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Trump and Biden Net Favorability Ratings by Age, Race, Sex and Education
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Net favorability ratings for president Trump and presidential hopeful Biden by selected demographic profiles follow.

For being a hidebound old white man, Biden does pretty well with non-white women–and abysmally with his fellow white men. For a Trumpian white pill, note that excepting women under the age of 35, Trump is viewed more favorably than Biden by whites young and old, educated or not. Whites:

Blacks:

Hispanics:

Others:

Parenthetically, results for Republicans and Democrats by race are not shown because they dwarf the other demographic dimensions in partisanly predictable ways.

 
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  1. What I find interesting is that for non-black men under the age of 35 (my demographic), neither are viewed positively. Where it breaks down on predictable racial lines is who is viewed with deeper distaste, but this does still betray the fact that neither party offers much to younger men. The Democrats are in thrall to women, the Republicans to old men.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
  2. Funny how the “diverse” (non-White) people have the least “diverse” political views. All in lockstep they are.

    White sheep continue to bicker among themselves, while the wolves grow in number, surrounding them, working together for their own, collective interests.

    • Agree: Realist
    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The Coalition of the Fringes is deeply fragile and relies on a heavy external factor-first Obama, then Trump-keeping it together. The various competing groups have precious little affection for each other. Looking at the dynamics of other multicultural societies in history, I have a very hard time buying Democratic arguments about how a society revolving around "diversity" as a primary justification in itself is going to be tenable. That doesn't mean the various components of the coalition are on board with "woke" ideology: ask any recent immigrant shopkeeper that just had his business go up in flames thanks to Antifa, or if you get sufficient alcohol into their system, what they really think of camp homosexuals and feminists. Wokeism is a creation of the managerial upper middle class that is the true nucleus of the modern Democratic Party, with the tacit support of the oligarchs. But they'll still vote Democrat because, hey, they aren't the targets of this stuff.

    It's almost as if the GOP could take advantage of this incoherence: after all, until well into the Clinton era, most Asians voted Republican. But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn't bother to hide it anymore), so don't count on that. In particular, Hispanics aren't stupid: as a group that benefits from Big Government more than they pay into it, GOP socioeconomic arguments are on some level deeply intellectually patronizing. This is a reality that well predates Donald Trump, who won more minorities than Romney did.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Mark G., @Libre, @Jane Plain

    , @guest007
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The lack of diversity in political view should not matter versus the lack of diversity across all facets of black culture. The same music, sports, food, entertainment, etc. Try to find the vegan black nerd at the Star Trek convention.

    , @Pop Warner
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Diversity of opinion is a luxury of a homogeneous nation. When your country is divided between competing races or ethnic groups you vote your tribe. But a lot of whites haven't gotten the memo about their demographic decline

  3. @Buzz Mohawk
    Funny how the "diverse" (non-White) people have the least "diverse" political views. All in lockstep they are.

    White sheep continue to bicker among themselves, while the wolves grow in number, surrounding them, working together for their own, collective interests.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @guest007, @Pop Warner

    The Coalition of the Fringes is deeply fragile and relies on a heavy external factor-first Obama, then Trump-keeping it together. The various competing groups have precious little affection for each other. Looking at the dynamics of other multicultural societies in history, I have a very hard time buying Democratic arguments about how a society revolving around “diversity” as a primary justification in itself is going to be tenable. That doesn’t mean the various components of the coalition are on board with “woke” ideology: ask any recent immigrant shopkeeper that just had his business go up in flames thanks to Antifa, or if you get sufficient alcohol into their system, what they really think of camp homosexuals and feminists. Wokeism is a creation of the managerial upper middle class that is the true nucleus of the modern Democratic Party, with the tacit support of the oligarchs. But they’ll still vote Democrat because, hey, they aren’t the targets of this stuff.

    It’s almost as if the GOP could take advantage of this incoherence: after all, until well into the Clinton era, most Asians voted Republican. But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn’t bother to hide it anymore), so don’t count on that. In particular, Hispanics aren’t stupid: as a group that benefits from Big Government more than they pay into it, GOP socioeconomic arguments are on some level deeply intellectually patronizing. This is a reality that well predates Donald Trump, who won more minorities than Romney did.

    • Agree: Charlotte
    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @nebulafox

    Thank you. That is a very intelligently-written comment. I wanted to just click "Agree," but that was not good enough.

    Our problem is that the "coalition" will continue to be used against us, for whoever's interest. Eventually it will be too late, and everything our people created will be destroyed or turned into mush. It just doesn't matter how non-cohesive the coalition is, as long as it holds together long enough to be useful for the forces of Evil.

    Replies: @nebulafox

    , @Mark G.
    @nebulafox


    But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn’t bother to hide it anymore), so don’t count on that.

     

    Trump is in no way a proponent of free market fundamentalism. If you are attacking free market fundamentalists, then you are attacking a group that hasn't had any influence on public policy for 50 years. Their last gasp was in the Reagan administration when members of his administration like David Stockman tried and failed to get Reagan and the Republicans in Congress to cut spending. Instead, a deal was made with the Democrats to increase domestic spending in exchange for increased military spending. People like Stockman are now outsiders attacking the Republican establishment. Any Republican presidential candidate advocating free market capitalism like Ron Paul would be lucky to get fifteen percent of the vote in a Republican primary.

    If you look at government spending as a percentage of GDP, there has been no decrease for the last 50 years except for a brief period during the economic bubble of the late nineties. It's a myth that the last half century has been an era of free market capitalism.

    Replies: @216

    , @Libre
    @nebulafox

    Asians vote Republican when blacks riot. I can't imagine Chung Lee the laundromat owner who just got mugged and Padar Patel the bodega franchisee are concerned much with answering phone polls, but they know who will put the troublemakers in timeout, and who will give them a cookie. Silicon valley and college Asians, on the other hand, might not care about such trivialities.

    However, what exactly do you want "free market fundamentalism" replaced with? They certainly have a misguided approach to it and bad messaging, but deregulation and lower taxes are good for businesses.

