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Tiananmen Square, 1989 -- Revisited
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Imagine it’s midsummer. Students from Yale, Harvard, Princeton, Radcliffe, Columbia, Vassar, Smith, Brown, Wellesley, Cornell, Dartmouth and Penn are demonstrating outside the White House and flooding the Washington Mall with Dolce & Gabbana hoodies. They’ve been there for six weeks and, as their number has grown, their mood has darkened: corruption has triggered another downturn, there’s a crime wave and rampant inflation threatens employment prospects and the National Merit Scholarship program has been canceled. Student leaders–some sponsored by a shadowy Chinese NGO, and recently returned from Beijing–say the failure to prosecute bankers is evidence of criminal conspiracy and government illegitimacy. The returnees are taunting the crowd for its cowardice, urging them to ignore the snipers on every roof and rush the White House. Inside, nervous staffers with sons and daughters, nieces and nephews among the demonstrators–try to discover which of them have been conspiring with the agitators.

Suddenly, simultaneously, all White House doors burst open and uniformed officers rush out bearing either (a) submachine guns, with which they open fire, slaughtering the children of America’s leading families, or (b) bottles of mineral water, slices of the First Lady’s birthday cake and an invitation to join the President that evening on the White House lawn for a barbecue and serious discussion.

In 1989, fourteen million Americans, six percent of the population were in college. That year two million Chinese kids, 0.2% of the population–the first postwar generation whose education was uninterrupted–an entire generation of its future leaders. The idea that any elite–let alone the child-worshipping Chinese–would murder its own children for demonstrating peacefully over legitimate grievances is even sillier than the notion that they were demonstrating about democracy. They were demonstrating about money and sex. The only ‘democracy’ they wanted was the big character democracy they had learned under Mao: hence the re-appearance of big character posters–not seen since the government de-revolutionized the Cultural Revolution twenty years earlier. Mao had told them what to do when an incompetent government would force them to bear the burdens of its incompetence and corruption: bring out the Big Character Posters. He’d even tried to get big postering constitutionally guaranteed.

1989 was a most uncommon year: the fortieth anniversary of the founding of the People’s Republic, the seventieth anniversary of the May Fourth Movement, the centenary of the Second Communist Internationale and the bicentennial of the French Revolution. The USSR was coming unglued and Deng’s Reform and Opening had, says Orville Schell,[1]Mandate of Heaven: The Legacy of Tiananmen Square and the Next Generation. By Orville Schell. ‘rammed Chinese society into reverse gear, stampeding the country into a form of unregulated capitalism that made the U.S. and Europe seem almost socialist by comparison’. Radical market-price reforms caused a major inflation and popular, student and worker unrest.

Elizabeth Perry wrote, “The Cultural Revolution left a significant mark on popular protests in post-Mao China. Repertoires of collective political action popularized during the Cultural Revolution—such as singing revolutionary songs, marches, rallies, and hunger strikes—had a great impact on the 1989 protest movement. The haunting specter of the Cultural Revolution also had a crucial impact on the Deng regime’s interpretation of—and thereby reaction to—the movement. Over three decades after China ventured down the path of capitalist marketization, the bleak reality of growing socioeconomic disparity, environmental degradation, massive layoffs of workers in state-owned enterprises, evisceration of social protections, rampant official corruption, illicit appropriation of public property, and exploitation of rural migrant labor has led to the unraveling of the broad but fragile consensus regarding the direction and rationality of post-Mao reforms that dominated Chinese intellectual discussions of the 1980s”. Reform and Opening–as far as common people could see–was a disaster and little was needed to light the fires of protest, according to Suzanne Pepper:[2]China’ Education Reform in the 1980s Policies, Issues, and Historical Perspectives. SUZANNE PEPPER. 1990. INSTITUTE OF EAST ASIAN STUDIES UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA AT BERKELEY CENTER FOR CHINESE STUDIES.

With the multiple economic and political crises of 1988 and 1989, the consequences of Deng Xiaoping’s decade of reform for higher education, at least, might better be categorized as a major tragedy for all concerned. Deng’s decade had begun with great fanfare, high hopes, and the total reversal of Cultural Revolution priorities.

During the spring 1988 academic meetings, the comments of Beijing University President Ding Shisun in particular created a sensation both because of their candor in criticizing official policies, “Some people ask me whether as Beijing University president I fear student protests, but I answer that what I fear most is not having enough money”. This provoked heated discussions among delegates and a satirical demonstration by a handful of student protesters who gathered in Tiananmen Square offering to shine delegates’ shoes.

By then, the imperatives driving the student protest movement had already taken on a life of their own. The most important issues were high prices, widespread corruption and the special privileges enjoyed by the families of high-level officials who appeared to benefit more than others from the new opportunities to engage in trade and travel. The students also began demanding the unhindered right to protest such negative consequences as they saw fit, once it became apparent that the authorities were trying to stop them. Between mid-October and December 1985, virtually every provincial and city Party secretary in the country visited every leading university and personally listened to students’ complaints. Inherent in the popular response was an undercurrent of Maoist mass-line or “work unit” democracy that was obviously different from both the Western and Deng Xiaoping’s anti-bureaucratic conceptions.

Thus while student demonstrators were occupying Tiananmen Square in May, one middle-aged, middle-ranking Beijing cadre remarked to a friend during a visit to Shenzhen that “Mao would have sent someone out to talk to them.”

The cadre went on to explain that workers and cadres alike in her industrial system felt they had much less opportunity to ‘participate’ within that system now than in the 1970s, when meetings were called for every problem and people could raise opinions that today would result in their dismissal. Preparations for the next phase of the student movement were thus essentially in place when Hu Yaobang died suddenly in mid-April and provided the perfect, if unanticipated, link. Later demands would include more pointed references to inflation, the special privileges of cadres, Swiss bank accounts and so on, but the leading concerns throughout were political. Among the first were seven drafted on April 23 by students from nineteen Beijing colleges and universities:

  1. reassess Hu Yaobang’s [an official much loved by the students] merits and demerits;
  2. allow the people to run newspapers;
  3. increase educational funding and raise the pay of intellectuals;
  4. reevaluate the 1986 student movement and the opposition to bourgeois liberalization;
  5. make public the truth of the April 20, 1989, incident (when police allegedly beat student demonstrators);
  6. oppose corruption, oppose bureaucratism and severely punish official profiteering;
  7. report truthfully all the events from the death of Hu Yaobang to the student demonstrations in Tiananmen Square.

In April, students and workers began massive demonstrations in Beijing and Shanghai, denouncing Deng Xiaoping’s reforms on placards, “It doesn’t matter if the cat is black or white, so long as the cat resigns”.

Dongpin Han, a student at the time, tells how the sudden relaxation of price controls set off bank runs, panic buying and hoarding. Crime was rampant and the country was ripe for destabilization: “Official corruption had disrupted China’s economy. The government, facing bankruptcy, had printed more money in 1984 than in the previous thirty-five years combined. Prices of commodities, previously State-controlled and stable, exploded. Meat rose five hundred percent. My parents had saved two thousand yuan. They’d bought their first house for four hundred yuan then, overnight, their savings lost 90 percent of their value. My mother rushed to the store and bought two hundred feet of plain cloth. Her neighbor bought four hundred pounds of salt and another bought forty TV sets. They believed that war-era inflation had returned and their money would become worthless. People started publicly denouncing corrupt officials and their children’s promotion to high office. Beijing’s Consumer Price Index had jumped 30% in 1988 and salaried workers panicked when they could no longer afford staples. State-owned enterprises were pressured to cut costs. Mao’s iron rice bowl–job security and social benefits ranging from medical care to subsidized housing–were suddenly at risk”.

State owned companies dumped millions of workers into the labor market and inflation consumed their severance pay, designed to last six months, in as many weeks. Graduates found themselves in the worst employment market since the war where, it seemed, only those with political connections got hired. A survey showed that the average university graduate earned less than high school matriculants. Government subsidies were cut to the bone and professors’ incomes reduced. Peasants who followed Deng’s admonition to ‘get rich’ were getting rich, enraging social elites who demanded[3]China Rising: The Meaning of Tiananmen ‘more money for education and higher pay for intellectuals’. The Toronto Sun’s Eric Margolis wrote, “This reaction to Deng’s policies was reflected not only in the Maoist sympathies of some Chinese students but also in the broad demands put forward by the student movement.The 1989 events were, at their core, a political civil war within the CCP where the weapons used went beyond the back rooms and onto the street: students and workers with real grudges due to rapid changes ended up being manipulated by factions within the CCP and foreign conspirators–and things got pretty out of hand”.

The withdrawal of Mao’s tuition subsidies crushed the dreams of millions of families thirsting for education and the government’s decision to maintain scholarships for African students touched off race riots. Thousands of Nanjing students chanted demands for reform, waved signs like “Kill the black devils!” and rampaged through the Africans’ student quarters, injuring many. The anti-African demonstrations spread to Beijing where, late on the night of April 19, student militants carrying banners saying, “No Offend Chinese Women,” yelling “Kill the foreigners!” and screaming insults at Deng marched on Party leaders’ living quarters at Zhongnanhai.

As eyewitness Lee Feigon relates, “The police seemed remarkably tolerant, unflustered by the constant jeering and screaming. Many who watched doubted that the American Secret Service would have reacted so genially if a similar mob were battering on the gates of the White House in the middle of the night. This was carried to an extreme at about 2:30 a.m. when the police tried to clear the crowd and some of them were pushed back onto a cluster of fallen bicycles. One tough picked up one of the bikes and smashed it over the head of one of the police. He was not arrested”.

Squabbling within the Forbidden City, where opposition to Deng’s Reform and Opening was still powerful among Maoists, reflected the turmoil in the Square. Conservatives and progressives struggled to implement contradictory policies and Hu Yaobang’s unexpected death left no trusted interlocutor. Demonstrations intensified when students marched into Tiananmen Square on April 26 singing the Internationale and holding aloft portraits of Mao. Lee Feigon continues, “The leaders of a prominent student group hung big pictures of Mao in the tents they pitched on the square. They talked openly and boldly about the good old days of the Cultural Revolution. Mao, they felt, had the right ideas although he sometimes used wrong tactics. Now they were determined to use what they considered the right ones”.

Like their American counterparts, whose dreams died at Kent State, China’s New Left knew the value of publicity. They expected repression and openly provoked it but, to their considerable surprise, provoked mostly sympathy. The Party’s reform wing hailed them as ‘bearers of the spirit of socialist democracy’ and The Peoples Daily gave them front-page photo spreads and adulatory coverage with headlines like, ‘A Million from All Walks of life Demonstrate in Support of Hunger-Striking Students,’ ‘Save the Students! Save the Children!’ The Guangming Daily ran front-page stories like, “The conditions of the students and the future of the country touch the heart of every Chinese who has a conscience”. Clearly, the students were not alone.

At the height of the turmoil organizers met with Party leaders and CCTV broadcast the meeting nationwide to millions sympathetic to their demands for an end to corruption and the crime wave Deng’s reforms had unleashed.By May 18, support for the students was so strong that the The Peoples Daily pushed coverage of Russian President Gorbachev’s state visit below the fold to feature their demands. Capitalizing on television coverage of Gorbachev’s visit, protesters blocked the Square and announced a hunger strike. The government responded by sending ten thousand doctors and nurses, one hundred ambulances and teams of sanitation workers and portable toilets.

The hunger strikers insisted on further dialog and, when the government complied, demanded that Deng retire, troops stationed outside the city be dispersed and martial law revoked and presented four demands. (1) better treatment for intellectuals, including more money for education, better salaries and job assignments after graduation. (2) An end to pervasive official corruption and to preferential treatment for relatives of Party officials in getting lucrative jobs and better living arrangements and education. (3) Hu Yaobang’s political reforms, including more government accountability and responsiveness to citizens’ ideas and opinions and broader input into government policy. (4) Respect for constitutionally guaranteed freedoms like freedom to demonstrate, freedom of speech and freedom of the press. (As these reforms were made in subsequent years the government’s trust and approval ratings rose steadily, reaching Olympian heights with Xi’s ending pervasive political corruption.)

The students received large sums of money from ordinary citizens, from foreign tourists and organizations abroad and worker activists claimed to have witnessed a ‘chaos of money’ and accused the leadership of pocketing it for themselves. The size and quality of tents and sleeping mats purchased with donated funds, they noted, ‘were allocated among student leaders according to their relative rank.’ Carried away by self-importance, like the elderly Party leaders they despised, they became steadily less available to the press and their bodyguards refused access to journalists without multiple ID cards and press passes. CNN’s Mike Chinoy[4]Mike Chinoy, China Live: Two Decades in the Heart of the Dragon, p.242. recalled, “The bickering students began to display the same bureaucratic and autocratic tendencies in their People’s Republic of Tiananmen Square that they were trying to change in the government”. Vito Maggioli, CNN’s assignment manager, recalled how, by late May, camera crews and producers would come back after reporting on events in the Square, complaining about the bureaucracy the students had created, with some even referring to student leaders as ‘fascists.’

Nor did student leaders welcome those who suffered the reforms’ cruelest effects, common workers. Andrew Walder and Gong Xiaoxia[5]University Workers in the Tiananmen Protests: The Politics of the Beijing Workers’ AutonomousFederation. Author(s): Andrew G. Walder and Gong Xiaoxia Source: The Australian Journal of Chinese Affairs, No. 29 (Jan., 1993), pp. 1-29. said a member of the Workers’ Autonomous Federation found the students were ‘especially unwilling’ to meet members of the Construction Workers’ Union, whom they drove from the Square, considering them as lowly ‘convict laborers’. They ‘were always rejecting us workers. They thought we were uncultured. We demanded participation in the dialogue with the government but the students wouldn’t let us. They considered us workers to be crude, stupid, reckless, and incapable of negotiating’. In response to their exclusivity, the workers produced their own charter inviting all to join and ‘members took pride in the fact that their leaders would talk freely with city people of all walks of life and peasants as well, and that the ‘democratic forum’ of their broadcasting station was open to any and all statements from the audience.’The workers added that they ‘observed in the student leaders and in their movement many of the faults of the nation’s leaders and their political system: hierarchy, secrecy, condescension toward ordinary people, factionalism, struggles for power, and even special privilege and corruption’.

