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California Public School Campuses Won't Reopen This Spring
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California public schools had been hoping to reopen their campuses in May, but that now seems unlikely:

California schools unlikely to reopen this academic year amid coronavirus, state schools chief says

By HOWARD BLUME, SONALI KOHLI
MARCH 31, 2020 4:26 PM

California public school campuses are unlikely to reopen for the remainder of the academic school year in response to the coronavirus pandemic, state Supt. of Public Instruction Tony Thurmond said Tuesday in a letter to school district officials.

“Due to the current safety concerns and needs for ongoing social distancing it currently appears that our students will not be able to return to school campuses before the end of the school year,” Thurmond wrote. “This is in no way to suggest that school is over for the year, but rather we should put all efforts into strengthening our delivery of education through distance learning.”

Earlier, Thurmond had resisted suggestions that there was no hope for returning to campus. His letter Tuesday represented a shift of direction.

Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?

Well we got no class
And we got no principals
And we got no innocence
We can’t even think of a word that rhymes
School’s out for summer
School’s out forever
My school’s been blown to pieces
No more pencils no more books
No more teacher’s dirty looks
Out for summer
Out till fall
We might not come back at all
School’s out forever
School’s out for summer
School’s out with fever
School’s out completely

 
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  1. Part of the problem with reopening the schools is that it would extend past the normal school year. Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days. Don’t believe me? You can go on line and see that this was proposed in Chicago and the teachers response. Never have the audacity to ask teachers to do more than the hardlines of a contract.

    • Replies: @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.
    , @Known Fact
    Just about everyone is going to see one-third of their local public school year wiped out, aside from some half-hearted "distance learning." I've beat this drum already, but what are homeowners supposed to think about the thousands in school taxes they just paid and are going to be asked to pay once again in the fall? I understand that some costs are fixed -- especially those pensions -- but still ...
    , @ScarletNumber

    Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days.
     
    Of course we would. Why wouldn't we? I'm working at home, and my contract says I work 180 days per year.
    , @Seth Largo
    Dude. I can't speak for all districts* but my wife is working twice as hard right now to create homework packets (on a running two-week basis), create video lectures, do individual Zoom meetings with kids who need extra help, field emails from parents, etc. Also: because the homework packets get sent out and returned every two weeks, that means grading is not spread out evenly. When those packets get returned, that's two weeks of grading she has to do in a weekend.

    *She actually works at a private school. But she has friends in the local public district who are doing the exact same thing.

  2. We don’t need no education
    We don’t need no thought control
    No dark sarcasm in the classroom
    Teachers leave them kids alone
    Hey, teachers, leave them kids alone
    All in all it’s just another sick in the Wu
    All in all you’re just another bat in the wok

    • LOL: SOL
    • Replies: @Mr McKenna
    Uh oh, they let him out again. Joe Biden holds forth on MSNBC:


    Presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden conducted a gaffe-filled interview on MSNBC Monday, kicking off his media appearance by referring to the epicenter of the coronavirus by the wrong name.

    “I suggested we should have people in China at the outset of this event, when it all started, in Luhan Province,” Biden told the network, meaning to refer to the city of Wuhan, in Hubei Province, where the virus originated.

    “We had people in our administration, we had CDC people in other countries because we wanted to anticipate when in fact another virus would occur, when in fact a pandemic might occur as a consequence of a spreading virus in another country, to act quickly. The president withdrew those people,” Biden said.
     
    Word salad almost worthy of Sarah Palin.


    The problem, however, is that regardless of staffing cuts, the CDC began offering to send a team of experts to the Chinese province back in early January, according to the New York Times.

    As he did last week, Biden again gave the wrong date for a USA Today op-ed he penned on the virus, again claiming it was posted on Jan. 17 when it was actually Jan. 27.

    The ex-VP also mixed up his drugstores and government agencies, accidentally referring to CVS as CVC.

    When thanked by the MSNBC co-host for sitting down with her, Biden had another awkward remark, responding, “Well, thanks for giving me the time. So they won’t wonder where I am.”
     
    Good work, Joe! But do you wonder where you are?
  3. Good. Do away with the whole corrupt public school system entirely. Online education is better and vastly more cost-efficient anyway.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Thomm, a local private high school for girls had already subscribed to a video program. The girls log on and they show up like a "patch work" quilt on the teacher's console. They must log in on time and in uniform, regular curriculum and subject matter. In private schools you get what you pay for, actually you demand it.
    , @bomag
    Generally agree with your sentiment, but a chunk of the population benefits from the soft institutionalization provided by the current model.

    We could be honest and provide this oversight and "subsidized dating" at a lower cost.
    , @Rob McX
    Isn't school a kind of pre-prison human warehousing service in certain urban quarters?
  4. He played golf.

    • Replies: @Cortes
    The Penguin paperback edition of RLS’s “Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde” I picked up for a niece’s Christmas gift had stylised sketches of the golfing AC on the cover. Excellent artwork.
    , @Clifford brown
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8OzPt7JaDA
  5. I hope that when this is all over, we get reams of data. State performance tests, national and international exams, IQ tests. College enrollment levels.

    BTW, I was thinking that the sports angle is pretty big. Sports is a subversion of natural tribalism into politically safe avenues.

    • Replies: @Lagertha
    Well, I have a funny feeling that now, that American teens missed their prom, spring musical, their final art project , their final concert, their IAC tournament game, their graduation ceremony...not to mention NIAC championships for Uni kids & the actual, competitors, they are sooo gonna turn on the Democrats and their wussy-assed, scaredy cat parents. Death is not a reality for young people!!!!!

    The facts are out: NE & Eastern Seaboard govts did not buy crucial equipment and materiel in 2015 (during the insipid Obama regime) when evaluations for Pandemics were highlighted at meetings. Supposedly evil, China had been flirting with Bioweapons for years, as had Russia...Israel said they could counter-attack - important clue. All of them are asshole countries. I hate them all. al-Gadaffi called it years ago! And, he was tortured before he was actually, killed.

    Kids are gonna tell their parents to STFU (especially, brain-washed, stupid-assed democrat-voting parents) after being locked up, in the house, with them. They will vote for Trump - being positive and not laying blame is always the best attitude. Lamont and Cuomo are just imploding.

    My last college student is happy to be in a passel of puppies in a house where they have more or less been together for 2 years. They are brothers and will remember this time: And, they will all vote for Trump. https://youtu.be/wZ1vn85iQRE


    Once, again, doomsday according to Democrat Governors/mayors is gonna bite them in the ass - But their too vain and pretentious to even, sense that. Trump can call Marshall Law at anytime.

    The really creepy governors & mayors of NY, NJ, CT, WA, Michigan+ can still be hunted down & they, and their children will be hunted down by very evil, prisoners and street-people, once food becomes an issue - once violence breaks out - rich people and walls are nuthin. Just so many guns, so many bullets - detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!

    , @Lagertha
    Well, I have a funny feeling that now, that American teens missed their prom, spring musical, their final art project , their final concert, their IAC tournament game, their graduation ceremony...not to mention NIAC championships for Uni kids & the actual, competitors, they are sooo gonna turn on the Democrats and their wussy-assed, scaredy cat parents Death is not a reality for young people!!!!!

    The facts are out: NE & Eastern Seaboard govts did not buy crucial equipment and materiel in 2015 (during the insipid Obama regime) when evaluations for Pandemics were highlighted at meetings. Mercurious China had been flirting with Bioweapons for years, as had Russia...Israel said they could counteract. All them are asshole countries. I hate them all. al-Gadaffi called it years ago!

    Kids are gonna tell their parents to STFU (especially, brain-washed, stupid-assed democrat-voting parents) after being locked up, in the house, with them. They will vote for Trump - being positive and not laying blame is always the best attitude. Lamont and Cuomo are just imploding.

    My last college student is happy to be in a passel of puppies in a house where they have more or less been together for 2 years. They are brothers and will remember this time: And, they will all vote for Trump. https://youtu.be/wZ1vn85iQRE


    Once, again, doomsday according to Democrat Governors/mayors is gonna bite them in the ass - But their too vain and pretentious to even, sense that. Trump can call Marshall Law at anytime.

    The really creepy governors & mayors of NY, NJ, CT, WA, Michigan+ can still be hunted down & they, and their children will be hunted down by very evil, prisoners and street-people, once food becomes an issue - once violence breaks out - rich people and walls are nuthin. Just so many guns, so many bullets - detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!

  6. Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?

    I’m sure plenty will be written about how this shutdown’s disparate impact on NAM students is explanatory of the racial performance gap of anyone now alive, as well as their children. That research will this be used to justify spending and Affirmative Action into the 2070s.

    Tangentially related, last week’s Freakonomics Radio had a segment musing about whether this social distancing will drive permanent changes in remote working, trade shows and college instruction. Nothing concrete.

    (https://freakonomics.com/podcast/covid-19-effects/
    There’s a transcript there too. last segment)

    • Replies: @prosa123
    Working from home on the computer has been The Next New Thing for well over a decade. I just don't see it catching on as a permanent thing.
    , @Morton's toes
    What this topic needs is a report from Asian kids who are now completely parental supervised and have to work 13 hours a day on their schoolwork instead of 11.5.
  7. OT
    Police shoot black teen for violating coronavirus curfew.

    Time to riot.

    nvm it was in Kenya.

    cops shoot 13-year-old boy dead as he played on the balcony of his home 20 minutes after coronavirus curfew came into force

    Violence probably due to inherited epigenetic trauma from colonialism.

  8. @James Speaks
    He played golf.

    The Penguin paperback edition of RLS’s “Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde” I picked up for a niece’s Christmas gift had stylised sketches of the golfing AC on the cover. Excellent artwork.

  9. • LOL: Kronos
    • Replies: @JimB
    When is “Hey, Hey, Hey, It’s Fat Albert” going to be released on DVD? One of Bill Cosby’s sexual assault victims should sue him for the home video rights so we can all see it again.
  10. I’ve been musing that social (and other) scientists should spend their time thinking about all the natural experiments these social restrictions are going to make possible.

    Gather your data while you may.

  11. What if social scientists were required to go on lockdown/quarantine and stop doing studies, and the rest of us did a study on how things changed?

    • Agree: Hibernian
    • LOL: Chrisnonymous
  12. @Buffalo Joe
    Part of the problem with reopening the schools is that it would extend past the normal school year. Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days. Don't believe me? You can go on line and see that this was proposed in Chicago and the teachers response. Never have the audacity to ask teachers to do more than the hardlines of a contract.

    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master’s who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I”d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Shitting bricks, indeed.
    , @Buffalo Joe
    Cher, The first thing US teachers talk about is their pay. Overseas you got the same pay and better perks? Then why return for less. We have PE teachers in my district making $100K for 184 days of work. And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize. And if you tell me you work ten hour days that is still a 1,840 hour year. Factory work at 40 hours and 50 weeks is 2000 hours. Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education.
    , @Je Suis Omar Mateen
    "However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option."

    If you paid any attention to reality, you'd know kiddles are largely immune to corona-chan. One million dead? You wish.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    ...US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.
     
    Woefully undertaught, too, from what I understand.
    , @Joe Stalin
    You want to see how much Chicago Public School teachers make?

    https://cps.edu/About_CPS/Financial_information/Pages/EmployeePositionFiles.aspx

    They list the teacher names, position, compensation, benefits, etc.

    HOLY F***ING COW!

    This is why taxes are outrageous in Chicago.

    Go ahead and just click on the latest date list for a spread sheet and compare that pay to the ordinary John and Jane Doe.
    , @Chief Seattle
    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of...

    Here they can do more than dream too -- but most get caught eventually.
    , @black sea
    According to this OECD data, teachers in the US are the 7th best paid in the world. It is true that in some countries housing is part of a teacher's compensation. I don't know whether benefits such as these were factored into the comparison.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/teacher-salaries-by-country-2017-5


    US teachers working abroad can do quite well in the Persian Gulf (no surprise) and China is reputed to pay quite well. Jobs in Western Europe are much harder for US citizens to come by unless they also have dual citizenship in an EU country or teach for the US DoD in a school for military kids.

    I am curious as to where you taught overseas, and the kinds of perks that you enjoyed. Usually, the well-paying jobs are well-paying for a reason, i.e. they are in places few Westerners would really want to visit, much less reside in.

    , @EdwardM

    US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.
     
    Spoken like a true US teacher!

    US teachers seem to be to be woefully overpaid. Apparently the total compensation package -- salary, work hours, time off, tenure, pension, lack of accountability -- has no problem attracting applicants. Show me that there exists a shortage of people willing to do the job for the compensation offered (broadly, not just in a small number of inner-city war zones) and I might accept the argument that they are underpaid.
  13. @snorlax

    We don't need no education
    We don't need no thought control
    No dark sarcasm in the classroom
    Teachers leave them kids alone
    Hey, teachers, leave them kids alone
    All in all it's just another sick in the Wu
    All in all you're just another bat in the wok
     

    Uh oh, they let him out again. Joe Biden holds forth on MSNBC:

    [MORE]

    Presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden conducted a gaffe-filled interview on MSNBC Monday, kicking off his media appearance by referring to the epicenter of the coronavirus by the wrong name.

    “I suggested we should have people in China at the outset of this event, when it all started, in Luhan Province,” Biden told the network, meaning to refer to the city of Wuhan, in Hubei Province, where the virus originated.

    “We had people in our administration, we had CDC people in other countries because we wanted to anticipate when in fact another virus would occur, when in fact a pandemic might occur as a consequence of a spreading virus in another country, to act quickly. The president withdrew those people,” Biden said.

    Word salad almost worthy of Sarah Palin.

    The problem, however, is that regardless of staffing cuts, the CDC began offering to send a team of experts to the Chinese province back in early January, according to the New York Times.

    As he did last week, Biden again gave the wrong date for a USA Today op-ed he penned on the virus, again claiming it was posted on Jan. 17 when it was actually Jan. 27.

    The ex-VP also mixed up his drugstores and government agencies, accidentally referring to CVS as CVC.

    When thanked by the MSNBC co-host for sitting down with her, Biden had another awkward remark, responding, “Well, thanks for giving me the time. So they won’t wonder where I am.”

    Good work, Joe! But do you wonder where you are?

    • LOL: bomag
    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    ...again claiming it was posted on Jan. 17 when it was actually Jan. 27.
     
    Perhaps he was thinking of Ben Franklin's birthday.
  14. Lot says:

    Bad news of the day: I just read a 2012 study about SARS vaccines. Several candidates were tested on mice and monkeys, and they worked! Viruses at undetectable levels 2 days after infection on immunized animals.

    The bad news: the animals all had major autoimmune damage to their lungs.

    I’ve got a growing sense of dread the shut-down-inflicted depression that has already started not only fails to control CV, but we get another round next winter.

    I won’t say this is likely yet, but the optimistic case rests on (1) our ability to do ChiCom level shutdowns (2) the honesty of the ChiComs about their shutdown’s effectiveness (3) optimism about a lack of second and third infection waves (4) optimism about medical advances.

    On the last point: (1) No HIV vaccine despite a jillion dollars and 40 years of research (2) flu vaccines often don’t work (3) there are no effective vaccines for any type of coronavirus.

    • Agree: Kronos, Alice
    • Replies: @Bragadocious
    And the wet markets are back & running all over China. This problem will never go away. It will simply mutate into something new and exciting each year. But according to the smart set we should be grateful, because while China might make us sick, they will also help us heal.
    , @Hamilton was right
    The lack of a common-cold coronavirus vaccine doesn’t bother me, because there’s no market for such an animal. It doesn’t exist because it doesn’t make economic sense to invest a few billion to create an effective one and deal with FDA mishegas for approval, not because it’s impossible to do.
    , @Kronos
    Great interview that covers many of those points.

    https://youtu.be/J6VEYzwSdZU
  15. Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?

    Steve, you’ve got a funny definition “natural.”

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids’ social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver’s license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond “education” and will permanently alter life in America.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond “education” and will permanently alter life in America.
     
    Worst case unemployment projections are 47 to 67 million.

    How many careers, dreams, and futures have simply vanished in our new reality?
    , @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    Couldn’t possibly agree more aside from YOURE UNDERstating it. College is closed, too.
    Fewer marriages, fewer amazing first kisses, fewer paid internships that lead to rewarding multi year careers, fewer opportunities TO PAY OFF STUDENT LOANS, fewer rock concerts (played in and spectated). Life for the under-25 cohort got vaporized.
    Further, the non-college track got #cancelled, too. The Army and the Marines have cancelled basic training and ait, which means 19 year olds don’t get their foot on the first step of the economic ladder. IBEW is not running apprenticeships, which means sons don’t follow fathers into the trades. This is catastrophic
    , @MBlanc46
    Yeah, ID, but they get all those wonderful Chinese-made electronic gizmos. And just about everything else that they use in their lives. Total disruption is a small price to pay.
    , @Lot
    “ Steve, you’ve got a funny definition “natural.”“

    He used the term natural experiment in its correct and most common meaning.
    , @The Germ Theory of Disease
    Doesn't matter, White schoolchildren for several age cohorts now have already had all of that stolen from them -- robbed of that, and much, much more, by enforced diversity. Racist, monstrous, soul-destroying diversity. No White child growing up today knows at all what it's like to live in his own country, among his own people, at ease in his own culture which was created by his ancestors for him and not for people 5,000 miles away who showed up last week.

    No White schoolchild today knows what it's like to just live a normal casual life, day to day, comfortable in his own skin, without being assaulted by poisonous nonsense every waking minute, and on top of that, the humiliation of being forced constantly to repeat and affirm the poisonous lie that it's better this way. I wonder what it's done to today's White children on the subconscious level: whether they somehow suspect that something is deeply, desperately wrong which they can't articulate, or whether the poison has taken such total hold that they're fine with the Soma.

    America has been stolen from White children wholesale, and handed on a platter to people who have nothing to do with this place.

    If you see a Fellow American today, be sure to thank them for their service.
    , @EdwardM
    Agree, and this is the cost side of the equation that our authoritarian-wannabe overlords in government and the media ignore with their overreaction to this. (Or maybe they see this as a benefit -- it all brings us closer to serfdom.)

    I think we will see grim statistics on bankruptcy, crime, abuse, and suicide in the months and years ahead.
  16. Everything Andrew Yang said would happen is happening. By means of a deadly pandemic instead of automation. Tens of millions of people are effectively unemployed and unemployable. Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.

