

    v The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11,

    ??

    Replies: @Ben tillman

    , @Kronos
    @Ben tillman

    True, but they also eventually crucified him via full-spectrum media vilification. I recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11. So they wired the jaws of progressives good and tight for a number of years until Micheal Moore released Fahrenheit 9/11 in 2004. That documentary opened the floodgates of Bush-hate.

    Also, Bill Ayers had some unfortunate luck on 9/11 that made plenty of liberal centrists cringe-grind their teeth immediately afterwords.

    https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Star-Making-Barack-Obama/dp/0062641832


    In a horrible accident of timing, Barack’s good friend Bill Ayers had just published Fugitive Days, a memoir of his Weather Underground involvement thirty years earlier. On the morning of September 11, a prominent New York Times feature story began with a powerful quote: “I don’t regret setting bombs,” Ayers said. “I feel we didn’t do enough.” Bill had previously made similar comments, telling the Chicago Reader’s Ben Joravsky in 1990 that “if anything, we didn’t go far enough. . . . I wouldn’t act any differently. . . . I wouldn’t change a thing.” But in the aftermath of September 11’s almost three thousand deaths, Ayer’s embrace of purposeful political violence seemed beyond callous.
     

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Ben tillman

  105. @prime noticer
    @Impolitic

    "Reagan’s choice of Bush Sr. to be his VP must rank among the most consequential decisions of modern American history."

    agree that it was one of the most consequential events of the last century. it cursed the Bush clan on America. but Reagan didn't get a choice about that. Bush was forced on him by GOP bosses. check the history and details about the 76 and 80 primaries.

    Reagan would have been the nominee in 76 if GOP had not blocked him to force Ford. being the nominee in 80 was conditional on him taking on Bush as VP.

    neocons were already largely influential by the late 70s and were helping to pick and choose the company man. Bush was who they wanted - Bush was just getting clobbered by Reagan in popularity among the voters.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Kronos

    Roger Stone contends that George H.W. Bush was behind the Iran-Contra scandal in order to replace Reagan with himself.

    More importantly, Haig clashed immediately and publicly with Vice President George H. W. Bush over amendments that would clarify the presidential line of succession in the event that President Reagan was incapacitated. Bush was actively planning Reagan’s ouster, where I believe he set Reagan up in the Iran-Contra Scandal, which briefly threatened Reagan’s presidency. “I was out of the loop,” Bush famously said when questioned about his role in the administration’s backdoor efforts to trade arms for hostages. Haig would lose this clash, and Reagan would approve the clarification Bush sought that would allow him to assume power if John Hinkley had succeeded in murdering Reagan or Reagan had been impeached or resigned in the Iran-Contra matter.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    Roger Stone doesn't make any sense: why would Bush launch a scandal that would potentially damage his own Presidential campaign just a couple years down the road? Plus, I don't think people understand just how much it took to get a resignation. If the taping system didn't exist, or was manually controlled like Johnson's was, Nixon would have served out his term, albeit crippled.

    Bush Senior's own diaries show what a CF Iran-Contra was...

    > recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11.

    That, and Clintonian neoliberalism had far less qualms with hawkishness than McGovernism did. Part of the reason Democrats couldn't object to Iraq was because the human rights rationale was the same as Yugoslavia, just on a much larger scale. Clinton himself had launched DESERT FOX just a few years earlier. It was also the times: the USSR imploding more than offset any memories lingering from Vietnam.

    Carter initially started out his Presidency as a relative dove, but the twin events of the Iranian Revolution and the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan changed him into the guy who'd start funding the mujahideen and would kick off the increased defense spending trend.

    Replies: @Kronos

  106. @Ben tillman
    @nebulafox

    Bush didn’t cause Obama to be elected. The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11, and they continued to lie for him through the invasion that they so strongly supported. In other words, the media propagated the idea that Bush was a smashing success.

    How you imagine that his awful wrongdoing — which the public never heard about — caused the election of Obama is beyond me. The election was largely due to McCain’s throwing the election.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Kronos

    v The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11,

    ??

    • Replies: @Ben tillman
    @Art Deco

    Bush’s approval ratings went up after 9/11/01. It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Alexander Turok, @Mr. Anon

  107. @Ben tillman
    @nebulafox

    Bush didn’t cause Obama to be elected. The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11, and they continued to lie for him through the invasion that they so strongly supported. In other words, the media propagated the idea that Bush was a smashing success.

    How you imagine that his awful wrongdoing — which the public never heard about — caused the election of Obama is beyond me. The election was largely due to McCain’s throwing the election.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Kronos

    True, but they also eventually crucified him via full-spectrum media vilification. I recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11. So they wired the jaws of progressives good and tight for a number of years until Micheal Moore released Fahrenheit 9/11 in 2004. That documentary opened the floodgates of Bush-hate.

    Also, Bill Ayers had some unfortunate luck on 9/11 that made plenty of liberal centrists cringe-grind their teeth immediately afterwords.

    In a horrible accident of timing, Barack’s good friend Bill Ayers had just published Fugitive Days, a memoir of his Weather Underground involvement thirty years earlier. On the morning of September 11, a prominent New York Times feature story began with a powerful quote: “I don’t regret setting bombs,” Ayers said. “I feel we didn’t do enough.” Bill had previously made similar comments, telling the Chicago Reader’s Ben Joravsky in 1990 that “if anything, we didn’t go far enough. . . . I wouldn’t act any differently. . . . I wouldn’t change a thing.” But in the aftermath of September 11’s almost three thousand deaths, Ayer’s embrace of purposeful political violence seemed beyond callous.

    • Replies: @Ben tillman
    @Kronos

    Yet The guy whose political career was launched in Ayers’s living room became the next President.

    , @Ben tillman
    @Kronos


    True, but they also eventually crucified him via full-spectrum media vilification.
     
    I never saw any of that, but if it happened it proves my point. Nothing Bush did mattered in the 2008 election. Only the media’s new spin on things mattered.

    The media loved the 9/11 attacks, and made that clear by preposterously proclaiming an official conspiracy theory twenty minutes after the attack, by never asking any of the obvious questions, by never suggesting Bush or anyone else should be held accountable for gross negligence or complicity. The media wanted the war, and lied like crazy to make it happen.

    The media also fully supported the policies that caused the real estate meltdown in 2007-08.

    These were all left-wing policies supported fully by the media. The vilification you allege, if real, was independent of Bush’s actual actions. No, Bush didn’t do anything to cause Obama to get elected.
  108. @Art Deco
    @Ben tillman

    v The media made Bush a hero by lying about 9/11,

    ??

    Replies: @Ben tillman

    Bush’s approval ratings went up after 9/11/01. It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Ben tillman

    Thanks for the evasion.

    , @Alexander Turok
    @Ben tillman


    It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.
     
    It doesn't because you are a moron and many of us are not morons.

    In your Trumptarded worldview, the media is damn-near omnipotent. Any success of your enemy, or failure of your side, can be explained away by citing the media. This allows you to escape any need to reflect on, and learn from, your mistakes.
    , @Mr. Anon
    @Ben tillman

    Huh. Both Art Deco and Alexander Turok said you were wrong.

    So I guess you must be right. Those two idiots aren't right about anything.

  109. @AnotherDad
    @Boethiuss


    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    ...

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.
     

    And you continue to be oblivious.

    Immigration restriction is basically the only policy that does matter.

    A hint: You're on a HBD blog.

    Replies: @Boethiuss, @Alexander Turok

    A hint: You’re on a HBD blog.

