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The Arguments Against "Race"
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This essay is drawn from the book Making Sense of Race, which can be purchased here.

“Race” is a coherent biological category, as much as is “species,” and the cases against it simply don’t add up.

Is “race” an outmoded, morally dubious idea that was deservedly cast into the dustbin of history, along with Stalinism, astrology, and blood-letting? Many say so. Indeed, there is a vociferous movement in anthropology, as well as in the mass media, opposed to the use of race as a biological category. Their opposition functions through a series of “memes” or “variations on themes,” which recur again and again. It is to these arguments that we now turn an informed and critical eye.

How Can You Draw a Line Between Different Races?

A chapter summary in Race and Intelligence includes the lines:

There are no biological races. Human physical appearance varies gradually around the planet, with the most geographically distant peoples generally appearing the most different from one another.[1]Jefferson M. Fish, ed., Race and Intelligence (Mahwah, NJ: Lawrence Erlbaum, 2011)

In other words: there is no clear way to divide different races. They merge into each other, with great variation in-between. A version of this argument is that there is no specific gene that is found only in one specific race. It can be countered that races are, of course, not entirely discrete categories because, if they were, they would be more like species, or perhaps genera, families, or orders on up the taxonomic scale.

Even if it were true that no unambiguous line can be drawn between races, this does not undermine the utility of race. The line between Grizzly bears and Brown bears is blurry, too—but you still know one when you see one and making distinctions between these subspecies is meaningful. Moreover, even if we were to accept that a species varies in small ways due to slightly different environments, then those at the extremes would differ so much, and in consistent ways, that it would become useful to distinguish between them.

Ultimately, it seems like people who make this argument are flirting with a kind of “tactical nihilism.” After all, no concept about the real world is mathematically pure. If “race” is “problematic” because it has blurry borders, then the concept of “history” is equally “problematic”—indeed, the term “problematic” is “problematic.” We use categories to divide our world into manageable chunks and thus negotiate it successfully. If we could not do that, we’d die. So the “blurry borders” argument fails the philosophical test of pragmatism. There exist population clusters that differ profoundly due to varying degrees of evolutionary isolation. These allow correct predictions to be made. That is all that is being argued.

Race is a “Western” Concept

Some say that race is illegitimate or immoral because it is steeped in Western history (and thus things like slavery and oppression), as well as the supposedly myopic and suffocating outlook of “Western science.” But this same argument could be made about almost any concept—including the ones that supposedly undermine or overcome Western hegemony. At some point, we have to accept a basic framing.

And the central question is whether race is a predictive category or not. If race is “problematic” because it’s Western, then, presumably, we cannot use Western concepts at all to analyze anything non-Western. Following this logic, we shouldn’t even talk about anything that is non-Western using a Western tongue. Such argument may sound profound, but under inspection, they’re rather shallow. And for what it’s worth, non-Western cultures clearly have words and concepts that track with the Western notion of “race.”

Race Has Meant Different Things

It has been noted that the word “race” can mean different things. Historically, it has been used in ways that “culture,” “ethnic group,” “nation,” or even “family” are now employed. Lord Acton’s Cambridge Modern History, for instance, referred to the “Habsburg race” in reference to the dynastic line.[2]Lord Acton, Stanley Mordaunt Leathes, Sir Adolphus William Ward, and G. W. Prothero, eds., Cambridge Modern History, vol. 2 (Cambridge: University of Cambridge Press, 1902). While the history of words is interesting, the fact that the meaning of words change over time is simply irrelevant to our purposes here. We are clear that by “race” we mean breeding populations separated in prehistory and adapted to different environments. If anyone uses race to mean anything else, then our use of race and his are merely homonyms. For what it’s worth, the word “mean” has meant different things historically. In Middle English, it meant “to intend.” Only by 1834 was “mean” widely being used in the way in which it is above.[3]Online Etymology Dictionary (2019), “Mean,” https://www.etymonline.com/ word/mean (accessed May 15, 2020). Does that “mean” that we cannot use the concept of “meaning”?

Studying Race Leads to Bad Things

Another supposed problem with race is that developing the concept leads to bad consequences. It legitimizes “racist groups,” “inspires hatred,” and so forth. That it might do this is clearly of no relevance to whether or not it is a scientifically justifiable and predictive category. This argument commits the fallacy of an “appeal to consequences” and, depending on how the consequences are described, an “appeal to emotion.” Firstly, it’s obvious that concepts of all kinds can have bad effects. Ecology—as well as awareness about pollution and natural degradation—has, on some level, “inspired” eco-terrorism and murder. Does that mean that research into cleaning the oceans and preserving their ecosystems should cease because it has led, in some way, to violence? To ask the question is to answer it.

Beyond that, it can be convincingly argued that suppressing the concept of race leads to very bad consequences. If a South Asian person has a kidney transplant and is given the kidney of a White person, then his body will likely reject it, elevating the possibility that the patient will die of kidney failure. This scenario is the reason why Britain’s National Health Service regularly appeals for more Black and South Asian organ donors.[4]Sandish Shoker, “The Health System’s Struggle to Get More Black and Asian Donors,” BBC News, July 4, 2015, https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england- nottinghamshire-33101610 (accessed May 15, 2020) During the 2020 Covid-19 pandemic, it was found that mortality was particularly high among Blacks and South Asians living in Northern Europe, something that was argued to be for genetic reasons. Specifically, Vitamin D deficiency rendered one more susceptible to serious complications from Covid-19, and non- Europeans were much more likely to be deficient due to their darker skin, leaving them less able to absorb Vitamin D from the sun.[5]Susanne Bejerot and Mats Humble, “Inhabitants of Swedish-Somali Origin Are at Great Risk for Covid-19,” British Medical Journal, 368 (2020): m1101.

There are consistent genetic racial differences in the prevalence of many serious medical conditions. Sometimes these stay in populations because a single inherited allele had positive consequences in ancestral environments, overwhelming the negatives consequences for individual carriers of two alleles. An example is sickle cell anaemia, a condition associated with Sub-Saharan Africans. If you carry two copies of the mutant allele, then you develop this debilitating condition. If, however, you carry one copy, then you will likely be immune to malaria.[6]Lucio Luzatto, “Sickle Cell Anaemia and Malaria,” Mediterranean Journal of Hematology and Infectious Diseases, 4(1) (2012): e2012065. Cystic Fibrosis, a congenital disease among Northern European, is similar.[7]Brian P. O’Sullivan and Steven D. Freedman, “Cystic Fibrosis,” Lancet, 373 (2009): 1891–1904. It only appears when two carriers of the faulty allele have a child, there being a 50 percent chance that such a child will have Cystic Fibrosis. Various hypotheses have been advanced to explain why Cystic Fibrosis has remained in European populations. One states that carrying a single copy of the faulty allele causes carriers to be better able to fight off tuberculosis.[8]Joanne K. Tobacman, “Does Deficiency of Arylsulfatase B Have a Role in Cystic Fibrosis?” Chest, 123 (2003): 2130–2139.

In some cases, something is adaptive under Darwinian conditions but is maladaptive under modern conditions. For example, South Asians are particularly good at storing fat, and this is useful in the context of food scarcity, for obvious reasons. But with food abundance brought on by the Industrial Revolution and the use of fossil fuels, South Asians become diabetic more easily than Europeans.[9]Emma Pomeroy, Veena Mushrif-Tripathy, Tim J. Cole, et al., “Ancient Origins of Low Lean Mass Among South Asians and Implications for Modern Type 2 Diabetes Susceptibility,” Scientific Reports, 9 (2019): 10515. Helping South Asians deal with these problems can only occur with a proper understanding of their nature.

There is evidence that Northeast Asians are less well-adapted to flu-like viruses than either Europeans or Sub-Saharan Africans. This may be because flu thrives in cold and wet or hot and wet ecologies, meaning that Europeans and Sub-Saharan Africans would be more strongly selected to be resistant to flu.[10]Office of the Ministry of Health, Monthly Bulletin of the Ministry of Health (1954), 173. Moreover, races that never developed complex agriculture—such as the Inuit, the Australian Aborigines, the Pacific Islanders, and many Native American groups—have low resistance to flu because animal husbandry often causes viruses to jump the species barrier, and races that evolved in such a context developed better adapted immune systems.[11]C. L. Chen, Li Xiao, Y-P. Zhou, et al., “Ethnic Differences in Susceptibilities to A(H1N1) Flu: An Epidemic Parameter Indicating a Weak Viral Virulence,” African Journal of Biotechnology, 8 (2009): 25. This would imply that, during an influenza pandemic, East Asians in Western countries should get special protection from the flu. Denying that race exists would simply put people in danger. All of these are poignant illustrations of why race is definitely not a “social construct” and a proper understanding of it is literally a matter of life and death.

Lewontin’s Fallacy

A more scientifically informed criticism of race can be found in the common criticism, “There are more differences within races than there are between them.” This is wheeled out with great profundity by biased scientists when interviewed in biased newspapers, without any references. It has come to be known as “Lewontin’s Fallacy,” named after biologist Richard Lewontin (b.1929), who argued that 85 percent of human genetic differences are due to individual variation, and only 15 percent due to differences between populations and ethnic groups; ergo, “there are more difference within races than between them.”

This fallacy can be easily dispatched. The sheer number of differences is less important than the direction of the differences. If a variety of small differences all push in the same direction—which they will in the case of subspecies evolved to different ecologies— then this can add up to significant overall differences between average members of different races.[12]Gregory Cochran and Henry Harpending, The 10,000 Year Explosion: How Civilization Accelerated Human Evolution (New York: Basic Books, 2009).

British biologist A.W.F. Edwards presented a systematic critique of Lewontin’s argument (along the way, coining the phrase “Lewontin’s Fallacy”).[13]A.W.F. Edwards, “Human Genetic Diversity: Lewontin’s Fallacy,” BioEssays, 25 (2003): 798-801. He noted that Lewontin simply looked at a small number of genetic loci and found that, indeed, 85 percent of human variation was due to individual differences. However, argues Edwards, if you look at lots of loci, then you will find these loci correlate differently in different groups, due to gene frequency differences, leading to very different results. Indeed, this leads to races being very different in numerous predictable ways, rendering “race” a scientific category. Edwards pointed out that, using Lewontin’s logic, we wouldn’t be able to distinguish between different tree structures, because these differences are hidden in the correlational data, just as race differences are. But using only genetic data, scientists were able to correctly highlight 15 forms of tree structure. As Edwards notes, Lewontin’s argument could only work if each of the genetic loci highlighted were randomly distributed between races, but it is in the very nature of races—being adaptations to different ecologies—that genes are not randomly distributed. Thus, Lewontin presents us—albeit wrapped up in abstruse scientific language—with nothing more than a circular argument.

To make matters worse, the loci which Lewontin used do not vary substantially between races. He used markers such as blood-type, and, as anthropologist Peter Frost has noted, these are “not particularly selectively important. . . . [W]hen genes vary within a population, despite similar selection pressures, it’s usually because they have little or no selective value.”[14]Peter Frost, “Lewontin’s Fallacy?” Evo and Proud, July 31, 2008, http:// evoandproud.blogspot.com/2008/06/lewontins-fallacy.html (accessed May 15, 2020). When methods were used with markers that do vary between races, such as craniometric variation and skin color, it was found that 81 percent of the variation is between races.[15]John H. Relethford, “Apportionment of Global Human Genetic Diversity Based on Craniometrics and Skin Color,” American Journal of Physical Anthropology, 118 (2002): 393-398. Lewontin, therefore, only uncovered the findings he did by using genetic loci that aren’t especially relevant to regional evolution—despite evolution to different regions being the essence of race. So, Lewontin’s argument is a kind of sleight of hand.[16]Nathan Cofnas, “Science Is Not Always ‘Self-Correcting’: Fact–Value Conflation and the Study of Intelligence.” Foundational Science, 21 (2015): 477-492. What he is actually proclaiming is this: When you use genetic loci that are distributed very similarly in all races, and in which there is much variation within races due to these loci not being very important to selection to different ecologies, then there are, indeed, more differences within races than between them. He hardly disproved the reality of race.

We’re All 99% The Same

In recent years, an argument against race has arisen that is much like the Lewontin fallacy: “Science has proven that every individual is more than 99 percent identical to every other.” This meme of “99%” was introduced at the turn of the century by none other than the Human Genome Project.[17]Eric S. Lander, John Sulston, Robert H. Waterston, et al., “Initial Sequencing and Analysis of the Human Genome,” Nature, 4 (2001): 860–921.

On the individual level, tiny genetic differences (humans only differ by 0.0012 percent on average) have important consequences, and it is highly misleading to downplay them. The genetic differences in heritable musical ability between a professional musician and Mozart are probably rather small, but they are obviously profound. Moreover, on the level of species, humans share a remarkable amount of genetic similarity (upwards of 98 percent) with our closest evolutionary relative, the chimpanzee. We even share much in common with other animals, like pigs and dogs. Clearly, small differences can have dramatic physical, psychological, and behavioral effects. And no one is willing to assert that since humans and chimpanzees are “98% the same,” we should not make distinctions between the two.

The Concept of Race Makes Me Uncomfortable

Another argument—and there are many versions of it—amounts to an appeal to emotion, in which a person essentially argues that “race” makes him feel unhappy. All that can be said is that this is manifestly fallacious and thus should be dismissed out of hand. How you feel is irrelevant to whether or not something is true. If being told that you have a rare blood disorder makes you feel unhappy, does that mean that it is not true or that you shouldn’t be told about it?

On a deeper level, we should understand that science is fundamentally amoral. It is about the relentless search for the objective truth. New scientific discoveries almost always offended some vested interest or other. This is why the kind of scientists who tend to make really important discoveries—so-called “geniuses”— seem to combine outlier high IQ with moderately low Agreeableness (altruism and empathy) and moderately low Conscientiousness (impulse control, rule following). This means that they can “think outside the box,” not bound by conventional rules—maybe they even take pleasure in slaughtering sacred cows. It also means that they either don’t care about offending people or they are sufficiently high on the “autism spectrum” that they wouldn’t be able to anticipate offending people even if they did care.[18]Dean K. Simonton, “Varieties of (Scientific) Creativity: A Hierarchical Model of Domain-Specific Disposition, Development, and Achievement.” Perspectives on Psychological Science, 4 (2009): 5.

If You Are Interested in “Race,” Then You Are Probably “Racist”

This criticism—that discussing race is “racist”—amounts to a so-called “fact-value conflation.” That a person presents something as being a “fact” has no bearing at all on his “values.” Facts are value-neutral. If a doctor tells you that you only have a week to live, does that mean he wants you to die? Furthermore, we should probably be, at the very least, suspicious of those who regularly employ the word “racist.” The first recorded use of the word “racist” was in 1932, with “racism” first observed in 1928. These terms gradually came to replace “racialist,” which was first recorded in 1910, and “racialism,” first noted in 1882.[19]Online Etymological Dictionary, “Racist,” https://www.etymonline.com/word/ racist (accessed May 15, 2020). In 1928, “racism” meant the belief that each “race” (meaning “ethnic group”) should have their own state and that civic society was optimal if states were racially based.[20]Ibid.
(Online Etymological Dictionary, “Racist,” https://www.etymonline.com/word/ racist (accessed May 15, 2020).)
“Racialism” referred to prejudices against other races and the belief that one’s own race was superior.

ORDER IT NOW

In the wake of World War II, “racist” gradually came to mean what “racialist” had once meant.[21]Robert Miles, Racism (London: Routledge, 1989). However, the term “racist” has been extended far beyond this, to refer to anybody who is seen to deviate from ideological orthodoxy with regard to the issue of race. Terming such a person the “racist” associates him with that which is accepted as somehow evil and immoral. As this association is damaging, the term “racist” is an emotionally manipulative means of keeping people on the “correct” ideological path. In other words, it is an ad hominem criticism. The essence of the accusation is that the subject has strayed sufficiently far from orthodoxy that he is immoral; he is a heretic. There are many terms of this kind. As English historian Alexandra Walsham summarizes, in her analysis of Early Modern religious non-conformity in England, the accusation of “atheist” was “available for the expression and repression of disquiet about ‘aberrant’ mental and behavioral tendencies—for the reinforcement and restatement of theoretical norms.” Both “atheist” and “papist” were “categories of deviance to which individuals who were even marginally departed from the prescribed ideals might be assimilated and thereby reproved.”[22]Alexandra Walsham, Church Papists: Catholicism, Conformity, and Confessional Polemic in Early Modern England (Woodbridge: The Boydell Press, 1999), 108.

There is simply no logical reason to reject the concept of race, and there are very persuasive reasons to accept it as what it is—a scientific category. On this basis, one should be rather guarded about the motives of those who refuse to accept it, who resort to name-calling and obfuscation, or who are mired in the contradictions and incoherence.

Notes

[1] Jefferson M. Fish, ed., Race and Intelligence (Mahwah, NJ: Lawrence Erlbaum, 2011)

[2] Lord Acton, Stanley Mordaunt Leathes, Sir Adolphus William Ward, and G. W. Prothero, eds., Cambridge Modern History, vol. 2 (Cambridge: University of Cambridge Press, 1902).

[3] Online Etymology Dictionary (2019), “Mean,” https://www.etymonline.com/ word/mean (accessed May 15, 2020).

[4] Sandish Shoker, “The Health System’s Struggle to Get More Black and Asian Donors,” BBC News, July 4, 2015, https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england- nottinghamshire-33101610 (accessed May 15, 2020)

[5] Susanne Bejerot and Mats Humble, “Inhabitants of Swedish-Somali Origin Are at Great Risk for Covid-19,” British Medical Journal, 368 (2020): m1101.

[6] Lucio Luzatto, “Sickle Cell Anaemia and Malaria,” Mediterranean Journal of Hematology and Infectious Diseases, 4(1) (2012): e2012065.

[7] Brian P. O’Sullivan and Steven D. Freedman, “Cystic Fibrosis,” Lancet, 373 (2009): 1891–1904.

[8] Joanne K. Tobacman, “Does Deficiency of Arylsulfatase B Have a Role in Cystic Fibrosis?” Chest, 123 (2003): 2130–2139.

[9] Emma Pomeroy, Veena Mushrif-Tripathy, Tim J. Cole, et al., “Ancient Origins of Low Lean Mass Among South Asians and Implications for Modern Type 2 Diabetes Susceptibility,” Scientific Reports, 9 (2019): 10515.

[10] Office of the Ministry of Health, Monthly Bulletin of the Ministry of Health (1954), 173.

[11] C. L. Chen, Li Xiao, Y-P. Zhou, et al., “Ethnic Differences in Susceptibilities to A(H1N1) Flu: An Epidemic Parameter Indicating a Weak Viral Virulence,” African Journal of Biotechnology, 8 (2009): 25.

[12] Gregory Cochran and Henry Harpending, The 10,000 Year Explosion: How Civilization Accelerated Human Evolution (New York: Basic Books, 2009).

[13] A.W.F. Edwards, “Human Genetic Diversity: Lewontin’s Fallacy,” BioEssays, 25 (2003): 798-801.

[14] Peter Frost, “Lewontin’s Fallacy?” Evo and Proud, July 31, 2008, http:// evoandproud.blogspot.com/2008/06/lewontins-fallacy.html (accessed May 15, 2020).

[15] John H. Relethford, “Apportionment of Global Human Genetic Diversity Based on Craniometrics and Skin Color,” American Journal of Physical Anthropology, 118 (2002): 393-398.

[16] Nathan Cofnas, “Science Is Not Always ‘Self-Correcting’: Fact–Value Conflation and the Study of Intelligence.” Foundational Science, 21 (2015): 477-492.

[17] Eric S. Lander, John Sulston, Robert H. Waterston, et al., “Initial Sequencing and Analysis of the Human Genome,” Nature, 4 (2001): 860–921.

[18] Dean K. Simonton, “Varieties of (Scientific) Creativity: A Hierarchical Model of Domain-Specific Disposition, Development, and Achievement.” Perspectives on Psychological Science, 4 (2009): 5.

[19] Online Etymological Dictionary, “Racist,” https://www.etymonline.com/word/ racist (accessed May 15, 2020).

[20] Ibid.

[21] Robert Miles, Racism (London: Routledge, 1989).

[22] Alexandra Walsham, Church Papists: Catholicism, Conformity, and Confessional Polemic in Early Modern England (Woodbridge: The Boydell Press, 1999), 108.

 
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  1. ANZ says:

    Funny how evolutionary theory was pushed by the department of education when it suited there needs. I remember that there was pushback from Christians against having to teach evolution in classroom. It was seen as a seditious and evil ideology because it went against the Christian/Jewish creation story.

    Now the tables have turned. When you apply basic Darwinian principles to the human species, existn de of races become undeniable. However, this goes against the new dogma of the church of wokeness. Will the department of education be pressured to scrap evolution from curricula?

    More over, Christians. There’s a new god in town. And he/she/it they are gender fluid dark-skinned ubermenschen.

  2. Element59 says:

    The anti-racists and the racial egalitarians are today faced with a mounting crisis: A profound dearth of hard scientific evidence to support their environmentalist positions. Social constructionism theory has significant limitations in explaining, let alone predicting, a wide range of racial disparities using the scientific method as we know it.

    This all reminds me of the infamous 1989 Rushton-Suzuki debate, when in Rushton’s rebuttal to Suzuki’s blistering opening condemnations of Rushton and his r/K theory of human population differences, Rushton directly asks Suzuki:

    “Why is it Dr. Suzuki, that Oriental women double ovulate less often than Caucasian women? Why is it that Oriental children take longer to walk than Caucasian children? Why do Oriental students score higher than Caucasians on IQ tests?”

    Suzuki did not (could not) answer these direct questions, he conveniently ignored them. In the 30+ years that have now elapsed, no social constructionist researcher has dared attempt to falsify these phenotypic scientific findings between population groups with an environmental explanation – which should be easy to refute, scientifically, if the evidence for such biological claims is indeed false.

    • Agree: Franz
    • Replies: @Curle
    , @Chinaman
  3. @ANZ

    Funny how evolutionary theory was pushed by the department of education when it suited there needs.

    I don’t see a problem with the Theory of Evolution being taught to the kiddies in school.

    I do see a problem with this theory being indoctrinated into students as a fact.

    Similar to the dogmatic faith attached to the Big Bang Theory (itself founded upon the Red Shift Theory), apparently universally accepted in educational institutions as an indisputable historical fact.

    When you apply basic Darwinian principles to the human species, existn de of races become undeniable.

    The existence of races within the human species is self-evident. This reality hardly requires the application of “basic Darwinian principles” (whatever that might be).

    • Agree: RoatanBill
  4. Patriot says:

    RE: Races do not exist because of “racial intermediates”:

    Colors do not exist, because of “color intermediates” between so-called colors.
    For example, the fact that orange exists, proves that red and yellow are not distinct colors. Likewise, green, disproves that yellow and blue exist. Hence, none of the “distinct” colors actually exist.

    Same for black vs. White. They don’t exist, as shown by grey, and all the beautiful shades of grey inbetween socalled black and white.

    Both “race” and “color” only exist in the minds of racists, who invented races and colors as a way to keep other races and POC down and to sell “art” and cars.

    Abolish colorism now!
    Not in our town!
    Burn crayons!!!
    Abolish art departments and museums! !!
    Tear down statues of past artists, burn their art!!!!
    All colors are equal!!
    Make laws demanding that ALL the socalled colors are used/displayed equally in our society!!
    Teach children that it is wrong to prefer one color over another. ALL COLORS ARE EQUAL!!!
    STOP THE HATE!!!

  5. As a proud member of the Somali race, I agree, races exist. Every Somali in the West is partially suffering from mental illness for not being among his or kin back home.

  6. joe2.5 says:

    Thank you for the clear and systematic thinking; also congratulations on the somatic-medical competence in describing assumed or proven, genetically-determined medical problems.
    [If I may, there is one non-relevant detail that needs correction: “non- Europeans were much more likely to be deficient due to their darker skin, leaving them less able to absorb Vitamin D from the sun.[5]” In fact, 7-dehydrocholesterol, mainly in the skin, is not absorbed but transformed to Vitamin D3 with the help of UV light (D2 is a plant product.) For a good summary see https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3968073/ ]

    • Thanks: Bert
  7. –Is “race” an outmoded, morally dubious idea that was deservedly cast into the dustbin of history, along with Stalinism, astrology, and blood-letting? Many say so.–

    A hysterical(and tiresome) argument used by the Thought Police so many times. Of course, the problem with such line of argument is everything has a dark side. After all, capitalism did much harm as well as good. Nuclear science led to wonders but also destruction of cities. Socialism can mean anything from radical communism of the Khmer Rouge to the welfare state(a fact of life in all modern societies). So, if critics of race argue that racial ideas may lead to great harm, most of us would concur. But this is true of anything. Without fire, there is no civilization. But fire has also burned down entire cities. Same with water. Without rain we are dead, but floods are dangerous.

    So, we need to be cautious with ideas. The problem isn’t so much the concept of race per se as the radicalization of racial science into hardline ideology, as with National Socialism. (Indeed, if Adolf Hitler and his followers were more like Benito Mussolini, who was less into racial ideology than the ‘democratic’ Anglos were, the horrors of Nazism could have been avoided.) Socialism need not be khmer-rouge-ism, and racial knowledge need not lead us to something like National Socialism(or the more extreme forms of Zionism). The real danger is not socialism or racialism(or race-ism) but radicalization of any idea. This even goes for democracy. Radical Democratism has led to 21st century wars that destroyed millions of lives, especially in the Middle East and North Africa. The US, by invoking ‘muh democracy’ at every turn, has justified its despicable and murderous acts of neo-imperialism. Radicalism is extremism, moral narcissism, and moral puritanism. “I am so very right, you are so very wrong” or “If you’re not with us, you’re against us.”
    So, the problem isn’t race-ism per se but radical racism. (By race-ism, I mean belief in the reality of race and racial differences. Ism means belief, and race + ism should mean belief in the reality of race. To emphasize the -ism element of the term, the dash[-] is used: Race-ism. It is not to be confused with ‘racism’ that is usually meant to mean racial hatred and supremacism, esp of the white kind.) When we consider most ideas, we don’t automatically obsess over the most extreme manifestation. So, ‘socialism’ doesn’t mean Stalinism or Maoism. Those are forms of radical socialism, but most forms of socialism haven’t been extreme. Likewise, when we say ‘capitalism’, we don’t mean the most extreme kind of libertarian plutocracy with no protections for workers and the poor.
    And yet, when it comes to the matter of race, people automatically jump to conclusions and assume it’s about extreme hatred, mass repression, and mass murder. Of course, it has a lot to do with Jewish control of media and narrative. Indeed, the discussion of race is not unlike the discussion of Jewish Power. For example, even the slightest noticing and criticism of Jewish Power is denounced as ‘antisemitism’. So, if you notice Jewish Power and its abuses, you are automatically a ‘Nazi’. You are to be denounced, that is unless you get on your knees and roll over like a dog. On some issues, taboos dominate the discourse in the West. This is where Reason and Enlightenment Values break down. While we can be rational and honest on most things, we must suspend our reason, skepticism, and critical faculties on certain matters, especially if they’re ‘triggering’ to Jews, blacks, and homos. Their FEELINGS count for more than demonstrable facts. Blacks are the most violent and murderous, but the Taboo says we must get on our knees and bawl about BLM.

    –(Anti-racists insist) there is no clear way to divide different races. They merge into each other, with great variation in-between. A version of this argument is that there is no specific gene that is found only in one specific race. It can be countered that races are, of course, not entirely discrete categories because, if they were, they would be more like species, or perhaps genera, families, or orders on up the taxonomic scale.–

    It is so obvious but PC follows its own twisted logic. We all know race is not species. Races are differences within a single species. Also, different species exist only because different races evolved into different species. If races don’t exist, species cannot exist. For example, take the common ancestors of (1) the apes that became the chimps and (2) the apes that became humans. At one time, there were no separate species of humans and chimps. Their deep ancestors belonged to the same species of ape. But within that species, groups went separate ways and they began to diverge gradually. For a long time, there were merely different races of the same ape species. But little by little, the differences accumulated, and something resembling separate species arose. One branch became the chimpanzee and the other branch became the ape that eventually evolved into humanhood. In other words, a species cannot suddenly split into new separate species. Rather, groups within it can gradually diverge and change. This process is race-ization. For a long time, the emerging races still belong within the same species. But over prolonged periods, especially in extreme geological separation from one another, they can evolve into separate species.
    This is true of mankind as well. If human races were to remain separate for another million years, they could evolve into different species. Evolution has proven this to be the case. For now, all human races belong to one species. But they have developed different characteristics, and there is a chance that they could evolve into separate species in the next 100,000 or million years. At any rate, if race isn’t real, then species isn’t real. Any organism, in order to evolve into a new species, must first evolve into different races(within the species). Consider tigers and lions. At one time, they had a common ancestor. It’s not like this common ancestor suddenly split into species tiger and species lion. Instead, it began to diverge into different races of itself. One race eventually became the tiger, and the other race eventually became the lion. They began as different races but eventually became different species.

    Also, mixed-race people can exist ONLY BECAUSE there are different races. After all, there can’t be mulattos in a world that is all-white or all-black. There can’t be mestizos in a world that is all white or all brown. Those mixed-breeds came into existence ONLY BECAUSE different races interbred. If we mix apple juice with grape juice, the mixture exists only because apple juice and grape juice existed in the first place. It would be stupid to deny the reality of apple juice and grape juice because a mixture exists. If anything, the mixture proves the existence of the other two.

    [MORE]

    –Even if it were true that no unambiguous line can be drawn between races, this does not undermine the utility of race. The line between Grizzly bears and Brown bears is blurry, too—but you still know one when you see one and making distinctions between these subspecies is meaningful.–

    Brown Bears and Grizzlies are not a good example. They are nearly indistinguishable. Generally, grizzlies are a bit smaller than brown bears, but they are almost the same. A better example is brown bears and polar bears. Though considered as separate species, they are actually different races of bears if we use the Rule of Fertility. Horses and donkeys are separate species because their offspring, the mule, is infertile. Likewise, a lion and leopard can mate and produce offspring but it is infertile. In contrast, the offspring of a polar bear and brown bear, like the offspring of members of different human races, is fertile. Therefore, polar bear and brown bear are really separate races within the same species. But who can deny the differences between the brown bear and polar bear? Just because hybrid bears exist doesn’t mean that the differences between brown bears and polar bears are meaningless, insignificant, or negligible. Also, contact between those races of bears usually means more danger to the polar bears. Though polar bears are equal in size and weight, brown bears are built more sturdily and are more aggressive. So, in most encounters, polar bears lose out and take ‘white flight’ from the brown bears. (For a long time, scientists believed Neanderthals to be a different species of humans, but recent DNA studies show that 5% of European DNA is Neanderthal. That means the offspring of Cro-Magnons and Neanderthals were fertile, and that means Neanderthals were another race of humans. But, the differences between Neanderthals and other humans were significant.) Another useful example comprise wolves, coyotes, and dogs. Like human races and polar/brown bears, wolves, coyotes, and dogs can mate and produce fertile offspring. That means, from a scientific viewpoint, they all belong to the same species. But should we ignore the very real differences among wolves, coyotes, and many breeds of dogs simply because various mutts and mongrels exist among them? Only a fool would say so. The fact is coyotes are no match for wolves in combat, and wolves can demolish any dog, just like a pitbull can demolish a beagle(just like a Nigerian can demolish any Briton or Japanese). A coyote that ignores the threat posed by wolves because a weasel tells it, “Hey, don’t be racist as if wolves are different and pose a danger” is a dead coyote.

    –Some say that race is illegitimate or immoral because it is steeped in Western history (and thus things like slavery and oppression), as well as the supposedly myopic and suffocating outlook of “Western science.” But this same argument could be made about almost any concept—including the ones that supposedly undermine or overcome Western hegemony… If race is “problematic” because it’s Western, then, presumably, we cannot use Western concepts at all to analyze anything non-Western.–

    Very true. Chemistry and physics are also Western Concepts. So, does that mean the world should reject medicine resulting from Western chemistry? Should people deny the laws of physics discovered by Western Scientists? Is atomic power just an illusion steeped in ‘western bias’? The West developed the scientific method, and that meant it was applied to just about everything. As humans are part of biological reality, a scientific view led to categorizations of race.
    Now, were all ideas associated with race valid? No, but that could be said of any scientific field. So many medical ideas once accepted as true turned out to be false. Physicists once speculated outer space was filled with ether. Science improves with more observation, testing, trials, and experiments. But in order for it to improve, there must be more truth, integrity, and honesty. There is no question that National Socialists misconceived and misapplied racial theories. Indeed, they were less interested in the science of race than in the ideology of race. Hitler and his cohorts(and the favored partisan hack scientists) insisted on the Correct Theory of Race that put ‘Aryans’ at the center. If they were truly interested in racial science, they would have allowed debate, but they didn’t. Aryanism became the national mythos of Germany. It was not unlike the concept of Chosen-ness among Jews except that it was explained in scientistic terms. Likewise, Marxism was less a rational economic theory than a prophecy. While claiming to be ‘materialist’ and ‘scientific’, it had more in common with Judeo-Christian vision of apocalypse and redemption. Communism was secular-christianity, and fascism was neo-paganism. Marxism was a form of scientism than real science. But as science gained prestige, all sides claimed to have ‘science’ on their side. Indeed, even Creationists play that game. They are allied with Intelligent-Design people who argue that one can ‘scientifically’ prove the existence of the supreme being behind the cosmos. Even more crude forms of Creationism pretend to ‘scientifically’ explain how mankind once lived alongside dinosaurs by pointing to ‘archaeological’ evidence. And Sigmund Freud insisted that his theory of sexuality was purely scientific when it had more to do with speculation, personal hang-ups, and resentment toward goy society.

    At any rate, the fake/flawed radical racial ‘science’ of the National Socialists wasn’t supplanted by true, rational, and improved science but by the fake/flawed radical anti-racial ‘science’ of Jewish Deracinators. It was out of the frying pan into the fire. The world went from false racial science to false anti-racial science. It went from one radical certainty to another. It was like going from a crazy pseudo-scientific argument that one should eat ONLY meat to another pseudo-scientific argument that one should eat NO meat. How about a truly scientific dietary plan that argues for meat, grains, and vegetables?

    Now, given World War II and the Shoah, there is no doubt that the radical racism of the National Socialists did great harm. And we can understand why people became freaked out about race. But the radical anti-racism since World War II(which especially accelerated in the 1960s)has also done great harm. Mass migration of non-whites into the West will surely lead to the fall of Western Civilization. And lack of white defenses against blacks will lead to racial doom for white folks. Europeans Europeanize, Africans Africanize. If Europe fills up with Africans, it will be Africanized like the Dark Continent(or Detroit).

    Consider the Jesse Owens and Joe Louis Narratives. They are often invoked to discredit the notion of ‘Aryan Supremacy’. You see, blacks beat the ‘Aryans’, and that means Nazi ‘racism’ was all nonsense. But that is only one side of the coin. Did Owens and Louis’ achievements prove that races are equal? They would have IF Louis fought Schmeling to a draw and if Owens finished in a tie with the ‘Aryan’ sprinters. But in fact, Louis destroyed Schmeling, and Owens beat the white runners by a considerable margin. So, even if their achievements blew ‘Aryan supremacism'(in athleticism) out of the water, they demonstrated the fact of black athletic superiority.
    What is the social implication of this? Tougher blacks can beat up whites. And in Europe, the racial violence is usually black on white, just like in the US and Brazil. That means blacks end up feeling contempt for white wussy weaklings. That means white males are robbed of manhood. It means white women become infected with jungle fever. BAMMAMA(blacks are more more muscular and more aggressive) leads to ACOWW(Afro-Colonization of White Wombs). It means total sexual triumph of blacks over whites. White males turn into pathetic cucks who watch their women go over to blacks who not only have tougher muscles but bigger dongs. (But then, the very people who say race is false and that ‘we all bleed red’ are also saying whites should import more blacks because blacks are so awesome in song, strong, and dong. So many Jewish-funded movies, TV shows, and advertising are predicated on Jungle Fever that says white women should reject white men and go with black men because the latter are superior in manhood. Go figure. They say one thing but show another. They say ‘race is not real’ but show ‘look at the big muscular Negro with the big dong compared to that flabby wussy maggoty white boy’. The ideology is ‘anti-racist’ but the idolatry is totally ‘racist’ in favor of blacks uber whites.)

    It’s also been said that German science suffered due to the exile of Jewish scientists during the National Socialist era. But if all races and human groups are the same, why was it a loss for Germany and a gain for the US when Jewish scientists went from one nation to the other? It was a loss for Germany and gain for the US only if Jews are smarter and superior at scientific research. That would imply group differences are true, or at least true enough.

    Now, there is a kernel of truth in the denunciation of Western bias in the science of ‘race’. While it’s true that virtually everything related to modern science, math, medicine, and technology emerged from the West, the non-human endeavors surely got a more objective treatment than human-related ones. Even today, hard sciences are more scientific than social sciences(that are never fully devoid of tribal or ideological bias). Now, there were examples of ideological bias in hard science as well, e.g. National Socialist science that denied the physics theories of Jewish physicists and Lysenko-ism in the USSR.
    Still, generally speaking, when it comes to hard science, the West transcends the West, i.e. the objective is to arrive at the truth, not to trump the specialness of any people, nation, or civilization. When a German chemist or physicist works on a project, he is seeking the truth, not waving the banner of German pride. Thus, even though modern science developed in the West, it goes beyond culture and race. The scientific method can be used by any nation or people.
    But the topic of race, even under scientific scrutiny, was never entirely empirical or objective. Rather, many racial scientists had ideological agenda or something to prove. And this has been the case in other nations as well. Chinese, for example, long insisted that they evolved from Peking Man than some group that emerged from Africa. Japanese racial ‘scientists’ insisted there is something ‘unique’ about the Japanese. Much of this is closer to mysticism than science. Jewish anthropologist Jared Diamond has argued against race but says DNA studies can identify who is really Jewish and who isn’t. Humans can be objective about lots of things but not themselves. They are too vain, too proud, too anxious, and/or too much at competition with, dominant over, or servile to other races to be totally objective. Take the controversy of “Were Ancient Egyptians black?” By the American one-drop rule, many Ancient Egyptians could be said to have been black. But as they were more Caucasian than Negroid, one could argue they were more ‘white’. Or, are Jews more ‘Semitic’ or ‘European’? Even Jews are confused about this.

    Still, if there was a Western Bias in racial science in the past, the proper way forward is to be rid of those biases and approach race more scientifically than to throw the baby out with the bathwater and pretend the very concept of race is untrue. But then, was anti-racism really sincere? I don’t think so. Deep down inside, many Jews surely believed in race and only pretended it didn’t exist because racial thinking might probe into differences among whites, blacks, Jews, and others that might prove to be inconvenient for Jewish Power. After all, even as Jews took pride in having higher IQ over goyim, their fear was that goyim might realize this and begin to resent Jews for their superior intelligence that leads to more wealth and power, which could be used by Jews to boost Jewish Power at the expense of white interests. The fact that Jews insist on the abolishment of white identity all the while insisting that whites revere, support, and lionize Jewish Identity & Power gives the game away. But white cuckery has become so ingrained in the white psyche that whites are in habitual denial of what is really going on. Take the recent election debacle. Jews are most responsible for the Crazy 2020, but most conservatives are blaming China, China, China, a secondary player if that in the fall of White America. Denial of racial differences in IQ is also useful to Jews in perpetuating ‘white guilt’ & white submission and in directing black rage at whites. If it were known that black failure in education and economic achievement owes to genetic factors, whites would feel less guilty about their history. Fading of white guilt would mean it’d be harder for Jews to guilt-bait whites into seeking redemption by sucking up to Jews(and blacks and homos). Also, if blacks realized they’re on the bottom due to lower IQ while Jews are on top due to higher IQ, blacks would be most envious and resentful of Jews. So, it is advantageous to Jews to blame black failure on white ‘racism’ and to keep blacks hating whites above all.

    –While the history of words is interesting, the fact that the meaning of words change over time is simply irrelevant to our purposes here. We are clear that by “race” we mean breeding populations separated in prehistory and adapted to different environments.–

    True enough as ‘gay’ can mean happy or homosexual, but still, maybe it’s useful to come up with a new term. As races developed through genetic changes over geographical distances, maybe racial science should be called geo-netics or geonetics. And maybe ‘geon’ should be used for ‘race’.

    –Another supposed problem with race is that developing the concept leads to bad consequences.–

    How about we denounce Zionism because it led to bad consequences for Palestinians? Also, if race is a relatively recent idea(and a toxic one at that), could it be said human history was more pleasant in the pre-race eras? Bantus didn’t have a concept of race, but they sure butchered a lot of people all across Africa. Maybe the Mongols didn’t think in terms of race, but they sure could conquer, pillage, and kill. Maybe the Conquistadors lacked the scientific notion of race, but they should committed many horrors in the Americas. And before them, the Aztecs could be cruel as hell.
    In contrast, the Anglos were profoundly mindful of race and racial differences, but one could make a strong case that they did most to advance mankind as a whole. Didn’t Anglos do more for their colonies than the less race-minded Spanish and the French for their colonies? And didn’t Anglo enslavement of blacks lead to more advancement for blacks than enslavements under Arabs and other Africans who presumably didn’t think in terms of race? So, one fallacy could be countered with another. If Political Correctness says, “The concept of race is evil because of all the bad things done in its name”, it could be countered, “The concept of race is good because Anglos, the most racial-minded of all imperialists, did most to advance and lift up mankind.” Was it better for blacks to come under Arab rule or Anglo rule? Who did better in the Americas? Blacks who lived under Anglo-American power or blacks who under less-racially minded Spanish/Portuguese power? Anglos were more ‘racist’ toward the Chinese than the Mongols were. It’s doubtful the Mongols called the Chinese ‘chinks’ since they were also a slanty-eyed people, but China achieved more under Anglo intrusion than under Mongol rule. Of course, such line of argument is fallacious but no more than the anti-racist school of thought that seeks to discredit all notions of race because some radical racists did bad things.

    Another thing. Anti-racism can be used to justify imperialism. After all, if races are all the same, it wouldn’t make a difference if People A invade and rape People B. After all, they are all the same. Chinese are taking over Tibet and push ‘anti-racism’. They say Chinese and Tibetans are all brothers under the skin, and Tibetans should just mate with Chinese and become fellow Chinese. On the surface, this sounds humanitarian and ‘inclusive’, but it also means doom for Tibetans as the Han Chinese outnumber them by a huge margin. Latin American elites justify the history of conquest, rape, and domination on the premise that there is only ONE people in Mexico and South America. Supposedly, people don’t see ‘race’ because they are all equal and all mixed. But it totally ignores the fact that the indigenous brown peoples were invaded, raped, and dominated by another people. ‘Inclusion’ is often a justification for invasion.

    Another thing. Some anti-racists argue that race-mixing is beneficial. But if all races are the same, why would race-mixing be beneficial when all groups are the same under the skin? Either the PC-pushers are stupid and ignorant of their contradictions or they are mendacious and push for race-mixing with full knowledge that it will favor certain races over others. Interracism between whites and blacks, for example, favor blacks. Not only do mixed-race people identify as black, but it’s usually black male and white female. Black men sexually conquer white women while white men are relegated to cucky-wuck dork-hood.

