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Odds That a Primary Case Transmitted COVID-19 in a Closed Environment Was 18.7 Times Greater Compared to an Open-Air Environment
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With much of the American political and media class having chosen beaches as the hill they would die on to evaluate their handling of the pandemic, it’s worth noting this small sample-size preprint from Japan:

Closed environments facilitate secondary transmission of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19)
Hiroshi Nishiura, Hitoshi Oshitani, Tetsuro Kobayashi, Tomoya Saito, Tomimasa Sunagawa, Tamano Matsui, Takaji Wakita, MHLW COVID-19 Response Team, Motoi Suzuki
doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/2020.02.28.20029272

Objective: To identify common features of cases with novel coronavirus disease (COVID-19) so as to better understand what factors promote secondary transmission including superspreading events. Methods: A total of 110 cases were examined among eleven clusters and sporadic cases, and investigated who acquired infection from whom. The clusters included four in Tokyo and one each in Aichi, Fukuoka, Hokkaido, Ishikawa, Kanagawa and Wakayama prefectures. The number of secondary cases generated by each primary case was calculated using contact tracing data. Results: Of the 110 cases examined, 27 (24.6%) were primary cases who generated secondary cases. The odds that a primary case transmitted COVID-19 in a closed environment was 18.7 times greater compared to an open-air environment (95% confidence interval [CI]: 6.0, 57.9). Conclusions: It is plausible that closed environments contribute to secondary transmission of COVID-19 and promote superspreading events. Our findings are also consistent with the declining incidence of COVID-19 cases in China, as gathering in closed environments was prohibited in the wake of the rapid spread of the disease.

Unfortunately, I’m not exactly sure how to interpret this 18.7 figure.

 
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  1. “We shall surrender the beaches, we shall surrender the playgrounds, we shall surrender the baseball fields and the streets, we shall surrender the hills. We shall surrender.”

    • Replies: @miss marple
    Don't worry. Cabin fever is driving the decision making of more than a few Americans. I read somewhere that twitter has a high frequency of the phrase "Let us work or the tire burning and window shattering begins!"
  2. I similarly wonder how the hazard ratio for touching surfaces compares with the other hazard ratios. Is there a single documented case of a totally hunkered-down person who contracted Covid from his Amazon box or from delivered groceries?

    • Thanks: Meretricious
  3. Anonymous[186] • Disclaimer says:

    Seems the current wild escalation of Negroes acting out on airplanes would be a better target for public shaming.

    If only major media outlets didn’t have written in the starting page of their reporters style books that black people are a small step below regular humans, so their primitive behavior is to be tolerated, regardless of the social price they will inevitably pay in the long run, because attempting to bring Negroes up to the standards of modern civilization will only waste our time, and needlessly puzzle the Negroes.

    Meanwhile, on a flight from Los Angeles to Detroit…

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/brawl-breaks-out-on-spirit-airlines-flight-over-noise-complaint/

    And in Detroit…

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/father-son-sought-in-security-guard-slaying-over-coronavirus-mask/

    • Replies: @Reg Cæsar

    And in Detroit…
     
    Flint is not "in Detroit". Or even close. It's farther away than Toledo.
    , @Paul Jolliffe
    Anon 168,

    It wasn’t Detroit - it was Flint (which is per capital even more dangerous than Detroit.)

    But you left out the interesting part: the middle name of the suspect shooter:

    “Travon”

    (The more likely a baby’s name is “Travon”, the more likely . . .?)

    Steve posted on this theme years ago.
    , @Bard of Bumperstickers
    Wish "jet set" still had a place in our world.

    Including on the ground.

  4. duh. It was designed to hit anyone indoors: restaurant workers, retail workers, hotel workers, doctors, lawyers, teachers (did not suck with young people – hmmm?; protecting their children?????) super sick people in compressed facilities:convalescent homes: the “useless eaters” according to Yuval Harriri , S. Pichai, all of the SV mobsters, who love the author of “Sapiens.”

    To this day, landscapers and outdoors workers are working hard. Ships are still runnin’ supplies runs are still running (thanks to President Trump). Ships and shipping does not chose partisan lines.

  5. @BenKenobi
    "We shall surrender the beaches, we shall surrender the playgrounds, we shall surrender the baseball fields and the streets, we shall surrender the hills. We shall surrender."

