The Unz Review: An Alternative Media Selection
A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media
 Thorsten J. Pattberg Archive
The Rising Cult of China Experts
🔊 Listen RSS
Email This Page to Someone

 Remember My Information



=>
Claremont McKenna College Professor Minxin Pei on the sources and implications of China’s kleptocracy, 2014 Hudson Institute Kleptocracy Initiative, Credit: Wikimedia Commons, CC BY 2.0.

Bookmark Toggle AllToCAdd to LibraryRemove from Library • BShow CommentNext New CommentNext New ReplyRead More
ReplyAgree/Disagree/Etc. More... This Commenter This Thread Hide Thread Display All Comments
AgreeDisagreeThanksLOLTroll
These buttons register your public Agreement, Disagreement, Thanks, LOL, or Troll with the selected comment. They are ONLY available to recent, frequent commenters who have saved their Name+Email using the 'Remember My Information' checkbox, and may also ONLY be used three times during any eight hour period.
Ignore Commenter Follow Commenter
Search Text Case Sensitive  Exact Words  Include Comments
List of Bookmarks

BEIJING – A couple of years ago I met a German man at Harvard who boasted about his political stipend, his up-coming talk in New York City, and how he worked hard on the liberalization of Tibet and the breaking-up of China. There are no human rights in China, he explained to me. I was impressed and reminded him that if he ever plotted this way against our German government he could be tried for treason. He left in contempt.

He isn’t the only one. There is a cult of Western evangelists and self-righteous crusaders who are determined to dislodge non-Western nations and usurp their governments.

In China they act as if above the law. That’s because they see the Chinese government as corrupt, non-elected, and communist, and thus illegitimate. So why care about what it says or stands for? Moreover, these evangelists believe Westerners can do whatever they want in China because America and the entire Western propaganda apparatus will bail them out should trouble arise.

These so-called China experts are now a political force in direct opposition to the Communist Party. They form clusters and networks, with a strong hierarchy and code of ethics: They reward their Twitter followers and lickspittles and praise each other’s work, while policing social media and punishing “traitors” or “China apologists”.

When Yang Rui, a CCTV news anchor, condemned the activities of foreigners in Beijing, his character was assassinated and internationally paraded by China experts as a glaring example of what happens to any Chinese should he or she dare to look askance at them.

In the West, foreign extremist groups, left or right, are monitored and tightly controlled. But no-one controls these Western imperialists. Germans finance Xinjiang separatists, Americans finance Taiwan separatists, British finance Tibetan separatist. US journalism even dispatches tactical troops to Hong Kong determined on bringing down Xi Jinping, the president, and his family.

The hierarchy of China experts is this: At the top we find the philosophers and statesmen who set the stage and agenda for the universal ideology – exclusively serving Western interests. They always reside in the West, know little or nothing about China, and discuss China solely on Western terms. In the past there were the likes of Kant, Hegel, and Wilhelm II; today we have Henry “on China” Kissinger, Francis “End of History” Fukuyama, and Samuel “Clash of Civilizations” Huntington.

Next we have the journalists and editors, most of them white or accessory white, in key positions at the New York Times, Wall Street Journal, Economist, and so on. Thanks to the Western planetary media monopoly, they have become the new global fascist elite. Their culture is narrowly interbred, and some personal relations border on the incestuous, so they float each other’s boat and write almost identical muck-raking stories. Everyone in China knows who they are, and their China-bashing is green-lighting all of us to join the onslaught.

Most China experts are culturists down to the last fiber. They tolerate all races as long as they Westernize and speak English, but show utter disdain for all foreign words, concepts, and terminologies (language imperialism). They also prominently decide who – Chinese or foreigner- gets praised and who gets defamed, and – most importantly- what gets omitted in their China reports. Their own corrupt ways get omitted. Ask yourself, when was the last time you read a piece by a prominent Chinese (other than a dissident) in your nation’s newspaper? You haven’t. It is a tight Orwellian grip.

Last, we have legions of lesser, disposable China watchers. Few of them enjoy fat expat packages, bigwig relatives in the media, or peddling political influence. Unable to find proper jobs and secure a future in China – apart from becoming activists, bloggers, or English teachers- they are recruited easily and radicalize quickly. Everyone has met those frustrated Westerners who once believed in their entitlement, got disillusioned, and found a way to spend their days: to patronize and correct the Chinese.

China isn’t the only victim. All other six non-Western civilizations are feeling the whip of Western imperialism. The West claims it is “universal” and that it does not (and cannot) take responsibility for any of its abusive individuals in foreign lands since they are all free agents. It’s the same old excuse since the age of colonialism.

Taking part in the Western mission to civilize the East is highly spiritually rewarding. And what is political destabilization and social unrest but a sweet revenge for China’s disregard for Western hegemony. Favorite targets are: corrupt officials, suppressed minorities, Han chauvinism and misogyny, demonstrations, currency manipulation, and censorship. It makes China experts feel good about themselves. They feel like social justice warriors. The problem: this is not their country, and their negativity is poisoning everything.

Thus, China experts are constantly on the look-out for Chinese stand-ins. Dissidents, pro-Western activists, any Wang who can waive the American flag. The collaborators are showered with media coverage, prizes, and stipends, visa, freedom awards, and even Nobel Peace prizes. This tactic didn’t get unnoticed by the zhishi fenzi (intellectuals), a class who would do anything for Western media attention – like the artist who in May sliced himself and cut out his own rib for a “more open China”.

Journalists and academic quacks who preach China doom

But let us return to Harvard and its agency of China doom. When press soldier Michael Forsythe paraded another academic quack for the New York Times‘ ‘Q. and A.’ on the future demise of the Communist Party of China, the “China experts” were all tuned in.

Not because Mr. Forsythe is particularly original or anything, but because he’s member of a very militant group blending journalism with soldiery. It’s like “journdiery.”

“Jouldiery?”

You know what I’m talking about. It is no secret that the New York Times, like so many other powers in this day and age, have abandoned traditional “news reporting” and instead focused on “news creation.”

And why not? Google how they create Chinese “Dissidents” and “Heroes,” and “Saviors”. Google how they support violent riots in Hong Kong. Google how they shame Chinese women for marrying too early. And you can’t blame politics. Those press soldiers are the vanguard of a very violent, sick society. (The destruction of Donald “Law and Order” Trump, anyone?)

But let’s not digress from this Minxin Pei. His actual name is Pei Minxin. He’s been turned into a “Minxin Pei” by Western media. It’s an old European fetish. We have to turn the names of the “good Chinese” around (as opposed to “evil Chinese” such as Mao Zedong and Xi Jinping who stay the same). So, Minxin Pei has this crystal ball and predicts… hold your breath: “that the odds are high that by 2030, China’s government will be quite different…” Bravo! Feichang hao!

He could also have said: “Tomorrow, nothing will ever be the same again,” or “Mike, we won’t meet so young anymore.” It is very interesting how truisms and prophecy are now sold off as the latest New York Times “journalpop.”

“Journprop?”

Journalism + agitprop. I can’t help but think that Mr. Forsythe must have foreseen that this interview was going to be complete trash. Mr. Pei had “predicted” the Party’s downfall no less than three times! In 1994, in 2006, and in 2016!

Ok, his 1994 take doesn’t really register, because he could not possibly have predicted the rise of the internet, email, September 11, and Starbuck frappuccinos. But by 2006 Mr. Pei could clearly tell, deduced from the wiggle of his toes, that the 60-million-members strong Communist Party of China would call it quits after his powerful book was published. Well, it didn’t.

So, when asked about his colleagues’ professional skepticism, this charlatan said, and I quote: “This is understandable since regime transition is an ultralow probability event.” Well, so, maybe, just MAYBE, this interview really has a ‘ultralow probability’ of ever becoming a triumph for journalism? Just saying.

Not that Mr. Forsythe isn’t morally flexible, though. He’s been manipulating another professor before, making Gardner Bovingdon look as if he condoned terrorism in Xinjiang.[1]New York Times, Q. and A.: Gardner Bovingdon on Uighur Discontent and China’s Choices, May 23, 2014, New York That was fun! So, maybe Mr. Forsythe, reluctant to do this interview in first place, purposely let stupid escalate.

This is one of my all-favorite Mr. Pei quotes: “China may be huge, but it is governed by human beings who, like their counterparts in small countries, make choices that are limited by practical and predictable constraints.” He could also have said: “Listen, my pants are down, I know shit.”

Journalists are scheming creatures: They call you up because they did research on you and know you are probably going to say certain things to support their agenda. And if you don’t, they’ll never call again.

Such tests of integrity cannot deter Pei Minxin, for now. His “serious intellectual exercise with potentially profound policy implications” is selling like hot potatoes to Westerners who must be thinking, hey, why don’t I become “a China expert” myself. I can do that! I can do “serious intellectual exercise with potentially profound policy implications”!

Look, this is a video, “Minxin Pei: China’s Crony Capitalism,” with Steve Paikin,[2]The Agenda with Steve Paikin, Minxin Pei: China’s Crony Capitalism, March 19, 2012, Ontario where Mr. Pei’s friendship with Ezra Vogel, previously on the show, is mentioned. Ezra Vogel is a fine Harvard man. But he is also a former government adviser and CIA man. China expert Michael Forsythe is Harvard, too. Mr. Pei is a PhD Pei from Harvard. They all quote and reference each other, you see. So here’s my pitch for the next Paikin show: “Harvard’s Crony Journalism!” No? I thought so.

But maybe our anti-China propaganda press has ‘good intentions’, right? In 2030. The probability is high. The Communist Party of China. Could indeed be very different. The crystal ball. The smoke. Mr. Forsythe’s creepy pasta: “Bigger forces shaping our lives.” But brother Pei is not lying, is he? “He believes one-party rule in China is unsustainable,” says Mr. Forsythe. Much like biodiversity, the environment, your health, capitalism, and the Cable TV model. Damn he is right! That shit over there in China is unsustainable! I knew it!

So, what’s it gonna be, asks Mr. Forsythe: “Reform? Revolution? Or… a combination of the two: refolution?” Since Mr. Pei is too stupid to answer this simple question, I’m going out on my nipples here and say: It’s definitely gonna be a “refolution.”

Yes! “Refolution!” it’s gonna be!

Here’s another New York Times‘ ‘Q. and A.’, this time by Chris Buckley, with a certain David Shambaugh, China expert on the Communist regime going down the toilet.[3]The New York Times, Q. and A.: David Shambaugh on the Risks to Chinese Communist Rule, March 15, 2015, New York Shambaugh is a regular at Harvard, too. [Here[4]Belfer Center for Science and International Affairs, David Shambaugh, Quarterly Journal: International Security, John F. Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University, Cambridge and here.[5]Fairbank Center, David Shambaugh, ‘China’s International Identities’, Charles Neuhauser Memorial Lecture, Harvard University, Cambridge] So he says things like: “This is where the exodus of the elite and the systemic traps in the economy come in.” Or: “For these reasons, this is why I see the “endgame” of the Communist Party as being underway.” Now, you will say, wait a minute: Mr. Shambaugh’s message is essentially the same as Mr. Pei’s? From the same group of people, Harvard? In the same paper, the New York Times? Wow! Woow!

It gets better. The New York Times evidently promotes such charlatans and quacks all the time. Gordon G. Chang, a favorite of Voice of America, for example. Although he’s no Harvard material, he still made it into the New York Times with an op-ed, here.[6]The New York Times, Chinese Economy On the Edge, July 25, 2013, New York As one commentator, AmateurHistorian, remarks: “[Mr. Chang] has been banking on his 2001 book ‘The Coming Collapse of China’ for the last 15 years. Talk shows and universities absolutely love him when he extols the virtue of America and why China must collapse.”

This is not to say that the New York Times only features doomsayer and pro-US Chinese muppets. They do try hard to throw in, every now and then, some proud Chinese patriot, like Yan Xuetong from Tsinghua University with his “more assertive China” theory. But then, “Xuetong Yan” is also a graduate from the University of Berkeley, California. Tsinghua is plagued by US agents and CIA people. Mr. Forsythe’ spouse, also a New York Times journalist, also from Harvard, is a (feminist-PhD) graduate from Tsinghua.[7]Big Think, When Should Chinese Women Marry –And Whom, April 10, 2014, New York Their boss at the Times until Sept 2014 was Jill Abramson, also Harvard. So, this is a surprisingly small group of China expert collaborators orchestrating subversive campaigns and deciding who gets mentioned, and who doesn’t.

Anyway, if the US flagship media says Minxin Pei is our man, he’s our man. The Wall Street Journal, following top-down propaganda protocol, immediately set up a page: “Notable Quotable Minxin Pei on China,”[8]The Wall Street Journal, Notable & Quotable: Minxin Pei, Nov 26, 2015, New York honoring Mr. Pei’s latest contribution to ‘The American Interest’ magazine and his essay “The Twilight of Communist Party Rule in China.” And – do we really need to mention this – The Wall Street Journal did similar features for David Shambaugh and Gordon G. Chang, too.

I’ll be completely honest with you, alright: Our Western media are practicing a form of unnatural selection by promoting not giants but quacks who tell them what they want to hear. This has inflated Pei Minxin (and many others) unrecognizable. It has corrupted academia. Who needs serious scholarship if you have benefactors with the New York Times, right? And so the business of China-bashing goes on and on.

If Beijing dares to protest, there will be ever harsher Western media campaigns: China is told it must not impede on Westerners’ “freedom” to slowly destabilize the country from within: Censor them, and they will tattletale. Incarcerate them, and they will become martyrs. Ignore them at your own peril.

Thorsten J. Pattberg, Ph.D. is a German cultural critic and political commentator on Sino-Western relations.

Notes

[1] New York Times, Q. and A.: Gardner Bovingdon on Uighur Discontent and China’s Choices, May 23, 2014, New York

[2] The Agenda with Steve Paikin, Minxin Pei: China’s Crony Capitalism, March 19, 2012, Ontario

[3] The New York Times, Q. and A.: David Shambaugh on the Risks to Chinese Communist Rule, March 15, 2015, New York

[4] Belfer Center for Science and International Affairs, David Shambaugh, Quarterly Journal: International Security, John F. Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University, Cambridge

[5] Fairbank Center, David Shambaugh, ‘China’s International Identities’, Charles Neuhauser Memorial Lecture, Harvard University, Cambridge

[6] The New York Times, Chinese Economy On the Edge, July 25, 2013, New York

[7] Big Think, When Should Chinese Women Marry –And Whom, April 10, 2014, New York

[8] The Wall Street Journal, Notable & Quotable: Minxin Pei, Nov 26, 2015, New York

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Academia, American Media, China 
Hide 252 CommentsLeave a Comment
Commenters to Ignore...to FollowEndorsed Only
Trim Comments?
    []
  1. Are you trying to tell us that “the press” would deceive us? They may lie about everything else, but they can’t be making stuff up about China, that would be a step too far!

  2. Nick J says:

    Here in NZ we have a growing trade partnership with China on good terms compared to that with the West, the USA in particular. For my whole lifetime NZ trade negotiators have had the US tariff us, ban our products etc, USA is absolutely protectionist. Yet they demand our political loyalty against China.

    My advice to young people around the world who wish to have a wealthy life, and to benefit their countries. Learn Mandarin or Cantonese. Get qualified in international trade, especially marketing. There are cities in China we have never heard of bigger than countries like us.

  3. Anon[183] • Disclaimer says:

    It hurts seeing the USA Deep State become as aggressive and dishonest as the old Soviet Union once was globally. We really are the bad guys now.

    • Agree: Realist, Tor597, dogbumbreath
  4. Whitewolf says:

    I had never thought about the size of the communist party in China. 60 million strong! That’s impressive. It makes you wonder however how many have made the trip to the west and are still faithful to the party. The large numbers of Chinese immigrants make policing such things pretty much impossible.

  5. Bill P says:

    “Thorsten,” you’re obviously Chinese, not German. That’s fine, and I agree that China experts are often scum — especially MSM employees.

    But the truth is that westerners who really love China and have/had good careers there are bailing out now. Something has changed there. It has become darker and more ominous. It has happened here, too.

    I think those of us who care Sino-Western relations should make some effort to repair the fraying relationship. The future of the world depends largely on Chinese and Westerners finding a way to get along and improve the human condition collaboratively.

    • Replies: @john weber
    , @frankie p
    , @J Lee
  6. This is only guessing, but I think that there is considerable Jewish investment in China, with pretty safe returns.
    That is one of the reasons why Jews are so upset with Trump, who does not like the trade imbalances with China.

    • Agree: Thim
    • Replies: @frankie p
  7. anonymous[400] • Disclaimer says:

    when was the last time you read a piece by a prominent Chinese (other than a dissident) in your nation’s newspaper? You haven’t. It is a tight Orwellian grip.

    So who gets propagandized? The American people as well as other western audiences. It’s not the Chinese public who themselves are oblivious to all the nonsense produced by the China “experts”. It’s not something new, the Russia (or USSR) specialists of previous years were every bit as inept and meddlesome as the current crop of charlatans. American foreign policy types have always been incompetent and Americans are the ones most heavily brainwashed by their misleading confections. There may be an ongoing attempt to subvert the Chinese government but their ability to do so is negligible. They’re reduced to claiming the Chinese are cruel to the Uyghurs, a group no one in America knows or cares about. There’s nothing specific about China; the US has a long track record of subverting and overthrowing other governments. There’s even manuals on how to conduct color revolutions. Lots of worthless so-called journalists are out there acting tremendously self-righteous. That’s also always been the case. They lie for a living.

  8. It’s written that the Iroquois and other Natives in North America ~~migrated from China. China also is home to Lao Tzu, Chuang Tzu, Sun Tzu, et al. The I Ching (sincere book of antiquity) is from China. Tao and 365 meridians in human body (“energy/chi”) Chinese enlightenment. Why would the West admit that China is the reality Napoleon stated. China understands Feng Shui and the West does not. Western devolution vs Eastern evolution, “*what it is” (*Buddha). The Dragon & Phoenix cannot be contaminated via western propaganda. Tao Te Ching at long last. Maybe there can be the Fourth World enlightenment after all.

  9. The Iroquois are the “Republic” model. The U.S. Constitution was actually fashioned via the Iroquois. China isn’t perfect, however, a new model for Earth is indeed a vitally important change to consider.

  10. Exile says:

    The American and European White Nationalist communities are the only political forces in the West that actually respect the sovereignty of foreign races and nations and support bringing the neoliberal globalist money & war machines to heel.

    We are the ones with the legitimate critiques of vulture capitalism that uses battlefield, covert and economic warfare to break national sovereignty and reduce sovereign peoples to homogenized consumer units for globalism – see 1990’s Russia. And our walk matches our talk, unlike Zion Don Trump and all the alleged “human rights crusaders” taking their nation-busting orders from Jerusalem, D.C. and New York and producing the propaganda in Hollywood.

    Globalists make us into boogeymen and call us hateful and violent in a futile attempt at fear and smear – to say nothing of projection.

    It’s because the doctrines our movements rest on fundamentally and integrally rely on and recognize the biological uniqueness of each race, our social and tribal human natures and the popular sovereignty implied and required by those realities.

    We are serious, we are many and we are not going away, no matter how much agit-prop the globalists hurl at us and how many of us are unjustly persecuted for supporting popular sovereignty in both economics and politics.

    A White Nationalist administration in charge of America would unequivocally recognize the sovereignty of the Chinese government and stop our irresponsible interference in Chinese affairs in places like Hong Kong and Taiwan. Just as we demand that White people be sovereign in their own lands, we recognize that the Han have the right to direct the affairs of their homelands as they see fit.

    • Agree: Tool Book and Rifle
    • Replies: @Meena
    , @Tor597
    , @Sollipsist
  11. sally says:

    Our Western media are practicing a form of unnatural selection by promoting not giants but quacks who tell them what they want to hear. This has inflated Pei Minxin (and many others) unrecognizable. It has corrupted academia. Who needs serious scholarship if you have benefactors with the New York Times, right? And so the business of China-bashing goes on and on.

    All must remember that 92% of all media is owned by just 6 people who control by their ability to control access to the media and to control utterances that comprise the information environments and hence the thinking of people of the world. Excluding facts, providing misinformation, selection (but I call it gated access) these six profit motive persons, are supported by just about every business in the world and by the activities of many governments and NGOs around the globe.. The support I speak of is advertising. collectively advertising accounts for what % of the GNP. and yet the benefit serves the needs of but 6 private persons -less 6% unaccounted for.

