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Searching up “coronavirus cases by country” returned these three suggested news stories ahead of the links retrieved in response to the actual query:

The neo-liberal establishment isn’t held together by scapegoating and subverting white conservatives. That’s a conspiracy theory. What are you, some kind of bigoted extremist?

Remember two weeks ago when it was racist to point out that it seemed like Asians might be getting hit harder by coronavirus than non-Asians? Well, now it’s racist not to point out that blacks and Hispanics seem to be getting hit harder than others by coronavirus.

Sure, the data are incomplete, imprecise, and unstandardized, so this is all conjecture at this point, but that’s a feature rather than a bug. It provides more room to maneuver The Narrative.

 
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  1. I see that the 3 “news” items are from Yahoo, NPR, and NBC. It’s the kind of thing I would have expected for the last 10 years at least. They have an agenda. Any pay-TV subscribers (left) are supporting that agenda. I won’t click on a one of these sites’ links, and I only have to view the Yahoo home page for 1/2 a second after I log out of email.

    I’m curious if this search was on Google, Bing, DuckDuckGo, or some other, A.E.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    DDG, actually.
  2. @Achmed E. Newman
    I see that the 3 "news" items are from Yahoo, NPR, and NBC. It's the kind of thing I would have expected for the last 10 years at least. They have an agenda. Any pay-TV subscribers (left) are supporting that agenda. I won't click on a one of these sites' links, and I only have to view the Yahoo home page for 1/2 a second after I log out of email.

    I'm curious if this search was on Google, Bing, DuckDuckGo, or some other, A.E.

    DDG, actually.

  3. Remember two weeks ago when it was racist to point out that it seemed like Asians might be getting hit harder by coronavirus than non-Asians?

    No, it was premature and unscientific.

    As I noted in a comment at iSteve:

    Some preliminary numbers by race/ethnicity: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/04/07/coronavirus-is-infecting-killing-black-americans-an-alarmingly-high-rate-post-analysis-shows/

    County majority Counties Cases per 100k Deaths per 100k

    Asian 6 19.5 0.4
    Black 131 137.5 6.3
    Hispanic 124 27.2 0.6
    White 2,879 39.8 1.1

    Obviously this is not the actual numbers for each group, but those for majority x group counties and the numbers are highly preliminary, but it follows the well-established mortality pattern of Asian-Hispanic-white-black in the U.S.

    This data is still preliminary (and subject to the caveat), but less so than earlier speculations.

    • Replies: @UK
    It was not premature nor unscientific to say that something seemed a certain way. To simply state one's fallible perception may be both honest and true even while the perception may not end up matching the underlying reality.

    For example, you seem very touchy about this. Why?
    , @Audacious Epigone
    "seemed like it might be" is merely suggestive. You're honest and inquisitive, so wanted to wait for more and better data. That wasn't why the corporate media was concerned. The establishment was concerned because it seemed to imply a potential biological/genetic explanation. With possible black (and possibly Hispanic) overrepresentation, the insinuation is not that it is biological/genetic but that it's a consequence of poverty, discrimination, etc.
  4. I find that middle headline really odd. How would the closest analogue have read in the 1920s? I’m guessing “New York Hardest Hit” – presuming, of course, that NYC was actually hit hard in relative terms.

    But “Latinx Residents” evokes transmania and open borders. “Deaths” blends the somber with the ridiculous, which makes it doubly strange. I’d almost say that it is an historic headline, but it is missing a special image, like battleship row smoking.

  5. Remember two weeks ago when it was racist to point out that it seemed like Asians might be getting hit harder by coronavirus than non-Asians? Well, now it’s racist not to point out that blacks and Hispanics seem to be getting hit harder than others by coronavirus.

    lt would so appear, but while it is racist not to notice a disparate impact, it is racist to ponder reasons why, such as obesity (preventable through self management), diabetes, (manageable through diet and exercise), hypertension (manageable once black embrace yoga) and social distancing (but that’s a white thing).

    It is also racist to notice the high percentages of blacks who work in nursing homes yet do not wash their hands.

    • Replies: @Twinkie
    Interestingly enough, Hispanics in the U.S. are lower income (and presumably worse access to healthcare) than whites and are more obese (close to black level), but enjoy a higher life expectancy and the preliminary data I posted above show lower rates of Covid-19 infection and lower mortality than whites.

    Very rarely is this brought up when discussing health outcomes and race in the country - it’s always white racism and black suffering. Few ever mention that Asians and Hispanics live longer than whites.
  6. @James Speaks

    Remember two weeks ago when it was racist to point out that it seemed like Asians might be getting hit harder by coronavirus than non-Asians? Well, now it’s racist not to point out that blacks and Hispanics seem to be getting hit harder than others by coronavirus.
     
    lt would so appear, but while it is racist not to notice a disparate impact, it is racist to ponder reasons why, such as obesity (preventable through self management), diabetes, (manageable through diet and exercise), hypertension (manageable once black embrace yoga) and social distancing (but that's a white thing).

    It is also racist to notice the high percentages of blacks who work in nursing homes yet do not wash their hands.

    Interestingly enough, Hispanics in the U.S. are lower income (and presumably worse access to healthcare) than whites and are more obese (close to black level), but enjoy a higher life expectancy and the preliminary data I posted above show lower rates of Covid-19 infection and lower mortality than whites.

    Very rarely is this brought up when discussing health outcomes and race in the country – it’s always white racism and black suffering. Few ever mention that Asians and Hispanics live longer than whites.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    Less social atomization does wonders.
    , @Mark G.
    Many Hispanics haven't adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven't been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state. These are all things that may increase life expectancy and make them less susceptible to the disease. This may counteract their obesity and lower income levels.

    The disease appears to have been initially spread by upper income individuals who can afford international air travel. Hispanics don't fall into that group and may not come into much contact with that group. Hispanics have developed their own set of parallel businesses. They have their own grocery stores, restaurants and other businesses that only they go to. The Hispanic factory, construction or agricultural worker may spend all day around other Hispanics and then spend their after work hours around other Hispanics so they may come into less contact with disease carrying whites.
  7. t says:

    I think the racial data is something that should be investigated on key factor is that while Hispanics are hardest hit in New York they have the lowest rates in Chicago and Los Angeles one difference is the nationality of Hispanics in the three cities:

    New York

    Puerto Rican 29%
    Dominican 28%
    South American 16%
    Mexican 14%
    Central American 7%
    Cuban 2%

    Chicago

    Mexican 75%
    Puerto Rican 13%
    South American 5%
    Central American 4%

    Los Angeles County

    Mexican 76%
    Central American 16%
    South American 3%

    The clear take away is that hispanics in New York are much more likely than those in Chicago or Los Angeles to have African ancestry, are Africans more prone to severe cases for some reason beside lifestyle?