The situation was volatile, but violence would require a catalyst, and the CIA was ready and eager to provide it. Having overthrown Iran’s government in 1953, South Vietnam’s in 1963 and Chile’s in 1973, the Agency moved its team of coupsters to Beijing. As The Vancouver Sun reported, “For months before the June 3 attack on the demonstrators, the CIA had been helping student activists form the anti-government movement, providing typewriters, facsimile machines and other equipment to help them spread their message, said one official”. The CIA moved Gene Sharp, author of the Color Revolution manual, to Beijing where financier George Soros had incorporated the eponymous Fund for the Reform and Opening of China. CIA Director George H.W. Bush withdrew Ambassador Winston Lord from Beijing and replaced him with James Lilley, an operative experienced in regime change. Bush and Lilley had been close friends since the early 1970s when Lilley was the head of station for the CIA in Beijing and Bush was Chief of Mission and de facto Ambassador. In 1975, as Bush was returning to Washington from Beijing to head the CIA he appointed Lilley National Intelligence Officer for China, the highest-ranked expert on China in the American intelligence community.

Lilley had made contact with Premier Zhao Ziyang who wanted China to adopt privatized media, freedom to organize, an independent judiciary, a multiparty parliamentary democracy, privatization of state-owned assets, the separation of Party and State and market-oriented economic reforms. In 1986 Soros endowed his Fund for the Reform and Opening of China with one million dollars—a huge sum for China those days—to promote cultural and intellectual exchanges with Zhao’s Institute for Economic Structural Reform. In 1988 the National Endowment for Democracy opened two offices in China, gave regular seminars on democracy, sponsored select Chinese writers and publications and recruited Chinese students studying in US. In February 1989, two months before the CIA launched its Tiananmen destabilization campaign, President Bush paid his first and only visit to China.

When the student protests erupted in late April the NED mailed thousands of inflammatory letters from Washington to recipients in China and aroused public opinion through Voice of America (VOA) shortwave radio broadcasts, in Mandarin, across China on the days of the protests. In Nanjing, university students had boom-boxes turned high as the VOA described events in China.

Deng had CIA strategist Gene Sharp arrested and expelled to British Hong Kong, whence he directed the insurrection, as he recounts in his memoir, Non-Violent Struggle in China. Another CIA operative, VOA’s Beijing chief, Alan Pessin, provided encouragement, provocation, strategic guidance and tactical advice in round-the-clock broadcasts and students who were there still talk of the VOA’s promised land of ‘freedom and democracy’.

The Taiwan-funded Chinese Alliance for Democracy issued an Open Letter from New York which, posted in Beijing University’s Triangle on April 26, called for ‘consolidating the organizational links established during the movement, strengthening the contacts with the critics and strengthening support for the movement within all sectors of society’. The Taiwanese government provided $1 million for equipment and flew its most prominent member (and future Nobelist) Liu Xiaobo from Washington to lead the protests. The students’ local leader Chai Ling, secretly holding a US visa, angrily accused Liu of using the student movement to ‘rebuild his own image’.

The stage was set for violence. Moderate student leaders argued that, having made their point, the students should withdraw and live to fight another day but Chai Ling commanded[6]Cries for Democracy: Writings and Speeches from the 1989 Chinese Democracy Movement (Princeton Univ. Press, 1990), p. 327. them to stay because, she explained, “Some fellow students asked me what our plans are, what our demands will be in future. This made me feel sick at heart; I started out to tell them that what we were waiting for was actually the spilling of blood, for only when the government descends to the depths of depravity and decides to deal with us by slaughtering us, only when rivers of blood flow in the Square, will the eyes of our country’s people truly be opened…But how could I tell them this? How could I tell them that their lives would have to be sacrificed in order to win?”

Wang Yam, her fellow organizer, publicly supported Chai Ling’s call for violence and gave government conservatives the excuse they needed, as one Long March veteran put it: “Those goddamn bastards! Who do they think they are, trampling on sacred ground like Tiananmen? They’re really asking for it! We should send the troops right now to grab those counter-revolutionaries! What’s the People’s Liberation Army for, anyway? What are the martial law troops for? They’re not supposed to just sit around and eat!”

At midnight on June 3, six weeks after the protests began, troops began moving from the railway station into the city under orders not to fire unless fired upon. An officer later testified at the official enquiry, “If we had been allowed to let ourselves go, one battalion would have been quite sufficient to quell the riot but, with rioters hiding behind onlookers, we had to stay our hand”. On the way in one soldier was seized, thrown from an overpass and killed, another doused with gasoline and set alight, one was clubbed to death and disemboweled and three major-generals were attacked and hospitalized. Rioters looted weapons and ammunition from captured trucks and attacked government buildings. Leaders distributed knives, iron bars, bricks and chains, urging people to ‘take up arms and overthrow the government’. At six the following evening loudspeakers told Beijingers to remain indoors as troops had been ordered to suppress the uprising by force and, when the soldiers moved in, rioters burned hundreds of vehicles, including sixty armored cars and thirty police cars. NYU Professor James C. Hsiung watched⁠[7]When the author queried Dr. Hsiung, he replied, “It could have been in a paper (report) I gave at a meeting in New York. The meeting had been scheduled long before the June 4 1989. I was supposed to give a paper at the meeting. But, since I had come only a few days before when the meeting took place, I did not have the time to write a paper. So, I gave a report on what I witnessed at the Tiananmen Square, instead.

I can assure you that I received very strong, almost tumultuous, reactions in response. One person in the audience even said: “Don’t think you can fool us. We witnessed it too, from the TV shorts”. So, watching TV made him an eye witness, too.

If you can read Chinese, I did have an article written on the 20th anniversary of the June 4th tragedy, titled: “一個天安門事件 ‘變相受害者’ 的喊冤回憶”, (The Painful Reminiscences of a “Virtual Victim“ of the Tiananmen Event, published in Taiwan’s Straits’ Review (海峽評論),No. 223 (July, 2009), pp. 173-178.

The Straits Review can be reached by e-mail at: <[email protected]>.

If you write, pls. ask for Mr. Shu-tao FU (福蜀濤)。 He knows me. In fact, he asked me for the article.
the action from his perch in the Beijing Hotel:

After midnight, I saw troops trotting on foot from the East towards Tiananmen Square, without helmets or weapons. As they were approaching the square, they were blocked by huge crowds and were forced to retreat, trotting back in the direction (east) they had come from. On their retreat route, the troops were chased by the crowds, many throwing rocks and bricks. Not long after, troops returned by truck, this time with helmets on and weapons in hand. By then, the crowds had set up more roadblocks. As the trucks were negotiating their way through, the crowds stopped them with a barrage of rocks. This free-for-all went on for some time, during which many soldiers were either killed or wounded; and some lost their weapons to the ruffians. Then came the armored reinforcements spitting sporadic fire, apparently in revenge, into the crowds along both sides of the road. Besides the ruffians and students, many were merely onlookers. The crowds, however, fought back hard. They climbed atop the on-coming tanks. Some even used Molotov cocktails or the equivalents of a flame-thrower against the tanks. One tank went ablaze. As the three soldiers inside opened the latch to run away from the heat, some hooligans shouted: “Kill them, kill them!” A BCC (Taiwan) radio reporter on the scene recorded the shouting. He later told me that he saw the three soldiers killed by their maulers. A Chinese-American friend, in whose house I had been a dinner guest only two nights before, later called and told me that a similar attack took place in front of their apartment building. One soldier’s corpse, lying by an incinerated troop-carrier truck, I was told, was set on fire by his killers, who had poured gasoline on the body. In all the cases we knew, the ruffians were much older than most college students and did not appear to be students at all.

Informed that troops were approaching Tiananmen Square and shooting had started, the students began withdrawing at 5 am and were gone by 6:30. Journalist Che Muqi⁠[8]Che Muqi: «Beijing turmoil – More than meets the eye», Foreign language press, Beijing 1990, ISBN 0-8351-2459-2; 7-119-01305-X
recounts his conversation with Kong Xiangzhi, a professor at Chinese People’s University:

At about 12:10 a.m., the troops marched in from West Chang’an Avenue. I was sitting on the steps outside the West entrance of the Great Hall of the People. When the troops marched towards the square, I saw a group of people throwing rocks at them. When a few soldiers went up to them, they ran southwards. These soldiers fired into the air. Then some other soldiers came up but they didn’t shoot at the crowds, otherwise I would have been shot, since I was now on the sidewalk.

I walked to the East entrance of the Great Hall where several hundred soldiers were sitting and some people were talking with them. The atmosphere seemed friendly. When I saw someone binding up a wound for a young soldier, I went up to help and asked him how he had been wounded. He told me he had been hit by rocks. He also told me that many of his comrades had also been wounded. I saw many whose heads, arms or hands were bound with gauze. I told him that I believed that the majority of the students and residents would not do this. He agreed with me. Then, an officer came to talk with us. He said that the troops would never open fire on the masses or the students. At about 3:30 a.m., the troops began to fall in. The officer then said to his men: “We’re going in to clear out the square. Now I want to make clear that no-one is permitted to shoot at the students or people; right now, this is the highest form of discipline”.

About 4:10 a.m. all the lights at the square went out. A lot of soldiers came out from the East entrance of the Great Hall. I sat down to watch under the pine trees, feeling excited and nervous. I was nervous because this was the first time I had seen so many soldiers carrying guns and I didn’t know how they were going to clear up the square. ..At about 4:30, the martial law troops announced over the loudspeaker, “Attention, students. We have agreed to your appeal. We will allow you to leave peacefully”. The announcement was broadcast over and over again. At about 4:50, the students around the monument began to leave. I looked around and saw that there was almost no one in sight. So I came back with the students. That was at 5:05 a.m. This was what I saw at the time. No one was killed throughout the whole process. Some people with ulterior motives who had fled abroad spread rumors that Tiananmen Square had been a blood-bath and that they had had to crawl out from underneath the corpses, which was sheer nonsense.

Famous Taiwanese entertainer Hou Dejian summarized his experience of the finale, “Some people said that two hundred died in the Square and others claimed that two thousand died. There were also stories of tanks running over students who were trying to leave. I have to say that I did not see any of that. I don’t know where those people died. I myself was in the Square until six-thirty in the morning”. Future Nobelist Liu Xiaobo remained to the end and said he saw nobody harmed.

On June 19, Beijing Party Secretary Li Ximing delivered the results of the official enquiry. More than 7,000 were wounded or injured and two hundred forty one killed, including thirty-six students, ten soldiers and thirteen People’s Armed Police during a riot in Chang’An Road.

For all its failures, tragedies and confusions, the Tiananmen incident ranks among the most successful propaganda campaigns in history. Long after the massacre story was disproved, foreign journalists–all of whom had left the Square–told readers that students had been demanding Western values in the face of ‘Red Chinese totalitarianism’. Their fabricated massacre gave the West an excuse to embargo China yet again, and to label it an international human rights pariah.

Some journalists, sinologists and officials had second thoughts. “I believe we tried to put a ‘made in the USA’ democracy stamp on it,” said Jackie Judd[9]Coverage of the Crisis


of ABC. Photographer Jeff Widener[10]Behind the Scenes: Tank Man of Tiananmen, NYT said he took the Tank Man photograph on June 5, more than a day after the students had left the Square. (Associated Press still distributes the image as if it were from June 4, so look for it).

Widener’s photo shows a man stopping four tanks but another photograph, taken by Stuart Franklin a few seconds earlier, shows nineteen tanks behind Widener’s four and makes it clear that the tanks are leaving the Square, driving east, out of the city.

And the story continued to leak out abroad:[11]The Vancouver Sun; Vancouver, B.C. [Vancouver, B.C]17 Sep 1992: A20 (1st Edition)

CIA man misread reaction, sources say. Vancouver Sun.

WASHINGTON – THE CIA STATION chief in China left the country two days before Chinese troops attacked demonstrators in the capital Beijing in 1989, after predicting the military would not act, U.S. officials said. China’s government had declared martial law 12 days earlier and moved tens of thousands of troops to the outskirts of Beijing in preparation for removing the demonstrators from Tiananmen Square.

The Central Intelligence Agency had sources among protesters, as well as within China’s intelligence services with which it enjoyed a close relationship since the 1970s, said the officials, who spoke this week on condition of anonymity.

For months before the June 3 attack on the demonstrators, the CIA had been helping student activists form the anti-government movement, providing typewriters, facsimile machines and other equipment to help them spread their message, said one official.

In the weeks leading up to the 1989 bloodshed, the CIA monitored the growing tension closely using its case officers, diplomats at the U.S. embassy, and a network of informers among the students who led the protest. But as the protest lost steam, the chief of the CIA station decided the threat of confrontation had been defused, said one official. The CIA declined all comment”.

The BBC’s Beijing correspondent, James Miles,confessed to having “Conveyed the wrong impression, and that there was no massacre in Tiananmen Square. Protesters who were still in the square when the army reached it were allowed to leave after negotiations with martial law troops…There was no Tiananmen Square massacre”. But, even after TheColumbia Journalism Review discredited⁠12 the massacre story and WikiLeaks released Ambassador James Lilley’s July 12 (a month after the events) cable, few editors were interested.






The Public Security Ministry issued arrest warrants for twenty-one demonstrators including Liu Xiaobo, Wang Dan, Wu’er Kaixi, Liu Gang and Chai Ling, but the CIA’s Operation Yellowbird had already exfiltrated four hundred leaders to Western countries. Ambassador Lilley claimed that America was involved in ‘almost exclusively legal exfiltrations,’ though it was later proven that Hong Kong’s notorious Sun Yee On criminal triad was involved.

A few months after the event Deng discussed the incident with Chinese-American academic Li Zhengdao, “In suppressing the turmoil we were at pains to avoid hurting people, especially the students; that was our guiding principle” and criticized his colleague Zhao Ziyang whom, he said, “was clearly exposed as siding with the agitators and attempting to split the Party” and reportedly told West German Chancellor Helmut Schmidt, “the students should not be blamed too much. The roots of the problem lay within the leadership of the Party”.