    –Beyond that, it can be convincingly argued that suppressing the concept of race leads to very bad consequences. If a South Asian person has a kidney transplant and is given the kidney of a White person, then his body will likely reject it, elevating the possibility that the patient will die of kidney failure.–

    All very true, but that is a petty example. It’s about individuals and illness. No civilization ever went under because people died of disease. After all, Europe survived the Bubonic Plague and Spanish Flu. So, the medical argument for race is weak. The real danger of overlooking the issue of race is that the white race might not wake up to the black threat and Jewish threat. Blacks are superior in brawn, and Jews are superior in brain. So, when whites allow Jews and blacks to run wild and free, Jews will take over elite institutions/industries and use their power to weaken white identity and unity. And blacks will dominate sports and take over as the new idols of national prowess. Black athletes who destroy white British ones are hailed as National Champions, and that means white girls will grow up with jungle fever and white boys will be instilled with cuckitis. As whites come to celebrate blackness as ‘badass’ and ‘cool’, it will be deemed especially evil to have any doubts about blacks. And that means whites won’t be able to say NO to further black immigration-invasion. And this will mean more black crime and black violence against whites in the streets and schools. And that will mean the end of Europe. THAT is the real evil of anti-racism.
    However, the real danger of the Current West isn’t ideological anti-racism but idolatrous pro-racism in favor of blacks. Today, many whites welcome more black immigration not on the basis of equality of the races but superiority of blacks. Whites in UK and France revere blacks as sports champions, rappers, twerking mamas, and big-donged studs. And this idolatrous supremacy of blacks is disseminated all around the world. There are tons of black-centric advertising in Germany and Poland, even in Russia. Even Japan, so distant from Europe and Africa, is falling into the Jungaru Trap. Japanese women are whores who mate with blacks, and their kids are taking over Japanese sports, and Japanese elites, ever so servile to the West, are pushing for ‘Japan That Can Say Ho’.

    –“There are more differences within races than there are between them.” This is wheeled out with great profundity by biased scientists when interviewed in biased newspapers, without any references. It has come to be known as “Lewontin’s Fallacy,”–

    It’s a fallacy alright. Besides, how can there be differences within the race when race doesn’t exist in the first place? If race doesn’t exist, then the differences within and outside the ‘race’ would be the same.

    My take on Lewontin’s BS is simply this. Most people within any group are average and part of the norm. So, even if it may well be that the genetic difference between a retarded Japanese giant and a genius Japanese midget is greater than between an average Japanese and an average Nigerian, the fact is most Japanese are not genius midgets or retarded giants. If we were to randomly pick two Japanese, they would most likely be average. Same if we randomly pick two Nigerians. Most Japanese belong to the average norm, and same goes for Nigerians. Now, would two average Japanese be more different from one another than either of them is to an average Nigerian? No way. That’d be like saying there’s more difference between Woody Allen and Alan Dershowitz than between either of them and Mike Tyson or George Foreman. That’s total BS.

    –Another argument—and there are many versions of it—amounts to an appeal to emotion, in which a person essentially argues that “race” makes him feel unhappy.–

    This is, of course, BS and very selective. ‘Race’ is supposed to make people uncomfortable IF it is about the validity of white race-hood. It’s NOT OKAY to be white. But blacks feel most comfortable when they are going on and on about their blackness and black identity and blackity blackness. So, when black people claim to find ‘race’ problematic, they really mean not enough (positive)attention is being showered on them. How dare any time be spent discussing other races when it should be about blacks 24/7, sheeeeiiiiiit.
    And Jews are the same way. It’s Jewish this, Jewish that. And it’s not just about culture and history. After all, Jewishness isn’t just about religion or historical consciousness. Even atheist Jews are considered as fellow Jews. A Jew can be a Buddhist or even Christian, but he’s still a Jew and can live in Israel. Jews seem to have no problem with Zionism’s blood-based identity of what constitutes Jewishness. Indeed, Zionism will accept an atheist person of Jewish lineage while rejecting an African, Chinese, or Arab who is eager to convert to Jewishness.

    Also, the Holocaust has gone from an Anti-Racist Narrative — “We Jews were victims of German racial supremacism” — to a Neo-Racist Narrative: “Jewish Lives Matter More”. After all, the 20th century has seen tons of deaths, and Jews did their share of killing. But it seems 80% of all moral outrage has been devoted to the Shoah. Why? Do Jewish lives matter more? Are Jewish lives more precious? Are Jewish Lives so precious that it doesn’t matter when Jews kill millions of goyim, as in the communist horrors of the USSR? Anne Frank matters more than the millions of Ukrainian kids who died in the Great Famine? A Jewish life matters more than the 100,000s killed by AIPAC-driven US Wars for Israel and crippling sanctions? Jewish life is so precious that it’s okay for Jews to kill others, but one mustn’t harm a hair on a Jew. Madeleine Albright can say it’s worth killing 500,000 Arab kids, but damnation to anyone who hurts Jewish feelings.
    Thus, Holocaust Narrative has come to mean that Jewish Lives are more precious and matter more. Anything is justified to save Jewish lives, protect Jewish lives, and to favor Jewish lives. It’s like the insane logic of BLM. Nothing is spoken about black violence on non-blacks. Blacks commit tons of crimes. Black soldiers in US bases around the world are the top rapists. Black athletes in colleges commit most crime and rape. Blacks are top thugs. But the moral outrage is only about the rare black who dies at the hands of whites. Same dynamics operates in US and UK. Also, this moral burden is placed on white shoulders. So, even though blacks kill blacks by the bushel in Africa, it’s no big deal because blacks, being special, can do as they please among themselves. Blacks can be amoral and nihilistic, but that’s okay because they are blackity-black wonderful. So, the burden of caring about black well-being falls on whites, even when blacks make other black lives miserable. (If non-whites mess up their own nations, they can’t be expected to bear the burden of fixing their own problems. Rather, whites must bear the burden of providing sanctuary for them in white nations.) But then, when white cops do their job and try to minimize crime and violence in black areas, blacks howl about ‘racism’ and riot(often with encouragement from Jews). It’s damned if you do, damned if you don’t.
    So, when Jews and blacks say ‘race’ makes them feel uncomfortable, they really mean all the talk should be about the Jewish race or black race, all favorable. After all, if race is real and if all races matter, then Jews and blacks must share the moral space with other groups. But Jews and blacks want to hog all the space for the Jewish race and black race.

    Now, there are whites who feel uncomfortable about ‘race’, but why? Because their minds have been molded by Jews who control media, academia, and whore politicians/officials who spout PC nonsense 24/7. This discomfort isn’t natural but ideological. It’s been inculcated in their minds by nonstop anti-white propaganda and education. If Jews and blacks feel angry when the discussion veers into anything other than their own noble/soulful identities, whites have been made to feel disgust about any positive expression of white identity. But then, the very PC whites who can’t abide white racial identity have no problem babbling endlessly about how great the black race or Jewish people are. So, the question must be asked, “Why is racial supremacism great for Jews and blacks but mere racial identity is evil for whites?”

    –On a deeper level, we should understand that science is fundamentally amoral. It is about the relentless search for the objective truth.–

    But let’s be honest here. Racial science is never meant to be merely scientific, objective, or amoral. When we study the differences among wolves, coyotes, bears, cougars, birds, and etc., we can be detached and neutral(though some people may favor certain animals over others while others may be alarmed about invasive species that may upset existing eco-systems in the interest of preserving bio-diversity). No one in the HBD movement has been merely scientifically interested. They are usually white identitarians who root for their own kind. Even as they acknowledge certain genetic advantages among non-whites, they use those facts to argue for white well-being. Richard Spencer, for example, says it’s not good for US to take in high-IQ Indians and Chinese as they might become the over-class over whites. Others admit that blacks are athletically superior, and THAT is the reason against ‘inclusion’ of blacks in white spaces. Tougher blacks will terrorize and wussify the whites, just like Mongol Wrestlers made a mockery of Japan’s sacred fatty sport of Sumo.
    So, while science itself is amoral, its uses and purpose is always moral or tribal or political. The physics behind the nuclear bomb is amoral, but the Bomb was used for reasons that biased one group against another. The dynamics of evolution is amoral, but every organism works to maximize its own survival and dominance. Indeed, why do we look into the science of race? After all, science can be used to look into just about anything. But we ignore most things and focus mostly on those that matter most to our survival, well-being, happiness, and power. The science of race is all-important because there are obvious problems in the West, and the most serious ones cannot be understood apart from race. Jewish brain power and black brawn power can only be understood in terms of racial differences. Power decides history, and racial differences profoundly affect power dynamics among various groups.

    –This is why the kind of scientists who tend to make really important discoveries—so-called “geniuses”— seem to combine outlier high IQ with moderately low Agreeableness (altruism and empathy) and moderately low Conscientiousness (impulse control, rule following). This means that they can “think outside the box,” not bound by conventional rules—maybe they even take pleasure in slaughtering sacred cows.–

    But then, why is the scientific community so PC and craven? While certain scientists may be like William Shockley or James Watson, most are smart enough to know that they must play the game. Also, even though they think outside the box, they work within the box of specialization. Thus narrowly focused, they outsource their social diplomacy to others. Take Mark Zuckerberg and Bill Gates. Maybe deep down inside, they know more than they let on, but as super-geeks, they are savvy enough to hire public relations and parrot the party line. Or take Craig Venter, the guy involved with DNA studies. He surely knows about race but pushed the PC line to keep his position.

    Now, there may be people who are so aspergish that they can’t help spouting off inconvenient views. Even with public relations department all around them, they can’t help muttering things that are bound to offend people(especially in a time when people are conditioned to feel ‘offended’ or ‘triggered’ by just about anything, now known as ‘micro-aggressions’). But such people are hardly inspirational, and their views are narrowly focused on one thing or another. They don’t offer the big vision. This was the case with James Watson. He narrowly focused on black IQ and despaired of the future of Africa. But he failed to construct and deliver a larger message about what black failure means to the West, especially with massive black migration to Europe. He also failed to address the Jewish Question at the heart of PC and anti-whiteness. After all, Jewish Intelligence may be even more fatal to the West because, despite being smart and genuinely capable, Jews use their amassed power and privilege to subvert and destroy the pillars of white power. Blacks degrade society because they are underachievers, but Jews degrade society by over-achieving and using their vast fortunes/power to subvert goy civilizations out of revenge, resentment, paranoia, or just plain nastiness that they revel in. Now, had James Watson gone further in his critique, he would have gotten into more trouble, but it would have been inspirational and earth-shaking. He would have spoken like a prophet. But he talked about race only as a geek, and just like a geek, he cowered under pressure. Aspergy types may say inconvenient stuff but lack the balls to see it through when pushed back. (Bobby Fischer was an exception though, to be sure, he went off the deep end.)

    Also, high IQ types don’t make good leaders for the people. They live in a world of their own. They don’t feel much camaraderie with the dummies and morons who make us most of humanity. When they go on and on about IQ, they favor the meritocracy of the best and brightest regardless of race. They are for the natural aristocracy. Take the lunatic Michio Kaku. He feels nothing for the Japanese. He feels nothing for most Americans. He just thinks the dummy masses should work and consume and pay taxes so that geniuses like him can advance science to the point where humanity can merge with artificial intelligence and become ‘gods’. So, even though aspergy types may sometimes go off-script, they offer nothing to inspire the masses or the volk. They are too narrowly focused than broadly aligned with ‘my people’.

    –In the wake of World War II, “racist” gradually came to mean what “racialist” had once meant.[21] However, the term “racist” has been extended far beyond this, to refer to anybody who is seen to deviate from ideological orthodoxy with regard to the issue of race. Terming such a person the “racist” associates him with that which is accepted as somehow evil and immoral.–

    No, following WWII, ‘racist’ came to mean ‘bigot’, ‘white supremacist’, ‘hater’, or some loon. It was never meant to be synonymous with ‘racialist’. The problem with the term ‘racist’ is it makes a mockery of the meaning of -ism. As -ism means belief, race + ism should mean belief in the reality of race. So, how did race + ism come to automatically mean racial hatred, racial supremacism, racial bigotry, and etc? Imagine if ‘socialism’ automatically means Stalinism or Maoism. It would be toxic. Socialism at its radical extremes can mean Stalinism or Maoism, but the generic meaning of socialism means some degree of statist role for collective interests. Thus, even social-democracy can be deemed socialist. And fascism too.

    But precisely because generic race + ism has been defined as racial extremism(especially of white variety), it’s difficult for people to honestly discuss matters of race. Genericism on race has been made synonymous with extremism. But same goes for the concept of whiteness. Once a neutral term — quality of European descent — , now it’s treated like some evil phantom of history. So, ‘whiteness studies’ doesn’t mean an objective study of white people and culture but an alarmist diagnosis of white people, history, culture, and whatever as the source of all the evils of the world. Whiteness isn’t a subject but a disease. It isn’t something to really study but to search and destroy or burn at the stake. It’s like Jewishness was never a neutral matter in National Socialist Germany. When Nazis studied Jewishness, they weren’t detached scholars but doctors studying a pathogen that must be wiped out.

    This is why the ONLY WAY to dig out of the hole is to embrace the term ‘race-ism’. The dash(-) emphasizes the true meaning of ‘ism’. Race-ism can become radical racism but need not be.

    But what’s most outrageous about all this is the Jews(as pathological semites) are playing a truly dirty game. If Jews, in their naive idealism, were waging war on ‘racism’ in an earnest effort to stamp out all manifestations of bigotry and hatred, it would at least be understandable. But the real reason why Jews bull-whip and terrorize white identity and interests is because they want to keep white people servile to Jewish supremacism. After all, Jews don’t say, “You whites give up your identity and interests, and we Jews will do the same.” No, Jews say, “You surrender your banner and carry ours.” It’s a case of “heads I win, tails you lose.” Jews denounce whites as ‘nazis’ because they want to be Judeo-Nazis over the world. Jewish message to Hungarians is as follows: “Give up your ‘racist’ Hungarian identity and borders but then be sure to support Israel uber alles.” Jewish message to white Americans is as follows: “Feel white guilt over the Holocaust and Slavery and always remind yourselves that you whites totally suck as the mass murderers of history, but then be sure to suit up with military gear to smash and kill any number of Arabs and Muslims for the benefit of Israel.” Pathological-Semites or Patho-Semites are truly sick in the head. But they rule the West because Anglos have weaker and more yielding personalities. Jews even joke about the lack of will among Anglos:

    https://counter-currents.com/2020/11/the-greatest-jewish-joke-ever-told/

    Now, some might say that I’m trying to blackpill people with all the doom-and-gloom talk. But we must speak honestly, just like a doctor must tell a cancer patient about his ailment. Unless the truth is outed, there can’t be any real treatment. The current West is like treating cancer with ALL MEANS except those meant to deal with cancer cells. Imagine a cancer patient who is given the most elaborate and expensive treatment for EVERYTHING but the cancer. His eyes, ears, throat, stomach, liver, pancreas, arms, legs, groins, buttocks, and etc are given special treatment with all the tools and medicine. Millions and millions are spent on the treatment… except his cancer is ignored. He will surely die. The black problem is handled that way in the West. Why do blacks fail in school? Lower IQ and rowdy behavior, but no one addresses the problem of natural lower IQ and natural higher aggression among blacks. Instead, money is poured into everything without addressing the crucial fact.
    And same goes for Jewish Power. So much of financial, cultural, and foreign policy failures can be traced back to Jewish supremacist abuse of power, but people blame Everyone and Everything but the Jews. Take the recent election. Jews were most responsible for the fiasco that was 2020. With control of medicine, media, deep state, Wall Street, and whore politicians, Jews were hellbent on doing EVERYTHING to topple Trump, but these Trumpists are blaming everything but the Jews. So, nothing will change, nothing will be fixed.

    Also, what the West needs is to study the Portnoid Style in Jewish Politics, just like a famous Jewish historian Richard Hofstadter once wrote of the Paranoid Style in American Politics. ‘Portnoia’ is necessary if we are to spill the beans on what is really happening. There must be no more inhibitions. In a way, Jews gained over Wasps because Jews were vulgar and portnoid in spilling the beans on the Real Wasp, i.e. while Wasps put on a respectable Country Club image, they were really a bunch of a–holes like Senator Geary in THE GODFATHER PART 2. Well, it’s about time whites did the same to Jews and went totally portnoid on Jewish Power. To be sure, this is harder to do as Jews immunized themselves with shamelessness. It’s easier to expose the phoniness of Wasps with their air of respectability and dignity than to expose the Jew who inoculated himself with the pride of vulgarity. One can shame William F. Buckley but not Howard Stern. Still, there is such a huge gap between the tragic and noble image of Jews as a long-suffering people full of wisdom and the obnoxious image of Jews as two-faced a–holes who’ve turned the Holocaust into License to Steal and Kill for the sake of stuffing their own pockets and securing their own supremacism.

    Being portnoid isn’t to blackpill but to see truth for what it is. Then and only then can people embark on the right and righteous path. Unfortunately, not everyone sees it that way. I got the following email complaining that my views have a blackpilling effect:

    “If your goal is to encourage cucky-wuckery and Jungle Fever then you’re doing a great job. Constantly hearing about BAMMAMA, ACOWW, the pussification of the white boy and big black dongs along with your convincing but pessimistic predictions regarding the future of white manhood is extremely de-moralizing. Reading your vivid, primal descriptions of black thugs smashing wussy white boys and humping white girls to mind-blowing orgasms is going to give your white male readers an uncomfortable number of masochistic boners and your white female readers plenty of tingles. The only way then to comfort yourself in your racial-sexual loserdom as a white boy is by whanking to videos of muscular Negro studs pumping beautiful Aryan women into cascades of convulsive ecstasy. You can only repeat this humiliating ritual so many times before you accept the inevitability of white racial defeat and even the desirability of bigger, stronger, more dominant black men conquering the women of your tribe and blotting-out the genes of the degenerate males too credulous, perverted and weak to prevent it. Do you really write for White National Liberation/National Humanism as you claim? Because I can assure you that the effect you are having is very different. Enough nationalists have a white genocide fetish already without any need to encourage it. I had already arrived at these basic conclusions a couple of years ago but your writings certainly added fuel to the fire. I would be interested in reading your thoughts on these subjects.”

    The writer assumes that facing the truth and speaking of the dangers is demoralizing, therefore fatal. But the ONLY way to change course is to speak the truth as things really are. I maintain American History could have been very different IF, in the time of Jack Johnson, white people spoke of the black threat in portnoid ways. But they didn’t, so here we are. Truth may not save a people, but it’s the only chance they have in a world of lies.

  8. @Ultrafart the Brave

    I don’t see a problem with the Theory of Evolution being taught to the kiddies in school.

    I have a problem with it because they teach a left-wing version that only pretends to value studying evolutionary differences. I don’t see why it is acceptable to offend Christians but not secular egalitarians

    The existence of races within the human species is self-evident. This reality hardly requires the application of “basic Darwinian principles” (whatever that might be).

    No but they mix Darwin with Gould and teach a censored version where racial differences just happen to be only superficial. They use this fraudulent science to teach that the races you see don’t actually exist.

    In fact the title of Darwin’s book is normally censored for high schools and colleges. The full title is:
    The Origin of Species and Preservation of Favoured Races

    While it is normally referred to as:
    The Origin of Species

    I’ve seen Anthro students suggest that by “races” Darwin meant something else. This is amusing since it shows they actually haven’t read anything that he said about race but made it into an undergrad program that teaches evolution.

    • Agree: Adûnâi
    • Replies: @raga10
    , @jamie b.
    , @JM
  9. raga10 says:
    @John Johnson

    The full title of Darwin’s book is actually “On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life “, so I would suggest that one might not necessarily have any ulterior motives for using the shortened title…

    • Agree: Alfred
    • Replies: @John Johnson
  10. Here is a politically incorrect (and honest) view of Darwin and Galton.
    https://wallbuilders.com/darwin-and-race/

    Galton is on record as wanting to replace Africans with Chinese. As in encourage the Chinese to colonize Africa. Gee whiz was that not mentioned in your biology class?

    You can find discussions online where liberals try to do damage control when people ask why the original title of Species was shortened (censored). They argue that he actually wasn’t talking about modern conceptions of race.

    Let’s have Charles Darwin have a say in this:
    The Western nations of Europe . . . now so immeasurably surpass their former savage progenitors [that they] stand at the summit of civilization” .. “The civilized races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace the savage races through the world

    Yea a true egalitarian. LOL.

    Note to liberals: Your PC re-creation of Darwin doesn’t last on the internet. Damn White people and their pesky technologies.

    • LOL: nokangaroos
  11. @Gurney Halleck

    I wish the Minnesotan ones the best of luck. I recall them as noble people, expert belittlers of the feminine Scandi tyranny of the Great Lakes. If America gets a Hitler, he will be like the previous Hitler: a Somali with an aryan phenotype.

  12. BCB232 says:

    Climates don’t exist because there’s no clear boundary between different regions in terms of temperature, humidity, precipitation. There’s no meaningful differences between arctic desert and humid tropical.

    • Replies: @Patriot
  13. BCB232 says:

    RE: south asians and fat storage. There’s a theory that type 2 diabetes is a function of limits to fat storage. When personal fat storage threshold is exceeded, excess energy “spills” into the system – this is associated with T2 diabetes.

    My understanding is South Asians typically can only store a limited amount of fat. On a bad diet, they gain 30 pounds or so and then become diabetic. Low fat storage threshold. I”m sure there are examples but I can’t think of many fat South Asians. I have seen fat North East Asians (orientals).

    • Replies: @John Johnson
  14. Wyatt says:

    How Can You Draw a Line Between Different Races?

    Simple. If a white or yellow person doesn’t believe in race, you dump them in Johannesburg, South Africa for a few months and you wait to retrieve their mangled corpse for a body bag. You then ask their colleagues if they believe in race. If they say no, repeat the process until they say yes or you run out of retards.

    Problems like this are never that hard. A healthy dose of reality and a friendly necklacing by rampaging Africans is enough to prove to anyone that race is real, at least until they finish burning to death.

    • Agree: noname27, TKK
    • Replies: @noname27
    , @TTSSYF
  15. Rahan says:

    Just read last week Mr. Dutton’s “The Genius Famine”.
    Excellent work.

  16. Patriot says:
    @BCB232

    Also, most of the variation in climate is WITHIN locations as opposed to BETWEEN locations. Therefore (according to idiot Woke SJW and Cultural Marxists), climates don’t exist. All places have the same climate, and all climates are equal.

    Those who say that their climate is better than someone else’s climate is a HATER and needs to be canceled.

    • LOL: europeasant
  17. @raga10

    Why do they publish versions of the book without the full title? Not enough space on the cover?

    You can find science books with much longer titles.

    It’s not by chance. Liberal teachers don’t want their students deviating outside the party line of race not existing.

    You can find youtube videos for biology classes where the full title just so happens to not be mentioned.

    It’s censorship. They are afraid of people googling about racial differences and learning that liberals and the left are completely full of sh-t.

  18. @BCB232

    My understanding is South Asians typically can only store a limited amount of fat. On a bad diet, they gain 30 pounds or so and then become diabetic. Low fat storage threshold.

    American Indians have the same problem.

    They get diabetes sooner than Whites with the same diet.

    It’s really not talked about as the media would rather just blame modern diets (that Whites created and are therefore to blame).

    Diet of course matters but when we ignore these racial differences it oversimplifies these problems.

  19. @Patriot

    Mountains don’t exist too, because of hills and plains. This is all so easy. Peace to the world!

  20. @Patriot

    Teach children that it is wrong to prefer one color over another. ALL COLORS ARE EQUAL!!!

    LOL
    When I hear people say they cannot tolerate discrimination, I ask them why they are wearing the colour of shirt they are wearing, or why did they eat what they ate for their last meal.

    • Replies: @Patriot
  21. @jamie b.

    Not an opinion, but this is what James Watson was really describing, perhaps without realizing it.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/nature11128#f4

  22. raga10 says:
    @John Johnson

    I agree with you – publications should absolutely have a full title as the author intended. I wasn’t even aware there are versions published under shortened title because the ones I’ve seen had the full version, albeit with one part emphasized by larger print (which is fine – after all, the original first edition does that as well).

    But when referencing the title even in formal context, I can understand why someone might want to shorten it for the sake of convenience and brevity.

    • Replies: @Badger Down
  23. jamie b. says:
    @John Johnson

    I’ve seen Anthro students suggest that by ‘races’ Darwin meant something else.

    The word was used ambiguously, essentially meaning ‘lineage.’ It could refer to what we now think of as ‘race,’ or it could refer species, or it could refer to familial lineage, etc.

    “Fate had determined that he should leave none of his race behind him, and that he should finish his life poor, lonely and childless.” Barry Lyndon.

    The way that Darwin used it was maybe analogous to what we would now call a ‘taxon. or ‘clade”

    • Replies: @John Johnson
  24. Levtraro says:

    [Edwards] noted that Lewontin simply looked at a small number of genetic loci and found that, indeed, 85 percent of human variation was due to individual differences. However, argues Edwards, if you look at lots of loci, then you will find these loci correlate differently in different groups, due to gene frequency differences, leading to very different results. Indeed, this leads to races being very different in numerous predictable ways, rendering “race” a scientific category

    I think this can be explained a bit better: Edwards argument was that racial differences stemmed from both, gene frequencies within and between ethnic groups and from their covariation, while Lewontin’s and popular accounts failed to take into account the covariation. Covariation can be a large part of total variation when the variables are not independent. Gene frequencies among individuals are obviously not independent.

    Essentially Edwards defended the use of race for human classification.

  25. @John Johnson

    Here is a version of the book with its full and proper title on the front cover being sold on Amazon, the publishing date of it is given as 2018. But on the whole most of the editions being sold do seem to use the truncated title, either The Origin of Species or The Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection. Although I don’t think it is necessarily due to political correctness that this arrangement is created, I recall even older edition published in the ’50s having the shortened title on the spine/front cover, with the full title being on the inside, as it is with all editions to this day.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
  26. In other words: there is no clear way to divide different races. They merge into each other, with great variation in-between.

    Is this really true? Is there a paint colour chart of people going from ginger Irish to Australian Aboriginie? No clustering and gaps?


  27. 10,000 Are Expected to Lose Jobs to Spotted Owl
    Environmental groups sue to protect northern spotted owl
    Northern Spotted Owl threatened by Eastern Barred Owl
    Barred Owl Threat

    [MORE]

    Spotted Owl and Barred Owl
    Due to the rapid expansion of the barred owl into the range of the spotted owl, evolution has not had time to play out. The barred owl is the slightly larger and more aggressive of the two species, plus it has some biological advantages over the spotted owl. Barred owls get by with much less acreage per territory which means they can densely pack the habitat occupied by spotted owls.

    barred owls nest more often, more successfully, and produce many times more young than do spotted owls. As a result of the barred owl invasion in the west, spotted owl populations are rapidly declining in many areas

    When two very similar species use the same space at the same time, usually one loses out. In our case, the smaller, less aggressive, spotted owls either move out of their established territories, or become mostly silent so they are very difficult to detect. Silence is detrimental to a species that relies on a variety of vocalizations to attract mates and defend territories.

    Only time will tell if the spotted owl is able to adapt quickly enough to persist as a species in the face of the barred owl invasion.

    • Replies: @GMC
    , @iffen
    , @Badger Down
  28. RonaldB says:
    @Priss Factor

    You really have a thing about Jews. I mean, Jews seem to inhabit every thought of every waking moment you have.

    I did read your tome. My advice is, you spend a bit more time reading, and a bit less time writing. You should read the books of Edward Dutton. In “The Genius Famine” and “At Our Wit’s End” and probably in “Making Sense of Race” he develops the idea of the genetic deterioration of a population due to the lack of Darwin stress and selection. A harsh environment causes unfit individuals to die out before reproducing; the development of technology relieves Darwinian stress and causes the genetic deterioration of a population, even in the absence of immigration. In other words, the type of problems you write about will occur with or without the presence of Jews. You yourself talk about Japan; but Japan is experiencing the same type of deterioration without immigration and certainly without Jews.

    One of the consequences of the genetic deterioration of a population is the spiteful mutant. The spiteful mutant is a genetically-dysfunctional individual who uses the interconnected nature of social complexity to sabotage not only himself, but genetically healthy individuals. Spiteful mutants arise naturally through relaxation of natural selection and go a long way towards explaining the propensity of society to destroy itself.

    I notice you ascribe a great deal of power to Jews and blacks. It’s as if the European-derived white had no agency at all, even when he was in the overwhelming majority. One prime example was the 1965 immigration act, passed when whites were still an overwhelming majority. They agreed to loosen immigration to import third-world individuals who would probably not fit in very well. But, rather than complain about Jews, why not complain about the compliance of whites when they had the political power in their hands? I guess the black pill approach is to assume, like Dutton, the deterioration of society and the present civilization is inevitable. The white pill is to assume that something can be done to halt the natural deterioration of society. But, finding the right approach is not a simple matter at all. You’ll find out why by reading Dutton’s books.

    • Disagree: Robert Dolan
  29. Patriot says:
    @Curmudgeon

    Also, EVERYONE practices (the evil, Nazi-inspired) eugenics, and have been since humans evolved. Dating, courtship and marriage are eugenic. Show any adolescent girl or guy 100 photos of ugly, giant-nosed, cross-eyed, no-chin, fat, or skinny, short, bow-legged, double-chinned, unibrow, aged or sickly-looking potential mates and ONE well-built, beautiful person with good teeth and bright eyes and ask which would they marry.

    All will choose the 1 out of 100 that is the most beautiful & healthy looking.

    Everyone dates and marries the best person they can get. This bias or prejudice toward young, beautiful mates is personal eugenics in action. It also results in assortative mating — beautiful people mate with beautiful people and tend to have beautiful children. Ugly people mate with ugly people and tend to have ugly children (except when beautiful young gold-diggers marry old shriveled, ugly rich men).

    A lot of the anger among SJW is actually envy and shame for being ugly and failures.

    Marxists and SJW claim to want equality, but, like all humans, they reject as mates the ugly, unhealthy and aged — they discriminate. They are all firggin liers. hypocrites, and idiots.

    • Replies: @raga10
  30. @jamie b.

    The word was used ambiguously, essentially meaning ‘lineage.’ It could refer to what we now think of as ‘race,’ or it could refer species, or it could refer to familial lineage, etc.

    What would he be talking about preserving then? We should preserve general familial lineage? That doesn’t make any sense.

    It is true that he doesn’t talk much about race in Origin.

    But his opinions on race are clear in Descent of Man
    https://genius.com/Charles-darwin-the-descent-of-man-chapter-7-on-the-races-of-man-annotated

    He describes Africans as a barbarous race that will eventually be exterminated.

    So extremely difficult to believe that he has such opinions on race but was just being ambiguous with the word in the first book.

    • Replies: @jamie b.
  31. @The Spirit of Enoch Powell

    But on the whole most of the editions being sold do seem to use the truncated title, either The Origin of Species or The Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection. Although I don’t think it is necessarily due to political correctness that this arrangement is created, I recall even older edition published in the ’50s having the shortened title on the spine/front cover, with the full title being on the inside, as it is with all editions to this day.

    It is entirely because of political correctness. If you do an Amazon search most of the results do not contain the full title but have plenty of space for it.

    You will find that videos made on youtube for high schoolers also do not contain the full title.

    This is not by chance or for the sake of brevity.

    There are popular non-fiction books with long titles that are not shortened like:
    The Violinist’s Thumb: And Other Lost Tales of Love, War, and Genius, as Written by Our Genetic Code

    I discovered this on my own by coming across an old copy. I had never seen “preservation of the races” mentioned anywhere in college text. You can find discussions online where people were shocked to learn about this phenomenon as they had also never seen the full title (along with liberals doing damage control).

    Most teachers and professors are liberal and do not want their students asking about Darwin and race. It contradicts the establishment liberal party line which is that race doesn’t exist and only stupid racist rednecks would think otherwise. That is why most copies use a shortened title. Evolution as taught in schools uses left-wing censorship.

  32. jamie b. says:
    @John Johnson

    We should preserve general familial lineage?

    Erm, ‘should’? The ToE is descriptive, not prescriptive. Darwin does speculate about the fates of other races, but doesn’t form any sort of judgement.

    AAR, yes, he is indeed talking mainly about ‘familial lineages’ in so far as natural selection mostly operates on the individual. A species evolves due to the preservation of fitter ‘races’ (lineages) over less fit ‘races.’ This was about as close as Darwin could get at that time to adopting a ‘selfish gene’ perspective.

    And when Darwin does speculate about what we would now call ‘group selection,’ it’s clear that he doesn’t necessarily have a taxonomic level in mind that corresponds neatly with what we would now call race: “If one man in a tribe… invented a new snare or weapon, the tribe would increase in number, spread, and supplant other tribes. In a tribe thus rendered more numerous there would always be a rather better chance of the birth of other superior and inventive members.”

  33. raga10 says:
    @Patriot

    Marxists and SJW claim to want equality, but, like all humans, they reject as mates the ugly, unhealthy and aged — they discriminate. They are all firggin liers. hypocrites, and idiots.

    I don’t think it is hypocritical to talk about equality in some domains but not others…. For example I think it is fairly non-controversial to say that ugly, unhealthy and aged should be treated under the law the same way as the young and beautiful. But from that it doesn’t at all follow that ugly, unhealthy and old guys should demand to sleep with a beautiful girl, who would actually prefer someone healthier, younger and more attractive.

    It might not be fair to them, but who she prefers is her choice, not theirs… and to claim otherwise is not at all a Marxist view! That’s the incel view.

    • Agree: Patriot
    • Replies: @Franklin Ryckaert
  34. Erm, ‘should’? The ToE is descriptive, not prescriptive. Darwin does speculate about the fates of other races, but doesn’t form any sort of judgement.

    Oh really? Here in Origin he basically says that the savage races have been driven to the hills:

    The various beings thus left stranded may be
    compared with savage races of man, driven up and
    surviving in the mountain-fastnesses of almost every land

    If any modern politician made that comment it would certainly be considered judgmental.

    At best you can argue that he wasn’t talking about human races in the title. I think he was in part to encourage racial thinking among the English. No one knows for certain. But regardless in his follow up books and diary entries it is clear that he was very much opinionated on the issue of race. If the left managed a 1984 style government they would certainly ban Decent of Man and is completely erodes their attempt at trying to re-create Darwin as some modern and enlightened egalitarian.

    I believe the title is shortened by publishers to discourage even breaching the subject of race. Like I said earlier Darwin is mixed with leftists like Gould and Diamond to depict race as a complete fabrication. The schools don’t want anyone getting any counter ideas. Liberal biology teachers and professors aren’t stupid. They are interested in undermining Christianity while keeping information related to race suppressed. But if you doubt this then by all means go to a college and give an open lecture on known racial differences. See how “science loving” the staff really is. The left only values evolution as a tool for attacking Christianity since they view it as a White religion. They would never have Darwin days if conservative Whites were secular and only minorities were Christian.

    AAR, yes, he is indeed talking mainly about ‘familial lineages’ in so far as natural selection mostly operates on the individual.

    One in the same as he talks about how changes start at the individual level but then propagate through the group. It is only an individual change for a mere generation.

  35. jamie b. says:

    At best you can argue that he wasn’t talking about human races in the title.

    Or 99% of the remainder of the book.

    One in the same as he talks about how changes start at the individual level but then propagate through the group. It is only an individual change for a mere generation.

    And at what level is selection in play? Darwin does speculate about group selection, but for the bulk of the book, in what sense is selection acting on ‘races’? What interpretation of the word would make the most sense?

    No one knows for certain.

    Yes, we do know for certain: in the context of the book’s content, the title would not make any sense if ‘race’ were interpreted only with the modern meaning. That would quite simply not be the theory that he was describing. Period.

    Here in Origin he basically says that the savage races have been driven to the hills…

    Which is clearly what he considered to be a possibly factual statement, no different from observing that placental dogs drove the thylacine to marginal habitats.

    …if you doubt this…

    I don’t really ‘doubt’ it as much as I consider it irrelevant to the point I’m making: ‘Race’ was an ambiguous word synonymous with ‘lineage.’ Leftist embarrassment over Darwin’s alleged racism has nothing to do with it, and cutting off the final part of the title is simply a dumb mistake on their part.

  36. Yes, we do know for certain: in the context of the book’s content, the title would not make any sense if ‘race’ were interpreted only with the modern meaning. That would quite simply not be the theory that he was describing. Period.

    It makes sense as a message that he is trying to include with the book.

    He talks about races of men, plants and animals but race then as now has more connotation with people than plants or animals. There is a racial subtitle and also a racial subtext of the entire book.

    People were much more racially aware in the 19th century.

    The book Races of Men came out in 1850. No one at the time looked at the title and became confused by the meaning of the words.

    Anyone who read about Origin at the time would have seen the full title and assumed he was talking about people. Darwin would have been fully aware of this in his selection of the title.

    Darwin’s alleged racism has nothing to do with it, and cutting off the final part of the title is simply a dumb mistake on their part.

    Alleged racism? If Trump wrote a book that said Africans are primitive barbarians that will eventually be exterminated by civilized races would that be called alleged racism? How would one reach the level of actual racism?

    There is no dumb mistake in the widespread shortening of the title. This conversation is exactly what the establishment fears. Educators don’t want anyone wading outside the establishment line of race not existing. The last thing liberal teachers want is for a student to google “darwin and race” and then come to a website like this one.

    I could list a dozen non-fiction books with longer titles that were not shortened. That’s not merely by chance or coincidence. It’s establishment censorship plain and simple. They would ban this website and send us to re-education camps if they could.

    • Agree: Ray Caruso, TTSSYF
  37. jamie b. says:

    It makes sense as a message that he is trying to include with the book.

    The book built up a case that evolution occurs, and described mechanisms for how it occurs (natural selection being the primary one). The title clearly reflects this fact.

    He talks about races of men, plants and animals but race then as now has more connotation with people than plants or animals.

    If you say so, the fact remains that the word was synonymous with ‘lineage,’ and this makes sense when using it for plants, animals, tribes, and individual lineages. Again I ask, at what level was Darwin most concerned about selection?

    People were much more racially aware in the 19th century.

    Sure, and the fact remains that the word was synonymous with ‘lineage,’ and this makes sense when using it for plants, animals, tribes, and individual lineages. Again I ask, at what level was Darwin most concerned about selection?

    The book Races of Men came out in 1850. No one at the time looked at the title and became confused by the meaning of the words.

    Same as if the word ‘lineage’ were used in place of ‘race.’

    Anyone who read about Origin at the time would have seen the full title and assumed he was talking about people.

    Only to the degree that they’d think ‘species’ only refers to people, which is to say, not really much.

    Alleged racism?

    Ugh. Again, nothing to do with the point I’m making.

    If Trump wrote a book that said Africans are primitive barbarians that will eventually be exterminated by civilized races would that be called alleged racism?

    A better analogy would be if he said that Amerindians were nearly exterminated, if we’re going to eliminate the advantage of hindsight. But again, beside the point.

    There is no dumb mistake in the widespread shortening of the title.

    Yes there is: Thinking that ‘race’ could only mean what it means today. Leftists (and creationists) are indeed dumb to think this. Here’s you chance to be smarter than them.

  38. Wyatt says:
    @RonaldB

    It’s as if the European-derived white had no agency at all, even when he was in the overwhelming majority.

    For the most part, he didn’t. Even Joe McCarthy was afraid of jewish influence despite the overwhelming presence of jews within the communist movement. If you want to go even further back, multiple jewish millionaires and moguls used their resources to try to exonerate Leo Frank, a jewish factory owner who raped and murdered a white girl and tried to blame it on a black janitor. Even in 1915, jews throughout America threw their support behind their fellow tribesman even though many of them thought he was guilty. In the end, the jews got him pardoned through the governor of Georgia, but a lynch mob carried out justice and hanged Leo Frank.

    After that, the ADL came into existence to defend jewish criminals from white prosecution and persecute whites wherever they could find a reason.

    Also, when you look at polling in 1965, Americans overwhelmingly did not want further immigration into the US. A handful of congressmen, barring some good ol’ boys from the South, approved the Hart-Celler Act. This country has a frightful history of the people being betrayed by the politicians, dating back clearly to Lincoln who imposed a draft and taxes to fight his stupid war and possibly further depending on how you look at it. Ultimately, American politics are a poignant illustration of why the Constitution is a failure of a document. It did such a poor job of hindering malignant governance that the country probably won’t make it intact to its tricentennial.

    • Replies: @RonaldB
  39. Bert says:
    @Priss Factor

    Jews degrade society by over-achieving and using their vast fortunes/power to subvert goy civilizations out of revenge, resentment, paranoia, or just plain nastiness that they revel in.

    What appears to be nastiness is negative ethnocentrism, i.e., hostility to the host population, that was selectively advantageous over the millennium during which the Ashkenazi population grew many times faster than the the native population of Central and Eastern Europe. It is easier to exploit those whom one hates, assuming that one minimizes the overt expression of the hatred while doing one’s business. Greater ability to exploit Europeans provided the most hostile Ashkenazim the financial ability to have larger families, which grew the Ashkenazi population at an astounding rate and increased the frequency of negative ethnocentricity among the Ashkenazim.

    Facts of population growth and the logic of exploitation of the host population strongly argue for an evolved nastiness among the Ashkenazim that has been expressed in North America as the Ashkenazi-led attack on European civilization over the past 100 years. Those like Kevin MacDonald who consider only the positive ethnocentricity of the Ashkenazim miss the causative factor responsible for the decline of the West.

    If Edward Dutton resided in a place with more Ashkenazim, he would be doing a great service to investigate the Ashkenazi negative ethnocentrism through psychological experiments and genetic markers.

    • Agree: Ray Caruso
    • Disagree: Robert Dolan
  40. Extreme suspicion of people who looked different was an important survival tool for 99% of the time humans have been on earth. When we lived outdoors in small bands, if we encountered another band of the same aggressive primate species, the odds were that its members would do their best to steal our pointy sticks, rape our women, and kill or enslave us. But now that we are civilized (sort of), this ancient protective response is maladaptive, but it is hard as the dickens to let go of, and it may yet prove to be our undoing.

  41. fnn says:

    Hilarious thread on “racist gardening culture” in the UK:

  42. RonaldB says:
    @Wyatt

    Well, thanks for your response. It kind of begs the question: if the European overwhelming majority countenances legislation they uniformly oppose, are they not giving up their own prerogative? Liberal Jewish organizations are not the only European religions supporting idiocies like mass immigration. You have the United Methodists, the Universalists, the Vatican Catholics, the Lutherans, etc. Finland, with hardly any Jews at all, is suddenly opening itself up to immigration.

    By the way, I don’t oppose talking about Jews and other identity influences. If the accusations are false, they can be disproven. If they are true, the airing of them will give people more ammunition to protect their own interests. Funny enough, the SPLC had non-Jewish leadership and apparently still do, although they are more than willing to take hundreds of millions from stupid Jewish contributors such as my relatives.

    • Replies: @HallParvey
  43. @RonaldB

    You are completely full of shit.

    “Whites” did NOT vote to open the borders in 1965 and frankly I am SICK of people like you promoting the Jew narrative on this topic.

    Celler and Javitz wrote the legislation for The Immigration Act of 1965, after organized Jewry lobbied for DECADES to open the borders of every white Christian nation on earth.

