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This will be a disoriented essay. These are disorienting times. Perhaps the reader should prepare himself with a double shot of Wild Turkey throat sanitizer, or a doob.

I am still getting mail saying that Floyd’s death was due to underlying conditions. I see. By purest coincidence, he died of natural causes while hand-cuffed, face down, with cops kneeling on him. Nothing could be more natural.

Autopsies: Pick any two of three.

Anyway, all of America and much of the rest of the world has lost its everlovin’ mind. You probably didn’t think of this. That’s how this column is. Full of original ideas.

OK, the sacking of America. Peaceful protesters have a point, though they may not be sure what it is. Bless them. The looters and arsonists should be shot. Back when the country was mostly white and law abiding, it would have made sense. The burning of a family’store by urban savages should, obviously I hope, not be allowed.

But the pillagers are overwhelmingly black. Expecting them to behave as if civilized would be racist, and intolerant, and cultural imperialism, and discrimination, and just like Hitler. So they hunt and gather at will, shrieking in ebonics and streaming from stores with bags of booty. It is the same in every riot. No, most blacks are not looters. Yes, many are horrified by it. Yes, blacks are human beings and have feelings like everybody else, etc. It remains that looting and burning are a black game.

What politician is going to order the shooting of hundreds of black Americans?

Why always blacks? Depressingly, the most parsimonious explanation, consistent with all of the facts, is that blacks cannot function well in a modern society. They never have, anywhere, do not, and seem unlikely to. The underlying cause appears to be low average intelligence and, perhaps, poor impulse control. They interpret apparently inevitable failure as systemic racism. The very real fact of past mistreatment changes nothing. This will not improve because it cannot. What now?

Again, many blacks oppose looting. Al Sharpton says looters are criminals and should be punished. The rap artist Lil Wayne said it is unreasonable to think all police are bad. Here we see that good sense comes in a plain brown rapper, like pornography.

OK, to brass tacks. The proximate cause of riots is always that white men have done something bad to blacks, like kill them. If in fact sometimes they have not, blacks believe that they have, encouraged by the media. Martin Luther King, Rodney King (no relation), Michael Brown, Freddie Gray, Eric Garner, George Floyd. The police are the customary agents of ignition. Technical details, such as guilt or innocence, do not seem to matter.

If policing blacks with white cops leads to burning cities, why keep doing it?

It’s like a man hitting his thumb with a hammer. Whackawhack. “Ouch! That really hurts!” Whackawhack. “Ouch! That really hurts” Whackawhack. “Ouch! That really hurts”

“So why don’t you stop?”

“…whut?”

And of course there is a lot of misbehavior by police, which until recently was seldom detected. Question: For a cop, what are the most terrifying words he will hear? Cancer? Pay cut? Doughnut shortage? No.

“Cell phone.”

This current ruction could be called, perhaps a bit too breathlessly, the first electronic world uprising. A cell phone video began it, went viral, and got picked up by the legacy media, which have mostly followed cellphone footage. The networks are too politically correct, too short on manpower, to compete with millions of iPhone videographers. When the Buffalo cops knocked an old man down and casually walked away as he lay unconscious and bleeding from the head, within hours the entire earth saw it. Violeta and I, in central Mexico, have watched live coverage of Washington on Australian television.

We are seeing (Fred said importantly) a new paradigm.

Now, applied stupidity. It would be easy to believe that the police are actually trying to spark riots. If you think idiocy is not normal with today’s gendarmes, consider Breonna Taylor. She, a black EMT, was in bed with her boyfriend after midnight in Louisville. The police, under a no-knock warrant, using a battering ram, with no warning, crashed into her apartment. Her boyfriend, wakened by the intrusion, thought the couple were being attacked by god knew who. Reasonably, he fired a pistol at them, hitting a cop in the leg. The cops responded by shooting Breonna eight times, killing her.

With a predictability that makes Congressional corruption seem a long shot, the police said that, actually, see, they knocked and announced that they were police.

The police are lying. First, you don’t get a no-knock warrant and then knock, calling out that you are police. Second, if the police announce themselves, a guy in bed with his girlfriend will get up and open the door.

However: What happens when police have done a cowboy battering-ram I’m-a-really-cool-SWAT-guy enhanced entrance, and then discover that they have killed a young woman? Easy. They suddenly remember that they knocked. Since they have killed the only other witness, they can get away with it.

Perhaps an autopsy report will say that she died of underlying conditions. Yes, of natural causes, by purest coincidence while being shot eight times. Happens all the time.

The Breonna murder, like the Floyd trophy animal technique, was inverse PR genius. There must be a manual on this. Can you think of a more preternaturally foolish approach to race relations? You don’t shoot the guy you are supposed to be arresting. No. You kill his girlfriend. What brilliant police work. Awesome.

Of course, blacks kill far more whites than whites kill blacks, whether cops or anyone else. but this doesn’t fit the desired narrative. The media hide the (extremely) lopsided kill ratio. Anyone interested in black-on-white murder might read Their Lives Matter Too, by Paul Kersey.

Sez me, there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks. Separate departments would further reduce antagonism. Let blacks decide whether and how they want to be policed and let them do it. Since the races don’t like each other and separate when allowed, semi -autonomous urban regions might be a good idea.

But this would not be the American way. When you have done something for decades that hasn’t worked, isn’t working, and isn’t going to work, why, keep doing it. Whackawhack.

If I were a goofy tooth-fairy liberal, I would probably say that the policy strives for diversity and inclusion. Which nobody seems to want, but what has that got to do with it?

At this point in our study of applied, and even inspired, stupidity, we will now Have Thoughts and Draw Conclusions. These will be obvious to everybody but I will package them as insight. Hey I’m a columnist.

First, the rioters do not care about black lives. Neither does Black Lives Matter. Thousands of blacks die annually of gunshot in Chicago, Baltimore, etc. No riots. In fact, hardly a squeak. If black cops are killed by blacks, no riots. If a black cop kills a black, no riots. Nor do they care about the many equally grotesque murders of whites by blacks.

Methinks the murder of Floyd was just a trigger for many and deeper diseases rotting America. The country is profoundly unhappy and pissed off about pretty much everything. The young labor under student loans they will perhaps never be able to pay off, these loans being tailored for the benefit of the banks. Families live paycheck to paycheck, maxed out on credit cards, which are an excuse for exorbitant interest rates. Jobs have been offshored to benefit the corporations. Jobs no longer have benefits as employees have been turned into “independent contractors” for the benefit of the employers. People do not go to doctors because the prices have become barbaric, for the benefit of medical swindlers. There is anger over racism, pervasive corruption, hatred of Trump. People are angry at having unwanted immigrants forced on them for the benefit of employers. The public has figured out that the government has no interest in their well-being, and that they have no influence over government, or anything else.

Except by rioting.

Finally, little will change, at least not for the better. The inner city will remain as it is, the pathologies intact. The police will be more restrained, for a while anyway. Crime will increase somewhat as cops will hesitate to arrest blacks. The country will be still more divided. Censorship will increase. Some businesses will reopen in burned out downtowns, and some won’t. Wall Street and the Pentagon, as always, will ride high, and together they will shepherd America’s descent into the Third World.

Write Fred at [email protected] Put the letters pdq in the subject line to avoid autodeletion.

 
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  1. Jamie_NYC says:

    I am still getting mail saying that Floyd’s death was due to underlying conditions. I see. By purest coincidence, he died of natural causes while hand-cuffed, face down, with cops kneeling on him.

    It was not a coincidence. If we wasn’t speedballing (being high simultaneously on Fentanyl and Meth), he wouldn’t have been arrested. He had enough Fentanyl in him to kill a horse.

    Get a grip.

  2. lloyd says: • Website

    The cop did not shoot Floyd eight times. He sat on his head.

  3. Haole says:

    Mexico is looking better and better. Fred is right.

  4. ruralguy says:

    Goethe said it best. The common and ignoble holds us all in bondage.

    • Replies: @Wally
  5. Sulu says:

    Fred, I’m getting whiplash. Why don’t you make up your mind if you are going to write drivel or great stuff. You doing both but choosing to alternate week by week is making me dizzy.

    Sulu

    • Replies: @Henry's Cat
  6. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Jamie_NYC

    Ok, that’s just straight up denial. Fentanyl is very short acting. It’s effects peak almost immediately and drop off in minutes. So whatever he had when he died, he had more before he was “arrested” and was doing fine. Plus there is the issue of tolerance which makes it impossible to predict a lethal dose. Meth acts similarly fast, but drops off more slowly. Still he was doing fine before the police arrived when his levels were as high or higher. Its pills that cause delayed problems. Neither of these are usually pills especially street use.

    You must be a veterinarian. How much Fentanyl does it take to kill a horse anyway?

  7. The Scalpel says: • Website

    People do not go to doctors because the prices have become barbaric, for the benefit of medical swindlers

    .

    True, I am an ER doctor and I avoid going to the ER as a patient because it is too expensive for me!

    I am beginning a book to be called “Stupid Medicine for Big Money” which describes how medical corporations intentionally dumb down medical care to create justification for unnecessary tests and medical visits.

    • Agree: Jazman
    • Thanks: Biff, Alfred
    • Replies: @Biff
    , @Dieter Kief
    , @turtle
  8. Loup-Bouc says:

    Mr. Reed:

    Your article reads like the ranting of a hebephrenic. Shifting erratically hither and thither, you observe (correctly) inter alia that cops murdered George Floyd and Breanna Taylor. Then you assert wholly unsupported, and likely quite false, racist tripe like this:

    Of course, blacks kill far more whites than whites kill blacks, whether cops or anyone else. but this doesn’t fit the desired narrative.

    Very frequently, when an assertion begins with “Of course,” one can expect that the assertion is dross, at best. Just so your above quoted assertion. Rather than clutter this thread with stuff I showed elsewhere in Unz Review, I shall cite some of my relevant comments posted under other Unz Review articles.

    [MORE]

    Under Paul Craig Roberts;s article, All Races Suffer from Police Violence, 3 June 2020), https://www.unz.com/proberts/all-races-suffer-from-police-violence/#comment-3949098 :
    * My comment of June 5, 2020 at 12:41 am GMT (comment # 14)

    Under Ron Unz’s article Race and Crime in America, Unz Review (20 July 2013), https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/
    * My comment of February 19, 2020 at 3:05 am GMT (comment # 151)
    * My comment of February 19, 2020 at 10:04 pm GMT (comment # 158)
    * My comment of February 19, 2020 at 10:38 pm GMT (comment # 160) as corrected in my comment of February 19, 2020 at 10:49 pm GMT (comment # 161)
    * My comment of February 20, 2020 at 10:31 pm GMT (comment # 168)
    * My comment of February 21, 2020 at 12:47 am GMT (comment # 170)
    * My comment of February 21, 2020 at 4:21 am GMT (comment # 172)
    * My comment of February 22, 2020 at 11:00 pm GMT (comment # 184) as corrected in my comment of February 23, 2020 at 2:10 am GMT (comment # 186)
    * My comment of June 3, 2020 at 2:09 am GMT (comment # 221)

    Also you assert:

    But the pillagers are overwhelmingly black. Expecting them to behave as if civilized would be racist, and intolerant, and cultural imperialism, and discrimination, and just like Hitler. So they hunt and gather at will, shrieking in ebonics and streaming from stores with bags of booty. It is the same in every riot. No, most blacks are not looters. Yes, many are horrified by it. Yes, blacks are human beings and have feelings like everybody else, etc. It remains that looting and burning are a black game.

    AND

    Why always blacks? Depressingly, the most parsimonious explanation, consistent with all of the facts, is that blacks cannot function well in a modern society. They never have, anywhere, do not, and seem unlikely to. The underlying cause appears to be low average intelligence and, perhaps, poor impulse control. They interpret apparently inevitable failure as systemic racism. The very real fact of past mistreatment changes nothing. This will not improve because it cannot.

    The FACT is that, this time (the George Floyd murder protest time), most rioters have been White or of another non-Black ethnicity. And, quite as the political right has insisted, many have been Antifa or idiotic, sociopath or border-sociopath individuals of groups incited by Antifa.

    And my above-cited comments prove that either (a) Blacks are not genetically predisposed to commit violent crimes or property-thefts or (b) no one has been able to show, validly, reliably, that Blacks are so predisposed.

    I grant you this: you are the weirdest racist I have encountered.

    Consider seeking the help of a character-analytic (or, less good, psychoanalytic) psychiatrist.

    Sic Transit Coatimundi.

  9. The saddest part of all this entire mess is that it actually has nothing to do with race, racism, or any kind of discrimination. What this is about is policing and how the culture of policing has some real problems. Many details to discuss, but the lunatic left now wants to defund the police, which, of course, is a direct assault on the civil society and the people. Policing can be fixed if we focus on a community policing model, not a SWAT-in-a-cruiser, paramilitary model. What Fred suggests is not inconsistent with this but the respective races is the most insignificant part of this overall problem. But, as per usual, there is no mileage or outrage to be had so we get the screams and finger pointing to trigger, divide, and conquer. On to the next travesty…

  10. Alex Weir says: • Website

    Yeah, but it was probably the Russians.

    • LOL: PaceLaw
  11. Pres says:

    Hello Fred, I’ve been reading your articles for —–well since the early eighties I believe and I hate to miss one actually I have only missed a couple for some reason I dont remember, You are one real person that thinks with a cool head and reason , which is hard to find in this day and age, there are so many occasions that could be rectified and settled with solid reasoning that never occur to most people in this time and age, they prefer to complicate it as much as they can for some unknown reason. I wish you were in control of most of whatever is going on today instead of the idiots that now hold the reins.The rulers cant figure out that the blacks and the whites will NEVER fit in the same slot, no matter how the government try to push them together, we had it going our way for years when the whites were on one side of the tracks and the blacks were on the other, then some damned bleeding heart liberal decided to make a name for himself and make everyone the exact same, not smart enough to know that neither one wanted to really do that, like mixing water and oil, it just aint gonna happen in the long run. But the stupid government is determined to force it to happen anyway. Like John Wayne once said “YOU just cant fix STUPID”… If I’m wrong , tell me how I am .

    • Replies: @sonofman
  12. Rich says:
    @The Scalpel

    Just 2-3 milligrams of fentanyl can kill a person, it’s been reported that the Floyd autopsy shows he had 11 milligrams in his system. You don’t have to be a veterinarian to see what killed him. Do you think he died of a heart attack because a knee was on the back of his neck? He died because he took drugs, 46 year olds who speedball die. Of heart attacks.

    • Replies: @Truth
    , @The Scalpel
    , @DonR
  13. Anon[296] • Disclaimer says:
    @Proudly Unaffiliated

    Tell you what; do yourself a favor by doing some research. Listen to some police and EMS channels on your laptop and then decide what it takes to police the Community. Blacks don’t want proactive policing unless it is their personal oxen being gored. The cops really don’t want to shoot anyone. Too much paperwork and hassle. But the classic 2 year wonder white guy is a problem to law-abiding as well as the Community. Fred is right about letting the races self segregate, and letting a more working class cop do his thing. The classic Irish cop is better for white areas, while the Community can hardly scream ‘Raycissim’ when their own are in charge. And hire big men, not scared little Barney Fifes that can’t wait to escalate.

    Problem solved.

    • Agree: Mefobills
    • Replies: @Wally
  14. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    Ok, that’s just straight up denial. Fentanyl is very short acting. It’s effects peak almost immediately and drop off in minutes. So whatever he had when he died, he had more before he was “arrested” and was doing fine. Plus there is the issue of tolerance which makes it impossible to predict a lethal dose.

    Since you’re a medical doctor, I’d welcome your opinion on the issue, which I haven’t tried to investigate.

    A post by Anatoly Karlin indicated that Floyd had 11 ng/ml of Fentanyl in his blood, and suggested that was a lethal dose:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/putlers-complicity-in-george-floyds-death/

    Moreover, he also had a high concentration of Meth and tested positive for Covid-19, which might have certainly contributed to his health problems. He was also supposedly reported by shopkeepers to be acting “drunk” or “intoxicated.” And I think he said he “couldn’t breath” while he was still standing and long before he ended up on the ground.

    Assuming these facts are correct, it seemed pretty plausible to me that the combination of all those very high levels of illegal drugs and other health problems plus the “stress” of interacting with the police caused him to die of a heart-attack.

    However, I have zero knowledge of these medical issues including Fentanyl levels, but perhaps you can evaluate them, including whether his Fentanyl levels were at the point of lethality as claimed.

    Normally, I’d just go by what my NYT+WSJ said, but they’re so totally dishonest on these things they haven’t even reported his apparent drug levels, so I just can’t trust them.

  15. MarkinLA says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    I think you have been accused of not being able to read in other posts so I don’t know if this simply a repeat or an intentional effort to lie but Fred did not say “rioters” he said “looters”. There is a difference. Most of the video out there of looters shows blacks running in and out of the stores.

    • Agree: meamjojo
    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
    , @Loup-Bouc
  16. Truth says:

    If policing blacks with white cops leads to burning cities, why keep doing it?

    Because if the calls by you, and various other Unzistas, to only police black areas with blacks, were heeded by state or local governments, the police unions would send white thugs to your homes to beat the ever-lovin’ shit out of you for taking away all of their overtime.

  17. Truth says:
    @Haole

    I like Mexicans. Please don’t go ruin it for those nice people. They really don’t need a million whiteys lusting after their teenage sons and telling them how to improve their lives, they don’t.

  18. Truth says:
    @Rich

    And of course, Richie, you believe it….

    • Replies: @daniel le mouche
  19. From Civil Rights to Tribal Riots.

    • Agree: anonymous1963
  20. Loup-Bouc says:
    @MarkinLA

    The rioter/looter “difference” bears zero significance. Really, and legally, mostly the “difference” is illusory

    Learn some law, pertinent empirical fact, and logic.

    Factually, looting is, very often, an index of rioting; and very often rioters loot.

    Per law, in a riot setting, a looter is a rioter. Per law, and as a matter of fact, if looting occurs in an unruly protest or the looting mutates, or helps to mutate, a peaceful protest to a riot, the looting is, at least presumptively, an act of rioting.

    In law, looting can be proof that a putative protest is a riot.

    Then, too, of Mr. Reed’s article’s sundry erratic thrusts, one was an assertion that Blacks tend to behave lawlessly with rioting and looting and other such conduct, more than do non-Blacks.

    Also, the “reading” problem is that of other comment posters, like you, who do not READ my comments, because they (like you) see with pathologically biased perception.

    Vous ne pouvez pas lire, Monsieur ou Madame Crétin. Donc, taisez-vous.

  21. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    It’s important to distinguish between two possibilities:

    (A) George Floyd would have died at that time due to substance abuse and underlying medical problems even if the police had treated him gently and taken their time.

    (B) George Floyd’s substance abuse and underlying medical conditions contributed to a state of medical frailty such that subsequent police mistreatment of him caused him to die more easily than expected.

    I believe the original commenter is making case (A), and you are making case (B).

    Regarding case (A), the idea that substance abuse was the cause is simply wrong. As I noted previously, these substances have their peak effect immediately and begin wearing off very quickly (especially Fentanyl) . So by the time the police were on Floyd’s neck and chest he was already well past the peak effects of those substances and he had survived. The underlying medical conditions are known unknowns. It is theoretically possible that George Floyd would have died of a heart attack at the same moment whether or not there were police on his neck and chest, but realistically, what are the odds? I believe we can safely dismiss that probability as vanishingly remote. It’s probably as likely that he would have died due to being hit by a car on that street at that time. No one would try to use that as a justification for the subsequent police actions.

    Regarding case (B), it would be difficult to deny that George Floyd’s substance abuse and underlying medical conditions were not contributing factors to his death, but that should not matter. By that logic, I could simply refuse to administer oxygen to many of my patients who are substance abusers, and have COPD, and have committed a petty crime. I could snuff them out easily without even kneeling on their neck. I have similar patients who can be agitated or anxious yet I don’t have to kneel on their neck or otherwise manhandle them to manage them. Waiting them out is almost always effective. These folks have no endurance for prolonged resistance. Is an extra 10 minutes, or (God forbid) even an hour worth a death sentence? Why not treat everyone as gently as possible (Floyd made no attempt to threaten the police) – as if they were a family member? Why not assume that they might have a serious medical condition that might be aggravated by manhandling? Aside from expedience and some misplaced sense of superior importance and standing, what is the argument for not treating petty criminals with underlying medical conditions and substance abuse issues humanely?

    Yes, ER doctors and police have different jobs, but we answer to the same God or moral principles. We both have the ability to treat our fellow human beings with as much care and dignity as the situation allows. Doing less indicates some sort of moral decay. Clearly, the police in this case did not treat George Floyd with as much care as the situation allowed. That is why George Floyd is dead now instead of next month or whenever.

    Regarding lethal doses, those values vary tremendously from person to person. Those who have built up tolerance to medications (tachyphylaxis) can easily handle quantities of those substances that would be dangerous for others. So simply having a blood level for these substances does not give us any solid information on the lethality in this individual. But as I noted above, in this case, the timeline shows that for George Floyd, the substance abuse was certainly not lethal.

  22. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Rich

    See my answer to Ron Unz below. Familiarize yourself with the term tachyphylaxis. (Tolerance). Re-read my explanation of the mechanism of action of these drugs vs the timeline of events.

  23. Loup-Bouc says:
    @MarkinLA

    I ought to have added this quote of Mr. Reed’s quasi-hebephrenic rant:

    Of course, blacks kill far more whites than whites kill blacks, whether cops or anyone else. but this doesn’t fit the desired narrative.

    That assertion shows that Mr. Reed’s argument was not limited to looting, butwas much more general, an argument the Blacks are feloniously violent more than are non-Blacks.

    Likewise, this of Mr. Reed’s assertions:

    Depressingly, the most parsimonious explanation, consistent with all of the facts, is that blacks cannot function well in a modern society. They never have, anywhere, do not, and seem unlikely to. The underlying cause appears to be low average intelligence and, perhaps, poor impulse control. They interpret apparently inevitable failure as systemic racism. The very real fact of past mistreatment changes nothing. This will not improve because it cannot.

  24. V. Hickel says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    so, you deny that blacks kill far more whites than vice-versa?

  25. JimDandy says:

    He collapses as soon as he stepped out of the car. He most likely swallowed the drugs he had on him, and was dying from that point on. No one is claiming “coincidence” you phony. What is this? Clickbait for Unz readers or something?

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    , @Ron Unz
    , @ANZ
  26. It’s beautiful watching Amerikastan burn.

    It’s even more beautiful watching Amerikastanis turn on each other in even more mutual hatred. I am long past the point where I thought that – like normal humans – most Amerikastanis were good and only the regime was evil.

    Burn, Amerikastan. Burn.

  27. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    More explanation of “lethal doses”. That term as it applies to medical issues refers to the minimum dose that could be lethal under the right circumstances. It is less than the dose that would kill an average person with no tolerance to the substance. It can be orders of magnitude less than the dose necessary to kill someone who has built up a large tolerance. Those numbers’ purpose is caution when physicians are treating a patient. What to look out for, so to speak. They really are only loosely related to what might be a lethal dose in a particular individual. Additionally, this whole issue varies with the particular mechanism of action of a particular drug. Huge tolerance is possible with opiates and amphetamines.

    • Thanks: FB
    • Replies: @Curmudgeon
  28. Pft says:
    @Haole

    Thats why they built the wall, to keep us in.

  29. @Truth

    Ok then pay them the same but do not task them with trying to police ‘groids, which is in any event a pontless, thankless endeavor.

    • Replies: @jsm
  30. Dr. Doom says:

    Remember when the sacking of Constantinople led to the Renaissance?

    We may as yet see a turning this time.

    Metropolis is depolicing and engaging in appeasement.

    THIS WILL INEVITABLY MAKE CRIME SKYROCKET.

    Donald J. Trump just seems to be inordinately lucky.

    Either that or his enemies are just STUPID.

    • Agree: Tono Bungay
    • Replies: @Blankaerd
  31. fritter says:

    America’s primary problem is the zionist jackboot on it’s neck. Until white Americans rise up against that, nothing will change.

    As to dealing with the high incarceration rates of blacks: The ANC in South Africa “solved” the crime problem by simply refusing to prosecute crimes commited by blacks. Many black murderers and armed robbers are no longer sought by police. Only whites who dare defend themselves are put in jail for murder. Many other crimes under Roman-Durch law, which were vigorously prosecuted under Apartheid, are no longer considered crimes. Problem solved! (NOT)

    • Replies: @Take it back
  32. Loup-Bouc says:

    Because of the mentality of too many Unz Review readers, you ought to re-emphasize that your discussion ASSUMES (for sake of argument):
    (a) that Floyd’s body bore residue(s) of some toxic (supposedly illegal) drug(s) capable of causeng his death
    and
    (b) that Floyd was suffering some possible non-drug-related comorbidity at the time of (i) one cop’s applying to him a choking maneuver that has caused deaths of other victims of poice misconduct and of (ii) two other cops’ applying to him a possibly fatal pressure to his chest.

    Those assumptions are only assumptions. They lack evidentiary premise sufficient to treat them as proved facts.

    • Troll: mocissepvis
  33. Don’t be silly, the cop was praying for Floyd. That’s why he was kneeling.

    No, I don’t think things will get better. Divide and conquer is what our owners want. They love seeing everyone at eachother’s throats. They’re good at making that happen. Keeps our reptile brains off of them and on other things. Nothing has changed much since Mesopotamia, except we got car keys and cell phones now.

  34. ‘Sez me, there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks. Separate departments would further reduce antagonism. Let blacks decide whether and how they want to be policed and let them do it. Since the races don’t like each other and separate when allowed, semi -autonomous urban regions might be a good idea.’

    I believe the term for this was separate but equal. Or apartheid.

    Not that I object.

    • Agree: Montefrío
  35. csucsu says:

    It is very simple , this can’t go on like this any longer between blacks and whites.
    We just don’t get along , and it’s only going to get worst.
    Lets have a divorce , let the blacks have they own country . Carve out three or four states for them.
    The United states of African America . If some dumb blond want to join them that’s fine.
    They can have Barak Huszein for president , the blacks are unbeatable playing basketball ,
    and rap music . So what can go wrong ?

    • Replies: @mocissepvis
    , @CW2isComing
  36. MarkinLA says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    A lot of words to say nothing. Looting and rioting are not the same, but you already knew that but can’t admit you are wrong. You can riot without looting. If you loot you are, of course, rioting.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  37. MarkinLA says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    Both are true statements, what’s wrong with that?

  38. You know, I read that the founder of BET called for 14 trillion dollars in reparations. I thought, ‘dream on, dude’, but then I thought what about land? We have a lot and we’re obviously never going to give any back to the ones who were here before whites or blacks, so instead of money, how about a giant chunk of the USA gets converted to African American land. Black government, black cops, black businesses and so they can do whatever they want and call it whatever they want, etc. A whole new country. And the problem of race relations would go away.

    This would be incredibly difficult to accomplish and yet, as Fred Reed says, the USA is dying. It’s beyond saving, the communists have become masters of keeping racial division wounds open and bleeding, and various groups don’t trust each other enough to make us whole. And the financial sharks destroyed whatever tiny chance we had of ever reducing the national debt with the 6 trillion dollar Covid heist in March. Why not make the transition before it gets any worse?

    • Replies: @Alice in Wonderland
  39. TRM says:

    “The underlying cause appears to be low average intelligence and, perhaps, poor impulse control.”

    No the underlying cause is a lack of a father in the home. How many black males from the nation of islam get into gangs? They don’t because they don’t need a surrogate father figure. They’ve got the real deal at home.

    39% of blacks under the age of 18 live in single parent households.
    https://www.afro.com/census-bureau-higher-percentage-black-children-live-single-mothers/

    Solve that one and we will make progress. Ignore it and we will spin our wheels forever.

  40. @The Scalpel

    It may be that Floyd died because he was not a stranger. The cop knew him for several years from his moonlighting job, and if not well, than perhaps just well enough to not take his protestations seriously. Floyd was a fit, violent three time loser ex-convict. The other cops were alarmed, he really was not.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  41. Miro23 says:

    Wall Street and the Pentagon, as always, will ride high, and together they will shepherd America’s descent into the Third World.

    It’s going to be a very unusual sort of Third World.

    Endangered lives: Jonathan Van Ness, who identifies as non-binary, responded to the author: ‘They’re dying. We’re fighting for Black people & trans people and you’re doing this?’ (pictured in February, 2020).

    J.K. Rowling (Harry Potter) was attacked for supporting the use of the word “woman” rather than “people who menstruate”.

    Jameela Jamil, Sarah Paulson and Jonathan Van Ness SLAM J.K. Rowling as transphobic after the author gets riled up by a simple headline.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-8396693/J-K-Rowling-faces-backlash-Jameela-Jamil-Sarah-Paulson-Jonathan-Van-Ness-transphobia.html

  42. Black lives do NOT matter. Very few become engineers or businessmen or scientists. The people that create wealth and give us our high standard of living. Blacks take up crime or go on welfare or get some do-nothing affirmative action job.

    It appears chauvin was in the wrong but the fact remains that floyd was a super-thug with a lengthy criminal record. Go ahead and lock up chauvin but let’s please stop mourning the death of floyd.

    • Replies: @Anon
  43. Loup-Bouc says:
    @V. Hickel

    Try READING. In my first comment in this thread (comment # 8, June 8, 2020 at 1:06 am GMT) AND in the references that comment bears, you will find the answer of your question, if you can READ, rather than hallucinate what your likely bigoted perception wishes to see. The answer does not fit a binary system.

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  44. @The Scalpel

    “he had more before he was ‘arrested’ and was doing fine.”

    Yeah, robbing a convenience store while appearing drunk to his victims is doin’ fine.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  45. @Loup-Bouc

    M. Loup-Bouc:

    It came to my attention that someone recently said water is wet. You must denounce this quasi-hebephrenic also.

  46. Freddy’s solution–separate policing–is correct insofar as it means apartheid. We are separate nations and this should be officially recognized. Expecting blacks to conform to white expectations regarding mores, customs, behavior, laws, etc. is as futile as attempting to change lead into gold, or a rose into a daisy. The project of trying to turn non-whites into whites at any cost in blood and treasure is insane fanaticism, and may well be regarded as a form of White Supremacy.

  47. AnalogMan says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    Then, too, of Mr. Reed’s article’s sundry erratic thrusts, one was an assertion that Blacks tend to behave lawlessly with rioting and looting and other such conduct, more than do non-Blacks.

    Yes; and..?

    • Replies: @Rogue
  48. Fred Reed: “What politician is going to order the shooting of hundreds of black Americans?”

    I hardly think it would be necessary to shoot more than a handful. The rest would get the idea soon enough. Same thing with wetbacks, btw. The rioting could be stopped, or the border secured, for the cost of a few bullets. This is so obvious it makes me conclude that a collective, though unconscious, decision by whites has been made to allow both phenomena to continue.

    • Replies: @Erzberger
    , @orionyx
  49. ruralguy says:
    @The Scalpel

    Like medical professionals, such as yourself, the police follow fixed procedures. Those procedures are based on many decades of experience and research. In an ideal world, a kinder and gentler approach would work, but like Floyd, the police are dealing with dangerous felons who threaten the lives of others and the police. Minneapolis and other city police procedures use research and experience to allow neck restraints, for a reason. The officers didn’t know Floyd had an arteriosclerotic (90% occlusion) and hypertensive heart.

    The Medical world that I’ve seen isn’t kinder nor gentler, than these police. It’s just as messy with lives. The author of this article is losing his eye sight to an incompetent surgeon. In my mother’s case, the doctors wanted to kill her outright. At 97, she was diagnosed with colon cancer. Three or more colorectal surgeons told us that at her age, she would certainly die if they attempted to remove it. The nurses wanted to move her to hospice where they promised hospice would kill her quietly with a cocktail of drugs (every time she went to the hospital, some nurse would suggest murdering her this way). But, one colorectal surgeon said nonsense. He operated on her. She had no surgical complications.

    But, as a doctor, you should know that people die gradually, over many decades, as they slowly lose their cognitive, memory, and other body functions. Like my mother past 100, Floyd was breathing, but he never had advanced cognitive function. He was a violent felon, not living a productive life. Those nurses and probably those surgeons knew that some lives no longer have value.

    • Troll: Biff, FB
    • Replies: @Republic
  50. TKK says:
    @Ron Unz

    A small amount of meth, about 1 teaspoon smoked- far less if injected- will keep an average sized man very high for 12- 16 hours. This is why meth is deemed the poor man’s crack. $20 will keep you high all day and into full dark. $20 of crack smoked lasts about 3 minutes.

    The meth high ncludes euphoria, hyper sexuality and hyper focus ( tweaking ). The high also includes, in the last few hours: rage, hallucinations, and paranoia.

    Being around a person high on meth is extremely frightening. They are unpredictable and impervious to pain. Indeed, meth users reject food and drink for days- leading to more pyschotic rages and poor health.

    Meth mouth is less attributed to the caustic substsnces in meth [ battery acid, Draino ] and more to the fact that meth users forget to drink water and brush their teeth for days.

    Floyd’s toxicology alone would produce two adverse reactions: his respiration would slow due to the synthetic opiod fentanyl and the meth would cause extreme arrythmia. Unless he had just used meth ( highky unlikely as meth binges are the norm) he would also be dehydrated.

    For an individual to have such potent, toxic substances in his systems, simultaneously, and to not attribute his cardiac and respiratory distress to them is not only deceitful but outright crimimal fraud by the media and the forensic pathologists.

    • Agree: Dieter Kief
    • Thanks: ruralguy, Thomasina
  51. Anonymous[401] • Disclaimer says:

    Reed is so senile/blind now that he smokes douches instead of “doobs” (his cringey attempt to seem cool to kids-tuday).

    >”I am still getting mail saying that Floyd’s death was due to underlying conditions. I see. By purest coincidence, he died of natural causes while hand-cuffed, face down, with cops kneeling on him. Nothing could be more natural.”

    Indeed it WAS natural for him to die in his condition with his past and present addictions.

    George Floyd was a violent thug. He’d previously entered a woman’s home with 5 other thugs, pointed a gun at her pregnant stomach, pistol-whipped her, searched for drugs/money…and caused her to miscarry.

    He was sentenced to 10 months in jail for possessing cocaine in 2005, too.

    He did 8 months for the same offense in 2002.

    He served 30 days for criminal trespassing.

    And yet another stint for theft in August 1998.

    He was dealing drugs from his car while suffering from coronary artery disease, trying to pass counterfeit bills. And had hypertensive heart disease. And was full of fentanyl (ultra heroin!), alcohol, and meth when confronted by cops.

    He was also infected with lung-harming Covid-19.

    Still, he was not a mouse. He was a bouncer who’d worked with Chauvin…the cop who also knew of George’s violent past.

    Some say George did porn, too. Google (at your peril!):
    “sexy petie kimberly brinks f*cked bybig floyd”

    George’s bad decisions that day:

    * dealing drugs from his car
    * ingesting alcohol and drugs
    * driving while heavily intoxicated
    * using fake money in a store
    * trying to drive the car again
    * resisting arrest in a police car

    Also of interest: the MN cops were taught by Israelis.
    https://israelpalestinenews.org/minn-cops-trained-by-israeli-police-who-often-use-knee-on-neck-restraint.

    It’s not the first time a neck-restraint had been used: https://tinyurl.com/y9ls49ur

    In fact, the Minneapolis Police Department’s policy manual permits the use of neck-restraints that can render suspects unconscious.

    So rage on, Fredo, from your hacienda in peaceful Meh-hee-coe. How open are the teachers of cholos hanged from bridges by drug cartels?

    • Agree: AceDeuce
    • Replies: @anonymous
  52. I believe everything the tv tells me. For example, I believe a cop called officer Chauvin murdered a guy while being filmed and looking right at the videographer. Previously this bad cop and his buddy officer Nutter ( look it up) had been reported for similar shenanigans. If they were named officers Racist and Nutcase, that would be too obvious I suppose. Similarly, I believe a swat team, being shot at and hit in the leg by a guy, do nothing to him but shoot his girlfriend Brianna Taylor 8 times until she stops moving. But no bullets for the guy with a gun in his hand.
    Definitely please get all worked up about this stuff. Make earnest pronunciations, argue about mitigating circumstances. Wring your hands, pop anxiety pills, whatever. Just don’t notice the treasury being looted and the Patriot act being renewed.

  53. Anonymous[401] • Disclaimer says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    Dude, why do I imagine you cataloging each corn chunk in your stool…while declaring Latin verse to your cat…as you dance with Harvey, the invisible rabbit?

    Now, repeat aprés moi: “Oh wah, tah goo, Siam!”

    Keep doin’ ‘er, increasing in tempo if need be, until the proverbial lightbulb comes on.

  54. Biff says:
    @The Scalpel

    describes how medical corporations intentionally dumb down medical care to create justification for unnecessary tests and medical visits.

    One of the last times I saw a doctor in the U.S. was a $300.00 dollar conversation that preceded a $6000.00 procedure. Later I skipped the procedure – I was out of money, and left town.

    • Replies: @Wielgus
  55. thordaddy says:
    @The Scalpel

    The video clearly refutes the notion that Chauvin had his right knee on Floyd’s “chest.” First, it is obviously impossible when one is belly down. Secondly, it doesn’t make sense to have a knee on the neck and the upper back (above chest). That’s a terrible detainment position. Third, as can be seen in the video, Chauvin hips are rotated away from Floyd giving one the appearance that his right knee is actually settled on the pavement. Lastly, there is literally zero “excessive” force in the entire nine minutes. There is nothing other than BASIC DETAINMENT and mob control.

    • Agree: Stan d Mute
    • Thanks: Dieter Kief, ruralguy
    • Replies: @Biff
    , @Bert
    , @Herald
    , @Wally
  56. Blacks policing blacks with whites policing whites. Add, as you say: “Semi autonomous urban regions” and you will create ghettos and no go areas for anybody packing a white-ish skin tone.

  57. Expecting them to behave as if civilized would be racist, and intolerant, and cultural imperialism, and discrimination…

    …and basically a pipe dream.

  58. Good article, Fred. In times of rampant, orchestrated dishonesty–and mass hysteria–a small dose of hard-edged reality can be so refreshing. Thank you, sir.

    But what if black lives did in fact not matter?

    Black life… not important?

    BLM is a hoax?

    And what if the truest non-believers in Black Lives Matter were themselves… black?

    https://abc7chicago.com/chicago-violence-crime-fatal-shooting-shootings/6224654/

  59. Pericles says:
    @The Scalpel

    Tachyphylaxis (Greek ταχύς, tachys, “rapid”, and φύλαξις, phylaxis, “protection”) is a medical term describing an acute, sudden decrease in response to a drug after its administration;[1] i.e. a rapid and short-term onset of drug tolerance. It can occur after an initial dose or after a series of small doses. Increasing the dose of the drug may be able to restore the original response.[2]

    Opioids
    In a patient fully withdrawn from opioids, going back to an intermittent schedule or maintenance dosing protocol, a fraction of the old tolerance level will rapidly develop, usually starting two days after therapy is resumed and, in general, leveling off after day 7. Whether this is caused directly by opioid receptors modified in the past or affecting a change in some metabolic set-point is unclear. Increasing the dose will usually restore efficacy; relatively rapid opioid rotation may also be of use if the increase in tolerance continues.

    Wikipedia has separate pages for ‘drug tolerance’, ‘desensitization’ and ‘habituation’.

    And here is fentanyl:

    Fentanyl, also spelled fentanil, is an opioid used as a pain medication and together with other medications for anesthesia.[3] Fentanyl is also used as a recreational drug, often mixed with heroin or cocaine.[5] It has a rapid onset and its effects generally last less than two hours.[3] Medically, fentanyl is used by injection, nasal spray, skin patch, or absorbed through the cheek (transmucosal) as a lozenge or tablet.[3][6]

    Common side effects include vomiting, constipation, sedation, confusion, hallucinations, and injuries related to poor coordination.[3][7] Serious side effects may include decreased breathing (respiratory depression), serotonin syndrome, low blood pressure, addiction, or coma.[3][7]

    • Thanks: The Scalpel
  60. The solution to at least the problem of policing is increased oversight by citizens, which is admittedly difficult because when the enforcers of the law violate it they are harder to catch. As to the underlying problems in black communities who knows. But to everybody saying this article is an incoherent mess I want to highlight the fact that you were indeed forewarned in the introduction prior to reading it.

  61. Fred,

    In your list of causes of the riots you forgot to mention that people are fed up with lock-down rules and regulations, and the police enforcement of even the pettiest infringements.

    Still … an idiot cop kills and idiot crim and now we all have to brace ourselves for a surge in Covid-19 because of these massive crowds in US, UK, France, countries already seriously hit by the pandemic and at the top of the world list in cases and deaths. The second wave looks more than likely, and even without it, with more than a million active cases you’re looking at another 100,000 deaths at least in the US. Now with these protests spreading it, God only knows what the final toll will be.

  62. @The Scalpel

    Are you sure he was doing fine when the police arrived?

    According to a 911 transcript obtained by BBC, a Cup Foods employee described Floyd as “drunk” and “not in control of himself” at the time.

    The toxicology analysis did not mention alcohol. But if Floyd was on fentanyl at the time, as the country coroner claimed, that could explain why he appeared “drunk.”

    https://merryjane.com/news/george-floyds-death-ruled-a-homicide-and-drug-use-had-nothing-to-do-with-it

    That Floyd was sitting in his car as if waiting for the police to arrive is a curious circumstance. Had the stress of the confrontation with the store employee already triggered a cardiopulmonary episode?

  63. Wally says:
    @Jamie_NYC

    On George Floyd:
    Candace Owens

    “Floyd is not a hero!” / Black conservative activist and Trump supporter ‘Candace Owens does not support the praise of violent criminal, ‘record a mile long,‘ George Floyd:

    and
    ‘Disgusting that blacks defend & praise their known very real & actual criminals’:

  64. Wally says:
    @ruralguy

    Goethe, indeed.

    Statistical facts ‘say this best’:

    There is no proof that “systemic racism” causes deaths of blacks by the police.

    – Says black African woman / “Black Lives Matter is a joke, they are the racists”:

    • Agree: ruralguy
    • Replies: @Da's Reich
  65. What politician is going to order the shooting of hundreds of black Americans?

    One whose house is about to be sacked and torched by them?

    If policing blacks with white cops leads to burning cities, why keep doing it?

    They can’t find enough black folk to pass both the written tests and the background character checks?

    Sez me, there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks.

    So, what case are we going to take to SCOTUS for a reversal of Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka, 347 U.S. 483 (1954)? It’s comforting to know that Plessey v. Ferguson, 163 U.S. 537 (1896), is good law after all. Nothing good ever came out of the Warren Court.

    • Replies: @mocissepvis
  66. anon[191] • Disclaimer says:

    Blacks will be against black cops policing them because of the simple reason that black cops would kick black ass. White cops are always walking on eggshells around blacks and really treat them with kid gloves.

    • Replies: @Hippopotamusdrome
  67. @Sulu

    His wife is writing the good stuff.

    • LOL: Realist
  68. gotmituns says:

    Yes, blacks are human beings and have feelings like everybody else
    —————————————————————————–
    I don’t believe this. Blacks are an intermediate sub-group that lingers between humans and apes.

    Semper Fi Fred.

  69. GMC says:

    Well, at least Fred came up with a Plan. That’s better and cheaper than any Mayor. POlice chief, religious activist, or someother City YeaHoo has done, in the past 50 years. There are No Plans , much less a peoples government left – in order to make the necessary calls -that’s the problem

  70. Thomasina says:
    @The Scalpel

    Don’t know if this is true or not, but:

    “The first two officers on the scene, when called from Cup Foods about George Floyd passing a counterfeit $20 bill, were rookies, each with less than 4 shifts as police officers.

    It was his FOURTH day as a police officer when Thomas Lane, 37, pulled his weapon on George Floyd and asked him to put his hands on the steering wheel of his car. Lane asked Floyd if he was ON something due to the foam coming out of his mouth. Floyd mumbled “I can’t breathe.”

    J Alexander Kueng, 26, is a rookie cop who was working his THIRD SHIFT EVER as a police officer when he encountered George Floyd. He stood on the passenger side of Floyd’s car, while Lane held a gun on him. Kueng, who identifies as an African-American, now faces 40 years in prison for the so-called “racist murder” of a fellow African-American.”

    Also this:

    “George Floyd had sickle cell anemia & heart disease & lethal levels of fentanyl & heroin in his body as well as meth, speed & marijuana in his body at the time of death. No one mentions this at all. Why?

    Sickle cell anemia reduces oxygen to your brain & tissues and lowers life expectancy by over 20 years in a HEALTHY individual. Fentanyl slows oxygen to your brain & both meth & speed can cause cardiac arrest.”

    https://www.tierneyrealnewsnetwork.com/post/the-truth-about-george-floyd-antifa-cair-keith-ellison-s-minnesota

    I get your point about being humane, but how many criminals fake illness because they don’t want to be arrested? Many do. Maybe we should have a doctor ride around in every police car, accompanied by Sister Theresa and a Black Lives Matter member.

    Sometimes people just kill themselves. That foam coming out of his mouth, what does that tell us?

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
    , @Karel
  71. @Jamie_NYC

    So you are suggesting that the prolonged kneeling on the neck was incidental to his death? This argument seems eristic at best. This would be like saying 3 of the people who died in the plane crash died of Covid-19. Good luck

    • Replies: @Jamm
    , @freedom-cat
  72. @Haole

    Ironically, it could be Mexicans that save us, as they are not afraid of dealing out street justice to black looters, and the the media has typically ignored Hispanic-on-Black street violence.

    • Replies: @FvS
  73. Breaking News!

    When Breonna Taylor was five years old she stole a lollipop from a sweet shop while her mum wasn’t looking!

    This proves her killing was justified and the, all white, policemen involved all deserve medals for eliminating a dangerous black criminal!