    Advertising is deductible as a business expense everywhere (a deduction is a government subsidy..just as oil and gas royalties for extraction of oil or gas is a government subsidy.. every deduction a corporation is allowed on its tax returns, is a government subsidy, because the deduction avoids taxation. Also the fact that the federal government has forced state and local government to support and subsidize monopoly powers generated by from thin air rule of law<=this monopoly power is found in the intangible assets section of nearly every major global corporation everywhere. These monopolies are copyrights, patents, and privatized government assets in the form of contracts and franchises ( like the franchise to provide private city, water, garbage and sewerage collection and disposal services like the power company franchise to provide the power or the privately owned communications companies). The intangible assets are subsidized nearly everywhere and they are the monopoly power that has separated the haves from the have nots in nearly every community in the world. The point is intangible assets are not taxed ever except when bought and sold.

    % hot thin air intangible assets /physical tangible assets on balance sheets by yr.
    S&P Market Value % by year 1975 1985 1995 2005 2015
    physical___% physical asset 83 % 68 % 32 % 20 % 16 %
    intangible__% intangible asset 17 % 32 % 68 % 80 % 84%
    source abstract and summary of 2017, Ocean Tomo Comparison Report of 39 companies
    reported several places on the net. The point is the privately owned major media have
    not made it clear that those with the bucks use the nation state governments as a private tool to
    make private profits. Moreover, government subsidy finances those 6 owned private media owners who present the “you can’t see news and media” goals.

    Basically the private media is the redirect between between the Oligarch and the governed masses.. Government activities are hidden by the private media. in exchange for the government subsidy.

    Private monopoly powers uses government to hold the masses still while the monopoly power rapes them.

    So i respond that rising Cult of Experts in nothing new.. what might be new is the Experts are now dissent Chinese.. Do I not understand your point?

  12. Tor597 says:

    Ironically, the China Derangement Syndrome the west is going through right now is more likely to help China than to hurt it.

    China has always had difficulty uniting their entire population, but now that the West has declared total war on Chinese People everywhere there is no longer plausible deniability in the motives the west has in their criticisms.

    Regular Chinese people who at one time thought the west was just trying to help China in pointing out its faults can now clearly see that the west is trying to do everything they can to keep the Chinese poor and weak.

    Since the west relies on divide and conquer tactics to assault a country, a united China will be much more effective in defending itself.

    Funny how Americans can be so concerned about Muslim rights in China after killing over a million Iraqis, completely destroying Libia to a point where its people are now slaves, and trying to do the same to Syria.

    • Agree: Chinaman
  13. Because I’m married to the daughter of a member of their military-industrial nomenklatura, I always have these “China Expert bloggers” pestering me during my office hours at my university in Dalian. They always follow the same track; they approach me as a “fellow American”— I’m not Jewish so that was their first mistake — ask me to divulge military secrets of magnitudes that I am neither allowed access to or am even interested in, get miffed when I tell them to find some other baizuo, and then post their insane theories anyway littered with anonymous sources a la Goldberg.

    Pathetic, contemptible bunch indeed.

    • LOL: Alfred, true.enough
    • Replies: @Alfred
    , @Anonymous
  14. Korbashi says:

    A lot of hot air and ad hominem attacks in here, but little of substance. Much is patently silly, like the kvetching about names.

    Why does the media refer to Minxin Pei and not Pei Minxin? For the simple reason that Pei is his surname and Minxin is his given name. Since he resides in America it makes sense to use American naming conventions, not Chinese ones. That’s no more a European fetish than our friendly German cultural critic Dr. Pattberg’s writing in English for an American publication is a Saxon fetish.

  15. Arcadian says:

    Thorsten, you are completely right. In our common home country, Germany, it is basically the same. I don’t read any newspapers nor watch TV reporting on China. I lived there for nearly 3,5 years, speak the language and don’t recognize this country in such reports. Most Germans have some kind of negative attitude towards China, but the Americans’ one is pure hatred – both echoes exactly the mainstream media reporting. No wonder with such journalists.

    • Agree: dogbumbreath
  16. Amerimutts are desperate for a war the Chinese won’t let them have.
    The end of the road is near for the satanic, nigger loving, kike serving nation of subhumans. They were given three chances over two centuries yet everytime they chose to make the kikes stronger. And not even for money, heh.

    Amerimutts and their kike masters will boil in human excrement. Where? In hell, of course. 1945 payback, scum. Last nail in the coffin.

  17. Svevlad says:

    Don’t see why turning names around is such a problem. Europeans say personal name first, asians say surname first. Then they should turn western names around too, else it’s cultural ass-kissing

  18. utu says:

    While different civilization can exist side by side if sufficiently separated form each other, they cannot mix. Whenever they try to mix then one civilization ends up dominating the other. This applies to cultural dominance including the language. The Wiki entry for Thorsten J. Pattberg states that his research focuses on “language imperialism”. He currently is with Peking University. Being German the issue of native language subjugation as the result of real military defeat and cultural domination by the victor must be close to his heart. Now he sees that China is being Westernized as Germany was Americanized. Chinese adopt Western values and begin to think Western thoughts. Their language patterns change. What he sees as “language imperialism” is an unavoidable process of cultural diffusion from richer and more lively culture to one that is relatively backward. Did Thorsten J. Pattberg hoped to find solace by going native in Beijing to bury his German grief or possibly find an avenger in the Big Chinese Brother?

    Stop shedding tears for China, Dr. Pattberg. You won’t stop the process of China converging with the West unless you convince Chinese to get another Mao Zedong or even better, another Pol Pot who would herd them back to country farms for the purpose of quieting their minds and ‘reeducation’.

    Tibet should not be a part of China for the same reason that Mongolia should not be a part of Russia or China. Hong Kong should not be a part of China for the same reason that Singapore is not a part of China. Taiwan should not be part of China for the same reason that Hawaii should not have been made a part of the US or for the same reason that Puerto Rico is not a part of the US and America does not go ballistic when Puerto Ricans discuss and consider their independence.

    • Troll: d dan, dogbumbreath
    • Replies: @Mackerel Sky
    , @Tor597
    , @denk
  19. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:

    When Yang Rui, a CCTV news anchor, condemned the activities of foreigners in Beijing, his character was assassinated and internationally paraded by China experts as a glaring example of what happens to any Chinese should he or she dare to look askance at them.

    LOL. The “China expert” ecosystem (the policy makers, professors, media owners, and their various “useful idiots”) really is worthy of nothing but ridicule and opprobrium.

    As if Western “agents of influence” and their sundry “theorists”, bootlickers and Chinese collaborators (openly termed “traitors” and “spies” by the wider Chinese public, with no prompting needed from their government) have any sort of power over any Chinese citizen, either inside or outside of China.

    Indeed, as Western power wanes, the list of places where Western censure and “exclusion” (of all types, economic, political, social) is openly disregarded, grows.

    They’ve damaged Yang Rui’s reputation? Laughable.

    In who’s eyes precisely have they damaged a Chinese anchorman’s reputation, I wonder. In self-referential, self-applauding Western policy, media and academic milieux? Let’s see now, these count for exactly . . . ZERO, as far as most non-Westerners are concerned, to include Chinese non-Westerners.

    Yang Rui remains just as respected before, where it matters – among his own countrymen.

    Must be frustrating to be so readily and easily ignored by the Chinese themselves. Next thing you know, these geniuses will resort to abducting Chinese citizens! Oh, wait . . .

  20. Ghali says:

    It is very nice and accurate article. It applies to many nations and cultures. For example, if one replaces China with Iran and Chinese with Iranian, the article equally applies to Iran. It is most likely the same experts will pop-up, because Western experts are “multi-skills”.

    • Agree: Alfred
    • Replies: @Alfred
    , @AnonFromTN
  21. anon[239] • Disclaimer says:

    The systemic anti-Indian bias in the Western MSM is along the same lines, although I’d say it is even more extreme. One reason that it is even more extreme is that, unlike in China, the MSM media within India is also biased. Western journalists who just copy the bias in Indian sources have it much easier because there’s already an abundance of biased reporting in India available (since the Indian MSM often has an anti-BJP, anti-Hindu, anti-nationalist, pro-Marxist bias, pro-Congress,… bias). That makes their job much easier compared to journalists writing about China, since at least within China the amount of anti-China reporting is less, so less can be copied from hostile sources.

    • Replies: @Tor597
    , @Alfred
    , @Anon
  22. In the West, foreign extremist groups, left or right, are monitored and tightly controlled. But no-one controls these Western imperialists.

    The hierarchy of China experts is this: At the top we find the philosophers and statesmen who set the stage and agenda for the universal ideology – exclusively serving Western interests. They always reside in the West, (…)

    Wait a second. Are you saying that “no-one” (I assume you are referring to the people — chiefs of state, lawmakers, etc. — elected to represent Western interests) is controlling those agents who are “exclusively serving Western interests”?

    This is really outrageous! We can’t have that!

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  23. A brilliantly scathing insight into Western supremacist attitudes towards China. Many thanks to the author and to Uncle Ron for publishing it.

  24. Miro23 says:

    An obvious question is why do the US elite hate China so much. Outsourcing US manufacturing to China over the last 40 years has made the 0.0001% vastly rich, and China doesn’t throw its weight around internationally the way the US does.

    My guess, is that realistically, Kissinger’s NWO has to include China since it’s the world’s premier manufacturing power. The problem is that the NWO can’t get its hooks into China. POLITICS – are a closed CPC shop with lifetime meritocratic careers starting in a small group of elite universities. MEDIA – Is Chinese owned and excludes an organization like AP (Associated Press), also excluding Western social media and search engines (providing local duplicates). FINANCE – Chinese self finance through mostly state banks with some private (Chinese) bank participation. EDUCATION – Merit based with high priority, high state investment and excellent result (for example numbers of STEM graduates and PISA results. FOREIGN POLICY – Investment and projects in resource rich developing nations coupled with a refusal to accept US international interference. For example in Iran:

    As a part of the deal, both the countries will invest the money to build infrastructure projects and spend on defense alongside to maintain closer ties with each other. China will inject $280 billion in Iran’s oil, gas and petrochemical sectors over the next five years. It is reported that further capital will be available in each subsequent five-year period.

    Furthermore, the capital infusion will see China investing another $120 billion to overhaul Iran’s transport and manufacturing infrastructure. Chinese companies will be granted to take part in any of the bidding processes for future new, postponed and uncompleted projects related to oil, gas and petrochemical inside Iran.

    https://www.globalbusinessoutlook.com/china-to-sign-400-billion-deal-with-iran-25-year-period/

    NATIONALISM – China defined as the home of the ethnic Chinese people – people who have occupied the land for millennia (evidence of rice farming by the Yangtze river 8.000 years ago) with patriotism regarded as an asset rather than a liability.

  25. Well said, well said!
    This China “expert” trend is one I’ve noticed too.

  26. Biff says:

    Great essay, but kind of old news…

    The last thirty years has been western media reports of doom and gloom about the Chinese economy; all the while the Chinese economy being the biggest bull market on the planet.

  27. GMC says:

    Good article – Every decade or so, we have different experts, in order to get us into more wars, more regime changes etc. Why I remember,, exactly 50 years ago – this month , I went 8000 miles across the Sea , in order to help fight the spread of Communism – whatever that was ! Anybody been to Vietnam lately? lol. So , if those college, perfumed military boys think that we can do to China, like we did in Nam, – I hope they are at the front of the charge. lol It’s all a Game – and its been going on – way to long. Spacibo

  28. gotmituns says:

    fougettaboud “China Experts.” ∃xpertism is raging throughout the world on every topic known the mankind. Everybody’s an “∃xpert” anymor∃.

  29. Moi says:
    @Curmudgeon

    China is a great civilization. By contrast, the US arguably is the most rapacious nation in history. Fact!

    • LOL: 36 ulster
  30. @Whitewolf

    60 millions back then, 90 millions today.

  31. Alfred says:
    @Whitewolf

    The large numbers of Chinese immigrants make policing such things pretty much impossible.

    Ethnic Chinese are essentially patriotic. Even the Chinese in Taiwan are privately proud of China. The Chinese of Singapore and S.E. Asia likewise.

    That is a huge advantage for their ancient civilisation. They may often speak different dialects, but they think in a similar fashion. Maoism did not succeed in destroying the family and clan.

  32. Mr. Pattberg has some good points. It’s not a matter of the American Lyin’ Press being biased so much as these journalists are among the stupidest people you will ever run into (and I have). You do read a lot from those who’ve never been to the place, such as Godfree Roberts right here on unz, and those who’ve only gone to Shanghai or Peking and stayed in 5-star hotels for a few days.

    Lest the reader here think that all commenters on China are like that, let me say that I’ve been there 11 times, once for nearly 2 months, staying in an apartment with Chinese people. In case anyone thinks the Peak Stupidity blog contains rantings of some China-bashing ignorant American, Peak Stupidity has written very fairly with lots of it from actual experience there, including all, the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly:

    Just a sampling here, of…

    The GOOD:

    A Peak Stupidity apology to our Chinese readers
    China vs. America and the local hardware store
    Trains in the Orient vs. America
    A China story and Chinese vs. American Police States
    Fireworks from China
    Fun with Pronouns

    The BAD:

    The Long March of the Chinese Commies
    The China to King Buffet Pipeline
    Current-Era Espionage and Immigration
    Banned in Beijing
    The Chinese are not happy with their over 20 year-long unfair! trade deal with America,
    and with even its own topic key, Cheap China-made Crap, we ask
    Cheap China-Made Crap – who’s responsible?

    The UGLY:

    The Ugly Chinaman

    OK, just for fun:
    Can we put this whole Moon-Pie vs. Moon-Cake issue behind us?
    Sexy Cyborg – Miss Naomi Wu and You know I read it in a magazeye-eee-eee-een…
    Litterbugs in China

    • Disagree: Biff
  33. Alfred says:

    ========= IMPORTANT ============

    The links on the footnotes do not work.

    For example,

    “Big Think, When Should Chinese Women Marry –And Whom, April 10, 2014, New York”

    should be here:

    https://bigthink.com/dragons-and-pandas/chinese-women-when-should-they-marry-and-whom

    =============================

  34. @Miro23

    Individual sovereignty is absolutely no no to the powers that be. and yet they constantly peddle the ideal of freedom and democracy all day long.

  35. Thorsten Twattbery, you are correct in your assessment of the contemptible “China watchers.” However, I felt a twinge of nausea when I got to your quote here:

    “Next we have the journalists and editors, most of them white or accessory white, in key positions at the New York Times, Wall Street Journal, Economist, and so on.”

    It’s pretty contemptible how you neglect the Jewish element in all this. But seeing as your a citizen of American-occupied (and by extension ZOG-occupied) Germany, I can’t blame you for being discreet about what you write. The consequences for you are probably prison, far worse than that of the pro-China journalists who try to express their opinions among the circle of “China watchers” that you mention, which is why you lamenting the poor fate of journalists who try to counter the anti-China narrative doesn’t gain my sympathy.

    What do you think would happen, Thorsten, if a Western journalist decided to praise China for being racially-conscious and ethnonationalist? What would happen if a white (non-Jewish) Western journalist praised China for having strict immigration and labor laws that prohibits foreigners from becoming Chinese citizens, having a controlling interest or owning most of the equity in China firms, owning land in China, working in Chinese industries, etc.? They would be hounded out as alt-right, Neo-Nazi extremists and not allowed to publish again. The fact is, most pro-white advocates, white nationalists, alt-righters, ethnonationalists, members of the dissident right(call them what you will) totally admire China and worship it as a city on a hill for its hardcore ultra-nationalist policies and culture that resists the globo-homo hegemony. China is the model of everything that they want to be (you can read a recent article by Keith Woods praising China in no uncertain terms for this very reason, and his sentiments are echoed on the dissident right all the time). Marrying a Chinese spouse and joining Team Yellow is obviously the most favored course of action for black-pilled whites who see their culture and civilization in the toilet, and I can’t blame them for it, unless you wanna join the Proud Boys and go duke it out with brainwashed, drug-addled, mentally-unstable Antifa bros.

    So spare me your virtue-signaling bashing of “white” journalists and get your priorities straight and don’t tell me how the so-called “Germans” supposedly fund Xinjiang separatists or how the so-called “British” supposedly fund Tibetan separatists or how the so-called “Americans” finance Taiwan separatists. You’re only stirring up unnecessary racial antagonism among whites and Asians, which normally respect each other.

    If white Americans do express anti-China sentiments, it’s only because they’ve been deluded, cucked, and gaslit in the same they’ve been on virtually every other issue relevant to race, ethnicity, and identity. And we all know who is to blame for that.

    You’re just as comical and ridiculous as the so-called China watchers you so self-righteously criticize.

    • Troll: vot tak, Tor597
    • Replies: @Realist
    , @Whitewolf
  36. frankie p says:
    @Whitewolf

    92 million members at the end of 2019.

    The western media monsters want you to believe the that CCP is limited to a bunch of old
    Communist Mullahs at the top who are corrupt and hold total power.

    In reality, CCP members have a responsibility to serve the nation. Who do you think was expected to VOLUNTEER to go to Wuhan when the COVID-19 crisis hit? Communist Party Members were called up and expected to answer the call. Failure to do so without real reasons probably led to some repercussions.

    People who study the organization and promotional system of CCP politicians must come to the conclusion that politically China and the CCP are FAR MORE meritocratic than western democracy.

    A simple study of the roots of the high political leaders of various nations and their origins immediately show that the CCP have FAR MORE high level leaders originating from the middle classes. In addition, looking at the promotional system shows that CCP leaders who reach the top work methodically through a long stream of lower then incrementally higher positions, succeeding and bringing benefit to the people in the areas that they serve for decades before they reach higher positions.

    • Agree: Realist
    • Replies: @E_Perez
    , @AnonFromTN
  37. frankie p says:
    @Bill P

    I agree Bill, but there don’t seem to be many western people making the effort to repair the fraying relationship. In fact, the opposite is happening, and the trend is intensifying. The reaction of the Chinese resembles that of the Russians in many ways. They WANT to have a stable and mutually beneficial relationship, and they are worried and scared, not of the power of the west and its political class and establishment, but of its deranged, unhinged nature.

  38. frankie p says:
    @Zarathustra

    I disagree completely. Of course there are significant Jewish investments. There are significant corporate investments in manufacturing in China from every developed country, including Asian ones.
    What does NOT EXIST in China is the global, Jewish run usurious financial services sector, and this is what the big Jews are pushing Trump to seek in his negotiations with China. Anyone who believes that the Chinese are ignorant of this fact and have any plans to allow the vampire squids to start sucking the prosperity out of China are not dealing with reality.

    • Agree: Realist, Robjil, Maowasayali
    • Replies: @Thorsten is a Twat
  39. @utu

    Most of Hong Kong, that is, Kowloon and the New Territories, are literally parts of the geographical Chinese Mainland, so your analogy with Singapore is inept. Most people in Hong Kong are from Guandong, or descended from people who are, at only one or two generations removed. Hong Kong is obviously part of China on several levels, including now politically. I suggest you get used to reality.

  40. Let me save the readers some time.

    One bullshit artist, the author, complaining about other bullshit artists.

    I wasted a few minutes so you won’t have to.

    • LOL: trickster
  41. …Taiwan separatists…

    oh gawd. That’s all I needed to read in order to understand Pattberg’s true character.

    But, kudos to Thorsten for all of the edgy photos of himself trying to look Asian. Squint the eyes, grow a goatee and kiss the supervisors’ shoes in beijing.

    • Troll: d dan
  42. Onebornfree says: • Website

    This article appears to have been written by a paid Chinese communist propagandist , and is essentially no different from most of the rest of the idiotic pro-big – government/communist /anti -freedom garbage I often encounter here. End of story.