    Yeah, yeah, I read the brochure, I even believe most of it.

    The way most of us think about immigration has been overtaken by events, and we have not adjusted. We like to talk about things like the economic and cultural dislocation caused by immigrants, especially immigration at scale, and how America as a society would be healthier in so many ways if we could stop it, or at least pause it.

    And that’s great, but the world doesn’t think about immigration that way any more. Not that they think we’re wrong necessarily, they’re not listening to us any more.

    We have invested ourselves in one man, Donald Trump, who has been inadequate for the responsibilities we have given him. And I have antagonized a lot of people here, for my criticism of him but given the turn of events I don’t see any alternative.

    Whereas before I thought that the negatives associated with Trump were tactical and situational, now it appears they are strategic and insoluble.

    At every situation, where it looked like we could move Right politics toward substance and away from Trump’s personal theatrics, Trump was there to insist otherwise, and we were there to defend him.

    As a consequence, we have been unable to make our case regarding immigration issues without being tied into supporting Trump’s real estate interests or payoffs to adult movie actresses. Those things ought to be extraneous, but we have been completely unable to pull that off.

  110. @Kronos
    @Ben tillman

    True, but they also eventually crucified him via full-spectrum media vilification. I recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11. So they wired the jaws of progressives good and tight for a number of years until Micheal Moore released Fahrenheit 9/11 in 2004. That documentary opened the floodgates of Bush-hate.

    Also, Bill Ayers had some unfortunate luck on 9/11 that made plenty of liberal centrists cringe-grind their teeth immediately afterwords.

    https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Star-Making-Barack-Obama/dp/0062641832


    In a horrible accident of timing, Barack’s good friend Bill Ayers had just published Fugitive Days, a memoir of his Weather Underground involvement thirty years earlier. On the morning of September 11, a prominent New York Times feature story began with a powerful quote: “I don’t regret setting bombs,” Ayers said. “I feel we didn’t do enough.” Bill had previously made similar comments, telling the Chicago Reader’s Ben Joravsky in 1990 that “if anything, we didn’t go far enough. . . . I wouldn’t act any differently. . . . I wouldn’t change a thing.” But in the aftermath of September 11’s almost three thousand deaths, Ayer’s embrace of purposeful political violence seemed beyond callous.
     

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Ben tillman

    Yet The guy whose political career was launched in Ayers’s living room became the next President.

  111. @Kronos
    @Ben tillman

    True, but they also eventually crucified him via full-spectrum media vilification. I recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11. So they wired the jaws of progressives good and tight for a number of years until Micheal Moore released Fahrenheit 9/11 in 2004. That documentary opened the floodgates of Bush-hate.

    Also, Bill Ayers had some unfortunate luck on 9/11 that made plenty of liberal centrists cringe-grind their teeth immediately afterwords.

    https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Star-Making-Barack-Obama/dp/0062641832


    In a horrible accident of timing, Barack’s good friend Bill Ayers had just published Fugitive Days, a memoir of his Weather Underground involvement thirty years earlier. On the morning of September 11, a prominent New York Times feature story began with a powerful quote: “I don’t regret setting bombs,” Ayers said. “I feel we didn’t do enough.” Bill had previously made similar comments, telling the Chicago Reader’s Ben Joravsky in 1990 that “if anything, we didn’t go far enough. . . . I wouldn’t act any differently. . . . I wouldn’t change a thing.” But in the aftermath of September 11’s almost three thousand deaths, Ayer’s embrace of purposeful political violence seemed beyond callous.
     

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Ben tillman

    True, but they also eventually crucified him via full-spectrum media vilification.

    I never saw any of that, but if it happened it proves my point. Nothing Bush did mattered in the 2008 election. Only the media’s new spin on things mattered.

    The media loved the 9/11 attacks, and made that clear by preposterously proclaiming an official conspiracy theory twenty minutes after the attack, by never asking any of the obvious questions, by never suggesting Bush or anyone else should be held accountable for gross negligence or complicity. The media wanted the war, and lied like crazy to make it happen.

    The media also fully supported the policies that caused the real estate meltdown in 2007-08.

    These were all left-wing policies supported fully by the media. The vilification you allege, if real, was independent of Bush’s actual actions. No, Bush didn’t do anything to cause Obama to get elected.

  112. @Ben tillman
    @Boethiuss


    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that.
     
    There is no “price tag”. Immigration restriction is a financial bonanza. And how has our support for Trump cost us anything?

    Replies: @Boethiuss

    There is no “price tag”. Immigration restriction is a financial bonanza.

    No, you’re not getting it. You’re talking about immigration restriction as if it’s a thing that existed, or could exist, and evaluating the consequences on that basis. But that’s exactly what we can’t do.

    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.

    And how has our support for Trump cost us anything?

    Well, at the moment it means that we are completely disinterested in the China virus, which has cost America trillions of dollars and many thousands of lives lost, because that’s how Trump is and we are with Trump.

    As a consequence, the American people see that obliviousness and lack of interest and make typical adverse judgments of us, and they’re not wrong.

    • Replies: @Ben tillman
    @Boethiuss


    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.
     
    Talking about it doesn’t associate us with Trump or discredit us. The apparatus of public opinion formation does that. And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

    Replies: @Boethiuss, @Alexander Turok

  113. anon[429] • Disclaimer says:
    @Boethiuss
    @Lot


    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.
     
    I'm not having this, on a couple of levels. I'm sure POTUS Hillary could have replaced Justice Scalia, but I very much doubt if she could have gotten amnesty, and in fact she might not have tried that hard for it.

    Mostly though, I'm disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Many Trump supporters tend to want to restrict immigration at any cost. But the way it's turned out, our support for Trump has cost us way more than whatever benefit we've gotten from Trump's immigration policy. I'd even venture that it's cost us more than whatever benefit we'd get if Trump actually were able to meaningfully curtail immigration, which of course he can't.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @Ben tillman, @anon, @ATBOTL

    Though it was unintentional, Trump has caused immigration to completely stop in 2020 and will be greatly reduced,if it happens at all, next year. There are no visas being issued by embassies and international travel has shut down. Whatever one may think of in terms of Covid, Trump has used it to advance many good policies. If he is reelected in, we might see negligible immigration next 4 years.

  114. @anon
    @Not Only Wrathful

    As an admittedly literal child, I (precociously) fully supported the Iraq war on the basis that it’d be absurdly racist to think that Iraqis wouldn’t do like the Germans and Japanese did after WW2 and create incredible world beating economies and live as part of the super friends’ group.

    Legit. I used to know really old guys, like WW II guys, who took the same position. Makes total sense in the Blank Slate universe where most of us grew up. Except for that pesky "reality" thing.

    When the various tribes of Mesopotamia failed to immediately form a Federal republic complete with Vermont town meetings and bi-cameral provincial assemblies...did you find yourself reconsidering some premises?

    Did you know anyone who went to the sandbox as a trigger puller? I did / do. What they told me totally iced my blank slate delusions.

    Replies: @Not Only Wrathful

    When the various tribes of Mesopotamia failed to immediately form a Federal republic complete with Vermont town meetings and bi-cameral provincial assemblies…did you find yourself reconsidering some premises?

    Yes, there were two options.

    Remove Iraqis’ agency from them, and lay the blame for their decision to slaughter each other at the feet of America, while conveniently forgetting that somehow invasion did not create the same effect elsewhere.

    Or, accept that Iraqis may not be, on average, the same in outlook as Germans, but were still free-willed humans.

    It felt that the latter both fit the facts better and did not alienate me from my (Iraqi) fellow man.