    (Yes, this is meant as a parody of the usual crap posted on this website. Cry me a river if you don’t like it.)

    • Replies: @Jefferson Temple
  74. @The Scalpel

    useful information about street drug interactions on SicSemperTyrannis

    Anesthesiologists know fentanyl at certain levels administered too rapidly can cause a kind of respiratory paralysis known as Wooden Chest Syndrome.

    Unfortunately, fentanyl is a norepinephrine(NE) reuptake inhibitor = excess NE in nerve synapses. Methamphetamine is an NE agonist, releasing stored NE into nerve synapses. Some of fentanyl’s sedative effects are offset by methamphetamine, but the NE effects are synergistic. Your respiration slows without your usual awareness of that happening. Aside from muscle tremors/stiffness, high NE levels can cause a sense of panic or feeling that something awful is about to happen.

    Wooden Chest Syndrome’s effects can vary in intensity. WCS is not necessarily fatal, but nanoxalone does not work to reverse its effects. Victims are sometimes treated for opioid intoxication while they slowly succumb to WCS induced respiratory failure.

    • Thanks: The Scalpel
    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  75. @The Scalpel

    People do not go to doctors because the prices have become barbaric, for the benefit of medical swindlers

    .

    True, I am an ER doctor and I avoid going to the ER as a patient because it is too expensive for me!

    I did not know that it is that bad. Let us know when your book is finished – good luck with it!

  76. Fred looks like you’ve got your mojo back! Another winner. But I’m going to have to take you to task on the old white man being shoved by the Buffalo cops. The police exit a building, the old man makes a bee line to the cops gets in their faces and then… Reaches for one of the cops waist bands with his right hand. What’s at the cops waist band? His gun! Big no no! The cops didn’t march by the old codger and randomly shove him in passing. He’s lucky they didn’t pummel him!
    Then the one cop reaches down to check on the guy, the other cops waives him on, then calls for help on the radio. They didn’t leave him there to die!
    I’m not pro cop or anti cop, they are a necessary evil. I’ve had a few try to take a routine traffic stop and attempt to antagonize me into escalating the situation into an arrestable offense, even having a plain clothes detective pull his Glock after telling me to exit the vehicle per his instructions, then tell me to get back in. He was a nut case! I’ve also had cops let me go when they had me dead to rights and could’ve issued a ticket. I’m sure many commenters here have had similar experiences. I’m white, and live in the Suburbs of Buffalo…
    Cops are supposed to protect the city during riots, have rocks, bricks, malatov cocktails thrown at them, get run down by cars… Two cops in Buffalo were hit by a car in Buffalo btw, bet you did’nt see that on the MSM propaganda outlets, and DO NOTHING? And people wonder why cops take their aggression out on people of any color?

  77. lavoisier says: • Website
    @V. Hickel

    so, you deny that blacks kill far more whites than vice-versa?

    It is very difficult to find a white liberal masochist who will acknowledge a fact that threatens their reality.

    To acknowledge that blacks kill an order of magnitude more whites than whites kill blacks is a bridge too far for the liberal fool. They will pretend that no such data exists, and if it is presented to them they will claim the data has been falsified because of–you guessed it–racism.

    This willful ignorance is hazardous to the health of any society.

    These people are fundamentalists when it comes to their cherished egalitarian worldview.

    • Replies: @Rogue
  78. @The Scalpel

    There is a difference between a therapist/doctor and a policeman, which is well established and makes sense. Doctors don’t get shot at that often, for example. Or knocked out or stabbed…

    Policemen in Minnesota are trained to hold a suspect down by putting a knee on his neck. (would there be a better method?).

    Commenter nier over at James Thompson’s blog wrote:

    “Signs associated with fentanyl toxicity include severe respiratory depression, seizures, hypotension, coma anddeath. In fatalities from fentanyl, blood concentrations are variable and have been reported as low as 3 ng/mL.”

    George Floyd seems to have been a cocaine addict – his use of Fentanyl might have been more or less accidentally and he might have had no Fentanyl tolerance.

    • Replies: @Ryan2
  79. @The Scalpel

    “Why not treat everyone as gently as possible (Floyd made no attempt to threaten the police) – as if they were a family member? Why not assume that they might have a serious medical condition that might be aggravated by manhandling? Aside from expedience and some misplaced sense of superior importance and standing, what is the argument for not treating petty criminals with underlying medical conditions and substance abuse issues humanely?”

    Why should the police “assume” more than that they are dealing with a criminal who might possibly attempt to kill them. All the cop wants to do is to arrest the perp without getting himself hurt. The police cannot be expected to go into an arrest worrying about whether or not the 6’6” 250 lb. Black man they’re about to be cuffing might possibly have a medical condition: a bad heart, low blood sugar, a boil on his ass, or anything else. That’s the perps problem, not the cops.

    From what I understand, the four police men involved with the arrest of “Big George” Floyd couldn’t manage to get his huge 6’6″ body into the squad car. I don’t know if that was because he was resisting arrest or if he was too heavy to lift, or what.

    What I know from George Floyd’s criminal record is that he was pure trash; you’d think him shoving a pistol in a pregnant black woman’s stomach (she begged for her life and her unborn baby’s life) during a home invasion would be enough to get him permanently banned from the American Sainthood list. Apparently, if you’re a Black criminal and die in the presence of a White cop all your sins are absolved

    That members of the GOP, presidential nominee Joe Biden, and millions of Americans are now taking a knee in Saint George Floyd’s honour is absurd. That Americans can allow our third-rate mainstream media to make a Saint out of unredeemable druggies and thugs like George Floyd, Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown, and Rodney King is unprecedented. Americans, before, weren’t that stupid. It’s as if Americans have given up on research/investigation and critical thinking, that they’ll swallow any narrative presented to them by the news channel of their choice because it’s faster and easier to be told what to think. I wonder what Americans are doing with all that time they’ve saved by not thinking critically.

    • Agree: Just another serf
    • Replies: @Hamlet's Ghost
  80. …Autopsies: Pick any two of three.

    …according to the results of two autopsies released on Monday — one by the county medical examiner and the other by independent pathologists commissioned by Floyd’s family

    LOL.

    Dr. Allecia [sic] Wilson, one of the pathologists who conducted the independent autopsy

    LOL. She seems legit.

    • Replies: @Redman
  81. @JimDandy

    He most likely swallowed the drugs he had on him, and was dying from that point on.

    Could well be.

    Kudos for your thought. – Interesting that nobody else has articulated it, as far as I know (and I’ve read quite a lot of articles about Geroge Floyd).

    • Replies: @JimDandy
  82. Biff says:
    @thordaddy

    There is nothing other than BASIC DETAINMENT and mob control.

    Up until it’s done to your Mama…

    • Replies: @RadicalCenter
  83. Why not defund medical services presently assumed available when convicted felons shoot each other?

  84. @Loup-Bouc

    The FACT is that, this time (the George Floyd murder protest time), most rioters have been White or of another non-Black ethnicity

    Really? You can literally go to youtube and see for yourself.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  85. Biff says:

    Interesting that I haven’t seen Breonna Taylor mentioned once in the comments. It’s all about George Floyd, and that is almost exactly how the general public approaches the situation. Can’t make excuses for the State, or cry racism, or “drugs in the system” when the victim is actually innocent sleeping in bed.

    Has there been one single protest for the lead heavy lady?

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  86. ((( The underminers ))) were building this powderkeg for decades.

    If it wasn’t Saint Carotid, it would’ve been someone else.

  87. @SolontoCroesus

    Fits the picture, unfortunately well, with regard to “Big George”.

    So – doctors say explicitly, it is no good idea to take Meth and Fentanyl combined – especially if you suffer from all kinds of heart- and vascular deformations and CO-19 is right behind you and you suffer from Sickle-cell-anemia and you find yourself in an arousing situation – that is unhelpful either, an arousing situation.

    And all that combined might have been deadlier than being immobilized on the ground.

    Dear readers – if you don’t mind, I might add something rather esoteric. A thought penned down by a dead man, more than 200 years old (the thought): Men is responsible for his own wellbeing and if he does not behave accordingly is betraying his own humanness.

    (Ok the name of this obscure person from Königsberg at the shore of the Baltic Sea: Immanuel Kant, philosopher).

    • Replies: @acementhead
  88. mcohen says:

    Fred at least spell her name right.Breonna.

  89. Moi says:
    @Haole

    Mexico or segregation–take yer pick 🙂

  90. OK Fred- but didn’t you yourself say that black problem is intractable: https://www.unz.com/freed/oncoming-racial-doom-the-clash-of-cultures/ ?

    We may agree or disagree about Floyd’s death, but the central point remains that no culture/race can get along with blacks/Africans, anytime & anywhere.

    Albert Schweitzer was right:

    “I have given my life to try to alleviate the sufferings of Africa. There is something that all white men who have lived here like I must learn and know: that these individuals are a sub-race. They have neither the intellectual, mental, or emotional abilities to equate or to share equally with white men in any function of our civilization. I have given my life to try to bring them the advantages which our civilization must offer, but I have become well aware that we must retain this status: the superior and they the inferior. For whenever a white man seeks to live among them as their equals they will either destroy him or devour him. And they will destroy all of his work. Let white men from anywhere in the world, who would come to Africa, remember that you must continually retain this status; you the master and they the inferior like children that you would help or teach. Never fraternise with them as equals. Never accept them as your social equals or they will devour you. They will destroy you.

    So- what is to be done, to “solve” the black problem relatively peacefully?

    Nothing can be done except getting rid of illusion of global humanist universalism and separating all races from almost all blacks.

    Perhaps that will happen; realistically- not. And so the most realistic future is north America & affluent Western Europe going down to history’s dustbin; the territory from eastern Europe to Japan (Russia, China, Japan,..) will become rulers of the world & strongly suppressing and eliminating blacks; Islamistan, India & Latin America will lead lives of stagnant existence, basically shitholes; black Africa – mass extinction from hunger & overpopulation & diseases.

    We all know that you can’t do anything with blacks…

    https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/05/china/china-zambia-murder-intl-hnk/index.html

    Three Chinese nationals were murdered and burned in Zambia, in a week when racial tensions were running high
    ………………………
    The gruesome murder of 52-year-old Cao Guifang, the wife of the textile warehouse owner — who was in their home province of Jiangsu, in eastern China, when the attack happened — and her two male employees, Bao Junbin, 58, and Fan Minjie, 33, came at the end of a week when anti-Chinese sentiment in the Zambian capital was nearing boiling point.
    ………………………………………………
    There are an estimated 22,000 Chinese nationals living in Zambia, operating 280 companies, mostly spread between Lusaka and the copperbelt in the north. Beijing owns about 44% of Zambia’s debt, which has led to fear among some Zambians that China has too much control over the country.
    ……………………………………………………
    Major infrastructure projects including airports, highways and dams in Zambia have been built by Chinese state-owned, or linked, firms. China also operates in the crucial mining sector, as do companies other foreign nations, and a Beijing-backed — although not owned — company even bought a 60% share in the Zambian state broadcaster. Local media frequently run inflammatory headlines, such as “How China is slowly colonizing Zambian economy.”

    • Agree: VinnyVette
    • Replies: @Anonymous Coward 3265
  91. anon332 says:
    @Haole

    Mexico City has the )ew mayor, same asd Minneapolis

  92. @Truth

    I don’t know many Mexicans, so I won’t say you’re wrong. But if they are so nice, as you say, why do thens of millions of them flee their so nice brethren to come north to the land of white oppression?

    • Replies: @Punisher
  93. @Proudly Unaffiliated

    If you think the average cop provides some value or service to the community, please list what that is. I, for one, see absolutely no value in having cops around. All they do is show up after the fact to draw a chalk outline around a body or pounce on drivers to ticket them for the made up crime of speeding or other traffic ‘violation’ that has no definable victim.

    We need investigators and detectives to find out who did it, but the average cop is useless to the public. We should eliminate that fraudulent position to save on tax funds.

    As is blatantly obvious by now, the police will not and can not protect you or your property. The average person needs to be armed, if they see the need, and protect themselves. These riots would be put down within a day if the business owners shot anyone that threw the first brick.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @HallParvey
  94. @Henry's Cat

    That Floyd was sitting in his car as if waiting for the police to arrive is a curious circumstance.

    I don’t know if you people are aware of the prevalence of criminality in society, and that very likely those Asian and Arab shopkeepers, like those Floyd slipped a fake note to, are involved in some kind of illicit and shady activities; and if they got burned down in these riots, they’ll be claiming insurance for a lot more stock than they actually had, as well as having removed most of their stock out of the shop after being warned that riots were being planned. So Floyd probably thought they wouldn’t bother calling the cops on him for a lousy 20 $ bill since they’re just fellow criminals, only a rung above him in the hierarchy of society’s criminal fraternity. Just some of my experiences:

    After a very long time absence from the UK, I walked into a shop in central London, and looking at the prices of cigarettes I jumped up startled and loudly exclaimed how expensive they were. The young Pakistani man, without saying a word, calmly walked up to the shelf, grabbed one end of the long plastic strip with the prices of various brands on it, and pulled it out revealing another set of prices nearly half the price of the originals.

    Another time I walked into another shop in London and an elderly white man asked me if I wanted a packet of much cheaper smuggled cigarettes from Poland rather than the expensive ones on the shelves and produced a packet from under the counter.

    Yet another time I was staying in a five star hotel in Florida and went down to the bar where there was cigar menu on each table with Cuban brands such as Cohiba, Partagas, Montecristo listed, which is illegal under US law. Rich guys sat around smoking these Cuban cigars, while a couple of uniformed cops were walking around. Now if I had made a fuss to those cops to do something about the illegal sale of Cuban cigars in that bar, they would have probably arrested me for causing a public disturbance and not the operators of the Cuban cigar racket.

    I have many more such stories from personal experience. These are no longer the days of mom-and-pop stores where small time shopkeepers try to make an honest living. And then the cops kill some black guy for selling loose cigarettes in the street and another for buying cigarettes with a fake 20$ bill. What kind of crime fighting is that? If you want to fight crime start at the top. But sure, you may just be unlucky to get arrested for something so pathetic, like jaywalking or pissing in the street, while most others get away with far bigger crimes. C’est la vie.

    • Agree: anarchyst
  95. AceDeuce says:

    People with bad hearts die shoveling snow, trying to exercise without taking due care,and having sex. An underlying condition exacerbated by sudden stress of the wrong type/excessive degree and it’s adios, amigo.

    This silverback had significant existing cardiovascular damage and was high as a kite. He then fought with cops with the stress and adrenaline dump going full tilt, knowing that he was going to go back to jail. Some people have said that he ingested his stash, to boot.

    • Replies: @Gordon K. Shumway
  96. Realist says:

    Studies in Applied Stupidity

    That applies to about 75% of college students.

    • LOL: Bardon Kaldian
  97. JimDandy says:
    @Dieter Kief

    It happens:

    https://www.tmz.com/2019/12/09/juice-wrld-swallowed-percocet-pills-hide-federal-agents-possible-overdose/

    If Floyd got caught with Fentanyl, etc., he would have done yet another stretch in prison. The big mystery to me is whether or not the facts will come out in court. Will the cop get an actual lawyer? Or will this be another Stalinist show like the James Fields travesty?

    Have you read anywhere exactly what rule the cop broke? Was the knee-to-neck move prohibited in the police rulebook–or encouraged?

    • Replies: @Redman
  98. Republic says:
    @ruralguy

    He was a high functioning felon!

  99. sonofman says:
    @Pres

    Hi Pres,
    If you read history, you would know that the Europeans came to America to escape monarchal slavery, and that the Africans, through the slave labor industry, arrived and formed the Black (not just the skin color)sub-culture based upon European mores and values. European -Americans and the Black African-Americans are literally joined at the hip in the quest for freedom. From the Revolution and every external and internal conflict thereafter, they were always allies. And they will always be compatriots. To even use the terms “Black” and “White” to insinuate that the attributes of a human being can only be based upon skin color is very simplistic, unanalytical and devoid of common sense, and does not take into account the proven environmental, political and social effects that form an individual. It is a fictional narrative used by antagonists to implement division.

  100. Rich says:
    @The Scalpel

    Please familiarize yourself with the number addicts who have heart attacks as they grow older, and due to the build up of “tolerance” to the drugs, use more and more. I know several hard drug users who died of heart attacks once they reached their 40s. It’s actually fairly common.A knee to the back of the neck doesn’t cause a heart attack. Fentanyl and meth very often do.

    • Agree: ruralguy
    • Troll: Biff
  101. Rogue says:
    @lavoisier

    I live in South Africa.

    It simply cannot be contested here that Blacks kill, rape, rob and commit other crimes of violence against the White population – per-capita – vastly more than the other way round.

    Black violence against Asians in South Africa (mostly from the Indian subcontinent and the largest foreign born Indian population in the world) would also be much higher (again per-capita) than the other way round.

    Despite the fact that South Africa has now been under Black rule for over 25 years and, therefore, has a completely “transformed” police, prison and judicial services, Black prison incarceration is substantially higher than White and even higher again than Asian. Specifically, per-capita.

    Not only is it the scale of the violence in South Africa, but the sheer depravity of much of it. Of course, like everywhere else where there are large numbers of Blacks, it’s the Blacks themselves that are the biggest victims of murder, rape, robbery etc etc in South Africa.

    So if in fact he’s trying to contend that Blacks don’t commit more interracial crime – especially violent crime – he’s plain talking out of his arse.

    When I lived in the UK some years ago, the London police commissioner said that in order to have an honest discussion of street crime, it had to be acknowledged that young Black men committed these crimes out of all proportion to their numbers. He said this in order to engage with Black leadership, and not because he was racist. He genuinely wanted an honest discussion.

    Some of the prominent Black “leadership” said he should resign.

    • Replies: @lavoisier
  102. Dr. X says:

    Since the races don’t like each other and separate when allowed, semi -autonomous urban regions might be a good idea.

    We tried that. It was called “segregation.” Lots of Southern whites liked it, but New York Jews and California’s Earl Warren didn’t. So they showed them peckerwoods a thing or two about how “diversity is our greatest strength!”

  103. Rodney King wasn’t killed by cops. He received a large settlement from taxpayers, bought a house with a pool, and drowned in his pool while under the influence of alcohol, cocaine, and PCP.

  104. @AceDeuce

    An autopsy would show whether he ate his stash. Has one been done?

  105. Rogue says:
    @AnalogMan

    Hi Analog, I know you’re originally from SA.

    Reading some of this dude’s crap (there’s no chance I’d try to get through all his tedious ooh, so academic blather) and having the reality of living in South Africa with all its crime, for this twit to suggest that Blacks don’t commit (or only possibly do) more interracial crime than the other way round with regard to Whites, indicates clearly that one can be a professor – and still essentially know nothing.

    BTW, I wish you’d return to the Savant blog. You were definitely one of the better commentators.

  106. And of course there is a lot of misbehavior by police, which until recently was seldom detected. Question: For a cop, what are the most terrifying words he will hear? Cancer? Pay cut? Doughnut shortage? No.

    “Cell phone.”

    Right.

    Cell phone videos go “viral” on their own without help. Jus happens n sheeit. A total cohenkydink. There is no alliance between news and social media, and certainly no computer algorithms or human selection involved.

    Conservative liberals like Fred Reed are gutless, disingenuous asses. Married to an “Hispanic” woman, is he? Residing in Meheeco?

    When has the existence of a video or the date of its release ever mattered to the Black Grievance Industry and its jewish Geppettos?

    Did it matter with Emmitt Till, Rodney King, or dozens of others?

    No, of course not.

    In July, 2011, police administered one of the worse beatings in modern history to Kelly Thomas.

    The video below captures Thomas’ beating by Fullerton, CA police and the aftermath. The beating was initiated by an obese “Hispanic” kwapper.

    Kelly Thomas was a homeless, schizophrenic white man of slight build.

    Video of Thomas’s murder never went viral. Interest in the case was predominately local:

    Hey Fred, ya dipshit, here are a few other videos/reports of police shootings that never generated any sustained interest for civil rights violations in the jewsmedia, BGI, corporate Amurica, or federal government:

    His name was James Boyd

    [MORE]

    His name was Zachary Hammond

    His name was Daniel Shaver

    Her name was Patricia Cook

    Her name was Justine Diamond Ruszczyk

    • Replies: @Biff
    , @fnn
  107. Anonymous[598] • Disclaimer says:
    @RoatanBill

    Let’s see. If the cops were any good, they’d show up and draw the chalk outline before the murder took place, right? There, that’ll do it; murders solved before they happen. As for speeding not having “definable victims” or consequences, it’s good to know for us motorists that Newton was wrong and velocity no longer plays a part in momentum during collisions. I have to admit I didn’t know this, so thanks for the heads up.

    By the way, the “average cop” is not a person, but actual cops, while they may not be your private security detail, will keep you and your family safe by making blacks looking to loot, burn, and rape your wife and kids think twice about cruising around in a fleet of armored SUVs with the license plates removed.

    • Replies: @RoatanBill
    , @Chris Mallory
  108. anarchyst says:
    @sonofman

    It’s not just “skin color” but DNA that is the determinant factor in behavior of blacks.

    Blacks are impulsive, have poor social self-control, no reasoning skills, and are amoral to boot. Blacks have great difficulty in following the “rules” of white-run society.

    Segregation is the only solution that can be imposed quickly.

    Repatriation to the African continent is the only permanent solution.

    Once they are repatriated to the African continent, they will have to make their way to their “tribe”.

    Blacks claim that “reparations” would cost the American taxpayer about 14 trillion dollars.

    I would consider that a “bargain” if “reparations” included a one-way ticket to the African continent with no possibility of returning to the USA. Revocation of American citizenship would be mandatory.

    This could be achieved by “microchipping” and “bar-coding” “reparations” recipients.

    Any attempt to return to the USA, once apprehended, would be dealt with extreme prejudice-execution.

    • Replies: @Hamlet's Ghost
  109. vot tak says:

    This one by Fred began well enough, but quickly devolved into the usual hit and miss that Fred’s exercises do. He seems to understand pindoland is facing a plethora of serious problems, but also doesn’t seem to be able to get much further than basic surface analysis of what the complications are in solving these problems. The sort of analysis one gets from pundits who rely mostly upon the propaganda pushed by the various zionazi-gay media wings in the west. He accepts a lot of the propaganda as fact, and the tries to reconcile that propaganda to the reality of america’s increasing problems trying to maintain the status quo among the “indentured” plebes.

    Example:

    “Sez me, there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks. Separate departments would further reduce antagonism.”

    That would only address part of the problem, the racism part. It would not do anything to solve what the underlying problems are. It is police corruption and the authoritarian use of the cops. Cops are not part of the communities they operate in. They are like an invading criminal mafioso tasked with keeping the community under control for the very rich, the oligarchs and their kin.

    Fred did discuss police corruption quite a lot in the article, but failed to see that it is systemic and at the core of the problems. The racism is one of the aspects of this systemic corruption because the sort of people deliberately recruited to be cops are authoritarian types, not cooperative types, and racism is common among these critters.

    Having black authoritarians police black communities and white authoritarians police white may sound good from a racist “seperate but equal” mindset, it would further keep society segregated, which is what these people essentially want. They don’t want to deal with others who are different. They want to be with only those who the consider like themselves.

    But therein lies the problem with the segregationist idea. The bigots, deprived of their obvious victims will simply redirect their bigotry to new victims. They will find new excuses for their mental defect to operate on.

    And most importantly, the police corruption and misuse of the police as an occupation army wont be much affected and will continue on.

    For a much more thoughtful and better analysis on how to solve the police problem and the racist policing, I highly recomend the ideas put forth by Dr. Jack Rasmus:

    Confronting Institutional Racism

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/confronting-institutional-racism/5714921

    Community control of the cops and political/bureaucracy. Make them accountable to the communities they serve. With serve being emphasized, not govern.

  110. @Hippopotamusdrome

    That’s no way to treat a Peaceful Protester! They should have tased her after she hit the ground for good measure.

  111. anonymous[400] • Disclaimer says:

    The no-knock raid is the handiwork of politicians who think it’s a great way to get the bad guys. The police carry it out and it’s easy to see that doing something like that entails a great deal of violence and that things will go frequently wrong. Ban those types of raids and other types of law enforcement that are unnecessary.
    Can’t have black cops police blacks since everyone is all spread out and it wouldn’t be feasible unless everyone was rigidly segregated. Might be theoretically appealing but not possible.
    The big issue here really boils down to blacks. Without them urban life would be quite tranquil.

  112. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @The Real and Original David

    LOL, you realize that you just reinforced the point I was making, don’t you? By doing fine, I meant that he was not medically in distress. I’m pretty sure you knew that, so all I can say is thanks. If you were additionally trying to say you don’t like him because he does bad things, that’s your prerogative. It’s a slippery slope though. Maybe some day you will be pulled over by a policeman who doesn’t like your political party. The Democrats/Republicans are responsible for a lot of terrible things you know. But maybe it’s not that, maybe you are Russian or Chinese…….

  113. Wielgus says:
    @Biff

    But Americans, or many of them, seem to think not being looted in return for medical care they receive is some kind of Bolshevism.

  114. Trump will err badly by trying to “reach out” to those who hate him.

    The cops, including the one who iced Floyd, remain in their job because of the inaction of the Democrats who control the cities and municipalities; they refuse to police the cops.

    Republicans will step in to take the blame for the inaction of the democrats who control all the big cities.

    Why would republicans do this?

    They are known as The Stupid Party for a reason

  115. FB says: • Website
    @The Scalpel

    Thanks, Doc…

    I notice that your comment has attracted a lot of responses from the shit-eating community here on UNZ…it’s important to note, though, that these troglodytes speak for nobody…

    A friend of mine is a psychiatrist…a cultured European woman with a private practice where she helps mostly middle aged women patients…recently she told me that a few of her patients have been distressed after having watched this snuff film either on the TV news or online…

    She describes it as a form of victimization…even watching violence in movies can be upsetting, even though we know it’s not real…watching actual violence and an actual killing can and does affect us in real way…she has had to prescribe medication for some of these distressed patients…

    Most of the population is not that sensitive, but we are still affected by such a graphic display of violence…that imagery is hard to erase from your mind’s eye…

    So the fact is that we are all victimized by these kinds of events occurring, and having to inevitably see all this unfolding before our eyes…

    This is why decent people are angry…who is going pay for us being victimized time and time again by this kind of sadistic violence by people who are supposed to work for our benefit…?

    Of course there are always the sociopath elements in society, like we see on this comment section…these are the ‘people’ we are hearing from here…these are the same ‘people’ that will actually pay to watch a snuff film, or even commission one if they have the means…instead of inducing empathy and distress, they manifest sadism and other destructive responses…

    Here’s the thing though…they are simply wired differently…their brain chemistry is NOT the same as normal people…[incidentally my doctor friend tells me that psychiatrists can quite accurately measure this brain chemistry by means of a multiple choice test, which I find rather ingenious…out of curiosity, I did have her administer this test several years back]…

    So there is no point in trying to reach these critters with anything that normal people can relate to…we simply take solace in the fact that these abnormal individuals are a very small percentage of the population…

    • Thanks: The Scalpel
  116. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @james wilson

    That’s a good point, though I assume we agree it doesn’t justify the police behavior.

  117. @Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist

    The riots stopped FIVE DAYS AGO, hasn’t “The Global Times” given you the memo? You and “Chinaman” should get a room.

  118. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Thomasina

    Police routinely bring suspects into the ER due to medical complaints. Some are exaggerated, some are not. I routinely see people exaggerating medical complaints most are not under arrest. Lots of reasons people do this. As a professional, I consider it part of the cost of doing businesses.

    “That foam coming out of his mouth, what does that tell us?“

    Probably that the police are lying. Were that the case, Floyd would not have been able to get out of the car under his own power. We know that is not the case.

    • Replies: @Thomasina
  119. @Anonymous

    Your comment is mentally lame and quite childish.

    The fact that cops don’t stop a crime before it happens means they are useless in fighting crime. Showing up after the fact provides them no credibility. No one can stop a crime before it happens but the police advertise their ‘services’ as being able to reduce crime or other nebulous ideas that the weak of mind buy into.

    How exactly do cops reduce crime? You can’t provide a testable mechanism because none exists.

    As for speeding, speed limits are arbitrary always ending in a 0 or 5. There is no possible mechanism to determine a safe speed given the various vehicle types and driver capabilities. It is just a way of fleecing the public. The average cop is a revenue source for the political regime he works for, nothing more.

    Investigators have a value to the society but cops don’t.

    Cops do not in the slightest keep anyone safe because they aren’t there when a home invader decides to target your abode. The only person that can keep you safe is you because you’re always on the scene. If the business owners defended their property with the threat of lethal force, they’d still have a business as opposed to a trashed or burned former business.

    • Agree: anarchyst
    • Replies: @Anonymous
  120. ronehjr says:

    We still have stupid old White men arguing over whether he was murdered or not. Who the hell cares. The people sponsoring these riots were going to provoke them one way or another. This is about bankrupting White people so there is no chance we can mobilize an effective resistance to our cultural replacement.

    • Agree: fnn
  121. Uncle Al says: • Website

    I can play that game.

    Able Lives Matter.
    White Lives Matter.
    Gifted Lives Matter.
    Citizen Lives Matter.
    Taxpayer Lives Matter.
    Homeowner Lives Matter.
    Saluting the Flag Matters.
    Heterosexual Lives Matter.
    Respecting the police Matters.
    Standing for the National Anthem Matters.
    Treating veterans with honor and medical care Matters.

    Strive for intellectual puberty, crush your enemies, then date. “…it is not right that matters, but victory.”

    youtu.be/dDpQmCGjEPc

  122. @Hippopotamusdrome

    How many more blows was honkey-cuck going to take from Ms. Kong before taking action?

    The black cop was fired for his heroic hook.

  123. Biff says:
    @Oldtradesman

    First I want to thank you for posting the link for Kelly Thomas. It’s a heart breaking story that should have gotten as much or “if it was a just world”, way more Attention than George Floyd, or anyone else – it was a ruthless beating, and an outright murder – with the perps walking free once again.

    Now, the rest of your shtick berating Fred – you can take that and cram it in your ass!

    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  124. Bert says:
    @thordaddy

    Why do you think Chauvin pulled Floyd out of the rear passenger-side door of the cruiser after Floyd was mostly in the rear seat? Pulled him out and on to the pavement.

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
    , @Wally
  125. Anon[202] • Disclaimer says:
    @Hang All Text Drivers

    Black lives do NOT matter. Very few become engineers or businessmen or scientists. The people that create wealth and give us our high standard of living. Blacks take up crime or go on welfare or get some do-nothing affirmative action job.

    Well said. The hypocrisy of BLM is astonishing to say the least. Case in point:

    There were 91 shootings resulting in 27 deaths in Chicago last weekend. 100 percent non-White and mostly Black-on-Black with the exception of Latin Kings gunning down a couple of loiters. Do those black lives matter or is it only the ones that can be used for the Left’s own virtue signaling?

    It sure will be entertaining to watch a once beautiful Scandinavian enclave [Minneapolis] quickly turn into another Mogadishu thanks to its incompetent, Marxist leadership.

    • Agree: Wally
  126. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Your reply suffers the ill of mystery (not contrived, but birthed by crippled thought and like expression).

    Not even magic could respond.

  127. @Truth

    Amazing, Truth, you found a reasonably articulate nigger. Hey, I’ve got a great idea: let’s get our history and current events lessons from HIM! A coss, he still be DOWN and shit, y’no’m’sayin, smokin mu’fu’n blunts on stage AN SHIT.
    Well done, monsieur!

  128. Ron Unz says:
    @JimDandy

    He most likely swallowed the drugs he had on him, and was dying from that point on.

    Well, I don’t have any medical expertise and I haven’t investigated the case, but offhand that sounds pretty plausible to me. It would explain why he apparently had such an extremely high level of Fentanyl in his blood, why he said he couldn’t breathe while still standing, and also why he died just a few minutes later. I think choking someone normally means compressing his windpipe, while the officer had his knee on the back of Floyd’s neck, which is something entirely different.

    I doubt the MSM will cover any of this. The NYT just purged its Editorial Page Editor for publishing an op-ed by a leading Neocon Republican senator and the Philadelphia Inquirer just purged its top editor because the paper published an article on the local mass looting that was insufficiently respectful towards the black looters.

    I also noticed that two of the world’s top medical journals, The Lancet and the New England Journal of Medicine just retracted very high-profile articles on Covid-19 treatment that apparently were apparently totally fraudulent. Evidence of the unreliability of our elite media is becoming more and more apparent.

  129. Wally says:
    @Anon

    said:
    “while the Community can hardly scream ‘Raycissim’ when their own are in charge:”

    – Say what?

    – “Hardly” my ass.

    Minneapolis police chief

  130. there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks. Separate departments would further reduce antagonism.
    ———————————-
    Sorry fred. This is called segregation. Societies don’t tend to go back in time. Not, at least, until a really long time has passed.
    Black cops are even harder on blacks than white cops.

    The main point of this riot: the Resistance is running scared. Obama, Rice, Clapper, Brennan and all the other criminals are running scared. They fear a Trump 2nd term in which the AG gets switched out to a crusader and the Treason trials begin.

    The Floyd video is a hoax. This is one of the biggest media swindles since 911.

    We have been in the middle of a slow motion coup since 2015.
    Welcome to the ‘Revolution’.

    • Replies: @Anon
  131. Juckett says:

    Talking Time is Over.Balkanize according to race, ideology and values.

  132. @Loup-Bouc

    Your writing problem is just as bad. Convoluted pedantry. The behavior of blacks, in terms of violent crime and more mundane matters like shutting the hell up on a subway car, is abysmal. None of your laughable pretentions can distract from this. But please continue, because you’re entertaining a lot of people here and elsewhere as I’m texting screenshots of your drivel to several people.

  133. Redman says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Was there a third autopsy? I only have heard of the 2 thus far.

  134. @sonofman

    That’s the South. Not the Northern US industrial zone.

    German and Polish and Italian immigrants were not joined at the hip with Africans.

    Most of them arrived long after the Civil War. For example, Trump’s grandparents.

    Africans are phenomenon of the Southeastern States.

    The Northern industrial base was a result of European immigration.

  135. @Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist

    Try to insert a little bit of class into your thought and your website.
    Polish it up a little bit.

  136. Sez me, there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks. Separate departments would further reduce antagonism. Let blacks decide whether and how they want to be policed and let them do it. Since the races don’t like each other and separate when allowed, semi -autonomous urban regions might be a good idea.

    You should visit Chicago. It’s already largely like that and it makes no difference.

    Of course it’s not completely like that because it can’t be. 2 of the cops involved with Floyd’s death were black. Black mayors and black councilmen and black sheriffs will still hire white police because they have a hard time getting enough competent cops without them.

    https://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/December-2014/The-Trouble-with-Robbins/

    Cops have been kneeling on people’s head and neck for a decade or more. It was an approved procedure in MN. Most of them do not die. Floyd also had (besides the cop kneeling on his neck) a heart problem, an overdose level of fentanyl, and coronavirus.

    Floyd was resisting, they could not get him into the car. What are they suppose to do? Should they have tazed him, or beaten him with billy clubs? He may have died that way too, and then people would still scream murder. Any kind of physical fight is going to be somewhat dangerous.

    I suppose since they had a couple of black cops handy they could have just had the black cops beat him unconscious and stick him in the car.

    But this is not viable in most places unless you somehow succeed in going full blown, separate countries and population transfer levels of segregation. Black people do not just stay in black areas. What are cops in a white area suppose to do with black criminals that come in? They don’t have enough black cops to police black criminals by themselves, and black cops generally can’t do an effective job of it anyway.

    In your last post, you were basically saying that this happened to him because he was black and it couldn’t happen to you. That’s BS. There are plenty of examples. If you acted like Floyd, the cops would kneel on your neck too. And maybe even if you didn’t.

    • Agree: anon8383892
  137. American Imperialist Hegemony is such that there is even Outrage Imperialism.

    If there are riots in the US over something, other nations must follow and imitate.

    Hegemonic Riots.

    If US decides to destroy a nation like Iraq, Libya, or Syria, there is the Coalition of the Willing.

    If US decides to burn down its cities, there is the Coalition of the Chillin’.

  138. BuelahMan says:

    Personally, I am not at all convinced that the dude is dead.

  139. FB says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    I think choking someone normally means compressing someone’s windpipe, while the officer had his knee on the back of Floyd’s neck, which is something entirely different.

    Well…considering you have zero professional knowledge in medicine and appear to take medical advice from the likes of Munchhausen Karlin, it’s hard to see how anyone can take your pronouncements seriously…

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    , @The Scalpel
  140. @Ron Unz

    why he said he couldn’t breathe while still standing

    Seems reasonable overall, just an aside here, so many people keep talking about this like it means something.

    “I can’t breathe” has become a slogan. Practically every black person who resists arrest now says this while resisting. Even before Floyd’s death Amazon was selling it printed on t-shirts.

    https://www.amazon.com/i-cant-breathe-shirt/s?k=i+can%27t+breathe+shirt

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  141. @RoatanBill

    We need investigators and detectives to find out who did it,

    After you find out, what then? Hmmmmm?

    In the movies, the police always arrest the wrong person. In medicine that would qualify as a false positive. Not to worry. Perry Mason will expose the error.

    In the perfect world of Movieland.

    Maybe the problem is that the world isn’t perfect. And never will be. Our solutions have to be the best available, not some utopian dream.

    • Replies: @RoatanBill
  142. @Loup-Bouc

    Referring someone to go back and read your past posts is not answering a question.
    In 2016, blacks killed 533 Whites. Whites killed 243 blacks.
    In 2018, blacks committed 550,000 violent crimes against whites. Whites committed 57,000 violent crimes against blacks.
    In 2016,Whites (65% of the population) committed 3197 murders. In 2016,blacks(14% of the population) committed 3156 murders. Whites commit 16 murders per 1,000,000 population. Blacks commit 75 murders per 1,000,000 population.

    There is no way to finger wave those numbers away. As a population, blacks are more violent than whites.

    • Thanks: V. Hickel
    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  143. Anonymous[598] • Disclaimer says:
    @RoatanBill

    All right. At least we agree each of us is responsible for defending his home and family from black and Hispanic savages.

    • Replies: @RoatanBill
  144. Fred777 says:

    Poor Loop-Boop, reality keeps undermining his intellectualism.

  145. schrub says:

    Blacks now exist only to perform their one function: to vote for the Democratic Party candidates in all circumstances in order to prevent the hated white goyim from ever re-seizing power. The black population’s 13% of the vote is absolutely vital to prevent these hated white gentiles from ever escaping the Jewish yoke.

    If the blacks were to lose this function by voting Republican in any significant number (by voting for Trump for example) they would be of absolutely no further use and be put on the rubbish bin so to say. The Jewish controlled media wold then declare that the now useless rioting black lawbreakers were a “threat to civilization” and demand that nothing less than 52-bombers be used to quell any uprisings in the black community, especially those uprisings that were becoming a threat to nearby Jewish neighborhoods and businesses. .

    Black riots (and the resulting looting) are nothing new. They have happened may times in the past.

    Way back in 1943 for instance, newly arrived blacks, thankful for all the newly created wartime jobs in a places like Detroit that had allowed them to escape their previous poverty in the southern states, rewarded their northern benefactors by staging a gargantuan riot there that required no less than 6,000 federal troops to end.

    In fact, World War Two offered discerning black rioters an absolutely splendid choice of seemingly never ending places in which to engage in their favorite hobby. Somehow this long series of wartime riots seems to have escaped coverage by our “unbiased” media. This media has also chosen to ignore black military mutinies that occurred during this same period. Read about this hidden and heavily sanitized (WIKI-ized) history here.

    interestingly, there are no correspondingly significant riots during this period in the “similarly downtrodden” Hispanic communities other than the highly hyped but relatively minor “Zoot Suit Riots” in southern California.

    Wartime riots (almost too numerous to count)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1943_Detroit_race_riot

    Military mutinies, anyone?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African-American_mutinies_in_the_United_States_Armed_Forces

  146. @Anonymous

    As for speeding not having “definable victims” or consequences, it’s good to know for us motorists that Newton was wrong and velocity no longer plays a part in momentum during collisions.

    You do realize that speed limits are set abnormally low for the sole purpose of raising revenue? The engineering standard is to set the speed limit at the speed driven by 85% of drivers. Because most people drive a safe speed. But speeds are arbitrarily set to cause most people to break them.

    A decade ago, my town upgraded a two lane winding road with no shoulders into a five lane, mostly straight road with sidewalks. It turned into an instant speed trap because the city set the speed limit at 30mph. The chief of police on the witness stand admitted that road department studies had shown that on that road, 90% of drivers drove faster than the posted speed limit.
    There is a four lane very limited access divided highway between two local towns. For years the speed was set at 45mph. Not because it was the top safe speed but because it gave KSP a place to poach citizens for speeding tickets.

    Roaming blacks raping and looting won’t get very far in areas where the people are armed. The police protect them from us, not us from them.

  147. An excellent set of observations, Mr. Reed. As the comments suggest you have made enough irrefutable observations with obvious implications to thoroughly upset partisans on both sides of this issue.

    I think that growing numbers of rational Americans are beginning to realize that some form of racial segregation is the only long-term solution to our current racial problems.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  148. @Biff

    There have been some protests for Taylor in Kentucky.

  149. JimDandy says:

    Swallowing drugs to avoid arrest is a common–and often fatal–practice:

    https://www.tmz.com/2019/12/09/juice-wrld-swallowed-percocet-pills-hide-federal-agents-possible-overdose/

    In the videos of Floyd’s arrest, he collapses as soon as he exits the car and then has to be half-carried to a wall, where he collapses again. Fentanyl and other intoxicants were in his bloodstream (as was COVID 19) and he was suffering from heart disease.

    And, yes, the elite media seems to now exist only as a propaganda machine. Virtually every story is stretched, chopped, and shaped to fit The Narrative, and the truth always dies in the process. The patron saint of today’s MSM is Procrustes.

    I was aware of how worthless those studies on hydroxichroiquine were only because I spent a great deal of time on alternative media sites researching the issue. But it has been even harder to get to the truth in the Floyd case. For instance, was the technique the officer used (knee to the back of the neck) sanctioned by his police department, or not?

  150. jsm says:
    @fredyetagain aka superhonky

    Can you imagine? A White cop paid the same, to police only White areas? Same money, much less danger to his personal self? WOW would that job ever be in demand! With no Affirmative Action to deal with, you could truly pick and choose the best of the best.

  151. Ragno says:

    After last week’s George Floyd was murdered! entry, which was mainly an opportunity to do the SPLC a solid by bashing VDare and, by extension, white nationalists and their quote “sullen racial hatred” unquote, I commented:

    See you next week, I suppose, for another chapter from that book you’ve been compiling for two decades now: How Blacks Are Simply Impervious To Civilization, or, You Can’t Co-Exist With A Cannibal.

    Can I call ’em, or can I call ’em? Apparently, should an American Negro visit the Reeds unannounced, Inez or Amparo or whatever her name is makes sure to disinfect all the drinking glasses and cutlery, and the toilet seat twice.

  152. @lloyd

    It helps to read and to try to comprehend what you’re reading before making a comment if you’d like to avoid the appearance of mongoloidism.

  153. @Biff

    First, I want to kindly acknowledge your thanking me for the Kelly Thomas video.

    Second, I want to acknowledge that you and Fred are jackholes.

    Conservative liberals are hypocritical scum.

  154. @HallParvey

    You have provided zero evidence that cops provide a needed service.

    Investigators hand their info over to the prosecution and then the courts figure out what to do. But you know that.

    Show me where the average street cop is worth having around. Sow me where they prevent crime or do anything useful in that regard.

    You can’t do that can you?

    • Replies: @HallParvey
  155. @Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist

    Most people aren’t saying that murder is justified by someone’s criminal history. But a lot of people are dumbfounded that so many places have been looted and burned over the death of this vile piece of shit. A man who would rob a pregnant woman at gunpoint, and pistol whip her too, no matter how long ago, gets zero tears from sensible people.

    Justice is not the concern. Chauvin was sitting in jail facing serious charges before most of the civil unrest began. BLM/ Antifa are communists and anarchists with the goal of finishing off the west (aided and abetted by the lugenpresse) in order to establish a non-capitalist dictatorship.

    George Floyd is just an excuse for these turds. One good thing about him though, was that he was the first American in about ten weeks to die of something other than corona.

    • Agree: Ace
    • Thanks: Achmed E. Newman
  156. JimDandy says:
    @FB

    Oh, this guy says something? Well, if some random virtue-signaling fame-seeking Youtube Dr. says something, why even bother having a trial?

    Even the authors of the politicized autopsy report had to admit that it was “not a legal determination of culpability or intent.”

  157. @Anonymous

    Then provide some rational explanation what the average street cop is good for besides handing out jaywalking and traffic tickets to fleece the citizenry where no victim can be identified.

    He is paid to fleece you and me to pay for his salary AND to shield the political class against the deplorables.

    Go ahead – describe how the average cop benefits the society. I dare you.

  158. J says:
    @Ron Unz

    It is not only “Evidence of the unreliability of our elite media” but of the lack of seriousness of America’s top university. Why should a Harvard Professor fake research data? Political reasons? Comrade Lysenko would thrive in USA 2020.

  159. Anon[202] • Disclaimer says:
    @steinbergfeldwitzcohen

    We have been in the middle of a slow motion coup since 2015.
    Welcome to the ‘Revolution’.

    Now is the appropriate time that people should familiarize themselves with the works of Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. Get ready for another Bolshevik Revolution my friends.

    • Replies: @Bill Jones
  160. Herald says:
    @thordaddy

    You see what you want to see, obviously.

    • Replies: @thordaddy
  161. @Proudly Unaffiliated

    “Policing can be fixed if we focus on a community policing model, not a SWAT-in-a-cruiser, paramilitary model.”