    “Because they are all ultimately funded via both direct and indirect theft [taxes], and counterfeiting [central bank monopolies], all governments are essentially, at their very cores, 100% corrupt criminal scams which cannot be “reformed”or “improved”,simply because of their innate criminal nature.” onebornfree

    No regards, onebornfree

    • Replies: @Tor597
  43. Anyone who has lived abroad or traveled much realizes that it is critical for MSM to propagandize the “exceptional” American people (usually via State Dept/ CIA narratives; legal since 2013) . Otherwise Americans will realize we are much worse off than almost any other modern country, and bad things might happen.
    While Mitt Romney and Bain were sending American manufacturing jobs to China, and Bill Clinton, in return for Chinagate money, was escalating offshoring plus highly technical equipment and technologies (previously verboten, “because of communism destroying our way of life”) and of course pushing for permanent free nation trading status. Only idiot Trump has waded into economic battle with the monster giant the US created, much too late.
    For China, once on par with Capitalist India forty years ago, it has worked out well. All those American jobs directly and indirectly have raised 88% of their population out of poverty. They have built, built, built, integrating new infrastructure and architecture with historic cultural sites throughout China, high speed trains, new airports, with an emphasis on science, technology and innovation. Their government is much more focused on helping their people and communities (the US is focused on helping Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates, Elon Musk, Zuckerberg, etc; their “club” is much bigger and more inclusive than the American Club).
    Covid-19 is emblematic of our future. China and SE Asia make most of our masks and drugs (and very soon will invent better medicines), the Chinese shared ventilators and supplies with Italy when the rest of the EU would not share, and most importantly (results!) have only 3 Covid-19 deaths per million (compared to the US with 598 per million, and our poodle the UK with 612 per million). Unless the Thucydides Trap brings them down (their partnership with Russia is critical), China and trade, rather than the US and banks and bombs, will win out in a big way.

    • Agree: Zarathustra, HeebHunter
    • Replies: @Thomasina
  44. MLK says:
    @john weber

    This author is a strange duck. What comes up are images from his dress up ‘Lenin’ phase:

    http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/communpedia/images/2/2d/Thorsten_J_Pattberg_German_philosopher_Peking_University_2012.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160131035743

    And YouTube videos in which he’s morphed into a look and manner only a German would come up with — white nationalist meets Fu Manchu:

    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=Thorsten+J.+Pattberg&docid=608033954709308575&mid=426EC50C3CE2CE1E5037426EC50C3CE2CE1E5037&view=detail&FORM=VIRE

    If Thorsten is any indication, those Han are going to relieve the Germans of its world-beating industries (e.g. Autos; Machine Tools) in record time.

    • Replies: @john weber
    , @Anonymous
  45. Realist says:

    It gets better. The New York Times evidently promotes such charlatans and quacks all the time. Gordon G. Chang, a favorite of Voice of America, for example.

    Chang is a half Chinese, self-hater who was born in the US and knows nothing about China. His prognostications about the fall of China have been laughably wrong. Unfortunately The New York Times is not the only media that takes Chang seriously…Tucker Carlson presents him from time to time to bad mouth China. Why Carlson promotes the China bad meme is unknown to me. He must know he is following the Republican Inc/Deep State dogma…is he stupid or controlled? On most other issues Carlson seems to be in line with reality. The Deep State lives in fear of China, because they stand in the way of US hegemony.

    • Replies: @HeebHunter
  46. Realist says:
    @Whitewolf

    It makes you wonder however how many have made the trip to the west and are still faithful to the party.

    If they visit any of our large shit hole cities…they are most likely on the next plane home.

  47. @Nick J

    How’s Fonterra holding up after that tainted baby formula episode due to Chinese lax standards?

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
    , @denk
    , @Nick J
  48. @frankie p

    What does NOT EXIST in China is the global, Jewish run usurious financial services sector,

    I wish you were right. If only what you said were true. Many of us would like to believe that China is this ultra-nationalist, red-pilled, super woke, racially conscious nation guided by woke, principled leaders. Unfortunately, the picture is not as rosy as you would like to believe, and even the savvy, red-pilled and bad-ass ethnonationalist Chinese capitulate to Jewish global finance and capital in more ways than you can imagine… Just one example: Sheldon Adelson is the biggest investor in Macau, with Sands Macau. I know it’s not mainland China, but still… How does Adelson continue to secure his gambling license? I’m sure he’s got his paws in a lot of vice industries involving prostitution and trafficking of Chinese girls. He may very well be like the Epstein of China for all we know. When is Xi going to kick him out? I know it’s complicated (given the potential for more international media backlash, psy-ops, and color revolutions much like the ones that we see occurring in Hong Kong), and Adelson probably knows how to bribe the right people and work with the triads, but Adelson needs to be kicked out. I thought the Chinese were a proud people who wouldn’t tolerate this disgusting encroachment on their culture. It’s time for Xi to man up and take care of business. The Chinese are actually TOO NICE!!

    • Troll: vot tak
    • Replies: @GMC
    , @Frankie P
  49. I agree Bill, but there don’t seem to be many western people making the effort to repair the fraying relationship

    The Chinese aren’t exactly trying to make nice either:

    • Thanks: Achmed E. Newman
  50. Marcali says:

    In the class room of a communist country we were told that if a one-party state has a socialist economy than it is a communist country.
    Then we asked what about a one-party state with a capitalist economy?
    That is fascism – answered the teacher instantly.

  51. KlcTan says:
    @Whitewolf

    CPC has 90 million members, not 60 million.

  52. Funny you should include the corpulent Jew Kissinger in your list of China detractors for if it wasn’t for him (he’s just representing the “Rothschild” interest in the West) a strong China wouldn’t have emerged in the last three or four decades, therefore, you must be a German Nazi. Are you?

    If there are China haters (I am one of them) then there’re China lovers (like you) so the score is equal on that but I think that if Minxin Pei is as bad as you say then Pattberg ThorstenJ is equally bad … it’s par for the course!

    • Replies: @trickster
  53. Everything China is a cult. Pro China is a cult. Anti China is another cult. I don’t get either with respect to China. Chinese steal intellectual properties. Seems like they botch almost everything they make. What exactly this trade war is about? Doesn’t seem like much since we’re still getting their exports minus the 5G, which I don’t get why anyone actually wants it. Then there is all that fentanyl China is making specifically for the American market. Now is that free markets at work or an act of war? Don’t know just wish we were operating on the slow boat mode of travel with respect to the Chinese. Because unlike the cults that either loves them or wants to own them, I just want to have a mutual mind your own business and leave me alone relationship with China.

    • Agree: Achmed E. Newman
  54. gotmituns says:

    ᛏᚺᛖ ᚾᚨᛏᛁᛟᚾᚨᛚ ᛊᛟcᛁᚨᛚᛁᛊᛏ ᛗᛟvᛖᛗᛖᚾᛏ ᚹᚨᛊ ᚱᛁᚷᚺᛏ

  55. GMC says:
    @Thorsten is a Twat

    That business about Adelson in China, would make a good article.

  56. Frankie P says:
    @Thorsten is a Twat

    Yes, Macau most certainly IS Mainland China, despite its history as a Portuguese colony. I feel that your description of the situation with Sheldon Adelson in Macao is superficial and doesn’t analyze the reasons China has allowed Adelson to operate there. There was certainly the hope for a quid pro quo, and the Chinese are fully aware of the clout Adelson has with Trump and the Republican party. I agree that things haven’t worked out the way the Chinese hoped, and perhaps, as you say, China will show Adelson the door. To portray his as having POWER over or even significant influence with the CCP is misguided. As to big Finance, do you understand the power it exerts over western governments? That does not exist in China.

    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  57. Realist says:
    @Thorsten is a Twat

    I see you are new here…two posts. Your dumbass nom de plume gives you away as a one issue troll.

    • Agree: Commentator Mike
  58. The author’s presentation is welcome.

    For perspective there are voices that view China in a different light upon a platform of philosophy and history that is not a monkey trap for the financial oligarchy.

    Case in point: Below is a presentation on Confusious and the building of civilization by Michael Billington, a western philosopher scholar and former political prisoner, incarcerated for his association with Lyndon LaRouche, and for his refusal to play the plea bargain game. First a recent article by him on the British role in fomenting a U.S. /China crisis, now and as a historical pattern.

    https://larouchepub.com/eiw/public/2020/eirv47n21-20200522/13-21_4721.pdf

    Billington represents, as an associate of LaRouche, an advocate of neither East nor West, but of universal human culture, and thus civilization, where the role of the sovereign nation state, is crucial and vital and as best exemplified by the mission of the United States of which the modern industrial revolution in China towards a New Silk Road, LaRouche’s idea, is situated as in the interest of the U.S. from a larger understanding of the economics of the American System situated upon advancement of humanity through commitment to development of the physical economy.

    • Thanks: Erebus
  59. Meena says:
    @Exile

    “The American and European White Nationalist communities are the only political forces in the West that actually respect “

    This is one of finer products of the cottage industries of the micro or sel-f propaganda . Once the big blizzard of the massive propaganda has crossed the land ,visibility of the self propaganda really takes off.

    The snow storm of the propaganda disintegrates under the weight of the reality, not into self awareness woke state, and readiness to face the incompleteness of the existing ideas, but into smaller clouds and, scattered piles of snows of old faiths and hard beliefs among those brain washed by the state (Harvard NYTimes Hudson or nay combination of newspaper universities and think tanks) .

    “A White Nationalist administration “ is the utopia generated by and implicit in the same old bigger foul ,audacious ,lying, and vindictive brainwashing propaganda of NYTimes CIA Harvard or Oxford or Max Planck.

    India is a crude example but of the reverse .Fancy and false ideas have coalesced into what we hear see today in India .

    This is human nature . But it is not productive efficient nor edifying .It just allows you to wait until a shyster worse than Trump or Falwell takes you to the cliff vacuums your wallet and leaves you stranded far from any hope.

  60. trickster says:

    More experts ? Have we not had enough of them and their bullshit ? There are 2 interesting articles on Townhall.com today. One deals with the up and down left and right funky chicken the Corona virus has become in Las Vegas. The other is about why Experts are more and more distrusted.

    The problem these days is that everyone has an opinion just like everyone has an asshole. The “expert” is the one who goes on and on about the same topic. Yet, the thinking man (and there aren’t too many left) soon discerns gaps in the dialogue, contradictions and of course outright lies and falsehoods in addition to wild claims and equally outrageous predictions. A classic case of this here on Unz is of course our resident Corona expert Dr Karlin. The ignorant majority slurp up their crap served up 24/7/365.

    All too often the “expert” is someone who used to hawk peanuts but decided to become a blogger OR one of those Ivy League graduates who dropped out of Junior Kindergarten but whose Papa contributed to said institutions endowment. In both cases the vulgar crowd hang onto the words of people who are more ignorant than they are.

    Any and every dickhead these days has a twitter account, an instagram account, a facebook account, a Youtube Account and a blogging account. If you become sufficiently popular you may get invited to the MSM clown show to be used and where your “expertise” is sure to be confirmed. Astonishing and astounding !

    Whereas before there was limited radio and TV time and newspapers had X pages, with unlimited server space that space has to be filled with information usually unintelligent, the goal being advertising revenue, content be damned.

    I dont believe anything I see on MSM and experts are just amusing clowns as far as I am concerned like stuck records.

    Further I could give a shit about China. Its a 4000 year old civilization that has contributed nothing to said civilization except cheesy Kung Fu movies, chop sticks and noodles. Day by day more and more of them flee their 4000 year old civilization to come to our 250 year old civilization. They have abandonned their vaunted Confucian education system to study in the good old USA so they can return to Hong Dong, Guandong or Short Dong with a certificate to impress their fellow villagers.

    The Chinks here on UNZ will tell you different but remember they too are “experts” living here or living there and wishing they were living here.

    Here is the expert opinion of the Trickster. The day we stop buying their cheap geegaws is the day they revert back to being a subsistence society planting rice and Bok Choy as they were doing a short 40 years ago. They were useless for 3,960 years (for those still using an abacus that is 4000-40). I say fuck them all, the “experts” can have them.

    • Troll: HeebHunter
  61. Tor597 says:
    @Whitewolf

    The Chinese who are exposed to the west are probably even more committed to the party. Why wouldn’t they be?

    Look at how racist the west is towards them.

    When you see how the west works from a distance it is easy to fall for their propaganda of human rights and democracy.

    But when they actually visit the west they can see how much of this is just BS.

    • Agree: Chinaman
  62. @Curmudgeon

    Well, it could lead to ww3 and nuclear war.

    You want that?

    As a few experts love to point out that Nuclear war is Not as bad as we are lead to believe. It seems that all cities and water sources getting nuked isn’t consider nation ending.

    Just a set back of 10 years.

    The opening paragraph of this article says it all, bravo.

    What is the charge for foreign agents actively trying to over throw a govt? Treason is only reserve for the Chinese citizens.

  63. For those of us old enough to have witnessed China just before, during and after Mao’s cultural revolution, followed by China’s rise as an economic power, it is hard not to conclude that an ethnocentric framework has informed our dealing with China. So long as China remained a backward country, there was little need for the legion of mostly hostile cult of China experts seen today. Our need for enemies is inextricably tied to our resentment of Others owning or competing with us for a piece of the pie. Our criminal actions against selected nations in the ME where hundreds of thousands have perished from our wars and societies destroyed follow this pattern of an ethnocentric basis of our lopsided relationship with these countries.

  64. Tor597 says:
    @Exile

    lol.

    This is the most ridiculous take I have seen from the Unz comment section.

    The white nationalist parts of the west are the most hostile and racist to China. They may hate neoliberalism because it causes immigration, but they definitely don’t want to leave China alone.

    It is only a very small minority of white nationalists who don’t worship Trump or even know what neoliberalism or neoconservative is.

    The huge majority of white nationalists love Trump and echo his hostility towards China. Look at how Trump politicized the “China Virus”. It is almost always white nationalists who use this line.

  65. @Frankie P

    At this point and stage. All the big companies in the USA are integrated into the govt. Especially high tech ones.

    Former NSA head just joined Amazon. They don’t even bother to hide it anymore.

    • Agree: Whitewolf
  66. @Nick J

    Australia is doing exactly that. China is it’s biggest trade partner and yet it shits on China constantly. The Chinese are now seeking out other raw material sources. This is gonna be fun.

    • Replies: @Whitewolf
    , @Nick J
  67. Tor597 says:
    @utu

    utu, what are you talking about?

    I agree that civilizations mixing is problematic. But the problem with the west is they do not want to even allow civilizations to exist seperately. You have to be colonized by the west or be neutralized.

    Why do you think it is inevitable that the Chinese become Americanized? I see the opposite. America was massively exposed because of the Corona Virus. Pro Western people in China are a minority and fading fast.

    Funny you mention America not caring if Puerto Rico wants to leave the US but Puerto Rico is not part of the US in the first place. Its citizens cannot vote. Let’s see how ballistic Americans get when Hawaii moves for independence.

    If you want to say that China should not have Tibet, HK, and Taiwan then fine. But why just bring up Hawaii? By that same logic America should also be forced to give up the American west and Alasks if not the entire continent.

    • Replies: @denk
  68. Ron Unz says:
    @Old and Grumpy

    How’s Fonterra holding up after that tainted baby formula episode due to Chinese lax standards?

    You might want to read my own article on that subject:

    https://www.unz.com/runz/chinese-melamine-and-american-vioxx-a-comparison/

    • Agree: Blinky Bill
  69. Whitewolf says:
    @Thorsten is a Twat

    The fact is, most pro-white advocates, white nationalists, alt-righters, ethnonationalists, members of the dissident right(call them what you will) totally admire China and worship it as a city on a hill for its hardcore ultra-nationalist policies and culture that resists the globo-homo hegemony. China is the model of everything that they want to be

    I’m pro-White and I certainly don’t worship China or see it as a model for Europeans. Their culture might suit Chinese but it would not suit Europeans. Not flooding your country with third world foreigners isn’t rocket science. You don’t need to copy the Chinese to do that. Copying is their thing not ours.

    Marrying a Chinese spouse and joining Team Yellow is obviously the most favored course of action for black-pilled whites who see their culture and civilization in the toilet, and I can’t blame them for it, unless you wanna join the Proud Boys and go duke it out with brainwashed, drug-addled, mentally-unstable Antifa bros.

    If you would consider marrying a Chinese woman then you probably shouldn’t be calling yourself pro-White. You’re already exactly what anti-Whites want you to be.

    • Replies: @trickster
  70. trickster says:
    @Really No Shit

    The “writer” is either one of the tribe pretending to be a Nazi or a Nazi wannabe Israeli. Either way members of either sect could give a shit about the Chinese other than scheming how to to run them like mutts. The fact is most of the world have no use for the Chinese and despise the lot of them. Name the race from Filipino to English, from Japanese to African, from German to South American and feel the lack of love. They are tolerated and God alone knows why. The article is just a blast of rectal wind from an “expert” commenting on other “experts”.

    Blacks in Africa wanted the white man out and the Chinaman in because he had a continuous smile on his face and was thus their Bro. They soon discovered the Chinaman’s smile was in fact a sneer and a snarl and now the Negroes are slowly coming to realize they are an abusive plague of locusts who make the white massa look like a benevolent monk. Too late for them though. The sheep in wolf’s clothing, the wolf in sheep’s clothing and the wolf in wolf’s clothing are already through the door and now unwelcome residents!

    Whites better get with the fucking program. There are some all for diversity, multiculturalism and all that nonsense. The day when their boss’s name is Fung, or Dung, they day when they turn up for work and see only shifty slanty eyes, when they are the only white (and the shit house janitor to boot) and that sneer is the day they will wake up.

    Like the boys in Africa, loving whites under the Chinese heel, with the $1.00 flip flop on their windpipe will realize that while we were for fairness, respect, human rights and all that lovey dovey shit, the Chinaman was all for domination ! What these dummies dont realize that what we consider kindness they consider weakness.

    Wake up people. Take a trip to JFK or La Guardia. More and more arrive everyday and when they attain population mass its your ass.

    Trickster Fortune Cookie says ” Bed Bugs under sheet bite you”. Sooner or later we WILL have to correct this situation and put them in their place. Like the bed big infestation the mattress will have to be burned, the room fumigated and the source eradicated. Otherwise our home will become uninhabitable.

  71. Alfred says:
    @Supply and Demand

    I tell them to find some other baizuo.

    Maybe you should tell them with a straight face to ask Pei Minxin or one of the others mentioned here. 🙂

  72. @Tor597

    It is only a very small minority of white nationalists who don’t worship Trump or even know what neoliberalism or neoconservative is.

    This is a lie if I’ve ever seen one. NO ONE in the dissident right likes Trump, let alone “worships” him.

    The huge majority of white nationalists love Trump and echo his hostility towards China. Look at how Trump politicized the “China Virus”. It is almost always white nationalists who use this line.

    Nope. Wrong again. WNs and people on the dissident right don’t fall for the China bashing, nor do they fall for the Islam bashing and counter-Jihad nonsense. They realize that all of that is just a diversion from Israeli and Jewish subversion and propaganda. For example, the idea that “China is causing censorship in the film industry”(which is the funniest of all given how China’s influence on the film industry is actually good thing because the Chinese screen out movies with race-mixing, degeneracy, and other Jewish garbage) or “spying on America” or “holding US treasury as a threat” or “spreading coronavirus” or whatever other stupid anti-China propaganda the JRight comes up with is the most laughable thing for WNs and the dissident right, because they understood how much Jews spy on America, control American finance and entertainment, and use China as bogeyman to distract people from Israeli influence over American tech, Israeli/Jewish censorship via hate crim legislation and anti-BDS legislation, Jewish blackmail of American political leaders via Epstein’s honeytrap video-tapes, Weinstein’s rapine of white Gentile girls, Israeli lobby’s draining of American resources, Israel’s violation of human rights in Palestine, etc.

    Whether by design or due to ignorance, you’ve confused the Zionist-led alt-light and Zionist-led mainstream conservative movement with the REAL dissident right. You’re either a disinformation agent or just plain ignorant.

    You’ve even gone so far as to misrepresent regular MAGApede conservatives in the process. To the extent that they “echo [Trump’s] hostility towards China,” it’s not on a racial basis (since MAGApedes and conservatives renounce racism and actually love to signal about how non-racist they are by finding black figureheads for their causes and seeking out black spokespeople to convey their message), it’s because they are being told that China is “communist,” which means that they have to “oppose communism” or “fight against socialism” so that they can “save the Chinese” and give them “freedom and human rights.” They [i.e. the conservatives and MAGApedes whom you’ve confused for WN and the dissident right] also hope to see American manufacturing and jobs returned, which Trump was never going to do. They are not “hostile” to China per se, as you so disingenuously claim, they are just misguided and deluded because Trump is slyly exploiting patriotic Americanism to win elections.

