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What stuff should you order now to have if it gets worse?

 
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  1. Condoms

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar


    What stuff should you order now to have if it gets worse?
     
    Condoms
     
    Are the "lifestyle clubs" taking this lying down? Have they been reduced to "soft swapping" for the duration of the epidemic?
    , @Lagertha
    I do believe this is a huge fakey-fakey-fake scare. I have relatives who died in the great Spanish Flu.

    I think if you wash your hands, take vitamins/drink high Ph water, and avoid sick people, you will be fine. And, most importantly, avoid hospitals, libraries, halls with loads of people.

    , @Not Raul
    Good idea. People have to be able to keep entertained and get exercise when they’re stuck at home with no electricity.
  2. n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that’s it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    • Replies: @Dylan
    I bought a 20 pack of N95s for $80 because I've got a pregnant wife and my in-laws are late 60s with some minor health issues. Any mitigation I'll take.
    , @bigdicknick
    update. I found a local hardware store that still has a lot of n95's and at normal retail. The store is a real crap hole which I think is why they still had them.
    , @Harry Baldwin
    What you really need, if you can afford it, is the army's M50 gas mask. It's going for $299 (used) - $500 (new).

    The M50 series is certified to MIL-SPEC PRF-EA-10003. The mask design features improved performance against chemical and biological agents, toxic industrial chemicals, and nuclear fallout. The dual, low profile filters reduce weight and bulk while reducing breathing resistance by fifty percent over the M40 series mask. The filters incorporate a shelf-life indicator patch which changes colors from white to blue when the filters are no longer serviceable. The mask face blank incorporates self sealing filter mounts that allow for filter changes in a contaminated environment.

    The single element eye lens gives the mask a 96 degree field of view and improved compatibility with military equipment and battlefield optical systems.
     

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M50_joint_service_general_purpose_mask
    , @DragonDancing
    I bought 2 n95 masks at my local hardware store yesterday and there were more.Walgreens still has some masks but double price from 2 weeks ago.
    , @Malcolm X-Lax
    I just went and checked my Amazon past ordering history because about 3 years ago I had to by my own n95 1860 mask to do the required fit-testing prior to a nursing contract I was working. Those are unsurprisingly out of stock. The hospital system I work at now has removed them from all of the clean supply rooms and require approval by the house supervisor to obtain. I've got a some left over from that box but gave many of them away to friends in the bay area during the Paradise "camp" fire back in 2018, (in which my uncle was one of the 84 people killed, incidentally). At any rate, here's the thing: You don't need an N95 mask. You may feel more protected but transmission is, assuming one believes the CDC, like the flu, through respiratory droplets, not floating on the air like TB or Measles. A regular surgical mask and face shield (or glasses), as well as good hand washing or anti-bacterial hand sanitizing should be enough to protect you. Also, avoid all oriental people. That last part was a joke.
    , @Cato
    The masks are almost all made in China. Visualize the factory. Workers dry coughing as they package the masks for shipment to Home Depot.
  3. Dont order in the Szechuan beef.

  4. Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.

    • Agree: Desiderius
    • Replies: @Steve in Greensboro
    Stay away from people?

    That's good advice regardless of the virus load in the environment.
    , @Almost Missouri
    Question: Given that it is a pandemic and that no man is an island, we are all, everyone, going to be exposed to Coronavirus eventually, and most of us will survive. So what is the point of delaying the inevitable and hobbling ourselves with a debilitating self-quarantine? Are we hoping for a vaccine to rescue us before we personally are exposed? Any vaccine won't come in time, and even if it did, I would hardly trust it. Better to face the music now and get it over with, rather than live a twilight existence and end up facing the same illness anyway.

    I understand that some of us have sickly or elderly friends and relations, and that for their sakes we don't want to hasten their demise, so we keep ourselves hygienic and our gratuitous contacts limited. But for those of us who are healthy now, are we going to be more healthy facing the virus after six months of living underground on canned food? Isn't it better to face it sooner, fresh and strong, than later, fearful and weakened?
    , @Anon

    Non-perishable food basically.
     
    Some ideas:

    -- Long lasting vegetables: potatoes, onions, carrots, cabbage

    -- Last a while vegetables and fruit and other: garlic, apples, still green bananas; cheese

    -- Seasonings: Salt, pepper, red chiles or flakes, Tabasco, jalapeno slices, soy sauce, powdered and whole cumin, powdered coriander, turmeric, cayenne, bay leaves, saffron, garam masala, chicken consomme cubes; bottled salsa; grow your own basil and cilantro



    -- Olive oil, Canola, butter, honey or sugar

    -- Meat, poultry, and sausage, pre-cut, ziplocked, and frozen; refrigerated ham and bacon

    -- Frozen vegetables: blanched broccoli and minced ginger, for example

    -- Rice, long and short grain; canned or dry kidney or other beans; frozen tortillas

    -- Canned and frozen vegetables

    -- Canned and bottled beverages

    -- Appliances: rice cooker, electric pressure cooker or slow cooker, bread machine

    Plan for some basic meals, mostly 1 pot or pressure cooker:

    -- Pasta needs pasta, canned tomatoes, salt, pepper, garlic, olive oil

    -- Various potatoes and meat dishes: stew, nikujaga

    -- Curries: lots of onions, garlic, some tomato, spices, meat or vegetables

    -- Minestrone: chicken consomme, bacon or ham, small pasta, vegetables

    -- Arroz con pollo: chicken, short grained rice, diced peppers or canned peppers, saffron

    -- Bread: flour (bread and regular), salt, dry yeast

    -- Burritos: At their simplest, refried beans (pintos in oil smashed with a potato masher), cheese melted in, and bottled salsa and jalapenos, in tortillas, taco style if small

    This will keep you from spending too much time in the markets or in restaurants. You'll find you need stuff, but you can take make a list and take quick, targeted shopping runs rather than wander around the grocery store.
    , @Lurker
    Bleach - I'm told bleach is no longer used in hospitals. Why is that? It kills everything, dissolves all sorts of nasty stuff.
  5. Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.
    Your PayPal donate link is still broken.

    • Replies: @Sean

    Your PayPal donate link is still broken
     
    'Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;. Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world' as Ed Harris says in The Stand


    https://youtu.be/L_DOr804kBs?t=31


    ------

    1. Avoid Italian produce especially olive oil, because the Mediterranean diet will lead to you becoming a nonagenarian, and elderly enough to die of it.

    2. Extended vacation in North Sentinel Island.
  6. Food and vital medicines. Doing what you can to to stay out of the public is really the most important right now.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    "Food and vital medicines."

    Also wooden stakes, silver bullets, and garlic. Because some who are infected with the virus become vampires. Richard Matheson previsioned the current apocalypse in his novel I Am Legend. The garlic is for you -- good for the immune system.
    , @Buck Ransom
    Vitamin C. I bought two bottles of something by Nature Made called Super C Immune Complex that contains Vitamins A, C, D, E and Zinc to help support the immune system.
  7. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:

    When shortages occur, the last government organization you will be able to depend upon is the police. When the police are overloaded, and people need food or other resources, they will invade your home to get it. If you’re not handy with firearms, just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.

    Stock up on toilet paper, bottled water, canned and dry goods.

    Stay away from fast food places, Home Depot, Lowe’s–anyplace that supports illegal aliens. Now is not the time for a kitchen rehab.

    Avoid the city of Arcadia.

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory

    just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.
     
    Joe Biden is that you?

    Yes a shotgun is a good home defense weapon. But at typical inside the house distances you do still have to aim. At 12 feet, you will have a 2-4" spread using buckshot. At 20 yards, depending on the shell you are using, your spread will be anywhere from 9-17 inches.

    Remember, all of those projectiles coming out of the muzzle of that shotgun are your responsibility. Buckshot will penetrate multiple sheetrock walls. So be careful if the badguy is standing in front of your kid's bedroom or the room your wife is in.

    Birdshot is for birds, not badguys.
    , @Polynikes
    This is the best advice most will ignite on here, especially for all you that live in a multicultural area.

    Rifle, handgun, and a shotgun should be the minimum in any home, along with plenty of ammunition, mags, etc... My town is homogeneous and probably pretty safe, but the more things break down the less faith I have in social cohesion. Places like LA are probably a few bad days away from riots.
    , @S. Anonyia
    Arcadia? Only one I know of is in Louisiana. Hope you don’t live near there it’s (Along with the rest of Northern Louisiana) a shithole.
    , @Anonymous
    In Katrina, police joined in the looting.
  8. Not necessarily what you (SSailor) should order but here are things to think of:
    NP95 mask respirator — The latest fashion accessory
    https://heavy.com/health/2020/02/n95-mask-respirator/

    Alt medicine
    Lugol’s iodine ….look on eBay, get 5% or 7%
    Vitamin C …I like vitamin C in the form of Magnesium ascorbate powder by NOW Foods
    Vitamin C ….the super version is lypospheric C that you can find at Amazon, Swanson’s etc.
    Other alt health defense can be found at Health Ranger website

    Tucker had a man on last night who said at the Wuhan bio lab you had researchers who would take animals home that survived the tests and trials. For some side money they would sell the animals at the Wuhan wild animal food market. Hard to believe!
    ___________________________

    Coronavirus: China bans citizens from eating wild animals including peacocks, pangolin and badgers
    Official order marks major U-turn in tolerance of practices – but slaughter of rabbits, pigs and chickens in open-air markets ‘still poses hygiene risk’

    China’s leaders have launched an immediate ban on selling and eating wild animals, in a fast-track decision to fight the spread of the coronavirus.

    Within hours of the crackdown being announced by the National People’s Congress – China’s top level of parliament – authorities started closing down markets across the country selling species ranging from badgers, deer and peacocks to turtles, pangolin and civet cats.

    The ban marks a major shift in the country’s attitude to selling and eating animals caught from the wild. Most towns and cities in the country have one or more wild animal markets.

    Experts say citizens are so worried about the rapid spread of coronavirus that they will help police the ban, by posting on social media photos and information on any traders breaching it.

    However, trade in pigeons, rabbits and quail, bred for consumption rather than taken from the wild, is still allowed.
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/coronavirus-china-animals-wild-eat-ban-wildlife-market-pangolin-dogs-cats-a9358496.html

    • Thanks: Triumph104
  9. – N95 masks
    – Food for 3mths
    – Medicine
    – Water
    – Hygiene products like desinfection gek, gloves, cleaning products
    – Extra freezer for meat
    – Bread machine
    – Oxygen in blood meter (for your finger)

    Maybe buy a ventilator/oxygen machine? They’re scarce and they help you survive.

    • Replies: @kikz
    Generic Guaifenesin 400mg..... cheap, about 1/4 the $price of brand names such as Mucinex, same active ingredient.

    flu/pneumomia: you're going to need expectorants to stave off fluid in lungs which if untreated leads to worse biotic infections. caveat: you must increase fluids to get it up/out.

    other stuff, you'll wish you had......

    TP/kleenex, ammo, batteries, water, (can/dry goods, rice/beans/pasta, bread flour/sugar/yeast)/ unfiltered apple cider vinegar/Gatorade powder or electrolyte solution, especially for elders/babies who dehydrate quickly.

    medicine cabinet: neosporin/H peroxide/aloe/bandages/alcohol/orajel- tooth pain, burns/aspirin, acetaminophen, etc/shelf stable pro-biotics/anti-emetics, anti-diarrheals/box of gloves/body wipes/dry shampoo?/toothpaste

    charcoal/gas cylinders - outdoor cooking/lighters/candles, tealights are a good deal, last about 4hrs. cannot stress enough - headlamp..... Energizer makes a good one.

    bleach/clorox wipes/dish soap/clothes soap/borax (mule)

    liquor.
  10. I’m going to stock up on vitamins and supplements i tend to take.

    Also some protein powder, tuna and maybe a big sack of rice and one of beans just in case things get out of hand.

    And some water and hand sanitizer… and maybe a I’ll get a few more pairs of comfortable shoes.

    oh and contact solution.

    Some .22lr ammo?

    • Replies: @Wazoo
    I wouldn’t wear contact lenses for the duration of the crisis. The Coronavirus can enter your body when you rub or touch your eyes.
  11. Coronavirus is amazing with Lyme disease.

    • Replies: @Testing12
    Well, they share a common origin story!
  12. Licorice root holds within
    A compound called glycyrrhizin.
    The Lancet doth write:
    Glycyrrhizin just might
    Be a cure for the fix that we’re in.

    • Replies: @Bard of Bumperstickers
    For love in the time of corona
    Buy missile silos in North Dakota
    She'll see you as hero
    For escaping patient zero
    And thwarting a fatal pneumonia.
    , @MEH 0910
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycyrrhizin#Adverse_effects

    The most widely reported side effect of glycyrrhizin use via consumption of black licorice is reduction of blood potassium levels, which can affect body fluid balance and function of nerves.[5][6] Chronic consumption of black licorice, even in moderate amounts, is associated with an increase in blood pressure,[6] may cause irregular heart rhythm, and adverse interactions with prescription medicines.[5]

    The effects on body fluids are related to the inhibition of cortisol metabolism within the kidney, subsequent stimulation of the mineralocorticoid receptors,[7] and decrease in blood levels of renin, potassium, and aldosterone, which collectively lead to increases in blood pressure.[6]
     

    Depending on amount and frequency of ingesting black licorice, other side effects may include:[5][8]

    Edema
    Lethargy
    Headache
    Paralysis
    Transient visual loss
    Torsades de pointes
    Tachycardia
    Cardiac arrest
    Reduced testosterone
    Premature birth
    Acute kidney failure
    Muscle weakness
    Myopathy
    Myoglobinuria
    Rhabdomyolysis
    Increased body weight
     
  13. I’m going to stock up on vitamins and supplements i tend to take.

    Also some protein powder, tuna and maybe a big sack of rice and one of red beans just in case things get out of hand.

    And some water and hand sanitizer… and maybe a I’ll get a few more pairs of comfortable shoes. And some socks.

    oh and contact solution.

    Some .22lr ammo?

    • Replies: @anon
    When I was a youngster and people were building and stocking fallout shelters my dad bought a pistol with the intent of forcing his way into a neighbors shelter if necessary. so all you really need for the present emergency are the locations of well stocked up hippies and your own weapon, as well as BBQ sauce if said hippies are vegetarians. Also plastic gloves to handle raw meat, to avoid transmitting diseases.
  14. Stock up on food, alcohol, and anything you need to stay at home for a while. Masks are likely to be of little help but might be nice to have.

    If a doctor has prescribed you statins, start taking them now. Having lower cholesterol makes you less likely to catch a virus and viruses reproduce less effectively in people with low cholesterol. In addition, statins are a powerful anti-inflammatory and can protect organs from destruction by your body’s immune system. People on statins who get the flu have half the death rate of those who don’t take statins, so a big difference.

    Vitamin C is a somewhat decent antiviral and does ward off illness to some degree. When fighting a virus the body depletes Vitamin C at a fast pace, so large doses are in order. As a preventative a few hundred milligrams a day are fine.

    There are a few other drugs which work as an antiviral, including Clomid and propranolol. You can also do a Google search for any meds you are taking to see if they work off-label as an antiviral. If you are taking these drugs, don’t stop now and get your scripts filled!

    • Replies: @Steve in Greensboro
    I got that alcohol part covered.
    , @S. Anonyia
    So I’ll be in pretty good shape health wise, as a 30 yr old just prescribed statins (not overweight, either, my family is just prone to high blood pressure. I don’t have that yet but presumably high cholesterol is a predecessor?)

    Im almost thinking I’d rather get the virus early then recover.

    When I get the flu, it doesn’t last that long. Only thing that’s ever really affected me was bronchitis years and years ago.

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?

    We already bought masks, gloves, safety goggles, vitamins. Wondering if I should get beans, tuna, peanut butter, and canned water, as well.
  15. Grabbed bottled water (not a ton) some extra canned goods (green beans, soups). a bigger bag of rice than I usually buy…..nothing crazy but enough to go a couple three weeks if there are interruptions!

    Yes…..some extra ammunition as well.

  16. Would you mind asking Greg Cochran and giving us the answers?

  17. Also: N95 masks if you can find them.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    "N95 masks if you can find them."

    I'll be wearing my rubber devil mask from a long ago Halloween. Those infected bastards won't come near me.
  18. A 50 lb bag of flour, a sourdough starter, access to potable water, and access to an oven or stove will provide enough food (sourdough bread) for 50 person/days. A few gallons of olive oil would be nice to go along with the bread as would a few gallons of wine. Almost makes me look forward to a “shelter in place” order.

    You can also make cowboy bread with the above ingredients and a pinch of baking soda.

  19. Here’s a video that covers the basics.

    • Replies: @Svigor
    That guy's a jackass. Probably good to write down his list and shop for alternatives, though. And put it all in backpacks, not gym bags.
  20. Vodka.

    • Agree: Steve in Greensboro
    • Replies: @Lockean Proviso
    Vodka not just to help the time pass, but also to sanitize the outside of masks while wearing them if need be.
  21. The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah – he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.

    So: You could look out for a little Campingaz-stove too, just in case, that there would be problems like a power-net breakdown or something.

    • Replies: @Smithsonian_6

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky.
     
    80% of cases are mild. He might have just got lucky.

    It is the 20% which require medical treatment.
    , @anon
    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky.

    Somehow being a blackpilled Eeyore who is afraid of women doesn't seem like much of a cure.
    , @Tex

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah – he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.
     
    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you recover from corona-chan, then it stands to reason plenty of booze will ward it off. Time to stock up on bourbon.
  22. Essentials! Something for everyone!

  23. Dry carbohydrates, rice, pasta, flour.
    Canned meat, fish, fruit.
    Disinfectant.

    An oxygen tank (the killer is secondary pneumonia) but you probably won’t be able to get one now for love nor money. So you might have to settle for electrolysis of water with a warning to vent the hydrogen safely to avoid blowing yourself up.

    Gloves and face mask. The face mask won’t prevent virus particles from getting in, but it will stop you from touching your face which is a common source of infection.

  24. Here’s Julie Bosman of the NYT doing her part to stoke the panic — does that name ring a bell with anyone?

    • Replies: @Hail

    Julie Bosman
    @juliebosman

    From @CDCgov press call: "Disruption to everyday life might be severe,"
     

    This is one of the problems with Twitter.

    Squeezing out tweets that are contextless to incite people, who of course do not check the (usually ungiven) source to see exactly what was said in context. The lazy Twitter followers retweet it, and it takes on a life of its own.

    The Twitterization of discourse.

    Al "Information Superhighway" Gore must be spinning in his grave.

  25. @Dieter Kief
    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah - he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.

    So: You could look out for a little Campingaz-stove too, just in case, that there would be problems like a power-net breakdown or something.

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky.

    80% of cases are mild. He might have just got lucky.

    It is the 20% which require medical treatment.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    And the little gas-stove? - sigh. I made a joke. I'm sorry. - OTOH I mean - humor is one of the best remedies against all kinds of threats. That's proven.
  26. The first thing is to start taking vitamin D and getting natural sunshine when you can. I’m also taking vitamin C, selenium, and keeping my electrolytes up (potassium, magnesium especially since I have Afib) but that’s just me.

    As far as extra food, I’ve got a little extra rice, beans, freeze dried onions, frozen ground beef, and canned tomatoes. I’ll live on chili if I have to, but I do not expect to need it.

    This thing does not look that serious unless one is old and in bad shape or has a genetic susceptibility to cytokine storms. The cytokine storms are the big deal for the young and healthy.

    Basically, our population is reacting (medically) like the Native Americans did to novel European diseases, but we have better hospitals. COVID-19 will probably become endemic like flu or colds but, since it is novel, there are a good many people out there right now who are genetically vulnerable,

    • Replies: @Jack D
    The mortality rate seems to be around 2.5% or 1 in 40 (somewhat higher (up to 4%) in places where the medical system sucks or has broken down - the Chinese were letting people die in the street). And that one is often an older gentleman whose parking meter was going to run out soon anyway. So it is not going to have the impact that smallpox had on Native Americans.

    What is sad are the exceptional cases where it strikes down some young healthy person and all of modern medical science cannot save them. This doesn't happen a lot but it happens.
  27. The people whose background suggests they know best about surviving say that for long term collapse, you need a tribe. If it is just you or your family, over the long stretch you will eventually get overrun and your carefully collected stuff stripped off your corpses. With a survivalist group of a couple dozen people or more, you have enough fighting power that marauders will move on and pick on an easier target, you can always have sentries and scouts on alert so you don’t get surprised, if you are sick or injured there are people who will protect you until you recover, there will be a variety of skills and knowledge in your tribe, agriculture can be sustained etc.
    For a potential short term crisis, the bug-out bag, stashed groceries and so forth should be fine.
    In the case of Coronaviris, fill up your pantry, get a face mask, have enough firepower to discourage casual looters, and hunker down. This still doesn’t look the Black Death, so the worst effect will not be from a massive death toll, but a temporary hiatus in commerce and transport.

    • Replies: @Dissident
    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Earth Abides is a 1949 post-apocalyptic science fiction novel by American writer George R. Stewart. It tells the story of the fall of civilization from deadly disease and its rebirth. The story was set in the United States in the 1940s in Berkeley, California and told by a character, Isherwood Williams, who emerges from isolation in the mountains to find almost everyone dead. [...]

    In November 1950, it was adapted for the CBS radio program Escape as a two-part drama starring John Dehner.
     

    I have not read the book but found the radio version, which can be found here (episodes # 148 and #149) quite good. Perhaps needless to say, I hope and pray that what we are facing now will not come to anything near what is portrayed in that drama.
    , @Wency
    "you need a tribe"

    Psalm 127

    Sons are indeed a heritage from the Lord,
    offspring, a reward.
    Like arrows in the hand of a warrior
    are the sons born in one’s youth.
    Happy is the man who has filled his quiver with them.
    They will never be put to shame
    when they speak with their enemies at the city gate.
  28. @Eustace Tilley (not)
    Licorice root holds within
    A compound called glycyrrhizin.
    The Lancet doth write:
    Glycyrrhizin just might
    Be a cure for the fix that we're in.

    For love in the time of corona
    Buy missile silos in North Dakota
    She’ll see you as hero
    For escaping patient zero
    And thwarting a fatal pneumonia.

  29. Have any non-Asians died of Coronavirus, so far?
    Table gives chance of contracting a dangerous version of the virus upon exposure.

    • Replies: @Lot
    I think the chart isn’t about infection risk directly but how many each population has, on average, of the 6 “higher ACE” genes.

    So the Japanese have 5.5 on average, Italians 3.

    You can check some of these yourself if you’ve done 23andme.
    , @JUSA
    Why are Utah residents with Northern & Western European ancestry more susceptible than other whites in the US?

    Also why are these whites more susceptible than other European whites:
    - British in England and Scotland
    - Finnish in Finland
    - Iberian population in Spain
    - Toscani in Italia
  30. Based on the info available thus far, it would appear that if you’re white, you have a very low risk of dying from the virus itself, though it is still incredibly nasty and unpleasant.

    What definitely would kill you is running out of food, water, or (as many forget) the means to prepare those things. Depending on the spread and severity, you might find yourself without power or fresh water for a while.

    If you plan to subsist on rice and pasta, make sure you also store plenty of water and portable cooking gear, just in case. If you’re filling up your freezer, make sure you have backup power for that freezer and the microwave/oven. If you plan to just get the hell out of Dodge, be prepared for gas stations to be swamped or out of fuel. And obviously, get ahead on any prescription meds you take.

    And if your primary form of entertainment is TV or vidya or social media, now might be a good time to take up reading books of the dead-tree variety.

    I’ve also stocked up on batteries and various kinds of emergency lighting. Maybe I’m being over-cautious, but I just have a feeling that the electric grid is going to be one of the first things to go during a real crisis – it’s becoming unreliable even in the best of times, and if workers stop showing up for work, well…

    I’m not stocking up on guns and ammo – this is a viral pandemic, not the set of Walking Dead. The major risk is mass isolation in a fragile supply chain, not invading armies and roving bands of bandits.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    "now might be a good time to take up reading books of the dead-tree variety"

    I'm surrounded by dead-trees. And 12 Gauge shotgun shells.
  31. not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    • LOL: another fred
    • Troll: Bert
    • Replies: @anon
    A really serious pandemic that takes out many of the over 70 will wipe out national debts of many countries in an instant!
    , @Anonymous

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I’m an extremely healthy boomer. I’ve worked out for years. Far more than you. Resting pulse is 58. Semi-retired. I don’t have to work. I can most likely buy and sell the likes of you.

    To me, you, in your mid-twenties, are essentially a happy, aimless fucktard. You are the outcome of too many boomers having too many babies. You were likely raised poorly. That is, you don’t even know how weak you are. You’re just a happy camper, taking up an annoying amount of space on the freeway in your shitty little Toyota Carolla.

    Probably the biggest problem I have with your lot is most of you are ingrates.

    You shouldn’t be here. Most of you were a mistake, who went on to thrive because post birth abortions are still against the law in this country, no matter how strong a mournful parents argument might be, and don’t think your parents didn’t have an iron-clad moral, ethical case for a pillow pressed passionately against your baby head.

    Look in the mirror today, and instead of being repulsed, be grateful.

    We let you live, to allow you to give life your best shot. You squandering it in front of a video game console isn’t our fault. It’s what we roughly predicted.
    , @Steve in Greensboro
    With any luck, the bat flu will be a repeat of the Spanish Flu of the early part of the last century which killed off mostly annoying young people like yourself.
    , @S. Anonyia
    Surely you’re not so cold you want to watch your parents die?
    , @PSR
    "as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already"

    how long til you are wondering why your phone doesn't work, why there's no water or electricity and who's going to fix everything?
  32. Man , GTFO of here with this the sky is falling clickbait . Even if Corona virus kills 10,000,000 it’s less than 1% of the 7,000,000,000 . This ain’t no Black Death , and even if it was it’ll only make the world a better place .

    We mock the climate change hysterical AHs for their childless hysteria . Shit ETOH kills more of us than any “pandemic” .

    ‘While there is death there is hope”

    • Replies: @donut
    Childish
    , @epebble
    With all the fear storm going around, it is good to remember that Tuberculosis kills in a day what coronavirus has done so far. Even malaria kills more than a thousand a day. In the U.S. , the greatest killer respiratory disease is smoking (infinitely deadlier than corona, since no one has died of the latter). You are more likely to die of lightning/dog bite/snakebite ( and definitely traffic accident ).

    That said, if you really want to horde something, a few large jars of hand sanitizer may be good; Also, a few bottles of Isopropyl Alcohol and Hydrogen Peroxide. A few gallons of bleach may be good too. it is too late to go and grab masks as China and Taiwan have stopped exporting a few weeks back.
  33. Hey Steve , I just posted a comment on Anatoly Karlin’s place . It got passed immediately , maybe you should give him a heads up about me .

    • LOL: Mr McKenna
  34. The time to prep was before everyone (including even my wife) started talking about prepping. This may blow over as nothing, but it ought to teach people a lesson.

    It’s cheaper to prep food-wise during sales: bags of rice, beans, boxes of pasta (this stuff doesn’t go bad for a long time). How about some dried fruits for vitamins?

    Since you asked now, though, Steve, just get foods that won’t perish quickly. I like some extra gas around. You may not have any place to store 25 G of gasoline with stabilizer – I get over 3 years out of it but still am experimenting. I also have a Coleman stove that runs off of unleaded gas, just in case you can’t cook otherwise (I don’t see that as the problem here). It’s easy enough to fill large containers with potable water from the sink now, even if other people have bought out the cases of bottled water.

    You seem like the type that would be OK for a month without coming out, so long as you have the internet. When it goes down, God help us all.

    (I may turn on the TV that I haven’t used the receiver of in years, and watch that D-debate with a friend just for laughs. That will likely sicken me a lot more than this virus.)

    • Replies: @Jack D
    Coleman stove is good but just don't use it inside the house, at least not without a LOT of windows open. I have a portable butane burner that runs off of what look like aerosol hairspray cans (because that's basically what they are) that is safe to use inside the house. My main stove is electric (induction - love it) so it gets used whenever the power goes out. They sell these (and the butane cans) in any Korean grocery store (and the stoves on Amazon). Also useful for tabletop cooking and not expensive (under $20). These are ubiquitous in Asia. It's as easy and idiot proof to use as a gas stove and each can gets you maybe 1 hr of cooking. Coleman stove requires a certain # of brain cells to operate.
  35. So Far:

    N95 Masks
    Hand sanitizer
    Disposable gloves (heavy duty so we can use for projects later)
    Unscented bleach
    TP
    Paper towels
    Tissue paper
    Tough garbage bags

    Cough syrup DM
    Typical flu OTC meds
    Imodium
    Aspirin

    Multiple pastas
    Canned Soups
    Various 5 pound rice bags
    Various bags dried beans
    Multiple chicken/beef stocks
    2 bags onions

    Several six packs of ensure

    I need to buy some more of the above foods, and pedilyte.

    We have our usual foods, the above is in a special tote–picked because we can use later if the grocery stores are not empty for two weeks

  36. @Lugash
    Food and vital medicines. Doing what you can to to stay out of the public is really the most important right now.

    “Food and vital medicines.”

    Also wooden stakes, silver bullets, and garlic. Because some who are infected with the virus become vampires. Richard Matheson previsioned the current apocalypse in his novel I Am Legend. The garlic is for you — good for the immune system.

    • LOL: sayless
    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    For Steve - THE Prepper's Anthem, best of all time, by Corb Lund out of Alberta, Canada:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uASQgLwaIs

    When the oil stops, everything stops, nothing left in the fountain.
    Nobody wants paper money son, so you just well stop countin'.
    Can you break the horse, can you light the fire, what's that I beg your pardon?
    You best start thinking where food comes from and I hope you tend a good garden.


    Getting down on the mountain, getting down on the mountain.
    Don’t wanna be around when the shit goes down.
    I'll be gettin' on down the mountain.


    When the truck don’t run, the bread don’t come, have a hard time finding petrol.
    Water ain't runnin' in the city no more, do hold any precious metal?
    Can you gut the fish, can you read the sky, whats that about over crowdin'?
    You ever seen a man who's kids ain't ate for 17 days and countin'?


    Getting down on the mountain, getting down on the mountain.
    Don’t wanna be around when the shit goes down.
    I'll be goin' to ground on the mountain.


    There ain't no heat, and the powers gone out It's kerosene lamps and candles.
    The roads are blocked. Its all grid-locked. You got a short wave handle?
    Can you track the deer, can you dig the well, couldn’t quite hear your answer?
    I think I see a rip in the social fabric, brother can you spare some ammo?



    Just because you had to get into this Zombie business, SBS, here's another by this band:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79llXVDWbCQ
  37. @donut
    Man , GTFO of here with this the sky is falling clickbait . Even if Corona virus kills 10,000,000 it's less than 1% of the 7,000,000,000 . This ain't no Black Death , and even if it was it'll only make the world a better place .

    We mock the climate change hysterical AHs for their childless hysteria . Shit ETOH kills more of us than any "pandemic" .

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19q1i-wAUpY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_4EnZRMHsY

    'While there is death there is hope"

    Childish

    • Replies: @sayless
    God forgives, donut. But the heads up won’t help, because you’re irrepressible.

    Cracks me up.
  38. @Anonymous
    https://twitter.com/Scholars_Stage/status/1230893418940895234

    Also: N95 masks if you can find them.

    “N95 masks if you can find them.”

    I’ll be wearing my rubber devil mask from a long ago Halloween. Those infected bastards won’t come near me.

  39. Olive leaf extract, Vit C (3000 milligrams minimum), Vit. D3 (10000 IU), Activated charcoal..

  40. Surprisingly, no one is mentioning vitamin B complex tablets. Vitamin B12 is the one substance you *have* to get from animal sources. If you’re living on beans, lentils and rice for a while, then there’s a non negligible risk of neurological damage from a lack of B12.

    Also, try for tinned rather than dried legumes. If things really, really go to hell, you need something you can empty out and grudgingly eat. A generator won’t be an option for a lot of people, and dried food you can’t eat defeats the purpose.

    • Replies: @Jesse
    Another thing people never seem to consider is their caffeine intake. Most adults will experience some sort of withdrawal symptoms if they don't get their fix. You need to consider stockpiling cheap supermarket coffee. (Energy drinks, caffeine pills etc., are NOT recommended).

    I assume most people have the beans, rice, water side of things covered. This is more a PSA about what people forget.
    , @Cagey Beast
    Marmite and Vegemite are two good sources of B vitamins and they're great for adding flavour to stews etc.
    , @Alden
    Good for you for remembering that dried food needs to be cooked. Dried beans are wonderful in that 1 cup of dried beans becomes 3 cups of cooked beans. But they need to be boiled a long time.

    Chickpeas take forever as long as 1o hours. Black beans and red kidney beans are about the shortest times, 2 hours. Lentil and dried peas 30 minutes.

    Every winter electricity goes out. So electric stoves, crock pots micro waves are useless. Gas stoves are more reliable. All those survivalist and earthquake preparedness ideas that depending on cooking food are useless if you can’t cook.

    Canned food that is palatable cold is best. Fruit, not vegetables. Standard sweetish baked beans instead of chili beans. Canned chili is pretty bad. Cold canned Chili must be awful. Canned beets corn green beans taste good canned potatoes and spinach bad. Carrots cabbage and turnips taste just fine raw and last a long time. Be careful where you store food that isn’t canned. You’ll get rats mice and raccoons.

    We had an electric stove and a couple power outages every year when we lived in the suburbs. We didn’t bother, just ate bread cookies fruit salad I always cooked 2 fried chickens at once so there was often cold chicken. Kids always wanted to cook hotdogs in the fireplace. We did a few times.
    I bet if you put regular rice in a pot of cold water it would soften as much as if it were cooked in a day. Certainly oatmeal cream of wheat minute rice and that kraft macaroni in a box would soften up in 24 hours etc.
    In the earthquakes the food falls off the shelves and food that’s in bags and boxes gets broken and messed up.

    Palatable when cold canned food is the way to go. Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration. Then there’s canned tuna and fish.

    I don’t believe the gas and electricity needs all that much human attention. The electric substations get along with just a few people to keep adjusting the circuit flow.
    , @ThreeCranes
    Have plenty of legumes, rice, lentils etc. on hand but you also won't go wrong by going long on canned food.

    Long ocean voyagers have favored canned food because it can be eaten without cooking AND it generally contains liquids, which serve as a substitute for water. So although canned is a bad choice for trail hikers because of the extra weight of the water--which they can get from a stream--it is good for cruising boats which generally carry a certain amount of internal ballast anyway. Same principle applies to your household where weight is not an issue.

    Canned pears and peaches and the like may remind you of institutional food, but they do contain sugars and water. Survival tales written by guys who endured isolation at sea regularly feature the "daily surprise" menu wherein he picks a delabeled can (from having been sloshing around in the bilges of his sinking boat) and opens it for his daily ration. It could be stewed tomatoes or pears; who knows! More prudent voyagers varnished their labels before they left the dock.
  41. @Dieter Kief
    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah - he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.

    So: You could look out for a little Campingaz-stove too, just in case, that there would be problems like a power-net breakdown or something.

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky.

    Somehow being a blackpilled Eeyore who is afraid of women doesn’t seem like much of a cure.

    • LOL: Alden, Redneck farmer
    • Replies: @Whiskey
    Black pilled Eeyore that's me. Afraid of women no. Dislike idiot feminist lunacy like nails on a chalkboard yes.

    As for guns ammo, you better have it. Periodically police run away: Rodney King and Freddy Gray riots, Criwn Heights, etc. Expect 3-5 days of wilding. The Purge movies in real life. No cops right there ... it's free crime day.

    You know who I am talking about. Better have ammo.

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.

    An epidemic police will be gone for months not days and you will be alone with the vibrant diverse.

    You'd damned well better be armed son!
  42. @Michael S
    Based on the info available thus far, it would appear that if you're white, you have a very low risk of dying from the virus itself, though it is still incredibly nasty and unpleasant.

    What definitely would kill you is running out of food, water, or (as many forget) the means to prepare those things. Depending on the spread and severity, you might find yourself without power or fresh water for a while.

    If you plan to subsist on rice and pasta, make sure you also store plenty of water and portable cooking gear, just in case. If you're filling up your freezer, make sure you have backup power for that freezer and the microwave/oven. If you plan to just get the hell out of Dodge, be prepared for gas stations to be swamped or out of fuel. And obviously, get ahead on any prescription meds you take.

    And if your primary form of entertainment is TV or vidya or social media, now might be a good time to take up reading books of the dead-tree variety.

    I've also stocked up on batteries and various kinds of emergency lighting. Maybe I'm being over-cautious, but I just have a feeling that the electric grid is going to be one of the first things to go during a real crisis - it's becoming unreliable even in the best of times, and if workers stop showing up for work, well...

    I'm not stocking up on guns and ammo - this is a viral pandemic, not the set of Walking Dead. The major risk is mass isolation in a fragile supply chain, not invading armies and roving bands of bandits.

    “now might be a good time to take up reading books of the dead-tree variety”

    I’m surrounded by dead-trees. And 12 Gauge shotgun shells.

    • Replies: @another fred
    Heh.

    Yeah, it's a little late to be buying ammo.
  43. @Smithsonian_6

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky.
     
    80% of cases are mild. He might have just got lucky.

    It is the 20% which require medical treatment.

    And the little gas-stove? – sigh. I made a joke. I’m sorry. – OTOH I mean – humor is one of the best remedies against all kinds of threats. That’s proven.

  44. God damn it Steve, even if this is a joke, this here is the most boomer post ever. Apply normal hygeine precautions, remember SARS, and don’t panic. Surely Beijing is lying but this is probably nothing
    ——–
    List anyway:
    Chloroquin, which [ahem] appears to cure this; it worked on SARS. It’s an old anti-malarial, proven and very widely available. Grep enough for ten days at 500mg. As with antibiotics, do not stop dosing when symptoms clear up.
    If all the rumors are true, including the one about six months of purging unbelievers:
    That American-Canadian herring (is it Bar Harbor?), Spanish octopus, Georgian caviar, Georgian wine, Russian caviar, Japanese mackeral, Litvak sprats, Spanish chorizo, Romanian trout, white tuna, King Oscar sardines, and Deming salmon; spring water (I assume you have filters as well), rices (especially sushi, basmati, wild, and black), red kidney beans, red lentils, green lentils, olive oil, kimchi, real sauerkraut, щи (in frozen but separated bricks), pickles, olives, a tent, a Perception Keowee sub-kayak with paddle and skirt and vehicle mounting, raw onions (for purging the membranes), ziplocs in varying sizes, disposable plates and cutlery, a sjambok, a machete, a Mora, a WWI German butcher bayonet, a Dutch oven, a pellet heater, water purification tablets, bleach, gasoline, a generator, a Faraday cage, Siberian restorative herbs, Lugol’s iodine, 5-HTP, NooPep, turmeric, duct tape, a kugelwagen (with a technical conversion, twin 50 cal at least), adult multi-vitamins, those new powderized vegetable pills, gmo-free beet powder, the really good more expensive first aid kit, Padron cigars with lighters and clippers, a S&W M&P II with four mags and 500 rounds of .223, a South African harness, a Coonan Classic with 300 rounds of .357 magnum, a decent Tikka in .308 with 150 rounds, an aquaponics setup, flashcards and pens (be able to communicate without internet or physical contact), bowls, a Chinese tactical shovel, flashlight and rechargeable batteries, sturdy garbage bags, marihuana (to be able to trade with hippie scum), oregano (to be able to mess with hippie scum), beads (to be able to trade wirh Indians), Luksosowa, Laphraoig, Mio sparking sake, Spanish Cava, a cow, two goats, six SILENT chickens, two roosters, normal soap, Castille soap, toilet paper, latex gloves (or another material if allergic), face masks (if infected*), and (of course) zinc.
    Slim-Fast is disgusting and unhealthy but (weakly) replaces a meal and keeps long at room temperature.
    All, for half a year.
    Avoid things which absorb moisture or will not keep, which includes improperly stored onions, and definitely most breads, crackers, cereals, etc.. Dairy runs out when it runs out: be able to drop it as a nutrient. Freezing milk gives mixed results.
    *Face masks are for the infected, to courteously prevent further spread. Shinobiying everywhere in a mask will not protect you.
    Skip that “vertical potato field” box. It works only with one kind of rapidly-growing potato.

    • Thanks: Mr McKenna
    • Replies: @JMcG
    I can only gaze in the stunned silence which naturally accompanies one’s first glimpse of the supernatural. This list is right up there with the original Mall Ninja posts. Sir, you have excelled yourself. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    What was the middle part again?
    , @Pheasant
    'Laphraoig'

    Damn straight.

    Being of one of those ethnicities that cannot have booze in thier house without drinking it immediately I have already finished my emergency supply.

    Oh well.
    , @Pheasant
    'Dairy runs out when it runs out: '

    Milk powder.
    , @Captain Tripps
    After getting a third of the way through your list, my eyes glazed over. But then I shook my head, regained my discipline, and read through each component. Very comprehensive! Except you forgot a critical component: isopropyl alcohol. Or, in a pinch, clear distilled spirits will do (plain vodka, corn whiskey, or better yet, Everclear!). And, while the Laphroaig is a nice touch, sadly, you omitted Jack Daniels Old No. 7.
  45. @Dieter Kief
    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah - he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.

    So: You could look out for a little Campingaz-stove too, just in case, that there would be problems like a power-net breakdown or something.

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah – he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.

    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you recover from corona-chan, then it stands to reason plenty of booze will ward it off. Time to stock up on bourbon.

    • Replies: @iffen
    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.