    • Disagree: Je Suis Omar Mateen
    • Replies: @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    100%, and it’s worse than Yang forecasted even.
    A good friend of mine owns a CrossFit Gym. Even assuming no economic disruption whatsoever, he still thinks he’ll fold. Many, many more people than before are now focusing on infection control than before (to be honest, who really cared before?) But post-covid, there will be fewer gyms, concerts, Burning Man’s, etc. if 10% of people get more squeamish about infection control, that’s a 10% drop in attendance and that’s 10% less revenue in venues with sub 10% profit margins. That is death.
    Dance classes, flower arranging classes, all dead
    , @Je Suis Omar Mateen
    "Everything Andrew Yang said would happen is happening. By means of a deadly pandemic instead of automation."

    Wrong. By means of malicious government decrees instead of automation.
    , @danand

    “Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.”
     
    Kyle, this restaurant is just not going to pay, probably not too much of a reason to pay; at least from a cutthroat, cold eyed, strictly business perspective. You would have to think many/most of the malls they inhabit may be shuttering: so the Cheesecake Factory may not have that much more to loose?

    “In a letter to landlords, Cheesecake Factory announced it will not be paying rent for any of its 294 restaurant locations in the month of April.”
     
    https://flic.kr/p/2iKNzhz

    https://www.insider.com/the-cheesecake-factory-2020-rent-strike-2020-3
  17. While admitting he had no answers, Rush was doing some musing today on why California’s apparent WuFlu numbers are not nearly as bad as we’d all expected by now, or as bad as NYC’s.

    • Replies: @Redneck farmer
    California's population is more spread out.
  18. OK, OK, while you were getting into the details of the masks, Big-Brother rectal thermometers, R0 coefficients, and such, Peak Stupidity has been all over this thing about the schools. Yes, of course, we have the Alice Cooper song and Pink Floyd’s (“… collect call from Mr. Floyd to Mrs. Floyd…”)

    See “School’s out For Ever!” and “Arts & Crafts”, along with a post from before the Kung Flu’s debut in America, called “Hey, Ed-Schools, leave them teachers alone!”.

    I think this is one BIG silver lining in all of this infotainment panic-fest. The parents will really get used to the kids being around and also note how short a time it takes to really do whatever learning was going on. Some of the MILFs at our elementary school are very active (in normal times) organizing this and that, and I think they could easily run a small actually-productive school, if they knew it were politically possible.

    The teachers ought to be excreting bricks right now.

    • Replies: @slumber_j
    We're running that micro-sociology experiment here in Connecticut with a 7th and a 9th grader home all day and interacting virtually with their far-flung classmates and teachers. I'm about to see how awesome home-schooling is--good and hard, and whether I like it or not.
  19. @Buffalo Joe
    Part of the problem with reopening the schools is that it would extend past the normal school year. Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days. Don't believe me? You can go on line and see that this was proposed in Chicago and the teachers response. Never have the audacity to ask teachers to do more than the hardlines of a contract.

    Just about everyone is going to see one-third of their local public school year wiped out, aside from some half-hearted “distance learning.” I’ve beat this drum already, but what are homeowners supposed to think about the thousands in school taxes they just paid and are going to be asked to pay once again in the fall? I understand that some costs are fixed — especially those pensions — but still …

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Known Fact, Buffalo's Public School Systems' budget topped ONE BILLION dollars this year. The City of Buffalo contributes less than 8% , Erie County and NYS kick in the rest. Less than 70% graduation rate and 35% of HS students miss 37 days or more and teachers that average more than 18 days absent. My cousin's wife retired on full pension last year at age 55, with full benefits and 75% of her last year's salary of $84.000...as an Art teacher. She and my cousin, also a retired Buffalo teacher, now earn $75 per hour teaching part time in the system...and every conversation starts with how poorly paid teachers are. Gag worthy. Actually worthy of a RICO investigation.
  20. @Intelligent Dasein

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    Steve, you've got a funny definition "natural."

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids' social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver's license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond "education" and will permanently alter life in America.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond “education” and will permanently alter life in America.

    Worst case unemployment projections are 47 to 67 million.

    How many careers, dreams, and futures have simply vanished in our new reality?

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Is it more than those already eliminated by Woke Corporate, Affirmative Action, and the war on boys? Probably not. Those policies deliberately target the innovator and the striver, which are minority groups among non-innovators and gib-recipients.
  21. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    Shitting bricks, indeed.

  22. @Intelligent Dasein

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    Steve, you've got a funny definition "natural."

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids' social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver's license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond "education" and will permanently alter life in America.

    Couldn’t possibly agree more aside from YOURE UNDERstating it. College is closed, too.
    Fewer marriages, fewer amazing first kisses, fewer paid internships that lead to rewarding multi year careers, fewer opportunities TO PAY OFF STUDENT LOANS, fewer rock concerts (played in and spectated). Life for the under-25 cohort got vaporized.
    Further, the non-college track got #cancelled, too. The Army and the Marines have cancelled basic training and ait, which means 19 year olds don’t get their foot on the first step of the economic ladder. IBEW is not running apprenticeships, which means sons don’t follow fathers into the trades. This is catastrophic

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    This is catastrophic
     
    It absolutely is.

    Almost overnight, young people's futures have been liquidated in an attempt to preserve a few hundred thousand high risk individuals.

    Many of those individuals have already had the chance and the privilege to live their best lives. They're not going to discover the secret of cold fusion at 95 years old in their assisted living home.

    This is sad, but not tragic:

    Texas’ first COVID-19 death was 97-year-old World War II veteran

    https://www.fox26houston.com/news/texas-first-covid-19-death-was-97-year-old-world-war-ii-veteran

    I already know I'm not blessed enough to make it to 97.

    Then again I wish I was 1% as tough as this guy:

    WW2 veteran, 98, beats coronavirus – becoming oldest Brit to survive disease

    https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/ww2-veteran-98-beats-coronavirus-21752377

    Or this guy:

    95-Year-Old Veteran Recovers From Coronavirus: ‘I Survived the Foxholes of Guam, I Can Get Through This Bullsh*t’

    https://www.complex.com/life/2020/03/95-year-old-veteran-recovers-from-coronavirus-survived-bullshit

    , @Alice
    this cannot be stated strongly enough.

    Our current "policy" has no way to open anything ever again. How will there be schools in the fall? How will there be colleges with dorms?

    there are no birthday parties. There are no graduations. No plays, movies, orchestras, baseball games. there are no events where people meet, date, fall in love.

    Every single bishop in the US has closed mass, and most of them have also stopped weddings, baptisms, confirmations, and even funerals.

    How will young people meet? working the amazon warehouse?

    there is no reason for my kids to do anything because there are no jobs they will jave even thr DMV is closed and you cant get a driver's license to be a trucker.
    , @Daniel Chieh
    Indeed: the greatest principle of the alt right is compulsory schooling in government dogma. With it, all civilization would end.
  23. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    Cher, The first thing US teachers talk about is their pay. Overseas you got the same pay and better perks? Then why return for less. We have PE teachers in my district making $100K for 184 days of work. And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize. And if you tell me you work ten hour days that is still a 1,840 hour year. Factory work at 40 hours and 50 weeks is 2000 hours. Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    "And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize."

    That was obliterated with the Trump tax cuts.

    "Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education."

    In some places.

  24. @Lot
    Bad news of the day: I just read a 2012 study about SARS vaccines. Several candidates were tested on mice and monkeys, and they worked! Viruses at undetectable levels 2 days after infection on immunized animals.

    The bad news: the animals all had major autoimmune damage to their lungs.

    I’ve got a growing sense of dread the shut-down-inflicted depression that has already started not only fails to control CV, but we get another round next winter.

    I won’t say this is likely yet, but the optimistic case rests on (1) our ability to do ChiCom level shutdowns (2) the honesty of the ChiComs about their shutdown’s effectiveness (3) optimism about a lack of second and third infection waves (4) optimism about medical advances.

    On the last point: (1) No HIV vaccine despite a jillion dollars and 40 years of research (2) flu vaccines often don’t work (3) there are no effective vaccines for any type of coronavirus.

    And the wet markets are back & running all over China. This problem will never go away. It will simply mutate into something new and exciting each year. But according to the smart set we should be grateful, because while China might make us sick, they will also help us heal.

    • Replies: @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    Wet markets are misunderstood as Chinese Gastronomic Barbarism, but they’re actually a pretty reasonable, rational response to an extraordinarily low trust society.
    Infant formula (INFANT FORMULA!) containing the poison Melomin was the tipping point for many Chinese. The Big People has grown such avarice they’d literally poison babies to make a buck (and not even a million bucks, proverbial chump change).
    If you are a Common Chinese, you (rightly!) feel you cannot trust any food that’s not immediately processed before your very eyes.
    Covid is effectively a failure of Chinese food safety laws, not of public medicine
  25. @Kyle
    Everything Andrew Yang said would happen is happening. By means of a deadly pandemic instead of automation. Tens of millions of people are effectively unemployed and unemployable. Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.

    100%, and it’s worse than Yang forecasted even.
    A good friend of mine owns a CrossFit Gym. Even assuming no economic disruption whatsoever, he still thinks he’ll fold. Many, many more people than before are now focusing on infection control than before (to be honest, who really cared before?) But post-covid, there will be fewer gyms, concerts, Burning Man’s, etc. if 10% of people get more squeamish about infection control, that’s a 10% drop in attendance and that’s 10% less revenue in venues with sub 10% profit margins. That is death.
    Dance classes, flower arranging classes, all dead

  26. @Thomm
    Good. Do away with the whole corrupt public school system entirely. Online education is better and vastly more cost-efficient anyway.

    Thomm, a local private high school for girls had already subscribed to a video program. The girls log on and they show up like a “patch work” quilt on the teacher’s console. They must log in on time and in uniform, regular curriculum and subject matter. In private schools you get what you pay for, actually you demand it.

    • Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
    The software was likely Zoom, whose business has absolutely exploded in the past couple of months. I use it to run a church group. It's actually very good; remarkably easy and intuitive to set up meetings, little to no time lag switching from speaker to speaker, very stable in general.

    The biggest problem is sound, which is in most cases likely to be due to users' personal hardware setups. Some older PCs and phones have lousy mics, so getting a clear, stable, feedback-free sound signal can be a problem. Some people also have nice new PCs that give you the option to set your mic to optimize sound pickup from one person sitting in front of the machine, or for a room full of people. If you get that setting wrong it can cause problems also. But these are not insurmountable obstacles in the greater scheme of things.

    There is a lot of scope for expansion in online learning being blended into F2F courses. See the following article from the HBR, for example:

    What the Shift to Virtual Learning Could Mean for the Future of Higher Ed

    Money quote:

    By freeing resources from courses that can be commoditized, colleges would have more resources to commit to research-based teaching, personalized problem solving, and mentorship. The students would also have more resources at their disposal, too, because they wouldn’t have to reside and devote four full years at campuses. They would take commoditized courses online at their convenience and at much cheaper cost. They can use precious time they spend on campus for electives, group assignments, faculty office hours, interactions, and career guidance, something that cannot be done remotely. In addition, campuses can facilitate social networking, field-based projects, and global learning expeditions — that require F2F engagements. This is a hybrid model of education that has the potential to make college education more affordable for everybody.
     
  27. Why would school teachers, or anyone else for that matter, work if they have an easy excuse not to?

    • Replies: @Peterike
    “Why would school teachers, or anyone else for that matter, work if they have an easy excuse not to?”

    Conscientiousness.
  28. Kids don’t get the fever,
    So school’s out for boomers!

    I wish CoronaHoax occurred in my school days. Americans weren’t effete bedwetters in the 1980s. GenX kids rode around untethered in the back of pickups, rode bikes without helmets, played outside unsupervised, walked home from school unescorted.

    But in vicarious appreciation for today’s lucky chillens:
    We ❤ you CoronaHoax!

    • Replies: @Kronos

    I wish CoronaHoax occurred in my school days. Americans weren’t effete bedwetters in the 1980s.
     
    We Millennials were taught by the best!

    https://youtu.be/jsGWrZUn2aY

    Keep in mind a few Gen Xers couldn’t handle the whole sex, drugs, and rock in roll thing. That subgroup led to the incorporation of so much b.s. courses in middle school covering guns (not the fun training courses) and anorexia. This led to a massive industry of scaring late boomer moms on this week’s new street drug and demanding awareness in schools. My mandatory health class spent a total of 2 hours watching a Lifetime special on anorexia, time I’ll never get back.


    https://youtu.be/ct2DVRpqCW4
  29. >no work
    >no money
    >depend on government for food
    >government just gave itself the power to make people want jobs as gulag cops
    >because cops earn a pittance, which is way more than anybody else makes
    Maybe there will be enormous death (or the lack thereof) and that will “justify” destroying life. Maybe it will blow over and Republicans, in a rare Lindsay Graham Finding his Balls moment, will batter the Democrats with this.
    But all of this, accidental or deliberate, just happens to be what Alex Jones was warning people about years ago.

    • Replies: @petit bourgeois

    >because cops earn a pittance
     
    That's not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn't retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.

    Just go to https://transparentcalifornia.com/ and look at the salaries. Those jack-booted thugs (by way of their corrupt unions) are compensated more than your average college graduate.

    Reminds me of 2003 when the UFCW went on strike. Is it reasonable for a grocery clerk to make $30 an hour? Methinks not.
  30. @James Speaks
    He played golf.

    • Replies: @Lurker
    Alice is great.

    This makes me laugh:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvrzrpNFR1g
  31. @MEH 0910
    https://i.imgflip.com/189hqk.jpg

    When is “Hey, Hey, Hey, It’s Fat Albert” going to be released on DVD? One of Bill Cosby’s sexual assault victims should sue him for the home video rights so we can all see it again.

  32. @The Wild Geese Howard

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond “education” and will permanently alter life in America.
     
    Worst case unemployment projections are 47 to 67 million.

    How many careers, dreams, and futures have simply vanished in our new reality?

    Is it more than those already eliminated by Woke Corporate, Affirmative Action, and the war on boys? Probably not. Those policies deliberately target the innovator and the striver, which are minority groups among non-innovators and gib-recipients.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    Is it more than those already eliminated by Woke Corporate, Affirmative Action, and the war on boys? Probably not.
     
    I understand the point you are making, but I can't agree with it.

    The shock to the system that has been created is similar to how a tsunami forms.

    Currently, we are in the phase where the water has been drawn back from the beach, i.e., "It's just a long vacation/extended spring break, bruh!"

    We are now just sitting here waiting for the 500 ft wall of water to hit us.
  33. @Known Fact
    Just about everyone is going to see one-third of their local public school year wiped out, aside from some half-hearted "distance learning." I've beat this drum already, but what are homeowners supposed to think about the thousands in school taxes they just paid and are going to be asked to pay once again in the fall? I understand that some costs are fixed -- especially those pensions -- but still ...

    Known Fact, Buffalo’s Public School Systems’ budget topped ONE BILLION dollars this year. The City of Buffalo contributes less than 8% , Erie County and NYS kick in the rest. Less than 70% graduation rate and 35% of HS students miss 37 days or more and teachers that average more than 18 days absent. My cousin’s wife retired on full pension last year at age 55, with full benefits and 75% of her last year’s salary of $84.000…as an Art teacher. She and my cousin, also a retired Buffalo teacher, now earn $75 per hour teaching part time in the system…and every conversation starts with how poorly paid teachers are. Gag worthy. Actually worthy of a RICO investigation.

    • Replies: @Carol
    But just think, they have to spend all day with kids, 40% of whom do no work and don't give af. And then put up with parents if they dare flunk little Alphonse. If admin will even allow it.
  34. Some parents will discover that home-schooling is not as nonachievable as had hitherto been thought. In retrospect, they will belatedly realize that it permits an alternative to Big Brother Education, especially when they discover that many off-the-shelf home-schooling programs are available.

    This realization will probably be one of the few, if any, good results of the pandemic.

  35. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    “However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.”

    If you paid any attention to reality, you’d know kiddles are largely immune to corona-chan. One million dead? You wish.

  36. @Buffalo Joe
    Cher, The first thing US teachers talk about is their pay. Overseas you got the same pay and better perks? Then why return for less. We have PE teachers in my district making $100K for 184 days of work. And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize. And if you tell me you work ten hour days that is still a 1,840 hour year. Factory work at 40 hours and 50 weeks is 2000 hours. Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education.

    “And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize.”

    That was obliterated with the Trump tax cuts.

    “Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education.”

    In some places.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Corvi, you can still take a deduction, I just looked it up and I will stand by my comments.
    , @Bel Riose
    1. According to who/whom?

    2. Sources?

    3. And what are YOU going to do about it?
  37. @Kyle
    Everything Andrew Yang said would happen is happening. By means of a deadly pandemic instead of automation. Tens of millions of people are effectively unemployed and unemployable. Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.

    “Everything Andrew Yang said would happen is happening. By means of a deadly pandemic instead of automation.”

    Wrong. By means of malicious government decrees instead of automation.

  38. @Buffalo Joe
    Known Fact, Buffalo's Public School Systems' budget topped ONE BILLION dollars this year. The City of Buffalo contributes less than 8% , Erie County and NYS kick in the rest. Less than 70% graduation rate and 35% of HS students miss 37 days or more and teachers that average more than 18 days absent. My cousin's wife retired on full pension last year at age 55, with full benefits and 75% of her last year's salary of $84.000...as an Art teacher. She and my cousin, also a retired Buffalo teacher, now earn $75 per hour teaching part time in the system...and every conversation starts with how poorly paid teachers are. Gag worthy. Actually worthy of a RICO investigation.

    But just think, they have to spend all day with kids, 40% of whom do no work and don’t give af. And then put up with parents if they dare flunk little Alphonse. If admin will even allow it.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Carol, thank you for the response, but you chose to teach in the US. No forced labor yet.
  39. Here is another spring breaker incident that indicates our ability to test and track is far, far behind how quickly this virus is able to spread:

    28 Texas spring breakers who just returned from Cabo have tested positive for the coronavirus

    https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-spring-breakers-cabo-texas-test-postive-2020-3

    The spring break coronavirus saga continues.

    Texas officials in Austin and Travis County have confirmed that 28 young spring breakers returning to the area from Cabo San Lucas, Mexico, have tested positive for the coronavirus, reported Tony Plohetski of local station KVUE-TV in a string of Tweets.

    And this is just one group of spring breakers from one city/university in Texas. How many people did they come in contact with during their trip? How many other people did they infect in Cabo and where did all those folks jet off to?

    Unfortunately, we will probably never know.

    Yes, the young lady in the feature photo is a total butterface.

    • Replies: @Ron Mexico
    "Yes, the young lady in the feature photo is a total butterface." Turn off the lights, it's all good.
  40. So, I have a plan. If anyone gets within five feet of me, I’m going to beat and rob them. That way, if I get arrested for improper social distancing, they’ll have to let me back out right away.

