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From a book review in the New York Times:
Ayaan Hirsi Ali on Muslim Men and Western Women
By Jill Filipovic
Jill Filipovic is a journalist and the author of “OK Boomer, Let’s Talk: How My Generation Got Left Behind” and “The H-Spot: The Feminist Pursuit of Happiness.”
Feb. 9, 2021PREY: Immigration, Islam, and the Erosion of Women’s Rights
By Ayaan Hirsi Ali… “Prey: Immigration, Islam, and the Erosion of Women’s Rights” argues that immigration from majority-Muslim countries imperils the hard-won rights of European women. Muslim men, who are by Hirsi Ali’s telling accustomed to gender-segregated societies in which female modesty is mandated and women are harassed out of public life, arrived in Europe in droves during the previous decade’s migration crisis, bringing old orthodoxies — and violent enforcement of them — to their new Northern homes. As a result, she says, European women face endemic sexual harassment and violence. Even worse, in an effort to not be seen as xenophobic or feed into rising right-wing nationalism, liberal Europeans are complicit in their own mounting oppression, playing down misogyny as mere multiculturalism even as Western women are criminally assaulted, told to cover their bodies and driven from the streets of their own cities. Hirsi Ali calls for a new feminist movement, one in which true feminists are “prepared to stand up for the rights of all women” and coalesce around the issue of “women’s safety from predatory men.”
Those are certainly laudable goals for a feminist movement, which is precisely why you may be wondering: Isn’t that what feminists have been doing this whole time?
Who can forget all the feminist marches in Rotherham back in 2005?
It is. Feminists the world over have agitated for greater freedoms for women, putting the right to be free of male violence at the center of their work and steadily rejecting the argument that patriarchal abuses are excusable in any culture. So it’s rather odd to see Hirsi Ali claim that feminists have created a near-paradise of liberalism for women in the Western world, and then accuse them of failing to adequately care about women’s rights because they also want their homelands to open doors to seekers of safe harbor, regardless of religion. But this is the one-two punch of “Prey”: Swear allegiance to Western liberalism, then push ideas and policies that would undermine it.
Western Liberalism is about knowing who are the Bad Guys and who are the Good Guys. You can tell them apart not by how they behave but by who they are. White Men are Bad and Muslim immigrants are Good. Why does Ayaan Hirsi Ali find these simple facts confusing?
It’s a dizzying rhetorical style, and succeeds only in knocking out straw men.
In seeking to make the case that hordes of sexually violent Muslim men are setting back women’s rights in Europe, Hirsi Ali excavates crime data, newspaper articles and social science research. She speaks with a handful of law enforcement officials, people who work on immigrant assimilation efforts and average citizens. She laudably admits that the data are extremely limited, but that doesn’t stop her from insisting that they nevertheless support her claims. She shares horrifying news stories of women and girls harassed, assaulted and raped by Muslim asylum-seekers to bolster her thesis. If readers didn’t know any better, they would come away with the impression that most sex crimes in Western Europe are committed by Muslim migrants against European female strangers. They aren’t — the men who pose the biggest threat to European women are the same category of men who pose the biggest threat to women everywhere: men whom women know.
For example, each and everyone of those 14 year old English girls in Rotherham knew her Muslim pimp. Follow The Science!
Similarly, the biggest cause of structure fires are accidental and natural causes, so extremists who are anti-arson are obvious bigots.
Hirsi Ali understands that she’s generalizing, she writes; she’s not saying all Muslim men are rapists. But she is saying that young men from conservative Muslim societies arrive in Europe — and most of the new arrivals are young men — having been previously steeped in profoundly misogynistic cultures and subject to laws that offer women fewer rights than men. That impacts how they behave, she claims, something Western liberals, who worship at the altar of cultural relativism, don’t want to recognize. “When it comes to migrants and minorities,” she writes, “pointing to cultural explanations for their behavior toward women is taboo.”
But is it? In the same book, Hirsi Ali rightly excoriates a German judge for acquitting a credibly accused rapist by making “allowances for migrant sex offenders’ lack of understanding of Western women’s sexual self-determination.” Is the problem that it’s taboo to point to cultural factors that drive sexual violence? Or is it that European authorities too often excuse sexual violence at the hands of Muslim immigrants by pointing to cultural factors?
Maybe Europeans should point to Muslim countries’ cultural factors when considering whom to let in to Europe, but then point to European cultural factors when judging violations of European norms against abusing women?
