The Unz Review • An Alternative Media Selection$
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 TeasersiSteve Blog
Flynn Effect of Rising IQs Sputtering Out in Rich Countries
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • B
Show CommentNext New CommentNext New ReplyRead More
ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
AgreeDisagreeThanksLOLTroll
These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Thanks, LOL, or Troll with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used three times during any eight hour period.
Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

From Intelligence:

Volume 96, January–February 2023, 101708

Ongoing trends of human intelligence
GerhardMeisenberg, RichardLynn
https://doi.org/10.1016/j.intell.2022.101708

Abstract
The aim of the study is to estimate the most recent trends of intelligence world-wide. We find that the most recent studies report mainly positive Flynn effects in economically less developed countries, but trivial and frequently negative Flynn effects in the economically most advanced countries. This is confirmed by an analysis of 48 countries in the 2000–2018 PISA tests, showing that high pre-existing IQ and school achievement are the best predictors of declining test scores. IQ gaps between countries are still large (e.g., 19 IQ points in PISA between East Asia and South Asia) but are diminishing world-wide. We predict that these trends, observed in adolescents today, will reduce cognitive gaps between the working-age populations of countries and world regions during coming decades. As is predicted by the well-established relationship between intelligence and economic growth, there is already evidence that the ongoing cognitive convergence is paralleled by global economic convergence. These developments raise questions as to how long this cognitive and economic convergence will continue, whether it will eliminate cognitive and economic gaps between countries entirely, and whether a condition with high levels of cognitive ability and economic prosperity is sustainable long-term.

 
Hide 145 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
Trim Comments?
  1. Anonymous[196] • Disclaimer says:

    I wonder if the Flynn effect is sputtering out and will possibly decline due to the smartphone and social media era that began in earnest in 2007.

    In the 20th century, the majorities in rich countries no longer had to spend their lives on the farm and in factories. They spent many years in school. There was TV, but above average IQ folks consumed lots of extended text via newspapers, magazines, novels, etc. If you look at old magazines like Nat Geographics from the 70s, even the ads have multiple wordy paragraphs of complex by today’s standards prose. People could and did spend hours of extended reading and contemplation.

    Nowadays, you hear about how even very intelligent people have difficulty maintaining attention and concentration due to the ubiquity of internet and smartphone distraction.

    • Agree: Angharad
    • Replies: @Houston 1992
    @Anonymous

    1) perhaps someone should create and market an app that simulates the 1950’s learning , cultural , social environment ?
    A few years ago some super elite admitted that he sent his kids to a school that was essentially computer and digital free …. He wanted his kids touching nature etc

    2) how are home schoolers performing ? Benefitting from Flynn effect ?

    Replies: @njguy73

    , @Moses
    @Anonymous

    Erm, let’s see the Flynn effect broken down by race.

    I suspect what is happening here is that increasing Brown + African population % is bringing down the IQ means.

    It’s just weighted average math. A 10 year old could do it.

  2. anonymous[233] • Disclaimer says:

    Kanye with a small at the end tells Trump to put God and America before Israel. Kanye is influenced by the anti-Jewish power ideas of Nick Fuentes.

    The next step is to follow the top recommendation of Philip Giraldi. There should be investigations into Jewish organizations lobbying Congress regarding their ties with the Israeli government.

    • Thanks: Angharad
    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
    @anonymous

    https://twitter.com/JonahPesner/status/1596624684887511043

    https://twitter.com/WalshFreedom/status/1596489443590168579

    https://twitter.com/DashDobrofsky/status/1596631252714418176

    Replies: @clifford brown, @Renard

  3. Intelligence:

    These developments raise questions as to how long this cognitive and economic convergence will continue, whether it will eliminate cognitive and economic gaps between countries entirely, and whether a condition with high levels of cognitive ability and economic prosperity is sustainable long-term.

    Billions must die

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/fear-of-a-black-planet-2/#comment-5341245 (#9)

  4. It’s hilarious that proponents of the idea that IQ gaps will disappear once economic development gaps close and who point to the Flynn effect of evidence of IQ’s malleability have to now cite a study coauthored by their Great Satan, Richard Lynn.

  5. We predict that these trends, observed in adolescents today, will reduce cognitive gaps between the working-age populations of countries and world regions during coming decades.

    So the good news is that everyone is getting more equal. Yeah! The bad news is that everyone is getting equally dumb. Oh, well. It just depends whether you are a glass “half full,” or “half empty,” kind of person.

    • Agree: Lady Strange
  6. I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it’s true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people – a trait I share with them, by the way – they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    • Agree: Almost Missouri, Kylie
    • Replies: @Peter Akuleyev
    @Pincher Martin

    I am Generation X - on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills. However they lack intellectual curiosity. Ideas like “culture”, “tradition” and “legacy” don’t mean anything to them. I blame the internet for this - all knowledge is at their fingertips, they don’t understand the sense of wonder one used to get from coming to an original answer to a question through painstaking research. When everything can be reduced to algorithms what does it mean to be “Croatian” or “a Mayflower descendant”? Just another marketing subcategory? I also blame the destruction of traditional identity for the rise of “trans” and other pseudo identities, but that would be a tangent.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Alec Leamas (working from home), @dr kill, @Pincher Martin

    , @Dr. DoomNGloom
    @Pincher Martin


    they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.
     
    Dogma gets run over by Karma's
    , @YetAnotherAnon
    @Pincher Martin

    "despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people"


    Young people are extremely religious, having been programmed by media* and social media (insert brackets where relevant) to the point where publicly denying the existence of "institutional racism" or "white supremacy" is almost certainly a lot worse for your career than, say, denying the divinity of Christ would have been in Victorian England.

    "Racist" is the new Mark Of Cain, and whoever is branded with the mark no longer has to be debated, acknowledged, employed or (maybe coming soon) given State benefits or medical treatment.

    Meanwhile people (as noted by Ghengis Khan) need something to hate, why not make white "racists" and Russians the target.


    "From victory unto victory, His armies he shall lead
    Til every foe is vanquished.."
     
    Just substitute "racist" for "foe".


    * nearly every TV advert in the UK shows mixed-race relationships - stuff aimed at families usually BM/WF, with the occasional light-skinned BF/WM pairing, stuff aimed at the young shows not only the traditional impossibly hip and good-looking group of friends, but impossibly unlikely mixed-race groupings. Asians are conspicuously absent (the occasional one in the impossible mixed race group), an advert featuring no blacks rare enough to be noteworthy.

    , @HammerJack
    @Pincher Martin

    Why is Gen X only 15 years long?

    Who is the Generations Commissioner who establishes these things? When was the very first Generation and why did it start then?

    Replies: @njguy73

    , @SFG
    @Pincher Martin

    There are a lot of intolerant people who can get you fired very easily these days, and the Internet never forgets. It’s a lot more dangerous to openly think for yourself these days.

    Replies: @Alec Leamas (working from home), @Pincher Martin

    , @J
    @Pincher Martin

    I am an old man still actively working. I am constantly surprised by the high quality of the young people I meet. They are serious, focused, ambitious. More than we were in our times.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

    , @James Speaks
    @Pincher Martin


    A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.
     
    A lack of intelligence, an abundance of political dogma, and a sense of self-righteousness is a recipe for catastrophe.

    FIFY
    , @epebble
    @Pincher Martin

    You may not be imagining things. There was a study commissioned in the 1980's titled A Nation at Risk. This was partly the impetus behind the No Student Left Behind Act in the 2000's. But the consequence seems to have been greater focus on test passing than learning.

    , @Corvinus
    @Pincher Martin

    “Alack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.“

    Neither is high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

  7. Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?

    • Replies: @Kylie
    @Redneck farmer

    "Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?"

    That was my first thought, only not in the form of a question.

    I do think the nature of social media has an adverse affect on one's ability to concentrate. I noticed my own ability is a bit compromised. l used to read Henry James for fun; still do but now it's his short stories rather than his novels

    Also I think fanaticism plays a part; in this case, leftwing fanaticism. It doesn't require critical thinking. (Indeed, critical thinking destroys it.) It requires only rote memorization of a few phrases and talking points, with feels and righteous indignation taking the place of thought and reason. This is why even today's academics and scholars sound so dumb.

    Replies: @HammerJack

    , @YetAnotherAnon
    @Redneck farmer

    It's lowered IQ because the child-bearing expectations of people from Crapholistan and Britain are very different. OK, we have an underclass*, but for the most part a Brit couple of average or above-average intelligence are likely to think - let's get our feet on the housing ladder then see about kids.

    But thanks to continual mass immigration, rents and house prices are through the roof while wages are held down, so it's very hard for our young couple. It's even more hard when every young woman is told that career comes before children, and women are more social creatures than men - that's healthy when the culture is healthy, not so good when the cultural messages come from people not so well disposed.

    Women are attending university at higher rates than men, so clocking up megadebt which is (ostensibly) repaid by an additional tax on earnings - just in the fertile years (the tax stops at 50).

    So it's hard for the Brits. But for the Crapholistanis it's fantastic - the benefit system means you get paid to have kids, and the cultural expectations of "a place of your own" are absent, there are many three-generational families in housing. Add chain migration from the home country, so your bride is from a place with YUGE expectations of women as child-bearers, and you have Bradford.

    https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/muslim-population-almost-doubles-space-decade-1824625


    An analysis of 2011 Census data for the Muslim Council of Britain (MCB) showed the number of Muslims rose by more than a million from 1.5million in 2011 to 2.7m in 2001, with a third below the age of 15.

    Deputy Prime Minister and Sheffield Hallam MP Nick Clegg said the report “helps give us a snapshot of the socio-economic challenges and opportunities now facing Britain’s Muslim communities.”

    He said: “What’s not in doubt is that British Muslims can be proud of the contribution they make to our country. Drawing on analysis like this, together, we can help create jobs, drive growth and enable more people to get on - building the stronger economy and fairer society we want for Britain’s future.”
     

    That'll be Nick "Facebook Global Affairs" Clegg.

    You can lower IQ by lowering the birth rate of intelligent women, or raising the birthrate of stupid ones. The UK has been doing both since at least the early 1970s.


    * http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4572219.stm


    Three schoolgirl sisters have given birth aged 12, 14 and 16.
    The Williams sisters, who live with their mother in a council house in Derby, feature in a BBC3 documentary called Desperate Midwives.

    Natasha, the oldest, Jade and Jemma, the youngest, are reported to receive £600 a week in benefits.

    Their mother Julie Atkins, 38, who said the girls were too young and had ruined their lives, blamed schools for providing poor quality sex education.
     

    , @Corvinus
    @Redneck farmer

    “Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?“

    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @John-.

  8. The importance of this research is underscored by recent reports about the end of the Flynn effect, and even its reversal, especially in several European countries

    Any chance this reversal is correlated to immigration?

  9. trivial and frequently negative Flynn effects in the economically most advanced countries

    The “negative Flynn effect” – it’s like getting a “negative raise”.

  10. Been around the world and found
    That only stupid people are breeding
    The cretins cloning and feeding
    And I don’t even own a TV

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Anonymous

    But smart people pushed man-is-woman and BLM and covid tyranny.

    A world run by smart people isn't necessarily smart because smart people will manipulate less smart people to keep the power.

  11. IQ gaps between countries are still large (e.g., 19 IQ points in PISA between East Asia and South Asia)

    That is an absolutely remarkable statistic.

    I wonder what the implications are for this stunning cognitive gap between the 2 regions.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @JohnnyWalker123

    "That is an absolutely remarkable statistic."

    Discussing IQ is the equivalent of a dose of saltpeter in your Captain Crunch. It is the death of the boner. Just imagine Steve, Charles, Sigundoo, and the rest of the badminton and watercress set frolicking bonerless at the Noah Cross Ranch. Not a pretty picture.

  12. @anonymous
    Kanye with a small at the end tells Trump to put God and America before Israel. Kanye is influenced by the anti-Jewish power ideas of Nick Fuentes.

    https://twitter.com/LegendaryEnergy/status/1597108128666898433

    The next step is to follow the top recommendation of Philip Giraldi. There should be investigations into Jewish organizations lobbying Congress regarding their ties with the Israeli government.

    Replies: @JohnnyWalker123

    • Replies: @clifford brown
    @JohnnyWalker123

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3u5vPOl6vs

    , @Renard
    @JohnnyWalker123

    Although I know next to nothing about this Nick Fuentes, if you can judge a man by his enemies he must be a stand-up guy.

  13. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    I am Generation X – on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills. However they lack intellectual curiosity. Ideas like “culture”, “tradition” and “legacy” don’t mean anything to them. I blame the internet for this – all knowledge is at their fingertips, they don’t understand the sense of wonder one used to get from coming to an original answer to a question through painstaking research. When everything can be reduced to algorithms what does it mean to be “Croatian” or “a Mayflower descendant”? Just another marketing subcategory? I also blame the destruction of traditional identity for the rise of “trans” and other pseudo identities, but that would be a tangent.

    • Replies: @Bill P
    @Peter Akuleyev


    Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z.
     
    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid's teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can't read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter. It's pretty bad. I don't live in a "super zip," but I'd say my county is pretty representative of middle America. It's probably somewhat above average, with a regional university and very good upward mobility according to Raj Chetty.

    When everything can be reduced to algorithms
     
    But everything can't be reduced to algorithms.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @That Would Be Telling, @Carol, @Known Fact

    , @Alec Leamas (working from home)
    @Peter Akuleyev


    I am Generation X – on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did.
     
    Is this reflected anywhere in objective inter-generational measures like SAT scores? Around the mid 1990s - which would have been the last years when Gen X was taking them - is when the SAT was "recentered" (to make the lower score the average) and Asian scores started peeling away from everyone else.

    I don't get the sense that Millennials or Zs have more raw intelligence - quite the opposite - but rather that they've been raised in technology and the early/proto regime ideology ("woke" or whatever) and are natives in it. They don't seem to find the modern world alienating in the same way that earlier generations do.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev

    , @dr kill
    @Peter Akuleyev

    Thank you for your comment. Chinese and Indian students have long demonstrated a similar skill set (long on memorization but short on creativity).
    I hope there are a few free thinkers in your cohort.

    , @Pincher Martin
    @Peter Akuleyev

    I agree our Generation X isn't an impressive cohort. But I didn't grow up believing it was impressive. Yet according to test scores, we were a higher-scoring generation than the Baby Boomers and thus the Flynn Effect was still applicable.

    According to this research (which had been found several times before), kids born from the 1990s onwards no longer show those same gains. Some research even show a decline.


    The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills.
     
    Perhaps. But I bet their superior knowledge is more specialized and less broad than it was in the past. As you say, they don't have much curiosity.
  14. Brown Out.

    • Replies: @Pincher Martin
    @Wokechoke

    The results hold even when controlled for race.

  15. I wonder how much of this is due to low-IQ third worlders moving to first world countries?

    • Agree: Gordo
  16. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Dogma gets run over by Karma’s

    • LOL: Pincher Martin
  17. @Peter Akuleyev
    @Pincher Martin

    I am Generation X - on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills. However they lack intellectual curiosity. Ideas like “culture”, “tradition” and “legacy” don’t mean anything to them. I blame the internet for this - all knowledge is at their fingertips, they don’t understand the sense of wonder one used to get from coming to an original answer to a question through painstaking research. When everything can be reduced to algorithms what does it mean to be “Croatian” or “a Mayflower descendant”? Just another marketing subcategory? I also blame the destruction of traditional identity for the rise of “trans” and other pseudo identities, but that would be a tangent.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Alec Leamas (working from home), @dr kill, @Pincher Martin

    Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z.

    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter. It’s pretty bad. I don’t live in a “super zip,” but I’d say my county is pretty representative of middle America. It’s probably somewhat above average, with a regional university and very good upward mobility according to Raj Chetty.

