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Here’s a new Raj Chetty-style study where the researchers get their hands on a near-universe of anonymized government data so they don’t have to use much in the way of sampling because they are looking at almost half the kids born in the US in the early 21st century. With millions of children in their database, they can slice and dice finely.

This one is about “intergenerational exposure to the criminal justice system” — e.g., Is your dad in the pen?

Not surprisingly, kids whose close relatives or mom’s latest boyfriend have tangles with the law tend to have problems themselves as they get older.

Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.

You used to be able to debate nature vs. nurture sometimes, but nowadays you aren’t even supposed to mention that kids growing up around criminals are probably getting bad nurture from their felonious relatives. Instead, they are suffering from “intergenerational exposure to the criminal justice system” as opposed to intergenerational exposure to lowlifes.

This makes modern social science papers hard to read. On the other hand, the quantity and quality of the data can be extraordinary in the Chetty Era.

Measuring Intergenerational Exposure to the U.S. Justice System: Evidence from Longitudinal Links between Survey and Administrative Data
Keith Finlay
U.S. Census Bureau
Michael Mueller-Smith
University of Michigan
Brittany Street
University of Missouri
June 9, 2022
Abstract

Intergenerational exposure to the justice system is both a marker of vulnerability among children and a measurement of the potential unintended externalities of crime policy in the U.S. Estimating the size of this population has been hampered by inadequate data resources, including the inability to (1) observe non-incarceration sources of exposure, (2) follow children throughout their childhood, and (3) measure multiple adult influences in increasingly dynamic households. To overcome these challenges, we leverage billions of restricted administrative and survey records linked with the Criminal Justice Administrative Records System (CJARS). We find substantially larger prevalences of intergenerational exposure to the criminal justice system than previously reported: 9% of children born between 1999–2005 were intergenerationally exposed to prison, 18% to a felony conviction, and 39% to any criminal charge; charge exposure rates reach as high as 62% for Black children. We regress these newly quantified types of exposure on measures of child well-being to gauge their importance and find that all types of exposure (parent vs. non-parent, prison vs. charges, current vs. previous) are strongly negatively correlated with development outcomes, suggesting substantially more U.S. children are harmed by crime and criminal justice than previously thought. …

Cumulative exposure from all potential caregivers. Finally, we expand our measure of exposure to all observed potential caregivers: biological parents, stepparents, adoptive parents, foster parents, unclassified caregivers, grandparents, aunts/uncles, non-familial adults (cohabiting 2+ years) and unclassified adults (cohabiting 2+ years).

I think they are talking about adults residing at the same address as the child who thus might be lending a hand in caring for the child, not all the child’s aunts and uncles in the world. For example, I had an uncle who, if I recall correctly from my early years, was shot dead at a dice game in Harlem. But I never met him before his rather spectacular demise (he was not a subject of dinner table conversation), and I can’t say he had much influence upon my life.

(Also, I was a notably incurious child about relatives. For example, growing up I had a third set of relatives in addition to my father’s and mother’s families, whom we saw about once a month. I never asked how they were related. Finally, when I was 21 my mother told me she’d been married before and they were her first husband’s extended family.)

To be conservative, we do not include any criminal justice involvement from other potential caregivers prior to cohabitation in our exposure measures. For example, if a stepparent has a felony conviction when the child is 3, but does not co-reside with the child until the age of 6, then the child is not considered exposed to the event.

In Figure 2C, we report that 8.8% of children are exposed to a potential caregiver in prison by age 18, 18.3%, to a felony conviction, 21.4%, to a felony charge, and 38.9% to any criminal charge

Exposure by child’s race and ethnicity. Stark divides emerge when disaggregating exposure rates by the race and ethnicity of children. As seen in Figure 3A, 62% of Black, non-Hispanic (referred to as Black for the remainder of Sections 6 and 7) children grow up in a household where one or more potential caregivers are charged with either a misdemeanor or felony criminal offense. American Indian/Alaska Native children have a similarly high rate at 60%, and 45% of Hispanic children have a potential caregiver charged with a criminal offense. White… and Asian children have high but relatively lower rates of intergenerational exposure to criminal charges at 32% and 17% respectively. …

We observe a strong income gradient with regard to indirect criminal justice exposure by a potential caregiver, which is consistent with prior work suggesting parental criminal justice contact inhibits social mobility along a range of outcomes, including the child’s own likelihood of adult incarceration (Chetty et al. 2018). …

Roughly one-in-three Black and American Indian/Alaska Native children have an adult in their household face violent criminal charges, while the corresponding estimate for White children is only one-in-eight. Relative to the distribution of offense types for exposed White children, exposed Black children are more likely to grow up in households with drug charges and less likely to witness DUI offenses

County of birth appears to play a minor role. For the White-Black comparison, if anything, the racial gap would be larger if White and Black children were equally distributed across places of birth.

Not good for Chetty’s plan to move black mothers with sons to the white exurbs.

But that may be an artifact of whites in big cities tending to be particularly well-behaved.

Similar conclusions can be drawn from the White-American Indian/Alaska Native decomposition. The White-Hispanic gap, however, does appear to potentially partially attributable to difference in county of birth, explaining roughly 7% to 27% of the raw gap.

When we add household income around the time of the child’s birth into the decomposition, a more substantial share of the raw gap across all minority groups is explained by observable characteristics. Conditional on county of birth, household income explains approximately 17% to 42% of the raw racial gap, depending on the specific type of exposure and minority group under consideration. …

Whether the source originated from a biological parent or another adult in the household, or whether the type of exposure was incarceration or something less serious, the estimated relationships are quite similar. This suggests that some sort of social, emotional, or other scarring effects may be at work. …

Or mom keeps picking out the same kind of boyfriend?

The largest effects of exposure on being charged with an adult crime (Panel G) stem from contemporaneous bio-parent justice involvement, regardless of the specific type of justice involvement.

So the kids with the highest chance of being accused of a serious crime before turning 18 are ones whose biological dads are in prison right now (one reason they aren’t out of prison yet is because they did something so serious or so frequently that they got a long term).

The estimated coefficients are roughly 3 times the size of the non-exposed child mean. Other forms of exposure (other potential caregivers, prior exposures) remain meaningfully high in the range of 1.5 to 2 times the non-exposed mean and are mostly statistically indistinguishable. …

Figure 8B shows stark differences in human capital development among exposed children by sex of the child. Boys appear to be significantly more sensitive to exposure, with estimated coefficients more than double the size compared to those for girls.

This is similar to Chetty’s finding that it’s a really bad idea for a black mother with sons to move to Detroit, Baltimore, or New Haven, probably because they are more likely to join a gang. In contrast, those places aren’t so terrible for daughters because there aren’t many girl gangs.

Given the disparity in the originating source of exposure by the sex of the adult, it may be that boys are uniquely impacted by the justice involvement or related events of their fathers and/or father-like figures.

Of if dad’s a bad man, maybe sons are more likely to grow up to be bad men than daughters?

More research is warranted to further probe this relationship.

It would be interesting to consider what exactly mothers could do in terms of relationships to keep their sons out of jail? For example, consider the Fresh Prince of Bel-Air situation of a slum cousin moving in with his suburban cousin. How often does rich Carlton help poor Will go straight? How often does Will drag down Carlton with him?

When you are talking about a detailed database of millions of people, unusual situations like that could conceivably be tested.

 
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  1. I call it the Louis Till syndrome.

    • Replies: @Hangnail Hans
    @JimDandy

    Well, true enough -- except that an even more common syndrome in the hood is not having any idea who your dad actually is. And your dad definitely doesn't know who his kids are. It takes a village, so the parents can pretty much skip out on the whole thing.

    Steve:


    Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.
     
    Not weird at all, once you accept the fact (well known to TD, Corvy, and 150 million wokesters) that crime isn't the problem, but white attitudes toward crime.

    Yeah, I said 150 million. Their army is growing.

    Replies: @JimDandy

    , @SunBakedSuburb
    @JimDandy

    "I call it the Louis Till syndrome."

    Father n' Son act? Was Louis buried in Italy after the rape or did the U.S. Army ship his body back to the U.S.?

    Replies: @JimDandy, @jallynn

  2. There was a pilot programme in the North East of Britain, I’m not sure if they shut it down, during the 2000s where the police would just take DNA samples from any man who aroused their attention for any minor crime.

    The idea was maybe Jim wasn’t a serious criminal but he might have close male relatives who were. Once you have your identified DNA from a crime scene you can match it to your database and knowing this sample was a first cousin with a common grandfather you’ve narrowed down the list of possibilities hugely.

    Male criminality is closely linked to ASPD or Anti-Social Personality Disorder as a psychological diagnosis. Given the symptoms it’s actually one of the best diagnosed and studied and most likely to represent something innate and real.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder

    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.

    • Replies: @Altai
    @Altai

    If we accept that we notice in real life that men and women with these traits are more attracted to and associate with each other more, then we can have a stable subpopulation in certain places where such density of these types pushes out anyone who can't stand them, thus 'ghettos', 'sink estates' or 'no-go zones'.

    This paper on the sociobiology of sociopathy got condemned had a few counter papers (Without an argument beyond it can’t be true because of the implication) and has largely been memory-holed except that it was probably the last serious paper of it’s type in a serious journal that I’m aware of.

    The link is to a whole journal edition, the paper in question is on page 121.

    https://sci-hub.hkvisa.net/10.1017/s0140525x00039595

    A paper like this goes a long way to explaining the dynamic of inner city honor cultures.

    The implications of this are that fundamentally IQ is looked at too much in terms of societies, the aggregate temperament or personality that dictates what social or cultural mores are sustainable is quite crucial as is that of the places societies are getting their immigrants. (As well as how clannish and how many generations they’ll have an ‘immigrant’ chip on their shoulder or identity)

    Do the two go together perfectly? No, there are big social and cultural changes that are really just due to certain wars or events going a certain way. But surely the mores of a society must have an impact on the reproductive fitness of different personality and temperament types and how well they adapt to the ruling macro situation.

    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.

    Indeed it seems to me that immigrants will largely disproportionately have people on this spectrum as everyone in the world has noticed throughout history.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave, @AnotherDad

    , @Curle
    @Altai

    Thanks for this. I’d followed the British ASBO phenom. in the past with some curiosity but never came across this detail.

    , @AnotherDad
    @Altai


    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.
     
    Great paragraph Altai. A parasite game-theory solution is exactly what the criminal personality type is.

    Minoritarianism is essentially an ideologic justification of parasitism--not just criminal but all of it. Basically "you normies don't get to say how you want to live; you exist to be looted; grab your ankles!". And unfortunately ... it has triumphed and is the reigning ideology today.
    , @Feryl
    @Altai

    Psycopaths exist because all tribes need people who can mercilessly deal out violence with no remorse. Of course, as one gets further from the equator people tend to be more cautious (due to their ancestors not jumping in the water and freezing to death) which weeds out psychopaths to some degree. But never are they totally eliminated, since psychopaths tend to be good at reproducing before they are killed or incarcerated.

  3. @Altai
    There was a pilot programme in the North East of Britain, I'm not sure if they shut it down, during the 2000s where the police would just take DNA samples from any man who aroused their attention for any minor crime.

    The idea was maybe Jim wasn't a serious criminal but he might have close male relatives who were. Once you have your identified DNA from a crime scene you can match it to your database and knowing this sample was a first cousin with a common grandfather you've narrowed down the list of possibilities hugely.

    Male criminality is closely linked to ASPD or Anti-Social Personality Disorder as a psychological diagnosis. Given the symptoms it's actually one of the best diagnosed and studied and most likely to represent something innate and real.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder

    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.

    Replies: @Altai, @Curle, @AnotherDad, @Feryl

    If we accept that we notice in real life that men and women with these traits are more attracted to and associate with each other more, then we can have a stable subpopulation in certain places where such density of these types pushes out anyone who can’t stand them, thus ‘ghettos’, ‘sink estates’ or ‘no-go zones’.

    This paper on the sociobiology of sociopathy got condemned had a few counter papers (Without an argument beyond it can’t be true because of the implication) and has largely been memory-holed except that it was probably the last serious paper of it’s type in a serious journal that I’m aware of.

    The link is to a whole journal edition, the paper in question is on page 121.

    https://sci-hub.hkvisa.net/10.1017/s0140525x00039595

    A paper like this goes a long way to explaining the dynamic of inner city honor cultures.

    The implications of this are that fundamentally IQ is looked at too much in terms of societies, the aggregate temperament or personality that dictates what social or cultural mores are sustainable is quite crucial as is that of the places societies are getting their immigrants. (As well as how clannish and how many generations they’ll have an ‘immigrant’ chip on their shoulder or identity)

    Do the two go together perfectly? No, there are big social and cultural changes that are really just due to certain wars or events going a certain way. But surely the mores of a society must have an impact on the reproductive fitness of different personality and temperament types and how well they adapt to the ruling macro situation.

    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.

    Indeed it seems to me that immigrants will largely disproportionately have people on this spectrum as everyone in the world has noticed throughout history.

    • Replies: @PhysicistDave
    @Altai

    Altai wrote:


    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.
     
    Oh, I'd say it's what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-'60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I'm a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the '60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say "No!" to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks "knew their place'; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the "Golden Rule" back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law ("A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful..."), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @Anonymous, @Altai, @Mike Tre, @Mr. Anon

    , @AnotherDad
    @Altai


    The implications of this are that fundamentally IQ is looked at too much in terms of societies, the aggregate temperament or personality that dictates what social or cultural mores are sustainable is quite crucial as is that of the places societies are getting their immigrants. (As well as how clannish and how many generations they’ll have an ‘immigrant’ chip on their shoulder or identity)
     
    Terrific paragraph, Altai.

    IQ is required, but it is the level of trust and cooperation that was bred into Western Christian peoples over that last thousand or so years--of "marry the girl next door" and "i'll help with your harvest, you help with mine"--that have made those societies particularly pleasant.
  4. @Altai
    @Altai

    If we accept that we notice in real life that men and women with these traits are more attracted to and associate with each other more, then we can have a stable subpopulation in certain places where such density of these types pushes out anyone who can't stand them, thus 'ghettos', 'sink estates' or 'no-go zones'.

    This paper on the sociobiology of sociopathy got condemned had a few counter papers (Without an argument beyond it can’t be true because of the implication) and has largely been memory-holed except that it was probably the last serious paper of it’s type in a serious journal that I’m aware of.

    The link is to a whole journal edition, the paper in question is on page 121.

    https://sci-hub.hkvisa.net/10.1017/s0140525x00039595

    A paper like this goes a long way to explaining the dynamic of inner city honor cultures.

    The implications of this are that fundamentally IQ is looked at too much in terms of societies, the aggregate temperament or personality that dictates what social or cultural mores are sustainable is quite crucial as is that of the places societies are getting their immigrants. (As well as how clannish and how many generations they’ll have an ‘immigrant’ chip on their shoulder or identity)

    Do the two go together perfectly? No, there are big social and cultural changes that are really just due to certain wars or events going a certain way. But surely the mores of a society must have an impact on the reproductive fitness of different personality and temperament types and how well they adapt to the ruling macro situation.

    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.

    Indeed it seems to me that immigrants will largely disproportionately have people on this spectrum as everyone in the world has noticed throughout history.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave, @AnotherDad

    Altai wrote:

    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.

    Oh, I’d say it’s what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-’60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I’m a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the ’60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say “No!” to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks “knew their place’; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the “Golden Rule” back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law (“A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful…”), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the ’60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    • Agree: SafeNow, northeast
    • Replies: @Hangnail Hans
    @PhysicistDave


    People who think the ’60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.
     
    Agree with your post, except I don't believe anyone really thinks that.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave

    , @Anonymous
    @PhysicistDave

    Here’s a cab driver being interviewed in the late 1980’s about daily life in the 1950’s. He had a good memory and his descriptions are vivid. He was from the D.C. area (that’s an old D.C. twang he has) so his descriptions might be more relatable to someone who grew up in the D.C. area (now called the “DMV” for D.C./MD/VA).

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NS4UT_t73b0

    , @Altai
    @PhysicistDave

    What you're describing is also noted famously in 'The Fourth Turning', that society goes through generational cycles where people and society adapt to greater or lesser impetuses for social conformity and cohesion. Usually due to a crisis that develops entirely due to a lack of society coming together to defend it's common interests or health.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory

    What has gone wrong in the West is that the last 'unraveling' has been so total that nice middle class white women with genetically normal and altruistic psychologies are doing what their grandparents did but instead of adopting a pro-social mantra they are spreading an anti-social mantra that is decided by the convoluted logic of the time as actually pro-social. In essence instead of trying to enforce social conformity to dampen down the unraveling they are promoting social conformity against anti-unraveling forces.

    This is what cancel culture is.

    Replies: @Ian Smith

    , @Mike Tre
    @PhysicistDave

    "I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid."

    With good reason. The way negroes and homosexuals now treat everyone else is a lot more deplorable than the former.

    , @Mr. Anon
    @PhysicistDave


    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.
     
    Yes, the cops should have left homosexual hangouts alone, and never raided Stonewall. Although one wonders why they bothered to raid such places. Maybe it was because there were underaged people there? Or maybe it was because they were behind on their protection money to this or that gang (including the blue gang).

    Regardless, given that the whole trans/what's-your-pronoun/shoving-deviant-sexuality-in-your-face-24/7 movement is part of a seamless arc that began on June 28th, 1969 (the same date as the assassination of Franz Ferdinand - hey, WWI and WWG started on the same date!), it's worth contemplating the idea that perhaps closets exist for a reason.
  5. @JimDandy
    I call it the Louis Till syndrome.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @SunBakedSuburb

    Well, true enough — except that an even more common syndrome in the hood is not having any idea who your dad actually is. And your dad definitely doesn’t know who his kids are. It takes a village, so the parents can pretty much skip out on the whole thing.

    Steve:

    Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.

