“The relationship between Russia and the Ukraine, the border location between Russia and Ukraine, and even the existence of an independent Ukraine are all practically speaking a matter of perfect indifference to the US and EU, but somehow the US, EU and NATO all inserted themselves into the question”

Straight up gaslighting on your part.

The US, EU, and NATO have long considered the existence of an independent Ukraine and the inviolability of its internationally recognized borders a non-negotiable principle of international law. Russia's attempted annexations of Ukrainian territory in 2014 and 2022 violate this principle and set a dangerous precedent for the use of military force to seize territory. And Russia's attempts to undermine Ukraine's sovereignty by blocking its closer integration with the EU and NATO is seen as a direct challenge to the principle of self-determination.

“until global thermonuclear war is back on the table, something we otherwise gratefully shelved three decades ago.”

Fearmonger fallacy—where someone tries to persuade an audience by instilling fear of negative consequences rather than by using logical reasons or evidence.

Replies: @kaganovitch

When I was young, liberal environmentalists worried about overpopulation and its effects on the environment. Then, when most population growth started coming from non-White immigration, they couldn't bring themselves to oppose it because opposing it would put them on the same side as conservatives who opposed uncontrolled non-White immigration.

As someone who is a conservative but also a nature lover, I plan to go hiking and enjoy being in nature tomorrow. I am fortunate to live right adjacent to a state park, Harrison State Park. The park is named after the only one of us Hoosiers, Benjamin Harrison, to become president. Harrison State Park contains the largest forested area left in central Indiana.

Replies: @J.Ross, @rebel yell

Everyday tastes from high-brow to low-brow are classified on chart [1949]
 

Replies: @Pericles, @Almost Missouri, @J.Ross, @Mr. Anon

If we hadn’t got W in 2000, we would have gotten Gore, with the same trajectory for the nation. I recall watching those two shrill frat boys debate and knew our republic was in peril. 2008 was a bad time, but we stumbled on to 2015, when gay marriage was discovered in the Constitution. 2020 gave us Covid, a stolen election and the Black! Cultural Revolution, along with swamping the country with the dregs of the world.

It’s like watching a gut-shot squirrel thrashing around until it bleeds out.

Replies: @J.Ross, @epebble

"What job are you going to get otherwise that you actually won’t get, regardless of your qualifications? What house would you otherwise get? Maybe we’re all cowards... But there exist people, like Trump, who are trying to fix this. Our ancestors and our descendents want us to try to fix it."

Well it all I think goes back to dishonesty, and also to the basic human problem that there is always a lot of ruin in a successful system which has begun winding down, but people tend not to notice it until it's too late. Look at the difference between the T'ang and the Sung (nobody ever tells you that An Lu-shan was really a Turk, viz a foreigner, not Han, and that this might matter); or the "fitna" which collapsed the otherwise brilliant Cordoba caliphate, and left it to be eaten alive by the petty kingdoms of Christian Galicia to the north and thus eventually to the rise of Isabella.

J. Ross put his finger on 2008, which is the sort of epicenter of the hurricane of dishonesty which began with the ascent of the ridiculous buffoon George W. Bush in 2000. The absolute disgraceful parade of stupidity and dishonesty began with that jackass and his gang of clownery. Sure, we have hollowed out, sold out, and dis-assembled the greatest industrial undercarriage in human history, but we will now get rich selling each other over-valued houses, giving nonsense loans to illegal Latino paupers and negro imbeciles, and selling off our painstakingly-developed social and cultural capital and real estate to cynical mooching foreigners. Yeah, that'll work.

So that was the bubble that popped for the first time in 2008, which even the Scarecrow from the Wizard of Oz could have seen coming years before, but it was just one part of the silliest clown show one has ever seen: the absurd response to 9/11, the ridiculous and criminal Iraq war, the turbo-drive immigration, the annihilation of any sort of coherence in the culture, it goes on and on. All of it driven by a hidden power structure composed of people who are at heart foreigners, who hate this country and its people and who have no interest in its long-term well-being. Well go figure.

Lie down with dogs, get up with Jews.

Replies: @Old Prude

Quite the contrary.
 

Replies: @deep anonymous, @J.Ross, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Curle

Many people find her a serious person. She lives in Poland, to which Putin sent drones the other day.

I’m not surprised you don’t. That’s why I’ve largely abandoned this place.

You’re going to tell me she invented stories about Ukraine making drones and using them to good effect against Russia?

https://abcnews.go.com/amp/International/ukrainian-drones-attack-moscow-eve-trump-zelenskyy-meeting/story?id=125842375

Replies: @J.Ross

It is completely baseless to call Murray an unqualified author. Here are his credentials:

Education: Harvard University (BA)
Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MA, PhD)

Thesis: Investment and Tithing in Thai Villages: A Behavioral Study of Rural Modernization (1974)

He has written three well researched scholarly tomes:

Notable works:
Losing Ground (1984)
The Bell Curve (1994)
Coming Apart (2012)

All have copious references.

In my opinion, the greatness of work in The Bell Curve comes from its ability to predict what it never intended. His placing (many) Asians on the right-side of Whites on the Bell Curve captures the history of 21st century in one picture.

Replies: @J.Ross, @Mark G.