    • LOL: Redneck farmer
  41. @J.Ross
    Is it more than those already eliminated by Woke Corporate, Affirmative Action, and the war on boys? Probably not. Those policies deliberately target the innovator and the striver, which are minority groups among non-innovators and gib-recipients.

    Is it more than those already eliminated by Woke Corporate, Affirmative Action, and the war on boys? Probably not.

    I understand the point you are making, but I can’t agree with it.

    The shock to the system that has been created is similar to how a tsunami forms.

    Currently, we are in the phase where the water has been drawn back from the beach, i.e., “It’s just a long vacation/extended spring break, bruh!”

    We are now just sitting here waiting for the 500 ft wall of water to hit us.

    • Agree: danand
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    not to be Randy but it really won't hit us, it'll hit that fraction of us who hold up the Earth, and then later we'll feel it.
  42. @Bragadocious
    And the wet markets are back & running all over China. This problem will never go away. It will simply mutate into something new and exciting each year. But according to the smart set we should be grateful, because while China might make us sick, they will also help us heal.

    Wet markets are misunderstood as Chinese Gastronomic Barbarism, but they’re actually a pretty reasonable, rational response to an extraordinarily low trust society.
    Infant formula (INFANT FORMULA!) containing the poison Melomin was the tipping point for many Chinese. The Big People has grown such avarice they’d literally poison babies to make a buck (and not even a million bucks, proverbial chump change).
    If you are a Common Chinese, you (rightly!) feel you cannot trust any food that’s not immediately processed before your very eyes.
    Covid is effectively a failure of Chinese food safety laws, not of public medicine

    • Replies: @petit bourgeois
    I dated a Catholic girl from Hong Kong in the oughts for seven years in San Francisco. They (Han Chinese) are hard wired to eat anything that moves.

    It's not an issue of trust. It's an issue of 3,000 years or more of eating anything that moves.
  43. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    …US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Woefully undertaught, too, from what I understand.

  44. Does this mean the death of the fine Western tradition of the Socratic method?

    The threat of a surly professor calling you out in class was always a great incentive to study to avoid the embarrassment of being stupid.

    But in California, the functional literacy rate is probably 50% or less, based on previous studies. High school graduation rates are also abysmally low. The community colleges and Cal State University systems are full of mestizos taking remedial classes in math and English. Whatever the teachers were doing was probably ineffective anyway. You can’t fix stupidity.

  45. @Mr McKenna
    Uh oh, they let him out again. Joe Biden holds forth on MSNBC:


    Presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden conducted a gaffe-filled interview on MSNBC Monday, kicking off his media appearance by referring to the epicenter of the coronavirus by the wrong name.

    “I suggested we should have people in China at the outset of this event, when it all started, in Luhan Province,” Biden told the network, meaning to refer to the city of Wuhan, in Hubei Province, where the virus originated.

    “We had people in our administration, we had CDC people in other countries because we wanted to anticipate when in fact another virus would occur, when in fact a pandemic might occur as a consequence of a spreading virus in another country, to act quickly. The president withdrew those people,” Biden said.
     
    Word salad almost worthy of Sarah Palin.


    The problem, however, is that regardless of staffing cuts, the CDC began offering to send a team of experts to the Chinese province back in early January, according to the New York Times.

    As he did last week, Biden again gave the wrong date for a USA Today op-ed he penned on the virus, again claiming it was posted on Jan. 17 when it was actually Jan. 27.

    The ex-VP also mixed up his drugstores and government agencies, accidentally referring to CVS as CVC.

    When thanked by the MSNBC co-host for sitting down with her, Biden had another awkward remark, responding, “Well, thanks for giving me the time. So they won’t wonder where I am.”
     
    Good work, Joe! But do you wonder where you are?

    …again claiming it was posted on Jan. 17 when it was actually Jan. 27.

    Perhaps he was thinking of Ben Franklin’s birthday.

    • Replies: @danand

    “Perhaps he was thinking of Ben Franklin’s birthday.”
     
    Reg Cæsar, nice bit of wit there, interjection of Ben Franklin into a discussion on schooling:

    “Josiah Franklin wanted Ben to attend school with the clergy but only had enough money to send him to school for two years. He attended Boston Latin School but did not graduate; he continued his education through voracious reading. Although "his parents talked of the church as a career" for Franklin, his schooling ended when he was ten.”

    “Abraham Lincoln was primarily self-educated, with intermittent formal schooling from travelling teachers of less than 12 months aggregate; he became an avid reader and retained a lifelong interest in learning. Family, neighbors, and schoolmates recalled that his reading included the King James Bible, Aesop's Fables, John Bunyan's The Pilgrim's Progress, Daniel Defoe's Robinson Crusoe, Mason Locke Weems's The Life of Washington, and The Autobiography of Benjamin Franklin.”
     
    Maybe the fact that Benjamin received more formal education than Abraham, is the reason Franklin got the $100 bill, and Lincoln the penny?
  46. @vhrm

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    I'm sure plenty will be written about how this shutdown's disparate impact on NAM students is explanatory of the racial performance gap of anyone now alive, as well as their children. That research will this be used to justify spending and Affirmative Action into the 2070s.

    Tangentially related, last week's Freakonomics Radio had a segment musing about whether this social distancing will drive permanent changes in remote working, trade shows and college instruction. Nothing concrete.

    (https://freakonomics.com/podcast/covid-19-effects/
    There's a transcript there too. last segment)

    Working from home on the computer has been The Next New Thing for well over a decade. I just don’t see it catching on as a permanent thing.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    Are you a boomer?

    I work in a high compensation field where WFH is the norm. Because boomers cant do my job and we demanded it.
  47. @Lot
    Bad news of the day: I just read a 2012 study about SARS vaccines. Several candidates were tested on mice and monkeys, and they worked! Viruses at undetectable levels 2 days after infection on immunized animals.

    The bad news: the animals all had major autoimmune damage to their lungs.

    I’ve got a growing sense of dread the shut-down-inflicted depression that has already started not only fails to control CV, but we get another round next winter.

    I won’t say this is likely yet, but the optimistic case rests on (1) our ability to do ChiCom level shutdowns (2) the honesty of the ChiComs about their shutdown’s effectiveness (3) optimism about a lack of second and third infection waves (4) optimism about medical advances.

    On the last point: (1) No HIV vaccine despite a jillion dollars and 40 years of research (2) flu vaccines often don’t work (3) there are no effective vaccines for any type of coronavirus.

    The lack of a common-cold coronavirus vaccine doesn’t bother me, because there’s no market for such an animal. It doesn’t exist because it doesn’t make economic sense to invest a few billion to create an effective one and deal with FDA mishegas for approval, not because it’s impossible to do.

  48. @J.Ross
    >no work
    >no money
    >depend on government for food
    >government just gave itself the power to make people want jobs as gulag cops
    >because cops earn a pittance, which is way more than anybody else makes
    Maybe there will be enormous death (or the lack thereof) and that will "justify" destroying life. Maybe it will blow over and Republicans, in a rare Lindsay Graham Finding his Balls moment, will batter the Democrats with this.
    But all of this, accidental or deliberate, just happens to be what Alex Jones was warning people about years ago.

    >because cops earn a pittance

    That’s not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn’t retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.

    Just go to https://transparentcalifornia.com/ and look at the salaries. Those jack-booted thugs (by way of their corrupt unions) are compensated more than your average college graduate.

    Reminds me of 2003 when the UFCW went on strike. Is it reasonable for a grocery clerk to make $30 an hour? Methinks not.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    This is legalism, I'm obviously not talking about cops as we knew them in the economy as we knew it.
    , @danand

    “That’s not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn’t retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.”
     
    Not for me to say/know what is fair, but officers from one of the early US SARS-CoV-2 hotspots typically do OK. I can’t remember the last time an officer was killed on the job in Santa Clara. I haven’t kept up in at least a decade or so; but it’s far from the worst place to be an officer. It’s definitely one department from which many of its retirees emerged multimillionaires.

    https://flic.kr/p/2iKZhep

    Jennifer Barry awarded Crisis Intervention Officer of the Year!

    https://flic.kr/p/2iL3mMp

    Santa Clara California officers who retire with 30 years of service receive 90% of last years base pay.
  49. @Intelligent Dasein

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    Steve, you've got a funny definition "natural."

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids' social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver's license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond "education" and will permanently alter life in America.

    Yeah, ID, but they get all those wonderful Chinese-made electronic gizmos. And just about everything else that they use in their lives. Total disruption is a small price to pay.

    • Replies: @Intelligent Dasein
    You're not really this flippant, are you? This is absolutely devastating the lives of millions of people and it's no laughing matter. I would not be surprised, and I would entirely approve, if everybody under 30 collectively stood up and told the government to "sit on it and rotate," so to speak. The young people are not going to forget this. The generational war has begun.
  50. @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    Couldn’t possibly agree more aside from YOURE UNDERstating it. College is closed, too.
    Fewer marriages, fewer amazing first kisses, fewer paid internships that lead to rewarding multi year careers, fewer opportunities TO PAY OFF STUDENT LOANS, fewer rock concerts (played in and spectated). Life for the under-25 cohort got vaporized.
    Further, the non-college track got #cancelled, too. The Army and the Marines have cancelled basic training and ait, which means 19 year olds don’t get their foot on the first step of the economic ladder. IBEW is not running apprenticeships, which means sons don’t follow fathers into the trades. This is catastrophic

    This is catastrophic

    It absolutely is.

    Almost overnight, young people’s futures have been liquidated in an attempt to preserve a few hundred thousand high risk individuals.

    Many of those individuals have already had the chance and the privilege to live their best lives. They’re not going to discover the secret of cold fusion at 95 years old in their assisted living home.

    This is sad, but not tragic:

    Texas’ first COVID-19 death was 97-year-old World War II veteran

    https://www.fox26houston.com/news/texas-first-covid-19-death-was-97-year-old-world-war-ii-veteran

    I already know I’m not blessed enough to make it to 97.

    Then again I wish I was 1% as tough as this guy:

    WW2 veteran, 98, beats coronavirus – becoming oldest Brit to survive disease

    https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/ww2-veteran-98-beats-coronavirus-21752377

    Or this guy:

    95-Year-Old Veteran Recovers From Coronavirus: ‘I Survived the Foxholes of Guam, I Can Get Through This Bullsh*t’

    https://www.complex.com/life/2020/03/95-year-old-veteran-recovers-from-coronavirus-survived-bullshit

    • Agree: AnonAnon
    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Almost overnight, young people’s futures have been liquidated in an attempt to preserve a few hundred thousand high risk individuals.

    Maybe perhaps therefore it could be appropriate for us -- at least those of us in Virginia, New York, Michigan, and California -- to look into the Cheltingham Wainscoting. At a certain point it objectively ceases to hurt.
  51. @songbird
    I hope that when this is all over, we get reams of data. State performance tests, national and international exams, IQ tests. College enrollment levels.

    BTW, I was thinking that the sports angle is pretty big. Sports is a subversion of natural tribalism into politically safe avenues.

    Well, I have a funny feeling that now, that American teens missed their prom, spring musical, their final art project , their final concert, their IAC tournament game, their graduation ceremony…not to mention NIAC championships for Uni kids & the actual, competitors, they are sooo gonna turn on the Democrats and their wussy-assed, scaredy cat parents. Death is not a reality for young people!!!!!

    The facts are out: NE & Eastern Seaboard govts did not buy crucial equipment and materiel in 2015 (during the insipid Obama regime) when evaluations for Pandemics were highlighted at meetings. Supposedly evil, China had been flirting with Bioweapons for years, as had Russia…Israel said they could counter-attack – important clue. All of them are asshole countries. I hate them all. al-Gadaffi called it years ago! And, he was tortured before he was actually, killed.

    Kids are gonna tell their parents to STFU (especially, brain-washed, stupid-assed democrat-voting parents) after being locked up, in the house, with them. They will vote for Trump – being positive and not laying blame is always the best attitude. Lamont and Cuomo are just imploding.

    My last college student is happy to be in a passel of puppies in a house where they have more or less been together for 2 years. They are brothers and will remember this time: And, they will all vote for Trump.

    Once, again, doomsday according to Democrat Governors/mayors is gonna bite them in the ass – But their too vain and pretentious to even, sense that. Trump can call Marshall Law at anytime.

    The really creepy governors & mayors of NY, NJ, CT, WA, Michigan+ can still be hunted down & they, and their children will be hunted down by very evil, prisoners and street-people, once food becomes an issue – once violence breaks out – rich people and walls are nuthin. Just so many guns, so many bullets – detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    Just so many guns, so many bullets – detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!
     
    So, you agree that there will be many versions of this scene after the dollar collapses:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3C_BubeBU8E
  52. Oh my revolution is taking place in “Big EDU”. lolgf

  53. fuck yeah!
    So, the Finnish movie:

  54. @petit bourgeois

    >because cops earn a pittance
     
    That's not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn't retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.

    Just go to https://transparentcalifornia.com/ and look at the salaries. Those jack-booted thugs (by way of their corrupt unions) are compensated more than your average college graduate.

    Reminds me of 2003 when the UFCW went on strike. Is it reasonable for a grocery clerk to make $30 an hour? Methinks not.

    This is legalism, I’m obviously not talking about cops as we knew them in the economy as we knew it.

  55. @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    Wet markets are misunderstood as Chinese Gastronomic Barbarism, but they’re actually a pretty reasonable, rational response to an extraordinarily low trust society.
    Infant formula (INFANT FORMULA!) containing the poison Melomin was the tipping point for many Chinese. The Big People has grown such avarice they’d literally poison babies to make a buck (and not even a million bucks, proverbial chump change).
    If you are a Common Chinese, you (rightly!) feel you cannot trust any food that’s not immediately processed before your very eyes.
    Covid is effectively a failure of Chinese food safety laws, not of public medicine

    I dated a Catholic girl from Hong Kong in the oughts for seven years in San Francisco. They (Han Chinese) are hard wired to eat anything that moves.

    It’s not an issue of trust. It’s an issue of 3,000 years or more of eating anything that moves.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    It’s not an issue of trust. It’s an issue of 3,000 years or more of eating anything that moves.
     
    The Japanese eat all manner of - to the western palate - disgusting sea creatures. Even the Japanese say that the Chinese will eat anything that slithers, creeps, or crawls. Any damned thing at all. The gustatory habits of the Chinese even disgust people who eat Sea Cucumber.
    , @Redneck farmer
    "The Land Of Famine" is a nickname for China.
  56. @The Wild Geese Howard

    Is it more than those already eliminated by Woke Corporate, Affirmative Action, and the war on boys? Probably not.
     
    I understand the point you are making, but I can't agree with it.

    The shock to the system that has been created is similar to how a tsunami forms.

    Currently, we are in the phase where the water has been drawn back from the beach, i.e., "It's just a long vacation/extended spring break, bruh!"

    We are now just sitting here waiting for the 500 ft wall of water to hit us.

    not to be Randy but it really won’t hit us, it’ll hit that fraction of us who hold up the Earth, and then later we’ll feel it.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    not to be Randy but it really won’t hit us, it’ll hit that fraction of us who hold up the Earth, and then later we’ll feel it.
     
    Nah.

    The feeling won't take nearly that long.
  57. @songbird
    I hope that when this is all over, we get reams of data. State performance tests, national and international exams, IQ tests. College enrollment levels.

    BTW, I was thinking that the sports angle is pretty big. Sports is a subversion of natural tribalism into politically safe avenues.

    Well, I have a funny feeling that now, that American teens missed their prom, spring musical, their final art project , their final concert, their IAC tournament game, their graduation ceremony…not to mention NIAC championships for Uni kids & the actual, competitors, they are sooo gonna turn on the Democrats and their wussy-assed, scaredy cat parents Death is not a reality for young people!!!!!

    The facts are out: NE & Eastern Seaboard govts did not buy crucial equipment and materiel in 2015 (during the insipid Obama regime) when evaluations for Pandemics were highlighted at meetings. Mercurious China had been flirting with Bioweapons for years, as had Russia…Israel said they could counteract. All them are asshole countries. I hate them all. al-Gadaffi called it years ago!

    Kids are gonna tell their parents to STFU (especially, brain-washed, stupid-assed democrat-voting parents) after being locked up, in the house, with them. They will vote for Trump – being positive and not laying blame is always the best attitude. Lamont and Cuomo are just imploding.

    My last college student is happy to be in a passel of puppies in a house where they have more or less been together for 2 years. They are brothers and will remember this time: And, they will all vote for Trump.

    Once, again, doomsday according to Democrat Governors/mayors is gonna bite them in the ass – But their too vain and pretentious to even, sense that. Trump can call Marshall Law at anytime.

    The really creepy governors & mayors of NY, NJ, CT, WA, Michigan+ can still be hunted down & they, and their children will be hunted down by very evil, prisoners and street-people, once food becomes an issue – once violence breaks out – rich people and walls are nuthin. Just so many guns, so many bullets – detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!

  58. Anonymous[751] • Disclaimer says:
    @prosa123
    Working from home on the computer has been The Next New Thing for well over a decade. I just don't see it catching on as a permanent thing.

    Are you a boomer?

    I work in a high compensation field where WFH is the norm. Because boomers cant do my job and we demanded it.

  59. @The Wild Geese Howard

    This is catastrophic
     
    It absolutely is.

    Almost overnight, young people's futures have been liquidated in an attempt to preserve a few hundred thousand high risk individuals.

    Many of those individuals have already had the chance and the privilege to live their best lives. They're not going to discover the secret of cold fusion at 95 years old in their assisted living home.

    This is sad, but not tragic:

    Texas’ first COVID-19 death was 97-year-old World War II veteran

    https://www.fox26houston.com/news/texas-first-covid-19-death-was-97-year-old-world-war-ii-veteran

    I already know I'm not blessed enough to make it to 97.

    Then again I wish I was 1% as tough as this guy:

    WW2 veteran, 98, beats coronavirus – becoming oldest Brit to survive disease

    https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/ww2-veteran-98-beats-coronavirus-21752377

    Or this guy:

    95-Year-Old Veteran Recovers From Coronavirus: ‘I Survived the Foxholes of Guam, I Can Get Through This Bullsh*t’

    https://www.complex.com/life/2020/03/95-year-old-veteran-recovers-from-coronavirus-survived-bullshit

    Almost overnight, young people’s futures have been liquidated in an attempt to preserve a few hundred thousand high risk individuals.