    Not weird at all, once you accept the fact (well known to TD, Corvy, and 150 million wokesters) that crime isn’t the problem, but white attitudes toward crime.

    Yeah, I said 150 million. Their army is growing.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @Hangnail Hans

    150 million, you say? I have no idea what the number is, but the Goodwhites problem is HUGE. Their response to the growing problem of black crime in America is usually an exercise in DoubleThink and Doublespeak: Growing black crime is a myth, and also it is happening because of old institutional racist policies such as redlining and police brutality and Jim Crow. The result is a black population that feels (correctly) untouchable. In the past few days there were several mob attacks on police in Chicago. And scenes like this one are becoming the norm:

    cwbchicago.com

    Hundreds of Chicago police officers were in the area to handle the large crowds and seemingly inevitable violence that descends on the area around Boystown after recent Pride Parades.

    Cops immediately radioed that shots had been fired and a vehicle, described as a “Dodge Ram pickup” and, alternatively, a “black truck,” was leaving the scene, according to a CPD report.

    Two or three minutes later, officers saw a black Dodge Ram pickup truck heading north on Broadway near Roscoe Street. They pulled it over.

    As officers removed three men from the four-door truck, bystanders swooped in to record the incident on their phones.

    “Let them go! Kim Foxx says let them go! Lawsuit! Lawsuit!” a man yelled in a video that has since been removed from the Citizen app. “Yeah, you mother f*cking clowns … I want a badge number from each and every one of you all.”

    “Another stupid mother f*cking clown … Incompetent! Incompetent! Let ’em go,” he continued. “Kim Foxx says let them go. Kim Foxx, Kim Foxx says let them go! Let them go!”

    Unbeknownst to the bystanders, police saw an ammunition magazine lying on the truck’s front passenger floorboard and a handgun in the rear passenger area, according to a CPD report that documented the stop.

    Police records indicate that officers sought charges for aggravated battery by discharging a firearm against at least one of the truck’s occupants. But, two days after the men were arrested, they were all released, according to police records.

    The heckler was correct. Kim Foxx declined to press charges against any of them.

    Replies: @Curle

  6. @PhysicistDave
    @Altai

    Altai wrote:


    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.
     
    Oh, I'd say it's what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-'60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I'm a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the '60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say "No!" to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks "knew their place'; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the "Golden Rule" back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law ("A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful..."), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @Anonymous, @Altai, @Mike Tre, @Mr. Anon

    People who think the ’60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Agree with your post, except I don’t believe anyone really thinks that.

    • Replies: @PhysicistDave
    @Hangnail Hans

    Hangnail Hans wrote to me:


    Agree with your post, except I don’t believe anyone really thinks that [the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll].
     
    Well, I was being a bit facetious.

    But a lot of the discussion about the '60s does focus on the "liberating" aspects of the '60s -- the Civil Rights movement, Second-Wave feminism, gay rights, the relaxed attitude towards drugs, etc., some of which was actually a good thing.

    But I think people tend to forget that along with all the big-name "Movements" there was also a degradation in simple civilized behavior -- obeying just laws, following the Golden Rule, encouraging courteous and responsible behavior between males and females, etc.

    There have been ups and downs (e.g., in the crime rate) since the '60s, but in many of these respects, we never seem to have gotten back to the better aspects of the 1950s.

    Again: the '50s were not really the "Wonder Years" of, say, the Happy Days show: there were real problems and injustices.

    But in some ways, they really were better then the six decades that have occurred since.

    Unfortunately, most people have trouble drawing distinctions like this, I am afraid.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @YetAnotherAnon

  7. OT but an amusing comment from one of the team at the cityunslicker blog.

    “Not very many realistic options left now. Failing to seize the key objectives early on, before events prevented them being gained at all.

    Having taken such losses to little effect. Weak and sometimes incompetent political appointees. Few professionals and too many cronies. Not much has been gained for such a horrendous expenditure of treasure.

    The task is too difficult. The support for the enemy now too numerous and sustained. Such a botched campaign of basic errors. Poor plans. Too many objectives and not enough focus or resources allocated to the key priorities.

    Because those methods had worked before, he thought he could rinse and repeat forever.

    An totally unnecessary conflict full of unforced, basic errors. Built on lies, deceit and one man’s egotistical belief that the rules won’t be applied to him in his desire for great glory.

    Surely Johnson must now resign?”

    • Replies: @Unintended Consequence
    @YetAnotherAnon

    My favorite Johnson quote is from Martin Kettle in The Guardian:

    "There is far more at stake in our politics right now than the future of one disreputable man's incontinent ego."

  8. anon[255] • Disclaimer says:

    U.S. children are harmed by crime

    Should be.

    US children harmed by exposure to criminals.

    And they are assuming that the criminal justice system is the problem. But I would say it is a good thing and very expensive and that the alternative is unthinkable. And that US blacks are fortunate that they can self segregate in neighborhoods with relaxed standards, which they frequently prefer.

  9. 62% of Black, non-Hispanic (referred to as Black for the remainder of Sections 6 and 7) children grow up in a household where one or more potential caregivers are charged with either a misdemeanor or felony criminal offense.

    The other 38% are taught by their “caregivers” how not to get caught.

  10. Anonymous[299] • Disclaimer says:
    @PhysicistDave
    @Altai

    Altai wrote:


    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.
     
    Oh, I'd say it's what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-'60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I'm a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the '60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say "No!" to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks "knew their place'; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the "Golden Rule" back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law ("A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful..."), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @Anonymous, @Altai, @Mike Tre, @Mr. Anon

    Here’s a cab driver being interviewed in the late 1980’s about daily life in the 1950’s. He had a good memory and his descriptions are vivid. He was from the D.C. area (that’s an old D.C. twang he has) so his descriptions might be more relatable to someone who grew up in the D.C. area (now called the “DMV” for D.C./MD/VA).

  11. OT, but World War T(hree?) has its very own transgender journalist covering the Ukraine conflict – one Sarah Ashton-Cirillo, apparently from Las Vegas.

    “One of the gender affirming healthcare options for transgender women is FFS: Facial Feminization Surgery. The procedure cosmetically provides a more feminine appearance for those whose male puberty has defined their features as unmistakably male. ”

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/dawnstaceyennis/2022/06/29/what-is-this-transgender-journalist-doing-in-ukraine-covering-a-war/

    Xhe’s certainly got some interesting stories.

    https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/06/war-crimes-lgbtq-people-ukraine-worse-people-can-imagine/

    “Russian forces are hunting down gay men, raping and castrating them.”

    But I’m not sure this tweet is terribly on-message:

    Some Ukrainian units are out of body bags and there is a shortage available to replenish them.

    Ukraine has already won but the cost is high.

    • Thanks: PhysicistDave
    • Replies: @Verymuchalive
    @YetAnotherAnon

    I wouldn't take anything this eunuch says seriously. He claims Ukraine has already won the war. It's either delusional or propaganda. Either way, ignore.

    , @AndrewR
    @YetAnotherAnon

    Lmaoooo idk how these people define "winning" other than "Russians haven't occupied Lviv yet"

    Replies: @sayless

  12. Amazing how nerds will get at these social problems with data (tongs/ 10 foot pole) but not know how to deal with the humans who manifest with these difficulties as a basketball coach might. So, geniuses of correlation-is-causation, what are the likely maladaptive behaviors manifested by these victims of circumstance? Poor impulse control, poor anger management, weak conflict resolution skills, failure to plan ahead, lack of empathy are a few I can think of along with difficulties with learning and tendencies towards substance abuse.

    Basically it’s the basis for an intervention to correct for the bad role model and/or bad genes which would first manifest as a study. I found a few expensive to access journal articles on mentoring such children (Social Work in Public Health is one such journal). Therefore mentoring is definitely a hands-on approach used to ameliorating the negative impact of an incarcerated father. I’m mostly certain the social workers dealt only with stress due to the disruption in the child’s life although it could also be utilized to teach adaptive behavior. However, this might cause problems once dad gets out of jail to discover his son is a wimpy little goody-two-shoes who needs to be smacked around a bit to get sorted.

    • Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease
    @Unintended Consequence

    "So, geniuses of correlation-is-causation, what are the likely maladaptive behaviors manifested by these victims of circumstance? Poor impulse control, poor anger management, etc."

    Actually the basic problem which is the underlying force beneath everything you cite, is: an inability to adapt to modernity.

    Modernity is highly complex, it is historically very very new, it was selectively developed (viz it is by no means universal), and it is very much unlike all previous modes of human existence, with the possible exception of the upper echelons of the Sung Dynasty.

    There are classes of people who simply have not had enough time and exposure to adapt to modernity, and there are people who are categorically, congenitally incapable of doing so.

    Like the late great Phil Hartman used to say, "I'm just a caveman! Your world frightens and confuses me!"

    Now imagine various population subgroups, and take that joke literally and seriously.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave

  13. @Hangnail Hans
    @PhysicistDave


    People who think the ’60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.
     
    Agree with your post, except I don't believe anyone really thinks that.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave

    Hangnail Hans wrote to me:

    Agree with your post, except I don’t believe anyone really thinks that [the ’60s were mainly about rock-and-roll].

    Well, I was being a bit facetious.

    But a lot of the discussion about the ’60s does focus on the “liberating” aspects of the ’60s — the Civil Rights movement, Second-Wave feminism, gay rights, the relaxed attitude towards drugs, etc., some of which was actually a good thing.

    But I think people tend to forget that along with all the big-name “Movements” there was also a degradation in simple civilized behavior — obeying just laws, following the Golden Rule, encouraging courteous and responsible behavior between males and females, etc.

    There have been ups and downs (e.g., in the crime rate) since the ’60s, but in many of these respects, we never seem to have gotten back to the better aspects of the 1950s.

    Again: the ’50s were not really the “Wonder Years” of, say, the Happy Days show: there were real problems and injustices.

    But in some ways, they really were better then the six decades that have occurred since.

    Unfortunately, most people have trouble drawing distinctions like this, I am afraid.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @PhysicistDave

    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it's speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There's the "cool" factor. It's never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days. Always, the defending of conservative social mores of yesteryear, or even the present, have been, and are, disparaged.

    That has gone on for over 1/2 a century now, so I would not discount it, even though it's not anything but a psychological factor. If it's not "hip to be square", then gullible and under-confident young people will go the other way.

    Of course, I do know that Huey Lewis and the News song. Was that a slight lull during the early/mid 1980s? I think they were just making a joke with the title and lyrics. "Square" has not been "OK" with the majority of young people since I've been alive.

    Replies: @AndrewR, @Curle, @PhysicistDave

    , @YetAnotherAnon
    @PhysicistDave

    "obeying just laws, following the Golden Rule, encouraging courteous and responsible behavior between males and females"


    The way I like it
    Is the way it is
    I got mine
    Don't worry 'bout his
     
    As one of the musical icons of the 60s put it.

    Indeed it's interesting how the "grab what's mine, what's mine is what I can grab, and f*** you!" mindset exists both at the very top and the very bottom of the income levels.
  14. @Unintended Consequence
    Amazing how nerds will get at these social problems with data (tongs/ 10 foot pole) but not know how to deal with the humans who manifest with these difficulties as a basketball coach might. So, geniuses of correlation-is-causation, what are the likely maladaptive behaviors manifested by these victims of circumstance? Poor impulse control, poor anger management, weak conflict resolution skills, failure to plan ahead, lack of empathy are a few I can think of along with difficulties with learning and tendencies towards substance abuse.

    Basically it's the basis for an intervention to correct for the bad role model and/or bad genes which would first manifest as a study. I found a few expensive to access journal articles on mentoring such children (Social Work in Public Health is one such journal). Therefore mentoring is definitely a hands-on approach used to ameliorating the negative impact of an incarcerated father. I'm mostly certain the social workers dealt only with stress due to the disruption in the child's life although it could also be utilized to teach adaptive behavior. However, this might cause problems once dad gets out of jail to discover his son is a wimpy little goody-two-shoes who needs to be smacked around a bit to get sorted.

    Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease

    “So, geniuses of correlation-is-causation, what are the likely maladaptive behaviors manifested by these victims of circumstance? Poor impulse control, poor anger management, etc.”

    Actually the basic problem which is the underlying force beneath everything you cite, is: an inability to adapt to modernity.

    Modernity is highly complex, it is historically very very new, it was selectively developed (viz it is by no means universal), and it is very much unlike all previous modes of human existence, with the possible exception of the upper echelons of the Sung Dynasty.

    There are classes of people who simply have not had enough time and exposure to adapt to modernity, and there are people who are categorically, congenitally incapable of doing so.

    Like the late great Phil Hartman used to say, “I’m just a caveman! Your world frightens and confuses me!”

    Now imagine various population subgroups, and take that joke literally and seriously.

    • Replies: @PhysicistDave
    @The Germ Theory of Disease

    The Germ Theory of Disease wrote:


    Actually the basic problem which is the underlying force beneath everything you cite, is: an inability to adapt to modernity.

    Modernity is highly complex, it is historically very very new, it was selectively developed (viz it is by no means universal), and it is very much unlike all previous modes of human existence...
     
    In the relevant respects, America was already a prime exemplar of "modernity" by 1950: a highly productive industrial market economy, a high level of literacy, a good deal of social and geographic mobility, impressive technology, etc.

    And it worked quite well -- stable families, low crime rate, high life expectancy, etc.

    And then it all fell apart in the next three decades.

    No, America was not wrecked by modernity -- this was not a natural death, this was homicide.

    A country that was not perfect but that worked remarkably well was sabotaged by its own elites.
  15. Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.

    Nothing weird about it. You have to blame society, i.e. whitey and his civilization, for all that ails the criminal minded among us. Blaming nurture is blame shifting and blaming nature is not even an option today in the blank slate world of the social sciences.

  16. Interesting the authors assume a child is ”harmed” by exposure to the criminal justice system. How many actually benefit because their adult male caregiver is a criminal? If Daddy steals a lot money rent gets paid and junior gets a new pair of Nike sneakers. I doubt many successful drug dealers insist their mate take a low paid job in a convalescent hospital or school cafeteria. She can stay home and raise her children same as an affluent suburban housewife.

    Given how many felony convictions it can take before a prison sentence is handed out and how seldom a person gets arrested for the felonies they do commit the lesson the child is likely to learn is that if you are careful, keep your mouth shut crime is good career. Certainly better than any job his adult guardian could otherwise get. The real danger comes not from the police or criminal justice system but from other negro criminals who will shoot you for a violation you may not even be aware you committed.

  17. Perhaps this was more of a factor in the 2nd half of the previous century, when the Welfare State encouraged “Baby Daddies” to be officially not residing with the single Moms who would thereby collect more monthly money from the taxpayers per kid, but:

    What about those fathers who never officially resided at home? This study is from Census Bureau data, so even if some criminal black Baby Daddies DID spend some quality time (haha) with their boys, they would not be a part of the official “exposure”. If it’s important that you not officially live there, then you don’t tell the Census Bureau.

    Wouldn’t that make this correlation look BETTER than it actually is, when it comes to boys with criminal Dads? (That is, “better” as in, even more of the bad black boys actually DID have criminal Dads – more correlation than these guys show.) As you wrote, the most hardcore criminal types would (hopefully) spend more time away, but, the genetics have been there since the get-go, no matter what.
    .

    BTW, this study just makes me feel that much better about having never told the Census Bureau anything more than “n many people live here.” Yeah, this is all de-identified, but when a certain desk in the FBI want names from them, they’ll get names.

    • Replies: @Pixo
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Baby-daddys usually use their own mother’s address. However, if they have no income, there’s no harm of losing welfare for their baby-mama by officially moving in, and she’ll get more in food stamps, but his mother will get less.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    , @Barnard
    @Achmed E. Newman


    BTW, this study just makes me feel that much better about having never told the Census Bureau anything more than “n many people live here.” Yeah, this is all de-identified, but when a certain desk in the FBI want names from them, they’ll get names.
     
    There are half a dozen other ways for them to get the names of the people living in your residence than the Census bureau. This isn't going to stop them.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

  18. @PhysicistDave
    @Altai

    Altai wrote:


    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.
     
    Oh, I'd say it's what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-'60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I'm a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the '60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say "No!" to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks "knew their place'; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the "Golden Rule" back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law ("A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful..."), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @Anonymous, @Altai, @Mike Tre, @Mr. Anon

    What you’re describing is also noted famously in ‘The Fourth Turning’, that society goes through generational cycles where people and society adapt to greater or lesser impetuses for social conformity and cohesion. Usually due to a crisis that develops entirely due to a lack of society coming together to defend it’s common interests or health.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory

    What has gone wrong in the West is that the last ‘unraveling’ has been so total that nice middle class white women with genetically normal and altruistic psychologies are doing what their grandparents did but instead of adopting a pro-social mantra they are spreading an anti-social mantra that is decided by the convoluted logic of the time as actually pro-social. In essence instead of trying to enforce social conformity to dampen down the unraveling they are promoting social conformity against anti-unraveling forces.

    This is what cancel culture is.

    • Replies: @Ian Smith
    @Altai

    The generational theory always seemed like one of those unfalsifiable things where you can find any traits you want per generation. I mean, Timothy Leary and Ronald Reagan were both in the Greatest Generation. Oliver North and John Holmes were both born in 1943. And the idea that it’s some kind of repeating cycle seems especially dubious to me.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

  19. @YetAnotherAnon
    OT but an amusing comment from one of the team at the cityunslicker blog.

    "Not very many realistic options left now. Failing to seize the key objectives early on, before events prevented them being gained at all.

    Having taken such losses to little effect. Weak and sometimes incompetent political appointees. Few professionals and too many cronies. Not much has been gained for such a horrendous expenditure of treasure.

    The task is too difficult. The support for the enemy now too numerous and sustained. Such a botched campaign of basic errors. Poor plans. Too many objectives and not enough focus or resources allocated to the key priorities.

    Because those methods had worked before, he thought he could rinse and repeat forever.