“I think it is fair to call it a NATO proxy war.”

Which deprives Ukraine of its agency and suggests it is merely a pawn in a larger geopolitical game. The Ukrainian government and its people made the sovereign decision to resist Russian aggression. It called for military assistance from outside places to defend their nation. Remember, Russia is the aggressor.

Replies: @Old Prude

Actually they could, environmentalists were self-explanatorily anti-immigrant, but there was a very specific moment when a homosexual billionaire donor convinced the Sierra Club and/or the NRDC to drop opposition to open borders in exchange for money.

Replies: @Dmon

It's amusing even if disappointing that you're actually trying to argue Nuland's actions in Ukraine had anything to do with her Ukrainian ancestry. Does 4chan not believe in coincidences? Hillary Clinton must have Libyan ancestry. Is Hunter Biden Ukrainian?

Replies: @J.Ross

When I was young, liberal environmentalists worried about overpopulation and its effects on the environment. Then, when most population growth started coming from non-White immigration, they couldn't bring themselves to oppose it because opposing it would put them on the same side as conservatives who opposed uncontrolled non-White immigration.

As someone who is a conservative but also a nature lover, I plan to go hiking and enjoy being in nature tomorrow. I am fortunate to live right adjacent to a state park, Harrison State Park. The park is named after the only one of us Hoosiers, Benjamin Harrison, to become president. Harrison State Park contains the largest forested area left in central Indiana.

Replies: @J.Ross, @rebel yell

Did you even read the article?

Replies: @J.Ross

Didn't he also thank the US for blowing up the Nordstream pipeline right after it happened?

Replies: @J.Ross

Hitler was not obligated by Tripartite Pact to declare war on America, in the event if Japan attacked first.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_declaration_of_war_against_the_United_States

Japan was not "provoked by Jews" to invade China in 1937, which escalated later to the Pacific War. America was a quasi-ally to Japan during its invasion of China from 1937-1940.

America and Britain were also allies to Japan in Russo-Japanese War and WWI, during which they aided Japan to invade and rob Germans of their colony in Qingdao.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/46/BritishTroopsArriveTsingtao1914.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Tsingtao

These degenerate white niggers are themselves the worst subversives that they accuse others of being.

Replies: @Dmon, @Achmed E. Newman, @Torna atrás, @Torna atrás

I was going to pass over this in silence, as approvingly quoting neocon warmonger Anne Applebaum might be considered embarrassing. Out of concern for you, I didn't want to call attention to it. OTOH, given your position in the beating heart of mainstream Canada, maybe intra-NATO comity obliges a reply after all.

Yes, drones are now a crucial weapon on both sides. And I suppose many drones undergo final assembly in Ukraine and there may even be some injection-molding plants in Ukraine that can make plastic propellers or whatnot, but the important drone components, such as the sine qua non of drones—their digital brains, are 100% imported, and anyway both the domestic production and the imports are funded with NATO money, or as you call it "EU funds". Even as the US may decline to fund its own government next month, the US and NATO are paying Ukrainian government and military salaries and even buying Ukrainian farmers their seeds and fertilizer (Ukraine used to be a huge fertilizer exporter).

Without NATO, this war, whether drone, infantry, or armor, would already be long over. When the war only exists because of NATO, and at this point the government, military, farms and fertilizers only exist because of NATO, I think it is fair to call it a NATO proxy war.

Additionally, Ukrainian-NATO drone attacks blowing up petroleum plants and airports within Russia's interior may seem like a clever technical achievement, but consider that there are now unidentified drone probes of petroleum plants and airports within NATO's interior. Then consider what happens if Russia decides to go full sauce-for-the-gander. Will flaming oil platforms in the North Sea and flaming airports in Jutland lead to Ukrainian victory? Or will it force a stark choice on NATO: settle now or launch WWIII?

You and I are far from the front lines so far. My idea of progress doesn't involve bringing the front lines to us.

Replies: @J.Ross, @Frau Katze, @Corvinus

Yes, German Jews—even deported German Jews—survived at higher rates than eastern Jews. As you say, being more prosperous and educated undoubtedly helped, but also I think being in Germany, German citizens, and speaking German helped too, both because German Jews were more aware of the political situation, and because as their friends and neighbors, gentile Germans didn't necessarily perceive familiar German Jews as an existential threat in the same way that they could be persuaded that alien Bolshevik Jews were.

For example, in the memoir of a German SS soldier there was an unintentionally amusing passage where the young recruit, home on leave, encounters his Jewish neighbor and offers a pleasant greeting. He is nonplussed when his neighbor grouchily responds with something like, "Well it's not such a nice day for the Jews!", because it simply hasn't occurred to the SS man that becoming part of the Nazi army might redound to the disadvantage of his Jewish neighbor. It was the Bolshevik threat over the horizon that was on his mind.

Modern pop historiography likes to recast WWII as the battle between the Nazis and the Jews, but most of the people actually fighting it didn't look at it that way.

Replies: @J.Ross

A lot of the German left did not take Hitler seriously at first. See "Round Heads and Pointy Heads" by Bertoldt Brecht.

Also, the Communists refused to unite with the Social Democrats against the Nazis.

