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Recently a prominent public intellectual emailed me and asked for an introductory genetics text. Not necessarily focused on population genetics (in which case, John Gillespie’s Population Genetics would do). I suggested An Introduction to Genetic Analysis, mostly because it seems pretty comprehensive, and, runs the gamut from classical genetic analysis to 21st century genomics. Yet I have to admit that I did not take an introductory genetics class as an undergraduate. My degrees are in biochemistry, and biology. But, I added the second major later, and basically bluffed my way into taking upper division genetics courses only.* An Introduction to Genetic Analysis is what I studied for my qualifying exam, so I’m familiar with it. But does anyone have other suggestions? E.g., has anyone tried out From Genes to Genomes?
In other genetics-related news, I’m going to be involved in a workshop on genetically modified organisms for the next few days. Though I don’t talk about it much, I’m a big proponent of GMO. If you want a perspective that will perhaps alter your preconceptions, Pam Ronald’s Tomorrow’s Table: Organic Farming, Genetics, and the Future of Food is a good introduction. Basically, my position is that the anti-GMO position is large part a luxury consumption good. In a world of horizontal gene transfer (our own human genomes seem to be about ~5% virus) GMO is not ipso facto concerning. Rather, what many people worry about really has nothing fundamentally to do with GMO, but with excessive centralization and corporate food production monoculture. But the key to recall here is that there is nothing fundamental in the connection between GMO and corporate agriculture. The corporatization of “organic” illustrates this. This segment of food production has higher profit margins, and so naturally corporations have become big proponents of it. Finally, some of you may have read Nassim Nicholas Taleb’s The Precautionary Principle (with Application to the Genetic Modification of Organisms). One thing I will say is that obviously I don’t buy the thesis in this case, but listening to him being interviewed by Russ Roberts, it is also pretty obvious he’s not a biological scientist because he makes some obvious factual errors in characterizing the scientific consensus. This doesn’t invalidate his position obviously, but it gets a little tiresome throughout the podcast when he argues that biologists themselves are not in a position to do appropriate risk assessment in relation to GMO (this is a defensible position in my opinion, insofar as it takes a diversified skill set which many biologists and non-biologists do not have).
So I’m reading Edward Said’s Orientalism. Mostly it’s so I can better mimic and mock the sort of postcolonial and critical race theory bot that you see on the interwebs. I think I do a pretty good job as it is, but perhaps I’ll try and pull an Alan Sokal at some point in the future, though this time going on about how genetics is fundamentally a tool of white racial oppression or something like that. Unfortunately this sort of “discourse” is actually very common in universities, and is starting to seep through into non-humanities degree programs through general education requirements. Because it’s a fad it will probably pass, but for a few years we’ll hear a lot about how things are “problematic” and “privileged.” Speaking of Orientalism, one of my major issues with Said’s work is that it was so loosely connected to facts, and also had obvious historical errors. But this is not a major issue for most purveyors of postcolonial theory, who basically seem to believe that excessive adherence to “fact” is a tool of oppression (implicitly, if not explicitly, as you can’t let facts get in the way of a good Theory).
I’ll end by pointing out a comment thread below which is what I’d like to see more of. It’s between Troy and Tobus for the most part (Ray also gets involved). I’m actually not very interested in what they’re discussing, but the individuals are engaging at a high, and civil, level. It strikes me as a genuinely edifying discussion which will show up in search engine hits for years to come. Bravo! (the thread begins with fits and starts here)
* Yes, I did take a very introductory genetics module as a biology major, but it lasted all of four weeks.
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I’m not going to enact the labor to explain why what you just said was extremely oppressive and minimizing. Look in the mirror and mansplain to yourself why you’re a shitlord.
P.S. I am quite taken with the concept of somebody mansplaining to themselves. I realise now that, as a CSWM, I am the truly the biggest victim of mansplainment: because everybody else can get people like me to shut up if only occasionally and briefly, while I have to live with the incessant chatter of CSWMsplaining inside my own brain.Replies: @Robert Ford
Orientalism page 169:
“…what the English mind surveyed was an imperial domain which by the 1880s had become an unbroken patch of British-held territory, from the Mediterranean to India.”