    However the hardest hit Hispanic areas in New York are in Queens where the population is much more Mestizo, here’s the breakdown for ZIP code . Another difference is that in New York Hispanics take the subway while in Chicago and Los Angeles most drive. Establishment liberals have been pushing for Mass Transit is that why people are dying?

    • Replies: @t
    Sorry about that the hispanic ancestry from ZIP code from zip code 11369 in Queens the hardest hit in New York excluding the one contains Riker's Island:

    South American 49%
    Dominican 21%
    Mexican 16%
    Central American 6%
    Other Hispanic 5%
    Puerto Rican 5%

    One other thing to keep in mind is that the virus is hitting middle class black areas harder than ghettos, Zip code 11233 has a median income of 35K and and 5.4 cases per thousand residents while ZIP code 11411 has a median income of 82K and 14.9 cases per thousand resident both zip are overwhelmingly black.
  8. t says:
    @t
    I think the racial data is something that should be investigated on key factor is that while Hispanics are hardest hit in New York they have the lowest rates in Chicago and Los Angeles one difference is the nationality of Hispanics in the three cities:

    New York

    Puerto Rican 29%
    Dominican 28%
    South American 16%
    Mexican 14%
    Central American 7%
    Cuban 2%

    Chicago

    Mexican 75%
    Puerto Rican 13%
    South American 5%
    Central American 4%

    Los Angeles County

    Mexican 76%
    Central American 16%
    South American 3%

    The clear take away is that hispanics in New York are much more likely than those in Chicago or Los Angeles to have African ancestry, are Africans more prone to severe cases for some reason beside lifestyle?

    However the hardest hit Hispanic areas in New York are in Queens where the population is much more Mestizo, here's the breakdown for ZIP code . Another difference is that in New York Hispanics take the subway while in Chicago and Los Angeles most drive. Establishment liberals have been pushing for Mass Transit is that why people are dying?

    Sorry about that the hispanic ancestry from ZIP code from zip code 11369 in Queens the hardest hit in New York excluding the one contains Riker’s Island:

    South American 49%
    Dominican 21%
    Mexican 16%
    Central American 6%
    Other Hispanic 5%
    Puerto Rican 5%

    One other thing to keep in mind is that the virus is hitting middle class black areas harder than ghettos, Zip code 11233 has a median income of 35K and and 5.4 cases per thousand residents while ZIP code 11411 has a median income of 82K and 14.9 cases per thousand resident both zip are overwhelmingly black.

    • Thanks: Audacious Epigone
  9. @Twinkie
    Interestingly enough, Hispanics in the U.S. are lower income (and presumably worse access to healthcare) than whites and are more obese (close to black level), but enjoy a higher life expectancy and the preliminary data I posted above show lower rates of Covid-19 infection and lower mortality than whites.

    Very rarely is this brought up when discussing health outcomes and race in the country - it’s always white racism and black suffering. Few ever mention that Asians and Hispanics live longer than whites.

    Less social atomization does wonders.

    • Replies: @Twinkie
    There is also some genetic variables at work though the research into this is still largely speculative.
  10. Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.

    • Replies: @A123

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic,
     
    Yes. You need at least 7 groups to properly breakdown the analysis.

    Anti-Castro Cuban ancestry and Mexican ancestry are very different.

    PEACE 😷
    , @res

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?
     
    Much more so. At least as far as conclusions about biological groups go. Despite their differences (and I'm not sure about "South Asians" aka subcontinentals here since terminology is not always consistent) Asians are relatively uniform (unmixed) in the US compared to whites, even more so blacks, and especially Hispanics.

    This paper contains a genetic PCA plot for the four groups. Figure 2 caption in the blockquote.
    Harmonizing Genetic Ancestry and Self-identified Race/Ethnicity in Genome-wide Association Studies (Fang et al. 2019)
    https://www.cell.com/ajhg/fulltext/S0002-9297(19)30338-6

    https://marlin-prod.literatumonline.com/cms/attachment/503f98d3-a0ab-4ca4-8c16-04fde7107e08/gr2.jpg

    Colored points represent individuals whose HARE agrees with SIRE. Black points highlight individuals whose genetically inferred ancestry strongly disagrees with SIRE; subsequently HARE for these individuals is set to missing. All other MVP participants are denoted in gray. The gold triangle indicates a hypothetical individual whose HARE could be non-Hispanic European, Hispanic, or missing, depending on her SIRE. Shown are non-Hispanic white (A), non-Hispanic black (B), Hispanic (C), and non-Hispanic Asian (D).
     
    Acronyms:
    MVP - Million Veteran Program
    SIRE - Self-identified Race/Ethnicity (see paper title)
    HARE - harmonized ancestry and race/ethnicity (a variable derived from SIRE and GIA which the authors use for stratifying their analysis)
    GIA - genetically indicated ancestry (from first 30 PCs)

    Although there appear to be many black (inconsistent) dots, it is worth noting that there are 200k subjects and only 0.5% of them are black dots. From the paper text.

    Among nearly 202,000 individuals with SIRE, 1,079 (0.53%) had GIA strongly indicating a different racial/ethnic group. These individuals are highlighted in Figure 2 (black points) and appear as genetic outliers compared to others with the same SIRE (colored points).
     
    "Hispanic" is a nearly useless category as far as genetic analysis goes.

    P.S. This paper was discussed in iSteve (in the context of SIRE actually being a pretty good identifier despite the FUD thrown about by the "race does not exist" crew):
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/only-0-5-of-racial-self-identifications-are-completely-wrong-genetically
    , @songbird
    Well, I'd say it is complicated. A lot of Hispanics want to promulgate the useful myth that they are la Raza.
    , @dfordoom

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?
     
    It's more problematic since the entire concept of Hispanic is pretty much nonsense.

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.
     
    A huge problem and an insoluble one.

    A good rule of thumb is that if you're trying to attach a label to a group of people and you can't even come close to coherently defining the meaning of the label then the label is entirely meaningless and useless.
  11. @iffen
    Isn't lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic,

    Yes. You need at least 7 groups to properly breakdown the analysis.

    Anti-Castro Cuban ancestry and Mexican ancestry are very different.

    PEACE 😷

  12. @Twinkie
    Interestingly enough, Hispanics in the U.S. are lower income (and presumably worse access to healthcare) than whites and are more obese (close to black level), but enjoy a higher life expectancy and the preliminary data I posted above show lower rates of Covid-19 infection and lower mortality than whites.