    Don’t worry. Cabin fever is driving the decision making of more than a few Americans. I read somewhere that twitter has a high frequency of the phrase “Let us work or the tire burning and window shattering begins!”

  6. Anonymous[186] • Disclaimer says:

    Oops! The coronavirus security guard murder was in Flint proper…

    https://apnews.com/9e9eadf6757e8ad1551030dacf6b3e29

  7. It appears that the authors are looking at transmission events and counting how many occurred outside vs. inside. They find, as one might expect, that there are many more cases of indoor transmission vs. outdoor. But if you don’t compare that ratio to the baseline of how much time people spend indoors vs. outdoors, it’s difficult to draw normative conclusions. If indoor transmission events are 19x more frequent, but being indoors in the first place is 23x more probable, then outdoors would be *more* dangerous for you per unit time.

    It still seems plausible to me that being outdoors is less risky ceteris paribus, but I don’t think this paper actually establishes that.

    • Replies: @Ozymandias

    It still seems plausible to me that being outdoors is less risky ceteris paribus, but I don’t think this paper actually establishes that.
     
    Well, it is well established that sunlight kills the virus. Which is probably why they're trying to herd all the homeless into motels.
  8. Anon[368] • Disclaimer says:

    Steve, did you read the pre-print? There is no data at all in this article. With the exception of outdoor environments that are jam-packed with people (Mardi Gras, Chinese New Year, etc.) I have yet to see any evidence that a single transmission has occurred outdoors. There seems to be increasing evidence that prolonged exposure (>15 min) in an enclosed space is required for transmission of enough viral load to cause a symptomatic case of Covid.

    • Replies: @Polynikes
    Mardi Gras is about 10% of the time outdoors watching a parade or group of people and about 90% of the time in a packed bar or restaurant. I suspect skiing is similar. People didn't catch it on the slopes but on the plane to and fro, and late in the evenings as they piled into bars and lodges to drink and socialize up close. Something like spring break, where the participants really are outdoors most of the time, did not result in much transmission that we know of.
  9. Hard to imagine that Japanese don’t spend more than 18.7 times as much time inside as outside? It would be useful to know whether the infamous Italian soccer match superspreader event was because of the shouting and singing outdoors, or the drinking festivities in bars before and after the game.

  10. Let’s have a good laugh , you know how they hate that .

  11. Personally, I have air purifiers with Hepa filters in my house, going full speed whenever I have a visitor, even with a mask.
    I trust they filter the entire room air every 5 minutes or so. I suppose that greatly reduces infection ristk.
    Certainly, it is very difficult to catch the Coronavirus in open air, with a filter and 8 feet social distance.
    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily. What more will we close down?

    • Replies: @The Alarmist

    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily. What more will we close down?
     
    Oh, the plan for the next round is to have everyone dig holes in their garden and just crawl in.
    , @Reg Cæsar

    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily.
     
    Ebola doesn't spread easily. It kills its victims too quickly.

    There is probably a "sweet spot" for pandemic disease, deadly-but-not-too-deadly. Anyone know the "medicalculus" of this?
    , @Lugash
    Dr. John Campbell has suggested having businesses open their doors and windows as a means of circulating air and reducing any airborne virus. Seems like a good idea in the parts of the country that aren't too hot yet. It also keeps you from grabbing a door handle like everyone else who comes in or out.
  12. Unfortunately, I’m not exactly sure how to interpret this 18.7 figure.

    It means you should probably get out of your writing closet more often, or at the very least not let anyone else in.

    Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group? Leaving aside the issue of multiple strains for the present argument, that is. Wouldn’t it mean you no longer have to worry so much? For those of us who aren’t convinced it’s all a big hoax, I mean. Couldn’t you resume some facsimile of normal life, along with others in the same boat?

    Is this what the immunity passport people are talking about? Ah, I see that it is. But the devil is in the details, no? That is, how do we ensure Diversity, Incusion, and Equity? Surely the Numinous Ones should qualify without testing, right? Maybe we can link this with the college-admissions thread.

    • Replies: @Polynikes

    it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?
     
    Not only for yourself but for society as a whole (I mean we're all about sacrificing for society these days right?). Had universities and schools not been closed we might be most of the way to herd immunity by now. Had we focused all our resources and attention on elder care homes we might even have gotten to herd immunity without some of the loss of life we've seen.