    You’re making the all-too-common mistake of thinking that the purpose of the police is to “serve and protect” the citizenry when it is clearly to serve and protect the Ruling Class FROM the community. That’s why the SWAT-in-a-cruiser model is the default. “Community policing” offers no effective way for the State to keep the proles in line.

  162. @Proudly Unaffiliated

    ” it actually has nothing to do with race, racism, or any kind of discrimination. What this is about is policing”

    This particular case has nothing to do with policing either. It’s obviously about stirring up violence, theft and vandalism to justify a lockdown. The conjob virus pretext has unraveled so something else is being used.

    Indications of fakery are fairly easy to spot in this narrative. The cellphone video is the first one. You have three cops working one arrestee, with only one of them busy restraining the guy. The other two allow someone to shoot a long video without even trying to stop the recording.

    That could mean that either it isn’t a cellphone video, but instead a bodycam video, (but it’s too well framed for a bodycam recording) or the video was made and released deliberately and the cops were just doing as told knowing it was a production.

    Chauvin’s performance is too phony to be believed. He’s putting almost no effort into restraining Floyd. It’s just too convenient that someone who obviously intended to release the video was allowed to stand there and record for such a long time. The other two cops could have (and definitely would have) stopped him and taken his phone from him. We see that happening every day.

    It looks like a setup to me. Are there other phone vids that capture the person recording the scene? I haven’t seen any. With all of this going on, starting with the arrest and everything else leading up to the pindown of Floyd, there should be at least one other vid that shows who is shooting the video that was released and has been used by every MSM outlet. There are lots of other videos, but I haven’t seen one that shows a wider angle of the pindown, including the person recording the media’s favorite video.

    I would like to hear from others who noticed examples of fakery. Youtube videos that attempt to analyze and list fakery in the video(s) and the behavior of the cops are taken down soon after being put up. I’m sure I’ve missed more than one of them.

  163. anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anonymous

    Azzmador, host of the Krypto Report podcast has for years played the 911 tapes of a white mentally ill homeless man, who while off his meds and abusing cocaine, called Dallas 911 himself because he was having a psychotic episode and was desperately afraid he was overdosing and panicked. He had committed no crime but perhaps disturbing the peace.

    In spite of already being doubled cuffed by the hands and feet by a private security guard, three Dallas cops on arrival used the prescribed knee on upper back/neck restraining technique for 11 or more minutes until the paramedics arrived. The cops were recorded joking that the man was perhaps dead when he apparently lost consciousness or stopped panicking. He was pronounced dead by the paramedics on arrival.

    None of the police were found guilty of misconduct or violating procedure. Maybe they were in fact following department guidelines as prescribed. Tragic as the situation was perhaps that was the only conclusion that could be made in spite of the family’s loss.

    My point in an ideal world cops would be allowed the discretion on how much force to use in individual cases based on perceived risk. In the George Floyd case where there was credible risk to the officers of attack by a large powerful man who one of the officers knew what Floyd would be capable of as a former bouncer, the knee on the upper back/neck technique seems justifiable.

    Using the same krav maga technique on the mentally ill or Palestinian teenagers for that matter seems brutal and excessive.

    But how can a police department avoid charges of racism if discretion if applied given the disproportionate violent tendencies of black males?

    Like the normies like to say ALL LIVES MATTER!!!

    • Replies: @Matt07924
    , @Bill Jones
  164. @csucsu

    let the blacks have they own country . Carve out three or four states for them.

    Good idea, on one condition: that they agree to accept all of the USSA’s woke whites in their midst.

    How about giving them Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, and Georgia? Those four states should be big enough to hold 41.5 million dindus, plus 60 million libtard whites (I’m being conservative here and estimating that this consists of about 25 percent of the white population). Granted, conditions might get a bit cramped, but hey, not our problem.

    Let the roundups and deportations to the new Dindustan began!

    • Replies: @Jim Sweeney
    , @Csucsu
  165. @lloyd

    Absolutely correct Floyd the criminal was murdered by Chauvin’s poisonous farts, as he was sitting on his head.

  166. Blankaerd says:
    @Dr. Doom

    Sacking of Constantinople led to the Renaissance? What?

    No. Little ice age starting in 1300 and resulting mass-famines and disease (i.e. black death) is what led to the Renaissance because it killed off all the people with low intelligence, poor immune systems and other undesirable traits. Thus leaving far more resources to the more intelligent and healthier survivors.

  167. Redman says:
    @JimDandy

    The restraint was apparently widely used and approved of by the police conduct manual.

    Floyd’s lawyer hired famed medical examiner Dr. Baden to conduct a second autopsy. He confirmed there was asphyxiation from the knee-hold by “watching the video.” Who needs a medical license for that?

    Of course last year when the same guy said Jeff Epstein didn’t kill himself, most of the MSM treated him like a nut job “conspiracy theorist.” It all depends on who’s controlling the narrative.

    • Agree: JimDandy
    • Replies: @JimDandy
  168. @Bert

    Good question. I don’t like watching snuff and didn’t follow all the available footage so I can only speculate. Bouncers are well known to sell drugs and given Floyd’s record he was probably doing that at his previous workplace. Chauvin, moonlighting for many years as a bouncer at the same club, probably wasn’t a clean cop. Recognising him, Floyd perhaps started pleading with him to let him go and could have started bringing up something he knew about Chauvain’s own illicit activities from their past working together to persuade him to let him go. Chauvin panicked and tried to shut him up so that the other cops wouldn’t hear what Floyd was saying, especially given that there was a rookie cop there, and took it too far. Also, Chauvin trying to prove to others, and the camera, that he wasn’t soft on criminals, although perhaps himself having been involved in criminal activities known to Floyd. Maybe if he had been first on the scene he would have let Floyd go, but under the circumstances he wanted to shut him up, and overdid it. Just a guess.

  169. Matt07924 says:
    @Proudly Unaffiliated

    Police culture is corrupt and the qualified immunity (thanks to the nine assholes in black robes) is icing on the cake. They can kill with impunity. Also, the police unions control the mayor and DA per PAC spending. This is beyond reform. To me police are enforcers and not helpers. They are doing the bidding of the oligarchy…keeping all of us rabble rousers away from the elite.

    To me the protests are about many things but the police brutality is a big factor. It was proven true by the numerous videos of police beating people senseless. They do not care!

    • Replies: @Emslander
  170. Patricus says:
    @Jamie_NYC

    And Mr. Floyd has an interesting criminal record to include armed robbery and years in prison. Other than that he was apparently a stellar citizen gettin his life together through the grace of our good Lord. By the way the cop has not yet been convicted. You know there is a quaint process whereby the accused may confront his accusers–a trial and all that boring stuff. It is just possible the short video clip doesn’t tell the whole story. Some say we don’t need no more evidence–the video explains all that is to be known. These are the kinds of people who are looting department stores and convenience stores. Attention Mexican law enforcement: watch out for Fred Reed.

  171. @Loup-Bouc

    And my above-cited comments prove that either (a) Blacks are not genetically predisposed to commit violent crimes or property-thefts or (b) no one has been able to show, validly, reliably, that Blacks are so predisposed…

    Your comments do not prove anything you pompous clown. They consist of you highlighting/speculating as to problems with statistics (stats being attempts to assert truths via empiricism). So your posts are attempts at disproving others’ assertions of fact, and in-depth versions of the “lies, damn lies and statistics”

    The FACT is that, this time (the George Floyd murder protest time), most rioters have been White or of another non-Black ethnicity.

    You spend your whole time trying to dismantle statistics that don’t fit your view, but then start asserting things as “FACT” without reference to any kind of proof. Absurd hypocrisy, I think a mark of deranged pomposity/narcissism.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  172. @The Alarmist

    “If policing blacks with white cops leads to burning cities, why keep doing it?

    “They can’t find enough black folk to pass both the written tests and the background character checks?”

    If they, under a separate police department, want to be, or don’t mind being policed by their fellow dindus who have felony records, who are we to tell them they can’t employ these people as cops?

  173. Matt07924 says:
    @anonymous

    Sorry….you lost me on George Floyd.

    There is NO reason for anyone to die passing a fake $20 bill. There are lots of ways to restrain someone….George Floyd did not have to die. It is clear that the police officers are murderers and displayed depraved indifference.

    • Replies: @anonymous
    , @Working Serf
  174. @Current History

    Progressive liberalism has replaced Christianity as the new state religion.

    Religion has little to do with facts or logic. People adopt religions to give them a sense of purpose, a code of conduct to adhere to, and a catechism to remind themselves that they are good people, and are on the side of the forces of light and goodness and not evil.

    Like it or not, Homo Sapiens is a religious animal. He is not so much rational as rationalizing.

  175. gotmituns says:

    I don’t give a rat’s butt about any blacks on this planet. I’m always for the White guy.

  176. Whackawhack … priceless!

  177. Agent76 says:

    May 28, 2020 #GeorgeFloyd Before Being Killed At The Hands Of Police Talking About Street Violence Killings

    Video of George Floyd Before being Killed talks about the violence on the streets.

  178. @anarchyst

    No reparations without repatriation.

    • Agree: anarchyst
    • Replies: @Allan
  179. fnn says:
    @Oldtradesman

    Douglas Zerby:

    Tony Timpa:

    • Thanks: Talha
  180. Jamm says:
    @Jim Richard

    There have been hundreds of uses of that neck restraint by Minneapolis police in recent years with no deaths prior to Floyd, so yeah, suggesting.

    “Since 2015, Minneapolis police have used neck restraints 237 times with 44 people falling unconscious, according to NBC News.

    Minneapolis is joining the majority of police departments in major cities: in a 2013 Justice Department survey, 43% of departments in cities with more than 1 million people allow neck restraint in some form.”

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mattperez/2020/06/05/minneapolis-city-council-agrees-to-ban-use-of-chokeholds-by-police/#d5bebd937a2b

  181. SafeNow says:

    The Covid aspect to racial unrest bears mentioning. The era of Covid monetary relief has inured the U.S. to simply printing money, and lots of it, and fast. The U.S. will now print again, with a capital T and that rhymes with P and that stands for Peace. The U.S. has never hesitated to spend money to purchase social peace. Christopher Caldwell asked, What did $20 trillion in debt buy? His answer: “social peace”. Surely the U.S. will not hesitate now. Besides the cash, the new administration will implement enhanced affirmative action, set-asides, and criminal-justice reform. Signing-off from S. California, where free-shoe-takers carry calculators, because if it’s less than $900, there’s nothing to see here.

  182. Delta G says:
    @Ron Unz

    The question is whether “The Scalpel” is a Doctor or a Quack. He could be a surgeon based on his Nick Name which would mean he has very little between his ears. Just a point to consider.

    • Replies: @FB
  183. anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @Matt07924

    Matt

    You are not listening. Police departments have been using these krav maga tactics on many cases not just large powerful black men, it has become an inflexible department policy for over a decade. The media knows these tactics are used in wide variety of cases even when I am sure the police would like to have more freedom of judgement as in the case I mentioned.

    You have video of city workers who call the cops in lots of blue state cities where open air drug use is tolerated who are simply trying to clean the streets of filth. Some of the homeless/mentally ill are harmless, others of these disease ridden who will bite/scratch/kick/punch/etc the cops and city worker, most are unpredictable. What do you want cops to do??

    Personally, I would like the police to retain the option of using their best judgement in evaluating risk to themselves and the community. I can accept some errors in judgement will be made. Tragedies like the Dallas case will occur regardless.

    But maximizing Anti-Racism leaves the choice between de-policing and inflexible police procedure.

    Same thing as letting suspected jihadis take pilot lessons one year then making great grandma take off her shoes so she can get on an airplane the next.

    The trend now seems that you will get your wish to see de-policing implemented on a far and unprecedented scale.

    Hope you can live with the consequences as the homicide rate sky rockets especially for blacks.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
    , @FB
  184. Shaman911 says:

    Shes a Freemason. Nuff said

    Ordo Ab Chao

  185. @mocissepvis

    Why not give black people Puerto Rico? There would be regional compatibility with other island blacks and the island would become more developed with more people losing its jungle appearance and being urbanized.

    Woke corporations and people could easily move there and PR could become its own country under protection by US military for a period of time with black military given preference if they volunteer.

  186. Awash says:

    Fred, your title for the article is misleading. You cheated. Confused racist.

  187. @The Scalpel

    You are missing the point. Who cares how quickly drugs dissipate in the body?

    Black people: Stop resisting when arrested.

    High or not. Guilty or not. It makes no nevermind.

    STOP RESISTING.

    And meanwhile, “doctor?” Stop mansplaining thugs who are high, ok?

    Thanks, doc.

  188. @Twodees Partain

    I’ve noticed video fakery and presentation fakery.

    The latter: in televised news reports. police officers who are supposedly in custody, the mugshots show no horizontal lines indicating height. This may seem like nit picking but I would suggest that it is really critical. America is a very large country with 3 LEVELS OF GOVERNMENT. Policies and procedures become critical in bureaucracy especially when the low-level and mid-level troops are low IQ. All 3 levels of government in the U.S. are full of affirmative action hires. In order for the bureacracy to work the designers of policies and procedures don’t leave much, if any, latitude to the troops to make decisions. Following procedures like a mindless drone is de rigeur.

    Given this context, how is it that the photos of the police officers, purported to be mug shots, have no horizontal lines?

    This is just ONE anomaly that I’ve noticed. The other anomalies involve the relationship between Chauvin and Floyd, the fact that Chauvin had neighbors of 20 years who had no idea he was a cop, the ‘EMT”s on the scene didn’t follow procedures in the chain of custody, etcetera ad nauseum.

    [MORE]
    Finally, timing. The race-baiting Jewish media had already primed the pump with the story of Ahmed ‘the jogger’ Arbery. Then along comes Floyd, a Black Police chief of a dysfunctional police department and a Jewish mayor. This is just so juicy the story writes itself. The bottom line: I just don’t believe what they are saying. After decades of watching the ‘media’ lie and concoct stories while simultaneously watching the ‘media’ become more and more consolidated viz a vis ownership (fewer and fewer and all Jewish) why would I believe anything they say? Icing on the cake: Obama did some kind of legislation/executive order re: media & propaganda that allows more duplicity by the MSM. Sorry, I am fuzzy on the details on this.

    Analogy: vicious, psychotic neighbor’s basement dwelling son is a pathological liar who tortures animals and sets them on fire. Why would I believe him/accept his testimony in criminal/civil court let alone turn my back on the maniac? The rational response is to install a home alarm system, get legal advice and arm oneself.

    Unfortunately, the English speaking media is gone. We lost it over the last 30 years, if we ever truly had a free press, to Jewish Billionaire psychopaths and their lapdogs in the UniParty.
    At the same time, we have an important Cabinet member, Esper, countermanding the President’s orders on troop movements this Wednesday past and a former member of government, Mattis, openly criticizing Trump.

    If I were a paranoid, Christian like Rick Wiles on TruNews I might start talking ‘Jew Coup’! But hey, accusing the elite of our society of TREASON is dangerous business and I could leave it guys like Bongino and Wiles to make accusations but I won’t.

    I smell Jewish Treason. They did it during the Reconquista of Spain from the Moors: jews made side deals with the Muslims and opened the City gates; Christians were murdered, raped and enslaved. You will never, ever see any admission of guilt for Jewish treason, Jewish mass murders (many historical examples including the Jewish Bolshevik run HOLODOMOR) or other horrible behavior.. I see the same treasonous behavior now that Jewish elites have engaged in throughout history. Past behavior is a good predictor of future actions.
    European Christian America is not stupid. People understand what is happening. They are prepared for this. As long as there is a sound base of sane Americans in rural and small-town America I don’t see that any attempt to implement a Communist revolution will be successful. That doesn’t mean, however, that it won’t be bloody.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  189. More whites are killed by cops than blacks.
    Black cops kill more readily than white.
    Women cops kill more readily than men.
    If confronted by a black woman cop lie down and play dead.

  190. This just in from the Russian Internet.
    From Russia with condolences:

    [MORE]

    For how many days now the most powerful state on the planet is taking leave of one of its best
    sons. Even Presidents are not buried like this. A gold casket, hundreds of thousands grieving
    and weeping, thousands of kneeling idiots begging forgiveness from the Black population in
    some states. The mayor of Minneapolis holding on to the casket in order to not collapse from
    grief, pressed to the corpse of one of the most worthy of the worthiest citizens of America, the

    mayor sheds crocodile tears and excess mucus. His sobs are riddled with wailing cries of “forgi-
    i-i-v-e-e me-e-e-e-.” The former wife of the slain one sobs drowning in her own drool. True, the

    last time she saw him was six years ago when he left her with a three month old daughter. He
    never once sent his former wife any money for the child but the unfortunate widow has already
    been screaming for a week how she was left without anything to live on. Because of this
    heartache, Americans have collected little by little $20,000,000 and the money is still coming in.
    The University of Massachusetts has set up a scholarship in the name of George Floyd. Could
    this learned husband read? We don’t know. Probably not. They don’t teach literacy in prisons. If
    events continue to unfold at this tempo, soon the Nobel Prize will be renamed “the Floyd.”
    The Great Floyd was sentenced to prison for theft, for selling narcotics, armed robbery (the last
    time clenching the throat of a pregnant woman while he pressed the barrel of a gun to her belly
    demanding money)… then he went for a plea bargain, gave up all his counterfeit bills for which
    he received a reduced sentence. At the autopsy narcotics were found in his blood. Such is the
    national hero of 21st

    century America. We could not preserve this ray of light and so we remain
    in his debt. The work of Floyd lives on and grows. Massive robberies, felonies and rapes in
    mark of respect and grief for George whip through the Blue States of America. Reduced to
    rubble are the pretty neighborhoods of various cities including New York and Los Angeles. 89
    policemen have been killed, a seventeen year old girl has been frightfully raped. Hundreds of
    Police and other cars have been burned, streets have been destroyed, squares, park lanes,
    swans living contentedly in city ponds have had their necks wrung… (until we meet again,
    Floydniks)…

    With an advancing form of senile dementia, Joe Biden, candidate for the presidency of the
    United States, also fell on his knees today. True, he could not get up himself and needed help
    but this will not daunt hundreds of thousands of admirers of Saint Floyd. They will vote in the
    elections for this redemption, for which, indeed, the Democrats are striving, not regretting
    anything. On your knees? No problem—on your knees!!! Face in the excrement?— with great
    pleasure!!! Anything you say, “Floydies.” And what is sad is that such is the whole Democratic
    party.

    [What they don’t know in Russia is that this is one of the “dirty tricks” of American Party Politics,
    with a little help from the Deep State. Floyd is a psy-op. He did not exist like the planes of 9/11 did
    not exist. After all, all is fair in love and war.]

    Который день самая мощная держава планеты прощается с одним из лучших своих
    сынов. Так не хоронят даже президентов. Золотой гроб, сотни тысяч скорбящих и
    рыдающих, тысячи коленопреклоненных идиотов просят прощения у чёрного населения
    некоторых штатов. Мэр Миниаполиса, уцепившись руками за гроб (чтоб не упасть от горя)
    с телом достойнейшего из достойных граждан Америки, льёт крокодильи слёзы и сопли.
    Рыдания его прерываются криками “Проооостииии”, иииии……. опять продолжаются по
    нарастающей. Захлебываясь слюной, рыдает бывшая жена убиенного, правда,
    последний раз она видела его 6 лет назад, когда он бросил её с трёхмесячной дочкой.
    Денег на дочь за эти годы он не послал бывшей жене ни разу, но несчастная вдова уже
    неделю кричит о том, что осталась без кормильца, а посему сердобольные американцы
    собрали ей с миру по нитке 20000000 долларов, и деньги продолжают поступать.
    Масачусетский университет учредил стипендию имени Джорджа Флойда. Умел ли сей
    учёный муж хотя бы читать, мы не знаем, скорее всего – нет. В тюрьмах этому не учат.
    Если события будут разворачиваться подобными темпами, то, не ровен час, Нобелевскую

    премию переименуют во Флойдовскую.
    Великий Флойд сидел за грабежи, за распространение наркотиков, за вооружённые
    разбои (в последний раз, держа своей клешней за горло беременную женщину и
    приставив дуло пистолета к её животу, он требовал денег)………. после пошёл на сделку
    со следствием, сдал всех своих подельников, чем на несколько лет сократил себе срок
    заключения. При вскрытии его тела, в крови обнаружили наркотики. Вот таков
    национальный герой Америки 21-ого века. Не уберегли мы свой луч света. Но остались
    последователи. Дело Флойда живёт и разрастается. Массовые грабежи и насилия, в знак
    уважения и скорби по Джорджу, захлестнули демократические штаты США. Разнесены в
    хлам красивейшие районы разных городов, включая Нью Йорк и Лос Анджелес. Убиты 89
    полицейских. Страшно изнасилована 17-ти летняя девочка, сожжены сотни полицейских,
    и не только, машин, обгажены и заблеваны улицы, площади, аллеи парков, свернуты шеи
    лебедей, живущих сыто и вольготно в каждом городском пруду……….(до встречи с
    Флойдовцами)………
    Кандидат в Президенты Соединённых штатов Джо Байден с тяжёлой формой
    старческой деменции, сегодня тоже пал на колени, встать сам, правда, не смог,
    понадобилась помощь, но сотни тысяч почитателей “святого Флойда” это не смутило. Они
    будут голосовать на выборах за это ископаемое, чего, собственно, демократы и
    добиваются, не гнушаясь ничем. На колени?! Не вопрос – на колени!!!! Мордой в
    дерьмо?!…… С нашим превеликим удовольствием!!!!! Всё, что прикажете, “Флойды”!!! И,
    что противно, что почти вся демократическая партия страны такова.

  191. JimDandy says:
    @Redman

    So what is the basis of the charges against him?

  192. Csucsu says:
    @mocissepvis

    Great idea it is going to be a happiest country in a world . No racism , just kumbaya all the way . It is going to be an envi of the whole world . This is a real opportunity for blacks to show us dumb whites how to run a tolerant society.

  193. Charlemagne says: • Website
    @Proudly Unaffiliated

    I’m a cop and entirely concur with abolishing police in those locals where the beautiful people want us defunded. By all means.
    Can’t wait when you get robbed, raped and murdered by your pets. Sorry I wasn’t available. I was at the labor department waiting on my benefits.

  194. anonymous[391] • Disclaimer says:
    @fnn

    Thank you for finding the Tony Timpa video that I already mentioned. It is very hard to watch. Still I don’t think technically the Dallas cops violated procedure and that is why none of them were dismissed.

    We have come to value anti-racism so much that we have abolished discretion because in all fairness whites are less violent to blacks and would be granted discretion more often.

    To hell with

    “To Serve and Protect”

    Now the motto is

    “Krav Maga For One and All”

  195. SafeNow says:

    “The question is whether “The Scalpel” is a Doctor or a Quack.”

    Arguably, there is no difference. A 2016 Johns Hopkins report concluded that there are 250,000 annual deaths due to medical negligence. The third-leading cause of death.

    But in defense of the doctors, I will say that they are overworked. Print some money, what the heck, and double the number of doctors. Covid relevance: Hypertension and diabetes, the #1 and #3 comorbidities for severe cases, are highly treatable. But that takes a lot of fastidious, empiric trial-and-error. Sure, it will take 7 years to train the additional docs, but Covid will probably be with us —— saying-the-unsayable alert —- forever.

  196. Anon[375] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Scalpel

    I’d assume that everyone here is making case B.

    And case B DOES matter. It would be a HUGE game-changer if this knee-to-neck was understood to be a non-lethal way of restraining people that does not actually suffocate them, which was taught in the academy in which Chauvin trained.

    It would be the difference between the cop choking him for no good reason because he is a racist who just wants to kill black people, full-well knowing that he was choking him, and the cop trying to subdue him, with the belief that the technique he was using was verified by his department as safe.

    The difference between these two possibilities could be the difference between massive riots and no riots.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
    , @Loup-Bouc
  197. @MarkinLA

    True. Flashmobs loot without rioting. That’s been a thing for several years now. A riot is an outgrowth of some protest or other that is being policed, or at least, that was the case until now. Now the riot happens even when the protest isn’t being policed.

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
  198. FB says: • Website
    @Delta G

    The question is whether “The Scalpel” is a Doctor or a Quack.

    Congratulations, ‘Delta G’…

    You’ve just secured the title of most retarded goofball in the UNZ universe…

    Scalpel happens to be a graduate of West Point, besides being an accomplished medical doctor…whereas ‘Delta G’ is a useless internet gimp who needs to see a doctor asap…

    • LOL: Jazman
    • Replies: @The Scalpel
    , @BuelahMan
  199. @steinbergfeldwitzcohen

    I had never noticed the absence of height lines in mugshots of cops, but you’re right. It’s as if the file photos of the cops are used instead of actually taking mugshots of them, which could indicate that they aren’t under arrest at all.

    There was a video by a guy with a heavy Caribbean accent, that really pointed out some fakery in the “viral video”. It was up for several days, maybe because youtube snitches didn’t understand what he was saying, but it was taken down. Here’s his youtube channel page:
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeuS0_B1qXQRZu28O_u8qOA
    He’s kind of a loon and his commentary is unintentionally funny.

    Both Floyd and Chauvin are actors, Chauvin has an IMBD page and Floyd was a porn actor. They worked at the same place at the same time, so they probably were acquainted that way. I think it’s another scam. If Landlord Floyd stars in another porn loop, we’ll know for sure. 😉

    • Troll: vot tak
  200. Thomasina says:
    @FB

    “Of course there are always the sociopath elements in society, like we see on this comment section…these are the ‘people’ we are hearing from here…these are the same ‘people’ that will actually pay to watch a snuff film, or even commission one if they have the means…instead of inducing empathy and distress, they manifest sadism and other destructive responses…”

    Speaking for myself only, this statement is completely laughable. Here’s the definition of sociopath from the DSM:

    “DSM-IV Definition

    Antisocial personality disorder is characterized by a lack of regard for the moral or legal standards in the local culture. There is a marked inability to get along with others or abide by societal rules. Individuals with this disorder are sometimes called psychopaths or sociopaths.

    [MORE]

    Diagnostic Criteria (DSM-IV)

    1. Since the age of fifteen there has been a disregard for and violation of the rights of others, those rights considered normal by the local culture, as indicated by at least three of the following:
    A. Repeated acts that could lead to arrest.
    B. Conning for pleasure or profit, repeated lying, or the use of aliases.
    C. Failure to plan ahead or being impulsive.
    D. Repeated assaults on others.
    E. Reckless when it comes to their or others safety.
    F. Poor work behavior or failure to honor financial obligations.
    G. Rationalizing the pain they inflict on others.

    2. At least eighteen years in age.

    3. Evidence of a Conduct Disorder, with its onset before the age of fifteen.

    4. Symptoms not due to another mental disorder.”

    Personally, I don’t have any of these traits, and I could never watch a snuff film, not even for a minute. George Floyd, on the other hand, held a gun to the stomach of a pregnant woman while she was being robbed. Who does this? People who fit into the list above do.

    I think people on this site use their emotions initially (as I did; I was horrified), but then they take it a step further – they actually start thinking, asking questions. That’s the difference. I’ve personally risked my own life twice to save two people (well, I guess we’ll never know if they would have died, since I acted and they lived). I would do it again in a heartbeat if called upon.

    I was watching a video of who showed up to protest in my home town. They were almost ALL young. Young people nowadays, indoctrinated by Facebook and other sites, act out on “emotion” only. They have no sense of history, no comparison, no real idea of what holds a society together. This is what the Left uses to guide them – emotions.

    I have personally been up close and personal to an addict, an addict who I love, but who has destroyed his life and all those around him. I know he is going to die. Every time the phone rings, I wonder if it’s going to be about him. I’ve helped him when he “loses his legs” and everything else in between. Don’t tell me I don’t understand! Or care!

    Start thinking.

    • Replies: @FB
  201. @The Scalpel

    I am not sure we can be quite so confident that the length of time between Mr Floyd’s detention by police and his death excludes drug use as the precipitating factor.

    First, we don’t know whether he took the drugs for recreational purposes or to conceal them from the police. If it was to conceal them, then they might have been contained in a wrapper that temporarily delayed their release, resulting in a delay in their toxic effects on the unfortunate Mr Floyd. That he became more agitated later in the detention is at least consistent with the possiblity of a delayed release of one or two powerful drugs into his system.

    Second, both fentanyl and methamphetamine, which I understand was also present in his system, can cause serious, acute neurophysiological side effects, such as hallucinations, agitation and elevated blood pressure. In a person with a compromised cardiovascular system, these drug induced side effects could preciptate a fatal acute cardiac episode, rather than this being a consequence of the restraint procedures.

    Third, unlike fentanyl, the effects of acute intoxication with methamphetamine are not only severe but long lasting. At least several hours, sometimes several days, during which disorientation, agitation and paranoia may increase to the point where the individual is unable to keep themself safe or comprehend others’ behaviour, and becomes acutely distressed as a result.

    I fully agree with the ethical requirement to treat people humanely at all times and to be alert to underlying medical needs. In particular, distressed pleas of “I can’t breathe” should never be treated as histrionic. However, the options available in a medical context for dealing with acutely agitated patients are very different to those available in law enforcement contexts.

    I must admit to some ethical misgivings about commenting on the personal tragedy of Mr Floyd’s demise. But it has raised much wider issues that potentially affect us all, so I feel some justification in doing so. Hopefully, the truth about his death will emerge in due course.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  202. VICB3 says:
    @Proudly Unaffiliated

    You hit on, accurately, the complete dysfunction of the Police Subculture. It’s what happens, always happens when you create an armed elite – two sets of rules, one for them and another for you, and theirs are better, works every time.

    But Black Subculture is equally dysfunctional as well. It’s something, an unpleasant truth that they and their enablers don’t want to hear. (Bill Cosby found that out to his regret with his Pound Cake Speech in 2004.)

    All this – the riots, looting, murders, criminality, abuse, posturing, emotional appeals, political pandering etc., both present and past by both sides – are the result of one completely dysfunctional subculture going head to head with another. And it will continue until both sides stop and take a very hard and realistic look at first themselves, then their behaviours and attitudes towards both each other, and finally their relationship with mainstream civilized society.

    Just a thought.

    VicB3

  203. @anonymous

    Agree. What you write is what used to be called common sense.

    Don’t know what I would have to call what we have now? – Insurance mentality? – That you can smooth out every outcome in life no matter what by applying the right mathematical formula – just as insurance companies successfully do.

    (In a way that is right – but only seen from the standpoint of different financial models – these models do work – as long as the numbers are somehow known or approximated).

    But it is something entirely different to think, you could in real life be a police officer able to make harsh cases disappear by applying the right formula – and everyday tragedy etc. (hardships) would all be manageable.

    Commenter scalpel has no answer for the dirty little situations/cases you describe above.

    What results from a mindset like his, is – on a practical level, something that just does not work in real life.

    On a more abstract level: He writes as if the highest moral standards would enable a society to function properly. Whereas in reality, it is much better to be cautious with your high moral standards. They themselves do nothing – except they – if too high – install an ethical pressure on the people in everyday life, in the streets, which makes them the prospective losers of every hard conflict that comes their way.

    – That has been done in Black schools already. The outcome of htis destructive liberalism is – demoralizing. Kids are withheld from what they need most: Structure and guidance.

    I used to teach in a black inner city school. Their issues are their own fault and I’m tired of pretending otherwise. from TrueOffMyChest

    Morals are abstract principals. To work properly, they have to be applied with care and restraint.

    The idea to turn law enforcement into a therapeutic venue is not up to the core of our nature as slightly domesticated omnivores – and intelligent apes.

    The veil of civilization is thin, as the old white males of yesterday knew.

    (This is still true now).

  204. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Chris Mallory

    Several numbers, not proofs. And, if they are like the raw statistics paraded around Unz Review often, they are false.

    In my comment of June 8, 2020 at 1:06 am GMT (comment # 8) in this thread, I cite eight of my comments posted under other Unz Review articles. In several of those other comments, I show that such raw statistics are either (a) false (proven so by, e.g., judicial exonerations based on DNA evidence, key witnesses’ recantations, or official recognitions of other compelling exculpatory evidence) or (b) statistically invalid or fatally unreliable.

    With your acid dross, specious numbers, and ad hominem attacks, you and your fellow bigots and neo-Nazi’s prove nothing save your sickness and stupidity.

    Attack actual, legitimately-proven crimes, the individuals who commit them, and the socioeconomic and political troubles that help engender criminal conduct, not ethnicities, and you may accomplish something useful.

    Referring someone to go back and read your past posts is not answering a question.

    Throughout all professional and scholarly communities and in some millions of Anglo-American judicial opinions, respected writers do exactly that — answer questions by referring readers to earlier texts, their own or another jurist’s, professional’s, or scholar’s text or texts. Grow up.

    Your and your fellow bigots’ and neo-Nazis’ reactions indicate or imply that you imagine I am Black or a Jew (two qualities you and your fellow consider social poisons requiring eradication). So, I invite you to read, e.g., the first four paragraphs of my comment of June 3, 2020 at 2:09 am GMT (comment # 221) posted under Ron Unz’s article Race and Crime in America, Unz Review (20 July 2013 (re-published recently as “Newsworthy / Promoted Again by Current Events” and “Hot,” https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/

  205. @Twodees Partain

    The other two allow someone to shoot a long video without even trying to stop the recording.

    Most police departments have started to learn that citizens have the First Amendment right to film government employees in the course of their duties and that if you are in public you have no expectation of privacy. Trying to stop the recording just sets the person filming up for a nice settlement from the city.

  206. @Loup-Bouc

    You write a whole lot of words to not say anything worth reading. Do you work for The New York Times?

  207. @Lars Porsena

    Interesting indeed, thanks. So it was a – slogan? – would that be correct? – or a trope – already when George Floyd said these words? – –

    – – I had from the very beginning the impression, that George Floyd did behave a lot like an actor.

    This is interesting on two levels.

    1) Because acting is a) making people believe, b) can give you power and command even on other peoples feelings (fellings first!) – and – – thoughts 8thoughts always second…).

    2) George Floyd knew he was filmed – and would soon appear on the internet…

  208. Anon[295] • Disclaimer says:

    “If a black cop kills a black, no riots.”

    In 2016 black police officers shot armed black criminals in Milwaukee and Chattanooga. In both cases this set off riots in which mobs of blacks attacked white people.

  209. @Dieter Kief

    Stuff like that Reddit message is an example of why I bother posting long, embarrassing — and embarassingly-feely comments here on the recent drama. There are tremendous issues here, and left un-dealt with they have had nation-destroying effects not just on AfricanAmerican development, but on the whole USA economic and social fabric (or lack thereof). There are many other confounding factors, but this particular racial complication is not just some noisy drama, dealing with this stuff has crippled mainstream culture, society, many institutions.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  210. Ragno says:
    @Fiendly Neighbourhood Terrorist

    It’s beautiful watching Amerikastan burn.

    Burn, Amerikastan. Burn.

    Who the hell is ‘Stan’?

  211. From both the white separatist and anarcho-primitivist point of view, what’s good about negroes is that they may well bring about the fall of Western civilization. What’s bad about them is that they aren’t bringing it about nearly fast enough.

    • Agree: commandor
  212. Thomasina says:
    @The Scalpel

    I think we need to wait to get ALL of the facts. That’s what I think. Drug-induced, seizure, heart attack, knee on neck? Who knows.

    I agree with your “tolerance” point, but I think we can all agree that this guy was slowly killing himself. It was only a matter of time before “tolerance” wasn’t going to cut it any longer, and perhaps that day was reached the day he died.

    Do we know if the officer was applying any pressure on Floyd’s neck, or was it just resting there? Did he have his weight on the other leg? These are all questions that need to be answered. The officer’s face didn’t appear to display any malice or hatred, and he certainly knew he was being filmed.

    But, hey, let’s just rip apart cities, incite riots and cause more deaths before we get all of the facts. The new religion – emotion.

  213. @sonofman

    This needn’t be comprehensively accurate to consider as a nice rhetorical and moral referent. It’s at least partly true. And I’m willing to select for that part.

    Idk what to say… He’s being super nice, maybe you could work something out right?

    I don’t get the meanness/indifference, coming from the whites, on this. I get wanting to self-segregate, catch some breathing room, make a little duchy homeland. Are you so devoid of any emotive of kindness, good-will, …anything? If not, I admit, it makes me sad.

    • Replies: @Anon
  214. Sam McGowan says: • Website

    Dear Fred,

    I enjoy your columns and generally agree with you on most things. In this case, I must point out that George Floyd was not facedown, his face was directed to his right, as the video makes clear. Personally, I think he had a heart attack before he went on the ground. There is video showing him struggling with the police as they tried to force him into the vehicle. They got him in apparently, but something happened inside and they pulled him out and restrained him. We’ll know what really happened whenever the officers are tried, if they ever are.

    By the way, I live in the Houston area and Floyd’s body was tended by a funeral home near me and he is currently laid out at a church about 10 miles away. Surprisingly, there has been little violence here in Houston. We’ll say if it continues.

    Regarding no-knock warrants: There was an episode here in Houston a couple of years ago when a black narc concocted a no-knock warrant and four officers, at least a couple of whom, if not all, were black, raided the house. The occupants, both white, fought back and shot some of the officers before they were killed. It made national TV and was a big deal until authorities learned the warrant was fraudulent. That narc arrested George Floyd by the way.

    I agree with you entirely about blacks. They go absolutely nuts if they are riled. However, if they are kept calm, they are rational. Many years ago, 1968, and in a state faraway, Georgia, I was a young Air Force E-5, a loadmaster at the time flying on C-141 jet transports. After Martin Luther King was killed, I was at our squadron for commander’s call. Afterwards, I went to a local beer joint on Front Street with my friend Gene Beck, who was an E-8. This was 1968 in Georgia and Front Street’s bars refused to serve blacks. The bar was called Cruickshank’s, after the owner. I don’t remember how we knew, but we had learned that some of the black airmen on the base had decided they wanted to integrate Front Street and cause a riot. You may recall that blacks were rioting on military bases and even on some ships at sea. Cruickshank had a shotgun under the bar and said he was going to use it if any blacks came in. Gene, who had been in the Air Force for over twenty years, said, “No, let me handle it.”

    It was early evening. Gene and I were the only patrons. The only other people in the bar were Cruickshank and a young blonde who worked behind the bar. Soon after it got dark, we heard voices and saw a crowd of people coming out of the main gate. A few minutes later, the door opened and a young black E-4 came through the door. He was in uniform, as were we. Cruickshank was fuming but Gene invited the young man to come on in (I was only 22 myself). He sat down at the bar and Gene got on his left side while I got on his left. The girl got him a draft beer. We sat there and drank our beers and talked about Martin Luther King and how his death was a tragedy. We knew there was a crowd of blacks outside. I think we knew there tactics, which was to send someone into a bar then rush in when they were thrown out. After he finished his beer, the young Negro got up and went outside. A few minutes later we saw the crowd go back across the street and back on to the base. I don’t know if they tried any of the other bars or not but I don’t think so because Cruickshank’s was the bar nearest the gate. God only knows what would have happened if Cruickshank had pulled our his shotgun. The next day I flew up to Fort Bragg and picked up a load of 82nd Airborne troops and their Jeeps and flew them to Andrews AFB for riot duty in Washington.

    Sam McGowan

  215. vot tak says:
    @Ron Unz

    The cop who killed, yes, killed, Floyd has been charged with 2nd degree murder. Not manslaughter, not negligent homicide, not the other crimes of death by accident or negligence. I shouldn’t have to explain basics here, but… 2nd degree homicide is murder where the murder was not planned beforehand, but still very much intentional, essentially.

    Now why would the prosecution bureaucracy go to all the expense and work to charge this cop with 2nd degree murder if they did not think there was a valid case for it?

    The reality is how the cop killed Floyd is essentially irrelevant to the cop’s intent to kill or seriously permanently cripple Floyd. That is why the criminal is being charged with 2nd degree murder.

    Besides, the gist of Fred’s article is not about the exact cause of death of Floyd, but about what happened after. The exact cause of death of Floyd is irrelevant to the article. This steering the discussion into irrelevancy is not only a time tested method of the right to derail discussion of subjects they hold dear (conformism enforcement, bigotry, pro-capitalism, pro-zionazism – whether overt or covert, essentially the western, and especially american pro- status quo/establishment), it is also disrespectful to Fred and what he intended to do with the piece. Do you think when Fred wrote the article he intended discussion of the article to devolve into a spamfest of how Floyd died?

    • Replies: @ploni almoni
    , @ANZ
  216. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @FB

    LOL. I see it all the time. “Bad doctor” or quack is simply a verbally challenged person’s way of saying “I disagree”. Thanks for the backup!

  217. Anonymous[589] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jamie_NYC

    FACTS are NOT relevant, Reality is REdefined…First was the Russia Hoax, then Impeachment, then teh Pandemia, NOW its BLMatter..just when the Obama mafia was about to be exposed the Floyd incident explodes..By whatever means necessary the Deepstate will NOT allow nay Trump RElection and the deepsatblishment is plotting from within the walls of the WHouse, Pentagon, FBI, etc. Trump is doomed. Floyd died in a BLUE State, blue states have the highes BLACK illietracy, unemployment, homicides, drug use, etc. while RED states are in peace and prosperous..and things are getting absurd BLMatter with NO blacks, defund the police, abolish USA Constitution, army, etc. This is a new form of GLOBAL warfare :TERRORISM is politics by other means..Trump pushed teh economy at more than 5% growth, renogotiated Nafta, trade with China, energy independence, lower teh trade deficit, qhile under Obama teh econimy collapse, $20trillion in debt and growing, unlimited foreign wars, dollar collapse, USA Treasury insolvent.,..etc..

  218. thordaddy says:
    @Herald

    Actually, I’ve bounced for twenty-five years and pretty much called the “autopsy report” before it came out.

    You, on the other hand, have zero detainment experience nor any experience with large, violent, criminal “blacks.”

    • Replies: @Herald
  219. FB says: • Website
    @anonymous

    The fact is that the knee-on-neck restraint is NOT ALLOWED by many city police forces, although Minneapolis does allow it…but only in cases where it is deemed necessary…

    ‘Regardless of what Mr. Floyd allegedly did or didn’t do, there’s no reason to put a knee on the neck,’ said John Peters Jr., president of the Institute for the Prevention and Management of In-Custody Deaths, which trains police academy instructors on use of force.

    –USA Today

    A very good discussion of this on Quora that was actually posted two years ago, by a federal police officer…

    We were specifically trained NOT to place any amount of our body weight upon the upper back or neck of a person being restrained face-down.

    Emphasis by the original author, officer Jay Tee…

    With a proper arm-lock or wrist-lock, or even a good grip on the person’s hair, there is absolutely NO reason to place weight on their NECK while handcuffing a person, compliant or not…

    It’s incredibly dangerous.

    (No! At first this doesn’t seem too bad, as the officer’s knee/weight is on the shoulder. But if the suspect should shift, even due to discomfort, not struggling to escape, the policeman could easily drop his weight suddenly forward. Crack.)

    So there is a lot of information out there that makes clear that this kneeling on a suspect’s neck is either not permitted, that police are trained not to do it…or at most, it is to be used as a last resort…

    None of these fit this situation…yet we continue to see an incredibly uninformed and low-level discussion here on this website where people just keep throwing up completely non-factual nonsense…

    • Agree: Herald
    • Replies: @Yawrate
    , @thordaddy
    , @fnn
  220. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Julian of Norwich

    The scenarios you present are possible but unlikely. The expression “grasping at straws” comes to mind. Actually, an autopsy would have found residue of wrappers in his GI tract if they were there so you can take that one out. I honestly appreciate your attempts at objectivity, though. Thanks

  221. turtle says:
    @The Scalpel

    When you own your own U.S. senator, many things become possible.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HCA_Healthcare
    For such a company, a $2 billion fine for defrauding U.S. taxpayers is just a cost of doing business.
    Their then CEO, Rick Scott, got a $300 million going away present, and went on to become governor of Florida, instead of doing time in federal prison, as would have happened to ordinary peons.

  222. @anon8383892

    There are many other confounding factors, but this particular racial complication is not just some noisy drama, dealing with this stuff has crippled mainstream culture, society, many institutions.

    This is the curse of postmodernism. Jordan Peterson, Camille Paglia, and – Jürgen Habermas (on a level not too many are inclined to work their way up to, ok, but – nevertheless) – those fabulous three are right about the corrosive downside of postmodernism.

    It is just not true, that anything goes. There is a hunger for structure (Erich Fromm) out there and it is outright a-human to denounce this hunger for structure (for rules, too) as oppressive, – if not fascist right away. That’s the postmodern core-error. and this error – steve sailer is quite right – hits the black kids an average much harder than the upper-class kids, lots of whom (especially the Asian ones) come to the schools with this structure alive and functioning already.

  223. @Anon

    I thought of Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn when first started.

    How long before the Organs suffer a shortage of officers?

    “And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say goodbye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling in terror
    at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin’s thirst; the cursed machine would have ground to a halt!”
    – The Gulag Archipelago

  224. FB says: • Website
    @Thomasina

    Antisocial personality disorder is characterized by a lack of regard for the moral or legal standards in the local culture…Personally, I don’t have any of these traits…

    I disagree…but I would suggest you get a professional opinion of that, along with that oral multiple choice test that a psychiatrist can administer to diagnose your brain chemical imbalance…

    Good luck on your healing journey…

    • Replies: @Thomasina
  225. @Dieter Kief

    You should have tried the Sydney Poitier method.
    “To Sir with love”

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  226. @anonymous

    “None of the police were found guilty of misconduct or violating procedure.”

    And that is the larger issue that never gets addressed.

    The policies and procedures of the police are crimes.

    Training the filth in Israel should be automatic grounds for a RICO prosecution of the City.

  227. Looks like a psyop. They don’t really have to kill anyone to get other people to kill one another.

    • Replies: @ploni almoni
    , @Thomasina
  228. DaveE says:

    Again, many blacks oppose looting.