    Replies: @216, @Intelligent Dasein

    , @Jane Plain
    @nebulafox

    I don't believe that there is a Coalition of the Fringes (CotF).

    Read Colin Woodard's American Nations. He focuses on whites almost exclusively, but it's a much better explanation of American voting patterns than the Sailer theory.

    CotF makes superficial sense at the upper reaches of the Democratic National Committee. But even there, it's mostly militant black rage and muscle, with oligarch money.

    Not much of a coalition, when you analyze it.

  4. @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The Coalition of the Fringes is deeply fragile and relies on a heavy external factor-first Obama, then Trump-keeping it together. The various competing groups have precious little affection for each other. Looking at the dynamics of other multicultural societies in history, I have a very hard time buying Democratic arguments about how a society revolving around "diversity" as a primary justification in itself is going to be tenable. That doesn't mean the various components of the coalition are on board with "woke" ideology: ask any recent immigrant shopkeeper that just had his business go up in flames thanks to Antifa, or if you get sufficient alcohol into their system, what they really think of camp homosexuals and feminists. Wokeism is a creation of the managerial upper middle class that is the true nucleus of the modern Democratic Party, with the tacit support of the oligarchs. But they'll still vote Democrat because, hey, they aren't the targets of this stuff.

    It's almost as if the GOP could take advantage of this incoherence: after all, until well into the Clinton era, most Asians voted Republican. But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn't bother to hide it anymore), so don't count on that. In particular, Hispanics aren't stupid: as a group that benefits from Big Government more than they pay into it, GOP socioeconomic arguments are on some level deeply intellectually patronizing. This is a reality that well predates Donald Trump, who won more minorities than Romney did.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Mark G., @Libre, @Jane Plain

    Thank you. That is a very intelligently-written comment. I wanted to just click “Agree,” but that was not good enough.

    Our problem is that the “coalition” will continue to be used against us, for whoever’s interest. Eventually it will be too late, and everything our people created will be destroyed or turned into mush. It just doesn’t matter how non-cohesive the coalition is, as long as it holds together long enough to be useful for the forces of Evil.

    • Replies: @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Thank you for your kindness.

    Well, that's all the more reason to politically mess with it. The progressive UMC people in ideological charge of the DNC really aren't as bright as they think they are, and that can be their downfall: Republican incompetence is the only reason they get to do what they do. Even conservative media fails to truly take advantage of things like the recent riots: they overplay their hand or are tone deaf when talking to non-white, blue collar or lower-middle class Democratic voters with certain "small-c" conservative views that can be exploited. Instead of emphasizing the "I wish the authorities came in here sooner to kick Antifa ass" angle, deepening anti-rioter sentiment, and letting the seeds grow, they try to explicitly cajole a statement of support for Donald Trump or a disavowal of the Democrats or something. You got to be smart about this.

    (But for Pete's sake, when you have the Latin Kings openly toting guns to warn BLMers and Antifa to stay the hell out of their neighborhoods... why does Donald Trump find the need to preside over a massive wealth transfer to monied interests? Why? If not for what is best for America, than for political propaganda in attacking "woke crony capitalism".)

    I get that the Evil Party is the real threat, not the Stupid Party, but the Stupid Party is what you use to combat the Evil Party, and that's why I focus on their tactics.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @TomSchmidt

  5. @Buzz Mohawk
    @nebulafox

    Thank you. That is a very intelligently-written comment. I wanted to just click "Agree," but that was not good enough.

    Our problem is that the "coalition" will continue to be used against us, for whoever's interest. Eventually it will be too late, and everything our people created will be destroyed or turned into mush. It just doesn't matter how non-cohesive the coalition is, as long as it holds together long enough to be useful for the forces of Evil.

    Replies: @nebulafox

    Thank you for your kindness.

    Well, that’s all the more reason to politically mess with it. The progressive UMC people in ideological charge of the DNC really aren’t as bright as they think they are, and that can be their downfall: Republican incompetence is the only reason they get to do what they do. Even conservative media fails to truly take advantage of things like the recent riots: they overplay their hand or are tone deaf when talking to non-white, blue collar or lower-middle class Democratic voters with certain “small-c” conservative views that can be exploited. Instead of emphasizing the “I wish the authorities came in here sooner to kick Antifa ass” angle, deepening anti-rioter sentiment, and letting the seeds grow, they try to explicitly cajole a statement of support for Donald Trump or a disavowal of the Democrats or something. You got to be smart about this.

    (But for Pete’s sake, when you have the Latin Kings openly toting guns to warn BLMers and Antifa to stay the hell out of their neighborhoods… why does Donald Trump find the need to preside over a massive wealth transfer to monied interests? Why? If not for what is best for America, than for political propaganda in attacking “woke crony capitalism”.)

    I get that the Evil Party is the real threat, not the Stupid Party, but the Stupid Party is what you use to combat the Evil Party, and that’s why I focus on their tactics.

    • Replies: @Buzz Mohawk
    @nebulafox

    I see what you see in the actions of the Republican party and Republican press (e.g. Fox News.)

    This leads me to wonder, "Who controls them?" They can't be that stupid.

    Think of any other thing in media or public relations (fields in which I worked in one form or another in a previous life before I joined the evil financial empire.)

    Nothing is accidental, and everything is a show. (I once talked all night on the biggest AM talk radio station in Denver about something I knew nothing about. The chick-host I was dating needed a guest, and I played an expert. People called in from all over the West.)

    You and I have no guarantee that anything we see isn't phony, but we can be sure that everything was carefully thought out and is presented to us for a reason.

    It is for that reason that I believe our whole "side" in MSM is a crock of shit. Controlled opposition.

    Right now, we have no representation whatsoever in our government. None in media either, save for places like this, UR and iSteve.

    (I sense I am rambling off on a tangent, but I am enjoying it. Thank you, and Good Morning.)