  46. Bottled water, some canned food, anti-flu medicines, and a way of storing your waste until the worst has passed.
    You should have this anyway, just for longer power outages.

  47. Vote for Don by mail.

    Batteries and clean water.

    Don’t bother looking for face masks at the obvious places. I got the last couple packages at my Home Depot around Feb 4. Everything on Amazon long sold out, and ebay only with people flipping at high prices.

    The bulk packages were gone at HD so they had them on 2 packs for $7. At least they were the really nice 3M ones.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    Somehow I was able to order N95s from Home Depot online for (free) home delivery. They were like 3 for $10, Milwaukee (re)brand and marked Made in India. They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing.
  48. @Jesse
    Surprisingly, no one is mentioning vitamin B complex tablets. Vitamin B12 is the one substance you *have* to get from animal sources. If you're living on beans, lentils and rice for a while, then there's a non negligible risk of neurological damage from a lack of B12.

    Also, try for tinned rather than dried legumes. If things really, really go to hell, you need something you can empty out and grudgingly eat. A generator won't be an option for a lot of people, and dried food you can't eat defeats the purpose.

    Another thing people never seem to consider is their caffeine intake. Most adults will experience some sort of withdrawal symptoms if they don’t get their fix. You need to consider stockpiling cheap supermarket coffee. (Energy drinks, caffeine pills etc., are NOT recommended).

    I assume most people have the beans, rice, water side of things covered. This is more a PSA about what people forget.

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    Right, I've heard very few mentions of coffee (or tea, if that's your morning fix) and a way to make it under any circumstance. Peanut butter is also useful and it keeps, but haven't been seeing anyone mention that
    , @Reg Cæsar

    Another thing people never seem to consider is their caffeine intake. Most adults will experience some sort of withdrawal symptoms if they don’t get their fix.
     
    People tell me this, but... I give up coffee every Lent, and have never experienced such a phenomenon. Perhaps I'm wired differently, but periodic breaks from caffeine might also protect you. (I do drink black and green tea, so it's not a total fast.)

    On the other hand, the saws "beer before liquor" and "sweets before dinner spoil your appetite" don't apply to me either, so maybe it is wiring.
  49. @donut
    Man , GTFO of here with this the sky is falling clickbait . Even if Corona virus kills 10,000,000 it's less than 1% of the 7,000,000,000 . This ain't no Black Death , and even if it was it'll only make the world a better place .

    We mock the climate change hysterical AHs for their childless hysteria . Shit ETOH kills more of us than any "pandemic" .

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19q1i-wAUpY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_4EnZRMHsY

    'While there is death there is hope"

    With all the fear storm going around, it is good to remember that Tuberculosis kills in a day what coronavirus has done so far. Even malaria kills more than a thousand a day. In the U.S. , the greatest killer respiratory disease is smoking (infinitely deadlier than corona, since no one has died of the latter). You are more likely to die of lightning/dog bite/snakebite ( and definitely traffic accident ).

    That said, if you really want to horde something, a few large jars of hand sanitizer may be good; Also, a few bottles of Isopropyl Alcohol and Hydrogen Peroxide. A few gallons of bleach may be good too. it is too late to go and grab masks as China and Taiwan have stopped exporting a few weeks back.

  50. @JimB
    Have any non-Asians died of Coronavirus, so far?

    https://www.eturbonews.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/risk.jpeg
    Table gives chance of contracting a dangerous version of the virus upon exposure.

    I think the chart isn’t about infection risk directly but how many each population has, on average, of the 6 “higher ACE” genes.

    So the Japanese have 5.5 on average, Italians 3.

    You can check some of these yourself if you’ve done 23andme.

    • Replies: @Hail
    I won't pretend I understand what the table means in technical terms, but I do have 23andMe.

    I plugged in "ACE2" into the 23andMe search box. They list thirteen Markers (SNP) for ACE2 genes and give one column called "Your Genotype," with either a letter (indicating you have it, I think) or the phrase "not genotyped."

    I have 3 letters; 10 "not genotyped."

    This puts me, as expected, with Europe. On whatever this is supposed to measure.

  51. Corona Extra.

    Corona Light has no prophylactic value.

    Oh! Lemons, lots of lemons. How could I forget?

  52. @another fred
    The first thing is to start taking vitamin D and getting natural sunshine when you can. I'm also taking vitamin C, selenium, and keeping my electrolytes up (potassium, magnesium especially since I have Afib) but that's just me.

    As far as extra food, I've got a little extra rice, beans, freeze dried onions, frozen ground beef, and canned tomatoes. I'll live on chili if I have to, but I do not expect to need it.

    This thing does not look that serious unless one is old and in bad shape or has a genetic susceptibility to cytokine storms. The cytokine storms are the big deal for the young and healthy.

    Basically, our population is reacting (medically) like the Native Americans did to novel European diseases, but we have better hospitals. COVID-19 will probably become endemic like flu or colds but, since it is novel, there are a good many people out there right now who are genetically vulnerable,

    The mortality rate seems to be around 2.5% or 1 in 40 (somewhat higher (up to 4%) in places where the medical system sucks or has broken down – the Chinese were letting people die in the street). And that one is often an older gentleman whose parking meter was going to run out soon anyway. So it is not going to have the impact that smallpox had on Native Americans.

    What is sad are the exceptional cases where it strikes down some young healthy person and all of modern medical science cannot save them. This doesn’t happen a lot but it happens.

    • Replies: @another fred

    What is sad are the exceptional cases where it strikes down some young healthy person and all of modern medical science cannot save them. This doesn’t happen a lot but it happens.
     
    Those are the cytokine storms. There appears to be a genetic component to having those.

    A few years back, during the bird flu episode, I met a man whose daughter died that way. She went from sniffles to dead in two days. He said her internal organs just almost dissolved - total failure.

    I posted this on another thread, but it's worth repeating. The bright side is that doctors are learning how to treat cytokine storms. The crucial factor is early diagnosis and treatment - they strike FAST.

    https://www.uab.edu/reporter/know-more/publications/item/8909-here-s-a-playbook-for-stopping-deadly-cytokine-storm-syndrome

  53. @Anonymous
    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    A really serious pandemic that takes out many of the over 70 will wipe out national debts of many countries in an instant!

    • Replies: @Joe Schmoe
    I think some have noted that despite China's economic rise, their population structure would cause them to grow old before they grow rich. So, yes, if half of the 70+ folks in China passed away suddenly, then the resources would go to the younger folks or to the rich who are positioned to transfer the value to themselves.
  54. Prepping? Based on what? Here’s the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    CDC – Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

    For comparison, here are the basic stats for the 2018-2019 regular flu season in the United States:

    – 42,900,000 people got the flu
    – 647,000 people were hospitalized
    – 61,200 died

    Worldwide, WHO estimates that 3-5 million people get very sick, and about 600,000 people die every year from the flu.

    How many of you are still panicked about COVID-2019?

    • Replies: @Smithsonian_2

    Prepping? Based on what? Here’s the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426
     
    You have heard of the saying "don't watch what they say, watch what they do?". Watch what the Chinese are *doing*. You think that they would quarantine 750,000,000 people for the flu?
    , @bigdicknick
    corona virus is like 1.5+ orders of magnitude deadlier than the flu. Mortality rate in china will probably end up being like 4%+
    , @vhrm
    The issue is Iran.

    It actually looked like China possibly had it under control. But apparently Iran's been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it's spread from there to there whole middle East. There's no way Iran's going to be able to do China style containment so it's probably going to become endemic there and then the rest of Middle East and South Asia and Africa.

    And at that point it's just a matter of time until it gets everywhere else, including here and back into China from the outside.
    , @Chris Mallory

    Prepping? Based on what?
     
    Based on being prepared. Earthquakes, ice storms, tropical storms, floods and yes quarantine from pandemic are all things that might happen where I live.

    Ten years ago, I went 30 days without power from an ice storm. During that ice storm, one Dollar Store in a county of 70,000 people had power and could do business. Their shelves were empty that first day. Was a week before the banks would let you take out more than $75 cash, and for that first week anything you wanted to buy was a cash transaction.

    The year katrina hit, I went 3 days without power after a tropical storm that had been a hurricane blew over where I live.

    Last summer during one of the hurricanes, a Dindu American was being interviewed on the news. It was two days after the storm had hit and no one in her building had food. They were standing around waiting for someone to feed them.
    , @DragonDancing
    I wouldn't put muh reliance on the CDC and WHO numbers for the flu as it has been proven that they count all pneumonia deaths as flu when most have nothing to do with the flu and the CDC and the WHO own the majority of patents on vaccines and the flu is a massive profit maker for them so they are always fear mongering to pump up sales for the flu virus. I just read that this years flu vaccine is 10% effective and it has not been more than 50% effective for over 20 years.
  55. Anonymous[328] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous
    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    I’m an extremely healthy boomer. I’ve worked out for years. Far more than you. Resting pulse is 58. Semi-retired. I don’t have to work. I can most likely buy and sell the likes of you.

    To me, you, in your mid-twenties, are essentially a happy, aimless fucktard. You are the outcome of too many boomers having too many babies. You were likely raised poorly. That is, you don’t even know how weak you are. You’re just a happy camper, taking up an annoying amount of space on the freeway in your shitty little Toyota Carolla.

    Probably the biggest problem I have with your lot is most of you are ingrates.

    You shouldn’t be here. Most of you were a mistake, who went on to thrive because post birth abortions are still against the law in this country, no matter how strong a mournful parents argument might be, and don’t think your parents didn’t have an iron-clad moral, ethical case for a pillow pressed passionately against your baby head.

    Look in the mirror today, and instead of being repulsed, be grateful.

    We let you live, to allow you to give life your best shot. You squandering it in front of a video game console isn’t our fault. It’s what we roughly predicted.

    • Replies: @Sam Haysom
    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.
    , @Athletic and Whitesplosive
    Ok boomer
    , @Tusk
    This is satire right?
    , @grim prognosis
    I've gotten into enjoying the squabbles between you two generations. You're a match in hell.

    We X's stand back and watch you with our notorious cynicism at the nonsense you two generations of true believers bellow out. Both of you in your respective youths believed "the whole world is watching" and projected a narcissistic media feedback loop. We weren't much for that stuff, maybe because we saw when we were young how full of shit you people had been.

    We have more in common with Silents in some respect, but on the whole we watch in disbelief.

    It's you people who turned this country into a balkanized, outsourced wasteland, after your hedonic wing completed the march through the institutions. I went to college just as the keys were being handed over, and at least caught the tail end of what the Silents had to offer. I could see what was coming. These millennials are your spawn, not us. The education I got not three decades ago is now gone, wiped out by your generation's silliness.

    It's going to take a long haul to undo the rot. Grateful for what? For destroying the social fabric of our country? Doing great? I bet you are. Where I am in flyover country, many of our communities don't even exist anymore. Sorry, some of us think of a nation as more than a bunch of consumers.

  56. @Tex

    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky. He said the treatment helped him recover quickly. Ah – he drank it warm, he said, 1 cup filled with it at a time.
     
    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you recover from corona-chan, then it stands to reason plenty of booze will ward it off. Time to stock up on bourbon.

    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.

    • Replies: @Lurker

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.
     
    At the age of 23.
    , @Dieter Kief
    Same here. He died with 66, not unhappy at all, a very peaceful, soft-spoken and quite humorous man. He had a case of beer in his hospital cupboard and when asked about it told the staff, no problem, beer is better than bread, you don't have to chew it. - His teeth had become bad. In those days, the hospital crew just let him have his way. The hospital was situated near Mannheim's Eichbaum Brauerei - which delivered him the stuff - and is still in business. He worked seven days a week all his life. No health problems whatsoever - until he died.
  57. Get your absentee ballot since nothing will help turnout quite like a pandemic.

  58. Having MMS should be a very good idea.
    MMS (sodium chlorite activated with a food grade acid which then produces chlorine dioxide) kills viruses as well as pathogens of all kinds and is an immune system builder. There is much anecdotal evidence that says MMS has proven very effective in eradicating viruses including Ebola, Swine Flu, TB, and other respiratory diseases. Chlorine dioxide was completely effective against Anthrax in 2001, and used by US Military for Ebola in 2014. It’s been proven by the Red Cross in 2012 to eradicate malaria in just four hours, to name a few.

  59. @Achmed E. Newman
    The time to prep was before everyone (including even my wife) started talking about prepping. This may blow over as nothing, but it ought to teach people a lesson.

    It's cheaper to prep food-wise during sales: bags of rice, beans, boxes of pasta (this stuff doesn't go bad for a long time). How about some dried fruits for vitamins?

    Since you asked now, though, Steve, just get foods that won't perish quickly. I like some extra gas around. You may not have any place to store 25 G of gasoline with stabilizer - I get over 3 years out of it but still am experimenting. I also have a Coleman stove that runs off of unleaded gas, just in case you can't cook otherwise (I don't see that as the problem here). It's easy enough to fill large containers with potable water from the sink now, even if other people have bought out the cases of bottled water.

    You seem like the type that would be OK for a month without coming out, so long as you have the internet. When it goes down, God help us all.

    (I may turn on the TV that I haven't used the receiver of in years, and watch that D-debate with a friend just for laughs. That will likely sicken me a lot more than this virus.)

    Coleman stove is good but just don’t use it inside the house, at least not without a LOT of windows open. I have a portable butane burner that runs off of what look like aerosol hairspray cans (because that’s basically what they are) that is safe to use inside the house. My main stove is electric (induction – love it) so it gets used whenever the power goes out. They sell these (and the butane cans) in any Korean grocery store (and the stoves on Amazon). Also useful for tabletop cooking and not expensive (under $20). These are ubiquitous in Asia. It’s as easy and idiot proof to use as a gas stove and each can gets you maybe 1 hr of cooking. Coleman stove requires a certain # of brain cells to operate.

  60. @Jack D
    The mortality rate seems to be around 2.5% or 1 in 40 (somewhat higher (up to 4%) in places where the medical system sucks or has broken down - the Chinese were letting people die in the street). And that one is often an older gentleman whose parking meter was going to run out soon anyway. So it is not going to have the impact that smallpox had on Native Americans.

    What is sad are the exceptional cases where it strikes down some young healthy person and all of modern medical science cannot save them. This doesn't happen a lot but it happens.

    What is sad are the exceptional cases where it strikes down some young healthy person and all of modern medical science cannot save them. This doesn’t happen a lot but it happens.

    Those are the cytokine storms. There appears to be a genetic component to having those.

    A few years back, during the bird flu episode, I met a man whose daughter died that way. She went from sniffles to dead in two days. He said her internal organs just almost dissolved – total failure.

    I posted this on another thread, but it’s worth repeating. The bright side is that doctors are learning how to treat cytokine storms. The crucial factor is early diagnosis and treatment – they strike FAST.

    https://www.uab.edu/reporter/know-more/publications/item/8909-here-s-a-playbook-for-stopping-deadly-cytokine-storm-syndrome

    • Replies: @JMcG
    The Spanish Flu caused cytokine storms. It was most deadly to young adults, something that seems completely alien to us. There’s a young man in my area who lost his legs to the flu in this manner, only a few years ago now. Terrible.
  61. Find out where your local FEMA is and be ready to run toward it. 🙂

    • Replies: @Father O'Hara
    People of Color are known for their warmth and generosity. If there are communities with large numbers of people of color,go there for help.
    They will gladly share what they have.
  62. @Lot
    Vote for Don by mail.

    Batteries and clean water.

    Don’t bother looking for face masks at the obvious places. I got the last couple packages at my Home Depot around Feb 4. Everything on Amazon long sold out, and ebay only with people flipping at high prices.

    The bulk packages were gone at HD so they had them on 2 packs for $7. At least they were the really nice 3M ones.

    Somehow I was able to order N95s from Home Depot online for (free) home delivery. They were like 3 for $10, Milwaukee (re)brand and marked Made in India. They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing.

    • Replies: @kaganovitch
    American science and surplus has a case of 50 for 18 bucks.
    , @Anonymous

    They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing
     
    Wrong. You need a certain grade of mask to stop the virus. It’s a zero-sum game. There's no such thing as better than nothing, in this case. Do your due diligence, or it will do you.
  63. Anonymous[375] • Disclaimer says:

    Costco sells a variety of emergency food kits that are very convenient. You can get 1 year’s supply of food for a family of four. It comes in 600 cans though, so you’d need space to store it.

    They also sell much smaller kits that’ll a feed a man for a month or 3 months if you don’t want to go all out and get the 600 cans.

  64. This is more important than Corona: the ongoing DoJ project to legalize murder so long as the victim is white.
    https://www.wlox.com/2020/02/25/arrested-five-teens-charged-with-capital-murder-death-year-old/

  65. @SunBakedSuburb
    "now might be a good time to take up reading books of the dead-tree variety"

    I'm surrounded by dead-trees. And 12 Gauge shotgun shells.

    Heh.

    Yeah, it’s a little late to be buying ammo.

  66. @JMcG
    Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.
    Your PayPal donate link is still broken.

    Your PayPal donate link is still broken

    ‘Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;. Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world’ as Ed Harris says in The Stand

    ——

    1. Avoid Italian produce especially olive oil, because the Mediterranean diet will lead to you becoming a nonagenarian, and elderly enough to die of it.

    2. Extended vacation in North Sentinel Island.

    • LOL: iffen
    • Replies: @Autochthon
    Are you crediting Stephen King for the words of W.B Yeats now?

    Sad.
  67. @Anonymous

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I’m an extremely healthy boomer. I’ve worked out for years. Far more than you. Resting pulse is 58. Semi-retired. I don’t have to work. I can most likely buy and sell the likes of you.

    To me, you, in your mid-twenties, are essentially a happy, aimless fucktard. You are the outcome of too many boomers having too many babies. You were likely raised poorly. That is, you don’t even know how weak you are. You’re just a happy camper, taking up an annoying amount of space on the freeway in your shitty little Toyota Carolla.

    Probably the biggest problem I have with your lot is most of you are ingrates.

    You shouldn’t be here. Most of you were a mistake, who went on to thrive because post birth abortions are still against the law in this country, no matter how strong a mournful parents argument might be, and don’t think your parents didn’t have an iron-clad moral, ethical case for a pillow pressed passionately against your baby head.

    Look in the mirror today, and instead of being repulsed, be grateful.

    We let you live, to allow you to give life your best shot. You squandering it in front of a video game console isn’t our fault. It’s what we roughly predicted.

    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    • Replies: @ATate
    With spittle flying and lots of harrumphing. Then deleting a few sentences, only to say sputter “fuck it” under his breath (don’t want to wake the ol battle axe snoring next to him) and rewriting a bit more, probably had his first erection in a while as he pressed “send”.

    Only thing missing is one of those tough old guy saying like “the only thing you can assume about an old man...blah-blah-blah”.
    , @jamie b.

    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.
     
    You mean something like this...?

    i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    At least the guy who responded knows how to use punctuation.
    , @Dissident
    (and ATate and anyone else to whom my words apply)

    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.
     
    Imagine being as psychopathic as to write, seemingly without any provocation,

    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     

    Imagine then completely ignoring such malignant effrontery but choosing to single-out for ridicule the reaction it provoked.
    , @Svigor
    I.e., imagine being a boomer.

    Sry, can't.
  68. anon[268] • Disclaimer says:
    @vhrm
    I'm going to stock up on vitamins and supplements i tend to take.

    Also some protein powder, tuna and maybe a big sack of rice and one of red beans just in case things get out of hand.

    And some water and hand sanitizer... and maybe a I'll get a few more pairs of comfortable shoes. And some socks.

    oh and contact solution.

    Some .22lr ammo?

    When I was a youngster and people were building and stocking fallout shelters my dad bought a pistol with the intent of forcing his way into a neighbors shelter if necessary. so all you really need for the present emergency are the locations of well stocked up hippies and your own weapon, as well as BBQ sauce if said hippies are vegetarians. Also plastic gloves to handle raw meat, to avoid transmitting diseases.

    • Replies: @Redneck farmer
    Ah, someone else who bought Contingency Cannibalism from the late, great Loompanics Unlimited!
  69. @bigdicknick
    n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that's it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    I bought a 20 pack of N95s for $80 because I’ve got a pregnant wife and my in-laws are late 60s with some minor health issues. Any mitigation I’ll take.

    • Replies: @bigdicknick
    Check local non chain hardware stores especially ones that aren't popular. The badly run hardware store near my house has a few dozen boxes of them. I bought one today and upon consideration plan to buy more tomorrow.
    , @Chrisnonymous
    Be careful with pregnancy and older people. You don't want to interfere with breathing in either group.
  70. This may be the biggest overreaction in history

    • Agree: Alden
    • Replies: @Smithsonian_2

    This may be the biggest overreaction in history
     
    Hope so. But prepare.
    , @Andy
    I don't think so. It has already become bigger than SARS and bird flu. It is growing and we don't still know when it will reach its peak (in the last few days it seems to have peaked in China, thanks to very drastic measures that will be hard to pull off in the West). It is clearly more contagious than SARS or bird flu, even though the mortality rate is relatively low so far. In Europe it is growing rapidly.
    , @Kylie
    "This may be the biggest overreaction in history"

    Right up there with Y2K and the Dems on 9 November 2016.
    , @Simon Tugmutton
    The Climate Emergency™ beats it by a country mile.
  71. @Alfa158
    The people whose background suggests they know best about surviving say that for long term collapse, you need a tribe. If it is just you or your family, over the long stretch you will eventually get overrun and your carefully collected stuff stripped off your corpses. With a survivalist group of a couple dozen people or more, you have enough fighting power that marauders will move on and pick on an easier target, you can always have sentries and scouts on alert so you don’t get surprised, if you are sick or injured there are people who will protect you until you recover, there will be a variety of skills and knowledge in your tribe, agriculture can be sustained etc.
    For a potential short term crisis, the bug-out bag, stashed groceries and so forth should be fine.
    In the case of Coronaviris, fill up your pantry, get a face mask, have enough firepower to discourage casual looters, and hunker down. This still doesn’t look the Black Death, so the worst effect will not be from a massive death toll, but a temporary hiatus in commerce and transport.

    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Earth Abides is a 1949 post-apocalyptic science fiction novel by American writer George R. Stewart. It tells the story of the fall of civilization from deadly disease and its rebirth. The story was set in the United States in the 1940s in Berkeley, California and told by a character, Isherwood Williams, who emerges from isolation in the mountains to find almost everyone dead. […]

    In November 1950, it was adapted for the CBS radio program Escape as a two-part drama starring John Dehner.

    I have not read the book but found the radio version, which can be found here (episodes # 148 and #149) quite good. Perhaps needless to say, I hope and pray that what we are facing now will not come to anything near what is portrayed in that drama.

    • Replies: @Kibernetika
    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Yes, that was a great two-episode Suspense production. John Dehner as Isherwood.
    , @Morris Applebaum IV
    I never heard of this radio program. Wow, that was a real treat, a fabulous story with one of my favorite actors, John Dehner. I was surprised at the sound quality as well, expecting something scratchy. Thank you very much for the link.
  72. @Jesse
    Surprisingly, no one is mentioning vitamin B complex tablets. Vitamin B12 is the one substance you *have* to get from animal sources. If you're living on beans, lentils and rice for a while, then there's a non negligible risk of neurological damage from a lack of B12.

    Also, try for tinned rather than dried legumes. If things really, really go to hell, you need something you can empty out and grudgingly eat. A generator won't be an option for a lot of people, and dried food you can't eat defeats the purpose.

    Marmite and Vegemite are two good sources of B vitamins and they’re great for adding flavour to stews etc.

  73. @Sam Haysom
    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    With spittle flying and lots of harrumphing. Then deleting a few sentences, only to say sputter “fuck it” under his breath (don’t want to wake the ol battle axe snoring next to him) and rewriting a bit more, probably had his first erection in a while as he pressed “send”.

    Only thing missing is one of those tough old guy saying like “the only thing you can assume about an old man…blah-blah-blah”.

  74. @vhrm
    I'm going to stock up on vitamins and supplements i tend to take.

    Also some protein powder, tuna and maybe a big sack of rice and one of beans just in case things get out of hand.

    And some water and hand sanitizer... and maybe a I'll get a few more pairs of comfortable shoes.

    oh and contact solution.

    Some .22lr ammo?

    I wouldn’t wear contact lenses for the duration of the crisis. The Coronavirus can enter your body when you rub or touch your eyes.

    • Replies: @vhrm
    hmmm... well, i don't really touch my eyes during the day, but it's a good point. If things become "degraded" maybe i would.

    i should finally order myself some glasses. (due to laziness I've become contacts-only the past few years)
  75. In my attic I’ve got a month’s supply of delicious live bats.

    • Replies: @anon
    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/0VkO5yJ0dGA/maxresdefault.jpg
    , @anonymous
    The German cinema needs you!
  76. @anon
    The first Englishman ever infected with Corona recommended Whisky.

    Somehow being a blackpilled Eeyore who is afraid of women doesn't seem like much of a cure.

    Black pilled Eeyore that’s me. Afraid of women no. Dislike idiot feminist lunacy like nails on a chalkboard yes.

    As for guns ammo, you better have it. Periodically police run away: Rodney King and Freddy Gray riots, Criwn Heights, etc. Expect 3-5 days of wilding. The Purge movies in real life. No cops right there … it’s free crime day.

    You know who I am talking about. Better have ammo.

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.

    An epidemic police will be gone for months not days and you will be alone with the vibrant diverse.

    You’d damned well better be armed son!

    • Replies: @Milestone D
    Once you reach a certain level of neighborhood affluence, you price out the cops. Which means they live somewhere else so any interruption in gas means they aren’t getting to work, and now the affluent have no police protection.
    , @Bert
    If your situation seems dire, you can dig rationally sited fighting holes and cover them with plywood and then leaf litter. Possibly more effective than responding from inside a house.
    , @Svigor

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.
     
    Rotgut's always saying stupid crap like this because he thinks it gets him cred, or something.

    Assemble your own AR (so you can buy parts when deals pop up) for $450. That'll prolly be cheaper than a "decent lever action." Whole hell of a lot more firepower.
  77. Prepping? Grow you own veggies and tomatoes.

    You can get a pack with three different impressive non-GMO tomato seeds here:

    https://hos.ifas.ufl.edu/public/kleeweb/newcultivars.html

    This gives you back-up if there is a local issue with one variety. NOTE: They are hybrids so they will not breed true. New seed is required for each season.

    If you want plants for multiple seasons via saving your own seed, you have to go for true heirloom tomatoes, however that requires significantly more gardening skills than the hybrids.

    https://hos.ifas.ufl.edu/public/kleeweb/links.html
    _____

    I could probably dig up some links for above average gardening tools, but I don’t want to give out “for profit” site links without a specific request.

    PEACE 😇
    _______

    • Replies: @Anon
    It takes 6 weeks to 3 months from seed to food. Half the country has long cold winters when nothing grows.
  78. @Anon7
    Prepping? Based on what? Here's the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    CDC - Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

    For comparison, here are the basic stats for the 2018-2019 regular flu season in the United States:

    - 42,900,000 people got the flu
    - 647,000 people were hospitalized
    - 61,200 died

    Worldwide, WHO estimates that 3-5 million people get very sick, and about 600,000 people die every year from the flu.

    How many of you are still panicked about COVID-2019?

    Prepping? Based on what? Here’s the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    You have heard of the saying “don’t watch what they say, watch what they do?”. Watch what the Chinese are *doing*. You think that they would quarantine 750,000,000 people for the flu?

    • Agree: Desiderius
    • Replies: @Anon7
    Prudent measures should be taken, and are being taken. In the meantime, factories are reopening in China already. The ChiComs need to balance maintaining control over their own people (they can’t be seen as entirely uncaring) with the negative publicity effect this virus is having on people around the world. Many are beginning to doubt whether they really want close ties with China, or to be so dependent on China’s factories.

    Most of the coronavirus doomsayers can’t wait for the stock market to decline even further, possibly triggering the recession that Democrats are praying for. They’re pretty tired of listening to Trump talking about the economy.

    Failing that, CoronaGate (tm; you heard it here first) will be used against him no matter what happens. The same people who ginned up the Russia collusion story have been hyping the virus.

    Trump IS vulnerable on this issue; as I wrote here about a month ago:

    Personally, I think that President Trump blew the political response, which should have been to get out in front of the do-nothing Democrats and show an excess of caution, even if it wasn’t really warranted scientifically.
     
  79. @Anonymous
    This may be the biggest overreaction in history

    This may be the biggest overreaction in history

    Hope so. But prepare.

  80. @Anonymous
    This may be the biggest overreaction in history

    I don’t think so. It has already become bigger than SARS and bird flu. It is growing and we don’t still know when it will reach its peak (in the last few days it seems to have peaked in China, thanks to very drastic measures that will be hard to pull off in the West). It is clearly more contagious than SARS or bird flu, even though the mortality rate is relatively low so far. In Europe it is growing rapidly.

  81. @Anonymous

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I’m an extremely healthy boomer. I’ve worked out for years. Far more than you. Resting pulse is 58. Semi-retired. I don’t have to work. I can most likely buy and sell the likes of you.

    To me, you, in your mid-twenties, are essentially a happy, aimless fucktard. You are the outcome of too many boomers having too many babies. You were likely raised poorly. That is, you don’t even know how weak you are. You’re just a happy camper, taking up an annoying amount of space on the freeway in your shitty little Toyota Carolla.

    Probably the biggest problem I have with your lot is most of you are ingrates.

    You shouldn’t be here. Most of you were a mistake, who went on to thrive because post birth abortions are still against the law in this country, no matter how strong a mournful parents argument might be, and don’t think your parents didn’t have an iron-clad moral, ethical case for a pillow pressed passionately against your baby head.

    Look in the mirror today, and instead of being repulsed, be grateful.

    We let you live, to allow you to give life your best shot. You squandering it in front of a video game console isn’t our fault. It’s what we roughly predicted.

    Ok boomer

    • Agree: Autochthon, Cloudbuster
  82. @JMcG
    Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.

    Stay away from people?

    That’s good advice regardless of the virus load in the environment.

    • Agree: Alden, JMcG
    • LOL: Bardon Kaldian
    • Replies: @BB753
    Good advice! Also try not to be over 65 years old of age and/or have a pre-existing condition. Do not smoke. Live in a sunny environment with high temperatures.
  83. @bigdicknick
    n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that's it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    update. I found a local hardware store that still has a lot of n95’s and at normal retail. The store is a real crap hole which I think is why they still had them.

    • Replies: @Chrisnonymous
    My father had same experience--found normal priced N95s at local non-chain store.

    They need to be NIOSH certified N95. The CDC has a list of approved N95 products on its website, linked via the CNET article on masks that comes up top Google search.

    Make sure you shave cleanly and watch N95 fitting videos online.

    Also, they are single-use. Save for times when you are confined and close to people, like an airplane cabin. Don't let anyone tell you they are pointless. There is a famous case in the medical literature of a flight where everyone in first class got TB because of one of the passengers.

    Safety glasses helpful if people around you are coughing.

    Gloves not that important, but washing hands is. Hand sanitizer should be 70% and ethanol if possible, but shouldn't replace hand-washing, especially for dirty places lke restrooms.

    If you work in a place like a hospital and have long hair, hair net/cover too.
  84. @ColRebSez
    Stock up on food, alcohol, and anything you need to stay at home for a while. Masks are likely to be of little help but might be nice to have.

    If a doctor has prescribed you statins, start taking them now. Having lower cholesterol makes you less likely to catch a virus and viruses reproduce less effectively in people with low cholesterol. In addition, statins are a powerful anti-inflammatory and can protect organs from destruction by your body's immune system. People on statins who get the flu have half the death rate of those who don't take statins, so a big difference.

    Vitamin C is a somewhat decent antiviral and does ward off illness to some degree. When fighting a virus the body depletes Vitamin C at a fast pace, so large doses are in order. As a preventative a few hundred milligrams a day are fine.

    There are a few other drugs which work as an antiviral, including Clomid and propranolol. You can also do a Google search for any meds you are taking to see if they work off-label as an antiviral. If you are taking these drugs, don't stop now and get your scripts filled!

    I got that alcohol part covered.

  85. Lawyers, guns and money.

    • Replies: @Bard of Bumperstickers
    Gimme "Fistful of Rain" by Warren Zevon:

    When your grasp has exceeded your reach
    And you put all your faith
    In a figure of speech
    You've heard all the answers
    But the questions remain
    Grab a hold of that fistful of rain

    and

    "Desperados Under the Eaves" also by WZ:

    . . . if California slides into the ocean
    Like the mystics and statistics say it will
    I predict this motel will be standing until I pay my bill

    and

    "Narcissus and Goldmund" by Hermann Hesse:

    “We fear death, we shudder at life's instability, we grieve to see the flowers wilt again and again, and the leaves fall, and in our hearts we know that we, too, are transitory and will soon disappear. When artists create pictures and thinkers search for laws and formulate thoughts, it is in order to salvage something from the great dance of death, to make something last longer than we do.”
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Because the world is so full of death and horror, I try again and again to console my heart and pick the flowers that grow in the midst of hell.”

    https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/955995-narzi-und-goldmund

  86. @Anonymous
    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    With any luck, the bat flu will be a repeat of the Spanish Flu of the early part of the last century which killed off mostly annoying young people like yourself.

    • LOL: Hhsiii
  87. @Warner
    Coronavirus is amazing with Lyme disease.

    Well, they share a common origin story!

  88. @Sean

    Your PayPal donate link is still broken
     
    'Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;. Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world' as Ed Harris says in The Stand


    https://youtu.be/L_DOr804kBs?t=31


    ------

    1. Avoid Italian produce especially olive oil, because the Mediterranean diet will lead to you becoming a nonagenarian, and elderly enough to die of it.

    2. Extended vacation in North Sentinel Island.

    Are you crediting Stephen King for the words of W.B Yeats now?

    Sad.

    • Agree: Thea
  89. @Sam Haysom
    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    You mean something like this…?

    i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    At least the guy who responded knows how to use punctuation.

  90. @Anon7
    Prepping? Based on what? Here's the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    CDC - Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

    For comparison, here are the basic stats for the 2018-2019 regular flu season in the United States:

    - 42,900,000 people got the flu
    - 647,000 people were hospitalized
    - 61,200 died

    Worldwide, WHO estimates that 3-5 million people get very sick, and about 600,000 people die every year from the flu.

    How many of you are still panicked about COVID-2019?

    corona virus is like 1.5+ orders of magnitude deadlier than the flu. Mortality rate in china will probably end up being like 4%+

    • Replies: @Hail
    Re mortality rate,

    See the graphic posted yesterday by Anatoly Karlin:

    https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/corona-mortality-age.jpg

    These predicted death rates are based on Chinese data so far.

    - Below Age 40, 0.2% deaths among those infected
    - Age 40 to 50, 0.4% deaths " "
    - Age 50 to 60, 1.3% deaths " "
    - Age 60 to 70, 3.6% deaths (at this age-range, and definitely above it, preexisting conditions start to become a real factor).

    With advances in treatment, the chance of dying for a healthy person under age 50 may end up being less than 1 in 1,000, and that is just for those who become infected. No virus ever reaches a 100% penetration.

  91. You single fellows out there (you know who you are!) be sure to get yourselves a few dozen back issues of Big’uns for when the ISPs, cell towers, and cable companies shut down….

    • LOL: RichardTaylor
  92. So that CDC Doc Messonnier, who is pushing the Coronavirus panic button all over TV, is Rod Rosenstein’s sister? Suddenly, I’m not too concerned about Coronavirus here.

  93. Is it the Corona or is this campaign message from Mike Bloomberg a bit … unclear?
    “Pathetic racists never fail to make me laugh. Mike Bloomberg doesn’t. Paid for by &cet.”
    https://postimg.cc/064Tmf0K
    So, racists consistently cause Mike (and/or an omniscient narrator) to laugh, but Mike himself does not fail to make [God?] laugh, so … Mike is a racist?

    • Replies: @Tex

    So, racists consistently cause Mike (and/or an omniscient narrator) to laugh, but Mike himself does not fail to make [God?] laugh, so … Mike is a racist?
     
    Yes, but not a pathetic one.
  94. @Jesse
    Surprisingly, no one is mentioning vitamin B complex tablets. Vitamin B12 is the one substance you *have* to get from animal sources. If you're living on beans, lentils and rice for a while, then there's a non negligible risk of neurological damage from a lack of B12.

    Also, try for tinned rather than dried legumes. If things really, really go to hell, you need something you can empty out and grudgingly eat. A generator won't be an option for a lot of people, and dried food you can't eat defeats the purpose.

    Good for you for remembering that dried food needs to be cooked. Dried beans are wonderful in that 1 cup of dried beans becomes 3 cups of cooked beans. But they need to be boiled a long time.

    Chickpeas take forever as long as 1o hours. Black beans and red kidney beans are about the shortest times, 2 hours. Lentil and dried peas 30 minutes.

    Every winter electricity goes out. So electric stoves, crock pots micro waves are useless. Gas stoves are more reliable. All those survivalist and earthquake preparedness ideas that depending on cooking food are useless if you can’t cook.

    Canned food that is palatable cold is best. Fruit, not vegetables. Standard sweetish baked beans instead of chili beans. Canned chili is pretty bad. Cold canned Chili must be awful. Canned beets corn green beans taste good canned potatoes and spinach bad. Carrots cabbage and turnips taste just fine raw and last a long time. Be careful where you store food that isn’t canned. You’ll get rats mice and raccoons.

    We had an electric stove and a couple power outages every year when we lived in the suburbs. We didn’t bother, just ate bread cookies fruit salad I always cooked 2 fried chickens at once so there was often cold chicken. Kids always wanted to cook hotdogs in the fireplace. We did a few times.
    I bet if you put regular rice in a pot of cold water it would soften as much as if it were cooked in a day. Certainly oatmeal cream of wheat minute rice and that kraft macaroni in a box would soften up in 24 hours etc.
    In the earthquakes the food falls off the shelves and food that’s in bags and boxes gets broken and messed up.

    Palatable when cold canned food is the way to go. Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration. Then there’s canned tuna and fish.

    I don’t believe the gas and electricity needs all that much human attention. The electric substations get along with just a few people to keep adjusting the circuit flow.

    • Replies: @JMcG
    Keep food in five gallon plastic buckets with lids, that’ll keep out the rodents. I’m one of the guys that keeps the power on and gets it back on when it fails. It takes constant, around the clock care to keep it going, believe me.
    , @Servant of Gla'aki

    Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration.
     
    Ah yes, those little cans of corned beef from Argentina...wait, what?
  95. @A123
    Prepping? Grow you own veggies and tomatoes.

    You can get a pack with three different impressive non-GMO tomato seeds here:

    https://hos.ifas.ufl.edu/public/kleeweb/newcultivars.html

    This gives you back-up if there is a local issue with one variety. NOTE: They are hybrids so they will not breed true. New seed is required for each season.

    If you want plants for multiple seasons via saving your own seed, you have to go for true heirloom tomatoes, however that requires significantly more gardening skills than the hybrids.

    https://hos.ifas.ufl.edu/public/kleeweb/links.html
    _____

    I could probably dig up some links for above average gardening tools, but I don't want to give out "for profit" site links without a specific request.

    PEACE 😇
    _______

    https://hos.ifas.ufl.edu/public/kleeweb/images/flavorheadr569.jpg

    It takes 6 weeks to 3 months from seed to food. Half the country has long cold winters when nothing grows.

  96. Propably, 2% of everybody will die.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    What are you willing to lose?

    For me, toenails, 10% of my ass, my appendix ... does that add up to 2% yet?
  97. @eah
    Here's Julie Bosman of the NYT doing her part to stoke the panic -- does that name ring a bell with anyone?

    https://twitter.com/juliebosman/status/1232347242666827783

    Julie Bosman
    @juliebosman

    From @CDCgov press call: “Disruption to everyday life might be severe,”

    This is one of the problems with Twitter.

    Squeezing out tweets that are contextless to incite people, who of course do not check the (usually ungiven) source to see exactly what was said in context. The lazy Twitter followers retweet it, and it takes on a life of its own.

    The Twitterization of discourse.

    Al “Information Superhighway” Gore must be spinning in his grave.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard
    I think the (((media))) may have discovered that working to create panic is bad for the stock market and thus bad for the economy, which removes one of Trump's strongest talking points.
  98. Holy God….less than 5 minutes into the debate and they’re already talking about Putin and Russia.

    • Replies: @anon
    .less than 5 minutes into the debate and they’re already talking about Putin and Russia.


    https://media.giphy.com/media/6YXCPq9D7H6H6/giphy.gif
  99. @anon
    When I was a youngster and people were building and stocking fallout shelters my dad bought a pistol with the intent of forcing his way into a neighbors shelter if necessary. so all you really need for the present emergency are the locations of well stocked up hippies and your own weapon, as well as BBQ sauce if said hippies are vegetarians. Also plastic gloves to handle raw meat, to avoid transmitting diseases.

    Ah, someone else who bought Contingency Cannibalism from the late, great Loompanics Unlimited!

  100. @Hail

    Julie Bosman
    @juliebosman

    From @CDCgov press call: "Disruption to everyday life might be severe,"
     

    This is one of the problems with Twitter.

    Squeezing out tweets that are contextless to incite people, who of course do not check the (usually ungiven) source to see exactly what was said in context. The lazy Twitter followers retweet it, and it takes on a life of its own.

    The Twitterization of discourse.

    Al "Information Superhighway" Gore must be spinning in his grave.

    I think the (((media))) may have discovered that working to create panic is bad for the stock market and thus bad for the economy, which removes one of Trump’s strongest talking points.