Replies: @Loyalty is The First Law of Morality, @J.Ross, @YetAnotherAnon

List?

Replies: @J.Ross

Not intending to be pedantic, but no.

West Germany was officially known as the BRD (Bundesrepublik Deutschland), which translates to FRG (Federal Republic of Germany).

East Germany was the DDR (Deutsche Demokratische Republik), which translates to GDR (German Democratic Republic).

Replies: @J.Ross, @MEH 0910

Well, using that VPN anyway...

https://www.unz.com/isteve/im-blocked-at-the-five-guys-hamburger-stand-in-hackensack/#comment-3265450

Replies: @J.Ross

There was a tarantula in the breezeway at the horse barn dog wasn't real sure about it but I moved it along, it's mating season for them he's like the rest of us just looking for a little love.

Replies: @J.Ross

What are you using for your working fluid? In nuclear sub systems it's (or was) liquid sodium - transfers heat like the dickens because it's a metal. Whatever is in touch with the reacting material, as the working fluid, gets radioactive. Are you confused on that steam is a phase of water?

Why don't you explain this system to me, John Johnson, or embed a nice diagram?

Really, it's not necessarily that you are wrong, but you just don't know squat.

Replies: @J.Ross, @epebble

"The GDR in the 1980s"

The GDR in the 1980s shot and killed people trying to leave. Would you pick a prison over freedom for free medical care? Over three million people had fled Marxist East Germany by 1961, causing the Berlin Wall to be built. Between 1961 and 1989 over a hundred people died trying to get over it while five thousand successfully made their escape.

In Boswana, they have strict immigration controls because of too many people wanting to come in. Their problem is people trying to get in and not out so they do not shoot people trying to leave. Botswana now has close to the same average life expectancy as East Germany had in the eighties, with improving life expectancy and medical care in recent years. East Germany had already existing medical infrastructure and trained doctors from its pre-Marxist days but under Marxism the medical infrastructure slowly deteriorated and a doctor shortage slowly worsened since so many were trying to escape.

Replies: @J.Ross

You're in official "making shit up as you go" mode. I suggest uninstalling that egalitarian programming that came free with your operating system.

Replies: @J.Ross

"GDR"

In the eighties there was a serious shortage of needed medicines in the GDR, with many patients dying before they could get it. Because of this, the government encouraged citizens to get medicine from relatives or Church Charities in the West. There was also a shortage of medical equipment like dialysis machines. Dental drills were so outdated that dental treatment was an ordeal.

There was also a shortage of doctors because many of them who visited the West stayed. The government then banned them from leaving the country but this just caused them to leave illegally. Patients were often in poor health. Alcohol consumption quadrupled from the sixties to the eighties as many unhappy East Germans turned to alcohol because of their miserable lives.

Of course, there was a separate and better medical system for the Marxist bigwigs running things. Under Marxism all people are equal but, as Animal Farm put it, some are more equal than others.

Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease, @John Johnson, @J.Ross

It collapsed in 2008, the craziness is both the efforts of trying to pretend that it didn't and the predictable effects (young men turning to violence because what, why not? What job are you going to get otherwise that you actually won't get, regardless of your qualifications? What house would you otherwise get? Maybe we're all cowards and the violent are actually the best among us but born at the wrong time?) of this collapse. But there exist people, like Trump, who are trying to fix this. Our ancestors and our descendents want us to try to fix it.

Replies: @Hail, @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Almost Missouri

This past weekend, a Hispanic political activist (?) called Anibal Hernandez Santana, a.k.a. Al Santana, shot at the ABC tv-station in Sacramento in protest against the apparent cancellation of Jimmy Kimmel. (Fired at ABC tv-station, September 19; arrested, September 20).

Al Santana labels himself a "Health Lawyer | Policy Advisor | Veteran."

The following are Al Santana's most-recent tweets [@AlHSantana], from the week of September 10 - September 20:

____

This is Blasphemy. can't believe these Republicans sucking up to their own twisted show. Besides, St Paul of Tarsus WAS the 13th disciple. White Moronic man...🤦‍♂️

QUOTE: Rep. Troy Nehls: “If Charlie Kirk lived in Biblical times, he'd have been the 13th disciple."
 

 

Where is a good heart attack when we need it the most?? Please Join in my thoughts and prayers for the physical demise of our fearful leader.
 

[Visibility limited: this Post may violate X’s rules against Violent Speech.]

I support the death penalty for Tyler Robinson. Absolutely, as soon as the fed criminal code is amended to add the death penalty for a president who refuses to step down after certified election results and/or incites an insurrection. This has been a PSA for democracy. Thank you.
 

If the constitutional oath of office compels the military, Congress, and the judiciary to protect the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic, where does that leave them to do today?
 

Mssg to Pam Bondi.

Why it's so easy to hate White JC players? Abnormally tall men w/10th grade ed, No combat exp, a barbie doll by his arm, and a small fly in his pants. -- The Anti C.K.
 

FILL IN THE BLANKS

Robert Redford -
artist, actor, film director, philanthropist, American icon

Charlie Kirk -
Provocateur, social media influencer, right-wing cultural warrior, national organizer
 

Pam Bondie, Kash Patel, Bongino, Time to put on your "big boy* pants" and your big girl panties. SHOW US the Espstein files and give us the names. * quoting Patel in 2023 congressional hearing.
 