    • Replies: @Tor597
  73. So, China practices “crony capitalism?”

    Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

  74. Jiminy says:

    Years ago I saw a tv show about the last Rubbermaid factory in the US being broken up and sent off to China, the whole lot. The president at no stage came out to say stop this nonsense.
    There are obviously plans afoot concerning China, which is now seen as the new boogeyman. The US is hellbent on antagonising China over its island bases in the south China sea, with their constant posturing over their perceived lack of freedom of navigation rights through the area. I wonder of America’s reaction if one morning they awoke to find an armada of Chinese warships parked in the Gulf of Mexico.
    Now our supreme leader is blindly following the yanks into troubled waters. Backing them up, as if to say,”if there’s more than one of us, then we must be in the right, and you’re wrong. “ And yet Australia needs China for our future growth probably more than China needs us. Clearly China sees its future in the Middle East and the dark continent.
    I think the attacks on China won’t cease until every part of the economy is freely opened up to the west. Until that happens, I suspect the China bashing to continue unabated.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  75. Whitewolf says:
    @Astuteobservor II

    Australia is doing exactly that. China is it’s biggest trade partner and yet it shits on China constantly. The Chinese are now seeking out other raw material sources. This is gonna be fun

    The governments of Australia and China might criticise each other publicly but it won’t affect trade too much. If you’ve ever dealt with Chinese or Asians in general you know they are extremely price sensitive. They’ll dump a long term supplier pretty quick if another offers the same a few cents cheaper. As long as Australia offers a cheap price they’ll continue to buy. Besides they are busy buying up Australian mining and other assets so they aren’t going to abandon that over some criticism.

    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  76. E_Perez says:
    @frankie p

    Did someone say “Volksgemeinschaft” ?

    Maybe the CCP even copied a tract from NS Germany, which declared

    “The new nobility of the German nation, which is open to every German, is nobility based on accomplishment.”

    • Replies: @frankie p
  77. Alfred says:
    @Ghali

    because Western experts are “multi-skills”.

    The one who always amazed me was Condoleezza Rice. Allegedly an expert on Russia. I have been told that her Russian is atrocious.

    Here is a typical example by 4 ” Russia experts” from the Hoover Institute – H. R. McMaster, John Cochrane, Niall Ferguson and Condoleezza Rice. Their ignorance is beyond belief.

    McMaster is a retired US general who was involved in the invasion of Iraq etc.
    Chochrane is an economist from Chicago – the very same people who tried to destroy Russia’s economy.
    Ferguson is a Scottish historian who considers himself a new-imperialist.
    Rice refused to testify to the 9/11 about her meetings with the CIA prior to this event.

    A bigger collection of failures it is hard to imagine.

  78. denk says:
    @utu

    Tibet, Xinjiang, Mongolia etc blah blah blah…

    There [[[they]]] go again,

    Those who are squatting on the biggest land grab in human history…USA, Canada, Oz, NZ, Hawaii, GUam, Falklands, Diego Garcia,
    Puerto Rico, OKinawa, Jeju,
    etc etc, are the last ones who get to lecture China.

    [[[]]] = five liars.

    • Agree: Tor597
    • Replies: @Curmudgeon
  79. @Miro23

    Maybe we should check. Carbon dating of Lucy’s skeleton established 9thousand years.
    So if Chinese already planted rice 8 thousand years ago the civilization in China is older than Africans.

    • Replies: @Miro23
  80. KA says:

    What would have happened if USA didn’t normalize the relationship with China ? What would have happened if India didn’t allow Vasco da Gama to land or East India Company to plant its roots ?
    What would have happened if Native Indians didn’t trust and teach colonist how to understand and use the nature for survival ?

    Certain thought can turn out to be a strong fetish offering vicarious self satisfying emotion and an eagerly waiting sense of vindication.

    A cursory analysis would show that the post 80 political ,military, economic realities wouldn’t have even have its earliest signs of beginning by this 2021 in USA or West . China still would have generated without any “ US help “ large part of its economy and improved its science base.

    Japanese in 19 th century , German in 19 th century and Hitler and Stalin in 20 th century turned the countries into shapes of technological behemoths with no active help from outside .

  81. denk says:
    @Old and Grumpy

    Chinese lax standards?

    As opposed to premeditated genocide... ?

    https://allthatsinteresting.com/agent-orange-victims

  82. @Tor597

    American big tech is run by Jews and its management collaborates with the ADL in enforcing strict censorship and de-platforming of the dissident right. Given this, do you honestly think WN and the dissident right would fall for propaganda that criticizes China for not having “free speech” or for censoring their Internet? WN and the dissident right applaud China for constructing their own parallel universe in cyberspace, one that is not regulated and administered by people surnamed Zuckerberg, Sandberg, Brin, Page, Ellison, etc.

    Don’t make me laugh!

    • Replies: @Tor597
  83. Tor597 says:
    @anon

    This is rediculous. There is no anti-Indian bias in the west. It is the opposite. India gets a pass because they are subservient.

    You mention anti-BJP stories, but no one in America even knows what the BJP is.

    It is one thing to report on actual events in India. The west will even do this to its allies. The difference lies in weaponizing these news stories to try and topple a foreign country.

    There is no sustained reports in the media or popular culture with the intention of overthrowing or containing India. Why would there be? India is already subservient to the west.

  84. Tor597 says:
    @Miro23

    The west hates China because it sees it self at the top of a caste system and it is afraid that China will displace them.

    • Replies: @TobiSandman
    , @Harold Smith
  85. @MLK

    My take is he uses China among others to explain a unique but ubiquitous situation where we introduce a new foreign words of non-western cultures, tend to look for its equivalent word in our own to substitute, instead of digging it deeper and figure out the true meaning of the word, which often results in huge misunderstanding between the west and the rest. And perhaps it could also help us learn from other cultures if we do it correctly, considering the fact that we have not been known for our ability to self-reflect, in the mist of a long political, social and economic slide in the west.

  86. @Curmudgeon

    I once overheard a conversation on Twitter many years ago, where Fortsythe and Minter and Wong made some remarks about how to abuse the Chinese users and when the Chinese Wu-Mau (50 Cents) retaliate, then they (the Westerners) could immediately claim VICTIMHOOD and OPPRESSION in China. So, they would basically write themselves as martyrs, win prizes for good journalism. This is what they do in China: bashing, provoking, fake news.

  87. Tor597 says:
    @Onebornfree

    Got it.

    Anyone that does not kow tow to the wests anti China narrative is a paid propagandist.

    Is that all you have? You cannot argue based on the merits of this article so you can only try to dismiss valid arguments.

  88. Nick J says:
    @Old and Grumpy

    Fonterra still doing a roaring trade, seems money trumps standards as always. Bad business in my book though.

    In my mind large single product trade is a vulnerability, diversity is far safer. China is a big enough market for this.

  89. Ram says:
    @Whitewolf

    I don’t know about the Party members who remain in the West after visiting it, but what is known is that 120 million Chinese citizens would go on holiday outside of their country and what’s more, return, annually.There must must be something there that is attractive to them that yet, is not visible to us.

  90. Nick J says:
    @Astuteobservor II

    Fun times, let’s see who has the cheapest hole in the ground.

  91. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @MLK

    Dunno about Lenin, but Mr Pattberg, if he grew his hair out a just a little, and groomed it less, looks straight out of that History Channel series “Vikings”.

    Like his ancestors were late comers to Central Europe, only coming in with the raiders, or maybe even from Christian Medieval Scandinavia.

  92. @Curmudgeon

    Most of it is total fabrication. Gordon Chang preaches China‘s collapse since 2001. Is on the news every year! Pei Minxin is so woke now, he identifies as white Jewish American who hates the Chinese so hard, he gets tens of thousands of dollars worth free airtime to promote his books.

  93. @Tor597

    Totale agree. Sadly, China cannot defend itself outside its own territory and has no allies. Therefore, it will not start this war. It all now depends on the US: Provoke a war or not?

  94. Alfred says:
    @anon

    since the Indian MSM often has an anti-BJP, anti-Hindu, anti-nationalist, pro-Marxist bias, pro-Congress,… bias

    Tell us of a single border incident or unnecessary war by India that the MSM did not wholeheartedly support.

    Here is the latest piece of nonsense to support the government’s lies. Instead of telling the public that the Indian army was recently thrashed and several hundred soldiers were killed by the Chinese, we have this fake nationalistic drivel.

    BTW, the soldiers on the left of this picture appear to be Gurkkas (Nepalese mercenaries) – not Indian soldiers.

    Before foiling Chinese moves, India worked on plan for almost a month

  95. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Supply and Demand

    So (not in so many words), you tell these Western “experts” (aka posers) to f*ck the hell off?

    WELL DONE!

    That’s all they deserve.

  96. @Whitewolf

    You need to read up on the Chinese activities in Latin America regarding mining.

    • Replies: @Alfred
  97. anonymous[331] • Disclaimer says:

    interesting article.

    however, no mention of the china daily(read c.c.p.) paying the nytimes to include an insert every wednesday for the last three years in the physical edition of the paper.

    playing both sides maybe?

  98. Miro23 says:
    @Zarathustra

    Maybe we should check. Carbon dating of Lucy’s skeleton established 9thousand years.
    So if Chinese already planted rice 8 thousand years ago the civilization in China is older than Africans.

    Lucy’s skeleton was a lot older, but she wasn’t a modern human.

    Lucy, a 3.2 million-year old fossil skeleton of a human ancestor, was discovered in 1974 in Hadar, Ethiopia. The fossil locality at Hadar where the pieces of Lucy’s skeleton were discovered is known to scientists as Afar Locality 288 (A.L. 288).
    https://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledge/library/lucy-a-marvelous-specimen-135716086/#:~:text=Lucy%2C%20a%203.2%20million%2Dyear,in%201974%20in%20Hadar%2C%20Ethiopia.&text=The%20fossil%20locality%20at%20Hadar,288).

  99. @denk

    Those who are squatting on the biggest land grab in human history…USA, Canada, Oz, NZ, Hawaii, GUam, Falklands, Diego Garcia,

    While I appreciate the land grab sentiment, the reality is that we know virtually nothing about the ancient and pre-historical migrations.
    In the US, there are “native American” oral history stories of giants who were living on the land. They were all killed, because the giants bit off the heads of the “native Americans”, and drank their blood. Skeletons of giants have been found in the US. Does that mean the “native Americans” participated in a land grabÉ
    In Canada (and the US) the Huron-Wyandot tribe claims their ancestors come from the East, not the West. DNA tests on pre-contact remains shows ancient European DNA. The Miꞌgmaq are the only known “native American” tribe with a written language. Their oral history says it was given to them by ancient visitors. I can tell you that the “Indians” on the west coast don`t look like plains “Indians” and that neither look like the Miꞌgmaq.
    In New Zealand, the Moaris, who arrived approximately 800 years ago, admit there were people living there when they arrived. They were people with blond and red hair. The Maoris conquered them and intermarried the women not killed. Obviously a land grab. A few years ago, one of the red haired Maoris submitted DNA for analysis. It was determined that the origins were from what is now Southern Iran and through South America.
    The “Cloud people” of the Andes were blond, and lived in stone villages resembling 3rd century Celtic dwellings.
    The Falklands were never inhabited. The dispute is over which “invader” has rights.
    The Bantus expanded from West Africa to the East and South, slaughtering and displacing millions, on their way to what is South Africa today.
    My point is, that land grabs have always taken place. Apparently, they are only bad when done by Whites.

    • Replies: @denk
    , @Tony Hall
  100. Ron Unz says:
    @Tor597

    The white nationalist parts of the west are the most hostile and racist to China. They may hate neoliberalism because it causes immigration, but they definitely don’t want to leave China alone.

    It is only a very small minority of white nationalists who don’t worship Trump or even know what neoliberalism or neoconservative is.

    The huge majority of white nationalists love Trump and echo his hostility towards China. Look at how Trump politicized the “China Virus”. It is almost always white nationalists who use this line.

    I don’t think that’s correct, or at best only very partially so…

    I’d say most of the harder-core WNs are generally friendly towards China, perhaps even friendlier towards China than towards Trump. That would include the Daily Stormer people and Eric Striker’s circle. On the other hand, the softer-core WNs or quasi-WNs like VDare or John Derbyshire are pretty hostile towards China, but that’s probably due to the opinions of their donors, many of whom may be elderly rightwingers. Plus I’m sure that the anti-China Trump people are spreading around lots of money this close to the election. Many WNs are in the middle, or at least conflicted.

    And only a sliver of Trump supporters would consider themselves WNs, with a large majority being ferociously anti-WN. Didn’t Trump’s son say that he’d love to see David Duke get a bullet in the head? The rank-and-file Trump people are probably the same as the FoxNews crowd, perhaps somewhat “implicitly” WN-ish, but certainly not explicitly so.

    Meanwhile, I think very few WNs are enthusiastically supporting Trump, although many of them are now strongly favoring Trump over Biden because of all the BLM rioting. Frankly, if the Democrats had nominated Sanders, I’d suspect that a good fraction of the hard-core WNs would be supporting him over Trump.

  101. Thim says:

    Americans have no beef with China, except the stuff they send over here is junk. We need to cut it off.

    Beyond that I do not think most Americans have any beef with China. No one cares about Tibet or even Hong Kong.

    The Deep State, a couple million people, the 1%, they have a beef with Xi. They had a replacement for him but Xi had him arrested before the color revolution could get traction. The son was rescued by the CIA at, I believe it was Harvard.

    As for all the media, just say CIA, it is CIA, all of it. The CIA has a beef with Xi. The American people’s beef is with the Deep State.

    We should be able to exist peacefully together, if we can dismantle the CIA.

  102. denk says:
    @Nick J

    Yet they demand our political loyalty against China

    Here lies the difference….

    China is about friendship and trade, they dont care who are your buddies ,..you dont need to choose side.

    With USA, there’s no middle ground.
    Your’r either with us, or against us.

    Mdm HIllary enforcer Clinton demand
    a common front from the family.

    https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2018/05/14/clin-m14.html

  103. denk says:
    @Curmudgeon

    YOu miss the point.

    Anglos grabbed the most land on the planet, yet they’r the most vociferous on Chinese sovereignty in Tibet, Xinjiang etc etc.

    They say USA is no longer white and it shows.

    murikkans no longer adhere to the whitey etho,
    [1] Those who live in glass house,…
    [2] Charity starts at home,

    Those two were the very first English proverbs when I started learning the language

  104. MyaTold says:

    Great piece! I follow the China experts closely in Hong Kong since the 2000s. Nothing has changed. They used HK as an outpost to subvert and destabilize the mainland. No exception. Constant China-bashing. Also: the creativity of it! I loved how the Guardian and the New York Times fabricated that Jewish messiah kid „Joshua“ who would lead the chosen people of Hong Kong into the promise land – the UK, 300,000 are eligible for UK passport. That was genius! Joshua!

  105. MyaTold says:

    What’s happening? I tried just now to share this article link on my Facebook group, and it says this link is prohibited. 🤬 On social media they won’t let us criticize the legacy media any more.

  106. Anon[258] • Disclaimer says:
    @anon

    since the Indian MSM often has an anti-BJP, anti-Hindu, anti-nationalist, pro-Marxist bias, pro-Congress,… bias).

    Another RSS BJP propaganda.

    Plain simple lie

    Facebook What’s App are also victims of RSS ‘s policing and manipulation .

    It’s so bad that even pro India and anti Chinese NYTimes have to get involved and this ending up exposing the systematic levers of controls BJP have placed on the publication expression printing of any news related to corruption , economic situation , violence against Muslim and NE Indian , nepotism of party officials and theft by the donor class out of Gujarat .

    Try your craps in the RSS ‘s monthly issued pamphlet or on its websites .

    • Agree: Alfred
    • Replies: @anon
  107. Alfred says:
    @Astuteobservor II

    You need to read up on the Chinese activities in Latin America regarding mining

    And you need to read up about US activities in Bolivia regarding mining and much else. I mean, they could not possibly allow that country to keep its lithium deposits.

    Of course, they forced Morales to flee. Just like Ukraine’s previous president Lukashenko.

    It is precisely the success of the president Evo Morales’ economic model which makes Bolivia such an attractive target for regime-change and neo-liberal economic looting.

    “Exporting Democracy” to Bolivia

    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  108. KA says:
    @Ron Unz

    Interesting . Someone should tease the complexities of WN apart and offer some unbiased account of them .

  109. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Jiminy

    I think the attacks on China won’t cease until every part of the economy is freely opened up to the west. Until that happens, I suspect the China bashing to continue unabated.

    No mate, the China bashing won’t stop until people of Chinese ethnicity cease to exist. It’s the unfortunate truth of it.

    The Chinese won’t be left at peace to live their own lives in their own land, nor to have legitimate mutually-consenting relations with any other culture, anywhere in the world.

    Yes, a frankly physically impossible task these Chinese-haters (I did not say China-haters, I meant Chinese-haters, for they hate the race, not just the country) have set for themselves.

    Oh well, let’s leave them be. Best ignored, really.

  110. @Alfred

    I don’t understand the point of your comment. It makes no sense for the comment chain you just replied to.

    • Replies: @Ernest Judd
  111. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thim

    The Deep State, a couple million people, the 1%, they have a beef with Xi. They had a replacement for him but Xi had him arrested before the color revolution could get traction. The son was rescued by the CIA at, I believe it was Harvard.

    You might be talking about Bo Xilai. He was purged at about the same time the CIA intelligence network in China was destroyed, most of its Chinese assets executed, and the Americans all outed and forced to leave (restrained of China not to arrest the Americans for espionage). This was pre-Cold War 2.0.

    If something like that happened today, you can bet American spies would end up with VERY long prison sentences.

  112. @Thim

    Lol, where did you pull the 2 million strong deep state number from?

  113. The fact is that US is continuously more and more dependent for industrial goods on China.
    To be dependent on another nation is not good.
    The result is that in nation who is dependent (like in this case US) the technical and and technological development is curtailed, and eventually stops. While the country on which it depends grows in wealth and progress, while the dependent country become more and more reliant on agriculture.
    That is now more and more apparent happening to US.
    There is no doubt about it that US is agricultural powerhouse, but the problem is that people in cities have no jobs, and cities have diminishing income.

  114. I have noticed a commonality amoung the Sino-philes which is that they are as vociferous in their demonization of anyone who criticizes absolutely anything that China does as the Zionists are, and revert to pointing fingers back at America on the false dichotomy that one must choose to defend the actions of the Chinese government or defend the actions of the United States government, or perhaps even the E.U. 

    The fact that the Sino-philes have no other constructive argument is because many of the actions that people often criticize the Chinese government for are as equally indefensible as actions taken by the United States government.

    A battle of hearts and minds cannot be won on those terms.

    There is a false assumption that anyone that criticizes the Chinese government is attempting to force U.S. policy or Western policy on individuals or nations. 

    This is obviously the information strategy pushed forth by people like George Soros or maybe members within the Chinese Communist Party. These are tactics of evasion and it only draws even more attention to the problems that they are attempting to conceal, and makes China appear even more calculating and suspicious with hidden motives.
    We do happen to be talking about a government, and not a country, for clarification purposes. Why is it that you trust the Chinese government? I have yet to hear a valid reason based on facts rather than some ethereal and vague ideology in direct contradiction to the present and past situations.

    Andrea Iravani

    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  115. Anonymous[408] • Disclaimer says:
    @Brás Cubas

    “But no-one controls these Western imperialists.”
    I think “no-one controls” is more along the line of “no-one restrains”. In the sense that they are letting the hunting dogs run free because it is in their interest for them to run free.

    • Replies: @Brás Cubas
  116. It used to be that the China experts from the BBC, Guardian, and New York Times couldn’t speak Mandarin at all. They went straight to Tibet, Xinjiang, Taiwan, Hong Kong and met potential dissidents who were willing to harm China in exchange for flights and visa to US/UK. It’s very dirty business, I think.

    • Agree: Tor597
  117. @Whitewolf

    I read numbers that say 80 million CCP members. Most are very loyal. Since their early youth or from university. Also, they all have basic Military training and can be drafted.

    • Replies: @Haruto Rat
  118. @Astuteobservor II

    If the West doesn’t get primacy of Bolivia’s resources: there will be war;
    If China gets primacy of Bolivia’s resources: there will be trade.