In The Legacy of Tiananmen James A. R. Miles explained, “A year after Tiananmen, Deng elaborated on his fears of civil war during a meeting with the former Canadian prime minister Pierre Trudeau. ‘You can imagine,’ Deng said, ‘what China in turmoil would be like. If turmoil erupts in China, it wouldn’t just be a Cultural Revolution-type problem. At that time (during the Cultural Revolution) you still had the prestige of the elder generation of leaders such as Mao Zedong and Zhou Enlai. Even though it was described as ‘all-out civil war,’ actually there wasn’t any major fighting. It wasn’t a proper civil war. Now it’s not at all the same. If turmoil erupts again, to the extent that the party is no longer effective and state power is no longer effective and one faction grabs one part of the army and another faction grabs another part of the army–that would be civil war. If some so-called democratic fighters seize power, they’ll start fighting among themselves. As soon as civil war breaks out there’ll be rivers of blood. What would be the point then of talking about ‘human rights’? As soon as civil war breaks out, local warlords will spring up everywhere, production will plummet, communications will be severed, and it won’t be a matter of a few million or even tens of millions of refugees. There’d be well over a hundred million people fleeing the country and the first to be affected would be Asia, now the most promising part of the world. It would be a global disaster’”.

Singapore’s Lee Kwan Yew later said he would have shot 200,000 demonstrators to maintain stability and U.S. Ambassador Charles Freeman opined, “I cannot conceive of any American government behaving with the ill-conceived restraint that the Zhao Ziyang administration did in China, allowing students to occupy zones that are the equivalent of the Washington National Mall and Times Square combined, while shutting down much of the Chinese government’s normal operations”.

The CIA’s operational analysis attributed the failure to ‘the difficulty of mobilizing young activists in the desired direction due to lack of strong polarizations in Chinese society’ and Chinese analysts attributed the lack of strong polarizations in Chinese society to the Cultural Revolution, which Mao had conducged specifically for that purpose.

Students had discovered their leader, Chai Ling, leaving the square and, accusing her of abandoning them to die, detained her. She escaped and recorded a speech saying that she witnessed at least twenty students and workers being massacred in the Square. She was given a scholarship to Princeton University and nominated for the 1990 Nobel Peace Prize. Though he had left the Square hours before the military arrived, another leader, Wu’er Kaixi claimed that he witnessed tanks killing hundreds of protesters by driving over them as they slept.Liu Xiaobo, later awarded the Nobel Peace Prizehelped the students avoid bloodshed and was pardoned. He, too, said that nobody in the Square was harmed.

The vice-president of the Tiananmen student body and leader of the riot in Chang’An Avenue, Wang Yam, was smuggled to the UK and given British citizenship. In 2006 he was tried in London, in the first British murder trial to be held in secret, for bludgeoning to death an elderly man. The Crown Prosecutor demanded that Wang’s trial be held in camera and the trial judge assented and gagged media speculation. Wang Yam was convicted of first degree murder and MI6, Britain’s intelligence agency, admitted that he was their employee.

In 1998, President Bill Clinton discussed the incident with President Jiang Zemin, as John Border⁠13 reported, “The drama of the meeting came in a remarkable 70-minute news conference, carried live on nationwide Chinese television, in which the two Presidents differed sharply on the nature of personal freedom, the role of the state and the meaning of the Tiananmen Square demonstrations that were violently suppressed by the Chinese Government in June 1989…Mr. Clinton flatly told the Chinese leader that his Government had been ‘wrong’ to use force to end the peaceful demonstrations of the spring of 1989 and that broad personal freedom and political expression were the price of admission to the world community of the 21st century. ‘For all of our agreements, we still disagree about the meaning of what happened then,’ Mr. Clinton said in his opening statement, referring to the violent crackdown on Tiananmen Square the night of June 3-4, 1989, that left hundreds of protesters dead”.

Three years after Tiananmen, in response to demonstrations in Los Angeles, President Bush sent in thousands of troops saying “There can be no excuse for the murder, arson, theft or vandalism that have terrorized the people of Los Angeles… Let me assure you that I will use whatever force is necessary to restore order”. Sixty-six people died, eleven thousand were arrested, and the media called the President’s action ‘decisive’. The following year, when President Clinton ordered federal forces to attack a Christian community in Waco, Texas, they killed eighty-one men, women and children. No-one was disciplined.


[1] Mandate of Heaven: The Legacy of Tiananmen Square and the Next Generation. By Orville Schell.

[2] China’ Education Reform in the 1980s Policies, Issues, and Historical Perspectives. SUZANNE PEPPER. 1990. INSTITUTE OF EAST ASIAN STUDIES UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA AT BERKELEY CENTER FOR CHINESE STUDIES.

[3] China Rising: The Meaning of Tiananmen

[4] Mike Chinoy, China Live: Two Decades in the Heart of the Dragon, p.242.

[5] University Workers in the Tiananmen Protests: The Politics of the Beijing Workers’ AutonomousFederation. Author(s): Andrew G. Walder and Gong Xiaoxia Source: The Australian Journal of Chinese Affairs, No. 29 (Jan., 1993), pp. 1-29.

[6] Cries for Democracy: Writings and Speeches from the 1989 Chinese Democracy Movement (Princeton Univ. Press, 1990), p. 327.

[7] When the author queried Dr. Hsiung, he replied, “It could have been in a paper (report) I gave at a meeting in New York. The meeting had been scheduled long before the June 4 1989. I was supposed to give a paper at the meeting. But, since I had come only a few days before when the meeting took place, I did not have the time to write a paper. So, I gave a report on what I witnessed at the Tiananmen Square, instead.

I can assure you that I received very strong, almost tumultuous, reactions in response. One person in the audience even said: “Don’t think you can fool us. We witnessed it too, from the TV shorts”. So, watching TV made him an eye witness, too.

If you can read Chinese, I did have an article written on the 20th anniversary of the June 4th tragedy, titled: “一個天安門事件 ‘變相受害者’ 的喊冤回憶”, (The Painful Reminiscences of a “Virtual Victim“ of the Tiananmen Event, published in Taiwan’s Straits’ Review (海峽評論),No. 223 (July, 2009), pp. 173-178.

The Straits Review can be reached by e-mail at: <[email protected]>.

If you write, pls. ask for Mr. Shu-tao FU (福蜀濤)。 He knows me. In fact, he asked me for the article.

[8] Che Muqi: «Beijing turmoil – More than meets the eye», Foreign language press, Beijing 1990, ISBN 0-8351-2459-2; 7-119-01305-X

[9] Coverage of the Crisis



[10] Behind the Scenes: Tank Man of Tiananmen, NYT

[11] The Vancouver Sun; Vancouver, B.C. [Vancouver, B.C]17 Sep 1992: A20 (1st Edition)

[12] The Myth of Tiananmen

[13] The New York Times

• Category: History • Tags: American Media, China, Tiananmen massacre 
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  1. Anonymous [AKA "ClintonsForkedTongue"] says:

    So Bill Clinton lectures Jiang Zemin in 1998 about how bad it is to use force against protesters.

    Funny how he said Yeltsin was “on the right side of history” after an undisputed massacre of hundreds in Moscow protesting Yeltsin’s actions:

    ~~In late 1991, after the fall of the Soviet Union, Boris Yeltsin won a year of special powers from the Russian Parliament: for one year, he was to be, in effect, the dictator of Russia to facilitate the midwifery of the birth of a democratic Russia. In March of 1992, under pressure from a discontented population, parliament repealed the dictatorial powers it had granted him. Yeltsin responded by declaring a state of emergency, giving himself the repealed dictatorial powers. Russia’s Constitutional Court ruled that Yeltsin was acting outside the constitution. But the US sided – against the Russian people and against the Russian Constitutional Court – with Yeltsin.

    Intoxicated with American support, Yeltsin dissolved the parliament that had rescinded his powers and abolished the constitution of which he was in violation. In a 636-2 vote, the Russian parliament impeached Yeltsin. But President Bill Clinton again sided with Yeltsin against the Russian people and Russian law, giving him $2.5 billion in aid. Clinton was interfering in the Russian people’s choice of leaders.

    Yeltsin took the money and sent police officers and elite paratroopers to surround the parliament building. Clinton “praised the Russian President has (sic) having done ‘quite well’ in managing the standoff with the Russian Parliament,” as The New York Times reported at the time. Clinton added that he thought “the United States and the free world ought to hang in there” with their support of Yeltsin against his people, their constitution and their courts, and judged Yeltsin to be “on the right side of history.”

    On the right side of history and armed with machine guns, Yeltsin’s troops opened fire on the crowd of protesters, killing about 100 people before setting the Russian parliament building on fire. By the time the day was over, Yeltsin’s troops had killed an unconfirmed 500 people and wounded nearly 1,000. Still, Clinton stood with Yeltsin. He provided ludicrous cover for Yeltsin’s massacre, claiming that “I don’t see that he had any choice…. If such a thing happened in the United States, you would have expected me to take tough action against it.” Clinton’s secretary of state, Warren Christopher, said that the US supported Yeltsin’s suspension of parliament in these “extraordinary times.”~~

  2. Biff says:

    One must stand in awe of the U.S streamlined mass media to completely bamboozle the American public. It is the largest most effective propaganda instrument ever known to man kind.

    • Agree: Mike P, Per/Norway
    • Replies: @Erebus
  3. Erebus says:

    All, repeat all of the spoon-fed official narratives, from the Holocaust, to the Cold War, to Tiananmen Sq, to JFK, to 9/11, to the recent tsunami of “rape/terror/mass shooting attacks”, and 100 smaller ones in between, have but the most tenuous connection to real events.

    Every time one gets interested in some event and removes the topsoil, one finds oneself staring into a deep subterranean sea of non-sequiturs, lies and absurdities.

    It really is amazing, but I’m guessing that it’s ever been thus, and that ever since language was invented, experience, perception, and human behaviour/reaction has been been a product of the prevailing narrative, and little besides.

    The human need for an understandable explanation seems as boundless as the number of possible narratives that can be formulated. Whoever generates something half-way satisfactory, rules them.

    • Replies: @Mike P
    , @Wally
  4. m___ says:


    Power requires stealth. Thus, anything in the public domain is a lie in a broader sense. Either out of context, insignificant, distraction and on. The “great” Noam Chomsky prides himself on the infusion “and readily available in public sources”, repeated many times over during his “distinguished” career financed by conventional sources. There is no better example of infusing value to propaganda up the “derrière” of the ignorants.

    Now, the single escalation is being global disinformation. Propaganda is the news. Is historical. Academia, not only media, the judicial system, politicians are mercenaries of the globalistic, in-group oriented elites, dwelling internationally in safe-bulbs, safe-havens, the rest of planetary territory is wastelands, the “ghettos” being larger then the bulbs.

    Imagine, IA, biology of genetics, nanotechnology, robotisation at hand, and tools for domination of a-l-l identities, groups, sub-groups of deplorables indifferently are abundant.

    Betrayed by their own, the commoner anywhere, does not seem to comprehend, is fast asleep focussing exclusively on the between groups of different identities variations in joke, it’s imposition, and secondly on individual consumer drifts and the equivalent consumption of digital trash.

    The editorial focus for one on ethnical group differences, is equally flawed, in the sense of importance given to group differences. There is more of the same, then differences between groups with an identity based on religion, ethnicity, territory. Muslims, Christians and their sub-groups, ethnicities, gender, territory. It is a deadbeat to pretend as a deplorable that is coincidentally confined to US territory to consider oneself an “American”, rather then part of bulk humanity regardless.

    The real problems and solutions are planetary, hence require organizing accordingly, if to have a chance to partake the future. The global elites core seem to have understood, as the single group part of the message. The infighting seems to be peetered out far from their live-bulbs, allowing for zero physical risk, and war looking like policing.

    Thus, as a prediction, propaganda should be noticed smoothing out and synchronizing, streamlining over larger swats of territory, over any divide, and accentuate virulent insignificant differences to keep interest alive.

    Some commenter elsewhere on this site(a search will drop you there, his comment is worth reading), suggests the term: Corporatacracy. When we learn to name the beast, our conversations could gain in comprehension.

    Assange and Wikileaks, is about the only meaningful method to combat propaganda. And …as we can see, very little publicity given to the single factor of importance to turn a tide of complete dominance of bulk humanity by a less then one percent sub-group of their own.

  5. Anonymous [AKA "Kaz Augustin"] says:

    Interesting and much in the same line as the book “Tiananmen Square ‘Massacre’?” by Wei Ling Chua (2014). Recommended. His bio at the end of the book reads:

    “Wei Ling Chua is a freelance journalist accredited by the Australia News and Feature Services (ANFS) and the International News Syndicate (INS). However, since 2009 he has been banned from accessing any of the benefits derived from his accredited membership due to an assignment he submitted to the Morris Journalism Academy questioning the honesty and ethics of the Western media. Wei Ling specialises in media disinformation.”

  6. vinteuil says:

    Do you really expect much of anybody to wade through your version of all this ancient history – especially after your previous efforts?

    Mao & Maoism are dead and buried, and no longer have much relevance to anything at all.

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  7. Miro23 says:

    For all its failures, tragedies and confusions, the Tiananmen incident ranks among the most successful propaganda campaigns in history. Long after the massacre story was disproved, foreign journalists–all of whom had left the Square–told readers that students had been demanding Western values in the face of ‘Red Chinese totalitarianism’. Their fabricated massacre gave the West an excuse to embargo China yet again, and to label it an international human rights pariah.

    That’s the story I got, and what I believed up to reading this article.

    What the US urgently needs, is the occupation of Washington by students demanding Western values in the face of “Zio-Globalist PC totalitarianism” and an end to Middle East wars – with everyone filming and reporting on it.

    How would Trump and Congress react to this?

  8. Mike P says:

    All, repeat all of the spoon-fed official narratives … have but the most tenuous connection to real events … non-sequiturs, lies and absurdities.

    I agree with you. May I ask you how long did it take you to realize this? Was it gradual, or did it happen all at once? Idle curiosity, not offended if you prefer not to answer.

    BTW we can add “climate change” to the list, as well as the moon landings.

    • Replies: @Erebus
    , @mulga mumblebrain
  9. neutral says:

    Democracy is the enemy of the majority of any nations population, the narrative that it is a form of government that reflects the will of the people is a complete joke. If the government truly cares about its own people then it must do everything in its power to crush pro “democracy” protests and sometimes literally crush these people with tanks.

    • Agree: dfordoom
  10. Good, well-researched article, and this time free of embarrassing Maoist hagiography.

    Even without this historical background, it always struck me as absurd that the Chinese government would (or should) tolerate a bunch of student rabble making radical demands in the very heart of the imperial capital. Failure to disperse such mobs contributes to catastrophes like 1789, 1848, and 1917.

    Likewise, American involvement always seemed probable to me.