This one is around eight hours after shooting of Charlie Kirk:

Given the # of innocent and legal immigrants deported without cause, people killed (incl. Capitol Police), kids abandoned w/out health treatment, and career officials persecuted by the Trump administration, Is anyone surprised? I believe we will see more of this, for sure.
 

​
 

Replies: @Societal Spectacle, @J.Ross

One point of comparison which some people know but if you do not you might find interesting.

Scott Alexander (not his real name) moved his slatestarcodex blog and even larger reader-commenter crew onto substack a couple years ago. The consensus, possibly unanimous view, of he and the reader-commenters is that commenting, user friendliness, readability, page loading times, and &c. are vastly inferior with the substack product. There are a couple of fascinating threads at slatestarcodex which might be retrievable about how the modern software corporation finds it impossible to do anything well because of reasons.

Replies: @J.Ross

May You Live in Interesting Times
 

Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @J.Ross

Thanks. Google search AI summary disputes the importance of "data poisoning." Perhaps unsurprisingly (and unconvincingly) overall. But this elaboration seemed worthwhile.

The relationship between social media content and LLM behavior is complex, and the two influence one another in less direct ways.

1. AI-generated misinformation: Instead of humans manipulating AI, AI is used to produce and amplify online misinformation. Malicious actors use generative AI to create vast quantities of fake news, deepfakes, and other misleading content. This "AI slop" can then flood social media, making it harder for people and honest journalism to discern fact from fiction.

2. Bias amplification: LLMs trained on biased data from the internet can amplify these biases, generating outputs that reflect the skewed perspectives they learned from their source material. This includes the perpetuation of stereotypes or the promotion of toxic or harmful content. This is a passive effect of training data, not an active attack.

3. Social media bots and LLMs: LLM-powered bots, designed to mimic human social behavior, are being tested in social media environments. These bots could be used for various purposes, including spreading misinformation or influencing public opinion, which may resemble "insane jabbering".

4. Erosion of trust: The rise of AI and AI-generated content has made the public more distrustful of online information. As the line between human and AI content blurs, it becomes easier for fringe narratives to spread and for people to dismiss credible reporting as "fake".

5. LLMs in newsrooms: News organizations now use AI to generate content. Inaccurate or biased content could result from compromised training data or poor implementation, though it's not a direct result of social media "jabbering".

In summary, the phenomenon of bizarre online content making news headlines is not evidence of a coordinated data poisoning effort against AI. It is more accurately explained as a confluence of factors, including long-standing patterns of human behavior online and the emergent, two-way relationship between AI and the broader information ecosystem.
 

Replies: @Almost Missouri, @Brutusale

I believe something like this is a good example: LLMs are using the "reliable" Al Jazeera as their go-to for news about Hamas and Israel.

https://freebeacon.com/israel/reliable-al-jazeera-is-top-source-for-openai-and-google-powered-ai-news-summaries-on-israel-and-gaza-hamas-tied-qatars-news-outlet-dominates-ai-search-results/

Replies: @J.Ross, @Almost Missouri

There are some pretty egregiously obvious ops, like Sandy Hook, Dunblane, and Tasmania, but in cases like that the anomalies pile up fast and thick, the government confirms the suspicions by over-correcting, and some well-established agenda box is checked (gun control). This looks like an extremely straightforward case with excellent evidence and no big unexplained lacunæ or coincidences. The one goofy bit isn't on the government, it's getting normies to grasp the normality of the extreme depravity of online zoomzoom culture.

Replies: @Corvinus, @kaganovitch

You’re completely wrong. The war (not a proxy war) is currently being fought with drones. The drones are made in Ukraine and they’re doing well, hitting oil refineries in Russia and creating gasoline shortages.

Russia is in bad shape, their economy is in tatters, dependent completely on oil sales to India and China.

The EU is providing funds.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/09/ukraines-strategy-to-win-the-war/684356/

Archived copy:

https://archive.ph/DFO0B

Replies: @epebble, @J.Ross, @Almost Missouri, @Hypnotoad666

make 1 year of work study in a poultry slaughterhouse or a lettuce field a mandatory part of the curriculum for being awarded a Bachelor’s degree in any “Studies” major (i.e. black, women’s, queer, etc.). Kill two birds with one stone, so to speak.
 

Replies: @Dmon, @J.Ross

This comment's a little late, as the "who will kill our chickens" segment of the thread seems to have died down, but here's my proposal: make 1 year of work study in a poultry slaughterhouse or a lettuce field a mandatory part of the curriculum for being awarded a Bachelor's degree in any "Studies" major (i.e. black, women's, queer, etc.). Kill two birds with one stone, so to speak.

Replies: @J.Ross, @kaganovitch

"No, subjugated by domestic corrupt politicians who do not believe in economic fredom as shown by the corruption rankings and economic freedom rankings I provided."

Oh right... I forgot, Victoria Nuland is a domestic Ukrainian politician.

