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"Deaths of Despair:" Case & Deaton's Book on the White Death
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From my new book review in Taki’s Magazine:

In 2017, 158,000 Americans died from what we call deaths of despair: suicide, overdoses, and alcoholic liver disease and cirrhosis. This is the equivalent of three full 737 MAXs falling out of the sky every day, with no survivors.

The new book Deaths of Despair: And the Future of Capitalism by economists Anne Case and Angus Deaton attempts to explain their important discovery—the declining lifespans of working-class white Americans since the turn of the century—by way of a strained analogy with the social chaos that African-Americans unleashed upon themselves as soon as the civil rights struggle was won for them in the 1960s:

What happened to inner-city African Americans after midcentury is, we shall argue, a foreshadowing of our account of whites in the 21st century….

But the more I study the White Death of the past two decades, the more I am instead reminded of the tragic trajectory of a now much less publicized American race, Native Americans. Like American Indians, working-class white Americans seem to be living, and dying, like a defeated people, quietly offing themselves with so little to-do that nobody even noticed what was happening to working-class white lifespans for the first fifteen years of this century until Case and Deaton came along.ege is that you come from a long line of victims and losers. By intention, this leaves white Americans, the descendants of the men who won The Big One and went to the Moon, psychically dispossessed in their own native land.

Read the whole thing there.

 
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  1. What do they have to fear from the enemies of science? Quite a bit. They might discover that Hispanics have replaced gays as the shock troops of gentrification.

    • Agree: Kronos
    • Replies: @Neuday
    , @syonredux
  2. Znzn says:

    Actually, if I am the Democratic strategist, I wonder how much mileage I can get out of the Trump wants to kill Hispanics, Blacks, and Asians by allowing the coronavirus to continue spreading line, given that all of those have higher death rates than whites.

    • Replies: @bomag
    , @Jack D
    , @Pop Warner
  3. “But at that point, Case and Deaton’s crimestop kicks in and they stop pondering the implications of their own runaway train of thought. Deaths of Despair isn’t a bad book, but it’s constantly derailed by political correctness keeping them from pursuing their own interesting ideas”

    Possibly with the fairly recent example of what happened to US economist Jason Richwine who tried to tell the truth about immigration and its effects on whites. Richwine didn’t resort to political correctness and initially paid the price for reporting his findings.

    By the way, speaking of blacks and lifespans, today, May 6th, is HOF NY/SF/NY CF Willie Mays’s 89th birthday. Can’t say for certain if Sabermetrics would permit him into the HOF (660 HR, 1903 RBI, .302 BA), but Willie was considered one of the best 5 tool players of his era so perhaps that’s worth mentioning.

  4. anon[259] • Disclaimer says:

    …you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?

    Ah, Steve: no death, no despair was ever so bad as finding yourself no longer getting invited to dinner parties.

    For more on this fascinating topic, I recommend Frasier.

    • LOL: bomag
  5. Winning ‘the Big One’ means little if you lose the world. Mr Buzz Mohawk said something the other day that really stuck with me. We’ve seen so many times how history itself is being rewritten. Not only will white people effectively vanish, but their legacy will be imputed to others, if it’s even recognized at all.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-falls-for-its-own-images-of-packed-shores/#comment-3869812

    • Agree: Louis Renault
  6. . . . [t]he social chaos that African-Americans unleashed upon themselves as soon as the civil rights struggle was won for them in the 1960s:

    (emphasis added)

    You made an interesting choice of prepositions to characterize the winning of the civil rights struggle in the 1950-1960s; it wasn’t won by African-Americans, but for them. Was this deliberate and who, in your opinion, won the struggle for (on behalf of?) the African-Americans. In my opinion, the struggle was won mostly by Jewish and “good-white” leaders to teach the “bad whites” (whose descendants are now dying in disproportionate numbers) just where they stood in society. The White Death may be a consequence of African-American victory in that struggle.

    Your comparison of the White Death to the on-going fate of American Indians is quite perceptive.

  7. Your review is remarkably graceful. Writing about these subjects is very tricky, because it is easy to slip into language that most decent Americans would reject without a second thought. You manage to make your points so pleasantly that many readers won’t notice how much you’re violating the regnant norms. My compliments.

    • Agree: Dieter Kief, Sean, Desiderius
    • Replies: @kihowi
    , @Ragno
    , @Thoughts
  8. A couple of other random bits, for your delectation gentle reader.

    Sleep is so important in the Time of Coronavirus. But..

    “Ask yourself how much sleep you lose to a man’s unconscious sense of entitlement?” journalist Lucy Mangan writes in the new issue of the UK’s Stylist magazine. “[It’s] a belief so profound it seems natural to feel his time, his rest, his smooth passage through the world is more important than yours.” One study apparently found women lose three hours of sleep every night because of their selfish male partners.

    Mangan suggests women should resolve this “problem” by giving their boyfriends “a good slap.”
    https://www.rt.com/op-ed/487807-sleep-gap-nightmare-modern-feminism/

    [MORE]

    How do our media mavens decide which early Covid Spreaders shall forever remain unidentified, lest they spread stereotypes as well, and which get the treatment of this guy?

    Dr. Cohen and other doctors at two hospitals northeast of Paris examined samples of patients who had been hospitalized with flulike symptoms in December and January. After setting aside samples of patients who tested positive for other pathogens or who had symptoms inconsistent with Covid-19, the doctors were left with 14 samples to be tested for the new coronavirus. One patient at Jean-Verdier Hospital, in the working-class Paris suburb of Bondy, tested positive.

    The man, Amirouche Hammar, went to the emergency room on Dec. 27, after suffering from cough, fever and headache over the previous four days. Mr. Hammar, 43, was coughing up blood the night before.

    “I had more and more trouble breathing,” Mr. Hammar said. “It was very painful.”

    He was admitted to the hospital’s intensive-care unit and then released after three days when his condition improved. Two of the man’s children, aged 10 and 4, fell ill days after Mr. Hammar. They too were taken to the emergency room and then recovered.

    Mr. Hammar and Dr. Cohen said he likely contracted the virus from his wife, who fell mildly ill around Dec. 20. She works at a fish stand at a large Carrefour supermarket northeast of Paris. Mr. Hammar said the fish stand attracts an international clientele because of its proximity to Charles de Gaulle airport.

    She also works right next to a sushi stand staffed by people of Chinese origin who could have been the source of her infection, Dr. Cohen said.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-timeline-is-upended-as-france-discovers-december-case-11588700408

    • Replies: @Cloudbuster
  9. utu says:

    “So don’t think of Professor Case as just a plain white American: The Cases have only been here for 170 years!” – I was always dubious about Ruth Benedict’s concept of “guilt culture” as in America and “shame culture” as in Japan and that the former was superior. But if she meant that there is not guilt of having no shame in the “guilt culture” then I get it.

    • Replies: @Kyle
  10. Polynikes says:

    Interesting review. Having not read the book and going just by the review, I’ll offer the following: I don’t see the point of even wading into the topic of the plight of whites if you’re going to let political correctness curtail any meaningful conclusions.

    Immigration, more or less, got a populist presidential candidate the nomination if not the outright election, but it still can’t be discussed in academia?

    I’d argue that the dual whammy of automation and globalism was going to apply enough pressure to about kill off the former working class. Piling unending immigration (both increasing the supply of labor and portion of the public lining up to hop on the government dole) just seems cruel. Maybe the history of the US really is one of class warfare.

  11. Mike Tre says:

    I prefer this version of Sailer (insightful and based) compared to the one we’ve had the last 2-3 months (paranoid and obtuse.)

  12. Your comparison between working-class White people and the American Indians is very insightful. It doesn’t have to end the same way though. White people are still in the majority in America, and even just the working class is relatively very sizable, compared to Indians vs. the White man by the end of the 19th century.

    Whites are being defeated by their own cowardice this time, not overwhelming man- and fire-power. It’s a cowardice about being called names, which is pretty shameful. Just as the Indian tribes did not all work for their side, White people are not sticking together. Were they to do so now, there need not be any Ghost Dancing later. When you maintain the basic economy and you have overwhelming firepower, there’s no call for that hippy-dippy Indian crap.

    • Agree: Dtbb
  13. danand says:

    “psychically dispossessed in their own native land”

    Unfortunately we are soon are going to find if “men native to the USA” become more, or less, mentally distressed than others as catastrophe unfolds:

    Economists surveyed by The Wall Street Journal forecast the coming report will show that unemployment rose to 16.1% in April, and that employers shed 22 million nonfarm payroll jobs. This is the equivalent of eliminating every job created over the past decade.

    And unless these trends change, physically the USA will become the land of the Latinos and Asians:

    2BD401EA-A106-4E2D-8911-181E6E6010F7

    I know I’m becoming a broken record on this, but it’s going to take significant safety reassurance to bring back a thriving interactive economy. Instant result testing is the only avenue currently available to provide that.

    Physician talking about the Alere i / Abbott ID NOW 15 minute Covid-19 test:

    Another physician’s experience with the ID NOW tester:

    Abbott Television Commercial for the ID NOW tester. Started showing up in prime time over the last few days:

    • Replies: @miss marple
    , @dfordoom
  14. Inverness says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    We seldom learn anything useful about a given struggle or war by consulting the versions enshrined by the victors. Sadly, that’s often all we have.

  15. utu says:

    OT: Antibody blocks infection by the SARS-CoV-2 in cells, scientists discover
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/05/200504074722.htm

    • Replies: @128
    , @Jack D
  16. I just read the review, Steve. (I have even less reason to read this book now than I did 5 minutes ago. Thanks.) I hope you have a lot of readers on Takimag looking forward to your weekly columns. They are well-written. Anyway, on this one:

    Then, the Mexican cartels switched to buying the chemical precursors of ultra-potent fentanyl from Wuhan, China.

    I don’t keep up with drug-smuggling news like this. Of course, the city Wuhan rings a bell for all of us. With all of the other writing on unz about conspiracy theories, some true, some not, where are the articles on this one? I have read NOTHING about the smuggling of these precursors, with the Chinese and Mexicans being the big players? Boy, that’s a big oversight! What, not enough Americans in the story to disparage?

    • Replies: @ic1000
  17. kihowi says:
    @Tono Bungay

    Steve could advocate genocide and sound reasonable.

    Being reasonable is a strictly white male obsession that nobody in the world shares. I’m reminded of Anders Breivik, an unreasonable man by anybody’s standard, who fell over himself in his manifesto trying to make his mass murder sound like the moderate thing to do.

    I’m not even sure if it’s a good thing. The last fifty years have been a concatenation of whites being bamboozled into harming themselves by supporting what sounded reasonable. Some times require extremism.

    • Replies: @jbwilson24
    , @EdwardM
  18. “After all, you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?”

    Steve? James Watson is on the line!

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  19. “After all, you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?”

    If Dr. Watson is any indication, there is still plenty to fear. And these economists aren’t really near Watson’s caliber as a scientist or in terms of fame.

  20. Dr. X says:

    The white man is the New Negro, sulking in his sharecropper shack, earning minimum wage while foreign workers are brought in to replace him and blacks, gays, transgenders, and women are given preferential treatment in hiring and promotions over him. Employers and government agencies actively despise him and recruit for “diversity.” His women abort his offspring and copulate with blacks. As in Jim Crow, the law and the courts actively discriminate against him, and if he is publicly a Trump supporter he will be humilated, kicked out of restaurants, and spat upon in public. The media and advertising agencies make heroes out of blacks and criminals out of whites. White children indoctrinated by government schools come home crying to mommy, wishing they weren’t white.

    A depressing situation, indeed…

    • Agree: Dtbb
    • Replies: @MBlanc46
  21. anonymous[207] • Disclaimer says:

    They weren’t good quality people. By dying they saved us and the Treasury years of disability and social security payments.

  22. Kyle says:
    @utu

    I had a pretty bad cough the first week of January. I could feel it coming on while I was watching the first news report about corona virus. I assumed it couldn’t have been covid-19 because at the time there were zero documented cases in America. But if this thing was in Paris on December 20th then it was probably elsewhere in the west. Maybe I should get an antibody test.

  23. Jake says:

    Another analogy is in order (in addition to American Indians): that of the English poor widely drinking and despairing themselves to death with the rise of industrialism, which included waves of forced urbanization. The Brit WASP Elites were more than fine with the English poor dying of cheap gin, no medical care worth having, poor nutrition, and despair that their lives were meaningless. Their ancestors had suffered major disruptions but at least they had been able, for the most part, retain meaningful senses of local community and therefore of history and culture. But peoples swept up in London, Liverpool, Manchester, Birmingham,. etc, and away from graves of kin and places that marked being with meaning for families, were ripe to be battered psychologically toward a type of acceptance of slow suicide once they realized that those who ruled them were determined that they remain poor and hopeless.

    And what swept the English working class was not as bad as what had already begun in Scotland.

    The English poor escaped that pattern imposed on them by their WASP Elite betters – the beneficiaries of the largest and richest empire in history – only by serving the Empire as soldier or civil servant or, much better for mental and emotional health fr those able to make a total break, by emigration.

    The Elites of the Anglo-Zionist Empire look at the American white working and middle classes the way, basically, that the Brit WASP Elites looked at the English working class, the non-noble Scots, and the Irish: trash that could be a threat.

    • Agree: Hibernian
    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
  24. @Polynikes

    Polynikes said:

    ” I don’t see the point of even wading into the topic of the plight of whites if you’re going to let political correctness curtail any meaningful conclusions.”

    I agree completely.

    (This is very much like another one of Steve’s favorite examples of the “pulled-their-punches-because-of-PC” phenomenon, Robert Putnam’s “Bowling Alone.”)

    You might be right that the effects of globalization and automation may well have been enough to do it, with or without our insane immigration policy since 1965.

    But I doubt it – I think the effects of runaway immigration, both legal and illegal, were probably the number one factor in depressing the standard of living for lower-middle-class/working-class white Americans between 1970 and now.

    Think about it – immigration meant higher home prices in “desirable” (ie: increasingly unaffordable) school districts as whites everywhere tried to shield their children from “diversity.”

    The Census Bureau currently predicts that by 2050, there will be 439 million people in the United States of America.

    That’s 157. 6 million more people than the beginning (2000) of the period examined by Case and Deaton!

    If we do see an additional 100 million people here in America between now and 2050, one can only wonder what future economists will have to say about the death-by-despair rate of working class Americans then!

    (Look at the bar graph on page 4 of the Census Bureau’s own projections.)

    https://www.census.gov/newsroom/cspan/1940census/CSPAN_1940slides.pdf

    • Agree: Polynikes
  25. Bruno says:

    For an example of people in the up side, this Igbo girl in the UK is incredible :

    – she got 15 A* for A-levels (16 yo exam). I would say it’s too 99.9

    – she got in the medical exams BMAT (//MCAT) top 3% in first section wich is IQ, and 99.8% in second section with is science (basics math, physics, biology and chemistry)

    – she is been admitted to Cambridge and is training to be a neuro-surgeon in London

    – she does videos to motivate black people into elite medicine but has referred to this goal only once in the 10 videos I have seen

    – she is extremelly modest and doesn’t have the typical bragging (Obama like) of intelligent black people and she is very skilled in understanding what is expected from some in a social environement (docimology is the art of high scores and she is very good at it)

    – she has done an extra-ordinary amount of extra curricular activities while at Cambridge

    All of her videos are interesting.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaAOF3fNCSc (The video where she mentioned her Black empowerment objective )

  26. Ganderson says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    One of the great tragedies for black America is that WEB DuBois won his argument with Booker T Washington.

    • Replies: @utu
  27. Anonymous[185] • Disclaimer says:

    A few months ago (at Thanksgiving, of course) I got into a political spat with a gay cousin. He was a big Obama supporter (and campaign volunteer) and of course was a big Bernie fan, and now presumably Biden fan, as well. He of course has eschewed all of his conservative family members to embrace homo loyalty. Never mind that his parents, siblings, aunts, uncles, and cousins – virtually all of whom are Republicans – have stood by him and still love him despite his what-we-used-to-call lifestyle choice.

    And of course he is utterly convinced that every single Trump voter in America wants to kill him – even his relatives, despite him being invited to and welcome at any and every family event for the last 20 years, and not yet being murdered yet even once.

    I explained to him that one Muslim guy had killed more gay men in one hour at a gay dance club in Orlando than had probably been murdered by Trump voters in the last 20 years. I further explained that it wasn’t even the first time that had happened. Based purely on demographics and probability alone, Muhammad Atta and his pals had probably murdered about 150 gays on 9/11. Not exactly because they were gay, but tolerance of homosexuality is one big reason why Muslims hate the West.

    In addition, I explained to pasty white gay cousin that he stands a far greater chance of getting harassed, assaulted, or murdered for his sexuality (or race) in the average Hillary voting precinct than in the average Trump voting one, but he refused to believe me. If hard data contradicts whatever sick fantasy you want to believe, choose the sick fantasy over the hard data.

    So gay cousin and all of his white, gay friends are loyal to a party that wants to import millions more Muhammad Attas and Omar Mateens into this country and that wants convicted felons to vote (including felons convicted for harassing and assaulting gays and lesbians). Why? Mostly because of little spats over political issues of no real significance.

    But my point in all this rant is that white people have spent the last 60+ years undermining the white community. If two gay men or black men or Asian men or Muslim men or Jewish men or Hispanic men show up in a political argument together – either online or in person – they can all assume that they have each other’s back. Straight non-Jewish whites can’t assume that at all. That lack of any sense of loyalty or community with each other explains, to some degree, why whites – especially white men – are dying of despair.

    • Agree: Redman
    • Replies: @Marty
    , @Testing12
  28. Re blacks & suicide- I’ve always thought they were less introspective, and hence, less suicidal. Could be.

    But on the other hand, many black African countries are highly suicidal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

    List of countries by suicide rate

    Food for thought….

    • Replies: @bomag
  29. JackOH says:

    “They just aren’t grateful enough.”

    Hungary under Soviet rulership had one of the highest suicide rates among developed nations IIRC. I don’t recall details of that stat. When apprised of that, one leader responded with the above quip about Hungarians. Don’t know if the leader was Western, Russian, or Hungarian.

    I do sarcasm very poorly. But I can readily imagine an American zillionaire or one of his puppet politicians uttering the same words to describe White Americans who just don’t seem to get the opportunities and challenges presented by penury, “psychic dispossession” ( good phrase, Steve), and hopelessness.

  30. Bruno says:
    @Bruno

    And this video is amusing because she is interviewing 2 white guys who got a parallel admission (meaning less selective and legit) and they explain how they did that (wich is sort of justifying themselves of being there ) :

    TAG means probable Transfer admission graduates

  31. Anonymous[283] • Disclaimer says:

    The real, plain, unvarnished truth is this:

    *NOBODY* BUT *NOBODY* gives a shit about white men.
    White men are truly on their own against the entire world – only many are too pussy or Economist whipped to realise it.

    – and, especially, that includes white women and the white male members of the political class (The Economist). And, that’s before all the other vultures have started tearing at the carcass …..

    The moral here is very very clear, in fact it could not be clearer:

    When in a position of unchallengeable and paramount power, the power holder must *NEVER* but *NEVER* give in to the whines, complaints, pleading and badgering of the weak to have ‘compassion’ or ‘understanding’ of their whining. If the weak want some of your power, let them actually *fight* – a real fight and foot stamping ‘civil rights’ style histrionics – and actually wrest power from your ‘cold dead hands’.

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Neoconned
  32. Anonymous[283] • Disclaimer says:

    A well known truism in psychology is when confronted with frustration the intelligent fall into despair and depression, while the unintelligent become aggressive, violent and psychopathic.

    • Agree: john cronk
  33. peterike says:

    Another obvious analog to the White Death in America is how Russian men drank themselves into an early grave during their defeat in the Cold War.

    It had nothing to do with their defeat in the Cold War. It was because a combination of American and Russian Jews looted the nation and threw people into hopeless poverty and despair, which in the view of the looters was a bonus.

    The Jewish looting of Russia remains one of the great untold crimes.

  34. I certainly don’t feel “despair.” I feel angry and energized by this crisis.

  35. Anonymous[117] • Disclaimer says:

    Weird, in that article Sailer doesn’t even allude to who’s this behind this slaughter of the white working class. For anyone wanting to know who the key players are I would suggest starting with E. Michael Jones’ The Slaughter of Cities.

  36. Letters and half a sentence cut off in outtake fourth line from bottom:

    In 21st-century America, however, the new fashion for asserting your claim to privilege is that you come from a long line of victims and losers.

  37. In truth, though, blacks only comprise about 30% of all victims of police shootings, while committing 57% of gun homicides. That’s not, by the way, because cops particularly want to kill more whites than blacks. It appears to be mostly because suicide-by-cop is much more of a white thing than a black thing.

    Or so the media tell us. In truth, it’s become a kind of article of faith among liberals that practically every time a White man gets shot by the cops, he ‘must have wanted, otherwise it wouldn’t have happened.’ Their proof? Because all cops are White and all Whites are White nationalists, so no White man would ever be shot unless they wanted it! A bit circular, no?

    But at that point, Case and Deaton’s crimestop kicks in and they stop pondering the implications of their own runaway train of thought.

    Deaths of Despair isn’t a bad book, but it’s constantly derailed by political correctness keeping them from pursuing their own interesting ideas.

    I don’t know Case or Deaton well enough to speculate on their personal motives. But here’s one possible explanation for their seemingly strange behavior: since we now inhabit a Soviet-type system where telling the truth too openly can get you in trouble, some sly academics may be using subliminal argument techniques to guide us clandestinely to the truth, in a manner that still gives them plausible deniability. This was said to have been practiced by certain writers, scientists and artists in the Soviet Union, according to my Russian contacts. This manoeuvre is also similar to what Galileo tried to do to evade church censorship of the heliocentric theory: he published dialogues pretending to argue against it using logic that was obviously flawed. (Too obviously, in this case. The church figured out what he was doing and demanded an apology.)

    After all, you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?

    Never having won a Nobel myself, I don’t know. Why not ask James Watson?

  38. slumber_j says:

    “Professor Sir Angus Deaton”…

    Totally not okay: yet another white guy hits the big time ripping off Doctor Professor Longhair.

    • Replies: @Stan
  39. Clue says:
    @Polynikes

    I’d argue that the dual whammy of automation and globalism was going to apply enough pressure to about kill off the former working class. Piling unending immigration (both increasing the supply of labor and portion of the public lining up to hop on the government dole) just seems cruel. Maybe the history of the US really is one of class warfare.

    I used to work for DHS. I can tell you the federal government (in Bush II/Obama admins) facilitated the daily movement of thousands of illegals through U.S. airports. Every day plane loads of illegals would move through major U.S. airports with the blessing of TSA/DHS/USCIS. The largest “through put” would be LAS (McCarran in Vegas). All illegals would have a Mexican Consular card and know the magic phrase to allow them through. They would always have an English-speaking handler with them who knew federal law and policy better than anyone in the group I worked.

    Later I went to work in investigations and backgrounds for DHS hires, particularly U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Service. In the major city I worked I would guess 80% of new hires for judges and officers were naturalized U.S. citizens originally from the third-world and the other 20% were U.S.-born law school graduates with experience working in immigrant causes.

  40. OT: Did you see the story on the discredited Imperial College prof Neil Ferguson violating the very lockdown he advocated to cat around with a married woman?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/05/exclusive-government-scientist-neil-ferguson-resigns-breaking/

    Professor Ferguson was branded an ‘arrogant hypocrite’ by critics today for catastrophically ‘undermining’ the government’s position and there was pressure for the police to fine him for ignoring the lockdown rules he helped create.

    … But Scotland Yard has said this afternoon that while his behaviour is ‘plainly disappointing’, officers ‘do not intend to take any further action’ because ‘he has accepted that he made an error of judgement and has taken responsibility’.

    “Rules for thee, but not for me.”

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8292249/Scientist-Neil-Fergusons-lover-said-lockdown-strained-marriage.html

    • Replies: @Trebitsch
  41. @Polynikes

    “Maybe the history of the US really is one of class warfare.”

    Maybe it’s well-disguised race warfare, and it’s relatively modern history.

    • Replies: @Polynikes
  42. hhsiii says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    By fangraphs WAR, Mays is the 3rd best player of all time by career WAR, wins above replacement, at 149.9. This includes 19th century players (Cap Anson is in the top 30). He missed most of 1952 (his 2nd season) and all of 1953 to military service, and promptly won the MVP in 1954 when he came back. Kinda like Ted Williams, who missed even more time in two wars and actually flew combat in Korea (with John Glenn).

    I got to see Wilie play after his prime. He was still a close to 6 WAR player in 1971 for the SF Giants, 10th best in the majors, at age 40.

    He was traded to the Mets in early 1972 (in MAy, about a month after Gild Hodges, their manager, died of a heart attack), and homered to win his 1st game as a Met, and was still a roughly 2 WAR player but was slipping fast. The Mets won a pennant in 1973 but by then Willie was at the end. And I watched his retirement speech late that year, although he still played through the World Series.

  43. bomag says:
    @Znzn

    how much mileage out of “Trump wants to kill Hispanics, Blacks, and Asians…”

    –Dems already have a 24/7 feed of Trump wanting to kill and roll back civil rights, so this meme will have to stand in line.

    –There could well be a shift in narrative that casts the shutdown as an overreaction, so saying he did too little would not fly well.

  44. 128 says:
    @utu

    Have not you seen all the paid actors from Italy and Spain lately?

  45. Appalachians have been part of the Basket of Deplorables for a long time, as can be understood in Nancy Isenberg’s 2015 book White Trash: The 400-Year Untold History of Class in America (https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B016JPTQ9U/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1)

    On passage from the aftermath of the Civil War in 1865, “one writer for the Atlantic Monthly asked…why should the victorious Union keep ‘the humble, quiet, hard-working negro’ disenfranchised and leave the North vulnerable to the vote of the ‘worthless’ and ‘vicious’ poor whites, who were ‘fit for no decent employment on earth except manual labor’?”