    • Thanks: Alfred
    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  119. @No Friend Of The Devil

    While your comment contained jack all but a criticism of “sinophiles”. I must admit it is very slick. A criticism without including any tangible point.

    Want to try to refute the points in the article?

    All the author did was calling out the so called experts.

    Your move.

  120. Tor597 says:
    @Thorsten is a Twat

    Ridiculous propaganda.

    White Nationals hate China only after the Jews. There are only a small handful of white nationals who are not hostile to China.

  121. Tor597 says:
    @Thorsten is a Twat

    Of course I think WN would fall for the propaganda. These are the same people who use China Virus and CCP for everything.

    While there may be individuals who admire China for nationalist interests there are only a handful of people.

  122. @Thorsten J. Pattberg

    CPSU topped at around 19.5 million members in 1989. Those numbers didn’t help much.

    Maybe Chinese have learned something from the Soviet mistakes, I don’t know.

    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  123. @Anonymous

    Possibly. Sorry about that. And thanks.

  124. Tony Hall says:
    @Curmudgeon

    My point is, that land grabs have always taken place. Apparently, they are only bad when done by Whites.

    Yes, land grabs run deep and far in the overall matrix of human affairs. The scale of the land grabs by European-dominated movements of people, however, is so vast and many-faceted that this process tends to form a unique phenomenon when viewed as a territorial totality. Moreover, the land grabs tend to be very recent and ongoing as is the case, for instance, in northern Canada even as we speak. Here in Alberta Canada the influx of European peoples followed by influxes of other kinds of people is pretty much a twentieth-century phenomenon.

    One of the indicators to me about the flakey and mercenary quality of the cynical co-opting of the Black Lives Matter by the Democratic Party/Wall Street/Deep State complex, is that there has been no credible engagement by the “peaceful protestors” with the historic and ongoing marginalization of the Indigenous peoples.

    https://www.unz.com/article/protest-riot-loot-and-burn-for-black-freedom-in-america/

    The destruction of a few Columbus statues does not a genuine reckoning make with the genocidal inheritances of the Columbian conquests. I wouldn’t mind seeing a discussion of alternatives to the name of the District of Columbia. Are the folks at Columbia University thinking about a name change? British Columbia? Now there’s a double imperial wammy!

    • Replies: @Bombercommand
    , @Curmudgeon
  125. @Exile

    I don’t agree with every idea that falls under the broad “white nationalist” brand, but I absolutely agree with this one.

    You’d think that a widespread liberal contempt for ‘colonialism’ would make people more sensitive to the coercion of culture and tradition, especially since most of them reflexively blame The West for countless atrocities and indignities in the course of inflicting its ‘righteous’ influence on other peoples.

    Their vision of multiculturalism is a horror of forced integration and assimilation. They cannot understand that there could be any kind of virtue in an exclusive and traditional culture; they cause misery in the name of eliminating conflict, rather than allowing true difference and self-segregation, and dealing pragmatically with the inevitable conflicts as they arise.

    Real ‘multiculturalism’ is in fact probably as wonderful as they like to believe… but the very thing that makes it so is the borders and boundaries that keep culture developing naturally by people of shared and unique traditions. This simply cannot happen with a global mandate to infect or conquer everything that doesn’t conform to whatever our currently prevailing ideas of righteousness may be.

  126. @Tor597

    Most White nationalists do not really concern themselves with geopolitics and care only about their own nation first. In America there is a strain of paleoconservative within the White nationalist movement which promotes non-interventionist foreign policy and trade protectionism. The hostility towards China is mostly a byproduct of the Western oligarchs and their decision to send jobs to China, White nationalists do not hate Chinese in their own country, China. The antagonism is there, but it is not based on anything deeper than the conditions our elites have imposed upon our nations. Most people in the world are decent and don’t hate others for racial characteristics as long as there is ethnic self-determination, which Whites do not have.

    Even within the West, East Asian immigrants are not really on the radar for most White nationalists. Look at organisations like American Renaissance, their concerns mostly lie with blacks and “browns”, in fact Jared Taylor seems to think highly of East Asians (Taylor was born in Japan himself).

    “Thorsten is a Twat”‘ and his assessment is absolutely correct, you are conflating neoconservative hawks (who are capitalising on the rise of anti-China sentiments in the wake of the coronavirus outbreak, much like they capitalised on the growth anti-Islam sentiments after 9/11) with White nationalists, who hate that their people are being sent out into foreign entanglements at the behest of vested interests and foreign powers.

    Also, I would like to see you explain what you mean by “hostile”, this is a subjective word, “hostile” could mean hating China with a passion according to some, while it could simply mean not liking China enough according to others.

    • Replies: @Tor597
  127. @frankie p

    looking at the promotional system shows that CCP leaders who reach the top work methodically through a long stream of lower then incrementally higher positions, succeeding and bringing benefit to the people in the areas that they serve for decades before they reach higher positions.

    That’s how it was supposed to work in the USSR. However, the fact that trash like Gorby or Yeltsin rose to the top shows that it did not. I hope Chinese learned from Soviet mistakes and won’t let greedy globohomo ruin their country.

  128. @Tony Hall

    Great idea Tony!!! Instead of Washington DC, how about District of Traditional First Nations’ Torture Party and Cannibal BBQ? A bit long, I admit, but it has the virtue of historical accuracy, and that is what you are after, right?

  129. @Ghali

    if one replaces China with Iran and Chinese with Iranian, the article equally applies to Iran.

    In fact, it equally applies to self-proclaimed Russian “experts”, Cuban “experts”, Venezuelan “experts”, etc. In each case clues policies are based on clueless “expertise”.

    • Replies: @AnonFromTN
  130. theMann says:
    @Nick J

    Wrong, and indeed, wildly wrong, on every level.

    1. Milton Friedman once said “short of bombing, rent control is the surest way of destroying a city’s housing stock” or word to that effect. Well theMann’s corollary “short of thermonuclear obliteration, Free Trade is the surest way to destroy a country’s Economy.” It is, as H Ross Perot quite rightly pointed out, the “giant sucking sound” of first Labor, and then Capital, leaving your country forever. The only means known to work for building a Nation’s wealth is internal freedom, and external tariffs. High Tariffs.Feel free to argue that fact, along with all the other morons, deliberate destroyers, and servants of international finance, who want to enrich the financial class and impoverish everyone else.

    2. Pointless to “Learn” Chinese, or any other Asian language, if you don’t learn it as a child. As a rule (and aside from the Chinese being extreme Racist bigots of the worst sort) Asians never hear their language(s) spoken badly, or by a non-native, and have zero ability to cope with understanding their language spoken less than fluently. English and Spanish speakers, on the other hand, spend their entire lives dealing with their language spoken badly, neither group even blinks, and always copes. If you are a native English speaker, learn French and Spanish, which is at least doable, and speaking that trio of languages will serve you well in any business environment.

    3. China’s past is China’s future. Somehow, some day, some where, there will be another EXTREME irruption of Xenophobia in China, slaughtering foreigners, and destroying Capital. You don’t want to be caught in it. BTW, Taipang, Boxer, Great Leap Forward….they are overdue, and it will be ugly when it happens. Not to mention, China’s neighbors don’t just dislike the Children of the Han, they LOATHE them. Virulently.

    4. Shove it with “international Trade”. Working there is just being a tool for the Financial Class. Maybe a well paid tool, but a tool. The fact remains that most, maybe a huge most, like 90%, of wealthy people got there by creating a business that really met a need, blossoming into more businesses, and so on…..

  131. @Ron Unz

    This seems pretty off-base to me. I’d say the majority of commenters on Unz Review are WNs or have WN leanings. In fact, it probably has one of the largest gatherings of WNs on the entire Internet. So, it’s pretty easy to gauge their views on China just from looking at the comments on this website. And the main splitting point in their views on China seems to be IQ level.

    The low-IQ WNs (the vast majority) tend to be rabidly anti-China. The high-IQ WNs (the minority) tend to have more nuanced views.

    • Agree: Tor597, GreatSocialist
  132. 5-Eyes does London. And London only

    Fortunately, Russia and China are building new [in]roads into a world I want to live in.

  133. Tor597 says:
    @Ron Unz

    I agree with Eric Striker but I think he is an exception.

    If you sample regular rank and file WN, you will see most are positively hateful towards China even if they will agree that they are doing several things correct.

    • Replies: @utu
  134. @AnonFromTN

    Sorry for the typo. I meant clueless policies are based on clueless expertise.

  135. @Ghan-buri-Ghan

    The low-IQ WNs (the vast majority) tend to be rabidly anti-China. The high-IQ WNs (the minority) tend to have more nuanced views.

    There is nothing specifically applicable to China in it. Low IQ people tend to be rabid in their views on everything, whereas higher IQ people are usually more nuanced.

  136. frankie p says:
    @E_Perez

    Maybe they copied a few tracts, including the one in which state controlled banks funnel liquidity into investment in industrial capacity and infrastructure that will help the nation as a whole rather than a usurious, extractive banking syndicate.

  137. Tor597 says:
    @The Spirit of Enoch Powell

    I would say the entirety of conservatives have moved to being rabidly anti-China territory. You can see this in many places and since I am a Libertarian Conservative I see this is a lot of places I follow.

    Everything from Fox news, YouTube comments on conservative channels, Twitter comments and tweets from conservatives, country music stars, etc.

    If you go to a place like 4Chan where lots of WN exist, you can see that China is a constant source of hatred second only to Jews.

    Anecdotally, places in the south that I could walk around before in peace, I am met with a lot of hostility and racist taunts even though I am not even Chinese lol.

    You won’t ever see violence against Asians covered in Fox news, but there have been lots of racist attacks against Asians due to China Virus hysteria where even a 5 year old kid got his face slashed open.

    You seem to focus on the intellectual leaders of movements. These people may be neutral on China or even friendly, but the rank and file WN are very hostile towards China. Ditto conservatives.

    There are small groups you can carve out from this such as Libertarians, but I would not include Paleoconservatives in this group because they are a mixed bag.

  138. @Haruto Rat

    The test sample I have seen of the membership test is like an IQ test and ideological test rolled into one. It is pretty hard to get into the CCP. It comes with a lot of perks and benefits. But when a crisis happens, you are going to the front lines. Like the covid, floods, and earthquakes.

    The biggest weakness of the Chinese civil society I have observed is they tend to refer to a few top experts and stops there. That is actually a very similar problem that USA also faces. The echo chambers.

  139. @Realist

    It is the policy of half truth, half bullshit. Amerimutts have been a lost cause for at least 100 years.

  140. @trickster

    “Nazi”
    “Slant eye”
    “Tribe”
    You forgot to ask permission to use “kikes” today?
    You are very bad at your job.

    • LOL: trickster
  141. @theMann

    Lol, you seem to exemplify point 3.

    Are you sure you aren’t projecting your own personal hatred?

  142. @trickster

    What incendieary statements!
    I’m sure that you even have a choice in choosing where your most basic wares come from, LOL

    This kind of insane, unhinged, deranged amerimutts are the reasons why the Chinks have been buying up their country too.

    Look at how stupid this dumb mutt is. You really need to change chink to hun and you get how easily the kikes herded these low IQ mulattoes into the world wars.

    • Replies: @trickster
  143. Chinaman says:

    Let me get this straight

    Descendants of Nazis chastising the Chinaman for concentration camps ?
    Ex-Slave owners and genocidal psychos lecturing us on human rights?
    Barbaric crusaders who have raped and killed millions of Arab Muslims now fighting for the freedom of the Uighur Muslims?

    How long do we need to suffer this unbearable hypocrisy! Oh, Please spare me the sanctimony and these rituals of dehumanising the enemy. Let’s just get on with WW3!

    Unfortunately, the West made made a gave mistake by tipping its hand. The trade war, Hong Kong riots and the pandemic ( What are the chances these once in a century events happened in a sequence!) was the best things that could have ever happened for the Chinese people since it have awakened every Chinaman from their slumber and made 1.4 billion people -race realists -overnight. This racial awakening is the impetus that is needed to unite 1.4 billion people for the renaissance of the Chinese race.

    The end of history will come when there is a only single race on earth. This Darwinian struggle is inevitable and ingrained in our evolutionary history. This is our destiny. We are all here to witness the beginning of the end…the final clash of civilisations in all human history!

    China vs West.

    We are not like the Mayans, the Australian Aboriginals or the Neanderthal…it won’t be easy and we won’t go down without a good fight.

    Bring it on!

    • Agree: HeebHunter
    • Replies: @Biff
    , @Suicidal_canadian
  144. Biff says:
    @Chinaman

    Let’s put some LSD in the punch bowl for this party!

  145. @Tor597

    “The west hates China because it sees it self at the top of a caste system and it is afraid that China will displace them.”

    I have a similar view.

    In order to gain complete control over the U.S. and Western European governments, the jewish collective basically had to trash their respective societies (satanists rise to the top not by their own merits but by bringing everyone else down).

    The problem with this strategy – if the goal is complete world domination and control – is that it has to be applied EVERYWHERE ON EARTH AT APPROXIMATELY THE SAME TIME or it will ultimately fail, because a jew-controlled society is a doomed society.

    Unfortunately for the satanists, China got away from them. So while the corrupt “West” crumbles as it must, an intelligent, industrious and independent China rises, thereby becoming the latest enemy du jour. And the China-must-be-destroyed hysteria has now reached a fever pitch thus we see loyal servant orange clown furiously bitch-slapping China on an almost daily basis accordingly.

    • Replies: @Daemon
  146. @trickster

    Heh! Great rant there about the “experts”, Trickster. I don’t agree with you 100% on that last part with its short history on China’s progress, but that doesn’t change the fact that this was a great, well-written rant. Regarding:

    Day by day more and more of them flee their 4000 year old civilization to come to our 250 year old civilization. They have abandonned their vaunted Confucian education system to study in the good old USA so they can return to Hong Dong, Guandong or Short Dong with a certificate to impress their fellow villagers.

    You do wonder why we have so many “visiting scholars”, many with a ride paid for partly by the CCP that stay extra long, are still here when people are studying remotely anyway (don’t they got the internet over there yet?), and keep looking for work visas and other ways to stay permanently.

    Hell, we know a lady who was a visiting scholar from China … in ENGLISH. WTF?? Oh, here’s the funny part: Her daughter came to visit over Spring Break, got kept out of China due to the Kung Flu over there, then they both skedddled back to China the long way (via NYC-Paris-Shanghai-2-week quaranteen) for $5,000 each, coach seats, in order to escape the US for fear of the Kung Flu here!! I LOL every time I think about this one. Suckers! Where’s that high-IQ when you need it?

    Something like 1,000 people at the University, almost all of them students, have cases of the Kung Flu. # of hospitalizations?

    .

    .

    Wait for it…

    .
    .
    ZERO!

    • Replies: @denk
  147. @Ghan-buri-Ghan

    Did you ever think of how many different commenters, under how many widely different viewed writers, write about how many different things? Do you have some amazing memory in which you know which of all the commenters said what? The WN’s only write on certain threads, and I’d say most of those threads are ones in which the subject of China hardly ever comes up.

    Sure, the WNs argue now and then over whether the Orientals have IQ’s somewhat higher, or whether to admit it anyway, but what the hell does that have to do with the actual price of tea in China? That’s not political. If anything, it’s usually about keeping Chinese people from moving here en masse just like any other group en masse. It’s a bad freakin’ idea. That doesn’t call for a war, or even bad relations.

  148. @Ron Unz

    Yes, very fair answer there, Mr. Unz. “Thornsten is a twat” (haha!) has been right all along, and Mr. Tor from China ought to just argue his main points that are pro-China.

  149. utu says:
    @Tor597

    The dividing line within the so-called WN on Unz Review is very simple.

    The racists who are genuine or tactical philo-Semites hang around Derbyshire and Sailer and they are more likely to be anti-China. They will not swallow what comes from Walter Duranty’s of China like Godfree Roberts. And if they do they see it as a warning and a threat from China. They are my-country-right-or-wrong kind of American patriots. This group is preyed on by Jewish neocons and all kinds of Jewish apologists whom the group assimilates.

    The conspiratorialists are overwhelmingly anti-Semitic and they hang around American Pravda and other revisionists articles. They are more likely to be pro-China as well as pro-Russia. So they are receptive to Walter Duranty’s of China like Thorsten Pattberg. Their hate for Jews and fear of Jewish threat is greater than their love for America so they are willing to side with the enemies of America. This group is preyed on by Chinese and Russian trolls and influencers whom the group assimilates.

    These are the two main rings in Ron Unz’s circus. Ron Unz keeps few animals and clowns who do not belong to either of the two rings.

    • Thanks: true.enough
    • Replies: @denk
    , @true.enough
  150. denk says:
    @Tor597

    If you want to say that China should not have Tibet, HK, and Taiwan then fine. But why just bring up Hawaii? By that same logic America should also be forced to give up the American west and Alasks if not the entire continent

    If [[[they]]] want Hans outta Tibet, why not anglos outta US, Canada, Oz, NZ etc etc…….?

    Thats the logical conclusion of course.

    But murkkans are the exceptional ones,
    Do as we say, not what we do.

    Hence the land grabbing carry on even today,
    while they keep dishing out sermons to the world etc.

    https://web.archive.org/web/20060519070429/http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200605/200605040021.html

  151. They always reside in the West, know little or nothing about China, and discuss China solely on Western terms. In the past there were the likes of Kant, Hegel, and Wilhelm II; today we have Henry “on China” Kissinger, Francis “End of History” Fukuyama, and Samuel “Clash of Civilizations” Huntington.

    Henry Kissinger is the real McCoy! He was the mastermind of China’s One-child Policy.

    Presidents and Prime Ministers come and go, but Henry Kissinger never dies.

  152. The world power truly facing its “endgame” is the United States. Domination by the ever-more-radical and ever-more-insane Democrat Party will mean the end. An escalation of the cold conflict between the Democrat Party and the relatively sane parcel of the population will also mean the end. Thanks to demographic change engineered by the Democrat Party and not resisted by Republicans or anyone else, the Democrat Party is certain to become dominant barring civil war or other form of disintegration. China was around long before the United States; it will be around long after.

  153. denk says:
    @utu

    Thorsten Pattberg. Their hate for Jews and fear of Jewish threat is greater than their love for America so they are willing to side with the enemies of America.

    I’ve lost count of murikkans who call China an ‘enemy’, even ‘no 1 enemy’, ‘existential threat’, but when I ask them to cite one reason, all slithered away with tail between legs.
    [yet that doesnt stop them slithering back in another thread, repeating exactly the same canard tho.]

    Would you be the first murikkan who tell me,
    ‘Why’s China your enemy’ ?

    • Replies: @Anon
  154. Yevardian says:
    @Ron Unz

    Since so many people here appear stunningly ignorant on this entire topic, I will put out a quick summary from someone essentially of that bent, though I don’t use that label as ‘white’ is very American term with all kinds of ideological baggage.

    I would say the vast majority of ‘serious’ WNs are pro-China for the reason that they’re indifferent to international affairs as far as they don’t affect domestic politics, with the obvious single-issue of demographics. Isolationist views are practically synonymous with WN, as America’s wars, economic imperialism and foreign-destabilisation efforts have had the primary effect of a mass-influx of Muslim refugees into Europe. Now with years long stirring up of rioting and mass-unrest in Hong Kong, another wave of now ‘political’ refugees looks to be likely soon streaming into Australia and the US. Of course, those falsely dubbed as WNs such as Steve Bannon will be cheering such disastrous developments (from the perspective of anyone concerned with ‘white’ demographics).
    Going back further, the legacy of the colonial Empires of Western Europe have had the same extremely negative effect with regard to home demographics, most strikingly in Britain and France.

    ‘White Supremacism’ in the sense of a movement wishing for the restoration of Ethnic-European control and domination over the entire world practically does not exist. There’s a strong recognition that the capability for such things is long gong, though I doubt almost anyone in the ‘movement’ harbours such petty dreams anyway, along with more obvious reasons detailed below.
    WNs do not ‘hate’ other ethnicities so much as they want nothing to do with them and don’t wish interact with them or be subject to the dysfunctions and problems of the less capable/advanced of them in their daily lives.
    China’s rise poses nothing negative to anyone in WN crowd, as far as the CCP’s stunning success in raising the living standards of near 1-billion of it’s citizens is concerned, this is only a positive development, as it naturally means far few of them will have any interest in emigrating to the West for better standards of living. The same goes for Africa, India or anywhere else in the world.