    Very rarely is this brought up when discussing health outcomes and race in the country - it’s always white racism and black suffering. Few ever mention that Asians and Hispanics live longer than whites.

    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state. These are all things that may increase life expectancy and make them less susceptible to the disease. This may counteract their obesity and lower income levels.

    The disease appears to have been initially spread by upper income individuals who can afford international air travel. Hispanics don’t fall into that group and may not come into much contact with that group. Hispanics have developed their own set of parallel businesses. They have their own grocery stores, restaurants and other businesses that only they go to. The Hispanic factory, construction or agricultural worker may spend all day around other Hispanics and then spend their after work hours around other Hispanics so they may come into less contact with disease carrying whites.

    • Replies: @anon
    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state.

    What facts do you base that opinion on? Do you know how many Mexicans in Mexico are now diabetic, for example? What's the rate of Type II diabetes among Mexican-Americans in California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas? Do you know what most Puerto Ricans in New York / New Jersey do for a job? What is the marriage rate among Central Americans in the US? What's the divorce rate among 2nd and 3rd generation Mexican Americans?

    How much meso-American genetics are found in Mexicans vs. Cubans vs. Puerto Ricans vs. people from the Dominican Republic? Does that make a difference in your opinion in terms of health factors?

    You don't really know much about "Hispanics", beyond a few media cliches. Suggest you learn more.
    , @Twinkie

    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet
     
    This is untrue. Hispanics are nearly as obese as blacks in America, precisely because they consume fast food heavily. There is a rather dramatic difference in diet among Mexicans depending on what side of the U.S.-Mexican border they reside.

    work in jobs that require more physical exertion
     
    That doesn’t seem to help blacks and poor whites in similar jobs. In fact, menial jobs in agriculture and construction have higher rates of accidents and are usually associated with worse health outcomes (this has a long history - pastoralists generally had better fitness and health than agriculturalists in ancient and pre-historical times). Backbreaking work is unhealthy.

    have close knit families and lots of social connections
     
    This is likely true. Hispanics have higher marriage rates than whites and blacks.

    haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state.
     
    A majority of Hispanics are American-born and their entitlement usage rates are higher than those of whites and Asians (though lower than those of blacks).
  13. AE, did you hear the story of Biden yapping with Kamala about how they could work together to do fundamental transformation using this crisis? You may be right after all, Kamala is going to be the next Democratic president, the day after inauguration when Biden disappears.

    I remember reading a article about her in which she talks about her desire to get in positions of power to do fundamental change, it’s time to start game planning her as having ultimate power.

  14. res says:
    @iffen
    Isn't lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    Much more so. At least as far as conclusions about biological groups go. Despite their differences (and I’m not sure about “South Asians” aka subcontinentals here since terminology is not always consistent) Asians are relatively uniform (unmixed) in the US compared to whites, even more so blacks, and especially Hispanics.

    This paper contains a genetic PCA plot for the four groups. Figure 2 caption in the blockquote.
    Harmonizing Genetic Ancestry and Self-identified Race/Ethnicity in Genome-wide Association Studies (Fang et al. 2019)
    https://www.cell.com/ajhg/fulltext/S0002-9297(19)30338-6

    Colored points represent individuals whose HARE agrees with SIRE. Black points highlight individuals whose genetically inferred ancestry strongly disagrees with SIRE; subsequently HARE for these individuals is set to missing. All other MVP participants are denoted in gray. The gold triangle indicates a hypothetical individual whose HARE could be non-Hispanic European, Hispanic, or missing, depending on her SIRE. Shown are non-Hispanic white (A), non-Hispanic black (B), Hispanic (C), and non-Hispanic Asian (D).

    Acronyms:
    MVP – Million Veteran Program
    SIRE – Self-identified Race/Ethnicity (see paper title)
    HARE – harmonized ancestry and race/ethnicity (a variable derived from SIRE and GIA which the authors use for stratifying their analysis)
    GIA – genetically indicated ancestry (from first 30 PCs)

    Although there appear to be many black (inconsistent) dots, it is worth noting that there are 200k subjects and only 0.5% of them are black dots. From the paper text.

    Among nearly 202,000 individuals with SIRE, 1,079 (0.53%) had GIA strongly indicating a different racial/ethnic group. These individuals are highlighted in Figure 2 (black points) and appear as genetic outliers compared to others with the same SIRE (colored points).

    “Hispanic” is a nearly useless category as far as genetic analysis goes.

    P.S. This paper was discussed in iSteve (in the context of SIRE actually being a pretty good identifier despite the FUD thrown about by the “race does not exist” crew):
    https://www.unz.com/isteve/only-0-5-of-racial-self-identifications-are-completely-wrong-genetically

    • Thanks: Audacious Epigone
  15. Obviously no opportunity to rev the ‘blacks hit hardest’ machinery into gear can be missed – yesterday I saw the lady who created the 1619 Project had started tweeting about this. Commenters of any race that noted that blacks have higher prevalence of pre-existing conditions that seem more closely related to the odds of getting Covid-19 than any group were waved away. The only possible explanation for this group having a huge share of its population with lifestyle-related health problems is structural racism and exclusion.

    • Replies: @anon
    Commenters of any race that noted that blacks have higher prevalence of pre-existing conditions that seem more closely related to the odds of getting Covid-19 than any group were waved away. The only possible explanation for this group having a huge share of its population with lifestyle-related health problems is structural racism and exclusion.

    Not sure about the odds of actually getting it. As far as anyone can tell, 80% of those who contract COVID-19 have mild to almost no symptoms. Of the 20% who have more serious symptoms not all wind up in ICU.

    However, there is a pretty solid list of comorbidities that make it more likely an individual will have bad outcomes including death. Diabetes, high blood pressure[1], asthma, heart disease are all on the list, and black Americans have higher rates of all of those things. Of course bad health outcomes among black people must be blamed on wypipo because reasons. We cannot discuss genetic differences / tendencies, nor can we hold people responsible for their decades of sugar-saturated big gulps and crap diet. That would be rayciss.

    [1] The Chinese noted this and both the Italians and Spanish have confirmed, however there's some evidence that the ACE-2 drugs often used to control high blood pressure (hypertension) are significant contributors, maybe the major factor, because of the virus using that ACE-2 receptor as the entry point to cells.
  16. @iffen
    Isn't lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.

    Well, I’d say it is complicated. A lot of Hispanics want to promulgate the useful myth that they are la Raza.

  17. I guess that one should predict that a concept defined by invisible forces would be invoked when the invisible (or microscopic) forces of disease are at play

    Harpending was right about racism: it is directly comparable to its uncivilized ancestor, the superstition of voodoo or hexes.