    Maybe perhaps therefore it could be appropriate for us — at least those of us in Virginia, New York, Michigan, and California — to look into the Cheltingham Wainscoting. At a certain point it objectively ceases to hurt.

    • Replies: @The Wild Geese Howard

    At a certain point it objectively ceases to hurt.
     
    Nothing wrong with checking out after that point.
  60. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    You want to see how much Chicago Public School teachers make?

    https://cps.edu/About_CPS/Financial_information/Pages/EmployeePositionFiles.aspx

    They list the teacher names, position, compensation, benefits, etc.

    HOLY F***ING COW!

    This is why taxes are outrageous in Chicago.

    Go ahead and just click on the latest date list for a spread sheet and compare that pay to the ordinary John and Jane Doe.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Joe, thank you. Facts make great arguments and there are 378K students in Chicago, not Cher's claim of millions.
  61. @Clifford brown
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8OzPt7JaDA

    Alice is great.

    This makes me laugh:

  62. @Buffalo Joe
    Thomm, a local private high school for girls had already subscribed to a video program. The girls log on and they show up like a "patch work" quilt on the teacher's console. They must log in on time and in uniform, regular curriculum and subject matter. In private schools you get what you pay for, actually you demand it.

    The software was likely Zoom, whose business has absolutely exploded in the past couple of months. I use it to run a church group. It’s actually very good; remarkably easy and intuitive to set up meetings, little to no time lag switching from speaker to speaker, very stable in general.

    The biggest problem is sound, which is in most cases likely to be due to users’ personal hardware setups. Some older PCs and phones have lousy mics, so getting a clear, stable, feedback-free sound signal can be a problem. Some people also have nice new PCs that give you the option to set your mic to optimize sound pickup from one person sitting in front of the machine, or for a room full of people. If you get that setting wrong it can cause problems also. But these are not insurmountable obstacles in the greater scheme of things.

    There is a lot of scope for expansion in online learning being blended into F2F courses. See the following article from the HBR, for example:

    What the Shift to Virtual Learning Could Mean for the Future of Higher Ed

    Money quote:

    By freeing resources from courses that can be commoditized, colleges would have more resources to commit to research-based teaching, personalized problem solving, and mentorship. The students would also have more resources at their disposal, too, because they wouldn’t have to reside and devote four full years at campuses. They would take commoditized courses online at their convenience and at much cheaper cost. They can use precious time they spend on campus for electives, group assignments, faculty office hours, interactions, and career guidance, something that cannot be done remotely. In addition, campuses can facilitate social networking, field-based projects, and global learning expeditions — that require F2F engagements. This is a hybrid model of education that has the potential to make college education more affordable for everybody.

    • Thanks: bomag
  63. @Lot
    Bad news of the day: I just read a 2012 study about SARS vaccines. Several candidates were tested on mice and monkeys, and they worked! Viruses at undetectable levels 2 days after infection on immunized animals.

    The bad news: the animals all had major autoimmune damage to their lungs.

    I’ve got a growing sense of dread the shut-down-inflicted depression that has already started not only fails to control CV, but we get another round next winter.

    I won’t say this is likely yet, but the optimistic case rests on (1) our ability to do ChiCom level shutdowns (2) the honesty of the ChiComs about their shutdown’s effectiveness (3) optimism about a lack of second and third infection waves (4) optimism about medical advances.

    On the last point: (1) No HIV vaccine despite a jillion dollars and 40 years of research (2) flu vaccines often don’t work (3) there are no effective vaccines for any type of coronavirus.

    Great interview that covers many of those points.

  64. Anon[315] • Disclaimer says:

    Interesting article. The author claims the coronavirus test kits are fundamentally flawed, and they’re giving positives to ANY coronavirus, even the common cold. He says there are no reliable tests that pick up Covid-19 itself.

    “The Mickey Mouse test kits being sent out to hospitals, at best, tell analysts you have some viral DNA in your cells. Which most of us do, most of the time. It may tell you the viral sequence is related to a specific type of virus – say the huge family of coronavirus. But that’s all. The idea these kits can isolate a specific virus like COVID-19 is nonsense.”

    “This is why you’re hearing that most people with COVID-19 are showing nothing more than cold/flu like symptoms. That’s because most Coronavirus strains are nothing more than cold/flu like symptoms. The few actual novel Coronavirus cases do have some worse respiratory responses, but still have a very promising recovery rate, especially for those without prior issues.”

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/manufactured-pandemic-testing-people-any-strain-coronavirus-not-specifically-covid-19/5707781

    • Replies: @vhrm
    That article strikes me as BS.

    This pdf describes the LabCorp COVID-19 RT-PCR Test
    (https://www.fda.gov/media/136151/download )

    The test matches three specific pieces of the Sars-cov-2 RNA and reports them independently.

    There's a table in there on cross-reactivity that tested it against ~30 other pathogens, including the other human coronaviruses and the test shows negative across the board except that the 3rd segment also matches , Sars-cov, the original SARS virus.

    There might be some problems with the tests but they're not as basic as this guy makes them sound.
  65. @Spud Boy
    Why would school teachers, or anyone else for that matter, work if they have an easy excuse not to?

    “Why would school teachers, or anyone else for that matter, work if they have an easy excuse not to?”

    Conscientiousness.

  66. @Corvinus
    "And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize."

    That was obliterated with the Trump tax cuts.

    "Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education."

    In some places.

    Corvi, you can still take a deduction, I just looked it up and I will stand by my comments.

    • Replies: @Hapalong Cassidy
    You can take a deduction, but only if your total itemized deductions are greater than the standard deduction, which is currently 24.4K for a married couple. I’m thinking most teachers can’t scrounge up enough in mortgage interest and state taxes to meet that threshold, where as before the Trump tax changes they could.
    , @Corvinus
    Let's clarify here.

    Before 2018, teachers were able to deduct expenses over and above the $250 limit – such as uniforms, union dues and transportation costs, to name a few. But the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act eliminated all miscellaneous deductions, including these unreimbursed employee expenses, until 2026 when the law expires.

    Under the new law, teachers can use the Educator Expense Deduction regardless of whether they take the standard deduction or itemize their tax deductions. A teacher can deduct a maximum of $250. Two married teachers filing a joint return can take a deduction of up to $250 apiece, for a maximum of $500.

    So it is true that a teacher can take a deduction, but it is capped. So we are both correct.
  67. @Carol
    But just think, they have to spend all day with kids, 40% of whom do no work and don't give af. And then put up with parents if they dare flunk little Alphonse. If admin will even allow it.

    Carol, thank you for the response, but you chose to teach in the US. No forced labor yet.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Thanks for all the great comments, Joe.

    For Carol, it probably can be a rough time, at least in the red rather than green schools as determined by schooldigger. However, many people go through much worse at plenty of other jobs at less pay. Have you thought about the many dangerous jobs that men do, where one mistake can get one maimed or killed? How about just nasty parts of jobs like crawling in the crawl space or attic among squirril-pooh-containing drooping Owens-Corning insulation installing replacing duct work?

    Would you say that type of job is easier or harder than getting chewed out by parents? Wait, you'd have to be there - but women aren't.
  68. @Buffalo Joe
    Part of the problem with reopening the schools is that it would extend past the normal school year. Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days. Don't believe me? You can go on line and see that this was proposed in Chicago and the teachers response. Never have the audacity to ask teachers to do more than the hardlines of a contract.

    Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days.

    Of course we would. Why wouldn’t we? I’m working at home, and my contract says I work 180 days per year.

    • Replies: @petit bourgeois
    I wish I could be a social parasite and work only 180 days per year. But then again, I'm a decent human being / American with a conscience and a work ethic.
    , @bomag

    ...my contract says I work 180 days per year.
     
    Nice attitude; another reminder of the animosity lurking between the public and private sectors.
    , @Buffalo Joe
    Scarlet, I just saw this. Almost all school districts started their lock downs by extending Spring Break. They then decided to start teaching online or in districts around here, have the kids pick up a work package and self school at home. So, somewhere in between teaching online, and the soft shut down, you had idle days. Oh, and you were paid for them.
    , @David
    Monday I called my boss to say that I could live on less for a while if doing so would help maintain the viability of his business. It's odd that I feel a greater (and more glad) sense of duty to my private sector employer than you to your public sector one.
  69. @Joe Stalin
    You want to see how much Chicago Public School teachers make?

    https://cps.edu/About_CPS/Financial_information/Pages/EmployeePositionFiles.aspx

    They list the teacher names, position, compensation, benefits, etc.

    HOLY F***ING COW!

    This is why taxes are outrageous in Chicago.

    Go ahead and just click on the latest date list for a spread sheet and compare that pay to the ordinary John and Jane Doe.

    Joe, thank you. Facts make great arguments and there are 378K students in Chicago, not Cher’s claim of millions.

  70. @MBlanc46
    Yeah, ID, but they get all those wonderful Chinese-made electronic gizmos. And just about everything else that they use in their lives. Total disruption is a small price to pay.

    You’re not really this flippant, are you? This is absolutely devastating the lives of millions of people and it’s no laughing matter. I would not be surprised, and I would entirely approve, if everybody under 30 collectively stood up and told the government to “sit on it and rotate,” so to speak. The young people are not going to forget this. The generational war has begun.

    • Replies: @Mr. Anon

    The generational war has begun.
     
    I think you might be right. Begun in earnest.

    "OK, Boomer" might just become "F**k Off and Die, Boomer".

    There might also be a real social re-alignment between, on the one hand those who work in the private sector who actually do productive work and have to turn a profit, and on the other hand those who are rentiers, retirees, corporate cubicle-drones who can work at home or on the Moon as easily as in the office, and government employees, all of whom never missed a check.

    A lot of people are not easily going to forget that they were thrown out of work or had their small businesses crushed.
    , @The Wild Geese Howard

    You’re not really this flippant, are you?
     
    He's being sarcastic.

    Quite unlike the sociopaths who have posted, "Small business is toast? LOL, who cares, we can just order everything from Amazon!"
  71. @Je Suis Omar Mateen
    Kids don't get the fever,
    So school's out for boomers!

    I wish CoronaHoax occurred in my school days. Americans weren't effete bedwetters in the 1980s. GenX kids rode around untethered in the back of pickups, rode bikes without helmets, played outside unsupervised, walked home from school unescorted.

    But in vicarious appreciation for today's lucky chillens:
    We ❤ you CoronaHoax!

    I wish CoronaHoax occurred in my school days. Americans weren’t effete bedwetters in the 1980s.

    We Millennials were taught by the best!

    Keep in mind a few Gen Xers couldn’t handle the whole sex, drugs, and rock in roll thing. That subgroup led to the incorporation of so much b.s. courses in middle school covering guns (not the fun training courses) and anorexia. This led to a massive industry of scaring late boomer moms on this week’s new street drug and demanding awareness in schools. My mandatory health class spent a total of 2 hours watching a Lifetime special on anorexia, time I’ll never get back.

    • Replies: @petit bourgeois
    Not true. I spent / wasted my youth on sex, drugs and rock and roll, and survived relatively unscathed. There were no such courses in my lifetime.

    Your characterization of my generation is entirely frivolous and arrogant millennial bullshit.
    , @The Wild Geese Howard
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaYYBwAt5d0
  72. @vhrm

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    I'm sure plenty will be written about how this shutdown's disparate impact on NAM students is explanatory of the racial performance gap of anyone now alive, as well as their children. That research will this be used to justify spending and Affirmative Action into the 2070s.

    Tangentially related, last week's Freakonomics Radio had a segment musing about whether this social distancing will drive permanent changes in remote working, trade shows and college instruction. Nothing concrete.

    (https://freakonomics.com/podcast/covid-19-effects/
    There's a transcript there too. last segment)

    What this topic needs is a report from Asian kids who are now completely parental supervised and have to work 13 hours a day on their schoolwork instead of 11.5.

  73. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of…

    Here they can do more than dream too — but most get caught eventually.

  74. @J.Ross
    not to be Randy but it really won't hit us, it'll hit that fraction of us who hold up the Earth, and then later we'll feel it.

    not to be Randy but it really won’t hit us, it’ll hit that fraction of us who hold up the Earth, and then later we’ll feel it.

    Nah.

    The feeling won’t take nearly that long.

  75. @ScarletNumber

    Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days.
     
    Of course we would. Why wouldn't we? I'm working at home, and my contract says I work 180 days per year.

    I wish I could be a social parasite and work only 180 days per year. But then again, I’m a decent human being / American with a conscience and a work ethic.

    • Troll: ScarletNumber
  76. @J.Ross
    Almost overnight, young people’s futures have been liquidated in an attempt to preserve a few hundred thousand high risk individuals.

    Maybe perhaps therefore it could be appropriate for us -- at least those of us in Virginia, New York, Michigan, and California -- to look into the Cheltingham Wainscoting. At a certain point it objectively ceases to hurt.

    At a certain point it objectively ceases to hurt.

    Nothing wrong with checking out after that point.

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    Checking out means not fighting, and there is something wrong with that.
  77. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    According to this OECD data, teachers in the US are the 7th best paid in the world. It is true that in some countries housing is part of a teacher’s compensation. I don’t know whether benefits such as these were factored into the comparison.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/teacher-salaries-by-country-2017-5

    US teachers working abroad can do quite well in the Persian Gulf (no surprise) and China is reputed to pay quite well. Jobs in Western Europe are much harder for US citizens to come by unless they also have dual citizenship in an EU country or teach for the US DoD in a school for military kids.

    I am curious as to where you taught overseas, and the kinds of perks that you enjoyed. Usually, the well-paying jobs are well-paying for a reason, i.e. they are in places few Westerners would really want to visit, much less reside in.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Black Sea, if we want to start an agita* inducing topic we can talk about Public Education in America. For those who want a stomach churning head start, Time Magazine published a series called "Teaching in America." Those words should bring it up or maybe, Time magazine's "Teaching in America." Personal stories of teachers who are "struggling" to survive on their paychecks. Best thing is to compare their stated pay to the median income in their location. My favorites: The single mother teacher who shares a bed with her only child, income $69,000 IIRC. And the teacher who sells plasma twice a week to pay her electric bill. Enjoy. *Agita is an Italian term to describe stomach upset or distress. ex."Liz Warren's pandering give me agita." Sometimes shortened to ahg.
  78. @Kronos

    I wish CoronaHoax occurred in my school days. Americans weren’t effete bedwetters in the 1980s.
     
    We Millennials were taught by the best!

    https://youtu.be/jsGWrZUn2aY

    Keep in mind a few Gen Xers couldn’t handle the whole sex, drugs, and rock in roll thing. That subgroup led to the incorporation of so much b.s. courses in middle school covering guns (not the fun training courses) and anorexia. This led to a massive industry of scaring late boomer moms on this week’s new street drug and demanding awareness in schools. My mandatory health class spent a total of 2 hours watching a Lifetime special on anorexia, time I’ll never get back.


    https://youtu.be/ct2DVRpqCW4

    Not true. I spent / wasted my youth on sex, drugs and rock and roll, and survived relatively unscathed. There were no such courses in my lifetime.

    Your characterization of my generation is entirely frivolous and arrogant millennial bullshit.

  79. @Intelligent Dasein

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    Steve, you've got a funny definition "natural."

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids' social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver's license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond "education" and will permanently alter life in America.

    “ Steve, you’ve got a funny definition “natural.”“

    He used the term natural experiment in its correct and most common meaning.

  80. Reopening schools in May was a bit like Trump’s Easter Miracle, on the one hand, you don’t want to preclude the possibility, because you never know, but on the other hand, you don’t have to read too many epidemiological projections to see that corona was unlikely be dormant or subdued or gone by May. In other words, I don’t think the school system ever seriously expected to reopen in May, but they didn’t want to announce all at once that — “Surprise, school year’s over!”

    My thinking about American education is largely this. Given the political and social realities of the society, it’s no worse than any other government enterprise, and is probably better than most. A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly. How do they know the other schools are so awful? Probably, they don’t.

    If as a society we could be more honest about differing expectations for different individual students, as well as for different cohorts, America would be in a position to improve its educational systems further, but that’s a big “if,” and in the meantime, a lot of effort will be expended in dragging as many kids as possible up to the C- minus level, with the more talented ones left to develop their talents in their own time, which come to think of it, probably offers some advantages as well.

    Anyway, as regards California schools, opening them back up in May, after some half-assed attempts at online learning, probably wouldn’t improve anything, and would just create another disruption in an already chaotic school term. Better to stick with the online stuff. The teachers should pick up some valuable skills for the future.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman

    A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly.
     
    Yes, Black Sea, but this time with their kids away from the school may bring that down a notch. I can see now how much time is wasted in the elementary school, even one that is a good one. The important thing there is simply that there are mostly GOOD KIDS there, so there aren't bad influences.

    The learning going on is a different story. From the time at the little conferences you get one impression, but we've got a different one now. My 2nd-grade boy was doing a little project to look up the state flower, bird, motto, dog (yes, there is one - that's one thing the FEDS still allow states to do), etc. It took only 5-10 minutes of "searching up" the info, but the rest of the project was 4 hours of cutting, gluing, and coloring.

    Don't get me wrong - he loves cutting, gluing, and coloring. However, that is time-wasting pre-school stuff. I told him that and asked "hey, is that what they've been doing, spending half the time on that stuff?" "No, it's about one quarter." See, we just got done working with fractions, adding/subtracting/multiplying/reducing, taking about 8 hours total over a week, after the school had been taking months with the concept - having the kids divide rectangles equally, and, of course, coloring them.
    , @donvonburg

    My thinking about American education is largely this. Given the political and social realities of the society, it’s no worse than any other government enterprise, and is probably better than most. A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly. How do they know the other schools are so awful? Probably, they don’t.
     
    Many suburban white areas in Flyover America actually have reasonably good public schools. They are not going to prepare kids like the really rigorous ones out East, because their families do not want them to work that hard. I didn't want my kids to work that hard. Asians make their kids grind and they get into schools above their natural ability and become mediocre practitioners.

    I came to the view early on that education is really important if, and only if, you are biologically way above average. Average people are going to do about average no matter what schooling they get. I have a daughter that is in that category-she went to public high school, went to the flagship state university for undergrad and is now at a fairly elite master's program. I have a son who is a little smarter than average and I encouraged him to go to vo-tech and get on with a utility, a railroad or with a big corporation. He went to work for a utility, got his bachelor's in management part time while working with the utility and will probably retire out management side with a fat pension. Most parents would have pushed him to get a four year degree immediately and he'd have wound up with a fat debt load and a liberal arts or business degree with little value. His mother is still mad at me, of course.
  81. There were no such courses in my lifetime.