  46. Jack D says:
    @Znzn

    Of course it is all somehow whitey’s fault. It always is.

    Here is an account by a nurse from Nevada of what goes on in NYC public hospitals:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8290251/NYC-nurse-claims-coronavirus-patients-literally-murdered.html

    Her final words of advice are: ” Stay out of New York City for your health care.”

    Outside of the enclaves of the rich, the rest of NYC is a 3rd world country with 3rd world level of incompetency. Actually, worse because it is this crazy polyglot sort of 3rd world country where people from different ethnic groups speak to each other in broken English. Minorities are dying of Covid in part because they are more susceptible to the virus (lack of Vitamin D, obesity and diabetes, etc.) but also because they are being sent to these hospitals that routinely kill their patients even on a good day. They have conveniently banned family members from visiting so they are free to neglect these patients without any oversight and then when they are dead they are delivered to a funeral home where their bodies get neglected some more.

  47. Weirdly, those 158,000 deaths weren’t considered worth shutting down the economy over. Maybe they could have been prevented by mass confiscation of wealth and redistribution to those in threatened demographics, thus relieving their despair. If it saves just one life….

    • Replies: @anon
  48. bomag says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    Related here, I was wondering if the authors looked at apartheid nations after freedom was “won” : life expectancy in South Africa went down by ten years; Zimbabwe saw a fifteen year drop. For comparison, Russia saw a five year drop after communism. (Rwanda had a 25 yr. drop for a spell in the nineties.)

  49. @Mr McKenna

    Lucy Mangan is not hot enough to be that much of a bitch:

    • Agree: fish
    • LOL: Meretricious
  50. Jack D says:
    @utu

    Israelis also report a monoclonal antibody isolation:

    https://www.businessinsider.com/israel-coronavirus-monoclonal-antibody-potential-treatment-2020-5

    However, this is still a long way from being a commercially available therapy.

  51. Nice review/article and may purchase the book through your link, Mr. Sailer.

    Let’s bring movies into this – was effective but bizarre horror movie US trying to make a point that black and white Americans had built their success on the bodies of native Americans?

    All the clones or whatever wore red jumpsuits

    The carnival funhouse was a native american theme in the 1980s and a wizard theme in the 2010s (no i dont know what it means either).

    There is (IIRC) almost zero racial tension between black and white in the movie. In fact, their friends are a similar economic status white family. Some were critical of the shots the filmmaker took at the white families venality and materialism, but it wasn’t that different from.the same being exhibited by the black family.

    The clones were not just white or black, they were black and white. Were there asians or any other race? I I there was a Hispanic man in the clone compound or whatever it was.

    What exactly was that movie saying?

  52. By intention, this leaves white Americans, the descendants of the men who won The Big One …

    Fighting the “big one” is a big part of the reason Whites all over the world are suffering.

    Patton said we fought the wrong enemy.

    • Agree: BenKenobi
  53. Another terrific column/review.

    My only quibble with it is use of the term “losers.” I know we don’t mince words around here, and yes, civilization-wise, those poor folks who got dragged over here as slaves were kind of losers, relative to say, ancient Greece. The same goes goes for “migrants” from Central America. But…

    I think use of this term opens the door to a sort of Tiny Duck/Corvinus counter-argument of, “Well, maybe working class whites are now the ‘losers,’ so perhaps they should quit their whining and get their acts together.”

    • Agree: Fluesterwitz
  54. @hhsiii

    Will Mike Trout surpass Willie in total WAR?

    https://www.mlb.com/news/mike-trout-surging-up-career-war-list-c303409878

    He strikes me as the player most like Willie.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    , @SafeNow
  55. Polynikes says:
    @Jack D

    I didn’t get a ton of “it’s whitey’s fault” from that, but she definitely played up the minority angle. I guess it is the implication. Of course, depending on where she was at in NYC she may have seen mostly minorities being off-ed, but she also neglected to mention that it was most likely a bunch of incompetent non-whitey doctors messing up.

    I’m suspicious of these stories. We all should be. With that said I think this lady’s story notwithstanding, there will be plenty of evidence in the coming months that New York is/was horribly mismanaged and that will be a big reason why they are an outlier. Whether that is top down policy making blunders or just general societal decay is anybody’s guess.

  56. Neuday says:
    @Redneck farmer

    Have you lived among “hispanics”? Just because they chased out the blacks doesn’t mean it’s gentrified. All they’ve done is turn a ghetto into a barrio. Perhaps an improvement but still no place to raise an American family.

  57. anonymous[400] • Disclaimer says:

    People thought life expectancies were going to go up forever but apparently that’s hit a snag. It may have hit its peak and now it is declining. Lifestyle has a lot to do with it apparently. The current lockdown will indirectly kill how many people? This is something imposed from the top down that demoralizes people. The black homicide rate is linked to the amount of freedom accorded to them to do as they wish and that’s what they wish, much as a gas expands to fill whatever enclosed space it is in. Insofar as Native Americans go are there any real ones left? Most are rather mixed by now so who knows what passes for AI these days (a Warren joke could be inserted here). No hope, do dope. The life expectancies of prisoners doesn’t seem to be very high either.

  58. Jack D says:

    Speaking of death, the NYTimes has plotted excess deaths (vs prior year averages) and there is a staggering skyscraper of death in NY (at peak, deaths were running at 6,000 excess deaths/ week) but not much elsewhere. In many states, deaths were actually running below average. Presumably the lockdown (and the lack of scheduled operations in hospitals) drove the death rate DOWN below the usual levels.

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/05/05/us/coronavirus-death-toll-us.html

  59. White men continue to reject their duties as men and refuse to get white women under control, or have families.

    You don’t need to be rich to have kids. Get on welfare and start having babies.

    I see more and more, Indians, Chinese, even Arabs dating white women now, because white men are only interested in going for the pump and dump.

    The end goal of a white man is to shed the bluepill upbringing, become redpilled, and use game to find a satisfactory wife and stay dominant in the relationship.

    White men are failing at this and turning to drugs, or negro culture, or beta culture. It’s a giant shit test and white men are failing badly.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @Stan Adams
  60. Corvinus says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    No, the Civil Rights movement was won by and for protectors of liberty. Remember, Southrons, or “bad whites”, simply could not follow through with the Plessy case. They got greedy with “separate and unequal”. So whites, blacks, Jews, northerners and southerners–they ALL formed organizations dedicated to eradicating segregation. Good riddance!

    “Your comparison of the White Death to the on-going fate of American Indians is quite perceptive.”

    And the irony escapes Mr. Sailer when he remarks “By intention, this leaves white Americans, the descendants of the men who won The Big One and went to the Moon, psychically dispossessed in their own native land.” This land was not “native” to whites, it was violently seized during the Age of Exploration/Colonization, at leas that is how Native Americans would view it. Remember “invade the world, invite the world”?

    • Troll: YetAnotherAnon
  61. Barnard says:
    @Polynikes

    Any attempts to point out the plight of the American Indian is an obvious example of what happens to men when they don’t have meaningful work is met with charges of racism. Why do they want to live in a world with a widespread population base that behaves like Indians on the reservation have for the last few decades? Wouldn’t it be better for elites and less of a threat to the whole system if the masses had something meaningful to occupy their time? It is possible we have reached a point where they are too decadent and disengaged to figure any of this out.

  62. Gabe Ruth says:
    @Jack D

    I keep staring at that daily deaths graph and seeing that weekly spike every Tuesday after the weekend lull, really obvious since beginning of April. The iatrogenic hypothesis for the worst hit areas in the US is a strong contender.

    I have several docs in my immediate family so I take no pleasure in saying this, but maybe our medical establishment should just try doing less.

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    , @Mr. Anon
  63. Thea says:

    Doubt any of these middle aged suicidal whites feel like they won the Big One or had anything to do with the moon that happened before they were born. That’s part of this ( my) generation’s problem – no great victory or accomplishment while watching your culture slide away.

    Anyhow the moon landing, as we now know thanks to Hollywood, was all due to a group who were decidedly not white men.

    • Replies: @Anon
  64. @Jack D

    Speaking of death, the NYTimes has plotted excess deaths (vs prior year averages) and there is a staggering skyscraper of death in NY (at peak, deaths were running at 6,000 excess deaths/ week) but not much elsewhere. In many states, deaths were actually running below average.

    I’d be careful about that comparison. Current year numbers are probably backlogged because of the lockdowns. Between schools being closed, school-age children needing to be cared for and government employees goofing off telecommuting, I expect productivity levels among our unelected masters – not high in the first place – have plunged into the abyss.

  65. Coronnovirus – Doing the opposite of Affirmitard Action Diversity since 2019!

  66. moshe says:

    OT:

    Is there any updated information about what percentage of the population is already “infected”?

    If you include kids (who more or less either can’t get or transmit the virus) I would guess that 50% of New Yorkers are already immune.

    Have more studies been done since NY and Miami over a week ago? This seems pretty important.

    If indeed we pretty much all already have it or will get it within a week of going outdoors maybe instead of everyone wearing cheapo masks that prevent them from “spreading it”, people who believe that they are vulnerable should wear the N95 mask in an effort not to “catch it”.

    I am ambivalent about the quarantine (because I believe it may have side benefits, not because I think it makes sense regarding Covid) but I am rather strongly opposed to mask wearing (and the social distancing philosophy) among those people who ARE going outdoors and returning to public life.

    This is a religious philosophy and a religious ritual and it should not be forced to by the public.

    Question: Saying to the police that mask-wearing goes against our beliefs would go over better if we can claim that our beliefs are associated with some religion or other. Alternatively some medical condition or other. “Personal conviction” will have less and less sway in our increasingly Right Thinking world so it’s best to tie your personal conviction to some religion or medical belief. Any come to mind?

    • Replies: @anon
  67. drawbacks says:

    Native Americans pushed to the margins.
    Naïve Americans’ turn next.

  68. Ragno says:
    @Tono Bungay

    And yet, this reality remains: were this review written fifteen or twenty years ago, the book’s authors would be far likelier to address Steve’s points of contention, however thorny the bramble bush they’d be entering to do so.

    But now?

    Piece of cake to ignore any of the points raised, which would also save them the unpleasantness of dismissing said points. However – if cornered, on camera or before a microphone – rest assured that any answer they might offer would be peremptory, with the questioner (in this case) slimed with the usual “white supremacist-slash-hate” associations which have the curious effect of pre-empting every other part of the discussion. That’s why their analysis comes prebundled with as many escape hatches as it does.

    Yes, but doesn’t such an approach hinder if not undermine scholarly/scientific inquiry? Don’t be silly. That’s the next Nobel winner’s lookout; in 2020, the foremost objective of any study such as this is – if you’ll pardon the French – to stay off the SPLC’s shit-list.

  69. “white Americans, the descendants of the men who won The Big One and went to the Moon”. But this is naive socio-political history. The people committing suicide are the descendants of indentured servants and imported cheap labor – they are not the same “people” who ‘went to the Moon’.

    Fordism and WW2 created some contingent solidarity between classes but once that was surplus to Capital’s requirements it has vanished, and we’re back to the previous norm: no one (who matters) cares about these people.

    I would go further and say maybe those poor whites would have been better off long term if they’d persisted with the kinds of inter racial alliances of the early Progressive movement – but I realize that won’t be a popular opinion here and it’s speculative.

    • Replies: @botazefa
  70. fish says:
    @Corvinus

    Oh Corby….you so KKKrazy.

  71. Bruno says:

    The problem with your explanation is that

    1) The phenomenon is even worse in Japan or Korea where they have no brown people and no magician jews to make them feel guilty about minorities suffering . And no migrants.

    2) I don’t see how saying « we are miserable because of brownies » is different from their own complaint (« we are victim of white racism »). Same fake exculpation

    So the explanation doesn’t make any sense

  72. Alfa158 says:
    @Corvinus

    “separate and unequal”.
    And that right there is why segregation was not sustainable. It has proven literally impossible to have separate but equal facilities for different races, they are always going to be unequal. Even if you start with schools, residential communities, public facilities and so forth that are physically identical and receive the same levels of public funding, segregated facilities will sort themselves into different levels of quality. Amos ‘n Andy World never developed into reality.
    Half a century of experience has demonstrated that Black areas will be worse than Hispanic, Hispanic will be worse than White and White will be worse than East Asian in educational achievement, income, crime rates, intact families, etc. no matter how much you try to move people in and out of Larry Niven style “magic dirt” regions.
    This has resulted in the scramble to intermix high performance people in with lower performance people to try and level the field and hide the obvious, and the resulting panic over the growing shortage of Whites for that purpose. School integration died in Los Angeles when the school district ran out of the supply of White children due to demographic replacement. We’ll see if Asians will put up with being used as the new moderating medium.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    , @Corvinus
  73. @danand

    How is longevity calculated? I’d expect a higher infant mortality rate for Hispanics which wouldn’t affect longevity statistics but what about violent deaths of adolescent males?

    • Replies: @anon
  74. Abe says:

    I happened to catch this very long documentary- really promo- about the making of Metallica’s “black” album . One shock was discovering I like Metallica’s polarizing (in Metallica fan circles, at least) long-time producer Bob Rock. My god, Bob Rock is his given Christian name, not some douchey made-up trade name (“Bob’s the name, rock’s my game… and, uh, name too now that I think about it”). And gosh, he seems like a pretty cool or at least reasonable guy, not the mediocrizing Svengali of hard-core fan legend (he’s also strinkingly- no homo- handsome, basically a somewhat better-looking Michael McKean as David St. Hubbins/former-SPINAL TAP frontman turned record producer clone).

    What was really shocking to me, though, was watching this part of the documentary where the album goes to press. My God, they still made cassettes and vinyl records then! My God, they made them in Pennsylvania. My God, look at all those white guys in ties and dress white T-shirts with pocket protectors (or, at least a bunch of pencils and other stuff in their pockets). They look positively middle class. They look like they might own their own homes. They look like they might have some kids they’ll soon be sending to college. And all by actually making stuff in America? Something must be done about this right away!!

    (link might not work, so scrub ahead to 1:18:42)

  75. Daniel H says:

    So, regarding immigration, Denton and Case understand perfectly well that mass immigration has been a disaster for all working class people, but because of good-white politesse they can’t state so. Reason and truth has clearly failed with these people and their ilk, so it is simple as this: good whites and repub/cuck whites must suffer for any progress to be made. Case and Denton will never suffer because they are famous enough and wealthy enough to buffer themselves from any fallout, but there are millions of followers/admirers of such as Case and Denton who may really start to suffer as this economy seriously declines. You should applaud and welcome this, even if it means that your own family and friends will suffer too. Good whites, repub/cuck whites will never follow truth and reason, but they will eventually follow self interest. Good whites must suffer. Only when they and their children are suffering grievously will they join with working class white and end the absolutely cruel policy of mass immigration.

  76. Another defeated race: the Germans.

  77. @Znzn

    The more people who die of the rona, the better democrats look in November. It’s why they were claiming that racism was the real virus while Pelosi went parading through Chinatown and de Blasio told people in early March to go to the movies

    • Replies: @peterike
  78. @Jack D

    I wonder how many of the saved lives were people not driving, and how many were people not getting the seasonal flu.

    Traffic deaths went up after 9/11 because people were scared to fly and did the statistically riskier act of driving.

    The death toll from the cancer deaths and traffic deaths etc indirectly related to 9/11 add up to more than died in the terrorist attack.

  79. Who picked the stock photo of a black guy tormented by a pile of red pills to illustrate White addiction to Oxycodone?

  80. The lockdown is so tenaciously popular because the atomized are so desperate for company in their misery. It validates what they were already doing but feeling uneasy/guilty about. There is strength in (even forced) unanimity.

    • Agree: john cronk
    • Replies: @dfordoom
  81. anon[117] • Disclaimer says:

    My guess about the relative lifespans is that, on an overall basis, asians have a simpler, more pragmatic, direct and self-centered view of life than whites and better nutritional habits, hispanics are less intelligent than whites and a happier, less circumspect mindset and less challenging lifestyle, whites have fairly high expectations for themselves and are most prone to taking in consideration of the big picture,their place in it, and worrying about it, blacks have lower intelligence and poor health habits, as do native americans.

  82. anon[250] • Disclaimer says:

    Case and Deaton note in passing that life expectancy for Russian males declined by 7.3 years between 1987 and 1994. But since 2005, Russian life expectancy has rebounded.

    Unlike white Americans, Russian men are not continuously told they are evil by their own government and the infotainment directorate. Maybe that’s part of the difference?

  83. “psychically dispossessed”

    Thanks, Steve. This is it precisely.

  84. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    William Howard Mays, Jr.

    Named after (his father who was named after) GOP and Cincinnati great William Howard Taft.

    Speaking of Cincinnati, for what it’s worth have seen four Trump flags flying this week. First Trump paraphernalia I’ve ever seen in public anywhere that I can recall, although regular Joes like to talk about Trump once they can tell you’re not an idiot.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  85. @Jack D

    It is our great misfortune as a nation that the main impact of the virus was in the Imperial Media Capital. If there were 23,000 excess deaths in Appalachia it would be a big yawn, accompanied by a couple Op-Eds about how it was due to their backwardness.

    Also, the NYT conspicuously failed to break out the “excess death” numbers by age, which would have been very interesting.

  86. People with high self esteem (to the point of narcissism) think they are invincible.

    People with low self esteem think they are irrelevant.

    Both types come to the same conclusion about their lives for quite different reasons-that nothing they do has any effect, either good (low self esteem) or bad (high self esteem).

    The entire purpose of jewish liberalism in the US (and world) is to shame and demoralize whites into acquiescing to hebrew leadership. This is why big US media, tech, corps, gov, etc treats whites like the Israeli Govt/society treats Palestinians. IE that since they are eternally guilty of crimes (remember the 6 gorillion/ slavery/etc) they “deserve” what happens to them.

    Whats funny is that the best cure for low self esteem isn’t asking your tormentor to stop…it’s standing up to them. That was the secret, forbidden, dangerous appeal of Trump. He was (during the campaing) the first person to stand up to the media, the courts, the establishment, the world, etc. To tell the guilt trippers, the pearl clutchers, the think piecers, etc to stfu.

    The problem today is that many of these “torments” are built into not just society, but the law. While legal solutions are possible, at this point extralegal ones are more likely to be both more effective and necessary, in the long run

  87. you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?

    Ask James Watson.

    • Agree: Bruno
  88. Q: What do they have to fear from the enemies of Science?
    A: This blog has chronicled a long list of tenured, Nobel-Prize-Winning professors who have been “un-personed”/”disappeared” for mentioning “That-Which-Must-Never-Be-Said”.

  89. Anonymous[366] • Disclaimer says:

    An even deeper phenomenon is this:

    A large proportion of young white men, especially of the more sensitive and intelligent type, fully realise and intuit that the USA is no place for white men, and reality will only worsen for white men in the future. This will inevitably lead to a blunting of the procreation instinct where the better type of white man fully realises that any future sons or grandsons will be the hated put upon bitches of The Economist new order.
    Therefore, to save their male offspring from lives of pain, humiliation and degradation they fully refuse to become parents. The consequences of this will be rapid and extreme in ensuing generations, inevitably leading to a demographic collapse in young whites of astonishing proportions.

    The correct analogy is with proud wild carnivores which totally ‘refuse’ to breed in captivity.

    • Agree: Stan d Mute
    • Replies: @dfordoom
  90. @Mr McKenna

    “Not only will white people effectively vanish, but their legacy will be imputed to others”

    I’m a marginal (okay, sub-marginal) player in an industry that can best be described as cultural propaganda. This has been an ongoing project for the past few years. Shock troops with law degrees and financial sector pedigrees from the Obama orbit have been working like intelligence operatives with racialist agendas to shift consciousness. Call it Mockingbird Redux. Allen Dulles and James Jesus Angleton have been replaced by Eric Holder and Valerie Jarrett.

    • Agree: Meretricious, Polynikes
    • Replies: @fish
  91. Polynikes says:
    @Abe

    Good find. Interesting enough, heavy metal itself is (or at that time “was”) a very white, middle-class endeavor. Behind some of the ridiculous cartoon-ish skull imagery are tons of songs with religious, mythological and literary references. The type of stuff middle class white kids who come from Christian communities might learn at public school growing up in America or England in the 70’s and 80’s. The themes are often more complex and draw heavily from a shared history more than their anti-authoritarian sound and stance might project at initial impression.

    Sure enough if you start flipping through the backgrounds of the members of some of the largest bands back then you’ll see that a heavy majority come from middle-class or working-class upbringings. Often enough the jobs their parents had allowed them to get a few stray piano lessons or join the band at the local public school, or maybe even get a guitar as a present as a youngster. These very much seem like the types of families and communities that are falling by the wayside described in Steve’s review.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
  92. notsaying says:
    @Abe

    I find myself looking at the background people and things in movies and TV shows more and more. One of things that you realize — like you did — or are reminded of is how much better life was even 20 years ago. The skyline of New York was so much more beautiful before all the big residential towers crowded everything out.

    Sometimes I notice things though that make me feel bad. That happened just last week while I was watching Ken Burns’s documentary on the Roosevelts. It showed Franklin Roosevelt at Hot Springs mixing in with and enjoying all the other patients. What I realized was that all the other patients were white and I thought of all the black people with infantile paralysis who would have benefitted from the therapy and activities too. Ouch. I wouldn’t have noticed that a few years ago, I am sorry to say.

    In any case I hope that you find, like I have, that the more you notice, the more you notice.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  93. @Hypnotoad666

    “It is our great misfortune as a nation that the main impact of the virus was in the Imperial Media Capital.”

    This thought has been making the rounds. And we know the NYC-DC Media Hive would have presented the virus impact in the marginal territories as the the second or third story in their outlets. But maybe NYC being the epicenter of a more virulent strain of the Fu Manchu Virus was by design. Konspiracy Korner is now closed.

  94. “any future sons or grandsons will be the hated put upon bitches of The Economist new order.”

    That outcome is a choice, not an inevitability.

    If you stand up for yourself, many things are possible.

    If you don’t, nothing is.

    On a related note, what kind of person person decides to have kids based on what a magazine thinks…

    • Agree: fish
  95. anon[117] • Disclaimer says:

    Consider:
    The U.S. Congress is controlled by powerful vested interest money
    Out of control kritarchs
    Political Correctness, suppression of free speech and assembly
    Censorship and control of media by leftist and corporate interests
    Control of academia and research by those same interests
    Control of dietary and medical advice through the AMA, ADA, etc. by vested interest finding
    The power of Big Agriculture and the food industry
    The power of Big Pharma and corruption of the FDA
    Decades of government intervention in daily life, promoting the interests of sub-groups based on ethnicity, gender, origin, sexual orientation, etc. instead of personal merit and capability.
    Decades of the corrupt political and mercantile partnership allowing illegal immigration to weaken rule of law and the IQ of the population, and devolve middle class culture to suit the desires of the interlopers, who overwhelmingly come from places with lower standards and/or populations with habits, philosophies and abilities that do not compare favorably to those of America’s western european forbears’ cohort.
    Decades of poor health of most of the population due to poor diet, and expensive maintenance of these unhealthy people
    Politically-motivated, scientifically-ignorant response to corona, resulting in financial catastrophe

    I don’t know if we’re getting early to bed and early to rise, but we’re certainly unhealthy, unwealthy and unwise.
    Western Civilization is over the edge and making its way down the slope. We can hope that it’s a shallow enough slope that things won’t become too much worse in the near future . But don’t count on it.
    This corona meltdown and history in general shows us how, after the situation is allowed to weaken for a long time, collapse can come very quickly.

  96. Stan says:
    @slumber_j

    People are always looking for the chance to litter.

  97. dearieme says:

    Sir Angus’ wife, Anne Case, … was born in America, but her ancestors came from Ireland to northeastern Pennsylvania in the middle of the nineteenth century, and her family remains influenced by their national and religious heritage.

    Lady Deaton (does she style herself thus when visiting Britain?) does not reveal which tribe of mendacious scoundrels she’s descended from. There were (at least) three tribes in Ireland – which was hers?

  98. @hhsiii

    The Mets won a pennant in 1973…

    …by the competitive equivalent of food stamps. Their record was 82-79, in a “division” with no other winning teams. They had the fourth-best record in the league, a half-game better than fifth. They were not the ’54 Giants.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    , @Barnard
  99. J.Ross says:

    It’s interesting that the establishment’s frequently demonstrated stock response to this is reptilian pitilessness (from the same geniuses who were just babbling about “empathy”) and “revealing” that what the whites are really complaining about is a dramatic concrete decline in living standard (and physical safety), as though that was some hypocrisy.
    ——–
    lockdown themesong:

  100. J.Ross says:
    @notsaying

    This this this. I couldn’t laugh at the Rifftrax (~MST3K) treatment of a Thanksgiving filmstrip from the 40s or 50s where a guy, who owns his own home, owns his own business, and has a loyal wife who has given him multiple children, hasn’t made enough money to buy a turkey for the holiday dinner, but uses the occasion to impress upon his family the importance of the holiday and American greatness. The snark crumbles and blows away like dust before such virile dignity.

    • Replies: @notsaying
  101. peterike says:
    @Pop Warner

    The more people who die of the rona, the better democrats look in November. It’s why they were claiming that racism was the real virus while Pelosi went parading through Chinatown and de Blasio told people in early March to go to the movies.

    I wouldn’t give de Blasio that much credit for being Machiavellian. The man is an obvious idiot. Pelosi, on the other hand…

  102. In 2017, 158,000 Americans died from what we call deaths of despair: suicide, overdoses, and alcoholic liver disease and cirrhosis.

    So, altogether, not many more deaths than in a bad flu season!

    By intention, this leaves white Americans, the descendants of the men who won The Big One and went to the Moon, psychically dispossessed in their own native land.

    Who would imagine the Manhattan Project and Apollo Program participants were so fecund?