    Kevin Macdonald gives a detailed analysis of this in Chapter Seven of “The Culture of Critique.”

    Priss is generally spot on, except when referring to National Socialism where he sadly pushes the mainstream Jew Narrative. Otherwise Priss provides some very good articles that he should be getting paid for.

    • Agree: Peripatetic Itch
    • Replies: @Stan d Mute
  44. “Those like Kevin MacDonald who consider only the positive ethnocentricity of the Ashkenazim miss the causative factor responsible for the decline of the West.”

    WTF?

    Clearly you have not read the CofC.

    KMAC roundly eviscerates the nose for their obvious hyper-ethnocentrism which has WRECKED the entire western world.

    Your take is absurdly wrong.

    • Replies: @Bert
  45. The single and ONLY reason that race is not allowed to be recognized is organized Jewry.

    The reason organized Jewry does not want race to be recognized is because the discussion of racial differences disrupts their impossible marxist egalitarianism (while at the same time the Jews consider their own race to be superior to the rest of humanity)

    Conveniently….the Jew narrative is that whites are “racists” and keeping everybody else down, when in fact it’s the NOSEBERGS that are insanely and pathologically RACIST and consider the rest of us to be cattle.

    It gives me a headache that things that are so obvious are still not understood.

    Nazism was simply an imitation of Judaism:
    Ingroup preference.
    Outgroup hostility.
    Ethnic purity.

    Most, if not all, of the societal disruption currently being experienced in the west is due to the Jewish Revolutionary Spirit….the wrong-headed Jewish conviction that they are the chosen ones and they have the right to rule over all of humanity.

    • Replies: @G J T
  46. thordaddy says:

    Your race is your father(s).

    Drawing a line between “races” is pointless as it is the line drawn by one’s father(s) which determines one’s race.

    After this, the myriad of separate races, over time, run parallel, perpendicular and/or against each other in the inexorable creation and chaos of “racism,” ie., my father(s) are better than yours.

  47. @ANZ

    You don’t see the parachute on the ground yet, even after getting dragged this far? Their next sermon from the Church of Cautious Enough will amount to spiritual evolution (as just incidentally abolishes all racial heresy) whereby you either got protection or you don’t. Think spiritual carbon tax credits rendered on a social credit scale.

    Don’t be real sure that you can see where this is going, or else you woulda seen where they’re really coming from. (Also known as the Church of ICU2, and their masters got it all planned out).

  48. @raga10

    Equality under the law is the only equality that makes sense. For the rest, all forms of inequality (especially of outcome) should be accepted.
    Vive la difference!

  49. @Patriot

    Similarly day and night don’t exist because of the intermediates of dawn and dusk.

    With this way of thinking we can make the world very simple indeed: most things don’t exist.

  50. noname27 says: • Website
    @Wyatt

    Well said.

    “I have given my life to alleviate the sufferings of Africa. There is something that all White men who have lived here like I have must learn and know: that these individuals are a sub-race. They have neither the mental or emotional abilities to equate or share equally with White men in any functions of our civilization. I have given my life to try to bring unto them the advantages which our civilization must offer, but I have become well aware that we must retain this status: White the superior, and they the inferior. For whenever a White man seeks to live among them as their equals, they will destroy and devour him, and they will destroy all his work. And so for any existing relationship or any benefit to this people, let White men, from anywhere in the world, who would come to help Africa, remember that you must maintain this status: you the master and they the inferior, like children whom you would help or teach. Never fraternize with them as equals. Never accept them as your social equals or they will devour you. They will destroy you.”

    — Dr. Albert Schweitzer

  51. noname27 says: • Website
    @Patriot

    Are the ‘colours’ known as ‘black’ and ‘white’ not even classified as colours?

  52. noname27 says: • Website

    “”RACIST” A made up word by the Jew Leon Trotsky (real name Bronstein) in 1927 and used to browbeat all dissenters of the Jewish Bolshevik Marxist/Communist ideology and still used today to keep white people walking on egg shells regarding other races. Only whites are racists according to these traitor sons of bitches, like John Mann, Labour MP.”

    — Brother Charles

  53. Curle says:
    @Element59

    “The anti-racists and the racial egalitarians are today faced with a mounting crisis: A profound dearth of hard scientific evidence to support their environmentalist positions.”

    That’s why we now have critical theory. Theory is given the deference once granted to evidence.

  54. Curle says:
    @Priss Factor

    “if Adolf Hitler and his followers were more like Benito Mussolini . . . the horrors of Nazism could have been avoided.”

    Probably not. The Bolsheviks weren’t explicitly racialist yet somehow found a way to target for mass murder mostly from select ethnic groups, Ukrainians and Great Russians for example. And they simultaneously found a way to avoid mass murder from other ethnic groups, Jews for example.

    • Agree: Robert Dolan
    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  55. Chinaman says:
    @Element59

    9

    Why do Oriental students score higher than Caucasians on IQ tests?”

    Because they wear masks and white children don’t?

    • LOL: Rufus Clyde
  56. GMC says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Good lesson H – I remember that NW spotted owl lost of logging jobs. – Personality behavior, also have a profound effect on society. One herd will act like everyone else in the Herd, because they are all bunched together and doing the same thing — which is normal because the others are doing it. Maybe personality geo engineering, and bunching of cultures, has more to do with the modern day word – Race. You could certainly bunch different types of people commenting here – easily . Either way, I see the use of Race as a Western tool for divide and conquer.

  57. I’m sympathetic to these argument, but fear they are a waste of time. They are not going to convince any of the woke-folk. They want to be seen as good, and being good for them means not noticing differences.

    It’s better just to go on with racial research rather than get stuck in the quicksand of justifying why 2+2=4.

  58. The article contrasts “race” and “species”. However, given the significant differences in anatomy, physiology, intellect, and behavior between Europeans and sub-Saharan Africans, if the two populations were to be classified taxonomically in a manner consistent with that of non-hominids, they would certainly be considered to belong to different species, if not different genera. The standard objection to that is that two populations belong to the same species if they can produce fertile offspring, but that is not the scientific criterion for differentiating between species. There are in fact numerous examples of fertile hybrids. For instance, any mating among dogs, wolves, coyotes, and jackals produces fertile offspring. Cattle and bison produce fertile offspring even though they belong to different genera, not just different species. Moreover, modern Europeans have a significant quantity of Neanderthal genes, which would be a logical impossibility without the existence of fertile sapiens–Neanderthal hybrids early on. Assertions that humans all belong to a single species, and even a single subspecies, are yet another instance of liberal ideology corrupting science.

    • Agree: Stan d Mute
    • Thanks: Peripatetic Itch
  59. @Observator

    We should be wary of aliens today, as much as we were in prehistory. While not all aliens are hostile, especially when of a common race or religion, very often that is indeed the case. Your implication that we should never be wary of aliens is based on liberal ideology, not reality. Consider James Wong in the post above, who is an alien to native Britons. At first glance, he appears to be a peace-loving gardener and a counterexample to the alien tendency toward hostility, but his comments reveal that he is indeed hostile to his hosts.

  60. JM says:
    @John Johnson

    As I understand it, by ‘race’ Darwin meant groups or lines within or between species – living competitively – and possessing similar phenotypic attributes.

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  61. JM says:
    @Ultrafart the Brave

    “I do see a problem with this theory being indoctrinated into students as a fact.”

    Why select the Theory of Evolution as different from anything else (say) in Science? Such instruction (which is probably the best that can be managed by teachers at the Elementary level and many these days at the Secondary level) is anathema to the method of Science. On the other hand, if we were to nominate a list of the top theories in the biological and social sciences that were most unlikely to be disproved, then the Theory of Evolution would be right up there.

    • Disagree: Stan d Mute
    • Replies: @Ultrafart the Brave
  62. G J T says:

    The distinction between, and separation of the races is, and always will be, the most clear and obvious manifestation of natural law and the order of God. Trying to fight against racial differences, or trying to force a multitude of races together, is literally trying to defeat nature and defeat God. It’s no coincidence that the people most responsible for trying to convince the world race doesn’t exist are a people who’ve made an entire lifestyle and identity out of trying to trick and deceive God with childish rituals among their in-group and mutilating children’s sex organs among the out-group.

    That’s what this all boils down to — the global hegemon, the Jew, cannot help but try and alter and overcome nature itself. It’s a war no sane person or group could imagine waging, but of course we are not dealing with a sane group of people. We are dealing with the synagogue of Satan. If the Jew can convince the world (or at least its racial, ideological and spiritual enemy) that race isn’t real, the massive historical lie it operates on — that the synagogue of Satan are actually the Israelites of the Bible — can live to see another day. Or decade, or century or millennia. Of even greater magnitude than the Holocaust™️ lie, the stolen identity of the white European race is what keeps Jews at the top of the global hierarchy. To peddle the insane notion that race doesn’t exist is to keep white Europeans powerless and the target of global extermination.

    Race is the very fabric of historical truth and of spiritual truth as well. If the Jew were to allow the white European race to discover its common heritage and re-establish the kinship that comes with that, the white European peoples just might see through the big Jewish lie and spoil their global hegemony and ambitions for total enslavement of the goyim.

    Racial awareness for white Europeans doesn’t just mean an ethnic adversary for the Jew, it means the total evisceration of the stolen identity the Jew has built his power and his fortune on. Is it any wonder they’re trying to convince us race is not real?

    • Agree: anarchyst
  63. Miroslav says:

    As a Serbian Australian it seems to me that Americans are getting themselves all mixed up with their smart arguments. If you believe that Americans came from North West Europe, then where did the North West Europeans come from? Probably the North West Europeans wouldn”t know. But the answer can be found by studying etymology and a little history. For a start there was a mysterious people in Italy called Estruscans who called themselves Raseni which to me sounds like The Race. Then there was another people in the Balkans called Thracians, which to me also sounds like The Race. In the middle ages Serbia was called Raska which sounds like The Race and today we have Russia which sounds like The Race. Surely this is a clue. Russia has something like over 1oo different peoples all living in harmony,as far as i know. Why can’t Americans do the same?

    • Replies: @GMC
  64. AaronB says:

    Race is real, and whatever racial hierarchy happens to exist the moment you are writing, is scientifically determined to exist for all time.

    If 150 years ago Whites were on top, they will be so for all time. If 150 years later, Jews are on top, and strivey Asians are doing better on tests, then naturally, it is scientifically determined that that will be the case for all time.

    And any quality any group of people display at a particular moment, is because of race and will be that way for all time. If blacks in American society are violent, its race, not environment. If Asians after being humiliated by the West developed an interest in STEM as what will help them defend themselves, its really just race, not environment and history, and the literary character of traditional Asian society didn’t exist.

    Its wonderful! There is no complex, nuanced reality, with multiple factors interacting in ways we don’t fully understand, its all just race! There is no change in group behavior! Despite what history says, we were all really always the way we are now, and always will be – until we aren’t, and then we will always be that way!

    This race thing is wonderful. It can explain anything. Why do current hierarchies exist? Race! Wait, is that just a tautology, like saying things are the way they are because things are the way they are? Hmm, dont make me think. Its race!

    • Replies: @AaronB
    , @PolarBear
  65. iffen says:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Your picture of the Spotted Owl shows more bars than spots while your picture of the Barred Owl shows more spots than bars.

  66. G J T says:
    @Robert Dolan

    The Marxist egalitarianism is merely a front for their tribal ambitions of total subjugation of the goyim. If there is one group of people who definitely do NOT believe in egalitarianism, it’s Jews. Judaism is a master-slave system that is totally antithetical to the egalitarianism they peddle on the goyim in order to destroy the white race.

    National socialist Germany was not “an imitation of Judaism,” it was precisely the opposite. In-group preference is nature, and in-group preference does not by necessity imply subjugation of the out-group. That is something that is uniquely Jewish, and it’s the perfect illustration of how the Jew takes something true and pure and defiles it. The ONLY way to defeat Jewish hegemony is to embrace the same in-group preference they practice. It’s why they’ve programmed it out of the white race. Hyper-individualism means the death of the white race and the total victory of the synagogue of Satan, and Hitler was keenly aware of this. I’m guessing you’ll tell us next that antifa “are the real fascists” or throw out some other retarded conservative meme?

    • Agree: Bert
    • Replies: @Robert Dolan
  67. AaronB says:
    @AaronB

    To clarify my comment, its perfectly normal to observe that a certain group behaves a certain way at the moment, and to order your life in such a way that you expect certain behavior from certain groups, now.

    Thats intelligent abd pragmatic. You don’t need to know the complex reasons why when going about your daily life.

    But science is supposed to me more than that. The concept of race – that certain groups behave the way they do because it is their nature – is a tautology. Basically, you are what you are because you are what you are. How does this advance knowledge? The concept of race kills thought.

    I might say, for instance, that Asians, after being humiliated by the West, abandoned the traditional literary character of their culture, and were driven to excel in STEM, to defend themselves. A complex interaction between environment and history gave rise to behavior we see today.

    This advances knowledge. The racist will just say, race! We are no further in knowledge, then a barbarian three thousand years ago, musing on why the world is the way it is. The world is the way it is because the world is the way it is.

    The concept of race must be studied from a sociological perspective- why has a tautology become so appealing to some people? Because it shuts down thought. Because it organizes a complex reality in simplistic ways.

    Scientifically, the concept of race has no knowledge value. If true, it does not enhance human control. Its an admission of ignorance. Things are the way they are.

    This may be useful pragmatically, but not scientifically.

  68. G J T says:
    @Priss Factor

    “The horrors of Nazism”

    Such as removing Jews from positions of power and influence, extrication from the global Jewish financial scheme, generous social welfare policies and near-full employment, unprecedented scientific achievements, social cohesion and trust not seen since, and on and on. My God, the horrors indeed!

    • Agree: HeebHunter
    • Replies: @HeebHunter
  69. gotmituns says:

    When the subject of race comes up, I say I’m a racial realist and people sit with their mouths open (my daughters silently go out of their minds – silently now because when they appeal to their mother, she tells them “don’t criticize your father.”). They really don’t come after me because of my age, especially at my VFW chapter because we all agree with rare exceptions. Younger people are scared to death of the subject and especially the concept of logic.

  70. @Gurney Halleck

    As a proud member of the Somali race, I agree, races exist. Every Somali in the West is partially suffering from mental illness for not being among his or kin back home.

    And here we have it, the single best explanation for our cultural decay. Life becomes onorous when a visit to Walmart reveals as many languages and cultures as a U.N. General Assembly. It slowly makes us crazy.

    Everyone, even the Democrat Communists, know this. Especially, the Jews know this — see Chuck Lorre’s Vanity Card #327:

    …until I wandered around Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, I didn’t realize how much my double helix yearned to be around similar strands.

    Homogeneity is strength, but nationalism is Kryptonite to a Jew. That’s why they promote dissolving America’s borders, and why our Magic Dirt has given up the ghost.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  71. @G J T

    It is what the “high IQ” huwhites do nowadays.
    Across the political and ideological spectrum, no matter what, they insist on “honoring” the scumbag/ignoramus/golem who sold every thing of value in Europe and their own European made countries to the kikes.
    Muh nazis
    Muh holohoax
    Muh socialism

    • Replies: @G J T
  72. @Priss Factor

    Oh pray tell, what were these “horrors of nazism”?

    Amerimutts like you will be celebrating 1945 for eternity with the kikes soon enough. In hell.

  73. Realist says:
    @John Johnson

    It’s censorship. They are afraid of people googling about racial differences and learning that liberals and the left are completely full of sh-t.

    Not a chance…Google has that covered.

  74. anarchyst says:

    Cassius Clay (Muhammad Ali) said it best. Being against miscegenation and going public about it, Clay offered an analogy.
    It is possible for a German Shepherd to “mate” with a Chihuahua, but is extremely difficult to do so.
    All one has to do is look at the various diseases and medical conditions that are race-based. Whites are more susceptible to malaria, blacks to sickle cell disease. It turns out that the sickle cell gene offers protection against malaria.
    All races are “different” from each other in profound ways…

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  75. GMC says:
    @Miroslav

    Very interesting – thanks – Americans could live together but they have a “race problem” called – Personality disbehaviour syndrome, that has been programmed into their lives for a hundred years. Even if you are a semi neutral person, in the ” race scene” , you are bombarded with the divide and conquer – 24/7 . And as the “Herds ” pack together, and then the personality flaws – really take off and cause a huge societal mess. And we can see it, in the foreign policy, when the US goes into other countries for a regime change – East EU, Ukraine, Georgia, a little in Belarus , but it’s hard since they are a solid slavic society. That’s my 2 rubles worth – anyways. spacibo

  76. PolarBear says:
    @AaronB

    Whites have always been on top. No one has surpassed White inventions, architecture, philosophy, ect. Jews are merely turncoat Whites. Asians can do well on a test but haven’t applied their test paper superiority to the World as Whites have.

    • Replies: @HeebHunter
    , @AaronB
  77. Ian Smith says:
    @Gurney Halleck

    Be the change you want to see in the world.

  78. The Thai T-shirt slogan explains race, and much else, in a few simple words: “Same same but different”.

  79. Bert says:
    @Robert Dolan

    You totally misunderstand my comment.

    The causative factor I refer to is the genetically-based negative ethnocentricity of the Ashkenazim. You apparently don’t understand the difference between positive and negative ethnocentricity. Positive ethnocentricity is the tendency to help coethnics more than non-coethnics. Many ethnic groups display positive ethnocentricity. Negative ethnocentricity is the tendency to harm those who are not coethnics. I believe Mr. Paul Kersey’s column has abundant evidence that Negroes show negative ethnocentricity to other groups, e.g., shooting someone who has already been successfully robbed.

    It is clear to all who care to look that Ashkenazi Jews have orchestrated an assault on Western traditions and culture. Pervasive and multi-faceted as it is, that assault cannot be explained by the widely recognized positive ethnocentricity of Ashkenazim. Nor is it plausible that the assault has an entirely cultural cause, as is implied by MacDonald’s book “The Culture of Critique.” I am suggesting that the cause of the assault is a high frequency among the Ashkenazim of individuals genetically programmed to display negative ethnocentricity, and that such a high frequency is the result of evolution over the period of time when the Ashkenazim made their livings largely by economic exploitation of European peasants.

    • Agree: Patriot
  80. “Terming such a person the “racist” associates him with that which is accepted as somehow evil and immoral. As this association is damaging, the term “racist” is an emotionally manipulative means of keeping people on the “correct” ideological path. In other words, it is an ad hominem criticism.”

    Analogous to being labeled an anti semite which cast even deeper traumatic experiences for the average person.

  81. Chinaman says:
    @AaronB

    Scientist have developed ingenious experiments to untangle the complex interaction between genes (to which race is just one of its manifestations) and environment using fraternal twins and identical twins. When it comes to real-world outcomes like education attainment or income, most of these experiments shows that genes can explain 60-80% of the variance. I think that’s the case when comparing between individuals. Not sure what proportion that would be when it comes to ill-defined race categories like white and blacks but I would venture to guess that the explanatory power is above 50% for most outcomes.

    A few thousand years of human history and culture becomes a blink of the eye and inconsequential when one see things from evolunationary time scale. They don’t matter. It is only logical that transient environmental factors have little impact when compared to the 20-100 thousand years of seperate evolution that each race have experienced.

    Genes already incorporate all the important environmental factors since they represent selection and adaptations to the environment. You can read human history from someone’s DNA ( e.g. Sherpa’s unique hemoglobin genes) They got passed down since it is important.

    • Replies: @AaronB
  82. @G J T

    Douche……you repeat what I said word for word and then congratulate yourself on your brilliant thoughts!

    When I say that Nazism is the mirror image of Judaism I am 100% correct and I am simply quoting something that KMAC has mentioned repeatedly.

    Hitler and the Nazis were fighting fire with fire, which is the ONLY way to deal with Jewish influence. Whites must unify and play identity politics as whites or whites will go extinct.

    Ingroup preference obviously requires a bit of outgroup hostility by the very nature of ethnocentric preference.

    In any case, the root of most of the world’s ills has to do with Jewish hyper-ethnocentrism.

    • Replies: @G J T
    , @Bert
  83. Chinaman says:
    @AaronB

    If blacks in American society are violent, its race, not environment.

    I said that you can read history from DNA. For example, We know that blacks have, on average, 20% of white admixture. This is mainly on the white chromosome. Now, How did those white gene get there?

    Did whites marry these black? Under what circumstances did that union happen and how much of that was consensual? If some of those cases were through rape and other coercion, what were the socioeconomic status of men that were “spltting black oak” And were the process violent?

    Does all this have any influence on the behavior dispositions and higher inclination for violence that we see in blacks?

    Are Black violent because of the white genes in them?

    I guess you can say about the same about how the famine during the Great leap forward in China have led to the higher propensity for mainland Chinese to be more selfish and frugal when compared to Taiwanese.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    , @Chinaman
  84. G J T says:
    @Robert Dolan

    It’s not a mirror image, though. Judaism is defined by inversion, National Socialism by natural law. One common thread — fighting fire with fire, as you say — does not make one a mirror image of the other.

    In any case, I apologize for misinterpreting your comment. You know as well as I do that comparing Nazis and Zionists/Jews is a go-to tactic for apologists of Judaism who call themselves anti-Zionist, and for people who quite frankly lack any understanding of either one beyond their conservative buzzwords and slogans.

    • Agree: Robert Dolan
  85. “Laksin’s article contains a number of misquotes and quotes out of context. Most egregiously, I do not have empathy for Nazi genocide, and my point on Nazism being a mirror-image of Judaism refers only to socializing group members into accepting group goals, the importance of within-group cooperation in attaining these goals, and the well-documented perceptions of many anti-Semites that the ethnic cohesion of Jews was a trait worth emulating.”

    Above quote is Kevin Macdonald’s response to Laksin.

    Obviously Macdonald does not seek to promote aggression toward outgroups but simply wants for whites to be able to pursue their own ethnic interests without interference from meddling Jews.

  86. G J T says:
    @HeebHunter

    The great thing about the Jewish methodology of inversion and projection is that they expose themselves without any coercion, and as a result you can almost always discern a fundamental truth from the monstrous lies they tell. The more they kvetch about The Holocaust™️ and notsees, the easier it becomes for generally Jew-wise people to accept the truth about both. The people who virtue-signal and betray their race by running cover for Jews are never going to be saved. They can hit the showers with Moshe and Shlomo.

  87. Bert says:
    @Robert Dolan

    Ingroup preference obviously requires a bit of outgroup hostility by the very nature of ethnocentric preference.

    Your thinking about ethnocentricity would be more clear if you would explicitly recognize that positive and negative ethnocentricities need not be strongly coupled. Endogamous religious groups, which in effect constitute an ethnic group genetically, usually show positive, but not negative, ethnocentricity. Amish for example; if one were robbing me at gunpoint I wouldn’t be too worried about being needlessly killed.

    Most importantly, I would argue that Ashkenazim are exceptional in their degree of negative ethnocentricity, but not in their positive ethnocentricity. I’ve dealt with some rough, tough rednecks over property line issues, late rent, etc. and never saw any tendency to escalate to physical conflict. Yet twice in my life a Jew has put his fist in front of my face over a trivial disagreement. Small sample size but indicative.

    • Replies: @Robert Dolan
  88. TTSSYF says:
    @Wyatt

    Meanwhile, the U.S. and other historically white Western countries are promoting miscegenation as much as they can, as though extinguishing the Caucasian race as quickly as possible is a moral imperative. It used to be considered, in the words of my grandmother, “breeding down.” If we eventually are taken over by the Chinese, we will have deserved it.

    • Replies: @Dave Bowman
    , @PolarBear
  89. AaronB says:
    @Chinaman

    History shows us groups changing dramatically in short spaces of time, so environment must play a huge role.

    Its really that simple.

    Since 50% of variance is not generic, its impossible to say how much a behavior is genetic. Even if only 5% of variance is environmental, this could lead to huge differences in outcome. We share 95% of our DNA with flies, I believe. We should apply our principles consistently. If, in the case of genes, we recognize minute differences may lead to enormous differences, we must be prepared to say the same about environment, or its special pleading

    We also evolved these large “general purpose” brains, that allow us to adapt to almost any environment, and has no specific program. We scan and analyze the data our environment sends us, and we change behavior accordingly. We exploit opportunity, and respond to our environment.

    Germans, in the 18th century, were sleepy poets. Conquered by Napoleon, in the 19th century they became great warriors to defend themselves. They adapted. Jews, it was thought, were scholars and merchants, and could never be fighters and farmers. Jews said no thank you, and created Israel.

    If you want to say, that each time a group shows new capabilities or dramatically changes its behavior, it had the genetic potential all along, you’re just constructing a tautology.

    If you like, we might say humans are genetically programmed to be adaptable to a wide range of circumstance, such that group behavior and capability may change dramatically in a short space of time in response to environmental factors.

    Studies which show gene “association” with particular behaviors, are problematic, because of “second order effects”, and “third order effects”. In other words, a gene may make one more fearful, say, and that shows up down the line in seemingly unrelated behaviors.

    There is also something I call the “paradox effect” – a person with an elevated sense of anxiety, may take steps to alleviate that, and may “present” as a confident person, etc.

    There are other factors at play too.

    For instance, a huge factor in any behavior is motivation. But motivation is mysterious. We observe it rise and fall in groups. Sometimes a group is super motivated to perform wonders, then it loses motivation and becomes “decadent”.

    It could simply be, a pattern of “rise and fall”, exhaustion following effort, etc.

    In fact, motivation is probably the most important neglected factor in group behavior.

  90. AaronB says:
    @Chinaman

    Actually, I dont object to your point at all. I see no reason why we shouldn’t use DNA as clues to history. Why not?

    I’m not even opposed to weighing genetic factors when it comes to group behavior and capability. Only, it is one factor, and its peculiarly difficult to assess.

    And I think people do not sufficiently appreciate the difficulties in assessing the contribution of genes to outcome. It is actually far more difficult than is realized, and this isn’t because of methodological shortcomings, but in principle.

    For instance, performance on any metrics whatsoever = ability + motivation. Yet, motivation cannot be assessed scientifically (although it can be assessed intuitively and probabilistically). Questionnaires obviously don’t work.

    It is impossible, for instance, to assess the contribution of genes to Asian performance in STEM in the modern world. We simply don’t know what role changes in Asian motivation in response to historical events make.

    We know that historically, Asian culture had a pronounced literary bias, and an anti-technology and naturalistic philosophy that was very influential among the intellectual elite. This is prima facie evidence that Asians do not have a genetic predisposition for STEM.

    We also know that an important historical event that can be considered to have a massive effect on motivation recently occurred in Asia; the humiliating encounter with the West.

    So probabilistically, Asians experienced a dramatic change in their motivation levels in response to new data coming in from the environment, which they adapted to.

    The same argument applies to IQ. We simply don’t know how much of anyone’s score is a reflection of higher motivation. Some people take tests seriously, some don’t.

    Some people have been raised in a culture of effort, so that making maximum effort to excel is an ingrained habit.

    There are also “second order” effects at play here too. A habit of making maximum effort to excel, say because you were born into a culture with high anxiety levels (like Jews), may train the mind so that it has elevated abilities that are not directly genetic.

    People often point to adoptions of different race children, but the hkne is not the only cultural influence. The child us bombarded with messages from the wider culture.

    • Replies: @Chinaman
  91. @Curle

    Close but no cigar.

    The Bolsheviks were Jews and vice versa (with minor exceptions like the Hechaluz Zionists persecuted under Stalin).
    Lenin explicitely forbade the forming of a Jewish caucus of the RuSDP (b) for that very reason.
    IIRC the first boss goy in the secret services was I. Serow 1954.
    Inhowfar it was a specifically Jewish thing (you wouldn´t understand) or Lenin generally regarded hated minorities as more reliable is up for debate.

    • Replies: @Curle
  92. @Bert

    You are correct in your assessment of the Jewish character; they never forgive and they never forget….they have an atavistic hatred of white Christian people that goes beyond the rational.

    The nose is still kvetching about historical wrongs they supposedly suffered hundreds of years ago.

    That is the main difference between Jews and the goyim; the goyim operate in a Christian value system that is based on forgiveness while the Jewish operating strategy (going back to Bible times) seems to be genocidal against any perceived enemy.

    Whites will do anything to avoid a confrontation while Jews deserve the stereotype of always being in someone’s face and acting in an irrationally hyper-aggressive manner.

    The truly frightening thing about Jewish aggression is that it’s super-fueled by massive wealth and hyper-ethnocentricity…..while whites have neither wealth nor organization and thus have no means of defense.

  93. @AaronB

    Germans, in the 18th century, were sleepy poets

    Frederick the Great

  94. @JM

    What Darwin meant by “race” we would call “strain” or “population” – the defining factor is “genetic isolation” i.e. they do not mix in nature (which incidentally is the current definition of species).
    It is all a bit fuzzy – if you go full Talmudist (“yes, but …”) on the terms you can deconstruct anything; there are only two fixed points: The revised Linnéan species (fertile F2 bastards) – no one but the antiracists uses it any longer (and it is not absolute either) – and the 85% rule (read: If you can thoroughly mix two populations and pick them apart again with better than 85% accuracy, you are entitled to speak of subspecies).

    In the case of humans, classification in (multivariate) genetic “clusters” (10 to 15, roughly but not exactly the same as “races”) makes the most sense.

  95. AaronB says:

    Since 50% of variance is not generic, its impossible to say how much a behavior is genetic.

    I did not express myself well here.

    If I know that, on average,for instance, 50% of variance for violence is genetic, and 50% environmental, I cannot know in any individual case of violence if it is mostly environmental, mostly genetic, or a mix.

    This goes for groups as well. Therefore that information has limited utility in the real world.

    A group with a much larger predisposition for violence, in the right environment may be quite peaceful. A group with a low predisposition for violence, if it feels itself under sufficient provocation, may become exasperated, and violent.

    Every group and race inhabits a different “psychological history” that affects his behavior. Each group understands itself as being at a different historical juncture for its group, and is responding to different psychological factors.

    For instance, the “psychological landscape” inhabited by Whites, is that of a group that has conquered the world, and invented everything. It has reached the “top”. This will result in one set of behaviors.

    Asians inhabit a different mental world, and see themselves as at a different historical juncture. Asians see themselves as having to catch up, and prove themselves. Thus will lead to a quite different set of behaviors.

    Let’s take Jews and Arabs as it relates to Israel.

    Jews see the historical juncture their group has reached, as having suffered the worst calamity in their history, and almost being destroyed, to creating their own state, and having an opportunity to contribute to secular life for the first in centuries. This will lead to a peculiar type of motivation to defend that state.

    Arabs see themselves as a huge empire and a huge people that isn’t going anywhere, and has all the time in the world. There is lacking in any real sense if urgency, leading to lower motivation.

    But are Jews better fighters than Arabs? Who can say? They are at different historical junctures.

    If at a particular time and environment, variance is 50% genetic, this is not necessarily stable across time and environment.

    In a different environment, with historical events changing the psychological landscape, the variance may be more or less genetic.

    Therefore, any finding at a particular historical moment, cannot really tell us what the “stable” contribution genes are making here.

  96. geokat62 says:

    Lewontin’s Fallacy
    A more scientifically informed criticism of race can be found in the common criticism, “There are more differences within races than there are between them.”

    It has come to be known as “Lewontin’s Fallacy,” named after biologist Richard Lewontin (b.1929)

    Richard Lewontin’s Early Life:

    Lewontin was born in New York City, to parents descended from late 19th-century Eastern European Jewish immigrants.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Lewontin

    A discussion on race and no mention of the fraudster Franz Boas, the so-called “pioneer” of modern anthropology, who was the first to falsely claim that race was a “social construct”?

    Franz Boas’ Early Life:

    Franz Boas was born on July 9, 1858,[27] in Minden, Westphalia, the son of Sophie Meyer and Meier Boas. Although his grandparents were observant Jews, his parents embraced Enlightenment values, including their assimilation into modern German society. Boas’s parents were educated, well-to-do, and liberal; they did not like dogma of any kind. An important early influence was the avuncular Abraham Jacobi, his mother’s brother-in-law and a friend of Karl Marx, and who was to advise him through Boas’s career.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franz_Boas

    Notice a trend, goy?

    • Replies: @AaronB
  97. @PolarBear

    Lol is that why Asia is becoming cyberpunk while the (((west))) is now an AIDS orgy for niggers, kikes and sexual deviants?

    • Replies: @PolarBear
  98. anarchyst says:

    “Multiculturalism and diversity for thee but not for me” is the jewish mantra.

    Whites may have been involved in the “civil-rights (for everyone but whites)” movement but “the elephant in the room” is the jews who really spearheaded the “movement”.

    I came of age during the first so-called “civil-rights” movement and saw for myself the underhanded dealings, the demonization of decent, law-abiding whites, and in general, the deterioration of civil society.

    Almost all of the “civil-rights” workers and demonstration “handlers” were of one persuasion–New York based leftist communist jews. They cared not one wit about true “civil rights”, but were there to create hate and discontent among their black charges (who were too stupid or naive to see that they were being used to suborn and destroy legitimate government and society–a favorite communist tactic).

    These New York-based “carpetbaggers” fomented their hate and discontent, only to become future “civil-rights” attorneys, race-hustlers, and America-hating leftist communists…and the ADL and $PLC being invented.

    Those of us whites who were in the middle of this “civil-rights” revolution had a saying: “Behind every negro, there is a jew”. No truer words were spoken.

    Let’s not forget jewish infestation of the nation’s education and entertainment systems, (which continues to the present day), in which they can spread their jewish supremacist poison.

    The so-called “non-violent civil-rights demonstrations” were anything but “non-violent”. Robberies, rapes, and other criminal acts committed by jewish civil-rights handlers and their black “pets” were common, but never reported, as even the “mainstream media” of the day was “in on the game” and conveniently turned off their cameras during the acts of violence. You see, even then,”creating crises” was a part of the agenda.

    The “beginning of the end” of America was the use of federal troops against white Americans, which, in itself was a violation of “posse comitatus”–the prohibition of the use of federal troops for domestic law enforcement purposes.

    President Eisenhower, being of jewish extraction showed his visceral hatred of white gentiles by using federal troops to suppress constitutionally protected dissent.

    As most whites were (and still are) law-abiding, they (we) were “steamrollered” by the use of federal troops to crush our (white) honest dissent.

    We never recovered from those unconstitutional actions. It was all downhill from there…

    • Thanks: G J T
  99. @TTSSYF

    If we eventually are taken over by the Chinese, we will have deserved it

    This shit AGAIN ?

    What part of “Long before we are “taken over by the Chinese” we will be overrun and destroyed by the Blacks and Moslems put here by the Jews” don’t you understand ?

    • Replies: @TTSSYF
    , @obwandiyag
  100. KULCHUR LODGE RADIO – GREG JOHNSON


  101. AaronB says:
    @geokat62

    Race is a social construct, useful language is a social construct, because we choose how to divide the world. We choose what to focus on, where to draw the line, based on what we think is important.

    For instance, does our skin seperate us from our environment, or connect us? What we focus on, is socially constructed.

    Are what unites human groups, more important than what separates them? Your answer, is a docial construct.

    There is no point in reifying our categories, and getting fooled by language. Just because race is a social construct, does not mean it isn’t useful. We use language to divide the world in ways that help us.

    Instead reifying race, we should talk about how the concept helps us deal with reality. It is a social construct that may or may not be useful. In some ways yes, in others no.

    • Replies: @geokat62
    , @Malla
  102. AaronB says:
    @PolarBear

    Its impossible to deny that of all human groups, Europeans achieved the most, the longest.

    To a certain extent, this continues today. The West is richer and more creative than Asia, even today.

    That being said, White motivation has – understandably – declined as of late, while Asian motivation has risen.

    This is not necessarily a bad thing. White elites continue to be highly driven and outperform Asians, but aside from the elite, there has been a decline in motivation. Jews are also, as a group, much more motivated, for now.

    Again, not necessarily a bad thing- trust me, you don’t want to be raised by a Tiger Mother, or work like a Chinese factory hand.

    But current realities, should not be taken as anything more than just historically contingent facts. They are not timeless, they don’t tell us anything about racial “essences”.

    They are useful facts to know about today’s world, that have interesting abd complex explanations, but don’t reify them.

    • Agree: Onan the Barbarian
    • Replies: @PolarBear
    , @Chinaman
  103. PolarBear says:
    @TTSSYF

    Satans chosen have always promoted breeding down, namely with Blacks, for Whites. While those same Satanic Jews schmear nothing but Nordic, namely Danish, semen on their bagels. Just look at porn and Hollywood, both filled to the brim with Jewish pederasts pushing undesirable miscegenation on Whites.

  104. Dutton’s book adds nothing new. We’ve heard it all before thousands of times. He is totally boring and unoriginal. “Lewontin’s fallacy!!!” Derp.

  105. Race is illegitimate because you idiots whinge on about it all the time.

    Meanwhile, the rich steal our money. Congratulations on helping them.

  106. @Priss Factor

    “These regulations demean women, make them feel inadequate…,” runs the organisation’s [Human Rights Watch], statement. “Modern sport should adapt itself to support inclusion and non-discrimination rather than perpetuate exclusion and discrimination.”

    Funny how, whenever I see that word inclusion anymore, I think of Honest Joe Biden’s candid I-cannot-tell-a-lie statement:

    “We have put together, I think, the most extensive and inclusive voter-fraud organization in the history of American politics,”

    Can we expect that the next great social cause will be the self-identification of legitimate voters as ballot-box stuffers, and vice versa?

    • Replies: @Dieter Kief
  107. geokat62 says:
    @AaronB

    Are what unites human groups, more important than what separates them? Your answer, is a social construct.

    Let’s see how the Great Eagle answers this question:

    War is not conducted against anyone in the world until they are first offered peace (and refuse it), whether this is a Discretionary War or a War of Mitzvoh, as it says, “when you come close to the city to fight with it, you shall call to it to make peace” (Deut. 20:10). If they make peace and accept the Seven Commandments incumbent upon the Sons of Noah (Gentiles), none of them are killed, but they must pay us tribute, as it says, “and they shall be for you a tributary, and they shall serve you” (Deut. 20:11). If they propose to accept upon themselves the payment of the tribute but not servitude to us or they accept servitude but not the tribute, we ignore their proposal until they accept both. The servitude referred to here is one of disgrace and is demeaning. They are not to raise their heads up to Israel for any reason. They must be subjugated to us and may never be assigned to a Position over us. The tribute they must pay shall be for service of the king, with their bodies and their money… (source: Mishneh Torah, Kings and Wars, Chapter 6)

  108. FLgeezer says:
    @Robert Dolan

    Excellent post Mr. Dolan. I’ve experienced the hyper aggressiveness you refer to. Many of my hapless goy friends have too.

  109. PolarBear says:
    @AaronB

    White Sun vs Asian toilet roll. Asians do have a more stable and unchanging core.

  110. @Robert Dolan

    The truly frightening thing about Jewish aggression is that it’s super-fueled by massive wealth and hyper-ethnocentricity

    And the massive wealth and hyper-ethnocentricity is fueled by the Jewish aggression as well, making for an ideal positive feedback loop.

    The story is told how members of the faith in the Pale of Settlement would have secret enclaves in their synagogues, in which they would auction off the rights to be the sole financial provider for any particular goyem in the community. The auction proceeds would go to Jewish causes while the auctioned mark would find he had but one source to lend him money or buy his goods, on whatever terms were asked.

    Another ploy was to visit the family of a just-deceased goyem and demand the immediate repayment of a massive but undocumented loan that only just been transacted.

    • Replies: @HallParvey
  111. This is a good example of why ‘race realists’ like Dutton are scientifically illiterate:

    There are consistent genetic racial differences in the prevalence of many serious medical conditions. Sometimes these stay in populations because a single inherited allele had positive consequences in ancestral environments, overwhelming the negatives consequences for individual carriers of two alleles. An example is sickle cell anaemia, a condition associated with Sub-Saharan Africans. If you carry two copies of the mutant allele, then you develop this debilitating condition. If, however, you carry one copy, then you will likely be immune to malaria.[6] Cystic Fibrosis, a congenital disease among Northern European, is similar.[7] It only appears when two carriers of the faulty allele have a child, there being a 50 percent chance that such a child will have Cystic Fibrosis. Various hypotheses have been advanced to explain why Cystic Fibrosis has remained in European populations. One states that carrying a single copy of the faulty allele causes carriers to be better able to fight off tuberculosis.

    In reality:

    “Thus, neither the ApoL1 risk variants nor the sickle-cell allele are ‘black’ diseases because many ‘black’ populations do not have these alleles, and in the case of sickle cell many “nonblack” populations do have the allele (Fig. 14. 2).”

    – Templeton (2018)

    Ethnic groups in East and South Africa have less than 1% frequency of the sickle-cell allele. Sickle cell is clearly not “associated with Sub-Saharan Africans” (what a stupid claim). Similarly, you can find many ethnic groups in Northern Europe with very low frequency of cystic fibrosis. Dutton completely ignores these.

    “These big groups that we characterize as races are too heterogeneous to lump together in a scientific way. If you’re doing a DNA study to look for markers for a particular disease, you can’t use ‘Caucasians’ as a group. They’re too diverse.”
    – Dr. Jurgen K. Naggert, a geneticist at the Jackson Laboratory in Bar Harbor, Maine

    The problem with ‘race’ as continental and subcontinental groupings is that they group together too genetically diverse populations that have no use in biomedicine or population genetics. Notice dimwit-Dutton doesn’t even discuss this main objection to race at all in his article or book… I wonder why?

    • Replies: @Malla
  112. PolarBear says:
    @HeebHunter

    Asians have not surpassed the bar set by Whites. Yes, after Whitey is beaten to death by the BearJew an Asian goo-girl can lay on top for the 3 count.

  113. Curle says:
    @nokangaroos

    I don’t see the inconsistency between my comment illustrating that Nazism is not a necessary component of mass murder and your comment. Seems your comment supports the point I was making.

    • Agree: nokangaroos
  114. @obwandiyag

    Western elites use Third World immigration as a tool to target and destroy the economic populism of Western peoples. The elites know that ethnic loyalty comes first but this is problematic when it comes to European people, as they would resist the demographic changes that the elites are bringing about. So the elites use a wide variety of tricks to deal with this, the most effective of which has seemingly been the Nazi card.

    But anyway, race is obviously not illegitimate as nonwhites recognise they exist and can be rallied around to advance socio-political agendas. Nonwhites and elites are more or less on the same side, which is why nonwhite “leftists” support measures like mass immigration which bring down wages even for immigrant-background workers. They clearly are not economically rational and predictably value ethnicity over economics. Who cares if they are poorer than they would be if mass immigration was not happening, at least the country will reflect their people and values and history, a price worth paying.

    The people helping elites steal money the most are the race denialists who insist mass importing lots of Third World people while simultaneously and paradoxically outsourcing jobs won’t turn the West into a slightly better version of the Third World. The main benefactors of this are the elites (they will have eliminated the bourgeois middle class, always the driver of revolutions) and the nonwhites, who have been inculcated with hatred of Whites and will also gain better living standards than in their home countries.

    • Agree: Malla
  115. @Observator

    But now that we are civilized (sort of), this ancient protective response is maladaptive, …

    I don’t think that it is civilization that makes it maladaptive, but the level of crowding combined with the weapons at our disposal. Civilizations have made great use of it to compete against other civilizations, just as small groups did against other small groups.