  18. @Twinkie

    Remember two weeks ago when it was racist to point out that it seemed like Asians might be getting hit harder by coronavirus than non-Asians?
     
    No, it was premature and unscientific.

    As I noted in a comment at iSteve:

    Some preliminary numbers by race/ethnicity: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/04/07/coronavirus-is-infecting-killing-black-americans-an-alarmingly-high-rate-post-analysis-shows/

    County majority Counties Cases per 100k Deaths per 100k

    Asian 6 19.5 0.4
    Black 131 137.5 6.3
    Hispanic 124 27.2 0.6
    White 2,879 39.8 1.1
     
    Obviously this is not the actual numbers for each group, but those for majority x group counties and the numbers are highly preliminary, but it follows the well-established mortality pattern of Asian-Hispanic-white-black in the U.S.
     
    This data is still preliminary (and subject to the caveat), but less so than earlier speculations.

    It was not premature nor unscientific to say that something seemed a certain way. To simply state one’s fallible perception may be both honest and true even while the perception may not end up matching the underlying reality.

    For example, you seem very touchy about this. Why?

  19. anon[318] • Disclaimer says:
    @Mark G.
    Many Hispanics haven't adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven't been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state. These are all things that may increase life expectancy and make them less susceptible to the disease. This may counteract their obesity and lower income levels.

    The disease appears to have been initially spread by upper income individuals who can afford international air travel. Hispanics don't fall into that group and may not come into much contact with that group. Hispanics have developed their own set of parallel businesses. They have their own grocery stores, restaurants and other businesses that only they go to. The Hispanic factory, construction or agricultural worker may spend all day around other Hispanics and then spend their after work hours around other Hispanics so they may come into less contact with disease carrying whites.

    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state.

    What facts do you base that opinion on? Do you know how many Mexicans in Mexico are now diabetic, for example? What’s the rate of Type II diabetes among Mexican-Americans in California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas? Do you know what most Puerto Ricans in New York / New Jersey do for a job? What is the marriage rate among Central Americans in the US? What’s the divorce rate among 2nd and 3rd generation Mexican Americans?

    How much meso-American genetics are found in Mexicans vs. Cubans vs. Puerto Ricans vs. people from the Dominican Republic? Does that make a difference in your opinion in terms of health factors?

    You don’t really know much about “Hispanics”, beyond a few media cliches. Suggest you learn more.

    • Replies: @Mark G.

    What facts do you base that opinion on?
     
    Well, let's take diet for one:

    Kolker says immigrants who are not used to consuming so much fast or processed food have an upper hand when they arrive in the United States because their dishes are usually made up of more natural, healthier ingredients. Maintaining that diet once in the United States takes commitment.

    https://www.pri.org/stories/2015-12-10/latinos-live-longer-despite-poverty-heres-their-secret

    In comparison to non-Hispanic whites, Latinos consume legumes such as beans much more frequently, especially Mexican and Central American immigrants. Beans have shown to have protective effects against cardiovascular disease and certain cancers. Intake of fruits is also higher in the Latino population which offers protection against degenerative disease such as cardiovascular disease. While this cannot directly explain why Hispanics are more resilient to the effects of a disease, several studies have hypostasized that there might be a connection.

    https://www.chicagohispanichealthcoalition.org/hispanic-health-paradox-hispanics-live-longer-despite-higher-rates-poverty-harsher-jobs-less-education-health-services/

    After controlling for child age, sex and BMI status, it was suggested that dietary quality among Latino children may be compromised as they assimilate more into the USA ‘mainstream’ culture. This is consistent with findings from many studies showing that acculturation among Latinos has a negative influence on breastfeeding, infant feeding practices, as well as on the quality of the diet consumed by children, adolescents, and adults (11,15). This fact has been interpreted as an indication of the positive lifestyle behaviors associated with the Hispanic culture that need to be protected so that they don't ‘wash out’ as the individuals and families get more exposure to the USA ‘mainstream’ culture.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/ /

    When one thinks of Hispanic food in the U.S., dishes like a Chipotle chicken burrito may come to mind, packing a whopping 1,300 calories into a neatly folded flour tortilla. But as delicious as these giant burritos are, they aren’t authentic.
    Hispanic heritage cooking incorporates vegetables, beans, sweet potatoes, corn and avocado, a powerful punch of nutrients and healthy fats and proteins. Additions like sour cream, cheddar cheese and white flour tortillas may be tasty but pack on the fat, calories and in some cases, sugar.
    “Beans, beans and more beans. The things we can learn from traditional diets: corn, squash and beans,” Greger says. “You start eating the American diet, you can die of American diseases.”

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/09/29/hispanic-health/1442099002/

    Researchers say long-term health has a lot to do with diet, and immigrants are far less likely to indulge in the types of fattening foods that have expanded the American waistline. Instead of fast food and processed products, immigrants tend to favor fruit, vegetables, rice and beans.
    Experts add that Hispanic immigrants eat far less red meat, instead consuming less-expensive chicken.

    https://abcnews.go.com/WN/us-hispanics-longer-life-expectancy-white-black-americans/story?id=11883156

    As they acculturate, they start eating more processed and animal-based foods, and consume fewer plant foods—and perhaps one plant food in particular: beans. Maybe a reason Latinos live longer is because they eat more beans. Although Latinos only represent about 10 percent of the population, they eat a third of the beans in the United States, individually eating four to five times more beans per capita, a few pounds a month as opposed to a few pounds per year. That may help explain the “Hispanic Paradox,” because legumes (beans, split peas, chickpeas, and lentils) cool down systemic inflammation.

    https://nutritionfacts.org/2019/06/11/whats-the-secret-to-latino-longevity/
  20. anon[318] • Disclaimer says:
    @Arclight
    Obviously no opportunity to rev the 'blacks hit hardest' machinery into gear can be missed - yesterday I saw the lady who created the 1619 Project had started tweeting about this. Commenters of any race that noted that blacks have higher prevalence of pre-existing conditions that seem more closely related to the odds of getting Covid-19 than any group were waved away. The only possible explanation for this group having a huge share of its population with lifestyle-related health problems is structural racism and exclusion.

    Commenters of any race that noted that blacks have higher prevalence of pre-existing conditions that seem more closely related to the odds of getting Covid-19 than any group were waved away. The only possible explanation for this group having a huge share of its population with lifestyle-related health problems is structural racism and exclusion.

    Not sure about the odds of actually getting it. As far as anyone can tell, 80% of those who contract COVID-19 have mild to almost no symptoms. Of the 20% who have more serious symptoms not all wind up in ICU.