    When everything can be reduced to algorithms

    But everything can’t be reduced to algorithms.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Bill P

    Culture is losing its national/ regional / local roots. That's the meaning of the expression used by Peter Akuleyev above: There is no algorithm for what it means to be a Croatian. - Seen from the EU-pudding perspective, it hardly matters whether you are from Croatia or from Andalusia or from Norwegian Sameland. - If you work as a software developper in Walldorf/Heidelberg (SAP), these differences - dematirialize/evaporate/diffundate... = somehow disappear - and dematerialize even. This means - we are - still - living in Karl marx not least modern times, which disrupt all kinds of historical bonds and tear them into pieces...(see the Communist Manifesto).

    , @That Would Be Telling
    @Bill P


    I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter.
     
    What methods does this school system use to teach children how to read? Phonics, or do they just pretend as our betters started to do in 1930 with the first Dick and Jane and Their Running Dog Spot basal reader? Or is this possibly a reflection of keeping physical schools closed beyond early 2021?

    Replies: @Bill P, @HammerJack

    , @Carol
    @Bill P

    This jibes with what I've read lurking at teachers' forums. And these are liberal teachers speaking against interest, that all the decades of "reform" have done nothing. Students are dumber than ever. A good one-third or more can't read on-level or even close.

    It's not even a phonics/whole language problem. The students simply refuse to engage and do not care to learn anything.

    Teachers have no real authority or disciplinary powers now and I think that causes an instinctive lack of respect by children.

    Replies: @Technite78

    , @Known Fact
    @Bill P


    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read.
     
    You're lucky if the teacher can read
  18. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    “despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people”

    Young people are extremely religious, having been programmed by media* and social media (insert brackets where relevant) to the point where publicly denying the existence of “institutional racism” or “white supremacy” is almost certainly a lot worse for your career than, say, denying the divinity of Christ would have been in Victorian England.

    “Racist” is the new Mark Of Cain, and whoever is branded with the mark no longer has to be debated, acknowledged, employed or (maybe coming soon) given State benefits or medical treatment.

    Meanwhile people (as noted by Ghengis Khan) need something to hate, why not make white “racists” and Russians the target.

    “From victory unto victory, His armies he shall lead
    Til every foe is vanquished..”

    Just substitute “racist” for “foe”.

    * nearly every TV advert in the UK shows mixed-race relationships – stuff aimed at families usually BM/WF, with the occasional light-skinned BF/WM pairing, stuff aimed at the young shows not only the traditional impossibly hip and good-looking group of friends, but impossibly unlikely mixed-race groupings. Asians are conspicuously absent (the occasional one in the impossible mixed race group), an advert featuring no blacks rare enough to be noteworthy.

    • Agree: HammerJack
  19. Late in his life the environmentalist Paul Ehrlich started to question to himself if his pleas to limit population growth were doing more harm than good since primarily only college girls appeared to be listening to him. Limitless population growth from less educated natives and immigrants more than offset any voluntary reductions in numbers of children among the more intelligent.

    If you combine the increased quantities of people causing strain in an era of increasingly limited natural resources here in the U.S. with decreased quality in the form of dropping IQ levels it will become increasingly difficult to maintain our current standard of living. You have already seen decreasing life expectancy in five of the last seven years, 2015-2017 and 2020-2021. 2022 is showing increases in overall mortality, possibly due to less intelligent people making less intelligent health choices, harmful aftereffects of the unsafe Covid vaccines and a deteriorating economy. Adjusted for inflation, incomes here in the U.S. have dropped 19 straight months in a row.

    • Thanks: HammerJack
    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Mark G.


    Late in his life the environmentalist Paul Ehrlich started to question to himself if his pleas to limit population growth were doing more harm than good since primarily only college girls appeared to be listening to him.
     
    White people sure were listening, and the CCP I suppose.
  20. @Bill P
    @Peter Akuleyev


    Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z.
     
    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid's teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can't read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter. It's pretty bad. I don't live in a "super zip," but I'd say my county is pretty representative of middle America. It's probably somewhat above average, with a regional university and very good upward mobility according to Raj Chetty.

    When everything can be reduced to algorithms
     
    But everything can't be reduced to algorithms.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @That Would Be Telling, @Carol, @Known Fact

    Culture is losing its national/ regional / local roots. That’s the meaning of the expression used by Peter Akuleyev above: There is no algorithm for what it means to be a Croatian. – Seen from the EU-pudding perspective, it hardly matters whether you are from Croatia or from Andalusia or from Norwegian Sameland. – If you work as a software developper in Walldorf/Heidelberg (SAP), these differences – dematirialize/evaporate/diffundate… = somehow disappear – and dematerialize even. This means – we are – still – living in Karl marx not least modern times, which disrupt all kinds of historical bonds and tear them into pieces…(see the Communist Manifesto).

  21. Anonymous[137] • Disclaimer says:

    OT: Merkle’s boner.

    https://mocoshow.com/blog/pilot-and-passenger-rescued-after-crashing-into-power-lines-power-restored-to-most-residents/

    Pilot and Passenger Rescued After Crashing Into Power Lines; Power Restored to Most Residents

    THE MOCO SHOW
    Patrick Herron November 28, 2022

    The pilot and passenger of a small plane that crashed into a power line tower near Goshen Road and Rothbury Drive in Gaithersburg/Montgomery Village around 5:30pm on Sunday were successfully rescued without incident by EMS personnel using two specialty crane/boom trucks just after midnight on Monday. According to Maryland State Police, the pilot was identified as Patrick Merkle, 65, of Washington, D.C. and the passenger was identified as Jan Williams, 66, of Louisiana. Both were transported to the hospital with serious injuries. The plane was also removed from the power lines early Monday morning…

  22. OT Steve, have you seen this?
    https://theobjectivestandard.com/2022/07/classified-the-untold-story-of-racial-classification-in-america-by-david-e-bernstein/
    On the one hand, a respectable mainstream academic clings to the “no such thing as race (and no way to begin to define races)” stuff; on the other hand, this is probably the most aggressive — and most normie-accessible — rubbishing of Directive 15 and government race favoritism to date. Includes stories of race hoaxers who got different parts if the government to declare them to be different races.

    Take, for example, the “Asian” classification. People often assume that this term refers to people from East Asian countries such as China, Japan, Korea, and Vietnam. But according to the federal government, it also includes Pakistanis, Indians, and Indonesians, who generally don’t view themselves as culturally, historically, or even geographically related to people of East Asian ancestry.

    The “Hispanic” classification is even more capricious. It was created by government fiat in the 1970s to encompass people whose ancestry is derived from Spanish-speaking countries. Basing a classification on language rather than history or biology is peculiar, given that language is not an immutable characteristic acquired at birth. But the Hispanic category also includes people who do not speak Spanish, such as Brazilians, who speak Portuguese, and immigrants from Spain who speak Catalan. What’s more, residents of Spanish-speaking countries do not call themselves “Hispanic,” and polls reveal that half of American-citizen Hispanics consider themselves white.

    The results of this bizarre taxonomy are sometimes silly. When Steven Spielberg’s remake of West Side Story appeared last year, studio publicists boasted that the cast would be racially “authentic” because the Puerto Rican character Maria would be portrayed by Hispanic actress Rachel Zegler. But Zegler is of Colombian and European ancestry and has no Puerto Rican heritage. “Exactly how casting a half-Colombian, half-European actress to play a Puerto Rican character is culturally sensitive was left unexplained,” writes Bernstein (33).

    • Replies: @Spect3r
    @J.Ross

    "Emigrants from Spain who speak Catalan"
    What?
    Catalan is a dialect specific to a region in Spain, not a national language.

    Replies: @J.Ross

  23. You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them.

    The curriculum has changed quite a bit over the years. At least where I am, much more is thrown at kids from kindergarten, so that many can’t develop at a reasonable pace, and many don’t learn to read or do basic math by third grade. The smart kids with helpful parents do well, but many others are hopelessly lost. What sense does it make to have second graders who can’t read diagram sentences or identify parts of speech? Math isn’t taught any better. Instead of drilling the basics, so that kids have something to build on, kids who don’t know 2+2=4, by any means at all, are expected to do number bonds, identify missing parts of equations, or explain how problems work when they can’t do basic math or read and write.

    I know someone who teaches kindergarten and she spends an hour a day in pre-planning meetings, and hours more writing plans, only to have kids trace letters and numbers, sing songs, and count and recite letters aloud. With all the money Americans spend on education, we get very little in return. Instead, we rely on the surplus educated from the rest of the world to fill the shortage of “smart” Americans because our public schools are so bad. We really need new elites.

    • Replies: @HammerJack
    @OilcanFloyd


    It’s Never Too Early to Teach Our Babies About Race
    By Sarah Ezrin on May 27, 2021 — Fact checked by Maria Gifford

    Babies aren’t colorblind. I’m teaching my infant to be anti-racist...

    What could I do to make difference? (sic)

    I looked at my son and thought of all the sons of the world, especially those taken too soon, like George Floyd. The answer was right in front of me.

    https://www.healthline.com/health/parenting/it-is-never-too-early-to-teach-our-babies-about-race

     

    If your infant son shows signs of racist thoughts — we all know how to recognize them by now — hit him hard over the head with a 2x4, which you should always keep handy for just this purpose. That'll teach him.

    Replies: @Foreign Expert

    , @Barbarossa
    @OilcanFloyd

    It's all about optics. Some planner bureaucrat can show what "advanced" material kids are doing these days and look good. If the teachers and admin can fudge it so that it looks like kids are sort of passing then the BS is perpetuated. It's immaterial if anyone learns anything. It's perfectly satisfactory if it only appears that kids are learning.

    It's too bad though since it's a terrible disservice to our kids. And when we are all screwed from the lack of basic competency in society (a dynamic which is already playing out) we'll all be paying the price.

    , @Carol
    @OilcanFloyd

    Yes they've bumped curriculum up at least a year: reading in K instead of First. Multiplication in Third, Algebra in Eighth.

    Because it's the 21st Century, and if you treat them like wizzes they'll rise to the challenge right?

    But the dirty little secret is that kids are no more ready intellectually for subjects a year earlier than they would have been in 1960.

  24. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    Why is Gen X only 15 years long?

    Who is the Generations Commissioner who establishes these things? When was the very first Generation and why did it start then?

    • Replies: @njguy73
    @HammerJack

    It was Douglas Coupland. Before him, no one ever thought in terms of generations.

  25. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    There are a lot of intolerant people who can get you fired very easily these days, and the Internet never forgets. It’s a lot more dangerous to openly think for yourself these days.

    • Agree: HammerJack
    • Disagree: Je Suis Omar Mateen
    • Replies: @Alec Leamas (working from home)
    @SFG


    There are a lot of intolerant people who can get you fired very easily these days, and the Internet never forgets. It’s a lot more dangerous to openly think for yourself these days.
     
    I think that the subtext of "cancellation" in businesses and industries is a sublimated response to Boomers (primarily) hanging on to power too long - the youth, which is proportionately more brown/female or gender creative/gay has constructed a set of ridiculous, internally-inconsistent rules which gives them a power to balance the entrenched Boomers and to move them out. You can't move the old white male law partner who manages lucrative long-standing client relationships (and receives enormous remuneration) out by argument or appeals to fairness, but you can make nebulous allegations that he acted "inappropriately" with a female junior associate or two that made her feel "unsafe." But the blackmail doesn't end with sending the old partner off to an abrupt end in disgrace - the incident itself is a lesson as to why we "need" more women of color in firm leadership!
    , @Pincher Martin
    @SFG

    I've never openly discussed my views at work, and I don't like people who do. That's true even when I agree with their views. I've always been the kind of person who believes that you don't discuss politics or religion at work.

    So that doesn't bother me. I don't base my views on workplace discussions because I never had those kinds of discussions. Young kids just don't seem particularly bright.

  26. @Bill P
    @Peter Akuleyev


    Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z.
     
    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid's teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can't read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter. It's pretty bad. I don't live in a "super zip," but I'd say my county is pretty representative of middle America. It's probably somewhat above average, with a regional university and very good upward mobility according to Raj Chetty.

    When everything can be reduced to algorithms
     
    But everything can't be reduced to algorithms.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @That Would Be Telling, @Carol, @Known Fact

    I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter.

    What methods does this school system use to teach children how to read? Phonics, or do they just pretend as our betters started to do in 1930 with the first Dick and Jane and Their Running Dog Spot basal reader? Or is this possibly a reflection of keeping physical schools closed beyond early 2021?

    • Replies: @Bill P
    @That Would Be Telling

    I know they used phonics. I think it's partly the lockdowns and school closures, although my kid's school wasn't closed for too long.The COVID hysteria scared a lot of parents into keeping their kids out of school even when the schools reopened. Not only because of the virus and related fears but because of a general distrust that came about due to masking and vaccine mandates.

    But there's more to it than COVID. Parents tend to be either hyper-invested or not invested at all. Millennial parenting as far as I can tell is pretty lousy due to selection effects. There's a big difference between the parents of my oldest and youngest kids' classmates, who are ten years apart -- quite a few of my oldest kid's classmates' parents are baby boomers while most of my youngest kid's are Millennials. Millennial fertility has fallen off a cliff, but guess which ones are still having kids? Not the ones you'd hope for -- at least not in significant numbers.

    Politics aside, I'm pleased with the quality of instruction at my kid's school. I don't care for the LGBTQ stuff (totally inappropriate), but under state law parents can opt out of it. The problem isn't the schools as far as I can tell, but rather the wider culture and perverse economic incentives and disincentives.

    , @HammerJack
    @That Would Be Telling

    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school. I don't even know how common it is. It does dislocate you a bit in first grade.

    Replies: @That Would Be Telling, @Bardon Kaldlan

  27. @Peter Akuleyev
    @Pincher Martin

    I am Generation X - on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills. However they lack intellectual curiosity. Ideas like “culture”, “tradition” and “legacy” don’t mean anything to them. I blame the internet for this - all knowledge is at their fingertips, they don’t understand the sense of wonder one used to get from coming to an original answer to a question through painstaking research. When everything can be reduced to algorithms what does it mean to be “Croatian” or “a Mayflower descendant”? Just another marketing subcategory? I also blame the destruction of traditional identity for the rise of “trans” and other pseudo identities, but that would be a tangent.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Alec Leamas (working from home), @dr kill, @Pincher Martin

    I am Generation X – on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did.

    Is this reflected anywhere in objective inter-generational measures like SAT scores? Around the mid 1990s – which would have been the last years when Gen X was taking them – is when the SAT was “recentered” (to make the lower score the average) and Asian scores started peeling away from everyone else.

    I don’t get the sense that Millennials or Zs have more raw intelligence – quite the opposite – but rather that they’ve been raised in technology and the early/proto regime ideology (“woke” or whatever) and are natives in it. They don’t seem to find the modern world alienating in the same way that earlier generations do.

    • Replies: @Peter Akuleyev
    @Alec Leamas (working from home)

    I should note - the kids I see are growing up in the hothouse pressure of affluent East Coast suburbs. It probably is wrong to generalize about Gen Z from them. What is interesting about these future elites is that they are being consciously raised as academic elites in a manner that would have seemed very alien in the US before the 1990s. The intellectual inequality inside Gen Z will be more like India or Southern Europe if we continue along this path.

  28. If you work as a software developper in Walldorf/Heidelberg (SAP), these differences – dematirialize/evaporate/diffundate… = somehow disappear – and dematerialize even

    “If” you are one of those people. Most of us still aren’t. This class has always been with us. Maybe there are more of them these days – a lot more, even – but the problem is not so much their existence as it is the childish, self-centered philosophy they adhere to as a class.

    • Replies: @Bill B.
    @Bill P


    ...the problem is not so much their existence as it is the childish, self-centered philosophy they adhere to as a class.
     
    I remain dubious that any great proportion of peoples are genuine "anywheres" (to use David Goodhart's term). In my experience everyone has a 'home' even if it is one that they do not wish to return to.