Unbroken? Said seems to have lost track of the Ottoman and Qajar empires. Just one example I found particularly egregious for those unfamiliar with his influential work.
I’m against GMOs for the same reason I’m in favor of global warming. GMOs make it easier to produce food and global warming will make it harder. More food means more people and the planet doesn’t need more people.
“Rather, what many people worry about really has nothing fundamentally to do with GMO, but with excessive centralization and corporate food production monoculture. ”
Razib, the opposition to GMOs really is a large grab bag of various objections. The worries about corporatism is a major one, but I think just as equally important are the worries in the opposite direction, namely GMO’s being let loose into the world as an unregulated DIY free for all resulting in problematic organisms being produced. And fundamentally there is also the concern that for various reasons mankind isn’t ethically/culturally “ready” yet for making advanced GMOs. I find it curious that although you do know these concerns exist, you seem to paint the opposition side as mainly concerned about the corporatization part instead.
Razib, the opposition to GMOs really is a large grab bag of various objections. The worries about corporatism is a major one, but I think just as equally important are the worries in the opposite direction, namely GMO's being let loose into the world as an unregulated DIY free for all resulting in problematic organisms being produced. And fundamentally there is also the concern that for various reasons mankind isn't ethically/culturally "ready" yet for making advanced GMOs. I find it curious that although you do know these concerns exist, you seem to paint the opposition side as mainly concerned about the corporatization part instead.Replies: @Razib Khan
this is what people who are arguing in favor of GMOs tell me. more precisely, a lot of high status people anti-GMO, such as michael pollan, seem primarily to fixate on the corporate aspect when drilled down on it. they don’t seem to believe that there’s any likelihood of superorganisms going wild when pushed on the science. yes, a lot of the broader social aversion is pretty diverse. anyway, perhaps you know better. i don’t really care.
1) Concerning DNA being a tool of the white patriarchy, the nutty fringes of the left have already gone there: http://cogweb.ucla.edu/Debate/Ehrenreich.html
2) You talked about ant evolution a while back and I didn’t get around to replying at the time. I think that ant colonies are, in many ways, a single distributed organism. Each ant is analogous to a cell in a multicellular organism but aren’t locked within a single physical body and can act autonomously, but they still support a reproductive core contained in the queen and drones much as the vast majority of cells in a multicellular organism don’t reproduce directly into the next generation organism but support reproductive organs that handle that.
https://www.unz.com/gnxp/science-is-different-from-religion/
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/01/130114192704.htm
“Milk consumption in a country increases the chances of winning Noble Prizes. ”
I can’t help but wonder if lactose tolerance is accidentally correlated with Nobel Prizes. Otherwise, half the words population should be supplementing milk substitute vitamins.
Razib, two random questions for you:
1) Can you recommend an introduction to Indian history for someone with minimal knowledge of the subject?
2) I’m a young man and have no plans to father children any time soon, though I plan to some day. Given that I might be in my 40s before having kids, do you think the paternal age effect warrants having my sperm frozen?
if you are very young & have the income, i'd do it. i would have.
1) Can you recommend an introduction to Indian history for someone with minimal knowledge of the subject?
2) I'm a young man and have no plans to father children any time soon, though I plan to some day. Given that I might be in my 40s before having kids, do you think the paternal age effect warrants having my sperm frozen?Replies: @Razib Khan
if you are very young & have the income, i’d do it. i would have.
"Milk consumption in a country increases the chances of winning Noble Prizes. "
I can't help but wonder if lactose tolerance is accidentally correlated with Nobel Prizes. Otherwise, half the words population should be supplementing milk substitute vitamins.Replies: @Razib Khan
eat & drink what ashkenazi jews & eat drink ;=)
I’m actually on a soul food diet. Daddy needs to dunk.