… It could also be said to be cut through with bigotry. Hirsi Ali seems to latch onto the trope of men of color threatening virtuous white women, a particular kind of fearmongering with a long and ugly history. European colonists saw their endeavors not simply as extractive, but as civilizing; to make that work, they doubled down on the idea of African and Arab men as sexually aggressive and uncontrolled, and white women their desired victims. European settlers worried about “the Black peril” of African rapists, which was also used to justify colonialism and the pervasive racist violence that went with it. During the French occupation of Germany after World War I, German newspapers sounded the (false) alarm about a “Black plague” of mass rapes and murders by Senegalese troops in the French Army. (Hitler, true to form, blamed the Jews for bringing in the Africans.) And Hirsi Ali, who emphasizes the importance of assimilation and now lives in the United States, is surely not ignorant of this country’s own history. “Make any list of anti-Black terrorism in the United States, and you’ll also have a list of attacks justified by the specter of Black rape,” Jamelle Bouie wrote in 2015, after Dylann Roof murdered nine people in Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church and reportedly told the Black congregation, “You rape our women, and you’re taking over our country, and you have to go.” Donald Trump, the most xenophobic American president in living memory, often used the threat of white girls being raped by immigrant men to justify his draconian immigration policies.
Hirsi Ali does skew this old narrative just a bit: Instead of being virtuous for their submissiveness, maternity or innocence — the usual rendering of white women in need of protection — European women in “Prey” are virtuous for their liberal feminist values, and also vulnerable because of them. But this is where Hirsi Ali gives away the game. After spending much of the book portraying herself as a defender of these very values, by the end, she’s ready to give them up if it means keeping certain immigrants out.
Letting all immigrants in should be Europe’s highest value.
Her proposed solutions include ramping up policing, harsher criminal penalties and intrusions into personal privacy. Even as she says she has “thought deeply about the seeming paradox of using illiberal means to achieve liberal ends,” she ultimately decides that the ends indeed justify the means — even “privacy-obsessed Germans,” she posits, could be persuaded to accept the use of video surveillance, artificial intelligence and facial recognition technology in “troubled neighborhoods.”
Video surveillance, artificial intelligence, and facial recognition technology must be used on Trump supporters, but not on rapey refugees.
… Whether Hirsi Ali herself, who wore the hijab as a teenager and supported the fatwa against Salman Rushdie, would have qualified for asylum under her rules is an outstanding question.
Gotcha!
Yet this is where her illiberalism truly shines through. “All liberal institutions are predicated on this idea,” she writes approvingly, that “the individual, whether male or female, is recognized as a decision-maker responsible for his or her behavior.” Central to this concept of liberal individualism is an antagonism to collective punishment, and the idea that individual responsibility means one person’s wrongdoing doesn’t implicate his family, his entire race or his religious group. No such concept of individual rights and responsibilities exists in the Muslim world, she says, where group identity takes precedence. It’s why, she writes, Muslims have a “victimhood complex” when sex crimes laws, which they believe are invalid in the first place, are enforced against Muslim men: “Because the individual is inextricably linked to the group, condemnation of the individual is considered vilification of the group.”
It’s Hirsi Ali, though, who does exactly this: She finds stories of individual Muslim immigrants who commit heinous crimes, and by suggesting those stories are broadly representative, uses them to justify curtailing the opportunities afforded to the whole group.
The opportunity of non-Europeans to move to Europe, which is the most sacred of all European rights.
This is not, as she suggests, a feminism of standing up for the rights of women. It is a feminism of reaction — and one that would undermine the very liberal values Hirsi Ali begs feminists to protect.
True liberalism is a suicide pact.
The world is approaching an isteve singularity, with the rate of insane “news” from the NYT diverging to ∞.
NO! This cannot be true!!!
Hear that? So if you even think of “blaming the jews” for bringing in Africans, well we know what you are, don’t we!
The solution to the flood of criminal third-worlders is greater freedom for women.
Also, the solution for psoriasis is seeding the clouds with silver iodide crystals.
We’re approaching an isteve singularity, with the rate insane articles from the NYT diverging to ∞.
Shale boys fighting against all odds, with the new administration regulations.
When the Visigoths sacked Rome in 410 AD legend states that decadent Roman matrons wondered eagerly when the rapes would begin. And who says history doesn’t repeat itself?