    A great swath of our cognitive but shallow elites may be able to distract themselves for their entire lifetimes so that they never have to get around to resolving this.
  29. So does this happen in cycles? There were the ‘Dark Ages’ when advanced learning was forgotten for a time (knowledge literally burned in the Library of Alexandria) and the clerics successfully kept wisdom alive in monastic groups. Are we entering another ‘low period’ where superstition and stupidity reign for a time? If so, that implies a future Renaissance, so stock up your physical books on medicine, engineering, metallurgy, etc., and decamp to a like-minded community to wait it out. Teach your kids to hunt, fight, farm, read, etc. Have them do likewise in concert with ideologically similar families. When the federal reach eventually becomes impotent, everything becomes local, same as always.

    All of this has been done before, and if you personally won’t do it, others are already in the process of doing so. With some amount of preparation, ‘life finds a way,’ eh?

  30. @SFG
    @Pincher Martin

    There are a lot of intolerant people who can get you fired very easily these days, and the Internet never forgets. It’s a lot more dangerous to openly think for yourself these days.

    Replies: @Alec Leamas (working from home), @Pincher Martin

    There are a lot of intolerant people who can get you fired very easily these days, and the Internet never forgets. It’s a lot more dangerous to openly think for yourself these days.

    I think that the subtext of “cancellation” in businesses and industries is a sublimated response to Boomers (primarily) hanging on to power too long – the youth, which is proportionately more brown/female or gender creative/gay has constructed a set of ridiculous, internally-inconsistent rules which gives them a power to balance the entrenched Boomers and to move them out. You can’t move the old white male law partner who manages lucrative long-standing client relationships (and receives enormous remuneration) out by argument or appeals to fairness, but you can make nebulous allegations that he acted “inappropriately” with a female junior associate or two that made her feel “unsafe.” But the blackmail doesn’t end with sending the old partner off to an abrupt end in disgrace – the incident itself is a lesson as to why we “need” more women of color in firm leadership!

  31. @That Would Be Telling
    @Bill P


    I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter.
     
    What methods does this school system use to teach children how to read? Phonics, or do they just pretend as our betters started to do in 1930 with the first Dick and Jane and Their Running Dog Spot basal reader? Or is this possibly a reflection of keeping physical schools closed beyond early 2021?

    Replies: @Bill P, @HammerJack

    I know they used phonics. I think it’s partly the lockdowns and school closures, although my kid’s school wasn’t closed for too long.The COVID hysteria scared a lot of parents into keeping their kids out of school even when the schools reopened. Not only because of the virus and related fears but because of a general distrust that came about due to masking and vaccine mandates.

    But there’s more to it than COVID. Parents tend to be either hyper-invested or not invested at all. Millennial parenting as far as I can tell is pretty lousy due to selection effects. There’s a big difference between the parents of my oldest and youngest kids’ classmates, who are ten years apart — quite a few of my oldest kid’s classmates’ parents are baby boomers while most of my youngest kid’s are Millennials. Millennial fertility has fallen off a cliff, but guess which ones are still having kids? Not the ones you’d hope for — at least not in significant numbers.

    Politics aside, I’m pleased with the quality of instruction at my kid’s school. I don’t care for the LGBTQ stuff (totally inappropriate), but under state law parents can opt out of it. The problem isn’t the schools as far as I can tell, but rather the wider culture and perverse economic incentives and disincentives.

    • Thanks: That Would Be Telling
  32. For what it’s worth, today is Cyber Monday. Our sons’ online charter school has the day off because the Internet will be too slow. Their sister is present at the brick-and-mortar school.

  33. I haven’t had a chance to read the full article, but without a very important corrective factor, these findings about the decline in PISA scores are meaningless. The developed countries of the western world have seen millions of low-ability third worlders arrive in the last decades. Sweden’s PISA results have shown this effect nicely – their 2015-18 results put them in the bottom half of Europe, while their 2021 results put them back in the top half. I wonder what kind of educational development this was the result of? None, they simply removed migrant children from the survey…

    • Thanks: Almost Missouri
  34. Steve wrote many times about women ‘closing the gap’ in track with men and if you just extrapolate that progress line forward, soon women will be running as fast as men. or not, as that makes no sense.

    third worlders are never going to be smart. but there sure are going to be a lot of them. a bigger, dumber world is the locked in future.

    my contention for a while has been that the smartest people are still getting slightly smarter every generation, by about 1 wechsler point. which in some ways is the only thing that matters. it’s possible that meanwhile the average person might have stopped getting smarter every generation. both things can be happening at the same time. there is no contradiction.

    likewise, the best athletes are probably still getting slightly better every generation, but at the same time, the average person is getting fatter, slower, and less athletic every generation. which is a problem for the military and the medical system. but not a problem for sports leagues.

    • Agree: Polistra
  35. A quick review of the bidding (my perspective, but I think basically correct):

    — the Flynn effect since the later half of the 20th century has been almost entirely in Raven’s type tests, with only trivial improvement in verbal IQ scores

    — I think you can helpfully break Flynn effect had two components:
    1) real environmental stuff that raised actual smarts–better nutrition, antibiotics and vaccines (less stunting) and universal education (brain wiring)
    2) more exposure to “symbolic processing” that allows people to come into Raven’s type tests and “get it” right away. This sort of stuff is useful does make people somewhat “smarter”, but it does not really make them more intelligent in the “taking on this new job and figuring it out” or “hey there’s a better way to do this” or “don’t do stupid stuff and screw up” kind of way

    — Only the latter is going on to some limited extent (with cell phones, games) in advanced nations.

    — Both Flynn#1–real gains in physical capability, educational exposure–and a whole lot of Flynn #2–with the 3rd world cell phone explosion–are going great guns in the 3rd world.

    — The advanced nations with welfare states, universal medical care (building mutational load) and feminism and female careerism are now solidly dysgenic … and are importing much dumber people from the 3rd world.

    ~~~

    Long term: There is no civilization without eugenic fertility. Period end of story. Math.

    The denial of this from the minoritarians “racism!”, “holocaust!”, “Nazis!” hysterics is absolutely toxic.

    Nations that do not go down this route of toxic, cancerous, stupidity and improve their population will win.

    • Agree: Houston 1992, Polistra
    • Thanks: Coemgen
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    I'm pretty sure the Chinese government is aware of all of these facts.
    And not shy about acting on them, and assessing the impact of dysgenic fertility on its rival nations.

    Replies: @AnotherDad

    , @AnotherDad
    @AnotherDad

    Probably within the next century we'll have plenty of folks doing gene editing, picking advantageous variants and nixing deleterious mutations.

    The only question is whether Western man has any nations left by the time, or whether this effort is led by the Chinese insuring their dominance.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  36. Faber-Castell wants you to think that your pencils are still made by experienced old white folk. This is obviously shot at their home plant near Nuremberg– or at their marginally “North American” one in Costa Rica:

    Here’s where their factories really are:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faber-Castell#Manufacturing

    • Thanks: Jim Don Bob, Polistra
  37. You’d think with Asians pulling away academically, we wouldn’t be getting much stupider. But there’s likely a lot of rural red state academic talent that goes undeveloped.

    I checked out the recent NAEP data and first impressions were that Massachusetts is coming back to the pack (though still very good) and that Florida is improving dramatically.

    • Replies: @Brutusale
    @Jack P

    Massachusetts is coming back to the pack because 23% of MA public school enrollees are now Hispanic. When the results of the past two years of flight from public schools start to come in, it'll be even worse.

  38. That’s because the Flynn Effect never existed…SAT scores in the US have been declining for 60 years, and kept declining even after the SAT “renormed” in 1996 and handed out between 60 and 100 free points to everyone…

    • Replies: @JosephD
    @pyrrhus

    The Flynn effect is well established. The SAT scores trended downwards (at least in part) due to a larger cohort taking the exam. When a test goes from "thinking of going to the Ivy league?" to "thinking of going to college?" something has to give.

    Replies: @John Johnson

  39. Are IQ tests consistent over time? I think they’ve watered down the SATs and the scoring.

    • Replies: @pyrrhus
    @Flip

    They have greatly watered down the SATs, and still the scores are declining....

  40. In other news, Swedes suddenly like throwing hand grenades around, the English are really into pimping out their children, people are running away from California because it’s not a great place to live, and not-so-nice Minnesotans are using welfare scams to fund Al-Shabab.

    • Thanks: Polistra
    • Replies: @That Would Be Telling
    @Ghost of Bull Moose


    In other news, Swedes suddenly like throwing hand grenades around
     
    While the list now ends abruptly in 2018 and there's a banner at the topic signaling it's a target of deletion, you knew this was getting bad when Wikipedia created an article "List of grenade attacks in Sweden."

    the English are really into pimping out their children
     
    When the police are implicitly in cahoots with the groomers and focus their efforts on enraged parents, you just might have a hostile ruling elite (since 1066) that disarmed you a century earlier and post-WWII made effective self-defense illegal.

    Still says something, but echoing @AnotherDad said elite ran a eugenics program starting in the 13th Century that physically removed 1-2% of the most violent members of society every year. Achieved a steadily decreasing level of interpersonal violence until post-WWII.
  41. @Bill P
    @Peter Akuleyev


    Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z.
     
    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid's teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can't read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter. It's pretty bad. I don't live in a "super zip," but I'd say my county is pretty representative of middle America. It's probably somewhat above average, with a regional university and very good upward mobility according to Raj Chetty.

    When everything can be reduced to algorithms
     
    But everything can't be reduced to algorithms.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @That Would Be Telling, @Carol, @Known Fact

    This jibes with what I’ve read lurking at teachers’ forums. And these are liberal teachers speaking against interest, that all the decades of “reform” have done nothing. Students are dumber than ever. A good one-third or more can’t read on-level or even close.

    It’s not even a phonics/whole language problem. The students simply refuse to engage and do not care to learn anything.

    Teachers have no real authority or disciplinary powers now and I think that causes an instinctive lack of respect by children.

    • Replies: @Technite78
    @Carol


    It’s not even a phonics/whole language problem. The students simply refuse to engage and do not care to learn anything.

    Teachers have no real authority or disciplinary powers now and I think that causes an instinctive lack of respect by children.
     
    Kids would eat ice cream, candy, and drink soda all day if not supervised. Wait, maybe that's why so many kids are overweight these days. All kidding aside, most children aren't self-directed and motivated enough to learn the skills required to make an honest living. They have to be constructively pushed by both their parents and their teachers to learn useful skills. Otherwise the whole enterprise is just government sponsored day care.
  42. A key reason why rich countries are becoming stupider is the great sea of third-world migration washing away their core populations. Ed West has just written off the USA as sliding into inevitable Brazil-style mediocrity. (Don’t worry: the UK is not far behind.)

    What the experts got wrong about migration

    Comments Share 26 November 2022, 10:15am
    On New Year’s Day, 2014, during those sunny, innocent times of Cameron, Clegg and Miliband, Labour MP Keith Vaz headed down to Luton Airport to greet new arrivals coming off the planes.

    There he met a rather bemused young Romanian man, Victor Spirescu, who had no idea he was going to become the face of migration on the day that citizens of Romania and Bulgaria were allowed free movement within the EU.

    It was a sort of mini-publicity stunt by Vaz, but all for a good cause: a response to fear mongering by the Right-wing press who warned that we’d be ‘flooded’ by Romanians, and predictions by MigrationWatch that’d we have 50,000 new arrivals a year from the A2 countries (as Romania and Bulgaria were called).

    Twitter that day was full of journalists and other public intellectuals laughing about how we were going to be ‘swamped’. Why would Romanians, after all, want to come here, to this miserable rainy island?

    [MORE]

    ‘We’ve seen no evidence of people who have rushed out and bought tickets in order to arrive because it’s the 1st of January,’ Vaz concluded.

    Various publications, with the ill-founded confidence so often found in the journalist trade, soon declared that the Romanian influx was a conservative fantasy.

    ‘Eastern European invasion comes to nothing’, the Independent declared on the day, just a tad prematurely you might say.

    A Guardian commentator suggested the year before that the number of Romanians and Bulgarians arriving might actually fall following accession, and that ‘all the “invasion” predictions… have more in common with astrology than demography.’

    The Open Democracy think-tank declared that notions that ‘people will move to richer countries to earn more money’ are too simplistic. ‘Serious migration studies, however, are aware that the drivers of migration are much more complex and that migration systems, migration networks, migration politics, opportunity-constraints structures, social and human capital, perceptions and imaginations, individual characteristics and emotions play crucial roles.’

    You, an idiot: people will move if they’re offered loads more money.

    Me, a think-tanker: opportunity-constraints structures, social and human capital, perceptions and imaginations…

    In the summer of that year Migration Matters, a campaign chaired by Tony Blair’s Migration Minister Barbara Roche, predicted that the number of Romanians and Bulgarians arriving would peak at 20,000 pear year and that ‘the anti-immigration lobby have cried wolf once too often’.

    They accused opponents, chiefly MigrationWatch and Ukip, of ‘pursu[ing] a partisan and divisive political agenda.’

    As it turned out, in the year to September 2015, 206,000 Romanians and Bulgarians took out a National Insurance number, meaning they were registering to work here. By late 2017, there were 413,000 Romanian and Bulgarians living in Britain, suggesting 90,000 had arrived each year since January 2014, while just 6,200 Britons had made the opposite journey.

    By mid-2018, there were more than 400,000 Romanians in Britain, making them one of the largest national minorities in England. The real figure is hard to tell, because the British state has lost the capacity or will to count the number of foreign residents, and it may be higher.

    I visited Romania in September, travelling across the seriously beautiful region of Transylvania, from the Hungarian enclave of Sfântu Gheorghe (or, if you want the considerably more challenging Magyar name, Sepsiszentgyörgy) to the dynamic, very Habsburgy city of Cluj. I was excited, at one point, to see a bear by the side of the road, but then the bear population here has been expanding for some years, in part because the human population is in freefall.

    In much of this region the Germans have all left, many of the Hungarians have left, and now the Romanians are leaving, too; many are now to be found along a bus route from Luton Airport to central London, congregating in parts of Haringey that were once heavily Greek and Turkish Cypriot. They work hard, often live in very Dickensian conditions, and grind away to improve their lot; many have settled happily in England, although poor Spirescu, tragically, was not one of them.

    The experts had been wrong about migration before. In 2004 the government vastly underestimated the numbers coming from A8 countries, chiefly Poland. The same thing is happening today with Albanian migration, and the inability of commentators to appreciate the potential numbers involved, and why this is a big problem.

    The scale of immigration in the 2000s and 2010s led to the rise of Ukip, the referendum and the political chaos that followed; what follows now we can’t yet say, but no one has seemed to have learned the lesson: that in the 21s century, because of easier travel, smartphones, smuggling networks and establishment communities in the West, the sheer scale of potential migration is astronomical. Yet people often have a very 20th or even 19th century understanding of how much people are able and willing to move, which makes them vastly underestimate the potential numbers arriving.

    The Turkish Cypriots of north London are a case in point, the example Paul Collier used in Exodus to show the huge extent of potential migration between countries with different levels of wealth.

    Because of colonial links, North Cyprus had free movement with Britain and so provided a test case: as a result, there are now more Turkish Cypriots in Britain than in Cyprus. In fact, not only did the majority of Turkish Cypriots move, but back in their homeland they become outnumbered by arrivals from a third, even poorer country, mainland Turkey, who are permitted to settle there.

    In a theoretical world of open borders, Britons would be outnumbered very quickly; infrastructure would start to buckle under the strain, and governments would find it difficult to increase the necessary number of houses, schools, hospitals and other services for this expanded population, because society would now lack the social capital and cohesion to make the personal sacrifices. People would begin to lose faith in the police, a difficult role in such a transient and diverse society, and politics would become increasingly unstable and aligned along ethnic lines.

