The Unz Review: An Alternative Media Selection
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 TeasersiSteve Blog
Floyd Bodycam Footage Finally Leaked
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New ReplyRead More
ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
AgreeDisagreeThanksLOLTroll
These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Thanks, LOL, or Troll with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used three times during any eight hour period.
Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

Here it is August and Keith Ellison’s Minnesota office was still keeping the bodycam footage from the cops bottled up. But now the Daily Mail has got their hands on some of it.

The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him, but it was definitely in the range where it sometimes can cause users to stop breathing. A friend who was given fentanyl during an operation says that at one point he just stopped breathing. Fortunately, his anesthesiologist was monitoring closely, so he immediately turned down the dosage, and breathing started over again. But when you are taking it yourself like Floyd was, bad things can happen.

With our new George Floyd Memorial Principle that no black man should be arrested if he’s really not in the mood to be arrested because, you know, he might resist arrest and wind up dead, look for massive pushes by white liberals for population transfers of blacks from blue to red areas, all in the name of Fighting Segregation and Punishing Hateful Whites.

I can’t see how property values in blue urban areas can be maintained under this new regimen without clearing out poor blacks in the name of fighting racism. Look for more citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania.

 
Hide 342 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
Trim Comments?
  1. Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video

    • Replies: @BenKenobi
    @Clyde

    "High as a kite everybody, goofballs!"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yokDFLIwKa0

    , @Hypnotoad666
    @Clyde

    Floyd's state looks a lot like what cops and ER doctors call "Excited Delirium" Syndrome (EXD). Some medical professionals think it's not really a thing, but first responders see it enough that they are specifically trained to deal with it. Basically, some combination of stress/drugs/mental illness/police restraint causes the person to become hallucinatory and to expend all of their energy in manic physical resistance, whereupon they can suddenly crash and stop breathing or go into cardiac arrest.

    Apparently, treatment includes restraining the person so that they don't expend all their energy or harm others while flailing around, and keeping them prone to improve breathing. In one of the other video clips, Chauvin is heard to say he is deliberately keeping Floyd on his stomach, presumably because he was following the EXD protocol on him.




    Here's what Wikipedia says about EXD.

    Definitions and symptoms
    EXD has been accepted by the National Association of Medical Examiners and the American College of Emergency Physicians, who argue in a 2009 white paper that "excited delirium" may be described by several codes within the ICD-9.[5] A November 2012 The Journal of Emergency Medicine literature review says that the American College of Emergency Physicians Task Force reached consensus, based on "available evidence, that Excited Delirium Syndrome (EDS) is a "real syndrome with uncertain, likely multiple, etiologies."[1]

    According to the 2020 publication, "excited delirium syndrome" is a "clinical diagnosis" with symptoms including delirium, psychomotor agitation, and hyperadrenergic autonomic dysfunction.[6]

    The diagnosis was not in the 2013 Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders-5 or the 1992 International Classification of Diseases.[1][7]

    Treatment and prognosis
    Treatment initially may include ketamine or midazolam and haloperidol injected into a muscle to sedate the person.[2] Rapid cooling may be required in those with high body temperature.[1] Other supportive measures such as intravenous fluids and sodium bicarbonate may be useful.[1] One of the benefits of ketamine is its rapid onset of action.[8] The risk of death among those affected is less than 10%.[1] If death occurs it is typically sudden and cardiac in nature.[1]

    Epidemiology and history
    How frequently cases occur is unknown.[1] Males are affected more often than females.[9] Those who die from the condition are typically male with an average age of 36.[1] Often law enforcement has used tasers or physical measures in these cases.[1] A similar condition was described in the 1800s and was referred to as "Bell's mania".[1]

    The first use of the term "excited delirium" (EXD) was in a 1985 Journal of Forensic Sciences article, co-authored by coroner, Charles V. Wetli, entitled "Cocaine-induced psychosis and sudden death in recreational cocaine users".[10][11][1] The JFS article reported that in "five of the seven" cases they studied, deaths occurred while in police custody.[11]

    Signs and symptoms
    The signs and symptoms for excited delirium may include:[12][13][14][15]

    Paranoia
    Disorientation
    Dissociation
    Aggressiveness and combativeness
    Fast heart rate
    Hallucination
    Diaphoresis (profuse sweating)
    Incoherent speech or shouting
    Unexpected strength (typically while trying to resist restraint)
    Hyperthermia (overheating)
    Inappropriately clothed e.g. having removed garments
    Cause
    Excited delirium occurs most commonly in males with a history of serious mental illness or acute or chronic drug abuse, particularly stimulant drugs such as cocaine and MDPV.[5][16][17] Alcohol withdrawal or head trauma may also contribute to the condition.[13] Physical struggle, especially if prolonged, greatly exacerbates many of the harmful symptoms such as metabolic acidosis, hyperthermia, catecholamine surge, and tachycardia.[1] A majority of fatal cases involved men in a law enforcement or restraint situation.

    People with excited delirium commonly have acute drug intoxication, generally involving PCP, methylenedioxypyrovalerone (MDPV), cocaine, or methamphetamine.[12] Other drugs that may contribute to death are antipsychotics.[18][19][20]

    The cause is often related to long-term drug use or mental illness.[1] Commonly involved drugs include cocaine, methamphetamine, or certain substituted cathinones.[3] In those with mental illness, rapidly stopping medications such as antipsychotics may trigger the condition.[1]

    Mechanisms
    The pathophysiology of excited delirium is unclear,[14] but likely involves multiple factors.[21] These may include positional asphyxia, hyperthermia, drug toxicity, and/or catecholamine-induced fatal abnormal heart rhythms.[21] The underlying mechanism may involve dysfunction of the dopamine system in the brain.[3]

    Diagnosis
    Key signs of excited delirium are aggression, altered mental status, and diaphoresis/hyperthermia.[22]

    Other conditions which can resemble excited delirium are mania, neuroleptic malignant syndrome, hypoglycemia, thyroid storm, and catatonia of the malignant or excited type.[23][22]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excited_delirium#:~:text=Excited%20delirium%20(EXD)%2C%20also,rhabdomyolysis%20or%20high%20blood%20potassium.

    Replies: @Anon7

    , @JimDandy
    @Clyde

    What's the lethal does of a guy's entire stash shoved up his rectum? He admitted he was hoopin'!

    , @AnotherDad
    @Clyde


    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video.
     
    For this we melted down the rule of law in America.

    And people think minoritarianism hasn't been a completely end-to-end disaster for our nation, the West?

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    , @Percy Gryce
    @Clyde

    If he had ODed 20 minutes earlier, he would have saved hundreds or thousands of lives and billions of dollars in property damage and misdirected funds.

    Replies: @lysias, @JMcG

  2. Translation: Perhaps Floyd’s death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that’s been going on in the US this summer?

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Never.

    It’ll be labeled “a highly contested issue” for a debate that’ll never occur. It’ll be memory-holed like Trayvon Martin‘s backpack full of jewelry and giant screwdriver.

    https://youtu.be/8OSPSnm26iY

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2013/05/01/m-dspd-cover-up-the-curious-case-of-trayvon-martins-backpack-with-stolen-jewelry-and-burglary-tool/

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

    , @Harry Baldwin
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Perhaps the hundreds of millions of dollars donated to Black Lives Matter can be rerouted to repairing the damage done by rioters to small businesses.

    Replies: @Kronos

    , @tyrone
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Yes ,that's happening right now on bizarro world.

    , @Stan Adams
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    When it starts snowing in Hell.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    , @Buck Ransom
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    If BLM, Antifa, the MSM, the DNC, George Soros and the rest of the money people want to go full throttle like this for the benefit of the Donald Trump Reelection Committee, I say it is their prerogative.

    , @Anonymous
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    We now have the advantage of having seen, over many long weeks, how the Organizers used the GF incident to create not just nationwide but even international turmoil. This also means we can now look back and reappraise the apparent situation based on Bayesian search principles.

    THOUGHT EXPERIMENT: Supposing one wanted to CREATE an incident like the highly public GF death:

    1. How much money would it take?
    2. How many individuals would need to be in on the plot?
    3. How many others would need to be involved, without necessarily knowing the big picture or even their own real role in the production?

    A THOUGHT: Is it unreasonable to suspect from GF's demeanor shown in the belatedly leaked video that he sensed, in his drug-addled mind, that the arrest and or his "trip" this time was dangerously different, and that he had been SET UP TO DIE? That would explain his repeated entreaties not to shoot him.

    GF could have been recruited under false pretenses for a more innocuous op, only to discover that he was the designated PATSY.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

  3. Opiates kill 70,000 plus Americans per year, likely even more during the Corona virus lockdown. The number of unarmed Black men shot and killed by police ranges from 9 to 15 per annum.

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    • Agree: BB753, Thoughts, theMann
    • Replies: @Rapparee
    @Clifford Brown

    Also good to remind ourselves that “unarmed” does not, contrary to ill-informed popular opinion, ipso facto make a shooting unjustified. Plenty of other factors and circumstances can justify the use of deadly force besides a physical weapon. (A buddy of mine remembers his Coast Guard superiors warning his gigantic Samoan shipmate not to come back from leave drunk and ready to pick a fight, because “We’ll have to shoot you, since you’re too big to subdue otherwise”). Police officers are convicted of actual homicide less than an average of once per year, though most bad shoots wind up going as manslaughter or some lesser charge.

    Replies: @Cowtown Rebel

    , @Kronos
    @Clifford Brown


    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.
     
    But then you have to contend with people that medically use those drugs (not just terminal cancer patients, the traditional recipients before the boom-boom 1990s) and the stock market. That’ll be a massive undertaking. I think they solved the initial problem by adding stuff to the pills that significantly hinders the chemical high and/or chance of overdose. (If they did that before, we wouldn’t be in this mess.)

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

    , @Anonymousse
    @Clifford Brown


    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.
     
    Except those with the background of the Sackler’s who sell the opiates and feel safer in racially divided country... unfortunately for everyone else their lives are the only ones that actually get to matter.
    , @Thoughts
    @Clifford Brown

    I agree with this comment.

    But I do think that what's really bothering Americans is an uneasiness with Diversity/Modern America ====> cops with guns.

    The first part of the video, where the cop points the gun at George Floyd when he's in the car...yes George was acting strange and could easily have pulled a weapon, and shot at the cop....

    The cop did nothing wrong.

    But....

    I think Americans are getting frightened. Diversity and life and competition...all of this is getting to white Americans.

    This fear of 'something that cannot be named' is causing Lib Gentile Americans to lose it. So they lash out.

    Libs can't control minorities.

    Cops, being public servants, can be controlled.

    It's missplaced, it's misguided, but it is rooted in a genuine feeling of unease of living in Modern Diverse America.

    Liberal whites need to learn to articulate their True Feelings for once, instead of taking it out on cops who are the first line enforcers against the negative effects of diversity.

    It would be nice for a white liberal to say 'I'm scared of being pulled over in traffic, having a bad day off my anti-depression meds as I deal with my divorce, and having a cop point a gun to my head.'

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

  4. It’s pretty clear he didn’t want to be arrested, so what gave the cops the right to do so?

    • Agree: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @Space Ghost

    Because they're racist, everything non-black is racist. It's so obvious. Get with the MSM's Narrative program.

  5. This video is just sad. It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @TGGP


    This video is just sad. It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.
     
    Or it’s someone with a criminal history, probation status, or outstanding warrants acting with knowledge that arrest is going to lead to undesired consequences. If he was just “freaking out,” where did he come up with the wits to repeatedly lie to the police to try to get out of the arrest?

    Replies: @TGGP, @Percy Gryce

    , @Cato
    @TGGP


    It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.
     
    Well, yes, he was freaking out. I had a friend who was doing Angel Dust, like a lot of us in 1975. The cops tried to talk to him, and ended up shooting him. He was white. Shit happens all the time. So the real question here is not why Saint George freaked out,... but why the whole fucking world freaked out?

    Replies: @Neuday

  6. • Thanks: bomag
    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    @Anon4784

    I'd re-write Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment with an African-American lead character, but I don't know how much of a market there is for a one chapter book where he kills the old lady, and doesn't think anything about it until confronted, when he simply says, "Bitch had it coming."

    Replies: @Dumbo

  7. OT, or maybe not, in some James Burke kind of way, Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced the Trump Administration’s firing of Merritt Corrigan from USAID due to her offending a certain minority’s sensibilities:

    White House-USAID liaison fired after series of anti-LGBTQ tweets

    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world, so make sure any complaints you have are lodged with the right one.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    @Reg Cæsar


    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world...
     
    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    https://i1.wp.com/www.towleroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/corrigan.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Replies: @SOL, @Reg Cæsar, @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @AnotherDad, @Kyle

    , @Anonymous
    @Reg Cæsar


    Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced
     
    Who is this individual?

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    , @Hippopotamusdrome
    @Reg Cæsar

    "Pooja Jhunjhunwala"

    Wat?

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  8. The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him

    What the Devil are you talking about, man? The autopsy shows THREE times the lethal dose in his blood. And that’s just the fentanyl. He had a grip of meth in his blood, too.

    I can’t breathe. That’s what happens when you have THREE times the lethal dose in you.

    Wasn’t enough? Are you for real?

    • Replies: @Ray Cissman
    @restless94110

    "Lethal dose" is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby. Mind you, I don't think the knee hold alone killed him, and I'm not sure what else the cops could have done in that situation

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Joe, Averaged, @Lot, @TWS

    , @travis
    @restless94110

    Floyd certainly had enough opioids in his blood to cause death.
    In one recent study on 249 Fentanyl deaths they found the mean vitreous fentanyl concentrations were 10.8ng/mL The levels found in Floyd's blood was 11 ng/mL https://read.qxmd.com/read/29408723/the-distribution-and-redistribution-of-fentanyl-norfentanyl-in-post-mortem-samples

    The blood levels of found in Floyd's blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died. His death would have been classified another COVID fatality if the police never tried to arrest him. Doubt he would have survive the day, even if an ambulance brought him directly to the hospital when he left the store with his stolen smokes.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    , @jon
    @restless94110

    From what I have been able to find, Floyd had a dose that was within the lethal range, but was on the lower end. So if he was a regular user, it might not have been enough to kill. But, of course, they also found meth, and he had heart disease and tested positive for Covid-19, so there were plenty of complications to make an OD plausible. And in the video he is clearly in the middle of a panic attack and claiming he can't breathe before they ever put him on the ground and put any pressure on him.
    He also had a high fentanyl to norfentanyl ratio. Fentanyl is rapidly metabolized to norfentanyl, so a high ratio suggests a recent dose.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  9. Well, so much for the heroic pose of St. George Floyd. He’ll lose a lot of respect from the black gangstas from this video alone. (Rule number one: never cry in front of the po-po. Rule number 2: never beg from the po-po.)

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive. I’m sure they’ve dealt with situations like that before. Floyd was flopping like a fish in the back of that police car and I think head-butted the police officer that had this body cam at [8:02].

    • Replies: @Rapparee
    @Kronos

    I listened to some of my police officer acquaintances gripe at length about the shortcomings of the bodycam program when it first rolled out, but once they had time to work out the kinks and establish some sensible policies, most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg).

    Replies: @David In TN, @Kronos, @Bragadocious, @LittleNano

    , @BenKenobi
    @Kronos

    Trayvon was Saint Skittles, The Innocuous.

    What should ol' Georgie-boy be?

    Saint Floyd, The Breathless?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Ripple Earthdevil, @Rouetheday

    , @anon
    @Kronos

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive.

    That's why this story was always so stupid. Originally, it was about an evil cop who just decided to kill this poor black man for no reason. And yet, he didn't shoot him or punch him or hit him with his nightstick or tase him or anything. He just kneeled on him.

    Have you ever heard of another case where someone who was determined to kill someone else did it by just kneeling on him, but did nothing else to him? I haven't.

    So it was always completely idiotic. But then, look at the kind of people who believed it.

    , @Buffalo Joe
    @Kronos

    Kronie, I can call you Kronie, right? One of dozens it not hundreds, if not thousands of body cam video and cell phone video of black suspects not following the simplest, most innocuous order. Let me see your hands. Both hands on the steering wheel. Hands on your head. Do not reach for the glove box. Step away from the car. Put your hands behind your back. Take a seat on the curb. Take your hand, slowly out of your pocket. This should be part of the famous message from blacks to their sons. Oh, and don't break the law.

  10. Chauvin is still in prison awaiting trial? If true, that is terribly unfair. His lawyers need to be fighting for their client in the court of public opinion. Make the point over and over that Chauvin was trying to help Floyd the best he could do. Get him to stay still and calm down which waiting for ambulance that was expected at any moment.

    • Replies: @James Braxton
    @Steve Richter

    Gag order.

    Replies: @Steve Richter

    , @Buffalo Joe
    @Steve Richter

    Steve, Chauvin is white, otherwise jail is a Covid-19 death sentence, including a couple of POSs that died on Death Row from Covid. Or maybe not, but who cares?

  11. @Clifford Brown
    Opiates kill 70,000 plus Americans per year, likely even more during the Corona virus lockdown. The number of unarmed Black men shot and killed by police ranges from 9 to 15 per annum.

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    Replies: @Rapparee, @Kronos, @Anonymousse, @Thoughts

    Also good to remind ourselves that “unarmed” does not, contrary to ill-informed popular opinion, ipso facto make a shooting unjustified. Plenty of other factors and circumstances can justify the use of deadly force besides a physical weapon. (A buddy of mine remembers his Coast Guard superiors warning his gigantic Samoan shipmate not to come back from leave drunk and ready to pick a fight, because “We’ll have to shoot you, since you’re too big to subdue otherwise”). Police officers are convicted of actual homicide less than an average of once per year, though most bad shoots wind up going as manslaughter or some lesser charge.

    • Replies: @Cowtown Rebel
    @Rapparee

    Question: "Why did David use a Sling to Slay Goliath?"

    Answer: "He didn't have a .45!"

  12. Are people still talking about Floyd? The left has been ignoring him for their ‘own personal issues’ for a long time now.

    White trannies seem to be hogging all the airtime. Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?

    • Replies: @Lurker
    @Anon


    White trannies seem to be hogging all the airtime. Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?
     
    Its certainly something the MSM want us to associate with whites. Why the media would want white men to be seen as effeminate and weird is a mystery that I guess will never be solved.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @Muggles
    @Anon

    >>Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?<<

    RuPaul, a highly successful drag queen entrepreneur, is black and has had a long running cable TV show. I think many of his guests are non white, though hard to tell. I only see the show while changing channels.

    Not sure about what remains under the hood. Don't want to find out either.

    The surgery is pretty expensive so white or otherwise, you have to have the money. Most transvestites (now often tabbed as "trans women") don't have the surgery but I don't know percentages. It is my belief (unverified) that most transvestites remain biologically male completely other than perhaps hormones. Some aren't even gay.

    Replies: @black sea

  13. @Kronos
    Well, so much for the heroic pose of St. George Floyd. He’ll lose a lot of respect from the black gangstas from this video alone. (Rule number one: never cry in front of the po-po. Rule number 2: never beg from the po-po.)

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive. I’m sure they’ve dealt with situations like that before. Floyd was flopping like a fish in the back of that police car and I think head-butted the police officer that had this body cam at [8:02].

    Replies: @Rapparee, @BenKenobi, @anon, @Buffalo Joe

    I listened to some of my police officer acquaintances gripe at length about the shortcomings of the bodycam program when it first rolled out, but once they had time to work out the kinks and establish some sensible policies, most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg).

    • Agree: Jim Don Bob
    • Replies: @David In TN
    @Rapparee

    "...most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg.

    Which is why Obama while still in office said "Bodycams aren't always the answer."

    , @Kronos
    @Rapparee

    Steve has written before that various black groups now find them racist for that very reason. Now they want to go back to the old system.

    , @Bragadocious
    @Rapparee

    Some cities are paying cops more to wear them. NY is, Cincinnati is, and Boston was looking at it as well. Cop unions are calling them an "encumbrance" which demands more compensation. I don't see it personally, but cop unions would never lie just to soak taxpayers more. Anyway, this might explain the sudden "acceptance" of the devices.

    , @LittleNano
    @Rapparee

    Locally, BLM has demanded the removal of both dash and body cams. Their claim is that cams are an invasion of privacy. I see their point. I like to keep muh drug fueled, violent rampages private too.

    Replies: @Hypnotoad666

  14. @Clifford Brown
    Opiates kill 70,000 plus Americans per year, likely even more during the Corona virus lockdown. The number of unarmed Black men shot and killed by police ranges from 9 to 15 per annum.

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    Replies: @Rapparee, @Kronos, @Anonymousse, @Thoughts

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    But then you have to contend with people that medically use those drugs (not just terminal cancer patients, the traditional recipients before the boom-boom 1990s) and the stock market. That’ll be a massive undertaking. I think they solved the initial problem by adding stuff to the pills that significantly hinders the chemical high and/or chance of overdose. (If they did that before, we wouldn’t be in this mess.)

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    @Kronos

    Kron, I think, my personal opinion, that terminal cancer patients should have access to all the opiods they need or want. No one should suffer in agonizing pain when relief is one or two or three pills away.

    Replies: @Kronos

  15. @Reg Cæsar
    OT, or maybe not, in some James Burke kind of way, Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced the Trump Administration's firing of Merritt Corrigan from USAID due to her offending a certain minority's sensibilities:


    White House-USAID liaison fired after series of anti-LGBTQ tweets

    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world, so make sure any complaints you have are lodged with the right one.

    Replies: @Rob McX, @Anonymous, @Hippopotamusdrome

    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world…

    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    • Replies: @SOL
    @Rob McX

    Hopefully she'll settle down with a nice young Chad and start making babies.

    Replies: @Rob McX

    , @Reg Cæsar
    @Rob McX



    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world…
     
    A hell of a lot.
     
    I can't hear that name without hearing the dulcet voice of Bobby Sherman:


    Pooja, Pooja, Pooja, do you love me?
    Pooja, Pooja, Pooja, do you care?
    Pooja, Pooja, Pooja Jhunjhunwala,
    Pooja, Pooja, are you still aware?

    I prefer Merritt Corrigan.
     
    Many of Pooja's menfolk probably do, as well. We can call her "Right Way Corrigan".

    C-O-double-R-I,
    G-A-N spells 'Corrigan'
    , @Giancarlo M. Kumquat
    @Rob McX

    Whoa! Poojit who?

    , @AnotherDad
    @Rob McX


    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.
     
    So do I. She's a cutie.

    Here's her offense from RegCaesar's link:

    Let me clear: Gay marriage isn’t marriage / Men aren’t women / US-funded Tunisian LGBT soap operas aren’t America First."
     
    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    Note: Unfortunate some people end up sexual screwed up. Nature ain't perfect. Some people end up blind or deaf or crippled. Diseases come and go. Nasty stuff happens. But the US shouldn't be promoting lunacy.


    I with SOL. She's cute and sane. I hope she gets off the political merry-go-round, finds a nice guy and starts having babies. The world will be a better place.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @YetAnotherAnon, @The Wild Geese Howard

    , @Kyle
    @Rob McX

    Her nose is fairly wide.

    Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome, @Liberty Mike

  16. @Space Ghost
    It's pretty clear he didn't want to be arrested, so what gave the cops the right to do so?

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Because they’re racist, everything non-black is racist. It’s so obvious. Get with the MSM’s Narrative program.

  17. @Clyde
    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video

    Replies: @BenKenobi, @Hypnotoad666, @JimDandy, @AnotherDad, @Percy Gryce

    “High as a kite everybody, goofballs!”

  18. Anon[957] • Disclaimer says:

    OT: Someone says that Milwaukee’s murder rate, per population, is comparable to Chicago’s. LA and NYC have a much lower murder rate per population (probably because it’s getting to be too expensive for blacks to occupy much territory in LA and NYC). A lot of Milwaukee’s blacks originally came from Chicago, so it seems they have an especially concentrated set of murderous blacks violent gene lines.

  19. They’re going to spin this the same way they tried with the Atlanta jogger: “He was being nice and polite and calling the police officer ‘sir’ while begging not to be shot and crying.” The obvious implication being that because he can shuck and jive up some sympathy the cops should have just let him go.

    Of course this framing ignores the fact that he was clearly high off his rocker in the driver side of a vehicle. What if the cops had let him go and he killed your son, your daughter, your husband in a DWI incident? What then?

    • Replies: @Daniel Williams
    @A PhD Student


    What if the cops had let him go and he killed your son, your daughter, your husband in a DWI incident?
     
    It would have been reported in the local news with no photos of the perp or the victims.
    , @Cortes
    @A PhD Student

    The gentle giant’s child-like lack of mens rea due to low IQ would sway any jury. “He cried for his mamma...” as the not guilty verdict is issued.

  20. Did the media program him to freak out?

  21. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Translation: Perhaps Floyd's death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that's been going on in the US this summer?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Harry Baldwin, @tyrone, @Stan Adams, @Buck Ransom, @Anonymous

    Never.

    It’ll be labeled “a highly contested issue” for a debate that’ll never occur. It’ll be memory-holed like Trayvon Martin‘s backpack full of jewelry and giant screwdriver.

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2013/05/01/m-dspd-cover-up-the-curious-case-of-trayvon-martins-backpack-with-stolen-jewelry-and-burglary-tool/

    • Replies: @Abolish_public_education
    @Kronos

    In recent years, there have been alarming reports of the public education policy of keeping really bad apples in school (you know, as funding tokens) rather than referring them to the juvenile justice system (where they belong). The most notorious token being Nikolas Cruz (the alleged Parkland School shooter).

    See Washington Times.

    Replies: @Kronos, @stillCARealist

  22. @Kronos
    Well, so much for the heroic pose of St. George Floyd. He’ll lose a lot of respect from the black gangstas from this video alone. (Rule number one: never cry in front of the po-po. Rule number 2: never beg from the po-po.)

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive. I’m sure they’ve dealt with situations like that before. Floyd was flopping like a fish in the back of that police car and I think head-butted the police officer that had this body cam at [8:02].

    Replies: @Rapparee, @BenKenobi, @anon, @Buffalo Joe

    Trayvon was Saint Skittles, The Innocuous.

    What should ol’ Georgie-boy be?

    Saint Floyd, The Breathless?

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @BenKenobi

    The patron saint of claustrophobic drug addicts?

    , @Ripple Earthdevil
    @BenKenobi

    St. George of the Faux Twenty

    , @Rouetheday
    @BenKenobi

    It wouldn't matter what you tried to label him, he'd still remain an enigma. Or, as he would put it... "I'm not that kinda guy..."

  23. No Steve lower property values and thus rents are exactly what the White urban mostly female professional class wants. A bunch of dudes like George Floyd running amok is exactly what rings their bell.

    Lower rents and tingles.

    Black peoples are not exactly hot to move to suburbs. That’s already filled with Hispanics. And Lori Lightfoot will move heaven and earth to keep her voters. Mexicans are not voting Groot.

  24. @Rob McX
    @Reg Cæsar


    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world...
     
    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    https://i1.wp.com/www.towleroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/corrigan.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Replies: @SOL, @Reg Cæsar, @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @AnotherDad, @Kyle

    Hopefully she’ll settle down with a nice young Chad and start making babies.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    @SOL

    I hope so too. She also tweeted that Viktor Orbán is "a shining champion of Western civilization".

    Elsewhere she wrote:

    A woman today is expected by society to come to marriage and motherhood in physical and spiritual decline, if ever. This is the life women have been offered by those who would rather us toil away as isolated economic units for faceless corporations, far from the natural pleasures of the domestic, far from the guardianship of a loving husband, and far from the life-giving experience of motherhood.
     

    She has no business in the Washington cesspit.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @AnotherDad

  25. I guess the trail hasn’t been scheduled yet? Waiting for it to start and for the aftermath. Prep now if you can afford it.

  26. Derrick Chauvin is not guilty of murder, IMO, and this video seems to prove it. Even before he was on the ground, George Floyd made a couple of remarks that suggested he might encounter breathing difficulties in the imminent future, suggesting that he’d had such episodes in the past. It seemed he wanted to be on the ground so that he could breathe. He said multiple times he wasn’t going to resist…yet resisted pretty consistently throughout the incident. Did the cops take his warnings about breathing with the same grain of salt that they took his promises not to resist? I couldn’t blame them if they did.

    He said things like “please don’t shoot me” and “I don’t want to die,” and I believe he was very sincere, but he seemed overwhelmed by his fear and was unable to control his flight/resistance response. Why? This is a guy who’d been arrested by cops dozens of times over the years, and had survived all of those arrests, so why was he so paranoid during this particular arrest? According to him, he’d been shot before and was scared of that happening again. Or was it the drugs? Or did he just think his previous and vast record was going to nail him to the wall this time? Or…maybe it was the widespread mythology that white cops murder black male suspects all the time, a myth that you can see propagated on almost any major media news broadcast, in one way or another.

    Still, George is a sympathetic character in this case. Either the drugs or his paranoia or his inability to comprehend the reality of the situation was likely the cause of death. His airway wasn’t crushed, yet his breathing stopped. I believe he died of fright. “Claustrophobia” as he said?

    • Replies: @James Speaks
    @J1234

    There something fishy about the Derrick Chauvin/ George Floyd relationship. That’s why Floyd was pleading for his life.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Nicholas Stix

    , @JerseyJeffersonian
    @J1234

    Excitable Delirium Syndrome. Police and emergency medical responders are increasingly aware of and trained to deal with this. It can kill all on its own.

    , @gutta percha
    @J1234

    "“Claustrophobia” as he said?" A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car. People under arrest say all kinds of BS, thinking it's going to help them.

    It's now clear that had Floyd not resisted, he would not have gotten the knee on the neck. This is the main message that all people, black and otherwise, should take away from this. If you choose to resist arrest, you will almost certainly fail, and possibly be injured. This risk is easily foreseeable. Resisting lawful arrest is a bad, bad choice. Perhaps black parents should include this lesson in the legendary "Talk" that they supposedly give all their kids.

    Replies: @Anon, @Art Deco, @Anon

    , @Bill P
    @J1234

    Yeah, he was panicking most likely due to being way too high. I honestly feel bad for the guy. The panic itself can cause extreme fluctuations of blood pressure and heart rate. Floyd was 46 with serious coronary artery disease.

    The man was a mess.

    But should we expect cops to be compassionate? Is that what they're paid for? Sounds cruel but how many people out there would have had compassion for a huge, difficult, middle-aged felon on drugs?

    There are real, physical limits to that kind of compassion.

    Maybe Floyd deserved it, but "deserve's got nothing to do with it." Most of us guys figure that out by a certain point and behave accordingly.

    I'm sorry Floyd never got there, but whose fault is that, really?

    Replies: @JimDandy

    , @duncsbaby
    @J1234

    Half of Mpls is destroyed and their police dept is to be abolished all because of a LIE: that George Floyd was killed by MPD cops. He is most definitely not a sympathetic character. He's a loser-criminal-thug whose death should not be mourned by anyone who wasn't a close loved one.

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

  27. The USG basically carves states out of existing states (i.e. public lands), in violation of Article 4 §3.

    But I would have no problem with the USG transferring the large, US legal population of tax leeches to the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (AK), and then peeling it off as the 51st state.

    We could call it “Liberia”.

    • Replies: @syonredux
    @Abolish_public_education

    Just declare that Mississippi and Alabama are Wakanda. Then a little population transfer (Whites out, Blacks in). As a bonus, the Blacks get ownership of everything in those states.

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

    , @Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY)
    @Abolish_public_education

    "The USG basically carves states out of existing states (i.e. public lands), in violation of Article 4 §3."

    When has this ever happened?

    Article 4 §3 says: "New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress. (The next clause is irrelevant.)

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

  28. @restless94110

    The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him
     
    What the Devil are you talking about, man? The autopsy shows THREE times the lethal dose in his blood. And that's just the fentanyl. He had a grip of meth in his blood, too.

    I can't breathe. That's what happens when you have THREE times the lethal dose in you.

    Wasn't enough? Are you for real?

    Replies: @Ray Cissman, @travis, @jon

    “Lethal dose” is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby. Mind you, I don’t think the knee hold alone killed him, and I’m not sure what else the cops could have done in that situation

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Ray Cissman

    “Lethal dose” is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby.

    The coroner measured the femoral blood level, i.e. the quantum in his bloodstream after it had been metabolized.

    , @Joe, Averaged
    @Ray Cissman

    In what way did the knee hold contribute to his death? Autopsy showed no damage to neck etc

    Replies: @Anonymousse, @Ray Cissman

    , @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

    , @TWS
    @Ray Cissman

    Knee had nothing to do with it.

  29. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Translation: Perhaps Floyd's death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that's been going on in the US this summer?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Harry Baldwin, @tyrone, @Stan Adams, @Buck Ransom, @Anonymous

    Perhaps the hundreds of millions of dollars donated to Black Lives Matter can be rerouted to repairing the damage done by rioters to small businesses.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Harry Baldwin

    Oh boy, the broken windows fallacy in practice...

    https://youtu.be/erJEaFpS9ls

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

  30. I try not to get mad about culture war shell game nonsense… but I’m actually kinda pissed that this video, which should be more than enough to correct the moronic narrative surrounding the martyrdom of St. Floyd, will be ignored and/or framed in a way that just reifies said moronic narrative. What a midwit world we live in.

  31. As if this will make any difference whatsoever to the current zeitgeist and narrative. Not a freaking chance…

    • Replies: @Percy Gryce
    @usNthem

    It might make a difference to twelve good men and true.

    Replies: @usNthem, @Known Fact

  32. @SOL
    @Rob McX

    Hopefully she'll settle down with a nice young Chad and start making babies.

    Replies: @Rob McX

    I hope so too. She also tweeted that Viktor Orbán is “a shining champion of Western civilization”.

    Elsewhere she wrote:

    A woman today is expected by society to come to marriage and motherhood in physical and spiritual decline, if ever. This is the life women have been offered by those who would rather us toil away as isolated economic units for faceless corporations, far from the natural pleasures of the domestic, far from the guardianship of a loving husband, and far from the life-giving experience of motherhood.

    She has no business in the Washington cesspit.

    • Agree: wren, Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @Ben tillman
    @Rob McX

    Wow — that is a really impressive quote. Surely the most perspicacious of the recent cancel victims.

    , @AnotherDad
    @Rob McX

    A woman today is expected by society to come to marriage and motherhood in physical and spiritual decline, if ever. This is the life women have been offered by those who would rather us toil away as isolated economic units for faceless corporations, far from the natural pleasures of the domestic, far from the guardianship of a loving husband, and far from the life-giving experience of motherhood.
     

    Wow. That's highly perceptive for a young woman.

    She's probably a bit old for my son. Some guy will score a sane wife--happy life.

  33. @A PhD Student
    They're going to spin this the same way they tried with the Atlanta jogger: "He was being nice and polite and calling the police officer 'sir' while begging not to be shot and crying." The obvious implication being that because he can shuck and jive up some sympathy the cops should have just let him go.

    Of course this framing ignores the fact that he was clearly high off his rocker in the driver side of a vehicle. What if the cops had let him go and he killed your son, your daughter, your husband in a DWI incident? What then?

    Replies: @Daniel Williams, @Cortes

    What if the cops had let him go and he killed your son, your daughter, your husband in a DWI incident?

    It would have been reported in the local news with no photos of the perp or the victims.

  34. The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him, but it was definitely in the range where it sometimes can cause users to stop breathing.

    The quantum of fentanyl in Floyd’s femoral blood was 11 nanograms per cc. I found literature which reviewed scores of autopsies on overdose deaths. That’s close to the median value observed in such deaths. I’m going to wager that if the case weren’t so contentious, it would have been ruled an overdose death and everyone outside his social circle would have forgotten about it.

    • Agree: Buffalo Joe
    • Replies: @Anon
    @Art Deco

    Not just 11ng/ml, but additionally 5.6 ng/ml norfentanyl, its metabolite.
    I am not a chemist or a physiologist, but doesn't that mean that he actually dosed (however) on almost 17 ng/ml?
    17 ng/ml is more than enough to induce respiratory failure in a 6'4" 223 lb. male.
    That's a lot of fentanyl to get that concentration, a self-administered overdose.
    No way you can pin murder on that.
    2nd degree manslaughter? I'm not a lawyer.

    Replies: @travis

  35. @Ray Cissman
    @restless94110

    "Lethal dose" is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby. Mind you, I don't think the knee hold alone killed him, and I'm not sure what else the cops could have done in that situation

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Joe, Averaged, @Lot, @TWS

    “Lethal dose” is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby.

    The coroner measured the femoral blood level, i.e. the quantum in his bloodstream after it had been metabolized.

  36. • Replies: @syonredux
    @Mike Tre

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0j2dVuhr6s

  37. The Daily Mail is not as woke as most of the media so it is interesting to see how they spin the video to still make the cops ruthless murderers of George. I can only imagine the spin of CNN and the NYT. The Mail article is a good example of why the so called news outlets don’t like comment sections that aren’t heavily censored. Commenters notice

    • Agree: Ben tillman
  38. @Rapparee
    @Kronos

    I listened to some of my police officer acquaintances gripe at length about the shortcomings of the bodycam program when it first rolled out, but once they had time to work out the kinks and establish some sensible policies, most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg).

    Replies: @David In TN, @Kronos, @Bragadocious, @LittleNano

    “…most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg.

    Which is why Obama while still in office said “Bodycams aren’t always the answer.”

  39. @A PhD Student
    They're going to spin this the same way they tried with the Atlanta jogger: "He was being nice and polite and calling the police officer 'sir' while begging not to be shot and crying." The obvious implication being that because he can shuck and jive up some sympathy the cops should have just let him go.

    Of course this framing ignores the fact that he was clearly high off his rocker in the driver side of a vehicle. What if the cops had let him go and he killed your son, your daughter, your husband in a DWI incident? What then?

    Replies: @Daniel Williams, @Cortes

    The gentle giant’s child-like lack of mens rea due to low IQ would sway any jury. “He cried for his mamma…” as the not guilty verdict is issued.

  40. Anon[804] • Disclaimer says:
    @Art Deco
    The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him, but it was definitely in the range where it sometimes can cause users to stop breathing.

    The quantum of fentanyl in Floyd's femoral blood was 11 nanograms per cc. I found literature which reviewed scores of autopsies on overdose deaths. That's close to the median value observed in such deaths. I'm going to wager that if the case weren't so contentious, it would have been ruled an overdose death and everyone outside his social circle would have forgotten about it.

    Replies: @Anon

    Not just 11ng/ml, but additionally 5.6 ng/ml norfentanyl, its metabolite.
    I am not a chemist or a physiologist, but doesn’t that mean that he actually dosed (however) on almost 17 ng/ml?
    17 ng/ml is more than enough to induce respiratory failure in a 6’4″ 223 lb. male.
    That’s a lot of fentanyl to get that concentration, a self-administered overdose.
    No way you can pin murder on that.
    2nd degree manslaughter? I’m not a lawyer.

    • Replies: @travis
    @Anon

    even the hospital could not save him from this OD. He arrived at the hospital still breathing and died 30 minutes after they took his blood. In addition to having a fatal dose of opioids in his blood he was an elderly man fighting COVID-19 with heart disease.

    Could they even convict these cops of police brutality ? for following police procedures against an uncooperative criminal ? Hard to see how they are even charged with manslaughter.

    Replies: @Ripple Earthdevil, @Chrisnonymous

  41. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Translation: Perhaps Floyd's death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that's been going on in the US this summer?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Harry Baldwin, @tyrone, @Stan Adams, @Buck Ransom, @Anonymous

    Yes ,that’s happening right now on bizarro world.

  42. Anonymous[380] • Disclaimer says:

    NO CONVICTIONS IN THIS CASE POSSIBLE FROM THE GETGO. They overcharged murder 2 deliberately to cause more rioting when it’s all thrown out. The Tape tells the tale…

    Floyd refused to open the car window/door when the cop first knocked.

    Floyd showed obvious signs of intoxication.

    Floyd claimed he couldn’t breathe while standing.

    Floyd WANTED to get on the ground. The officers wanted him in the cop car.

    Floyd claimed he couldn’t get into the police car without claustrophobia but sat in his own car with no problem.

    Floyd claimed to have Covid19.

    Video/audio shows the officer’s knee on the neck was not causing Floyd’s airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique. It took Floyd 7 minutes plus to pass out from the drugs. Lack of oxygen would’ve knocked him out much quicker.

    Also Floyd’s two companions complied with officers instructions and had no problems.

    So after a few minutes into the arrest the cops knew…

    1 Floyd was uncooperative verbally/physically.
    2 Floyd was intoxicated guilty of DUI.
    3 Floyd was not truthful in his responses.

    CONCLUSION: The cops treated George Floyd appropriately and did so also re Floyd’s companions.

    • Replies: @James N. Kennett
    @Anonymous


    Video/audio shows the officer’s knee on the neck was not causing Floyd’s airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique.
     
    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness. If the pressure is sustained after the person has lost consciousness, it is likely to kill him.

    Of course, I do not know whether Floyd died for this reason, or from something else - drugs, panic attack, or whatever. However, I would have expected the officers to wait until Floyd passed out, and then pick him up and put him in the car. Prosecutors will want to know why this did not happen.

    Replies: @Sean, @Anonymous, @Art Deco

  43. Floyd’s claim to have covid is by itself the end of the murder charge.

    Cops used full immobilization techniques on a drugged up guy who claimed to have the scariest disease in the world.

    Case closed.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Anonymous


    Floyd’s claim to have covid is by itself the end of the murder charge.

    Cops used full immobilization techniques on a drugged up guy who claimed to have the scariest disease in the world.

    Case closed.
     
    What does his having Covid have to do with this?