    • Replies: @Anon
    I'd say the working media is genuinely frightened. They all know people in the high-risk categories or are in the high-risk categories themselves. They're also about to get their open-borders ideology right back in their faces good and hard, and they don't like being wrong. Also, most of the people they're backing for president are elderly and in the high-risk categories.

    But if the death rate is 1.3% or so, that means 98.7% of us will come out all right. If you were given a lottery ticket with a 98.7% chance of winning, you'd be thrilled.
    , @anon
    Based on some of his corona virus comments,Trump's already potentially set himself up for a McCain '08 "Economy's Strong" situation.

    A leader shouldn't try to deny this stuff, it creates deep seated loss of trust if he turns out wrong. And if pandemic doesn't occur, markets would've likely recovered from any interim decline prior to November, in which case he has gained nothing saying there's nothing to worry about.

  101. @C. Van Carter
    In my attic I've got a month's supply of delicious live bats.

  102. @Dylan
    I bought a 20 pack of N95s for $80 because I've got a pregnant wife and my in-laws are late 60s with some minor health issues. Any mitigation I'll take.

    Check local non chain hardware stores especially ones that aren’t popular. The badly run hardware store near my house has a few dozen boxes of them. I bought one today and upon consideration plan to buy more tomorrow.

    • Replies: @bigdicknick
    Bought more today....I got an off brand box, but still niosh certified. The price went up to $40 a box vs. $30 for a box of 3m yesterday. All the 3m 20 unit boxes were gone and only the 10 unit boxes were left. I know own 42 n95 masks.
  103. @Hypnotoad666
    Lawyers, guns and money.

    https://youtu.be/F2HH7J-Sx80

    Gimme “Fistful of Rain” by Warren Zevon:

    When your grasp has exceeded your reach
    And you put all your faith
    In a figure of speech
    You’ve heard all the answers
    But the questions remain
    Grab a hold of that fistful of rain

    and

    “Desperados Under the Eaves” also by WZ:

    . . . if California slides into the ocean
    Like the mystics and statistics say it will
    I predict this motel will be standing until I pay my bill

    and

    “Narcissus and Goldmund” by Hermann Hesse:

    “We fear death, we shudder at life’s instability, we grieve to see the flowers wilt again and again, and the leaves fall, and in our hearts we know that we, too, are transitory and will soon disappear. When artists create pictures and thinkers search for laws and formulate thoughts, it is in order to salvage something from the great dance of death, to make something last longer than we do.”
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “Because the world is so full of death and horror, I try again and again to console my heart and pick the flowers that grow in the midst of hell.”

    https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/955995-narzi-und-goldmund

  104. @J.Ross
    God damn it Steve, even if this is a joke, this here is the most boomer post ever. Apply normal hygeine precautions, remember SARS, and don't panic. Surely Beijing is lying but this is probably nothing
    --------
    List anyway:
    Chloroquin, which [ahem] appears to cure this; it worked on SARS. It's an old anti-malarial, proven and very widely available. Grep enough for ten days at 500mg. As with antibiotics, do not stop dosing when symptoms clear up.
    If all the rumors are true, including the one about six months of purging unbelievers:
    That American-Canadian herring (is it Bar Harbor?), Spanish octopus, Georgian caviar, Georgian wine, Russian caviar, Japanese mackeral, Litvak sprats, Spanish chorizo, Romanian trout, white tuna, King Oscar sardines, and Deming salmon; spring water (I assume you have filters as well), rices (especially sushi, basmati, wild, and black), red kidney beans, red lentils, green lentils, olive oil, kimchi, real sauerkraut, щи (in frozen but separated bricks), pickles, olives, a tent, a Perception Keowee sub-kayak with paddle and skirt and vehicle mounting, raw onions (for purging the membranes), ziplocs in varying sizes, disposable plates and cutlery, a sjambok, a machete, a Mora, a WWI German butcher bayonet, a Dutch oven, a pellet heater, water purification tablets, bleach, gasoline, a generator, a Faraday cage, Siberian restorative herbs, Lugol's iodine, 5-HTP, NooPep, turmeric, duct tape, a kugelwagen (with a technical conversion, twin 50 cal at least), adult multi-vitamins, those new powderized vegetable pills, gmo-free beet powder, the really good more expensive first aid kit, Padron cigars with lighters and clippers, a S&W M&P II with four mags and 500 rounds of .223, a South African harness, a Coonan Classic with 300 rounds of .357 magnum, a decent Tikka in .308 with 150 rounds, an aquaponics setup, flashcards and pens (be able to communicate without internet or physical contact), bowls, a Chinese tactical shovel, flashlight and rechargeable batteries, sturdy garbage bags, marihuana (to be able to trade with hippie scum), oregano (to be able to mess with hippie scum), beads (to be able to trade wirh Indians), Luksosowa, Laphraoig, Mio sparking sake, Spanish Cava, a cow, two goats, six SILENT chickens, two roosters, normal soap, Castille soap, toilet paper, latex gloves (or another material if allergic), face masks (if infected*), and (of course) zinc.
    Slim-Fast is disgusting and unhealthy but (weakly) replaces a meal and keeps long at room temperature.
    All, for half a year.
    Avoid things which absorb moisture or will not keep, which includes improperly stored onions, and definitely most breads, crackers, cereals, etc.. Dairy runs out when it runs out: be able to drop it as a nutrient. Freezing milk gives mixed results.
    *Face masks are for the infected, to courteously prevent further spread. Shinobiying everywhere in a mask will not protect you.
    Skip that "vertical potato field" box. It works only with one kind of rapidly-growing potato.

    I can only gaze in the stunned silence which naturally accompanies one’s first glimpse of the supernatural. This list is right up there with the original Mall Ninja posts. Sir, you have excelled yourself. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

  105. @Wazoo
    I wouldn’t wear contact lenses for the duration of the crisis. The Coronavirus can enter your body when you rub or touch your eyes.

    hmmm… well, i don’t really touch my eyes during the day, but it’s a good point. If things become “degraded” maybe i would.

    i should finally order myself some glasses. (due to laziness I’ve become contacts-only the past few years)

  106. @Anon7
    Prepping? Based on what? Here's the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    CDC - Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

    For comparison, here are the basic stats for the 2018-2019 regular flu season in the United States:

    - 42,900,000 people got the flu
    - 647,000 people were hospitalized
    - 61,200 died

    Worldwide, WHO estimates that 3-5 million people get very sick, and about 600,000 people die every year from the flu.

    How many of you are still panicked about COVID-2019?

    The issue is Iran.

    It actually looked like China possibly had it under control. But apparently Iran’s been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it’s spread from there to there whole middle East. There’s no way Iran’s going to be able to do China style containment so it’s probably going to become endemic there and then the rest of Middle East and South Asia and Africa.

    And at that point it’s just a matter of time until it gets everywhere else, including here and back into China from the outside.

    • Agree: Servant of Gla'aki
    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard
    Iran has a significant population of men with lungs that were affected by chemical weapons used during the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq War.

    I expect that group to get hit hard and distort the numbers for a few weeks.
    , @Joe Schmoe

    But apparently Iran’s been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it’s spread from there to there whole middle East.
     
    ...be a shame if this wiped out the middle east...
    , @Jack Henson
    Imagine believing the numbers out of China.
  107. @Lot
    I think the chart isn’t about infection risk directly but how many each population has, on average, of the 6 “higher ACE” genes.

    So the Japanese have 5.5 on average, Italians 3.

    You can check some of these yourself if you’ve done 23andme.

    I won’t pretend I understand what the table means in technical terms, but I do have 23andMe.

    I plugged in “ACE2” into the 23andMe search box. They list thirteen Markers (SNP) for ACE2 genes and give one column called “Your Genotype,” with either a letter (indicating you have it, I think) or the phrase “not genotyped.”

    I have 3 letters; 10 “not genotyped.”

    This puts me, as expected, with Europe. On whatever this is supposed to measure.

    • Replies: @Travis
    not genotyped means they did not test this SNP for you.

    23andme keeps changing the chips they use and changing the SNPs they genotype.

    My test was done on the V3 chip and I have results for 11 of the 13 ACE2 genes.
    My daughter was tested with the V4 chip and has the same results as you , just 3 were genotyped
  108. @RichardTaylor
    Find out where your local FEMA is and be ready to run toward it. :)

    People of Color are known for their warmth and generosity. If there are communities with large numbers of people of color,go there for help.
    They will gladly share what they have.

    • Thanks: HammerJack
    • LOL: JMcG
  109. @bigdicknick
    corona virus is like 1.5+ orders of magnitude deadlier than the flu. Mortality rate in china will probably end up being like 4%+

    Re mortality rate,

    See the graphic posted yesterday by Anatoly Karlin:

    These predicted death rates are based on Chinese data so far.

    – Below Age 40, 0.2% deaths among those infected
    – Age 40 to 50, 0.4% deaths ” ”
    – Age 50 to 60, 1.3% deaths ” ”
    – Age 60 to 70, 3.6% deaths (at this age-range, and definitely above it, preexisting conditions start to become a real factor).

    With advances in treatment, the chance of dying for a healthy person under age 50 may end up being less than 1 in 1,000, and that is just for those who become infected. No virus ever reaches a 100% penetration.

    • Replies: @PennTothal
    It would be useful to see these mortality rates broken out for smokers versus non-smokers.

    It would seem that adult non-smokers under age 60 who take common-sense rest and re-hydration when they fall ill (unlike those poor Chinese doctors driven by work-work-work ethos to work themselves to death) are highly likely to survive this infection.
    , @bigdicknick
    the flu probably has a similar age based pattern so we are still talking about something that is like 50x deadlier than a flu.
  110. Things are looking dark for Assange, and proven dark by abysmal under-reporting:
    https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2020/02/your-man-in-the-public-gallery-assange-hearing-day-1/

    The points which Lewis wished the media to know were these: it is not true that mainstream outlets like the Guardian and New York Times are also threatened by the charges against Assange, because Assange was not charged with publishing the cables but only with publishing the names of informants, and with cultivating Manning and assisting him to attempt computer hacking. Only Assange had done these things, not mainstream outlets.

    Following an adjournment, magistrate Baraitser questioned the prosecution on the veracity of some of these claims. In particular, the claim that newspapers were not in the same position because Assange was charged not with publication, but with “aiding and abetting” Chelsea Manning in getting the material, did not seem consistent with Lewis’ reading of the 1989 Official Secrets Act, which said that merely obtaining and publishing any government secret was an offence. Surely, Baraitser suggested, that meant that newspapers just publishing the Manning leaks would be guilty of an offence?

    This appeared to catch Lewis entirely off guard. The last thing he had expected was any perspicacity from Baraitser, whose job was just to do what he said. Lewis hummed and hawed, put his glasses on and off several times, adjusted his microphone repeatedly and picked up a succession of pieces of paper from his brief, each of which appeared to surprise him by its contents, as he waved them haplessly in the air and said he really should have cited the Shayler case but couldn’t find it. It was liking watching Columbo with none of the charm and without the killer question at the end of the process.

    Suddenly Lewis appeared to come to a decision. Yes, he said much more firmly. The 1989 Official Secrets Act had been introduced by the Thatcher Government after the Ponting Case, specifically to remove the public interest defence and to make unauthorised possession of an official secret a crime of strict liability – meaning no matter how you got it, publishing and even possessing made you guilty. Therefore, under the principle of dual criminality, Assange was liable for extradition whether or not he had aided and abetted Manning. Lewis then went on to add that any journalist and any publication that printed the official secret would therefore also be committing an offence, no matter how they had obtained it, and no matter if it did or did not name informants.

    Lewis had thus just flat out contradicted his entire opening statement to the media stating that they need not worry as the Assange charges could never be applied to them. And he did so straight after the adjournment, immediately after his team had handed out copies of the argument he had now just completely contradicted. I cannot think it has often happened in court that a senior lawyer has proven himself so absolutely and so immediately to be an unmitigated and ill-motivated liar. This was undoubtedly the most breathtaking moment in today’s court hearing.

  111. @Anonymous
    When shortages occur, the last government organization you will be able to depend upon is the police. When the police are overloaded, and people need food or other resources, they will invade your home to get it. If you’re not handy with firearms, just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.

    Stock up on toilet paper, bottled water, canned and dry goods.

    Stay away from fast food places, Home Depot, Lowe’s–anyplace that supports illegal aliens. Now is not the time for a kitchen rehab.

    Avoid the city of Arcadia.

    just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.

    Joe Biden is that you?

    Yes a shotgun is a good home defense weapon. But at typical inside the house distances you do still have to aim. At 12 feet, you will have a 2-4″ spread using buckshot. At 20 yards, depending on the shell you are using, your spread will be anywhere from 9-17 inches.

    Remember, all of those projectiles coming out of the muzzle of that shotgun are your responsibility. Buckshot will penetrate multiple sheetrock walls. So be careful if the badguy is standing in front of your kid’s bedroom or the room your wife is in.

    Birdshot is for birds, not badguys.

  112. @Hail
    Re mortality rate,

    See the graphic posted yesterday by Anatoly Karlin:

    https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/corona-mortality-age.jpg

    These predicted death rates are based on Chinese data so far.

    - Below Age 40, 0.2% deaths among those infected
    - Age 40 to 50, 0.4% deaths " "
    - Age 50 to 60, 1.3% deaths " "
    - Age 60 to 70, 3.6% deaths (at this age-range, and definitely above it, preexisting conditions start to become a real factor).

    With advances in treatment, the chance of dying for a healthy person under age 50 may end up being less than 1 in 1,000, and that is just for those who become infected. No virus ever reaches a 100% penetration.

    It would be useful to see these mortality rates broken out for smokers versus non-smokers.

    It would seem that adult non-smokers under age 60 who take common-sense rest and re-hydration when they fall ill (unlike those poor Chinese doctors driven by work-work-work ethos to work themselves to death) are highly likely to survive this infection.

    • Agree: Hail
  113. Stay off the moors, Steve.

    Stay on the road…

  114. @Anon7
    Prepping? Based on what? Here's the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    CDC - Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

    For comparison, here are the basic stats for the 2018-2019 regular flu season in the United States:

    - 42,900,000 people got the flu
    - 647,000 people were hospitalized
    - 61,200 died

    Worldwide, WHO estimates that 3-5 million people get very sick, and about 600,000 people die every year from the flu.

    How many of you are still panicked about COVID-2019?

    Prepping? Based on what?

    Based on being prepared. Earthquakes, ice storms, tropical storms, floods and yes quarantine from pandemic are all things that might happen where I live.

    Ten years ago, I went 30 days without power from an ice storm. During that ice storm, one Dollar Store in a county of 70,000 people had power and could do business. Their shelves were empty that first day. Was a week before the banks would let you take out more than $75 cash, and for that first week anything you wanted to buy was a cash transaction.

    The year katrina hit, I went 3 days without power after a tropical storm that had been a hurricane blew over where I live.

    Last summer during one of the hurricanes, a Dindu American was being interviewed on the news. It was two days after the storm had hit and no one in her building had food. They were standing around waiting for someone to feed them.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    The San Fernando Valley was hit by medium size earthquakes in 1971 and 1994 -- no more than 100 deaths.

    Nothing since.

    , @Autochthon
    While the idiots were at the Dollar General, the people who had their shit together of course just put the Pewags on their vehicles of choice and drove until they escaped the conditions....
    , @anon
    Bad luck seems to follow you, buddy! Nothing personal but I'm steering clear of your house.
    , @bigdicknick
    dindu prepping i guess.
  115. You guys need this ’58 Lincoln. It’s gigantic and perfect for plowing through hordes of infected attackers that will soon be roaming the streets. And it’s on eBay right now for $3500. Doesn’t run, but when you get it running, it has the much needed points ignition that I’ve mentioned before for the inevitable solar flares that will occur during the pandemic.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/1958-Lincoln-Premier/223924216033?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3Dfdb48f806ad54562836451a0a5a9f744%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D15%26mehot%3Dnone%26sd%3D174200610274%26itm%3D223924216033%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2380057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3Ad667a493-583c-11ea-a105-74dbd180361b%7Cparentrq%3A7f40612a1700a446c35251cefff72b54%7Ciid%3A1

    • Thanks: HammerJack
    • LOL: ThreeCranes
    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Hell no.

    Get a Land Rover or a Jeep and do a Mercedes, Perkins, or SD Nissan Diesel conversion, or a seventies squarebody Chevy truck with a 53 Series Detroit Diesel. They run with no electrics at all and will burn any grade of diesel fuel, jet fuel or kerosene with a little oil in it, or any of several biodiesels or vegetable oils. If a stock vehicle must be bought get an IH Scout with the SD33t or a Mercedes sedan with an OM616 or OM617.
  116. @Steve in Greensboro
    Stay away from people?

    That's good advice regardless of the virus load in the environment.

    Good advice! Also try not to be over 65 years old of age and/or have a pre-existing condition. Do not smoke. Live in a sunny environment with high temperatures.

  117. Stand erect,feet spread about shoulder width.
    Slowly bend forward as far as possible…and kiss your ass goodbye.

  118. @Sam Haysom
    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    (and ATate and anyone else to whom my words apply)

    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    Imagine being as psychopathic as to write, seemingly without any provocation,

    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    Imagine then completely ignoring such malignant effrontery but choosing to single-out for ridicule the reaction it provoked.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don't see an argument against that.
  119. @C. Van Carter
    In my attic I've got a month's supply of delicious live bats.

    The German cinema needs you!

  120. @SunBakedSuburb
    "Food and vital medicines."

    Also wooden stakes, silver bullets, and garlic. Because some who are infected with the virus become vampires. Richard Matheson previsioned the current apocalypse in his novel I Am Legend. The garlic is for you -- good for the immune system.

    For Steve – THE Prepper’s Anthem, best of all time, by Corb Lund out of Alberta, Canada:

    When the oil stops, everything stops, nothing left in the fountain.
    Nobody wants paper money son, so you just well stop countin’.
    Can you break the horse, can you light the fire, what’s that I beg your pardon?
    You best start thinking where food comes from and I hope you tend a good garden.

    Getting down on the mountain, getting down on the mountain.
    Don’t wanna be around when the shit goes down.
    I’ll be gettin’ on down the mountain.

    When the truck don’t run, the bread don’t come, have a hard time finding petrol.
    Water ain’t runnin’ in the city no more, do hold any precious metal?
    Can you gut the fish, can you read the sky, whats that about over crowdin’?
    You ever seen a man who’s kids ain’t ate for 17 days and countin’?

    Getting down on the mountain, getting down on the mountain.
    Don’t wanna be around when the shit goes down.
    I’ll be goin’ to ground on the mountain.

    There ain’t no heat, and the powers gone out It’s kerosene lamps and candles.
    The roads are blocked. Its all grid-locked. You got a short wave handle?
    Can you track the deer, can you dig the well, couldn’t quite hear your answer?
    I think I see a rip in the social fabric, brother can you spare some ammo?

    Just because you had to get into this Zombie business, SBS, here’s another by this band:

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard
    Corb Lund is a Canadian national treasure.
  121. @J.Ross
    God damn it Steve, even if this is a joke, this here is the most boomer post ever. Apply normal hygeine precautions, remember SARS, and don't panic. Surely Beijing is lying but this is probably nothing
    --------
    List anyway:
    Chloroquin, which [ahem] appears to cure this; it worked on SARS. It's an old anti-malarial, proven and very widely available. Grep enough for ten days at 500mg. As with antibiotics, do not stop dosing when symptoms clear up.
    If all the rumors are true, including the one about six months of purging unbelievers:
    That American-Canadian herring (is it Bar Harbor?), Spanish octopus, Georgian caviar, Georgian wine, Russian caviar, Japanese mackeral, Litvak sprats, Spanish chorizo, Romanian trout, white tuna, King Oscar sardines, and Deming salmon; spring water (I assume you have filters as well), rices (especially sushi, basmati, wild, and black), red kidney beans, red lentils, green lentils, olive oil, kimchi, real sauerkraut, щи (in frozen but separated bricks), pickles, olives, a tent, a Perception Keowee sub-kayak with paddle and skirt and vehicle mounting, raw onions (for purging the membranes), ziplocs in varying sizes, disposable plates and cutlery, a sjambok, a machete, a Mora, a WWI German butcher bayonet, a Dutch oven, a pellet heater, water purification tablets, bleach, gasoline, a generator, a Faraday cage, Siberian restorative herbs, Lugol's iodine, 5-HTP, NooPep, turmeric, duct tape, a kugelwagen (with a technical conversion, twin 50 cal at least), adult multi-vitamins, those new powderized vegetable pills, gmo-free beet powder, the really good more expensive first aid kit, Padron cigars with lighters and clippers, a S&W M&P II with four mags and 500 rounds of .223, a South African harness, a Coonan Classic with 300 rounds of .357 magnum, a decent Tikka in .308 with 150 rounds, an aquaponics setup, flashcards and pens (be able to communicate without internet or physical contact), bowls, a Chinese tactical shovel, flashlight and rechargeable batteries, sturdy garbage bags, marihuana (to be able to trade with hippie scum), oregano (to be able to mess with hippie scum), beads (to be able to trade wirh Indians), Luksosowa, Laphraoig, Mio sparking sake, Spanish Cava, a cow, two goats, six SILENT chickens, two roosters, normal soap, Castille soap, toilet paper, latex gloves (or another material if allergic), face masks (if infected*), and (of course) zinc.
    Slim-Fast is disgusting and unhealthy but (weakly) replaces a meal and keeps long at room temperature.
    All, for half a year.
    Avoid things which absorb moisture or will not keep, which includes improperly stored onions, and definitely most breads, crackers, cereals, etc.. Dairy runs out when it runs out: be able to drop it as a nutrient. Freezing milk gives mixed results.
    *Face masks are for the infected, to courteously prevent further spread. Shinobiying everywhere in a mask will not protect you.
    Skip that "vertical potato field" box. It works only with one kind of rapidly-growing potato.

    What was the middle part again?

    • LOL: HammerJack
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Just remember "Chloroquin."
  122. @Hail
    Re mortality rate,

    See the graphic posted yesterday by Anatoly Karlin:

    https://www.unz.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/corona-mortality-age.jpg

    These predicted death rates are based on Chinese data so far.

    - Below Age 40, 0.2% deaths among those infected
    - Age 40 to 50, 0.4% deaths " "
    - Age 50 to 60, 1.3% deaths " "
    - Age 60 to 70, 3.6% deaths (at this age-range, and definitely above it, preexisting conditions start to become a real factor).

    With advances in treatment, the chance of dying for a healthy person under age 50 may end up being less than 1 in 1,000, and that is just for those who become infected. No virus ever reaches a 100% penetration.

    the flu probably has a similar age based pattern so we are still talking about something that is like 50x deadlier than a flu.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Hard to tell right now because there seem to be many asymptomatic infections. If we factored those in, it might be closer to flu levels.
    , @Hail
    It might be useful to think of it as Super Flu; but, then, how many doctors die of flu?

    50x deadlier than a flu
     
    More data needed, but what I am seeing is it could be as low as 10x deadlier, or up to as high 40x or 50x deadlier, than the usual seasonal flu.

    If, in a bad year, 10% of US residents get regular seasonal flu (33.5 million), of whom 20,000 die, this new flu could mean 200,000 would die, in a good-case scenario.

  123. How can you talk about disease at all when sentient animate humanity-hating weapons (presumably under orders from AM) have halved our national population?
    https://postimg.cc/gXSKf4Nc

  124. anon[372] • Disclaimer says:

    Thucydides on the Plague:

    Men now coolly ventured on what they had formerly done in a corner, and not just as they pleased, seeing the rapid transitions produced by persons in prosperity suddenly dying and those who before had nothing succeeding to their property. So they resolved to spend quickly and enjoy themselves, regarding their lives and riches as alike things of a day. Perseverance in what men called honour was popular with none, it was so uncertain whether they would be spared to attain the object; but it was settled that present enjoyment, and all that contributed to it, was both honourable and useful. Fear of gods or law of man there was none to restrain them. As for the first, they judged it to be just the same whether they worshipped them or not, as they saw all alike perishing; and for the last, no one expected to live to be brought to trial for his offences, but each felt that a far severer sentence had been already passed upon them all and hung ever over their heads, and before this fell it was only reasonable to enjoy life a little.

  125. @Dissident
    (and ATate and anyone else to whom my words apply)

    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.
     
    Imagine being as psychopathic as to write, seemingly without any provocation,

    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     

    Imagine then completely ignoring such malignant effrontery but choosing to single-out for ridicule the reaction it provoked.

    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don’t see an argument against that.

    • Agree: Almost Missouri
    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    One of many arguments "against that" is that it's painting with a ridiculously large brush.
    People born in 1964 have very little in common with those born in 1946.
    Speaking as one of the latter I wish I'd been one of the former.
    , @Dissident
    [Anonymous[409] wrote:

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I replied with condemnation, characterizing the expressed sentiments as psychopathic.
    J.Ross then replied to me:

    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don’t see an argument against that.
     
    Have you considered that the generations below you may one day say the same about you and your generation? That you will be considered more of a burden and liability than a blessing and an asset? Should that happen, are you agreeable to the idea of, say, being euthanized? For the benefit of the younger generations; the greater good, of course.

    Is that not the logical conclusion of your thinking?

    Such sentiments, from an individual who for a long time seemingly endorsed and promoted 4Chan and Chateau Heartiste, should perhaps not come as much of a surprise. But for a number of the others who have now endorsed, echoed and expanded upon the statements I quoted above? For someone as seemingly mature, thoughtful, educated, and articulate as Almost Missouri? I am reminded of the thread, from sometime within the past few months or so, on Ezekiel Emmanuel's long-infamous declaration to the effect that individuals above a certain age (75?) are not worth the expense of keeping alive. Among the considerable number of comments that I recall as expressing support for this view, were at least two from regular comment-posters who purport to be devout Christians (one of the two stands-out for perhaps being the most self-anointed and harshly judgemental of any of the regular comment-posters I have come across here). I was absolutely shocked by this and since witnessing it, have wanted to challenge those individuals as follows. Doesn't Christianity hold all life, from the moment of conception to death, to be absolutely sacred?

  126. @Chris Mallory

    Prepping? Based on what?
     
    Based on being prepared. Earthquakes, ice storms, tropical storms, floods and yes quarantine from pandemic are all things that might happen where I live.

    Ten years ago, I went 30 days without power from an ice storm. During that ice storm, one Dollar Store in a county of 70,000 people had power and could do business. Their shelves were empty that first day. Was a week before the banks would let you take out more than $75 cash, and for that first week anything you wanted to buy was a cash transaction.

    The year katrina hit, I went 3 days without power after a tropical storm that had been a hurricane blew over where I live.

    Last summer during one of the hurricanes, a Dindu American was being interviewed on the news. It was two days after the storm had hit and no one in her building had food. They were standing around waiting for someone to feed them.

    The San Fernando Valley was hit by medium size earthquakes in 1971 and 1994 — no more than 100 deaths.

    Nothing since.

  127. @Achmed E. Newman
    What was the middle part again?

    Just remember “Chloroquin.”

  128. @JMcG
    Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.

    Question: Given that it is a pandemic and that no man is an island, we are all, everyone, going to be exposed to Coronavirus eventually, and most of us will survive. So what is the point of delaying the inevitable and hobbling ourselves with a debilitating self-quarantine? Are we hoping for a vaccine to rescue us before we personally are exposed? Any vaccine won’t come in time, and even if it did, I would hardly trust it. Better to face the music now and get it over with, rather than live a twilight existence and end up facing the same illness anyway.

    I understand that some of us have sickly or elderly friends and relations, and that for their sakes we don’t want to hasten their demise, so we keep ourselves hygienic and our gratuitous contacts limited. But for those of us who are healthy now, are we going to be more healthy facing the virus after six months of living underground on canned food? Isn’t it better to face it sooner, fresh and strong, than later, fearful and weakened?

    • Replies: @JMcG
    I don’t really think it’s going to be that bad, but Steve asked what to stock up on. That’s what I responded with. I pulled all my money out of stocks a week ago too. We all owe God a death, no sense fretting about it too much.
    , @Lugash
    There's speculation that you can easily be reinfected with a different strain of Covid-19 and that the reinfection is what's more deadly.
    , @Bill

    So what is the point of delaying the inevitable
     
    You want to be infected either early or late, not in the middle. In the middle, the ICUs are full and there are no ventilators available.
  129. @bigdicknick
    the flu probably has a similar age based pattern so we are still talking about something that is like 50x deadlier than a flu.

    Hard to tell right now because there seem to be many asymptomatic infections. If we factored those in, it might be closer to flu levels.

    • Replies: @Hail

    Hard to tell right now because there seem to be many asymptomatic infections. If we factored those in, it might be closer to flu levels.
     
    The biggest set of data we have on COVID19, outside the Chinese Communist Party-controlled health bureaucracy, is South Korea.

    As of today:

    46,000 South Koreans have been tested, mainly cases stemming from the Shinchonji armageddon cult, either cult members or close-quarter-contacts of cult members.
    - 28,247 found not infected;
    - 16,734 results pending;
    - 1,146 infected
    -- > of whom, 12 have died;
    -- > of whom, 22 have been certified fully recovered, no longer virus carriers, and released. These are the earlier cases, e.g. return-travelers from China diagnosed in January; not associated with the Shinchonji Doomsday Cult superspreader events); the large majority, 1,100 people, remain under quarantine.

    FWIW, the infection rate among people coming into fairly close contact with a carrier of the virus appears to be only 4% -- [infected]/([infected]+[tested-but-not-infected]) -- though the odds would obviously (naturally) rise with prolonged contact.

    The death rate stands at 1% there.

  130. @Chris Mallory

    Prepping? Based on what?
     
    Based on being prepared. Earthquakes, ice storms, tropical storms, floods and yes quarantine from pandemic are all things that might happen where I live.

    Ten years ago, I went 30 days without power from an ice storm. During that ice storm, one Dollar Store in a county of 70,000 people had power and could do business. Their shelves were empty that first day. Was a week before the banks would let you take out more than $75 cash, and for that first week anything you wanted to buy was a cash transaction.

    The year katrina hit, I went 3 days without power after a tropical storm that had been a hurricane blew over where I live.

    Last summer during one of the hurricanes, a Dindu American was being interviewed on the news. It was two days after the storm had hit and no one in her building had food. They were standing around waiting for someone to feed them.

    While the idiots were at the Dollar General, the people who had their shit together of course just put the Pewags on their vehicles of choice and drove until they escaped the conditions….

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
    Only if you had a chainsaw and a 4wheel drive. Most roads had multiple trees down on them.
  131. @Jack D
    Somehow I was able to order N95s from Home Depot online for (free) home delivery. They were like 3 for $10, Milwaukee (re)brand and marked Made in India. They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing.

    American science and surplus has a case of 50 for 18 bucks.

  132. @bigdicknick
    the flu probably has a similar age based pattern so we are still talking about something that is like 50x deadlier than a flu.

    It might be useful to think of it as Super Flu; but, then, how many doctors die of flu?

    50x deadlier than a flu

    More data needed, but what I am seeing is it could be as low as 10x deadlier, or up to as high 40x or 50x deadlier, than the usual seasonal flu.

    If, in a bad year, 10% of US residents get regular seasonal flu (33.5 million), of whom 20,000 die, this new flu could mean 200,000 would die, in a good-case scenario.

  133. @The Wild Geese Howard
    Holy God....less than 5 minutes into the debate and they're already talking about Putin and Russia.

    .less than 5 minutes into the debate and they’re already talking about Putin and Russia.

  134. @Anonymous

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I’m an extremely healthy boomer. I’ve worked out for years. Far more than you. Resting pulse is 58. Semi-retired. I don’t have to work. I can most likely buy and sell the likes of you.

    To me, you, in your mid-twenties, are essentially a happy, aimless fucktard. You are the outcome of too many boomers having too many babies. You were likely raised poorly. That is, you don’t even know how weak you are. You’re just a happy camper, taking up an annoying amount of space on the freeway in your shitty little Toyota Carolla.

    Probably the biggest problem I have with your lot is most of you are ingrates.

    You shouldn’t be here. Most of you were a mistake, who went on to thrive because post birth abortions are still against the law in this country, no matter how strong a mournful parents argument might be, and don’t think your parents didn’t have an iron-clad moral, ethical case for a pillow pressed passionately against your baby head.

    Look in the mirror today, and instead of being repulsed, be grateful.

    We let you live, to allow you to give life your best shot. You squandering it in front of a video game console isn’t our fault. It’s what we roughly predicted.

    This is satire right?

  135. Two things happened in the last few days that shook me enough to become wary:

    1. Yesterday I went to the doctor’s office for a routine office visit. It’s downtown in a big city. The entire front desk crew was wearing masks (!) and asking everyone who checked in about their past 3 weeks of travel, and whether they’d had any contact with China or anyone who’d been in China in that time (!).

    2. Today I went to a large Home Depot in a normal suburban city. Asked where the face masks were. They were all sold out (!) unless I wanted a respirator one.

    At that point, I ran to the local supermarket and bought a ton of rice, beans, and a case of water, and a siphon tube, and texted friends and family to do the same. I filled up my gas tank, too, and will keep it no lower than 3/4 for the foreseeable future.

    And this was before the CDC came out today and told us all it was going to get worse, which the HHS promptly tried to walk back.

    I don’t have any guns (heavy blue area), but I sure as heck have some sharp pointy tools that look scary as weapons, and have been used as weapons in past wars.

    It’s going to get worse in the next 5 days merely from panic. Tomorrow I’ll go out and grab more rice, beans, water, and OTC medicine from the store. I’ll also grab a gas can if I can and fill that up with extra gas. And then plot out a Get Out Of Dodge route to at least two remote places.

    I’m a bit paranoid normally, but this is well beyond my usual. The panic–the stripping of store shelves, and the violence as people fight for food and other goods, the young dudes who form gangs to abuse people—will hurt far more people than the disease.

    God bless us all. Lent starts tomorrow. Time to pray.

    P.S. And if you do try to flee your area, leave as soon as possible and leave at the crack of dawn. Bad guys don’t get up early in the morning, they prowl and party at night.

  136. @Whiskey
    Black pilled Eeyore that's me. Afraid of women no. Dislike idiot feminist lunacy like nails on a chalkboard yes.

    As for guns ammo, you better have it. Periodically police run away: Rodney King and Freddy Gray riots, Criwn Heights, etc. Expect 3-5 days of wilding. The Purge movies in real life. No cops right there ... it's free crime day.

    You know who I am talking about. Better have ammo.

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.

    An epidemic police will be gone for months not days and you will be alone with the vibrant diverse.

    You'd damned well better be armed son!

    Once you reach a certain level of neighborhood affluence, you price out the cops. Which means they live somewhere else so any interruption in gas means they aren’t getting to work, and now the affluent have no police protection.

    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    True enough, but not particularly relevant. Because even a 20% increase in demand means cops aren't available anyway.
  137. Anon[324] • Disclaimer says:
    @JMcG
    Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.

    Non-perishable food basically.

    Some ideas:

    — Long lasting vegetables: potatoes, onions, carrots, cabbage

    — Last a while vegetables and fruit and other: garlic, apples, still green bananas; cheese

    — Seasonings: Salt, pepper, red chiles or flakes, Tabasco, jalapeno slices, soy sauce, powdered and whole cumin, powdered coriander, turmeric, cayenne, bay leaves, saffron, garam masala, chicken consomme cubes; bottled salsa; grow your own basil and cilantro

    [MORE]

    — Olive oil, Canola, butter, honey or sugar

    — Meat, poultry, and sausage, pre-cut, ziplocked, and frozen; refrigerated ham and bacon

    — Frozen vegetables: blanched broccoli and minced ginger, for example

    — Rice, long and short grain; canned or dry kidney or other beans; frozen tortillas

    — Canned and frozen vegetables

    — Canned and bottled beverages

    — Appliances: rice cooker, electric pressure cooker or slow cooker, bread machine

    Plan for some basic meals, mostly 1 pot or pressure cooker:

    — Pasta needs pasta, canned tomatoes, salt, pepper, garlic, olive oil

    — Various potatoes and meat dishes: stew, nikujaga

    — Curries: lots of onions, garlic, some tomato, spices, meat or vegetables

    — Minestrone: chicken consomme, bacon or ham, small pasta, vegetables

    — Arroz con pollo: chicken, short grained rice, diced peppers or canned peppers, saffron

    — Bread: flour (bread and regular), salt, dry yeast

    — Burritos: At their simplest, refried beans (pintos in oil smashed with a potato masher), cheese melted in, and bottled salsa and jalapenos, in tortillas, taco style if small

    This will keep you from spending too much time in the markets or in restaurants. You’ll find you need stuff, but you can take make a list and take quick, targeted shopping runs rather than wander around the grocery store.

  138. @Lugash
    Food and vital medicines. Doing what you can to to stay out of the public is really the most important right now.

    Vitamin C. I bought two bottles of something by Nature Made called Super C Immune Complex that contains Vitamins A, C, D, E and Zinc to help support the immune system.

  139. @Smithsonian_2

    Prepping? Based on what? Here’s the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426
     
    You have heard of the saying "don't watch what they say, watch what they do?". Watch what the Chinese are *doing*. You think that they would quarantine 750,000,000 people for the flu?

    Prudent measures should be taken, and are being taken. In the meantime, factories are reopening in China already. The ChiComs need to balance maintaining control over their own people (they can’t be seen as entirely uncaring) with the negative publicity effect this virus is having on people around the world. Many are beginning to doubt whether they really want close ties with China, or to be so dependent on China’s factories.

    Most of the coronavirus doomsayers can’t wait for the stock market to decline even further, possibly triggering the recession that Democrats are praying for. They’re pretty tired of listening to Trump talking about the economy.

    Failing that, CoronaGate (tm; you heard it here first) will be used against him no matter what happens. The same people who ginned up the Russia collusion story have been hyping the virus.

    Trump IS vulnerable on this issue; as I wrote here about a month ago:

    Personally, I think that President Trump blew the political response, which should have been to get out in front of the do-nothing Democrats and show an excess of caution, even if it wasn’t really warranted scientifically.

  140. @Anonymous
    Hard to tell right now because there seem to be many asymptomatic infections. If we factored those in, it might be closer to flu levels.

    Hard to tell right now because there seem to be many asymptomatic infections. If we factored those in, it might be closer to flu levels.

    The biggest set of data we have on COVID19, outside the Chinese Communist Party-controlled health bureaucracy, is South Korea.

    As of today:

    46,000 South Koreans have been tested, mainly cases stemming from the Shinchonji armageddon cult, either cult members or close-quarter-contacts of cult members.
    – 28,247 found not infected;
    – 16,734 results pending;
    – 1,146 infected
    — > of whom, 12 have died;
    — > of whom, 22 have been certified fully recovered, no longer virus carriers, and released. These are the earlier cases, e.g. return-travelers from China diagnosed in January; not associated with the Shinchonji Doomsday Cult superspreader events); the large majority, 1,100 people, remain under quarantine.

    FWIW, the infection rate among people coming into fairly close contact with a carrier of the virus appears to be only 4% — [infected]/([infected]+[tested-but-not-infected]) — though the odds would obviously (naturally) rise with prolonged contact.

    The death rate stands at 1% there.

    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
    The biggest fears right now are as follows, most serious first:

    1. Supply chain disruption---especially medicine, but also food. The human race and the global economy cannot stand China suddenly stop producing at this time.

    2. Panic---see the Milan markets barren thanks to the outbreak. And see the LA riots.

    3. Actual death and suffering from the disease itself.
  141. @Dissident
    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Earth Abides is a 1949 post-apocalyptic science fiction novel by American writer George R. Stewart. It tells the story of the fall of civilization from deadly disease and its rebirth. The story was set in the United States in the 1940s in Berkeley, California and told by a character, Isherwood Williams, who emerges from isolation in the mountains to find almost everyone dead. [...]

    In November 1950, it was adapted for the CBS radio program Escape as a two-part drama starring John Dehner.
     

    I have not read the book but found the radio version, which can be found here (episodes # 148 and #149) quite good. Perhaps needless to say, I hope and pray that what we are facing now will not come to anything near what is portrayed in that drama.

    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Yes, that was a great two-episode Suspense production. John Dehner as Isherwood.

    • Replies: @Dissident

    Yes, that was a great two-episode Suspense production.
     
    Didn't you mean to write Escape?

    There were a number of scripts that were performed by both Suspense! and Escape. But to the best of my knowledge, Earth Abides is not among them.

    At any rate, it is great to finally see others here who appreciate Old Time Radio.

  142. Anon[416] • Disclaimer says:

    LECTURE TIME:

    HOW TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR MUCOUS MEMBRANES.

    Yes, it is possible to do something about this. The human body makes mucous membranes (your first line of defense against viruses) out of simple starch. Most people don’t know this. After you cook a simple starch, it starts to cool down and the molecules reknit themselves into resistant starch. People trying to diet likely have already encountered this. Resistant starch is worthless. You can’t make mucous membranes out of it, and it’s no good for fueling your body with energy. Your gut bacteria can eat it, but you can’t. If it’s a leftover that’s been in the fridge for the last 24 hours, it has very little simple starch.

    Any commercially processed food that was cooked back at the factory, packaged, and then shipped out via a supply chain that’s a couple of weeks old, is going to have small amounts of simple starch and lots of resistant starch. It is worthless for keeping your mucous membranes in good shape.

    1) Hot cereal is good. Cold cereal is not.
    2) Gravies are good. A can of cornstarch is useful, or packaged gravy mixes.
    3) Freshly baked or boiled potatoes are good, as is freshly boiled corn.
    4) Those cardboard cans of dough for rolls that you crack open and make biscuits out of are good. You can throw them together right after you come home from work.
    5) Frozen bread dough that you buy at the store and bake at home is good.
    6) Rice varies. Short-grain rice has lots of simple starch. It’s also known as sweet rice or sushi rice. Medium grain rice has less simple starch, and long-grain rice the least of all. Heirloom rice has too much resistant starch and too little simple starch.