    I googled searched for “psychically dispossessed” (between quotation marks) and one of the 32 results was Sailer’s book review, after an ad for psychic readings, an interpretation of a Bob Dylan song, and a book about dance but that seemingly talks about non-men trapped in men’s bodies, or something.

  103. Love the line: “Anne Case was born in America, but…” Almost like she’s apologizing for committing a crime. I guess she respects fairy rings so that makes her Irish.

    Professor Sweaty Sock and his American-in-passport-only wife should team up with Raj Chetty to truly get to the bottom of inequality in America. Tax returns + open borders big brains should point us to the correct conclusions that we could never arrive at.

  104. From a commenter on a Yahoo News story about the Flint Family Dollar killing, sarcasm done deftly:

    Longrod 19 hours ago

    Before you get too bent out of shape, I think this would be a wonderful opportunity to pause for a moment and give thanks for

    a) the many great contributions of the black community and their culture to our society.

    b) Their peaceful and generous nature makes them ideal neighbors, lending testimony to their exceptional family values and parenting skills unrivaled by any other culture.

    c) Their commitment to academic excellence enriches our schools and serves as an example to all who hope to achieve prominence as a people.

    d) Real Estate values are fueled by the influx of North American blacks into an area due to their caring and respectful nurturing of these communities, an example of all they have achieved by their enthusiasm for self-improvement through hard work and a self-reliant can-do nature.

    e) Truly without their industrious and creative drive, we would be poorer as a nation.

    Presently enriching the cities of Spokane WA, Chicago IL, Philadelphia PA, Washington D.C., St. Louis MO, New Orleans LA, Los Angeles CA, **Flint MI**, Baltimore MD, Pontiac MI, Gary Ind., Newark NJ, Cleveland OH, Atlanta GA, Richmond VA, Memphis TN, Birmingham AL, Camden NJ; and let’s not forget Detroit, the tourism capital of the world!

    • Replies: @Rob
  105. anonymous[387] • Disclaimer says:

    Steve,

    A couple of questions to be spread over several posts.

    Are you really saying that the unrelenting spiritual pollution that is the heart of Cultural Marxism is the real driving force here but afraid to??? Sure the Sacklers are the most obvious purveyors of the WHITE DEATH, but what about all aspects of Jewish controlled media and academia.

    Wow what else happened around 1965 besides the Civil Rights and Immigration Acts? How about the breaking of the decades old decency codes by Hollywood. Just why are whites for the last 60 years been unable to act in their collective interests to stop open borders and as EMJ likes to say “The Slaughter of Cities”??? It has to be the unending beat down from Cultural Marxism.

    Is there any mention by Deaton and Case of Cultural Marxism??? Of course not they would get thrown out of academia.

    But lets be honest, there is nothing that Deaton and Case has presented here that was not predicted by Dr. William Luther Pierce 30 years ago. Dr Pierce died 18 years ago just as the opioid crisis was taking off. Listen to his old shortwave broadcasts like I did a couple of years ago for the first time if you do not believe me.

    I know several people who have recovered from opioid addiction. They may claim that the key to recovery was solely an embrace of some sort of Christianity and some sort of 12 program. But increasingly there is an awareness of the term Cultural Marxism and a conscious recognition and rejection of it in all its forms. And they know who is behind it, white Zoomer males especially. These folks are not meek and mild turn the other cheek types they are increasingly over turn money changers and clean out the temple Christians.

  106. botazefa says:
    @blank-misgivings

    Fordism and WW2 created some contingent solidarity between classes but once that was surplus to Capital’s requirements it has vanished, and we’re back to the previous norm: no one (who matters) cares about these people.

    You nailed it!

    As ever it has been, the rich are the problem. Only thing they respond to are the tattered pitchfork bearing masses. Unfortunately for us working class males are a bag of pussies.

  107. @Hypnotoad666

    …the Imperial Media Capital

    What decade do you live in? NYC has long been eclipsed by Los Angeles, London, and even Atlanta.

    • Replies: @Hypnotoad666
    , @anonymous
  108. Mark G. says:
    @Corvinus

    No, the Civil Rights movement was won by and for protectors of liberty.

    I can remember as a small child in 1961 sitting at a swimming pool with my mother and several of her friends. I asked my mother why there were no colored people there. There was sudden silence and all the adults looked embarrassed. Segregation ended because most middle class whites no longer wanted to defend it, were embarrassed by it, and just wanted it to go away.

    There was hope at the time among whites that once segregation ended blacks would peacefully integrate into white society. Many whites were dismayed when blacks went on a crime spree starting in the late sixties. They were dismayed when blacks rejected white middle class culture and celebrated black thug culture. Whites, like my parents, were forced to abandon their homes and move elsewhere to get away from this. The situation might have been tolerable for whites if forced segregation had been replaced by freedom of association because they could have maintained at least some distance from misbehaving blacks. Instead it was replaced by forced integration with many white children traveling miles a day on a bus to school along with various other forms of forced integration.

    True protectors of liberty would object to forced integration just as much forced segregation.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  109. @Reg Cæsar

    The ’54 Giants weren’t all that either. What they did manage, was to sweep CLE who had won 111 games that season with three 20 game winning P’s. The ’73 Mets actually had some talent. Rusty Staub, HOF Tom Seaver, Jerry Koosman, among others. They managed to beat CIN, “The Big Red Machine” in the NLCS, and took OAK to 7 games in the WS.

    • Agree: hhsiii
    • Replies: @hhsiii
  110. Barnard says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    They also went on to beat the 99 win Cincinnati Reds in the NLCS and went to seven games in the World Series with the A’s. It was similar to the NY Knicks staggering into the 1999 NBA playoffs as the 8 seed and then making the NBA Finals. It is rare for teams who barely make the playoffs to go on big runs, but it does happen and regular seasons results don’t diminish that accomplishment.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  111. anon[250] • Disclaimer says:
    @LoutishAngloQuebecker

    White men continue to reject their duties as men and refuse to get white women under control, or have families.

    How’s your family doing? Your wife and kids ok?

    You don’t need to be rich to have kids. Get on welfare and start having babies.

    How many children do you have?

    I see more and more, Indians, Chinese, even Arabs dating white women now, because white men are only interested in going for the pump and dump.

    Aren’t you a white man by that definition, i.e. only going for the pump and dump?
    Or are you recently married?

    The end goal of a white man is to shed the bluepill upbringing, become redpilled, and use game to find a satisfactory wife and stay dominant in the relationship.

    So how’s your relationship with your wife going?

    White men are failing at this and turning to drugs, or negro culture, or beta culture. It’s a giant shit test and white men are failing badly.

    Tell us more, perhaps provide a URL to your website or an email address where we can sign up for your newsletter!

  112. @Desiderius

    In Presidential elections, OH remains, (and has for the longest time been) a bellweather state.

  113. @Gabe Ruth

    “I keep staring at that daily deaths graph and seeing that weekly spike every Tuesday after the weekend lull”

    Same in UK, I assume The Great British Weekend and the admin staff only catch up with collating the deaths by Tuesday.

    Traditionally the weekend is a bad time to be in an emergency situation, because doctors like a day or two off like everyone else. So quite a few specialists will be missing.

    • Replies: @Black-hole creator
  114. Interesting article. Nobody talks much about the tragedy of most people being left behind by the on-going changes in our civilization. Something like 50% of jobs are already completely obsolete, especially in the States due to outsourcing. Factories that were manned by thousands ~20 years ago are now staffed by dozens + robots. On the other hand, a man in America has been defined primarily by his work, more so than anywhere else in world. No good job prospects, destructive elites, no strong safety net – quite a few obstacles to deal with.

  115. @hhsiii

    Willie Mays put up pretty huge numbers at a time when pitchers were relatively dominant. The play he made on Vic Wirtz’ fly ball 450+ feet in the Polo Grounds which would have been a towering home run in any actual baseball stadium may well be the single greatest defensive play ever.

  116. Peter Frost says: • Website
    @Corvinus

    And the irony escapes Mr. Sailer

    His irony was intentional. You were the one who missed it.

    • Replies: @dearieme
    , @Corvinus
  117. Anon[236] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thea

    Doubt any of these middle aged suicidal whites feel like they won the Big One or had anything to do with the moon that happened before they were born.

    https://facesofsuicide.com/

    “It has been often said, very truly, that religion is the thing that makes the ordinary man feel extraordinary; it is an equally important truth that religion is the thing that makes the extraordinary man feel ordinary.” ― G.K. Chesterton

    Be sure to read E. Michael Jones’ recent encounter with with a suicidal black woman on the bridge in South Bend: https://culturewars.com/news/god-has-a-plan-for-your-life

    The human heart is complex and many-layered. Many suicides are caused by mental problems and thus they are not fully responsible for the act. God in His mercy will get them in to Heaven if their fundamental option had been been for love and life, not death, and they did not despair of God.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
  118. @Alfa158

    “It has proven literally impossible to have separate but equal facilities”

    Of course, unseparated but equal turns out not to be possible either.

    It might be that the problem lies in this so called “equal” part …

  119. dearieme says:
    @Peter Frost

    Yeah, and he doesn’t understand “native” either. Hardly worth bothering with, is he?

  120. @YetAnotherAnon

    I think the local Tuesday death peaks are much more likely due to quirks in accounting. It is not like the stats are updated in real time, somebody compiles them regularly and that somebody probably has a week-end off.

    But I can easily believe the chaos and mismanagement going on in NY hospitals. Another very significant factor increasing the mortality rate is the absence of support from family members. You need somebody by your side to make those cynical doctors work. They literally have no incentive to fight for your life. I had a pretty bad pneumonia thirty years ago and until my family showed up a few days later I felt like a nuisance to the hospital staff.

  121. Mr. Anon says:

    In 2017, 158,000 Americans died from what we call deaths of despair: suicide, overdoses, and alcoholic liver disease and cirrhosis.

    I was told by a GI specialist that they are now seeing an increasing number of people who develop cirrhosis as a result of obesity, rather than alcholism. Whether or not some or all of this can be chalked up to despair is another matter. But to expand on another point you made, some of those white people killed by police are, essentially, commiting suicide, so those should probably be chalked up in the despair column as well.

    The sense of being a conquered people is reinforced by all the famous, influential, and powerful people who gleefully proclaim that whites are fast becoming a minority in this country, and are giddy at how wonderful a thing that is.

    But in this century, whites have lost interest in Indians, who also seem to have lost interest in themselves as the other Indians have come to play a much larger role in American life.

    The interest whites had in Indians was tied up with their own history of the frontier, the old west, and 19th century America. But that history itself, once deemed characteristicly American, was de-emphasized in favor of the immigrant narrative of the Ellis Island Peoples.

    After all, you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?

    Ask James Watson.

  122. @Reg Cæsar

    What decade do you live in? NYC has long been eclipsed by Los Angeles, London, and even Atlanta.

    LA is capital of frivolous entertainment. London is undoubtedly the culture capital for Europe and much of the world. But NYC (and DC) are where the U.S. power elite reside and where the MSM is headquartered. So NYC looms large.

    I don’t think anybody cares about Atlanta. But maybe I’m out of the loop on that.

    • Replies: @GoRedWings!
    , @Reg Cæsar
  123. How do blacks treat native Americans?

  124. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/29/magazine/racial-disparities-covid-19.html

    directly related, especially the ‘black people die because of racism even when you control for poverty’ study

  125. @Hypnotoad666

    “It is our great misfortune as a nation that the main impact of the virus was in the Imperial Media Capital. If there were 23,000 excess deaths in Appalachia it would be a big yawn, accompanied by a couple Op-Eds about how it was due to their backwardness.”

    Yeah, it’s a funny contrast, huh?

    “In 2017, 158,000 Americans died from what we call deaths of despair: suicide, overdoses, and alcoholic liver disease and cirrhosis. This is the equivalent of three full 737 MAXs falling out of the sky every day, with no survivors.”

    Yawns all around.

    In 2018 and 2019, two third-world-piloted 737 MAXs crash.

    Global crucifixion of Seattle engineering employer.

    In 2020, Imperial Media Capital NYC re-achieves 2018-level of flu mortality.

    National media panic. Constitution shredded. All citizens under house arrest. No end in sight.

    What could account for the different reactions?

    Some lives are just more equal than others.

    • Agree: Chrisnonymous
    • Replies: @HallParvey
  126. syonredux says:
    @Redneck farmer

    Hardline tactics succeed in keeping outsiders away from Boyle Heights, the Latino community that is the last holdout to Los Angeles gentrification

    This hardscrabble Latino community, just across the Los Angeles river from the lofts and skyscrapers of downtown, is waging a vigorous and in many ways effective campaign against gentrification.

    Where Brooklyn, San Francisco, Oakland and other parts of LA have yielded to and often embraced moneyed outsiders, Boyle Heights has dug a metaphorical moat.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/apr/19/los-angeles-la-gentrification-resistance-boyle-heights

  127. Mr. Anon says:
    @Gabe Ruth

    I keep staring at that daily deaths graph and seeing that weekly spike every Tuesday after the weekend lull, really obvious since beginning of April.

    The COVID-19 pandemic is the most important crisis the World has faced in 70 years.

    But only during the work week.

  128. Corvinus says:
    @Alfa158

    “It has proven literally impossible to have separate but equal facilities for different races, they are always going to be unequal.”

    It’s not “literally impossible” to have the same water fountain for both races.

    https://www.army.mil/article/200456/water_fountains_symbolize_1960s_civil_rights_movement

    It’s not “literally impossible” when a black applicant to a law school has met the credentials for admission and is denied said admission merely for being black.

    Murray v. Maryland–The plaintiff, Donald G. Murray was a highly qualified Amherst graduate who had been denied entry to the University of Maryland Law School. In 1935 Houston consented and argued the case with Marshall in Baltimore City Court before Judge Eugene O’Dunne. The Judge ruled that Murray had been rejected solely on the basis of race and ordered the University to admit him. Murray became the first black graduate of the University’s law school in 1938.

    It’s not “literally impossible” to ensure that a similar education for blacks and whites would put both in a position to achieve economic success.

    Source –> https://www.nber.org/digest/dec05/w11394.html

    If black workers who were born in the South in the 1920s and 1930s had attended schools with the same measurable characteristics (for example, length of school year and students per teacher) as white schools, how much higher might their income have been later in life? To answer this question, the authors use individual-level data from the 1970 census to estimate the average labor market returns to school quality for southern-born black men. The results suggest that southern-born black men from the 1920s birth cohorts would have earned 6 to 9 percent more than they actually did in 1970 if they had gone to “equal” schools. For southern-born black men from the 1930s birth cohorts, income would have been 2 to 5 percent higher. The relatively small difference indicates that this later birth cohort attended schools that were fairly similar to white schools in terms of school-year length and students per teacher. The link between school quality and income is forged largely by the connection between school quality and years of educational attainment – southern-born black men who went to better schools completed more grades and therefore earned higher incomes. Thus, the disparities in school resources were a significant factor in determining the earnings gap between southern-born blacks and whites, but a large earnings gap remains after accounting for differences in school quality.

    Source –> https://www.aft.org/periodical/american-educator/summer-2004/jim-crows-schools

    For example, the federal Census Bureau reported a literacy rate for black adults in 1890 of slightly more than 40 percent. This meant that six out of 10 blacks could not read and write at all, at a time when nearly seven out of 10 white adults were literate. Forty years later, in 1930, the reported literacy rate for blacks had doubled, to just over 80 percent, while more than nine in 10 white adults were literate.

    Even genteel whites who sought to maximize their business opportunities scratched their head at these type of laws–Georgia: All persons licensed to conduct the business of selling beer or wine…shall serve either white people exclusively or colored people exclusively and shall not sell to the two races within the same room at any time.

    Imagine a white liquor store owner who had no issue with having “mixed company” purchasing his goods. Would not such a law violate his right to freely associate with people?

    “Even if you start with schools, residential communities, public facilities and so forth that are physically identical and receive the same levels of public funding…”

    Except they didn’t! It’s not “literally impossible” to have the same amount of money spent for whites and blacks when it came to school funding.

    Source –> https://www.aft.org/periodical/american-educator/summer-2004/jim-crows-schools

    In the Jim Crow states that stretched from Delaware to Texas, local school boards spent almost three times as much on each white student as they did on blacks. The funding disparities in the Deep South states, where blacks outnumbered whites in hundreds of rural countries, were far greater. Alabama spent $37 on each white child in 1930 and just $7 on those who were black; in Georgia the figures were $32 and $7, in Mississippi they were $31 and $6, and those in South Carolina were $53 and $5, a disparity of more than 10-to-one.

    The largest chunk of the school budget in every district goes to pay teachers; and the salaries of black teachers during the 1930s were far below those of whites. The monthly salary of black teachers in the South in 1930 was about 60 percent of the white average, $73 for blacks and $118 for whites, with the yearly school term in white schools about two months longer, which added to the salary gap.

    “Half a century of experience has demonstrated that Black areas will be worse than Hispanic, Hispanic will be worse than White and White will be worse than East Asian in educational achievement, income, crime rates, intact families, etc. no matter how much you try to move people in and out of Larry Niven style “magic dirt” regions.”

    Because of poverty or because of race?

    • Replies: @syonredux
  129. ic1000 says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    > Wuhan rings a bell for all of us. With all of the other writing on unz about conspiracy theories, some true, some not, where are the articles on this one? I have read NOTHING about the smuggling of these precursors, with the Chinese and Mexicans being the big players?

    Achmed, I had the same reaction. I’ve lost a great deal of respect for the American news media, because I read what they print. But then I hit a story like the one Steve links to, concerning the origins of fentanyl’s precursor chemicals. Ms. Linthicum is an excellent journalist (no sarcasm).

    Coronavirus chokes the drug trade — from Wuhan, through Mexico and onto U.S. streets. By Kate Linthicum, the Los Angeles Times. April 24, 2020.

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
  130. Muggles says:

    Today’s article is thought provoking though most of the “thoughts” expressed in comments are the same stock complaints and racialist theories that are popular here. Many self pitying from what seem to be white men. Ah, how we suffer!

    There is of course in all of this the usual cherry picking of absurd media commentary by SJW and leftist prog fools. That gets the blood up.

    Re: suicide by whites. Well, the Japanese historically in the last several decades lead the world in suicides. Is this from the “defeated nation” blues? I doubt that. Does pachinko and karaoke finally pall after age 60?

    Also, American Indians never had the “defeated nation” mopes, as some seem to believe. None of this analysis, promoted by Mr. Sailer today, comes from actual Indians explaining their behavior. The AmerInd population has multiplied vastly since the era of 1890, the the tribes were “tamed.” No suicidal extinction mania in those places. As to their suicide rates compared to others, in the last few decades, where’s the data?

    All of this maudlin “white extinction” seems nonsensical. Just look at exactly who is killing themselves (of all races). I suspect mostly very old, sick people at the end of life. Yes, some depressed people who have biological basis for depression, or bi-polar. Some drug over-dosers are labeled suicides. If you adjust for self medicating overdose (booze, opiods) how much is “despair” or “white anguish” even a factor? Do hillbilly “disability” kings/queens in trailer parks kill themselves because they can’t get work in steel factories? Or is it idleness and pointless addiction? Or just painful old age, hurting and alone?

    Grand theorizing seems absurd. Just find a real AmerInd and ask them.

    • Replies: @Hibernian
  131. Corvinus says:
    @Mark G.

    “There was hope at the time among whites that once segregation ended blacks would peacefully integrate into white society.”

    Which they generally did.

    “Many whites were dismayed when blacks went on a crime spree starting in the late sixties.”

    Where?

    “They were dismayed when blacks rejected white middle class culture and celebrated black thug culture.”

    Some blacks assuredly have rejected it.

    “The situation might have been tolerable for whites if forced segregation had been replaced by freedom of association…”

    Freedom of association remains, just not legal segregation. Big difference. Remember, there were southern genteel whites who wanted to conduct business with blacks on an equal footing, or even (gasp) wanted to date and mate with them, but were denied that liberty due to the enforcement of Jim Crow laws.

    “because they could have maintained at least some distance from misbehaving blacks.”

    Not all or even most blacks misbehave.

  132. Corvinus says:
    @Peter Frost

    He’s smart, but not that smart.

    • LOL: ic1000
  133. B36 says:

    OT (or maybe not completely): another excellent essay by Christopher Caldwell
    “Pledging Allegiance: Dual citizenship, dual loyalty, and inequality”.

    https://claremontreviewofbooks.com/pledging-allegiance/

  134. bomag says:
    @Bardon Kaldian

    Interesting. Some African countries on the low end; Caribbean Blacks have the very lowest rates.

  135. Mr. Anon says:
    @Corvinus

    Where?

    Detroit, Cleveland, Birmingham, Newark, Milwaukee, etc. All those cities that whites cleared out of from the 60s through the 80s.

    “They were dismayed when blacks rejected white middle class culture and celebrated black thug culture.”

    Some blacks assuredly have rejected it.

    Not enough.

    Freedom of association remains, just not legal segregation.

    A lie.

    Not all or even most blacks misbehave.

    It doesn’t have to be all of them. Just enough of them. Which it is.

    You are a prating idiot, idiot.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  136. “Blacks were living longer until Black Lives Matter encouraged them to start shooting each other again.”

    They shoot plenty of us too.

    Exactly how many is a remarkably difficult number to get a hold of. So difficult, one might suppose that there is a coordinated effort to prevent anyone knowing. Perhaps because that number long ago exceeded the number of lynchings that every white person is supposed to feel guilty about forever.

    • Replies: @anon
  137. Dave Chappelle even joked about the white-black suicide gap in one of his recent Netflix specials (in the context of Anthony Bourdain). Chappelle’s private thoughts are obviously not always entirely within the PC orthodoxy, but like many other public figures he frequently backtracks to preserve career and social security.

  138. @kpkinsunnyphiladelphia

    He strikes me as the player most like Willie.

    He’s much more Mickey Mantle than Willie Mays.

  139. anonymous[387] • Disclaimer says:

    Steve,

    I found your old ISTEVE blog 16-17 years ago. At the time what I liked about your world view was that you were a hopeful positive and sincere Civic Nationalist/Citizenist counterpoint to moderate White Identitarians like Jared Taylor within the conservative race realist community.

    For 25 years the Amren crowd would like to say their organizing principle/goal were white homeland(s) carved out of America. This allowed Jared Taylor to avoid the “JQ” for decades while holding on to his White Homelands/Separatist lite pretensions. Now, decades of mounting “Facts on the Ground” in almost every state have made made any White Separatist option laughable.

    Today, anybody who listens any Amren podcast by Taylor and Paul Kersey knows that Cultural Marxism is discussed through out the show. Taylor can claim he is still no David Duke/William Luther Pierce but in all reality he and almost all of his audience are just as J-Woke.

    However, now Civic Nationalism is being fully discredited, cooped by the likes of Charlie Kirk style grifters, the “Kosher Nationalists” and the Kushner Presidency. At least try to convince any Millennial or especially Zoomer otherwise.

    My Question is Steve are you still in your heart the Civic Nationalist/Citizen you claimed to be 20 years ago. If so fine, but how is that possible given the increasing dominance of Cultural Marxism? But is not the overwhelming and increasing dominance of Cultural Marxism just the expression of the reality of Jewish Supremacy. How can Cultural Marxism be overturned without a direct open counter force reaction to Jewish(Racial?)Supremacy. What will this force look like especially in an America where Whites are no longer a majority?

    It is absolutely essential that the destruction being waged on this country by Cultural Marxism be stopped. Time is running out. I wish it could be done non-violently but I seriously have my doubts now. The Covid-19 shutdown shows just how far the Jews/elites will go in attempting to control the masses. Increasingly the best option for a least violent alternative to Cultural Marxist ruin is the Logos Rising philosophy of E Michael Jones.

    EMJ says he rejects the concept of race as an organizing/unifying basis for society. EMJ is however a LOGOS Supremacist and freely admits LOGOS is in direct opposition to Judaism.

    Steve are you a budding LOGOS supremacist??? Is it possible to be a LOGOS supremacist as an alternative to any racial supremacy or even identity?

  140. Eagle Eye says:
    @Polynikes

    Maybe the history of the US really is one of class warfare.

    That’s why the word “class” is taboo in Polite Society.

  141. @ic1000

    What are the current stats for overdoses etc? Any indications that ‘deaths of despair’ are dropping with the closed borders and fentanyl imports cut, or is there enough to go round in the US already?

    What length of border closure would be necessary to seriously damage the trade?

    • Replies: @ic1000
  142. Testing12 says:
    @Anonymous

    White men have more diversity of thought (true diversity) than any other demographic.

    This is a double edged sword.

  143. anonymous[105] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    What decade do you live in? NYC has long been eclipsed by Los Angeles, London, and even Atlanta.

    Oh yes, definitely. When it comes to cultural influence, the place where almost all relevant print, televised, and online old and new news media companies are located, from The Times to CBS to Fox to Vox to Vice, it matters where The Carbonaro Effect and the plurality of First 48 Episodes are filmed.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  144. @Jack D

    The article that you linked to makes an interesting contrast with the white death being discussed here. It looks like the coronavirus is (at least so far) mainly affecting blue states and cities, with red states being much less hard hit. For example, the article lists 15 states (including Washington, D.C.) where death rates are actually lower than normal. 11 of them voted for Trump in 2016. Meanwhile, 7 of the 8 states where deaths are higher than normal by double-digit percentages voted for Hillary.

    This may change. The virus is still spreading, and some people are predicting that rural areas will be hard hit due to the lower availability of medical care. But right now, it looks like the areas affected by the white death and the areas affected by the virus are very different. Appalachia, for example, seems so far to be largely untouched. Even when the coronavirus spreads to rural areas, the examples that I have heard about seem to be places such as prisons, Indian reservations, and meatpacking plants staffed by migrant workers, not areas inhabited by working class white people.

  145. @kihowi

    “Being reasonable is a strictly white male obsession that nobody in the world shares.”