But this is the one-two punch of “Prey”:Swear allegiance to Western liberalism, then push ideas and policies that would undermine it.
This is ,per usual, IMAX level projection. It is the immigration uber alles advocates that do this on a wholesale scale.
You are on fire with your posts lately, Steve. I guess the New York Times is your fuel.
I have a better idea than reading either of these two woman’s writing, for the rest of us anyway, as it’s your job, Steve. Let’s quit listening to women spouting off on any of this feminist garbage to begin with. Let the Moslems do things the way they like to, but in the Moslem world. Let the men run the Western World again, so we can have a society build on law and justice again rather than compassion.*
I don’t want to hear from either of these broads. When the financial SHTF comes, all this talk will be of no use to anyone.
.
* Men have compassion too, but, since they look farther away than just the noses in front of their faces, that compassion for their kind often involves doing the tough things for the short run… like sending people the hell home.
I invite Jill Filipovic to spend a weekend wandering around Malmo in a mini-skirt
Hirsi Ali should call Filipovic out on her white privilege, daring to explain away and diminish the experiences of a woman of color! More like woke privilege in action, or Filipovic would never have dared criticize a POC.
I have to admit, she’s quite good at implying that certain things are merely the product of the author’s fevered imagination: “Muslim men, who are by Hirsi Ali’s telling accustomed to gender-segregated societies in which female modesty is mandated and women are harassed out of public life . . .” Really? We only have Hirsi Ali’s word on that, do we?
And that idea that black men are interested in white women? All these black male/white female couples are purely coincidental! I used to live in a town with a significant Somali immigrant population. A coworker who had very long and striking red hair used to field marriage proposals from random Somali men who were fascinated by her hair.
The less of that garbage, the better.
The book reviewer …
OK--I'm exaggerating a bit, but still, ...
I have no dog in this hunt but I’m always puzzled with book reviews that quickly turn into arguments with the book, much like interviews that quickly reveal themselves to be arguments with the interview subject. It’s always the reviewer or interviewer making it all about themselves rather than the source material.
Filipovic at least holds back for several paragraphs before launching into her own op-ed reply, but then it’s off to the races as usual for the NYT.
That did NOT happen! Which proves that such fears are always ungrounded, and that this did NOT happen either:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marocchinate
Women in the West are too spoiled. Feminism has gone too far in promoting hook up culture, women dressing like hookers, and esp. in Europe, nude and topless beaches. Somehow, Hirsi Ali wants to protect these liberal values, while the self-proclaimed feminist and uber liberal Filipovic believes men who attack these values should be invited in. Strange world we live in.
They got her with the good old trope-a-dope. Ali said something that reminds the writer of something someone else supposedly once said. So her point is invalid. Rhetoric 101.
I would never occur to a NYT writer that a “trope” exists because reality causes different people to repeatedly come to the same conclusions.
Doesn’t help that most prostitutes in the West, lingerie models, porn stars and near-porn stars in Hollywood are white women. Even elementary school girls in my neighborhood are wearing spaghetti strap tops and short shorts (with their butt cheeks hanging out) to school on warm days. Maybe having more Muslim men to come in and attack these vaunted “liberal values” isn’t such a bad thing.
No, Western men and women are supposed to set appropriate norms for their young. Constraining the dress, behavior and especially sexual behavior of young women to support a culture of marriage and reproduction that actually reproduces the culture--its norms, values and skills--intact, is pretty much job #1. (Cultures that do not reproduce themselves do not survive. Math.)
That this is even an issue, is because of the degeneration we've seen in the West because of minoritarianism and feminism: The continual attack on white, Western Christian people and culture, the attack on parental authority, the attack on majority rule and republican government and having our culture steeped in all the crap from degenerate Hollyweird.
The West--the part that wants to survive--needs to drive out the minoritarian garbage in our midst. The last thing in the world we need is more minoritarian garbage of a muslim hue.
(And note: I've got nothing against Arabs or Muslims. Enjoyed my brief time in their lands. Met some good folks. But that's where they and their culture belong. Not in the West.)
I would never occur to a NYT writer that a "trope" exists because reality causes different people to repeatedly come to the same conclusions.Replies: @The Last Real Calvinist
‘trope-a-dope’ is excellent, HypnoToad; thanks much.
The Muslim apostate Nonie Darwish once argued that a Western Feminist movement is very unlikely in Dar Al Islam. The reason is that Muslims women see the oppressive strictures around them as badges of honor. More importantly, they seem to like to rat out women who do not conform to the customs of Sharia. Unity among Muslim women is very unlikely.