    By the way, beans are worthless for your membranes. The raffinose in them is a resistant starch, not a simple starch. Okay if you want to feed gut bacteria or get some protein, otherwise useless.

    If you eyeball this list, it bears a remarkable resemblance (except for the rice) to the way Americans used to eat before the modern era, when we were thinner and had less diabetes. Despite complaints about a starchy diet, it’s always better for you to get your energy from starch than sugar. The body has to process starch. Getting your fuel from sugar is a fast route to diabetes. If you eat more simple starch in your diet, you’ll find you don’t crave sugar so much.

    By the way, people who have celiac disease, or who eat Paleo, can encounter a syndrome in which their eyes and mucous membranes get dry, and they develop a chronic thirst, and get dehydrated easily. This is because they aren’t eating enough simple starch, and their mucous membranes have thinned out. Many of the celiacs think they have Sjorgen’s Syndrome. Most don’t. They’re in what I call Starch Starvation Mode. They are not aware that commercial gluten-free baked goods, which they have come to rely on, have almost zero simple starch in them. These baked goods are almost all resistant starch.

    Simple starch has one big flaw. It’s very fragile. The more glue-like it cooks up, the more simple starch it has. In the early days when food manufacturers started experimenting with gluten free-foods, they grew frustrated because their early efforts tended to fall apart and crumple into crumbs. When the customer tried to do things like butter a slice of gluten-free bread, it fell apart under the knife. So the manufacturers switched to adding tons of resistant starch to these foods and removing the simple starch to make a product that could stand up. But many of these poor celiacs are in bad shape because of this.

    If you are in Starch Starvation Mode, you have to eat simple starch like a hog at a trough to get out of it. Your body keeps burning it off as fuel (the body’s first priority), and not rebuilding membranes properly. You have to rebuilt yard after yard of membranes from your mouth to your anus, and all over inside your lungs, mouth, and sinuses. Even your endocrine glands need it to work properly.

    If you’re heading into this Covid-19 pandemic and you’re in Starch Starvation Mode, you MUST fix this before the virus hits. If you’re worried about weight gain, do it later. When you’re sick, your body goes into ketosis, and it burns your fat stores. Digestion is a process that uses energy, and the body is trying to reserve it’s energy for fighting the disease. This is why you lose your appetite when you’re sick. This is one time you really need your body fat.

    OTHER RECOMMENDATIONS:

    Cinchona Bark (aka Quinine). Sold over the counter and has anti-viral properties.
    Olive Oil. Has anti-viral properties
    The usual stuff for colds, aspirin (although Cinchona Bark has natural aspirin in it), tissues, cough medicine. A humidifier for home.

    Food stores, toilet paper. Vitamin pills with vitamin C. Green tea tastes like crap, but it has anti-viral properties.

    Develop a taste for horseradish and wasabi. Both have anti-viral properties.

    Keep in mind that hot outdoor temperatures dry up sneezed water droplets that contain viruses, and that UV light destroys viruses. Hanging clothes and bedding out on a washing line in hot sun helps kills the viruses in them.

    Anything you really need to decontaminate, put on your car dashboard, and then leave your car out in the hot sunlight with the windows up. The excess heat and sunlight will kill viruses.

    Covid-19 is likely to hit in spring, not winter, so we will have warmer temperatures to help stave it off.

    • Thanks: Servant of Gla'aki
  143. @another fred

    What is sad are the exceptional cases where it strikes down some young healthy person and all of modern medical science cannot save them. This doesn’t happen a lot but it happens.
     
    Those are the cytokine storms. There appears to be a genetic component to having those.

    A few years back, during the bird flu episode, I met a man whose daughter died that way. She went from sniffles to dead in two days. He said her internal organs just almost dissolved - total failure.

    I posted this on another thread, but it's worth repeating. The bright side is that doctors are learning how to treat cytokine storms. The crucial factor is early diagnosis and treatment - they strike FAST.

    https://www.uab.edu/reporter/know-more/publications/item/8909-here-s-a-playbook-for-stopping-deadly-cytokine-storm-syndrome

    The Spanish Flu caused cytokine storms. It was most deadly to young adults, something that seems completely alien to us. There’s a young man in my area who lost his legs to the flu in this manner, only a few years ago now. Terrible.

  144. @Anonymous
    When shortages occur, the last government organization you will be able to depend upon is the police. When the police are overloaded, and people need food or other resources, they will invade your home to get it. If you’re not handy with firearms, just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.

    Stock up on toilet paper, bottled water, canned and dry goods.

    Stay away from fast food places, Home Depot, Lowe’s–anyplace that supports illegal aliens. Now is not the time for a kitchen rehab.

    Avoid the city of Arcadia.

    This is the best advice most will ignite on here, especially for all you that live in a multicultural area.

    Rifle, handgun, and a shotgun should be the minimum in any home, along with plenty of ammunition, mags, etc… My town is homogeneous and probably pretty safe, but the more things break down the less faith I have in social cohesion. Places like LA are probably a few bad days away from riots.

  145. Well, I reckon a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.

    • Replies: @Steve Sailer
    Hopefully not Poe's "Masque of the Red Death."
    , @Kibernetika
    Well, I reckon a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.

    O, Boccaccio!

    An interesting footnote is how much of the Italian fashion industry is really Chinese immigrant labor. For example, look up the demographics of Milan and Prato.
    , @Anon

    a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.
     
    Has anyone read this, in translation? Is it worth reading for a modern general reader?

    I kind of like frame story books like the Arabian Nights (which goes down as far as four levels of frames) and the Manuscript Found in Sargossa, which has an interesting backstory in itself.
  146. @Hail

    Hard to tell right now because there seem to be many asymptomatic infections. If we factored those in, it might be closer to flu levels.
     
    The biggest set of data we have on COVID19, outside the Chinese Communist Party-controlled health bureaucracy, is South Korea.

    As of today:

    46,000 South Koreans have been tested, mainly cases stemming from the Shinchonji armageddon cult, either cult members or close-quarter-contacts of cult members.
    - 28,247 found not infected;
    - 16,734 results pending;
    - 1,146 infected
    -- > of whom, 12 have died;
    -- > of whom, 22 have been certified fully recovered, no longer virus carriers, and released. These are the earlier cases, e.g. return-travelers from China diagnosed in January; not associated with the Shinchonji Doomsday Cult superspreader events); the large majority, 1,100 people, remain under quarantine.

    FWIW, the infection rate among people coming into fairly close contact with a carrier of the virus appears to be only 4% -- [infected]/([infected]+[tested-but-not-infected]) -- though the odds would obviously (naturally) rise with prolonged contact.

    The death rate stands at 1% there.

    The biggest fears right now are as follows, most serious first:

    1. Supply chain disruption—especially medicine, but also food. The human race and the global economy cannot stand China suddenly stop producing at this time.

    2. Panic—see the Milan markets barren thanks to the outbreak. And see the LA riots.

    3. Actual death and suffering from the disease itself.

  147. @Alden
    Good for you for remembering that dried food needs to be cooked. Dried beans are wonderful in that 1 cup of dried beans becomes 3 cups of cooked beans. But they need to be boiled a long time.

    Chickpeas take forever as long as 1o hours. Black beans and red kidney beans are about the shortest times, 2 hours. Lentil and dried peas 30 minutes.

    Every winter electricity goes out. So electric stoves, crock pots micro waves are useless. Gas stoves are more reliable. All those survivalist and earthquake preparedness ideas that depending on cooking food are useless if you can’t cook.

    Canned food that is palatable cold is best. Fruit, not vegetables. Standard sweetish baked beans instead of chili beans. Canned chili is pretty bad. Cold canned Chili must be awful. Canned beets corn green beans taste good canned potatoes and spinach bad. Carrots cabbage and turnips taste just fine raw and last a long time. Be careful where you store food that isn’t canned. You’ll get rats mice and raccoons.

    We had an electric stove and a couple power outages every year when we lived in the suburbs. We didn’t bother, just ate bread cookies fruit salad I always cooked 2 fried chickens at once so there was often cold chicken. Kids always wanted to cook hotdogs in the fireplace. We did a few times.
    I bet if you put regular rice in a pot of cold water it would soften as much as if it were cooked in a day. Certainly oatmeal cream of wheat minute rice and that kraft macaroni in a box would soften up in 24 hours etc.
    In the earthquakes the food falls off the shelves and food that’s in bags and boxes gets broken and messed up.

    Palatable when cold canned food is the way to go. Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration. Then there’s canned tuna and fish.

    I don’t believe the gas and electricity needs all that much human attention. The electric substations get along with just a few people to keep adjusting the circuit flow.

    Keep food in five gallon plastic buckets with lids, that’ll keep out the rodents. I’m one of the guys that keeps the power on and gets it back on when it fails. It takes constant, around the clock care to keep it going, believe me.

  148. Steve, call Jim Bakker’s hotline and order some of his emergency food buckets ASAP:

  149. @Anon
    Condoms

    What stuff should you order now to have if it gets worse?

    Condoms

    Are the “lifestyle clubs” taking this lying down? Have they been reduced to “soft swapping” for the duration of the epidemic?

  150. @Almost Missouri
    Question: Given that it is a pandemic and that no man is an island, we are all, everyone, going to be exposed to Coronavirus eventually, and most of us will survive. So what is the point of delaying the inevitable and hobbling ourselves with a debilitating self-quarantine? Are we hoping for a vaccine to rescue us before we personally are exposed? Any vaccine won't come in time, and even if it did, I would hardly trust it. Better to face the music now and get it over with, rather than live a twilight existence and end up facing the same illness anyway.

    I understand that some of us have sickly or elderly friends and relations, and that for their sakes we don't want to hasten their demise, so we keep ourselves hygienic and our gratuitous contacts limited. But for those of us who are healthy now, are we going to be more healthy facing the virus after six months of living underground on canned food? Isn't it better to face it sooner, fresh and strong, than later, fearful and weakened?

    I don’t really think it’s going to be that bad, but Steve asked what to stock up on. That’s what I responded with. I pulled all my money out of stocks a week ago too. We all owe God a death, no sense fretting about it too much.

  151. Anon[416] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Wild Geese Howard
    I think the (((media))) may have discovered that working to create panic is bad for the stock market and thus bad for the economy, which removes one of Trump's strongest talking points.

    I’d say the working media is genuinely frightened. They all know people in the high-risk categories or are in the high-risk categories themselves. They’re also about to get their open-borders ideology right back in their faces good and hard, and they don’t like being wrong. Also, most of the people they’re backing for president are elderly and in the high-risk categories.

    But if the death rate is 1.3% or so, that means 98.7% of us will come out all right. If you were given a lottery ticket with a 98.7% chance of winning, you’d be thrilled.

  152. @Almost Missouri
    Question: Given that it is a pandemic and that no man is an island, we are all, everyone, going to be exposed to Coronavirus eventually, and most of us will survive. So what is the point of delaying the inevitable and hobbling ourselves with a debilitating self-quarantine? Are we hoping for a vaccine to rescue us before we personally are exposed? Any vaccine won't come in time, and even if it did, I would hardly trust it. Better to face the music now and get it over with, rather than live a twilight existence and end up facing the same illness anyway.

    I understand that some of us have sickly or elderly friends and relations, and that for their sakes we don't want to hasten their demise, so we keep ourselves hygienic and our gratuitous contacts limited. But for those of us who are healthy now, are we going to be more healthy facing the virus after six months of living underground on canned food? Isn't it better to face it sooner, fresh and strong, than later, fearful and weakened?

    There’s speculation that you can easily be reinfected with a different strain of Covid-19 and that the reinfection is what’s more deadly.

    • Replies: @Anonymous

    There’s speculation that you can easily be reinfected with a different strain of Covid-19 and that the reinfection is what’s more deadly.
     
    Right. It mutates, you breath it in again, then the antibiotics that were applied to save you actually work to your detriment. You then have a heart attack, and die. There were allegedly many deaths that occurred via this process in China, before they figured out what was happening.

    It’s part of the reason why people in the medical community are getting a bit hyper about it. When cases begin to multiply, it’s hard to manage.

    By the way, I’ve been reading that the virus allegedly seems to be taking off in Africa. If it gets going there, it’s going to have quite a run.
    , @Almost Missouri
    Okay, but then doesn't the same logic apply to the new strain? We're all going to get it eventually. Better to face when you're relatively healthy.
  153. @Anonymous

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I’m an extremely healthy boomer. I’ve worked out for years. Far more than you. Resting pulse is 58. Semi-retired. I don’t have to work. I can most likely buy and sell the likes of you.

    To me, you, in your mid-twenties, are essentially a happy, aimless fucktard. You are the outcome of too many boomers having too many babies. You were likely raised poorly. That is, you don’t even know how weak you are. You’re just a happy camper, taking up an annoying amount of space on the freeway in your shitty little Toyota Carolla.

    Probably the biggest problem I have with your lot is most of you are ingrates.

    You shouldn’t be here. Most of you were a mistake, who went on to thrive because post birth abortions are still against the law in this country, no matter how strong a mournful parents argument might be, and don’t think your parents didn’t have an iron-clad moral, ethical case for a pillow pressed passionately against your baby head.

    Look in the mirror today, and instead of being repulsed, be grateful.

    We let you live, to allow you to give life your best shot. You squandering it in front of a video game console isn’t our fault. It’s what we roughly predicted.

    I’ve gotten into enjoying the squabbles between you two generations. You’re a match in hell.

    We X’s stand back and watch you with our notorious cynicism at the nonsense you two generations of true believers bellow out. Both of you in your respective youths believed “the whole world is watching” and projected a narcissistic media feedback loop. We weren’t much for that stuff, maybe because we saw when we were young how full of shit you people had been.

    We have more in common with Silents in some respect, but on the whole we watch in disbelief.

    It’s you people who turned this country into a balkanized, outsourced wasteland, after your hedonic wing completed the march through the institutions. I went to college just as the keys were being handed over, and at least caught the tail end of what the Silents had to offer. I could see what was coming. These millennials are your spawn, not us. The education I got not three decades ago is now gone, wiped out by your generation’s silliness.

    It’s going to take a long haul to undo the rot. Grateful for what? For destroying the social fabric of our country? Doing great? I bet you are. Where I am in flyover country, many of our communities don’t even exist anymore. Sorry, some of us think of a nation as more than a bunch of consumers.

    • Replies: @Cloudbuster
    OK, Xer.
    , @Almost Missouri
    Generally agree, as an X-er. I can't always blanket condemn Boomers and Millennials because I have too many friends and acquaintances in those categories whom I like and admire, and who in turn have helped me. (I feel the same way about Jews, FWIW.) Not that this blinds me to the painfully obvious habits these groups can have in aggregate though. Ok, now that I'm done with my personal virtue signalling, I'll note my frustration with the Boomer generation in particular, which I think is hardly unique.

    After having inherited the greatest windfall of social assets in recorded history, rather than pass it on improved, or at least unencumbered, they are instead sucking out and consuming what is (or can be made) liquid—which though selfish, is at least understandable and rational from an amoral point of view—but additionally they are handing out what remains to the manifestly unworthy in exchange for socially destructive (though personally vainglorious) diversity points.

    Having spent a fair chunk of my life climbing the greasy poles of academic and corporate hierarchy, it is of course dismaying to learn that the payoff to this investment is, "sorry we're only hiring/promoting Diversity now, and you're not it. Of course, we weren't doing that when I, Boomer, made my career, but now that mine's made, we are because it makes me feel good about myself and that's what's important." Thanks, man. Had I known this would be the outcome, I would have focused more on my own thing and less on your teamplayer BS.

    Note to the younger generations: don't trust boomer institutions to have have your back when you reach boomer age—or even before. (Yes, I know the Social Security Ponzi scheme was set up long pre-boomer, but those people are overrated too. FDR, rot in hell.)

    Kathy Shaidle (a tail-end boomer I admired), used to describe the boomers as the Cash Out Generation. I can't disagree. Having won the born-in-the-right-place-at-the-right-time lottery, they've worked to ensure that no one after them will ever say that again. Some people, especially those in groups we're increasingly importing, have ethnic nepotism workarounds to advance themselves, but I don't. Besides not being "ethnic", I trusted the pre-boomer meritocracy to continue to work despite the boomer-led social ructions of the late twentieth century. I was mistaken.

    Here endeth the lament.
  154. Get some BHT.

    It’s been shown to destroy lipid coated viruses, which – as I understand it – includes coronavirus.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/163494
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/163494
    http://www.delano.com/blog/?p=498
    https://www.advance-health.com/bht.html
    etc.

  155. @Jesse
    Another thing people never seem to consider is their caffeine intake. Most adults will experience some sort of withdrawal symptoms if they don't get their fix. You need to consider stockpiling cheap supermarket coffee. (Energy drinks, caffeine pills etc., are NOT recommended).

    I assume most people have the beans, rice, water side of things covered. This is more a PSA about what people forget.

    Right, I’ve heard very few mentions of coffee (or tea, if that’s your morning fix) and a way to make it under any circumstance. Peanut butter is also useful and it keeps, but haven’t been seeing anyone mention that

  156. @Anonymous
    This may be the biggest overreaction in history

    “This may be the biggest overreaction in history”

    Right up there with Y2K and the Dems on 9 November 2016.

    • Replies: @R.G. Camara
    A massive world-wide outbreak of a superflu that is killing on orders of magnitude more than normal flu and has massively interrupted the supply chain and has literally killed the first doctors who worked on it and has quarantined whole cities?

    Sorry, dude, if you think this is an overreaction, you're just not paying attention.
    , @Hail
    I think this is a reference to the virus:

    An important person called Glenn Kirschner declares people will "let Trump declare a national emergency & cancel the election."

    https://twitter.com/glennkirschner2/status/1232463840580952064

    Glenn Kirschner [Verified]
    @glennkirschner2

    Do the Republicans have a breaking point? Do they let Trump declare a national emergency & cancel the election? Do they let him round up & imprison his political opponents? Do they let him turn over the codes to Russia? Is there anything he can do that would be a bridge too far?

    7:34 PM · Feb 25, 2020
     

    Glenn Kirschner
    @NBCNews @MSNBC Legal Analyst; Fmr 30-yr fed prosecutor w/ [US Attorney's Office, District of Columbia], DC Chief of Homicide & @USArmy JAG. President of @HomFamAdvocates

    26.9K Following | 219.3K Followers
     
    , @Lagertha
    exactly, Kylie...something stinks so much! Let's not forget: Zika, Ebola, Sars, N1H1 (which is soooo normal) and scary meningitis on college campuses in the 2010's.

    I worry about a new, more virulent tick/mosquito disease., because, unfortunately, NO ONE is protected from this bug. So, no one in-group can control this bug to not take out their in-group population. Coastal can't vanquish Interior/South can't destroy North/ Cities can't destroy rural dwellers.
  157. @Anonymous
    When shortages occur, the last government organization you will be able to depend upon is the police. When the police are overloaded, and people need food or other resources, they will invade your home to get it. If you’re not handy with firearms, just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.

    Stock up on toilet paper, bottled water, canned and dry goods.

    Stay away from fast food places, Home Depot, Lowe’s–anyplace that supports illegal aliens. Now is not the time for a kitchen rehab.

    Avoid the city of Arcadia.

    Arcadia? Only one I know of is in Louisiana. Hope you don’t live near there it’s (Along with the rest of Northern Louisiana) a shithole.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    I assume he meant Arcadia, California, near Steve. It's 60% Asians.
  158. @JMcG
    Non-perishable food basically. Water should be ok. Three months of any prescription meds you might need. Anti bacterial soap, bleach. Probably too late for masks already and their efficacy is doubtful.
    Stay away from people to the extent possible. Don’t shake hands. Wash your hands often. Don’t touch your eyes, mouth, or nose.

    Bleach – I’m told bleach is no longer used in hospitals. Why is that? It kills everything, dissolves all sorts of nasty stuff.

    • Replies: @Pheasant
    Its because disinfectant is less harsh on peoples lungs having no ammonia etc.
  159. @ColRebSez
    Stock up on food, alcohol, and anything you need to stay at home for a while. Masks are likely to be of little help but might be nice to have.

    If a doctor has prescribed you statins, start taking them now. Having lower cholesterol makes you less likely to catch a virus and viruses reproduce less effectively in people with low cholesterol. In addition, statins are a powerful anti-inflammatory and can protect organs from destruction by your body's immune system. People on statins who get the flu have half the death rate of those who don't take statins, so a big difference.

    Vitamin C is a somewhat decent antiviral and does ward off illness to some degree. When fighting a virus the body depletes Vitamin C at a fast pace, so large doses are in order. As a preventative a few hundred milligrams a day are fine.

    There are a few other drugs which work as an antiviral, including Clomid and propranolol. You can also do a Google search for any meds you are taking to see if they work off-label as an antiviral. If you are taking these drugs, don't stop now and get your scripts filled!

    So I’ll be in pretty good shape health wise, as a 30 yr old just prescribed statins (not overweight, either, my family is just prone to high blood pressure. I don’t have that yet but presumably high cholesterol is a predecessor?)

    Im almost thinking I’d rather get the virus early then recover.

    When I get the flu, it doesn’t last that long. Only thing that’s ever really affected me was bronchitis years and years ago.

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?

    We already bought masks, gloves, safety goggles, vitamins. Wondering if I should get beans, tuna, peanut butter, and canned water, as well.

    • Replies: @Jack D

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?
     
    Most young healthy people will be fine. However, some (and there's no way to know which ones in advance) develop "cytokine storms" . A cytokine storm is an overproduction of immune cells and their activating compounds (cytokines) that end up in your the lungs. The virus doesn't kill you - your own immune system kills you. You develop pneumonia and you die. This is why so many young, healthy people died in the Spanish Flu epidemic . Having a young healthy immune system makes the cytokine storm WORSE.

    So "just get it over with" is not a good idea. They are working on fast tracking a vaccine and they are learning by the day which anti-viral medications are best at reducing the severity of the disease for those who become infected and what are the best treatment protocols for those who develop cytokine storms, so time is your friend. If you can't avoid being infected, later is better than sooner - maybe you'll get lucky and get hit by a bus in the interim so the virus won't kill you.
  160. @Anonymous
    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    Surely you’re not so cold you want to watch your parents die?

  161. Better make sure you still have a non-electric can opener. And don’t forget the dog food

  162. anon[282] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Wild Geese Howard
    I think the (((media))) may have discovered that working to create panic is bad for the stock market and thus bad for the economy, which removes one of Trump's strongest talking points.

    Based on some of his corona virus comments,Trump’s already potentially set himself up for a McCain ’08 “Economy’s Strong” situation.

    A leader shouldn’t try to deny this stuff, it creates deep seated loss of trust if he turns out wrong. And if pandemic doesn’t occur, markets would’ve likely recovered from any interim decline prior to November, in which case he has gained nothing saying there’s nothing to worry about.

  163. Anonymous[186] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jack D
    Somehow I was able to order N95s from Home Depot online for (free) home delivery. They were like 3 for $10, Milwaukee (re)brand and marked Made in India. They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing.

    They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing

    Wrong. You need a certain grade of mask to stop the virus. It’s a zero-sum game. There’s no such thing as better than nothing, in this case. Do your due diligence, or it will do you.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    Yes. N95. These masks are N95.
    , @mobi

    Wrong. You need a certain grade of mask to stop the virus. It’s a zero-sum game. There’s no such thing as better than nothing, in this case. Do your due diligence, or it will do you.
     
    Even dirt-cheap dust masks would provide two of the most useful benefits:

    1) Remind you to not touch hands to your nose/mouth

    2) Encourage people in public places to keep more distance from the guy in the mask - 'might be sick'


    #1 is good enough reason to wear one even around the house for the next little while - pretty painless.

    But sure - N95 and up if you can find them
  164. Better remind your wife or girlfriend to stock up on feminine products — like Elaine on Seinfeld with that closet full of her favorite sponge. Does that stuff come from Asia? I could see empty shelves for tampons, adult diapers and diabetic needs.

  165. Anonymous[427] • Disclaimer says:
    @J1234
    You guys need this '58 Lincoln. It's gigantic and perfect for plowing through hordes of infected attackers that will soon be roaming the streets. And it's on eBay right now for $3500. Doesn't run, but when you get it running, it has the much needed points ignition that I've mentioned before for the inevitable solar flares that will occur during the pandemic.

    https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/XGgAAOSwtjBeR3kz/s-l1600.jpg


    https://www.ebay.com/itm/1958-Lincoln-Premier/223924216033?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3Dfdb48f806ad54562836451a0a5a9f744%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D15%26mehot%3Dnone%26sd%3D174200610274%26itm%3D223924216033%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2380057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3Ad667a493-583c-11ea-a105-74dbd180361b%7Cparentrq%3A7f40612a1700a446c35251cefff72b54%7Ciid%3A1

    Hell no.

    Get a Land Rover or a Jeep and do a Mercedes, Perkins, or SD Nissan Diesel conversion, or a seventies squarebody Chevy truck with a 53 Series Detroit Diesel. They run with no electrics at all and will burn any grade of diesel fuel, jet fuel or kerosene with a little oil in it, or any of several biodiesels or vegetable oils. If a stock vehicle must be bought get an IH Scout with the SD33t or a Mercedes sedan with an OM616 or OM617.

    • Replies: @Sergeant Prepper
    Thousands of Somali warlords and South African farmers can't be wrong: what you need is a Toyota Hilux 4*4. (Preferably a fairly old one that you can fix yourself.) Mount a .50 caliber machine gun on the back and I guarantee you: men will want to be you and women will want to be with you.
    , @Mr McKenna
    However, your advice--unlike Lincoln Man's--is totally devoid of humor.
  166. @bigdicknick
    n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that's it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    What you really need, if you can afford it, is the army’s M50 gas mask. It’s going for $299 (used) – $500 (new).

    The M50 series is certified to MIL-SPEC PRF-EA-10003. The mask design features improved performance against chemical and biological agents, toxic industrial chemicals, and nuclear fallout. The dual, low profile filters reduce weight and bulk while reducing breathing resistance by fifty percent over the M40 series mask. The filters incorporate a shelf-life indicator patch which changes colors from white to blue when the filters are no longer serviceable. The mask face blank incorporates self sealing filter mounts that allow for filter changes in a contaminated environment.

    The single element eye lens gives the mask a 96 degree field of view and improved compatibility with military equipment and battlefield optical systems.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M50_joint_service_general_purpose_mask

    • Thanks: Triumph104
  167. Anonymous[186] • Disclaimer says:
    @Lugash
    There's speculation that you can easily be reinfected with a different strain of Covid-19 and that the reinfection is what's more deadly.

    There’s speculation that you can easily be reinfected with a different strain of Covid-19 and that the reinfection is what’s more deadly.

    Right. It mutates, you breath it in again, then the antibiotics that were applied to save you actually work to your detriment. You then have a heart attack, and die. There were allegedly many deaths that occurred via this process in China, before they figured out what was happening.

    It’s part of the reason why people in the medical community are getting a bit hyper about it. When cases begin to multiply, it’s hard to manage.

    By the way, I’ve been reading that the virus allegedly seems to be taking off in Africa. If it gets going there, it’s going to have quite a run.

  168. @iffen
    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.

    At the age of 23.

    • LOL: JMcG
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar


    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.
     
    At the age of 23.
     
    Gotta watch those streetcars!


    https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2018/05/Screen-Shot-2018-05-11-at-1.03.00-PM-1920x1236.png
  169. @Kylie
    "This may be the biggest overreaction in history"

    Right up there with Y2K and the Dems on 9 November 2016.

    A massive world-wide outbreak of a superflu that is killing on orders of magnitude more than normal flu and has massively interrupted the supply chain and has literally killed the first doctors who worked on it and has quarantined whole cities?

    Sorry, dude, if you think this is an overreaction, you’re just not paying attention.

  170. Anonymous[270] • Disclaimer says:

    Massively under-rated: cotton liner gloves. If you have to go out and touch all kinds of things, it’s better to do it in gloves. But you won’t be able to go on for hours without liners – the sweat will quickly make it intolerable for extended periods.

    Under-rated: oregano oil. Tons of anecdotal and some amount of scientific indirect evidence suggests that it can protect from infections by all kinds of enveloped viruses (and may also somehow strengthen innate immunity?). It’s nasty and basically a poison in large quantities but in small quantities perfectly safe.

    Isopropyl alcohol is cheapest of all disinfectants and will be effective even when diluted 2X from how it is sold by gallons in pharmacies.

    Of all the usual stuff besides food, gloves and masks, the most important is aspirin/acetaminophen. You are unlikely to die but if you do get sick, fever might be the worst part.

    Most of all, though: it’s all bullshit! There won’t be 70% of population infected. Personally, I am doing zero prepping. People scoff at the comparison, but prepping for global coronavirus epidemics makes as much sense as was prepping for Y2K causing an abrupt end to all economic activities.

    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    ....but prepping for global coronavirus epidemics makes as much sense as was prepping for Y2K causing an abrupt end to all economic activities.

    Y2K didn't do serious damage because the relevant people took it seriously and paid people to beaver away at fixing hardware and software in time. The fact that a bunch of Alex Jones types heard about Y2K, and hyped it for fun and profit, obscures that fact. In any case, having years to fix how machines handle dates and times is nothing compared to containing a global pandemic that suddenly breaks out.
  171. The best thing to do is not be Chinese.

  172. @JimB
    Have any non-Asians died of Coronavirus, so far?

    https://www.eturbonews.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/risk.jpeg
    Table gives chance of contracting a dangerous version of the virus upon exposure.

    Why are Utah residents with Northern & Western European ancestry more susceptible than other whites in the US?

    Also why are these whites more susceptible than other European whites:
    – British in England and Scotland
    – Finnish in Finland
    – Iberian population in Spain
    – Toscani in Italia

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    You have to allow a few percentage point margin for error, so some of the "differences" may not really be there.

    As I understand it, the basic ACE2 story is that it is common in East Asia and uncommon around the Mediterranean, with everyone else on a gradient in between. So, Southern Europeans (Iberia, Toscani) have it less than Northern Europeans (British and NW-Euro-descended Utahans) have it less than Northeastern Europeans (Finns) have it less than Asians. Etc.

    The peculiar pair is British vs. Utah, who should be about the same or if different British should be lower due to more admixture of ancient Iberian, but instead British is significantly higher. Don't know what that's about.

    Also, I would hesitate to translate "frequency of genetic variants" into "susceptibility to disease". This is still at the theory stage, IMHO.
  173. Talk about price gouging. I bought a pack of twenty 3M N95 masks on Amazon two weeks ago for $20. Now 2 sellers are selling the same box of twenty for $158!

    Can you reuse these masks? They’re disposable.
    https://www.amazon.com/3M-Particulate-Respirator-Disposable-Masks/dp/B0845ZC6FN/ref=sr_1_25?keywords=n95+mask&qid=1582695702&sr=8-25

  174. @Kylie
    "This may be the biggest overreaction in history"

    Right up there with Y2K and the Dems on 9 November 2016.

    I think this is a reference to the virus:

    An important person called Glenn Kirschner declares people will “let Trump declare a national emergency & cancel the election.”


    [MORE]

    Glenn Kirschner [Verified]
    @glennkirschner2

    Do the Republicans have a breaking point? Do they let Trump declare a national emergency & cancel the election? Do they let him round up & imprison his political opponents? Do they let him turn over the codes to Russia? Is there anything he can do that would be a bridge too far?

    7:34 PM · Feb 25, 2020

    Glenn Kirschner
    @NBCNews @MSNBC Legal Analyst; Fmr 30-yr fed prosecutor w/ [US Attorney’s Office, District of Columbia], DC Chief of Homicide & @USArmy JAG. President of @HomFamAdvocates

    26.9K Following | 219.3K Followers

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Kirschner is an MSNBC minion and a former subordinate of Robert Mueller. Nothing he says about anything can matter any more than a bon mot from the dude who survived WW2 tending Hitler's personal flag. Cue the cantors insisting that a Jew cannot have Christian references in his name. I like that the obvious Shatt-al-Arab setup (remember USN sailors weeping, on their knees, before superior Iranian Revolutionary Guard? Remember that? Remember a motorless riverine craft in the ocean, on the evening of the SOTU by coincidence?) is not "too much" for Obama supporters.
  175. I don’t get why HHS doesn’t simply stop all international flights to/from the US for the next 30 or 60 days. If they are concern about hits to the economy, the cost of a big outbreak in the US will be far larger than any temporary losses incurred by the airlines and travel industry now.

    • Agree: Thea
  176. @vhrm
    The issue is Iran.

    It actually looked like China possibly had it under control. But apparently Iran's been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it's spread from there to there whole middle East. There's no way Iran's going to be able to do China style containment so it's probably going to become endemic there and then the rest of Middle East and South Asia and Africa.

    And at that point it's just a matter of time until it gets everywhere else, including here and back into China from the outside.

    Iran has a significant population of men with lungs that were affected by chemical weapons used during the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq War.

    I expect that group to get hit hard and distort the numbers for a few weeks.

    • Replies: @JMcG
    Interesting and plausible. First time I’ve seen it mentioned.
  177. @Kylie
    "This may be the biggest overreaction in history"

    Right up there with Y2K and the Dems on 9 November 2016.

    exactly, Kylie…something stinks so much! Let’s not forget: Zika, Ebola, Sars, N1H1 (which is soooo normal) and scary meningitis on college campuses in the 2010’s.

    I worry about a new, more virulent tick/mosquito disease., because, unfortunately, NO ONE is protected from this bug. So, no one in-group can control this bug to not take out their in-group population. Coastal can’t vanquish Interior/South can’t destroy North/ Cities can’t destroy rural dwellers.

  178. @Hail
    I think this is a reference to the virus:

    An important person called Glenn Kirschner declares people will "let Trump declare a national emergency & cancel the election."

    https://twitter.com/glennkirschner2/status/1232463840580952064

    Glenn Kirschner [Verified]
    @glennkirschner2

    Do the Republicans have a breaking point? Do they let Trump declare a national emergency & cancel the election? Do they let him round up & imprison his political opponents? Do they let him turn over the codes to Russia? Is there anything he can do that would be a bridge too far?

    7:34 PM · Feb 25, 2020
     

    Glenn Kirschner
    @NBCNews @MSNBC Legal Analyst; Fmr 30-yr fed prosecutor w/ [US Attorney's Office, District of Columbia], DC Chief of Homicide & @USArmy JAG. President of @HomFamAdvocates

    26.9K Following | 219.3K Followers
     

    Kirschner is an MSNBC minion and a former subordinate of Robert Mueller. Nothing he says about anything can matter any more than a bon mot from the dude who survived WW2 tending Hitler’s personal flag. Cue the cantors insisting that a Jew cannot have Christian references in his name. I like that the obvious Shatt-al-Arab setup (remember USN sailors weeping, on their knees, before superior Iranian Revolutionary Guard? Remember that? Remember a motorless riverine craft in the ocean, on the evening of the SOTU by coincidence?) is not “too much” for Obama supporters.

  179. @Anonymous
    Propably, 2% of everybody will die.

    What are you willing to lose?

    For me, toenails, 10% of my ass, my appendix … does that add up to 2% yet?

    • LOL: bigdicknick
  180. @Achmed E. Newman
    For Steve - THE Prepper's Anthem, best of all time, by Corb Lund out of Alberta, Canada:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uASQgLwaIs

    When the oil stops, everything stops, nothing left in the fountain.
    Nobody wants paper money son, so you just well stop countin'.
    Can you break the horse, can you light the fire, what's that I beg your pardon?
    You best start thinking where food comes from and I hope you tend a good garden.


    Getting down on the mountain, getting down on the mountain.
    Don’t wanna be around when the shit goes down.
    I'll be gettin' on down the mountain.


    When the truck don’t run, the bread don’t come, have a hard time finding petrol.
    Water ain't runnin' in the city no more, do hold any precious metal?
    Can you gut the fish, can you read the sky, whats that about over crowdin'?
    You ever seen a man who's kids ain't ate for 17 days and countin'?


    Getting down on the mountain, getting down on the mountain.
    Don’t wanna be around when the shit goes down.
    I'll be goin' to ground on the mountain.


    There ain't no heat, and the powers gone out It's kerosene lamps and candles.
    The roads are blocked. Its all grid-locked. You got a short wave handle?
    Can you track the deer, can you dig the well, couldn’t quite hear your answer?
    I think I see a rip in the social fabric, brother can you spare some ammo?



    Just because you had to get into this Zombie business, SBS, here's another by this band:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79llXVDWbCQ

    Corb Lund is a Canadian national treasure.

  181. @Lurker

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.
     
    At the age of 23.

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.

    At the age of 23.

    Gotta watch those streetcars!

  182. I look both ways, every single time, when in Europe.

    • Replies: @JMcG
    Definitely. I had an acquaintance who was killed driving out of Shannon airport some years ago. Looked the wrong way and pulled out in front of a truck.
  183. I’m not prepping for the Coronavirus. I trust that others will solve the issue before it gets to me. Either stop it from spreading or develop a vaccine. Plus my family would probably survive it.

    I’ll cancel my vacation to China (and Italy), but that’s my only prep.

  184. @Anon
    Condoms

    I do believe this is a huge fakey-fakey-fake scare. I have relatives who died in the great Spanish Flu.

    I think if you wash your hands, take vitamins/drink high Ph water, and avoid sick people, you will be fine. And, most importantly, avoid hospitals, libraries, halls with loads of people.

    • Replies: @Hhsiii
    Unfortunately I take the subway to work. :(
  185. @Chris Mallory

    Prepping? Based on what?
     
    Based on being prepared. Earthquakes, ice storms, tropical storms, floods and yes quarantine from pandemic are all things that might happen where I live.

    Ten years ago, I went 30 days without power from an ice storm. During that ice storm, one Dollar Store in a county of 70,000 people had power and could do business. Their shelves were empty that first day. Was a week before the banks would let you take out more than $75 cash, and for that first week anything you wanted to buy was a cash transaction.

    The year katrina hit, I went 3 days without power after a tropical storm that had been a hurricane blew over where I live.

    Last summer during one of the hurricanes, a Dindu American was being interviewed on the news. It was two days after the storm had hit and no one in her building had food. They were standing around waiting for someone to feed them.

    Bad luck seems to follow you, buddy! Nothing personal but I’m steering clear of your house.

  186. A tad OT,but is Harvey Weinstein’s lady lawyer a tranny? No,really,is she,or xe?

  187. Anonymous[162] • Disclaimer says:

    The masks only give people a false sense of security. The key is to STAY AWAY from areas where the virus droplets are.

    Steve is a white dude. Low ACE2 receptor count. No big deal.

    Maybe someone in da family is Asian? If this thing goes critical then you gotta isolate them until it blows over. Asians are at real risk. Whites who live with Asians need to be sure the Whites are not symptomless carriers. Not easy to do.

    Literally head for the hills and camp in the woods for a few months…sounds crazy but a lot of people in Wuhan today wish they would’ve done just that very thing back in December.

  188. @Anon
    Condoms

    Good idea. People have to be able to keep entertained and get exercise when they’re stuck at home with no electricity.

  189. @Eustace Tilley (not)
    Licorice root holds within
    A compound called glycyrrhizin.
    The Lancet doth write:
    Glycyrrhizin just might
    Be a cure for the fix that we're in.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycyrrhizin#Adverse_effects

    The most widely reported side effect of glycyrrhizin use via consumption of black licorice is reduction of blood potassium levels, which can affect body fluid balance and function of nerves.[5][6] Chronic consumption of black licorice, even in moderate amounts, is associated with an increase in blood pressure,[6] may cause irregular heart rhythm, and adverse interactions with prescription medicines.[5]

    The effects on body fluids are related to the inhibition of cortisol metabolism within the kidney, subsequent stimulation of the mineralocorticoid receptors,[7] and decrease in blood levels of renin, potassium, and aldosterone, which collectively lead to increases in blood pressure.[6]

    [MORE]

    Depending on amount and frequency of ingesting black licorice, other side effects may include:[5][8]

    Edema
    Lethargy
    Headache
    Paralysis
    Transient visual loss
    Torsades de pointes
    Tachycardia
    Cardiac arrest
    Reduced testosterone
    Premature birth
    Acute kidney failure
    Muscle weakness
    Myopathy
    Myoglobinuria
    Rhabdomyolysis
    Increased body weight

  190. @bigdicknick
    n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that's it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    I bought 2 n95 masks at my local hardware store yesterday and there were more.Walgreens still has some masks but double price from 2 weeks ago.

  191. @Anon7
    Prepping? Based on what? Here's the scoop from the CDC:

    COVID-19: Confirmed Cases in the United States*†
    ==================================
    Travel-related____________12
    Person-to-person spread_____2
    Total confirmed cases_______14
    Total deaths______________0
    Total tested____________ 426

    CDC - Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

    For comparison, here are the basic stats for the 2018-2019 regular flu season in the United States:

    - 42,900,000 people got the flu
    - 647,000 people were hospitalized
    - 61,200 died

    Worldwide, WHO estimates that 3-5 million people get very sick, and about 600,000 people die every year from the flu.

    How many of you are still panicked about COVID-2019?

    I wouldn’t put muh reliance on the CDC and WHO numbers for the flu as it has been proven that they count all pneumonia deaths as flu when most have nothing to do with the flu and the CDC and the WHO own the majority of patents on vaccines and the flu is a massive profit maker for them so they are always fear mongering to pump up sales for the flu virus. I just read that this years flu vaccine is 10% effective and it has not been more than 50% effective for over 20 years.