    Yes, I’ve noticed this as well. (White women don’t have that trait). I’m all for rationality, but the obsession with reasonableness, inclusion, and conciliatory behavior is particularly European. It’s a massive disadvantage when dealing with groups that have none of those traits, and which have tribal or honor based cultures in which being reasonable is seen as being weak.

    It must be my Aztec blood, but my attitude is that if a foreign group comes into your territory and starts to do bad things, you slaughter them (preferably with brutal forms of torture preceding the slaughter). I don’t think the Aztecs, Mongols or Romans really cared if people thought they were reasonable or likable.

    If white males were less reasonable and more sensible, there wouldn’t be Muslim rape gangs rampaging all throughout the UK, attacking children and gloating about it. Armenia and Russia don’t have this sort of gang activity for a reason.

  146. fish says:
    @SunBakedSuburb

    By all means….tell us more!

  147. utu says:
    @Ganderson

    Booker T Washington had anti-semitic tendencies.

  148. @Jake

    I agree, but calling them WASPs is anachronistic.

    They are the heirs (sometimes genetically; always culturally) of the Normans, the greatest and most ruthless conquerers the world has ever seen.
    Their ruthlessness might be equaled or even surpassed by that of the Mongols and the Vandals, but their greatness is uniquely evidenced by this one astounding truth: whatever they conquered they still hold, from the conquest of that Normandy to which they gave their name, through that of England in 1066 and then consecutively Scotland and Wales and Ireland, and then further across the seas to Sicily where, under Italianate names the Norman heritage still strongly flows (if, admittedly, somewhat enervated by the Mediterranean climes).

    They are everything you say – but how else does one stay on top for over a thousand years?

  149. @Almost Missouri

    If NBCCBSABC and their sisters in propaganda don’t say anything about something, then it didn’t happen.

    Equality is for the deplorable serfs.

    • Agree: the grand wazoo
    • Replies: @the grand wazoo
  150. @Old Palo Altan

    They are everything you say – but how else does one stay on top for over a thousand years?

    By being born to the right mother. Heredity trumps everything else.

  151. @Corvinus

    “Freedom of association remains, just not legal segregation.”

    Freedom of association for blacks, but not for whites.

    “Some blacks assuredly have rejected [black thug culture].

    How many? 10%? And I’m not counting the “respectable” blacks who live off of affirmative action.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  152. J1234 says:

    In 2017, 158,000 Americans died from what we call deaths of despair: suicide, overdoses, and alcoholic liver disease and cirrhosis.

    There was a time when the last three causes of death on that list would’ve been generally perceived as deaths of decadence rather than despair. Sorry…I consider myself a white advocate on many levels, but I’m not buying into the “my self-destructiveness is somebody else’s fault” argument, even (and maybe especially) for white people. I’m in my early sixties, and yet somehow have managed to avoid recreational drugs all of my life – even pot – so my empathy for whites who overdose and drink excessively (I do drink moderately) is limited. I’ve had minor bouts with depression, and have never made much money, but I’ve more or less live right and try to optimize my outcomes given what I have, and things have turned out surprisingly well. How about that? Not going crazy or being foolish can do wonders for your life!

    Indians used to be admired by whites for having put up a strong fight for over 250 years, in contrast to blacks, who were relatively easy to dominate. But in this century, whites have lost interest in Indians, who also seem to have lost interest in themselves as the other Indians have come to play a much larger role in American life.

    Very true. Blacks have largely (but not always) followed the path of least mental resistance (i.e., a sort of aversion to self-actualization), which has meant a general default towards reliance on others, be they a slave master or a government. The mouthy Van Jones style blacks of the last fifty years have had as their mission the creation of a mythology that insists blacks got everything they received from the white man by confronting him in the manner of 19th century Indians. True, the threat of black criminal and social violence has been an effective political tool for blacks over the past 50 years, but that’s a far cry from the bravery of the Indian Wars. In fact, it’s sort of the opposite of bravery.

    It was depressing to witness the unique poverty of Indians on a reservation in AZ last summer. The poverty of a defeated people. The most decrepit panhandlers I believe I’ve ever seen.

    I’m not willing to call the OD crises among whites “the poverty of a defeated people,” though, or find parallels with Indians, because I don’t think that’s correct. I think it would be more accurate to call it the poverty of an affluent and self-indulgent society.

    • Replies: @Stan Adams
    , @dfordoom
  153. anon[225] • Disclaimer says:
    @Cloudbuster

    There is a small difference. Those wanted to die; the ones dying now didn’t/don’t want to die.

    • Replies: @Cloudbuster
  154. anon[681] • Disclaimer says:
    @Almost Missouri

    Exactly how many is a remarkably difficult number to get a hold of.

    The FBI’s crime report gives a pretty accurate number. You can find it rather easily with a search tool.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
  155. Rob says:
    @Bruno

    I’m a bit leery of blacks who claim to test well. Statistically, it is less likely, even for an Ibo, though they are widely regarded as the the brightest black population, than for whites. Hell, (iPad corrected that to He’ll. I guess iPad don’t like cursin’ no how) even whites have been known to take multiple IQ tests and study between them, a behavior well-known to trash the reliability, to brag and technically avoid lying. Many whites, even racially-conscious ones, enjoy the good doggy feeling of thinking a black is smart.

    If the scores are public, And you checked, I withdraw my comment.

    • Troll: Big Dick Bandit
    • Replies: @Bruno
    , @Slimer
    , @obwandiyag
  156. anon[225] • Disclaimer says:
    @moshe

    I don’t think citing “religion” would work. Practicing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digambara faith will most likely not be allowed. Female circumcision is not allowed though male circumcision is legal in many places. So, it is a matter of “Right Thinking world”.

    • Replies: @moshe
  157. anon[377] • Disclaimer says:

    A non trivial factor in the decline of the white working class was the Vietnam War. They were sent off to fight and die for nothing. Betrayed by the elites. They were justifiably enraged and the negative effects just multiplied.

    They wanted me to go, but I managed to avoid it. But even that was a very negative experience. It took me 10 years to realize I should have been in finance. Ha.

    As far as damaging, it was the beginning of the end for the military as a option for mobility. But all of a sudden, the military was gone, High wage union work was on the way out via Japanese imports. The beginning of stagflation.

    It seems like it is too obvious to even mention. But it was a really really stupid ideas. And evil. I was in Hanoi a decade ago, and there were plenty of ATM’s by then.

  158. SafeNow says:
    @kpkinsunnyphiladelphia

    As long as people are talking about various centerfielders, here is a thought experiment. A time machine assembles all the great baseball players in their prime. You are choosing your team versus an opponent. It is time to pick the center fielder, and you have first pick. Willie, I am old enough to have watched you play, and oh the joy of it. But my pick would be the Clipper. The “clubhouse effect.” Elevates everyone. Not so OT after all. “Where have you gone Joe DiMaggio…” Can one still sing that?

  159. anon[681] • Disclaimer says:
    @miss marple

    How is longevity calculated?

    Why don’t you look it up yourself? If you can type words in a combox, you can type words in a search engine, or have you never heard of https://www.google.com in all these years?

    I’d expect a higher infant mortality rate for Hispanics which wouldn’t affect longevity statistics

    That’s an ignorant thing to write. You really should look up some basic terms about “how longevity is calculated”.

    but what about violent deaths of adolescent males?

    What about them? How about you try the CDC site for a start, miss lazybones-feed-me-with-a-spoon?

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  160. Trebitsch says:
    @The Alarmist

    Adultery is an essential activity for satanists. He should have been praised…

  161. @SafeNow

    What about Mickey Mantle? If you were old enough to see Mays play, then you may also have seen Mickey play as well. When healthy, Mickey was DiMaggio’s equal. Granted his health wasn’t always top notch. But DiMaggio also suffered some injuries late in his career too (or rather his career was cut short due to injuries). Point being, Mickey Mantle wasn’t just a bat taking up space in the OF, and he was well respected for both his arm and his glove. For many decades, regarding CF, Mays, Mantle, DiMaggio, even Duke Snider were considered the gold standard in MLB.

    OT but still on point. Funny how for all the hoopla and verbal fellatio regarding HOF BOS LF Ted Williams’s hitting prowess, almost no one ever mentions his fielding and throwing. Because he wasn’t a five tool player. He was below average in the outfield, quite slow and sluggish, and his arm wasn’t all that special. If he had been all that defensively, then he would’ve been recognized for it during his career. From a defensive aspect, he certainly wasn’t in the same sentence as HOF BOS OF Carl Yaztremski.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    , @Reg Cæsar
  162. @Morton's toes

    Vin Scully said that Willie Mays’ 1954 World Series catch on TV was nothing compared to an untelevised catch Willie Made in a regular season game against the Dodgers with 2 outs in the 9th and the game on the line. Mays ran even further back, launched himself flatout, caught the ball on the fly stretched out horizontal to the ground, and crashed head first into the fence, knocking himself unconscious. The Dodger runners circled the bases for the win, assuming he must have dropped the ball. Eventually, the second base umpire arrived at Mays’ unconscious body, found the ball still in his glove and signalled “Game Over: Giants win.”

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  163. ic1000 says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    > Any indications that ‘deaths of despair’ are dropping with the closed borders and fentanyl imports cut?

    I don’t know, but here is a quote from the LAT article:

    Kameron Korte, a spokeswoman for the San Diego field division of the DEA, said fentanyl pills in her region now sell for $7 each, up from $5 a few months ago. The average cost of methamphetamine has risen from $1,000 per pound to $1,400 per pound, she said.

    Similar price hikes have been seen in other parts of the country.

    A $5 fentanyl fix that now sells for $7… doesn’t sound like the supply has been slashed.

    • Agree: YetAnotherAnon
  164. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    A lot of people would have preferred Musial to Ted Williams, especially in the clubhouse. Williams was kind of like Barry Bonds, a technical genius but not much of a team player. But he was a decent manager, because he was super smart and didn’t worry about conventional wisdom. “Ball Four” talked about how Williams turned Frank Howard, still a project at age 30, into 40+ homer per year man.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
  165. @Bruno

    War Nerd calls the Ibos the jews of Africa.

  166. the descendants of the men who won The Big One

    Not sure that White America includes too many descendants of members of the 1940s Soviet military – those are the men (and women) who won The Big One.

    • Agree: dfordoom
  167. Jake says:
    @Old Palo Altan

    That new English leadership cadre solidified during the Reformation was not Norman. but part-Norman in genetics. The things that best identified it were its embrace of Protestantism as a national religion owned and controlled by English Elites for their class benefit, and their total distancing of all things that were obviously French in origin as they embraced most things that were Anglo-Saxon gentry in origin.

    Ultimately, culture matters more than genetics. Charlemagne knew that the Franks were in origin a Germanic tribe speaking a Germanic language, but he knew also that the Franks of his time did not have the same culture as Saxons. The cultural differences were what mattered.

  168. Corvinus says:
    @Mr. Anon

    “Detroit, Cleveland, Birmingham, Newark, Milwaukee, etc. All those cities that whites cleared out of from the 60s through the 80s.”

    Because of a crime wave?

    “Not enough.”

    Actually, it’s quite alot.

    “A lie.”

    Not at all. Freedom of association remains, just not legal segregation.

    “Just enough of them. Which it is.”

    Most embrace our American way of life.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon
  169. Corvinus says:
    @Nicholas Stix

    “Freedom of association for blacks, but not for whites.”

    No, freedom of association for Americans.

    “How many? 10%? And I’m not counting the “respectable” blacks who live off of affirmative action.”

    More like 90%.

    • Replies: @Nicholas Stix
  170. Abe says:
    @Morton's toes

    The play he made on Vic Wirtz’ fly ball 450+ feet in the Polo Grounds which would have been a towering home run in any actual baseball stadium may well be the single greatest defensive play ever.

    Ahem…

    (this was in a tied Game 7 NLCS, though the 83-81 Cards would go on to win the game and championship)

  171. Kronos says:
    @Diversity Heretic

    It’s true.

    I’m currently reading Bernie Sanders book “Our Revolution” that was written after he lost the Democratic Primary in 2016 but before Trump won in November. I recall he performed terribly amongst blacks in 2016 and southern blacks butchered his chances again in the 2020 primary. I thought it would be neat to learn more about the guy and find some precious knowledge nuggets.

    Sanders does appear to be an old left economic socialist. They certainly don’t make them like that anymore since the 1960s. He doesn’t (so far) go into any detail on how the Democratic Party changed since he marched with MLK in the Civil Rights Movement. (He did come from a working class background and wasn’t any “Rothschild Freedom Rider” in advancing Zionist objectives.) But I found this passage quite interesting:

    The following year, in August 2014, I returned to Mississippi. On that trip, we held an unforgettable meeting in Jackson at the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers (IBEW) Local 480 union hall. I was excited by the idea of meeting with trade unionists in Mississippi, but had my doubts as to how many people would actually show up to meet with the socialist senator from Vermont.

    We were very pleasantly surprised. The doors opened and people kept coming. We ended up filling the hall with several hundred attendees—almost all working class. Approximately two-thirds were white, one-third black. There were also a number of black members from the state legislature at the meeting, as well as the chairman of the state Democratic Party. People were happy to attend, because it was very unusual for a non-Republican U.S. senator to visit Mississippi. After all, the state was deep red. There was no money to raise. Why would a Democratic senator visit? I was introduced by the local union president, John Smith. He and his wife could not have been more gracious, and I still have the denim IBEW jacket, made in America, they gave me. I spoke for a while and then asked a question to the audience that had been on my mind for a long time.

    “How does it happen that in one of the poorest states in this country, Mississippi, voters keep electing right-wing Republicans who have contempt for working people and who push policies that benefit the rich at the expense of nearly everyone else?” The answer that I got back was “Race, race, race.” The white population in Mississippi was overwhelmingly Republican. In 2012, Obama received, unbelievably, only 10 percent of the white vote.

    He once again got creamed (some say blacked) four years later by black Democratic primary voters while working class white voters didn’t switch parties to nominate him. The young (white) kids love him by 70% but older whites (and blacks) are fearful of disrupting the status quo. Blacks are happy with rubbing uncle Joe Biden’s leg hair and watch it glisten in the sun.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  172. 158,000?!?!?

    We should shut down all liquor stores, and ban the sale of alcohol orpainkillers. Also, guns, knives, rope, and many other items in hardware stores.

  173. @J1234

    Non-whites have no moral agency; they are eternal victims. We should pity them and give them generous federal assistance.

    But dispossessed white folks are just lazy, self-indulgent drunks and addicts who should get off their flabby asses and learn to code. Fuck ’em. They have only themselves to blame for their misery.

  174. @Morton's toes

    The play he made on Vic Wirtz’ fly ball 450+ feet in the Polo Grounds which would have been a towering home run in any actual baseball stadium may well be the single greatest defensive play ever

    Death valley in the old Yankee Stadium was 490 feet to dead center.

  175. Polynikes says:
    @YetAnotherAnon

    I wouldn’t rule it out. But it is a hell of a disguise. Did Reagan help? Did either Bush? Did Clinton, himself from a middle class white background? The senatorial class? In varying degrees they just drove the stake in deeper.

    Blacks haven’t had a majority in Congress or the presidency. Neither have the statistically over-represented Jews. White Americans seem to be the ones in charge. And both parties are to blame, but ironically the Democrats have lead the charge with the backing of the very unions who supposedly exist to protect the working class.

  176. Anonymous[146] • Disclaimer says:
    @Kronos

    That blacks vote for Senilo G. proves one thing; as Bob Whitaker correctly stated, blacks are without political agency and vote how they be told to vote by the Big Man.

  177. Thoughts says:
    @Tono Bungay

    I’m not a fan of reasonable

    Reasonable leads to coffee drinking and lots of ‘Oh that’s interesting…’ before one goes out to plant the pegonias

  178. @Steve Sailer

    Williams was kind of like Barry Bonds, a technical genius but not much of a team player.

    Yup, he turned himself into one of the best fly fisherman in the world after his playing days, not exactly a team sport.

    • Replies: @hhsiii
  179. @Bruno

    The world of full of former “future geniuses” who tested extraordinarily all the way into grad school but never amounted to much extraordinary in their professional lives.

    • Replies: @Bruno
  180. Sushipal says:

    I was watching a video about the benefit of living in overwhelmingly white states. It was interesting to notice that the *epidemic* of white suicides & opioid addiction is among whites who are living in multi-culti states. It’s practically NON-EXISTENT when whites are living around other whites! And culturally, besides having very low crime, these states also have a much higher then average marriage rate, much lower than average divorce rate, close to zero unemployment & homelessness, very small govt, etc. North Dakota rated as the overall best state to raise a family. N.D. also has its own state run bank so that banking stays local!

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  181. Bruno says:
    @Rob

    The 15A* are public (GCSE). Her sister, two years less, got 13. And both went into a famous public school with a fellowship.

    The BMAT is not but she scored much better on the science part wich implied exactly the same type of discipline that she used for the GCSE and A-Levels.

    She struggled for the 1 year at Cambridge. And when you listened to her experience as a young surgeon, you see how articulate she is. She never worked more than 6 hours a day because of attention span limitation. So it’s not as she has crystallized to compensate a lower IQ.

    There is no doubt her IQ is between 130 and 140. My guess is 135. I don’t think she will invent anything useful but she will be an extremely good doctor solving problems. I don’t know many blacks, a fortiori high IQ blacks, thats why I was interested by her.

    PS: I don’t find Obama very … But his physician brother has the same level as this young lady. I showed the video to my girlfriend who is an anaesthesiologist and she found it slow and boring, and typical of normally very driven who are medical material . She says I wouldn’t be interested if she weren’t black … I fear that may be a kind of racialism too in my part.

  182. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Mays lead the Majors in WAR 7 times, which is more times than any player, I believe. Even more than Babe Ruth (6). Trout has done it 3 times already. (Interestingly, Cal Ripken led MLB in WAR 3 times. I sometimes think his Iron Man record actually has made people forget he was one of the all time greatest.)

    Aaron never once in his career topped the MLB in WAR. Not once. He complained about only getting 1 NL MVP, but that is all he deserved.

  183. Slimer says:
    @Rob

    It seems that all African groups that speak English as a first language are outperforming whites in the UK. There’s nothing special about Igbos: https://www.unz.com/article/a-troublesome-intelligence/

  184. @Sushipal

    Opioids are pretty bad plague in New Hampshire and maybe Maine, as well as West Virginia.

    • Agree: JackOH
  185. Bruno says:
    @Black-hole creator

    I never said the young girl is a future genius. In fact I don’t believe she will ever make an important contribution to science . But I think she will be a top 10% specialist doctor, caring and being a very good at diagnostic and performing difficult operations.

    In fact she could even be a top 1% doctor, and be exactly like a Ben Carson.

    Both thing would be very good.

    I dont even think western countries need that kind of talent. It’s not really useful. But it doesn’t really hurt either .

  186. dfordoom says: • Website

    If you’re going to argue that White Death is caused by immigration it would be helpful if you could point to similar trends in other western countries that have had very high rates of immigration over the same period. Is White Death a thing in Britain? Or France? Or Australia?

    I don’t know the answer to that question. Is there any useful data from those countries?

  187. @Morris Applebaum IV

    Mays, Aaron, F. Robinson was pretty clearly the NL hierarchy of great outfielders, in that order, for a long time. Were any of them experimenting with early steroids?

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    , @Anon87
  188. @Steve Sailer

    In Game 2 of the 1936 WS, NYY vs NYG, The New York Giants’ Hank Leiber hit a ball to dead center. 490 feet into dead center to be exact. DiMaggio made the catch while running up the steps of the clubhouse. The thing about this catch is that it was about 40 feet farther than Willie Mays’ “The Catch” in 1954. Granted, the Yankees were up by 14 runs in the game, but it was a great catch nevertheless.

    Also, in game 5 of the 1956 WS in the fifth inning, Gil Hodges of the Brooklyn Dodgers hit a line-drive into Yankee Stadium’s “Death Valley.” Mantle was there to make an amazing running one-handed catch.

    For those who don’t know, Yankee Stadium’s “Death Valley” is called so because of the 490-foot distance from home plate to the centerfield wall. This helped to preserve Don Larsen’s perfect game. As Mel Allen used to say, “How about that!”

    • Thanks: hhsiii
  189. @Steve Sailer

    Oh, come on Steve.

    PEDS didn’t exist at the time Mays broke into the league in 1951, Robinson in ’56, or Aaron in ’54. First professional team that started using PEDS was SD in the NFL in late 50’s or early ’60’s, as I believe you have commented on before. Also, Mays, Robinson, and Aaron were all in their prime, their 20’s, and thus could get along quite well without PEDS.

    You forgot to mention PIT RF HOF Roberto Clemente as a great gold standard outfielder, better than Aaron.

    Willie Mays commented when asked, “Who’s the greatest player you ever saw?” “Me.” He replied. In Mays’s opinion, Roberto Clemente was the 2nd greatest player he ever saw.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  190. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Whites are being defeated by their own cowardice this time

    Or maybe lower-class whites are being defeated by the selfishness, greed and viciousness of middle-class and upper-class whites. Maybe the White Death has little or nothing to do with race, and everything to do with class.

    Are we seeing lots of white corporate lawyers, CEOs and commodities brokers dying deaths of despair?

    • Agree: Big Dick Bandit
    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  191. @Morris Applebaum IV

    Ruth has the highest career WAR of 20th century MLB players. If Mays was great during single seasons, he could have helped his team win more WS. Aside from the Catch, Mays underperformed when it mattered most: In October.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  192. dfordoom says: • Website
    @danand

    Is there any data of US life expectancy broken down by class?

  193. Rob says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    The comment seems to have been memoryholed. America, especially yahoo news, it seems, is still very racist. Imagine if such full-throated praise of white people could ever be deleted? No! You just can’t say anything positive about blacks In mainstream media.

  194. @Abe

    One other thing I noticed a few years ago when watching that documentary – filmed in 1990/early 1991 – was how the Metallica band members and others spoke. It was less “black” for lack of a better word, as well as less inarticulate – fewer “uhhs” and “yeahs” and “whatevers” – than is the standard today (and for the last 20 odd years). They also didn’t drop swear words every other sentence and didn’t feel the need to throw in hip lingo or use deliberately vulgar phraseology. And these were heavy metal entertainer dudes. Kind of sad to realize how much changed in white standards just between say 1990 and 2000. Rap was what changed things.

    • Replies: @Polynikes
  195. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    San Diego Chargers tried steroids in training camp in 1963. Mays had a huge 1962-1965 late stretch, Robinson won the Triple Crown in 1966, Aaron unexpectedly averaged 41 homers per season from 1969 (age 35) to 1973 (age 39). Tom House was on Atlanta off and on from 1971. But the ownership was also pulling in the fences as well.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  196. @anonymous

    Did I say Atlanta? Sorry, I meant Wilmington.

  197. @LoutishAngloQuebecker

    The end goal of a white man is to shed the bluepill upbringing, become redpilled, and use game to find a satisfactory wife

    Good advice. Now tell me: where can one find these elusive women who would make satisfactory wives?

    At work?
    https://metoomvmt.org/

    On the street?

    Online?

    and stay dominant in the relationship.

    Yes, this is important. If you can stay dominant in the relationship, you’ll never have to worry that she’ll get bored one day and file for no-fault divorce, ending up with at least half of your assets, full custody of the kids, and ruinous alimony and child-support payments for a period to be determined by a man-hating judge.

  198. newrouter says:
    @Kratoklastes

    >Not sure that White America includes too many descendants of members of the 1940s Soviet military – those are the men (and women) who won The Big One.<

    lol What also defeating Japan is chopped liver?

  199. I often ponder why American whites are so apathetic, and go out of their way to not be noticed. I think there’s several reasons, and I think a smart person with time and the will to do a little research, may find the causes can be traced, and are not coincidental but connected. Here’s my list off the top of my head, and not necessarily in chronological order: The Federal Reserve Act of 1913 – lead to depressing debt slavery, flouridation of the nations water supply – lowered the IQ and a cause of apathy, vacinations and their use of animal viruses, heavy metals mercury and aluminum – caused 10s of thousands of early cancer deaths in the 80s, the media/zionist attack on White Males, corrolated events : knowledge that the official story of 911 is a lie, the lies that drew us into wars with Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria, Yemen, and eventually Iran, no one went to prison tor the crash of 2008, bailout monies for billionaires, and the latest hoax covid 19 that officials used as a ruse to see how far they could push and already compliant public. And, oh yeah the $6 trillion bailout of April. All this speaks to the impotence we as a people have accepted.

  200. moshe says:
    @anon

    But I am a nudist Jain monk.

    You know, the world aint moving in my preferred direction regarding clothing. In general I’ll demand sunglass removal if someone wants to talk to me. And away from the poker table everyone does so. Hiding your face in a conversation is about as dodgy as it gets. This whole mask/social distancing thing is often getting tossed at the feet of the elderly and boomers but, in my experience, it is FAR more the fault of little pussy bitches forever afraid of exploration and begging authorities to keep them in a safe space.

    I’m in an area where literally 1 out of every 30,000 people died from coronavirus.

    1 in 30,000.

    None young of course.

    Yet, 9 out of every 10 teenagers have not left their home EVEN ONCE in the past 5 weeks.

    I’m not complaining. There are both downsides and upsides to living in such a society and I’m cool with that. Mainly because there’s no way to calculate whether the costs outweigh the benefits so I prefer to believe that they don’t.

    But it is wildly inaccurate to imagine that this fear – even if it theoretically benefits them most – is driven by the communal feelings if boomers and greatest’generationers. It is driven by the young and terrified. Not only in America but around the world in every civilized country.

    I’m thankful for whatever benefits accrue to us all thanks to their unacceptable of the possibility of dying but it must be noted that when it veers into the retarded and counter-productive territory of mass hysteria their childish nonsense oughtn’t guide pubkic policy.

    The quarantine saved nobody. Eveyone caught the “virus” or will catch it. It is impossible not to. Even the quarantine can’t stop it. (Unless viral load matters and you can catch it and make antibodies from a few germs and then be safe in the presence of many germs but I haven’t heard this to be true.)