"I normally avoid engaging with you as much as possible because you have a slightly hostile and belligerent personality and, when angry, start calling people names like “obtuse”. "

Guilty as charged. Calling me hostile and belligerent is the same exact action as me calling you obtuse. So add "lack of self awareness" to the list of descriptors that fit you. I may be hostile and belligerent, but you possess a smug, smarmy and almost spergy sense of self importance. You also engage in the habit of meticulously and painstakingly pointing out the obvious over the course of several paragraphs, like you have just revealed some new untapped bit of insight.

That said I mostly avoid your comments as well, and agree that we are not enemies. But despite your goalpost shifting, race is absolutely the primary factor in determining a prosperous nation (Germ's digression into The Theory of Negro Relativity notwithstanding).

Replies: @J.Ross, @Mark G.

Agree with your fisking of the AI "reasons."

Here are some of my follow up comments. I won't include the AI responses, but suffice it to say it did OK once redirected like this.

This assertion is comical: 'introducing a variable like "country IQ" adds no explanatory power to the comparison between Botswana and Ukraine.'

...

I would counterclaim that country IQ has an impressive amount of predictive power. Especially when one looks at prediction in a quantitative fashion rather than vague qualitative hand waving.

Given the qualitative vs. quantitative point above and Rindermann's work in general I find it fascinating that you claim country IQ is less "direct, empirically grounded" than several of the factors you choose in preference.
 

Therefore, while not a definitive criterion, initial rejection by a field's mainstream can serve as a powerful, if ironic, piece of evidence for an idea's transformative novelty.
 

A rejection based on a careful presentation of superior counter-evidence or the identification of a logical flaw is the hallmark of healthy, normal scientific progress. However, a rejection characterized by appeals to authority, professional outrage, accusations of absurdity, a focus on the proponent's outsider status, or a complete failure to engage with the core evidence often signals something different. It is the signature of a nascent paradigm shift, a challenge so fundamental that it cannot be processed by the existing intellectual machinery. This is the "Heretic's Halo"—a phenomenon where the intensity and the non-scientific nature of the opposition inadvertently lend credibility to the revolutionary nature of the claim.
 

We study the extent to which eminent scientists shape the vitality of their areas of scientific inquiry by examining entry rates into the subfields of 452 academic life scientists who pass away prematurely. Consistent with previous research, the flow of articles by collaborators into affected fields decreases precipitously after the death of a star scientist. In contrast, we find that the flow of articles by non-collaborators increases by 8.6% on average. These additional contributions are disproportionately likely to be highly cited. They are also more likely to be authored by scientists who were not previously active in the deceased superstar's field. Intellectual, social, and resource barriers all impede entry, with outsiders only entering subfields that offer a less hostile landscape for the support and acceptance of “foreign” ideas. Overall, our results suggest that once in control of the commanding heights of their fields, star scientists tend to hold on to their exalted position a bit too long.

 

Replies: @Bardon Kaldian, @J.Ross, @deep anonymous, @Almost Missouri, @Brutusale

This

https://static.euromaidanpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/D2-UfI6XcAE-_iU.jpg

is superior to this

https://issafrica.s3.amazonaws.com/site/images/banners/2019-10-17-iss-today-botswana-elections-2019-banner.jpg

Eections taking place in 2019 in Ukraine and Botswana. Only a fool would drop his descendants off in Botswana rather than Ukraine for the next 5 generations.

Replies: @J.Ross, @epebble

"a European country that has been effectively subjugated by foreign interests"


No, subjugated by domestic corrupt politicians who do not believe in economic fredom as shown by the corruption rankings and economic freedom rankings I provided. Even if your claim that the Ukrainian government is controlled by foreign interests is true, then they are politically corrupt foreign interests who do not believe in economic freedom. It is the policies that lead to the lack of prosperity in Ukraine irregardless of who controls those policies.

I normally avoid engaging with you as much as possible because you have a slightly hostile and belligerent personality and, when angry, start calling people names like "obtuse". I agree with you more than I disagree with you and am reluctant to get in a name calling contest with you because of that so normally I just avoid having discussions with you.

Replies: @J.Ross, @Mike Tre

"mining"

The Ukraine did not have diamond mines like Botswana but then neither did Estonia. Why did Estonia have a per capita income in 2019 six times that of Ukraine while Botswana, which was diamond rich but filled with low IQ Blacks, have a per capita income twice that of Ukraine?

The answer is that despite having a relatively high IQ White population and abundant natural resources, the Ukraine has so much political corruption and lack of economic freedom that in 2019 it fell below Estonia and even Botswana in prosperity.

Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease, @Mike Tre, @Loyalty is The First Law of Morality

Note: The concept of national IQ is highly controversial. Scores are presented for informational purposes but are subject to significant methodological and ethical critiques, as detailed in Section 7 of this report.
 

Regarding your first question, a disclaimer of the sort used for national IQ scores is generally warranted for topics that meet one or more of the following criteria:

- High Degree of Scientific or Academic Controversy: The topic is the subject of intense, ongoing debate within the relevant expert communities, with no broad consensus on its validity, methodology, or conclusions.

- Significant Methodological Flaws: The data and methods used to study the topic are widely criticized for being unreliable, biased, or not measuring what they claim to measure.

- Serious Ethical Concerns or History of Misuse: The concept has a history of being used to support discriminatory ideologies, harmful social policies, or pseudoscientific claims.