    , @TomSchmidt
    @nebulafox

    "The progressive UMC people in ideological charge of the DNC really aren’t as bright as they think they are, and that can be their downfall"

    I think they thought they could just shut down the economy for the virus, and then flip a switch and it would all come back on, after Biden got elected. Andrew Cuomo is only one example of this arrogant, unaccountable, clueless style of governance. Except: he has blown multi-billion dollar holes in his budget with his lockdowns, and probably permanently damaged NYC as a post-Industrial services center. The city is lifeless, and the demand for offices is about to drop through the floor. He is going to have to cut the budget, massively, or try to raise the highest taxes in the country; if he cuts the budget for white middle class items, they'll leave, and if he tries to raise taxes on the wealthiest, they'll depart for Florida, like Trump did.

    It's going to be very ugly.

  6. The reversed age gradient with blacks has been observed before. No one seems to have found a way to exploit it yet.

    My guess is that the “kids in cages” is why younger Hispanic women are so opposed to Trump, compared to other blocs which are the typical “meh”.

    For all the talk of the fetishization of Asian women, it is not reciprocated at all when it comes to politics. Maybe our people will learn a lesson.

    • Replies: @JohnPlywood
    @216

    Men who get Asian women are upscale, usually STEM graduates. They don't support Trump, like most white men under 30.

    Working class and humanities white men vote Trump and grudgingly settle for their own warthog women, but would take an Asian girl if they could get one, even if they voted Democrat. Biological imperative trumps politics, and support for Republicans is declining among white men anyway, except among those poor unfortunate souls who have been reduced to accepting their sole source of income from special interest groups in exchange for spreading propaganda online.

    Replies: @botazefa

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @216

    Indeed, it is regularly apparent with both blacks and Jews. The youth are more Republican--and certainly less Democrat--than the elders.

  7. @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Thank you for your kindness.

    Well, that's all the more reason to politically mess with it. The progressive UMC people in ideological charge of the DNC really aren't as bright as they think they are, and that can be their downfall: Republican incompetence is the only reason they get to do what they do. Even conservative media fails to truly take advantage of things like the recent riots: they overplay their hand or are tone deaf when talking to non-white, blue collar or lower-middle class Democratic voters with certain "small-c" conservative views that can be exploited. Instead of emphasizing the "I wish the authorities came in here sooner to kick Antifa ass" angle, deepening anti-rioter sentiment, and letting the seeds grow, they try to explicitly cajole a statement of support for Donald Trump or a disavowal of the Democrats or something. You got to be smart about this.

    (But for Pete's sake, when you have the Latin Kings openly toting guns to warn BLMers and Antifa to stay the hell out of their neighborhoods... why does Donald Trump find the need to preside over a massive wealth transfer to monied interests? Why? If not for what is best for America, than for political propaganda in attacking "woke crony capitalism".)

    I get that the Evil Party is the real threat, not the Stupid Party, but the Stupid Party is what you use to combat the Evil Party, and that's why I focus on their tactics.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @TomSchmidt

    I see what you see in the actions of the Republican party and Republican press (e.g. Fox News.)

    This leads me to wonder, “Who controls them?” They can’t be that stupid.

    Think of any other thing in media or public relations (fields in which I worked in one form or another in a previous life before I joined the evil financial empire.)

    Nothing is accidental, and everything is a show. (I once talked all night on the biggest AM talk radio station in Denver about something I knew nothing about. The chick-host I was dating needed a guest, and I played an expert. People called in from all over the West.)

    You and I have no guarantee that anything we see isn’t phony, but we can be sure that everything was carefully thought out and is presented to us for a reason.

    It is for that reason that I believe our whole “side” in MSM is a crock of shit. Controlled opposition.

    Right now, we have no representation whatsoever in our government. None in media either, save for places like this, UR and iSteve.

    (I sense I am rambling off on a tangent, but I am enjoying it. Thank you, and Good Morning.)

  8. Another curiousity.

    Middle aged and older men (Asian/Mixed/Other) are rather relaxed in their opposition to Trump, compared with the female rage that is echoed by their Woke sons.

    Another opportunity to exploit that campaign staff is probably clueless about.

  9. The bottom line seems to be the idea of any republican winning the presidency much beyond this year is remote.

  10. Whites are more intelligent than POC…but whites, to their detriment, are not monolithic in their self interest.

  11. @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The Coalition of the Fringes is deeply fragile and relies on a heavy external factor-first Obama, then Trump-keeping it together. The various competing groups have precious little affection for each other. Looking at the dynamics of other multicultural societies in history, I have a very hard time buying Democratic arguments about how a society revolving around "diversity" as a primary justification in itself is going to be tenable. That doesn't mean the various components of the coalition are on board with "woke" ideology: ask any recent immigrant shopkeeper that just had his business go up in flames thanks to Antifa, or if you get sufficient alcohol into their system, what they really think of camp homosexuals and feminists. Wokeism is a creation of the managerial upper middle class that is the true nucleus of the modern Democratic Party, with the tacit support of the oligarchs. But they'll still vote Democrat because, hey, they aren't the targets of this stuff.

    It's almost as if the GOP could take advantage of this incoherence: after all, until well into the Clinton era, most Asians voted Republican. But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn't bother to hide it anymore), so don't count on that. In particular, Hispanics aren't stupid: as a group that benefits from Big Government more than they pay into it, GOP socioeconomic arguments are on some level deeply intellectually patronizing. This is a reality that well predates Donald Trump, who won more minorities than Romney did.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Mark G., @Libre, @Jane Plain

    But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn’t bother to hide it anymore), so don’t count on that.

    Trump is in no way a proponent of free market fundamentalism. If you are attacking free market fundamentalists, then you are attacking a group that hasn’t had any influence on public policy for 50 years. Their last gasp was in the Reagan administration when members of his administration like David Stockman tried and failed to get Reagan and the Republicans in Congress to cut spending. Instead, a deal was made with the Democrats to increase domestic spending in exchange for increased military spending. People like Stockman are now outsiders attacking the Republican establishment. Any Republican presidential candidate advocating free market capitalism like Ron Paul would be lucky to get fifteen percent of the vote in a Republican primary.