    Eschew the mask.

    Encourage anyone unhealthy over 70 to wear an N95 so as to be protected from the germs of others (as simple masks don’t necessarily do that) and mock anyone under 45 who wears the mask outdoors.

    No shirt, No shoes, No Full Cranial Windshield

    Full Fuckin Service

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  201. @Polynikes

    Good points. While metal has worldwide appeal the dominant metal scene now seems to be bands from Scandinavia and Eastern Europe, occasionally Germany — not so much the US or England anymore. There are stacks of albums inspired by Norse mythology but none featuring American mythology. Not sure what that might mean in the context of white American decline, though.

  202. @HallParvey

    If NBCCBSABC and their sisters in propaganda don’t say anything about something, then it didn’t happen.

    And that goes double for this virus too. My daughter asked me when this will be over, and I said when the MSM says it is.

  203. @Anon

    My most macabre writing assignment was a doctor who collected the brains of suicide victims for intense study — her theory was that aside from a few coldly rational situations, most suicide victims were driven by some tangible physical brain damage we have yet to pin down. Her family was suicide-prone, adding an obvious personal element.

  204. @Steve Sailer

    After his Triple Crown season, Robinson’s stats reverted to a more regular career arc (downward) as befitting his age. Starting in 1966, Mays stats began to revert back to normal levels as well.

    During the bulk of his career, from 1954-74, Hank Aaron didn’t hit fewer than 25 HRs and not more than 47 HRs. Consistency. It also helped that he never suffered any major injuries the way that Mantle did. PEDS didn’t appear to have helped Tom House.

    Per Wiki:

    House has stated that “six or seven” pitchers on every major league staff in the 1970s were “fiddling” with steroids or human growth hormone. He attributes players’ willingness to experiment with performance-enhancing substances to the permissiveness of the drug culture of the 1960s, and he believes that steroid use has declined in major league baseball since the 1970s, as players have become more aware of the potential long-term drawbacks.[19]

    Why exactly are we to just blindly accept his word on this? Especially since he believes that PED usage declined since the 1970’s, when the opposite is known to have occurred. Sounds like some major BS on his part is what is going on. All one would have to do is examine the players of the ’70’s with those of the ’90’s and 2000’s (at the height of MLB PED usage) for comparison.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  205. @Rob

    Hahahaha. Little black girl is smarter than you are. Nyanyanyanyanyanya.

    Fact. Incontrovertible.

  206. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Desiderius

    The lockdown is so tenaciously popular because the atomized are so desperate for company in their misery. It validates what they were already doing but feeling uneasy/guilty about. There is strength in (even forced) unanimity.

    I think that’s true. The current situation is every autistic person’s wet dream. The autistics now feel they were right all along and that they should impose the autistic lifestyle on everyone.

    Maybe the big divide these days is not left vs right or globalist vs nationalist or black vs white. Maybe the big divide is the autistic vs the non-autistic.

    The other big divide today seems to be Puritan vs non-Puritan. The Puritans (or perhaps we should call them secular Puritans or Neo-Puritans) see this situation as a wonderful opportunity to stop people from enjoying themselves. It’s a chance to crack down on fun.

    The autistic vs non-autistic and Puritan vs non-Puritan divides do not seem to line up with ideological divides. There are left-wing Neo-Puritans and right-wing Neo-Puritans. There are left-wing autists and right-wing autists. These new divides do not even line up with the globalist vs nationalist divide.

  207. MBlanc46 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    A system that doesn’t let Mays into the Hall is a failed system and never saw him play.

  208. MBlanc46 says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    If wishes were horses….

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  209. …Aaron unexpectedly averaged 41 homers per season from 1969 (age 35) to 1973 (age 39).

    “Unexpectedly”? Until Denver and Phoenix got into the game, Hank’s “Launching Pad” held the record MLB elevation by a comfortable margin.

    https://sabr.org/bioproj/park/atlanta-fulton-county-stadium

    Aaron tied Eddie Mathews for the most home runs (47) hit in a season by an American-born Brave. Andruw Jones is the only Brave ever to hit the 50 mark, with 51. In an insult to Boston, Mathews set the franchise record in their first year in Milwaukee.

    I’m more impressed with the previous record holder, Wally Berger, who set his records at Braves Field (20′), not County Stadium (602′) or Atlanta Stadium (1,050′).

  210. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Anonymous

    Therefore, to save their male offspring from lives of pain, humiliation and degradation they fully refuse to become parents.

    So how do you explain the fact that the decline in white birth rates started in the third quarter of the 19th century? In Britain it started in the 1860s. And it started with the middle and upper classes who were doing extremely well at the time.

    My theory is that it began with the widespread availability of cheap, effective, relatively convenient contraceptives. And yes, cheap, effective, relatively convenient contraceptives were widely available in the 1860s. When white people suddenly discovered they could have one or two or at most three kids instead of six or eight or ten they embraced the idea with enthusiasm (just as East Asians have embraced the same idea with enthusiasm in more recent times). They discovered that it was possible to have sex for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.

    The decline in birth rates accelerated with the introduction of the contraceptive pill in the early 60s because it made birth control even easier and even more convenient. It made recreational sex even more fun.

    The truth is that most people do not want lots of kids. They want one or two. If they can have regular enjoyable sex without ending up with a horde of kids then that’s what they will choose.

    That may be, and probably is, the entire explanation for demographic collapse.

  211. MBlanc46 says:
    @Dr. X

    Depressing and far too accurate and without anything resembling a clear way forward in view. It’s not difficult to think that the patient is terminal.

  212. @Kratoklastes

    Not sure that White America includes too many descendants of members of the 1940s Soviet military – those are the men (and women) who won The Big One.

    80% of the boys born in the USSR in 1923 did not live to see 1946. They’d have few descendants anywhere.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @anon
  213. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    I’m not aware of Tom House ever saying Aaron (or Davey Johnson) was on steroids in 1973. But I do know Nolan Ryan gave a shout out to Tom House in his Hall of Fame induction speech for Nolan’s late career renaissance.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  214. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    Because of poverty or because of race?

    Well, poverty tends to be related to IQ, and IQ is related to race…..

    Black American average IQ: 85

    White American average IQ: 100

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Corvinus
  215. syonredux says:
    @Kratoklastes

    the descendants of the men who won The Big One

    Not sure that White America includes too many descendants of members of the 1940s Soviet military – those are the men (and women) who won The Big One.

    Not in the Pacific……

    • Thanks: Hibernian
  216. Hibernian says:
    @Muggles

    Also, American Indians never had the “defeated nation” mopes, as some seem to believe.

    So why the high rate of alcoholism? And since you’re lecturing about asking the Indians for the answer, how many Indians have you met?

    • Replies: @Muggles
  217. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    The Giants with Willie Mays won a lot of baseball games, they had 18 winning records in the 21 years Mays was on the team (one of the losing seasons was while he was mostly in the military), they just tended to not be able to get past the Yankees, Dodgers (Brooklyn and Koufax LA), and Cardinals with Bob Gibson, with Aaron’s Braves and Robinson’s Reds occasionally getting in the way.

  218. reflections on some of the baseball comments on this thread:

    When we talk about great ballplayers of the past, we have no knowledge of the cheating, the grooved fastballs down the middle, the chumps hired by the opposition to make the visiting hero look great, the payoffs to the umpires and the grounds crew, the special sauce or the little green pills (amphetamines and, apparently starting in the 60s, roids) that doctors or semi-doctors provided, and so on. Of course the Yankees were the best team, of course Babe Ruth was the best home run hitter, but those are plain broad statements – when you get to the details, to talking about the difference between the third and fourth best player, or the second and third best team, you really do not know what was going on – you just don’t, no matter how much research you do. WWE style shenanigans had to be frequent: I mean , read up on the clown(s) who pretended to be upright commissioners, or the crazy crew of owners of the Atlantic Coast teams (not that the Midwest crew was much better).

    That being said, you can still make semi-accurate judgements of offensive players of the past just by watching the old videos, or by reading the honest assessments made by their peers. Ted Williams had a swing that was as different from Hank Aaron’s as you could imagine, but both were pretty good swings. I don’t remember any of Mickey Mantle’s peers every criticizing his level of play. Some managers were winners and were universally praised by every sober player on their roster, some were not.

    Pitchers are a different story than position players, I think the ratings of pitchers are pretty accurate (Curt Schilling’s twitter feed is currently a good place to start, if you are interested in circa 1970s-2010s pitchers).

    Now, about 5 decades after the first time I caught a fly ball on the run in the outfield, I gotta say that there are no real impressive defense plays. Imagine you spend your life sprinting full out for five seconds with a glove on your hand and every single time you are practicing catching a ball at the end of the five seconds. As interesting as the Endy Chavez and Willy Mays and other famous outfield catches were, it would be pretty sad if catches like that were not regularly made by people who spent their lives trying to do exactly that. If you have the speed, it should not be that hard to do once in every ten or twenty tries, for example. Not saying I could do it, but I did not spend long afternoons every year of my life from second grade on practicing how to do it. Sort of wish I had, but we all need to know our limits, and to find what we are best at, and not waste time on what we are not best at.

  219. Mr. Anon says:
    @Corvinus

    Because of a crime wave?

    Yes. One that was largely caused by them.

    Not at all. Freedom of association remains, ……….

    No, it largely doesn’t.

    Most embrace our American way of life.

    Debatable. Anyway, that isn’t what’s at issue, you moron.

  220. @dfordoom

    But Israel’s secular Jews have a much higher fertility rate b/c that society explicitly affirms the sanctity of their genetic continuity. Surely the success of Israel acts as a rle model for Whites. We admire Israel so much that we want one for ourselves.

  221. @SafeNow

    In one edition of the Bill James historical abstract he says the Mickey Mantle 1956 season was the single Most Valuable ever.

    Obviously this question is sort of pointless; I enjoyed reading the book anyway but it has never been allocated permanent library shelf space. Also James thinks Yogi Berra was vastly more talented as a baseball player than as a conversationalist. That might be the one that was most surprising to me.

    Also I will never forget his evaluation of Rick Cerrone. “Now holds the record for longest career milked out of one good year. The record was previously held by Oscar Gamble.” It’s been thirty years since I read that and it may as well have been yesterday.

    • Replies: @Stephen Dodge
    , @Known Fact
  222. @Morton's toes

    You have to know who Joe Garagiola was to understand the second paragraph of that comment.

  223. @Barnard

    They also went on to beat the 99 win Cincinnati Reds in the NLCS and went to seven games in the World Series with the A’s.

    A seven-game “NLCS” is a crapshoot. I prefer the more impressive 154- and 162-game NLCS they used until 1968.

    It is rare for teams who barely make the playoffs to go on big runs, but it does happen…

    Actual playoffs are quite rare, as first place isn’t shared that often after six months of play. I’ve been told that MLB uses the language “championship series” precisely because calling them “playoffs”, which they are not, can open them up to lawsuits, FTC action, and the like.

    …and regular seasons results don’t diminish that accomplishment.

    You’ve got it backwards. “That accomplishment” diminishes regular season results.

    Worse than 1973 was 1987. The Twins clinched their pathetic excuse of a division with a week remaining, and basically went on vacation, losing the last seven, while regional rivals Detroit and Toronto were chasing 100 wins together.

    A Minnesota friend told me at regular season’s end that he relished the prospect of his well-rested squad making quick work of the worn-out, beaten-up winner in the East. I replied that that would be both ugly and obscene.

    Turns out we were both right.

    Milwaukee lies farther west than Chicago, anyway, so were the divisions aligned to fit their names, the Brewers would have beat the Twins by six games rather than finishing seven behind Detroit. Same in 1973– Cincinnati is in the Mets’ time zone, not Chicago and St Louis.

  224. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Funny how for all the hoopla and verbal fellatio regarding HOF BOS LF Ted Williams’s hitting prowess, almost no one ever mentions his fielding and throwing. Because he wasn’t a five tool player.

    Babe Ruth spent his entire post-Sox career in right field or at first base, notorious dumping grounds for those who can hit but not field. Yes, there have been many capable defensemen at both, but why would you waste a Hall-of-Fame glove at either of the two least critical positions?

    Ruth’s accomplishments in the field came on the mound. So he was a great both in the field and at the plate, but not at the same time.

  225. @dfordoom

    ‘They discovered that it was possible to have sex for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.”

    Right, in all of human evolution (millions of years) it took until the twentieth century for people to figure out that they really, really liked sex a whole bunch a lot. BS

    First off, one of the main reasons why humans tended to have tons of children was because of: the woman’s likelihood of dying during childbirth (as it was indeed a risky endeavor until early twentieth century). And then also, out of 8-10 children, two or three would die before reaching the age of five, and another two or three would die before reaching adulthood. The only way the human race could survive from generation to generation was to overshoot the mark and have as many kids as possible.

    Of course, from time to time you’d have the problem that Edward III of England did, where he had about a dozen children and about nine of them survived into adulthood. This was the main reason for why the Plantagenet dynasty in England ended (War of the Roses).

    But since ordinary people weren’t as fortunate to have all their many brood survive into adulthood, overshooting the mark was necessary.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  226. @Morton's toes

    I remember James urging Spike Owen and Willie Randolph to exchange names — because “Spike Owen” was too cool a name to waste on a crappy short-careered ballplayer

  227. @Steve Sailer

    In his autobiography Juiced, Jose Canseco made a passing reference to Nolan Ryan being on the Rangers when he joined the team. It’s unlikely that Ryan did steroids during his prime. If one wants to make a case that he did in fact juice during the final years of his career, it is an interesting idea to ponder and wouldn’t have been surprising as he pitched into the beginnings of when most agree that the PED era of MLB was getting underway (late ’80’s, early ’90’s).

    Aside from strikeouts and no-hitters, Nolan Ryan was very overrated. In twenty-seven years he had only two 20 game W seasons, and also is the MLB career leader in bases on balls. From a winning perspective, Ryan was at .526. Respectable, nothing to write home about. All those K’s, it would’ve helped if he had more W’s during the season. And more games W lead to WS W’s as well.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  228. Anonymous[200] • Disclaimer says:
    @Bruno

    Oh! How wonderful!

    My only question is this:

    The distinctly under doctored Nigerian people are in vastly greater need of medical care and attention than the pampered British – who have doctors and fully equipped hospitals at, literally, every street corner.
    Obviously, this young woman would be of much more use to her own kind – who, obviously, she couldn’t give a damn about – than the racially alien former colonizers of Nigeria upon whom she has imposed herself.

    Of course, it’s just all about money and her standard of living. She absolutely couldn’t care less about the millions of her country folk suffering pain and disease.

    In short, she is *contemptible* and not some sort of heroine people are pretending she is.

  229. Alden says:
    @Anonymous

    It was White men who did it to White men. Every President, Vice President Senator judge and all but about 10 Congress critters involved in destroying White men were White men.

    Once more, 1964 civil rights act, 1965 unlimited non White immigration act, 1967 Philadelphia Plan 1968 affirmative action act 1973 Griggs vs Duke Power. 1975 opening to China and massive Asian invasion in California and the mopping up operation, Kaiser vs Weber 1979.

    From 1967 Philadelphia Plan to 1979 Kaiser vs Weber White men destroyed White American men in just 12 years.

    It’s very very striving petty bourgeois to believe that only working class White men are being destroyed. White men have been driven out of medicine from physicians and researchers to EMTs and nurses aides. The White men who built the American tech industry were kicked out as soon as it was built and the barely functional code coolies were imported.

  230. anon[314] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    80% of the boys born in the USSR in 1923 did not live to see 1946.

    Citation required.

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  231. anon[314] • Disclaimer says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    80% of the boys born in the USSR in 1923 did not live to see 1946.

    Citation required.

  232. Anonymous[200] • Disclaimer says:
    @dfordoom

    No.

    I’m describing a quite new and different phenomenon entirely.

    As I tried to explain, young white men of the better sort, by that I mean those blessed with a certain intelligence and sensitivity and instinctive awareness of the world about them – and the rulers over them – intuit full well that the white men of the future will be the bitches, punks, slaves etc of the new entrenched black/brown/feminist Economist overclass, who politically will be all powerful and unassailable. The Democrat Party.
    Therefore they refuse to bring children into this world, the Democrat/Economist run USA. They are not stupid. They are very wise to do this. As I said they remind me of magnificent carnivores incarcerated in zoos which simply refuse to breed. The higher the type of life,the stronger is this birth protest against oppression.

    This is not the same as Malthusian induced family limitation.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  233. dfordoom says: • Website
    @moshe

    This whole mask/social distancing thing is often getting tossed at the feet of the elderly and boomers but, in my experience, it is FAR more the fault of little pussy bitches forever afraid of exploration and begging authorities to keep them in a safe space.

    That’s what I’m seeing here in Australia. The only white people wearing masks are Millennials. And Millennials just love love love the lockdowns and the social distancing.

    • Agree: moshe
  234. notsaying says:
    @J.Ross

    I had to look up Rifftrax to see what it was. I wish I could see what you saw.

    It is very humbling sometimes to realize how people from prior generations went without what we take for granted, such as a holiday turkey. On the other hand there are things they took for granted that we either don’t have or worry about losing. The post-WW II American way of life is in shambles for our working class and under threat for our middle class. That people have lots more degrees and gizmos and eat out a lot more often doesn’t change that. That life is fairer and freer for women and blacks doesn’t make up for what we have lost either.

    People feel robbed — all kinds of people — and most of them are right.

  235. Alden says:
    @syonredux

    How does higher IQ help when every employer in the country happily obeys federal court ordered and federal and state regulations to not hire the most qualified Whites?

  236. Anonymous[341] • Disclaimer says:
    @dfordoom

    The decline in birth rates accelerated with the introduction of the contraceptive pill in the early 60s because it made birth control even easier and even more convenient. It made recreational sex even more fun.

    “When I see a couple of kids
    And guess he’s fucking her and she’s
    Taking pills or wearing a diaphragm,
    I know this is the paradise
    Everyone old has dreamed of all their lives—
    Bonds and gestures pushed to one side
    Like an outdated combine harvester,
    And everyone young going down the long slide
    To happiness, endlessly. …”
    ~ Philip Larkin

  237. Muggles says:
    @Hibernian

    >>So why the high rate of alcoholism? And since you’re lecturing about asking the Indians for the answer, how many Indians have you met?<<

    As to question one, there are several theories. One is again genetic. AmerInds had no alcoholic drinks prior to European arrival (maybe a few accidently fermented berries, like bears sometimes find.) So lacking beer or wine for generations, they might be more susceptible. Some think this may also account for the higher rate among Nordic peoples (Scandinavians, European Russians) since they had only weak beer at most. Also, AmerInds being on the government dole and loss of their original nomadic lifestyles, living in remote rural areas, might play a factor.

    As to question two, I was raised in a state with numerous Indian reservations. Went to school with some (though not near a res.) For a time I was acquainted with Indian activist Russell Means through mutual friends. Different tribes/bands have different cultures, habits, belief systems, economic lifestyles. In my limited experience they tend to be quiet with a good sense of humor. Obviously personalities and even tribal customs differ.

  238. In Case and Deaton’s view the White Death, which got rolling after the Sackler family’s Purdue Pharma introduced OxyContin in the mid-1990s, symbolizes the failures of Milken Era capitalism that let down the white American working class

    I seem to recall Paul Craig Roberts defending Michael Milken, or at least arguing that the man was being railroaded. As a Nixon man, he must have experienced déjà-vu; my boss may be a penny-ante crook, but those going after him are much worse.

    That would seem pretty interesting, but Case and Deaton then largely drop other races besides white and black at that point.

    Kevin McDonald once suggested that he’d take a break from Jews and go study other diasporas. I don’t think he ever did, but others ere know his œuvre better, so I’ll leave the question to them.

    Thomas Sowell and Amy Chua produced fascinating work by examining multiple diasporas. McDonald is capable of the same.

  239. Ron Unz says:

    I haven’t read the book, but I wonder if it provides any information on the regional distribution of these severe white working-class problems. For example, I’d be interested in knowing whether they’re present in California.

    A large majority of the CA working-class is non-white, especially Latino. But although lots of working-class whites left the state over the last couple of decades, over 15M whites still live here, and millions of them surely must be working-class. Adjusted for living-expenses, CA has probably worst poverty rates in America. So we’re talking about a white working-class, in a white-minority state, having very high poverty levels. It sounds absolutely tailor-made for “deaths of despair,” especially since the state government is so overwhelmingly liberal Democrat.

    But I’ve never seen any indications of the problem in the CA newspapers. For example, CA has had a relatively small Opioid problem. And although homelessness is a major state issue, from what I’ve read here and there, a good fraction of the white homeless are actually drug addicts who’ve moved here from other states.

    Anyway, if the book or some other source has mortality/suicide/addiction data on working-class whites in CA, I’d be very interested in seeing it.

  240. @MBlanc46

    If wishes were horses…

    …the streets would stink to high heaven.

    (Or high hell.)

    Actually, the Times was pretty close to the mark. The streets of 1944 London were buried– under rubble.

  241. @Ron Unz

    If ever a state should consider increasing their minimum wage to help workers, CA is certainly that state.

  242. @YetAnotherAnon

    “After all, you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?”

    Steve? James Watson is on the line!

    With a vial of William Shockley’s frozen semen.

    We owe more than we realize to Shockley. If he weren’t such a horrible boss, there might never have been a Fairchild Semiconductor.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traitorous_eight

  243. @Reg Cæsar

    Not true. Ruth tied for the lead in the AL in HR’s in 1918, his last full year as a pitcher. The reason he didn’t lead the AL in HR’s during his pitching years was because he didn’t play every day. Ruth is of course an outlier in that yes, he did play in the field and was still a dominant hitter. But he was also on trajectory to become a HOF P, pitching 29 consecutive scoreless innings in two WS.

    By any major metric, Babe Ruth is the most dominant, the greatest player, hitter, period, in MLB history. You know you’re dominant in your sport when you not only transcend the sport itself, but you change the way the game is played. The HR has been the be all and end all of MLB since ca.1920, the year that Ruth hit more than entire teams combined. He and he alone did that. Ruth also set a record for intentional walks and total walks in a single season (which stood for 80 plus yrs until bested by Barry Bonds). So two of Sabermetrics’ three true outcomes (HR, BB) were directly impacted by Babe Ruth. It’s not too off the mark to state that if Babe Ruth hadn’t existed, someone like Bill James would’ve had to invent a prototype for what a most dominant player would look like. Thankfully history has a flesh and blood example of that prototype and his name is Babe Ruth.

    Also, HOF Roberto Clemente, one of the greatest NL RF’s of all time. 1 MVP, 3,000H, three batting titles, a sucky player? Really? Hank Aaron also played RF, and some consider him to have been a great fielder. Frank Robinson as well. Also, in modern times, Ichiro Suzuki, also a very dominant RF.
    So the greatest most dominant players are usually great at both with their bat and in the field (or on the mound in Ruth’s case). Williams was one of the few who were only great with their bat and nothing else. If he had struck out more times, he’d have been compared to Jim Thome or Harmon Killebrew.

    • Replies: @Desiderius
  244. Anonymous[387] • Disclaimer says:

    OT (Though perhaps not as OT as I would like, given both this topic and the present set of circumstances.)

    There is a quote, not in George Orwell’s 1984, but rather, about Orwell’s 1984 that I am hoping some clever person here will be able to recognise and refer me to the original quote.

    The quote goes something like this: when Orwell first published 1984, many in the West felt as though they wanted to commit suicide because they viewed the book as an ominous portent of things to come.

    but

    People in socialist countries viewed the book as a source of hope because they realised that 1984 told their own story to the outside world.

    (If anyone recognises the quote, I would be grateful if they could refer me to it.)

  245. syonredux says:
    @Ron Unz

    A large majority of the CA working-class is non-white, especially Latino. But although lots of working-class whites left the state over the last couple of decades, over 15M whites still live here, and millions of them surely must be working-class. Adjusted for living-expenses, CA has probably worst poverty rates in America. So we’re talking about a white working-class, in a white-minority state, having very high poverty levels. It sounds absolutely tailor-made for “deaths of despair,” especially since the state government is so overwhelmingly liberal Democrat.

    But I’ve never seen any indications of the problem in the CA newspapers. For example, CA has had a relatively small Opioid problem. And although homelessness is a major state issue, from what I’ve read here and there, a good fraction of the white homeless are actually drug addicts who’ve moved here from other states.

    Doctors in CA seem to be a tad less eager when it comes to handing out opioids:

    Opioid Pain Reliever Prescriptions
    In 2013, California providers wrote 54.9 opioid prescriptions for every 100 persons (approximately 21 million prescriptions). In the same year, the average U.S. rate was 79.3. Since then, opioid prescriptions in the United States have declined, with a nearly 12.8 percent decline in California from 2013 to 2015, resulting in an estimated 47.9 opioid prescriptions per 100 persons (18.7 million prescriptions) in 2015 (IMS Health, 2016).

    https://www.drugabuse.gov/drugs-abuse/opioids/opioid-summaries-by-state/california-opioid-summary

    Ethnic factors may play a role. Some states have White populations (Irish Catholics and Scots-Irish) that are prone to melancholy. Then there are environmental factors (CA is a famously sunshiny state).

    There’s also the question of political ideology. California Whites embrace the idea of White racial extinction. For example. I know White Republicans in CA who are quite glad that their grandchildren are not White. Whites in certain other states are less enthusiastic about the death of White America….

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
  246. @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Ryan’s amazing age 42-46 years (e.g., 300 strikeouts at 42) were unprecedented until Roger Clemens came along and did much the same.

    • Agree: Inverness
    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  247. @anon

    This fact-checker looked into it, and lowered the figure to 68%. That’s still quite a lot. It would be interesting to find out in which year the 80% mark was reached.