    • Replies: @Jack D

    I just read that this years flu vaccine is 10% effective and it has not been more than 50% effective for over 20 years.

     

    You can't really compute the effectiveness of the vaccine until the flu season is over so whoever said 10% is pulling this number out of their ass. Flu vaccine has to be manufactured based upon the best guesses of which strains will be most common in the coming year, based upon those that were most common last year. So this is like picking next year's winner of the World Series before spring training even begins. You can make educated guesses but you're not going to be able to guess right 100% of the time (or even 50% of the time). 50% is better than nothing and even if the vaccine does not completely prevent the disease it usually reduces its severity, so the lack of complete effectiveness is no reason not to get it, especially if you are older (as with coronavirus, the older you are the more likely it is that the flu will kill you). Side effects are rare, it's usually 100% covered by insurance and you can get it in almost any pharmacy. Humans have this unique ability to rationalize not doing almost anything. Yeah, don't get the flu shot because god forbid someone might make money off of it.
  192. @iffen
    If a steady diet of whiskey helps you

    My great grand-pappy said drinking a half-pint each day would keep you alive. It worked for him until he died.

    Same here. He died with 66, not unhappy at all, a very peaceful, soft-spoken and quite humorous man. He had a case of beer in his hospital cupboard and when asked about it told the staff, no problem, beer is better than bread, you don’t have to chew it. – His teeth had become bad. In those days, the hospital crew just let him have his way. The hospital was situated near Mannheim’s Eichbaum Brauerei – which delivered him the stuff – and is still in business. He worked seven days a week all his life. No health problems whatsoever – until he died.

  193. @bigdicknick
    update. I found a local hardware store that still has a lot of n95's and at normal retail. The store is a real crap hole which I think is why they still had them.

    My father had same experience–found normal priced N95s at local non-chain store.

    They need to be NIOSH certified N95. The CDC has a list of approved N95 products on its website, linked via the CNET article on masks that comes up top Google search.

    Make sure you shave cleanly and watch N95 fitting videos online.

    Also, they are single-use. Save for times when you are confined and close to people, like an airplane cabin. Don’t let anyone tell you they are pointless. There is a famous case in the medical literature of a flight where everyone in first class got TB because of one of the passengers.

    Safety glasses helpful if people around you are coughing.

    Gloves not that important, but washing hands is. Hand sanitizer should be 70% and ethanol if possible, but shouldn’t replace hand-washing, especially for dirty places lke restrooms.

    If you work in a place like a hospital and have long hair, hair net/cover too.

  194. @Dylan
    I bought a 20 pack of N95s for $80 because I've got a pregnant wife and my in-laws are late 60s with some minor health issues. Any mitigation I'll take.

    Be careful with pregnancy and older people. You don’t want to interfere with breathing in either group.

  195. I’m ordering a president that can make N95 productions run on time…

    https://mobile.twitter.com/KyotoKenshu/status/1232513816375758850

  196. @Dissident
    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Earth Abides is a 1949 post-apocalyptic science fiction novel by American writer George R. Stewart. It tells the story of the fall of civilization from deadly disease and its rebirth. The story was set in the United States in the 1940s in Berkeley, California and told by a character, Isherwood Williams, who emerges from isolation in the mountains to find almost everyone dead. [...]

    In November 1950, it was adapted for the CBS radio program Escape as a two-part drama starring John Dehner.
     

    I have not read the book but found the radio version, which can be found here (episodes # 148 and #149) quite good. Perhaps needless to say, I hope and pray that what we are facing now will not come to anything near what is portrayed in that drama.

    I never heard of this radio program. Wow, that was a real treat, a fabulous story with one of my favorite actors, John Dehner. I was surprised at the sound quality as well, expecting something scratchy. Thank you very much for the link.

    • Replies: @Dissident

    Thank you very much for the link.
     
    My pleasure. Glad you enjoyed it.

    Another favorite of mine that you may enjoy is #48 from the Columbia Workshop: Slim. (Also available on YouTube) Although quite different, there are certain common threads between the respective recordings that stand-out. Not only is the audio quality of Slim remarkably clear and intimate but the music and sound effects, as well as the entire production is rather masterfully executed. The story is of a young hobo who upon riding a freight train for the first time meets and is befriended by a mysterious man. It is poignant and not at all trite or predictable. The ending is ambiguous, leaving the listener to either form his own conclusions, or remain wondering about...Better that I reveal no more.

    I am ever grateful to Max Schmid, whose weekly radio program introduced me to the wonderful world of old time radio (OTR). It is truly The Theater of the Mind, where the only limits are those of one's imagination. And, being audio-only, one's eyes remain completely free to drive or perform any number of physical activities and mundane chores while listening.

    Might we one day witness a rediscovery and even rebirth of this great art form? Might not only vintage recordings from radio's Golden Age but also newly produced content in its mold once again become popular?

  197. @Anonymous
    When shortages occur, the last government organization you will be able to depend upon is the police. When the police are overloaded, and people need food or other resources, they will invade your home to get it. If you’re not handy with firearms, just buy a shotgun. It works as easy as an old instamatic camera. Just point and shoot. You’re highly likely to get a piece of your subject.

    Stock up on toilet paper, bottled water, canned and dry goods.

    Stay away from fast food places, Home Depot, Lowe’s–anyplace that supports illegal aliens. Now is not the time for a kitchen rehab.

    Avoid the city of Arcadia.

    In Katrina, police joined in the looting.

  198. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    Well, I reckon a copy of "The Decameron" would be appropriate.

    Hopefully not Poe’s “Masque of the Red Death.”

    • Replies: @Lurker
    Years ago a friend of my parents was dying of AIDS (turned out he had been secretly gay all along) later his widow died of the same. Last time I saw him he had come round to talk to my mum, he was a bit manic, a bit weird - symptoms of the condition. Anyhow my brother and I were watching the Masque of the Red Death (with Vincent Price) on TV as they talked. Somewhat creepy and ironic.
  199. @Lagertha
    I do believe this is a huge fakey-fakey-fake scare. I have relatives who died in the great Spanish Flu.

    I think if you wash your hands, take vitamins/drink high Ph water, and avoid sick people, you will be fine. And, most importantly, avoid hospitals, libraries, halls with loads of people.

    Unfortunately I take the subway to work. 🙁

  200. @Anonymous
    Hell no.

    Get a Land Rover or a Jeep and do a Mercedes, Perkins, or SD Nissan Diesel conversion, or a seventies squarebody Chevy truck with a 53 Series Detroit Diesel. They run with no electrics at all and will burn any grade of diesel fuel, jet fuel or kerosene with a little oil in it, or any of several biodiesels or vegetable oils. If a stock vehicle must be bought get an IH Scout with the SD33t or a Mercedes sedan with an OM616 or OM617.

    Thousands of Somali warlords and South African farmers can’t be wrong: what you need is a Toyota Hilux 4*4. (Preferably a fairly old one that you can fix yourself.) Mount a .50 caliber machine gun on the back and I guarantee you: men will want to be you and women will want to be with you.

  201. @The Wild Geese Howard
    Iran has a significant population of men with lungs that were affected by chemical weapons used during the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq War.

    I expect that group to get hit hard and distort the numbers for a few weeks.

    Interesting and plausible. First time I’ve seen it mentioned.

  202. @Lagertha
    I look both ways, every single time, when in Europe.

    Definitely. I had an acquaintance who was killed driving out of Shannon airport some years ago. Looked the wrong way and pulled out in front of a truck.

  203. @Anonymous
    Massively under-rated: cotton liner gloves. If you have to go out and touch all kinds of things, it's better to do it in gloves. But you won't be able to go on for hours without liners - the sweat will quickly make it intolerable for extended periods.

    Under-rated: oregano oil. Tons of anecdotal and some amount of scientific indirect evidence suggests that it can protect from infections by all kinds of enveloped viruses (and may also somehow strengthen innate immunity?). It's nasty and basically a poison in large quantities but in small quantities perfectly safe.

    Isopropyl alcohol is cheapest of all disinfectants and will be effective even when diluted 2X from how it is sold by gallons in pharmacies.

    Of all the usual stuff besides food, gloves and masks, the most important is aspirin/acetaminophen. You are unlikely to die but if you do get sick, fever might be the worst part.

    Most of all, though: it's all bullshit! There won't be 70% of population infected. Personally, I am doing zero prepping. People scoff at the comparison, but prepping for global coronavirus epidemics makes as much sense as was prepping for Y2K causing an abrupt end to all economic activities.

    ….but prepping for global coronavirus epidemics makes as much sense as was prepping for Y2K causing an abrupt end to all economic activities.

    Y2K didn’t do serious damage because the relevant people took it seriously and paid people to beaver away at fixing hardware and software in time. The fact that a bunch of Alex Jones types heard about Y2K, and hyped it for fun and profit, obscures that fact. In any case, having years to fix how machines handle dates and times is nothing compared to containing a global pandemic that suddenly breaks out.

    • Agree: vhrm
    • Replies: @Anonymous

    nothing compared to containing a global pandemic that suddenly breaks out
     
    As anyone who can see sees, the Chinese did it just fine. The rate of new confirmed cases there went from >20% to 0.5% in a month. Sure, we probably will do worse job but the good thing is that most of us are not as easy to infect. So, everything is going to be fine!
  204. @Anonymous

    They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing
     
    Wrong. You need a certain grade of mask to stop the virus. It’s a zero-sum game. There's no such thing as better than nothing, in this case. Do your due diligence, or it will do you.

    Yes. N95. These masks are N95.

  205. @Autochthon
    While the idiots were at the Dollar General, the people who had their shit together of course just put the Pewags on their vehicles of choice and drove until they escaped the conditions....

    Only if you had a chainsaw and a 4wheel drive. Most roads had multiple trees down on them.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
    As I wrote: "the people who had their shit together."
  206. If what gets worse? The actual outbreak or the zombie apocalypse panic being stoked in the media? I’m going to buy an abdominal binder so I don’t split my gut laughing at those fools.

  207. Anon[212] • Disclaimer says:

    The normal masks are hard enough to wear for extended periods. I imagine that a tighter fitting, more tightly filtered mask would be claustrophobic and cause breathlessness in itself.

    My wife bought a third party vacuum cleaner attachment that is so skinny she can vacuum under low lying furniture. It screeches like a banshee, and she burns out the vacuum cleaner engine annually, requiring a replacement. N95 masks are sort of like my wife’s attachment.

  208. Here’s the link to the estimated Iranian casualty counts for the Iraqi chemical weapons attacks in the Iran-Iraq War:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_chemical_attacks_against_Iran#Casualties

    Note that these are only for the known Iraqi chemical attacks.

    Yes, it is unfortunate the table doesn’t break the casualty counts down by killed/wounded/missing/etc.

  209. Anonymous[140] • Disclaimer says:

    Doctor on CNBC said this morning that we have no accurate test in the US for Coronavirus at the moment. The CDC admitted the test kits they sent out earlier this month don’t work, told hospitals to stop using them and that they were working on more accurate tests.

    With that said, how much faith do we have that Italy or Iran have accurate tests, and that the deaths they are reporting are actually Coronavirus and not flu or something else that caused Cytokine Storm that killed these patients over 70 with pre-existing conditions?

    I’ve had flu or strep swab tests over the years that came back positive initially in doctors office quick test and later were negative after further lab results.

    My kids’ school here in US just went through its worst Influenza and Norovirus in years. Had to close for several days in February. The Flu is still circulating throughout the world. I really think that a lot of the Coronvirus diagnosis outside of China may overlap with Flu seasonality. I don’t think medical facilities or hospitals are discerning between coronavirus and influenza and chalking some of these flue cases as Coronavirus cases.

  210. @S. Anonyia
    So I’ll be in pretty good shape health wise, as a 30 yr old just prescribed statins (not overweight, either, my family is just prone to high blood pressure. I don’t have that yet but presumably high cholesterol is a predecessor?)

    Im almost thinking I’d rather get the virus early then recover.

    When I get the flu, it doesn’t last that long. Only thing that’s ever really affected me was bronchitis years and years ago.

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?

    We already bought masks, gloves, safety goggles, vitamins. Wondering if I should get beans, tuna, peanut butter, and canned water, as well.

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?

    Most young healthy people will be fine. However, some (and there’s no way to know which ones in advance) develop “cytokine storms” . A cytokine storm is an overproduction of immune cells and their activating compounds (cytokines) that end up in your the lungs. The virus doesn’t kill you – your own immune system kills you. You develop pneumonia and you die. This is why so many young, healthy people died in the Spanish Flu epidemic . Having a young healthy immune system makes the cytokine storm WORSE.

    So “just get it over with” is not a good idea. They are working on fast tracking a vaccine and they are learning by the day which anti-viral medications are best at reducing the severity of the disease for those who become infected and what are the best treatment protocols for those who develop cytokine storms, so time is your friend. If you can’t avoid being infected, later is better than sooner – maybe you’ll get lucky and get hit by a bus in the interim so the virus won’t kill you.

    • Replies: @another fred

    "...what are the best treatment protocols for those who develop cytokine storms..."
     
    There's even a book ($187.99) at Amazon:

    https://www.amazon.com/Cytokine-Storm-Syndrome-Randy-Cron/dp/3030220931?SubscriptionId=AKIAILSHYYTFIVPWUY6Q&tag=duckduckgo-d-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=3030220931

    According to the article linked below there are probably genetic problems:

    Mutations in the genes responsible for “any one of the 10-plus proteins that get perforin to do what it does” are linked to a higher risk of cytokine storm syndrome, Cron said.

    Some 10% to 15% of the population may carry these mutations, according to Cron’s calculations. Unlike infants, who tend to have two bad copies of one of the 10+ perforin-associated genes, these people have one mutated copy and one normal copy. “Generally, that’s enough to produce all the killing you need,” Cron said. “But if you get the wrong organism or the wrong inflammatory state it may push you over the edge.”
     
    https://www.uab.edu/reporter/know-more/publications/item/8909-here-s-a-playbook-for-stopping-deadly-cytokine-storm-syndrome
    , @ColRebSez
    The potential for a cytokine storm is one reason statins are so potentially helpful. They act as a very strong anti-inflammatory. The flu death rate for those taking statins is half that of those who don't. The cytokine storm is what made the 1918 Spanish Flu so lethal and caused it to kill so many young men.
  211. @Lugash
    There's speculation that you can easily be reinfected with a different strain of Covid-19 and that the reinfection is what's more deadly.

    Okay, but then doesn’t the same logic apply to the new strain? We’re all going to get it eventually. Better to face when you’re relatively healthy.

    • Replies: @Jack D

    We’re all going to get it eventually.
     
    No we won't. First of all, even in an uncontrolled epidemic 100% of the population does not become infected. 2nd they are working on vaccines and due to advances in techniques they may be able to produce one very quickly. Probably Covid-19 will fade when warm weather comes and possibly by next fall they will have an effective vaccine. It's not at all inevitable that 100% of the population is going to get this - in fact that's the least likely outcome.
  212. Influenza/Pneumonia Mortality by State
    https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/flu_pneumonia_mortality/flu_pneumonia.htm

    If you assume Coronavirus will follow the pattern of other pneumonia then it is time to pursue your childhood dream of moving to Alaska. Cali, not a good choice. FLA also works. Just remember, past performance is no guarantee of future performance.

    It might be interesting to get the breakdown by age and if possible insurance and other factors to get a first estimate of the place you have the best shot in. Oddly, scanning the states in rank order, I did not see an easy to discern pattern.

  213. @DragonDancing
    I wouldn't put muh reliance on the CDC and WHO numbers for the flu as it has been proven that they count all pneumonia deaths as flu when most have nothing to do with the flu and the CDC and the WHO own the majority of patents on vaccines and the flu is a massive profit maker for them so they are always fear mongering to pump up sales for the flu virus. I just read that this years flu vaccine is 10% effective and it has not been more than 50% effective for over 20 years.

    I just read that this years flu vaccine is 10% effective and it has not been more than 50% effective for over 20 years.

    You can’t really compute the effectiveness of the vaccine until the flu season is over so whoever said 10% is pulling this number out of their ass. Flu vaccine has to be manufactured based upon the best guesses of which strains will be most common in the coming year, based upon those that were most common last year. So this is like picking next year’s winner of the World Series before spring training even begins. You can make educated guesses but you’re not going to be able to guess right 100% of the time (or even 50% of the time). 50% is better than nothing and even if the vaccine does not completely prevent the disease it usually reduces its severity, so the lack of complete effectiveness is no reason not to get it, especially if you are older (as with coronavirus, the older you are the more likely it is that the flu will kill you). Side effects are rare, it’s usually 100% covered by insurance and you can get it in almost any pharmacy. Humans have this unique ability to rationalize not doing almost anything. Yeah, don’t get the flu shot because god forbid someone might make money off of it.

    • Agree: Malcolm X-Lax
    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    You can’t really compute the effectiveness of the vaccine until the flu season is over

     

    https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/past-seasons-estimates.html
  214. @Almost Missouri
    Okay, but then doesn't the same logic apply to the new strain? We're all going to get it eventually. Better to face when you're relatively healthy.

    We’re all going to get it eventually.

    No we won’t. First of all, even in an uncontrolled epidemic 100% of the population does not become infected. 2nd they are working on vaccines and due to advances in techniques they may be able to produce one very quickly. Probably Covid-19 will fade when warm weather comes and possibly by next fall they will have an effective vaccine. It’s not at all inevitable that 100% of the population is going to get this – in fact that’s the least likely outcome.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    Ah, thanks for answering my question. I appreciate your authoritative take on this and other subjects. But still I have to persist. No one can live alone indefinitely*, so eventually the virus will touch everyone. Maybe it will be after the main "epidemic" is over, and maybe that's an advantage, so maybe it is worth trying for somehow, but at some point, the costs of isolation are prohibitive.

    As I understand it, viruses don't die off, they "fade into the background" until they become just another childhood illness that no bothers about much anymore.

    As I understand vaccines, they operate by giving you a mild version of what they are supposed to inoculate you against. So you are essentially trading weak exposure now against strong exposure later. And maybe that's a good trade (assuming the the vaccine guys got the formula right and you don't react to any of the other vaccine ingredients, etc.). But you're still getting touched by the virus.

    So tl;dr: it still looks to me like everyone's gonna get this one way or another, whether or not it is inside the "epidemic" window.

    *Yes there have been exceptions (the Siberians who moved to America 12,000 years ago being the big one), but as soon as they come back into contact with the main mass of humanity, they have to update their virus situation in a hurry, usually with disastrous consequences. So the exceptions prove the rule, as it were.

  215. @S. Anonyia
    Arcadia? Only one I know of is in Louisiana. Hope you don’t live near there it’s (Along with the rest of Northern Louisiana) a shithole.

    I assume he meant Arcadia, California, near Steve. It’s 60% Asians.

  216. These guys have decent checklists – one for preps one for behavior.

    https://12survivors.com/blog/your-pandemic-preparedness-checklist/comment-page-1#comment-1783

    The biggie on the latter is stay away from crowds.

    And the big question is: Just how dumb do you have to be to go on a plane nowadays?

    I guess we’ll find out.
    Darwin is not mocked.

    I think I’m good now for three months, with water from a local stream. I can treat and filter 10,000 gallons.

  217. Anonymous[270] • Disclaimer says:
    @Cagey Beast
    ....but prepping for global coronavirus epidemics makes as much sense as was prepping for Y2K causing an abrupt end to all economic activities.

    Y2K didn't do serious damage because the relevant people took it seriously and paid people to beaver away at fixing hardware and software in time. The fact that a bunch of Alex Jones types heard about Y2K, and hyped it for fun and profit, obscures that fact. In any case, having years to fix how machines handle dates and times is nothing compared to containing a global pandemic that suddenly breaks out.

    nothing compared to containing a global pandemic that suddenly breaks out

    As anyone who can see sees, the Chinese did it just fine. The rate of new confirmed cases there went from >20% to 0.5% in a month. Sure, we probably will do worse job but the good thing is that most of us are not as easy to infect. So, everything is going to be fine!

  218. @anon
    A really serious pandemic that takes out many of the over 70 will wipe out national debts of many countries in an instant!

    I think some have noted that despite China’s economic rise, their population structure would cause them to grow old before they grow rich. So, yes, if half of the 70+ folks in China passed away suddenly, then the resources would go to the younger folks or to the rich who are positioned to transfer the value to themselves.

  219. @vhrm
    The issue is Iran.

    It actually looked like China possibly had it under control. But apparently Iran's been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it's spread from there to there whole middle East. There's no way Iran's going to be able to do China style containment so it's probably going to become endemic there and then the rest of Middle East and South Asia and Africa.

    And at that point it's just a matter of time until it gets everywhere else, including here and back into China from the outside.

    But apparently Iran’s been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it’s spread from there to there whole middle East.

    …be a shame if this wiped out the middle east…

  220. IThe best defense against Corona virus is to quit smoking cigarettes or cigars if you are a smoker, because smokers are much more likely to die of respiratory diseases.

    If you are overweight reducing your weight to acceptable parameters would also be helpful since many overweight people also have respiratory and circulatory problems.

    Moving South could also help. Corona viruses and flu viruses tend to flourish more in the winter time when the weather is cold than in the summertime when it is warm therefore it is intuitive that if you move to South Florida or Hawaii perhaps you are less likely to catch the virus.

    Here in North Florida the weather is fairly mild at the present time but it’s dipping close to freezing temperatures at night this week, however we soon expect some warmer weather. It will be interesting to see whether the incidence of cases of the COVID virus occur more frequently in more northerly latitudes in the United States this spring.

    Stay out of airplanes. Inside airplanes and also to some extent inside airport buildings is probably the place where you are most likely to catch the virus. If you cannot stay out of airplanes using your own private jet would probably preferable. If you work at an airport just quit your job or stay home for the duration. If you are an airline pilot or crew change your job. Also avoid cruise ships if possible.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house. Alternatively you can shop with the Walmart shopping app where they bring your groceries out to your vehicle and put them in the back of your vehicle and you do not need to go inside the store.

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor’s offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    Stay away from places of mass entertainment such as restaurants and cinemas or theaters. As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube. Outdoor mass entertainment venues such as football stadiums maybe a little safer but even then they could be some risk of people coughing over you. Indoor venues like basketball should be avoided.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    100% agree with everything you said UNTIL you got to the stock market. Typically the stock market overreacts and then swings back again. The best advice is to ignore temporary swings and play the long game. Going short (assuming you are betting against the market and not just hedging your portfolio) is crazy risky and not something that amateurs should attempt.
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    You're right about needlessly being near to people if there are other options. Quitting your job, though?! That's for infotainment-filled, hysterical pussies. Your telling people to avoid hospitals is reasonable, even when there's no badass new virus going around, as where to most people die, after all? That's right, in the hospital! However, if you work in one, you just need to take more of the precautions that you should have been doing all along.

    Oh, and people are supposed to move south because of this one particular virus? Come on, man. It's one thing if you already live in an RV. If you live in a van down by the Raisen River up in Monroe, by all means, fill it up before the stations are out, and live in your van down by the Suwannee River down in Mayo.

    Will quitting smoking THIS WEEK make a difference, or is it a long-term thing, which I'm sure would be better for you next year or two after you've kept them clear for a while?

    Half of your advise, Mr. Mason, is, to put it nicely, UNSOUND.
    , @Lurker
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78GE90_AX_c
    , @mobi

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.
     
    Even the Spanish Flu apparently only took ~ 10% out of the Dow:

    https://ofdollarsanddata.com/how-will-coronavirus-affect-your-portfolio/

    A global pandemic that killed 3% of the Earth’s population only sent markets down 10% over a period of 4 months.

    This is a stunning result. The worst virus since the bubonic plague and markets go through a run-of-the-mill decline? I would not have guessed that beforehand.

    And it is unlikely that coronavirus will be anywhere near as catastrophic as the Spanish flu because of our greatly improved medical knowledge over the past century. However, this does not imply that the economic costs will be lower.

    If anything, the economic costs of coronavirus are likely to be higher than prior epidemics as we take larger preventive measures to stop the virus from spreading. Cancelling tens of thousands of flights to the most populous country on Earth is just one example of this.

    We can speculate on this in every way we want, but no one knows what will happen. If history is any guide, coronavirus is likely to cause a small, but temporary, pullback as it continues to spread.

    But once things begin to improve, the market is likely to get out of its funk and recover its losses. Another crisis will be averted and humanity will march on.
     
    , @Dissident

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house.
     
    What if one's Amazon PrimeNow or Fresh deliverymen is likely to be from one's local Chinatown? (To say nothing of the warehouse workers preparing one's order.)

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor’s offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.
     
    What if one has a loved one who is confined to a hospital or nursing home?

    As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube.

     

    It might not be a bad idea to download and save digital content now (videos as well as audio files; books and other text documents, etc.) to have available should one lose Internet access yet retain electrical power. This might be a good time for people to discover such lesser-known offerings as recordings of Old Time Radio, or of the many public domain books read by LibriVox volunteers.

    Also:
    - maintain extra, charged batteries for phone (plus laptop, tablet, etc) at all times; and a UPS (uninterruptible power supply) unit
    - properly backup critical data daily. Maintain redundancy: at least two separate copies (at least one on physical media), stored in two separate locations (at least one a secured physical; cloud storage should not be relied upon for more than one instance of redundancy.
    - I did not see anyone mention those crank-powered (wind-up) radios with built-in flashlights

  221. @Jack D

    We’re all going to get it eventually.
     
    No we won't. First of all, even in an uncontrolled epidemic 100% of the population does not become infected. 2nd they are working on vaccines and due to advances in techniques they may be able to produce one very quickly. Probably Covid-19 will fade when warm weather comes and possibly by next fall they will have an effective vaccine. It's not at all inevitable that 100% of the population is going to get this - in fact that's the least likely outcome.

    Ah, thanks for answering my question. I appreciate your authoritative take on this and other subjects. But still I have to persist. No one can live alone indefinitely*, so eventually the virus will touch everyone. Maybe it will be after the main “epidemic” is over, and maybe that’s an advantage, so maybe it is worth trying for somehow, but at some point, the costs of isolation are prohibitive.

    As I understand it, viruses don’t die off, they “fade into the background” until they become just another childhood illness that no bothers about much anymore.

    As I understand vaccines, they operate by giving you a mild version of what they are supposed to inoculate you against. So you are essentially trading weak exposure now against strong exposure later. And maybe that’s a good trade (assuming the the vaccine guys got the formula right and you don’t react to any of the other vaccine ingredients, etc.). But you’re still getting touched by the virus.

    So tl;dr: it still looks to me like everyone’s gonna get this one way or another, whether or not it is inside the “epidemic” window.

    *Yes there have been exceptions (the Siberians who moved to America 12,000 years ago being the big one), but as soon as they come back into contact with the main mass of humanity, they have to update their virus situation in a hurry, usually with disastrous consequences. So the exceptions prove the rule, as it were.

    • Replies: @Jack D

    But you’re still getting touched by the virus.
     
    I was (hopefully all of us were) inoculated as a child against various deadly illnesses - smallpox, polio, diptheria, etc. Getting the vaccine is a far cry from getting the disease itself. You can "touch" a bullet by holding it in the palm of your hand or it can touch you by being fired from a gun and making a hole in you. These are both "touches" but they are two completely different things.
  222. @Almost Missouri
    Ah, thanks for answering my question. I appreciate your authoritative take on this and other subjects. But still I have to persist. No one can live alone indefinitely*, so eventually the virus will touch everyone. Maybe it will be after the main "epidemic" is over, and maybe that's an advantage, so maybe it is worth trying for somehow, but at some point, the costs of isolation are prohibitive.

    As I understand it, viruses don't die off, they "fade into the background" until they become just another childhood illness that no bothers about much anymore.

    As I understand vaccines, they operate by giving you a mild version of what they are supposed to inoculate you against. So you are essentially trading weak exposure now against strong exposure later. And maybe that's a good trade (assuming the the vaccine guys got the formula right and you don't react to any of the other vaccine ingredients, etc.). But you're still getting touched by the virus.

    So tl;dr: it still looks to me like everyone's gonna get this one way or another, whether or not it is inside the "epidemic" window.

    *Yes there have been exceptions (the Siberians who moved to America 12,000 years ago being the big one), but as soon as they come back into contact with the main mass of humanity, they have to update their virus situation in a hurry, usually with disastrous consequences. So the exceptions prove the rule, as it were.

    But you’re still getting touched by the virus.

    I was (hopefully all of us were) inoculated as a child against various deadly illnesses – smallpox, polio, diptheria, etc. Getting the vaccine is a far cry from getting the disease itself. You can “touch” a bullet by holding it in the palm of your hand or it can touch you by being fired from a gun and making a hole in you. These are both “touches” but they are two completely different things.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    By the same token, touching a bullet now doesn't make you bulletproof later, so maybe bullets aren't the best metaphor for viruses, which are after all two completely different things.

    Yes, most of us did get inoculations as children. OTOH, epidemiologically most of of those diseases inoculated against were on the wane by the time the vaccines came out, which suggests that mankind's collective immune system was already overcoming the diseases, but the vaccine makers just arrived in time to bayonet the wounded and declare themselves the victors (to make a different metaphor).
  223. @J.Ross
    Is it the Corona or is this campaign message from Mike Bloomberg a bit ... unclear?
    "Pathetic racists never fail to make me laugh. Mike Bloomberg doesn't. Paid for by &cet."
    https://postimg.cc/064Tmf0K
    So, racists consistently cause Mike (and/or an omniscient narrator) to laugh, but Mike himself does not fail to make [God?] laugh, so ... Mike is a racist?

    So, racists consistently cause Mike (and/or an omniscient narrator) to laugh, but Mike himself does not fail to make [God?] laugh, so … Mike is a racist?

    Yes, but not a pathetic one.

  224. @JUSA
    Why are Utah residents with Northern & Western European ancestry more susceptible than other whites in the US?

    Also why are these whites more susceptible than other European whites:
    - British in England and Scotland
    - Finnish in Finland
    - Iberian population in Spain
    - Toscani in Italia

    You have to allow a few percentage point margin for error, so some of the “differences” may not really be there.

    As I understand it, the basic ACE2 story is that it is common in East Asia and uncommon around the Mediterranean, with everyone else on a gradient in between. So, Southern Europeans (Iberia, Toscani) have it less than Northern Europeans (British and NW-Euro-descended Utahans) have it less than Northeastern Europeans (Finns) have it less than Asians. Etc.

    The peculiar pair is British vs. Utah, who should be about the same or if different British should be lower due to more admixture of ancient Iberian, but instead British is significantly higher. Don’t know what that’s about.

    Also, I would hesitate to translate “frequency of genetic variants” into “susceptibility to disease”. This is still at the theory stage, IMHO.

    • Replies: @JohnPlywood
    Wow, you managed to get everytning wrong. P.S., The "ancient Iberian" in British people is Bell Beaker immigrants from Germany who invaded Iberia from the North and then just as rapidly invaded England from Iberia. They had no Mediterranean ancestry to speak of.
  225. @Jack D

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?
     
    Most young healthy people will be fine. However, some (and there's no way to know which ones in advance) develop "cytokine storms" . A cytokine storm is an overproduction of immune cells and their activating compounds (cytokines) that end up in your the lungs. The virus doesn't kill you - your own immune system kills you. You develop pneumonia and you die. This is why so many young, healthy people died in the Spanish Flu epidemic . Having a young healthy immune system makes the cytokine storm WORSE.

    So "just get it over with" is not a good idea. They are working on fast tracking a vaccine and they are learning by the day which anti-viral medications are best at reducing the severity of the disease for those who become infected and what are the best treatment protocols for those who develop cytokine storms, so time is your friend. If you can't avoid being infected, later is better than sooner - maybe you'll get lucky and get hit by a bus in the interim so the virus won't kill you.

    “…what are the best treatment protocols for those who develop cytokine storms…”

    There’s even a book ($187.99) at Amazon:

    According to the article linked below there are probably genetic problems:

    Mutations in the genes responsible for “any one of the 10-plus proteins that get perforin to do what it does” are linked to a higher risk of cytokine storm syndrome, Cron said.

    Some 10% to 15% of the population may carry these mutations, according to Cron’s calculations. Unlike infants, who tend to have two bad copies of one of the 10+ perforin-associated genes, these people have one mutated copy and one normal copy. “Generally, that’s enough to produce all the killing you need,” Cron said. “But if you get the wrong organism or the wrong inflammatory state it may push you over the edge.”

    https://www.uab.edu/reporter/know-more/publications/item/8909-here-s-a-playbook-for-stopping-deadly-cytokine-storm-syndrome

  226. @Anonymous
    not being a damn boomer or having a foot in the grave beforehand

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    “as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already”

    how long til you are wondering why your phone doesn’t work, why there’s no water or electricity and who’s going to fix everything?

  227. @grim prognosis
    I've gotten into enjoying the squabbles between you two generations. You're a match in hell.

    We X's stand back and watch you with our notorious cynicism at the nonsense you two generations of true believers bellow out. Both of you in your respective youths believed "the whole world is watching" and projected a narcissistic media feedback loop. We weren't much for that stuff, maybe because we saw when we were young how full of shit you people had been.

    We have more in common with Silents in some respect, but on the whole we watch in disbelief.

    It's you people who turned this country into a balkanized, outsourced wasteland, after your hedonic wing completed the march through the institutions. I went to college just as the keys were being handed over, and at least caught the tail end of what the Silents had to offer. I could see what was coming. These millennials are your spawn, not us. The education I got not three decades ago is now gone, wiped out by your generation's silliness.

    It's going to take a long haul to undo the rot. Grateful for what? For destroying the social fabric of our country? Doing great? I bet you are. Where I am in flyover country, many of our communities don't even exist anymore. Sorry, some of us think of a nation as more than a bunch of consumers.

    OK, Xer.

    • Replies: @Tusk
    Gen X suffers from Middle Child Syndrome to the extreme.
  228. @Jack D

    I just read that this years flu vaccine is 10% effective and it has not been more than 50% effective for over 20 years.

     

    You can't really compute the effectiveness of the vaccine until the flu season is over so whoever said 10% is pulling this number out of their ass. Flu vaccine has to be manufactured based upon the best guesses of which strains will be most common in the coming year, based upon those that were most common last year. So this is like picking next year's winner of the World Series before spring training even begins. You can make educated guesses but you're not going to be able to guess right 100% of the time (or even 50% of the time). 50% is better than nothing and even if the vaccine does not completely prevent the disease it usually reduces its severity, so the lack of complete effectiveness is no reason not to get it, especially if you are older (as with coronavirus, the older you are the more likely it is that the flu will kill you). Side effects are rare, it's usually 100% covered by insurance and you can get it in almost any pharmacy. Humans have this unique ability to rationalize not doing almost anything. Yeah, don't get the flu shot because god forbid someone might make money off of it.

    You can’t really compute the effectiveness of the vaccine until the flu season is over

    https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/past-seasons-estimates.html

  229. @donut
    Childish

    God forgives, donut. But the heads up won’t help, because you’re irrepressible.

    Cracks me up.

  230. @bigdicknick
    Check local non chain hardware stores especially ones that aren't popular. The badly run hardware store near my house has a few dozen boxes of them. I bought one today and upon consideration plan to buy more tomorrow.

    Bought more today….I got an off brand box, but still niosh certified. The price went up to $40 a box vs. $30 for a box of 3m yesterday. All the 3m 20 unit boxes were gone and only the 10 unit boxes were left. I know own 42 n95 masks.

    • Replies: @bigdicknick
    I am going to go to Costco to stock up on various other supplies...basically just the same shit I always get, but moving my dry goods purchases forwards by several months. If anywhere in my large city has coronavirus it's probably costco so ill be masking up and wearing gloves.
  231. Traps if squirrels are in your yard. Best types are homemade seesaw PVC pipe, or Black Cat rat trap from India. The latter takes a month to arrive but saves you the trouble of dispatching the little guy.

    Things to forego: cannabis, women not living with you. Things to do: exercise moderately, sleep immoderately.

    • Replies: @Antiwar7
    Why cannabis?
  232. @bigdicknick
    n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that's it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    I just went and checked my Amazon past ordering history because about 3 years ago I had to by my own n95 1860 mask to do the required fit-testing prior to a nursing contract I was working. Those are unsurprisingly out of stock. The hospital system I work at now has removed them from all of the clean supply rooms and require approval by the house supervisor to obtain. I’ve got a some left over from that box but gave many of them away to friends in the bay area during the Paradise “camp” fire back in 2018, (in which my uncle was one of the 84 people killed, incidentally). At any rate, here’s the thing: You don’t need an N95 mask. You may feel more protected but transmission is, assuming one believes the CDC, like the flu, through respiratory droplets, not floating on the air like TB or Measles. A regular surgical mask and face shield (or glasses), as well as good hand washing or anti-bacterial hand sanitizing should be enough to protect you. Also, avoid all oriental people. That last part was a joke.

    • Replies: @Lurker
    My vague assumption is that people wear the masks to protect themselves but in reality they actually do more to stop the infected spreading their germs than stop the uninfected catching them.
  233. @Jack D

    But you’re still getting touched by the virus.
     
    I was (hopefully all of us were) inoculated as a child against various deadly illnesses - smallpox, polio, diptheria, etc. Getting the vaccine is a far cry from getting the disease itself. You can "touch" a bullet by holding it in the palm of your hand or it can touch you by being fired from a gun and making a hole in you. These are both "touches" but they are two completely different things.

    By the same token, touching a bullet now doesn’t make you bulletproof later, so maybe bullets aren’t the best metaphor for viruses, which are after all two completely different things.

    Yes, most of us did get inoculations as children. OTOH, epidemiologically most of of those diseases inoculated against were on the wane by the time the vaccines came out, which suggests that mankind’s collective immune system was already overcoming the diseases, but the vaccine makers just arrived in time to bayonet the wounded and declare themselves the victors (to make a different metaphor).

  234. @J.Ross
    God damn it Steve, even if this is a joke, this here is the most boomer post ever. Apply normal hygeine precautions, remember SARS, and don't panic. Surely Beijing is lying but this is probably nothing
    --------
    List anyway:
    Chloroquin, which [ahem] appears to cure this; it worked on SARS. It's an old anti-malarial, proven and very widely available. Grep enough for ten days at 500mg. As with antibiotics, do not stop dosing when symptoms clear up.
    If all the rumors are true, including the one about six months of purging unbelievers:
    That American-Canadian herring (is it Bar Harbor?), Spanish octopus, Georgian caviar, Georgian wine, Russian caviar, Japanese mackeral, Litvak sprats, Spanish chorizo, Romanian trout, white tuna, King Oscar sardines, and Deming salmon; spring water (I assume you have filters as well), rices (especially sushi, basmati, wild, and black), red kidney beans, red lentils, green lentils, olive oil, kimchi, real sauerkraut, щи (in frozen but separated bricks), pickles, olives, a tent, a Perception Keowee sub-kayak with paddle and skirt and vehicle mounting, raw onions (for purging the membranes), ziplocs in varying sizes, disposable plates and cutlery, a sjambok, a machete, a Mora, a WWI German butcher bayonet, a Dutch oven, a pellet heater, water purification tablets, bleach, gasoline, a generator, a Faraday cage, Siberian restorative herbs, Lugol's iodine, 5-HTP, NooPep, turmeric, duct tape, a kugelwagen (with a technical conversion, twin 50 cal at least), adult multi-vitamins, those new powderized vegetable pills, gmo-free beet powder, the really good more expensive first aid kit, Padron cigars with lighters and clippers, a S&W M&P II with four mags and 500 rounds of .223, a South African harness, a Coonan Classic with 300 rounds of .357 magnum, a decent Tikka in .308 with 150 rounds, an aquaponics setup, flashcards and pens (be able to communicate without internet or physical contact), bowls, a Chinese tactical shovel, flashlight and rechargeable batteries, sturdy garbage bags, marihuana (to be able to trade with hippie scum), oregano (to be able to mess with hippie scum), beads (to be able to trade wirh Indians), Luksosowa, Laphraoig, Mio sparking sake, Spanish Cava, a cow, two goats, six SILENT chickens, two roosters, normal soap, Castille soap, toilet paper, latex gloves (or another material if allergic), face masks (if infected*), and (of course) zinc.
    Slim-Fast is disgusting and unhealthy but (weakly) replaces a meal and keeps long at room temperature.
    All, for half a year.
    Avoid things which absorb moisture or will not keep, which includes improperly stored onions, and definitely most breads, crackers, cereals, etc.. Dairy runs out when it runs out: be able to drop it as a nutrient. Freezing milk gives mixed results.
    *Face masks are for the infected, to courteously prevent further spread. Shinobiying everywhere in a mask will not protect you.
    Skip that "vertical potato field" box. It works only with one kind of rapidly-growing potato.

    ‘Laphraoig’

    Damn straight.

    Being of one of those ethnicities that cannot have booze in thier house without drinking it immediately I have already finished my emergency supply.

    Oh well.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    Being of one of those ethnicities that cannot have booze in thier house without drinking it immediately I have already finished my emergency supply.

    Oh well.
     