    Replies: @Marty

    , @backup
    @Anonymous

    He claimed to have had COVID. In the coroners report it is reported the COVID test was positive but also that he had tested positive early April. The report explicitly states that this happens quite often and is due to virus residue.

    So the claim is likely true.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  44. No wonder Keith X Ellison doesn’t want you to see the exculpatory video.

  45. Remember the case Kersey spotlighted where a St. Louis cop or EMT used the fentanyl antidote to revive a dying overdose victim — and the junkie shot him dead on the spot? You cannot be too careful with someone this high, even if the media is going to jump the gun and call it a “murder” or a “killing”

  46. @Rob McX
    @Reg Cæsar


    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world...
     
    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    https://i1.wp.com/www.towleroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/corrigan.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Replies: @SOL, @Reg Cæsar, @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @AnotherDad, @Kyle

    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world…

    A hell of a lot.

    I can’t hear that name without hearing the dulcet voice of Bobby Sherman:

    Pooja, Pooja, Pooja, do you love me?
    Pooja, Pooja, Pooja, do you care?
    Pooja, Pooja, Pooja Jhunjhunwala,
    Pooja, Pooja, are you still aware?

    I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    Many of Pooja’s menfolk probably do, as well. We can call her “Right Way Corrigan“.

    C-O-double-R-I,
    G-A-N spells ‘Corrigan’

  47. Anonymous[270] • Disclaimer says:

    Very sad but at least three times in that video (@7:54, 8:25, 8:36) he says “I can’t breath” – all of them not being on a ground and having a knee to his neck.

    It’s then inconceivable that the cop will be convicted of murder. An acquittal is most likely because the cops just acted by the book. Which means more rioting. Oh, great. Just what we need most right now.

    • Replies: @Johnny Smoggins
    @Anonymous

    If Minnesota's smart, they'll hold the Chauvin trial in mid January to discourage the dindus from taking to the street.

  48. Yeah, George Floyd killed himself.

  49. Anonymous[367] • Disclaimer says:
    @TGGP
    This video is just sad. It's not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks "I don't feel like getting arrested today". It's someone freaking out.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Cato

    This video is just sad. It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.

    Or it’s someone with a criminal history, probation status, or outstanding warrants acting with knowledge that arrest is going to lead to undesired consequences. If he was just “freaking out,” where did he come up with the wits to repeatedly lie to the police to try to get out of the arrest?

    • Replies: @TGGP
    @Anonymous

    I don't see much evidence of him having his wits available. The stuff he's saying wouldn't get him out of any arrest. The closest he comes to even attempting that is saying "I ain't like that", although it was unclear what specifically he was denying there. At best he might have gotten an ambulance to arrive sooner, which would just result in him being handcuffed to a hospital bed and transferred to jail later.

    Replies: @gutta percha

    , @Percy Gryce
    @Anonymous

    I think it's a combination of all those factors: fear of the consequences of his criminal activity, resulting anxiety, and perhaps a drug-fueled freakout.

  50. Anonymous[367] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar
    OT, or maybe not, in some James Burke kind of way, Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced the Trump Administration's firing of Merritt Corrigan from USAID due to her offending a certain minority's sensibilities:


    White House-USAID liaison fired after series of anti-LGBTQ tweets

    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world, so make sure any complaints you have are lodged with the right one.

    Replies: @Rob McX, @Anonymous, @Hippopotamusdrome

    Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced

    Who is this individual?

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Anonymous


    Who is this individual?
     
    https://www.zoominfo.com/p/Pooja-Jhunjhunwala/1821378699

    https://www.linkedin.com/search/results/people/?firstName=Pooja&lastName=Jhunjhunwala&origin=SEO_PSERP


    She is not the only Pooja at USAID, either:

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/poojasoodpayeur/

    Half The Sky - Pooja's Story

    Their case against Miss Corrigan is un-Merritted!

    House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Eliot Engel and 19 other Democrats wrote acting USAID Administrator John Barsa that Corrigan holds positions “in direct opposition to the work USAID supports.”

    In another tweet, Corrigan wrote: “The United States is losing ground in the battle to garner influence through humanitarian aid because we now refuse to help countries who don’t celebrate sexual deviancy. Meanwhile, Russia and China are happy to step in and eat our lunch.”

    "I’m not cis-anything. I’m a woman.”

    https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/03/trump-appointee-merritt-corrigan-fired-from-usaid-amid-anti-lgbtq-tweets.html

     

  51. @Kronos
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Never.

    It’ll be labeled “a highly contested issue” for a debate that’ll never occur. It’ll be memory-holed like Trayvon Martin‘s backpack full of jewelry and giant screwdriver.

    https://youtu.be/8OSPSnm26iY

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2013/05/01/m-dspd-cover-up-the-curious-case-of-trayvon-martins-backpack-with-stolen-jewelry-and-burglary-tool/

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

    In recent years, there have been alarming reports of the public education policy of keeping really bad apples in school (you know, as funding tokens) rather than referring them to the juvenile justice system (where they belong). The most notorious token being Nikolas Cruz (the alleged Parkland School shooter).

    See Washington Times.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Abolish_public_education

    Oh yes, I recall that information.

    , @stillCARealist
    @Abolish_public_education

    I have to relate this anecdote from a local school since you're my new favorite commenter.

    Mind you, this isn't about a shooting. It's about Kindergarten.

    A friend, who is now homeschooling his kids, had his daughter in a local "good" school for Kindergarten. Among the kids were a handful of absolute monsters who wouldn't or couldn't cooperate with basic instructions. He said a couple of them would curse at the teacher (he volunteered occasionally). The teacher spent all her time and energy trying to control the beasts and had almost nothing left for the compliant majority of students. None of the kids learned a thing. When the virus hit and the schools closed in March, he started teaching his daughter at home. She learned more in 6 weeks with him than in the previous 6 months.

    I confess: I don't want the PS's to open up again.

  52. @Ray Cissman
    @restless94110

    "Lethal dose" is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby. Mind you, I don't think the knee hold alone killed him, and I'm not sure what else the cops could have done in that situation

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Joe, Averaged, @Lot, @TWS

    In what way did the knee hold contribute to his death? Autopsy showed no damage to neck etc

    • Replies: @Anonymousse
    @Joe, Averaged

    Sedentary soymalians who play a lot of video games and watch a lot of movies imagine that a knee on the rear to one side of your neck obviously kills you (somehow?).

    Might sound funny to some reading this on their verandas in their smoking jackets, but there are people who specialize in this stuff. Ask any experienced submission grappler... Chauvin’s position is NOT any kind of choke and will neither cut off air (the front of the neck) nor bloodflow (the front towards both sides of the neck). Choking a grown man (much less a particularly big and strong one) is harder than it looks and without intent and precise positioning it won’t happen.

    You can try the Fetanyl Floyd challenge yourself and worst case you might want to see a chiropractor the next day for an almighty annoying crick.

    , @Ray Cissman
    @Joe, Averaged

    Not the knee so much as the face-down positioning which is not conducive to easy breathing. There's a video of a white guy who died the same way, but I'm not sure if he was as loaded. I was against charging the cops from the get-go, but I will always wonder if things might have turned out different had they turned him on his side. There were four of them for Christ's sake.

  53. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Translation: Perhaps Floyd's death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that's been going on in the US this summer?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Harry Baldwin, @tyrone, @Stan Adams, @Buck Ransom, @Anonymous

    When it starts snowing in Hell.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    @Stan Adams

    "People in Hell want ice water, don't mean shit to me."--Harlan Ellison on Esquire's "Frank Sinatra has a Cold" by Gay Talese.

  54. @BenKenobi
    @Kronos

    Trayvon was Saint Skittles, The Innocuous.

    What should ol' Georgie-boy be?

    Saint Floyd, The Breathless?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Ripple Earthdevil, @Rouetheday

    The patron saint of claustrophobic drug addicts?

  55. @Rapparee
    @Kronos

    I listened to some of my police officer acquaintances gripe at length about the shortcomings of the bodycam program when it first rolled out, but once they had time to work out the kinks and establish some sensible policies, most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg).

    Replies: @David In TN, @Kronos, @Bragadocious, @LittleNano

    Steve has written before that various black groups now find them racist for that very reason. Now they want to go back to the old system.

  56. That explains how a handcuffed Floyd ended up on the ground after being in the police car. Why did 4 cops need to sit on him? Why wasn’t the video released immediately?

  57. Look for more citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania.

    Raj Chetty… What a joke! Like Paul Krugman before him, embraced the Narrative, ignored genetics, [and therefore] spouted nonsense. Probably salivating for that Nobel Prize…

  58. This isn’t Chauvin’s cam, he came on the scene later. But I have to say I’m surprised the initial officer was pointing his gun sideways in the face of Floyd and cursing him out when Floyd hadn’t yet done anything. I thought the call out was for a guy driving high after trying to pass a fake note.

    But then I imagine with a guy as big as Floyd they wanted to establish dominance or were genuinely afraid of what he could do with his fists. Still, it’s not going to look good and I can see CNN playing that clip where he jabs his gun while holding it sideways and tells him to ‘get the fuck out of the car’ while Floyd says ‘sorry sir’. If you do those rounds you’re all the time playing Russian roulette for the one time somebody does something.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Altai

    Taser not a firearm. And turned diagonally due to the angle/distance he was at.

    Replies: @CAL2

  59. I had a car stolen earlier this year. The police called me and said they had recovered it. I had no idea where they were and it was 5:00AM and they offered to come get me. They did but made me ride in the back seat of a police cruiser. I’m not 6′ 6″ but its a tight squeeze and I commented that there wasn’t a lot of leg room. The cop chuckled and said ‘going to jail is not meant to be comfortable’ but I thought about this when the Floyd situation happened and I said then I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car.

    Don’t know what the police can do about it though. They seemed to be as helpful as the situation allowed but the RULES are ‘you don’t talk your way out of an arrest’. No police force can operate like that. The best they can do is call an ambulance if a suspect seems to needs medical attention. Until the EMT take control of the suspect he has to be restrained not ‘let go’. Chauvin wasn’t being brutal he just kept Floyd from thrashing around. Unfortunately it will take a brave jury to acquit him of murder even though he is not guilty of that,

    • Replies: @jon
    @unit472


    I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car
     
    Watch the video - it wasn't a squad car, it was an SUV.
    , @Anonymous
    @unit472


    I said then I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car.
     
    Floyd didn’t have a problem being cooped up in a private vehicle just seconds beforehand. In fact, he refused to get out of one,

    Have you considered the possibility that maybe Floyd just didn’t want to go to the police station and get booked?
  60. @Rapparee
    @Kronos

    I listened to some of my police officer acquaintances gripe at length about the shortcomings of the bodycam program when it first rolled out, but once they had time to work out the kinks and establish some sensible policies, most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg).

    Replies: @David In TN, @Kronos, @Bragadocious, @LittleNano

    Some cities are paying cops more to wear them. NY is, Cincinnati is, and Boston was looking at it as well. Cop unions are calling them an “encumbrance” which demands more compensation. I don’t see it personally, but cop unions would never lie just to soak taxpayers more. Anyway, this might explain the sudden “acceptance” of the devices.

  61. And since I know Steve loves the idea that bodycams were introduced to record all the epic police brutality but instead are helping cops get exonerated.

    2019 saw the release of a film whose premise is an entertaining one, black female cop catches corrupt white cops executing black man, one of them tries to kill her but she escapes with the whole event on her bodycam. But since the footage gets taped over every 12 hours, she has to evade both the cops and the black gangs (Who are in league with the corrupt cops) in a black ghetto where she is seen as the enemy in her attempt to get the footage uploaded.

    • LOL: Charles
    • Replies: @TGGP
    @Altai

    In Chicago we actually did have police killing people for gangsters. Some of it stemmed from when the Housing Authority had their own police force (created out of perceived neglect from CPD), which was later incorporated back into CPD.
    https://theintercept.com/series/code-of-silence/

  62. @Rapparee
    @Kronos

    I listened to some of my police officer acquaintances gripe at length about the shortcomings of the bodycam program when it first rolled out, but once they had time to work out the kinks and establish some sensible policies, most have concurred that the bodycams now work out heavily in their favor (though they still cost the city an arm and a leg).

    Replies: @David In TN, @Kronos, @Bragadocious, @LittleNano

    Locally, BLM has demanded the removal of both dash and body cams. Their claim is that cams are an invasion of privacy. I see their point. I like to keep muh drug fueled, violent rampages private too.

    • Replies: @Hypnotoad666
    @LittleNano


    Locally, BLM has demanded the removal of both dash and body cams.
     
    They originally adopted body cams after Fergusson at the insistence of BLM and the ACLU, so this reversal of positions shows that keeping a record of the facts must help the officers more.

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

  63. @restless94110

    The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him
     
    What the Devil are you talking about, man? The autopsy shows THREE times the lethal dose in his blood. And that's just the fentanyl. He had a grip of meth in his blood, too.

    I can't breathe. That's what happens when you have THREE times the lethal dose in you.

    Wasn't enough? Are you for real?

    Replies: @Ray Cissman, @travis, @jon

    Floyd certainly had enough opioids in his blood to cause death.
    In one recent study on 249 Fentanyl deaths they found the mean vitreous fentanyl concentrations were 10.8ng/mL The levels found in Floyd’s blood was 11 ng/mL https://read.qxmd.com/read/29408723/the-distribution-and-redistribution-of-fentanyl-norfentanyl-in-post-mortem-samples

    The blood levels of found in Floyd’s blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died. His death would have been classified another COVID fatality if the police never tried to arrest him. Doubt he would have survive the day, even if an ambulance brought him directly to the hospital when he left the store with his stolen smokes.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @travis


    The blood levels of found in Floyd’s blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died.
     
    Add sickle-cell anemia (people regularly die around George Floyd's age from it - he had it). Add severe coronary disease; heart disease; high blood pressure. Add his arousal under such conditions. The psychic stress he was under - not only because he he was in serious legal troubles, but also because his image as a man who had found Jesus and becomes orderly and clean was about to disappear like smoke.

    As an aside: It can well be that George Floyd's death was listed as a COVID-19 fatality.

    Paul Craig Roberts has the Floyd-details


    https://www.unz.com/proberts/should-we-be-protesting-about-george-floyd-or-julian-assange/

    Replies: @Lot, @Sean

  64. Exceptional restraint and professionalism displayed throughout the video.

    If anything, the officers were too patient and should have went up the force continuum much quicker.

    • Replies: @usNthem
    @William D. Wall

    I’ve seen a number of - probably too many - videos where the cops are way too patient and restrained when mouth breathing joggers are basically going bonkers, especially verbally. To see them continually and calmly repeat the same instructions over and over again while a chimpout is in progress in maddening to watch.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Johnny Smoggins

  65. @Harry Baldwin
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Perhaps the hundreds of millions of dollars donated to Black Lives Matter can be rerouted to repairing the damage done by rioters to small businesses.

    Replies: @Kronos

    Oh boy, the broken windows fallacy in practice…

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Kronos

    We could have used this guy in 1917, 1941, 1950, and 1965. We went through a lot of destruction, instead.

    Replies: @Kronos

  66. @Ray Cissman
    @restless94110

    "Lethal dose" is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby. Mind you, I don't think the knee hold alone killed him, and I'm not sure what else the cops could have done in that situation

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Joe, Averaged, @Lot, @TWS

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    • Replies: @Ben tillman
    @Lot

    There was morphine in his blood.

    , @Redman
    @Lot

    He also said he was “hooping” at one point. Could that have meant the slang term for using crushed drugs up one’s rectum? I originally thought it meant he was playing basketball, but maybe he was being honest,

    , @FPD72
    @Lot


    Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.
     
    Heroin quickly metabolizes into morphine. Mr. Floyd’s blood concentration of morphine was 86 ng/mL. 200 ng/mL is almost always fatal. In a recent study of Fentanyl overdose deaths, the mean blood concentration was 8.2 ng/mL. My Floyd’s concentration was 11 ng/mL. When the Fentanyl metabolite is added, he started with a concentration of 21 ng/mL. So a blood concentration of Fentanyl of 2.5 times the mean fatal concentration plus a morphine blood concentration of 43% of the almost always fatal concentration, plus meth and traces of THC, all of which combined into a deadly cocktail. Add in the pre-existing heart conditions and recent Covid-19 and Mr. Floyd was a cardiac arrest waiting to happen.

    Replies: @Lot

    , @Mr McKenna
    @Lot


    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.
     
    Didn't you say you were smart, just the other day?
    , @John Johnson
    @Lot

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    You clearly live in the burbs.

    Black men will not have a penny in their pocket but will still drive around in a BMW or classic car and have brand new $200 shoes. Having an addiction doesn't change this.

    It's just something you aren't supposed to talk about in liberal company. You can be ex-communicated for pointing out the irony of 30k cars in a low income apartment complex.

    Replies: @Lurker

    , @Brutusale
    @Lot

    Definition #3:

    https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Hooping

  67. @J1234
    Derrick Chauvin is not guilty of murder, IMO, and this video seems to prove it. Even before he was on the ground, George Floyd made a couple of remarks that suggested he might encounter breathing difficulties in the imminent future, suggesting that he'd had such episodes in the past. It seemed he wanted to be on the ground so that he could breathe. He said multiple times he wasn't going to resist...yet resisted pretty consistently throughout the incident. Did the cops take his warnings about breathing with the same grain of salt that they took his promises not to resist? I couldn't blame them if they did.

    He said things like "please don't shoot me" and "I don't want to die," and I believe he was very sincere, but he seemed overwhelmed by his fear and was unable to control his flight/resistance response. Why? This is a guy who'd been arrested by cops dozens of times over the years, and had survived all of those arrests, so why was he so paranoid during this particular arrest? According to him, he'd been shot before and was scared of that happening again. Or was it the drugs? Or did he just think his previous and vast record was going to nail him to the wall this time? Or...maybe it was the widespread mythology that white cops murder black male suspects all the time, a myth that you can see propagated on almost any major media news broadcast, in one way or another.

    Still, George is a sympathetic character in this case. Either the drugs or his paranoia or his inability to comprehend the reality of the situation was likely the cause of death. His airway wasn't crushed, yet his breathing stopped. I believe he died of fright. "Claustrophobia" as he said?

    Replies: @James Speaks, @JerseyJeffersonian, @gutta percha, @Bill P, @duncsbaby

    There something fishy about the Derrick Chauvin/ George Floyd relationship. That’s why Floyd was pleading for his life.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @James Speaks

    When did Chauvin arrive on the scene?

    Replies: @Redman, @Lot, @James Speaks, @Chrisnonymous

    , @Nicholas Stix
    @James Speaks

    "the Derrick Chauvin/ George Floyd relationship."
    There was no relationship; the "fishy factor" was added by conspiracy theorists.

  68. @restless94110

    The amount of fentanyl in George Floyd’s system wasn’t enough to always kill him
     
    What the Devil are you talking about, man? The autopsy shows THREE times the lethal dose in his blood. And that's just the fentanyl. He had a grip of meth in his blood, too.

    I can't breathe. That's what happens when you have THREE times the lethal dose in you.

    Wasn't enough? Are you for real?

    Replies: @Ray Cissman, @travis, @jon

    From what I have been able to find, Floyd had a dose that was within the lethal range, but was on the lower end. So if he was a regular user, it might not have been enough to kill. But, of course, they also found meth, and he had heart disease and tested positive for Covid-19, so there were plenty of complications to make an OD plausible. And in the video he is clearly in the middle of a panic attack and claiming he can’t breathe before they ever put him on the ground and put any pressure on him.
    He also had a high fentanyl to norfentanyl ratio. Fentanyl is rapidly metabolized to norfentanyl, so a high ratio suggests a recent dose.

    • Thanks: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @jon

    From what I have been able to find, Floyd had a dose that was within the lethal range, but was on the lower end.

    Nope. Femoral blood levels were middle range for the population of overdose deaths. (Whatever dose he took was sufficient to induce that in his very large body).

  69. @J1234
    Derrick Chauvin is not guilty of murder, IMO, and this video seems to prove it. Even before he was on the ground, George Floyd made a couple of remarks that suggested he might encounter breathing difficulties in the imminent future, suggesting that he'd had such episodes in the past. It seemed he wanted to be on the ground so that he could breathe. He said multiple times he wasn't going to resist...yet resisted pretty consistently throughout the incident. Did the cops take his warnings about breathing with the same grain of salt that they took his promises not to resist? I couldn't blame them if they did.

    He said things like "please don't shoot me" and "I don't want to die," and I believe he was very sincere, but he seemed overwhelmed by his fear and was unable to control his flight/resistance response. Why? This is a guy who'd been arrested by cops dozens of times over the years, and had survived all of those arrests, so why was he so paranoid during this particular arrest? According to him, he'd been shot before and was scared of that happening again. Or was it the drugs? Or did he just think his previous and vast record was going to nail him to the wall this time? Or...maybe it was the widespread mythology that white cops murder black male suspects all the time, a myth that you can see propagated on almost any major media news broadcast, in one way or another.

    Still, George is a sympathetic character in this case. Either the drugs or his paranoia or his inability to comprehend the reality of the situation was likely the cause of death. His airway wasn't crushed, yet his breathing stopped. I believe he died of fright. "Claustrophobia" as he said?

    Replies: @James Speaks, @JerseyJeffersonian, @gutta percha, @Bill P, @duncsbaby

    Excitable Delirium Syndrome. Police and emergency medical responders are increasingly aware of and trained to deal with this. It can kill all on its own.

    • Thanks: Percy Gryce
  70. @James Speaks
    @J1234

    There something fishy about the Derrick Chauvin/ George Floyd relationship. That’s why Floyd was pleading for his life.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Nicholas Stix

    When did Chauvin arrive on the scene?

    • Replies: @Redman
    @Steve Sailer

    You can see Chauvin arriving on the scene near the end of the video. On the left side.

    , @Lot
    @Steve Sailer

    The transcript is a lot more informative than the two videos. The video I didn't catch hardly any of the conversation with the girlfriend for example.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @James Speaks
    @Steve Sailer

    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows ...

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.

    Replies: @Coemgen, @Beavertales

    , @Chrisnonymous
    @Steve Sailer

    As regards any possible Chauvin-Floyd prior relationship leading to murder, this was the only suspicious bit--Chauvin's first question on arriving at the scene is "is he going to jail?"

    In theory this could be evidence that Floyd knew something Chauvin didn't want him to tell (like something to do with cointerfeit money?). On the other hand, Chauvin's murder technique doesn't seem very foolproof. On the other hand, he would have had to make it look like an accident from a slightly too aggressive restraint... Not plausible at all except for the sawing action Chauvin does with his knee just prior to Floyd going unresponsive.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @James Speaks

  71. @Clyde
    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video

    Replies: @BenKenobi, @Hypnotoad666, @JimDandy, @AnotherDad, @Percy Gryce

    Floyd’s state looks a lot like what cops and ER doctors call “Excited Delirium” Syndrome (EXD). Some medical professionals think it’s not really a thing, but first responders see it enough that they are specifically trained to deal with it. Basically, some combination of stress/drugs/mental illness/police restraint causes the person to become hallucinatory and to expend all of their energy in manic physical resistance, whereupon they can suddenly crash and stop breathing or go into cardiac arrest.

    Apparently, treatment includes restraining the person so that they don’t expend all their energy or harm others while flailing around, and keeping them prone to improve breathing. In one of the other video clips, Chauvin is heard to say he is deliberately keeping Floyd on his stomach, presumably because he was following the EXD protocol on him.

    [MORE]

    Here’s what Wikipedia says about EXD.

    Definitions and symptoms
    EXD has been accepted by the National Association of Medical Examiners and the American College of Emergency Physicians, who argue in a 2009 white paper that “excited delirium” may be described by several codes within the ICD-9.[5] A November 2012 The Journal of Emergency Medicine literature review says that the American College of Emergency Physicians Task Force reached consensus, based on “available evidence, that Excited Delirium Syndrome (EDS) is a “real syndrome with uncertain, likely multiple, etiologies.”[1]

    According to the 2020 publication, “excited delirium syndrome” is a “clinical diagnosis” with symptoms including delirium, psychomotor agitation, and hyperadrenergic autonomic dysfunction.[6]

    The diagnosis was not in the 2013 Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders-5 or the 1992 International Classification of Diseases.[1][7]

    Treatment and prognosis
    Treatment initially may include ketamine or midazolam and haloperidol injected into a muscle to sedate the person.[2] Rapid cooling may be required in those with high body temperature.[1] Other supportive measures such as intravenous fluids and sodium bicarbonate may be useful.[1] One of the benefits of ketamine is its rapid onset of action.[8] The risk of death among those affected is less than 10%.[1] If death occurs it is typically sudden and cardiac in nature.[1]

    Epidemiology and history
    How frequently cases occur is unknown.[1] Males are affected more often than females.[9] Those who die from the condition are typically male with an average age of 36.[1] Often law enforcement has used tasers or physical measures in these cases.[1] A similar condition was described in the 1800s and was referred to as “Bell’s mania”.[1]

    The first use of the term “excited delirium” (EXD) was in a 1985 Journal of Forensic Sciences article, co-authored by coroner, Charles V. Wetli, entitled “Cocaine-induced psychosis and sudden death in recreational cocaine users”.[10][11][1] The JFS article reported that in “five of the seven” cases they studied, deaths occurred while in police custody.[11]

    Signs and symptoms
    The signs and symptoms for excited delirium may include:[12][13][14][15]

    Paranoia
    Disorientation
    Dissociation
    Aggressiveness and combativeness
    Fast heart rate
    Hallucination
    Diaphoresis (profuse sweating)
    Incoherent speech or shouting
    Unexpected strength (typically while trying to resist restraint)
    Hyperthermia (overheating)
    Inappropriately clothed e.g. having removed garments
    Cause
    Excited delirium occurs most commonly in males with a history of serious mental illness or acute or chronic drug abuse, particularly stimulant drugs such as cocaine and MDPV.[5][16][17] Alcohol withdrawal or head trauma may also contribute to the condition.[13] Physical struggle, especially if prolonged, greatly exacerbates many of the harmful symptoms such as metabolic acidosis, hyperthermia, catecholamine surge, and tachycardia.[1] A majority of fatal cases involved men in a law enforcement or restraint situation.

    People with excited delirium commonly have acute drug intoxication, generally involving PCP, methylenedioxypyrovalerone (MDPV), cocaine, or methamphetamine.[12] Other drugs that may contribute to death are antipsychotics.[18][19][20]

    The cause is often related to long-term drug use or mental illness.[1] Commonly involved drugs include cocaine, methamphetamine, or certain substituted cathinones.[3] In those with mental illness, rapidly stopping medications such as antipsychotics may trigger the condition.[1]

    Mechanisms
    The pathophysiology of excited delirium is unclear,[14] but likely involves multiple factors.[21] These may include positional asphyxia, hyperthermia, drug toxicity, and/or catecholamine-induced fatal abnormal heart rhythms.[21] The underlying mechanism may involve dysfunction of the dopamine system in the brain.[3]

    Diagnosis
    Key signs of excited delirium are aggression, altered mental status, and diaphoresis/hyperthermia.[22]

    Other conditions which can resemble excited delirium are mania, neuroleptic malignant syndrome, hypoglycemia, thyroid storm, and catatonia of the malignant or excited type.[23][22]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excited_delirium#:~:text=Excited%20delirium%20(EXD)%2C%20also,rhabdomyolysis%20or%20high%20blood%20potassium.

    • Thanks: Ben tillman
    • Replies: @Anon7
    @Hypnotoad666

    OTOH the Minneapolis police manual says

    “ Once the subject is secured, an officer shall watch for any of the following signs: (06/13/14)
    · Significant change in behavior or level consciousness;
    · Shortness of breath or irregular breathing;
    · Seizures or convulsions;
    · Complaints of serious pain or injury; and/or
    · Any other serious medical problem.
    H. If officers observe any serious medical issue, they shall immediately contact EMS or transport directly to a local hospital. Officers shall also notify a supervisor. ”

    http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/police/policy/mpdpolicy_9-100_9-100

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Redman

  72. @LittleNano
    @Rapparee

    Locally, BLM has demanded the removal of both dash and body cams. Their claim is that cams are an invasion of privacy. I see their point. I like to keep muh drug fueled, violent rampages private too.

    Replies: @Hypnotoad666

    Locally, BLM has demanded the removal of both dash and body cams.

    They originally adopted body cams after Fergusson at the insistence of BLM and the ACLU, so this reversal of positions shows that keeping a record of the facts must help the officers more.

    • Replies: @Abolish_public_education
    @Hypnotoad666

    Always-on body cams, and GPS-based locaters should be required wear for all government workers, especially LEOs and schoolteachers, during their shifts.

    The audio-video and location coordinates should be made publicly available in real-time.

    Politicians should also be subject to those regulations, but coverage extended to 24x7.

  73. @J1234
    Derrick Chauvin is not guilty of murder, IMO, and this video seems to prove it. Even before he was on the ground, George Floyd made a couple of remarks that suggested he might encounter breathing difficulties in the imminent future, suggesting that he'd had such episodes in the past. It seemed he wanted to be on the ground so that he could breathe. He said multiple times he wasn't going to resist...yet resisted pretty consistently throughout the incident. Did the cops take his warnings about breathing with the same grain of salt that they took his promises not to resist? I couldn't blame them if they did.

    He said things like "please don't shoot me" and "I don't want to die," and I believe he was very sincere, but he seemed overwhelmed by his fear and was unable to control his flight/resistance response. Why? This is a guy who'd been arrested by cops dozens of times over the years, and had survived all of those arrests, so why was he so paranoid during this particular arrest? According to him, he'd been shot before and was scared of that happening again. Or was it the drugs? Or did he just think his previous and vast record was going to nail him to the wall this time? Or...maybe it was the widespread mythology that white cops murder black male suspects all the time, a myth that you can see propagated on almost any major media news broadcast, in one way or another.

    Still, George is a sympathetic character in this case. Either the drugs or his paranoia or his inability to comprehend the reality of the situation was likely the cause of death. His airway wasn't crushed, yet his breathing stopped. I believe he died of fright. "Claustrophobia" as he said?

    Replies: @James Speaks, @JerseyJeffersonian, @gutta percha, @Bill P, @duncsbaby

    ““Claustrophobia” as he said?” A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car. People under arrest say all kinds of BS, thinking it’s going to help them.

    It’s now clear that had Floyd not resisted, he would not have gotten the knee on the neck. This is the main message that all people, black and otherwise, should take away from this. If you choose to resist arrest, you will almost certainly fail, and possibly be injured. This risk is easily foreseeable. Resisting lawful arrest is a bad, bad choice. Perhaps black parents should include this lesson in the legendary “Talk” that they supposedly give all their kids.

    • Replies: @Anon
    @gutta percha

    I'm claustrophobic, as is my mother. We both acquired it in adulthood. I think it's a heritable genetic trait whose heritability increases as you age, like a lot of things. I used to be able to sleep in a mummy sleeping bag while backpacking. Now it would panic me. My mom can't close the door on airline toilets and had flight attendants stand guard while she goes, although this pretty much caused her never to fly.

    Claustrophobics can panic and hyperventilate and that can create shortness of breath, not enough to kill you I wouldn't think, but combined with another problem (Floyd had everything from sickle cell to various drugs) it could push you over the edge.

    Any sort of constriction can bring on a panic attack to claustrophobics. Handcuffs behind your back in an open space can do it; in front is less of a problem. A big guy like Floyd handcuffed behind his back in the cramped back seat of an SUV?: I can believe he panicked in that situation. He mentioned claustrophobia three times, and one of the officers said he'd run the air conditioning and open the windows. It sounds like that officer knew something about the condition, because heat aggravates it. MRIs have non-metallic air pressure operated fans to blow on patients who are mildly claustrophobic because being cooled off helps. Getting a stomach camera scan or a colonoscopy can trigger claustrophobia because you cannot freely move.

    I'm not blaming the officers at all, and I don't think they should be prosecuted or disciplined. However, this is perhaps another case that demonstrates poor training relating to medical matters. Eric Garner died not from the choke hold, but from "positional asphyxia" after he was on the ground. Like Floyd the autopsy showed zero esophageal crushing.


    Obese people especially, lying face down, prone, are unable to breathe when enough pressure is put on their back. The pressure prevents the diaphragm from going up and down, and he can’t inhale and exhale.
     
    https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/05/opinion/eric-garner-daniel-pantaleo-and-lethal-police-tactics.html

    If the cop had simply rolled Garner over after cuffing him, Garner wouldn't have died. Floyd's case is more nuanced, given all the ways he was fucked up, but some awareness of genuine claustrophobia should be conveyed to officers in their training. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that tactical restraint during interrogations is well-known by police as a way to elicit confessions: I would confess to anything if I were about to panic.

    Replies: @FPD72, @Rob McX

    , @Art Deco
    @gutta percha

    The ultimate complaint is that a deplorable (Chauvin et al) has authority over persons of higher status. Black chauvinists think they are the persons of higher status. Gentry liberals think that, as morally excellent people, they assign status and their black clientele have higher status than the deplorables who make up the police force.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    , @Anon
    @gutta percha


    ““Claustrophobia” as he said?” A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car.
     
    I can completely believe this. I get anxious when I am not driving, but not when I am driving. I’m O.K. in my own car when parked, but if that thing happens where the car locks up because the tires are turned the wrong direction or whatever happens with cars these days, I start to sweat while I try things and read the manual even though rationally I know I’ll eventually figure it out. I have shopped for some sort of keychain window smasher thing, and I would smash my window if anxious. Claustrophobia, by definition, is not rational.

    And remember, he was handcuffed behind his back, which is triggering even out of a car in the middle of a parking lot.

    Don’t try to logic this out: Talk to people who have this or read up on it online. If you don’t have it, your choplogic thinking is not going to come up with the right answer.
  74. @unit472
    I had a car stolen earlier this year. The police called me and said they had recovered it. I had no idea where they were and it was 5:00AM and they offered to come get me. They did but made me ride in the back seat of a police cruiser. I'm not 6' 6" but its a tight squeeze and I commented that there wasn't a lot of leg room. The cop chuckled and said 'going to jail is not meant to be comfortable' but I thought about this when the Floyd situation happened and I said then I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car.

    Don't know what the police can do about it though. They seemed to be as helpful as the situation allowed but the RULES are 'you don't talk your way out of an arrest'. No police force can operate like that. The best they can do is call an ambulance if a suspect seems to needs medical attention. Until the EMT take control of the suspect he has to be restrained not 'let go'. Chauvin wasn't being brutal he just kept Floyd from thrashing around. Unfortunately it will take a brave jury to acquit him of murder even though he is not guilty of that,

    Replies: @jon, @Anonymous

    I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car

    Watch the video – it wasn’t a squad car, it was an SUV.

  75. Anonymous[380] • Disclaimer says:

    They’re bitching that the officer pulling his weapon quickly is evidence of racism.

    1 Cop is responding to a serious crime not a cat stuck in a tree.
    2 Cop ran the plate before approaching vehicle. Knows the owner is a convicted violent felon with rap sheet. (Home invasion plus battery with a loaded weapon — against a pregnant lady)
    3 Cop taps window and immediately the driver starts playing games. (90% of people are right handed — cop approaches from the left side therefore the perp’s right hand must stay visible otherwise cop must assume foul play.)

    The real story of the video is that the cops absolutely babied this loser convicted felon scumbag.

  76. My armchair analysis of the situation:

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user. People who overdose on fentanyl don’t get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy, breathing slows, then stops, then they die. They don’t have air hunger; in fact the problem with fentanyl is that it takes away air hunger. So someone complaining that they can’t breathe is not consistent with a fentanyl overdose–people overdosing on fentanyl don’t care if they can’t breathe, and that’s the problem.

    However the fact that he was complaining that he couldn’t breathe early during the arrest suggests that he was having some other medical event at the time of arrest. This could have been any number of things, some of which can be detected on autopsy (heart attack, pulmonary embolism), some of which cannot (arrhythmia, severe bronchospasm.) Furthermore, these may have been caused by some of the other drugs found in his system (PCP I believe was found?), they may have been exacerbated by it, they may have just happened independently. It’s pretty much impossible to know for certain.

    If an individual is having some sort of medical event that causes shortness of breath, the restraint techniques used by the police would almost certainly make the situation worse. Generally you want somebody sitting up so that their weight is off the diaphragm and they can breathe as deeply as possible. However they were clearly not choking him as he could speak, so the trachea wasn’t obstructed. Regardless, it certainly made the situation worse.

    However from the police’s perspective, it’s difficult to know whether this guy really is having a cardiopulmonary issue or whether he’s just faking to try to get out of being arrested. Even if they had training, they don’t really have the equipment to figure this stuff out.

    • Disagree: Cloudbuster
    • Thanks: Patrick in SC
    • Replies: @415 reasons
    @SimpleSong

    Methamphetamine

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    , @TGGP
    @SimpleSong

    So it sounds like if they'd kept him sitting in the cop car, rather than letting him out to lie down as he requested, he might have had better odds of surviving?

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    , @Alden
    @SimpleSong

    Even less weight on the diaphragm if the patient is lying down on his back.

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    , @Art Deco
    @SimpleSong

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user.

    You're confounding the dose with the blood level.

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    , @Bozo the Clown
    @SimpleSong

    “ People who overdose on fentanyl don’t get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy...”

    I once knew a black fella who, upon snorting a couple of $10 bags of snortable heroin, would get wired like he’d just done a bunch of coke instead. Surely that was a sign of his tolerance to the stuff. Or maybe it’s a black thing and we wouldn’t understand.

  77. @William D. Wall
    Exceptional restraint and professionalism displayed throughout the video.

    If anything, the officers were too patient and should have went up the force continuum much quicker.

    Replies: @usNthem

    I’ve seen a number of – probably too many – videos where the cops are way too patient and restrained when mouth breathing joggers are basically going bonkers, especially verbally. To see them continually and calmly repeat the same instructions over and over again while a chimpout is in progress in maddening to watch.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @usNthem

    Still one of my favorites...

    https://youtu.be/Q9Co2iH44ug

    Replies: @usNthem, @Mr McKenna, @Steve in Greensboro

    , @Johnny Smoggins
    @usNthem

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It's refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn't mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn't mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @John Johnson, @Kronos, @Hypnotoad666, @Anonymous

  78. @Anon
    Are people still talking about Floyd? The left has been ignoring him for their 'own personal issues' for a long time now.

    White trannies seem to be hogging all the airtime. Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?

    Replies: @Lurker, @Muggles

    White trannies seem to be hogging all the airtime. Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?

    Its certainly something the MSM want us to associate with whites. Why the media would want white men to be seen as effeminate and weird is a mystery that I guess will never be solved.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Lurker

    Blacks are actually overrepresented among homosexual transexuals and underrepresented among autogynephilic transexuals. Understanding the difference is key.

    Homosexual transexuals are basically gay men who "become women to attract men." They adopt an exaggerated form of femininity, to become "more women than the women," one could see this as an example of the "zeal of the convert." They are underrepresented among transexual activists, perhaps because their ultimate goal is crypsis, to be undifferentiated from actual women in order to better attract men, which open transexual activism and drawing a lot of attention to transsexuals as a group would interfere with.

    Autogynephilics, in contrast, get off on the idea of themselves as women. Many maintain their attraction to women, which actual women don't usually reciprocate. Thus they place a supreme importance on making women accept them as part of "muh sisterhood," via PC activism and indoctrination. This leads to an inevitable conflict with certain parts of the radical feminist movement, which is currently gripped by an internal conflict, not unlike that which occurred between racial and religious antisemites in the 19th century.

    Basically, the homosexual transsexual is the soldier who wants to make people think he is part of the landscape. The autogynephilic transexual is the Emporer who wants to force people to say he is wearing clothes even though everyone knows he is naked, by threatening to have them fired if they don't toe the line.

    Replies: @Lurker

  79. @Abolish_public_education
    @Kronos

    In recent years, there have been alarming reports of the public education policy of keeping really bad apples in school (you know, as funding tokens) rather than referring them to the juvenile justice system (where they belong). The most notorious token being Nikolas Cruz (the alleged Parkland School shooter).

    See Washington Times.

    Replies: @Kronos, @stillCARealist

    Oh yes, I recall that information.

  80. @Rob McX
    @Reg Cæsar


    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world...
     
    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    https://i1.wp.com/www.towleroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/corrigan.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Replies: @SOL, @Reg Cæsar, @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @AnotherDad, @Kyle

    Whoa! Poojit who?

  81. @SimpleSong
    My armchair analysis of the situation:

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user. People who overdose on fentanyl don't get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy, breathing slows, then stops, then they die. They don't have air hunger; in fact the problem with fentanyl is that it takes away air hunger. So someone complaining that they can't breathe is not consistent with a fentanyl overdose--people overdosing on fentanyl don't care if they can't breathe, and that's the problem.

    However the fact that he was complaining that he couldn't breathe early during the arrest suggests that he was having some other medical event at the time of arrest. This could have been any number of things, some of which can be detected on autopsy (heart attack, pulmonary embolism), some of which cannot (arrhythmia, severe bronchospasm.) Furthermore, these may have been caused by some of the other drugs found in his system (PCP I believe was found?), they may have been exacerbated by it, they may have just happened independently. It's pretty much impossible to know for certain.

    If an individual is having some sort of medical event that causes shortness of breath, the restraint techniques used by the police would almost certainly make the situation worse. Generally you want somebody sitting up so that their weight is off the diaphragm and they can breathe as deeply as possible. However they were clearly not choking him as he could speak, so the trachea wasn't obstructed. Regardless, it certainly made the situation worse.

    However from the police's perspective, it's difficult to know whether this guy really is having a cardiopulmonary issue or whether he's just faking to try to get out of being arrested. Even if they had training, they don't really have the equipment to figure this stuff out.