    Ya’ know, I wonder if this illustrates the difference between a “well regulated militia” and a “not-so-well-regulated militia.”

    In my experience blacks are horrendously harassed by cops, constantly, in cities like Nashville and Los Angeles. I have first-hand eyewitness experience of this in both cities and no, I’m not a “bleeding heart liberal” – I’m a white Republican in general. But da’ facts is da’ facts. I have seen Mexicans beaten to a pulp – and even a Jewish roomate (who looked Mexican) get his skull cracked in 7 places in pre- Rodney King LA – then ruled by another Gates dirtbag – Daryl Gates – when the LA pigs busted up a block party (literally – with clubs) in a rich, white beach community, after some white darling complained of noise made by my city-hired band. The hypocrisy is deafening.

    My point is: Blacks, Mexicans, “white niggas” and pretty much everyone except Harvard Business School graduates are just plain trash in the eyes of”The Chosen”, these days. The Parasite Class has got every working-class goober enslaved, shackled and utterly screwed, but G_d forbid anyone lash out and express their discontent in any meaningful (non-trivial) way.

    Which is worse: 1.) People who fight back with their bare hands ala Christ clearing the temple of the money-changer-scum – OR – 2.) People who complain but do nothing except write letter to zionist jewspapers – i.e. a complete waste of time?

    Equivalently stated: Where do you draw the line between “resistance” and “armed resistance” or a “regulated militia” and a non-regulated militia?

    Personally, I’m with the thugs who fight with their bare hands. They have more “Christ-ian” courage than any 20,000 banksters – be they black, white, yellow or little green men from Mars.

    • Agree: FB
  229. Emslander says:
    @FB

    I notice that your comment has attracted a lot of responses from the shit-eating community here on UNZ…it’s important to note, though, that these troglodytes speak for nobody…

    So, now we know that you consult a psychiatrist “friend” for your opinions. Have you discussed with her your inability to distinguish from the people who are trying to examine the truth about a very unfortunate death in police custody and the types of people you seem to have always in mind and onto whom you project your hatred?

    You saw a disturbing video. It seemed to mean something nefarious to you at the time. In the time since the video first appeared, other factors have arisen in the facts known to the public that may modify that conclusion in the minds of the thinking population.

    Try that on before you characterize any of these arguments in your normal manner.

  230. Loup-Bouc says:
    @fatmanscoop

    You quote and attack my statement that

    The FACT is that, this time (the George Floyd murder protest time), most rioters have been White or of another non-Black ethnicity.

    I have viewed many photos and videos of scenes of the George Floyd protests and riots. The sources were of the left, middle, and right — American MSM (CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NY Times, Washington Post……), Fox News, right-wing rags (e.g., Washington Times), RT, Breitbart, Sputnick, AlJezeera, World Socialist Website……). Some photos or videos showed Blacks more than others. But a notable majority showed non-Blacks more than Blacks.

    But available reliable information is relatively spare (compared with, say, 1960s and early 1970s newsreels of scenes of the Vietnam war and of Vietnam war protests occurring in the U.S.). The available George Floyd protest information does not form a valid premise of determining quite accurately the frequency-distribution of Black rioters or “liberal” or “progressive” White rioters or Alt right rioters……

    Trump & other politicians insist Antifa thugs have incited & committed many of the riots’ crimes. “Liberal” politicians & “liberal” media have asserted that the criminal rioters & their instigators are Alt Right or neo-Nazi.

    I KNOW only this: Like the rest of Oregon, Portland Oregon & my Portland-suburb city, Beaverton Oregon, have markedly few Blacks. The demographics are similar in Idaho and Utah and many cities of the Great Plains states and in much of the Southwest.

    In Portland, George Floyd riots occurred daily for more than a week. I & others here SEE that the rioters are overwhelmingly Whiteand of great number. Portland & all Western Oregon is predominately “liberal” or “progressive.” In Oregon, Antifa has fomented & participated in riots of the rather recent past. The visual evidence is beyond compelling. One can SEE apparent Antifa (wearing typical Antifa garb) participating in the current (George Floyd) Portland riot. One can see rather few Blacks.

    [MORE]

    You wrote:

    You spend your whole time trying to dismantle statistics that don’t fit your view, but then start asserting things as “FACT” without reference to any kind of proof.

    No. Your bigot’s or ne-Nazi mind needs to believe, irrespective of truth, that I pick statistics that fit my view. ZERO legitimate statistics or data support your bigot-mind’s racist beliefs. [See below.]

    I do NOT pick statistics because they “fit [my] view.” I present statistics that led me to my determination [“my view”].

    For the assertion that Blacks commit violent crimes more than non-Blacks do, Unz Review authors have relied upon sources like Homicide Trends in the United States, 1980-2008, and Annual Rates for 2009 and 2010, in Patterns & Trends, U.S. Department of Justice, Office of Justice Programs, Bureau of Justice Statistics [hereinafter “DOJ Homicide Stats”], https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf
    See, e.g., Paul Craig Roberts’s article All Races Suffer from Police Violence, Unz Review (3 June 2020), https://www.unz.com/proberts/all-races-suffer-from-police-violence/#comment-3942795

    DOJ Homicide Stats uses invalid data and invalid statistics. That source’s “statistics” include both “homicides” that were subjects of arrests AND ESTIMATES of “homicides” respecting which no arrests are reported. Since DOJ Homicide Stats relied on “statistics”-reporting law enforcement agencies that included the U.S. Department of Justice, perhaps the “statistics” included records of prosecutions, perhaps even records of homicide convictions. See pages 34-35 of DOJ Homicide Stats. But DOJ Homicide Stats does not express or imply clearly that its data include convictions or even prosecutions.

    Law enforcement agencies’ arrest-data cannot prove frequency or incidence of crime, or the relative frequency of Black crime versus non-Black crime. One reason ought to be obvious even to YOU. Many arrests do not even lead to convictions. But other reasons are equally, or more, important — e.g., the irrebuttably proved fact that not only many crime-claims and crime-charges are false. MANY CONVICTIONS ARE FALSE — especially where the person accused was Black.

    See my comment of June 5, 2020 at 12:41 am GMT (comment # 14) posted under Paul Craig Robert’s above-cited article, published at https://www.unz.com/proberts/all-races-suffer-from-police-violence/#comment-3942795

    Begin reading that comment at this paragraph (which, in the original text also, was set in all-caps):

    IMPORTANT NOTE: BELOW THIS COMMENT WILL REFERENCE CERTAIN OTHERS OF MY COMMENTS. THIS COMMENT WILL CITE THOSE OTHER COMMENTS BY DATE, TIME, AND COMMENT NUMBER. ALL THOSE OTHER COMMENTS APPEAR UNDER RON UNZ’S ARTICLE “RACE AND CRIME IN AMERICA,” UNZ REVIEW (20 July 2013), https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/
    PLEASE SEE https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/ TO READ THOSE OTHERS OF MY COMMENTS.

    That paragraph begins my above-referenced comment’s pertinent to the flaws of DOJ Homicide Stats (supra).

  231. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Anon

    I see your point, however, let me provide some insight. I see people like George Floyd all the time in the ER. The same people the police arrest appropriately and bring into the ER for care without manhandling or kneeling on their neck. Frequently they get agitated in the ER and we are able to manage them without kneeling on their neck and killing them even if they are drunk or high as a kite. Even if they have other medical problems. We do it all the time.

    Once the police have ensured the suspect has no dangerous weapons, why should they treat the suspect any differently than we do? Our society has become so militarized through propaganda, TV, movies, etc. that police brutality is normalized in the minds of many. But there really is no good reason for it. I am a 57 year old man with a bad back. If I can manage an agitated person with a couple security guards and a couple female nurses, then surely a couple young muscular police can do the same. But they are trained to be and act like John Rambo, not like those we hire with our tax dollars to protect and serve. We are frogs in a boiling pot. Our society is becoming sick and we are becoming conditioned to feel that sick is normal. If this continues it can only end in disaster.

    • Thanks: Talha
  232. KenH says:

    Again, nobody would be talking about this case or give a damn if George Floyd was white. Or if Derek Chauvin was black. It would just be another day at the office.

    It’s hard to tell if officer Chauvin is applying any pressure to Floyd’s neck. Based on toxicology reports and the fact that Floyd’s heart attack began prior to being taken out of the squad car (and put face down while being restrained by three officers) he may have died 1-3 hours later anyway. It’s hard to claim that they were trying to kill gentle giant Floyd when the officers called an ambulance because of his complaints about breathing difficulty.

    What’s not being explained adequately is why the officers felt the need to restrain Floyd in the manner that they did. The officers originally put Floyd in the squad car where it would be impossible for white supremacist and killer of black bodies Derek Chauvin to put his knee on his neck and from articles I read Floyd was demanding to be let out of the squad car.

    Would Fredrico and Violeta be appalled if George Floyd was white? The police in Mexico do bad things all the time like raping females and threatening to “disappear” people, among other things. Yet Fredrico acts like Mexico is Switzerland.

  233. Yawrate says:
    @Henry's Cat

    That is a salient point. Instead of leaving the area he stayed. Why?

  234. @Zarathustra

    Oh Sidney Poitier in To Sir with Love-lovely indeed. -That was then. So pure. And charming. Rather civilized. Tcha. – Now go back to what True of my Chest writes in my comment No. 209. – What a difference!

  235. Yawrate says:
    @FB

    Floyd apparently resisted being put into a squad car (SUV). At that point, further effort was needed to restrain him. I’m not justifying the knee on the neck but when arrested and refusing to be placed in a squad vehicle further restraint is required. Remember, George Floyd was a big man. Perhaps the strategy was to wait him out while he was placed in an uncomfortable position such that he was less resistant to being put in the squad vehicle.

    • Replies: @FB
  236. Emslander says:
    @Matt07924

    Police culture is corrupt and the qualified immunity (thanks to the nine assholes in black robes) is icing on the cake. They can kill with impunity. Also, the police unions control the mayor and DA per PAC spending. This is beyond reform. To me police are enforcers and not helpers. They are doing the bidding of the oligarchy…keeping all of us rabble rousers away from the elite.

    Just a thought exercise:

    If you own a small business in a community where the police force has been removed and, presumably, not in the jurisdiction of any other police force, who do you call? I’m pretty sure the desire of people to take what isn’t theirs with the use of force won’t automatically die. If you have no one to call in the instance where you might lose everything, including your life, do you continue to do business in that community? Will that be better or worse?

  237. Yawrate says:

    The militarization of the police is disturbing.

    Protect and serve?

    They seem overly interested in protecting themselves. And I say this knowing full well that most police officers invariably do the right thing.

  238. R2b says:
    @Twodees Partain

    I think you are right. And you could say he died with, or maybe of civid. And of course he could breathe, especially whitout a mask. There is also the possibility this fake went real, cause Chauvin may have relieved himself greately, giving the reason why Floyd couldnt breathe. Yes there are many variants to this event, but they all seem to connect covidly, that is conveniently covering covid, for a brief moment, only suggested by the ”I cant breathe”. Which is of course a bit moore difficult with a mask, covering your upper breathing apparatus, but more importantly signaling the character of the virus. So the theme is kept, as the next act is in waiting.

    • Thanks: Twodees Partain
  239. Wally says:
    @Bert

    Maybe I missed it, but where can we see “Floyd being pulled out the rear passenger-side door of the cruiser”?

    Thanks.

  240. Wally says:
    @thordaddy

    The big point lost in all of this:

    There’s no proof that Chauvin’s behavior was “racist”?

    • Agree: mark green
  241. FB says: • Website
    @Yawrate

    Floyd apparently resisted being put into a squad car (SUV).

    He did…?

    That’s news to me and all the millions of people around the world who watched the ENTIRE incident on video…

    He was PULLED OUT of the police vehicle after already being in the back seat, with his arms handcuffed behind his back…he was not freaking out, nor doing anything that required anything more than to shut the car door and drive him to the police station…

    Maybe you have an ‘explanation’ as to why an arrested and handcuffed person should be pulled out of a police vehicle and then snuffed out on the ground by kneeling on his neck for nine minutes…?

    • Replies: @Thomasina
  242. oh boy! I could not get past 2 paragraphs of this! Fred Reed, a pure naked Anglo Saxon who clearly has little to nothing of value or common sense to say begins by calling people savage! Reed has nothing to say of any value and that is clear from obfuscating nonsense he starts with. so I did not bother to go deep, wasting my time

    Incredible however! I am stymied! my best guess is that it takes one to know one. and when it comes to savagery, by pedigree the Ango Saxon knows savagery best. Anglo Saxon is the quintessential human savage… and Reed who it seems is more Anglo Saxon than most, judged by what he writes surely knows what savgery is..in himself for sure. Reed is not justified calling any other human savage in the negative..not at all!

    oh boy again! the personality of the Unz R is on full display as things get socially tight! Linh Dinh, The Saker, Kersey, Reed, Derbyshire..the list of racists writing for the Unz seems endless.

    it was fun for a while but the sheer number of racist ‘riters/journos here, and the pure horror of their output is getting a bit heavy..to much for me. nothing is more illogical, racist and lunatic than what I read from all these here

    I am impressed by Ron Unzs’ intellectual ability and by some of the work he has deone that I have read. there is nothing else about the Unz that is worth while. PCR used to be a fine economist producing solid opinion in the popular interest, opposed to the status quo. but PCR is geting old now and it shows. I will always appreciate PCR however as a real one…a white man by name an Anglo Saxon, but who for many, many years proved that he was indeed no Savage.

    there are no other real ones in these pages

  243. Allan says:
    @Hamlet's Ghost

    The case for “reparations” is just a case for state sponsored looting, but I’m with you on expulsion.

  244. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Dieter Kief

    Please see my response #237 above. I am talking about real life and what is possible. Your theorizing is well intended but seems defeatist to me and clashes with the reality I live on a daily basis. Shit happens, no doubt about that. But more shit happens when people act carelessly to put it gently, or overzealously, or with malice. I don’t believe you are trying to state that some immutable force caused the police to act as they did. No, it was their training, and the (low) expectations our society has of them for civil behavior. All this can be addressed, but not if we try to make excuses for their unacceptable behavior

    Also, I am not “a liberal “. I need to be convinced. Some liberal ideas and some conservative ideas make sense to me. FWIW, I would describe myself as certainly independent, and probably a non=violent anarchist in the tradition of Henry David Thoreau

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  245. FB says: • Website

    Some may not have seen this footage…

    Clearly visible how Chauvin is shifting his weight to place maximum force on Floyd’s neck…

    Floyd is heard begging for his life in a groaning voice…

    The amount of willful denial on this thread is absolutely astonishing…

    • Agree: Agent76, The Scalpel
    • Replies: @Wally
  246. Anon[375] • Disclaimer says:
    @The Scalpel

    There is a big difference, though, between the situation in the hospital and that of the cop.

    In the hospital, all patients would want to be treated, they fight back simply because they are confused and not with their senses. You have to restrain them until they figure out what it going on.

    But when it comes to criminals, it is not just that they are not confused. They want to get away. They want to get away with their crime. They want to fight back, maybe even kill, the officers and scram, because their literally can’t afford to go to jail/prison. They will bust the windows off the police car, and fight all day, to get away. I’m not sure that you can just sit on them and wait for them to kindly agree to get in the police car which will take them to jail. They’ll wait for days, until you are worn out, and scram.

    I understand the urge to take an anti-police side and never budge, to make it out as if the actions of the police are completely absurd and idiotic and only a mad racist would take them. But the truth of this matter is that police policy, even this very neck restraint, has been developed over many years as the police have tried and failed to catch criminals. You can look at Minneapolis police manuals for yourself, as others have linked them. They are exhaustive and detailed as all heck.

    Maybe it is wrong. Clearly it HAS to change. Things cannot go on this way. But I cannot join the hate mob. I never have been the sort of person to join hate mobs. I guess you can call me indecisive. I don’t decide on a side and then go slaughter (in the modern world, that is not allowed, so we have to do our best to ruin their lives as much as is humanly possible) the bad people on the other side.

  247. FB says: • Website
    @The Scalpel

    Doc, thanks for that insight into how things look day to day in the ER…

    I am a 57 year old man with a bad back. If I can manage an agitated person with a couple security guards and a couple female nurses, then surely a couple young muscular police can do the same.

    But they are trained to be and act like John Rambo, not like those we hire with our tax dollars to protect and serve.

    We are frogs in a boiling pot. Our society is becoming sick and we are becoming conditioned to feel that sick is normal. If this continues it can only end in disaster.

    That is the sad reality in a nutshell…

    I will add that there has been plenty of discussion here about ordinary white folks that are brutalized by police…still others have noted that we all suffer due to the fools among us who fail to send police criminals to jail, even after outrageous police murders like that of young Daniel Shaver, and many others…

    These morons are flushing society down the toilet because they are sick…they have a sociopathy where they in fact WANT to see this kind of state violence [as long as it’s against blacks] and so they support it…even going to the most extreme mental gymnastics as we see here to try to somehow deny visible reality…

    But they are in fact flushing society down the crapper…decent people need to wake up and realize that the enemy is among us…the fifth column of sociopathic and usually retarded individuals that think police violence should be tolerated and even excused…

    They also fail to understand that we are all economically enslaved by the very large criminals that run this Banksta Paradise…and that this kind of meek acceptance of state violence is exactly what the our ruling masters want…

    • Agree: acementhead, Jazman
  248. Erzberger says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    Im sure if you shot – or preferably: convicted and executed – a handful of white superlooters, the rest would get the idea soon enough. Thinking of the overwhelmingly white banksters who looted millions of Americans of various skin colours, then walked away with a big fat bailout and bonuses, all courtesy of Obama, cheered by Congress. Because the show must go on. Or the Criminal in Chief in the White House, who robbed charities, foreign (illegal) workers, Trump University students, the IRS, etc etc. They waste no opportunity to enrich themselves at the expense of others, and I suppose a lot of black people are not stupid enough to believe that only hard, honest work gets you anywhere

  249. @Jus' Sayin'...

    From what I’ve read so far, 60% of the comments, most of the arguments are over the specific point of whether this cop really killed Mr. Floyd, intentionally or not. A majority of the commenters seem to agree with the gist of Mr. Reed’s column, and I put myself in that category, for a change. I don’t see any partisanship except out of the usual Commies that come on occasionally to not try to figure problems out but just bad-mouth all things American.

    Good column, Mr. Reed. I wish I could write that more often!

  250. Marty says:
    @The Scalpel

    This really is a rather naive statement. There’s an obvious reason that a druggie loser like Floyd would be more easily manageable for medical personnel than for the police – he sees the doctors/nurses as his last chance. Plus, his “community” didn’t drum it into his mind for 20 years that doctors are the enemy. Jeez.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  251. @Dieter Kief

    (Ok the name of this obscure person from Königsberg at the shore of the Baltic Sea: Immanuel Kant, philosopher).

    You quote Kant to us?

    Have you forgotten that Immanuel Kant was a real pissant who was very rarely stable*

    *Bruce’s Philosopher’s Song

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  252. “Why always blacks?”

    And its not always blacks

    however just maybe because color is the cause for the discrimination, there’s not such that blacks can do to hide or blend in that other groups might normally engage in to assimilate. Regardless of where they go and who they are

    skin color remains the issue and since whites have build the society on skin color — blacks hold the toughest rungs of the social ladder by virtue of the socialization process that included discriminating against them

    but blacks make up the largest segment of the minority community and when conflicts arise the two largest coops will have larger collisions.

    it is not as if the are Chechens who upon slight shift of name, dress, dialect, relations can bob and weave through Russian society.

    Unlike new comers such as asians and ;atinos, indians — they have earned their right to fight and complain — no fear of deportation, less and less of that high context group over individual

    • Troll: Chris Mallory
  253. @vot tak

    Give up, Old boy. You have blown your cover and everyone knows you are a fake. Nobody likes a shill.

    • Troll: vot tak
  254. turtle says:
    @The Scalpel

    I never had the pleasure of being “up close and personal” with a “meth monster,” but I did have a “close encounter” with a hallucinating LSD user, many decades ago, of which I have vivid memories.
    This fellow was clearly hallucinating (took a swing at me, but was oblivious to my presence), was highly agitated, sweating profusely, urinating in his trousers, jumping up and down, screaming nonsense about God and the Devil. He was not a large fellow at all. From distant memory, I estimate he was about 5′-8″ and maybe 150 lbs. He seemed to have found physical strength beyond what one might expect, and it required several (3, as I recall) burly cops to strap him down before transport to the nut hatch. I heard he completely recovered from his trip in a few days (good to hear, in contrast to the tales we heard of those who never came back – I knew one such sad case, also).

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  255. thordaddy says:
    @FB

    You seem to be oblivious to the fact that you are taking the word of the INFILTRATORS seeking to utilize the criminal element to advance their “anti-racist“ objectives and surveillance state aims.

    You can perform this BASIC detainment technique AND SEE FOR YOURSELF the results.

    Clearly, 6-7 minutes on the neck EQUALS “very little pressure” on ONE carotid artery (there are two that need to be “squeezed” for a “chokehold” to be enacted). These arteries are PRESSURE POINTS such that direct pressure causes EXCRUCIATING PAIN. Ergo, a focus on time lapse versus pressure applied EXPOSES the liars and infiltrators.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    , @Dieter Kief
  256. Thomasina says:
    @FB

    I was vulnerable with you; I relayed some personal information. For that I get told to take a psychiatric test. Ouch, that’s kind of like a “psychological” knee to the neck, isn’t it? You just did what you’re accusing the officer of.

    Hey, it’s okay, I’m not weak. I can take it.

    I suggest it is you who needs healing.

  257. MarkinLA says:
    @Twodees Partain

    Thank you for the correction. I hadn’t thought of the flash mobs on a mass looting run. So you can loot without a riot just as you can riot without looting.

    • Replies: @Twodees Partain
  258. @fnn

    Thanks very much for posting this, fnn.

  259. turtle says:
    @The Scalpel

    Our society is becoming sick

    Our society has been “sick” for a long time…

    we are becoming conditioned to feel that sick is [the new] normal.

    If this continues it can only end in disaster.

    Agree.

  260. Jazman says:
    @The Scalpel

    It is pleasure reading your comments
    Thank you

    • Thanks: The Scalpel
  261. fnn says:
    @FB

    But dangerous no-knock raids with flash-bangs and firearms are common. Reason magazine, for example, has been writing about them for many years:

    https://reason.com/2016/10/11/minn-judge-swat-raid-unconstitutional/

    https://reason.com/2015/08/03/swat-team-liable-for-wrong-house-flash-b/

    https://reason.com/2010/03/01/45-swat-raids-per-day/

    https://www.twincities.com/2007/12/17/botched-police-raids-not-so-rare/

    Balko, a senior editor with Reason magazine, wrote in 2006 that at least 40 people have died following such botched raids “since SWAT teams began proliferating in the late 1980s.”

    Perhaps the most publicized in recent months involves Kathryn Johnson, a 92-year-old woman shot and killed when cops mistakenly raided her Atlanta home looking for drugs. The shooting led to the dismantling of that city’s narcotics team.

    The most notorious case in local memory took place Jan. 25, 1989, when cops threw flash grenades inside a Minneapolis home during a drug raid.

    Probably the most famous no-knock raid in US history was the initial ATF assault on the Waco Branch Davidian compound in 1993. But abuses by the state security organs have only become more frequent since then. These organs present themselves as more liberal and enlightened (just like the City of Minneapolis) than the populist and nationalist forces that brought Trump to power. Of course Trump has now almost entirely abandoned the populists and nationalists.

  262. Attila says:

    I see Africans as total failures wherever they end up. Many claim degrees in specialist fields but zero contribution to civilisation. They are only good at ball games and entertainment bad attitude and big talk. Always dragging everyone else back. Humanity owes them squat. They will never change.

  263. Thomasina says:
    @FB

    Maybe he puked in the back seat, so they brought him out again? Maybe he was having seizures? Maybe they had already called for an ambulance? Maybe the officer was trying to protect him from hurting himself while having a seizure? Maybe the officer wasn’t putting any weight on his neck because his other leg took all the weight?

    Lots of “maybe’s”. Let’s get the facts.

  264. The Scalpel says: • Website

    @FB

    Hear, hear!! Excellent comments and video.

    The point you raised earlier about pulling Floyd out of the police car, for me, is the window to the police state of mind. I brought this up myself in Fred’s previous article on this topic. At one point, before things went horribly wrong ,all they had to do was shut the door and drive to the station. One commenter states that Floyd was kicking his feet making it difficult to shut the door.

    Seriously? “He made it tough for us to shut the door, so instead of wasting any more time with that, we decided to pull him out and brutalize him some more so he would not put up such a fuss”

    That’s the BEST case the apologists can make

    • Replies: @Bombercommand
  265. FvS says:
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    Yeah, but then the country turns into Mexico.

  266. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @turtle

    Thanks for the insight. Yes, it happens uneventfully every day. Those policemen acted appropriately. It’s not that hard.

  267. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Marty

    You should visit my ER some time.

    • Replies: @Marty
  268. @fnn

    I just watched that Timpa video. I skimmed the other one and decided not to watch it.

    The Timpa video is a bit awful to watch just knowing what happens but I do not see the police doing anything wrong. They were trying to help him. It made me wonder why he died so I googled it and this is the first thing I’ve found:

    https://heavy.com/news/2019/08/tony-timpa/

    An autopsy ruled that Timpa’s cause of death was a homicide. The medical examiner said Timpa died from sudden cardiac arrest due to “the toxic effects of cocaine and the stress associated with physical restraint.”

    He called the police on himself and said he was off his meds, crazy, and had taken drugs. They were restraining him. Having a heart attack due to cocaine and stress while being restrained is not homicide. The cops have done nothing wrong there.

    I don’t know why you post that in particular but it interesting to see because it is probably somewhat comparable to the George Floyd case in how the guy died. The cops in the Timpa video where clearly more gentle than they were with Floyd, the cop is primarily kneeling on his arm and shoulder and no one can claim that causes heart attack.

    Stress from being restrained is a fact of life and cops absolutely need to restrain people.

    If you are looking for examples of police brutality against white guys there are far better (or worse) videos than that.

    This one is completely sick and terrifying. The video ends 1 millisecond before the cop shoots him multiple times and kills him. The shooting is not in this particular video.

    This CNN news report covers 2 cases, 1 white 1 hispanic. It’s also a real doozy, he is a crazy homeless person, and they are trying to get him to leave a park. Somebody throws a flashbang near him, then he gets scared and says he’ll leave, and when he turns around they shoot him 3 times in the back and he falls down. Then they sic a german shepherd on him. Then they shoot him with bean bags repeatedly.

    • Replies: @fnn
  269. lavoisier says: • Website
    @Rogue

    Black leadership are very much like the brain dead white liberal masochist: Totally incapable of dealing with reality.

    They are “truth averse.”

    • Replies: @Rogue
  270. shotgun6 says:

    The current situation will NOT change UNTIL Blacks are no longer the predominant minority in many areas, and are outnumbered by Hispanics and Asians, who also have a proportionately appropriate share of political power. THEN, when the inevitable rioting occurs, and the targets are the Hispanics and Asians, and their businesses, the backlash against this nonsense will be supported because it can no longer be construed as anger coming from “white supremacy”. Anyone with any common sense can see the demographic shifts coming in this country; the growth segments are Hispanics and Asians, who culturally regarding education, entrepreneurship, and community are far closer in spirit to what have long been considered “white” values than they are to “black” values; there is positive benefit in ensuring these groups, who are here to stay anyway, feel valued and welcomed, and are encouraged to assimilate. The 13% will always be with us; makes sense to ensure they don’t get any more power than proportionately they are entitled to.

    • Replies: @Slimer
  271. sally says:
    @Haole

    an autopsy report will say that she died of underlying conditions. Yes, of natural causes, by purest coincidence while being shot eight times. Happens all the time.

    Analyze the words <=is there a problem.. ? probably not, I think, but if there were; consider the following:

    Unfortunately we don't criminalize and punish for the crime of lying. Actually there is no place I know of where lying by officials, media, or police is a crime. Yes there are many places where the governed are required to assert the truth, and failing to do so is a punishable crime, but no place I know of that a member of government, media or a corporate person, can be held accountable for lying. The governed are held accountable for the truth in testimony before a court, a congress, or false statements made to investigators, false statements on applications, and the like, but no where are the governors held liable for their lies?

    Misrepresenting the truth should be criminalized and everyone should be held accountable: President, member of the House, a member of the press, a city mayor, a police chief, a County Commissioner, a State governor, a Bureaucrat, an autopsy specialist, a scientist speaking on SARS CoVid 19, a Bat Virus Researcher, an expert of any kind, and even eye witnesses can all misrepresent the truth (by omission as well as commission) , and even if the fabrication, misstatement, etc. is discovered no penalty can be applied.

    [MORE]

    Misrepresentation, misstatement, fabrication, and lying (including commission or omission) are devices often seen in use by those who provide content, or who make authoritative statements, which is or are distributed by the media, officials of government, agencies and institutions that derive authority or funds from such governments, to control or misdirect those they govern. President after president have been shown to fib during political campaigns, no President has spent a single day in jail. Certain generals and presidents lied us into war after war.

    I think, we need an amendment to the Constitution of the United States.

    According my understanding of the first amendment, government cannot make a law to abridge the right of any person to express himself or herself on any media [air, paper, digital, etc.] in any format [language, written, printed, or art or image], at any place.

    But after the expression is uttered (published, expressed in or on some media), the utterance can be examined by everyone (unlimited qualifications, unlimited numbers of persons, by persons with or without qualification, all would be eligible to examine the utterance). If one or more of the examiners discovers in that uttered, or any part of that uttered, published or expressed in some way, to be a misrepresentation, misstatement, fabrication, or a lie, then, IANAL, but

    The constitutional amendment I propose would command that the examiner report his or her probable cause finding that a misstatement, fabrication, falsification or lie may have occurred, together with copies of the evidence to support that finding, to any federal prosecutor. The prosecutor in receipt of an examiner's assertion that a lie has been uttered shall be commanded by the amendment to act within 10 days, to issue and to serve a complaint containing the "allegations made by the examiner, together with the allegations embodied in the complaint the prosecutor filed with a court having jurisdiction. The amendment should define the materials to be served and shall standardize the instructions to be delivered as a part of the complaint to the accused. The accused would then be expected to respond to the complaint in writing, under oath, to the court in which the Prosecutor filed the complaint. The complaint should be written so that the accused can answer the assertions one by one, and shall describe for each assertion all defenses which might apply to the complaint.
    The amendment I would propose would require the court to set a trial date, to hear the case, and complete the proceedings within four months following the date the Prosecutor received the examiners certified mail assertion.

    I would propose that if the court decides the utterance by the accused contains a misrepresentation, misstatement, fabrication, or a lie, that is, the court finds the person charged to be guilty of the crime of uttering misrepresentation, false, fabricated or misleading content, then the amendment would direct the court to sentence the person found guilty, to 5 years, in the federal penitentiary, without exception, without bail and without possibility to be released early and without possibility to be relieved of the obligation to serve the full sentence. (The amendment I would propose would deny application of the pardon by the President to persons convicted under the proposed amendment).

    yeah, i know this is not likely to happen, but i think it is needed to restore people's faith in their government, culture and society.

  272. @Loup-Bouc

    You’re clueless, Loop-Boop.

    A Finno-Ugric atheist, are you?

    No problem with your ancestry or atheism. No problem with your music studies. Did you minor in English? No problem with that, either.

    Work on your communication skills. Comm 101 is helpful.

    Nobody is impressed by the “Wedgewood china and fine leather upholstery” routine. We suspect it’s a pose.

    Condescending liberal art poseurs aren’t taken seriously by retired engineers and technicians.

    Provide a direct link to your comments or stop wasting our time.

  273. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Anon

    You fail to consider another possibility, a Case C — that neither (a) drug intoxication (alleged fentanyl intoxication and recent methamphetamine use) nor (b) any possible endogenous comorbidity (alleged arteriosclerotic and hypertensive heart disease) was a contributing cause of Floyd’s death.

    (1) Not infrequently, local medical examiners color findings so police will not suffer law-violation accusations or so prosecutors can win cases. The federal court reports bear quite enough decisions that support all of my last sentence (first sentence of this paragraph). Every honest criminal law expert lawyer and any honest federal judge will agree.

    And in the independent autopsy conducted by Dr. Michael Baden, former chief medical examiner of New York City, we see reason to suspect that such is true in George Floyd’s case. Baden said cause-of-death was compression of Floyd’s neck and back — compression that interfered with blood flow and breathing. Bond did not suggest that drug-intoxication or arteriosclerotic and hypertensive heart disease were comorbidities contributing to Floyd’s death.

    [MORE]

    See https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/voices/george-floyds-autopsy-and-the-structural-gaslighting-of-america/
    See also
    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-two-autopsies-of-george-floyd-arent-as-different-as-they-seem/

    (2) Even if some comorbidity COULD have contributed to some extent to Floyd’s dying when assaulted by police, still

    (a) The record, even including the local medical examiner’s reports, does not support a conclusion that any comorbidity DID contribute to Floyd’s death. See again https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/voices/george-floyds-autopsy-and-the-structural-gaslighting-of-america/ AND https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-two-autopsies-of-george-floyd-arent-as-different-as-they-seem/

    (b) The police committed murder or 1st degree manslaughter irrespective of whether any comorbidity COULD have contributed to Floyd’s death. One takes one’s victim as he is, when one undertakes, intentionally, to do a harmful act against him. And if death is a foreseeable result of the harmful act and one does the act with “depraved heart” or with “depraved indifference” to, or “reckless disregard” of, foreseeability that the act may be deadly, one commits felony homicide — murder or 1st degree manslaughter.
    Cf., e.g., https://courses.lumenlearning.com/suny-criminallaw/chapter/9-5-second-degree-murder/
    addressing lkaw generally in the U.S.
    AND https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/murder-charges-in-minnesota-43141
    addressing Minnesota law

    No sane person can argue honestly that the Floyd-killing police’s arrest tactics were not harmful. Yet, all sane, honest people must concede, readily, that sometimes police may need to use harmful tactics to apprehend a person legitimately suspected of having committed a crime, if that person is armed or resists arrest.

    But, still, police may not use UNNECESSARY force, especially when, foreseeably, that force may be deadly. Since police choke-holds have been deadly in more than a few cases, in Floyd’s case, death was a foreseeable consequence. Such is especially true in Floyd’s case, because such choke hold was applied by one cop while extreme chest-pressure was applied by other cops. Recall that former New York City Chief Medical Examiner, Dr. Michael Baden, said THE Floyd cause-of-death was COMPRESSION OF FLOYD’S NECK AND BACK.

    Just so, such choke holds are banned in quite enough jurisdictions. And, in Minneapolis, before the Floyd murder, such choke hold was allowed ONLY WHEN REASONABLY NECESSARY. In Floyd’s case, such choke hold, and severe chest-pressure, were CLEARLY unnecessary, because Floyd was unarmed (as even the cops and local law enforcement authority admitted) and Floyd did not resist arrest. See, e.g.,
    https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/501073-floyds-friend-says-he-did-not-resist-arrest
    AND
    https://www.cbs58.com/news/surveillance-video-does-not-support-police-claims-that-george-floyd-resisted-arrest
    AND
    https://www.thecut.com/2020/06/man-pinned-down-by-minneapolis-police-officer-dies.html
    AND
    https://fox6now.com/2020/06/05/witness-george-floyd-didnt-resist-arrest-tried-to-defuse-things/

    Since Floyd was neither armed nor resisting arrest, in some jurisdictions, the Floyd-killing cops were guilty of (a) “depraved indifference” murder (2nd degree murder) or (b) “reckless disregard” murder (3rd degree murder) or “reckless disregard” manslaughter (1st degree manslaughter), because Floyd’s death was a foreseeable consequence the cops’ intended, unnecessary harm.

    In Minnesota, Floyd’s killing is 3rd degree murder called “depraved heart” murder. https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/murder-charges-in-minnesota-43141

    The Minnesota Attorney General upped the charge to 2nd degree murder, apparently because of evidence suggesting that the choke-hold-applying cop (maybe all the assaulting cops) acted with bigotry-caused intent to kill Floyd. I have no opinion respecting whether a 2nd degree murder charge is legitimate. I lack evidence necessary to assessing the matter.

  274. Loup-Bouc says:
    @The Scalpel

    Please see my comment of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (commetn # 282), which considers a third possibility, a “Case C” — that neither (a) drug intoxication (alleged fentanyl intoxication and recent methamphetamine use) nor (b) any possible endogenous comorbidity (alleged arteriosclerotic and hypertensive heart disease) was a contributing cause of Floyd’s death.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  275. fnn says:
    @Lars Porsena

    Some were saying there were strong similarities between the Timpa and Floyd cases. That may be more true than we can say for sure right now, because some of the Floyd footage is missing or has not been made publicly available. Missing is the alleged struggle to get him into the patrol car and the events that caused him to be extricated from the patrol car and caused him to wind up on the ground. IIRC, he was allegedly complaining about “claustrophobia” when he was inside the patrol car.

    • Replies: @Lars Porsena
  276. @fnn

    Somebody in the Unz Review comments has actually posted that video and I saw it here, but now I cannot find it, and I cannot find it anywhere else. It was not a great video in terms of view and quality, but it showed them seeming to struggle or fail to get him in the car. From watching that video, it did not seem like they ever got him more than half in the car.

    I cannot find the video anywhere though, but it is out there somewhere. I think I saw it in Steve Sailer’s blog comments.

  277. Wally says:
    @FB

    – Guaranteed, those with long & violent criminal pasts like Floyd may not be treated so well by police when they are forced to arrest him … again.

    – Predictably you don’t mention how many people “begged” Floyd to stop assaulting them during Floyd’s lengthy criminal past.

    – And where’s the proof that his death was due to “racism”?

    – The amount of “willful” Communist nonsense by low information children like yourself is “astonishing”.

    • Replies: @FB
  278. Thomasina says:
    @Thomas Milton

    That’s the way I’m leaning too.

  279. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Loup-Bouc

    Don’t you remember the exchange we had a couple months ago where you bitterly complained about common acronyms and how people should be considerate enough to spell them out?

    What pray tell, does GMT stand for? 😉

    On a more serious note, thanks! I will check it out

    • Replies: @vot tak
    , @Loup-Bouc
  280. FB says: • Website
    @Wally

    – Guaranteed, those with long & violent criminal pasts like Floyd may not be treated so well by police when they are forced to arrest him … again.

    Look PINHEAD…

    There is nothing in either the law, nor especially in MORALITY that says someone who committed a crime long in the past, and for which he has paid his debt to society, can now simply be snuffed out on the street in broad daylight…

    The fact is that this was a minor ALLEGED offense [we don’t even know if that twenty dollar bill was fake, nor if Floyd was simply passing on a bill he had received at another store]…

    Also, I have seen on youtube lots of people, including white people that knew George from church and they say he was a good man…

    None of us know what was in that man’s heart…certainly pinheads like you have no right to judge anyone [in some regimes, a softheaded retard like yourself might be simply eliminated for the good of society, and in fact were in Nazi Germany, even before the war started]…

    Remember the golden rule…’do not judge, lest ye be judged’…

    • Replies: @Chris Mallory
  281. vot tak says:

    To protect and to serve…

    Videos: US Cops Spotted Slashing Tires Belonging to Protesters, Journalists, Medics

    https://sputniknews.com/us/202006091079560840-videos-us-cops-spotted-slashing-tires-belonging-to-protesters-journalists-medics/

    “Mother Jones and the Minneapolis Star Tribune reported on and later identified various officers of the Anoka County Sheriff’s Office who have been puncturing tires and leaving protesters, reporters and even area medics without transportation amid the ongoing anti-police brutality protests honoring the memory of the late George Floyd.

    A video compilation pieced together by Mother Jones shows various incidents in which the uniformed officers disable vehicles. Images of car owners documenting their damaged property were also included.

    Video uploaded to Twitter by documentary and television producer Andrew Kimmel showed numerous cars with slashed tires in a Minneapolis parking lot – including his rental car.

    In addition to filing a lawsuit, the Los Angeles, California, resident has also announced his intent to organize a fund for those whose cars met a similar fate in the K-Mart parking lot.”

    Compel the criminals to “serve” while wearing a ball and chain.

  282. ANZ says:
    @vot tak

    Now why would the prosecution bureaucracy go to all the expense and work to charge this cop with 2nd degree murder if they did not think there was a valid case for it?

    You must not be familiar with the Trayvon Martin case, which interestingly also features the involvment of the race baiter Benjamin Crump.

    I highly recommend the book “If I Had a Son” which delves into the prosecutorial malfeasance which surrounded the Trayvon Martin debacle.

    Your faith in the DA’s office is misplaced. You have to understand that with this amount of insane media hype and political pressure, they HAVE to charge the cop, regardless of the evidence. Same for the white guys in Georgia who were physically engaged by the jogger.

    • Agree: Oldtradesman
  283. Meanwhile, … GOYIM Lives Matter (GLM).

  284. vot tak says:

    To America, Black Lives Only Sometimes Matter

    https://m.journal-neo.org/2020/06/05/to-america-black-lives-only-sometimes-matter/

    “Even today, racism is still institutionalized. It also permeates American culture, laying just beneath a superficial layer of tolerance and equality.

    This is not just about white people who remain racist against blacks and other minorities – a product of America’s terminally ill culture – it is also about fundamental racism that still very much sits at the heart of American foreign and domestic policy – against not only blacks, but virtually every race on the planet from Africans to Asians to even Slavs.

    The US is a nation that encourages its people to hate entire groups of people abroad to help justify otherwise unjust wars. Arabs, Chinese people, Russians – are all vilified with bigotry and hatred sanctioned by mainstream American culture. It isn’t hard to see why in a nation like this, hatred for other groups is easily justified in the minds of racists and the unjust.

    US-backed militants in Libya would hunt down Libya’s black population, killing them, torturing them, and even enslaving them in open air slave markets – a spectacle one might have believed was unthinkable in the 21st century – but something made possible by America, its foreign policy, and its deeply rooted racism and sense of supremacy – despite having a “black” president at the time.

    As long as America believes it is better than all others abroad – able to justify exploitation, coercion, and even military aggression to assert itself and pursue its “interests” – racism and injustice will persist at home. The same corporate-financier interests driving US injustice abroad see the US population – white and black – as merely another market segment to use and abuse – to divide and conquer – to put under itself for its own benefit.

    Black lives matter, whether they are being strangled by a racist white cop in America or being bombed by US warplanes in Libya. Once Americans can unite in both understanding and opposing this across-the-board racism and injustice, something might actually be done about it besides kicking the can down the road for a few more months until the next video of police abuse emerges online.

    America will not heal its domestic hatred and divisions if it remains built entirely on projecting and profiting from hatred and division abroad. It was no coincidence that legendary champions for equality like Martin Luther King Jr. were both opposed to racism and injustice at home and ceaselessly opposed to American aggression and hegemony abroad. The two are linked by the common thread of fundamental injustice. Until they are both exposed and smashed completely, they will both continue.”

    • Agree: Biff
    • Disagree: Oldtradesman
    • Thanks: FB, Iris
    • Replies: @Wally
  285. ANZ says:
    @JimDandy

    My unbiased initial reaction when watching the arrest video was that the guy didn’t want to get popped with a drug charge when he knew the police were on him, so he ingested whatever he was holding.

    We know he was intoxicted from what the clerk who called the cops said in the 911 call. Makes sense that he downed the rest of his stash and then OD on the street. Still, that doesn’t justify a knee to the neck of a face-down cuffed man for eight minutes, but it does absolve the cop of second degree murder charge.

    That said, I don’t see the media coming out and publicizing the tox screen from the autopsy. That would defeat their vested interest in inciting their black golem aggressors. It will quietly come out some time in the future while the legend of St. Floyd lives on.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
  286. Ron Unz says:

    Well, I noticed that someone at one of Steve Sailer’s threads had put together a detailed outline of his proposed chronology of Floyd’s alleged overdose death from Fentanyl, so those interested might want to take a look:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/bye-bye-minneapolis/#comment-3953196

    The whole situation in the US is so totally crazy, it reminded me of that very funny joke that was going around Chinese social media a couple of years ago, with Chairman Mao coming back to life and asking questions about the modern world:

    • LOL: JimDandy, Iris
    • Troll: FB
  287. @Matt07924

    Maybe he shouldn;t have eaten his drug stash then

  288. Marty says:
    @The Scalpel

    Hey doc, here’s a guy who asphyxiated himself by getting wedged between two buildings, no cop knees required. Gotta hand it to those jigs for originality, eh?

    https://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Coroner-Oakland-man-in-July-police-chase-died-of-6639695.php

  289. @Jamie_NYC

    Explain Breonna Taylor to me. Come on. Let’s see you brilliant assholes take a shot at it. You’ve already been proved absolutely wrong beyond the shadow of a doubt about Floyd. Now let’s see you go for Taylor. It’ll be hilarious watching you squirm like you’re doing right now.

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    , @anon
  290. @csucsu

    Shall we call this black utopia “Wakanda”?

  291. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Ron Unz

    One must hallucinate to believe that the video shows Floyd doing whtat the video’s poster asserts. Also, the poster asserts quite falsely that the autopsies did not say what they say and that they said what they did not say.

    Mr. Unz, you disappoint. Why do you render credit to such racist fraud?

    • Replies: @Getaclue
  292. @FB

    I like how not a one of them dares to so much as let the name of Breonna Taylor raise its ugly head. And then there’s the white guy who they shot to death (lots of bullets; always lots of bullets) because he was lying in his own bed crying. They don’t like to talk about him either.

  293. ANZ says:
    @The Scalpel

    Ok, that’s just straight up denial. Fentanyl is very short acting. It’s effects peak almost immediately and drop off in minutes. So whatever he had when he died, he had more before he was “arrested” and was doing fine.