    There is really no reason not to open up at this point (maybe with some basic social distancing practices still in place). It also seems to me it is better to have the majority of the population catch this through the summer than wait and have it pick back up again in the fall and winter. That would potentially needlessly crowd the hospitals as the regular flu season kicks in too.
  13. So much for “Stay Inside; Stay Safe …”

    • Replies: @Meretricious
    It all depends on how many Africans are outside.
  14. @Sincerity.net
    Personally, I have air purifiers with Hepa filters in my house, going full speed whenever I have a visitor, even with a mask.
    I trust they filter the entire room air every 5 minutes or so. I suppose that greatly reduces infection ristk.
    Certainly, it is very difficult to catch the Coronavirus in open air, with a filter and 8 feet social distance.
    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily. What more will we close down?

    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily. What more will we close down?

    Oh, the plan for the next round is to have everyone dig holes in their garden and just crawl in.

  15. Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?

    Because we don’t know for certain yet whether people who “get over it” are in fact unscathed. I think the way Coronavirus 19 damages so many organs is cause for concern. Some viruses hide in T-cells, others in other organs.

    It is best for a group of young, healthy, feckless morons to volunteer to be guinea pigs. Not that the target group I have in mind would do so willingly or for altruistic reasons. More of a “you can’t make me wear a mask” mentality. Serves the same purpose.

    OT: Had anyone spotted TD lately?

    • Replies: @Meretricious
    You'd think that TD would be all over this one, what with the differential rates of affliction. Maybe he's been hired by the House Ways and Means Committee.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/WaysMeansCmte/status/1257001477958238211?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Eembeddedtimeline%7Ctwterm%5Eprofile%3AWaysMeansCmte%7Ctwcon%5Etimelinechrome&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwaysandmeans.house.gov%2F

    , @Eagle Eye


    Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?

     

    Because we don’t know for certain yet whether people who “get over it” are in fact unscathed.
     
    We have many thousands of KNOWN individuals who were found to have been infected in March. It can't be too hard to go back and check how many of these were INFECTED AGAIN since.

    Related point - how many formerly infected patients now have ANTIBODIES?

    Lastly - how many different strains are we looking at in the U.S. and worldwide? How does a history of infection with one strain affect the course and outcome of a later infection with another strain?

    The apparent lack of such simple data is entirely unrelated to the fact that the TPTB and their friends are making a lot of MONEY, and arrogating to themselves a lot of unconstitutional POWER, while the UNCERTAINTY continues.

  16. I wish Americans could do contact tracing and write papers like that one.

  17. @The Alarmist
    So much for "Stay Inside; Stay Safe ..."

    It all depends on how many Africans are outside.

  18. @James Speaks

    Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?
     
    Because we don’t know for certain yet whether people who “get over it” are in fact unscathed. I think the way Coronavirus 19 damages so many organs is cause for concern. Some viruses hide in T-cells, others in other organs.

    It is best for a group of young, healthy, feckless morons to volunteer to be guinea pigs. Not that the target group I have in mind would do so willingly or for altruistic reasons. More of a “you can’t make me wear a mask” mentality. Serves the same purpose.

    OT: Had anyone spotted TD lately?

    You’d think that TD would be all over this one, what with the differential rates of affliction. Maybe he’s been hired by the House Ways and Means Committee.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/WaysMeansCmte/status/1257001477958238211?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Eembeddedtimeline%7Ctwterm%5Eprofile%3AWaysMeansCmte%7Ctwcon%5Etimelinechrome&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwaysandmeans.house.gov%2F

    • Replies: @BenKenobi
    The-person-who-thinks-they-are-TD was initially bragging-by-proxy about how Africa and assorted American blegs were the least-hardest hit by Corona-Chan (pbuh). Now that America's saintly founding stock have been revealed to be the biggest victims, he/she/it has only posted a few drive-by non-sequitur comments in the past few weeks.

    Of course, Coronavinus is still at large, and presumed faggy.
  19. Sounds like it would be a good idea for the Catholic Church to resurrect the old custom from under the Penal Laws and start doing open-air Masses on hills and meadows (with proper spacing)… or parking lots, in modern cities. (Kneeling on pavement can serve as much-needed penance). Unfortunately, our highest-ranking prelates largely don’t believe in their own religion, so resuming access to the sacraments isn’t pressingly urgent for most of them.