    However, there is a pretty solid list of comorbidities that make it more likely an individual will have bad outcomes including death. Diabetes, high blood pressure[1], asthma, heart disease are all on the list, and black Americans have higher rates of all of those things. Of course bad health outcomes among black people must be blamed on wypipo because reasons. We cannot discuss genetic differences / tendencies, nor can we hold people responsible for their decades of sugar-saturated big gulps and crap diet. That would be rayciss.

    [1] The Chinese noted this and both the Italians and Spanish have confirmed, however there’s some evidence that the ACE-2 drugs often used to control high blood pressure (hypertension) are significant contributors, maybe the major factor, because of the virus using that ACE-2 receptor as the entry point to cells.

  21. @Twinkie

    Remember two weeks ago when it was racist to point out that it seemed like Asians might be getting hit harder by coronavirus than non-Asians?
     
    No, it was premature and unscientific.

    As I noted in a comment at iSteve:

    Some preliminary numbers by race/ethnicity: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/04/07/coronavirus-is-infecting-killing-black-americans-an-alarmingly-high-rate-post-analysis-shows/

    County majority Counties Cases per 100k Deaths per 100k

    Asian 6 19.5 0.4
    Black 131 137.5 6.3
    Hispanic 124 27.2 0.6
    White 2,879 39.8 1.1
     
    Obviously this is not the actual numbers for each group, but those for majority x group counties and the numbers are highly preliminary, but it follows the well-established mortality pattern of Asian-Hispanic-white-black in the U.S.
     
    This data is still preliminary (and subject to the caveat), but less so than earlier speculations.

    “seemed like it might be” is merely suggestive. You’re honest and inquisitive, so wanted to wait for more and better data. That wasn’t why the corporate media was concerned. The establishment was concerned because it seemed to imply a potential biological/genetic explanation. With possible black (and possibly Hispanic) overrepresentation, the insinuation is not that it is biological/genetic but that it’s a consequence of poverty, discrimination, etc.

    • Agree: Twinkie
  22. Republican leaders have largely ignored competing with the professional media. They have, instead, focused on lining their pockets with donations while selling out their impressionable constituents who lack both a voice in society and the human capital to make one of their own.

    Google Sponsored CPAC To Shape Narrative On Nationalism

    https://dailycaller.com/2019/03/01/google-cpac-nationalism-immigration/

    Big Tech Probe Splits The GOP

    https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/06/koch-brothers-tech-industry-031204

    Sundar Pichai Confirms Google Gave Money to National Review Institute

    https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2019/02/18/sundar-pichai-confirms-google-gave-money-to-national-review-institute/

    “Conservative” think tank Heritage Foundation defends big tech, despite censorship claims

    A new report from The Campaign For Accountability obtained by this show highlights how conservative organizations in D.C. have colluded with big tech to shield left-wing monopolies from any oversight at all.

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/tucker-carlson-attacks-heritage-foundation-heritage-foundation-fires-back-in-statement/

    There are lots of other stories.

  23. @anon
    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state.

    What facts do you base that opinion on? Do you know how many Mexicans in Mexico are now diabetic, for example? What's the rate of Type II diabetes among Mexican-Americans in California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas? Do you know what most Puerto Ricans in New York / New Jersey do for a job? What is the marriage rate among Central Americans in the US? What's the divorce rate among 2nd and 3rd generation Mexican Americans?

    How much meso-American genetics are found in Mexicans vs. Cubans vs. Puerto Ricans vs. people from the Dominican Republic? Does that make a difference in your opinion in terms of health factors?

    You don't really know much about "Hispanics", beyond a few media cliches. Suggest you learn more.

    What facts do you base that opinion on?

    Well, let’s take diet for one:

    Kolker says immigrants who are not used to consuming so much fast or processed food have an upper hand when they arrive in the United States because their dishes are usually made up of more natural, healthier ingredients. Maintaining that diet once in the United States takes commitment.

    https://www.pri.org/stories/2015-12-10/latinos-live-longer-despite-poverty-heres-their-secret

    In comparison to non-Hispanic whites, Latinos consume legumes such as beans much more frequently, especially Mexican and Central American immigrants. Beans have shown to have protective effects against cardiovascular disease and certain cancers. Intake of fruits is also higher in the Latino population which offers protection against degenerative disease such as cardiovascular disease. While this cannot directly explain why Hispanics are more resilient to the effects of a disease, several studies have hypostasized that there might be a connection.

    https://www.chicagohispanichealthcoalition.org/hispanic-health-paradox-hispanics-live-longer-despite-higher-rates-poverty-harsher-jobs-less-education-health-services/

    After controlling for child age, sex and BMI status, it was suggested that dietary quality among Latino children may be compromised as they assimilate more into the USA ‘mainstream’ culture. This is consistent with findings from many studies showing that acculturation among Latinos has a negative influence on breastfeeding, infant feeding practices, as well as on the quality of the diet consumed by children, adolescents, and adults (11,15). This fact has been interpreted as an indication of the positive lifestyle behaviors associated with the Hispanic culture that need to be protected so that they don’t ‘wash out’ as the individuals and families get more exposure to the USA ‘mainstream’ culture.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/ /

    When one thinks of Hispanic food in the U.S., dishes like a Chipotle chicken burrito may come to mind, packing a whopping 1,300 calories into a neatly folded flour tortilla. But as delicious as these giant burritos are, they aren’t authentic.
    Hispanic heritage cooking incorporates vegetables, beans, sweet potatoes, corn and avocado, a powerful punch of nutrients and healthy fats and proteins. Additions like sour cream, cheddar cheese and white flour tortillas may be tasty but pack on the fat, calories and in some cases, sugar.
    “Beans, beans and more beans. The things we can learn from traditional diets: corn, squash and beans,” Greger says. “You start eating the American diet, you can die of American diseases.”

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/09/29/hispanic-health/1442099002/

    Researchers say long-term health has a lot to do with diet, and immigrants are far less likely to indulge in the types of fattening foods that have expanded the American waistline. Instead of fast food and processed products, immigrants tend to favor fruit, vegetables, rice and beans.
    Experts add that Hispanic immigrants eat far less red meat, instead consuming less-expensive chicken.

    https://abcnews.go.com/WN/us-hispanics-longer-life-expectancy-white-black-americans/story?id=11883156

    As they acculturate, they start eating more processed and animal-based foods, and consume fewer plant foods—and perhaps one plant food in particular: beans. Maybe a reason Latinos live longer is because they eat more beans. Although Latinos only represent about 10 percent of the population, they eat a third of the beans in the United States, individually eating four to five times more beans per capita, a few pounds a month as opposed to a few pounds per year. That may help explain the “Hispanic Paradox,” because legumes (beans, split peas, chickpeas, and lentils) cool down systemic inflammation.

    https://nutritionfacts.org/2019/06/11/whats-the-secret-to-latino-longevity/

    • Replies: @Twinkie

    Maybe a reason Latinos live longer is because they eat more beans.
     