    An totally unnecessary conflict full of unforced, basic errors. Built on lies, deceit and one man’s egotistical belief that the rules won’t be applied to him in his desire for great glory.












    Surely Johnson must now resign?"
     

    Replies: @Unintended Consequence

    My favorite Johnson quote is from Martin Kettle in The Guardian:

    “There is far more at stake in our politics right now than the future of one disreputable man’s incontinent ego.”

  20. @PhysicistDave
    @Hangnail Hans

    Hangnail Hans wrote to me:


    Agree with your post, except I don’t believe anyone really thinks that [the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll].
     
    Well, I was being a bit facetious.

    But a lot of the discussion about the '60s does focus on the "liberating" aspects of the '60s -- the Civil Rights movement, Second-Wave feminism, gay rights, the relaxed attitude towards drugs, etc., some of which was actually a good thing.

    But I think people tend to forget that along with all the big-name "Movements" there was also a degradation in simple civilized behavior -- obeying just laws, following the Golden Rule, encouraging courteous and responsible behavior between males and females, etc.

    There have been ups and downs (e.g., in the crime rate) since the '60s, but in many of these respects, we never seem to have gotten back to the better aspects of the 1950s.

    Again: the '50s were not really the "Wonder Years" of, say, the Happy Days show: there were real problems and injustices.

    But in some ways, they really were better then the six decades that have occurred since.

    Unfortunately, most people have trouble drawing distinctions like this, I am afraid.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @YetAnotherAnon

    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it’s speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There’s the “cool” factor. It’s never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days. Always, the defending of conservative social mores of yesteryear, or even the present, have been, and are, disparaged.

    That has gone on for over 1/2 a century now, so I would not discount it, even though it’s not anything but a psychological factor. If it’s not “hip to be square”, then gullible and under-confident young people will go the other way.

    Of course, I do know that Huey Lewis and the News song. Was that a slight lull during the early/mid 1980s? I think they were just making a joke with the title and lyrics. “Square” has not been “OK” with the majority of young people since I’ve been alive.

    • Replies: @AndrewR
    @Achmed E. Newman

    There is increasing popularity among younger people, if not from the top-down shapers of culture and law, to embrace traditional values like not being a shameless whore.

    I was born in 1984 so the messages I got growing up were pretty much the same as the messages that people born in 1964 or even 1954 got growing up (albeit probably even more degenerate)

    But the teenagers today have grown up in a very different society than I did. We didn't have OnlyFans, tranny mania, or wokeism in general. But these things have created a backlash even among many young people.

    Basically we are creating two parallel cultures and it seems likely the polarization we are experiencing makes the polarization of the late 1960s look tame in comparison (speaking as someone born after that)

    , @Curle
    @Achmed E. Newman

    In some ways I think the square association with conservatism is mostly an creation of the media and the Left and less a product of youth culture. I attended an conservative campaign training program in the ‘80s and was surprised by the sartorial variety of the people there. Long hair on men in some instances. Nothing like the buzz cut or overly preppy look touted as the uniform by the Left. Nary an bow tie or seersucker in sight.

    Of course, this was an campaign training program as opposed to an seminar so it was directed at the doers and work horses not the navel gazers.

    , @PhysicistDave
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Achmed E. Newman wrote to me:


    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it’s speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There’s the “cool” factor. It’s never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days.
     
    Well, it's an interesting question.

    Back around 1962-'63, when I was in mid-grade school, the word in my peer group was not "cool," but "neat-o." I remember this very distinctly because my dad thought it was very funny how important the final "o" was to us kids.

    And "neat-o" had a different connotation than "cool" had: "neat-o" did not mean edgy or transgressive or rebellious or likely to irritate adults. It basically just meant really appealing to grade-school boys.

    The space program, for example, was "neat-o."

    By 1968-'69, on the other hand, "cool" was in common use, though not universally, since it did tend to mean edgy or offensive to adults, and not all of us wanted to offend adults.

    The space programs brings up who our heroes were in the early '60s: the Mercury astronauts certainly counted as did some sports figures. All my friends knew who Maris and Mantle were (and we were not heavily into sports), and everyone in St. Louis could name several of the stars on the baseball Cardinals: one of my classmates' main claim to fame was that she baby-sat for Lou Brock's kids (Brock was Black and our community was fairly racist, but since Brock was a superstar with the Cards, that overrode his race).

    If you had asked my grade-school peers and me for "heroes," aside from the astronauts and sports figures, I think we would have been reduced to naming figures from history -- Washington, Edison, etc.

    Even when it came to pop music, there was less generational division than you'd think from reading about the period: even adults recognized that "Yesterday," "The Girl from Ipanema," "The Sound of Silence," "Unchained Melody," etc. were good songs. My dad, whose tastes were very conservative, was fond of "Puff the Magic Dragon" (needless to say, Dad did not know about the supposed connection to marijuana!).

    Even in high school, I could not name a single student that I knew to be using illicit drugs (i.e., aside from tobacco and alcohol): there were vague rumors that some unnamed students were using, but that was all.

    Being boys, most of us did occasionally engage in damn-fool behavior: I myself was more cautious than most boys, but I still remember a few foolish actions. But most of that damn-fool behavior was similar to the damn-fool behavior our dads and their dads before them had engaged in: i.e., it was not generational rebellion as much as just boys being boys,

    I grew up in a lower-middle class/working-class suburb of St. Louis. In grade school, we were not tracked, and my close friends ranged from top students to guys who were just barely passing, so they were a fairly random sample.

    For us, "the '60s" were really sort of a media presentation: we heard and read about the hippies, drugs, the "death of God," the antiwar movement, and all the rest, but it was not part of our lives. Most of us did end up being against the war, but, again, this happened at about the same time that most adults turned against the war.

    "The '60s" seemed to us to be something that happened on college campuses, among spoiled rich kids, and out in the big coastal cities.

    That changed at some point in the '70s, but I was off at college by then and did not see the changes in our community happening up close and personal.

    I'm curious to know if guys in my age group from other parts of the country had similar or different experiences of "the '60s."

    Replies: @Feryl

  21. @PhysicistDave
    @Hangnail Hans

    Hangnail Hans wrote to me:


    Agree with your post, except I don’t believe anyone really thinks that [the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll].
     
    Well, I was being a bit facetious.

    But a lot of the discussion about the '60s does focus on the "liberating" aspects of the '60s -- the Civil Rights movement, Second-Wave feminism, gay rights, the relaxed attitude towards drugs, etc., some of which was actually a good thing.

    But I think people tend to forget that along with all the big-name "Movements" there was also a degradation in simple civilized behavior -- obeying just laws, following the Golden Rule, encouraging courteous and responsible behavior between males and females, etc.

    There have been ups and downs (e.g., in the crime rate) since the '60s, but in many of these respects, we never seem to have gotten back to the better aspects of the 1950s.

    Again: the '50s were not really the "Wonder Years" of, say, the Happy Days show: there were real problems and injustices.

    But in some ways, they really were better then the six decades that have occurred since.

    Unfortunately, most people have trouble drawing distinctions like this, I am afraid.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @YetAnotherAnon

    “obeying just laws, following the Golden Rule, encouraging courteous and responsible behavior between males and females”

    The way I like it
    Is the way it is
    I got mine
    Don’t worry ’bout his

    As one of the musical icons of the 60s put it.

    Indeed it’s interesting how the “grab what’s mine, what’s mine is what I can grab, and f*** you!” mindset exists both at the very top and the very bottom of the income levels.

  22. @PhysicistDave
    @Altai

    Altai wrote:


    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.
     
    Oh, I'd say it's what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-'60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I'm a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the '60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say "No!" to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks "knew their place'; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the "Golden Rule" back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law ("A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful..."), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @Anonymous, @Altai, @Mike Tre, @Mr. Anon

    “I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.”

    With good reason. The way negroes and homosexuals now treat everyone else is a lot more deplorable than the former.

  23. @Achmed E. Newman
    Perhaps this was more of a factor in the 2nd half of the previous century, when the Welfare State encouraged "Baby Daddies" to be officially not residing with the single Moms who would thereby collect more monthly money from the taxpayers per kid, but:

    What about those fathers who never officially resided at home? This study is from Census Bureau data, so even if some criminal black Baby Daddies DID spend some quality time (haha) with their boys, they would not be a part of the official "exposure". If it's important that you not officially live there, then you don't tell the Census Bureau.

    Wouldn't that make this correlation look BETTER than it actually is, when it comes to boys with criminal Dads? (That is, "better" as in, even more of the bad black boys actually DID have criminal Dads - more correlation than these guys show.) As you wrote, the most hardcore criminal types would (hopefully) spend more time away, but, the genetics have been there since the get-go, no matter what.
    .


    BTW, this study just makes me feel that much better about having never told the Census Bureau anything more than "n many people live here." Yeah, this is all de-identified, but when a certain desk in the FBI want names from them, they'll get names.

    Replies: @Pixo, @Barnard

    Baby-daddys usually use their own mother’s address. However, if they have no income, there’s no harm of losing welfare for their baby-mama by officially moving in, and she’ll get more in food stamps, but his mother will get less.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @Pixo


    However, if they have no income, there’s no harm of losing welfare for their baby-mama by officially moving in...
     
    I have not much experience in that world (only one GF from years ago took part in some of this stuff), but I don't get that, Pixo. Single Moms get the breaks. Men and intact families in general don't get so many breaks. (That's other than those men on fake disability.)

    ... she’ll get more in food stamps, but his mother will get less.
     
    How's that? I'm talking about an ADULT father.

    Replies: @John Johnson

  24. “measure multiple adult influences in increasingly dynamic households.”

    Mama seemed to have a different boyfriend every night back then. Uncle Chetty said that was OK, just means we have an “increasingly dynamic household.”

    • Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Pixo


    "increasingly dynamic household."
     
    This sort of obscurant writing always reminds me of the famous passage from Solzhenitsyn in which Nature magazine reports the discovery of a frozen underground river containing prehistoric fish "preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot."

    Replies: @Jack D

  25. “On the other hand, the quantity and quality of the data can be extraordinary in the Chetty Era.”

    More Data =/= More Wisdom.

    • Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease
    @Ben Kurtz

    “On the other hand, the quantity and quality of the data can be extraordinary in the Chetty Era.”

    From the little that I can tell (not being an expert, just using chess-problem logic), Chetty and his ilk appear to be not merely misusing or misinterpreting their mountains of data, but actively weaponizing it in order to deliberately reach conclusions which are not only false, but which are maliciously, malignantly the opposite of the truth.

  26. The language in the sociological papers is interesting. Exposure and treatment are terms art used for the proposed explanatory variable in causal inference. Inferring causation, however, is tricky. Looks like they stop at correlation.

    I would like to be charitable and believe that the authors are just phrasing as they must to survive. There are some questions cannot be asked explicitly. Nonetheless, my direct experience with sociologists is that they truly believe. I had one, in a math methods tutorial, volunteer, largely unmotivated, about how Charles Murray had written a very racist book, “the Bell Curve”.

  27. The great unmentionable in today’s discussion is that our most ‘marginalized’ community generally is dropping the ball repeatedly in their adult relationships and then in their efforts as parents. The news will often talk about the need for more public resources on a wide variety of things for youths (schools, recreation, etc.) but what they are really calling for is effectively parenting outside of the home.

    Insulated (and largely white) elites and their black fellow travelers love to carp about what America supposedly owes blacks, but a large and growing share of the population understands perfectly well that a huge share of this most treasured population is failing their own kids and society at large – and will grow increasingly uninterested in public policy that favors blacks at the expense of everyone else.

  28. @Ben Kurtz
    "On the other hand, the quantity and quality of the data can be extraordinary in the Chetty Era."

    More Data =/= More Wisdom.

    Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease

    “On the other hand, the quantity and quality of the data can be extraordinary in the Chetty Era.”

    From the little that I can tell (not being an expert, just using chess-problem logic), Chetty and his ilk appear to be not merely misusing or misinterpreting their mountains of data, but actively weaponizing it in order to deliberately reach conclusions which are not only false, but which are maliciously, malignantly the opposite of the truth.

  29. If biomedical research were framed like this, they’d be trying to discover the cause of diseases by looking at household members’ rates of hospitalization.

    • Thanks: Coemgen, Achmed E. Newman
    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @International Jew

    Indeed this is yet another case of logical error and simplemindedness about variables. Correlation does not mean causation, that sort of thing. Another one is the idea being bandied about, here sometimes and by Tucker Carlson last night, that SSRIs might be causing mass shootings.

    Even Tucker last night poo-pooed the idea of correlation not meaning causation, as if that very correct concept just didn't matter.

    SSRIs are prescribed to people with problems, and the people doing White-style mass shootings have problems, therefore those people are more likely than the people outside the sample to be taking SSRIs. Whatever the cause of the shooting might be, it is something about the shooter that led to both the shooting and the prescription. (I don't necessarily think I am right about this, but the logic is there, and denying it doesn't help.)

    Of course in the case of this Black! crime thing, the authors of the paper Steve is writing about are probably just doing verbal contortions to conform to present-day requirements that all Blacks! are all good at all times and cannot be the cause of anything bad themselves.

    Replies: @JimDandy, @SunBakedSuburb

  30. @International Jew
    If biomedical research were framed like this, they'd be trying to discover the cause of diseases by looking at household members' rates of hospitalization.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk

    Indeed this is yet another case of logical error and simplemindedness about variables. Correlation does not mean causation, that sort of thing. Another one is the idea being bandied about, here sometimes and by Tucker Carlson last night, that SSRIs might be causing mass shootings.

    Even Tucker last night poo-pooed the idea of correlation not meaning causation, as if that very correct concept just didn’t matter.

    SSRIs are prescribed to people with problems, and the people doing White-style mass shootings have problems, therefore those people are more likely than the people outside the sample to be taking SSRIs. Whatever the cause of the shooting might be, it is something about the shooter that led to both the shooting and the prescription. (I don’t necessarily think I am right about this, but the logic is there, and denying it doesn’t help.)

    Of course in the case of this Black! crime thing, the authors of the paper Steve is writing about are probably just doing verbal contortions to conform to present-day requirements that all Blacks! are all good at all times and cannot be the cause of anything bad themselves.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @Buzz Mohawk

    It's good that people are talking about SSRIs, but I think there is a correlation between the new breed of fearless black criminals--the 13 year old carjackers and muggers, etc.--and drugs. I don't think they are much different from the child soldiers of Liberia/Sierra Leone. They aren't taking cane juice and gunpowder, but incredibly powerful marijuana, heroin, coke, etc.

    , @SunBakedSuburb
    @Buzz Mohawk

    "SSRIs might be causing mass shootings"

    SSRIs are certainly an element. This is where the malignant practice of psychiatry enters the picture. The drugs are used to zombify kids, particularly young white males. They become susceptible to messaging produced by the culture, or that which purposefully emanates from sinister actors with an agenda. An enterprising criminologist might want to do a comparison study between the serial killer phenomenon of the 60s and 70s and the mass shooter events that picked up steam in the late 1990s. The criminologist might want to contrast synthetic and organic factors that may determine causality.

  31. > Weirdly [sic], the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.

    On topic, here’s a comment I left yesterday on your prior social-science-paper-review post, “How To Predict Who Gets Shot In Chicago.”

    Credentialed social scientists respond to incentives in their subculture just as much as do the social inferiors under their microscopes.

    Yeah, perverse, if one is naive enough to credit the claimed aspirations of academics. The farthest thing from weird.

  32. “Conditional on county of birth, household income explains approximately 17% to 42% of the raw racial gap”

    Someone will be doing a good public service to point to an article that explains this jargon. Household income apparently has some relationship to “the raw racial gap”, but how is “17% to 42%” calculated, and more importantly, how is the word “explain” justified?

  33. @Achmed E. Newman
    Perhaps this was more of a factor in the 2nd half of the previous century, when the Welfare State encouraged "Baby Daddies" to be officially not residing with the single Moms who would thereby collect more monthly money from the taxpayers per kid, but:

    What about those fathers who never officially resided at home? This study is from Census Bureau data, so even if some criminal black Baby Daddies DID spend some quality time (haha) with their boys, they would not be a part of the official "exposure". If it's important that you not officially live there, then you don't tell the Census Bureau.

    Wouldn't that make this correlation look BETTER than it actually is, when it comes to boys with criminal Dads? (That is, "better" as in, even more of the bad black boys actually DID have criminal Dads - more correlation than these guys show.) As you wrote, the most hardcore criminal types would (hopefully) spend more time away, but, the genetics have been there since the get-go, no matter what.
    .


    BTW, this study just makes me feel that much better about having never told the Census Bureau anything more than "n many people live here." Yeah, this is all de-identified, but when a certain desk in the FBI want names from them, they'll get names.

    Replies: @Pixo, @Barnard

    BTW, this study just makes me feel that much better about having never told the Census Bureau anything more than “n many people live here.” Yeah, this is all de-identified, but when a certain desk in the FBI want names from them, they’ll get names.

    There are half a dozen other ways for them to get the names of the people living in your residence than the Census bureau. This isn’t going to stop them.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @Barnard

    This post was about the Census Bureau data, Barnard, but you're right. I got it covered the best I can. Unless I see a reason some org needs a piece of info. on me, they don't get it.

  34. Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.

    I think you mean “as is now standard on pain of excommunication”. Though it is kind of weird that the declaration of such obvious reversal of cause and effect is now mandatory. Almost as if some powerful malevolent force were at work.

    9% of children born between 1999–2005 were intergenerationally exposed to prison, 18% to a felony conviction,

    Does this mean that only half of felony convicts go to prison? This seems like an awfully low imprisonment rate of known felons for the supposedly “incarceration nation”.

    Or does this mean that only half visit their felony convict relative in prison? But how would the authors know that from census data?

    Or maybe when the father/mother’s-boyfriend is arrested, his residence with the child ends, so there is no longer “exposure”? But then that is a flaw in how the authors are reading the data, since all incarceration should end exposure unless the child is incarcerated with the adult, which never happens that I know of.