    • Replies: @m___
  11. ohmy says:

    “Democracy, and Freedom”! Well, that’s the ideal. Right? Shades of fascism, all around me, is all I see. Media has matured, morphed into a giant blunt object, used to terrorize us all day. Whipping us unto shape. Move over for the queers and, the unidentified generation . Don’t say this and, don’t say that. Why? You may be attacked. Physically? Maybe.
    Tiananmen Square. I thought I would go to my grave before anyone told the truth about that. Ask a friend old enough to remember Tiananmen Sq. Odds are he or she will say; “yeah, wasn’t that when the Chinese drove tanks over a bunch a kids, squashing them”? Here in present day America, home of the free and the brave, YTD police in the US, across this nation have killed close to 500. It happens every year. Maybe they need to visit Starbucks for sensitivity training.
    Those in power will always be in power. George Carlin pegged it when he humorously said. “It’s a big club and, you ain’t in it”.

  12. kauchai says:

    ” Han Dongping, a student at the time, tells how the sudden relaxation of price controls set off bank runs, panic buying and hoarding.”

    I believe that Milton Friedman had a hand in the above. The “guru of free markets” was “co-opted” as economic adviser to china at the time. Looking at all the literature on this event, I think Friedman’s role in this whole fiasco deserved to be put under the microscope.

    Anyone out there care to enlighten?

  13. Good article..

    Exploitation has been the theme song of the Pharaoh since the time of …; its deeply rooted in the 1897 invention of Zionism, supported by backers of London’s East India Company and it is strongly expressed in the monopoly powers franchised by the pharaoh controlled nation states to Pharaoh owned corporations and to those corruptible few [slave drivers] who agree to rule and regulate the mass of humanity captured within the nation state franchisees; and to do so, at the pleasure of the Pharaoh

    Divide and conquer methods have allowed Pharaohs to control the masses through proxy servants [slave drivers]since before … The Pharaoh has for centuries divided our global human existence into controllable structures; modernly called nation states, and appointed slave drivers to extort and to remove from the pockets of the governed slaves “large parts of the value governed slaves can produce”.

    United the masses have all of the power, divided the power is balanced, making it easy for Pharaohs to manipulate the outcomes; it being necessary only to maintain between side polarity (a major function of propaganda).

    Separate the masses into groups, isolate and limit inter group communications, filter everyone’s access to knowledge except as need to know demands or as propaganda needs dictate. Pit one group against the other in never ending battles by presenting scam after scam (abortion, nuclear weapons, WMDs, guns, education, gay rights, human rights, environment, terrorism, whatever) anything that will divide the awesome powers that united, focused masses of humanity can bring to the table.

    Render the masses as polarized groups, which I will called net sum zero binaries. Net sum zero binaries reduce the power of the masses to the net remainder power after the polarized sizes have been merged ( A votes yes, B votes no, the result of the vote is NADA). Quantify this by example: united =1,010 slaves vs 10 Pharaohs, divided into pro gay rights and anti gay rights groups, we have 500 pro gay rights and 500 anti-gay rights, they cancel each other, 10 people don’t care, and so half of them are in each of the two groups. They vote and the net result of the vote 505 vs 505.. Ah, but the Pharaoh has a vote, and he or she caste the deciding vote. This is how it works and why propaganda is so important to the divide and conquer machinery.

    Divide the nations against each other, then divide the people within each of the nations against each other, then divide the divided sides, into subdivided factions. Division after division renders united masses of humanity into weak, powerless binaries. The divided binary
    Pharaohs stabilize their powers by working with divided binaries.

    Popular protests merge the binaries, re establish the right of self determination and give strength to powers inherent in target united masses of humanity. It is for this reason, that the nation states of the world, rarely discipline one of their own for using state power to murder masses of humans organizing to encourage an unauthorized objective. The power of self determination must not be allowed to exist in the masses, but between nations it is highly defended as state sovereignty. Justifications such as Capitalist marketization, capitalism, socialism, communism, Nazism, whatever are just that, Pharaoh ploys seeking to justify their wanton plan that cause the middle men (those in structural control of the society) to destroy its own humanity whenever that humanity finds ways to unite.

  14. ok, that second tank picture just made the original tank picture into fucking propaganda. daaamn.

    nice article.

    • Replies: @Joe Wong
  15. Alden says:

    Being the cynic that I am I always assumed the whole thing was a propaganda show. I assumed the show was put on by Chinese government upper classes.

    They wanted to make it easier to loosen communist austerity and return to the traditional Chinese upper class worship of money and consumption.

    Students yuck. They’ve been used by the powers that be for centuries. If a government wants a stable society, provide job training for 14 to 18year olds and stop funding the useful idiots.

  16. Anon[425] • Disclaimer says:

    Three years after Tiananmen, in response to demonstrations in Los Angeles, President Bush sent in thousands of troops saying “There can be no excuse for the murder, arson, theft or vandalism that have terrorized the people of Los Angeles… Let me assure you that I will use whatever force is necessary to restore order”. Sixty-six people died, eleven thousand were arrested, and the media called the President’s action ‘decisive’.

    No. LA Riot was a full-blown riot, and the state was very slow to respond. And it was not about freedom and justice but total craziness. And most people were killed by the general melee, not by government forces. It was about blacks doing what they do best: Mayhem.

    LA Riot was an example of government inaction. Bush sent in troops after the city burned down.

    The following year, when President Clinton ordered federal forces to attack a Christian community in Waco, Texas, they killed eighty-one men, women and children. No-one was disciplined.

    WACO ended badly and one could argue that the government acted irresponsibly. But it was about a crazy cult that violated all sorts of laws. It was nothing like the Chinese protests that were, by and large, for more freedom and liberty.

    I’ll grant that foreign elements tried to manipulate events in China. And many young protesters were deluded and even a bit nutty. But it was a massive protest, and the themes were generally sound.
    If one could argue in favor of the government crackdown, one could argue China wasn’t ready for that kind of revolution, i.e. it’s better for a nation to gradually grow into a society of increased liberties under economic control and social stability. After all, Taiwan and South Korea both gradually moved toward democracy. Democracy is expensive. It requires a vast middle class, a large educated class, and etc. China in 1989 was still backward and mostly a peasant economy. It wasn’t ready for democracy.

    • Replies: @Alden
    , @Alden
  17. @vinteuil

    ‘Mao & Maoism are dead and buried, and no longer have much relevance to anything at all.’?

    Only if you believe our media. Otherwise, every Chinese politician quotes him and studies him, and so do all the leading businessmen like Jack and Pony Ma.

    • Replies: @El Dato
    , @Howling wolf
  18. I tend to be skeptical of the TienAnMen Square revisionism, although there are a few good points.

    Thing is, at the time, I had friends who were foreign students from China. (Bush I allowed each and every one of them to stay in the US forever, which hurt Americans in STEM, but that is a different matter.)

    Some of my friends had friends who were at TienAnMen Square at various times. Some of them left before the massacre, others were still there. In one case I met someone who had been there during the massacre and I got a first-hand account of events.

    In addition, a friend of my mother wrote a book with lots of pictures of events that night. Those were real pictures, not fakes.

    Here is what is true about this article: there were serious divisions amongst the students. At one point, not long before the massacre, most students left. One of those students sent a letter to a close friend of mine explaining why she left. According to this student, the students realized what sort of people their leaders were.

    As for the massacre: I’ve seen photos, and I talked to someone who was there a couple of weeks afterwards. I went to a welcoming party for the guy, and at one point the Chinese students were singing patriotic songs. The massacre survivor burst into tears when the other students started singing The Internationale.

    He said the students welcomed the soldiers, and greeted them with patriotic songs. When the students were singing The Internationale, the soldiers opened fire.

    So, do I believe first hand accounts, when there are a lot of photos of the carnage that evening? Or do I believe someone who seems to have an agenda based on third-hand reports?

  19. anon[228] • Disclaimer says:
    @Paleo Liberal

    Not believing that US had no hand , had no real hand , or believing US had only indirect moral hand of vocal support and nothing else, would be like looking at the river at two different points or 3 or 4 different points separated by hundreds of miles and then claim that those points on the river stream are not connected or united by same stream.

    Syrian plans in 1950, successful Guatemala plans in 1950s and Iran success in 1960 are all connected and are to latest attempt on Syria , efforts to dislodge Iran regime and efforts to create chaos in Russia.

    China just fits right in the middle

  20. Alden says:

    President Bush never sent the army to Los Angeles during the Rodney King riot. The governor of the state sent the state troops, the volunteer National Guard to stop the riot.

    The Rodney King riot and the OJ Simpson acquittal by 10 out of 12 black jurors was the end of black dominance in Los Angeles.

    When the riots ended discussions were held at the very highest level. Politicians liberals and Jews were not invited to those discussions, only the business finance and real estate people that really rule the city and county.

    The owners of the Los Angeles Times were allowed to attend but were told their input and opinions were not welcome. The Tines people were there to be told what was going to happen. The rest of the media were not invited.

    Result of those meetings was the Hispanic invasion of black Los Angeles, affirmative action in government jobs for Hispanics instead of blacks. It was the beginning of a White Hispanic Asian coalition against the old Jewish black coalition that led to the riots and the OJ acquittal
    Interesting that the Jews put black Mator Bradley in as a solution to racial problems after the Watts riots and the King riots happened in his last term.

    Fewer blacks, less crime. And some competent pleasant civil servants instead of nothing but surly hateful black civil

    • Replies: @Miro23
    , @Ron Unz
  21. DB Cooper says:
    @Paleo Liberal

    My problem with the TienAnMen narrative in the West is that the photos of dead soldiers killed by the people are censored. I am not denying that no civilians were killed, I have seen pictures of them. But photos of soldiers burnt to a crisp and hanged under overpass, propped up at the stairs of a pedestrian bridge, in front of burnt out personnel armor vehicles…etc. are never shown in the media. I suspect that the reason these pictures, widely available and seen by millions by people in Taiwan and Hong Kong, are censored is that it does not fit nicely to a narrative of peaceful protesters against an oppressive government. Another important point is that the government did not proactively kill the protesters. It react violently after unarmed troops were killed by the protesters, most likely by Molotov cocktails to the unarmed troops trapped in their armor personnel carriers.

    On the other hand, the narrative of ‘peaceful protesters demonstrating for democracy but were gunned down by the hundreds by their government’ did happen in another East Asian country less than a decade ago before Tiananmen Square, 1989. Guess what country is it?

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  22. Alden says:

    Not one person was killed by the national guard troops.

  23. Miro23 says:

    It was the beginning of a White Hispanic Asian coalition against the old Jewish black coalition that led to the riots and the OJ acquittal-

    Maybe a prequel worth seeing.

    Whites alone can’t resist the manic Jewish drive for destruction, but US Asians are natural opponents of PC radicalism, as are Hispanic traditionalists, and they would both be quite ready to dump Jews and Blacks.

    “Hey, Hey, This is a Library” wouldn’t have worked with a White protagonist.

  24. What amazes me about those days in China will always be the acknowledged restraint of the government.

    I always thought there would be no way they would tolerate such dissent.

    • Replies: @Joe Wong
  25. Ron Unz says:

    When the riots ended discussions were held at the very highest level. Politicians liberals and Jews were not invited to those discussions, only the business finance and real estate people that really rule the city and county….

    Result of those meetings was the Hispanic invasion of black Los Angeles, affirmative action in government jobs for Hispanics instead of blacks. It was the beginning of a White Hispanic Asian coalition against the old Jewish black coalition that led to the riots and the OJ acquittal

    That’s a very interesting claim, and certainly not inconsistent with what actually transpired politically over the next few years.

    Can you cite any sources for it, or was it just a local rumor going around in certain circles?

    • Replies: @Alden
  26. Gary says:

    So Rwanda wasn’t what we were told it was, Yugoslavia wasn’t what we were told it was, Iraq wasn’t what we were told it was, and surprise, surprise Tiananmen wasn’t what we were told it was! What next, are you going to tell me the Gulf of Tonkin was made up, and there were no “Kuwaiti incubator babies,” and that Gaddafi didn’t have “viagra fueled rape camps?” Oh, yeah, right, none of those things were true either. Geeze, what a freaking coincidence? It appears you just can’t trust Western MSM CIA war propaganda. Who knew?

    One thing that is clear is that the West’s leadership, as has been the case for the last 500+ years of our planetary pillage project, is completely amoral, unimaginably violent & psychopathic and can never EVER be trusted to tell the truth to we its own citizens. Of course if it did tell us the truth – we’d have to hang them all – each an every one – for treason and crimes against humanity. So instead we ourselves live in our own little navel gazing bubble waiting for the next new iPhone to come out, or for the release of “Ironman 15,” or some other such ultra violent superhero nonsense. Anything, anything but deal with the real world. All while we hopelessly wallow in our own narcissism to the point that we can’t help but imagine that everyone on the planet wants to be “just – like – us.”

    • Replies: @Joe Wong
    , @Alden
  27. Joe Wong says:
    @Astuteobservor II

    The first tank picture (the tank man picture)is also a doctored picture, the tanks got re-positioned, and the American also manufactured a whole virtual story telling about the scene. No wonder Colin Powell could present the fabricated Iraqi WMD in the UN so convincingly, because they have tried and proved the technique at Tiananmen Square first.

  28. Alden says:
    @Ron Unz

    I knew one of the men who was active in it. He keeps a very low profile. He’s a major real estate developer, union league club bohemian club Jonathan club California club daughters 4th generation at Yale upper level type person.
    The catholic cardinal and bishops were involved too.
    Even the non real estate people were furious because real estate values went down for a year or so after the riots.

    I never heard rumors about it.

    It sure worked. I don’t think there are any black activists left in Los Angeles.

  29. Joe Wong says:

    Most of the CCP 1st generation leaders were students who started out their revolution lives during the Fifth May movement. They have empathy with the students. Most of the Westerners are brainwashed by the Western colonial imperialists from cradle to grave so deep that they did not know they are brainwashed and had an ideology.

  30. Alden says:

    Tianemin square however it’s spelled was a disaster for America because it let in gazillions of Chinese to glom up all the old age housing, SSI, Medicare free bus passes free food, take all the STEM jobs and raise housing price by crowding 20 people into small houses.

    Man I know owned a liquor store and sold it a Chinese immigrant. Buyer asked seller where do you sleep? At home of course. The buyer moved wife kids pair of FOB grandparents who never worked a day in the US glomming up SSI

    He went back and visited out of curiosity Sure enough they were living in the store room, fridge stove and bunk beds clothes stored in trash bags.