    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.
  24. @iffen
    Isn't lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?

    It’s more problematic since the entire concept of Hispanic is pretty much nonsense.

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.

    A huge problem and an insoluble one.

    A good rule of thumb is that if you’re trying to attach a label to a group of people and you can’t even come close to coherently defining the meaning of the label then the label is entirely meaningless and useless.

    • Replies: @utu
    "label is entirely meaningless and useless" - Like men and women. And who did not belong to either group belonged to hospital or mental institution. Or like Aryans and Jews. Who had some doubts which group to belong could always ask Goering: "I decide who is a Jew". Botanist and biologist often have problems how to classify some organism. Categories are man created or social constructs as they would say now. There always will be problems on fuzzy boundaries.

    Hispanics were invented for 1970 US Census and became a racial category because in the questionnaire Hispanic placed next Black and Caucasian. Hispanic made sense as linguistic group that came from Spanish America. If at that time instead of Black and Caucasian or White they had African and European the whole race classification could have been weakened and diluted or even done with. And Hispanics should have been called Latin.

    I wonder which group would object the most if Black and White categories were replaced with African and European?
  25. @nebulafox
    Less social atomization does wonders.

    There is also some genetic variables at work though the research into this is still largely speculative.

  26. @Mark G.
    Many Hispanics haven't adopted the American fast food diet, work in jobs that require more physical exertion, have close knit families and lots of social connections, and haven't been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state. These are all things that may increase life expectancy and make them less susceptible to the disease. This may counteract their obesity and lower income levels.

    The disease appears to have been initially spread by upper income individuals who can afford international air travel. Hispanics don't fall into that group and may not come into much contact with that group. Hispanics have developed their own set of parallel businesses. They have their own grocery stores, restaurants and other businesses that only they go to. The Hispanic factory, construction or agricultural worker may spend all day around other Hispanics and then spend their after work hours around other Hispanics so they may come into less contact with disease carrying whites.

    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet

    This is untrue. Hispanics are nearly as obese as blacks in America, precisely because they consume fast food heavily. There is a rather dramatic difference in diet among Mexicans depending on what side of the U.S.-Mexican border they reside.

    work in jobs that require more physical exertion

    That doesn’t seem to help blacks and poor whites in similar jobs. In fact, menial jobs in agriculture and construction have higher rates of accidents and are usually associated with worse health outcomes (this has a long history – pastoralists generally had better fitness and health than agriculturalists in ancient and pre-historical times). Backbreaking work is unhealthy.

    have close knit families and lots of social connections

    This is likely true. Hispanics have higher marriage rates than whites and blacks.

    haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state.

    A majority of Hispanics are American-born and their entitlement usage rates are higher than those of whites and Asians (though lower than those of blacks).

    • Agree: Yahya K.
    • Replies: @anon
    What's to argue?

    Hispanics are descended from the Old School asians who crossed the Bering Straight.

    Asians have genetically higher life expectancy-- Hispanics share some of that legacy. They flow from the same fountain.
  27. @Mark G.

    What facts do you base that opinion on?
     
    Well, let's take diet for one:

    Kolker says immigrants who are not used to consuming so much fast or processed food have an upper hand when they arrive in the United States because their dishes are usually made up of more natural, healthier ingredients. Maintaining that diet once in the United States takes commitment.

    https://www.pri.org/stories/2015-12-10/latinos-live-longer-despite-poverty-heres-their-secret

    In comparison to non-Hispanic whites, Latinos consume legumes such as beans much more frequently, especially Mexican and Central American immigrants. Beans have shown to have protective effects against cardiovascular disease and certain cancers. Intake of fruits is also higher in the Latino population which offers protection against degenerative disease such as cardiovascular disease. While this cannot directly explain why Hispanics are more resilient to the effects of a disease, several studies have hypostasized that there might be a connection.

    https://www.chicagohispanichealthcoalition.org/hispanic-health-paradox-hispanics-live-longer-despite-higher-rates-poverty-harsher-jobs-less-education-health-services/

    After controlling for child age, sex and BMI status, it was suggested that dietary quality among Latino children may be compromised as they assimilate more into the USA ‘mainstream’ culture. This is consistent with findings from many studies showing that acculturation among Latinos has a negative influence on breastfeeding, infant feeding practices, as well as on the quality of the diet consumed by children, adolescents, and adults (11,15). This fact has been interpreted as an indication of the positive lifestyle behaviors associated with the Hispanic culture that need to be protected so that they don't ‘wash out’ as the individuals and families get more exposure to the USA ‘mainstream’ culture.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/ /

    When one thinks of Hispanic food in the U.S., dishes like a Chipotle chicken burrito may come to mind, packing a whopping 1,300 calories into a neatly folded flour tortilla. But as delicious as these giant burritos are, they aren’t authentic.
    Hispanic heritage cooking incorporates vegetables, beans, sweet potatoes, corn and avocado, a powerful punch of nutrients and healthy fats and proteins. Additions like sour cream, cheddar cheese and white flour tortillas may be tasty but pack on the fat, calories and in some cases, sugar.
    “Beans, beans and more beans. The things we can learn from traditional diets: corn, squash and beans,” Greger says. “You start eating the American diet, you can die of American diseases.”

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/09/29/hispanic-health/1442099002/

    Researchers say long-term health has a lot to do with diet, and immigrants are far less likely to indulge in the types of fattening foods that have expanded the American waistline. Instead of fast food and processed products, immigrants tend to favor fruit, vegetables, rice and beans.
    Experts add that Hispanic immigrants eat far less red meat, instead consuming less-expensive chicken.

    https://abcnews.go.com/WN/us-hispanics-longer-life-expectancy-white-black-americans/story?id=11883156

    As they acculturate, they start eating more processed and animal-based foods, and consume fewer plant foods—and perhaps one plant food in particular: beans. Maybe a reason Latinos live longer is because they eat more beans. Although Latinos only represent about 10 percent of the population, they eat a third of the beans in the United States, individually eating four to five times more beans per capita, a few pounds a month as opposed to a few pounds per year. That may help explain the “Hispanic Paradox,” because legumes (beans, split peas, chickpeas, and lentils) cool down systemic inflammation.

    https://nutritionfacts.org/2019/06/11/whats-the-secret-to-latino-longevity/

    Maybe a reason Latinos live longer is because they eat more beans.