    • Replies: @Tor597
  155. Thomasina says:
    @Michael888

    The “888” in your name gives you away.

    Our elite gave away the farm. Imagine being given all the technology you ever wanted, handed to you on a silver platter. All the years and years of hard-won expertise and know-how simply given away so the Chinese and Western elites could line their own pockets. The Chinese elites jumped in bed with the Western elites; both sides are enjoying their silk sheets. The West lost their jobs, and the Chinese got choked.

    Kind of like a hooker who gets taken in by some rich guy who showers her with jewelry, fine clothes, cars, a beautiful apartment. Of course, the relationship goes along fine as long as she holds up her end of the bargain. But if she begins branching out on her own, stops readily putting out, wants to develop herself, the trouble begins. That wasn’t part of the bargain.

    Did she really think she was going to get something for nothing?

    Had she taken the time to develop herself, she would never have hooked up with someone like that, but then that takes time and hard work. So much easier to get it given to you.

    “Thank you for all the technology. Now we’re going to use it against you. And thank you for opening up your country to our exports, even though we’re not about to do the same for you. And thanks for allowing our corrupt Chinese elite to secure citizenship in your countries (a safe harbor to flee to, just in case). And thanks for looking the other way as we bought up western properties using cheap liquidity (or laundered money) provided by the Chinese government (sorry, you can’t buy our property). Thanks also for educating our children in your western schools, and then allowing us to pretend we make no overseas income, greatly reducing our taxes owing. Thanks for everything.”

    China wants it both ways!

    Now they want to act all meek and humble and say, “What? All we want to do is develop a little silk road.”

    Western elite, Chinese elite, it makes no difference. They’re all scum. If the Chinese become the new world leader, they won’t be any different. They’ll be just as power-hungry as the western elites are.

    Remember when the western elites used to just be into trade? No bombing? China will follow the same route if given the chance. They are no different; just a shark of a different color.

    • Replies: @Anonymous
    , @Harold Smith
  156. @utu

    Their hate for Jews and fear of Jewish threat is greater than their love for America so they are willing to side with the enemies of America. This group is preyed on by Chinese and Russian trolls and influencers whom the group assimilates.

    There never seems to be a shortage of Useful Idiots. So incredibly naive, like a fool buying a knockoff product from the smiling con artist in Chinatown.

    Chinese National Intelligence Law (2017) states clearly that “all organizations and citizens shall, according to the law, provide support and assistance to and co­ operate with the State intelligence work, and keep secret the State intelligence work that they know”.

    Hmmm. All Chinese citizens required by law to provide support, assist and cooperate with State intel work.

    But it’s racist for patriots to act on that?

    A jew! Gesundheit.

  157. @Astute Observer II,

    Astute Observer II,

    Supporting the Chinese  government is a tangible point as well as a critical, fandamental, and valid question.

    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
  158. @trickster

    I think there are many more Indian CEOs of large US companies. I would even expect a Chinese company like TikTok in the USA to have a Yank CEO. [email protected]

  159. Daemon says:
    @Harold Smith

    That’s what I’ve noticed as well. Jews are well adept at politicking and maneuvering themselves into positions of power. But what they do once they get there leaves much to be desired.
    They may rule, but they do not know how to govern.

    • Replies: @Harold Smith
  160. @Chinaman

    It is hard to take seriously your whining about racism when half of your comments are racisg remarks about the white man.

    • Replies: @trickster
  161. anon[258] • Disclaimer says:
    @theMann

    Milton Friedman was a neocon in a financial sense . ‘ This would happen if you didn’t do this ‘ then getting his 3 rd personal choice delivered .
    That was also a great trademark slogan of the neoconservative after 911.

    Why is the rent outpacing inflation ? Why 40% of income has to be spent on rent ?
    Why affordability of home ownership has decreased in metro areas ?
    How the Friedman’s policy has given rise to zero interest situation ? What has been his lasting role in the bank realizing bonanza year after year at the cost of the other segments of economy ?

  162. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Thomasina

    Kind of like a hooker who gets taken in by some rich guy who showers her with jewelry, fine clothes, cars, a beautiful apartment. Of course, the relationship goes along fine as long as she holds up her end of the bargain. But if she begins branching out on her own, stops readily putting out, wants to develop herself, the trouble begins. That wasn’t part of the bargain.

    Did she really think she was going to get something for nothing?

    Had she taken the time to develop herself, she would never have hooked up with someone like that, but then that takes time and hard work. So much easier to get it given to you.

    Cool story. And nice try, but it’s complete inaccurate bu**sh*t. Sounds good, but let’s dig deeper.

    Let’s continue that analogy of yours about the hooker and the rich guy. Exactly who was taking advantage of whom, again? Weren’t they using each other?

    [MORE]

    See, the rich guy, he was actually a sexual deviant-pervert. Yup, what he really wanted to do was have a lot of sex, and his wife, he thought, was going to give it to him any time, any where, on demand. But she had begun to be burdened by it all. It was just too much.

    The wife started demanding better living conditions. Before, she had been content to have a place to stay and food on the table. Now, she wanted to be more reasonable with the sex, to be given a nicer car, to have some vacation time, to bring the kids to better doctors and send them to nice schools.

    She’d still give him what he wanted, but the rich man would have to give something too. The rich deviant-pervert would have to treat her as a human being. And he didn’t want to..

    Then the rich man, wanting everything for nothing, found a pretty hooker who would give him what he wanted. All the sex, any time, for less money than he would have to spend on his wife and kids.

    So they made a deal: The hooker would put out (though she knew she was working for cheap), and the man would pay, and pay less than having to give gifts to his wife (though he knew he wasn’t actually loved, he was delighted at the deal he’d gotten). Simple deal, both people were satisfied.

    The man neglected the upkeep on his own house, which started to fall apart. He also neglected his own wife, and his kids, as he spent money that could have gone to their health and education, on his sweet deal with the hooker.

    But that wasn’t on the hooker, that was on the rich guy.

    Meanwhile, the hooker actually had a brain, and the capacity for discipline and hard work. She took care of her own little kids, giving them the best food, healthcare and schooling. She set a good example for them. The kids too studied diligently, got good grades, and were raised right. The hooker had started her own, successful business too, and was starting to make money on her own.

    She got her high school diploma (she was underage, just like the rich guy preferred), and then went on to complete her college studies, with honors in a tough major, no less. She scrimped, she saved, she lived very frugally. All the gifts given her, she sold for cash, keeping no trinkets, clothes, or jewelry for herself.

    Years later, the rich guy had gotten PLENTY of great sex, and he’d personally gotten MORE than his money’s worth. He had gorged himself, and then gorged himself some more. He was very satisfied. He’d neglected his own home, but he didn’t care about that. He just didn’t give a shit, just as long as he had his sexual release.

    Also years later, the hooker had become an entrepreneur, and was financially independent. Her kids had grown up, and were going, on scholarship due to good grades, to very good schools. She’d upgraded her home, too. The rich guy’s home wasn’t looking too good – lack of upkeep and sheer neglect.

    The relationship had changed. The rich guy still wanted his good sex, at very low prices. But the former hooker, used as an object for years, now wanted to stop putting out. And the rich guy is thinking “This wasn’t part of the deal! You were supposed to stay poor, dependent and stupid. You were supposed to have a body, not a brain or a soul! How dare you take care of your own kids and set them up for good lives, while I neglected mine! You are MY slut-bitch, mine to use, forever!”

    “I WAS your used and abused slut-bitch, past tense.”, said the former hooker. “I WAS”.

    _____________________________________________________________

    TL;DR – The deviant-pervert used and abused the hooker, for years. She let him; she also used him. Now the hooker is fine with what took place, but the deviant-pervert is furious, for some reason. He feels “cheated”, and it might be all in his mind.

    Rich deviant-pervert -> The business elite of the United States

    Hooker -> China

    Wife and kids of deviant-pervert -> The American workforce and middle class

    Hooker’s kids -> The Chinese workforce

    • Agree: HeebHunter
    • Replies: @Thomasina
  163. trickster says:
    @Suicidal_canadian

    Chinaman and his cohort Biff are 2 sacks of rotting shit. I visited Markham ? Unionville? north of Toronto and there is practically a Chinese city within the City. Nearly every business is Chinese, street names are in Chinese the faces are all Chinese. Going for a meal there or shopping there a non-Chinese gets the impression THEY are doing you a favour by allowing you to spend your money. All too often the denizens dont speak English !

    This comes to my bones of contention. They go on and on about their high level of intelligence but I ask what are they doing here ? If China is such a great place why come to North America. Why send your pregnant wives here to deliver their litter ? Why fabricate and execute visa, green card and permanent residence fraud to stay here ? Why pack dozens into shipping containers to be smuggled into a country “worse” than yours ? Further, I dont see the rest of the world rushing to immigrate to China, wonderful country it is supposed to be !! ??

    These slime bags, the more you give them the more they want and the racism ploy is the vehicle by which they demand more from the weak kneed politicians who having let all these miserable wretches into the country, now need their vote.

    The final joke is that they sell UNZ readers that they lived in the US and were extremely successful. One, I dont remember which stated he worked for Soros. I dont know whuch Jew is going to put his money in the hands of a Chinaman but that is the bullshit story they peddle on this site. Anyway, after making tons of “fuck you” money they retired to Hong Kong/ Taiwan/ China or some fairy tale story along those lines. I guess they would not have become affluent making 0.50 cents an hour working in an advanced and highly intelligent environment like China.

    If Chinaman and Biff are the cream of the crop then God help China. If in the land of the dumb the man with an IQ of 5 is king then these 2 clowns must be the last emperors of China.

    • Thanks: Achmed E. Newman
    • Replies: @HeebHunter
  164. Anon[293] • Disclaimer says:

    Hi, thanks for writing this. I know many of the people mentioned in the article personally as I was once a fledgling “China” hand that studied under them. I am very well acquainted with the aforementioned ecosystem of anti-China thought. If I may, a brief exposition on “China Studies” here in America:

    One needs to carefully examine the background of such China hands to really understand their motivations. Chinese in America an incredibly self-selecting group. People like Pei immigrated around the 80’s or earlier; people like Gordon Chang fled circa 1949. These are people that bet that their lives would be better here–and were wrong. It was probably hard to get out of China at that time, and many likely thought it a huge advantage. It is human nature to maintain a tenuous grasp on reality that validates past decision-making than to accept the new normal and realize you made mistakes. And of course, you have the majority of white liberals that find themselves in China mostly to get laid for the first time.

    I studied under such people because I, like many others, was genuinely curious about China. Why not learn more about a burgeoning power and an ancient civilization? It seemed exciting at the time. However, upon taking the coursework, something did not feel right. Upon making friends with native Chinese in China, I realized you’re really just being conditioned to hate China and its government. Any advancement in the field whatsoever necessitates an artificially bearish view of the world.

    To be honest, I don’t actually think many of these China hands really believe what they say. They are more motivated by a pursuit of status than by truth– to an unusual degree.

  165. trickster says:
    @HeebHunter

    Me dishes from Europe inherited and underneath “it no say make in China”. All me tools also inherited from Fadda. They make in UK 1940-1950. Expensive no cheap. They no make in China !

    When I slave in Corporate world, suits make in London, English tailor no Chinese ! Me ledda shoe, mek in Portugal, Portuguese cobbler, ledda pun ledda, stitched an nailed no cheap Chinee ting. Me bedding ? mek in Spain. Inherit from Gran Madda, 70 years old but like new. Mek by han, no cheap, no Chinee, good quality !

    Once Me buy one screwdriver at dalla store for wan dalla. It no work. End break, Me waste dalla. Me buy clothes hanga. Break. No good. Cheap. Me waste dalla.

    Me retire now. Few clothes but Chinos mek in New York, Russia taila, shut from when I use to wuk and boots mek in Ukraine (ledda sow pun ledda, soles nail to uppa). Same boots lass me 33 years. Good quality. No chinee !

    Me no buy cheap. More expensive than wen buy quality. When you buy Chinee you pay dalla, waste dalla, no good, cheep cheep ……brake too quik. You waste dalla Chinee make dalla. No good. You get poor Chinee get rich………LMAO

    • Replies: @Anonymous
  166. @Thomasina

    “Western elite, Chinese elite, it makes no difference. They’re all scum. If the Chinese become the new world leader, they won’t be any different. They’ll be just as power-hungry as the western elites are.”

    So you’re jewish?

    • Replies: @Thomasina
  167. Xi’s got a heart of gold, he’d never let me down!

    It’s pretty much a salad tossing up in here.

  168. @Daemon

    Like every other creature, they do what it’s in their nature to do, and their nature is to destroy (that’s what satanism is all about).

    “We Jews, we, the destroyers, will remain the destroyers forever. NOTHING that you will do will meet our needs and demands. We will forever destroy, because we need a world of our own, a God-world, which it is not in your nature to build.” (Samuel, Maurice. “You Gentiles.” New York: Harcourt, Brace and Company, Inc., 1924, p.155. Print).

    Here’s Dr. William Pierce’s view of the subject:

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/ea3ALH6C1K3p/

  169. @Ron Unz

    Thanks for writing this. This is an important distinction, so if I may, I’d like to expound upon who is actually “anti-China”. The Anti-China crowd fall into several camps:

    The first camp is ethnic Chinese that live outside China; I’m including Chinese-Americans, Taiwanese, and Hong Kongers all in the same group here. They left mainland China for a variety of reasons—fear of persecution; pursuit of wealth and status—but generally did so upon the premise that their lives would be better in the United States. They assumed that they would have the mandate of heaven by now, but do not and are therefore bitter.

    The second camp are globalist interests embittered by the fact that the Chinese consumer base doesn’t exist for the sake of Western capitalists. These are really just the modern day equivalent of Opium dealers that view the Chinese masses as sheep to be exploited. There’s no real ideological impetus that drives such individuals—they just hate things that get in the way of their making money.

    The third camp is the evangelizing white liberals that work for institutions like the State Department. You find many of these in Taiwan and they’re either usually homosexuals, or beta male white bottom feeders there for the poon tang. Worth noting is that such individuals embody the same pathologies of which they accuse their opponents of having. Whereas a white nationalist likely admires the cultural and racial homogeneity from which East Asian nations benefit, a white liberal believes his values are superior and that there is something morally repugnant about the rest of the world not adopting them. Hu be da supremacist now?

    The socioeconomic positioning of these seemingly disparate groups stems from a world order in which China is really just an up-and-coming America. To the extent that China exerts actual agency, their prerogative is to bring an end to the Chinese regime as fast as possible.

    One last thing: it’s important to distinguish between “anti-China or anti-Chinese” and “anti-Chinese-immigration”. If someone was really “pro-China” in the sense of ensuring a preservation of Chinese culture, they would logically be supportive of social configurations that would be conducive to that end (like Chinese remaining in China), and opposed to things that lead to its demise (multiculturalism and immigration). Chinese immigration to America is a nasty process that makes no one happy.

    • Thanks: Daemon
    • Replies: @Astuteobservor II
    , @Tor597
  170. trickster says:
    @Whitewolf

    Yeah right on. First, any white who marries that sweet looking Chinese woman soon comes to realize that that there is a foot trap at the altar. Once you say I do and exit the church, its that trip to immigration to sponsor every aunt, uncle, second cousin and distant grandparent eligible usually from villages that appear on no map of China. Ah, let me back up. Family sponsoring can only happen once SHE gets her green card. Sorry for that slip up in sequence.

    Not only that, but the poor bastard thought he was going to snuggle all alone with that sweet slope pussy. Right ? WRONG !

    All those relatives are coming to live with him and he is expected to support them, drive them all over the place, be respectful even when they sling buckets of shit at him and smile knowingly when they all converse in Cantonese. And dont think about leaving because that house, the cars etc that you paid for while the wife stayed home and took care of Uncle Chang and Grandma Ting A Kee, well the bad news is half or more is her’s. Guess who is the bitch now ?

    What a lot of people dont know, dont care about or choose to ignore is that these plays on a personal level also happen at the international level. Whites who are all for Christian values and what is right and just, better wake up and realize that what we consider righteous and fair is bullshit to these people.

    China, through a series of loans that would make organized crime blush, has already positioned itself in some very strategic areas of the world by foreclosing on those loans. Idiots argue “well I dont see why we should criticize them when the US has done the same thing !”

    When the white man comes into his kitchen and cant find a slice of stale bread and Fung has a full rice bowl these very same people are going to wake up to Real Politik and throw their bibles away. They will WANT the government to put China in its place.

    We live as we do because others dont. That is the way it has always been for hundreds of thousands of years. People dont understand this. Right and wrong is irrelevant when a man is without.

    Consider this. The UK will be Moslem dominated in 15 years. The folks who gave them quarter will find no quarter is given in return. Where North America is concerned this is something to think about.

  171. @theMann

    2. Pointless to “Learn” Chinese, or any other Asian language, if you don’t learn it as a child. As a rule (and aside from the Chinese being extreme Racist bigots of the worst sort) Asians never hear their language(s) spoken badly, or by a non-native, and have zero ability to cope with understanding their language spoken less than fluently.

    I wanted to quickly refute this as this is bad advice, unnecessarily defeatist, and runs the risk of misleading people. While it is very difficult if not impossible to become “native” in a foreign language without having been raised within it, it is possible to become “fluent”. With daily online lessons and a good teacher, someone can be “fluent” in Mandarin within 2-3 years for less than five grand.

    Your answer also presupposes a level of linguistic homogeneity within the Chinese population that doesn’t exist. Not only are there a plethora of Chinese dialects, but each region (North v. South) has a different means by which they pronounce the official Putonghua Mandarin. This is not including the fact that certain regions that fall within the imagined space of “China” (Taiwan and Hong Kong) have demonstrably substandard levels of Mandarin. Japan, on the other hand, is a completely different story…

  172. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @trickster

    Thank you, trickster.

    You show yourself, once again, a very rational, logical and nuanced poster.

    Pls, continue.

    We all take you VERY seriously here at The Unz Review fora, and eagerly await your comments.

    Few clothes but Chinos mek in New York

    BTW, did you type “Chinos” in your post? Are you perhaps Spanish or Hispanic? Just curious.

    • Replies: @vot tak
  173. J Lee says:
    @Whitewolf

    Too many party members are traveling to the United States and failing to be impressed by American freedom.
    That is why an executive order is coming that shall ban them forthwith from stepping on the sacred soil of liberty.
    Surely so deprived they will soon recant their loyalties to evil and the CCP shall fall.
    /s

  174. Anon[101] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    China will monopolize production, that’s where they are headed. Production is power. Without power and production, the standard of living in the US will sink even lower.

    • Replies: @denk
  175. Thomasina says:
    @Anonymous

    “I WAS your used and abused slut-bitch, past tense.”, said the former hooker. “I WAS”.

    Yes, the hooker and the businessman had a contract which has fallen apart; you scratch my back and I’ll scratch your’s is now over.

    The businessman enjoyed the sex and the hooker used this time to not only build up her knowledge, educate her kids, but get access to all of the businessman’s technology, something that she and her children, had they set their mind to developing on their own, could never have accomplished in several lifetimes, if ever.

    Had it ended right there, no harm, no foul. The deal was the businessman got the sex and the hooker got to live well.

    But now the hooker wants to take the businessman’s technology (which the businessman and his kids ingeniously and painstakingly developed over years and years of trial and error, hard work and at much expense) and use this technology to gain access to the businessman’s markets, in essence, compete against him.

    The hooker not only wants, but “expects” that the businessman’s clients should willingly jump on board the “Hooker Train” and do business with her. She tells them, “Look, with this new technology I have stolen…..er, taken…..er, gotten access to, my kids and I can make products much cheaper.”

    She can’t understand why the other countries don’t jump at the chance. She doesn’t realize, because she is self-centered and egotistical, that the businessman’s clients have longstanding relationships with him, and they don’t trust that she won’t do the same thing to them, steal their technology and markets too. Which, of course, she will. They already know this about her because, after all, she is a hooker.

    So the hooker stole the crown jewels and suddenly thinks she can become a new mob don. We’ll see what the other mob dons think about this.

  176. @No Friend Of The Devil

    Are you so inept to the point of not able to learn to use the reply button?

    Calling out the so called experts is the same as supporting the Chinese govt?

    Even in this you are thinking in zero sum.