    • Replies: @Joe Wong
  31. Joe Wong says:

    “Gulf of Tonkin” was an American false flag op. “Kuwaiti incubator babies,” was a fabrication, the 15 year old witness Nayirah al-Ṣabaḥ was the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador to the United States. All conflicts involved USA around the world directly or indirectly were manufactured, directed or instigated by the USA covertly or overtly.

  32. Alden says:

    Everyone else on the planet might not want to be just like us, but they sure want. to live in Europe, actually N W Europe because it has higher welfare than S or E Europe, Canada, the US and Australia

    So we must be doing something right

    • Replies: @Joe Wong
  33. Alden says:

    Maybe probably not. That was a coalition in one city to drive out the 10 percent of the population that caused 99 percent of the problems in that one year.

    The horror because real estate values went down was something to behold.

  34. Alden says:

    Los Angeles didn’t burn down. The blacks set some fires in their own ghetto neighborhoods businesses.

    Those neighborhoods were soon rejuvenated by respectable Hispanic residents and small businesses including a lot of reasonably honest excellent work reasonably priced auto repair shops owned by Hispanics.

    The chain stores, smaller stores medical offices are thriving in the formerly black neighborhoods

    It’s not the job of the president to send in troops to put down riots It’s the job of the governor to send in the national guard when local law enforcement can’t control the criminals.

  35. @Miro23

    In reality, it did not work with a white protagonist.

    Ask Alexandra Wallace.

    • Replies: @Miro23
  36. Wally says:

    “All, repeat all of the spoon-fed official narratives, from the Holocaust, to the Cold War, to Tiananmen Sq, to JFK, to 9/11, to the recent tsunami of “rape/terror/mass shooting attacks”, and 100 smaller ones in between, have but the most tenuous connection to real events.”

    Indeed, the public is awakening to the ‘holocau$t’ Big Lie cam.

    Get the facts here:

    The ‘6M Jews, 5M others, & gas chambers’ are scientifically impossible frauds.
    see the ‘holocaust’ scam debunked here:
    No name calling, level playing field debate here:


  37. Miro23 says:

    You’ve got a point there. Asians are into studying, but they’ve got a more active way of doing it, and don’t mind a bit of multi-tasking.

    The Blacks in the library aren’t there to study, and Jews nowadays don’t seem much interested in going there either. So Alexandra’s just doing what she can.

    The point is that Whites can’t face off Black/Prog activists activists but Asians can (Why? Because the activists have a large package of memes developed specifically to attack White targets – but nothing for Asians – ergo – they are speechless).

    I don’t have any problem with her video or the Chinese guy. It’s Free Speech – as in legitimate differences of opinion, but she’s right that libraries are traditionally quiet places. Karl Marx caused a lot of problems outside the British Museum Reading Room, but while he was there he kept quiet.

  38. Joe Wong says:

    You are lying without blinking an eye. People has STEM jobs do not live like the White trashes glomming up all the old age housing, SSI, Medicare free bus passes, free food, and crowding 20 people into small houses.

    Bill Gates started up Microsoft in his parents’ garage while staying in his parents’ house too. You should pay a visit to that liquor store Chinese owner, he can offer you a gardening job for his monster home in the suburb so you do not need to glom up SSI for a change.

  39. Joe Wong says:

    The North America does not belong to the White aliens, it belongs to the First Nations of the North America, if you are in the North America, then go back to the old continent where you came from. If you are in Europe then put up a tall wall stopping aliens going into your old continent, don’t just whine.

  40. denk says:

    In 1965, MI6 planted fake news in its HK organ about impending coup in Indonesia , allegedly orchestrated by Beijing and supported by Chinese ‘fifth columns’.
    That gave excuse for the Suharto regime to launch a genocidal war on ‘leftists’ and ‘Chinese sympathizers’, at least three millions people were slaughtered like sacrificial lambs in that bloodbath.

    until this day,
    Company‘ veterans still reminiscent fondly over that CIAs greatest hit when gather around the water dispensers

    In 1989, fukus [CIA/MI6] orchestrated the mother of all ‘occupy centre‘ in TAM, BEIJING. Thousands of students workers occupied TAM to protest on corruption, runaway inflation etc etc. Numerous attempts by CCP failed to persuade the protestors to leave the square.
    After weeks of occupation, the square had become a sanitary nightmare, on the eve of Gorbachev state visit, CCP decided to clear the mess.

    Unarmed troops were sent in to remove the students initially. I vividly recalled watching on the tube, unarmed PLA troops in fatigue kits arriving in TAM , after a long jog from their base camps many miles away.
    The amused foreign correspondents were saying the troops , in their condition, dont seem ready and too eager to engage the protestors from the square.
    I chuckled to myself and went to bed, thinking that all was well, nothing to worry about.

    The next morning I woke up to find that all hell had broken loose during the night. The tubes, the papers were all blaring about ‘massacre in TAM‘, ‘thousands of unarmed students slaughtered’/,,,,,,,,,

    Once again, the mi6 used its HK conduit to propagate fake news, which was immediately lapped up by all the five lies press and disseminated to the world. [1]

    Only years later as bits and pieces of facts eventually dripped out , we started to know what really happened that night in TAM.

    the first wave of unarmed soldiers were brutally attacked by agent provocateurs in the crowds , then Beijing sent in armed reinforcements which clashed with the embedded rioters in the alleys around TAM. hundreds were killed in the melee, including many soldiers .

    But as is always the case,
    A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.
    It was the fukus blatent lies that persist to this day, viz

    Sounds familiar ?

    Kosovo, Libya, Syria, Iraq, Sudan, Myanmar, Salisbury, Skripal ….?

    The five lies just couldnt stop lying.

    Mathews traces much of the problem to a Hong Kong newspaper that immediately, after the 1989 disturbance, ran a long story under the name of an alleged student protester. He claimed he was at the square when troops arrived with machine guns to mow down students in the hundreds.

    Distributed around the globe, the article was seen as final proof that the original BBC and other massacre reports were accurate. But the alleged author of that report was never located, and for good reason: The article was almost certainly planted — one of the many black information operations organized by British intelligence over the years.

    • Replies: @Joe Wong
  41. Joe Wong says:

    If one looks around, one can find the whole world’s ills were created by the Anglo.

    • Replies: @denk
  42. denk says:
    @Paleo Liberal

    If there were any incriminating evidence of a massacre it would have already been splashed across the front pages of all the msm years ago .
    Except there were none….zero, nada, zilch.

    Not that it matters .
    the five lies citizens were very well trained, they’d simply parrots anything fed from the msm, in spite of the presstitudes serial lying track record !

    There were tons of photos of murdered soldiers tho, many were burned to charcoals. wonder why not even one made it to the front page of Gaurdian etc etc ?

    A whitewash of epic scale.

    What they’ve been hiding from you, the fotos that told a different story/……

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  43. denk says:
    @Joe Wong

    That’d be fukus,
    coming from an Ex anglophile who’s since woken up.


  44. Anonymous[415] • Disclaimer says:

    This article makes some very valuable and insightful points. I had never realized how much the student and worker protests was powered by economic grievances and more importantly the intra-party power struggle in the background. The Maoist faction opposed Deng and enabled along the students allowing them to take over the capital and occupy it by the hundreds of thousands to serve as a cudgel against Deng.

    However, there’s just too much one-sided BS and faulting an external power in this account to make it credible. That’s sad because there is so much of value in this take.

    What I particularly dislike about this article:

    1. Omits or really glosses over the existence of a massacre in the disproportionate use of force against the workers (but not the students at Tiananmen Square). Three subway stations west of Tiananmen Square is Muxidi. At the bridge there scores of people were massacred by troops on a Bloody Sunday rampage against the rioting workers.

    2. I’ll take your word for it that the CIA started supporting the students. Soros had a trouble making fund that made donations starting years before. What did the donations, Voice of America broadcasts, and students on the CIA’s payroll amount to in terms of significance? Ultimately it was a completely Chinese uprising by students and workers with economic grievances and a faction of power the elite that opened the way for them so that it could retake power. It should be clear that while the USG wanted regime change, they mostly had just the power to watch.

    3. The workers might not have cared much about democracy and freedom of speech but the students certainly did put it at the top of the agenda. To borrow a phrase from commentator AaronB, intellectual men really want to have a secure spiritual and moral footing for endeavors to give their actions meaning, make it more than about clawing back student stipends and securing better job prospects. Democracy and free speech provided that foundation.

  45. Erebus says:
    @Mike P

    Well, it seems I’ve always been a bit of a contrarian, if teacher comments in my public school report cards are any indication. I guess the “realization” you’re asking about came gradually overall, punctuated by several distinct steps that abruptly propelled my scepticism to a new level. The latter have been coming thick and fast over the last decade.

    I am now at the point where my default approach to whatever the Wurlitzer is trying to make me believe is to assume it’s lying, and such interest I may have in its lies is academic – namely, who’s Wurlitzer is it, what direction is it trying to steer public opinion in, and to what end?

    … All lies and jest. Still, a man hears what he wants to hear. And disregards the rest…

    • Agree: Mike P
    • Replies: @Mike P
  46. @Paleo Liberal

    ” do I believe first hand accounts, when there are a lot of photos of the carnage that evening? Or do I believe someone who seems to have an agenda based on third-hand reports?”

    There’s no need for belief. With a little investigation we can discover the truth.

    Can you give us the names and contact addresses of your contacts who said they were in the Square? We can check with them.

    Can you give us links to their photographs and we can check them for you? That would be a start.

  47. @DB Cooper

    How many photos of the LA Riots and the Waco Massacre do you see in our media?

  48. DB Cooper says:

    Meanwhile no one is interested in (or have even heard of) the Gwangju Uprising when over hundreds of peaceful pro-democracy demonstrators were gunned down by the government troops.

    • Replies: @denk
  49. vk says: • Website

    First things first: there’s no doubt Tiananmen Square was a counter-revolutionary, color revolution style operation designed to topple China’s socialist system and install a capitalist regime. The six reivindication points make it clear for any good reader. They were riding the wave of the fall of the USSR (Iron Curtain, Berlin Wall) to do the same in China. Too bad for them Deng Xiaoping found it out in time, and acted quickly.

    But I would like to highlight the lasting effects 1989 had in the USA:

    1) it gave birth to the famous theory of “middle-class revolution/revolt” in China. This theory states that, as Chinas grows and interacts with the “superior” Western values (i.e. representative/bourgeois democracy) and system (i.e. capitalism), it will create a huge, “affluent” middle class, big enough to easily topple the CCP. This theory disseminated in the USA after the end of the 80s, and served as a political rationale for the American capitalists — Republicans, Democrats and Independents — to accelerate their outsourcing to China: a movement that culminated with Trump’s election in November 2016.

    2) it gave the West the false pretense/discourse (denial?) that the reforms of Deng Xiaoping were capitalists or made China a full-fledged capitalist country, i.e. that Deng Xiaoping actually crushed a revolution, not a counter-revolution. So, every time a false flag operation fails in China, the American elite, in order to appease its left-wing, uses this narrative as a consolation prize.

  50. Mike P says:

    For me, the “fast and thick” came over the last less than a year – quite a journey. Makes me feel like an ass, too, for having taken so long.

  51. denk says:
    @DB Cooper


    I posted a comment there too .

  52. m___ says:

    On the cognitive capabilities that influence decision making.

    It would be possible to reverse engineer the cognitive capacity of the Chinese decision making elites on data spanning other fields of social and economic issues. The outcome: possibly? higher cognitive capacity would do the explaining of a more streamlined and discrete decision making system.

    That in itself would be a guarantor of how the 1989 elites handled the issue of Tiananmen.

    How the US “stoked” betting on disruption is probable. How a higher IQ on average student body steered their resentment, and compliance, as compared to Occupy Wallstreet seems on the same theoretical base plausible. That the “conventional” side of the government did not push for internationally explaining the “what” was again, on a theoretical basis, the logical follow up. Better decision making needs less propaganda.

  53. The Tianmen Square events were surely more complex than a demonic government pitted against angelic students. But the author entirely loses his credibility with his claim that the tank picture is fake – and it’s shameful that some UNZ commenters gullibly accepted his claim without a moment’s thought.

    It took me literally five seconds to paste “tianmen square tank” into youtube, and sixty seconds of viewing to confirm that the tanks were headed towards the protester, who did block the first one, and even climbed on top of it. Further checking reveals multiple videos, photos, and first-person accounts.

    An interesting lesson in fake news.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
    , @El Dato
  54. DB Cooper says:
    @New Dealer

    The tank man picture is not fake, but is certainly not what you think.

    The mayhem happened in the late night of June 3rd, early hours of June 4th, 1989. By the morning of June 4th the crowd has long been dispersed and all is quiet and the city was in a virtual lock down, for several days. You can see from the clip that the tank man event occurred in broad day night. It actually happened several days later and is not directly related to the mob violence and the subsequent crackdown on the night of June 3rd/early hours of June 4th. What it is showing is actually a guy trying to block a column of tanks from leaving the city after several days of lockdown. The clip doesn’t show how it end here but I remember seeing the man eventually got pull away by some other guy after several minutes of standoff.

  55. denk says:
    @DB Cooper

    fukus hypocrisy knows no bound.

    Fallujah, Iraq, Mosul, Libya, Syria, Kosovo, Indonesia, Nam ., Cambodia, Loas, Afpak, Yemen, Somalia, Sudan, Diego Garcia, Okinawa, Jeju, Korea, …

    Arunachal Pradesh. Assam. Manipur. Meghalaya. Mizoram. Nagaland. Sikkim. Tripura,Kashmir….
    Gujarat, dalits…..

    East Timor, Aceh, West Papua New GUinea….

    Tip of an iceberg.
    Suffice to say that all the confirmed, indisputable genocides since ww2 were perpetrated by none other than China’s accusers themselves, fukusI.

    But it might as well never happened,

    Harold Pinter [RIP] [1]

    It never happened. Nothing ever happened. Even while it was happening it wasn’t happening. It didn’t matter. It was of no interest. The crimes of the United States have been systematic, constant, vicious, remorseless, but very few people have actually talked about them. You have to hand it to America. It has exercised a quite clinical manipulation of power worldwide while masquerading as a force for universal good. It’s a brilliant, even witty, highly successful act of hypnosis

    How did they pull off this ‘disappearance act’ [mh370 !] ?

    by demonising China.