    Furthermore, I am not so lacking in self-insight that I am unable to consciously conceive of the impulse to glory, honour and fun in pursuing old grudges in Mesopotamian tribal fashion.

    Did you know anyone who went to the sandbox as a trigger puller? I did / do. What they told me totally iced my blank slate delusions

    Yes, and paradoxically, they are also the people best placed to empathise with the Iraqis. They “other” them less, because at least they understand the differences, rather than pretending such differences can’t exist.

  115. @Boethiuss
    @Ben tillman


    There is no “price tag”. Immigration restriction is a financial bonanza.
     
    No, you're not getting it. You're talking about immigration restriction as if it's a thing that existed, or could exist, and evaluating the consequences on that basis. But that's exactly what we can't do.

    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.


    And how has our support for Trump cost us anything?
     
    Well, at the moment it means that we are completely disinterested in the China virus, which has cost America trillions of dollars and many thousands of lives lost, because that's how Trump is and we are with Trump.

    As a consequence, the American people see that obliviousness and lack of interest and make typical adverse judgments of us, and they're not wrong.

    Replies: @Ben tillman

    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.

    Talking about it doesn’t associate us with Trump or discredit us. The apparatus of public opinion formation does that. And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

    • Replies: @Boethiuss
    @Ben tillman


    Talking about it doesn’t associate us with Trump or discredit us. The apparatus of public opinion formation does that. And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.
     
    I don't know what the "apparatus of public opinion formation" is supposed to be, or if that's any different than plain old public opinion. Whatever it is, it's not true, and it's contrary to the way immigration restriction has played out for say, 25 years.

    From say, 1995 to 2015, the strategy behind the restriction side of the issue was to manipulate it in such a way that the public opinion, which was reliably on our side, could come to bear. That's how we shut down the Capitol switchboard in 2007, that's how we beat the Gang of 8.

    Those things aren't available for us any more, because we don't have public opinion with us.

    Americans who might be opposed to immigration, or at least persuadeable in that direction, can't be bothered. Instead, they're looking at Trump and his inanity, and who is propping him up, away from political oblivion. So they're looking at us, and they're not wrong.
    , @Alexander Turok
    @Ben tillman


    And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

     

    But it isn't lies, it's the truth. And (some) people can see the difference between the truth and lies.

    I get it, though. You can do no wrong. You can deflect any accusation with "sure, I raped those girls, but the feminists would be calling me a rapist no matter what I did!"
  116. @Kronos
    @prime noticer

    Roger Stone contends that George H.W. Bush was behind the Iran-Contra scandal in order to replace Reagan with himself.

    https://www.amazon.com/Nixons-Secrets-Untold-President-Watergate-ebook/dp/B00L4FSW1E


    More importantly, Haig clashed immediately and publicly with Vice President George H. W. Bush over amendments that would clarify the presidential line of succession in the event that President Reagan was incapacitated. Bush was actively planning Reagan’s ouster, where I believe he set Reagan up in the Iran-Contra Scandal, which briefly threatened Reagan’s presidency. “I was out of the loop,” Bush famously said when questioned about his role in the administration’s backdoor efforts to trade arms for hostages. Haig would lose this clash, and Reagan would approve the clarification Bush sought that would allow him to assume power if John Hinkley had succeeded in murdering Reagan or Reagan had been impeached or resigned in the Iran-Contra matter.
     

    Replies: @nebulafox

    Roger Stone doesn’t make any sense: why would Bush launch a scandal that would potentially damage his own Presidential campaign just a couple years down the road? Plus, I don’t think people understand just how much it took to get a resignation. If the taping system didn’t exist, or was manually controlled like Johnson’s was, Nixon would have served out his term, albeit crippled.

    Bush Senior’s own diaries show what a CF Iran-Contra was…

    > recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11.

    That, and Clintonian neoliberalism had far less qualms with hawkishness than McGovernism did. Part of the reason Democrats couldn’t object to Iraq was because the human rights rationale was the same as Yugoslavia, just on a much larger scale. Clinton himself had launched DESERT FOX just a few years earlier. It was also the times: the USSR imploding more than offset any memories lingering from Vietnam.

    Carter initially started out his Presidency as a relative dove, but the twin events of the Iranian Revolution and the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan changed him into the guy who’d start funding the mujahideen and would kick off the increased defense spending trend.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @nebulafox


    Roger Stone doesn’t make any sense: why would Bush launch a scandal that would potentially damage his own Presidential campaign just a couple years down the road?
     
    Throughout chapter 16 in “Nixon and the Bushes” George H.W.Bush often significantly struggled in elections and was never able to construct a strong personal base among Republican voters. Many conservatives distrusted Bush I as a Rockefeller Republican liberal (a rapidly dying faction) and his east coast Wall Street contacts. He was never culturally/economically ideological and often gaffed himself with supporting causes that would grind the gears of conservatives. (He had many nicknames and “rubbers” was one of them. Because he very much supported contraceptives.) Nancy didn’t much care for him and his relationship with Reagan was hardly better. So it was hardly a sure bet he’d automatically receive the 1988 nomination even if Reagan fully supported him.

    Keep in mind he did lose control of the Republican Party factions in 1992 with Ross Perot. The one Republican President that hadn’t won re-election since Hoover. Something that George W. Bush was able to do.

  117. @SunBakedSuburb
    @Art Deco

    You and Steve are the last two Americans who accept the Warren Commission narrative.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @nebulafox

    Why are people so averse to believing that one angry, ideologically motivated young loser with a gun really can shake history? Just look at Gavrilo Princip.

    • Agree: William Badwhite
    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    @nebulafox

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don't buy that.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  118. @Hunsdon
    @Cloudbuster

    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon, since, if you examine his actual record, he implemented so many inarguably leftist policies.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @William Badwhite, @Art Deco

    Nixon was largely indifferent to domestic policy and handed it off to John Ehrlichman, who was a Seattle-style Republican with moderately liberal views. Nixon’s instinctual domestic tendencies mostly leaned toward heterodox centrism-not to be confused with “moderate”-so the arrangement worked out fine.

    Always found it amusing how the media lumped him and Haldeman together as Siamese twins. The two were really very different, both as personalities and as ideological influences. In many respects, they were rivals.

  119. @Sparkon
    @Art Deco

    Ask any adult American alive at the time what they were doing when they learned Pres. Kennedy had been assassinated, and most will give you a detailed account of where they were, what they were doing, and how they first learned of the assassination.

    George and Barbara Bush were registered at a Dallas hotel on Nov. 22, 1963, but George apparently couldn't remember where he was at the time, or what the heck he was doing. There are plenty of details about that for another time.

    But anyway, how does a guy who was head of the CIA for just one year get the CIA's headquarters named after himself?

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @sayless

    George H. W. said he couldn’t remember. That simply isn’t credible. Especially since his father was a senator.

    Not speculating on why he was lying. But he was certainly lying–say, did anyone ever ask Barbara Bush where she was, what she was doing on that day?

    Art Deco is strangely passionate on this subject.

    • Replies: @dcthrowback
    @sayless

    1/ "Family of Secrets" by Russ Baker.

    2/ Bush calling his whereabouts before the murder - classic Bush family chicanery. Evil SOBs. The fact our citizens were sold a bill of goods about "Poppy Bush" shows Operation Mockingbird is still in effect.

    3/ George HW Bush ran "Iran-Contra" out his VP office w/ the assistance of Oliver North and Mark Seal. This is fact (aided & abetted by Bill Clinton in Arkansas.) "Compromised" by Terry Reed lays it all out.