    • Agree: ic1000
    • Replies: @AndrewR
    @Almost Missouri

    The US is a very strange culture. I'm sure a lot of people are in prison that shouldn't be, and I'm sure that prison messes up the mental health and the life prospects of most/all prisoners, but clearly we have huge numbers of people, predominantly black and male, who pose an obvious danger to the public and should not be allowed freedom. I don't see any sustainable solution besides repatriation.

  35. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/243103421_How_Many_People_Do_You_Know_in_Prison

    Again I saw that under the sun the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, nor bread to the wise, nor riches to the intelligent, nor favor to the men of skill; but time and chance happen to them all.

    I did not go to Harvard and I do know people who are in prison. Count your blessings my friend!

  36. @YetAnotherAnon
    OT, but World War T(hree?) has its very own transgender journalist covering the Ukraine conflict - one Sarah Ashton-Cirillo, apparently from Las Vegas.

    "One of the gender affirming healthcare options for transgender women is FFS: Facial Feminization Surgery. The procedure cosmetically provides a more feminine appearance for those whose male puberty has defined their features as unmistakably male. "
     
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/dawnstaceyennis/2022/06/29/what-is-this-transgender-journalist-doing-in-ukraine-covering-a-war/

    Xhe's certainly got some interesting stories.

    https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/06/war-crimes-lgbtq-people-ukraine-worse-people-can-imagine/

    "Russian forces are hunting down gay men, raping and castrating them."

    But I'm not sure this tweet is terribly on-message:

    Some Ukrainian units are out of body bags and there is a shortage available to replenish them.

    Ukraine has already won but the cost is high.
     
    https://twitter.com/SarahAshtonLV/status/1544325881723772928

    Replies: @Verymuchalive, @AndrewR

    I wouldn’t take anything this eunuch says seriously. He claims Ukraine has already won the war. It’s either delusional or propaganda. Either way, ignore.

  37. The next major population study on the docket should be the behavioral impacts on children who attended “woke” schools encouraging, celebrating, and collaborating with children to choose new “Selective Sexual Identities” (SSI) as part of the New Age assumption that the human personality is infinitely malleable. Sexual deviance is evidently the new moniker for celebrating one’s newfound freedom from God and Nature. But wasn’t it Nietzsche who concluded that if one proposes that God does not exist, then he (or she) is posing that he (or she) is God? This has always proved an impossible burden to bear. It’s tempting fate.

    I recall the term “SSI” was popularized by the billionaire clan of Pritzer transvestites from Chicago who evidently can’t get over the “soft pillows” that fate has given them to fall on when they screw up by the numbers. But, again, they’re tempting fate. I’ve had relatives who “transitioned”. Their road back has been difficult and their psychological and often physical damage appears permanent when they realized that their presumptions of God-like powers were fleeting chimeras beyond their reach.

    Nonetheless, it should be a given that most people (and especially children) do not have “Pritzer Pillows” to fall on when they are encouraged by their teachers to engage in deviant sexual behaviors before they’ve even reached puberty. It’s time we start cataloging the damage.

  38. @Pixo
    “measure multiple adult influences in increasingly dynamic households.”

    Mama seemed to have a different boyfriend every night back then. Uncle Chetty said that was OK, just means we have an “increasingly dynamic household.”

    Replies: @Ghost of Bull Moose

    “increasingly dynamic household.”

    This sort of obscurant writing always reminds me of the famous passage from Solzhenitsyn in which Nature magazine reports the discovery of a frozen underground river containing prehistoric fish “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose


    “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”
     
    Disinformation from the counterrevolutionary Solzhenitsyn. How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish? If the criminals were starving, would they have taken the time to dish out the relish?

    Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics. Starvation exists only under condition of capitalism where monopoly capitalists deprive the working class of the wealth that they have created.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @MEH 0910, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Reg Cæsar

  39. @Hangnail Hans
    @JimDandy

    Well, true enough -- except that an even more common syndrome in the hood is not having any idea who your dad actually is. And your dad definitely doesn't know who his kids are. It takes a village, so the parents can pretty much skip out on the whole thing.

    Steve:


    Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.
     
    Not weird at all, once you accept the fact (well known to TD, Corvy, and 150 million wokesters) that crime isn't the problem, but white attitudes toward crime.

    Yeah, I said 150 million. Their army is growing.

    Replies: @JimDandy

    150 million, you say? I have no idea what the number is, but the Goodwhites problem is HUGE. Their response to the growing problem of black crime in America is usually an exercise in DoubleThink and Doublespeak: Growing black crime is a myth, and also it is happening because of old institutional racist policies such as redlining and police brutality and Jim Crow. The result is a black population that feels (correctly) untouchable. In the past few days there were several mob attacks on police in Chicago. And scenes like this one are becoming the norm:

    cwbchicago.com

    Hundreds of Chicago police officers were in the area to handle the large crowds and seemingly inevitable violence that descends on the area around Boystown after recent Pride Parades.

    Cops immediately radioed that shots had been fired and a vehicle, described as a “Dodge Ram pickup” and, alternatively, a “black truck,” was leaving the scene, according to a CPD report.

    Two or three minutes later, officers saw a black Dodge Ram pickup truck heading north on Broadway near Roscoe Street. They pulled it over.

    As officers removed three men from the four-door truck, bystanders swooped in to record the incident on their phones.

    “Let them go! Kim Foxx says let them go! Lawsuit! Lawsuit!” a man yelled in a video that has since been removed from the Citizen app. “Yeah, you mother f*cking clowns … I want a badge number from each and every one of you all.”

    “Another stupid mother f*cking clown … Incompetent! Incompetent! Let ’em go,” he continued. “Kim Foxx says let them go. Kim Foxx, Kim Foxx says let them go! Let them go!”

    Unbeknownst to the bystanders, police saw an ammunition magazine lying on the truck’s front passenger floorboard and a handgun in the rear passenger area, according to a CPD report that documented the stop.

    Police records indicate that officers sought charges for aggravated battery by discharging a firearm against at least one of the truck’s occupants. But, two days after the men were arrested, they were all released, according to police records.

    The heckler was correct. Kim Foxx declined to press charges against any of them.

    • Replies: @Curle
    @JimDandy

    “ Growing black crime is a myth, and also it is happening because of old institutional racist policies such as redlining and police brutality and Jim Crow.”

    Redlining doesn’t cause crime, crime causes redlining. Racism doesn’t cause crime, crime creates protective responses characterized as racism. Police brutality doesn’t cause crime, it is an mostly unavoidable side effect of suppressing crime. I hope all that is clear now?

    History:

    In the years immediately preceding Revolution British courts render decision allowing certain escaped slaves freedom. Alarmed southern colonists see writing on the wall and reverse long held resistance to separation from Britain. Northern colonies agitating against Britain ally with South to separate. At no point in time is the protection of slavery, the inevitable result of this war, an barrier to northern ambitions. The war is prosecuted by both North and South with full knowledge it will extend the life of the institution of slavery.

    Post Revolution British allow their Black allies (Blacks fought for King George) to migrate to Britain. In very short order their Black allies had dramatically increased crime and had become charity dependents incentivizing the British to create Sierra Leone and populate it (involuntarily for the blacks) with their erstwhile former allies the former Black American slaves. Lesson learned.

    Pre Civil War Northern cities become wracked with crime as a consequence of slaves freed in the South migrating North. The result is an increased concern that Southern business practices are leading to the presence of an criminal population in the North. Legislative hearings are held and state commissions assembled to address the social problem of migrating former slaves now criminals residing in northern cities. Northern Black codes are adopted putting restrictions on the freedoms enjoyed by Blacks. All for the purpose of lowering crime and increased charitable dependency caused by former slaves migrating North. Hostility to Blacks in the North leads to hostility to slave dependent businesses and opposition to growth of slavery in new states.

    The cotton gin and increase in the size of the southern slave economy alarms already concerned northerners. Agitation against slavery continues to rise.

    Amendment to constitution is proposed by Congress to make slavery protected in states permitting it. Several northern states adopt to keep slaves in the South, to avoid war and to halt further growth of slavery in new states. Lincoln does not oppose.

    Civil War.

    During reconstruction slaves are bottled up in the South by the Union army to keep them from migrating North to protect North from the now well known scourge of Black crime. One-quarter of former slave population perishes from starvation and disease unable to escape to the North and to food, charity and criminal opportunities. Northerners do nothing to save the now starving former slaves.

    Black criminality has been a constant since the American Revolution and in every setting where Blacks were not restrained by Black codes or the institution of slavery. It isn’t caused by racism.

    Replies: @JimDandy

  40. @Buzz Mohawk
    @International Jew

    Indeed this is yet another case of logical error and simplemindedness about variables. Correlation does not mean causation, that sort of thing. Another one is the idea being bandied about, here sometimes and by Tucker Carlson last night, that SSRIs might be causing mass shootings.

    Even Tucker last night poo-pooed the idea of correlation not meaning causation, as if that very correct concept just didn't matter.

    SSRIs are prescribed to people with problems, and the people doing White-style mass shootings have problems, therefore those people are more likely than the people outside the sample to be taking SSRIs. Whatever the cause of the shooting might be, it is something about the shooter that led to both the shooting and the prescription. (I don't necessarily think I am right about this, but the logic is there, and denying it doesn't help.)

    Of course in the case of this Black! crime thing, the authors of the paper Steve is writing about are probably just doing verbal contortions to conform to present-day requirements that all Blacks! are all good at all times and cannot be the cause of anything bad themselves.

    Replies: @JimDandy, @SunBakedSuburb

    It’s good that people are talking about SSRIs, but I think there is a correlation between the new breed of fearless black criminals–the 13 year old carjackers and muggers, etc.–and drugs. I don’t think they are much different from the child soldiers of Liberia/Sierra Leone. They aren’t taking cane juice and gunpowder, but incredibly powerful marijuana, heroin, coke, etc.

  41. @Ghost of Bull Moose
    @Pixo


    "increasingly dynamic household."
     
    This sort of obscurant writing always reminds me of the famous passage from Solzhenitsyn in which Nature magazine reports the discovery of a frozen underground river containing prehistoric fish "preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot."

    Replies: @Jack D

    “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”

    Disinformation from the counterrevolutionary Solzhenitsyn. How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish? If the criminals were starving, would they have taken the time to dish out the relish?

    Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics. Starvation exists only under condition of capitalism where monopoly capitalists deprive the working class of the wealth that they have created.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @Jack D

    Thanks and LOL are due, due to the relish joke. (Yes, I'd thought of that too, cause I don't relish relish.)

    , @MEH 0910
    @Jack D

    https://rusandsov.com/products/relish-1940-soviet-advertising-poster
    https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0489/6971/1782/files/Relish_Soviet_Poster_480x480.png


    Relish (Russian: Релиш) is a 1940 Soviet advertising poster. Its full text reads, "Relish sweet and sour. Vegetable seasoning for meat and fish dishes" (Russian: «Релиш сладкий и кислый - овощная приправа к мясным и рыбным блюдам»).

    The top of the poster shows it is from the People's Commissariat for Food Industry of the USSR. Glavkonserv (Russian: Наркомпищепром СССР. Главконсерв).
     

    Replies: @Jack D

    , @The Germ Theory of Disease
    @Jack D

    Gotta hand it to ya: that one was very funny. Good job!

    , @Reg Cæsar
    @Jack D


    How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish?

    ...Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics.
     

    "Reliable [Southern] sources such as [Capt Wirz] proved that there was no starvation in the [POW camps]."

    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-rrJRzMwHKAE/WZo3IpdLcKI/AAAAAAAAUz4/E0xhljy8jJ08nVQRueDjTS9Ruv9UwIYAQCLcBGAs/s1600/wirz2.jpg

    https://www.legendsofamerica.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/CaptainHenry-Wirz.jpg


    https://allthatsinteresting.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/emaciated-prisoners.jpg

  42. For some moms isn’t “the same kind of boyfriend” pretty much the only kind available to them? It isn’t like any of these baby mommas are going to have neurosurgeons courting them.

  43. @Pixo
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Baby-daddys usually use their own mother’s address. However, if they have no income, there’s no harm of losing welfare for their baby-mama by officially moving in, and she’ll get more in food stamps, but his mother will get less.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    However, if they have no income, there’s no harm of losing welfare for their baby-mama by officially moving in…

    I have not much experience in that world (only one GF from years ago took part in some of this stuff), but I don’t get that, Pixo. Single Moms get the breaks. Men and intact families in general don’t get so many breaks. (That’s other than those men on fake disability.)

    … she’ll get more in food stamps, but his mother will get less.

    How’s that? I’m talking about an ADULT father.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @Achmed E. Newman

    I have not much experience in that world (only one GF from years ago took part in some of this stuff), but I don’t get that, Pixo. Single Moms get the breaks. Men and intact families in general don’t get so many breaks. (That’s other than those men on fake disability.)

    He is talking about the situation where the dad is a deadbeat and lives with the mom but she lists the father as unknown to get more benefits.
    It's been going on for a long time.

    They rack up multiple baby daddies and try to get cash from them while telling the state they don't know who knocked them up. Gosh I'm just a slut that keeps getting knocked up by random men I don't know. This is actually perfectly acceptable.


    Or the dad is there the whole time and in on it. He hustles or just hangs around and the mom claims she is alone. Then they share the welfare benefits.

    There are a few more advanced scams that I don't want to talk about since I don't want to spread them.

    I had a relative that was a social worker for a period and it was unreal as to how much the state tries to help these worthless women. They pay college educated White women to serve these slobs like slaves. There are so many social science graduates that these low paying state jobs are actually highly competitive. We are actually paying White women to load up on debt and White guilt so they can serve some idiot slut with 5 baby daddies.

    Replies: @J.Ross

  44. @PhysicistDave
    @Altai

    Altai wrote:


    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.
     
    Oh, I'd say it's what we have seen since 1960 (or more accurately, the mid-'60s; also, different parts of the country and different ethnic groups took the hit at different times)!

    I'm a few years older than Sailer, old enough to actually remember the transformation of the '60s.

    It was quite a sight to behold: in 1960, girls wore dresses and knew they had to say "No!" to boys; girls took home-ec and boys took shop; Black folks "knew their place'; and gays just kept their mouths shut.

    By 1975, it was a whole new world.

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    But along with the conformity to social roles and statuses in 1960, there was also conformity to laws and to minimal standards of human decency: you heard a lot more about the "Golden Rule" back then than you do today, and I can still recite the Boy Scout law ("A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful..."), which sounds awfully quaint today.

    People who think the '60s were mainly about rock-and-roll miss the point.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @Anonymous, @Altai, @Mike Tre, @Mr. Anon

    I am not claiming the change was all for the worse: the way Blacks and gays were treated in 1960 was pretty deplorable, and sex roles were unnecessarily rigid.

    Yes, the cops should have left homosexual hangouts alone, and never raided Stonewall. Although one wonders why they bothered to raid such places. Maybe it was because there were underaged people there? Or maybe it was because they were behind on their protection money to this or that gang (including the blue gang).

    Regardless, given that the whole trans/what’s-your-pronoun/shoving-deviant-sexuality-in-your-face-24/7 movement is part of a seamless arc that began on June 28th, 1969 (the same date as the assassination of Franz Ferdinand – hey, WWI and WWG started on the same date!), it’s worth contemplating the idea that perhaps closets exist for a reason.

  45. @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose


    “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”
     
    Disinformation from the counterrevolutionary Solzhenitsyn. How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish? If the criminals were starving, would they have taken the time to dish out the relish?

    Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics. Starvation exists only under condition of capitalism where monopoly capitalists deprive the working class of the wealth that they have created.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @MEH 0910, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Reg Cæsar

    Thanks and LOL are due, due to the relish joke. (Yes, I’d thought of that too, cause I don’t relish relish.)

  46. @Altai
    There was a pilot programme in the North East of Britain, I'm not sure if they shut it down, during the 2000s where the police would just take DNA samples from any man who aroused their attention for any minor crime.

    The idea was maybe Jim wasn't a serious criminal but he might have close male relatives who were. Once you have your identified DNA from a crime scene you can match it to your database and knowing this sample was a first cousin with a common grandfather you've narrowed down the list of possibilities hugely.

    Male criminality is closely linked to ASPD or Anti-Social Personality Disorder as a psychological diagnosis. Given the symptoms it's actually one of the best diagnosed and studied and most likely to represent something innate and real.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder

    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.

    Replies: @Altai, @Curle, @AnotherDad, @Feryl

    Thanks for this. I’d followed the British ASBO phenom. in the past with some curiosity but never came across this detail.

  47. “Intergenerational exposure to the justice system is both a marker of vulnerability among children and a measurement of the potential unintended externalities of crime policy in the U.S.”

    Legitimate social science research is dead. The above statement betrays a complete ignorance of, or hostility to causal thinking.

    Similar problems have destroyed educational research. You cannot speak of “I.Q.” in a positive sense. Researchers typically either ignore I.Q. or “g,” or deny its existence (e.g., the Thernstroms), or simply lie, and assert that IQ research has been “debunked.”

    As a result of such anti-thinking, the ruling elites have pickpocketed Whites of tens of trillions of dollars since circa 1965.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @Nicholas Stix

    "Legitimate social science research is dead."

    Hasn't it always been the domain of stupidly altruistic whites with a blax fetish and right-of-center whites funded by genocidal white billionaires interested in determining which demographic should go first to give Mother Earth a break?

    Replies: @Nicholas Stix

  48. Anon[173] • Disclaimer says:

    “White… and Asian children have high but relatively lower rates of intergenerational exposure to criminal charges at 32% and 17% respectively.”

    32% for whites? The paragraph above states misdemeanors count along with felonies, and a misdemeanor can mean a speeding ticket. 32% is way too high a number for white kids with relatives who have been charged with a felony. That’s nonsense. There’s no way 32% of white kids grow up with a serious criminal in the household. You don’t even go to jail for a misdemeanor.