    Over Two-Thirds of Soviet Males Born in 1923 Did Not Live to the End of World War II

    Yes, the peace was deadlier than the war. If you call those early Soviet years “peace”.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
  248. @syonredux

    Doctors in CA seem to be a tad less eager when it comes to handing out opioids:

    Doctors are less aggressive where lawyers are more so.

  249. @dfordoom

    Are we seeing lots of white corporate lawyers, CEOs and commodities brokers dying deaths of despair?

    Those are barely the middle class, if at all, DforDoom, (I mean, you may call the corporate lawyers “upper middle class”, but not the CEOs and brokers.) The middle class is being slowly wiped out by Globalism and Socialism, which can cause lots of despair.

    Some avoid it for a while by getting in debt up to their ears to live the quality of life that a middle-class family in the 1980s lived. Others, being “working class” now, discriminated against for employment and college admissions since the 1970s while being told they are privileged at the same time, seeing opportunities get worse and worse for them, seeing family formation become out of the question, all while being forced (economically and legally) to live with people they’d rather not live with and raise kids around, may easily despair. Drugs don’t usually help matters.

    Socialism has caused the dysgenic effect in which there are even more people of all races that are not “viable” (in Falling Down terminology) in the new economy. Most of them would not have been bred and raised in a responsibility-rewarding society. The 55-year-long Globalist-pushed immigration invasion has kept wages down and made quality of life worse for everyone but the upper classes.

    I didn’t say the name-calling wasn’t from higher-class whites. That’s what I mean. Whenever (maybe if ever) they try to stand up for themselves as a group, whites are told they are being xenophobic, racist, and all manner of supposed insults. They need to quit worrying about being called these names and stick the hell together.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  250. @Old Palo Altan

    Don’t forget the Kievan Rus, the Byzantine Varangian guards and the (admittedly brief) existence of Vinland in North America!

    • Replies: @Old Palo Altan
  251. J.Ross says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Norm MacDonald had a bit where he pretended to have only just now discovered that Austrian politician Adolf Hitler was something of a curate’s egg. It would be less sad if we had an elite unburdened by such a pretense regarding Stalin.

  252. @Steve Sailer

    And I agree. If anyone can demonstrate beyond a doubt that Ryan used PEDS, I won’t a shed a tear. I don’t think that Nolan Ryan was juicing in the ’70’s when he was with the Angels and beginning to dominate the AL. The last few seasons of his career, however, perhaps a case can be made. Although true to form, he didn’t win more games. I am very much surprised to read that Nolan Ryan never won the Cy Young Award. That alone should demonstrate that among his peers he wasn’t considered the greatest of the great. A great strikeout pitcher, absolutely. And nothing else. A much greater pitcher among Ryan’s peers is Steve Carlton, who seldom receives much attention.

    Funny thing about Jose Canseco. No one called him a liar regarding the names he named in his book. Every single name that he mentioned who used PEDS were later found to have juiced. Every single one. I understand that Canseco retroactively (and quite publicly) attempted to deny that he believed that Clemens juiced, but in his book he makes the case that when they were teammates they talked about steroids and what they could do to help a player’s performance. Canseco also recalls that Clemens would state things along the lines that 2nd rate hitters were hitting much better due to PED usage, and that pitchers were losing any competitive edge at all. The book seems clear: Clemens decided to even the odds and start juicing.

    So lesson for today’s MLB. Test Trout, Judge, Cruz, Stanton, etc. Test them consistently and when they least expect it, a la the Olympics.

  253. Franz says:
    @Ron Unz

    But I’ve never seen any indications of the problem in the CA newspapers. For example, CA has had a relatively small Opioid problem.

    I haven’t seen the latest statistics, but a team of us went round this bush two years ago.

    The short version is, where weed is legal and cheap, narcotics are often ignored as an expensive luxury. In places like Ohio, where “medical” grass requires a $500 clinic fee and even then your supply can cost $100 per daily supply, cannabis is effectivly still illegal for the working class.

    Hence lots of deaths from illegal narcotics.

    California simply lets those in despair use what nature has provided to alleviate it. Other places are not so lucky, so the body count continues.

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
  254. @anon

    “The FBI’s crime report gives a pretty accurate number.”

    OK, what’s the number?

    “You can find it rather easily with a search tool.”

    Maybe you can show me how. From what I can see, the FBI gives “offenders by race” and “victims by race”, but there is no way to match offenders to victims.

    Even the (in)famous Color of Crime reports punt on this tricky question.

  255. @Reg Cæsar

    At the MLB level, the most incompetent outfielders usually end up in left field, not right. Right fielders need to make the long throw to third base, so they have to have better arms than left fielders.

  256. Ron Unz says:
    @Franz

    California simply lets those in despair use what nature has provided to alleviate it. Other places are not so lucky, so the body count continues.

    I tend to doubt that “medical marijuana” in California is much of a factor. My strong impression is that working-class whites here just don’t have the “despair factor” that seems to be very strong in much of the Midwest and the Appalachia region. Obviously, they’re often unhappy about the terrible traffic and the very high cost of housing, but that isn’t quite the same thing.

    For example, I remember a few years ago I was talking with a high-ranking CA union leader who’d recently relocated out here from a similar position in the Midwest, and he happened to mention how his workers seemed so much more optimistic in CA than he had become used to.

    Here’s another datapoint. One sign of the unhappiness of working-class whites was that so many of them voted for Trump in 2016, partly because the Establishment hated him. But white support for Trump in CA was something like 25(!) points lower than in the rest of the country. If whites everywhere had voted like CA whites, Trump would have lost all 50 states, most of them in gigantic landslides.

    Anyway, it would be interesting to see data on white suicide rates in CA or trends in white life-expectancy, or any other possible indicators of white working-class “despair.” I’m just skeptical that it’s been much of an issue in CA.

    • Replies: @Franz
    , @syonredux
  257. Keypusher says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Every time you say anything about sabermetrics you make a fool of yourself. I would avoid the topic if I were you.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  258. Keypusher says:

    The obvious difference between what happened to whites in the early 21st century and what blacks did in the last 35 years of the 20th century is that whites grew more suicidal while blacks grew more homicidal.

    Damn, that’s good.

    After all, you’ve already won a Nobel Prize: How much do you still have to fear from the enemies of science?

    Yes, what have the enemies of science ever done to a Nobel Prize winner?

  259. Franz says:
    @Ron Unz

    For example, I remember a few years ago I was talking with a high-ranking CA union leader who’d recently relocated out here from a similar position in the Midwest, and he happened to mention how his workers seemed so much more optimistic in CA than he had become used to.

    Might auger well for down the road: Fed up people in West Virginia, Ohio, etc., migrating out to California like the Okies in the 1930s. If poorly paid anyway, go where the weather’s better and laws more sane.

    Might reverse more than one trend but I’d be careful before I wished for it.

  260. @Achmed E. Newman

    Whites are being defeated by their own cowardice this time, not overwhelming man- and fire-power. It’s a cowardice about being called names, which is pretty shameful.

    The stories that white Americans are told about themselves and constantly repeat are significant surely. White Americans used to believe in ‘manifest destiny’, but now communally believe that their presence on the North American continent is totally illegitimate. I don’t see how any group can compete when they continually tell themselves they don’t deserve to even be in the competition.

  261. @The Last Real Calvinist

    Some leftfielders like Ricky Henderson and Barry Bonds are really fast but just have weak arms. But some leftfielders like Greg Luzinski are just bad.

    At the lower levels, however, right field is where you hide your bad fielders, like me and Peter Yarrow of Peter, Paul, and Mary:

  262. dfordoom says: • Website
    @J1234

    In 2017, 158,000 Americans died from what we call deaths of despair: suicide, overdoses, and alcoholic liver disease and cirrhosis.

    There was a time when the last three causes of death on that list would’ve been generally perceived as deaths of decadence rather than despair. Sorry…I consider myself a white advocate on many levels, but I’m not buying into the “my self-destructiveness is somebody else’s fault” argument, even (and maybe especially) for white people.

    I think you have a point. The idea that despair drives people to self-destructiveness is popular, but dubious.

    I’m in my early sixties, and yet somehow have managed to avoid recreational drugs all of my life – even pot – so my empathy for whites who overdose and drink excessively (I do drink moderately) is limited.

    I tend to agree. I think you can make a pretty strong argument that a person who has problems with drugs has a problem because he chooses to use drugs. A person who has problems with excessive drinking has a problem because he chooses to drink too much. Nobody is holding a gun to his head and forcing him to take drugs or have that twelfth Scotch.

    Of course this being Unz Review it’s inevitable that the popular view here will be that it’s all the result of a vast conspiracy.

  263. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    ‘They discovered that it was possible to have sex for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.”

    Right, in all of human evolution (millions of years) it took until the twentieth century for people to figure out that they really, really liked sex a whole bunch a lot. BS

    You’ve entirely missed my point (rather spectacularly). It was not until the third quarter of the 19th century that the technology existed to allow people to have sex for pleasure without having to worry too much that they would end up with lots more kids than they wanted. By the early 1960s the technology existed to allow people to have sex for pleasure with even less cause for worry that they would end up with lots more kids than they wanted.

    The appearance of the technology to separate sex for pleasure from the risk of unwanted pregnancy was one of the most momentous changes in all of history.

    For the first time in history a married couple could decide exactly how many children they were going to have without having to give up having sex.

    And the conclusion is blindingly obvious. Birth rates have plummeted not just in western countries but in lots of non-western countries as well. Birth rates started to collapse before the time when economic hardships or immigration or feminism or cultural marxism could possibly have been factors. Therefore it logically follows that when given the choice most people people will choose to have only one or two kids because that’s how many kids they actually want.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
    , @anon
  264. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Anonymous

    As I tried to explain, young white men of the better sort, by that I mean those blessed with a certain intelligence and sensitivity and instinctive awareness of the world about them – and the rulers over them – intuit full well that the white men of the future will be the bitches, punks, slaves etc of the new entrenched black/brown/feminist Economist overclass, who politically will be all powerful and unassailable. The Democrat Party.
    Therefore they refuse to bring children into this world

    The problem is that that is entirely an unproven assertion.

    The evidence is that birth rates have plummeted among non-whites as well as whites. How do you explain the fact that birth rates in Singapore, Taiwan, Japan, South Korea, etc are even lower than birth rates for whites in North America and Europe? That inconvenient fact does not fit your theory at all.

    Birth rates among American blacks have plummeted. How does your theory explain that?

    I did understand your point. I just don’t think there’s any evidence to support it.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  265. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Achmed E. Newman

    The middle class is being slowly wiped out by Globalism and Socialism, which can cause lots of despair.

    But are middle-class white people killing themselves with opioids and other drugs, and alcoholism? If not, why are they immune from such problems?

    And the question for those who see race as the explanation for absolutely everything (and I’m not including you in that category) – why don’t middle-class whites care about the plight of working-class whites?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  266. Polynikes says:
    @Sam Malone

    As I touched on in another post, metal rock guys tend to be more intelligent and thoughtful than you would expect. We’re not talking scientist level intelligence, but on the spectrum of athlete/entertainer they will be near the top. They’re generally into themes found in history, mythology and even psychology. Trent Reznor of NiN has found a second act doing scores for movies, and he’s pretty good at it.

  267. @Ron Unz

    Let me reintroduce a post that I made a few years ago.

    I did my own analysis to determine the best states to live and raise a child.

    Here’s what I did to create my list.

    1. I inputed the rates of incarceration, overdose, teen births, death, and obesity for each state. However, I only utilized the data for the Non-Hispanic white populations of each state.
    2. For America’s entire non-Hispanic white population, I found the national medians on the rates of incarceration, overdose, teen births, death, and obesity.
    3. I divided each state’s incarceration, overdose, teen pregnancy, death, and obesity rates by the respective national medians.
    4. By averaging together these modified rates, I computed an “Index of Misery” for each state.
    5. Higher the index, the worse off the population. Lower the index, better off the state. Above 1 = worse than average. Below 1 = better than average. You can make a relative comparison among our various states.
    6. The below chart applies only to NH-Whites.

    The data apply to all Whites, not just those from the working-class.

    As you can see, California Whites do quite well. Whites from the Upper Midwest perform favorably too, as do Whites from much of the Northeast.

    Perhaps it’s not surprising that Whites perform well in California and the Northeast, as high real estate prices force out the more marginal and troubled elements.

    View post on imgur.com

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
  268. Corvinus says:
    @syonredux

    Correlation does not equal causation. At least from this statistic, more white people by the numbers are impoverished.

    African American Poverty Rate: 20.8% (8.9 million people)–Percentage of African Americans who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    Hispanic Poverty Rate: 17.6% (10.5 million people)–Percentage of Hispanics who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    White Poverty Rate: 8.1% (15.7 million people)–Percentage of non-Hispanic Whites who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    Native American Poverty Rate: 23.7% (600,000 people)–Percentage of Native Americans who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    • Replies: @syonredux
  269. @fatmanscoop

    No, the people telling are doing so in order to distance themselves from any taint of White identity (and now American identity out of confusion/megalomania). The dynamic is in no sense suicidal except perhaps inadvertently. The purveyors are such White supremacists that they can’t even imagine their treachery perhaps coming back to haunt them.

  270. @Hypnotoad666

    London is undoubtedly the culture capital for Europe and much of the world.

    London isn’t even the cultural capital of the UK. Nobody on the continent knows or cares about what London does. Europe is very nationalistic and decidedly not anglophile (with the exception of Scandinavia) It is also not anglophone, which seems hard to grasp for Americans and Brits. The vast majority of people (again, excluding Scandinavians, but not Finns) is out of the reach of BBC and CNN because they simply do not speak English (well enough)

  271. Slimer says:

    It’s nice how Ron Unz periodically reminds everyone that life in California’s not so bad. Isn’t that what really matters?

  272. Ron Unz says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    The data apply to all Whites, not just those from the working-class.

    As you can see, California Whites do quite well. Whites from the Upper Midwest perform favorably too, as do Whites from much of the Northeast.

    Perhaps it’s not surprising that Whites perform well in California and the Northeast, as high real estate prices force out the more marginal and troubled elements.

    That’s pretty interesting, and accords with my own impressions.

    However, just as you say, the CA figures might be skewed because working-class whites are probably a much smaller percentage of the local white population.

    But my guess would be that even if you restricted the results only to working-class whites, CA would come out looking pretty good. I just haven’t seen much anecdotal evidence of the sort of “culture of despair” apparently widespread elsewhere in the country.

    Similarly, although my local newspapers are very liberal, I almost never see the sort of “anti-white agitprop” that’s annoyingly common in the NYT and other national publications.

  273. @Keypusher

    Point being, is to add balance to the conversation. Extremes exist on both sides of the debate. While it may be the accepted consensus, the “science” is not 100% accurate let alone perfect by any means. For example, it’s no secret but an actual fact that the Sabermetricians initially downplayed/ignored the direct impact that players on PEDS were having on the sport at large.

  274. @dfordoom

    “You’ve entirely missed my point (rather spectacularly).”

    No, I heard your point, and I totally rejected it with regards of the timespan, placing it in the late nineteenth century, rather than in the the twentieth century where it belongs.

    While some improvements in birth control were being made at the time, childbearing as well as child delivery during the nineteenth century was still a burden if not a major danger for most women around the world, including in the US. It wasn’t until the early 20th century where dying during child delivery was for the most part totally eradicated (at least in the Western world). You also conveniently ignored my point, that the reason birthrates were quite high during the nineteenth century (as they were before for most of human history) was not only because of lack of birth control, but also because they had to be to insure the survival of the human species. If a woman had 8-10 children, it was a given that anywhere from 4-7 would die either before they reached their tenth birthday, or before they made it to adulthood. This was just basic evolutionary survival. And survival will trump pleasure any day of the week.

    For a society devoted (or at least greatly concerned about) the value of pleasure (or leisure), one needs to be fairly affluent in lifestyle, where survival isn’t the main concern, and of course with less risk as you touched upon.

    See, you missed my point entirely. Having time for pleasure, planning how many kids are wanted, etc. takes time. It also means that an individual family unit is doing quite well on the economic scale so as to have oodles of time to decide these things, rather than a couple of times during the week while making sure the family doesn’t die out because of dire economic circumstances. Couple that with the fact that childbearing became easier for women in general (the chance of dying was greatly removed during the twentieth century) and the fact that most children would be born fairly healthy enough to make it into adulthood, and you now have time for leisure, pleasure, to make the decisions regarding how many kids you want to raise.

    Lets not so lightly gloss over the fact that up to the 20th century, childbearing wasn’t an easy task for women in the Western world. And again, having tons of kids was to ensure the survival of the species. Ten kids per family meant that at least 2-4 would see adulthood to pass on their genes to the next generation. The twentieth century, with the advent of better birth control methods as well as easier time of childbearing/delivery, and the birthrates began to come down.

    Except for during the good economic times known as the “Baby Boom” Generation at mid. century. The irony, of course being, that the economy was very stable, there was now plenty of leisure time for most Americans, childbearing and delivery were definitely easier than at any time in human history, and guess what? The US birth rate increased. So collectively, most Americans during this time decided that they wanted to have more children as it was worth it to them. Their pleasure for sex was used to procreate and have more kids.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  275. @dfordoom

    “Birth rates among American blacks have plummeted.”

    That’s a fairly easy one. Abortion. Some studies indicate that nearly half of all total number of US annual abortions are performed on African-Americans. Among other factors of course. But abortion is a major factor regarding why the black birthrates have fallen. It’s also the case in Japan, which was one of the earliest nations to legalize abortion (ca. 1947). China’s One Child Policy for several decades will probably had some long term impact on China’s population as well down the road.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @dfordoom
  276. syonredux says:
    @Ron Unz

    Similarly, although my local newspapers are very liberal, I almost never see the sort of “anti-white agitprop” that’s annoyingly common in the NYT and other national publications.

    Agitprop is deployed where it is needed. CA Whites are completely pozzed; hence, they get less agitprop.

  277. syonredux says:
    @Corvinus

    Correlation does not equal causation. At least from this statistic, more white people by the numbers are impoverished.

    African American Poverty Rate: 20.8% (8.9 million people)–Percentage of African Americans who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    Hispanic Poverty Rate: 17.6% (10.5 million people)–Percentage of Hispanics who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    White Poverty Rate: 8.1% (15.7 million people)–Percentage of non-Hispanic Whites who fell below the poverty line in 2018

    Come on! You’ve got to be a parody account! Do you seriously expect me to believe that you don’t understand percentages?

  278. syonredux says:
    @Ron Unz

    Here’s another datapoint. One sign of the unhappiness of working-class whites was that so many of them voted for Trump in 2016, partly because the Establishment hated him. But white support for Trump in CA was something like 25(!) points lower than in the rest of the country. If whites everywhere had voted like CA whites, Trump would have lost all 50 states, most of them in gigantic landslides.

    Again, the Poz factor. CA Whites think that White America needs to die. Whites in other parts of the country think differently.

  279. anon[394] • Disclaimer says:
    @dfordoom

    They discovered that it was possible to have sex for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.

    Ok Boomer!

    What is Tantra? When did it first exist?
    Who was Geoffrey Chaucer? When did he write the Tale of the Wife of Bath?

    When was the Song of Solomon written?

    lol @ignorant dfordumbass

  280. anon[394] • Disclaimer says:
    @dfordoom

    It was not until the third quarter of the 19th century that the technology existed to allow people to have sex for pleasure without having to worry too much that they would end up with lots more kids than they wanted.

    Ridiculous. Just for a start, condoms existed in the 16th century.

    Here’s some cookies on the lower shelf for you. Suggest you learn to use Google someday.

    http://www.afn.org/~afn32612/Contraception.htm
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silphium
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_birth_control

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  281. @Ron Unz

    Here are the percentage of working-class Whites by state. The data are from the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis.

    View post on imgur.com

    According to the data set, America was 43.2% Non-Hispanic White in the 2013-2017 time interval. During the same interval, America was approximately 61.6% Non-Hispanic White. So 70% of Non-Hispanic White Americans are working-class.

    According to the graphic above, California appears to be 22% working-class White. California was approximately 37.8% Non-Hispanic White in 2015. So 58.2% of Non-Hispanic White Californians are working-class.

  282. @dfordoom

    Because the middle-class whites are OK with being middle-class until they are not anymore (middle-class, that is). That’s what I’m getting at. I don’t think this kind of despair sets in until the money runs out to support that quality of life that one’s pay used to cover nicely. The middle class in America as a group is dwindling fast.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  283. @fatmanscoop

    I agreed until the “… they continually tell themselves …” part, Fat Man. It’s not like it’s mostly individuals telling their very selves these things. It’s the higher-class white people, as DforDoom wrote, that keep drilling in, in schools, universities, HR department and whatever-else that “you white men are bad and your presence is illegitimate.” They don’t include themselves in this, as, being the ones calling out white people, they are A-OK.

    Sorry for the late reply, BTW.

  284. @Diversity Heretic

    I had forgotten them – thank you for reminding me.
    I’m a particular admirer of the Kievan Rus, so shame on me.

  285. syonredux says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    According to the data set, America was 43.2% Non-Hispanic White in the 2013-2017 time interval. During the same interval, America was approximately 61.6% Non-Hispanic White.

    Unless you’re Ron Unz, that’s a pretty depressing stat.Here are some more:

    Reflecting a demographic shift, 109 U.S. counties have become majority nonwhite since 2000.

    https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/08/21/u-s-counties-majority-nonwhite/

    The US white majority will soon disappear forever
    By 2050, the US will be a ‘majority-minority’ country, with white non-Hispanics making up less than half of the total population.

    https://www.chicagoreporter.com/the-us-white-majority-will-soon-disappear-forever/

    The slow death of Anglo-America….

    • Replies: @JohnnyWalker123
  286. @Ron Unz

    Off topic, but here’s some interesting news about Jeffrey Epstein.

    Epstein had his own office at Harvard. He had his own key card to give him unlimited access to the building. He visited the building over 40 times. This was AFTER his 2008 conviction for child prostitution.

    Read here.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279193/Jeffrey-Epstein-OFFICE-Harvard-damning-report-reveals.html

    Apparently, Harvard faculty flew on Epstein’s infamous “Lolita Express” plane. They also visited his “homes” in NY, Florida, and New Mexico. They visited his island as well.

    They visited him in jail too (after the arrest for child sex crimes), which is sort of interesting.

    Harvard admitted that many faculty members wined and dined with Epstein, even after he was convicted of child sex acts in 2008

    “A number of the Harvard faculty members we interviewed also acknowledged that they visited Epstein in his homes in New York, Florida, New Mexico or the Virgin Islands, visited him in jail or on work release, or traveled on one of his planes. Faculty members told us that they undertook these off-campus activities primarily in their personal capacities rather than as representatives of Harvard. These actions did not implicate Harvard rules or policies,” the investigation concluded.

    I know you are a Harvard alumni who takes a lot of interest in your Alma Mater. So I wanted to let you know what the faculty members of your Alma Mater have been up to.

    Alan Dershowitz taught at Harvard Law School for many years. Given his close relationship with Jeffrey Epstein, maybe he was the conduit through which Epstein gained access to Harvard.

  287. @JohnnyWalker123

    That chart doesn’t separate Hispanic and non-Hispanic whites. Where would “white Hispanic” George Zimmerman fit? Freddie Prinze, Sr or Jr?

    If you add whites, Hispanics, and Asians, they make up 52% of DC’s 2018 population. Non-blacks were over 55%.

    Counting Hispanic whites, the District is fast approaching a white majority, with maybe 5% at most of them proletarian. Like Dick Heller.

    Then there’s this:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Washington,_D.C.#LGBT_population

    The 23rd Amendment, whatever its utility once–it was ratified by 40 states–is now obsolete.

  288. @Steve Sailer

    Yeah, it was Luzinski who immediately came to my mind when prompted to think about ‘bad MLB left fielders’.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  289. @Reg Cæsar

    That chart doesn’t separate Hispanic and non-Hispanic whites.

    Actually, it does separate Whites from White Hispanics.

    https://www.stlouisfed.org/on-the-economy/2019/october/white-working-class-state-county-level-changes

  290. syonredux says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    Key facts about the racial and ethnic composition of the U.S. child population
    The proportion of non-Hispanic white children in the U.S. has declined from 61 percent of all children in 2000 to 51 percent in 2016.

    In contrast, the proportion of children with Hispanic origins has grown from 17 percent in 2000 to 25 percent in 2016.
    The percentage of the child population that is non-Hispanic black has stayed relatively constant since 1980, at 14 to 15 percent.

    Dear me, I hope that Ron doesn’t start drooling….

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  291. syonredux says:
    @Reg Cæsar

    Mind you, most of the “White Latinx” that I’m personally acquainted with are academics…..But, based on that sample, White Latinx really, really hate Anglo-Whites…..

    Incidentally, did you know that Nazis were running LA back in the ’30s? It’s on HBO, so it must be true….

  292. Ron Unz says:
    @JohnnyWalker123

    According to the graphic above, California appears to be 22% working-class White. California was approximately 37.8% Non-Hispanic White in 2015. So 58.2% of Non-Hispanic White Californians are working-class.

    Thanks for the information. That’s really a little surprising since I’d generally assumed that CA whites these days skewed much more affluent than that.

    If almost 60% of CA whites are working-class, then the rather low level of CA white support for Trump and lack of “white deaths of despair” in the state is even more significant. On the latter point, do you have any data on the longevity trends of CA whites over the last couple of decades? That’s probably one of the best proxies we could have for “white deaths of despair.” My guess is that CA whites are actually doing pretty well compared with the horrible trends for whites nationally.

    Consider that CA whites are now the smallest statewide white minority in America (except for tiny Hawaii). If my suspicions are correct and they’re actually doing pretty well in longevity and other social indicators factors, I’d say that would tend to undercut the assumptions of many of the commenters here. It would demonstrate that becoming a white minority may—or may not—lead to all sorts of social and psychological problems, depending upon various other factors.