I might be killed for breaking this secret but the key food to create Jewish intelligence is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gefilte_fish
I really enjoyed that Troy/Tobus discussion, even if I couldn’t follow all the math. Is Troy perhaps one of the McGrew couple? He/she seems deeply familiar with Bayesian probability reasoning and the McGrew’s authored an interesting Bayesian case for belief in the Resurrection.
It has been 25 years since I read Orientalism, but I remember having the thought that Said is too intelligent and well-read for us to attribute his misrepresentations, exaggerations and errors to plain ignorance (as one can in the case of most of his fans, who tend to be more or less ignorant and have read very little history outside of a few select propaganda-type courses and books).
At that time, I think I concluded that Said knew this was not how orientalism really worked, but he thought this was the best way to attack the specific imperialism that he felt was responsible for Israel. i.e., I thought his motivation was very personal and very specific and that was why he paid little or no attention to Russian, Chinese or Arab imperialism. What motivated him was the urge to undermine (by any means necessary) one specific imperium, not imperialism or “othering” in general.
I wonder if I would think the same if I read him now?
Does he strike you as a knowledgeable but slimy intellectual who is deliberately creating propaganda? or as someone who really does not know better and more or less believes what he is writing?
For many “mind workers,” opposition to GMOs is driven by anti-corporatism but I think ordinary people have a more visceral opposition. It’s unnatural, and because it’s unnatural, it’s dangerous. For all the millions of Americans who don’t believe in evolution, there are “human genes” and “carrot genes” and “fish genes” and they can’t legitimately be moved from one species to another. (And, yeah, lots of Americans who think they believe in evolution feel the same way.)
A fine irony is that corporations are happy to push fear of GMOs if they think it will help their bottom line. E.g. Chipotle’s bragging about how it is removing all GMOs from their restaurants. Because, among other things, GMOs don’t have “integrity.”
http://chipotle.com/gmo
I googled it at the time but couldn’t find other examples of someone saying “enact” and “labor” together as a jargon term. Perhaps this expression was SP’s personal innovation. I’d like to imagine that it was intended as a great contribution to the galaxy of academic lefty cant(s).
P.S. I am quite taken with the concept of somebody mansplaining to themselves. I realise now that, as a CSWM, I am the truly the biggest victim of mansplainment: because everybody else can get people like me to shut up if only occasionally and briefly, while I have to live with the incessant chatter of CSWMsplaining inside my own brain.
2) You talked about ant evolution a while back and I didn't get around to replying at the time. I think that ant colonies are, in many ways, a single distributed organism. Each ant is analogous to a cell in a multicellular organism but aren't locked within a single physical body and can act autonomously, but they still support a reproductive core contained in the queen and drones much as the vast majority of cells in a multicellular organism don't reproduce directly into the next generation organism but support reproductive organs that handle that.Replies: @Greg Pandatshang, @Razib Khan
What’s more Kim Tallbear has already taken “DNA as a tool of oppression” to the heighth of (unintentional) self-parody. A tough act to follow.
https://www.unz.com/gnxp/science-is-different-from-religion/
Dear Razib: Please drop what you are doing. We need to to read and comment on Neasl Stephenson’s new novel:
Neal Stephenson on his new novel, Seveneves, and the future of humanity. By Ed Finn
Do you have any comments on Nassim Taleb’s “fat-tailed” objections to GMO’s? (FYI – I asked Cochran about it and he curtly replied “He doesn’t know what he’s talking about.”)
P.S. I am quite taken with the concept of somebody mansplaining to themselves. I realise now that, as a CSWM, I am the truly the biggest victim of mansplainment: because everybody else can get people like me to shut up if only occasionally and briefly, while I have to live with the incessant chatter of CSWMsplaining inside my own brain.Replies: @Robert Ford
everyone is a victim of your privilege. even you. Stare into a mirror and repeat: “I am a shitlord.” 1,000x
Hi Razib,
I got two questions for you:
1. I know you have mentioned before that most of the world’s populations have already had their DNA analyzed, with that in mind do you think there are still any new discoveries to be made in human population genetics?