    Replies: @415 reasons, @TGGP, @Alden, @Art Deco, @Bozo the Clown

    Methamphetamine

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
    @415 reasons

    Ah, I didn't realize it was meth. Yeah that can cause all sorts of cardiopulmonary issues, obviously. Meth is much worse for your body than fentanyl provided you don't overdose.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  82. @Abolish_public_education
    The USG basically carves states out of existing states (i.e. public lands), in violation of Article 4 §3.

    But I would have no problem with the USG transferring the large, US legal population of tax leeches to the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (AK), and then peeling it off as the 51st state.

    We could call it “Liberia”.

    Replies: @syonredux, @Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY)

    Just declare that Mississippi and Alabama are Wakanda. Then a little population transfer (Whites out, Blacks in). As a bonus, the Blacks get ownership of everything in those states.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    @syonredux

    syon, and Lou Saban goes to coach at Ohio Stae.

  83. @Abolish_public_education
    The USG basically carves states out of existing states (i.e. public lands), in violation of Article 4 §3.

    But I would have no problem with the USG transferring the large, US legal population of tax leeches to the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (AK), and then peeling it off as the 51st state.

    We could call it “Liberia”.

    Replies: @syonredux, @Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY)

    “The USG basically carves states out of existing states (i.e. public lands), in violation of Article 4 §3.”

    When has this ever happened?

    Article 4 §3 says: “New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress. (The next clause is irrelevant.)

    • Replies: @Abolish_public_education
    @Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY)

    That the USG doesn’t formally declare land within an existing state to be a US territory or a new state (e.g. WV) is just legalistic baloney.

    The fact is that Washington (special interests!) controls the land, not the state it’s nominally a part of.

    That’s unconstitutional.

  84. @Mike Tre
    http://womenwholiveonrocks.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/ispeakjiveblogedit.jpg

    Replies: @syonredux

  85. @Clifford Brown
    Opiates kill 70,000 plus Americans per year, likely even more during the Corona virus lockdown. The number of unarmed Black men shot and killed by police ranges from 9 to 15 per annum.

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    Replies: @Rapparee, @Kronos, @Anonymousse, @Thoughts

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    Except those with the background of the Sackler’s who sell the opiates and feel safer in racially divided country… unfortunately for everyone else their lives are the only ones that actually get to matter.

    • Agree: Mr McKenna
  86. He seemed paranoid. Do opiates make you paranoid? He had meth in his system too.

    He also said he had just lost his mother. A quick google search reveals that his mother died two years ago. Her name was Larcenia. You couldn’t have made this guy’s story up.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Mr. Anon


    He seemed paranoid. Do opiates make you paranoid? He had meth in his system too.
     
    A lot of people don’t like to be arrested and go to jail. Have you seen the story of the guy who wrestled with police recently at the Wendy’s in Atlanta and was shot by one of the officers?
  87. Anonymous[123] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous
    Floyd's claim to have covid is by itself the end of the murder charge.

    Cops used full immobilization techniques on a drugged up guy who claimed to have the scariest disease in the world.

    Case closed.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @backup

    Floyd’s claim to have covid is by itself the end of the murder charge.

    Cops used full immobilization techniques on a drugged up guy who claimed to have the scariest disease in the world.

    Case closed.

    What does his having Covid have to do with this?

    • Replies: @Marty
    @Anonymous

    It means you’re excused from having to risk wrestling the guy. Hello?

  88. So is George Schwartz, CNN, MSNBC, and all the other instigators going to pay for all the property damage done throughout our major cities because of the Saint George HOAX?

    So how long before another Saint Trayvon or Saint George comes on the scene again?

    One thing we know for certain, there will not be any protests manufactured by the media or Georgie Schwartz over all the White victims of Black on White violence that happens daily all over America and Europe.

  89. TGGP says: • Website
    @Anonymous
    @TGGP


    This video is just sad. It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.
     
    Or it’s someone with a criminal history, probation status, or outstanding warrants acting with knowledge that arrest is going to lead to undesired consequences. If he was just “freaking out,” where did he come up with the wits to repeatedly lie to the police to try to get out of the arrest?

    Replies: @TGGP, @Percy Gryce

    I don’t see much evidence of him having his wits available. The stuff he’s saying wouldn’t get him out of any arrest. The closest he comes to even attempting that is saying “I ain’t like that”, although it was unclear what specifically he was denying there. At best he might have gotten an ambulance to arrive sooner, which would just result in him being handcuffed to a hospital bed and transferred to jail later.

    • Replies: @gutta percha
    @TGGP

    "The stuff he’s saying wouldn’t get him out of any arrest. "

    And yet in the hundreds of arrest bodycam videos online, you'll see plenty of people bleat and lie and spin BS distractions, thinking they can talk their way out of arrest. It's actually pretty common; seems to happen regardless of race of arrestee. I'm sure that cops get tired of hearing it so often.

    A great example is Rayshard Brooks. He improvised a full half-hour of continuous, pure, dense verbal bullsh!t, before he decided to fight the all-too-patient cops. It's exhausting and maddening to listen to.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna

  90. @Hypnotoad666
    @Clyde

    Floyd's state looks a lot like what cops and ER doctors call "Excited Delirium" Syndrome (EXD). Some medical professionals think it's not really a thing, but first responders see it enough that they are specifically trained to deal with it. Basically, some combination of stress/drugs/mental illness/police restraint causes the person to become hallucinatory and to expend all of their energy in manic physical resistance, whereupon they can suddenly crash and stop breathing or go into cardiac arrest.

    Apparently, treatment includes restraining the person so that they don't expend all their energy or harm others while flailing around, and keeping them prone to improve breathing. In one of the other video clips, Chauvin is heard to say he is deliberately keeping Floyd on his stomach, presumably because he was following the EXD protocol on him.




    Here's what Wikipedia says about EXD.

    Definitions and symptoms
    EXD has been accepted by the National Association of Medical Examiners and the American College of Emergency Physicians, who argue in a 2009 white paper that "excited delirium" may be described by several codes within the ICD-9.[5] A November 2012 The Journal of Emergency Medicine literature review says that the American College of Emergency Physicians Task Force reached consensus, based on "available evidence, that Excited Delirium Syndrome (EDS) is a "real syndrome with uncertain, likely multiple, etiologies."[1]

    According to the 2020 publication, "excited delirium syndrome" is a "clinical diagnosis" with symptoms including delirium, psychomotor agitation, and hyperadrenergic autonomic dysfunction.[6]

    The diagnosis was not in the 2013 Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders-5 or the 1992 International Classification of Diseases.[1][7]

    Treatment and prognosis
    Treatment initially may include ketamine or midazolam and haloperidol injected into a muscle to sedate the person.[2] Rapid cooling may be required in those with high body temperature.[1] Other supportive measures such as intravenous fluids and sodium bicarbonate may be useful.[1] One of the benefits of ketamine is its rapid onset of action.[8] The risk of death among those affected is less than 10%.[1] If death occurs it is typically sudden and cardiac in nature.[1]

    Epidemiology and history
    How frequently cases occur is unknown.[1] Males are affected more often than females.[9] Those who die from the condition are typically male with an average age of 36.[1] Often law enforcement has used tasers or physical measures in these cases.[1] A similar condition was described in the 1800s and was referred to as "Bell's mania".[1]

    The first use of the term "excited delirium" (EXD) was in a 1985 Journal of Forensic Sciences article, co-authored by coroner, Charles V. Wetli, entitled "Cocaine-induced psychosis and sudden death in recreational cocaine users".[10][11][1] The JFS article reported that in "five of the seven" cases they studied, deaths occurred while in police custody.[11]

    Signs and symptoms
    The signs and symptoms for excited delirium may include:[12][13][14][15]

    Paranoia
    Disorientation
    Dissociation
    Aggressiveness and combativeness
    Fast heart rate
    Hallucination
    Diaphoresis (profuse sweating)
    Incoherent speech or shouting
    Unexpected strength (typically while trying to resist restraint)
    Hyperthermia (overheating)
    Inappropriately clothed e.g. having removed garments
    Cause
    Excited delirium occurs most commonly in males with a history of serious mental illness or acute or chronic drug abuse, particularly stimulant drugs such as cocaine and MDPV.[5][16][17] Alcohol withdrawal or head trauma may also contribute to the condition.[13] Physical struggle, especially if prolonged, greatly exacerbates many of the harmful symptoms such as metabolic acidosis, hyperthermia, catecholamine surge, and tachycardia.[1] A majority of fatal cases involved men in a law enforcement or restraint situation.

    People with excited delirium commonly have acute drug intoxication, generally involving PCP, methylenedioxypyrovalerone (MDPV), cocaine, or methamphetamine.[12] Other drugs that may contribute to death are antipsychotics.[18][19][20]

    The cause is often related to long-term drug use or mental illness.[1] Commonly involved drugs include cocaine, methamphetamine, or certain substituted cathinones.[3] In those with mental illness, rapidly stopping medications such as antipsychotics may trigger the condition.[1]

    Mechanisms
    The pathophysiology of excited delirium is unclear,[14] but likely involves multiple factors.[21] These may include positional asphyxia, hyperthermia, drug toxicity, and/or catecholamine-induced fatal abnormal heart rhythms.[21] The underlying mechanism may involve dysfunction of the dopamine system in the brain.[3]

    Diagnosis
    Key signs of excited delirium are aggression, altered mental status, and diaphoresis/hyperthermia.[22]

    Other conditions which can resemble excited delirium are mania, neuroleptic malignant syndrome, hypoglycemia, thyroid storm, and catatonia of the malignant or excited type.[23][22]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excited_delirium#:~:text=Excited%20delirium%20(EXD)%2C%20also,rhabdomyolysis%20or%20high%20blood%20potassium.

    Replies: @Anon7

    OTOH the Minneapolis police manual says

    “ Once the subject is secured, an officer shall watch for any of the following signs: (06/13/14)
    · Significant change in behavior or level consciousness;
    · Shortness of breath or irregular breathing;
    · Seizures or convulsions;
    · Complaints of serious pain or injury; and/or
    · Any other serious medical problem.
    H. If officers observe any serious medical issue, they shall immediately contact EMS or transport directly to a local hospital. Officers shall also notify a supervisor. ”

    http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/police/policy/mpdpolicy_9-100_9-100

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Anon7

    They did call an ambulance but, apparently, it got dispatched with a lower priority than the cops requested and got lost on the way.

    Replies: @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @Anon7, @stillCARealist, @JimDandy

    , @Redman
    @Anon7

    The ambulance went to the wrong location. In the full transcript that was released a while ago, the cops were trying to figure out why it had taken so long. That was the reason.

  91. @SimpleSong
    My armchair analysis of the situation:

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user. People who overdose on fentanyl don't get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy, breathing slows, then stops, then they die. They don't have air hunger; in fact the problem with fentanyl is that it takes away air hunger. So someone complaining that they can't breathe is not consistent with a fentanyl overdose--people overdosing on fentanyl don't care if they can't breathe, and that's the problem.

    However the fact that he was complaining that he couldn't breathe early during the arrest suggests that he was having some other medical event at the time of arrest. This could have been any number of things, some of which can be detected on autopsy (heart attack, pulmonary embolism), some of which cannot (arrhythmia, severe bronchospasm.) Furthermore, these may have been caused by some of the other drugs found in his system (PCP I believe was found?), they may have been exacerbated by it, they may have just happened independently. It's pretty much impossible to know for certain.

    If an individual is having some sort of medical event that causes shortness of breath, the restraint techniques used by the police would almost certainly make the situation worse. Generally you want somebody sitting up so that their weight is off the diaphragm and they can breathe as deeply as possible. However they were clearly not choking him as he could speak, so the trachea wasn't obstructed. Regardless, it certainly made the situation worse.

    However from the police's perspective, it's difficult to know whether this guy really is having a cardiopulmonary issue or whether he's just faking to try to get out of being arrested. Even if they had training, they don't really have the equipment to figure this stuff out.

    Replies: @415 reasons, @TGGP, @Alden, @Art Deco, @Bozo the Clown

    So it sounds like if they’d kept him sitting in the cop car, rather than letting him out to lie down as he requested, he might have had better odds of surviving?

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
    @TGGP

    Might have changed it a bit but only very slightly. Positioning can help a little bit or hurt a little bit but you have to address the underlying medical issue. The restraint hold that was used is definitely not great for somebody who is having some sort of cardiopulmonary event, but, what are you to do when a criminal is combative and you don't even know if they are having a medical issue, you're not even trained to handle this stuff? It's simply a bad situation.

  92. @TGGP
    This video is just sad. It's not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks "I don't feel like getting arrested today". It's someone freaking out.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Cato

    It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.

    Well, yes, he was freaking out. I had a friend who was doing Angel Dust, like a lot of us in 1975. The cops tried to talk to him, and ended up shooting him. He was white. Shit happens all the time. So the real question here is not why Saint George freaked out,… but why the whole fucking world freaked out?

    • Replies: @Neuday
    @Cato


    So the real question here is not why Saint George freaked out,… but why the whole fucking world freaked out?
     
    Because Trump's handling of the Plandemic wasn't ensuring his November loss, and Creepy Joe wasn't inspiring the Blecks to vote. Something had to be done.
  93. Look for more citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania.

    Chettymandering.

  94. @Joe, Averaged
    @Ray Cissman

    In what way did the knee hold contribute to his death? Autopsy showed no damage to neck etc

    Replies: @Anonymousse, @Ray Cissman

    Sedentary soymalians who play a lot of video games and watch a lot of movies imagine that a knee on the rear to one side of your neck obviously kills you (somehow?).

    Might sound funny to some reading this on their verandas in their smoking jackets, but there are people who specialize in this stuff. Ask any experienced submission grappler… Chauvin’s position is NOT any kind of choke and will neither cut off air (the front of the neck) nor bloodflow (the front towards both sides of the neck). Choking a grown man (much less a particularly big and strong one) is harder than it looks and without intent and precise positioning it won’t happen.

    You can try the Fetanyl Floyd challenge yourself and worst case you might want to see a chiropractor the next day for an almighty annoying crick.

  95. @415 reasons
    @SimpleSong

    Methamphetamine

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    Ah, I didn’t realize it was meth. Yeah that can cause all sorts of cardiopulmonary issues, obviously. Meth is much worse for your body than fentanyl provided you don’t overdose.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @SimpleSong

    He was on both meth and fentanyl. A stimulant and a depressant taken together is known as a Speedball, and is well known to be quite dangerous.

    Replies: @Joe Joe

  96. Anon[957] • Disclaimer says:

    OT: I think this qualifies as a Darwin award. “A 17-year-old activist who called to remove in-school police officers died Sunday morning after he was shot two days earlier.”

    What a dumbass.

    https://www.bing.com/search?q=activist+killed+chicago&cvid=06a69f78499044908c6e2cc11d420e67&FORM=ANNTA1&PC=DCTS

    Here’s another ironic shooting: “Two women who worked with a group called Mothers Against Senseless Killings to try to stop gun violence in their South Side Chicago neighborhood were killed by bullets that police don’t believe were intended for them.”

    They were hanging around on a corner with a gang member just out of prison who was the intended target. Bet you 10 bucks the gang member was a relative. What keeps you safe from gun violence is staying the heck away from gang members.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/07/30/chicago-gun-violence-activists-chantell-grant-andrea-stoudemire-shot/1865742001/

  97. Ctrl-f for “corona….”

    On Feb. 10, I wrote the following:

    Economists have long been puzzled at the lack of working-from-home in contexts where it’s easily possible. It makes office politics harder, but that should be a feature, not a bug. It makes it harder to surveil workers, but many companies make a point not to do that anyway even when it’s not hard to do via remote desktop spying.

    If the fears about China lying and asymtomatic carriers are correct and it happens that people end up trapped inside for the ~1.5 years it takes to develop a vaccine, a silver lining might be the normalization of working from home. The gains would be quite significant, especially in counties like the USA with a lot of urban areas favored by corporations that have horrible politics around zoning and crime.

    https://alexanderturok.wordpress.com/2020/02/10/will-corona-lead-to-more-working-from-home-long-term/

    I didn’t get everything right. I naively assumed we could do better than China, I thought if China was telling the truth that they had the situation under control, we could get it under control too, but I severely overestimated the capacity of my fellow Americans to be reasonable. I didn’t see how many would be willing to whore themselves out. And for what? What’s the dollar value here? It’s like the old joke, man offers a woman a million dollars to sleep with him, she accepts, he then offers her 100$, she says she’s not a whore, and he says, well, you’ve already crossed that line, now we’re just haggling over the price. I don’t know how much it would take to get me to sell out my countrymen, to look the other way at the rivers of blood, because I haven’t received that offer. So maybe I’m being too harsh.

    Nor did I foresee that corona would indirectly trigger the crime wave. I knew that there was this Bereau of Land Management stuff bouncing around in these blue urban areas, but I didn’t see the whoring out and the discrediting of the right, which paved the way for the BLM’s ascendency. It does provide a convenient way out for those who were at those truck stops, no longer possess their virginity and want to ignore corona, to point to it and say, ah, this is why there’s this flight away from the cities. And it’ll be true, but it won’t be the whole truth.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Alexander Turok

    I'm surprised you emerged from your bio-containment bubble long enough to comment.

    I'm guessing that almost nobody here cares what you have to say. I know for certain that I don't.

    Replies: @Alexander Turok

    , @Hippopotamusdrome
    @Alexander Turok

    Relax. It's just the flu, bro.

  98. @Anonymous
    @Reg Cæsar


    Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced
     
    Who is this individual?

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    Who is this individual?

    https://www.zoominfo.com/p/Pooja-Jhunjhunwala/1821378699

    https://www.linkedin.com/search/results/people/?firstName=Pooja&lastName=Jhunjhunwala&origin=SEO_PSERP

    She is not the only Pooja at USAID, either:

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/poojasoodpayeur/

    Half The Sky – Pooja’s Story

    Their case against Miss Corrigan is un-Merritted!

    House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Eliot Engel and 19 other Democrats wrote acting USAID Administrator John Barsa that Corrigan holds positions “in direct opposition to the work USAID supports.”

    In another tweet, Corrigan wrote: “The United States is losing ground in the battle to garner influence through humanitarian aid because we now refuse to help countries who don’t celebrate sexual deviancy. Meanwhile, Russia and China are happy to step in and eat our lunch.”

    “I’m not cis-anything. I’m a woman.”

    https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/03/trump-appointee-merritt-corrigan-fired-from-usaid-amid-anti-lgbtq-tweets.html

  99. No courtroom cameras = they already know these guys walk.
    ———-
    Oh hey, what are the odds of this, another church lit by an IED:
    https://www.patriotledger.com/news/20200803/weymouth-police-fire-investigating-church-fire-as-arson

  100. @Rob McX
    @SOL

    I hope so too. She also tweeted that Viktor Orbán is "a shining champion of Western civilization".

    Elsewhere she wrote:

    A woman today is expected by society to come to marriage and motherhood in physical and spiritual decline, if ever. This is the life women have been offered by those who would rather us toil away as isolated economic units for faceless corporations, far from the natural pleasures of the domestic, far from the guardianship of a loving husband, and far from the life-giving experience of motherhood.
     

    She has no business in the Washington cesspit.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @AnotherDad

    Wow — that is a really impressive quote. Surely the most perspicacious of the recent cancel victims.

    • Agree: bomag
  101. @usNthem
    @William D. Wall

    I’ve seen a number of - probably too many - videos where the cops are way too patient and restrained when mouth breathing joggers are basically going bonkers, especially verbally. To see them continually and calmly repeat the same instructions over and over again while a chimpout is in progress in maddening to watch.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Johnny Smoggins

    Still one of my favorites…

    • Replies: @usNthem
    @Kronos

    Should have had a follow up as to how the new dwarf - oops, I mean little people - job was going.

    , @Mr McKenna
    @Kronos

    Officer Evan Rosenthal? Well, there's one cop who won't be made world-famous when someone dies in his charge.

    , @Steve in Greensboro
    @Kronos

    The circus is in town?

  102. How many of the people blithely dismissing overdose have read the excellent article which appeared here at Unz a while back and connected overdose symptoms (and symptoms of arrest shock) to Floyd’s behavior?

  103. @Steve Richter
    Chauvin is still in prison awaiting trial? If true, that is terribly unfair. His lawyers need to be fighting for their client in the court of public opinion. Make the point over and over that Chauvin was trying to help Floyd the best he could do. Get him to stay still and calm down which waiting for ambulance that was expected at any moment.

    Replies: @James Braxton, @Buffalo Joe

    Gag order.

    • Replies: @Steve Richter
    @James Braxton

    how is a gag order on a defendant constitutional? Public opinion is the reason Chauvin is in jail and on trial. The fact that the trial is not held immediately kind of proves that public opinion will sway the jury. The defendant has to be allowed to make his case to the public since it is the public's threat of violence that will compel the jury to convict him.

  104. @Altai
    And since I know Steve loves the idea that bodycams were introduced to record all the epic police brutality but instead are helping cops get exonerated.

    2019 saw the release of a film whose premise is an entertaining one, black female cop catches corrupt white cops executing black man, one of them tries to kill her but she escapes with the whole event on her bodycam. But since the footage gets taped over every 12 hours, she has to evade both the cops and the black gangs (Who are in league with the corrupt cops) in a black ghetto where she is seen as the enemy in her attempt to get the footage uploaded.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCfSeVCr7ng

    Replies: @TGGP

    In Chicago we actually did have police killing people for gangsters. Some of it stemmed from when the Housing Authority had their own police force (created out of perceived neglect from CPD), which was later incorporated back into CPD.
    https://theintercept.com/series/code-of-silence/

  105. @Stan Adams
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    When it starts snowing in Hell.

    Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    “People in Hell want ice water, don’t mean shit to me.”–Harlan Ellison on Esquire’s “Frank Sinatra has a Cold” by Gay Talese.

  106. @TGGP
    @Anonymous

    I don't see much evidence of him having his wits available. The stuff he's saying wouldn't get him out of any arrest. The closest he comes to even attempting that is saying "I ain't like that", although it was unclear what specifically he was denying there. At best he might have gotten an ambulance to arrive sooner, which would just result in him being handcuffed to a hospital bed and transferred to jail later.

    Replies: @gutta percha

    “The stuff he’s saying wouldn’t get him out of any arrest. ”

    And yet in the hundreds of arrest bodycam videos online, you’ll see plenty of people bleat and lie and spin BS distractions, thinking they can talk their way out of arrest. It’s actually pretty common; seems to happen regardless of race of arrestee. I’m sure that cops get tired of hearing it so often.

    A great example is Rayshard Brooks. He improvised a full half-hour of continuous, pure, dense verbal bullsh!t, before he decided to fight the all-too-patient cops. It’s exhausting and maddening to listen to.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    @gutta percha


    A great example is Rayshard Brooks. He improvised a full half-hour of continuous, pure, dense verbal bullsh!t, before he decided to fight the all-too-patient cops. It’s exhausting and maddening to listen to.
     
    Should have gone into politics. Particularly in the Current Year.

    Oh well. There's millions more just like him. Only breathing.
  107. @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

    There was morphine in his blood.

  108. @Altai
    This isn't Chauvin's cam, he came on the scene later. But I have to say I'm surprised the initial officer was pointing his gun sideways in the face of Floyd and cursing him out when Floyd hadn't yet done anything. I thought the call out was for a guy driving high after trying to pass a fake note.

    But then I imagine with a guy as big as Floyd they wanted to establish dominance or were genuinely afraid of what he could do with his fists. Still, it's not going to look good and I can see CNN playing that clip where he jabs his gun while holding it sideways and tells him to 'get the fuck out of the car' while Floyd says 'sorry sir'. If you do those rounds you're all the time playing Russian roulette for the one time somebody does something.

    Replies: @anon

    Taser not a firearm. And turned diagonally due to the angle/distance he was at.

    • Replies: @CAL2
    @anon

    That doesn't look like a taser. That's a gun with a flashlight underneath the barrel. At least it looks that way to me.

  109. Anonymous[348] • Disclaimer says:
    @Lurker
    @Anon


    White trannies seem to be hogging all the airtime. Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?
     
    Its certainly something the MSM want us to associate with whites. Why the media would want white men to be seen as effeminate and weird is a mystery that I guess will never be solved.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Blacks are actually overrepresented among homosexual transexuals and underrepresented among autogynephilic transexuals. Understanding the difference is key.

    Homosexual transexuals are basically gay men who “become women to attract men.” They adopt an exaggerated form of femininity, to become “more women than the women,” one could see this as an example of the “zeal of the convert.” They are underrepresented among transexual activists, perhaps because their ultimate goal is crypsis, to be undifferentiated from actual women in order to better attract men, which open transexual activism and drawing a lot of attention to transsexuals as a group would interfere with.

    Autogynephilics, in contrast, get off on the idea of themselves as women. Many maintain their attraction to women, which actual women don’t usually reciprocate. Thus they place a supreme importance on making women accept them as part of “muh sisterhood,” via PC activism and indoctrination. This leads to an inevitable conflict with certain parts of the radical feminist movement, which is currently gripped by an internal conflict, not unlike that which occurred between racial and religious antisemites in the 19th century.

    Basically, the homosexual transsexual is the soldier who wants to make people think he is part of the landscape. The autogynephilic transexual is the Emporer who wants to force people to say he is wearing clothes even though everyone knows he is naked, by threatening to have them fired if they don’t toe the line.

    • Thanks: wren
    • Replies: @Lurker
    @Anonymous

    Thanks, that's the best summation Ive seen.

  110. @Joe, Averaged
    @Ray Cissman

    In what way did the knee hold contribute to his death? Autopsy showed no damage to neck etc

    Replies: @Anonymousse, @Ray Cissman

    Not the knee so much as the face-down positioning which is not conducive to easy breathing. There’s a video of a white guy who died the same way, but I’m not sure if he was as loaded. I was against charging the cops from the get-go, but I will always wonder if things might have turned out different had they turned him on his side. There were four of them for Christ’s sake.

  111. @Clyde
    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video

    Replies: @BenKenobi, @Hypnotoad666, @JimDandy, @AnotherDad, @Percy Gryce

    What’s the lethal does of a guy’s entire stash shoved up his rectum? He admitted he was hoopin’!

  112. @Hypnotoad666
    @LittleNano


    Locally, BLM has demanded the removal of both dash and body cams.
     
    They originally adopted body cams after Fergusson at the insistence of BLM and the ACLU, so this reversal of positions shows that keeping a record of the facts must help the officers more.

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

    Always-on body cams, and GPS-based locaters should be required wear for all government workers, especially LEOs and schoolteachers, during their shifts.

    The audio-video and location coordinates should be made publicly available in real-time.

    Politicians should also be subject to those regulations, but coverage extended to 24×7.

  113. Anonymous[380] • Disclaimer says:

    Thanks for Merritt hot chick pic/links. She looks like the kind that stays sexy for 30 years or more. Say 18-48. (18 is not the actual biological low end number but in the current hysterical feminist era it’s the safe # for publishing.)

    I wouldn’t call her a waif type but most of the women who hit the wall in their 40s are waifs. It’s the curvy bombshells who hit the wall around 30. Latin curvy means the wall is coming mid-late 20s. Sorry truth hurts.

    Isteve blog is alltime classic but could use more hot chick pics. Who can deny it?

    • LOL: Percy Gryce
  114. @Kronos
    @usNthem

    Still one of my favorites...

    https://youtu.be/Q9Co2iH44ug

    Replies: @usNthem, @Mr McKenna, @Steve in Greensboro

    Should have had a follow up as to how the new dwarf – oops, I mean little people – job was going.

  115. When the civilian is that out-of-their mind behind the wheel of a car, I wonder if a better approach would be just to take his keys away and impound his car. When sober, the civilian can go to the police station to get his car, while at the same time he is arrested. In this case, it was for a fake $20 bill. If he doesn’t come to the station, he loses his car. Also, they can get his ID, which can be used to affect a later arrest or apply some other consequence.

    Perhaps, the same strategy could have been done for the guy who was passed out at the Wendy’s.

    By the way, I’ve seen a few of these videos and the civilians really start to go nuts when they get handcuffed. This article refers to it as “excited delirium syndrome (ExDS)”. There is a video near the end of the article of a black cop with his knee on the neck of white guy, who subsequently dies, presumably of a drug overdose.

    At 5:25 a Black police officer uses knee-to-neck restraint against the white suspect. The Black police officer resumes this position seconds later. The suspect dies in this position.”

    https://medium.com/@gavrilodavid/why-derek-chauvin-may-get-off-his-murder-charge-2e2ad8d0911

    • Replies: @anon
    @ziggurat

    Perhaps, the same strategy could have been done for the guy who was passed out at the Wendy’s.

    Sigh. This, again? Dude, all that discretion was taken away from cops in the 80's and 90's by Mothers Against Drunk Driving. Now it's "blow over 0.08? Car gets towed, driver goin' to jail" in most states, maybe all. You seriously asking street cops to risk their jobs for some drunk? Really?

    Then there's liability - if the cops in Atlanta let that drunk who passed out in the Wendy's driveup start walking home and he got clipped by a car in the street, who would be at fault? The cops. The city. The county. CaCHING$!

    Maybe that stuff was done like 50 years ago, but it's all over now, thanks to the well meaning lieberals who decided 30+ years ago that officer discretion was a bad thing. But mandatory arrest? Good thing. Knowing the law is a good thing too...

    If you do not like this, contact your state legislature and start working. You will be going up against middle aged women with a lot of time on their hands. Good luck on that.

    Know something else? If your local cop shop offers "ride alongs" you should go on one, just to observe what cops do on their shift. See what really happens. It's like watching COPS only in real time, mostly boring but not always. Drunks...are not as funny in real life as on TV.

    Replies: @JMcG

  116. @Anon7
    @Hypnotoad666

    OTOH the Minneapolis police manual says

    “ Once the subject is secured, an officer shall watch for any of the following signs: (06/13/14)
    · Significant change in behavior or level consciousness;
    · Shortness of breath or irregular breathing;
    · Seizures or convulsions;
    · Complaints of serious pain or injury; and/or
    · Any other serious medical problem.
    H. If officers observe any serious medical issue, they shall immediately contact EMS or transport directly to a local hospital. Officers shall also notify a supervisor. ”

    http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/police/policy/mpdpolicy_9-100_9-100

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Redman

    They did call an ambulance but, apparently, it got dispatched with a lower priority than the cops requested and got lost on the way.

    • Replies: @Giancarlo M. Kumquat
    @Steve Sailer

    How ironic if the ambulance driver was a Somalian.

    , @Anon7
    @Steve Sailer

    From the NYTimes:


    The filings also indicate that an ambulance, called early in the encounter, did not respond right away and initially went to the wrong spot.

    According to the transcripts, Mr. Lane called for an ambulance after Mr. Floyd’s mouth started bleeding. Mr. Lane told investigators it was likely when Mr. Floyd banged his face on the glass inside of the squad car.

    Mr. Lane then upgraded that ambulance request, from a less-serious “Code 2” to a more serious “Code 3,” after Mr. Floyd had repeatedly said he could not breathe and the officers discussed whether he could be high on drugs...

    After the ambulance arrived, Mr. Lane rode with Mr. Floyd to a hospital alongside ambulance workers and performed chest compressions on him. One worker told Mr. Lane the ambulance waited to respond because it was called in as a “code 2 mouth injury.”

    ”And then as we’re sitting here, I’m like, ‘Now it says Code 3, I just don’t understand,’” the worker said, explaining what had happened. “And then we figured out where it was so, and then one of your officers was like, ‘Hey, hey ding-dongs, you’re at the wrong spot.’”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/us/george-floyd-body-camera-transcripts.html
     

    Replies: @Tusk

    , @stillCARealist
    @Steve Sailer

    Ambulances get lost? What, they don't have GPS and others tracking their whereabouts? Heck, FedEx knows where all its packages are, and I know where my teen daughter is all the time.

    Replies: @Rob McX, @The Alarmist

    , @JimDandy
    @Steve Sailer

    That dispatcher should get the chair.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  117. citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania

    Chetty’d be satisfied with sending them to Scranton Wilkes-Barre. Those Dunder-Mifflin office park types are hoarding privilege.

  118. Anonymous[380] • Disclaimer says:

    MERRITT CORRIGAN = NOT GUILTY

    George F*cking Floyd = Guilty As F*ck

  119. @J1234
    Derrick Chauvin is not guilty of murder, IMO, and this video seems to prove it. Even before he was on the ground, George Floyd made a couple of remarks that suggested he might encounter breathing difficulties in the imminent future, suggesting that he'd had such episodes in the past. It seemed he wanted to be on the ground so that he could breathe. He said multiple times he wasn't going to resist...yet resisted pretty consistently throughout the incident. Did the cops take his warnings about breathing with the same grain of salt that they took his promises not to resist? I couldn't blame them if they did.

    He said things like "please don't shoot me" and "I don't want to die," and I believe he was very sincere, but he seemed overwhelmed by his fear and was unable to control his flight/resistance response. Why? This is a guy who'd been arrested by cops dozens of times over the years, and had survived all of those arrests, so why was he so paranoid during this particular arrest? According to him, he'd been shot before and was scared of that happening again. Or was it the drugs? Or did he just think his previous and vast record was going to nail him to the wall this time? Or...maybe it was the widespread mythology that white cops murder black male suspects all the time, a myth that you can see propagated on almost any major media news broadcast, in one way or another.

    Still, George is a sympathetic character in this case. Either the drugs or his paranoia or his inability to comprehend the reality of the situation was likely the cause of death. His airway wasn't crushed, yet his breathing stopped. I believe he died of fright. "Claustrophobia" as he said?

    Replies: @James Speaks, @JerseyJeffersonian, @gutta percha, @Bill P, @duncsbaby

    Yeah, he was panicking most likely due to being way too high. I honestly feel bad for the guy. The panic itself can cause extreme fluctuations of blood pressure and heart rate. Floyd was 46 with serious coronary artery disease.

    The man was a mess.

    But should we expect cops to be compassionate? Is that what they’re paid for? Sounds cruel but how many people out there would have had compassion for a huge, difficult, middle-aged felon on drugs?

    There are real, physical limits to that kind of compassion.

    Maybe Floyd deserved it, but “deserve’s got nothing to do with it.” Most of us guys figure that out by a certain point and behave accordingly.

    I’m sorry Floyd never got there, but whose fault is that, really?

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @Bill P

    It was Floyd's fault. There. I said it so you didn't have to.

  120. The sooner there isn’t any reason to keep mentioning G.F. the better. Exonerate Chauvin, spray the people protesting his exoneration with dog piss or gasoline or both, and forget about it.

  121. @Steve Sailer
    @Anon7

    They did call an ambulance but, apparently, it got dispatched with a lower priority than the cops requested and got lost on the way.

    Replies: @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @Anon7, @stillCARealist, @JimDandy

    How ironic if the ambulance driver was a Somalian.

  122. @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

    He also said he was “hooping” at one point. Could that have meant the slang term for using crushed drugs up one’s rectum? I originally thought it meant he was playing basketball, but maybe he was being honest,

  123. @Bill P
    @J1234

    Yeah, he was panicking most likely due to being way too high. I honestly feel bad for the guy. The panic itself can cause extreme fluctuations of blood pressure and heart rate. Floyd was 46 with serious coronary artery disease.

    The man was a mess.

    But should we expect cops to be compassionate? Is that what they're paid for? Sounds cruel but how many people out there would have had compassion for a huge, difficult, middle-aged felon on drugs?

    There are real, physical limits to that kind of compassion.

    Maybe Floyd deserved it, but "deserve's got nothing to do with it." Most of us guys figure that out by a certain point and behave accordingly.

    I'm sorry Floyd never got there, but whose fault is that, really?

    Replies: @JimDandy

    It was Floyd’s fault. There. I said it so you didn’t have to.

    • Agree: duncsbaby
  124. @Steve Sailer
    @James Speaks

    When did Chauvin arrive on the scene?

    Replies: @Redman, @Lot, @James Speaks, @Chrisnonymous

    You can see Chauvin arriving on the scene near the end of the video. On the left side.

  125. @Steve Sailer
    @Anon7

    They did call an ambulance but, apparently, it got dispatched with a lower priority than the cops requested and got lost on the way.

    Replies: @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @Anon7, @stillCARealist, @JimDandy

    From the NYTimes:

    The filings also indicate that an ambulance, called early in the encounter, did not respond right away and initially went to the wrong spot.

    According to the transcripts, Mr. Lane called for an ambulance after Mr. Floyd’s mouth started bleeding. Mr. Lane told investigators it was likely when Mr. Floyd banged his face on the glass inside of the squad car.

    Mr. Lane then upgraded that ambulance request, from a less-serious “Code 2” to a more serious “Code 3,” after Mr. Floyd had repeatedly said he could not breathe and the officers discussed whether he could be high on drugs…

    After the ambulance arrived, Mr. Lane rode with Mr. Floyd to a hospital alongside ambulance workers and performed chest compressions on him. One worker told Mr. Lane the ambulance waited to respond because it was called in as a “code 2 mouth injury.”

    ”And then as we’re sitting here, I’m like, ‘Now it says Code 3, I just don’t understand,’” the worker said, explaining what had happened. “And then we figured out where it was so, and then one of your officers was like, ‘Hey, hey ding-dongs, you’re at the wrong spot.’”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/us/george-floyd-body-camera-transcripts.html

    • Replies: @Tusk
    @Anon7

    To admit that the ambulance should have come/been notified he was on fentanyl is to admit that drugs were a factor in his death, otherwise why would it be important an ambulance arrived if he was only bleeding due to a cut on his mouth?

  126. @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

    Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    Heroin quickly metabolizes into morphine. Mr. Floyd’s blood concentration of morphine was 86 ng/mL. 200 ng/mL is almost always fatal. In a recent study of Fentanyl overdose deaths, the mean blood concentration was 8.2 ng/mL. My Floyd’s concentration was 11 ng/mL. When the Fentanyl metabolite is added, he started with a concentration of 21 ng/mL. So a blood concentration of Fentanyl of 2.5 times the mean fatal concentration plus a morphine blood concentration of 43% of the almost always fatal concentration, plus meth and traces of THC, all of which combined into a deadly cocktail. Add in the pre-existing heart conditions and recent Covid-19 and Mr. Floyd was a cardiac arrest waiting to happen.

    • Thanks: ThreeCranes
    • Replies: @Lot
    @FPD72

    (also @bentillman)

    "Heroin quickly metabolizes into morphine"

    Codeine, which comes in prescription pills and is sometimes added to counterfeit drugs, also has morphine as a metabolite. In fact, the autopsy uses the phrase "Morphine - Free (Codeine Metabolite)."

    We can also rule out day-of-death heroin use, as he tested negative for 6-monoacetylmorphine which is both a unique heroin metabolite and found on its own in most street heroin.

    No needle marks or scars and the fact that fake oxycodone pills with fentanyl were all over MN and were the cause of Prince's OD death, all lead to the strongest inference that he did probably did not have much if any opioid tolerance. It also appears he and his companions, while they had a pipe of some sort in the SUV, did not have any heroin paraphernalia.

    "Mr. Floyd’s blood concentration of morphine was 86 ng/mL. 200 ng/mL is almost always fatal."

    It was a urine test. Do they test the same, or do they give urine test results normalized for blood concentration?

  127. @Anon7
    @Hypnotoad666

    OTOH the Minneapolis police manual says

    “ Once the subject is secured, an officer shall watch for any of the following signs: (06/13/14)
    · Significant change in behavior or level consciousness;
    · Shortness of breath or irregular breathing;
    · Seizures or convulsions;
    · Complaints of serious pain or injury; and/or
    · Any other serious medical problem.
    H. If officers observe any serious medical issue, they shall immediately contact EMS or transport directly to a local hospital. Officers shall also notify a supervisor. ”

    http://www2.minneapolismn.gov/police/policy/mpdpolicy_9-100_9-100

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Redman

    The ambulance went to the wrong location. In the full transcript that was released a while ago, the cops were trying to figure out why it had taken so long. That was the reason.

  128. @Anon
    @Art Deco

    Not just 11ng/ml, but additionally 5.6 ng/ml norfentanyl, its metabolite.
    I am not a chemist or a physiologist, but doesn't that mean that he actually dosed (however) on almost 17 ng/ml?
    17 ng/ml is more than enough to induce respiratory failure in a 6'4" 223 lb. male.
    That's a lot of fentanyl to get that concentration, a self-administered overdose.
    No way you can pin murder on that.
    2nd degree manslaughter? I'm not a lawyer.

    Replies: @travis

    even the hospital could not save him from this OD. He arrived at the hospital still breathing and died 30 minutes after they took his blood. In addition to having a fatal dose of opioids in his blood he was an elderly man fighting COVID-19 with heart disease.

    Could they even convict these cops of police brutality ? for following police procedures against an uncooperative criminal ? Hard to see how they are even charged with manslaughter.

    • Replies: @Ripple Earthdevil
    @travis

    He was 46 years old. That's not exactly elderly.

    , @Chrisnonymous
    @travis

    He arrived at the hospital still breathing? Got a link?

  129. @Anonymous
    @Anonymous


    Floyd’s claim to have covid is by itself the end of the murder charge.

    Cops used full immobilization techniques on a drugged up guy who claimed to have the scariest disease in the world.

    Case closed.
     
    What does his having Covid have to do with this?

    Replies: @Marty

    It means you’re excused from having to risk wrestling the guy. Hello?

  130. @BenKenobi
    @Kronos

    Trayvon was Saint Skittles, The Innocuous.

    What should ol' Georgie-boy be?