  20. There’s a bar chart at the bottom of the preprint from which one can make a guess at their raw data, which seems pretty sparse. I’ll try to write it in a comprehensible way:
    Of the 110 primary cases:
    83 (77 outside, 6 inside) had no secondary transmission;
    16 ( 7 outside, 9 inside) had one secondary transmission;
    4 ( 1 outside, 3 inside) had 2 secondaries;
    4 ( 1 outside, 3 inside) had 3 secondaries;
    1 inside had 4 secondaries;
    1 inside had 9 secondaries;
    1 inside had 12 secondaries.

    My take-aways are: 75% had no secondary transmission, period. Secondary transmission to a single person is just as likely indoors or outdoors (not surprising); however, secondary transmission to more than one other person is increasingly unlikely, but if it happens it’s going to be indoors. The sample size seems to small to make any quantitative judgements about relative risks.

  21. By all means, Governor Baker, let’s protect everyone safe by keeping the golf courses closed!

  22. @Anon
    Steve, did you read the pre-print? There is no data at all in this article. With the exception of outdoor environments that are jam-packed with people (Mardi Gras, Chinese New Year, etc.) I have yet to see any evidence that a single transmission has occurred outdoors. There seems to be increasing evidence that prolonged exposure (>15 min) in an enclosed space is required for transmission of enough viral load to cause a symptomatic case of Covid.

    Mardi Gras is about 10% of the time outdoors watching a parade or group of people and about 90% of the time in a packed bar or restaurant. I suspect skiing is similar. People didn’t catch it on the slopes but on the plane to and fro, and late in the evenings as they piled into bars and lodges to drink and socialize up close. Something like spring break, where the participants really are outdoors most of the time, did not result in much transmission that we know of.

  23. @Mr McKenna

    Unfortunately, I’m not exactly sure how to interpret this 18.7 figure.
     

    It means you should probably get out of your writing closet more often, or at the very least not let anyone else in.

    Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn't better to get exposed, so long as you're not in a serious risk group? Leaving aside the issue of multiple strains for the present argument, that is. Wouldn't it mean you no longer have to worry so much? For those of us who aren't convinced it's all a big hoax, I mean. Couldn't you resume some facsimile of normal life, along with others in the same boat?

    Is this what the immunity passport people are talking about? Ah, I see that it is. But the devil is in the details, no? That is, how do we ensure Diversity, Incusion, and Equity? Surely the Numinous Ones should qualify without testing, right? Maybe we can link this with the college-admissions thread.

    it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?

    Not only for yourself but for society as a whole (I mean we’re all about sacrificing for society these days right?). Had universities and schools not been closed we might be most of the way to herd immunity by now. Had we focused all our resources and attention on elder care homes we might even have gotten to herd immunity without some of the loss of life we’ve seen.

    There is really no reason not to open up at this point (maybe with some basic social distancing practices still in place). It also seems to me it is better to have the majority of the population catch this through the summer than wait and have it pick back up again in the fall and winter. That would potentially needlessly crowd the hospitals as the regular flu season kicks in too.

  24. @Anonymous
    Seems the current wild escalation of Negroes acting out on airplanes would be a better target for public shaming.

    If only major media outlets didn’t have written in the starting page of their reporters style books that black people are a small step below regular humans, so their primitive behavior is to be tolerated, regardless of the social price they will inevitably pay in the long run, because attempting to bring Negroes up to the standards of modern civilization will only waste our time, and needlessly puzzle the Negroes.

    Meanwhile, on a flight from Los Angeles to Detroit...

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/brawl-breaks-out-on-spirit-airlines-flight-over-noise-complaint/

    And in Detroit...

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/father-son-sought-in-security-guard-slaying-over-coronavirus-mask/

    And in Detroit…

    Flint is not “in Detroit”. Or even close. It’s farther away than Toledo.

  25. @Anonymous
    Seems the current wild escalation of Negroes acting out on airplanes would be a better target for public shaming.

    If only major media outlets didn’t have written in the starting page of their reporters style books that black people are a small step below regular humans, so their primitive behavior is to be tolerated, regardless of the social price they will inevitably pay in the long run, because attempting to bring Negroes up to the standards of modern civilization will only waste our time, and needlessly puzzle the Negroes.

    Meanwhile, on a flight from Los Angeles to Detroit...

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/brawl-breaks-out-on-spirit-airlines-flight-over-noise-complaint/

    And in Detroit...

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/father-son-sought-in-security-guard-slaying-over-coronavirus-mask/

    Anon 168,

    It wasn’t Detroit – it was Flint (which is per capital even more dangerous than Detroit.)