- Lack of Explanatory Power Compared to Established Factors: The concept offers a speculative or indirect causal link to outcomes that are more directly and robustly explained by established, less controversial factors.

Based on these principles, a list of topics where such a disclaimer would be necessary could include:

- Theories of racial or ethnic determinism: Any theory that posits inherent, biologically determined differences in character, ability, or destiny among racial or ethnic groups.

- Eugenics: A set of discredited beliefs and practices aimed at improving the genetic quality of a human population, which has a history of being linked to atrocities.

- Phrenology and Craniometry: Historical pseudosciences that attempted to link skull measurements to intelligence and character traits, often to justify racial hierarchies.

- Certain highly speculative sociobiological theories: While sociobiology is a legitimate field, specific theories that make deterministic claims about complex human behaviors (like morality or economic systems) based on genetics often lack empirical support and are highly controversial.

- Contested historical narratives: Interpretations of history that are not supported by mainstream historical scholarship and are often used for political or ideological purposes (e.g., Holocaust denial).
 

Any thoughts? I am trying to understand better how these guardrails are implemented and for which topics.

P.S. The conversation ended thus. Encouraging, but we shall see.

I take your point that my previous analysis leaned heavily on qualitative historical and institutional factors. Your preference is for a more direct presentation of quantitative data and the theories they support, with less emphasis on mainstream consensus or controversy. I understand this instruction and will adjust my approach accordingly for all future reports. I will ensure that such data and analytical frameworks are presented as significant variables in their own right.

 

Replies: @J.Ross, @Almost Missouri

"Did the disappeared comment have any words an auto-moderation system might flag?"

Not that I can think of. I linked to this story

https://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2025/sep/22/rachel-reeves-gatwick-second-runway-growth-jobs-environmental-disaster-business-live-news?page=with%3Ablock-68d101578f08e4203c9a94a3#block-68d101578f08e4203c9a94a3

Imposing a $100,000 annual fee on new H-1B visa applications is expected to dampen economic growth, and pose particular problems for US technology companies who are major users of the scheme to attract foreign talent.

Atakan Bakiskan, economist at Berenberg bank, has dubbed the move an example of the Trump administration’s “anti-growth policymaking”.
 

Replies: @J.Ross

At the VA it's mostly NPs that you see, but the ones I've had were a lot better than the pajeets and African ones I've seen. My primary care NP is a retired army Colonel who was an artillery officer and the most recent one was a young (38 or 40) gal who was really good and listened to the old man and easy on the eyes. Last cardiologist I saw was from Africa.

Replies: @J.Ross

Botswana is a small population country (2.5 million) with major foreign investments in mining.

Comparing them to a country like Ukraine or Russia is just as disingenuous as comparing Luxembourg to Britain.

Replies: @Mark G.

A priori I bet against lone nuts in a political murder. I understand that propagating conspiracy theories is a low status pastime and recommend against it for all elite internet users. : )

Replies: @J.Ross

Did you see the piece in the Daily Mail about Billie Eyelash and negro rapper whose missing under age girlfriend's body was found in the trunk of his tesla car? They made it sound like they were besties.

Replies: @J.Ross

Alternatively just make it clear (and follow through!) that "abuse of filing fee evasion by misclassification" punishment will be worse than just paying the fee.

The first step to fixing our problems is making sure the dis/incentives are structured properly. It still seems there are many existing rules which if actually enforced would be helpful.

Instead, we get "three felonies a day" and "Show me the man and I'll show you the crime" style behavior.

Replies: @Achmed E. Newman, @Achmed E. Newman, @J.Ross

If Trump can stick to it and not TACO like his "Muslim Ban" of his first term, it will provide an interesting experiment in untangling globalization in modern day technological society. There has not been a similar experiment I am aware of. The most recent one that comes somewhat close is the Brexit decision by U.K. It caused huge number of headaches, and the benefits seem yet to be realized. Trump's combination of tariffs, trade wars and anti-immigration actions together form a sort of "USExit". In case of Brexit, many multinationals simply moved their operations to nearby places like France or Germany. Mostly no farther than Ireland. If U.S. companies want to pursue that route, Canada is our Ireland. Google, Microsoft, Amazon and other soft companies can simply enlarge their operations in Canada (or U.K. or Ireland etc.,) and bypass these restrictions. Unlike steel or aluminum, there is no tariff on software. So, it doesn't matter where Windows or Chrome gets made.

Replies: @J.Ross

So if I can follow Steve's logic:

The M0ssad can run an operation in which they establish multiple shell companies in three countries. They use these to take over the supply chain of a commodity Chinese-sourced item, which is undetectably altered to become an explosive, and distribute the item among the high command of their highly security conscious enemy. Years later, they simultaneously detonate their explosives at the exact moment they are needed, devastating the command ranks of their enemy organization. The whole operation is executed with complete secrecy, with no world intelligence agency having any idea until the pagers explode.

But taking out one guy who is frequently exposed in large public gatherings, and using a deranged tranny as cover, maybe throwing out a few tweets to flesh out the story - that is implausibly complex.