    If you look at government spending as a percentage of GDP, there has been no decrease for the last 50 years except for a brief period during the economic bubble of the late nineties. It’s a myth that the last half century has been an era of free market capitalism.

    • Replies: @216
    @Mark G.

    Conservatives spent the last 10 years sucking up to Big Tech, in hopes that the "libertarian" Silicon Dons would shower them in donations.

    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

    Replies: @Mark G., @Kratoklastes

  12. @Mark G.
    @nebulafox


    But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn’t bother to hide it anymore), so don’t count on that.

     

    Trump is in no way a proponent of free market fundamentalism. If you are attacking free market fundamentalists, then you are attacking a group that hasn't had any influence on public policy for 50 years. Their last gasp was in the Reagan administration when members of his administration like David Stockman tried and failed to get Reagan and the Republicans in Congress to cut spending. Instead, a deal was made with the Democrats to increase domestic spending in exchange for increased military spending. People like Stockman are now outsiders attacking the Republican establishment. Any Republican presidential candidate advocating free market capitalism like Ron Paul would be lucky to get fifteen percent of the vote in a Republican primary.

    If you look at government spending as a percentage of GDP, there has been no decrease for the last 50 years except for a brief period during the economic bubble of the late nineties. It's a myth that the last half century has been an era of free market capitalism.

    Replies: @216

    Conservatives spent the last 10 years sucking up to Big Tech, in hopes that the “libertarian” Silicon Dons would shower them in donations.

    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

    • Replies: @Mark G.
    @216


    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

     

    As of 2018, the U.S. ranked 17th in the world in economic freedom. It used to rank in the top two or three. How is it that a country that is supposedly in thrall to free market fundamentalism moving in a statist direction like that? Like I said before, it's a myth that the last 50 years has been a period in the U.S. of free market capitalism. The myth is perpetuated by people who don't want to admit that our economic decline has nothing to do with adopting more free market policies, since we never actually did that.

    https://reason.com/2018/01/31/sadly-americas-not-the-freest-country-in/

    Replies: @botazefa

    , @Kratoklastes
    @216


    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.
     
    Why would you write something that is so ridiculously easy to prove false? Did you ever check whether or not what you were writing was supported by facts, or did you not care either way? Are you accustomed to a mouth-breathing audience of gullible fuckwits (e.g., FreeRepublic or something)?

    List of countries by government share of GDP

    The unadjusted US ratio of government expenditure to GDP is 41.6% - within the margin of error for equality with Canada and Japan, and fully 7 percentage points greater than Australia (whose public sector accounting massively understates public-sector expenditure).

    There are significant accounting issues - for every government in the West - because a large proportion of government expenditure is, weirdly, not counted as part of government expenditure under the National Accounting framework.

    Public-sector accounting principles are dodgy as fuck, and public-sector financial statements are rife with accounting chicanery - if they were pricate-sector accounts whoever prepared them would be imprisoned for fraud.

    When the OECD attempts to harmonise data across countries comparisons get screwed up - but the latest data indicates that the US is not "at the bottom or 2nd-last" in the OECD, or even in the G20.

    OECD General Government Expenditure as a share of GDP

    G20 Government Expenditure as a share of GDP


    Note that all of the data comparisons use government-produced 'real' GDP components: that by itself makes them dodgy because the real GDP number is inflated by conversion using very biased deflators; by contrast the deflator used for government expenditure numbers biases real government expenditure numbers downwards. The US is the worst offender on the deflator side of things.

  13. Off topic

    • Replies: @Truth
    @216

    LOL, why does this guy put his height on his Twitter page.

  14. For a Trumpian white pill, note that excepting women under the age of 35, Trump is viewed more favorably than Biden by whites young and old, educated or not.

    Also excepting the even more Trump disfavoring category of white postgraduate women.

  15. @Buzz Mohawk
    Funny how the "diverse" (non-White) people have the least "diverse" political views. All in lockstep they are.

    White sheep continue to bicker among themselves, while the wolves grow in number, surrounding them, working together for their own, collective interests.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @guest007, @Pop Warner

    The lack of diversity in political view should not matter versus the lack of diversity across all facets of black culture. The same music, sports, food, entertainment, etc. Try to find the vegan black nerd at the Star Trek convention.

  16. We are gonna lose.

    We don’t have anybody that can match skeletor Ruth Bader Ginsburg in sheer grit.

    America RIP

    • Replies: @Talha
    @iffen

    “She. Just. Won’t. Go. Away!”

    The above is what I predict my grandson saying in 2067.

    Peace.

    , @Audacious Epigone
    @iffen

    Skeletor is ripped. I knew that when I was kid, forgot it for decades, and then rediscovered it not too long ago.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/8/8a/Skeletor-spoo.jpg/250px-Skeletor-spoo.jpg

  17. Polling on Trump and Biden seem like a paradox for gathering real information on the way the populace feels. We are a moving target. Our ideas cancel each other out and change daily. I notice you did not factor in the favorabilityof Jews in your graphs?

    What we are witnessing is a short circuit of accurate information of inventory (collecting information and deciding it is accurate), reality, and decision making. We cannot come up with accurate facts to enact policy and disseminate information. So polling is like sticking your finger in downed electrical wires. Nihilism is upon us. It may not be a designed phenomena but it is here. It is the result of humans at their wits end. The internet and social media have allowed the civilized world to be triggered with a maze of surreal information. Lies up lies up more lies. There used to be a clearing house for information after a certain tumult and divisiveness. Like after Vietnam we all settled down and reviewed the facts and agreed on the causes and effects of what happened and what went wrong. The same is true with the McCarthy era, WW2 etc.. We as a society have lost our ability to discern truth and clear the debris away. We are being driven nuts which is what we are. People are deliberately setting our hair on fire. I do not think it is one group over another. It is everyone joining in.