    What route of administration are you assuming?
    You have said twice on this thread that peak effects are immediate. That simply isn’t the case with oral administration, like if he had perhaps swallowed his stash when he realized the heat was coming down on him.

    I know that when I take an Advil, my headache doesn’t immediately disappear.

    As a doctor, you should know that different routes of administration have different times for the onset of effects. Therefore, you shouldn’t use the title of doctor to lend undue credit to your tunnel vision assertion that fentanyl’s peak effects are immediate. They are not always. Ever hear of parachuting? Ever hear of perps swallowing drugs to get rid of the evidence?

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  294. @ANZ

    No they do NOT “have to charge the cop.” Most cops who are murderers don’t even get charged. And the rest get acquitted. Because the jury is afraid of cops. But you wouldn’t understand. You don’t know nothing. All you have is drool coming out of your shit-eating mouth.

  295. vot tak says:
    @Ron Unz

    From the 3cranes post linked:

    “Here’s video Floyd being taken out of his Mercedes SUV, cuffed and made to sit on the sidewalk. He tries to ditch some packets of white powder.”

    The video is from infowars and pushes the same manipulative line. What one actually sees in the video is Floyd might have dropped something small and white colored that was in his hands that were handcuffed behind his back as he was seated down against the wall by the cop. After he is leaning towards the direction of the camera and one doesn’t see the object any more. Then as the cops are getting him up towards the end of the video one sees the cop reach down and pick up something from the area where Floyd is seated. The cop puts what he picked up into his trowser pocket.

    The whole comment by 3cranes is nothing but pure speculation tailored to fit the “get the criminal cops off by any bs means available” narrative. There is no factual material at all in that comment and what little evidence he posted, he misrepresented, in the manner I just showed here.

    This whole line of trying to make Floyd look as criminal as possible, while obfuscating his cause of death has only one purpose. To make the criminals (the cops who murdered him) look as thweet and innocent as possible and facilitate in the public mind they are innocent of wrongdoing, and by extension, the criminal, corrupt, racist, fascist establishment they are typical representatives of. In other words, get the killers off, pin the blame on the victim, and continue on the misrule in america as before.

    Again.

    The cop who killed, yes, killed, Floyd has been charged with 2nd degree murder. Not manslaughter, not negligent homicide, not the other crimes of death by accident or negligence. I shouldn’t have to explain basics here, but… 2nd degree homicide is murder where the murder was not planned beforehand, but still very much intentional, essentially.

    Now why would the prosecution bureaucracy go to all the expense and work to charge this cop with 2nd degree murder if they did not think there was a valid case for it?

    The reality is how the cop killed Floyd is essentially irrelevant to the cop’s intent to kill or seriously permanently cripple Floyd. That is why the criminal is being charged with 2nd degree murder.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
    , @Brás Cubas
  296. JimDandy says:
    @ANZ

    “Still, that doesn’t justify a knee to the neck of a face-down cuffed man for eight minutes,”

    I saw some video of what I sensed was St. Floyd kicking out at cops when they tried to keep him in the back of police car. I guessed that maybe he connected a kick to a cop’s face or groin, and got pulled out of the car and put down on the ground in a painful restraint for it. I don’t know that, though.

    When the newbie cops mentioned that someone on fentanyl could suffocate if they were in the wrong body position, the cop with his knee on Floyd’s neck said, “That’s why we have him on his stomach.”

    I’m going to assume that the cop will stick to the story that he was doing what he thought was best for the perp. But I’m still not sure what actions he took that justify the charges against him. Or any crime. Do you know? People keep telling me that the knee-to-the-neck move was approved departmental procedure.

    • Replies: @ANZ
  297. ANZ says:
    @Ron Unz

    In reference to Antony Karlin’s claim that George Floyd has 11 ng/ml of fentanyl, here is a quote and reference website for an EU drug monitoring agency:

    “Blood concentrations of approximately 7 ng/ml or greater have been associated with fatalities where poly-substance use was involved.”

    https://www.emcdda.europa.eu/publications/drug-profiles/fentanyl_en

    George Floyd also came back positive for methamphetamine.

  298. vot tak says:
    @ANZ

    Another likudite zionazi-gay troll mouthing the same zionazi-gay “talking points”. You boogaloo butt bros might as well be computer generated bots. Probably most are.

  299. @FB

    Umm, that isn’t the Golden Rule.

    The Golden Rule is Matthew 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

    Quoting Matthew 7:1 without verse 2 is leaving out quite a bit.

    1Judge not, that ye be not judged.
    2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

    Really in context with verses 3-5 it is a teaching against hypocrisy.

  300. Slimer says:
    @shotgun6

    LOL! White fantasies of browns and yellows swooping in and save them are always good for a laugh.

    What you’re describing would require cutting off immigration so that Asians and Hispanics have time to assimilate. Since that’s not going to happen anytime soon, those groups will continue to occupy a sort of buffer zone where they put their heads down, focus on work and avoid dealing in politics. They’ll side with white people by default, but change direction the moment a white person makes fun of their food, or refuses to go on a date with them. Then it’s POC unity, etc. This is especially true for Asians, who regard blacks as boring and see whites as more worthy competitors.

    Hispanics are more rah rah about sticking it to blacks, but the reach of that hostility extends little further than occasional gang wars and catty comments on twitter about black women’s looks. On the political front, Hispanics have no interest in challenging blacks.

  301. Getaclue says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    You’re the “fraud” — what is stated is actually credible as to everything I’ve seen as to this incident– in your creepy world view that’s “RAYCISSSSSS” — but you are the Racist who wants a bs narrative of YT wantonly killing a poor lad for no reason so that Cities can be burned down and innocent people murdered by your righteous Comrades and your lunatic Leftist “vision” enacted — you don’t give a crap about the truth nor about justice — you just want some bs Leftist Utopia Fraud enacted on the rest of us…you’ll lose badly in the end — people are waking up to how very dangerous you lunatics are — to everyone regardless of their “Race”.

  302. vot tak says:
    @The Scalpel

    “What pray tell, does GMT stand for? 😉”

    The answer is in the time stamp just below your name in your comment, Greenwich Mean Time…I have those lapses all the time. ;-D

    Nice work discussing the medical aspects here, btw.

  303. Loup-Bouc says:
    @The Scalpel

    You must be kidding. June 9, 2020 at 1:14 am GMT is the date & time identifies Unz Review places at the start of every comment. The “GMT” part is not my doing. And, having read Unz Review and posted many comments here, surely you must know its meaning. Your current point is irrelevant to our previous debate.

  304. Fred,

    Well done as usual with recommendations about how a difficult topic might be improved upon in America.

    Someone, other than myself, has finally suggested that the country is descending quickly and inexorably into third world country status. If it is not already there as I have personally believed for some years!

    Freda

  305. @Jim Richard

    Autopsy says Floyd had COVID-19. Maybe they should just declare he died of Covid-19 like they did with everyone else who died with it in their system. Why bother telling the truth? Nobody seems to care about Truth anymore; they just buy into whatever lie makes them feel better and secure.

  306. Loup-Bouc says:
    @vot tak

    Your comment is partly correct and very useful, especially because of its accurate description of what the video shows and does not show and its observation that the 3cranes comment is speculative (and, I add, and much fraudulent).

    But partly your comment misapprehends the applicable law and what that law indicates. See my comment of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (comment 282).

    I applaud your courage.

  307. @vot tak

    Now why would the prosecution bureaucracy go to all the expense and work to charge this cop with 2nd degree murder if they did not think there was a valid case for it?

    Mob rules.

  308. Getaclue says:
    @Jamie_NYC

    The Israelis taught the “knee” move to that Police Department — how about that? — the Black Chief of Police brought them in to do so as has happened Nationwide — that will be the Defense, it’s a standard practice at many Police Departments now– the Mainslime Media of course has lied about this…what else?:https://www.henrymakow.com/2020/06/george-staged-masonic-sacrifice.html

  309. Rogue says:
    @lavoisier

    Specifically, just to be clear, it was a prominent Black woman who went public and said that the police commissioner should resign for his remarks regarding street crime and Black youths. What other prominent Black people said at the time, I don’t know. They might have disagreed with her or not.

    This same woman now sits in the House of Lords in the UK, and continues to be a prominent Black UK voice.

    A couple of years ago she accused the fire department of racism for not tackling a massive blaze at a London tower block with sufficient fervor, because most of the people within it were non White. Needless to say, no credible evidence has ever emerged to validate her allegations.

  310. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @ANZ

    The autopsy didn’t find any pills. QED

    • Replies: @ANZ
  311. Realist says:

    What politician is going to order the shooting of hundreds of black Americans?

    Exactly…and that is why politicians will not solve the problems of the US.

  312. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    That hypothesis is really going out on a limb. None of the autopsy reports, even the first one which was biased toward the police, supports it. No pill fragments, no wrappers, no residue in the GI tract.

    Why would the police pull a dead man back out of the car? The video clearly shows that it was not to do CPR. If he was not struggling they should have driven to the station. If he was struggling, he was not dead. Which is it?

    The scenario you noted makes the comical assertion that by dying, Floyd was resisting arrest, and further manhandling by the police was called for! How about checking for a pulse or breathing? Then, Floyd magically comes back to life back out of the car, struggling, saying “I can’t breathe”. Fatal overdoses don’t do that. Its a simple down and out unless there is recusitation.

    Then he dies with police officer kneeling on his neck, yelling that he can’t breath, from an unrelated overdose! How convenient!

    This scenario is like the worst of George W Bush fixing the facts around the conclusion, making up yellow cake to fill in the gaps, ignoring the obvious absence of evidence to support it.

    • Replies: @ANZ
  313. @The Scalpel

    I was that commenter and you have dishonestly paraphrased what I wrote. The video shows the young cop unable to close the door because Floyd’s legs below the knee were sticking out the door, and Chauvin walking around to the other side door. The MSM cuts off the video there. I suggested the video was cut there as what it showed would not support the St. Floyd narrative. That’s all. Floyd would have been placed in the cruiser legs first, so he deliberately poked both legs out to be disruptive. I don’t like cops, but it was St. Floyd’s behavior, starting with his multiple convictions and ending here that was a major cause of his death. I don’t like cops, and I dislike MD’s more. For every person who killed by police, MD’s kill 250 through malpractice, and how many more by malice? I have direct experience of the stupidity and malice of your exalted profession. I went to ER with extreme leg pain and cyanotic toes. In Imaging, the two MDs acted in a flip, distainful manner. They stupidly sent me to an ultrasound for a “veinus”, then told me to my face I had no blockage, one looked at my cyanotic toes and said in a flip manner “weird”. I had a blockage in my leg artery. They should have admitted me then and there but merely referred me to a Vascular Surgeon. Before the date of that appointment I ended up in the ER(different one). Here I experienced the arrogance, hostility and sexual perversion of Surgeons. Of the four I dealt with, three were scum. One, a Somali, was openly hostile to me while leering pervertedly at my girlfriend. I refused to let him be involved in my surgery. Two others were also openly hostile and abusive. The fourth was OK, nothing special just OK. I got lucky. What would have happened if I didn’t get lucky I don’t want to think about. You, “Scalpel” are getting palsy with “FB”, and its a big mistake. “FB” is mentally ill, and has humiliated himself here by “proving” that what happened the the Russian ELINT aircraft in Syria( shot down by a Syrian SAM) was “impossible”. He disappeared for a few months after that, and now he is back, sneering and pretending he is the smartest guy in the room. Now you are doing it too.

    • Replies: @Biff
    , @The Scalpel
  314. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    I can’t emphasize enough the amount of illogical, unsupported, gerrymandering of evidence and pure imagination is necessary to promote this scenario.

    A. A man dies after shouting that he can’t breath (with a police officer kneeling on his neck for something like 9 minutes) because the police officer had him face down kneeling on his neck.

    B. A man orally overdoses without any witnesses or leaving any evidence of this in his GI tract. The drugs conveniently do not disable him enough to prevent him from resisting being put in a police car, then they disable him so much that he is lying on the ground unable to get into the police car. Then they do not disable him enough to stop him from again struggling while being placed in the police car. Then they disable him so much that the police pull him out of the police car out of concern for his health. Then the police don’t do anything to ensure he is healthy. Then the drugs are not disabling him enough to prevent him from struggling enough to prompt a police officer to kneel on his neck. Then he dies, just by coincidence, (not due to the police kneeling on his neck mind you!) but from the unrelated drug overdose at miraculously the the same time the policeman is kneeling on his neck.

    Which scenario you gonna believe? I know what Occam would believe.

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
  315. vot tak says:

    Cheers Loup-Bouc. You go into a lot more detail and have more knowledge of the applicable law than I do. This short article has some more info on the charges levelled on the 4 criminal cops:

    Prosecutors seek right balance of charges in George Floyd case

    https://www.kare11.com/mobile/article/news/local/george-floyd/prosecutors-seek-right-balance-of-charges-in-george-floyd-case/89-18b68e8a-8b79-40c7-9814-cd740d321669

    According to the article, the prosecution is seeking 2nd degree murder under a different reason than I wrote above and I stand corrected.

  316. neutral says:
    @Truth

    Mexicans don’t like niggers.

    • Replies: @Biff
  317. Wally says:
    @vot tak

    – Except that you have no proof that ‘has a record a mile long’ violent criminal Floyd’s death was due to “racism”.

    – The question about America being better than everyone else or “racist” is answered by the simple fact that it IS the most preferred destination of so called ‘immigrants’.

    good news:

    Trump to Resume Iconic MAGA Rallies Within Weeks: https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/06/08/trump-campaign-to-resume-iconic-maga-rallies-within-weeks/

    • Troll: vot tak
  318. @Wally

    Brilliant,

    Fair play to this young lady

  319. @Haole

    Mexico is looking better and better.

    According to blogger Jim Stone, another Mexican ex-pat, you don’t have to stop at red lights after 10 p.m. due to the risk of carjacking.

    Sounds like a peach of a place.

    • Replies: @Haole
  320. MarkinLA says:
    @obwandiyag

    There are plenty of stories of innocent people being gunned down during one of these no-knock raids. She is far from the only one. Lavosier posted one in Maryland that was probably due to “red flag laws”.

  321. Biff says:
    @Bombercommand

    leering pervertedly at my girlfriend.

    Her name was Steve, and the rest of your rant is idiotic.

    • LOL: FB
    • Replies: @vot tak
  322. Biff says:
    @neutral

    Mexicans don’t like niggers.

    With some cumin, hot chili, and lime juice they might change their mind.

  323. Miro23 says:
    @Dieter Kief

    The veil of civilization is thin, as the old white males of yesterday knew.

    Yes, and it’s the morality of a decadent society to coddle these Black students with free computers, free food, no discipline and tolerate their violence.

    A healthy society would only give them money for work and throw them out of education if they were disruptive. But then the US and the UK are very sick societies. For example the Pakistani mayor of London, Sadiq Khan, is currently compiling a list of historic London statues that have to be pulled down (they’re “racist”).

    Unlikely that Islamabad has an English mayor making a list of local historic statues to pull down.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8401935/Sadiq-Khan-calls-Londons-slave-trader-statues-removed-orders-landmarks-review.html

    • Replies: @Jeff Stryker
    , @Dieter Kief
  324. ANZ says:
    @The Scalpel

    Most illicit fentanyl from places like China comes in powder form. The lack of pills in his GI tract does not rule out overdose.

    In your opinion, how did all that fentanyl get into his system?

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  325. @Biff

    Welllll … we can safely assume that his mother is not a muscular 6’6”, 255-pound man.

  326. @fnn

    His name was James Whitehead

    His name was Daniel Kevin Harris

    [MORE]

    His name was Richard Gary Black

    His name was Robert Earl Lawrence

  327. @Miro23

    Its not so much charity as way to clear troublemakers off the streets whose numbers would make everyday a civil unrest.

    The idea behind-which is logical-is simply to keep them off the street. Kind of like Soviets and Chinese forced known prostitutes to work in factories.

    Morons believe that with no money they would suddenly stop selling drugs, stealing cars, fencing and become Class A workers with a Calvinist work ethic.

    What a crock of sh*t.

    Enough money and diversion prevents looting and riots from happening every single day of the year.

    Africans already live in Mexico. On the Yucatan.

  328. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Bombercommand

    Bombercommand,

    I am thankful for the information you presented about Floyd kicking his legs to resist closing the squad car door. I did not intend to insult or malign you in any way. My point was that if that was the only issue preventing the door closing and the trip to the police station, then a few minutes of effort could have solved that rather than pulling him back out of the car, further brutalizing him, and eventually killing him.

    I am sorry for your negative experiences with the medical field. I won’t try to make any excuses for that. It sounds awful.

  329. ANZ says:
    @The Scalpel

    None of the autopsy reports, even the first one which was biased toward the police, supports it. No pill fragments, no wrappers, no residue in the GI tract.

    I’ve read the autopsy report. There is only a macroscopic visual inspection of the stomach contents. To say no residues were found in the GI tract is misleading to say the least. They didn’t look for them.

    Then, Floyd magically comes back to life back out of the car, struggling, saying “I can’t breathe”. Fatal overdoses don’t do that. Its a simple down and out unless there is recusitation.

    Your claims of being a doctor who sees lots of OD patients doesn’t pass the smell test. I’ve actually seen people OD on pills in real life with my own eyes. It’s doesn’t work like a light switch. It’s a progression along a continuum. It goes from mild to bad to worse over time.

    Because oral OD is not like a light switch, an ER would pump the stomach of a patient to get rid of any additional drugs ASAP to treat the OD.

    Your continued contention that a fentanyl OD always presents immediately and like a light switch does not square with reality. I hope you are not a real MD who sees real patients because your errors are glaring.

    • Agree: Getaclue
    • Replies: @Biff
    , @The Scalpel
    , @Rurik
  330. @Miro23

    the Pakistani mayor of London, Sadiq Khan, is currently compiling a list of historic London statues that have to be pulled down (they’re “racist”).

    The idea is to heal the past. Its like drying water. We’re collectively approaching child-heaven-on-earth of absolutely sinless love & purity.

    Something else the old (Goya) knew: The sleep of reason creates monsters.

    And a last one: “Even utopias have their time tables.” (Philosopher Ernst Bloch)

  331. ANZ says:
    @JimDandy

    I believe there probably was a struggle to subdue Floyd which would constitute resisting arrest. If you’re a cop, you’re training tells you to use more force to physically subdue the suspect. I also have the hunch that this knee to neck tactic was department approved and possibly trained. This means no murder charge is the officer was following established protocol, regardless of whether that protocol itself was right or wrong.

    Having a guy face down and cuffed with his arms behind his back constitutes subdued for me. I could see the use of a knee to neck technique being used briefly to get a man cuffed but not sustained after that. Seemed a bit ecessive to me but not murderously so.

    • Replies: @JimDandy
    , @Loup-Bouc
  332. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @ANZ

    I agree. He injected it or snorted it. The effect of overdose is seconds not minutes. Boom. Passed out. Had he overdosed, he would have been down and out almost immediately not 15 minutes or more later.

  333. Biff says:
    @ANZ

    I’ve actually seen people OD on pills in real life with my own eyes.

    We don’t need explicit details on how you raped your sister.

  334. Fred,
    You of all people should smell a rat here. This thing was staged, with “George” or whatever his name really is, as the lead. They do this all the time.

  335. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @ANZ

    He did not overdose on pills! It is to your credit that you don’t know that abusers snort or inhale this stuff. They don’t take it in pill form. Amphetamine pills would not have dissolved completely in that time frame. They would have been seen on autopsy. But the bottom line is that abusers snort or inject this stuff. The effect is heightened. It is within a few seconds. Watch Breaking Bad for God’s sake. Would you rather spend an equal amount of money on a Corvette or a Prius if your goal was to go fast?

    • Replies: @ANZ
  336. Karel says:
    @Thomasina

    Yes it makes sense the policeman wanted to alleviate Floyds respiratory problem by kneeling on his neck , which is a well established but largely forgotten procedure. It is unfortunate, that it is not used more in hospitals on patients who cannot breath on their own as it would save a lot of money thrown away buying expensive but useless ventilators.

  337. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    I can’t emphasize enough the amount of illogical, unsupported, gerrymandering of evidence and pure imagination is necessary to promote this scenario.

    Well, I watched the detailed NYT video account again, and it emphasized that Floyd was in obvious “distress” even just after he exited his car. Since he apparently had an extremely high, supposedly lethal level of Fentanyl in his blood, wouldn’t that best explain his “distress”?

    There was also a big NYT story this morning about Floyd’s background, which naturally under-emphasized his long and violent criminal history. But at the end it did mention that he’d spent the last couple of weeks just prior to his death “recovering” from Covid-19. It sounds like he had a reasonably severe case, and wouldn’t that have very possibly given him serious lung and heart problems?

    Apparently, the knee-neck hold had been a standard practice in Minneapolis for years, and I think I saw somewhere that it’s used thousands of times each year in the US. Given the gigantic MSM coverage, wouldn’t we have already heard if it had produced a non-negligible number of fatalities? Maybe Floyd is the first American who ever died from it in the last few years.

    I also heard that the elderly doctor who the family hired for a second autopsy that came to a different conclusion did his “autopsy” just by watching the video. Do doctors consider that a real “autopsy”? And the family has now collected $20 million in donations, which certainly provides a strong incentive for claiming that Floyd was brutally murdered by the police.

    If Floyd’s lungs and heart were in bad shape from the aftermath of Covid-19 and he had a lethal level of Fentanyl plus other drugs in his system, wouldn’t that be a plausible explanation of his demise rather than a reasonably-common police restraint technique? Especially if he didn’t die by asphyxiation?

    I’m certainly not taking a firm position on any of this, and my “investigation” has been limited to reading a few comment-threads here and there and watching the NYT video. But it just doesn’t seem like an open-and-shut case to me…

  338. @ANZ

    Your faith in the DA’s office is misplaced. You have to understand that with this amount of insane media hype and political pressure, they HAVE to charge the cop, regardless of the evidence. Same for the white guys in Georgia who were physically engaged by the jogger.

    Agreed.

    Furthermore, these “controversies” are about sustaining and advancing the regime’s narrative and power.

    The perps are expendable white gentiles on the bottom of the hierarchy. The deceased are the regime’s black tools. The regime must charge these white perps because the visuals are superficially damning and the circumstances seemingly fit the regime’s anti-white narrative.

    The stories would have gone nowhere if the races of perps and deceased had been reversed.

    If rightly or wrongly Derek Chauvin gets off at the state level, a Federal civil rights investigation will ensue.

    On May 21st the FBI launched an investigation into the killing of black EMT Breonna Taylor in Kentucky. According to CNN:

    Robert Brown, special agent in charge for the FBI Louisville, issued a statement Thursday that said in part, “The FBI will collect all available facts and evidence and will ensure that the investigation is conducted in a fair, thorough and impartial manner.”

    A federal investigation into Breonna’s death is warranted because blacks are a specially protected species relative to whites on the bottom of the sociopolitical hierarchy, the optics are damning, and a successful prosecution advances the regime’s narrative.

    The regime’s message to bottom whites is, “Don’t mess with our pets!”

    Conservative-liberal clowns like Fred Reed are fully aware of this, of course.

    • Replies: @ANZ
  339. ANZ says:
    @The Scalpel

    I am well aware that meth and fentanyl can be injected or snorted. They are also commonly smoked.

    In your opinion, it is possible that a known drug dealer would have a supply of fentanyl POWDER on him on a given day? If this person were to see police approaching, could this individual dispose of drugs by swallowing them?

    If this were to happen, could an OD slowly commence and become fatal in the timeframe of say around 20 minutes (or whatever the exact timeframe was)?

    All of this seems very plausible and is consistent with the dynamics of the GI OD route. While this may not be what happened, dismissing it as some crackpot denialist conspiracy thoery is uncalled for and ignores medical science.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  340. @Ron Unz

    Now you don’t get down and dirty for no reason, you’ll only make more problems for urself.

  341. @RoatanBill

    You have provided zero evidence that cops provide a needed service.

    You could say that about most government activity. But, let’s try.

    When you are cruising along at 45 mph in a 30 mph zone and spot a cop car, what is your reaction? Mine is to back off on the accelerator. I don’t want to get a ticket for speeding.

    So, the existence of the cop suppresses speeding. Not everywhere, not all the time, but enough to keep the overall death rate from fatal automobile accidents down somewhat.

    Did that help? We have to accept that there are legacy operations that may be obsolete. The cop shop might be one of those. But until we come up with a better way, it’s what we have.

    An example would be to mandate governers on all vehicles sold in the country. 20 mph headon crashes are probably survivable.

    • Replies: @RoatanBill
  342. JimDandy says:
    @ANZ

    Yeah, but “excessive” is a subjective term, which, I guess, would give a jury leeway to convict him of just about anything.

    I don’t think the cop killed him. When you’ve got coronary heart disease (and the stroke-inducing blood disease, Covid-19) and you’re filled to the gills with fentanyl and entering cardiac arrest while violently resisting arrest, it certainly doesn’t help matters to have a cop’s knee on the back of your neck. But who is to blame for that?

    • Replies: @ANZ
  343. Rurik says:
    @ANZ

    Then, Floyd magically comes back to life back out of the car, struggling, saying “I can’t breathe”. Fatal overdoses don’t do that. Its a simple down and out unless there is recusitation.

    Your claims of being a doctor who sees lots of OD patients doesn’t pass the smell test. I’ve actually seen people OD on pills in real life with my own eyes. It’s doesn’t work like a light switch. It’s a progression along a continuum. It goes from mild to bad to worse over time.

    I haven’t had a lot of time to scrutinize these comments, but it seems to me what The Scalpel is saying is that once the OD patient ODs, (loses consciousness) then they don’t generally pop back into consciousness without some assistance of some kind. Not, as you seem to be suggesting, that a person who ODs does so immediately and without a progression of symptoms.

    The ‘light switch’ is once they finally succumb, not the progression up until that point.

    But just to chime in, I think a salient point here is that I don’t imagine anyone would try to defend what the cop did by lingering on the guy’s neck, as the man pleads that he can’t breath.

    I hope we all agree that such was callous, if not a down-right criminal disregard for a man’s (utterly subdued) wellbeing. Once he was subdued, it wasn’t the cop’s prerogative to further subjugate him. Their job is to subdue the suspect, and then let off. But the problem is too many cops consider it their right to punish the suspect and impose their own personal sense of justice upon them.

    That is an abuse of power, and any time someone in authority (of any race) abuses the power they’re trusted with, then the full weight of society’s righteous wrath needs to come down upon them like a ton of bricks.

    Floyd may well have been a scumbag, (and it seems that he was), but that doesn’t give the cops the right to punish him. That’s the job of the courts and criminal ‘justice’ and society, if they deem it’s merited.

    But what I sense with this case, is that so many (often but not only white) people are so (understandably) outraged by the criminality of illiterate, (stupid) violent, hate-filled young black men (the Michael Browns) in general, that they’d be willing to give some leeway to cops to use a little rough tactics from time to time, if only because these ‘scumbags’ (probably do) deserve it.

    But once you give cops the power to personally dispense punishment to those who offend them, or don’t respect their ‘authority’, then you’re headed to a Police State.

    Which is what the PTB want, trust me.

    They’re using this tragedy (don’t they always ; ) to hype-up racial division and hatred. Their end-game is to sow the kind of chaos that will facilitate their being able ‘crack down’.

    We shouldn’t play into their schemes.

    Less power for cops, and more societal opprobrium for black and brown criminality- which is *not* a consequence of ‘white racism’, (((as we’re all hectored relentlessly to believe))), but is rather a consequence of paying poor (often stupid) white and black and brown women to have babies they can’t afford, and who will grow up to be just as stupid and socially failed as their mothers and ‘baby-daddys’.

    Subsidizing poverty and giving financial incentives for poor and unemployable women to have babies, is the stupidest thing a society could possibly do, unless ((they)) wanted that society to destroy itself.

    A smarter way would be to pay these women not to have babies. But then that would be like the ‘Nazis’, who practiced eugenics.

    better that we practice reverse eugenics, (which is what the welfare scam is all about anyways),

    so that Never Again! must we lose any sleep over someone trying to remove the iron boot ((we)) have on Western civilization’s neck.

    • Replies: @ANZ
  344. @Robert Dolan

    Impressive list of victims ignored by “our” systemically racist regime and its proponents. The phrase “systemic racism” as employed by progressive-liberals is projection, for the regime and its proponents are anti-white.

    I disagree with Duke’s take on the coronavirus, however.

  345. @The Scalpel

    Unless I’ve missed it in your replies, you have not addressed that Floyd it is alleged that was complaining “I can’t breathe” before he was taken to the ground. Once on the ground a call for medical help was made. That would indicate there was a problem in progress, if true. Additionally, we don’t know when he took the drugs. He could have taken them sitting in his car just before police arrived. I understand tolerance, as well as time, method of ingestion and body mass plays a part as well. Even with Floyd’s tolerance and size factored in, it is irrelevant if he was complaining he couldn’t breathe before he was taken down.

    Aside from all that, I can’t get my head around why a convenience store would call police solely because of a fake $20 bill. I have asked a number of people who work in retail, and they are puzzled as well. Their standard response to fake bills is “we can’t take that”, and don’t get involved any further. This “story” has some serious discrepancies. Have you ever seen EMS/EMTs wearing bullet proof vests and not bringing medical supplies to a patient?

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  346. ANZ says:
    @Rurik

    Nodding out is a characteristic of opioid use.

    There is a huge difference between the characteristic of an oral OD vs a smoked or injected OD.

    For the latter, the effects are near instantaneous and you don’t come back from it sans naloxone or something similar. I believe that Scalpel has been saying that this couldn’t have been an OD case because the Floyd comes in and out of it. This would be true if he shot up.

    However, oral OD progresses through ever increasing levels of intoxication, with all the associates manifest signs. This would include nodding in and out of consciousness due to fentanyl before succumbing to its lethal effects. If Floyd ate his stash, his OD would be consistent with the video evidence.

    Aside from that, my other comments on this matter are more or less in line with the rest of your analysis.

    • Thanks: Rurik
  347. @HallParvey

    If you’re cruising 45 in a 30 zone, where is the injured party – the victim of your actions? If there’s no victim then there’s no crime. Why must you pay a ticket for injuring no one?

    Just because some politician decides to tell you how fast you are supposed to drive doesn’t mean there’s any logical reason for the restriction. There can’t be any ‘science’ behind the restriction because we all drive different vehicles with different capabilities, not to mention the person behind the wheel varies in capabilities immensely.

    The ticket scam is an attempt at social control, nothing more. There are plenty of laws backed up by common sense that says hitting something with your vehicle makes you liable. Hitting something at an unreasonable speed should be taken into consideration at trial IF you actually cause injury or property damage. Handing out tickets for injuring no one or no thing is prior restraint and tyranical.

  348. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    … Fentanyl plus other drugs in his system, wouldn’t that be a plausible explanation of his demise rather than a reasonably-common police restraint technique? Especially if he didn’t die by asphyxiation?

    … But it just doesn’t seem like an open-and-shut case to me…

    Sure, as to the exact cause of his death, and so forth.. sure.

    But, watching the video of the man pleading that he can’t breath, while being utterly subdued and prostrate in the street with three cops kneeling on him, isn’t it obviously an open and shut case that the cop on his neck should have pulled back, (since he was utterly subdued), and pleading that he couldn’t breath?

    I mean if for nothing else, than the pure optics of it.

    Our society is becoming unglued by racial strife, with a common theme of police brutality, especially (if not dishonestly characterized), by the ((media)).

    The cop must have seen the people video taping the scene, and he put his hand in his pocket as nonchalantly as can be. Like torturing a man is blasé.

    Once we remove race from the issue, it seems clear, (at least to me), that the actions of the cop were appalling and egregious. IOW it doesn’t (or shouldn’t) matter that the guy was a scumbag and on drugs and not to be trusted. For a cop who’s a professional, you remove the threat, and then you conduct the procedures necessary to get the suspect into custody while still alive.

    This case reminds me of Freddy Grey, where they tortured (a yes, scumbag) to death.

    They broke his spine that then gave him a ‘rough ride’ to the station, in a metal van, instead of an ambulance.

    The problem is our media is soooo dishonest and one-sided, that everyone assumes these are all cartoon cases of ‘racist cops (of every race) vs. put-upon, innocent blacks, or (from the other side) that these violent criminals are so beneath contempt that they don’t deserve a shred of compassion.

    Cops should be held to a very strict code of conduct, and blacks (and others) need to be held accountable for their criminality.

    The problem is our media (no ((echoes)) even necessary ; ), approve of both the criminality of blacks, and the brutality of the police. Both are seen as weapons against the greater (white) society that they consider their existential enemies.

    We are at war, and we don’t even know it. And black (and other) criminality, and cops who consider the public as their enemy, are simply weapons of that war being waged against the West.

    • Agree: The Scalpel, acementhead
    • Replies: @Curmudgeon
  349. @Ron Unz

    I agree. There is a lot missing from the narrative. It is an assumption that he took the drug orally. In fact, there are a lot of assumptions throughout the narrative, and a whole lot of unanswered questions, such as why would 3 police cars with six officers report to an attempt to pass an alleged $20 dollar bill? Why were Floyd and his friend still at the scene long after (in the context of post criminal action) the 911 call?

    Slightly off topic, but to address Fred Reed’s article, there are plenty of innocent people shot in police raids, not all of them are going to be Black., and a lot of them are “wrong door”. This is from 2014.
    https://www.vox.com/2014/10/29/7083371/swat-no-knock-raids-police-killed-civilians-dangerous-work-drugs
    The raids have increased, not decreased. IMO it is irrelevant whether Breanna Taylor was Black, White, Red, Yellow, or polka dot. Conducting these types of raids are an invitation for bad things to happen, and there effectiveness is highly questionable.

    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  350. Loup-Bouc says:
    @ANZ

    I believe there probably was a struggle to subdue Floyd….

    Who needs facts? Right?

    Just pick a belief and transmute reality to the hallucinations the belief requires.

    • Replies: @ANZ
  351. Haole says:
    @Nancy Pelosi's Latina Maid

    Depends on where you are in beautiful el Beanerstan, just like the USA. Remember when somebody moves out of Minneapolis they probably wont move to chicago, salt lake might work.

  352. @Rurik

    Overall, I agree with your comment. However, the police are subject to a strict code of conduct, the problem comes from who is administering it. If George Floyd had been White, I can guarantee you that those in charge of administering the conduct would have been defending what had happened as a druggie resisting arrest meeting an unfortunate end brought about, in part, by his own actions of failing to obey a lawful order. The problem is not the code of conduct, it’s the selective enforcement.

    As I have posted elsewhere, this whole narrative has a lot of odd things happening, not the least of which is why 3 cars and 6 officers would respond to a report of a fake $20 bill being passed.

    • Replies: @Rurik
  353. @sonofman

    Certainly see part of your point, but the rest sadly is well-intentioned wishful thinking. You’re a kindhearted person for celebrating the interests that people of all races and colors have in common, the times we have gotten along and gotten good things accomplished in the past, and for wanting that to be the general prevailing pattern.

    Skin color itself of course does nothing to make it harder for different peoples to live and work together peacefully, productively. That is a straw man, perhaps not intended.

    Rather, the things that make it harder for such peaceful, productive coexistence appear reasonably well correlated with skin color but go far beyond something so superficial. We are not talking aesthetics but fundamental deep differences. It should be obvious that there are genetically based differences in average aptitudes, different Levels and “kinds” of intelligence, differing degrees of natural interests, preferences, and proclivities (re proclivities that we all share to some degree as human beings). These genetic differences likely come in large part from millenia of separate evolution in very different physical and climactic environments.

    There is no need to insult or get emotional about “us” being “better” than “them” as an unqualified statement. The narrower but still vital is that it is futile to try to force fundamentally different groups together in society. The adverse consequence — including natural hostility, tension, and violence — are all the more severe when we try to force the mixing on a large scale, heavyhandedly, rather than being content with selective, truly voluntary interaction from largely separate geographic and societal “bases.”

    If Africans had never been brought to this country, my life would be poorer because some very special, trustworthy, caring people — one particularly dear old friend, and other acquaintances — all descendants of slaves, would not be here. But my life, health, physical safety, peace of mind, and everyday quality of life would be light years ahead of where they are now.

    It happens that I suffer a permanent serious back condition from an explicitly racial assault, and many nonAfrican people have not been thus directly targeted and attacked. But it is not at all rare, and it appears to be getting more common as we become naive self-doubting schmucks and try to deny the glaring reality of persistent racial differences. These differences can and do cost nonAfricans (and some Africans) their lives, their jobs, their ability to ever let their guard down and feel truly at home in the extended family called a nation.

    I have hated and been hated, and grown tired and saddened by both. But we only invite more problems, and more violence, if we stay on our present course instead of speaking candidly and regaining out collective courage and common sense about race — in the American context, that one disproportionately volatile and dangerous race in particular. “Separate, stop the hate” is the least bad solution i have seen, sad and difficult though it may be in some respects.

    • Thanks: The Scalpel
  354. I feel like I’m living through the 1965 movie, “DOCTOR ZHIVAGO”.

    God bless President Donald John Trump and our United States of America, and damn the Bolsheviks who’ve taken over our streets shrieking their ignorant “politically correct” propaganda!

    Nationwide repeal of all firearms legislation, accompanied by a restoration of racial segregation, along with legalized implementation of Code Duello, would immediately resolve almost all contemporary social problems.

    I freely admit that, without any apology, I am racially prejudiced in favor of my own Caucasian race (i.e., Viking, Celtic, Anglo-Saxon).

    In spite of that, throughout my mortal life, I have personally witnessed repeated instances of Christian brotherhood, regardless of race.

    Never the less, I believe that racial prejudice is an inherent survival instinct with which we are endowed from the moment we are born into mortality.

    Because of this, no government mandated legislation may be permitted to infringe upon our inalienable right to choose who we will associate with, and/or refuse to associate with.

    However, being racially prejudiced does not justify persecuting others because of the circumstances of their birth, except when required for family and/or community defense.

    When there is no rule of law, due to the deliberate failure of elected officials and appointed bureaucrats to obey or uphold existing law, then the helpless citizenry must appeal for their mutual survival to historic practical alternatives, i.e., night-riding vigilante justice, the Sons of Liberty, and/or the Ku Klux Klan, which, to be effective, must make public examples of the retribution to be imposed on those who violate accepted community moral standards.

    John Robert Mallernee

  355. ANZ says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    Show me a complete video of the arrest to substantiate your “reality.” Otherwise you’re nothing more than a pot calling a kettle black.

    Looks like they were trying awful hard to control him in the back of the police car, as video shows.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  356. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @ANZ

    Those are good points. Still opiate overdose is a one way ticket. Once drowsiness sets in, unconsciousness occurs rapidly thereafter and level of consciousness never improves again. One really does not see this in the video unless one claims that just by coincidence Floyd was not suffering any sedation from the Fentanyl until the police had his knees on Floyd’s neck.

    Is that possible in theory? Yes, lots of things are possible in theory. Probable? I’d say it’s a case of “Are you going to believe me (the apologists) or your own lying eyes (video)?

    This is not to mention that there is absolutely no evidence in the autopsy or otherwise that Floyd swallowed Fentanyl. Dropping a plastic bag? Is no evidence he swallowed anything

    • Replies: @ANZ
  357. @Curmudgeon

    The raids have increased, not decreased. IMO it is irrelevant whether Breanna Taylor was Black, White, Red, Yellow, or polka dot. Conducting these types of raids are an invitation for bad things to happen, and there effectiveness is highly questionable.

    Agree that raids have increased and their effectiveness is questionable. However, you are mistaken to believe race is irrelevant.

    Race is employed by the systemically racist, anti-white regime to sustain and advance its power. You may not care about race, but the anti-white regime cares about you.

    Anybody who actually believes that “defunding police departments” is about reforming police methods is averse to reality and ignoring 56+ years of history.

    This is about elevating the left’s power in police departments.

    Law enforcement is not going away. Leaving will be unreliable “deplorables” in police departments. Their replacements will be white SJWs and anti-white blacks with a chip on their shoulders.

    If you think present law enforcement as presently constituted is one-sided and hypocritical toward whites on the bottom, you haven’t seen anything yet.

    • Agree: Rogue
    • Replies: @Dannyboy
  358. turtle says:
    @Robert Dolan

    His name was Chris Mihaylo

    https://www.azfamily.com/news/suspect-accused-of-stabbing-phoenix-man-80-times-inside-apartment/article_7790dede-ca89-11e9-a624-df7f52f6f21d.html

    I once knew his parents.
    Chuck Mihaylo is an orphan.
    His wife, Gail, is the daughter of a (white) Georgia sharecropper.
    They are both religious and teetotal, and worked hard for every penny they ever earned.

  359. Loup-Bouc says:
    @ANZ

    I did not purport to premise an opinion on a complete or partial video or on any belief.

  360. Exador says:

    Nobody seems to notice a pertinent fact: Floyd was HUGE! 6’8″. I’m guessing the cops who arrested him were a bit intimidated by that and probably a little over-zealous about getting and keeping him under control. Also, people that big, that haven’t led a very healthy life, rarely make it to 50. So while the cop probably was the cause, Floyd’s ticker was probably on the verge of going anyway. All it needed was a little excitement, like having a cop kneel on you.

    • Replies: @Truth
  361. ANZ says:
    @The Scalpel

    I have seen opiate users nod off and come to again. Have you?

    They do come back from unconsciousness. Until there is too much drug in their system. Then they don’t. If they shoot the drug, they go from 0 to 60 and have too much drug all at once. Very stark contrast. Might nod out and never come back.

    If they ingest too much of the drug, they go through the stages of first being high, then going to OD status. This is because GI absorption is not all at once, but exhibits gradual uptake. Powdered drug would show the sharpest rate of absorption and therefore the quickest time to OD. Being high on opiates regularly includes drifting into and out of consiousness.

    He looked impaired when he was first removed from his vehicle. He looked impaired to the clerk when he tried to pass a fake $20. Might not take much more to push him over the edge, perhaps. Who knows?

    Have you seen people OD on oral opiates, or is this just theory for you?

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  362. Dannyboy says:
    @Oldtradesman

    Anybody who actually believes that “defunding police departments” is about reforming police methods is averse to reality and ignoring 56+ years of history.

    This is about elevating the left’s power in police departments.

    Law enforcement is not going away. Leaving will be unreliable “deplorables” in police departments. Their replacements will be white SJWs and anti-white blacks with a chip on their shoulders.

    If you think present law enforcement as presently constituted is one-sided and hypocritical toward whites on the bottom, you haven’t seen anything yet.

    Bingo! Excellent post.

  363. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    Sedation, lethargy, then unconsciousness are the symptoms of opiate overdose. So no, “ distress” (I’m thinking they meant agitation) is not a sign of opiate overdose. Methamphetamine, sure, but that doesn’t cause one to stop breathing. Moreover, once the sedation starts, its a one way ticket to unconsciousness, no bouncing back and forth between consciousness and unconsciousness.

    I don’t have any data on the neck restraint fatality rate either, but I do know that if you put weight on a person’s chest and neck long enough, those muscles will fatigue, CO2 levels will rise in the blood stream leading to CO2 narcosis, unconsciousness and death. The amount of weight and the amount of time required varies depending on the individual.

    I would like to re-emphasize a point I made in my earlier response to you. Doubtless, Floyd had other medical conditions and was a substance abuser. You again emphasize those as contributing factors. I agree. Where we seem to disagree is your implication that those somehow give the police a pass on the fact that their use of unnecessary force caused a man in his condition to stop breathing. They are still responsible for causing him to stop breathing. I think the position you are implying is a sort of disclaimer. “ We as police take no responsibility for your medical problems or current state of health. If we use unnecessary force and you are not in good health and die as a result, we take no responsibility for this outcome. We didn’t really intend for that to happen.” Is that what you are trying to say?

    I’m not a lawyer here, but I think the key is the idea of “unnecessary force”. Negligence theory holds one accountable for even unintended consequences of negligent acts. I agree with that.

    Police are human beings. Doctors are human beings. George Floyd was a human being, maybe not that respectable in some ways, but is there a sliding scale on ones right not to be suffocated by police vs one’s respectability? Or one’s medical problems? That’s a very slippery scale and who is in charge of handing out scores? Every policeman in uniform? There are many who would disagree as we are now seeing.

    And shouldn’t that score apply equally to everyone? Should I as a physician get a pass for malpractice on every patient who has had substance abuse issues and underlying medical conditions? I think not. I could fill up a graveyard quite quickly. Then why should police malpractice be any different? I’m not talking about necessary measures to disarm those with weapons. I’m talking about unnecessary force used on unarmed suspects. These are the same people that thousands of police manage appropriately every day and I am eye witness to many of them.

    Are we saying here that those we have hired with our tax dollars to protect and serve us have some sort of special dispensation to negligently kill us? Sadly, I think many Americans are saying just that! This is the moral decay in our society that I was previously referring to. But let me be somewhat liberal in point of view in criticizing the police. Perhaps it is not entirely their fault. Perhaps they were raised in an environment that glorified violence and militarism. Perhaps they were trained to approach their fellow citizens as if they were enemy troops and not flawed human beings with possible medical problems. More symptoms of our society’s moral decay. Still, the problem exists and should be addressed – will be addressed, one way or the other. We are seeing that now.

    • Agree: FB, Biff
    • Thanks: RadicalCenter, Jazman
    • Replies: @turtle
    , @turtle
    , @Loup-Bouc
  364. @Ron Unz

    In Israel too – neck and knee. Any complaints in the NYT about it? Ever? One might – as a few commenters did here – also mention, that GeorgeFloyd had been suffering from sickle-cell anemia as well a severely stressed heart and vascular problems, which (at least in part) resulted too from his decades-long drug-consumption. Anatoly Karlin said, that sexually transmitted diseases might also be at play, since George Floyd had been working as porn “star” for a while. All these conditions and illnesses contribute too to his fragility. So – this is an impressive list, Dr. Scalpel is not too inclined to take into consideration, as it seems.