  49. Targeting “Exposure to the Justice System” is one of those classic “Wet Streets Cause Rain” reversals — A willful case of dyslexic logic. Much like decarceration will cut crime, or handing out free money will ease inflation.

    Oh BTW an aide to Mayor Adams was threatened and robbed in Brooklyn while out looking to arrange a photo op.

    • Agree: Achmed E. Newman
  50. anon[216] • Disclaimer says:

    Technically, “intergenerational exposure to the criminal justice system” does weigh in on nature vs nurture: it is, of course, that specific form of the nurture argument that lays all blame on traditional White institutions (and here, does so teleologically).

    But the real aim is the use of jargon to obfuscate thought: very Orwellian and, as even Steve finds it confusing, very effective.

    That’s the New Dark Age for you: social scientists with multimillion point databases but no ability to draw the correct conclusions. It’s a lot like Big Pharma: keep the diligent little scientists busy designing and conducting trials, then only submit the ‘good’ results. Big Lie at work.

  51. @Altai
    @PhysicistDave

    What you're describing is also noted famously in 'The Fourth Turning', that society goes through generational cycles where people and society adapt to greater or lesser impetuses for social conformity and cohesion. Usually due to a crisis that develops entirely due to a lack of society coming together to defend it's common interests or health.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory

    What has gone wrong in the West is that the last 'unraveling' has been so total that nice middle class white women with genetically normal and altruistic psychologies are doing what their grandparents did but instead of adopting a pro-social mantra they are spreading an anti-social mantra that is decided by the convoluted logic of the time as actually pro-social. In essence instead of trying to enforce social conformity to dampen down the unraveling they are promoting social conformity against anti-unraveling forces.

    This is what cancel culture is.

    Replies: @Ian Smith

    The generational theory always seemed like one of those unfalsifiable things where you can find any traits you want per generation. I mean, Timothy Leary and Ronald Reagan were both in the Greatest Generation. Oliver North and John Holmes were both born in 1943. And the idea that it’s some kind of repeating cycle seems especially dubious to me.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @Ian Smith

    Absolutely, Ian! I read both Generations and The Fourth Turning (Strauss & Howe).

    1) All that cycle theory is based on a British-descended population. The authors stated this early on. If you recall, the examples of the highs, awakenings, unravellings and crises and the turnings between them, started way back in England with the Glorious Revolution and earlier. How in hell does this apply to modern America, per the theory? But yes, we ARE entering a crisis, so that's dumb luck.

    2) You can pull out 1,000 examples from TV, movies, newspapers, music, political statements, whatever to back up any thing you want to about "this generation was like this."

    Replies: @J.Ross

  52. @YetAnotherAnon
    OT, but World War T(hree?) has its very own transgender journalist covering the Ukraine conflict - one Sarah Ashton-Cirillo, apparently from Las Vegas.

    "One of the gender affirming healthcare options for transgender women is FFS: Facial Feminization Surgery. The procedure cosmetically provides a more feminine appearance for those whose male puberty has defined their features as unmistakably male. "
     
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/dawnstaceyennis/2022/06/29/what-is-this-transgender-journalist-doing-in-ukraine-covering-a-war/

    Xhe's certainly got some interesting stories.

    https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/06/war-crimes-lgbtq-people-ukraine-worse-people-can-imagine/

    "Russian forces are hunting down gay men, raping and castrating them."

    But I'm not sure this tweet is terribly on-message:

    Some Ukrainian units are out of body bags and there is a shortage available to replenish them.

    Ukraine has already won but the cost is high.
     
    https://twitter.com/SarahAshtonLV/status/1544325881723772928

    Replies: @Verymuchalive, @AndrewR

    Lmaoooo idk how these people define “winning” other than “Russians haven’t occupied Lviv yet”

    • Replies: @sayless
    @AndrewR

    Yes. I think the Washington Post dismissed what the Russians have done so far as only "incremental" gains.

  53. @JimDandy
    I call it the Louis Till syndrome.

    Replies: @Hangnail Hans, @SunBakedSuburb

    “I call it the Louis Till syndrome.”

    Father n’ Son act? Was Louis buried in Italy after the rape or did the U.S. Army ship his body back to the U.S.?

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @SunBakedSuburb

    Buried in Naples. And then shipped to France for some reason.

    This NPR headline has always pissed me off. Murder is murder, but why not stick to the facts?

    "Emmett Till's Father Was Also Hanged: A New Book Tells His Story"

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @sayless

    , @jallynn
    @SunBakedSuburb

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oise-Aisne_American_Cemetery_Plot_E

  54. @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose


    “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”
     
    Disinformation from the counterrevolutionary Solzhenitsyn. How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish? If the criminals were starving, would they have taken the time to dish out the relish?

    Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics. Starvation exists only under condition of capitalism where monopoly capitalists deprive the working class of the wealth that they have created.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @MEH 0910, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Reg Cæsar

    https://rusandsov.com/products/relish-1940-soviet-advertising-poster

    Relish (Russian: Релиш) is a 1940 Soviet advertising poster. Its full text reads, “Relish sweet and sour. Vegetable seasoning for meat and fish dishes” (Russian: «Релиш сладкий и кислый – овощная приправа к мясным и рыбным блюдам»).

    The top of the poster shows it is from the People’s Commissariat for Food Industry of the USSR. Glavkonserv (Russian: Наркомпищепром СССР. Главконсерв).

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @MEH 0910

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    The objective was to project a narrative of abundance.

    The Soviet ads’ primary purpose was not to market the products and encourage people to buy them, but rather to create an idealistic view of society and the country. The TV and print ads were supposed to inform consumers that the advertised products existed somewhere, even though the shelves in their local stores were empty.

    Here is the most cynical ad imaginable:

    https://miro.medium.com/max/680/0*GfJxVWpn9FClUukh

    The caption says "Force yourself to eat black caviar!"

    Caviar was the ultimate luxury good in Russia - it was only available to Party members with connections. You were supposed to imagine that somewhere in Russia, people were sick of eating caviar like prisoners in Maine who used to beg not to be fed any more lobsters.

    Replies: @John Johnson, @MEH 0910

  55. @Achmed E. Newman
    @PhysicistDave

    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it's speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There's the "cool" factor. It's never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days. Always, the defending of conservative social mores of yesteryear, or even the present, have been, and are, disparaged.

    That has gone on for over 1/2 a century now, so I would not discount it, even though it's not anything but a psychological factor. If it's not "hip to be square", then gullible and under-confident young people will go the other way.

    Of course, I do know that Huey Lewis and the News song. Was that a slight lull during the early/mid 1980s? I think they were just making a joke with the title and lyrics. "Square" has not been "OK" with the majority of young people since I've been alive.

    Replies: @AndrewR, @Curle, @PhysicistDave

    There is increasing popularity among younger people, if not from the top-down shapers of culture and law, to embrace traditional values like not being a shameless whore.

    I was born in 1984 so the messages I got growing up were pretty much the same as the messages that people born in 1964 or even 1954 got growing up (albeit probably even more degenerate)

    But the teenagers today have grown up in a very different society than I did. We didn’t have OnlyFans, tranny mania, or wokeism in general. But these things have created a backlash even among many young people.

    Basically we are creating two parallel cultures and it seems likely the polarization we are experiencing makes the polarization of the late 1960s look tame in comparison (speaking as someone born after that)

    • Agree: Curle
  56. @Buzz Mohawk
    @International Jew

    Indeed this is yet another case of logical error and simplemindedness about variables. Correlation does not mean causation, that sort of thing. Another one is the idea being bandied about, here sometimes and by Tucker Carlson last night, that SSRIs might be causing mass shootings.

    Even Tucker last night poo-pooed the idea of correlation not meaning causation, as if that very correct concept just didn't matter.

    SSRIs are prescribed to people with problems, and the people doing White-style mass shootings have problems, therefore those people are more likely than the people outside the sample to be taking SSRIs. Whatever the cause of the shooting might be, it is something about the shooter that led to both the shooting and the prescription. (I don't necessarily think I am right about this, but the logic is there, and denying it doesn't help.)

    Of course in the case of this Black! crime thing, the authors of the paper Steve is writing about are probably just doing verbal contortions to conform to present-day requirements that all Blacks! are all good at all times and cannot be the cause of anything bad themselves.

    Replies: @JimDandy, @SunBakedSuburb

    “SSRIs might be causing mass shootings”

    SSRIs are certainly an element. This is where the malignant practice of psychiatry enters the picture. The drugs are used to zombify kids, particularly young white males. They become susceptible to messaging produced by the culture, or that which purposefully emanates from sinister actors with an agenda. An enterprising criminologist might want to do a comparison study between the serial killer phenomenon of the 60s and 70s and the mass shooter events that picked up steam in the late 1990s. The criminologist might want to contrast synthetic and organic factors that may determine causality.

  57. The apple never falls very far from the tree.

  58. @Almost Missouri

    Weirdly, the authors have to write as if it’s mostly the criminal justice system itself that is causing the kids’ problems rather than mostly the nature and/or nurture they share with their jailbird relatives.
     
    I think you mean "as is now standard on pain of excommunication". Though it is kind of weird that the declaration of such obvious reversal of cause and effect is now mandatory. Almost as if some powerful malevolent force were at work.


    9% of children born between 1999–2005 were intergenerationally exposed to prison, 18% to a felony conviction,
     

     
    Does this mean that only half of felony convicts go to prison? This seems like an awfully low imprisonment rate of known felons for the supposedly "incarceration nation".

    Or does this mean that only half visit their felony convict relative in prison? But how would the authors know that from census data?

    Or maybe when the father/mother's-boyfriend is arrested, his residence with the child ends, so there is no longer "exposure"? But then that is a flaw in how the authors are reading the data, since all incarceration should end exposure unless the child is incarcerated with the adult, which never happens that I know of.

    Replies: @AndrewR

    The US is a very strange culture. I’m sure a lot of people are in prison that shouldn’t be, and I’m sure that prison messes up the mental health and the life prospects of most/all prisoners, but clearly we have huge numbers of people, predominantly black and male, who pose an obvious danger to the public and should not be allowed freedom. I don’t see any sustainable solution besides repatriation.

  59. @Nicholas Stix

    “Intergenerational exposure to the justice system is both a marker of vulnerability among children and a measurement of the potential unintended externalities of crime policy in the U.S.”
     
    Legitimate social science research is dead. The above statement betrays a complete ignorance of, or hostility to causal thinking.

    Similar problems have destroyed educational research. You cannot speak of “I.Q.” in a positive sense. Researchers typically either ignore I.Q. or “g,” or deny its existence (e.g., the Thernstroms), or simply lie, and assert that IQ research has been “debunked.”

    As a result of such anti-thinking, the ruling elites have pickpocketed Whites of tens of trillions of dollars since circa 1965.

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb

    “Legitimate social science research is dead.”

    Hasn’t it always been the domain of stupidly altruistic whites with a blax fetish and right-of-center whites funded by genocidal white billionaires interested in determining which demographic should go first to give Mother Earth a break?

    • Replies: @Nicholas Stix
    @SunBakedSuburb

    I read your comment almost immediately, but I don't have an answer for you. In any event, it's a very interesting take.

  60. woke researchers turn high quality, year 2020, internet accumulated, computer stored database datasets on 100 million first world citizens, into useless output.

    DIGO. data in, garbage out.

    in contrast to GIGO, DIGO is deliberate crapification of the numbers so that the results are worthless.

    the human version of dumbing down AIs so that they don’t notice patterns.

    • Agree: Kratoklastes
  61. The shocking thing about this big havily-funded research paper is that there is no hint anywhere in it that children might inherit any behavioral tendencies at all from their birth parents. The words “heritable”, “genetic” and “DNA” never appear. The authors live in a fantasy world of blank-slateism.

    • Agree: Random Anonymous
  62. This effect of family members who are criminals is well known to law enforcement.

    In the past (can’t say about now) law enforcement organizations were careful to investigate family members and check criminal/arrest records for new hire applicants to determine if they had any such exposure.

    In NYC for instance, having any Mafia family members generally barred you from joining the NYPD.

    I recall being surprised that when I applied to join a Big 8 accounting firm after college graduation, they hired private investigators to interview neighbors of my parents. I found this out from my parents. I was surprised since that hadn’t been mentioned by anyone in hiring process.

    I had no criminal record or relatives with such. Also my parents moved nearly 2,000 miles from where I had been raised during college and no one in the new location had ever known me, no school ties, etc.

    With the Woke mania (now) and AA for a few decades, this “linking” to family might now be fudged some. Too many blacks have criminal family members to be “fair.” Having a family member who is in law enforcement (or was) or successful military career tends to count as a positive.

    No telling how corrupt this process is now. Having gang affiliated police recruits/members is a major problem in places like LA, Chicago or other large “diverse” cities which are forced to hire otherwise not qualified non Whites.

    In the old days you had to overcome “the sins of the fathers” and cousins, etc.

  63. Roger says: • Website

    So which is better — having a criminal father in the home, or a criminal father in prison?

    If the genes are the problem, it might not make much difference. If the direct criminal influence in the home is the problem, then it would be worse to have the criminal dad living with the child. Or maybe the presence of the dad is a positive influence, even if he is a criminal.

  64. What about schools’ male coaches and male teachers strongly serving as solid role models? I tread carefully with this, because a while back I suggested that lower-grades teachers would make great wives; commenters corrected me: That was back in your day, SafeNow, this has changed; I acknowledged being wrong. So maybe I am similarly wrong about the solid-role-model idea.

  65. Or, the Eugenics Movement Was Right.

  66. Why didn’t they add in criminal siblings?

    Where are all the criminal Asians? Do they have a wildly disproportionate share of Asian children?

    • Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease
    @Ralph L

    "Where are all the criminal Asians?"

    Why, at UC Berkeley, Irvine, UCLA, Harvard, Goldman Sachs, USG.....

  67. Of if dad’s a bad man

    It passed spell check, but not smell check.

    BTW, Steve, is there any chance of you persuading Ron and Taki to set their text colors to #000, true black?  This stuff like #222222 just makes things harder to read.

  68. @Achmed E. Newman
    @Pixo


    However, if they have no income, there’s no harm of losing welfare for their baby-mama by officially moving in...
     
    I have not much experience in that world (only one GF from years ago took part in some of this stuff), but I don't get that, Pixo. Single Moms get the breaks. Men and intact families in general don't get so many breaks. (That's other than those men on fake disability.)

    ... she’ll get more in food stamps, but his mother will get less.
     
    How's that? I'm talking about an ADULT father.

    Replies: @John Johnson

    I have not much experience in that world (only one GF from years ago took part in some of this stuff), but I don’t get that, Pixo. Single Moms get the breaks. Men and intact families in general don’t get so many breaks. (That’s other than those men on fake disability.)

    He is talking about the situation where the dad is a deadbeat and lives with the mom but she lists the father as unknown to get more benefits.
    It’s been going on for a long time.

    They rack up multiple baby daddies and try to get cash from them while telling the state they don’t know who knocked them up. Gosh I’m just a slut that keeps getting knocked up by random men I don’t know. This is actually perfectly acceptable.

    Or the dad is there the whole time and in on it. He hustles or just hangs around and the mom claims she is alone. Then they share the welfare benefits.

    There are a few more advanced scams that I don’t want to talk about since I don’t want to spread them.

    I had a relative that was a social worker for a period and it was unreal as to how much the state tries to help these worthless women. They pay college educated White women to serve these slobs like slaves. There are so many social science graduates that these low paying state jobs are actually highly competitive. We are actually paying White women to load up on debt and White guilt so they can serve some idiot slut with 5 baby daddies.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    @John Johnson

    And there are knock-on effects. Generally the reason a battered ghettopotamus refuses to press charges is not fear, it's because her abuser is a crucial source of income. In her ideal solution, the police would put the fear of God[ess] into Stradivarious, then immediately return him to her Section Eight lair.

    Replies: @John Johnson

  69. anon[390] • Disclaimer says:

    Here’s a new Raj Chetty-style study where the researchers get their hands on a near-universe of anonymized government data so they don’t have to use much in the way of sampling

    This is important. Statistics is hard, and most of it disappears when you have enough data. Gets rid of P hacking, NHST, etc.

    Credit scores would be a nice addition. A good proxy for race.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    @anon

    The scale of the data should allow all sorts of fine detailed analyses impossible to do with previous state of the art tracking studies like National Longitudinal Study of Youth with sample sizes of 12,000: e.g., let's test Raj Chetty's theory that black mothers of sons in the inner cities should move to cheap white exurbs -- ok, that's only a tiny percentage of the database, but the new database is so huge that here's 77,000 families matching those criteria -- let's see how their boys turned out.

    Heck, we could probably find 10,000 cases of where one black sister and her sons moved to the exurbs and the other and her sons stayed in the 'hood.

    Bill James does studies of matched baseball players: e.g., find pairs of players who had the most similar rookie years except one was righthanded and the other lefthanded and then see who had a better career.

    We could do that kind of matching here, although that might be getting into privacy issues.

  70. @Altai
    @Altai

    If we accept that we notice in real life that men and women with these traits are more attracted to and associate with each other more, then we can have a stable subpopulation in certain places where such density of these types pushes out anyone who can't stand them, thus 'ghettos', 'sink estates' or 'no-go zones'.

    This paper on the sociobiology of sociopathy got condemned had a few counter papers (Without an argument beyond it can’t be true because of the implication) and has largely been memory-holed except that it was probably the last serious paper of it’s type in a serious journal that I’m aware of.

    The link is to a whole journal edition, the paper in question is on page 121.

    https://sci-hub.hkvisa.net/10.1017/s0140525x00039595

    A paper like this goes a long way to explaining the dynamic of inner city honor cultures.