    • Replies: @syonredux
    , @syonredux
  293. syonredux says:
    @Ron Unz

    If my suspicions are correct and they’re actually doing pretty well in longevity and other social indicators factors, I’d say that would tend to undercut the assumptions of many of the commenters here. It would demonstrate that becoming a white minority may—or may not—lead to all sorts of social and psychological problems, depending upon various other factors.

    The course of action is obvious: Whites in other states must be conditioned to accept minority status. Once they accept that POC domination is right and good, they will start to feel better. Of course, we will have to increase the level of POZ Propaganda…..

    https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2019/11/25/history-violence-against-latinos

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoot_Suit_Riots

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_L.A._walkouts

  294. @Hypnotoad666

    But NYC (and DC) are where the U.S. power elite reside and where the MSM is headquartered. So NYC looms large.

    The biggest bitches on this site are about deplatforming, demonetization and the like, and the culprits invariably in Santa Clara County or along Puget Sound. New York City is irrelevant, except for the stock exchange. And even that– the corporations are all registered in Delaware, not New York.

    If the city is so damned dominant, how come I have to wait for the occasional Super Bowl to see my Giants on TV in the Upper Midwest?

  295. Neoconned says:
    @Anonymous

    You know what they say about sharks when they smell “blood in the water….”

  296. syonredux says:
    @Ron Unz

    Maybe California Anglo-Whites are a tad unwell……

    While death rates have generally been decreasing in the United
    States and other industrialized countries, death rates in California
    have stopped declining among young and middle-aged whites
    (ages 25–34 years and 40–64 years, respectively) since 2000.a
    The impact of this trend is startling: between 1995 and 2014,
    increases in death rates in these two age groups from specific
    causes claimed an estimated 21,350 lives.

    We found that the leading causes of rising death rates among
    whites in California included drug and alcohol overdoses, suicides,
    and accidents. The rise in drug and alcohol abuse and suicides is
    striking—what some have called “deaths of despair:”

    Death rates from drug overdoses doubled between
    1995 and 2014 among young and middle-aged
    whites in California.
    • Death rates from alcohol poisoning (e.g., binge
    drinking) more than quadrupled among younger
    whites and increased by 1163%—more than a
    12-fold increase—among those ages 40–64 years.
    • The rate of suicides among middle-aged whites
    increased by 37% after 2000. Hanging, strangulation, or suffocation were the most common
    forms of non-firearm suicide, doubling in frequency
    after 1995.

    https://societyhealth.vcu.edu/media/society-health/pdf/StateMortalityStudiesCaliforniaFinal.pdf

  297. EdwardM says:
    @kihowi

    Fantastic comment. The white man, especially of the Anglo-American variety, values reason, fair play, and, above all, the Golden Rule. It was nice when those shared values were the path to liberty and prosperity. But the rest of the world doesn’t abide by them, of course, so now we just seem like suckers.

  298. Anonymous[406] • Disclaimer says:
    @syonredux

    If that particular trend persists, then the percentage of births attributable to ‘Hispanics’ alone will out number those attributable to ‘European’ Americans.
    This, of course, does not include black or Asian births.

    The Economist’s dream and ambition of a Brazilian style future for the USA will, surely, be manifest.

  299. Anonymous[406] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Perhaps, this might be the ultimate blasphemy to some, but in light of the above post, and to paraphrase Enoch Powell on an entirely different subject, (capitalism),
    “Praise the Holy Ghost for the invention of abortion”.

  300. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    No, I heard your point, and I totally rejected it with regards of the timespan, placing it in the late nineteenth century, rather than in the the twentieth century where it belongs.

    The decline in birth rates most certainly began in the late 19th century. Of course birth rates have continued to decline since then. But the third quarter of the 19th century is when it started. It seems to have started first in Britain and France. The French were starting to panic about it even before 1914.

    While some improvements in birth control were being made at the time, childbearing as well as child delivery during the nineteenth century was still a burden if not a major danger for most women around the world, including in the US.

    True but irrelevant. In fact the dangers of child-bearing were almost certainly one of the reasons that birth control, once available, was seen as an attractive option for so many married couples.

    If a woman had 8-10 children, it was a given that anywhere from 4-7 would die either before they reached their tenth birthday, or before they made it to adulthood.

    The fact remains that birth rates did start to decline in the 19th century.

    See, you missed my point entirely. Having time for pleasure, planning how many kids are wanted, etc. takes time. It also means that an individual family unit is doing quite well on the economic scale so as to have oodles of time to decide these things

    Which supports my contention that having fewer children is a choice that people make when economic times are good. My contention was that the popular idea that birth rates are low today because of poor economic conditions is incorrect.

    Except for during the good economic times known as the “Baby Boom” Generation at mid. century. The irony, of course being, that the economy was very stable, there was now plenty of leisure time for most Americans, childbearing and delivery were definitely easier than at any time in human history, and guess what? The US birth rate increased.

    The Baby Boom was a temporary aberration caused entirely by the war which meant lots of people suddenly getting married and having kids at the same time. They were not having more kids – they were simply all having kids at the same time. Birth rates were falling again by the late 50s. The Baby Boom actually only lasted ten years and it was an artificial phenomenon.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  301. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    “Birth rates among American blacks have plummeted.”

    That’s a fairly easy one. Abortion.

    Yes. And abortion is a method of birth control. It’s a crude unpleasant method but it is still a method of birth control. The end result is plummeting birth rates.

    So my question remains – if falling white birth rates are due to an evil conspiracy to reduce whites to despair so they’ll stop breeding and go extinct how do you explain the fact that birth rates have also plummeted among so many non-whites?

    My theory that falling birth rates are caused by people freely choosing to have fewer kids because they want fewer kids seems to be consistent with the facts on the ground. The opposing theories (the white genocide theories) do not appear to be consistent with the facts on the ground.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  302. dfordoom says: • Website
    @anon

    It was not until the third quarter of the 19th century that the technology existed to allow people to have sex for pleasure without having to worry too much that they would end up with lots more kids than they wanted.

    Ridiculous. Just for a start, condoms existed in the 16th century.

    If you’d actually read my comment you’d have noticed that I said “cheap, effective, relatively convenient contraceptives.” Prior to the mid-19th century condoms were not cheap because they were not mass-produced. And anyone who thinks that the crude 16th century condoms were an attractive proposition has a few problems.

    Birth control had been around for a long time. The methods used in earlier times were either of dubious effectiveness or they were expensive or they significantly reduced sexual pleasure.

    Around the 1860s contraceptives became cheap enough, readily available enough, convenient enough and pleasant enough to use for this to qualify as something that was going to be game-changing. And it was.

    They discovered that it was possible to have sex for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.

    Ok Boomer!

    What is Tantra? When did it first exist?
    Who was Geoffrey Chaucer? When did he write the Tale of the Wife of Bath?

    When was the Song of Solomon written?

    Irrelevant nonsense. The change was that it was now possible to have sex for pleasure without fear of pregnancy and without the avoidance of pregnancy entailing a great deal of expense and inconvenience.

    I don’t think you’re tall enough for this ride.

    • Replies: @anon
  303. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Because the middle-class whites are OK with being middle-class until they are not anymore (middle-class, that is). That’s what I’m getting at. I don’t think this kind of despair sets in until the money runs out to support that quality of life that one’s pay used to cover nicely.

    Yes, that’s quite a reasonable point.

    It is likely that we’re going to see a lot of people sliding down the socio-economic scale, and some middle-class people are going to find themselves falling right out of the middle class.

    When that happens to middle-class whites will they suddenly embrace white solidarity? Or will they end up venting their hatred and resentment on those whites even further down the socio-economic scale? It remains to be seen.

  304. anon[226] • Disclaimer says:
    @dfordoom

    Irrelevant nonsense. The change was that it was now possible to have sex for pleasure without fear of pregnancy and without the avoidance of pregnancy entailing a great deal of expense and inconvenience.

    That isn’t what you wrote, not even close. You are being childish. Here is what you wrote:

    They discovered that it was possible to have sex for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.

    It is ridiculous on the face of it as I amply demonstrated. Now you bluster and try to change the subject. All that you have done is yet again demonstrate your ignorance and poor research skills.

    Contraception and abortion were not 19th century inventions. That claim is wrong and ignorant

    You wrote carelessly out of ignorance, and obviously cannot admit when you err. This is your personal problem, not mine or anyone else’s.

    There is an edit feature on comments, you should use it.
    There are search engines available, you should learn to use them.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  305. @The Last Real Calvinist

    I presume Luzinski wasn’t a first baseman because he wasn’t reliable enough at catching throws from infielders.

  306. @Steve Sailer

    There must have been something keeping the Phillies from moving him to first.

    When I was a kid I pitched and played outfield. I was borderline competent at the former, and pretty terrible at the latter. At least watching a real MLB player like Luzinski struggle helped me feel better.

  307. @The Last Real Calvinist

    You might try to hide a bad fielder in right field, where fewer balls are hit than left field, but big league hitters use the entire outfield.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  308. Anonymous[387] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    If you can type words in a combox, you can type words in a search engine, or have you never heard of https://www.google.com in all these years?

    I have to ask: is the aforementioned search engine the search engine of choice for unz.com members?

  309. hhsiii says:
    @kaganovitch

    So, world class fighter pilot, hitter and fly fisherman.

  310. hhsiii says:
    @Jack D

    I had to be in a private (but not-for-profit) hospital twice in the last 2 years. Lenox Hill Hospital, part of Northwell Health. The service was excellent, I thought. Everyone very nice, staff, nurses. Even the food was good (even the pollock with caper/butter sauce). Part of Northwell Health, which started off as LIJ. Most recently after Thanksgiving, a stay that started in a Southside Hospital in Bay Shore (also Northwell). Puerto Rican neurosurgeon and Egyptian (christian) anesthesiologist. Then we paid for ambulance to send me to Lenox Hill. $800.

    In any event, that’s a private hospital in NYC, and not even the best in the neighborhood. But something to note: most public employees in NYC have decent insurance. Get one family member a governement job and you generally have access to pretty good care. But a lot of the time it’s where you live, the nearest hospital, what you are familiar with. Admittedly I wouldn’t want to go to one of the public hospitals.

  311. dfordoom says: • Website
    @anon

    Contraception and abortion were not 19th century inventions. That claim is wrong and ignorant

    That’s not the claim I made, but reading comprehension isn’t everyone’s strong point.

    You wrote carelessly out of ignorance, and obviously cannot admit when you err. This is your personal problem, not mine or anyone else’s.

    No, in that case I perhaps wrote carelessly out of carelessness. The sentence you picked out is quite clear when taken in context, but when taken out of context it is perhaps not crystal clear. I probably should have said, “They discovered that it was possible to have sex solely for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.”

    • Replies: @anon
  312. hhsiii says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    They squeaked in but did beat the Big Red Machine and took A’s to 7, as you said. By the end of the year they were pretty good. Cleon Jones came back from injury, Tug McGraw either had been injured or a slump but he finished strong, etc.

    I was at the playoff game where Harrelson and Pete Rose had a fight when Rose came in hard to break up a DP. The Reds were getting killed. Staub hit 2 homers. So Rose was feisty.

    People in left field showered him with beer, batteries and coins next half inning. Willie Mays, Yogi BerraSeaver, Cleon Jones and Staub had to go out to left and plead with fans to stop it or else there’d be a forfeit.

  313. @dfordoom

    “The decline in birth rates most certainly began in the late 19th century. Of course birth rates have continued to decline since then.”

    Nope, it started to occur during the early 20th century.

    “The Baby Boom was a temporary aberration caused entirely by the war which meant lots of people suddenly getting married and having kids at the same time. ”

    Which is akin to what had been going on throughout most of US history up to that time, namely, tons of people getting married and having kids at same time. Actually, this type of thing was going on throughout most of recorded history (albeit in smaller numbers as the world’s population was smaller way, way, back in the day).

    “They were not having more kids – they were simply all having kids at the same time. ”

    Like duh. That’s what occurs when a generation tends to have tons and tons of offspring. Compared to the first part of the 20th century, (but not when compared to previous centuries when women tended to have anywhere from 6-12 children because about less than half would survive into adulthood) when birth rates were noticeably beginning to significantly decline as opposed to previous generations, the Baby Boom Generation had more children. And we still haven’t reached the higher birth rate numbers of the children born during the Baby Boom Generation.

    “Birth rates were falling again by the late 50s.”

    Early ’60’s, close enough.

    “The Baby Boom actually only lasted ten years and it was an artificial phenomenon.”

    Baby Boom is from 1946-1964, it began with the ending of WW2 and lasted until the election of LBJ in ’64. The two numbers marking beginning and end are world events which are also related to the economy at large (as warfare and a voting on potential change of government usually produce wide ranging effects). It marked the time period when the US had finally emerged from Depression and War with a relatively prosperous economy as well as the leisure time to pursue other events. Procreation was now officially tied to pleasure, and survival was no longer the main impetus. More than previous generations, the US was now mostly a consumer driven society, where it remains to this day.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  314. @dfordoom

    “how do you explain the fact that birth rates have also plummeted among so many non-whites?”

    Since mid. century, the US has been a consumer driven society. Abortion is not free, it a service provided to the consumer. Abortion has also been marketed as birth control to meet the demand for fewer children, which was only made possible during the 20th century when childbirth wasn’t as dangerous for women as in times past. Now it was possible to decide how many children one wanted due to leisure time as well as better economics for most US citizens across the board.

    “The opposing theories (the white genocide theories) do not appear to be consistent with the facts on the ground.”

    The facts on the ground contain a major part of the equation that Steve highlighted of which you ignore. Since 1965, just as the Baby Boom Gen. ended as well as it was then clear to all that the birth rates were drastically falling, IMMIGRATION rates were and remain where the bulk of the birth rates are coming from. Notice, that since ’65, the majority of immigrants are non-white (as only a nitwit would argue that the majority composition of immigrants post-1965 have been white, when in fact they have not).

    So, take a half century and counting of runaway levels of non-white immigration, and many of these immigrant groups have children 2-4 times the level of native born US citizens (especially whites), coupled with the fact that since the late ’90’s, outsourcing of industrial jobs that were largely filled (historically) by lower class whites, and the recipe for disaster is quite clear as shown in Deatons book, albeit without the emphasis on non-white immigration (which continues to this day). And the non-white immigrant groups continue to have higher birthrates than the native born US citizens. Which is the reason why white’s share of total US population is projected to fall below half within 20-30 yrs. It wasn’t just lower birthrates; it’s also due in large measure to non-white immigrants presence in the US at higher rates post 1965, and these non-whites are in fact, having more children than US whites.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @dfordoom
  315. @Steve Sailer

    You and Last Real Calvinist made me remember just why PHI went out and got Pete Rose in ’79. To stick him at 1B. People seem to forget that Pete Rose played at some point in his career every position on the field except at P and C. He was known as more than competent at just about every position he played, which is why he shifted often during his career between infield and outfield. He could fill the role wherever you put him. He was more than competent at 1B. And PHI wasn’t about to move HOF PHI 3B Mike Schmidt from the third sack.

    Its really a shame. Pete Rose does belong in the HOF without question. Of course, for that reason alone he also doesn’t belong in the HOF either.

  316. @hhsiii

    Great baseball story, HH! So, nobody got taken in on terroristic charges? Oh, right, it was the 1970s, when this was till a fun, sane, and freer country.

  317. @hhsiii

    Remember, that was how Rose played. That was his style, especially on the basepaths. In the 1970 All Star Game he barreled into C Ray Fosse at home plate to score a run, and that was just an all star game. That’s how he played. Him bareling into Harrelson wasn’t unusual at all, except that Harellson took it personal and tried to fight back. Good for him. Perhaps if more opposing players had done to Rose what Harellson tried to do, then Rose would have toned down his aggressive style on the basepaths. Or maybe not, but he would’ve gotten more injuries for his troubles.

  318. anon[123] • Disclaimer says:
    @dfordoom

    I probably should have said, “They discovered that it was possible to have sex solely for the sheer pleasure of having sex. They liked that idea a lot.”

    Lol. That’s just as ridiculous as the previous claim, and as easily demolished. Perhaps you could actually try reading something about the history of contraception and learn sometime?

    Counterexamples are trivial to find. How old is Tantra?
    When was Lysistrata written? What’s a major plot point?

    lol.
    You’ve been rumbled multiple times on this. Time for you to declare victory and quit yet?

  319. anon[123] • Disclaimer says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Since 1965, just as the Baby Boom Gen. ended as well as it was then clear to all that the birth rates were drastically falling, IMMIGRATION rates were and remain where the bulk of the birth rates are coming from.

    The US probably achieved Zero Population Growth around 1975 if not earlier. ZPG used to be a thing with the environmental movement, until they were bribed to shut up about immivasion. “Quality of life” used to be a thing with libs and lefties in general, but that was before they realized how they could benefit from population replacement.

    I’m sure the US was a pretty good place with a population of about 175,000,000 to 200,000,000 people, but a population that is close to steady state doesn’t support an endlessly growing housing sector, an endlessly growing consumer sector, and an endlessly taller financial sector.

    Population replacement means someone gets replaced, and erased. They fade out like a plant that is left in the sun unwatered, to wither and die.

    People who are being genocided may not realize it consciously, but the unconscious is a powerful pattern recognizer. That’s why we have to be constantly pummeled with propaganda, to keep our pattern recognizers dulled. Otherwise we’d Notice things way too much.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  320. @anon

    So, what’s your point? Doesn’t really sound as if you have one (aside of course from expanding upon my points in answer to someone else, meaning that you agree with me, and for that I do thank you).

    Regarding replacement population. There is a viable alternative, you know. Expand abortion clinics in the inner city.

    1. In the inner cities, urban areas, ethnic enclaves, open at least one clinic on every single street corner, if not more.

    2. Advertise on urban/ethnic radio as well as in Spanish. Highlight the cultural aspect, make it a matter of ethnic pride, that this a positive good, and market it directly to various immigrants in their own language.

    3. Use the tax code to directly tie abortions to SNAP, Welfare programs, etc. Make the social welfare benefits tied to how many abortions a woman has in the inner city. The more procedures, the more benefits she receives per yr. The Left will go along with this type of legislation de facto under the guise of safeguarding women’s rights in general.

    4. Make it as pervasive in ethnic enclaves, inner cities, etc. as possible (via advertising). Over time, this will have the intended affect of reducing certain group populations total rate as a percentage of the US.

    What can the Left then do? They can’t cry and scream “racism”, or “anti-immigrant”, because abortion is being pro-woman and pro-reproductive rights, and they don’t want to be perceived as being anti-abortion. Even now, blacks’s rates of abortion as a percentage of their race is almost as high as whites, and no one complains. Therefore, no one would complain if Hispanics were brought in as well.

    This isn’t the cure all for reducing replacement population, but it is a viable start. A goal would be to have as many clinics opened as there are McDonalds–everywhere, as pervasive as possible and even more so. According to various studies, the total annual percentage of all non-whites having abortions is over one-half the total number. So have the goal of increasing that percentage to two-thirds, and then three-fourths of the total number of annual abortions performed. Over time, with each passing decade, that will have the direct effect of reducing the non-white population in the US.

    Often times there are few viable solutions offered to stave off replacement population, here was one just offered.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  321. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    “The decline in birth rates most certainly began in the late 19th century. Of course birth rates have continued to decline since then.”

    Nope, it started to occur during the early 20th century.

    Nope, it started to occur in some western European countries during the late 19th century. Like most significant social changes it did not occur at the same time among all social classes or in all places. The fact is that a fall in birth rates started to occur at a time and a place which makes nonsense of arguments that declining fertility must be linked to periods of economic insecurity, or to the rise of “cultural marxism” or to an epidemic of despair among whites. Clearly falling birth rates must have been caused to a considerable extent by some other factors.

    How about if I say, “The decline in birth rates began in some countries in the mid to late 19th century but started to become a more general phenomenon in the early 20th century.” Would you agree with that?

    Which is akin to what had been going on throughout most of US history up to that time, namely, tons of people getting married and having kids at same time.

    You’ve missed the point. Due to the Second World War there was a period of several years during which a lot of people who would have married and started families were forced to delay those decisions. Once the war was over they got married and started to have kids. Which meant that in the immediate postwar years there was a temporary and artificial rise in the number of births because you had the people who would normally have married and had kids at that time plus those who would normally have married and had kids a few years earlier all marrying and having kids at the same time. It was not a case of people wanting more children but simply a case of a lot more people than normal having children at the same time. It was an artificial phenomenon.

    Baby Boom is from 1946-1964, it began with the ending of WW2 and lasted until the election of LBJ in ’64.

    You’re talking about the Baby Boom as a sociological phenomenon of people born in a certain time frame who supposedly share certain social and cultural characteristics. I’m talking about the Baby Boom as a short-term jump in birth rates and that rise in birth rates started to peter out in the late 50s.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
  322. @dfordoom

    Nah, the Baby Boom in the US went on for a long time, usually said to be 19 years: 1946-1964.

    Britain had a short Baby Boom in 1946, but then it petered out and births were low until the late 1950s.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
    , @Anonymous
  323. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Since 1965, just as the Baby Boom Gen. ended as well as it was then clear to all that the birth rates were drastically falling, IMMIGRATION rates were and remain where the bulk of the birth rates are coming from.

    If you’re arguing that immigration has caused declining birth rates you’d need to provide some evidence of an actual direct causal link.

    The other problem with your argument is that you’re actually admitting that birth rates fell before the large increase in immigration numbers.

    And it also needs to be kept in mind that whether you’re right (that birth rates started to fall in the early 60s) or whether I’m right (that they stared to fall in the last 50s as part of a long-term trend) the fact is that birth rates fell at a time of enormous economic prosperity. Which I think makes the argument that falling birth rates is due to white despair very very dubious indeed.

  324. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    According to various studies, the total annual percentage of all non-whites having abortions is over one-half the total number. So have the goal of increasing that percentage to two-thirds, and then three-fourths of the total number of annual abortions performed. Over time, with each passing decade, that will have the direct effect of reducing the non-white population in the US.

    It sounds disturbingly like you’re arguing that people you don’t like should be quietly and humanely eliminated from the population. With a certain degree of coercion. What exactly are you going to do if those people you disapprove of choose not to voluntarily eliminate themselves?

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  325. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Steve Sailer

    Nah, the Baby Boom in the US went on for a long time, usually said to be 19 years: 1946-1964.

    The exact point at which birth rates started to fall is of course irrelevant. Whether it was 1956 in some places or 1960 in other places or even 1964 doesn’t matter. What is relevant is that birth rates started to fall during economic boom times, at a time when cultural marxism was not yet a major thing, at a time when feminism was still insignificant and before mass immigration could possibly have had any effect.

    So arguments that declining birth rates are caused by things like economic slumps, cultural marxism, feminism or mass immigration (or white despair) start to look very very shaky.

    Could it be possible that what actually caused the long-term downward trend in fertility to accelerate might have been the introduction of the contraceptive pill in the early 60s?

  326. @dfordoom

    “What exactly are you going to do if those people you disapprove of choose not to voluntarily eliminate themselves?”

    Very naive. And you’ve totally missed the point. If this were twenty years ago, you might have a stronger point. The policy is long term. The word is persuasion. The majority of people tend to be followers and will go along with the policy, especially if it becomes officially sanctioned by the government and a part of obtaining social benefits. As more and more citizens are on some form of government assistance, over time this will become a part of accepted policy. Most people do not collectively think “Gee, maybe we should stop having so many birth control moments and start having more kids.” You yourself are contradicting what you’ve been attempting to state: Namely, that more and more US citizens are having fewer children (consciously) because they like to have sex primarily for pleasure. Fine and so be it. Therefore, by closing the circle and going one further. Namely, one can have all the pleasure and by making it official government policy to reward certain private behaviors, and as people want fewer and fewer children, then that’s what will occur on a widescale level, and with government approval. We see this already happening in most of Europe as well as Japan. For decades, China explicitly had this policy (albeit it was a crude one) known as the One Child Policy. But the result was the same, and China’s population is not as high as it would have been had the government not stepped in. The US would much prefer not to think about social policies in that kind of explicit manner. But subtler, implicit policies, such as widespread encouragement of the culture of abortion to become accepted practice and to thoroughly promote it as a public good, and most opposition to it will wither away.

    Most of Western Europe and Japan have low birthrates, that’s a fact. Due in large part to various factors. All these nations supply abortion on demand. It’s established legal precedent. The people who are seeking pleasure and not reproduction are already eliminating themselves. If the problem you seem to have is that it’s okay if a population group willingly eliminates itself, then thats a semantic distinction without a difference as the end result is the same. After all, a few generations ago when abortion became legal in these nations and the birth rates began to drop due to various factors (including legal access to abortion), no one noticed at the time that their nation’s birthrates were declining at a rapid pace. But then, nothing’s being done about it currently as these nations’s birthrates still aren’t at above replacement levels.

    Generally speaking, people don’t think of eliminating their progeny or their future generations when they agree to have an abortion. Also, it would take an organized group of people consciously thinking “Gee, maybe we should try and protest, or at least take action against this type of policy.”

    According to the PEW research center and other surveys, the younger generations are not professing belief in organized religion. Traditionally, religion was the one concrete group of people who were quite strongly opposed to abortion. As the decades since Roe V Wade was ratified into law, while the abortion numbers have somewhat leveled off, they haven’t disappeared either. It is now acceptable practice for a woman to have an abortion and the once social stigma even ostracization by society is a thing of the past. The same is playing out with gay marriage. Twenty years ago, the vast majority of US citizens across the board would’ve laughed at the idea of two members of the same gender actually getting married and it certainly wasn’t ratified into law. About six years ago, one court decision has changed that. With each passing decade of it becoming established law, gay marriage is or will be seen as a positive good for society as a whole. Point being is that once established legal precedent is ratified into law, that social policy becomes accepted, then normalized, and then come to be viewed as a positive good, a virtue. The same has been true for abortion. There are now more legal means to terminate a pregnancy. The clinic is the traditional way.