    What did the Chinese govt do to you? Trying to figure you out, even though I already have some clues.

  177. @trickster

    Lol, do you have personal experience?

    • Replies: @trickster
  178. @Cho Seung-Hui

    Woah, you seem like a very smart Chinese anon.

    • Replies: @Cho Seung-hui
  179. J Lee says:
    @Bill P

    But the truth is that westerners who really love China and have/had good careers there are bailing out now.

    Just how many of those careers were based on something concrete like trade or technology as opposed to English teaching, vlogging, journalism and lifelong academia which seems to be the genesis of all China Watchers?
    In fact its the US State Department that finds American businessmen and professionals still too cozy with China and must find ways to hasten their departure.
    On the other hand, it is the class of western human detritus who would have never achieved anything back home that are finding they have overstayed their welcome. Their last hope, become a China Expert.

    • Replies: @Bill P
  180. @Astuteobservor II

    Same guy, just figured out how to comment with a consistent name just now.

  181. @Thomasina

    PSA.

    This anon is what a retard that has been fed on propaganda looks like.

    I doubt I can find a better version.

  182. denk says:
    @Anon

    That doesnt make China an enemy.

    China monopolise manufacturing .
    But they do not stop yanks from competing
    Its yanks own fault ,
    They used to make all kinds of stuff, then one fine afternoon, they decided that making nickers, washing machinese aint worth shit, they are meant for bigger thing… like stealing nations.
    Imagine, One Iraq alone was worth how many nickers, or washing machinese ?
    [mad Albright thought it’s worth 5000000 children]

    So they sent all that sweat shop stuffs over to China, together with the smog.
    They earn bigger bucks on the back of the Chinese peasants who’r willing to work 997 at 1/10 yanks wage, besides, yanks get to blame China for all those carbon emisson to boot.
    Its win win for yanks , or so they thought,.
    The rest is history

    Now that the Chinese are tired of making 10000000 nickers for ONE Boeing, they’r gunning for those core tech that yanks keep for themselves..
    Huawei has toppled CISCO and leading the wave of 5G
    yanks are getting panicky and try to kill off China Inc. by a GLobal Chinese Exclusion Act, stopping all countries, friends or foes , to do biz with China.
    Also, from what I gather, vast majority of yanks are rabid Chinese haters, taking it out on the former peasants while letting the real culprits off the hooks, viz, yanks own oligarchs who hit on that wonderful deal with the Chinese, markets for tech, who now regrets and blame it all on those ‘thieving Chinese’., yanks fall for it hook line and sinker.
    What a shame.

    ————-
    Enemy.
    Cambridge Dictionary

    a person who hates or opposes another person and tries to harm them or stop them from doing something:

    By the above def
    yanks are China’s enemy, not the other way round.

    May be murikkan dictionary has some wacky interpretation of enemy,
    yanks always have some wacky idea about everything, war is peace, black is white, heads I win, tail you loose….
    that
    kind of stuff.
    The exceptional people.
    hehehe

    BUt I’ll stick to the Cambridge, or Oxford, being of old English school stock [sic]

    • Replies: @Anon
    , @Anon
  183. Anon[101] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    Of course it makes them an enemy, in some peoples minds. You have your opinion, and others have theirs.

    You’re just trying to bait people and abuse them with your particular take on things.

    But you’re free to add many pages more to your non-convincing writing. Bait away, you’ll only convince people of like mind to yours.

  184. Thomasina says:
    @Harold Smith

    The Jewish are included in the “western” elites.

  185. Anon[101] • Disclaimer says:
    @denk

    You haven’t proved that Chinese don’t hate Americans. Chinese will remember bu ping treaties forever.

    If bu ping treaties don’t motivate Chinese, then why do they remember them forever? Chinese hate Americans , British and others because of bu ping treaties, and the drug trade and occupations of 19th century.

    Chinese hate Americans. Chinese will hide hatred forever also, they know how to hide their real opinions.

    • Replies: @anon
    , @denk
  186. Tor597 says:
    @Yevardian

    Your view is more along the lines of Erick Striker who is a very small minority amongst WN.

    You even allude to this yourself by saying the vast majority of “serious” WN but then you had to qualify it by saying “serious”. Ie a small subset of a larger group.

    Being non-interventionalist, anti-immigration, having no beef with other races or people, and even admiring what China has accomplished so white countries can do the same is consistent with Eric Striker.

    But again, this is a small subgroup of WN.

    I would say the majority of WN agree with much of what Striker says, but it does not mean they are not extremely racist against most people including the Chinese.

    All you have to do is go where WN post content and read what they say lol. Its not like the hostility is kept a secret. Even in the comments in the thread you can see it.

  187. Tor597 says:
    @Cho Seung-Hui

    1) Ethnic Chinese that live outside China used to make up a big part of the Anti-China crowd. But this is much much smaller today because the Chinese who live in the west can see that it is declining rapidly.

    Also there has been a lot of Anti-Asian sentiment in the west. So this group is much more likely to have swung back to being anti-west now.

    2) Agreed on the globalist.

    3) I would not limit this to whites that work for institutions. Instead I would say white expats who lived/live in Asia and experienced high status, only to see their status diminish as the west grows weaker and the east stronger.

    These people want to see Asia remain poor and backwards at all costs yet they claim they want to bring freedom and democracy to Asia lol.

    4) You completely leave out white people living in the west. These white people can be liberal or conservative. But they are mainly characterized by the fear that China is getting ahead and the west is declining.

    It doesn’t matter how many bad things the west is doing or whether China/Asia is advancing based on merit.

    They don’t like what they see because they can only imagine a world with whites on top and asians below whites.

    This is the biggest and most vociferous group of anti-China people around.

    • Agree: GreatSocialist
  188. Yevardian says:
    @Tor597

    I actually think most people in Europe don’t particularly care about China, the ones most hostile are those countries whose media is kept most in lockstep with American interests.
    You’re also ignoring that other countries in South and East Asia have much negative feelings towards China than Europe. You’re not Indian by any chance? Your tone suggests so.

  189. vot tak says:
    @Tor597

    “They don’t like what they see because they can only imagine a world with whites on top and asians below whites.

    This is the biggest and most vociferous group of anti-China people around.”

    This white supremacist attitude is promoted in over drive by israel’s likudite psywar ops in the west. The half pig mutant called netanyahoo is a poster boi for white supremacism. It is no accident trumps daughter is married to family friends of netanyahoo and that trump promotes divisiveness by excusing white supremacists, while at the same time being a doppelganger of netanyahoo with regard to everything zionazi.

  190. vot tak says:
    @trickster

    You thought you bought a bride, but found out you paid for her whole family, as well. They played your own selfish, rightwing exploit the other for your own aspie degenerate personal greed personality right back at you. Ever see a film called the Flim Fan Man?

    😀

    • Replies: @trickster
  191. vot tak says:
    @Anonymous

    Sayanim being praised by other sayanim. The guardianista way of doing zio-psywar.

  192. @Tor597

    4) You completely leave out white people living in the west. These white people can be liberal or conservative. But they are mainly characterized by the fear that China is getting ahead and the west is declining.

    This fall within number #2 and #3 within my post. Other than that, people without a desire to make money off China or wish to see China change don’t really care about the place, frankly.

    • Replies: @Tor597
  193. anon[544] • Disclaimer says:
    @Anon

    bu ping treaties

    LOL, another clueless Chinese expert. Stop throwing around Chinese words that you have no idea how to use them.

  194. denk says:

    Talking about the kiwis

    Once upon a time I thought NZ was the most benign least belligerent of the [[[family]]], but looks like the intrusion is too much to bear,

    New Zealand US ambassador pressure more openly align and integrate with Washington

    pressure from Britain’s high commissioner New Zealand halt negotiations with Russia

    new zealand, Why do we have the ‘Terrorism Suppression Act 2002, because the Americans told us we had to

    New Zealand ludicrous defence of US imperialism, describing it as a philanthropic

    Australian and New Zealand media designed to ratchet up an ongoing anti-China propaganda

    NZ has lost its virginity. 🙁

    • Replies: @HeebHunter
    , @Chinaman
  195. vox4non says:
    @Thomasina

    There’s so much normative insinuation, as in the value judgements that only the US can do right. Have a look in the mirror, the “businessman” has abused others while all the time shouting hypocritical slogans. All too often, jingoists have ignored the fact that military power and the post-WWII economic system has made many countries acquiesce to its demands rather than the attractiveness of its “values”. It indeed behaves very much like a mafia don.

    After all, the US had shown time and time again that might makes right. So, why be surprised when others learn from the same playbook? At the same time, the rest of the world is growing weary of the sanctimony of the US and its lapdogs.

  196. denk says:
    @trickster

    FUKUS in a nutshell…

    250 vs 1

    Always at the right side of history.

    http://krysstal.com/democracy_whyusa03.html

    Whites who are all for Christian values and what is right and just

    Sure you wanna claim that credit ?
    MOst your buddies would wanna blame it on da joos !

    heheheh

  197. Daemon says:
    @Thomasina

    You can steal an idea, but you cannot steal an execution of an idea (unless we’re talking software). What part of that does your addled brain not comprehend?

  198. denk says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Ahmad,

    Suckers! Where’s that high-IQ when you need it?

    Chinese are liq, conformists, just look at all those stupid masks and the lock down.

    whites are hiq, individualistic, brave men who dont take that shit lying down.

    Got it !

    Do the world a favor,

    Do yourself a favor, aint you sick of this nonsense [[[they]]] keep saying ,

    its the new normal, get used to it

    . ?

    Slay that beast, you’r the man.

    Che

    I envy you. You North Americans are very lucky. You are fighting the most important fight of all. You live in the belly of the beast.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  199. @denk

    I don’t know what the hell you’re on about with this one, Mr. Denk.

    Are you quoting Che Guevera now? This guy?:

    • Replies: @denk
  200. denk says:
    @Thomasina

    a new mob don. We’ll see what the other mob dons think about this.

    YOu mean the unitedsnakes aka [[[five liars]]] ?

    Is that a Freudian slip ?

  201. denk says:
    @Anon

    are you the same anon as above ?

    you’ll only convince people of like mind to yours

    How to convince an idiot ?

    Get a moniker forchrissake !

    I wanna bozo file you.

  202. Tor597 says:
    @Cho Seung-hui

    Lol.

    You are delusional man. Nice propoganda.

    • Replies: @Daemon
  203. denk says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    Wow hiq white man duno what Im talking ?

    willfully obtuse eh ?

    YOu been complaining about that
    CertificateOfVaccinID , well do something about it, forchrissake !

    I presume you know who’r the mastermind of this CertificateOfVaccinID crap, dont you ?
    [hint] it doesnt take a hiq white man to figure that out,

    PS
    wasting your time, I seldom, if ever, click on videos .
    If you’ve any valid point to make, shoot.

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
  204. Daemon says:
    @Tor597

    He’s not wrong. The average middle class white citizen has no knowledge of and no desire to know more of the entity known as ‘China’. The idea that the west is filled with back to back sinophobes is just a fantasy, and not a constructive one. They may harbor illusions like it would be better if China were ‘democratic’, but ultimately it is not a pertinent concern to them.

    Reddit, twitter and online comment sections are not substitutes for reality. Do not make the same mistake as the haters and fall to projection.

    • Thanks: Cho Seung-hui
    • Replies: @d dan
    , @Tor597
  205. @denk

    Those subhuman liberal anglos have always been like that. Never forget the Kim Dotcom raid.

    • Replies: @denk
  206. Donald Trump had his ass reamed so bad by the Chinese in the Avenue of Americas deal that he has a dildo up his ass he has never managed to take out.

    Small wonder he is now blaming China for a virus that most likely was developed in, and escaped from US laboratories. Let’s understand that everyone realizes at some level that Donald is the main fool responsible for the 200,000 deaths in the US. Not USAMRIID Fort Detrick(where the Trump virus escaped from), not Wuhan, not WIV, and not China.

    Every night, Donald has this dream, where Hua Mulan rides into the WhiteHouse, castrates him with a flick of her Jian, then throws his microscopic parts out into WhiteHouse lawn, where they become fertilizer for Melania’s new roses.

    Big countries always have to be careful of each other and protect their own interests. But making childish playground false accusations and hurting your own US businesses just to get back at your opponent because your little ego was hurt by TikTok videos, is about as stupid and Trump-like as it gets.

    America really has a fool for a president, and his name is Donald Trump.

    • Agree: Harold Smith
  207. @Thomasina

    Sounds like muttmerica and Europe.
    Muttmerica being the insane whore who killed Europe out of spite.

  208. @trickster

    This mulatto is too stupid to understand that the true elite classes of Asia, doctors, scientists, soldiers, academics are staying, while they send their underachievers abroad to bag some good and take care of some population density. If through sheer will some of the expats “make it”, all the better, they will come back with insight.

    But you are a stupid amerimutt, and your grandpa was a kike serving piece of shit. That is why your low IQ mind link Mexico with China.

    • Replies: @trickster
  209. @denk

    It’s hard to have a valid point when I don’t know WTF you are going on about. It’s past your bedtime, Chinaboy. Go to sleep…

    • Replies: @denk
  210. Anonymous[226] • Disclaimer says:

    It’s obvious.

    Western elitists know full well the inevitability of full spectrum Chinese economic, financial, technological, scientific and military global dominance in the near future.

    It frightens the Hell out of them. Hence they are doing everything possible to destroy China.

    Their dream scenario is getting some filthy coward/traitor ‘reformer’ Gorbachev type figure in charge of China.

    If you are Chinese – particularly in a high position – and reading this, PLEASE TAKE NOTE.

    This is probably the most important thing you’ll ever read.

    • Replies: @Chinaman
  211. trickster says:
    @vot tak

    No not me Bro. I am much too smart and well educated to get caught up in those traps. The Trickster is part fox, part mongoose and part serpent. I married my own kind !

    A workmate of mine with an Engineering Degree and expertise in compression and injection molding got a lucrative contract in 1991 with a rubber plant in China . Guaranteed employment for 5 years with option to renew, free apartment, free car with translator/ driver, one month vacation with passage assistance etc.

    Came back in 2001 with the prettiest Chinese girl you ever did see and three beautiful children. He met her at the plant where he worked and figured she would be a grateful wife coming the land of milk and honey and all that only to find out that once she arrived and settled in it was time to welcome the rest of her impoverished family. His sister told me the love nest turned into a barrel of snakes and he went from 220 lbs down to skin and bones.

    It got so bad that he just moved out leaving everything behind but this was not enough. His lawyer advised him to move out of the City and terminate ALL contact as the situation had degenerated into a dangerous one. For a while the man lived in a room with a family two hours away and went on welfare. A friend lent him an old VW to get around. Ultimately with his skills he moved out of the country leaving kids and everything behind. Lost it all and had to start all over from scratch.

    That is what happens when you mix chalk and cheese !

    • Replies: @HeebHunter
  212. trickster says:
    @Astuteobservor II

    See my reply to Vor Tak at comment # 216

  213. denk says:
    @HeebHunter

    Some bedside stories [[[five liars]]] mothers dream up to scare the rowdy kids,

    IN Oz,

    The students, businessmen, even tourists from China are sleeper agents,. Once the embassy give the signal, they will pour into the streets to paralyse the country.

    [sic]

    In NZ,

    The Chinese are waging a hybrid war against the west.

    Anne Mary Brady, the resident empire shill ,

    Chinese agents broke into my house , stole my hard disk…..

    [As if she had just designed the west’s next gen jet fighter !]

    Professional China basher like her are a dime a ton in [[[five liars]]] land, the bitch want us to believe CCP would carry out a risky op in hostile land to get at her craps …..this is too mofoking funny!

    but you aint seen nuthin yet…

    Beijing is preparing to “cause domestic havoc” in New Zealand “once the cold war with America gets hot

    Holy shit,
    What these [email protected]#$%^ accuse China , without a shred of evidence, are exactly the kind of stuff [[[they]]] have been doing to China for seventy years.

    Talk about
    wolf crying wolves,
    bandits crying robbery !

    Then we’ve
    john perfidious Derby

    China is the land of lies.

    Just wondering,
    Do [[[five liars]]] have mirrors in their homes ?

  214. denk says:
    @Achmed E. Newman

    the hiq whitey playing dumb.

    This is an adult side, for serious stuff.

    Since all you know is dumping silly videos , which Im not interested anyway, why dont you go play at youtube. ?

  215. d dan says:
    @Daemon

    “The average middle class white citizen has no knowledge of and no desire to know more of the entity known as ‘China’. “

    This I agree. But this lack of curiosity is exactly the problem. The “hard” news of all-round progresses of China in all areas, couples with constant bombardments of lies from the media and the “intelligence” and “experts” community emphasizing and twisting all news beyond their original and reasonable intents, meanings and interpretations, make those average white citizens easily manipulated.

    “The idea that the west is filled with back to back sinophobes is just a fantasy…”

    Please explain this when: 81% of republicans, 63% of democrats and 60% of independents perceived “China as unfriendly or an enemy” at the end of April 2020.
    Source: https://www.unz.com/anepigone/china-slides/

    And this:

    A new poll shows nearly three-quarters of Americans view China negatively,…

    source: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/07/30/poll-americans-views-china-sours-amid-coronavirus-trump-attacks/5535455002/

    And many more surveys and polls from WSJ, from Gallup, from Politico, … over the years.

    “Reddit, twitter and online comment sections are not substitutes for reality. “

    Many of the surveys I saw are not just from online – they include polls from telephone calls or through other random sampling.

    • Agree: Harold Smith, Tor597
    • Replies: @Daemon
  216. @trickster

    You know this and you still babble about how the underclass chinese are begging to go to your country for anything positive.
    LOL
    Typical stupid quadroon mutt. Oh well, you will join grandpas in the boiling cauldron of human shit soon enough, along with the rest of the kikes.

    • Replies: @trickster
  217. Bill P says:
    @J Lee

    Not many people in tech stay for very long in China, because Chinese policy is to transfer technology to CCP-controlled firms. The foreigner’s role is to teach the Chinese how to use the tech, then leave. It works well for a number of engineers and others, who get paid a lot for a couple years’ work. Ultimately, I’m not sure the Chinese are getting as good of a deal out of it as they think, because having random experts spend a couple of years teaching people how to machine jet turbines and such doesn’t do much to teach the institutional culture of aircraft production.

    One company the Chinese wisely kept around continuously for over 100 years is Siemens, but from my limited interaction with them I think Siemens gets the better end of the deal than the Chinese. It was Siemens that originally sold the Chinese on this stupid panopticon solution, which will eventually blow up in their faces because people instinctively resent it.

    The people I knew who lived in China long term were typically upper middle class professionals who stayed because they liked it. These days many are relocating to Taiwan or California. One guy I knew left recently, and that kind of shocked me, because he told me he had no interest in returning to America. He’d married a Chinese woman and “gone native” as far as I could tell. Spoke fluent Mandarin, and even had a successful career as an actor over there. Now he’s back in California, and leading a much more anonymous life. I don’t know why exactly he left, but there must have been a compelling reason. I don’t recall him being political, and he put up with stuff I never would have tolerated.

    The people leaving China are the types China would have done well to keep. It isn’t your average Westerner who can tolerate the place for too long, much less actually thrive over there. If they are forced to leave, yeah, there’s going to be some resentment. You put that much of your life and work into a place, then you get shoved out… What do you expect?

  218. Jiminy says:

    First off, I have to say that I am no expert on China. But if people haven’t noticed yet, then I will say it. The global war on terrorism is over. Twenty years of officially sanctioned destruction of the muslims, I believe , has ceased. The good guys have taught the bad guys a lesson that they will never forget- don’t trust the west.
    The new target is of course China. Accusations are ramping up almost daily at an alarming rate, enough to begin the process of changing people’s views on the country. China is bad. Look at what it is doing to the Muslim population in the northwest region.
    Every morning my alarm clock goes off set to the national radio broadcaster. Today the news said that Chinese officials with close ties to an embassy were raided, and computers and phones were collected, somehow bypassing diplomatic protections. Yesterday we were told that a Chinese company had collected data freely available from the internet and collated it into a possible leaked dirt file on several million people worldwide. I can’t wait to hear tomorrow’s news.
    You don’t have to be an expert on China to see that something is clearly planned and it’s ramping up rather quickly.

    • Replies: @denk
  219. Chinaman says:
    @denk

    It is 4 million people on stolen land. Who cares what they think…

    The Chinese have already brought up Auckland and runs the economy.