    Saint Floyd, The Breathless?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Ripple Earthdevil, @Rouetheday

    St. George of the Faux Twenty

  131. @Rapparee
    @Clifford Brown

    Also good to remind ourselves that “unarmed” does not, contrary to ill-informed popular opinion, ipso facto make a shooting unjustified. Plenty of other factors and circumstances can justify the use of deadly force besides a physical weapon. (A buddy of mine remembers his Coast Guard superiors warning his gigantic Samoan shipmate not to come back from leave drunk and ready to pick a fight, because “We’ll have to shoot you, since you’re too big to subdue otherwise”). Police officers are convicted of actual homicide less than an average of once per year, though most bad shoots wind up going as manslaughter or some lesser charge.

    Replies: @Cowtown Rebel

    Question: “Why did David use a Sling to Slay Goliath?”

    Answer: “He didn’t have a .45!”

  132. anon[286] • Disclaimer says:
    @ziggurat
    When the civilian is that out-of-their mind behind the wheel of a car, I wonder if a better approach would be just to take his keys away and impound his car. When sober, the civilian can go to the police station to get his car, while at the same time he is arrested. In this case, it was for a fake $20 bill. If he doesn't come to the station, he loses his car. Also, they can get his ID, which can be used to affect a later arrest or apply some other consequence.

    Perhaps, the same strategy could have been done for the guy who was passed out at the Wendy's.

    By the way, I've seen a few of these videos and the civilians really start to go nuts when they get handcuffed. This article refers to it as "excited delirium syndrome (ExDS)". There is a video near the end of the article of a black cop with his knee on the neck of white guy, who subsequently dies, presumably of a drug overdose.


    At 5:25 a Black police officer uses knee-to-neck restraint against the white suspect. The Black police officer resumes this position seconds later. The suspect dies in this position."

     

    https://medium.com/@gavrilodavid/why-derek-chauvin-may-get-off-his-murder-charge-2e2ad8d0911

    Replies: @anon

    Perhaps, the same strategy could have been done for the guy who was passed out at the Wendy’s.

    Sigh. This, again? Dude, all that discretion was taken away from cops in the 80’s and 90’s by Mothers Against Drunk Driving. Now it’s “blow over 0.08? Car gets towed, driver goin’ to jail” in most states, maybe all. You seriously asking street cops to risk their jobs for some drunk? Really?

    Then there’s liability – if the cops in Atlanta let that drunk who passed out in the Wendy’s driveup start walking home and he got clipped by a car in the street, who would be at fault? The cops. The city. The county. CaCHING$!

    Maybe that stuff was done like 50 years ago, but it’s all over now, thanks to the well meaning lieberals who decided 30+ years ago that officer discretion was a bad thing. But mandatory arrest? Good thing. Knowing the law is a good thing too…

    If you do not like this, contact your state legislature and start working. You will be going up against middle aged women with a lot of time on their hands. Good luck on that.

    Know something else? If your local cop shop offers “ride alongs” you should go on one, just to observe what cops do on their shift. See what really happens. It’s like watching COPS only in real time, mostly boring but not always. Drunks…are not as funny in real life as on TV.

    • Thanks: ziggurat
    • Replies: @JMcG
    @anon

    Agreed. MADD puts volunteers in all the local district courts to make sure no one gets off a DUI hearing for any reason. Other than being an illegal with no license, that is.

  133. @Clyde
    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video

    Replies: @BenKenobi, @Hypnotoad666, @JimDandy, @AnotherDad, @Percy Gryce

    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video.

    For this we melted down the rule of law in America.

    And people think minoritarianism hasn’t been a completely end-to-end disaster for our nation, the West?

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @AnotherDad

    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.

    Replies: @Lot, @Hypnotoad666

  134. @Alexander Turok
    Ctrl-f for "corona...."

    On Feb. 10, I wrote the following:

    Economists have long been puzzled at the lack of working-from-home in contexts where it’s easily possible. It makes office politics harder, but that should be a feature, not a bug. It makes it harder to surveil workers, but many companies make a point not to do that anyway even when it’s not hard to do via remote desktop spying.

    If the fears about China lying and asymtomatic carriers are correct and it happens that people end up trapped inside for the ~1.5 years it takes to develop a vaccine, a silver lining might be the normalization of working from home. The gains would be quite significant, especially in counties like the USA with a lot of urban areas favored by corporations that have horrible politics around zoning and crime.
     
    https://alexanderturok.wordpress.com/2020/02/10/will-corona-lead-to-more-working-from-home-long-term/

    I didn't get everything right. I naively assumed we could do better than China, I thought if China was telling the truth that they had the situation under control, we could get it under control too, but I severely overestimated the capacity of my fellow Americans to be reasonable. I didn't see how many would be willing to whore themselves out. And for what? What's the dollar value here? It's like the old joke, man offers a woman a million dollars to sleep with him, she accepts, he then offers her 100$, she says she's not a whore, and he says, well, you've already crossed that line, now we're just haggling over the price. I don't know how much it would take to get me to sell out my countrymen, to look the other way at the rivers of blood, because I haven't received that offer. So maybe I'm being too harsh.

    Nor did I foresee that corona would indirectly trigger the crime wave. I knew that there was this Bereau of Land Management stuff bouncing around in these blue urban areas, but I didn't see the whoring out and the discrediting of the right, which paved the way for the BLM's ascendency. It does provide a convenient way out for those who were at those truck stops, no longer possess their virginity and want to ignore corona, to point to it and say, ah, this is why there's this flight away from the cities. And it'll be true, but it won't be the whole truth.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Hippopotamusdrome

    I’m surprised you emerged from your bio-containment bubble long enough to comment.

    I’m guessing that almost nobody here cares what you have to say. I know for certain that I don’t.

    • Replies: @Alexander Turok
    @Mr. Anon

    My bio-containment bubble has been equipped with internet commenting functionality for months now.


    I’m guessing that almost nobody here cares what you have to say. I know for certain that I don’t.
     
    I'm guessing that our host privately agrees with my comment.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

  135. @Anon7
    @Steve Sailer

    From the NYTimes:


    The filings also indicate that an ambulance, called early in the encounter, did not respond right away and initially went to the wrong spot.

    According to the transcripts, Mr. Lane called for an ambulance after Mr. Floyd’s mouth started bleeding. Mr. Lane told investigators it was likely when Mr. Floyd banged his face on the glass inside of the squad car.

    Mr. Lane then upgraded that ambulance request, from a less-serious “Code 2” to a more serious “Code 3,” after Mr. Floyd had repeatedly said he could not breathe and the officers discussed whether he could be high on drugs...

    After the ambulance arrived, Mr. Lane rode with Mr. Floyd to a hospital alongside ambulance workers and performed chest compressions on him. One worker told Mr. Lane the ambulance waited to respond because it was called in as a “code 2 mouth injury.”

    ”And then as we’re sitting here, I’m like, ‘Now it says Code 3, I just don’t understand,’” the worker said, explaining what had happened. “And then we figured out where it was so, and then one of your officers was like, ‘Hey, hey ding-dongs, you’re at the wrong spot.’”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/us/george-floyd-body-camera-transcripts.html
     

    Replies: @Tusk

    To admit that the ambulance should have come/been notified he was on fentanyl is to admit that drugs were a factor in his death, otherwise why would it be important an ambulance arrived if he was only bleeding due to a cut on his mouth?

  136. @Kronos
    @Harry Baldwin

    Oh boy, the broken windows fallacy in practice...

    https://youtu.be/erJEaFpS9ls

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    We could have used this guy in 1917, 1941, 1950, and 1965. We went through a lot of destruction, instead.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Reg Cæsar

    Keep in mind someone is making lots of money repairing windows. It’s just a general financial/economic loss to society.

  137. @SimpleSong
    @415 reasons

    Ah, I didn't realize it was meth. Yeah that can cause all sorts of cardiopulmonary issues, obviously. Meth is much worse for your body than fentanyl provided you don't overdose.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    He was on both meth and fentanyl. A stimulant and a depressant taken together is known as a Speedball, and is well known to be quite dangerous.

    • Replies: @Joe Joe
    @Mr. Anon

    Yes, John Belushi found that out the hard way!

  138. @travis
    @Anon

    even the hospital could not save him from this OD. He arrived at the hospital still breathing and died 30 minutes after they took his blood. In addition to having a fatal dose of opioids in his blood he was an elderly man fighting COVID-19 with heart disease.

    Could they even convict these cops of police brutality ? for following police procedures against an uncooperative criminal ? Hard to see how they are even charged with manslaughter.

    Replies: @Ripple Earthdevil, @Chrisnonymous

    He was 46 years old. That’s not exactly elderly.

  139. @FPD72
    @Lot


    Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.
     
    Heroin quickly metabolizes into morphine. Mr. Floyd’s blood concentration of morphine was 86 ng/mL. 200 ng/mL is almost always fatal. In a recent study of Fentanyl overdose deaths, the mean blood concentration was 8.2 ng/mL. My Floyd’s concentration was 11 ng/mL. When the Fentanyl metabolite is added, he started with a concentration of 21 ng/mL. So a blood concentration of Fentanyl of 2.5 times the mean fatal concentration plus a morphine blood concentration of 43% of the almost always fatal concentration, plus meth and traces of THC, all of which combined into a deadly cocktail. Add in the pre-existing heart conditions and recent Covid-19 and Mr. Floyd was a cardiac arrest waiting to happen.

    Replies: @Lot

    (also @bentillman)

    “Heroin quickly metabolizes into morphine”

    Codeine, which comes in prescription pills and is sometimes added to counterfeit drugs, also has morphine as a metabolite. In fact, the autopsy uses the phrase “Morphine – Free (Codeine Metabolite).”

    We can also rule out day-of-death heroin use, as he tested negative for 6-monoacetylmorphine which is both a unique heroin metabolite and found on its own in most street heroin.

    No needle marks or scars and the fact that fake oxycodone pills with fentanyl were all over MN and were the cause of Prince’s OD death, all lead to the strongest inference that he did probably did not have much if any opioid tolerance. It also appears he and his companions, while they had a pipe of some sort in the SUV, did not have any heroin paraphernalia.

    “Mr. Floyd’s blood concentration of morphine was 86 ng/mL. 200 ng/mL is almost always fatal.”

    It was a urine test. Do they test the same, or do they give urine test results normalized for blood concentration?

  140. @Rob McX
    @Reg Cæsar


    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world...
     
    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    https://i1.wp.com/www.towleroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/corrigan.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Replies: @SOL, @Reg Cæsar, @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @AnotherDad, @Kyle

    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    So do I. She’s a cutie.

    Here’s her offense from RegCaesar’s link:

    Let me clear: Gay marriage isn’t marriage / Men aren’t women / US-funded Tunisian LGBT soap operas aren’t America First.”

    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    Note: Unfortunate some people end up sexual screwed up. Nature ain’t perfect. Some people end up blind or deaf or crippled. Diseases come and go. Nasty stuff happens. But the US shouldn’t be promoting lunacy.

    I with SOL. She’s cute and sane. I hope she gets off the political merry-go-round, finds a nice guy and starts having babies. The world will be a better place.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @AnotherDad


    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.
     
    Anyone who can speak the words "appalling sexual perversion" in 2020 is all right by me. Has anyone in the media bothered to ask the Tunisians what they think of this young lady? Or her opinions?

    Truman Capote once mocked Diana Trilling for gasping about "the appalling rise in homosexuality" in their day. Now, the Capotes are in charge!

    (And probably equipped with bodycams, too, to get back on topic.)
    , @YetAnotherAnon
    @AnotherDad

    When Iran said the US was "The Great Satan" people thought it was funny. Turns out they were right, at least as far as the US state is concerned.

    , @The Wild Geese Howard
    @AnotherDad


    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.
     
    I've seen this up close and in person at a US embassy, led by a woman that could have been Hillary's sister.

    It really is quite appalling to see our tax dollars at work in this fashion.
  141. @Steve Sailer
    @James Speaks

    When did Chauvin arrive on the scene?

    Replies: @Redman, @Lot, @James Speaks, @Chrisnonymous

    The transcript is a lot more informative than the two videos. The video I didn’t catch hardly any of the conversation with the girlfriend for example.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Lot


    The transcript is a lot more informative than the two videos. The video I didn’t catch hardly any of the conversation with the girlfriend for example.
     
    What did you find informative about the transcript? How did it influence your perceptions and understanding?
  142. Anonymous[186] • Disclaimer says:

    I think we can all agree that drug abuse of substances like fentanyl continue to rise at an alarming rate. The irony is the drug abuse that set the stage for George Floyd is also helping to fuel the resulting riots… among other bizarre happenings…

  143. Anonymous[186] • Disclaimer says:

    Meanwhile, Antifa rioters are finding their demonstrative ways in the suburbs to be semi-problematic, on account of semi-automatics:

  144. @Rob McX
    @SOL

    I hope so too. She also tweeted that Viktor Orbán is "a shining champion of Western civilization".

    Elsewhere she wrote:

    A woman today is expected by society to come to marriage and motherhood in physical and spiritual decline, if ever. This is the life women have been offered by those who would rather us toil away as isolated economic units for faceless corporations, far from the natural pleasures of the domestic, far from the guardianship of a loving husband, and far from the life-giving experience of motherhood.
     

    She has no business in the Washington cesspit.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @AnotherDad

    A woman today is expected by society to come to marriage and motherhood in physical and spiritual decline, if ever. This is the life women have been offered by those who would rather us toil away as isolated economic units for faceless corporations, far from the natural pleasures of the domestic, far from the guardianship of a loving husband, and far from the life-giving experience of motherhood.

    Wow. That’s highly perceptive for a young woman.

    She’s probably a bit old for my son. Some guy will score a sane wife–happy life.

    • Agree: YetAnotherAnon
  145. @Reg Cæsar
    OT, or maybe not, in some James Burke kind of way, Pooja Jhunjhunwala has just announced the Trump Administration's firing of Merritt Corrigan from USAID due to her offending a certain minority's sensibilities:


    White House-USAID liaison fired after series of anti-LGBTQ tweets

    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world, so make sure any complaints you have are lodged with the right one.

    Replies: @Rob McX, @Anonymous, @Hippopotamusdrome

    “Pooja Jhunjhunwala”

    Wat?

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Hippopotamusdrome


    “Pooja Jhunjhunwala”
    Wat?
     
    This broad works for USAID, which represents America abroad. However, as a "spokesperson", she likely spends most of her workday representing abroad to Americans.

    Though not Tunisia, apparently.

    https://www.usaid.gov/news-information/fact-sheets/lgbt-global-development-partnership

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Tunisia#Forced_anal_testing

    Tunisia's sodomy law has the same number as our own federal regulation protecting Silicon Valley:


    ‘Article 230’ and the criminalisation of homosexuality in Tunisia "
    Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act

    Nevertheless, Nomadic Boys lists Tunisia as the gay-friendliest Arab country after Lebanon:

    https://nomadicboys.com/gay-friendly-arab-countries/

    Say, has anyone looked into that Beirut explosion being a result of a lovers' quarrel?


    https://nomadicboys.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Pinterest-5-gay-friendly-Arab-countries-720x1080.jpg

  146. @AnotherDad
    @Clyde


    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video.
     
    For this we melted down the rule of law in America.

    And people think minoritarianism hasn't been a completely end-to-end disaster for our nation, the West?

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.

    • Replies: @Lot
    @Mr. Anon

    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.

    “ How did you go bankrupt?” Bill asked.

    “Two ways,” Mike said. “Gradually and then suddenly.”

    In retrospect, it will all seem so obvious.

    Replies: @Captain Tripps, @Anonymous

    , @Hypnotoad666
    @Mr. Anon


    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.
     
    You forgot the Ukraine Impeachment Hoax, which was only put out of its misery on February 5, 2020. By March 15, 2020 we were deep into the Corona Hysteria Hoax. And on May 24, 2020 it was the BLM-Floyd Systemic Racism Hysteria Hoax.

    I'm afraid the mother of all hoaxes will be the Nov. 3, 2020 mail-in election. Mail-in balloting means that no one will know who won for weeks and the result will ultimately depend on who can control the post offices and postal workers to stuff the most ballots after-the-fact, while deep-sixing the other side's ballots.

    It will be like 1876, but with Twitter. I shudder at the thought.

    Replies: @Rob McX

  147. @AnotherDad
    @Rob McX


    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.
     
    So do I. She's a cutie.

    Here's her offense from RegCaesar's link:

    Let me clear: Gay marriage isn’t marriage / Men aren’t women / US-funded Tunisian LGBT soap operas aren’t America First."
     
    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    Note: Unfortunate some people end up sexual screwed up. Nature ain't perfect. Some people end up blind or deaf or crippled. Diseases come and go. Nasty stuff happens. But the US shouldn't be promoting lunacy.


    I with SOL. She's cute and sane. I hope she gets off the political merry-go-round, finds a nice guy and starts having babies. The world will be a better place.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @YetAnotherAnon, @The Wild Geese Howard

    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    Anyone who can speak the words “appalling sexual perversion” in 2020 is all right by me. Has anyone in the media bothered to ask the Tunisians what they think of this young lady? Or her opinions?

    Truman Capote once mocked Diana Trilling for gasping about “the appalling rise in homosexuality” in their day. Now, the Capotes are in charge!

    (And probably equipped with bodycams, too, to get back on topic.)

    • Agree: bomag
  148. Anon[133] • Disclaimer says:

    OT

    I’ve noticed an inverted Karen syndrome where black people reflexively call #JusticeForSomeBlackPerson press conferences (or Twitter campaigns) at the drop of a hat, rather than use normal channels. This is the black version of the 911 call. In the sense that maybe 911 calls lead to bullets through the head for black people (I don’t believe that), press conferences alleging racism may lead to innocent white people getting in trouble or losing a job.

    Here’s one from the Sacramento Bee:

    https://www.sacbee.com/news/local/health-and-medicine/article244696017.html

    A young black woman (apparently not obese) is six months pregnant and has Covid and abdominal pains. There’s a whole series of allegations, a blood clot, a casesarian while forcibly intubated because she was doing the “resisting arrest” thrashing and cursing dance on the operating table, but she ends up brain dead. The family says she was not properly treated because of racism. Others say she was properly treated for someone with Covid in this new age. To me it seems like it’s somewhere on the nothingburger-to-malpractice spectrum, racism has nothing to do with it, public outrage will accomplish nothing beyond the obligatory black victim Go Fund Me Campaign, and either an internal investigation or a lawsuit is the way to handle it, not press conferences.

    My prediction: There will be a medical Ferguson Effect. To the extent that they can, hospitals and doctors will avoid doing anything to black patients that they think will be more likely to get them in trouble. Any decision between not doing anything and doing something will go with the latter if there is deniability. Second and third opinions will be sought, in writing, delaying treatment and driving up costs. Minus 1.5 sigma MCAT black doctors and surgeons will find themselves suddenly swimming in new referrals from white, Jewish, and Asian doctors unloading their hot potatoes onto these “experts” and “specialists.” You wanted doctors “who look like you”? You got it. The entire waiting room also looks like you.

  149. @Mark Spahn (West Seneca, NY)
    @Abolish_public_education

    "The USG basically carves states out of existing states (i.e. public lands), in violation of Article 4 §3."

    When has this ever happened?

    Article 4 §3 says: "New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress. (The next clause is irrelevant.)

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

    That the USG doesn’t formally declare land within an existing state to be a US territory or a new state (e.g. WV) is just legalistic baloney.

    The fact is that Washington (special interests!) controls the land, not the state it’s nominally a part of.

    That’s unconstitutional.

  150. A mystery, wrapped in an enigma, surrounded by “more guns caused more murders”:

    https://www.vox.com/2020/8/3/21334149/murders-crime-shootings-2020-coronavirus-pandemic

    I guess we will never know…

  151. @Rob McX
    @Reg Cæsar


    There is a surprising number of Pooja Jhunjhunwalas in the world...
     
    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.

    https://i1.wp.com/www.towleroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/corrigan.jpg?w=600&ssl=1

    Replies: @SOL, @Reg Cæsar, @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @AnotherDad, @Kyle

    Her nose is fairly wide.

    • Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome
    @Kyle



    Her nose is fairly wide.

     

    https://www.hostpic.org/images/2008041842240102.jpg
    U WOT M8
    , @Liberty Mike
    @Kyle

    Emphasis on "fairly" as the width of this fair-haired cutie's proboscis is not in the same galaxy as the width of fentanyl Floyd's or that of Georgia's Godzilla of Grievance, stout Stacey.

  152. Anonymous[166] • Disclaimer says:

    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin’s actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots – and huge death toll – on their conscience.

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    @Anonymous

    "no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots – and huge death toll – on their conscience"

    Or indeed the threat of riot and murder outside their home - and maybe inside, too.

    This could be the equivalent of a 'railroaded' jury returning the kind of verdict that 'society' wants - you know, just like the juries in the school history books that hanged innocent black men in the 1930s.

    , @FPD72
    @Anonymous


    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin’s actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots – and huge death toll – on their conscience.
     
    It wouldn’t be the first time an innocent man was convicted in order to prevent civic unrest, and I don’t mean the second trial of the Rodney King arresting cops:

    So the chief priests and the Pharisees called the council together and said, “What are we doing? For this man is performing many miraculous signs. If we allow him to go on in this way, everyone will believe in him, and the Romans will come and take away our sanctuary and our nation.”

    Then one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said, “You know nothing at all! You do not realize that it is more to your advantage to have one man die for the people than for the whole nation to perish.”
    , @lysias
    @Anonymous

    Given the evidence that has come out, doesn't the prosecution now have an ethical obligation to drop the case, or at least to drop the murder charge? Then it would never go to a jury.

    Replies: @anonymous

    , @anon
    @Anonymous

    Like the medieval practice of trying and executing an animal for its “crime” against a human. Intent of the accused is not an issue. The only issue is something happened for which punishment must be meted out. A primitive notion of justice.

    Or perhaps closer to having your heart ripped out to satisfy the blood lust of an Aztec priesthood and the gods they claim to be serving. Nothing personal, pal. Gods gotta be appeased. Nothing personal, Officer Chauvin, hope you understand our position.

    Replies: @Cortes

  153. Anonymous[229] • Disclaimer says:
    @unit472
    I had a car stolen earlier this year. The police called me and said they had recovered it. I had no idea where they were and it was 5:00AM and they offered to come get me. They did but made me ride in the back seat of a police cruiser. I'm not 6' 6" but its a tight squeeze and I commented that there wasn't a lot of leg room. The cop chuckled and said 'going to jail is not meant to be comfortable' but I thought about this when the Floyd situation happened and I said then I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car.

    Don't know what the police can do about it though. They seemed to be as helpful as the situation allowed but the RULES are 'you don't talk your way out of an arrest'. No police force can operate like that. The best they can do is call an ambulance if a suspect seems to needs medical attention. Until the EMT take control of the suspect he has to be restrained not 'let go'. Chauvin wasn't being brutal he just kept Floyd from thrashing around. Unfortunately it will take a brave jury to acquit him of murder even though he is not guilty of that,

    Replies: @jon, @Anonymous

    I said then I think he WAS claustrophobic and had a panic attack from being cuffed and forced into the cramped back seat of a squad car.

    Floyd didn’t have a problem being cooped up in a private vehicle just seconds beforehand. In fact, he refused to get out of one,

    Have you considered the possibility that maybe Floyd just didn’t want to go to the police station and get booked?

    • Agree: ThreeCranes
  154. @Steve Sailer
    @James Speaks

    When did Chauvin arrive on the scene?

    Replies: @Redman, @Lot, @James Speaks, @Chrisnonymous

    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows …

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.

    • Replies: @Coemgen
    @James Speaks


    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows …

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.
     

    Why put so much effort into thinking about something that you only know about because "the media" made great efforts to publicize the event (George Floyd's death)?

    Why not put your efforts into something that you can't escape whether or not "the media" publicizes it?

    For example: the pandemic (AKA sars-cov-2, covid-19, coronavirus, Wuhan Flu, etc.)
    What suspicions can one have about the pandemic?
    1. It's appearance coincided with the failure of the Democrats' impeachment of President Trump.
    2. It kills older persons. Thus potential Trump voters are isolated and/or dying while younger Democrat voters are allowed to protest/riot/socialize.
    3. The Democrats are gleeful that the pandemic is causing economic woes.
    4. The existence of the pandemic was reported on Chinese social media long before it was picked up by "the media." Why wasn't "the media" screaming bloody murder that international borders needed to be closed to limit the pandemic back in January/February 2020? For that matter, why the hell are we paying billions for the CIA who either was unaware of the pandemic or did not report it to the President and Congress.
    5. Your suspicious mind's turn now ...

    Something else to ponder: Why did "the media" show us one side of the George Floyd story then demand a rush to judgement?

    Replies: @James Speaks

    , @Beavertales
    @James Speaks

    "My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are"

    Before the bars shut down because of Covid, Floyd was a club bouncer. These guys are usually paid in cash at the end of the night. That's when the staff count the money and find any fake bills that slipped through.

    That a bouncer would be in possession of a fake bill is not at all improbable. He might have been hanging on to it for a while. When desperate, he may have tried to exchange it for a commodity that could be traded.

    Replies: @John Johnson

  155. Anonymous[229] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mr. Anon
    He seemed paranoid. Do opiates make you paranoid? He had meth in his system too.

    He also said he had just lost his mother. A quick google search reveals that his mother died two years ago. Her name was Larcenia. You couldn't have made this guy's story up.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    He seemed paranoid. Do opiates make you paranoid? He had meth in his system too.

    A lot of people don’t like to be arrested and go to jail. Have you seen the story of the guy who wrestled with police recently at the Wendy’s in Atlanta and was shot by one of the officers?

  156. OT: A science editor named Michael Eisen made fun of roundworms on Twitter. He was accused of microagressing, and one commenter likened his tweet to racism and sexism. One of his critics sent a tweet beginning, “The worm community has the right to be sensitive. . . “

    There ought to be a prize for this kind of thing; sort of an intellectual Darwin Award for the craziest accusation of the year.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8588031/Scientist-angers-Twitter-accused-sexism-racism-saying-roundworms-useless.html

  157. @SimpleSong
    My armchair analysis of the situation:

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user. People who overdose on fentanyl don't get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy, breathing slows, then stops, then they die. They don't have air hunger; in fact the problem with fentanyl is that it takes away air hunger. So someone complaining that they can't breathe is not consistent with a fentanyl overdose--people overdosing on fentanyl don't care if they can't breathe, and that's the problem.

    However the fact that he was complaining that he couldn't breathe early during the arrest suggests that he was having some other medical event at the time of arrest. This could have been any number of things, some of which can be detected on autopsy (heart attack, pulmonary embolism), some of which cannot (arrhythmia, severe bronchospasm.) Furthermore, these may have been caused by some of the other drugs found in his system (PCP I believe was found?), they may have been exacerbated by it, they may have just happened independently. It's pretty much impossible to know for certain.

    If an individual is having some sort of medical event that causes shortness of breath, the restraint techniques used by the police would almost certainly make the situation worse. Generally you want somebody sitting up so that their weight is off the diaphragm and they can breathe as deeply as possible. However they were clearly not choking him as he could speak, so the trachea wasn't obstructed. Regardless, it certainly made the situation worse.

    However from the police's perspective, it's difficult to know whether this guy really is having a cardiopulmonary issue or whether he's just faking to try to get out of being arrested. Even if they had training, they don't really have the equipment to figure this stuff out.

    Replies: @415 reasons, @TGGP, @Alden, @Art Deco, @Bozo the Clown

    Even less weight on the diaphragm if the patient is lying down on his back.

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
    @Alden

    Depends on the individual, but generally when lying flat your abdominal viscera pooch out and put pressure on your diaphragm. Standing up gives you the best lung expansion because the viscera actually pull the diaphragm down. Head down gives you the worst. Face down is usually better than face up for lung expansion. People in pulmonary edema from heart failure often instinctively sit up and hang their legs off the bed to take weight off the lungs and draw fluid away from them.

    However if you have low blood pressure, laying down is good, head down is the best. Which makes me think he may have been having a cardiac issue at the time of arrest.

    Regardless, whatever was going on with this guy, I don't think the way the cops held him was the cause of death. In hindsight we can say that he probably needed some medical attention but I don't know how you expect cops to be doing cop things and doing paramedic things and effortlessly switching from one role to the other--it just isn't humanly possible.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

  158. @travis
    @restless94110

    Floyd certainly had enough opioids in his blood to cause death.
    In one recent study on 249 Fentanyl deaths they found the mean vitreous fentanyl concentrations were 10.8ng/mL The levels found in Floyd's blood was 11 ng/mL https://read.qxmd.com/read/29408723/the-distribution-and-redistribution-of-fentanyl-norfentanyl-in-post-mortem-samples

    The blood levels of found in Floyd's blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died. His death would have been classified another COVID fatality if the police never tried to arrest him. Doubt he would have survive the day, even if an ambulance brought him directly to the hospital when he left the store with his stolen smokes.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    The blood levels of found in Floyd’s blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died.

    Add sickle-cell anemia (people regularly die around George Floyd’s age from it – he had it). Add severe coronary disease; heart disease; high blood pressure. Add his arousal under such conditions. The psychic stress he was under – not only because he he was in serious legal troubles, but also because his image as a man who had found Jesus and becomes orderly and clean was about to disappear like smoke.

    As an aside: It can well be that George Floyd’s death was listed as a COVID-19 fatality.

    Paul Craig Roberts has the Floyd-details

    https://www.unz.com/proberts/should-we-be-protesting-about-george-floyd-or-julian-assange/

    • Replies: @Lot
    @Dieter Kief

    He had sickle cell trait like about 5% of US blacks, not disease. Slightly negative but far leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.

    Replies: @botazefa, @Dieter Kief

    , @Sean
    @Dieter Kief

    The Russians used Fentanyl to end the Moscow Theatre siege. A person with a lethal dose of Fentanyl can't stand up, he is pole-axed, or at least unresponsive. Lane and his partner went up to the car with drawn guns; Floyd had started crying and asked them not to shoot him; he was sworn at, had a gun pointed at him then manhandled out his car and handcuffed. Several minutes after he was sworn at, had a gun pointed at him, been manhandled out his car and handcuffed, he was finally told what it was about: he was being investigated for paying with a counterfeit bill. Rather than making a fast getaway, he had been sitting in a vehicle right outside the store, so it is not like the officers could assume he knew what it was about.

    George Floyd once he was finally told what he was being accused of started being an asshole to avoid getting taken in, so Chauvin in his wisdom decided to punish him and that is why Chauvin was on top of Floyd. Floyd spoke twenty times while on the ground while Chauvin scoffed that “It takes a lot of oxygen to talk” and told Floyd to stop yelling about how he could not breath .

    Here is the key point: Chauvin, as an experienced police officer, knew very well what opioid intoxication looked like. He would have never have done what he did to Floyd if there had been the slightest reason to suspect that Floyd was in on the opioid OD train. In the bodycam Floyd is clearly not a man dangerously affected by whatever Fentanyl he had in his system because he is barely even slurring his words, and certainly wide awake with good muscle tone and balance. He was using every trick in the book while a mission to avoid being taken to jail. Floyd was either yelling and despite being handcuffed no-hands grappling using his size and strength to stay tight and tall and noisy in order to stop the cops from getting him into their vehicle, or Floyd was dying of a Fentanyl overdose. Not both.

  159. This video has been posted to the Reddit hivemind, and obviously ended up on the front page. It has 5.4k comments as I write this.

    Surprisingly, the top comments are along the lines of “well, that changes things”, which clearly endangers the media narrative.

    • Replies: @Matthew Kelly
    @Change that Matters

    One of my favorites there: "Rip the rest of 2020"

  160. @Change that Matters
    This video has been posted to the Reddit hivemind, and obviously ended up on the front page. It has 5.4k comments as I write this.

    Surprisingly, the top comments are along the lines of "well, that changes things", which clearly endangers the media narrative.

    Replies: @Matthew Kelly

    One of my favorites there: “Rip the rest of 2020”

  161. @AnotherDad
    @Rob McX


    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.
     
    So do I. She's a cutie.

    Here's her offense from RegCaesar's link:

    Let me clear: Gay marriage isn’t marriage / Men aren’t women / US-funded Tunisian LGBT soap operas aren’t America First."
     
    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    Note: Unfortunate some people end up sexual screwed up. Nature ain't perfect. Some people end up blind or deaf or crippled. Diseases come and go. Nasty stuff happens. But the US shouldn't be promoting lunacy.


    I with SOL. She's cute and sane. I hope she gets off the political merry-go-round, finds a nice guy and starts having babies. The world will be a better place.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @YetAnotherAnon, @The Wild Geese Howard

    When Iran said the US was “The Great Satan” people thought it was funny. Turns out they were right, at least as far as the US state is concerned.

  162. @Anonymous
    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin's actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots - and huge death toll - on their conscience.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon, @FPD72, @lysias, @anon

    “no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots – and huge death toll – on their conscience”

    Or indeed the threat of riot and murder outside their home – and maybe inside, too.

    This could be the equivalent of a ‘railroaded’ jury returning the kind of verdict that ‘society’ wants – you know, just like the juries in the school history books that hanged innocent black men in the 1930s.

  163. @Mr. Anon
    @AnotherDad

    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.

    Replies: @Lot, @Hypnotoad666

    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.

    “ How did you go bankrupt?” Bill asked.

    “Two ways,” Mike said. “Gradually and then suddenly.”

    In retrospect, it will all seem so obvious.

    • Replies: @Captain Tripps
    @Lot

    So then where are you parking your assets, Mr. Lot? Don't be coy...

    Replies: @Lot

    , @Anonymous
    @Lot


    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.
     
    Lot, I have to think you are mostly being humorously provocative and hyperbolic with this. Are you?

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

  164. @Dieter Kief
    @travis


    The blood levels of found in Floyd’s blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died.
     
    Add sickle-cell anemia (people regularly die around George Floyd's age from it - he had it). Add severe coronary disease; heart disease; high blood pressure. Add his arousal under such conditions. The psychic stress he was under - not only because he he was in serious legal troubles, but also because his image as a man who had found Jesus and becomes orderly and clean was about to disappear like smoke.

    As an aside: It can well be that George Floyd's death was listed as a COVID-19 fatality.

    Paul Craig Roberts has the Floyd-details


    https://www.unz.com/proberts/should-we-be-protesting-about-george-floyd-or-julian-assange/

    Replies: @Lot, @Sean

    He had sickle cell trait like about 5% of US blacks, not disease. Slightly negative but far leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.

    • Thanks: Dieter Kief
    • Replies: @botazefa
    @Lot


    leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.
     
    The autopsy didn't say he had advanced heart disease. It said he had atherosclerosis. That's a very common condition for men in their 40's and older. The autopsy didn't quantify the level of atherosclerosis, nor did it blame his death on heart disease or heart attack.

    Replies: @Lot, @Art Deco

    , @Dieter Kief
    @Lot

    Steve Sailer retweeted this from Spotted Toad

    @toad_spotted
    Incidentally, this is pretty interesting. Any evidence this happens sometimes to living people with sickle cell trait who are COVID positive? Would be a pretty striking explanation for racial disparities  https://web.archive.org/web/20200604001830/https://www.hennepin.us/-/media/hennepinus/residents/public-safety/documents/Autopsy_2020-3700_Floyd.pdf/

    From the Autopsy: 

    "Comments: The finding of sickled-appearing cells in many of theautopsy tissue sections prompted the Hemoglobin S quantitationreported above. This quantitative result is indicative of sicklecell trait. Red blood cells in individuals with sickle cell traitare known to sickle as a postmortem artifact. The decedent’santemortem peripheral blood smear (made from a complete blood countcollected 5/25/20 at 9:00 p.m.) was reviewed by an expert HHChematopathologist at the Medical Examiner’s request. This reviewfound no evidence  of antemortem sickling.The decedent was known to be positive for 2019-nCoV RNA on 4/3/2020.Since PCR positivity for 2019-nCoV RNA can persist for weeks afterthe onset and resolution of clinical disease, the autopsy result mostlikely reflects asymptomatic but persistent PCR positivity fromprevious infection.6/1/2020XAndrew M. Baker, M.D.Chief Medical ExaminerSigned by: Andrew M. Baker MDIn accordance with HCME policy, this report wasreviewed by another board-certified forensicpathologist prior to release."

  165. @Kronos
    @usNthem

    Still one of my favorites...

    https://youtu.be/Q9Co2iH44ug

    Replies: @usNthem, @Mr McKenna, @Steve in Greensboro

    Officer Evan Rosenthal? Well, there’s one cop who won’t be made world-famous when someone dies in his charge.

  166. @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Didn’t you say you were smart, just the other day?

    • LOL: BenKenobi
  167. @gutta percha
    @TGGP

    "The stuff he’s saying wouldn’t get him out of any arrest. "

    And yet in the hundreds of arrest bodycam videos online, you'll see plenty of people bleat and lie and spin BS distractions, thinking they can talk their way out of arrest. It's actually pretty common; seems to happen regardless of race of arrestee. I'm sure that cops get tired of hearing it so often.

    A great example is Rayshard Brooks. He improvised a full half-hour of continuous, pure, dense verbal bullsh!t, before he decided to fight the all-too-patient cops. It's exhausting and maddening to listen to.

    Replies: @Mr McKenna

    A great example is Rayshard Brooks. He improvised a full half-hour of continuous, pure, dense verbal bullsh!t, before he decided to fight the all-too-patient cops. It’s exhausting and maddening to listen to.

    Should have gone into politics. Particularly in the Current Year.

    Oh well. There’s millions more just like him. Only breathing.

  168. @J1234
    Derrick Chauvin is not guilty of murder, IMO, and this video seems to prove it. Even before he was on the ground, George Floyd made a couple of remarks that suggested he might encounter breathing difficulties in the imminent future, suggesting that he'd had such episodes in the past. It seemed he wanted to be on the ground so that he could breathe. He said multiple times he wasn't going to resist...yet resisted pretty consistently throughout the incident. Did the cops take his warnings about breathing with the same grain of salt that they took his promises not to resist? I couldn't blame them if they did.

    He said things like "please don't shoot me" and "I don't want to die," and I believe he was very sincere, but he seemed overwhelmed by his fear and was unable to control his flight/resistance response. Why? This is a guy who'd been arrested by cops dozens of times over the years, and had survived all of those arrests, so why was he so paranoid during this particular arrest? According to him, he'd been shot before and was scared of that happening again. Or was it the drugs? Or did he just think his previous and vast record was going to nail him to the wall this time? Or...maybe it was the widespread mythology that white cops murder black male suspects all the time, a myth that you can see propagated on almost any major media news broadcast, in one way or another.

    Still, George is a sympathetic character in this case. Either the drugs or his paranoia or his inability to comprehend the reality of the situation was likely the cause of death. His airway wasn't crushed, yet his breathing stopped. I believe he died of fright. "Claustrophobia" as he said?

    Replies: @James Speaks, @JerseyJeffersonian, @gutta percha, @Bill P, @duncsbaby

    Half of Mpls is destroyed and their police dept is to be abolished all because of a LIE: that George Floyd was killed by MPD cops. He is most definitely not a sympathetic character. He’s a loser-criminal-thug whose death should not be mourned by anyone who wasn’t a close loved one.

    • Agree: throtler
    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    @duncsbaby

    dunc, to paraphrase a comment from the other day and yet these are the heroes in the new bLM,SJW, left narrative.

  169. Anon[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @gutta percha
    @J1234

    "“Claustrophobia” as he said?" A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car. People under arrest say all kinds of BS, thinking it's going to help them.

    It's now clear that had Floyd not resisted, he would not have gotten the knee on the neck. This is the main message that all people, black and otherwise, should take away from this. If you choose to resist arrest, you will almost certainly fail, and possibly be injured. This risk is easily foreseeable. Resisting lawful arrest is a bad, bad choice. Perhaps black parents should include this lesson in the legendary "Talk" that they supposedly give all their kids.

    Replies: @Anon, @Art Deco, @Anon

    I’m claustrophobic, as is my mother. We both acquired it in adulthood. I think it’s a heritable genetic trait whose heritability increases as you age, like a lot of things. I used to be able to sleep in a mummy sleeping bag while backpacking. Now it would panic me. My mom can’t close the door on airline toilets and had flight attendants stand guard while she goes, although this pretty much caused her never to fly.

    Claustrophobics can panic and hyperventilate and that can create shortness of breath, not enough to kill you I wouldn’t think, but combined with another problem (Floyd had everything from sickle cell to various drugs) it could push you over the edge.

    Any sort of constriction can bring on a panic attack to claustrophobics. Handcuffs behind your back in an open space can do it; in front is less of a problem. A big guy like Floyd handcuffed behind his back in the cramped back seat of an SUV?: I can believe he panicked in that situation. He mentioned claustrophobia three times, and one of the officers said he’d run the air conditioning and open the windows. It sounds like that officer knew something about the condition, because heat aggravates it. MRIs have non-metallic air pressure operated fans to blow on patients who are mildly claustrophobic because being cooled off helps. Getting a stomach camera scan or a colonoscopy can trigger claustrophobia because you cannot freely move.

    I’m not blaming the officers at all, and I don’t think they should be prosecuted or disciplined. However, this is perhaps another case that demonstrates poor training relating to medical matters. Eric Garner died not from the choke hold, but from “positional asphyxia” after he was on the ground. Like Floyd the autopsy showed zero esophageal crushing.

    Obese people especially, lying face down, prone, are unable to breathe when enough pressure is put on their back. The pressure prevents the diaphragm from going up and down, and he can’t inhale and exhale.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/05/opinion/eric-garner-daniel-pantaleo-and-lethal-police-tactics.html

    If the cop had simply rolled Garner over after cuffing him, Garner wouldn’t have died. Floyd’s case is more nuanced, given all the ways he was fucked up, but some awareness of genuine claustrophobia should be conveyed to officers in their training. On the other hand, I’m pretty sure that tactical restraint during interrogations is well-known by police as a way to elicit confessions: I would confess to anything if I were about to panic.