    I could also add a point 5. Promotion on ethnic/urban radio of RU-486, Norplant and other surgical methods to slow the rate of pregnancies, etc. By sending a constant, consistent message in the popular culture, in academia, and in various New Age faiths, (not to mention that these are officially sanctioned policies by the government) and opposition over time decreases even further. It becomes accepted policy and it seen as part of the public good.

    I think this policy in the longer run would work. Perhaps anywhere up to 80% IF it is constantly and consistently applied and it is the main message heard on radio, TV, internet, pop culture, education, etc. Organized religion has been slowly shrinking, as has the pro-life movement at large.

    I am taking your point, that people have sex today for pleasure and not for replacement of birth rates to the next step. This were to become officially sanctioned government policy and promoted at all levels aforementioned, then this definitely would have the effect of reducing non-traditional populations of the US.

    Once something becomes legal, over time it then becomes accepted among society as normal and even a virtue. We have already seen it with gay marriage and gay rights at large. We are seeing it with the trans movement as well. Abortion has been legal everywhere in the US since 1973, but it has not been as thoroughly saturated across society at every single level, with every single ethnic urban grouping constantly and consistently as it could be. I am referring to a constant message 24/7/365 within the popular culture, as well as education. Persuasion is any indirect and non-government interfering. The only government direct sanction in this case would be for abortion to be tied to government policy regarding receiving many social benefits. This would be immediately tied to women’s rights, and women’s reproductive rights in general. If sold in this manner, then it definitely would become established practice. Because abortion trumps any idea of not permitting it to occur, for any reason.

    Were this all encompassing, pervasive message (of promoting it as a societal good) to occur, then yes, I believe I am correct that over time, say over a couple decades, one would definitely see a drastic lowering of each group’s population within the US. As we already are beginning to see among whites in other developed nations. Some will say, it’s not just abortions that’s causing the reduction. But also, it’s not an irrelevant factor either and it is a part of the equation.

    A thorough saturation of the policy via persuasion at all major (and minor) levels of society. The vast majority will go along with the policy thru persuasion since most opposition has by that time withered away.

    While others dither and talk about the problem, again, a viable option has been suggested.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  327. Anon87 says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Mays and Aaron certainly liked uppers.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  328. @Anon87

    Uppers, or “greenies” were first brought to popular attention in Jim Bouton’s Ball Four. During the late 50’s up thru the ’70’s, with constant intercontinental jet travel, along with fewer days off for MLBers, greenies were seen as a viable alternative to keep going. The twinight doubleheader used to be a thing (which was great for fans, as you’d get two games for the price of one). You don’t see scheduled twinight doubleheaders much anymore on a regular basis. Was this due to the MLBPA demanding an end to them? In fact, doubleheaders aren’t scheduled much the way they used to be. Wonder why?

    But greenies are no different than drinking 12-14 cups of expresso. Just having a bunch of caffeine in your system. Basically if an ordinary dude drinks about 1-2 gallons of coffee or tea per day, it’s the same thing.

    Not really the same thing as PEDS. But that line’s somewhat becoming common. “Oh, back in the day they had greenies so they were juicing too.” Uh, no they were not. PEDS aren’t caffeine pills.

    • Replies: @Anon87
  329. Anon87 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    I’m not equating uppers with anabolic steroids, but let’s not compare coffee with amphetamines either.

    Can we all agree there has never been a “clean” era of baseball, and look forward to a 2020 season?

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  330. @Mr McKenna

    Winning ‘the Big One’ means little if you lose the world.

    Dude, white people lost “the big one”.

  331. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    But subtler, implicit policies, such as widespread encouragement of the culture of abortion to become accepted practice and to thoroughly promote it as a public good, and most opposition to it will wither away.

    So you don’t have any problems with encouraging ethnic groups that you personally dislike to eliminate themselves from the population? So I’m assuming you also wouldn’t have any problems with government policies to encourage white people to stop breeding and gradually eliminate themselves from the population? If you’re OK with a kinder gentler version of non-white genocide then logically you should be A-OK with a kinder gentler version of white genocide? There’s zero moral difference between these two things.

    If you can convince people that trying to change the ethnic composition of the population by aggressively targeting birth control at certain ethnic groups you could hardly then complain if those same policies were turned back on white people. There are people who might think it’s a great idea but that it should be targeted at rural whites.

    The second problem. Assuming the policies you advocate actually worked (I’m not entirely convinced they would but it’s possible) you do realise that the result would be an acceleration of demographic collapse? And even if it did succeed in reducing the non-white population it would certainly also reduce the white population (because making abortion even more socially acceptable than it is already would presumably result in more white abortions as well). The result would be even lower overall birth rates which would in turn lead to hysterical demands from the corporate sector for massive increases in immigration levels. So you’d end up with even more non-whites than you already have.

    Are you sure you’ve really thought through your proposal?

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  332. @Anon87

    Not true at all. If by “clean” you mean PEDS and amphetamines free, then yes, the years before the late 1950’s would definitely be classified as “clean” or “free from substances” for MLB.

    Amphetamines are no different than coffee or tea, if one were to drink 1-2 gallons per day. Caffeine acts similar to amphetamines and isn’t any different in that respect. That’s all greenies were. But it has become fashionable as of late to equate amphetamines with PEDS.

    In his autobiography, Jose Canseco mentioned that when he first broke into MLB in the mid. ’80’s, many players were still taking amphetamines or “greenies” to get wired and some kind of edge before
    a game. As soon as he (among the first players) introduced PEDS into MLB and showed just how much more effective they were, that’s when greenies all but disappeared from MLB. There wasn’t any reason to take them compared to PEDS. The evidence that amphetamines did anything is a placebo. Again, one could drink tons of espresso or highly caffeinated energy drinks to get the same effect. PEDS, however, changed MLB forever.

    It wasn’t greenies that caused people to hit 50, 60, and 70+ HRS per season. It wasn’t greenies that caused people’s annual stats to increase severalfold. They never had that kind of power, it was mostly psychological as well as a coping mechanism, a reaction to the abrupt and sudden changes to MLB: the expanded 162 game season, intercontinental flights to cities, fewer days off, and of course more and more night games. Basically ca. 1960-1986 could be considered Generation Greenie in MLB.

    Back in the day during the 154 game season, and before the mid. to late ’50’s, road traveling was done by train, and the farthest point west was STL. And of course before the ’50’s, most games were played during the day. So there really wasn’t a need to take greenies as you had more time to rest up during the season.

    • Replies: @Anon87
  333. @dfordoom

    “Are you sure you’ve really thought through your proposal?”

    Uh yes, actually. Having a semblance of ability to submit a proposal is part of finding an answer to long range questions regarding overpopulation.

    “So you don’t have any problems with encouraging ethnic groups that you personally dislike to eliminate themselves from the population?”

    I have stated a realistic proposal, period. How one feels or emotes about a policy is irrelevant. Why do you dislike white people and have no problem that they are already eliminating themselves from the population? In other words, the argument can be used vs your own. And, apparently you have no problem if an ethnic (or race) group is reducing themselves, so long as it is done unconsciously. And, so long as the ethnic group being eliminated is white, then its not a major problem. Sounds like it only becomes a problem if a non-white group were reducing themselves, even though the result is the same.

    “So I’m assuming you also wouldn’t have any problems with government policies to encourage white people to stop breeding and gradually eliminate themselves from the population? ”

    This is very naive on your part to the point of foolishness. White people’s birthrates have been below levels of replacement for nearly an entire generation and by mid. century they will reap the results, being less than half majority of the US population. So that fact being stated, you apparently don’t have a problem with this ongoing process, but would have a problem if other groups (non-white) were to follow suit, especially if persuaded by the culture at large. If you’re pro-life, that’s your personal decision, but forcing someone’s values on other people to make them public policy flies in the face of settled constitutional law, (e.g. Roe vs Wade). Abortion is legal. It is a legal procedure. If you’re against the procedure, that is of course your prerogative. But the law isn’t likely to be overturned.

    Notice, you have not answered, but avoided my point, that opposition to the saturation of acceptance to the culture of promoting abortion would wither away over time. Especially if it is promoted as a virtue 24/7/365. By promotion I mean that it is implicitly promoted and encouraged at all levrels of society so that it is the main option being promoted and encouraged . Because you did not addres this point, therefore I assume that I am correct that this indeed would occur.

    “If you’re OK with a kinder gentler version of non-white genocide”

    So, its really only a “genocide” if its non-whites lowering their own birthrates (and entirely by their choices made in the marketplace). And you talk of morals. Are non-whites sacred? Are they of greater importance than others?

    “then logically you should be A-OK with a kinder gentler version of white genocide?”

    The fact that you do not view this has already going on and has been so for nearly an entire generation means that you are incredibly naive or are A-OK with whites becoming a smaller population due in large part to lower birthrates. As you are ok with this, but apparently not ok with it if it were to happen to non-whites, one has to ask the question: Do you hate white people to the point where its fine if they can’t reproduce themselves.

    “There’s zero moral difference between these two things.”

    You are of course entitled to your subjective private opinion as far as what constitutes morality in the case of abortion, and how it is used on various groups. If you are personally against abortion, then that is your right. But there are many in the US who do not see it from a moral perspective and want to keep abortion legal.

    “If you can convince people”

    Why are against legal access to abortion? This is settled constitutional law. So, under your proposal you would outlaw the procedure as well as all methods of birth control and force people to seek underground, backalley abortions. Why? Why impose your morality on others who don’t share your views.

    If you are in favor of abortion, then it doesn’t really matter the reason why people get abortions performed. Most abortions are for reasons of birth control. Therefore, it doesn’t matter one bit either way what the stated reason an abortion was performed. Per the constitutional right, the individual wanted it performed, that is their right to have it performed, and that’s the end of it. In the eyes of the law, one doesn’t have to have the “correct” reason to have an abortion. If they want to terminate the pregnancy, then that is their right.

    “that trying to change the ethnic composition of the population by aggressively targeting birth control at certain ethnic groups you could hardly then complain if those same policies were turned back on white people.”

    Actually, if a person is in favor of population control, then having the birthrates reduced across the board would be consistent. But if a person were in favor of one group over another, then a person would be most pleased indeed to see other groups’s birthrates reduced which would leave his preferred group to increase as a larger share of a nation’s total population.

    “you do realise that the result would be an acceleration of demographic collapse?”

    I am not a fool and do not appreciate your condescending tone. It’s not me that’s being naive. It’s not me that has an implicit bias vs white people as a group, and it’s not me that seems to think it’s A-OK if whites unconsciously accelerate their own demographic demise/collaspse, but suddenly its NOT fine if non-whites were to do the same. Abortion is legal constitutional law, pure and simple. If people want to get one, it’s no one’s business the reason why they are performed. What part of settled law don’t you understand?

    It would be an acceleration of demographic collapse for some populations but not necessarily others. Annual abortions for all non-whites is actually about the same or somewhat higher than abortion for whites (admittedly this is thru clinics and doesn’t take into account all birth control methods). So if non-whites share of total abortions performed per year were to increase to three-fourths the total number, why is that a problem? Is abortion only considered “bad” or a “genocide” for non-whites but its A-OK for whites?

    “And even if it did succeed in reducing the non-white population it would certainly also reduce the white population (because making abortion even more socially acceptable than it is already would presumably result in more white abortions as well)”

    No, not necessarily. If abortions are peaking among whites because the white birthrate has been declining for nearly a generation, (which fewer whites are having children, which is of course a fact) then the real growth among total annual number of abortions will be from among non-white groups. Again, it seems to only be a problem with you if non-whites birthrates start to decline or if their share of total annual abortions becomes a significant majority.

    “in turn lead to hysterical demands from the corporate sector for massive increases in immigration levels. So you’d end up with even more non-whites than you already have.”

    No, not necessarily. You’ve demonstrated that you didn’t fully read my points. One of the points I listed was to advertise and open clinics in urban areas as well as in immigrant enclaves. Example: Many Hispanic immigrants get abortions, it’s not just limited to native born. By increasing abortions among the immigrant populations and advertising the procedure in their own languages, on their radio stations, newspapers, websites that they tend to view, etc. then the abortion rates will increase among immigrant populations as well. I know you skipped this part of my original points listed because I know I listed this point very, very, clearly. Also, tie many immigrant benefits, welfare, etc to having abortion(s) and the numbers will increase. Will immigrant populations lead the way in rising numbers of abortions? I never said that. But, over time, with each passing decade, and with the the organization and mechanism in place to promote the procedure among newly arrived immigrants, then slowly over time, the numbers among immigrants having abortions will increase as well. Total saturation within the culture, and especially at the grassroots level.

    It is certain that corporations do want to bring in large levels of immigrants. They also, however, will not dare go against settled constitutional law such as abortion. They would never allow themselves to be seen as anti-abortion, because then the activist groups, politicians, etc. will come down on them quite hard. It would be bad for business for globalists to be seen as publicly against abortion. As the Left has consistently from day one defended a woman’s right to choose to terminate her pregnancy for whatever the reason, it’s a little late in the ballgame to suddenly switch gears and say “Well, yeah, we all want abortion to be legal and with few restrictions as possible. But only if white people are getting abortions. If blacks want abortions we’re gonna turn them all away.” That opens up charges of racism, and sexism into the equation.

    Therefore, no matter the reason, no matter the population, if an abortion is performed, then its seen as a positive good. Pure and simple. The reason does not matter. And any attempt to impose someone else’s values upon the public sphere will be met with charges of anti-abortion.

    I have offered what I think is a proposal that, if implemented consistently, constantly, a thoroughly total saturation in the popular culture, education, among urban/ethnic/immigrant enclaves, over time, say, 20-30 yrs., will definitely work without question.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
  334. Anonymous[666] • Disclaimer says:
    @Steve Sailer

    Actually, there was a ‘mini boom’ in UK births in the mid 1960s. How much this is tied in with mass Commonwealth immigration, which peaked at that time, is hard to say. Not in coincidentally, 1966 was the UK’s all time peak year in terms of employment, wage growth and industrial production.
    In all events, the mini boom was over by 1972, the key year in which reproductive rates fell below replacement level, and have never recovered since and never will in the future. The UK economy basically tanked in 1974, and has been up shit creek ever since – despite all the lies and bullshit you might read.
    The ‘David Steel’ Abortion Act was passed in 1968 and basically means that ‘abortion on demand’ is the norm in the UK. Roughly 700,000 ‘live births’ occur each and every year in the UK, and similarly there are a consistent 200,000 abortions performed per annum.

    Oh, and the birthrate shot up in the 2000s due the the Blair (Economist) Administration policy of unrestricted mass immigration.
    For what’s its worth, in England ‘white’ births are likely no more than a bare 60% of the total. And rapidly declining both in absolute and relative terms.

  335. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Why do you dislike white people and have no problem that they are already eliminating themselves from the population?

    You’re talking nonsense. The fact that white people are breeding at below replacement level is a fact. The fact that I acknowledge that this is happening does not in any way shape or form mean that I like it. Facts don’t care whether you like them or not. Facts just are.

    I would be delighted if white people suddenly decided to have more children. I just don’t know how I or anyone else can persuade them to do so.

    And, apparently you have no problem if an ethnic (or race) group is reducing themselves, so long as it is done unconsciously.

    If they’re doing it voluntarily I can’t see that there is anything much I can do about it. I don’t particularly like the idea of holding a gun to their heads and telling them to breed or else. And I have no idea what else would work.

    And, so long as the ethnic group being eliminated is white, then its not a major problem

    That does not logically follow from anything I’ve said. You’re making wild and unwarranted assumptions about my motivations.

    Do you hate white people to the point where its fine if they can’t reproduce themselves.

    I’m not encouraging white people to do this. Again you’re indulging in mind-reading. I’m not fine with it at all. It seems that white people are fine with it, otherwise they’d have more kids. It would be great if they did. I don’t expect it to happen but it would be great if it did.

    Abortion is legal constitutional law, pure and simple. If people want to get one, it’s no one’s business the reason why they are performed. What part of settled law don’t you understand?

    In this discussion to date I haven’t offered any opinion on the subject of abortion. Try reading what I’ve written, rather than responding to some secret message your imagination thinks it’s discovered in what I’ve written.

    • Replies: @Yojimbo/Zatoichi
  336. Anon87 says:
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    I tend to disagree on the cut-off of greenies. I’d say 2006 rather than 1986.

    https://www.razorgator.com/blog/remember-when-everyone-in-the-mlb-was-using-greenies/

    I kind of want to see ballplayers drink 1-2 gallons of coffee to get the equivalent effect as amphetamines. They’d have to install some of those infamous Wrigley troughs in the dugouts or on the warning track.

    I was more referring to “clean” in the looking for an edge way. You know, if you ain’t cheatin you ain’t trying. I love stories of the original 1890s Baltimore Orioles. Hilarious levels of cheating. I always thought they could make a good Slap Shot type movie out of that era of baseball.

  337. @dfordoom

    “I don’t particularly like the idea of holding a gun to their heads and telling them to breed or else. And I have no idea what else would work.”

    It is not an either or situation. That sounds a bit like extremist thinking. That would be explicit. My proposal, based on persuasion, is implicit. My idea, if implemented consistently over time, a total saturation, would definitely see results over a generation.

    “I just don’t know how I or anyone else can persuade them to do so.”

    First things first. A total reduction among non-white groups, including immigrants. Also, perhaps make marriage less of a “risk” for men. There is something afoot among younger generations of men known as MGTOW. It is a conscious response to not only feminism’s ideology, but what many men perceive as a “stacked deck” vs them in marriage when it comes to divorce, and the aftermaths in the courts. More women tend to file for divorce than men. Of the two genders, men are penalized more severely (their wages garnished, few receive total custody, many don’t receive even partial custody of their children, alimony, as well as child support, etc). Many men, especially in the MGTOW movement, are fed up with how this is unfolding and have made the decision that marriage isn’t for them. This isn’t the only reason why marriages have been declining for some time in the US, but it is a significant reason nonetheless.

    “I don’t particularly like the idea of holding a gun to their heads and telling them to breed or else. And I have no idea what else would work.”

    Life is made up of choices. No one currently in the government is doing such a nonsensical thing of which you claim. There are various factors that could help increase the birth rate, perhaps you need to further consider them.

    “That does not logically follow from anything I’ve said. You’re making wild and unwarranted assumptions about my motivations.”

    Yes it does, based on what you wrote. You wrote “genocide”, but only when it were to occur with non-white groups. If that’s not what you intended, then you shouldn’t have used that word. There you go again with that condescending tone.

    “It seems that white people are fine with it, otherwise they’d have more kids. It would be great if they did. I don’t expect it to happen but it would be great if it did.”

    And that was one of the main underlying points of Deaton’s book, albeit an indirect one. He seems to put great weight in the fact that the number of white’s suicides are occuring among the lower classes because their jobs are being outsourced (or insourced to other people, in some cases, by way of immigration). Therefore, the point is rather clear. Scale back outsourcing, bring back the jobs for the lower white working class, and the suicide rate will begin to decline. From there, the formation of families as well as having children can resume. You yourself made mention that among the first time in the early twentieth century in America (UK was 19th century, as you mentioned) with improved birth control methods, that physical relations based on pleasure became more widespread. What also has to be made mentioned is that with each passing decade into the 20th century, particularly after the Depression, the US’s economic outlook greatly improved. A better economic lot for ordinary people also equates to less stress. Less stress equates to having more time for other non-work pursuits. But its awfully difficult to have time for physical relations when large swaths of people are depressed to the point of suicide that they’ve lost their jobs. With the return of jobs, then the return of pleasure can follow as well.

    Try reading what I’ve written, rather than responding to some secret message your imagination thinks it’s discovered in what I’ve written.”

    I have responded to what you’ve written. Granted, you don’t actually offer any kind of concrete type of proposal regarding how to alleviate the dilemma. It is easier to cast aspersions at others while all the time holding up one’s hands and claiming that “I don’t know what’s the answer”. In that case, how is this beneficial or constructive? If one isn’t part of the solution (or at least attempting to offer a way toward finding some kind of improvement) then one is part of the problem. Any left side of the BC could offer the same amount of imput (nothing) and the result would be the same. Everyone can sit around and state “I don’t know, I don’t know.” That sounds very reasonable at first, but if it persists, and someone then asks “So, what do you propose to do?”, but the response is the same “I don’t know.” Then that person should be passed over, because they’re not offering anything. And they can play that game of non-response for the rest of their lives and meanwhile, the problems only worsen. Fiddling, while Rome burns.

    I have offered a proposal where, if it is consistently applied across the board, to all walks of life, by targeting on various groups, then this will indeed reap results over time (about a full generation). For it to work, there will have to be a consistent level of all sectors of society in with the plan. Educational system, popular culture, everywhere. I think that these sectors will be fairly easy to convince to comply, as they are already on board with promotion of abortion. It’s just not thoroughly done at a constant level. Also, I stated that with the decline of religion in the US, the one consistent aspect of society that has traditionally opposed abortion, the opposition to the procedure withers away. Again, for this proposal to work, it would need to be thoroughly saturated within society at large, including urban/ethnic areas as well as immigrant enclaves. That’s why this isn’t a rapidly overnight proposal. But over time, this proposal will not only work, it will see long term lasting results.

    Anyone can say “I don’t know, I don’t know” and never attempt to offer a plan, and then when someone comes along with a proposal shoot it down. That’s not being constructive, that’s a result of limited thinking to the problems faced. Anyone can then revert to “No, it’s not that at all, you’re just so and so.” That is the result of a herd mentality, part of the masses who don’t tend to think very hard about things in general so it’s not entirely surprising that they wouldn’t have anything constructive to offer.

    I have offered a concrete proposal to the problems regarding declining white birthrates. If implemented consistently, constantly, and in a total saturation way, it will yield tangible results over time (at least a full generation). If people don’t have a counter offer, a different proposal, then they’re just idling by, passively fiddling away remaining time while one group reaches minority status in the nation, and don’t have a thing to contribute to reaching a solution.

    I give politicians this much: their mettle is made of stronger stuff in that they don’t fiddle away time. They (or the powers that be supporting them) tend to offer concrete proposals on attempting to solve societal problems at large, and then they implement government policies to achieve this end. It does not follow that their solutions are the correct ones. It does follow that they are attempting to help alleviate the problems, which is an admirable trait in elected leaders. Don’t just do nothing, hold up hands and say “I don’t know, and no one knows”, that’s not a sufficient answer to the problem. One fails in the classroom during examination time with that way of thinking.

    Rather, it’s better in the long run for someone to state: Since no one else is offering any constructive answers, here is a proposal. Let’s test it and see if and when it brings results. I don’t expect you to understand much less concur. But it is better to have a proposal of some kind than to do nothing and watch as the problems continue to worsen.

    I stand by what I wrote. It’s my proposal and I do think that if implemented, consistently and thoroughly, over time, that it will reap lasting results that will improve the condition of lower white birthrates.

    • Replies: @dfordoom
    , @dfordoom
  338. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    You wrote “genocide”, but only when it were to occur with non-white groups.

    I think you’ll find that I used the word “genocide” in reference to both whites and non-whites.

    Granted, you don’t actually offer any kind of concrete type of proposal regarding how to alleviate the dilemma. It is easier to cast aspersions at others while all the time holding up one’s hands and claiming that “I don’t know what’s the answer”.

    I don’t think your proposal has the slightest chance of being implemented. It’s politically impractical. It’s politically impractical because it will be portrayed as racist. Whether I think it’s racist or not doesn’t matter. Whether you think it’s racist or not doesn’t matter. The fact is that it will be portrayed as being racist so politically it just won’t fly. Can you explain to me how you’re going to promote an idea to encourage non-white groups to gradually abort themselves into non-existence as anything but racist?

    The response to your proposal will be that if it looks like a racist policy, swims like a racist policy, and quacks like a racist policy, then it probably is a racist policy. The problem with the alt-right/dissident right is a total lack of political realism.

    Your proposal is also very negative. Trying to persuade groups of people that the best contribution they can make to society is to cease to exist is hard to paint in anything other than a negative light. It’s going to sound like you’re telling those people that they’re worthless.

    I don’t see the point of solutions that clearly are not going to work.

    A proposal that aims to persuade people that they are not worthless and that they can make a valuable contribution to society by having children would be much easier to sell politically. But if it looks like there’s a racist tinge to the proposal (if for example you only try to encourage whites to have children) then again it is likely to be labelled as racist and the proposal is likely to sink like a stone.

    As to whether a policy aimed at encouraging people to have kids is likely to work, I’m very sceptical. My view, as I’ve explained elsewhere, is that people really don’t want more kids than they’re already having. Maybe it would have some effect. Maybe it’s worth trying. But if it seems to be racially targeted it ain’t gonna happen.

  339. dfordoom says: • Website
    @Yojimbo/Zatoichi

    Also, perhaps make marriage less of a “risk” for men. There is something afoot among younger generations of men known as MGTOW. It is a conscious response to not only feminism’s ideology, but what many men perceive as a “stacked deck” vs them in marriage when it comes to divorce, and the aftermaths in the courts. More women tend to file for divorce than men. Of the two genders, men are penalized more severely (their wages garnished, few receive total custody, many don’t receive even partial custody of their children, alimony, as well as child support, etc). Many men, especially in the MGTOW movement, are fed up with how this is unfolding and have made the decision that marriage isn’t for them. This isn’t the only reason why marriages have been declining for some time in the US, but it is a significant reason nonetheless.

    I don’t really disagree that some men do feel, and have valid reasons for feeling, that marriage is not an attractive option at the moment. I’m all in favour of anything that will improve that situation.

    I’m sceptical as to whether this has had very much actual effect on birth rates. Maybe a small effect. But it’s still worth trying to make marriage more attractive to men.

  340. @Corvinus

    Where?

    Are you serious? I’m from Baltimore. My parents in the 50s could walk anywhere downtown at night. By the 60s, no. By the 70s the crime had hit the neighborhoods more near the suburbs, where the “elite” of the city put the Section 8 housing. I was almost murdered. Your disingenuous questions are ridiculous. Everybody knows unless they live in, maybe, Wyoming.

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