    4/ The ties between John Hinckley and the Bush family. /shudder

    5/ https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/Bush_Sr%2C_JFK_-_J_Edgar_Hoover_memo_2.jpg ||

    6/ Bush was likely the only person w/ the juice to put together the hitmen (besides LBJ) and change the wound on the plane before it landed in DC after the murder.

    Of course Reagan was pressured to take Bush on the ticket. Every populist movement was *must* by neutered and taken over by the establishment. (RIP OWS 2011-2012; RIP Tea Party 2009-2011; RIP MAGA, 2015-2019 etc., etc).

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco

    , @flyingtiger
    @sayless

    Barbara (Annie Oakley)Bush was behind the grassy knoll. You will not that she has never had to talk about this under oath before congress.

  120. @JosephB
    @AnotherDad

    Don't feel so bad, I not only voted for his reelection but was in favor of the war on terror. There was much craziness then.

    Then again, I saw step #1 in the WOT as forging an alliance with Russia. Heck, we probably could have made a deal with China back in 2003 based on the problem of pissed off Muslims. Sigh...missed opportunities.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt

    I favored Persian Excursion 1. I learned from that and hated PE2. Don’t beat yourself up over it. Fool me twice…you can’t get fooled again.

  121. @Ed
    In my opinion George W. Bush is the worst potus of my lifetime, I’m 42. Obama is preferable.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt

    Yes. There’s no question about that. People who complain about Trump to me as the worst President ever then get to defend W. They really cannot.

  122. @nebulafox
    @SunBakedSuburb

    Why are people so averse to believing that one angry, ideologically motivated young loser with a gun really can shake history? Just look at Gavrilo Princip.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don’t buy that.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @TomSchmidt

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don’t buy that.

    You have two factual errors and a faulty assumption in this sentence.

    Replies: @Hibernian, @TomSchmidt

  123. @Ben tillman
    @Boethiuss


    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.
     
    Talking about it doesn’t associate us with Trump or discredit us. The apparatus of public opinion formation does that. And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

    Replies: @Boethiuss, @Alexander Turok

    Talking about it doesn’t associate us with Trump or discredit us. The apparatus of public opinion formation does that. And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

    I don’t know what the “apparatus of public opinion formation” is supposed to be, or if that’s any different than plain old public opinion. Whatever it is, it’s not true, and it’s contrary to the way immigration restriction has played out for say, 25 years.

    From say, 1995 to 2015, the strategy behind the restriction side of the issue was to manipulate it in such a way that the public opinion, which was reliably on our side, could come to bear. That’s how we shut down the Capitol switchboard in 2007, that’s how we beat the Gang of 8.

    Those things aren’t available for us any more, because we don’t have public opinion with us.

    Americans who might be opposed to immigration, or at least persuadeable in that direction, can’t be bothered. Instead, they’re looking at Trump and his inanity, and who is propping him up, away from political oblivion. So they’re looking at us, and they’re not wrong.

  124. @AnotherDad
    @Boethiuss


    Mostly though, I’m disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    ...

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.
     

    And you continue to be oblivious.

    Immigration restriction is basically the only policy that does matter.

    A hint: You're on a HBD blog.

    Replies: @Boethiuss, @Alexander Turok

    A hint: You’re on a HBD blog.

    I’ve noticed a gradual de-emphasis on IQ, as he doesn’t want to face the fact that his commenters have poorer judgment than members of better-educated groups and need stricter moral guidance from society. Steve’s basic mantra is that we should just ignore all stupid, destructive, evil behavior if it comes from his readership.

    IMO, Idiocracy would not have been utopia if everyone involved were white.

  125. @Hunsdon
    @Cloudbuster

    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon, since, if you examine his actual record, he implemented so many inarguably leftist policies.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @William Badwhite, @Art Deco

    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon

    Leftists in the know hate Nixon because of Nixon’s aggressive pursuit of the communist Alger Hiss while on the House Unamerican Activities Committee. Most of the other leftists (like my fat brain dead cousin) hated him because they were told to.

    • Agree: Hibernian
  126. @Ben tillman
    @Art Deco

    Bush’s approval ratings went up after 9/11/01. It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Alexander Turok, @Mr. Anon

    Thanks for the evasion.

  127. @TomSchmidt
    @nebulafox

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don't buy that.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don’t buy that.

    You have two factual errors and a faulty assumption in this sentence.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
    @Art Deco

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines. Could have been faking it as part of his role as an intel asset, if he was one.

    Replies: @anon, @Art Deco

    , @TomSchmidt
    @Art Deco

    As to the speed of the rifle:
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1556184/Oswald-had-no-time-to-fire-all-Kennedy-bullets.html


    In fresh tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action weapon, supervised by the Italian army, it was found to be impossible for even an accomplished marksman to fire the shots quickly enough.
    ...
    The official Warren Commission inquiry into the shooting concluded the following year that Oswald was a lone gunman who fired three shots with a Carcano M91/38 bolt-action rifle in 8.3 seconds.

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds - suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.
     

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Art Deco

  128. @Ben tillman
    @Boethiuss


    Before we implement immigration restriction, we have to talk about it. Talking about it associates us with Trump, which discredits us.
     
    Talking about it doesn’t associate us with Trump or discredit us. The apparatus of public opinion formation does that. And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

    Replies: @Boethiuss, @Alexander Turok

    And that apparatus would use a different set of lies to discredit immigration restrictionists, as they’ve been doing for 100 years, if there were no Trump.

    But it isn’t lies, it’s the truth. And (some) people can see the difference between the truth and lies.

    I get it, though. You can do no wrong. You can deflect any accusation with “sure, I raped those girls, but the feminists would be calling me a rapist no matter what I did!”

  129. @Hunsdon
    @Cloudbuster

    It always struck me as odd how much the left (to use a Whiskeyism) HATES HATES HATES Nixon, since, if you examine his actual record, he implemented so many inarguably leftist policies.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @William Badwhite, @Art Deco

    1. Nixon was awkward. High school never ends for some people.

    2. The Nixon family exemplified a fairly standard conception of domestic standards and practices, as did the Agnews. Everything about them suggested they were at home with everyday American life. (Three of the Agnew kids had problems and living, but in only one case did these hit the papers)

    3. Agnew in particular was an acidulous critic of obnoxious college students and feral slum bums. No excuses offered or accepted.

    4. Nixon was always quite clear that there were boundaries to legitimate discourse in this country and that certain people should be debarred from public employment, and that included public higher education. If Nixon had his druthers, any Howard Zinn working for a public institution would have been put out on the curb. Liberals are quite content to see conservatives run out of higher education (while lying to themselves and others about what is happening), but running red-haze twits out is beyond the pale.

  130. @Ben tillman
    @Art Deco

    Bush’s approval ratings went up after 9/11/01. It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Alexander Turok, @Mr. Anon

    It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.

    It doesn’t because you are a moron and many of us are not morons.

    In your Trumptarded worldview, the media is damn-near omnipotent. Any success of your enemy, or failure of your side, can be explained away by citing the media. This allows you to escape any need to reflect on, and learn from, your mistakes.

  131. @nebulafox
    @Kronos

    Roger Stone doesn't make any sense: why would Bush launch a scandal that would potentially damage his own Presidential campaign just a couple years down the road? Plus, I don't think people understand just how much it took to get a resignation. If the taping system didn't exist, or was manually controlled like Johnson's was, Nixon would have served out his term, albeit crippled.