    If somebody would try to quantify George Floyd’s odds to survive his arrest, he might come up with not much above – what 60 %? Maybe 60% with neck and knee applied and – what: 64 % without it?

    That he took such a high risk of losing his life was his decision. And is thus his responsibility as a grown p person, because taking care of oneself is what constitutes the grown-up and what allows him to be free (according to Kant). Acting irresponsibly towards our own needs diminishes our own status as moral subjects and thus free individuals. Freedom and dignity are only ours as long as we behave in a reasonable way (this is still Kant – and Hegel too (freedom = insight in the necessities of our existence).

    People in a liberal society are free to take high risks. That’s fine. What’s new is, that people who did so and suffered would have to be acclaimed – or even admired, if not – – – sanctified.
    (May I add: New stuff is not necessarily good stuff…).

    The claims, that George Floyd was “murdered” (lots of German politicians on the left, and quite a few big german news media) or “tortured to death” (US-correspondent Daniel Friedrich Sturm of the daily Die weLT Germany, numerous times) – such claims are unreasonable.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  365. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @ANZ

    Yes of course they can recover. They don’t cycle between recovery and unconsciousness.

    We have gone over this.

    Yes, it’s possible

    Yes I have seen it but it is rare and there is almost always evidence even on autopsy. Pathologists are well aware of the issue believe it or not.

    No there is no evidence that happened.

    Yes you are welcome to grasp at straws

    Let’s agree to disagree on this one

  366. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Curmudgeon

    “I can’t breathe”is not a typical sign of opiate overdose. Perhaps he was short of breath from resisting. Perhaps he was the boy who cried wolf. Perhaps it was something else. I have seen it all. We will never know. Doesn’t change the rest of it. I addressed this in my response to Ron

  367. turtle says:
    @The Scalpel

    “ We as police take no responsibility for your medical problems or current state of health. If we use unnecessary force and you are not in good health and die as a result, we take no responsibility for this outcome. We didn’t really intend for that to happen.”

    Sooo…, in your opinion, what is the “level of care” which to which the police should be held?
    Must the police ass-u-me that every citizen with whom they interact has (some complex, but unspecified) constellation of medical conditions which render him (it is nearly always “him”) at severe risk of dying from “standard police procedures” (rolling my eyes, here) which are “adjudged” (rolling eyes again) by police supervisors to pose “minimal risk” to “healthy individuals”?
    Just asking…not implying this question has any particular relevance to the specific case at hand, although it might.

    Criticizing the “standard police procedures” appears to me to be a slightly different question, and one which may very well be warranted, to put it mildly.

    MDs, such as yourself, get paid whether they succeed or fail, AFAIK.
    For police, to quote Yoda, “there is no try.
    Either you arrest the reputed “bad guy,” who may be trying to kill you, or you do not.
    And no, I am emphatically NOT excusing the many cases of blatant murder by police which have gone unpunished.

    The times, they need to be a changin’.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  368. The Scalpel: “I don’t have any data on the neck restraint fatality rate either, but I do know that if you put weight on a person’s chest and neck long enough, those muscles will fatigue, CO2 levels will rise in the blood stream leading to CO2 narcosis, unconsciousness and death. The amount of weight and the amount of time required varies depending on the individual.”

    Yes, this is key. Chauvin’s knee was putting pressure on Floyd’s carotid arteries, with pressure on the arteries on the other side from the pavement. His neck muscles gradually fatigued, thus increasing the pressure as he went unconscious. Chauvin, in what in my opinion was an intentional effort inflict brain damage, did not remove his knee for several minutes afterward. Cops are sadistic, cowardly pieces of shit who are well aware of this effect, do this all the time, and joke about it among themselves. “Ha! ha! Really fried that guy’s brain!” This sort of thing would be very difficult to prove in court, even if the typical recipient of such treatment wanted to try, assuming both that he had the resources and that there was enough left of his brain to allow him to do so. Did his IQ, which is now 60, used to be 85? Who’s to say? Chauvin just overestimated the amount of time he could get away with leaving his chokehold on.

    The Scalpel: “Are we saying here that those we have hired with our tax dollars to protect and serve us have some sort of special dispensation to negligently kill us? Sadly, I think many Americans are saying just that! ”

    People will never generally admit to this, but nevertheless it’s true. Part of the unofficial job description of police has always been to dispose of those who are, from society’s point of view, undesirable people — the homeless, the “mentally ill”, the drug addicts, the criminals. That’s one reason why the job attracts the sadistic scumbags it does. The jails and the prisons are like a huge garbage can into which vast numbers of people for which society has no use are dumped. But sometimes the short route is taken and they’re just flagrantly murdered. That’s riskier, but usually saves society a lot of time and money. However, as the celebrations of the beatification of St. Floyd the Innocent (aka riots) are showing, it can backfire.

    • Agree: acementhead
    • Thanks: The Scalpel
    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  369. Truth says:
    @Exador

    I think Floyd is the only man in history who has grown 4 inches since he died.

  370. turtle says:
    @The Scalpel

    Perhaps they were trained to approach their fellow citizens as if they were enemy troops

    Now you may be getting somewhere.
    Language means something. For some time, I have attempted to deplore the usage, by civilian law enforcement, of the term “civilian” to refer to “the rest of us.”

    To me, the antonym of “civilian” is “military.” Thus, if the police refer to citizens as “civilians,” it implies they regard themselves AS MILITARY. The name Daryl Gates unfortunately comes to mind.

    A military force patrolling a country where no military operations are underway is, de facto, an occupying army, correct?

    I am not suggesting that all police officers behave this way. Quite the contrary.*
    I am suggesting that we need to eradicate that mindset, wherever it does exist.

    *Our local county sheriff (Riverside County, CA) is a splendid example.
    Sheriff Bianco stated quite vehemently that he would *NOT* implement a “police state” at the behest of the county health doctor (who just happens to have last name Kaiser).
    Thanks, sheriff, for “just saying no” to der Kaiser.

  371. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @turtle

    Must the police ass-u-me that every citizen with whom they interact has (some complex, but unspecified) constellation of medical conditions which render him (it is nearly always “him”) at severe risk of dying from “standard police procedures” (rolling my eyes, here) which are “adjudged” (rolling eyes again) by police supervisors to pose “minimal risk” to “healthy individuals”?
    Just asking…not implying this question has any particular relevance to the specific case at hand, although it might.

    I think it is enough for police to not use unnecessary force. I realize that is like trying to define porn. Its an I know it when I see it sort of thing. I do know from personal experience that it is possible to control unarmed people without resorting to assaulting them, or putting them in stress positions or kneeling on their neck, etc. Police do it all the time and they frequently bring them to the ER where they do it there too. When necessary, we do it with just security guards and nurses. It just takes patience, some verbal skills, and different methods.

    In defense of the police, they are often not trained this way, and many in our society glorify them for the unnecessary use of force which only encourages it more. That has to change or what is a riot today will be civil war tomorrow.

    • Agree: turtle, Biff
  372. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Ron Unz

    There was also a big NYT story this morning about Floyd’s background, which naturally under-emphasized his long and violent criminal history.

    * * *

    Well, I watched the detailed NYT video account again, and it emphasized that Floyd was in obvious “distress” even just after he exited his car. Since he apparently had an extremely high, supposedly lethal level of Fentanyl in his blood,….

    * * *

    Apparently, the knee-neck hold had been a standard practice in Minneapolis for years, and I think I saw somewhere that it’s used thousands of times each year in the US.

    * * *

    I also heard…

    Mr. Unz: Your Floyd-case reactions reek of bigotry. To prove to yourself — to your bigotry — that Floyd deserved to be murdered or that the cops did no wrong by violating the criminal law, the federal constitution, and police-conduct-rules-and-standards, you use the specious device — “pilpul” — that Gilad Atzmon sought to lambast in his Jew-hate article “Pilpul for Biginners,” https://www.unz.com/gatzmon/pilpul-for-beginners/#comment-3911804

    You employed the same “pilpul” in your article Race and Crime in America, which is rife with risibly invalid statistical arguments and specious assumptions struggling to premise illogical arguments seeking to show that Blacks’ genetic structure makes them violent criminals. See myu comments posted under your article”Race and Crime in America, https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/ AND cf. my comment of June 5, 2020 at 12:41 am GMT (comment # 14) posted under Paul Craig Roberts’s article “All Races Suffer from Police Violence,” https://www.unz.com/proberts/all-races-suffer-from-police-violence/#comment-3949098

    [MORE]

    “I also heard…,” you say, Mr. Unz. Whenever anyone says something (albeit unproven or bullshit) that you think may help you build a case that Floyd was the culprit, you knit the statement into the whole cloth of phony “facts” that constitute your “case.” [Cf. my comment of June 9, 2020 at 3:16 am GMT (comment # 300, this thread).]

    There was also a big NYT story this morning about Floyd’s background, which naturally under-emphasized his long and violent criminal history.

    Floyd’s background cannot justify (legally or morally) or excuse (legally or morally) the cops’ choking Floyd and pressuring his chest harshly beyond the point of Floyd’s being clearly subdued and then beyond the point of Floyd’s pleading that he could not breathe. The cops’ conduct was clearly criminal homicide. See my comment of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (comment # 282, this thread).

    Floyd’s actual criminal-conviction record (not a rumored “background”) consisted of ONE felony conviction for armed robbery. According to one source, Floyd’s putative “record” included also ALLEGEDLY pointing a gun at a pregnant woman and a cocaine-possession charge based on his ALLEGEDLY having a “white baggie.”

    See, e.g., https://thecourierdaily.com/george-floyd-criminal-past-record-arrest/20177/

    Or see this:

    • George Floyd moved to Minneapolis in 2014 for a fresh start after being released from prison inHouston, Texas following an arrest for aggravated robbery
    • Floyd had turned his life around but died on Monday after a white officer knelt on his neck while arresting him for allegedly paying with a fake $20 bill
    • None of the officers could have been aware of Floyd’s more than a decade-old criminal history at the time of the arrest
    • The 46-year-old had left behind his past in Houston after being released from prison stemming from a 2007 robbery
    • He plead guilty to entering a woman’s home, pointing a gun at her stomach and searching the home for drugs and money, according to court records
    • Floyd was sentenced to 10 months in jail for having less than one gram of cocaine in a December 2005 arrest
    • He had previously been sentenced to eight months for the same offense, stemming from an October 2002 arrest
    • Floyd was arrested in 2002 for criminal trespassing and served 30 days in jail
    • He had another stint for a theft in August 1998

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8366533/George-Floyd-moved-Minneapolis-start-new-life-released-prison-Texas.html

    Another source states:

    Floyd stood out on the football field and excelled at basketball, playing the latter sport when he went to college.

    * * *

    He dropped out of college and came back to Houston to help out his family.

    In the 1990s, he threw himself into Houston’s hip-hop circuit under the name of “Big Floyd,” where he enjoyed some success.

    But he could not escape the violence of Houston’s underground scene, and was arrested several times for thefts and drug dealing. Local media said he was jailed in the early 2000s for armed burglary, serving four years.

    After prison, he turned to religion and fell in with the pastor of a church in the Third Ward, using his notoriety and his love of basketball star Lebron James to draw in young men to the ministry, where he taught them religion and coached them in basketball.

    “He was powerful, he had a way with words,” said Philonese.

    Floyd moved to Minneapolis in 2014 for a “change of scenery” and to look for more stable employment to help support the mother of his newborn daughter Gianna.

    He worked as a truck driver for the Salvation Army and then as a bouncer at a bar, a job he lost when the city’s restaurants shut down because of the pandemic.

    “I got my shortcomings and my flaws, and I ain’t better than nobody else,” Floyd wrote on Instagram in 2017.

    “But, man, the shootings that’s going on, man, I don’t care what religion you’re from, man, or where you’re at, man. I love you, and God love you, man. Put them guns down, man.”

    https://www.thestar.com.my/news/world/2020/06/09/george-floyd-gentle-giant-with-a-criminal-record-who-found-redemption-in-religion

    I do not pretend to KNOW any pertinent TRUE details of any part(s) of Floyd’s history. Such history is legally (and morally) irrelevant. See my comment of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (comment # 282, this thread) and cf. herein below. And, even if such history COULD be “morally” relevant, it cannot supply rational empathy, even sympathy, for the cops, since (per most, if not all, sources) Floyd’s “violent” criminality ceased about 10 years before the cops killed Floyd.

    …Floyd’s background, which naturally under-emphasized his long and violent criminal history.

    His “criminal history” was not long, Its proved violence occurred in just one event, a single armed robbery — about 10 years before the cops killed him. https://www.thestar.com.my/news/world/2020/06/09/george-floyd-gentle-giant-with-a-criminal-record-who-found-redemption-in-religion

    Your terms “WHICH NATURALLY UNDER-EMPHASIZED his long and violent criminal history [my emphasis], shows your bias — your near-reflex inclination of assuming that if a source’s statement does not comport with your bigotry, you will either dismiss it or insist that it downplays Black violence or other Black “genetic flaws” because the source is “liberal” or suffers some other political or psychological failing that enables the “criminal Black race” to evade suffering what it deserves.

    Apparently, the knee-neck hold had been a standard practice in Minneapolis for years, and I think I saw somewhere that it’s used thousands of times each year in the US.

    Your term “Apparently” seeks to substitute for “actually, as proven.” You have no proof.

    Again you try to put a fact-free argument with your language “I think I saw somewhere that it’s used thousands of times each year in the US.” You think you saw “SOMEWHERE”? Exactly WHERE? Impressive, though: “THOUSANDS of times.” Why not “millions of times”? Or “billions”? You missed your chance. Oh, but what of those jurisdictions (like New York) that have outlawed cops’ using choke-holds — a fact we learned in the Eric Garner case. See. e.g., https://www.cbsnews.com/news/eric-garner-trial-nypd-administrative-judge-recommends-firing-daniel-pantaleo-today-2019-08-02/

    And WHY, Mr. Unz, do you disregard the recorded unlawful conduct of at least three of the cops who killed Floyd?

    Thomas Lane, 37, was convicted for criminal charges and traffic violations seven times before becoming a Minneapolis police officer. See, e.g., https://www.insider.com/fired-minneapolis-police-officer-thomas-lane-had-criminal-record-2020-6
    AND https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8394629/One-officers-charged-George-Floyds-killing-hired-despite-having-criminal-record.html

    Derek Chauvin — the choke-hold applying cop — had been with the Minneapolis police since 2001. During his career, he was the subject of over a dozen police conduct complaints. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/minneapolis-police-officer-center-george-floyd-s-death-had-history-n1215691

    The Star Tribune states:

    Chauvin’s 19-year career with the Minneapolis Police Department, where he was involved with several police shootings, includes both commendations and more than 15 conduct complaints. Almost all the complaints were closed without discipline, records show, suggesting the allegations weren’t sustained. The nature of the complaints wasn’t made public. The file includes a 2008 letter of reprimand Chauvin received for the two violations involving “discretion” and a squad car camera. “This case will remain a B violation and can be used as progressive discipline for three years,” the letter notes.

    The letter doesn’t give any details of the incident. However, there is a complaint in the file from August 2007 from a woman who accused Chauvin and another officer of pulling her from her car, frisking her and putting her in the squad car for going 10 mph over the speed limit. “Further investigation showed (redacted) did not have the audio on and the squad MVR tape had been turned off during course of stop.”

    * * *

    [Tou Thao, 34, has a record that includes] six unspecified police conduct complaints. Five were closed without discipline, but one was open at the time of his firing. Thao’s police training records were not included in the personnel records released.

    Thao and another officer were the subjects of a 2017 police brutality lawsuit. Lamar Ferguson alleged that in 2014 the two officers told him they were serving a warrant for his arrest, then beat him, breaking his teeth, while he was handcuffed. The city of Minneapolis paid $25,000 to settle the civil rights case.

    https://www.startribune.com/personnel-records-shed-light-on-four-minneapolis-police-officers-charged-in-george-floyd-death/571019902/

    Those cops’ records bear violence and criminality indications at least strong as any aspects of Floyd’s record. And, since no argument is needed to support the proposition that near-routinely police departments, fellow cops, municipal officials, and prosecutors bend rules and fudge or withhold evidence to protect accused cops [FBI and Police Corruption Investigation evidence is near-astronomical and quite widely known], one may, reasonably, suppose that official corruption is the reason why Lane, Chauvin, and Thao avoided legal punishment, cop-job loss, or cop-job hiring-refusal.

    Ah, but U.S. jurisdictions have these rules of evidence [the premises of which are moral much as pragmatic]:

    Rule 403
    The court may exclude relevant evidence if its probative value is substantially outweighed by a danger of one or more of the following: unfair prejudice, confusing the issues, misleading the jury, undue delay, wasting time, or needlessly presenting cumulative evidence.

    Rule 404
    (a) Character Evidence.
    (1) Prohibited Uses. Evidence of a person’s character or character trait is not admissible to prove that on a particular occasion the person acted in accordance with the character or trait.
    * * *
    (b) Crimes, Wrongs, or Other Acts.
    (1) Prohibited Uses. Evidence of a crime, wrong, or other act is not admissible to prove a person’s character in order to show that on a particular occasion the person acted in accordance with the character.
    (2) Permitted Uses; Notice in a Criminal Case. This evidence may be admissible for another purpose, such as proving motive, opportunity, intent, preparation, plan, knowledge, identity, absence of mistake, or lack of accident.

    Rule 609. Impeachment by Evidence of a Criminal Conviction
    (a) In General. The following rules apply to attacking a witness’s character for truthfulness by evidence of a criminal conviction:
    (1) for a crime that, in the convicting jurisdiction, was punishable by death or by imprisonment for more than one year, the evidence:
    (A) must be admitted, subject to Rule 403, in a civil case or in a criminal case in which the witness is not a defendant; and
    (B) must be admitted in a criminal case in which the witness is a defendant, if the probative value of the evidence outweighs its prejudicial effect to that defendant; and
    (2) for any crime regardless of the punishment, the evidence must be admitted if the court can readily determine that establishing the elements of the crime required proving – or the witness’s admitting – a dishonest act or false statement.
    (b) Limit on Using the Evidence After 10 Years. This subdivision (b) applies if more than 10 years have passed since the witness’s conviction or release from confinement for it, whichever is later. Evidence of the conviction is admissible only if:
    (1) its probative value, supported by specific facts and circumstances, substantially outweighs its prejudicial effect; and
    (2) the proponent gives an adverse party reasonable written notice of the intent to use it so that the party has a fair opportunity to contest its use.

    [Excerpted from the Federal Rules of Evidence, https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/fre

    Very similar rules will protect the Floyd-killing cops in their trials of charges that they murdered Floyd or that their killing him was manslaughter. Surely justice requires that, in our consideration of Floyd’s part of the affray that led to his death, we accord Floyd, and his family, justice and fairness great as the law will accord Floyd’s killers.

    Well, I watched the detailed NYT video account again, and it emphasized that Floyd was in obvious “distress” even just after he exited his car. Since he apparently had an extremely high, supposedly lethal level of Fentanyl in his blood,….

    The Scalpel has shown quite well enough the illegitimacy of that one of your assertions, Mr. Unz. I shall not elaborate on The Scalpel’s observations, but simply cite, by comment number, The Scalpel’s pertinent comments: # 6, # 21, # 27, # 115, # 121, # 226, # 237, # 273, # 323, # 325, # 339, # 343, # 346, # 369, # 377 [first 2 paragraphs], # 379.

    You are, quite obviously, a very intelligent man. I regret that you corrupt your intelligence with “pilpul” (see above) that you employ in the service of bigotry — not only against Blacks, but also against Jews.

    I concede that many Blacks display criminal tendencies and that many Jews have committed financial and other economic crimes and that Zionism and classical Judaism are evil. But Jewish and Black bad behavior is learned, not inherited. [No one has PROVED the contrary.]

    But very many Jews have contributed immense good to society — to social decency and Benthamian utility. Blacks have done so, too (albeit not much as Jews). And, relative to the number of U.S. Blacks, TRULY PROVEN, ACTUAL Black crimes are not appreciably more numerous than truly proven actual crimes committed by non-Blacks. Cf. my comments referenced above in this comment’s paragraph that begins: “You employed the same “pilpul” in your article Race and Crime in America….”

    And do not disregard the so-called “non-violent” crimes, “white collar” crimes, war crimes, treaty-violation crimes, constitution-violations, and international law crimes — and the flagrancy and immense harms of such crimes — committed by Whites.

    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
    , @Rogue
  373. Rurik says:
    @Curmudgeon

    If George Floyd had been White

    then yes, it would have been a nothing burger

    one more white guy dead.. “yea, great!”

    Of course there’s a raging double standard and hypocrisy enough to choke a nation, but as someone else mentioned, look at Palestine.

    the way the news is spun, is always based on the eternal question, ‘is it good for Jews?’

    And making every case of murder-by-cop, into a hysterical lie that America is an endemically racist nation that murders innocent blacks wholesale, is just as dishonest as murderous Jews in Israel claiming they’re only ‘defending themselves’.

    But both of these abortions of truth, are both considered ‘good for the Jews’.

    And none of it will ever stop, until it becomes widely known that Jewish supremacists own and control our media (and federal and some state governments and other critical institutions) completely, and that this is what has to stop, if we’re ever going to solve any of these problems, (most of which are simply manufactured by the media)), to serve an agenda.

    Like this one, and the ones before, and the ones to come…

  374. Loup-Bouc says:
    @The Scalpel

    Please see my comment of June 9, 2020 at 11:08 pm GMT (comment # 387).

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  375. @FB

    “victimized time and time again by this kind of sadistic violence”

    Sadism is “the tendency to derive pleasure, especially sexual gratification, from inflicting pain, suffering, or humiliation on others.” since it was Derek Chauvin doling out the violence, I assume you mean he is the sadist.

    What evidence do you have for this? It adds light to the story.

  376. @Loup-Bouc

    Much better, Loup. Quite readable. Disagree with your viewpoint re: black criminality, but well done overall.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  377. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    Apparently, the knee-neck hold had been a standard practice in Minneapolis for years, and I think I saw somewhere that it’s used thousands of times each year in the US. Given the gigantic MSM coverage, wouldn’t we have already heard if it had produced a non-negligible number of fatalities? Maybe Floyd is the first American who ever died from it in the last few years.

    In Minneapolis alone in 44 cases of a total of about 200 neck restraint incidents, suspects have lost consciousness

    NBC News (go to 30 second mark)

    Wow! that’s even more than I anticipated. Greater than 20% near fatality rate. Shameful that this was still policy. Heads should roll. Disgusting.

    • Replies: @Iris
    , @Ron Unz
  378. Ryan2 says:
    @Dieter Kief

    Neither do cops. Health care workers face a lot of violence. Maybe equal to cops? I don’t know. There are all kinds of fields of health care work.
    I know a nurse who was knocked out twice over their career.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  379. ANZ says:
    @JimDandy

    I think there was fault on both sides. Man didn’t deserve to die like that, even if he was a drain on society. I don’t think the cop was trying to murder him either by using a department sanctioned restraint technique applied for too long. Would he have died without the neck hold? We will never know. Tough situation all around.

    • Agree: Rogue
  380. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Dieter Kief

    I think that what you are trying to say is that it is OK for police to kill people with medical and substance abuse problems because it is easier to do so, and because you don’t like them.

    Is that what you are trying to say?

    Where have I heard that before? (I’m sorry for that wisecrack, but you made it way too easy for me)

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  381. ANZ says:
    @Oldtradesman

    It’s very dangerous when the media and the judiciary are run by foreign ethnics who have a vested interest in subverting the traditional white majority. It’s the result of a slow motion coup d’etat.

    That Breonna Taylor fiasco is a mess. No knock warrants are a recipe for disaster but it’s not a racist tool. That terrible tactic gets used on whites all the time too. Just like knee to neck holds as well. This isn’t about race, but that’s the media’s narrative so the puzzle piece will be relentlessly hammered into place even though it is not a genuine fit.

  382. @Dr. Robert Morgan

    Good post, Doc.

    I know very little about the mechanics involved, but would pinching the carotid artery interrupt the supply of oxygen to the brain? If so, then to my thinking, that is a form of asphyxiation.

  383. orionyx says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    It worked famously for Napoleon. All it took for him to clear the streets of rioters was ‘a whiff of grapeshot’. I’m sure we can afford that.

  384. Biff says:

    Once again, most if not all comments are about the George Floyd’s second degree murder(or he died of natural causes; however you want to view it), and almost none about the far more tragic murder of Breonna Taylor. The media reflects this too..
    Why, why, why?

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
    , @The Scalpel
  385. Loup-Bouc says:

    This comment addresses claims that cops kill Whites more thatn they kill Blacks. Such claims address the wrong question.

    The matter is one of relative frequency, not absolute numbers. Since the Black population (18%) is much smaller than the White population (72% “identifying as” White), White/police contacts must be markedly greater than Black/police contacts, even if police more likely detain Blacks relatively more frequently than they detain Whites. And that matter must be refined to account frequencies (Black versus White) of police contacts ending with the death of the contacted civilian.

    …the three largest states – California, Texas and Florida – have the highest total number of killings of Black people by police officers. Once these figures are adjusted for the population size and demographics, in nearly every state, African Americans face a significantly higher risk of being killed by police officers than white Americans.

    In Utah, the African Americans comprise just 1.06 percent of the population but they accounted for 10 percent of police killings over the past seven years – a disproportional rate of 9.21 times. In Minnesota, Black Americans are nearly four times as likely to be killed by law enforcement, with Black victims comprising 20 percent of those killed, despite comprising only 5 percent of the overall population.

    https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/interactive/2020/05/mapping-police-killings-black-americans-200531105741757.html

    I do not suggest that the above-quoted assertions state absolutely sure, fully complete truth. I lack sufficient clearly valid, clearly reliable data. But numerous other sources agree with the above-quoted assertions, or show more strongly that a Black suffers a killed-by-police chance MUCH greater than the chance that a White suffers.
    See, e.g.,
    (1) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6080222/
    (2) https://theconversation.com/a-new-look-at-racial-disparities-in-police-use-of-deadly-force-98681
    (3) https://www.statista.com/chart/21872/map-of-police-violence-against-black-americans/

    The immediately preceding paragraph’s second source considers, among else, the relation of (a) whether a police-contact associates with an alleged incident of violent crime versus (b) whether the police-contact does not associate with an alleged, or proved, incident of violent crime. I expect that the bigots here will try to blame police-caused Black deaths on the bigots’ belief that actually Blacks commit violent crimes relatively much more — even absolutely more — than Whites do. But, that belief cannot find proof in any valid, reliable statistical analysis or valid, reliable, quantifiable data.

    Consistently, the bigots here confuse — invalidly (and, I expect, oft-intentionally) — conviction-rates or arrest-numbers (or, worse, “estimated” crime-rates) with true numbers of actual crimes. See my comment of June 8, 2020 at 1:06 am GMT (comment # 8, this thread) AND my other comments that the same comment # 8 references (my comments posted under Paul Craig Roberts’s article All Races Suffer from Police Violence, https://www.unz.com/proberts/all-races-suffer-from-police-violence/#comment-3942795 AND under Ron Unz’s article, Race and Crime in America, https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/ .

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
  386. JimDandy says:
    @ANZ

    I agree, in essence, but… a violent, drug-crazed ex con–the kind of guy who broke into a woman’s home and jabbed a gun into her fetus (and who knows what other violent crimes he didn’t get caught for?)–acted exactly like the scumbag he was and ended up dead? THAT is the justification for all this murderous anarchy? I’m sorry the guy is dead, but the priorities of those devoting their lives to honoring the memory of St, Floyd are way beyond absurd.

  387. Big Tim says:
    @Jamie_NYC

    How do you know how much Fentanyl, or anything else, was in his body? Were the figures published?

  388. Big Tim says:
    @lloyd

    No, he did not sit on his head, or any other part of him.

    • Replies: @lloyd
  389. Big Tim says:
    @The Scalpel

    If the videos are a true indication and he was not acting ( and he was who they say he was), he was not doing fine or “OK”, he was totally messed up and acting irrationally, uncoordinated. Not forcefully resisting but crazy.

  390. MarkinLA says:
    @Biff

    Because people are killed all the time by stupid no-knock raids. Her case isn’t special and the raids have nothing to do with race. Should no-knock raids be outlawed? Yes, but there is nothing special about it, Fred is just trying to make it so.

  391. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Oldtradesman

    Thank you, daddy. May I have some ice cream now?

    You are presumptuous and arrogant.

    I confess that I possess and manifest hubris — which is NOT arrogance (one’s assuming power or ability one does not possess). Hubris is conduct like Achilles’s disobeying Zeus’s law by dragging Hector’s body rabidly before the walls of Troy: it is an act of scorning “authority.”

    Do you delude yourself to believe that your approval — or anyone’s — matters to me?

    And writing quality or communication-elegance? I admit that I commit typing/editing errors, because I never learned how to type (since, for nearly seven decades, I depended on a secretary) and my eyesight is to too poor to enable me to proofread, reliably, a text set on a computer screen. But otherwise? Cf. my comment of June 8, 2020 at 2:41 pm GMT (comment # 66) & my comment of June 7, 2020 at 2:44 am GMT (comment # 37) posted under Gilad Atzmon’s article “Liberating the American People,” Unz Review (5 June 2020), https://www.unz.com/gatzmon/liberating-the-american-people/#comment-3951941 .

    YOU have not shown your writing, or thinking, even competent.

    Tout sonne mieux en la plus belle langue, la langue française. Donc, je termine ce commentaire ainsi: Taisez-vous, Monsieur le Crétin.

    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  392. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Biff

    I believe it is because there is no debating the injustice of Breonna Taylor’s murder. Ironically, that works against instigating any change, because without debate it is easily swept under the rug. Perhaps it is some kind of karmic justice that the George Floyd incident occurred at about the same time. Otherwise we might never have heard of Breonna Taylor and the issue of no knock raids would not be being debated at all.

    This may sound radical, but I believe that the legitimacy of the theory of self-defense makes it just as legal to kill a policeman in a no knock raid as it is to kill an armed robber or murderer during a forced entry. The police assume that risk when they instantly put the suspect in what the suspect perceives to be a disorienting life or death situation.

    • Agree: vot tak
    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
    , @turtle
  393. MarkinLA says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    But, that belief cannot find proof in any valid, reliable statistical analysis or valid, reliable, quantifiable data.

    I think it does in the murder statistics. This is from links in the other article:

    Additionally, these are the breakdowns for black arrest in 2018 according to the FBI Uniform Crime Report:
    Overall arrests = 27.4%
    Violent crime arrests = 37.4%
    Weapons arrests = 43.3%
    Robbery arrests = 54.2%
    Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter arrests = 53.3% (8 times higher than non-Hispanic whites)

    Weapons, violent crime, robbery and murder. I bet when you go after these people the chance of something spinning out of control is a lot higher than arresting somebody for shoplifting.

    https://medium.com/@agent.orange.chicago/unarmed-killings-of-african-americans-numbered-under-10-last-year-a-400-reduction-since-2015-e54f3eeb67ae

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  394. vot tak says:
    @Biff

    The bombercommand zionazi troll is gay? Who’d of thunk… 😀

  395. Loup-Bouc says:
    @MarkinLA

    You did not READ my comment to which think you have replied, or my other comments to which that comment referred.

    Your Uniform Crime Report statistics are not valid or reliable bases of the conclusion you seek, illogically, to to assert. I showed so in quite enough of my comments. See my comment of June 8, 2020 at 1:06 am GMT (comment # 8, this thread) AND my other comments that the same comment # 8 references (my comments posted under Paul Craig Roberts’s article All Races Suffer from Police Violence, https://www.unz.com/proberts/all-races-suffer-from-police-violence/#comment-3942795 AND under Ron Unz’s article, Race and Crime in America, https://www.unz.com/runz/race-and-crime-in-america/ .

    You deserve the closing I put to Oldtradesman: Taisez-vous, Monsieur le Crétin.

    • Replies: @MarkinLA
  396. Iris says:
    @The Scalpel

    Greater than 20% near fatality rate. Shameful that this was still policy.

    On Monday, the French Home Minister announced that national police will not be allowed to use neck restraint anymore.

    ” The controversial arresting method of neck-restraint, also known as “strangulation”, will be abandoned. It will no longer be taught in police and gendarmerie schools. It is a method that was dangerous.” said Minister Francois Castaner.

    This decision is one of the conclusions of the fact-finding mission carried out after the death of Cédric Chouviat, a (White) delivery man who died in Paris in January 2020 after being arrested by the police.
    https://www.francetvinfo.fr/economie/emploi/metiers/armee-et-securite/methode-d-etranglement-sanctions-formation-ce-qu-il-faut-retenir-des-annonces-de-christophe-castaner-contre-les-violences-policieres_4000827.html

    42-year old Chouviat was at work driving his scooter when he was pulled down by the police. He tried to film his interaction with them. As a consequence, they brutally dragged him to the ground and applied neck restraint; he was filmed by passer-by apparently struggling to breathe. He died a few hours later with a fractured larynx.

    Chouviat’s lawyers recall that this technique was involved in three cases: in the death of Cédric Chouviat who “was asphyxiated” and whose “larynx was fractured” in January 2020, in the 2016 death of Adama Traoré, according to a new examination carried out at the request of the family of the deceased and revealed on 2 June, and in the death of Mohamed Gabsi according to an autopsy report pointing to dangerous police practices revealed on 5 June. All these were retrospective examinations, after the victims families’ complaints were initially dismissed.

    https://www.francetvinfo.fr/faits-divers/police/violences-policieres/mort-de-cedric-chouviat-les-avocats-de-sa-famille-demandent-l-interdiction-du-plaquage-ventral-par-les-forces-de-l-ordre-dans-une-lettre-a-christophe-castaner_4000799.html

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  397. Ron Unz says:
    @ANZ

    I think there was fault on both sides. Man didn’t deserve to die like that, even if he was a drain on society. I don’t think the cop was trying to murder him either by using a department sanctioned restraint technique applied for too long. Would he have died without the neck hold? We will never know. Tough situation all around.

    Yes, that seems a pretty balanced verdict.

    Someone on a Sailer thread claimed that the Minnesota AG is refusing to release the police webcam videos that allegedly show Floyd resisting arrest and roughing-up the two rookie officers who initially were trying to deal with him. A missing video segment has now appeared on YouTube, showing that they spent at least a couple of minutes unsuccessfully trying to force him into the police car, which certainly supports the idea he was resisting arrest.

    If you’re a huge violent criminal, 250 lb and maybe 6’6″, who’s high on drugs and violently resisting arrest, is it so totally unreasonable that a police officer would apply an officially-sanctioned restraint technique to subdue you? And they did call an ambulance for him. A charge of “murder” seems unwarranted under these circumstances.

    Like I’ve said, I haven’t investigated this case and anyway, until all the facts, testimony, and missing video clips come out, I really don’t think that any of us can form a solid opinion.

    But one reason I’m extremely suspicious of the official MSM narrative is that once the facts came out in several of the previous high-profile cases, they turned out to be 100% contrary to the initial narrative. This was especially true in the Trayvon Martin case that launched the whole Black Lives Matter movement, and also true in the Ferguson/Michael Brown case. As I discussed in an article, similar MSM falsehoods and omissions have been common for at least the last half-century:

    https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-the-kkk-and-mass-racial-killings/

    So if the MSM narrative was totally false in so many other cases involving the killings of blacks, I’m pretty suspicious of the Floyd case, especially given the lethal level of Fentanyl he had in his system.

    • Replies: @Biff
    , @Rurik
    , @ANZ
  398. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    In Minneapolis alone in 44 cases of a total of about 200 neck restraint incidents, suspects have lost consciousness

    But surely they would have mentioned any fatalities, so we can assume there were none. Given the massive MSM focus on the controversial neck-restraint technique over the last week, wouldn’t we have probably heard of any fatalities if they had occurred anywhere in America? So it seems increasingly likely that Floyd may be the first and only person to die as a consequence in recent years, even though it’s supposedly been used many thousands of times across the country.

    If there had never been a previous American fatality, can we really blame the police officer for assuming that it was quite safe? Is it reasonable to charge him with murder for using a restraint technique that had never previously killed anyone? Doesn’t it suggest that the extremely high level of deadly drugs in Floyd’s system along with his very recent Covid-19 illness may have been the crucial factors in his death?

    Tasers are regarded as non-lethal weapons. But I’m sure that people with particular medical conditions, perhaps severe heart problems or particular drugs in their system, could die from a tasering. Does that mean that an officer who uses a taser could be charged with murder?

    • Replies: @Rurik
  399. Oldtradesman: “I know very little about the mechanics involved, but would pinching the carotid artery interrupt the supply of oxygen to the brain? ”

    Yes. If it’s pinched shut completely, unconsciousness ensues very rapidly, and if bloodflow isn’t restored relatively quickly, brain damage will occur. In the video, it looks to me like the pressure from the knee restricting blood supply to the brain was a factor, and increasingly so as Floyd’s neck muscles fatigued and he went limp. The way Chauvin kept the pressure on for over two minutes after Floyd went unconscious tells me he was trying to cause brain damage from oxygen deprivation.

  400. Loup-Bouc says:
    @The Scalpel

    This may sound radical, but I believe that the legitimacy of the theory of self-defense makes it just as legal to kill a policeman in a no knock raid as it is to kill an armed robber or murderer during a forced entry. The police assume that risk when they instantly put the suspect in what the suspect perceives to be a disorienting life or death situation.

    Your belief is correct (at least per the law of many or most jurisdictions), except this: “The police assume that risk….” Asumption of risk is not involved, or necessary.

    “Assumption of risk” is a tort-doctrine defense. It does not, need not, and ought not obtain in criminal law.

  401. turtle says:
    @The Scalpel

    This may sound radical, but I believe that the legitimacy of the theory of self-defense makes it just as legal to kill a policeman in a no knock raid as it is to kill an armed robber or murderer during a forced entry. The police assume that risk when they instantly put the suspect in what the suspect perceives to be a disorienting life or death situation.

    Sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
    If your burglar alarm goes off, accompanied by the unmistakable sounds of forced entry, at 3 AM, what are you supposed to assume, other than your life, and that of anyone close to you, is in imminent danger? IMO, the right of self defense is absolute, and I believe the law pays at least lip service to that notion.

    BTDT. In my own case, it was criminals, not cops, nor “criminal cops,” no weapons were discharged, and I am here to talk about it, years later. Had it been local PD, conducting an “Oops, wrong address” forcible entry, I expect my life might have ended that night. And I also expect that, had that happened, the cops would have walked, because, y’know…

    My best advice is to secure your outer perimeter as best you might.
    Make it GODDAMNED DIFFICULT for anyone, cops included, to breach multiple layers of physical security. (Tiger traps, punji sticks, etc., are not allowed – obey the law, for your own safety.)

  402. The Scalpel says: • Website

    But surely they would have mentioned any fatalities, so we can assume there were none.

    Do you seriously believe that? Didn’t the initial coroner IN THIS CASE attempt to make the claim that the neck restraint had nothing to do with Floyd’s death? I guess if you believe that, you would believe that 44 people were choked to the point of unconsciousness (very near death) but none died, and that’s just in Minneapolis!

    I’m pretty sure it was not the original coroner’s first rodeo. Do you think it at all possible that coroners routinely shade their findings to absolve the police of responsibility? Do you think that police departments might want to bury that type of outcome characterizing it as as a “heart attack,” or “overdose” just like you are doing now? Do you think that maybe deaths resulting from these “neck restraints” are hushed up and not publicized if possible?

    Perhaps these Minneapolis police are highly skilled experts in choking someone to near death without killing them. I am aware of your high IQ. Do you know how ridiculous and improbable your evaluation of that statistic sounds?

    I’m pretty suspicious of the Floyd case, especially given the lethal level of Fentanyl he had in his system.

    Ugggggg. I took a lot of time and effort explaining the concept of tolerance to you and how users can develop huge tolerance and what the idea of a minimum lethal dose is and why it does not apply to habitual users, and the timing and mechanism of action of Fentanyl and it seems you did not read any of it. It makes me want to bang my head against a wall. I was trying to be of assistance, but if you don’t believe me, you can look it up – anywhere!

    I have nothing against police in general. Through my work in ED’s, I have many friends who are police. I do have something against obvious police brutality and the use of unnecessary force.

    • Replies: @FB
    , @Ron Unz
  403. DonR says:
    @Rich

    The autopsy report is on line

    The fentanyl concentration measured was 11 nanograms per milliliter.

    That is a very small amount.

    Yes, the idiot was indeed taking recreational drugs. But it is questionable whether they were actually affecting him very at the time he was arrested.

    Knowledgeable people I know tell me their effect would have been to make him more docile rather than aggressive as the cops would like you to believe.

    • Replies: @Rich
  404. Anon[229] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon8383892

    It’s negro fatigue.

  405. Biff says:
    @Ron Unz

    high on drugs and violently resisting arrest

    given the lethal level of Fentanyl he had in his system.

    Confusing and mutually exclusive. Fentanyl doesn’t make one violent, on the contrary, it puts you to sleep.

  406. @The Scalpel

    What I say is, that you take a risk if you are drugged up to the nth degree and resist police officers doing their work.

    You do not criticize my assumptions as to how high the risk might have been, George Floyd took by acting as he did.

    You left out quite a few the risks which came along with George Floyd’s life-style and drug habits and biology (sickle-cell-anemia). That weakens your argument from a medical point of view.

    and it puts in a new light my main point: To answer the question of what caused the death of George Floyd it is not enough to describe what happened when he died. In doing so, your argument lacks logic.

    It might turn out the neck restraint is too dangerous. I wrote that in my comment No. 80 above and asked you about a better alternative – you did not bother to answer. Instead, you now attack me personally via ad hominems. In one respect I agree though: I don’t much like George Floyd. But of course, I would never eve say, that therefore he would not have to be treated in lawful ways by police trying to arrest him.

    The parallel here would rather be that of doctors who resisted Semmelweis’ advice and thus indeed killed women giving birth. None of them had been put in jail. And none of them has been called a racist either.

    • Replies: @FB
  407. @Loup-Bouc

    You’re quite welcome, Loup-Bouc! Yes, you may have ice cream and chocolate. 🙂

    You are presumptuous and arrogant.

    Oh my! The pot calling the kettle black. Will it never cease?

    I confess that I possess and manifest hubris — which is NOT arrogance (one’s assuming power or ability one does not possess). Hubris is conduct like Achilles’s disobeying Zeus’s law by dragging Hector’s body rabidly before the walls of Troy: it is an act of scorning “authority.”

    You needn’t define hubris for me, but thank you all the same.

    You are arrogant, however, and examples abound at Unz, MoA, and elsewhere.

    If your intent is to intimidate lesser mortals, then I’m very sorry. Some Anglais are not intimidated by the “Wedgewood China and fine, leather upholstery” crowd.

    And writing quality or communication-elegance? I admit that I commit typing/editing errors, because I never learned how to type (since, for nearly seven decades, I depended on a secretary) and my eyesight is to too poor to enable me to proofread, reliably, a text set on a computer screen. But otherwise? Cf. my comment of June 8, 2020 at 2:41 pm GMT (comment # 66) & my comment of June 7, 2020 at 2:44 am GMT (comment # 37) posted under Gilad Atzmon’s article “Liberating the American People,” Unz Review (5 June 2020), https://www.unz.com/gatzmon/liberating-the-american-people/#comment-3951941 .

    So poor eyesight was the reason for your incompre.. er, communication difficulties? And I take it your secretary is no longer with you? Really! We should all have personal secretaries to handle those mundane communications to business associates and adversaries at the Unz Review. I’m sure you miss him/her, as an equal and not a servant?

    I’m glad you’ve learned to link previous comments. It was rather tedious laboring through reams of profundity to find the gem-iest statement of them all, you know. Time, signal-to-noise ratio, a lesser intellect, and all that.

    YOU have not shown your writing, or thinking, even competent.

    You’re beginning to sound like me. I’ve corrupted you! So very sorry. I wouldn’t want to be the cause of any muddled thinking or incompetence on your part. All I want for you is to follow the KISS philosophy in written communications. You did very well in #387, much better than previously, and on the heels of advice I proffered in another thread! So keep up the good work!

    No backsliding, ya hear?

    Tout sonne mieux en la plus belle langue, la langue française. Donc, je termine ce commentaire ainsi:

    Very impressive and in French, a language of culture and sophistication, and so much more pleasing to the ear than our guttural Anglais! Wish I had enrolled in high school. We can’t all be perfect.

    Taisez-vous, Monsieur le Crétin.

    Now that wasn’t very nice, Mr. Loo, but thank you for your time. Say hello to your secretary for me.

  408. @Ryan2

    Health care workers face a lot of violence. Maybe equal to cops?

    No, not at all. My guess for the ratio would be that cops are shot at maybe 100 times more than health care workers while on duty.

    https://www.osha.gov/Publications/OSHA3826.pdf

    In 2013, the broad “healthcare and social assistance”
    sector had 7.8 cases of serious workplace violence per 10,000 full-time employees

    • Replies: @Ryan2
  409. FB says: • Website
    @The Scalpel

    Thanks Doc…

    I was wondering when your patience with this nonsense would run out…

    I tip my hat to you for the way you have handled yourself here…You’ve been practically mobbed by angry, hallucinating mouthfoamers who insist on twisting visible reality…

    I am reminded of the witch’s cackling at the death of Gaddafi…this is what lack of character looks like…

    But I hope all the decent people here take note that outside of this little hole in the ground, nobody is going to agree with the ugliness and stupidity being voiced here…

    Do you know anyone in your day to day life to whom you could say what Ron Unz is saying here…?

    I certainly don’t, and boy am I ever glad for that…

    Perhaps Mr Unz’s social circle is different…maybe they would not think him a ‘Hillary’ for being so, ahem, ‘forthright’…I don’t know…?