    • Replies: @denk
  220. Daemon says:
    @d dan

    You are confusing a general negative perception of China with being a sinophobe. A little bit of nuance is needed here. The former is simply a vague feeling of threat whereas the latter is to be against everything China stands for from the very core of your being.

    The average american (and I stress average) is indeed feeling threatened – by the job losses, by the military tensions and mainly by the idea that America is losing her undisputed grip over the world but very few of them are actually against what China IS. Mostly because a) they don’t know and b) even if they do know they simply don’t have the time or energy to care. They may spout this and that about ‘democracy’ or ‘freedom’ or ‘authoritarianism’ but it’s very clear they don’t really have a clue of what they’re talking about and are just parroting MSM talking points to sound informed. What they’re actually attacking isn’t China, but a collection of the worst traits of the USA projected onto a mental construct that they have labelled ‘China’ in their mind. So yes, as an outsider seeing others smear your nation with the ills and evils of their own country is unfair and quite franky, frustrating. But it helps to realize they’re simply making the best of a bad situation. It also helps to realize in the end they’re all powerless anyway.

    The average Republican, you will find, are actually conditional china haters. If you listen to their complaints and filter out the anti-Obama/Clinton diatribes (which are quite valid btw), you will find that their gripe is almost exclusively due to the fact that their dominance is being challenged. This is very evident where if you push back even a tiny bit they will very quickly turn to material like ‘nuke chyna’, their infantile reverence of their battle carrier groups or try and bring up Japan/WW2, Korea/Vietnam war about how they/Japan shot and killed your countrymen by the thousands. Because to them, they don’t give a flying fig about ‘the rejuvenation of the downtrodden people of China’, because that’s fag talk. Dominance is everything and to them, geopolitics is analogous to two alpha males sizing each other up right before a drunken barfight.
    This isn’t sinophobia and will be the same if you swap out China for Guatemala, Chile or Japan. The result will be the same. Of course the whole “Communism” thing seems like a convenient bugbear, but it’s simply schelling point for their base to rally around. Otherwise you will see the exact same hate for countries like Vietnam, or Laos or Cuba, but you just … don’t.

    Liberals, however DO HATE what China is/has become/always was. Because in their mind the chinese shared their dream of a homosexual/multicultural paradise due to that ‘communist’ label. That facade that has protected China for decades is quickly slipping and the libs are waking up to china’s ‘betrayal’. They’re discovering for the first time that China always was and will be a reactionary place. For the liberal true believers, this is fundamentally what the Uighurs/HK and the whole nauseating talk about ‘shared values’ is about.
    This is why I agreed with Cho’s assessment. The liberals are the real enemy, because they fundamentally want to change what China IS.

    Third party independents aka libertarians fall under the money making guys Cho was talking about earlier. All the low hanging fruit has been picked so now they’re sad. Fuck ’em.

    Of course, over a long enough period negative perceptions can harden into a sort of a phobia for a percentage of the population, i.e. the Russians or the Arabs, but we have not reached that point yet. 10-5 years from now, that may change. But if you feel that any criticism of China warrants that person being labelled a sinophobe, regardless of whether that stance is taken due to material insecurity or genuine sino-hatred, you are fundamentally doing more harm than good. People need to vent, and talking smack on the internet hurts noone, In fact it helps China in the long run by channeling negative energy away from doing productive things, lessening the competition. Taking away this avenue of expression will in fact hurt you as they will likely channel that energy into actual concrete action.

    • Disagree: Tor597
  221. Chinaman says:
    @Anonymous

    Although I am not a Chinaman in a high position, I still appreciate the comment. The people running China have witness the implosion of the Soviet Union and every reform that was taken in the past 30 years is to avoid the same calamity. The people running China today are not dumb. Meritocracy have its merits. More importantly, even dumb Chinaman like me are cognisant of the vile intentions of the West. The blatant aggression and racism is just getting too far.

    Ultimately, China have lead the world for most of the time in the last 2000 years and it is time it regains its rightful place amongst the League of Nations. The IQ and national character of the people will get them there.

    • Replies: @VinnyVette
  222. denk says:
    @Jiminy

    War Of Terror,
    30 millions dead, 60 millions displaced.

    BUsh

    sorry pal, We dont count collateral damages

    https://consortiumnews.com/2020/09/10/tens-of-millions-displaced-by-war-on-terror-greatest-scam/

    trickster the whitey

    Whites are all for Christian values and what is right and just, better wake up and realize that

    • Replies: @trickster
  223. Did the Unz really need another pro China anti American writer / propagandist? Romanoff isn’t enough? Yeah I like American supremacy. If the Chinese could pull it off and switch roles, which they are attempting to do, they would and it would not be any prettier. China does not have or acknowledge human rights, the U.S.A. as of now does. Is the U.S. fucked up? Sure, but any sane person would take it over the totalitarian China.
    Please if you lovee China so much and this goes for all the China loving Unz commentariat, move to China and take as many blacks as you can with you. Adios!

    • Agree: trickster
    • Replies: @Tor597
    , @denk
  224. @Chinaman

    “Ultimately, China have lead the world for most of the time in the last 2000 years”
    Lead the world in what exactly?

    • Replies: @trickster
  225. @Daemon

    What a line of self indulgent crap!

    • Agree: Tor597
    • Replies: @Daemon
  226. Anonymous[121] • Disclaimer says:
    @Daemon

    This is actually a pretty good, fairly nuanced analysis of the anti-Chinese emotions and thoughts in the West (meaning Western Europe and North America).

    IMHO, the situation is the following:

    For liberals, China’s existence is a repudiation of liberal Western values. China is not anti-Western-values, like Islam say, but China simply ignores what the West (or anyone else) preaches. And that’s a mortal challenge to modern liberalism.

    For conservatives, China’s existence is clear proof that Western power has its limits. China is not challenging the West for primacy directly, like the Soviet Union did, it’s just that China’s sustained rapid advance is regardless of the West. And that is a mortal challenge to Western dominance and self-perception.

    Basically, it’s China’s existence that’s the core problem, in both cases, but for different reasons. Liberals want to crusade and convert, conservatives want to dominate and rule. Both kinds of desire and patterns of action blend together into what I like to call the “Western Way of Civilizational Relations”.

    “I am both Moral, and Powerful, You are both Wrong and Weak, which means I COMMAND and You . . . OBEY”, quoth the West to the Rest (of Humanity).

    Conservatives wouldn’t mind China getting poor, internally and externally weakening, and breaking up, just to be sure.

    Liberals, for their part, wouldn’t lose sleep if China lost its identity, became mentally colonized as a slave-class for Western culture, business and geopolitics, and breaking up, just to be sure.

    Chinese have no time for either camp, as they continue to simply live their own lives. IMHO.

    • Agree: Yevardian, HeebHunter
    • Thanks: Daemon
  227. trickster says:
    @VinnyVette

    They will lead the world in sweet and sour dog consumption.

  228. trickster says:
    @denk

    Next stop? CHINA !

    There are too many gooks and we need to cull the litter, dispose of the trash so to speak. The men have to go but the ladies will remain to look after us. We will be using Negro troops so you need to tell us where your Mama and sisters live LOL

    • Replies: @denk
    , @anon
  229. trickster says:
    @HeebHunter

    Are you one of those underclass slopes who stuffed themselves in a container with 50 other slimy and smelly countrymen to come to this beautiful country ? Days with little water, days with little food and days shitting in a bucket with all the others ? And owing smugglers thousands to come here and live with the white man like a whiteman ? To work as a slave for other Chinks in unsanitary conditions in Chinatown? And then from time to time the smugglers come and say:

    Eenie meenie minee mo
    Heebhunter;s mother will be my hoe
    If to USA she wants to go
    Get on her knees and start to blow

    For the whole gang………LOL

    • Replies: @HeebHunter
  230. denk says:
    @Chinaman

    Who cares what they think…

    Personally, I wont enjoy living in an hostile
    environment, where resentment is barely concealed and frequently erupts into violent outburst.

  231. denk says:
    @trickster

    YOur hero the great white hoax is turning fukus into the laughing stock of the world…

    Another 200 vs one.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/21/us-iran-sanctions-un-mike-pompeo

    Good job, comrade Trump !

    PS
    Why black on white porn are so hot in fukus ?
    Better keep an eye on your daughter .

  232. @Tony Hall

    Moreover, the land grabs tend to be very recent and ongoing as is the case, for instance,…

    The known ones are more recent.
    Who grabbed Ötzi´s land? Didn’t the North American giants have their land grabbed? Have the Mongols apologized yet for their land grab and extermination of countless tribes?

  233. @trickster

    If I were one of them I would be too busy sucking you dry to your death. And send money back to the homeland without any of the liberal dogshit.

    Your propaganda is weak. You might need to focus on honing those enlisted nigger, sheeboon and tranny officers.

    • Replies: @trickster
  234. anon[301] • Disclaimer says:
    @trickster

    Denk is not Chinese. He is a mulatto coloured Turkish refugee in Holland sucking the Dutch government for a monthly stipend. The white man he curses puts food in his mouth. Apparently he lives in a hostel with a whole bunch of other Turks who came accross on a raft. Erdogan getting rid of his filth by sending them to Europe.

    • Replies: @trickster
  235. Daemon says:
    @VinnyVette

    Whats with you boomers and snarky one line retorts? No, the world you have constructed in your mind is not self-evident. Either come up with a rebuttal or stay silent.

    • Replies: @VinnyVette
  236. Tor597 says:
    @Daemon

    Not true at all.

    The west is deeply insecure about its place in the world and its path forward. So much so that average Americans, conservative or liberal, are willing to engage in China bashing no matter how ridiculous it is.

    You can see this on Reddit, twitter, tv, and yes real life if you pay attention. It was not my imagination that a 5 year old Asian kid got his face slashed open or an asian women had acid thrown on her because of “China Virus”.

  237. Tor597 says:
    @Daemon

    It is a moot point though.

    I don’t think Americans inherently hate anybody including the Chinese. If China was a weak and poor country, no one in America would care about Uighers or human rights.

    But the point is that China is wealthier and more powerful by the day. So average Americans are going to increase their hatred of China even though the hatred is not inherent, just relative to China’s competitiveness.

    This is what the west always does when it is threatened by someone. They try to demean them and to spread this hate all the way down to everyone.

    You act like this is just something topical with no consequence in real life. But average AMERICANS who are not even Chinese are being attacked in the streets. A 5 year old got his face slashed open and a woman got acid thrown on her face because of “China Virus”.

    It is not just Chinese people who are being attacked by the way. Japanese, Korean, even Phillipino tourists get harassed when they visit the west.

    • Agree: GreatSocialist
  238. Tor597 says:
    @VinnyVette

    lol.

    If you want an echo chamber why go to Unz in the first place. Unz is about challenging conventional wisdom, not soothing your fragile ego.

    To say that America believes in human rights is a joke. How about you not sterilize immigrants as they come to the country? Work on this and then we will talk.

    Why don’t you move to Europe and take as many Jews with you.

  239. @Daemon

    I’m gen X not Boomer. I’m a man of few words. One line is all I needed.

  240. d dan says:
    @Daemon

    That is a bunch of lame excuses and tenuous arguments:

    “You are confusing a general negative perception of China with being a sinophobe. A little bit of nuance is needed here. The former is simply a vague feeling of threat whereas the latter is to be against everything China stands for from the very core of your being.”

    I believe the distinction is quite meaningless because the line between the two definitions
    1. is very thin (e.g. if someone believe Chinese steals his job, is he having a “general negative perception” or is he against what China “stands for”?)
    2. is of very little practical implications (both types of feelings result in hostile, irrational and unproductive actions against China)
    3. is unclear how many/what percentage have crossed the line. (you only have a gut feel to support your conclusion. Any poll numbers are likely unreliable on this)

    “The average american (and I stress average) is indeed feeling threatened…”

    What about the average Chinese? If they feel insecure, do they have the license to smear and spread all types of lies around the world about White Americans harvesting human organs from inmates, putting millions of Muslims in concentration camps, randomly shooting Blacks in the streets, intentionally releasing virus on innocent peoples, …

    “… feeling threatened – by the job losses, by the military tensions and mainly by the idea that America is losing her undisputed grip over the world but very few of them are actually against what China IS. “

    If so, please explain how the following “blame China” attitude is due to fear of job losses/military conflicts:

    “Around three-quarters (78%) place a great deal or fair amount of the blame for the global spread of the coronavirus on the Chinese government’s initial handling of the COVID-19 outbreak in Wuhan.”

    And 73% want actively promoting human rights in China even if it “harms bilateral economic relations”. That is going beyond “just parroting MSM talking points”:

    “As the U.S. imposes sanctions on Chinese companies and officials over Beijing’s treatment of Uighurs and other minority groups… Around three-quarters (73%) say the U.S. should try to promote human rights in China, even if it harms bilateral economic relations, …

    source: https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2020/07/30/americans-fault-china-for-its-role-in-the-spread-of-covid-19/

    So, no, you can’t ascribe all/most Americans’ ill feelings to some innocuous reasons. The reasons also include a range of prejudices, biases, superiority complex, stupidity, hatred and racism.

    “What they’re actually attacking isn’t China, but a collection of the worst traits of the USA projected onto a mental construct that they have labelled ‘China’ in their mind.”

    In other words, you believe that an attack is not an “attack” unless the substance of the attack is true? If someone calls you a murderer, rapist and motherfucker, he is not “attacking” you (because they are not true)?

    “But it helps to realize they’re simply making the best of a bad situation.”

    You call this “the best”: 24/7 repetitions of lies, reverberating throughout the world’s echo chamber by millions or even billions?

    “It also helps to realize in the end they’re all powerless anyway.”

    Victimhood argument like: Blacks are crime-prone because they are powerless.

    “But if you feel that any criticism of China warrants that person being labelled a sinophobe, regardless of whether that stance is taken due to material insecurity or genuine sino-hatred, you are fundamentally doing more harm than good.”

    Negative feeling of any type is always harmful to good relationship and world peace – whatever the causes. And I don’t agree with your simplistic dichotomy of the good/bad or excusable/inexcusable causes.

    “…talking smack on the internet hurts noone”

    Hurt no one? Color revolutions, religious and racial conflicts in many parts of the world were started through inflammable opinions generated in Internet. Same could happen for WW3.

    “In fact it helps China in the long run by channeling negative energy away from doing productive things, lessening the competition.”

    Right, criticizing China in Internet actually “helps China” – what a twisted logic. You believe China benefits if average Whites do not work or compete? You think China’s talk of “win-win” relationship is just for show?

    • Replies: @Daemon
  241. denk says:
    @VinnyVette

    China does not have or acknowledge human rights, the U.S.A. as of now does

    Another crazy has escaped from the asylum…

    UN votes records

    Calls for alternative approaches within the United Nations system for improving the enjoyment of human rights and fundamental freedoms.

    Condemns Israeli human rights practices in occupied territories.

    Declares that education, work, health care, proper nourishment, national development, etc are human rights.

    Resolutions about cooperation, human rights, trade and development.

    200 vs ONE.

  242. trickster says:
    @anon

    About Denk…….I always thought he was Chinese his English was so bad and to me had a Chinese inflection and his logic seemed disjointed. So he is really a nigger Turk, pretending to be Chinese, living in Holland and drawing the whiteman’s perks while cursing him ?

    Man, he is one seriously twisted fuck. And an unemployed refugee at that. No wonder he has so much time to spend here on Unz. He is probably living there illegally. Uncle Erdogan cleaning out his gutters and sending the Moslem scum to Europe !

  243. denk says:

    Whites who are all for Christian values and what is right and just

    moslem scums

    Who’r those who bombed xtian Yugo back to stone age, on behalf of their KLA moslem scums bro ?

    hehehehe

    https://original.antiwar.com/nicolas_davies/2020/07/06/key-us-ally-indicted-for-organ-trade-murder-scheme/

    hehehehe

  244. trickster says:
    @HeebHunter

    Do you know what a Heeb is ? It is a word attributed to Jewish youth denoting their pride in their ethnicity. So your handle means you are a Jew Hunter ? LOL.

    You must have spent a lot of time looking at Inglorious Basterds at the internet cafe. I’ll bet money that if you saw a bunch of old Jewish men with walking sticks you would pee in your pants with fright.

    You had better change your handle and watch your comments before those Heebies Jeebies come and rock your Dutch refugee hostel. You might find yourself on a raft back to Turkey and the only people you will be sucking dry are those Turkey prison officers. Oh, say hello to your boyfriend Denk, that is if you and Denk are not the same person. LMAO

    HeebHunter !! What a joke you are little circus midget.

  245. Daemon says:
    @d dan

    I won’t rebutt what you wrote, because you’re not wrong. However you misinterpreted my post as a call to lay down arms rather than as a series of my personal observations as well as a suggestion to pick your battles. By all means, attack the smearers and ideologues (as an ever increasing number of americans are becoming), they’re irredeemable, very vocal and very visible – even on here. If they start cranking out the Uighur, SCS, Hong Kong, Tienanmen bullshit you know they’re already lost anyway.
    But a few I’ve noticed aren’t like that. They’re mostly just regular nationalists who’ve internalized that their value as a human being is connected to the strength of their country. Feels kinda familiar actually.

    But my main point was – if you follow the comment chain back to its source – that there’s really no point in attacking sympathetic targets who have views that are slightly adjacent to yours. Target selection is an art, so pick your battles by not choosing neutral targets. Attacking a target only pushes them away and entrenches beliefs further. For those on the fence it is exactly the last thing you want to be doing.

    Right, criticizing China in Internet actually “helps China” – what a twisted logic. You believe China benefits if average Whites do not work or compete? You think China’s talk of “win-win” relationship is just for show?

    Normally, I would agree with you but for this particular opponent, I would like to remind you who you are up against.
    You are up against the megalomaniac descendants of pirates and raiders who think in terms of ‘my way or the highway’. To them, this talk of win-win is exactly why china is looked down on. To the hegemon you must play the same game – heads I win, tails you lose. Until they’re crushed or come to their senses, then we can talk about win-win.

    • Thanks: d dan
  246. Whether or not Americans like delusional old dotard Donald Trump can actualize their masturbatory fantasies against China, it’s somewhat irrelevant, because America cannot stop the rise of China, no matter what America does.

    The American military is always happy to attack other countries as long as they don’t get too much blowback, casualties or damage. Always ready to kill others, but very reluctant to die themselves.

    When Trump backed down like a scared little dopey pussy after Iran bombed his US base in Iraq with ballistic missiles, everybody saw him, choked up with fear, like a little drug-addled snowflake(he’s an Adderall addict), slurring and disorientated, saying he will back down and n doesn’t have the guts escalate with Iran.

    Iran gave him an ultimatum: back down and we end here with us bombing your base, if u escalate then we bomb all your bases in ME with 10,000 missiles. What say u, pussy-man?

    And Trump said, “Please let’s not fight anymore, I’ll bend over n u can ream my ass.”

    That was a clear end to the pathetic myth of American military supremacy in the Middle East. If America is too pussy-scared to attack Iran after Iran bombs their biggest base in Iraq with ballistic missiles, how will it deal with North Korea and China? Or even Venezuela?

    And Trump has no equal when it comes to hurting his own people and destroying his own country. Just like all the businesses he started then ran into the ground. Trump University. All his 6 casinos going bankrupt. His listed company DJT going bankrupt, killing all its investors.

    If he had not been bailed out by Arabs, Israeli and Russian investors, he would be gone. That’s why he is so eager to suck on their nether parts.

    He’ll let America DIE FIRST, but take care of Arab, Israeli and Russian interests first.

    • Thanks: denk
  247. Smith says:

    It’s the usual claptraps.

    The actual chink experts live in Asia. We are wise to their tricks, accusing raysism abroad while practising nationalism at home.

Current Commenter
says:

Leave a Reply -


 Remember My InformationWhy?
 Email Replies to my Comment
Submitted comments have been licensed to The Unz Review and may be republished elsewhere at the sole discretion of the latter
Subscribe to This Comment Thread via RSS Subscribe to All Thorsten J. Pattberg Comments via RSS
PastClassics
The “war hero” candidate buried information about POWs left behind in Vietnam.
Are elite university admissions based on meritocracy and diversity as claimed?
Our Reigning Political Puppets, Dancing to Invisible Strings