    Hey, me too!
  235. @J.Ross
    God damn it Steve, even if this is a joke, this here is the most boomer post ever. Apply normal hygeine precautions, remember SARS, and don't panic. Surely Beijing is lying but this is probably nothing
    --------
    List anyway:
    Chloroquin, which [ahem] appears to cure this; it worked on SARS. It's an old anti-malarial, proven and very widely available. Grep enough for ten days at 500mg. As with antibiotics, do not stop dosing when symptoms clear up.
    If all the rumors are true, including the one about six months of purging unbelievers:
    That American-Canadian herring (is it Bar Harbor?), Spanish octopus, Georgian caviar, Georgian wine, Russian caviar, Japanese mackeral, Litvak sprats, Spanish chorizo, Romanian trout, white tuna, King Oscar sardines, and Deming salmon; spring water (I assume you have filters as well), rices (especially sushi, basmati, wild, and black), red kidney beans, red lentils, green lentils, olive oil, kimchi, real sauerkraut, щи (in frozen but separated bricks), pickles, olives, a tent, a Perception Keowee sub-kayak with paddle and skirt and vehicle mounting, raw onions (for purging the membranes), ziplocs in varying sizes, disposable plates and cutlery, a sjambok, a machete, a Mora, a WWI German butcher bayonet, a Dutch oven, a pellet heater, water purification tablets, bleach, gasoline, a generator, a Faraday cage, Siberian restorative herbs, Lugol's iodine, 5-HTP, NooPep, turmeric, duct tape, a kugelwagen (with a technical conversion, twin 50 cal at least), adult multi-vitamins, those new powderized vegetable pills, gmo-free beet powder, the really good more expensive first aid kit, Padron cigars with lighters and clippers, a S&W M&P II with four mags and 500 rounds of .223, a South African harness, a Coonan Classic with 300 rounds of .357 magnum, a decent Tikka in .308 with 150 rounds, an aquaponics setup, flashcards and pens (be able to communicate without internet or physical contact), bowls, a Chinese tactical shovel, flashlight and rechargeable batteries, sturdy garbage bags, marihuana (to be able to trade with hippie scum), oregano (to be able to mess with hippie scum), beads (to be able to trade wirh Indians), Luksosowa, Laphraoig, Mio sparking sake, Spanish Cava, a cow, two goats, six SILENT chickens, two roosters, normal soap, Castille soap, toilet paper, latex gloves (or another material if allergic), face masks (if infected*), and (of course) zinc.
    Slim-Fast is disgusting and unhealthy but (weakly) replaces a meal and keeps long at room temperature.
    All, for half a year.
    Avoid things which absorb moisture or will not keep, which includes improperly stored onions, and definitely most breads, crackers, cereals, etc.. Dairy runs out when it runs out: be able to drop it as a nutrient. Freezing milk gives mixed results.
    *Face masks are for the infected, to courteously prevent further spread. Shinobiying everywhere in a mask will not protect you.
    Skip that "vertical potato field" box. It works only with one kind of rapidly-growing potato.

    ‘Dairy runs out when it runs out: ‘

    Milk powder.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    There is also shelf stable milk (packed in UHT packaging aka juice boxes) - this is good for several months at least (and probably longer than the package date indicates). Not to mention canned milk (condensed and evaporated).

    Generally speaking, when a product package indicates "BEST BEFORE" this means that after that date the taste of the product may deteriorate or change from when it was freshly packed, but as long as the package remains intact it is generally still safe to eat. Let your taste and your eyes be your guide - if the product tastes rancid or "off" or looks curdled, the wrong color, etc. then discard. If it looks and tastes OK then don't worry about the BEST BEFORE date. Also use your common sense - if the best by date is 2/20 and now it's 3/20 it's probably fine. If the expiration date was Jan 1999 - maybe not.

    "USE BY" or "USE OR FREEZE BY" means that the product may actually be spoiled and unsafe to eat if not consumed by the indicated date. You should take those expiration dates more seriously.

    , @Achmed E. Newman
    Expiration dates are for pussies.

    That's what I told my doctor when he asked about my stocking up on some medicine a few years back.
  236. @Whiskey
    Black pilled Eeyore that's me. Afraid of women no. Dislike idiot feminist lunacy like nails on a chalkboard yes.

    As for guns ammo, you better have it. Periodically police run away: Rodney King and Freddy Gray riots, Criwn Heights, etc. Expect 3-5 days of wilding. The Purge movies in real life. No cops right there ... it's free crime day.

    You know who I am talking about. Better have ammo.

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.

    An epidemic police will be gone for months not days and you will be alone with the vibrant diverse.

    You'd damned well better be armed son!

    If your situation seems dire, you can dig rationally sited fighting holes and cover them with plywood and then leaf litter. Possibly more effective than responding from inside a house.

  237. @Jonathan Mason
    IThe best defense against Corona virus is to quit smoking cigarettes or cigars if you are a smoker, because smokers are much more likely to die of respiratory diseases.

    If you are overweight reducing your weight to acceptable parameters would also be helpful since many overweight people also have respiratory and circulatory problems.

    Moving South could also help. Corona viruses and flu viruses tend to flourish more in the winter time when the weather is cold than in the summertime when it is warm therefore it is intuitive that if you move to South Florida or Hawaii perhaps you are less likely to catch the virus.

    Here in North Florida the weather is fairly mild at the present time but it's dipping close to freezing temperatures at night this week, however we soon expect some warmer weather. It will be interesting to see whether the incidence of cases of the COVID virus occur more frequently in more northerly latitudes in the United States this spring.

    Stay out of airplanes. Inside airplanes and also to some extent inside airport buildings is probably the place where you are most likely to catch the virus. If you cannot stay out of airplanes using your own private jet would probably preferable. If you work at an airport just quit your job or stay home for the duration. If you are an airline pilot or crew change your job. Also avoid cruise ships if possible.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house. Alternatively you can shop with the Walmart shopping app where they bring your groceries out to your vehicle and put them in the back of your vehicle and you do not need to go inside the store.

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor's offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    Stay away from places of mass entertainment such as restaurants and cinemas or theaters. As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube. Outdoor mass entertainment venues such as football stadiums maybe a little safer but even then they could be some risk of people coughing over you. Indoor venues like basketball should be avoided.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

    100% agree with everything you said UNTIL you got to the stock market. Typically the stock market overreacts and then swings back again. The best advice is to ignore temporary swings and play the long game. Going short (assuming you are betting against the market and not just hedging your portfolio) is crazy risky and not something that amateurs should attempt.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
    Every stock position should be hedged, but I think there is a good chance that the market may go down more over the next month or two when it starts to become apparent that the epidemic is affecting various areas of commerce such as travel. Auto stocks are getting slammed and companies like Starbucks and Apple are cutting back on operations in China.

    It is not so much the effects of the virus, which may be no worse than a normal flu season, but the effect of the measures taken to contain it.

    The Disney theme park in Shanghai is closed and that is affecting businesses in surrounding communities such as hotels and restaurants. So is the Hong Kong Disney.

    DIS is a Dow stock.

    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=disney+coronavirus&view=detail&mid=A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54&FORM=VIRE

    Also the U.S. 10-Year Treasury Note Yield Index (TNX) collapsed to close to a record low, due to fears of a coronavirus-led recession in several countries. The CBOE Volatility Index (VIX) has also spiked.

    Also I would not be wanting to increase any long positions in health insurance stocks during the primary voting season.

  238. Anon[710] • Disclaimer says:

    I wouldn’t worry about electricity or water. Most of those systems don’t take much tending. Gasoline, however, is another problem. Gasoline has to be driven in trucks to your local station. If too many truck drivers are sick, there’s going to be no gas delivered until they’re well enough to drive. I expect local shortages.

    • Agree: kikz
  239. @Alden
    Good for you for remembering that dried food needs to be cooked. Dried beans are wonderful in that 1 cup of dried beans becomes 3 cups of cooked beans. But they need to be boiled a long time.

    Chickpeas take forever as long as 1o hours. Black beans and red kidney beans are about the shortest times, 2 hours. Lentil and dried peas 30 minutes.

    Every winter electricity goes out. So electric stoves, crock pots micro waves are useless. Gas stoves are more reliable. All those survivalist and earthquake preparedness ideas that depending on cooking food are useless if you can’t cook.

    Canned food that is palatable cold is best. Fruit, not vegetables. Standard sweetish baked beans instead of chili beans. Canned chili is pretty bad. Cold canned Chili must be awful. Canned beets corn green beans taste good canned potatoes and spinach bad. Carrots cabbage and turnips taste just fine raw and last a long time. Be careful where you store food that isn’t canned. You’ll get rats mice and raccoons.

    We had an electric stove and a couple power outages every year when we lived in the suburbs. We didn’t bother, just ate bread cookies fruit salad I always cooked 2 fried chickens at once so there was often cold chicken. Kids always wanted to cook hotdogs in the fireplace. We did a few times.
    I bet if you put regular rice in a pot of cold water it would soften as much as if it were cooked in a day. Certainly oatmeal cream of wheat minute rice and that kraft macaroni in a box would soften up in 24 hours etc.
    In the earthquakes the food falls off the shelves and food that’s in bags and boxes gets broken and messed up.

    Palatable when cold canned food is the way to go. Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration. Then there’s canned tuna and fish.

    I don’t believe the gas and electricity needs all that much human attention. The electric substations get along with just a few people to keep adjusting the circuit flow.

    Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration.

    Ah yes, those little cans of corned beef from Argentina…wait, what?

    • Replies: @anon
    The US Feds banned those little cans of corned beef from Argentina back around 2001, then there was some event in 2014. Possibly some food safety issues?

    Spam might be cheaper and keeps just as long on the shelf. Assuming one doesn't mind eating pork.

    , @Jack D
    We don't get this stuff (AKA "Bully Beef") much in America but it's very popular in countries where refrigeration is not as common (and in places where it was less common until recently). The closest thing that we get is SPAM (the kind in a can, not the email kind) which is packed in the same way.
    , @J.Ross
    USsians get criticized (by crazy plant worshippers) for red meat consumption, but it's really us, Mexicans, Brazilians, and Argies who eat much more red meat than most others, and I believe Argies consume more beef than we do. Brazilian and Argentine style steakhouses are expensive but absolutely worth a visit.
  240. @Lurker
    Bleach - I'm told bleach is no longer used in hospitals. Why is that? It kills everything, dissolves all sorts of nasty stuff.

    Its because disinfectant is less harsh on peoples lungs having no ammonia etc.

    • Replies: @Lurker
    OK, thanks, that makes sense.
  241. @grim prognosis
    I've gotten into enjoying the squabbles between you two generations. You're a match in hell.

    We X's stand back and watch you with our notorious cynicism at the nonsense you two generations of true believers bellow out. Both of you in your respective youths believed "the whole world is watching" and projected a narcissistic media feedback loop. We weren't much for that stuff, maybe because we saw when we were young how full of shit you people had been.

    We have more in common with Silents in some respect, but on the whole we watch in disbelief.

    It's you people who turned this country into a balkanized, outsourced wasteland, after your hedonic wing completed the march through the institutions. I went to college just as the keys were being handed over, and at least caught the tail end of what the Silents had to offer. I could see what was coming. These millennials are your spawn, not us. The education I got not three decades ago is now gone, wiped out by your generation's silliness.

    It's going to take a long haul to undo the rot. Grateful for what? For destroying the social fabric of our country? Doing great? I bet you are. Where I am in flyover country, many of our communities don't even exist anymore. Sorry, some of us think of a nation as more than a bunch of consumers.

    Generally agree, as an X-er. I can’t always blanket condemn Boomers and Millennials because I have too many friends and acquaintances in those categories whom I like and admire, and who in turn have helped me. (I feel the same way about Jews, FWIW.) Not that this blinds me to the painfully obvious habits these groups can have in aggregate though. Ok, now that I’m done with my personal virtue signalling, I’ll note my frustration with the Boomer generation in particular, which I think is hardly unique.

    After having inherited the greatest windfall of social assets in recorded history, rather than pass it on improved, or at least unencumbered, they are instead sucking out and consuming what is (or can be made) liquid—which though selfish, is at least understandable and rational from an amoral point of view—but additionally they are handing out what remains to the manifestly unworthy in exchange for socially destructive (though personally vainglorious) diversity points.

    Having spent a fair chunk of my life climbing the greasy poles of academic and corporate hierarchy, it is of course dismaying to learn that the payoff to this investment is, “sorry we’re only hiring/promoting Diversity now, and you’re not it. Of course, we weren’t doing that when I, Boomer, made my career, but now that mine’s made, we are because it makes me feel good about myself and that’s what’s important.” Thanks, man. Had I known this would be the outcome, I would have focused more on my own thing and less on your teamplayer BS.

    Note to the younger generations: don’t trust boomer institutions to have have your back when you reach boomer age—or even before. (Yes, I know the Social Security Ponzi scheme was set up long pre-boomer, but those people are overrated too. FDR, rot in hell.)

    Kathy Shaidle (a tail-end boomer I admired), used to describe the boomers as the Cash Out Generation. I can’t disagree. Having won the born-in-the-right-place-at-the-right-time lottery, they’ve worked to ensure that no one after them will ever say that again. Some people, especially those in groups we’re increasingly importing, have ethnic nepotism workarounds to advance themselves, but I don’t. Besides not being “ethnic”, I trusted the pre-boomer meritocracy to continue to work despite the boomer-led social ructions of the late twentieth century. I was mistaken.

    Here endeth the lament.

    • Agree: Autochthon
    • Replies: @Jack D
    Boomer-like behavior is not unique to Boomers. It's a human thing. I was speaking recently to a friend about his British maternal grandfather, who had owned a very substantial business - something involving metallurgy, with defense contracts, etc. - I forget the details. His grandfather would have been born before WWI so even older than Greatest Generation. He recalled that as a child he had visited his grandparents and they had lived like proper British upper class people, with a stately home, a Rolls, servants, impeccably dressed, etc. - the whole nine yards. But they spent every penny that they had on themselves and left his mother nothing. He wasn't really bitter about it - it was their money and they were free to spend it as they wished and what they wished was to spend it on themselves.
    , @Achmed E. Newman
    A.M.: In 1978 someone I know well was turned down for a great DJ position at a Country Music radio station due to the boss having to hire a black guy to please the FCC. This stuff has been going on a LONG TIME. You can definitely blame the Boomer generation for being complacent about it and not fighting it enough. However, they'd had the same BS on them too, albeit not the ludicrously stupid woke berating that one hears now.

    .

    .

    Oh, the black guy lasted only through the summer, and the boss hired the white guy after that, who was so loyal to the place that he quit cussing for life, just so he wouldn't make a mistake on the air. He and that boss from over 40 years back have been friends ever since. No, that wasn't me! (Can you tell?)
    , @Alden
    Affirmative action act was passed in 1968 the disparate impact rule came in Griggs 1973. The oldest boomers were 22 and 27 , not in a position to do anything. A few were just out of law school.

    Brown 1953 to Griggs 1973. It really was the greatest generation who did it. 20 years when White judges presidents VPs Senators Congress critters and all the capitalist and communist powers that be destroyed White Americans .

    Some of us tried, really tried, especially born before the boomers in our 30s and 40s. There were some seriously illegal things contemplated. But we lost and are on our way to extinction.
    , @bigdicknick
    "We need to make room for diversity, well not me specifically, but definitely you!"
  242. @Pheasant
    'Dairy runs out when it runs out: '

    Milk powder.

    There is also shelf stable milk (packed in UHT packaging aka juice boxes) – this is good for several months at least (and probably longer than the package date indicates). Not to mention canned milk (condensed and evaporated).

    Generally speaking, when a product package indicates “BEST BEFORE” this means that after that date the taste of the product may deteriorate or change from when it was freshly packed, but as long as the package remains intact it is generally still safe to eat. Let your taste and your eyes be your guide – if the product tastes rancid or “off” or looks curdled, the wrong color, etc. then discard. If it looks and tastes OK then don’t worry about the BEST BEFORE date. Also use your common sense – if the best by date is 2/20 and now it’s 3/20 it’s probably fine. If the expiration date was Jan 1999 – maybe not.

    “USE BY” or “USE OR FREEZE BY” means that the product may actually be spoiled and unsafe to eat if not consumed by the indicated date. You should take those expiration dates more seriously.

    • Replies: @Lurker
    Recently I noticed the next door neighbours had put out a big bag of potatoes for refuse collection. They looked fine so I looked more closely - the potatoes had exceeded their BBE date, that was all! This is where this stuff gets absurd.

    I was very tempted to sneak them back to our house. You can look at an apple or a potato and you can see if they're OK, why fuss over the specific date? Even if they're past their best you can still cut bad bits out. Especially as some fresh stuff will turn even before the BBE date. People have conflated the BBE for packaged food with that for fresh.

    Otoh I was clearing out some ancient jars of pickle, sauce, relish etc from an older relative's house. They'd got stuff stashed that had been open for ten years and unused in all that time. Way waay beyond BBE. A lot of it looked/smelled OK but I didn't trust it. All gone into my garden compost bins.

  243. @Chris Mallory
    Only if you had a chainsaw and a 4wheel drive. Most roads had multiple trees down on them.

    As I wrote: “the people who had their shit together.”

  244. @Pheasant
    'Dairy runs out when it runs out: '

    Milk powder.

    Expiration dates are for pussies.

    That’s what I told my doctor when he asked about my stocking up on some medicine a few years back.

  245. @Jonathan Mason
    IThe best defense against Corona virus is to quit smoking cigarettes or cigars if you are a smoker, because smokers are much more likely to die of respiratory diseases.

    If you are overweight reducing your weight to acceptable parameters would also be helpful since many overweight people also have respiratory and circulatory problems.

    Moving South could also help. Corona viruses and flu viruses tend to flourish more in the winter time when the weather is cold than in the summertime when it is warm therefore it is intuitive that if you move to South Florida or Hawaii perhaps you are less likely to catch the virus.

    Here in North Florida the weather is fairly mild at the present time but it's dipping close to freezing temperatures at night this week, however we soon expect some warmer weather. It will be interesting to see whether the incidence of cases of the COVID virus occur more frequently in more northerly latitudes in the United States this spring.

    Stay out of airplanes. Inside airplanes and also to some extent inside airport buildings is probably the place where you are most likely to catch the virus. If you cannot stay out of airplanes using your own private jet would probably preferable. If you work at an airport just quit your job or stay home for the duration. If you are an airline pilot or crew change your job. Also avoid cruise ships if possible.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house. Alternatively you can shop with the Walmart shopping app where they bring your groceries out to your vehicle and put them in the back of your vehicle and you do not need to go inside the store.

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor's offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    Stay away from places of mass entertainment such as restaurants and cinemas or theaters. As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube. Outdoor mass entertainment venues such as football stadiums maybe a little safer but even then they could be some risk of people coughing over you. Indoor venues like basketball should be avoided.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

    You’re right about needlessly being near to people if there are other options. Quitting your job, though?! That’s for infotainment-filled, hysterical pussies. Your telling people to avoid hospitals is reasonable, even when there’s no badass new virus going around, as where to most people die, after all? That’s right, in the hospital! However, if you work in one, you just need to take more of the precautions that you should have been doing all along.

    Oh, and people are supposed to move south because of this one particular virus? Come on, man. It’s one thing if you already live in an RV. If you live in a van down by the Raisen River up in Monroe, by all means, fill it up before the stations are out, and live in your van down by the Suwannee River down in Mayo.

    Will quitting smoking THIS WEEK make a difference, or is it a long-term thing, which I’m sure would be better for you next year or two after you’ve kept them clear for a while?

    Half of your advise, Mr. Mason, is, to put it nicely, UNSOUND.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    Will quitting smoking THIS WEEK make a difference, or is it a long-term thing, which I’m sure would be better for you next year or two after you’ve kept them clear for a while?
     
    Corona virus will probably be around for a few years.
  246. @Servant of Gla'aki

    Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration.
     
    Ah yes, those little cans of corned beef from Argentina...wait, what?

    The US Feds banned those little cans of corned beef from Argentina back around 2001, then there was some event in 2014. Possibly some food safety issues?

    Spam might be cheaper and keeps just as long on the shelf. Assuming one doesn’t mind eating pork.

  247. @Almost Missouri
    Generally agree, as an X-er. I can't always blanket condemn Boomers and Millennials because I have too many friends and acquaintances in those categories whom I like and admire, and who in turn have helped me. (I feel the same way about Jews, FWIW.) Not that this blinds me to the painfully obvious habits these groups can have in aggregate though. Ok, now that I'm done with my personal virtue signalling, I'll note my frustration with the Boomer generation in particular, which I think is hardly unique.

    After having inherited the greatest windfall of social assets in recorded history, rather than pass it on improved, or at least unencumbered, they are instead sucking out and consuming what is (or can be made) liquid—which though selfish, is at least understandable and rational from an amoral point of view—but additionally they are handing out what remains to the manifestly unworthy in exchange for socially destructive (though personally vainglorious) diversity points.

    Having spent a fair chunk of my life climbing the greasy poles of academic and corporate hierarchy, it is of course dismaying to learn that the payoff to this investment is, "sorry we're only hiring/promoting Diversity now, and you're not it. Of course, we weren't doing that when I, Boomer, made my career, but now that mine's made, we are because it makes me feel good about myself and that's what's important." Thanks, man. Had I known this would be the outcome, I would have focused more on my own thing and less on your teamplayer BS.

    Note to the younger generations: don't trust boomer institutions to have have your back when you reach boomer age—or even before. (Yes, I know the Social Security Ponzi scheme was set up long pre-boomer, but those people are overrated too. FDR, rot in hell.)

    Kathy Shaidle (a tail-end boomer I admired), used to describe the boomers as the Cash Out Generation. I can't disagree. Having won the born-in-the-right-place-at-the-right-time lottery, they've worked to ensure that no one after them will ever say that again. Some people, especially those in groups we're increasingly importing, have ethnic nepotism workarounds to advance themselves, but I don't. Besides not being "ethnic", I trusted the pre-boomer meritocracy to continue to work despite the boomer-led social ructions of the late twentieth century. I was mistaken.

    Here endeth the lament.

    Boomer-like behavior is not unique to Boomers. It’s a human thing. I was speaking recently to a friend about his British maternal grandfather, who had owned a very substantial business – something involving metallurgy, with defense contracts, etc. – I forget the details. His grandfather would have been born before WWI so even older than Greatest Generation. He recalled that as a child he had visited his grandparents and they had lived like proper British upper class people, with a stately home, a Rolls, servants, impeccably dressed, etc. – the whole nine yards. But they spent every penny that they had on themselves and left his mother nothing. He wasn’t really bitter about it – it was their money and they were free to spend it as they wished and what they wished was to spend it on themselves.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    Yes, selfishness has a long history, but there are two things that distinguish the Boomers.

    1) Whatever the financial choices of your friend's grandparents were, it was, as you say, their own money. By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers and one may be excused for expecting would continue to exist after them too: corporate assets, NGOs, universities, governments. The drying up of most pension arrangements coincidentally as boomers are finished with them is an example.

    2) Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation, and a generation distinctly at odds with previous generations (and it is now turning out, at odds with later generations as well). I forget who said it, but someone characterized the boomers (when they were younger) as a tribe not of place but of time. I think this fairly encapsulates their self-created in-group/out-group mentality.

    I myself would have been happy to skip all the adversarial intergenerational feuding, just as I would have been happy to skip all interethnic identity-politics feuding, but the boomers enthusiastically embraced both generation tribalism and identity politics, such that now those are both immovable features of our socio-political landscape. Nowadays the political heft of both are turning against their erstwhile boomer sponsors, and the boomers suddenly want a rethink. They ended deference to the authority of elders back when they didn't have it. Now that they are the elders, they suddenly want it back.

    Too late! Shoulda listened to your elders back when they told you you were young, foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible, fifty years ago. Actually, I'm kinda kidding. Their elders didn't tell them nearly enough how foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible they were. As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, "the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation" which tells you that the Greatest wasn't so great either.
  248. @Almost Missouri
    Generally agree, as an X-er. I can't always blanket condemn Boomers and Millennials because I have too many friends and acquaintances in those categories whom I like and admire, and who in turn have helped me. (I feel the same way about Jews, FWIW.) Not that this blinds me to the painfully obvious habits these groups can have in aggregate though. Ok, now that I'm done with my personal virtue signalling, I'll note my frustration with the Boomer generation in particular, which I think is hardly unique.

    After having inherited the greatest windfall of social assets in recorded history, rather than pass it on improved, or at least unencumbered, they are instead sucking out and consuming what is (or can be made) liquid—which though selfish, is at least understandable and rational from an amoral point of view—but additionally they are handing out what remains to the manifestly unworthy in exchange for socially destructive (though personally vainglorious) diversity points.

    Having spent a fair chunk of my life climbing the greasy poles of academic and corporate hierarchy, it is of course dismaying to learn that the payoff to this investment is, "sorry we're only hiring/promoting Diversity now, and you're not it. Of course, we weren't doing that when I, Boomer, made my career, but now that mine's made, we are because it makes me feel good about myself and that's what's important." Thanks, man. Had I known this would be the outcome, I would have focused more on my own thing and less on your teamplayer BS.

    Note to the younger generations: don't trust boomer institutions to have have your back when you reach boomer age—or even before. (Yes, I know the Social Security Ponzi scheme was set up long pre-boomer, but those people are overrated too. FDR, rot in hell.)

    Kathy Shaidle (a tail-end boomer I admired), used to describe the boomers as the Cash Out Generation. I can't disagree. Having won the born-in-the-right-place-at-the-right-time lottery, they've worked to ensure that no one after them will ever say that again. Some people, especially those in groups we're increasingly importing, have ethnic nepotism workarounds to advance themselves, but I don't. Besides not being "ethnic", I trusted the pre-boomer meritocracy to continue to work despite the boomer-led social ructions of the late twentieth century. I was mistaken.

    Here endeth the lament.

    A.M.: In 1978 someone I know well was turned down for a great DJ position at a Country Music radio station due to the boss having to hire a black guy to please the FCC. This stuff has been going on a LONG TIME. You can definitely blame the Boomer generation for being complacent about it and not fighting it enough. However, they’d had the same BS on them too, albeit not the ludicrously stupid woke berating that one hears now.

    .

    .

    Oh, the black guy lasted only through the summer, and the boss hired the white guy after that, who was so loyal to the place that he quit cussing for life, just so he wouldn’t make a mistake on the air. He and that boss from over 40 years back have been friends ever since. No, that wasn’t me! (Can you tell?)

  249. @Servant of Gla'aki

    Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration.
     
    Ah yes, those little cans of corned beef from Argentina...wait, what?

    We don’t get this stuff (AKA “Bully Beef”) much in America but it’s very popular in countries where refrigeration is not as common (and in places where it was less common until recently). The closest thing that we get is SPAM (the kind in a can, not the email kind) which is packed in the same way.

    • Replies: @black sea
    When I was a kid you could buy dried slices of beef in a jar. Maybe Armour sold it. I don't know if the grocery stores still stock it. Excellent for making creamed chipped beef, if you like that kind of thing, which I did.

    Found a video:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=dried+beef+in+a+jar&oq=dried+beef+in+a+&aqs=chrome.0.0j69i57j0l6.6352j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#kpvalbx=_UrtWXp3KK9aD1fAPyYS_6Ak58

  250. Anon[710] • Disclaimer says:

    Letter published in the Lancet from 2 nurses in Wuhan:

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/langlo/article/PIIS2214-109X(20)30065-6/fulltext

    They claim 14,000 nurses have been send to Wuhan to support the medical staff there. Wuhan, being the size of New York City should have around the same amount of nurses. New York has around 744 registered nurses per 100,000 people, or about 74,400 per 10,000,000 people.

    So Wuhan should have a nursing base of 84,400. If they’re each taking care of 6 Covid-19 patients (which is a regular nursing load in normal times), that’s 506,400 patients in Wuhan. However, a number of the volunteers are probably nursing those people in the quickly-built container hospitals, and I bet they all have more than 6 patients per day. California nurses used to have a caseload of 10 patients per nurse until the legislature changed the maximum to 6. If all the Wuhan nurses have 10 patients, then the number sick in Wuhan hospitals is 844,000.

    If close to 1/10th of the whole city is sick enough to be in the hospital, that’s quite a load. China is also underreporting its numbers of sick by at least a factor of 10, if my calculations are correct.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    California nurses used to have a caseload of 10 patients per nurse until the legislature changed the maximum to 6.
     
    A lot depends on the acuity of the caseload for the nurses.

    If all the patients are on intravenous fluids and also receiving intravenous medications, and require wound care, are postoperative and non ambulant and suchlike, then it is pretty labor intensive. And in the US a huge amount of documentation is required.

    On the other hand if most of the infectious disease patients are people who were previously healthy adults and are able to eat and drink, toilet, and bathe themselves, then the need for nursing care would be much less and I suspect, although I do not know this for sure, that the documentation requirements in China are much less than in the US.

    What we do know is that there is no specific medication for this illness, so they would just be getting treatment for symptoms, with perhaps cough medicine, asthma inhalers or nebulizers for impaired breathing, and anti fever medications like Tylenol and encouraged to drink plenty of fluids and rest.

  251. @Jack D
    We don't get this stuff (AKA "Bully Beef") much in America but it's very popular in countries where refrigeration is not as common (and in places where it was less common until recently). The closest thing that we get is SPAM (the kind in a can, not the email kind) which is packed in the same way.

    When I was a kid you could buy dried slices of beef in a jar. Maybe Armour sold it. I don’t know if the grocery stores still stock it. Excellent for making creamed chipped beef, if you like that kind of thing, which I did.

    Found a video:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=dried+beef+in+a+jar&oq=dried+beef+in+a+&aqs=chrome.0.0j69i57j0l6.6352j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#kpvalbx=_UrtWXp3KK9aD1fAPyYS_6Ak58

    • Replies: @Jack D
    In the past, when there was less access to fresh or frozen meats or other foods there were many more kinds of shelf stable products in cans, jars, etc. Many of these products are still made but they are not the big sellers that they once were. Now that fresh beef (and fridges to keep it in) is everywhere, rehydrated dried beef or canned beef is not as appealing to most people. And once a product falls below a certain volume, regular supermarkets are going to give its shelf space to some other product and you are only going to be able to find it in some kind of specialty shop or by mail order.

    The only place I have seen the Argentinian canned corned beef on sale in America is in ethnic groceries that cater to people from the Arab world, e.g. Egypt and the Egyptians probably got their taste for the product from the English. I think there's a Caribbean version also. Again places that refrigeration reached more recently than here.

    The English brought back a lot of new foods from their colonies but the culinary influence ran both ways and even after the colonial masters departed they left behind a taste for some of their food and drink (or local imitations thereof). The #1 selling spirit in the world is Officer's Choice Whisky, a brand that you probably have never heard of. That is because it is made in India and sold mostly to Indians in India, all billion+ of them. It is a vague imitation of Scotch but it is made mostly from molasses and not grain so it is really more of a rum than a whisky. Regardless of what it is, India is the world's #1 market for whisky (or "whisky").

    , @Kibernetika
    When I was a kid you could buy dried slices of beef in a jar. Maybe Armour sold it. I don’t know if the grocery stores still stock it. Excellent for making creamed chipped beef, if you like that kind of thing, which I did.

    Years ago in the Navy it was popularly known as S.O.S. -- S**t on a Shingle :)
  252. @bigdicknick
    Bought more today....I got an off brand box, but still niosh certified. The price went up to $40 a box vs. $30 for a box of 3m yesterday. All the 3m 20 unit boxes were gone and only the 10 unit boxes were left. I know own 42 n95 masks.

    I am going to go to Costco to stock up on various other supplies…basically just the same shit I always get, but moving my dry goods purchases forwards by several months. If anywhere in my large city has coronavirus it’s probably costco so ill be masking up and wearing gloves.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8zNsUTWsOc
  253. @Pheasant
    Its because disinfectant is less harsh on peoples lungs having no ammonia etc.

    OK, thanks, that makes sense.

  254. @Jack D
    100% agree with everything you said UNTIL you got to the stock market. Typically the stock market overreacts and then swings back again. The best advice is to ignore temporary swings and play the long game. Going short (assuming you are betting against the market and not just hedging your portfolio) is crazy risky and not something that amateurs should attempt.

    Every stock position should be hedged, but I think there is a good chance that the market may go down more over the next month or two when it starts to become apparent that the epidemic is affecting various areas of commerce such as travel. Auto stocks are getting slammed and companies like Starbucks and Apple are cutting back on operations in China.

    It is not so much the effects of the virus, which may be no worse than a normal flu season, but the effect of the measures taken to contain it.

    The Disney theme park in Shanghai is closed and that is affecting businesses in surrounding communities such as hotels and restaurants. So is the Hong Kong Disney.

    DIS is a Dow stock.

    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=disney+coronavirus&view=detail&mid=A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54&FORM=VIRE

    Also the U.S. 10-Year Treasury Note Yield Index (TNX) collapsed to close to a record low, due to fears of a coronavirus-led recession in several countries. The CBOE Volatility Index (VIX) has also spiked.

    Also I would not be wanting to increase any long positions in health insurance stocks during the primary voting season.

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason
    Looks like this morning's rally was a dead cat bounce and has all been given back again. I expect the indexes to decline more by the closing bell today and open lower tomorrow.

    (There, I have predicted this in public, and perhaps will be shown to be totally wrong tomorrow and will lose any credibility that I ever had).
    , @J.Ross
    There must be a lot of people crowding the City of London who visit Shanghai, Hong Kong, and Singapore.
  255. @J.Ross
    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don't see an argument against that.

    One of many arguments “against that” is that it’s painting with a ridiculously large brush.
    People born in 1964 have very little in common with those born in 1946.
    Speaking as one of the latter I wish I’d been one of the former.

    • Replies: @Dissident

    One of many arguments “against that” is that it’s painting with a ridiculously large brush.
    People born in 1964 have very little in common with those born in 1946.
     
    Is it not also painting with a ridiculously large brush to categorically condemn even all people born in a single year?

    And even if there were to be certain criticisms that could legitimately be applied to entire generations, the questions would remain:
    1.) Can anyone of a subsequent generation know that he would have been any better than any of those he condemns, had he lived in their time and place?

    2.) Is anything good accomplished by singling-out entire past generations for condemnation and resentment?

    Aren't people the products of their environment? Of the time, place and circumstances in which they live? How much influence or power do the overwhelming majority of people, in any given time and place, have over society-at-large? What percentage of any given population is even politically aware and active? Or have the requisite intelligence, time and opportunity that they can reasonably be expected to know more than following the dominant, accessible sources of information allow for? Is it reasonable to expect more than a relatively small percentage of the population to have the kind of knowledge, intelligence and capacity for independent and often highly dissident thought that individuals such as the better contributors to iSteve threads demonstrate?
  256. @Maciano
    - N95 masks
    - Food for 3mths
    - Medicine
    - Water
    - Hygiene products like desinfection gek, gloves, cleaning products
    - Extra freezer for meat
    - Bread machine
    - Oxygen in blood meter (for your finger)

    Maybe buy a ventilator/oxygen machine? They’re scarce and they help you survive.

    Generic Guaifenesin 400mg….. cheap, about 1/4 the $price of brand names such as Mucinex, same active ingredient.

    flu/pneumomia: you’re going to need expectorants to stave off fluid in lungs which if untreated leads to worse biotic infections. caveat: you must increase fluids to get it up/out.

    other stuff, you’ll wish you had……

    TP/kleenex, ammo, batteries, water, (can/dry goods, rice/beans/pasta, bread flour/sugar/yeast)/ unfiltered apple cider vinegar/Gatorade powder or electrolyte solution, especially for elders/babies who dehydrate quickly.

    medicine cabinet: neosporin/H peroxide/aloe/bandages/alcohol/orajel- tooth pain, burns/aspirin, acetaminophen, etc/shelf stable pro-biotics/anti-emetics, anti-diarrheals/box of gloves/body wipes/dry shampoo?/toothpaste

    charcoal/gas cylinders – outdoor cooking/lighters/candles, tealights are a good deal, last about 4hrs. cannot stress enough – headlamp….. Energizer makes a good one.

    bleach/clorox wipes/dish soap/clothes soap/borax (mule)

    liquor.

  257. @Milestone D
    Once you reach a certain level of neighborhood affluence, you price out the cops. Which means they live somewhere else so any interruption in gas means they aren’t getting to work, and now the affluent have no police protection.

    True enough, but not particularly relevant. Because even a 20% increase in demand means cops aren’t available anyway.

  258. @Anonymous
    Hell no.

    Get a Land Rover or a Jeep and do a Mercedes, Perkins, or SD Nissan Diesel conversion, or a seventies squarebody Chevy truck with a 53 Series Detroit Diesel. They run with no electrics at all and will burn any grade of diesel fuel, jet fuel or kerosene with a little oil in it, or any of several biodiesels or vegetable oils. If a stock vehicle must be bought get an IH Scout with the SD33t or a Mercedes sedan with an OM616 or OM617.

    However, your advice–unlike Lincoln Man’s–is totally devoid of humor.

  259. @Anon
    Letter published in the Lancet from 2 nurses in Wuhan:

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/langlo/article/PIIS2214-109X(20)30065-6/fulltext

    They claim 14,000 nurses have been send to Wuhan to support the medical staff there. Wuhan, being the size of New York City should have around the same amount of nurses. New York has around 744 registered nurses per 100,000 people, or about 74,400 per 10,000,000 people.

    So Wuhan should have a nursing base of 84,400. If they're each taking care of 6 Covid-19 patients (which is a regular nursing load in normal times), that's 506,400 patients in Wuhan. However, a number of the volunteers are probably nursing those people in the quickly-built container hospitals, and I bet they all have more than 6 patients per day. California nurses used to have a caseload of 10 patients per nurse until the legislature changed the maximum to 6. If all the Wuhan nurses have 10 patients, then the number sick in Wuhan hospitals is 844,000.

    If close to 1/10th of the whole city is sick enough to be in the hospital, that's quite a load. China is also underreporting its numbers of sick by at least a factor of 10, if my calculations are correct.

    California nurses used to have a caseload of 10 patients per nurse until the legislature changed the maximum to 6.

    A lot depends on the acuity of the caseload for the nurses.

    If all the patients are on intravenous fluids and also receiving intravenous medications, and require wound care, are postoperative and non ambulant and suchlike, then it is pretty labor intensive. And in the US a huge amount of documentation is required.

    On the other hand if most of the infectious disease patients are people who were previously healthy adults and are able to eat and drink, toilet, and bathe themselves, then the need for nursing care would be much less and I suspect, although I do not know this for sure, that the documentation requirements in China are much less than in the US.

    What we do know is that there is no specific medication for this illness, so they would just be getting treatment for symptoms, with perhaps cough medicine, asthma inhalers or nebulizers for impaired breathing, and anti fever medications like Tylenol and encouraged to drink plenty of fluids and rest.

  260. @Jonathan Mason
    Every stock position should be hedged, but I think there is a good chance that the market may go down more over the next month or two when it starts to become apparent that the epidemic is affecting various areas of commerce such as travel. Auto stocks are getting slammed and companies like Starbucks and Apple are cutting back on operations in China.

    It is not so much the effects of the virus, which may be no worse than a normal flu season, but the effect of the measures taken to contain it.

    The Disney theme park in Shanghai is closed and that is affecting businesses in surrounding communities such as hotels and restaurants. So is the Hong Kong Disney.

    DIS is a Dow stock.

    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=disney+coronavirus&view=detail&mid=A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54&FORM=VIRE

    Also the U.S. 10-Year Treasury Note Yield Index (TNX) collapsed to close to a record low, due to fears of a coronavirus-led recession in several countries. The CBOE Volatility Index (VIX) has also spiked.

    Also I would not be wanting to increase any long positions in health insurance stocks during the primary voting season.

    Looks like this morning’s rally was a dead cat bounce and has all been given back again. I expect the indexes to decline more by the closing bell today and open lower tomorrow.

    (There, I have predicted this in public, and perhaps will be shown to be totally wrong tomorrow and will lose any credibility that I ever had).

    • Replies: @Jonathan Mason

    Looks like this morning’s rally was a dead cat bounce and has all been given back again. I expect the indexes to decline more by the closing bell today and open lower tomorrow.
     
    Well, looks like I was on the money there. I am not a big stock market player, but I did make enough to pay the excess that I owe on my income tax bill.
  261. @Jack D
    There is also shelf stable milk (packed in UHT packaging aka juice boxes) - this is good for several months at least (and probably longer than the package date indicates). Not to mention canned milk (condensed and evaporated).

    Generally speaking, when a product package indicates "BEST BEFORE" this means that after that date the taste of the product may deteriorate or change from when it was freshly packed, but as long as the package remains intact it is generally still safe to eat. Let your taste and your eyes be your guide - if the product tastes rancid or "off" or looks curdled, the wrong color, etc. then discard. If it looks and tastes OK then don't worry about the BEST BEFORE date. Also use your common sense - if the best by date is 2/20 and now it's 3/20 it's probably fine. If the expiration date was Jan 1999 - maybe not.

    "USE BY" or "USE OR FREEZE BY" means that the product may actually be spoiled and unsafe to eat if not consumed by the indicated date. You should take those expiration dates more seriously.

    Recently I noticed the next door neighbours had put out a big bag of potatoes for refuse collection. They looked fine so I looked more closely – the potatoes had exceeded their BBE date, that was all! This is where this stuff gets absurd.

    I was very tempted to sneak them back to our house. You can look at an apple or a potato and you can see if they’re OK, why fuss over the specific date? Even if they’re past their best you can still cut bad bits out. Especially as some fresh stuff will turn even before the BBE date. People have conflated the BBE for packaged food with that for fresh.

    Otoh I was clearing out some ancient jars of pickle, sauce, relish etc from an older relative’s house. They’d got stuff stashed that had been open for ten years and unused in all that time. Way waay beyond BBE. A lot of it looked/smelled OK but I didn’t trust it. All gone into my garden compost bins.