    The wheel is still in spin as to how sustainable our current population level (and the crowding that accompanies it) might be.

    It seems to me that, barring extinction, we have two possible futures. In one our social environment reverts to one more similar to the one we evolved in (less crowded) and in the other we evolve to a more “domesticated” species that can sustain the crowding. Either could still sustain civilization but only in the second would the “protective response” be maladaptive.

    Neither path would be smooth and painless, either could mean a lot of blood and death, just in different fashions. I doubt that our intentions will determine the ultimate weight in the balance. More likely what men call fate or chance will matter most.

    Think about what the Han went through to arrive at this state…

    • Replies: @another fred
  116. @another fred

    And yes, I know the baby is Japanese, but the Chinese are similar and their history is better known.

  117. @The Spirit of Enoch Powell

    Funny comment.

    Most Brexit supporters voted for UK to leave EU because they were concerned about eastern-European (‘white’) especially Polish, Romanian and Bulgarian immigrants, not immigrants (‘non-whites’) from outside of Europe.

    Trying to divide popular immigration concerns as European/white versus non-European/non-white seems redundant.

  118. Chinaman says:
    @Chinaman

    This is mainly on the white chromosome

    I mean on the Y male chromosome…goddamn typos and autocorrect on my Huawei Mate X!

  119. Anonymous[136] • Disclaimer says:
    @Ultrafart the Brave

    The Theory of Evolution and The Big Bang Theory are totally different things.

    The only people who seem to have a problem with evolution are religious people experiencing cognitive dissonance.

    • Agree: Onan the Barbarian
    • Thanks: Rufus Clyde
    • Replies: @Ultrafart the Brave
  120. @Oliver D. Smith

    Most Brexit supporters voted for UK to leave EU because they were concerned about eastern-European (‘white’) especially Polish, Romanian and Bulgarian immigrants, not immigrants (‘non-whites’) from outside of Europe.

    They were concerned with both. European immigrants (and more particularly Eastern European immigrants) for making use of the freedom of travel and work privileged and undermining wages for native workers in such occupations as plumber, electrician, carpenter etc and they are concerned with non-European immigration due to its political and cultural implications, as it is much much harder to assimilate nonwhites than it is to assimilate Europeans.

    I think Farage’s “Breaking Point” poster showing columns of Middle Eastern refugees/migrants at the Croatia-Slovenia border also have the wrong idea to the public that the EU was somehow responsible for British immigration policy pertaining to immigration from non-EU nations.

    The EU, particularly in the minds of older voters who carried Brexit over the line, represents a sort of background music to their nations decline, since Britain joined the EU, all sorts of unpleasant things have happened like the massive demographics shift, the breakdown of native morals, the rise of political correctness and so on. The EU is (wrongly) seen as a causal factor by many people.

    Dividing immigration concern by White and nonwhite is only relevant when discussing cultural concerns, as far as economic concerns goes there is little difference. However the fact is that many nonwhites who proclaim to be left wing support mass immigration as these nonwhites latch onto the left wing as a vehicle for their ethnic agenda.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  121. Chinaman says:
    @AaronB

    We also know that an important historical event that can be considered to have a massive effect on motivation recently occurred in Asia; the humiliating encounter with the West.

    Well..that humiliation actually begun a few hundred years earlier with the Manchurian occupation. History can be summarised as “ Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men.”. That’s evolution in a nutshell. Those few centuries of hardship MIGHT have accelerated evolution and selected for a extremely resilient genotype in China.

    It is impossible, for instance, to assess the contribution of genes to Asian performance in STEM in the modern world. We simply don’t know what role changes in Asian motivation in response to historical events make.

    I estimated that China have about 30-35 times the number of 140 IQ individuals than America. The fact that China have half of the world’s STEM graduate does seem to correspond with a world average IQ of 85. I believe that you can fully explain the Asian STEM “anomaly” without resorting to other variables once you take into account IQ. There is an element of hard work in here of course but STEM are fields that requires raw IQ. Motivation or even hard work ain’t going to help you much if you have a 2 digit IQ.

  122. The (((same folks ))) who insist race isn’t real are now claiming men and women are identical, so much so a man may become a woman simply by making the claim.

    Historically, the only way half-functional multicultural sewers don’t run red has been when unabashed Whites run the show. Shit fell apart just by Trump and #gopertards pretending Whites don’t exist. How will things fare now that anti-White creep biden has stolen the election?

    • Replies: @Dr. Charles Fhandrich
  123. Chinaman says:
    @AaronB

    The naive reductionist view is of course unsatisfactory and insufficient when it comes to explaining every anomaly or history coincidences . It is an average which assumes mean reversion and noise cancelling will work in the long run…

    There will be a lot of volatility in the short run and all of us can be “fooled by randomness” or survival bias if we make were to make simple extrapolation into the future based on the last 500-1000 years. That kind of time scale is too short to draw conclusions on anything when it comes to biology.

  124. Curle says:

    “ Most Brexit supporters voted for UK to leave EU because they were concerned about eastern-European (‘white’) especially Polish, Romanian and Bulgarian immigrants, not immigrants (‘non-whites’) from outside of Europe.”

    Why do you believe ‘most’ are making that distinction?

  125. Anonymous[401] • Disclaimer says:
    @Priss Factor

    Ooooo-weeeeee, mama!

    A 7,900-word (8,051 with cut-and-pastes cites!) comment on a 3,100-word essay?

    Why not submit your comments as articles?

    • Agree: TTSSYF
  126. @Oliver D. Smith

    Maybe white Europeans are seen as a threat to jobs because they are mostly gainfully employed and pay taxes while the others … Or perhaps that’s how it was presented by the Brexiters because of possible accusations of racism if they condemned other immigrants, but it doesn’t imply that most were not concerned about that too.

  127. @RonaldB

    Liberal Jewish organizations are not the only European religions supporting idiocies like mass immigration. You have the United Methodists, the Universalists, the Vatican Catholics, the Lutherans, etc.

    The groups mentioned are slaves to Judaism. They are proud to be owned by the God of the Jews. Their God is half Jew. His godliness rests on the teaching of Jew prophets.

    Never underestimate the ability of the Jews to sell really great philosophical concepts to non-Jew Europeans. Christianity, Communism, Socialism, Integration. The only question is, is there a philosophy too far. As of now, the answer is no.

    • Agree: TTSSYF
  128. anarchyst says:
    @Robert Dolan

    We also have to get away from the “judeo-Christian” mindset, as well…

    Using the “Old Testament” for “laws” is wrong.

    [MORE]

    Yes, the Ten Commandments are a good guide which proscribes certain behaviors, but the rest of mosaic law relies on a vindictive, vengeful “god” to exact “punishment” on “his people”.

    That my work fine for jews, as they have their supremacist “Talmud” to rely on, but “for the rest of us”, it won’t wash.

    Jews were (and still are) misbehaving and need a “firm hand” to keep them “in line”, something that is sorely lacking today.

    Judaism is an insular belief system that shuns outsiders, prohibits proselytization, and promotes a form of supremacy, relegating all gentiles (non-jews) to the status of livestock-subhumans with souls, only to be used for the advancement and benefit of jews.

    In fact, slavery (of goyim) is still condoned and encouraged in the jewish Talmud. In addition, the jewish Talmud condones pedophilia, allowing lecherous old jews to rape children as long as they are “three years and a day” of age.

    The barbaric practice of circumcision (male genital mutilation) is also suspect, the mohel fellating the infant after the “deed is done” passing on (who knows what) STDs to the infant. Sick…

    In fact, every jewish “holiday” (holy day) is based on the celebration of genocide and destruction of gentiles.

    Our present troubles are a result of a jewish cabal taking over political decisions in our nominally “multicultural” country.

    Tying Judaism to Christianity was a clever trick used by the jews to “cement” their claim to the “land of Israel” and of the covenant, to which I reply, “God is not a real estate agent”.

    Jews rejected the covenant when they murdered Jesus Christ. Their covenant with (their) God was then “null and void”.

    It is the flawed Schofield translation of the Bible that elevated jews to the status of Christianity’s “elder brothers”, which was then reinforced by the Catholic (flawed) “Vatican II Ecumenical Council” in the 1960s.

    I cringe when I hear well-meaning people talk about out judeo-Christian heritage.

    Nothing could be further from the truth.

    The god of judaism is a vengeful god, totally unlike the merciful and welcoming God of Christianity.

    Christianity welcomes ALL, regardless of nationality or social status, not true of judaism.

    Jews DID murder Jesus Christ and TOOK FULL RESPONSIBILITY FOR DOING SO.
    Sad to say, even the present-day (post-Vatican II ecumenical council) Catholic church has bought into absolving the jews for Jesus Christ’s murder.

    As is the case, even today, the jews got others, the Romans to do their dirty work for them, the crucifixion of Jesus Christ.

    How can Christians have the same values as the Jews; the very people who denounced and betrayed the founder of Christianity, Jesus Christ, and call for his execution (by others, of course, that is the Jewish way).

    It makes absolutely no sense at all.

    Jews have no respect for Christianity, for Jesus Christ or Mary, his mother, who are both honored as Prophets in Islam, but instead, Jews spit on hearing their names and do the same while passing a Christian of any kind or a Christian Church in Israel. They have no respect for Christians or any other religion.

    It is time the Jewish lobbies and the American Government leaders as well as the evangelical Christian leaders who mislead the poor American young into joining the military and believing that they are doing something for God and Christianity by fighting Israel’s wars were named, shamed and arrested and tried for treason.
    In a perverse sort of way, israel’s favorite “war song” is “Onward Christian Soldiers”
    There…I’ve said it…

    • Thanks: G J T
  129. You can judge a book by looking at its cover. Five people, 100% of whom are male: odd that. It’s as if …

  130. @Peripatetic Itch

    The story is told how members of the faith in the Pale of Settlement would have secret enclaves in their synagogues, in which they would auction off the rights to be the sole financial provider for any particular goyem in the community.

    Obviously Jews are intelligent enough to look out for their self interest. Jews hanging around the synagogue arguing about the philosophy of ownership and how to increase profits, will alway trump nonJews sitting around the fire discussing the relative qualities of the latest halfback.

  131. “In some cases, something is adaptive under Darwinian conditions but is maladaptive under modern conditions.”
    There are no “Darwinian” or “non-Darwinian” conditions. There are just biological conditions, and with the advent of modern medicine and social security ours have changed, but they still remain biological conditions. In the old days intelligence favoured survival, whereas today dumbness favours having plenty of progeny, and thus we are on our way towards idiocracy.

  132. Thomm says:

    Except that no discussion of race is complete without a deep examination of the unusually high variance in the quality of whites, which is revealed with research that I have posted here.

    The white genome has a special feature that ensures that all undesirable traits fall into a small fraction of the population (estimated at 10-20%), and the remaining 80-90% of us this remain fully free of flaws.

    This creates a bi-modal distribution of white ‘quality’. Hence, white quality is not even a continuum, but rather a functional race of exceptional people, daylight in between, and a defective subrace where 10-20% reside. This subrace effectively functions as a wastebasket into which unwanted genetic waste is dumped, for efficient removal from our genome.

    The quality of the parents has no bearing on whether their offspring will be functional or a member of this ‘wastebasket’ subrace. Poor, uneducated white parents still produce functional offspring 80-90% of the time, while even the most impressive parents produce an offspring designed for wastebasket purposes 10-20% of the time. In that way, the white genome is very egalitarian as far as which parents are going to bear the misfortune of a boy that becomes a WN homo, or a girl that becomes a radical feminist.

    Since this defective subrace is not meant to reproduce, it entirely explains why the men become White Trashionalists, while the women become the fat bluehaired feminists. Both of these groups are equal in number, and neither has a significant presence of people from the other gender.

    More proof :

    We just saw that at least 54% of white women voted for Trump and downticket GOP candidates. Yet the White Trashionalist community has virtually zero women in it, aside from a couple of elderly fag hags (Rosie and Alden, in the case of this website). The WN community obviously has nothing to do with the GOP or support of President Trump.

    How can there be no women? Could it have something to do with the fact that 40%+ of WNs openly and proudly say that :

    i) They would rather have sex with a white man than a black woman, since racial loyalty trumps sexual orientation, and producing no baby is better than producing a mulatto baby.
    ii) They have no problem with transgenderism, since the race of the person did not change, so nothing meaningfully changed about their suitability as a sexual partner.

    This pattern becomes evident from viewing the comments on any WN-heavy website. The overwhelming homosexuality of the WN community is just one of the reasons that the ideology will never be able to recruit heterosexuals.

    Politics is a circle, and that is why WNs and antifags freely cross over, given the almost total ideological similarities between the two. In fact, participating in antifa-type activities gives WNs rare access to the females of their defective subrace. Hence, when the police round up the degenerates, the photos of arrestees looks like this :

    [MORE]

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTQmZA3WmPCNXirpfaemW_HLjYEueWPK_jyKQ&usqp=CAU

    Notice how defective they look, from their faces alone. They are too far removed from the functional white race to be considered members of the same race. Once again, politics is a circle, and WNs and antifags freely cross over into each others’ ranks. The two should not even be distinguished, for reasons described above.

    PostScript : As this is a 140 IQ topic that discusses 70-IQ subjects, the only response these 70-IQ WN wiggers have to my profound and accurate analysis is to accuse me of being a ‘South Asian’, which is false as there is zero proof, and even Ron Unz admitted that he made that up just to test if the WNs on this site will believe anything (as is the true purpose of this website). Thus, any WN who claims that is just broadcasting how much they love to believe everything that a Media Jew tells them.

  133. @Peripatetic Itch

    Funny how, whenever I see that word inclusion anymore, I think of Honest Joe Biden’s candid I-cannot-tell-a-lie statement:

    “We have put together, I think, the most extensive and inclusive voter-fraud organization in the history of American politics,”

    He did maneuver through quite some of rocky terrain here with all these extensive/exclusive/inclusive/intensive bumps he had to avoid – and that awfully stressful beginning of his sentence might have detracted him enough to lose it completely by the time he started to finish it.

  134. Corvinus says:
    @anarchyst

    Race is linked to biology; ethnicity is linked to culture. Race is a biological and social construct. Ethnicity is a social construct. Ethnicity is the term for the culture of people in a given geographic region, including their language, heritage, religion and customs. To be a member of an ethnic group is to conform to some or all of those practices. Certainly, race and ethnicity overlap, but they are distinct. For example, a Japanese-American would probably consider himself a member of the Asian race, but, if he does not engage in any of the practices or customs of his ancestors, he might not necessarily identify with the ethnicity, but rather consider himself to be American. Of course, American is not a “race”, it is a conglomeration of distinct ethnic groups all rolled into one, with a common cultural bond. Scandanavians, which are from the white race, are descendants from several distinct (North) Germanic tribes. Through intermarriage, they developed a unique set of customs that incorporated Old Norse traditions. So, in a nutshell, race refers to a group of people who possess similar and distinct physical characteristics, while ethnicity refers to a a category of people who regard themselves to be different from other groups based on common ancestral, cultural, national, and social experience.

    Remember, natural science consists of mental constructs, created with the objective of explaining sensory experience of our world. Human beings affix labels to make sense of our environment. For example, the California spotted owl is an animal, i.e. biological construct. The name of the creature is a human designation—strix occidentalis, i.e. human construct. That is, binomial nomenclature refers to a formal system, developed by people, to name species. The California owl was not a “California owl” until someone actually and specifically labeled it. Race, biology, ethnicity–all are concepts created by man as an organizational tool to offer a consistency about the natural world in which they observe.

  135. Corvinus says:
    @Nancy Pelosi's Latina Maid

    “Homogeneity is strength, but nationalism is Kryptonite to a Jew. That’s why they promote dissolving America’s borders, and why our Magic Dirt has given up the ghost.”

    Everyone has heard of Celts, Anglo-Saxons, and Vikings. And most of us are familiar with the idea that the English are descended from Anglo-Saxons, who invaded eastern England after the Romans left, while most of the people in the rest of the British Isles derive from indigenous Celtic ancestors with a sprinkling of Viking blood around the fringes. Yet there is no agreement among historians or archaeologists on the meaning of the words “Celtic” or “Anglo-Saxon”. What is more, new evidence from genetic analysis indicates that the Anglo-Saxons and Celts, to the extent that they can be defined genetically, were both small immigrant minorities. Neither group had much more impact on the British Isles gene pool than the Vikings, the Normans or, indeed, immigrants of the past 50 years. Essentially, the English are Mutts.

    America has always experienced this backlash political milieu, a sort of quasi-civil war: in one corner are the unpretentious and besieged “authentic Americans”, and in the other corner are the hordes of the unwashed and the undesired. According to Who/Whom are contemptuous of the tastes and attitudes of the people who inhabit, or seek to inhabit, the “land of milk and honey”. When the chairman of the Republican National Committee in announced in 1992 that “We Are America” and “those other people are not”, he was providing yet another version of a century-old formula–“immigrants are the enemy of real Americans”. The problem, of course, is that today’s “authentic Americans” or “real Americans” tend not recall the trials and tribulations of their great-great grandfathers and grandmothers.

    https://hti.osu.edu/opper/lesson-plans/immigration/images/looking-backward

    Remember, the Irish, the Italians, the Poles…ALL had been denigrated and downgraded by nativists as not being one of them. It made little difference that those three groups were European, they were deemed “inferior” and incapable of understanding the fundamentals of representative democracy. Sure, they were “better” than blacks and browns, so long as they knew their proper place on the European ethnic hierarchy. Somehow, someway, that mentality changed.

    Magic dirt, indeed.

    Interestingly enough, Alt Right leader Vox Day says…

    “Many, if not most, descendants of immigrants are not the Posterity of the then-People of the United States. Neither are people living in Mexico, Germany, Israel, or even Great Britain. The U.S. Constitution was not written for them, nor was it ever intended to secure the Blessings of Liberty for them. The idea that the Constitution was intended to do anything at all for immigrants, resident aliens, or foreigners is as absurd as the idea that its emanations and penumbras provide them with an unalienable right to an abortion. The fact that courts have declared otherwise is totally irrelevant.”

  136. @The Spirit of Enoch Powell

    I disagree. It’s probably easier to assimilate immigrants from Commonwealth countries than eastern-Europeans. Commonwealth countries already have a high percentage who speak English fluently (for many its also their first language) and share many cultural and historical links to UK since they were former British colonies (with the exception of Mozambique and Rwanda that have no historical ties to the British Empire) while eastern-European countries don’t have this connection; most Polish or Romanian immigrants don’t either speak English fluently. There appears to be survey evidence that British citizens prefer or rank the top immigrants from some Commonwealth countries – Australia and Canada. Of course, those immigrants are predominantly the same Angl0-Celtic ancestry as ‘white British’ and are Christian-countries, however, if you look at the same survey evidence, you find British citizens prefer Indian immigrants than Romanian immigrants, while Pakistan and Romanian immigrants are treated roughly similar, so it’s more complicated than arguing white British will always prefer white immigrants over non-white immigrants as well as Christian immigrants over non-Christian immigrants.

    • Replies: @geokat62
    , @Malla
    , @GomezAdddams
  137. @Observator

    But now that we are civilized (sort of), this ancient protective response is maladaptive,

    Sez who? Maladaptive in what sense? Maladaptive to what goal? And how do you presume to know what traits are ultimately adaptive versus maladaptive when the future is an unknown?

  138. Xi says:

    I’ve found that probably 90% of arguments against race fall into either the continuum fallacy, lewontin’s fallacy, or claim that it is “social construct” therefore meaningless (this one is most obviously a bad argument because all scientific models as well as any sort of labelling at all are social constructs).

    • Agree: GomezAdddams
  139. @Thomm

    Those photos are cherry-picked. Thousands of Antifa were arrested and had their mug shots taken; in response, alt-right/WNs took the ugliest few dozen photos out of like 2000 (and even photo-shopped a couple to make them look even more weird).

    I’m not a fan of antifa, but cherry-picking some mugshots to call an entire group “ugly” and “spiteful mutant” is rather lame.

    Dutton’s claims about right-wing people being on average more attractive is also debunked here:

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Spiteful_mutant_hypothesis#Spiteful_mutations_as_ugliness

  140. TTSSYF says:
    @Dave Bowman

    Aren’t we already being overrun and destroyed by blacks (I don’t capitalize) and, if not Muslims, others put here by Jews?

  141. Of course race is real,else how would blacks know whom to hate?

  142. Curle says:
    @AaronB

    “ History shows us groups changing dramatically in short spaces of time, so environment must play a huge role.”

    History shows mostly the opposite of dramatic changes. Work hard to depress your nation’s productivity through insane economic policies and yes you will see an Argentina fall for a period. But in the main, your reading of history is focusing at temporary extremes not the norm.

  143. @Ultrafart the Brave

    What precisely do you mean by “this theory being indoctrinated into students as a fact”, and what is the problem with this practice?

    If you don’t know what “basic Darwinian principles” are, then how do you know that the existence of races within the human species does not require the application of such principles? Are you trying to say that racial differences are not the result of the principles of natural selection in action? Did Jeebus do it?

    • Replies: @Ultrafart the Brave
  144. @Robert Dolan

    “Whites” did NOT vote to open the borders in 1965 and frankly I am SICK of people like you promoting the Jew narrative on this topic.

    Celler and Javitz wrote the legislation for The Immigration Act of 1965, after organized Jewry lobbied for DECADES to open the borders of every white Christian nation on earth.

    Odd that the Jews could accomplish this without a majority (white) in both the Congress and Senate. Who was the Jew President that signed the bill?

    This is where every Jew blamer falls flat. If a Jew tells you to rape your daughter, whose fault is it when she shows up pregnant?

    While I certainly don’t like the Jews who are dedicated to the eradication of my tribe, I can’t blame them for trying. But I can and DO blame each and every white man who does the Jews’ bidding and harms his own people. The concept of the “race traitor” is something that everyone is going to have to come to grips with if there is any chance whatsoever of preserving our kind.

    There’s a reason why Treason is a capital crime.

    • Replies: @geokat62
    , @Robert Dolan
  145. Whitewolf says:

    Another supposed problem with race is that developing the concept leads to bad consequences. It legitimizes “racist groups,” “inspires hatred,” and so forth.

    By that reasoning acknowledging your family as something separate from the rest of humanity leads to hatred. Of course all talk of “racist groups” is centered on Whites. The same people pushing such nonsense have no problems with non-Whites being “racist”. They call themselves anti-racist when in reality they are just anti-White.

  146. geokat62 says:

    If the commenters are right that race isn’t a biological reality, then how can we have a system built on systemic racism, or have a society dominated by white privilege, or one ruled by white supremacists?

    And if multiculti is truly the new utopia, both Londonistan (the stabbing capital of the world) and Paris (the biggest shithole in Europe) are exposing that big lie.

    This shift away from ethno-nationalism to civic-nationalism (which inevitably leads to multiculti), is inorganic. It didn’t arise from the grassroots. It was foisted on the people from above. Jewish Supremacist Organizations (JSOs) came to the realization that “love of country” isn’t good for the Jews. That’s why Never again! means saying goodbye to “blood and soil” and hello to “multiculti.”

    Finally, if these posters sincerely believe ethno-nationalism is an evil, racist construct and must, therefore, be immediately replaced by civic-nationalism, they should be at the front of the line calling for the dismantling of the Jewish state. The biggest question I have is, Why aren’t they?

  147. geokat62 says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    however, if you look at the same survey evidence, you find British citizens prefer Indian immigrants than Romanian immigrants

    Truth be told, most indigenous Brits prefer not to become a minority in their own country:

    Approximately 7 in 10 Britons showed concern over the demographic changes they’d been presented with.

    https://wewereneverasked.co.uk/home

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  148. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    I disagree. It’s probably easier to assimilate immigrants from Commonwealth countries than eastern-Europeans.

    I disagree, it is easier to assimilate Eastern Europeans than non White commonwealth country populations. You over estimate the Empire, Poland is more similar to the UK in lifestyle than India is. Always was, always will be. Language is not everything.

    however, if you look at the same survey evidence, you find British citizens prefer Indian immigrants than Romanian immigrants,

    They are brainwashed. But ofcourse it could also be because of the difference in experience with educated Indian elites contrasted with experiences White native Britons have with criminal Easter European gypsies who call themselves “Romanians”.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  149. geokat62 says:
    @Stan d Mute

    Who was the Jew President that signed the bill?

    Lyndon Baines Johnson?

    Excerpts from Jewish Site Claims LBJ Was a Jew:

    A key resource for uncovering LBJ’s pro-Jewish activity is the unpublished 1989 doctoral thesis by University of Texas student Louis Gomolak, “Prologue: LBJ’s Foreign Affairs Background, 1908-1948.” Johnson’s activities were confirmed by other historians in interviews with his wife, family members and political associates…

    Additional Note

    Lyndon Johnson’s maternal ancestors, the Huffmans, apparently migrated to Frederick, Maryland from Germany sometime in the mid-eighteenth century. Later they moved to Bourbon, Kentucky and eventually settled in Texas in the mid-to-late nineteenth century.

    According to Jewish law, if a person’s mother is Jewish, then that person is automatically Jewish, regardless of the father’s ethnicity or religion. The facts indicate that both of Lyndon Johnson’s great-grandparents, on the maternal side, were Jewish.

    These were the grandparents of Lyndon’s mother, Rebecca Baines. Their names were John S. Huffman and Mary Elizabeth Perrin. John Huffman’s mother was Suzanne Ament, a common Jewish name. Perrin is also a common Jewish name.

    Huffman and Perrin had a daughter, Ruth Ament Huffman, who married Joseph Baines and together they had a daughter, Rebekah Baines, Lyndon Johnson’s mother. The line of Jewish mothers can be traced back three generations in Lyndon Johnson’s family tree. There is little doubt that he was Jewish.

    https://nationalvanguard.org/2017/05/jewish-site-claims-lbj-was-a-jew/

    • Thanks: Maowasayali
    • Replies: @RonaldB
  150. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Stop blabbering like a fool with idiotic logic. Just because different races share some traits does not mean race does not exist. A Dutchman will always be genetically much more closer to an Englishman over an African or Yemeni whether you like it or not.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  151. Whitewolf says:

    If You Are Interested in “Race,” Then You Are Probably “Racist”

    If you are interested in racists then you are probably anti-White.

  152. Superman and Batman should not be scoffed at and same with Santa Claus—-

  153. @The Spirit of Enoch Powell

    My god are you confused.

    Oh, wait a minute. I get it. You’re a troll. Trolls often say totally confused things. I don’t know if it’s that they’re stupid or the talking points memos they get are blurred.

    But you shore be smupid.

  154. Whether race is real or not is a moot point.

    Whether it is or not, you are idiots for whanging on about the subject all the time.

    Instead of the only thing that matters–money.

    (And I agree, of course immigration takes food out of our mouths. Immigration’s taking away of jobs is, btw, just as deleterious, if not more, for blacks and native Hispanics as it is for whites. But you don’t get the point. Immigrants are not bad because they are individually bad. They are bad as a group because the groups takes away the last jobs, while their foreignness permanently prevents union-organizing.)

    And I love the one above who thinks the rich and the blacks united are out to get him. I bet his buck teeth stick straight out, his glasses are like bottle-bottoms, ears like Dumbo’s, eyes crossed as a dipsomaniac’s, and he eats ice cream cones by smashing them into his forehead. Or else he’s a particularly dumb troll.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
  155. @Dave Bowman

    Sorry. Your premise is right, but your qualification is wrong.

    Overrun, not by blacks and Muslims–by Mexicans, Indians, and Chinese.

    • Replies: @HeebHunter
    , @Malla
  156. @geokat62

    I don’t trust that survey data – it’s from Mark Collett (a literal neo-Nazi) and Laura Towler (fascist, white nationalist). They likely made it up.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Collett
    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Laura_Towler

    That said, reliable surveys have repeatedly shown around 70% of the British population want a reduction in immigration. However, that doesn’t equate to be concerned about ‘white British’ becoming a minority. I think few people are concerned about the latter, no higher than 20% (and most of those won’t be at all fanatical about it like how Collett is).

    • Replies: @geokat62
  157. @Stan d Mute

    Read “The Creature From Jekyll Island.”

    We didn’t vote for the FED in 1913.

    We didn’t vote for the Immigration Act of 1965.

    We didn’t vote for abortion.

    We didn’t vote for porn.

    Jewish donors/organized Jewry run the entire political system, the intelligence agencies, Wall St. and finance, academia, media…..they have command of every control point of our society.

    With vast unlimited wealth they are able to buy off all of the leadership of both “sides.” Those they can’t buy off they threaten and blackmail and KILL.

    Yes, there are shabbos goy traitors for sure…..but organized Jewry is the head of the snake.

    • Agree: PolarBear, Druid55
  158. @obwandiyag

    True, North Africans and Middle Easterners are White according to the offcial federal census on ethnicities.
    So only Mexicans and Chinese are the real invaders. Indians are based Aryans though, sure to help us put those chinks in their place!
    Hehe

  159. @Oliver D. Smith

    Herbert W Armtrong was the man and his World Tomorrow had ALL the answers and attending Ambassador College was next best to being in the Elecroral College.

  160. @Thomm

    Your so-called IQ140 analysis of a so-called IQ70 subject is entirely mistaken. If you really think that white nationalists are degenerated people, I would advise you to read their websites (or watch their videos).

    For starters try following sites: The Occidental Observer, Counter-Currents, National Vanguard, American Renaissance, Renegade Tribune, John de Nugent, Daily Andrea Ostrov, Irish Savant and Eurocanadian.ca. You will see that their content is of high quality with no trace of degeneracy whatsoever. And the idea that most white nationalists are homosexuals and that there is a cross over to their opposite the Antifas is too ridiculous to take seriously.

    Next time you try to troll find something better.

  161. @RonaldB

    Jews bribed sociopath whites they promoted into politics in the first place to pass the 1965 immigration act. Jews are to blame not white people. Just because some white people are traitors does not absolve jews who’s control of the money from debt scam amplifies their power. You are a fraud.

  162. Malla says:
    @obwandiyag

    not by blacks and Muslims–by Mexicans, Indians, and Chinese.

    If you mean the USA, you are right, but it is different for Europe. In Europe it really is more Blacks and Muslims.

  163. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Spiteful_mutant_hypothesis#Spiteful_mutations_as_uglines

    LOL. Rational Wiki is not that rational. It is a Commie Zionist White genocide promoting outlet of propaganda and bullshit.

  164. 2020 is 1984. Big Other says male is female. Abnormal is Normal. Black is White. Emmanuel Goldstein declares that only one race matters, HIS. Every single time!

  165. RT says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    If most Brits suported such view, they signed the death sentence of their country.

  166. @Malla

    A Dutchman will always be genetically much more closer to an Englishman over an African or Yemeni whether you like it or not.

    Yes. Isolation-by-distance explains most of human population genetics (so an Englishman will be genetically closer to Dutchman than a Yemenite Arab). This is uncontroversial.

    My argument is not against race as a local breeding population (Dutch, English, Yemenite Arab to use your examples) but grouping together such local gene pools into large heterogenous groups. It makes no sense for example to group together Yemenite Arabs with Dutch and/or English as “Caucasoid” as early 20th century physical anthropologists did. Nor does it make sense to group Icelanders with Sardinians (or southern Europeans & northern Europeans in general, only unless someone is looking at a superficial character under climatic selection like skin colour).

    I’ve never denied local breeding populations in population genetics & biomedicine. If someone wants to call those ‘races’, fine by me (although admittedly the semantics may cause confusion so I prefer to use the term local breeding population or simply ‘local population’). So we can talk of a Dutch race, English race etc., but not a European, Caucasoid or African race.

    Like so many other s0-called ‘race realists’ – Edward Dutton seems to set up the straw man fallacy that says the race denial position is denying local populations. Yet I’m not aware of any population geneticist who has ever said that; Lewontin certainly never has done (he sampled many local populations in his 1972 blood-group study). Rather his work rejects clustering local populations. it’s a semantics issue what we call those.

    • Replies: @Malla
    , @mikemikev
  167. geokat62 says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Mark Collett (a literal neo-Nazi) and Laura Towler (fascist, white nationalist)

    Anyone who wants the indigenous people to remain a majority in their ethnic homeland is now ipso facto a neo-Nazi/fascist in your books? Tell me something, Ollie, have you ever accused a Zionist of being a neo-Nazi/fascist for wanting an ethnic homeland for the Jewish people?

    They likely made it up.

    Sure they did. I believe you.

    However, that doesn’t equate to be concerned about ‘white British’ becoming a minority. I think few people are concerned about the latter, no higher than 20% (and most of those won’t be at all fanatical about it like how Collett is).

    Oh, so you feel comfortable summarily dismissing the survey results (that around 70% of white British are concerned about becoming a minority) in favour of your own hunch that it’s “no higher than 20%”? Unless you can produce evidence that corroborates your assertion that they lied, I’ll stick to the survey estimate and pass on your gut feel, as it may just be indigestion.

    • Replies: @Malla
    , @Oliver D. Smith
  168. How many human “races” are there if human “races” are real?

    Why do “race” realists have an obsession with the unscientific sociologically-derived term “race” in regards to the scientific identification of the human animal subpopulations’ genetic differences?

    There are obviously way way more than 3 large subset groups of humans that there is a very effective and scientifically accurate term already used for another animal that’s very close to humans in terms of living quarters.

    They are called dogs.

    And the scientifically valid term is called breeds.

    There are many different breeds of humans as there are many different breeds of dogs.

    Just as all those breeds are still dogs.

    All the current breeds of humans that exist today are homo sapien sapiens that have absorbed all other minority humanoid species on the planet over the last few million years, which account for the majority of physical and genetic differences in human subpopulations.

    It’s how we got to where we are now. Any scientist that doesn’t work for Breitbart, the Sociology Department of the University of California Berkley, or for Israel’s Hasbara counter-intelligence psychological warfare unit 8200 knows this is verifiable fact as per the undersranding of the admixture of different Neanderthals, multiple Denisovans, a plethora of African hominids, and other yet-to-be-identified hominids from other parts of the world present in various current human subpopulation DNA.

    And yet, these “race”-obsessed people harp on the “scientific” validity of “whites” and “blacks” as homogeneous races with in-built solidarity (never proven and dubiously derived from biblical sources such as the Torah, Talmud, and Kabbalah — of which is never mentioned in the “race” discussion nor is the coincidental Black vs White checkered floor Freemasonic Divide and Conquer Hegelian Dialectic pattern Order “Out of Chaos” Dark to Light Kabbalah symbolism of “race”).

    My question is why?

    Why use the term “race”?

    Why insist on its use and double down on it when we all know it is not accurate and dubiously derived and when there is a much more precise, granular, scientific, and generally accepted term used for classifying other animals’ subpopulations called breeds?

    How can someone born on the Indian subcontinent be seriously considered a Caucasian, the same as a Norwegian?

    It is blatantly idiotic and meant to cause confusion on purpose.

    Breeds are very close to ethnicity or tribe in terms of accurate identification of human subpopulations genetically.

    This would mean there are 100s or 1000s of different human subpopulations living today, not the Kabbalistic Freemasonic 3 “races”.

    Which would mean that the “racial” solidarity notion and IQ-relation regarding large abstract “racial” populations is dubious and would make much more sense statistically when applied directly to human breeds/tribes/ethnic groups and subpopulations rather than giant “races”.

    If this is true, then the world would make a lot more sense as Indians themselves are most likely a few 100 subpopulations with large genetic diversity that has nothing to do with their supposed fellow “Caucasian” cousins, the Norwegians. And would account for why Norwegians look nothing like the Irish or Spanish let alone Nigerians.

    The world operates on the scientifically accurate human breed model as any ethnic ghetto around the world will tell you through direct observation.

    It does not operate on “race” or any 3 or 12 or Talmudically-derived Kabbalistic divisible number.

    Nature is not gematria. Sorry Unz. It’s not despite you wishing it was.

  169. Chinaman says:
    @AaronB

    To a certain extent, this continues today. The West is richer and more creative than Asia, even today.

    That being said, White motivation has – understandably – declined as of late, while Asian motivation has risen.

    I am a bit tired of all this pissing contest on UNZ so let’s assume you are right…

    But it is exactly this kind of mentality and superiority complex that you professed that motivates Asians while demotivating to Whites. Thinking you are best is very detrimental to improvement. I would argue that the largest single driver of progress and discovery in the West had been competition and its bastard child, Capitalism. China went through centuries of stagnation because of its homogeneity and insular outlook while the people in the West competed and kill off each other in one existential crisis after another. It have been centuries of arm races in every domain. Chinese invented gunpowder and use it for fireworks while you guys immediately thought of using it to kill each other. Psychopathy aside, this is an example of how competition breeds creativity. The tables have turned now and the humiliation\ inferiority complex you have cited have become dry tinder which is fuelling China’s progress. Every Chinese have a burning desire to get ahead. We are the real Avengers who needs to get back at the Japs and then at white people. I assure you we are just getting started and we actually NEED more condescension and humiliation from White people. It is very motivating. All the hatred and vile comments here does rile me up but they do force me to think about the deeper issues and how China can get ahead.

    I guess Huawei’s lead in 5G (also quantum computers recently) and the challenges posed by China is a wake up call to the West and force you guys to up your game. This civilisational struggle between East and West could be a good thing for humanity in the long run. This is true as long as we don’t annihilate each other in one nuclear Holocaust, The competition in tech and AI between China and America could bring forth the Singularity earlier than expected where we are all uploading our consciousness to the internet and become part machine (as portrayed in the cyberpunk game). That will really be the end of history and we will look back at IQ, Race and nationalism as such obsolete and passé concepts. I hope we get there before the competition in the military domain gets out of hand.

  170. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    It makes no sense for example to group together Yemenite Arabs with Dutch and/or English as “Caucasoid” as early 20th century physical anthropologists did.

    It makes sense with respect to facial features and other traits. I mean contrasted with Mongoloids or Negroids fro example, average Arabs would be more similar to Englishmen or Dutchmen. But of course Arabs are quite a mixed group with Negroid traits mixed in. It is a rough division, sure but such divisions do play their part in explaining some aspects of humanity.
    It is a matter of contrasting with the others. I mean once we Indians were just Punjabis and Bengalis and Tamils. But during British Empire as travel increased, we Indians realized that we Punjabis, Tamils and Bengalis have more in similar with each other as contrasted to Europeans,Africans, East Asians, Middle Easterners etc… This consciousness did play its part in the Indian Independence Movement.

  171. fnn says:

    There’s still some good stuff on Twitter.

  172. Malla says:
    @geokat62

    Sure they did. I believe you.

    LOL
    (no really, I was laughing out loud, ask my dog)

  173. @Chinaman

    I guess Huawei’s lead in 5G (also quantum computers recently) and the challenges posed by China is a wake up call to the West and force you guys to up your game. This civilisational struggle between East and West could be a good thing for humanity in the long run. This is true as long as we don’t annihilate each other in one nuclear Holocaust, The competition in tech and AI between China and America could bring forth the Singularity earlier than expected where we are all uploading our consciousness to the internet and become part machine (as portrayed in the cyberpunk game). That will really be the end of history and we will look back at IQ, Race and nationalism as such obsolete and passé concepts. I hope we get there before the competition in the military domain gets out of hand.

    Most of the technology China has was stolen from America by Israel and given to China on purpose.

    Much of the intelligence of China was murdered via the Cultural Revolution and now exists in Taiwan and Hong Kong.

    That’s what these Commies (I.E. Secular pseudo-scientific atheistic “humanist” Marxist Zionist Jews) do. They kill off all the smart people with any semblance of critical thinking skills and creativity.

    They kill them because they ask too many questions and demand rights, economic fairness, labor laws, free speech, and respect.

    So you actually never got “smarter” (that is if you are you and not the more likely Hasbara Unit 8200 sockpuppet troll pretending to be Chinese from China). You got more robotic and better at following orders and completing repetitive tasks like all the CITIC assembly line jobs you were handed by CITIC ftom 1978 onward by Kissinger, the Neocons, the Rockefellers, the Rothschilds, and other Globalist scum directly shipped to you from America.

    The intelligence you guys possess has nothing to do with the most important forms of intelligence, which are critical thinking skills, logical reasoning, creativity, humor, problem-solving, and geometrical intelligence.

    Abstraction, memorization, processing speed, symbolism, multilingualism, and recall are all Rockefeller “obedient worker” forms of intelligence that don’t improve society or technology. That’s what you have in China. They lead to human slavery just like the Freemasonic Zionists and Marxist want for their technocratic bankster mafia cabal cult, which you coincidentally make note of by referencing the Jewish Kabbalistic Technocratic “singularity” agenda of merging humanity with AI and idiotically thinking you can “upload yourself” to the almighty hive mind AI Bugbrain overmind that the Transhumanist Kabbalistic morons think will be the future of humanity.

    It will be the death of humanity.

    Humans are animals. You can not be “uploaded”. You are the physical meat of the animal – not your thoughts. Very easy to understand this. A child can. You are just brainwashed and ignorant.

    Lose the cult worship.

    You do not understand science at all. You’ve got Bugbrain screamer brain, which means you’re a fucking retard. Not “smart” at all no matter how hard you outwork “us” at it. You’re just a worker ant that will be disposed of by the 0.01% as soon as they can cost-effectively manufacture AI-powered autonomous robots to do all the work.

    Your transhumanist future will be entering a box thinking you’re uploading your “consciousness to the cloud” and you’ll really just be receiving a technocratic drone-delivered bullet to the head.

    It’s really that simple, the scam they have metaphorically cast a spell on you to believe.

    How do I know? They already did it to us in Europe and America for millenia since Rome going back to Josephus.

    • Replies: @Chinaman
  174. AaronB says:
    @Chinaman

    But it is exactly this kind of mentality and superiority complex that you professed that motivates Asians while demotivating to Whites. Thinking you are best is very detrimental to improvement. I would argue that the largest single driver of progress and discovery in the West had been competition and its bastard child, Capitalism. China went through centuries of stagnation because of its homogeneity and insular outlook while the people in the West competed and kill off each other in one existential crisis after another. It have been centuries of arm races in every domain. Chinese invented gunpowder and use it for fireworks while you guys immediately thought of using it to kill each other. Psychopathy aside, this is an example of how competition breeds creativity. The tables have turned now and the humiliation\ inferiority complex you have cited have become dry tinder which is fuelling China’s progress. Every Chinese have a burning desire to get ahead. We are the real Avengers who needs to get back at the Japs and then at white people. I assure you we are just getting started and we actually NEED more condescension and humiliation from White people. It is very motivating. All the hatred and vile comments here does rile me up but they do force me to think about the deeper issues and how China can get ahead.

    Excellent point. You seem to be an intelligent person who understands human behavior.

    Total success, and the lack of credible competitors, led to Western decline. When/if China becomes a credible peer competitor, and actually humiliates the West in some areas, it will jolt the West out of its sense of complacency and reignite the competitive spirit in the West.

    If Western contempt spurs China to new heights, Chinese success will reignite the spirit of competition in the West.

    Your enemies, may be necessary for your health. Your enemies may not truly be enemies, from this perspective. “Frenemies”.

    I am not convinced, though, that China can really become a true peer competitor under the repressive CCP, because I think a higher level of anarchy is needed for creativity. I think China, after a period, will have to graduate to aa more relaxed system that permits greater anarchy. But we shall see.