    Of course, almost no one is in favour of open borders — that would be insane. But many people, and a disproportionate number in the commentariat, are opposed to almost any measure that will reduce numbers, and will denounce or aim to toxify any policy which might slow down the pace of migration, including illegal migration across the Channel.

    Yet Britain’s immigration restrictionists already have huge disadvantages in trying to keep numbers down, due to immigration being very path dependent. The more immigration from country A to B, the more demand and pressure for further migration from A to B, because it becomes far easier for an individual to migrate to a land where he has friends and family, somewhere to stay and job opportunities.

    The more migration you have, the harder it becomes to slow down, including politically; more and more vested interest groups lobby for more migration, either to increase their share of compatriots, or on behalf of businesses which have become dependent on foreign workers.

    It’s why the Brazilianization of the US into a super-diverse society with low social capital, very high inequality and higher risk of political instability is now unstoppable. As time goes by the population tends to become less resistant, partly because their fear of migrants has been eased by meeting them (contact theory certainly has a lot of merit) but also because of social desirability factors — and because a larger share are now descended from recent immigrants, and the social pressure to identify with the majority has declined.

    Britain is unusually attractive as a destination, in part because we have dozens of established migrant communities already; in part because the prevailing atmosphere is very tolerant; and in part because of the English language, which has now become dominant even in formerly Francophone parts of the Middle East and Africa. We also, almost uniquely in Europe, have no ID cards, weak labour laws and plenty of low-paid work in the grey economy.

    For that reason, Britain is more attractive to migrants than its relative wealth merits. Even as wages have flatlined, homelessness has massively increased and public services have started to collapse, the numbers willing to come are still enormous. It’s why parts of London have become quite dystopian where, as one Twitter user put it: ‘You now compete with the world’s richest on the housing market and the world’s poorest on the labour market.’

    Since the introduction of free movement between eastern and western Europe, there has been a colossal brain drain from the east, dwarfing those of 1933 from Germany and 1453 from Constantinople. A lot of places in the former Eastern Bloc are emptying of medical staff. Latvia has lost 30 per cent of its population since independence from the Soviet Union, and that loss is set to continue. Huge numbers of Albanians have left for the EU. Half of Albania’s remaining population wish to leave.

    In part this is because of unemployment and poverty but in the case of Albania they are also fleeing political and social dysfunction — and it tends to be the case that migrants bring their culture to their new homeland.

    Path dependency explains why, without a state willing to stop them, illegal immigration will grew exponentially; it’s why the number of people crossing the Channel has gone from 299 in 2018 to 8,466 in 2020 to more than 40,000 this year. They come because they reason, quite correctly, that it will be worth it; only 21 foreign nationals were removed from the UK in the year to June 2022 under supposedly tougher asylum rules introduced after Brexit. Albanians also come to Britain because they get sent home by France or Germany. As long as this remains the case, more and more will continue to arrive, in even greater numbers, where they will continue to be housed in poor areas.

    The government finds it hard to resist, partly because its hands are tied by refugee conventions, human rights laws and modern slavery legislation. There is also a whole infrastructure of organisations, including charities, which lobby for easier immigration, and try to stop deportations. Of course, people must do what they feel to be right, but they should also be aware of the potential numbers involved, and the political consequences in Britain.

    New immigration figures this week show the total now running at 1.1 million a year — and that’s not including the Channel crossings. Net migration is 504,000, beating the pre-Brexit record of 336,000. This is far higher than the peak under Blair, when the economy was booming, and house prices had not yet reached their current levels. Meanwhile many Tories are determined to stop the building of houses, meaning that the pressure on younger people grows ever more unbearable.

    The numbers will continue to rise because, as Collier explained, migration is a self-fulfilling and accelerating process, with increasingly lower material costs and risks for travelling encouraging poorer or more risk-averse people to follow compatriots.

    In his book Whiteshift, Eric Kaufmann looked at the potential numbers willing to move, citing studies by Gallup World Poll suggesting that 700 million people worldwide would migrate to the West, including 31 per cent of sub-Saharan Africa. But even that might rise if people saw others moving, he suggested.

    He quoted one study looking at five neighbourhoods in Dakar, Senegal, a country which has been at peace for some time and is far from being the worst place to live. Of those polled, 92 per cent said they would consider migrating, and of these, 40 per cent said they would consider migration illegally.

    Most were men, and 77 per cent were willing to risk their life to go. Half were willing to risk it even if their chance of dying was 25 per cent, because there were huge rewards for their families if they were able to settle in Europe and send remittances. The only thing that would prevent them going was knowing that they would not be allowed to stay, and migrants understand that if they reach Britain, the odds are good.

    They will continue to come for the same reason that you or I would do the same in their shoes; that life is better for them here than it is back home, and better for their loved ones. And the more of their compatriots and family and friends who come, the more attractive their new home becomes. Until the point when the strain on social cohesion becomes too great, at which point everyone loses.

    The path-dependent nature of migration means that Britain either becomes far more restrictive — something that might entail immediate economic costs when we are least able to bear them — or the rapid change that triggered Brexit in the first place is going to speed up. If the Tories can’t prevent that, indeed if they can’t manage the basic state function of controlling the border, there are others waiting in the wings promising to do so.

    This article first appeared on Ed West’s Wrong Side of History Substack.

    • Thanks: Houston 1992, Polistra
  43. @Peter Akuleyev
    @Pincher Martin

    I am Generation X - on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills. However they lack intellectual curiosity. Ideas like “culture”, “tradition” and “legacy” don’t mean anything to them. I blame the internet for this - all knowledge is at their fingertips, they don’t understand the sense of wonder one used to get from coming to an original answer to a question through painstaking research. When everything can be reduced to algorithms what does it mean to be “Croatian” or “a Mayflower descendant”? Just another marketing subcategory? I also blame the destruction of traditional identity for the rise of “trans” and other pseudo identities, but that would be a tangent.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Alec Leamas (working from home), @dr kill, @Pincher Martin

    Thank you for your comment. Chinese and Indian students have long demonstrated a similar skill set (long on memorization but short on creativity).
    I hope there are a few free thinkers in your cohort.

  44. Sounds like immigration from 3rd world to 1st world countries is having its effect.

  45. @Bill P

    If you work as a software developper in Walldorf/Heidelberg (SAP), these differences – dematirialize/evaporate/diffundate… = somehow disappear – and dematerialize even
     
    "If" you are one of those people. Most of us still aren't. This class has always been with us. Maybe there are more of them these days - a lot more, even - but the problem is not so much their existence as it is the childish, self-centered philosophy they adhere to as a class.

    Replies: @Bill B.

    …the problem is not so much their existence as it is the childish, self-centered philosophy they adhere to as a class.

    I remain dubious that any great proportion of peoples are genuine “anywheres” (to use David Goodhart’s term). In my experience everyone has a ‘home’ even if it is one that they do not wish to return to.

    A great swath of our cognitive but shallow elites may be able to distract themselves for their entire lifetimes so that they never have to get around to resolving this.

  46. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    In other news, Swedes suddenly like throwing hand grenades around, the English are really into pimping out their children, people are running away from California because it’s not a great place to live, and not-so-nice Minnesotans are using welfare scams to fund Al-Shabab.

    Replies: @That Would Be Telling

    In other news, Swedes suddenly like throwing hand grenades around

    While the list now ends abruptly in 2018 and there’s a banner at the topic signaling it’s a target of deletion, you knew this was getting bad when Wikipedia created an article “List of grenade attacks in Sweden.”

    the English are really into pimping out their children

    When the police are implicitly in cahoots with the groomers and focus their efforts on enraged parents, you just might have a hostile ruling elite (since 1066) that disarmed you a century earlier and post-WWII made effective self-defense illegal.

    Still says something, but echoing said elite ran a eugenics program starting in the 13th Century that physically removed 1-2% of the most violent members of society every year. Achieved a steadily decreasing level of interpersonal violence until post-WWII.

    • Agree: Mark G.
  47. No idea what her IQ is, but this is the mother of two of Elon Musk’s children. One has to wonder about the effects of this environment on their children.

    • Replies: @OilcanFloyd
    @Reg Cæsar


    No idea what her IQ is, but this is the mother of two of Elon Musk’s children. One has to wonder about the effects of this environment on their children
     
    Between her and Amber Heard, Musk seems to like the crazies.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  48. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    I am an old man still actively working. I am constantly surprised by the high quality of the young people I meet. They are serious, focused, ambitious. More than we were in our times.

    • Agree: Peter Akuleyev
    • Replies: @Pincher Martin
    @J

    I don't doubt your experience, but perhaps it's limited because of your region, industry or just luck.

    Something is causing test scores to drop and I doubt it's anything good.

  49. Though increases in diagnoses of autism AKA mental retardation are driven by financial and psychological incentives, I personally know waaay too many boys who are actual legitimate tards – and I don’t even know that many people. It’s probably genetic damage from ((vaxxines)) inflicted on mothers’ ova. Or maybe it’s toxic levels of dietary and environmental estrogens. This at least in part explains the stalling of IQ scores.

    • Replies: @Hernan Pizzaro del Blanco
    @Je Suis Omar Mateen

    Good point. Back in the 1980s 3% of the population was diagnosed as mentally retarded and today just 1.5% are diagnosed as mentally retarded.....the majority of the decrease was caused by a change in how we label the mentally retarded children...today we call half of them autistic , even when they have an IQ of 60

  50. As an old man who has a lot of contact with younger people I have respect for their intelligence.
    As a group they have a working knowledge over a wide range.
    Like most of us it’s hard to discern how much of this knowledge is “Google” knowledge. This Wikipedia type of knowledge invites superficiality suspicions. This lack of substance coupled with a corresponding lack of a well thought out ethos leaves one questioning the basic intelligence of the group in question. In truth this lack of substance charge could be levelled against all of us. The current adhoc system of morals lends itself to superficial ethical structures as individuals strive to make sense of an increasingly senseless world.
    These superficial structures grafted onto the complex systems developed during periods when more substantial systems were in place just adds to a further sense of dislocation. This severing of the past from the future leaves the present floundering , with individuals grabbing for any kind of certainty they can find.

    • Agree: Jim Bob Lassiter
  51. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    A lack of intelligence, an abundance of political dogma, and a sense of self-righteousness is a recipe for catastrophe.

    FIFY

  52. @Reg Cæsar
    No idea what her IQ is, but this is the mother of two of Elon Musk's children. One has to wonder about the effects of this environment on their children.

    Replies: @OilcanFloyd

    No idea what her IQ is, but this is the mother of two of Elon Musk’s children. One has to wonder about the effects of this environment on their children

    Between her and Amber Heard, Musk seems to like the crazies.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @OilcanFloyd

    One of his spawn is already "transgender", and has disowned Dad. So much for eight-children-for-eight-generations!


    https://mobile.twitter.com/simonehcollins


    Well, at least "Vivian" goes both ways, so the calling cards don't need to be redone...

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  53. Why study, White Boy, when you’re fated
    To be barred from your dreams, and then slated
    To be Conan at Wheel
    While Majorities steal
    As much as they can, and you’re hated?

  54. Twenty years ago 64% of American high school students were White or Asian…Today just 56% are White or Asian

    We should expect the average IQ of American high school students to decline due to the changing demographics of our nation.

    • Replies: @Dmon
    @Hernan Pizzaro del Blanco

    This. The exact same thing could be written about crime in Minneapolis, or welfare fraud in Maine. "The study found that rioting over soccer games is actually increasing in advanced countries like Belgium, while decreasing in less economically developed areas such as Morocco".

    , @pyrrhus
    @Hernan Pizzaro del Blanco

    The problem is that SAT scores were declining already by the time that there was significant low IQ invasion...That's true all over the West...France found a progressive and rapid decline of IQ...

  55. OT – Monkey Pox gets rebranded again. Now it is mpox. Which kind of sounds like the name of a boy band.

    https://www.axios.com/2022/11/28/who-renames-monkeypox-mpox

  56. Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I’ve seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By “bright”, I mean well above the US IQ. We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob
    @Jon Claerbout


    We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.
     
    Or maybe the slow ones.
    , @Charles Erwin Wilson
    @Jon Claerbout


    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I’ve seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By “bright”, I mean well above the US IQ.
     
    This is why it is important for America to strip mine the third world of its most intelligent offspring. Bring the best and brightest here. America flourishes, and the third world continues to suffer.

    It is what all the best people think in America - diversity is a win-win.

    But not for the third world.
    , @Gordo
    @Jon Claerbout


    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I’ve seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By “bright”, I mean well above the US IQ.
     
    Get one of them to explain averages to you.
    , @Pincher Martin
    @Jon Claerbout

    Average IQs in sub-Saharan Africa are well below that of African-Americans. But while there are some 40 million African-Americans, there are a billion Africans of sub-Saharan descent. That ratio of 25 to 1 explains why one can occasionally come across an African able to do quality work at the best universities despite their low average IQ.

    Still, there aren't many.

    , @Midnights
    @Jon Claerbout

    Are you implying the Africans we got during the slave days weren't the best and the brightest? The Hell you say...

  57. @Carol
    @Bill P

    This jibes with what I've read lurking at teachers' forums. And these are liberal teachers speaking against interest, that all the decades of "reform" have done nothing. Students are dumber than ever. A good one-third or more can't read on-level or even close.

    It's not even a phonics/whole language problem. The students simply refuse to engage and do not care to learn anything.

    Teachers have no real authority or disciplinary powers now and I think that causes an instinctive lack of respect by children.

    Replies: @Technite78

    It’s not even a phonics/whole language problem. The students simply refuse to engage and do not care to learn anything.

    Teachers have no real authority or disciplinary powers now and I think that causes an instinctive lack of respect by children.

    Kids would eat ice cream, candy, and drink soda all day if not supervised. Wait, maybe that’s why so many kids are overweight these days. All kidding aside, most children aren’t self-directed and motivated enough to learn the skills required to make an honest living. They have to be constructively pushed by both their parents and their teachers to learn useful skills. Otherwise the whole enterprise is just government sponsored day care.

  58. Please forgive me for going off-topic.
    Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation. Biden never replied. Now we have war. Putin pleaded, “I want to offer President Biden that we continue our discussion, but on the condition that we do it live, online, without any delays,” reported by US News & Reuters 3/18/21. The Russian Youtube is now blocked. Video of Putin speaking these words is easily found at my Stanford University office website: sep.stanford.edu/sep/jon/putin.html

    • Thanks: HammerJack
    • Replies: @Jon Claerbout
    @Jon Claerbout

    http://sep.stanford.edu/sep/jon/putin.html

    , @tyrone
    @Jon Claerbout


    Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation.
     
    ........Biden is not capable of a public or private conversation.....he can barely read a teleprompter.
    , @HA
    @Jon Claerbout

    "Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation. Biden never replied...(reported by ...Reuters)"

    Oh, NOW we have war? As if any other course (other than complete capitulation to Russia) would have been possible?

    Here's another report rom Reuters (now in partnership with TASS!):

    Vladimir Putin's chief envoy on Ukraine told the Russian leader as the war began that he had struck a provisional deal with Kyiv that would satisfy Russia's demand that Ukraine stay out of NATO, but Putin rejected it and pressed ahead with his military campaign, according to three people close to the Russian leadership.
     

    But yeah, I'm sure another couple of empty promises from Putin to Biden would have cleared all this up and satiated Russia's hunger for expansion forever.

    Note that if the war were going as well for Putin as his trolls would have us believe, they would be slapping America on the back for helping facilitate Russia's glorious victory and acquisition of territory that it will hold on to "forever" (I mean apart from areas like Kyiv or Kherson and Kharkiv that it "temporarily" retreats from) but that somehow would have managed to stay in Kyiv's hands if Biden had only answered Putin's call. The fact that they're now instead spinning conspiracy theories to shift blame away from Putin for having launched an invasion that every Western diplomat was warning him against shows us how well they really think this war is proceeding.