    • Replies: @Jack D
    The amount of food waste in America is absurd. And in the old days, when people kept domestic animals (chickens, goats, a cow, a pig) if there was some food that was past its prime you could at least give it to the animals and get eggs, meat or milk out of the deal.
  262. @Malcolm X-Lax
    I just went and checked my Amazon past ordering history because about 3 years ago I had to by my own n95 1860 mask to do the required fit-testing prior to a nursing contract I was working. Those are unsurprisingly out of stock. The hospital system I work at now has removed them from all of the clean supply rooms and require approval by the house supervisor to obtain. I've got a some left over from that box but gave many of them away to friends in the bay area during the Paradise "camp" fire back in 2018, (in which my uncle was one of the 84 people killed, incidentally). At any rate, here's the thing: You don't need an N95 mask. You may feel more protected but transmission is, assuming one believes the CDC, like the flu, through respiratory droplets, not floating on the air like TB or Measles. A regular surgical mask and face shield (or glasses), as well as good hand washing or anti-bacterial hand sanitizing should be enough to protect you. Also, avoid all oriental people. That last part was a joke.

    My vague assumption is that people wear the masks to protect themselves but in reality they actually do more to stop the infected spreading their germs than stop the uninfected catching them.

    • Agree: another fred
  263. @Jonathan Mason
    IThe best defense against Corona virus is to quit smoking cigarettes or cigars if you are a smoker, because smokers are much more likely to die of respiratory diseases.

    If you are overweight reducing your weight to acceptable parameters would also be helpful since many overweight people also have respiratory and circulatory problems.

    Moving South could also help. Corona viruses and flu viruses tend to flourish more in the winter time when the weather is cold than in the summertime when it is warm therefore it is intuitive that if you move to South Florida or Hawaii perhaps you are less likely to catch the virus.

    Here in North Florida the weather is fairly mild at the present time but it's dipping close to freezing temperatures at night this week, however we soon expect some warmer weather. It will be interesting to see whether the incidence of cases of the COVID virus occur more frequently in more northerly latitudes in the United States this spring.

    Stay out of airplanes. Inside airplanes and also to some extent inside airport buildings is probably the place where you are most likely to catch the virus. If you cannot stay out of airplanes using your own private jet would probably preferable. If you work at an airport just quit your job or stay home for the duration. If you are an airline pilot or crew change your job. Also avoid cruise ships if possible.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house. Alternatively you can shop with the Walmart shopping app where they bring your groceries out to your vehicle and put them in the back of your vehicle and you do not need to go inside the store.

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor's offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    Stay away from places of mass entertainment such as restaurants and cinemas or theaters. As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube. Outdoor mass entertainment venues such as football stadiums maybe a little safer but even then they could be some risk of people coughing over you. Indoor venues like basketball should be avoided.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

  264. @Almost Missouri
    Question: Given that it is a pandemic and that no man is an island, we are all, everyone, going to be exposed to Coronavirus eventually, and most of us will survive. So what is the point of delaying the inevitable and hobbling ourselves with a debilitating self-quarantine? Are we hoping for a vaccine to rescue us before we personally are exposed? Any vaccine won't come in time, and even if it did, I would hardly trust it. Better to face the music now and get it over with, rather than live a twilight existence and end up facing the same illness anyway.

    I understand that some of us have sickly or elderly friends and relations, and that for their sakes we don't want to hasten their demise, so we keep ourselves hygienic and our gratuitous contacts limited. But for those of us who are healthy now, are we going to be more healthy facing the virus after six months of living underground on canned food? Isn't it better to face it sooner, fresh and strong, than later, fearful and weakened?

    So what is the point of delaying the inevitable

    You want to be infected either early or late, not in the middle. In the middle, the ICUs are full and there are no ventilators available.

  265. @Lurker
    Recently I noticed the next door neighbours had put out a big bag of potatoes for refuse collection. They looked fine so I looked more closely - the potatoes had exceeded their BBE date, that was all! This is where this stuff gets absurd.

    I was very tempted to sneak them back to our house. You can look at an apple or a potato and you can see if they're OK, why fuss over the specific date? Even if they're past their best you can still cut bad bits out. Especially as some fresh stuff will turn even before the BBE date. People have conflated the BBE for packaged food with that for fresh.

    Otoh I was clearing out some ancient jars of pickle, sauce, relish etc from an older relative's house. They'd got stuff stashed that had been open for ten years and unused in all that time. Way waay beyond BBE. A lot of it looked/smelled OK but I didn't trust it. All gone into my garden compost bins.

    The amount of food waste in America is absurd. And in the old days, when people kept domestic animals (chickens, goats, a cow, a pig) if there was some food that was past its prime you could at least give it to the animals and get eggs, meat or milk out of the deal.

    • Agree: Dissident
  266. @Chris Mallory

    Prepping? Based on what?
     
    Based on being prepared. Earthquakes, ice storms, tropical storms, floods and yes quarantine from pandemic are all things that might happen where I live.

    Ten years ago, I went 30 days without power from an ice storm. During that ice storm, one Dollar Store in a county of 70,000 people had power and could do business. Their shelves were empty that first day. Was a week before the banks would let you take out more than $75 cash, and for that first week anything you wanted to buy was a cash transaction.

    The year katrina hit, I went 3 days without power after a tropical storm that had been a hurricane blew over where I live.

    Last summer during one of the hurricanes, a Dindu American was being interviewed on the news. It was two days after the storm had hit and no one in her building had food. They were standing around waiting for someone to feed them.

    dindu prepping i guess.

  267. @J.Ross
    God damn it Steve, even if this is a joke, this here is the most boomer post ever. Apply normal hygeine precautions, remember SARS, and don't panic. Surely Beijing is lying but this is probably nothing
    --------
    List anyway:
    Chloroquin, which [ahem] appears to cure this; it worked on SARS. It's an old anti-malarial, proven and very widely available. Grep enough for ten days at 500mg. As with antibiotics, do not stop dosing when symptoms clear up.
    If all the rumors are true, including the one about six months of purging unbelievers:
    That American-Canadian herring (is it Bar Harbor?), Spanish octopus, Georgian caviar, Georgian wine, Russian caviar, Japanese mackeral, Litvak sprats, Spanish chorizo, Romanian trout, white tuna, King Oscar sardines, and Deming salmon; spring water (I assume you have filters as well), rices (especially sushi, basmati, wild, and black), red kidney beans, red lentils, green lentils, olive oil, kimchi, real sauerkraut, щи (in frozen but separated bricks), pickles, olives, a tent, a Perception Keowee sub-kayak with paddle and skirt and vehicle mounting, raw onions (for purging the membranes), ziplocs in varying sizes, disposable plates and cutlery, a sjambok, a machete, a Mora, a WWI German butcher bayonet, a Dutch oven, a pellet heater, water purification tablets, bleach, gasoline, a generator, a Faraday cage, Siberian restorative herbs, Lugol's iodine, 5-HTP, NooPep, turmeric, duct tape, a kugelwagen (with a technical conversion, twin 50 cal at least), adult multi-vitamins, those new powderized vegetable pills, gmo-free beet powder, the really good more expensive first aid kit, Padron cigars with lighters and clippers, a S&W M&P II with four mags and 500 rounds of .223, a South African harness, a Coonan Classic with 300 rounds of .357 magnum, a decent Tikka in .308 with 150 rounds, an aquaponics setup, flashcards and pens (be able to communicate without internet or physical contact), bowls, a Chinese tactical shovel, flashlight and rechargeable batteries, sturdy garbage bags, marihuana (to be able to trade with hippie scum), oregano (to be able to mess with hippie scum), beads (to be able to trade wirh Indians), Luksosowa, Laphraoig, Mio sparking sake, Spanish Cava, a cow, two goats, six SILENT chickens, two roosters, normal soap, Castille soap, toilet paper, latex gloves (or another material if allergic), face masks (if infected*), and (of course) zinc.
    Slim-Fast is disgusting and unhealthy but (weakly) replaces a meal and keeps long at room temperature.
    All, for half a year.
    Avoid things which absorb moisture or will not keep, which includes improperly stored onions, and definitely most breads, crackers, cereals, etc.. Dairy runs out when it runs out: be able to drop it as a nutrient. Freezing milk gives mixed results.
    *Face masks are for the infected, to courteously prevent further spread. Shinobiying everywhere in a mask will not protect you.
    Skip that "vertical potato field" box. It works only with one kind of rapidly-growing potato.

    After getting a third of the way through your list, my eyes glazed over. But then I shook my head, regained my discipline, and read through each component. Very comprehensive! Except you forgot a critical component: isopropyl alcohol. Or, in a pinch, clear distilled spirits will do (plain vodka, corn whiskey, or better yet, Everclear!). And, while the Laphroaig is a nice touch, sadly, you omitted Jack Daniels Old No. 7.

  268. @Jonathan Mason
    Every stock position should be hedged, but I think there is a good chance that the market may go down more over the next month or two when it starts to become apparent that the epidemic is affecting various areas of commerce such as travel. Auto stocks are getting slammed and companies like Starbucks and Apple are cutting back on operations in China.

    It is not so much the effects of the virus, which may be no worse than a normal flu season, but the effect of the measures taken to contain it.

    The Disney theme park in Shanghai is closed and that is affecting businesses in surrounding communities such as hotels and restaurants. So is the Hong Kong Disney.

    DIS is a Dow stock.

    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=disney+coronavirus&view=detail&mid=A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54A1BEE845A4D5AE1F6D54&FORM=VIRE

    Also the U.S. 10-Year Treasury Note Yield Index (TNX) collapsed to close to a record low, due to fears of a coronavirus-led recession in several countries. The CBOE Volatility Index (VIX) has also spiked.

    Also I would not be wanting to increase any long positions in health insurance stocks during the primary voting season.

    There must be a lot of people crowding the City of London who visit Shanghai, Hong Kong, and Singapore.

  269. @Steve Sailer
    Hopefully not Poe's "Masque of the Red Death."

    Years ago a friend of my parents was dying of AIDS (turned out he had been secretly gay all along) later his widow died of the same. Last time I saw him he had come round to talk to my mum, he was a bit manic, a bit weird – symptoms of the condition. Anyhow my brother and I were watching the Masque of the Red Death (with Vincent Price) on TV as they talked. Somewhat creepy and ironic.

  270. @Alfa158
    The people whose background suggests they know best about surviving say that for long term collapse, you need a tribe. If it is just you or your family, over the long stretch you will eventually get overrun and your carefully collected stuff stripped off your corpses. With a survivalist group of a couple dozen people or more, you have enough fighting power that marauders will move on and pick on an easier target, you can always have sentries and scouts on alert so you don’t get surprised, if you are sick or injured there are people who will protect you until you recover, there will be a variety of skills and knowledge in your tribe, agriculture can be sustained etc.
    For a potential short term crisis, the bug-out bag, stashed groceries and so forth should be fine.
    In the case of Coronaviris, fill up your pantry, get a face mask, have enough firepower to discourage casual looters, and hunker down. This still doesn’t look the Black Death, so the worst effect will not be from a massive death toll, but a temporary hiatus in commerce and transport.

    “you need a tribe”

    Psalm 127

    Sons are indeed a heritage from the Lord,
    offspring, a reward.
    Like arrows in the hand of a warrior
    are the sons born in one’s youth.
    Happy is the man who has filled his quiver with them.
    They will never be put to shame
    when they speak with their enemies at the city gate.

  271. @Servant of Gla'aki

    Those little cans of argentine corned beef don’t need refrigeration.
     
    Ah yes, those little cans of corned beef from Argentina...wait, what?

    USsians get criticized (by crazy plant worshippers) for red meat consumption, but it’s really us, Mexicans, Brazilians, and Argies who eat much more red meat than most others, and I believe Argies consume more beef than we do. Brazilian and Argentine style steakhouses are expensive but absolutely worth a visit.

  272. @Achmed E. Newman
    You're right about needlessly being near to people if there are other options. Quitting your job, though?! That's for infotainment-filled, hysterical pussies. Your telling people to avoid hospitals is reasonable, even when there's no badass new virus going around, as where to most people die, after all? That's right, in the hospital! However, if you work in one, you just need to take more of the precautions that you should have been doing all along.

    Oh, and people are supposed to move south because of this one particular virus? Come on, man. It's one thing if you already live in an RV. If you live in a van down by the Raisen River up in Monroe, by all means, fill it up before the stations are out, and live in your van down by the Suwannee River down in Mayo.

    Will quitting smoking THIS WEEK make a difference, or is it a long-term thing, which I'm sure would be better for you next year or two after you've kept them clear for a while?

    Half of your advise, Mr. Mason, is, to put it nicely, UNSOUND.

    Will quitting smoking THIS WEEK make a difference, or is it a long-term thing, which I’m sure would be better for you next year or two after you’ve kept them clear for a while?

    Corona virus will probably be around for a few years.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    OK, that part makes more sense then, in that case. The post was about prepping for tomorrow and the next month, the way I took it.
  273. @Jack D

    How bad does coronavirus actually affect people under 50?
     
    Most young healthy people will be fine. However, some (and there's no way to know which ones in advance) develop "cytokine storms" . A cytokine storm is an overproduction of immune cells and their activating compounds (cytokines) that end up in your the lungs. The virus doesn't kill you - your own immune system kills you. You develop pneumonia and you die. This is why so many young, healthy people died in the Spanish Flu epidemic . Having a young healthy immune system makes the cytokine storm WORSE.

    So "just get it over with" is not a good idea. They are working on fast tracking a vaccine and they are learning by the day which anti-viral medications are best at reducing the severity of the disease for those who become infected and what are the best treatment protocols for those who develop cytokine storms, so time is your friend. If you can't avoid being infected, later is better than sooner - maybe you'll get lucky and get hit by a bus in the interim so the virus won't kill you.

    The potential for a cytokine storm is one reason statins are so potentially helpful. They act as a very strong anti-inflammatory. The flu death rate for those taking statins is half that of those who don’t. The cytokine storm is what made the 1918 Spanish Flu so lethal and caused it to kill so many young men.

    • Replies: @another fred

    The potential for a cytokine storm is one reason statins are so potentially helpful.
     
    Is it the statins or the hyperlipidemia?

    Note that the less severe in the link below had a greater incidence of hyperlipidemia. Whether or not they were taking statins is a good question.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32077115/

  274. @Pheasant
    'Laphraoig'

    Damn straight.

    Being of one of those ethnicities that cannot have booze in thier house without drinking it immediately I have already finished my emergency supply.

    Oh well.

    Being of one of those ethnicities that cannot have booze in thier house without drinking it immediately I have already finished my emergency supply.

    Oh well.

    Hey, me too!

  275. @Almost Missouri
    You have to allow a few percentage point margin for error, so some of the "differences" may not really be there.

    As I understand it, the basic ACE2 story is that it is common in East Asia and uncommon around the Mediterranean, with everyone else on a gradient in between. So, Southern Europeans (Iberia, Toscani) have it less than Northern Europeans (British and NW-Euro-descended Utahans) have it less than Northeastern Europeans (Finns) have it less than Asians. Etc.

    The peculiar pair is British vs. Utah, who should be about the same or if different British should be lower due to more admixture of ancient Iberian, but instead British is significantly higher. Don't know what that's about.

    Also, I would hesitate to translate "frequency of genetic variants" into "susceptibility to disease". This is still at the theory stage, IMHO.

    Wow, you managed to get everytning wrong. P.S., The “ancient Iberian” in British people is Bell Beaker immigrants from Germany who invaded Iberia from the North and then just as rapidly invaded England from Iberia. They had no Mediterranean ancestry to speak of.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    Okay, please give JUSA the correct explanations then.
  276. @black sea
    When I was a kid you could buy dried slices of beef in a jar. Maybe Armour sold it. I don't know if the grocery stores still stock it. Excellent for making creamed chipped beef, if you like that kind of thing, which I did.

    Found a video:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=dried+beef+in+a+jar&oq=dried+beef+in+a+&aqs=chrome.0.0j69i57j0l6.6352j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#kpvalbx=_UrtWXp3KK9aD1fAPyYS_6Ak58

    In the past, when there was less access to fresh or frozen meats or other foods there were many more kinds of shelf stable products in cans, jars, etc. Many of these products are still made but they are not the big sellers that they once were. Now that fresh beef (and fridges to keep it in) is everywhere, rehydrated dried beef or canned beef is not as appealing to most people. And once a product falls below a certain volume, regular supermarkets are going to give its shelf space to some other product and you are only going to be able to find it in some kind of specialty shop or by mail order.

    The only place I have seen the Argentinian canned corned beef on sale in America is in ethnic groceries that cater to people from the Arab world, e.g. Egypt and the Egyptians probably got their taste for the product from the English. I think there’s a Caribbean version also. Again places that refrigeration reached more recently than here.

    The English brought back a lot of new foods from their colonies but the culinary influence ran both ways and even after the colonial masters departed they left behind a taste for some of their food and drink (or local imitations thereof). The #1 selling spirit in the world is Officer’s Choice Whisky, a brand that you probably have never heard of. That is because it is made in India and sold mostly to Indians in India, all billion+ of them. It is a vague imitation of Scotch but it is made mostly from molasses and not grain so it is really more of a rum than a whisky. Regardless of what it is, India is the world’s #1 market for whisky (or “whisky”).

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Speaking of whisky demographics, why is it that most women HATE HATE HATE whisky?
    , @Alden
    I see that Argentina corned beef in big supermarkets all the time. If you like corned beef hash and can’t eat the nasty greasy canned kind, you can make it with the Argentina corned beef. Fry the meat pieces separately to get all the fat rendered out. Then add to the potatoes and onions
  277. @Jonathan Mason

    Will quitting smoking THIS WEEK make a difference, or is it a long-term thing, which I’m sure would be better for you next year or two after you’ve kept them clear for a while?
     
    Corona virus will probably be around for a few years.

    OK, that part makes more sense then, in that case. The post was about prepping for tomorrow and the next month, the way I took it.

  278. @ColRebSez
    The potential for a cytokine storm is one reason statins are so potentially helpful. They act as a very strong anti-inflammatory. The flu death rate for those taking statins is half that of those who don't. The cytokine storm is what made the 1918 Spanish Flu so lethal and caused it to kill so many young men.

    The potential for a cytokine storm is one reason statins are so potentially helpful.

    Is it the statins or the hyperlipidemia?

    Note that the less severe in the link below had a greater incidence of hyperlipidemia. Whether or not they were taking statins is a good question.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32077115/

  279. @Jack D
    In the past, when there was less access to fresh or frozen meats or other foods there were many more kinds of shelf stable products in cans, jars, etc. Many of these products are still made but they are not the big sellers that they once were. Now that fresh beef (and fridges to keep it in) is everywhere, rehydrated dried beef or canned beef is not as appealing to most people. And once a product falls below a certain volume, regular supermarkets are going to give its shelf space to some other product and you are only going to be able to find it in some kind of specialty shop or by mail order.

    The only place I have seen the Argentinian canned corned beef on sale in America is in ethnic groceries that cater to people from the Arab world, e.g. Egypt and the Egyptians probably got their taste for the product from the English. I think there's a Caribbean version also. Again places that refrigeration reached more recently than here.

    The English brought back a lot of new foods from their colonies but the culinary influence ran both ways and even after the colonial masters departed they left behind a taste for some of their food and drink (or local imitations thereof). The #1 selling spirit in the world is Officer's Choice Whisky, a brand that you probably have never heard of. That is because it is made in India and sold mostly to Indians in India, all billion+ of them. It is a vague imitation of Scotch but it is made mostly from molasses and not grain so it is really more of a rum than a whisky. Regardless of what it is, India is the world's #1 market for whisky (or "whisky").

    Speaking of whisky demographics, why is it that most women HATE HATE HATE whisky?

    • LOL: Achmed E. Newman
    • Replies: @anon
    Speaking of whisky demographics, why is it that most women HATE HATE HATE whisky?

    It depends on what they are used to drinking, and what the man they want is drinking. Not necessarily in that order.
  280. Hipsters shall be cleansed from the Earth:

  281. Francis Boye, a top level credentialled authority who has participated in several international law projects, has said that Corona is an engineered bioweapon which came out of Wuhan’s plague lab. He has in the past said that Zika was a chimaera. Boyle points to evidence in Science Direct Antiviral Research 10 February 2020 (“The spike glycoprotein coronavirus contains a furin-like cleavage site absent in CoV of the same clade”). There is a German claiming to be able to prove a similar claim and getting rejected by scientific publishers. Really painful messy transcript with many charming interruptions by Alex here:
    https://www.infowars.com/full-transcript-of-smoking-gun-bombshell-interview-prof-frances-boyle-exposes-the-bioweapons-origins-of-the-covid-19-coronavirus/

    And let me just conclude, the critical part here where it says, “and may provide a gain of function to the 2019 nCoV for efficient spreading in the human population compared to other beta coronaviruses.”

  282. @vhrm
    The issue is Iran.

    It actually looked like China possibly had it under control. But apparently Iran's been hit for a month and basically had no idea and/or covered it up and now it's spread from there to there whole middle East. There's no way Iran's going to be able to do China style containment so it's probably going to become endemic there and then the rest of Middle East and South Asia and Africa.

    And at that point it's just a matter of time until it gets everywhere else, including here and back into China from the outside.

    Imagine believing the numbers out of China.

    • Replies: @vhrm
    i don't believe the absolute numbers, and also I'm sure they don't KNOW the total number infected.

    However their ability to suppress information, while impressive, is not unlimited nowadays, especially in cities when large numbers are affected.

    They can hide/disappear a village or 10 but we can be fairly confident that they're not hiding 10k dead middle class people in Beijing or Shanghai or something on that scale... that would leak.
  283. @Anonymous

    They looked fine if maybe a notch below the 3Ms. Better than nothing
     
    Wrong. You need a certain grade of mask to stop the virus. It’s a zero-sum game. There's no such thing as better than nothing, in this case. Do your due diligence, or it will do you.

    Wrong. You need a certain grade of mask to stop the virus. It’s a zero-sum game. There’s no such thing as better than nothing, in this case. Do your due diligence, or it will do you.

    Even dirt-cheap dust masks would provide two of the most useful benefits:

    1) Remind you to not touch hands to your nose/mouth

    2) Encourage people in public places to keep more distance from the guy in the mask – ‘might be sick’

    #1 is good enough reason to wear one even around the house for the next little while – pretty painless.

    But sure – N95 and up if you can find them

  284. @JohnPlywood
    Wow, you managed to get everytning wrong. P.S., The "ancient Iberian" in British people is Bell Beaker immigrants from Germany who invaded Iberia from the North and then just as rapidly invaded England from Iberia. They had no Mediterranean ancestry to speak of.

    Okay, please give JUSA the correct explanations then.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Don't reply to him, Anatoly let him use that "you managed to get everything wrong" trick in a factless bigoted babble about how Tennessee is next door to Georgia.
  285. @Anonymous
    Speaking of whisky demographics, why is it that most women HATE HATE HATE whisky?

    Speaking of whisky demographics, why is it that most women HATE HATE HATE whisky?

    It depends on what they are used to drinking, and what the man they want is drinking. Not necessarily in that order.

  286. @Jonathan Mason
    IThe best defense against Corona virus is to quit smoking cigarettes or cigars if you are a smoker, because smokers are much more likely to die of respiratory diseases.

    If you are overweight reducing your weight to acceptable parameters would also be helpful since many overweight people also have respiratory and circulatory problems.

    Moving South could also help. Corona viruses and flu viruses tend to flourish more in the winter time when the weather is cold than in the summertime when it is warm therefore it is intuitive that if you move to South Florida or Hawaii perhaps you are less likely to catch the virus.

    Here in North Florida the weather is fairly mild at the present time but it's dipping close to freezing temperatures at night this week, however we soon expect some warmer weather. It will be interesting to see whether the incidence of cases of the COVID virus occur more frequently in more northerly latitudes in the United States this spring.

    Stay out of airplanes. Inside airplanes and also to some extent inside airport buildings is probably the place where you are most likely to catch the virus. If you cannot stay out of airplanes using your own private jet would probably preferable. If you work at an airport just quit your job or stay home for the duration. If you are an airline pilot or crew change your job. Also avoid cruise ships if possible.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house. Alternatively you can shop with the Walmart shopping app where they bring your groceries out to your vehicle and put them in the back of your vehicle and you do not need to go inside the store.

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor's offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    Stay away from places of mass entertainment such as restaurants and cinemas or theaters. As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube. Outdoor mass entertainment venues such as football stadiums maybe a little safer but even then they could be some risk of people coughing over you. Indoor venues like basketball should be avoided.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

    Even the Spanish Flu apparently only took ~ 10% out of the Dow:

    https://ofdollarsanddata.com/how-will-coronavirus-affect-your-portfolio/

    A global pandemic that killed 3% of the Earth’s population only sent markets down 10% over a period of 4 months.

    This is a stunning result. The worst virus since the bubonic plague and markets go through a run-of-the-mill decline? I would not have guessed that beforehand.

    And it is unlikely that coronavirus will be anywhere near as catastrophic as the Spanish flu because of our greatly improved medical knowledge over the past century. However, this does not imply that the economic costs will be lower.

    If anything, the economic costs of coronavirus are likely to be higher than prior epidemics as we take larger preventive measures to stop the virus from spreading. Cancelling tens of thousands of flights to the most populous country on Earth is just one example of this.

    We can speculate on this in every way we want, but no one knows what will happen. If history is any guide, coronavirus is likely to cause a small, but temporary, pullback as it continues to spread.

    But once things begin to improve, the market is likely to get out of its funk and recover its losses. Another crisis will be averted and humanity will march on.

  287. Swimming goggles.

    Eyes are one of the few entry points for this. Sure, you could wear safety glasses, face shields, etc, but hardly any provide full protection (even the giant soft-plastic ones are full of little ventilation holes).

    And none provide any protection if you’re not wearing them, and let’s face it – how many people will leave them at home in order not to ‘look ridiculous’?

    Swimming goggles provide a full seal, and are about the least conspicuous eye protection available, so you might actually wear them. Some even look fairly fashionable these days.

  288. @Jack Henson
    Imagine believing the numbers out of China.

    i don’t believe the absolute numbers, and also I’m sure they don’t KNOW the total number infected.

    However their ability to suppress information, while impressive, is not unlimited nowadays, especially in cities when large numbers are affected.

    They can hide/disappear a village or 10 but we can be fairly confident that they’re not hiding 10k dead middle class people in Beijing or Shanghai or something on that scale… that would leak.

    • Replies: @Jack Henson
    Who's "we", kemosabe?

    Obviously you're unfamiliar with the amount of crematoriums and emissions tracking out there, but yeah, tell me more fairytales about how they can't stop the signal.
  289. @Bert
    Traps if squirrels are in your yard. Best types are homemade seesaw PVC pipe, or Black Cat rat trap from India. The latter takes a month to arrive but saves you the trouble of dispatching the little guy.

    Things to forego: cannabis, women not living with you. Things to do: exercise moderately, sleep immoderately.

    Why cannabis?

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    smoking --> ACE2
  290. @Almost Missouri
    Okay, please give JUSA the correct explanations then.

    Don’t reply to him, Anatoly let him use that “you managed to get everything wrong” trick in a factless bigoted babble about how Tennessee is next door to Georgia.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri
    Yeah, he seems to be some kind of semitroll, but I like to give everyone the benefit of the doubt initially.
  291. @Jack D
    Boomer-like behavior is not unique to Boomers. It's a human thing. I was speaking recently to a friend about his British maternal grandfather, who had owned a very substantial business - something involving metallurgy, with defense contracts, etc. - I forget the details. His grandfather would have been born before WWI so even older than Greatest Generation. He recalled that as a child he had visited his grandparents and they had lived like proper British upper class people, with a stately home, a Rolls, servants, impeccably dressed, etc. - the whole nine yards. But they spent every penny that they had on themselves and left his mother nothing. He wasn't really bitter about it - it was their money and they were free to spend it as they wished and what they wished was to spend it on themselves.

    Yes, selfishness has a long history, but there are two things that distinguish the Boomers.

    1) Whatever the financial choices of your friend’s grandparents were, it was, as you say, their own money. By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers and one may be excused for expecting would continue to exist after them too: corporate assets, NGOs, universities, governments. The drying up of most pension arrangements coincidentally as boomers are finished with them is an example.

    2) Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation, and a generation distinctly at odds with previous generations (and it is now turning out, at odds with later generations as well). I forget who said it, but someone characterized the boomers (when they were younger) as a tribe not of place but of time. I think this fairly encapsulates their self-created in-group/out-group mentality.

    I myself would have been happy to skip all the adversarial intergenerational feuding, just as I would have been happy to skip all interethnic identity-politics feuding, but the boomers enthusiastically embraced both generation tribalism and identity politics, such that now those are both immovable features of our socio-political landscape. Nowadays the political heft of both are turning against their erstwhile boomer sponsors, and the boomers suddenly want a rethink. They ended deference to the authority of elders back when they didn’t have it. Now that they are the elders, they suddenly want it back.

    Too late! Shoulda listened to your elders back when they told you you were young, foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible, fifty years ago. Actually, I’m kinda kidding. Their elders didn’t tell them nearly enough how foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible they were. As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, “the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation” which tells you that the Greatest wasn’t so great either.

    • Agree: JMcG, Autochthon
    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    Great posts on the Boomers, AM; I agree pretty much throughout.

    It's your first point here that I find the most salient, and the most depressing.

    , @Thoughts
    It wasn't the Boomers, it was the Generation in which the Jews took over
    , @Reg Cæsar

    Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation...
     
    Horse manure. It was cooked up by minions in Steve's old industry, marketing research, and embraced by lazy "journalists"-- the kind that use myth for "something untrue"-- for use on slow news days.

    There had been talk of a baby boom since 1947, but I don't remember hearing boomer until the mid-1980s, except for submarines. (And in Oklahomans' parody of Yale's fight song.) It is not an identity. This is new.


    By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers...
     
    Like Social Security, which netted their parents several times what they paid in? Or Medicare, the crown jewel in the storebought 1964 election which destroyed Barry Goldwater for telling the truth? (An election in which all of two states allowed even the oldest "boomers" a vote.)

    As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, “the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation”
     
    If otherwise admirable ladies like Ann Coulter and Jennifer Roback Morse want to apologize for their imagined "generation", that's their business. Leave me out of it. It only makes them look bad.

    ...which tells you that the Greatest wasn’t so great either.
     
    Peak moral relativism in the United States came in 1945. The eldest of "boomers" were still in gestation.

    As for "greatest" and "millennial", one term drips with the filial guilt of Tom Brokaw and Tim Russert, and the other with stomach-turning narcissism.

    , @Anonymous
    You can trace the problem back to the 1930s and the Depression. People who went hungry as kids will have a tendency to spoil their own kids rotten 20 years later.

    Some people blame Dr. Spock for this, but his ideas wouldn't have gained traction if they weren't already in sync with how everybody was thinking anyway.

  292. @J.Ross
    Don't reply to him, Anatoly let him use that "you managed to get everything wrong" trick in a factless bigoted babble about how Tennessee is next door to Georgia.

    Yeah, he seems to be some kind of semitroll, but I like to give everyone the benefit of the doubt initially.

  293. @Antiwar7
    Why cannabis?

    smoking –> ACE2

    • Replies: @Antiwar7
    I see, thanks. So this doesn't apply to edibles, for example.

    I found this article interesting. Thanks for bringing up ACE2.

    https://fortune.com/2020/02/19/coronavirus-china-smoking-rate-men/
  294. If masks run out, there’s always furnace filters:

  295. My wife has a really terrible, undiagnosed nervous system disorder that is basically ruining her life. Because of this, I have to take her to the hospital at least once per week. Often more like 2-3 times. So among regular commenters here (I used to post under “Kevin O’Keeffe“), I may very well be the first to contract the virus. So I’ll keep y’all posted on my pending, somewhat dubious adventure.

    Needless to say, if shortly after coronavirus hits the USA in a serious way, I suddenly drop off the site, then be afraid, and increase your level of precaution.

    • Thanks: Almost Missouri
  296. @bigdicknick
    I am going to go to Costco to stock up on various other supplies...basically just the same shit I always get, but moving my dry goods purchases forwards by several months. If anywhere in my large city has coronavirus it's probably costco so ill be masking up and wearing gloves.

  297. A life-size poster of Corona-chan!

  298. @vhrm
    i don't believe the absolute numbers, and also I'm sure they don't KNOW the total number infected.

    However their ability to suppress information, while impressive, is not unlimited nowadays, especially in cities when large numbers are affected.

    They can hide/disappear a village or 10 but we can be fairly confident that they're not hiding 10k dead middle class people in Beijing or Shanghai or something on that scale... that would leak.

    Who’s “we”, kemosabe?

    Obviously you’re unfamiliar with the amount of crematoriums and emissions tracking out there, but yeah, tell me more fairytales about how they can’t stop the signal.

  299. @Jesse
    Surprisingly, no one is mentioning vitamin B complex tablets. Vitamin B12 is the one substance you *have* to get from animal sources. If you're living on beans, lentils and rice for a while, then there's a non negligible risk of neurological damage from a lack of B12.

    Also, try for tinned rather than dried legumes. If things really, really go to hell, you need something you can empty out and grudgingly eat. A generator won't be an option for a lot of people, and dried food you can't eat defeats the purpose.

    Have plenty of legumes, rice, lentils etc. on hand but you also won’t go wrong by going long on canned food.

    Long ocean voyagers have favored canned food because it can be eaten without cooking AND it generally contains liquids, which serve as a substitute for water. So although canned is a bad choice for trail hikers because of the extra weight of the water–which they can get from a stream–it is good for cruising boats which generally carry a certain amount of internal ballast anyway. Same principle applies to your household where weight is not an issue.

    Canned pears and peaches and the like may remind you of institutional food, but they do contain sugars and water. Survival tales written by guys who endured isolation at sea regularly feature the “daily surprise” menu wherein he picks a delabeled can (from having been sloshing around in the bilges of his sinking boat) and opens it for his daily ration. It could be stewed tomatoes or pears; who knows! More prudent voyagers varnished their labels before they left the dock.

  300. @Cloudbuster
    OK, Xer.

    Gen X suffers from Middle Child Syndrome to the extreme.

    • Agree: Almost Missouri
  301. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    Well, I reckon a copy of "The Decameron" would be appropriate.

    Well, I reckon a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.

    O, Boccaccio!

    An interesting footnote is how much of the Italian fashion industry is really Chinese immigrant labor. For example, look up the demographics of Milan and Prato.

    • Replies: @Alden
    Chinese garment workers are probably the reason the disease is concentrated in N Italy.
  302. @Almost Missouri
    Yes, selfishness has a long history, but there are two things that distinguish the Boomers.

    1) Whatever the financial choices of your friend's grandparents were, it was, as you say, their own money. By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers and one may be excused for expecting would continue to exist after them too: corporate assets, NGOs, universities, governments. The drying up of most pension arrangements coincidentally as boomers are finished with them is an example.

    2) Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation, and a generation distinctly at odds with previous generations (and it is now turning out, at odds with later generations as well). I forget who said it, but someone characterized the boomers (when they were younger) as a tribe not of place but of time. I think this fairly encapsulates their self-created in-group/out-group mentality.

    I myself would have been happy to skip all the adversarial intergenerational feuding, just as I would have been happy to skip all interethnic identity-politics feuding, but the boomers enthusiastically embraced both generation tribalism and identity politics, such that now those are both immovable features of our socio-political landscape. Nowadays the political heft of both are turning against their erstwhile boomer sponsors, and the boomers suddenly want a rethink. They ended deference to the authority of elders back when they didn't have it. Now that they are the elders, they suddenly want it back.

    Too late! Shoulda listened to your elders back when they told you you were young, foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible, fifty years ago. Actually, I'm kinda kidding. Their elders didn't tell them nearly enough how foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible they were. As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, "the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation" which tells you that the Greatest wasn't so great either.

    Great posts on the Boomers, AM; I agree pretty much throughout.

    It’s your first point here that I find the most salient, and the most depressing.

    • Replies: @Autochthon
    He should write a book or start his own blog about this topic; his insights show he understands it very well.
  303. @black sea
    When I was a kid you could buy dried slices of beef in a jar. Maybe Armour sold it. I don't know if the grocery stores still stock it. Excellent for making creamed chipped beef, if you like that kind of thing, which I did.

    Found a video:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=dried+beef+in+a+jar&oq=dried+beef+in+a+&aqs=chrome.0.0j69i57j0l6.6352j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#kpvalbx=_UrtWXp3KK9aD1fAPyYS_6Ak58

    When I was a kid you could buy dried slices of beef in a jar. Maybe Armour sold it. I don’t know if the grocery stores still stock it. Excellent for making creamed chipped beef, if you like that kind of thing, which I did.

    Years ago in the Navy it was popularly known as S.O.S. — S**t on a Shingle 🙂

  304. @bigdicknick
    n95 masks are pretty expensive online now. I went home depot to try to scoop some locally and they were completely sold out.

    I have 2 n95s and that's it. Still better than zero. I also have tons of gloves. some food, some water. Water purification gear. At least enough to survive a while if everything shut down.

    I am not sure paying $80 for a box of n95s is a good investment, but it could be.

    The masks are almost all made in China. Visualize the factory. Workers dry coughing as they package the masks for shipment to Home Depot.

  305. @The Last Real Calvinist
    Great posts on the Boomers, AM; I agree pretty much throughout.

    It's your first point here that I find the most salient, and the most depressing.

    He should write a book or start his own blog about this topic; his insights show he understands it very well.

  306. @Anonymous
    This may be the biggest overreaction in history

    The Climate Emergency™ beats it by a country mile.

  307. If you plan on public excursions with a serious mask and also have facial hair, it will be necessary to shave at least enough so that there is no hair under the sealing areas of the mask. The following link from the CDC provides illustrations of ways to retain portions of your facial hair. As an aside, I found it amusing that our hardworking bureaucrats provided a name for each facial hair configuration, most of which I never knew had a name.

    https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/15116056/2020/02/FacialHairWmask11282017-508.pdf

    Alternatively, smear something gooey but cleanable on the mask seal area to mark what parts of your facial hair should be removed.

  308. @Morris Applebaum IV
    I never heard of this radio program. Wow, that was a real treat, a fabulous story with one of my favorite actors, John Dehner. I was surprised at the sound quality as well, expecting something scratchy. Thank you very much for the link.

    Thank you very much for the link.

    My pleasure. Glad you enjoyed it.

    Another favorite of mine that you may enjoy is #48 from the Columbia Workshop: Slim. (Also available on YouTube) Although quite different, there are certain common threads between the respective recordings that stand-out.

    [MORE]
    Not only is the audio quality of Slim remarkably clear and intimate but the music and sound effects, as well as the entire production is rather masterfully executed. The story is of a young hobo who upon riding a freight train for the first time meets and is befriended by a mysterious man. It is poignant and not at all trite or predictable. The ending is ambiguous, leaving the listener to either form his own conclusions, or remain wondering about…Better that I reveal no more.

    I am ever grateful to Max Schmid, whose weekly radio program introduced me to the wonderful world of old time radio (OTR). It is truly The Theater of the Mind, where the only limits are those of one’s imagination. And, being audio-only, one’s eyes remain completely free to drive or perform any number of physical activities and mundane chores while listening.

    Might we one day witness a rediscovery and even rebirth of this great art form? Might not only vintage recordings from radio’s Golden Age but also newly produced content in its mold once again become popular?

  309. Anon[151] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Germ Theory of Disease
    Well, I reckon a copy of "The Decameron" would be appropriate.

    a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.

    Has anyone read this, in translation? Is it worth reading for a modern general reader?

    I kind of like frame story books like the Arabian Nights (which goes down as far as four levels of frames) and the Manuscript Found in Sargossa, which has an interesting backstory in itself.

    • Replies: @Anon
    The New Yorker had a long review of the Decameron in the midst of the MERS coronavirus outbreak in 2013, when coincidentally a new translation was published:

    https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/11/11/renaissance-man-4

    Most of the tales also describe, not politely, how people had sex, and dealt with bathroom matters. Glancing down the table of contents of Dubin’s volume, we find the following titles: “The Knight Who Made Cunts Talk,” “The Piece of Shit,” “The Mourner Who Got Fucked at the Grave Site,” “The Peasant’s Fart.” The words used here have not been adjusted to conform to modern immodesty; the translation is literal. In “The Piece of Shit,” a man actually eats one, though it’s his wife’s, and small. This is fun, until you get tired of it. A fuck is always a “fuck,” regardless of what was presumably one episode’s difference from another.

    Boccaccio is like a castle to a cave. He is probably Western literature’s foremost master of sexual euphemism. His lovers grind at the mill; they give the wool a whacking; they make the nightingale sing. Boccaccio does this not because he is abashed by his material but because, as an artist of language, he would be ashamed to say “fuck” five times in one story.
     
  310. Anon[151] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.
     
    Has anyone read this, in translation? Is it worth reading for a modern general reader?

    I kind of like frame story books like the Arabian Nights (which goes down as far as four levels of frames) and the Manuscript Found in Sargossa, which has an interesting backstory in itself.

    The New Yorker had a long review of the Decameron in the midst of the MERS coronavirus outbreak in 2013, when coincidentally a new translation was published:

    https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/11/11/renaissance-man-4

    Most of the tales also describe, not politely, how people had sex, and dealt with bathroom matters. Glancing down the table of contents of Dubin’s volume, we find the following titles: “The Knight Who Made Cunts Talk,” “The Piece of Shit,” “The Mourner Who Got Fucked at the Grave Site,” “The Peasant’s Fart.” The words used here have not been adjusted to conform to modern immodesty; the translation is literal. In “The Piece of Shit,” a man actually eats one, though it’s his wife’s, and small. This is fun, until you get tired of it. A fuck is always a “fuck,” regardless of what was presumably one episode’s difference from another.