Having said that, I don’t think an observer of Muslim society from a century or two ago would ever imagine Jihadi terrorists strapping bombs to the chests of their women and asking them to blow themselves up in the service of Allah. Maybe I am being facetious but it looks like that the drive to have female suicide bombers is partially an attempt by conservative Muslims to co-opt the Western feminist movement. They tell their girls that they are equal in the eyes of Allah if they blow themselves up and take a few infidels with them.
Those who don't are either 'passed it' or have some other hang up, either way, they are the deviants from the female norm, and the provocatively dressed are the mainstream. Hence some of the harshest and shrillest critics of the provocatively dressed are older women.
Now, in Islamic societies, dress codes, in the final analysis are policed, using religious justification, by a male patriarchy, which - unlike the west - has power. The patriarchy is strong enough to impose 'voluntary' adherence by young women, who have internalized the strong signalling to be 'pious'.
Muslims, no full well, that once the patriarchy goes, even 'pious' women will, naturally, fall into their proclivities, and behave no different to western women.
The natural female instinct is not to 'band together' but to to compete with each other in terms of allure.Replies: @Steve Sailer
NYT journalist Jill Filipovic reports, “Donald Trump … often used the threat of white girls being raped by immigrant men to justify his draconian immigration policies.”
Donald Trump has been a tweeter and public speaker for many years, so there must be a lot of evidence for Filipovic’s thesis. Ms. Filipovic, please quote these tweets and produce these video clips.
It’s also set to have a long and ugly future, because it’s the reality – not a “trope” – we’ve brought on ourselves with immigration.
In the US we had those stupid pussy-hat marches against Trump for whatever vague reasons they had; he’s bad, a sexist, yada yada. Nothing about what might in reality be inimical to the quality of life for actual women is ever addressed. Feminist leadership is a paid group with the mass of followers being just followers of fashion, useful idiots mostly.
From Wikipedia
Sophia Loren was in a movie where her daughter was raped by Moroccan troops:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Women
If you want another one, read the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. WWI with German atrocities in a French village. Plot spoiler: everybody dies.
Relevant cartoon:
https://postimg.cc/CRgkzDZ5
Ali and Fillipovic are embematic of two types of women. Non Western women get the hell beat out of them regularly. Mostly by their spouses who are layabouts who don’t work. Laziness is the genetic heritage of much of the Third World male population. Instead its competing to be the best fighters, singers, dancers, etc.
For women like Ali who had her lady parts mutilated, a Western beta male White guy is a prize. He won’t beat her, will actually work and not just at the job but at home too, and is generally pleasant and agreeable and very, very dutiful.
White women despise that kind of man. Women like Fillipovic who by her photo is attractive, HATE HATE HATE the White Western beta male. The kind of guy who is attentive, polite, and …. horrors … nice. What she wants is a warlord. Or aspiring rapper. They are one and the same. Now Europe is flooded with EXACTLY the kind of men she wants: IQ south of 75, violent, impulsive, abusive, DANGEROUS. Like a sparkly gay brutally violent vampire of her own. Or a bondage cruel billionaire.
The Rapefugees are there because White women, from Mutti Merkel on down, wanted them there. Period. White women neither want nor care about dutifulness and loyalty and niceness. They want danger and brutality. I suspect they will get it, and probably will be delighted by it.
If you observe something, and someone in the past observed it, that means it isn’t true.
Sort of like how if you say that George Soros is doing something bad, that’s like what people said about Jews in the past, so by definition it’s untrue.
A fact that is being passed over in all of this is that Islam, real Islam places enormous value on sexual continence – and punishes transgressors of sexual continence with the utmost severity.
Vide, in a real Islamic society rapists and sexual molesters of women would either be killed out of hand or publicly beaten.
By the same token the western world, which is largely a ‘United States of Pornography’ in which adultery is taken as about as seriously littering, would to a true Muslim be a disgusting, filthy Sodom and Gomorrah which would taint and contaminate the pious by the mere act of breathing the same air as the swinish infidel.
My contention is that the huge numbers of Muslims currently flooding Europe – for the sake of Mammon and Mammon alone, are the real hypocrites and deceivers. If they were truly pious, they wouldn’t come to the west for the sake of their children’s souls, something that no material price can be put on. After all, they have no guarantee whatsoever that their grandchildren will not be seduced from the path of the righteous and on to the path of deviancy, and it must be said the powers of the seducers in the western world are stronger than the powers that their faith can muster.