    Bush Senior's own diaries show what a CF Iran-Contra was...

    > recall many Clinton liberal Boomers didn’t want a Vietnam repeat of yelling/spitting on returning solders especially right after 9/11.

    That, and Clintonian neoliberalism had far less qualms with hawkishness than McGovernism did. Part of the reason Democrats couldn't object to Iraq was because the human rights rationale was the same as Yugoslavia, just on a much larger scale. Clinton himself had launched DESERT FOX just a few years earlier. It was also the times: the USSR imploding more than offset any memories lingering from Vietnam.

    Carter initially started out his Presidency as a relative dove, but the twin events of the Iranian Revolution and the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan changed him into the guy who'd start funding the mujahideen and would kick off the increased defense spending trend.

    Replies: @Kronos

    Roger Stone doesn’t make any sense: why would Bush launch a scandal that would potentially damage his own Presidential campaign just a couple years down the road?

    Throughout chapter 16 in “Nixon and the Bushes” George H.W.Bush often significantly struggled in elections and was never able to construct a strong personal base among Republican voters. Many conservatives distrusted Bush I as a Rockefeller Republican liberal (a rapidly dying faction) and his east coast Wall Street contacts. He was never culturally/economically ideological and often gaffed himself with supporting causes that would grind the gears of conservatives. (He had many nicknames and “rubbers” was one of them. Because he very much supported contraceptives.) Nancy didn’t much care for him and his relationship with Reagan was hardly better. So it was hardly a sure bet he’d automatically receive the 1988 nomination even if Reagan fully supported him.

    Keep in mind he did lose control of the Republican Party factions in 1992 with Ross Perot. The one Republican President that hadn’t won re-election since Hoover. Something that George W. Bush was able to do.

  132. @sayless
    @Sparkon

    George H. W. said he couldn't remember. That simply isn't credible. Especially since his father was a senator.

    Not speculating on why he was lying. But he was certainly lying--say, did anyone ever ask Barbara Bush where she was, what she was doing on that day?

    Art Deco is strangely passionate on this subject.

    Replies: @dcthrowback, @flyingtiger

    1/ “Family of Secrets” by Russ Baker.

    2/ Bush calling his whereabouts before the murder – classic Bush family chicanery. Evil SOBs. The fact our citizens were sold a bill of goods about “Poppy Bush” shows Operation Mockingbird is still in effect.

    3/ George HW Bush ran “Iran-Contra” out his VP office w/ the assistance of Oliver North and Mark Seal. This is fact (aided & abetted by Bill Clinton in Arkansas.) “Compromised” by Terry Reed lays it all out.

    4/ The ties between John Hinckley and the Bush family. /shudder

    5/||

    6/ Bush was likely the only person w/ the juice to put together the hitmen (besides LBJ) and change the wound on the plane before it landed in DC after the murder.

    Of course Reagan was pressured to take Bush on the ticket. Every populist movement was *must* by neutered and taken over by the establishment. (RIP OWS 2011-2012; RIP Tea Party 2009-2011; RIP MAGA, 2015-2019 etc., etc).

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @dcthrowback

    3/ George HW Bush ran “Iran-Contra” out his VP office w/ the assistance of Oliver North and Mark Seal. This is fact (aided & abetted by Bill Clinton in Arkansas.) “Compromised” by Terry Reed lays it all out.

    This is a fantasy and you're a mark.

    , @Art Deco
    @dcthrowback

    6/ Bush was likely the only person w/ the juice to put together the hitmen (besides LBJ) and change the wound on the plane before it landed in DC after the murder.

    Bush ran a small oil exploration business which he'd recently sold. He had no juice whatsoever.

  133. @dcthrowback
    @sayless

    1/ "Family of Secrets" by Russ Baker.

    2/ Bush calling his whereabouts before the murder - classic Bush family chicanery. Evil SOBs. The fact our citizens were sold a bill of goods about "Poppy Bush" shows Operation Mockingbird is still in effect.

    3/ George HW Bush ran "Iran-Contra" out his VP office w/ the assistance of Oliver North and Mark Seal. This is fact (aided & abetted by Bill Clinton in Arkansas.) "Compromised" by Terry Reed lays it all out.

    4/ The ties between John Hinckley and the Bush family. /shudder

    5/ https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/Bush_Sr%2C_JFK_-_J_Edgar_Hoover_memo_2.jpg ||

    6/ Bush was likely the only person w/ the juice to put together the hitmen (besides LBJ) and change the wound on the plane before it landed in DC after the murder.

    Of course Reagan was pressured to take Bush on the ticket. Every populist movement was *must* by neutered and taken over by the establishment. (RIP OWS 2011-2012; RIP Tea Party 2009-2011; RIP MAGA, 2015-2019 etc., etc).

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco

    3/ George HW Bush ran “Iran-Contra” out his VP office w/ the assistance of Oliver North and Mark Seal. This is fact (aided & abetted by Bill Clinton in Arkansas.) “Compromised” by Terry Reed lays it all out.

    This is a fantasy and you’re a mark.

  134. @dcthrowback
    @sayless

    1/ "Family of Secrets" by Russ Baker.

    2/ Bush calling his whereabouts before the murder - classic Bush family chicanery. Evil SOBs. The fact our citizens were sold a bill of goods about "Poppy Bush" shows Operation Mockingbird is still in effect.

    3/ George HW Bush ran "Iran-Contra" out his VP office w/ the assistance of Oliver North and Mark Seal. This is fact (aided & abetted by Bill Clinton in Arkansas.) "Compromised" by Terry Reed lays it all out.

    4/ The ties between John Hinckley and the Bush family. /shudder

    5/ https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/Bush_Sr%2C_JFK_-_J_Edgar_Hoover_memo_2.jpg ||

    6/ Bush was likely the only person w/ the juice to put together the hitmen (besides LBJ) and change the wound on the plane before it landed in DC after the murder.

    Of course Reagan was pressured to take Bush on the ticket. Every populist movement was *must* by neutered and taken over by the establishment. (RIP OWS 2011-2012; RIP Tea Party 2009-2011; RIP MAGA, 2015-2019 etc., etc).

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco

    6/ Bush was likely the only person w/ the juice to put together the hitmen (besides LBJ) and change the wound on the plane before it landed in DC after the murder.

    Bush ran a small oil exploration business which he’d recently sold. He had no juice whatsoever.

  135. A former president selling artwork is like a former NFL star doing movie acting: easy income despite an obvious lack of talent. In terms of public persona, though, W is going the McCain route and trying to become a hero to the left…now that he’s hated by the right for starting the Iraq war. Too bad the right didn’t hate him back when he started the Iraq war. (I did. I voted for him in 2000 but not in 2004, and was very vocal about my problems with him.) We have to admit it: there are a lot of idiots on the right who will follow the leadership wherever they go.

  136. @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    Sure, paper pushers who destablize nations and help to foment civil wars.

    You'd have a hard time locating a foreign country 'destabilized' by Foreign Service officers, much less one where a civil war was manufactured by them. These boards are shot through with people who sound like the bozos who founded the Institute for Policy Studies (but garnish that discourse with a hatred of blacks and Jews).

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    You’d have a hard time locating a foreign country ‘destabilized’ by Foreign Service officers,

    Not really. Just need a map and some darts.

    You are a fool and an idiot.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    Not really. Just need a map and some darts.

    No, you need some actual knowledge to go with your ample supply of hot air.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  137. @Art Deco
    @TomSchmidt

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don’t buy that.

    You have two factual errors and a faulty assumption in this sentence.