    • Agree: Ben tillman
    • Replies: @FPD72
    @Anon

    According to a University of Minnesota study in 2019, “positional asphyxia” is not a proven cause of death.

    The conclusions of the study are enough to exonerate the officers from a murder charge:

    “Our data do not support the hypothesis of restraint asphyxia.”
    “When a cause of death cannot otherwise be determined, positional asphyxia is often suggested […] Proponents of this theory often hypothesize that subjects restrained prone, with applied downward weight force, hobbled, or in maximal restraint (restrained on their stomach with hands and wrists secured to the handcuffs) were unable to breathe because the position caused chest wall and abdominal restriction that prevented adequate expansion of the lungs. Subsequent rigorous scientific studies, however, using sophisticated measurements have debunked the positional or restraint asphyxia hypothesis because the prone position does not produce respiratory compromise.”
    “To date, none of the published human clinical studies, or epidemiological studies, support the hypothesis that the pronerestraint position causes or contributes to ventilatory compromise”
    “DiMaio and DiMaio observed that acceptance of the concept of positional asphyxia as the cause of death in restraint associated deaths often involves the suspension of common sense and logical thinking. Further, other researchers have commented that positional asphyxia is an interesting theory unsupported by the experimental data. Nor are significant changes in cardiovascular measures found.”

    , @Rob McX
    @Anon

    Part of his breakdown may have been due to claustrophobia, but he was under the influence of drugs anyway.

    At 8.00 pm, two employees from the store went across the street to his car to tell him he'd paid with a fake bill and asked for the return of the cigarettes he'd bought. He refused, and at 8.01 one of the employees reported the matter to the police and told them Floyd was "awfully drunk" and "not in control of himself" (from Wikipedia, sources NYT and WaPo). The police arrived seven minutes later. We now know the drug in question wasn't alcohol, but he clearly shouldn't have been driving.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  170. @James Speaks
    @Steve Sailer

    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows ...

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.

    Replies: @Coemgen, @Beavertales

    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows …

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.

    Why put so much effort into thinking about something that you only know about because “the media” made great efforts to publicize the event (George Floyd’s death)?

    Why not put your efforts into something that you can’t escape whether or not “the media” publicizes it?

    For example: the pandemic (AKA sars-cov-2, covid-19, coronavirus, Wuhan Flu, etc.)
    What suspicions can one have about the pandemic?
    1. It’s appearance coincided with the failure of the Democrats’ impeachment of President Trump.
    2. It kills older persons. Thus potential Trump voters are isolated and/or dying while younger Democrat voters are allowed to protest/riot/socialize.
    3. The Democrats are gleeful that the pandemic is causing economic woes.
    4. The existence of the pandemic was reported on Chinese social media long before it was picked up by “the media.” Why wasn’t “the media” screaming bloody murder that international borders needed to be closed to limit the pandemic back in January/February 2020? For that matter, why the hell are we paying billions for the CIA who either was unaware of the pandemic or did not report it to the President and Congress.
    5. Your suspicious mind’s turn now …

    Something else to ponder: Why did “the media” show us one side of the George Floyd story then demand a rush to judgement?

    • Replies: @James Speaks
    @Coemgen

    Attempt at misdirection and obfuscation.

    Replies: @Coemgen

  171. S says:

    In the Floyd video, almost immediately fellow Blacks attempt to interfere in Floyd’s arrest.

    The 1851 book Negro-Mania observed the same phenomena almost two hundred years ago now. Officers of the law in Northern US cities would attempt arrests of Blacks for criminal acts, and immediately hordes of fellow Blacks in acts of tribal loyalty would appear and attempt to stop the arrests from occurring and ‘rescue’ their fellow Blacks from the consequences of their law breaking. [Am not referencing here the fugitive slaves, myself, but rather the simple law breakers.]

    Nothing much has changed in that regard.

    Negro-Mania (1851) – pg 494

    Not withstanding the paucity of the numbers of the blacks, they have given the greatest trouble to the authorities of the Northern cities. Insignificant in power and resources, they are still insolent and arrogant to a degree which renders them dangerous to the community. The officers of justice scarce venture to arrest them; and it is a task of great and mortal peril to take a fugitive slave, or a fugitive from justice, from among them. It is unnecessary to refer the reader to the columns of our newspapers, which give, almost weekly, accounts of rescues by the blacks.

    https://archive.org/stream/negromaniabeinge00camp/negromaniabeinge00camp_djvu.txt

    • Thanks: Stan d Mute
    • Replies: @Known Fact
    @S

    Imagine PJ O'Rourke or Ann Coulter getting ready to call their new book Negro Mania-- and getting a memo from Legal warning that some guy from 1851 already has the rights

    , @vinteuil
    @S

    In 1868, the publisher G. W. Carleton published a fascinating compilation, by a certain Hinton Rowan Helper, of reports by [w]hite explorers of their early encounters with [B]lacks:

    The Negroes in Negroland

    Familiarity with the contents of this book should be a prerequisite for any "conversation" about race.

    Replies: @vinteuil

    , @Buffalo Joe
    @S

    S, I saw a video, posted IIRC on a California news site, where the interference in an arrest was called..."de-arresting" the suspect. Who makes this shit up?

    Replies: @S

  172. Don’t be so hard on Keith Ellison. He’s got a lot on his plate, like how to convince the good people of Minneapolis to stop reporting rapes to the police.

    https://thefederalist.com/2020/07/21/minn-attorney-general-keith-ellison-says-he-doesnt-want-police-officers-responding-to-rape-calls/

  173. Minneapolis Uprising Syllabus
    https://adambledsoe.wordpress.com/minneapolis-uprising-syllabus/

    I am a scholar, teacher, and thinker of the Black Diaspora… You can find my research at: https://spanalumni.academia.edu/AdamBledsoe

    “Minneapolis Uprising Syllabus” Tells Why That City Sparked National Rebellion
    https://blackagendareport.com/minneapolis-uprising-syllabus-tells-why-city-sparked-national-rebellion

  174. @Dieter Kief
    @travis


    The blood levels of found in Floyd’s blood was slightly above the average found among the Fentanyl deaths in 2018. Hard to see how drugs were not the main cause of his death, especially since he was fighting COVID-19 when he died.
     
    Add sickle-cell anemia (people regularly die around George Floyd's age from it - he had it). Add severe coronary disease; heart disease; high blood pressure. Add his arousal under such conditions. The psychic stress he was under - not only because he he was in serious legal troubles, but also because his image as a man who had found Jesus and becomes orderly and clean was about to disappear like smoke.

    As an aside: It can well be that George Floyd's death was listed as a COVID-19 fatality.

    Paul Craig Roberts has the Floyd-details


    https://www.unz.com/proberts/should-we-be-protesting-about-george-floyd-or-julian-assange/

    Replies: @Lot, @Sean

    The Russians used Fentanyl to end the Moscow Theatre siege. A person with a lethal dose of Fentanyl can’t stand up, he is pole-axed, or at least unresponsive. Lane and his partner went up to the car with drawn guns; Floyd had started crying and asked them not to shoot him; he was sworn at, had a gun pointed at him then manhandled out his car and handcuffed. Several minutes after he was sworn at, had a gun pointed at him, been manhandled out his car and handcuffed, he was finally told what it was about: he was being investigated for paying with a counterfeit bill. Rather than making a fast getaway, he had been sitting in a vehicle right outside the store, so it is not like the officers could assume he knew what it was about.

    George Floyd once he was finally told what he was being accused of started being an asshole to avoid getting taken in, so Chauvin in his wisdom decided to punish him and that is why Chauvin was on top of Floyd. Floyd spoke twenty times while on the ground while Chauvin scoffed that “It takes a lot of oxygen to talk” and told Floyd to stop yelling about how he could not breath .

    Here is the key point: Chauvin, as an experienced police officer, knew very well what opioid intoxication looked like. He would have never have done what he did to Floyd if there had been the slightest reason to suspect that Floyd was in on the opioid OD train. In the bodycam Floyd is clearly not a man dangerously affected by whatever Fentanyl he had in his system because he is barely even slurring his words, and certainly wide awake with good muscle tone and balance. He was using every trick in the book while a mission to avoid being taken to jail. Floyd was either yelling and despite being handcuffed no-hands grappling using his size and strength to stay tight and tall and noisy in order to stop the cops from getting him into their vehicle, or Floyd was dying of a Fentanyl overdose. Not both.

  175. @Anonymous
    @TGGP


    This video is just sad. It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.
     
    Or it’s someone with a criminal history, probation status, or outstanding warrants acting with knowledge that arrest is going to lead to undesired consequences. If he was just “freaking out,” where did he come up with the wits to repeatedly lie to the police to try to get out of the arrest?

    Replies: @TGGP, @Percy Gryce

    I think it’s a combination of all those factors: fear of the consequences of his criminal activity, resulting anxiety, and perhaps a drug-fueled freakout.

  176. @Anonymous
    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin's actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots - and huge death toll - on their conscience.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon, @FPD72, @lysias, @anon

    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin’s actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots – and huge death toll – on their conscience.

    It wouldn’t be the first time an innocent man was convicted in order to prevent civic unrest, and I don’t mean the second trial of the Rodney King arresting cops:

    So the chief priests and the Pharisees called the council together and said, “What are we doing? For this man is performing many miraculous signs. If we allow him to go on in this way, everyone will believe in him, and the Romans will come and take away our sanctuary and our nation.”

    Then one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said, “You know nothing at all! You do not realize that it is more to your advantage to have one man die for the people than for the whole nation to perish.”

  177. @Clyde
    Hot mess. This fenteyl guy was high as a kite and resisting arrest during most of the video

    Replies: @BenKenobi, @Hypnotoad666, @JimDandy, @AnotherDad, @Percy Gryce

    If he had ODed 20 minutes earlier, he would have saved hundreds or thousands of lives and billions of dollars in property damage and misdirected funds.

    • Replies: @lysias
    @Percy Gryce

    The forces behind the riots were just waiting for an incident to happen to serve as their excuse. If it had not been this one, there would soon have been another.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @JMcG
    @Percy Gryce

    Then it would have been the POS at the Wendy’s in Atlanta. Something was going to start it.

  178. @James Speaks
    @J1234

    There something fishy about the Derrick Chauvin/ George Floyd relationship. That’s why Floyd was pleading for his life.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @Nicholas Stix

    “the Derrick Chauvin/ George Floyd relationship.”
    There was no relationship; the “fishy factor” was added by conspiracy theorists.

    • Agree: Gandydancer
  179. @Clifford Brown
    Opiates kill 70,000 plus Americans per year, likely even more during the Corona virus lockdown. The number of unarmed Black men shot and killed by police ranges from 9 to 15 per annum.

    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.

    Replies: @Rapparee, @Kronos, @Anonymousse, @Thoughts

    I agree with this comment.

    But I do think that what’s really bothering Americans is an uneasiness with Diversity/Modern America ====> cops with guns.

    The first part of the video, where the cop points the gun at George Floyd when he’s in the car…yes George was acting strange and could easily have pulled a weapon, and shot at the cop….

    The cop did nothing wrong.

    But….

    I think Americans are getting frightened. Diversity and life and competition…all of this is getting to white Americans.

    This fear of ‘something that cannot be named’ is causing Lib Gentile Americans to lose it. So they lash out.

    Libs can’t control minorities.

    Cops, being public servants, can be controlled.

    It’s missplaced, it’s misguided, but it is rooted in a genuine feeling of unease of living in Modern Diverse America.

    Liberal whites need to learn to articulate their True Feelings for once, instead of taking it out on cops who are the first line enforcers against the negative effects of diversity.

    It would be nice for a white liberal to say ‘I’m scared of being pulled over in traffic, having a bad day off my anti-depression meds as I deal with my divorce, and having a cop point a gun to my head.’

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Thoughts


    Libs can’t control minorities.

    Cops, being public servants, can be controlled.
     

    I think the first part is more unconscious - which makes the second part even more desirable.

    Plus there is this: The video shows somebody while dying to the whole world. This is such a freakingly intimate act - people just aren't prepared to deal with such a raw experience, which is new to almost all of them.

    Then there is this. a sentence by the old writer & muser Johann Wolfgang von Goethe from the appendix of his Maxims and Reflections:

    He who despairs is being forgiven everything.

  180. @usNthem
    As if this will make any difference whatsoever to the current zeitgeist and narrative. Not a freaking chance...

    Replies: @Percy Gryce

    It might make a difference to twelve good men and true.

    • Replies: @usNthem
    @Percy Gryce

    In a sane world - unfortunately, that train left the station ages ago. In the year of covitardation and negro worship, chauvin doesn’t stand a chance. A sub- moronic, drug addled criminal jogger whose body was paraded around several cities and buried in a gold casket. Murals of that ugly mug everywhere and now a holographic tour. No chance the narrative will be changed just because of some inconvenient video and transcripts.

    , @Known Fact
    @Percy Gryce

    I can see a Twelve Angry Men sequel here -- as Henry Fonda struggles to convince 11 sassy black women with hair issues

  181. Look for more citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania.

    Already happening in Illinois between Chicago and Downstate cities. https://www.wglt.org/post/12-injured-mass-shooting-peoria-riverfront#stream/0

  182. @Mr. Anon
    @Alexander Turok

    I'm surprised you emerged from your bio-containment bubble long enough to comment.

    I'm guessing that almost nobody here cares what you have to say. I know for certain that I don't.

    Replies: @Alexander Turok

    My bio-containment bubble has been equipped with internet commenting functionality for months now.

    I’m guessing that almost nobody here cares what you have to say. I know for certain that I don’t.

    I’m guessing that our host privately agrees with my comment.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
    @Alexander Turok

    And yet nobody else replied to your comment, so I'm guessing I'm mostly right.

  183. @Anonymous
    NO CONVICTIONS IN THIS CASE POSSIBLE FROM THE GETGO. They overcharged murder 2 deliberately to cause more rioting when it's all thrown out. The Tape tells the tale...

    Floyd refused to open the car window/door when the cop first knocked.

    Floyd showed obvious signs of intoxication.

    Floyd claimed he couldn't breathe while standing.

    Floyd WANTED to get on the ground. The officers wanted him in the cop car.

    Floyd claimed he couldn't get into the police car without claustrophobia but sat in his own car with no problem.

    Floyd claimed to have Covid19.

    Video/audio shows the officer's knee on the neck was not causing Floyd's airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique. It took Floyd 7 minutes plus to pass out from the drugs. Lack of oxygen would've knocked him out much quicker.

    Also Floyd's two companions complied with officers instructions and had no problems.

    So after a few minutes into the arrest the cops knew...

    1 Floyd was uncooperative verbally/physically.
    2 Floyd was intoxicated guilty of DUI.
    3 Floyd was not truthful in his responses.

    CONCLUSION: The cops treated George Floyd appropriately and did so also re Floyd's companions.

    Replies: @James N. Kennett

    Video/audio shows the officer’s knee on the neck was not causing Floyd’s airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique.

    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness. If the pressure is sustained after the person has lost consciousness, it is likely to kill him.

    Of course, I do not know whether Floyd died for this reason, or from something else – drugs, panic attack, or whatever. However, I would have expected the officers to wait until Floyd passed out, and then pick him up and put him in the car. Prosecutors will want to know why this did not happen.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @James N. Kennett

    That would be a very dangerous argument for a trial defence attorney to make considering how long it follows the duration of choke applied had been. Chauvin was hands-free sort of squatting beside/ half kneeling on Floyd for almost 10 minutes total, and minutes after he stopped moving and talking. If Chauvin were to admit he had been deliberately applying a choke during that time, he would be incarcerated until the middle of the century.


    ... knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness.
     
    Might work if you mashed his neck into the pavement hard enough to cut off the other carotid artery (there is one each side of neck) although there would be a huge risk of damage to the cervical spine. If you were really trying to choke out someone lying like Floyd was, that would a very heterodox way to do it. Moreover, being choked into unconsciousness is not equivalent to being given a very strong sedative, in medical circles it has long been recognized to be much more a brain trauma equivalent to a boxing KO.
    , @Anonymous
    @James N. Kennett


    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness.
     
    Nope. The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is to help restrain the suspect, but not by inducing unconsciousness.
    , @Art Deco
    @James N. Kennett

    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness.

    The carotid arteries are on the front of your neck, not the side or the back.

  184. @Percy Gryce
    @usNthem

    It might make a difference to twelve good men and true.

    Replies: @usNthem, @Known Fact

    In a sane world – unfortunately, that train left the station ages ago. In the year of covitardation and negro worship, chauvin doesn’t stand a chance. A sub- moronic, drug addled criminal jogger whose body was paraded around several cities and buried in a gold casket. Murals of that ugly mug everywhere and now a holographic tour. No chance the narrative will be changed just because of some inconvenient video and transcripts.

  185. @Alexander Turok
    Ctrl-f for "corona...."

    On Feb. 10, I wrote the following:

    Economists have long been puzzled at the lack of working-from-home in contexts where it’s easily possible. It makes office politics harder, but that should be a feature, not a bug. It makes it harder to surveil workers, but many companies make a point not to do that anyway even when it’s not hard to do via remote desktop spying.

    If the fears about China lying and asymtomatic carriers are correct and it happens that people end up trapped inside for the ~1.5 years it takes to develop a vaccine, a silver lining might be the normalization of working from home. The gains would be quite significant, especially in counties like the USA with a lot of urban areas favored by corporations that have horrible politics around zoning and crime.
     
    https://alexanderturok.wordpress.com/2020/02/10/will-corona-lead-to-more-working-from-home-long-term/

    I didn't get everything right. I naively assumed we could do better than China, I thought if China was telling the truth that they had the situation under control, we could get it under control too, but I severely overestimated the capacity of my fellow Americans to be reasonable. I didn't see how many would be willing to whore themselves out. And for what? What's the dollar value here? It's like the old joke, man offers a woman a million dollars to sleep with him, she accepts, he then offers her 100$, she says she's not a whore, and he says, well, you've already crossed that line, now we're just haggling over the price. I don't know how much it would take to get me to sell out my countrymen, to look the other way at the rivers of blood, because I haven't received that offer. So maybe I'm being too harsh.

    Nor did I foresee that corona would indirectly trigger the crime wave. I knew that there was this Bereau of Land Management stuff bouncing around in these blue urban areas, but I didn't see the whoring out and the discrediting of the right, which paved the way for the BLM's ascendency. It does provide a convenient way out for those who were at those truck stops, no longer possess their virginity and want to ignore corona, to point to it and say, ah, this is why there's this flight away from the cities. And it'll be true, but it won't be the whole truth.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon, @Hippopotamusdrome

    Relax. It’s just the flu, bro.

  186. @AnotherDad
    @Rob McX


    A hell of a lot. I prefer Merritt Corrigan.
     
    So do I. She's a cutie.

    Here's her offense from RegCaesar's link:

    Let me clear: Gay marriage isn’t marriage / Men aren’t women / US-funded Tunisian LGBT soap operas aren’t America First."
     
    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    Note: Unfortunate some people end up sexual screwed up. Nature ain't perfect. Some people end up blind or deaf or crippled. Diseases come and go. Nasty stuff happens. But the US shouldn't be promoting lunacy.


    I with SOL. She's cute and sane. I hope she gets off the political merry-go-round, finds a nice guy and starts having babies. The world will be a better place.

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar, @YetAnotherAnon, @The Wild Geese Howard

    A few true statements. It really is foul that the US having gone off the deep end, uses the tax money of normies to promote deviancy abroad.

    I’ve seen this up close and in person at a US embassy, led by a woman that could have been Hillary’s sister.

    It really is quite appalling to see our tax dollars at work in this fashion.

  187. anon[279] • Disclaimer says:
    @Kronos
    Well, so much for the heroic pose of St. George Floyd. He’ll lose a lot of respect from the black gangstas from this video alone. (Rule number one: never cry in front of the po-po. Rule number 2: never beg from the po-po.)

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive. I’m sure they’ve dealt with situations like that before. Floyd was flopping like a fish in the back of that police car and I think head-butted the police officer that had this body cam at [8:02].

    Replies: @Rapparee, @BenKenobi, @anon, @Buffalo Joe

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive.

    That’s why this story was always so stupid. Originally, it was about an evil cop who just decided to kill this poor black man for no reason. And yet, he didn’t shoot him or punch him or hit him with his nightstick or tase him or anything. He just kneeled on him.

    Have you ever heard of another case where someone who was determined to kill someone else did it by just kneeling on him, but did nothing else to him? I haven’t.

    So it was always completely idiotic. But then, look at the kind of people who believed it.

  188. @Kronos
    @usNthem

    Still one of my favorites...

    https://youtu.be/Q9Co2iH44ug

    Replies: @usNthem, @Mr McKenna, @Steve in Greensboro

    The circus is in town?

  189. @Kyle
    @Rob McX

    Her nose is fairly wide.

    Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome, @Liberty Mike

    Her nose is fairly wide.


    U WOT M8

  190. @Anon4784
    A little off-topic, but here's a recent story of crime and punishment.

    The crime:

    http://www.terpconnect.umd.edu/~pnc/temp/Mead2020_Article_PovertyAndCulture.pdf

    The outcry:

    https://retractionwatch.com/2020/07/27/hundreds-petition-to-retract-paper-they-call-unscholarly-overtly-racist-and-full-of-racially-violent-narratives/

    And the punishment:

    https://retractionwatch.com/2020/07/31/springer-nature-retracts-paper-that-hundreds-called-overtly-racist/

    Replies: @The Alarmist

    I’d re-write Dostoevsky’s Crime and Punishment with an African-American lead character, but I don’t know how much of a market there is for a one chapter book where he kills the old lady, and doesn’t think anything about it until confronted, when he simply says, “Bitch had it coming.”

    • LOL: Cortes
    • Replies: @Dumbo
    @The Alarmist

    - Mr. Ras'kol'nigg'ov, why did you kill the old lady?
    - I dindu nuffin". Also, the old bitch was racyss.

    Acquitted by the all-black jury because of lack of evidence.
    Old white victim's relatives accused or racism and hate speech, ten years in jail.

    * THE END *

  191. @Lot
    @Dieter Kief

    He had sickle cell trait like about 5% of US blacks, not disease. Slightly negative but far leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.

    Replies: @botazefa, @Dieter Kief

    leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.

    The autopsy didn’t say he had advanced heart disease. It said he had atherosclerosis. That’s a very common condition for men in their 40’s and older. The autopsy didn’t quantify the level of atherosclerosis, nor did it blame his death on heart disease or heart attack.

    • Replies: @Lot
    @botazefa

    “ The autopsy didn’t quantify the level of atherosclerosis”

    It did.

    , @Art Deco
    @botazefa

    It actually said he had 'severe' 'coronary artery disease'. No, that's not the norm for men of 46.

    BTW, his father died at the age of 53. Good health doesn't run in the family.

    Replies: @Lurker

  192. @Thoughts
    @Clifford Brown

    I agree with this comment.

    But I do think that what's really bothering Americans is an uneasiness with Diversity/Modern America ====> cops with guns.

    The first part of the video, where the cop points the gun at George Floyd when he's in the car...yes George was acting strange and could easily have pulled a weapon, and shot at the cop....

    The cop did nothing wrong.

    But....

    I think Americans are getting frightened. Diversity and life and competition...all of this is getting to white Americans.

    This fear of 'something that cannot be named' is causing Lib Gentile Americans to lose it. So they lash out.

    Libs can't control minorities.

    Cops, being public servants, can be controlled.

    It's missplaced, it's misguided, but it is rooted in a genuine feeling of unease of living in Modern Diverse America.

    Liberal whites need to learn to articulate their True Feelings for once, instead of taking it out on cops who are the first line enforcers against the negative effects of diversity.

    It would be nice for a white liberal to say 'I'm scared of being pulled over in traffic, having a bad day off my anti-depression meds as I deal with my divorce, and having a cop point a gun to my head.'

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    Libs can’t control minorities.

    Cops, being public servants, can be controlled.

    I think the first part is more unconscious – which makes the second part even more desirable.

    Plus there is this: The video shows somebody while dying to the whole world. This is such a freakingly intimate act – people just aren’t prepared to deal with such a raw experience, which is new to almost all of them.

    Then there is this. a sentence by the old writer & muser Johann Wolfgang von Goethe from the appendix of his Maxims and Reflections:

    He who despairs is being forgiven everything.

  193. @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    You clearly live in the burbs.

    Black men will not have a penny in their pocket but will still drive around in a BMW or classic car and have brand new $200 shoes. Having an addiction doesn’t change this.

    It’s just something you aren’t supposed to talk about in liberal company. You can be ex-communicated for pointing out the irony of 30k cars in a low income apartment complex.

    • Replies: @Lurker
    @John Johnson

    Wasn't a Rolls-Royce seen being used in a recent looting video?


    It’s just something you aren’t supposed to talk about in liberal company. You can be ex-communicated for pointing out the irony of 30k cars in a low income apartment complex.
     
    There's a saying about not trusting someone who's car is worth more than their house. Somewhat blunted by inflated property values.
  194. @Anonymous
    Very sad but at least three times in that video (@7:54, 8:25, 8:36) he says "I can't breath" - all of them not being on a ground and having a knee to his neck.

    It's then inconceivable that the cop will be convicted of murder. An acquittal is most likely because the cops just acted by the book. Which means more rioting. Oh, great. Just what we need most right now.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    If Minnesota’s smart, they’ll hold the Chauvin trial in mid January to discourage the dindus from taking to the street.

  195. @Ray Cissman
    @restless94110

    "Lethal dose" is different for everyone and is likely higher for a junky like George kirby. Mind you, I don't think the knee hold alone killed him, and I'm not sure what else the cops could have done in that situation

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Joe, Averaged, @Lot, @TWS

    Knee had nothing to do with it.

  196. @Anon
    @gutta percha

    I'm claustrophobic, as is my mother. We both acquired it in adulthood. I think it's a heritable genetic trait whose heritability increases as you age, like a lot of things. I used to be able to sleep in a mummy sleeping bag while backpacking. Now it would panic me. My mom can't close the door on airline toilets and had flight attendants stand guard while she goes, although this pretty much caused her never to fly.

    Claustrophobics can panic and hyperventilate and that can create shortness of breath, not enough to kill you I wouldn't think, but combined with another problem (Floyd had everything from sickle cell to various drugs) it could push you over the edge.

    Any sort of constriction can bring on a panic attack to claustrophobics. Handcuffs behind your back in an open space can do it; in front is less of a problem. A big guy like Floyd handcuffed behind his back in the cramped back seat of an SUV?: I can believe he panicked in that situation. He mentioned claustrophobia three times, and one of the officers said he'd run the air conditioning and open the windows. It sounds like that officer knew something about the condition, because heat aggravates it. MRIs have non-metallic air pressure operated fans to blow on patients who are mildly claustrophobic because being cooled off helps. Getting a stomach camera scan or a colonoscopy can trigger claustrophobia because you cannot freely move.

    I'm not blaming the officers at all, and I don't think they should be prosecuted or disciplined. However, this is perhaps another case that demonstrates poor training relating to medical matters. Eric Garner died not from the choke hold, but from "positional asphyxia" after he was on the ground. Like Floyd the autopsy showed zero esophageal crushing.


    Obese people especially, lying face down, prone, are unable to breathe when enough pressure is put on their back. The pressure prevents the diaphragm from going up and down, and he can’t inhale and exhale.
     
    https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/05/opinion/eric-garner-daniel-pantaleo-and-lethal-police-tactics.html

    If the cop had simply rolled Garner over after cuffing him, Garner wouldn't have died. Floyd's case is more nuanced, given all the ways he was fucked up, but some awareness of genuine claustrophobia should be conveyed to officers in their training. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that tactical restraint during interrogations is well-known by police as a way to elicit confessions: I would confess to anything if I were about to panic.

    Replies: @FPD72, @Rob McX

    According to a University of Minnesota study in 2019, “positional asphyxia” is not a proven cause of death.

    The conclusions of the study are enough to exonerate the officers from a murder charge:

    “Our data do not support the hypothesis of restraint asphyxia.”
    “When a cause of death cannot otherwise be determined, positional asphyxia is often suggested […] Proponents of this theory often hypothesize that subjects restrained prone, with applied downward weight force, hobbled, or in maximal restraint (restrained on their stomach with hands and wrists secured to the handcuffs) were unable to breathe because the position caused chest wall and abdominal restriction that prevented adequate expansion of the lungs. Subsequent rigorous scientific studies, however, using sophisticated measurements have debunked the positional or restraint asphyxia hypothesis because the prone position does not produce respiratory compromise.”
    “To date, none of the published human clinical studies, or epidemiological studies, support the hypothesis that the pronerestraint position causes or contributes to ventilatory compromise”
    “DiMaio and DiMaio observed that acceptance of the concept of positional asphyxia as the cause of death in restraint associated deaths often involves the suspension of common sense and logical thinking. Further, other researchers have commented that positional asphyxia is an interesting theory unsupported by the experimental data. Nor are significant changes in cardiovascular measures found.”

    • Thanks: Dieter Kief
  197. @Kyle
    @Rob McX

    Her nose is fairly wide.

    Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome, @Liberty Mike

    Emphasis on “fairly” as the width of this fair-haired cutie’s proboscis is not in the same galaxy as the width of fentanyl Floyd’s or that of Georgia’s Godzilla of Grievance, stout Stacey.

  198. @usNthem
    @William D. Wall

    I’ve seen a number of - probably too many - videos where the cops are way too patient and restrained when mouth breathing joggers are basically going bonkers, especially verbally. To see them continually and calmly repeat the same instructions over and over again while a chimpout is in progress in maddening to watch.

    Replies: @Kronos, @Johnny Smoggins

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Johnny Smoggins

    But cops have guns, so you should give them courtesy.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    , @John Johnson
    @Johnny Smoggins

    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Why would they do that? White men are naturally civil towards the police and it drives the left crazy since it makes these types of videos all the harder to deal with. For most White men it would take additional effort to be uncivil towards the police.

    If White men acted like this all the time then the left would be relieved as they could show common equivalency.

    There is really nothing that drives the left mad like White men being themselves and not apologizing for it. It makes a mockery of the left's constant demand for multi-million dollar programs to fight crime when there are actually remote White rural areas that actually don't have law enforcement because it isn't needed.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    , @Kronos
    @Johnny Smoggins


    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.
     
    Whites understand there is a time and place “for keeping it real” and police interactions aren’t one of them.

    https://youtu.be/WuxEhiVFtZM
    , @Hypnotoad666
    @Johnny Smoggins


    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.
     
    If a person in authority has discretion to make your life very difficult, should you: (a) Insult and annoy them, and give them every excuse and motive to f*ck you up even at the cost of having to do a bunch of paperwork?; or (b) Be polite and cooperative so that they have the maximum incentive to make their own lives easier by letting you go with a minor citation or a warning?

    Interacting with the police is basically an IQ test. And the racial differences in the scores are exactly what one would predict.

    Replies: @John Johnson, @black sea

    , @Anonymous
    @Johnny Smoggins



    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.
     
    It is worth recalling that you were watching a television programme, and that TV programmes with the most exciting and, er, stimulating footage tend to attract larger audiences and perform better in the TV ratings. No small consideration in countries where television programming is paid for largely with advertising dollars.

    Commercial aspects aside, there is also the phenomenon known as, "nothing left to lose."

    If you have been arrested 10 times before, I do not expect you would have much to lose by arguing with the police when you are being arrested for the 11th time, would you?

    However, I do not see how being argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful is going to help your case if you are being arrested for the first or second time. Quite the contrary, I should think.

    It might be more instructive if we knew how the subsequent sentencing of these uncooperative individuals went, first, before we start their following dubious example. It may be the case that your giving the police a hard time results in you being given a much longer time in clink.
  199. @jon
    @restless94110

    From what I have been able to find, Floyd had a dose that was within the lethal range, but was on the lower end. So if he was a regular user, it might not have been enough to kill. But, of course, they also found meth, and he had heart disease and tested positive for Covid-19, so there were plenty of complications to make an OD plausible. And in the video he is clearly in the middle of a panic attack and claiming he can't breathe before they ever put him on the ground and put any pressure on him.
    He also had a high fentanyl to norfentanyl ratio. Fentanyl is rapidly metabolized to norfentanyl, so a high ratio suggests a recent dose.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    From what I have been able to find, Floyd had a dose that was within the lethal range, but was on the lower end.

    Nope. Femoral blood levels were middle range for the population of overdose deaths. (Whatever dose he took was sufficient to induce that in his very large body).

  200. @Percy Gryce
    @Clyde

    If he had ODed 20 minutes earlier, he would have saved hundreds or thousands of lives and billions of dollars in property damage and misdirected funds.

    Replies: @lysias, @JMcG

    The forces behind the riots were just waiting for an incident to happen to serve as their excuse. If it had not been this one, there would soon have been another.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @lysias

    That's true. It would have been the dead jogger instead.

  201. @gutta percha
    @J1234

    "“Claustrophobia” as he said?" A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car. People under arrest say all kinds of BS, thinking it's going to help them.

    It's now clear that had Floyd not resisted, he would not have gotten the knee on the neck. This is the main message that all people, black and otherwise, should take away from this. If you choose to resist arrest, you will almost certainly fail, and possibly be injured. This risk is easily foreseeable. Resisting lawful arrest is a bad, bad choice. Perhaps black parents should include this lesson in the legendary "Talk" that they supposedly give all their kids.

    Replies: @Anon, @Art Deco, @Anon

    The ultimate complaint is that a deplorable (Chauvin et al) has authority over persons of higher status. Black chauvinists think they are the persons of higher status. Gentry liberals think that, as morally excellent people, they assign status and their black clientele have higher status than the deplorables who make up the police force.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard
    @Art Deco


    Black chauvinists think they are the persons of higher status. Gentry liberals think that, as morally excellent people, they assign status and their black clientele have higher status than the deplorables who make up the police force.
     
    The limousine liberals are trying to cast blacks as a sort of racial samurai in their prog utopia, and the blacks seem more than happy to inhabit that role.
  202. @Johnny Smoggins
    @usNthem

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It's refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn't mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn't mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @John Johnson, @Kronos, @Hypnotoad666, @Anonymous

    But cops have guns, so you should give them courtesy.

    • Replies: @Johnny Smoggins
    @Steve Sailer

    Respect the gun, not the man.

  203. @SimpleSong
    My armchair analysis of the situation:

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user. People who overdose on fentanyl don't get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy, breathing slows, then stops, then they die. They don't have air hunger; in fact the problem with fentanyl is that it takes away air hunger. So someone complaining that they can't breathe is not consistent with a fentanyl overdose--people overdosing on fentanyl don't care if they can't breathe, and that's the problem.

    However the fact that he was complaining that he couldn't breathe early during the arrest suggests that he was having some other medical event at the time of arrest. This could have been any number of things, some of which can be detected on autopsy (heart attack, pulmonary embolism), some of which cannot (arrhythmia, severe bronchospasm.) Furthermore, these may have been caused by some of the other drugs found in his system (PCP I believe was found?), they may have been exacerbated by it, they may have just happened independently. It's pretty much impossible to know for certain.

    If an individual is having some sort of medical event that causes shortness of breath, the restraint techniques used by the police would almost certainly make the situation worse. Generally you want somebody sitting up so that their weight is off the diaphragm and they can breathe as deeply as possible. However they were clearly not choking him as he could speak, so the trachea wasn't obstructed. Regardless, it certainly made the situation worse.

    However from the police's perspective, it's difficult to know whether this guy really is having a cardiopulmonary issue or whether he's just faking to try to get out of being arrested. Even if they had training, they don't really have the equipment to figure this stuff out.

    Replies: @415 reasons, @TGGP, @Alden, @Art Deco, @Bozo the Clown

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user.

    You’re confounding the dose with the blood level.

    • Replies: @SimpleSong
    @Art Deco

    A distinction without a difference. I guess I could change this to 'a serum level that would correspond to a lethal dose in mcg per unit body weight, given the volume of distribution of fentanyl, Mr. Floyd's age and sex, and the typical rate of metabolism of fentanyl' but this isn't pharm 101.

    In any case it's neither the dose nor the serum level that is lethal, but the physiologic effects, which are imperfectly correlated with the serum level, which in turn are imperfectly correlated with the dose.

    However dose is very easy to measure quantitatively, serum level more difficult, end-organ effects very very difficult (difficult to measure quantitatively, although qualitatively not so hard), so usually people discuss 'lethal doses' and 'effective doses' when in reality those are just crude population measures. In this particular case my point is that we don't know the dose of fentanyl, the serum levels suggest a high dose was given, but based on the video evidence it doesn't appear that the physiologic effects associated with fentanyl overdose were present, so there's not much point in trying to argue that he took 500 mcg of fentanyl versus 50--whatever he took he could handle it, he clearly wasn't acting like a fentanyl OD.

    Replies: @Art Deco

  204. @Anonymous
    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin's actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots - and huge death toll - on their conscience.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon, @FPD72, @lysias, @anon

    Given the evidence that has come out, doesn’t the prosecution now have an ethical obligation to drop the case, or at least to drop the murder charge? Then it would never go to a jury.

    • Replies: @anonymous
    @lysias

    With respect, ethical shmethical. I have been an attorney for many years. The shenanigans that Woke district attorneys are openly indulging in now would have brought condemnation on them from the members of the bar, and the local media.
    Not any more.

  205. @Johnny Smoggins
    @usNthem

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It's refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn't mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn't mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @John Johnson, @Kronos, @Hypnotoad666, @Anonymous

    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Why would they do that? White men are naturally civil towards the police and it drives the left crazy since it makes these types of videos all the harder to deal with. For most White men it would take additional effort to be uncivil towards the police.

    If White men acted like this all the time then the left would be relieved as they could show common equivalency.

    There is really nothing that drives the left mad like White men being themselves and not apologizing for it. It makes a mockery of the left’s constant demand for multi-million dollar programs to fight crime when there are actually remote White rural areas that actually don’t have law enforcement because it isn’t needed.

    • Replies: @Johnny Smoggins
    @John Johnson

    I didn't mean that Whites should go out and commit crime. Nor did I mean that Whites should become rude or aggressive with the police, which is never a good idea.

    Do what leftists and activists do and make their job as difficult as possible. Beyond showing them ID, you owe a cop nothing. Throughout the interaction keep asking "Am I under arrest?" "Am I being detained?" "Am I free to go now?" Keep silent beyond that and demand a lawyer immediately.

    Way too many Whites think it's Leave it to Beaver and the friendly neighborhood cop is just doing his job. That ship sailed decades ago and now cops are just the teacher's union, only with guns.

    Never, ever trust a cop.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE&t=14s

    Replies: @John Johnson

  206. anon[234] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous
    Of course, no matter the rights or wrongs of Chauvin's actions, no jury will acquit him.

    Quite simply, no juror will want the responsibility of the inevitable massive scale riots - and huge death toll - on their conscience.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon, @FPD72, @lysias, @anon

    Like the medieval practice of trying and executing an animal for its “crime” against a human. Intent of the accused is not an issue. The only issue is something happened for which punishment must be meted out. A primitive notion of justice.

    Or perhaps closer to having your heart ripped out to satisfy the blood lust of an Aztec priesthood and the gods they claim to be serving. Nothing personal, pal. Gods gotta be appeased. Nothing personal, Officer Chauvin, hope you understand our position.

    • Replies: @Cortes
    @anon

    The quirky “Criminal Prosecution and Capital Punishment of Animals” by E.P. Evans has the example of an ass in Colonial America which benefited from a character witness to escape execution in a bestiality case.

    Is modern US justice less enlightened?

  207. anon[345] • Disclaimer says:

    Only Black Lives Matter caravan attempts to reach Seattle PD chief’s house in the countryside, engages in intimidation of all the neighbors. Are we having fun, yet?

    https://lynnwoodtimes.com/2020/08/02/hundreds-of-blm-supporters-storm-snohomish-county-neighborhood-to-protest-at-seattle-police-chief-carmen-bests-home/

    A crowd of about 200 persons, mostly white men and women in their twenties, were dressed in black with masks and black hoods and carried signs that read “Black Lives Matter.” Black Lives Matter protestors shouted profanity and insults at neighbors, took license plate information on vehicles, took pictures of homes, and asked little kids who lived in the neighborhood what schools they attended.

    Other BLM protesters carrying large duffle bags attempted to make their way to Chief Best’s private residence. When confronted by neighbors to show the content of the large duffle bags, protesters refused to cooperate. There were no reports of any physical altercations.

    A community resident and witness to the protest shared some of the tactics used by BLM protestors.

    “They were very organized. They had radios, talking to each other. They had numbers they used to decal all their cars for who knows what. So, they were identifying all their vehicles individually by number. They came with a mission…They were out here intimidating us.”

    iSteve asked how a potential President Biden would turn this machine off. Why would Biden or his handlers do that? It’s obviously a useful tool for keeping people in line. A lot like the Ku Klux Klan, in fact.

    • Replies: @Coemgen
    @anon


    iSteve asked how a potential President Biden would turn this machine off. Why would Biden or his handlers do that? It’s obviously a useful tool for keeping people in line. A lot like the Ku Klux Klan, in fact.

     

    "Occupy Wall Street" pretty much fizzled out after Obama was re-elected in 2012:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Occupy_Wall_Street

    BLM looks an awful lot like OWS. I suspect BLM is OWS re-activated after being on standby status during Obama's second term.
  208. @James Braxton
    @Steve Richter

    Gag order.

    Replies: @Steve Richter

    how is a gag order on a defendant constitutional? Public opinion is the reason Chauvin is in jail and on trial. The fact that the trial is not held immediately kind of proves that public opinion will sway the jury. The defendant has to be allowed to make his case to the public since it is the public’s threat of violence that will compel the jury to convict him.