    The implications of this are that fundamentally IQ is looked at too much in terms of societies, the aggregate temperament or personality that dictates what social or cultural mores are sustainable is quite crucial as is that of the places societies are getting their immigrants. (As well as how clannish and how many generations they’ll have an ‘immigrant’ chip on their shoulder or identity)

    Do the two go together perfectly? No, there are big social and cultural changes that are really just due to certain wars or events going a certain way. But surely the mores of a society must have an impact on the reproductive fitness of different personality and temperament types and how well they adapt to the ruling macro situation.

    What we’ve seen in parts of the US since 2020 are certain types of people feeling free of the ‘oppression’ of having to live up to nice North West European guilt culture standards.

    Indeed it seems to me that immigrants will largely disproportionately have people on this spectrum as everyone in the world has noticed throughout history.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave, @AnotherDad

    The implications of this are that fundamentally IQ is looked at too much in terms of societies, the aggregate temperament or personality that dictates what social or cultural mores are sustainable is quite crucial as is that of the places societies are getting their immigrants. (As well as how clannish and how many generations they’ll have an ‘immigrant’ chip on their shoulder or identity)

    Terrific paragraph, Altai.

    IQ is required, but it is the level of trust and cooperation that was bred into Western Christian peoples over that last thousand or so years–of “marry the girl next door” and “i’ll help with your harvest, you help with mine”–that have made those societies particularly pleasant.

  71. @Altai
    There was a pilot programme in the North East of Britain, I'm not sure if they shut it down, during the 2000s where the police would just take DNA samples from any man who aroused their attention for any minor crime.

    The idea was maybe Jim wasn't a serious criminal but he might have close male relatives who were. Once you have your identified DNA from a crime scene you can match it to your database and knowing this sample was a first cousin with a common grandfather you've narrowed down the list of possibilities hugely.

    Male criminality is closely linked to ASPD or Anti-Social Personality Disorder as a psychological diagnosis. Given the symptoms it's actually one of the best diagnosed and studied and most likely to represent something innate and real.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder

    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.

    Replies: @Altai, @Curle, @AnotherDad, @Feryl

    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.

    Great paragraph Altai. A parasite game-theory solution is exactly what the criminal personality type is.

    Minoritarianism is essentially an ideologic justification of parasitism–not just criminal but all of it. Basically “you normies don’t get to say how you want to live; you exist to be looted; grab your ankles!”. And unfortunately … it has triumphed and is the reigning ideology today.

  72. As far as I can determine, I’ve known only two people who’ve been to prison. There was a much older cousin who was a compulsive shoplifter, and after many arrests and stints on probation she finally ended up serving about a year in prison. The other was a friend of my father’s, who engaged in check kiting in a desperate attempt to save his business from failure. I don’t remember how long he served, maybe a couple years.

  73. @Barnard
    @Achmed E. Newman


    BTW, this study just makes me feel that much better about having never told the Census Bureau anything more than “n many people live here.” Yeah, this is all de-identified, but when a certain desk in the FBI want names from them, they’ll get names.
     
    There are half a dozen other ways for them to get the names of the people living in your residence than the Census bureau. This isn't going to stop them.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    This post was about the Census Bureau data, Barnard, but you’re right. I got it covered the best I can. Unless I see a reason some org needs a piece of info. on me, they don’t get it.

  74. The short version: America needs better people.

    We should be expelling–or sterilizing–criminals so they can not reproduce their parasitism, and have very generous tax breaks for productive earners having children so they can concentrate their resources on that and are incentivized to create more productive people if they are so inclinded.

    Even shorter: America–any society that wants to survive and prosper–needs eugenic fertility.

  75. @Ian Smith
    @Altai

    The generational theory always seemed like one of those unfalsifiable things where you can find any traits you want per generation. I mean, Timothy Leary and Ronald Reagan were both in the Greatest Generation. Oliver North and John Holmes were both born in 1943. And the idea that it’s some kind of repeating cycle seems especially dubious to me.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    Absolutely, Ian! I read both Generations and The Fourth Turning (Strauss & Howe).

    1) All that cycle theory is based on a British-descended population. The authors stated this early on. If you recall, the examples of the highs, awakenings, unravellings and crises and the turnings between them, started way back in England with the Glorious Revolution and earlier. How in hell does this apply to modern America, per the theory? But yes, we ARE entering a crisis, so that’s dumb luck.

    2) You can pull out 1,000 examples from TV, movies, newspapers, music, political statements, whatever to back up any thing you want to about “this generation was like this.”

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Strong agree point two -- not only is their evidence anecdotal and asserted, a lot of their proofs are motifs from popular movies. It did leap out at me though that uniquely for Gen X, movies pursued the EVIL DEMON CHILD WITH RED GLOWING EYES thing, and then as soon as the line is crossed Millennials get cinematic angel babies. Gen X was born under every bad sign (it's right there in the name) but it's starting to look deserved since our destiny was to repair the damage caused by Silent and Boomer scum and thus far our response has been, "whatever."

  76. @John Johnson
    @Achmed E. Newman

    I have not much experience in that world (only one GF from years ago took part in some of this stuff), but I don’t get that, Pixo. Single Moms get the breaks. Men and intact families in general don’t get so many breaks. (That’s other than those men on fake disability.)

    He is talking about the situation where the dad is a deadbeat and lives with the mom but she lists the father as unknown to get more benefits.
    It's been going on for a long time.

    They rack up multiple baby daddies and try to get cash from them while telling the state they don't know who knocked them up. Gosh I'm just a slut that keeps getting knocked up by random men I don't know. This is actually perfectly acceptable.


    Or the dad is there the whole time and in on it. He hustles or just hangs around and the mom claims she is alone. Then they share the welfare benefits.

    There are a few more advanced scams that I don't want to talk about since I don't want to spread them.

    I had a relative that was a social worker for a period and it was unreal as to how much the state tries to help these worthless women. They pay college educated White women to serve these slobs like slaves. There are so many social science graduates that these low paying state jobs are actually highly competitive. We are actually paying White women to load up on debt and White guilt so they can serve some idiot slut with 5 baby daddies.

    Replies: @J.Ross

    And there are knock-on effects. Generally the reason a battered ghettopotamus refuses to press charges is not fear, it’s because her abuser is a crucial source of income. In her ideal solution, the police would put the fear of God[ess] into Stradivarious, then immediately return him to her Section Eight lair.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @J.Ross

    And there are knock-on effects. Generally the reason a battered ghettopotamus refuses to press charges is not fear, it’s because her abuser is a crucial source of income. In her ideal solution, the police would put the fear of God[ess] into Stradivarious, then immediately return him to her Section Eight lair.

    There is a simple solution but neither party has the guts to enact it much less discuss it.

    DNA test the baby and cross-reference against the state criminal database.

    Someone suggested the idea a while back and the ACLU freaked out as if the Nazis were rising from their graves.

    I guess it is a "civil liberty" for welfare scamming women to not name the father.

  77. @Achmed E. Newman
    @Ian Smith

    Absolutely, Ian! I read both Generations and The Fourth Turning (Strauss & Howe).

    1) All that cycle theory is based on a British-descended population. The authors stated this early on. If you recall, the examples of the highs, awakenings, unravellings and crises and the turnings between them, started way back in England with the Glorious Revolution and earlier. How in hell does this apply to modern America, per the theory? But yes, we ARE entering a crisis, so that's dumb luck.

    2) You can pull out 1,000 examples from TV, movies, newspapers, music, political statements, whatever to back up any thing you want to about "this generation was like this."

    Replies: @J.Ross

    Strong agree point two — not only is their evidence anecdotal and asserted, a lot of their proofs are motifs from popular movies. It did leap out at me though that uniquely for Gen X, movies pursued the EVIL DEMON CHILD WITH RED GLOWING EYES thing, and then as soon as the line is crossed Millennials get cinematic angel babies. Gen X was born under every bad sign (it’s right there in the name) but it’s starting to look deserved since our destiny was to repair the damage caused by Silent and Boomer scum and thus far our response has been, “whatever.”

  78. Is intergenerational a commonly-used term in sociology? I don’t recall having seen it much, but one use rings a bell, in this classic article from Boston magazine:

    “We live in a culture that’s hysterical about children and assumes they have no sexual agency or desire,” says Dan Savage, an author and nationally syndicated sex columnist. “But anyone who can remember what they were like when they were 11 knows that kids are sexual, and whether it was messing around with their cousin, playing doctor with their neighbor, or making passes at people 10 years older, they were horny. So NAMBLA steps out to articulate all this, albeit in its usual highly dysfunctional and creepy way, and because we know what they say to be true on this issue, we’ve got to label them as insane perverts. Any attempt at rational discussion about youth sexuality and intergenerational sex is simply shouted down.”

    https://www.bostonmagazine.com/2006/05/15/boy-crazy/

    Many commenters here claim pederasty– or “pedophilia”– will be the “next big thing”. But others have been saying this for decades, and the opposite happened:

    Gay bookstores are putting up barricades of their own, choosing not to carry the NAMBLA Bulletin for the first time in the organization’s history. At Giovanni’s Room in Philadelphia, the store’s owner, Ed Hermance, says he pulled the NAMBLA Bulletin off the shelves last year after his staff threatened to strike if he didn’t.

    “I think it’s a strange day for gay culture when we start banning something because it makes us uncomfortable,” Hermance says. “Especially when that thing is a foundation of gay literature. If we pulled all the books that had adult-youth sexual themes, we wouldn’t have many novels, memoirs, or biographies left.”

    Besides, little boys don’t have big things. At least not when I showered after gym class years ago. Maybe it’s different today? Corvinus might know.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    @Reg Cæsar

    When late Boomers started having kids in the 80's, they really hammered the living crap out of the worst thing to come out of the sleazy 70's, which was pederasty advocacy. The gay liberators basically treated it as a niche adjunct of gay rights into the early 80's, but since then the pederasts have increasingly been marginalized (Gen X hates pedos even more than late Boomers do). Silent and early Boomers parents to a large degree basically let their kids fend for themselves and in the process failed to recognize just how many perverts "liberated" themselves in the 70's and took advantage of a culture that was lax about protecting kids.

  79. @MEH 0910
    @Jack D

    https://rusandsov.com/products/relish-1940-soviet-advertising-poster
    https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0489/6971/1782/files/Relish_Soviet_Poster_480x480.png


    Relish (Russian: Релиш) is a 1940 Soviet advertising poster. Its full text reads, "Relish sweet and sour. Vegetable seasoning for meat and fish dishes" (Russian: «Релиш сладкий и кислый - овощная приправа к мясным и рыбным блюдам»).

    The top of the poster shows it is from the People's Commissariat for Food Industry of the USSR. Glavkonserv (Russian: Наркомпищепром СССР. Главконсерв).
     

    Replies: @Jack D

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    The objective was to project a narrative of abundance.

    The Soviet ads’ primary purpose was not to market the products and encourage people to buy them, but rather to create an idealistic view of society and the country. The TV and print ads were supposed to inform consumers that the advertised products existed somewhere, even though the shelves in their local stores were empty.

    Here is the most cynical ad imaginable:

    https://miro.medium.com/max/680/0*GfJxVWpn9FClUukh

    The caption says “Force yourself to eat black caviar!”

    Caviar was the ultimate luxury good in Russia – it was only available to Party members with connections. You were supposed to imagine that somewhere in Russia, people were sick of eating caviar like prisoners in Maine who used to beg not to be fed any more lobsters.

    • Thanks: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @John Johnson
    @Jack D

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    Because they would still want to promote one product over another for economic reasons

    For example they might have a surplus of cabbage and would want to promote that over a foreign product.

    By 1940 they had given up on collectivism and had switched to state monopoly capitalism. You can only buy from the state but there is still some basic choice in what you buy.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @Jack D

    , @MEH 0910
    @Jack D

    https://www.rbth.com/russian-kitchen/333856-thursday-fish-day-ussr
    https://twitter.com/dehammo/status/1401638669350576136

    Replies: @Jack D

  80. @anon

    Here’s a new Raj Chetty-style study where the researchers get their hands on a near-universe of anonymized government data so they don’t have to use much in the way of sampling
     
    This is important. Statistics is hard, and most of it disappears when you have enough data. Gets rid of P hacking, NHST, etc.

    Credit scores would be a nice addition. A good proxy for race.

    Replies: @Steve Sailer

    The scale of the data should allow all sorts of fine detailed analyses impossible to do with previous state of the art tracking studies like National Longitudinal Study of Youth with sample sizes of 12,000: e.g., let’s test Raj Chetty’s theory that black mothers of sons in the inner cities should move to cheap white exurbs — ok, that’s only a tiny percentage of the database, but the new database is so huge that here’s 77,000 families matching those criteria — let’s see how their boys turned out.

    Heck, we could probably find 10,000 cases of where one black sister and her sons moved to the exurbs and the other and her sons stayed in the ‘hood.

    Bill James does studies of matched baseball players: e.g., find pairs of players who had the most similar rookie years except one was righthanded and the other lefthanded and then see who had a better career.

    We could do that kind of matching here, although that might be getting into privacy issues.

  81. @SunBakedSuburb
    @JimDandy

    "I call it the Louis Till syndrome."

    Father n' Son act? Was Louis buried in Italy after the rape or did the U.S. Army ship his body back to the U.S.?

    Replies: @JimDandy, @jallynn

    Buried in Naples. And then shipped to France for some reason.

    This NPR headline has always pissed me off. Murder is murder, but why not stick to the facts?

    “Emmett Till’s Father Was Also Hanged: A New Book Tells His Story”

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    @JimDandy

    That's a well-travelled corpse. It would make a great exhibit on an all-black cruise ship, next to the entrance to the ballroom where Emmett performs his Mark Twain show.

    , @sayless
    @JimDandy

    Louis Till murdered the woman he raped.

    Replies: @JimDandy

  82. @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose


    “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”
     
    Disinformation from the counterrevolutionary Solzhenitsyn. How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish? If the criminals were starving, would they have taken the time to dish out the relish?

    Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics. Starvation exists only under condition of capitalism where monopoly capitalists deprive the working class of the wealth that they have created.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @MEH 0910, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Reg Cæsar

    Gotta hand it to ya: that one was very funny. Good job!

  83. @JimDandy
    @SunBakedSuburb

    Buried in Naples. And then shipped to France for some reason.

    This NPR headline has always pissed me off. Murder is murder, but why not stick to the facts?

    "Emmett Till's Father Was Also Hanged: A New Book Tells His Story"

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @sayless

    That’s a well-travelled corpse. It would make a great exhibit on an all-black cruise ship, next to the entrance to the ballroom where Emmett performs his Mark Twain show.

  84. @Achmed E. Newman
    @PhysicistDave

    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it's speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There's the "cool" factor. It's never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days. Always, the defending of conservative social mores of yesteryear, or even the present, have been, and are, disparaged.

    That has gone on for over 1/2 a century now, so I would not discount it, even though it's not anything but a psychological factor. If it's not "hip to be square", then gullible and under-confident young people will go the other way.

    Of course, I do know that Huey Lewis and the News song. Was that a slight lull during the early/mid 1980s? I think they were just making a joke with the title and lyrics. "Square" has not been "OK" with the majority of young people since I've been alive.

    Replies: @AndrewR, @Curle, @PhysicistDave

    In some ways I think the square association with conservatism is mostly an creation of the media and the Left and less a product of youth culture. I attended an conservative campaign training program in the ‘80s and was surprised by the sartorial variety of the people there. Long hair on men in some instances. Nothing like the buzz cut or overly preppy look touted as the uniform by the Left. Nary an bow tie or seersucker in sight.

    Of course, this was an campaign training program as opposed to an seminar so it was directed at the doers and work horses not the navel gazers.

  85. @Ralph L
    Why didn't they add in criminal siblings?

    Where are all the criminal Asians? Do they have a wildly disproportionate share of Asian children?

    Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease

    “Where are all the criminal Asians?”

    Why, at UC Berkeley, Irvine, UCLA, Harvard, Goldman Sachs, USG…..

  86. @Jack D
    @MEH 0910

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    The objective was to project a narrative of abundance.

    The Soviet ads’ primary purpose was not to market the products and encourage people to buy them, but rather to create an idealistic view of society and the country. The TV and print ads were supposed to inform consumers that the advertised products existed somewhere, even though the shelves in their local stores were empty.

    Here is the most cynical ad imaginable:

    https://miro.medium.com/max/680/0*GfJxVWpn9FClUukh

    The caption says "Force yourself to eat black caviar!"

    Caviar was the ultimate luxury good in Russia - it was only available to Party members with connections. You were supposed to imagine that somewhere in Russia, people were sick of eating caviar like prisoners in Maine who used to beg not to be fed any more lobsters.

    Replies: @John Johnson, @MEH 0910

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    Because they would still want to promote one product over another for economic reasons

    For example they might have a surplus of cabbage and would want to promote that over a foreign product.

    By 1940 they had given up on collectivism and had switched to state monopoly capitalism. You can only buy from the state but there is still some basic choice in what you buy.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    @John Johnson

    China under Mao had a lot more selection. One could get Chairman Mao jackets in either blue or gray. Hair styles varied from rice-bowl cut to "we can't afford scissors, Comrade."

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    , @Jack D
    @John Johnson

    This wasn't the reason. Generally speaking the USSR was a shortage economy in consumer goods (and food) - almost EVERYTHING was in short supply except for a few things that nobody really wanted. People did manage to eat and be clothed thru various clever means but a lot of stuff that was advertised (caviar, electronics, cars, etc.) were always difficult to obtain so advertising was not directed at increasing demand. In some cases (tinned fish) they really did want to increase demand because they had problems with the supply of meat (the state dictated price was below the cost of production so collective farms didn't want to produce it but if they tried to raise the price there were literally riots).

    Replies: @Anonymous

  87. @J.Ross
    @John Johnson

    And there are knock-on effects. Generally the reason a battered ghettopotamus refuses to press charges is not fear, it's because her abuser is a crucial source of income. In her ideal solution, the police would put the fear of God[ess] into Stradivarious, then immediately return him to her Section Eight lair.