    My own view, and my own hope, is not that China continues the tradition of western Promethean science, but develops a humanistic science based on Taoist principles (working with nature rather than dominating it), and exports that to the West. My hope is that Chinese science makes a contribution to the world based on the genuine Chinese spirit.

    I understand you hope for the Singularity, and mankinds final defeat of nature. I hope for mankind to return to nature.

    • Thanks: Chinaman
    • Replies: @Chinaman
  175. Malla says:
    @AaronB

    Race is a social construct,

    You got it the other way round, Society is partly (significant part) a racial construct.

  176. There is a problem when you falsify history, create a propaganda, and start believing that this is the truth. That is the case with ‘Westerners’, especially, so-called ‘Caucasians’. What does it mean ‘Caucasian’? Today’s ‘Westerners’ (W.Europe, N.America, Australia) mostly originated in Russian steppes and were not white. The oldest civilisations in Europe was Vincha (L.Vir, Danube, Old Europe) civilisation where white race originated. Those, I2 people, moved to the north of Europe and British Isles, where lived for more than 3000 years before R1b (future ‘westerners’) came from the steppes. R1b conducted genocides against indigenous people, killing more than 90% of men. There is also a historical falsification that they brought so-called ‘Indo-European’ (formerly Indo-Germanishe) language from which all Euro and some Asian languages were formed. The truth is that the future ‘Westerners’ mixed with locals, becoming white, and also took their local (for the sake of commenting, let’s call it – Serbian) language. This language was later brought by Aryans to South Asia as Sanskrit. Future ‘Westerners’ came to British Isles about 2500BC. From 100%, the percentage of indigenous I2 dropped to 5%. Some descendants of exterminated I2 are Chuck Norris, Bill Gates, US president Munro, Davy Crocket, Ted Dunson (so as Novak Djokovic and 40% of Serbs). In sum, I2 (Vincha) are indigenous Europeans who were white and spoke (proto)Serbian language (‘race’ is a Serbian word) for 9000 years before R1b came to Europe from Russian steppes. ‘Indo-European’ is a meaningless term.

    • Troll: Malla
    • Replies: @Malla
  177. @raga10

    What cracks me up is when people call Darwin’s book “The Origin of the Species”.
    Autocorrect doesn’t want you to find it, but it’s out there.

  178. mikemikev says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    This was addressed when you brought it up here, as well as the point about the number of races from Allen Trombone.

    https://www.unz.com/jthompson/explaining-race-and-genetics-no-need-to-despair/?showcomments

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  179. @RonaldB

    “Japan … certainly without Jews”!

    The “American” Abraham Foxman advises Japan how to educate its children:
    https://news.yahoo.com/265-anne-frank-books-vandalized-tokyo-libraries-114032676.html
    And “israel” made sure their propaganda books were returned to library shelves.

    Goldman Sucks a lot of wealth out of Tokyo, but it’s nice to know Lehman Brothers was a “US company”:
    https://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2018/09/13/editorials/decade-lehman-shock/

    News media control:
    http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v16/v16n3p34_Weber.html

    • Thanks: Malla
  180. @Oliver D. Smith

    Those photos are cherry-picked.

    [declines to provide any photos of counterfactuals]

  181. @Chinaman

    Chinese invented gunpowder

    Maybe not.

  182. @Malla

    Who were Indo Europeans? Why they were Indo-Germanishe for 100 years before they became Indo-Europeans? Where they originated? Russian steppes? When they came to Europe? Whom they found in Europe? What is Indo and what is European in this meaningless term? How they influenced new European languages? Have they brought Sanskrit to India? Which modern language is the most similar to Sanskrit? What is their (IE) genetics (haplogroup-s)? What is the link btw Sanskrit and English or German if the time distance is more than 3000 years? What was their mythology? Etc, etc…

  183. Poco says:
    @ANZ

    The blackities most definitely believe in race and of course they are the ubermenschen. They built the pyramids, built America, created science, art, music, and it was all done stolened from them.
    Almost nobody believes this no race crap except egghead leftwing assholes.

    • Replies: @PolarBear
  184. @Malla

    Or, something easier for you – who were Aryans? They brought Sanskrit and Rg Veda to India. Were they so-called ‘Indo-Europeans’?

    I doubt that you can answer any of previous questions. You can try with Wiki but it will not be enough.

    More important – you should work on your interpersonal communication.

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
    , @Malla
  185. @mikemikev

    Nothing was addressed. You would need to explain how lumping heterogenous populations together is useful to population genetics, biomedicine or physical anthropology. And you’ve never done that. Lumping populations together only makes sense for a very small number of superficial characters like skin pigmentation because populations over broad geographical areas are relatively homogenous in these features because of climatic selection. Dermatologists for example use the Fitzpatrick scale and ‘northern European’ pigmentation would be Fitzpatrick skin types I and II – I was classified by a dermatologist as type II and called ‘northern European’, so this is still in use in dermatology. In population genetics however there is such thing as a useful ‘northern European’, there’s too significant genetic differences between populations to lump them together.

    • Replies: @mikemikev
  186. @JM

    Why select the Theory of Evolution as different from anything else (say) in Science?

    Only because that’s the specific subject raised by ANZ at Post # 1.

    Such instruction (which is probably the best that can be managed by teachers at the Elementary level and many these days at the Secondary level) is anathema to the method of Science.

    It’s refreshing to have a response by someone who is aware of the Scientific Method and its application to the real world.

    On the other hand, if we were to nominate a list of the top theories in the biological and social sciences that were most unlikely to be disproved, then the Theory of Evolution would be right up there.

    True, I can’t personally dream up a test that would conclusively disprove the notion that selection of random variations in species for survival accounts for the diversity of species in the world today.

    Maybe someone can and eventually will. Maybe someone already has. Or not.

    It’s something of a moving target, to say the least.

  187. @Rufus Clyde

    What precisely do you mean by “this theory being indoctrinated into students as a fact”, and what is the problem with this practice?

    How precise would you like the statement to be? Plain English is as plain as it gets.

    As to the problem, teaching impressionable young students that a theory is an indisputable fact is simply wrong. I don’t accept that its OK to teach kiddies that a particular theoretical viewpoint is gospel truth.

    If you don’t know what “basic Darwinian principles” are, then how do you know that the existence of races within the human species does not require the application of such principles?

    Such hubris. People have known of the existence of different races amongst humankind for millenia, by using that inherent faculty known as eyesight. No “Darwinian Principles” required.

    Moreover, your appeal to “Darwinian Principles” (whatever that may be) as essential to the existence of races within the human species, dogmatically overlooks the truth that the “Theory of Evolution” is a theory. Not fact (although apparently you hold religious fidelity to the notion).

    Are you trying to say that racial differences are not the result of the principles of natural selection in action? Did Jeebus do it?

    Despite your adversarial disposition, it’s neither my stance, nor my problem, to prove anything one way or another.

    Sadly, you appear to have a binary position on this subject – “Evolutionist” vs “Creationist”.

    An objective individual wouldn’t be so concerned with picking sides and rallying to the cause, as simply looking to find the truth of the matter.

  188. @Anonymous

    The Theory of Evolution and The Big Bang Theory are totally different things.

    How very astute.

    What they have in common is that they are both theories, and both have numerous adherents who defend their infallibility with evangelical ferocity.

    The only people who seem to have a problem with evolution are religious people experiencing cognitive dissonance.

    True, that bunch of people cast as “Creationists” do seem to have some difficulty entertaining the notions put foward by Darwin’s “Theory of Evolution”.

    In a similarly dogmatic manner, the multitudes indoctrinated into the Church of the “Evolutionists” rail against their arch-foes in perpetual defence of their infallible doctrine.

    On a par with George Dubya’s “you’re either with us or against us” nonsense.

    Woe unto the heretics against either side.

    Meanwhile, more open and inquiring minds choose to acknowledge that all these things are just theories. Not fact. Theories.

  189. @Malla

    There’s plenty of fairly good to very attractive left-wing politicians

    Arguably the most attractive female politician in Greece is centre-left (PASOK), Eva Kaili.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eva_Kaili

    When you resort to calling all people whose politics you disagree with “ugly” you have no argument.

    • Replies: @Malla
  190. PolarBear says:
    @Poco

    Afrocentrics are so full of shit. Nation of Islam claims a negro Scientist invented Whites. Egyptians were depicted killing hordes of Black Nubians in Egyptian art. So much for Black Egypt. The real Black Africa is hell, not Wakanda.

    • Replies: @John Johnson
  191. @geokat62

    Anyone who wants the indigenous people to remain a majority in their ethnic homeland is now ipso facto a neo-Nazi/fascist in your books?

    No not necessarily but anyone who supports such a position is an ethnic nationalist or what Eric Kaufmann calls ‘ethno-traditionalist nationalist’ (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/nana.12516). Among ethnic nationalists though you always find neo-Nazis. Collett is a literal neo-Nazi who has said Adolf Hitler is his hero, has self-described himself as a “Nazi sympathiser”, believes in anti-Semitic conspiracy theories, supports an ethno-state and wants to repatriate non-white immigrants – so he’s the most hardcore and extreme of ethno-nationalists. His former girlfriend also had Nazi swastica tattoos all over her.

    I was always suspicious of Collett because he tried to demonise the Leave EU campaign by showing up at a stall with his swastica tattoo girlfriend, trying to demonise Brexit voters by associating them with Nazism. This has led to allegations from other nationalists he’s a Hope not Hate spy:

    The insane poster on this thread, ‘Mikemikev’ (Michael Coombs) was doing similar things as Collett. In 2015 I caught him trying to associate Nazism to Brexit on PoliticalForum.

    Oh, so you feel comfortable summarily dismissing the survey results (that around 70% of white British are concerned about becoming a minority) in favour of your own hunch that it’s “no higher than 20%”? Unless you can produce evidence that corroborates your assertion that they lied, I’ll stick to the survey estimate and pass on your gut feel, as it may just be indigestion.

    No reliable surveys have asked the demographic question. My view it is under 20% is based on a separate line of evidence that shows no greater than 1/5 of the population will vote for a far-right party.

    https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/article/?id=4677

    • Replies: @geokat62
  192. geokat62 says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Among ethnic nationalists though you always find neo-Nazis.

    Interesting. What percentage of the indigenous British people who think they should not become a minority in their historic homelands would you say are neo-Nazis?

    While you’re at it, perhaps you’d be kind enough to furnish an answer for the Han in China or the Israeli Jews in Eretz Yisrael? What percentage of these ethno-nationalists would you say are neo-Nazis?

    This has led to allegations from other nationalists [Mark Collett’s] a Hope not Hate spy

    Other nationalists? You must be referring to civic-nationalists, someone like a Tommy Robinson, perhaps? Pure BS and you know it.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  193. @Robert Dolan

    Mr Dolan ,your writings on world Jewry should be turned into a teaching book .My question to you sir is What can be done about this or is it to late?

  194. @White Men Can’t Jump

    In the original Sanskrit the term has decidedly racial connotations
    (“arya varna”= the “light” or “noble” colour, as opposed to “krishna varna”= the lit. “black” or “red-eyed”) the invaders used to describe themselves.
    Unfortunately the usage of “populations” vs “language groups” is a bit messed up
    (though they tend to coincide), and nowhere more than on the subcontinent.

    “Caucasian” is a term coined by Blumenbach for the hypothetical “primal race”, based on a literal reading of Genesis; I´m afraid only Americans still use that nonsense.

    • Replies: @Malla
  195. @Robert Dolan

    Mr Dolan ,your writings on world Jewry should be turned into a teaching book .My question to you sir is What can be done about this or is it to late?

  196. Chinaman says:
    @Allen Trombone

    The intelligence you guys possess has nothing to do with the most important forms of intelligence, which are critical thinking skills, logical reasoning, creativity, humor, problem-solving, and geometrical intelligence.

    Abstraction, memorization, processing speed, symbolism, multilingualism, and recall are all Rockefeller “obedient worker” forms of intelligence

    I would venture to guess that you are a bit unsecured about your own intelligence or some boomer dude whose STEM job was taken by some Asian. I get it.

    I will skip the rant and trolling but address an important observation you made.

    I actually understand what you mean above and the distinctions you made regarding different forms of intelligence. I have known and worked with some 135- 140 IQ Chinese ( gave them an IQ test ) in STEM fields who I would consider aspergic or somewhere along the autism spectrum. They are quite common but certainly not all high IQ Chinese are like that. The type of intelligence they exhibit is the automaton, mechanical form of intelligence without self-awareness or free-will ( or at least the illusion of one). The “alphago” Type of deep learning algorithms that “mimics” human intelligence.

    Then there is Imagination, intellectual curiosity and critical thinking skills that are distinct from machine intelligence and quintessential traits makes us human. ( I guess you consider Chinese subhumans in that case). I have thought about these issues for a long time and my conclusion is that what you perceived as “important type of intelligence” are actually personality traits that are orthogonal to intelligence. We are talking about attitudes towards risks and failure, general outlook on life, openness, risk adversion levels, excitbility and extroversion. What you are actually trying to say is that Asians are boring people when compared with Whites.

    Well, that exactly what blacks would say about Whites… That white people are not street smart, boring, uncreative and lacks imagination. Go figure what that actually means.

    I would argue that some of these things are not immutable and can be systematically instilled from a young age. ( perhaps against the natural inclination of the subject). However, some components are genetic. The average savings Of Americans are $400, a saving rate of 2%… East Asians, on average, save 30% of their income. That’s just different tolerances for risk and manifest itself in problem solving when it comes to the size of the search space, abidence to rules and traditions (masks?) and tolerance towards failure. In any case, I believe all of this issues can be overcomed with the right incentives and the reconfiguring dopamine pathways.

    Any Chinese reading your rant will become more “intelligent” And creative overnight as he consciously attempts to break his mode of thinking. As I said, we need more people like you to challenge and rain condescension\racism towards us.

    It is only going to make us better.

    • Replies: @Allen Trombone
  197. geokat62 says:

    Even the clergy are beginning to ask tough questions…

  198. Malla says:
    @White Men Can’t Jump

    Or, something easier for you – who were Aryans? They brought Sanskrit and Rg Veda to India. Were they so-called ‘Indo-Europeans’?

    Aryans were Indo-Europeans from Central Asia/ Ukraine region before they came to India/Persia. Rig Veda might have been written in India after coming here. Now it seems they might have been formed from European hunter gatherers.
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/viking-genomics/#comment-4169855
    https://www.unz.com/pescobar/russia-and-the-eu-business-as-usual-is-over/#comment-4242619

    Which modern language is the most similar to Sanskrit?

    North Indian languages as well as Persian/Dari and Balto Slavic languages.

    What is Indo and what is European in this meaningless term?

    It is not meaningless. A common population from Central Asia/Ukraine spread South to Middle East/South Asia to spread new cultures, genes and civilizations.

    What was their mythology?

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/heres/#comment-4034736

  199. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    When you resort to calling all people whose politics you disagree with “ugly” you have no argument.

    Whu dids I calls da uglis? All I did was show some pics of right winged chicks and left winged er… creatures…er…dat sort of things. beauty can be after all in the eye of the beholder….

  200. geokat62 says:

  201. @geokat62

    Interesting. What percentage of the indigenous British people who think they should not become a minority in their historic homelands would you say are neo-Nazis?

    1/5 of the British electorate support far-right policies: stopping all immigration, deporting illegals and voluntary repatriation of legal immigrants – those people fit the ethno-nationalist label. How many of them are neo-Nazis? I wouldn’t say very many. Generally speaking, the British far-right has never been sympathetic to Nazism because Britain went to war with Germany, so it’s not patriotic. Nick Griffin also kicked out the neo-Nazi cranks from the BNP in the 2000s when he tried to cosmetically improve the image of the BNP and detoxify it for more electoral support. Ex-BNP hardliners like Chris Jackson, Richard Edmonds and Kevin Bryan joined the National Front; Mark Collett was expelled from the BNP by Griffin after he was caught on camera praising Adolf Hitler as exposed in the 2002 documentary Young, Nazi and Proud. However, he later somehow managed to re-join the party and stood as a BNP candidate in the 2005 general election.

    To ordinary people though, the aforementioned ethnic nationalist views are virtually as unpleasant as Nazism. So it doesn’t really matter if you’re an ethnic nationalist or a neo-Nazi – both are unpleasant and extreme far-right positions. I don’t support either, although I do make a distinction between them.

    While you’re at it, perhaps you’d be kind enough to furnish an answer for the Han in China or the Israeli Jews in Eretz Yisrael? What percentage of these ethno-nationalists would you say are neo-Nazis?

    Han Chinese nationalism is ethnic nationalism. Certain forms of Zionism are ethnic nationalism (it depends how Jewish is defined). The percentage of neo-Nazis among these is virtually zero, if not zero for obvious reasons.

    Other nationalists? You must be referring to civic-nationalists, someone like a Tommy Robinson, perhaps? Pure BS and you know it.

    Robinson isn’t a real civic-nationalist. He’s an ex-BNP member and has made plenty of comments that are sympathetic to ethnic nationalism. But he’s someone who realises civic nationalism and populism is more palatable to ordinary people than ethnic nationalism, much the same as many people in UKIP, so he pretends to be a civic nationalist to receive less criticism.

    As for the allegation Collett is a Hope not Hate spy – Joe Owens (the man in the video making the allegation) certainly isn’t a civic nationalist – he’s ex-NF and ex-BNP and an ethno-nationalist.

    Collett was widely thought to be a spy in the BNP in the 2000s. Going on camera and praising Adolf, isn’t exactly a vote winner. Many thought he did that to loose the BNP votes at the time Griffin was trying to modernise the party and improve its image. Perhaps Hope not Hate paid him £500 or something to do it. I really don’t know but I found the 2016 Leave EU Nazi thing very suspicious. Literally the week for the referendum, Collett was in newspapers at a vote Leave EU stall with his swastica-tatoo girlfriend and journalists just so happened to photo her…

    • Replies: @John Johnson
    , @geokat62
  202. @obwandiyag

    Whether race is real or not is a moot point.

    Whether it is or not, you are idiots for whanging on about the subject all the time.

    A moot point? Liberals have bet over a trillion dollars that it doesn’t exist.

    The Con In narrative completely falls apart under the reality of racial differences.

    If widespread racial realism was accepted then our two party system would have to go back to the drawing board.

    Liberals could no longer blame Whites for all inequalities and conservatives could no longer push their “minimum government is everything” line of bulls–t.

  203. @PolarBear

    Afrocentrics are so full of shit. Nation of Islam claims a negro Scientist invented Whites. Egyptians were depicted killing hordes of Black Nubians in Egyptian art. So much for Black Egypt. The real Black Africa is hell, not Wakanda.

    It seemed pretty obvious from their art but guilty White liberals let them maintain the lie. DNA testing was eventually done on Egyptians which of course annoyed both Black nationalists and liberals. It turns out they weren’t Bantu of the North. Shocking I know.

    I’m sure the whole Egyptians were Black lie is still taught in Black schools.

    White liberals believe in lying to Blacks about Africa while demeaning anything White. For equality we must be dishonest!

  204. @Oliver D. Smith

    Most British are even bigger pussy hats than urban White Americans.

    I really believe the theory that they lost too many strong men to emigration.

    Then it didn’t help that they put their upper class officers in front of German machine guns.

    But even in WW1 they talked about how their men weren’t as good at killing as the Germans. They just didn’t have the guts for it.

    The current British population is too nice for their own good. They still act like a cup of tea will fix everything. There are even more loathe to look at the genetic question than Americans.

    Oh and their media is total trash. Their daily shows sink lower than Hollywood garbage.

  205. AaronB: “The concept of race – that certain groups behave the way they do because it is their nature – is a tautology. … The concept of race kills thought.”

    Not necessarily. Nobody, I think, denies that environment plays a role in shaping behavior. But that doesn’t invalidate the fact that genetics does too. When we say that race exists as an objective quality in humans, we mean it in the same sense that we mean it about other species, many or even most of which also have races. The fact that humans are uniquely malleable in that they can be trained to behave in countless ways also doesn’t mean that they are infinitely flexible. For example, the project of trying to make negroes behave exactly as whites behave, on average, may well be doomed to failure because of the peculiarities of their respective genetics.

    It’s the presumption that there are no races, only the human race, that actually kills thought. This presumption is based in religious thinking, not scientific thinking. In the West, it’s an inheritance from its Christian past.

    AaronB: “Since 50% of variance is not generic, its impossible to say how much a behavior is genetic.”

    Not really. Behaviors can be heritable, although strictly speaking not inherited. For instance, like IQ, height is heritable, and both Pygmies and Dinkas can have their height affected by environment. But you could improve the nutrition (i.e., the environment) of the Pygmy as much as you like, and still they will never be as tall on average as Dinkas. There’s no reason to suppose that IQ and other personality factors (like propensity to violence) that influence behavior are any different, and in fact there are a lot of reasons to suspect they are not. The main one is that, for mysterious reasons, ultimately, I think, probably grounded in his insane religion of Christianity, the white man seems to have adopted the black man as his charge, and has literally spent centuries trying to get him to behave the same as white people, with little to show for it. It’s way past time to conclude that the project should be given up as futile.

    • Agree: Patriot
  206. @AaronB

    But science is supposed to me more than that. The concept of race – that certain groups behave the way they do because it is their nature – is a tautology. Basically, you are what you are because you are what you are. How does this advance knowledge? The concept of race kills thought.

    The concept of race is a tautology? That is truly amusing.

    Egalitarian anti-racial thinking is entirely anti-intellectual as every racial observation must be made with an unsupported proof.

    Let’s look at an example of this thinking:

    Since race doesn’t exist so Haiti must be poor for entirely external reasons.

    The possibility of biology being even 1% of the reason is erased entirely from the supposition.

    What happens if you question this explanation?

    WELL UZ JUST A STOOPID RACISS.

    This is the best that people with doctorate degrees could come up with. Eliminate race as a factor from the analysis and then call people racist if they ask questions.

    (slow clap)

    And these professors are actually paid for this non-sense. How is this helping Haiti?

  207. @Dr. Robert Morgan

    Not really. Behaviors can be heritable, although strictly speaking not inherited. For instance, like IQ, height is heritable, and both Pygmies and Dinkas can have their height affected by environment. But you could improve the nutrition (i.e., the environment) of the Pygmy as much as you like, and still they will never be as tall on average as Dinkas.

    A corollary here is that if you equalized the environment you would extenuate the genetic differences.

    This is a big problem that egalitarians never consider.

    If you declare Group A is just Group B but with the wrong diet you could end up proving that A is not B and eliminating any doubt that once existed.

    Egalitarians of course are certain that nature/God did not make group differences (except maybe sports and medicine) so they are not concerned with this scenario.

    But in many areas through repeated billion dollar failures they may end up proving the opposite of what they are trying to show and in fact eliminating doubt from the undecided. So in the future they could look back on this time with envy when doubt existed.

  208. geokat62 says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    So it doesn’t really matter if you’re an ethnic nationalist or a neo-Nazi – both are unpleasant and extreme far-right positions. I don’t support either, although I do make a distinction between them.

    Yeah, a distinction without a difference!

    As for the allegation Collett is a Hope not Hate spy – Joe Owens (the man in the video making the allegation) certainly isn’t a civic nationalist – he’s ex-NF and ex-BNP and an ethno-nationalist.

    Joe Owens? Here’s what Max Musson had to say about JO in, An Open Letter to Joe Owens:

    Firstly, a bit of feedback. I appreciate that you are sincere in what you do, but so far you have named and denounced, either as a conscious agent of our  enemies, or as a ‘useful idiot’, virtually everyone who has either held, currently holds, or who aspires to hold a leadership position in British nationalism. In doing so you will of course, by use of this scatter gun approach, have been right in your denunciations in some instances, but you must also appreciate that you will be entirely wrong on others, and through your actions you will, if not careful, completely denude nationalism of all it’s potential leaders and make yourself a lot of enemies into the bargain. This is not a sensible approach.

    Do you think it likely, that other than yourself, everyone else who is anyone in nationalism is either a ‘spy’ or a nincompoop? That’s not very likely, is it?

    http://www.westernspring.co.uk/open-letter-joe-owens/

    Perhaps Hope not Hate paid him £500 or something to do it. I really don’t know…

    No, just like Joe Owens your spreading lies. Collett loves his country and would never sell it out for £500. But, because he loves his country, he’s smeared as being a neo-Nazi. The truth is more and more “normies” are breaking out of the spell cast upon them by Jewish Supremacist Organisations (JSOs) to believe the impossible, that Diversity Is A Strength. For centuries the common man understood that homogeneity was a strength… a common language, a common religion, a common heritage.

    Unfortunately for JSOs, however, the narrative no longer corresponds to the reality. Bringing diverse peoples together is a colossal mistake (see Londonistan, the stabbing capital of the world and Paris, the biggest shithole in Europe).

    To add insult to injury, rather than sticking to the lie of a colour-blind nation, JSOs have pivoted to the cultural Marxist rhetoric that the ethnic majority is guilty of oppressing all the minorities and must repent for their sins. This little spell will wear off faster than you can say “oy vey”!

    No, whether you like it or not, the future belongs to the ethno-nats. The civ-nats, like the phoney Tommy Robinson, have been exposed as the Trojan Horse they are for acting as a stepping stone to “multiculti.” Civ-nats are doing the bidding of Supremacist Jewry by deceiving the ordinary Brits to avoid embracing ethno-nationalism out of fear of being called the dreaded R word, “racist.”

    No, the scheme hatched by JSOs to transform Europe into a multiculti fairytale as disclosed by Barbara Lerner Spectre will fail, as it is clearly turning Europe into a hellhole.

    John Lennon’s Imagine may have been the inspiration for many progressives, but unfortunately just like the fabled “worker’s paradise,” it’s simply an unachievable phantasm.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  209. Adûnâi says: • Website
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    > “Nobody, I think, denies that environment plays a role in shaping behavior. But that doesn’t invalidate the fact that genetics does too.”

    The irony is that genetics is in large part determined by the environment. The snowstorm in Pyongyang will nudge the Koreans into a path similar in many ways to Western Eurasians. Skin tone is a characteristic shared by both Sardinians and Icelanders (compared to Negroes), no matter the origin of the specific populations. If you transport modern Negroes to the Europe of glaciations, and leave them for 50k years, isn’t there a chance they will take upon the features of the Aryan race? Humans are malleable – not only in society, but also in their evolution. (To a certain point – dolphins aren’t going back to land any time soon.)

    > ” The main one is that, for mysterious reasons, ultimately, I think, probably grounded in his insane religion of Christianity, the white man seems to have adopted the black man as his charge, and has literally spent centuries trying to get him to behave the same as white people, with little to show for it.”

    The irony here is that a success of this strategy would have been equally suicidal to the Aryan race. It’s White immigration all over again. Let’s assume all the Negroes of Africa suddenly become Sardinians. How exactly does the appearance of another competitive, advanced civilisation help the Icelanders of England? The same way how introducing non-founder populations, even White, to the nascent USA helped said founders. It’s all Christian proclivity to suicide.

    The biggest question here is how much the conversion to Christianity was genetic. An impartial judge might even celebrate the extinction of this wretched race. Who has the certainty to say where the Aryan ends and the Jew begins?

    > “It’s the presumption that there are no races, only the human race, that actually kills thought.”

    Objection! Let’s say, you’re a high-IQ academic at Google, and you come out as racist. Your ability to engage in thoughtful discussions, to partake in sciences, to write high-IQ peer-reviewed papers will be diminished. Parables aside, it may be the case that accepting one irrational thought opens the door to greater rationality. Sacrificing the truth of race lets you experience the warm embrace of the inner world of a Pajeet.

    • Replies: @Allen Trombone
  210. @Malla

    As I expected my questions were not answered. We don’t know who so-called ‘Indo-Europeans’ were. “Common people from Central Asia”?? What is in this ‘Indo’ and what ‘European’ (or ‘Germanishe’)? They brought to SA culture, genes and civilisations. Which CG&C?

    But, let see if something is there? Aryans were Indo-Europeans who brought Sanskrit (&Vedas). The mainstream says that Yamnaya people from Russian steppes (future ‘Westerners’) brought IE language to Europe. How come? They were not Aryans but they brought the same language to Europe? We know who are indigenous people in Australia, Americas, Africa, Antarctica, who were indigenous people in Europe?

    North Indian languages were derived from Sanskrit but so-called ‘Balto-Slavic’ term did not exist at Aryan times. There were only Serbian speaking tribes and the original ‘IE’ language, which has been making confusion since its inception, was Serbian language. Because we have never-ending quest for elusive IE language and IE people. Modern Serbian is the most similar to Sanskrit (Tagore’s granddaughter found 20% identical and 11% very similar words). From this ancient Serbian language evolved all future so-called ‘Slavic’ languages and it has influenced several thousands of years younger westEU languages and Latin.

    In sum, paradoxically you are right – so-called ‘Indo-Europeans’ were white, they brought Sanskrit, their genes, culture and civilisation to SA but they were NOT Yamnaya (i.e. future ‘Westerners’) people. Who were they? It is not difficult to find, there are 200 million of their descendants in SA. It is needed just to replace the meaningless ‘Indo-European’ term with appropriate one.

  211. @Chinaman

    I am not racist towards Chinese people.

    I have many Chinese friends that are very smart and not “robotic”.

    However, they live in America. They avoided the “Cultural Revolution” or more aptly the “Cultural Devolution” and culling of the smartest Chinese.

    Essentially the Jewish Marxist Communist Chinese Cultural Revolution that killed tens of millions of Chinese people (the best and the brightest Chinese, many of whom fled to America if not Taiwan and Hong Kong) just as the Marxists killed tens of millions of the smartest in Russia and Eastern Europe during the time of the USSR.

    Why is it that most of the technological innovation comes from democratic and capitalistic Taiwan and not mainland China? Best chipmakers in the world and more.

    You even admit many of the intelligent Chinese you work with that have 135 – 140 IQs (140 was the IQ I tested at the last time I took one but in all likelihood my IQ is much higher, albeit IQ is not a good predictor of overall intelligence in my opinion because it only tests for those autistic robotic traits that we’ve both mentioned in our respective comments – processing speed, memorization retention, and recall) have Asperger’s.

    It is not a personality trait. You can not learn that which your brain can not perceive, which if you understand autism, Asperger’s, and the ASDs you know that it can take years for someone with those disorders (they lack the micro mimicry mechanism in addition to many other things) to mimic what a person with a normal brain can do naturally in seconds. No amount of “hard work” will allow you to learn how to do something that your brain did not evolve to do or that you have been brainwashed into not understanding.

    Right now and in my previous comment, I discuss the Kabbalistic aspect of what you discussed in your previous comment about a technological singularity. I mentioned the Transhumanist agenda and the stupidity of it and yet you completely ignored that part of my comment, which is the most important part of it.

    This demonstrates 2 things – 1) you are either a troll and not even Chinese – most likely a Hasbara Unit 8200 Sock puppet or other intel agency shill or you’re a CCP apologist and 2) you either understand what I’m saying and are purposely diverting attention from it using a false Hegelian Dialectic Problem Reaction Solution non sequitur tactic to accuse me of racism when I made no such racist claims or you literally are not smart enough or too brainwashed to understand the concepts of Hegelian Dialectic, Kabbalistic Transhumanism and the stupidity of it in terms of the understanding and realization that we exist as animals and cannot be turned into robots or AI ( we just die if we try – see Deus Ex series for example), and that you can even entertain that you are going to be able to mechanically learn behaviors that are Darwinian selected. The sheer stupidity of thinking that you can learn the ability to make the way your brain perceives things through raw input change is your hubris.

    You yourself most likely have some form of autism or Asperger’s. I can see it through your mechanical writing technique and n + 1 thinking.

    Remember – Exponential growth leads to death.

    • Replies: @Chinaman
  212. Adûnâi says: • Website
    @White Men Can’t Jump

    > “Modern Serbian is the most similar to Sanskrit (Tagore’s granddaughter found 20% identical and 11% very similar words).”

    Isn’t it Lithuanian? Is this a joke? Could you please elaborate? And what does an unspecified [Rabindranath?] Tagore’s granddaughter have to do with Serbia?

    All I have found is this. Typical delusional folk etymology, just like in “Saxons=Isaac’s sons”.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbinda

  213. @White Men Can’t Jump

    Basques – https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basques

    And a variety of Neanderthals were the original Europeans.

    That is how we got our phenotype.

    I actually think there were many hominids that went into modern humans.

    What happened was the homo sapiens fucked them all into oblivion.

    They all became absorbed into the homo sapien sapien and only maintain small remnant portions of our genomes.

    • Agree: Patriot
  214. @Adûnâi

    Without European Catholicism, the rest of the world would be an absolute shithole right now.

    Be careful with the way you describe the craziness of the European insanity.

    They are not stupid. They have an Evil Machiavellian Middle Eastern parasite in their brains (i.e. Christianity) as in the comic series Legion yet they are so powerful and smart like the Legion character in the Marvel TV series Legion that not even this all powerful parasite in their brain can kill them despite endlessly trying.

    COVID19 being just the latest attempt by the parasite to kill off its host. Not smart on the parasite’s part because they will soon die if they are successful.

  215. @Adûnâi

    Lithuanian? I know about ‘archaic Lithuanian’ from the 15 c.AC, but not from the 20 c.BC. Who is the joker here? Where were Lithuanians at the time of Alexander the Great or at the time of the Roman Empire? Obviously, you are very behind and you must do a lot of research on your own. If you think to find all this in Wikipedia you are so naïve. I can give you several thousands of Serbian toponyms from Hindustan, Tibet, Central Asia, China. Can you give me any Lithuanian toponym?

    If Aryan descendants consist 16% or so (i.e. 220 million) of India’s population is it normal to expect that they brought not only the language (Sanskrit) than thousands of toponyms as well (not speaking about mythology and many other things). Hope, you will catch up, stay tuned. Tagore’s g-g-daughter Alokananda Miter studied Serbian and Slavic languages for 30 years and published papers. R.Tagore was a great friend of Serbian people and visited Serbia couple times. AM found that Serbian and her Bengali are the most similar to Sanskrit.

  216. @Allen Trombone

    Exactly. ‘Bichon man’, 14000 years old from Switzerland, was I2a. Forty % of Serbs have this haplogroup (I above mentioned few other I2a people). From Vincha many of them migrated or escaped from genocide (conducted by future ‘westerners’ – Yamnaya people from Russian steppes) to the North Europe (where their genetic cousins, I1, lived), British Isles, Sardinia.

  217. mikemikev says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    That was also addressed, in addition to IBD which was thoroughly addressed. In fact you made the same lie it was not addressed in that thread, and I linked to where it was addressed in another thread. You remind me of a character type in Mein Kampf, who repeats the same nonsense day after day, seemingly forgetting that he was refuted earlier. I suppose “pathological liar” captures it.

  218. Malla says:
    @White Men Can’t Jump

    As I expected my questions were not answered.

    What are you? an idiot?

    We don’t know who so-called ‘Indo-Europeans’ were.

    Of course we know who they were.

    Aryans were Indo-Europeans who brought Sanskrit (&Vedas).

    Actually Sanskrit is a much much later development, the original language was Prakrit.

    How come? They were not Aryans but they brought the same language to Europe?

    They were the same people as the so called Aryans.

    North Indian languages were derived from Sanskrit

    Most likely Prakrit.

    so-called ‘Balto-Slavic’ term did not exist at Aryan times.

    So? The people existed.

    was Serbian language

    Maybe but the Aryan genetic component in South Asians is related today’s NORTH EASTERN EUROPEANS. i.e. Baltic and Northern Slavic people.

    but they were NOT Yamnaya

    The Yamnaya were the same people as the Aryans.

    • Agree: nokangaroos, RJ Macready
  219. @mikemikev

    Neither were addressed? Anyone can check this by reading the threads hence you don’t quote a comment. Your response to IBD was denial while providing no rebuttal. That’s not addressing it.

    IBD captures ~77% of genetic variation between populations.
    https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/18159552.pdf

    In the same thread you also denied populations in Sub-Saharan Africa have the most genetic and phenotypic diversity – something contradicted by countless data and studies; laughably your response was posting a link by a proponent of the Out of America theory, arguing humans originated in the Americas continent. So it’s apparent you’re a total crank. You don’t understand basic population genetics or evolutionary biology. This is why most people don’t waste time debating you since you’re a dumbass troll (also a nutcase who creates countless sockpuppets.)

    • Replies: @mikemikev
  220. @geokat62

    Lol.

    “Mark Collett smeared as a neo-nazi”.

    Despite he is self-admitted neo-Nazi as caught on camera and is a huge anti-Semite and Holocaust denier etc.

    Watch the documentary (search for it on YouTube):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young,_Nazi_and_Proud

    The documentary focused on the then chairman of Young BNP, Mark Collett. Interviews highlighted the ideological background of Collett, particularly his sympathetic stance towards the policies of Nazism and Adolf Hitler.

    • Replies: @geokat62
  221. Chinaman says:
    @Allen Trombone

    Essentially the Jewish Marxist Communist Chinese Cultural Revolution that killed tens of millions of Chinese people (the best and the brightest Chinese, many of whom fled to America if not Taiwan and Hong Kong)

    Well, let’s assume you are right but the question is not how many tens of millions died but how many got to pass on their “best and brightest” genes before the purge happened. It is always perplexing to see some white dude profess even more hatred for the CCP than my mom who almost drowned escaping from Guangzhou to Hong Kong when the revolution came to our door. As expected for a white dude, the cliches you have made about the CCP and China betray a very superficial understanding of the issues. Traditionally, the smartest Chinese have always came from Zhenjiang province that covers Shanghai and Suzhou. These were where the literary and government elites retired and take in tens of concubines and have a bunch of kids. I don’t know how many escaped (my dad did in 1933 before the Battle of Shanghai) but I assure you most of the population survived. Shanghainese still have the highest AVERAGE IQ In China at 115. That’s one standard deviation and the same size as the black-white IQ gap. Having lived in Taiwan and being a Hong Konger myself, I assure you mainland Chinese are as smart and much more driven than their brethren.

    You can not learn that which your brain can not perceive, which if you understand autism, Asperger’s, and the ASDs you know that it can take years for someone with those disorders

    That might be true in some extreme cases but IQ or the G factor is a measure of general cognitive ability and a high IQ denotes malleability and adaptability. You mentioned critical thinking SKILLS so I assume you believe it can be taught. Lateral thinking can definitely be taught. You can even enhanced all those exalted qualities you cited via Transcranial direct current stimulation which suppress the anterior temporal lobes which is used for reasoning and logic (I guess you don’t like that idea).

    I discuss the Kabbalistic aspect of what you discussed in your previous comment about a technological singularity.

    I met Ray Kurzweil in 2008 and that’s how I came across the concept of a singularity, I am not completely sold on it and I agree that exponential growth have never been sustainable. It is but one possible trajectory of the future. But If there is no singularity, then it will be genetic engineering galore.

    You yourself most likely have some form of autism or Asperger’s. I can see it through your mechanical writing technique and n + 1 thinking.

    Yeah. Go write something in Chinese and see how poetic and creative you sound. May be I am aspergic but then…your emotionally charged vitriol on a public forum over CCP, Kabbalistic Transhumanism and other things you don’t understand very well would suggest you are a nut.

    • Thanks: Patriot
    • Replies: @Ron Unz
  222. Chinaman says:
    @AaronB

    I am not convinced, though, that China can really become a true peer competitor under the repressive CCP, because I think a higher level of anarchy is needed for creativity. I think China, after a period, will have to graduate to aa more relaxed system that permits greater anarchy. But we shall see.

    As a Hongkonger, I was brought up to think that the CCP was the Antichrist and then I went there and discovered that’s the biggest lie fed to us by the Albions. There is more FREEDOM in China than any East Asian country after the 90s. There were no laws and It was an Wild West back then. Everything was negotiable. If It was so repressive and authoritarian, how did it even get to where it is now? Lifting 800m out of poverty in the process? I know you are thinking I am a CCP apologist now but my best advice is to go experience it yourself.

    Just as America is not the city on the hill portrayed in Hollywood movies, the China is not the authoritarian hell that the Western media feeds you.

    • Agree: Patriot
    • Replies: @AaronB
  223. AaronB says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    The fact that humans are uniquely malleable in that they can be trained to behave in countless ways also doesn’t mean that they are infinitely flexible. For example, the project of trying to make negroes behave exactly as whites behave, on average, may well be doomed to failure because of the peculiarities of their respective genetics

    .

    Correct, but we simply lack the scientific tools at present to determine what is generics and what is environment, and we simply have too many historical examples of groups radically changing behavior, or displaying new capabilities, in short spaces of time, to come to any conclusions.

    We can safely assume genetics plays a role, yes.

    But instead of reifying racial essences, we can remain empirical, and simply say certain groups behave certain ways for the time being.

    Why not say what we know, and keep our minds open? Why not remain empirical?

    It would have been very easy for, say, Japanese who encountered an unbelievably superior West in the 19th century, to say that the difference was racial, and there is no way they could catch up.

    It would have been very easy for Jews to say, they could never be fighters and farmers, and trying to create Israel was a pipe dream.

    But both groups did not believe in racial essences, and believed in racial flexibility.

    I would submit to you, that the idea if racial essences – the emphasis on stasis, on limits – is one more manifestation of European decadence , of Eurooean exhaustion.

    Vital, energetic races put the emphasis on possibility . Jews, and Chinese, today, believe in environment and effort, not race.

    Of course, genes play a role, mankind is not infinitely flexible, race exists, and imposes limitations. But it is a question of what you choose to emphasize.

    Blacks exactly like Whites? Maybe, maybe not. So far, not. And there is no need for them to be exactly like Whites

    Let us stick to the facts, remain empirical, look at history, and keep open minds.

    It’s the presumption that there are no races, only the human race, that actually kills thought. This presumption is based in religious thinking, not scientific thinking. In the West, it’s an inheritance from its Christian past.

    I agree. To completely eliminate race from consideration, and to claim everyone is the same, is an ideology. It is unintelligent and kills thought.

    In my opinion, there are many more races than the big divisions. Humanity is divided into many, many groups that have limited ability to understand each other and live like each other, and accepting this may lead to tolerance.

    The idea that humanity is one race, has led to wars of ideology, and intolerance of different ways of living.

    There is a place for accepting limitation, and for recognizing flexibility.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  224. geokat62 says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Collett, particularly his sympathetic stance towards the policies of Nazism and Adolf Hitler.

    A young British lad who loves his country and doesn’t wish to see it turned into a dystopian hellhole says some flattering words about Hitler… is ipso facto a neo-Nazi?

    Tell me something, Ollie, do you consider JFK to be a neo-Nazi for making these statements?

    Kennedy, then 28, predicted “Hitler will emerge from the hatred that surrounds him now as one of the most significant figures who ever lived”.

    “He had in him the stuff of which legends are made,” he continued.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-39371715

    • Replies: @Malla
  225. Malla says:
    @White Men Can’t Jump

    We know who are indigenous people in Australia, Americas, Africa, Antarctica, who were indigenous people in Europe?

    Who are the indigenous people of Africa again? Surely not black Africans, there are older Caucasian skulls found in Africa like the Hoffmeyr Skulls then the oldest Negroid skulls 12,000 yrs back. So what you mean by indigenous people of Africa?