Islam values sexual continence in women only, and anything men do to women, the women were asking for it.
The religious risk comes from their children and grandchildren, who rebel against the religious indifference of their parents.Replies: @Mr. XYZ
Jilly belongs to this “march” ….
=> sexist!
"Islam is wrong about women."
=> Islamophobic!
------
Same energy:
"How do you occupy an idiot?
(see other side)"
"How do you occupy an idiot?
(see other side)"
> "If you look at history 1400 years ago, women in Islam got granted rights that women in the west do not have."
> Shrill shrieking. "No No No"Muslims see this and know their ancestors were very wise.Also:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXWlQxUNFLY"That's what happens when you leave tumblr haha"
Her looks scream, “Harem Porn Reader”.
Having said that, I don't think an observer of Muslim society from a century or two ago would ever imagine Jihadi terrorists strapping bombs to the chests of their women and asking them to blow themselves up in the service of Allah. Maybe I am being facetious but it looks like that the drive to have female suicide bombers is partially an attempt by conservative Muslims to co-opt the Western feminist movement. They tell their girls that they are equal in the eyes of Allah if they blow themselves up and take a few infidels with them.Replies: @Anonymous
Women’s inherent character is always to dress as provocatively as possible.
Those who don’t are either ‘passed it’ or have some other hang up, either way, they are the deviants from the female norm, and the provocatively dressed are the mainstream. Hence some of the harshest and shrillest critics of the provocatively dressed are older women.
Now, in Islamic societies, dress codes, in the final analysis are policed, using religious justification, by a male patriarchy, which – unlike the west – has power. The patriarchy is strong enough to impose ‘voluntary’ adherence by young women, who have internalized the strong signalling to be ‘pious’.
Muslims, no full well, that once the patriarchy goes, even ‘pious’ women will, naturally, fall into their proclivities, and behave no different to western women.
The natural female instinct is not to ‘band together’ but to to compete with each other in terms of allure.
Those who don't are either 'passed it' or have some other hang up, either way, they are the deviants from the female norm, and the provocatively dressed are the mainstream. Hence some of the harshest and shrillest critics of the provocatively dressed are older women.
Now, in Islamic societies, dress codes, in the final analysis are policed, using religious justification, by a male patriarchy, which - unlike the west - has power. The patriarchy is strong enough to impose 'voluntary' adherence by young women, who have internalized the strong signalling to be 'pious'.
Muslims, no full well, that once the patriarchy goes, even 'pious' women will, naturally, fall into their proclivities, and behave no different to western women.
The natural female instinct is not to 'band together' but to to compete with each other in terms of allure.Replies: @Steve Sailer
“Women’s inherent character is always to dress as provocatively as possible.”
Nah, most women are sensitive to social norms about what is respectable. They try to push the envelope within a fairly narrow band of what is proper in this time and place.
If patriarchy well and truly vanishes, as it almost has done in the west, reality will kick in.
One of the wonders of the internet, obscenity and all, is that it shows what the human species actually *is* - shielded from norms and consequences - and not what the species is 'supposed' to be.
It is both.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZHuFah0udsReplies: @Almost Missouri, @El Dato
“Islam is right about women.”
=> sexist!
“Islam is wrong about women.”
=> Islamophobic!
——
Same energy:
“How do you occupy an idiot?
(see other side)”
“How do you occupy an idiot?
(see other side)”
Women also respond to what men want.
In family-centered cultures (like that of the Muslims), men won’t marry the town “slut” because it’ll disappoint their mother.
In individualistic cultures (like that of today’s Whites), men don’t care what mother thinks. They only care what makes them self happy. In many cases, they may want to enter into a relationship with a woman who exudes sexuality because this sexual confidence implies she is “good in bed.”
If the average White man decided to become family-oriented and began consulting his family elders on marital decisions, provocatively-dressed women would begin getting their engagements broken off. They’d then tell their female friends and relatives. As a consequence of this rising awareness of changing male marital preferences, women would begin to dress conservatively again.
People respond to feedback.
If White women dress provocatively, plenty of the blame should go on White men too.
In the past, people used to consult their family before they decided with whom to form a marriage/partnership. Nowadays, most people just do what they want, disregarding the wisdom of family elders.