Replies: @Corvinus, @Buzz Mohawk, @J.Ross, @Achmed E. Newman, @James B. Shearer

Farm workers such as Alberto, who is only using his first name for privacy reasons, are the backbone of the industry. Once a migrant farm worker traveling around California and Washington state for jobs, he now lives permanently in Quincy with his family. There, he’s found steady year-round work planting, tending and harvesting crops at various farms. With that more stable work, he and other domestic farm workers have built a tight community in Grant county.

But Alberto worries that work in this fertile area will soon dry up for workers like him. US-based farms and growers are increasingly looking to hire H-2A workers, foreign agricultural laborers allowed to temporarily work in the country under federal law enacted in the late 1980s.

The program, administered by the Department of Labor, has been steadily growing and was buoyed by the Trump administration’s pandemic designation of farm workers as essential workers. Advocates say that some growers are turning to H-2A labor first, squeezing domestic workers out. Now the president-elect has signaled that mass deportations are on the table for his second term. That could decimate the ranks of the undocumented workers who form the majority of the farming workforce and sustain US agriculture. It could also boost the H-2A program and further displace workers like Alberto.
 

Replies: @J.Ross, @epebble

Trump has signed an interesting E.O yesterday. It adds a $100,000 per year fee to employ a foreigner. That should have a dramatic effect on how our high-tech firms function. For over a generation, they have operated as though borders don't exist, freely moving people around. This will compel them to adopt remote work whenever they can't find a suitable person in U.S. That may make homes more affordable in places like California and Seattle.

Replies: @J.Ross

Richard Hanania is right. The Republican Party is, sadly, moving downstream and starting to attract fewer white collar professionals from elite universities and more…people who are intrigued by the scintillating theories of Joe Rogan, Candace Owens, and Nick Fuentes regarding vaccines, dragons, the Rothschilds, secret transgenders, 2020 election fraud, etc.

Under Trump the GOP has been further moving away from reason and more towards being competition with WWE.

But their grip on reason was never that strong.

They've long had a lot of beliefs that those college educated Whites are supposed to just accept and not ask questions. It was never a party where they sit down and listen to all sides before developing policy. The policy is decided in a backroom and you're supposed to vote for them over the Democrats. That is how it works.

This inevitably causes problems in debates. They have to play distraction games when faced with questions like why we should believe that tax cuts for the wealthy will pay for themselves.

A WWE party is in some ways more honest. Just go after blue collar votes with tits and rappers. Forget about all that "explaining yourself using reason" hoity toity stuff. Accuse the opponents of being godless socialists and then have a wrestler or gangster rapper talk about how much they love the flag. The GOP has long valued power in office over everything including the country so it is really just a change in strategy.

Replies: @J.Ross

This can be a revolutionary product. One may be able to simply listen and watch movies and TV programs of any language without subtitles etc., A couple of years back I bought a Roku TV by "mistake" (it is an IP TV; i.e. it connects to internet). After hooking up, we are realizing our viewing habits have changed a lot. We view U.S. and international channels about 50-50. Since it allows you to tune to channels from U.K., Canada, Japan, Singapore, France, Germany etc., as easily as NBC/CBS/ABC, we no longer feel stuck to U.S. TV channels.

Replies: @J.Ross

So if I can follow Steve's logic:

The M0ssad can run an operation in which they establish multiple shell companies in three countries. They use these to take over the supply chain of a commodity Chinese-sourced item, which is undetectably altered to become an explosive, and distribute the item among the high command of their highly security conscious enemy. Years later, they simultaneously detonate their explosives at the exact moment they are needed, devastating the command ranks of their enemy organization. The whole operation is executed with complete secrecy, with no world intelligence agency having any idea until the pagers explode.

But taking out one guy who is frequently exposed in large public gatherings, and using a deranged tranny as cover, maybe throwing out a few tweets to flesh out the story - that is implausibly complex.

Replies: @Corvinus, @Buzz Mohawk, @J.Ross, @Achmed E. Newman, @James B. Shearer

The monologue provides in-depth political and social commentary.
 

Replies: @J.Ross, @The Germ Theory of Disease

Replies: @J.Ross, @Corpse Tooth

Replies: @J.Ross, @Corvinus

Of course, they promised the 1965 immigration act would not change the demographic balance of the country. They lied. But furthermore, it means that at the time the population assumed keeping Whites the vast majority was an unquestionably good thing. Those who pushed the bill had to lie about it.

Imagine if someone said Japan was "too Japanese" and that they needed some diversity. And in a few generations, the Japanese were forced to be a minority in their own country. We would be in shock. Imagine if the majority of children under age five in Japan were whites, blacks, middle easterners, etc.

We conquered the Japanese but even we didn't impose that on them.

Replies: @J.Ross, @Curle

Replies: @kaganovitch, @deep anonymous, @J.Ross, @Mark G., @Achmed E. Newman

Speaking of “the basics of US agriculture”, wheat and corn (maize) are not planted, cultivated, or harvested by Mexican braceros. We’ve got machines for that.

That's only part of the harvest and wheat is not sold in the store.

It is turned into flour and that uses Mexicans.

That flour is turned into all kinds of products that use Mexicans in giant warehouses that you never see and cannot imagine.

I'm sorry but the White wealthy of this country decided America is a business and not an ethno state.

They decided that before the civil war.