2. I have been reading Spencer Wells’ Deep Ancestry (yes, I know it is somewhat dated) and he says in the appendix that mtDNA haplogroups I and W are linked to the Aurignacian culture in Europe. I know that in one of your earlier posts you said that it is unlikely that Europeans trace their ancestry back to the Gravettian period or earlier, and I highly doubt that ancient DNA was the source of Wells’ claim, so do you have any idea where he came up with this theory?
Thanks.
yes. the phylogenetics stuff doesn't need huge sample sizes or marker sets. but a lot of the analysis of function, selection, de novo mutation, needs more samples and better coverage.
I have been reading Spencer Wells’ Deep Ancestry (yes, I know it is somewhat dated) and he says in the appendix that mtDNA haplogroups I and W are linked to the Aurignacian culture in Europe. I know that in one of your earlier posts you said that it is unlikely that Europeans trace their ancestry back to the Gravettian period or earlier, and I highly doubt that ancient DNA was the source of Wells’ claim, so do you have any idea where he came up with this theory?
i'll ask spencer. we're friends.
2) You talked about ant evolution a while back and I didn't get around to replying at the time. I think that ant colonies are, in many ways, a single distributed organism. Each ant is analogous to a cell in a multicellular organism but aren't locked within a single physical body and can act autonomously, but they still support a reproductive core contained in the queen and drones much as the vast majority of cells in a multicellular organism don't reproduce directly into the next generation organism but support reproductive organs that handle that.Replies: @Greg Pandatshang, @Razib Khan
this is the analogy that eo wilson and david sloan wilson like too.
Neal Stephenson on his new novel, Seveneves, and the future of humanity. By Ed FinnReplies: @Razib Khan
purchased.
I got two questions for you:
1. I know you have mentioned before that most of the world's populations have already had their DNA analyzed, with that in mind do you think there are still any new discoveries to be made in human population genetics?
2. I have been reading Spencer Wells' Deep Ancestry (yes, I know it is somewhat dated) and he says in the appendix that mtDNA haplogroups I and W are linked to the Aurignacian culture in Europe. I know that in one of your earlier posts you said that it is unlikely that Europeans trace their ancestry back to the Gravettian period or earlier, and I highly doubt that ancient DNA was the source of Wells' claim, so do you have any idea where he came up with this theory?
Thanks.Replies: @Razib Khan
1. I know you have mentioned before that most of the world’s populations have already had their DNA analyzed, with that in mind do you think there are still any new discoveries to be made in human population genetics?
yes. the phylogenetics stuff doesn’t need huge sample sizes or marker sets. but a lot of the analysis of function, selection, de novo mutation, needs more samples and better coverage.
I have been reading Spencer Wells’ Deep Ancestry (yes, I know it is somewhat dated) and he says in the appendix that mtDNA haplogroups I and W are linked to the Aurignacian culture in Europe. I know that in one of your earlier posts you said that it is unlikely that Europeans trace their ancestry back to the Gravettian period or earlier, and I highly doubt that ancient DNA was the source of Wells’ claim, so do you have any idea where he came up with this theory?
i’ll ask spencer. we’re friends.
i listened. same rxn as cochran. the issue is two-fold. he lacks a fine grained knowledge of the details of biology. fine. he’s not a biologist. but he seems to think that GMO techniques as they are today are fundamentally different from what has come before. they’re not.
Razib, in your opinion how did Blood Type B get from Asia to Ireland where it’s found in roughly 9% of the population? In the UK the precentage drops to 8%.
Re Orientalism, I just received Michael Cook’s “Ancient Religions, Modern Politics: The Islamic Case in Comparative Perspective.” He compares the religious histories of Islam, Hinduism & Christianity (particularly in third world contexts) to answer the question of why Islam is more prominent in countries w/ majority adherents than other religions are in theirs. He concludes that religious fundamentalism is more politically adaptive for Muslims, than for Christians or Hindus. This is a big comparative history book, not a religious survey — by “fundamentalism” he means the resolution to go back to the original source.
Razib: Thank you. We await your report with bated breath.
Do you have any book suggestions for a comprehensive overview of bio? Another book for biotech?
Awesome!