The presence of huge hordes of sexually rapacious Muslim men and sexually puritanical Muslim women must be changing what the sexual marketplace looks like in Western Europe.
You can’t have a free-love sexual nirvana when there are so many Muslims running around. The presence of all these Muslims must be making Western Europe into a more sexually conservative place.
It doesn’t take that many Muslims to do that.
If a Western Euro country is 5% Muslim, probably 10% will be Muslim in the big cities. Among the younger age cohort in the big cities, probably more like 15-20% of city youths will be Muslim. Given the extreme aggressiveness and pack behavior of Muslims, Muslims are numerous enough to change what the sexual market looks like in a typical major Western Euro city.
Muslims are gradually bringing an end to the sexual revolution in Western Europe.
Your father might’ve told you that Stockholm was a free-love playground in the 70s. I’d bet that if you to Stockholm these days, you’d find a way different sexual vibe.
Islam is right about women.
https://postimg.cc/CRgkzDZ5Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
Not just thanks, but muchas gracias, Senor Baldwin! I’d been looking for this cartoon that I liked when I saw it long ago. I remember spending half an hour to try to find it a couple of years ago with no luck. It’s hard to search for things when you have only the basic idea in your head, without some of the wording.
Feminists are a threat to humanity everywhere. I support Muslims on this one. You give women an inch, they end up bullying you from HR.
the men who pose the biggest threat to European women are the same category of men who pose the biggest threat to women everywhere: men whom women know.
You see, it’s not Muslims who commit the most rapes in Europe. Likewise, I’ve read that only seven percent of previously convicted rapists are ever rearrested for sexual assault, which obviously means over ninety percent of rapes are committed by first timers – so the men who post the biggest threat are the ones who have not raped anyone.
Really, women should only spend time around Muslim men who are also convicted rapists. Mathematically speaking. For their safety.
The Iranians perhaps had the right idea in 1979. Throw out liberal Western culture and keep women on a short leash. Then punish rape severely. Iranian women I’ve met say they are better off and happier.
It is usually women who are the strictest at enforcement of public morality in such a culture. With good reason. See the ISIS armed female morality force.
A tour de force, Mr. Sailer. Bravissimo!
It all depends on who’s making the rules.
If patriarchy well and truly vanishes, as it almost has done in the west, reality will kick in.
One of the wonders of the internet, obscenity and all, is that it shows what the human species actually *is* – shielded from norms and consequences – and not what the species is ‘supposed’ to be.
Ahhh… a stroll through beautiful Rosengård. Judging from her pictures she’d look good in said mini-skirt; I’m sure Sven and Ole would be appreciative. What? Sven and Ole don’t live in Malmö anymore?
Vide, in a real Islamic society rapists and sexual molesters of women would either be killed out of hand or publicly beaten.
By the same token the western world, which is largely a 'United States of Pornography' in which adultery is taken as about as seriously littering, would to a true Muslim be a disgusting, filthy Sodom and Gomorrah which would taint and contaminate the pious by the mere act of breathing the same air as the swinish infidel.
My contention is that the huge numbers of Muslims currently flooding Europe - for the sake of Mammon and Mammon alone, are the real hypocrites and deceivers. If they were truly pious, they wouldn't come to the west for the sake of their children's souls, something that no material price can be put on. After all, they have no guarantee whatsoever that their grandchildren will not be seduced from the path of the righteous and on to the path of deviancy, and it must be said the powers of the seducers in the western world are stronger than the powers that their faith can muster.Replies: @Elli, @Anon
There’s a lot of unreal Islamic societies then, from the banlieues of Paris and their tournantes, the groping gauntlets in Cairo, the village councils in Pakistan who sentence women to be raped to redress honor issues between clans, the families who kill their own sisters and daughters and mothers for being raped.
Islam values sexual continence in women only, and anything men do to women, the women were asking for it.
Sorry ladies but not one F$£K given. You vote in droves for this stuff and you make your bed.
I have to admit, she’s quite good at implying that certain things are merely the product of the author’s fevered imagination: “Muslim men, who are by Hirsi Ali’s telling accustomed to gender-segregated societies in which female modesty is mandated and women are harassed out of public life . . .” Really? We only have Hirsi Ali’s word on that, do we?
And that idea that black men are interested in white women? All these black male/white female couples are purely coincidental! I used to live in a town with a significant Somali immigrant population. A coworker who had very long and striking red hair used to field marriage proposals from random Somali men who were fascinated by her hair.Replies: @Intensifier, @Anon
Now now Charlotte. You are noticing too much.
that was disturbing.