    Now the certainty over the election results is at our door step. Not that someone will plan to steal it, just that with the internet there will be enough doubts planted, with frightening seeds of horror that someone planned and stole it. Sort of similar to the last election only worse. We will all loose our collective minds if this is not brought under control with some sort of truth clearing house. We have to vote in a federal election system with thumb prints. We are way past the states ability to handle voting and tallying. If some minorities feel disenfranchised because they cannot be ID’d then too bad. If you can not be identified you do not deserve to vote. Big changes need to be made for us to survive. I fear the democrats will use this chaos for a marxist takeover.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    @Fran Taubman

    Jews are not broken out as a separate category at Civiqs. Where does Biden fall in a preference distribution among Jewish leftists?

  18. @216
    @Mark G.

    Conservatives spent the last 10 years sucking up to Big Tech, in hopes that the "libertarian" Silicon Dons would shower them in donations.

    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

    Replies: @Mark G., @Kratoklastes

    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

    As of 2018, the U.S. ranked 17th in the world in economic freedom. It used to rank in the top two or three. How is it that a country that is supposedly in thrall to free market fundamentalism moving in a statist direction like that? Like I said before, it’s a myth that the last 50 years has been a period in the U.S. of free market capitalism. The myth is perpetuated by people who don’t want to admit that our economic decline has nothing to do with adopting more free market policies, since we never actually did that.

    https://reason.com/2018/01/31/sadly-americas-not-the-freest-country-in/

    • Replies: @botazefa
    @Mark G.


    it’s a myth that the last 50 years has been a period in the U.S. of free market capitalism.
     
    How do you reconcile the labor free for all in the US, based upon porous borders encouraging wage decreases across the board, with the idea that the US isn't really free market?

    Replies: @Mark G.

  19. I wonder how the “others” will like the BLM black party.

    Its 24/7 black at the D-Party nowadays.

    Its all about black lives, bodies, lies, habits, tripe and endless demands.

    Those Mestizos may not show up for that party.

    • Replies: @Mr. Rational
    @Dr. Doom


    I wonder how the “others” will like the BLM black party.
     
    In a nutshell, the Sailer strategy is to brand the donks as the "black party".  Blacks don't play well with others, even other members of the "coalition of the fringes".  If the party of blacks drives the "latinx", women, LGBT, etc. into not voting at all, that's half as good as driving them to vote Republican.  You can win elections that way.
  20. @216
    The reversed age gradient with blacks has been observed before. No one seems to have found a way to exploit it yet.

    My guess is that the "kids in cages" is why younger Hispanic women are so opposed to Trump, compared to other blocs which are the typical "meh".

    For all the talk of the fetishization of Asian women, it is not reciprocated at all when it comes to politics. Maybe our people will learn a lesson.

    Replies: @JohnPlywood, @Audacious Epigone

    Men who get Asian women are upscale, usually STEM graduates. They don’t support Trump, like most white men under 30.

    Working class and humanities white men vote Trump and grudgingly settle for their own warthog women, but would take an Asian girl if they could get one, even if they voted Democrat. Biological imperative trumps politics, and support for Republicans is declining among white men anyway, except among those poor unfortunate souls who have been reduced to accepting their sole source of income from special interest groups in exchange for spreading propaganda online.

    • Replies: @botazefa
    @JohnPlywood


    but would take an Asian girl if they could get one, even if they voted Democrat.
     
    Any data to back up your claim? I don't think white guys generally prefer Asian women. Personally, I don't find them to be attractive.

    What motivates you?
  21. @Buzz Mohawk
    Funny how the "diverse" (non-White) people have the least "diverse" political views. All in lockstep they are.

    White sheep continue to bicker among themselves, while the wolves grow in number, surrounding them, working together for their own, collective interests.

    Replies: @nebulafox, @guest007, @Pop Warner

    Diversity of opinion is a luxury of a homogeneous nation. When your country is divided between competing races or ethnic groups you vote your tribe. But a lot of whites haven’t gotten the memo about their demographic decline

    • Agree: Mr. Rational
  22. @Dr. Doom
    I wonder how the "others" will like the BLM black party.

    Its 24/7 black at the D-Party nowadays.

    Its all about black lives, bodies, lies, habits, tripe and endless demands.

    Those Mestizos may not show up for that party.

    Replies: @Mr. Rational

    I wonder how the “others” will like the BLM black party.

    In a nutshell, the Sailer strategy is to brand the donks as the “black party”.  Blacks don’t play well with others, even other members of the “coalition of the fringes”.  If the party of blacks drives the “latinx”, women, LGBT, etc. into not voting at all, that’s half as good as driving them to vote Republican.  You can win elections that way.

  23. @216
    @Mark G.

    Conservatives spent the last 10 years sucking up to Big Tech, in hopes that the "libertarian" Silicon Dons would shower them in donations.

    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

    Replies: @Mark G., @Kratoklastes

    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

    Why would you write something that is so ridiculously easy to prove false? Did you ever check whether or not what you were writing was supported by facts, or did you not care either way? Are you accustomed to a mouth-breathing audience of gullible fuckwits (e.g., FreeRepublic or something)?

    List of countries by government share of GDP

    The unadjusted US ratio of government expenditure to GDP is 41.6% – within the margin of error for equality with Canada and Japan, and fully 7 percentage points greater than Australia (whose public sector accounting massively understates public-sector expenditure).

    There are significant accounting issues – for every government in the West – because a large proportion of government expenditure is, weirdly, not counted as part of government expenditure under the National Accounting framework.

    Public-sector accounting principles are dodgy as fuck, and public-sector financial statements are rife with accounting chicanery – if they were pricate-sector accounts whoever prepared them would be imprisoned for fraud.

    When the OECD attempts to harmonise data across countries comparisons get screwed up – but the latest data indicates that the US is not “at the bottom or 2nd-last” in the OECD, or even in the G20.

    OECD General Government Expenditure as a share of GDP

    G20 Government Expenditure as a share of GDP

    Note that all of the data comparisons use government-produced ‘real’ GDP components: that by itself makes them dodgy because the real GDP number is inflated by conversion using very biased deflators; by contrast the deflator used for government expenditure numbers biases real government expenditure numbers downwards. The US is the worst offender on the deflator side of things.