    Glad I don’t have to find out…

    • Agree: acementhead
    • Thanks: The Scalpel
    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  410. lloyd says: • Website
    @Big Tim

    Mine was the sort of Kiwi response to Americans’ obsessions with the legal niceties of a low life death. He was not murdered but died from Covid-19. Someone else in Unz Review pointed out he should be listed in the mortality list of the virus.

  411. Rogue says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    ACTUAL Black crimes are not appreciably more numerous than truly proven actual crimes committed by non-Blacks

    If you are referring to violent crime or street crime such as robbery, rape, assault, homicide etc – and try to deny that Blacks commit these crimes in substantially higher numbers than Whites – then you are just plain talking bollox.

    Whether it’s the USA, UK, Canada, Brazil, France, Sweden or South Africa, Blacks commit substantially higher amounts of these crimes – per capita – than Whites. That would also include interracial crime.

    Obviously, most Blacks don’t commit crime, and there are very many good and upstanding Black people etc etc, but to stick to your ridiculous claim quoted above – if that’s what you’re claiming – is just plain nonsense.

    Simple proof that you can be an academic – but still essentially know nothing.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  412. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    Do you seriously believe that? Didn’t the initial coroner IN THIS CASE attempt to make the claim that the neck restraint had nothing to do with Floyd’s death? I guess if you believe that, you would believe that 44 people were choked to the point of unconsciousness (very near death) but none died, and that’s just in Minneapolis!

    Sure, that’s a reasonable point. But if a week of digging by the MSM haven’t been able to locate a single apparent American case of death by knee-neck hold, I’d think fatalities must be extremely uncommon. For example, I remember that back in (I think) the 1980s, there was quite a lot of MSM controversy in LA regarding some blacks who died from police arm-chokeholds, which caused the LAPD to abandon that restraint technique. But apparently nothing like that had previously come up with knee-neck holds, despite many years of use nationally.

    On the other hand, in support of your position, a quick Google search located this NYT article from May which claimed that the knee-neck hold was listed as a “deadly force technique” in the Minneapolis police handbook:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/29/us/knee-neck-george-floyd-death.html

    I’m certainly suspicious of the NYT on these sorts of matters, but assuming they’re correct, it would strengthen the case for a manslaughter verdict.

  413. BuelahMan says:
    @FB

    Seeing how medical malpractice/mistakes are one of this country’s leading killers (generally protected, as well), I don’t blame anyone for wondering. White coat worship will be the death of us all.

    I’ve known several people who are no longer with us due to medical mistakes. I question every white coat that deals with me.

    Is he correct about Fentanyl? In my experience, the users, especially speedballing, don’t take the stuff and miraculously get straight, as he seems to indicate. Therefore, I question his ability as a doctor. But he is real good at internet commenting.

  414. @Ron Unz

    listed as a “deadly force technique” in the Minneapolis police handbook:

    Ok – how deadly is a never but once deadly force?

  415. Fred,

    Why are many of the comments concerned about what the cops, the victims and others did and/or had on board when they were seriously injured or died? This happens sadly and very frequently in third world countries every day.

    In January 2018, Donald Trump referred to Haiti, El Salvador and African nations as “shit hole countries!” He went on to query as to why America couldn’t import people from Norway, for example.

    What he did not do almost 2 1/2 years ago in his shocking and shameful racist comments was to include the United States of America as the biggest shit hole country in the world. Hopefully, everyone in the world will be put out of their DJT misery in November, if not before!

    Freda

  416. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Rogue

    In comments posted in this thread and in my other-thread comments I referenced in comments I posted in this thread, I supplied the proof you missed because you cannot read what you want not to see.

  417. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    Ok, this took 30 seconds on Google:

    LA Times

    https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-06-05/george-floyd-carotid-neck-hold-police

    The Los Angeles Police Commission severely restricted its use in 1982 after the deaths of a dozen black men and then-LAPD Chief Daryl Gates’ notorious comment that African Americans were dying because the “veins or arteries of blacks do not open up as fast as they do in normal people.”

    The above illustrates both the problem and the pathetic attempts at covering it up. Please don’t tell me that you believe Daryl Gates‘ explanation

    USA Today

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2020/06/02/police-departments-nationwide-ban-use-deadly-neck-restraint/3125464001/

    The NYPD banned chokeholds in 1993 after a number of people died while being apprehended or in police custody.

    Please don’t try to make the case that these are not precisely the same technique. Does it look like the police are being precise when using this? It should go without saying that if you put pressure on someone’s neck long enough, you just might kill them. Any fool knows that.

    CBS News

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-mexico-cop-charged-with-involuntary-manslaughter-after-man-in-custody-dies-in-neck-restraint/

    A police officer from Las Cruces, New Mexico, is being charged with involuntary manslaughter for the death of a man who he had restrained in February and placed in a neck restraint.

    Canadian Broadcasting Corporation

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/george-floyd-knee-neck-1.5600126

    More evidence of widespread cover up.

    A coroner’s report initially deemed Faqiri’s cause of death “unascertained…
    But the case was reopened after an investigation by CBC’s The Fifth Estate, in which an inmate across the hall from Faqiri said he watched in horror as guards repeatedly pepper-sprayed and beat him, one of them allegedly pressing his knee into Faqiri’s neck.

    The above is just the FIRST PAGE of results of a google search “neck restraint death”. There are many more pages of results. It took me 30 seconds to make that search.

    This is so common that there is a Law Firm that specializes in it and lists case after case of fatalities from it.

    https://www.lvcriminaldefense.com/neck-restraint-proves-fatal-yet/

    I could keep going. Try it yourself. I guess this puts paid to your “ If I haven’t heard of it, it must never happen” theory of investigation.

    • Thanks: FB
    • Replies: @Ron Unz
    , @Brás Cubas
  418. Why are white people so afraid of standing up in open defiance of black people?

    Why are so many white people enabling the black people?

    Why are white Americans actively (or passively) seeking our own destruction?

    Who in their right mind is still going to want a career as a police officer after all this?

    • Replies: @Truth
  419. This reminds me of the continuous anti-white racial strife endured as a soldier while serving in the ranks of the United States Army during and after the Viet Nam War, which no one ever dared talk about.

  420. MarkinLA says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    You didn’t show anything other than you are some clown who refuses to see reality. I bet if I really cared I could find another “academic” study that shows that lawyers in Oregon are the dumbest in the country. Obviously, you are just an anecdote but certainly supportive of that study.

    There are worthless studies for everything. The FBI stats are the best we have.

  421. The subjugation of blacks has been basically subtle. The elites are to blame since they
    seem to be very racist. You ever notice that famous blacks who are peaceful and try to benefit their races (and others) seem to die very young. Walter Payton – “sweetness” died of a rare cancer. Kobe Bryant killed in a helicopter ‘accident’; Arthur Ashe who dies of AZT, the poisonous drug prescribed for HIV; OJ was famous but not a particularly good example but was prodded into killing a couple of people (to explain would take too long); MLK who was shot maybe by the FBI or the military, not James Earl Ray who was the patsy; other black leaders took up a low profile afterward; several other sports stars and potential leaders that I can’t remember fit into this category. No black is allowed to excel now except those who profess the established meme; look what happened to the Black Panthers – they originally were for organizing the slums, giving out food, helping provide baby care and other aids and giving black people some political power.
    The establishment was scared as hell of this organization. And after wiping out the Black Panthers, they introduced drugs into the ghettos which totally put the blacks in a war against each other. Pretty clever. If you kill all the leaders and good examples, what can the rest of the people do?

    • Replies: @Truth
  422. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    I’m going to make one more comment because I think I can tell where this discussion is going. This is for all those who are about to tell me that none of those cases I just turned up are relevant because he used an arm instead of a leg, his knee was here instead of there, he was attempting to compress his carotid arteries and not his trachea, he had his fingers crossed, or his thumb in his anus, or one hand in his pants masturbating while he was doing it….

    This is biology, anatomy, physiology, it is not computer programming. Millimeters count. Seconds count. When applying pressure to someone’s neck, a couple millimeters, a centimeter, 10 seconds, can make the difference between sore muscles and death. Does anyone at all believe that the police are capable, either by training or in practical conditions, to adhere to that level of precision and timing? Especially with thrashing around, distractions, miscalculation?

    None of this is necessary. Thousands of police appropriately handle men like this every day without using unnecessary force. Many of them come to the ER and I am eye witness to that, and the police often do the same thing in the ER, and we do the same thing at times without the police – just a couple security guards and nurses. All it takes is some patience, verbal skills, and different methods.

    The fact that this is even a debate is very sad. We have become normalized to violence, sadism, and oppression.

    • Agree: FB
    • Replies: @Biff
  423. FB says: • Website
    @Dieter Kief

    Shaddup already, GOOF…

    Here is the issue in a nutshell…most ordinary folks, black and white and otherwise have been disgusted by the snuff film we have all had to watch of a man being crushed like a bug on the pavement…

    This ugly imagery that has been burned into our memory is an AFFRONT to NORMAL people…it is an affront to our sense of right and wrong…it is an affront to our human dignity…it is an affront to our cherished ideas about what it means to have a decent society and live like human beings…it is an affront on the most basic level…

    This is why there is such a reaction…sensitive people have been put on medication due to the distress of having seen this horrible thing on their screens…millions of others have decided to go into the streets and protest…

    It’s a tiny amount of sociopathic individuals like yourself that go to online hangouts and vent their mental sickness…because you have no sense of right and wrong…because you have long ago trampled your human dignity and now exist as some kind of an empty shell of a human being…because you don’t give a shit about the rest of us, nor our efforts to build a decent society…

    Ordinary folks are getting fed up with your kind…we all realize there is a problem with police violence that has got completely out of hand and many victims of all colors are piling up…

    Ordinary folks want to start making examples of criminals like Chauvin and his helpers…we want to stop having to see these kinds of snuff videos…nobody needs to hear from the mentally sick members of society like yourself that only want more of this kind of sick violence…

    You have NOTHING to contribute, which is why you don’t…your participation in human society is limited to spitting grotesque bile in obscure internet chat rooms…far far away from real life…

  424. Al Lipton says:

    there is only one way to end the recurring riots: Have white cops police whites, and black cops police blacks

    Absolutely! It would work. Maybe. Also, it would take about 5 seconds to denounce the idea as “racist.”

    Imagine that a gentleman of color, let’s name him Pink Floyd, gets stopped by white cops for a traffic violation, then they request their PD to send black cops to deal with Pink Floyd. Pink knows he has advantage until black forces arrive at the scene. What are the odds that Pink Floyd wouldn’t attempt to peace out in the meantime? And what could the white cops do in that situation? Traffic violations would have to be ignored altogether.

    Also, another problem: PDs would have to hire only black and white officers. Shaun King types, or any sort of Asians, Arabs, American Indians, Eskimo, Jew or Gypsy etc, could not qualify to enforce the law.

    • Replies: @Truth
  425. Rich says:
    @DonR

    You’re probably a well meaning guy and are just not aware of the effects of hard drugs on people over 40. I’ll try to explain, if you are really interested you can read more about it. Floyd had both fentanyl and methamphetamine in his system, this is known as a “speedball “. A very dangerous drug combination that often causes heart attacks and respiratory failure in even young, healthy drug users. According to the autopsy, the confessed,convicted, violent felon died of heart failure, this is consistent with the way someone using meth and fentanyl would die. His neck wasn’t broken and he wasn’t strangled.

    Are there no innocent blacks, not on drugs, not robbing, raping or assaulting who can be held up as saints? Is this felon the only mountain these black supremacists have to plant their flag?

  426. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @FB

    I have to admit that I was initially taken aback by Ron’s comments and actually believed he was being coy in order to draw out some good discussion. That’s why I put so much effort into it. I am very thankful and respectful that he had put up a site like this that makes huge efforts to encourage intelligent discussion outside the Overton window. He is very tolerant of a wide range of views including even somewhat heated debate directed at himself as I have just demonstrated.

    Nonetheless, it seems that he was being straight with his comments. I find it a bit shocking, but it is an educational experience to see that even among the intellectually gifted (definitely not including myself here) there can be such a diversity of opinion and at the same time, such a subconscious drive to defend the actions of the status-quo, even when it stretches the bounds of logic.

    The last time I experienced this was when I was in Saudi Arabia and Iraq as a Conscientious Objector. All the intelligent Army medical and JAG officers were trying dissuade me from my actions and convince me that it was an excellent idea to become militarily involved in Iraq in Operation Desert Storm. We all know how that ended. Oh wait…..it hasn’t ended!

    • Replies: @FB
  427. I read the discussion/argument between The Scalpel and Ron Unz about 2 days and I personally have three points on Mr. Unz here:

    1. Base on his opinion on black people, Mr. Unz seem has some kind of personal hatred to black people than being harsh criticize. I guess he must be bullied or attacked by black thugs so much when he is young and poor, right?

    2. Mr. Unz is become another hoaxer, ironically. I mean if you guys just watch video (combine the analysis from The Scalpel), you will have to agree that George Floyd is more likely death by neck kneeing. For some reason, Mr. Unz seem does not want his believe “black people is 100% violence and police is right to attack or kill them for self-defense 100% of time” is damaged by George Floyd dead. In simple way, his attitude is right now similar to his attitude on the moon hoax article last year.

    3. Mr. Unz, like he himself admits, does not have any knowledge on the medical knowledge like doctor The Scalpel but instead just being neutral on the George Floyd matter, he still act like “he know it all” and he is pretty enthusiasm when someone support his current believe right now “George Floyd death is hoax” or “George Floyd is killed by drug-addicted” at least even if the thing that support his believe is from Alex Jones. I assume that if Alex Jones bring a ton of thing (possible contain many non-sense things), he will applaud Alex Jones for his effort to prove and reinforce his believe that “George Floyd is killed by being disobeyed to police” or any blame the victim things.

    I think I just understand more about what personalities and traits Ron Unz is. Ron Unz is some kind person like when he believes something, he will never question what he believes until someone else like Kevin Barrett point out. He also will become a denialism or hoaxer to protect something he believe so toxically. He is some kind of lack of self-awareness person to me.

    I will take on Jonathan Revusky as an example. If my memory serve me right, Ron Unz said that Jonathan Revusky articles is pretty bet for him personally but he let Jonathan Revusky published his articles in the Unz Review because Ron Unz feel pity for Jonathan Revusky, and Mr. Revusky is able to write about 10,000 words article. Another example here is Andrew Anglin, Ron Unz indirectly admit that he post Andrew Anglin article here on the April to serve like a COVID-19 hoaxer magnet. From two example above, I doubt that Ron Unz make the Unz Review not because he respect freedom of speech or believe people like John Derbyshire deserve a place to express their believe and opinion but because he want to run the website like a Human Freak Zoo (I hope I am truly wrong on my doubt).

    This is just my own personal opinion on Mr. Unz right now.

    • Thanks: FB
    • Replies: @FB
  428. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Iris

    Chouviat’s lawyers recall that this technique was involved in three cases: in the death of Cédric Chouviat who “was asphyxiated” and whose “larynx was fractured” in January 2020, in the 2016 death of Adama Traoré, according to a new examination carried out at the request of the family of the deceased and revealed on 2 June, and in the death of Mohamed Gabsi according to an autopsy report pointing to dangerous police practices revealed on 5 June. All these were retrospective examinations, after the victims families’ complaints were initially dismissed.

    Thanks

  429. Biff says:
    @The Scalpel

    All it takes is some patience, verbal skills, and different methods.

    Unacceptable in a Zero Tolerance society.

    • LOL: The Scalpel
  430. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    And they did call an ambulance for him.

    But it wasn’t EMTs or paramedics who showed up. It was armed, bullet-proof vest wearing cops, who didn’t even make a pretext of providing medical attention.

    So if the MSM narrative was totally false in so many other cases involving the killings of blacks, I’m pretty suspicious of the Floyd case…

    something is going on..

    Obama Foundation tweeted about George Floyd on May 17th, a week before his supposed murder

    https://projectcamelotportal.com/2020/06/09/the-george-floyd-set-up/

    • Replies: @lloyd
  431. Truth says:
    @The Saigon Kid

    Who in their right mind is still going to want a career as a police officer after all this?

    A mediocre high school graduate who wants to make $80,000 a year.

  432. Punisher says:
    @Tono Bungay

    Tono Bungay
    Most of the Latin people coming to this country are not Mexican but from central America Honduras or Guatemala. Mexico is a richer country than the United States. Alot of jobs that were in the United States went to Mexico. Mexico is a beautiful country. The Latin people who come from Honduras come through Mexico and they are escaping gangs and poverty and the ones who come are starving and uneducated. The middle class do not come to the United states.

  433. Truth says:
    @conspirator

    And after wiping out the Black Panthers, they introduced drugs into the ghettos which totally put the blacks in a war against each other. Pretty clever. If you kill all the leaders and good examples, what can the rest of the people do?

    Yes, and the one BP who finally got the message, Bobby Seale, has been a Representative for years now.

    • Replies: @AceDeuce
  434. Truth says:
    @Al Lipton

    White police would not go for it because they don’t earn their 4,000 square foot houses or daughter’s private school tuitions working 9- 5 in Grosse Pointe or East Hampton. They work tons of overtime hours (getting paid double time) in downtown inner-cities, where they also get to make arrests that stick (instead of paperwork disappearing after pulling over the judge’s son for DWI), get to shake down suspects for money and drugs, and get free sex as a job bonus, and they spend half of their overtime hours at Village Inn anyway.

    Some of these academics here, have never known a police officer and have been studying for their PhD in Applied Linguistics for 20 years now.

  435. FB says: • Website
    @The Scalpel

    Nonetheless, it seems that he [Ron Unz] was being straight with his comments. I find it a bit shocking…

    Yes, it is shocking…that’s exactly the right word…

    Again, it is about character, or lack thereof…

    Hillary exceeded any possible bounds of decency [what we consider a major part of ‘character’] by that disgusting display of callousness and inhumanity…

    I will say right now that I think Mr Unz will come to regret displaying very publicly a similar lack of judgement…

    Look Doc…I’ve said this already a number of times, but I will say it again…people have been absolutely gobsmacked by the depravity and utter inhuman display we saw from the criminal Chauvin and his accomplices…we have all been brutalized and victimized by this disgusting spectacle…

    Watching that pornography is harmful to all of us on a very basic human level…and we are fucking pissed about having to watch this for the thousandth time…

    That is why people are freaking out…including many decent people…that is also why those of us here are shocked when someone like Mr Unz tries to simply normalize this revolting imagery…there is NOTHING normal about it…

    There is also nothing normal about that 75 year old man who was shoved to the ground by police and I think Donald Trump is likewise going to regret attacking this victim…just for that one very poor lapse in judgement, he will have many many decent folks who will not vote for him…

    Look, character is a big part of life…whatever type of endeavor you labor in, being of ‘good character’ is required by all decent and thoughtful folks…It IS IMPORTANT…

    This precludes people who want to shove snuff pornography down our throats and say it’s all okay…no it’s not…we’ve had enough of people without any discernible character lowering the bar of civilization for all of us…

    Ron Unz has stepped in it big time…unless he’s a hermit I have to wonder what people he may know and who might have chanced upon his comments here are going to say to his face…

    • Agree: Jazman
  436. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    Ok, this took 30 seconds on Google…The Los Angeles Police Commission severely restricted its use in 1982 after the deaths of a dozen black men

    But that’s exactly what I had said in my own comment, namely that during the 1980s quite a number of blacks in LA died due to police arm-choke-holds, leading the LAPD to prohibit that restraint method. A dozen deaths in a single city obviously meant that the technique was quite dangerous and it was banned as a consequence.

    However, as far as I can tell, you still haven’t found a single case in the US in which someone died as a result of a knee-neck-hold, despite the thousands of times its supposedly been used over the years. Perhaps if you Google some more, you’d eventually find such an example, but wouldn’t our MSM have already found and highlighted it during the last ten days of huge feeding-frenzy?

    Perhaps you’re correct and all the deaths have been covered up by dishonest coroners, but why wouldn’t they have covered up the dozen official chokehold deaths in LA alone during the 1980s?

    According to a medical study mentioned on another thread, individuals who die from Fentanyl generally have between 5 and 10 ng/ml in their system, with the level depending upon their degree of tolerance and presence of other significant drugs. Floyd had 11 ng/ml of Fentanyl plus Meth and had just recently recovered from a serious bout of Covid-19.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/chicago-2/#comment-3955166

    So if Floyd was indeed the first and only American in recent years to die from a knee-neck-hold, perhaps it’s more than purely coincidental that he also had lethal levels of illegal drugs in his system at the time of his death.

    I’m not claiming to be sure what really happened. But I do think all these possibilities should be seriously considered.

  437. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    videos that allegedly show Floyd resisting arrest and roughing-up the two rookie officers who initially were trying to deal with him. A missing video segment has now appeared on YouTube, showing that they spent at least a couple of minutes unsuccessfully trying to force him into the police car, which certainly supports the idea he was resisting arrest.

    If you’re a huge violent criminal, 250 lb and maybe 6’6″, who’s high on drugs and violently resisting arrest, is it so totally unreasonable that a police officer would apply an officially-sanctioned restraint technique to subdue you?

    All of that is relevant and true, right up to the point where he was subdued. After which, it doesn’t matter how violent or disrespectful or even what crimes he may have committed. Once he was (obviously) subdued, the ‘officially-sanctioned restraint technique’ (intended to subdue a resisting suspect), looks more like sadism than police work. Like punching a man in handcuffs. Or when those cops were beating Rodney King while he was prostrate on the pavement. It looks like a bunch of thugs, beating a helpless man, because that’s what it is.

    If Rodney King (or George Floyd) had raped the wife of one of those cops, then I think we could all understand. But for most people, it is unacceptable for cops to punish suspects once they’re subdued and no longer any threat. Then you turn on your professionalism and understand that now that person’s life and well-being are your responsibility. You’re the professional, you’re the one charged with and trusted with protecting the man or woman you have in handcuffs, and are taking into custody.

    Here’s a video from your hometown, that shows a cop throttling a handcuffed suspect and asking him if he thinks he’s a ‘tough guy”. The thing about it is the kind of cowardice it takes to act like a ‘tough guy’, (as the cop is obviously trying to do), while abusing a man in handcuffs.

    Cops are given a lot of power and authority by our society, even the power of life and death, so that they can enforce the laws. But when they abuse that power, to lord it over (always on the powerless) segments of society, they’re worse than the criminals they’re supposed to be arresting.

    The clubs coming down on Rodney King were arguably warranted- until he was prostrate and subdued on the pavement, and no longer any threat. After which, those clubs raining down were the acts of sadistic thugs, taking out their frustration on a helpless man, who was in their custody, and supposedly under their protection.

    Once George Floyd was subdued and no threat to anyone, then the cop had no more business applying an officially-sanctioned restraint technique’. Especially when the guy kept saying he couldn’t breath.

    Perhaps it wasn’t murder, as you suggest, but it was still an egregious breach of common decency.

    I wonder sometimes, when I hear people defending the action of the cop (not that you’re doing that), if segments of our society are becoming so jaded at the hyper criminality and violence of so many blacks, and the revolting and despicable way our media always blames a ‘racist’ white society for all black failure, whether or not some people are getting to the point where they figure it’s time to start treating black thugs and criminals like they treat others, and do unto them as they’d do unto us.

    I suppose it’s even understandable on a certain level, when these animals relentlessly menace and prey upon decent people. I think they’ve decided in places like Chicago, to just let these sub-humans slaughter each other. What’s the down side?

    So I kind of ‘get it’, on some level. But I’ve also known a lot of cops who have no business wearing a badge, and are often just as murderous and thuggish as the worst black or MS13 gang-banger. So I don’t really have sympathies for any of them, ‘hood rats’ who have zero compunction about raping a woman, or thug cops who abuse their authority to personally take out their anger on the underclass.

    IMO both of these phenomena are created and used by the PTB as two ends of the societal vice to crush the law abiding ((and hated)) white working and middle class. Black and brown and white thugs, from the bottom, and uniformed thugs from the top.

    And I suspect this whole George Floyd thing is being orchestrated for some nefarious scheme they’re always up to.

    And other than creating more racial hatred and strife, ((their calling card)) and further alienating the militarized police, I’m not sure what it is.

  438. @Ron Unz

    ‘You’re gonna kill me!’: Dallas police body cam footage reveals the final minutes of Tony Timpa’s life
    https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investigations/2019/07/31/you-re-gonna-kill-me-dallas-police-body-cam-footage-reveals-the-final-minutes-of-tony-timpa-s-life/

    Just knee on his back, not neck and that Dallas guy is died by “just knee on his back”.

    Now watch again the new angle of Geogre Floyd video:

    George Floyd may be died by combination of heroin and ton of “human meat” in his back, butt, and neck. The problem here you seem to assume that police does not do anything wrong and blame the drug mainly.

    Now another case that pretty similar to George Floyd:

    Dallas man dies after deputy is seen with knee on his neck during arrest (I must take 10 minutes to find it on google, bing, duckduckgo, etc.)
    https://mashable.com/2015/08/31/dallas-man-dies-police/

    I will select some important quote from the report above:

    The Dallas County Medical Examiner’s office said Monday that Hutcheson died from a combination of the effects of being restrained, cocaine, methamphetamine and hypertensive cardiovascular disease.

    Another that contradict to the Dallas Police statement (This is relate to Dallas Police Case Above):

    Death of man in Dallas County jail lobby ruled a homicide, according to Dallas County Medical Examiner’s office
    https://www.dallasnews.com/news/2015/08/31/death-of-man-in-dallas-county-jail-lobby-ruled-a-homicide-according-to-dallas-county-medical-examiner-s-office/

    Now something pretty strange here:

    Palmer said the family hired a private pathologist to conduct a second autopsy. The doctor could not determine what had killed Hutcheson, but told the family that the organs in his throat were missing.

    I see the behavior of the police medical analysis in George Floyd case is pretty similar to the Dallas Police in 2015. The police seem tries cover their crime by publish a very confusing CAM here:

    How can we know that we can trust the police? The police can lie too.

    • Replies: @The Scalpel
  439. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    Are you blind, man? I just showed you that Google is rife with examples of people dying from neck restraints. I linked to the articles and examples. I showed you how those deaths are routinely miscategorized unless someone demands an independent evaluation. There are literally hundreds, probably thousands of such deaths if one extrapolates data from Minneapolis to the entire USA and world.

    Do you really believe that 44/200 cases of this led to near death in Minneapolis but not a single person died until the very first time one such incident was captured well on video? I know you are smarter than that. What gives?

    The mention of deaths in almost all the articles does not say if it was an arm around the neck or a knee on the neck or the exact positioning of the arm or knee in any particular case because it does not matter. The maneuver is not precise. It cannot possibly be precise under the conditions. I already described to you the level of precision necessary for it to possibly be safe. Its impossible under the conditions. All the variations on “neck restraints” if applied with sufficient force/duration/imprecision are deadly. I know you are intelligent enough to understand that.

    Have you gone through the individual cases cited in each of the articles that does not describe the precise method of “neck restraint”? I’m sure you have not. You are simply assuming that none of dozens of cases I cited were similar to this case. How can you possibly make that assumption? I know you are smarter than that! So why do it? Why?

    But your clear bias (for what reason I do not know) shines through in one particular comment you made. I was anticipating this, and hoped not to see it. But here it is:

    You commented:

    ” …as far as I can tell, you still haven’t found a single case in the US

    Why did you write “in the US”? It would have been less effort to leave that out because if it is deadly, what difference does it make? You left it out because one of the articles did mention the specific method in an individual case, and it is a knee to the neck, but it is from Canada. You knew that, but you left it out because it disproves your point. In this matter, you would rather be seen to be correct than to be honest. Why?

    As I said previously, it took me 30 seconds to find all these cases. How many do you think someone who put serious effort into it could discover? Honestly, how many? I think we can both agree, A LOT.

    Perhaps you’re correct and all the deaths have been covered up by dishonest coroners

    WTF? Who said that? I gave you dozens of examples. I’m sure not all of them were covered up, but I also showed that a lot ARE covered up.

    …individuals who die from Fentanyl generally have between 5 and 10 ng/ml in their system

    OMG you are so much smarter than that. Why are you being so disingenous? Why? You know that “generally” refers to a standard distribution, not an individual, and that it is quite possible that George Floyd as an individual fell outside the center of that standard distribution. You know that, yet you are implying that this is somehow evidence that George Floyd died of a Fentanyl overdose over at the very least 20 minutes after he took it (when Fentanyl hits its peak in seconds,) and not the obvious knee to the neck and weight on the chest and face down position while screaming “I can’t breathe” for 9 minutes

    I think we are done here. You are EXTREMELY biased in this case. There is none so blind, as he who will not see. It is pointless to make any further attempt to convince you.

    • Replies: @Rurik
    , @RSDB
    , @Ron Unz
    , @vot tak
  440. @The Scalpel

    I am totally ignorant of American law and also haven’t read all the comments, but perhaps you could answer me one simple question: has this procedure (knee on neck) been banned in Minnesota?

    If it hasn’t, can the officer in question be considered guilty for using it? Supposing there is anyone to blame for what happened, shouldn’t that blame be pinned instead on his superiors for allowing that procedure?

    As for the supposed guilt of the State, let me make a medical analogy: suppose a doctor prescribes a medicine for a disease which is by consensus recommended for that disease. If later research finds that said medicine has some adverse effect and as a consequence it is banned, should that doctor be considered guilty of malpractice if that adverse effect happens on a patient he treated before the ban?

    In police matters, shouldn’t there be a normative organization which would be the equivalent of the FDA for police procedures?

    These may come across as absurd questions and propositions, in which case I apologize in advance.

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
    , @The Scalpel
  441. JimDandy says:
    @Ron Unz

    Ron, I wrote the following as a response to your comment, but it didn’t register as a response, so I’m re-sending it:

    Swallowing drugs to avoid arrest is a common–and often fatal–practice:

    https://www.tmz.com/2019/12/09/juice-wrld-swallowed-percocet-pills-hide-federal-agents-possible-overdose/

    In the videos of Floyd’s arrest, he collapses as soon as he exits the car and then has to be half-carried to a wall, where he collapses again. Fentanyl and other intoxicants were in his bloodstream (as was COVID 19) and he was suffering from heart disease.

    And, yes, the elite media seems to now exist only as a propaganda machine. Virtually every story is stretched, chopped, and shaped to fit The Narrative, and the truth always dies in the process. The patron saint of today’s MSM is Procrustes.

    I was aware of how worthless those studies on hydroxichloiquine were only because I spent a great deal of time on alternative media sites researching the issue. But it has been even harder to get to the truth in the Floyd case. For instance, was the technique the officer used (knee to the back of the neck) sanctioned by his police department, or not?

  442. ANZ says:
    @Ron Unz

    But one reason I’m extremely suspicious of the official MSM narrative is that once the facts came out in several of the previous high-profile cases, they turned out to be 100% contrary to the initial narrative. This was especially true in the Trayvon Martin case that launched the whole Black Lives Matter movement, and also true in the Ferguson/Michael Brown case. As I discussed in an article, similar MSM falsehoods and omissions have been common for at least the last half-century:

    This narrative is heavily pushed whenever possible and the MSM is eagerly looking for a case that fits their narrative that whites are out to get blacks. Yet the fact they have such a hard time finding a genuine case that fits this twisted narrative and instead have to concoct, reframe and invent racial angles to non-racial events speaks volumes. Is says that their narrative is completely bogus, made up, and agenda driven instead of fact driven.

    Yet the opposite agenda, which is that some blacks operate on blatant and admitted anti-white racism in the commission of crimes, is left unaddressed by the MSM. This would be the more accurate racial angle to pursue in the news if they were interested in real reporting. It is completely upside down. So I tune out the MSM on most any topic and only check headlines to see how bad the bias has gotten on their part.

  443. Ron Unz says:
    @Brás Cubas

    I am totally ignorant of American law and also haven’t read all the comments, but perhaps you could answer me one simple question: has this procedure (knee on neck) been banned in Minnesota?

    Yes, it seems to have been absolutely authorized as a standard restraint technique by the Minneapolis police department, and in fact as mentioned above, it had been used some 200 times by the MPD during last the couple of years. That’s why the officers weren’t hiding their actions in any way as a crowd gathered.

    However, I do think a strong case can be made that the officer applied it outside of the proper guidelines, and so could reasonably be charged with manslaughter in Floyd’s death. Probably the strongest defense would be that the death was caused by the lethal level of illegal drugs in Floyd’s system and related health factors, with the officer’s action being only a minor contribution. That’s the sort of thing a court should be trying to determine.

    • Thanks: Brás Cubas
  444. Rurik says:
    @The Scalpel

    There is none so blind, as he who will not see.

    Everyone seems to be looking at this issue though their own prejudices.

    Blacks see racism everywhere, (perhaps a lot of projection when it comes to that).

    White liberal’s ‘brains’ are indoctrinated mush. They see what they’ve been programmed to see, (white racism everywhere!)

    And those on the far right, have hit rock bottom for sympathy for endemic black criminality. There’s simply no more compassion for that segment of society. Too many Michael Browns, and a media that hails all Michael Browns as victims of rampant white racism, while demonizing all white cops, who like the one in Michael Brown’s case, was simply doing his job.

    So there are camps out there, like those blacks and J-supremacists that consider all the white lives lost to sub-human black orcs (Channon Christian, et al) as justifiable deaths, because all white people are ‘racists and anti-Semites’. Hardly a soul has heard of Channon, because J-supremacists consider her life worthless, and her death justified, but the entire planet has been harangued with George Floyd, with demands that all white people are responsible for all black suffering and criminality, because white people have ‘had their knee on black’s necks for four hundred years!’, blah, blah, blah. ‘We demand 14 trillions in reparations now!’

    That kind of thing, and so one extreme (all whites are all racists and owe big time, and all blacks are all victims, blah, blah..), brings out the other extreme. ‘Every action has an equal and opposite reaction’. And howling that whitey is evil and guilty and racist!, endlessly from every TV screen and magazine and so forth, for generations now, has created a kind of cynicism from some ranks, where they’re ‘fuck the black criminals’, ‘my sympathies and my compassion are for my own family and tribe, and as long as blacks (obviously hate my guts, and have zero sympathy for people like Channon), then fuck them’. No tears from me when one of their thugs gets ‘the treatment’ from the police’.

    That is how I’m starting to see this sort of callous disregard for George Floyd’s terrible death.

    There’s no other way I can explain it or understand it, except as a reaction to the endless hysteria and lies and hatred from the left and so many blacks and the ((media)) for white people, since I’ve been alive.

    Apparently, it has created a callous disregard for people like Floyd.

    I guess I’ll just thank God that people like you are not infected by it all, because as bad as it is when the police have such contempt for people’s welfare, it’d be even much, much worse if such a mentality were prevalent in the medical fields.

    Keep on being you Scalpel, the human race is better for it.

  445. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Brás Cubas

    I’m not a lawyer, so perhaps you are correct. I’m guessing one would have to know the man’s state of mind. His conduct history is concerning. I agree that the fact that this conduct is state sanctioned is disturbing. There has been some commentary by Minnesota officials regarding this particular conduct, and they have stated that the maneuver should be discontinued immediately upon gaining control. so there is a grey zone here. My personal take is that it extended well beyond the time that police gained control.

    • Thanks: Brás Cubas
  446. RSDB says:
    @The Scalpel

    Do you really believe that 44/200 cases of this led to near death in Minneapolis but not a single person died until the very first time one such incident was captured well on video? I know you are smarter than that. What gives?

    Do you know if specific details (names, for instance) in these instances are available anywhere? It might be worthwhile for someone (not me, I have zero competence in this area) to make a careful investigation.

  447. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    Are you blind, man?…You are EXTREMELY biased in this case. There is none so blind, as he who will not see.

    Well, I’m just trying to look at the unfortunate situation objectively, while you seem very emotionally involved.

    Let’s suppose, as seems likely based on the evidence, that the fatality rate of the knee-neck-hold restraint is exceptionally low, perhaps a couple of deaths per every thousand applications. Under such circumstances, the officer could not have reasonably imagined that Floyd would be killed, which is why everything was done in public, even with phone-cameras (and body-cams) recording.

    (A couple of times, you’ve stated that 20% of the knee-neck incidents over the last couple of years in Minneapolis nearly resulted in death, but I haven’t seen any evidence supporting your claim.)

    You could still make a case that Floyd’s death was due to negligent homicide or manslaughter or something like. But it’s absurd to charge the officer with second-degree murder. And even so, it would be important to try to objectively determine whether or not Floyd’s lethal level of illegal drugs and other health problems was the main thing that killed him.

    However, the MSM and most of our elites seem to be ignoring these important issues and declaring that Floyd was brutally murdered by several police officers in public. As a direct consequence of this MSM fabrication, we’ve seen the largest wave of nationwide riots and looting in two generations, and things may get worse over this summer.

    As a minor example, Chicago just set its all-time record for the largest number of homicides in a single 24 hour period, with 18 victims. My guess is that nearly all of the killings were black-on-black, and I’d assume that at least some of the victims were less deserving of their fate than Floyd.

    Steve Sailer has previously noted “the Ferguson Effect,” namely that MSM falsehoods about the death of a black at the hands of police often produce a social/ideological climate that results in major spikes in the black homicide rate, with thousands of additional blacks being killed over the following couple of years. Since Floyd’s death has been so much higher-profile, I’d think its likely that the results will be at least as large.

    So if many thousands of additional blacks soon begin dying by homicide as a consequence of the dishonest MSM treatment of the Floyd case, what exactly is the positive value of that dishonesty?

  448. The author is a few short of a six pack.

    First off, does he think black cops are stupid? Which are the most violent and dangerous parts of the city and the author tells us to insure blacks police those areas. Now as a black cop what would you think of this idea? Second, do you think the race hustlers and race baiters care if black cops were on patrol? Blacks are equal opportunity killers, they’d shot a black cop as soon as they’d shot a black one.

    I recently saw BLM nutcase insult a long line of NY cops focusing his outrage on a short hispanic cop, who had to be restrained by his fellow officers. The long string of insults couldn’t restrain his fellow officers who finally put a stop to this race baiter. The fact of the matter is if you poke the bear you better be ready for what follows.

    Blacks thinks they can do this it part of their black privilege. We see affirmative action, racial quotas, and if you really want to see whose in power call a black a nigger at work and see what happens. If you did this in response to a black calling you red neck honkey what penalty do you think the black would get?

    As for the nonsense about Floyd;s death isn’t it interesting that Floyd’s non resistance, which was captured on the cop’s cameras in the cop car has been hidden by the same DA who is bringing 2nd degree manslaughter charges against this cop. A charge that will be very difficult if not impossible to prove when a 3rd degree charge was a given. Could it be the DA wants acquittal so that the usual suspects could stir up further rioting?

    By the way if the author wants blacks to police their own, how about restricting firemen, teachers, medical personnel who are black to black areas? Aren’t blacks sure to cheer this idea?

    What is wrong are those who pander to blacks and allow them “room to destroy.” This never happened before the 60s because blacks knew what would happen. Since law and order doesn’t exist anymore its only a matter of time before anarchy erupts.

  449. vot tak says:
    @The Scalpel

    With these people, the cops MUST be seen as innocent of wrong doing. Additionally, blacks MUST be portrayed as deserving of their being prejudiced against.

  450. lloyd says: • Website
    @Rurik

    As if at a signal, there was a tremendous bleating of the sheep. ‘Four legs good. Two legs better.’ By the time they had stopped, all the pigs had re-entered the house.

    • Agree: Rurik
  451. Iris says:
    @Ron Unz

    And even so, it would be important to try to objectively determine whether or not Floyd’s lethal level of illegal drugs and other health problems was the main thing that killed him.

    If the lethal level of drugs is so difficult to determine, then why would a sensible police officer decide to take the chance, on the balance, and continue applying a hold upon the respiratory ways of somebody who wasn’t a threat and who was distinctly claiming that he was in distress?

    Why would anybody normal continue to unnecessarily hurt somebody who’s plainly telling them that they are in pain?

    It is one thing to have a suspect dying of OD, and another to help this outcome come about.
    The PD’s instructions and procedures may well be imprecise and dangerous, but Officer Chauvin, as an individual, has behaved in a callous and cruel manner. His only acceptable excuse in a tribunal would be his stupidity.

    I trust that every normal person sees it this way: you don’t hurt people just because you can.
    Sensible police officers do not defend Chauvin. NYC police union boss O’Meara:

    “Everybody’s trying to shame us,” he thundered. “Legislators. The press. Everybody’s trying to shame us into being embarrassed of our profession. You know what? This isn’t stained by someone in Minneapolis,” he said, waving his badge in the air. “ [..]

    O’Meara condemned the killing of Floyd, calling Chauvin’s actions “disgusting,” and insisted that his department is “restrained.”
    “It’s not what we do,” he said, referring to the shocking murder. “It’s not what police officers do… he killed someone. We didn’t.”

    https://www.rt.com/usa/491344-new-york-police-union-animals/

  452. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Ron Unz

    Mr. Unz:

    In your comment of June 10, 2020 at 4:31 pm GMT (comment # 453), you put more specious (even absurd) arguments seeking to rescue your bigotry-driven pro-police/anti-Black bias. You closed that comment with this paragraph:

    I’m not claiming to be sure what really happened. But I do think all these possibilities should be seriously considered.

    I put this comment because, sincerely, for your sake, I urge that you undertake “serious consideration” of what psychic mechanism presses you to use ever-more logically/empirically invalid pilpul to defend, in your mind, your bigoted arguments’ flaws.

    [MORE]

    First, I note that The Scalpel has demolished your spurious arguments — your pilpul — that attempt to suggest that officer Chauvin’s knee-press choke-hold did not kill Floyd. Beyond The Scalpel’s comments I referenced in my comment of June 9, 2020 at 11:08 pm GMT (comment # 387), I reference, here, also The Scalpel’s comments of June 10, 2020 at 1:29 am GMT (comment # 392, June 10, 2020 at 5:00 am GMT (comment # 419), June 10, 2020 at 12:48 pm GMT (comment # 434), June 10, 2020 at 1:52 pm GMT (comment # 439), June 10, 2020 at 3:11 pm GMT (comment # 443), and June 10, 2020 at 6:03 pm GMT (comment # 456). See also Iris’s comment of June 10, 2020 at 3:49 am GMT (comment # 413).

    This comment will refute your arguments a different way.

    You try, inter alia, to justify your position with an assertion that the recorded death-causing police-applied choke-holds have not included the knee-press choke-hold type used on George Floyd — hence, perhaps (you do not specify) elbow-crotch choke-holds, forearm choke-holds, or two-hand choke-holds. See your same comment # 453.

    No legitimate physics-experiment could show that the asphyxiation-probability-effect of an “average” knee-press choke-hold is significantly different from the asphyxiation-probability-effect of an “average” elbow-crotch choke-hold or “average” forearm choke-hold — UNLESS it shows that an “average” knee-press choke-hold’s asphyxiation-probability-effect is GREATER than that of either of the other two, because of the mass, velocity or force, and direction of a knee-press choke-hold’s human apparatus.

    My immediately preceding paragraph assumes that elbow-crotch choke-hold or forearm choke-hold is being applied while the assailant and the victim are essentially prostrate —in the elbow-crotch case, the assailant lying either under or at the side of the victim, and in the forearm case, the assailant being above the victim.

    If the assailant and victim are essentially standing, a forearm choke-hold would be a joke, unless the victim were pinned against a wall, and even then, often a victim (other than, say, a little old lady or frightened-stiff un athletic man) could avoid deadly pressure or escape.

    But a forearm choke-hold could be more effective than an elbow-crotch choke-hold if either is applied while assailant & victim are essentially prostrate — the matter depending PARTLY on:
    (a) whether the elbow-crotch-choke-hold-applying assailant (i) uses a horizontal quasi-lifting motion after he puts an elbow-crotch choke-hold in place and (ii) possesses strength and leverage enough to accomplish sufficient quasi-lifting while also pulling the victim’s neck somewhat backward or sharply sidewards
    and
    (b) whether the forearm-choke-hold-applying assailant has body-mass, arm-strength, skill, and position optimum for pinning the victim hopelessly and places his forearm firmly and forcefully against the trachea or a carotid artery or jugular vein

    But, still, if in each case the assailant is the same and the victims are of like physique, weakness, strength, and ability, the assailant’s mass, velocity or force, and direction would make an “average” knee-press choke-hold’s kill-likelihood greater than that of the elbow-crotch choke-hold

    A forearm choke-hold could be more likely deadly than a knee-press choke-hold if the forearm-choke-hold-using assailant positions his body so that he can apply the maximum-possible amount of the mass of his torso and hips, but (as was NOT the case in the Floyd-killing) the knee-press-choke-hold-using assailant is of slight build, leans his torso somewhat away from the victim, and does not press sufficiently against enough of a critical part of the neck’s anatomy.

    Another cop-used choke-hold involves the assailant’s two hands. See the 0.00 to 0.18 of the video linked immediately after this sentence — for comparison of the two-hands choke-hold and the typical knee-press choke-hold.

    If you react honestly, you will see that the knee-press choke-hold is considerably more likely to kill the victim, because it applies more mass and force to more of the neck-anatomy’s critical parts. Officer Chauvin applied quite such knee-press choke-hold to Floyd.

    Officer Chauvin applied his whole torso-and-hip mass with his knee-press choke-hold, and several times Chauvin also jerked pressure downward in full-torso thrusts.

    Ask a marshal arts expert which choke-hold most likely will cause death — asphyxiation-death or cervical-spine-break death. He will answer: ” knee-press choke-hold.”

    In another thread, I reported that I hold an Aikido black belt [merely shodan (1st degree), but that is good enough fo the current purpose]. In the dojo where I learned the Aikido, the chief teacher was a 7th dan Aikidoka (who learned Aikido, in 1946-19451 Japan, from the art’s originator). The chief teacher was also a judo 6th dan and a jiu jitsu 3rd dan. Aikido’s originator was also a 19th century samurai and jiu jitsu master who, in duels, killed a goodly number — in 19th-century Japan, where marshal arts killings were tolerated.