If you want another one, read the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. WWI with German atrocities in a French village. Plot spoiler: everybody dies.
Hirsi Ali either knowingly, or because she has been cut off from mainstream Muslim society for so long, or because she knows the female oppression card plays well with her target audience, seems to obscure an important fact: Muslim women, far from being dominated victims of patriarchy and religious oppression, are actually the drivers of said patriarchy and oppression.
Depending on the Muslim culture, their religiosity far exceeds men’s , and, as a general rule they tend to dominate their husbands and sons behind closed doors. Muslim men are socially conservative, not necessarily because of their fathers, but because of their mothers, their sisters and their wives. For every Talibani whacking a woman for not wearing a burqa, there are at least a handful of women back home cheering him on.
From an objective perspective, it could well be that by controlling access to other females through conservative social norms (enforced by their husbands and sons), Muslim women are able to shape their sons’ reproductive and sexual choices in a way that mothers in the West would never be able to.
This neatly explains the perversions of Muslim men in places like Rotherham: Muslim men, in the absence of strong female control at home, and not particularly interested in western attitudes to females, turn into predators, not because they are Muslim, but because they are men.
Achmed, I could not find this cartoon with a Google search despite my best efforts. Pretty sure Big Tech does its best to deep-six such stuff. Finally I recalled sharing it with a friend a few years ago and I retrieved it from my sent folder.
O.K., Maureen Dowd’s daughter, but who’s the dad? Can’t be Michael Douglas…
I have to admit, she’s quite good at implying that certain things are merely the product of the author’s fevered imagination: “Muslim men, who are by Hirsi Ali’s telling accustomed to gender-segregated societies in which female modesty is mandated and women are harassed out of public life . . .” Really? We only have Hirsi Ali’s word on that, do we?
And that idea that black men are interested in white women? All these black male/white female couples are purely coincidental! I used to live in a town with a significant Somali immigrant population. A coworker who had very long and striking red hair used to field marriage proposals from random Somali men who were fascinated by her hair.Replies: @Intensifier, @Anon
I realize that’s a joke, but there are female, black and brown “conservative” commentators who play the race card to silence their white liberal critics. It’s almost as sickening as when liberal commentators do the same.
The less of that garbage, the better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZHuFah0udsReplies: @Almost Missouri, @El Dato
> Marches around freely and pointlessly
> “If you look at history 1400 years ago, women in Islam got granted rights that women in the west do not have.”
> Shrill shrieking. “No No No”
Muslims see this and know their ancestors were very wise.
Also:
“That’s what happens when you leave tumblr haha”
Vide, in a real Islamic society rapists and sexual molesters of women would either be killed out of hand or publicly beaten.
By the same token the western world, which is largely a 'United States of Pornography' in which adultery is taken as about as seriously littering, would to a true Muslim be a disgusting, filthy Sodom and Gomorrah which would taint and contaminate the pious by the mere act of breathing the same air as the swinish infidel.
My contention is that the huge numbers of Muslims currently flooding Europe - for the sake of Mammon and Mammon alone, are the real hypocrites and deceivers. If they were truly pious, they wouldn't come to the west for the sake of their children's souls, something that no material price can be put on. After all, they have no guarantee whatsoever that their grandchildren will not be seduced from the path of the righteous and on to the path of deviancy, and it must be said the powers of the seducers in the western world are stronger than the powers that their faith can muster.Replies: @Elli, @Anon
You are correct: the religiosity of migrants isn’t really the issue, and they aren’t likely to be fundamentalists in any real sense. The biggest risk from first generation Muslim migrants is cultural: they are like caged beasts let loose in an unfamiliar land, hence the spate of sexual assaults described here.
The religious risk comes from their children and grandchildren, who rebel against the religious indifference of their parents.
First two sentences–with you 100%. On the last sentence, you are, frankly, nuts.
No, Western men and women are supposed to set appropriate norms for their young. Constraining the dress, behavior and especially sexual behavior of young women to support a culture of marriage and reproduction that actually reproduces the culture–its norms, values and skills–intact, is pretty much job #1. (Cultures that do not reproduce themselves do not survive. Math.)
That this is even an issue, is because of the degeneration we’ve seen in the West because of minoritarianism and feminism: The continual attack on white, Western Christian people and culture, the attack on parental authority, the attack on majority rule and republican government and having our culture steeped in all the crap from degenerate Hollyweird.