    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.

    • Replies: @Mark G.

    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.
     
    Asians eat other healthy foods. The book "The Blue Zones" looks at places where there are a lot of long lived people. One chapter looks at Okinawa. "The Jungle Prescription" looks for areas where there are low levels of various diseases and again looks at Okinawa as does the book "The Okinawa Program". "The China Study" looks at China. "The Mediterrasian Way" looks at Asian diets more generally along with the similarly healthy Mediterranean diet. The first two books I mentioned discuss the positive health effects of Latin diets along with others. I don't know of any book length studies of that.

    Most nutrition experts agree the American fast food diet is unhealthy. They'll say traditional ethnic diets were better and some even want to go back to the way our prehistoric ancestors ate. If someone does eat in fast food restaurants a lot due to time or money constraints, the book "The Fast Food Diet" by Stephen Sinatra points the way to some better choices there.
  28. @Twinkie

    Maybe a reason Latinos live longer is because they eat more beans.
     
    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.

    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.

    Asians eat other healthy foods. The book “The Blue Zones” looks at places where there are a lot of long lived people. One chapter looks at Okinawa. “The Jungle Prescription” looks for areas where there are low levels of various diseases and again looks at Okinawa as does the book “The Okinawa Program”. “The China Study” looks at China. “The Mediterrasian Way” looks at Asian diets more generally along with the similarly healthy Mediterranean diet. The first two books I mentioned discuss the positive health effects of Latin diets along with others. I don’t know of any book length studies of that.

    Most nutrition experts agree the American fast food diet is unhealthy. They’ll say traditional ethnic diets were better and some even want to go back to the way our prehistoric ancestors ate. If someone does eat in fast food restaurants a lot due to time or money constraints, the book “The Fast Food Diet” by Stephen Sinatra points the way to some better choices there.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    >One chapter looks at Okinawa.

    I don't think it was just diet, though that was obviously a huge part of it: Okinawan old people also tended to remain very active. They were very plugged into their communities, and to the extent that their age permitted it, lived life actively: whether it working in their fields, fishing, gambling with their friends, touching the hair of blonde children against their will, whatever. It's not an accident that clinical depression is heavily common in people whose lives seem pointless to them. Human beings weren't meant for that, and I think that's at the root of so many problems we've got as a society.

    As another note, there's another important lesson here. These people went through a degree of absolute hell-Dante Aligheri level stuff-in 1945 that I suspect would be very, very hard for most people today to imagine. But they did not define their lives around that event. They didn't engage in denial about it and no doubt were haunted by their experiences, but they picked up, moved on, and had fulfilled lives anyway. They didn't make their identity about the war. That's a much bigger proverbial FU to the IJA than any amount of lecture circuits and museums: because they refused to not live life on their own terms and let their lives be dictated by what they suffered. That's a *real* example of refusing power to your tormentors.

    That sort of quiet dignity and grit is very inspirational: maybe all the moreso because it seems in such short supply in an age where victimhood has become something to be aspired to, as power in disguise, as opposed to a condition to be pitied and overcome.

    , @RSDB

    They’ll say traditional ethnic diets were better and some even want to go back to the way our prehistoric ancestors ate.
     
    The modern period (right down to the twentieth century) featured a number of deficiency diseases due to rapid changes in diet and food processing technology. It's a fair guess that a similar process is occurring today.
  29. @Twinkie

    Many Hispanics haven’t adopted the American fast food diet
     
    This is untrue. Hispanics are nearly as obese as blacks in America, precisely because they consume fast food heavily. There is a rather dramatic difference in diet among Mexicans depending on what side of the U.S.-Mexican border they reside.

    work in jobs that require more physical exertion
     
    That doesn’t seem to help blacks and poor whites in similar jobs. In fact, menial jobs in agriculture and construction have higher rates of accidents and are usually associated with worse health outcomes (this has a long history - pastoralists generally had better fitness and health than agriculturalists in ancient and pre-historical times). Backbreaking work is unhealthy.

    have close knit families and lots of social connections
     
    This is likely true. Hispanics have higher marriage rates than whites and blacks.

    haven’t been here long enough to be affected by the corrupting effects on character of an extensive welfare state.
     
    A majority of Hispanics are American-born and their entitlement usage rates are higher than those of whites and Asians (though lower than those of blacks).

    What’s to argue?

    Hispanics are descended from the Old School asians who crossed the Bering Straight.

    Asians have genetically higher life expectancy– Hispanics share some of that legacy. They flow from the same fountain.

  30. @Mark G.

    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.
     
    Asians eat other healthy foods. The book "The Blue Zones" looks at places where there are a lot of long lived people. One chapter looks at Okinawa. "The Jungle Prescription" looks for areas where there are low levels of various diseases and again looks at Okinawa as does the book "The Okinawa Program". "The China Study" looks at China. "The Mediterrasian Way" looks at Asian diets more generally along with the similarly healthy Mediterranean diet. The first two books I mentioned discuss the positive health effects of Latin diets along with others. I don't know of any book length studies of that.

    Most nutrition experts agree the American fast food diet is unhealthy. They'll say traditional ethnic diets were better and some even want to go back to the way our prehistoric ancestors ate. If someone does eat in fast food restaurants a lot due to time or money constraints, the book "The Fast Food Diet" by Stephen Sinatra points the way to some better choices there.

    >One chapter looks at Okinawa.

    I don’t think it was just diet, though that was obviously a huge part of it: Okinawan old people also tended to remain very active. They were very plugged into their communities, and to the extent that their age permitted it, lived life actively: whether it working in their fields, fishing, gambling with their friends, touching the hair of blonde children against their will, whatever. It’s not an accident that clinical depression is heavily common in people whose lives seem pointless to them. Human beings weren’t meant for that, and I think that’s at the root of so many problems we’ve got as a society.

    As another note, there’s another important lesson here. These people went through a degree of absolute hell-Dante Aligheri level stuff-in 1945 that I suspect would be very, very hard for most people today to imagine. But they did not define their lives around that event. They didn’t engage in denial about it and no doubt were haunted by their experiences, but they picked up, moved on, and had fulfilled lives anyway. They didn’t make their identity about the war. That’s a much bigger proverbial FU to the IJA than any amount of lecture circuits and museums: because they refused to not live life on their own terms and let their lives be dictated by what they suffered. That’s a *real* example of refusing power to your tormentors.

    That sort of quiet dignity and grit is very inspirational: maybe all the moreso because it seems in such short supply in an age where victimhood has become something to be aspired to, as power in disguise, as opposed to a condition to be pitied and overcome.