  24. @Mark G.
    @216


    The US ranks either at the bottom or 2nd-last in government spending as a % of GDP.

     

    As of 2018, the U.S. ranked 17th in the world in economic freedom. It used to rank in the top two or three. How is it that a country that is supposedly in thrall to free market fundamentalism moving in a statist direction like that? Like I said before, it's a myth that the last 50 years has been a period in the U.S. of free market capitalism. The myth is perpetuated by people who don't want to admit that our economic decline has nothing to do with adopting more free market policies, since we never actually did that.

    https://reason.com/2018/01/31/sadly-americas-not-the-freest-country-in/

    Replies: @botazefa

    it’s a myth that the last 50 years has been a period in the U.S. of free market capitalism.

    How do you reconcile the labor free for all in the US, based upon porous borders encouraging wage decreases across the board, with the idea that the US isn’t really free market?

    • Replies: @Mark G.
    @botazefa


    How do you reconcile the labor free for all in the US, based upon porous borders encouraging wage decreases across the board, with the idea that the US isn’t really free market?


     

    Currently employers don't pay the full cost of immigrant labor. They pay such low wages that immigrants and their families qualify for multiple government welfare benefits. They also receive other indirect benefits. For example, if the employer doesn't give them health insurance they show up at the local hospital emergency ward, where it has been made illegal to turn them away. When they don't pay, the costs are shifted over to paying customers. This drives up health care costs for everyone else.

    This is an example of privatizing the profits while socializing the costs. It's not a good deal for the average taxpayer but is one for employers that hire lots of immigrants, which is why they support lax immigration laws. In the late nineteenth century this was less of a problem. You didn't have an extensive welfare state then. Up to half of immigrants couldn't make it here and returned home. If they stayed, the employer needed to pay them enough for them and their families to live on.

    You could have a requirement that immigrants need to pay taxes and stay off welfare for a certain period of time, say ten years. This would eliminate a lot of third world immigrants since many of them would never be able to adjust to American society and be productive enough to support themselves. The roadblock would be that both parties would be against it. The Republican big business donors like the cheap labor. The Democrats also like the current system because more clients for the welfare state means more votes for the Democrats. When immigrant supported leftist politicians start nationalizing large businesses, at that point those companies will realize they made a mistake supporting increased immigration.

    Replies: @botazefa

  25. @JohnPlywood
    @216

    Men who get Asian women are upscale, usually STEM graduates. They don't support Trump, like most white men under 30.

    Working class and humanities white men vote Trump and grudgingly settle for their own warthog women, but would take an Asian girl if they could get one, even if they voted Democrat. Biological imperative trumps politics, and support for Republicans is declining among white men anyway, except among those poor unfortunate souls who have been reduced to accepting their sole source of income from special interest groups in exchange for spreading propaganda online.

    Replies: @botazefa

    but would take an Asian girl if they could get one, even if they voted Democrat.

    Any data to back up your claim? I don’t think white guys generally prefer Asian women. Personally, I don’t find them to be attractive.

    What motivates you?

  26. @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    Thank you for your kindness.

    Well, that's all the more reason to politically mess with it. The progressive UMC people in ideological charge of the DNC really aren't as bright as they think they are, and that can be their downfall: Republican incompetence is the only reason they get to do what they do. Even conservative media fails to truly take advantage of things like the recent riots: they overplay their hand or are tone deaf when talking to non-white, blue collar or lower-middle class Democratic voters with certain "small-c" conservative views that can be exploited. Instead of emphasizing the "I wish the authorities came in here sooner to kick Antifa ass" angle, deepening anti-rioter sentiment, and letting the seeds grow, they try to explicitly cajole a statement of support for Donald Trump or a disavowal of the Democrats or something. You got to be smart about this.

    (But for Pete's sake, when you have the Latin Kings openly toting guns to warn BLMers and Antifa to stay the hell out of their neighborhoods... why does Donald Trump find the need to preside over a massive wealth transfer to monied interests? Why? If not for what is best for America, than for political propaganda in attacking "woke crony capitalism".)

    I get that the Evil Party is the real threat, not the Stupid Party, but the Stupid Party is what you use to combat the Evil Party, and that's why I focus on their tactics.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @TomSchmidt

    “The progressive UMC people in ideological charge of the DNC really aren’t as bright as they think they are, and that can be their downfall”

    I think they thought they could just shut down the economy for the virus, and then flip a switch and it would all come back on, after Biden got elected. Andrew Cuomo is only one example of this arrogant, unaccountable, clueless style of governance. Except: he has blown multi-billion dollar holes in his budget with his lockdowns, and probably permanently damaged NYC as a post-Industrial services center. The city is lifeless, and the demand for offices is about to drop through the floor. He is going to have to cut the budget, massively, or try to raise the highest taxes in the country; if he cuts the budget for white middle class items, they’ll leave, and if he tries to raise taxes on the wealthiest, they’ll depart for Florida, like Trump did.

    It’s going to be very ugly.

  27. @botazefa
    @Mark G.


    it’s a myth that the last 50 years has been a period in the U.S. of free market capitalism.
     
    How do you reconcile the labor free for all in the US, based upon porous borders encouraging wage decreases across the board, with the idea that the US isn't really free market?

    Replies: @Mark G.

    How do you reconcile the labor free for all in the US, based upon porous borders encouraging wage decreases across the board, with the idea that the US isn’t really free market?

    Currently employers don’t pay the full cost of immigrant labor. They pay such low wages that immigrants and their families qualify for multiple government welfare benefits. They also receive other indirect benefits. For example, if the employer doesn’t give them health insurance they show up at the local hospital emergency ward, where it has been made illegal to turn them away. When they don’t pay, the costs are shifted over to paying customers. This drives up health care costs for everyone else.