    My dojo’s chief teacher insisted that learning be VERY realistic. So, e.g., we learned UNARMED defense against ferocious wieldings of REAL samurai swords and UNARMED defense against
    jo weapons

    and bo weapons

    and learned to endure being thrown hard onto concrete or blacktop of streets and to defend against savage attacks wrought by karate experts and professional boxers. In the above-linked jo weapon and bo weapon videos, one does not see UNARMED defense. The immediately following link opens a video of unarmed Aikido defenses against various weapons.

    In my dojo, attacks were more ferocious.

    We learned also to defend against various kinds of choke-holds applied ruthlessly. The worst — most resistant to defense and most damaging — was the knee-press choke-hold, which, twice, required rushing a student to an emergency-room. [One could not be a student in that dojo unless one signed a legally binding agreement that one assumed all harm-risks that might obtain. I, since 1972 a law professor, assure you that the agreement would have survived any legal challenge.]

    Therefore, since (as is true) police have killed victims with elbow-crotch choke-holds and forearm choke-holds [perhaps even two-hand choke-holds, though I do not know so], then, a fortiori, death was a very foreseeable outcome of the knee-press choke-hold that Officer Chauvin applied to Floyd. [RE: foreseeability & the law, see my comment of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (comment # 282.] And, as the medical evidence indicates, Chauvin’s choke-hold (and at least one other cop’s pressing Floyd’s chest) DID kill Floyd. Worse, the available video evidence shows that Officer Chauvin’s intent was viscous, not merely designed to subdue Floyd.

    Mr. Unz, you are very intelligent, and you have authored very useful articles, like your “American Pravda: Our Coronavirus Catastrophe as Biowarfare Blowback?” [Unz Review (21 April 2020)], https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-our-coronavirus-catastrophe-as-biowarfare-blowback/

    Please cease trying to defend Floyd’s killers with specious arguments. Floyd’s killers are indefensible. Your arguments pursue bigotry, not truth. You are disgracing yourself.

    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  453. AceDeuce says:
    @Jamie_NYC

    Fred you old bunghole, you never fail to disappoint.

    If some sedentary 55 year old YT shoveled snow and died, no one would be surprised.

    If a 46 year old COVID ridden cardiovascular mess drug addict gets in a fight with cops, knowing that he’s probably in parole violation and going back to the graybar hotel, and has a huge adrenaline dump fighting the cops for 10 minutes, I imagine that’s physically and emotionally far more stressful than shoveling snow.

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  454. The Scalpel says: • Website
    @Ron Unz

    The case itself is certainly awful, but the thing that is frustrating here is what appears to be your willful ignorance and tendency to not disprove, but disregard any information that does not fit your bias. Many people here highly respect your opinion. I was one of them. I am certainly OK with disagreeing with people, but when they distort and ignore evidence repeatedly, even after they are made aware of it, there is something wrong there. This site is your bully pulpit. I would hope that at a minimum, you respect that and try to be honest.

    For example:

    A couple of times, you’ve stated that 20% of the knee-neck incidents over the last couple of years in Minneapolis nearly resulted in death, but I haven’t seen any evidence supporting your claim.

    I posted a video of NBC news reporting this fact. You yourself acknowledged that. Let me reassure you, if you choke someone to the point they pass out, they could be mere seconds from death. Certainly not more than a minute or two. The brain does not tolerate hypoxia well. You are aware of that, yet still you made the claim.

    Honestly, I’m not all that concerned with what the specific charges against the police are. That’s a legal matter. Floyd is already dead. He’s not coming back. I’m concerned about the truth, and the issue, and how it should be addressed going forward. If people don’t at least accept this for what it is, if they just try to make excuses for the police behavior because of their personal biases, there will not be any change.

    …fatality rate of the knee-neck-hold restraint is exceptionally low, perhaps a couple of deaths per every thousand applications.

    Based on the Los Angeles data, it is likely much higher than that. But what you are saying implies that you consider choking someone until they pass out to be an acceptable police procedure as long as they don’t kill them, and if they do “accidentally kill them” who could have known that terrorists would fly planes into the World Trade Center, er, I mean who could have known that they might die? Need I say more about the moral decay in our society?

    …declaring that Floyd was brutally murdered by several police officers in public. As a direct consequence of this MSM fabrication,

    Floyd WAS brutally (let’s say killed) in public. His substance abuse is a separate issue. What moral system makes it OK to choke someone to death (even without intent to kill by choking them) just because they are a substance abuser? Moral decay again.

    As a minor example, Chicago just set its all-time record for the largest number of homicides in a single 24 hour period, with 18 victims. My guess is that nearly all of the killings were black-on-black, and I’d assume that at least some of the victims were less deserving of their fate than Floyd.

    Why is this even relevant to the issue of police brutality? Plus, that’s pretty close to saying Floyd was deserving to be choked to death.

    “the Ferguson Effect,” namely that MSM falsehoods about the death of a black at the hands of police often produce a social/ideological climate that results in major spikes in the black homicide rate.

    I’m sorry, but that sounds like complete bull**it to me. I don’t know how anyone could ever establish causality between those variables or even define or quantify things like “MSM falsehoods” or “social/ideological climate” with any accuracy

    • Agree: Iris
    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
    , @Rurik
    , @Ron Unz
  455. Rurik says:
    @Ron Unz

    if many thousands of additional blacks soon begin dying by homicide as a consequence of the dishonest MSM treatment of the Floyd case, what exactly is the positive value of that dishonesty?

    the media has never given a damn about the schwartzes, except as weapons to use against the white society they hate so much.

    If all the blacks in Zimbabwe were to starve tomorrow, it wouldn’t bother George Soros in the least. They’ve accomplished what they set out to accomplish in Zimbabwe, and now the blacks are dispensable. Same with S. Africa just as it will be here in ZSUA.

    So the ‘positive value’ of hyping these types of crimes is always the racial strife- intended as an indictment of white society as racist and guilty, in order to undermine white self-respect and dignity. Making it easier to decimate and dissolve Western culture and values, by undermining the people who represent those values, so that they can further their absolute domination of the nation.

    (duh ; )

    When the media use their bullhorn to create race-hate (how many slavery movies do they make every year?), this has a debilitating effect (to say the least) on black people’s lives and well-being. When you wake up in the morning hating ‘whitey’, and go to bed at night hating whitey, and hating whitey every moment in between, this insidiously destroys your serenity and quality of life. Because they live in the West, and the West was created by whitey, for whitey.

    Now, if the media and government were interested in black people’s welfare, they’d tell blacks that they’re lucky to be here living in a white society, rather than the shitholes of Africa or Haiti or every other black run place. If you go to the welfare office, you’ll see teens in $800.00 tennis shoes, with morbidly obese mothers, driving late model cars, as they renew their EBT cards and get their new Obama phones.

    All while simmering with rancor in their souls for how much whitey has ruined their lives.

    The blacks weren’t always full of hate. There was a time, (I like to remember) back in the Seventies when black music was Motown and disco and soul and jazz, and they didn’t infuse their music with hate lyrics, but sang of love and peace.

    we’ve gone from this

    to this

    and all of it steered by our media elites.

    Do they care if they destroyed black people’s quality of life? Does Rahm Emanuel give a rat’s ass if a thousand blacks kill each other in a week in his city?

    No, they don’t care. They never cared about blacks or refugees or homos or anyone else, except insofar as supporting these groups, serves their eternal agenda, of burning down white society, so that they can build their own society on the ashes of what was once a great nation.

    WeimAmerica, in other words. ~ (As if.. with all due respect Mr. Unz- you didn’t already know all that ; )

  456. @AceDeuce

    Be prepared to hear, that there is no snow outside anywhere in – Minneapolis – or Minnesota – and the fact that you bring up something so obviously wrong just goes to show how moronic your reasoning is…
    (And this kind of attack would not come for no reason here. I.o. w. – you’re the AceDeuce – and really nailed what’s up in a straightforward and simple manner. Thanks!)

    • Thanks: AceDeuce
  457. Loup-Bouc says:
    @The Scalpel

    Well said, Mr. Scalpel.

    Please see my comment of June 10, 2020 at 9:48 pm GMT (comment # 470); and please reconsider my comments of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (comment # 282) and June 9, 2020 at 11:08 pm GMT (comment # 387).

    Mr. Unz’s bigotry has wrought a tragic waste high intelligence.

    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  458. Rurik says:
    @The Scalpel

    I’m sorry, but that sounds like complete bull**it to me. I don’t know how anyone could ever establish causality between those variables or even define or quantify things like “MSM falsehoods” or “social/ideological climate” with any accuracy

    since I’m here.. I’ll just say that I agree 100% with your moral qualms about choking people as a routine police tactic, and particularly the egregious disregard for Floyd’s dignity, well-being, and very life.

    You’re spot on, in my opinion. And good on you for it.

    But as to the last point, what, if not crazed, “social/ideological climate” did the MSM falsehoods over Travon and ‘Hands up, don’t shoot’ Michael Brown create in cities across this nation and beyond?

    Those were media lies and hysteria, intended to create a crazed ‘social/ideological climate’, and drive the blacks to violence and destruction. Just as the media hysteria over Floyd’s tragic death is intended to do.

    Yes, it was a criminal act of callous disregard for Floyd’s welfare, by professionals who ought to have known better, not to mention simply being a decent human being, means you don’t ignore a man’s pleas that he can’t breath, with your knee on his neck.

    But tragedies like this happen all the time. Cops murder people in even far worse cases of murder in the first degree, like I posted a video of, with a man lying in the snow, being tortured with a tazer, until he was simply murdered, deliberately, in cold blood, by a sadistic, power-crazed cop.

    Or the tragic torture-death of Freddy Grey.

    But those crimes, even worse than the terrible death of George Floyd, didn’t fit the narrative of ‘evil whitey is a racist and all blacks are victims’, so they waited until they found the perfect crime, with all the optics in perfect alignment – to suit and serve their eternal agenda.

    (it’s so ‘perfect’ in fact, that I and many others aren’t wondering if there’s more to it)

    And the whole point is to spin it and bullhorn it to the ends of the earth, in order to (as always) distort and alter the “social/ideological climate” – to better serve their agenda.

    Just like they did with 9/11, just like they did with ‘Russian collusion’, and the Ukraine idiocy, and every time you see one of them on the CNN or MSNBC or all the rest, talking and emoting and hectoring and moralizing.. they’re always doing so in order to steer the “social/ideological climate” to serve their supremacist agenda.

    And the tragic death of George Floyd is no different.

    It was a police brutality issue, that they’ve dishonestly turned into a racial issue. To suit, as always, as always, as always, ((((their)))) eternal agenda.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  459. FB says: • Website
    @Unorthodox Black Sheep VN

    I doubt that Ron Unz make the Unz Review not because he respect freedom of speech or believe people like John Derbyshire deserve a place to express their believe and opinion but because he want to run the website like a Human Freak Zoo (I hope I am truly wrong on my doubt).

    And from Scalpel at his reply to Mr Unz here…

    I am certainly OK with disagreeing with people, but when they distort and ignore evidence repeatedly, even after they are made aware of it, there is something wrong there.

    This site is your bully pulpit. I would hope that at a minimum, you respect that and try to be honest.

    A number of people here are starting to doubt Mr Unz and his honesty…including myself…

    It’s not surprising, as we see from a number of commenters who are puzzled about his behavior and cannot figure out what he really stands for…

    Does he in fact stand for anything at all…?

    Or is this website just game of some sort, a kind of psyop…?

    America today stands as one of the very few examples in history of a large and successful multiethnic society.

    If we are to continue and extend our success—which is hardly foreordained—we can only do so by returning to the core principles of Propositions 209 and 227: ethnic assimilation, and individual equality under the law.

    Otherwise, we face the very real threat of future movements along the lines of Proposition 187, each worse than the last, and on a national scale.

    There are few forces that could so easily break America as the coming of white nationalism.

    –Ron K Unz, 1999

    Is this the same Mr Unz we see commenting here today…?

    Does he still think that white nationalism will ‘break’ America…?

    Maybe the white nationalists that follow him here today would be interested in knowing where he really stands…?

    • Thanks: Loup-Bouc
    • Replies: @Rogue
  460. @Ron Unz

    So if many thousands of additional blacks will soon begin dying by homicide as a consequence of the dishonest MSM treatment of the Floyd case, what exactly is the positive value of that dishonesty?

    This is exactly the right question. George Floyd was a thuggish ex-con who died at police hands after 1) attempting to pass a bogus bill and then 2) resisting arrest. There’s a term for this guy: criminal L-O-S-E-R.

    The cop(s) responsible for Floyd’s accidental death are about to pay a very heavy price for their rough handling of the accused. Justice will certainly be done (perhaps excessively). It’s time to move forward and consider, once again, the Big Picture.

    What about the crooked cops who are black and the victims of police brutality who are white? For the sake of balance, shouldn’t the MSM look diligently there as well? (Fact: twice as many whites are gunned down by police every year than blacks, for instance. This is news!)

    These surprising facts should be examined. But they probably won’t be. This is a huge problem.

    Dishonest news can (and does) produce mayhem. Yet there’s no media accountability. None.

    What about the undiagnosed epidemic of media mendacity?

    It is certainly time that we got serious about the misinformation and demagoguery that pours into millions of passive households each and every night via television, don’t you think?

    Junk news can be deceptive, misleading, inflammatory, and false. But the damage it does is real. What not examine the impact of Fake/False news and identify its sources? Shouldn’t the disseminators pay some kind of a price?

    And since we’re shaming cops, shouldn’t we also be shaming criminals?

    Repeat after me: ‘Looters are scum. Worthless scum.’ Say it loud! Aren’t criminals part of the problem? (Like maybe a really big part?)

    And what about all the omitted news and information that is being deplatformed right now? The far left is conducting an organized and escalating assault on Free Speech and Expression. This is causing even more damage.

    Methinks that we have spent far too much time on one crime and one sleazy criminal. The Big Picture is ar more interesting and far more urgent. At stake is civilization itself.

    • Troll: Loup-Bouc, FB
  461. Absent from the chaos…’Who was in command?’

    Michael Brown: black police chief in Ferguson

    Eric Garner: black female sergeant on site.

    Freddie Gray: 3 of the 6 officers black, black police chief, black mayor, black DA…tried under a black judge, under a 2 term black president, and 2 black attorneys general.

    George Floyd: 3 of 4 the officers of ‘color’, Minneapolis black police chief.

    The ‘commander’ is ultimately responsible for everything that the unit/soldier does or fails to do.

    Training.

    Who were the deputy chiefs of training in these police departments?

    Why were they not fired?

    Why didn’t the black police chiefs hold them accountable for the bad training? Training re-evaluation?

    • Replies: @mark green
    , @Loup-Bouc
  462. @joe tentpeg

    black, blak, backity-black! So true. Where’s there’s smoke, there’s fire.

  463. ..blacks cannot function well in a modern society.

    That is the whole root of the problem right there, but nobody will say it.

  464. @Loup-Bouc

    Mr. Loo,

    This latest missive is clear, concise, and to the point. I knew you could do it! But alas, there is room for improvement.

    I admit that I commit typing/editing errors, because I never learned how to type (since, for nearly seven decades, I depended on a secretary) and my eyesight is to too poor to enable me to proofread, reliably, a text set on a computer screen.

    Has your secretary returned? Or did you spend the entire day pecking the keyboard with one finger?

    Mr. Unz, you are very intelligent, and you have authored very useful articles, like your “American Pravda: Our Coronavirus Catastrophe as Biowarfare Blowback?” [Unz Review (21 April 2020)]

    I want to offer more advice. Feel free to accept or ignore it, of course.

    Please consider the possibility that Mr. Unz is not impressed by gratuitous flattery. Some people, obsequious brown-nosers, believe flattery convinces others to take them seriously. While often true that flattery greases skids, such is not always the case.

    If Mr. Unz should take you seriously without justification others will spot it. That would diminish his credibility. Capische? In time, perhaps, you’ll write something worthy of his response.

    Please cease trying to defend Floyd’s killers with specious arguments. Floyd’s killers are indefensible. Your arguments pursue bigotry, not truth. You are disgracing yourself.

    I thought you were a professor of law, Mr. Loo.

    Do you realize how badly these four sentences have harmed your credibility and case?

    Just trying to be helpful here.

    Mend your muddled thinking and a scoop of vanilla w/chocolate-topping shall be your reward. 🙂 If you’re really good, I’ll make it a double-scoop with a cherry! 😉 🙂

    Thinking of you, Mr. Loo…

    Le Cretin

  465. Loup-Bouc says:
    @joe tentpeg

    Specious “argument.” The command responsibility relates to accountability of a department or a precinct. Rarely are commanders involved in particular stops or out-of-precinct arrests or home-break-ins.

    The stopping or arresting police bear the criminal-law and civil-rights law responsibility for the actual acts that constitute cops’ criminal assaults, criminal homicides, and criminal invasions of private places. Such liability-allocation is legally appropriate, fair, and a sound policy (sound PARTLY because otherwise law enforcement agencies might not be able to find competent commanders, since anyone really smart enough would not risk the liability-threat that would attend a rule that makes commanders legally liable for the acts of on-the-street, unsupervised acts of low-echelon cops).

    In Floyd’s and Garner’s cases the responsibility was that of the arresting officers, who were not commanders. In Garner’s case, the Black woman cop was relegated to a bystander-position, because the real power (physical power and customary police-hierarchy power) and legal power resided in the male White cops who committed the murder. The Black woman cop could not have done anything to stop the White cop murderers. She had to fear the consequences of her breaking the “Blue Line,” especially because she was a Black woman and the power-bearing line-members were White males.

    In the Michael Brown case, some low level Black officials behaved like balless punks. But the prosecutor was White, and he abused his office and violated his constitutional and legal duty by not making the criminal case that was clear and solid.

    Obama’s Attorney General, and Obama, were gilded Uncle Toms of the Black-despising Democrat elites (Clinton Democrats). But, still, the criminal and moral liability was that of the arresting cops, particularly the actuall Killer, Darren Wilson, who was a White male. Wilson murdered Brown. The blabbed some goody-goody crap to save their blackface-wearing faces. But they did NOTHING — except wipe their butts with the 13th amendment and the 42 U.S.C. 1983.

    I am NOT Black, and I do not like Black culture. But the matter is law, empathy, morality, and justice, not my personal taste.

    Sorry: reality, morals, and law cannot twist into the designed, hateful hallucinations of your bigot’s world.

  466. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Rurik

    It was a police brutality issue, that they’ve dishonestly turned into a racial issue. To suit, as always, as always, as always, ((((their)))) eternal agenda.

    See my comment of June 10, 2020 at 2:12 am GMT (comment # 401), and my other comments referenced there.

    I shall not argue the matter. In have argued it quite enough. You will chose to treat the evidence according to your bias, which is very likely unextinguisable and immutable.

  467. @Loup-Bouc

    Really now, Mr. Loo. This was uncalled for:

    Mr. Unz’s bigotry has wrought a tragic waste high intelligence.

    I’m shocked, I say, shocked that you, a professor of law, would stoop to such low characterizations of your host. Is that why you teach and not practice your profession?

    Please see my comment of June 10, 2020 at 9:48 pm GMT (comment # 470); and please reconsider my comments of June 9, 2020 at 1:04 am GMT (comment # 282) and June 9, 2020 at 11:08 pm GMT (comment # 387).

    I see you’re slipping, my friend. Please link to earlier comments or blockquote the central point you wish to make. Few people will scroll through reams of profundity in search of the gem. Time, signal-to-noise ratio, etc.

    Remember this: We lesser mortals are no longer in the classroom.

    When making a point it is advisable to follow the KISS philosophy: Keep It Simple, Stupid!

    Your friend,

    Monsieur Le Cretin

    • Replies: @Rogue
  468. Ron Unz says:
    @The Scalpel

    The case itself is certainly awful, but the thing that is frustrating here is what appears to be your willful ignorance and tendency to not disprove, but disregard any information that does not fit your bias.

    Well, we’ve gone back-and-forth on the facts of the Floyd case about five or six times now, and obviously neither of us will convince the other, so we’ll just have to disagree. One difference is that you seem quite certain in your verdict, while I have emphasized the opposite about mine.

    “the Ferguson Effect,” namely that MSM falsehoods about the death of a black at the hands of police often produce a social/ideological climate that results in major spikes in the black homicide rate.

    I’m sorry, but that sounds like complete bull**it to me.

    You have medical expertise, which I certainly do not. However, I do think I have a great deal of expertise in racial/ethnic issues and related social policies, which were the main focus of my research and writing from the early 1990s up until just the last few years. Frankly, I think I’ve written more widely in that topic area than almost anyone else who comes to mind, with the body of my work totaling hundreds of thousands of words, and some of my articles being quite influential. Here’s a link to some of my more important articles, which you can freely browse if you wish:

    https://www.unz.com/page/race-ethnicity-articles/

    Since you seem never to have heard of the “Ferguson Effect,” it doesn’t sound like you’ve focused much on these sorts of issues. The particular hypothesis was promoted by Heather Mac Donald and Steve Sailer, and although it’s been disputed, the evidence seems absolutely overwhelming to me. If you’re interested, here are links to a couple of Mac Donald’s articles:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2016/07/20/the-ferguson-effect/

    https://www.city-journal.org/html/ferguson-effect-lives-14919.html

    You can also Google “Ferguson Effect Steve Sailer unz” and get dozens of his posts on the subject.

    • Replies: @Loup-Bouc
  469. I wonder how many blacks are going to die in the coming months and years because of all this “anti-racism” hysteria. Thousands?

    Will there be a SUPER-Ferguson effect?

  470. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Ron Unz

    …I do think I have a great deal of expertise in racial/ethnic issues and related social policies, which were the main focus of my research and writing from the early 1990s up until just the last few years. Frankly, I think I’ve written more widely in that topic area than almost anyone else who comes to mind, with the body of my work totaling hundreds of thousands of words, and some of my articles being quite influential.

    So, your self-claimed expertise trumps evidence and logic.

    Since you seem never to have heard of the “Ferguson Effect,” it doesn’t sound like you’ve focused much on these sorts of issues. The particular hypothesis was promoted by Heather Mac Donald and Steve Sailer, and although it’s been disputed, the evidence seems absolutely overwhelming to me.

    (1) You do not know whether The Scalpel “never to have heard of the ‘Ferguson Effect’.” You are presumptuous and show, again, your penchant of arguing, fact-free, according to the need of your bigotry or your ego.

    (2) Prove that your preferred evidence “is overwhelming” — rebuts conclusively, or at least compellingly, the opposing evidence. Do not try to stand on your claim of greater expertise.

    (3) No “Ferguson Effect” exists, at least as you imagine it. Rather it is whatever way this or that political/socioeconomic group colors the Ferguson murder’s aftermath to propagandize for that groups interests.

    Ferguson was murdered by a White cop. His murder was not revenged because of the corruption of cowardice of vile politicians and officials. That wrong was never remedied because of the same cowardice and corruption. Blacks and decent Whites felt anger and despair for a while. The depraved elites and corrupt and cowardly politicians returned to “business as usual.” That is all, except, understandably Blacks never forgot.

    (4) McDonald and Sailer are stone bigots who conflate, disregard, and invent or hallucinate evidence to distort reality to a world where their bigotry is the “true” reality.

    McDonald is avowedly a pro-police, pro-security-state, anti-social-welfare ultra conservative racist. She insists that actual victims (even “boys”) are not victims. Her views consist with social Darwinism, which not only has no basis in Darwin’s science or in any evidence or logic, but also serves the quasi-genocidal goals of White supremacists and the greediest neoliberal capitalists, who act to oppress and impoverish all those whom powerful Whites and powerful neoliberal capitalists deem mere costs.

    Sailer is a White supremacist who contemns all Jews and Blacks as if they were rats infested by fleas carrying bubonic plague. His writings’ premises are purely toxic dross.

    Why do you embrace evil?

    • Agree: Menes
    • Troll: anonymous1963
  471. Rogue says:
    @Ron Unz

    But it’s absurd to charge the officer with second-degree murder.

    Agreed. The original 3rd degree murder charge was clearly more sensible. Entirely obvious it was changed to 2nd degree because of the huge eruption that has taken place.

  472. Rogue says:
    @FB

    I am a conservative. Specifically, a circa 1990 conservative.

    The political and social spectrums have moved so far left over the last couple of decades, that believing in entirely normal and taken for granted things of a generation ago can now get you labelled as far-right or extreme-right.

    Bonkers.

    I dislike the term White Nationalist for the simple reason that Whites are a race – loosely speaking – and not a single nation.

    Jared Taylor from Amren uses the term “White Identity.”

    That to me is a perfectly good way to describe Whites and their interests. After all, Blacks are not a monolithic race either, but they certainly do have Black identity.

    You seem to have an issue with Whites standing up for their own interests. Why? Every other race has no problem standing up for their own interests. Indeed, they proudly proclaim it.

    It is entirely possible to be a “White Nationalist” i.e standing up for the concerns of White people, and not be a White supremacist or hate other races.

  473. Rogue says:
    @Oldtradesman

    Ha ha, old Loopy Doop has really gotten to you. Lol.

    Mind you, I like your stuff.

    Better than Loop’s tedious sludge, anyway.

  474. @Loup-Bouc

    Sailer is a White supremacist who contemns all Jews and Blacks as if they were rats infested by fleas carrying bubonic plague.

    Steve Sailer is one of the Jew-friendliest persons here at Unz, second only, perhaps, to John Derbyshire. Here is an example of Sailer seeing anti-semitism where it is debatable:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/will-black-anti-semitism-once-again-undermine-the-latest-peak-black-moment/

    For what it’s worth, Steve Sailer claims to be of Jewish descent on one side of his biological ancestry (he was raised by Catholic adoptive parents). He says that it explains his early affinity with Milton Friedman.

    • Replies: @Iris
    , @Loup-Bouc
  475. AceDeuce says:
    @Truth

    Uh, Bobby Seale is not and has not been a “representative”.

    I’m guessing you’re thinking Bobby Rush.

    Oh, and he’s a POS.

    And as far as the other guy talking about how drugs “were introduced” into the groid community in the 60s:

    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!! Just read Manchild in the Promised Land or the autobio of noted homosexual Malcolm X. Blechpipo have been tokin’ and snortin’ and shootin’ up for a long time now. Up until the 60s, they were they only ones–must have been part of their “Gotta work twice as hard to get half as far” regimen.

  476. Iris says:
    @Brás Cubas

    Steve Sailer is one of the Jew-friendliest persons here at Unz, second only, perhaps, to John Derbyshire.

    You forgot Anatoli Karlin and Paul Kersy, who are super-Israel firsters too, but think they are too subtle for the reader to notice.

    • Replies: @vot tak
  477. @MarkinLA

    Yep. We’re starting to see riots with looting that aren’t even associated with any protest, as well. This seems to be a standard feature of “the new normal”. Once police departments are replaced with social justice enforcement agencies, the terms will be changed so that riots and looting will be classified as “maintaining order”.

  478. Corvinus says:
    @thordaddy

    “You can perform this BASIC detainment technique AND SEE FOR YOURSELF the results.”

    Indeed, it leads to someone’s death when employed for 9 minutes. So much for your “bouncer” expertise.

  479. @acementhead

    Song is funny, thanks, didn’t know it!

  480. @thordaddy

    It is really astounding that the basic fact, that there are two arteries leading up to one’s head, is mentioned practically nowhere in this George Floyd case.

    Btw. – this might well be a good reason, that neck-arrest with an arm is the method, that causes more accidental harm than the knee on kneck technique of the arrest.

    And if that’d be right, I’d have to say again: Hardly mentioned anywhere.

  481. @Bardon Kaldian

    The Schweitzer quote seems entirely bogus. See here:

    https://bantueducation.blogspot.com/2008/07/schweitzer-cleared-of-racism-for-now.html

    If one cannot make a case without this nonsense, why bother? Possible answers are left as an exercise for the reader.

    • Replies: @Bardon Kaldian
  482. Loup-Bouc says:
    @Brás Cubas

    Thank you for referring me to the Steve Sailer article “Will Black Anti-Semitism Once Again Short-Circuit the Latest Peak Black Moment?” But I do not see in it what you seem to suggest you see.

    Some Blacks hate Jews. Some Blacks appreciate Jews. In our current raving “Black Lives Matter” protest situation, one can expect that the Jew-hating Blacks will dominate. But that observation does not imply that the observer is a Zionist or loves or deifies Jews.

    I am told that Sailer has made a point of the fact that the mean “Jewish” IQ (113) is markedly higher than the mean “White” IQ (100) and very markedly higher (28 to 43 points higher) than the range of mean Black IQs (70-85).

    But I have read antisemite texts that use that fact against Jews. I cannot cite one now, and I have decided that this will be my final comment on this thread, because of my professional obligations and because I cannot imagine being able to say more here without committing the sin of redundancy.

    But again, thank you, for the reference and for the dispassionate and civilized tone of your reply comment.

    • Replies: @mark green
  483. Loup-Bouc says:

    Yes. I did say, today (11 June 2020) that I decided not to post another comment on this thread. See my comment of June 11, 2020 at 7:26 pm GMT (comment # 500). But I happened upon a Sputnick article that deserves being linked here:
    https://sputniknews.com/us/202006111079587909-i-dont-care-us-man-dies-in-police-custody-after-telling-cops-i-cant-breathe—graphic-video-/

    Res ipsa loquitur.

    • Replies: @vot tak
  484. turtle says:
    @Oldtradesman

    The former First Basilisk hails from Oak Park, IL
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oak_Park,_Illinois
    Daddy made enough money to send her to Wellesley College
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wellesley_College
    where she evidently became a pseudo-disciple of various Marxists, including some resident @ U. of Chicago, learned enough of the lingo to give a “pretend student radical” speech @ her graduation in 1968.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Chicago
    U of C is in Hyde Park
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyde_Park,_Chicago
    Just south of Hyde Park is Woodlawn
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodlawn,_Chicago#Present-day_Woodlawn
    which is home to these fine folks:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almighty_Black_P._Stone_Nation

    My comments:
    It’s a long way from Oak Park to Hyde Park, and an even longer (cultural) journey from Hyde Park to Woodlawn. I don’t know what it is like these days, but in the early 1970s. Hyde Park was a very dangerous place. anyone. white or black, put his/her life at risk just by stepping outside.

    Woodlawn, in those days, was a place no sane white person was likely to venture.

    So, if Hillary is looking for credibility, I suggest she move to Woodlawn, say 79th & Stony island
    https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2019/11/16/2-men-shot-on-79th-street-near-stony-island-avenue/
    and get in the habit of taking a stroll after dark, wearing jewelry.
    Alone, unarmed, and without a bodyguard.

    • Agree: Oldtradesman
    • Replies: @Oldtradesman
  485. Dannyboy says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    Ferguson was murdered by a White cop. His murder was not revenged because of the corruption of cowardice of vile politicians and officials.

    Hey Professor Froot Loup, Ferguson is the name of the PLACE where that stupid nigger was made good. Brown was the stupid nigger’s actual name. Got it?

    Having any luck with finding a nice place in West Baltimore?

    https://www.zillow.com/homes/West-Baltimore_rb/

    There you go Boss Man. Have at it.

    Think of the money you’ll save. And you get to live among some of the finest human beings on the Planet. You should get together with EliteCommie and Cuckvinus, they have expressed interest in putting their money where their big hypocrite mouths are as well.

    • LOL: mark green
  486. vot tak says:
    @Loup-Bouc

    Saw that article and was going tp post here in boogaloo-butt-bro-ville. The police problem in the usa remains pervasive. These are criminals let off the leash, now. Literally.

    The zionazi-gay freakshow is very upset the untermenschen are resisting their occupation forces. They are going all out first trying to de-legitimize opposition to their zionazi-nazi occupation force and on the other hand working to co-op this anti-authoritarian movement. That’s how the western right works. The litterally buggered/buggering things are trying every psywar tactic in their how to manuels to keep things in zionazia as they were.

    • Replies: @Dannyboy
  487. turtle says:
    @Rurik

    all white people are ‘racists and anti-Semites’.

    Yeah, so?

    Even if true (which it manifestly is not), so what?
    Life is what it is.
    Deal with it.
    If you are incapable of dealing with it, check out.
    Very few will miss you.

  488. @The Scalpel

    No. He could have ingested the powder. Which is what he would have done if he was trying to get rid of the evidence. Powder swallowed. 15 minutes later he ODs

    • Agree: Dieter Kief
    • Replies: @vot tak
  489. @Oldtradesman

    Hillary’s voice is so relaxed and – thick – there is this drawl – some small unmotivated and off-beat delays, too – so, that sounds as if she would not have been quite sober when she gave that speech.

  490. vot tak says:
    @Iris

    Well, that is 4 white supremacists (sailor, derbyshire, karlin & kersey) who are also zionazis.

  491. vot tak says:
    @restless94110

    And your sacred cops, suspecting he may have swallowed an excessive amount of drugs decided it would be a good idea to sit on him and choke him till long after he stopped breathing to make sure he od’d properly.

    • Replies: @restless94110
  492. vot tak says:
    @Ron Unz

    “But it’s absurd to charge the officer with second-degree murder.”

    Why do you think you are better qualified to determine what charges should be brought against the murderers than the attorneys prosecuting the case are?

    Four takeaways from Ellison’s decision to prosecute the three other ex-MPD officers, add 2nd-degree murder charge against Chauvin

    https://www.minnpost.com/metro/2020/06/five-takeaways-from-ellisons-decision-to-prosecute-the-three-other-ex-mpd-officers-add-2nd-degree-murder-charge-against-chauvin/

    “I believe the evidence available to us now supports the stronger charge of second-degree murder,” for Chauvin, Ellison said Wednesday afternoon. At his side was Hennepin County Attorney Mike Freeman, whose office is assisting in the prosecution.”

    • Replies: @Iris
  493. @turtle

    So, if Hillary is looking for credibility, I suggest she move to Woodlawn, say 79th & Stony island
    https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2019/11/16/2-men-shot-on-79th-street-near-stony-island-avenue/
    and get in the habit of taking a stroll after dark, wearing jewelry.
    Alone, unarmed, and without a bodyguard.

    I agree.

    I’ll go further. Wearing jewelry is unnecessary; Hillary’s skin color and physical features provide sufficient enticement.

    • Agree: turtle
  494. @vot tak

    Swami mind reader vot tak:

    1. They ain’t my sacred cops, what’s wrong with you, man?
    2. Now how would you know what your sacred cops suspected? What’s wrong with you, man?
    3. The cops decided to subdue a 260 pound felon who was resisting arrest and sat on the guy in order to prevent him from continuing to resist arrest. What’s wrong with you, man?
    4. He was not choked and continued to act for the cameras breathing deeply while saying I can’t breathe, while breathing. The knee on neck procedure is taught and approved by the Minneapolis PD. What’s wrong with you, man?
    5. Now how would you know that a cop wanted a detained resisting violently strong man to OD? What is wrong with you, man?

    Calm down, Swami. And get help.

  495. @The Scalpel

    I notice Mr. Scalpel is like so many tin-horn ” experts” when reasonable alternate theories to his own are put forth, he ignores them.

    Ingesting powder subverts your “expert” narrative, and is most likely to have happened out of all the theories, including and especially your own.

  496. Dannyboy says:
    @vot tak

    The “White Supremacists” have obtained exclusive footage of our boy vot tak posting on Unz.com.

    [MORE]

    You are quite a high strung chap with obvious anger issues as well as an unhealthy obsession for homosexual imagery/sodomy.

    My recommendation would be to seek counseling and/or medication immediately, and then possibly channel some of that negative energy into spreading the word that BLACK LIVES MATTER.

    It’s quite clear that the majority of the monkeys in the various “primate dens” formally known as American cities haven’t gotten the memo yet.

    https://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2020/06/11/tyra-phillips-weaa-killed-shooting-latest/

    http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/bs-md-ci-cr-thursday-crime-20200611-t2jusxxhibfutj5x64dobsfx5e-story.html

    LOL

    • Troll: Iris
  497. Iris says:
    @vot tak

    Thomas Lane, one of the police officers involved in the death of George Floyd, has been released on bail after $750,000 were raised online from the public in sympathy to his family suggesting that Lane did everything in his power to try and save Floyd’s life.

    In his legal statement, Lane declared that his asked several time Chauvin to roll Floyd’s body to the side in a protective posture posture. It was something that Chauvin refused to do; TMZ reports that the prosecutors in charge of investigating the case have confirmed this information.

    Lane’s family added that he also is the one who called the ambulance before George Floyd lost consciousness, and even he who, once the ambulance was there, began performing a heart massage in an attempt to save Floyd’s life, then on the brink of death.

    Thomas Lane was the only other “White” in the team of four policeman.

    It is beyond common sense that anybody in their right mind could defend, excuse or minimise Derek Chauvin’s actions. While Chauvin represents only himself, not the Whites and not even the police forces as a whole, defending the disgusting and callous actions that lead to Floyd’s death just beggars belief .

    Or maybe this is deliberate all along: defend the morally indefensible makes sense to set up Whites against Black and trigger the war of all against all, Bellum omnium contra omnes.

    • Thanks: Biff
    • Replies: @vot tak
  498. vot tak says:
    @Iris

    I saw lane had been released on bail, but I didn’t know that information about his actions during the murder. If true, he probably should be acquitted.

  499. vot tak says:

    ‘Breonna’s Law’: Louisville bans ‘no-knock search warrants’ after police killed black woman during night raid on her home

    https://www.rt.com/usa/491601-breonna-taylor-police-law/

    “The city of Louisville, Kentucky has banned police from invading homes without announcing their presence. This tactic prompted protests after plainclothes officers killed a black woman while raiding her apartment.

    Three plainclothes narcotics detectives had this type of warrant when they arrived in the middle of the night at the apartment of a young black paramedic, Breonna Taylor, in March.

    Taylor’s boyfriend, Kenneth Walker, who was at home with her during the raid, took his gun and fired at the officer after mistaking him for a robber, according to his lawyer. The officers returned fire and fatally shot Taylor. No drugs were found at her apartment.”

    Oh, oh. The boogaloo likeitupthebuttskys are not going to be happy about that.

  500. @Jamie_NYC

    Fentanyl doesn’t do what you think it does. Meth does. And testing positive doesn’t mean it was currently affecting his heart in that instance. In fact, Fentanyl would have decreased the workload on his heart under a stressful situation, in general. But what do I know, I only give it every day as part of my job in the OR.

  501. @Anonymous Coward 3265

    No, Schweitzer quote is exact. I’ve seen in past few years attempts to deny its veracity, but they all failed (the link you provided being one of the examples). I am not trying to beat around the bush or to deflect to other similar quotes. What is at stake is: did he really wrote it or not?

    1. Schweitzer foundation never explicitly denied it.

    2. it can be found in first – not later, revised editions of his African Notebooks.

    3. earlier versions are not available for general inspection & Schweitzer fans- instead of publishing them for the general public- are continually using red-herrings to point to other , marginal issues or aver that he’d been a man of his times.

    I didn’t care whether he actually wrote it or not. It doesn’t change my stance on the issue a bit (for me, Schweitzer was deluded for most of his life). Just, the Internet SJWs have contorted themselves out of any rational discourse/normal shape to show that their saint had not said that.

    So, givens pros & cons- he wrote it.

    https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=340008

    http://crimesofthetimes.blogspot.com/2012/11/albert-schweitzer-and-his-controversial.html

    https://books.google.hr/books?id=vAJADwAAQBAJ&pg=PA100&lpg=PA100&dq=schweitez+sub-race+devour&source=bl&ots=Dum1VaVnl4&sig=ACfU3U2xOqptNyeuAh0fHpAnatgFOgtZXQ&hl=hr&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi4sN_Ssv3pAhXs0qYKHWwbCQ8Q6AEwAHoECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q=schweitez%20sub-race%20devour&f=false

    • Replies: @Anonymous Coward 3265
  502. TJM says: • Website

    Great essay by Fred Reed. He’s right on all points. Perhaps tribalism is always triumphant. Governments are always corrupt and self serving. So what is a civilized human being to do?

  503. Iris: “It is beyond common sense that anybody in their right mind could defend, excuse or minimise Derek Chauvin’s actions. ”

    Chauvin’s evident composure while killing Floyd should tell everyone that cops do this all the time. Chauvin had no fear that he would be interrupted by the other cops, since he was just following their normal procedure for pacifying troublesome individuals. Inflicting brain damage with a chokehold kept on too long on someone they’ve taken a particular dislike to is all in a day’s work for these cowards. In truth, there is little that differentiates a badge nigger from the garden variety like Floyd. Both kinds have no respect for the law. Both kinds are cowards, and prefer to attack in packs, not one on one. Cops will beat you, but will first put you in handcuffs so you can’t fight back. They are truly swine, completely deserving the epithet “pigs”.

    Of course, they will always say it’s an accident when they murder someone in the course of their “duties”. Randy Weaver’s wife? Oh, an accident. Bob Mathews burned alive? Another accident. Waco, with many children incinerated? Oopsie! Sure didn’t mean to do that!

    Murderous, bloodthirsty, sadistic scum. That’s the boys in blue.

    • Replies: @FB
    , @Twodees Partain
  504. @Bardon Kaldian

    Mr. Kaldian:

    You say, “What is at stake is: did he really wrote [sic] or not?”. A very clear and precise summary of the question. I have no issue with that much.

    I agree also that whether Schweitzer wrote it or not does not of itself make the statement itself necessarily true or false. But the question before us is did he write it?

    Normal procedure for quotations from printed books is author, title and page number at a minimum; a full citation will contain more. You say that it is only in the first edition; a useful and necessary detail. I have myself seen “controversial” statements edited out of later editions of books by reasonably well-known authors (Mencken comes to mind).

    As to your citations about the quote, The Straight Dope basically said the quote cannot be located. “Crimes of the Times” quotes Schweitzer in a different work affirming the need for a “social interval” between whites and Africans, but not your quotation. Your third citation to The Legacies of Albert Schweitzer Reconsidered gives the quote, but no page or edition.

    So we are nearly where we began.

    Perhaps he did write it. But no one, yourself included, seems to be able to provide an ordinary standard citation to it. You may say all this is simple pedantry; perhaps so. But the fact that the sources you do provide do not support your assertion does not inspire confidence.

    At some point one must ask what is being served by all this. You may continue to assert the validity of the quotation; I will remain more than a little skeptical. Others may draw what conclusions they wish.

    regards,

    Anonymous Coward 3265

  505. @Anonymous Coward 3265

    How about referencing reality for whether it could be true? He got of of there alive. Many recent aid workers have been killed over there. But some were spies so I guess that is understandable.

    • Replies: @Anonymous Coward 3265
  506. FB says: • Website
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    In truth, there is little that differentiates a badge nigger from the garden variety like Floyd. Both kinds have no respect for the law.

    Absolutely true…police in the US are light years removed from civilized countries…although things seem to be going downhill in many places…

    Look at Britain…police killings are practically unheard of…the same is true even in China…US cops kill over 1,000 civilians EACH YEAR…that’s insane…

    Thanks for your comments about cops deliberately inflicting brain damage with these chokeholds…that is so medieval that one has to wonder why these kinds of sadists haven’t been rooted out of the gene pool yet…

    It’s absolutely true that permanent brain damage results from cutting off blood flow for any length of time…I’m reminded of the case of a soldier some years ago who was up on misconduct charges, having committed war crimes against civilians in Africa…

    Well the word was they were going to make an example of this asshat, so he decided to off himself…only his attempt to hang himself didn’t work, and he ended up pretty much a vegetable…

    And we have cops going around and doing this to people…that’s pretty fucking scary…and who pays the cost for these victims becoming wards of the state…how much does that cost…in fact how much damage do these cops cause all round…in settlements to victims and many other social costs…the retarded fascists on this website don’t want to think about all that…

    • Replies: @Biff
    , @vot tak
  507. FB says: • Website
    @Anonymous Coward 3265

    Thanks…it’s not very hard to poke holes in the uneducated nonsense that floats around here, from all the usual retards…

  508. anon[335] • Disclaimer says:
    @obwandiyag

    Explain Breonna Taylor to me. Come on. Let’s see you brilliant assholes take a shot at it. You’ve already been proved absolutely wrong beyond the shadow of a doubt about Floyd. Now let’s see you go for Taylor. It’ll be hilarious watching you squirm like you’re doing right now.

    Breonna Taylor was wrongfully killed by over-aggresive cops. Nobody’s squirming with the explanation.
    Tamir Rice was wrongfully killed by over-aggresive cops. Nobody’s squirming with the explanation.
    Alton Sterling got what he had coming – good riddance.
    Keith Lamont Scott was a vicious criminal and got what he had coming – good riddance.
    Sandra Bland hanged herself – not my problem.
    Eric Garner killed himself resisting arrest – not my problem.
    Michael Brown attacked a cop and tried to take his gun – good riddance.
    George Floyd killed himself resisting arrest and taking drugs, and the cop should have been more careful keeping track of how his prisoner was doing – that’s the way it goes.

    Every case is different, dummy.

  509. @Anonymous Coward 3265

    Your third citation to The Legacies of Albert Schweitzer Reconsidered gives the quote, but no page or edition.

    Of course there is, having in mind delicacy of the situation, not a definite proof. I doubt we can get it. But circumstantial evidence points that he actually wrote it, and I mean considering the sources available to us from the Internet.

    1. his foundation had never denied it, which is, given the sensational nature of the citation- strange

    2. one readily available book, The Legacies … is widely acclaimed & basically pro-Schweitzer. It is not some obscure pamphlet.

    And in this book we see that Schweitzer is quoted as if he actually said/wrote it.

    In my view, there is enough evidence that he did it. Perhaps n