    The so called Aryans were related to the indigenous people of Europe (European hunter gatherers), they were basically a branch of European hunter gatherers who went to the Steppes and turned pastoralists. Aryans invading Europe was a home coming, a return back home.
    If you zoom in on the map on R1a (One of the Aryan) haplogroup, you get. the small print

    The oldest example of R1a in ancient DNA from Central Asia is dated to 2132-1940 calBCE (ID I3770, Narasimhan 2019). Moreover, this sequence is closely related to much older R1a samples from Central, Eastern and Northern Europe, and phylogenetically nested within their diversity. Thus, it must surely represent a population expansion from Europe to Central Asia. Indeed, it’s also associated with the Bronze Age Andronovo archeological culture, which is usually seen as an offshoot of the Corded Ware culture (CWC) of Late Neolithic Europe. The vast majority of present-day R1a lineages in Central Asia are closely related to that of I3770, and so must also ultimately derive from Europe.”

    Also form the map of R1a
    The oldest instance of R1a in ancient DNA from South Asia is dated to just 1044-922 calBCE (ID I12457, Narasimhan 2019). This sequence, as well as the vast majority of present-day South Asian R1a lineages, are closely related to much older R1a samples from Central, Eastern and Northern Europe, and phylogenetically nested within their diversity. Thus, they must surely represent a population expansion from Europe to South Asia via Central Asia, in all likelihood during the Bronze Age. Even if R1a existed in South Asia before the Bronze Age, which is extremely unlikely, because it’s found in samples from indigenous European hunter-gatherers, the vast majority of present-day R1a lineages in South Asia must be ultimately from Europe.

  226. Malla says:
    @White Men Can’t Jump

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6822619/
    The Formation of Human Populations in South and Central Asia

    By sequencing 523 ancient humans, we show that the primary source of ancestry in modern South Asians is a prehistoric genetic gradient between people related to early hunter-gatherers of Iran and southeast Asia. Following the Indus Valley Civilization’s decline, they mixed with people in the southeast to form one of the two main ancestral populations of South Asia whose direct descendants live in southern India. Simultaneously, they mixed with descendants of Steppe pastoralists who spread via Central Asia after 4000 years ago to form the other main ancestral population. The Steppe ancestry in South Asia has the same profile as that in Bronze Age Eastern Europe, tracking a movement of people that affected both regions and that likely spread the unique shared features shared between Indo-Iranian and Balto-Slavic languages.

  227. AaronB says:
    @Chinaman

    I think that was true till about 5 years ago. China was a wonderfully free and chaotic place. But I think its gotten much more repressive lately. Whats more worrying, is that the vision of the CCP going forward is more social control and repression. I also see this trend as larger than just China and global.

    I’m certainly open to the possibility that beneath a veneer of authoritarianism, there can be much freedom, and beneath a democratic veneer, there can be tyranny. I’m not hung up on superficial appearances.

    In fact, I think the CCP will gradually loosen up without ever becoming a formal democracy, and it won’t matter.

    Anyways, I’m open to the possibility I’m wrong. When Covid is over I am planning a trip to Asia so we will see.

  228. Malla says:
    @geokat62

    do you consider JFK to be a neo-Nazi for making these statements?

    Ollie might consider the Jewish director Stanley Kubrick an “evul” Neo Nazi too. LOL
    From
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_and_religious_beliefs_of_Stanley_Kubrick
    Frederic Raphael, who co-authored the Eyes Wide Shut script with Kubrick, says that the director once remarked that “Hitler was right about almost everything”,.

    • Agree: RJ Macready
    • Thanks: geokat62
    • Replies: @RJ Macready
  229. geokat62 says:

    Things are starting to heat up across the pond!

    Sir Keir Starmer fails to challenge radio caller’s racist conspiracy theory

    Excerpts from, Starmer criticised for not challenging racist conspiracy theory on LBC:

    Keir Starmer has been criticised for failing to directly challenge the white supremacist views of an LBC caller who joined his ‘Call Keir’ session this morning and promoted a conspiracy theory advocated by racists.
    The Labour leader made clear repeatedly that he disagreed with the view that football players taking the knee should be booed, but he did not confront the other dangerous comments of the caller today…

    The caller, who said her husband joined the booing of Millwall players for protesting racism, asked whether white people should “also start playing identity politics now before they become a minority themselves by 2066”.

    In asking the question, the caller introduced as Gemma promoted the white replacement conspiracy theory advanced by white nationalists and the far right. Neither host Nick Ferrari nor Starmer picked up on it…

    Ferrari later asked the caller why her husband chose to boo the players. She repeated the belief that “racial inequality is now against the indigenous people of Britain because we are set to become a minority by 2066”.

    The caller added: “We just have to look across to the Middle East. Israel has a state law that they are the only people in that country to have self-determination. Why can’t I, as a white British female, have that same right?”

    Starmer replied: “Gemma, we all have those rights. This is about recognising some injustices that have gone on for a very long time, and I think people were genuinely moved this year and want to make sure that that injustice is dealt with.
    “People will look at it different ways but I think the vast majority of people do want a more equal society.”

    Commenting on the exchange, Labour MP Clive Lewis said: “For neither the presenter nor Keir to, at the very least, explore further, unpack and robustly challenge such an extreme statement is frankly appalling.”

    Nadia Whittome MP said: “This is a ‘Great Replacement’ conspiracy theory as old as time. We must be able to recognise and robustly challenge white supremacy – especially when it is promoted on national radio.”

    https://labourlist.org/2020/12/starmer-criticised-for-not-challenging-racist-conspiracy-theory-on-lbc/

    How would you respond to the caller’s query (especially the one bolded), Ollie?

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  230. Ron Unz says:
    @Chinaman

    Essentially the Jewish Marxist Communist Chinese Cultural Revolution that killed tens of millions of Chinese people (the best and the brightest Chinese, many of whom fled to America if not Taiwan and Hong Kong)

    As expected for a white dude, the cliches you have made about the CCP and China betray a very superficial understanding of the issues.

    I’m sure you find it rather amusing when some of the commenters here spout off in an ignorant or even ridiculous fashion about Hong Kong or China, places whose history and society you apparently know extremely well.

    But please do consider that many of your own statements regarding the history and society of America would seem just as ignorant or ridiculous. It’s much better for sensible people to be cautious in making claims about foreign countries about which they lack any serious knowledge.

    • Replies: @Chinaman
  231. Malla says:
    @nokangaroos

    “Caucasian” is a term coined by Blumenbach for the hypothetical “primal race”, based on a literal reading of Genesis;

    One theory goes as this: Noah’s ship landing on Mt. Ararat, Turkey, Southern Caucasus mountains after the floods in Iraq (Sumeria region). All of his three kids were supposedly White, hence the term Caucasians from Mt. Ararat in Caucasus Mts. The Jaspeths went across the black sea from Northern Turkey/Mt.Ararat becoming the Aryans of Ukraine, before spreading out. While Shem and Ham were supposedly related to Celts were in the Middle East/North Africa, eventually mixed up with the pre Adamic black races to become today’s brown Caucasoids there. Hence, the Tutankhamen Mummy (Ham) was found to have British DNA from his father’s side in the Swiss study. Pharoah Tutunkamen’s Y-DNA was more similar to today’s British men than the Egyptians today. The Celtic side of Brits. Of course the study was suppressed.

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  232. Chinaman says:
    @Ron Unz

    80% of the commenters here routinely makes preposterous and ridiculous claims…

    I am not one of them.

    You might disagree with my interpretation of certain events but I always try to back up my claims with facts and cite my sources. If you find my claims “ridiculous” or ignorant, it is because you disagree with some other AMERICAN “expert’s” perspective. These Americans might be dishonest, ignorant, politically motivated or have some hidden agenda but they in the mainstream media which is why I hear about their views. You are not.

    Your perspectives belongs to a extremely minority of people. Take your disagreement up with media and these expert sprouting these “falsehood.”

    Now, What I am quite certain is that I am on the right side of history since that’s the how it will be written..whether it is true of not…

    What you don’t seem to understand is that I don’t really care about the historical accuracy of how White colonisers’s presence lead to the demise of native Indians…I am interested in genocide as a universal phenomenon and the possible genetic underpinning of genocidal tendencies and how it might have evolved…Isn’t that much more interesting??? Despite your professed interest in sociobiology, this social phenomenon doesn’t seem to have pique your interest. Anyway, who cares…

    Let me be, ok?

  233. @White Men Can’t Jump

    When looking at etymology it is not always easy to determine who influenced whom. The Vincha culture may have introduce script but nobody knows what language they spoke thousands of years BC.

    How do you prove that those Serbian words were spread to India or not from India? Arabs spread Indian numerals to Europe so it is likely that they also spread some words in the same direction. In our time we can see the spread of Anglo words into many languages, especially when it comes to technical terms, so it is easy for us to determine the source and direction of such words but going back into the deep past it becomes difficult.

    Pali is an interesting language as you will find words from many different languages in it. But was it the source of those words or it adopted them from others? I’m no linguist but I think you need to prove how a word moved in a particular direction and not another.

  234. @Malla

    You are carrying crows to Berchtesgaden, but thanks 😀

    – Give up on trying to enlighten a willfully ignorant bakkaballer …
    none so blind as etc.
    – It´s fascinating how well the DNA vindicated the 19th century Urheimat
    hypothesis for the origin of Indogermanics based on language comparison alone.
    – The early Steppe cultures are an intriguing topic – 4000 years of Silk Road
    (cf. bronze knives type Leopoldsberg) – and the Russians deserve to be flogged for looting the kurgans around the turn of the last century for what amounted to nothing more than a royal fancy for gold.
    – Nice graphics 😉

  235. @Malla

    You haven’t answered who were Indo-Europeans. You do not need to be frustrated. If you did it would be easier to make conclusions. You wrote about R1a but Yamnaya people were R1b (future ‘westerners’). Which haplogroups have north Europeans. What’s happened with the ‘Indo-European’ language brought by Yamnaya? They came to EU about 2800BC but we have English, German and Scandinavian languages formed few hundreds years ago. What was in meantime? Neither ‘Balto-Slavic’ nor ‘Soviet’ languages existed 4000 years ago but existed Serbian language from which all ‘Slavic’ languages later developed (first mentioning of Russian name is in the 8th c.AC, other much later).

    Why is the Serbian language the most similar to Sanskrit but not surrounding languages – Hungarian, Italian, German, French, Greek, etc? Serbs and other Slavics are mostly R1a+I2a. They were Aryans, not Germans or Anglo-Celtic. So-called Indo-Iranian languages are much younger than 2000BC i.e. than Sanskrit. How nomads could bring sophisticated language, Vedas and culture? How much time was needed for the formation of the ‘proto’ language (‘proto Indo-European’) and after that the ‘real’ (‘Indo-European’) language? Where this happened? Where people lived during the Ice Age?

    Lived in Vincha (Iron Gates, Danube, L.Vir, Starcevo). Immediately after the Ice Age, we have urban life in Lepenski Vir and Vincha, high technology, metallurgy, architecture, wheel, trades, fashion, the oldest alphabet, etc. Who lived there between 12000BC and 3000BC when Yamnaya nomads came to Europe? Which language was spoken there?

    • Replies: @Malla
  236. @AaronB

    You set up a straw man most ‘race realists’ do. No one has ever said “everyone is the same”. Denying human races exist doesn’t mean everyone is identical:

    * No two individuals are literally identical (not even monozygotic twins).
    * The human species will never be panmictic (random breeding) i.e. there will always be different breeding populations.

    A breeding population though would be Amish people or the Basques not “Whites”, “Caucasoids” etc. Edward Dutton is confused with what breeding populations are.

    • Replies: @AaronB
  237. AaronB says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    My point was in line with your point, and in favor of making finer distinctions than the large racial groupings.

    Not just local breeding populations, where already at this level differences can be significant, but even “races” within local breeding population.

    Every community contains a mixture of types, and it may not make sense to force one lifestyle onto everyone.

    Most of human history, was the attempt to impose one kind of lifestyle and value system, on a community (and eventually, the world) , based on the assumption “humanity”, is a single entity.

    But if in a sense, a community is composed of multiple “races”, or groups that cannot understand each other or live like each, then this attempt has been a tragic mistake.

    For instance, some people care very much about technological progress. I dont care at all and dont wish to work towards that end. Instead of each of us trying to prove that our preference is the only right one for humanity, we may accept that we belong to different races, and become tolerant of each other.

    Obviously, this is just a way of organizing reality, that may or may not be useful.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  238. @IrrationalWiki

    Finally this year he (mostly) has left me alone. Only took him about 7 years…

    Rutherford is indeed Mikemikev’s new obsession/victim.

    What’s he’s doing to Rutherford now is what he did to me – create dozens of accounts on social media to attack me and then go around the internet impersonating/using my name on fake accounts. It’s the same repetitive insane behaviour, only a different victim.

    22:13, 25 November 2020 CircularReasoning (talk | contribs) blocked Adam Rutherford (talk | contribs) with an expiration time of π×infinity! (account creation disabled, cannot edit own talk page) (Ban evasion: Mikey boy)
    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Adam_Rutherford

    17:04, 10 October 2016 David Gerard (talk | contribs) blocked Oliver D Smith (talk | contribs) with an expiration time of π×infinity! (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page) (mikemikev, no reason to allow this account to edit ever again)
    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Oliver_D_Smith

  239. @AaronB

    I’m mostly in agreement with you – the only difference is I’m saying only those fine-grained/local populations have any utility in population genetics and forensic science. The big population divisions at the continental or subcontinental level like “Caucasoid”, “African”, “European”, “East Asian” etc., have no utility so should be discarded (thankfully they are – most population geneticists don’t use them anymore).

    Forensic science is slower to update than population genetics, but there was a major paper published this year, telling forensic scientists to abandon the old Caucasoid-Negroid-Mongoloid division.
    https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/wfs2.1369

    The future of ancestry estimation research centers on: (a) abandoning the trait list approach, (b) rejecting the three‐group model, (c) establishing larger and more representative reference data, (d) assessing the utility of mixed method models, and (e) developing new statistical approaches and updating current software tools.

    I also know this myself because I recently studied a BSc bio-archaeology module.

    • Replies: @Malla
  240. @Commentator Mike

    The genetics has confirmed that Aryans and Serbs i.e. Slavics (this term is used since the 7th c.AC) from Scandinavia to Kamchatka and from Arctic to the Golf have the same genetics. Germans and Anglo-Celtics were NOT Aryans. Almost no one think anymore that all those people originated and left India, populated the world and none of them left in India. Who are the native speakers of Sanskrit in India?

    There are thousands of linguistic examples, hope I will have time and space to present some. In addition, there is very similar mythology brought in Vedas of Serbs (i.e. Slavics) and Hinduism. There are thousands of Serbian toponyms in S.Asia. Was there any toponym from SAsia brought to Europe? Yamnaya nomads could not bring a sophisticated language and culture to Europe. Btw, there are many Serbian toponyms in British Isles, too. For example, Serbian word MED (honey) is a root for medicine, medication, etc and it is present in about 50 EuroAsian languages. There are many other Serbian words which are present in many languages (e.g. in phonetic – duh, pir, vampire, etc). English word LAND (in phonetic – lend) is a nasal pronunciation of Serbian word LED (ice). I will present this example. This people remember when the ice border in Europe in 8000BC was in today’s Czechoslovakia.

    Some signs from the oldest in the world Vincha’s alphabet (swastika is one sign) were present in continuity until today in modern Serbian alphabet, including old Etruscan alphabet, too.
    The funniest example is the word – father, pater, padre, etc, which evolved via wrong Greek translation of the Serbian word – bato i.e. brother. It means that the word ‘father’ actually means ‘brother’. More to come, stay cool.

  241. Corvinus says:
    @Malla

    “I disagree, it is easier to assimilate Eastern Europeans than non White commonwealth country populations. ”

    LOL. WASPs stated differently in the 1920’s. You know, Heritage Americans. So, you have to go back.

    Interesting how “since the foundations of the American commonwealth were laid in colonial times over 300 years ago, vigorous complaint and more or less bitter persecution have been aimed at newcomers to our shores. Also the congressional reports of about 1840 are full of abuse of English, Scotch, Welsh immigrants as paupers, criminals, and so forth. Old citizens in Detroit of Irish and German descent have told me of the fierce tirades and propaganda directed against the great waves of Irish and Germans who came over from 1840 on for a few decades to escape civil, racial, and religious persecution in their native lands. And it is eminently fitting and proper that so many Members of this House with names as Irish as Paddy’s pig, are taking the floor these days to attack once more as their kind has attacked for seven bloody centuries the fearful fallacy of chosen peoples and inferior peoples. The fearful fallacy is that one is made to rule and the other to be abominated.”

    Robert H. Clancy, August 8, 1924

    • Replies: @Malla
  242. Malla says:
    @White Men Can’t Jump

    They came to EU about 2800BC

    But R1b existed in Europe much before that, the oldest Haplogroup R1B in the World was found in Europe and is dated 14 000 years. Olalde et al. (2017) trace the spread of haplogroup R1b-M269 in western Europe, particularly Britain, to the spread of the Beaker culture, with a sudden appearance of many R1b-M269 haplogroups in Western Europe ca. 5000–4500 years BP during the early Bronze Age. D’Atanasio et al. (2018) propose that R1b-V88 originated in Europe about 12 000 years ago and crossed to North Africa by about 8000 years ago; it may formerly have been common in southern Europe, where it has since been replaced by waves of other haplogroups, leaving remnant subclades almost exclusively in Sardinia.
    Both R1b and R1a are originally European haplogroups who got reintroduced back by the Yamnaya/Indo-Europeans.

    They came to EU about 2800BC but we have English, German and Scandinavian languages formed few hundreds years ago. What was in meantime?

    Other languages in between.What were the Germans speaking when they fought Rome?

    So-called Indo-Iranian languages are much younger than 2000BC i.e. than Sanskrit. How nomads could bring sophisticated language, Vedas and culture?

    Sanskrit being 2000 years old is doubtful and speculative. There is no written documentary proof of Sanskrit before BC period. The earliest documentary proof of Sanskrit starts after Christ i.e. AD. During Emperor Ashoka’s time, we have rock carvings throughout Indian subcontinent all the way to Afghanistan, in Prakrit and Greek but no Sanskrit. Show me one documentary evidence of written Sanskrit from BC period.

    You wrote about R1a but Yamnaya people were R1b (future ‘westerners’).

    R1b originated in Europe as well. And as far as the R1b/R1a split
    From a poster Ano4
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/heres/#comment-4034979
    One possible explanation would be the R1a versus R1b haplogroup split in PIE / PII populations. Afanasievo people derived from Yamnaya and were R1b, Andronovo people of Arkaim Sintashta/ Petrovka were R1a. Afanasievo migrated to Central Asia first, Andronovo came later. Andronovo replaced Afanasievo. Ancient Iranians and their Iranian, Ossetian, Kurdish descendants seem having more haplogroup R1b as compared to Scythians, Indian “Aryan ” castes and Balto-Slavic people who were R1a. Also Scythians were mainly R1a, while Sarmatians were mainly R1b, Sarmatians conquered Scythians in the Pontic plains and put an end to their domination. According to Tacitus, Sarmatians spoke a corrupted form of Scythian, and Germans spoke a language that had some similarities to Sarmatian.
    Perhaps the R1b people and R1a people have lived through ages of conflict resulting into an antagonistic use of some important words that were common in their respective dialects.
    The region where the ancient R1a / R1b split would have occurred might well be Xinjiang with the Uighur having a balanced proportion of both R1a and R1b on top of the typical Mongoloid Y haplogroups they share with Han Chinese and other Extreme Oriental populations.

    Who lived there between 12000BC and 3000BC when Yamnaya nomads came to Europe? Which language was spoken there?

    You tell me.

  243. Malla says:
    @Corvinus

    Idiotic comment. Did the heritage Americans write that non Europeans (South Asians, Middle Easterners, Blacks etc…) made better immigrants than the Europeans they were complaining about? If getting along with different ethnic groups people of the same race was so hard, imagine how much harder it will be getting along with people of different races.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  244. AaronB: “But instead of reifying racial essences, we can remain empirical, and simply say certain groups behave certain ways for the time being.”

    The problem is that science is an open-ended project, with no circumstances under which it can cease to be skeptical and conduct further inquiries, while man’s time and resources are limited. To recur to my example of the Pygmy and the Dinka, how many centuries should we try experiments to increase the average height of Pygmies to that of the Dinka simply by changing their nutrition? How long before we conclude it’s impossible given their genetics? To this, science itself can give no answer. It’s, as you might style it, a pragmatic question. It’s up to our discretion.

    AaronB: “Why not say what we know, and keep our minds open? Why not remain empirical?”

    Reaching a conclusion isn’t abandoning empiricism. We can remain open to new ideas while accepting certain things as true, pending new data or new theories. Problem is, even after centuries of experimentation and encouragement, there is very little to suggest that the black man’s very well-hidden ability to “become white” even exists at all.

    AaronB: “It would have been very easy for, say, Japanese who encountered an unbelievably superior West in the 19th century, to say that the difference was racial, and there is no way they could catch up.

    It would have been very easy for Jews to say, they could never be fighters and farmers, and trying to create Israel was a pipe dream.

    But both groups did not believe in racial essences, and believed in racial flexibility.”

    Jews, the most notorious, endogamous “chosen people”, don’t believe in race? LOL. That’s a good one!

    But you would probably say in response that the idea of being a chosen people has nothing to do with “racial essences”, whatever you mean by that. And that might even be right, though perhaps some rabbis would disagree with you. But in fact, if we take your idea seriously, neither the Jews nor the Japanese could possibly have had such notions to discourage them, since they weren’t white, and so of course had no clue about “racial essences”. Who was the Jewish or Japanese Linnaeus, or Darwin? They would have to have had such geniuses to give them such ideas; but they weren’t white, and so didn’t (couldn’t?) produce them. Further, without contact with whites due to the expansion of the technological system, both groups might have continued on indefinitely in the same way they had been for millennia. One might argue in this fashion, as some do, to try to prove that the whole system of taxonomy, and even science itself, is only a means by which whites attempt to assert their supremacy over other races.

    Then there is the issue of the technological system altering behavior and hence, destroying race, for racial classifications of any animal are partly based on behavior. As the behaviors of the races converge, natural races are extinguished, and Homo technologicus is born. Is a Jew or Jewess who presses a button to fire a missile at a target a thousand miles away really a “warrior”; a Japanese sitting in an air-conditioned cabin of a harvester really a “farmer”? And even if so, is that person any different than a negro who can do the same thing?

    In the current environment, races are in flux, can come in and out of existence quickly, and are tied to certain forms of behavior via technology. Hence, a need to decide the question of the importance of race exists right now, because races are being destroyed as we speak. We can allow it to continue, and accept our own self-destruction (egalitarians, technophiles, and transhumanists even welcome this), but if we whites think our race is worth preserving, we have to act now.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  245. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    the only difference is I’m saying only those fine-grained/local populations have any utility in population genetics and forensic science. The big population divisions at the continental or subcontinental level like “Caucasoid”, “African”, “European”, “East Asian” etc., have no utility so should be discarded

    Ridiculous. Races still have and will always have utility in population genetics and forensic science if political correct propaganda does not suppress it. In spite of your wishful thinking.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2ARnUeK-Y8WejZ1c3ZZZUE4YWs/view
    Global PCA map. Clustering by races can be seen.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  246. @Malla

    Ridiculous. Races still have and will always have utility in population genetics and forensic science if political correct propaganda does not suppress it. In spite of your wishful thinking.

    They don’t have any utility. I’ve been asking ‘race realists’ for the past 8 years (!) if not longer to provide evidence of a useful continental population in population genetics. They fail every time. I already debunked Dutton’s claims of “European” or “Sub-Saharan African” being useful ancestry groups in biomedicine. See post #115

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2ARnUeK-Y8WejZ1c3ZZZUE4YWs/view
    Global PCA map. Clustering by races can be seen.

    The clustering in that PCA is an artefact of the (poor) sampling i.e. populations were not sampled from many geographical regions. Typically not included are populations from Saharan Africa. Studies usually sample northernmost Africans and populations from sub-Saharan Africa, but include very few or none of the populations in-between from the Saharan desert and Sahel.

    If you sampled only Faroese, Igbo and Maori – of course you will end up with 3 genetic clusters. That fallacy is all that PCA is doing but with more samples (but an insufficient amount since it is excluding population samples from many large geographical areas).

    • Replies: @Malla
  247. @Malla

    ‘I’ haplogroup is the only haplogroup originated in Europe. I1 (so called Nordic) separated from Vincha’s I2a (so called Dinaric) and moved to the north of EU. R1b was present in Europe before big Yamnaya ‘wave’ btw 3300-2800BC which conducted genocides against indigenous people in Europe. I guess, we concluded that Yamnaya (R1b) were NOT Aryans. And Aryans have ‘Slavic’ genetics. How could Central Asian nomads from Russian steppes could develop proto-language, language and high civilization? The fact is that Serbs (who are proto-Slavics) have the same genetics with Aryan descendants in SAsia and that modern Serbian language is the most similar to Sanskrit (plus mythology and toponyms). How to explain this? It is known only the migration of Gypsies in the 9th c.AC from India to Europe.

    English language was formed in the 12th c.AC and German in the 14th c.AC, i.e. more than 3500 years after Sanskrit. What is the link between them? What were the names of these languages in this interim period? Serbian language of I2a Vincha’s people who moved to British Isles and Scandinavia influenced the formation of the Proto-Germanic language.

    ‘Which language spoke Germans while attacking Roman Empire’. What were mother tongues of Roman Emperors – Diocletian, Constantine, Licinius, Jovian, Justin, Justinian and two dozen others? Which language spoke Aleksandar the Great?

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  248. Corvinus says:
    @Malla

    “Idiotic comment.”

    Code for you don’t have a cogent rebuttal.

    “Did the heritage Americans write that non Europeans (South Asians, Middle Easterners, Blacks etc…) made better immigrants than the Europeans they were complaining about?”

    The point is that magic dirt won out.

    “If getting along with different ethnic groups people of the same race was so hard, imagine how much harder it will be getting along with people of different races.”

    Consider, however, that America’s history is based on this cycle:

    Newcomers arrive
    Newcomers are unwelcome
    Newcomers assimilate
    New newcomers arrive
    Old newcomers are unwelcome toward new newcomers
    Ad infinitum

    • Replies: @Franklin Ryckaert
    , @Malla
  249. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    “We can allow it to continue, and accept our own self-destruction (egalitarians, technophiles, and transhumanists even welcome this), but if we whites think our race is worth preserving, we have to act now.”

    The reality is that whites are preserving their race by their own accord in ways you personally disagree.

  250. @Malla

    Holy Shit. I am actually a filmmaker and Kubrick is one of my heroes(duh!). I had no idea he thought this way “Hitler was right about almost everything”. Having said that Frederic Raphael’s book was derided upon release and many people came forward saying many things in the book are outright bullshit. But I still believe Kubrick would feel that way- He was an ubermensch, incredibly intelligent and wise.

    PS- I eagerly await your mail. Past week I’ve been going through your posts all the way from 2017 when you started posting. There is so much to talk.

    https://aux.avclub.com/frederic-raphael-eyes-wide-open-a-memoir-of-stanley-k-1798193959

    Eyes Wide Open: A Memoir of Stanley Kubrick by Frederic Raphael from StanleyKubrick

    • Replies: @Malla
  251. Those who are interested in the meaning of the word RACE can read my comment in the neighbouring thread – Race Denialists Dig In. Txs.

  252. mikemikev says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Anyone who cares can just read the thread and see that you’re lying and repeating the same debunked points, like you always do.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  253. @White Men Can’t Jump

    There was a lot more interaction between East and the West in the ancient world than most are aware of. King Ashoka sent emissaries to the Middle East, Europe and North Africa in the third century BCE and some of his edicts were written in Greek and Aramaic as well as Indian languages. Maybe some of the linguistic influences of Indian on European languages may have originally been from Aryan influences on India earlier on but it’s hard to prove.

    The old Vincha language, whatever it may have been, could have influenced some others, I’m almost sure of that, but how would you go about proving this, or more specifically what those influences were? You claim that the Indo-European invasion exterminated all the old peoples of Europe (I’m not sure even that is true or can be proved) so how did the old Vincha language survive? And how do you go about proving that Alexander the Great’s native language was anything other than ancient Greek? There were no written records kept in those old languages to this day. So let’s say that in some ancient Latin or Greek records you find words and toponyms that correspond to modern Serbian, how can you say that they didn’t originate from Latin or Greek? Yes it’s possible that some Latin and Greek travellers may well have recorded some terms from oral languages they came across but trying to prove which is which today is almost impossible as interaction works both ways. Everyone tries to claim primacy of their own.

    • Replies: @White Men Can't Jump
  254. @Sick of Orcs

    Biden does not believe a single word of it, which of course, makes him all the more despicable as a human being. His whole political career is based on lies, corruption and plagiarism, the last word being equivalent to being “inauthentic”….

  255. @Malla

    The point is that left wing women, more often than not, make themselves ugly. Thus, the real meaning of Plato’s “truth is beauty and beauty is truth.”

  256. @mikemikev

    Nah, you’re projecting again Michael.

    Are you going to go back to pretending to be a female? Nutcase.

  257. @geokat62

    Israel is more ethnically diverse than UK.

    ~75% Jewish (= 45% Ashkenazi, 30% Mizrahi, 10% Sephardic, 3% Ethiopian Jews, the rest “mixed” or “other”)
    ~20% Arab (Palestinian, Bedouin, Druze etc., I have no sub-group estimates)
    ~ 5% Other (Arameans, Assyrians, many other small groups and refugees etc.)

    In contrast, UK is ~86% ‘White British’ (2011 census)

    • Replies: @geokat62
  258. geokat62 says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Israel is more ethnically diverse than UK.

    LOL! Are you suggesting that Eretz Yisrael is a stellar example of a civic-nationalist state? If so, why are they so keen to keep all the schwarzes out by building a wall?

    ~75% Jewish (= 45% Ashkenazi, 30% Mizrahi, 10% Sephardic, 3% Ethiopian Jews, the rest “mixed” or “other”)

    British (= 85% English, 8% Scottish, 5% Welsh, 3% Northern Irish)

    According to wiki:

    Historically, British people were therefore thought to be descended mainly from the different ethnic stocks that settled there before the 11th century: pre-Celtic, Celtic, Anglo-Saxon, Viking, and Norman.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_the_United_Kingdom

    The Brits were sufficiently diverse before JSOs pushed governments to flood the country with migrants from all over the world.

    Bottom Line: Diversity Is A Strength is simply a big lie pushed by JSOs… and you know it.

  259. @Corvinus

    If those newcomers were white, they could eventually assimilate into the white population. How much different do Irish or Germans look from the English? If they speak English you don’t notice a difference. Blacks were brought into America before most European immigrants came, yet they never “assimilated”. I leave it to your imagination, why that is the case.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  260. Malla says:
    @Corvinus

    Code for you don’t have a cogent rebuttal.

    No code here. It meant idiotic comment of an idiot. Simple as that.

    The point is that magic dirt won out.

    Just because magic dirt worked out with people of different ethnicities does not mean it will work out with people with different races.

    Consider, however, that America’s history is based on this cycle:
    Newcomers arrive
    Newcomers are unwelcome
    Newcomers assimilate
    New newcomers arrive

    As long as they are White (and maybe a few East Asians) it will work out. If not, third world shithole or Balkanisation. And without a White West, the rest of the World goes back even more tribal,more Oriental despotism (we in the third world are already moving towards it), more exploitation.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  261. Malla says:
    @RJ Macready

    Thanks

    I eagerly await your mail. Past week

    Gimme some time. I have not used my personal email for some time now (thanks to Whatsapp and the like). Gotta find the password and all that. I have only been using my professional email for the last some years.

  262. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    They don’t have any utility.

    Of course it has.

    The clustering in that PCA is an artefact of the (poor) sampling i.e

    What are you? A nutcase? have you actually seen the map? A good chunk of humanity are sampled. Siberians, Papuans, Arabs, South Asians of different types, South East Asians, Native Americans.

    Typically not included are populations from Saharan Africa.

    So what? even if you include Saharans like the Tuaregs, they are not gonna map with Europeans or East Asians.

    If you sampled only Faroese, Igbo and Maori

    Are you on crack? Did you see the map in the link? Only a certified crackpot would write an idiotic comment like that about that map.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  263. It is the height of absurdity to believe that only white Americans are racist, that is, notice race and are often guided by it. The problem boils down to semantics as do so many arguments people engage in. Foreign peoples absolutely engage in racism and it can be most simply proved by pointing out that they are ubiquitously aware of THE OTHER, THE OTHER, being those not like them. Really, the proof that others are aware of race and let it guide them is known to ever world traveler there ever was,.now and in the distant past. The philosopher and polymath, J.W. von Goethe, noticed that translation from one language to another is extremely difficult, simply because the people who speak the different languages are different. Now he was expressing a view from Europe, not the whole world!!

  264. It is the height of absurdity to believe that only white Americans are racist, that is, notice race and are often guided by it. The problem boils down to semantics as do so many arguments people engage in. Foreign peoples absolutely engage in racism and it can by most simply proved by pointing out that they are ubiquitously aware of THE OTHER, THE OTHER. Those not like them, if you will. Really, the proof that others are aware of race and let it guide them is that simple.

  265. Corvinus says:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    “If those newcomers were white, they could eventually assimilate into the white population.”

    It made no difference if they were white according to nativists and WASPs. From Alt Right leader Vox Day…”The Italians and the Irish were the original problem. They could have, and should have, been handled like the Chinese were. But they laid the groundwork for the Jews, the Germans, and the Scandinavians, who made things even worse. And they paved the way for the Mexicans, the Africans, and the Muslims. At this point, the USA probably can’t get back to 1986, let alone 1965.”

    Interesting. Basically, a specific group of whites, in this case European, who were deemed undesirable, which then opened up the floodgates to other “alien” Europeans to invade our shores.

    So, only those of stout Anglo-Saxon heritage served as the conduit to Western Civilization superiority and American exceptionalism. Do you really think they desired to have their culture being watered down by immigrants of notoriously questionable character, that being swarthy Poles and Italians?

    Consider that in the late 1800’s/early 1900’s, Senator Henry Cabot Lodge articulated the necessity for literacy tests and other measures to weed out, at worst, or outright deny, at best, the inclusion of “new” immigrants into American society.

    “It is found, in the first place, that the illiteracy test will bear most heavily upon the Italians, Russians, Poles, Hungarians, Greeks, and Asiatics, and lightly, or not at all, upon English-speaking emigrants, or Germans, Scandinavians, and French. In other words, the races most affected by the illiteracy test are those whose emigration to this country has begun within the last twenty years and swelled rapidly to enormous proportions, races with which the English speaking people have never hitherto assimilated, and who are most alien to the great body of the people of the United States.”

    Now, do YOU assume the redeemable qualities that only Anglo-Saxons possess, in the name of “fellow white brethren”? Ironically, it seems you are opposed to non-white immigration even though your ancestors had been labeled being other than white and thus incapable and unworthy of assimilation. So, to what extent were nativists and WASPs inaccurate of their assessment of YOUR people?

    “How much different do Irish or Germans look from the English?”

    NOTICEABLE different, according to nativists and WASPs.

  266. Corvinus says:
    @Malla

    “Just because magic dirt worked out with people of different ethnicities does not mean it will work out with people with different races.”

    Wait, I thought there was no such thing as “magic dirt”! I wouldn’t admit that point openly again, given how your handlers are carefully monitoring your every move.

    Regardless, if “magic dirt” worked out for different ethnicities–who in the past had been deemed as being COMPLETELY incompatible with comprehending WASP cultural values**–then assuredly it is able to work out for different races.

    **At least, according to Alt Right leader Vox Day

    “Many, if not most, descendants of immigrants are not the Posterity of the then-People of the United States. Neither are people living in Mexico, Germany, Israel, or even Great Britain. The U.S. Constitution was not written for them, nor was it ever intended to secure the Blessings of Liberty for them. The idea that the Constitution was intended to do anything at all for immigrants, resident aliens, or foreigners is as absurd as the idea that its emanations and penumbras provide them with an unalienable right to an abortion. The fact that courts have declared otherwise is totally irrelevant.”

    “As long as they are White (and maybe a few East Asians) it will work out.”

    LOL, absolutely no East Asians, especially according to nativists and WASPs. And it’s about being a desirable white, which is very restrictive–almost like a club! Let us NOTICE in our current ideological climate who are the Bad Guys and who are the Good Guys.

    BAD
    Trouble maker white –> Middle Eastern and Jewish

    We feel sorry for you because you are not white –> blacks, Asians, indigenous

    Fake white –> SJW, leftist, and/or feminist designation

    PROBABLY BAD
    Inferior white –> white + black or Asian or indigenous or mutt

    You may be white, but probably not –> those who are wiggers

    Wannabe whites –> those who lighten their skin to pass as white

    Nazi white –> those who are extremist whites or in the KKK or those who love Hitler

    PROBABLY GOOD
    White, but not white –> those who oppose the Alt Right but are not leftists or feminists

    Simply white –> whites who prefer not to be labeled…receive the label

    GOOD
    True white –> Alt Right designation

    Exceptional white –> Alt Right designation + trace ancestors directly from 13 colonies

    “And without a White West, the rest of the World goes back even more tribal,more Oriental despotism (we in the third world are already moving towards it), more exploitation”.

    No, that’s human nature, not “whiteness”.

    • Replies: @geokat62
    , @Malla
  267. geokat62 says:
    @Corvinus

    No, that’s human nature, not “whiteness”.

    Simple question, Corvy.

    Do you think that Londonistan (stabbing capital of the world) and Paris (biggest shithole city in Europe) are better off today after receiving heavy doses of cultural enrichment than they were in the 50s?

    If you respond in the affirmative, do you think the Zionist Project should also embrace diversity and abandon its status as an ethno-state and join the West and embrace civic-nationalism?

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  268. Corvinus says:
    @geokat62

    “Do you think that Londonistan (stabbing capital of the world) and Paris (biggest shithole city in Europe) are better off today after receiving heavy doses of cultural enrichment than they were in the 50s?”

    You mean are the lovely, historic cities of London and Paris better off today after receiving an infusion of immigrants for the past 70 years. I do not see why not, but you would have to ask the residents there. Of course, some would say “Yes”, others would say “No”. But the citizens there have to figure out there own immigration policies.

    https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/uk-public-opinion-toward-immigration-overall-attitudes-and-level-of-concern

    https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/insights/28390/in-macron-s-france-immigration-policy-is-getting-more-restrictive

    I have stated on this fine opinion webzine that the U.S. should limit immigration and provide ways to immerse the newcomers into our body politic. But as far as who should come in, it should not be restrictive as far as “No darkies” or “No muzzies”. And, we should take to the woodshed those companies who hire illegal immigrants and put them and U.S. Yet, that ultimate decision rests upon policy makers and our influence on them.

    Here is something interesting.

    https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/us/trump-admin-loses-3rd-lawsuit-against-imposition-of-wage-hike-for-h-1b-holders/articleshow/79739121.cms

    “If you respond in the affirmative, do you think the Zionist Project should also embrace diversity and abandon its status as an ethno-state and join the West and embrace civic-nationalism?”

    You mean should Israel enable the Palestinians to have their own homeland. I have always felt this group–Palestinians–ought to have self-determination.

    • Replies: @geokat62
    , @geokat62
  269. Corvinus: “The reality is that whites are preserving their race by their own accord in ways you personally disagree. ”

    Only if destroying something is the same thing as preserving it. But as I say, many people, including Christians like yourself, welcome this transformation, which is nothing less than a global homogenization of races and behavior. However, as Ted Kaczynski explained quite clearly in his essay “Industrial Society and Its Future”, reducing what had been humans to the status of mere technicians, and finally, after the whole system begins to be run by AI, to an entirely useless biological appendage, is not a project that’s sustainable. It can’t end well, and it’s better that it all come crashing down sooner rather than later. For racists, the only important question now is whether that will happen before the white race is extinguished, or after.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  270. @Malla

    You appear to be too lowbrow a poster to understand the point I made.

    The PCA you posted is incomplete and doesn’t sample populations from many geographical areas. Any clustering is an artefact of this poor sampling scheme. If you add more populations you won’t find such genetic clustering.

    Take for example a look at the PCA in Tishkoff et al. 2009.

    Populations in West Eurasia form a genetic continuum with Saharan Africa who form a genetic continuum with populations in sub-Saharan Africa etc.

    Where is the genetic clustering? You have a continua and any slicing of it is arbitrary.

    • Replies: @Malla
  271. geokat62 says:
    @Corvinus

    You mean are the lovely, historic cities of London and Paris better off today after receiving an infusion of immigrants for the past 70 years. I do not see why not, but you would have to ask the residents there.

    Have to ask the residents? Like asking Londoners if they’re happy their once beautiful city has become the murder capital of the world?

    London Becomes Murder Capital Of The World

    https://newspunch.com/london-murder-capital/

    … or the residents of Paris? It appears Paris has received 600,000 immigrants from Africa who are peeing and defecating in the streets…

    Paris Is A Shithole

    You mean should Israel enable the Palestinians to have their own homeland.

    No, I mean should the Zionist Project tear down its walls, declare an end to the ethno-state, and embrace mass immigration from the third world, just as Jewish Supremacist Organisations have pushed Western countries to do.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  272. geokat62 says:
    @Corvinus

    You mean are the lovely, historic cities of London and Paris better off today after receiving an infusion of immigrants for the past 70 years. I do not see why not, but you would have to ask the residents there.

    Have to ask the residents? Like asking Londoners if they’re happy their once beautiful city has become the murder capital of the world?

    London Becomes Murder Capital Of The World

    https://newspunch.com/london-murder-capital/

    … or the residents of Paris? It appears Paris has received 600,000 immigrants from Africa who are peeing and defecating in the streets…

    Paris Is A Shithole

    You mean should Israel enable the Palestinians to have their own homeland.

    No, I mean should the Zionist Project tear down its walls, declare an end to the ethno-state, and embrace mass immigration from the third world, just as Jewish Supremacist Organisations have pushed Western countries to do.

  273. @Commentator Mike

    Thanks for correct reply without frustration. I’ll try in the following comments to answer. Yamnaya people killed 90% of men and took Vincha’s women. Remaining I2 escaped as far as Sardinia and later learnt to fight, allying with R1a against R1b. Today’s Serbs are I2+R1a. Before this Yamnaya intrusion, Vincha had at least 2000 years of peace and they could develop language, alphabet, technology, architecture, arts, mythology, metallurgy, agriculture, etc. From this language evolved the Serbian language, the oldest language in Europe. ‘Indo-Germanishe’ (or ‘Indo-European’) is a fictional construct (even Wiki says this) which only makes confusion. Even more stupid construct is ‘IE people’ so as the search for IE language(s?)/people birthplace.

    Re: Lesandar Karanovic (aka Alexander the Great), I think it is obvious that he was not a Greek. His dynasty was 500 years long, there was NOT one Greek there. Btw, the name ‘Greek’ was given by indigenous people to colonists who came from Egypt and Middle East. This name first mentioned Aristotle and it was in use after Roman conquering in the 2nd c.BC. Among several dozens of tribes in Alexander’s Makedonia NOT one was a Greek and the most of them are now Serbian surnames. Makedonia was an Empire which conquered the world while Greeks only had isolated city-polises which were vassals to Makedonia (in Serbian=’poppy valley’). Greek did not have their own state until 1829 AC (!) when English and Austrians created it together with their instant ‘ancient’ history.