    This is an example of privatizing the profits while socializing the costs. It’s not a good deal for the average taxpayer but is one for employers that hire lots of immigrants, which is why they support lax immigration laws. In the late nineteenth century this was less of a problem. You didn’t have an extensive welfare state then. Up to half of immigrants couldn’t make it here and returned home. If they stayed, the employer needed to pay them enough for them and their families to live on.

    You could have a requirement that immigrants need to pay taxes and stay off welfare for a certain period of time, say ten years. This would eliminate a lot of third world immigrants since many of them would never be able to adjust to American society and be productive enough to support themselves. The roadblock would be that both parties would be against it. The Republican big business donors like the cheap labor. The Democrats also like the current system because more clients for the welfare state means more votes for the Democrats. When immigrant supported leftist politicians start nationalizing large businesses, at that point those companies will realize they made a mistake supporting increased immigration.

    • Replies: @botazefa
    @Mark G.

    I think what you are saying is that by allowing corporations to externalize so many expenses into the economy the free market is distorted. Earlier, I was thinking corporate America was free to do pretty much whatever they want. That's true. But now I see your point that it isn't really a 'free market,' due to the externalizations. Maybe it's 'better' than free. For them, that is.

    I agree with everything you wrote. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.

  28. @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The Coalition of the Fringes is deeply fragile and relies on a heavy external factor-first Obama, then Trump-keeping it together. The various competing groups have precious little affection for each other. Looking at the dynamics of other multicultural societies in history, I have a very hard time buying Democratic arguments about how a society revolving around "diversity" as a primary justification in itself is going to be tenable. That doesn't mean the various components of the coalition are on board with "woke" ideology: ask any recent immigrant shopkeeper that just had his business go up in flames thanks to Antifa, or if you get sufficient alcohol into their system, what they really think of camp homosexuals and feminists. Wokeism is a creation of the managerial upper middle class that is the true nucleus of the modern Democratic Party, with the tacit support of the oligarchs. But they'll still vote Democrat because, hey, they aren't the targets of this stuff.

    It's almost as if the GOP could take advantage of this incoherence: after all, until well into the Clinton era, most Asians voted Republican. But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn't bother to hide it anymore), so don't count on that. In particular, Hispanics aren't stupid: as a group that benefits from Big Government more than they pay into it, GOP socioeconomic arguments are on some level deeply intellectually patronizing. This is a reality that well predates Donald Trump, who won more minorities than Romney did.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Mark G., @Libre, @Jane Plain

    Asians vote Republican when blacks riot. I can’t imagine Chung Lee the laundromat owner who just got mugged and Padar Patel the bodega franchisee are concerned much with answering phone polls, but they know who will put the troublemakers in timeout, and who will give them a cookie. Silicon valley and college Asians, on the other hand, might not care about such trivialities.

    However, what exactly do you want “free market fundamentalism” replaced with? They certainly have a misguided approach to it and bad messaging, but deregulation and lower taxes are good for businesses.

    • Replies: @216
    @Libre

    I would prefer to see the US adopt labor/economic policies similar to what Germans call the "social market economy". I also like the approach of Singapore to keep key industries under state ownership, and for the state to develop a "sovereign wealth fund", while largely remaining within a free market framework.

    If at all possible, the power of FIRE needs to be severely curbed.

    , @Intelligent Dasein
    @Libre


    I can’t imagine Chung Lee the laundromat owner who just got mugged...
     
    https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.35079130.9287/fc,550x550,white.u4.jpg

    Sorry, I couldn't resist that one.
  29. @Mark G.
    @botazefa


    How do you reconcile the labor free for all in the US, based upon porous borders encouraging wage decreases across the board, with the idea that the US isn’t really free market?


     

    Currently employers don't pay the full cost of immigrant labor. They pay such low wages that immigrants and their families qualify for multiple government welfare benefits. They also receive other indirect benefits. For example, if the employer doesn't give them health insurance they show up at the local hospital emergency ward, where it has been made illegal to turn them away. When they don't pay, the costs are shifted over to paying customers. This drives up health care costs for everyone else.

    This is an example of privatizing the profits while socializing the costs. It's not a good deal for the average taxpayer but is one for employers that hire lots of immigrants, which is why they support lax immigration laws. In the late nineteenth century this was less of a problem. You didn't have an extensive welfare state then. Up to half of immigrants couldn't make it here and returned home. If they stayed, the employer needed to pay them enough for them and their families to live on.

    You could have a requirement that immigrants need to pay taxes and stay off welfare for a certain period of time, say ten years. This would eliminate a lot of third world immigrants since many of them would never be able to adjust to American society and be productive enough to support themselves. The roadblock would be that both parties would be against it. The Republican big business donors like the cheap labor. The Democrats also like the current system because more clients for the welfare state means more votes for the Democrats. When immigrant supported leftist politicians start nationalizing large businesses, at that point those companies will realize they made a mistake supporting increased immigration.

    Replies: @botazefa

    I think what you are saying is that by allowing corporations to externalize so many expenses into the economy the free market is distorted. Earlier, I was thinking corporate America was free to do pretty much whatever they want. That’s true. But now I see your point that it isn’t really a ‘free market,’ due to the externalizations. Maybe it’s ‘better’ than free. For them, that is.

    I agree with everything you wrote. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.

  30. @Libre
    @nebulafox

    Asians vote Republican when blacks riot. I can't imagine Chung Lee the laundromat owner who just got mugged and Padar Patel the bodega franchisee are concerned much with answering phone polls, but they know who will put the troublemakers in timeout, and who will give them a cookie. Silicon valley and college Asians, on the other hand, might not care about such trivialities.

    However, what exactly do you want "free market fundamentalism" replaced with? They certainly have a misguided approach to it and bad messaging, but deregulation and lower taxes are good for businesses.

    Replies: @216, @Intelligent Dasein

    I would prefer to see the US adopt labor/economic policies similar to what Germans call the “social market economy”. I also like the approach of Singapore to keep key industries under state ownership, and for the state to develop a “sovereign wealth fund”, while largely remaining within a free market framework.