    That being said, there are still true believers out there on Russian state-sponsored TV (and wherever Douglas Macgregor is being interviewed) who are confident that Russia is just one blitzkrieg-winter-offensive from being back on track to bring even Poland and the Balkans into "one big Russian home", because, after all, it's only natural for an imperial "hegomon" like Russia to be in a perpetual state of war (the last 30 anomalous years excepted).

    https://twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1597005533760073729

  59. @Hernan Pizzaro del Blanco
    Twenty years ago 64% of American high school students were White or Asian...Today just 56% are White or Asian

    We should expect the average IQ of American high school students to decline due to the changing demographics of our nation.

    Replies: @Dmon, @pyrrhus

    This. The exact same thing could be written about crime in Minneapolis, or welfare fraud in Maine. “The study found that rioting over soccer games is actually increasing in advanced countries like Belgium, while decreasing in less economically developed areas such as Morocco”.

  60. @Jon Claerbout
    Please forgive me for going off-topic.
    Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation. Biden never replied. Now we have war. Putin pleaded, "I want to offer President Biden that we continue our discussion, but on the condition that we do it live, online, without any delays," reported by US News & Reuters 3/18/21. The Russian Youtube is now blocked. Video of Putin speaking these words is easily found at my Stanford University office website: sep.stanford.edu/sep/jon/putin.html

    Replies: @Jon Claerbout, @tyrone, @HA

  61. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    You may not be imagining things. There was a study commissioned in the 1980’s titled A Nation at Risk. This was partly the impetus behind the No Student Left Behind Act in the 2000’s. But the consequence seems to have been greater focus on test passing than learning.

  62. @Redneck farmer
    Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?

    Replies: @Kylie, @YetAnotherAnon, @Corvinus

    “Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?”

    That was my first thought, only not in the form of a question.

    I do think the nature of social media has an adverse affect on one’s ability to concentrate. I noticed my own ability is a bit compromised. l used to read Henry James for fun; still do but now it’s his short stories rather than his novels

    Also I think fanaticism plays a part; in this case, leftwing fanaticism. It doesn’t require critical thinking. (Indeed, critical thinking destroys it.) It requires only rote memorization of a few phrases and talking points, with feels and righteous indignation taking the place of thought and reason. This is why even today’s academics and scholars sound so dumb.

    • Replies: @HammerJack
    @Kylie


    I used to read Henry James for fun
     
    Aha! I always knew you were into S&M!

    Replies: @kaganovitch

  63. @Flip
    Are IQ tests consistent over time? I think they've watered down the SATs and the scoring.

    Replies: @pyrrhus

    They have greatly watered down the SATs, and still the scores are declining….

  64. @Hernan Pizzaro del Blanco
    Twenty years ago 64% of American high school students were White or Asian...Today just 56% are White or Asian

    We should expect the average IQ of American high school students to decline due to the changing demographics of our nation.

    Replies: @Dmon, @pyrrhus

    The problem is that SAT scores were declining already by the time that there was significant low IQ invasion…That’s true all over the West…France found a progressive and rapid decline of IQ…

  65. OT, but BBC coverage of the anti-lockdown protests in China definitely has the subtext of “righteous protest against authoritarian state“.

    Which is odd, because the subtext of coverage of UK anti-lockdown protests only 18 months ago was “science denying conspiracy theorists are putting us all at risk – and look, one of them is Corbyn’s brother!

  66. @Peter Akuleyev
    @Pincher Martin

    I am Generation X - on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills. However they lack intellectual curiosity. Ideas like “culture”, “tradition” and “legacy” don’t mean anything to them. I blame the internet for this - all knowledge is at their fingertips, they don’t understand the sense of wonder one used to get from coming to an original answer to a question through painstaking research. When everything can be reduced to algorithms what does it mean to be “Croatian” or “a Mayflower descendant”? Just another marketing subcategory? I also blame the destruction of traditional identity for the rise of “trans” and other pseudo identities, but that would be a tangent.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Alec Leamas (working from home), @dr kill, @Pincher Martin

    I agree our Generation X isn’t an impressive cohort. But I didn’t grow up believing it was impressive. Yet according to test scores, we were a higher-scoring generation than the Baby Boomers and thus the Flynn Effect was still applicable.

    According to this research (which had been found several times before), kids born from the 1990s onwards no longer show those same gains. Some research even show a decline.

    The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did. They certainly have better math skills.

    Perhaps. But I bet their superior knowledge is more specialized and less broad than it was in the past. As you say, they don’t have much curiosity.

  67. @Redneck farmer
    Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?

    Replies: @Kylie, @YetAnotherAnon, @Corvinus

    It’s lowered IQ because the child-bearing expectations of people from Crapholistan and Britain are very different. OK, we have an underclass*, but for the most part a Brit couple of average or above-average intelligence are likely to think – let’s get our feet on the housing ladder then see about kids.

    But thanks to continual mass immigration, rents and house prices are through the roof while wages are held down, so it’s very hard for our young couple. It’s even more hard when every young woman is told that career comes before children, and women are more social creatures than men – that’s healthy when the culture is healthy, not so good when the cultural messages come from people not so well disposed.

    Women are attending university at higher rates than men, so clocking up megadebt which is (ostensibly) repaid by an additional tax on earnings – just in the fertile years (the tax stops at 50).

    So it’s hard for the Brits. But for the Crapholistanis it’s fantastic – the benefit system means you get paid to have kids, and the cultural expectations of “a place of your own” are absent, there are many three-generational families in housing. Add chain migration from the home country, so your bride is from a place with YUGE expectations of women as child-bearers, and you have Bradford.

    https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/muslim-population-almost-doubles-space-decade-1824625

    An analysis of 2011 Census data for the Muslim Council of Britain (MCB) showed the number of Muslims rose by more than a million from 1.5million in 2011 to 2.7m in 2001, with a third below the age of 15.

    Deputy Prime Minister and Sheffield Hallam MP Nick Clegg said the report “helps give us a snapshot of the socio-economic challenges and opportunities now facing Britain’s Muslim communities.”

    He said: “What’s not in doubt is that British Muslims can be proud of the contribution they make to our country. Drawing on analysis like this, together, we can help create jobs, drive growth and enable more people to get on – building the stronger economy and fairer society we want for Britain’s future.”

    That’ll be Nick “Facebook Global Affairs” Clegg.

    You can lower IQ by lowering the birth rate of intelligent women, or raising the birthrate of stupid ones. The UK has been doing both since at least the early 1970s.

    * http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4572219.stm

    Three schoolgirl sisters have given birth aged 12, 14 and 16.
    The Williams sisters, who live with their mother in a council house in Derby, feature in a BBC3 documentary called Desperate Midwives.

    Natasha, the oldest, Jade and Jemma, the youngest, are reported to receive £600 a week in benefits.

    Their mother Julie Atkins, 38, who said the girls were too young and had ruined their lives, blamed schools for providing poor quality sex education.

  68. @Alec Leamas (working from home)
    @Peter Akuleyev


    I am Generation X – on the whole we aren’t a particularly impressive cohort. Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z. The sharp kids are very sharp and academically perform much better than our generation did.
     
    Is this reflected anywhere in objective inter-generational measures like SAT scores? Around the mid 1990s - which would have been the last years when Gen X was taking them - is when the SAT was "recentered" (to make the lower score the average) and Asian scores started peeling away from everyone else.

    I don't get the sense that Millennials or Zs have more raw intelligence - quite the opposite - but rather that they've been raised in technology and the early/proto regime ideology ("woke" or whatever) and are natives in it. They don't seem to find the modern world alienating in the same way that earlier generations do.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev

    I should note – the kids I see are growing up in the hothouse pressure of affluent East Coast suburbs. It probably is wrong to generalize about Gen Z from them. What is interesting about these future elites is that they are being consciously raised as academic elites in a manner that would have seemed very alien in the US before the 1990s. The intellectual inequality inside Gen Z will be more like India or Southern Europe if we continue along this path.

  69. @J
    @Pincher Martin

    I am an old man still actively working. I am constantly surprised by the high quality of the young people I meet. They are serious, focused, ambitious. More than we were in our times.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

    I don’t doubt your experience, but perhaps it’s limited because of your region, industry or just luck.

    Something is causing test scores to drop and I doubt it’s anything good.

  70. @AnotherDad
    A quick review of the bidding (my perspective, but I think basically correct):

    -- the Flynn effect since the later half of the 20th century has been almost entirely in Raven's type tests, with only trivial improvement in verbal IQ scores

    -- I think you can helpfully break Flynn effect had two components:
    1) real environmental stuff that raised actual smarts--better nutrition, antibiotics and vaccines (less stunting) and universal education (brain wiring)
    2) more exposure to "symbolic processing" that allows people to come into Raven's type tests and "get it" right away. This sort of stuff is useful does make people somewhat "smarter", but it does not really make them more intelligent in the "taking on this new job and figuring it out" or "hey there's a better way to do this" or "don't do stupid stuff and screw up" kind of way

    -- Only the latter is going on to some limited extent (with cell phones, games) in advanced nations.

    -- Both Flynn#1--real gains in physical capability, educational exposure--and a whole lot of Flynn #2--with the 3rd world cell phone explosion--are going great guns in the 3rd world.


    -- The advanced nations with welfare states, universal medical care (building mutational load) and feminism and female careerism are now solidly dysgenic ... and are importing much dumber people from the 3rd world.

    ~~~

    Long term: There is no civilization without eugenic fertility. Period end of story. Math.

    The denial of this from the minoritarians "racism!", "holocaust!", "Nazis!" hysterics is absolutely toxic.

    Nations that do not go down this route of toxic, cancerous, stupidity and improve their population will win.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @AnotherDad

    I’m pretty sure the Chinese government is aware of all of these facts.
    And not shy about acting on them, and assessing the impact of dysgenic fertility on its rival nations.

    • Replies: @AnotherDad
    @Anonymous


    I’m pretty sure the Chinese government is aware of all of these facts.
    And not shy about acting on them, and assessing the impact of dysgenic fertility on its rival nations.
     
    Agreed. But they've been dogmeat slow with these issues. They were super-slow pulling the one-child policy, at least 15 years after the problems were obvious. (Problems that were foreseeable in the first place.)

    And now Xi--like Putin--is obsessed with being big and stuff that doesn't matter--like Taiwan--instead of this issue which will determine whether China pulls away and is the dominant power of the 21st century.

    Given that China is not hobbled by a traitorous/disloyal elite pushing minoritarian nonsense, and they don't have democratic constraint on action, the Chicom performance is really pretty mediocre.
  71. @SFG
    @Pincher Martin

    There are a lot of intolerant people who can get you fired very easily these days, and the Internet never forgets. It’s a lot more dangerous to openly think for yourself these days.

    Replies: @Alec Leamas (working from home), @Pincher Martin

    I’ve never openly discussed my views at work, and I don’t like people who do. That’s true even when I agree with their views. I’ve always been the kind of person who believes that you don’t discuss politics or religion at work.

    So that doesn’t bother me. I don’t base my views on workplace discussions because I never had those kinds of discussions. Young kids just don’t seem particularly bright.

  72. @Anonymous
    I wonder if the Flynn effect is sputtering out and will possibly decline due to the smartphone and social media era that began in earnest in 2007.

    In the 20th century, the majorities in rich countries no longer had to spend their lives on the farm and in factories. They spent many years in school. There was TV, but above average IQ folks consumed lots of extended text via newspapers, magazines, novels, etc. If you look at old magazines like Nat Geographics from the 70s, even the ads have multiple wordy paragraphs of complex by today's standards prose. People could and did spend hours of extended reading and contemplation.

    Nowadays, you hear about how even very intelligent people have difficulty maintaining attention and concentration due to the ubiquity of internet and smartphone distraction.

    Replies: @Houston 1992, @Moses

    1) perhaps someone should create and market an app that simulates the 1950’s learning , cultural , social environment ?
    A few years ago some super elite admitted that he sent his kids to a school that was essentially computer and digital free …. He wanted his kids touching nature etc

    2) how are home schoolers performing ? Benefitting from Flynn effect ?

    • Replies: @njguy73
    @Houston 1992


    perhaps someone should create and market an app that simulates the 1950’s learning , cultural , social environment ?
     
    Perhaps someone should make a movie about that. Oh, wait...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don%27t_Worry_Darling
  73. @Wokechoke
    Brown Out.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

    The results hold even when controlled for race.

  74. @OilcanFloyd
    @Reg Cæsar


    No idea what her IQ is, but this is the mother of two of Elon Musk’s children. One has to wonder about the effects of this environment on their children
     
    Between her and Amber Heard, Musk seems to like the crazies.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    One of his spawn is already “transgender”, and has disowned Dad. So much for eight-children-for-eight-generations!

    https://mobile.twitter.com/simonehcollins

    Well, at least “Vivian” goes both ways, so the calling cards don’t need to be redone…

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Reg Cæsar

    https://mobile.twitter.com/SimoneHCollins/status/1597304148978204672

  75. @OilcanFloyd

    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them.
     
    The curriculum has changed quite a bit over the years. At least where I am, much more is thrown at kids from kindergarten, so that many can't develop at a reasonable pace, and many don't learn to read or do basic math by third grade. The smart kids with helpful parents do well, but many others are hopelessly lost. What sense does it make to have second graders who can't read diagram sentences or identify parts of speech? Math isn't taught any better. Instead of drilling the basics, so that kids have something to build on, kids who don't know 2+2=4, by any means at all, are expected to do number bonds, identify missing parts of equations, or explain how problems work when they can't do basic math or read and write.

    I know someone who teaches kindergarten and she spends an hour a day in pre-planning meetings, and hours more writing plans, only to have kids trace letters and numbers, sing songs, and count and recite letters aloud. With all the money Americans spend on education, we get very little in return. Instead, we rely on the surplus educated from the rest of the world to fill the shortage of "smart" Americans because our public schools are so bad. We really need new elites.

    Replies: @HammerJack, @Barbarossa, @Carol

    It’s Never Too Early to Teach Our Babies About Race
    By Sarah Ezrin on May 27, 2021 — Fact checked by Maria Gifford

    Babies aren’t colorblind. I’m teaching my infant to be anti-racist…

    What could I do to make difference? (sic)

    I looked at my son and thought of all the sons of the world, especially those taken too soon, like George Floyd. The answer was right in front of me.

    https://www.healthline.com/health/parenting/it-is-never-too-early-to-teach-our-babies-about-race

    If your infant son shows signs of racist thoughts — we all know how to recognize them by now — hit him hard over the head with a 2×4, which you should always keep handy for just this purpose. That’ll teach him.

    • Replies: @Foreign Expert
    @HammerJack

    When I lived in japan sometimes very young babies would stare at me, presumably recognizing that I was of a different race. I am white.

    Replies: @Moses

  76. @Reg Cæsar
    @OilcanFloyd

    One of his spawn is already "transgender", and has disowned Dad. So much for eight-children-for-eight-generations!


    https://mobile.twitter.com/simonehcollins


    Well, at least "Vivian" goes both ways, so the calling cards don't need to be redone...

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  77. @Kylie
    @Redneck farmer

    "Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?"

    That was my first thought, only not in the form of a question.

    I do think the nature of social media has an adverse affect on one's ability to concentrate. I noticed my own ability is a bit compromised. l used to read Henry James for fun; still do but now it's his short stories rather than his novels

    Also I think fanaticism plays a part; in this case, leftwing fanaticism. It doesn't require critical thinking. (Indeed, critical thinking destroys it.) It requires only rote memorization of a few phrases and talking points, with feels and righteous indignation taking the place of thought and reason. This is why even today's academics and scholars sound so dumb.

    Replies: @HammerJack

    I used to read Henry James for fun

    Aha! I always knew you were into S&M!

    • LOL: Kylie, Renard
    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    @HammerJack

    Aha! I always knew you were into S&M!