    Now that’s pretty lucky. The courses themselves are a joke but potentially protect schools from potential lawsuits for not educating on the dangers of x, y, and z. People can make some decent money on the anti-whatever education circuit. Though I’ll always laugh if I tried putting a condom on a banana.

    Keep in mind I’m not dissing any generation or fun lifestyle. I’d be a latchkey kid any day compared to being watched by helicopter parents. Every generation is going to have low-IQ knuckleheads that made poor life decisions. The ones that go in front of a school auditorium and talked about how they performed certain sexual favors to obtain certain schedule 2 narcotic substances and that you shouldn’t do it.

    But those Gen X knuckleheads partially paved the way for the future bubble-rapping of the Millennials.

  82. @Intelligent Dasein
    You're not really this flippant, are you? This is absolutely devastating the lives of millions of people and it's no laughing matter. I would not be surprised, and I would entirely approve, if everybody under 30 collectively stood up and told the government to "sit on it and rotate," so to speak. The young people are not going to forget this. The generational war has begun.

    The generational war has begun.

    I think you might be right. Begun in earnest.

    “OK, Boomer” might just become “F**k Off and Die, Boomer”.

    There might also be a real social re-alignment between, on the one hand those who work in the private sector who actually do productive work and have to turn a profit, and on the other hand those who are rentiers, retirees, corporate cubicle-drones who can work at home or on the Moon as easily as in the office, and government employees, all of whom never missed a check.

    A lot of people are not easily going to forget that they were thrown out of work or had their small businesses crushed.

  83. @petit bourgeois
    I dated a Catholic girl from Hong Kong in the oughts for seven years in San Francisco. They (Han Chinese) are hard wired to eat anything that moves.

    It's not an issue of trust. It's an issue of 3,000 years or more of eating anything that moves.

    It’s not an issue of trust. It’s an issue of 3,000 years or more of eating anything that moves.

    The Japanese eat all manner of – to the western palate – disgusting sea creatures. Even the Japanese say that the Chinese will eat anything that slithers, creeps, or crawls. Any damned thing at all. The gustatory habits of the Chinese even disgust people who eat Sea Cucumber.

  84. @Lagertha
    Well, I have a funny feeling that now, that American teens missed their prom, spring musical, their final art project , their final concert, their IAC tournament game, their graduation ceremony...not to mention NIAC championships for Uni kids & the actual, competitors, they are sooo gonna turn on the Democrats and their wussy-assed, scaredy cat parents. Death is not a reality for young people!!!!!

    The facts are out: NE & Eastern Seaboard govts did not buy crucial equipment and materiel in 2015 (during the insipid Obama regime) when evaluations for Pandemics were highlighted at meetings. Supposedly evil, China had been flirting with Bioweapons for years, as had Russia...Israel said they could counter-attack - important clue. All of them are asshole countries. I hate them all. al-Gadaffi called it years ago! And, he was tortured before he was actually, killed.

    Kids are gonna tell their parents to STFU (especially, brain-washed, stupid-assed democrat-voting parents) after being locked up, in the house, with them. They will vote for Trump - being positive and not laying blame is always the best attitude. Lamont and Cuomo are just imploding.

    My last college student is happy to be in a passel of puppies in a house where they have more or less been together for 2 years. They are brothers and will remember this time: And, they will all vote for Trump. https://youtu.be/wZ1vn85iQRE


    Once, again, doomsday according to Democrat Governors/mayors is gonna bite them in the ass - But their too vain and pretentious to even, sense that. Trump can call Marshall Law at anytime.

    The really creepy governors & mayors of NY, NJ, CT, WA, Michigan+ can still be hunted down & they, and their children will be hunted down by very evil, prisoners and street-people, once food becomes an issue - once violence breaks out - rich people and walls are nuthin. Just so many guns, so many bullets - detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!

    Just so many guns, so many bullets – detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!

    So, you agree that there will be many versions of this scene after the dollar collapses:

    • Replies: @Lagertha
    much worse than that. People will get skinned alive. Read history: all this BS about transhumanism and transwhatthefuckevahism, blows up in the face of "progresso-soups." It is just a flow of anarchy - a dirty stream of anarchy - that is the reality of Progressives dreams: anarchy and violence. But, Democrats do not know how to create ANYTHING. They are failure before they fail.

    Get a gun, get many of them if you live in a sketchy state, or well, region. And, fuk off - I don't like people.

    Get guns and howitzers it you can.

  85. @Intelligent Dasein
    You're not really this flippant, are you? This is absolutely devastating the lives of millions of people and it's no laughing matter. I would not be surprised, and I would entirely approve, if everybody under 30 collectively stood up and told the government to "sit on it and rotate," so to speak. The young people are not going to forget this. The generational war has begun.

    You’re not really this flippant, are you?

    He’s being sarcastic.

    Quite unlike the sociopaths who have posted, “Small business is toast? LOL, who cares, we can just order everything from Amazon!”

  86. @Kronos

    I wish CoronaHoax occurred in my school days. Americans weren’t effete bedwetters in the 1980s.
     
    We Millennials were taught by the best!

    https://youtu.be/jsGWrZUn2aY

    Keep in mind a few Gen Xers couldn’t handle the whole sex, drugs, and rock in roll thing. That subgroup led to the incorporation of so much b.s. courses in middle school covering guns (not the fun training courses) and anorexia. This led to a massive industry of scaring late boomer moms on this week’s new street drug and demanding awareness in schools. My mandatory health class spent a total of 2 hours watching a Lifetime special on anorexia, time I’ll never get back.


    https://youtu.be/ct2DVRpqCW4

    • Agree: Kronos
    • Replies: @Kronos
    I’m still waiting for the PSA commercials against huffing your own fecal matter.

    Go to 11:45

    https://youtu.be/-OQ8Dn2oxUU
  87. @The Wild Geese Howard

    Just so many guns, so many bullets – detail is gonna go protect their families for f*ckes sake! Plus, body guards know they have been talked down to for years. So bring on Hunger Games!
     
    So, you agree that there will be many versions of this scene after the dollar collapses:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3C_BubeBU8E

    much worse than that. People will get skinned alive. Read history: all this BS about transhumanism and transwhatthefuckevahism, blows up in the face of “progresso-soups.” It is just a flow of anarchy – a dirty stream of anarchy – that is the reality of Progressives dreams: anarchy and violence. But, Democrats do not know how to create ANYTHING. They are failure before they fail.

    Get a gun, get many of them if you live in a sketchy state, or well, region. And, fuk off – I don’t like people.

    Get guns and howitzers it you can.

  88. @black sea
    Reopening schools in May was a bit like Trump's Easter Miracle, on the one hand, you don't want to preclude the possibility, because you never know, but on the other hand, you don't have to read too many epidemiological projections to see that corona was unlikely be dormant or subdued or gone by May. In other words, I don't think the school system ever seriously expected to reopen in May, but they didn't want to announce all at once that -- "Surprise, school year's over!"

    My thinking about American education is largely this. Given the political and social realities of the society, it's no worse than any other government enterprise, and is probably better than most. A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid's school, which they regard pretty highly. How do they know the other schools are so awful? Probably, they don't.

    If as a society we could be more honest about differing expectations for different individual students, as well as for different cohorts, America would be in a position to improve its educational systems further, but that's a big "if," and in the meantime, a lot of effort will be expended in dragging as many kids as possible up to the C- minus level, with the more talented ones left to develop their talents in their own time, which come to think of it, probably offers some advantages as well.

    Anyway, as regards California schools, opening them back up in May, after some half-assed attempts at online learning, probably wouldn't improve anything, and would just create another disruption in an already chaotic school term. Better to stick with the online stuff. The teachers should pick up some valuable skills for the future.

    A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly.

    Yes, Black Sea, but this time with their kids away from the school may bring that down a notch. I can see now how much time is wasted in the elementary school, even one that is a good one. The important thing there is simply that there are mostly GOOD KIDS there, so there aren’t bad influences.

    The learning going on is a different story. From the time at the little conferences you get one impression, but we’ve got a different one now. My 2nd-grade boy was doing a little project to look up the state flower, bird, motto, dog (yes, there is one – that’s one thing the FEDS still allow states to do), etc. It took only 5-10 minutes of “searching up” the info, but the rest of the project was 4 hours of cutting, gluing, and coloring.

    Don’t get me wrong – he loves cutting, gluing, and coloring. However, that is time-wasting pre-school stuff. I told him that and asked “hey, is that what they’ve been doing, spending half the time on that stuff?” “No, it’s about one quarter.” See, we just got done working with fractions, adding/subtracting/multiplying/reducing, taking about 8 hours total over a week, after the school had been taking months with the concept – having the kids divide rectangles equally, and, of course, coloring them.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Ach, do you have a "teacher's aide?" You have to have an aide, read yor contract.
  89. @Anon
    Interesting article. The author claims the coronavirus test kits are fundamentally flawed, and they're giving positives to ANY coronavirus, even the common cold. He says there are no reliable tests that pick up Covid-19 itself.

    "The Mickey Mouse test kits being sent out to hospitals, at best, tell analysts you have some viral DNA in your cells. Which most of us do, most of the time. It may tell you the viral sequence is related to a specific type of virus – say the huge family of coronavirus. But that’s all. The idea these kits can isolate a specific virus like COVID-19 is nonsense."

    "This is why you’re hearing that most people with COVID-19 are showing nothing more than cold/flu like symptoms. That’s because most Coronavirus strains are nothing more than cold/flu like symptoms. The few actual novel Coronavirus cases do have some worse respiratory responses, but still have a very promising recovery rate, especially for those without prior issues."

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/manufactured-pandemic-testing-people-any-strain-coronavirus-not-specifically-covid-19/5707781

    That article strikes me as BS.

    This pdf describes the LabCorp COVID-19 RT-PCR Test
    (https://www.fda.gov/media/136151/download )

    The test matches three specific pieces of the Sars-cov-2 RNA and reports them independently.

    There’s a table in there on cross-reactivity that tested it against ~30 other pathogens, including the other human coronaviruses and the test shows negative across the board except that the 3rd segment also matches , Sars-cov, the original SARS virus.

    There might be some problems with the tests but they’re not as basic as this guy makes them sound.

    • Thanks: FPD72
  90. @black sea
    Reopening schools in May was a bit like Trump's Easter Miracle, on the one hand, you don't want to preclude the possibility, because you never know, but on the other hand, you don't have to read too many epidemiological projections to see that corona was unlikely be dormant or subdued or gone by May. In other words, I don't think the school system ever seriously expected to reopen in May, but they didn't want to announce all at once that -- "Surprise, school year's over!"

    My thinking about American education is largely this. Given the political and social realities of the society, it's no worse than any other government enterprise, and is probably better than most. A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid's school, which they regard pretty highly. How do they know the other schools are so awful? Probably, they don't.

    If as a society we could be more honest about differing expectations for different individual students, as well as for different cohorts, America would be in a position to improve its educational systems further, but that's a big "if," and in the meantime, a lot of effort will be expended in dragging as many kids as possible up to the C- minus level, with the more talented ones left to develop their talents in their own time, which come to think of it, probably offers some advantages as well.

    Anyway, as regards California schools, opening them back up in May, after some half-assed attempts at online learning, probably wouldn't improve anything, and would just create another disruption in an already chaotic school term. Better to stick with the online stuff. The teachers should pick up some valuable skills for the future.

    My thinking about American education is largely this. Given the political and social realities of the society, it’s no worse than any other government enterprise, and is probably better than most. A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly. How do they know the other schools are so awful? Probably, they don’t.

    Many suburban white areas in Flyover America actually have reasonably good public schools. They are not going to prepare kids like the really rigorous ones out East, because their families do not want them to work that hard. I didn’t want my kids to work that hard. Asians make their kids grind and they get into schools above their natural ability and become mediocre practitioners.

    I came to the view early on that education is really important if, and only if, you are biologically way above average. Average people are going to do about average no matter what schooling they get. I have a daughter that is in that category-she went to public high school, went to the flagship state university for undergrad and is now at a fairly elite master’s program. I have a son who is a little smarter than average and I encouraged him to go to vo-tech and get on with a utility, a railroad or with a big corporation. He went to work for a utility, got his bachelor’s in management part time while working with the utility and will probably retire out management side with a fat pension. Most parents would have pushed him to get a four year degree immediately and he’d have wound up with a fat debt load and a liberal arts or business degree with little value. His mother is still mad at me, of course.

    • Agree: black sea
    • Replies: @Redneck farmer
    Too many people like your wife. Also, one of the things supporting outsourcing is the idea that people who work with their hands shouldn't make more than people with college degrees.
  91. @Buffalo Joe
    Carol, thank you for the response, but you chose to teach in the US. No forced labor yet.

    Thanks for all the great comments, Joe.

    For Carol, it probably can be a rough time, at least in the red rather than green schools as determined by schooldigger. However, many people go through much worse at plenty of other jobs at less pay. Have you thought about the many dangerous jobs that men do, where one mistake can get one maimed or killed? How about just nasty parts of jobs like crawling in the crawl space or attic among squirril-pooh-containing drooping Owens-Corning insulation installing replacing duct work?

    Would you say that type of job is easier or harder than getting chewed out by parents? Wait, you’d have to be there – but women aren’t.

    • Replies: @Ganderson
    Achmed- you and I agree on many many things- and I don’t exactly disagree with you here, BUT, (and I’m aware that everything before the “but” is BS) I've never argued that there aren’t many jobs that are more difficult than my job as a teacher. I wouldn't’ want to crawl around in the squirrel poo, and if those guys can get a better wage than me good on ‘em, mate. That said, I don’t think everyone could do my job well either, and that includes a lot of people who are smarter than me! I'm not sure what my response would be if asked to extend the year- I’m sure I wouldn’t be wild about it, but I could be convinced if we were doing it for the sake of the kids, not merely to get our 180 days in. I’m guessing that in my district there wouldn’t be much support from the community for an extension, assuming we open back up.

    I am putting lessons on line, communicating with the chilluns, etc. Am I working as hard as I do in school? No. Are my kids learning as much as in class? No. Remember though, this is not our choice- we have to close- and I’d guess Massachusetts schools will be closing for the rest of the year too.

    I’m coming around to the opinion that, with apologies to our host and Mr. Cochran, this is all an extreme overreaction, but then I'm just a dopey schoolteacher.
    And Buffalo Joe- great to have you back. And to be clear- I never really thought I was underpaid- but there is no amount of money that would get me to teach in inner city Buffalo, or inner city anywhere else for that matter.

  92. @Known Fact
    While admitting he had no answers, Rush was doing some musing today on why California's apparent WuFlu numbers are not nearly as bad as we'd all expected by now, or as bad as NYC's.

    California’s population is more spread out.

  93. @petit bourgeois
    I dated a Catholic girl from Hong Kong in the oughts for seven years in San Francisco. They (Han Chinese) are hard wired to eat anything that moves.

    It's not an issue of trust. It's an issue of 3,000 years or more of eating anything that moves.

    “The Land Of Famine” is a nickname for China.

  94. @donvonburg

    My thinking about American education is largely this. Given the political and social realities of the society, it’s no worse than any other government enterprise, and is probably better than most. A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly. How do they know the other schools are so awful? Probably, they don’t.
     
    Many suburban white areas in Flyover America actually have reasonably good public schools. They are not going to prepare kids like the really rigorous ones out East, because their families do not want them to work that hard. I didn't want my kids to work that hard. Asians make their kids grind and they get into schools above their natural ability and become mediocre practitioners.

    I came to the view early on that education is really important if, and only if, you are biologically way above average. Average people are going to do about average no matter what schooling they get. I have a daughter that is in that category-she went to public high school, went to the flagship state university for undergrad and is now at a fairly elite master's program. I have a son who is a little smarter than average and I encouraged him to go to vo-tech and get on with a utility, a railroad or with a big corporation. He went to work for a utility, got his bachelor's in management part time while working with the utility and will probably retire out management side with a fat pension. Most parents would have pushed him to get a four year degree immediately and he'd have wound up with a fat debt load and a liberal arts or business degree with little value. His mother is still mad at me, of course.

    Too many people like your wife. Also, one of the things supporting outsourcing is the idea that people who work with their hands shouldn’t make more than people with college degrees.

    • Agree: Kronos
    • Replies: @Ganderson
    I strongly disagree that people that people who work with their hands should be paid less than people with degrees. Most degrees are worthless, and you wouldn’t want to live in a house I built.
  95. @Intelligent Dasein

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    Steve, you've got a funny definition "natural."

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids' social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver's license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond "education" and will permanently alter life in America.

    Doesn’t matter, White schoolchildren for several age cohorts now have already had all of that stolen from them — robbed of that, and much, much more, by enforced diversity. Racist, monstrous, soul-destroying diversity. No White child growing up today knows at all what it’s like to live in his own country, among his own people, at ease in his own culture which was created by his ancestors for him and not for people 5,000 miles away who showed up last week.

    No White schoolchild today knows what it’s like to just live a normal casual life, day to day, comfortable in his own skin, without being assaulted by poisonous nonsense every waking minute, and on top of that, the humiliation of being forced constantly to repeat and affirm the poisonous lie that it’s better this way. I wonder what it’s done to today’s White children on the subconscious level: whether they somehow suspect that something is deeply, desperately wrong which they can’t articulate, or whether the poison has taken such total hold that they’re fine with the Soma.

    America has been stolen from White children wholesale, and handed on a platter to people who have nothing to do with this place.

    If you see a Fellow American today, be sure to thank them for their service.

    • Agree: Rob McX
    • Replies: @vhrm

    No White schoolchild today knows what it’s like to just live a normal casual life, day to day, comfortable in his own skin, without being assaulted by poisonous nonsense every waking minute, and on top of that, the humiliation of being forced constantly to repeat and affirm the poisonous lie that it’s better this way. I wonder what it’s done to today’s White children on the subconscious level: whether they somehow suspect that something is deeply, desperately wrong which they can’t articulate, or whether the poison has taken such total hold that they’re fine with the Soma.

    America has been stolen from White children wholesale, and handed on a platter to people who have nothing to do with this place.
     
    It doesn't just poison the white kids, it poisons everyone. A non-white growing up being told that white people hate him and all his problems and his family's problems are because of while people and the institutional racism* isn't exactly conducive to a normal and productive outlook either. "social justice"/"identity politics" are just terrible for society.

    * my phone originally wrote "institutional racism" as "insurance tacos". That should be a thing. Get in a fender bender? insurance company dispatches an adjuster who also brings tacos to make everyone feel better.
  96. @Kyle
    Everything Andrew Yang said would happen is happening. By means of a deadly pandemic instead of automation. Tens of millions of people are effectively unemployed and unemployable. Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.