    Its a no brainer, they dont need no proof,
    just do it.
    The five lies citizens will swallow any B.S. fed to them by the presstitudes..
    .’Mao murdered millions, Deng massacred thousands, Tibet, Xinjiang , hell on earth , bully in SCS, an existential threat to Oz, NZ blah blah..’

    One stone kills two birds.

    Due to saturation bombing by western presstitudes, China is already synonymous with ‘evil’, its a consensus across the board, left right and center.

    Lets put the spotlight on China the ‘evil empire‘ 24×7

    So the real criminals , fukusIndia, get away scot free with their wanton killing, torturing, raping , all the while sniggering at China’s humiliation


    somebody should do a an autopsy on Pinter,

  56. Anon[130] • Disclaimer says:
    @Paleo Liberal

    Are you Canspeccy from the 5lies?

    Hmm…so your friends’ friends’ mother’s aunty’s child was in TAM protest(for CIA) witnessing students cornered, mowed down by machine guns & grinded by tanks, yet he/she could escape unscathed miraculously, even flown into US to enjoy Princeton STEM education & leading fairy tale good lives in US of Snakes. There the tearing innocents showed you the bloody TAM photo replacing bloodied & burned soldiers with innocent students, using CIA provided Photoshop Editor.

    Sound all so familiar. Is his name Xi Er Kai En, her name Cailin? You should believe their words as 1st hand account, just as West msm told you so with all doctored photos & evidences.

    I had also seen many display of US HQ Falungong claimed of China tortured photos in my country, yet never a single Chinese friends ever witness or agreed to that. And such cold blooded China leadership who massacre peaceful students is bringing China to miraculous prosperity day by day, enjoying lowest crime rate & high approval support from all Chinese, while all Western countries guided by FUKUSI peace loving leaders are sinking into cesspit of wars, violent crimes & insane migrants policy.

    • Replies: @denk
  57. TT says:

    Mr Godfrey Robert, may i suggest you to also consider writing on below topics that are entangling China with its neighbors, making Asia unable to rise peacefully:

    1) South China Seas
    Is China really the big bully illegally occupying spratly islands with non existing 9 dotted lines, militarizing it while ignoring UN Hague Permanent Arbitary Court order, as below leaders widely claimed?

    Lead by US Prez Obama & now Trump team, Japan PM Abe, Vietnam PM, Philippine Prez Aquino & its subsequent FM, India PM Modi, Spore PM LHL, Indonesia Prez, Oz PM Turnbull, etc. are vehemently blasting China on SCS in every occassions.

    2) Sino- India border war 1962
    Most Indians are harbouring great enmity towards China up to these days, as all their leaders (since India 1st PM Nehru) & msm are still crying China had backstab India by invading an unexpected friendly India on 1962, culminating to their humiliating defeat. China also snatch much of their lands.

    Did China really invade India in 1962 & grab its land, or the other way round?

    -Oz Maxwell said its India that invade China in its endless quest to grab every neighbors’ land since independent from its British master.

    -But for last 50yrs, Indians & West scholars & their government bodies are claiming its China that invaded India, including in their many official records.

    3) Is Diaoyu island actually belonging to China or Japan historically?

    • Replies: @anon
    , @TT
    , @denk
  58. TT says:

    Even with so much open information on TAM, there are no lack of clowns & traitors in Hongkong propagating FUKUS lies on TAM annually, dying for West gift – China Spring & color revolution.

    Bust of Liu Xiaobo on Display in Hong Kong Ahead of Tiananmen Memorial Vigil.

    Fong Zee-yeung, who heads the
    Hong Kong Federation of Social
    Work Students, said many in the
    former British colony draw
    similarities between the 1989
    protests on Tiananmen Square, and
    Occupy Central.
    “We see many similarities between
    the 1989 protests and our
    democracy movement here in Hong
    Kong,” Fong said. “We believe that it
    is our duty as students to engage in
    student movements; we are willing
    to sacrifice more for our community
    because of our status as students.”
    “We hope that we will be able to
    keep alive the spirit of the 1989
    movement here in Hong Kong,” he

    Here are some informative sites on TAM.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  59. DB Cooper says:

    The India Today article is pure BS but this is the kind of nonsense the Indian government has been feeding its people.

    • Replies: @denk
  60. TT says:

    Of course I know, that’s purpose i listed out as contrast example (evidence), there are tons of such Indian & Western official shameless lies & distorted propaganda if you google. Google is working hard under Pichai. Truth sink to bottom, scum float to top in this ZFUKUS world.

    For over 50yrs, Mr Maxwell is the only rare white journalist that will speak the sino-indo war truth. British & murkans are sealing up their archive as MI6-CIA secret, while the rest of world leaders pretending they don’t know.

    Since independent, starting from its 1st PM Nehru, India had been lying shamelessly till now to brainwash its people with hatred, with Modi trying to repeat aggression in Donglang again under ZUS-bloated Indian pride. But China is no longer in 1962 dilapidated civil war aftermath, it will be a disastrous war liberating all India invaded lands & splinter it into many parts. ZFUKUS will swap down like vultures to feast up.

    We saw similar play book of propaganda lies in TAM, Iraq, Libya, Yemen, Afghanistan, Yugoslavia, Cuba, Venezuela, NK,…now in Syria, Iran, Russia & China SCS.

    With pathologic lying ZFUKUS, India & Japan as bearers of truth now, who will need another liar.

  61. TT says:

    If Mr Robert could, pls also research & write on these interesting topic on

    4) US-China Trade wars, why & who will Trump.

    5) China-Vietnam war & Spratly island dispute, oil drilling confrontation

    Many Vietnamese i knew are also harbouring great hatred towards China, been constantly fed with lies of China aggression by ZFUKUS & Vietcon. ZUS, India & Japan are trying hard to herd Vietnam towards clashing with China. Now Russia has its oil driller joining the disputed SCS oil drilling. China has almost the whole world trying to sabotage its rising, including the supposingly ally, Russia.

    Here, the main historical lesson is that China is a constant threat to encroach upon Vietnam, that Vietnam may be swallowed up entirely by China. Can you imagine American kids being taught that their nation’s biggest menace is not Putin, Islamic patsies or Mexican busboys, but the machinations of Israel?

    Why China gave Viet punitive attack:

    I only get to read about China attacked to Vietnam in Lee Kuan Yew memoir. There he said, “after US defeated and fled, North Viet started to invade Cambodia, with Asean next. Vietnam, backed by Soviet, is invincible now. Asean had sent all their armies to Thailand’s border, possibly able to hold few weeks at most. So LKY went to ask Deng XP help. After China unsuccessful to dissuade Vietnam(whose China help rebuilt its economic and infrastructure after war), Chinese army launched punitive short attack to destroy its war capacity, while confronting Soviet million troops at its northern border. Soviet failed to honor its mutual defense treaty with Vietnam to defend it, so Vietnam invincibility war pride got crippled. China save whole Asean with its blood(many thousands soldier dead), so Asia can enjoy peaceful growth for next 30 yrs.”

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  62. denk says:

    George Carlin

    ‘What the US produces in abundance, is bullshit and bombs. It can’t produce a toaster worth shit, it can’t furnish 80 million of its citizens with adequate health care, it can’t keep all of its citizens productively employed, but it sure can bomb the shit out of other countries and it sure can pump out bullshit to justify it. ‘

    • Replies: @anon
  63. denk says:

    Hmm…so your friends’ friends’ mother’s aunty’s child was in TAM protest(for CIA) witnessing students cornered, mowed down by machine guns & grinded by tanks,

    I was once shocked by the audacity of such bald faced lies, but no longer, this is kindergarten stuff by fukus standard.

    We could never fathom the soul , or the lack of it in fukus, lying comes to them as natural as breathing.

    Its in the culture, they had all of five centuries to practice on it, it’s been refined into a science .

    Oh, what a tangled web we weave…when first we practice to deceive

    OTOH, they might have drawn from their own vast experience , in Nam, Iraq, Korea, Cambodia,….

    Crushing civilians with Abram tanks in Fallujah, mowing down apache women/children with Gattling guns, sending hellfires missiles into a crowded market place on a sunday morning in ex yugo, bombing Korea into stone age…the lot.

    • Replies: @TT
  64. denk says:
    @DB Cooper

    When it comes to bullshit, Indian cow dungs are even more exquisite than the murkkan variety.
    If anybody can out con the whiteys it’d be the Indians.

    It figures,
    aint aryan Indians the distant cousins of anglos ?

    • Replies: @TT
    , @Sankaracharya
  65. DB Cooper says:

    By the way I need to clarify one thing that Godfree’s article mischaracterizes the event. It is this sentence.

    “The circumstantial evidence points to an attempted US destabilization of China designed to coincide with the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1989. ”

    The Tiananmen protest starts out as the impromptu gathering of people in the Tiananmen square to grief the untimely death of the beloved and disgraced party secretary Hu Yaobang in mid April. At that time the Soviet Union was far from collapsing, at least from the conventional wisdom of the West. China at that time was actually in a honey moon period with the United States in fighting against the common enemy the Soviet Union and the two countries were cooperative in many areas, including assisting the upgrading of Chinese fighter jet by the United States air force. So I don’t see any reason why the United States will want to disrupt the relation. But as the protest in Tiananmen square drags on it presents an opportunity to the US too tempting to miss. The United States has proven itself to be extremely regime change/color revolution happy and at the core view China’s political system with contempt. So the US just want to ‘help’. This is not a premeditated crime, as many of the commentators suggested, but rather a crime of opportunity, from a national level, so to speak.

    A little over a year after the Tiananmen incident people in Eastern European openly revolted against their governments and Gorbachev pretty much do nothing, a restraint I think has a lot to do with the aftermath of the Tiananmen incident. A few months later the Soviet Union collapse, an event which was totally unanticipated in the spring of 1989.

    • Replies: @TT
  66. TT says:

    Yeh, now see CNA, a Singapore press that LKY set up to provide independent news source, is now turning to full time propaganda mouthpiece of ZFUKUS-India by his son LHL in spreading lies daily, brainwashing Spore & Asean, & urge on by Indians & Anglozionist to fight China for ZUS. But funny is CNA do restraint on anti-Russia Western news.

    On TAM: Without fail annually, today CNA continue to help AFP propagate TAM lies.–re-evaluate--crackdown-10333118

    Open discussion of the crackdown is forbidden in China, where hundreds – by some estimates more than a thousand – died when the Communist Party sent tanks to crush demonstrations in the square in Beijing on Jun 4, 1989, after student-led protesters had staged a peaceful seven-week sit-in to demand democratic reforms.

    “No one from the successive governments over the past 29 years has ever asked after us, and not one word of apology has been spoken from anyone, as if the massacre that shocked the world never happened,” said the letter, which was released on Thursday by the non-profit Human Rights in China.

    On SCS: Compare how AFP, Reuters vs RT report, with CNA opted to publish only West propaganda but not full Chinese General rebuke to Mattis lies, and all foolish comments from its brainwashed people.

    AFP: quote out of context China General comment.

    Reuters: spiced up to paint a picture of Asean confronting China bully with help of USM hero Mattis.–new-reality--of-china-10346796

    RT: Complete report on Chinese general warns Mattis against making ‘irresponsible claims & interfering in internal affairs’

    You should always help to comment in CNA to correct FUKUS-Indian lies with your talent since 1998. Millions of Sporeans & Asean are brainwashed by CNA need your salvation. A few wise commentators trying to do so but are often drowned by vocal Indians & Anglos liars.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
    , @denk
    , @denk
  67. TT says:

    Not true, Indians believed whites’ dung is always best in the world. So Indians help British to conquer & colonized huge India with a tiny thousand soldiers, and remained their most loyal sepoy to invade Asia.

    Historically, Indians may be skilled in practising sophistry & lying, but its rupee wise & pound fool to be always cheated by skillful whites. ZUS-Russia is goading it to ultra militarize to fight China, so they can ply open the miser pulse wide to buy their junk weapons in $100B for suicide war, instead of building its dilapidated infrastructures.

    Under clown Modi, India is trying to compete with China BRI. China invested its abundant reserves in BRI to enlarge global demand, so to export its excess mfg capacity while import cheaper resources in best efficiency. India has no industry to benefit, yet its foolishly splashing its little money building others infrastructures while neglecting own’s.

    With 70% of India people living in rural struggling with tiny land farming & heckling with gov over petty crop price, 1340M of 45% illiterate poors with 1960’s infrastructure & half without toilet access, how is India possible to be next world hyperpower ZUS painted to them?

    Under such foolish corrupted egoistic leaders infighting for power in a Western dysfunctional democratic system, India is their own biggest enemy for self destruction.

  68. TT says:
    @DB Cooper

    I believed all the while FUKUS has been planning/preparing such color revolution for all countries, including all its allies & enemies, China & Soviet.

    When opportunity arises, they jumped into it, activating all its sleeper cells like Cailing. If as you said, US is having honey moon with China then, even helping with its fighter jet(citation?), Bush won’t act so swiftly to slap sanction on China military & economic immediately upon TAM. He would probably waited until Soviet collapse to act safely on destabilizing China.

    Its possible a simultaneous color revolutions, ripen to harvest concurrently.

    UK Margaret Thatcher been shown middle finger by Deng in her blatant demand of perpetual ownership of HK, certainly had her MI6 involvement till these days.

    If Zhao Ziyang had his way to “demoncraptized” China using rioters & ignorant students, in cohort of FUKUS & George Soros to remove Deng, he may be another Yeltsin of China to let West plunder the country wealth, & sign away HK to UK while allowing Taiwan independent.

    • Replies: @DB Cooper
  69. DB Cooper says:

    Yes, the US was helping China to upgrade their J8 fighter at that time. This is not a secret.

    You can ask any Chinese who are knowledgeable in military things and they can confirm it. As to why the US won’t waited until Soviet collapse to act safely on destabilizing China, the US just couldn’t help it. It is just too good an opportunity to pass up. The US seeing regime change opportunity is like shark smelling blood in the water. And the US is never shy about it either. It sees it as a moral and righteous thing to do.

    • Replies: @denk
  70. @TT

    I had heard that it was LKY himself who begged China to stop Vietnam, but this is the first quote I’ve seen that supports that claim.

    Can you provide the exact source of the quote and, if possible, the page on which it occurs?

    Many thanks.