  209. @Percy Gryce
    @usNthem

    It might make a difference to twelve good men and true.

    Replies: @usNthem, @Known Fact

    I can see a Twelve Angry Men sequel here — as Henry Fonda struggles to convince 11 sassy black women with hair issues

  210. Look for more citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania.

    This has been going on for years and without Raj Chetty.

    It’s done through the social workers.

    The liberal states try to push their baby mommas into rural states on the promise that there are more benefits due to less demand. The social workers handle the details of the move.

    So they end up packing low-income government housing that is really intended as temporary shelter for rural Whites. The mass stabbing that happened in Boise is connected to this type of welfare exporting.

    • Replies: @Abolish_public_education
    @John Johnson

    I’m a bit surprised by your assertion. I’ll search for source.

    A few years ago California made a fuss (in US court?) because it had discovered that Nevada was giving its bums one-way bus tickets to SF.

    As I recall, NV pledged to cease the practice and even paid damages.

  211. @S
    In the Floyd video, almost immediately fellow Blacks attempt to interfere in Floyd's arrest.

    The 1851 book Negro-Mania observed the same phenomena almost two hundred years ago now. Officers of the law in Northern US cities would attempt arrests of Blacks for criminal acts, and immediately hordes of fellow Blacks in acts of tribal loyalty would appear and attempt to stop the arrests from occurring and 'rescue' their fellow Blacks from the consequences of their law breaking. [Am not referencing here the fugitive slaves, myself, but rather the simple law breakers.]

    Nothing much has changed in that regard.


    Negro-Mania (1851) - pg 494

    Not withstanding the paucity of the numbers of the blacks, they have given the greatest trouble to the authorities of the Northern cities. Insignificant in power and resources, they are still insolent and arrogant to a degree which renders them dangerous to the community. The officers of justice scarce venture to arrest them; and it is a task of great and mortal peril to take a fugitive slave, or a fugitive from justice, from among them. It is unnecessary to refer the reader to the columns of our newspapers, which give, almost weekly, accounts of rescues by the blacks.
     

    https://archive.org/stream/negromaniabeinge00camp/negromaniabeinge00camp_djvu.txt

    Replies: @Known Fact, @vinteuil, @Buffalo Joe

    Imagine PJ O’Rourke or Ann Coulter getting ready to call their new book Negro Mania— and getting a memo from Legal warning that some guy from 1851 already has the rights

    • LOL: S
  212. @Abolish_public_education
    @Kronos

    In recent years, there have been alarming reports of the public education policy of keeping really bad apples in school (you know, as funding tokens) rather than referring them to the juvenile justice system (where they belong). The most notorious token being Nikolas Cruz (the alleged Parkland School shooter).

    See Washington Times.

    Replies: @Kronos, @stillCARealist

    I have to relate this anecdote from a local school since you’re my new favorite commenter.

    Mind you, this isn’t about a shooting. It’s about Kindergarten.

    A friend, who is now homeschooling his kids, had his daughter in a local “good” school for Kindergarten. Among the kids were a handful of absolute monsters who wouldn’t or couldn’t cooperate with basic instructions. He said a couple of them would curse at the teacher (he volunteered occasionally). The teacher spent all her time and energy trying to control the beasts and had almost nothing left for the compliant majority of students. None of the kids learned a thing. When the virus hit and the schools closed in March, he started teaching his daughter at home. She learned more in 6 weeks with him than in the previous 6 months.

    I confess: I don’t want the PS’s to open up again.

  213. @Art Deco
    @gutta percha

    The ultimate complaint is that a deplorable (Chauvin et al) has authority over persons of higher status. Black chauvinists think they are the persons of higher status. Gentry liberals think that, as morally excellent people, they assign status and their black clientele have higher status than the deplorables who make up the police force.

    Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    Black chauvinists think they are the persons of higher status. Gentry liberals think that, as morally excellent people, they assign status and their black clientele have higher status than the deplorables who make up the police force.

    The limousine liberals are trying to cast blacks as a sort of racial samurai in their prog utopia, and the blacks seem more than happy to inhabit that role.

  214. @Steve Sailer
    @Anon7

    They did call an ambulance but, apparently, it got dispatched with a lower priority than the cops requested and got lost on the way.

    Replies: @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @Anon7, @stillCARealist, @JimDandy

    Ambulances get lost? What, they don’t have GPS and others tracking their whereabouts? Heck, FedEx knows where all its packages are, and I know where my teen daughter is all the time.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    @stillCARealist

    Yes, that's pretty strange. GPS will practically drive you there. I can't find any info on the driver. Maybe they need to have the directions in a few more obscure languages and dialects to keep up with runaway diversity.

    , @The Alarmist
    @stillCARealist


    I know where my teen daughter is all the time.
     
    As long as you are comfortable believing that, more power to ya, bra.
  215. @Anonymous
    @Lurker

    Blacks are actually overrepresented among homosexual transexuals and underrepresented among autogynephilic transexuals. Understanding the difference is key.

    Homosexual transexuals are basically gay men who "become women to attract men." They adopt an exaggerated form of femininity, to become "more women than the women," one could see this as an example of the "zeal of the convert." They are underrepresented among transexual activists, perhaps because their ultimate goal is crypsis, to be undifferentiated from actual women in order to better attract men, which open transexual activism and drawing a lot of attention to transsexuals as a group would interfere with.

    Autogynephilics, in contrast, get off on the idea of themselves as women. Many maintain their attraction to women, which actual women don't usually reciprocate. Thus they place a supreme importance on making women accept them as part of "muh sisterhood," via PC activism and indoctrination. This leads to an inevitable conflict with certain parts of the radical feminist movement, which is currently gripped by an internal conflict, not unlike that which occurred between racial and religious antisemites in the 19th century.

    Basically, the homosexual transsexual is the soldier who wants to make people think he is part of the landscape. The autogynephilic transexual is the Emporer who wants to force people to say he is wearing clothes even though everyone knows he is naked, by threatening to have them fired if they don't toe the line.

    Replies: @Lurker

    Thanks, that’s the best summation Ive seen.

  216. @botazefa
    @Lot


    leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.
     
    The autopsy didn't say he had advanced heart disease. It said he had atherosclerosis. That's a very common condition for men in their 40's and older. The autopsy didn't quantify the level of atherosclerosis, nor did it blame his death on heart disease or heart attack.

    Replies: @Lot, @Art Deco

    “ The autopsy didn’t quantify the level of atherosclerosis”

    It did.

  217. @botazefa
    @Lot


    leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.
     
    The autopsy didn't say he had advanced heart disease. It said he had atherosclerosis. That's a very common condition for men in their 40's and older. The autopsy didn't quantify the level of atherosclerosis, nor did it blame his death on heart disease or heart attack.

    Replies: @Lot, @Art Deco

    It actually said he had ‘severe’ ‘coronary artery disease’. No, that’s not the norm for men of 46.

    BTW, his father died at the age of 53. Good health doesn’t run in the family.

    • Thanks: bomag
    • Replies: @Lurker
    @Art Deco


    Good health doesn’t run in the family.
     
    It staggers along.
  218. @James N. Kennett
    @Anonymous


    Video/audio shows the officer’s knee on the neck was not causing Floyd’s airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique.
     
    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness. If the pressure is sustained after the person has lost consciousness, it is likely to kill him.

    Of course, I do not know whether Floyd died for this reason, or from something else - drugs, panic attack, or whatever. However, I would have expected the officers to wait until Floyd passed out, and then pick him up and put him in the car. Prosecutors will want to know why this did not happen.

    Replies: @Sean, @Anonymous, @Art Deco

    That would be a very dangerous argument for a trial defence attorney to make considering how long it follows the duration of choke applied had been. Chauvin was hands-free sort of squatting beside/ half kneeling on Floyd for almost 10 minutes total, and minutes after he stopped moving and talking. If Chauvin were to admit he had been deliberately applying a choke during that time, he would be incarcerated until the middle of the century.

    … knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness.

    Might work if you mashed his neck into the pavement hard enough to cut off the other carotid artery (there is one each side of neck) although there would be a huge risk of damage to the cervical spine. If you were really trying to choke out someone lying like Floyd was, that would a very heterodox way to do it. Moreover, being choked into unconsciousness is not equivalent to being given a very strong sedative, in medical circles it has long been recognized to be much more a brain trauma equivalent to a boxing KO.

  219. Anonymous[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @Lot
    @Steve Sailer

    The transcript is a lot more informative than the two videos. The video I didn't catch hardly any of the conversation with the girlfriend for example.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    The transcript is a lot more informative than the two videos. The video I didn’t catch hardly any of the conversation with the girlfriend for example.

    What did you find informative about the transcript? How did it influence your perceptions and understanding?

  220. of blacks from blue to red areas, all in the name of Fighting Segregation and Punishing Hateful Whites.

    Again, I ask you to think. I realize it’s hard, but try.

    How many poor blacks are there TO move? Art Deco – are you there? You always have the numbers.

    Well, since AD isn’t here to give the numbers, I’ll do it myself. There are 22 million blacks in the lower 50% of their population.

    Distributing the lower 50% of the black community throughout Red America will dilute their political power, which is based on population concentration and density.

    Also, blacks now have a lower than replacement level TFR.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/226292/us-fertility-rates-by-race-and-ethnicity/

  221. anonymous[117] • Disclaimer says:
    @lysias
    @Anonymous

    Given the evidence that has come out, doesn't the prosecution now have an ethical obligation to drop the case, or at least to drop the murder charge? Then it would never go to a jury.

    Replies: @anonymous

    With respect, ethical shmethical. I have been an attorney for many years. The shenanigans that Woke district attorneys are openly indulging in now would have brought condemnation on them from the members of the bar, and the local media.
    Not any more.

  222. @John Johnson
    @Lot

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    You clearly live in the burbs.

    Black men will not have a penny in their pocket but will still drive around in a BMW or classic car and have brand new $200 shoes. Having an addiction doesn't change this.

    It's just something you aren't supposed to talk about in liberal company. You can be ex-communicated for pointing out the irony of 30k cars in a low income apartment complex.

    Replies: @Lurker

    Wasn’t a Rolls-Royce seen being used in a recent looting video?

    It’s just something you aren’t supposed to talk about in liberal company. You can be ex-communicated for pointing out the irony of 30k cars in a low income apartment complex.

    There’s a saying about not trusting someone who’s car is worth more than their house. Somewhat blunted by inflated property values.

  223. @Art Deco
    @botazefa

    It actually said he had 'severe' 'coronary artery disease'. No, that's not the norm for men of 46.

    BTW, his father died at the age of 53. Good health doesn't run in the family.

    Replies: @Lurker

    Good health doesn’t run in the family.

    It staggers along.

  224. @John Johnson
    @Johnny Smoggins

    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Why would they do that? White men are naturally civil towards the police and it drives the left crazy since it makes these types of videos all the harder to deal with. For most White men it would take additional effort to be uncivil towards the police.

    If White men acted like this all the time then the left would be relieved as they could show common equivalency.

    There is really nothing that drives the left mad like White men being themselves and not apologizing for it. It makes a mockery of the left's constant demand for multi-million dollar programs to fight crime when there are actually remote White rural areas that actually don't have law enforcement because it isn't needed.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    I didn’t mean that Whites should go out and commit crime. Nor did I mean that Whites should become rude or aggressive with the police, which is never a good idea.

    Do what leftists and activists do and make their job as difficult as possible. Beyond showing them ID, you owe a cop nothing. Throughout the interaction keep asking “Am I under arrest?” “Am I being detained?” “Am I free to go now?” Keep silent beyond that and demand a lawyer immediately.

    Way too many Whites think it’s Leave it to Beaver and the friendly neighborhood cop is just doing his job. That ship sailed decades ago and now cops are just the teacher’s union, only with guns.

    Never, ever trust a cop.

    • Agree: Stan d Mute
    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @Johnny Smoggins

    Do what leftists and activists do and make their job as difficult as possible.

    Why would I do that? Do you also make life difficult for other workers?

    Way too many Whites think it’s Leave it to Beaver and the friendly neighborhood cop is just doing his job. That ship sailed decades ago and now cops are just the teacher’s union, only with guns.

    The police in my area are nice and catch criminals for us.

    Why would I be rude to them?

    I'm not a fan of the teacher's union but that doesn't mean I am going to take it out on an individual teacher. That doesn't make any sense. They don't have a choice on whether they can join or not.

  225. @Steve Sailer
    @Johnny Smoggins

    But cops have guns, so you should give them courtesy.

    Replies: @Johnny Smoggins

    Respect the gun, not the man.

  226. @anon
    @Altai

    Taser not a firearm. And turned diagonally due to the angle/distance he was at.

    Replies: @CAL2

    That doesn’t look like a taser. That’s a gun with a flashlight underneath the barrel. At least it looks that way to me.

  227. @Reg Cæsar
    @Kronos

    We could have used this guy in 1917, 1941, 1950, and 1965. We went through a lot of destruction, instead.

    Replies: @Kronos

    Keep in mind someone is making lots of money repairing windows. It’s just a general financial/economic loss to society.

  228. @Lot
    @Mr. Anon

    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.

    “ How did you go bankrupt?” Bill asked.

    “Two ways,” Mike said. “Gradually and then suddenly.”

    In retrospect, it will all seem so obvious.

    Replies: @Captain Tripps, @Anonymous

    So then where are you parking your assets, Mr. Lot? Don’t be coy…

    • Replies: @Lot
    @Captain Tripps

    Like most middle class Californians, my main asset is my highly appreciated house.

    Suburban estate and stocks should be mostly OK if we get hit with inflation. Woke Capitalism and cheap labor migration shouldn’t be bad for Capital.

    What I avoid are non-inflation protected assets like bonds.

  229. @Art Deco
    @SimpleSong

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user.

    You're confounding the dose with the blood level.

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    A distinction without a difference. I guess I could change this to ‘a serum level that would correspond to a lethal dose in mcg per unit body weight, given the volume of distribution of fentanyl, Mr. Floyd’s age and sex, and the typical rate of metabolism of fentanyl’ but this isn’t pharm 101.

    In any case it’s neither the dose nor the serum level that is lethal, but the physiologic effects, which are imperfectly correlated with the serum level, which in turn are imperfectly correlated with the dose.

    However dose is very easy to measure quantitatively, serum level more difficult, end-organ effects very very difficult (difficult to measure quantitatively, although qualitatively not so hard), so usually people discuss ‘lethal doses’ and ‘effective doses’ when in reality those are just crude population measures. In this particular case my point is that we don’t know the dose of fentanyl, the serum levels suggest a high dose was given, but based on the video evidence it doesn’t appear that the physiologic effects associated with fentanyl overdose were present, so there’s not much point in trying to argue that he took 500 mcg of fentanyl versus 50–whatever he took he could handle it, he clearly wasn’t acting like a fentanyl OD.

    • Agree: Sean
    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @SimpleSong

    A distinction without a difference.

    No, the dose is what he ingested. The blood level is his systemic exposure.

    Replies: @Sean

  230. @Johnny Smoggins
    @usNthem

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It's refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn't mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn't mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @John Johnson, @Kronos, @Hypnotoad666, @Anonymous

    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Whites understand there is a time and place “for keeping it real” and police interactions aren’t one of them.

  231. @anon
    @ziggurat

    Perhaps, the same strategy could have been done for the guy who was passed out at the Wendy’s.

    Sigh. This, again? Dude, all that discretion was taken away from cops in the 80's and 90's by Mothers Against Drunk Driving. Now it's "blow over 0.08? Car gets towed, driver goin' to jail" in most states, maybe all. You seriously asking street cops to risk their jobs for some drunk? Really?

    Then there's liability - if the cops in Atlanta let that drunk who passed out in the Wendy's driveup start walking home and he got clipped by a car in the street, who would be at fault? The cops. The city. The county. CaCHING$!

    Maybe that stuff was done like 50 years ago, but it's all over now, thanks to the well meaning lieberals who decided 30+ years ago that officer discretion was a bad thing. But mandatory arrest? Good thing. Knowing the law is a good thing too...

    If you do not like this, contact your state legislature and start working. You will be going up against middle aged women with a lot of time on their hands. Good luck on that.

    Know something else? If your local cop shop offers "ride alongs" you should go on one, just to observe what cops do on their shift. See what really happens. It's like watching COPS only in real time, mostly boring but not always. Drunks...are not as funny in real life as on TV.

    Replies: @JMcG

    Agreed. MADD puts volunteers in all the local district courts to make sure no one gets off a DUI hearing for any reason. Other than being an illegal with no license, that is.

  232. @Alden
    @SimpleSong

    Even less weight on the diaphragm if the patient is lying down on his back.

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    Depends on the individual, but generally when lying flat your abdominal viscera pooch out and put pressure on your diaphragm. Standing up gives you the best lung expansion because the viscera actually pull the diaphragm down. Head down gives you the worst. Face down is usually better than face up for lung expansion. People in pulmonary edema from heart failure often instinctively sit up and hang their legs off the bed to take weight off the lungs and draw fluid away from them.

    However if you have low blood pressure, laying down is good, head down is the best. Which makes me think he may have been having a cardiac issue at the time of arrest.

    Regardless, whatever was going on with this guy, I don’t think the way the cops held him was the cause of death. In hindsight we can say that he probably needed some medical attention but I don’t know how you expect cops to be doing cop things and doing paramedic things and effortlessly switching from one role to the other–it just isn’t humanly possible.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @SimpleSong

    Thanks for your comments, which seem to me informed and well-reasoned.

    From reading about ExDS and watching the videos of Floyd, I don't think it's fair to characterize Floyd as being in ExDS. (He was clearly anxious and agitated, but not unreasonably, and without signs of hyperthermia.) However, whether or not the police thought he was in ExDS is another matter. It's clear from the video--from their manners of speech--that Officers Chauvin and Thou are not rocket scientists. This and their training has to be taken into account when deciding whether their actions were reasonable. It is not entirely true that police officers cannot wear an EMT hat at the same time--the officers had the insight to call an ambulance and asked in the middle of the restraint whether Floyd ought to be on his side.

    I think Chauvin's trial is going to turn on whether or not the defense can show that he had received training that would lead him to believe that the suggested necessity or benefit of continuing a restraint in this situation outweighed the otherwise transparently obvious benefit of checking vital signs in a unresponsive person. If they can't, it seems likely the 2nd degree manslaughter charge will stick (if an officer's failure to assist can be construed as "causing" death, which is a legal matter I don't know about). I don't see how the second degree murder charge can stick unless the gov't also accuses Chauvin of, say, felony assault, which to my knowledge they haven't done yet.

    Then there's the body camera footage from the other officers. Contrary to what everyone is assuming, we can't actually see yet that anyone has their weight on Floyd's back throughout the restraint. From the available footage, it's possible Chauvin's right knee is not touching Floyd and that the other officers are not participating in the restraint. If that's the case, it will be virtually impossible to hold that the restraint impaired breathing, which would mean the heart attack was simply induced by the panic of the situation (which would bring us back again to the legal issue of whether failure to assist "causes" death, which I don't know about).

  233. @Steve Sailer
    @Anon7

    They did call an ambulance but, apparently, it got dispatched with a lower priority than the cops requested and got lost on the way.

    Replies: @Giancarlo M. Kumquat, @Anon7, @stillCARealist, @JimDandy

    That dispatcher should get the chair.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @JimDandy


    That dispatcher should get the chair.
     
    Why?

    Replies: @JimDandy

  234. @TGGP
    @SimpleSong

    So it sounds like if they'd kept him sitting in the cop car, rather than letting him out to lie down as he requested, he might have had better odds of surviving?

    Replies: @SimpleSong

    Might have changed it a bit but only very slightly. Positioning can help a little bit or hurt a little bit but you have to address the underlying medical issue. The restraint hold that was used is definitely not great for somebody who is having some sort of cardiopulmonary event, but, what are you to do when a criminal is combative and you don’t even know if they are having a medical issue, you’re not even trained to handle this stuff? It’s simply a bad situation.

  235. @Percy Gryce
    @Clyde

    If he had ODed 20 minutes earlier, he would have saved hundreds or thousands of lives and billions of dollars in property damage and misdirected funds.

    Replies: @lysias, @JMcG

    Then it would have been the POS at the Wendy’s in Atlanta. Something was going to start it.

  236. @anon
    Only Black Lives Matter caravan attempts to reach Seattle PD chief's house in the countryside, engages in intimidation of all the neighbors. Are we having fun, yet?

    https://lynnwoodtimes.com/2020/08/02/hundreds-of-blm-supporters-storm-snohomish-county-neighborhood-to-protest-at-seattle-police-chief-carmen-bests-home/

    A crowd of about 200 persons, mostly white men and women in their twenties, were dressed in black with masks and black hoods and carried signs that read “Black Lives Matter.” Black Lives Matter protestors shouted profanity and insults at neighbors, took license plate information on vehicles, took pictures of homes, and asked little kids who lived in the neighborhood what schools they attended.
     

    Other BLM protesters carrying large duffle bags attempted to make their way to Chief Best’s private residence. When confronted by neighbors to show the content of the large duffle bags, protesters refused to cooperate. There were no reports of any physical altercations.
     

    A community resident and witness to the protest shared some of the tactics used by BLM protestors.
     

    “They were very organized. They had radios, talking to each other. They had numbers they used to decal all their cars for who knows what. So, they were identifying all their vehicles individually by number. They came with a mission…They were out here intimidating us.”
     
    iSteve asked how a potential President Biden would turn this machine off. Why would Biden or his handlers do that? It's obviously a useful tool for keeping people in line. A lot like the Ku Klux Klan, in fact.

    Replies: @Coemgen

    iSteve asked how a potential President Biden would turn this machine off. Why would Biden or his handlers do that? It’s obviously a useful tool for keeping people in line. A lot like the Ku Klux Klan, in fact.

    “Occupy Wall Street” pretty much fizzled out after Obama was re-elected in 2012:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Occupy_Wall_Street

    BLM looks an awful lot like OWS. I suspect BLM is OWS re-activated after being on standby status during Obama’s second term.

  237. @John Johnson
    Look for more citations of Raj Chetty’s work as proving that blacks must be transferred from, say, Brooklyn to western Pennsylvania.

    This has been going on for years and without Raj Chetty.

    It's done through the social workers.

    The liberal states try to push their baby mommas into rural states on the promise that there are more benefits due to less demand. The social workers handle the details of the move.

    So they end up packing low-income government housing that is really intended as temporary shelter for rural Whites. The mass stabbing that happened in Boise is connected to this type of welfare exporting.

    Replies: @Abolish_public_education

    I’m a bit surprised by your assertion. I’ll search for source.

    A few years ago California made a fuss (in US court?) because it had discovered that Nevada was giving its bums one-way bus tickets to SF.

    As I recall, NV pledged to cease the practice and even paid damages.

  238. @James Speaks
    @Steve Sailer

    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows ...

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.

    Replies: @Coemgen, @Beavertales

    “My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are”

    Before the bars shut down because of Covid, Floyd was a club bouncer. These guys are usually paid in cash at the end of the night. That’s when the staff count the money and find any fake bills that slipped through.

    That a bouncer would be in possession of a fake bill is not at all improbable. He might have been hanging on to it for a while. When desperate, he may have tried to exchange it for a commodity that could be traded.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @Beavertales

    That a bouncer would be in possession of a fake bill is not at all improbable. He might have been hanging on to it for a while. When desperate, he may have tried to exchange it for a commodity that could be traded.

    Correct and they have uses outside of stores.

    What they will do is sell drugs to suburban Whites and give them change in fakes. Probably a good lesson to be honest. Better to get ripped off then lose your life later.

    Stores in Black areas get them all the time and know what to look for. They also have pens to scan them. So it's highly unlikely as the media suggested that it might not have been a fake.

    Here you can see them in the car
    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12071891/cops-fake-george-floyd-car-cops-killed-minneapolis/

    This backs the video where he is clearly doing something with his right hand. He was likely trying to crumple the bills to hide them.

  239. Blacks transferred to western PA? I’m gonna have to defend my magic dirt!

  240. Anonymous[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @James N. Kennett
    @Anonymous


    Video/audio shows the officer’s knee on the neck was not causing Floyd’s airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique.
     
    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness. If the pressure is sustained after the person has lost consciousness, it is likely to kill him.

    Of course, I do not know whether Floyd died for this reason, or from something else - drugs, panic attack, or whatever. However, I would have expected the officers to wait until Floyd passed out, and then pick him up and put him in the car. Prosecutors will want to know why this did not happen.

    Replies: @Sean, @Anonymous, @Art Deco

    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness.

    Nope. The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is to help restrain the suspect, but not by inducing unconsciousness.

  241. @Lot
    @Ray Cissman

    No evidence Floyd was a junkie, as opposed to a sporadic recreational user who accidentally took a fatal dose.

    For example, the autopsy found no injection marks. Nor were there even traces of heroin or oxycodone.

    The fact he was driving a Mercedes SUV in fair condition is further evidence he did not have an expensive opiate habit, and therefore a tolerance that would have made the dose he took non-fatal.

    Replies: @Ben tillman, @Redman, @FPD72, @Mr McKenna, @John Johnson, @Brutusale

  242. @Anon
    Are people still talking about Floyd? The left has been ignoring him for their 'own personal issues' for a long time now.

    White trannies seem to be hogging all the airtime. Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?

    Replies: @Lurker, @Muggles

    >>Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?<<

    RuPaul, a highly successful drag queen entrepreneur, is black and has had a long running cable TV show. I think many of his guests are non white, though hard to tell. I only see the show while changing channels.

    Not sure about what remains under the hood. Don't want to find out either.

    The surgery is pretty expensive so white or otherwise, you have to have the money. Most transvestites (now often tabbed as "trans women") don't have the surgery but I don't know percentages. It is my belief (unverified) that most transvestites remain biologically male completely other than perhaps hormones. Some aren't even gay.

    • Replies: @black sea
    @Muggles

    Ru Paul 's show centers around a sort of drag Miss Universe contest, with lots of bitchy gossip and teary reconciliations. I think getting gender-reassignment surgery would be considered a form of cheating.

    In my 20s, I hung out with a number of music people and had a couple of brief social encounters with Ru Paul. I knew someone who'd been friends with him in high school, during which, she said, he was a khaki slacks and polo shirts sort of preppy. This was all before he moved to New York and made it big.

  243. @The Alarmist
    @Anon4784

    I'd re-write Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment with an African-American lead character, but I don't know how much of a market there is for a one chapter book where he kills the old lady, and doesn't think anything about it until confronted, when he simply says, "Bitch had it coming."

    Replies: @Dumbo

    – Mr. Ras’kol’nigg’ov, why did you kill the old lady?
    – I dindu nuffin”. Also, the old bitch was racyss.

    Acquitted by the all-black jury because of lack of evidence.
    Old white victim’s relatives accused or racism and hate speech, ten years in jail.

    * THE END *

    • LOL: The Alarmist
  244. I remember watching a documentary about Kevin DuBrow, the late lead singer for Quiet Riot, where his brother, an MD, talked about his overdose death being an example of polypharmacy, which usually afflicts the elderly taking multiple prescription drugs. One point he made was that too many drug abusers forget that the number and strength of drugs they happily took in their 20s will kill them in then they’re in their 40s.

  245. @Alexander Turok
    @Mr. Anon

    My bio-containment bubble has been equipped with internet commenting functionality for months now.


    I’m guessing that almost nobody here cares what you have to say. I know for certain that I don’t.
     
    I'm guessing that our host privately agrees with my comment.

    Replies: @Mr. Anon

    And yet nobody else replied to your comment, so I’m guessing I’m mostly right.

  246. @James N. Kennett
    @Anonymous


    Video/audio shows the officer’s knee on the neck was not causing Floyd’s airway to be blocked. It was an immobilization technique not a choking technique.
     
    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness. If the pressure is sustained after the person has lost consciousness, it is likely to kill him.

    Of course, I do not know whether Floyd died for this reason, or from something else - drugs, panic attack, or whatever. However, I would have expected the officers to wait until Floyd passed out, and then pick him up and put him in the car. Prosecutors will want to know why this did not happen.

    Replies: @Sean, @Anonymous, @Art Deco

    The purpose of the knee on the side of the neck is not to block the airway, but to reduce the flow of blood through the carotid artery and thereby induce unconsciousness.

    The carotid arteries are on the front of your neck, not the side or the back.

  247. @SimpleSong
    @Art Deco

    A distinction without a difference. I guess I could change this to 'a serum level that would correspond to a lethal dose in mcg per unit body weight, given the volume of distribution of fentanyl, Mr. Floyd's age and sex, and the typical rate of metabolism of fentanyl' but this isn't pharm 101.

    In any case it's neither the dose nor the serum level that is lethal, but the physiologic effects, which are imperfectly correlated with the serum level, which in turn are imperfectly correlated with the dose.

    However dose is very easy to measure quantitatively, serum level more difficult, end-organ effects very very difficult (difficult to measure quantitatively, although qualitatively not so hard), so usually people discuss 'lethal doses' and 'effective doses' when in reality those are just crude population measures. In this particular case my point is that we don't know the dose of fentanyl, the serum levels suggest a high dose was given, but based on the video evidence it doesn't appear that the physiologic effects associated with fentanyl overdose were present, so there's not much point in trying to argue that he took 500 mcg of fentanyl versus 50--whatever he took he could handle it, he clearly wasn't acting like a fentanyl OD.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    A distinction without a difference.

    No, the dose is what he ingested. The blood level is his systemic exposure.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Art Deco


    Femoral blood levels were middle range for the population of overdose deaths.
     
    You appear to be following a line of reasoning somewhat analogous to Dershowitz's when he argued that OJ Simpson spousal abuse was irrelevant because though he battered his wife statistics showed the odds of a wife beater having went on to murder his victim were one in 2500. However Simpson's wife had not just been battered by her partner, she had also been murdered. When a woman is battered by a partner and murdered, 8 times out of 9 the partner is the killer.

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin's weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Anonymous

  248. @Cato
    @TGGP


    It’s not a case of some arrogant punk who thinks “I don’t feel like getting arrested today”. It’s someone freaking out.
     
    Well, yes, he was freaking out. I had a friend who was doing Angel Dust, like a lot of us in 1975. The cops tried to talk to him, and ended up shooting him. He was white. Shit happens all the time. So the real question here is not why Saint George freaked out,... but why the whole fucking world freaked out?

    Replies: @Neuday

    So the real question here is not why Saint George freaked out,… but why the whole fucking world freaked out?

    Because Trump’s handling of the Plandemic wasn’t ensuring his November loss, and Creepy Joe wasn’t inspiring the Blecks to vote. Something had to be done.

  249. About all I can conclude from this video is that this guy had…ummmm…”issues.”

  250. @Johnny Smoggins
    @John Johnson

    I didn't mean that Whites should go out and commit crime. Nor did I mean that Whites should become rude or aggressive with the police, which is never a good idea.

    Do what leftists and activists do and make their job as difficult as possible. Beyond showing them ID, you owe a cop nothing. Throughout the interaction keep asking "Am I under arrest?" "Am I being detained?" "Am I free to go now?" Keep silent beyond that and demand a lawyer immediately.

    Way too many Whites think it's Leave it to Beaver and the friendly neighborhood cop is just doing his job. That ship sailed decades ago and now cops are just the teacher's union, only with guns.

    Never, ever trust a cop.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE&t=14s

    Replies: @John Johnson

    Do what leftists and activists do and make their job as difficult as possible.

    Why would I do that? Do you also make life difficult for other workers?

    Way too many Whites think it’s Leave it to Beaver and the friendly neighborhood cop is just doing his job. That ship sailed decades ago and now cops are just the teacher’s union, only with guns.

    The police in my area are nice and catch criminals for us.

    Why would I be rude to them?

    I’m not a fan of the teacher’s union but that doesn’t mean I am going to take it out on an individual teacher. That doesn’t make any sense. They don’t have a choice on whether they can join or not.

  251. @stillCARealist
    @Steve Sailer

    Ambulances get lost? What, they don't have GPS and others tracking their whereabouts? Heck, FedEx knows where all its packages are, and I know where my teen daughter is all the time.

    Replies: @Rob McX, @The Alarmist

    Yes, that’s pretty strange. GPS will practically drive you there. I can’t find any info on the driver. Maybe they need to have the directions in a few more obscure languages and dialects to keep up with runaway diversity.

  252. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Translation: Perhaps Floyd's death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that's been going on in the US this summer?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Harry Baldwin, @tyrone, @Stan Adams, @Buck Ransom, @Anonymous

    If BLM, Antifa, the MSM, the DNC, George Soros and the rest of the money people want to go full throttle like this for the benefit of the Donald Trump Reelection Committee, I say it is their prerogative.

  253. @Muggles
    @Anon

    >>Do blacks even get gender reassignment surgery, or is that a white thing?<<

    RuPaul, a highly successful drag queen entrepreneur, is black and has had a long running cable TV show. I think many of his guests are non white, though hard to tell. I only see the show while changing channels.

    Not sure about what remains under the hood. Don't want to find out either.

    The surgery is pretty expensive so white or otherwise, you have to have the money. Most transvestites (now often tabbed as "trans women") don't have the surgery but I don't know percentages. It is my belief (unverified) that most transvestites remain biologically male completely other than perhaps hormones. Some aren't even gay.

    Replies: @black sea

    Ru Paul ‘s show centers around a sort of drag Miss Universe contest, with lots of bitchy gossip and teary reconciliations. I think getting gender-reassignment surgery would be considered a form of cheating.

    In my 20s, I hung out with a number of music people and had a couple of brief social encounters with Ru Paul. I knew someone who’d been friends with him in high school, during which, she said, he was a khaki slacks and polo shirts sort of preppy. This was all before he moved to New York and made it big.

  254. @stillCARealist
    @Steve Sailer

    Ambulances get lost? What, they don't have GPS and others tracking their whereabouts? Heck, FedEx knows where all its packages are, and I know where my teen daughter is all the time.

    Replies: @Rob McX, @The Alarmist

    I know where my teen daughter is all the time.

    As long as you are comfortable believing that, more power to ya, bra.

  255. @Art Deco
    @SimpleSong

    A distinction without a difference.

    No, the dose is what he ingested. The blood level is his systemic exposure.

    Replies: @Sean

    Femoral blood levels were middle range for the population of overdose deaths.

    You appear to be following a line of reasoning somewhat analogous to Dershowitz’s when he argued that OJ Simpson spousal abuse was irrelevant because though he battered his wife statistics showed the odds of a wife beater having went on to murder his victim were one in 2500. However Simpson’s wife had not just been battered by her partner, she had also been murdered. When a woman is battered by a partner and murdered, 8 times out of 9 the partner is the killer.

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin’s weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Sean

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin’s weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    He had a sufficient quantity of fentanyl in him to kill him. That's the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen's teeth. Which is why the restraint technique is used in law enforcement.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6023692/

    Replies: @Sean

    , @Anonymous
    @Sean


    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest
     
    No. Floyd was placed on his side.
  256. @S
    In the Floyd video, almost immediately fellow Blacks attempt to interfere in Floyd's arrest.

    The 1851 book Negro-Mania observed the same phenomena almost two hundred years ago now. Officers of the law in Northern US cities would attempt arrests of Blacks for criminal acts, and immediately hordes of fellow Blacks in acts of tribal loyalty would appear and attempt to stop the arrests from occurring and 'rescue' their fellow Blacks from the consequences of their law breaking. [Am not referencing here the fugitive slaves, myself, but rather the simple law breakers.]

    Nothing much has changed in that regard.


    Negro-Mania (1851) - pg 494

    Not withstanding the paucity of the numbers of the blacks, they have given the greatest trouble to the authorities of the Northern cities. Insignificant in power and resources, they are still insolent and arrogant to a degree which renders them dangerous to the community. The officers of justice scarce venture to arrest them; and it is a task of great and mortal peril to take a fugitive slave, or a fugitive from justice, from among them. It is unnecessary to refer the reader to the columns of our newspapers, which give, almost weekly, accounts of rescues by the blacks.
     

    https://archive.org/stream/negromaniabeinge00camp/negromaniabeinge00camp_djvu.txt

    Replies: @Known Fact, @vinteuil, @Buffalo Joe

    In 1868, the publisher G. W. Carleton published a fascinating compilation, by a certain Hinton Rowan Helper, of reports by [w]hite explorers of their early encounters with [B]lacks:

    The Negroes in Negroland

    Familiarity with the contents of this book should be a prerequisite for any “conversation” about race.

    • Replies: @vinteuil
    @vinteuil

    Sorry, here's the link:

    https://openlibrary.org/books/OL7182215M/The_negroes_in_negroland

  257. @Kronos
    Well, so much for the heroic pose of St. George Floyd. He’ll lose a lot of respect from the black gangstas from this video alone. (Rule number one: never cry in front of the po-po. Rule number 2: never beg from the po-po.)

    The police seemed rather professional. They didn’t seem startled or overly aggressive. I’m sure they’ve dealt with situations like that before. Floyd was flopping like a fish in the back of that police car and I think head-butted the police officer that had this body cam at [8:02].

    Replies: @Rapparee, @BenKenobi, @anon, @Buffalo Joe

    Kronie, I can call you Kronie, right? One of dozens it not hundreds, if not thousands of body cam video and cell phone video of black suspects not following the simplest, most innocuous order. Let me see your hands. Both hands on the steering wheel. Hands on your head. Do not reach for the glove box. Step away from the car. Put your hands behind your back. Take a seat on the curb. Take your hand, slowly out of your pocket. This should be part of the famous message from blacks to their sons. Oh, and don’t break the law.

  258. @Steve Richter
    Chauvin is still in prison awaiting trial? If true, that is terribly unfair. His lawyers need to be fighting for their client in the court of public opinion. Make the point over and over that Chauvin was trying to help Floyd the best he could do. Get him to stay still and calm down which waiting for ambulance that was expected at any moment.

    Replies: @James Braxton, @Buffalo Joe

    Steve, Chauvin is white, otherwise jail is a Covid-19 death sentence, including a couple of POSs that died on Death Row from Covid. Or maybe not, but who cares?

  259. @Kronos
    @Clifford Brown


    Imagine if Americans focused their political outrage and energy to reducing opiates deaths as opposed to the largely imagined deaths of unarmed Black men. This would not be a racially divisive cause, but would benefit Americans of every background.
     
    But then you have to contend with people that medically use those drugs (not just terminal cancer patients, the traditional recipients before the boom-boom 1990s) and the stock market. That’ll be a massive undertaking. I think they solved the initial problem by adding stuff to the pills that significantly hinders the chemical high and/or chance of overdose. (If they did that before, we wouldn’t be in this mess.)

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

    Kron, I think, my personal opinion, that terminal cancer patients should have access to all the opiods they need or want. No one should suffer in agonizing pain when relief is one or two or three pills away.

    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Buffalo Joe

    Oh I do too. But they won’t put up nearly as much as a fight as those with less severe medical conditions (both significant and minor.) Various medical groups will fight further opioid restrictions so 65 year old “Old Ben” can play golf without significant joint pain.

    Replies: @Kronos

  260. @Beavertales
    @James Speaks

    "My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are"

    Before the bars shut down because of Covid, Floyd was a club bouncer. These guys are usually paid in cash at the end of the night. That's when the staff count the money and find any fake bills that slipped through.

    That a bouncer would be in possession of a fake bill is not at all improbable. He might have been hanging on to it for a while. When desperate, he may have tried to exchange it for a commodity that could be traded.

    Replies: @John Johnson

    That a bouncer would be in possession of a fake bill is not at all improbable. He might have been hanging on to it for a while. When desperate, he may have tried to exchange it for a commodity that could be traded.

    Correct and they have uses outside of stores.

    What they will do is sell drugs to suburban Whites and give them change in fakes. Probably a good lesson to be honest. Better to get ripped off then lose your life later.

    Stores in Black areas get them all the time and know what to look for. They also have pens to scan them. So it’s highly unlikely as the media suggested that it might not have been a fake.

    Here you can see them in the car
    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12071891/cops-fake-george-floyd-car-cops-killed-minneapolis/

    This backs the video where he is clearly doing something with his right hand. He was likely trying to crumple the bills to hide them.

  261. The knee on the neck/shoulder-blade is something cops are trained to do, as it keeps the suspect from moving around too much and banging their head on the ground. You can find many, many training vids where this method is used. Chauvin probably used this technique scores of times without incident, which is probably why he seems so cavalier in the video. When I first saw the video it upset me because I didn’t understand what I was seeing, and that this was a viable option to use in restraint scenarios. Floyd’s situation was a perfect storm of a suspect resisting arrest, and having an anxiety attack with a cocktail of drugs in his system. Couple that with the late EMT response and you get the end result. But it is 100% NOT murder by any definition. If you charge Chauvin, then you have to also charge the department that trained him. Unfortunately he will not get a fair trial, and they will have to find him guilty of something to avoid more cities burning down for no good reason at all.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Frank McGar


    The knee on the neck/shoulder-blade is something cops are trained to do, as it keeps the suspect from moving around too much and banging their head on the ground. You can find many, many training vids where this method is used.
     
    Could you please post links to some videos? Thank you.

    Replies: @Frank McGar

  262. @vinteuil
    @S

    In 1868, the publisher G. W. Carleton published a fascinating compilation, by a certain Hinton Rowan Helper, of reports by [w]hite explorers of their early encounters with [B]lacks:

    The Negroes in Negroland

    Familiarity with the contents of this book should be a prerequisite for any "conversation" about race.

    Replies: @vinteuil

    • Thanks: S
  263. @Anon
    @gutta percha

    I'm claustrophobic, as is my mother. We both acquired it in adulthood. I think it's a heritable genetic trait whose heritability increases as you age, like a lot of things. I used to be able to sleep in a mummy sleeping bag while backpacking. Now it would panic me. My mom can't close the door on airline toilets and had flight attendants stand guard while she goes, although this pretty much caused her never to fly.