    “Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.”

    Kyle, this restaurant is just not going to pay, probably not too much of a reason to pay; at least from a cutthroat, cold eyed, strictly business perspective. You would have to think many/most of the malls they inhabit may be shuttering: so the Cheesecake Factory may not have that much more to loose?

    “In a letter to landlords, Cheesecake Factory announced it will not be paying rent for any of its 294 restaurant locations in the month of April.”

    5DDF51D2-711A-4E1D-B638-60D421C55586

    https://www.insider.com/the-cheesecake-factory-2020-rent-strike-2020-3

    • Replies: @anon
    You would have to think many/most of the malls they inhabit may be shuttering: so the Cheesecake Factory may not have that much more to loose?

    The word you need to use here is "lose".

    Lose and Loose are not synonyms. Only a loser would think so.
  97. @Buffalo Joe
    Corvi, you can still take a deduction, I just looked it up and I will stand by my comments.

    You can take a deduction, but only if your total itemized deductions are greater than the standard deduction, which is currently 24.4K for a married couple. I’m thinking most teachers can’t scrounge up enough in mortgage interest and state taxes to meet that threshold, where as before the Trump tax changes they could.

  98. @The Wild Geese Howard
    Here is another spring breaker incident that indicates our ability to test and track is far, far behind how quickly this virus is able to spread:

    28 Texas spring breakers who just returned from Cabo have tested positive for the coronavirus

    https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-spring-breakers-cabo-texas-test-postive-2020-3


    The spring break coronavirus saga continues.

    Texas officials in Austin and Travis County have confirmed that 28 young spring breakers returning to the area from Cabo San Lucas, Mexico, have tested positive for the coronavirus, reported Tony Plohetski of local station KVUE-TV in a string of Tweets.
     

    And this is just one group of spring breakers from one city/university in Texas. How many people did they come in contact with during their trip? How many other people did they infect in Cabo and where did all those folks jet off to?

    Unfortunately, we will probably never know.

    Yes, the young lady in the feature photo is a total butterface.

    “Yes, the young lady in the feature photo is a total butterface.” Turn off the lights, it’s all good.

  99. The AP teachers seem to be piling on the work. My one child gets texts from 10am- 4pm and tests at lunch hour from just one teacher, another is handing out work this week which is technically their spring break so they seem to be cracking the whip. I suppose they’re trying to make sure the kids do well on the upcoming AP tests so they get their bonus or attaboys or whatever motivates them to pressure the kids to take the test. AP classes are all front loaded to get ready for the test and after AP tests are done the classes don’t seem to do much of anything so continuing the at home schooling isn’t that big a deal imo. AP/College Board was smart this year and made you pay for the tests in October so that money is gone. It’ll be interesting to see if colleges give out AP credits for this year’s tests since they’re modifying them to be given on line. Our school district arranged for free internet service for the free lunch crowd. Tough luck for those of us who already pay for it, of course.

    I do feel bad for my senior child since it looks like there won’t be a graduation ceremony. I’d be more upset if my college child was deprived of graduation but we’ve got a year left. I am upset his education is being downgraded in a crucial portion of his degree program. It’s hard to do labs properly when you don’t have the equipment. At least he lived in campus housing so we’ll get a refund for this last quarter. So many off campus kids have signed year leases so I’m not sure what parents are doing about that. One of his internship opportunities has already been cancelled and I’m just waiting for the shoe to drop on the backup job. He was set to graduate with the world at his feet next year but he’ll be lucky if he graduates into just a recession. I’m GenX and graduated into aerospace mergers and layoffs but I anticipate the economic devastation is going to be much, much worse. My silent generation parents were born in the Depression and grew up rather poor. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I or my children would have to live through a similar time.

    On the positive side the kids seem to be rolling with on line classes and moving their socializing on line. My youngest is working on getting practice driving hours for his license so it’s been nice to drive on the emptier roads but god knows when we’ll be able to take the road test. The high school girls next door still seem to be hanging out with their friends and having a social life. Too bad Orange County doesn’t have a Safer At Home snitch line like LA County. I owe them for reporting our dog to the HOA.

    • LOL: bomag
    • Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!
  100. “School’s out forever”

    I kid you not, everyday for the first week of this school shutdown, I had “Alexa” play Alice’s song as a wake up anthem for my Jr High daughter.

    Tonight, at ~10:00PM, I received a email from our school district superintendent that campus attendance would not resume for the 2019/2020 year.

    My daughter was less than thrilled; diametrically opposed to the reaction I would have had in the wayback.

    I guess that’s, at least one, reason Mr. Cooper’s song is as much pure music to my ears, as it is screech to hers.

  101. @ScarletNumber

    Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days.
     
    Of course we would. Why wouldn't we? I'm working at home, and my contract says I work 180 days per year.

    …my contract says I work 180 days per year.

    Nice attitude; another reminder of the animosity lurking between the public and private sectors.

    • Replies: @ScarletNumber
    The animosity only goes in one direction.
  102. @Thomm
    Good. Do away with the whole corrupt public school system entirely. Online education is better and vastly more cost-efficient anyway.

    Generally agree with your sentiment, but a chunk of the population benefits from the soft institutionalization provided by the current model.

    We could be honest and provide this oversight and “subsidized dating” at a lower cost.

  103. @bomag

    ...my contract says I work 180 days per year.
     
    Nice attitude; another reminder of the animosity lurking between the public and private sectors.

    The animosity only goes in one direction.

    • Agree: bomag
  104. @AnonAnon
    The AP teachers seem to be piling on the work. My one child gets texts from 10am- 4pm and tests at lunch hour from just one teacher, another is handing out work this week which is technically their spring break so they seem to be cracking the whip. I suppose they’re trying to make sure the kids do well on the upcoming AP tests so they get their bonus or attaboys or whatever motivates them to pressure the kids to take the test. AP classes are all front loaded to get ready for the test and after AP tests are done the classes don’t seem to do much of anything so continuing the at home schooling isn’t that big a deal imo. AP/College Board was smart this year and made you pay for the tests in October so that money is gone. It’ll be interesting to see if colleges give out AP credits for this year’s tests since they’re modifying them to be given on line. Our school district arranged for free internet service for the free lunch crowd. Tough luck for those of us who already pay for it, of course.

    I do feel bad for my senior child since it looks like there won’t be a graduation ceremony. I’d be more upset if my college child was deprived of graduation but we’ve got a year left. I am upset his education is being downgraded in a crucial portion of his degree program. It’s hard to do labs properly when you don’t have the equipment. At least he lived in campus housing so we’ll get a refund for this last quarter. So many off campus kids have signed year leases so I’m not sure what parents are doing about that. One of his internship opportunities has already been cancelled and I’m just waiting for the shoe to drop on the backup job. He was set to graduate with the world at his feet next year but he’ll be lucky if he graduates into just a recession. I’m GenX and graduated into aerospace mergers and layoffs but I anticipate the economic devastation is going to be much, much worse. My silent generation parents were born in the Depression and grew up rather poor. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I or my children would have to live through a similar time.

    On the positive side the kids seem to be rolling with on line classes and moving their socializing on line. My youngest is working on getting practice driving hours for his license so it’s been nice to drive on the emptier roads but god knows when we’ll be able to take the road test. The high school girls next door still seem to be hanging out with their friends and having a social life. Too bad Orange County doesn’t have a Safer At Home snitch line like LA County. I owe them for reporting our dog to the HOA.

    I’m beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity…

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    • Replies: @black sea
    Perhaps you've seen this already, but homeschooling Israeli style:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-nftLnl8H4
    , @Redneck farmer
    My cousin's wife is a teacher and she's complaining how it doesn't appear her daughters are learning much. She says they seem to be asking more per class than she does of her students, and her students are slacking off.
    , @Alice
    Speaking as a 4 yr homeschooling mom of 3, I think it highly unlikely. (Also, this house arrest is not what most homeschoolers call homeschooling, with the parks, museums, libraries, etc. and playmates prohibited.)

    we take for granted the tendency/desire of humans to do what everyone else is doing. this is why a classroom works, because most kids almost never say "no, I prefer not to." they just sit because the others sit, walk in line because the others do, write stuff because the others do. to the extent that antisocial kids are in the classroom, then it's just chaos, of course, but the classrooms most of us grew up in were not that.

    we use the derogatory "peer pressure" to refer to this when the teen is aware of not wanting to stand out, but our animal nature makes this the default at all times.

    but without the clasroom, why do any of it?

    there are no peers. how will mom make you if you say no? mom has no idea, neither does dad.

    there are more than 14 waking hours to fill for the kids and no kids you're allowed to play or school with. What activity is your carrot? what grounding of said activity is your stick? you have no motivational tools

    why should the child get up at all? they will behave as if they don't have to, even if they don't quite consciously realize they don't have to.

    some kids like competition. how will homeschool provide that?

    most kids go to school to see their friends. This homeschool doesn't provide that.

    why do grades matter? for some because of the next school or college opportunity. Those are gone. summer camp gone. swim team gone.

    this idea humans are internally motivated is a crock. most are motivated be fear--feae of being homeless, fear of being hungry, fear of disappointing someone. some are motivated by what they can buy, experience. some motivated by besting someone. kids aren't going to suddenly be excited to see paintings of the Masters on the wall of some place they'll never visit. They aren't going to learn algebra just for its own sake.

    so parents are going to fail, and not have time to do it well, and not see how to get their kids on board, and give up anyway.

    its a simulacrum of life, not living.

    , @Intelligent Dasein

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome,
     
    Please allow me to slightly modify your point.

    Parents will have to go back to work eventually and not every parent either can or wants to homeschool their children. But, there ought to be a nice market springing up for private teachers to attend to homeschooling co-ops. No more 5-year "education" degree required, since it's all private. The board of parents decides whom they want teaching their children, and how much to pay them.

    If you're an intellectual sort of person who likes to read and talk about things with other interested people, and who doesn't mind taking a low wage job for awhile for the chance to get to do so away from the rat race---and let's admit it, there are plenty of us out there---this could be a great opportunity for you to do something you've always loved, hich would also help to take back the academy from the government bureaucrats and progressive thought pirates.
    , @Seth Largo
    They're getting assigned homework + classwork. Is all the classwork necessary? Probably not. But teachers have to fill up your kids' lives with 7 hours worth of material, so . . . .

    In good schools, that 7 hours of material will be valuable in varying degrees. In bad schools, it will have little to no benefit. But education is about child care. The education part is secondary. It's funny that the same people who admit this will also be the ones who complain about how bad schools are at education.

    If you aren't homeschooling your kids, you're taking advantage of 7 hours of free, subsidized childcare 5 days a week, 9 months per year, for 16 years. The workers who spend more time with your kids than you do deserve to be paid decently.

    , @adreadline

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.
     
    Certainly. As are retail workers, restauranteurs, small business owners...
  105. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    Perhaps you’ve seen this already, but homeschooling Israeli style:

    • Replies: @Ron Mexico
    The Israeli woman is a teacher. The video was posted to a humor site.
  106. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    My cousin’s wife is a teacher and she’s complaining how it doesn’t appear her daughters are learning much. She says they seem to be asking more per class than she does of her students, and her students are slacking off.

  107. @Thomm
    Good. Do away with the whole corrupt public school system entirely. Online education is better and vastly more cost-efficient anyway.

    Isn’t school a kind of pre-prison human warehousing service in certain urban quarters?

    • Replies: @Known Fact
    NYC just about openly acknowledges that the major pursuit is not education but 1) day-care and 2) free-meal provision
    , @Morton's toes
    Attendance punctuality obedience.

    School was engineered by Prussian bureaucrats to raise up soldiers and factory workers for the Kaiser's army and the Deutchbank.

  108. https://www.msn.com/en-us/finance/careers/colleges-drop-sat-easing-admissions-burden-for-at-least-one-class/ar-BB11VhdL

    Tufts, BU and Case Western(!) have got rid of standardized testing.

    Why? Let’s ask U of Chicago’s Dean of Admissions : “Our current freshman class is the most diverse in our history,”. U of C got rid of their requirements a year ago.

    Bridges are going to fall down in ten years because of engineering schools want to be diverse.

    • Replies: @Alice
    think harder. how will Case Western even have students year from now? with what tuition? colleges live off dorm and food payments. who will attend? why pay for online school no better than Coursera?
    , @Milesglorious
    Anybody want to hazard a guess as to how many Wu tang flu deaths can be chalked up to diversity?
  109. @Achmed E. Newman
    OK, OK, while you were getting into the details of the masks, Big-Brother rectal thermometers, R0 coefficients, and such, Peak Stupidity has been all over this thing about the schools. Yes, of course, we have the Alice Cooper song and Pink Floyd's ("... collect call from Mr. Floyd to Mrs. Floyd...")

    See "School's out For Ever!" and "Arts & Crafts", along with a post from before the Kung Flu's debut in America, called "Hey, Ed-Schools, leave them teachers alone!".

    I think this is one BIG silver lining in all of this infotainment panic-fest. The parents will really get used to the kids being around and also note how short a time it takes to really do whatever learning was going on. Some of the MILFs at our elementary school are very active (in normal times) organizing this and that, and I think they could easily run a small actually-productive school, if they knew it were politically possible.

    The teachers ought to be excreting bricks right now.

    We’re running that micro-sociology experiment here in Connecticut with a 7th and a 9th grader home all day and interacting virtually with their far-flung classmates and teachers. I’m about to see how awesome home-schooling is–good and hard, and whether I like it or not.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    It's gotta be different at those ages, but still, try to avoid as much of the on-line crap as possible without them getting penalized somehow. Then, you'll realize that they can learn a whole lot in 3 hours, and have, if not a 2 hour recess, then 2 hours time for whatever they really like (sports, music, reading for pleasure). After that and lunch, they could knock out another hour of some math and, on the whole, be way ahead of what the half-wasted day in government school would have gotten them.

    Unless the kids are real discipline problems to begin with, this makes for a MORE relaxing day at the house. As AnonAnon wrote above, a really big benefit I haven't mentioned is getting them away for the Woke reading material.

    The reading material and social studies for the whole damn whole month of February was nothing but blackety-blackety-black, in the descriptive terms I attribute to John Derbyshire. A big break from that would be a big boon to all of us.
  110. @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    Couldn’t possibly agree more aside from YOURE UNDERstating it. College is closed, too.
    Fewer marriages, fewer amazing first kisses, fewer paid internships that lead to rewarding multi year careers, fewer opportunities TO PAY OFF STUDENT LOANS, fewer rock concerts (played in and spectated). Life for the under-25 cohort got vaporized.
    Further, the non-college track got #cancelled, too. The Army and the Marines have cancelled basic training and ait, which means 19 year olds don’t get their foot on the first step of the economic ladder. IBEW is not running apprenticeships, which means sons don’t follow fathers into the trades. This is catastrophic

    this cannot be stated strongly enough.

    Our current “policy” has no way to open anything ever again. How will there be schools in the fall? How will there be colleges with dorms?

    there are no birthday parties. There are no graduations. No plays, movies, orchestras, baseball games. there are no events where people meet, date, fall in love.

    Every single bishop in the US has closed mass, and most of them have also stopped weddings, baptisms, confirmations, and even funerals.

    How will young people meet? working the amazon warehouse?

    there is no reason for my kids to do anything because there are no jobs they will jave even thr DMV is closed and you cant get a driver’s license to be a trucker.

    • Replies: @Daniel Chieh

    No plays, movies, orchestras, baseball games. there are no events where people meet, date, fall in love.
     
    It is true.

    Without schools, humanity will never reproduce again.

    Sometimes I'm wondering if this is some version of Poe's law.
    , @Intelligent Dasein

    Every single bishop in the US has closed mass, and most of them have also stopped weddings, baptisms, confirmations, and even funerals.
     
    This is the most appalling thing of all. Of course, the Roman Catholic establishment has been heretical since Vatican II anyway, and all they do is preach SJWism, so their loss is actually no real loss to the faith; but the fact that they would cowardishly close the churches and deny people the sacraments is horrific. The (real) Catholic clergy used to defy government edicts, torture, and death in order to bring people the sacraments; these clowns are just looking for an excuse to not even bother. I'm glad I will niot be them, facing the Lord on the Day of Judgment.
  111. @Hodag
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/finance/careers/colleges-drop-sat-easing-admissions-burden-for-at-least-one-class/ar-BB11VhdL

    Tufts, BU and Case Western(!) have got rid of standardized testing.

    Why? Let's ask U of Chicago's Dean of Admissions : “Our current freshman class is the most diverse in our history,”. U of C got rid of their requirements a year ago.

    Bridges are going to fall down in ten years because of engineering schools want to be diverse.

    think harder. how will Case Western even have students year from now? with what tuition? colleges live off dorm and food payments. who will attend? why pay for online school no better than Coursera?

  112. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    Speaking as a 4 yr homeschooling mom of 3, I think it highly unlikely. (Also, this house arrest is not what most homeschoolers call homeschooling, with the parks, museums, libraries, etc. and playmates prohibited.)

    we take for granted the tendency/desire of humans to do what everyone else is doing. this is why a classroom works, because most kids almost never say “no, I prefer not to.” they just sit because the others sit, walk in line because the others do, write stuff because the others do. to the extent that antisocial kids are in the classroom, then it’s just chaos, of course, but the classrooms most of us grew up in were not that.

    we use the derogatory “peer pressure” to refer to this when the teen is aware of not wanting to stand out, but our animal nature makes this the default at all times.

    but without the clasroom, why do any of it?

    there are no peers. how will mom make you if you say no? mom has no idea, neither does dad.

    there are more than 14 waking hours to fill for the kids and no kids you’re allowed to play or school with. What activity is your carrot? what grounding of said activity is your stick? you have no motivational tools

    why should the child get up at all? they will behave as if they don’t have to, even if they don’t quite consciously realize they don’t have to.

    some kids like competition. how will homeschool provide that?

    most kids go to school to see their friends. This homeschool doesn’t provide that.

    why do grades matter? for some because of the next school or college opportunity. Those are gone. summer camp gone. swim team gone.

    this idea humans are internally motivated is a crock. most are motivated be fear–feae of being homeless, fear of being hungry, fear of disappointing someone. some are motivated by what they can buy, experience. some motivated by besting someone. kids aren’t going to suddenly be excited to see paintings of the Masters on the wall of some place they’ll never visit. They aren’t going to learn algebra just for its own sake.

    so parents are going to fail, and not have time to do it well, and not see how to get their kids on board, and give up anyway.

    its a simulacrum of life, not living.