    • Replies: @TT
  71. anon[228] • Disclaimer says:

    Government job is not to find health care for everybody or job for everybody Its job is about keeping the country safe from terrorism and attacks from rogue countries.

    American economic system is interconnected Russia wants to join So is Armenia Belarus and India and Pakistan ,even Iran. It has good GDP and growth rate of GDP is comfortable. Other countries perk their surplus in this nation.

  72. DB Cooper says:

    Today LKY is regarded by western scholars (Graham Allison, for example) as some kind of elder statesman whose opinion is highly sought after. But actually for a long time the West held LKY in contempt. People don’t believe me can read the late WSJ’s William Safire numerous tirade against LKY.

    William Safire view represents the general consensus the West have for him. He was called a dictator who has no respect for the human rights blah blah blah. Pretty much the usual nonsense today’s China is being portrayed. During the 1959 election the US and other Western countries tried very hard to prevent LKY from being elected because he was seen at the very least a communist sympathizer if not an outright crypto-communist because of his anti-colonial rhetoric.

    The US meddling in Singapore didn’t stop after LKY became prime minister but the US was outmaneuvered by LKY at every step.

    So it is ironic and sad that the press LKY set up to provide independent news source is now turning to full time propaganda mouthpiece for the West and India.

    • Replies: @TT
  73. denk says:

    A few wise commentators trying to do so but are often drowned by vocal Indians & Anglos liars.

    It figures,
    Indians are kinda like Caucasoid, cut from the same cloth.

    So nuthin has changed eh ?
    Thats exactly the way when I started my career twenty years ago.
    The eight nations alliance gang up on the the Chinese , cyber version ! [sans the jps, not that they’r above the fray but they practically dont do english sites. ]

    I plunged right in with gusto, starting from the newgroups, then to Guardian, ICH, Atimes, Warpo, SMH, ,,,,,….
    So full of fire back then, often ‘do battle’ with hordes of’ fukusI overnight. Once my PC went kaput in the heat of ‘battle’ at 2am, some sob planted virus .
    I was so pissed that I stayed up the whole night , reformatting the disk and continue ‘battle’ without missing a beat.
    Those were the days !

    Shameless plug…
    When I entered the fray in CIF, Guardian, its practically one against the fukusI, dared say I gave a good account of myself, its only later that more Chinese posters started to trickle in.
    A trial blazer ?,

    But all these late nights have taken its toll.
    Eyes are failing, memories are fading, concentration is drifting….kinda knackered.

    The noose is also tightening,
    Im banned by many sites including the WSWS !
    Guardian has practically closed up its comments sect cuz its not going their way, 😉

    Been downsizing these days .
    All these sacrifice and for what ?
    Can you imagine, some sob at the China Daily or was it the Global times, censored my posts while giving free reign to the opposition, fukusI .

    WTF !

    • Replies: @TT
  74. Anonymous [AKA "Mr Gwydion Williams"] says: • Website

    At the time, it was widely recognised that the entire Chinese Communist system came close to being overthrown, as happened by stages in the next few months in Europe, culminating in the Soviet collapse in 1989.

    The rapid decline of post-Soviet Russia convinced many that the Chinese government had accepted a grim necessity for the country’s future. Even some of the protestors have been won over.

    Meantime the various exiles were embarrassingly bad. Unlike the Soviet exiles, there wasn’t anyone worth boosting. And in Britain, at least, it has taken till now to get a documentary. On tonight, 4/6/18, interested to see what it says

    I’ve always classed it as Communist China’s 1989 Fight for Survival.

    At the time, I was hopeful for Reform Communism and disappointed that Deng’s government had not been overthrown, which is what the demands amounted to. He had no formal position he could be removed from, but the proposals would have ended his power.

    Later events convinced me China had a narrow escape. Would be in a complete mess if a bunch of highly muddled protestors had won out.

    • Replies: @myself
  75. TT says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    That quote is based on my memory I had read in LKY memoirs decades ago, i think its “Hard Truth”. I had given all my book collections away after stop reading & writing in last 15yrs, roaming & living in 3rd world countries since. So i can’t give you the exact pages of quote. But its certainly in LKY memoirs worth to read.

    LKY said in his memoir, Deng is the only leader he admired.

    I tried to google search but to no avail, none in the world except LKY show gratitude to China-Deng sacrifice for stopping Soviet-Vietnam grand invasion to Asia(that will change the world destiny). Its probably to deny China the deserving honary status by FUKUS out to demonize China.

    In many official gov sites, incl Spore gov sites, it stated facts opposite from LKY memoirs & China accounts. They tried to projected a Spore lead Asean as the main driver for stopping Vietnam invasion to Cambodia, playing down ZUS meddling behind, while ignoring China pivoting contribution in the punitive war to destroy Vietnam war capacity & shattered Soviet-Vietnam invincible image after defeating US allied.

    I hope you can contribute to world peace by allowing many brainwashed people to know the true peaceful history of China that FUKUS-India had been demonized, like TAM, SCS & India border war.

    Writing to msm like Globaltimes, CNA, Wapo, India msm, etc. will have wider reach than Unz. China is too weak in English domain propaganda war, unlike Russia.

    Below are some long info sharing only for those like to read more into Spore-LKY-China-Vietnam issues.


    You can google to find lot of info.

    From what i had read in summary & closer to China/LKY version:

    Soviet had instructed its commie China to assist Vietcon in resisting US allied invasion. After defeated US allied force, China was then asked by Soviet to help rebuild Vietnam.

    When expansionism Soviet sour its relationship with China, Soviet tried to leapfrog China using Vietnam as proxy to expand into south. So it signed a 25yrs Mutual Defense Pact with Vietnam to prepare for Asean invasion.

    After defeating US allied, there is no one can stop the war hardened Vietcom backed by Soviet. LKY said in his memoir, the whole Asean armies were sent to Thai border to defend, barely able to resist for few weeks. So he visited Deng to beg for help, but only been told to give him a few weeks. Then Deng swiftly delivered punitive incursion into Vietnam against Soviet military threat to save Asean. LKY was very impressed.

    After Deng visited US, China backed Cambodia Khmer Rouge under Pol Pot was asked to launch full counter attack on Vietnam to lure its main army into Cambodia. With expiry of the 1950 Sino-Soviet Treaty, China announced its plan to punish Vietnam. Then China launched a punitive invasion to destroy its war capacity thru scorched earth policy, with China army went all the way to outskirts of Hanoi. Soviet failed to defend Vietnam, so Deng openly denounced its alliance with Soviet & call out Soviet inability to honor a defense treaty with Vietnam.

    Strategist Deng had actually amassed million troop at Sino-Russia border before punishing Vietnam. Soviet knew very well any intervention to clash with China will be disastrous & a massive war that will weaken it, while anticipating US & world will back China to stop its expansion. So the Soviet-Vietnam expansionary grand plan was stalled with China blood with Deng’s steely will, farsight & strategy.

    Its no accident that LKY had then been giving China every help Spore could since Deng era, training numerous China cradles, transferring all management skills & experience, giving generous scholarships for its people to study in Spore, transfering high technologies including Chartered Semiconductor 0.18um fab that was sanctioned by West-Jp, providing one of highest FDI to China, etc.

    But ultra corrupted Jiang ZM blunted many projects like Spore-Suzhou Industrial Park, & damage China core interests for few decades. LKY probably perceived that a rising China under corrupted lawless Jiang will be a great menace to the Asean, so he advocate for US to balance China, leading to unexpected Obama’s military aggressive pivoting to SCS intending to make Asean its canon fodder in clashing with China to keep its hedgmon role. But Prez Xi tried to overhaul China, & resisted ZUS aggression in SCS successfully to stay peaceful with Asean.

    The chief architecture of Spore every success, DPM Dr Goh Keng Swee, was the only one LKY highly praised for making all the miraculous feats in his memoir, well beyond LKY ability to achieve. Up to today, all Spore core policies remained largely unchanged as formulated by GKS decades ago, yet still working very well.

    Yet in DPM Goh KS prime time, he was invited by Deng to China as special advisor for last 40yrs to help China rise, likely a reciprocate repayment of China saving of Asean. GKS return only to die at old age few years ago. In LKY advocating, GKS was given an exceptional state funeral reserved for Prez as a recognition of his exceptional contribution.

    LKY exercised rigorous restrictions on the mainstream media–in particular from the
    US – inside of Singapore. He played pivotal role in balancing global geopolitical for Asean peace & prosperity actively, esp between US & China. But installing his idiotic son LHL as PM had turn Spore msm into Fukus- India mouthpiece & become a stooge of ZUS-India. This nepotism is the worst failure of LKY that destroyed his own legacy & country he nurtured.

    We only allow the US papers into Singapore so that we can figure out what the US write about us. And what their perception of us is. We cannot allow them to assume a role in Singapore that the American media plays in America : That of invigilator, adversary, and inquisitor of the administration.

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  76. TT says:

    LOL, your young time hero fight with FUKUS-India. I only join abit in last few months using my smart phone, but already taken a toll to mind & body. The trolling lies & propaganda is avalanche, overwhelming.

    Yah, i find Globaltimes moderator very strange, they marked all my comments as spam no matter long or short, while allowed FUKUS, esp Indians to smear them freely. It also published many low grade articles written by fools. Same in alt sites. Unz is probably last best place without censor to allow free debating. Thks to Ron.

    I will retire from all msm & comment, its filled with so much unwholesome, violent, & lies in this FUKUS-India-Jp-Oz perverted world. Better to go back my old cocoon life to live in peaceful rural place without msm.

    Take good care friend.

    • Replies: @denk
  77. @TT

    Many thanks!

    • Replies: @TT
  78. denk says:
    @DB Cooper

    A Chinese researcher ,Tong Zeng, claimed that fukusJp collected many Chinese blood and DNA samples during the ‘honeymoon era’, prolly for research on ethnic specific bio weapons targetting the Chinese, sars perhaps ??

    the US won’t waited until Soviet collapse to act safely on destabilizing China, the US just couldn’t help it. It is just too good an opportunity to pass up. The US seeing regime change opportunity is like shark smelling blood in the water. And the US is never shy about it either. It sees it as a moral and righteous thing to do.

    kinda agree until the last part .

    It sees it as a moral and righteous thing to do.

    I’d think moral and fukus is an oxymoron !

  79. For all its failures, tragedies and confusions, the Tiananmen incident ranks among the most successful propaganda campaigns in history. Until Syria where the US funds arms and trains Al queda and ISIS terrorists.. And now protects them using the US airforce inside Syria..

  80. denk says:

    Oh its that day again .
    Every 4/6 since 1989 fukus would raise the ghost of TAM, ‘wE shant let China forget the TAM massacre‘. [sic]

    So they want the world to commemorate a fake ‘massacre’ Ad infinitum, while real genocides like Gujarat, Kashmir, Nagaland, fallujah, Indonesia genocides, Timor, Papua New Guninea, Nam, Ex Yugo, Libya, Cambodia, …..were flushed down the memory holes and the murkkans currently bombing six countries.

    You kids, dont look here, look there, daddy has work to do. !

    that circus at the Shangrila hotel , looks like the latest iteration of the 8nations alliance.
    China might’ve stood up but the barbarians have never actually left the gate !

    ‘Mattis slammed China for SCS militarisation’, scream the headline . The indignant Chinese who ask ‘whats wrong with bolstering defense in my own front yard’ ?, still dont realise that the murkkans consider SCS their backyhard !

    Hererin lies the problem,
    The criminals are holding court and they set the agenda.

    They’d never talk about GUjarat, Fallujah, Indonesia genocide , fukus war crimes,,,,,,its always about China,
    western allegations about TAM, Falun GOng, Tibet, Xinjiang, Liu Xiao Bo……….SCS,…

    So we who speak out for China are always on the defensive, a great disadvantage.

    They also set the rule of engagement.

    If you ask ‘who’r the murkans to lecture China when USA itself has militarised land, sea, air and space and ring China with dozens of bases’ ?
    you might think its a coup de grace but wait, they tell you ‘this is about China, no whataboutism allowed’. [another cute concoction from fukus ]

    comment deleted !

    Its like a foot ball game, where you’r playing against 12 men and you’r not allowed to cross the half line. !


  81. denk says:

    Better to go back my old cocoon life to live in peaceful rural place without msm.

    Wish you well with your contentment.

    Dont think I can totally withdraw from reality just yet.
    No doubt a bit worn out now, but still exploring new venue to vent my spleen, even tho not too keen in getting into
    high octane , real time debate these days.

    Been posting to that ausie site Theconversation for some times until they banned me outright.
    I thought it’s better than all those Murdoch controlled MSM like SMH, etc etc which are all trigger happy in censoring unPC posts, turns out just like birds of the same feather.

    so much for that vaunted freedom of expression that the 5lies keep lecturing to the Chinese,

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  82. TT says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    Still no luck to find the quote of LKY memoirs with my tiny smart phone surfing with slow connection in rural backward country i reside now.

    But here are some interesting links you might want to take a look on 1979 sino-vietnam war. Overall quite in line with my personal opinion & old memory. Hope that help.

    Henry Kissinger book on the 1979 Sino-Vietnam War. It refered to Memoirs of Singapore statesman Lee Kuan Yew, From Third World to First: The Singapore Story, 1965-2000. so that quote could be in this memoir i read decade ago. Coincidentally, LKY had quite similar opinion as me, the West wrote off China punitive action that had changed the history of East Asia(world).

    Page 376
    Singapore’s Prime Minister lee Kuan Yew has summed up the ultimate result of the war: “The Western press wrote off the Chinese punitive action as a failure. I believe it changed the history of East Asia.

    This transcript of LKY in UK to push for support against Soviet-Vietnam expansionary threat to Asean revealed his strong opinion/stand completely in line with Deng view as narrated in Kissinger book.

    Very detailed article on how Chinese leaders thoughts, strategized & derived to the punitive action, culled from many old Chinese records. With or without LKY plead, Deng will still do it for China needs, while saving Asean.