    Speaking of which, how is Steve not all over this story?

    https://alphanews.org/controversial-energy-official-charged-with-stealing-womans-luggage-at-msp/

    The gift that keeps on giving. OK maybe not giving but the gift that keeps on stealing.

    Replies: @kaganovitch

  78. @That Would Be Telling
    @Bill P


    I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter.
     
    What methods does this school system use to teach children how to read? Phonics, or do they just pretend as our betters started to do in 1930 with the first Dick and Jane and Their Running Dog Spot basal reader? Or is this possibly a reflection of keeping physical schools closed beyond early 2021?

    Replies: @Bill P, @HammerJack

    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school. I don’t even know how common it is. It does dislocate you a bit in first grade.

    • Replies: @That Would Be Telling
    @HammerJack


    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school.
     
    Historically quite a few, with or without some phonics instruction, and infamously one community tested for "whole word" instruction before 1930 were the children of University of Chicago faculty, who even with reversion to the mean were way above average. At the other end the teaching of phonics is required for a very large fraction of the population to learn how to read.

    Replies: @AnotherDad

    , @Bardon Kaldlan
    @HammerJack

    I learned in school. I was so proud of my growing ability to read,I'd show it off.
    My mom and I were coming back from a jaunt in the park one sunny day. As we walked up 55th,just after Ashland,I saw it in newly dried cement.
    Some sweet soul had carved "Fuck you!" I can read that,thought I..
    I happily chirped,"Fuck you!"
    I don't think even Joe Louis could've thrown a left with such speed. Never saw it coming!

  79. @OilcanFloyd

    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them.
     
    The curriculum has changed quite a bit over the years. At least where I am, much more is thrown at kids from kindergarten, so that many can't develop at a reasonable pace, and many don't learn to read or do basic math by third grade. The smart kids with helpful parents do well, but many others are hopelessly lost. What sense does it make to have second graders who can't read diagram sentences or identify parts of speech? Math isn't taught any better. Instead of drilling the basics, so that kids have something to build on, kids who don't know 2+2=4, by any means at all, are expected to do number bonds, identify missing parts of equations, or explain how problems work when they can't do basic math or read and write.

    I know someone who teaches kindergarten and she spends an hour a day in pre-planning meetings, and hours more writing plans, only to have kids trace letters and numbers, sing songs, and count and recite letters aloud. With all the money Americans spend on education, we get very little in return. Instead, we rely on the surplus educated from the rest of the world to fill the shortage of "smart" Americans because our public schools are so bad. We really need new elites.

    Replies: @HammerJack, @Barbarossa, @Carol

    It’s all about optics. Some planner bureaucrat can show what “advanced” material kids are doing these days and look good. If the teachers and admin can fudge it so that it looks like kids are sort of passing then the BS is perpetuated. It’s immaterial if anyone learns anything. It’s perfectly satisfactory if it only appears that kids are learning.

    It’s too bad though since it’s a terrible disservice to our kids. And when we are all screwed from the lack of basic competency in society (a dynamic which is already playing out) we’ll all be paying the price.

  80. @Bill P
    @Peter Akuleyev


    Maybe there is more variability in Gen Z.
     
    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid's teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can't read. Maybe a third of them. At least a quarter. It's pretty bad. I don't live in a "super zip," but I'd say my county is pretty representative of middle America. It's probably somewhat above average, with a regional university and very good upward mobility according to Raj Chetty.

    When everything can be reduced to algorithms
     
    But everything can't be reduced to algorithms.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief, @That Would Be Telling, @Carol, @Known Fact

    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read.

    You’re lucky if the teacher can read

  81. @Jon Claerbout
    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I've seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By "bright", I mean well above the US IQ. We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @Gordo, @Pincher Martin, @Midnights

    We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    Or maybe the slow ones.

  82. • Replies: @Joe Stalin
    @JohnnyWalker123


    But what an inspiration for movie music!
     
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trWoUFihU34
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-GPsN-L9gk
  83. @JohnnyWalker123

    IQ gaps between countries are still large (e.g., 19 IQ points in PISA between East Asia and South Asia)
     
    That is an absolutely remarkable statistic.

    I wonder what the implications are for this stunning cognitive gap between the 2 regions.

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb

    “That is an absolutely remarkable statistic.”

    Discussing IQ is the equivalent of a dose of saltpeter in your Captain Crunch. It is the death of the boner. Just imagine Steve, Charles, Sigundoo, and the rest of the badminton and watercress set frolicking bonerless at the Noah Cross Ranch. Not a pretty picture.

  84. @AnotherDad
    A quick review of the bidding (my perspective, but I think basically correct):

    -- the Flynn effect since the later half of the 20th century has been almost entirely in Raven's type tests, with only trivial improvement in verbal IQ scores

    -- I think you can helpfully break Flynn effect had two components:
    1) real environmental stuff that raised actual smarts--better nutrition, antibiotics and vaccines (less stunting) and universal education (brain wiring)
    2) more exposure to "symbolic processing" that allows people to come into Raven's type tests and "get it" right away. This sort of stuff is useful does make people somewhat "smarter", but it does not really make them more intelligent in the "taking on this new job and figuring it out" or "hey there's a better way to do this" or "don't do stupid stuff and screw up" kind of way

    -- Only the latter is going on to some limited extent (with cell phones, games) in advanced nations.

    -- Both Flynn#1--real gains in physical capability, educational exposure--and a whole lot of Flynn #2--with the 3rd world cell phone explosion--are going great guns in the 3rd world.


    -- The advanced nations with welfare states, universal medical care (building mutational load) and feminism and female careerism are now solidly dysgenic ... and are importing much dumber people from the 3rd world.

    ~~~

    Long term: There is no civilization without eugenic fertility. Period end of story. Math.

    The denial of this from the minoritarians "racism!", "holocaust!", "Nazis!" hysterics is absolutely toxic.

    Nations that do not go down this route of toxic, cancerous, stupidity and improve their population will win.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @AnotherDad

    Probably within the next century we’ll have plenty of folks doing gene editing, picking advantageous variants and nixing deleterious mutations.

    The only question is whether Western man has any nations left by the time, or whether this effort is led by the Chinese insuring their dominance.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @AnotherDad


    The only question is whether Western man has any nations left by the time, or whether this effort is led by the Chinese insuring their dominance.
     
    The Chinese have their own demographic issues to confront. Try India.
  85. @Anonymous
    Been around the world and found
    That only stupid people are breeding
    The cretins cloning and feeding
    And I don't even own a TV

    Replies: @Anonymous

    But smart people pushed man-is-woman and BLM and covid tyranny.

    A world run by smart people isn’t necessarily smart because smart people will manipulate less smart people to keep the power.

  86. @Pincher Martin
    I know every generation says this about subsequent generations, but I do feel it's true that younger people (under 30) are stupider than my generation (Generation X: 1965-80). This article confirms there is some basis to my prejudices.

    And despite the lack of religious feeling among younger people - a trait I share with them, by the way - they seem far less inclined to question their beliefs than people my age. A lack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.

    Replies: @Peter Akuleyev, @Dr. DoomNGloom, @YetAnotherAnon, @HammerJack, @SFG, @J, @James Speaks, @epebble, @Corvinus

    “Alack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.“

    Neither is high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling.

    • Replies: @Pincher Martin
    @Corvinus

    But what generation would that description fit?

    Replies: @Corvinus

  87. @Jack P
    You'd think with Asians pulling away academically, we wouldn't be getting much stupider. But there's likely a lot of rural red state academic talent that goes undeveloped.

    I checked out the recent NAEP data and first impressions were that Massachusetts is coming back to the pack (though still very good) and that Florida is improving dramatically.

    Replies: @Brutusale

    Massachusetts is coming back to the pack because 23% of MA public school enrollees are now Hispanic. When the results of the past two years of flight from public schools start to come in, it’ll be even worse.

  88. OT:

  89. @Redneck farmer
    Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?

    Replies: @Kylie, @YetAnotherAnon, @Corvinus

    “Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?“

    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.

    • Replies: @Bill P
    @Corvinus

    Im not so sure "WASPs" really thought these people were stupid. If you're well-read in early 20th century literature you'd know that American authors were more likely to characterize them as ruthless, cunning and exploitative.

    I put scare quotes around WASP because most of us Americans haven't ever been part of any elite controlling consensus, and it's obscene to claim otherwise. We were as exploited as anyone.

    It's an ugly thing today to see favored minorities dogpiling struggling American families in concert with big money interests.

    Replies: @Corvinus

    , @Charles Erwin Wilson
    @Corvinus


    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.
     
    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants. You are the living embodiment of the Babinski reflex - just like your fellow travelers in the animal kingdom. No thought, no reason, no merit, no hope; you are just a mindless automaton.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Moses, @John Johnson

    , @John-.
    @Corvinus

    IQ tests done at that time on the US born children of those immigrants didn't show a IQ difference, though there was prejudice.

    On the other hand, IQ tests on the children of Puerto Rican immigrants in New York DID show a lower IQ, and the claim was that it would close in time - close to 100 years later and the gap is still there, and it probably stems from their black admixture [which is 30% on average].

    Steve has a article here on UNZ about this and it's where I remember first hearing about it:
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/puerto-rico-and-iq-same-as-it-ever-was/

    Replies: @Corvinus

  90. @Je Suis Omar Mateen
    Though increases in diagnoses of autism AKA mental retardation are driven by financial and psychological incentives, I personally know waaay too many boys who are actual legitimate tards - and I don't even know that many people. It's probably genetic damage from ((vaxxines)) inflicted on mothers' ova. Or maybe it's toxic levels of dietary and environmental estrogens. This at least in part explains the stalling of IQ scores.

    Replies: @Hernan Pizzaro del Blanco

    Good point. Back in the 1980s 3% of the population was diagnosed as mentally retarded and today just 1.5% are diagnosed as mentally retarded…..the majority of the decrease was caused by a change in how we label the mentally retarded children…today we call half of them autistic , even when they have an IQ of 60

  91. @Jon Claerbout
    Please forgive me for going off-topic.
    Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation. Biden never replied. Now we have war. Putin pleaded, "I want to offer President Biden that we continue our discussion, but on the condition that we do it live, online, without any delays," reported by US News & Reuters 3/18/21. The Russian Youtube is now blocked. Video of Putin speaking these words is easily found at my Stanford University office website: sep.stanford.edu/sep/jon/putin.html

    Replies: @Jon Claerbout, @tyrone, @HA

    Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation.

    ……..Biden is not capable of a public or private conversation…..he can barely read a teleprompter.

  92. @Corvinus
    @Redneck farmer

    “Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?“

    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @John-.

    Im not so sure “WASPs” really thought these people were stupid. If you’re well-read in early 20th century literature you’d know that American authors were more likely to characterize them as ruthless, cunning and exploitative.

    I put scare quotes around WASP because most of us Americans haven’t ever been part of any elite controlling consensus, and it’s obscene to claim otherwise. We were as exploited as anyone.

    It’s an ugly thing today to see favored minorities dogpiling struggling American families in concert with big money interests.

    • Thanks: Coemgen
    • Replies: @Corvinus
    @Bill P

    “Im not so sure “WASPs” really thought these people were stupid.”

    But they did, along with the traits you stated. Eastern and Southern Europeans were viewed as being inferior. There was a quota act to limit their presence.

    “I put scare quotes around WASP because most of us Americans haven’t ever been part of any elite controlling consensus, and it’s obscene to claim otherwise.”

    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.

    Replies: @Bill P

  93. has steve ever written about how israel’s christians have higher IQs than its jews?

    christians are 2% of israel’s population.

    • Thanks: BB753
  94. @HammerJack
    @That Would Be Telling

    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school. I don't even know how common it is. It does dislocate you a bit in first grade.

    Replies: @That Would Be Telling, @Bardon Kaldlan

    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school.

    Historically quite a few, with or without some phonics instruction, and infamously one community tested for “whole word” instruction before 1930 were the children of University of Chicago faculty, who even with reversion to the mean were way above average. At the other end the teaching of phonics is required for a very large fraction of the population to learn how to read.

    • Replies: @AnotherDad
    @That Would Be Telling


    Historically quite a few, with or without some phonics instruction, and infamously one community tested for “whole word” instruction before 1930 were the children of University of Chicago faculty, who even with reversion to the mean were way above average. At the other end the teaching of phonics is required for a very large fraction of the population to learn how to read.
     
    The "whole word" ideology is utterly typical of most ed-school nut-jobbery and most of contemporary leftist happy-dappy ideology--pie in the sky, refuted by both common sense and all the empirical data.

    Seriously, take an alphabetic language, the strong point of which is of course the direct connection being the written and spoken word ... and toss that away making it as opaque as learning Chinese characters. Genius! So brilliant only ed-schools could come up with it.
  95. @HammerJack
    @Kylie


    I used to read Henry James for fun
     
    Aha! I always knew you were into S&M!

    Replies: @kaganovitch

    Aha! I always knew you were into S&M!

    Speaking of which, how is Steve not all over this story?

    https://alphanews.org/controversial-energy-official-charged-with-stealing-womans-luggage-at-msp/

    The gift that keeps on giving. OK maybe not giving but the gift that keeps on stealing.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    @kaganovitch

    I see Cagey Beast beat me to it.

  96. @Anonymous
    @AnotherDad

    I'm pretty sure the Chinese government is aware of all of these facts.
    And not shy about acting on them, and assessing the impact of dysgenic fertility on its rival nations.

    Replies: @AnotherDad

    I’m pretty sure the Chinese government is aware of all of these facts.
    And not shy about acting on them, and assessing the impact of dysgenic fertility on its rival nations.

    Agreed. But they’ve been dogmeat slow with these issues. They were super-slow pulling the one-child policy, at least 15 years after the problems were obvious. (Problems that were foreseeable in the first place.)

    And now Xi–like Putin–is obsessed with being big and stuff that doesn’t matter–like Taiwan–instead of this issue which will determine whether China pulls away and is the dominant power of the 21st century.

    Given that China is not hobbled by a traitorous/disloyal elite pushing minoritarian nonsense, and they don’t have democratic constraint on action, the Chicom performance is really pretty mediocre.

  97. @OilcanFloyd

    You have kids in school? I talked to my youngest kid’s teacher (3rd grade) a few weeks ago. A lot of his classmates still can’t read. Maybe a third of them.
     
    The curriculum has changed quite a bit over the years. At least where I am, much more is thrown at kids from kindergarten, so that many can't develop at a reasonable pace, and many don't learn to read or do basic math by third grade. The smart kids with helpful parents do well, but many others are hopelessly lost. What sense does it make to have second graders who can't read diagram sentences or identify parts of speech? Math isn't taught any better. Instead of drilling the basics, so that kids have something to build on, kids who don't know 2+2=4, by any means at all, are expected to do number bonds, identify missing parts of equations, or explain how problems work when they can't do basic math or read and write.

    I know someone who teaches kindergarten and she spends an hour a day in pre-planning meetings, and hours more writing plans, only to have kids trace letters and numbers, sing songs, and count and recite letters aloud. With all the money Americans spend on education, we get very little in return. Instead, we rely on the surplus educated from the rest of the world to fill the shortage of "smart" Americans because our public schools are so bad. We really need new elites.

    Replies: @HammerJack, @Barbarossa, @Carol

    Yes they’ve bumped curriculum up at least a year: reading in K instead of First. Multiplication in Third, Algebra in Eighth.

    Because it’s the 21st Century, and if you treat them like wizzes they’ll rise to the challenge right?

    But the dirty little secret is that kids are no more ready intellectually for subjects a year earlier than they would have been in 1960.

  98. @JohnnyWalker123
    @anonymous

    https://twitter.com/JonahPesner/status/1596624684887511043

    https://twitter.com/WalshFreedom/status/1596489443590168579

    https://twitter.com/DashDobrofsky/status/1596631252714418176

    Replies: @clifford brown, @Renard

  99. @Bill P
    @Corvinus

    Im not so sure "WASPs" really thought these people were stupid. If you're well-read in early 20th century literature you'd know that American authors were more likely to characterize them as ruthless, cunning and exploitative.