    Replies: @Hibernian, @TomSchmidt

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines. Could have been faking it as part of his role as an intel asset, if he was one.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Hibernian

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    How do you know that?

    Replies: @Hibernian

    , @Art Deco
    @Hibernian

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    Where did this meme originate?


    The limousine was < 100 yards away and was traveling at about 15 feet per second. Clay pigeons leave the house at 4x that speed and slugs like me have been known to hit them now and again.

    The concatenation of things which would have to be so for Lee Harvey Oswald to be an innocent man is quite impressive. You might try reviewing it.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt, @Hibernian

  138. @Hibernian
    @Art Deco

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines. Could have been faking it as part of his role as an intel asset, if he was one.

    Replies: @anon, @Art Deco

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    How do you know that?

    • Replies: @Hibernian
    @anon

    See my reply below to Art Deco.

  139. @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco


    You’d have a hard time locating a foreign country ‘destabilized’ by Foreign Service officers,
     
    Not really. Just need a map and some darts.

    You are a fool and an idiot.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    Not really. Just need a map and some darts.

    No, you need some actual knowledge to go with your ample supply of hot air.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco

    Ukraine. Syria. Libya. For starters. It's not as if there aren't plenty more too, you smug nitwit.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  140. @Hibernian
    @Art Deco

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines. Could have been faking it as part of his role as an intel asset, if he was one.

    Replies: @anon, @Art Deco

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    Where did this meme originate?

    The limousine was < 100 yards away and was traveling at about 15 feet per second. Clay pigeons leave the house at 4x that speed and slugs like me have been known to hit them now and again.

    The concatenation of things which would have to be so for Lee Harvey Oswald to be an innocent man is quite impressive. You might try reviewing it.

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    @Art Deco

    The book The Devil's Chessboard tells about Oswald going hunting in the USSR. He was such a terrible shot ... forget me doing this. The book is here:
    https://www.amazon.com/Devils-Chessboard-Dulles-Americas-Government/dp/0062276174

    Search for the word rabbit on page 515.

    The soviets, who might have been lying to confuse us, saw him as an incompetent shot.

    , @Hibernian
    @Art Deco

    The meme originated with Marines who served with him. I'm not alleging, and I don't believe, that he was innocent. I go with the proposition that there was some kind of conspiracy, maybe a small one, with Oswald as one of the players. I don't believe, as some seem to, that all of JFK's enemies got together and did it, or almost all of them.

    Replies: @anon

  141. @sayless
    @Sparkon

    George H. W. said he couldn't remember. That simply isn't credible. Especially since his father was a senator.

    Not speculating on why he was lying. But he was certainly lying--say, did anyone ever ask Barbara Bush where she was, what she was doing on that day?

    Art Deco is strangely passionate on this subject.

    Replies: @dcthrowback, @flyingtiger

    Barbara (Annie Oakley)Bush was behind the grassy knoll. You will not that she has never had to talk about this under oath before congress.

    • LOL: Hibernian
  142. @Art Deco
    @Hibernian

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    Where did this meme originate?


    The limousine was < 100 yards away and was traveling at about 15 feet per second. Clay pigeons leave the house at 4x that speed and slugs like me have been known to hit them now and again.

    The concatenation of things which would have to be so for Lee Harvey Oswald to be an innocent man is quite impressive. You might try reviewing it.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt, @Hibernian

    The book The Devil’s Chessboard tells about Oswald going hunting in the USSR. He was such a terrible shot … forget me doing this. The book is here:

    Search for the word rabbit on page 515.

    The soviets, who might have been lying to confuse us, saw him as an incompetent shot.

  143. @Art Deco
    @TomSchmidt

    A terrible shot manages to squeeze off bullets faster than the gun can actually fire, and hits a man in a moving car? I don’t buy that.

    You have two factual errors and a faulty assumption in this sentence.

    Replies: @Hibernian, @TomSchmidt

    As to the speed of the rifle:
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1556184/Oswald-had-no-time-to-fire-all-Kennedy-bullets.html

    In fresh tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action weapon, supervised by the Italian army, it was found to be impossible for even an accomplished marksman to fire the shots quickly enough.

    The official Warren Commission inquiry into the shooting concluded the following year that Oswald was a lone gunman who fired three shots with a Carcano M91/38 bolt-action rifle in 8.3 seconds.

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @TomSchmidt

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.


    Sounds like they weren't too talented with a weapon.

    https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk8/mc.htm

    , @Art Deco
    @TomSchmidt

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.


    Sounds like they weren't too talented with a weapon.

    https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk8/mc.htm

    , @Art Deco
    @TomSchmidt

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.


    Sounds like they weren't too talented with a weapon.

    https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk8/mc.htm

  144. @TomSchmidt
    @Art Deco

    As to the speed of the rifle:
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1556184/Oswald-had-no-time-to-fire-all-Kennedy-bullets.html


    In fresh tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action weapon, supervised by the Italian army, it was found to be impossible for even an accomplished marksman to fire the shots quickly enough.
    ...
    The official Warren Commission inquiry into the shooting concluded the following year that Oswald was a lone gunman who fired three shots with a Carcano M91/38 bolt-action rifle in 8.3 seconds.

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds - suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.
     

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Art Deco

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.

    Sounds like they weren’t too talented with a weapon.

    https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk8/mc.htm

  145. @Art Deco
    @Hibernian

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    Where did this meme originate?


    The limousine was < 100 yards away and was traveling at about 15 feet per second. Clay pigeons leave the house at 4x that speed and slugs like me have been known to hit them now and again.

    The concatenation of things which would have to be so for Lee Harvey Oswald to be an innocent man is quite impressive. You might try reviewing it.

    Replies: @TomSchmidt, @Hibernian

    The meme originated with Marines who served with him. I’m not alleging, and I don’t believe, that he was innocent. I go with the proposition that there was some kind of conspiracy, maybe a small one, with Oswald as one of the players. I don’t believe, as some seem to, that all of JFK’s enemies got together and did it, or almost all of them.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Hibernian

    The meme originated with Marines who served with him.

    Oh yeah? Who were those Marines? Names?

    smh.

    How many times did Marine Oswald shoot the Marine rifle qual? What were his scores? Could that info be out there on the intertubes? Would that give us a clue about his ability to shoot, more so than rando Russian rabbit hunters?

    lol

    Replies: @Hibernian

  146. @TomSchmidt
    @Art Deco

    As to the speed of the rifle:
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1556184/Oswald-had-no-time-to-fire-all-Kennedy-bullets.html


    In fresh tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action weapon, supervised by the Italian army, it was found to be impossible for even an accomplished marksman to fire the shots quickly enough.
    ...
    The official Warren Commission inquiry into the shooting concluded the following year that Oswald was a lone gunman who fired three shots with a Carcano M91/38 bolt-action rifle in 8.3 seconds.

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds - suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.
     

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Art Deco

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.

    Sounds like they weren’t too talented with a weapon.

    https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk8/mc.htm

  147. @TomSchmidt
    @Art Deco

    As to the speed of the rifle:
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1556184/Oswald-had-no-time-to-fire-all-Kennedy-bullets.html


    In fresh tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action weapon, supervised by the Italian army, it was found to be impossible for even an accomplished marksman to fire the shots quickly enough.
    ...
    The official Warren Commission inquiry into the shooting concluded the following year that Oswald was a lone gunman who fired three shots with a Carcano M91/38 bolt-action rifle in 8.3 seconds.

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds - suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.
     

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Art Deco, @Art Deco

    But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds – suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.