    • Agree: iffen, Mark G.
    • Replies: @songbird
    The victimhood narrative of the war didn't really break the public surface until about 1970 - I think that is another reason to dispense with it. As I often say, no idea that was popularized in 1970s America is a moral idea. Think divorce, or the rainbow flag, or busing.

    Re: Okinawa: another important fact is genes. One cannot simply duplicate their diet and lifestyle and get the same result. They are very adapted to their diet in a way that Europeans are not, at least not to the same type of diet, with copious amounts of rice.
    , @utu
    "That sort of quiet dignity and grit..." - If they won the war would they be as dignified? Having you ass kicked sometimes helps you in the grit department. Then otoh if they were the ones who set up Auschwitz I wonder whether their inborn grit and dignity would survive the onslaught of the pedagogy of shame and guilt that would descend on them after the lost war.
  31. @nebulafox
    >One chapter looks at Okinawa.

    I don't think it was just diet, though that was obviously a huge part of it: Okinawan old people also tended to remain very active. They were very plugged into their communities, and to the extent that their age permitted it, lived life actively: whether it working in their fields, fishing, gambling with their friends, touching the hair of blonde children against their will, whatever. It's not an accident that clinical depression is heavily common in people whose lives seem pointless to them. Human beings weren't meant for that, and I think that's at the root of so many problems we've got as a society.

    As another note, there's another important lesson here. These people went through a degree of absolute hell-Dante Aligheri level stuff-in 1945 that I suspect would be very, very hard for most people today to imagine. But they did not define their lives around that event. They didn't engage in denial about it and no doubt were haunted by their experiences, but they picked up, moved on, and had fulfilled lives anyway. They didn't make their identity about the war. That's a much bigger proverbial FU to the IJA than any amount of lecture circuits and museums: because they refused to not live life on their own terms and let their lives be dictated by what they suffered. That's a *real* example of refusing power to your tormentors.

    That sort of quiet dignity and grit is very inspirational: maybe all the moreso because it seems in such short supply in an age where victimhood has become something to be aspired to, as power in disguise, as opposed to a condition to be pitied and overcome.

    The victimhood narrative of the war didn’t really break the public surface until about 1970 – I think that is another reason to dispense with it. As I often say, no idea that was popularized in 1970s America is a moral idea. Think divorce, or the rainbow flag, or busing.

    Re: Okinawa: another important fact is genes. One cannot simply duplicate their diet and lifestyle and get the same result. They are very adapted to their diet in a way that Europeans are not, at least not to the same type of diet, with copious amounts of rice.

  32. @dfordoom

    Isn’t lumping many groups under the Hispanic label as problematic, or more so, as lumping many groups under the Asian label?
     
    It's more problematic since the entire concept of Hispanic is pretty much nonsense.

    As we well know, there is a problem with the white label as well.
     
    A huge problem and an insoluble one.

    A good rule of thumb is that if you're trying to attach a label to a group of people and you can't even come close to coherently defining the meaning of the label then the label is entirely meaningless and useless.

    “label is entirely meaningless and useless” – Like men and women. And who did not belong to either group belonged to hospital or mental institution. Or like Aryans and Jews. Who had some doubts which group to belong could always ask Goering: “I decide who is a Jew”. Botanist and biologist often have problems how to classify some organism. Categories are man created or social constructs as they would say now. There always will be problems on fuzzy boundaries.

    Hispanics were invented for 1970 US Census and became a racial category because in the questionnaire Hispanic placed next Black and Caucasian. Hispanic made sense as linguistic group that came from Spanish America. If at that time instead of Black and Caucasian or White they had African and European the whole race classification could have been weakened and diluted or even done with. And Hispanics should have been called Latin.

    I wonder which group would object the most if Black and White categories were replaced with African and European?

  33. @nebulafox
    >One chapter looks at Okinawa.

    I don't think it was just diet, though that was obviously a huge part of it: Okinawan old people also tended to remain very active. They were very plugged into their communities, and to the extent that their age permitted it, lived life actively: whether it working in their fields, fishing, gambling with their friends, touching the hair of blonde children against their will, whatever. It's not an accident that clinical depression is heavily common in people whose lives seem pointless to them. Human beings weren't meant for that, and I think that's at the root of so many problems we've got as a society.

    As another note, there's another important lesson here. These people went through a degree of absolute hell-Dante Aligheri level stuff-in 1945 that I suspect would be very, very hard for most people today to imagine. But they did not define their lives around that event. They didn't engage in denial about it and no doubt were haunted by their experiences, but they picked up, moved on, and had fulfilled lives anyway. They didn't make their identity about the war. That's a much bigger proverbial FU to the IJA than any amount of lecture circuits and museums: because they refused to not live life on their own terms and let their lives be dictated by what they suffered. That's a *real* example of refusing power to your tormentors.

    That sort of quiet dignity and grit is very inspirational: maybe all the moreso because it seems in such short supply in an age where victimhood has become something to be aspired to, as power in disguise, as opposed to a condition to be pitied and overcome.

    “That sort of quiet dignity and grit…” – If they won the war would they be as dignified? Having you ass kicked sometimes helps you in the grit department. Then otoh if they were the ones who set up Auschwitz I wonder whether their inborn grit and dignity would survive the onslaught of the pedagogy of shame and guilt that would descend on them after the lost war.

  34. @Mark G.

    Asians eat very little beans and live much longer than Hispanics.
     
    Asians eat other healthy foods. The book "The Blue Zones" looks at places where there are a lot of long lived people. One chapter looks at Okinawa. "The Jungle Prescription" looks for areas where there are low levels of various diseases and again looks at Okinawa as does the book "The Okinawa Program". "The China Study" looks at China. "The Mediterrasian Way" looks at Asian diets more generally along with the similarly healthy Mediterranean diet. The first two books I mentioned discuss the positive health effects of Latin diets along with others. I don't know of any book length studies of that.

    Most nutrition experts agree the American fast food diet is unhealthy. They'll say traditional ethnic diets were better and some even want to go back to the way our prehistoric ancestors ate. If someone does eat in fast food restaurants a lot due to time or money constraints, the book "The Fast Food Diet" by Stephen Sinatra points the way to some better choices there.

    They’ll say traditional ethnic diets were better and some even want to go back to the way our prehistoric ancestors ate.

    The modern period (right down to the twentieth century) featured a number of deficiency diseases due to rapid changes in diet and food processing technology. It’s a fair guess that a similar process is occurring today.

  35. Collection and release of corona virus statistics by race is racist. No, wait, failure to collect and release the statistics by race is racist. And the SJW intellectual jet set claims rationality as its exclusive domain–deplorables need not apply.

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