    I put scare quotes around WASP because most of us Americans haven't ever been part of any elite controlling consensus, and it's obscene to claim otherwise. We were as exploited as anyone.

    It's an ugly thing today to see favored minorities dogpiling struggling American families in concert with big money interests.

    Replies: @Corvinus

    “Im not so sure “WASPs” really thought these people were stupid.”

    But they did, along with the traits you stated. Eastern and Southern Europeans were viewed as being inferior. There was a quota act to limit their presence.

    “I put scare quotes around WASP because most of us Americans haven’t ever been part of any elite controlling consensus, and it’s obscene to claim otherwise.”

    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.

    • Replies: @Bill P
    @Corvinus


    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.
     
    Yeah, I'd totally turn down a Monica Bellucci for some plain Jane Anglo girl because I don't want to "spoil [my] gene pool."
    😂

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Corvinus

  100. @That Would Be Telling
    @HammerJack


    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school.
     
    Historically quite a few, with or without some phonics instruction, and infamously one community tested for "whole word" instruction before 1930 were the children of University of Chicago faculty, who even with reversion to the mean were way above average. At the other end the teaching of phonics is required for a very large fraction of the population to learn how to read.

    Replies: @AnotherDad

    Historically quite a few, with or without some phonics instruction, and infamously one community tested for “whole word” instruction before 1930 were the children of University of Chicago faculty, who even with reversion to the mean were way above average. At the other end the teaching of phonics is required for a very large fraction of the population to learn how to read.

    The “whole word” ideology is utterly typical of most ed-school nut-jobbery and most of contemporary leftist happy-dappy ideology–pie in the sky, refuted by both common sense and all the empirical data.

    Seriously, take an alphabetic language, the strong point of which is of course the direct connection being the written and spoken word … and toss that away making it as opaque as learning Chinese characters. Genius! So brilliant only ed-schools could come up with it.

    • Agree: kaganovitch
  101. @HammerJack
    @Pincher Martin

    Why is Gen X only 15 years long?

    Who is the Generations Commissioner who establishes these things? When was the very first Generation and why did it start then?

    Replies: @njguy73

    It was Douglas Coupland. Before him, no one ever thought in terms of generations.

  102. @Corvinus
    @Redneck farmer

    “Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?“

    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @John-.

    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.

    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants. You are the living embodiment of the Babinski reflex – just like your fellow travelers in the animal kingdom. No thought, no reason, no merit, no hope; you are just a mindless automaton.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    @Charles Erwin Wilson

    Clearly you’ve no idea what you’re talking about. I’ve made reference several times to the HbD inspired work of Madison Grant, who discussed that the Nordic race was superior to that of the Alpine and Mediterranean races. His findings were influential in helping to craft the 1921 and 1924 quota acts.

    , @Moses
    @Charles Erwin Wilson

    Do not feed the troll lol

    , @John Johnson
    @Charles Erwin Wilson

    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants.

    A proud defender of the status quo, eh? Recent college graduate? I can also remember being arrogant and naively assuming that what I was being told was based on rigorous study.

    NYC schools have children that are mostly from foreign born immigrants.

    Care to explain why the liberals of NYC are pushing to get rid of gifted classes? Why are NYC schools not the paragon of excellence if immigration is always a net additive? Why are liberals constantly making excuses for them?

  103. @Houston 1992
    @Anonymous

    1) perhaps someone should create and market an app that simulates the 1950’s learning , cultural , social environment ?
    A few years ago some super elite admitted that he sent his kids to a school that was essentially computer and digital free …. He wanted his kids touching nature etc

    2) how are home schoolers performing ? Benefitting from Flynn effect ?

    Replies: @njguy73

    perhaps someone should create and market an app that simulates the 1950’s learning , cultural , social environment ?

    Perhaps someone should make a movie about that. Oh, wait…

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don%27t_Worry_Darling

  104. @Jon Claerbout
    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I've seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By "bright", I mean well above the US IQ. We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @Gordo, @Pincher Martin, @Midnights

    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I’ve seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By “bright”, I mean well above the US IQ.

    This is why it is important for America to strip mine the third world of its most intelligent offspring. Bring the best and brightest here. America flourishes, and the third world continues to suffer.

    It is what all the best people think in America – diversity is a win-win.

    But not for the third world.

  105. …except for blacks.

    Have we been here before?

  106. @AnotherDad
    @AnotherDad

    Probably within the next century we'll have plenty of folks doing gene editing, picking advantageous variants and nixing deleterious mutations.

    The only question is whether Western man has any nations left by the time, or whether this effort is led by the Chinese insuring their dominance.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    The only question is whether Western man has any nations left by the time, or whether this effort is led by the Chinese insuring their dominance.

    The Chinese have their own demographic issues to confront. Try India.

  107. @HammerJack
    @That Would Be Telling

    I wonder how many of us learned to read and write on our own, before starting school. I don't even know how common it is. It does dislocate you a bit in first grade.

    Replies: @That Would Be Telling, @Bardon Kaldlan

    I learned in school. I was so proud of my growing ability to read,I’d show it off.
    My mom and I were coming back from a jaunt in the park one sunny day. As we walked up 55th,just after Ashland,I saw it in newly dried cement.
    Some sweet soul had carved “Fuck you!” I can read that,thought I..
    I happily chirped,”Fuck you!”
    I don’t think even Joe Louis could’ve thrown a left with such speed. Never saw it coming!

  108. @Corvinus
    @Bill P

    “Im not so sure “WASPs” really thought these people were stupid.”

    But they did, along with the traits you stated. Eastern and Southern Europeans were viewed as being inferior. There was a quota act to limit their presence.

    “I put scare quotes around WASP because most of us Americans haven’t ever been part of any elite controlling consensus, and it’s obscene to claim otherwise.”

    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.

    Replies: @Bill P

    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.

    Yeah, I’d totally turn down a Monica Bellucci for some plain Jane Anglo girl because I don’t want to “spoil [my] gene pool.”
    😂

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Bill P


    Yeah, I’d totally turn down a Monica Bellucci for some plain Jane Anglo girl because I don’t want to “spoil [my] gene pool.”
     
    Monica Bellucci is a poor poster child for responsible reproduction. She protested Italy's common-sense ban on unmarried women buying sperm. By stripping-- as if that had any shock value in this century.
    , @Corvinus
    @Bill P

    WASPs beck then took very seriously efforts that they didn’t breed with inferior stock. You’d be considered an outcast.

    Replies: @Bill P

  109. Live Steam!

  110. @Corvinus
    @Pincher Martin

    “Alack of intelligence and an abundance of political dogma is not a good combination.“

    Neither is high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

    But what generation would that description fit?

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    @Pincher Martin

    "Neither is high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling."

    It's not a generation thing. It's a person thing. Each generation has individuals who fit this description.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

  111. @pyrrhus
    That's because the Flynn Effect never existed...SAT scores in the US have been declining for 60 years, and kept declining even after the SAT "renormed" in 1996 and handed out between 60 and 100 free points to everyone...

    Replies: @JosephD

    The Flynn effect is well established. The SAT scores trended downwards (at least in part) due to a larger cohort taking the exam. When a test goes from “thinking of going to the Ivy league?” to “thinking of going to college?” something has to give.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @JosephD

    The Flynn effect is well established. The SAT scores trended downwards (at least in part) due to a larger cohort taking the exam. When a test goes from “thinking of going to the Ivy league?” to “thinking of going to college?” something has to give.

    The Flynn effect is well established in that the system embraced it for egalitarian reasons.

    It was never "peer reviewed" and falls apart to simple questions like how were Vietnamese students able to adapt academically even when their diets were piss poor as children.

    American children post civil war were raised on oats and yet somehow led the industrial revolution as adults.

  112. @Jon Claerbout
    Please forgive me for going off-topic.
    Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation. Biden never replied. Now we have war. Putin pleaded, "I want to offer President Biden that we continue our discussion, but on the condition that we do it live, online, without any delays," reported by US News & Reuters 3/18/21. The Russian Youtube is now blocked. Video of Putin speaking these words is easily found at my Stanford University office website: sep.stanford.edu/sep/jon/putin.html

    Replies: @Jon Claerbout, @tyrone, @HA

    “Vladimir Putin invited president Biden for a public conversation. Biden never replied…(reported by …Reuters)”

    Oh, NOW we have war? As if any other course (other than complete capitulation to Russia) would have been possible?

    Here’s another report rom Reuters (now in partnership with TASS!):

    Vladimir Putin’s chief envoy on Ukraine told the Russian leader as the war began that he had struck a provisional deal with Kyiv that would satisfy Russia’s demand that Ukraine stay out of NATO, but Putin rejected it and pressed ahead with his military campaign, according to three people close to the Russian leadership.

    But yeah, I’m sure another couple of empty promises from Putin to Biden would have cleared all this up and satiated Russia’s hunger for expansion forever.

    Note that if the war were going as well for Putin as his trolls would have us believe, they would be slapping America on the back for helping facilitate Russia’s glorious victory and acquisition of territory that it will hold on to “forever” (I mean apart from areas like Kyiv or Kherson and Kharkiv that it “temporarily” retreats from) but that somehow would have managed to stay in Kyiv’s hands if Biden had only answered Putin’s call. The fact that they’re now instead spinning conspiracy theories to shift blame away from Putin for having launched an invasion that every Western diplomat was warning him against shows us how well they really think this war is proceeding.

    [MORE]

    That being said, there are still true believers out there on Russian state-sponsored TV (and wherever Douglas Macgregor is being interviewed) who are confident that Russia is just one blitzkrieg-winter-offensive from being back on track to bring even Poland and the Balkans into “one big Russian home”, because, after all, it’s only natural for an imperial “hegomon” like Russia to be in a perpetual state of war (the last 30 anomalous years excepted).

    • Troll: Je Suis Omar Mateen
  113. @Bill P
    @Corvinus


    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.
     
    Yeah, I'd totally turn down a Monica Bellucci for some plain Jane Anglo girl because I don't want to "spoil [my] gene pool."
    😂

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Corvinus

    Yeah, I’d totally turn down a Monica Bellucci for some plain Jane Anglo girl because I don’t want to “spoil [my] gene pool.”

    Monica Bellucci is a poor poster child for responsible reproduction. She protested Italy’s common-sense ban on unmarried women buying sperm. By stripping– as if that had any shock value in this century.

    • Disagree: Corvinus
  114. @kaganovitch
    @HammerJack

    Aha! I always knew you were into S&M!

    Speaking of which, how is Steve not all over this story?

    https://alphanews.org/controversial-energy-official-charged-with-stealing-womans-luggage-at-msp/

    The gift that keeps on giving. OK maybe not giving but the gift that keeps on stealing.

    Replies: @kaganovitch

    I see Cagey Beast beat me to it.

  115. @HammerJack
    @OilcanFloyd


    It’s Never Too Early to Teach Our Babies About Race
    By Sarah Ezrin on May 27, 2021 — Fact checked by Maria Gifford

    Babies aren’t colorblind. I’m teaching my infant to be anti-racist...

    What could I do to make difference? (sic)

    I looked at my son and thought of all the sons of the world, especially those taken too soon, like George Floyd. The answer was right in front of me.

    https://www.healthline.com/health/parenting/it-is-never-too-early-to-teach-our-babies-about-race

     

    If your infant son shows signs of racist thoughts — we all know how to recognize them by now — hit him hard over the head with a 2x4, which you should always keep handy for just this purpose. That'll teach him.

    Replies: @Foreign Expert

    When I lived in japan sometimes very young babies would stare at me, presumably recognizing that I was of a different race. I am white.

    • Replies: @Moses
    @Foreign Expert

    Lol same. Some would cry. Others would be fascinated.

    Human nature is hard-coded.

  116. @JohnnyWalker123
    @anonymous

    https://twitter.com/JonahPesner/status/1596624684887511043

    https://twitter.com/WalshFreedom/status/1596489443590168579

    https://twitter.com/DashDobrofsky/status/1596631252714418176

    Replies: @clifford brown, @Renard

    Although I know next to nothing about this Nick Fuentes, if you can judge a man by his enemies he must be a stand-up guy.

  117. What role brown immigrants play in one side of the convergence ?

    In France, African people were 0,1% of births in 1950ies to 40% now,. We know through sickle cell testing.

  118. @Bill P
    @Corvinus


    WASPs as a group regardless of social class considered themselves elite. They certainly didn’t want Italians and Greeks around to spoil their gene pool.
     
    Yeah, I'd totally turn down a Monica Bellucci for some plain Jane Anglo girl because I don't want to "spoil [my] gene pool."
    😂

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @Corvinus

    WASPs beck then took very seriously efforts that they didn’t breed with inferior stock. You’d be considered an outcast.

    • Replies: @Bill P
    @Corvinus

    Even into the 20th century, but mainly before widespread industrialization, the main barrier to intermarriage in the US between different European ethnicities was religion. So an Anglo Protestant could easily marry a Mediterranean/Alpine French Huguenot, but not a Nordic Dutch Catholic. The racial angle was a nativist response to waning influence of churches that had begun decades earlier during the ongoing industrial/scientific revolution.

  119. @Charles Erwin Wilson
    @Corvinus


    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.
     
    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants. You are the living embodiment of the Babinski reflex - just like your fellow travelers in the animal kingdom. No thought, no reason, no merit, no hope; you are just a mindless automaton.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Moses, @John Johnson

    Clearly you’ve no idea what you’re talking about. I’ve made reference several times to the HbD inspired work of Madison Grant, who discussed that the Nordic race was superior to that of the Alpine and Mediterranean races. His findings were influential in helping to craft the 1921 and 1924 quota acts.

  120. @Anonymous
    I wonder if the Flynn effect is sputtering out and will possibly decline due to the smartphone and social media era that began in earnest in 2007.

    In the 20th century, the majorities in rich countries no longer had to spend their lives on the farm and in factories. They spent many years in school. There was TV, but above average IQ folks consumed lots of extended text via newspapers, magazines, novels, etc. If you look at old magazines like Nat Geographics from the 70s, even the ads have multiple wordy paragraphs of complex by today's standards prose. People could and did spend hours of extended reading and contemplation.

    Nowadays, you hear about how even very intelligent people have difficulty maintaining attention and concentration due to the ubiquity of internet and smartphone distraction.

    Replies: @Houston 1992, @Moses

    Erm, let’s see the Flynn effect broken down by race.

    I suspect what is happening here is that increasing Brown + African population % is bringing down the IQ means.

    It’s just weighted average math. A 10 year old could do it.

  121. @Foreign Expert
    @HammerJack

    When I lived in japan sometimes very young babies would stare at me, presumably recognizing that I was of a different race. I am white.

    Replies: @Moses

    Lol same. Some would cry. Others would be fascinated.

    Human nature is hard-coded.

  122. @Charles Erwin Wilson
    @Corvinus


    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.
     
    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants. You are the living embodiment of the Babinski reflex - just like your fellow travelers in the animal kingdom. No thought, no reason, no merit, no hope; you are just a mindless automaton.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Moses, @John Johnson

    Do not feed the troll lol

  123. The flynn effect has always been a load of bullshit.

    As with other egalitarian theories it isn’t going to be scrutinized for obvious reasons. What social scientists call “peer reviewed” is entirely political. Social scientists have a reputation to maintain and don’t want to risk their careers by taking apart a feel-good theory. The Flynn effect has been the great hope of the academic left.

    Anyone with a basic knowledge of US history knows that it stinks to high heaven.

    Whites of the post civil war were raised with terrible diets and yet they somehow had an industrial revolution. The common newspaper articles of the 1900s read like graduate journals of today.

    • Replies: @Element59
    @John Johnson

    Recent research into potential causal factors behind the "Flynn Effect" by Michael Woodley suggests that the most g loaded modules (with the highest heritability) showed little rise in scores, but the most environmentally sensitive modules saw the lion's share of the rise in scores.