    At Alexander’s time, i.e. almost 1000 years after the Trojan battle, Greeks still did not reach Mt Olympus. How they could have Olympus mythology during this battle? Their and later Romans’s instant mythologies were replicas of several thousands of years older Serbian Pelasgian mythology. Iliad is not a Greek epic (at that time they even did not have the name). Alexander’s army consisted of Serbs and just few Greeks, who were actually hostages and sons of rich Athenians, who warranted a peace back at home while he was in Asia. Greeks did not have any fertile land nor any horse, how they could fight Persians? Actually, they fought Alexander in a decisive battle at Granik where consisted one half of Persian army (out of 20K Greeks, 18K got killed). Demosthenes could say a word or two about this ‘barbarian’. Btw, the name – Hellen is also Serbian.

    There are so many things in this falsified history, hope the moderators will open this topic as they did with Roman Empire. For the beginning, let’s agree in this that Greeks came as colonists from Africa/Middle East to today’s Greece where indigenous Pelasgians lived. I will also cite some Plato’s writings. Do you know the real name of Plato and what does it mean? Do you know that ‘Plato’ is a (Serbian) nickname, meaning – ‘wide or square shouldered’ guy? Enough for now, cheers!

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  274. geokat62 says:

    Letter to President Barack Obama signed by 370 Scholars of Graeco-Roman antiquity from all around the World about ancient Macedonian History

    Letter to President Barack Obama

    [email protected]

    May 18, 2009

    The Honorable Barack Obama
    President, United States of America
    White House
    1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
    Washington, DC 20500

    Dear President Obama,

    We, the undersigned scholars of Graeco-Roman antiquity, respectfully request that you intervene to clean up some of the historical debris left in southeast Europe by the previous U.S. administration.

    On November 4, 2004, two days after the re-election of President George W. Bush, his administration unilaterally recognized the “Republic of Macedonia.” This action not only abrogated geographic and historic fact, but it also has unleashed a dangerous epidemic of historical revisionism, of which the most obvious symptom is the misappropriation by the government in Skopje of the most famous of Macedonians, Alexander the Great.

    We believe that this silliness has gone too far, and that the U.S.A. has no business in supporting the subversion of history. Let us review facts. (The documentation for these facts [here in boldface] can be found attached and at: http://macedonia-evidence.org/documentation.html)

    [MORE]

    The land in question, with its modern capital at Skopje, was called Paionia in antiquity. Mts. Barnous and Orbelos (which form today the northern limits of Greece) provide a natural barrier that separated, and separates, Macedonia from its northern neighbor. The only real connection is along the Axios/Vardar River and even this valley “does not form a line of communication because it is divided by gorges.”

    While it is true that the Paionians were subdued by Philip II, father of Alexander, in 358 B.C. they were not Macedonians and did not live in Macedonia. Likewise, for example, the Egyptians, who were subdued by Alexander, may have been ruled by Macedonians, including the famous Cleopatra, but they were never Macedonians themselves, and Egypt was never called Macedonia.

    Rather, Macedonia and Macedonian Greeks have been located for at least 2,500 years just where the modern Greek province of Macedonia is. Exactly this same relationship is true for Attica and Athenian Greeks, Argos and Argive Greeks, Corinth and Corinthian Greeks, etc.

    We do not understand how the modern inhabitants of ancient Paionia, who speak Slavic – a language introduced into the Balkans about a millennium after the death of Alexander – can claim him as their national hero. Alexander the Great was thoroughly and indisputably Greek. His great-great-great grandfather, Alexander I, competed in the Olympic Games where participation was limited to Greeks.

    Even before Alexander I, the Macedonians traced their ancestry to Argos, and many of their kings used the head of Herakles – the quintessential Greek hero – on their coins.

    Euripides – who died and was buried in Macedonia– wrote his play Archelaos in honor of the great-uncle of Alexander, and in Greek. While in Macedonia, Euripides also wrote the Bacchai, again in Greek. Presumably the Macedonian audience could understand what he wrote and what they heard.

    Alexander’s father, Philip, won several equestrian victories at Olympia and Delphi, the two most Hellenic of all the sanctuaries in ancient Greece where non-Greeks were not allowed to compete. Even more significantly, Philip was appointed to conduct the Pythian Games at Delphi in 346 B.C. In other words, Alexander the Great’s father and his ancestors were thoroughly Greek. Greek was the language used by Demosthenes and his delegation from Athens when they paid visits to Philip, also in 346 B.C.

    Another northern Greek, Aristotle, went off to study for nearly 20 years in the Academy of Plato. Aristotle subsequently returned to Macedonia and became the tutor of Alexander III. They used Greek in their classroom which can still be seen near Naoussa in Macedonia.

    Alexander carried with him throughout his conquests Aristotle’s edition of Homer’s Iliad. Alexander also spread Greek language and culture throughout his empire, founding cities and establishing centers of learning. Hence inscriptions concerning such typical Greek institutions as the gymnasium are found as far away as Afghanistan. They are all written in Greek.

    The questions follow: Why was Greek the lingua franca all over Alexander’s empire if he was a “Macedonian”? Why was the New Testament, for example, written in Greek?

    The answers are clear: Alexander the Great was Greek, not Slavic, and Slavs and their language were nowhere near Alexander or his homeland until 1000 years later. This brings us back to the geographic area known in antiquity as Paionia. Why would the people who live there now call themselves Macedonians and their land Macedonia? Why would they abduct a completely Greek figure and make him their national hero?

    The ancient Paionians may or may not have been Greek, but they certainly became Greekish, and they were never Slavs. They were also not Macedonians. Ancient Paionia was a part of the Macedonian Empire. So were Ionia and Syria and Palestine and Egypt and Mesopotamia and Babylonia and Bactria and many more. They may thus have become “Macedonian” temporarily, but none was ever “Macedonia”. The theft of Philip and Alexander by a land that was never Macedonia cannot be justified.

    The traditions of ancient Paionia could be adopted by the current residents of that geographical area with considerable justification. But the extension of the geographic term “Macedonia” to cover southern Yugoslavia cannot. Even in the late 19th century, this misuse implied unhealthy territorial aspirations.

    The same motivation is to be seen in school maps that show the pseudo-greater Macedonia, stretching from Skopje to Mt. Olympus and labeled in Slavic. The same map and its claims are in calendars, bumper stickers, bank notes, etc., that have been circulating in the new state ever since it declared its independence from Yugoslavia in 1991. Why would a poor land-locked new state attempt such historical nonsense? Why would it brazenly mock and provoke its neighbor?

    However one might like to characterize such behavior, it is clearly not a force for historical accuracy, nor for stability in the Balkans. It is sad that the United States of America has abetted and encouraged such behavior.

    We call upon you, Mr. President, to help – in whatever ways you deem appropriate – the government in Skopje to understand that it cannot build a national identity at the expense of historic truth. Our common international society cannot survive when history is ignored, much less when history is fabricated.

    Sincerely,

    NAME TITLE INSTITUTION
    Anagnostis P. Agelarakis, Professor of Anthropology, Adelphi University (USA)

    Ioannis M. Akamatis, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    June W. Allison, Professor Emerita, Department of Greek and Latin, The Ohio State University (USA)

    Georgios Anagnostopoulos, Professor of Philosophy, University of California-San Diego (USA)

    Mariana Anagnostopoulos, Assistant Professor of Philosophy, California State University, Fresno (USA)

    Ronnie Ancona, Professor of Classics, Hunter College and The Graduate Center, CUNY (USA)

    John P. Anton, Distinguished Professor of Greek Philosophy and Culture University of South Florida (USA)

    Dr. Norman George Ashton, Senior Honorary Research Fellow, The University of Western Australia (Australia)

    Lucia Athanassaki, Associate Professor of Classical Philology, University of Crete (Greece)

    Effie F. Athanassopoulos, Associate Professor Anthropology and Classics, University of Nebraska-Lincoln (USA)

    Harry C. Avery, Professor of Classics, University of Pittsburgh (USA)

    Dr. Dirk Backendorf. Akademie der Wissenschaften und der Literatur Mainz (Germany)

    Elizabeth C. Banks, Associate Professor of Classics (ret.), University of Kansas (USA)

    Leonidas Bargeliotes, Emeritus Professor of Philosophy, University of Athens, President of the Olympic Center for Philosophy and Culture (Greece)

    Alice Bencivenni, Ricercatore di Storia Greca, Università di Bologna (Italy)

    David L. Berkey, Assistant Professor of History, California State University, Fresno (USA)

    Luigi Beschi, professore emerito di Archeologia Classica, Università di Firenze (Italy)

    Josine H. Blok, professor of Ancient History and Classical Civilization, Utrecht University (The Netherlands)

    Alan Boegehold, Emeritus Professor of Classics, Brown University (USA)

    Efrosyni Boutsikas, Lecturer of Classical Archaeology, University of Kent (UK)

    Ewen Bowie, Emeritus Fellow, Corpus Christi College, Oxford (UK)

    Keith Bradley, Eli J. and Helen Shaheen Professor of Classics, Concurrent Professor of History, University of Notre Dame (USA)

    Kostas Buraselis, Professor of Ancient History, University of Athens (Greece)

    Stanley M. Burstein, Professor Emeritus, California State University, Los Angeles (USA)

    Francis Cairns, Professor of Classical Languages, The Florida State University (USA)

    John McK. Camp II, Agora Excavations and Professor of Archaeology, ASCSA, Athens (Greece)

    David A. Campbell, Emeritus Professor of Classics. University of Victoria, B.C. (Canada)

    Paul Cartledge, A.G. Leventis Professor of Greek Culture, University of Cambridge (UK)

    Paavo Castren, Professor of Classical Philology Emeritus, University of Helsinki (Finland)

    William Cavanagh, Professor of Aegean Prehistory, University of Nottingham (UK)

    Angelos Chaniotis, Professor, Senior Research Fellow, All Souls College, Oxford (UK)

    Paul Christesen, Professor of Ancient Greek History, Dartmouth College (USA)

    James J. Clauss, Professor of Classics, University of Washington (USA)

    Ada Cohen, Associate Professor of Art History, Dartmouth College (USA)

    Randall M. Colaizzi, Lecturer in Classical Studies, University of Massachusetts-Boston (USA)

    Kathleen M. Coleman, Professor of Latin, Harvard University (USA)

    Rev. Dr. Demetrios J Constantelos, Charles Cooper Townsend Professor of Ancient and Byzantine history, Emeritus; Distinguished Research Scholar in Residence at the Richard Stockton College of New Jersey (USA)

    Michael B. Cosmopoulos, Ph.D., Professor and Endowed Chair in Greek Archaeology, University of Missouri-St. Louis (USA)

    Carole L. Crumley, PhD., Professor of European Archaeology, University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill (USA)

    Kevin F. Daly, Assistant Professor of Classics, Bucknell University (USA)

    Joseph W. Day, Professor of Classics, Wabash College (USA)

    François de Callataÿ, Professor of Monetary and financial history of the Greek world, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes (Paris/Sorbonne) and Professor of Financial history of the Greco-Roman world, Université libre de Bruxelles (France and Brussels)

    Wolfgang Decker, Professor emeritus of sport history, Deutsche Sporthochschule, Köln (Germany)

    Luc Deitz, Außerplanmäßger Professor of Mediaeval and Renaissance Latin, University of Trier (Germany), and Curator of manuscripts and rare books, National Library of Luxembourg (Luxembourg)

    Charalambos Dendrinos, Lecturer in Byzantine Literature and Greek Palaeography, Acting Director, The Hellenic Institute, Royal Holloway, University of London (UK)

    Michael Dewar, Professor of Classics, University of Toronto (Canada)

    John D. Dillery, Associate Professor of Classics, University of Virginia (USA

    John Dillon, Emeritus Professor of Greek, Trinity College Dublin (Ireland)

    Sheila Dillon, Associate Professor, Depts. of Art, Art History & Visual Studies and Classical Studies, Duke University (USA)

    Michael D. Dixon, Associate Professor of History, University of Southern Indiana (USA)

    Douglas Domingo-Foraste, Professor of Classics, California State University, Long Beach (USA)

    Myrto Dragona-Monachou, Professor emerita of Philosophy, University of Athens (Greece)

    Stella Drougou, Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Pierre Ducrey, professeur honoraire, Université de Lausanne (Switzerland)

    John Duffy, Professor, Department of the Classics, Harvard University (USA)

    Roger Dunkle, Professor of Classics Emeritus, Brooklyn College, City University of New York (USA)

    Michael M. Eisman, Associate Professor Ancient History and Classical Archaeology, Department of History, Temple University (USA)

    Mostafa El-Abbadi, Professor Emeritus, University of Alexandria (Egypt)

    R. Malcolm Errington, Professor für Alte Geschichte (Emeritus) Philipps-Universität, Marburg (Germany)

    Christos C. Evangeliou, Professor of Ancient Hellenic Philosophy, Towson University, Maryland, Honorary President of International Association for Greek Philosophy (USA)

    Panagiotis Faklaris, Assistant Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Denis Feeney, Giger Professor of Latin, Princeton University (USA)

    Michael Ferejohn, Associate Professor of Ancient Philosophy, Duke University (USA)

    Kleopatra Ferla, Ph.D. in Ancient History, Head of Research and Management of Cultural Information, Foundation of the Hellenic World, Athens (Greece)

    Elizabeth A. Fisher, Professor of Classics and Art History, Randolph-Macon College (USA)

    Nick Fisher, Professor of Ancient History, Cardiff University (UK)

    R. Leon Fitts, Asbury J Clarke Professor of Classical Studies, Emeritus, FSA, Scot., Dickinson Colllege (USA)

    John M. Fossey FRSC, FSA, Emeritus Professor of Art History (and Archaeology), McGill Univertsity, Montreal, and Curator of Archaeology, Montreal Museum of Fine Arts (Canada)

    Dr. Athanasios Fotiou, Adjunct Professor, College of the Humanities, Greek and Roman Studies, Carleton University, Ottawa (Canada)

    Robin Lane Fox, University Reader in Ancient History, New College, Oxford (UK)

    Dr. Lee Fratantuono, William Francis Whitlock Professor of Latin, Ohio Wesleyan University (USA)

    Stavros Frangoulidis, Associate Professor of Latin. Aristotelian University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    William K. Freiert, Professor of Classics and Hanson-Peterson Chair of Liberal Studies, Gustavus Adolphus College (USA)

    Rainer Friedrich, Professor of Classics Emeritus, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S. (Canada)

    Heide Froning, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Marburg (Germany)

    Peter Funke, Professor of Ancient History, University of Münster (Germany)

    Traianos Gagos, Professor of Greek and Papyrology, University of Michigan (USA)

    Karl Galinsky, Cailloux Centennial Professor of Classics, University of Texas, Austin (USA)

    Robert Garland, Roy D. and Margaret B. Wooster Professor of the Classics, Colgate University, Hamilton NY (USA)

    Hans-Joachim Gehrke, Prof. Dr., President of the German Archaeological Institute Berlin (Germany)

    Dr. Ioannis Georganas, Researcher, Department of History and Archaeology, Foundation of the Hellenic World (Greece)

    Douglas E. Gerber, Professor Emeritus of Classical Studies, University of Western Ontario (Canada)

    Dr. Andre Gerolymatos, Chair and Professor of Hellenic Studies, Simon Fraser University (Canada)

    Stephen L. Glass, John A. McCarthy Professor of Classics & Classical Archaeology, Pitzer College: The Claremont Colleges (USA)

    Hans R. Goette, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Giessen (Germany); German Archaeological Institute, Berlin (Germany)

    Sander M. Goldberg, Professor of Classics, UCLA (USA)

    Mark Golden, Professor, Department of Classics, University of Winnipeg (Canada)

    Ellen Greene, Joseph Paxton Presidential Professor of Classics, University of Oklahoma (USA)

    Robert Gregg, Teresa Moore Professor of Religious Studies, Emeritus, Director, The Abbasi Program in Islamic Studies, Stanford University (USA)

    Frederick T. Griffiths, Professor of Classics, Amherst College (USA)

    Dr. Peter Grossmann, Member emeritus, German Archaeological Institute, Cairo (Egypt)

    Erich S. Gruen, Gladys Rehard Wood Professor of History and Classics, Emeritus, University of California, Berkeley (USA)

    Martha Habash, Associate Professor of Classics, Creighton University (USA)

    Christian Habicht, Professor of Ancient History, Emeritus, Institute for Advanced Study, Princeton (USA)

    Donald C. Haggis, Nicholas A. Cassas Term Professor of Greek Studies, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (USA)

    Judith P. Hallett, Professor of Classics, University of Maryland, College Park, MD (USA)

    Kim Hartswick, Academic Director, CUNY Baccalaureate for Unique and Interdisciplinary Studies, New York City (USA)

    Prof. Paul B. Harvey, Jr. Head, Department of Classics and Ancient Mediterranean Studies, The Pennsylvania State University (USA)

    Eleni Hasaki, Associate Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Arizona (USA)

    Rosalia Hatzilambrou, Ph.D., Researcher, Academy of Athens (Greece)

    Miltiades B. Hatzopoulos, Director, Research Centre for Greek and Roman Antiquity, National Research Foundation, Athens (Greece)

    Stephan Heilen, Associate Professor of Classics, University of Illinois at Urbana- Champaign (USA)

    Wolf-Dieter Heilmeyer, Prof. Dr., Freie Universität Berlin und Antikensammlung der Staatlichen Museen zu Berlin (Germany)

    Pontus Hellstrom, Professor of Classical archaeology and ancient history, Uppsala University (Sweden)

    Steven W. Hirsch, Associate Professor of Classics and History, Tufts University (USA)

    Karl-J. Holkeskamp, Professor of Ancient History, University of Cologne (Germany)

    Frank L. Holt, Professor of Ancient History, University of Houston (USA)

    Dan Hooley, Professor of Classics, University of Missouri (USA)

    Meredith C. Hoppin, Gagliardi Professor of Classical Languages, Williams College, Williamstown, MA (USA)

    Caroline M. Houser, Professor of Art History Emerita, Smith College (USA) and Affiliated Professor, University of Washington (USA)

    Professor Carl Huffman, Department of Classics, DePauw University (USA)

    John Humphrey, Professor of Greek and Roman Studies, University of Calgary (Canada)

    Frosen Jaakko, Professor of Greek philology, University of Helsinki (Finland)

    Dr Thomas Johansen, Reader in Ancient Philosophy, University of Oxford (UK)

    Vincent Jolivet, Archaeologist CNRS, Paris [French School Rome] (Italy)

    Georgia Kafka, Visiting Professor of Modern Greek Language, Literature and History, University of New Brunswick (Canada)

    Mika Kajava, Professor of Greek Language and Literature; Head of the Department of Classical Studies, University of Helsinki (Finland)

    Anthony Kaldellis, Professor of Greek and Latin, The Ohio State University (USA)

    Eleni Kalokairinou, Assistant Professor of Philosophy, Secretary of the Olympic Center of Philosophy and Culture (Cyprus)

    Lilian Karali, Professor of Prehistoric and Environmental Archaeology, University of Athens (Greece)

    Andromache Karanika, Assistant Professor of Classics, University of California, Irvine (USA)

    Robert A. Kaster, Professor of Classics and Kennedy Foundation Professor of Latin, Princeton University (USA)

    Dr. Athena Kavoulaki, Lecturer, Department of Philology, University of Crete, Rethymnon (Greece)

    Vassiliki Kekela, Adjunct Professor of Greek Studies, Classics Department, Hunter College, City University of New York (USA)

    John F. Kenfield, Associate Professor, Department of Art History, Rutgers University (USA)

    Dietmar Kienast, Professor Emeritus of Ancient History, University of Düsseldorf (Germany)

    Karl Kilinski II, University Distinguished Teaching Professor, Southern Methodist University (USA)

    Dr. Florian Knauss, associate director, Staatliche Antikensammlungen und Glyptothek München (Germany)

    Denis Knoepfler, Professor of Greek Epigraphy and History, Collège de France (Paris, France)

    Ortwin Knorr, Associate Professor of Classics, Willamette University (USA)

    Robert B. Koehl, Professor of Archaeology, Department of Classical and Oriental Studies Hunter College, City University of New York (USA)

    Thomas Koentges, Visiting lecturer, Ancient History, University of Leipzig (Germany)

    Georgia Kokkorou-Alevras, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Athens (Greece)

    Ann Olga Koloski-Ostrow, Associate Professor and Chair, Department of Classical Studies, Brandeis University (USA)

    Eric J. Kondratieff, Assistant Professor of Classics and Ancient History, Department of Greek & Roman Classics, Temple University (USA)

    Dr Eleni Kornarou, Visiting Lecturer of Ancient Greek Literature, Dept. of Classic and Philosophy, University of Cyprus (Cyprus)

    Haritini Kotsidu, Apl. Prof. Dr. für Klassische Archäologie, Goethe-Universität, Frankfurt/M. (Germany)

    Lambrini Koutoussaki, Dr., Lecturer of Classical Archaeology, University of Zürich (Switzerland)

    David Kovacs, Hugh H. Obear Professor of Classics, University of Virginia (USA)

    Prof. Dr. Ulla Kreilinger, Institut für Klassische Archäologie, Universität Erlangen (Germany)

    Dr. Christos Kremmydas, Lecturer in Ancient Greek History, Royal Holloway, University of London (UK)

    Peter Krentz, W. R. Grey Professor of Classics and History, Davidson College (USA)

    Friedrich Krinzinger, Professor of Classical Archaeology Emeritus, University of Vienna (Austria)

    Michael Kumpf, Professor of Classics, Valparaiso University (USA)

    Donald G. Kyle, Professor of History, University of Texas at Arlington (USA)

    Prof. Dr. Dr. h.c. Helmut Kyrieleis, former president of the German Archaeological Institute, Berlin (Germany)

    Margaret L. Laird, Assistant Professor, Roman art and archaeology, University of Washington (USA)

    Gerald V. Lalonde, Benedict Professor of Classics, Grinnell College (USA)

    Steven Lattimore, Professor Emeritus of Classics, University of California, Los Angeles (USA)

    Francis M. Lazarus, President, University of Dallas (USA)

    Mary R. Lefkowitz, Andrew W. Mellon Professor in the Humanities, Emerita Wellesley College (USA)

    Irene S. Lemos FSA, Professor in Classical Archaeology,, S.Ioannou Centre for Classical and Byzantine Studies, Oxford University (UK)

    Ioannes G. Leontiades, Assistant Professor of Byzantine History, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Iphigeneia Leventi, Assistant Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Thessaly (Greece)

    Daniel B. Levine, Professor of Classical Studies, University of Arkansas (USA)

    Christina Leypold, Dr. phil., Archaeological Institute, University of Zürich (Switzerland)

    Vayos Liapis, Associate Professor of Greek, Centre d’Etudes Classiques & Departement de Philosophie, Université de Montreal (Canada)

    Hugh Lloyd-Jones, Professor of Greek Emeritus, University of Oxford (UK)

    Yannis Lolos, Assistant Professor, History, Archaeology, and Anthropology, University of Thessaly (Greece)

    Stanley Lombardo, Professor of Classics, University of Kansas (USA)

    Anthony Long, Professor of Classics and Irving G. Stone Professor of Literature, University of California, Berkeley (USA)

    Julia Lougovaya, Assistant Professor, Department of Classics, Columbia University (USA)

    Dr. John Ma, Lecturer in Ancient History, Oxford University and Tutorial Fellow in Ancient History, Corpus Christi College, Oxford (UK)

    A.D. Macro, Hobart Professor of Classical Languages emeritus, Trinity College (USA)

    John Magee, Professor, Department of Classics, Director, Centre for Medieval Studies, University of Toronto (Canada)

    Dr. Christofilis Maggidis, Associate Professor of Archaeology, Dickinson College (USA)

    Chryssa Maltezou, Professor emeritus, University of Athens, Director of the Hellenic Institute of Byzantine and Postbyzantine Studies in Venice (Italy)

    Jeannette Marchand, Assistant Professor of Classics, Wright State University, Dayton, Ohio (USA)

    Evangeline Markou, Adjunct Lecturer in Greek History, Open University of Cyprus (Cyprus)

    Anna Marmodoro, Faculty of Philosophy, University of Oxford (UK)

    Richard P. Martin, Antony and Isabelle Raubitschek Professor in Classics, Stanford University (USA)

    Maria Mavroudi, Professor of Byzantine History, University of California, Berkeley (USA)

    Jody Maxmin, Associate Professor, Dept. of Art & Art History, Stanford University (USA)

    Alexander Mazarakis-Ainian, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Thessaly (Greece)

    James R. McCredie, Sherman Fairchild Professor emeritus; Director, Excavations in Samothrace Institute of Fine Arts, New York University (USA)

    Brian McGing M.A., Ph.D., F.T.C.D., M.R.I.A., Regius Professor of Greek, Trinity College Dublin (Ireland)

    James C. McKeown, Professor of Classics, University of Wisconsin-Madison (USA)

    Richard McKirahan, Edwin Clarence Norton of Classics and Professor of Philosophy, Pitzer College: The Claremont Colleges (USA)

    Robert A. Mechikoff, Professor and Life Member of the International Society of Olympic Historians, San Diego State University (USA)

    Andreas Mehl, Professor of Ancient History, Universität Halle-Wittenberg (Germany)

    John Richard Melville-Jones, Winthrop Professor, Classics and Ancient History, University of Western Australia (Australia)

    Marion Meyer, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Vienna (Austria)

    Dr. Aristotle Michopoulos, Professor & Chair, Greek Studies Dept., Hellenic College (Brookline, MA, USA)

    Harald Mielsch, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Bonn (Germany)

    Stephen G. Miller, Professor of Classical Archaeology Emeritus, University of California, Berkeley (USA)

    Lynette G. Mitchell, Senior Lecturer in Classics & Ancient History, Exeter University (UK)

    Phillip Mitsis, A.S. Onassis Professor of Classics and Philosophy, New York University (USA)

    Peter Franz Mittag, Professor für Alte Geschichte, Universität zu Köln (Germany)

    David Gordon Mitten, James Loeb Professor of Classical Art and Archaeology, Harvard University (USA)

    Mette Moltesen, MA, Curator of Ancient Art, Ny Carlsberg Glyptotek, Copenhagen (Denmark)

    Margaret S. Mook, Associate Professor of Classical Studies, Iowa State University (USA)

    Anatole Mori, Associate Professor of Classical Studies, University of Missouri- Columbia (USA)

    William S. Morison, Associate Professor of Ancient History, Grand Valley State University (USA)

    Jennifer Sheridan Moss, Associate Professor, Wayne State University (USA)

    Aliki Moustaka, Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristotelian University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Mark Munn, Professor of Ancient Greek History and Greek Archaeology, the Pennsylvania State University (USA)

    Ioannis Mylonopoulos, Assistant Professor of Greek Art History and Archaeology, Columbia University, New York (USA)

    Alexander Nehamas, Edmund N. Carpenter II Class of 1943 Professor in the Humanities, Professor of Philosophy and Comparative Literature, Princeton University (USA)

    Richard Neudecker, PD of Classical Archaeology, Deutsches Archäologisches Institut Rom (Italy)

    James M.L. Newhard, Associate Professor of Classics, College of Charleston (USA)

    Carole E. Newlands, Professor of Classics, University of Wisconsin, Madison (USA)

    Andrew G. Nichols, Visiting Lecturer of Classics, University of Florida (USA)

    Jessica L. Nitschke, Assistant Professor of Classics, Georgetown University (USA)

    John Maxwell O’Brien, Professor of History, Queens College, City University of New York (USA)

    James J. O’Hara, Paddison Professor of Latin, The University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill (USA)

    Martin Ostwald, Professor of Classics (ret.), Swarthmore College and Professor of Classical Studies (ret.), University of Pennsylvania (USA)

    Olga Palagia, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Athens (Greece)

    Beata M. Kitsikis Panagopoulos, Professor of Art History, Retired, San Jose State University, Caifornia (USA)

    Christos Panayides, Associate Professor of Philosophy, University of Nicosia, (Cyprus)

    Vassiliki Panoussi, Associate Professor of Classical Studies, The College of William and Mary (USA)

    Maria C. Pantelia, Professor of Classics, University of California, Irvine (USA)

    Pantos A.Pantos, Adjunct Faculty, Department of History, Archaeology and Social Anthropology, University of Thessaly (Greece)

    Eleni Papaefthymiou, Curator of the Numismatic Collection of the Foundation of the Hellenic World (Greece)

    Maria Papaioannou, Assistant Professor in Classical Archaeology, University of New Brunswick (Canada)

    Anthony J. Papalas, Professor of Ancient History, East Carolina University (USA)

    Nassos Papalexandrou, Associate Professor, The University of Texas at Austin (USA)

    Polyvia Parara, Visiting Assistant Professor of Greek Language and Civilization, Department of Classics, Georgetown University (USA)

    Richard W. Parker, Associate Professor of Classics, Brock University (Canada)

    Robert Parker, Wykeham Professor of Ancient History, New College, Oxford (UK)

    Robert J. Penella, Professor and Chairman, Classics, Fordham University (USA)

    Anastasia-Erasmia Peponi, Associate Professor of Classics, Stanford University (USA)

    Jacques Perreault, Professor of Greek archaeology, Universite de Montreal, Quebec (Canada)

    Patrick Pfeil, magister artium Universität Leipzig, Alte Geschichte (Germany)

    Edward A. Phillips, Professor of Classics at Grinnell College (USA)

    Yanis Pikoulas, Associate Professor of Ancient Greek History, University of Thessaly (Greece)

    Lefteris Platon, Assistant Professor of Archaeology, University of Athens (Greece)

    John Pollini, Professor of Classical Art & Archaeology, University of Southern California (USA)

    David Potter, Arthur F. Thurnau Professor of Greek and Latin. The University of Michigan (USA)

    Daniel Potts, Edwin Cuthbert Hall Professor of Middle Eastern Archaeology, University of Sydney (Australia)

    Robert L. Pounder, Professor Emeritus of Classics, Vassar College (USA)

    Nikolaos Poulopoulos, Assistant Professor in History and Chair in Modern Greek Studies, McGill University (Canada)

    Selene Psoma, Senior Lecturer of Ancient History, University of Athens (Greece)

    William H. Race, George L. Paddison Professor of Classics, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (USA)

    John T. Ramsey, Professor of Classics, University of Illinois at Chicago (USA)

    Christian R. Raschle, Assistant Professor of Roman History, Centre d’Etudes Classiques & Departement d’Histoire, Université de Montreal (Canada)

    Karl Reber, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Lausanne (Switzerland)

    Gary Reger, Professor of History Trinity College, Connecticut (USA)

    Rush Rehm, Professor of Classics and Drama, Stanford University (USA)

    Heather L. Reid, Professor of Philosophy, Morningside College (USA)

    Christoph Reusser, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Zürich (Switzerland)

    Werner Riess, Associate Professor of Classics, The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (USA)

    Dr Tracey E Rihll, Senior lecturer, Department of Classics, Ancient History and Egyptology, Swansea University ( Wales, UK)

    Robert H. Rivkin, Ancient Studies Department, University of Maryland Baltimore County (USA)

    Walter M. Roberts III, Assistant Professor of Classics, University of Vermont (USA)

    Barbara Saylor Rodgers, Professor of Classics, The University of Vermont (USA)

    Robert H. Rodgers. Lyman-Roberts Professor of Classical Languages and Literature, University of Vermont (USA)

    Guy MacLean Rogers, Kemper Professor of Classics and History, Wellesley College (USA)

    Roberto Romano, professore di ruolo (II level) di Civiltà bizantina e Storia bizantina, Università “Federico II” di Napoli (Italy)

    Nathan Rosenstein, Professor of Ancient History, The Ohio State University (USA)

    John C. Rouman, Professor Emeritus of Classics, University of New Hampshire, (USA)

    Dr. James Roy, Reader in Greek History (retired), University of Nottingham (UK)

    Steven H. Rutledge, Associate Professor of Classics, Department of Classics, University of Maryland, College Park (USA)

    Daniel J. Sahas, Professor Emeritus, University of Waterloo (Canada)

    Christina A. Salowey, Associate Professor of Classics, Hollins University (USA)

    Pierre Sanchez, Professor of Ancient History, University of Geneva (Switzerland)

    Theodore Scaltsas, Professor of Ancient Greek Philosophy, University of Edinburgh (UK)

    Thomas F. Scanlon, Professor of Classics, University of California, Riverside (USA)

    Thomas Schäfer, Professor, Institut für Klassische Archäologie, Universität Tübingen (Germany)

    Bernhard Schmaltz, Prof. Dr. Archäologisches Institut der CAU, Kiel (Germany)

    Prof. Dr. Andras Schmidt-Colinet, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Vienna (Austria)

    Robert C. Schmiel, Prof. Emeritus of Greek & Roman Studies, University of Calgary (Canada)

    Rolf M. Schneider, Professor of Classical Archaeology, Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität München (Germany)

    Joseph B. Scholten, PhD, Associate Director, Office of International Programs/Affiliate Assoc. Prof. of Classics, University of Maryland, College Park (USA)

    Peter Scholz, Professor of Ancient History and Culture, University of Stuttgart (Germany)

    Christof Schuler, director, Commission for Ancient History and Epigraphy of the German Archaeological Institute, Munich (Germany)

    Paul D. Scotton, Assoociate Professor Classical Archaeology and Classics, California State University Long Beach (USA)

    Danuta Shanzer, Professor of Classics and Medieval Studies, The University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign and Fellow of the Medieval Academy of America (USA)

    James P. Sickinger, Associate Professor of Classics, Florida State University (USA)

    Athanasios Sideris, Ph.D., Head of the History and Archaeology Department, Foundation of the Hellenic World, Athens (Greece)

    G. M. Sifakis, Professor Emeritus of Classics, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki & New York University (Greece & USA)

    Christos Simelidis, British Academy Postdoctoral Fellow, Lincoln College, University of Oxford (UK)

    Henk W. Singor, Associate Professor of Ancient History Leiden University (Netherlands)

    Prof. Dr. Ulrich Sinn, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Wurzburg (Germany)

    Marilyn B. Skinner Professor of Classics, University of Arizona (USA)

    Niall W. Slater, Samuel Candler Dobbs Professor of Latin and Greek, Emory University (USA)

    Peter M. Smith, Associate Professor of Classics, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (USA)

    Dr. Philip J. Smith, Research Associate in Classical Studies, McGill University (Canada)

    Susan Kirkpatrick Smith Assistant Professor of Anthropology Kennesaw State University (USA)

    Antony Snodgrass, Professor Emeritus of Classical Archaeology, University of Cambridge (UK)

    Gina M. Soter, Lecturer IV, Classical Studies, The University of Michigan (USA)

    Slawomir Sprawski, Assistant Professor of Ancient History, Jagiellonian University, Krakow (Poland)

    Stylianos V. Spyridakis, Professor of Ancient History. University of California, Davis (USA)

    Theodosia Stefanidou-Tiveriou, Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Rachel Sternberg, Associate Professor of Classics, Case Western Reserve University (USA)

    Dr. Tom Stevenson, Lecturer in Classics and Ancient History, University of Queensland (Australia)

    Andrew Stewart, Nicholas C. Petris Professor of Greek Studies, University of California, Berkeley (USA)

    Oliver Stoll, Univ.-Prof. Dr., Alte Geschichte/ Ancient History, Universität Passau (Germany)

    Richard Stoneman, Honorary Fellow, University of Exeter (UK)

    Ronald Stroud, Klio Distinguished Professor of Classical Languages and Literature Emeritus, University of California, Berkeley (USA)

    Sarah Culpepper Stroup, Associate Professor of Classics, University of Washington (USA)

    Dr Panico J. Stylianou, Lecturer in Ancient History, Lady Margaret Hall, University of Oxford (UK)

    Thomas A. Suits, Emeritus Professor of Classical Languages, University of Connecticut (USA)

    Nancy Sultan, Professor and Director, Greek & Roman Studies, Illinois Wesleyan University (USA)

    Peter Michael Swan, Professor of History Emeritus, University of Saskatchewan (Canada)

    David W. Tandy, Professor of Classics, University of Tennessee (USA)

    James Tatum, Aaron Lawrence Professor of Classics, Dartmouth College (USA)

    Martha C. Taylor, Associate Professor of Classics, Loyola College in Maryland (USA)

    Petros Themelis, Professor Emeritus of Classical Archaeology, Athens (Greece)

    Eberhard Thomas, Priv.-Doz. Dr., Archäologisches Institut der Universität zu Köln (Germany)

    Michalis Tiverios, Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Michael K. Toumazou, Professor of Classics, Davidson College (USA)

    Stephen V. Tracy, Professor of Greek and Latin Emeritus, Ohio State University (USA)

    Prof. Dr. Erich Trapp, Austrian Academy of Sciences/Vienna resp. University of Bonn (Germany)

    Christopher Trinacty, Keiter Fellow in Classics, Amherst College (USA)

    Stephen M. Trzaskoma, Associate Professor of Classics, University of New Hampshire (USA)

    Vasiliki Tsamakda, Professor of Christian Archaeology and Byzantine History of Art, University of Mainz (Germany)

    Christopher Tuplin, Professor of Ancient History, University of Liverpool (UK)

    Yannis Tzifopoulos, Associate Professor of Ancient Greek and Epigraphy, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Gretchen Umholtz, Lecturer, Classics and Art History, University of Massachusetts, Boston (USA)

    Panos Valavanis, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of Athens (Greece)

    Eric R. Varner, Associate Professor, Departments of Classics and Art History, Emory University, Atlanta (USA)

    Athanassios Vergados, Visiting Assistant Professor of Classics, Franklin & Marshall College (USA)

    Frederik J. Vervaet, PhD, Lecturer in Ancient History. School of Historical Studies The University of Melbourne (Australia)

    Christina Vester, Assistant Professor of Classics, University of Waterloo (Canada)

    Dr. Zsolt Visy, Leiter Universität Pécs Lehrstuhl für Alte Geschichte und Archäologie, Archäologisches Seminar (Hungary)

    Emmanuel Voutiras, Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    Speros Vryonis, Jr., Alexander S. Onassis Professor (Emeritus) of Hellenic Civilization and Culture, New York University (USA)

    Michael B. Walbank, Professor Emeritus of Greek, Latin & Ancient History, The University of Calgary (Canada)

    Dr. Irma Wehgartner, Curator of the Martin von Wagner Museum der Universität Wurzburg (Germany)

    Bonna D. Wescoat, Associate Professor, Art History and Ancient Mediterranean Studies, Emory University (USA)

    E. Hector Williams, Professor of Classical Archaeology, University of British Columbia (Canada)

    Peter James Wilson FAHA, William Ritchie Professor of Classics, The University of Sydney (Australia)

    Roger J. A. Wilson, Professor of the Archaeology of the Roman Empire, and Director, Centre for the Study of Ancient Sicily, University of British Columbia, Vancouver (Canada)

    Engelbert Winter, Professor for Ancient History, University of Münster (Germany)

    Timothy F. Winters, Ph.D. Alumni Assn. Distinguished Professor of Classics Austin Peay State University (USA)

    Ioannis Xydopoulos, Assistant Professor in Ancient History, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    David C. Young, Professor of Classics Emeritus, University of Florida (USA)

    Maria Ypsilanti, Assistant Professor of Ancient Greek Literature, University of Cyprus (Cyprus)

    Katerina Zacharia, Associate Professor and Chair, Department of Classics & Archaeology, Loyola Marymount University (USA)

    Michael Zahrnt, Professor für Alte Geschichte, Universität zu Köln (Germany)

    Paul Zanker, Professor Emeritus of Classical Studies, University of Munich (Germany)

    Froma I. Zeitlin, Ewing Professor of Greek Language & Literature, Professor of Comparative Literature, Princeton University (USA)

    332 signatures as of June 22nd, 2009, that were sent with the update.

    The original letter sent on May 18th, 2009, had 200 signatures.

    For the growing list of scholars, please go to the Addenda.

    cc: J. Biden, Vice President, USA

    H. Clinton, Secretary of State USA

    P. Gordon, Asst. Secretary-designate, European and Eurasian Affairs

    H.L Berman, Chair, House Committee on Foreign Affairs

    I. Ros-Lehtinen, Ranking Member, House Committee on Foreign Affairs

    J. Kerry, Chair, Senate Committee on Foreign Relations

    R.G. Lugar, Ranking Member, Senate Committee on Foreign Relations

    R. Menendez, United States Senator from New Jersey.

    Addenda

    3 Scholars added on June 25th 2009:

    Jerker Blomqvist, Professor emeritus of Greek Language and literature, Lund University (Sweden)

    Christos Karakolis, Assistant Professor of New Testament, University of Athens (Greece)

    Chrys C. Caragounis, Professor emeritus of New Testament Exegesis and the development of the Greek language since ancient times, Lund University (Sweden)

    5 Scholars added on June 29th 2009:

    Harold D. Evjen, Professor Emeritus of Classical Studies, University of Colorado at Boulder (USA)

    Hara Tzavella-Evjen, Professor Emerita of Classical Archaeology, University of Colorado at Boulder (USA)

    Michael Paschalis, Professor of Classics, Department of Philology, University of Crete, Rethymnon (Greece)

    Vrasidas Karalis, Professor, New Testament Studies, The University of Sydney (Australia)

    Emilio Crespo, Professor of Greek Philology, Universidad Autónoma de Madrid (Spain)

    2 Scholars added on July 8th 2009:

    Dr. Zoi Kotitsa, Archaeologist, Scientific research fellow, University of Marburg (Germany)

    Dr. Ekaterini Tsalampouni, Assistant Lecturer in New Testament, Graeco-Roman antiquity and Koine Greek, Ludwig-Maximillian University of Munich (Germany)

    2 Scholars added on July 18th 2009:

    Karol Myśliwiec, Professor Dr., Director of the Research Centre for Mediterranean Archaeology, Polish Academy of Sciences, Warsaw (Poland)

    Stephen Neale, Distinguished Professor of Philosophy and Linguistics, John H. Kornblith Family Chair in the Philosophy of Science and Values, City University of New York (USA)

    1 Scholar added on July 20th 2009:

    Marsh McCall, Professor Emeritus, Department of Classics, Stanford University (USA)

    1 Scholar added on August 10th 2009:

    Georgia Tsouvala, Assistant Professor of History, Illinois State University (USA)

    1 Scholar added on September 3rd 2009:

    Mika Rissanen, PhL, Ancient History, University of Jyvaskyla (Finland)

    2 Scholars added on October 10th 2009:

    José Antonio Fernández Delgado. Professor of Greek Philology, Universidad de Salamanca (Spain)

    Zinon Papakonstantinou, Assistant Professor of Hellenic Studies, Henry M. Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle (USA)

    1 Scholar added on October 17th 2009:

    Eugene Afonasin, Professor of Greek Philosophy and of Roman Law, Novosibirsk State University (Russia)

    1 Scholar added on October 28th 2009:

    Hartmut Wolff, Professor für Alte Geschichte (emeritus), Universität Passau (Germany)

    1 Scholar added on October 30th 2009:

    Eleni Manakidou, Assistant Professor of Classical Archaeology, Aristoteles University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    1 Scholar added on November 3rd 2009:

    Pavlos Sfyroeras, Associate Professor of Classics, Middlebury College (USA)

    1 Scholar added on November 11th 2009:

    Konstantinos Kapparis, Associate Professor of Classics, Department of Classics, University of Florida (USA)

    1 Scholar added on November 14th 2009:

    Prof. Dr. Ingomar Weiler, Professor Emeritus, Ancient Greek and Roman History, Karl-Franzens-Universität of Graz (Austria)

    1 Scholar added on November 15th 2009:

    Werner Petermandl, Universitätslektor, Karl-Franzens-Universität of Graz (Austria)

    1 Scholar added on December 4th 2009:

    István Kertész, Professor of ancient Greco-Roman history, Department of Ancient and Medieval History, Pedagogic College in Eger (Hungary)

    1 Scholar added on March 11th 2010:

    Nassi Malagardis, chargée de Mission au Département des Antiquités Grecques, Etrusques et Romaines du Musée du Louvre, Paris (France)

    2 Scholars added on March 25th 2010:

    Gonda Van Steen, Professor, Department of Classics, University of Florida (USA)

    Robert Wagman, Associate Professor of Classics, Department of Classics, University of Florida (USA)

    2 Scholars added on March 27th 2010:

    Angelos Barmpotis, Ph.D., Director of the Digital Epigraphy and Archaeology Project, University of Florida (USA)

    Eleni Bozia, Ph.D. Visiting Lecturer, Department of Classics, University of Florida (USA)

    1 Scholar added on April 16th 2010:

    Timothy Johnson, Associate Professor, Department of Classics, University of Florida (USA)

    1 Scholar added on April 17th 2010:

    Christos C. Tsagalis, Associate Professor of Classics, Aristotle University of Thessaloniki (Greece)

    1 Scholar added on August 31st 2010:

    Potitsa Grigorakou, Lecturer in Hellenism in the Orient, Public University of Athens (Greece)

    2 Scholars added on September 3rd 2010:

    Maurice Sartre, Professor of Ancient History, emeritus. Université François-Rabelais, Tours (France)

    Apostolos Bousdroukis, Researcher, Institute for Greek and Roman Antiquity, National Hellenic Research Foundation (Greece)

    1 Scholar added on September 10th 2010:

    Alastar Jackson, Hon. Research Fellow in Ancient History, Manchester University (U.K.)