    Sounds like they weren’t too talented with a weapon.

    https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk8/mc.htm

  148. @anon
    @Hibernian

    He was a terrible shot in the Marines.

    How do you know that?

    Replies: @Hibernian

    See my reply below to Art Deco.

  149. @Ben tillman
    @Art Deco

    Bush’s approval ratings went up after 9/11/01. It should go without saying that the approval was due to the media’s spin on the event.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Alexander Turok, @Mr. Anon

    Huh. Both Art Deco and Alexander Turok said you were wrong.

    So I guess you must be right. Those two idiots aren’t right about anything.

  150. @Art Deco
    @SunBakedSuburb

    In your imagination only. I'm not a buff and off the top of my head I can think of three who have vigorously debunked the entire body of conspirazoid literature: Gerald Posner, John McAdams, and the late Vincent Bugliosi.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    He meant “intelligent Americans” – which you are clearly not.

  151. @Steve Sailer
    @Sparkon

    There is a fair amount of evidence that George H.W. Bush's offshore oil company in Mexico provided logistical support for the Bay of Pigs landing.

    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Sparkon

    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.

    Hmm… maybe Danny was CIA.

    The contrast between personal and professional can be pretty funny. I went to college with a girl who knew G.H.W. Bush and called him Poppy. He was vice president at the time. Her father was a lifelong friend of his and had played baseball with him at Yale. Hers was another prominent American family, a household name you might see on your car or flying over the Superbowl.

    She had wonderful things to say about Poppy. He visited every Christmas and always brought presents for the children. You’d think the guy was Santa Claus.

    I think he was just an old softie who was always willing to do things for his friends — whether that meant bringing gifts for kids or providing logistical support for an amphibious attack.

    Note, he had a dominant wife.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Note, he had a dominant wife.

    No, he had a wife who had a certain amount of asperity and a temperament less sanguine than was his. Wherever he wanted to move to next, she went with him without complaint. Brass tacks, she wasn't any more dominant than Pat Nixon, just more sociable and authoritative in her methods (as you'd expect of a woman who had four sons). Compare her to Nancy Reagan, who could and did boss around the President's chief of staff (at least when the issue was scheduling or ceremonial events); or Rosalynn Carter (who occasionally attended cabinet meetings, was posted on actual diplomatic missions now and again, and who told her husband when he resigned from the Navy that she was ruining his life and hers); or, of course, Hellary.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

  152. @Steve Sailer
    @Sparkon

    There is a fair amount of evidence that George H.W. Bush's offshore oil company in Mexico provided logistical support for the Bay of Pigs landing.

    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Sparkon

    There is a fair amount of evidence too that the Bay of Pigs plot was hatched originally by none other than Richard Nixon and E. Howard Hunt, while Tricky Dick was Ike’s VP, and Hunt was involved in covert operations at the CIA.

    Dick Nixon is another guy who had memory problems with his whereabouts on Nov. 22, 1963.

    Richard Milhouse Nixon had arrived in Dallas on Nov. 20 to participate in a conference of the American Bottlers of Carbonated Beverages as legal representative of both Pepsi Cola and Pepsi president Donald Kendall on behalf of Mudge, Nixon, et al, where Nixon was a new partner, who had attracted Pepsi as a new client. Kendall owed Nixon for getting a Pepsi into the hands of Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev in Moscow at an expo there in 1959. Pepsi subsequently won a 15-year exclusive contract for the Soviet market, and Coke was shut out.

    Nixon was a remarkable rainmaker. Big clients followed him around like puppies.

    After Pres. Kennedy was killed, Richard Nixon told several different versions of how he first learned of JFK’s assassination. In all his fibs, Nixon claimed he had flown out of Dallas on the morning of Nov. 22, well before the assassination, and was riding in a cab in NYC when got the news, in one story from a man who ran across from a street corner, in another version from a woman who ran out of a house screaming and crying. There are still other versions.

    However, people who were at the Pepsi convention in Dallas said Nixon was still there when news of Pres. Kennedy’s shooting was announced.

    Dick Nixon had entirely legitimate business in Dallas at the time, so there was no apparent reason for him to lie about it, except for consciousness of guilt.

    Hmm. LBJ certainly had a motive to kill the President, Poppy Bush apparently had a busy day, but couldn’t remember any of it, and Tricky Dick lied to establish the fake fact that he wasn’t anywhere near the scene of the crime.

    Well, Steve’s article is about George W. Bush. Clearly, his paintings of immigrants are better than they look.

    Some JFK assassination researchers think young Shrub was hanging around Dealey Plaza on Nov. 22, 1963.

  153. @Buzz Mohawk
    @Steve Sailer


    I heard about JFK being shot from my friend Danny.
     
    Hmm... maybe Danny was CIA.

    The contrast between personal and professional can be pretty funny. I went to college with a girl who knew G.H.W. Bush and called him Poppy. He was vice president at the time. Her father was a lifelong friend of his and had played baseball with him at Yale. Hers was another prominent American family, a household name you might see on your car or flying over the Superbowl.

    She had wonderful things to say about Poppy. He visited every Christmas and always brought presents for the children. You'd think the guy was Santa Claus.

    I think he was just an old softie who was always willing to do things for his friends -- whether that meant bringing gifts for kids or providing logistical support for an amphibious attack.

    Note, he had a dominant wife.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    Note, he had a dominant wife.

    No, he had a wife who had a certain amount of asperity and a temperament less sanguine than was his. Wherever he wanted to move to next, she went with him without complaint. Brass tacks, she wasn’t any more dominant than Pat Nixon, just more sociable and authoritative in her methods (as you’d expect of a woman who had four sons). Compare her to Nancy Reagan, who could and did boss around the President’s chief of staff (at least when the issue was scheduling or ceremonial events); or Rosalynn Carter (who occasionally attended cabinet meetings, was posted on actual diplomatic missions now and again, and who told her husband when he resigned from the Navy that she was ruining his life and hers); or, of course, Hellary.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @Art Deco

    Your description of her is better than mine.

    When I'm wrong, I'm wrong.

  154. @Wilkey
    It’s funny that politicians like George W. Bush keep feeling the need to recognize the contributions of immigrants based on their status as immigrants but never feel the need to recognize the value of Americans based on our status as Americans. If an immigrant does something useful, worthy, or important his contributions point to the value of all immigrants. But if an American does something important it only reflects on him, not Americans as a group.

    Replies: @bro3886

    Except in the “minds” of the Bushes no white American ever does anything useful, worthy, or important unless it is in service to non-whites or billionaires.

  155. @Art Deco
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Note, he had a dominant wife.

    No, he had a wife who had a certain amount of asperity and a temperament less sanguine than was his. Wherever he wanted to move to next, she went with him without complaint. Brass tacks, she wasn't any more dominant than Pat Nixon, just more sociable and authoritative in her methods (as you'd expect of a woman who had four sons). Compare her to Nancy Reagan, who could and did boss around the President's chief of staff (at least when the issue was scheduling or ceremonial events); or Rosalynn Carter (who occasionally attended cabinet meetings, was posted on actual diplomatic missions now and again, and who told her husband when he resigned from the Navy that she was ruining his life and hers); or, of course, Hellary.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

    Your description of her is better than mine.

    When I’m wrong, I’m wrong.

  156. anon[348] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hibernian
    @Art Deco

    The meme originated with Marines who served with him. I'm not alleging, and I don't believe, that he was innocent. I go with the proposition that there was some kind of conspiracy, maybe a small one, with Oswald as one of the players. I don't believe, as some seem to, that all of JFK's enemies got together and did it, or almost all of them.