    But you left out the interesting part: the middle name of the suspect shooter:

    “Travon”

    (The more likely a baby’s name is “Travon”, the more likely . . .?)

    Steve posted on this theme years ago.

  26. @Sincerity.net
    Personally, I have air purifiers with Hepa filters in my house, going full speed whenever I have a visitor, even with a mask.
    I trust they filter the entire room air every 5 minutes or so. I suppose that greatly reduces infection ristk.
    Certainly, it is very difficult to catch the Coronavirus in open air, with a filter and 8 feet social distance.
    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily. What more will we close down?

    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily.

    Ebola doesn’t spread easily. It kills its victims too quickly.

    There is probably a “sweet spot” for pandemic disease, deadly-but-not-too-deadly. Anyone know the “medicalculus” of this?

  27. @Sincerity.net
    Personally, I have air purifiers with Hepa filters in my house, going full speed whenever I have a visitor, even with a mask.
    I trust they filter the entire room air every 5 minutes or so. I suppose that greatly reduces infection ristk.
    Certainly, it is very difficult to catch the Coronavirus in open air, with a filter and 8 feet social distance.
    I wonder what will happen if ever Ebola or worse become pandemic. Really deadly disease that can spread more easily. What more will we close down?

    Dr. John Campbell has suggested having businesses open their doors and windows as a means of circulating air and reducing any airborne virus. Seems like a good idea in the parts of the country that aren’t too hot yet. It also keeps you from grabbing a door handle like everyone else who comes in or out.

  28. The Outer Banks have been closed to non residents, even nonresident property owners. Plenty of beltway poobahs own property there. And if they ain’t going to the beach, ain’t nobody going to the beach.

  29. The World Military Games held in Wuhan in late Oct 2019 may have been the original super-spreader event.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Military_World_Games

  30. Odds That a Primary Case Transmitted COVID-19 in a Closed Environment Was 18.7 Times Greater Compared to an Open-Air Environment

    Odds that such a ratio could actually be stated to three significant figures? About zero.

    • Replies: @res
    Especially given the confidence interval: "95% confidence interval [CI]: 6.0, 57.9"
    Hard to be confident in even one significant digit there.
  31. @Mr. Anon

    Odds That a Primary Case Transmitted COVID-19 in a Closed Environment Was 18.7 Times Greater Compared to an Open-Air Environment
     
    Odds that such a ratio could actually be stated to three significant figures? About zero.

    Especially given the confidence interval: “95% confidence interval [CI]: 6.0, 57.9”
    Hard to be confident in even one significant digit there.

  32. @lambdaphagy
    It appears that the authors are looking at transmission events and counting how many occurred outside vs. inside. They find, as one might expect, that there are many more cases of indoor transmission vs. outdoor. But if you don't compare that ratio to the baseline of how much time people spend indoors vs. outdoors, it's difficult to draw normative conclusions. If indoor transmission events are 19x more frequent, but being indoors in the first place is 23x more probable, then outdoors would be *more* dangerous for you per unit time.

    It still seems plausible to me that being outdoors is less risky ceteris paribus, but I don't think this paper actually establishes that.

    It still seems plausible to me that being outdoors is less risky ceteris paribus, but I don’t think this paper actually establishes that.

    Well, it is well established that sunlight kills the virus. Which is probably why they’re trying to herd all the homeless into motels.

  33. @Meretricious
    You'd think that TD would be all over this one, what with the differential rates of affliction. Maybe he's been hired by the House Ways and Means Committee.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/WaysMeansCmte/status/1257001477958238211?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Eembeddedtimeline%7Ctwterm%5Eprofile%3AWaysMeansCmte%7Ctwcon%5Etimelinechrome&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwaysandmeans.house.gov%2F

    The-person-who-thinks-they-are-TD was initially bragging-by-proxy about how Africa and assorted American blegs were the least-hardest hit by Corona-Chan (pbuh). Now that America’s saintly founding stock have been revealed to be the biggest victims, he/she/it has only posted a few drive-by non-sequitur comments in the past few weeks.

    Of course, Coronavinus is still at large, and presumed faggy.

    • LOL: William Badwhite
    • Replies: @William Badwhite

    Of course, Coronavinus is still at large, and presumed faggy.
     