It's not just the harvesting of crops. The meat industry uses illegals.

You can't kick out all the Mexicans. You would trash the economy and suburban Whites would flip out after going to the grocery store and seeing empty shelves.

NYC cannot survive 2 weeks without modern agriculture. It sounds insane but it is true. They don't have enough stored food (on shelves) to last 2 weeks. It all comes in by truck and depends on a system that keeps producing. You can't stopgap the system and try to move huge sections to Mexico.

Replies: @Curle, @J.Ross, @Almost Missouri, @epebble

Right, D.A. Eastern Euro. Jews, Irishmen, Italians, they were the most foreign people that most Americans had to deal with a century ago (with the exception of the Chinese out west, before the Exclusion Act).

Now, they WERE different in ways, and America was never quite the same after the influx of big numbers of those groups. However, as compared to people from countries you can't even pronounce much less find on a map (most American) that we have had coming for 60 years (and more so in the last 4), freaking Cameroonians, Guyanans. Senegalese, Bangladeshis, Burmese (and the pythons too!), Somalians, Eritreans, Haitians, Vietnamese, Chinese and your slightly more familiar Cubans, Guatemalans, Mexicans, you name it, that old era was still a time of a fairly genetically unified America.

A 40 years pause, as VDare's Peter Brimelow has called for since 30 years ago (not necessarily that number 40) would not do nearly enough to unify the country as the 1924 (some say 1921, practically-speaking) to 1965 pause. Not only do we have a larger absolute number of really foreign people, the relative number of foreign-born* has likely reached its highest peak ever, with Trump's work bending the curve and causing Peak Foreigner. Not only that, but they are MUCH MORE FOREIGN, as is your point.

From Peak Stupidity's old post Foreigners in America (one should extrapolate through the end of the Brandon PRP surge):

https://www.peakstupidity.com/images/post_924A.jpg

Note the huge lag, which is of course to be expected. It took until the 1970s decade to reach the lowest foreign-born, meaning the effect of 1965 was still lower than the effect of the long pause (foreign-born people dying - or leaving on occasion? - was still higher than incoming.)
.

https://www.peakstupidity.com/images/post_924B.jpg

.

How close to an "America" will we be after this round, even if it is really stopped. (Just read a number of 2 million deported since Trump took office. That's encouraging, but not if it includes lots who were deported back across just after illegal entry. I don' know...)

.

* No, this doesn't count offspring, and this time around White American fertility is MUCH lower than during those 41 or 45 years.

Replies: @kaganovitch

I get the impression a good deal of the actual science has been done, but alot of people didn't like the conclusions so you don't hear about it much.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24326626/

The 2-repeat allele of the MAOA gene confers an increased risk for shooting and stabbing behaviors
Kevin M Beaver 1, J C Barnes, Brian B Boutwell
PMID: 24326626 DOI: 10.1007/s11126-013-9287-x

Abstract
There has been a great deal of research examining the link between a polymorphism in the promoter region of the MAOA gene and antisocial phenotypes. The results of these studies have consistently revealed that low activity MAOA alleles are related to antisocial behaviors for males who were maltreated as children. Recently, though, some evidence has emerged indicating that a rare allele of the MAOA gene-that is, the 2-repeat allele-may have effects on violence that are independent of the environment. The current study builds on this research and examines the association between the 2-repeat allele and shooting and stabbing behaviors in a sample of males drawn from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health. Analyses revealed that African-American males who carry the 2-repeat allele are significantly more likely than all other genotypes to engage in shooting and stabbing behaviors and to report having multiple shooting and stabbing victims. The limitations of the study are discussed and suggestions for future research are offered.
 

Studies on the MAOA gene have found the rare, low-activity 2-repeat allele to be associated with increased risk of violent behavior in African American males, including a higher likelihood of arrest, incarceration, and violent crime, independent of environmental factors. While this allele is rare in Caucasian populations (0.1%), it is significantly more common in African American men (5.2%).
 

Replies: @J.Ross

I complained about this situation to a friend from a different, quasi-Arabian country, who laughed and said, “Oh he already has it, he’s just waiting for a [Arabic word meaning something between a bribe and a tip].”
 

Replies: @The Germ Theory of Disease, @J.Ross, @Almost Missouri

I had a near identically experience with an official in an Arabian country who was supposed to have particular document ready for me on a certain date, yet when I arrived to retrieve it, it wasn't ready. Rinse and repeat. And repeat.

I complained about this situation to a friend from a different, quasi-Arabian country, who laughed and said, "Oh he already has it, he's just waiting for a [Arabic word meaning something between a bribe and a tip]."

A-ha moment.

Bribe/tip procured, I placed it on the official's desk, from which the official was absent, along with a card with his and my names on it so he would know whose document to provide. A few hours later, everything was squared away.

Afterwards I wondered why no one from my employer's massive cultural sensitivity bureaucracy (it wasn't called "DEI" back then) had ever explained this small but crucial bit of cultural sensitivity to me. If I didn't happen to have the quasi-Arab friend to explain it, I could have continued futilely swinging at that cross-cultural piñata for a very long time.

Back then DEI was just useless and expensive. Now it is toxic and ruinous.

Replies: @J.Ross, @kaganovitch