    Claustrophobics can panic and hyperventilate and that can create shortness of breath, not enough to kill you I wouldn't think, but combined with another problem (Floyd had everything from sickle cell to various drugs) it could push you over the edge.

    Any sort of constriction can bring on a panic attack to claustrophobics. Handcuffs behind your back in an open space can do it; in front is less of a problem. A big guy like Floyd handcuffed behind his back in the cramped back seat of an SUV?: I can believe he panicked in that situation. He mentioned claustrophobia three times, and one of the officers said he'd run the air conditioning and open the windows. It sounds like that officer knew something about the condition, because heat aggravates it. MRIs have non-metallic air pressure operated fans to blow on patients who are mildly claustrophobic because being cooled off helps. Getting a stomach camera scan or a colonoscopy can trigger claustrophobia because you cannot freely move.

    I'm not blaming the officers at all, and I don't think they should be prosecuted or disciplined. However, this is perhaps another case that demonstrates poor training relating to medical matters. Eric Garner died not from the choke hold, but from "positional asphyxia" after he was on the ground. Like Floyd the autopsy showed zero esophageal crushing.


    Obese people especially, lying face down, prone, are unable to breathe when enough pressure is put on their back. The pressure prevents the diaphragm from going up and down, and he can’t inhale and exhale.
     
    https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/05/opinion/eric-garner-daniel-pantaleo-and-lethal-police-tactics.html

    If the cop had simply rolled Garner over after cuffing him, Garner wouldn't have died. Floyd's case is more nuanced, given all the ways he was fucked up, but some awareness of genuine claustrophobia should be conveyed to officers in their training. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that tactical restraint during interrogations is well-known by police as a way to elicit confessions: I would confess to anything if I were about to panic.

    Replies: @FPD72, @Rob McX

    Part of his breakdown may have been due to claustrophobia, but he was under the influence of drugs anyway.

    At 8.00 pm, two employees from the store went across the street to his car to tell him he’d paid with a fake bill and asked for the return of the cigarettes he’d bought. He refused, and at 8.01 one of the employees reported the matter to the police and told them Floyd was “awfully drunk” and “not in control of himself” (from Wikipedia, sources NYT and WaPo). The police arrived seven minutes later. We now know the drug in question wasn’t alcohol, but he clearly shouldn’t have been driving.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Rob McX


    Part of his breakdown may have been due to claustrophobia, but he was under the influence of drugs anyway.

    At 8.00 pm, two employees from the store went across the street to his car to tell him he’d paid with a fake bill and asked for the return of the cigarettes he’d bought.
     

    Claustrophobia? He didn’t mind being cooped up in a private vehicle with two other people.

    Maybe he didn’t want to ride down to jail?

  264. @Mr. Anon
    @AnotherDad

    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.

    Replies: @Lot, @Hypnotoad666

    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.

    You forgot the Ukraine Impeachment Hoax, which was only put out of its misery on February 5, 2020. By March 15, 2020 we were deep into the Corona Hysteria Hoax. And on May 24, 2020 it was the BLM-Floyd Systemic Racism Hysteria Hoax.

    I’m afraid the mother of all hoaxes will be the Nov. 3, 2020 mail-in election. Mail-in balloting means that no one will know who won for weeks and the result will ultimately depend on who can control the post offices and postal workers to stuff the most ballots after-the-fact, while deep-sixing the other side’s ballots.

    It will be like 1876, but with Twitter. I shudder at the thought.

    • Replies: @Rob McX
  265. @syonredux
    @Abolish_public_education

    Just declare that Mississippi and Alabama are Wakanda. Then a little population transfer (Whites out, Blacks in). As a bonus, the Blacks get ownership of everything in those states.

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

    syon, and Lou Saban goes to coach at Ohio Stae.

  266. @Johnny Smoggins
    @usNthem

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It's refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn't mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn't mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @John Johnson, @Kronos, @Hypnotoad666, @Anonymous

    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    If a person in authority has discretion to make your life very difficult, should you: (a) Insult and annoy them, and give them every excuse and motive to f*ck you up even at the cost of having to do a bunch of paperwork?; or (b) Be polite and cooperative so that they have the maximum incentive to make their own lives easier by letting you go with a minor citation or a warning?

    Interacting with the police is basically an IQ test. And the racial differences in the scores are exactly what one would predict.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @Hypnotoad666

    Interacting with the police is basically an IQ test. And the racial differences in the scores are exactly what one would predict.

    Well libertarians at Unz would probably fail that test.

    They still think "big government" is the problem and the police are its stormtrooper arm that need to be undermined. These are the same people that complain about the "militarization of the police" which I guess means wearing too much body armor and carrying an AR-15.

    I'm sure these libertarians would just take a nightstick if they had to go up against Antifa.

    Libertarians need to go carve out their own New Chaz of Africa. Show us how everything is a matter of minimal government. Hand out AK-47s to the locals and tell them about Rand. Let us know how that works out.

    , @black sea
    @Hypnotoad666

    Birney Jarvis, one of the Hells Angels profiled in Hunter Thompson's book, and clearly one of the most accomplished and intelligent, pointed out the utility of being polite during a confrontation with police. "Yes sir" and "no sir" go a long way when most of the other people the cops are dealing with are addressing them as "motherf*cker" and the like.

    Jarvis, called "Preetam Bobo" is Thompson's book, was a 9th grade drop out who went on the become a successful journalist, a Golden Gloves champion, a Black Belt in karate, a sailor, a world traveler, a Mason, and a member of the Coast Guard Auxiliary on the Alabama coast, where he ultimately retired. He was also the inspiration for the TV series, Then Came Bronson,, starring Charles Bronson as a nomadic motorcyclist roaming America.

    I mention all of this because, despite his fairly defiant and hell-raising lifestyle, he was smart enough to avoid arrest by being civil to the cops.

  267. Anonymous[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @Rob McX
    @Anon

    Part of his breakdown may have been due to claustrophobia, but he was under the influence of drugs anyway.

    At 8.00 pm, two employees from the store went across the street to his car to tell him he'd paid with a fake bill and asked for the return of the cigarettes he'd bought. He refused, and at 8.01 one of the employees reported the matter to the police and told them Floyd was "awfully drunk" and "not in control of himself" (from Wikipedia, sources NYT and WaPo). The police arrived seven minutes later. We now know the drug in question wasn't alcohol, but he clearly shouldn't have been driving.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Part of his breakdown may have been due to claustrophobia, but he was under the influence of drugs anyway.

    At 8.00 pm, two employees from the store went across the street to his car to tell him he’d paid with a fake bill and asked for the return of the cigarettes he’d bought.

    Claustrophobia? He didn’t mind being cooped up in a private vehicle with two other people.

    Maybe he didn’t want to ride down to jail?

  268. @duncsbaby
    @J1234

    Half of Mpls is destroyed and their police dept is to be abolished all because of a LIE: that George Floyd was killed by MPD cops. He is most definitely not a sympathetic character. He's a loser-criminal-thug whose death should not be mourned by anyone who wasn't a close loved one.

    Replies: @Buffalo Joe

    dunc, to paraphrase a comment from the other day and yet these are the heroes in the new bLM,SJW, left narrative.

  269. @S
    In the Floyd video, almost immediately fellow Blacks attempt to interfere in Floyd's arrest.

    The 1851 book Negro-Mania observed the same phenomena almost two hundred years ago now. Officers of the law in Northern US cities would attempt arrests of Blacks for criminal acts, and immediately hordes of fellow Blacks in acts of tribal loyalty would appear and attempt to stop the arrests from occurring and 'rescue' their fellow Blacks from the consequences of their law breaking. [Am not referencing here the fugitive slaves, myself, but rather the simple law breakers.]

    Nothing much has changed in that regard.


    Negro-Mania (1851) - pg 494

    Not withstanding the paucity of the numbers of the blacks, they have given the greatest trouble to the authorities of the Northern cities. Insignificant in power and resources, they are still insolent and arrogant to a degree which renders them dangerous to the community. The officers of justice scarce venture to arrest them; and it is a task of great and mortal peril to take a fugitive slave, or a fugitive from justice, from among them. It is unnecessary to refer the reader to the columns of our newspapers, which give, almost weekly, accounts of rescues by the blacks.
     

    https://archive.org/stream/negromaniabeinge00camp/negromaniabeinge00camp_djvu.txt

    Replies: @Known Fact, @vinteuil, @Buffalo Joe

    S, I saw a video, posted IIRC on a California news site, where the interference in an arrest was called…”de-arresting” the suspect. Who makes this shit up?

    • Replies: @S
    @Buffalo Joe

    I can believe it, though I certainly do wish it were made up.

    Replies: @vinteuil

  270. @Hippopotamusdrome
    @Reg Cæsar

    "Pooja Jhunjhunwala"

    Wat?

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    “Pooja Jhunjhunwala”
    Wat?

    This broad works for USAID, which represents America abroad. However, as a “spokesperson”, she likely spends most of her workday representing abroad to Americans.

    Though not Tunisia, apparently.

    https://www.usaid.gov/news-information/fact-sheets/lgbt-global-development-partnership

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Tunisia#Forced_anal_testing

    Tunisia’s sodomy law has the same number as our own federal regulation protecting Silicon Valley:

    ‘Article 230’ and the criminalisation of homosexuality in Tunisia “
    Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act

    Nevertheless, Nomadic Boys lists Tunisia as the gay-friendliest Arab country after Lebanon:

    https://nomadicboys.com/gay-friendly-arab-countries/

    Say, has anyone looked into that Beirut explosion being a result of a lovers’ quarrel?

  271. I am willing to bet that George Floyd, the halogram, makes an appearance at the democrat national convention, and Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    • Replies: @anon
    @Buffalo Joe

    Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    This isn't a question I'd have expected to need an answer to a year ago, but if we're going to have to have a new civic religion based on paying homage the head of a black person, would you prefer the hologram of George Floyd's head, or the animatronic head of Bina Rothblatt (wife of AI researcher and occasional iSteve content provider Martine Rothblatt)?

    https://youtu.be/KYshJRYCArE

    Replies: @Jane Plain, @Buffalo Joe

    , @J.Ross
    @Buffalo Joe

    That hologram is so poorly done that the chin looks like an open screaming mouth.

  272. @anon
    @Anonymous

    Like the medieval practice of trying and executing an animal for its “crime” against a human. Intent of the accused is not an issue. The only issue is something happened for which punishment must be meted out. A primitive notion of justice.

    Or perhaps closer to having your heart ripped out to satisfy the blood lust of an Aztec priesthood and the gods they claim to be serving. Nothing personal, pal. Gods gotta be appeased. Nothing personal, Officer Chauvin, hope you understand our position.

    Replies: @Cortes

    The quirky “Criminal Prosecution and Capital Punishment of Animals” by E.P. Evans has the example of an ass in Colonial America which benefited from a character witness to escape execution in a bestiality case.

    Is modern US justice less enlightened?

  273. @Lot
    @Dieter Kief

    He had sickle cell trait like about 5% of US blacks, not disease. Slightly negative but far leas likely to have killed him than his advanced heart disease.

    Replies: @botazefa, @Dieter Kief

    Steve Sailer retweeted this from Spotted Toad

    @toad_spotted
    Incidentally, this is pretty interesting. Any evidence this happens sometimes to living people with sickle cell trait who are COVID positive? Would be a pretty striking explanation for racial disparities  https://web.archive.org/web/20200604001830/https://www.hennepin.us/-/media/hennepinus/residents/public-safety/documents/Autopsy_2020-3700_Floyd.pdf/

    From the Autopsy: 

    “Comments: The finding of sickled-appearing cells in many of theautopsy tissue sections prompted the Hemoglobin S quantitationreported above. This quantitative result is indicative of sicklecell trait. Red blood cells in individuals with sickle cell traitare known to sickle as a postmortem artifact. The decedent’santemortem peripheral blood smear (made from a complete blood countcollected 5/25/20 at 9:00 p.m.) was reviewed by an expert HHChematopathologist at the Medical Examiner’s request. This reviewfound no evidence  of antemortem sickling.The decedent was known to be positive for 2019-nCoV RNA on 4/3/2020.Since PCR positivity for 2019-nCoV RNA can persist for weeks afterthe onset and resolution of clinical disease, the autopsy result mostlikely reflects asymptomatic but persistent PCR positivity fromprevious infection.6/1/2020XAndrew M. Baker, M.D.Chief Medical ExaminerSigned by: Andrew M. Baker MDIn accordance with HCME policy, this report wasreviewed by another board-certified forensicpathologist prior to release.”

  274. anon[124] • Disclaimer says:
    @Buffalo Joe
    I am willing to bet that George Floyd, the halogram, makes an appearance at the democrat national convention, and Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    Replies: @anon, @J.Ross

    Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    This isn’t a question I’d have expected to need an answer to a year ago, but if we’re going to have to have a new civic religion based on paying homage the head of a black person, would you prefer the hologram of George Floyd’s head, or the animatronic head of Bina Rothblatt (wife of AI researcher and occasional iSteve content provider Martine Rothblatt)?

    • Replies: @Jane Plain
    @anon

    Thanks. There is so much weird going on, I needed a little normal to balance things.


    *****
    Perhaps people here don't pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it's important to note that they are off the bandwagon.

    There's every chance Chauvin will be acquitted. Cities will burn. But this time, people like me will have zero sympathy for the rioters. Unfortunately who ever is president will allow the cities to burn with impunity.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    , @Buffalo Joe
    @anon

    anon, well, nice hairs, but I guarantee there will be a homage to Floyd.

  275. Anonymous[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @Frank McGar
    The knee on the neck/shoulder-blade is something cops are trained to do, as it keeps the suspect from moving around too much and banging their head on the ground. You can find many, many training vids where this method is used. Chauvin probably used this technique scores of times without incident, which is probably why he seems so cavalier in the video. When I first saw the video it upset me because I didn't understand what I was seeing, and that this was a viable option to use in restraint scenarios. Floyd's situation was a perfect storm of a suspect resisting arrest, and having an anxiety attack with a cocktail of drugs in his system. Couple that with the late EMT response and you get the end result. But it is 100% NOT murder by any definition. If you charge Chauvin, then you have to also charge the department that trained him. Unfortunately he will not get a fair trial, and they will have to find him guilty of something to avoid more cities burning down for no good reason at all.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    The knee on the neck/shoulder-blade is something cops are trained to do, as it keeps the suspect from moving around too much and banging their head on the ground. You can find many, many training vids where this method is used.

    Could you please post links to some videos? Thank you.

    • Replies: @Frank McGar
    @Anonymous

    Sure. Here's one where two men are restraining a woman, starts around 3 min mark:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CcERs1TpnA

    This one shows the knee placement at about the 50 second mark; at this point the guy has his full body weight on the guy's neck/upper back:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BanyzDPUI4

    This video shows how cops are "revising" the knee to neck technique, which makes it clear they were already doing this as a common practice.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6G9Kv8MnGE

    There's a ton more on youtube.

    Replies: @Sean

  276. @Hypnotoad666
    @Johnny Smoggins


    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.
     
    If a person in authority has discretion to make your life very difficult, should you: (a) Insult and annoy them, and give them every excuse and motive to f*ck you up even at the cost of having to do a bunch of paperwork?; or (b) Be polite and cooperative so that they have the maximum incentive to make their own lives easier by letting you go with a minor citation or a warning?

    Interacting with the police is basically an IQ test. And the racial differences in the scores are exactly what one would predict.

    Replies: @John Johnson, @black sea

    Interacting with the police is basically an IQ test. And the racial differences in the scores are exactly what one would predict.

    Well libertarians at Unz would probably fail that test.

    They still think “big government” is the problem and the police are its stormtrooper arm that need to be undermined. These are the same people that complain about the “militarization of the police” which I guess means wearing too much body armor and carrying an AR-15.

    I’m sure these libertarians would just take a nightstick if they had to go up against Antifa.

    Libertarians need to go carve out their own New Chaz of Africa. Show us how everything is a matter of minimal government. Hand out AK-47s to the locals and tell them about Rand. Let us know how that works out.

  277. @Buffalo Joe
    @Kronos

    Kron, I think, my personal opinion, that terminal cancer patients should have access to all the opiods they need or want. No one should suffer in agonizing pain when relief is one or two or three pills away.

    Replies: @Kronos

    Oh I do too. But they won’t put up nearly as much as a fight as those with less severe medical conditions (both significant and minor.) Various medical groups will fight further opioid restrictions so 65 year old “Old Ben” can play golf without significant joint pain.

    • Thanks: Buffalo Joe
    • Replies: @Kronos
    @Kronos

    Oh jeez, I should’ve added this.

    https://youtu.be/WGV8DcuiZGo

  278. @travis
    @Anon

    even the hospital could not save him from this OD. He arrived at the hospital still breathing and died 30 minutes after they took his blood. In addition to having a fatal dose of opioids in his blood he was an elderly man fighting COVID-19 with heart disease.

    Could they even convict these cops of police brutality ? for following police procedures against an uncooperative criminal ? Hard to see how they are even charged with manslaughter.

    Replies: @Ripple Earthdevil, @Chrisnonymous

    He arrived at the hospital still breathing? Got a link?

    • Agree: Gandydancer
  279. @lysias
    @Percy Gryce

    The forces behind the riots were just waiting for an incident to happen to serve as their excuse. If it had not been this one, there would soon have been another.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    That’s true. It would have been the dead jogger instead.

  280. @Steve Sailer
    @James Speaks

    When did Chauvin arrive on the scene?

    Replies: @Redman, @Lot, @James Speaks, @Chrisnonymous

    As regards any possible Chauvin-Floyd prior relationship leading to murder, this was the only suspicious bit–Chauvin’s first question on arriving at the scene is “is he going to jail?”

    In theory this could be evidence that Floyd knew something Chauvin didn’t want him to tell (like something to do with cointerfeit money?). On the other hand, Chauvin’s murder technique doesn’t seem very foolproof. On the other hand, he would have had to make it look like an accident from a slightly too aggressive restraint… Not plausible at all except for the sawing action Chauvin does with his knee just prior to Floyd going unresponsive.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Chrisnonymous


    Not plausible at all except for the sawing action Chauvin does with his knee just prior to Floyd going unresponsive.

     

    Optical illusion. Floyd passed out, causing his body to rotate into a more face down position. This happened while Chauvin had his eyes on the disturbance on the sidewalk. What you observed was him shifting slightly to maintain balance with Floyd’s movement.
    , @James Speaks
    @Chrisnonymous


    In theory this could be evidence that Floyd knew something Chauvin didn’t want him to tell (like something to do with cointerfeit money?).
     
    Follow the money trail.
  281. @Hypnotoad666
    @Mr. Anon


    First the Coronapocalypse and then the Summer of George (Floyd). 2020 will be remembered as the year the World went mad.
     
    You forgot the Ukraine Impeachment Hoax, which was only put out of its misery on February 5, 2020. By March 15, 2020 we were deep into the Corona Hysteria Hoax. And on May 24, 2020 it was the BLM-Floyd Systemic Racism Hysteria Hoax.

    I'm afraid the mother of all hoaxes will be the Nov. 3, 2020 mail-in election. Mail-in balloting means that no one will know who won for weeks and the result will ultimately depend on who can control the post offices and postal workers to stuff the most ballots after-the-fact, while deep-sixing the other side's ballots.

    It will be like 1876, but with Twitter. I shudder at the thought.

    Replies: @Rob McX

  282. @JimDandy
    @Steve Sailer

    That dispatcher should get the chair.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    That dispatcher should get the chair.

    Why?

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @Anonymous

    Joking.

  283. @Buffalo Joe
    @S

    S, I saw a video, posted IIRC on a California news site, where the interference in an arrest was called..."de-arresting" the suspect. Who makes this shit up?

    Replies: @S

    I can believe it, though I certainly do wish it were made up.

    • Replies: @vinteuil
    @S


    I certainly do wish it were made up.
     
    Be careful about using the subjunctive correctly.It might draw their attention.
  284. @Anonymous
    @Frank McGar


    The knee on the neck/shoulder-blade is something cops are trained to do, as it keeps the suspect from moving around too much and banging their head on the ground. You can find many, many training vids where this method is used.
     
    Could you please post links to some videos? Thank you.

    Replies: @Frank McGar

    Sure. Here’s one where two men are restraining a woman, starts around 3 min mark:

    This one shows the knee placement at about the 50 second mark; at this point the guy has his full body weight on the guy’s neck/upper back:

    This video shows how cops are “revising” the knee to neck technique, which makes it clear they were already doing this as a common practice.

    There’s a ton more on youtube.

    • Thanks: ziggurat
    • Replies: @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    They are doing something not too dissimilar though briefly during the process of handcuffing and restraining. But George Floyd was already handcuffed when they (four of them remember) put him down on the pavement. While use of knees might have a purpose, that is not what Chavin was using it for Chavin got knees on Floyd and kept them there for 9 minutes 30 seconds while resting his hands on top of his own legs. It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd's rib cage movement and make it difficult to breath. Take a look at Conor McGregor's breathing being restricted by an opponent's body weight.

    https://youtu.be/iu6n_Xja8mU?t=279

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off--reluctantly-- after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Frank McGar, @Chrisnonymous, @Art Deco

  285. @Captain Tripps
    @Lot

    So then where are you parking your assets, Mr. Lot? Don't be coy...

    Replies: @Lot

    Like most middle class Californians, my main asset is my highly appreciated house.

    Suburban estate and stocks should be mostly OK if we get hit with inflation. Woke Capitalism and cheap labor migration shouldn’t be bad for Capital.

    What I avoid are non-inflation protected assets like bonds.

    • Thanks: Captain Tripps
  286. @anon
    @Buffalo Joe

    Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    This isn't a question I'd have expected to need an answer to a year ago, but if we're going to have to have a new civic religion based on paying homage the head of a black person, would you prefer the hologram of George Floyd's head, or the animatronic head of Bina Rothblatt (wife of AI researcher and occasional iSteve content provider Martine Rothblatt)?

    https://youtu.be/KYshJRYCArE

    Replies: @Jane Plain, @Buffalo Joe

    Thanks. There is so much weird going on, I needed a little normal to balance things.

    *****
    Perhaps people here don’t pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it’s important to note that they are off the bandwagon.

    There’s every chance Chauvin will be acquitted. Cities will burn. But this time, people like me will have zero sympathy for the rioters. Unfortunately who ever is president will allow the cities to burn with impunity.

    • Agree: Gandydancer
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jane Plain


    Perhaps people here don’t pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it’s important to note that they are off the bandwagon.
     
    Off which bandwagon?

    Replies: @Jane Plain

  287. @Buffalo Joe
    I am willing to bet that George Floyd, the halogram, makes an appearance at the democrat national convention, and Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    Replies: @anon, @J.Ross

    That hologram is so poorly done that the chin looks like an open screaming mouth.

  288. @SimpleSong
    @Alden

    Depends on the individual, but generally when lying flat your abdominal viscera pooch out and put pressure on your diaphragm. Standing up gives you the best lung expansion because the viscera actually pull the diaphragm down. Head down gives you the worst. Face down is usually better than face up for lung expansion. People in pulmonary edema from heart failure often instinctively sit up and hang their legs off the bed to take weight off the lungs and draw fluid away from them.

    However if you have low blood pressure, laying down is good, head down is the best. Which makes me think he may have been having a cardiac issue at the time of arrest.

    Regardless, whatever was going on with this guy, I don't think the way the cops held him was the cause of death. In hindsight we can say that he probably needed some medical attention but I don't know how you expect cops to be doing cop things and doing paramedic things and effortlessly switching from one role to the other--it just isn't humanly possible.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    Thanks for your comments, which seem to me informed and well-reasoned.

    From reading about ExDS and watching the videos of Floyd, I don’t think it’s fair to characterize Floyd as being in ExDS. (He was clearly anxious and agitated, but not unreasonably, and without signs of hyperthermia.) However, whether or not the police thought he was in ExDS is another matter. It’s clear from the video–from their manners of speech–that Officers Chauvin and Thou are not rocket scientists. This and their training has to be taken into account when deciding whether their actions were reasonable. It is not entirely true that police officers cannot wear an EMT hat at the same time–the officers had the insight to call an ambulance and asked in the middle of the restraint whether Floyd ought to be on his side.

    I think Chauvin’s trial is going to turn on whether or not the defense can show that he had received training that would lead him to believe that the suggested necessity or benefit of continuing a restraint in this situation outweighed the otherwise transparently obvious benefit of checking vital signs in a unresponsive person. If they can’t, it seems likely the 2nd degree manslaughter charge will stick (if an officer’s failure to assist can be construed as “causing” death, which is a legal matter I don’t know about). I don’t see how the second degree murder charge can stick unless the gov’t also accuses Chauvin of, say, felony assault, which to my knowledge they haven’t done yet.

    Then there’s the body camera footage from the other officers. Contrary to what everyone is assuming, we can’t actually see yet that anyone has their weight on Floyd’s back throughout the restraint. From the available footage, it’s possible Chauvin’s right knee is not touching Floyd and that the other officers are not participating in the restraint. If that’s the case, it will be virtually impossible to hold that the restraint impaired breathing, which would mean the heart attack was simply induced by the panic of the situation (which would bring us back again to the legal issue of whether failure to assist “causes” death, which I don’t know about).

  289. “Perhaps people here don’t pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it’s important to note that they are off the bandwagon.”

    Nahhh, Dreher’s climbing back on the bandwagon already.

  290. @Sean
    @Art Deco


    Femoral blood levels were middle range for the population of overdose deaths.
     
    You appear to be following a line of reasoning somewhat analogous to Dershowitz's when he argued that OJ Simpson spousal abuse was irrelevant because though he battered his wife statistics showed the odds of a wife beater having went on to murder his victim were one in 2500. However Simpson's wife had not just been battered by her partner, she had also been murdered. When a woman is battered by a partner and murdered, 8 times out of 9 the partner is the killer.

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin's weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Anonymous

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin’s weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    He had a sufficient quantity of fentanyl in him to kill him. That’s the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen’s teeth. Which is why the restraint technique is used in law enforcement.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6023692/

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Art Deco


    That’s the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.
     
    Which is a very different thing to saying people with that quantity in them usually die. New users are the ones killed by that amount. But I think we are safe in assuming it was not Floyd's first rodeo. Floyd being killed by that quantity is like a hard drinker being killed by downing an amount of whiskey fatal for a teetotaler.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen’s teeth
     
    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Jane Plain

  291. Anonymous[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @Chrisnonymous
    @Steve Sailer

    As regards any possible Chauvin-Floyd prior relationship leading to murder, this was the only suspicious bit--Chauvin's first question on arriving at the scene is "is he going to jail?"

    In theory this could be evidence that Floyd knew something Chauvin didn't want him to tell (like something to do with cointerfeit money?). On the other hand, Chauvin's murder technique doesn't seem very foolproof. On the other hand, he would have had to make it look like an accident from a slightly too aggressive restraint... Not plausible at all except for the sawing action Chauvin does with his knee just prior to Floyd going unresponsive.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @James Speaks

    Not plausible at all except for the sawing action Chauvin does with his knee just prior to Floyd going unresponsive.

    Optical illusion. Floyd passed out, causing his body to rotate into a more face down position. This happened while Chauvin had his eyes on the disturbance on the sidewalk. What you observed was him shifting slightly to maintain balance with Floyd’s movement.

  292. Anonymous[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jane Plain
    @anon

    Thanks. There is so much weird going on, I needed a little normal to balance things.


    *****
    Perhaps people here don't pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it's important to note that they are off the bandwagon.

    There's every chance Chauvin will be acquitted. Cities will burn. But this time, people like me will have zero sympathy for the rioters. Unfortunately who ever is president will allow the cities to burn with impunity.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Perhaps people here don’t pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it’s important to note that they are off the bandwagon.

    Off which bandwagon?

    • Replies: @Jane Plain
    @Anonymous

    The "George Floyd may have not been perfect but the police murdered him or if not murdered him he died as a result of police misconduct" bandwagon.

    Walsh has been on fire ever since the riots. He's taken 50 black pills so he was never really on the Floyd bandwagon but I mentioned him as a normie conservative who's come to the light.

    Dreher thought Floyd was murdered, but after the video he thinks the police acted correctly. Dreher's responses are *always* overwrought and childlike, but he is a major voice in conservatardism, so his change of mind is noteworthy.

  293. @Frank McGar
    @Anonymous

    Sure. Here's one where two men are restraining a woman, starts around 3 min mark:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CcERs1TpnA

    This one shows the knee placement at about the 50 second mark; at this point the guy has his full body weight on the guy's neck/upper back:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BanyzDPUI4

    This video shows how cops are "revising" the knee to neck technique, which makes it clear they were already doing this as a common practice.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6G9Kv8MnGE

    There's a ton more on youtube.

    Replies: @Sean

    They are doing something not too dissimilar though briefly during the process of handcuffing and restraining. But George Floyd was already handcuffed when they (four of them remember) put him down on the pavement. While use of knees might have a purpose, that is not what Chavin was using it for Chavin got knees on Floyd and kept them there for 9 minutes 30 seconds while resting his hands on top of his own legs. It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd’s rib cage movement and make it difficult to breath. Take a look at Conor McGregor’s breathing being restricted by an opponent’s body weight.

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off–reluctantly– after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Sean


    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off–reluctantly– after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?
     
    You’d understand better if you knew how much pressure was being applied to the back—not the trachea, not the carotid artery—of Floyd’s neck.

    The answer: Very little.
    , @Frank McGar
    @Sean

    I understand your take- he was on top of him for a long time. But in a heightened situation, with a crowd yelling and adrenaline flowing, it's easy to lose track of time. The ambulance also went to the wrong location so what should have been a couple of minutes took a lot longer. The police restraint videos show a very specific position used for restraining people who are in an "excited" or delirious state, and more than likely this was part of their training, which will come out in court. I guess it's possible he was trying to be punitive, but it's hard for me to imagine a cop with almost 20 years experience was trying to kill a guy with a crowd watching and recording the entire thing (as well as police body cams). I think it's more likely that he was using the technique that they commonly use on people who are more "agitated" than normal, and the combination of drugs, anxiety, and too much time passing resulted in his death. If he was putting pressure directly on his airway, Floyd would not have been able to talk and move around for so long.

    As far as the Conor thing I think it's entirely different, as he was placing pressure directly on his chest/diaphragm while Conor was on his back. An argument can be made that the police techniques need to be changed- my main point is that this was part of their training, and as the training videos show the breathing is not restricted.

    Replies: @Sean

    , @Chrisnonymous
    @Sean

    Hopefully, the other officers' body cam footage will be released to the public at some point because we can't actually see Chauvin's right knee on Floyd's back. That is something you are assuming because it's central to the narrative you've created in your head about Chauvin asphyxiating Floyd. But we don't know that's what's happening in the video.

    The police criminal complaint against the officers specifically says that Chauvin placed his left knee on Floyd's neck, but it doesn't say anything about his right knee. If the prosecutors believed that Floyd died because his breathing was restricted by weight from Chauvin's right knee, I think they would have put that in the criminal complaint. Instead the complaint seems to be following the coroner's report, which puts part of the blame for the homicide on neck compression.

    The complaint also says Kueng and Lane were "holding" Floyd's back and legs. Were a group of people kneeling on him as happened with Eric Garner? It seems unlikely from how the coroner's report is written, the difference in charges brought against Chauvin and Kueng/Lane, and the way the criminal complaints are written. Again, we'll have to see the body cam footage to know what really happened.

    I'm guessing that when the trial comes, the issue will be about (1) the total effect of a restraint that was not necessary causing too much stress on Floyd's heart and (2) the failure of the officers to act to check Floyd's condition and otherwise protect him. But it won't be about positional asphyxia per se. As so many people have pointed out, Floyd was already complaining of an inability to breath before he went down on the ground suggesting that he was feeling the effects of oxygen debt in his fragile heart as a result of the panic from the arrest situation (I do believe Floyd was actually scared of going into the vehicle).

    As an aside, while fooling around with friends in a dojo after class, I have had both small adult women and larger adult men standing on my back while I am lying face down. I can attest that a full-grown man standing with all his weight on your back in certain places on your back can restrict your breathing. I can also attest that while this restriction happened, I was able to speak. However, the speaking was strained and could come only in short weak bursts. On the other hand, a full-grown Asian woman can walk on my back without restricting my breathing, and the moans and petitions Floyd was making don't sound like he was unable to inflate his lungs.

    If you think that Chauvin's restraint created a mechanical obstruction to his breathing, then get some friends together along with an oximeter. Recreate the scene, and look at the oximeter for the Sp02 to drop. If it doesn't drop, there is no obstruction to your breathing even if you feel it's difficult. As I said in a previous thread, I would do this experiment myself, but I literally don't have anyone I can talk about about this incident.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    , @Art Deco
    @Sean

    It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd’s rib cage movement

    Thanks for the issue of your imagination. Been an education.

    Replies: @Sean

  294. @anon
    @Buffalo Joe

    Joe Biden, with tears streaming down his face, takes a knee to the image.

    This isn't a question I'd have expected to need an answer to a year ago, but if we're going to have to have a new civic religion based on paying homage the head of a black person, would you prefer the hologram of George Floyd's head, or the animatronic head of Bina Rothblatt (wife of AI researcher and occasional iSteve content provider Martine Rothblatt)?

    https://youtu.be/KYshJRYCArE

    Replies: @Jane Plain, @Buffalo Joe

    anon, well, nice hairs, but I guarantee there will be a homage to Floyd.

  295. @Art Deco
    @Sean

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin’s weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    He had a sufficient quantity of fentanyl in him to kill him. That's the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen's teeth. Which is why the restraint technique is used in law enforcement.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6023692/

    Replies: @Sean

    That’s the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.

    Which is a very different thing to saying people with that quantity in them usually die. New users are the ones killed by that amount. But I think we are safe in assuming it was not Floyd’s first rodeo. Floyd being killed by that quantity is like a hard drinker being killed by downing an amount of whiskey fatal for a teetotaler.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen’s teeth

    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Sean


    Chauvin is a very odd duck.
     
    Chauvin is a good man, who was trying to do his best in a difficult situation.
    , @Jane Plain
    @Sean


    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

     

    That doesn't make him guilty of murder.

    Replies: @Sean

  296. Anonymous[387] • Disclaimer says:
    @Johnny Smoggins
    @usNthem

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It's refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn't mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn't mean you owe the cop courtesy either.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer, @John Johnson, @Kronos, @Hypnotoad666, @Anonymous

    Before it was taken off the air, I used to watch Live PD. I was amazed at how many people, particularly blacks and women, were routinely argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful to the cops.

    It is worth recalling that you were watching a television programme, and that TV programmes with the most exciting and, er, stimulating footage tend to attract larger audiences and perform better in the TV ratings. No small consideration in countries where television programming is paid for largely with advertising dollars.

    Commercial aspects aside, there is also the phenomenon known as, “nothing left to lose.”

    If you have been arrested 10 times before, I do not expect you would have much to lose by arguing with the police when you are being arrested for the 11th time, would you?

    However, I do not see how being argumentative, aggressive and disrespectful is going to help your case if you are being arrested for the first or second time. Quite the contrary, I should think.

    It might be more instructive if we knew how the subsequent sentencing of these uncooperative individuals went, first, before we start their following dubious example. It may be the case that your giving the police a hard time results in you being given a much longer time in clink.

  297. Out of curiosity I checked the homepage of CBS, abc and NBC. No mention of new bodycam footage in the least interesting and important story of the year.

  298. @Kronos
    @Buffalo Joe

    Oh I do too. But they won’t put up nearly as much as a fight as those with less severe medical conditions (both significant and minor.) Various medical groups will fight further opioid restrictions so 65 year old “Old Ben” can play golf without significant joint pain.

    Replies: @Kronos

    Oh jeez, I should’ve added this.

  299. Anonymous[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Sean
    @Art Deco


    Femoral blood levels were middle range for the population of overdose deaths.
     
    You appear to be following a line of reasoning somewhat analogous to Dershowitz's when he argued that OJ Simpson spousal abuse was irrelevant because though he battered his wife statistics showed the odds of a wife beater having went on to murder his victim were one in 2500. However Simpson's wife had not just been battered by her partner, she had also been murdered. When a woman is battered by a partner and murdered, 8 times out of 9 the partner is the killer.

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest with his hands manicled behind his back and a portion of Chauvin's weight placed on his torso for over nine minutes thirty seconds, at the end of which time he was found to have expired.

    Replies: @Art Deco, @Anonymous

    Floyd did not merely die with a certain blood level of Fentanyl, he was alive with a level of Fentanyl and was placed in a dorsal up position on his chest

    No. Floyd was placed on his side.

  300. Anonymous[424] • Disclaimer says:
    @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    They are doing something not too dissimilar though briefly during the process of handcuffing and restraining. But George Floyd was already handcuffed when they (four of them remember) put him down on the pavement. While use of knees might have a purpose, that is not what Chavin was using it for Chavin got knees on Floyd and kept them there for 9 minutes 30 seconds while resting his hands on top of his own legs. It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd's rib cage movement and make it difficult to breath. Take a look at Conor McGregor's breathing being restricted by an opponent's body weight.

    https://youtu.be/iu6n_Xja8mU?t=279

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off--reluctantly-- after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Frank McGar, @Chrisnonymous, @Art Deco

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off–reluctantly– after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    You’d understand better if you knew how much pressure was being applied to the back—not the trachea, not the carotid artery—of Floyd’s neck.

    The answer: Very little.

  301. Anonymous[344] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    Translation: Perhaps Floyd's death was not the direct result of the MPD after all. So when can we expect BLM and Antifa to publicly issue an apology and cease forthwith all the rioting that's been going on in the US this summer?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Harry Baldwin, @tyrone, @Stan Adams, @Buck Ransom, @Anonymous

    We now have the advantage of having seen, over many long weeks, how the Organizers used the GF incident to create not just nationwide but even international turmoil. This also means we can now look back and reappraise the apparent situation based on Bayesian search principles.

    THOUGHT EXPERIMENT: Supposing one wanted to CREATE an incident like the highly public GF death:

    1. How much money would it take?
    2. How many individuals would need to be in on the plot?
    3. How many others would need to be involved, without necessarily knowing the big picture or even their own real role in the production?

    A THOUGHT: Is it unreasonable to suspect from GF’s demeanor shown in the belatedly leaked video that he sensed, in his drug-addled mind, that the arrest and or his “trip” this time was dangerously different, and that he had been SET UP TO DIE? That would explain his repeated entreaties not to shoot him.

    GF could have been recruited under false pretenses for a more innocuous op, only to discover that he was the designated PATSY.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @Anonymous

    Or why not wait around until some black guy winds up dead while resisting arrest? It's not like you'll have to wait a really long time?

    Replies: @Rob McX

  302. @Anonymous
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    We now have the advantage of having seen, over many long weeks, how the Organizers used the GF incident to create not just nationwide but even international turmoil. This also means we can now look back and reappraise the apparent situation based on Bayesian search principles.

    THOUGHT EXPERIMENT: Supposing one wanted to CREATE an incident like the highly public GF death:

    1. How much money would it take?
    2. How many individuals would need to be in on the plot?
    3. How many others would need to be involved, without necessarily knowing the big picture or even their own real role in the production?

    A THOUGHT: Is it unreasonable to suspect from GF's demeanor shown in the belatedly leaked video that he sensed, in his drug-addled mind, that the arrest and or his "trip" this time was dangerously different, and that he had been SET UP TO DIE? That would explain his repeated entreaties not to shoot him.

    GF could have been recruited under false pretenses for a more innocuous op, only to discover that he was the designated PATSY.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    Or why not wait around until some black guy winds up dead while resisting arrest? It’s not like you’ll have to wait a really long time?

    • Replies: @Rob McX
    @Steve Sailer

    What's surprising is that this doesn't happen more often. In fact, there have been cases where the police were more clearly at fault and no rioting ensued, e.g. the shooting of Walter Scott in South Carolina in 2015. What is strange is the difference in reaction between these cases.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous, @Anonymous

  303. @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    They are doing something not too dissimilar though briefly during the process of handcuffing and restraining. But George Floyd was already handcuffed when they (four of them remember) put him down on the pavement. While use of knees might have a purpose, that is not what Chavin was using it for Chavin got knees on Floyd and kept them there for 9 minutes 30 seconds while resting his hands on top of his own legs. It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd's rib cage movement and make it difficult to breath. Take a look at Conor McGregor's breathing being restricted by an opponent's body weight.

    https://youtu.be/iu6n_Xja8mU?t=279

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off--reluctantly-- after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Frank McGar, @Chrisnonymous, @Art Deco

    I understand your take- he was on top of him for a long time. But in a heightened situation, with a crowd yelling and adrenaline flowing, it’s easy to lose track of time. The ambulance also went to the wrong location so what should have been a couple of minutes took a lot longer. The police restraint videos show a very specific position used for restraining people who are in an “excited” or delirious state, and more than likely this was part of their training, which will come out in court. I guess it’s possible he was trying to be punitive, but it’s hard for me to imagine a cop with almost 20 years experience was trying to kill a guy with a crowd watching and recording the entire thing (as well as police body cams). I think it’s more likely that he was using the technique that they commonly use on people who are more “agitated” than normal, and the combination of drugs, anxiety, and too much time passing resulted in his death. If he was putting pressure directly on his airway, Floyd would not have been able to talk and move around for so long.