    No, you are wrong. You fail to NOTICE Mr. Kenobi your own biases and fake news. You MEANT to say that Coronavinus is an excellent noticer and not just an ankle-biting halfwit

    https://media.agonybooth.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/06053827/flare.jpg
  34. Why do we call this Bug COVID 19 when we could just as accurately call it SARS 2? Given its symptoms which at their extreme are killing a lot of people, what could be a better way to describe the Bug than Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome 2 ? Calling it COVID 19 just associates it with bunch of relatively harmless flues; this association may be epidemiologically correct but is existentially deceptive. This Bug can be a mean mother. COVID 19 seems innocuous. SARS or Sever Acute Respiratory Syndrome 2 seems more threatening – scary actually from my point of view.

    Ok, I have been to the epidemiological sites. They say SARS 2 is the cause and COVID 19 the disease. Naturally it is the disease that is foremost on our minds. But when the epidemiologists define SARS and COVID 19, they seem like the same thing. Epidemiologists seem like they are making a distinction without a difference. Meanwhile when I hear a victim of this disease say she felt like she had an elephant on her chest, I think Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome and not Corona Virus . So why not call the Bug SARS 2? That way we expressively capture its potential severity. We also recognize that this is the second time in a generation that we have been exposed to a virus with an origin in the same place although the consequences of SARS 1 were significantly less severe

    • Agree: Inverness
  35. @Anonymous
    Seems the current wild escalation of Negroes acting out on airplanes would be a better target for public shaming.

    If only major media outlets didn’t have written in the starting page of their reporters style books that black people are a small step below regular humans, so their primitive behavior is to be tolerated, regardless of the social price they will inevitably pay in the long run, because attempting to bring Negroes up to the standards of modern civilization will only waste our time, and needlessly puzzle the Negroes.

    Meanwhile, on a flight from Los Angeles to Detroit...

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/brawl-breaks-out-on-spirit-airlines-flight-over-noise-complaint/

    And in Detroit...

    https://nypost.com/2020/05/04/father-son-sought-in-security-guard-slaying-over-coronavirus-mask/

    Wish “jet set” still had a place in our world.

    Including on the ground.

  36. @BenKenobi
    The-person-who-thinks-they-are-TD was initially bragging-by-proxy about how Africa and assorted American blegs were the least-hardest hit by Corona-Chan (pbuh). Now that America's saintly founding stock have been revealed to be the biggest victims, he/she/it has only posted a few drive-by non-sequitur comments in the past few weeks.

    Of course, Coronavinus is still at large, and presumed faggy.

    Of course, Coronavinus is still at large, and presumed faggy.

    No, you are wrong. You fail to NOTICE Mr. Kenobi your own biases and fake news. You MEANT to say that Coronavinus is an excellent noticer and not just an ankle-biting halfwit

  37. @James Speaks

    Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?
     
    Because we don’t know for certain yet whether people who “get over it” are in fact unscathed. I think the way Coronavirus 19 damages so many organs is cause for concern. Some viruses hide in T-cells, others in other organs.

    It is best for a group of young, healthy, feckless morons to volunteer to be guinea pigs. Not that the target group I have in mind would do so willingly or for altruistic reasons. More of a “you can’t make me wear a mask” mentality. Serves the same purpose.

    OT: Had anyone spotted TD lately?

    Separately: will someone please tell me why it isn’t better to get exposed, so long as you’re not in a serious risk group?

    Because we don’t know for certain yet whether people who “get over it” are in fact unscathed.

    We have many thousands of KNOWN individuals who were found to have been infected in March. It can’t be too hard to go back and check how many of these were INFECTED AGAIN since.

    Related point – how many formerly infected patients now have ANTIBODIES?

    Lastly – how many different strains are we looking at in the U.S. and worldwide? How does a history of infection with one strain affect the course and outcome of a later infection with another strain?

    The apparent lack of such simple data is entirely unrelated to the fact that the TPTB and their friends are making a lot of MONEY, and arrogating to themselves a lot of unconstitutional POWER, while the UNCERTAINTY continues.

  38. Idiots. Being indoors with other people, visitors, etc., is of course more dangerous than outdoors. You don’t need a study for that. On the other hand, if you stay indoors alone. Or with your family who are also staying indoors with you, you are much safer than out there mingling, indoors or outdoors.

    What is most dangerous is going to the hospital. They don’t take care of you there. They are afraid to touch you if you have it. They just leave you in a room to rot, those great heroes of medical care, ventilator destroying your lungs if the virus don’t.

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