    91 quotes of Lee Kuan Yew that show why you either love or hate him

    12 On the great men he met: “I would say the greatest was Deng Xiaoping. At his age, to admit that he was wrong, that all these ideas, Marxism, Leninism, Maoism, they are just not working and have to be abandoned, you need a great man to do that…” Tom Plate’s Conversations with Lee Kuan Yew 

    13. On Deng Xiaoping (again): Deng Xiao Ping is a great man because he changed China from a broken-backed state, which would have imploded like the Soviet Union, into what it is today, on the way to becoming the world’s largest economy. Hard Truths to Keep Singapore Going

    20. On Chinese President Xi Jinping: “I would put him in Nelson Mandela’s class of persons. A person with enormous emotional stability who does not allow his personal misfortunes or sufferings to affect his judgement. In other words, he is impressive.” TIME Nov 19, 2007

    21. On late DPM Goh Keng Swee: “Of all my Cabinet colleagues, it was Goh Keng Swee who made the greatest difference to the outcome for Singapore…When he held a contrary view, he would challenge my decisions and make me reexamine the premises on which they were made. As a result, we reached better decisions for Singapore.” Eulogy at the State Funeral service for Goh Keng Swee, May 23, 2010.

    Lee Kuan Yew talks about Asia’s rise to economic power, China’s ambitions and the West’s chances of staying competitive.

    You can download one LKY book for free, or borrow ebook in some sites. I have no luck with my slow net.

    LKY view on Deng towards TAM. Its seemed LKY believed in West propaganda, but he tried justifying Deng’s strong action as a duty any responsible leader should do, even to kill thousands of students.(in his memoir, he said he will do the same thing).

    His place in history in the West has been tarnished by his tough standard here on Tiananmen, but I think his place in Chinese history will be different. The Chinese will judge him not from whether he was humane or he was brutal, but whether he saved China, or he allowed China to risk disintegration, because now with the Tiananmen Papers out, it is revealed, as I suspected at that time, that mass demonstrations were not in Beijing alone, but also spreading to the other cities, and he had to stop it.

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  83. @TT

    Many thanks for that information. I’ve been trying to track down Lee’s role in the Vietnam incursion for years.

    • Replies: @TT
  84. @denk

    The Conversation is the most heavily censored site I’ve encountered, too. Very strange for an academic site.

    • Replies: @denk
  85. denk says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    Did all the 5lies MSM circuit except NZ.

    No show at the Economist, The Independent, LondonTimes…
    Heavily censored at Guardian.

    think Globe N Mail etc etc was ok, cant recall exactly, that was some years back.

    In Oz,
    No show at The Australian, heavily censored by SMH, The age…..thought the ‘independent’ Conversation would be better, had a good run at first, eventually censored when I crossed their red line, or is it the half line ?

    Lots of ‘academic’ outfit or think tanks in the 5lies turn out to be fronts for TPTB.


  86. TT says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    LKY probably is the most instrumental driver behind to drive Asean & West with the world(UN) towards thawing Soviet-Vietnam expansion into Asia.

    But many historical records seemed to point out, Deng was the real visionary strategist & architect of Vietnam punitive incursion & stopping of Soviet-Vietnam expansionary, that he convinced LKY & US that the danger – Cambodia invasion was only the beginning of Soviet-Vietnam Pan Asia expansion.

    Its amazing to read that a leader of tiny island could play such a big role in many geopolitical issues, the remarkable forceful & persuasive way he could master to drive US, UK & China leaders. If given a large country to lead, his influence to the world may be very significant. But Deng was the leader that impressed him into admiration, where Deng told LKY: “If given only a Shanghai, I could rule better than Spore. But China is too big, too complicated.”(quote: LKY memoir). Still LKY had great influence in China rise & convincing of US to cooperate.

    Too bad, China dont has declassification rule to disclose, & Spore PM LHL response to a 30yrs term suggestion is, perhap 100yrs. So LKY memoirs served a better source, its never pleasant to publicize that LKY was the one requesting Deng to attack Vietnam, after been such foremost forceful advocate for US to resist North Vietcon(hence prolong the Nam war) as you can read yourself here.

    The PRC could stand as a de facto ally of the conservative Southeast Asian regimes against what they feared would be Vietnamese and Soviet attempts at controlling the whole region. Singapore’s anti-communist leader, Lee Kuan Yew, told Western visitors that ‘if the Chinese had not punished Vietnam, all of Southeast Asia would have been open to Soviet influence. Now it has gained 10 to 15 years. The Thai premier, for instance, is a new and relaxed man after the Chinese punitive expedition.’ China’s attempts at ‘teaching Hanoi a lesson’ may have been a disaster from a Chinese military perspective, but the stunned praise it brought Beijing from countries further south gave Deng time to quietly shelve his country’s support for communist insurgencies outside its own borders.

    Today, China is an important player on the world stage and its leaders can talk directly to other world leaders everywhere. But Chinese leaders continue to appreciate Singapore’s view on the world. As then Vice-President Xi Jinping told Mr Lee during the 2008 Beijing Olympic Games: “We will need you for a long time. I have been to Singapore, I know what you have and our people want to learn. We get more from you than from America.”

    When Vietnam invaded and occupied Cambodia in 1978, for example, Mr Lee was the first to write to then Thai Prime Minister Kriangsak Chamanan and Chair of ASEAN to urge the organisation to stand united and steadfast in supporting the Cambodian coalition and pressure Vietnam to withdraw its troops. He later wrote: “We had spent much time and resources to thwart the Vietnamese in Cambodia because it was in our interest.

    You can also try to access this Spore author books see if it helps. LKY advocative role in nam war was mentioned in detail revealing his later mindset about Vietnam invasion to Cambodia & China punitive incursion.

    ANG CHENG GUAN is Associate Professor at the Nanyang Technological University, Singapore. He specialises in the International history of modern Southeast Asia. His most recent book is Southeast Asia and the Vietnam War (London: Routledge, 2010). He is the author of two forthcoming books: Lee Kuan Yew’s Strategic Thought and Singapore, ASEAN and the Cambodian Conflict 1978-1991

    Ps. I used to able photographically memorize a few hundreds pages text on eve of exam to use like a ebook at high school time, but lost that ability after start drinking. Still some Eidetic memory work ad hoc for my comments, mostly forgetful as aging. Otherwise I could give you the exact citation source of LKY. Now you need to read his whole memoirs, which was worthy as very insightful imo.

    Wish you, denk, DB Cooper, Jason Wong & all defender of truth all the best. Now I should retired from unz & msm to enjoy my peaceful ascetic life in forest.

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  87. TT says:
    @DB Cooper

    William Safire understated LKY prowess like a baby. I was born & grown up in Spore under LKY, personally attended his rally, he was beyond your imagination.

    Karlin tried to superficial write about LKY & his Spore.

    US is always meddling in every countries, be it ally or enemy. LKY deported US ambassador with $1M fine for funding opposition Francis Seow, a prez of Law society turn fugitive.

    Yes, LKY setup CNA so that Asian can has a msm free from West over bearing propaganda. It was so good in posting wide perspective of free news having wide readership in Asia, including wide sources like RT up to LKY death, that US turned it to its mouthpiece few years ago. Few leaders can resist FUKUSInd, only few strong men like LKY, Deng & Xi could. Cuba, Venezula, Iran, Syria, Iraq, Libya, NK, Philippine Dutert . ..are all struggling or already kaput. Even Putin shake like pudding. LKY is exceptional, extraordinary without a big powerful backing.

    LKY: We only allow the US papers into Singapore so that we can figure out what the US write about us. And what their perception of us is. We cannot allow them to assume a role in Singapore that the American media plays in America : That of invigilator, adversary, and inquisitor of the administration.

    Continue to defend truth, esp for China peaceful rise that will shape the world & common destiny of mankind. Xi still yet to pay me a single cent of my hardwork. So I will retire.

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  88. myself says:

    Later events convinced me China had a narrow escape.

    IMHO, (yours may differ) . . . not that narrow.

    China has faced far worse turmoil than the Tian An Men incident. FAR WORSE – like the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution.

    A great many people died in each of these episodes, but the state’s ultimate survival and retention (and even enhancement) of its power was never seriously in question. What was in play, both times, was what direction China would henceforth take.

    Both episodes were resolved, by whatever means necessary. Advancing 1/5 of humanity, albeit of unified ethno-culture, is no easy task, requiring hard men (yes, China’s leaders are overwhelmingly male) and ever harder choices.

    To suggest that hard, even ruthless and brutal action would NOT have been undertaken by the government during the Tian An Men gatherings, IMHO, flies in the face of all historical experience.

    Then there is also the fact that the agitators simply did not have the support of the farmers, the workers, the white collar employees, most of the scholars and professors, and probably the vast majority of fellow students.

    Many saw the Tian An Men protests as the work of the overly-pampered and hopelessly naive, at best. A great many still view the Tian An Men agitation as a case of ambitious individuals working hand-in-hand with foreign (Western) powers to overthrow the Chinese state, and so advance themselves.

    A basic rule in China is: never accept the help or patronage of aliens if you want to effect change – whatever the merits of your cause, you risk losing credibility. In the case of Tian An Men, perhaps there was basis for distrust.

    The Tian An Men protests were probably the wrong tool, used at the wrong epoch in China’s development.

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  89. @TT

    Many thanks for the links.

  90. @TT

    Do you have a link for ‘LKY deported US ambassador with $1M fine for funding opposition Francis Seow,’?


    • Replies: @TT
  91. @myself

    “China has faced far worse turmoil than the Tian An Men incident. FAR WORSE – like the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution.”

    There was no violence associated with the Great Leap and a negligible amount with the Cultural Revolution–considering that it was a real revolution that lasted ten years and succeeded in its aims.

    Don’t be misled by our media’s account of Chinese affairs, it’s worse than useless.

  92. @denk

    Can’t resist can you showing your pathological hatred of India on a Qianmen square thread clone rat. Did the Indo Tibetan border force rape your family? Well consider it a free of cost genetic upgrade.

    • Replies: @Anon
  93. TT says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    Try utilize google search. Its in LKY memoir & Francis Seow book.

    The world could do like LKY, even tiny Spore stand up facing US tariff punishment.–United_States_relations#Hendrickson_affair

    A Heritage Foundation paper speculated that Singapore’s angry public reaction to the Hendrickson affair may have been a response to the January 1988 termination of Singapore’s eligibility for the Generalized System of Preferences , which provided tariff exemptions on Singaporean exports to the United States. [10]

    Without pretentious, LKY:

    “Politics are dirty, i never said its clean!”

    “Yes I am dictator, a most benevolent dictator.”

    “If i could govern without answer to election, I could do even much more…, ”

    Kissinger:”To be US enemy is dangerous, to be its friend is fatal.”

    • Replies: @Godfree Roberts
  94. Anon[167] • Disclaimer says:

    Call no one a hater, antisemitist, nazist, apologist, troll or whatever, but if one is truth speaker.

    Denk speak historical truth. You spew hatred abuses with falsehood. How can IQ81 pathological violent rapist-ethnic act be any free genetic upgrade to mankind? Is that reason why Indians are so proud of their generous donation of deform genes to its own women & neighbor countries thru violent rapes?

  95. @TT

    Many thanks for those links. There’s more to the story than I imagined.

    • Replies: @Anon
  96. Anon[320] • Disclaimer says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    You can google search for pdf or borrow ebook from libraries free, including all LKY memoirs. This allow you to search keyword quickly for your writings.

  97. Anon[320] • Disclaimer says:

    CIA plants its 5th column & opposition in every country for global governing in stealth, including all its allies. Its cheapest way to rule another country, direct invasion is last resort.

    5eyes work to collect evidences for holding global leaders & their judges/minister ransom, beside stealing & collecting global data. Msm hypnotize their people. FB & social networks collect public data to ferment color revolution & spread propaganda.

    Information technology is used to steal & collect global data. Microsoft & Apple have backdoor & remote control with self data sending, iOS allowed easy hacking, Android is sending your data to Amazon cloud using 10~30% of your monthly data, Apple/Intel CPU even have embeded secret separate system to send data itself thus hard to stop. So are many other like Qualcom cpu/GPU, flash, memory chip, telcom, Apps & softwares are tools of NSA/CIA.

    The world biggest parasitic robber is always crying robbery. Do a quick search, almost all US networking products are spying down to chip level.

    Hence China is bend to come out with its own entire IT system to enhance its Great Firewall.

  98. @Miro23

    The Jaw fears the Samurai, even if he’s Chinese.

  99. peterAUS says:

    Now….I know the article and the thread are old,but, after watching a couple of Youtube videos (of all places….) I do feel I got, almost, how it all happened.

    I don’t buy, for a millisecond, almost anything the author says about China.
    Having said that, I am rather impressed by how the regime in Beijing handled the protests. Yes, I know how it sounds.
    Smooth, measured, professional approach. Just enough of necessary ruthlessness.

    Two elements that still evade me; probably will bring them in future comments on other articles because the thread, obviously, withered out:
    1. Where exactly the first shot was fired and why? It wasn’t on the square. My take: on approach route by one of approaching units. Why the soldier(s) fired? Was it really tactically necessary; was it loss of nerve; was it an order from above to “go hard”?
    2. WHO were the guys in that APC that got firebombed on the square? Or, were they designated cannon fodder (expendables), or, highly trained and motivated professionals?

  100. El Dato says:
    @New Dealer

    The tanks are just aligning in front of the guy (for whatever reason).

    Longer, where the person is removed from premises by other bystanders or something:

  101. El Dato says:
    @Godfree Roberts

    That’s not a plus for Mao but a minus for the politicians and other “leading businessmen” (Protip: A leading businessman is not leading because he’s good, but because of postselection, aka “if he’s leading, he must be good, otherwise he wouldn’t be leading, would he?”)

    An upwardly mobile military-cum-revolutionary riding the wave of the Japanese invasion mashing up communism into locally comestible fare? Nutritious, it is not. May be required reading though. We had Marx in high school (without critical commentary to boot), I suppose to becalm the local communists.

    One would suppose China would have a lot of high-quality social philosophy and commentary from the times prior to Mao.

    • Troll: mulga mumblebrain
  102. @Mike P

    Denying anthropogenic climate destabilisation ie denying the undeniable, is definitely a religion on the lunatic Right.

  103. @Paleo Liberal

    I doubt your faery story, but if true, your ‘friend’ lied to you. You appear to be a typical lying Sinophobe. Scratch a ‘liberal’ find a fascist.

  104. @Godfree Roberts

    This is a Dem-Soc PRC citizen.
    No, it’s dead. After 1978, China persisted in its socialist disguise.
    You can see some Marxist terms used in a superficial way at any time, but describing a completely different vision from the left.
    The only trace left by Mao is that Xi seems to be interested in his personality worship and highly centralized style.

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