    If at all possible, the power of FIRE needs to be severely curbed.

    • Agree: Mr. Rational
  31. The Party of the southern plantation has become the Party of the urban plantation.

    The DNC: Quick! Tear down those confederate statues before BLM opens a history book!

  32. @Libre
    @nebulafox

    Asians vote Republican when blacks riot. I can't imagine Chung Lee the laundromat owner who just got mugged and Padar Patel the bodega franchisee are concerned much with answering phone polls, but they know who will put the troublemakers in timeout, and who will give them a cookie. Silicon valley and college Asians, on the other hand, might not care about such trivialities.

    However, what exactly do you want "free market fundamentalism" replaced with? They certainly have a misguided approach to it and bad messaging, but deregulation and lower taxes are good for businesses.

    Replies: @216, @Intelligent Dasein

    I can’t imagine Chung Lee the laundromat owner who just got mugged…

    Sorry, I couldn’t resist that one.

  33. @nebulafox
    @Buzz Mohawk

    The Coalition of the Fringes is deeply fragile and relies on a heavy external factor-first Obama, then Trump-keeping it together. The various competing groups have precious little affection for each other. Looking at the dynamics of other multicultural societies in history, I have a very hard time buying Democratic arguments about how a society revolving around "diversity" as a primary justification in itself is going to be tenable. That doesn't mean the various components of the coalition are on board with "woke" ideology: ask any recent immigrant shopkeeper that just had his business go up in flames thanks to Antifa, or if you get sufficient alcohol into their system, what they really think of camp homosexuals and feminists. Wokeism is a creation of the managerial upper middle class that is the true nucleus of the modern Democratic Party, with the tacit support of the oligarchs. But they'll still vote Democrat because, hey, they aren't the targets of this stuff.

    It's almost as if the GOP could take advantage of this incoherence: after all, until well into the Clinton era, most Asians voted Republican. But that would mean ditching the free market fundamentalism that even their own base white working/lower-middle class voters hate (they are largely stuck with the GOP since the other party hates them, wants to replace them, and doesn't bother to hide it anymore), so don't count on that. In particular, Hispanics aren't stupid: as a group that benefits from Big Government more than they pay into it, GOP socioeconomic arguments are on some level deeply intellectually patronizing. This is a reality that well predates Donald Trump, who won more minorities than Romney did.

    Replies: @Buzz Mohawk, @Mark G., @Libre, @Jane Plain

    I don’t believe that there is a Coalition of the Fringes (CotF).

    Read Colin Woodard’s American Nations. He focuses on whites almost exclusively, but it’s a much better explanation of American voting patterns than the Sailer theory.

    CotF makes superficial sense at the upper reaches of the Democratic National Committee. But even there, it’s mostly militant black rage and muscle, with oligarch money.

    Not much of a coalition, when you analyze it.

  34. @216
    Off topic

    https://twitter.com/ScottMGreer/status/1289944662220967936

    Replies: @Truth

    LOL, why does this guy put his height on his Twitter page.

  35. @216
    The reversed age gradient with blacks has been observed before. No one seems to have found a way to exploit it yet.

    My guess is that the "kids in cages" is why younger Hispanic women are so opposed to Trump, compared to other blocs which are the typical "meh".

    For all the talk of the fetishization of Asian women, it is not reciprocated at all when it comes to politics. Maybe our people will learn a lesson.

    Replies: @JohnPlywood, @Audacious Epigone

    Indeed, it is regularly apparent with both blacks and Jews. The youth are more Republican–and certainly less Democrat–than the elders.

  36. @iffen
    We are gonna lose.

    We don't have anybody that can match skeletor Ruth Bader Ginsburg in sheer grit.

    America RIP

    Replies: @Talha, @Audacious Epigone

    “She. Just. Won’t. Go. Away!”

    The above is what I predict my grandson saying in 2067.

    Peace.

    • Thanks: Talha
  37. @iffen
    We are gonna lose.

    We don't have anybody that can match skeletor Ruth Bader Ginsburg in sheer grit.

    America RIP

    Replies: @Talha, @Audacious Epigone

    Skeletor is ripped. I knew that when I was kid, forgot it for decades, and then rediscovered it not too long ago.

  38. @Fran Taubman
    Polling on Trump and Biden seem like a paradox for gathering real information on the way the populace feels. We are a moving target. Our ideas cancel each other out and change daily. I notice you did not factor in the favorabilityof Jews in your graphs?

    What we are witnessing is a short circuit of accurate information of inventory (collecting information and deciding it is accurate), reality, and decision making. We cannot come up with accurate facts to enact policy and disseminate information. So polling is like sticking your finger in downed electrical wires. Nihilism is upon us. It may not be a designed phenomena but it is here. It is the result of humans at their wits end. The internet and social media have allowed the civilized world to be triggered with a maze of surreal information. Lies up lies up more lies. There used to be a clearing house for information after a certain tumult and divisiveness. Like after Vietnam we all settled down and reviewed the facts and agreed on the causes and effects of what happened and what went wrong. The same is true with the McCarthy era, WW2 etc.. We as a society have lost our ability to discern truth and clear the debris away. We are being driven nuts which is what we are. People are deliberately setting our hair on fire. I do not think it is one group over another. It is everyone joining in.

    Now the certainty over the election results is at our door step. Not that someone will plan to steal it, just that with the internet there will be enough doubts planted, with frightening seeds of horror that someone planned and stole it. Sort of similar to the last election only worse. We will all loose our collective minds if this is not brought under control with some sort of truth clearing house. We have to vote in a federal election system with thumb prints. We are way past the states ability to handle voting and tallying. If some minorities feel disenfranchised because they cannot be ID'd then too bad. If you can not be identified you do not deserve to vote. Big changes need to be made for us to survive. I fear the democrats will use this chaos for a marxist takeover.

    Replies: @Audacious Epigone

    Jews are not broken out as a separate category at Civiqs. Where does Biden fall in a preference distribution among Jewish leftists?

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