  113. NY State by the way has canceled spring break — meaning that the online learning allegedly going on must continue rather than just letting kids mill around aimlessly and hang out together for the next two weeks. Makes sense, right?

    But incredibly, according to the WOR radio report, some teachers are upset about this — the soundbite was one saying she had been looking forward to the time off “to catch my breath.” Hey lady, my wife is a teacher too — semi-retired per diem and losing plenty of pay, sadly missing her (Catholic) school, with all kinds of time right now to “catch her breath.”

  114. @Rob McX
    Isn't school a kind of pre-prison human warehousing service in certain urban quarters?

    NYC just about openly acknowledges that the major pursuit is not education but 1) day-care and 2) free-meal provision

  115. @Achmed E. Newman
    Thanks for all the great comments, Joe.

    For Carol, it probably can be a rough time, at least in the red rather than green schools as determined by schooldigger. However, many people go through much worse at plenty of other jobs at less pay. Have you thought about the many dangerous jobs that men do, where one mistake can get one maimed or killed? How about just nasty parts of jobs like crawling in the crawl space or attic among squirril-pooh-containing drooping Owens-Corning insulation installing replacing duct work?

    Would you say that type of job is easier or harder than getting chewed out by parents? Wait, you'd have to be there - but women aren't.

    Achmed- you and I agree on many many things- and I don’t exactly disagree with you here, BUT, (and I’m aware that everything before the “but” is BS) I’ve never argued that there aren’t many jobs that are more difficult than my job as a teacher. I wouldn’t’ want to crawl around in the squirrel poo, and if those guys can get a better wage than me good on ‘em, mate. That said, I don’t think everyone could do my job well either, and that includes a lot of people who are smarter than me! I’m not sure what my response would be if asked to extend the year- I’m sure I wouldn’t be wild about it, but I could be convinced if we were doing it for the sake of the kids, not merely to get our 180 days in. I’m guessing that in my district there wouldn’t be much support from the community for an extension, assuming we open back up.

    I am putting lessons on line, communicating with the chilluns, etc. Am I working as hard as I do in school? No. Are my kids learning as much as in class? No. Remember though, this is not our choice- we have to close- and I’d guess Massachusetts schools will be closing for the rest of the year too.

    I’m coming around to the opinion that, with apologies to our host and Mr. Cochran, this is all an extreme overreaction, but then I’m just a dopey schoolteacher.
    And Buffalo Joe- great to have you back. And to be clear- I never really thought I was underpaid- but there is no amount of money that would get me to teach in inner city Buffalo, or inner city anywhere else for that matter.

    • Thanks: Jim Don Bob
    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Ganderson, I really did have you in mind when I wrote some of the comments here (and on Peak Stupidity. You are right that you are often in a bind these days in your job at the public school. The PC and woke stuff that infiltrates almost all subjects now has got to be exasperating for a white guy. I gotta admit that my posts have been more about the world in elementary school too, not HS, with its bigger problems. I imagine if this were 1955, you would have much less stress in your job.

    I wish there were more male teachers yourself, as things would probably run differently. At the elementary school in question there are no male teachers but the gym teacher. That's it. There would probably be much more pushback against the pressure from the school boards and Ed Schools (or even the requirement of having to go get an expensive Masters or what-have-you to be able to teach.)

    As a man, you would indeed be better off, mentally at least, installing ductwork in nasty conditions than teaching in an inner-city school. Now, at a private school where the teachers run the show, you'd probably work for quite a bit less for the satisfaction, I'm guessing. I went to school at a place for some years, where everybody except the Principal and the 2 custodians taught class. It was a lean and mean operation. (The coaches, BTW, mostly sucked as teachers, I'll admit.)

    Lastly, I'm in complete agreement with you on the overkill regarding the Kung Flu. If you have time, read the latest C.F. Hopkins article on this site, along with his 2 previous ones - I think you'd really like them.
    , @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    I am a former teacher who left for the military and I swear to anyone who asks the Combat Arms are easier, safer and better than being an inner city teacher. I’d take a fire base in Afghanistan over a classroom in Lawrence, MA every single time
  116. @Redneck farmer
    Too many people like your wife. Also, one of the things supporting outsourcing is the idea that people who work with their hands shouldn't make more than people with college degrees.

    I strongly disagree that people that people who work with their hands should be paid less than people with degrees. Most degrees are worthless, and you wouldn’t want to live in a house I built.

  117. @Buffalo Joe
    Part of the problem with reopening the schools is that it would extend past the normal school year. Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days. Don't believe me? You can go on line and see that this was proposed in Chicago and the teachers response. Never have the audacity to ask teachers to do more than the hardlines of a contract.

    Dude. I can’t speak for all districts* but my wife is working twice as hard right now to create homework packets (on a running two-week basis), create video lectures, do individual Zoom meetings with kids who need extra help, field emails from parents, etc. Also: because the homework packets get sent out and returned every two weeks, that means grading is not spread out evenly. When those packets get returned, that’s two weeks of grading she has to do in a weekend.

    *She actually works at a private school. But she has friends in the local public district who are doing the exact same thing.

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Seth, First, see how I addressed you by name? You can call me Buff or Joe, but we're good. Of course you are going to defend your wife, she tightens the V-vise and you are screwed, or not. Anyhow, your wife is grading papers at home, grading she did during the school day between classes. The kids are knocking off their home work in one day or two or three but returning it all at once. Some kids don't do it until the day it is due. Some suggestions. Make all homework multiple choice questions, easiest to correct. Meet with individual students that need help on an appointment basis. That's what they do in our district. A set time during the school day but before or after classes. It's in the contract. Your wife already wakes up in her class room so she actually has more time. Pray that the virus goes and away and then parents won't pay as much attention to what their kids are doing in school.
  118. @ScarletNumber

    Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days.
     
    Of course we would. Why wouldn't we? I'm working at home, and my contract says I work 180 days per year.

    Scarlet, I just saw this. Almost all school districts started their lock downs by extending Spring Break. They then decided to start teaching online or in districts around here, have the kids pick up a work package and self school at home. So, somewhere in between teaching online, and the soft shut down, you had idle days. Oh, and you were paid for them.

    • Replies: @Ron Mexico
    "Oh, and you were paid for them." Yeah, that's how a contracted salary works.
  119. @black sea
    Perhaps you've seen this already, but homeschooling Israeli style:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-nftLnl8H4

    The Israeli woman is a teacher. The video was posted to a humor site.

  120. @Buffalo Joe
    Scarlet, I just saw this. Almost all school districts started their lock downs by extending Spring Break. They then decided to start teaching online or in districts around here, have the kids pick up a work package and self school at home. So, somewhere in between teaching online, and the soft shut down, you had idle days. Oh, and you were paid for them.

    “Oh, and you were paid for them.” Yeah, that’s how a contracted salary works.

  121. @danand

    “Tomorrow is april 1st and rent is due.”
     
    Kyle, this restaurant is just not going to pay, probably not too much of a reason to pay; at least from a cutthroat, cold eyed, strictly business perspective. You would have to think many/most of the malls they inhabit may be shuttering: so the Cheesecake Factory may not have that much more to loose?

    “In a letter to landlords, Cheesecake Factory announced it will not be paying rent for any of its 294 restaurant locations in the month of April.”
     
    https://flic.kr/p/2iKNzhz

    https://www.insider.com/the-cheesecake-factory-2020-rent-strike-2020-3

    You would have to think many/most of the malls they inhabit may be shuttering: so the Cheesecake Factory may not have that much more to loose?

    The word you need to use here is “lose”.

    Lose and Loose are not synonyms. Only a loser would think so.

    • Thanks: danand
  122. @black sea
    According to this OECD data, teachers in the US are the 7th best paid in the world. It is true that in some countries housing is part of a teacher's compensation. I don't know whether benefits such as these were factored into the comparison.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/teacher-salaries-by-country-2017-5


    US teachers working abroad can do quite well in the Persian Gulf (no surprise) and China is reputed to pay quite well. Jobs in Western Europe are much harder for US citizens to come by unless they also have dual citizenship in an EU country or teach for the US DoD in a school for military kids.

    I am curious as to where you taught overseas, and the kinds of perks that you enjoyed. Usually, the well-paying jobs are well-paying for a reason, i.e. they are in places few Westerners would really want to visit, much less reside in.

    Black Sea, if we want to start an agita* inducing topic we can talk about Public Education in America. For those who want a stomach churning head start, Time Magazine published a series called “Teaching in America.” Those words should bring it up or maybe, Time magazine’s “Teaching in America.” Personal stories of teachers who are “struggling” to survive on their paychecks. Best thing is to compare their stated pay to the median income in their location. My favorites: The single mother teacher who shares a bed with her only child, income $69,000 IIRC. And the teacher who sells plasma twice a week to pay her electric bill. Enjoy. *Agita is an Italian term to describe stomach upset or distress. ex.”Liz Warren’s pandering give me agita.” Sometimes shortened to ahg.

    • Replies: @anon
    Black Sea, if we want to start an agita* inducing topic we can talk about Public Education in America

    Suggested starting point:

    https://www.johntaylorgatto.com/
  123. @slumber_j
    We're running that micro-sociology experiment here in Connecticut with a 7th and a 9th grader home all day and interacting virtually with their far-flung classmates and teachers. I'm about to see how awesome home-schooling is--good and hard, and whether I like it or not.

    It’s gotta be different at those ages, but still, try to avoid as much of the on-line crap as possible without them getting penalized somehow. Then, you’ll realize that they can learn a whole lot in 3 hours, and have, if not a 2 hour recess, then 2 hours time for whatever they really like (sports, music, reading for pleasure). After that and lunch, they could knock out another hour of some math and, on the whole, be way ahead of what the half-wasted day in government school would have gotten them.

    Unless the kids are real discipline problems to begin with, this makes for a MORE relaxing day at the house. As AnonAnon wrote above, a really big benefit I haven’t mentioned is getting them away for the Woke reading material.

    The reading material and social studies for the whole damn whole month of February was nothing but blackety-blackety-black, in the descriptive terms I attribute to John Derbyshire. A big break from that would be a big boon to all of us.

  124. @Achmed E. Newman

    A lot of people gripe about how awful it is, but then they exempt their own kid’s school, which they regard pretty highly.
     
    Yes, Black Sea, but this time with their kids away from the school may bring that down a notch. I can see now how much time is wasted in the elementary school, even one that is a good one. The important thing there is simply that there are mostly GOOD KIDS there, so there aren't bad influences.

    The learning going on is a different story. From the time at the little conferences you get one impression, but we've got a different one now. My 2nd-grade boy was doing a little project to look up the state flower, bird, motto, dog (yes, there is one - that's one thing the FEDS still allow states to do), etc. It took only 5-10 minutes of "searching up" the info, but the rest of the project was 4 hours of cutting, gluing, and coloring.

    Don't get me wrong - he loves cutting, gluing, and coloring. However, that is time-wasting pre-school stuff. I told him that and asked "hey, is that what they've been doing, spending half the time on that stuff?" "No, it's about one quarter." See, we just got done working with fractions, adding/subtracting/multiplying/reducing, taking about 8 hours total over a week, after the school had been taking months with the concept - having the kids divide rectangles equally, and, of course, coloring them.

    Ach, do you have a “teacher’s aide?” You have to have an aide, read yor contract.

    • LOL: Achmed E. Newman
  125. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome,

    Please allow me to slightly modify your point.

    Parents will have to go back to work eventually and not every parent either can or wants to homeschool their children. But, there ought to be a nice market springing up for private teachers to attend to homeschooling co-ops. No more 5-year “education” degree required, since it’s all private. The board of parents decides whom they want teaching their children, and how much to pay them.

    If you’re an intellectual sort of person who likes to read and talk about things with other interested people, and who doesn’t mind taking a low wage job for awhile for the chance to get to do so away from the rat race—and let’s admit it, there are plenty of us out there—this could be a great opportunity for you to do something you’ve always loved, hich would also help to take back the academy from the government bureaucrats and progressive thought pirates.

    • Replies: @adreadline

    If you’re an intellectual sort of person who likes to read and talk about things with other interested people, and who doesn’t mind taking a low wage job for awhile for the chance to get to do so away from the rat race—and let’s admit it, there are plenty of us out there—
     
    What kind of low wage job, away from the rat race, you're referring to? Would that, whatever it is, help the Nasdaq and the Dow recover from the 3% dip they took today? If so, how? Would you mind explaining?
  126. @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    Couldn’t possibly agree more aside from YOURE UNDERstating it. College is closed, too.
    Fewer marriages, fewer amazing first kisses, fewer paid internships that lead to rewarding multi year careers, fewer opportunities TO PAY OFF STUDENT LOANS, fewer rock concerts (played in and spectated). Life for the under-25 cohort got vaporized.
    Further, the non-college track got #cancelled, too. The Army and the Marines have cancelled basic training and ait, which means 19 year olds don’t get their foot on the first step of the economic ladder. IBEW is not running apprenticeships, which means sons don’t follow fathers into the trades. This is catastrophic

    Indeed: the greatest principle of the alt right is compulsory schooling in government dogma. With it, all civilization would end.

  127. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    They’re getting assigned homework + classwork. Is all the classwork necessary? Probably not. But teachers have to fill up your kids’ lives with 7 hours worth of material, so . . . .

    In good schools, that 7 hours of material will be valuable in varying degrees. In bad schools, it will have little to no benefit. But education is about child care. The education part is secondary. It’s funny that the same people who admit this will also be the ones who complain about how bad schools are at education.

    If you aren’t homeschooling your kids, you’re taking advantage of 7 hours of free, subsidized childcare 5 days a week, 9 months per year, for 16 years. The workers who spend more time with your kids than you do deserve to be paid decently.

  128. @ScarletNumber

    Teachers would demand extra pay for the extra days.
     
    Of course we would. Why wouldn't we? I'm working at home, and my contract says I work 180 days per year.

    Monday I called my boss to say that I could live on less for a while if doing so would help maintain the viability of his business. It’s odd that I feel a greater (and more glad) sense of duty to my private sector employer than you to your public sector one.

  129. @The Wild Geese Howard
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaYYBwAt5d0

    I’m still waiting for the PSA commercials against huffing your own fecal matter.

    Go to 11:45

  130. @Seth Largo
    Dude. I can't speak for all districts* but my wife is working twice as hard right now to create homework packets (on a running two-week basis), create video lectures, do individual Zoom meetings with kids who need extra help, field emails from parents, etc. Also: because the homework packets get sent out and returned every two weeks, that means grading is not spread out evenly. When those packets get returned, that's two weeks of grading she has to do in a weekend.

    *She actually works at a private school. But she has friends in the local public district who are doing the exact same thing.

    Seth, First, see how I addressed you by name? You can call me Buff or Joe, but we’re good. Of course you are going to defend your wife, she tightens the V-vise and you are screwed, or not. Anyhow, your wife is grading papers at home, grading she did during the school day between classes. The kids are knocking off their home work in one day or two or three but returning it all at once. Some kids don’t do it until the day it is due. Some suggestions. Make all homework multiple choice questions, easiest to correct. Meet with individual students that need help on an appointment basis. That’s what they do in our district. A set time during the school day but before or after classes. It’s in the contract. Your wife already wakes up in her class room so she actually has more time. Pray that the virus goes and away and then parents won’t pay as much attention to what their kids are doing in school.

  131. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    I'm beginning to hear reports from friends and family of their grade-school children getting positively slammed and overwhelmed by absurd amounts of online homework, far more than regular live-school assignments ever were.

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Once White children become comfortably at ease with online home-schooling, and even adopt it as the new normal; and once White parents discover that homeschooling is feasible, practical, dignified, and not really that hard; and once White parents discover they can observe for themselves, and start to filter out, the noxious racist anti-White poison that their kids are being fed; and once White parents discover they can give their children a fine education at home, without exposing their children to the poisons and dangers of diversity...

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome, except as babysitters and prison wardens for the vibrant.

    Sounds like a winner to me!

    My theory is that the teachers are desperate to re-establish and prove their relevance and necessity.

    Certainly. As are retail workers, restauranteurs, small business owners…

  132. @Buffalo Joe
    Black Sea, if we want to start an agita* inducing topic we can talk about Public Education in America. For those who want a stomach churning head start, Time Magazine published a series called "Teaching in America." Those words should bring it up or maybe, Time magazine's "Teaching in America." Personal stories of teachers who are "struggling" to survive on their paychecks. Best thing is to compare their stated pay to the median income in their location. My favorites: The single mother teacher who shares a bed with her only child, income $69,000 IIRC. And the teacher who sells plasma twice a week to pay her electric bill. Enjoy. *Agita is an Italian term to describe stomach upset or distress. ex."Liz Warren's pandering give me agita." Sometimes shortened to ahg.

    Black Sea, if we want to start an agita* inducing topic we can talk about Public Education in America

    Suggested starting point:

    https://www.johntaylorgatto.com/

    • Replies: @J.Ross
    ALL OF MY THIS: JTG's Underground History is a Foundational Book, an absolute must-read. Might follow it up with Facing Reality In American Education by Robert Walters, or use Ed Boland's unintentionally hilarious Battle for Room 314 as a sorbet.
  133. @Rob McX
    Isn't school a kind of pre-prison human warehousing service in certain urban quarters?

    Attendance punctuality obedience.

    School was engineered by Prussian bureaucrats to raise up soldiers and factory workers for the Kaiser’s army and the Deutchbank.

    • Agree: Daniel Chieh
  134. @Buffalo Joe
    Corvi, you can still take a deduction, I just looked it up and I will stand by my comments.

    Let’s clarify here.

    Before 2018, teachers were able to deduct expenses over and above the $250 limit – such as uniforms, union dues and transportation costs, to name a few. But the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act eliminated all miscellaneous deductions, including these unreimbursed employee expenses, until 2026 when the law expires.

    Under the new law, teachers can use the Educator Expense Deduction regardless of whether they take the standard deduction or itemize their tax deductions. A teacher can deduct a maximum of $250. Two married teachers filing a joint return can take a deduction of up to $250 apiece, for a maximum of $500.

    So it is true that a teacher can take a deduction, but it is capped. So we are both correct.

  135. @Alice
    this cannot be stated strongly enough.

    Our current "policy" has no way to open anything ever again. How will there be schools in the fall? How will there be colleges with dorms?

    there are no birthday parties. There are no graduations. No plays, movies, orchestras, baseball games. there are no events where people meet, date, fall in love.

    Every single bishop in the US has closed mass, and most of them have also stopped weddings, baptisms, confirmations, and even funerals.

    How will young people meet? working the amazon warehouse?

    there is no reason for my kids to do anything because there are no jobs they will jave even thr DMV is closed and you cant get a driver's license to be a trucker.