The West–the part that wants to survive–needs to drive out the minoritarian garbage in our midst. The last thing in the world we need is more minoritarian garbage of a muslim hue.
(And note: I’ve got nothing against Arabs or Muslims. Enjoyed my brief time in their lands. Met some good folks. But that’s where they and their culture belong. Not in the West.)
“Math is hard.”
This is deeply stupid. The product of a “math is hard” female verbalist brain.
“Immigration” is not a value of actual Western liberalism. It’s not a value of any coherent culture, because “immigration” is turning over your territory to some other people/culture.
Traditional Western liberalism is simply not the same thing as Jewish minoritarianism and it’s off-shoot immigrationism–or more properly “immivasionism”. In fact, Jewish minoritarianism is deeply anti-liberal. It’s core purpose is precisely to stop people (white gentiles) from making their own organic, freely chosen social arrangements and use the state to force them to “open up” (i.e. be exploitable by) minorities. And as we see it is not compatible with core liberal values like free speech and the free flow of ideas. Minoritarianism is simply an anti-majoritarian orthodoxy and totalitarian state ideology.
But no ideological analysis is required here.
Western liberalism is … the name is a hint … Western! The product of the West–Western people, Western culture. Immigration of non-Western peoples means there are relatively more of them and relatively fewer Westerners. (And with feminism there are already a *lot* fewer Westerners.) With fewer Westerners the culture becomes less and less “Western.”
No doubt, Jill, they did not cover this sort of analysis is your gender studies courses. I know “math is hard”, but if you just slow down and go step by step, you can work through it.
Any Muslim man is likely going to want to have sex with her–and not necessarily with acquiring her consent beforehand!
OK–I’m exaggerating a bit, but still, …
Jill Filipovic, the 21st century equivalent of Roxelana! 😉 But just who exactly will be her Suleiman the Magnificent?
The religious risk comes from their children and grandchildren, who rebel against the religious indifference of their parents.Replies: @Mr. XYZ
And against being an underclass in their new countries?
Muslims should also know that Western women aren’t their women.
“Jesch’s opinion, which is also that of the majority of scholars, is that there were no female Viking warriors as this would have been antithetical to the Viking ethos. Even though women shared equal rights with men (they could own land, initiate divorce, serve as clergy, and run their own businesses), their sphere of influence was largely domestic. Women took care of the home, the elderly relatives, and the children and were unlikely to be tolerated slipping those responsibilities to join men in battle. Norse literature and mythology, however, depicts a number of legendary women who do precisely that.”
Look how much fun we used to have together till all of you came along.
Men rule the public and workspaces in the Muslim world but at home most are as henpecked and dominated as any Asian husband.
And most are nowhere close to having four wives. That’s for Crown Prince bin Salman and guys who were smart enough to get on a rubber raft north to scam the various European welfare systems, not the average Mo Kebab.
Man love Thursday is also a thing. Just ask any Iraq or Afghan vet.
All the guys running around calling for, “white sharia,” may want to be careful what they wish for.
Matches my experience.
What’s the feminine analogue of the verb “to white-knight?” It’s attested historically, whatever it is. I’m sure the 1940s version Filipovic* could write a shi’ite-testing “Free Louis Till” pamphlet.
*a good BIPOCVAC surname there (Via Auto-Correct)
It IS odd. Yet, it’s happening. Life is funny that way. Filipovic doesn’t appreciate subtlety.
Feminists have created? Here’s the problem:
“Men have sacrificed and crippled themselves physically
and emotionally to feed, house, and protect women and
children. None of their pain or achievement is registered
in feminist rhetoric, which portrays men as oppressive
and callous exploiters.” — Camille Paglia
Feminism is decadence. Some women have become so comfortable they attack the men who keep them alive. Feminism survives only by the support of men. Some movement. Dependent on their enemy.
‘Hirsi Ali calls for a new feminist movement, one in which true feminists are “prepared to stand up for the rights of all women” and coalesce around the issue of “women’s safety from predatory men.”’
Is this the beginning of a new appeal to virtue fallacy, i.e., “no true feminist?”
“prepared to stand up for the rights of all women”
Stand up to whom? Men? Here, again, success is tied to men. Feminists can’t attain their goal; they must get men to grant it to them.
Mr Spock says they are illogical.