    Replies: @anon

    The meme originated with Marines who served with him.

    Oh yeah? Who were those Marines? Names?

    smh.

    How many times did Marine Oswald shoot the Marine rifle qual? What were his scores? Could that info be out there on the intertubes? Would that give us a clue about his ability to shoot, more so than rando Russian rabbit hunters?

    lol

    • Replies: @Hibernian
    @anon

    Don't know what the marksmanship standards for Marines were late '50s/ early 60s, but in a reserve component of the Army (ARNG) 1989 - 2010, including Basic Training at Fort Dix NJ 1989-1990, 23/40 (57.5%) for shooting at pop up targets and 26/40 (65%) for shooting at paper targets (not allowed in Basic, common in ARNG until the GWOT) were the minimums. Of course in Basic you'd really get yelled at for not doing any better than the minimum. My Dad was a Marine, and he impressed on me the fact that Marines (other than himself, of course) were not always ten feet tall, contrary to legend.

    Replies: @anon

  157. @Boethiuss
    @Lot


    Trump literally saved America from the complete disaster of Hillary narrowly beating Jeb in 2016, one in which Scalia is replaced by a 5th leftist vote and 11 million illegals get an amnesty, the vote, and a wave of chain migration that puts 1986 to shame.
     
    I'm not having this, on a couple of levels. I'm sure POTUS Hillary could have replaced Justice Scalia, but I very much doubt if she could have gotten amnesty, and in fact she might not have tried that hard for it.

    Mostly though, I'm disillusioned of the value of restricting immigration in the first place, and the price tag associated with that. And the lack of awareness from Trump supported regarding that price tag.

    Many Trump supporters tend to want to restrict immigration at any cost. But the way it's turned out, our support for Trump has cost us way more than whatever benefit we've gotten from Trump's immigration policy. I'd even venture that it's cost us more than whatever benefit we'd get if Trump actually were able to meaningfully curtail immigration, which of course he can't.

    Whatever the substance of immigration policy is worth, the cost of opposing liberalized immigration, either the status quo or further amnesty, has completely shot through the roof under the Trump Administration. And there is no one to blame for this except Trump supporters, and they are entirely oblivious to that.

    Replies: @AnotherDad, @Ben tillman, @anon, @ATBOTL

    Where is this gibberish coming from? Immigration restriction is the goal. Nothing else matters. No cost is too high. Looks like shills are now trying to move the dissident right away from opposing immigration.

    • Replies: @Boethiuss
    @ATBOTL


    Where is this gibberish coming from? Immigration restriction is the goal. Nothing else matters. No cost is too high. Looks like shills are now trying to move the dissident right away from opposing immigration.
     
    No no. I ain't having it.

    Objectively and substantively speaking, the Trump Presidency has been pretty much a nonentity riding the status quo. There's two SCOTUS Justices and a tax cut, and that's basically it.

    But in terms of solidarity and goodwill among Americans, we've all lost a lot. America in general has lost a lot, the Right specifically has lost a lot.

    Just within the last few days, there's been a typical twitter flame war over Trump suggesting he should be on Mount Rushmore. Everybody will forget about it soon enough, but it's the sort of thing the American people are sick of, and it's degrading our quality of life.

    Where does immigration restriction stack up against this? If we think it's the only thing that matters and what's going on now we just ignore, we're only fooling ourselves.
  158. @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    Not really. Just need a map and some darts.

    No, you need some actual knowledge to go with your ample supply of hot air.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Ukraine. Syria. Libya. For starters. It’s not as if there aren’t plenty more too, you smug nitwit.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    None of these places were ruined by Foreign Service officers, nor was the Foreign Service anything but a bit player in their political dramas.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  159. @anon
    @Hibernian

    The meme originated with Marines who served with him.

    Oh yeah? Who were those Marines? Names?

    smh.

    How many times did Marine Oswald shoot the Marine rifle qual? What were his scores? Could that info be out there on the intertubes? Would that give us a clue about his ability to shoot, more so than rando Russian rabbit hunters?

    lol

    Replies: @Hibernian

    Don’t know what the marksmanship standards for Marines were late ’50s/ early 60s, but in a reserve component of the Army (ARNG) 1989 – 2010, including Basic Training at Fort Dix NJ 1989-1990, 23/40 (57.5%) for shooting at pop up targets and 26/40 (65%) for shooting at paper targets (not allowed in Basic, common in ARNG until the GWOT) were the minimums. Of course in Basic you’d really get yelled at for not doing any better than the minimum. My Dad was a Marine, and he impressed on me the fact that Marines (other than himself, of course) were not always ten feet tall, contrary to legend.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Hibernian

    Don’t know what the marksmanship standards for Marines were late ’50s/ early 60s

    But you could find out, if you wanted to. That would give you an idea about Oswald's ability with a rifle. Then you could try to discuss an historical event intelligently.

    Yet you don't do any of that. Why are you so averse to facts?

  160. @ATBOTL
    @Boethiuss

    Where is this gibberish coming from? Immigration restriction is the goal. Nothing else matters. No cost is too high. Looks like shills are now trying to move the dissident right away from opposing immigration.

    Replies: @Boethiuss

    Where is this gibberish coming from? Immigration restriction is the goal. Nothing else matters. No cost is too high. Looks like shills are now trying to move the dissident right away from opposing immigration.

    No no. I ain’t having it.

    Objectively and substantively speaking, the Trump Presidency has been pretty much a nonentity riding the status quo. There’s two SCOTUS Justices and a tax cut, and that’s basically it.

    But in terms of solidarity and goodwill among Americans, we’ve all lost a lot. America in general has lost a lot, the Right specifically has lost a lot.

    Just within the last few days, there’s been a typical twitter flame war over Trump suggesting he should be on Mount Rushmore. Everybody will forget about it soon enough, but it’s the sort of thing the American people are sick of, and it’s degrading our quality of life.

    Where does immigration restriction stack up against this? If we think it’s the only thing that matters and what’s going on now we just ignore, we’re only fooling ourselves.

  161. anon[159] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hibernian
    @anon

    Don't know what the marksmanship standards for Marines were late '50s/ early 60s, but in a reserve component of the Army (ARNG) 1989 - 2010, including Basic Training at Fort Dix NJ 1989-1990, 23/40 (57.5%) for shooting at pop up targets and 26/40 (65%) for shooting at paper targets (not allowed in Basic, common in ARNG until the GWOT) were the minimums. Of course in Basic you'd really get yelled at for not doing any better than the minimum. My Dad was a Marine, and he impressed on me the fact that Marines (other than himself, of course) were not always ten feet tall, contrary to legend.

    Replies: @anon

    Don’t know what the marksmanship standards for Marines were late ’50s/ early 60s

    But you could find out, if you wanted to. That would give you an idea about Oswald’s ability with a rifle. Then you could try to discuss an historical event intelligently.

    Yet you don’t do any of that. Why are you so averse to facts?

  162. @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco

    Ukraine. Syria. Libya. For starters. It's not as if there aren't plenty more too, you smug nitwit.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    None of these places were ruined by Foreign Service officers, nor was the Foreign Service anything but a bit player in their political dramas.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Art Deco

    Are you willfully stupid, or does it just come naturally to you?

  163. @Art Deco
    @Mr. Anon

    None of these places were ruined by Foreign Service officers, nor was the Foreign Service anything but a bit player in their political dramas.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    Are you willfully stupid, or does it just come naturally to you?

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