    No plays, movies, orchestras, baseball games. there are no events where people meet, date, fall in love.

    It is true.

    Without schools, humanity will never reproduce again.

    Sometimes I’m wondering if this is some version of Poe’s law.

  136. @Intelligent Dasein

    Well, the teachers will find themselves completely unnecessary and unwelcome,
     
    Please allow me to slightly modify your point.

    Parents will have to go back to work eventually and not every parent either can or wants to homeschool their children. But, there ought to be a nice market springing up for private teachers to attend to homeschooling co-ops. No more 5-year "education" degree required, since it's all private. The board of parents decides whom they want teaching their children, and how much to pay them.

    If you're an intellectual sort of person who likes to read and talk about things with other interested people, and who doesn't mind taking a low wage job for awhile for the chance to get to do so away from the rat race---and let's admit it, there are plenty of us out there---this could be a great opportunity for you to do something you've always loved, hich would also help to take back the academy from the government bureaucrats and progressive thought pirates.

    If you’re an intellectual sort of person who likes to read and talk about things with other interested people, and who doesn’t mind taking a low wage job for awhile for the chance to get to do so away from the rat race—and let’s admit it, there are plenty of us out there—

    What kind of low wage job, away from the rat race, you’re referring to? Would that, whatever it is, help the Nasdaq and the Dow recover from the 3% dip they took today? If so, how? Would you mind explaining?

  137. @Alice
    this cannot be stated strongly enough.

    Our current "policy" has no way to open anything ever again. How will there be schools in the fall? How will there be colleges with dorms?

    there are no birthday parties. There are no graduations. No plays, movies, orchestras, baseball games. there are no events where people meet, date, fall in love.

    Every single bishop in the US has closed mass, and most of them have also stopped weddings, baptisms, confirmations, and even funerals.

    How will young people meet? working the amazon warehouse?

    there is no reason for my kids to do anything because there are no jobs they will jave even thr DMV is closed and you cant get a driver's license to be a trucker.

    Every single bishop in the US has closed mass, and most of them have also stopped weddings, baptisms, confirmations, and even funerals.

    This is the most appalling thing of all. Of course, the Roman Catholic establishment has been heretical since Vatican II anyway, and all they do is preach SJWism, so their loss is actually no real loss to the faith; but the fact that they would cowardishly close the churches and deny people the sacraments is horrific. The (real) Catholic clergy used to defy government edicts, torture, and death in order to bring people the sacraments; these clowns are just looking for an excuse to not even bother. I’m glad I will niot be them, facing the Lord on the Day of Judgment.

  138. @Ganderson
    Achmed- you and I agree on many many things- and I don’t exactly disagree with you here, BUT, (and I’m aware that everything before the “but” is BS) I've never argued that there aren’t many jobs that are more difficult than my job as a teacher. I wouldn't’ want to crawl around in the squirrel poo, and if those guys can get a better wage than me good on ‘em, mate. That said, I don’t think everyone could do my job well either, and that includes a lot of people who are smarter than me! I'm not sure what my response would be if asked to extend the year- I’m sure I wouldn’t be wild about it, but I could be convinced if we were doing it for the sake of the kids, not merely to get our 180 days in. I’m guessing that in my district there wouldn’t be much support from the community for an extension, assuming we open back up.

    I am putting lessons on line, communicating with the chilluns, etc. Am I working as hard as I do in school? No. Are my kids learning as much as in class? No. Remember though, this is not our choice- we have to close- and I’d guess Massachusetts schools will be closing for the rest of the year too.

    I’m coming around to the opinion that, with apologies to our host and Mr. Cochran, this is all an extreme overreaction, but then I'm just a dopey schoolteacher.
    And Buffalo Joe- great to have you back. And to be clear- I never really thought I was underpaid- but there is no amount of money that would get me to teach in inner city Buffalo, or inner city anywhere else for that matter.

    Ganderson, I really did have you in mind when I wrote some of the comments here (and on Peak Stupidity. You are right that you are often in a bind these days in your job at the public school. The PC and woke stuff that infiltrates almost all subjects now has got to be exasperating for a white guy. I gotta admit that my posts have been more about the world in elementary school too, not HS, with its bigger problems. I imagine if this were 1955, you would have much less stress in your job.

    I wish there were more male teachers yourself, as things would probably run differently. At the elementary school in question there are no male teachers but the gym teacher. That’s it. There would probably be much more pushback against the pressure from the school boards and Ed Schools (or even the requirement of having to go get an expensive Masters or what-have-you to be able to teach.)

    As a man, you would indeed be better off, mentally at least, installing ductwork in nasty conditions than teaching in an inner-city school. Now, at a private school where the teachers run the show, you’d probably work for quite a bit less for the satisfaction, I’m guessing. I went to school at a place for some years, where everybody except the Principal and the 2 custodians taught class. It was a lean and mean operation. (The coaches, BTW, mostly sucked as teachers, I’ll admit.)

    Lastly, I’m in complete agreement with you on the overkill regarding the Kung Flu. If you have time, read the latest C.F. Hopkins article on this site, along with his 2 previous ones – I think you’d really like them.

  139. @petit bourgeois

    >because cops earn a pittance
     
    That's not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn't retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.

    Just go to https://transparentcalifornia.com/ and look at the salaries. Those jack-booted thugs (by way of their corrupt unions) are compensated more than your average college graduate.

    Reminds me of 2003 when the UFCW went on strike. Is it reasonable for a grocery clerk to make $30 an hour? Methinks not.

    “That’s not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn’t retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.”

    Not for me to say/know what is fair, but officers from one of the early US SARS-CoV-2 hotspots typically do OK. I can’t remember the last time an officer was killed on the job in Santa Clara. I haven’t kept up in at least a decade or so; but it’s far from the worst place to be an officer. It’s definitely one department from which many of its retirees emerged multimillionaires.

    CE382210-643D-4276-B78C-7DE453ED7034

    Jennifer Barry awarded Crisis Intervention Officer of the Year!

    DC186B63-8DF6-48A5-8A56-3BDD6852A156

    Santa Clara California officers who retire with 30 years of service receive 90% of last years base pay.

    • Replies: @Jim Don Bob

    Santa Clara California officers who retire with 30 years of service receive 90% of last years base pay
     
    .

    IIRC, that is true for all state LEOs in California. It's one of the last things that Grey Davis did before he got recalled as governor, which led to the doofus regime of Ahnuld.

    Most people do not know that most cops belong to a union, and can and do get mucho overtime. I talked to a bus driver here in the Peoples' Republic some years back who said he would use his seniority to get at much overtime work as possible in the final three years that determined his retirement.

    I have never met a government employee who did not know 1) when he could GTFO, and 2) how much he was gonna get.

    Maryland, Illinois, and California, to name just a few, are already underwater on their pensions if you substitute real investment returns (< 2%) for the ones they use in their coverage calculations, which is usually 5-8%.
  140. @Hodag
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/finance/careers/colleges-drop-sat-easing-admissions-burden-for-at-least-one-class/ar-BB11VhdL

    Tufts, BU and Case Western(!) have got rid of standardized testing.

    Why? Let's ask U of Chicago's Dean of Admissions : “Our current freshman class is the most diverse in our history,”. U of C got rid of their requirements a year ago.

    Bridges are going to fall down in ten years because of engineering schools want to be diverse.

    Anybody want to hazard a guess as to how many Wu tang flu deaths can be chalked up to diversity?

    • Replies: @Hodag
    Here is how the diverse west side of Chicago is dealing with social distancing.

    https://youtu.be/t2wImvD6hrQ

    Steve, wasn't your wife born in Austin?
  141. @The Wild Geese Howard

    At a certain point it objectively ceases to hurt.
     
    Nothing wrong with checking out after that point.

    Checking out means not fighting, and there is something wrong with that.

  142. @anon
    Black Sea, if we want to start an agita* inducing topic we can talk about Public Education in America

    Suggested starting point:

    https://www.johntaylorgatto.com/

    ALL OF MY THIS: JTG’s Underground History is a Foundational Book, an absolute must-read. Might follow it up with Facing Reality In American Education by Robert Walters, or use Ed Boland’s unintentionally hilarious Battle for Room 314 as a sorbet.

  143. @Reg Cæsar

    ...again claiming it was posted on Jan. 17 when it was actually Jan. 27.
     
    Perhaps he was thinking of Ben Franklin's birthday.

    “Perhaps he was thinking of Ben Franklin’s birthday.”

    Reg Cæsar, nice bit of wit there, interjection of Ben Franklin into a discussion on schooling:

    “Josiah Franklin wanted Ben to attend school with the clergy but only had enough money to send him to school for two years. He attended Boston Latin School but did not graduate; he continued his education through voracious reading. Although “his parents talked of the church as a career” for Franklin, his schooling ended when he was ten.”

    “Abraham Lincoln was primarily self-educated, with intermittent formal schooling from travelling teachers of less than 12 months aggregate; he became an avid reader and retained a lifelong interest in learning. Family, neighbors, and schoolmates recalled that his reading included the King James Bible, Aesop’s Fables, John Bunyan’s The Pilgrim’s Progress, Daniel Defoe’s Robinson Crusoe, Mason Locke Weems’s The Life of Washington, and The Autobiography of Benjamin Franklin.”

    Maybe the fact that Benjamin received more formal education than Abraham, is the reason Franklin got the $100 bill, and Lincoln the penny?

  144. @The Germ Theory of Disease
    Doesn't matter, White schoolchildren for several age cohorts now have already had all of that stolen from them -- robbed of that, and much, much more, by enforced diversity. Racist, monstrous, soul-destroying diversity. No White child growing up today knows at all what it's like to live in his own country, among his own people, at ease in his own culture which was created by his ancestors for him and not for people 5,000 miles away who showed up last week.

    No White schoolchild today knows what it's like to just live a normal casual life, day to day, comfortable in his own skin, without being assaulted by poisonous nonsense every waking minute, and on top of that, the humiliation of being forced constantly to repeat and affirm the poisonous lie that it's better this way. I wonder what it's done to today's White children on the subconscious level: whether they somehow suspect that something is deeply, desperately wrong which they can't articulate, or whether the poison has taken such total hold that they're fine with the Soma.

    America has been stolen from White children wholesale, and handed on a platter to people who have nothing to do with this place.

    If you see a Fellow American today, be sure to thank them for their service.

    No White schoolchild today knows what it’s like to just live a normal casual life, day to day, comfortable in his own skin, without being assaulted by poisonous nonsense every waking minute, and on top of that, the humiliation of being forced constantly to repeat and affirm the poisonous lie that it’s better this way. I wonder what it’s done to today’s White children on the subconscious level: whether they somehow suspect that something is deeply, desperately wrong which they can’t articulate, or whether the poison has taken such total hold that they’re fine with the Soma.

    America has been stolen from White children wholesale, and handed on a platter to people who have nothing to do with this place.

    It doesn’t just poison the white kids, it poisons everyone. A non-white growing up being told that white people hate him and all his problems and his family’s problems are because of while people and the institutional racism* isn’t exactly conducive to a normal and productive outlook either. “social justice”/”identity politics” are just terrible for society.

    * my phone originally wrote “institutional racism” as “insurance tacos”. That should be a thing. Get in a fender bender? insurance company dispatches an adjuster who also brings tacos to make everyone feel better.

  145. @Ganderson
    Achmed- you and I agree on many many things- and I don’t exactly disagree with you here, BUT, (and I’m aware that everything before the “but” is BS) I've never argued that there aren’t many jobs that are more difficult than my job as a teacher. I wouldn't’ want to crawl around in the squirrel poo, and if those guys can get a better wage than me good on ‘em, mate. That said, I don’t think everyone could do my job well either, and that includes a lot of people who are smarter than me! I'm not sure what my response would be if asked to extend the year- I’m sure I wouldn’t be wild about it, but I could be convinced if we were doing it for the sake of the kids, not merely to get our 180 days in. I’m guessing that in my district there wouldn’t be much support from the community for an extension, assuming we open back up.

    I am putting lessons on line, communicating with the chilluns, etc. Am I working as hard as I do in school? No. Are my kids learning as much as in class? No. Remember though, this is not our choice- we have to close- and I’d guess Massachusetts schools will be closing for the rest of the year too.

    I’m coming around to the opinion that, with apologies to our host and Mr. Cochran, this is all an extreme overreaction, but then I'm just a dopey schoolteacher.
    And Buffalo Joe- great to have you back. And to be clear- I never really thought I was underpaid- but there is no amount of money that would get me to teach in inner city Buffalo, or inner city anywhere else for that matter.

    I am a former teacher who left for the military and I swear to anyone who asks the Combat Arms are easier, safer and better than being an inner city teacher. I’d take a fire base in Afghanistan over a classroom in Lawrence, MA every single time

    • Replies: @Buffalo Joe
    Oo-ee, you owe an apology to every single veteran who returned from Afghanistan missing one or more limbs or sight. A teacher can, as you did, willing leave their post. We have a terrible name for military personnel who leave their's. Teachers will walk a picket line if you ask them to to add 15 minutes to their contract day. Or, heaven forbid, ask them to kick into their benefit package. But cold cock an old lady teacher into unconsciousness and they man their posts. Bad behavior in classrooms is fueled by teachers not pressing charges or just leaving the classroom in protest.
  146. @Corvinus
    "And before you tell me that you have out pocket expenses, they are deductible, except now you have to itemize."

    That was obliterated with the Trump tax cuts.

    "Abymal graduation rates and staunch resistance to testing are benchmarks of American public education."

    In some places.

    1. According to who/whom?

    2. Sources?

    3. And what are YOU going to do about it?

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    LOL. Your last activity was October 19, 2019. Then you come out of the woodwork and have 4 posts for me in a week. So, you really don’t have anything of substantive value to contribute.
  147. @Milesglorious
    Anybody want to hazard a guess as to how many Wu tang flu deaths can be chalked up to diversity?

    Here is how the diverse west side of Chicago is dealing with social distancing.

    Steve, wasn’t your wife born in Austin?

  148. @danand

    “That’s not true at all in California. My dad was a cop, and while he didn’t retire as a millionaire, his pension has paid out handsomely.”
     
    Not for me to say/know what is fair, but officers from one of the early US SARS-CoV-2 hotspots typically do OK. I can’t remember the last time an officer was killed on the job in Santa Clara. I haven’t kept up in at least a decade or so; but it’s far from the worst place to be an officer. It’s definitely one department from which many of its retirees emerged multimillionaires.

    https://flic.kr/p/2iKZhep

    Jennifer Barry awarded Crisis Intervention Officer of the Year!

    https://flic.kr/p/2iL3mMp

    Santa Clara California officers who retire with 30 years of service receive 90% of last years base pay.

    Santa Clara California officers who retire with 30 years of service receive 90% of last years base pay

    .

    IIRC, that is true for all state LEOs in California. It’s one of the last things that Grey Davis did before he got recalled as governor, which led to the doofus regime of Ahnuld.

    Most people do not know that most cops belong to a union, and can and do get mucho overtime. I talked to a bus driver here in the Peoples’ Republic some years back who said he would use his seniority to get at much overtime work as possible in the final three years that determined his retirement.

    I have never met a government employee who did not know 1) when he could GTFO, and 2) how much he was gonna get.

    Maryland, Illinois, and California, to name just a few, are already underwater on their pensions if you substitute real investment returns (< 2%) for the ones they use in their coverage calculations, which is usually 5-8%.

  149. @Bel Riose
    1. According to who/whom?

    2. Sources?

    3. And what are YOU going to do about it?

    LOL. Your last activity was October 19, 2019. Then you come out of the woodwork and have 4 posts for me in a week. So, you really don’t have anything of substantive value to contribute.

  150. @Oo-ee-oo-ah-ah-ting-tang-walla-walla-bing-bang
    I am a former teacher who left for the military and I swear to anyone who asks the Combat Arms are easier, safer and better than being an inner city teacher. I’d take a fire base in Afghanistan over a classroom in Lawrence, MA every single time

    Oo-ee, you owe an apology to every single veteran who returned from Afghanistan missing one or more limbs or sight. A teacher can, as you did, willing leave their post. We have a terrible name for military personnel who leave their’s. Teachers will walk a picket line if you ask them to to add 15 minutes to their contract day. Or, heaven forbid, ask them to kick into their benefit package. But cold cock an old lady teacher into unconsciousness and they man their posts. Bad behavior in classrooms is fueled by teachers not pressing charges or just leaving the classroom in protest.

  151. @Cherubino
    As a high school teacher, I find your comment ridiculous. In my state, as in many, we must suddenly come up with a brand new online curriculum, with only two weeks to plan it. As someone with a Master's who has taught all over the world, I can assure you that I''d much rather be teaching kids face to face. However, with the corona and the need for extreme social distancing, unless we want more than 1 million dead, that is not an option.

    Overseas, I got a similar salary, but perks that American teachers can only dream of; US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Re your comment re pay and the extension of the school year, what would happen to reopening in the fall? How would the calendar be changed? In Chicago, how many millions of school kids are there, hundreds or thousands of buses, auxiliary personnel, and so on.

    Get a reality check.

    US teachers are woefully underpaid compared to those in other developed countries.

    Spoken like a true US teacher!

    US teachers seem to be to be woefully overpaid. Apparently the total compensation package — salary, work hours, time off, tenure, pension, lack of accountability — has no problem attracting applicants. Show me that there exists a shortage of people willing to do the job for the compensation offered (broadly, not just in a small number of inner-city war zones) and I might accept the argument that they are underpaid.

  152. @Intelligent Dasein

    Are any social scientists gearing up to measure this huge natural experiment in different types of education?
     
    Steve, you've got a funny definition "natural."

    But anyway, education is only one of the minor side effects of schooling. These kids' social lives and social milestones are being seriously disrupted, and the younger you are the more epochal these milestones seem at the time. How many people are not going to senior prom, not taking tests, not applying to college, not getting that summer internship, not getting their driver's license on their 16th birthday, not getting their braces on (or off), not trying out for the track team, not getting to go to summer camp, getting locked out of the skate park just when they learned how to ollie, having all their plans dashed because their parents are suddenly unemployed, experiencing a new sense of anxiety and uselessness, clashing with adults who are now under financial and emotional duress, etc.

    This lockdown is going to create sociological ripples that extend far beyond "education" and will permanently alter life in America.

    Agree, and this is the cost side of the equation that our authoritarian-wannabe overlords in government and the media ignore with their overreaction to this. (Or maybe they see this as a benefit — it all brings us closer to serfdom.)

    I think we will see grim statistics on bankruptcy, crime, abuse, and suicide in the months and years ahead.

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