    Replies: @John Johnson

    And there are knock-on effects. Generally the reason a battered ghettopotamus refuses to press charges is not fear, it’s because her abuser is a crucial source of income. In her ideal solution, the police would put the fear of God[ess] into Stradivarious, then immediately return him to her Section Eight lair.

    There is a simple solution but neither party has the guts to enact it much less discuss it.

    DNA test the baby and cross-reference against the state criminal database.

    Someone suggested the idea a while back and the ACLU freaked out as if the Nazis were rising from their graves.

    I guess it is a “civil liberty” for welfare scamming women to not name the father.

  88. @John Johnson
    @Jack D

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    Because they would still want to promote one product over another for economic reasons

    For example they might have a surplus of cabbage and would want to promote that over a foreign product.

    By 1940 they had given up on collectivism and had switched to state monopoly capitalism. You can only buy from the state but there is still some basic choice in what you buy.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @Jack D

    China under Mao had a lot more selection. One could get Chairman Mao jackets in either blue or gray. Hair styles varied from rice-bowl cut to “we can’t afford scissors, Comrade.”

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar
    @Achmed E. Newman


    China under Mao had a lot more selection.
     
    And affirmative action. Mao preferred racial minorities to Han Chinese, thinking (hardly without good reason) they would make more dedicated revolutionaries. (Come to think of it, our overlords think the same way about our own minorities!)

    Minorities were also exempt from the post-Mao one-child policy. Why is an interesting question. Because they agreed with Mao? Because the minorities were tucked safely away behind the Hu Line? Because it would have fit the international definition of genocide, particularly that of the United Nations, in which their membership was rather new? Or did they just forget about them, being preoccupied elsewhere?

    Anyway, minorities have increased their share of the population from four percent to eight since Mao's day.

    Replies: @Malla

  89. @JimDandy
    @Hangnail Hans

    150 million, you say? I have no idea what the number is, but the Goodwhites problem is HUGE. Their response to the growing problem of black crime in America is usually an exercise in DoubleThink and Doublespeak: Growing black crime is a myth, and also it is happening because of old institutional racist policies such as redlining and police brutality and Jim Crow. The result is a black population that feels (correctly) untouchable. In the past few days there were several mob attacks on police in Chicago. And scenes like this one are becoming the norm:

    cwbchicago.com

    Hundreds of Chicago police officers were in the area to handle the large crowds and seemingly inevitable violence that descends on the area around Boystown after recent Pride Parades.

    Cops immediately radioed that shots had been fired and a vehicle, described as a “Dodge Ram pickup” and, alternatively, a “black truck,” was leaving the scene, according to a CPD report.

    Two or three minutes later, officers saw a black Dodge Ram pickup truck heading north on Broadway near Roscoe Street. They pulled it over.

    As officers removed three men from the four-door truck, bystanders swooped in to record the incident on their phones.

    “Let them go! Kim Foxx says let them go! Lawsuit! Lawsuit!” a man yelled in a video that has since been removed from the Citizen app. “Yeah, you mother f*cking clowns … I want a badge number from each and every one of you all.”

    “Another stupid mother f*cking clown … Incompetent! Incompetent! Let ’em go,” he continued. “Kim Foxx says let them go. Kim Foxx, Kim Foxx says let them go! Let them go!”

    Unbeknownst to the bystanders, police saw an ammunition magazine lying on the truck’s front passenger floorboard and a handgun in the rear passenger area, according to a CPD report that documented the stop.

    Police records indicate that officers sought charges for aggravated battery by discharging a firearm against at least one of the truck’s occupants. But, two days after the men were arrested, they were all released, according to police records.

    The heckler was correct. Kim Foxx declined to press charges against any of them.

    Replies: @Curle

    “ Growing black crime is a myth, and also it is happening because of old institutional racist policies such as redlining and police brutality and Jim Crow.”

    Redlining doesn’t cause crime, crime causes redlining. Racism doesn’t cause crime, crime creates protective responses characterized as racism. Police brutality doesn’t cause crime, it is an mostly unavoidable side effect of suppressing crime. I hope all that is clear now?

    History:

    In the years immediately preceding Revolution British courts render decision allowing certain escaped slaves freedom. Alarmed southern colonists see writing on the wall and reverse long held resistance to separation from Britain. Northern colonies agitating against Britain ally with South to separate. At no point in time is the protection of slavery, the inevitable result of this war, an barrier to northern ambitions. The war is prosecuted by both North and South with full knowledge it will extend the life of the institution of slavery.

    Post Revolution British allow their Black allies (Blacks fought for King George) to migrate to Britain. In very short order their Black allies had dramatically increased crime and had become charity dependents incentivizing the British to create Sierra Leone and populate it (involuntarily for the blacks) with their erstwhile former allies the former Black American slaves. Lesson learned.

    Pre Civil War Northern cities become wracked with crime as a consequence of slaves freed in the South migrating North. The result is an increased concern that Southern business practices are leading to the presence of an criminal population in the North. Legislative hearings are held and state commissions assembled to address the social problem of migrating former slaves now criminals residing in northern cities. Northern Black codes are adopted putting restrictions on the freedoms enjoyed by Blacks. All for the purpose of lowering crime and increased charitable dependency caused by former slaves migrating North. Hostility to Blacks in the North leads to hostility to slave dependent businesses and opposition to growth of slavery in new states.

    The cotton gin and increase in the size of the southern slave economy alarms already concerned northerners. Agitation against slavery continues to rise.

    Amendment to constitution is proposed by Congress to make slavery protected in states permitting it. Several northern states adopt to keep slaves in the South, to avoid war and to halt further growth of slavery in new states. Lincoln does not oppose.

    Civil War.

    During reconstruction slaves are bottled up in the South by the Union army to keep them from migrating North to protect North from the now well known scourge of Black crime. One-quarter of former slave population perishes from starvation and disease unable to escape to the North and to food, charity and criminal opportunities. Northerners do nothing to save the now starving former slaves.

    Black criminality has been a constant since the American Revolution and in every setting where Blacks were not restrained by Black codes or the institution of slavery. It isn’t caused by racism.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @Curle

    Yeah, I thought I was pretty clear that I was articulating the typical moronic views of Goodwhites.

  90. @Curle
    @JimDandy

    “ Growing black crime is a myth, and also it is happening because of old institutional racist policies such as redlining and police brutality and Jim Crow.”

    Redlining doesn’t cause crime, crime causes redlining. Racism doesn’t cause crime, crime creates protective responses characterized as racism. Police brutality doesn’t cause crime, it is an mostly unavoidable side effect of suppressing crime. I hope all that is clear now?

    History:

    In the years immediately preceding Revolution British courts render decision allowing certain escaped slaves freedom. Alarmed southern colonists see writing on the wall and reverse long held resistance to separation from Britain. Northern colonies agitating against Britain ally with South to separate. At no point in time is the protection of slavery, the inevitable result of this war, an barrier to northern ambitions. The war is prosecuted by both North and South with full knowledge it will extend the life of the institution of slavery.

    Post Revolution British allow their Black allies (Blacks fought for King George) to migrate to Britain. In very short order their Black allies had dramatically increased crime and had become charity dependents incentivizing the British to create Sierra Leone and populate it (involuntarily for the blacks) with their erstwhile former allies the former Black American slaves. Lesson learned.

    Pre Civil War Northern cities become wracked with crime as a consequence of slaves freed in the South migrating North. The result is an increased concern that Southern business practices are leading to the presence of an criminal population in the North. Legislative hearings are held and state commissions assembled to address the social problem of migrating former slaves now criminals residing in northern cities. Northern Black codes are adopted putting restrictions on the freedoms enjoyed by Blacks. All for the purpose of lowering crime and increased charitable dependency caused by former slaves migrating North. Hostility to Blacks in the North leads to hostility to slave dependent businesses and opposition to growth of slavery in new states.

    The cotton gin and increase in the size of the southern slave economy alarms already concerned northerners. Agitation against slavery continues to rise.

    Amendment to constitution is proposed by Congress to make slavery protected in states permitting it. Several northern states adopt to keep slaves in the South, to avoid war and to halt further growth of slavery in new states. Lincoln does not oppose.

    Civil War.

    During reconstruction slaves are bottled up in the South by the Union army to keep them from migrating North to protect North from the now well known scourge of Black crime. One-quarter of former slave population perishes from starvation and disease unable to escape to the North and to food, charity and criminal opportunities. Northerners do nothing to save the now starving former slaves.

    Black criminality has been a constant since the American Revolution and in every setting where Blacks were not restrained by Black codes or the institution of slavery. It isn’t caused by racism.

    Replies: @JimDandy

    Yeah, I thought I was pretty clear that I was articulating the typical moronic views of Goodwhites.

  91. @Jack D
    @Ghost of Bull Moose


    “preserved in so fresh a state that those present [starving zeks from the gulag] devoured them with relish on the spot.”
     
    Disinformation from the counterrevolutionary Solzhenitsyn. How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish? If the criminals were starving, would they have taken the time to dish out the relish?

    Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics. Starvation exists only under condition of capitalism where monopoly capitalists deprive the working class of the wealth that they have created.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @MEH 0910, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Reg Cæsar

    How could they be starving if the Chief Administration of Corrective Labor Camps took care to provide them with relish that they consumed as a condiment with their fish?

    …Reliable Western sources such as Duranty proved that there was no starvation in the Soviet republics.

    “Reliable [Southern] sources such as [Capt Wirz] proved that there was no starvation in the [POW camps].”

    [MORE]

  92. Of if dad’s a bad man, maybe sons are more likely to grow up to be bad men than daughters?

    Today, sons aren’t that much more likely to grow up to be bad men than they are likely to grow up to be daughters. Cf Soule v Connecticut Association of Schools, aka 1620 v 1619.

  93. @Achmed E. Newman
    @John Johnson

    China under Mao had a lot more selection. One could get Chairman Mao jackets in either blue or gray. Hair styles varied from rice-bowl cut to "we can't afford scissors, Comrade."

    Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    China under Mao had a lot more selection.

    And affirmative action. Mao preferred racial minorities to Han Chinese, thinking (hardly without good reason) they would make more dedicated revolutionaries. (Come to think of it, our overlords think the same way about our own minorities!)

    Minorities were also exempt from the post-Mao one-child policy. Why is an interesting question. Because they agreed with Mao? Because the minorities were tucked safely away behind the Hu Line? Because it would have fit the international definition of genocide, particularly that of the United Nations, in which their membership was rather new? Or did they just forget about them, being preoccupied elsewhere?

    Anyway, minorities have increased their share of the population from four percent to eight since Mao’s day.

    • Replies: @Malla
    @Reg Cæsar

    It was the same game in the USSR too. When the German Army entered the USSR, they found a decapitated society and proof of massive ethnic manipulation in those days. To cut things short, the trick was Jews+Russians in positions of power in non Russian areas and jews + non Russians in positions of power in Russian area. This way the Commie elites do not have much feelings for the "peasant populations" of those specific areas and they follow the diktats of Moscow without any hesitation. Could also explain why non white infiltrators are brought in such large numbers, why Asians are being put in positions of power in the Orwellian tech industry. Lot of social engineering.

  94. For example, growing up I had a third set of relatives

    Maybe you addressed “relatives” at some point and I missed it? If not by now you MUST have data. Maybe you have some super practical reason to be silent on the matter? But if it mainly a matter of not giving our ideological enemies material then screw them. You’re Steve Sailer goddamit. Your kids know that and whomever they date or wed will know that. And you also don’t shirk from sharing your thoughts and feelings out of fear of what some jackasses may say about it.

    So of all the vignettes in the world, why not discuss what you found out regarding your own genesis.

    Obviously, as with all comments, don’t publish this if you don’t want to.

  95. @Achmed E. Newman
    @PhysicistDave

    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it's speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There's the "cool" factor. It's never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days. Always, the defending of conservative social mores of yesteryear, or even the present, have been, and are, disparaged.

    That has gone on for over 1/2 a century now, so I would not discount it, even though it's not anything but a psychological factor. If it's not "hip to be square", then gullible and under-confident young people will go the other way.

    Of course, I do know that Huey Lewis and the News song. Was that a slight lull during the early/mid 1980s? I think they were just making a joke with the title and lyrics. "Square" has not been "OK" with the majority of young people since I've been alive.

    Replies: @AndrewR, @Curle, @PhysicistDave

    Achmed E. Newman wrote to me:

    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it’s speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There’s the “cool” factor. It’s never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days.

    Well, it’s an interesting question.

    Back around 1962-’63, when I was in mid-grade school, the word in my peer group was not “cool,” but “neat-o.” I remember this very distinctly because my dad thought it was very funny how important the final “o” was to us kids.

    And “neat-o” had a different connotation than “cool” had: “neat-o” did not mean edgy or transgressive or rebellious or likely to irritate adults. It basically just meant really appealing to grade-school boys.

    The space program, for example, was “neat-o.”

    By 1968-’69, on the other hand, “cool” was in common use, though not universally, since it did tend to mean edgy or offensive to adults, and not all of us wanted to offend adults.

    The space programs brings up who our heroes were in the early ’60s: the Mercury astronauts certainly counted as did some sports figures. All my friends knew who Maris and Mantle were (and we were not heavily into sports), and everyone in St. Louis could name several of the stars on the baseball Cardinals: one of my classmates’ main claim to fame was that she baby-sat for Lou Brock’s kids (Brock was Black and our community was fairly racist, but since Brock was a superstar with the Cards, that overrode his race).

    If you had asked my grade-school peers and me for “heroes,” aside from the astronauts and sports figures, I think we would have been reduced to naming figures from history — Washington, Edison, etc.

    Even when it came to pop music, there was less generational division than you’d think from reading about the period: even adults recognized that “Yesterday,” “The Girl from Ipanema,” “The Sound of Silence,” “Unchained Melody,” etc. were good songs. My dad, whose tastes were very conservative, was fond of “Puff the Magic Dragon” (needless to say, Dad did not know about the supposed connection to marijuana!).

    Even in high school, I could not name a single student that I knew to be using illicit drugs (i.e., aside from tobacco and alcohol): there were vague rumors that some unnamed students were using, but that was all.

    Being boys, most of us did occasionally engage in damn-fool behavior: I myself was more cautious than most boys, but I still remember a few foolish actions. But most of that damn-fool behavior was similar to the damn-fool behavior our dads and their dads before them had engaged in: i.e., it was not generational rebellion as much as just boys being boys,

    I grew up in a lower-middle class/working-class suburb of St. Louis. In grade school, we were not tracked, and my close friends ranged from top students to guys who were just barely passing, so they were a fairly random sample.

    For us, “the ’60s” were really sort of a media presentation: we heard and read about the hippies, drugs, the “death of God,” the antiwar movement, and all the rest, but it was not part of our lives. Most of us did end up being against the war, but, again, this happened at about the same time that most adults turned against the war.

    “The ’60s” seemed to us to be something that happened on college campuses, among spoiled rich kids, and out in the big coastal cities.

    That changed at some point in the ’70s, but I was off at college by then and did not see the changes in our community happening up close and personal.

    I’m curious to know if guys in my age group from other parts of the country had similar or different experiences of “the ’60s.”

    • Replies: @Feryl
    @PhysicistDave

    A lot of early Boomers were "square", or perhaps, waited until the late 70's or early 80's to go nuts (the murder rate peaked in 1980, serial killing also peaked in the early 80's). On the other hand, late Boomers were kids or early teenagers when things began to come unglued in the very late 60's and early 70's, and their overall "scene" was one of violence, sex, and drugs. Teen drug use peaked in the late 70's, school fights also peaked in the late 70's. The wild teen "party" comedies and slasher movies of circa 1978-1984 represent these trends. Early Gen X perpetuated these trends, then later generations began calming down and reversing these trends.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave

  96. Back to the topic of the original post:

    Razib Khan often reminds, “Read the paper!” As with “How To Predict Who Gets Shot In Chicago,” Steve isn’t doing a Point-‘n-Sputter as to how the authors approach the concept of “Crime.” Maybe he should?

    If you want to understand the philosophy that motivates George Soros’ favorite D.A.s (Boudin, Gascon, Krasner, Foxx, etc.) — read this paper.

    Below the fold, I’ll describe “The Sherwood Forest Theory of Criminal Justice.”

    [MORE]

    Robin Hood and his Band of Merry Men Penis-Owners and Vulva-Owners are living their best lives, raising their offspring on a diet of wholesome venison, nutritious roasted acorns, and poetry slams. Into this idyll storms the Sherriff of Nottingham, determined to incarcerate the Merry Folk at the bidding of his racist overlords. The Sheriff, his deputies, and far-off King Richard’s well-to-do subjects have hearts of stone: they are indifferent to the suffering their Criminal Justice System visits upon the children of the Forest. Only the PhD-awarded Friar Tucks and Maid Miriams of the Academy have the insight and bravery to Speak Truth To Power. Smash this oppressive edifice that the bourgeoisie have created!

    The paper’s Introduction includes a thicket of maskirovka paragraphs: maybe children are affected by their parents’ criminal behavior as well as by The System’s interventions. Certain caregiver actions might directly harm children.

    These possible causal arrows have been discarded by the time we get to the heart of the paper. Normies (e.g. most iSteve readers) understand that adults who behave badly often get in scrapes with the law, and that adults who behave badly often wind up doing things that cause harm to their children. Keith Finlay (Census Bureau), Michael Mueller-Smith (U. Mich.), and Brittany Street (U. Missouri) adamantly do not recognize these associations. In their world, the criminal justice system is a perverse lottery, bestowing its malign winning tickets on random people. (Of course, given White Privilege, these random victims are disproportionately Black, Hispanic, and Native American.)

    This project is founded on the premise that Wet Streets are uncorrelated with Rain.

  97. How did you miss that about your Mom?

    That’s so bizarre

  98. @Jack D
    @MEH 0910

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    The objective was to project a narrative of abundance.

    The Soviet ads’ primary purpose was not to market the products and encourage people to buy them, but rather to create an idealistic view of society and the country. The TV and print ads were supposed to inform consumers that the advertised products existed somewhere, even though the shelves in their local stores were empty.