    1 Scholar added on October 5th 2010:

    Frances Van Keuren, Professor Emerita of Ancient Art History, University of Georgia (USA)

    1 Scholar added on December 4th 2010:

    Thomas Heine Nielsen, Associate Professor of Ancient Greek, University of Copenhagen (Denmark)

    1 Scholar added on April 18th 2011:

    Antonis Bartsiokas, Associate Professor of Anthropology, Department of History and Ethnology, University of Thrace (Greece)

    1 Scholar added on October 16th 2011:

    Thanasis Maskaleris, Emeritus Professor of Classics and Comparative Literature, San Francisco State University (USA)

    1 Scholar added on February 22nd 2013:

    Stephen Bertman, Professor Emeritus of Classics, The University of Windsor (Canada)

    1 Scholar added on October 12th 2013:

    Helen Karabatzaki, Associate Professor emeritus of Ancient Greek Philosophy, University of Ioannina (Greece)

    1 Scholar added on February 19th 2018:

    Sylvian Fachard, Professor of Classical Studies, American School of Classical Studies (Switzerland)

    1 Scholar added on February 23rd 2018:

    Charalampos Stamelos, Instructor in the History of Law, European University Cyprus (Greece)

    Page 2 of 2
    [email protected]

    June 22, 2009

    The Honorable Barack Obama
    President, United States of America
    White House
    1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
    Washington, DC 20500-0001

    Dear President Obama,

    On May 18 we sent a letter asking for your help in preserving the historical integrity of Alexander the Great. Since that time many more scholars of Graeco-Roman antiquity have joined the effort, motivated by a concern with the threat posed to the scientific basis of our profession by ephemeral political manipulation.

    The purpose of this letter is to update you with regard to the signatories of the original letter which now total 332 from 20 different countries (see below). The original letter appears at http://macedonia-evidence.org/obama-letter.html, together with the supporting documentation for that letter.

    We would also note that the FAQ entry on our web site has been expanded to include points not in our original letter (http://macedonia-evidence.org/faq-history.html). Further, much of the site is now translated into FYROM Slavic, Greek, and German. French and Italian are to be added soon.

    A point of clarification about our intentions is perhaps in order since they have been misinterpreted in some quarters. We do not ask that the United States withdraw its recognition of the “Republic of Macedonia”. We do ask that the weight of US diplomacy be used to stop the theft of history and historic figures, starting with Alexander the Great.

    With best wishes and the continued hope of your active support,

    ************************

    Click here to see the list of co-signers

    =================

    cc:

    J. Biden, Vice President, USA

    H. Clinton, Secretary of State USA

    P. Gordon, Asst. Secretary-designate, European and Eurasian Affairs

    H.L Berman, Chair, House Committee on Foreign Affairs

    I. Ros-Lehtinen, Ranking Member, House Committee on Foreign Affairs

    J. Kerry, Chair, Senate Committee on Foreign Relations

    R.G. Lugar, Ranking Member, Senate Committee on Foreign Relations

    R. Menendez, United States Senator from New Jersey

    B. Mikulski, United States Senator from Maryland

    J. Shaheen, United States Senator from New Hampsire

    O. Snowe, United States Senator from Maine

    S. Berkely, United States Representative, Nevada district 1

    G. Bilirakis, United States Representative, Florida district 9

    H.E. Brown, United States Representative, South Carolina district 1

    R. Carnahan, United States Representative, Missouri, district 3

    L. Diaz-Balart, United States Representative, Florida district 21

    R.D. Holt, United States Representative, New Jersey district 12

    J.L, Jackson, Jr., United States Representative, Illinois district 2

    P.J. Kennedy, United States Representative, Rhode Island district 1

    B. Lee, United States Representative, California district 9

    M.E. McMahon, United States Representative, New York district 13

    C.B. Maloney, United States Representative, New York district 14

    F. Pallone, Jr., United States Representative, New Jersey district 6

    D.M. Payne, United States Representative, New Jersey district 10

    T. Poe, United States Representative, Texas district 2

    J.P. Sarbanes, United States Representative, Maryland district 3

    A. Sires, United States Representative, New Jersey district 13

    Z.T. Space, United States Representative, Ohio district 18

    D. Titus, United States Representative, Nevada district 3

    N. Tsongas, United States Representative, Massachusetts district 5

    C. Van Hollen, United States Representative, Maryland district 8

    O. Rehn, European Commissioner for Enlargement

    K. Hedberg, Head of EU Enlargement Unit B2, FYROM

    M. Dawson, Deputy Head of EU Enlargement Unit B2, FYROM

    http://macedonia-evidence.org/obama-letter.html

    • Replies: @RT
  275. Corvinus says:
    @geokat62

    “Have to ask the residents?”

    Indeed. Refer to the link I provided. It’s up to them to decide how to proceed.

    “Like asking Londoners if they’re happy their once beautiful city has become the murder capital of the world?”

    Not quite.

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/18/world/london-us-cities-homicide-rates-comparison-intl-gbr/index.html

    https://metro.co.uk/2019/06/16/murder-graph-shows-london-killings-compare-us-cities-9971033/

    “It appears Paris has received 600,000 immigrants from Africa who are peeing and defecating in the streets…”

    How many exactly of those immigrants are engaging in that activity? Certainly, they do that. Then again, native French, who are notoriously selfish, also mightily contribute to wretchedness.

    https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/apr/12/why-cant-french-cities-clean-up-after-their-dogs-montpellier

    https://www.france24.com/en/20180913-paris-clean-dirty-hygiene-tourism-dogs-cigarette-butt-urine-anne-hidalgo

    Apparently, the most dirtiest city in Europe is Rome.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/tamarathiessen/2020/02/20/romantic-paris-is-not-the-most-dirty-capital-in-europe/?sh=4cb30e5134a8

    “No, I mean should the Zionist Project tear down its walls, declare an end to the ethno-state, and embrace mass immigration from the third world”

    OK, great. Push for that at your next Jew Derangement Syndrome meeting.

    “just as Jewish Supremacist Organisations have pushed Western countries to do.”

    That has been OUR, i.e. western/American, decision. That is who we are.

    • Replies: @geokat62
  276. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    “But as I say, many people, including Christians like yourself, welcome this transformation, which is nothing less than a global homogenization of races and behavior”.

    Religion trumps one’s skin suit.

    “However, as Ted Kaczynski explained quite clearly in his essay “Industrial Society and Its Future”, reducing what had been humans to the status of mere technicians, and finally, after the whole system begins to be run by AI, to an entirely useless biological appendage, is not a project that’s sustainable.”

    Assuming we as humans decidedly go that route.

    “It can’t end well, and it’s better that it all come crashing down sooner rather than later.”

    You talk a good game. Alas, if you were serious about this allegedly dire situation, you would have done something about it by now. So please spare us your concern trolling and virtue signalling. Put up or shut up.

    “For racists, the only important question now is whether that will happen before the white race is extinguished, or after.”

    The white race isn’t being genocided or extinguished. It’s really silly to think that way, but whatever floats your boat.

  277. geokat62 says:
    @Corvinus

    The jury is in, Corvy. Multiculti is a disaster. No amount of doublespeak can reverse that. All your efforts to put lipstick on that pig are in vain. Diversity Is A Strength was a Big Lie sold to us by Jewish Supremacists. Even normies can see with their own eyes what is transpiring in Londonistan, Paris, Malmö, etc, etc. It’s an unqualified train wreck. The vision of a multiracial kumbaya has turned out to be, like the workers paradise, another Tikkum olam snow job.

    That has been OUR, i.e. western/American, decision. That is who we are.

    Keep repeating that to yourself and you might believe it.

    It was JSOs that formulated the new mantra of “Never again!” This meant saying goodbye to “blood and soil” and hello to “multiculti.”

    Mess with peoples’ homelands, don’t expect them to be overjoyed.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  278. Corvinus says:
    @geokat62

    “The jury is in, Corvy. Multiculti is a disaster. No amount of doublespeak can reverse that.”

    Management appreciates your opinion.

    “Even normies can see with their own eyes…”

    You mean some normies are seeing what they want to see as shown by the Alt Right intelligentsia.

    “Mess with peoples’ homelands, don’t expect them to be overjoyed.”

    Played like a broken record. So, the orcs long ago have invaded the shire. What are YOU prepared to do about it other than harping on a blog? See, the time has come for YOU and your ilk to put words into action, otherwise it is merely the guys at their Saturday night bowling league yammering about their wives, but come Sunday morning, they do not do anything they promised to the fellas they would do.

    • Agree: geokat62
  279. I am not Obama (who probably also thinks that white men can’t jump) but I have noticed the above letter addressed to him. It sounded to me as the nuclear war was imminent or that ‘Putin was ante portas’. There is an unbelievable list of recipients (I am surprised that my name was not there) so as the list of senders from all corners of the globe. And what was the cause for such exhilaration?

    [MORE]

    A small population of the former YU Republic of Macedonia, created in 1945, as an artificial nation with an artificial language by communists as one of many measures to destroy the Serbian nation (so as in cases of Montenegro, Bosnia, Dalmatia, etc) claimed that Alexander the Great was one of them – Macedonian. It is preposterous that someone in the 21st century is claiming the ancient past from 2500 years ago and has nothing in between but this is not the point right here.

    But, it is surprising the ‘argumentation’ which was provided to support the case that Alexander the Great was a Greek. It was probably executed by someone, to put it mildly, who is not a top intellectual while all other people were just lending their names. There are some gems:
     Alexander was ‘thoroughly and indisputably’ Greek because his great-great-great grandfather, Alexander I, competed in the Olympic Games where participation was limited to Greeks.
     Herakles – the quintessential Greek hero
     Macedonian Greeks have been located for at least 2,500 years just where the modern Greek province of Macedonia is
     Philip was appointed to conduct the Pythian Games at Delphi (!!! by whom?)
     Alexander the Great’s father and his ancestors were thoroughly Greek
     The ancient Paionians may or may not have been Greek, but they certainly became Greekish
     Etc, etc…

    To make more convincing case the signatories could provide some of the following answers: are Greeks indigenous Balkan people or they came as colonists, when they came to Balkan and where they came from, what was their name at that time, which language they spoke, what’s happened with indigenous people, how city-polises controlled Macedonia without armies, fertile lands and any resources, who were the members of 500 years long Alexander’s dynasty and who were Greeks amongst them, what does it mean Macedonia in Greek, was it Alexander’s original name Lesandar and what does it mean in which language, which Greek tribes lived in Macedonia, who gave them the name ‘Greeks’ (is it a bit derogatory name), why Greeks fought in Persian army against Alexander, who built Delphi, why Demosthenes held Philippique against Phillip ‘non-Greek and barbarian’, why Greeks have chosen the name for their currency ‘drachma’ and not Alexander’s ‘dinar’ as some other did, why they organised celebration in Athens when Alexander was killed, why today’s Greece was just a part of Roman province Illyric and did not give any fighting unit nor any Roman Emperor (for e.g. Illyrians were Romans’ elite army, their iron fist and gave a couple dozens of Roman Emperors), etc, etc…

    We may revisit previous and ask new questions if Admin opens such thread.

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  280. I disagree with Edward Dutton’s views, but he has never engaged in Mikemikev’s sort of bad behaviour. I think he debated Adam Rutherford on video if I’m not mistaken.

    In contrast the insane troll Mikemikev / Michael Coombs is harassing Rutherford on Twitter on dozens of fake accounts, his most recent is pretending to be a female with a PhD named Sandra:

  281. @White Men Can't Jump

    – You´re the first Serbocentrist I encounter, so pray indulge my ignorance in part.
    (I´m familiar with the Illyrism of the turn of the last century, largely a thing of the Germanized Zagreb intelligentsia).

    In no particular order …

    – Lepenski Vir is interesting, especially the concrete
    (for the other commenters, this is not a joke). Similarities to archaic Polynesian are Charles Berlitz land.
    – What language was Sikhander Khan speaking? The Greeks regarded the Macedonians of their time as a kind of Appalachian hicks but definitely kin and not barbaroi (lit. “the blabbering”, those who do not speak Greek), tall and blond like themselves.
    – Greek was a lingua franca (as has been hypothesized for Latin) but well established (Minoan Linear A was already definitely Greek).
    – The Spartans claimed descent from Herakles.
    – Modern Macedonia (both Greek- and Yugoslav-) is, if anything, an organic
    part of Greater Bulgaria – but you knew that already.

    – Back in the day it was a fad for amateurs to take up mythological and etymological studies – little of that has stood the test of time e.g. there was a (dot) Indian delegation to the SS-Ahnenerbe who looked for Mount Meru (“around whom sun and moon walk in circles”, where the Aryans come from) on Svalbard.
    If only they had known what you know …

    So far you have postulated (correct me if I got this wrong):
    – There is a relic population of proto-Illyrian/Albanian goatfucker/really Serb/secret Masters of the Universe who, in partisan-friendly habitat, have outwitted the Anatolian farmers (= neolithic revolution), the Yamnaya/battleaxe people and the Doric Invasion (= classical Greece/Macedonia) and are secretly the true Europeans as well as the original Aryans ™ .
    – The Sardinian relic are usually regarded as proxy for Anatolian farmer (Ötzi), you say they are younger and independent; please elaborate.
    – [Evil scientist´s laughter, long and hard 😀 😀 😀 ]

    • Replies: @White Men Can't Jump
  282. Malla says:
    @Corvinus

    then assuredly it is able to work out for different races.

    No it will not.

    No, that’s human nature, not “whiteness”.

    There are differences in tendencies among races or even ethnic groups on average. This is something everybody in other countries, most of humanity understands. It is only Western leftists who are too weird to understand this.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  283. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    Populations in West Eurasia form a genetic continuum with Saharan Africa who form a genetic continuum with populations in sub-Saharan Africa etc.

    Blue, Green and Yellow colours are a continuum in wavelength. That does not mean Blue or Yellow does not exist.

  284. @White Men Can't Jump

    In what records contemporary to antiquity do you find the name Lesandar Karanovic for Alexander the Great?

    You remind me of Malakaay who used to come out with statements that Croats are the original Illyrians who were later conquered by Slavs (Serbs) invading the Balkans but other than repeating the same allegations over and over he offered little evidence. You too need to substantiate your claims with some reference to historical records. Yes it’s possible that some of our understanding of classical history could be wrong but whatever new claims are made require some firm evidence. For example, did the Serbs come from Sorbia or the Sorbs from Serbia? Or were perhaps the Serbs presents over wider territories that included both into which other peoples were later inserted, such as the Huns?

    If you want a separate thread on these questions then somebody needs to write a relevant article. Perhaps you could ask the new contributor to UR, Nicholas R. Jeelvy, a Macedonian nationalist, to write an article on why Macedonia isn’t Greece, why Alexander the Great isn’t a Greek, and by what rights do Slav Macedonians appropriate him as their national hero. It would generate an interesting discussion.

  285. geokat62 says:
    @Commentator Mike

    Perhaps you could ask the new contributor to UR, Nicholas R. Jeelvy, a Macedonian nationalist, to write an article on why Macedonia isn’t Greece, why Alexander the Great isn’t a Greek, and by what rights do Slav Macedonians appropriate him as their national hero. It would generate an interesting discussion.

    Great idea. And if the new contributor to UR, Nicholas R. Jeelvy, agrees to take on that challenge, let him be sure to present evidence that refutes the evidence cited in a letter to President Barack Obama by the 370 Scholars of Graeco-Roman antiquity from all around the World.

    • Agree: Commentator Mike
  286. RT says:
    @geokat62

    Shame on those scientists (predominantly Greeks, Shmiels, Shulers, Bidens, Clintons etc) to ask Obama to solve a historical dispute. Is Obama a specialist in ancient European history?
    While modern Macedonians are not descendants of ancient Macedonians (at least not linguistically and culturally), so Greeks are not descendants of ancient Macedonians (and only partially descendants of ancient Greeks). Although ancient Macedonians spread Hellenism, they also were not Greeks.

  287. Corvinus: “Religion trumps one’s skin suit.”

    Religion is a collective hallucination, and race is more than skin color.

    Corvinus: “Assuming we as humans decidedly go that route.”

    People who think it’s a question of choice haven’t understood the issue completely. Imagining that there is such a thing as “free will” is part of the religious delusion.

    Corvinus: “You talk a good game. Alas, if you were serious about this allegedly dire situation, you would have done something about it by now.”

    Ted Kaczynski tried to do something about it, and all it got him was three life terms in Supermax. To bring down the entire global system of technology is no small thing. It will require more than a few bombs made of smokeless powder and match heads. But if the white race is worthy of being saved, it will produce another hero who is equal to the task.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    , @Boismortier
  288. geokat62 says:
    @RT

    Shame on those scientists (predominantly Greeks, Shmiels, Shulers, Bidens, Clintons etc) to ask Obama to solve a historical dispute. Is Obama a specialist in ancient European history?

    Resolve a historical dispute?

    Those classicists were not appealing to Obama to resolve a historical dispute. They were urging the American President to restore US foreign policy to what it had been in the mid-40s, before making the transition to clown world:

    In December 1944, a cable from the State Department to the US Authorities, signed by the then US Secretary of State, Edward Stettinius, stated, among other things, that:

    “The Government of the United States takes the view that references to a ‘Macedonian Nation’, a ‘Macedonian Mother Homeland’ or a ‘Macedonian national conscience’ are unjustified demagoguery as they do not reflect any political reality. It detects in them the resurgence of a possible guise concealing underneath aggressive plans against Greece”.

    https://www.mfa.gr/en/the-question-of-the-name-of-the-republic-of-north/

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  289. @RT

    Good logical thinking.

    • Replies: @RT
  290. @geokat62

    Change of policy I guess as by the 1990s US et al needed to promote these petty nationalisms, real or fake, to break up Yugoslavia, USSR, Czechoslovakia, so that the newer globalist policies could be easier to spread in the new millennium into these by now smaller weakened nations and all else that comes along with it.

    • Agree: geokat62
  291. Corvinus says:
    @Malla

    “There are differences in tendencies among races or even ethnic groups on average”.

    Not to the point that they cannot get along with one another very well in the same area. It has been working out for the different races. You just simply don’t want to believe it.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
    , @Malla
  292. @Commentator Mike

    There are so many things and I am a bit afraid to occupy to much space especially in threads non-dedicated to the topic of falsified world history. I will note your remarks/questions and answer accordingly. The fact is that the world history is heavily falsified. I missed recent serial about falsifications in the 1st millennia, especially regarding the Roman Empire, but it seems that ‘ancient Greece’ was not touched at all. I think that the cornerstone of the falsified world history is alleged migration of Slavics (probably Serbs because the term Slavic did not exist than) to Balkan.

    Many national histories are abandoning this nonsense which disguise many important topics – Aryans origins and migration, ‘ancient’ Greek and Rome, so-called ‘Indo-European’ language/people, the beginning of Christianity, etc, etc. The Serbs I mentioned are ancient tribes which evolved from Vincha civilisation and spoke Serbian language. There are about 750 names used for the tribes which had in common that spoke Serbian language, had the same genetics, mythology, anthropology, etc. Over time, from them all other so-called Slavic and their languages evolved (Russian name was first mentioned in the 8th c.AC and others much later). Modern Serbian nation is a fraction of the ancient, Serbian speaking corpus (which occupied the most of Europe up to China, India and Japan) and which preserved the original name and historical vertical. Stay tuned.

    • Replies: @Commentator Mike
  293. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    “Religion is a collective hallucination, and race is more than skin color.”

    Not quite.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=u0cKuFfYnVw&feature=emb_title

    “People who think it’s a question of choice haven’t understood the issue completely”.

    Humans are rational creatures. We ponder and pontificate. Clearly, we make conscious choices every day based on our own interpretations of our surroundings.

    “Imagining that there is such a thing as “free will” is part of the religious delusion.”

    It is patently obvious that we as humans have the power of acting without the constraint of necessity or fate. You are trying to dispute the indisputable.

    “Ted Kaczynski tried to do something about it, and all it got him was three life terms in Supermax.”

    He and St. Brievik are heroes in the eyes of those who desire to remove by force the Orcs who have invaded the shire.

    “To bring down the entire global system of technology is no small thing”.

    You are in a small minority of people who feel that way. You could do something about it, so go ahead.

    “But if the white race is worthy of being saved”

    The white race is saved through our Lord.

    “it will produce another hero who is equal to the task.”

    Then be the hero. Talk is cheap.

    • Replies: @geokat62
  294. geokat62 says:
    @Corvinus

    The white race is saved through our Lord.

    … as in Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ?

    If so, which denomination, Corvy?

  295. @nokangaroos

    If it is easier for your mental pathway to box me as a ‘Serbocentrist’, let it be. You touched many things about which I think you have very shallow or no knowledge at all and they are not worth replying but here are a couple telegraphic remarks:

    • Illyrism – you don’t know much, I may write when comes in the focus
    • Lepenski Vir – what is interesting? The most of European people lived there during the Ice Age.
    • Greeks regarded Macedonians as kin not barbarians? – You are probably joking. ‘Tall and blond’? Who? Greeks? Are you watching NBA?
    • DO you know who Spartans were and if Heracles was a historical or mythical person?
    • Both Macedonias is an organic part of Greater Bulgaria! – This is enough to see that you don’t have much knowledge. Bulgarians 90% are ethnically Serbs, Bulgars were an Asiatic Turkic tribe which came initially to settle in Bessarabia (today’s Romania) with a permission of Serbian ruler. After about 100 years they crossed Danube and came to today’s Bulgaria where indigenous Serbs lived. There were tensions between them until Bulgars converted to Christianity. Their language disappeared much earlier, and they spoke Serbian which did not change until the 18th c.AC when was slightly changed to be perceived different from Serbian, etc, etc.

    I am very tolerant, you may have a sense of humour whatever you like, I can answer if you have a specific remark/question but will not react on any bs you throw at me and other unz readers.

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  296. @Corvinus

    An effective way to reduce ethnic conflict is large-scale intermarriage between ethnic groups — this is the conclusion of Tatu Vanhanen: “biological mixing of conflicting groups would provide the most effective way to reduce and ultimately remove ethnic conflicts.” (Ethnic Conflicts: Their Biological Roots in Ethnic Nepotism, 2012: 220) When describing some Latin American countries, Vanhanen notes, “Extensive racial mixing between whites, indigenous peoples and blacks seems to have blurred ethnic boundaries and decreased ethnic conflicts”.[47]:110 He also mentions that in the Dominican Republic, “Extensive racial mixing has restrained ethnic conflicts and supported ethnic peace in the country”,[47]:121 in Cuba, “Ethnic peace in Cuba can be traced to… the extensive racial mixing of the population”[47]:163 and in Panama, “racial mixing of the population may be a factor which dampens ethnic interest conflicts.”[47]:170. I do not though personally support this because I oppose human procreation — a more simple solution is to massively decline the world population size. During the Neolithic or Mesolithic (pre-civilisation) there were considerably less ethnic conflicts because of much smaller population sizes of different groups.

    • Replies: @Malla
  297. The following are the map and the list of almost 1000 towns and villages in today’s Greek Macedonia which Serbian-Macedonian names were changed to Greek names after the WW1. Also, at that time was almost 1 million Serbs in today’s Greece. Now, there are almost no Serbs there.

    • Replies: @White Men Can't Jump
  298. @White Men Can't Jump

    [Too much entirely off-topic Serbian nonsense.]

  299. RonaldB says:
    @geokat62

    So, with that type of obscure legalistic claim to Judaism, did LBJ even know he was Jewish. Als0, someone who accepts a religious doctrine directly contradictory to Judaism, such as acceptance of Christianity, cannot really be considered a Jew.

    But this begs the question. If you want to defend European culture and the European ethnic groups, you can’t keep switching back to claim anyone who follows a position different from yours comes from Jews. In your world, there are two positions: 1) the weak European at the beck and call of the conniving Jews; 2) the Jews and their remote descendants who always seem to grab power and who always know what they want with a laser focus.

    Let me make an observation. You guys had better start coming up with realistic ways to control your own destiny. My own suggestion: make the privilege of voting and political participation something rare and valuable, not to be given to groups who don’t share your goals. You can protect individual rights while denying the political rights of peoples who don’t share your identity. There’s the problem also of global interests. Global corporations do better when national borders are fuzzy. I personally don’t see any reason why US corporations should be allowed to own capital investments outside the US. If they want to be global, they can depend on the laws and property rights in, say, Abu Dubai. If they want to have the protection of US laws, they can be firmly bound to US, as opposed to globalist, prosperity.

  300. RT says:
    @White Men Can't Jump

    And Macedonians are certainly not Serbians. As someone already mentioned above, they are part of the Greater Bulgaria. Been there in the 90s, seen it.
    Take your dispute to the Croat Malakey, it would be interesting.
    To the Greeks – take your dispute to the Turks.

  301. @White Men Can't Jump

    All in good humor – I really don´t know what you´re aiming at 😀

    – You no doubt have recognized the borders of San Stefano 1878, coincident with the limits of the Bulgarian (not the Serbian) orthodox church and far more sensible than the later dispensations; are you going to claim everything between the Pyrenees and the Jenissej as Serbian? Since the ice age?
    (not that I´d be surprised) Good luck.
    – Lepenski Vir is not older than ~8ka.
    – Early Greek history may be debatable; but the language is older than Thera, and the racial stock was not the recent one. The xiphos and the round shield were foreign. Names like Xanthos (leader of the returning Heraklids) and Xanthippe 😀 were common. What is NBA?
    – I2 haplogroup shows classic retreat/relic behavior; living fossil, if you will.

  302. Malla says:
    @Oliver D. Smith

    An effective way to reduce ethnic conflict is large-scale intermarriage between ethnic groups — this is the conclusion of Tatu Vanhanen: “biological mixing of conflicting groups would provide the most effective way to reduce and ultimately remove ethnic conflicts.”

    It will not work. Humans conflicts are permanent. Unfortunately.
    India was formed by the mixing of various races, yet we had one of the most exploitative caste system in the world. In Islam, there has been mixing in between ethnic groups and races, yet wars between Islamic powers existed. New ethnic groups will still emerge and conflicts will always continue.

    And this mixing of ethnic groups can happen in the brown black world. White people (or yellows) mixing out will be a disaster. The whole world will turn to third world shithole. You could try your mix maxing with Jews, browns and Blacks to your heart’s content.

  303. Malla says:
    @Corvinus

    You just simply don’t want to believe it.

    On the other hand, it is you who do not want to believe it.
    Let me explain this to you.We in India stereotype, make fun and hate each other. South Indians hate and make fun of North Indians, Punjabis to this to Bengalis, Bengalis to Punjabi s, Marathis to Gujarati, Gujaratis likewise etc… A maze of inter Indian/Indian subcontinent level dislike with each other their ways and ethnic tendencies. When people from one part of India migrate to another part, the local native ethnics complain about their ways and tendencies and behaviour.
    But no Indian in his right mind would believe that a person from a foreign race like a black African, European or East Asian or Middle Easter have the same gap in between us as is much smaller the gap in between Indians. No Indian would accept large scale migration of foreigners from outside South Asia will work. And they are right, they speak with wisdom, something you lack. Most of the World, rightfully and wisely thinks that way.

  304. Corvinus: “It is patently obvious that we as humans have the power of acting without the constraint of necessity or fate. You are trying to dispute the indisputable.”

    All human action is causally determined, and reality itself is nothing but a combination of determinisms. By making such a lame objection, you are denying causality, fleeing into religious delusion.

    Corvinus: “You could do something about it, so go ahead. …be the hero. Talk is cheap.”

    Sure thing. Crashing the technological system is a tough job, but I think killing off about 99.9% or so of the world’s population could do the trick. Would you prefer I create and disseminate a virus with that lethality rate? Or would you rather I start a global thermonuclear war, maybe by using my haxxor skills to craft a trojan or worm that infiltrates missile launch computers? Or how about an omnivorous synthetic strain of bacteria that is capable of reducing Earth’s entire biosphere to dust in a matter of weeks?

    None of those should take me more than a couple of hours to knock out. Let me know which one you want, and I’ll let you know when it’s ready.

    • Replies: @Stonehands
    , @Corvinus
  305. @Malla

    No Indian would accept large scale migration of foreigners from outside South Asia will work.

    Yet you Malla are inviting all the world’s Jews to move to India. I must say it would be interesting, humorous too, to watch the Jews trying to climb to the top of Indian society and wrest control from the Hindu elites.

    • Replies: @Malla
  306. @White Men Can't Jump

    Undoubtedly there are some people in the Balkans today who are descended from the ancient Lepenski Vir/Vincha population, from Illyrians, Romans, and many others groups, to a greater or lesser extent, and mixed in with various newcomers. Some of what you write could be common sense but you need more than that to go on if you wish to persuade others, and then you drift into obscurantist claims without any proof.

    Yeah, I’ve come across that wildest of claims of the genocide of 1 million Serbs by Greeks early in the 20th Century, something that almost nobody has ever heard of nor accepts. How was it accomplished so that nobody, even most Serbs, neither noticed nor complained about it? Anyway let’s not derail this thread.

  307. Inter marriage is a way to centralize identity under white supremacist globalism.

    No one is surprised Wasps support it.

    https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04264a.htm

    The welfare of the social order, according to St. Augustine (City of God XV.16) and St. Thomas (Suppl. Q. liii, a. 3), demanded the widest possible extension of friendship and love among all humankind, to which desirable aim the intermarriage between inimical families and races, ruinous internecine warfare was diminished and greater peace and harmony secured among the newly-converted Christians

    This intermarriage led to the 5 centuries of racism & white supremacy we POC have faced.

    We say no to:
    the global sale and control of women (feminism)
    The rejection of ancestor worship (inter caste)
    Dilution of identity via liberalism (inter racial)
    No to the individualism giving whites a free pass

    White women with coloured men is anti-racist
    White men with women is racist.

    We must encourage one and extirpate the other||

    https://hbdchick.wordpress.com/2011/04/04/whatever-happened-to-european-tribes/

    Among the anthropologically defined 356 contemporary societies of Euro-Asia and Africa, there is a large and significant negative correlation between Christianization (for at least 500 years) and the absence of clans and lineages

    • Troll: mikemikev
  308. @Dr. Robert Morgan

    Crashing the technological system is a tough job, but I think killing off about 99.9% or so of the world’s population could do the trick. Would you prefer I create and disseminate a virus with that lethality rate? Or would you rather I start a global thermonuclear war, maybe by using my haxxor skills to craft a trojan or worm that infiltrates missile launch computers? Or how about an omnivorous synthetic strain of bacteria that is capable of reducing Earth’s entire biosphere to dust in a matter of weeks?

    None of those should take me more than a couple of hours to knock out…

    Megalomania is a mental illness. People with megalomania have delusional fantasies that they are more relevant or powerful than they truly are. They have inflated self-esteem and overestimate their powers and beliefs.

  309. An interesting paper would be “When did human subspecies go extinct?”.

    Human geographic variation obviously exists, but it is not racial. Modern paleoanthropology and genetics are among the disciplines that have shown that there is no taxonomy in the human species below the species level. They also show that the present poorly reflects the past. Neandertal morphology and genetics, and genetic evidence of other distinct groups, suggest far more population structure in the past. It is likely that for much of the Pleistocene the human species had races. But, whether or not races appeared in the past, they did not persist. With only some exceptions, much of the Pleistocene human variation did not survive the enormous population expansions and replacements of the latest Pleistocene and Holocene.

    – Wolpoff, 2013

    • Replies: @nokangaroos
  310. Oliver D. Smith: “An interesting paper would be “When did human subspecies go extinct?”.”

    If they did. It seems to me your argument here depends upon a certain definition of race and species that is not at all self-evident, and of dubious relevance to the human case. As a thought experiment at least, could you apply it to dogs and wolves? Dogs are commonly thought to be a race of wolves, Canis lupus domesticus, but sometimes are treated as a separate species altogether. I’ve read that the two are even more closely related genetically than human races, and yet nobody denies that there is a real, significant, non-socially-constructed difference between them.

    • Replies: @Oliver D. Smith
  311. @Oliver D. Smith

    Run-of-the-mill Boasist-Lysenkoist drivel.

    In SubSaharan Africa alone we can discern 2 species (Khoisan and everybody else) and 6 or so populations that merit the rank of subspecies (Bantu, Nilotes, Amhara s.l. (+/- Massai and Samburu), Sahel herders, Mbuti (Congo pygmies)) without getting red in the face.
    The Bantu overran Africa in historical time, so the diversity was probably greater.
    (This does not yet address the “ghost” populations)

    – The (((naysayers))) argue that Homo is so exalted he is no longer an object of biology or evolution – let´s see if they believe it
    IOW is Israel an Open Society ™ ?

    (“Biste meschugge?! Not in our own country!!”)

    So indeed they are saying it is pointless for the goyim to be special as they are cattle and only there to serve – besides it might give them dangerous ideas about the Secular Body of Yahweh.

    (-> Coudenhove-Kalergi)

    You may notice that the unifying principle in their edicts is they refuse to give a definition of that-which-does-not-exist.

  312. Corvinus says:
    @Malla

    “Let me explain this to you.We in India stereotype, make fun and hate each other.”

    All races and ethnic groups engage in this action.

    “But no Indian in his right mind would believe that a person from a foreign race like a black African, European or East Asian or Middle Easter have the same gap in between us as is much smaller the gap in between Indians.”

    Of course, there are Indians, and Europeans, and Americans, for that matter, who are of their right and sound mind that think differently.

    “Most of the World, rightfully and wisely thinks that way.”

    Not really.

    • Replies: @Malla
  313. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    “All human action is causally determined, and reality itself is nothing but a combination of determinisms.”

    What you are saying here actually supports free will–the ability to choose between different possible courses of action unimpeded.

    “Sure thing. Crashing the technological system is a tough job, but I think killing off about 99.9% or so of the world’s population could do the trick.”

    The problem here is you thinking in the macro, rather than in the micro. They say knocking down that first domino is a tough slog, but with your alleged moxie for mayhem, and supposedly high IQ to boot, that shouldn’t be a problem. Start local. Your people are depending upon you. Don’t let them down.

  314. @Dr. Robert Morgan

    Would maybe the hero’s emergence be help by the deification of Jacques Ellul?

  315. @Dr. Robert Morgan

    There’s a strong and weak definition of subspecies/race. The strong definition is a geographical isolate (parapatric/allopatric population) and incipient species i.e. a geographically isolated population that given enough time will become reproductively isolated. The weak definition in contrast is a genetically or morphologically distinguishable population. Yes no doubt under the latter definition races exist, however it’s a lumper vs splitter issue what populations count as races [I disagree with lumping local groups into continental populations, so I would be a splitter not a lumper].

    I was using the strong definition for when races went extinct since there are no parapatric/allopatric population today (unless one considers a few remote tribes).

    To avoid confusion, some scientists restrict the strong definition to only subspecies, while use the word race for the weak definition. However this causes confusion since Mayr’s writings in the 1950s or 1960s ‘geographical race’ has been widely considered synonymous with subspecies.

  316. Corvinus: “What you are saying here actually supports free will–the ability to choose between different possible courses of action unimpeded.”

    Sounds like you’re trying here to stake out the position known as “compatibilism”. It’s pure sophistry. Man is only another animal on planet Earth; nothing special about him. If that’s your definition of free will, then any animal possesses it.

    But all are constrained by causality.

    Corvinus: “Start local.”

    LOL. Who says I haven’t?

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  317. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    “Sounds like you’re trying here to stake out the position known as “compatibilism”.”

    That is a strawman on your part.

    “Man is only another animal on planet Earth; nothing special about him. If that’s your definition of free will, then any animal possesses it.”

    I have been offering a nuanced definition. Try paying closer attention. Again, humans are rational creatures. We ponder and pontificate. Clearly, we make conscious choices every day based on our own interpretations of our surroundings. Through our ability to reason and process information in a patently skillful manner, we have the ability to choose between different possible courses of action unimpeded.

    “LOL. Who says I haven’t?”

    If that be the case, you would have showed us your progress. You talk a good game, but you just do not have it in you to do what needs to be done.

  318. Oliver D. Smith: “Yes no doubt under the latter definition races exist, however it’s a lumper vs splitter issue what populations count as races … ”

    I agree. But that makes the existence of race and racism just a matter of taste. I think in considering which definition to adopt, we should consider why taxonomies are set up in the first place. Isn’t it because they make useful distinctions? Certainly if you expect wolves to be as trainable as dogs, you’re going to be disappointed, and dangerously so. Likewise, I’d say, with negroes and whites.

  319. Corvinus: “That is a strawman on your part.”

    No, it’s not. Looks like you’re not familiar with the terminology used in discussions of free will.

    Corvinus: “… we have the ability to choose between different possible courses of action unimpeded.”

    That’s compatibilism! It’s sophistry, for the reason I explained.

    Corvinus: “If that be the case, you would have showed us your progress.”

    LOL. I don’t think so. Why would I do that?

    Corvinus: “You talk a good game, but you just do not have it in you to do what needs to be done. ”

    John the Baptist didn’t need to BE Jesus. He only announced his coming.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
  320. Malla says:
    @Corvinus

    Of course, there are Indians, and Europeans, and Americans, for that matter, who are of their right and sound mind that think differently.

    Think differently sure but not of right and sound mind. They lack wisdom.

    “Most of the World, rightfully and wisely thinks that way.”
    Not really.

    You do not understand most of humanity.

    • Disagree: Corvinus
  321. Malla says:
    @Commentator Mike

    Jews are the only foreigners who will be accepted by the Hinjews (Hindus) and Jewns (Jains). India can potentially solve the whole Jewish problem in the West/ White World as well as maybe the Middle East. Hinjews have repeatedly chest thumped how they have never been anti-Jewish (popularly called anti-Semitic), now is the time to walk the walk after talking the talk. LOL.

  322. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    I hadn’t brought into the conversation specifically the role of determinism along with free will. In other words, I would have expressly done so. You clearly disagree regarding my position, and this has debate has been raging on between philosophers for centuries regarding whether we have control over our actions, and if so, what sort of control, and to what extent. I’m not going to convince you otherwise–your mind is made up.

    So, moving on, you would show your progress if you were absolutely dedicated to the cause you promote–the saving of the white race. Better admit that you are not as into it as you claim, rather than virtue signal everyone to death.

    • Replies: @Jatt Aryaa
  323. Corvinus: “… you would show your progress if you were absolutely dedicated to the cause you promote–the saving of the white race.”

    My comments are not hortatory; not a call to action. I’m not promoting anything, merely making observations about the means by which that goal — the saving of the white race as it presently exists — might be attained. Whether anyone wants to save it enough to pay the price, which is living in a world with much simpler, more primitive technology, is another question entirely. My view is that a technological regression is something that people would never agree to do voluntarily, so if it’s to happen, it will have to be because either the global technological system crashes on its own through accident, or it is brought down by the direct action of some individual or small cell. If it turns out that most who claim that saving the white race is what they want are hypocrites, that’s just the way it goes. It certainly doesn’t surprise me, nor does it alarm me. I only show the doorway. Whether anyone walks through it or not is up to them.

    • Replies: @Corvinus
    , @Stonehands
  324. @Corvinus

    All I read from your comments is the same ideas of white supremacist assimilation that Kendi describes as one half of the dueling consciousness – the other being segregation.

    Both rely on the assumption that Whites and Westerners are the most advanced group and must lead others on the right path.

    Jews are included in the above, hence, quite seriously you’re a white supremacist and need to challenge your bigotry.

    “Stopping our racist patterns of behavior must be more important than convincing others we don’t have them” – Robin DiAngelo

    • LOL: Corvinus
  325. Corvinus says:
    @Dr. Robert Morgan

    Of course your statements are meant to testify to your eagerness to counsel others and demand justice prevail. Do not insult your cause. Otherwise, what you write ends up being terminal prolixity.

    The bottom line is that (white) people have chosen to live the life they chose, whether or not it employs technology on a limited or grandiose scale. So unless you are leading the charge and making the ultimate sacrifice to serve as a springboard to a domino effect to stop us from destroying ourselves by way of physical actions, your observations are worthless in this age where everything allegedly is falling apart at the seams.

  326. @Dr. Robert Morgan

    “My comments are not hortatory;… I only show the doorway. Whether anyone walks through it or not is up to them…”

    Free advice. LOL. Yeah, that’s a rarity on the internet. How revolutionary!

  327. Corvinus: “Of course your statements are meant to testify to your eagerness to counsel others and demand justice prevail.”

    So you imagine. But, as I say, my remarks aren’t a call to action, still less a call for “justice”, whatever that’s supposed to mean.

    Corvinus: “So unless you are leading the charge and making the ultimate sacrifice to serve as a springboard to a domino effect to stop us from destroying ourselves by way of physical actions, your observations are worthless in this age where everything allegedly is falling apart at the seams. ”

    Whether the observation that the ongoing development of technological civilization will inevitably result in the extinction of the white race is true or false will be shown only by the course of events. If the white race at this point consists only of Christians and their cultural equivalents who welcome their demise with open arms, then I say let them get their wish and die. Otoh, if a hero emerges who employs technology to destroy the technological system, then the white race will probably continue, so long as his method leaves enough left alive to do so. In my judgement, the advent of such a hero is possible, but not the way to bet. More likely is that the collapse, when it comes, will happen by accident. Making this observation doesn’t imply that I have to get involved in any way. Strange you would think so!

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