    This suggested that increased exposure to modern test-taking patterns and the classroom education experience in the industrialized West, combined with increasing nutrition abundance, drove up the most environmental aspects of IQ test taking (closing in on one's phenotypic maximum).

    In other words, IQ test cohorts weren't actually getting more "intelligent" over several decades, but they were incrementally getting better at test-taking skills and coming better prepared to cognitively focus.

    , @Pincher Martin
    @John Johnson


    The flynn effect has always been a load of bullshit.
     
    Not true. The Flynn Effect is widely accepted even by those who believe the possibility that genes contribute to racial gaps in IQ.

    The Flynn Effect is a very simple measuring artifact. It's also subject to falsification. The fact it was found nearly everywhere in the modern world until recently is pretty powerful evidence that it exists and measures something real about intelligence.
  124. @Corvinus
    @Bill P

    WASPs beck then took very seriously efforts that they didn’t breed with inferior stock. You’d be considered an outcast.

    Replies: @Bill P

    Even into the 20th century, but mainly before widespread industrialization, the main barrier to intermarriage in the US between different European ethnicities was religion. So an Anglo Protestant could easily marry a Mediterranean/Alpine French Huguenot, but not a Nordic Dutch Catholic. The racial angle was a nativist response to waning influence of churches that had begun decades earlier during the ongoing industrial/scientific revolution.

  125. @Charles Erwin Wilson
    @Corvinus


    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.
     
    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants. You are the living embodiment of the Babinski reflex - just like your fellow travelers in the animal kingdom. No thought, no reason, no merit, no hope; you are just a mindless automaton.

    Replies: @Corvinus, @Moses, @John Johnson

    As a card-carrying member of the powers-that-be you could have offered support for your position. But you have no data and you have no argument. You are a pathetic reactionary. You react based on your sentimental and debunked view of immigrants.

    A proud defender of the status quo, eh? Recent college graduate? I can also remember being arrogant and naively assuming that what I was being told was based on rigorous study.

    NYC schools have children that are mostly from foreign born immigrants.

    Care to explain why the liberals of NYC are pushing to get rid of gifted classes? Why are NYC schools not the paragon of excellence if immigration is always a net additive? Why are liberals constantly making excuses for them?

  126. @JosephD
    @pyrrhus

    The Flynn effect is well established. The SAT scores trended downwards (at least in part) due to a larger cohort taking the exam. When a test goes from "thinking of going to the Ivy league?" to "thinking of going to college?" something has to give.

    Replies: @John Johnson

    The Flynn effect is well established. The SAT scores trended downwards (at least in part) due to a larger cohort taking the exam. When a test goes from “thinking of going to the Ivy league?” to “thinking of going to college?” something has to give.

    The Flynn effect is well established in that the system embraced it for egalitarian reasons.

    It was never “peer reviewed” and falls apart to simple questions like how were Vietnamese students able to adapt academically even when their diets were piss poor as children.

    American children post civil war were raised on oats and yet somehow led the industrial revolution as adults.

  127. IQ isn’t the only thing “sputtering out” in Europe. Central heating is going, too.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/stillgray/status/1579739514737917953

    • LOL: Peter Akuleyev
  128. @JohnnyWalker123
    https://twitter.com/NoContextBrits/status/1597326644603408384

    Replies: @Joe Stalin

    But what an inspiration for movie music!

  129. @John Johnson
    The flynn effect has always been a load of bullshit.

    As with other egalitarian theories it isn't going to be scrutinized for obvious reasons. What social scientists call "peer reviewed" is entirely political. Social scientists have a reputation to maintain and don't want to risk their careers by taking apart a feel-good theory. The Flynn effect has been the great hope of the academic left.

    Anyone with a basic knowledge of US history knows that it stinks to high heaven.

    Whites of the post civil war were raised with terrible diets and yet they somehow had an industrial revolution. The common newspaper articles of the 1900s read like graduate journals of today.

    Replies: @Element59, @Pincher Martin

    Recent research into potential causal factors behind the “Flynn Effect” by Michael Woodley suggests that the most g loaded modules (with the highest heritability) showed little rise in scores, but the most environmentally sensitive modules saw the lion’s share of the rise in scores.

    This suggested that increased exposure to modern test-taking patterns and the classroom education experience in the industrialized West, combined with increasing nutrition abundance, drove up the most environmental aspects of IQ test taking (closing in on one’s phenotypic maximum).

    In other words, IQ test cohorts weren’t actually getting more “intelligent” over several decades, but they were incrementally getting better at test-taking skills and coming better prepared to cognitively focus.

    • Agree: Pincher Martin
  130. @Mark G.
    Late in his life the environmentalist Paul Ehrlich started to question to himself if his pleas to limit population growth were doing more harm than good since primarily only college girls appeared to be listening to him. Limitless population growth from less educated natives and immigrants more than offset any voluntary reductions in numbers of children among the more intelligent.

    If you combine the increased quantities of people causing strain in an era of increasingly limited natural resources here in the U.S. with decreased quality in the form of dropping IQ levels it will become increasingly difficult to maintain our current standard of living. You have already seen decreasing life expectancy in five of the last seven years, 2015-2017 and 2020-2021. 2022 is showing increases in overall mortality, possibly due to less intelligent people making less intelligent health choices, harmful aftereffects of the unsafe Covid vaccines and a deteriorating economy. Adjusted for inflation, incomes here in the U.S. have dropped 19 straight months in a row.

    Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose

    Late in his life the environmentalist Paul Ehrlich started to question to himself if his pleas to limit population growth were doing more harm than good since primarily only college girls appeared to be listening to him.

    White people sure were listening, and the CCP I suppose.

  131. anon[400] • Disclaimer says:

    #26

    “What methods does this school system use to teach children how to read? Phonics, or do they just pretend as our betters started to do in 1930 with the first Dick and Jane and Their Running Dog Spot basal reader?”

    I remember ” Dick and Jane.” I also remember the command, “Sound it out!” whenever we got stuck on a “passage.” So it appears we had some element of the phonics approach to Dick and Jane directed at us by teachers who were prepared to “think outside the box.” Those old bags really knew how to teach.

    • Thanks: That Would Be Telling
  132. @John Johnson
    The flynn effect has always been a load of bullshit.

    As with other egalitarian theories it isn't going to be scrutinized for obvious reasons. What social scientists call "peer reviewed" is entirely political. Social scientists have a reputation to maintain and don't want to risk their careers by taking apart a feel-good theory. The Flynn effect has been the great hope of the academic left.

    Anyone with a basic knowledge of US history knows that it stinks to high heaven.

    Whites of the post civil war were raised with terrible diets and yet they somehow had an industrial revolution. The common newspaper articles of the 1900s read like graduate journals of today.

    Replies: @Element59, @Pincher Martin

    The flynn effect has always been a load of bullshit.

    Not true. The Flynn Effect is widely accepted even by those who believe the possibility that genes contribute to racial gaps in IQ.

    The Flynn Effect is a very simple measuring artifact. It’s also subject to falsification. The fact it was found nearly everywhere in the modern world until recently is pretty powerful evidence that it exists and measures something real about intelligence.

  133. anon[197] • Disclaimer says:

    @Mark G #19

    “Late in his life the environmentalist Paul Ehrlich started to question to himself if his pleas to limit population growth were doing more harm than good since primarily only college girls appeared to be listening to him.”

    Reducing the population of college girls sounds decidedly like doing more good than harm. It’s just mother nature’s way of saying, “If by virtue of their superior intelligence they can so easily be led to to their own extinction – even by a charlatan like Paul Ehrlich – what good are they?” Natural selection works.

  134. @Corvinus
    @Redneck farmer

    “Has the importation of lower-IQ foreigners helped lower IQ?“

    It certainly did in the early 1900’s, according to WASPs, when Eastern and Southern Europeans poured into the nation our ancestors built.

    Replies: @Bill P, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @John-.

    IQ tests done at that time on the US born children of those immigrants didn’t show a IQ difference, though there was prejudice.

    On the other hand, IQ tests on the children of Puerto Rican immigrants in New York DID show a lower IQ, and the claim was that it would close in time – close to 100 years later and the gap is still there, and it probably stems from their black admixture [which is 30% on average].

    Steve has a article here on UNZ about this and it’s where I remember first hearing about it:
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/puerto-rico-and-iq-same-as-it-ever-was/

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    @John-.

    “IQ tests done at that time on the US born children of those immigrants didn’t show a IQ difference, though there was prejudice.“

    Red herring. The Southern and Eastern Europeans coming in by the early 1900s were of illiterate, peasant stock. That’s what Madison Grant pointed out, and was horrified that they would be breeding en masse over here than over there.

  135. @Pincher Martin
    @Corvinus

    But what generation would that description fit?

    Replies: @Corvinus

    “Neither is high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling.”

    It’s not a generation thing. It’s a person thing. Each generation has individuals who fit this description.

    • Replies: @Pincher Martin
    @Corvinus

    But individually such a combination is perfectly harmless and perhaps on occasion even beneficial.

    The philosopher David Hume fits your description, for example. He had a high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling. And that was at a time when such a combination made him such an extreme outlier that it endangered his career.

  136. @Corvinus
    @Pincher Martin

    "Neither is high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling."

    It's not a generation thing. It's a person thing. Each generation has individuals who fit this description.

    Replies: @Pincher Martin

    But individually such a combination is perfectly harmless and perhaps on occasion even beneficial.

    The philosopher David Hume fits your description, for example. He had a high IQ, an abundance of political dogma, and a lack of religious feeling. And that was at a time when such a combination made him such an extreme outlier that it endangered his career.

  137. @J.Ross
    OT Steve, have you seen this?
    https://theobjectivestandard.com/2022/07/classified-the-untold-story-of-racial-classification-in-america-by-david-e-bernstein/
    On the one hand, a respectable mainstream academic clings to the "no such thing as race (and no way to begin to define races)" stuff; on the other hand, this is probably the most aggressive -- and most normie-accessible -- rubbishing of Directive 15 and government race favoritism to date. Includes stories of race hoaxers who got different parts if the government to declare them to be different races.

    Take, for example, the “Asian” classification. People often assume that this term refers to people from East Asian countries such as China, Japan, Korea, and Vietnam. But according to the federal government, it also includes Pakistanis, Indians, and Indonesians, who generally don’t view themselves as culturally, historically, or even geographically related to people of East Asian ancestry.

    The “Hispanic” classification is even more capricious. It was created by government fiat in the 1970s to encompass people whose ancestry is derived from Spanish-speaking countries. Basing a classification on language rather than history or biology is peculiar, given that language is not an immutable characteristic acquired at birth. But the Hispanic category also includes people who do not speak Spanish, such as Brazilians, who speak Portuguese, and immigrants from Spain who speak Catalan. What’s more, residents of Spanish-speaking countries do not call themselves “Hispanic,” and polls reveal that half of American-citizen Hispanics consider themselves white.

    The results of this bizarre taxonomy are sometimes silly. When Steven Spielberg’s remake of West Side Story appeared last year, studio publicists boasted that the cast would be racially “authentic” because the Puerto Rican character Maria would be portrayed by Hispanic actress Rachel Zegler. But Zegler is of Colombian and European ancestry and has no Puerto Rican heritage. “Exactly how casting a half-Colombian, half-European actress to play a Puerto Rican character is culturally sensitive was left unexplained,” writes Bernstein (33).
     

    Replies: @Spect3r

    “Emigrants from Spain who speak Catalan”
    What?
    Catalan is a dialect specific to a region in Spain, not a national language.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    @Spect3r

    The immediate objection is that they're not Uruguayan and the broader point is that government racial categories are indefensibly sloppy. Was bringing it up to Steve because this book, which might not have anything new to us, was promoted very excitedly by a total normie who avoids talking about race, and could make a popular impact. Affirmative Action and equity are not just unconstitutional and bad policy, they are also incoherent, because they depend on lunatic categories which are less scientific than anything racists believed.

    Replies: @Spect3r

  138. @Spect3r
    @J.Ross

    "Emigrants from Spain who speak Catalan"
    What?
    Catalan is a dialect specific to a region in Spain, not a national language.

    Replies: @J.Ross

    The immediate objection is that they’re not Uruguayan and the broader point is that government racial categories are indefensibly sloppy. Was bringing it up to Steve because this book, which might not have anything new to us, was promoted very excitedly by a total normie who avoids talking about race, and could make a popular impact. Affirmative Action and equity are not just unconstitutional and bad policy, they are also incoherent, because they depend on lunatic categories which are less scientific than anything racists believed.

    • Replies: @Spect3r
    @J.Ross

    I understand, and agree, with the overall idea.
    Is just that using "Spanish people who speak Catalan" is a weird example.

    Replies: @J.Ross

  139. @John-.
    @Corvinus

    IQ tests done at that time on the US born children of those immigrants didn't show a IQ difference, though there was prejudice.

    On the other hand, IQ tests on the children of Puerto Rican immigrants in New York DID show a lower IQ, and the claim was that it would close in time - close to 100 years later and the gap is still there, and it probably stems from their black admixture [which is 30% on average].

    Steve has a article here on UNZ about this and it's where I remember first hearing about it:
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/puerto-rico-and-iq-same-as-it-ever-was/

    Replies: @Corvinus

    “IQ tests done at that time on the US born children of those immigrants didn’t show a IQ difference, though there was prejudice.“

    Red herring. The Southern and Eastern Europeans coming in by the early 1900s were of illiterate, peasant stock. That’s what Madison Grant pointed out, and was horrified that they would be breeding en masse over here than over there.

  140. @Jon Claerbout
    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I've seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By "bright", I mean well above the US IQ. We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @Gordo, @Pincher Martin, @Midnights

    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I’ve seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By “bright”, I mean well above the US IQ.

    Get one of them to explain averages to you.

    • Agree: Pincher Martin
  141. @Jon Claerbout
    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I've seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By "bright", I mean well above the US IQ. We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @Gordo, @Pincher Martin, @Midnights

    Average IQs in sub-Saharan Africa are well below that of African-Americans. But while there are some 40 million African-Americans, there are a billion Africans of sub-Saharan descent. That ratio of 25 to 1 explains why one can occasionally come across an African able to do quality work at the best universities despite their low average IQ.

    Still, there aren’t many.

  142. @J.Ross
    @Spect3r

    The immediate objection is that they're not Uruguayan and the broader point is that government racial categories are indefensibly sloppy. Was bringing it up to Steve because this book, which might not have anything new to us, was promoted very excitedly by a total normie who avoids talking about race, and could make a popular impact. Affirmative Action and equity are not just unconstitutional and bad policy, they are also incoherent, because they depend on lunatic categories which are less scientific than anything racists believed.

    Replies: @Spect3r

    I understand, and agree, with the overall idea.
    Is just that using “Spanish people who speak Catalan” is a weird example.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    @Spect3r

    Yes.

  143. @Spect3r
    @J.Ross

    I understand, and agree, with the overall idea.
    Is just that using "Spanish people who speak Catalan" is a weird example.

    Replies: @J.Ross

    Yes.

  144. @Jon Claerbout
    Africa, like every other continent, contains both smart and dumb people. I've seen bright Africans in our Stanford PhD program. By "bright", I mean well above the US IQ. We can hypothesize that when European slave ships purchased slaves in Africa, the ones they got were the dumb ones.

    Replies: @Jim Don Bob, @Charles Erwin Wilson, @Gordo, @Pincher Martin, @Midnights

    Are you implying the Africans we got during the slave days weren’t the best and the brightest? The Hell you say…

Comments are closed.

Subscribe to All Steve Sailer Comments via RSS
PastClassics
The Shaping Event of Our Modern World
Shouldn't they recuse themselves when dealing with the Middle East?
The JFK Assassination and the 9/11 Attacks?