    As far as the Conor thing I think it’s entirely different, as he was placing pressure directly on his chest/diaphragm while Conor was on his back. An argument can be made that the police techniques need to be changed- my main point is that this was part of their training, and as the training videos show the breathing is not restricted.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/05/29/15/28974730-8369723-image-m-4_1590761223499.jpg

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

  304. @SimpleSong
    My armchair analysis of the situation:

    While he did have fentanyl in his system, this was probably not a fentanyl overdose based on the way he was behaving. While he did have a large amount of fentanyl in his bloodstream, people who regularly use opioids rapidly develop tolerance and thus a serum level that would be a lethal dose in a normal person can be perfectly tolerable in a habitual user. People who overdose on fentanyl don't get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy, breathing slows, then stops, then they die. They don't have air hunger; in fact the problem with fentanyl is that it takes away air hunger. So someone complaining that they can't breathe is not consistent with a fentanyl overdose--people overdosing on fentanyl don't care if they can't breathe, and that's the problem.

    However the fact that he was complaining that he couldn't breathe early during the arrest suggests that he was having some other medical event at the time of arrest. This could have been any number of things, some of which can be detected on autopsy (heart attack, pulmonary embolism), some of which cannot (arrhythmia, severe bronchospasm.) Furthermore, these may have been caused by some of the other drugs found in his system (PCP I believe was found?), they may have been exacerbated by it, they may have just happened independently. It's pretty much impossible to know for certain.

    If an individual is having some sort of medical event that causes shortness of breath, the restraint techniques used by the police would almost certainly make the situation worse. Generally you want somebody sitting up so that their weight is off the diaphragm and they can breathe as deeply as possible. However they were clearly not choking him as he could speak, so the trachea wasn't obstructed. Regardless, it certainly made the situation worse.

    However from the police's perspective, it's difficult to know whether this guy really is having a cardiopulmonary issue or whether he's just faking to try to get out of being arrested. Even if they had training, they don't really have the equipment to figure this stuff out.

    Replies: @415 reasons, @TGGP, @Alden, @Art Deco, @Bozo the Clown

    “ People who overdose on fentanyl don’t get agitated like Floyd appearas to, quite the opposite, they get sleepy…”

    I once knew a black fella who, upon snorting a couple of $10 bags of snortable heroin, would get wired like he’d just done a bunch of coke instead. Surely that was a sign of his tolerance to the stuff. Or maybe it’s a black thing and we wouldn’t understand.

  305. @Coemgen
    @James Speaks


    As noted by others, Chauvin arrived after Floyd had pleaded not to be shot. My suspicious mind wonders if this had been a test run of the counterfeit $20. If so, and with Floyd waiting for someone to show up because he knows he screwed up, and who shows up later but someone he knows …

    My suspicious mind wonders where the rest of the counterfeit bills are. Or were.
     

    Why put so much effort into thinking about something that you only know about because "the media" made great efforts to publicize the event (George Floyd's death)?

    Why not put your efforts into something that you can't escape whether or not "the media" publicizes it?

    For example: the pandemic (AKA sars-cov-2, covid-19, coronavirus, Wuhan Flu, etc.)
    What suspicions can one have about the pandemic?
    1. It's appearance coincided with the failure of the Democrats' impeachment of President Trump.
    2. It kills older persons. Thus potential Trump voters are isolated and/or dying while younger Democrat voters are allowed to protest/riot/socialize.
    3. The Democrats are gleeful that the pandemic is causing economic woes.
    4. The existence of the pandemic was reported on Chinese social media long before it was picked up by "the media." Why wasn't "the media" screaming bloody murder that international borders needed to be closed to limit the pandemic back in January/February 2020? For that matter, why the hell are we paying billions for the CIA who either was unaware of the pandemic or did not report it to the President and Congress.
    5. Your suspicious mind's turn now ...

    Something else to ponder: Why did "the media" show us one side of the George Floyd story then demand a rush to judgement?

    Replies: @James Speaks

    Attempt at misdirection and obfuscation.

    • Replies: @Coemgen
    @James Speaks


    Attempt at misdirection and obfuscation.
     
    What you are feeling now is called cognitive dissonance.

    It's the first step towards admitting you are wrong.

    Once you can admit you are wrong, you have made the first step towards freedom of thought.
  306. @Chrisnonymous
    @Steve Sailer

    As regards any possible Chauvin-Floyd prior relationship leading to murder, this was the only suspicious bit--Chauvin's first question on arriving at the scene is "is he going to jail?"

    In theory this could be evidence that Floyd knew something Chauvin didn't want him to tell (like something to do with cointerfeit money?). On the other hand, Chauvin's murder technique doesn't seem very foolproof. On the other hand, he would have had to make it look like an accident from a slightly too aggressive restraint... Not plausible at all except for the sawing action Chauvin does with his knee just prior to Floyd going unresponsive.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @James Speaks

    In theory this could be evidence that Floyd knew something Chauvin didn’t want him to tell (like something to do with cointerfeit money?).

    Follow the money trail.

  307. @Steve Sailer
    @Anonymous

    Or why not wait around until some black guy winds up dead while resisting arrest? It's not like you'll have to wait a really long time?

    Replies: @Rob McX

    What’s surprising is that this doesn’t happen more often. In fact, there have been cases where the police were more clearly at fault and no rioting ensued, e.g. the shooting of Walter Scott in South Carolina in 2015. What is strange is the difference in reaction between these cases.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @Rob McX

    That was 5 years ago. Five years of organizing....
    https://www.blackagendareport.com/george-floyd-protests-were-result-years-organizing

    Plus, the specifics have to matter. Protests and riots are like a fire, but to get started you need just the right people to react in just the right way--Minnesotans vs South Carolinians, for example?

    , @Anonymous
    @Rob McX


    In fact, there have been cases where the police were more clearly at fault and no rioting ensued, e.g. the shooting of Walter Scott in South Carolina in 2015.
     
    The police were not “clearly” at fault in the Walter Scott case. Scott was resisting arrest and tussled with a police officer. He may have even gone for the officer’s taser or caused it to go off.
  308. @Hypnotoad666
    @Johnny Smoggins


    It’s refreshing to see. White men should stop treating cops deferentially. Doesn’t mean you have to get in a fight, but it doesn’t mean you owe the cop courtesy either.
     
    If a person in authority has discretion to make your life very difficult, should you: (a) Insult and annoy them, and give them every excuse and motive to f*ck you up even at the cost of having to do a bunch of paperwork?; or (b) Be polite and cooperative so that they have the maximum incentive to make their own lives easier by letting you go with a minor citation or a warning?

    Interacting with the police is basically an IQ test. And the racial differences in the scores are exactly what one would predict.

    Replies: @John Johnson, @black sea

    Birney Jarvis, one of the Hells Angels profiled in Hunter Thompson’s book, and clearly one of the most accomplished and intelligent, pointed out the utility of being polite during a confrontation with police. “Yes sir” and “no sir” go a long way when most of the other people the cops are dealing with are addressing them as “motherf*cker” and the like.

    Jarvis, called “Preetam Bobo” is Thompson’s book, was a 9th grade drop out who went on the become a successful journalist, a Golden Gloves champion, a Black Belt in karate, a sailor, a world traveler, a Mason, and a member of the Coast Guard Auxiliary on the Alabama coast, where he ultimately retired. He was also the inspiration for the TV series, Then Came Bronson,, starring Charles Bronson as a nomadic motorcyclist roaming America.

    I mention all of this because, despite his fairly defiant and hell-raising lifestyle, he was smart enough to avoid arrest by being civil to the cops.

  309. @Rob McX
    @Steve Sailer

    What's surprising is that this doesn't happen more often. In fact, there have been cases where the police were more clearly at fault and no rioting ensued, e.g. the shooting of Walter Scott in South Carolina in 2015. What is strange is the difference in reaction between these cases.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous, @Anonymous

    That was 5 years ago. Five years of organizing….
    https://www.blackagendareport.com/george-floyd-protests-were-result-years-organizing

    Plus, the specifics have to matter. Protests and riots are like a fire, but to get started you need just the right people to react in just the right way–Minnesotans vs South Carolinians, for example?

    • Agree: Rob McX
  310. @Mr. Anon
    @SimpleSong

    He was on both meth and fentanyl. A stimulant and a depressant taken together is known as a Speedball, and is well known to be quite dangerous.

    Replies: @Joe Joe

    Yes, John Belushi found that out the hard way!

  311. @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    They are doing something not too dissimilar though briefly during the process of handcuffing and restraining. But George Floyd was already handcuffed when they (four of them remember) put him down on the pavement. While use of knees might have a purpose, that is not what Chavin was using it for Chavin got knees on Floyd and kept them there for 9 minutes 30 seconds while resting his hands on top of his own legs. It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd's rib cage movement and make it difficult to breath. Take a look at Conor McGregor's breathing being restricted by an opponent's body weight.

    https://youtu.be/iu6n_Xja8mU?t=279

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off--reluctantly-- after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Frank McGar, @Chrisnonymous, @Art Deco

    Hopefully, the other officers’ body cam footage will be released to the public at some point because we can’t actually see Chauvin’s right knee on Floyd’s back. That is something you are assuming because it’s central to the narrative you’ve created in your head about Chauvin asphyxiating Floyd. But we don’t know that’s what’s happening in the video.

    The police criminal complaint against the officers specifically says that Chauvin placed his left knee on Floyd’s neck, but it doesn’t say anything about his right knee. If the prosecutors believed that Floyd died because his breathing was restricted by weight from Chauvin’s right knee, I think they would have put that in the criminal complaint. Instead the complaint seems to be following the coroner’s report, which puts part of the blame for the homicide on neck compression.

    The complaint also says Kueng and Lane were “holding” Floyd’s back and legs. Were a group of people kneeling on him as happened with Eric Garner? It seems unlikely from how the coroner’s report is written, the difference in charges brought against Chauvin and Kueng/Lane, and the way the criminal complaints are written. Again, we’ll have to see the body cam footage to know what really happened.

    I’m guessing that when the trial comes, the issue will be about (1) the total effect of a restraint that was not necessary causing too much stress on Floyd’s heart and (2) the failure of the officers to act to check Floyd’s condition and otherwise protect him. But it won’t be about positional asphyxia per se. As so many people have pointed out, Floyd was already complaining of an inability to breath before he went down on the ground suggesting that he was feeling the effects of oxygen debt in his fragile heart as a result of the panic from the arrest situation (I do believe Floyd was actually scared of going into the vehicle).

    As an aside, while fooling around with friends in a dojo after class, I have had both small adult women and larger adult men standing on my back while I am lying face down. I can attest that a full-grown man standing with all his weight on your back in certain places on your back can restrict your breathing. I can also attest that while this restriction happened, I was able to speak. However, the speaking was strained and could come only in short weak bursts. On the other hand, a full-grown Asian woman can walk on my back without restricting my breathing, and the moans and petitions Floyd was making don’t sound like he was unable to inflate his lungs.

    If you think that Chauvin’s restraint created a mechanical obstruction to his breathing, then get some friends together along with an oximeter. Recreate the scene, and look at the oximeter for the Sp02 to drop. If it doesn’t drop, there is no obstruction to your breathing even if you feel it’s difficult. As I said in a previous thread, I would do this experiment myself, but I literally don’t have anyone I can talk about about this incident.

    • Replies: @Art Deco
    @Chrisnonymous

    Were a group of people kneeling on him as happened with Eric Garner?

    No one kneeled on Eric Garner. The police officer's arm was around his neck for all of nine seconds. He was a very ill man who had an idiosyncratic reaction to an ordinary police tackle.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

  312. @Frank McGar
    @Sean

    I understand your take- he was on top of him for a long time. But in a heightened situation, with a crowd yelling and adrenaline flowing, it's easy to lose track of time. The ambulance also went to the wrong location so what should have been a couple of minutes took a lot longer. The police restraint videos show a very specific position used for restraining people who are in an "excited" or delirious state, and more than likely this was part of their training, which will come out in court. I guess it's possible he was trying to be punitive, but it's hard for me to imagine a cop with almost 20 years experience was trying to kill a guy with a crowd watching and recording the entire thing (as well as police body cams). I think it's more likely that he was using the technique that they commonly use on people who are more "agitated" than normal, and the combination of drugs, anxiety, and too much time passing resulted in his death. If he was putting pressure directly on his airway, Floyd would not have been able to talk and move around for so long.

    As far as the Conor thing I think it's entirely different, as he was placing pressure directly on his chest/diaphragm while Conor was on his back. An argument can be made that the police techniques need to be changed- my main point is that this was part of their training, and as the training videos show the breathing is not restricted.

    Replies: @Sean

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @Sean

    As you probably know, the photo you posted is a screen capture from a video that only shows the first moments of Floyd's restraint. The officers definitely changed position after the moment portrayed here--how much is difficult to say. Later, Chauvin's center is clearly no longer above the middle of Floyd's back, and we can't see where his right knee is. Possibly it's on Floyd but possibly not. And we don't know where Keung and Lane were later. We have to wait until their body cams are released before we know for sure.

    In the mean time, the way the coroner's report and prosecutor's criminal complainants are written seem to make a case that the officers were not putting weight on Floyd's torso throughout the restraint.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  313. The cops are going to be acquitted. Prepare for more riots.

  314. Anon[306] • Disclaimer says:
    @gutta percha
    @J1234

    "“Claustrophobia” as he said?" A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car. People under arrest say all kinds of BS, thinking it's going to help them.

    It's now clear that had Floyd not resisted, he would not have gotten the knee on the neck. This is the main message that all people, black and otherwise, should take away from this. If you choose to resist arrest, you will almost certainly fail, and possibly be injured. This risk is easily foreseeable. Resisting lawful arrest is a bad, bad choice. Perhaps black parents should include this lesson in the legendary "Talk" that they supposedly give all their kids.

    Replies: @Anon, @Art Deco, @Anon

    ““Claustrophobia” as he said?” A peculiar case of claustrophobia, which does not affect him at all in his own vehicle, but only when he is asked to sit in a police car.

    I can completely believe this. I get anxious when I am not driving, but not when I am driving. I’m O.K. in my own car when parked, but if that thing happens where the car locks up because the tires are turned the wrong direction or whatever happens with cars these days, I start to sweat while I try things and read the manual even though rationally I know I’ll eventually figure it out. I have shopped for some sort of keychain window smasher thing, and I would smash my window if anxious. Claustrophobia, by definition, is not rational.

    And remember, he was handcuffed behind his back, which is triggering even out of a car in the middle of a parking lot.

    Don’t try to logic this out: Talk to people who have this or read up on it online. If you don’t have it, your choplogic thinking is not going to come up with the right answer.

  315. @Sean
    @Art Deco


    That’s the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.
     
    Which is a very different thing to saying people with that quantity in them usually die. New users are the ones killed by that amount. But I think we are safe in assuming it was not Floyd's first rodeo. Floyd being killed by that quantity is like a hard drinker being killed by downing an amount of whiskey fatal for a teetotaler.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen’s teeth
     
    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Jane Plain

    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

    Chauvin is a good man, who was trying to do his best in a difficult situation.

  316. Anonymous[109] • Disclaimer says:
    @Rob McX
    @Steve Sailer

    What's surprising is that this doesn't happen more often. In fact, there have been cases where the police were more clearly at fault and no rioting ensued, e.g. the shooting of Walter Scott in South Carolina in 2015. What is strange is the difference in reaction between these cases.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous, @Anonymous

    In fact, there have been cases where the police were more clearly at fault and no rioting ensued, e.g. the shooting of Walter Scott in South Carolina in 2015.

    The police were not “clearly” at fault in the Walter Scott case. Scott was resisting arrest and tussled with a police officer. He may have even gone for the officer’s taser or caused it to go off.

  317. @Anonymous
    @Jane Plain


    Perhaps people here don’t pay attention to mainstream conservatives such as Rod Dreher and Matt Walsh, but I think it’s important to note that they are off the bandwagon.
     
    Off which bandwagon?

    Replies: @Jane Plain

    The “George Floyd may have not been perfect but the police murdered him or if not murdered him he died as a result of police misconduct” bandwagon.

    Walsh has been on fire ever since the riots. He’s taken 50 black pills so he was never really on the Floyd bandwagon but I mentioned him as a normie conservative who’s come to the light.

    Dreher thought Floyd was murdered, but after the video he thinks the police acted correctly. Dreher’s responses are *always* overwrought and childlike, but he is a major voice in conservatardism, so his change of mind is noteworthy.

  318. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:
    @Lot
    @Mr. Anon

    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.

    “ How did you go bankrupt?” Bill asked.

    “Two ways,” Mike said. “Gradually and then suddenly.”

    In retrospect, it will all seem so obvious.

    Replies: @Captain Tripps, @Anonymous

    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.

    Lot, I have to think you are mostly being humorously provocative and hyperbolic with this. Are you?

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Anonymous

    Interesting question. Might not be answerable.

  319. @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    They are doing something not too dissimilar though briefly during the process of handcuffing and restraining. But George Floyd was already handcuffed when they (four of them remember) put him down on the pavement. While use of knees might have a purpose, that is not what Chavin was using it for Chavin got knees on Floyd and kept them there for 9 minutes 30 seconds while resting his hands on top of his own legs. It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd's rib cage movement and make it difficult to breath. Take a look at Conor McGregor's breathing being restricted by an opponent's body weight.

    https://youtu.be/iu6n_Xja8mU?t=279

    I will never understand what Chauvin was thinking for those minutes, he knew he was being filmed, and only got off--reluctantly-- after it was pointed out that Floyd was not breathing. How long was Chauvin intending to kneel on Floyd, as long as it took to kill him?

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Frank McGar, @Chrisnonymous, @Art Deco

    It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd’s rib cage movement

    Thanks for the issue of your imagination. Been an education.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Art Deco

    What Chauvin was trying to achieve, I really cannot imagine. There seems to be an supposition even by the prosecutors that he was not trying to kill, but how long was he intending to stay on top of a cuffed Floyd's back, and to what purpose?


    I am sure everyone is really glad those those four cops did not shoot Floyd, or hit him with their batons or even pepper spray him. No, after they had him handcuffed they--led by an extremely experienced officer--did what was listed by the pathologist report on Eric Garner as "compression of chest and prone positioning". Top Mixed Martial Arts competitors in superb physical condition become worn down lying on mats with one opponent deliberately putting weight on top of them chest to chest. Floyd was cuffed and lying like a wet dishcloth on the pavement with at one point two trained professional law enforcement officers kneeling on his torso and another on his legs.

    Did Chauvin as do this for a few minutes until Floyd was weak as a kitten and begging to be allowed to stand up, or until Chauvin noticed Floyd had suddenly expired. Neither, it was a bystander who pointed out that Floyd had gone from being silent to not breathing. If in such extremely close physical contact Chauvin could not detect Floyd 's breathing stopping, I think that shows Floyd's rib cage movement (his stomach was on a hard surface) had been extremely shallow if not imperceptible for many minutes.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

  320. @Chrisnonymous
    @Sean

    Hopefully, the other officers' body cam footage will be released to the public at some point because we can't actually see Chauvin's right knee on Floyd's back. That is something you are assuming because it's central to the narrative you've created in your head about Chauvin asphyxiating Floyd. But we don't know that's what's happening in the video.

    The police criminal complaint against the officers specifically says that Chauvin placed his left knee on Floyd's neck, but it doesn't say anything about his right knee. If the prosecutors believed that Floyd died because his breathing was restricted by weight from Chauvin's right knee, I think they would have put that in the criminal complaint. Instead the complaint seems to be following the coroner's report, which puts part of the blame for the homicide on neck compression.

    The complaint also says Kueng and Lane were "holding" Floyd's back and legs. Were a group of people kneeling on him as happened with Eric Garner? It seems unlikely from how the coroner's report is written, the difference in charges brought against Chauvin and Kueng/Lane, and the way the criminal complaints are written. Again, we'll have to see the body cam footage to know what really happened.

    I'm guessing that when the trial comes, the issue will be about (1) the total effect of a restraint that was not necessary causing too much stress on Floyd's heart and (2) the failure of the officers to act to check Floyd's condition and otherwise protect him. But it won't be about positional asphyxia per se. As so many people have pointed out, Floyd was already complaining of an inability to breath before he went down on the ground suggesting that he was feeling the effects of oxygen debt in his fragile heart as a result of the panic from the arrest situation (I do believe Floyd was actually scared of going into the vehicle).

    As an aside, while fooling around with friends in a dojo after class, I have had both small adult women and larger adult men standing on my back while I am lying face down. I can attest that a full-grown man standing with all his weight on your back in certain places on your back can restrict your breathing. I can also attest that while this restriction happened, I was able to speak. However, the speaking was strained and could come only in short weak bursts. On the other hand, a full-grown Asian woman can walk on my back without restricting my breathing, and the moans and petitions Floyd was making don't sound like he was unable to inflate his lungs.

    If you think that Chauvin's restraint created a mechanical obstruction to his breathing, then get some friends together along with an oximeter. Recreate the scene, and look at the oximeter for the Sp02 to drop. If it doesn't drop, there is no obstruction to your breathing even if you feel it's difficult. As I said in a previous thread, I would do this experiment myself, but I literally don't have anyone I can talk about about this incident.

    Replies: @Art Deco

    Were a group of people kneeling on him as happened with Eric Garner?

    No one kneeled on Eric Garner. The police officer’s arm was around his neck for all of nine seconds. He was a very ill man who had an idiosyncratic reaction to an ordinary police tackle.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Art Deco

    This Eric Garner case was covered in 2017 by Rolling Stone's N't'l Affairs Desk writer Matt Taibbi in his book - I Can't Breathe- A Killing on Bay Street - I Can't Breathe... - this looks almost like a pattern there

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Can%27t_Breathe:_A_Killing_on_Bay_Street

  321. @Art Deco
    @Sean

    It was purely punitive and intended to restrict Floyd’s rib cage movement

    Thanks for the issue of your imagination. Been an education.

    Replies: @Sean

    What Chauvin was trying to achieve, I really cannot imagine. There seems to be an supposition even by the prosecutors that he was not trying to kill, but how long was he intending to stay on top of a cuffed Floyd’s back, and to what purpose?

    I am sure everyone is really glad those those four cops did not shoot Floyd, or hit him with their batons or even pepper spray him. No, after they had him handcuffed they–led by an extremely experienced officer–did what was listed by the pathologist report on Eric Garner as “compression of chest and prone positioning”. Top Mixed Martial Arts competitors in superb physical condition become worn down lying on mats with one opponent deliberately putting weight on top of them chest to chest. Floyd was cuffed and lying like a wet dishcloth on the pavement with at one point two trained professional law enforcement officers kneeling on his torso and another on his legs.

    Did Chauvin as do this for a few minutes until Floyd was weak as a kitten and begging to be allowed to stand up, or until Chauvin noticed Floyd had suddenly expired. Neither, it was a bystander who pointed out that Floyd had gone from being silent to not breathing. If in such extremely close physical contact Chauvin could not detect Floyd ‘s breathing stopping, I think that shows Floyd’s rib cage movement (his stomach was on a hard surface) had been extremely shallow if not imperceptible for many minutes.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @Sean


    If in such extremely close physical contact Chauvin could not detect Floyd ‘s breathing stopping, I think that shows Floyd’s rib cage movement (his stomach was on a hard surface) had been extremely shallow if not imperceptible for many minutes.
     
    .

    Or perhaps Chauvin was relying on Keung and Lane who both, as the audio transcripts show, say Floyd is still breathing. Without time stamps on the audio it's hard to place these comments. I'd guess at maybe the 70% or 80% of restraint time mark.

    My guess is that the previous commenter upthread who pointed out that the ambulance was late arriving probably identified the issue. Chauvin clearly says in the audio transcript that he intends to keep Floyd in that position until EMS arrives. Ironically, the bystanders shouting at Chauvin and Tao probably made it less likely Chauvin would change strategy and check Floyd's welfare. My guess is that, in general, police like to control situations, so they don't want to be perceived as taking directions from a mob of onlookers, especially when that means apparently conceding that they are messing something up.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  322. @Anonymous
    Floyd's claim to have covid is by itself the end of the murder charge.

    Cops used full immobilization techniques on a drugged up guy who claimed to have the scariest disease in the world.

    Case closed.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @backup

    He claimed to have had COVID. In the coroners report it is reported the COVID test was positive but also that he had tested positive early April. The report explicitly states that this happens quite often and is due to virus residue.

    So the claim is likely true.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @backup


    The report explicitly states that this happens quite often and is due to virus residue.
     
    The report said no such thing. The report found actual virus, not viral fragments. Floyd was probably still contagious and the officers risked their lives.
  323. @Sean
    @Art Deco


    That’s the usual quantity you find in people dead from an overdose.
     
    Which is a very different thing to saying people with that quantity in them usually die. New users are the ones killed by that amount. But I think we are safe in assuming it was not Floyd's first rodeo. Floyd being killed by that quantity is like a hard drinker being killed by downing an amount of whiskey fatal for a teetotaler.

    Death from positional asphyxia is rare as hen’s teeth
     
    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @Jane Plain

    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

    That doesn’t make him guilty of murder.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Jane Plain

    It does and it doesn't. A man is dead, which alters the whole burden of proof. Because Floyd died they can get Chauvin for felony murder, which is what he is charged with. It sidesteps the issue of intent. All they have to do is show Floyd went slightly beyond what the law on use of force allows to begin to commit an assault, and they have him on cast iron felony murder.

    The advice in certain circles is if arrested is to fake having a heart attack. So cops have heard it all before. However, given the signs of drug use (foaming at mouth) and the coronavirus epidemic it was poor judgement to put him cuffed on the pavement with two cops on his back as shown in the above photo. But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @anon

  324. @Art Deco
    @Chrisnonymous

    Were a group of people kneeling on him as happened with Eric Garner?

    No one kneeled on Eric Garner. The police officer's arm was around his neck for all of nine seconds. He was a very ill man who had an idiosyncratic reaction to an ordinary police tackle.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    This Eric Garner case was covered in 2017 by Rolling Stone’s N’t’l Affairs Desk writer Matt Taibbi in his book – I Can’t Breathe- A Killing on Bay Street – I Can’t Breathe… – this looks almost like a pattern there

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Can%27t_Breathe:_A_Killing_on_Bay_Street

  325. @S
    @Buffalo Joe

    I can believe it, though I certainly do wish it were made up.

    Replies: @vinteuil

    I certainly do wish it were made up.

    Be careful about using the subjunctive correctly.It might draw their attention.

  326. @Jane Plain
    @Sean


    Chauvin is a very odd duck.

     

    That doesn't make him guilty of murder.

    Replies: @Sean

    It does and it doesn’t. A man is dead, which alters the whole burden of proof. Because Floyd died they can get Chauvin for felony murder, which is what he is charged with. It sidesteps the issue of intent. All they have to do is show Floyd went slightly beyond what the law on use of force allows to begin to commit an assault, and they have him on cast iron felony murder.

    The advice in certain circles is if arrested is to fake having a heart attack. So cops have heard it all before. However, given the signs of drug use (foaming at mouth) and the coronavirus epidemic it was poor judgement to put him cuffed on the pavement with two cops on his back as shown in the above photo. But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Sean


    But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.
     
    Should the police act in accordance with the dictates of unruly and partisan bystanders or in accordance with police training?

    Replies: @Sean

    , @anon
    @Sean

    But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges

    Ah, now all is clear. Your mind is made up and you do not wish to be distracted with mere facts.

    Thanks!

  327. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:
    @backup
    @Anonymous

    He claimed to have had COVID. In the coroners report it is reported the COVID test was positive but also that he had tested positive early April. The report explicitly states that this happens quite often and is due to virus residue.

    So the claim is likely true.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    The report explicitly states that this happens quite often and is due to virus residue.

    The report said no such thing. The report found actual virus, not viral fragments. Floyd was probably still contagious and the officers risked their lives.

  328. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:
    @Sean
    @Jane Plain

    It does and it doesn't. A man is dead, which alters the whole burden of proof. Because Floyd died they can get Chauvin for felony murder, which is what he is charged with. It sidesteps the issue of intent. All they have to do is show Floyd went slightly beyond what the law on use of force allows to begin to commit an assault, and they have him on cast iron felony murder.

    The advice in certain circles is if arrested is to fake having a heart attack. So cops have heard it all before. However, given the signs of drug use (foaming at mouth) and the coronavirus epidemic it was poor judgement to put him cuffed on the pavement with two cops on his back as shown in the above photo. But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @anon

    But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.

    Should the police act in accordance with the dictates of unruly and partisan bystanders or in accordance with police training?

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Anonymous

    It all depends if they are talking more sense than the training officer (Chauvin) was. If one trusts oneself, an inner voice will be there. It seems to have been for the hapless colleagues of Chauvin, but they did not act on it. Two of the three helping Chauvin are said to have objected to what he was having them do to Floyd. One told Chauvin in relation to the knee on the neck: 'You shouldn't do that'. There are certain circumstances where the normal rules cease to be a good guide as to the extraordinary action required by the dictates of self preservation.

    The kind of resolve needed for telling a training officer he was in violation of proper procedure, or even committing a crime that required intervention in accordance with the lawful duty of a cop, comes from the knowledge each is ultimately responsible for his own fate and given intuition as one part of a practical syllogism. Failure to bear that responsibility in action is what has got the three stooges in a hell of a jam. They are not even going to a Federal prison but a state one where they will be locked up with lifers. One would not wish to be in any of the three's shoes.

    Replies: @Anonymous

  329. @Anonymous
    @JimDandy


    That dispatcher should get the chair.
     
    Why?

    Replies: @JimDandy

    Joking.

  330. @Anonymous
    @Lot


    2020 won’t have anything on 2021.

    No money left to borrow and distribute, COVID vaccines and treatments fail and it mutates, increasingly senile President Biden gets Covid and then covers it up until he’s intubated, Trump self-pardons but is arrested in New York, border caravans of 100,000+ from Central America, Camp of Saints from Haiti, law enforcement budget cuts and strikes.
     
    Lot, I have to think you are mostly being humorously provocative and hyperbolic with this. Are you?

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    Interesting question. Might not be answerable.

  331. @Sean
    @Jane Plain

    It does and it doesn't. A man is dead, which alters the whole burden of proof. Because Floyd died they can get Chauvin for felony murder, which is what he is charged with. It sidesteps the issue of intent. All they have to do is show Floyd went slightly beyond what the law on use of force allows to begin to commit an assault, and they have him on cast iron felony murder.

    The advice in certain circles is if arrested is to fake having a heart attack. So cops have heard it all before. However, given the signs of drug use (foaming at mouth) and the coronavirus epidemic it was poor judgement to put him cuffed on the pavement with two cops on his back as shown in the above photo. But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.

    Replies: @Anonymous, @anon

    But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges

    Ah, now all is clear. Your mind is made up and you do not wish to be distracted with mere facts.

    Thanks!

  332. @Anonymous
    @Sean


    But the duration is the thing that is going to hang Chauvin and his band of stooges. Chauvin continuing to kneel on Floyd for several minutes after bystanders started filming him and asking him to stop; not the act of a man acting in accordance with his professional training, or common sense in relation to what the law allows.
     
    Should the police act in accordance with the dictates of unruly and partisan bystanders or in accordance with police training?

    Replies: @Sean

    It all depends if they are talking more sense than the training officer (Chauvin) was. If one trusts oneself, an inner voice will be there. It seems to have been for the hapless colleagues of Chauvin, but they did not act on it. Two of the three helping Chauvin are said to have objected to what he was having them do to Floyd. One told Chauvin in relation to the knee on the neck: ‘You shouldn’t do that’. There are certain circumstances where the normal rules cease to be a good guide as to the extraordinary action required by the dictates of self preservation.

    The kind of resolve needed for telling a training officer he was in violation of proper procedure, or even committing a crime that required intervention in accordance with the lawful duty of a cop, comes from the knowledge each is ultimately responsible for his own fate and given intuition as one part of a practical syllogism. Failure to bear that responsibility in action is what has got the three stooges in a hell of a jam. They are not even going to a Federal prison but a state one where they will be locked up with lifers. One would not wish to be in any of the three’s shoes.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Sean


    One told Chauvin in relation to the knee on the neck: ‘You shouldn’t do that’.
     
    No he didn’t. Get your facts straight.

    The kind of resolve needed for telling a training officer he was in violation of proper procedure
     
    Chauvin didn’t violate procedure.
  333. Anonymous[190] • Disclaimer says:
    @Sean
    @Anonymous

    It all depends if they are talking more sense than the training officer (Chauvin) was. If one trusts oneself, an inner voice will be there. It seems to have been for the hapless colleagues of Chauvin, but they did not act on it. Two of the three helping Chauvin are said to have objected to what he was having them do to Floyd. One told Chauvin in relation to the knee on the neck: 'You shouldn't do that'. There are certain circumstances where the normal rules cease to be a good guide as to the extraordinary action required by the dictates of self preservation.

    The kind of resolve needed for telling a training officer he was in violation of proper procedure, or even committing a crime that required intervention in accordance with the lawful duty of a cop, comes from the knowledge each is ultimately responsible for his own fate and given intuition as one part of a practical syllogism. Failure to bear that responsibility in action is what has got the three stooges in a hell of a jam. They are not even going to a Federal prison but a state one where they will be locked up with lifers. One would not wish to be in any of the three's shoes.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    One told Chauvin in relation to the knee on the neck: ‘You shouldn’t do that’.

    No he didn’t. Get your facts straight.

    The kind of resolve needed for telling a training officer he was in violation of proper procedure

    Chauvin didn’t violate procedure.

  334. @BenKenobi
    @Kronos

    Trayvon was Saint Skittles, The Innocuous.

    What should ol' Georgie-boy be?

    Saint Floyd, The Breathless?

    Replies: @Kronos, @Ripple Earthdevil, @Rouetheday

    It wouldn’t matter what you tried to label him, he’d still remain an enigma. Or, as he would put it… “I’m not that kinda guy…”

  335. @Sean
    @Frank McGar

    https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/05/29/15/28974730-8369723-image-m-4_1590761223499.jpg

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    As you probably know, the photo you posted is a screen capture from a video that only shows the first moments of Floyd’s restraint. The officers definitely changed position after the moment portrayed here–how much is difficult to say. Later, Chauvin’s center is clearly no longer above the middle of Floyd’s back, and we can’t see where his right knee is. Possibly it’s on Floyd but possibly not. And we don’t know where Keung and Lane were later. We have to wait until their body cams are released before we know for sure.

    In the mean time, the way the coroner’s report and prosecutor’s criminal complainants are written seem to make a case that the officers were not putting weight on Floyd’s torso throughout the restraint.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Chrisnonymous


    In the mean time, the way the coroner’s report and prosecutor’s criminal complainants are written seem to make a case that the officers were not putting weight on Floyd’s torso throughout the restraint.
     
    What do you mean? Please elaborate.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

  336. @Sean
    @Art Deco

    What Chauvin was trying to achieve, I really cannot imagine. There seems to be an supposition even by the prosecutors that he was not trying to kill, but how long was he intending to stay on top of a cuffed Floyd's back, and to what purpose?


    I am sure everyone is really glad those those four cops did not shoot Floyd, or hit him with their batons or even pepper spray him. No, after they had him handcuffed they--led by an extremely experienced officer--did what was listed by the pathologist report on Eric Garner as "compression of chest and prone positioning". Top Mixed Martial Arts competitors in superb physical condition become worn down lying on mats with one opponent deliberately putting weight on top of them chest to chest. Floyd was cuffed and lying like a wet dishcloth on the pavement with at one point two trained professional law enforcement officers kneeling on his torso and another on his legs.

    Did Chauvin as do this for a few minutes until Floyd was weak as a kitten and begging to be allowed to stand up, or until Chauvin noticed Floyd had suddenly expired. Neither, it was a bystander who pointed out that Floyd had gone from being silent to not breathing. If in such extremely close physical contact Chauvin could not detect Floyd 's breathing stopping, I think that shows Floyd's rib cage movement (his stomach was on a hard surface) had been extremely shallow if not imperceptible for many minutes.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    If in such extremely close physical contact Chauvin could not detect Floyd ‘s breathing stopping, I think that shows Floyd’s rib cage movement (his stomach was on a hard surface) had been extremely shallow if not imperceptible for many minutes.

    .

    Or perhaps Chauvin was relying on Keung and Lane who both, as the audio transcripts show, say Floyd is still breathing. Without time stamps on the audio it’s hard to place these comments. I’d guess at maybe the 70% or 80% of restraint time mark.

    My guess is that the previous commenter upthread who pointed out that the ambulance was late arriving probably identified the issue. Chauvin clearly says in the audio transcript that he intends to keep Floyd in that position until EMS arrives. Ironically, the bystanders shouting at Chauvin and Tao probably made it less likely Chauvin would change strategy and check Floyd’s welfare. My guess is that, in general, police like to control situations, so they don’t want to be perceived as taking directions from a mob of onlookers, especially when that means apparently conceding that they are messing something up.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Chrisnonymous


    Ironically, the bystanders shouting at Chauvin and Tao probably made it less likely Chauvin would change strategy and check Floyd’s welfare. My guess is that, in general, police like to control situations, so they don’t want to be perceived as taking directions from a mob of onlookers, especially when that means apparently conceding that they are messing something up.
     
    That is an interesting theory. Equally likely, the existence of the unruly onlookers simply took the officers’ attention away from Floyd. They would have been more focused on him and his well being if they didn’t have to worry about crowd control.
  337. Anonymous[415] • Disclaimer says:
    @Chrisnonymous
    @Sean

    As you probably know, the photo you posted is a screen capture from a video that only shows the first moments of Floyd's restraint. The officers definitely changed position after the moment portrayed here--how much is difficult to say. Later, Chauvin's center is clearly no longer above the middle of Floyd's back, and we can't see where his right knee is. Possibly it's on Floyd but possibly not. And we don't know where Keung and Lane were later. We have to wait until their body cams are released before we know for sure.

    In the mean time, the way the coroner's report and prosecutor's criminal complainants are written seem to make a case that the officers were not putting weight on Floyd's torso throughout the restraint.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    In the mean time, the way the coroner’s report and prosecutor’s criminal complainants are written seem to make a case that the officers were not putting weight on Floyd’s torso throughout the restraint.

    What do you mean? Please elaborate.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    @Anonymous

    I elaborated in a previous comment on this thread. See above. Commenter @Sean chose to ignore it.

  338. Anonymous[415] • Disclaimer says:
    @Chrisnonymous
    @Sean


    If in such extremely close physical contact Chauvin could not detect Floyd ‘s breathing stopping, I think that shows Floyd’s rib cage movement (his stomach was on a hard surface) had been extremely shallow if not imperceptible for many minutes.
     
    .

    Or perhaps Chauvin was relying on Keung and Lane who both, as the audio transcripts show, say Floyd is still breathing. Without time stamps on the audio it's hard to place these comments. I'd guess at maybe the 70% or 80% of restraint time mark.

    My guess is that the previous commenter upthread who pointed out that the ambulance was late arriving probably identified the issue. Chauvin clearly says in the audio transcript that he intends to keep Floyd in that position until EMS arrives. Ironically, the bystanders shouting at Chauvin and Tao probably made it less likely Chauvin would change strategy and check Floyd's welfare. My guess is that, in general, police like to control situations, so they don't want to be perceived as taking directions from a mob of onlookers, especially when that means apparently conceding that they are messing something up.

    Replies: @Anonymous

    Ironically, the bystanders shouting at Chauvin and Tao probably made it less likely Chauvin would change strategy and check Floyd’s welfare. My guess is that, in general, police like to control situations, so they don’t want to be perceived as taking directions from a mob of onlookers, especially when that means apparently conceding that they are messing something up.

    That is an interesting theory. Equally likely, the existence of the unruly onlookers simply took the officers’ attention away from Floyd. They would have been more focused on him and his well being if they didn’t have to worry about crowd control.

  339. @Anonymous
    @Chrisnonymous


    In the mean time, the way the coroner’s report and prosecutor’s criminal complainants are written seem to make a case that the officers were not putting weight on Floyd’s torso throughout the restraint.
     
    What do you mean? Please elaborate.

    Replies: @Chrisnonymous

    I elaborated in a previous comment on this thread. See above. Commenter ean chose to ignore it.

  340. @James Speaks
    @Coemgen

    Attempt at misdirection and obfuscation.

    Replies: @Coemgen

    Attempt at misdirection and obfuscation.

    What you are feeling now is called cognitive dissonance.

    It’s the first step towards admitting you are wrong.

    Once you can admit you are wrong, you have made the first step towards freedom of thought.

    • LOL: Dieter Kief
  341. • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    @Jim Don Bob


    So, who killed George Floyd? He did.
     
    - so - the enlightenment trophy for reason, clear-mindedness and Sam Spade-like intuition accompanied with concise and dense arguing in honor of William of Occam's famous old Razor goes to - - - - - - - Stefan Molineux who very early on wrote (from memory)



    suspect od-s on fentanyl

    resists police attempt to calm him down

    dies



    PS

    Thanks Jim Don Bob - this report you linked to is good indeed
  342. @Jim Don Bob
    https://spectator.org/george-floyd-death-toxicology-report/

    Long but good.

    tl:dr. He did.

    Replies: @Dieter Kief

    So, who killed George Floyd? He did.

    – so – the enlightenment trophy for reason, clear-mindedness and Sam Spade-like intuition accompanied with concise and dense arguing in honor of William of Occam’s famous old Razor goes to – – – – – – – Stefan Molineux who very early on wrote (from memory)

    suspect od-s on fentanyl

    resists police attempt to calm him down

    dies

    PS

    Thanks Jim Don Bob – this report you linked to is good indeed

Comments are closed.

Subscribe to All Steve Sailer Comments via RSS
PastClassics
The “war hero” candidate buried information about POWs left behind in Vietnam.
Becker update V1.3.2
Are elite university admissions based on meritocracy and diversity as claimed?
Our Reigning Political Puppets, Dancing to Invisible Strings
The sources of America’s immigration problems—and a possible solution