    Here is the most cynical ad imaginable:

    https://miro.medium.com/max/680/0*GfJxVWpn9FClUukh

    The caption says "Force yourself to eat black caviar!"

    Caviar was the ultimate luxury good in Russia - it was only available to Party members with connections. You were supposed to imagine that somewhere in Russia, people were sick of eating caviar like prisoners in Maine who used to beg not to be fed any more lobsters.

    Replies: @John Johnson, @MEH 0910

    https://www.rbth.com/russian-kitchen/333856-thursday-fish-day-ussr

    • Replies: @Jack D
    @MEH 0910

    Some of the Soviet canned fish products were actually pretty good. Riga Sprats (which were during Soviet times and still are produced in Latvia) are sardines that are first smoked and then canned, completely put American canned sardines to shame.

    In general, if you visit a "Russian" supermarket in America you will find all sorts of canned and smoked and pickled fish (some of it is now produced in Brooklyn and some still comes from the Baltics) that are of excellent quality and great variety (albeit not always in accordance with American tastes).

  99. @AndrewR
    @YetAnotherAnon

    Lmaoooo idk how these people define "winning" other than "Russians haven't occupied Lviv yet"

    Replies: @sayless

    Yes. I think the Washington Post dismissed what the Russians have done so far as only “incremental” gains.

  100. @JimDandy
    @SunBakedSuburb

    Buried in Naples. And then shipped to France for some reason.

    This NPR headline has always pissed me off. Murder is murder, but why not stick to the facts?

    "Emmett Till's Father Was Also Hanged: A New Book Tells His Story"

    Replies: @SunBakedSuburb, @sayless

    Louis Till murdered the woman he raped.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    @sayless

    Yeah, but Emmett wasn't hanged.

  101. “The apple does not fall far from the tree.”

  102. @sayless
    @JimDandy

    Louis Till murdered the woman he raped.

    Replies: @JimDandy

    Yeah, but Emmett wasn’t hanged.

  103. @MEH 0910
    @Jack D

    https://www.rbth.com/russian-kitchen/333856-thursday-fish-day-ussr
    https://twitter.com/dehammo/status/1401638669350576136

    Replies: @Jack D

    Some of the Soviet canned fish products were actually pretty good. Riga Sprats (which were during Soviet times and still are produced in Latvia) are sardines that are first smoked and then canned, completely put American canned sardines to shame.

    In general, if you visit a “Russian” supermarket in America you will find all sorts of canned and smoked and pickled fish (some of it is now produced in Brooklyn and some still comes from the Baltics) that are of excellent quality and great variety (albeit not always in accordance with American tastes).

  104. You used to be able to debate nature vs. nurture sometimes, but nowadays you aren’t even supposed to mention that kids growing up around criminals are probably getting bad nurture from their felonious relatives. Instead, they are suffering from “intergenerational exposure to the criminal justice system” as opposed to intergenerational exposure to lowlifes.

    I have to stop reading Sailer while drinking my afternoon cup of hot green tea so I don’t guffaw the liquid contents all over my big beautiful monitor.

  105. Well, obviously the solution is to not arrest, convict, and/or incarcerate black people. If this is done, then black children will not be surrounded by criminals or just highly successful criminals as role models. On the other hand, they might see how profitable and easy the life of a criminal can be. Let the suckers work and just take what you want from them. Hmmmm.

  106. @Altai
    There was a pilot programme in the North East of Britain, I'm not sure if they shut it down, during the 2000s where the police would just take DNA samples from any man who aroused their attention for any minor crime.

    The idea was maybe Jim wasn't a serious criminal but he might have close male relatives who were. Once you have your identified DNA from a crime scene you can match it to your database and knowing this sample was a first cousin with a common grandfather you've narrowed down the list of possibilities hugely.

    Male criminality is closely linked to ASPD or Anti-Social Personality Disorder as a psychological diagnosis. Given the symptoms it's actually one of the best diagnosed and studied and most likely to represent something innate and real.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder

    Such types may also be better seen not as aberrations but a totally different life history strategy that is somewhat stable. These individuals are effectively human parasites which exploit larger human groups by social defection.

    Replies: @Altai, @Curle, @AnotherDad, @Feryl

    Psycopaths exist because all tribes need people who can mercilessly deal out violence with no remorse. Of course, as one gets further from the equator people tend to be more cautious (due to their ancestors not jumping in the water and freezing to death) which weeds out psychopaths to some degree. But never are they totally eliminated, since psychopaths tend to be good at reproducing before they are killed or incarcerated.

  107. @PhysicistDave
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Achmed E. Newman wrote to me:


    I would add one more important factor, Dave. I was not there in the 1950, so it’s speculation for that time, but I have been here for most of the rest. There’s the “cool” factor. It’s never been cool to be Conservative, socially, that is, since I would guess back in those old days.
     
    Well, it's an interesting question.

    Back around 1962-'63, when I was in mid-grade school, the word in my peer group was not "cool," but "neat-o." I remember this very distinctly because my dad thought it was very funny how important the final "o" was to us kids.

    And "neat-o" had a different connotation than "cool" had: "neat-o" did not mean edgy or transgressive or rebellious or likely to irritate adults. It basically just meant really appealing to grade-school boys.

    The space program, for example, was "neat-o."

    By 1968-'69, on the other hand, "cool" was in common use, though not universally, since it did tend to mean edgy or offensive to adults, and not all of us wanted to offend adults.

    The space programs brings up who our heroes were in the early '60s: the Mercury astronauts certainly counted as did some sports figures. All my friends knew who Maris and Mantle were (and we were not heavily into sports), and everyone in St. Louis could name several of the stars on the baseball Cardinals: one of my classmates' main claim to fame was that she baby-sat for Lou Brock's kids (Brock was Black and our community was fairly racist, but since Brock was a superstar with the Cards, that overrode his race).

    If you had asked my grade-school peers and me for "heroes," aside from the astronauts and sports figures, I think we would have been reduced to naming figures from history -- Washington, Edison, etc.

    Even when it came to pop music, there was less generational division than you'd think from reading about the period: even adults recognized that "Yesterday," "The Girl from Ipanema," "The Sound of Silence," "Unchained Melody," etc. were good songs. My dad, whose tastes were very conservative, was fond of "Puff the Magic Dragon" (needless to say, Dad did not know about the supposed connection to marijuana!).

    Even in high school, I could not name a single student that I knew to be using illicit drugs (i.e., aside from tobacco and alcohol): there were vague rumors that some unnamed students were using, but that was all.

    Being boys, most of us did occasionally engage in damn-fool behavior: I myself was more cautious than most boys, but I still remember a few foolish actions. But most of that damn-fool behavior was similar to the damn-fool behavior our dads and their dads before them had engaged in: i.e., it was not generational rebellion as much as just boys being boys,

    I grew up in a lower-middle class/working-class suburb of St. Louis. In grade school, we were not tracked, and my close friends ranged from top students to guys who were just barely passing, so they were a fairly random sample.

    For us, "the '60s" were really sort of a media presentation: we heard and read about the hippies, drugs, the "death of God," the antiwar movement, and all the rest, but it was not part of our lives. Most of us did end up being against the war, but, again, this happened at about the same time that most adults turned against the war.

    "The '60s" seemed to us to be something that happened on college campuses, among spoiled rich kids, and out in the big coastal cities.

    That changed at some point in the '70s, but I was off at college by then and did not see the changes in our community happening up close and personal.

    I'm curious to know if guys in my age group from other parts of the country had similar or different experiences of "the '60s."

    Replies: @Feryl

    A lot of early Boomers were “square”, or perhaps, waited until the late 70’s or early 80’s to go nuts (the murder rate peaked in 1980, serial killing also peaked in the early 80’s). On the other hand, late Boomers were kids or early teenagers when things began to come unglued in the very late 60’s and early 70’s, and their overall “scene” was one of violence, sex, and drugs. Teen drug use peaked in the late 70’s, school fights also peaked in the late 70’s. The wild teen “party” comedies and slasher movies of circa 1978-1984 represent these trends. Early Gen X perpetuated these trends, then later generations began calming down and reversing these trends.

    • Replies: @PhysicistDave
    @Feryl

    Feryl wrote to me:


    A lot of early Boomers were “square”...
     
    Yeah, most people forget that in the Nixon-McGovern race in 1972, Nixon actually won the under-30 vote!

    Nixon truly was a very unappealing candidate -- both personally and in terms of policies -- so that is truly remarkable.

    What happened was that the rather raucous college kids made it into the news, but the more restrained college kids and, especially, working-class kids were below the radar for the national news media.

    I myself voted (reluctantly) for Nixon in 1972, and our dorm at Caltech seemed about evenly split between Nixon and McGovern.

    I also remember watching the riots at the Democratic National Convention in Chicago in 1968: what I (and, as it turned out, most of the country) saw were privileged kids behaving badly and the Chicago PD lashing out in response.
  108. @Reg Cæsar
    Is intergenerational a commonly-used term in sociology? I don't recall having seen it much, but one use rings a bell, in this classic article from Boston magazine:

    “We live in a culture that's hysterical about children and assumes they have no sexual agency or desire,” says Dan Savage, an author and nationally syndicated sex columnist. “But anyone who can remember what they were like when they were 11 knows that kids are sexual, and whether it was messing around with their cousin, playing doctor with their neighbor, or making passes at people 10 years older, they were horny. So NAMBLA steps out to articulate all this, albeit in its usual highly dysfunctional and creepy way, and because we know what they say to be true on this issue, we've got to label them as insane perverts. Any attempt at rational discussion about youth sexuality and intergenerational sex is simply shouted down.”

    https://www.bostonmagazine.com/2006/05/15/boy-crazy/
     

    Many commenters here claim pederasty-- or "pedophilia"-- will be the "next big thing". But others have been saying this for decades, and the opposite happened:

    Gay bookstores are putting up barricades of their own, choosing not to carry the NAMBLA Bulletin for the first time in the organization's history. At Giovanni's Room in Philadelphia, the store's owner, Ed Hermance, says he pulled the NAMBLA Bulletin off the shelves last year after his staff threatened to strike if he didn't.

    “I think it's a strange day for gay culture when we start banning something because it makes us uncomfortable,” Hermance says. “Especially when that thing is a foundation of gay literature. If we pulled all the books that had adult-youth sexual themes, we wouldn't have many novels, memoirs, or biographies left.”
     

    Besides, little boys don't have big things. At least not when I showered after gym class years ago. Maybe it's different today? Corvinus might know.

    Replies: @Feryl

    When late Boomers started having kids in the 80’s, they really hammered the living crap out of the worst thing to come out of the sleazy 70’s, which was pederasty advocacy. The gay liberators basically treated it as a niche adjunct of gay rights into the early 80’s, but since then the pederasts have increasingly been marginalized (Gen X hates pedos even more than late Boomers do). Silent and early Boomers parents to a large degree basically let their kids fend for themselves and in the process failed to recognize just how many perverts “liberated” themselves in the 70’s and took advantage of a culture that was lax about protecting kids.

    • Agree: sayless
  109. @SunBakedSuburb
    @JimDandy

    "I call it the Louis Till syndrome."

    Father n' Son act? Was Louis buried in Italy after the rape or did the U.S. Army ship his body back to the U.S.?

    Replies: @JimDandy, @jallynn

  110. Are we to ignore the mental and emotional IQ?

  111. @John Johnson
    @Jack D

    Why would you need advertising in a socialist economy?

    Because they would still want to promote one product over another for economic reasons

    For example they might have a surplus of cabbage and would want to promote that over a foreign product.

    By 1940 they had given up on collectivism and had switched to state monopoly capitalism. You can only buy from the state but there is still some basic choice in what you buy.

    Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @Jack D

    This wasn’t the reason. Generally speaking the USSR was a shortage economy in consumer goods (and food) – almost EVERYTHING was in short supply except for a few things that nobody really wanted. People did manage to eat and be clothed thru various clever means but a lot of stuff that was advertised (caviar, electronics, cars, etc.) were always difficult to obtain so advertising was not directed at increasing demand. In some cases (tinned fish) they really did want to increase demand because they had problems with the supply of meat (the state dictated price was below the cost of production so collective farms didn’t want to produce it but if they tried to raise the price there were literally riots).

    • Thanks: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    @Jack D


    the state dictated price was below the cost of production so collective farms didn’t want to produce it
     
    Or they produced it, but it disappeared into the black market, with the same outcome.
  112. I can’t wait for Chetty’s next study on how intergenerational NBA playing career exposure causes children to be exceptionally tall. Or how intergenerational polynesian tattoo exposure makes people significantly larger than average. Even better, how high levels of exposure to cat food drastically increases the probability that your son ends up being a cat.

  113. Anonymous[112] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    @John Johnson

    This wasn't the reason. Generally speaking the USSR was a shortage economy in consumer goods (and food) - almost EVERYTHING was in short supply except for a few things that nobody really wanted. People did manage to eat and be clothed thru various clever means but a lot of stuff that was advertised (caviar, electronics, cars, etc.) were always difficult to obtain so advertising was not directed at increasing demand. In some cases (tinned fish) they really did want to increase demand because they had problems with the supply of meat (the state dictated price was below the cost of production so collective farms didn't want to produce it but if they tried to raise the price there were literally riots).

    Replies: @Anonymous

    the state dictated price was below the cost of production so collective farms didn’t want to produce it

    Or they produced it, but it disappeared into the black market, with the same outcome.

  114. @Feryl
    @PhysicistDave

    A lot of early Boomers were "square", or perhaps, waited until the late 70's or early 80's to go nuts (the murder rate peaked in 1980, serial killing also peaked in the early 80's). On the other hand, late Boomers were kids or early teenagers when things began to come unglued in the very late 60's and early 70's, and their overall "scene" was one of violence, sex, and drugs. Teen drug use peaked in the late 70's, school fights also peaked in the late 70's. The wild teen "party" comedies and slasher movies of circa 1978-1984 represent these trends. Early Gen X perpetuated these trends, then later generations began calming down and reversing these trends.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave

    Feryl wrote to me:

    A lot of early Boomers were “square”…

    Yeah, most people forget that in the Nixon-McGovern race in 1972, Nixon actually won the under-30 vote!

    Nixon truly was a very unappealing candidate — both personally and in terms of policies — so that is truly remarkable.

    What happened was that the rather raucous college kids made it into the news, but the more restrained college kids and, especially, working-class kids were below the radar for the national news media.

    I myself voted (reluctantly) for Nixon in 1972, and our dorm at Caltech seemed about evenly split between Nixon and McGovern.

    I also remember watching the riots at the Democratic National Convention in Chicago in 1968: what I (and, as it turned out, most of the country) saw were privileged kids behaving badly and the Chicago PD lashing out in response.

  115. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    @Unintended Consequence

    "So, geniuses of correlation-is-causation, what are the likely maladaptive behaviors manifested by these victims of circumstance? Poor impulse control, poor anger management, etc."

    Actually the basic problem which is the underlying force beneath everything you cite, is: an inability to adapt to modernity.

    Modernity is highly complex, it is historically very very new, it was selectively developed (viz it is by no means universal), and it is very much unlike all previous modes of human existence, with the possible exception of the upper echelons of the Sung Dynasty.

    There are classes of people who simply have not had enough time and exposure to adapt to modernity, and there are people who are categorically, congenitally incapable of doing so.

    Like the late great Phil Hartman used to say, "I'm just a caveman! Your world frightens and confuses me!"

    Now imagine various population subgroups, and take that joke literally and seriously.

    Replies: @PhysicistDave

    The Germ Theory of Disease wrote:

    Actually the basic problem which is the underlying force beneath everything you cite, is: an inability to adapt to modernity.

    Modernity is highly complex, it is historically very very new, it was selectively developed (viz it is by no means universal), and it is very much unlike all previous modes of human existence…

    In the relevant respects, America was already a prime exemplar of “modernity” by 1950: a highly productive industrial market economy, a high level of literacy, a good deal of social and geographic mobility, impressive technology, etc.

    And it worked quite well — stable families, low crime rate, high life expectancy, etc.

    And then it all fell apart in the next three decades.

    No, America was not wrecked by modernity — this was not a natural death, this was homicide.

    A country that was not perfect but that worked remarkably well was sabotaged by its own elites.

    • Agree: Nicholas Stix
  116. @SunBakedSuburb
    @Nicholas Stix

    "Legitimate social science research is dead."

    Hasn't it always been the domain of stupidly altruistic whites with a blax fetish and right-of-center whites funded by genocidal white billionaires interested in determining which demographic should go first to give Mother Earth a break?

    Replies: @Nicholas Stix

    I read your comment almost immediately, but I don’t have an answer for you. In any event, it’s a very interesting take.

  117. @Reg Cæsar
    @Achmed E. Newman


    China under Mao had a lot more selection.
     
    And affirmative action. Mao preferred racial minorities to Han Chinese, thinking (hardly without good reason) they would make more dedicated revolutionaries. (Come to think of it, our overlords think the same way about our own minorities!)

    Minorities were also exempt from the post-Mao one-child policy. Why is an interesting question. Because they agreed with Mao? Because the minorities were tucked safely away behind the Hu Line? Because it would have fit the international definition of genocide, particularly that of the United Nations, in which their membership was rather new? Or did they just forget about them, being preoccupied elsewhere?

    Anyway, minorities have increased their share of the population from four percent to eight since Mao's day.

    Replies: @Malla

    It was the same game in the USSR too. When the German Army entered the USSR, they found a decapitated society and proof of massive ethnic manipulation in those days. To cut things short, the trick was Jews+Russians in positions of power in non Russian areas and jews + non Russians in positions of power in Russian area. This way the Commie elites do not have much feelings for the “peasant populations” of those specific areas and they follow the diktats of Moscow without any hesitation. Could also explain why non white infiltrators are brought in such large numbers, why Asians are being put in positions of power in the Orwellian tech industry. Lot of social engineering.

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