    Boccaccio is like a castle to a cave. He is probably Western literature’s foremost master of sexual euphemism. His lovers grind at the mill; they give the wool a whacking; they make the nightingale sing. Boccaccio does this not because he is abashed by his material but because, as an artist of language, he would be ashamed to say “fuck” five times in one story.

  311. @Kibernetika
    I am eerily reminded, by your words especially, of Earth Abides

    Yes, that was a great two-episode Suspense production. John Dehner as Isherwood.

    Yes, that was a great two-episode Suspense production.

    Didn’t you mean to write Escape?

    There were a number of scripts that were performed by both Suspense! and Escape. But to the best of my knowledge, Earth Abides is not among them.

    At any rate, it is great to finally see others here who appreciate Old Time Radio.

    • Replies: @Kibernetika

    Didn’t you mean to write Escape?
     
    Thanks for catching that. Further, your response to my error was both polite and civil. These days that's remarkable because it's so rare.
  312. @B36
    Vodka.

    Vodka not just to help the time pass, but also to sanitize the outside of masks while wearing them if need be.

  313. @J.Ross
    smoking --> ACE2

    I see, thanks. So this doesn’t apply to edibles, for example.

    I found this article interesting. Thanks for bringing up ACE2.

    https://fortune.com/2020/02/19/coronavirus-china-smoking-rate-men/

  314. @Kibernetika
    Well, I reckon a copy of “The Decameron” would be appropriate.

    O, Boccaccio!

    An interesting footnote is how much of the Italian fashion industry is really Chinese immigrant labor. For example, look up the demographics of Milan and Prato.

    Chinese garment workers are probably the reason the disease is concentrated in N Italy.

  315. @Jack D
    In the past, when there was less access to fresh or frozen meats or other foods there were many more kinds of shelf stable products in cans, jars, etc. Many of these products are still made but they are not the big sellers that they once were. Now that fresh beef (and fridges to keep it in) is everywhere, rehydrated dried beef or canned beef is not as appealing to most people. And once a product falls below a certain volume, regular supermarkets are going to give its shelf space to some other product and you are only going to be able to find it in some kind of specialty shop or by mail order.

    The only place I have seen the Argentinian canned corned beef on sale in America is in ethnic groceries that cater to people from the Arab world, e.g. Egypt and the Egyptians probably got their taste for the product from the English. I think there's a Caribbean version also. Again places that refrigeration reached more recently than here.

    The English brought back a lot of new foods from their colonies but the culinary influence ran both ways and even after the colonial masters departed they left behind a taste for some of their food and drink (or local imitations thereof). The #1 selling spirit in the world is Officer's Choice Whisky, a brand that you probably have never heard of. That is because it is made in India and sold mostly to Indians in India, all billion+ of them. It is a vague imitation of Scotch but it is made mostly from molasses and not grain so it is really more of a rum than a whisky. Regardless of what it is, India is the world's #1 market for whisky (or "whisky").

    I see that Argentina corned beef in big supermarkets all the time. If you like corned beef hash and can’t eat the nasty greasy canned kind, you can make it with the Argentina corned beef. Fry the meat pieces separately to get all the fat rendered out. Then add to the potatoes and onions

    • Thanks: Malcolm X-Lax
    • Replies: @Cagey Beast
    Argentine corned beef, not "Argentina" corned beef. Just because our neoliberal ruling classes chose to swamp our Anglosphere with Third World cheap labour, it doesn't mean we have to start speaking pidgin English in order to fit in.

    If COVID-19 is what wipes us out, at least let's die with some dignity. Don't die from a Chinese disease while speaking your own language like a Chinaman. At least deny the globalists that victory.

    By the way, you're right to recommend corned beef.

    , @Jack D
    Are there a lot of Filipinos where you live?
  316. @Almost Missouri
    Generally agree, as an X-er. I can't always blanket condemn Boomers and Millennials because I have too many friends and acquaintances in those categories whom I like and admire, and who in turn have helped me. (I feel the same way about Jews, FWIW.) Not that this blinds me to the painfully obvious habits these groups can have in aggregate though. Ok, now that I'm done with my personal virtue signalling, I'll note my frustration with the Boomer generation in particular, which I think is hardly unique.

    After having inherited the greatest windfall of social assets in recorded history, rather than pass it on improved, or at least unencumbered, they are instead sucking out and consuming what is (or can be made) liquid—which though selfish, is at least understandable and rational from an amoral point of view—but additionally they are handing out what remains to the manifestly unworthy in exchange for socially destructive (though personally vainglorious) diversity points.

    Having spent a fair chunk of my life climbing the greasy poles of academic and corporate hierarchy, it is of course dismaying to learn that the payoff to this investment is, "sorry we're only hiring/promoting Diversity now, and you're not it. Of course, we weren't doing that when I, Boomer, made my career, but now that mine's made, we are because it makes me feel good about myself and that's what's important." Thanks, man. Had I known this would be the outcome, I would have focused more on my own thing and less on your teamplayer BS.

    Note to the younger generations: don't trust boomer institutions to have have your back when you reach boomer age—or even before. (Yes, I know the Social Security Ponzi scheme was set up long pre-boomer, but those people are overrated too. FDR, rot in hell.)

    Kathy Shaidle (a tail-end boomer I admired), used to describe the boomers as the Cash Out Generation. I can't disagree. Having won the born-in-the-right-place-at-the-right-time lottery, they've worked to ensure that no one after them will ever say that again. Some people, especially those in groups we're increasingly importing, have ethnic nepotism workarounds to advance themselves, but I don't. Besides not being "ethnic", I trusted the pre-boomer meritocracy to continue to work despite the boomer-led social ructions of the late twentieth century. I was mistaken.

    Here endeth the lament.

    Affirmative action act was passed in 1968 the disparate impact rule came in Griggs 1973. The oldest boomers were 22 and 27 , not in a position to do anything. A few were just out of law school.

    Brown 1953 to Griggs 1973. It really was the greatest generation who did it. 20 years when White judges presidents VPs Senators Congress critters and all the capitalist and communist powers that be destroyed White Americans .

    Some of us tried, really tried, especially born before the boomers in our 30s and 40s. There were some seriously illegal things contemplated. But we lost and are on our way to extinction.

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri

    "Brown 1953 to Griggs 1973. It really was the greatest generation who did it. 20 years when White judges presidents VPs Senators Congress critters and all the capitalist and communist powers that be destroyed White Americans ."
     
    Yes, I agree. Many of the signposts that we can see in retrospect were stakes through the heart of heritage America were planted there before the boomers were voters.

    "Some of us tried, really tried, especially born before the boomers in our 30s and 40s. There were some seriously illegal things contemplated. But we lost and are on our way to extinction."
     
    I am aware of that too, and I genuinely thank you for your efforts.

    The statutes and court decisions which are turning out to condemn heritage America weren't necessarily obviously going to do so at the time, and indeed were often not meant to do so by their backers (even if there may have been a few especially diabolical backers who did foresee the consequences). A lot of the damage came subsequently as the general culture and the cumulative effect of thousands of tiny court cases, regulatory updates and bureaucratic decisions gradually gave form and hideous strength to the amorphous moral fissures opened by Griggs, affirmative action, et al.

    A lot of that occurred during the ascendancy of the baby boom generation, though of course not with the cooperation of all its members. Rather, the left wing of the boom generation has been especially prominent and active ... and, unfortunately, successful. The right wing, by contrast, has been notably quieter and less effective. So, justly or not, the general perception is that the boomers were a left wing generation and that "boomer" now stands as a kind of shorthand for smug, hypocritical, limousine liberal establishment: think Clintons, the SPLC, 60 Minutes hosts, etc.

  317. [MORE]

    Researchers at the South China Agricultural University in Guangzhou suggested pangolins as the animal source at a press conference on 7 February. Pangolins are highly sought-after in China for their meat and their scales; the latter are used in traditional medicine. Although sales of the animal are forbidden in China as part of a worldwide ban, they are still smuggled in from a handful of southeast Asian and African countries. The researchers said they had found a coronavirus in smuggled pangolins that was a 99% genetic match to the virus circulating in people.

    But the result did not actually refer to the entire genome. In fact, it related to a specific site known as the receptor-binding domain (RBD), say the study’s authors, who posted their analysis1 on the biomedical preprint server bioRxiv on 20 February. The press-conference report was the result of an “embarrassing miscommunication between the bioinformatics group and the lab group of the study”, explains Xiao Lihua, a parasitologist at the South China Agricultural University and a co-author of the paper. A whole-genome comparison found that the pangolin and human viruses share 90.3% of their DNA.

  318. @Almost Missouri
    Yes, selfishness has a long history, but there are two things that distinguish the Boomers.

    1) Whatever the financial choices of your friend's grandparents were, it was, as you say, their own money. By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers and one may be excused for expecting would continue to exist after them too: corporate assets, NGOs, universities, governments. The drying up of most pension arrangements coincidentally as boomers are finished with them is an example.

    2) Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation, and a generation distinctly at odds with previous generations (and it is now turning out, at odds with later generations as well). I forget who said it, but someone characterized the boomers (when they were younger) as a tribe not of place but of time. I think this fairly encapsulates their self-created in-group/out-group mentality.

    I myself would have been happy to skip all the adversarial intergenerational feuding, just as I would have been happy to skip all interethnic identity-politics feuding, but the boomers enthusiastically embraced both generation tribalism and identity politics, such that now those are both immovable features of our socio-political landscape. Nowadays the political heft of both are turning against their erstwhile boomer sponsors, and the boomers suddenly want a rethink. They ended deference to the authority of elders back when they didn't have it. Now that they are the elders, they suddenly want it back.

    Too late! Shoulda listened to your elders back when they told you you were young, foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible, fifty years ago. Actually, I'm kinda kidding. Their elders didn't tell them nearly enough how foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible they were. As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, "the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation" which tells you that the Greatest wasn't so great either.

    It wasn’t the Boomers, it was the Generation in which the Jews took over

  319. Last April, I bought a pack of 20 N95 masks in preparation. I already had goggles. I’ve LDS relatives helping with food preparation. My attempt to buy an oxygen concentrator about a month ago ran into problems with hidden sourcing (ie: They said “USA” but that was referring to warehouses that were supplied from China). I’d also estimated (about a month ago) the plausible demand for quarantine facilities as compared with RV’s sitting around idle and thought maybe I should try to buy one of the derelict RVs you see sitting around. Well, I didn’t. I put it off. Now its getting difficult to find deals because people are preparing to go on their spring outings (I don’t think there’s been a run on RVs yet the way there has been for N95 masks).

    I’m going to pick up a triple-fuel industrial grade generator this weekend for my “country home”.

    PS: I moved to rural Iowa, to a house near a river about 10 years ago to prepare more for Reformation II than a pandemic — although one might consider the emergent “Inclusion Uber Alles” theocracy a kind of global pandemic that paves the way for viruses.

    • Replies: @Kibernetika
    It's good to have LDS family, friends and neighbors (well, in emergencies, at least). Learn to look past the religious/spiritual stuff and appreciate that they are incredibly well prepared for disasters. They have specialists in food security, communications, etc., at each temple. In brief, if you've got a few Mormon families in your neighborhood, there's food for a few months.
  320. @Jonathan Mason
    Looks like this morning's rally was a dead cat bounce and has all been given back again. I expect the indexes to decline more by the closing bell today and open lower tomorrow.

    (There, I have predicted this in public, and perhaps will be shown to be totally wrong tomorrow and will lose any credibility that I ever had).

    Looks like this morning’s rally was a dead cat bounce and has all been given back again. I expect the indexes to decline more by the closing bell today and open lower tomorrow.

    Well, looks like I was on the money there. I am not a big stock market player, but I did make enough to pay the excess that I owe on my income tax bill.

  321. @Jonathan Mason
    IThe best defense against Corona virus is to quit smoking cigarettes or cigars if you are a smoker, because smokers are much more likely to die of respiratory diseases.

    If you are overweight reducing your weight to acceptable parameters would also be helpful since many overweight people also have respiratory and circulatory problems.

    Moving South could also help. Corona viruses and flu viruses tend to flourish more in the winter time when the weather is cold than in the summertime when it is warm therefore it is intuitive that if you move to South Florida or Hawaii perhaps you are less likely to catch the virus.

    Here in North Florida the weather is fairly mild at the present time but it's dipping close to freezing temperatures at night this week, however we soon expect some warmer weather. It will be interesting to see whether the incidence of cases of the COVID virus occur more frequently in more northerly latitudes in the United States this spring.

    Stay out of airplanes. Inside airplanes and also to some extent inside airport buildings is probably the place where you are most likely to catch the virus. If you cannot stay out of airplanes using your own private jet would probably preferable. If you work at an airport just quit your job or stay home for the duration. If you are an airline pilot or crew change your job. Also avoid cruise ships if possible.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house. Alternatively you can shop with the Walmart shopping app where they bring your groceries out to your vehicle and put them in the back of your vehicle and you do not need to go inside the store.

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor's offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    Stay away from places of mass entertainment such as restaurants and cinemas or theaters. As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube. Outdoor mass entertainment venues such as football stadiums maybe a little safer but even then they could be some risk of people coughing over you. Indoor venues like basketball should be avoided.

    Go to cash,short stocks or buy puts because it is very likely that the stock market will crash as the extent to which the virus is going to damage trade becomes evident.

    Have your food delivered to the house by Amazon and have them leave it outside the house.

    What if one’s Amazon PrimeNow or Fresh deliverymen is likely to be from one’s local Chinatown? (To say nothing of the warehouse workers preparing one’s order.)

    Avoid going anywhere near hospitals, nursing homes, doctor’s offices, or pharmacies as these are typically full of sick people.

    What if one has a loved one who is confined to a hospital or nursing home?

    As far as we know the virus cannot be transmitted by the internet so stick to YouTube.

    It might not be a bad idea to download and save digital content now (videos as well as audio files; books and other text documents, etc.) to have available should one lose Internet access yet retain electrical power. This might be a good time for people to discover such lesser-known offerings as recordings of Old Time Radio, or of the many public domain books read by LibriVox volunteers.

    Also:
    – maintain extra, charged batteries for phone (plus laptop, tablet, etc) at all times; and a UPS (uninterruptible power supply) unit
    – properly backup critical data daily. Maintain redundancy: at least two separate copies (at least one on physical media), stored in two separate locations (at least one a secured physical; cloud storage should not be relied upon for more than one instance of redundancy.
    – I did not see anyone mention those crank-powered (wind-up) radios with built-in flashlights

  322. @Hail
    I won't pretend I understand what the table means in technical terms, but I do have 23andMe.

    I plugged in "ACE2" into the 23andMe search box. They list thirteen Markers (SNP) for ACE2 genes and give one column called "Your Genotype," with either a letter (indicating you have it, I think) or the phrase "not genotyped."

    I have 3 letters; 10 "not genotyped."

    This puts me, as expected, with Europe. On whatever this is supposed to measure.

    not genotyped means they did not test this SNP for you.

    23andme keeps changing the chips they use and changing the SNPs they genotype.

    My test was done on the V3 chip and I have results for 11 of the 13 ACE2 genes.
    My daughter was tested with the V4 chip and has the same results as you , just 3 were genotyped

  323. @Almost Missouri
    Yes, selfishness has a long history, but there are two things that distinguish the Boomers.

    1) Whatever the financial choices of your friend's grandparents were, it was, as you say, their own money. By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers and one may be excused for expecting would continue to exist after them too: corporate assets, NGOs, universities, governments. The drying up of most pension arrangements coincidentally as boomers are finished with them is an example.

    2) Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation, and a generation distinctly at odds with previous generations (and it is now turning out, at odds with later generations as well). I forget who said it, but someone characterized the boomers (when they were younger) as a tribe not of place but of time. I think this fairly encapsulates their self-created in-group/out-group mentality.

    I myself would have been happy to skip all the adversarial intergenerational feuding, just as I would have been happy to skip all interethnic identity-politics feuding, but the boomers enthusiastically embraced both generation tribalism and identity politics, such that now those are both immovable features of our socio-political landscape. Nowadays the political heft of both are turning against their erstwhile boomer sponsors, and the boomers suddenly want a rethink. They ended deference to the authority of elders back when they didn't have it. Now that they are the elders, they suddenly want it back.

    Too late! Shoulda listened to your elders back when they told you you were young, foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible, fifty years ago. Actually, I'm kinda kidding. Their elders didn't tell them nearly enough how foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible they were. As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, "the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation" which tells you that the Greatest wasn't so great either.

    Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation…

    Horse manure. It was cooked up by minions in Steve’s old industry, marketing research, and embraced by lazy “journalists”– the kind that use myth for “something untrue”– for use on slow news days.

    There had been talk of a baby boom since 1947, but I don’t remember hearing boomer until the mid-1980s, except for submarines. (And in Oklahomans’ parody of Yale’s fight song.) It is not an identity. This is new.

    By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers…

    Like Social Security, which netted their parents several times what they paid in? Or Medicare, the crown jewel in the storebought 1964 election which destroyed Barry Goldwater for telling the truth? (An election in which all of two states allowed even the oldest “boomers” a vote.)

    As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, “the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation”

    If otherwise admirable ladies like Ann Coulter and Jennifer Roback Morse want to apologize for their imagined “generation”, that’s their business. Leave me out of it. It only makes them look bad.

    …which tells you that the Greatest wasn’t so great either.

    Peak moral relativism in the United States came in 1945. The eldest of “boomers” were still in gestation.

    As for “greatest” and “millennial”, one term drips with the filial guilt of Tom Brokaw and Tim Russert, and the other with stomach-turning narcissism.

    • Agree: Dissident
    • Replies: @Almost Missouri

    ["Boomer"] was cooked up by minions in Steve’s old industry, marketing research, and embraced by lazy “journalists”... There had been talk of a baby boom since 1947, but I don’t remember hearing boomer until the mid-1980s ... It is not an identity. This is new.
     
    Reg, I think we had this conversation before.

    Ah yes, here it is, October 2018, you, me, Steve and some others:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-the-senate-affirmative-action-for-white-people/#comment-2573630

    Now, as then, I agree with you 1) that the name "boomer" is more recent that the generation itself, and 2) that it is a stupid basis for identity.

    Nevertheless, 1) that name refers to something that already existed under other names, and 2) stupid or not, boomers and others have accepted the concept.

    Like Social Security, which netted their parents several times what they paid in?
     
    Yes, the intergenerational scam known as "Social Security" comes from the Victorian-era baby FDR, as I noted previously. And yes, the boomers, occupying the middle tier in the pyramid scheme won't do as well out of it as their parents did. On the other hand, they will do much better than will the bottom tier people who come after them. And—I'm not blaming, just observing, please don't take this a criticism, just a friendly heads-up—unlike the boomers' parents, who will be long gone when the bottom tier of the pyramid scheme finally figures out that they are the bottom tier of the pyramid, the boomers will likely still be around as a focus for the resentment of those who subsidized them.

    Or Medicare, the crown jewel in the storebought 1964 election which destroyed Barry Goldwater for telling the truth? (An election in which all of two states allowed even the oldest “boomers” a vote.)
     
    Yes, I agree, and otherwise same as I said for Social Security, except this one is from LBJ, who can rot in hell too.
  324. @Jesse
    Another thing people never seem to consider is their caffeine intake. Most adults will experience some sort of withdrawal symptoms if they don't get their fix. You need to consider stockpiling cheap supermarket coffee. (Energy drinks, caffeine pills etc., are NOT recommended).

    I assume most people have the beans, rice, water side of things covered. This is more a PSA about what people forget.

    Another thing people never seem to consider is their caffeine intake. Most adults will experience some sort of withdrawal symptoms if they don’t get their fix.

    People tell me this, but… I give up coffee every Lent, and have never experienced such a phenomenon. Perhaps I’m wired differently, but periodic breaks from caffeine might also protect you. (I do drink black and green tea, so it’s not a total fast.)

    On the other hand, the saws “beer before liquor” and “sweets before dinner spoil your appetite” don’t apply to me either, so maybe it is wiring.

  325. @J.Ross
    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don't see an argument against that.

    [Anonymous[409] wrote:

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already

    I replied with condemnation, characterizing the expressed sentiments as psychopathic.
    J.Ross then replied to me:

    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don’t see an argument against that.

    Have you considered that the generations below you may one day say the same about you and your generation? That you will be considered more of a burden and liability than a blessing and an asset? Should that happen, are you agreeable to the idea of, say, being euthanized? For the benefit of the younger generations; the greater good, of course.

    Is that not the logical conclusion of your thinking?

    Such sentiments, from an individual who for a long time seemingly endorsed and promoted 4Chan and Chateau Heartiste,

    [MORE]
    should perhaps not come as much of a surprise. But for a number of the others who have now endorsed, echoed and expanded upon the statements I quoted above? For someone as seemingly mature, thoughtful, educated, and articulate as Almost Missouri? I am reminded of the thread, from sometime within the past few months or so, on Ezekiel Emmanuel’s long-infamous declaration to the effect that individuals above a certain age (75?) are not worth the expense of keeping alive. Among the considerable number of comments that I recall as expressing support for this view, were at least two from regular comment-posters who purport to be devout Christians (one of the two stands-out for perhaps being the most self-anointed and harshly judgemental of any of the regular comment-posters I have come across here). I was absolutely shocked by this and since witnessing it, have wanted to challenge those individuals as follows. Doesn’t Christianity hold all life, from the moment of conception to death, to be absolutely sacred?

    • Replies: @Almost Missouri

    "Have you considered that the generations below you may one day say the same about you and your generation? That you will be considered more of a burden and liability than a blessing and an asset?"
     
    It's not really a "may one day" thing with the generation behind us. The Sarah Jeong generation already definitively considers us enemies of the woke state and openly cheers our demise, with the full backing of the media-political complex. You may not live long enough to see their wishes become kinetic, but those younger than yourself can ill afford complacent optimism.

    "But for a number of the others who have now endorsed, echoed and expanded upon the statements I quoted above?"
     
    I prefer to think of my contribution as honing rather than "expanding".

    "For someone as seemingly mature, thoughtful, educated, and articulate as Almost Missouri?"
     
    Thanks for the accolade, however undeserved.

    "Doesn’t Christianity hold all life, from the moment of conception to death, to be absolutely sacred?"
     
    As someone who is merely desultorily trying to be Christian, I don't want to speak for the self-described devout, but may I just point out that Christianity and Jainism are not identical, and even Jains can display a certain hostility to those they perceive to be athwart their own interests.
    , @bigdicknick
    I have no doubt later generations will look on me (a white millenial) with disdain since they won't share my race, heritage or culture. So yes, you are correct, but not for the right reasons.
  326. @Alden
    I see that Argentina corned beef in big supermarkets all the time. If you like corned beef hash and can’t eat the nasty greasy canned kind, you can make it with the Argentina corned beef. Fry the meat pieces separately to get all the fat rendered out. Then add to the potatoes and onions

    Argentine corned beef, not “Argentina” corned beef. Just because our neoliberal ruling classes chose to swamp our Anglosphere with Third World cheap labour, it doesn’t mean we have to start speaking pidgin English in order to fit in.

    If COVID-19 is what wipes us out, at least let’s die with some dignity. Don’t die from a Chinese disease while speaking your own language like a Chinaman. At least deny the globalists that victory.

    By the way, you’re right to recommend corned beef.

    • Replies: @JMcG
    Argentina is a brand name. My dad got a taste for the stuff in England. I could never manage it myself. I’ll have to give it another try. Good luck to you.
  327. @Mr McKenna
    One of many arguments "against that" is that it's painting with a ridiculously large brush.
    People born in 1964 have very little in common with those born in 1946.
    Speaking as one of the latter I wish I'd been one of the former.

    One of many arguments “against that” is that it’s painting with a ridiculously large brush.
    People born in 1964 have very little in common with those born in 1946.

    Is it not also painting with a ridiculously large brush to categorically condemn even all people born in a single year?

    And even if there were to be certain criticisms that could legitimately be applied to entire generations, the questions would remain:
    1.) Can anyone of a subsequent generation know that he would have been any better than any of those he condemns, had he lived in their time and place?

    2.) Is anything good accomplished by singling-out entire past generations for condemnation and resentment?

    Aren’t people the products of their environment? Of the time, place and circumstances in which they live? How much influence or power do the overwhelming majority of people, in any given time and place, have over society-at-large? What percentage of any given population is even politically aware and active? Or have the requisite intelligence, time and opportunity that they can reasonably be expected to know more than following the dominant, accessible sources of information allow for? Is it reasonable to expect more than a relatively small percentage of the population to have the kind of knowledge, intelligence and capacity for independent and often highly dissident thought that individuals such as the better contributors to iSteve threads demonstrate?

  328. @Dissident

    Yes, that was a great two-episode Suspense production.
     
    Didn't you mean to write Escape?

    There were a number of scripts that were performed by both Suspense! and Escape. But to the best of my knowledge, Earth Abides is not among them.

    At any rate, it is great to finally see others here who appreciate Old Time Radio.

    Didn’t you mean to write Escape?

    Thanks for catching that. Further, your response to my error was both polite and civil. These days that’s remarkable because it’s so rare.

  329. @Cagey Beast
    Argentine corned beef, not "Argentina" corned beef. Just because our neoliberal ruling classes chose to swamp our Anglosphere with Third World cheap labour, it doesn't mean we have to start speaking pidgin English in order to fit in.

    If COVID-19 is what wipes us out, at least let's die with some dignity. Don't die from a Chinese disease while speaking your own language like a Chinaman. At least deny the globalists that victory.

    By the way, you're right to recommend corned beef.

    Argentina is a brand name. My dad got a taste for the stuff in England. I could never manage it myself. I’ll have to give it another try. Good luck to you.

  330. @Reg Cæsar

    Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation...
     
    Horse manure. It was cooked up by minions in Steve's old industry, marketing research, and embraced by lazy "journalists"-- the kind that use myth for "something untrue"-- for use on slow news days.

    There had been talk of a baby boom since 1947, but I don't remember hearing boomer until the mid-1980s, except for submarines. (And in Oklahomans' parody of Yale's fight song.) It is not an identity. This is new.


    By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers...
     
    Like Social Security, which netted their parents several times what they paid in? Or Medicare, the crown jewel in the storebought 1964 election which destroyed Barry Goldwater for telling the truth? (An election in which all of two states allowed even the oldest "boomers" a vote.)

    As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, “the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation”
     
    If otherwise admirable ladies like Ann Coulter and Jennifer Roback Morse want to apologize for their imagined "generation", that's their business. Leave me out of it. It only makes them look bad.

    ...which tells you that the Greatest wasn’t so great either.
     
    Peak moral relativism in the United States came in 1945. The eldest of "boomers" were still in gestation.

    As for "greatest" and "millennial", one term drips with the filial guilt of Tom Brokaw and Tim Russert, and the other with stomach-turning narcissism.

    [“Boomer”] was cooked up by minions in Steve’s old industry, marketing research, and embraced by lazy “journalists”… There had been talk of a baby boom since 1947, but I don’t remember hearing boomer until the mid-1980s … It is not an identity. This is new.

    Reg, I think we had this conversation before.

    Ah yes, here it is, October 2018, you, me, Steve and some others:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nyt-the-senate-affirmative-action-for-white-people/#comment-2573630

    Now, as then, I agree with you 1) that the name “boomer” is more recent that the generation itself, and 2) that it is a stupid basis for identity.

    Nevertheless, 1) that name refers to something that already existed under other names, and 2) stupid or not, boomers and others have accepted the concept.

    Like Social Security, which netted their parents several times what they paid in?

    Yes, the intergenerational scam known as “Social Security” comes from the Victorian-era baby FDR, as I noted previously. And yes, the boomers, occupying the middle tier in the pyramid scheme won’t do as well out of it as their parents did. On the other hand, they will do much better than will the bottom tier people who come after them. And—I’m not blaming, just observing, please don’t take this a criticism, just a friendly heads-up—unlike the boomers’ parents, who will be long gone when the bottom tier of the pyramid scheme finally figures out that they are the bottom tier of the pyramid, the boomers will likely still be around as a focus for the resentment of those who subsidized them.

    Or Medicare, the crown jewel in the storebought 1964 election which destroyed Barry Goldwater for telling the truth? (An election in which all of two states allowed even the oldest “boomers” a vote.)

    Yes, I agree, and otherwise same as I said for Social Security, except this one is from LBJ, who can rot in hell too.

  331. @James Bowery
    Last April, I bought a pack of 20 N95 masks in preparation. I already had goggles. I've LDS relatives helping with food preparation. My attempt to buy an oxygen concentrator about a month ago ran into problems with hidden sourcing (ie: They said "USA" but that was referring to warehouses that were supplied from China). I'd also estimated (about a month ago) the plausible demand for quarantine facilities as compared with RV's sitting around idle and thought maybe I should try to buy one of the derelict RVs you see sitting around. Well, I didn't. I put it off. Now its getting difficult to find deals because people are preparing to go on their spring outings (I don't think there's been a run on RVs yet the way there has been for N95 masks).

    I'm going to pick up a triple-fuel industrial grade generator this weekend for my "country home".

    PS: I moved to rural Iowa, to a house near a river about 10 years ago to prepare more for Reformation II than a pandemic -- although one might consider the emergent "Inclusion Uber Alles" theocracy a kind of global pandemic that paves the way for viruses.

    It’s good to have LDS family, friends and neighbors (well, in emergencies, at least). Learn to look past the religious/spiritual stuff and appreciate that they are incredibly well prepared for disasters. They have specialists in food security, communications, etc., at each temple. In brief, if you’ve got a few Mormon families in your neighborhood, there’s food for a few months.

  332. @Alden
    Affirmative action act was passed in 1968 the disparate impact rule came in Griggs 1973. The oldest boomers were 22 and 27 , not in a position to do anything. A few were just out of law school.

    Brown 1953 to Griggs 1973. It really was the greatest generation who did it. 20 years when White judges presidents VPs Senators Congress critters and all the capitalist and communist powers that be destroyed White Americans .

    Some of us tried, really tried, especially born before the boomers in our 30s and 40s. There were some seriously illegal things contemplated. But we lost and are on our way to extinction.

    “Brown 1953 to Griggs 1973. It really was the greatest generation who did it. 20 years when White judges presidents VPs Senators Congress critters and all the capitalist and communist powers that be destroyed White Americans .”

    Yes, I agree. Many of the signposts that we can see in retrospect were stakes through the heart of heritage America were planted there before the boomers were voters.

    “Some of us tried, really tried, especially born before the boomers in our 30s and 40s. There were some seriously illegal things contemplated. But we lost and are on our way to extinction.”

    I am aware of that too, and I genuinely thank you for your efforts.

    The statutes and court decisions which are turning out to condemn heritage America weren’t necessarily obviously going to do so at the time, and indeed were often not meant to do so by their backers (even if there may have been a few especially diabolical backers who did foresee the consequences). A lot of the damage came subsequently as the general culture and the cumulative effect of thousands of tiny court cases, regulatory updates and bureaucratic decisions gradually gave form and hideous strength to the amorphous moral fissures opened by Griggs, affirmative action, et al.

    A lot of that occurred during the ascendancy of the baby boom generation, though of course not with the cooperation of all its members. Rather, the left wing of the boom generation has been especially prominent and active … and, unfortunately, successful. The right wing, by contrast, has been notably quieter and less effective. So, justly or not, the general perception is that the boomers were a left wing generation and that “boomer” now stands as a kind of shorthand for smug, hypocritical, limousine liberal establishment: think Clintons, the SPLC, 60 Minutes hosts, etc.

  333. @Dissident
    [Anonymous[409] wrote:

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I replied with condemnation, characterizing the expressed sentiments as psychopathic.
    J.Ross then replied to me:

    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don’t see an argument against that.
     
    Have you considered that the generations below you may one day say the same about you and your generation? That you will be considered more of a burden and liability than a blessing and an asset? Should that happen, are you agreeable to the idea of, say, being euthanized? For the benefit of the younger generations; the greater good, of course.

    Is that not the logical conclusion of your thinking?

    Such sentiments, from an individual who for a long time seemingly endorsed and promoted 4Chan and Chateau Heartiste, should perhaps not come as much of a surprise. But for a number of the others who have now endorsed, echoed and expanded upon the statements I quoted above? For someone as seemingly mature, thoughtful, educated, and articulate as Almost Missouri? I am reminded of the thread, from sometime within the past few months or so, on Ezekiel Emmanuel's long-infamous declaration to the effect that individuals above a certain age (75?) are not worth the expense of keeping alive. Among the considerable number of comments that I recall as expressing support for this view, were at least two from regular comment-posters who purport to be devout Christians (one of the two stands-out for perhaps being the most self-anointed and harshly judgemental of any of the regular comment-posters I have come across here). I was absolutely shocked by this and since witnessing it, have wanted to challenge those individuals as follows. Doesn't Christianity hold all life, from the moment of conception to death, to be absolutely sacred?

    “Have you considered that the generations below you may one day say the same about you and your generation? That you will be considered more of a burden and liability than a blessing and an asset?”

    It’s not really a “may one day” thing with the generation behind us. The Sarah Jeong generation already definitively considers us enemies of the woke state and openly cheers our demise, with the full backing of the media-political complex. You may not live long enough to see their wishes become kinetic, but those younger than yourself can ill afford complacent optimism.

    “But for a number of the others who have now endorsed, echoed and expanded upon the statements I quoted above?”

    I prefer to think of my contribution as honing rather than “expanding”.

    “For someone as seemingly mature, thoughtful, educated, and articulate as Almost Missouri?”

    Thanks for the accolade, however undeserved.

    “Doesn’t Christianity hold all life, from the moment of conception to death, to be absolutely sacred?”

    As someone who is merely desultorily trying to be Christian, I don’t want to speak for the self-described devout, but may I just point out that Christianity and Jainism are not identical, and even Jains can display a certain hostility to those they perceive to be athwart their own interests.

  334. @Almost Missouri
    Yes, selfishness has a long history, but there are two things that distinguish the Boomers.

    1) Whatever the financial choices of your friend's grandparents were, it was, as you say, their own money. By contrast, I am referring to institutional wealth, tangible and intangible, that was in certain ways in the public commons, that existed in some form before the boomers and one may be excused for expecting would continue to exist after them too: corporate assets, NGOs, universities, governments. The drying up of most pension arrangements coincidentally as boomers are finished with them is an example.

    2) Boomers, to an extent that I cannot find any trace of with prior generations, cultivated a consciousness of themselves as a distinct generation, and a generation distinctly at odds with previous generations (and it is now turning out, at odds with later generations as well). I forget who said it, but someone characterized the boomers (when they were younger) as a tribe not of place but of time. I think this fairly encapsulates their self-created in-group/out-group mentality.

    I myself would have been happy to skip all the adversarial intergenerational feuding, just as I would have been happy to skip all interethnic identity-politics feuding, but the boomers enthusiastically embraced both generation tribalism and identity politics, such that now those are both immovable features of our socio-political landscape. Nowadays the political heft of both are turning against their erstwhile boomer sponsors, and the boomers suddenly want a rethink. They ended deference to the authority of elders back when they didn't have it. Now that they are the elders, they suddenly want it back.

    Too late! Shoulda listened to your elders back when they told you you were young, foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible, fifty years ago. Actually, I'm kinda kidding. Their elders didn't tell them nearly enough how foolish, reckless, self-absorbed and irresponsible they were. As honorary X-er Ann Coulter noted, "the Worst Generation was raised by the Greatest Generation" which tells you that the Greatest wasn't so great either.

    You can trace the problem back to the 1930s and the Depression. People who went hungry as kids will have a tendency to spoil their own kids rotten 20 years later.

    Some people blame Dr. Spock for this, but his ideas wouldn’t have gained traction if they weren’t already in sync with how everybody was thinking anyway.

  335. @Alden
    I see that Argentina corned beef in big supermarkets all the time. If you like corned beef hash and can’t eat the nasty greasy canned kind, you can make it with the Argentina corned beef. Fry the meat pieces separately to get all the fat rendered out. Then add to the potatoes and onions

    Are there a lot of Filipinos where you live?

  336. @Almost Missouri
    Generally agree, as an X-er. I can't always blanket condemn Boomers and Millennials because I have too many friends and acquaintances in those categories whom I like and admire, and who in turn have helped me. (I feel the same way about Jews, FWIW.) Not that this blinds me to the painfully obvious habits these groups can have in aggregate though. Ok, now that I'm done with my personal virtue signalling, I'll note my frustration with the Boomer generation in particular, which I think is hardly unique.

    After having inherited the greatest windfall of social assets in recorded history, rather than pass it on improved, or at least unencumbered, they are instead sucking out and consuming what is (or can be made) liquid—which though selfish, is at least understandable and rational from an amoral point of view—but additionally they are handing out what remains to the manifestly unworthy in exchange for socially destructive (though personally vainglorious) diversity points.

    Having spent a fair chunk of my life climbing the greasy poles of academic and corporate hierarchy, it is of course dismaying to learn that the payoff to this investment is, "sorry we're only hiring/promoting Diversity now, and you're not it. Of course, we weren't doing that when I, Boomer, made my career, but now that mine's made, we are because it makes me feel good about myself and that's what's important." Thanks, man. Had I known this would be the outcome, I would have focused more on my own thing and less on your teamplayer BS.

    Note to the younger generations: don't trust boomer institutions to have have your back when you reach boomer age—or even before. (Yes, I know the Social Security Ponzi scheme was set up long pre-boomer, but those people are overrated too. FDR, rot in hell.)

    Kathy Shaidle (a tail-end boomer I admired), used to describe the boomers as the Cash Out Generation. I can't disagree. Having won the born-in-the-right-place-at-the-right-time lottery, they've worked to ensure that no one after them will ever say that again. Some people, especially those in groups we're increasingly importing, have ethnic nepotism workarounds to advance themselves, but I don't. Besides not being "ethnic", I trusted the pre-boomer meritocracy to continue to work despite the boomer-led social ructions of the late twentieth century. I was mistaken.

    Here endeth the lament.

    “We need to make room for diversity, well not me specifically, but definitely you!”

  337. @Dissident
    [Anonymous[409] wrote:

    as a an under-30 guy, i relish the possibility of a pandemic virus that kills mostly elderly people, you live damn too long already
     
    I replied with condemnation, characterizing the expressed sentiments as psychopathic.
    J.Ross then replied to me:

    Corona or no, we will live less, and live diminished lives while they last, partially as a result of boomerism. I don’t see an argument against that.
     
    Have you considered that the generations below you may one day say the same about you and your generation? That you will be considered more of a burden and liability than a blessing and an asset? Should that happen, are you agreeable to the idea of, say, being euthanized? For the benefit of the younger generations; the greater good, of course.

    Is that not the logical conclusion of your thinking?

    Such sentiments, from an individual who for a long time seemingly endorsed and promoted 4Chan and Chateau Heartiste, should perhaps not come as much of a surprise. But for a number of the others who have now endorsed, echoed and expanded upon the statements I quoted above? For someone as seemingly mature, thoughtful, educated, and articulate as Almost Missouri? I am reminded of the thread, from sometime within the past few months or so, on Ezekiel Emmanuel's long-infamous declaration to the effect that individuals above a certain age (75?) are not worth the expense of keeping alive. Among the considerable number of comments that I recall as expressing support for this view, were at least two from regular comment-posters who purport to be devout Christians (one of the two stands-out for perhaps being the most self-anointed and harshly judgemental of any of the regular comment-posters I have come across here). I was absolutely shocked by this and since witnessing it, have wanted to challenge those individuals as follows. Doesn't Christianity hold all life, from the moment of conception to death, to be absolutely sacred?

    I have no doubt later generations will look on me (a white millenial) with disdain since they won’t share my race, heritage or culture. So yes, you are correct, but not for the right reasons.

  338. Get a flu shot. Don’t waste your time on CV.

    (If you actually don’t have a minimal prepper kit: 20lbs of rice in airtight containers per person, 5 jars of peanut butter per person, couple bags of charcoal per, small charcoal grill, bic lighters, 25 gallons of water per. Rotate all perishables out every 6 months or so.)

  339. @Kronos
    Here’s a video that covers the basics.

    https://youtu.be/eFHEyJIFFB0

    That guy’s a jackass. Probably good to write down his list and shop for alternatives, though. And put it all in backpacks, not gym bags.

    • Replies: @Kronos

    That guy’s a jackass.
     
    True, but he’s a very talented one. I very much enjoyed his book on being a credit analyst during the Housing Boom and subsequent crisis.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1439204063/ref=dbs_a_w_dp_1439204063
  340. @Sam Haysom
    Imagine having a melt down of this proportion and then typing it all out and then pushing send.

    I.e., imagine being a boomer.

    Sry, can’t.

  341. @Whiskey
    Black pilled Eeyore that's me. Afraid of women no. Dislike idiot feminist lunacy like nails on a chalkboard yes.

    As for guns ammo, you better have it. Periodically police run away: Rodney King and Freddy Gray riots, Criwn Heights, etc. Expect 3-5 days of wilding. The Purge movies in real life. No cops right there ... it's free crime day.

    You know who I am talking about. Better have ammo.

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.

    An epidemic police will be gone for months not days and you will be alone with the vibrant diverse.

    You'd damned well better be armed son!

    That includes a rifle. A decent lever action can work against a mob.

    Rotgut’s always saying stupid crap like this because he thinks it gets him cred, or something.

    Assemble your own AR (so you can buy parts when deals pop up) for $450. That’ll prolly be cheaper than a “decent lever action.” Whole hell of a lot more firepower.

  342. @Svigor
    That guy's a jackass. Probably good to write down his list and shop for alternatives, though. And put it all in backpacks, not gym bags.

    That guy’s a jackass.

    True, but he’s a very talented one. I very much enjoyed his book on being a credit analyst during the Housing Boom and subsequent crisis.

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